Dangerous Skies

When I heard about the foiled plots, I thought about you and some others I knew that had returned from Europe in the past couple of weeks.

I'm glad you're all home safely.

bc

Joel, we're glad you're home, too.

And thank God for Scotland Yard. I hope they got everybody involved.

The last time my daughter took a plane, she thought she would take a snack--cheese. Harmless enough. But her next idea wasn't so brilliant: a sharp knife to slice it with? She actually got all the way to the security checkpoint without reconsidering her choice. So they took the knife from her at security, and now I expect she'll never walk through security again without an interview and a personal bag search. And every time I get pulled aside and have my luggage examined, swabbed and analyzed, I'll think, it's because I have the same name as that crazy girl who tried to take a knife on the plane (!)

Andy Borowitz says he's offended by the signs that say, "no jokes allowed" in the airport security area--he says he's a victim of profiling, and that would apply to you too, Joel--you seem to have difficulty staying serious for prolonged periods of time. How do you handle your humor urges when you are going through security?

Thank goodness you and your family are home safely. Air travel is something I now avoid unless it's absolutely necessary.

While visiting DC a couple of summers ago, my wife and I were struck by the lack of visible security personnel in the Metro. We rode the red (?) line from the vicinity of Damascus to the Smithsonian station andf saw but one bicycle toting transit officer on th etrip into the central station, and nobody else until we detrained at the central station. That place had a very visible security presence. The overall security picture, however was incongruent with what we expected: no uniformed security personnel on the trains, nor the platforms during a 45 minute trip into the central station. As such, one has to suspect that the news items about the way HS is running the security operation rings true in the sense that it is a work in progreess. I sense a reactive mode as oppoosed to a proactive mode, as least with respect to commuter trains, freight trains and ports.

Jack: I would point out a couple of things--Metro, like all law enforcement agencies, has a finite amount of personnel resources, and they try to post them where the threat potential is higher, i.e. like Metro Center. Metro does have good video surveilance throughout the system to try and monitor potential problems. It isn't perfect, of course, but with multiple entries scattered over 102 miles of track routes, it probably isn't possible to provide complete security. As was said above, the best way to foil these plots is before they get started.

You are a fine observer JA. I note that you compliment the French agent for not being robotic or rote in her application of the security measures. Why ? Is it because this is the way the TSA employees are applying them in the US ? I think so. I'm always amaze to see them picking a 10 year old child in shorts and flip flops for the complete search. It's disconcerting to see the agent sorting through stuffed animals and candy packs while the bearded swarthy guy gets the pass. I know the theory, if you let 10 years old Mormon girls get through easily the bad guys will disguise themselves as 10 years old Mormon girls, but I'm still amazed at this flagrant waste of resources. TSA has a long way to go before reaching the professionalism of many European countries' agencies. Even before the Day that Should Have Another Name and not a Bunch of Numbers Switzerland had those guys&gals picking people up in the queues for a quick chat. All of them could speak multiple languages and were incredibly professional and good at picking oddballs. I was always a bit frustrated to be dismissed after two words, they put me in the boring bin in no time flat. I wish there was at least a whiff of danger about me.

When we took the kids to the airport before the trip, I gave them a little talk of what to expect on the plane so that if they hit turbulence they wouldn't be worried etc. What we forgot to warn them was how serious it was to go through security. I was allowed to take them to the gate, my husband could only go as far as the security check. While we were waiting in line we had them clean out pockets, and my husband suggested my older daughter remove her jacket, without pausing she said, as only a ten year old could, "why Dad its not like I am going to bomb the plane", which sent mom and dad into panic and a rushed explanation of how your cannot joke about those things in an airport.

I hope they caught all the people involved, I hope there are not others waiting to fill in. So many innocent people have been caught in the crossfire of hatred already, I hope it stops.

Most importantly I hope the perpetrators get punished not those who happen share only a common nationality (by birth or heritage) or religion with the criminals.

When returning from France on New Years Eve 2003, I was stopped and interogated by the FBI because my name matched a similar name on a watch list. Richard Lieby wrote an article about an NIH employee named Mike McMahon that was also stopped on the same day for the same reason.

I would supply a link, but all I have is a photocopy of Richard Leiby's Reliable Source column of February 18, 2004 titled "Canceled Again? Blame The Luck of the Irish". The article is not Googleâ„¢able and the WaPo archives is on the fritz.

Not to downplay the need for us to be more vigilant, but isn't when we are walking OFF the plane the wrong time to apprehend dangerous potential terrorists like myself?

If we truly did break-up a plot to destroy multiple planes, yay for us (or Scotland Yard or MI-7 or whoever actually did the real heavy lifting). I am also a little disturbed that a lot of these plots are coming out of Britain, including the recent subway attacks.

When my wife flew to Rome way back in 1984, the airport was crawling with heavily armored police with German Shepards and automatic weapons. It freaked her out a little bit, but given Italy's long struggle with terrorism, it made sense and seems to have worked.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qd3VV8Za04g

eb: Just wondering aloud...It would be pretty oppressive to have a constant, visible presence. I got the feeling of being in a heightened state of awareness during that visit, particularly since the children were in tow. Living in our rather insulated world, I forget about things like video surveillance and how effective it is. HS and I suppose the entire global security apparatus is faring pretty well despite the work-in-progress appearance. We would certainly be aware otherwise.

At least you, Joel, included the line: "Will our man in Texas leave his ranch?"

If this is such a serious situation, why wasn't Bush winging his way back to Washington last night? I guess it's more important to go fishing on his man-made lake, clear some brush, talk to Tony on secure video lines from his Crawford bunker, ignore Cindy Sheehan. Will this obvious diversion from the government's serious business be this year's "Hurricane Katrina" disaster for Bush?

Why was Robert Mueller of the FBI on the stage this morning merely as a placeholder, a dummy, a puppet--the only response from him coming from him after a question was directed specifically to him? Why was Alberto Gonzales at the mic this morning? What was value-added in his remarks? Is anyone as cynical as I am and wondering why this announcement was made a day after the Lamont upset in Connecticut--drawing attention away from the weakness of the Republican senatorial candidate there and possible Rove shenanigans behind-the-scenes?

There are so many missing pieces of this news jigsaw puzzle that we don't know--particularly the British side of the story. How many countries were tracking the movements and activities of these would-be terrorists? Is the British terrorist plot of undetermined bomb-making liquids linked to al Qaeda?

Notice that there appears to be no attempt on the part of terrorists to hijack the planes and direct them at U.S. targets--the 9/11 scenario (they could be shot down), but rather the focus is on the alleged attempt to assemble small kits of chemical substances to be combined inflight in the planes' restrooms to create a bomb.

Are these alleged terrorists of Pakistani descent? Where was Scotland Yard canvassing in the British Isles? Again back in Leeds, the hometown of the subway bombers? What kind of press conference was held in Britain? Who were the British players at the mic there--that wasn't shown on either the ABC or NBC morning shows here in San Antonio.

As Shreiking Denizen pointed out, why is our own Transporation Safety Administration so bad at catching or apprehending would-be terrorists? Shouldn't we be targeting men and women of Middle Eastern descent--and have better specificity in our profiling--despite the cries of ethnic wrongdoing? Point made by Shreiking Denizen and taken about the 10-year-old Mormon girl--also consider the granny with a carry-on, or the business traveler who travels light, like my own husband.

Are those FBI computers up and working yet? Pull out the old stories about all the problems with the FBI software! What role did our own CIA play? Also, our Department of Homeland Security? Why cripple and slow the whole U.S. transportation grid for an undetermined amount of time, when the thrust of the terroist activity seems to be, in this early round of reporting, directed at three or four possble domestic carriers, and perhaps British Airways, on flights from Great Britain into the United States?

In this time of heightened sensitivity to war, destruction, and terrorism, is *this*

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/08/09/AR2006080901881.html

really such a great idea?

I've spend many, many hours of time in Washington DC area traffic (my daily commute is 40 miles each way, and I work in the city), but I'm not sure about the tastefulness of gettin' all Ayn Rand-y on the hated Wilson Bridge at this particular point in time.

bc

bc,
You're now turning the terrorist discussion of Homeland Security into a local discussion of your infrastructure. S'O.K, but no comments about the international activities and press conference this morning?

We in the midst of deep south Texas even had local stations going to cover the San Antonio airport and lines and checkpoints there this morning. Still a pretty sleepy scenario here. I guess the local yokels have to fill airtime someway somehow.

Loomis, CTV new, and likely CBC news carried the press breifing from the Brits. I caught only parts of it, because Mr.dr was still sleeping and the volume was way low.

There will likely be better coverage on the Brits later today on your local stations.

My closest colleague is over in England right now with his family. They just left this week and are due to remain over there for the next week or so. Timing is everything I guess.

I can't help but wonder in sheer amazement that if this country (with others) had invested the energy and resources directly against al Queda at the beginning that have been utterly wasted (along with all the wasted people who have died (both U.S. and Iraqi)) in Iraq, the situation wouldn't be quite so volatile.

I'm thrilled that the UK appears to have shut down this operation (or at least most of it), but I look at our very own DHC as the Keystone Kops, with operations looking like a Rube Goldberg fantasy without the humor or the ingenuity. Nothing but string and chewing gum over here. And, alas, unsurprisingly, Little Boy insists on his vacation.

*sigh*

Achenfan, you were monitoring the boodle a little while ago; you still there? How far away from Hong Kong is the "super typhoon" that's tearing up South China? There's a long story in the Post that mentions lots of cities and provinces--not one of which I ever heard of and have no clue about where they are talking about (which IMHO is bad writing; all I ask is one lousy little sentence like "approximately 400 miles southwest of Hong Kong," or some such).

In the last chat, mostlurking (IIRC) was discussing Ruth Rendell's psychological mysteries. I would also recommend mysteries by Charles Todd, especially "Wings of Fire," a really good psychological whodunit set in England (where else) in the 1920s.

We had the discussion about the demographic make-up of the military during Vietnam, and I have to confess, as interesting as that discussion might have been then and might be now, I still don't see the relevance. Yes, the demographics are skewed. And? Demographics are always skewed one way or another, and military demographics are always skewed, and always will be due to the nature of the work and the opportunity aspect. Caesar's Roman Legion demographics were skewed the same way Grant's were, Eisenhower's were, Westmoreland's were, and Pace's are.

Although he's often pretty bland, I generally like David Broder's political commentary, but this morning on WaPo radio I thought he said something especially dumb and irritating about the arrest of those potential hijackers in Britain (and many congrats to the boyos at Scottland Yard): Broder praised President Bush for (paraphrasing) "being on top" of the situation. Jeez. Talk about gratuitous sucking up.

There is also some video available on BBC News. On the home page, watch live, and then down at the bottom of the news player screen. Click on the Major threat leader.

Anybody catch this on Slate?

http://www.slate.com/id/2146654/entry/2146655/

About the screwups in the FBI, one of Louis Freeh's first acts was to get rid of the computer in his office...wow.

I'm not sure I could read the book and not be actively ill. We can't be Luddites and expect to survive, as the news from London shows. I just hope this means we're all doing a better job at intelligence.

Why do we worry so much about our own little pleasure trips to Saint Chapelle and CERN (yeah, yeah, I'm picking on Joel somewhat by example) and not headlines and stories like these?

By Andy Mosher
Washington Post Foreign Service
Thursday, August 10, 2006; Page A20

BAGHDAD, Aug. 9 -- Figures compiled by the city morgue indicated Wednesday that the number of killings in the Iraqi capital reached a new high last month, and the U.S. military said a new effort to bring security to Baghdad will succeed only if Iraqis "want it to work."

The Baghdad morgue took in 1,815 bodies during July, news services quoted the facility's assistant manager, Abdul Razzaq al-Obeidi, as saying. The previous month's tally was 1,595. Obeidi estimated that as many as 90 percent of the total died violent deaths.

Mudge, my boss, the erstwhile Republican, told me yesterday that he got to go along and meet POTUS on his last visit to our fair town. His impression was that POTUS isn't real bright.

Don't blame me, I didn't vote for him, either time!

Liquids and Lotions? they're banning liquids and lotions now. Does this include toothpaste? aftershave? this is really starting to get a little out of hand.

My first thought was that I shouldn't be flying for some time. Right now I have something weird going on that requires I manually adjust my water and sodium balance at periodic intervals.

I could never manage a flight with those titchy servings of fluids they serve, I've always needed at least 16 oz more fluids than they give. And I'd hate to be arrested for carrying salt packets on. But without either, it's just remotely possible I could go into a medical emergency. Granted, I won't be bombing anything.

I think the airlines should be more mindful of the fluid shortage now, and be more forthcoming with the beverages.

You mean there are no women employed by Scotland Yard? Who'da thunk it?

http://www.sameshield.com/press/sspress09a.html

We now come to Class 3, Paid Patrols. Those employed in London, working with the Metropolitan Police, and paid by Scotland Yard, are at present engaged chiefly upon work coming under Nos. 1 and 2 of the activities given above for Policewomen; and they are making a valuable contribution towards the welfare of the nation. Their work differs from that of that of the Paid Patrols in the provinces in being carried out in the actual company of men constables on their different beats; whilst a further distinction is that they draw their pay from the Police, whereas Paid Patrols in provincial towns in some cases receive it through a voluntary association.

Selfish, yeah I know. But people can live without toothpaste on the carryons, and all that dreck, even if I do tend to pack those myself in the carryon so I have something in case my luggage is stolen... often all I have is the carryon.

At least we can thank god that most airports sell beverages past the security checkpoints. Unless you're stuck in Moscow then all you can buy is vodka...

Loomis, that review is dated May 1918!!!

Channeling Tom fan===> 'our our' in first sentence of second paragraph...

The Brits aren't even allowing liquids for disinfecting contact lenses. I wonder about squirt cans of shaving cream. Maybe in the future we can put our clothing into checked baggage and wear paper gowns and slippers for the trip.

Typhoon Saomai has hit the Chinese coast north of Taiwan with 150 mph winds. It had been a category 5. Weather Underground has an impressive picture of the storm as it reached land well south of Shanghai.

I know, Wilbrod. Now you can see the strides--maybe not--women have made? Or men's perceptions of women in law enforcement?

There is a rather infamous case of an overzealous TSA agent forcing a woman to drink breast milk before taking it on the plane. What are the rest of us going to do? Brush our teeth? "Look, it whitens my teeth, freshens my breath, and when mixed with shaving cream creates a volatile explosive!"

As a good practice, I like to pack a few essentials including fresh underwear into my carry-on luggage for when, not if, the airline loses my luggage. Now I will just have to rely on hotel branded trinkets for all my grooming and hygenic needs while traveling.

The cynic in me makes me wonder if this isn't all a marketing scheme by the toiletries manufacturers. Look at what the last round of overzealous paranoia did for the nail clipper business.

I'm not an United Kingdomder, so I can't say. But if those books and BCC specials starring Helen Mirren as Inspector Tennyson are any indication at all of reality, progress remains hard.

I will say that I would like to see similar stuff for America in 1916, given that women were still struggling for the right to vote back then.

Linda,
the Metropolitan police spoke of "all British citizens, many of Pakistani descent" in their description of the 21 men arrested. Only men were arrested again, of course.
Your granny comment reminded me of an incident I witnessed from 6 feet back at O'Hare around 2003 (pre TSA I believe). The airport security agent demanded that a frail old lady (at least 75, maybe up to 85) using one of those aluminum cane/walker, the ones with 4 feet at the base, open a small wrapped gift she had in her hand luggage. The granny grumpily complied, adding a few choice words addressed at security measures in general, not at the agent. The gift for her son was a small wooden billy club for stunning a fish once hauled in the boat. It was a very decorated item about 7-8 in. long, not large enough for a good pike and certainly not enough to knock down any person, even when handled by a strong man. The agent promptly confiscated the item as a weapon. The grumpy granny wasn't amused and started arguing using strong words but again nothing personal, insulting or threatening. The agent then pushed the panic button that closed the doors to that section, in fact sequestering our little group between two glass walls, and summoned Chicago's finest. Thankfully the veteran cop that showed up made common sense prevail. You should have seen the look of contempt he gave to the twenty-something security guard. The grumpy granny, armed with her cane and miniature billy club were let free to enter the departing area. Chicago PD 1, Airport Security 0.

Yellowjkt... you could try powdered toothpaste? Like baking soda?

Of course, explaining THAT could sound tricky, especially if you're staring at an "NO TOOTHPASTE sign."

"It's baking soda, I like to keep the smell in my luggage nice and clean. Don't you hate it when you're flying to Paris and your clothes smell like Rio de Janerio? It just wrecks the mood."

Hey, both the New York Times and the Washington Post got to use the word "thwart" in their headlines.

That can't be all bad.

I'm no fan of Dubya by any means, but I'm not sure what he could accomplish by rushing back to Washington vs. utilizing the no doubt superlative communications equipment that he has at his ranch to stay in touch with this emerging situation. I was working across the Potomac from the Pentagon on 9/11 and obviously was directly affected by that attack, but I had no problem with the idea that they took him to a secure underground bunker in Omaha for a few hours rather than bringing him straight back to Washington when we didn't know what else might be about to happen here.

Let's face it, Washington isn't the best place to be during periods of heightened terrorist activity. Whatever you may think of Dubya as a person, the Presidency itself must be protected.

My wife is the nervous flyer, and she gets the extra search and questions everytime we've flown anywhere (even when flying between Boondockia and Hicksville).

In 2004 we flew out of De Gaulle to Toronto. We're sitting in the centre section, getting ready to taxi. My wife is even more nervous than normal and eventually says 'watch this guy next to me'. Youngish, Middle Eastern looking man, very fidgety. Calming words to wife. Then I notice a bit of pattern. Guy looks in his bag every thirty seconds (without taking anything out or putting anything in), looks at his watch and also keeps making eye contact with another guy about 10 rows forward and left. Now I'M paying attention and getting an adrenaline surge. The next 30 minutes passed very slowly. We get to altitude, buddy calms down, pulls out a novel and trip passes uneventfully.

Also, a colleague in the office left London on the Tube the day London was hit. So this stuff is close to home for a lot of people.

Somebody wrote a funny column awhile back about overzealous security screeners.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/06/02/AR2005060201588.html

He even fit the word "spiffy" in.

And either Joel, Barry, or Weingarten wrote a "modest proposal" that we all fly naked for complete trust, safety, and security. I hope I haven't offended the two didn't write it.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/terrorism/story/0,,1841778,00.html

Police were today searching a number of homes and businesses in London, High Wycombe and Birmingham after the arrest of 21 people in connection with the alleged terrorist plot to blow up planes leaving the UK.

Tony Blair's away on holiday, too? Too much!

Hi, yellojkt - "Naked Air" was actually Tom Friedman. Not normally that funny a guy . . .

Omni, thanks, will fix.

I think I can see the day, and it may not be far off, when the TSA/airlines will banish ALL carry-ons. Everything goes into the luggage bin that you can get in your pocket or purse. On the plus side, it will make getting on and off the plane a whole lot easier!

Wilbrod, I'm with you on the water. I always take (or took, rather) my own snacks and water so that I don't have to depend on the service.

Linda, my 9:52 was more thinking about context that a detailed discussion of local DC infrastructure.

bc

'mudge, I'm having trouble keeping track of all the typhoons, tropical storms, and tropical depressions around here at the moment.

Last week Typhoon Prapiroon, which was 280 km southwest (or south/southwest?) of Hong Kong at its closest, brought gale-force winds and torrential rain -- loooxurry compared with the damage elsewhere (Guangdong? Guaungzhou? Again: having trouble keeping track.) The level-3 warning signal was raised, but a lot of people are taking umbrage because they think it should have been an 8. (I find this rather comforting -- I now know I can survive an 8.)

Now Tropical Depression Bopha, which was downgraded from a tropical storm, is 170 km east/southest of Hong Kong and not having much of an impact here but did cause landslides in Taiwan.

Meanwhile, the South China Morning Post reports that yet another typhoon -- Typhoon Saomai -- is "swirling towards Taiwan."

We're going to Bali on Saturday. Not sure whether I should be more worried about weather delaying our flight or about terrorists. Might be best if I try the Don't Worry Be Happy approach. (But I reserve the right to be just a little bit scared of those biting, thieving monkeys they have down there.)

The bad guys were using liquids and gel containers to transport materials onto planes where they could be combined to form explosives. The also needed some kind of electronics to set the thing off, so phones and other battery powered things might be in the not in your carryon list.
My understanding is that today in Britian all you get to carry on is your wallet and your passport. No meds, no anything else.

I have no problem with them blocking those kinds of substances but the airlines are going to have to be prepared for the provision of more food and water on board.

ebtnut,

I also predict purses the size of steamer trunks. I think British Airways is even banning iPods and cell phones. If the goal was to paralyze the economies of infidel nations, the terrorists have already won.

All terrorists really need to do to crush our civilization is to post increasingly idiotic plans on websites easily searchable by Googleâ„¢ (complete with English translations, in case we fire more valuable military personnel because they want to sleep with the wrong gender) and watch us run around screaming about the sky falling, particularly in election years.

*time warp alert*

This is the second time I've read down to the last post in the Boodle, refreshed the page, and found a NEW post that is EARLIER than the last post.

*faxing a few more cesium atoms to WaPo's atomic clock*

;-)

Good work, omni.
You're good at weeding our the typos.

One of my posts also appeared BEFORE a post I had already read as I was typing my post. The time stamp for mine was 1 minute earlier.

Please stay calm. Despite the time warping, people are still welcome to carry their personal baggage onto this boodle.

And yes, they may consume all the beverages they want, although if they brush their teeth while boodling etc. I think we would prefer not to know (or watch.)

I am sure I read that darn CERN word again this morning. It may have been in yesterdays boodle.

Scotland Yard has been looking over this case for months! They managed to disrupt the plot when they lost track of a couple of people and were forced to move in. I give them full credit for not bungling the case. You're bound to lose a suspect, but, they still managed to get the majority of individuals in question.

In a scenerio like this where the authorities are monitoring specific people, I would imagine profiling to be a good idea, especially when you know what your suspects are going to look like.

During other times, however, I just don't buy it. I suppose I'm partially biased, as I am considered "Middle Eastern." It's troubling to know that just my simple appearance on a genetic level - something that I can do nothing about - can cause so much fear and distrust within passengers.

Oh I'm young, clean-shaven, well-educated, and whatever counterstereotype you can throw out there. (And some say I look Italian anyway.) But what else do I have to do to be treated like a normal human being and not some rabid and dangerous animal ?

That's my point: I shouldn't have to try! If authorities are going to stop me because I match someone specific they're looking for, then I agree with that 100% If my name matches someone they're looking for, then all the better! (Not possible, my name is ancient Persian and rare.)

If they're stopping me because I have dark hair and my name isn't John Irving, then I have a problem with that.

ebtnut, I foresee a big run on parachute and cargo pants for airline passengers.

I could jam a lot of stuff into 8 or 10 pockets.

bc

Achenblog is on the home page. Above the fold, even.

Hey, A-fan, you *are* going to buy one of those great traditional Balinese ladies' hats while you're there, aren't you?

bc

Ruh-roh, we're in for it now!

KJ, you are right, of course. But that doesn't make it easier, I'm sure. I wish I knew the solution to your problem.

Last time I flew was October 2001. I figured that was probably the safest since that date with no name.

Mudge: I guess POTUS is the pentultimate multitasker if he's on top of vacation and everything else so worldly. Riding circles about the joggers on the 100 degree workout circuit, indeeed.

KJ, go blonde with white streaks! Get body piercings, or a tattoo of the American flag (or whatever).

Say "Dude" a lot and say "Whooe, I wonder if you could build a Nascar that would go as fast as a plane, would it take off, you think?"

But I have the sense this does not fit your personality at all whatsover.

annie,

Thanks for the memory fill-in on Friedman. The original article has obviously disappeared behind the TimesSelect golden rope. The best I could find was this transcription.

http://www.interesting-people.org/archives/interesting-people/200112/msg00320.html

The idea is not unique to Friedman. I do not recommend Googlingâ„¢ "fly naked" at work. And especially don't click on any links promising pictures.

Wilbrod, I think the toothpaste-foam-dripping-from-mouth while boodling makes a nice touch; it adds character!

Wilbrod - good idea! Though I'd also have to dye my eyebrows, lest I wish to join a circus.

Or I could inquire about those Groucho disguises...hmmm gears are turning! We're on the right track!

Mudge, for the typhoon track, go to http://tsr.mssl.ucl.ac.uk/. Click on the strom track arrow and a table will come up with the typhoon names. Click on a storm name and a detailed track will appear with major city names. Looks like HK will not affected by the big one. The smaller is headed directly at HK.

I'm thinking about the potential dangers of various personal care products, and one that's really making me a little queasy is hydrogen peroxide, particularly if it's been concentrated above that of what's on the shelves.

IIRC, mixing it with a lot of common stuff even at room temps can cause all kinds of nasty chemical reactions, including exothermal.

bc

KJ, You can have red hair or dark reddish brown hair with blackish eyebrows.

Don't go too ordinary though, I've seen many Asians color their hair in some interesting ways, including somebody who apparently got blonde tips on his black hair.

Just don't go crazy with makeup. a lot of people are deathly afraid of clowns, with white-faced mimes a close second.

I'm with KJ on the evils of profiling. As I related earlier, the IRA has disrupted air travel for a lot of redheads with "Mc" or "O'" in their surnames. If you don't believe me, just ask Teddy:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A17073-2004Aug19.html

I do feel really bad for anyone remotely swarthy that has a name that can't be pronounced by the airport screener.

Do what the British are doing and find the bad guys before they get to the airport.

I wonder if Bush press secretary Tony Snow will keep U.S. citizens apprised of how many foreign leaders President Bush has spoken to while on holiday in Crawford?:

Telephone diplomacy is no holiday
By Philip Webster

Tony Blair will still be engaged in negotiations over Lebanon from the Caribbean


TONY BLAIR left belatedly for his Caribbean holiday yesterday, voicing hope that the United Nations will approve a resolution on Lebanon today but preparing to spend much of his time off on the telephone.

Mr Blair set off to join his family in Barbados saying that he was still very much in charge.

He had intended to leave last Friday but, unlike many other world leaders -- Angela Merkel, the German Chancellor, President Chirac of France and President Bush -- Mr Blair, decided to delay after facing Cabinet and backbench dissent over his handling of the Middle East.

Mr Blair will be able to continue his telephone diplomacy from Barbados and will be closely following events in the UN as it considers the resolution calling for a cessation of hostilities and another that will set out the mandate for the multinational force.

With his fellow leaders scattered across several timezones, Mr Blair will be making calls early in the morning or late at night. Barring new crises, however, his officials are unlikely to disturb him in the middle of the night. The Prime Minister, now five hours adrift of Downing Street, has an office and secretarial staff with him. Like his fellow leaders he has a secure communications centre from which to make calls.

His key staff are either at No 10 or on holiday but all are on standby. Mr Blair often speaks to Emyr Jones-Parry, the British Ambassador to the United Nations. In recent days he has had regular conversations with M Chirac, Frau Merkel, President Putin of Russia, José Luis Rodríguez Zapatero, the Spanish Prime Minister, Ehud Olmert, the Israeli Prime Minister, Romano Prodi, the Italian Prime Minister, and on Monday he spoke to Mahmoud Abbas, the President of the Palestinian Authority.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,3-2304644,00.html

I'm reminded for some reason of Jack Handey (paraphrasing):

You know, the President has been under so much stress lately that I think the ideal gift would be a chocolate gun. He's so busy though. I think the best way to give it to him might be to run up and hand it to him.

Joel -- very glad to have you and your family home safe and sound. Back living in the number one terrorist bulls eye city in the country! :-) Gee, if they keep the POTUS away . . .

Loomis -- thanks for telling me the secrets of link posting. I'm not a Luddite, like Freeh --but I have a very imperfect understanding of how to use all the fancy equipment in front of me.

I'm very glad this plot originated in Britain and not the U.S. -- not sure our team would have caught it.

I also wondered about making someone taste the liquid baby food, as was mentioned in one of the articles on the "foiled plot" (doesn't that phrase sound like something out of a Snidely Whiplash type melodrama?).

Do liquid explosives have taste? Would they cause a sour-mouth gesture? How good a test would this actually be?

I also want to go back to a thread in yesterday's boodle about a draft or some other way to share the burden of military service.

As I finished reading Fiasco, and watched Arbuste give one of his perfomances before the camera about liberty and freedom the world over, it ocurred to me that he wants to spread all this liberty and freedom not only at the point of a gun, but with the most undemocratic militay in the world.

I think it would be very good for this country to have mandatory service, like Israel and a number of European countries have.

True conscientious objectors could serve through Americorps or Peace Corps.

But if every single young woman and man had to serve a year or two in the military, I think the possibility of another war of choice happening would become zero.

I also think that to instill in all young Americans a taste of what it's like to be in the military would be beneficial in keeping the peace, and in times of absolute crisis, sharing the burden fairly.

Down heah, in the Tidewater, many, many cars car the little magnetic ribbons asking us to support the troops. (I also see ribbons with "One Nation Under God" a lot.)

I wonder what the occupants of many of these cars have done to actually support the troops? do they follow the events in Iraq? I don't know.

But I suspect that some of these ribbons are the result of knee-jerk patriotism. There are tons of them.

A return to a patriotism suffused with strategic, analytic thinking -- citizens who have served, who understand the risks inherent in war, citizens who have a viseral connection to the armed services, would keep a war-prone president in check.

Who knows -- people may even become more engaged in the political and civil life of a country if they feel a vested interest in because of service.

It's raining!! A light, soft rain, with temps in the high 70s. 70s. Unbelievable. This will be the first day in over two weeks it won't be over 90 degrees.

I abandoned the garden two weeks ago -- what survived survived. The other nite, it was finally cool enough to go out and inspect the carnage. Lost only a few plants. Many are stubbly looking, the mums don't have buds yet; but I was not about to stand out there in 100 degree heat even at 8pm to pamper my plants.

Besides, the whole garden is going to be given away this fall. It's funny how an impending, much anticipated move will reduce one's previous obsession with the garden to casual interest.

Anyone who has to fly, stay sane in security. dmd -- keep your ten year old in check!! :-)

Really Wilbrod? I thought Mimes were first. How about clowns that mime? I think there may be laws against that, though...

Yellojkt - I agree 100% Not to knock on our intelligence, but I wonder what the British are doing that enables them to actually capture these suspects BEFORE they get on a plane. Well, there was Richard Reid, but he was a loner.

KJ -- your Persian name could work as an asset for you, actually. Most folks in this country, and in the current administrtion for that matter, don't know that Iran is not an Arab country. That the language is Farsi, not Arabic.

They may not know that Iran is ancient Persian, as in the Pelopponesian Wars. If they know about the Pelopponesian Wars.

I think a "tips" highlight job on your hair, long, formless T-shirt with similar formless shorts, large, too-heavy-to-lift-the-foot sneakers, and you will have mastered the American slacker look. The idea being that you're too lazy, too South Parkian, to even construct a bomb, much less be bothered to detonate it.

Taking those shoes off for security may be a hassle though . . . :-)

yellojkt,
how many T. Kennedy in the English speaking world ? The actual T. Kennedy who was a threat probably traveled under P. O'connor or something. This is to show again that security measures are useless when applied in such a bureaucratic way. One guy in New Zealand refused access to a plane to one of the Windsor, I think the one that flew helicopters for the RN in the Falklands war (Andy or Ed, not Charlie for sure). He didn't have a photo ID or something. So there is the Prince with his full retinue being held up at the airport by some bureaucratically inflexible dope. Must have been a riot.

"They may not know that Iran is ancient Persian, as in the Pelopponesian Wars. If they know about the Pelopponesian Wars."

Not for nothing, but weren't the Pelopponesian wars fought between Athens and Sparta (neither of which were Persian)?

Thucydides cries somewhere....

Joel,

The experience you had at Charles de Gaulle airport recently mirrors one I had back in 1997 when flying from Heathrow to Dulles. The security person asked me all the same questions, with the same seriousness, and noted that they have found bombs in luggage before. I also had a similar experience in 1996 while changing planes in Frankfurt to Dulles. Even though I had flown from Hamburg and was changing planes in the same country, I still got the security grill and had to get a stamp on my ticket before I could even go get my boarding pass. Your experience just confirmed my feelings at that time that the Europeans have been taking airport security very seriously for a long time.

From Joel's June 5, 2005 article that yellojkt linked to: 'Eventually they got rid of the "smoking section" when they realized that an airplane is just one room.'

I've been thinking about just this fact all morning. The airplane cabin is just one room. Why is that?

Let's assume that no security screening process ever can be perfect. Persons of bad intent WILL get onto airplanes. As I discussed with our engineer, who is an inventive guy and also a martial artist, you cannot prevent a person from getting a weapon onto an airplane, you can only change the identity of the weapon. A metal ruler and a whetstone makes a knife. A wooden cane can be broken to make a shiv. A plastic knife will go right through every security process other than direct physical search. Block out all the weapons, and you can break off the seatback tray-table. Use a pencil as a stabbing weapon. Use your fingers, with some training. You CANNOT keep out persons who are enabled to kill.

So, what are the possible consequences of a bad person getting onto an airplane, and how do we counter them?

(1) Injure passengers directly. You cannot prevent this, only limit it with air marshalls. The Bad Day has shown us that this method can be used to pressure pilots to yield control of the plane.

(2) Fire a gun and break pressure-containment. This can kill the passengers and disable the aircraft, because the pilots are in the same pressure-vessel as the passengers.

(3) Detonate an explosive and break pressure-containment. This can kill the passengers and disable the aircraft, because the pilots are in the same pressure-vessel as the passengers.

(4) Detonate an explosive, rupture the fuel tanks, and destroy the aircraft. This can happen because passengers have access to the wing roots, where the fuel tanks are.

(5) Detonate an explosive and disable the aircraft directly. This requires a bigger bomb, but is not out of the question.

I propose we defeat the ability of Bad Persons to seize control of the aircraft by redesigning passenger aircraft. Expensive, yes, but consider the costs of maintaining a gigantic security-screening process that depends mainly on the stupidity and rarity of terrorists, especially since terrorists have become smart and numerous.

Rebuild the aircraft to contain multiple sealed pressure-compartments. Each compartment will have its own galley, toilets, and complement of flight-attendants (and air-marshall). The only possible access between compartments is outside the aircraft. Thus, it becomes much more difficult for one person to hijack the whole plane. The pilot compartment has space for a few extra-special Zero-Class (beyond First) passengers, such as fellow-pilots who can serve as backup, who go through an exceedingly rigorous security screening, pat-down, strip search, etc. A hijacker could influence the pilot to change course, by threatening passengers within his own compartment, but could not physically assume control of the aircraft because it is physically impossible to get into the cockpit. The space at the wing root is left empty (unlikely), or is made into an extra-special passenger area in order to have a big enough attraction to compensate people for an extra-rigorous security screening.

Personnel costs will go up, in order to man all those compartments. On the other hand, under-sold flights can leave a compartment completely empty, cutting the operating cost.

New possibilities arise. Compartments could become like freight containers and be swapped entirely, so that a plane can stay in operation while the passenger facilities are being maintained or upgraded. That makes it possible to imagine luxury compartments for rich travellers, similar to old-fashioned luxury train cars. You maintain a special compartment, but not a whole plane, and pay an exorbitant fee to have your compartment installed when you wish to travel in style. The essential airframe can be built with reinforcement against internal explosions so that it becomes that much harder to disable an aircraft by cutting the frame or electrical or hydraulic lines. The aircraft can be designed so that the pilot can break it up in air, if the airplane is disabled, allowing the compartments to parachute individually. They'll hit hard, but gentler than a full airplane crash. Or, maybe just be able to break up the plane after ditching, to improve flotation.

Raoul Duke -- sadly, Thucydides is crying at my mangling of history.

So sorry. My face is as red as the shirt I am wearing.

I was thinking of the great war between Greece and the Persians. didn't bother to get up and look at (yes, I own a copy of Thucydides' works). Just took a wild stab in the darkness of my own mind.

Thanks for the correction.

I'm gonna go stand out in the rain now and do penance. :-)

Ohhh, my goodness. That was really long.

The Peloponnesian War started out between Athens and Sparta as the principals, along with their various allies. Persia joined the fun, after Alcibiades defected to them from both Athens and Sparta, thinking that they had the opportunity to crush the upstart Greeks, both Ionic and Doric, who had embarrassed Persia so severely at Marathon and in the Persian War. Alcibiades kicked some a$$ in a big way, but eventually went back to Athens, crippling the Persian incursion (I like how that sounds). Eventually Athens got tired of him, again, the Spartan leadership still nursed hurt feelings over his various romantic infidelities, so he went back to Persia. The satrap of the province of Lydia welcomed him back, then threw him in prison and gave him enough wine to drink himself to death.

Assuming I remembered all that correctly -- pretty good for last reading Thucydides 24 years ago!

SciTim, we're back to Starship Troopers, with the individual capsules.

For my part, I've been trying for years for someone to pay attention to my idea for Very Large Catapults for travel.

One size doesn't fit all for airport security...what works at DeGaulle, or Heathrow, or Da Vinci, etc. (or even Gatwick and Orly), won't work here b/c we don't have a national, fully subsidized airline industry (even w/ TSA and Chapt. 11 bailouts) and there are significantly more international flights from ATL, LAX, JFK, IAD, BOS, ORD, DFW, MIA, etc. and all the airports that feed into them. I think British intelligence and other anti-terrorism task forces did a great job, but the follow up is critical.

Also -- Europe has been dealing with the culture of terrorism (in its modern iteration) for a long time. Airport attacks in Rome and Vienna were 20 years ago already. European airport/airline officials have been asking those screening questions and have had a strong police/ military airport presence ever since. And be mindful that Euros don't hesitate to use force to quell a situation. We've got to adjust and adapt here at home.

Raoul Duke -- sadly, Thucydides is crying at my mangling of history.

So sorry. My face is as red as the shirt I am wearing.

I was thinking of the great war between Greece and the Persians. didn't bother to get up and look at (yes, I own a copy of Thucydides' works). Just took a wild stab in the darkness of my own mind.

Thanks for the correction.

I'm gonna go stand out in the rain now and do penance. :-)

I like that idea. I've always thought airplanes should be required to have a small first-aid station with flip-down bed for emergencies. Putting that in a separate compartment would be a great idea.

Just additionally, that would also provide space for extra-large service dogs to park under... or for wheelchairs and other medical equipment that many airlines try and press people to put in cargo instead ;). Many service dogs alert to medical emergencies, so that's not a bad idea. I'd also suggest sniffer dogs fly in that area as well.

Any grand terrorist plots could easily be foiled by a well trained newf way too close to the cockpit, and that is a breed that slobbers rather than bites. But who the heck is going to take that risk when there's a big hairy monster in front of you?

(Heck, my dog can alert me to specific scents on command, now if I just had an anti-terrorism scent kit for him... ;). )

Good catch, Raoul; I was a few steps right behind you. The wars between the Greeks and the Persians was called (at least in Western textbooks) the, ah, er...Persian Wars. Don't know what you called it in your Persian textbooks, KJ; "the Greek War," maybe. Thermopylae, the 300 Spartans led by Richard Egan, Xerxes and Darius, Marathon, Salamis, all that crowd.

C'mon, people, this starting to get a little too PC for my taste. I don't object to profiling when it's done with some common sense. If you're looking for Islamic terrorists, it seems to me you look for people who possibly look Islamic (yeah, yeah, I know...but we can safely say that very damn few Islamic terrorists look like, say Grandma Moses, Toshiro Mifune, Pedro Valenzuela, or Paddy O'Reilly) or even have Islamic names. Sorry for your hassles, KJ, but I get the impression you are saying that because you are Persian rather than Arabic or Islamic that somehow this should be transparently obvious, especially to security screeners who are probably operating today at a level of nervousness that would make a three-toed sloth jumpy. And if you are in Ireland or GB and are looking for an IRA bomber, I don't think it's unreasonable to profile Irish-looking people (whatever that is; we really DO know, though, what it isn't: Asian, African, Hispanic, Eskimo, etc.). Sometimes I think you anti-profile people would chastise Dr. Richard Kimball for persecuting the handicapped just because he was looking for a one-armed man. Yes, there are times when it ISN'T appropriate for profiling, such amake all sorts of assumptions about black people, and so forth. Yes, there are abuses, but there also has to be an injection of common sense.

Regarding liquid explosives, I'm no chemist or munitions experts by any means (nor have I ever watched McGiver, oddly enough), but I know there are whole categories of liquid explosives such as the "binaries" (see "Die Hard II" among several Hollywoodized versions), and other weird/interesting stuff. And there's common, ordinary stuff you can buy off the shelf in any hardware store that can make a firebomb or explosion nasty enough to take out an airplane. You don't even need a timer or battery or spark, either; the stuff will self-ignite. Cost: maybe ten or fifteen bucks. (Whether the stuff I'm thinking of will set off airport detectors I don't know; I don't do that kind of work.)

Heheheh, SD, wouldn't you love to see the after-action report and performance appraisal on the bureaucratic bumbler who stopped a Windsor? Wonder if the officer kept his job?

Curmudgeon, actually Islam is a religion that has world-wide reach.

There are indeed "Asian" looking muslims in Indonesia and very american-indian looking ones in Central Asia.

I knew a muslim from Bangladesh that practically looked vietnamese except for a slight waviness to his hair that indicated an infusion of more Middle eastern blood. He was actually living in Dubai, and he told me he thought America had no culture. And what he wrote about Mohammed and showed to me... hm. This was pre 9/11.

The largest Islamic country in the world is India-- and the muslims are far outnumbered by the Hindus. and let's not forget the large numbers of Muslims in Africa, and the native black Muslims here (who are somewhat unlikely to participate in Al Qaeda), as well as young converts to Islam who might be zealous and easily swayed into fundamentalist terrorism because they don't know what Islam really is.

And those converts can look like Paddy O'Reilly.

Yes, most of Al-Qaeda seems to draw its recruits from Pakistan, Afganistan, Saudi Arabia and the Middle East, likely because of the high anti-US sentiment over there due to Israel and the corrupt ruling regimes funded by international oil money. And I met many Muslims from Sarevejo. They look Eastern European to me.

Additionally, Every year muslims from all over make a hadji to Mecca in Saudi Arabia.

Bottom line: yes, check out anybody who sounds and acts foreign, is acting suspicious. Work outside the profile at times.

Dana Priest, in her online chat, is mentioning arrests also taking place in Pakistan. No details.

This fellow perhaps?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/4779009.stm

SCC: Grammar, capitalization, and flow. It makes sense to focus on a profile, but also sample outside the profile.

After all, terrorists do have families, relatives, friends, etc.

For instance, what's to stop anybody from giving friend a bunny to give to the adorable daughter of a visiting american friend?
And if that bunny has a bomb activable by atmosphere pressure change and nearly undetectable by scanners? Hell, I want that kid to be stopped and questionned if the luggage x-rays of the stuffed bunny looks at all odd. Bugger profiling.

Slyness,
I don't know about the emplyment status of the guy but there were quite a number of huffing and puffing opinion pieces about the "colonials" in the UK papers.
Wilbrod,
I thought Indonesia was the most numerous Islamic country. People of all shape, size and color out there. And they do have their own branch of the ol' al Quada.

With respect to profiling, what Mudge said.

Before they gave it the fancy schmancy name of profiling it would have just plain old statistical analysis. Everyone does this. Ever give your phone number at a store as you purchase items? They are using it to figure out where their customer base is from, or so they say. Ever fill in a census form? Same same. We disscussed demographics yesterday. Same thing.

Web search:

Up to as many as 50 may be involved...

British born or naturalized, albeit with ties to Pakistan

I think some profiling is inevitable, but I would hope there is more of an effort to nail down who we are looking for, with possible names, descriptions etc. Other than that who is to say some wacko, outside of who we are profiling won't make an attempt figuring all the attention is on Arab/Muslim passengers.

Screen everyone, do intelligence.

Nelson, I will try to control the ten year old. To make you feel better the 5 year old volunteered to have them wave the wand over her, actually she insisted. They also checked out their carry on bag full of toys, apparently a magnetic doll set looked suspicious in the xray machine.

seems pretty quiet in here.

ScienceTim, I guarantee that if the passenger scrunched up next to me ever pulls out a metal ruler and a whetstone, I'll let the flight attendant know. Likewise if he starts disassembling his i-pod. A pencil as a stabbing weapon would not be particularly effective against several hundred--or even several dozen--or half-a-dozen--angry passengers. An actual knife might do-in a small group, but not a whole plane.

The 911 hijackers were able to subdue whole planes with a few box cutters because for 40 years we had been told to cooperate with hijackers to minimize the possibility of injury. But that plan was based on the assumption that hijackers just wanted a free flight to Cuba, or attention to their cause and some sort of concession. Now that Al Quaeda's upped the ante, nobody's going to make those assumptions any more.

What would make more sense than banning shampoo and toothpaste is to lock down the overhead bins before takeoff to limit the possibilities for assembling devices in flight. And *maybe* limit what can be kept under the seat, if experts come up with realistic scenarios that could be executed unnoticed by the surrounding passengers and vigilant flight attendants.

If it seems too quiet, just go back and read a couple lines of the book I posted earlier. 15 or 20 trips like that, and you'll be through it!

Nelson - well I do have long hair, so that also may make me look more, um, lazy. :) Plus, I'm only 25, so I still have time to pull off the slacker look fairly well.

Curmudgeon - I see your point on the PC bit. That's the other side of the spectrum that I don't want to venture towards.

Actually you were right on as to my point; I'm supportive of profiling if they are looking for something specific. And I don't think that they should profile 95 year-olds just to make the situation fair. I think that's just a waste of resources.

(Actually, there have been cases a few years back of elderly people caught hiding copious amounts of drugs in their canes and walkers. They were runners from S. America.)

And I would definitely volunteer extra scrutiny if the people around me felt better by it.

I don't expect the average person to know the difference between Iran, a Persian country, and say... Jordan, UAE, or Saudi Arabia. In fact, I still get people asking me where Iran is and that they've never heard of it. Imagine the consternation of trying to explain that Iranians are Aryan and not Arab.

I think my fears are just paranoia. I've flown three times in the last three years and I was never given any more extra scrutiny than the average person.

It just gets a little depressing from time to time - all the heightened alerts and such. It's also reality.

Excuse me for being skeptical of the British and Bush-colored U.S. Government, but has any blogger or enterprising mainstream reporter ever bothered to compare the number of "Terrorist Alerts" with U.S. election cycles?

Dollars to donuts, there are more "terrorist alerts" in even numbered years than odd.

Someone please answer that question. I'll check back.

P.S. I am so sick of Bush sticking us with his "terror" and "fear" taser. Can't he and his corporate-facist ilk find any other way to lead the masses of we American shivering rabbits?

Interesting stuff, *Tim. Great out of the box thinking.

Comments:
I tend to think of an aircraft fusilage as a big aluminum beer can designed to take the loads of payload and powered flight.

It's designed to be as light (to maximize payload and income) and as simple as possible (easy/inexpensive to maintain and to shorten turnaround times).

I'm 100% with you that the pilot's compartment(s) should be segmented away from the passenger compartments, galley, head, etc.

The evolved pressure-segmented and containterized bird you're describing sounds great from a passenger perspective, but the aircraft you're proposing sounds like it will have weight penalties and complexity compared to current models and certianly a shorter operatonal range. And a large up-front capital costs of purchase as compared to a current Airbus, for example. Hmm. I wonder how the operational expenses would stack up compared to conventional, too.

On a side note, I watched an episode of "Mythbusters" where they tested pressurized commercial aircraft fusilages (to aprroximate the pressure differential at 30,000 ft or so) to see how big a hole would have to be made before explosive decompression occurred. They couldn't make a big enough hole with a gun, even when they shot windows, trying to get them to blow out. Airplanes are pretty tough beer cans, when you get right down to it.

bc

By quiet I meant we're on the home page, but I guess 'Achenblog' doesn't attract the loonies the way an actual title would.

Where's my tinfoil???

:-)

bc, I saw that episode too. That was a pleasant surprise. The "Jaws" episode was interesting as well.

It happened again!!! omni's 1:33 was NOT there the first time I refreshed after my post!!! :-O

*assembling more tinfoil*

:-)

GJ, I think the things you mentioned will be the end result of this.

At the same time, you can find salt or baking soda in every nation in the world. If they loose your plane luggage, brush your teeth with it. Really when you get down to it, what they are asking of us is to live with a very small inconvenience of POSSIBLY having this kind of personal item lost if they loose the rest of your check in luggage. Even the extra security is really just and inconvenience.

Are we really so spolied that we can't live without just for a tiny bit?

SCC: please excuse the fuzzy thinking, lousy english, and just plain crappy spelling.

Again, I'm Boodling while on the phone.

bc

bc
I think the modular plane would be inefficient too, too heavy and costly. I could see a passenger containment system though, something like the harness used in modern standing up rides. They would clip the passengers there for the flight, passengers would have to raise their hands to go have a tinkle. With such a good containment system the airport could be much smaller and much closer to downtown as the aircrafts could use a steam catapult for take-off and tailhook and arresting wires for landing...

GJ, I agree that small hand-to-hand weapons are not useful against the resistance of many passengers, but it only works if the multitude really are willing to attack him. You will notice that the TSA still does not let us bring knives on board the airplane, even though they are useless for hijacking outside of interpersonal combat. If the terrorist were holding you or your child or your wife or the flight attendant, or any poor shlub, with a knife to the throat, are you really so tough that you could accept the hostage's death as the cost of disarming/killing the assailant? As to sharpening the ruler -- think of the bathroom.

The idea of the compartmentalized aircraft is to make it actually impossible for the terrorist to gain access to the cockpit, regardless of the psychology of the crew and passengers. Even if the hijackers have cutting torches, there could be planned depressurized gaps between the pressurized compartments, making it extra-difficult to get between sections -- providing enough time to make an emergency landing.

Well, here we have heard of it, although we won't take a poll on how many people could find it on a map.

Iran is due west of Pakistan and Afghanistan, (and SW of Turkenestian). Go a bit further east and south, and you're in India. This forms a nice corridor to Asia Minor.

Go north of Iran, you got The Caspian Sea (Russia on the other side of that sea). To the farthest northwest, it is practically in Europe, as it borders Turkey and Azerbaijan

Iran is at the "pinch point" where the arabian Peninsula joins Asia, with the Caspian sea to the north, the Persian gulf to the South.

It's more East than the middle East. Asia minor merging into SE Asia.

The greeks just had to sail north and along the coast and pass the straits entering the Black Sea (think Constantiople, now Istabul, Turkey), hog the southern coast, and make an landing in armenia/Soviet Georgia for a march into what would be modern-day Iran.

Xerxes' empire likely extended much further than the current boundaries of Iran-- swallowing much Turkey for one.

But it's easy to see why Alex the Great, having conquerered Darius, decided to go on further East and conquer spots in the high mountain passes of Pakistan, Afghanistan, before dying young, just before he could really invade the lush plains of the Punjab (India).

And anybody who knows the history of India/Pakistan/Iran knows there have been a lot of armies galloping back and forth in this area.

It's not surprising Iranians look European, lighter skinned than north Pakistanis and Indians, and much less Asian than Afghanistanis.

By the way, not to get too mushy on you all, but I've been following this blog from time to time, for quite a while now. To the point where I recognize a lot of the monikers. This group is probably the most intelligent and mature group of thinkers I've seen in a long time.

None of that virol hatred you see elsewhere; just a good group of people expressing thoughts, memories, and stories.

I've been getting that time warp thing too. And yes someone (Loomis) did mention CERN earlier in this boodle. But I suspect the real reason is that somewhere in the world someone is wathcing "The Rocky Horror Picture Show"...

Tim, regarding your 12:08: What, no porch?

Wilbrod, regarding: "actually Islam is a religion that has world-wide reach.

There are indeed "Asian" looking muslims in Indonesia and very american-indian looking ones in Central Asia."

This is exactly the kind of PC thinking I was railing against. Have there been any Asian-looking hijackers to date? No. Have their been any Navaho-looking al Qaeda hijackers? Not so far. No Apaches. No Mongol-looking Central Asian ones. No potentially Islamic Scotsmen with kilts and bombs in their sporanges. No India-type Indian/Hindu-looking ones so far. Yes, someday al Qaeda may recruit one, but until then I think it's pretty safe to confine the profiling to the couple hundred million people who DO look possible Islamic-type persons.

If and when al Qaeda gets a better HR department with a better diversity recruiter, I think a little common sense would go a long way toward improving our security arrangements a bit. The whole point of the problem is you can't predict or look for the anomaly; that's why they call it an anomaly. If you start looking for anomalies, then that's when you start frisking infants and 90-year-old grandmothers.

bc, I always wondered about the toughness of aircraft vs. bullet damage. It saw a fair amount of use as a plot-device in the 60's and 70's, IIRC.

I agree that there is a legitimate concern as to the weight costs of building separate passenger compartments. On the other hand, freight systems currently find this to be a very cost-effective way of transporting cargo. If the pressure-armor is built into the container, you can design the aircraft fuselage itself to be relatively tenuous. A rigid skeleton with a flimsy skin. The people-containers then slip into place. I haven't figured out how you build matching hatches in the people-container and in the aircraft fuselage. I guess the people-container has the pressure-door while the fuselage has a flimsy door just for aerodynamic purposes.

Hmmm, another option: it becomes even easier to design an effective outer skin if you do without windows! Position a few cameras outside the aircraft and replace the passenger "windows" with LCD monitors. You don't need to pull a shade, you just dim the monitor. Seat-back displays can provide a view from the airplane nose (after all, it would be very confusing to have the side windows looking forward). Maybe install some limited skylight windows on the aircraft, to match up with skylight ports on the modules, in order to have electricity-free lighting occasionally. The difference between skylights and windows is that you can place the skylights according to the needs of structural integrity, and they don't need to match up all that well for cosmetic purposes.

With this kind of design, cargo- and passenger-carrying versions of aircraft become nearly identical, so that the same airplane can serve for different purposes depending on the needs of the moment.

Welcome KJ

SciTim, I think you just invented a flying submarine. Or the Titanic.

I have expanded my rather minor kerfuffle with homeland security into a full blogpost. Loyal boodlers will recognize the sections that I have lifted straight from today's comments in direct defiance of WaPo Rule 6.

http://livebythefoma.blogspot.com/2006/08/terrorist-in-name-only.html

Not that I really need to plug my blog too much. My archive post about the post-doc hooker that had her day in court yesterday has all the pervs hitting me from Google and making my Sitemeter spin like the electric meter on a particle accelerator. Check it out, but you're on your own for explaining the history file entries to your spouse and/or boss.

http://livebythefoma.blogspot.com/2006/05/brandys-back.html

KJ, not to get too mushy back at you, but you *obviously* fit right in here, so don't hesitate to chime in with whatever crosses your mind!

Re profiling -- what Curmudgeon said. Big difference between "could possibly be" and "most likely is." Difference between life and death, in fact. A guy was killed with a crossbow in Manhattan a few years ago. That doesn't mean that the NYPD should be focusing its efforts on crossbow-related violence.

I am Irish in fact, with a face and a surname that make it impossible to mistake me for anything else. I attract heightened attention at Heathrow, even though I'm just a nice lady who teaches Sunday School and sings in the choir and takes in stray animals.

In fact, a few years ago, I was summoned aside by a Heathrow agent who asked me if I cared to explain what was the object at the end of my keychain. "Oh, that! That's just my miniature can of. Oh. RIght. Mace. But I can explain! I live on Capitol Hill, and some guy tried to mug me on Christmas Eve last year, and the guy at the hardware store sold me this, I just want to be safe."

"If you live on Capitol Hill, why are you travelling on an Irish passport, may I ask?"

"I am a dual citizen. It's just, as you can see, I am arriving from Athens, and the U.S. and Greece have had some unfortunate disagreements in the past, and the Irish passport just seemed like the better move all the way around. Odd that the Greek airport officials didn't confiscate the mace, come to think about it."

"Their standards are rather different from those of Her Majesty's security services. And what were you going in Greece?"

"Attending the wedding of my boyfriend's sister, and breaking up with him, as it turns out."

"Well, Her Majesty's government take a dim view of Irish nationals waltzing through British airports with dangerous weapons."

At which point, I burst into tears. Sorry for the cliche, but there really is no more accurate description of a woman commencing to cry. It rattled the bobby much more than the mace.

"What on earth is the matter with you?"

"It's just -- I'm tired, and I've been in airplanes for the past 12 hours, and it's over with my boyfriend, and now even THE QUEEN is mad at me."

He was very kind, gave me a handkerchief, took the mace and just made me sign a few forms promising to mend my ways. Wonder how that scene would play out now? Wonder if I'd be able to boodle from Her Majesty's pokey?

KJ, thanks for those kind words. Great to have you hear. One of the neat things about the boodle is that it is entirely self-assembled. It just sort of ... happened. It evolved like life in the proverbial small warm pond.

ah, welcome KJ.

everyone remember 'che'? Believe it or not, he's (assuming it's a he) posting his claptrap on the celebritology blog. of all places, sheesh. can you imagine any one so clueless?

Welcome, KJ! We have a lot of fun here. I've learned a lot from the folks with technical backgrounds, so it's informative too.

And if you're REALLY concerned about air safety: put the pilots and the passengers in actual separate aircraft! The pilots occupy a small aircaft with big engines and a tow-cable that extends back to a great big glider that holds the passengers. The passenger-aircraft would need pilots too, I guess, but they get no engines. Or, maybe they get teeny little wimpy engines that can prolong flight time but that are inadequate for take-off and that couldn't maintain a high cruising speed. Just enough for landing. Drop the tow when you get close to the destination and fly in separately.

Somehow, I have my doubts about such an arrangement working at several hundred miles per hour. But really, do we need to rush about so quickly?

The comment monster ate my post or someone is working my computer other than me. Just totally turn itself off. I hope they find the people that are involved in this latest terrorist act, all of them.

Welcome, KJ, we love company. Stick around.

Welcome KJ!

omni, I actually saw the che post you're writing about, and thought that it was oddly appropriate among the discussions of J-Lo's pants and who's breaking up with whom.

Tim, a one-word suggestion: decaf.

Tim, couldn't you just design us one of those flying cars the Jetsons had. :)

Sorry its a disturbing day, levity was required.

SciTim, dirigibles carrying airstream trailer-like pods.

Dirigibles. That's the answer. No bad historical air disaster connotations there. Popular Science and other glassy-eyed techno-pr0n magazines have been predicting the imminent return of zeppelins since I was in grade school. Good luck with that.

Tim, if it helps I was just informed that there is 3 billion waiting for me in Nigeria all I have to do is send my bank account number.

I LOVE dirigibles! Except for those air-disaster problems. Helium works, but it takes a lot of it, and it tends to leak through the walls of the containment vessels.

Nope, I think low-speed glider-trains are the wave of the future. That's where I'll be investing my money.

We've been compared to a puddle. By the Boss.

Hey, you guys remember Steven Weber from "Wings," the comedy about the two small-time airline pilots on Natucket? Well, he's over on the chat side doing a chat about today's bomb and airport security stuff!

(OK, just kidding--it's a different Steven Weber. But many of the questions seem to have been sent in by Lowell [Thomas Haden Church], 'cause there's some really dumb ones.)

Not to a puddle, dr, but to bacteria or archaea, possibly eukaryotes, to split hairs (or branching orders).

Airlines stocks sliding on today's news and Tim's ideas, gas prices also dropping because the conventional wisdon is that air traffic will drop in the immediate near term.

K'guy also commented on the Celebritology blog. I wish he would come home to us.

My wife and I had an interesting airport security experience six years ago. I had taken a five day business trip from San Francisco-Mexico City-Panama City-Bogota, Columbia, San Palo, Brazil and then met wife in Rio De Janario for a few days R&R with the company paying for my half of the travel. Then we went back to San Palo for two more days of business. The flight from Rio to San Palo was like getting on a bus. All they wanted to see was a ticket. We were returning from SP to Miami on one of the new United 777s. Upon arrival at the terminal four little pedestals were aligned up in front of the ticket counter each staffed with a United attendant. Our guy politely asked us the usual questions, had we packed our own bags, had they been out of our control. Of course we answered yes. We were traveling light with only one rolling carryon each. Then he asked how we got to the terminal which is quite a ways from the city. We told him we had taken a taxi from the hotel. Then he asked if the taxi driver had handled our bags. Well we told him he had picked them up and handed them to us after we had got in the back seat. That seemed to be ok and he allowed us go to the counter and check in. Then we went on down to our departure gate which was really austere because they were remodeling so there were a lot of temporary plywood panel walls. There we were told the departure would be delayed a half hour which turned into about two hours (which was not too bad compared to what I had been experiencing the week before). When we prepared to board, here were all the same security attendants that had questioned us at check in lined up in the flight way where they run us through the same questioning routine. We were flying business class and had selected the emergency exit row seats. On this configuration there are two rows of two seats facing each other. We had the forward facing seats catercornered across the aisle from a set of amidships set of restrooms. While we were waiting a man came down the aisle, open the restroom door, looked in and put something in the in the waste basket and abruptly left without closing the door. That was a little disconcerting especially when a little later the pilot came on the intercom and said we might have noticed we haven't yet began to back off the ramp. Then the kicker, "I'm sorry to say there has been a bomb reported to be on the plane and we will all have to deplane and leave our carry on luggage behind while the plane is searched". On the way out the same security attendants were in the flight way and I told our guy what we had seen and he said they would check it out. A while later we were told to re-board and the security attendants were all lined up again in the flight way again assuring everyone everything was ok and our guy told us they had checked the restroom and there was nothing unusual. While we were taxing out a flight attendant took the seat facing us and I asked her how often this happens and she said "About once a week". By this time we were beginning to worry about making our connecting flight from Miami to San Francisco. The pilot came on the intercom and said they were going to try to make up time and would try to get many of the connecting flights held up for our arrival. When we got to Miami there were a flock of attendants calling out destinations. We went to one calling out SF and she said follow me and it was off on the run down to our gate and directly on the plane. No check in, no boarding pass and told take any seat. So we took a couple of first class and went to sleep after one glass of champagne before we had even taken off.

bc,

On the Wilson Bridge... I don't see the critical response. Yes, we should be more concerned about this crazy crazy idea. Whom ever pushes the button can ONLY be aiding the enemy.

OR,

How about if we had let it be known that Bush/Cheney/The cabinet/Congress/and 75% of all American Industrialists will be standing on the old Wilson Bridge span on August 14 between the hours of 8 am and 12 noon ...

Maybe we could get a free demo. I say "Harness Terrorism not horses"

annie, I feel like such scum, but your story made me laugh.

Its a good reminder that you have to look at modern travel with some humour or else you are going to end up on one of those bad traveler shows.

Yep, we are officially pond scum.

Hmm, I hate to pick an argument, but you said "No India-type Indian/Hindu-looking ones so far."

Mudge, for your memory refreshment-- 9/11 hijacker photos. You may disagree with me, but 4 clearly look like possible Pakistani/North Indian to me. And at least one, with hats etc. could pass for black.

http://www.september11news.com/AAAHijakers22Photo.jpg

In addition, one of my weird hobbies is guessing ethnic background of people, especially foreigners. It's the geneticist in me, and I like to guess countries of origin, especially from names-- I like linguistics and it's not hard to put the two together.

So what I was saying just now is NOT PC-- but my own experience. I've only met one muslim from Saudi Arabia, most I meet are from other countries, including this one. I know most of the hijackers are from Saudi Arabia.

Still, I want the screeners to use their eyes, not their prejudices. Note what Al Qaeda has been doing in how many countries. You think they don't have operatives in those countries or who at least can merge into the background there?
http://www.terrorismfiles.org/organisations/al_qaida.html

Also goggle Ayman al-Zawahri (number 2) who is Egyptian-born and see what ethnicity you could put on him. Heck, with western clothes and a haircut he could pass for Jewish. Just saying.

As a profiler myself, I would pay most attention to ANYBODY whose name and appearance did not quite match, especially when they don't match the country they are supposed to be from. That and any inconsistencies in dress, behavior, etc.

It's just simple sense, most of those hijackers will be travelling on stolen or forged passports and under aliases, and they may well be trying to disguise their ethnic appearance also.

Thanks, Annie! Good story! We just have to accept the fact we may come under suspicion sometimes due to stuff we will never be told about. I remember a particularly careful search at a rural aiport and then my flight was detoured to another city. I always had the feeling maybe they had gotten a security tip or something. My dog got wanded really thoroughly, too, and developed a crush on the TSA agent as a result.

At least I was NOT carrying mace. ;).

Good point, Linda, but I just didn't want to think we were being consigned to such a low order genus. I have proven that I am one, I laughed at annie's story.

But it was a really great story.

Yes, annie, great story, and thanks for sharing. Hope your love life has improved since then.

annie,

Your story is hilarious. I'm surprised you got all the way to Heathrow with the mace. My aunt who does a lot of business travelling thinks that based on her frequency of being pulled out of line that Homeland Security has a rock solid tip that the next bomber will be a middle-aged red-headed LPN.

For you ethnic profilers, try to distinguish among the different types of Asians:

http://www.alllooksame.com/

I only got 7 out of 18 and I thought I would do better.

"putting her toe ever so carefully into the pond, evaluating the temperature, wondering if her recent classical history gaffe (one among many) would cause the pond scum to evict her. Toe in, she cautiously slides in her feet. Perhaps better to wade a bit instead of diving in."

"She lurks silently in the shallows of the pond, watching the more intelligent, better read species swim by, leaving erudite, witty posts in their wake."

"Yes, best just to lurk. She remembers what her high school gemoetry teacher said to her about it being better to stay quiet and let everyone think she's a fool than to open her mouth and remove all doubt. Then the math anxiety attack, quiescent for so many years, commences, leaving her barely able to use her keyboard."

"Never mind the public humiliation of not even knowing how to post a link. Hopeless, knowing she is less evolved than the other pond scum, she slips into the pond and slinks into the warm muddy ooze of the bottom."

SCC: geometry

ah, see, I thought gemoetry was like haiku, but instead of seasonal allusions, its all about gemstones. oh well...

nelson, all the best stuff comes from warm muddy ooze.

I notice a lot of praise for the way the Brits handled this but one still has to be cautious.

A couple of month ago there was this incident where their police raided a house that was used as a chemical labratory. The terrorist cell living there was about to launch an attack somewhere in the UK. One of the inhabitants was shot when he raised a gun towards one of the policemen.
It later turned out that there was no chemical labratory, that the guy who was shot didn't have a gun and that the "intelligence" wasn't as deffinitive as was first made out.

Eurotrash is back!

ET came home.

See, this is where religion comes in handy. When I read Joel's comment, I took it to mean that the boodle is miraculous. (Of course, so is pond scum.)

And in contemplating the mystery, here's the scripture that occurred to me:

"In the beginning was the Word." --John 1:1

Seems appropriate to Achenblog, as well as Everything Else

And there was the Brasilian electrician of course, shot in the head a few days or weeks after 7/7.
The "war on terror" is doing for the anti-terrorist police forces what the "war on drugs" has done for the Narcotics police forces.
Have we won the "war on drugs yet by the way ? That one has been going on since the Reagan administration, we should have made some progress...

My new phrase, that I'm trying to work into as many contexts as possible, since seeing it on a random website last week:

"The Bush Administration's War on Peace"

Actually, it's a lovely pond, located in a private garden on a secluded street in Washington. The owner has taken much care with it, so there's not a great deal of ooze. What little mud there is feels great between the toes. One notices the wonderful work of the pondkeeper first. Most days, the pond creatures frolic happily, interacting with banter and, occasionally, serious discussions on important topics.

Mudge, take it from here!

kbert, you always find the right things to say.

Welcome, KJ.

Glad you came home, ET.

I was impressed that there wasn't a response to the HAIFA post yesterday. The boodle remained above the fray. Ya see, KJ, this is where it's at.

Shrieking, I must say that I am for our cops (be they US, UK, French or Belgian etc.) to be vigilant and ruthless when they need to be. It's just that I thought that some boodlers made the UK cops seem to make few if any mistakes, which of course they do.

Hey there, dr, no worries, you were *meant* to laugh. Even at the time, distraught as I was, I had to appreciate the humor of the whole thing, too. Plus the guy was really just so kind and decent. It even turned out that he had a daughter about my age who also lived in Washington, and that he worried about her safety, and though he had to confiscate MY mace, he was going to call the daughter and tell her to go buy some for herself.

Even more interesting to me than the fact that I made it to Heaththrow with the mace is the fact that I made it *out of* the States with it. My outbound flight left from Dulles! This was the summer of 2000, right before the Day That Needs Another Name. It staggers the mind to remember how relaxed everything used to be. I know I should be cringing at our idiotic cluelessness, but the truth is, I miss those days.

Slyness, thanks for kind wishes re love life. The truth is, it has had its ups and downs in the six years since then. Will elaborate if anyone is interested, there are -- believe me -- some stories there that make the hilarity of the Heathrow story pale by comparison.

And Nelson. Inserting a link into a post is easy. I know this because even I can do it. And I still have a rotary phone. Truly. You know that standard recording "if you're calling from a rotary phone, please wait. An operator will answer your call in the order received." That's all for me. I am the last person in America with a rotary phone, and the day I give mine up, that recording gets erased.

Anyway. Open up the site you want. Put your cursor up on the URL. (the thing in the long skinny box at the top that starts http://andthenwwwandhasamillionforwardslashs)

RIGHT CLICK on that long string of gibberish.

Select "copy" from the pull down menu under "Edit".

Then go to your boodle box, put your cursor to the place in your post where you want to insert the link, and select "paste" from the pull down menu under "Edit."

Voila!

I have a better idea, *Tim.

Put all the passengers under general anesthetic, rack 'em, stack 'em, and fly 'em.

You could significantly increase the passenger capacity of airliners, reduce the in-flight requirements (no drinks, no silly bags of peanuts, no pillows, blankets, windows, movies, phones, radios, or seats), and since no one's awake for the ride other than an onboard medico, a highly reduced chance of terrorist incidents.

As far as the other stuff you're suggesting goes, typically commerical freight aircraft (Fed Ex, UPS, etc.) are converted airliners for the reasons you suggested. And there are modular cargo containers that are loaded and unloaded in warehouses, then installed in the freight aircraft, similar to cargo shipping and rail freight.

Aircraft *do* use a stressed-skin semi-monocoque construction (where the skin/hull of the aircraft is in fact structural), which is why the fusilages tend to be cylindrical. It's the best tradeoff of strength for weight. While there are structural bulkheads to add rigidity and to help distriubute load (i.e. from the wings), the whole structure does have a fair amount of flex and stretch built into it. The fusilage expands and contracts a fair amount as it goes from sea level to 30,000 feet and back down again with pressurization, heating and cooling.

bc

bc, your wonderful ideas never end! I like the thought of being unconscious during flight. No boredom, no jet lag!

SCC: "general anesthesia". Eh, you know what I meant: Knock us all out.

bc

War on drugs thought.
Couple of weeks ago in San Francisco I was discussing some aspects of my errant youth with a similarly well-seasoned colleague who also experimented with gas phase mood modifier in his youth. It turned out we were both very experienced Glaucoma medicine test subjects. A few liquid phase mood modifiers later we were considering lighting up a bazooka of a spliff at Haig-Ashbury for memories sake. We then considered the procurement logistics problems and the fact that the "war on drugs" functionaries probably installed a surveillance camera on that spot, the geezer cam. We declined.

Not all air freight planes are converted. Many are custom built. When I took the Boeing tour, the 747 they had on the assembly line was for freight service for Air Japan. The clue was no windows. No need to put them in if no one will ever look out them.

My little security story involves one of those small screwdrivers sets. Jewlers screwdrivers I think they are called.
I use them once in a while for work and keet them in my laptop bag.

When I have to fly I normaly check beforehand to see if I don't have anything dangerous with me.

One time I forgot and the xray guard noticed these screwdrivers, which could be used as a stabbing weapons, and I got asked to leave the line. Another security guard told me off and said she needed to talk to the supervising cop about me having contraband.
She came back, handed me the screwdrivers and told me that I was lucky that cop 1 was on duty because if it had been cop 2 I would have been cautioned and would not been able to catch my flight. I offered to leave the screwdrivers with her because I understood they could be dangerous, but she wouldn't have them and told me to take them with me.

What I learned was that depending on which cop is in charge you either get punished, or you can take the deadly weapons on board. (This was in Brussels airport.)

SD, I prefer the term "Glaucoma test pilots", and the motto borrowed from Alan Shepard: "Let's *light* this candle!"

Shepard also brought a golf club and some balls to the moon in '71 and played a crater or two. Very GTP behavior, IMO, particularly when he ate all of his and his co-pilot's space food and freeze dried ice cream when he got back on board the LEM.

bc

My plans are sounding better and better... Build the pressure modules out of carbon-composite instead of aluminum (for lightness), build-in some intentional weaker regions in the modules and the aircraft skin (to relieve stress in the case of an actual bomb explosion), and you have an aircraft in which hijacking and homicide are possible, but far more pointless.

Hey, this is a very exclusive pond, I'll have you know!! Name me any other pond with its own porch!

:-)

Slyness, did he say the boodle was like a puddle? Or a piddle? (I got a little spot of something on my monitor and can't quite make it out...)

Grrrrrrr. I've been editing some of the most idiotic stuff I've seen in several years today, so I'm in a testy mood. Can't talk about it on the boodle, since it's gummint stuff (VERY low grade)(lower than low)(downright subterranean). But I can tell you taxpayers this: you got some really stoopid peepul workin' for ya. (If this keeps up, I could find myself copy-editing Bush's speeches, and then I'd REALLY be sorry.)

Science Tim,

Wouldn't the weight of the plaines go up enormously?
Every compartement would need it's own airconditioning unit and backup etc.
And all the duplicate wiring that would need to be placed. That alone weighs tonnes.

Tim, instead of intentionally weaker sections in the carbon/kevlar (kevlar being a material used for bullet-proof vests, and can be applied into a composite mould with carbon fiber) using the pods, how about plain old (but big) blow-off valves?

To your point, they (I'm going to assume more than one, so that they couldn't be defeated easliy) could be situated in a manner that would have little disruption of the aircraft's airworthiness when they trigger.

bc

My wife and I had an interesting experience at Heathrow. late 1983 I had been offered a position in Scotland to manage an electronic assembly plant in Irving, Scotland near Glasgow and the company offered a trip for my wife to go with me to check out the area to see if the living conditions acceptable for three year assignment. We flew AA from San Francisco to Heathrow and then needed to take a BA shuttle to Glasgow. We had two suitcases. A large shuttle bus circled the airport picking up people from one terminal and dropping them off at their connecting terminals. The driver would put their bags in the boot at the rear of the bus and retrive them for exiting passengers. When we got to the terminal for the Glasgow shuttle our suitcases weren't in the boot. The driver said quick get back on and zoomed around the route and sure enough there were our suitcases sitting on the curb where he had mistakenly dopped them off. Except now there were some of Heathrow's finest standing across the street eyeing our bags. The drived jumped out retrived the bags and we were on our way. I was later told by an English engineer we were lucky to back there so soon because if we were a few minutes later all we would have found was some confetti. I used to go down to London to the company's headquarter once a month for a staff meeting and this same guy would pick me up at Heathrow in the morning and drop me off in the afternoon to return to Glasgow. If there was a unmaned car parked at the curb where he was to collect me or drop me off, he wouldn't stop and continue to circle the terminal until the parked car was gone.

SCC: please remove "using the".

bc

Eurotrash, were those teensy-weensy Phillips-head screwdrivers? Or teensy-weensy flat-blade screwdrivers? 'Cause I believe most al Qaeda operatives prefer to carry teensy-weensy Phillips-heads, because they don't slip as much when you're trying to unscrew teensy-weensy little screws. Also, they are closer to ice-pick size, and you can also use them to fix your glasses when that teensy-weensy screw falls out, which I understand a lot of crazed not-very-Islamic-looking hijackers from Northern India/Pakistan have a lot of trouble with.

Cur,

They were the teensy weensy flat heads.
But I would not want someone to stab me in the throath(?) with them.

Instead of all this reactive technology, we need a means to look into the hearts of men.

Of course, such a system will create a lot of biohazard waste at check-in and will require a large post-op area, but I think it's workable.

SoC, Men? I think its a big mistake to think going forward it will always be men involved.

Here at the Medford, OR airport recently security conficated a miniture 1 1/2 inch keyring crescent wrench a man carried to remove and stow his car's radio antenna while gone. Security claimed it was a tool the could be used to dismantle the aircraft in flight. The local newspaper made a big deal out of publishing a photo along side a ruler for scale.

So far, I think the Anesthesia Airways solution is both the most effective AND the simplest (and least expensive) to implement. My only concern is that bad guys might develop an anesthesia antidote they could self-administer before getting to the airport. Then they would play possum after getting their airline-administered sedative, and then when the plane reached cruising altitude and all of *us* were well and truly out of it, they would spring into action.

Gosh, Mudge, you've done some real speed reading since I made that comment.

Yeah, arrest anybody who wears bulky, not very stylish glasses and is not the right color. The eyeglasses probably store clear bomb liquid in rims and the frame can be broken up for bomb parts too.

Hmm, now I'm seeing your point on profiling, Mudge.

Mudge, does "ruler for scale" require an SCC?

dmd, women would never blow up an airplane; there'd be too much mess to vacuum up afterward. *running to dive into bunker before that inbound Katushya rocket fired from Loomis's San Antonion silo gets here*

dmd, you took my post as literal and the only thing strange was the use of the phrase "hearts of men"?!

On screwdrivers, it's a little known fact that during the Cold War small screwdrivers were standard issue for the Spetsnaz. Of course, they carried Robertson screwdrivers.

I think you're OK on the SCC, bh. I understood it.

I think the future of flight is dirigables.

They have many advantages:

1. They are cleaner then airplaines. Less polution.

2. Helium filled zeps don't make good missiles.

3. Realy big ones could carry a lot of people.

4. Science Tim's pod idea is easely done with them. So they would be secure.

4. You could use your cellphone or laptop onboard the whole time because well, even if the navigational equipement is messed up for a second or two it won't fall down.

The only disadvantage would be the speed. It would take a day or two to cross the Atlantic. But they just need to add a casino pod and the voyage can be done in style.

I just saw that someone already had had the zeppelin idea.

I bow my head in shame.

I think Zeppelin had the idea first, actually.

I think Zeppelin had the Zeppelin idea first, actually.

Actually David Schwarz was the first one to design a dirrigable. Zep, being the good venture capitalist that he was, bought the plans from his widow.

Hey KJ. Good to have you in the pond. And Eurotrash -- wow! Long time no hear from.

I remember the first time I got freaked out in an airport was during the 1970s (I was living in Sweden then) when I traveled to (then) West Germany. On my way down to Regensburg I had to change flights in Frankfurt. Now, remember, at that time the Baader-Meinhoff gang was at its peak. The first thing I noticed was an abundance of military types every few feet holding submachine guns. I recall feeling immensely fragile at that time (and I still had knees then). I've been in similar situations in different countries since then, and now I seem not to notice it with as much apprehension. Very strange how we get acclimated to these kinds of things. That, in and of itself, is a bit troublesome.

"Anesthesia Airways", ha!
I think I see how to address that problem, annie.

Everybody's going to need to be physically locked down in transit anyway to avoid injury. Strap 'em in a 5 point harness with a lock and cuff/lock the ankles and wrists. To those that play possum, I say "Enjoy your flight."

bc

Anesthesia Airways!
Where flying is as safe and easy as 1, 2, zzzz

Eurotrash: details, details. I'm a big-picture guy.

Yes, probably each module would have to have built-in life-support. On the other hand, the built-in unit could be the lightweight minimally-competent backup, while the aircraft could provide the primary system as a common service (with shut-off sensors for untoward chemicals). I'm more concerned about toilets. Either each module needs to store its own waste, or there has to be a common plumbing system. With a common system, you have a mechanism for collating liquid explosives into a part of the aircraft where it could do some real damage, so that will take some thinking.

Note that we don't need a terribly large number of modules -- these aren't like train compartments. Current aircraft already have separate "cabins" for different classes of service. Four separate modules would do the job -- 1 for pilots and super-First Class; 1 for First Class; 1 for Business class; and 1 big one for Coach. Coach lives are cheaper, so you can put more of them at risk, right? Alternatively, you can use multiple smaller compartments in order for them to be a standard size: 1 First Class module; 2 Business Class modules; 4 Coach modules. Any terrorist action affects only occupants of one of the 7 passenger modules, unless the terrorist manages to get into the pilot compartment, or manages to get a really big bomb on board. Then, you're screwed. However, it would be MUCH harder to cause trouble because super-First Class earns super-scrutiny, and that would take a lot of explosive if deployed in any one of the passenger compartments.

Even if terrorists act in all the passenger compartments, the plane stays in the air, because the compartments are not integral to the structure of the aircraft. Thus, survivors have some hope of rescue, and the plane does not fall down on inhabited regions.

Anesthesia Airways!
Where flying is as safe and easy as 1, 2, zzzz

An alternate solution for "Anesthesia Airways" would be to have an attendant make like one of those Whack-a-mole games...

From the BBC, a link about liquid expolsives.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/4780391.stm

Hi FirstTime,

Dumb question probably: Aren't there machine gun totin' guards at US airports?

I don't remember seeing any when I landed at Philly airport but then again, I wasn't paying attention.

It just occurred to me (probably while my blood sugar was low) that we could just handcuff everybody in place in the airplane, like they did in "Con Air" and in "U.S. Marshals." But then I realized, in both those cases the planes crashed anyway. Ah, well, back to the drawing board.

Ha, SoC, though I think the counting might actually be "100, 99, 98, zzzz".

bc

Science Tim,

I think I'm going to call Airbus tomorrow. Maybe they can adapt the A380. It can probably handle a lot of modules.
Since the plane is behind schedule anyway, a little redesign won't have have that much of an impact on the roll out time.

Mudge, that's why I'm avocating Anesthesia Airways' "Comfortably Numb" practices.

bc

Okay, gang, let's see how much capital we can raise to start Anesthesia Airways. This could be the idea that revolutionizes the transportation sector of the global economy! And we who are in at the beginning will make billions...

bc, you're making me all nostalgic for the '60s, when our generation produced some of the finest, most daring glaucoma test pilots the world has ever known.

I think they could divide the airplane into different cabins for different tastes: totally unconscious up front, then a cabin for total stoners, one for us nitrous oxide freaks (I LOVE going to the dentist; it's the only recreational use of drugs I've had in 30-some years), maybe a cabin for kids who can sniff glue and aerosol can propellants, perhaps an opium den for passengers who like it a bit on the exotic side, etc.

We have to act fast, as I'm sure Carnival Cruises is already planning on taking its system of gross intoxication for passenger control into the airline business.

WaPo radio just reported a flight from Montreal just made an emergency landing at BWI within the hour--no other details. OK, what are you Canuckistanis up to now???

Eurotrash, I've never seen machine-gun-totin' guards anywhere but military installations in the US.

That being said, the Baltimore Sun's homepage featured a pic of one at BWI today, so maybe they only pull them out for the extra-scary days.

WaPo reports total now up to 24 arrests in England, plus five suspects still at large, plus 2 or 3 arrests made in Pakistan.

Dentists and surgeons fly free on Anesthesia Airways. Get your root-canal , etc., done in-flight!

I won't fly Carnal Cruise lines' Way High Fun Planes (Anesthesia Airways' direct competitor) anymore.

Everytime I do it makes my rear end hurt.

bc

Just heard about that plane that made the emergency landing. It was an unclaimed package that caused the fuss. The plane has been cleared and is benign.

I had a nephew traveling today. they were up early enough to repack at home before they got to the airport. They just hope that the luggage arrives when they do.

I feel bad for all those folks trying to fly today, though inconvenience is better than getting hurt.

Glad to hear that the situation at BWI was one of caution rather than a real threat.

bc

Looney Loser Goes Off Deep End

By PATRICK HEALY and JENNIFER MEDINA
Published: August 10, 2006

Senator Joseph I. Lieberman seized on the terror arrests in Britain today to attack his Democratic rival, Ned Lamont, saying that Mr. Lamont's goals for ending the war in Iraq would constitute a "victory" for extremists, including those accused of plotting to blow up airliners traveling between Britain and the United States.

"If we just pick up like Ned Lamont wants us to do, get out by a date certain, it will be taken as a tremendous victory by the same people who wanted to blow up these planes in this plot hatched in England," Mr. Lieberman said at a campaign event at lunchtime in Waterbury, Conn. "It will strengthen them and they will strike again."

Pssst, Joe. Wake up. The race is over. The terrorists arrested today were British citizens of Pakistani descent. Not Saudi, not Iraqi. Pakistan, on the border of Afghanistan. You remember. Perhaps the Global War on Terror rings a bell? Remember Usama bin Laden? You know, the one terrorist we didn't really go after? Kinda fumbled the pursuit around Tora Bora?

Slyness, I am with you. I actually really, truly do think that Anesthesia Airlines could work. Sure, you come out from under not feeling so great, but that beats the he77 out of waking up dead. And I'm all about getting in on the ground floor of something hot and making billions. In fact, that was Plan A when I took the satellite radio company job, though perhaps that's a bad example.

Re. the advertising pitch: It could be "Easy as 1, 2, zzzz" or "100, 99, 98, zzz." But keep in mind too that test where they ask you who is the president of the United States. Realizing that you would have completely forgotten, when you ride Anesthesia Airlines, could be a big selling point for a lot of people right about now.

NYT reporting. Hal the Schemer ate my snarky comments to Joe:

Senator Joseph I. Lieberman seized on the terror arrests in Britain today to attack his Democratic rival, Ned Lamont, saying that Mr. Lamont's goals for ending the war in Iraq would constitute a "victory" for extremists, including those accused of plotting to blow up airliners traveling between Britain and the United States.

"If we just pick up like Ned Lamont wants us to do, get out by a date certain, it will be taken as a tremendous victory by the same people who wanted to blow up these planes in this plot hatched in England," Mr. Lieberman said at a campaign event at lunchtime in Waterbury, Conn. "It will strengthen them and they will strike again."

SCC: So sorry. Slow display time.

I don't know... you'd think those terrorists actually want pro-war politicans to be re-elected. Seems like they slack off when it's not election year.
Lieberman was tasteless, I thought, but maybe his core disagrees. Pakistan is not Irak.

bc,

You are missing a great marketing opportunity. We can exploit this situation for medical procedures other than dentistry:

Anesthesia Airlines. Colonoscopies for everyone!

annie,

Is the rotary phone you have the pink princess phone you mentioned a couple of boodles back? I kinda hope not.

Just a quick note to say that unfortunately my mom lost her battle with cancer late this afternoon. In the end she went very quickly and painlessly.

Thank you all for your kind words and support through her illness.

I'm sorry to hear of your loss, Dmd. I am glad she went painlessly, but know you will feel the pain of grief for a long time to come.

My thoughts and prayers will be with you and your family, dmd. May God's peace be with you all.

dmd, love and sympathy for the loss of your Mom, you and your family are in my thoughts and prayers

My sympathies to both you and jack, dmd. You have both suffered tough losses in the past few days and I will keep you and your families in my thoughts.

dmd;

My deepest condolences. I hope you can take some comfort in knowing it was painless for her. *hug*

Thank you everyone, I do indeed take comfort in the fact that it was painless and that she is at rest. The loss has not set in yet, probably will start tomorrow when I head to see my dad. Then again we come from an Irish heritage and times like these are always a mixture of tears, laughter and remembrance but most importantly of a celebration of life, we mourn the loss in our lives but never forget how much our lives were enriched in the time we had together.

I feel for my sister right now who has to fly across the country.

dmd and jack,

May your memories provide you with some comfort.

dmd, my condolences.

dmd,
Cancer deaths and the slow decline can be particularly challenging--we had that experience with my mother-in-law, as well as an aunt and uncle on my mother's side--all tobacco-related. You have shown remarkable strength. Our thoughts are with you in the days ahead.

dmd,

May the same Lord who receives your mother's soul and keeps it in light perpetual also comfort you and your family in your loss. Safe travels to your sister. I hold you in my thoughts and prayers.

Was my cynicism earlier today totally unfounded or spot on (see graf with asterisks)?

http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20060810/pl_afp/britainattacksairline_060810185330

Vice President Dick Cheney and White House spokesman Tony Snow had argued that Democrats wanted to raise what Snow called "a white flag in the war on terror," citing as evidence the defeat of a three-term Democratic senator who backed the Iraq war in his effort to win renomination.

But Bush aides on Thursday fought the notion that they had exploited their knowledge of the coming British raid to hit Democrats, saying the trigger had been the defeat of Democratic Senator Joseph Lieberman of Connecticut by an anti-war political novice.

"The comments were purely and simply a reaction" to Democratic voters who "removed a pro-defense Senator and sent the message that the party would not tolerate candidates with such views," said Snow.

The public relations offensive "was not done in anticipation. It was not said with the knowledge that this was coming," the spokesman said.

Snow said Bush first learned in detail about the plot on Friday, and received two detailed briefings on it on Saturday and Sunday, as well as had two conversations about it with British Prime Minister Tony Blair.

*************
But a senior White House official said that the British government had not launched its raid until well after Cheney held a highly unusual conference call with reporters to attack the Democrats as weak against terrorism.
*************

An aide to Lieberman, who would have been one of the first Democrats to hear of the plot because he is the top Democrat on the Senate Homeland Security Committee, said the lawmaker first heard of it late Wednesday.

On Wednesday, Cheney had suggested that Democrats believe "that somehow we can retreat behind our oceans and not be actively engaged in this conflict and be safe here at home, which clearly we know we won't, we can't, be," he said.

While some Democrats have opposed some steps in the war on terrorism, and more and more are calling for a withdrawal from Iraq, no major figures in the party have called for a wholesale retreat in the broader conflict.

But Bush's Republicans hoped the raid would yield political gains.

"I'd rather be talking about this than all of the other things that Congress hasn't done well," one Republican congressional aide told AFP on condition of anonymity because of possible reprisals.

"Weeks before September 11th, this is going to play big," said another White House official, who also spoke on condition of not being named, adding that some Democratic candidates won't "look as appealing" under the circumstances.

Fairchild Aircraft built a prototype of a modular aircraft in the 1950s. As I recall, it was a twin-engined aircraft, with a cockpit attached to wings and a boom-tail. Various modules could be attached underneath--there was one for passengers, one for cargo, I think one for military equipment. Only one module could be carried at a time in the original design. The module was wheeled under the plane, locked into place, and away they went. There was even talk of putting a module on wheels, having people check in for their flight at a downtown bus or train station, and then ride in the module to the airport where they would be latched onto the plane.

Sikorsky Aircraft put a similar module-based helicopter into production in the 1960s (the S-64; US Army CH-54). A few are still flying. Mil in the Soviet Union also built one (the Mi-10, IIRC).

Anesthesia Air was done in the movie "The Fifth Element"; the bad guys blew up the space ship anyway.

As much as I love airplanes, my vote--slow down schedules a little, and use trains on land and ships overseas. Isn't the SS United States stored somewhere? It could make New York to London in 4 days, which is almost as good as an airline with these security delays.

By the way...when do we get to see the bc/Mudge kits? The Achenworld awaits these masterpieces...

Dmd, I am thinking of you and remembering the death of my own mother. It just takes time to absorb the loss. My condolences.

dmd, so sorry to hear of your loss.

KJ, welcome. Eurotrash, welcome back! Where have you been?

When I heard about the airline carry on restrictions today, I thought it wouldn't affect me much. I put all that stuff in my checked bag anyhow, so I have more room for books. I use minimal makeup (none usually), no prob - but what about chapstick?!? Can I take chapstick with me??? And no water - makes me thirsty just thinking about it. I take a minimum of 2 bottles...I'm glad I'm not planning to fly anytime soon...

I'd bet that you can take an empty water bottle with you through security, then fill it at a water fountain before you board the plane.

Tim, I bet you can't. This is great profit opporunity for the airlines to sell bottles of water at $3.00 q pop.

Dmd, I am so sorry about your mom. May your memories give you comfort through the difficult time ahead.

WOW, check out http://tsr.mssl.ucl.ac.uk/. Looks like the typhoon took a sudden left turn so Achenfan will be ok for her departure to Bali.

Thanks, Dooley. It took some looking-around to find a picture of the Fairchild XC-20 Packplane. You can see it here: http://avia.russian.ee/air/usa/fair_xc-120.html.

This isn't quite what I had in mind. Still, it achieves the goal of putting the pilots and passengers into separate pressurized compartments. On the bad side, a bomb detonated on the cargo fuselage's ceiling probably would penetrate the flight-deck fuselage and disable the entire aircraft.

Sorry, that's XC-120 Packplane.

Thanks for that link, bh -- I'll have to add that site to my Favorites.
You know, moving to Hong Kong seemed like a good idea at the time, but I'm starting yearn for a good old D.C. ice storm. Even wintry mix is starting to sound attractive.

dmd:
My condolences. :(

bc:
Good call re. the Balinese hat. Why, just last week I was thinking my gold-crown-atop-space-helmet look was getting a bit tired -- it's sooooo mid-2005. (And I should probably think about trading in my purple velvet cape for something more suited to a tropical climate.)

Cassandra, I was just reading google news and there was an article about computer viruses and worms and I suddenly recalled that your computer shut down without you doing anything. There are far more qualified people around here than I, but I wonder if your computer has a virus? Are you on automatic security updates?

http://www.techspot.com/news/22493-microsoft-patch-numbers-reach-record-levels.html

Achenfan, glad to be of service. My last years of work 5 years ago were spent a lot of the time in Suzhou. My last assighment was for a month in September. Due to the humidity and temp, I was using two pair of levies a day. I changed at lunch and hung up the morning pair in the hotel in front of the AC so I would have something dry to wear in the evening.
As I knew this would be my last trip, I took one weekend to Xian to see the Terracoda soldiers. It was so hot there, ones feet stuck to the asphalt in the parking lot. The last weekend I went up to Beijing to go the Great Wall while I had a chance; against the warning of my Chinese associates. Well It was hot. An American associate recommended a tour guide that worked out of the Palace hotel that could take me in an air conditioned merk to a place in the wall away from where the tourist buses went. Well when we got there she said she had been there before so she and the driver would wait in the car while I climbed up the wall. I was dressed light but it was so hot the sweat kept running in my eyes so much I could hardly see through the view finder of the video camera. Met some nice people on the wall. Some Chinese students that offered to take pictures of me while resting in shade of one of the lookout towers, some American teachers on the way home from summer school teaching in Korea and a nice Canada couple.

Ha -- that is so true about the heat, bh.
I've heard it's not unusual for non-locals to change their shirts two or three times a day during the summer in these parts.

Then again, I guess it gets pretty hot in the U.S. in the summertime, too. Puts me in mind of a song . . .

In New York summers get hot
Well into the hundreds
You can't walk around the block
Without a change of clothing
Hot as a hairdryer in your face
Hot as a handbag and a can of mace
In New York
I just got a place in New York
New York, New York

In New York you can forget, forget how to sit still
Tell yourself you will stay in
But it's down to Alphaville

New York, New York, New York
New York, New York, New York

The Irish have been coming here for years
Feel like they own the place
They got the airport, city hall, concrete, asphalt, they even got the police
Irish, Italian, Jews and Hispanics
Religious nuts, political fanatics in the stew
Living happily not like me and you
That's where I lost you . . . New York

New York, New York
New York, New York

. . . You lose your balance, lose your wife
In the queue for the lifeboats
You got to put the women and children first
But you've got an unquenchable thirst for New York

New York, New York
New York, New York

-- U2, from the album "All That You Can't Leave Behind," 2000

[That song always reminds me of 9/11, even though it was written well before then.]

[Actually, the whole album reminds me of 9/11. Cue "Twilight Zone" music.]

Annie - During my time in England I gained a good friend who was an Irish ex-pat. Shortly after he had moved to London (a couple of years before I met him in 1990), an IRA-signature-type explosion led the police to issue a look-out advisory with a description which generally matched him. A concerned neighbor apparently called the constabulary to alert them to the presence of the recent (and obviously Irish) resident of the area.

Michael was taken in for questioning, ended up spending almost two weeks in custody while everyone assured themselves that he wasn't a danger [you'll want to bear in mind that he was about 21 years old, and completely alone in England, having left family & friends behind], and (less than two years later) was able to laugh about it with me!

As long as there are foks like him around, I'd say that there's hope for the world.

Good morning, friends. Oh, dmd, I am so sorry about your mother. My prayers are with you and family. I know it hurts, this is the month that my mother died, and the pain for me is still sharp. Is there anything I can do for you? I don't know what, but feel the need to offer.

Eurotrash, good to hear you again. SonofCarl, I have the Windows Beta thing. I don't know anything about computers, do good to get a comment up and posted.

This week we've found that as a country and a people we are hated enough for plotters to seek our lives in planes killing hundreds without a second thought. And in Iraq the killings continue. And the wars in the Middle East have taken on a life of their own. That part of the world is soaked in blood. And has been from the beginning, not new. Yet one keeps hoping that the response will be different. We know that blood calls for more blood, yet we continue down the same path. I've prayed this morning asking God through Christ for peace. It is my belief that I need to fly to God, and through His Son, Jesus, seek peace. I'm sure many find this naive thinking on my part, but don't knock it, if you haven't tried it.

I hope the day for you will be peaceful, and that somewhere along the way you and I will realize that God loves us so much more than we can imagine through Him that died for all, Jesus Christ.

Yesterday's discussion of profiling versus randomly searching 80-year-old grannies has reminded me of a chapter in Bill Maher's 2002 book, "When You Ride Alone You Ride With Bin Laden: What the Government SHOULD Be Telling Us to Help FIght the War on Terrorism." The book has these wonderful illustrations inspired by 1940s government posters aimed at boosting public support for the war effort. (The book's title and the picture on the cover were adapted from an actual poster that reads "When you ride ALONE you ride with Hitler! Join a Car-Sharing Club TODAY!")

Anyway, this chapter I'm thinking of -- "The Problem at the Airports" -- is accompanied by a picture of an old lady and a young boy being scrutinized by security officers while Osama bin Laden himself walks through the metal detector, apparently unnoticed.

Some excerpts from the chapter:
[Shrieking Denizen, I think you'll enjoy this.]

"I hate stupidity, but what I hate even more is when people actually brag about it. For example, when America's television stars finally felt it was 'emotionally safe' to hold the 2001 Emmy Awards -- after a compromise of no tuxes and a somber tone -- local new reports ignorantly raved about the preposterously inefficient level of security. They boasted that 'even the most recognizable stars were required to present a valid photo ID.' Which is exactly what's wrong with America's approach to security: we're so intent on presenting the appearance of evenhandedness, on not singling anyone out or hurting anyone's feelings, that we defeat the purpose. They're celebrating the fact that it *appears* as if they've left no stone unturned and I'm thinking -- you have limited resources -- leave a stone unturned! *Sharon Stone*, for instance. You can direct your manpower elsewhere because she's not a likely terrorist suspect -- she's *Sharon Stone*!

". . . having robots and nitwits check everyone equally is a sure recipe for disaster. It's a mindless, exploitable system of window dressing and posturing; it's procedure-bound automatons following prescribed guidelines by rote. It's randomness when we need focus. It's heads up a$$es when we need heads up.

". . . . Somewhere along the line we became this oversensitive victim culture where it is assumed that no one is ever supposed to get physically or emotionally hurt. We can't approach or question anyone about anything for fear of hurting their feelings, making them self-conscious, and ultimately becoming the defendant in their discrimination lawsuit. Remember, we're not talking about beating young Middle Eastern men with rubber hoses or placing Arab-American families into internment camps. We're asking them to perhaps endure a few extra questions at the baggage check-in line so that we can all get back to the days when the most life-threatening thing on a plane was the Chicken Kiev.

". . . . We've been brainwashed into believing that it's a sin to discriminate. But discrimination doesn't mean racism; it means telling unlike things apart. Iowa grandpas and nine-year-old girls from Ohio are simply not looking to visit 'a painful chastisement upon the Western infidels.' 'Profiling,' like 'discrimination,' has become a bad word, even though all police work is based on it, as it must be. If we stopped calling it profiling and started calling it 'proactive intelligence screening' or 'high-alert detecting,' people would be saying, 'Well, it's about time.'

". . . . It would be good if we could get with the program. It would be better if we had one first."

-- from "When You Ride Alone You Ride With Bin Laden: What the Government SHOULD Be Telling Us to Help Fight the War on Terrorism," by Bill Maher [The "Politically Incorrect" guy]

Interesting article on the family background of some of the suspected London terrorists.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20060811.wbomb-suspects0811/BNStory/Front

JA, Hal, somebody...

Please delete that blogspam at 12:58.

ThenQ.

:-)

Don't fill up bottles at the cooler. They are going to do secondary screening at gates, allegedly (I see personnel shortages, maybe). My only suggestion would be to rent my children and I will package White Russians and milkshakes as "formula" for the price of roundtrip fare for them and one parent to luxury destinations. You don't even have to sit that close to them.

The voices in my head have other money-making ideas: Avon reps, RUN, don't walk, to your nearest baggage claim. Sales should be phenomenal. And all you posters who are computer literate (your parents were married geeks), where are the links to the old (The National Homelife Security PMS Warning System) and the your new humor: Fashion Emergency: Hygiene Red Alert? Never have so many smelled so bad for so long for so little reason. The possibilities are endless. College students, post digital photos of the great unwashed flying population on MySpace and link here. We're coding out for lack of humor.

dmd: I pass along my condolences. You and your family are in my thoughts and prayers. Peace be with you and your family.

dmd, sorry about your loss. Obviously everyone here on the boodle wishes you the best.

I always try to fly Anesthesia Airways whenever possible. I just self administer the anesthesia, and I don't need much since I can sleep anywhere anytime. I once slept on the loading ramp of an inflight C-130 because the parachute strap seats were too crowded and uncomfortable.

Did anyone else read Charles Krauthammer's editorial and breathe a little easier that the neo-cons once again have their liberal boogeyman to beat up? Oh my God! As soon as possible, his fingers were typing again about liberal panty-waistedness! As though liberals are somehow to blame for terrorists. I love neo-cons. I live in their walls and attics during the day, and crawl under their beds at night, telepathically filling their minds with visions of liberal horrors. Where else do you think these guys dream up this crap?

dmd: My condolences on your loss. I don't have much to add to the discussion at the moment, except to say that if the government had something like a national tranportation policy that included trains and buses, not just planes, we would much better off domestically at least.

dmd, you and your family have my condolences as well. I hope the fact that your friends in the Boodle are thinking of you offers you some solace in this difficult time.

A-fan, as much as I like the space helm/crown and velvet cape outfit, I agree that it should be but aside until the next time we go visit the property on Tempel-1. I think a nice Balinese outfit with a elaborately embroidered skirt (and what do they call those parts that the ladies hold in their hands?) and one of those wonderful hats would make a appropriate replacement. And thanks for the Maher, that made me giggle.

Re. Anesthesia Airlines, yes, it's not a new idea, I think the first time I ever heard of such a thing was when I saw the Star Trek episode "Space Seed". But in the discussion about what to do about making commerical aircraft more terrorist-resistant, it occurred to me that while the technical challenges are quite interesting and morally worthwhile, the real problem is not the airplanes. The *airplanes* are just fine. The problem is people. Take the people out of the equation, no problem.

And to pj's 7:09 PM comment, hey howzabout that selection of inflight movies, eh?

So, no liquids are allowed on airplanes, but how about this 40-year old bottle of 5000 nitroglycerine tablets for my heart condition?

bc

Achenfan,
Glad you own Maher's book. I read it pretty much cover to cover at the bookstore when it first came out and now regret I didn't buy it--full of wisdom.

Oour local newpaper cartoonist, David Branch, drew a cartoon this morning that is the equivalent, graphically, of "Naked Air." Wonder where he got the idea?

Heard on this morning's national news morning show that yesterday an airport screener even confiscated ketchup--also that not all screening nationwide was consistent, some folks allowed to carry beverges on their planes. Also, with people forced to preserve their precious liquids by checking bags which otherwise would have been carried on, that baggage handlers and the system itself are overwhelmed--accounting--surprise, sirprise--for lots of lost luggage.

If you don't like Krauthammer this morning, may I suggest Paul Krugman at the NYT (behind the velevet ropes). Krugman takes on the unredeemable Libreman and the collective power of "irate moderates."

My sympathies for your losses, jack and dmd.

"When it seems that our sorrow is too great to be borne,
let us think of the great family
of the heavy-hearted into which our grief has given us entrance,
and inevitable, we will feel about us, their arms and their understanding." Helen Keller

Achenfan, glad you're back.

http://politics.guardian.co.uk/terrorism/story/0,,1842320,00.html

Patrick Wintour, political editor
Friday August 11, 2006
The Guardian

Downing Street admitted Tony Blair would not have left the country on Monday for his Caribbean holiday if he had known the police would need to swoop so quickly to disrupt a terrorist plot. He has known about it in general terms for months, and has spoken to President George Bush about it on a number of occasions. The two leaders discussed it in more detail on Sunday, during a conversation on a secure line in which the prime minister outlined what he knew of the British cell being monitored by the security services.

Downing Street officials said he had also mentioned the specific surveillance operation. Mr Blair warned the president that it showed there was a specific threat to US airlines and urged total secrecy, warning premature leaks would destroy the monitoring of the group.
From his holiday home, he spoke again to Mr Bush on Wednesday around 8pm UK time, again mentioning the security threat, but primarily discussing fresh plans to break the deadlock at the UN on the Middle East. Hours later police and security services were in contact with their US partners to say a specific threat was being acted upon.

The decision to sanction the raids took ministers by surprise. Douglas Alexander, the transport secretary, was on holiday in Mull on Wednesday when he was told by security officials he needed to be briefed on a threat to UK aviation. The official flew to Mull, and he was told there was a plot to blow up planes simultaneously. ...

No 10 was reluctant to go into details of exactly how much Mr Blair has known about the scale of the plot in the past few months. Some of the near desperate tone in Mr Blair's speeches, especially in Los Angeles, suggest he was exercised by the levels of alienation of Muslim opinion in the Middle East and Britain. British foreign policy was not perceived to be even-handed or just, he conceded, even if he offered no criticism of the invasion of Iraq or the scale of Israeli bombings in Lebanon.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,2-2307947_2,00.html

Perhaps this date might make a little more sense:

Michael Chertoff, the US Homeland Security Secretary, said that the British plot was "getting really quite close to the execution stage". For British and American crisis planners, the date August 22 looms large. This year it corresponds in the Islamic calendar to the day in 1427 which Muslims commemorate as when Muhammad took flight on the winged horse Buraq to the "furthest mosque", usually assumed to be Jerusalem. Bernard Lewis, an expert on the Middle East, writes: "This might well be deemed an appropriate date for the apocalyptic ending of Israel and if necessary of the world."

President Ahmadinejad of Iran has cited August 22 as the date on which he will give his final answer on nuclear development. The suggestion that the foiled British plot involved blowing up aircraft over towns and cities corresponds with a longstanding ambition held by al-Qaeda.

As disturbing as this development is, I can't help feeling relieved. Now I no longer feel obligated, as a concerned global citizen, to follow the war in Lebanon so closely. I can focus on something bigger and more dramatic. I don't know what will happen when they figure out that solids in carry-on bags can be made to blow up, and hands wielded as lethal weapons, too. But for now, liquids. Solids - leave it for tomorrow. War in Lebanon - I'll check back later.

'Morning, folks. dmd, my condolences.

Great line on the Colbert Report last evening (from night before, I guess), attempting to justify Bush's "need" to take so many vacations: "George Bush is like a handy, portable Black and Decker Red Devil Shop-Vac: he has to recharge his batteries before he sucks."

Now who the Ford in his right mind needs to take a bottle of ketchup on an airplane? The in-flight french fries just aren't that good anyway. Jeez.

Suggested alternate ad slogan for Anaesthesia Airline: Fly the friendly skiezzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz, or "Hi, I'm thorazine; fly me!"

My wife and I had this "discussion" (i.e., non-shouting argument/difference of opinion) when I went into maximum curmudgeon mode about banning all this carry-on stuff. She defends passengers who take all this carry-on crap, on the grounds that you have to "wait in line" to get your checked baggage, that airlines "loose everything," people are in a hurry, blah blah blah. I say the hell with that; people need to (a) stop whining and suck it up, (b) should check their *&^%$#@ crap, not sling it on board. If you're traveling with infants and kids, fine: take what you need; if you needs meds and stuff, fine; take what you need; if you're a reasonably normal, healthy human being, which 95 percent of passengers are, then just take a book, magazine or newspaper, or whatever, get on the damn plane, sit down, belt up, shut up, go to sleep or read your book, and wait for the flight attendent to bring you your freakin' beverage.

Among the vast, vast, vast number of things you DON"T need to take on board: ketchup, lotions, emollients, lubricants, Preparation H, kerosene, Starbuck's triple vente mocha latte non-foam with a half twist in pike position, toothpaste, mouthwash, binary explosives, Grey Poupon, KY jelly, mousse, Cabernet Sauvignon, 10W-30 motor oil, strawberry-peach-flavored seltzer water, chai tea with a cinnamon stick, a 10-oz. tube of gorilla glue, a hundred-dollar bottle of L'eau de odor du jour, Head-and-Shoulders shampoo, Prestone antifreeze, liquid oxygen, Gatorade, Massengill vinaigrette, Windex, two-part five-minute epoxy, Worcestershire sauce, wintergreen linament, turpentine, low-sodium V-8, sun tan lotion, turtle wax, chicken stock, extra virgin olive oil, a bottle of 30-year-old Hai Karate, or a nice cup of tea with a lemon slice.

And this is what I thought BEFORE all this security stuff came along. C'mon, people, it's usually just a 2- or 3- or 4-hour airplane ride, that's all it is. Stow your baggage and take a nap.

Good morning, all. PJ, no indeed, the pink princess phone Trimline of days gone by has long since retired. The current rotary phone is a big black very heavy thing that looks like something Sam Spade might have had in his office in The Maltese Falcon.

I like the fact that it's heavy enough to double as a weapon, should anyone break into my house and somehow make it past my dog. I also like its nerve-center-stunning old fashioned ring.

Annie,
I think I said that before but a couple of years ago I had to teach my then 14 years old daughter to use a rotary dial phone at the horse barn. Time sure flies. Do you remember the Contempra phones, with the rotry dial on the handset ? It won multiple design prizes in the early 70s.

'Mudge;

You might wanna reconsider that gorilla glue. Never know when you'll need to reattach a wing or something.

:-)

*SIGH*

Another sad day for journalism...

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/08/11/business/media/11mag.html?_r=1&oref=slogin

I don't know if I can agree with the preparation H thing, Mudge, there are those who might consider it vital. Not me of course.

I'm kind of interested to hear what President Ahmadinejad of Iran will say in his interview with Mike Wallace. And I am even more interested to see how the rest of the world responds. I wish my sat carrier would have Al Jazzera.

Mudge,
but you can bring that highly flammable 52% alcohol duty-free rum on board right?

Just got an email from my neice who is flying off to Boston today for an extended weekend. What's to see and do in Boston and where are the really good little places to eat?

Because airlines are getting cheap, cheap cheap, and passengers fly hungry, people tend to take food aboard--it's also good business for the kiosk (fast-fattening food) vendors at the airports. The ketchup was one of those little plastic packets, not a bottle, for crying out loud. (I remember flying Alaska Airlines back in the early 80s and being served steak and baked potato!)

Now here's a recipe for you:

http://www.opednews.com/articles/opedne_teresa_s_060811_fear_a_la_carte_2c_ser.htm

Fear a la Carte

One foiled plot stopping teroists from blowing up several U.S.-bound airplanes.

Hundreds of airport wastebaskets filled with:
water bottles
perfume
lipstick
deoderant
baby formula
tax-free items purchased at duty-free stores in airports wherever.

A 24x7 cacaphanous media repeating Bush
propaganda: fear fear fear fear fear fear fear ad infinitum.

Pour into giant cauldron of fear.

One highly infantilized, immoral head of government aka as master chef to mix it all into bleets, belows, slurps, and spoonfuls of fear, fear, fear.

I suspect that anyone with a bottle of ketchup and a tube of ky is of dubious motives on any aircraft.

Loomis, you may have seen this already as it seems to be referenced in your 9:50. Bernard Lewis on significant dates:

http://www.opinionjournal.com/extra/?id=110008768

dr;

What ISN'T there to do in Boston???

Old North Church (one if by land, two if by sea, etc.)
Boston Common
USS Constiution
New England Aquarium
Museum of Science
Bunker Hill (great view of the new Zakim Bridge - stunning!)
Fanueil Hall

And the list goes on...

Good little places to eat?? North End (near Fanueil Hall) for Italian, most anywhere for seafood.

And why exactly was Britain's foreign secretary Jack Straw sacked?:

http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,20867,20050494-2703,00.html

Straw's sacking insults Britain
Jack Straw was dismissed by the US President, writes William Rees-Mogg

August 08, 2006
WHEN British foreign secretary Jack Straw was replaced by Margaret Beckett in a cabinet reshuffle this year, it seemed almost inexplicable. Straw had been highly competent - experienced, serious, moderate and always well-briefed. Beckett is embarrassingly inexperienced.
I made inquiries in Washington and was told US Defence Secretary Donald Rumsfeld had taken exception to Straw's statement that it would be "nuts" to bomb Iran. The US, it was said, had put pressure on British Prime Minister Tony Blair to change his foreign secretary. Straw had been fired at the request of the Bush administration, particularly at the behest of the Pentagon.

Not long before he was dismissed, Straw went on a charm tour with US Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice, in which they visited his Blackburn constituency in northern England.

This has been given two explanations. One was that Rice was hoping to protect Straw against the undiplomatic attack from the Pentagon. She wanted to keep Rumsfeld's tanks off her turf. She had found Straw competent and effective. If that were so, then Rice lost the battle in the Washington turf war.

The alternative explanation was given more recently by Irwin Stelzer in The Spectator. He has remarkably good Washington contacts and is probably right. His account is that Straw was indeed dismissed because of US anxieties, but that Rice herself had become worried, on her visit to Blackburn, by Straw's dependence on Muslim votes. About 20 per cent of the voters in Blackburn are Islamic. Straw was dumped only four weeks after Rice's visit.

mudge,

We usually agree, but I have to call you out on the Turtle Wax ban. I have rented some prett dingy rental cars. I have an image to project.

Here is what I usually have in a carry-on bag:

Two back issues of Wired magazine
A trashy novel
A classy non-fiction book I've been meaning to read
A pair of headphones not compatible with the armrest jacks
My camera bag complete with telephoto lens, memory cards, and spare battery
A ziploc'ed bag with toothbrush, toothpaste, spare underwear and socks
My car keys with remote lock fob

Okay, all you MacGyvers out there, blow up a plane with that.

NEW KIT!

Oh, and dr;

Lots of little places to eat near Boston University, and in Cambridge by Hah-vahd...

:-)

In answer to my question of yesterday, yes we really are that spoiled. We can't do without our brand of whatever till we get off the plane and collect our luggage, and we definitely can't stand for it to be lost along with our clothes from our other luggage.

This may be slightly inflammatory, but there is part of me wonders if we don't deserve some comeuppance.

Dr, tell your neice to bring her walking shoes. Boston is a great place to walk around. The Public Gardens, ride the swan boat. Quincy Market is a tourist trap but Fanueil Hall is historic. The Museum of Fine Arts, the USS Constitution, the Freedom Trail takes you to all the historic sights. If her feet get tired, the Duck Boat ride is a great trip, I learned stuff about Boston I never knew, they also go into the Charles River for a nice water ride.
The North End ((Italian section) has the best food, lots of little places to eat. I know I should have a longer list but part of my mind is still decorating the house and the rest of it needs more coffee. The weather this weekend is going to be perfect for sightseeing. She should have a wonderful visit, just tell her to stay out of the Big Dig tunnels, they have this tendency to collapse. The Sumner and Callahan tunnels are old, but safe.

Hey, Denizen -- I don't remember the Contempra phone, alas. But I forgot one other thing I love about rotary phones: not only the sound of the ring tone, but that clicking sound the wheel makes when it goes around.

I know it's ridiculous -- when people leave messages on the house phone, I have to use my blackberry to dial in to voice mail and retrieve them. When people phone from the entrance to my apartment building to be let it, I can't press 9 and buzz them in -- have to hang up, run down the stairs and greet them in person.

But what can I tell you. I like the way the big black phone looks and sounds, I like the way it reminds me of my grandmother (whose phone it was), and I don't base my life decisions 100% on efficiency. There are other virtues I prize as well.

If you *really* want to blow your daughter's mind some time, see if you can find an old IBM Selectric typewriter to show her.

Nelson--
I completely agree with your stand on American mandatory military service. I can't help but wonder how our foreign policy would change if the sons and daughters of Congressmen/women, Cabinet members, and the President were required to serve in a hot zone? I bet we would pick our battles more carefully, and design an exit strategy before we started shooting...

Glad to see the prescription label must agree with the ID. That's a relief, because: a terrorist gets a fake passport, a fake driver's license, a fake visa, and then . . . stopped cold because he can't get a fake prescription label.
Yep. I feel much safer now that this extra burden has been placed on the bad guys.

Has all these heightened airport security actually caught any terrorist directly? We know about this liquid explosive for years, but we have not done anything to prevent or detect it. Now suddenly the Brits caught a group of people who actually planned to carry the liquid explosive on board, we disrupted all travel by imposing all these no-liquid carry on rules. Any terrorist with half a brain cell will know they can't get on the plane, so what do they do? They will turn around and try a different day, and use a different method. We have not eliminated the risk, just delayed it. Notice how the terrorist adapts their attack strategy while we are constantly on the defensive? We need to think out of the box? How about developing a safer plane that's capable of surviving small explosions? What about partitioning the plane into multi-compartments in order to contain any damages? We are spending billions in Iraq, is that a wise allocation of our limited resources?

You know, it would be really nice to think that the UK would get its act together about the home-grown terrorist problem in their midst. 3 attempts in a year, one successful, one almost successful, and now a plot that was disrupted, largely through Pakistani assistance, that would have possibly eclipsed 9/11 in its diabolical plan of destruction?

Am I the lone voice out there NOT praising this country-the United Kingdom, which seems to have to be dragged, kicking and screaming into the post 9/11 reality world? The UK STILL doesn't monitor the mosques in England as to what is happening there-they STILL allow radical British Muslims, on both television and radio, to spew their dialogue of hate against the west in general, and the US in particular, and NO ONE does anything about it, claiming civil liberties issues-well obviously, where is the greater harm here to society, when plots to bring down more than 11 planes were in the final stages before the test run?

You would think that the situation would be different after last summer's bombings but no-this country STILL is dithering over what to do!

Do you know that the Finsbury Park Mosque in London, with its radical imam, Abu Hamza-who preached his vitriol for many years against the west to impressionable and adrift young Muslims like Moussaoui and Richard Reid wasn't picked up for incitement to terrorism until AFTER the last summer's successful terrorist bombing?

Have you also noticed, that not ONE other European country has this problem, not Spain, not Italy, not France, not Germany ONLY the UK?

When is someone going to say to the Brits that we are TIRED of what is happening in your country, so you better DO something about it, and DO IT NOW- because your refusal to deal with this home-grown terrorist issue is adversely affecting the lives of everyone around the world-at a minimum.

And the famous "stiff upper lip" and "British reserve in the face of this adversity?" Methinks that's on;ly a cover for incompetence, and a lack of will to do what it takes to prevent the seeds of destruction from germinating in that country in the first instance.

These terrorists have no value of human life.
They worship death and will probably do everything possible to guarantee their success. Banning all carry on articles is a start and shoe inspections and other inspections, but what about traditional turbans. A terrorist could easily smuggle a bomb under a traditional turbin! What's to stop a terrorist from smuggling a bomb on board which has been surgically inserted into the terrorist's human body after all they are human bombs which have no value on human life. Maybe we should learn from WWII when Kamakazi attacks were the fact of life. It took 2 nuclear bombs to threaten them to stop or be obliterated out of existance. I don't know what else will stop these terrorists.

After 9-11 I said I'd fly naked if I had to as long as the flights were safe. We're getting closer!
http://www.smartdigitalcamera.info

Has anyone seen Mahmoud Ahmadinejad's blog? I can't log on, the server's busy; I guess Achenblog will have to do. I'm sure Mahmoud's is very similar to this. Could anyone who succeeds in accessing the page let me know?

http://www.ahmadinejad.ir/

To girlsppytravel who posted on August 12. Yes, much of what you say about Britain is true, but the fact remains, it was the British who foiled this plot!You imply that they are incompetant. Well, they found the subway bombers very quickly and then this. You want incompetance? Look to our department of so-called Homeland Security. It is a model of incompetance.

Only a partial listing up to 10-05. How many before or since? With how many more bogus fear tactics will the MSM engage in complicity before the November elections?

---October 12, 2005 | 8:35 p.m. ET

The Nexus of Politics and Terror (Keith Olbermann)

Secaucus - Last Thursday on Countdown, I referred to the latest terror threat - the reported bomb plot against the New York City subway system - in terms of its timing. President Bush's speech about the war on terror had come earlier the same day, as had the breaking news of the possible indictment of Karl Rove in the CIA leak investigation.

I suggested that in the last three years there had been about 13 similar coincidences - a political downturn for the administration, followed by a "terror event" - a change in alert status, an arrest, a warning.

We figured we'd better put that list of coincidences on the public record. We did so this evening on the television program, with ten of these examples. The other three are listed at the end of the main list, out of chronological order. The contraction was made purely for the sake of television timing considerations, and permitted us to get the live reaction of the former Undersecretary of Homeland Security, Asa Hutchinson.

We bring you these coincidences, reminding you, and ourselves here, that perhaps the simplest piece of wisdom in the world is called "the logical fallacy." Just because Event "A" occurs, and then Event "B" occurs, that does not automatically mean that Event "A" caused Event "B."

But one set of comments from an informed observer seems particularly relevant as we examine these coincidences.

On May 10th of this year, after his resignation, former Secretary of Homeland Security Ridge looked back on the terror alert level changes, issued on his watch.

Mr. Ridge said: "More often than not we were the least inclined to raise it. Sometimes we disagreed with the intelligence assessment. Sometimes we thought even if the intelligence was good, you don't necessarily put the country on (alert)... there were times when some people were really aggressive about raising it, and we said 'for that?'"

Please, judge for yourself.

Number One:

May 18th, 2002. The first details of the President's Daily Briefing of August 6th, 2001, are revealed, including its title - "Bin Laden Determined To Strike In U.S." The same day another memo is discovered - revealing the FBI knew of men with links to Al Qaeda training at an Arizona flight school. The memo was never acted upon. Questions about 9/11 Intelligence failures are swirling.

May 20th, 2002. Two days later, FBI Director Mueller declares another terrorist attack "inevitable." The next day, the Department of Homeland Security issues warnings of attacks against railroads nationwide, and against New York City landmarks like the Brooklyn Bridge and the Statue of Liberty.

Number Two:

June 6th, 2002. Colleen Rowley, the FBI agent who tried to alert her superiors to the specialized flight training taken by Zacarias Moussaoui, whose information suggests the government missed a chance to break up the 9/11 plot, testifies before Congress. Senate Intelligence Committee Chair Graham says Rowley's testimony has inspired similar pre-9/11 whistle-blowers.

June 10th, 2002. Four days later, speaking from Russia, Attorney General John Ashcroft reveals that an American named Jose Padilla is under arrest, accused of plotting a radiation bomb attack in this country. Padilla had, by this time, already been detained for more than a month.

Number Three:

February 5th, 2003. Secretary of State Powell tells the United Nations Security Council of Iraq's concealment of weapons, including 18 mobile biological weapons laboratories, justifying a U.N. or U.S. first strike. Many in the UN are doubtful. Months later, much of the information proves untrue.

February 7th, 2003. Two days later, as anti-war demonstrations continue to take place around the globe, Homeland Security Secretary Ridge cites "credible threats" by Al Qaeda, and raises the terror alert level to orange. Three days after that, Fire Administrator David Paulison - who would become the acting head of FEMA after the Hurricane Katrina disaster - advises Americans to stock up on plastic sheeting and duct tape to protect themselves against radiological or biological attack.

Number Four:

July 23rd, 2003: The White House admits the CIA -- months before the President's State of the Union Address -- expressed "strong doubts" about the claim that Iraq had attempted to buy uranium from Niger. On the 24th, the Congressional report on the 9/11 attacks is issued; it criticizes government at all levels; it reveals an FBI informant had been living with two of the future hijackers; and it concludes that Iraq had no link to Al-Qaeda. 28 pages of the report are redacted. On the 26th, American troops are accused of beating Iraqi prisoners.

July 29th, 2003. Three days later, amid all of those negative headlines, Homeland Security issues warnings of further terrorist attempts to use airplanes for suicide attacks.

Number Five:

December 17th, 2003. 9/11 Commission Co-Chair Thomas Kean says the attacks were preventable. The next day, a Federal Appeals Court says the government cannot detain suspected radiation-bomber Jose Padilla indefinitely without charges, and the chief U.S. Weapons inspector in Iraq, Dr. David Kay, who has previously announced he has found no Weapons of Mass Destruction in Iraq, announces he will resign his post.

December 21st, 2003. Three days later, just before Christmas, Homeland Security again raises the threat level to Orange, claiming "credible intelligence" of further plots to crash airliners into U.S. cities. Subsequently, six international flights into this country are cancelled after some passenger names purportedly produce matches on government no-fly lists. The French later identify those matched names: one belongs to an insurance salesman from Wales, another to an elderly Chinese woman, a third to a five-year old boy.

Number Six:

March 30th, 2004. The new chief weapons inspector in Iraq, Charles Duelfer tells Congress we have still not found any WMD there. And, after weeks of refusing to appear before the 9/11 Commission, Condoleezza Rice finally relents and agrees to testify. On the 31st: Four Blackwater-USA contractors working in Iraq are murdered, their mutilated bodies dragged through the streets and left on public display in Fallujah. The role of civilian contractors in Iraq is widely questioned.

April 2nd, 2004. Homeland Security issues a bulletin warning that terrorists may try to blow up buses and trains, using fertilizer and fuel bombs - like the one detonated in Oklahoma City - stuffed into satchels or duffel bags.

Number Seven:

May 16th, 2004. Secretary of State Powell appears on "Meet The Press." Moderator Tim Russert closes by asking him about the "enormous personal credibility" Powell had placed before the U.N. in laying out a case against Saddam Hussein. An aide to Powell interrupts the question, saying the interview is over. Powell finishes his answer, admitting that much of the information he had been given about Weapons of Mass Destruction was "inaccurate and wrong, and, in some cases, deliberately misleading."

May 21st, 2004, new photos showing mistreatment of Iraqi prisoners at Abu Ghraib Prison are released. On the 24th - Associated Press video from Iraq confirms U.S. forces mistakenly bombed a wedding party - killing more than 40.

Wednesday the 26th. Two days later, Attorney General Ashcroft and FBI Director Mueller warn that intelligence from multiple sources, in Ashcroft's words, "indicates Al-Qaeda's specific intention to hit the United States hard," and that "90 percent of the arrangements for an attack on the United States were complete." The color-coded warning system is not raised, and Homeland Security Secretary Ridge does not attend the announcement.

Number Eight:

July 6th, 2004. Democratic Presidential candidate John Kerry selects Senator John Edwards as his vice presidential running mate, producing a small bump in the election opinion polls, and a huge swing in media attention towards the Democratic campaign.

July 8th, 2004. Two days later, Homeland Secretary Ridge warns of information about Al-Qaeda attacks during the summer or autumn. Four days after that, the head of the U.S. Election Assistance Commission, DeForest B. Soaries, Junior, confirms he has written to Ridge about the prospect of postponing the upcoming Presidential election in the event it is interrupted by terrorist acts.

Number Nine:

July 29th, 2004. At their party convention in Boston, the Democrats formally nominate John Kerry as their candidate for President. As in the wake of any convention, the Democrats dominate the media attention over the ensuing weekend.

Monday, August 1st, 2004. The Department of Homeland Security raises the alert status for financial centers in New York, New Jersey, and Washington to orange. The evidence supporting the warning - reconnaissance data, left in a home in Iraq - later proves to be roughly four years old and largely out-of-date.

Number Ten:

Last Thursday. At 10 AM Eastern Time, the President addresses the National Endowment for Democracy, once again emphasizing the importance of the war on terror and insisting his government has broken up at least 10 terrorist plots since 9/11.

At 3 PM Eastern Time, five hours after the President's speech has begun, the Associated Press reports that Karl Rove will testify again to the CIA Leak Grand Jury, and that Special Prosecutor Fitzgerald has told Rove he cannot guarantee that he will not be indicted.

At 5:17 PM Eastern Time, seven hours after the President's speech has begun, New York officials disclose a bomb threat to the city's subway system - based on information supplied by the Federal Government. A Homeland Security spokesman says the intelligence upon which the disclosure is based is "of doubtful credibility." And it later proves that New York City had known of the threat for at least three days, and had increased police presence in the subways long before making the announcement at that particular time. Local New York television station, WNBC, reports it had the story of the threat days in advance, but was asked by "high ranking federal officials" in New York and Washington to hold off its story.

Less than four days after revealing the threat, Mayor Michael Bloomberg says "Since the period of the threat now seems to be passing, I think over the immediate future, we'll slowly be winding down the enhanced security."

While news organizations ranging from the New York Post to NBC News quote sources who say there was reason to believe that informant who triggered the warning simply 'made it up', a Senior U.S. Counter-terrorism official tells the New York Times: "There was no there, there."

The list of three additional examples follows.

Number Eleven:

October 22nd, 2004. After weeks of Administration insistence that there are terrorist plans to disrupt the elections, FBI, Law Enforcement, and other U.S. Intelligence agencies report they have found no direct evidence of any plot. More over, they say, a key CIA source who had claimed knowledge of the plot, has been discredited.

October 29, 2004. Seven days later - four days before the Presidential election - the first supposedly new, datable tape of Osama Bin Laden since December 2001 is aired on the Al-Jazeera Network. A Bush-Cheney campaign official anonymously tells the New York Daily News that from his campaign's point of view, the tape is quote "a little gift."

Number Twelve:

May 5th, 2005. 88 members of the United States House of Representatives send a letter to President Bush demanding an investigation of the so-called "Downing Street Memo" - a British document which describes purported American desire dating to 2002 to "fix" the evidence to fit the charges against Iraq. In Iraq over the following weekend, car bombings escalate. On the 11th, more than 75 Iraqis are killed in one.

May 11th, 2005. Later that day, an instructor and student pilot violate restricted airspace in Washington D.C. It is an event that happens hundreds of times a year, but this time the plane gets to within three miles of the White House. The Capitol is evacuated; Vice President Cheney, the First Lady, and Nancy Reagan are all rushed to secure locations. The President, biking through woods, is not immediately notified.

Number Thirteen:

June 26th, 2005. A Gallup poll suggests that 61 percent of the American public believes the President does not have a plan in Iraq. On the 28th, Mr. Bush speaks to the nation from Fort Bragg: "We fight today because terrorists want to attack our country and kill our citizens, and Iraq is where they are making their stand. So we'll fight them there, we'll fight them across the world, and we will stay in the fight until the fight is won."

June 29th 2005. The next day, another private pilot veers into restricted airspace, the Capitol is again evacuated, and this time, so is the President.

To summarize, coincidences are coincidences.

We could probably construct a similar time line of terror events and warnings, and their relationship to - the opening of new Walmarts around the country.

Are these coincidences signs that the government's approach has worked because none of the announced threats ever materialized? Are they signs that the government has not yet mastered how and when to inform the public?

Is there, in addition to the "fog of war" a simple, benign, "fog of intelligence"?

But, if merely a reasonable case can be made that any of these juxtapositions of events are more than just coincidences, it underscores the need for questions to be asked in this country - questions about what is prudence, and what is fear-mongering; questions about which is the threat of death by terror, and which is the terror of threat.--

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/12253937/

Jack commented, "I forget about things like video surveillance and how effective it is."

Actually, as is often the case with security, video surveillance is not particularly effective because the person watching the video gets bored unless tested every so often by a security officer posing as a terrorist. But, on the other hand, the bad guys can't be certain that the person at the TV screen isn't watching, and probably don't want to risk that chance. So they'll go somewhere to a "softer" target. Which means the CCTV is more effective as a deterrent than as a way of catching a terrorist. That is why including some phony cameras along with the real ones can be an effective lower cost ploy.

In general, protecting information about a security system and its weaknesses, keeping the enemy uncertain as to your true capabilities, is a vital part of security. In a democracy, with nearly unlimited freedom of speech and freedom of the press, that can be tough to accomplish. People have to use some self-censorship and decide whether it is better to publicize a security weakness in hopes it will get fixed or of staying silent in hopes the bad guys don't learn of it. A better option may be to first send a letter with information about the weakness to the authorities in charge, with a copy to your elected representative who has some control of the agency's budget.