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Maureen Dowd Samizdat

    Last night a friend handed over two pieces of paper containing words that I quickly recognized to be one of the most precious commodities in the current information marketplace: The Maureen Dowd column. A black market printout. This was like the samizdat of the Soviet dissidents. My hands trembled, and as I rapidly scanned the column I kept telling myself, "Slow down, slow down." Instinct makes you want to rush through the thing before someone takes it away.

    You can't get the Dowd column online anymore unless you are willing to pay a fee to enter a newly created garden of journalistic delights called Times Select. Conceivably you could also buy the newspaper itself, the actual pulped-tree thing, with all those sections and inserts and agate-type listings of things you don't care about, but the Times costs an entire dollar. If you could save that dollar every day, by the end of the week you'd have enough money for a beer, if perhaps not one of the fussier microbrews.

    In any case, most of my acquaintances simply throw Dowd parties. An email goes out: "Dowdfest at MacArthur Blvd. Starbucks!" And then everyone converges. Someone always has a photocopy of Mo's latest savage tweaking of the Bush dynasty. It's never clear where the samizdat originates -- I assume some computer whiz has hacked into the Times Select wallgarden. Although I haven't done a full survey, I believe the Frank Rich crowd gets together at Java House, the Paul Krugman fans gather at Busboys & Poets, and the David Brooksians can be found at the Metropolitan Club. The key thing is, Times Select is bringing people together in new mini-communities that are dedicated not only to their favorite Times columnist but also to the principle that no one should be forced to pay for opinion columns. It feels revolutionary. It feels like the Prague Spring.

    Another huge drawback to Times Select is that the columnists are under extreme pressure to produce writing that can justify a surcharge. You can sense they're straining. No doubt they will pound out a perfectly fine column and then think: Is it good enough for Times Select? And then they'll go back into it and insert allegedly more valuable insights and jokes and observations, not realizing that they're destroying the natural warp and woof of the column. Especially the woof.

    Times Select demands that columnists produce not just the usual written material, but all kinds of "extras," like their favorite cookie recipe, their private list of Top Ten Beatles Songs, and their secret feelings about major public figures that they could never normally publish due to libel concerns. Some of this falls into the Too Much Information category. Do we need to know their brand of shampoo? Personally I am totally supportive of Mo's refusal to install DowdCams at her desk, in her car and in her home. I think it was invasive of the Times to demand that she be miked around the clock, and submit to regular electroencephalographs so that readers could monitor the electrical patterns of her brain. At some point it becomes just a little sick. I'm not playing along and I'm not paying along, ya dig? And one more thing: DOWDFEST AT STARBUCKS AT NOON!!!!

By Joel Achenbach  |  October 6, 2005; 7:35 AM ET
 
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Comments

Where is everyone? Gone to the Dowdfest already?

Posted by: Mary Ann | October 6, 2005 9:33 AM | Report abuse

Any chance you'd risk throwing those of us in the Midwest a bone by passing along some of that Dowd? We're getting a little hungry out here. Not literally, of course- all quite well fed in the Midwest.

I think it was Wonkette yesterday who pointed out that Maureen Dowd is the only TimesSelect columnist who isn't playing along with special features for the paying. She's protesting, apparently.

Posted by: suecris | October 6, 2005 9:36 AM | Report abuse

No one comes here anymore. There's a thing called Post Select where, for a fee, you can get a version of the Post web site that doesn't include the Achenblog.

Posted by: Achenbach | October 6, 2005 9:37 AM | Report abuse

Joel, don't Dubcek that column, my friend.

Posted by: Dolphin Michael | October 6, 2005 9:40 AM | Report abuse

Right on, Achenbach. The Revolution will not be televized; it will downloaded and streamed. Fight the Power, Comrade.


And I totally heart Dowd, and am too poor throw cash at the Times to let me read her column. I am thinking of having moms back in NY cut the column out of her dead tree copy, and then mail it too me snail-mail style. This totally cramps my style, however. What kind of revolutionary has mom cut out newspaper columns? Those Times folks are crafty.

Posted by: LP | October 6, 2005 9:40 AM | Report abuse

On one hand, you have to respect what the NYT is doing, even if the whole conceit is a little silly.

I'm actually giddy about the inevitability of the first NYT piracy lawsuit. It has the possibility of redefining the very nature of newspapers and journalism as we know it. I think that news should be free, or at least availible for a nominal fee on every street corner. Broadcast news is free, but with cable news is it headed the way of the broadsheet? Is access to news a priviledge, or a right? And when the founding fathers wrote the 1st Amendment, did they do so with the assumption that the press would always be accessible to everyone, and not just those who can afford a computer, internet, and subscription fee?

Posted by: jw | October 6, 2005 9:42 AM | Report abuse

Oh, and what's wrong with the comics on the WaPost site? are we going to have to pay for our morning chuckles, too?

Posted by: LP | October 6, 2005 9:42 AM | Report abuse

When the First Amendment was written, jw, most average folks wouldn't even have been able to read, much less have access to any kind of newspaper. I don't think the founding fathers would have been too concerned that joe shmoe couldn't moniter their every movement 24/7.

Posted by: LP | October 6, 2005 9:47 AM | Report abuse

Good point--but also only white male landholders could vote. The group of people who should be informed about current events has expanded a bit.

Posted by: jw | October 6, 2005 9:49 AM | Report abuse

About Maureen Dowd's passive resistance to Times Select, it wasn't Wonkette, it was this:

http://www.mediainfo.com/eandp/news/article_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1001260315

though god only knows how I happened to have read that yesterday.

My brain cells are dying, I guess.

Posted by: suecris | October 6, 2005 9:58 AM | Report abuse

Mr. Achenbach

You are hereby ordered to cease and desist from all reading, perusal, scanning, glimpsing, peeking, reviewing, coveting, parsing, considering, evaluating, proofreading; deciphering; studying; apprehending, comprehending, or conveying any articles, treatese, white papers, columns, or polemics issued, published, written or transmitted by Maureen Dowd under penalty of being forced to read The Rush Limbaugh Story: Talent on Loan from God an Unauthorized Biography 700 times while at work.

Please conduct yourself accordingly.

Posted by: UnmarkedCow | October 6, 2005 10:01 AM | Report abuse

Maybe we should invent a place where the lowlanders could go and read books, magazines and newspapers for free. We could call it a Public Bookmagnewsary or something like that. Nah, on second thought, that would be way too radical. It would be like supporting communism, socialism, Achenblogism or something along those lines. Fuggetabooooit.

Posted by: Oim Oim | October 6, 2005 10:08 AM | Report abuse

I doubt that the framers of the Constitution were too concerned about who could or couldn't buy and read the news, they were much more concerned about making sure that anyone with the means to do so could publish it.

By way of helping pay for this forum, my roommate subscribes to the paper edition & I buy it 3-4 times a week at the stand. Ten or so copies a week in a household of three should be sufficient for their needs, I think. I also recently have gotten in the habit of clicking on an advertisement or two every time I'm on the Post website. I think that's how they get paid.

Posted by: Bob S. | October 6, 2005 10:09 AM | Report abuse

I have already written to Maureen Dowd AND the Washington Post protesting Times Select! It sure was a clever way to milk us some more, but I am not only not buying Timmes Select, I won't even buy the New York Times at the newstand as I do every Sunday and sometimes during the week. Money grabbers everywhere, there is only so much in MY wallet! I am hooked on Maureen Dowd and Paul Krugman, but, I will fight the habit and kick it! Maureen, Paul, I will miss you.

Posted by: jAmanda | October 6, 2005 10:12 AM | Report abuse

Wait--I've got it! You could call it a Pagetorium. And it would be free for everyone!

Posted by: jw | October 6, 2005 10:13 AM | Report abuse

Bob, I do the same thing. I like paging through a paper much more than trying to find something on the website, and I think it's important to do my little part to support all the chats and online-only stuff the Post privides.

Posted by: jw | October 6, 2005 10:16 AM | Report abuse

Hmmm. Jealous? I like Achenbach and Maurteen Dowd columns. I'm willing to pay $40 a year--early signup discount--to read her AND Frank Rich. (I ignore the other TimesSeelect nonsense.) I only wish the Post were as provocative on the OpEd page.

Posted by: notanitpicker | October 6, 2005 10:16 AM | Report abuse

JA, is it true what Bob S. says, that WaPo is paid by how many times we click on ads? If so, I will happily click away in order to keep WaPo from going the way of the Times.

If not enough people subscribe to Times Select, I imagine the NYT will have to figure something else out if it wants to keeps its op-ed columns. Personally, I think the Times does itself a disservice by reducing the number of people reading its opinion pages.

Posted by: TA | October 6, 2005 10:17 AM | Report abuse

I've always been religiously opposed to the NYT anyway. Stupid New York. It was a sad day when they bought the Boston Globe.

Posted by: jw | October 6, 2005 10:17 AM | Report abuse

I'm glad I'm not addicted to the Dowd column. The memory is still fresh of the pain and suffering I experienced when the Post failed to make the Rough Draft column available online a few weeks ago. I called the webmaster/customer service in DC and was told it "must be an oversight" and they would get it fixed right away, and after that they never answered the phone or returned my calls. I went to three different news outlets, but in my area, no go. I went to the library, but they don't get the paper until 10 days after the pub date (they must have it mailed at special printed matter rate). I was on my last gasp when Joel finally linked us up to the Tallahassee Democrat. To develop another dependency like my Achenhabit would be waaay too risky.

Posted by: Abby | October 6, 2005 10:18 AM | Report abuse

I paid. Paid early in fact. What the hell else can we do way up here in northern Vermont. What's going to happen when all the major centers of intellectual insight begin to charge; another widening of the crack between haves and have nots, between rich and poor will surely result. Many more may become members of the great uninformed by virtue of lack of money. The net effect will be a deepening of poverty and we all lose. So far I don't think Times Select is worth it except there's no other way to pick so many brains.

Posted by: Stephen | October 6, 2005 10:22 AM | Report abuse

Pagetorium! Eureka! It will revolutionize the collective American mind! All our children will be geniuses! What a great idea. Hey, wait a minute, am I supposed to believe that somebody actually pays the Kaboodle Master? What? Do I look like I just fell out of a tree or something? I mean, if you could see me. Hah. Paid... The Kaboodle Master... That's a good one.

Posted by: Oim Oim | October 6, 2005 10:25 AM | Report abuse

I'm not about to pay out for TimesSelect either but isn't this just another step in a familiar direction? e.g. what would WP, NYT, et al do with log-on e-mail addresses? And readers continually manuever thru goofy and/or irritating ads, see above on this page, just to read the "free" stuff. It's not news friends, it's profit.

Posted by: LB | October 6, 2005 10:25 AM | Report abuse

I used to be hooked on Salon online magazine, read it first thing every morning until they started charging for some of THEIR articles! They taunted with you with just a smidgen of the article, then said you must join "Premium Salon" in order to read the full report. Well, I stopped going to Salon and went to the Washington Post to read Dowd and Krugman, who were so much better than the Salon columnists anyway! So...now..... :-( same ole same ole! Who do I go to next???

Posted by: Amanda | October 6, 2005 10:28 AM | Report abuse

Dudes, like, oh my gawd, I've just discovered this place that carries newspapers and magazines and books and, like, they even have computers with internet access for free. Public Libraries.

Posted by: peanutgallerymember | October 6, 2005 10:30 AM | Report abuse

I agonized over the Times Select for a week, truly agonized, I tell you. I have a friend on the East Coast who said that once the fee for the NYT op-edders kicked in, he would send me a bootlegged electronic copy of the op-eds. A week passed and then no e-mails from him.

My husband and I did some rough math--we figured that the NYT Select columns would cost 11 cents a day. Can we afford 11 cents a day? Yes. Would I get 11 cents of enjoyment out of the columns each day? Absolutely. I was having severe NYT op-ed withdrawal, so after a week's time, we pulled out the credit card. (Then I hear from my friend.) There are two columnists most responsible my gut-wrenching withdrawal pains: Dowd, of course, and Frank Rich.

Now, I can see the additional "features" of being a NYT Select member. Why, one can e-mail Frank Rich with one's latest opinion about television shows? I can join Tierney's book club and his discussion of that month's book. (I saw his list. I, too, bought "1481" this past month. But why did he select "Madame Bovary's Ovaries"? I perused, at some length, Garreau's "Radical Evolution" and would love to discuss the Heaven and Hell scenarios with Tierney and others who have read Garreau. But where's the interactivity?)

And guess what? Also no interconnectivity? No blogs. No group chats. In that respect, the Washington Post is head and shoulders above the New York Times. I believe that the relationship between a newspapers and its readers should be dynamic.

Heck, when I was studying for my Certificate in Telecommunications Management at Golden Gate University in San Francisco, we were looking at electronic information services over coaxial cable--when it was called Videotext. Today, it's known as the Internet. You would really think that the Times would get with the times! (Ha, ha, laughing at own play on words!)

I see even Jay Rosen, in Howie Kurtz's very recent column, thinks the Washington Post is edging out the Times as the East Coast paper of record. (However, I think there are strengths and weaknesses to both papers, so I choose to have both in my world.)

For those talking about early media in the colonies/states, may I recomend Paul Starr's Pulitzer-prize winning "The Creation of the Media: Political Origins of Modern Communications."

I have no portrait or silhouette of Joseph--or Mary White--Loomis when they settled Connecticut in 1639. But Joseph's signature exists. He could write, so presumably he could read. And perhaps that has made all the difference in our collective family history.

Posted by: Linda Loomis | October 6, 2005 10:32 AM | Report abuse

Yikes, that post was snarky. It was funnier in my head. I need more practice on being cuttingly funny but not snarky....

Posted by: peanutgallerymember | October 6, 2005 10:33 AM | Report abuse

Amanda writes:
went to the Washington Post to read Dowd and Krugman, who were so much better than the Salon columnists anyway!

WOW!
Front page news...Dowd and Krugman join the WP! Quick, get Amanda a map, an electronic map!

Posted by: Loomis | October 6, 2005 10:34 AM | Report abuse

Couldn't someone write in here telling us about this "great Dowd article" and then go on to tell us exactly what it is??? I mean, maybe someone who gets the paper because they can afford it could write in so we can ALL read the articles! Would that be legal?? I heard the article yesterday about "Bush's Buttoned Up Nannies" was great. It was about those "strong women" around him, like Rice, Hughes and Mier!! Wish I could have read about his nannies! :-( And we have no coffee shop Dowd fan clubs here!

Posted by: Amanda | October 6, 2005 10:35 AM | Report abuse

Am gratified to see that we haven't blinked yet - perhaps the NYT will reconsider - http://technorati.com/ and http://www.johntabin.com/neverpayretail/
good sources.

Posted by: nate roth | October 6, 2005 10:35 AM | Report abuse

Here is a suggestion from Canada. Our govt. should stop all sales of newsprint paper to the times until they rescind that that stupid Times Select nonsense
I would'nt mind a popup or two extra of advertising to help pay for the cost to the times for the free internet edition

Posted by: jacques | October 6, 2005 10:36 AM | Report abuse

Complaints, complaints-go see what it costs to read the columns in the Independent (the co.uk one). And after you read them you may need to get them translated into American. But where else can I get my Fisk fix?

Posted by: hmr | October 6, 2005 10:41 AM | Report abuse

I read the New York Times on the web every day. It was an addiction. I had to read it. I decideded to "cold turkey" on 9/19/05.
For us old enough to remember/understand the rants about liberals/democrats being elitist,having to pay for Dowd and Co. is just absurd. It's like paying for a tee-shirt with a logo. They've conned you into not only buying their shirt but paying for their advertising.
I guess I'll go back to being one of the unwashed masses and have to figure out my own opinion!

Posted by: Karen Davis-Beam | October 6, 2005 10:42 AM | Report abuse

Public Libraries, peanutgallerymember?

That's so, like, 20th century.

Posted by: LP | October 6, 2005 10:42 AM | Report abuse

I've always enjoyed reading the NYT, but I have grown to love the WaPost much more in the past year or so. When I was taking a news writing class (before I changed my major from Public Relations to Art History because I realized I wasn't into the corporate aspect of things) we were told to read a local paper, the NYT, the WaPost and a Los Angeles paper of our choice at least once a week. Most of us just read them on the internet, but some of us took out subscriptions. I bought a subscription to the WaPost and the local paper and then I picked up a NYT on campus once a week and read an L.A. paper (I can't remember which one and I don't care to take the time to find out) online. I always enjoyed the Post much more than the Times, so I have been a Post reader since.

Now that we have this whole Achenblog community going, I feel even more loyal to the Post because I have much more interaction with it. I agree with Linda. A paper that has a dynamic relationship with its readers is more enjoyable and interesting.

Posted by: Sara | October 6, 2005 10:43 AM | Report abuse

I didn't know how close to the mark I was the other day when I wrote that the only person that Joel would support for the supreme court was Dowd. I don't read the columns of people who only write about their agenda, much less pay for the privilege. I think that the Times is going to have trouble charging people for what used to be free. The only online that I pay for is the WSJ.

Posted by: LB | October 6, 2005 10:44 AM | Report abuse

Okay Loomis.... You know that I know Krugman and Dowd write for the New York Times! It was an error, yes, glad you brought it to my attention! Your post didn't really catch mine, actually!

Posted by: Amanda | October 6, 2005 10:46 AM | Report abuse

There's more to the explanation. Use the link.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samizdat

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia.
For other uses, see Samizdat (disambiguation).

Samizdat, book published by Pathfinder Press containing a collection of forbidden Trotskyist Samizdat textsSamizdat (self-published, in Russian самиздат) was a grassroots practice to evade officially imposed censorship in the Soviet-bloc countries wherein people clandestinely copied and distributed government-suppressed literature or other media. The idea was that copies were made a few at a time, and anyone who had a copy and access to any sort of copying equipment would make more copies.

Posted by: Loomis | October 6, 2005 10:46 AM | Report abuse

GADZOOKS another LB posted at 10:25!

Posted by: LB | October 6, 2005 10:47 AM | Report abuse

Thank you, thank you, nate roth!

Posted by: suecris | October 6, 2005 10:49 AM | Report abuse

Yes Amanda, we have the technology. It is called reverse engineering, if you are into engineering; I don't know what journalists call it, but we can pretty much determine what Mo Dowd will be writing about next week by studying her past columns, her DNA and east coast cloud formations and then comparing that data with the latest Bush speech. FBI profilers do it all the time; that's how they caught the UNI Bomber so quickly.

Posted by: Oim Oim | October 6, 2005 10:50 AM | Report abuse

interestingly, before the Times went to Select its site was one of the most stable--now its one of the more unstable ones....are site crashes one of the real costs of greed?
I too was addicted to the columns mentioned- until the cost of Select made me realize that the addiction was only to my own opinions heard in an echo-chamber -not much of a challenge there.
Saving money thus saves time as well.

Posted by: Kirk | October 6, 2005 10:54 AM | Report abuse

Oim Oim, how clever! Go for it! Today would not be a good day for me to study Dowd, nary a cloud in the sky! I started to listen to the latest Bush speech a little while ago, shut him down! Dowd's DNA????? really!

Posted by: Amanda | October 6, 2005 10:58 AM | Report abuse

I thought Bush was going to talk about Iraq on TV tonight, was looking forward to getting in "watching the president" mode and having fun. Missed it - darn!

Posted by: suecris | October 6, 2005 10:58 AM | Report abuse

Dowd, it appears, isn't playing ball with the TimesSelect thing.

http://www.editorandpublisher.com/eandp/news/article_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1001260315

Posted by: Bayou Self | October 6, 2005 11:00 AM | Report abuse

Well it appears that market forces (to wit: declining revenue in the public's recognition that the NYT's news section are now part of its editorial page) are being felt. The question is: will the Times ever the message and return to reporting the news, thus become relevant again?

In the meantime, the very public symptoms of the decline of the NYT (the acidic, venomous crone who can't get past her hate of the "shrub;" the goateed purported academic who has declared himself to be brilliant; the former media critic out of his depth in world and national politics; and the mustachioed guru who grows ever more pompous, now convinced of his infallibility) are now safely hidden behind the curtain of subscription. Such insufferable twits!

Oh, did I mention I do not buy the Times anymore?

Posted by: wep | October 6, 2005 11:02 AM | Report abuse

Meanwhile, this fellow says WP is better than the NYT, and yet never mentions Joel.

http://journalism.nyu.edu/pubzone/weblogs/pressthink/2005/10/04/tms_pst.html

Posted by: Bayou Self | October 6, 2005 11:02 AM | Report abuse

I'm in a vast Post Select wasteland. Surrounded by the deafening roar of Radical Conservatives hell bent on teaching Intelligent Design. I'm currently leading a rag tag faction of independent minded rebels against this oppressive regime. I'm holding out as long as I can, but need help and direction. The OPED folks at NYT used to provide some assistance for those of us trying to fight the good fight. But they have pushed us out of the loop leaving only people like me who are weary of carrying the load alone.

IS ANYONE OUT THERE?

Posted by: MadMaxnKS | October 6, 2005 11:06 AM | Report abuse

I kinda like Friedman

Posted by: LB | October 6, 2005 11:07 AM | Report abuse

What made the NYT a worthwhile site to visit was the quality of its editoral writing. With TimeSelect, you have removed the reason for visiting the Times. The first rule for a newspaper is to be "READ'. The second rule is to hold onto your readers. The Times is failing in both categories.

Posted by: lAlan Carver | October 6, 2005 11:10 AM | Report abuse

Bayou Self,

Below is a link from the article you cited that could have interesting implications for the Achenblog: WaPo hired someone as "Editor, Editorial Innovations" starting a month ago? This sounds like a guy Joel would get along with, so long as he doesn't have Hal-esque aspirations of domination.

http://www.poynter.org/column.asp?id=31&aid=86489

Posted by: Reader | October 6, 2005 11:13 AM | Report abuse

Wep seems to have been quite familiar with the NYT columnists, especially Dowd! You are very well read in the NYT wep, why did you decide to end it all?? Don't you miss them??

Posted by: Amanda | October 6, 2005 11:13 AM | Report abuse

I'd like to wander off topic slightly to muse on the internet. Written communication is obviously more difficult than spoken- no visual cues, no instant feedback, etc. I have always observed that being a good and voracious reader made one a better writer, but this depends upon the quality of material you read. Since there is no qualification for writing on the net, I mean, I'm doing it, then will the internet tend to improve or erode reading and writing skills in the population at large. A lot of folks are probably reading and writing more than they ever did before, but, content aside, a lot of it is pretty pedestrian stuff, unedited, stream of consciousness and not too well thought out (present company excepted of course). What will the be the ultimate result? Will we begin to respect really good writing more or less?

Posted by: kurosawaguy | October 6, 2005 11:17 AM | Report abuse

I believe the NYT is shooting its own foot with this one. I mean, at a moment where its columnists are ranting about how the Bush propaganda is permeating the mayor media outlets and puting a leash on discenting voices, they go and put their most important voices behind a money courtain. Lets face it, The NYT has chosen to make a buck by preaching to the convert and does not care who knows what anymore. Someone should check if the NYT has not been aquired by a neoconservative non-profit group from Texas with money "borrowed" from some soon to be bankrupted trust fund.

If this issue is that important for all of you, imagine how it is for those who live in the third world. I tell you, it's REALLY HARD to get a different voice from up north here in Argentina. I will miss Dowd, Krugman and Friedman (Yes, even him).

Anyway, I´ve already had a moment like this before. I've experienced the angish that comes with the absence of a cherished voice. It didn't happen in NY, though. And it wasn't a matter of reason against political aparatus, either. Do you know who I miss the most? Yes, Michael Franz.

PS, please forgive my spelling errors.

Posted by: Leo | October 6, 2005 11:23 AM | Report abuse

Thanks for the wry look at the same frustration I had recently when - alas! - my daily log-on to read Maureen the Queen's column was thwarted. Maybe the Grey Lady will relent from this greed move, but I'm pessimistic - greed, self-interest and non-civicmindedness having infected the "free" press these days like everywhere else.

Posted by: Preacher Steve | October 6, 2005 11:24 AM | Report abuse

I don't know if I missed somebody else mentioning it but check out Truthout--it sometimes runs Times columnists, including Dowd, Krugman, Herbert. Having said this, I hope the evil ones at Times haven't noticed this and will rush to stop it.
http://www.truthout.org/index.htm

Posted by: linda | October 6, 2005 11:26 AM | Report abuse

You can read NYTimes columnists for FREE

here (sometimes a day late):

http://www.johntabin.com/neverpayretail/

Maureen Dowd should consider working for Washington Post Online!!!!!!!!!

Posted by: cml | October 6, 2005 11:27 AM | Report abuse

kurosawaguy:

Speaking for myself, the internet has given me the opportunity to write ad infinitum for a potentially limitless audience, and even get occasional feedback on my efforts (intermittent reinforcement, works on humans just as well as on rats!)
As a result, I'm sure the quality of my off-the-cuff writing has improved, but concurrently my appreciation for professional writers has increased. It is hard to do what Joel does, and very easy to do what we do out here in the kaboodle.

Posted by: Reader | October 6, 2005 11:29 AM | Report abuse

"Especially the woof"

http://www.bartleby.com/59/4/warpandwoof.html

Posted by: mizerock | October 6, 2005 11:40 AM | Report abuse

I could not take it any longer. I could not leave behind my addiction to Dowd's column. I just renewed my subscription to the Sunday NYY; unfortunately, while I could have subscribed online so that I could read right away Mo, I could not resist the temptation that by mailing in the Subscription Card that I could have 4 more weeks for free; this offer is not available online. NYT: hear that sucking sound? It's the nickle-and-diming of Mo addicts.

Posted by: Forced to Renew Subscription | October 6, 2005 11:41 AM | Report abuse

I asked the Editorial Board not once but twice to at least let us read the "Select" columns in the archival files so I at least pretend to be up to speed with what americas cleverest were thinking.

I would have thought that the "Selected" pundits might themselves have protested. Appearently no-one at "all the news that fit to sell" has any intention of appealing any longer to the prolitariat.

Posted by: Bill | October 6, 2005 11:44 AM | Report abuse

Last time we ordered NYT for home delivery, they constantly left it while we were away--great security system--even though we told them two weeks in advance each time. Then, when we cancelled it--security again--someone bent our windshield wipers and left some crazy note about our complaint. Bought a security system.
Now we buy it on the street. But I'd much rather print out a Dowd column for my spouse than hand him a torn out column.

Posted by: reader from Philly | October 6, 2005 11:45 AM | Report abuse

NYT: great writers, pro-war owners. They will get not one dime from me.

http://www.nationalreview.com/comment/carson200406020845.asp

Posted by: mizerock | October 6, 2005 11:46 AM | Report abuse

K-guy, I don't know but I wonder about the effect on quantity as well as quality. I think there will be a trend towards less quantity on a per poster basis. More short stories and less War and Peaces. However, unlike the Kaboodle Master, I haven't been right about anything yet and my punctuation skills are getting worse by the minute.

Posted by: Oim Oim | October 6, 2005 11:53 AM | Report abuse

mizerock, I must be missing something. The link you provided is another hacked-up piece of NRO filth from the right wing castigating the NYT for being to liberal and easily duped by Saddam Hussein. How does this translate into pro-war owners?

Posted by: suecris | October 6, 2005 12:03 PM | Report abuse

aagggh - too liberal, not "to liberal"

Posted by: suecris | October 6, 2005 12:04 PM | Report abuse

I just tacked on any old article I could link to that referred to the big Judith Miller Hoodwink. Sloppy! Try this one.

http://www.commondreams.org/headlines04/0526-09.htm

Posted by: mizerock | October 6, 2005 12:06 PM | Report abuse

Or, we could link to Al Jazerrah and open the door to all sorts of trolls!

http://www.aljazeerah.info/Opinion%20editorials/2004%20opinions/May/30o/Inventing%20WMD%20at%20the%20New%20York%20Times%20By%20Mike%20Whitney.htm

But, as Bill Bennett would say, that would be wrong.

Posted by: mizerock | October 6, 2005 12:08 PM | Report abuse

Maureen Dowd ought to get the congressional medal of honor!
She's the only one in the press with enough balls to take on Bush.

I've really got to send her some candy and flowers one of these days.

p.s. I subscribe to times select (yup, I'm the guy) I wish I didn't have to pay for it, but I will until they come to their senses and make it free again. They will. Its only a matter of time.

Posted by: TrueAmerican | October 6, 2005 12:16 PM | Report abuse

Am I the only one to ask, what Starbucks? You know, it's not like there's only one in town.

Posted by: MxWPFan | October 6, 2005 12:16 PM | Report abuse

I'm offering 4 downloads from The Best of Neil Young for 2 Krugmans and Dowd.

Posted by: vachon | October 6, 2005 12:17 PM | Report abuse

Joel Achenbach,

Your deep envy to be Dowd is palpable. I sense your ideology and views are not far from hers. You need to be much more cutting and ironic and extreme to be her equal, however. [A little -- or possibly quite a lot--of transgendering would help because a columnist of her ilk is probably more potent as a woman.]

If you can make these adjustments, perhaps the WP will charge for your content, and pay you commensurably.

Good luck with your decision. And note she's not brave enough to have a blog.

Posted by: goombah | October 6, 2005 12:18 PM | Report abuse

mizerock, can you be asserting that the NYT is really secretly pro-war in Iraq? That's a pretty long stretch for me.

I think when you have a Pulitzer-prize winning journalist who knows where the bodies are buried you shut up and let her write what she wants, even if later you have to issue these kinds of emendations/apologies when what she puts out is crap. She's awful, but she's not going to leave the NYT and they are having to live with her, warts and all.

Posted by: suecris | October 6, 2005 12:18 PM | Report abuse

The Times Select has add to my health. I now have to hike the tree blocks to my local library for my Bush Bashing but it's a small price to pay. I sometimes wait days and just gorge.

Posted by: Bob Radcliffe | October 6, 2005 12:21 PM | Report abuse

If the metaphor for Times Select is a garden of journalistic delights then does that make me an allegorical wild flower in the fields of Achenblogia. If so, am I a busboy bloom or a poetic petunia?

Posted by: Oim Oim | October 6, 2005 12:21 PM | Report abuse

I find myself reading the Post website more now and the NYT less. That's how I found Achenblog.

Posted by: Mike | October 6, 2005 12:23 PM | Report abuse

Oim Oim--are you Moi Moi?

Posted by: vulvix | October 6, 2005 12:23 PM | Report abuse

You know, the idea of the NYT making some money off those of us who read on the web isn't so bad, but why such a big lump-sum? And why do they make you buy all the _other_ stuff. I bet they would make more money if just charged you a quarter a column. Who wouldn't be willing to throw quarter off of their credit card 3-4 times a week to the times for reading Paul Krugman (my personal favorite) or David Brooks or whomever. A quarter's not so much. Of course, though, stodgy old NYT cannot POSSIBLY escape the subscription-paradigm of paying for online content. Is it so hard or otherworldly to come up with a pay-for-what-you-read format that makes them some money? I mean, maybe they have to charge 30 or 35 cents a column, but I bet not even that. But having to for over $50 at a time feels like a lot of dough, and then what if I don't read it _enough_ to be worth my while? What if I have a few weeks or a month where I'm in some other country or don't have leisurely access to the internet? Why can nobody (except i-tunes) get out of the tired old subscription paradigm?

Posted by: Dan | October 6, 2005 12:24 PM | Report abuse

The New York Times editorial pages are too contrived and have lost breadth of issues and objectivity. It is evident they have a "directive" to their "elite" columnists to write with single purpose and intent. All styles/opinions seem to be changing.(Read paper for over 40 years.) Keller and Collins (Op-Ed editors) are too evident in their expectaions and purpose. I love Maureen Dowd. Herbert has been directed to write like others. Only one connected to plain Americans and their issues. I too plan to cancel my NY Times subscription. Will buy days when Dowd writes. SAD. VERY SAD.

Posted by: Gloria Cardoso | October 6, 2005 12:24 PM | Report abuse

Where's Videlicit these days?

Posted by: suecris | October 6, 2005 12:25 PM | Report abuse

Thanks for that link, Reader.

Maybe the new guy reads Joel's blog.

Posted by: Bayou Self | October 6, 2005 12:29 PM | Report abuse

I like this notion of fighting greed-inspired efforts like Times Select to make the 'net a revenue stream... so much so, that until eBay, Orbitz, Hotels.com, iTunes, my local artisan friend trying to sell pottery, and others trying to make a buck online start offering their products and services for free, I'm boycotting them all. The consitution needs amending ... the Internet shall be FREE. Fight on brothers and sisters!!!

Posted by: untethered | October 6, 2005 12:36 PM | Report abuse

Vulvix, I once was Moi Moi but the metamorphosis from the third person universe to the first person universe seems to have jumbled my vowels so now I am, Oh I Am, Oh I Am, or Oim Oim for short. In a word, yes.

Posted by: Oim Oim | October 6, 2005 12:38 PM | Report abuse

I could tell it was you. Nice prose. I get my vowels jumbled sometimes, too

Posted by: Vulvix | October 6, 2005 12:41 PM | Report abuse

MO' BETTER BLUES, THANK YOU THANK YOU! I HAVE JUST HAD MY MAUREEN DOWD FIX,THANKS TO YOU!! AHHHHHHHHHHHHH, KEEP IT UP, YOU WILL DRIVE THE NYT NUTS!!! THOSE BUTTONED UP NANNIES ARE SO SPECIAL, AREN'T THEY???

Posted by: Amanda | October 6, 2005 12:42 PM | Report abuse

Joel's not the only one to have a deep envy to be Dowd!

Posted by: pls | October 6, 2005 12:44 PM | Report abuse

Can public libraries pay the subscription fee to give visitors access to the Times Select? It's unconscionable to restrict information, even if it's opinionated, based on solvency.

Posted by: Maren | October 6, 2005 12:47 PM | Report abuse

I recommend you get the Maureen Dowd composition facilitator. It has 120 personal, hate-filled phrases, arranged in 3 equal columns. To compose, choose 10 phrases, at random, from each of the three columns, and link them with punctuation, using your choice of "dubya", "Bush" or "Bushies" wherever a subject or predicate is needed. Just add a theme topic sentence, and magically, you'll have a Maureen Dowd column!

Posted by: Max Bouknecht | October 6, 2005 12:50 PM | Report abuse

***********FREE MAUREEN DOWD***********

http://www.johntabin.com/neverpayretail/


******Bookmark this website**************


**********Pass it on**************

Joel, if you're readidng this, please move this post to number #1 spot!!!!!!!!

Posted by: cml | October 6, 2005 12:50 PM | Report abuse

NYT Select would not cost that much, but JUST SAY NO. If you give in, you will only encourage them.

Posted by: Ed | October 6, 2005 12:55 PM | Report abuse

MxWPfan, Ah ha! Yes, but there is only one Busboys and Poets, as far as I know. So, I am a Krugmanian by default.

Posted by: Oim Oim | October 6, 2005 12:59 PM | Report abuse

Max Bouknecht - don't you think Maureen Dowd is a little mild-mannered to describe as "hate-filled"? I guess it's just frustrating when she disagrees with you, huh? Makes your vision go red and your eyes bulge out? And then you feel the urge to hit something?

There are medications for that, you know.

Posted by: suecris | October 6, 2005 12:59 PM | Report abuse

Terrific rip Joel! I have read the New York Times for many years during and after my long residence in Manhattan. I paid the hefty tab for their Sunday Edition. This Times Select idea will blow up right in their greedy faces. I know calls for the printed word are waning, not with a codger like me, but with a lot of young computerites, but to present a paper on the internet for years, and then make its more attractive features available...at a price, is bound to cause resentment like those three dollar lattes at Starbucks. Nice job.

Posted by: Big Dave | October 6, 2005 1:00 PM | Report abuse

no, suecris, your prescription is for a castration. she's had hers, I think.

Posted by: vulvix | October 6, 2005 1:01 PM | Report abuse

Except, Dave, that those lattes seem to be selling rather well.

Posted by: Bayou Self | October 6, 2005 1:03 PM | Report abuse

TimesSelect. Why? Oh Why? I think I even have to give ANOTHER password. Powerful WP, please press NYT with every great columnist you got.

Posted by: clara | October 6, 2005 1:05 PM | Report abuse

Or should that be Krugmaniac? A little help here, please. Is it Krugmanian or Krugmaniac or both or something else?

Posted by: Oim Oim | October 6, 2005 1:07 PM | Report abuse

wow! my name is being thrown around a lot today! would it that i were making her kinda money!

and jw - watch the nyc bashing - that's my favorite city in the whole wide world! (venice is a close second cuz i don't speak italian)

k-guy - i think the internet is forcing ppl to read more, write more (maybe good, maybe bad cuz we have more IM speak and less punctuation - my bad!) but also i think it will make us appreciate good literature more... i cherish the times that i am offline with a good book - but i work in the IT world so i do it all day... sometimes i need to be offline!

as for oped's - i don't tend to read them... i mean, the whole opinions are like ... well... you know... everyone has one... tho i did enjoy the dowd one about bushie and his nannies...

Posted by: mo | October 6, 2005 1:10 PM | Report abuse

I got my free 14 days, but I'm going to quit today. They slipped in a "Questionaire" promising that it wouldn't really be used for anything, just that they, you know, wanted the info for "research", and stuff like that, and that they would NEVER EVER EVER sell it like my bank does. That was the straw, as it were. So, Dowdness, my love, goodbye forever, farewell, I'll see you in my dreams, we may meet again somewhere, someplace, sometime, in another life perhaps, or maybe from NeverPayRetail, albeit a day late.

Posted by: HollywoodJim | October 6, 2005 1:10 PM | Report abuse

suecris: the NYT, pro-war? Well, they do have corporate / Republican owners, but yeah, it does seem unlikely. Maybe it's just that the lefty blogs still bash them for Miller - and the righty ones just bash on principle. Y'know, because of COURSE the NYT is part of liberal elite, no specific examples (outside of the editorials) are needed.

"NY Times Skews the News... Again"
http://mediachannel.org/blog/node/799

Posted by: mizerock | October 6, 2005 1:11 PM | Report abuse

So, apparently Bush and his gang of terrorism experts have stopped 10 plots in the last 4 years - wow - 10 whole plots. And 3 of them in the U.S.? Gee. That's supposed to make us completely OK with the war in Iraq? Not working, bub.

And of course, Bush hasn't elaborated on the 10 plots. Are you sure it's not 20, there, W.? *rolling eyes*

I can't believe we have another three years of this crap.

Posted by: pls | October 6, 2005 1:12 PM | Report abuse

A mo of our own, and multifaceted at that! Eat your selective hearts out NYT-ers.

Posted by: Oim Oim | October 6, 2005 1:16 PM | Report abuse

Wasn't Maureen Dowd found guilty of plaigerism or something. I find a lot of what she writes about already available through email chain letters and websites.

Posted by: DFT-MD | October 6, 2005 1:18 PM | Report abuse

pls:

My thought today along those lines "three more years..." --was, there's no guarantee that the Republicans won't win in 2008, none at all, and since John McCain is in Hero Mode today with his anti-torture amendment to the military appropriations bill, I actually thought, if McCain ran for President, I might for the first time in my life consider voting Republican, because this country is so far gone that we may need a moderate Republican to bring them back to center before they can even think about being progressive again. I think I'm depressing myself.

Posted by: Abby | October 6, 2005 1:19 PM | Report abuse

Harriet Miers isn't married? Hey, we should get her a husband. I hear Congressman David Dreier is single. I wonder what kind of woman he's romantically attracted to.

Posted by: E. Etage | October 6, 2005 1:21 PM | Report abuse

for the same bucks why not get a year's subscription to The Atlantic, Harper's and maybe even US News with a little left over for a large coffee at Dunkin' Donuts and a cruller of your choice.

As for the NY, I guess that "greed" retains its posiion as one the capitals.

Posted by: eclectiana | October 6, 2005 1:22 PM | Report abuse

mo, my favorite city is also new york. I lived there in a former life, working as a wardrobe lady in the Broadway stage plays. I intend to return in my next life, only this time as an actor. You had asked what I thought of Geraldine Paige in Summer & Smoke. Too busy swooning over Laurence Harvey to notice her. Since you are a Tennessee Williams aficionado, pray tell, did he have a lighter side? All his characters are so tortured.

Posted by: Nani | October 6, 2005 1:24 PM | Report abuse

Someone should clue Dowd in on all this adoration going on over at the competition. I stopped reading (online) the NYT as soon as they imposed that greedy, capitalistic, the proletariat-be-damned TimesSelect. WaPo is better overall anyway; 'specially since it has Achenbach and Weingarten. Not only their witty columns, but blogs and chats! Eat your heart out arrogant NYT, your days are numbered.

Posted by: jlessl | October 6, 2005 1:26 PM | Report abuse

Abby,

I might vote for McCain, too, if he ran. Depends on who the Dem was. (Shhh, don't tell anyone.)

Posted by: pls | October 6, 2005 1:28 PM | Report abuse

I have already called the New York Times to complain about this TimesSelect mess. I love Maureen Dowd's courage and her writing, along with some of the other writers. However, I am on a fixed income and will not give any more of my pension to greedy, capitalistic pigs. One should not have to pay for information.

Posted by: elizabeth foster | October 6, 2005 1:33 PM | Report abuse

The Constitution does not guarantee you the right to your entertainment of choice, for free. Please don't become one of those "the government owes me!!" types - pay up, or visit a library.

I pay Salon.com my yearly coin without a complaint. I would do the same for WaPo - there, I said it - go ahead and start charging! It's a business, not a charity. Until Mo gets a grant from the Corporation for Public Broadcasting, you've got to pay to play.

Posted by: mizerock | October 6, 2005 1:38 PM | Report abuse

I have already called the New York Times to complain about this TimesSelect mess. I love Maureen Dowd's courage and her writing, along with some of the other writers. However, I am on a fixed income and will not give any more of my pension to greedy, capitalistic pigs. One should not have to pay for information.

Posted by: elizabeth foster | October 6, 2005 1:41 PM | Report abuse

awww tanx moi moi! did you really nani? that's very cool! just make sure if you come back as an actor that you are a successful one - pounding the acting pavement as a no name is no fun - i know this from experience! tenn williams himself was a tortured soul... his sister, who he was very close with, had serious mental problems and had a botched labotomy that he never forgave his parents for... he was an alcoholic/drug user and was a victim of a particularly vicious gay bashing tho he wasn't permanently injured (at least physically). most of his life is in those plays/screenplays. the only play i can think of that had a lighter side was night of the iguana - but it's more of a black comedy.

Posted by: mo | October 6, 2005 1:41 PM | Report abuse

I can't wait for the Post to start charging to read your column...

Posted by: LA90012 | October 6, 2005 1:41 PM | Report abuse

I paid for Times Select; Dowd, Rich, Krugerman, et al are well worth the surcharge. I also receive the Sunday NYT at my home (in Texas) as well a subscribe to the WP. If WP decides to do start doing something similiar to Times Select I'll pay for that as well, provided it delivers the same quality of op/ed content.

Posted by: Richard Collins | October 6, 2005 1:41 PM | Report abuse

nani made me think of a question for the 'boodle:

do you think one has to "suffer" for their art? is it more believable/palatable knowing that the artist is speaking from experience?

(eg: tennessee williams characters/plots were almost all from his own personal life)

Posted by: mo | October 6, 2005 1:45 PM | Report abuse

John McCain winning the Republican nomination would be a very good thing for this country. Then, assuming we had a good Democratic candidate, we might actually hear some elevated debate and it would be a win-win situation no matter who was elected.

Posted by: TA | October 6, 2005 1:57 PM | Report abuse

Maureen Dowd's courage?? A woman with an agenda who knows all of the Bush haters eat it up. She writes real Pulitzer stuff.

Posted by: LB | October 6, 2005 1:58 PM | Report abuse

eep! did i commit achenboodlecide?

Posted by: mo | October 6, 2005 2:05 PM | Report abuse

Sara, isn't the Post too political for you? I like it, too, but I'm a political junkie.

Also, have to agree that Dowd's appeal is beyond me. She and Krugman are off the deep end, but Friedman is bright light. A shame I can't keep their insights nearby now. The burden of making sense of this crazy world is now all yours, Joel.

Posted by: Kane | October 6, 2005 2:08 PM | Report abuse

mo, no I don't think deep personal suffering is an absolute requirement for someone to produce great art; it's just that great pain is sometimes a great motivator, but then so is love, joy, guilt, hate-filled doughnuts with green sprinkles on top. I believe there is room for just about everyone in the arts who feels like diving in. Some folks might even enjoy it.

Posted by: Oim Oim | October 6, 2005 2:13 PM | Report abuse

Well, mo, I think great artists in most instances do suffer for their art, and they make those around them suffer for it too. Think of the many instances where an artist has neglected or abandoned loved ones for the sake of their work. Or conversely, try to think of an example of a true artistic genius who is also known as a great parent or spouse. It all comes back to the single minded pursuit of the artistic product to the exclusion of all else.

Posted by: kurosawaguy | October 6, 2005 2:22 PM | Report abuse

But then, if your art causes great pain to others it might not sell very well, but I could be wrong again.

Posted by: Oim Oim | October 6, 2005 2:26 PM | Report abuse

I took a class on madness and the arts, mo, and speaking as an artist myself I say it's a chicken and the egg conundrum - does suffering make an artist or does an artist feel suffering more?

Posted by: LP | October 6, 2005 2:30 PM | Report abuse

mo, I was a darn good wardrobe lady and will be a successful actor, you can count on that. I want those good juicy character roles like Eileen Heckert, Maggie Smith, Diana Rigg and Ruby Dee played. Marlon Brando's life wasn't a bed of roses, the Angel of Grief visited his home more than once. It seems suffering goes with the territory. A good actor probably needs a great deal of empathy, along with and maybe even more than actual experience, wouldn't you think? And a good director don't hurt! I can't wait to see what Philip Seymour Hoffman does with "Capote".

Posted by: Nani | October 6, 2005 2:30 PM | Report abuse

Mo:

You're not a Boodlekiller. You're simply creating a parallel thread, which is a good thing.

No, I don't think an artist necessarily has to suffer to create good art (has Mick Jagger ever really suffered in his career?); it's just that some tremendous art has sprung from the suffering of creative people.

As for paying for access for e-columns, I don't object to it. It's a business decision each paper has to make. I like to think that there are collateral benefits to the paper that make offering free internet access advantageous to it. It seems to be the attitude of the LA Times and the The New Republic.

Posted by: CowTown | October 6, 2005 2:34 PM | Report abuse

If I cut my ear off, will I be able to stay inside of the lines better with my paint by number set?

Posted by: LB | October 6, 2005 2:35 PM | Report abuse

Thinking about art, good writing and suffering has reminded me of "The Golden Notebook" by Doris Lessing. The two things I remember about the book are that nothing I have ever read came as close to making me feel like I knew what it was to be a woman, and that I never wanted to read it again. It was too hard, too intense, too painful.

Posted by: kurosawaguy | October 6, 2005 2:36 PM | Report abuse

I'm too tight to pony up the money just to read the columnists I'd been enjoying so long for free. But, I do miss my bi-weekly Mo-fix. Reading this column and the comments may change my mind, but I keep hoping (in some Never-Never land) that the Times will change its mind.

Posted by: Steve | October 6, 2005 2:37 PM | Report abuse

Krugman is off the deep end???

Sometimes, when an economist tells you how he sees things and can back it up with the stats, I guess it can sting.

Posted by: Dolphin Michael | October 6, 2005 2:38 PM | Report abuse

if you look at some of the greats:
van gogh - mental illness
beethoven - deaf
mozart - didn't he have father issues?
tenn williams - family and substance abuse
picasso - a hole...

i'm sure there are more but i can't think of 'em...

Posted by: mo | October 6, 2005 2:39 PM | Report abuse

LB, only if you use a very sharp knife and cut with great care and precision. Practice makes perfect. Don't worry about the suffering part because it will take care of itself.

Posted by: Oim Oim | October 6, 2005 2:43 PM | Report abuse

I don't have a whole lot of ears that I can practice on.

Posted by: LB | October 6, 2005 2:44 PM | Report abuse

Mozart - you should definitly watch amadeus, mo.

Posted by: LP | October 6, 2005 2:44 PM | Report abuse

Uh, Joel, we have something in this country much scarier than the KGB, and that's the copyright laws. And you're sort of admitting to, uh, violating those laws. Why not talk about your DVD pirating ring next, or, if blowing through trademark law is your thing, when the next shipment of fake Rolexes you're expecting is do in. I mean, the key to breaking these laws is not to write columns about doing so! Of course, there's fair use, and you're a journalist, so maybe no harm, no foul. And you are a humor columnist (or is that George Will?), so maybe you're column isn't a serious confession, right?

I promise I'm not a stick in the mud. But I'm just sayin', don't write about your crimes. Write about your "friend's" crimes. Like, there's this "friend" who photocopies and distributes Dowd columns to all "his" friends, etc., etc.

Next question: why would you want to read her columns on purpose, and go to such lengths to do so? I can understand ACCIDENTLY reading Dowd, but seeking her columns out deliberately strikes me as strange.... very strange. To each his own, I suppose...

Posted by: Huntsman | October 6, 2005 2:45 PM | Report abuse

We are talking about corn here, right? Ears of corn?

Posted by: Oim Oim | October 6, 2005 2:46 PM | Report abuse

Speak up, I can't hear you

Posted by: LB | October 6, 2005 2:51 PM | Report abuse

but see LB - van gogh created art OUTSIDE of the lines...
and k-guy - virginia woolf did that too me... she had MAJOR problems!

according to aristotle's Poetics... great art (specifically tragedy) provides the viewer with the catharsis to experience the emotions without actually going thru the experience first hand...
"Tragedy, then, is an imitation of a noble and complete action, having the proper magnitude; it employs language that has been artistically enhanced . . . ; it is presented in dramatic, not narrative form, and achieves, through the representation of pitiable and fearful incidents, the catharsis of such incidents."

lp - that's a good question - i took psychology of art and i'm an artist as well... as an actor i can tell you that some roles, esp ones with great emotional requirements, can really get to you... sometimes it's easy to forget where you end and the character starts in your effort to be "good"...

Posted by: mo | October 6, 2005 2:53 PM | Report abuse

lp - i did see amadeus - one of my fav movies... (which is where i get the father issues thing from - don't know if it's a true account...) i thought tom hulce did a great job (btw - hulce himself has a LOT of problems)

Posted by: mo | October 6, 2005 2:57 PM | Report abuse

LB writes:
If I cut my ear off, will I be able to stay inside of the lines better with my paint by number set?

Depends. Are you syphilitic?
(as Van Gogh was? Or perhaps you have never loved a woman with great passion?)

I knew my college art major would come in handy some day ;-)

Off topic:
suecris writes:
Where's Videlicit these days?

I miss Vizzy, too. I just wonder if he got in trouble mentioning the male bandicoot with his double-tipped hoo-hah. It was out of context in one of his last posts, but it made me Google "bandicoots." Did you know the female is equally bifurcated/endowed? And I learned a lot about the bandicoot as marsupial.

And don't think this blog hasn't mentioned marsupials. I brought them up in relation to last year's news in terms of civet cats and SARS. Now news in the last two weeks points to scientific studies implicating horseshoe bats as the vector in transmitting SARS.

What got me interested in the topic of marsupials? Why several years ago I met author David Liss and he served me coffee made in the 16th century tradition (EEeewwwww! Yuck! BBleechk!) and our conversation turned to what type of animals are civets (Liss didn't know, so I e-mailed him once I found out), given their "role" in the current coffee industry.

O.K., back to Maureen Dowd.

Posted by: Loomis | October 6, 2005 2:59 PM | Report abuse

mo
I thought about that, but my degree is in science, so I really need to stay inside of the lines

Posted by: LB | October 6, 2005 3:00 PM | Report abuse

Mo,
I believe Beethoven was deaf because of syphilis. Perhaps someone can verify that?

Posted by: Loomis | October 6, 2005 3:01 PM | Report abuse

I have been thinking the past few days about Times Select and part of what I've concluded is that it will inevitably hurt the credibility and careers of the Opinion columnists to be on pay-for-play. Their names may be in the mainstream now, but three years from now we'll all be asking "Maureen who?"

For all the Posts' recent navel-gazing about how they will improve, I wonder if they are paying attention to the wonderful opportunity staring them right in the eyes. They will be able to steal several notable Times' columnists very soon. Question is, will they do it and who would they bump?

Posted by: irregardless | October 6, 2005 3:02 PM | Report abuse

By all accounts Mark Twain was a loving husband and a wonderful parent. So that's one.

"Amadeus", while it is a fine film, seriously slanders Antonio Salieri with its entirely fictitious portrayal of him.

Does Jackie Chan count as a great artist? He has certainly suffered for his art.

Posted by: kurosawaguy | October 6, 2005 3:02 PM | Report abuse

I was taught repeatedly that Beethoven was deaf as a result of child abuse (his father "boxed his ears" as punishment). Of course if the American education system has misinformed me about this, it isn't the only time it has happened.

Posted by: Abby | October 6, 2005 3:05 PM | Report abuse

Gotta weigh in between phone calls --

I have a couple of problems with McCain, even though he is much less nasty and appears to be much less entitlement oriented than the Bushies and their cronies.

First, he has said that he is anti-choice (except, apparently for his daughter, for whom it would be "her choice" -- which doesn't make him any different from the Bush family).

Second, he sucked up to the Bush campaign in 2004, even after Rove & Company eviscerated him in the South Carolina primary in 2000. That, my dear friends, does not show much (many?) balls. No moral center there, in my opinion, nor a particularly straight spine, after having bent over a little once too often.

I miss Maureen Dowd, too. Not willing to fork over my hard earned bucks, though. NYT will have to go on doing what they do without me.

Posted by: firsttimeblogger | October 6, 2005 3:06 PM | Report abuse

Or maybe it was lead poisoning...

Posted by: Click here | October 6, 2005 3:07 PM | Report abuse

re: beethoven (from wikidpedia)

It is unlikely, however, that lead poisoning was the cause of his deafness, which several researchers have seen as caused by an immunopathic disorder such as systemic lupus erythematosus. When the hair was analysed chemically in 1996, distinctive trace-metal patterns associated with genius, irritability, glucose disorders, and malabsorption were not present. Absence of detectable mercury levels was consistent with the view that Beethoven did not have syphilis, which was treated at the time with mercury compounds. The absence of drug metabolites indicates that Beethoven avoided opiate painkillers.

Posted by: mo | October 6, 2005 3:09 PM | Report abuse

Dear Huntsman:
Thank you for the warning on the copyright laws. In court I would defend myself on the grounds that what I write is a pack of lies, also known as "satire," and just in case anyone was wondering, I actually don't think people have some kind of Constitutional right to read MoDo's column for free. I think the decision by the Times to charge readers for something those readers clearly value and might be willing to pay good money for is not on its face an evil act.

Posted by: Achenbach | October 6, 2005 3:19 PM | Report abuse

I knew Joel wrote satire when he said that he put corn gluten on his crabgrass to kill it. Seriously now, no one would really do that.

Posted by: LB | October 6, 2005 3:22 PM | Report abuse

Let me add one more thing, because I'm suddenly enjoying the sound of my voice, or more precisely, fingers on the keyboard: I really like doing this blog, but it could disappear at any second for the simple reason that the labor costs associated with its production may greatly exceed any kind of associated revenue. It's a business. Shocking but true.

Posted by: Achenbach | October 6, 2005 3:23 PM | Report abuse

Jackie Chan, Sun Tzu, sure, why not include them too.

Posted by: Oim Oim | October 6, 2005 3:24 PM | Report abuse

LB: Next year I'm doubling the corn gluten. And if that doesn't work, I'm bring in the concrete. Will just pave the lawn. Will sterilize entire property. Not a little paramecium left alive.

Posted by: Achenbach | October 6, 2005 3:25 PM | Report abuse

to apply less labor, JA, you need to have someone develop an AchenTron that uses artificial intelligence to do what you do in terms of monitoring and witty interventions and replies

Posted by: goombah | October 6, 2005 3:26 PM | Report abuse

just go ahead and make a tennis court out of it.

Posted by: LB | October 6, 2005 3:27 PM | Report abuse

Subscribe to Achenblog Select and you will get a daily Crab Grass Reduction briefing. [Has MoDo EVER offered a single good tip about solving a crab grass problem? I DON'T THINK SO.]

Posted by: Achenbach | October 6, 2005 3:27 PM | Report abuse

I bet Maureen would no more know how to operate a weedeater than how to fire a bazooka.

Posted by: Achenbach | October 6, 2005 3:29 PM | Report abuse

In my opinion, Jackie Chan is a great artist AND a great human being, in contrast to, say, Picasso, who was a great artist and (what was the term above, started with an "a", can't quite pronounce it...)

Posted by: Abby | October 6, 2005 3:29 PM | Report abuse

Hey Joel,

I am not shocked; I was born in the USA. It's just not any of my business.

Posted by: Oim Oim | October 6, 2005 3:29 PM | Report abuse

Here comes trouble: Maureen on a riding lawn mower!!!!
[We tease because we luv.]

Posted by: Achenbach | October 6, 2005 3:30 PM | Report abuse

Glad you talk about that issue,Joel. I think it´s outrageous.That´s one of the things that make me love WP and dislike NYTimes.I had only get into those two websites about 6 months ago.There´s a great difference between them.Here you feel you´re part of the things.There´s some kind of real human touch (something i can´t explain well,at least in english).
I like that Maureen Dowd(even that i hadn´t understand fully all the hype around her.Sometimes she theams like the beautiful and clever girl of our classroom, nothing more than that)but i believe she can do more than spanking W(that´s how she calls Bush) all the time.She´s fixed in him.I know she had been out, writing a book.Does anyone knows if that book is already published?
But the rest of the guys from NYT are not better than the columnists of the WaPo.Take the example of that guy Paul Krugman.He´s arrogant.
Whit that "selected acess" they had lost a wider audience
I don´t believe in the road they had followed whit payed acess, but i´m afraid that other news corporations will follow the same road.
Best wishes for all

Posted by: suprassis | October 6, 2005 3:32 PM | Report abuse

Maybe I should work now. Sigh.

Posted by: Achenbach | October 6, 2005 3:32 PM | Report abuse

she wouldn't get near a mower, that's what real people do. Plus Joel, you have never offered a single good tip about reducing crab grass either. I suspect that if it was a cash crop, you could retire.

Posted by: LB | October 6, 2005 3:34 PM | Report abuse

Joel, you may have a case of Dowd-envy, but we, your loyal readers, already know you are way better than she is.

Of course she doesn't know about crabgrass, or earthquakes, or George Washington, or Led Zeppelin, or UFO's, or Japanese history, or cars--not the way you know about them. She may, however, be even with you on the Congressional Record. But I'm sure you'll catch up and pass her soon.

Posted by: Achenfan is Not Here, So It's Up to Us | October 6, 2005 3:34 PM | Report abuse

Achenbach,
Does this mean no revolution?

G@#$^** fr*@k*ng da^@!mit.

Posted by: LP | October 6, 2005 3:38 PM | Report abuse

LP

I with'ya. Here I'd changed into black coveralls, ski mask and bandana, with pockets full of rocks intended to be hurled at the closest Starbucks. Oh well, I look pretty ridiculous anyway.

Posted by: CowTown | October 6, 2005 3:41 PM | Report abuse

Delay-Rove-Frist...major scandal brewing..can the Dems capitalize on the Right's moral follies?..from the associated press...I understand why Bush had his "major" speech today

Feds won't guarantee they won't indict Rove
Presidential advisor Karl Rove will testify in the CIA leak case even though prosecutors won't promise not to indict him, sources said. (AP, 3:18 p.m.)

Posted by: DFT-MD | October 6, 2005 3:41 PM | Report abuse

i have TO riden a riding lawn mower! *harumpf*...

oh... you mean the OTHER maureen... i'm getting so confused... you people keep saying my name!!!! sheesh!

Posted by: mo | October 6, 2005 3:46 PM | Report abuse

DFT-MD:

Yes!

This is from Bush's speech today:

"Evil men obsessed with ambition and unburdened by conscience must be taken very seriously, and we must stop them before their crimes can multiply."

I think it was a reference to Cheney/Rove/Wolfowitz.

Posted by: Abby | October 6, 2005 3:46 PM | Report abuse

we would never talk disparaging about you mo

Posted by: LB | October 6, 2005 3:49 PM | Report abuse

Disparagingly

Posted by: LB | October 6, 2005 3:52 PM | Report abuse

True American- You cannot be serious when you state that Dowd is the only one with the testicular fortitude to challenge the President.

For Exhibit A, I'll direct you to George Will's column in the Post yesterday, which pretty much castigated the nomination of Miers and strongly encouraged (that phrase is insufficient to express the heft of his argument, but it's all I've got for now) the members of the Senate to both question her thoroughly, but also, more or less, to kick her to the curb. And remember- Will is a conservative.

So, if the committed liberal Dowd is courageous and heroic in your sight (and if that's your definition of courage- attacking the President in the pages of the NYT- you'd be well served to read some history books), what does that make George Will?

The hagiography for Dowd around here is frightening.

Also, how does Frank Rich go from culture commentator/critic to political columnist? Do the editors at the NYT just walk around the building handing out column inches to anyone willing to slam the President? Dowd, Rich, Krugman...

Posted by: Raoul Duke | October 6, 2005 4:09 PM | Report abuse

If the same Dowd column appears twice in the comments section does that make the blog twice as illegal?

Is anyone else amused by the irony of reading a Dowd column in the comments section of a blog at washingtonpost.com?

If anyone important finds out about this there will be trouble!

Posted by: mdmbkr | October 6, 2005 4:12 PM | Report abuse

the great Maureen Dowd
a journalistic genius
put's Bush down again

Posted by: omnigood | October 6, 2005 4:12 PM | Report abuse

I read the other day where Maureen Dowd does her own auto repairs and recently rebuilt the 289 in an old Mustang.

Okay, I made that up.

Posted by: Bayou Self | October 6, 2005 4:13 PM | Report abuse

I read that MD bagged a brown bear with a .22. Then she competed in a pentathalon before cooking a Julia Child-quality dinner for one.

Posted by: omnigasm | October 6, 2005 4:17 PM | Report abuse

I doubt seriously that she does her own nails

Posted by: LB | October 6, 2005 4:18 PM | Report abuse

So what's next? Pay-per-view at NPR?

Posted by: JL | October 6, 2005 4:24 PM | Report abuse

Dr. Martin Luther King jr once said that "...the arch of the universe is long but it bends toward justice".

Posted by: Anonymous | October 6, 2005 4:24 PM | Report abuse

I am so happy to hear that I am not alone with my angst over this TimesSelect-induced MD withdrawal thing. I have actually spent the buck just to read her column and thrown the rest of the paper away. I also think that she is incredibly hot!

Posted by: Bill | October 6, 2005 4:24 PM | Report abuse

The New York Times has a print edition? Since when?

Posted by: Dave R | October 6, 2005 4:28 PM | Report abuse

Uh, Bill, check this out-

www.strangepolitics.com/ images/content/3442.jpg

Posted by: kurosawaguy | October 6, 2005 4:29 PM | Report abuse

I dunno if anyone else has mentioned it, but if you go to Technorati, you'll see pointers to columns by Maureen Dowd, Frank Rich, Paul Krugman and David Brooks. (I can't account for that last one, but maybe everyone reads Brooks to get a good laugh). I await a flurry of RIAA-style lawsuits which go nowhere because no matter how many times you explain DHCP to lawyers, they don't get it.

Anyhoo, I'm a _Times_ subscriber with free access, but I often read the columns this way because TimeSelect annoys me.

Posted by: lazysod | October 6, 2005 4:34 PM | Report abuse

Hello, my name is yellojkt.

I am a NYT OpEd junkie. I live near Baltimore and I get the Sunpaper and they used to run NYT columnists like Friedman and MoDo. Then the NYT wanted to sell the Sun a bunch of newswire services with the op/ed columnists and the Sun say, "No thanks, we have our own newswire. Just give us Friedman and MoDo." And the Times said "Tough." So I started reading them online except I had to read them quick because after a week they went into the pay archive.

And then NYT said they wanted $50 for me to read Friedman and Rich and MoDo. I just renewed my Time magazine subscription for 56 cents an issue which gets me two years of Time and Time goes and kills trees and puts it in my mail box and everything for the same $50.

My wife got me a WaPo subscription because they were giving away Giant coupons. But George Will is not as cute as MoDo and Dionne isn't as witty and sarcastic as Friedman. It's nice, but it's not the same.

So now the only way I can read the NYT Op/Ed is to scrounge around the recycling bin of Starbucks looking for leftover copies of the NYT. Except people steal them and only leave the WaPo Sports Section, which I already ignore at home. Help me people, I've hit rock bottom and my life is not my own.

Posted by: yellojkt | October 6, 2005 4:42 PM | Report abuse

Aren't all newspaper columnists doing it for pay? Does Joel work for free?

And until we got online access to newspapers, didn't we have to buy them to read them? Well.. at least one person had to buy a newspaper and then could pass it along (not a violation of copyright).

Reading off someone else's computer screen (someone who paid for NYT Select) isn't violating copyright laws, either. That would make it illegal to borrow someone's book.

That's why gathering at Starbucks to all read someone's laptop is OK. That same someone copying and pasting the column in an email to her friends is not OK.

Posted by: TBG | October 6, 2005 4:43 PM | Report abuse

Achenbach:
"I bet Maureen would no more know how to operate a weedeater than how to fire a bazooka."

No, but she knows how to verbally grind our political leaders into little pieces--figuratively, amd literarily (not literally)--with wit and humor to boot. That alone has got to be worth the price of admission. How skilled are you, Joel, with a meatgrinder and a set of Wusthof knives?

Like you, Joel, I thought of the marketplace idea of "value-added." Reading Dowd adds to the pleasure of my day, therefore, she has value (and subscribing to her column is worth the price).

I had lunch one day, quite by accident, both of us eating sack lunches, with Doug Engelbart, the inventor of the mouse (much like the accidental Roman Polanski dining/meeting I've already mentioned). In the modern wired marketplace, we vote with our mice/mouses(?) and our credit cards. With TV, one votes for one's favorite shows with a remote control. The world is a marketplace after all: we collectively vote with our feet, our hands, our pocketbooks--and advertisers and advertising rates respond accordingly.

Joel writes:
"I really like doing this blog, but it could disappear at any second for the simple reason that the labor costs associated with its production may greatly exceed any kind of associated revenue."

So, Joel, where is the Washington Post headed on this? Why did the WP offer up blogs to the general public in the first place? Is your blog (and other WP blogs) a societal experiment? How about some insight on this?

Posted by: Loomis | October 6, 2005 4:44 PM | Report abuse

LABOR COSTS? HUH? WE'RE DOING ALL THE WORK HERE!

Posted by: Anonymous | October 6, 2005 4:47 PM | Report abuse

Maureen..., Please, NO Times Select???????? :-(

Posted by: Amanda | October 6, 2005 4:57 PM | Report abuse

That's true, the best thing about this blog is the volunteer labor. The problem is that the tiny stone that is my brain can be squeezed of only so much blood a day, and the people who pay my salary might decide they'd rather have more of it staining newsprint.

Posted by: Achenbach | October 6, 2005 4:58 PM | Report abuse

And who needs to go through a firewall or a friend who subscribes, at our local Starbucks in Connecticut -- there are always extra copies of the NY Times for their customers to read -- though it would be fun to sit around and talk about a particular column and I did enjoy e-mailing them to my daughters or friends and then discussing via e-mail -- actually I am a fan of all four that you mentioned (what can I say I like the different perspectives).
The other alternative to those in the midwest is go to your local library, get with some friends -- they always have a few copies in the library and then discuss --- I am sorry the Times felt this had to be done, but if you read the NOTE occasionally they will link to a must read with permission.

Posted by: Paulet | October 6, 2005 4:59 PM | Report abuse

Pretty soon, to make the TimesSelected articles even more appealing, they may include some out-takes, some material not found in the print edition, ... a la DVD's.

Posted by: Krishna | October 6, 2005 5:22 PM | Report abuse

re: Beethoven waaaay back thar. I believe it was Beethoven's mother who had syphilis and they were never sure if it was passed on to little Ludwig. But now Linda has cleared that up and it is not an issue. As far as Beethoven being a tortured soul that is not entirely accurate. Beethoven was known to be incredibly sociable and had an excellent sense of humor and probably the first person to sell himself with PR. Yes, he pined after his immortal beloved who eventually rejected him (who hasn't?). He only isolated himself after he began to really lose his hearing but his reputation as a genius composer was established well before then. Beethoven also had a tremendous ego (surprise!) and reportedly after hearing complaints from the concertmaster (principal violin and general orchestra leader) about the difficulty of some violin licks in one of his concertos (and suggesting alternative configurations), Beethoven allegedly told him that "If God intended it to be easy He would not have told me to write it." Of course, I am a mere woodwind player but I still snicker when I think of this story.

Posted by: peanutgallerymember | October 6, 2005 5:28 PM | Report abuse

Although speaking of tortured souls you should really hear about the wives of these composers! Mrs. Clara Schumann and Mrs. Mahler in particular have most excellent reputations to read up on. Also, Richard Wagner was not a tortured soul (anti-Semitic, yes). My apologies for only referencing classical composers but they are my forte.

Pun intended.

Posted by: peanutgallerymember | October 6, 2005 5:34 PM | Report abuse

Yes, you CAN get Maureen Dowd's column free:
Just go to google, type in the title of the article and Dowd AND
"Lo and Behold"!!!
Don't let it get around!!!!!

Posted by: Claire | October 6, 2005 5:37 PM | Report abuse

truthout.org is still getting around NYT.

sssshhh!

Posted by: WanderingHoo | October 6, 2005 5:46 PM | Report abuse

I always wondered who reads her. I guess we're on the same team, but she's as predictable as the schoolyard biter.

Posted by: Spitzbub | October 6, 2005 5:57 PM | Report abuse

Joel: Someday I'm going to buy your George Washington book! (I promise) And I'm not going to check it out of a library and I won't borrow it from a friend! And I think everyone here should buy your book(s) as well!

Come on, folks! Let's help out Joel. And maybe he'll be able to afford a new car someday!

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0684848570/qid=1128635774/sr=8-1/ref=pd_bbs_1/102-4311398-7554500?v=glance&s=books&n=507846

I wonder who will find the first typo....?

ot

Posted by: Off Topic | October 6, 2005 6:00 PM | Report abuse

used to be a dowdie, but now i'm undergoing withdrawal pains, even tho' i subscribe to the paper copy of the nytimes, but along the way, i discovered the wapo.

Posted by: sacred cow | October 6, 2005 6:06 PM | Report abuse

Krishna, can the Director's Cut be far behind? Or parenthetical side notes on what the writer was thinking as he or she wrote the piece?

An example, from the Dowd column:

Maybe it's because his mom was not adoring enough, but more tart and prickly, even telling her son, the president, not to put his feet up on her coffee table. (Ha! I worked in a coffee table! Gimme a Pulitzer now!) Or maybe it's because, as his wife says, his kinship with his mom gives him a desire to be around strong, "very natural" women. (Singing: "Just like a natural woman ..." Come to think of it, if they ever make a movie out of this column, they should work that song into the soundtrack right at this spot.) But W. loves being surrounded by tough women who steadfastly devote their entire lives to doting on him, like the vestal virgins guarding the sacred fire, serving as custodians for his values and watchdogs for his reputation. (I have to admit that I have no idea why I worked in vestal virgins. Sue me. It's a column, for crying out loud, and I've got some 700 words to crank out.)

Posted by: Bayou Self | October 6, 2005 6:07 PM | Report abuse

I think irregardless may be correct and that Times Select will lead to NYT columnists losing influences, especially among the digerati.

There's a whiff of oxymoron to paying for content, especially opinion content, on the Internet.

It will be interesting to see if and how quickly the columnists behind the wall become obscure. Will it take the dying off of the old-guard paper readers? Or will the tendancy of blog-watchers to not pay and thus not read and thus not quote have an effect more quickly outside our own small world.

I will relate that I have a technophobe spouse, and he has some technophobe friends. And I regularly print stories and columns (two-sided to save paper) from both the WashPo and the NYT to have him read and pass along.

Until Times Select dies (or I follow a link to free versions), he and his friens won't be reading Mo or Krugman or Rich anymore. But are there many others like me who spread information from the Internet into the dirt world? If not, then maybe Times Select will only have an effect in the digital world.

An interesting thought occurs--would the WSJ editorial page, wingnut that it is, be more influential if IT were not behind a pay wall?

Posted by: Cal Gal | October 6, 2005 6:11 PM | Report abuse

you can get MoDo for no dough at www.truthout.org. Along with other brilliant minds like Molly Ivins & once, Garrison Keillor, prog roundups & analysis.

Posted by: bay area Jane Doe | October 6, 2005 6:15 PM | Report abuse

Is it arrogance, or desperation, which drives the NY Times to delude itself into believing it's Op-Ed and other columnists are so vital to life that people will pay to read them on the web?

Times Select (TS) is the next self-inflicted wound driving the NYT's death spiral as a newspaper of international influence.

Times' top management (EE and Publisher) lie to themselves when they think restricting access to their columnists will increase the reach of their readership - which is what influence is all about: you can't influence someone you don't reach.

The proof comes from the Times itself: A review of the past 7 days most emailed articles shows only 1 TS column on the list. (At 10:49 CDT, 10/03/2005) Prior to TS's advent, the 7-day list would be replete with perhaps 7 - 10 columnists in the list of 25 most emailed.

That means tens of thousands of people who formerly were influenced by the Times' columnists are now obvious to them. The Times' columnists are now writing to themselves, and their choir. While they may be positively reinforcing those groups, they are not affecting the direction, or national discourse, of the nation and its policies.

It's time for the Times to come back to Earth; you are becoming a laughingstock for the nation, and an embarrassment for the profession.

Your ham-handed handling of conjecture passed off as fact about a Fox reporter, coupled with Krugman's near-psychotic denial of error, compounded by Gail's own denial of reality (Note to Gail: You are not being cruel to readers, as you said to deflect shame from your handling of this affair; it is you and the paper who are being cruel to your integrity, the readers are suffering from watching your inability to be honest).

TS will be remembered for what it is, another nail in the coffin of the NY Times as a great newspaper. It was driven by arrogance, lack of personal integrity, and disconnection from the readers.

RIP, NYT.

Kenneth E. Lamb
Pensacola, FL

Posted by: Kenneth E. Lamb | October 6, 2005 6:54 PM | Report abuse

I have personally thwarted 3 alien invasions. No kidding.

Posted by: jw | October 6, 2005 7:29 PM | Report abuse

SCC put's

blorphing at work, aaaallllgha

Posted by: omnigood | October 6, 2005 7:36 PM | Report abuse

not really blorphing, just over working

Posted by: omnigood | October 6, 2005 7:37 PM | Report abuse

omnigoof
aaaallllgha

Posted by: omnigoof | October 6, 2005 7:39 PM | Report abuse

let us try again:

intrepid Maureen
journalistic excellence
thrashes Bush again

better me thinks

Posted by: omnigood | October 6, 2005 7:46 PM | Report abuse

Online papers who charge bug me. I vowed a long time ago never to read them in print or to purchase online. With TV news, more-so now that I have satellite tv, and CBC radio news, I have often found myself newsed out for the day.

Conversely, if WaPo decided to charge for the online, I would pay in a New York minute. I knew that after about 3 weeks of reading Gene W, and JA and Sally Squires.

Posted by: dr | October 6, 2005 7:47 PM | Report abuse

better, but still no seasoning

Posted by: omnigoof | October 6, 2005 7:47 PM | Report abuse

Why would anyone read Dowd's whiny comments? She is a classic example of a brain-dead writer! Stupid! Stupid! Stupid!

Posted by: surfer-joe | October 6, 2005 7:56 PM | Report abuse

I think it's clear that newspapers are still struggling with how to incorporate this "internet" thing into some kind of coherent business plan. At least one that makes a profit. And this blog is no exception. For what is the value of our beloved Achenblog to the corporate entity that is the Washington Post? Is the blog advertising? Consumer outreach? A convenient place for Joel to dump questionable columns that would otherwise vanish into the ether? Or is it, perhaps, part of a cunningly complex psychological experiment about the nature of virtual community? Whatever it's true nature, eventually, of course, it must be worth Joel's professional time. For although we like to think that this is a labor of love for him, his first priority is to the economic needs of himself and his family. Which include three daughters who probably irrationally expect both a college education and a wedding with ice sculptures. Perhaps we could all help ensure the continued existence of this blog by purchasing vast quantities of his books and then informing his publisher that we heard about them here. Or we could all tell the Post that if they stop the blog, we and our 2.3 million friends will cancel our subscriptions. Or at least we could all play nicely together and keep this blog pleasant. And legal. I think we owe Joel that.

Posted by: RD Padouk | October 6, 2005 8:16 PM | Report abuse

Get over it. It's less than a dollar a week. Why should it be free?

Posted by: notanipicker | October 6, 2005 8:16 PM | Report abuse

Umm, bay area Jane Doe, Molly Ivins is available *legally* at www.creators.com/opinion.html. Twice a week, with no infringement of copyright laws.

Posted by: suecris | October 6, 2005 8:49 PM | Report abuse

Well said, Mr. Padouk. Thank you.

Posted by: CowTown | October 6, 2005 9:07 PM | Report abuse

Maureen Dowd is my #ONE favorite opinion writer. It is our great misfortune that she agreed to write for nytimes.com. Because I always agree with her , Ms Dowd is always right. It is...was so nice to have my personal biases reinforced by a person so celebrated and famous and smart and actually in the great New York Times. Whew! However, I will not pay Sulzberger one goddamned farthing to read Ms Dowd's perfect opinions. Contrarily, maybe you've noticed the latimes.com has just stopped charging for a features section, 'calendarlive'. Perhaps if enough people raise enough hell the neocon bastards who concocted this typically neocon extremist idea of exacting coin to read opinions will be overruled by real people with brains instead of pre-programmed agendas. Yes, neocons. What better way to increase PROFITS and throttle dissenting opinion. Rich people who can afford to pay the fees won't because they hate Maureen Dowd and her snipp]


anti-Bush opinions. Middle and low income folk won't pay because we can't afford it--so nobody will read her columns anymore and soon she'll be fired and that will be the end of one more probably-communist liberal and her snotty not-with-the-program opinions. Sulzberger--a secret neocon?

Posted by: cody mccall | October 6, 2005 9:35 PM | Report abuse

Maureen Dowd is my #ONE favorite opinion writer. It is our great misfortune that she agreed to write for nytimes.com. Because I always agree with her , Ms Dowd is always right. It is...was so nice to have my personal biases reinforced by a person so celebrated and famous and smart and actually in the great New York Times. Whew! However, I will not pay Sulzberger one goddamned farthing to read Ms Dowd's perfect opinions. Contrarily, maybe you've noticed the latimes.com has just stopped charging for a features section, 'calendarlive'. Perhaps if enough people raise enough hell the neocon bastards who concocted this typically neocon extremist idea of exacting coin to read opinions will be overruled by real people with brains instead of pre-programmed agendas. Yes, neocons. What better way to increase PROFITS and throttle dissenting opinion. Rich people who can afford to pay the fees won't because they hate Maureen Dowd and her snippy anti-Bush opinions. Middle and low income folk won't pay because we can't afford it--so nobody will read her columns anymore and soon she'll be fired and that will be the end of one more probably-communist liberal and her snotty not-with-the-program opinions. Sulzberger--a secret neocon?

Posted by: cody mccall | October 6, 2005 9:45 PM | Report abuse

Ahh, spent a long day at a charity gig, sorry I missed this one.

I've been in the Internet/Web app biz for a long time (starting with dialup app networks, during the '80's), and I've seen lots of things that work, and lots of things that don't.

'net content providers that charge readers fees for content - select, or any other flavor - have a pretty poor track record compared to the "free content w/advertising" content models. However, there's only so much advertising that you can put into/around a typical "page", so content providers should keep a close eye on their costs and income, and make sure things don't get too far out of whack. The best managed content providers I've observed grow ther sites and content organically as the business (and the logfile analysis) allows. When a provider/publisher decides that some of their content is too good or too valuable for their regularly sponsored site, that's often been a kiss of death. Not necessarily for the whole site, but those columns that are "selected" can become irrelevant over time. Sometimes those columns are reborn - on another site, or with a different name on the same site, if the publisher is willing to eat a bit of crow.

The most successful models I've Observed for original news/infromation/analysis/opinion (NIAO) sites are those that support other businesses. Newspapers, magazines, TV and radio stations/networks, internet retail, and even brick and mortar retail are reasonable examples of foundations/sponsors for NIAO sites.

The Fed Ex Washingtonpost.com?
The New York Times powered by Sun Microsystems?
The Red Hat USA Today?
Slate, broght to you by McDonalds?

It could happen.

I could go on, but I won't, other than to say that I think the WasPost is doing a reasonably good job with their site(s) overall, though they do have some weak spots they should decide to address (by investing resources) or discard.

The NYT Select experiment - call it chutzpah or hubris - is very interesting, and my gut says that it's not going to work (ask Stephen King what he thinks about it), because it hasn't done well in the past. Maybe it'll work this time...?

bc

Posted by: bc | October 6, 2005 10:34 PM | Report abuse

O.k., guys it's all my fault. As an old Jewish male, I am an expert on guilt. I had been reading the Times online for years, and I thought, "Why am I getting all this stuff for free? I am not worthy." So I wrote to the Times and begged them to charge me something. Can you believe I suggested $10 a month? (That's $120 a year for you math challenged readers.)

Seriously, didn't you folk ever pay for hard copy newspapers in your youth? Times Select is so much better because if you come across a reference you missed or want more info on, just click and WHAM! the article is pulled free from the archives. Besides you're not denuding Maine. This is the future of news(papers?).

Posted by: lench | October 6, 2005 10:39 PM | Report abuse

In reverse order:
Is "cody mccall" one person, or two people with very similar names and thoughts? (Joke, of course! Sheesh!)
Cowtown (& RD) Hear, hear! RD put it at least as well as anyone else today. Things that cost money, require money, don't they now? This morning I mentioned my little efforts to support this particular forum. If it turns out that those efforts don't suffice, I'll ponder how much more it's worth to me. But I certainly don't have a philosophical objection to someone informing me that they need to make a living at what they do (for me)!

Posted by: Bob S. | October 6, 2005 10:39 PM | Report abuse

Brilliant! Witty! Insightful! Loved it -- great post, Joel.

Posted by: SW | October 6, 2005 11:59 PM | Report abuse


...back there in the 15th century when J.
GUTENBERG got the PRESS idea sorted out
the idea of printed word and image widely
made accessible was put in motion.......
of course if you were unable to read then
you had to count on and trust someone who
did....who likely was the guy who came up
with the idea of editorial pages....:-)..
but seriously we all benefited from the
idea of wide spread printing...and the
newspaper as we know it today still is on
paper....but likely joel composes his day
to day stuff on a computer...which if the
editor decides to publish is then via a
combination of electronic and still quite
mechanical devices printed out on paper...
however using a website to create a "paper"
is so much simpler...no tree felling....
no pulping...no heavy hauling of paper to
the press building...no carrying paper to
distribution sites...no leftover unsold
papers to dispose of.....SO MUCH SIMPLER..
...so it is likely at some point we all
will be living in a inet,cell phone and
television linked world....inet with the
content...cell phone all immediate and
mid level interconnect and the computer tied into the tv to benefit from that nice
new plasma or lcd vividness...movies..the
news...informational or educational..fun
and sports programming all off the inet...
...so this TIMES SELECT idea is somehow
one way of evolving from newspapers on
paper to paperless newsinet....i dont think
its a bad idea but may prove difficult to
prove the value of...opinion is not hard
to find..just ask your friend or a coworker
....:-).....and by the way...want to read
up on J.GUTENBERG and his press?..go to
www.ideafinder.com...it can be found there
for FREE....:-)...this inet...isnt it just
the greatest?..............................
...and pls at 1:12:18 pm.....your last
comment made me laugh....painful as it was
to watch and listen to GOP BOY last night
on cnn i did....and my impression was as
you point out....I CANT BELIEVE WE HAVE
ANOTHER THREE YEARS OF THIS CRAP.....:-)
....not eloquent but to the point...and
so THE ONION in tone.....that rag comes
free by the way too...............:-)

Posted by: an american in siam.... | October 7, 2005 1:37 AM | Report abuse

This is how they do it in £ondon.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/section/0,,6969,00.html

Pretty clever, those Brits.

Posted by: Off Topic | October 7, 2005 2:38 AM | Report abuse

Off Topic:

That's pretty clever - the pound sign for "L" in London - guess one has to find the foreign script key.

I've always thought it might one day come to paying for the online version of a paper - like the timesonline. It might be worth it for the whole paper like the WP (hope I'm far enough away so the rocks won't hurt) If it were reasonable, I'd be willing. But to just charge for columnists or opinions seems backward to me. No offense, Joel. If they charged for the Achenblog, count me in. What about tips on getting rid of "creeping charlie" - our bane out here? We have lots of corn, too.

What is irksome is to subscibe to the Wall Street Journal paper edition, like I do for business reasons, and then have to pay extra for the online edition.

mo:

Add Eugene O'Neil to your list. He sure suffered for and in his plays.

Go Sox - White or Red - take your pick.

bdl

Posted by: boondocklurker | October 7, 2005 4:19 AM | Report abuse

The Washington Post has an electronic edition. I actually subscribed to it in hopes of gaining access to the missing Rough Draft column (one more contortion I didn't mention in my previous "pain and suffering" post). There is a "free trial" option, so it didn't cost me anything to find out that the Sunday Magazine is not included. Cancel. I really have trouble figuring out why anyone would pay for this service. To avoid pop-up ads? To soothe guilt? Just to be able to see it on the computer screen the way it looks in real life? To be able to (virtually) turn a (virtual) page? I don't get it.

Posted by: Abby | October 7, 2005 5:55 AM | Report abuse

only if you are bored...

Posted by: Blogger Tangent Related to Achenblog | October 7, 2005 7:45 AM | Report abuse

Joel - I bought your GW book - hardback, full price.

By the way, I hear Maureen Dowd opened for the Rolling Stones last night.

Posted by: Mary Ann | October 7, 2005 9:21 AM | Report abuse

Just to tie up a loose end from Thursday's blog:

http://www.sparknotes.com/biography/vangogh/summary.html

In Paris, Vincent's psychiatric health began its decline, and the dark side of his complicated condition (probably a combination of mild epilepsy and schizophrenia or bipolar disorder, compounded with syphilis, glaucoma, Digitalis poisoning from paint, and a weakness for absinthe and alcohol) started to reveal itself in violent mood swings, depression, and drunken and erratic behavior.

I'm not sure how foxglove was used to make oil paints at the time. I do know that Grandma Loomis died of "digitalis intoxication"--before medical malpractice lawsuits became common.

Posted by: Loomis | October 7, 2005 10:11 AM | Report abuse

Van Gogh/Digitalis

http://www.mrcophth.com/ophthalmologyonstamps/plantsandeye/9.html

Digitalis used in cardiac failure and cardiac arrhythmia is derived from the plant foxgloves. The man credited with the introduction of digitalis into the practice of medicine was William Withering. Withering was born in Wellington, Shropshire, England in 1741. Toxic doses can give rise to ocular effects which include colour vision abnormalities (most patients complain of seeing yellow colour, xanthopsia), visual sensations and hallucinations, scotomas and retinal toxicity with abnormal ERG amplitudes. The great Dutch painter [Van Gogh] was thought to suffer from digitalis poisoning because of his predominant use of yellow paint. He had epilepsy and was treated with digitalis which was commonly used to control seizure.

http://www.psych.ucalgary.ca/PACE/VA-Lab/AVDE-Website/VanGogh.html

Given the multiplictiy of diagnoses, it is not clear if van Gogh suffered from a visual disorder and if so, its origins. Van Gogh was treated by the well-known doctor, Paul-Ferdinand Gachet, a physician for one of the France's railroad companies. Gachet may well have treated van Gogh for mania and/or epilepsy with digitalis. In the 19th century digitalis, extracted from the purple foxglove plant, was one of the main treatments for these disorders. It was used as a sedative, an anticonvulsant, and an anti-manic agent. Interestingly, on the only two occasions that van Gogh painted Doctor Gachet he was holding a foxglove plant (right). Was this van Gogh's way of telling us that he suffered from the effects of digitalis poisoning at Doctor Gachet's hand?

Posted by: Loomis | October 7, 2005 10:22 AM | Report abuse

van Gogh's "The Chair" is uncannily amazingly familiar to my Aunt Dora and Uncle Claude's little farm house kitchen. Woodbox in the corner, the colors. But Uncle's Bull Durham chaw tobaccy always waited for him in his chair instead of van Gogh's pipe and tobacco.

Posted by: Nani | October 7, 2005 10:54 AM | Report abuse

I think there ain't gonna be a new kit today. It will be good practice for when the blog is killed. Actually I don't think the blog will be killed, but it is definitely viewed now by the bosses as a bad habit of mine, like smoking cigars.

Not that anyone cares, but I am trapped in a Starbucks. I left my umbrella in the car. This is not a dry rain. This is that very exotic thing known as a wet rain. (For those of you not in Washington, it hasn't rained for two months. And now, the deluge.)

The problem with getting online at Starbucks is that I have to pay 10 bucks for a T-Mobile day pass. Now you might say, no problem, just EXPENSE it. Hahahahahaha right. I forgot to expense an entire trip I took in Feb. 2003 to Denver, a freelance gig, and I am hoping that particular publication will still accept the receipts. But why would they? Weingarten and I agree that, if we were in charge of the medical expenses, we'd pay 100 percent for medical care, because who can do those forms? It's not worth it. I'd rather pay full price. I don't do forms. You know that trip to Japan? Had to go through a giant pile of receipts that were not only yen but largely in kanji. I actually learned the Japanese language trying to figure out if something was a taxicab receipt or a receipt from the hot spring.

Posted by: Achenbach | October 7, 2005 10:55 AM | Report abuse

LindaLoo: Is it Van GO or Van GOFF. I heard it's Van GOFF. You ever heard that?

Mary Ann: Thanks for buying the book! Were you at the gig last night? There was a Potomac Conservancy fundraiser in a nice cottage on a bluff overlooking the river. I could use a crib like that.

Posted by: Achenbach | October 7, 2005 10:59 AM | Report abuse

Abby writes:

The Washington Post has an electronic edition. I actually subscribed to it in hopes of gaining access to the missing Rough Draft column (one more contortion I didn't mention in my previous "pain and suffering" post). There is a "free trial" option, so it didn't cost me anything to find out that the Sunday Magazine is not included. Cancel. I really have trouble figuring out why anyone would pay for this service...."

Abby, I told you, they buy that special edition so they don't have to read my column or blog. That's Post Select. The Joel-free zone. It's marketing genius!!!

Posted by: Achenbach | October 7, 2005 11:02 AM | Report abuse

Can you die from drinking too much coffee while trapped in a Starbucks during a tropical storm? I'm just wondering. [I bet Maureen never has this problem. I bet she has a driver. Or even...the mere thought makes me quiver...her own office. With a door. That can be shut.]

Posted by: Achenbach | October 7, 2005 11:05 AM | Report abuse

My memoir: "Diary of a Boodle-killer."

Posted by: Achenbach | October 7, 2005 11:07 AM | Report abuse

Maureen is less than a block away. I'm calling her. She'll rescue me. She may be the only person who could understand my pain.

Posted by: Achenbach | October 7, 2005 11:08 AM | Report abuse

THERE ARE GIANT SPIDERS EVERYWHERE

Posted by: Achenbach | October 7, 2005 11:09 AM | Report abuse

....heeeeeeeelp.......meeeeeeeeee....

Posted by: Achenbach | October 7, 2005 11:10 AM | Report abuse

JA--you sound awfully jumpy today. Please relax. Your job will go on, even if the blog augers in.

What you should really be thinking of is a gig on your on XM Satellite Radio channel. Or be a kind of Don Imus (not his content), with your radio show carried on cable.

Posted by: melvin/a | October 7, 2005 11:12 AM | Report abuse

My favorite Starbucks reference is in "Best in Show" when the yuppie couple with the neurotic Weimarauner describe their meeting. They were both in Starbucks when suddenly their eyes met, but they couldn't speak- because they were in two different Starbucks on opposite sides of the street.

Posted by: kurosawaguy | October 7, 2005 11:12 AM | Report abuse

What's going on here? This is not Joel - our fearless leader!

Git a hold of yerself, partner!

(You're scaring me)

Posted by: Off Topic | October 7, 2005 11:14 AM | Report abuse

I am afraid he is poised to commit seppaku.

Posted by: melvin/a | October 7, 2005 11:14 AM | Report abuse

yo - maybe someone should lay off the lattes.

(what do they put in starbucks coffee that seems to make it so addictive anyways? hmmmm.......I mean, it can't be the taste, that coffee is crap)

Posted by: LP | October 7, 2005 11:17 AM | Report abuse

so long as he doesn't commit seppuku.

Posted by: omnigoof | October 7, 2005 11:17 AM | Report abuse

you say seppuku, I say seppaku

you say tomato, I say tomahto

you say Bush, I say something really vulgar

let's call the whole thing off

Posted by: omnigasm | October 7, 2005 11:20 AM | Report abuse

JA, it's definitely Van Gogh. As in "go." Otherwise my entire art history education has been a sham and there's no reason to go on living because everything has been a lie. If you can't trust your professors, who can you trust?

Giant spiders everywhere? Are you sure you're not in Texas? Childhood memories of the giant "banana spiders" haunt me.

kurosawaguy, I remember that reference! I laughed my head off. What will we ever do if Starbucks goes away? There will be an awful lot of empty real estate and a lot of coffee withdrawl symptoms.

Posted by: Sara | October 7, 2005 11:20 AM | Report abuse

great journalism
the Maureen Dowd samizdat
the must read column

Posted by: omnigood | October 7, 2005 11:20 AM | Report abuse

I wouldn't mind being stuck in a Starbucks. At least it has windows. My office has no windows.

Posted by: jw | October 7, 2005 11:22 AM | Report abuse

Sorry sara - your professors were wrong...

Posted by: Off Topic | October 7, 2005 11:23 AM | Report abuse

"What will we ever do if Starbucks goes away?"

Dunkin' Donuts will fill the void and assume their rightful place as monarch of coffee. And bad spelling.

Posted by: jw | October 7, 2005 11:23 AM | Report abuse

Still snickering about bumper sticker viewed on way in to work today:

Somebody Else for President

Posted by: Dolphin Michael | October 7, 2005 11:26 AM | Report abuse

I want to market a bumper-sticker to H2 drivers that says, "My other car is a Prius."

Posted by: jw | October 7, 2005 11:28 AM | Report abuse

When Shelley Winters was trying to impress James Mason in the original Lolita, she pronounced it "van Gock".

Posted by: Nani | October 7, 2005 11:30 AM | Report abuse

I cancelled my annual subscription to the online crossword puzzles at the NYT as a simulacrum's boycott of the Times Select. An act I would have followed through with, even if there was no pro-rated refund in it for me.

I figure if there is a must read from the sequestered columninists, then a technologically benevolent blogger will post it a few days later.

Posted by: Sulzberger | October 7, 2005 11:31 AM | Report abuse

The rain will subside.
Peace will descend on Joel's soul.
Tranquilness restored.

Posted by: aroc | October 7, 2005 11:34 AM | Report abuse

Sulzberger's Postulate:

If there is a must read from the sequestered (NYTIMES) columninists, then a technologically benevolent blogger will post it a few days later

Posted by: Dolphin Michael | October 7, 2005 11:34 AM | Report abuse

Up here in Portland, we have a bunch of micro-rotisseries. Starbucks came in a few years back, and eventually had to install bullet-proof glass cuz their front windows got busted once a week. I still don't understand how they stay in business - i never see nayone in there.

Posted by: LP | October 7, 2005 11:34 AM | Report abuse

A better movie is "How to Steal a Million". Audrey Hepburn and her movie father pronounce it pretty well.

the "gh" is more like a "ch" (in German). It's a guttural sound - an "airy" sound - like you're clearing your throat.

(not easy to describe...)

Posted by: Off Topic | October 7, 2005 11:38 AM | Report abuse

11:34 - "anyone"

Posted by: LP | October 7, 2005 11:44 AM | Report abuse

Yes, it kind of hurts your throat too. My elementary German professor spoke the language with a Texas twang. I learned more German from the Andrews Sisters' "By mier bis du schoen."

Posted by: Nani | October 7, 2005 11:48 AM | Report abuse

Off Topic,

Well, I guess it's all over for me then.

I just looked it up and apparently some people also think it's pronounced "Fven Hoch" (The "G" in Gogh sounding like a gutteral "H" and the "gh" like "ch" in Johann Sebastian Bach). I can't pronounce it that way.

In order to avoid sounding pretentious, however, I will continue saying it the American way while in America. In Italy they called him Van "Go" too, though. I guess I'll just call him what the natives call him wherever I happen to be. That's probably the easiest way to go about it.

Speaking of pretentious, that reminds me of a time in my British Literature class when a girl that no one liked because she was pretentious said in a slightly British accent that she adopted even though she was from Nebraska, "Actually, it's Don Joo-anne. Not Don Wan." And I guess it can be said that way according to the dictionary (Well, joo-an, not joo-anne), but we all thought, "Will you ever just be quiet?" This is why I will comform to national standards wherever I may be. I wouldn't want to be compared to her.

Posted by: Sara | October 7, 2005 11:48 AM | Report abuse

LP, I just figured that you were Scottish

Posted by: Dolphin Michael | October 7, 2005 11:49 AM | Report abuse

That gutteral sound is called an "ACH-laut"

(FYI)

Posted by: Abby | October 7, 2005 11:50 AM | Report abuse

11:34 "anyone". Thought he/she meant nary a one.

Posted by: Nani | October 7, 2005 11:50 AM | Report abuse

Ha! Off Topic, ya beat me to the gutteral "ch" thing. I've never been good at the gutteral thing. I also can't roll the letter "r."

Posted by: Sara | October 7, 2005 11:50 AM | Report abuse

NYTIMES drops yet another notch Big suprise

Posted by: THE LEFT COAST | October 7, 2005 11:53 AM | Report abuse

jw, I feel your pain. I too have no windows, heck I don't even have walls. I am a no-cubicle office person, whose fondest dream is to mimic Les Nesmond and tape off my space and request that people have to knock and open my non-existent door before they talk to me. I am pathetic.

Posted by: dr | October 7, 2005 11:57 AM | Report abuse

I think we can all stick with Van Go, since the correct pronunciation will inevitably seem pretentious. Which is worse than being wrong.

[I think I can make a break for it in a minute...Deluge subsiding...]

Posted by: Achenbach | October 7, 2005 12:05 PM | Report abuse

Hmmm... I think my whole starbucks post sounded pretty pretentious. But I think I like living in a place that has such loyalty to its small business owners. If only the rest of the US felt the same way.

Posted by: LP | October 7, 2005 12:16 PM | Report abuse

Joel,

No sooner did you say that it stopped and I am getting hit harder than before.

Bring me a cup of coffe, will ya!!!!

No sense for both of us to get wet.

Posted by: Dolphin Michael | October 7, 2005 12:20 PM | Report abuse

Come on Joel, just do a Gene Kelly, Singin in the Rain type thingie and dance your way to wherever it is you're going.

Posted by: Nani | October 7, 2005 12:22 PM | Report abuse

LP,

No, you weren't sounding pretentious.

If more people felt the way you did, this country would be a whole lot better off. Starbucks just creates a market for everyone else, and that is great.

Starbucks is clearly the Kinko's of the food business. It ain't cheap.

BTW, several DC restaurants are now giving away Internet Access. It can be a bit of a pain for the poor schmoe who has to monitor the network, but it makes great business sense.

(and the coffee is better and cheaper)

Posted by: Dolphin Michael | October 7, 2005 12:31 PM | Report abuse

mmmmmmmmmmm... love Starbucks Chai.

How pathetic is it that when I walk into "my" starbucks they know exactly what I drink and how? I used to feel quite smug that I knew the lingo (Gimme a non-fat venti...) and now I feel a little ashamed that I spend $3 for a Chai, but I can't help it because it's so addicting.

I had a crazy experience at the Minnesota airport. I ordered a skim chai and I don't think they call it skim out there so they were confused and didn't know what it was. I got my drink but foolishly didn't take a sip until I got on the plane and discovered they had given me a just a cup of skim milk. A nice $3 cup of milk. Oh well, at least I slept well!

Posted by: AJ | October 7, 2005 12:35 PM | Report abuse

Thanks, Dolphin Michael. You should try some of the coffee up here, too it's amazing. Much, much better than the starbucks stuff, and the folks who work at those places tend to be a lot more friendly too.

Posted by: LP | October 7, 2005 12:43 PM | Report abuse

Thanks, Dolphin Michael. You should try some of the coffee up here, too it's amazing. Much, much better than the starbucks stuff, and the folks who work at those places tend to be a lot more friendly too.

Posted by: LP | October 7, 2005 12:43 PM | Report abuse

Ha! AJ, I'm from Minnesota. I order skim chai's all the time and they usually understand. They must have hired a real genius at the airport. I'm going to be at the airport in three weeks, I may have to test it out. See if I just get a $3 cup of skim milk, too.

Posted by: Sara | October 7, 2005 12:44 PM | Report abuse

Thanks, Dolphin Michael. You should try some of the coffee up here, too it's amazing. Much, much better than the starbucks stuff, and the folks who work at those places tend to be a lot more friendly too.

Posted by: LP | October 7, 2005 12:45 PM | Report abuse

Thanks, Dolphin Michael. You should try some of the coffee up here, too it's amazing. Much, much better than the starbucks stuff, and the folks who work at those places tend to be a lot more friendly too.

Posted by: LP | October 7, 2005 12:47 PM | Report abuse

Up here there are a few Starbucks, but I've never been. Ever. I do frequent Tim Hortons though. Its kind of like the Canadian version of Starbucks, no matter which road I take to the office, there is at least one Timmy's to pass. My community is coffee crazy. 65,000 people 5 Tim's, 2 Starbucks, and at least a dozen independants.

Posted by: dr | October 7, 2005 12:53 PM | Report abuse

what the heck? sorry guys, don't know how that quadruple post happened -

Posted by: LP | October 7, 2005 12:53 PM | Report abuse

Joel, at least you're not at the Kornheiser/Wilbon charity golf tournament up a Whiskey Creek.

It'll probably be a round like the preacher in "Caddyshack". Hopefully withouth the lightning.

And another thing... why won't you go outside in the rain sans bumbershoot? Is it going to mess up your hair or something? Will you get wet, then start sprouting black mold while sitting at your office desk?

Ok, maybe we're a little out of practice dealing with this wet rain stuff, but most of us take showers every day, getting wet is not the end of the world for a guy.

Ladies, I totally understand not wanting to get soaked in a rain near the office.
However, it could make for a hilarious (and lurid) episode of "The Office"...

bc

Posted by: bc | October 7, 2005 12:54 PM | Report abuse

SCC: "at" in first sentence.

Feh.

bc

Posted by: bc | October 7, 2005 12:56 PM | Report abuse

I refuse to use the "Starbucks" names for sizes. Saying "medium" instead of "grande" is my private protest. And what's with "venti" being a trademark?

Posted by: jw | October 7, 2005 12:57 PM | Report abuse

I love "The Office." Dwight Schrute is hilarious. And Steve Carell has always been hilarious, he was my favorite reporter on the Daily Show. Did anyone see him in SNL last weekend? I loved the song during his monologue.

Posted by: Sara | October 7, 2005 12:58 PM | Report abuse

If Starbucks ever tried to open a store in my neighborhood, the outrage of the patrons of St. Elmo's Coffee Pub would make the pitchfork and torch wielding villagers in "Frankenstein" look like a preschool picnic.

Personally, I quit drinking coffee when I quit smoking over 30 years ago (there is not a missionary in the entire world more zealous or more obnoxious than a reformed smoker). I view the coffee craze as a strange kind of PC-acceptable vice. You know, "I don't smoke or drink to excess, but I buy $5 cups of coffee." An indulgence which is pretty much guilt free.

Posted by: kurosawaguy | October 7, 2005 12:58 PM | Report abuse

AJ - I think being recognized by your Starbucks barrista is much better than being recognized by the guy behind the sandwich counter at work. He sees me approaching with my toasted rye (we have to toast our own bread here) and knows I'm the tuna with lettuce & tomato.

Joel - I wasn't at the gig - I'm in Charlottesville - but sounds like it was the kind of place to which I need to be accustomed. I bought your book this summer in Williamsburg. But if I'd been there last night, I would have bought it again.

Posted by: Mary Ann | October 7, 2005 12:59 PM | Report abuse

My favorite Starbucks reference was in The Simpsons. They're walking along inside a shopping mall (Bart and Homer, maybe, but somebody is walking along) and they go by a Starbucks. As they walk and talk they go by another Starbucks. Then they go by an empty store with a sign that says a Starbucks is coming there.

Posted by: Bayou Self | October 7, 2005 1:07 PM | Report abuse

After paying Starbuck's prices, I couldn't afford the full NYT Select, so I am only subscribing to the nouns and gerunds.

Posted by: PeterK | October 7, 2005 1:08 PM | Report abuse

Gee, I step away from the blog for a few hours and it(Joel) goes bonkers over the pronunciation of Van Gogh. (I've never heard the Van GOFF pronunciation though. Never had instruction in Dutch, but lots of German and a semester of Swedish. Jag ar Svenska flicka.)

It's sprinkling here in San Antonio, though, just enough to begin to trickle into and begin to replenish our two large oak rain barrels. I have shut off the AC after literally months, and can work inside with this amazing cool air coming through the back screen door. Heaven!

The subject is apparently coffee. East Coast author and now San Antonio resident David Liss wrote the book "The Coffee Trader." We became acquainted over coffee and my questions about civet cats (marsupials)--and he tipped me off to the existence of Kopi Luwak coffee. They don't serve it at Starbuck's yet (wink, wink), but you can order it from several coffee outlets in California. If any of you have ever swallowed/tasted/experienced it, I'd love to know.

You can Google this info on the Web, but I'll give you a more recent story from the Taipei Times, since Joel is an Asian (receipt-tallying) frame of mind.
***

AP , JAKARTA
Tuesday, Jan 20, 2004, Page 5

A cup of ``Kopi Luwak'' at a coffee shop in Jakarta, Indonesia, on Friday. The slightly oily brew is made from half-digested coffee beans. (caption to photo)


SARS fears have stopped the Chinese from eating civet cats. But that hasn't turned off others from sipping the strangest of brews -- one they insist is made from coffee beans eaten, partly digested and then excreted by the weasel-like animals.

The story goes like this: Civets live in the foliage of plantations across Southeast Asia. These fussy foragers pick the best and ripest coffee berries. Enzymes in their digestive system break down the flesh of the fruit before the animals expel the bean.

Workers collect beans from the plantation floor, wash away the dung and roast them to produce a unique drink that devotees might say is good to the last dropping.

Skeptics, though, dismiss it all as a weird and unverifiable marketing gimmick.

Still in Indonesia's capital Jakarta, the owner of three fashionable cafes, Agus Susanto, sells what he claims is a mix of regular beans and those that have passed through civets. The blend and the cafes are both called "Kopi Luwak" -- in English: "Civet Coffee."

"Our coffee has a strong taste and an even stronger aroma," Susanto said by telephone from his factory in central Java.

In Vietnam, now the world's second-largest regular coffee grower, a blend supposedly containing some civet beans is produced by the Trung Nguyen company under the "Weasel Coffee" brand.

In the Philippines, the Old Manila Coffee House used to sell a civet brew, but supplies have dwindled over the years, said Ellen Tuason, its finance officer.

"Some of our guests said it was an aphrodisiac. It has a strong coffee smell, but different. There is a distinct odor and flavor," she said.

The beans are also marketed internationally. Several US-based Internet coffee traders claim to offer them for up to US$325 a kilogram, placing it among the world's most expensive beverages.

However, many in Asia's coffee trade doubt whether the beans are truly produced in significant quantities, if at all.

"There are maybe a few bags here, a few bags there, but mostly its just a myth," said Victor Mah, a Singaporean who has been selling coffee from Southeast Asia for more than 25 years.

Others just won't swallow the claims.

"I think it's a big scam," said Mark Hanusz, who has spent eight months traveling Indonesia researching his book about coffee called A Cup of Java.

In the past few weeks, authorities in southern China have exterminated thousands of civet cats on fears that they carry and spread the SARS virus.

The World Health Organization also sees a potential relationship between the furry black-and-white animals and the disease that killed 774 people worldwide last year.

If that link is confirmed, consumer interest in civet coffee could plummet.

But in Jakarta, Susanto isn't worried. He expects to keep selling what he claims is 100 tonnes of civet coffee a month.

"There are many different kinds of civets in this world. The Indonesian ones are different from those in China," he said.

Henry Harmon, an American from Boston, Massachusetts, who owns a chain of coffee shops in Indonesia, said he thinks the drink is for real, though he has no plans to introduce it in his stores.

"It has a nice romantic -- well semi-romantic -- twist to it, but I'd be worried about product liability lawsuits," Harmon said.

Posted by: Linda Loomis | October 7, 2005 1:09 PM | Report abuse

Gerunds are the best part anyway.

Posted by: jw | October 7, 2005 1:10 PM | Report abuse

The civet is not a marsupial, it is a placental mammal. Civets are distantly related to cats -- not ancestral, they are distant cousins.

I knew all that, but I checked on about.com just in case I got it wrong.

Posted by: ScienceTim | October 7, 2005 1:16 PM | Report abuse

I notice that coffee enemas are back in the news for their supposed cancer preventative qualities. Surely Starbucks will hop on this trend like froggy on a Junebug. What to call the special Starbucks coffee treatment? Royal Flush? Cup of GI Joe?

Posted by: kurosawaguy | October 7, 2005 1:18 PM | Report abuse

Wow. Could LL be in wrong? This may be one for the histrory books.

I'll never believe anything she says again. I feel so betrayed.

Posted by: jw | October 7, 2005 1:19 PM | Report abuse

Sara, I missed Carell's SNL gig, though several folks told me it was good.

I loved the Brit version of "The Office", and the US version's pretty good too.

Mmmm. Can I get some Civet Coffee to wash down my balutes?

bc

Posted by: bc | October 7, 2005 1:19 PM | Report abuse

WP website appears to be very flaky today...

As a result of becoming acquainted with Liss, I bought one of the books cited in his bibliography in his fictional "The Coffee Trader."

"The Devil's Cup: A History of the World According to Coffee" is written by the zany Stewart Lee Allen, who makes a modern-day mapcap dash around the world pursuing the story of the history of coffee. Readers are whisked past Ethiopian bandits, past Parisian waiters, and into aromatic dens from Turkey to Brazil, just to name a few of his escapades.

Of course, Allen had me at his first epigram:

"As with art 'tis prepared, so you should drink it with art.
Abd el Kader (16th century)

Posted by: Loomis | October 7, 2005 1:20 PM | Report abuse

Useless, yet not entirely trivial information -- that's my beat.

Posted by: ScienceTim | October 7, 2005 1:20 PM | Report abuse

Maybe a greater mind can decipher what Merriam-Websster is saying about van the man in the second and third pronunciations, but the Goff thing appears to be British. So that's how you'd say it at a Starbucks over there.

Main Entry: Gogh, van
Pronunciation: van-'gO, -'gä[k], -'[k]o[k], British also -'g&f
Function: biographical name
Vincent Willem 1853-1890 Dutch painter; developed unique style of broad, expressive brushwork, heightened colors and contoured forms; influenced Expressionist and Symbolist schools

Posted by: Bayou Self | October 7, 2005 1:28 PM | Report abuse

Websster is a British pronunciation.

Posted by: Bayou Self | October 7, 2005 1:30 PM | Report abuse

jw,
Google is very split on this--civet cat marsupial vs. placental mammal. Where's Charles Darwin when we need him--or Vizzy, for that matter. Or a very current science textbook explanation? If I'm wrong, why, I shall never post again! I couldn't look David Liss in the face! (Would ja miss me?...Don't answer that!)

http://itotd.com/articles/474/

On a handful of Indonesian islands lives a small catlike animal called the palm civet (Paradoxurus hermaphroditus, if you care), also known as a "musang" or "toddy cat"--or, in Indonesian, a "luak." The palm civet is not a marsupial, though nearly every Web site about Kopi Luwak describes it as such--caveat lector. It's a nocturnal mammal that spends its life in the trees and eats a balanced diet of insects, rodents, and fruit. One fruit it's especially fond of is the coffee cherry, and it's very picky about which cherries it eats, too--only perfectly ripe ones will suffice.

http://www.tastesoftheworld.net/product_info.php/products_id/75

The Palm Civet or marsupial luwak of Indonesia a tree climbing animal that ranges in weight from three to ten pounds uses it's sense of smell and eyesight to seek out it's favorite treat the ripest coffee cherries.

Posted by: Loomis | October 7, 2005 1:33 PM | Report abuse

When on travel, given the choice between Starbucks and McD's, I'll pay the FourBucks. At home, I make my own latte (I use Lavazza beans) and yes, while the machine was a bit on the expensive side, I figure it will pay for itself in 2 years, max. No waiting in line, no wasting gas or looking for parking. Great coffee enjoyed the way it was meant to be-- Reading the paper edition of the WashPost in my PJ's!

Posted by: Pixel | October 7, 2005 1:36 PM | Report abuse

bc,
Fill us in on balutes (You know, if I could tempt you with a case of Shiner Bock or any other of Shiner's specialty/ seasonal beers, I would more than invite you to fix my floppy passenger-side car window.)

Science Tim,
Fill me in on sources, sources (legit, scientific, respectable) to solve the civet question marsupial/placental mammal.
Please? Jw is about to beat me up--he's casting aspersions on my stellar reputation. I may have to wear the Scarlet Letter "I"--for inaccurate!

Oh, the Friday Follies!

Posted by: Loomis | October 7, 2005 1:40 PM | Report abuse

Linda, look at it as a positive. If you weren't such a reliable source of all kinds of obscure knowledge, then no one would notice/care if you botched one once in a while. The fact that you're always right just makes trying to prove you wrong every once in a while fun. And I think always being right is a good thing.

Posted by: jw | October 7, 2005 1:45 PM | Report abuse

Civets are of the order Carnivora family Viverridae, which are all definitely placental.

Posted by: kurosawaguy | October 7, 2005 1:50 PM | Report abuse

Where do marsupials branch off? Order or family?

Posted by: jw | October 7, 2005 1:52 PM | Report abuse

K-guy: at the risk of turning this worthy Achenblog into a salacious Weingartenchat, in answer to the question, "What would Starbucks call a coffee enema?" I suspect the answer is: Colochino Grande. You could get one with extra mocha and double foam to allay the bitterness and burnt flavor missing in regular coffee enemas. I LOLed at your "GI Joe" double entendre (if that's what that was), but it presents a marketing problem: you can't charge four or five times what it's really worth with a pedestrian/middle class name like GI Joe. A Colochino Grande, on the other hand, just calls out for serious over-pricing.

Posted by: Curmudgeon | October 7, 2005 1:57 PM | Report abuse

I loved the item, but you must know that it's easy to get around the Times. Bring up a Select column, click on Edit, then Select All, then Copy. Address an e-mail and hit Edit, then Paste... and voila! Send it on.

Posted by: Dan Cordtz | October 7, 2005 2:01 PM | Report abuse

jw,
I saw mo's pictures. Great job, mo! You're quite the handsome young knave, I must say. Why, if I were 30 years younger I might just give your "old lady" a run for her money. No wonder Sara was flirting. (The more I type, the more trouble I'll get myself into.) Are you blushing yet, jw?

The civet question is still unsettled until I can see a definitive source.

I screwed up about Rev. Elisha Loomis (not Nathaniel) as the father of the first white-born child in the Hawaiian Islands. (That was simply a look-up problem, as the Loomis genealogy book is downstairs.)

I also said that George W. Bush and I share a common ancestor in Mayflower pilgrim Francis Cooke, woolcomber. Well, after I said that, I contacted the Francis Cooke Genealogical Society and the genealogist helped me immensely. Appears that Experience Mitchell married Jane Cooke, and for years everybody thought all the Mitchell children were descended from this union. Come to find out Jane died and Experience took a second wife, Mary (?). I'm descended from this second union.

George W. is decended from Francis Cooke's son John. Mitchell hadn't arrived for the first Thanksgiving dinner in 1622, but arrived about a year later. (I say this as we all start to think/feel fall..yeah! And it's a GIANT relief to me to know that my connection with Georgie and the rest of the Bushes [British Bohuns] is a lot more distant time-wise than I formerly thought.)

If anything, this blog is making me work harder! Aaargghh! This rainy Friday feels like a good day for confessions of the awkward kind.

Posted by: Loomis | October 7, 2005 2:03 PM | Report abuse

For those who require authority greater than mine-

http://animaldiversity.ummz.umich.edu/site/accounts/classification/Mammalia.html#Mammalia

Posted by: kurosawaguy | October 7, 2005 2:08 PM | Report abuse

Linda:

My main source of information is my own reasonably prodigious memory. Forced to find documentation, it took me until after kurosawaguy already got you the straight dope. Even so, I found some stuff via Google, noting that civets are in the same family (the Viverridae) as binturongs and mongooses (info from San Diego Zoo web site, related to lansangs; I saw their binturong a year ago and remembered it as a placental mammal). Further searching on dictionary definitions indicated the mongoose relationship, a creature that I knew for certain is placental. The clincher was the identification in order Carnivora. The definition of the Carnivora is much more stringent than just eating meat, and specifically includes cats and and dogs and a number of other critters (including civets, obviously). It is definitely a group of placental mammals.

As a general rule -- if it's a mammal outside Australia/New Zealand/Tasmania, the odds strongly favor it being a placental mammal.

Sorry about the use of secondary sources -- reasonably prodigious though my memory may be, I am an astrophysicist, not a biologist. Nevertheless, it's in a field of science, which is why I included the "Science" in my handle.

Posted by: ScienceTim | October 7, 2005 2:11 PM | Report abuse

Curmudgeon, Colochino Grande or whatever, there would never be any question about one thing. They would all be "to go."

Posted by: kurosawaguy | October 7, 2005 2:13 PM | Report abuse

Civets are of the order Carnivora family Viverridae, which are all definitely placental.

kuroswaguy,
How do you know this, the "blanket statement" part about ALL definitely being placental? How did you know about spiders? You let your e-mail address on the blog one day and it ended with si.edu. I just Googled si.edu and it's coming up Smithsonian Institute. Do you really work there? Doing what?

This blog is becoming an amazing place. Nani has revealed more about herself lately. Our Mo has worked out in Los Angeles. And, kurosawaguy, your Starbucks jokes are pretty darn funny today!

Lovin' the Boodle! Why did Joel write "luv" yesterday--felt so 60s or 70s?

Posted by: Loomis | October 7, 2005 2:14 PM | Report abuse

"placental"

I'm totally going to try and use that word in conversation today. Oh, Boy!

Posted by: LP | October 7, 2005 2:17 PM | Report abuse

time for tanka (compare haiku):

coffee enema
colochino grande, please
at least once a week
beats gasoline enemas
really, I'm quite sure of that

Posted by: omnigoof | October 7, 2005 2:18 PM | Report abuse

Do you think they would make a coffee nasal spray? I imagine it would work a whole lot better than the coffee I just snarfed all over my desk from laughing. What would one call it?

Posted by: peanutgallerymember | October 7, 2005 2:19 PM | Report abuse

kurosawaguy:

THAT is an ultra-cool geek-o-rama web site! I will have to show it to my daughter who memorizes all things related to animals (she could have authoritatively commented on the issue of civets being placental mammals).

Posted by: ScienceTim | October 7, 2005 2:21 PM | Report abuse

Haha! Linda, when jw and I were still in our brief flirting mode I still hadn't seen pictures of him. Not bad though, huh? I was pleasantly surprised to find out that I was actually flirting with a handsome man. In fact, the local D.C. boodlers are all a good looking group. Add the out of towners in and it'd have to be one of the best looking blogging groups around.

Posted by: Sara | October 7, 2005 2:26 PM | Report abuse

Trust me on this, (where have I heard that phrase before?) Joel wasn't just being a weather wimp when he chose Starbucks over the deluge. This was the leftover from Tropical Storm Tammy, and she was still in a bitchy mood. We're talking horizontal tsunami. Besides, with the ground so dry here in DC, flash floods were practically guaranteed. Joel was just wisely, nay heroically, sacrificing his own sense of machismo to prevent himself from being washed into the Potomac and instigating a national crisis. Besides, avoiding the rain to stay inside and drink way too much coffee is an innate characteristic of our species. Heck, in the Pacific Northwest, where I was raised, this practice is considered the bedrock of civilization.

Posted by: RD Padouk | October 7, 2005 2:37 PM | Report abuse

Coffee nasal spray names: Perk-ocet. Postum Nasal Drip. Flownice. Juanvaldezomine. A Starbucks Snortachino.

Posted by: Curmurdgeon | October 7, 2005 2:39 PM | Report abuse

Trust me on this one. I know about placental mammals. I know many, many placental mammals on a personal basis. I am married to a placental mammal. I come from a long line of placental mammals. I am myself a placental mammal.

Posted by: kurosawaguy | October 7, 2005 2:50 PM | Report abuse

LP, try "monotreme". It is even more mellifluous than "placental".

Linda Loomis, don't be fooled by the E-mail address. Many of the activitites here at Area 51 are carried out under the nominal aegis of the Smithsonian. Oops, now I'll have to kill you.

Posted by: kurosawaguy | October 7, 2005 2:59 PM | Report abuse

Padouk,
Where in the Pacific Northwest?

kurosawaguy,
"Oops, now I'll have to kill you."

I'm shakin' in my boots. My ex went into Army Delta Force or something like that after our big "D." A few years ago, I decided to find him after 20 years of silence to settle journalistic curiosity, let us say. I'd ask my leading former-journalist kind of questions to him, and his reply--often--was "If I told you, I'd have to kill you." Then he laughs.

Loved your reply to my question(s) to you, though.

and yes, Sara...
the pictures that mo provided of the Boodlers at the first BPH showed that all are truly attractive and extremely photogenic! Too bad we can't be there (somewhere there in D.C.) on the 11th.

Posted by: Loomis | October 7, 2005 3:19 PM | Report abuse

P.S. kurosawaguy,

Groom Lake, Nevada is a loooong way from D.C.!

Posted by: Loomis | October 7, 2005 3:25 PM | Report abuse

Hahahaha! Excellent name choices! If only I were so clever (hence asking the 'boodle).

I'll take one grande Mocha Colochino and a tall Chai Snortachino. [Turns to Curmurdgeon] You want anything?

Posted by: peanutgallerymember | October 7, 2005 3:35 PM | Report abuse

Puyallup. If you know where that is you are clearly a native. BTW - beaing able to post at this hour is a freakish occurance for me. I am home today.

Posted by: RD Padouk | October 7, 2005 3:41 PM | Report abuse

The Ig Nobel Prizes for 2005 have been awarded!

http://www.improb.com/ig/ig-pastwinners.html#ig2005

Posted by: Mary Ann | October 7, 2005 3:41 PM | Report abuse

LL--btw, I think mo is a female.

Posted by: golconda | October 7, 2005 3:45 PM | Report abuse

The nominal aegis of the Smithsonian covers a lot of territory. (I just like saying "nominal aegis", not as good as "monotreme" but still good.) WMGNFRB as Dave Barry would say.

Posted by: kurosawaguy | October 7, 2005 3:48 PM | Report abuse

moi moi:

at the exact moment someone thought you annoying, i was sure you were a genius lyricist...the words were so bouncy

Robert Duval suffered his first movie role with a non-speaking part.....MoDo can provide the catharsis of his pain with a Compote-Boodle-inspired "Hey Boo!," making him feel like...stay with me here...the most thoughtful, farsighted he-man in the world.

Posted by: sisjen | October 7, 2005 3:48 PM | Report abuse

Stop the presses! Breaking news! Just got the phone call I've been anxiously awaiting. No. 1 grand-girl just delivered No. 1 great-grand-boy. Must fly to hospital!
Melvin/a, please brief the press. Love, Nani

Posted by: Nani | October 7, 2005 3:52 PM | Report abuse

Nani, Joel would be a good name, if the kids are looking for suggestions.

Posted by: Bayou Self | October 7, 2005 3:55 PM | Report abuse

Nani:

That's great news! But get to the hospital safely to see the new little one.

Fellow 'boodlers and Kit master JA--all have a great weekend and a happy Columbus Day. Where I work we don't have it off. Sigh.

Posted by: aroc | October 7, 2005 3:56 PM | Report abuse

Also Nani, what with all the numbering o' the relations, you're not related to Charlie Chan, are you?

Posted by: Bayou Self | October 7, 2005 3:56 PM | Report abuse

Nani,

Congrats! I just got some pictures of my newest second cousin (though she'll feel like more of a neice because I'm so close to my cousins). They had to deliver a month early because of complications, but she's 3 weeks old now and she's filling out and she's adorable! The hospital dressed her up in a little mermaid costume for Halloween so that her parents could send pictures to the entire family (most haven't seen her because she's not allowed to leave the hospital yet and they don't like to let many visitors in), so I got those pictures this morning. She's absolutely gorgeous and I'm going out to Utah to see her and celebrate my grandparent's 50th wedding anniversary in about three weeks. I'm excited about that. Have fun with your newest and first great-grandbaby!

Posted by: Sara | October 7, 2005 4:07 PM | Report abuse

Nani,
Congrats!

golconda,
Yup, mo is female...so she says and the photos show

Padouk
Puyallup--Tiptoe through the tulips...

kurosawaguy,
Unfamiliar with Dave Barry-speak, so the letter jumble is lost on me...sorry.

Posted by: Loomis | October 7, 2005 4:22 PM | Report abuse

Linda, as a graduate school advisor once told my herpetologist brother, "You must broaden your cultural base." WMGNFRB= Would Make a Good Name For a Rock Band
And now ladies and gentlemen, Mo and the Monotremes!

Posted by: kurosawaguy | October 7, 2005 4:40 PM | Report abuse

Nani, congrtulations! You must be the first Great-Grandmother here. The Boodle strikes another first!

Posted by: dr | October 7, 2005 5:26 PM | Report abuse

I mean Congratulations.

Posted by: dr | October 7, 2005 5:30 PM | Report abuse

last time i checked i was female... but golconda, she meant she looked at the photos i posted and saw jw - the quintesstial cute boy! (stop blushing jw!)
i myself am neither attractive nor photogenic but i am a presence to be reckoned with! HAH!

all the cawfee talk had me busting out! i don't drink coffee so i'm not a pawn to the dark overlord starbuck's!

Posted by: mo | October 7, 2005 6:23 PM | Report abuse

and congrats nani!!!

Posted by: mo | October 7, 2005 6:23 PM | Report abuse

Linda, at the risk of terminally boring the kaboodle I must point out that although many tulips are grown in Puyallup, during my wild youth it was known for its daffodils. The cultural high point was, of course, the Daffodil Festival, which came complete with a lovely Daffodil Queen and the epic Daffodil Parade. (Like the places the rest of you grew up were all so gosh-darn cool....)

Posted by: RD Padouk | October 7, 2005 6:35 PM | Report abuse

Holy smokes! I AM blushing! And my girlfriend just emailed me about it. It must be Friday if this is what we've been reduced to--not that I mind (wink wink!)

Posted by: jw | October 7, 2005 6:41 PM | Report abuse

My God, what kind of blogspeak do we have here? I think I am losing it or am I in some kind of a stupor?? You are all nuts!

Posted by: Amanda | October 7, 2005 6:45 PM | Report abuse

Of course we are nuts. It is our finest charm.

To one and all, I bid you a happy Thanksgiving. We Canucks happily adopted your holiday a long time ago, but somewhere along the line, someone forgot to check his calendar and celebrated a month early! Happy Thanksgiving!

Posted by: dr | October 7, 2005 7:02 PM | Report abuse

Nani, Although I have never met you and probably never will, I am deligted at the birth of your grandchild. Such is the power of the internet and the benevolent aura of Joel Achenbach. I shall open a bottle of Chateau St. Michelle Gewurztraminer just for you.

Posted by: RD Padouk | October 7, 2005 7:08 PM | Report abuse

Padouk,
I am guilty. I have not been to Puyallup, but know a lot of the rest of Washington state, some areas better than others. I Googled Puyallup and saw that it has tulips but is far better known for its Daffodil Festival. The town where my husband and I lived from '86-'94, in Tracy, was known for its annual dry bean festival.

For several years, when the product Beano was entering the market, there would be free Beano samples passed out at one of the bean festival booths. The festival was a real gas! I miss it and some of the festival offerings/food dishes. So, be glad you're associated with daffodils. I have a T-shirt that reads: Happiness is Bean in Tracy (with little humanoid beans much like the Kingsburg, Calif., dancing/singing raisins).

And yes, Canada's thanksgiving is this month, as dr, the Canuck, reminds us. I'm actually glad that you identified yourself from the Pacific Northwest, Padouk, because that area didn't seem to have much Boodle representation for when Boodlechat sometimes goes local. And if you're pulling out Gewurz, I'll be right over!

I, for one, am glad for the various perspectives. Glad when omududu says he's Nigerian and we can get some feel for stories or issues from the African continent. Glad to hear from Eurotrash (though he's been rather quiet lately just getting back from vacation and all) and American in Siam, whose Boodle postings almost seem poetic in terms of their layout/narrower page margins.

We can tell Joel we've had a rather Dutch day on the Achenblog--starting with the Dutch painter van Gogh, moving to Dutch coffee traders, and ending with the Dutch who settled Puyallup and the Skagit Valley--and who knows what else sandwiched in-between. I can just imagine the BPH on the 11th--everyone will be going Dutch, or is that Dutch treat (paying his/her own bar tab).

Posted by: Linda Loomis | October 7, 2005 8:04 PM | Report abuse

Linda, you are a way cool lady. And its not just the Gewurztraminer talking. I hope everyone has a great three day weekend.

Posted by: RD Padouk | October 7, 2005 9:07 PM | Report abuse

I come to read and participate here and at Gene's chats, because I am fascinated by how different and how the same we are as nations. WE think so very different on some levels, and so much the same on others. Listening to you talk about your nations issues, all the silly and sublime, serious and frustrating things that happen in any nation, and I begin to understand my own nation better and myself better.

I've come to understand just how personal the change that the internet has brought is. The world that I knew as a child in small town Ssskatchewan will never feel the same again. The small town that I come from has high speed internet now, and no child growing up there will ever feel so far away, so remote from the rest of the world again. The horizons I see now are a whole lot further than just to the edge of the next field, and the next small town down the highway.

Besides all the laughter, besides all the very fine people I meet here, it is what you teach me that I treasure most.

Posted by: dr | October 7, 2005 11:25 PM | Report abuse

dr, what a nice comment. Happy Thanksgiving! I think the Canadians got it right (as usual) - much better time for a holiday - better weather for traveling, not so close to Christmas, harvested vegetables fresher.

RD, I know Puyallup and even pronounce it correctly, although I'm not a native Northwesterner. Have lived here longer than anywhere else, though. Why, I remember when Starbucks was just one store in Seattle...I have struggled hard to avoid the latte addiction because I cannot afford it. I treat myself when travelling. Mmmm, frapuccino...

Nani, congratulations! Have a great time with the little boodle of joy!

I still think Miers looks Dutch...the spelling, I mean. Oh, and it irritates me to hear the TV tennis commentators pronounce Russian names. They invariably get the accent on the wrong syllable - it is not that hard to get it right. But apparently they are given a prounciation guide that is wrong but sounds more American. Ai-yi-yi...

Oh, and Science Tim - astrophysicist! What a cool job.

Alas, Monday is not a holiday for me, but I work Tue-Fri, so in a way it is. Think I'll turn up Green Day really loud!

Posted by: mostlylurking | October 8, 2005 12:00 AM | Report abuse

Wow. Honesty at its finest.

Posted by: FF | October 8, 2005 12:12 AM | Report abuse

Richard (in case you happen to run accross this!),
It took me a while to get back to the thread, but I was grateful to see your thoughtful reply to my remarks of Wed night/Thur morning. Heck, I was just rambling in the middle of the night to hear myself talk (type), I didn't really expect anyone to THINK about my babblings!
I definitely agree that there's an intolerant, mean way of thinking that has a very disturbing predominance in current affairs. I think that it will be beaten back (because smart, reasonable people always win in the long run. But then, cockroaches and bacteria always win in the REALLY long run!), but vigilance is the key.

Thanks again for the thoughts & reply.

Posted by: Bob S. | October 8, 2005 11:46 AM | Report abuse

On an entirely different note:
I was just standing on my townhouse deck (which overlooks a tiny back yard, then a common clearing maybe twenty yards deep, then a fairly small stand of trees) and was struck by the activity of the local bird population. For no particularly good reason, I've always assumed that most birds would be annoyed by torrential rainfall, and would hunker down until it lightened up, in the absence of some really compelling need. This is, as it turns out, most assuredly NOT necessarily the case. They're out there just laughing and singing and flitting to-and-fro.
I'm seeing birds that I didn't realize were present in the general vicinity. There are the usual generic LBB's (Little Brown Birds), but more robins than I've ever noticed, along with (I'm no birdwatcher, so please understand that these are just the impressions of an uninformed layman):
A veritable flock of bluejays, a hawk or two that has wandered through periodically (upsetting the others, I've noticed!), two hummingbirds that are sipping the last that the neighbor's flowers have to offer, comically small owl that appears for the briefest of moments, and a couple of St. Louis Cardinals. Well, OK, probably not that last, they're all in San Diego today, right? But, dammit, it's some kind of very brightly colored red bird!
What's up with all the activity? Is it the rain causing easy food to come to the surface?

Posted by: Bob S. | October 8, 2005 12:17 PM | Report abuse

In case her Saturday column isn't read by everyone:

Apropos of the Frist & DeLay messes, Ruth Marcus tossed out this sweet zinger (with proper attribution to Euripides):

"Whom the gods would destroy, they first elect to leadership posts."

Posted by: Bob S. | October 8, 2005 12:33 PM | Report abuse

ll

Posted by: Anonymous | October 8, 2005 12:33 PM | Report abuse

Define: Starbucks
I live in rural North Carolina, and not clear about that. As to Maureen Dowd, boy does she creamate W, and makes one laugh while doing it.

Posted by: Cassandra S | October 8, 2005 1:01 PM | Report abuse

Congrats Nani!

Posted by: peanutgallerymember | October 8, 2005 1:17 PM | Report abuse

Cassandra, I'll bite (although I suspect that you're joshing, just a little, about your ignorance of Starbucks!)

Starbucks is a beautiful idea run amok. "Let's take the classic, funky little coffee shop & spread it around the country."

Great concept, very popular, so successful that its familiarity now breeds contempt. In most larger cities, you'd find it difficult to take a leak on a streetcorner without it draining by a Starbucks. (Wasn't THAT delightfully vulgar!)

Wal-Mart has somewhat the same problem... "Let's take large discount stores and bring them to smaller towns..."

Posted by: Bob S. | October 8, 2005 1:35 PM | Report abuse

Just on the offchance that you were serious about not knowing much about Starbucks:

It's goes deeper. There's a committment to bringing quality coffee to the great unwashed masses that have only had burnt cinders before. (Some serious coffee drinkers claim that Starbucks offers only faint hints of quality, but that's a debate I'll leave for the connoisseurs) There's also a laudable corporate goal of social resposibility. They claim (accurately, as far as I know) to pay their workers well above the prevailing wages for similar service jobs, and to take great care in choosing the providers of their supplies (particularly, but not exclusively, the coffee) to ensure minimal exploitation further down the supply chain.

It's a great concept, and EXTREMELY successfil. There is, however, a faint aura of "holier-than-thou" that comes sometimes from both the company and its patrons that some find off-putting. Also, anything that becomes large and successful will draw much (often but not always) criticism, methinks!

Posted by: Bob S. | October 8, 2005 1:52 PM | Report abuse

SCC - Did I really type "successfil" up there somewhere? That's EXACTLY why I don't usually make many entries to this wonderful forum!

Posted by: Bob S. | October 8, 2005 1:55 PM | Report abuse

Further SCC -
I won't even dwell on the "It's goes deeper." That was a beautiful example of incomplete self-editing.

Posted by: Bob S. | October 8, 2005 1:58 PM | Report abuse

I'm gonna leave this alone now, but this actually concerns content:

That parenthetical remark at the end of the last Starbucks thing was intended to read, "(often, but not always, unjustified)".

Posted by: Bob S. | October 8, 2005 2:04 PM | Report abuse

Apropos (pronounced Ah-Pro-Prose - like someone who writes for pay) of the Van Go-Goff-Gock-Hock thing:

The Brits also pronounce Cervantes's hero 'Don Kwix-it' instead of our 'Don Key-hoe-tee'.

Didn't Churchill say we were two cultures divided by a common language?

Posted by: pj | October 8, 2005 4:20 PM | Report abuse

Unfortunately Bob, the Starbucks-Wal-Mart analogy breaks right about at the point where you say the coffee chain has a "laudable corporate goal of social resposibility. They claim (accurately, as far as I know) to pay their workers well above the prevailing wages for similar service jobs, and to take great care in choosing the providers of their supplies (particularly, but not exclusively, the coffee) to ensure minimal exploitation further down the supply chain." None of this applies to Wal-Mart. It's all about the low price in Bentonville.

Posted by: kurosawaguy | October 8, 2005 5:51 PM | Report abuse

Yup. Wasn't thinking too clearly there. To the extent that Wal-Mart has a laudable goal, it's bringing goods to consumers everywhere at the lowest possible price. Plenty of room to question whether their ends have always justified their means.

Not that Wal-Mart doesn't do good stuff as community members or as a corporate entity (witness some timely & tremendously helpful actions during the recent hurricane mess). But jacking up wages anywhere along the supply chain certainly ain't corporate policy!

Posted by: Bob S. | October 8, 2005 6:04 PM | Report abuse

mo, I must disagree, I've seen your "hidden" (if you know where to look you can find it) picture on your web site and all I can say is: meow. )How do you spell that with emphasis again... meeeaooow!!!

Posted by: omnigood | October 8, 2005 6:25 PM | Report abuse

I nth that congrats nani. I'm tearing up here. That's tears..and some more tears..

Posted by: omnigood | October 8, 2005 6:27 PM | Report abuse

ah blorph, if anyone is not photogenic it's me. Look at the last picture of me between everyone..me standing.. and you'll see!

Posted by: omnigoof | October 8, 2005 6:31 PM | Report abuse

Thanksgiving on a Monday??? What wre you thinking. No long weekend?? so sorry

Posted by: omnigoof | October 8, 2005 6:34 PM | Report abuse

Sorry for all the multiple posts (trying to catch up).

dr, so true what you say about Nations, we are all just people. just like we are all WEIRD (thanks Tom fan).

Posted by: omnigood | October 8, 2005 6:37 PM | Report abuse

I'm thinking Starbucks is a coffee house franchise, that the city has lots of them, but I've never seen a Starbucks. And my knowledge of them comes from the movies! I wasn't sure it was one and the same. I live in a tier-one county (poorest of the poor), but we have the largest Wal-Mart in the world, just built. It's so big, one feels as if they're on an island, without the water.

Posted by: Cassandra S | October 8, 2005 6:45 PM | Report abuse

SCC for that rascal omnigoof (he's currently blorphing) were not wre.

And for Sara I think: check your local PBS station, they might be showing a 1940 version of "Pride and Prejudice" with Laurence Olivier. I plan to record and watch it. I hope you get this if it's on in your area.

Posted by: omnigood | October 8, 2005 6:47 PM | Report abuse

PJ, it was George Bernard Shaw who said that Americans and English were two nations separated by a common language. Do you know what parts of a vehicle are the boot and the bonnet?

Posted by: slyness | October 8, 2005 8:15 PM | Report abuse

I spent a few years in England, and while I generally knew the standard lingo differences (even the locals can't keep up with the slang of London, Newcastle & Liverpool!), I got tripped up occasionally.

Early in my stay there, while trying to recall the name of a pub regular, I referred to him as, "the tall dark-haired guy who alway wears suspenders." This caused great hilarity, as the gentleman in question (whose general appellation was "Long John", by the way) was a rather awkward looking fellow, and: What we call "suspenders", they call "braces", and what they call "suspenders", we would generally refer to as "garters". The thought of Long John prancing around in garters slayed them!

Near the end of my stay, I needed to replace the grass in my little back yard (always called a "garden", by the way), because three years of hosting my dog had been hard on it. When I mentioned that I needed to buy some "sod", the pub crowd was perplexed and mightily amused. "Sod" brings to the English mind any number of terms related to sodomy, but definitely does not hearken to mind what they would call "turf".

Live & learn, I reckon!

Posted by: Bob S. | October 8, 2005 9:11 PM | Report abuse

Congrats from me, too, Nani, on your great grand baby. Safe traveling.

May the deluge in DC not wash you all away and you come up for air next week.

Cheers for Columbus and the Nina, Pinta, and Santa Maria! They probably made this blog possible.

bdl

Posted by: boondocklurker | October 8, 2005 10:10 PM | Report abuse

Perrrrrr-fect. :-)

I was commenting last month of what I disliked about the NYT compared to the Post. WP not only is better written (they don't publish outright trash that the NYT does -- especially with the language [some people just don't like, or prefer, to be verbally assaulted with cuss words and outright uncivil language. If I wanted unvarnished talk, I'd browse the usenet instead]); it's offering it's readers things like these blogs, (which I'm loving more and more each day); the newspaper is even tweaked for the non-DC resident (non-residents are more interested in the politics in Washington, not the Metro and Life sections); and the post tries very hard to check-check-check it's sources, and even has an ombudsman program (which increases their journalistic integrity, and not just treating WP as a money grabbing enterprise -- a rarity now). Heck, apart from the Vontage ads, I even like their ads (especially the interactive ones, like the IBM one). With all these changes, and public participation outlets, even if WP will charge in the future for it, I'd be more inclined to buy a suscription because WP is simply more classy and considerate to it's readers.

NYT never offered me any tweaks, perks or even a good forum. Never a way to get to know the newspaper staff better than some dry copy (which is common in smaller cities, where you get to know your newspaper staff very well). Why would I be inclined to buy their newspaper, let alone have an interest to peruse their site more than WP, if they don't try to make me feel accepted and tailor my reading to what I feel is important (which IS WP's editorials and columns and exposes)?

To my dismay this morning I went to the NYT site following links, and found the main content an non city resident would read comes with a price tag. $14.95 for just reading a columnist's screed???? Some people are on a very limited income, and that high price tag makes it off limits. I'd rather spend $14.95 on a movie/DVD, than getting a 1000 word blah-blah from some arrogant and nasty talking anarchist in heels, or one that needs a good shave because he looks worse than a drunk under a bridge -- and probably reeks worse too.

So enjoy your next cup of cappa at Starbucks with pirated copies of Dowd for all I care. Maybe when NYT staff finally grows a brain cell they'll learn a lesson -- at least before you start charging people tailor the content for them, not charge them for columnist pinings (why would I want to know what shampoo Dowd uses??!! It could have an EPA warning on the label!! lololol) and treat them as money bags. You build loyality by offering things to your customers FIRST, not the other way around (maybe someone needs to teach the NYT crew civility, let alone simple business psychology??).

Happy tidings, WP. I hope you get the readers NYT lost!

SandyK

Posted by: SandyK | October 9, 2005 12:26 AM | Report abuse

Bob S. wrote:
===========================================
It's goes deeper. There's a committment to bringing quality coffee to the great unwashed masses that have only had burnt cinders before. (Some serious coffee drinkers claim that Starbucks offers only faint hints of quality, but that's a debate I'll leave for the connoisseurs) There's also a laudable corporate goal of social resposibility.
===========================================

Ah, Starbucks doesn't serve the best coffee by a long shot. If "good" coffee has to have all sorts of junk in it to drink, it's no longer coffee folks are drinking.

Try a cup of cowboy coffee (grinds and all), and then you'll appreciate coffee as coffee -- not milk, sugar, whip cream, chocolate sprinkles, etc..

As for social responsibility. WP knows what is the bottom line, especially when they get their bandwidth bill for these blogs and paying Typepad's licensing fee. To stay afloat and pay those socially "responsible" bills of their employees, they have to offer them a living wage, and that doesn't come from offering things for free.

As folks dislike Wal-Mart, after reading that despite Wal-Mart not paying for health insurance for it's employees, it seems to do the country a greater good for all -- like being a "shock absorber" for INFLATION. So it may not offer a living wage or perks for it's employees, but it sure gives both to the country so they can have their perks and pay for their health insurance by keeping inflation in check.

SandyK

Posted by: SandyK | October 9, 2005 12:46 AM | Report abuse

One word for WalMart employees: UNION. Pass it on.

Posted by: Once a Fellow Traveler, Now a Running Dog | October 9, 2005 8:12 AM | Report abuse

This is really off topic for this blog (apologies to Off Topic) but FINALLY here is a balanced look at the many influences that led to the New Orleans/Katrina disaster.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/10/08/AR2005100801458.html

Posted by: peanutgallerymember | October 9, 2005 9:37 AM | Report abuse

Slyness, thanks for the correction! The boot is the trunk and the bonnet is the hood?

Posted by: pj | October 9, 2005 2:51 PM | Report abuse

PJ, you got it!

Posted by: Slyness | October 9, 2005 2:58 PM | Report abuse

Linda Loo-

Sorry for being so late in getting back to you, I had a very busy weekend starting Friday afternoon.

Re. balutes with my Civet Coffee...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Balut

Mmmm.

Enjoy.

bc

Posted by: bc | October 10, 2005 9:40 AM | Report abuse

RE: TimesSelect

PSSSSSSSSSSSSST:
Ever hear of Copy & Paste?
"Control C" and "Control V" and you can then (furtively) email Dowd et al to all your email buddies.
Of course, SOMEBODY has to have forked over the fee initially...

One of my big gripes about this whole system is that "The Top Emailed Articles" list has become totally skewed--it no longer reflects the truly most popular articles.

Posted by: Nicki | October 13, 2005 1:10 PM | Report abuse

I read Dowd's column at the coffee shop at lunch w/out buying the paper. But that's because I:
1)wouldn't throw any money into the NYT cesspool, with its anti-U.S. administration, biased news and columnists,
2)think it's a hoot to read Dowd and Krugman, with their overflowing anger that disrupts any objectivity in their brains.

Posted by: steve bourg | October 22, 2005 3:21 PM | Report abuse

I read Dowd's column at the coffee shop at lunch w/out buying the paper. But that's because I:
1)wouldn't throw any money into the NYT cesspool, with its anti-U.S. administration, biased news and columnists,
2)think it's a hoot to read Dowd and Krugman, with their overflowing anger that disrupts any objectivity in their brains.

Posted by: steve bourg | October 22, 2005 3:22 PM | Report abuse

for decades I was used to pay for at least one daily newspaper and one weekly newspaper as a subscriber (and ad hoc for lots of others). when I started to read my german newspapers online I was prepared to pay but I got it for nothing. today I am asked to pay, not only by TImes Select, and I of course I will or would do so - IF the total price for my newspaper-online-time is not going to exceed some 50 dollars per month.
those people who decide about the prices should realize that the online-reader is somebody absolutely different from the former subscriber. as an online-reader I am looking at a multitude of papers in different languages edited all over the world. I will have to change what has grown into a habit if all those papers will ask for the same amount as Times Select already does. there has to be quite another system of compensation.

Posted by: matthias | October 25, 2005 7:21 AM | Report abuse

for decades I was used to pay for at least one daily newspaper and one weekly newspaper as a subscriber (and ad hoc for lots of others). when I started to read my german newspapers online I was prepared to pay but I got it for nothing. today I am asked to pay, not only by TImes Select, and I of course I will or would do so - IF the total price for my newspaper-online-time is not going to exceed some 50 dollars per month.
those people who decide about the prices should realize that the online-reader is somebody absolutely different from the former subscriber. as an online-reader I am looking at a multitude of papers in different languages edited all over the world. I will have to change what has grown into a habit if all those papers will ask for the same amount as Times Select already does. there has to be quite another system of compensation.

Posted by: matthias | October 25, 2005 7:37 AM | Report abuse

이 사이트의 무궁한 발전을 기원합니다.
100배 이상 영어학습이 빨라지고 쉬워지는 원리가
개발되었다고 하는군요.
많은 지식인들이 그 원리를 알아보고 영어의 혁명이
일어났다고들 한답니다.
사이트 www.007.or.kr 에서 그냥 샘플을 다운받아
살펴보시면 공감이 가실겁니다.
모든분들이 영어에 자신감을 가져 국력을 키워 갔으면 하는 마음입니다.

p.s 운영자님
이 내용게시를 원하지 않으시면 저의 메일로 사이트주소를 보내주시면
즉시 삭제후 다시는 올리지 않겠습니다..
죄송합니다. 건강하십시요. 메일주소는 gasu017@hotmail.com 입니다.
비번: 2345

Posted by: 정진우 | October 25, 2005 10:42 AM | Report abuse

이 사이트의 무궁한 발전을 기원드립니다.
영어 때문에 우리는 너무 많은 시간을 투자합니다.
그러나 기네스북에 도전할 정도로 빠르고
100배 쉽게 영어를 정복할수 있는 원리가 있답니다.
이 원리를 보고 많은 지식인들은 영어의 혁명이
일어났다고 한답니다.
사이트 www.007.or.kr 에서 그 모든것을 확인해
볼수 있아오니 모든 분들이 영어를 100배 쉽게 빠르게 학습
했으면 하는 마음 간절하여 이글 드립니다.


운영자님 대단히 죄송합니다.
이 내용게시를 원하지 않으시면 아래 메일로 사이트주소를 통보해 주시면
다시는 올려지는 일이 없도록 하겠습니다.
(사이트에 연결되는 다른 주소가 있다면 모든 사이트 주소도 알려
주셔야 다시는 올라가지 않습니다)
-- 메일주소 apadong1@hotmail.com 입니다.
비번: 1234

Posted by: 이정식 | November 3, 2005 8:44 PM | Report abuse

Running out to the local coffee house to find a stained copy of the ocal MSM before it goes into the recycling box, just to read Dowd and Rich addended, has become a chore that matches the "Old Gray Lady" as dominatrix, as much as under the WMD headlines of Judith Miller.

Posted by: MG | November 8, 2005 7:34 PM | Report abuse

I read all the op-eds from the NYT at my local college library....they have a subscription to lexus nexus.... requires a little work (searching by author or headline)....my brother in law school gets them emailed from westlaw everyday... alternatively, can you share the times select login with people?

peace

Posted by: Al | November 9, 2005 12:43 PM | Report abuse

정말 깜짝 놀랄만한 질병 치료법입니다.
누구나 단 하루를 배워서 많은 질병을 치료할수 있는 획기적인
치료법이라면 믿으시겠습니까. 누구나 쉽게 배워서 쉽게 할수 있답니다.
이 방법으로 많은 질병을 다스린다면 정말 믿으시겠습니까?
이제 귀하도 훌륭한 치료사가 되어서 가족의 건강을 책임질수 있답니다.
치료법은 www.007.or.kr 에 있사오니 면밀히 검토해 보시고 공감이 가시면
훌륭한 치료사가 되시어 가족과 이웃에 건강을 선물하십시요.

운영자님 죄송합니다. 이 게시물을 원치 않으시면
gasu01044@hotmail.com 으로 홈피주소를 알려주십시요.
(연결되는 모든 홈피주소를 알려주셔야 다시 올라가지 않습니다)
늘 건강하십시요.
삭제번호 : 23456

Posted by: 박관호 | December 3, 2005 9:34 AM | Report abuse

Each month lots of people visit http://www.Alcwin.org Whether it is Chemistry, geology, mathematics or a whole range of topics

Posted by: Education Portal | July 7, 2006 10:22 AM | Report abuse

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