Network News

X My Profile
View More Activity

Floridians Now Booked to Return to the Fold


Democratic National Committee Chairman Howard Dean gestures during an interview with The Associated press, Thursday, March 27, 2008, at DNC Headquarters in Washington. (AP.)

Updated 2:12 p.m.
By Jonathan Weisman
After months of animus and finger-pointing, Democratic National Committee Chairman Howard Dean offered Florida's Democratic House delegation an olive branch this morning: He booked them hotel rooms in Denver.

It may not seem like much, but Florida House members hailed the gesture and the tone of the morning meeting as a breakthrough. Dean had pledged he would do everything in his power to seat Florida's delegates, months after he stripped the state of its convention voice after it moved its primary forward against party rules.

"Good tone, good tenor, everybody's on the same page," declared Rep. Alan Boyd (D-Fla.). "I now have confidence we can get this thing done."

Rep. Debbie Wasserman-Schultz admitted they were no closer to figuring out how those delegates would be apportioned. Hillary Rodham Clinton wants the results of the nullified Jan. 29 primary respected, while Barack Obama wants a 50-50 split so the apportionment wouldn't effect his lead. Wasserman-Schultz said everyone agreed it would take a few more contests to decide on the math.

"That won't be up to us," Boyd said. "The decision needs to be made by the campaigns."

The hotel gesture is not meaningless. There was real fear that by the time the standoff is resolved, no rooms would be left in Denver.

"There will be no empty chairs at the convention in Denver," predicted Rep. Alcee Hastings (D-Fla.).

This afternoon, Dean, Florida Democratic Party chairwoman Karen L. Thurman and the Florida congressional members at the morning meeting issued a joint statement, which follows the jump:

"We are all committed to doing everything we can to ensure that a Florida delegation is seated in Denver. We all agree that whatever the solution, it must have the support of both campaigns. While there may be differences of opinion in how we get there, we are all committed to ensuring that Florida's delegation is seated in Denver. We're committed to working with both campaigns to reach a solution as soon as realistically possible. We are also laying the groundwork to ensure we win in Florida in November and spent time here today talking about how to do just that. We will continue to work towards a solution to ensure delegates are seated and logistics are in place for a Florida delegation in Denver."

By Web Politics Editor  |  April 2, 2008; 12:42 PM ET
Categories:  B_Blog , Primaries  
Save & Share:  Send E-mail   Facebook   Twitter   Digg   Yahoo Buzz   Del.icio.us   StumbleUpon   Technorati   Google Buzz   Previous: Obama Casts Himself as the True Underdog in Pa.
Next: McCain Assembling Veep List

Comments

there is the professional world of warcraft power leveling here. welcome.

Posted by: jimelyyes | May 7, 2008 11:08 AM | Report abuse

there is the professional world of warcraft power leveling here. welcome.

Posted by: jimelyyes | May 2, 2008 2:16 AM | Report abuse

I've been a Democrat all my life and I'm 79 and from Massachusetts.

If Hillary wins because of the Florida delegation, there is no doubt that the sway voters will rebel against the party and elect McCain and Bush's war and policies will continue for another 8 years guaranteed.

It will serve the Democraric party right.

As a further note, I left the boxes for president blank the last two elections. I may have to do the same in 2008.

Posted by: RUKidding | April 8, 2008 10:48 PM | Report abuse

If you think that the Swift Boat Ads hurt Kerry just think what they can do to Obama if he is the nominee Swift Boaters have Wright Kerry Farrakan Ayers Rezko Gov of PR and now Hanio Jane

Posted by: yankeenana2 | April 3, 2008 10:19 PM | Report abuse

it's a bit absurd to me that anything hillary does is caricatured as her being simply ambitious and self-serving.

if situations were reversed and obama won florida and michigan and wanted to get them the vote everyone would be applauding his democratic virtues and denouncing hillary for being the washington insider that prevents them from voting by insisting on the rules.

regardless of what you think of hillary, these states should get their voices heard in one way or another (although a 50-50 split seems unfair, especially in florida since they were both on the ballot, and they did favor hillary). they are two huge democratic states and ignoring the vote of the people, the most basic democratic privilege, will reasonably piss them off, which will effect the general election. this is an extremely close and heated election, how would you feel if your vote was entirely ignored because of a technicality?

Posted by: other49 | April 3, 2008 6:29 PM | Report abuse

Why did they take away the delegates and tell everybody not to run if they are going to act like a bunch of spineless politician and back down at the last minutes. This mess look more and more like the big fix just in case Hillary screw it up and need a bail out has she obviously need right now! And if their role was reversed would Obama and Florida be told to fold this up and be back in 2016.

Posted by: johnupnorth | April 3, 2008 6:22 PM | Report abuse

it's a bit absurd to me that anything hillary does is caricatured as her being simply ambitious and self-serving.

if situations were reversed and obama won florida and michigan and wanted to get them the vote everyone would be applauding his democratic virtues and denouncing hillary for being the washington insider that prevents them from voting by insisting on the rules.

regardless of what you think of hillary, these states should get their voices heard in one way or another (although a 50-50 split seems unfair, especially in florida since they were both on the ballot, and they did favor hillary). they are two huge democratic states and ignoring the vote of the people, the most basic democratic privilege, will reasonably piss them off, which will effect the general election. this is an extremely close and heated election, how would you feel if your vote was entirely ignored because of a technicality?

Posted by: other49 | April 3, 2008 6:17 PM | Report abuse

donald169 Someone has to state just what you did over and over till it entered some of the thick heads.Nice post.

Posted by: roncraw | April 3, 2008 4:28 PM | Report abuse

It's so maddening to keep reading the misinformation and outright deceptions being offered by the supporters of Senator Obama here. 1)
1) It is FALSE to keep saying Obama played by the rules in Florida and Clinton did not. Obama ran 2 weeks of commercials on MSNBC and CNN, and they played many times every day all over Florida; he claimed it was just national advertising that coincidentally had to be shown in Florida, but in fact it began 15 days before the primary and ENDED THE VERY DAY AFTER. Clinton made no ads, and while both candidates had supporters who worked to get them votes, neither of them campaigned in the state personally.

2) It is FASLSE to claim that the candidates were "told to" or "asked to" remove their names from the Michigan ballot. Obama did so on his own, partly to please Iowa voters who hated having Michigan go ahead of them--his campaign said as much. In addition to Clinton's name, the ballot had Kucinich, Dodd, Biden, and Gravel. Everyone could have left their names on, and no rule even suggested they not do so.

3) It is DECEPTIVE to claim that Florida's vote is worthless because people stayed at home, thinking it would not count. In fact, 1.7 MILLION people voted in the Democratic primary, and that was the HIGHEST PERCENTAGE Florida has ever had in a Democratic primary. Further, if people stayed home instead of voting, surely it was as true of pro-Clinton voters as pro-Obama voters. That argument is specious and deceptive. Lastly, even though some thought the contretemps wouldn't be solved, many assumed it would, and the votes would count, so they voted. And they voted also in large numbers because important other issues were on the ballot. If you go to vote for one reason, why in the world would you choose to leave blank the option for President!!

4) It is FALSE to claim that Mrs. Clinton ever pledged to oppose the seating of Florida or Michigan delegates. Anyone making that claim needs to have some source to back it up; it's a lie. She agreed, along with the other candidates, to not campaign in the states, and she did not. No other agreement or pledge was ever asked of any of the candidates.

The most audaciously unfair proposal ever made in modern polltics is that of Obama's camp regarding Florida--give us half the delegates, even though we won only 43%! Anyone supporting such an outrageous suggestion is either loopy or is uninterested in actual democracy.

Finally, it is true that were we count only Democratic voters in all the primaries and caucuses, Clinton would have a substantial lead in votes. Members of the Democratic Party have spoken clearly--they prefer Hillary Clinton as their party's candidate. Independents and Republicans voted in sufficient numbers in our primaries to sway the vote towrds the candidate DEMOCRATS rejected.

Posted by: donald169 | April 3, 2008 4:15 PM | Report abuse

Anyone wonder why Obama has been against Fla voting again. The latest poll in Fla Clinton 44 Mccain 42, Mccain 46 Obama 37---Ohio Clinton 48 Mccain 40,Obama 43 Mccain 39 I'm sure they did a internal poll and knew this.

Posted by: roncraw | April 3, 2008 3:50 PM | Report abuse

Anyone wonder why Obama has been against Fla voting again. The latest poll in Fla Clinton 44 Mccain 42, Mccain 46 Obama 37---Ohio Clinton 48 Mccain 40,Obama 43 Mccain 39 I'm sure they did a internal poll and knew this.

Posted by: roncraw | April 3, 2008 3:50 PM | Report abuse


Here is an entry from the MI / FL petition;

Jocelyn and Michael in Michigan - We are so furious with Barack Obama at this point in time that we have both made a pact NOT to vote for him in November if he is the nominee for the Democrats. We've had enough of this absurdity. We VOTED. And this freshman rookie Senator from Illinois doesn't want our votes to count? To hell with him.

--


There you have it. Sign at;

http://www.ipetitions.com/petition/seatourdelegates/signatures.html


-

Posted by: straightmedia | April 3, 2008 3:44 PM | Report abuse

I wonder why there are so few to consider these facts! The Clintons are the only VERY dangerous powerhouse for the Republicans. They've beat them and humiliated them many, many times.

Hillary got elected easily in the Senate, two times, including in heavily Republican areas of the state.

Hillary was for eight years part of the most successful presidency of the 2nd part of the 20th century. She didn't just cook for Bill and watched soap operas in the afternoons. Like Bill, a Harvard graduate, she was most likely involved/consulted in all important decisions during Bill Clinton's presidency. There isn't anybody in America today, with that kind of experience for the job.

Obama didn't win any blue state. He won only red states, with heavy support from blacks, who deserted the Clintons, and support from Republicans impersonating Democrats in the primaries. The Republicans really hate and fear the Clintons who humiliated them repeatedly in the past. They heavily supported Obama in the primaries. They know they can easily beat him in the fall (even before the Wright story), but they know they've always lost to the Clintons.

Howard Dean should be ashamed about allowing this situation to happen. One year ago, the press was talking about Hillary's Coronation, now the 70 years old McCain has real chances to win the elections after eight years of Bush!!! I feel VERY, VERY embarrassed for the Democrats!

Posted by: alan_pr | April 3, 2008 3:29 PM | Report abuse

---> damcgaffey | April 3, 2008 11:11 AM

Check your Facts BEFORE you start running your mouth. Obama was the ONLY candidate who ran commercial ads in Florida! HE and ONLY HE BROKE those rules. Clinton won Florida fair!!

Posted by: glamourchild1 | April 3, 2008 3:26 PM | Report abuse

As a Florida voter, this whole thing has been disenchanting. First of all, let's not forget we were led into this by a Republican legislature! Secondly, I can speak first hand on the fact that voters did not take the primary seriously because it "didn't count". Therefore, THE RESULTS ARE INVALID! We are not holding another primary and the first should be null and void. Period!

P.S. We resent the "red state" jargon. We are a state of millions, who were narrowly labeled red due to uncounted votes!

Posted by: greenmichaelj | April 3, 2008 3:19 PM | Report abuse

How can you include delegates selected from voters who were a small percentage of what the turnout would have been if Howard Dean and the DNC weren't totally incompetent and punished the Florida delegation the way the RNC did, by reducing its delegation, BEFORE the primary. The DNC is either stupid or corrupt or incompetent or all three.Howard Dean is an intelligent man, but i'm not sure he should be in charge of a dig kennel. Smart doesn't imply a good manager. The reason I believe they have drug their feet so long is because the situation would and should have been taken to court and settled there. However, there is less judicial authority (less legislation) over party primaries than general elections.
I's total disenfranchisement of the public to allot candidates based on results from a cancelled, meaningless primary. The jerks in Tallahassee could have at least rescheudled legitimate caucauses if they didn't want to pay to do redo the primary which probably wouldn't have got past the courts anyway because thre are specific laws about scheduling and conducting elections that must be followed even for party primaries. Plus the party didn't want to pay for it.
The Republicans handled it okay, the Democrats didn't. I have a feeling an important swing state will realize what party demonstrated competence and which didn't. Mostly they should blame their state delegations for violating the rules in the first place in order to have more 'influence' over the nominations.

This really needs to be sorted out in court, but that may take a while. It really makes the politicians there look utterly corrupt, but what happened, happend and Sen. Clinton and FL voters should stop crying. Things don't go your way all the time and this was your fault. Why don't you try throwing out some of those hacks in your state government such as the state senate and legislature

Posted by: KRittenmyer | April 3, 2008 3:01 PM | Report abuse

Which political commercial (played over and over night after night) will have more power in the general:

1) scenes of McCain partying with Bush

2) scenes of Reverend Wright talking about hook-nosed Italians and the AIDS virus created by the government, and questions about what Obama knew and when did he know it. (By the way, where the heck is Reverend Wright hiding out?)

Posted by: lithium452 | April 3, 2008 2:32 PM | Report abuse

Good, they should seat the delegation in its entirety. Both candidates were on the ballot, neither campaigned there, and its a battleground state. If the Dems don't seat these delegates in their entirety, they will lose Florida, and likely the election in the fall regardless of which candidate wins the nomination.

Posted by: boothe | April 3, 2008 2:32 PM | Report abuse

Foremost for Democracy is representation from the 2 effected states must be seated at Nat'l Convention.

Secondly, the "sentence" that was handed down on early-set primaries was Un-Democratic, no matter how you slice it.

Thirdly, a penalty is due since those states' Democratic Leaders decided to go against the DNC mandates. What penalty should that be? Half-a-vote per delegate for Primary purpose? ...It is up to DNC and the effected states' Dem. Leaders to arbitrate a solution for "Primary-count" purposes.

Fourthly, The effected states are burdened with the task of ensuring "other than those that voted in Republican Primary" are allowed to vote "again" for fair proportionality at "penalized level". The DNC should share a partial burden of cost of the "do-over" primary since it was the DNC's sentence of "no representation" that further botched the democratic process.

Fifthly, the candidates have to abide by the results of this arbitrated re-vote unquestionably, as they are participants in a Party-driven democratic process with penalties assessed.

Sixthly, quit hashing the horrible mess that was produced historically and move forward for the sake of the Democratic process and most importantly for the WHOLE of peoples' voices to be counted.

Thank you for your consideration. Search with a "Beam of Hope" always in your mind.

Posted by: gee_why_1959 | April 3, 2008 2:24 PM | Report abuse


-- Just like 1968 and 1972 destroyed the party for 40 years, --

-


You mean, all except the Presidentials won
in '76, '92 and '96 - and the majority held
in the House until 1994, then retaken 2006...

;-)


Dude; Will Tear Up Party, Quit Now,
has been the bankrupt Media Inc. drivel
since before OH / TX. It is aired daily.

What a joke. If Obama was slightly behind and
anyone said quit now, there would be outrage
at denying him his chance. No politician would
dare say that to the Af/Am candidate.

But for a caucasian female - fine to deny her
opportunity.


Here is the problem of the elitists;
The process, is the process. Remaining
voters get to speak, Hillary gets to make
her case. Something about Democracy
I think...

No amount of baseless crying about tearing
up the party, changes that. Wake up -


-

Posted by: straightmedia | April 3, 2008 1:30 PM | Report abuse

-- hotel rooms booked --


Translation: The pressure put on Dean by
party regulars who have NO intention of
putting FL at risk in November, is working.

-- while Barack Obama wants a 50-50 split so the apportionment wouldn't effect his lead. --

Whhaaaa!!

..uhm, I know I lost FL and all, but could
I still have half the votes?!!

I mean, Media Inc. has already declared
me the nominee! It's only FAIR. Whhaaaa!!

;-)

What a joke, Barack Obama is turning out
to be...


-

Posted by: straightmedia | April 3, 2008 1:16 PM | Report abuse


When does reality come back into your life?

The math is simple,

If you are running for office in the rust belt and the south

1. Attack America (rev Wright) + 2. Be a minority = 3. Defeat!

Now throw in the fact that you are going up against a war machine that turned a war hero (John Kerry) into Chicken Little. What do you think these Swift Boaters are going to do to Senator Obama and Rev. Wright?

And finally, throw in his legislative record. Save your breath on me. When it comes to experience, the Republicans will make you see what you refuse to see - he is an ambitious lightweight.

Yes, Hillary carries a lot of baggage but she is experienced, and tough. She can win.

Posted by: alrascal11 | April 3, 2008 12:31 PM | Report abuse

JakeD got it right. Just like 1968 and 1972 destroyed the party for 40 years, Hillary is prepared to devastate us again for the politics of power. And, the US of A will suffer the consequences as we see the increasing politics of greed from the right.

In both cases, hubris will do us in. Would the last one of the Democratic Party please turn off the lights.

Posted by: cwcrosby42 | April 3, 2008 12:21 PM | Report abuse

I hope Dean Howard understands there is far more at stake here than the president's office.

Millions of voters believe the Florida and Michigan "elections" did not meet America's standards for fair and open elections as the candidates did not campaign in either state, and Sen. Obama did not appear on the ballot. Thus, if Sen. Clinton wins the nomination based on these flawed elections, tens of thousands of Sen. Obama's supporters will boycott the general election.

A great many contests are at stake in the general election; low democrat voter turn out risks local, state, and national seats.

Our local and state officeholders play a far more important role in our day to day lives, than that of the president.

Our local and state officials directly effect the level of our state income taxes, property taxes, sales taxes, business taxes, and other such fees.

Our local and state officials determine how our money is spent, and how our resources are managed. Our local and state officials determine the quality of education in our schools; the quality of our local and state infrastructures; the quality of our local healthcare systems; and the vitality of our local and state economies.

Sen. Obama has more popular votes than Sen. Clinton, and has won more states than Sen. Clinton. A boycotted general election by Sen. Obama supporters could prove detrimental to democrat candidates and incumbents on the local and state level.

Posted by: txgall | April 3, 2008 12:11 PM | Report abuse

Does anyone uphold the laws in this country or obey the rules or laws. Florida and Michigan were both warned and held their election early. They should be punished. The people in these states now what they did and now should suffer the result. DO NOT SEAT THEM!!!!! But I guess as always our government changes the rules in midstream just because they can. What good does it do to make the rules and then not back them. OH! I forgot our government says it all. (crooks, liers, thieves)

Posted by: cacooper | April 3, 2008 11:38 AM | Report abuse

I agree that Florida and m\Michigan should be seated at the Convention. BUT the promary elections in those states were not fairly contested battles as Obama followed the rules and did not campaign in those states. Therefore, Clinton cannot claim that she won those states. In the interest of including these important states in the Democratic Pary Convention I suggest dividing the delegates 50/50 between Clinton and Obama

Posted by: damcgaffey | April 3, 2008 11:11 AM | Report abuse

Obama gets away with lies! Buried in Eloquence, Obama Contradictions About Pastor: http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/story?id=4480868&page=1

More than 60 lies he got away with:
http://www.audacityofhypocrisy.com/?p=54

Obama record may be gold mine for critics
http://www.audacityofhypocrisy.com/?p=59

Posted by: snakebaby | April 3, 2008 11:09 AM | Report abuse

As always, Hillary is tarred with the brush of hubris, that it's "obvious she covets this win so much it completely overshadows what is good for the party."

Um. . . and Obama doesn't want to win? He is an innocent plucked off the Chicago streets, just doing what he can for democracy, by serving the will of the people. How did this fantasy start?

Politicians are hard-bitten people. She is not a harpy, he is not a martyr. They both want to win fiercely, and have powerful machines, count on it.

Posted by: rangerjim1 | April 3, 2008 11:09 AM | Report abuse

As a resident of Palm Beach County Florida, I faithfully continue to cast my vote for Democrats in every election. Who knows? Maybe someday my vote will actually be counted!

Why is everyone so quick to end the Democratic Primary? Whenever I turn on the news, it is all about the Democrats. All of the attention on the Democrats can't be a bad thing. I think of it as an easy, free way for them to get their messages out.

Is there even a Republican candidate? Or is it that what he has to say is just a rerun of the last 8 years and we have already heard it.

Posted by: pweikel | April 3, 2008 11:00 AM | Report abuse

Methinks that the pressure is getting to Dean!! What an incompetent fool!!!!

I still do not trust this as it does not give us a measure of what will be the result. Seating the delegates with any penalty and a 50/50 deal is totally UNFAIR to the voters!!!
A RE-VOTE is the only viable solution if the votes would not be allocated as they were casted. Doing this is a concesion to Obama and totally unfair to Hillary!!!

The party needs to learn a lesson, to listen to its constituency and a scrap thrown to try to appease does not work Howard Dean. Are you going to be a LEADER and do the right thing for the voters instead of favoring your candidate. I have unmasked you and know your intentions. Your role as DNC chairman is quite LACKING and you will be ultimately responsible for a loss in November if Florida and Michigan's voters are MISHANDLED!!!!

Posted by: Hispana | April 3, 2008 10:48 AM | Report abuse

obama posted ads in florida newspapers so that is a form of campaining so he broke the rules and lied about campaining in florida so he shoul not get any of the votes rules are rules

Posted by: dixieb | April 3, 2008 10:44 AM | Report abuse

Obama did not personally campaign in Florida, but he did spend 1.3 million in ads in that state. Hillary should receive the the number of delegates and voter count , she received in that primary. Obama did not follow rules , he advertised and he still lost. His name remained on the ballot. Import read: Could the Republicans Pick the Democratic Nominee? - The Untold Story of How the GOP Rigged Michigan and Florida http://www.huffingtonpost .com

Posted by: jpannebecker | April 3, 2008 10:13 AM | Report abuse

Have you ever seen a picture of Howard Dean in which he looks 'CAPABLE'. Not surprised he has this 'all mucked up' !!!

Posted by: darkhillbilly | April 3, 2008 9:32 AM | Report abuse

The myth being spread by the obamabots that Hillary "agreed" to not have the FL & MI delegates count, she agreed she wouldn't campaign there and she didn't obama did. And the nerve of obama and his nutbag supporters of trying to disenfranchise 2.5 million Democrats is not only disgusting it is idiotic to think that obama could win these states after telling 2.5 million people they don't matter. Sorry Hillary has the popular vote and is damn close in delegates with these 2 states and very well could over come the delegate count with these States. obama won't win the general if he is nominated because of his sleazy tactics and his sleazy supporters.

Posted by: sjl106 | April 3, 2008 9:31 AM | Report abuse

Barack Obama's removal of his name from the Michigan primary ballot was an act of naivety, inexperience and poor judgment, which will permeate his tenure as President if elected. He, initially, sided with undemocratic rules of the DNC and Howard Dean and company against the Forces of Democracy and the rights of Member States to be heard. Now that the DNC and Howard Dean and company are reversing course, under extreme pressure from these Forces of Democracy, all Obama is left to do is 'whine' about not being on the ballot. Since he chose to, effectively, boycott the Michigan primary, he should be accorded NO delegates unless his name is 'Uncommitted' and the delegates should be seated at the convention under the names to which they were pledged. This goes for the Florida primary, too. If this undoes the Democratic Party, as it very well may, then you have Howard Dean and company to thank or blame, depending on your perspective (along with Barack Obama who so gullibly and shortsightedly followed this id*** to party demise).

As for the nominating process in general, I haven't seen anything as UNDEMOCRATIC in my life. I say do away with all the staggered primaries and caucuses, disenfranchisement, double-voting, party-switching, pledged delegates and super delegates and lets strap it up and have good 'old-fashioned' national primary elections, ruled by Democracy: One person-One vote, registered Party Members or registered Independents only, most POPULAR VOTES win nomination!

In Texas, I had to go vote twice for a candidate: primaries in the day, caucuses at night. A candidate won the primaries and the POPULAR VOTE but lost the caucuses (the same voters that voted in the daytime primaries didn't all show up again at night to caucus) and, consequently, lost the election and the delegate count, which they are still counting and arguing about nearly two months later.

What's with all the Republicans voting in the Democratic primaries for candidates that they deem easier-to-defeat in the general election? I say if you register as Republican, Democrat or Independent and vote in a national primary election, then you are OBLIGED to vote the same in the national general election! NO more Bait and Switch! For state and local elections, rules can be set by individual states but not for the national elections! If the candidate that you voted for in the national primaries doesn't win the nomination then your options in the general election are to vote along party lines with which you are registered or vote UNCOMMITED! NO more Bait and Switch!

What a turn off! This 'AIN'T' Democracy! More like 'THIRD-WORLD'; only worse!!!

Posted by: darkhillbilly | April 3, 2008 9:17 AM | Report abuse

dj333 - thanks for injecting a much needed note of sanity. FL and MI cannot get full recognition, esp. if it would tilt the outcome, since would-be voters were frozen out, thinking it was all for naught. OTOH, it would be suicidal in the GE to allow this to fester in 2 critical states.

This isn't the clash of civilizations or a moral crisis of the first order. It's a practical political problem and requires a pragmatic solution, balancing interests
of all involved and patching this over so the candidate isn't hobbled by the issue in the GE. However, it can't become the deciding element in tilting the nomination to a candidate who otherwise would have trailed in delegates and in the trending polls.

I'm an Obama supporter who will vote for Clinton if she can turn the tide running in favor of Obama and fairly gain support of the majority of delegates. I won't agonize if the Super Ds break in her favor because Obama gets clocked in PA, she finishes strong in NC and his polls are trending down. That would represent a reasoned judgment that his candidacy is too narrow to win in November. But I might draw the line if PA was close, he won NC and the MI-FL settlement becomes a Trojan Horse for a coup d'etat by her forces at the convention. That would split the party as badly as 1968.

Posted by: zoot1 | April 3, 2008 8:31 AM | Report abuse

Sounds like a lot of people are jumping the gun, here: a hotel room is not a seat on the floor, and I doubt *anybody* knows how this will turn out yet.

One plan I heard was to refuse to seat the illegal delegations during the balloting, then as soon as the votes are all cast and the nominee is chosen, there will be a move to invite the exiled delegates to the convention, which will pass unanimously, and allow them to vote on such things as party platform, and to do all the other things that go on at a national convention *excluding* voting on the nominee. Will that happen? We'll just have to wait and find out.

Dean is actually not that loose a cannon - he had some baggage with Iowa and NH (he actually lost Iowa in 04 because he'd spoken against their first caucus status in an interview in 02, but that didn't get much play outside Iowa) which tied his hands when dealing with early states, but he probably isn't going to take an extreme position on the final status of those delegates (seating them in violation of the rules in play when they were selected would be an extreme position, as would baring them from the convention entirely). Counting them as half-votes (the RNC solution to their earlys) probably wouldn't make anyone happy, since it wouldn't give Clinton enough votes to overtake Obama (which would make her task of winning with super-delegates that much harder). The 50/50 option might also work, if it became clear that there was no way they would be allowed to alter the outcome of the pledged delegate race - and I doubt they will be allowed to do that. If they did, it would taint Clinton's win.

People who see a big conspiracy here to keep the powerful white woman down should really get a grip - these rules were made at a time when everybody expected the race to be over on super-tuesday. Most people actually expected Clinton to have won by now, and the plan was that these delegates would not matter, and they'd be given their seats with a symbolic slap on the wrist. It's not Dean's fault Hillery's campaign had a melt down early on and Obama's took off - I mean, the same thing happened in the Republican race and everything worked out fine there ;^P

Posted by: dj333 | April 3, 2008 3:36 AM | Report abuse

"the apportionment wouldn't effect his lead."

Mr. Weisman, PLEASE NOTE: "effect" is still a noun. "Affect" is still a verb.
Might you correct this to "the apportionment wouldn't affect his lead."

Posted by: infuse | April 3, 2008 1:49 AM | Report abuse

The hotel rooms announcement was a big deal.

Negotiating for the voting arrangements will be done in time for the convention. It is likely each Florida delegate will only get a half-vote, which is the penalty written down in the party rules and the same as the GOP penalty. The "sudden death" 0 vote committee decision designed to stop more states from moving their primary dates forward will be revoked.

I hope the state party leaders will also lose half their votes, they are the ones who started this mess.

Once FL is resolved it will be a guide for MI. The big loser is Clinton as gaining 10 or so FL votes will leave her over 100 votes short at the convention.

Posted by: gary_ | April 2, 2008 11:11 PM | Report abuse

Forget the fact that this is destroying democracy in so many ways (especially for those who thought they couldn't cast a meaningful vote for their desired candidate), let's just think ahead... to the 2012 campaign.
States: Have your primaries whenever you want - Jan 2012, Nov 2011 or, why not go the whole nine yards, and have it in 2010?
Candidates: Never take your name off the ballot, even if told to. Campaign in every state, even if told not to.
Voters: Vote for you candidate, even if their name is not on the ballot and everyone says it won't count. Remember, everyone, the votes will count (Politicians have always been afraid of democracy)!
So, many thanks HRC - your desperation to get elected has ensured that the 2012 election campaign will start before you even take the Oath of Office. CNN thanks you (No one else will!).
P.S. If it's fine to cheat and get away with it, can we all go back and get perfect scores in our SATs?

Posted by: justzig | April 2, 2008 11:06 PM | Report abuse

Hey, now Florida knows how the rest of us feel. Then they voted for gwb in 2004 .

Posted by: majorteddy | April 2, 2008 10:44 PM | Report abuse

"This should never have gone on so long !"

A. Quit whining.

B. Nice to know that so many people regurgitate MSM talking points. The process has gone on this long in the past. There was no drumbeat trying to oust a candidate before. Wonder why so many tried to force Hillary to drop out when so many are left to vote? Here's an idea! Let the people vote, count the votes, and stop whining and puking out media blowhards' ridiculous talking points.

Posted by: millerz | April 2, 2008 8:14 PM | Report abuse

"This should never have gone on so long !"

A. Quit whining.

B. Nice to know that so many people regurgitate MSM talking points. The process has gone on this long in the past. There was no drumbeat trying to oust a candidate before. Wonder why so many tried to force Hillary to drop out when so many are left to vote? Here's an idea! Let the people vote, count the votes, and stop whining and puking out media blowhards' ridiculous talking points.

Posted by: millerz | April 2, 2008 8:13 PM | Report abuse

Now I know why the Fascist in Italy, the Nazis in Germany and the Communist in the Soviet Union were so successful, initially; all this talk about the party, the party, the party by democrats who want Obama to be crowed ruler is sick. It's the people who count, the ones who voted in Michigan and Florida, not the party and that's what is being left out here. Really democracy is wasted on some of you!

Posted by: jamesbaie | April 2, 2008 6:34 PM | Report abuse

all votes? What about the people who would have voted in their own primary instead of the other, or stayed home, under the impression that they wouldn't have any delegates? Their voices don't count, apparently. So you give some people their supposed voice, but not others? But hey, it's okay, since it works out well for Hillary...

What about accountability for the state legislatures for playing games with their votes? We are a country of rules. Except when it comes to the Clintons, it seems...

Posted by: Charlene-K | April 2, 2008 4:49 PM | Report abuse

Hillary said she would agree not to count the Florida and Michigan primaries because they would be before New Hampshire. Hillary lied to the New Hampshire voters she really didn't care if New Hampshire was not first. The New Hampshire primary should be redone, then suddenly Hillary will once again say she is against Florida and Michigan counting because she would need the New Hampshire voters. You can't trust Hillary she says what ever she needs to say to help herself, she is a compulsive liar. For the war against the war. For NAFTA against NAFTA. Sniper fire in Bosnia, no sniper fire in Bosnia. WE are tired of presidents that lie. Hillary Clinton is not truthful or trustworthy.

Posted by: info4 | April 2, 2008 4:47 PM | Report abuse

Thank you Mr. Dean for doing the right thing:
All votes counts.

Posted by: hoangtmhanh | April 2, 2008 4:42 PM | Report abuse

affect his lead, affect, not effect.

Posted by: GaiasChild | April 2, 2008 4:32 PM | Report abuse

donnight! That's not fair! I was going to say that :-)

Posted by: icache | April 2, 2008 4:25 PM | Report abuse

Howard Dean, Looser look at who is leading the pack, no wonder the Democrats are struggling with this issue. Just look at his track record speaks volumes to this subject.

Posted by: usmdillon | April 2, 2008 4:24 PM | Report abuse

This is awesome news and the first step to seating the delegates and counting the votes. I thank you and President Clinton thanks you.

Posted by: TALVES | April 2, 2008 3:44 PM | Report abuse

The delegates should be seated in both Florida and Michigan. We cannot disenfranchise three million voters. It was not the voters who made the silly decision to be penalized. Howard Dean and the two legislatures created this mess; they need to clean it up. Dean's censure was far too severe.

Posted by: Kansas28 | April 2, 2008 3:07 PM | Report abuse

We all know that eventually they will seat the delegations in the benefit of the Democratic Party. No one wants to every be tarnished with the notion that they disenfranchised million of voters.

Should the arrangement of seating Florida & Michigan be left to Obama & Clinton to agree upon or should the Party decide?

http://www.youpolls.com/details.asp?pid=2018

.

Posted by: f.fox1212 | April 2, 2008 2:44 PM | Report abuse

JakeD-Brokered?

Try:

"BROKEN"! :-)

And Howling screams: YEeaaaAaHHHHH!

And the RED State of Florida relpies:

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!! ;~)

Posted by: rat-the | April 2, 2008 2:34 PM | Report abuse

Wow, who got to Dean?

Posted by: Debmood | April 2, 2008 2:30 PM | Report abuse

donnight said:

"The beginning of the end for Obama, followed closely by the end of the Democratic Party as a meaningful political entity.
The backlash from disenchanted Obamacrats watching Hillary steal the nomination will be incalculable. Hillary's hubris will be the end of the Democratic Party for a generation."

Nothing else NEEDS to be said!

Posted by: CitizenXX | April 2, 2008 2:07 PM | Report abuse

donnight:

From your finger-tips to God's ear ...

Posted by: JakeD | April 2, 2008 1:19 PM | Report abuse

I was so enthused when this primary season began...now I am worn out and am getting to the point where I really don't care which of these candidates wins. This should never have gone on so long ! Hillary Clinton has reached the point where it is obvious she covets this win so much it completely overshadows what is good for the party. She does not care....she just wants to be president, and actually it is Bill Clinton who keeps pushing and pushing. He is obsessed with the very thought that he and Hillary may be the first (and probably only) husband-wife couple who may be president. He is salivating at the thought of their legacy.

Posted by: beccajo | April 2, 2008 1:13 PM | Report abuse

The beginning of the end for Obama, followed closely by the end of the Democratic Party as a meaningful political entity.
The backlash from disenchanted Obamacrats watching Hillary steal the nomination will be incalculable. Hillary's hubris will be the end of the Democratic Party for a generation.

Posted by: donnight | April 2, 2008 1:05 PM | Report abuse

BROKERED CONVENTION!!!

Posted by: JakeD | April 2, 2008 12:45 PM | Report abuse

The comments to this entry are closed.

 
 
RSS Feed
Subscribe to The Post

© 2010 The Washington Post Company