Network News

X My Profile
View More Activity

The Jupiter effect

A quick update from the beach, where we've been camping, and roughing it, and getting very close to nature, and only sometimes checking e-mail. Also we listened to the end of the Skins game in an SUV in the parking lot. But otherwise: a wilderness experience.

Last night the stars popped out and then faded behind clouds and then popped out again; we counted them and stopped at a bajillion. Jupiter dominates the sky -- it's so close it feels a little dangerous. Triangulate the heavens and you'll see Jupiter, Earth, Sun in an alignment that probably explains a LOT about all the stuff that's going on. You know: the stuff. That's going on. Much of which is not right. Anyway, with binoculars, as I've noted before, you can see the moons of Jupiter, either two, three, or four, depending on how steady is the hand. One becomes conscious of one's unsteadiness, in general, when trying to do this. One thinks: Must become a steadier person. Then one has the better thought: Must buy tripod.

You know how everything tastes better outside? Bugs have the same thought. This is why they like it when I'm outside and they can devour me and try to sport me away like the flying monkeys nabbing Toto. As an environmentalist it is my vow to defend nature from the assaults of industrial human civilization, but secondarily we really need to get rid of all these insects. That may move to the top of my To Do list: Eliminate the bugs.

Sunrise this morning was a show-stopper, or would have been had there been a show. Imagine living in a pre-scientific age when no one knew what the Sun actually was, as an object, as a thing, as a doohicky in the sky. Only now, thanks to modern science and astrophysics, do we have the ability to understand that the Sun is not a god after all, but just a ball of flame hundreds of miles in diameter, like almost as big as Texas. It is humbling, possessing such knowledge. For me right now, knowing these things almost feels like too much responsibility.

We also saw roughly 30 shooting stars and so the star count is now a bajillion minus 30.

By Joel Achenbach  | October 11, 2010; 8:34 AM ET
 
Save & Share:  Send E-mail   Facebook   Twitter   Digg   Yahoo Buzz   Del.icio.us   StumbleUpon   Technorati   Google Buzz   Previous: Macondo blowout: Where was the government?
Next: The rescue

Comments

Joel, I'm confused. You were in hearings and out of contact with the weather, and also roughing it at the beach?

Posted by: -bia- | October 11, 2010 9:32 AM | Report abuse

I envy you! As you well know, the DC area is pretty much a dead zone when it comes to looking at the nighttime sky. And a tripod would be a great investment. Even a monopod if you are, like, want to go minimalistic.

Whenever we used to visit my in-laws in Lancaster county I used to revel in the sight of the stars. We saw Halle-Bopp up there and I really could feel myself getting all communal with the spirits of my ancestors. (Of course, I was sitting in a hot-tub at the time sipping a nice Shiraz.)

The point, of course, is that the world is full of wonderful sights that we have lost our appreciation for. Like the stars, and a roaring campfire.

Although, at most beaches anymore, they pretty much want you to limit this to the stars.

Posted by: RD_Padouk | October 11, 2010 9:35 AM | Report abuse

Also, as Joel well knows, the Jupiter Effect refers to the partial alignment of the planets that occurred in early 1982. It was supposed to cause massive disasters like earthquakes and other bad stuff. I remember very clearly sitting with my roommate in our dorm room listening to KROQ waiting for the big moment. Of course, it never came. So we started our homework.

Posted by: RD_Padouk | October 11, 2010 9:38 AM | Report abuse

As I noted on the latest Macondo Kit, I blame the WaPo servers for not serving up the Kits appropriately...

Posted by: Scottynuke | October 11, 2010 9:40 AM | Report abuse

'Syzygy' is one of my favorite words. Not as good as 'defenestration', but still quite nice.

Posted by: yellojkt | October 11, 2010 9:44 AM | Report abuse

That makes sense, Scotty. I was going to say nasty things about Joel not putting the needs of the boodle above those of family and job -- the idea! -- but if it's the server's fault, I guess we can let him off the hook.

Posted by: -bia- | October 11, 2010 9:53 AM | Report abuse

That's 30 wishes!

Posted by: Windy3 | October 11, 2010 9:54 AM | Report abuse

Good morning, y'all.

Warm muffins, coffee and OJ on the table.

LiT wins the tiara! Again! Hurrah for you!

Recent planetary alignments:
Oct 5: Mars and Venus
Oct 7: Sun and Moon (new moon)
Oct 8: Saturn and Mercury, with Sun close by and Moon skedaddling away

Not really worth writing home about.

I like 'syzygy' too. I used it in a 5th grade essay and my teacher insisted it wasn't a real word.

Posted by: MsJS | October 11, 2010 10:00 AM | Report abuse

I'm glad to see that we're returning to the important things. Even if Joel couldn't be troubled to come out to Pasadena last week...

Posted by: ScienceTim | October 11, 2010 10:09 AM | Report abuse

I present to the boodle a new song.

"Disastrahoochie"
(to the tune "The Sound of Music" by Rodgers and Hammerstein)

The Gulf’s filled with oil from Disastrahoochie,
let loose from its lair of a million years.
The ooze in the soil’s by Disastrahoochie.
The slime on the birds brings me close to tears.

For days and then weeks we all watched as the oil and gas gushed up into the sea.
We learned terms like junk shot and bottom kill and, of course, BOP.
BP’s being called to explain what failed with the well on that day.
The folks on the shore lost their jobs, they want BP to pay.

The Congress smells blood, and there’ll be more hearings.
The press is abuzz, like bees ‘round the hive.
The one thing I know ‘bout Disastrahoochie:
We’re still gonna drive.

Posted by: MsJS | October 11, 2010 10:14 AM | Report abuse

Bugs are why the backyard is basically a really big outhouse for the dog. I'm not bothered too much, but mosquitoes and their brethren view my wife as an all-you-can-eat buffet. Now and then she will venture out, but only with the aid of massive chemical warfare. I think you can see the citronella torches from space.

Posted by: RD_Padouk | October 11, 2010 10:18 AM | Report abuse

Speaking of Jupiter effects -- you should look up superionic water some time. Very weird stuff, to which I have just been (conceptually) introduced.

Posted by: ScienceTim | October 11, 2010 10:18 AM | Report abuse

Bugs are why the backyard is basically a really big outhouse for the dog. I'm not bothered too much, but mosquitoes and their brethren view my wife as an all-you-can-eat buffet. Now and then she will venture out, but only with the aid of massive chemical warfare. I think you can see the citronella torches from space.

Posted by: RD_Padouk | October 11, 2010 10:22 AM | Report abuse

Good morning all. Came back early to work on taxes (yuck) and find out I get the tiara this week? Wow. You take half the games as upsets, you don't expect to win. Who knew?

Have a very happy day all.

Posted by: LostInThought | October 11, 2010 10:33 AM | Report abuse

I would go on my annual Genocidal Explorer Appreciation Day rant, but it just annoys the Italian-Americans in the boodler community. I will note that it is also National Coming Out Day.

http://www.hrc.org/ncod/

My wife is disappointed for yet another year.

Posted by: yellojkt | October 11, 2010 10:41 AM | Report abuse

LiT,
You and bc keep hogging that tiara. Give us cellar dwellers a chance.

Posted by: yellojkt | October 11, 2010 10:47 AM | Report abuse

Near Riot in Camp Esperanza.
A few minutes ago, the Plan B rig left the work area. Media people almost overwhelmed polic opening the way. Some ugly shoving took place as media people pushed to interview crew.

Good thing police reinforcements arrived last night to seal off the area.

The extraction of the miners should begin within the next 48 hours.

Brag

Posted by: Braguine | October 11, 2010 11:01 AM | Report abuse

Before I read the kit, a shout out to Joel, last evening I was driving eldest daughter and two of her friends to a movie. One of the girls, we will call her "hyper-chatty" was talking non-stop at rapid speed in the backseat. In her ramblings she happened to mention how bored she was that day, so she decided to read her dads NatGeo (kids these days no respect for a fine magazine), the article she mentioned reading - Joels!

Posted by: dmd3 | October 11, 2010 11:10 AM | Report abuse

My prayers and thoughts are with the miners, Brag. Getting the bends wouldn't be good, I hope the medical attention will be appropriate.

October is a great time to camp. Usually. I hope it's an aberration that the mosquitoes are still with us. One buzzed me yesterday afternoon in the driveway at the mountain place. I never did get a good swat at it, darn it.

Posted by: slyness | October 11, 2010 11:17 AM | Report abuse

Miners update

Last night, unannounced, A test of the Fenix-1 capsule was carried out. It reached close to the bottom without problems.

The resue will begin at 00:00 hours of Wednesday.

That is midnight tomorrow night.

During ascent arterial pressure, heartbeat, breathing will be monitored. The rescuee will be in continuous touch via telephone and video.

Paramedics will be at the bottom of the shaft. On the surface they will have a medical reception team, similar to the teams receiving astronauts.

Brag :)

Posted by: Braguine | October 11, 2010 11:38 AM | Report abuse

I'll be watching that and praying, Brag.

Happy Thanksgiving to everybody, even if you don't celebrate it( by getting the day off), or are celebrating it later.

Posted by: --dr-- | October 11, 2010 11:48 AM | Report abuse

"Paramedics at the bottom of the shaft." I guess that means that they will start by sending men *down* the shaft, to prepare the miners for extraction and to rig up the medical devices? Wow. Those paramedics are pretty gutsy.

Posted by: ScienceTim | October 11, 2010 12:01 PM | Report abuse

RIP Carla Cohen of Politics and Prose. She was 74.

I gather the bookstore is still up for sale. But I sure as hell hope once it has new buyers that it doesn't disappear or otherwise lose its flavor.

And as for my Canuckistani boodler friends, you're making me hungry for our Thanksgiving, and we still have to wait for a few weeks. Well, okay, I'm actually hungry for lunch. . . .

Hey, how *about* my Lions yesterday, eh?????

Posted by: ftb3 | October 11, 2010 12:02 PM | Report abuse

Your Lions done great, ftb!

Happy Thanksgiving up north and happy get-the-miners-out way down south. Welcome news all around.

This calls for...fresh-baked cookies. I just made both oatmeal raisin and chewy chocolate. BYOB.

Posted by: MsJS | October 11, 2010 12:10 PM | Report abuse

Speaking of bugs, John Kelly's piece is rather silly, mostly pointless, and kind of fun:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/10/10/AR2010101003299.html?hpid=sec-metro

Posted by: Bob-S | October 11, 2010 12:13 PM | Report abuse

Tripods are nice but less than ideal when viewing the heavens. An increase in steadiness is offset by the acute awareness of the earth's rotation as the object of observation wanders out of the field.

By Jove, the best thing about camping is the sense of appreciation for the conveniences of modern life. How's that high maintenance thing working for you while camping, Joel?

Posted by: edbyronadams | October 11, 2010 12:20 PM | Report abuse

I think, despite his whining, Joel is a pretty happy camper.

Happy Thanksgiving to our Canadian boodlers! It has been a great weekend for me and shown me lots to be thankful for, so I'm with you in spirit.

Saturday we visited my great niece (and her parents) to make a furniture swap and take them out for a great Korean meal.

Despite living near a large Korean population here in NoVa, the best Korean food I've found is at the Korea House hole-in-the-wall restaurant in Charlottesville. My great niece, who will turn 2 in a month, absolutely LOVED the food and kept asking for more a-choo until we realized she had forgotten the word for kim-chee.

On the way home we stopped at the Moo-Thru dairy bar on US 29 in Remington, Va, where the ice cream is made fresh on location, from local dairy milk. Oh. My. God. It was amazing. I'm sure yello has made a stop there in his travels in that area.

Yesterday we went into DC to cheer my friend K, who was completing the 60-mile, 3-day Komen walk for Breat Cancer. Surprising her at the cheering station at Farragut Square was great and then attending the closing ceremony on the Monument grounds was amazing and inspiring.

I think there were about 2,000 walkers in the event, some of them women with hair just returning after cancer treatments. Some were walking in memory of loved ones, some in honor of survivors and some just to help raise money for research. This year's DC walk raised more than $5 million (K's team raised almost $120,000!).

Posted by: -TBG- | October 11, 2010 12:23 PM | Report abuse

Wo, TBG, that's quite a number for fundraising. Congratulations to all who participated.

Posted by: slyness | October 11, 2010 12:30 PM | Report abuse


I liked the Post's video presentation of searching for bedbugs in a hotel room. Just wondering how much the front desk appreciates the call to housekeeping after the bed is disassembled for inspection.

Ah, the joys of being mostly a homebody!

Posted by: edbyronadams | October 11, 2010 12:30 PM | Report abuse

Oh.. forgot to mention... one of the best sights of yesterday was the team of burly men walking with t-shirts that said "Fight like a girl!"

Posted by: -TBG- | October 11, 2010 12:31 PM | Report abuse

Hippy T-Birdy, Canuckistanis. (Not the birdday birdy, the T-day turket-type birdy.)

But...where my Yoki? I midses my Yoki. Likewides my CqP. Where her be? Her can't be dribing Porpoise Boy to swimmy meet again. Hope she not riding her bike into more deer, elk, moose, caribou, etc.

Posted by: Curmudgeon5 | October 11, 2010 12:40 PM | Report abuse

Yes, Happy Thanksgiving!

Posted by: Bob-S | October 11, 2010 12:43 PM | Report abuse

Moo-Thru is a definite must-stop if you ever find yourself in the greater Remington area along James Madison Highway.

http://www.moothru.com/

My only disappointment is that they are closed on Mondays.

This has been an uncompensated endorsement.

Posted by: yellojkt | October 11, 2010 1:03 PM | Report abuse

Oh, and congrats on the great fundraising effort by your friend.

Posted by: yellojkt | October 11, 2010 1:04 PM | Report abuse

yello... I think the 3-day walk is right up your alley. You should think about doing it next year. You can join K's team and I'll help you with fundraising.

(This is not a challenge... merely a friendly suggestion.)

Posted by: -TBG- | October 11, 2010 1:13 PM | Report abuse

Not being able to find my old 7 x 35's, I went out the other day and bought a pair of 10 x 50 binoculars. Either I still can't hold still well enough, or the optics aren't that great, but I still couldn't pick out the moons. Maybe I needed to be out on the beach too?

Posted by: ebtnut | October 11, 2010 1:21 PM | Report abuse

BTW, this is what I was messing around with on this past beautiful weekend:
http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=340775&nseq=13

Posted by: ebtnut | October 11, 2010 1:24 PM | Report abuse

Yup, Tim. 4 Guys are going down the shaft, 2 paramedics and two mining experts. As back up, police commandoes are practicing in getting people out without a capsule.

The trip will take aproximately 15 minutes. They estimate getting out one man per hour.

4 hours to lower rescuers who will work in two shifts, 33 hours to get the trapped miners out,then 4 more hours to get rescuers out. Total 41 hours.

The standby capsules are shorter and narrower than Fenix-1

Brag :)

Posted by: Braguine | October 11, 2010 1:27 PM | Report abuse

yello - my objection to rants about "genocidal explorers" have less to do with the vowels in my name and more to do with my intellectual disdain for substituting one simplistic historical fairy tale with another simplistic historical fairy tale.

Posted by: RD_Padouk | October 11, 2010 1:28 PM | Report abuse

Rant of the day: Rick Sanchez has almost achieved Octomom or Joe the Plumber status in my book.

Why are people talking about him, anyway? Don't we think his comments were meant to achieve what they have? Just don't look!

Posted by: baldinho | October 11, 2010 1:29 PM | Report abuse

Speaking of which, on our cruise ship they had a program called "On Deck for the Cure," a Komen-affiliated fundraising walk my wife participated in. 12 laps around the promenade deck equals three miles. About 100 or so passengers participated, and the next day the captain announced they raised $1,500. We roughly calculated that if each of 15 ships has one each week (each cruise), times 4 weeks in October, that would be 15 x 4 x $1,500 = $90,000.

Posted by: Curmudgeon5 | October 11, 2010 1:34 PM | Report abuse

Ah, the joys of using binoculars. I took a pair to Africa and found that once I could actually focus on something, my eyes were watering like there's no tomorrow! Just terribly! I took plenty of tissues with me, but geez, what a pain.

Just reading about the Moo-thru put a buncha pounds on me, TBG. I do hope there's a mint-chocolate-chip in the list of choices, as one moos thru.

Brag, I've been following your commentary about extricating the miners with heightened interest. I, too, am faxing only the most excellent karma in their direction.

Posted by: ftb3 | October 11, 2010 1:36 PM | Report abuse

Maybe I should be the one to rant about "genocidal explorers" today...

http://www.americanchronicle.com/articles/view/82946

Posted by: -TBG- | October 11, 2010 1:48 PM | Report abuse

So we should just stick with the established Eurocentric narrative where a geographically naive bumbler was kind enough to bring to the Western Hemisphere the benefits of Christianity and measles?

Posted by: yellojkt | October 11, 2010 1:58 PM | Report abuse

And guns, too, yello!

Posted by: -TBG- | October 11, 2010 2:01 PM | Report abuse

I still hold that the Portuguese knew a lot more about what lay west of the Azores than they let on at Tordesillas. Columbus just had a big mouth. Besides, he was working for the Spanish. It's not like Italy got anything out of the deal except bragging rights.

Posted by: yellojkt | October 11, 2010 2:07 PM | Report abuse

And horses, since the people who really discovered the Western Hemisphere went and killed off all the original megafauna. Well, except for bison.

Posted by: yellojkt | October 11, 2010 2:14 PM | Report abuse

Now come on. This isn't an either/or thing. As I said, the traditional view is a fairy tale. The point is that human history has always been a messy amalgamation of generosity and greed, hatreds and loyalties, opportunism and idealism. The history of Europeans in the Americas A half of a millennium of profoundly complex interaction cannot be reduced to a simple morality story of evil Europeans and pristine innocents. (Which always manages to bring up the that largely fictitious story of the smallpox and the blankets.) To do so, I assert, does nobody any good.

Further, why make a fetish out of Columbus accidentally hitting the Caribbean as being some original sin? The notion that if he had just minded his own business then the Americas would have forever remained an unspoiled paradise is silly. The only way this would have happened if is the world would have remained frozen in those happy days of the middle ages, when Men were Men and Women were Chattel.

Posted by: RD_Padouk | October 11, 2010 2:15 PM | Report abuse

Here's one non-rant take on Columbus Day:
http://www.theamericanscholar.org/what-columbus-day-really-means/

Posted by: cowhand214 | October 11, 2010 2:18 PM | Report abuse

Not just guns. Metal blades--knives, swords, etc. Stone weapons weren't competitive against steel.

Vasco da Gama's journey to India eclipsed Columbus's voyages as a feat of navigation.

Posted by: DaveoftheCoonties | October 11, 2010 2:18 PM | Report abuse

Neat link, TBG. Byzanjtine. Hmm.

Lately I have been thinking we in the U.S. maybe shouldn't identify with the Roman (western) empire so much. Because the Eastern empire lasted a lot longer... the result of Byzantine bureaucracies & regulations, no doubt.

Posted by: Jumper1 | October 11, 2010 2:20 PM | Report abuse

Daniel Jantzen once pointed out that a Costa Rican tree's fruits are dispersed mostly by horses, which gulp them down and drop the seeds later on. He figured the tree must have had a hard time in the interval between disappearance of the American megafauna and the arrival of European horses.

Posted by: DaveoftheCoonties | October 11, 2010 2:21 PM | Report abuse

Correction: that's Daniel Janzen, no "t". I should never, ever mention names without checking.

Posted by: DaveoftheCoonties | October 11, 2010 2:23 PM | Report abuse

RD,
I completely agree with you. In my much earlier unwritten rant, I was to point out that Columbus and his effect on both hemispheres is highly nuanced. America would have been 'discovered' one way or another. The overall course of the Age of Discovery is unlikely to have been changed. Some idiot was bound to sail into land sooner or later. The Americas are tough to miss.

However, Columbus himself died in disgrace for being a far worse colonial administrator than he was navigator, which he arguably wasn't much good at either.

I find myself amused that the current politically correct revisionism is most vehemently renounced by the people of a nation-state that wouldn't exist for another 400 years after Columbus's discovery out of some sort of misplaced nationalist pride.

Imagine if the Irish were to get upset over people pointing out that Saint Patrick was actually Scottish because it would take away their right to get stereotypically drunken and belligerent on his feast day.

Posted by: yellojkt | October 11, 2010 2:34 PM | Report abuse

There's a recent book, The Grand Strategy of the Byzantine Empire by Edward Luttwak, explaining how the Empire persisted as enemies came and went.

I recall a book review noting that the Byzantines kept their enemies weak rather than destroying them, on the logic that an empty niche would soon be filled by a new enemy, possibly worse than the vanquished one.

Posted by: DaveoftheCoonties | October 11, 2010 2:34 PM | Report abuse

Great picture, ebtnut. Superb modeling. Almost looks like a real train!

:-D

Posted by: Bob-S | October 11, 2010 3:03 PM | Report abuse

Don't I recall that the natives gave the Europeans syphilis? That was a fair trade, I suppose.

Posted by: slyness | October 11, 2010 3:18 PM | Report abuse

Don't forget tobacco, slyness.

Posted by: yellojkt | October 11, 2010 3:23 PM | Report abuse

I agree that Columbus is more a tragic figure than a heroic one. But that a really confused Italian can make his mark on history purely by chance should be an inspiration to us all.

And let me stress that I'm not attempting to be any kind of apologist for the horrific things that have happened to those who got to America first. It just, for me, comes down to this:

Human history can be largely explained by predatory behavior. Brutal horrific wars of conquest and the systematic cruel subjugation of weaker populations have been the norm, up to the present day. And unintended consequences have always haunted us.

Europeans have fought Europeans, Africans have fought Africans, Native Americans have fought Native Americans, and Asians have fought Asians since the first proto-human picked up that rock.

With a few notable exceptions, all human civilizations have been warlike and mean. And the powerful have always been pretty bad to the weak.

What is significant about what happened in the Americas, and many other places around the world, is that a vastly more powerful civilization encountered a weaker one. It isn't, I assert, that the indigenous population was any more peaceful, or more philosophically virtuous, it's just that they were weaker. (Indeed, various factions of indigenous peoples have always been quite willing to sell each other out.)

So, yes, of course, the bad things that happened after Europeans came to America were certainly bad. But they really weren't morally or ethically unique in their underlying motivation, just their execution.

So, for me, the real challenge is to attempt to change the paradigm. To make use of the centuries of philosophical and ethical thought that have passed since Columbus, and see if, maybe, just maybe, we might be able to do a little bit better in the future.

This, to me, is a worthwhile goal of Columbus Day.


Posted by: RD_Padouk | October 11, 2010 3:31 PM | Report abuse

Good column by EJ today:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/10/10/AR2010101003045.html?hpid=opinionsbox1

Thanks, cowhand, for the link to the origins of Columbus Day. I had no idea. This is probably the first time in my working life that I have gotten the day off, so have never thought much about it (although I am sympathetic to the Native American point of view).

Posted by: seasea1 | October 11, 2010 3:47 PM | Report abuse

That's quite a strawman you've built there RD. I don't know of anybody touting pre-Columbian America as a pastoral Eden. The Aztecs were brutal beyond even European Inquisition-era standards. I have a hard time 'celebrating' any event which deliberately or inadvertently destroys 90% of a population.

I'm guess I'm also just a little bitter because as someone who has lived primarily in the South and hasn't worked for the federal gummint, I have never, ever had Columbus Day off as a paid holiday. And don't get me started on Lee-Jackson Day.

Posted by: yellojkt | October 11, 2010 3:54 PM | Report abuse

Yello - have you not *seen* Pocahontas?

Posted by: RD_Padouk | October 11, 2010 3:56 PM | Report abuse

RD's eloquently stated thinking on the meaning of Columbus Day serves very well as a reflection on the value of other vestiges of our past that we might rather forget. One of the good things about the periodic fuss over Maryland's appalling pro-Confederacy state song is that it reminds Marylanders that our state was not clean of the stain of human enslavement. Maryland stayed in the Union only at gunpoint (actually, cannon-point). There can be no easy assumption of a history of highly moral forebears. We do better to be reminded that virtue is something to strive for, not something innate. Virginians have deprived themselves of this lesson, by repudiating their own awful state song. They should have stuck with it as a reminder of unpleasant truths. The unpleasant truths are the only ones that teach us anything.

Posted by: ScienceTim | October 11, 2010 3:57 PM | Report abuse

And let me thank cowhand for that amazing article about the origins of Columbus Day.

Posted by: RD_Padouk | October 11, 2010 3:58 PM | Report abuse

Good afternoon, all.

A busy - er, what day is it again?
I have no idea.

Oh right - Happy Thanksgiving, Cauckistanis, and er, it's Columbus Day.
My place of employment chose some years ago to have today as a regular work day, and to give us the Friday after Thanksgiving off instead.

A reasonable trade, I suppose. But on a day as lovely and warm as this, I wonder...

Congrats to LiT on administering another sound defeat to the rest of us in the Battle for the Tiara. Enjoy it. Again.

As far as a Jupiter effect goes, I need not of any further changes brought on my an object in the sky. I get sunburns and then there's the whole, er, howling issue I have once a month (Lycanthropy bites. Trust me on this.).

But what like effect would Jupiter have on people?

Discuss. (And please Brett Farve's reputed amateur photographic self-portrait out of it. Thank you.)

bc

Posted by: -bc- | October 11, 2010 3:59 PM | Report abuse

Also, yello, point to any really significant new discovery that hasn't had very bad unintended consequences. Watt - Industrial Revolution - Child Labor - Climate Change.

Damn those machines.

Posted by: RD_Padouk | October 11, 2010 4:01 PM | Report abuse

I can cite at least one person who touted to me the idyllic and Edenic pre-Columbian world, in which all evil came from Europeans -- in fact, specifically from Columbus' crew, every one of whom was a convicted murderer or other hardened criminal awaiting execution (guess there must have been a backlog at the gallows), who introduced scalping in order to acquire bounties (paid by whom, I wonder), who raped and pillaged and introduced every communicable disease that ever existed, and so forth. So, the population of people who believe such things is non-zero. I cannot say whether it extends out of the single digits.

Posted by: ScienceTim | October 11, 2010 4:02 PM | Report abuse

Apparently (according to FB, anyway), there's also a non-zero population that believes it would be good to have more people like John Wayne (not just the actor, the person) around. Even Marion's Wiki bio shows how silly that idea is. *SIGH*

Posted by: Scottynuke | October 11, 2010 4:15 PM | Report abuse

SciTim,
I'm sorry to hear of your acquaintance with someone completely oblivious to any known historical record. People who approach the social sciences with that much pre-determined narrative are tough to reason with. Much like the variety of Tea Partiers who insist on putting an evangelical Christian veneer on the established writings of our Founding Fathers.

RD,
I understand that Disney films aren't particularly accurate with respect to feudal China either. Not to mention the works of Victor Hugo. I'd suggest not using them as secondary sources for any term papers.

cowhand,
That was a fascinating article. American history is an amazing chronicle of how to assimilate successive waves of immigrants; legal, illegal, and conquering. So the holiday was conceived as some way of placating both Native- and Italian-Americans. As the current debate over the holiday shows, it's tough to please everybody.

Posted by: yellojkt | October 11, 2010 4:23 PM | Report abuse

I'm kinda okay with the Industrial Revolution, and not just because I am employed in an industry with a direct lineage to Watt and crew. Children had always labored, just in fields and not in factories. The inequities of the early nineteenth century eventually swung the pendulum way the other way. I submit my own child as evidence of how much better kids have gotten it, laborwise, in the long run.

Posted by: yellojkt | October 11, 2010 4:34 PM | Report abuse

But you've just made my point Yello. You can't just look at one set of repercussion of a historical event and conclude that the event is therefore worthy of being celebrated or not. Many good things came from the voyages of Columbus as well. History is messy.

Posted by: RD_Padouk | October 11, 2010 4:44 PM | Report abuse

Speaking of people with pre-determined historical narratives, this article on Professor Beck is pretty spot on:

http://www.theawl.com/2010/10/glenn-beck-as-americas-professor

And fairly apropos to this afternoon's conversation.

Posted by: yellojkt | October 11, 2010 4:48 PM | Report abuse

Let's just say that the people who migrated to the Western Hemisphere after 1492, particularly if they did so voluntarily, have fared much better than those who arrived before then.

Posted by: yellojkt | October 11, 2010 4:55 PM | Report abuse

Also, to "celebrate" Columbus Day doesn't necessarily mean throwing a big party. It means commemorating this event and what it means. Which sorta comes back to my original point, and the one I am going to leave with.

History deserves more than a simplistic moralistic fairy tale. It is complex, messy, and difficult to interpret. Sometimes the meaning of something that happened long ago is what individuals seek to take from it today.

Posted by: RD_Padouk | October 11, 2010 5:07 PM | Report abuse

I'm having eggplant Parmesan. Does that count?

Posted by: Jumper1 | October 11, 2010 5:11 PM | Report abuse

With respect to the New World, what steel weapons didn't do to the indigenous populations, disease did. We don't have good documentation on the great epidemics, but some historians have put forth very high estimates of the Americas' original populations. Also for Hawai'i. "Before the Horror: the population of Hawai'i on the eve of western contact" by David E. Stannard gives insight into what must have happened in the Caribbean after Columbus's arrival.

For Glenn Beck, today's New Yorker has Sean Wilentz's "Confounding Fathers: the Tea Party's Cold War roots". Quite a job.
http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2010/10/18/101018fa_fact_wilentz

But not to worry, the new Republican House will pass a resolution acknowledging the states' right of nullification.

Posted by: DaveoftheCoonties | October 11, 2010 5:17 PM | Report abuse

Yello, we can say that, but how about we add in "the descendants of" before "the people." Which is what you meant, I know, but it matters in the reasoning, since one of those troubling simplifications is the identification of current people with their ancestors -- or at least some of their ancestors.

Posted by: -bia- | October 11, 2010 5:18 PM | Report abuse

I had no idea of the history either until I read that article this morning. It really was rather interesting. I had certainly heard of the incident at Wounded Knee but I never read anything before about the thing down in New Orleans. Interesting stuff.

Glad others enjoyed it.

Posted by: cowhand214 | October 11, 2010 5:18 PM | Report abuse

I think that one of the things that has disturbed me the most as I have aged is the disappointment I feel that despite the bazillions of years of evolutionary development, the ages of wonderful music and mathematical theory of several hundreds of years ago, the industrial revolution and its attendant automobiles, washing machines and dryers, dishwashers, stoves, refrigerators and, of course, computers of today -- the disappointment I feel is that despite all of that, we really haven't emerged all that far from the cave mentality.

Oh, sure, there are those of us who have (sorta), but those who were not read to as infants and toddlers and who have no idea or (alas) interest in the written word, those who evince no curiosity about things they cannot fathom -- that their first instinct is to cringe in fear and if they could, their first move would be to kill "it" -- that the absoluteness of various religions is enough to buffer them for a short while, but does not really protect them from their fear. . . .

It is what I *don't* know that intrigues me. As I'm getting through "Petals of Blood" I do completely understand why its author was incarcerated for this book. And it amazes me that those who do not read, and who think that reading for pleasure is an elitist activity, do not have a clue about how very powerful the written word is (okay, "written" in dead tree version or electronically). And that is what is exciting. At least to me.

So, let's get on to the important issues of today -- LiT, did you pick the Lions to get your weekly tiara? Forgive me, but I really am still giddy.

Posted by: ftb3 | October 11, 2010 5:22 PM | Report abuse

A substantial portion of the whites arriving in colonial Virginia seem to have been indentured servants who usually died before their indentures were up.

Book alert: Arctic Sanctuary: Images of the Arctic National Wildlife Refuge

http://www.press.uchicago.edu/presssite/metadata.epl?mode=synopsis&bookkey=10387566


Posted by: DaveoftheCoonties | October 11, 2010 5:23 PM | Report abuse

I never though of Columbus Day as celebrating anything other than cheaper mattresses and TV sets.

Posted by: -TBG- | October 11, 2010 5:35 PM | Report abuse

ftb, I did. One of the few favorites I chose. Jacksonville, Washington, Chicago NYG, Tenn and Philly were my upsets yesterday that paid off. But I'm with you, very exciting day in football.

Posted by: LostInThought | October 11, 2010 5:42 PM | Report abuse

Randy Newman discusses Columbus Day:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ua0pR06pevU

Posted by: -pj- | October 11, 2010 6:05 PM | Report abuse

I see that Joan Sutherland has passed. While I hardly qualify as much of an opera buff, I am a child of a time when Sunday broadcasts of various classical performances were steady television fare, and knew her well enough to recognize her.

Posted by: Bob-S | October 11, 2010 6:15 PM | Report abuse

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Knights_of_columbus
These folks might disagree with you, TBG.

I have a hypothesis that the phenomenon of idealizing the (somewhat fictitious) life of the pre-Columbian Indians is related to the idealizing of the (somewhat fictitious) earlier forms of U.S. government. It may be related to idealizing one's own childhood. Such a simpler time it all was.

Posted by: Jumper1 | October 11, 2010 6:30 PM | Report abuse

(That was a little creepy. I wasn't finished with that comment)

... knew her well enough to recognize her great talent, to have enjoyed a number of her performances, and to be saddened by her passing.

(clapping, and tossing roses in her direction)

Posted by: Bob-S | October 11, 2010 6:31 PM | Report abuse

Jumper - I have an even-more-simplified hypothesis which has vastly greater amounts of anecdotal evidential support: "Love is letting go of fear."

Peeps who are not fearful celebrate all the many aspects of their heritage(s) joyfully, inclusively, and mindful of the negative crap that's part of everybody's journey.

Fearful folk do it differently.

Posted by: Bob-S | October 11, 2010 6:42 PM | Report abuse

Jumper - In other words, I completely agree with you, and it's a mundane manifestation of an age-old disease.

Posted by: Bob-S | October 11, 2010 6:49 PM | Report abuse

"Seeing a pompous and lavish burial of a member of the Politburo, Rabinovich sadly shakes his head: 'What a waste! I could have buried the whole Politburo with this kind of money!'"

from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_jokes

Posted by: Jumper1 | October 11, 2010 6:52 PM | Report abuse

There's the very good question of what Columbus day is supposed to commemorate, anyway. The discovery of the New World? Arguable.

This has nothing to do with Columbus as much as how we want to record and commemorate history as specific to places, times, and people.

That said, I had to read Columbus' diary of his voyages for American Literature, and I wasn't very enthused by his accounts, including enslaving and bringing back natives as curios for the monarchs of Spain.

Do we commemorate Columbus day by discussing the complexities of bloodstained history? Or do we simply close the banks and have big dinners across the border in Canada?

Or do we ignore Columbus day altogether, deciding the historical significance accorded to it is rather akin to dating Rome's existence from April 21, 752 BC?

In my case, we had a dinner for our canadian relatives a couple years soon after we buried my grandma. This happened on Canadian Thanksgiving aka Columbus day.

Most of us had some indigenous blood as well as the corruptible European blood. Some of our European ancestors came here before Jamestown, even. That's the only meaningful Columbus day I can recall.

Quebec has been settled for 402 years now. Jamestown, 403 years.

Plymouth rock will not celebrate its 400th anniversary for 10 more years. Willamsburg will not turn 400 for 22 more years.

Rome has been in existence for 2,762 years, give or take a few.
The earliest signs of permanent habitation in Paris (formerly Lyceum to the Romans) are 6300 years old.

The Na-Dene people entered North America around 8000 BCE and settled the Pacific Northwest and migrated along the coast to Alaska and North Canada.
The Mississippian culture had its civilized heyday around 1200-1650 CE.

I merely mention this to compare civilizations on both continents.

Also, latitude-wise, Paris is more north than Quebec, and Rome is only slightly south of Boston and slightly north of Chicago, Illinois.

Washington, DC is south of Ankara, Turkey and Caligari, Italy. San Francisco is more south than Athens, Greece.

Phoenix, AZ is more south than Islamabad, Pakistan. New Orleans is more south than Cairo, Egypt.

Tampa, Florida is more south than New Delhi or the Canary Islands. Miami is more south than Guwahati, Assam (India).

Key west is more south than Taipei, Taiwan or Ridyah (Saudi Arabia)

Honolulu is more south than Mecca or Hong Kong.

Now, Columbus didn't discover all of that. He just ran into some islands in the Caribbean, rather than the mainland of North America itself.


Europe benefits from the gulf currents warming it to habitable levels.

Posted by: Wilbrod_Gnome | October 11, 2010 7:00 PM | Report abuse

Jumper- I laughed out [...] loud.

Posted by: Bob-S | October 11, 2010 7:06 PM | Report abuse

Bob, even as a lad I had to figure that if Joan Sutherland was big enough for Robin Williams to skewer ("And now -- Joan Sutherland sings Rod Stewart!") then she was alright. RIP Joan...

Posted by: Scottynuke | October 11, 2010 7:11 PM | Report abuse

I believe Jared Diamond's "Guns, Germs, and Steel" included climatological studies in his discussion, Wilbrod. I haven't read that book in years. I need to go back and look at it again. I recall being very impressed with it.

Posted by: -pj- | October 11, 2010 7:12 PM | Report abuse

Whatever point Wilbrod was making, I agree wholeheartedly! Anybody who doesn't is an ignorant, belligerent (and probably mean-spirited) clod not fit for polite society.

Posted by: Bob-S | October 11, 2010 7:13 PM | Report abuse

And let us not forget that in Minnesota it is Leif Eriksson Day. Frosti would let us know that, too, I bet.

I thought Joan Sutherland was into her 90s, so she was (relatively speaking) younger than I thought. I had mixed feelings about her. Her singing was masterful, but it is my understanding (without a lot of more recent diggings into it) that as far as Australia was concerned she was a bit of a right-wing zealot, wanting to keep immigration (especially of those of a different feather) at zero. Not entirely too sure of that, so do take with grain of salt.

I love it when Kristen Chenoweth sings opera. Man, can that woman sing -- anything!

Posted by: ftb3 | October 11, 2010 7:24 PM | Report abuse

Jumper, when I was in the revolution reenactment biz, there was a blossoming of younguns that took to portraying the natives. I'd like to think it had something to do with cultural whatnot, but I think it boiled down to a couple of prime reasons: they got to smoke native herbs, and chicks dug them.

Posted by: baldinho | October 11, 2010 7:25 PM | Report abuse

Oh. Ow. I have just begun reading Tom Shroder's article from the Oct 3 WaPo magazine and have encountered a howlingly bad copy-editing error at the beginning of paragraph 13. Am I late to the party? Did anyone else comment upon it?

Posted by: ScienceTim | October 11, 2010 7:35 PM | Report abuse

Thanksgiving supper is done and I ate too much. Cooked the entire meal by myself, but since it was me, stuffing from a box, gravy from a mix, along with turkey, baked potatoes, rice, corn, asparagus, rolls and a little left over scalloped potatoes (store bought), store bought cake for dessert. Despite my lake of culinary skills everything was very good - those little pop up timers in the turkey are a great invention.

Sorry Yoki, hope you do not bang your head on the wall too much.

I do not have anything to add on Columbus minor figure in history here.

Great day with the family went to get pumpkins and just hung out.

Posted by: dmd3 | October 11, 2010 7:39 PM | Report abuse

I'm sure dinner was wonderful, dmd! Happy T'giving to you and the whole family!

But I have to ask: Why did you cook today?

Posted by: -TBG- | October 11, 2010 8:22 PM | Report abuse

Now that I've had a chance to think this through, I believe there are two distinct questions. First, are the voyages of Columbus something to celebrate or something to mourn? Second, what is meant by Columbus Day?

I've said quite enough about the first.

Regarding the second, I think TBG said it quite well.

It's a day for Mattress Sales.

By which is meant that a holiday is what we make of it. Like all holidays, I don't think anyone gets to dictate to you what it means or what it doesn't mean. It's a day off for many. It's a day for shopping. It's a day to make Italian food. It's a day for kids to put on silly skits where they look through telescopes made of cardboard and say "Sail On." And, if you wish to view it as a day of mourning for indigenous peoples, that's your prerogative.

Posted by: RD_Padouk | October 11, 2010 8:22 PM | Report abuse

Not sure why I cooked today TBG, I seem to be the go to person for roasts, last night roast beef, today the turkey - could have something to do with it being very difficult to screw up roasting something!

Posted by: dmd3 | October 11, 2010 8:29 PM | Report abuse

This post on Apartment Therapy (and the ensuing comment thread) reminds me of MoftheMountain's new kitchen and the 1970s magazine pictures they found plastered to the wall under the latest wallpaper.

http://www.apartmenttherapy.com/la/inspiration/no-wallpaper-try-these-items-129196

Posted by: -TBG- | October 11, 2010 8:32 PM | Report abuse

If he was such a good sailor, how did he end up in Ohio?

Posted by: baldinho | October 11, 2010 8:55 PM | Report abuse

A most profound query, baldinho.

Posted by: RD_Padouk | October 11, 2010 9:00 PM | Report abuse

Stop it, baldo. This is serious business!

:-)

Posted by: Bob-S | October 11, 2010 9:00 PM | Report abuse

I think he also made it to Georgia, baldinho. Maybe he took an overland route looking for the Northwest Passage.

Posted by: -pj- | October 11, 2010 9:04 PM | Report abuse

Soviet-era joke told to me by a Russian circa 1971.

Stalin takes his old mother to see his new dacha. She admires the large house, the fine plate and linens, comfortable furniture and various objets d'art, and then looks up at him in dismay and says, "But Joe, what if the Communists come back into power?!"

Posted by: Yoki | October 11, 2010 9:06 PM | Report abuse

Soviet-era joke told to me by the same Russian, of pre-Soviet hardship.

What did the peasant say to her son when they came across a dead dog in the middle of the cart track? "At least this year we'll eat."

Posted by: Yoki | October 11, 2010 9:14 PM | Report abuse

While the Chilean miners are getting plenty of empathy/sympathy/support as it is, think how much bigger a deal this could be if they had something cuter than grizzled miners down there.

I understand that it would be difficult to justify hauling a baby down for each shift, but surely they could have a mascot puppy or kitten? A cage of canaries would be endearing, and traditional.

Posted by: Bob-S | October 11, 2010 9:15 PM | Report abuse

Admirable goal, Bob. Kinda tough to put that in after the fact, though. Maybe there's an eyeless newt or some such critter down there that they could adopt as a mascot. Assuming they didn't eat it, of course.

Posted by: -pj- | October 11, 2010 9:21 PM | Report abuse

Admirable goal, Bob. Kinda tough to put that in after the fact, though. Maybe there's an eyeless newt or some such critter down there that they could adopt as a mascot. Assuming they didn't eat it, of course.

Posted by: -pj- | October 11, 2010 9:23 PM | Report abuse

Arrrrghhhhh, damned Moveable Type.

Posted by: -pj- | October 11, 2010 9:24 PM | Report abuse

Well, there you are, Yoki. I was beginning to worry.

Tim, I scoured paragraph 13 and couldn't find anything. Could they have fixed it? What did you spot? (I think the Two Buck Chuck is $2.99 at Trader Joe's but I'm not sure. If it was me, I'd make it Two-Buck Chuck.)

Posted by: Curmudgeon5 | October 11, 2010 9:26 PM | Report abuse

'mudge! I'm awfully glad to see you. Welcome home.

Posted by: Yoki | October 11, 2010 9:28 PM | Report abuse

Christopher Columbus is famous as the last person to discover America.

Posted by: Jumper1 | October 11, 2010 9:32 PM | Report abuse

RD,

You insist on being so reasonable and logical, but when you say it's not about ethnicity, I have to disagree. Both jumper's and cowhand's links point to the cult of Columbus having nationalistic and/or religious origins.

Not to go on a rant (and I wasn't going to but somebody had to poke that somnolent canine), but let's review what we've learned today. The Americas were bound to be found by Europeans eventually and since they were on the upper side of the technological curve they were destined to nearly exterminate two continents. While some chalk that up to a hiccup on the March of Progress, others might consider it a epic tragedy indicative of the moral bankruptcy of seventeenth century Western civilization. And while life everywhere at that time was full of Hobbesian adjectives, as soon as the conquistadors saw precious metals, the aboriginal inhabitants got the short end of a rather sharp stick.

Since the outcome was foregone, my description of it as Genocidal Explorer Appreciation Day is more descriptive and subtly ironic. And it would at least open up the ambiguity of the event it commemorates.

And while treating Columbus Day as a day of contemplation over the vagaries of colonization would be a great idea, we don't have the Judaic day of atonement tradition on our civic calendar. Rather than as some sort of intellectual enterprise, the holiday was invented to appease the violent tendencies of Italian immigrants. Indeed, where it is observed as all, it is treated as Guido Pride Day. It's a wonder the cast of Jersey Shore aren't the grand marshal over every parade in the country.

All this is to stroke the fragile egos of an ethnic group whose lasting cultural contribution has been being the milieu for the oeuvres of Francis Ford Coppola and Martin Scorcese. They haven't even produced a president, which puts them behind the scions of Irish rumrunners and Kenyan goatherders.

I modestly propose that we take away Columbus Day and give it to a more deserving nationality by making the day after St. Patrick's Day a federal holiday. And if you don't understand why the day afterward, you haven't been celebrating it right.

So rather than honor some itinerant naval carpetbagger, perhaps we give up on the pretense of creating arbitrary holidays for ambiguously significant figures and just give people a few more days off because we need and deserve it. And we need an excuse to go shopping for mattresses and TV sets.

But that's just my opinion, I could be wrong.

Posted by: yellojkt | October 11, 2010 9:35 PM | Report abuse

Should there be commas around 'of course' in the first sentence? Too many uses of the word 'had' in the second sentence? Not sure about that, though. I work for the government and we live for the passive voice.

Posted by: -pj- | October 11, 2010 9:39 PM | Report abuse

Well, ya gotta like the first play of MNF, Randy Moss throwing a pass to Brett Farve.

I don't know if it's going to help, since it was called back on a penalty.

As has been noted, Columbus Day is a curious thing. RD notes that history is messy, and it's clear that perceptions of what humans of any given group think or believe happened and the results of those events does indeed change over time and depend on context and perspective.

In this case, the initiation of contact between European and Native American civilizations, and the expansion of European empires to the Americas is certainly worthy of note, though a Columbus Day holiday is a debateable topic.

And even that debate seems to have changed over the years.

For me, I celebrate an Italian-American holiday every day I get up and see myself in the mirror.

Well, most days, anyway.

bc

Posted by: -bc- | October 11, 2010 9:51 PM | Report abuse

Ye who slur carelessly upon the persons of "itinerant naval carpetbaggers" best tread very, very, very carefully.

I'm just sayin', is all.

Posted by: Curmudgeon5 | October 11, 2010 9:51 PM | Report abuse

Bob S, I wouldn't go that far. I just wanted to throw in some random facts for newer historical perspective.

Sheesh, Columbus sailed 518 years ago now. The Western Roman Empire didn't last that long before it collapsed(503 years), nor did the Roman Republic before then (482 years.)

Come to think of it, the longest-surviving political system-- the Byzantine empire collapsed just 39 years before Columbus sailed.

518 years before Columbus-- 974 AD, the political map of Europe was like this:

The Kurds ruled Armenia.
First Turkish sultanate had just been established.
Lions had just became extinct in Europe, too, the last one dying in the Caucasus.
Reindeer had just became extinct in Scotland.
Vikings had just settled Normandy.
Swedish influence extends to the Black sea.
Kievan Rus' (Mediveal Rus) under Vladmir I was trying to invade other areas.
Basil II had just begun ruling the Eastern Roman Empire.
Otto I (Frankish), the first Holy Roman Emperor, had just kicked Maygar butt 20 years before-- the Maygar problem was large then. Otto I had also married the dowager queen of Italy and been crowned 10 years before.

Lief Erikkson, son of Eric the Red, was already four years old. In 1002-3 AD he and his crew explored and tried to settle Costal Canada.

In the Americas:
Lowland Maya civilization collapsed.
Mississippian culture began.
Earliest evidence of lost-wax casting in mexico.

Elsewhere:
Avicenna, the greatest mediveal physican and philosopher (Iranian) wasn't even born yet-- 980.
The Western Chalukya empire was re-established and ruling SE India.
Emperor Taizu of Song, who founded the Song Dynasty in China, would rule until 976.

Hops were also first mentioned in connection to beer brewing in the 10th century.
Chinese invent fire arrows-- gunpowder. This wouldn't spread to Europe for a while.

Here's my homage to Columbus Day. Hooray for history.

Posted by: Wilbrod_Gnome | October 11, 2010 10:00 PM | Report abuse

Well, there's nothing wrong with "October Bank Holiday". Not everything needs to be about something.

Posted by: Bob-S | October 11, 2010 10:05 PM | Report abuse

The only people I've ever heard investing much meaning into "Columbus Day" weren't much fun to be around.

There was a small group of us (it was still small but much larger the second year that we did it) at and around Georgia Tech who insisted upon celebrating "Colobus Day", and dressing & acting appropriately. It wasn't pretty and it wasn't especially edifying. But it amused us.

Posted by: Bob-S | October 11, 2010 10:21 PM | Report abuse

mudge,
Wise advice I will heed. I wiki'ed Vasco da Gama today and while I was impressed with his sailing, it did seem fairly foolhardy to annoy your host enough to have leave under the dead of night during monsoon season. That little faux pas cost him two ships and half his crew.

It also was a significant moment in the history of European hubris. They were practically laughed out of the kingdom for not bringing enough cash.

Posted by: yellojkt | October 11, 2010 10:46 PM | Report abuse

Not sure if I have mentioned the Leon Russell/Elton John collaboration. Their album The Union comes out on the 19th - NPR is streaming it here:
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=130376600&ft=1&f=1039

For those of you who get The Fuse channel, their concert from the Beacon Theater will be broadcast live on Oct 19 - 8 pm. (Alas, I don't get that channel.)

Posted by: seasea1 | October 11, 2010 10:53 PM | Report abuse

I've never heard it called Michel Richard Citronelle, but I guess that is the official full name of the restaurant. Still on the to-do list.

Posted by: yellojkt | October 11, 2010 10:55 PM | Report abuse

Not pretty? Black-and-white colobus are pretty monkeys. The red colobus, I admit is somewhat more punky-looking.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Red_Colobus_monkey.jpeg

The western red colobus definitely quirky, not to mention a carrier of Ebola.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_Red_Colobus

Did you ever agree on which colobus to be?


Posted by: Wilbrod_Gnome | October 11, 2010 10:57 PM | Report abuse

I ate at Citronelle with two colleagues (on the firm's nickel, of course) in 2000 (?) and it was, simply, the best meal I've eaten in North America, with the exception of a steak frites at an obscure bistro in a small town on the shores of Lake Ontario, for which I still cannot account).

I hear that since my visit to MRC the service has run into very serious problems, and that is a problem for me. The essence of a truly fine restaurant is in the magic nexus of cuisine, design and service. When one falls, they all do.

This doesn't mean I'm a snob (though I may well be a snob for other reasons); I'm very happy at my local very good kebab or ramen house, but I don't hold them to the same standard as a $1000/3 meal.

Posted by: Yoki | October 11, 2010 11:07 PM | Report abuse

Major error in the penultimate paragraph. If Tom the Butcher is making sangria with Two Buck Chuck and fruit juice, I don't want an invite. Without some brandy or even gin, that stuff is just punch.

And while I always feel the sommelier is snickering at me, I've had enough Charles Shaw to know it's barely suitable for glass washing. They got good wines in Trader Joe's (at least in Virginia) but that ain't it.

Posted by: yellojkt | October 11, 2010 11:11 PM | Report abuse

Dennis Cathcart, whose Tropiflora nursery is in Sarasota, was in town today explaining how to care for bromeliads (day) and in the evening his nursery's role as a major plant supplier for Singapore's Gardens by the Bay:
http://www.gardensbythebay.org.sg/

Tropiflora airlifted some 200,000 plants to Singapore, even including some 20 foot baobabs. I would guess that one reason for becoming a supplier was that Tropiflora's bromeliads are probably the best-documented anywhere. A fair number will be descended from plants collected in the wild by Dennis.

The gardens project is almost unbelievable in its size and engineering sophistication, part of the Singapore government's efforts to create a "city in a garden."

The collapse of public financial support for American state universities makes me wonder how many American scientists and engineers might find work in Singapore.

Posted by: DaveoftheCoonties | October 11, 2010 11:41 PM | Report abuse

I shall leave high-end dining commentary to those with more experience than myself. Although I'll certainly agree that sangria without a touch of something more authoritative is wine punch.

Wilbrod, I'd guess that the "Colobus Day" goof-off would not have been your cup of tea. Dress of the day was some combination of black, gray, red, and/or white, with tufts of fur-like stuff wherever the spirit moved. The whole point of the exercise was to ridicule the tribalization & categorization that "Columbus Day" seems sometimes to represent, and that comes so naturally to some folks. All Colobuses & Sneetches, of whatever variety, were welcome.

Posted by: Bob-S | October 12, 2010 12:03 AM | Report abuse

That sounds good to me, really. I bet you do a mean colobus impression to this day.

Posted by: Wilbrod_Gnome | October 12, 2010 12:05 AM | Report abuse

No doubt. And it surely isn't as cute as it was a few decades ago.

Posted by: Bob-S | October 12, 2010 12:14 AM | Report abuse

Chacun a son gout.

Posted by: Wilbrod_Gnome | October 12, 2010 1:22 AM | Report abuse

Or podagra, depending on individual genetics.

Posted by: Yoki | October 12, 2010 1:27 AM | Report abuse

Yes, indeed.

Posted by: Wilbrod_Gnome | October 12, 2010 1:34 AM | Report abuse

Bob, that was probably more fun than celebrating Calibos Day.

Posted by: baldinho | October 12, 2010 6:05 AM | Report abuse

Bob, that was probably more fun than celebrating Calibos Day.

Posted by: baldinho | October 12, 2010 6:06 AM | Report abuse

Gut morninkzz, Boodlers!
Miners rescue still scheduled to commence at 00:00 (11PM ET). It could start earlier if concrete hardens earlier for the hoisting platform. The minutest shift in the position of the cable could make contact with the shaft and cause a break.

Brag :)

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 7:34 AM | Report abuse

'morning all. Bugs? I had a different outdoors problem this morning. Frost. Even though I had to know it was coming I still had to rummage through boxes and shelves to find a pair of gloves and a scraper. I guess that we wish it wouldn't come so we do not prepare for it.
I drove a student back to his college yesterday. The corn fields that had been harvested were covered with Canada geese, it was quite the sights. The sun was bringing the best colours from the woods in the Bois Francs (Hardwoods) region. Next time we'll be back there it will be bare and grey...
I'm following the rescue as well Brag. It's a very technical extraction, to say the least.

Posted by: shrieking_denizen | October 12, 2010 7:57 AM | Report abuse

Let's get those miners safe starting today.

Bob, I am inspired. From now on, I will celebrate Columbo day each year. All I need is the coat. I have a year to work on the mannerisms.

Let's hope there aren't any staff meetings next Columbo day. It could get dicey.

Posted by: baldinho | October 12, 2010 7:58 AM | Report abuse

Hi Brag, I appreciate all your updates on the miners. I have my fingers crossed for them.

Grey morning, going into work early but that means I get out early. Can't say I'm missing Randy Moss much...

Posted by: badsneakers | October 12, 2010 8:01 AM | Report abuse

"Just one more thing..."
***shuffles through raincoat absentmindedly***
[long rambling explanation of how the killer did what was shown in the opening scene]
"Sorry to bother you."

Posted by: yellojkt | October 12, 2010 8:06 AM | Report abuse

God loves us so much more than we can imagine through Him that died for all, Jesus Christ.


Good morning, friends. I see Target has plan for adults reading with children, but we don't have a store here. Perhaps I can contact them and see what their plan is about. I don't know where the closest one is, but can proabably find that on the computer. Sounds good if such a program is already worked out, all we have to do is participate.

JA, nice that you got to see the stars. I haven't look at the night sky in some time because I'm usually in by dark.

ftb, your comment on cave mentality sounds reasonable, and in most cases would apply. As to religion covering our fears or not, I think many of us retain a certain amount of fear, some more than others. Driving down the road yesterday from the doctor's office, I was talking to God, I do that when alone, out loud(please don't send for the truck) I confessed to God that I am fearful. If something is easy I will make it difficult with fear, anxiety, the works. It seems to be my nature to add to any situation, and it makes my whole body tense and I'm sure keep my blood pressure high. I pray for release of that fear.

In the water yesterday, fear took hold of me, but I pushed forward, wobbly and shakey but forward anyway. A couple of my grandchildren have inherited this fear, and I deeply regret that, yet I try to get them to try new things working beyond the fear, as I myself, try new things. It's not easy, yet after being in the water for awhile I didn't want to get out. Thursday will be better. And I found a swimsuit that fits, well my daughter did, I love it!

Have a wonderful day, folks, and love to all.

What did Brett Favre do?

Slyness, now if I can get somebody to teach me to swim. I can't hear a thing in the water, have to take the hearing-aid out and the glasses off, but still fun!

Posted by: cmyth4u | October 12, 2010 8:15 AM | Report abuse

The news last night had a computer graphic of the Chilean mineshaft rescue pod. It looks like they could turn it into a thrill ride afterwards. As long as you weren't claustrophobic.

Posted by: yellojkt | October 12, 2010 8:16 AM | Report abuse

May I just say I have nothing to say (of any consequence, anyway)?

Thank you.

*always-glad-for-a-short-work-week Grover waveS* :-)

Posted by: Scottynuke | October 12, 2010 8:18 AM | Report abuse

Casandra asked "What did Brett Favre do?"

You are better off not knowing. Trust me.

Posted by: yellojkt | October 12, 2010 8:21 AM | Report abuse

Did I see a headline about Brett Favre apologizing for being a distraction? I didn't read the story.

Nothing much to say here, either. I have developed a viral infection (a.k.a. a cold) currently centered in the back of my mouth. It has a tingly feeling and is creating snottiness. I'll be okay if it doesn't get any worse.

Onward into the day...

Posted by: slyness | October 12, 2010 8:42 AM | Report abuse

I actually don't know exactly what Favre did (besides being a serial retirer). There some things even I'm afraid to Google.

Posted by: yellojkt | October 12, 2010 8:53 AM | Report abuse

Slyness... love your description of your cold... hate the cold, though. Sorry you feel crummy.

I'm staying home today (trading my Friday off) because a crew is coming here to replace one of our window wells. It's a good thing we are such procrastinators about getting the basement fixed after the pipe-burst fiasco because that bad rain we had a couple of weeks ago cascaded into the (thankfully unfinished and empty) basement through the window well, which apparently has sunk nearly below surface outside.

They are going to replace the corrugated metal with a much higher piece, rebury the downspout on that side of the yard (using heavy PVC pipe) and re-grade the yard to slope away from the house again.

The guy told me they'd be bringing some cool equipment, so if any is nearby and wants to come watch, you're more than welcome. (Reminds me of the businessmen who line up to watch building construction downtown during lunch hour.)

Yannow... if I'd really wanted to spend a couple of thousands of dollars today I could have thought of a lot of great things to buy. A new window well would not have been in that list. (But I guess a dry basement would be, so never mind).

Posted by: -TBG- | October 12, 2010 8:56 AM | Report abuse

Good morning, y'all.

Warm muffins, coffee and OJ on the table.

We're having great fun at CasaJS this morning. Yesterday the intercom call-up box in the vestibule needed repair. After the repair guy left we discovered that the three-digit call-up numbers to all 60 units in the building got scrambled. Our old number now belongs to a woman upstairs and we have the number that used to belong to someone down the hall. Everyone coming to visit finds s/he's calling the wrong unit.

It's an amusing way to meet new people.

Posted by: MsJS | October 12, 2010 9:01 AM | Report abuse

Cassandra, wish I was closer to teach you to swim. Most important lesson is the most difficult - relax. I had a terrible fear of water when I was young - we had a pool but I would not go near it until I was 5 or 6.

If you can float easily (not everyone can) practise that first, learn to breath and float on your back, then get comfortable swimming, remember you can float! It is also easier to swim under water than on top but you must be comfortable first. If it is available try holding on to a floater board or similar device and work on kicking - with straight legs, from the thighs not the knees this will also help keep you afloat.

Most important have fun, work at a pace you are comfortable with but with gentle nudges to increase your competancy.

Really admiring you for overcoming your fear.

Posted by: dmd3 | October 12, 2010 9:03 AM | Report abuse

Good morning, Boodle.

9 question heads above the fold on the home page. The three dumbest:
1) Did anything happen yesterday?
2) Why should we tell you?
3) What do you think we are, a news disseminating organization?

"Telling" is soooo last century. In the 21st century newspapers ask questions, they don't bother answering them. A marketing genius told them to do this, so that their dying medium circles the drain a tad slower than it would otherwise, as editors ask themselves what they're doing wrong. I expect to see this hed in CJR any day now: "Can Question Headlines Save a Dying Newspaper Industry?"

And a poll reports that "people don't like government." Perhaps it would do well to ask how many screaming, government-hating pontificating glasshats like Limbaugh, Hannity, Beck, Palin, et al., have influenced this finding.

It was 63 degrees in our office this morning, has now risen to 66. They turn off all the heat during the 3-day weekend. So you'll be glad to know your tax dollars are being well spent, as hundreds of government workers huddle around trash cans with burning paper files in them. (But you don't like government, so what do you care, right? Let the poor b@st@rds shiver all morning.)

Ooops, just saw a new headline over a story I think I have to read: "Making a mess of sex on the airwaves" by Tom Shales. Perhaps it'll warm me up a bit. (But it does raise the question about where the WaPo headline writers were. I mean, this hed could have said, "Is TV making a mess of sex on the airwaves?" Or "Is TV sex messier than it is in real life?" Or "Do headlines about messy TV sex keep government workers warm while distracting them from their work? What's your opinion?"

Although it occurs to me I am almost certainly not watching the right TV shows.

Posted by: curmudgeon6 | October 12, 2010 9:30 AM | Report abuse

If you want a question, the last line of Shales column provides it:

"Where there is sex, there is confusion -- but why is it that media, instead of making any perceptible attempt to clear up some of that confusion, seem instead hellbent on compounding it?"

I'm confused what he is even asking.

One of my favorite shows is 'How I Met Your Mother' which is a fairly smutty show, but it is eclipsed by the follow-up shows 'Rules of Engagement' and 'Two And A Half Men'.

Last night's episode of RoE involved Patrick Warburton disappointing his wife's amorous advances because he kept taking matters into his own hands, so to speak. Let's just say that if he was in the Seinfeld Contest that episode would have been about 30 seconds long.

And then 2.5 Men had a running gag about Charlie Sheen's character ordering a 'quiet' hooker out of deference to the teenagers sleeping in the house. Turns out the hooker in question was deaf and she signed an offer for a particular sex act which Charlie understood and accepted. Who knew he could read ASL?

There wasn't much confusion about what all these jokes were about.

Posted by: yellojkt | October 12, 2010 9:48 AM | Report abuse

In last week's RoE, the Patrick Warburton character gave an old rug to his neighbors but mentioned that there may be some amorous stains on it. The neighbors were grossed out by this revelation and steam cleaned the rug but decided the only way to get the mental image out of their mind was to overlay some stains of their own.

Warburton then reclaimed the rug but was nonplussed when told of its current condition.

I think this episode was what Shales was thinking of when he said that sex on television (or in this case, on the carpet) was messy.

Posted by: yellojkt | October 12, 2010 9:58 AM | Report abuse

Pretty good, pretty interesting Anne Applebaum column with a lot of food for thought in it: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/10/11/AR2010101104271.html?hpid=opinionsbox1

Posted by: curmudgeon6 | October 12, 2010 10:01 AM | Report abuse

You can never have enough Grover.

http://www.thestar.com/entertainment/article/873840--old-spice-guy-gets-sesame-spoofed

Posted by: dmd3 | October 12, 2010 10:10 AM | Report abuse

Good morning all. Ya think they'll turn the cameras around for the miners, let them see the media circus before they step into it? Just telling them what's waiting for them doesn't seem sufficient, but showing them may be worse.

Posted by: LostInThought | October 12, 2010 10:13 AM | Report abuse

Good morning all. Ya think they'll turn the cameras around for the miners, let them see the media circus before they step into it? Just telling them what's waiting for them doesn't seem sufficient, but showing them may be worse.

Posted by: LostInThought | October 12, 2010 10:13 AM | Report abuse

yello... I love How I Met Your Mother but can't stand to watch those other two shows.

Posted by: -TBG- | October 12, 2010 10:20 AM | Report abuse

Miners meadia circus increasing. People keep arriving. Last night, an old lady arrived by wheel chair. Though she did not have press credentials, cops gave her a ride.

President Piñera is arriving at 6 PM local time. Prez Evo Morales of Bolivia is also arriving plus guests of the two prezes.

The whole thing is getting ceremonialized.

Media will be kept away from miners.

Three cameras will form a media pool and send out a satelite signal for the rest of the media to catch.

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 10:34 AM | Report abuse

Slyness

So sorry you're not feeling well. Maybe try some tea with lemon, it might help. I'm no authority on what's good for a cold. I made chicken soup for my daughter last week, not from scratch, because they had the cold bug too. I hope you feel better soon.

Posted by: cmyth4u | October 12, 2010 10:40 AM | Report abuse

I only DVR HIMYM, but if I'm home watching it 'live' I'm just too lazy to turn off the TV.

Somebody watches them. Charlie Sheen is the highest paid actor on television. Even the talentless kid makes several mill a year. And should the show be at least Two and Three-Quarters Men by now?

Posted by: yellojkt | October 12, 2010 10:42 AM | Report abuse

On 2.5M, Courtney Thorne-Smith has been guest-starring as an oversexed divorced MILF inexplicably attracted to Jon Cryer's character, but I think her run is over. Which is a shame. They kept coming up with creative plot devices to put her into lingerie. For those of us who remember her run on Melrose Place in the 90s, it's a little bittersweet to see her aging so gracefully.

Posted by: yellojkt | October 12, 2010 10:56 AM | Report abuse

Mudge, it was this line: "Kathy, a youthful brunette with a very casual and self-deprecating manner..." In the print magazine, it was "manor." I do not believe it is really possible for a manor to be casual, and self-deprecation is more a matter of decoration than architecture.

Posted by: ScienceTim | October 12, 2010 11:04 AM | Report abuse

Thanks, Cassandra! I *do* have tea and a lemon in the fridge, that's a good idea. I'm loading up on vitamin C right now.

Has that baby come yet? Did I miss it?

I also hope you keep enjoying the water therapy. Swimming is a great skill to acquire, at any age.

Just back from having my hair cut. Why is it that I HATE how every beautician drys my hair and wash it immediately upon getting home?

Posted by: slyness | October 12, 2010 11:05 AM | Report abuse

My grandmother loves 2.(7?)5 Men. She just laughs and laughs at it. I can't stand it, but then my tolerance for TV in general is pretty low.

lol, TBG, those are so much more suitable to the space than my magazine food, although the newspaper is starting to capture the busyness. I still have to pose the question: What do you do when you want to change your post-it or newspaper wallpaper? Wallpaper back over it? Then you're back to square one. That's truly been my problem. It's been Kilz-ed, but is still terribly uneven. Compound has helped some, but wow.

We decided to expose the chimney in the kitchen, but now we need a mason to clean it up and replug the stovepipe hole, since it clearly was never meant to be seen.

FYI, if anyone else has old plaster that's separated from the wall, Big Wally's Plaster Magic is amazing. We've fixed three big cracks so far, and they seem pretty solid.

Posted by: MoftheMountain | October 12, 2010 11:14 AM | Report abuse

Speaking of vitamin C, this question was one among those on the various shipboard trivia contests: Which part of the tomato has the most vitamion c: the skin, the meat, the seeds, or the jelly that surrounds the seeds? I got it right, only because I guessed the least likely answer. Yep, it's the jelly.

Thanks, Tim. "Manor." Jeez. Well, that's what happens when you lay off the copy editing staff.

Chile has two presidents? I know Bolivia has two capitals, but this is getting out of hand, even for a continent with two "--guays" in it.

Posted by: curmudgeon6 | October 12, 2010 11:14 AM | Report abuse

...peace on every planet among beings of good will...
<|: )

Posted by: RichNomore | October 12, 2010 11:14 AM | Report abuse

<|: )

Posted by: RichNomore | October 12, 2010 11:17 AM | Report abuse

A heat way is forecast for the left coast today. But first it is preceded by a lawn whiting frost. Covered the tomatoes last night.

Posted by: bh72 | October 12, 2010 11:29 AM | Report abuse

'e's a witch!

Posted by: -TBG- | October 12, 2010 11:30 AM | Report abuse

'e turned me into a newt!

I got better.

Posted by: yellojkt | October 12, 2010 11:33 AM | Report abuse

Evo Morales is prez of Bolivia. One of the miners is Bolivian-

Piñera is prez of Chile

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 11:33 AM | Report abuse

OK, so I realized I hadn't read the whole article after posting. The clear Draw-Tite primer is intriguing as a coating, but my gal used polyurethane or something like it, so it was slick and didn't sand well. I also have no idea what paste was used, but it's stuck tight in most places.

Oh, and I don't remember if I knew this when I discussed it before, but half the kitchen walls have lead paint under the decoupage, so sanding and scraping it off was not an option for us DIYers.

TBG, there was a second full-page avocado lurking behind the fridge, just about straight across from the first one. Must've been a big guacamole family.

Posted by: MoftheMountain | October 12, 2010 11:34 AM | Report abuse

Ah, thank you Brag. Always glad to know you've got my six.

How you doing down there? You seem happy and your usual perky self. Still writing? If I have my geography correct, you guys have Summer coming up soon, yes?

Posted by: curmudgeon6 | October 12, 2010 11:38 AM | Report abuse

The skink spraying made made its way to the west last night. At least it waited until after dinner. The airedale must have thought it was a squirrel and was right on its tail because he got it right in the mouth. Lots of foaming and rubbing the eyes. Gave him a warm water face shampoo and it seemed to do the trick. Was tolerable sleeping in the bedroom last night.

Posted by: bh72 | October 12, 2010 11:39 AM | Report abuse

I can't imagine who in West Virginia would vote for this guy...

From thinkprogress.org:

GOP Senate Nominee John Raese: ‘I Made My Money The Old-Fashioned Way: I Inherited It’

Yesterday, Raese appeared on the Matt Lewis show, a conservative talk radio program. When Lewis asked Raese about his background and his life experience, Raese offered this straight-faced response:

LEWIS: Tell us a little bit about you and your business experience and how you got here.

RAESE: I made my money the old-fashioned way, I inherited it. I think that’s a great thing to do. I hope more people in this country have that opportunity as soon as we abolish inheritance tax in this country, which is a key part of my program.

Listen here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gS4A5aR8hPA

[Me again: In 2009, the estate tax was limited to those inheriting more than $3.5 million. Next year, it returns to $1 million. I wonder how many West Virginians will be inheriting $1 million any time soon?]

Posted by: -TBG- | October 12, 2010 11:44 AM | Report abuse

Hiya Mudge, all well with me here, having a late winter. Still writing , had to junk new novel as something with 3 same premises already been pubbed.

Brag

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 11:44 AM | Report abuse

Hi. Walking pneumonia here but starting to get better. In my case, biking pneumonia? On the to-do list: make money and parent. Passive boodling here; will boodle more later.

Am ok.

Very much hope the miner tube escapes are smooth and as fast as possible. God bless the engineers, those stalwarts of force vectors, curve-fitting, plumb lines, drill bits. HUZZAH you Hectors of the Vectors, you Ajaxes of Adzes, You Wodins of Winches.... For you, I offer new pocket protectors in the color of choice but Talitha and I suggest something in a microfiber interfacing set-up, in Purple Heart purple shades.

Tubes: anybody here recall the vacuum tube document systems in some businesses? I think of the miners in such a setting but larger, darker, and more dangerous.

Posted by: CollegeQuaParkian1 | October 12, 2010 11:51 AM | Report abuse

Hiya Mudge.
I am well. Still writing. Had to dump latest novel as something similar been pubbed.

Should be spring here, but it feels more like is still winter.

Brag

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 11:53 AM | Report abuse

Makes me think of the movie Brazil, CqP. Hope you're feeling great soon, too.

Posted by: -TBG- | October 12, 2010 11:58 AM | Report abuse

I remember those tubes well CqP, I worked a summer in a bank back in the 70s. Titles, certificates and other documents were moved around in those tubes. The only thing remotely like this that remains is the money vacuums in some store. But they are one-way; the cashier rolls the bills in a can, puts the can in the tube and it gets sucked into the Machine. The modern version is a one way deal, nothing will return.

Posted by: shrieking_denizen | October 12, 2010 12:17 PM | Report abuse

I got an email this morning from my friend K...

"Are YOU TBG and am I "K"? Just wondering... seems like kind of a weird coincidence if not. If so, VERY exciting!!!! Thanks for the shout-out!"

She says a friend was looking online for coverage of the Komen 3-day and found my posts. Very cool!

Posted by: -TBG- | October 12, 2010 12:22 PM | Report abuse

OK, now we have the "Dumb Caption Contest." My nominastion is the first one in the Spartacus Turns 50 photo gallery: "Extras playing dead people hold cards with numbers on them between takes." Uh, okay. But why?

Posted by: curmudgeon6 | October 12, 2010 12:27 PM | Report abuse

Good afternoon, all.

Brag, thanks for your updates - much appreciated.

Citronelle is a wonderful place (if needing a bit of a remodel of late), and when I can't afford a full dinner there (which would be almost all of the time), sometimes I sneak over to the Citronelle lounge after work for some food and a glass of wine. A nice treat without breaking the bank.

Speaking of TV, I've pretty much given up on it these days with the exception of the occasional Daily Show/Colbert Report, PTI, 60 Minutes, and various sports/games.

OK, and my TV equivalent of cotton candy, Burn Notice. I'd tell you why I watch it, but then I'd have to... well, you know.

At least I didn't make any comments about watery tarts and governments.

bc


Posted by: -bc- | October 12, 2010 12:33 PM | Report abuse

'Mudge - Maybe the extras might need to be identified for continuity purposes, to make sure they end up back in the same place and position for later shots?

Posted by: bobsewell | October 12, 2010 12:48 PM | Report abuse

And the answer is: WaPo took the Spartacus photos from the Life magazine Web site, and omitted the following, which is one the Life Web site: "[Kirk] Douglas had teamed with director [Stanley] Kubrick a few years before, on one of the very greatest anti-war movies ever made, Paths of Glory. Spartacus was Kubrick's first film since that 1957 triumph. "Imaginative ideas," LIFE reported at the time, "many of them from the fertile mind of Stanley Kubrick, included this one. Kubrick put the numbered signs among the 'corpses' after a big battle so that he could holler, 'You there, next to number 163, move over or look dead or something.' Otherwise, he would have hollered 'you there' and nine guys would have hollered back 'Who, me?' When he was ready to shoot they took the numbers away and shot. As a technique it worked fine, but on-screen the scene proved disappointing so they shot it all over again, this time indoors at Universal's Hollywood studio."

Moral of the story: if you're gonna lift something from somebody else's Web site, steal the whole damn thing, not just random bits and pieces.

Posted by: curmudgeon6 | October 12, 2010 12:52 PM | Report abuse

I don't watch much television. I do always read Hank Stuever's reviews, though, as they seem to be much more consistently entertaining.

Posted by: RD_Padouk | October 12, 2010 1:08 PM | Report abuse

Take care of yourself CP!

I remember seeing some vacuum tubes in old buildings, but never saw them being used. This saddens me as I always thought they had a wonderful grace to them.

Posted by: RD_Padouk | October 12, 2010 1:11 PM | Report abuse

I do like "The Big Bang Theory," if only because I get a smug pleasure in identifying the equations they have in the background. When Sheldon was estimating his life span didja see the Bayesian Probability Formula? Cool, right? Right?

My wife didn't think so either.

Posted by: RD_Padouk | October 12, 2010 1:17 PM | Report abuse

I would think most Boodlers can sympathize with this writer's malady:

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/10/10/movies/homevideo/10bugs.html

:-)

Posted by: Scottynuke | October 12, 2010 1:26 PM | Report abuse

Indeed. ScottyNuke. Indeed.

Posted by: RD_Padouk | October 12, 2010 1:34 PM | Report abuse

That was great, Scotty... that wascally wabbit. I looked for some Bugs on Netflix and happy to see that at least this one is available to Watch Instantly...

Bugs Bunny Superstar(1975) NR

Orson Welles narrates this nostalgic look back at the origins of beloved Warner Bros. characters such as Bugs Bunny, Daffy Duck and Porky Pig, featuring early black-and-white footage of animators at work plus nine classic cartoons. Highlights include "A Wild Hare" (1940), which is widely considered the first official Bugs Bunny 'toon, and "Walky Talky Hawky" (1946), which earned an Oscar nod for Best Short Subject, Cartoons.

Posted by: -TBG- | October 12, 2010 1:36 PM | Report abuse

I used to tweak Hank Stuever on my blog when he was a feature writer and was on an open-every-closet-door kick (I mean did Sean Hayes really have to be outed?), but I luv his television writing. RD is right. Stuever's reviews are always funny even, perhaps especially, if the show being skewered isn't.

I had thought he had taken some sort of WaPo buyout, but I am very glad to be seeing his byline on a regular basis again.

There have been persistent rumors that WaPo will kill their 'West Coast' bureau which would put Lisa de Moraes out of a job. That would be almost enough to make me cancel my subscription even though I already get the RSS feed of her On Television column. She is the best writer on the TV business in print or on the web.

Posted by: yellojkt | October 12, 2010 1:39 PM | Report abuse

I still see them at times at banks that have more than 1 drive through lane. The far one will have a vacuum tube.

Whenever I think of them I'm reminded of a story of guy who put a whole bunch of loose coins for deposit in one and sent it over to the teller. It was so heavy that when it arrived, it essentially crashed and burst open, spraying coins. I have no idea if it is true, and I can't remember where I heard/read it but the visual is amusing.

Feel better CqP, and because I forgot to include it earlier, go Cassandra! :)

Posted by: MoftheMountain | October 12, 2010 1:39 PM | Report abuse

Yellojkt, I have a feeling that Charlie knows sex in 100 languages.
And not much else in the way of vocabulary.

Posted by: Wilbrod_Gnome | October 12, 2010 1:40 PM | Report abuse

Feel for you, bh.

I think skunks are taking over North America.

I blame Obama.

Posted by: -dbG- | October 12, 2010 1:52 PM | Report abuse

RD, your 1:17...I'm impressed. I've got a Five Minute University recall.

Posted by: LostInThought | October 12, 2010 1:52 PM | Report abuse

My wife loves BBT because she doesn't just watch it, she lives it. The other night in my son's dorm room she says she felt like she had the lowest IQ of the eight people in the room. She is much too modest.

Posted by: yellojkt | October 12, 2010 1:59 PM | Report abuse

What you guys are calling "vacuum tubes" are what are more generally called pneumatic tubes. "Vaccum tubes" are those things they used to put in televisions back before transistors were invented.

Pneumatic tubes were invented by Hero of Alexandria back in the first century CE, according to Wiki. (Wiki neglects to mention that "Hero of Alexandria" was once one of my nicknames, back in the day, but that's a long story for another day, and anyway, I'm not the same guy as the P-tube guy Hero, which was his name, not his job description.)

I just love the fact that the NYT article on Bugs firmly adheres to the Times style guide, and refers to him throughout as "Mr. Bunny." That is an inspired bit of writing as well as a very wise use of copy editing benign neglect. But it only works in the NYT; you couldn't use it in the WaPo, I don't think. It works because it is in the NYT. (Likewise, love the references to Mr. Fudd.) And this perfect clause: "...and a few examples of Mr. Bunny’s later, lesser work, including “Carrotblanca” and “Hare and Loathing in Las Vegas,” when gunfire no longer seemed to challenge him as an actor."

Posted by: curmudgeon6 | October 12, 2010 2:05 PM | Report abuse

Heads up, ftb: http://www.slashfilm.com/2010/10/11/first-look-daniel-craig-in-the-girl-with-the-dragon-tattoo-more-news-of-unpublished-fourth-novel-in-the-series/

Posted by: curmudgeon6 | October 12, 2010 2:14 PM | Report abuse

Count me in on that, too, Scottynuke.

And resist the urge to buy that collection...

Speaking of which, it seems like there are indeed bugs going around (and not just the local stink- type) -- for all of you feeling poorly today and suffering through some illness, I hope you're feeling better soon, each and every one of you.

Ah, intra-building pneumatic capsule delivery systems - I always thought those were great. Almost makes me want to go to a drive-up bank teller window (the far lane, of course) just to use one again.

The Way the Future Was, indeed.

bc

Posted by: -bc- | October 12, 2010 2:20 PM | Report abuse

Those tube systems are still common in hospitals. I have no idea where else though.

Posted by: yellojkt | October 12, 2010 2:24 PM | Report abuse

True Mudge they were called pneumatic tubes. Ours were used only for documents, for sending something on the third floor for signature for exemple to get it back a few minutes later. The building was from the mid-sixties so the systems were in use quite late. The spare change story might well be apocryphal, I don't see this system shooting bullets filled with quarters three story up or down. But the visuals are interesting indeed.

This in-house high-tech system was completed by us, the couriers, as we were carrying the titles/papers/certificates between the various banks in the downtown area. It was done on foot and it was no picnic in hot humid days as we were wearing cheap polyester sports coat (complete with the logo of the banks woven in the back) and ties. Yukky summer job if there was one.

Posted by: shrieking_denizen | October 12, 2010 2:36 PM | Report abuse

Thanks, Mudge, but I've been following all of that on the Swedish newspapers. They even have some TV snippets of the filming around Stockholm and other parts of the country.

As for the 4th/5th book, the ownership is still a part of the conflict between his father and brother, and Eva Gabrielsson, his common-law wife (so to speak) of 30 years or so. Even over there, if there is no will and one is not married, the estate automatically goes to immediate family members. Furthermore, in Sweden children *cannot* by law be disinherited.

I didn't see the second movie when it was out. But I still have to talk with my colleague in Sth who promised to get me DVDs of the longer version of each of the movies -- that was shown on Swedish television, but I couldn't access them from over here.

Posted by: ftb3 | October 12, 2010 2:41 PM | Report abuse

I remember the pneumatic tube system in the old Charlotte Observer/Charlotte News building. It was torn down in the late 60's/early 70's and replaced by the current building, which I don't believe has such a system.

CqP, feel better soon!

My cold isn't particularly bad, but the timing is horrible. I have to be nice to maroons who are trying to use our online credit card system for Mr. T's fire station design conference. It's amazing how many ways people can screw up entering a credit card number, or that the system screws up. I have no idea what the problem is, and it's difficult to be a good customer service representative when I want to tell them to go jump.

Posted by: slyness | October 12, 2010 2:48 PM | Report abuse

I bought the Looney Tunes Collection (all the volumes) for my husband a few years back. I'm glad it's on DVD, because we play them so much that we'd have worn out a tape by now.

Not Bugs, but he used to assign an essay this one back when he taught freshman history, Drip-a-long Daffy:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=3120470060764630180#

Posted by: MoftheMountain | October 12, 2010 2:49 PM | Report abuse

Thanks for the compliment LiT! And extra point for the Guido Sarducci reference!

Posted by: RD_Padouk | October 12, 2010 2:51 PM | Report abuse

I think the spare change story comes from this excellent commercial...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MNl_6LLXMko

Posted by: -TBG- | October 12, 2010 2:52 PM | Report abuse

SCC: an essay *on* this one

Posted by: MoftheMountain | October 12, 2010 2:56 PM | Report abuse

I got this awesome error message from Moveable Type, even though it still posted my comment (of course, I'm not sure how many times it posted it)...

"Can't call method "remove" on an undefined value "

Posted by: -TBG- | October 12, 2010 2:56 PM | Report abuse

LOL! Yep that must be it.

Posted by: MoftheMountain | October 12, 2010 2:59 PM | Report abuse

If anyone didn't notice, I've got a 30-minute delay built into my Boodling.

By the time I get 'round to something, it's already gone.

Like my youth.

bc

Posted by: -bc- | October 12, 2010 3:01 PM | Report abuse

hey yello. The LA bureau has been closed for months. de Moraes is working in Washington.

Posted by: Yoki | October 12, 2010 3:11 PM | Report abuse

I'm off to pick up Daughter from her after-school activity, but y'all who can watch videos should see this great Improv Everywhere video...

http://improveverywhere.com/2010/10/12/the-mp3-experiment-seven/

Posted by: -TBG- | October 12, 2010 3:15 PM | Report abuse

Pres Piñera has just inspected the blue lighted reception area.

It looks like extraction will start at 5 PM ET

Piñera asked for all church bells to ring when first miner comes out

Brag

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 3:20 PM | Report abuse

Yoki,
That explains it. I knew something was up. I hope they fly her around first class when she has to cover events in person.

Posted by: yellojkt | October 12, 2010 3:24 PM | Report abuse

Brag, that sounds great! Cool about the church bells, too.

Dearest CqP, I *meant* to say something about your walking pneumonia (to which I also start humming "Waltzing Matilda" for some reason). I shall immediately fax you some authentic chicken soup with a bottle of Tabasco (or your hot sauce of choice) for a fast recuperation time. I've had walking pneumonia, and the fatigue factor is indescribable! I could barely walk down the street without falling from sheer fatigue. Please be careful on your bike.

Posted by: ftb3 | October 12, 2010 4:04 PM | Report abuse

Workers are now securing the pulley support structure to the base platform. It looks like they will have the pulley,cable and rescue capsule ready in one hour.

Brag :)

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 4:05 PM | Report abuse

Walking pneumonia and cycling would not seem to mix, ftb. Wouldn't it be called bicycling pneumonia, then?

Posted by: Wilbrod_Gnome | October 12, 2010 4:20 PM | Report abuse

Sigh. I thought I had been a good parent. I thought I'd done everything right. But I just found out that Daughter has never heard of the original Hawaii 5-O.

She's never even heard of the expression "book 'em, Dano."

Posted by: -TBG- | October 12, 2010 4:50 PM | Report abuse

I have a question... when Don't Ask, Don't Tell was enacted, wasn't it considered a step in the right direction?

I mean, before that it was We Can Ask, You've Gotta Tell, wasn't it?

Posted by: -TBG- | October 12, 2010 4:58 PM | Report abuse

TBG,
You better buy her box sets of Rockford Files, Columbo, Quincy, and Barnaby Jones. You better throw in Remington Steele and Moonlighting for good measure. Heck, just get the entire Quinn-Martin library.

Posted by: yellojkt | October 12, 2010 5:00 PM | Report abuse

Yup, TBG. They thought they were being pretty darned tolerant!

Posted by: bobsewell | October 12, 2010 5:39 PM | Report abuse

I just hate to see people writing about the "17-year ban on openly gay troops."

There was a 200-year ban on in-the-closet gay troops leading up to that, wasn't there?

It should be repealed, don't get me wrong. It's just a good example of how things change slowly... laws, attitudes, etc.

Posted by: -TBG- | October 12, 2010 5:43 PM | Report abuse

Y'all following the "twin discrimination" articles in the NYT?

A (previously?) respected journalist wrote about how the Brooklyn Botanical Gardens were discriminating against her 3 year old twins. Her twin-mom and dad homies seem to agree but not many others do. A second article was published today.

Posted by: -dbG- | October 12, 2010 6:06 PM | Report abuse

http://cityroom.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/10/08/complaint-box-twin-discrimination/?apage=1#comments

http://cityroom.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/10/12/no-twin-discrimination-but-no-special-treatment-either/#comment-778395

somewhat amusing. I see a reality show developing from this: The Parent Trap. Who will gold medal?

Of course, it's not nearly as bad as Ms Steiner's former WaPo blog.

Posted by: -dbG- | October 12, 2010 6:15 PM | Report abuse

I hadn't seen it before dbG, but the responses in today's blog post were pretty much on the mark. Thanks for pointing it out!

Original post: http://nyti.ms/ahURce

Today's followup: http://nyti.ms/bubjMX

Posted by: -TBG- | October 12, 2010 6:15 PM | Report abuse

Since we are happily spending TBG's money for her daughter, don't forget the Rocky and Bullwinkle sets. Lots of great fun there with Fractured Fairy Tales, Peabody and Sherman, along with the stars of the show.

Posted by: -pj- | October 12, 2010 6:30 PM | Report abuse

RESCUE

19:55. Minister Golbourne announced, instalation of communication, monitor and video lines require two more hours. After that there will be an empty test run of the Fenix-2 capsule.

Don't expect miner extraction to begin 'till about 10 PM ET.

Brag

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 7:08 PM | Report abuse

After sunset. the platform at the shaft looks like a theater stage. The mood is sober. Media are in the press tent and a corral has been scraped out for them.

In Copiapo, the Plaza de Armas (Town square) is packed with people cheering. Two huge video screens have been set up there.

The road to Camp Esperanza is closed.

Brag

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 7:34 PM | Report abuse

Wow. That's really something Brag. We're so lucky to have you here with us. Thanks for the updates and please keep them coming.

Posted by: -TBG- | October 12, 2010 7:41 PM | Report abuse

Oh my, TBG. This means the poor child has no understanding of the grave threat posed by Wu Fat and his cool little submarine.

Posted by: RD_Padouk | October 12, 2010 7:41 PM | Report abuse

I second PJ's Rocky and Bullwinkle suggestion, they aren't Mr. B. Bunny, but they and their friends are very good.

Brag, this whole rescue is riveting. I'm watching coverage on TV. The capsule design is amazing and the plans for caring for them, both before they come up (aspirin to prevent thrombosis) and after is so thorough.

Just cleaned out both freezers (small ones in two refrigerators) and only found three mystery packages - I usually find twice that. I don't have to grocery shop, except for perishables, for a month!

Posted by: badsneakers | October 12, 2010 7:42 PM | Report abuse

Never underestimate the value of Animaniacs either.

Posted by: yellojkt | October 12, 2010 7:53 PM | Report abuse

Yup, the planning has been impeccable, the execution precise. This is quite amazing as nothing like this has ever been tried.
One must consider how hopeless this all was at the beginning.

At the moment the capsule is upright.

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 7:54 PM | Report abuse

Lowering fibre optic cable takes forever

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 8:05 PM | Report abuse

No thanks to Columbus Day, I had to wait until today to pick up the Jonathan Franzen book at the library. I also stumbled on a book called 'The Night Gardener' by somebody whose name is too hard to spell. Plus the very first four episode of the original Degrassi Junior High series. I have a busy week ahead of me.

Posted by: yellojkt | October 12, 2010 8:07 PM | Report abuse

Watching it here, Brag...

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/video/2005/04/12/VI2005041201139.html?hpid=topnews

Posted by: -TBG- | October 12, 2010 8:10 PM | Report abuse

But need your commentary to tell us what's actually happening!

:-)

Posted by: -TBG- | October 12, 2010 8:15 PM | Report abuse

I am glued to the live coverage of the rescue. As Brag says, this is something that has never been done before; it is an incredible thing to witness it.

Posted by: Yoki | October 12, 2010 8:20 PM | Report abuse

now hooking up communications. It appears they have been practicing beforehand

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 8:22 PM | Report abuse

The green helmet, Pedro Gallo, is a volunteer, specialist on communications,

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 8:25 PM | Report abuse

CNN's also showing the feed live from Chile...

Posted by: Scottynuke | October 12, 2010 8:30 PM | Report abuse

Today, to ease tensions, cops stages a puppet show.

Lowering the capsule for its test run of 612 meters, it will be done without a passenger.

Wheels have shock absorbers- The white section can be ungooked in case of emergency, passenger is wearing a harness connected to surface

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 8:30 PM | Report abuse

Is this just a test run Brag? Or the real thing?

Posted by: -TBG- | October 12, 2010 8:30 PM | Report abuse

Notice steam. Indicates the bitter night cold in the desert.

Prez inspecting

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 8:32 PM | Report abuse

Test run, first stage 56 meters

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 8:34 PM | Report abuse

I am so glad you are all posting about the rescue, I can't watch, couldn't bear watching if something were to go wrong. Wishing for a positive outcome.

Posted by: dmd3 | October 12, 2010 8:36 PM | Report abuse

And so it begins!

Posted by: Yoki | October 12, 2010 8:36 PM | Report abuse

I'm getting a "first moon landing" sort of vibe from the coverage, and in a fairly appropriate way, too...

Posted by: Scottynuke | October 12, 2010 8:36 PM | Report abuse

This test will chack going down and up at three critical places, estimated time about one hour.

There are three places where diamter of shaft changes.

Later , a rescuer will descend very slowly.

Testing the table so it will not spin, made in Austria. Is I.6 kg. per meter

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 8:39 PM | Report abuse

Yes, exactly, Scotty! Only with a greater human-empathy component, and so even more intense.

Posted by: Yoki | October 12, 2010 8:41 PM | Report abuse

Showing the rescuers who will descend

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 8:45 PM | Report abuse

And thankfully CNN's being honest about how much waiting is still left before we might see real progress.

Posted by: Scottynuke | October 12, 2010 8:46 PM | Report abuse

dmd

I meant to thank you this morning but forgot. I'm hanging in there. And thanks also, motfmountain.

CQP
I had walking pneumonia, and it's serious, so you need to do what the doctor tells you and take the meds. Just take care of yourself, and hoping you get to feeling better real soon. I didn't realize I had it until going for my doctor's appointment, and they started talking about calling the rescue squad! I just thought I had a cold.

Slyness, baby isn't here yet, but the time is getting close. We're looking at the end of next month or first of December. My daughter went for her appeal today, so keep her in prayer. I hope they reconsider and she gets her job back. She so needs a job.

I'm looking at CNN too, hope everything goes okay for those guys. I know their families are sitting on pins.

Have a good evening, folks. Sweet dreams boodle.

Posted by: cmyth4u | October 12, 2010 8:54 PM | Report abuse

Comparing to moon landing is appropiate. There hasn´t been as much coverage of an event since Apollo 11.

reached 60 meters

going up.

President will shortly authorize descent. onw mining expert and a Marine will be first rescuers down


Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 8:56 PM | Report abuse

checking capsule now

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 8:59 PM | Report abuse

CNN switches Anderson Cooper for Larry King.

Meh.

Posted by: Scottynuke | October 12, 2010 9:02 PM | Report abuse

I admire so much how carefully this is being executed. So it takes a little longer; better than playing to the cameras for drama. Those miners deserve nothing less than thebestwecandotoprotectyou.

Posted by: Yoki | October 12, 2010 9:03 PM | Report abuse

Next trip will be manned, increasing the number of people inside

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 9:04 PM | Report abuse

Hooboy, I so would freak if I had to ride in that thing...God bless them all.

Posted by: slyness | October 12, 2010 9:07 PM | Report abuse

Big difference how this government handles this vs the way the old one handles earthquake.

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 9:08 PM | Report abuse

The wheels need more tension ahd the body of the capsule had excessive rubbing.
Delay, 15 minues to add tension to the wheels

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 9:11 PM | Report abuse

You'd think by this point Larry wouldn't have to correct himself on "NASA" v. "Nassau." *SIGH*

Posted by: Scottynuke | October 12, 2010 9:12 PM | Report abuse

I am now monitoring but couldn't watch on CNN, announcer was bothering me, watching on the CBC.

Posted by: dmd3 | October 12, 2010 9:13 PM | Report abuse

Capsule going down for another test.

Notice that shaft is not vertical but 82 degrees

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 9:16 PM | Report abuse

Cassandra, I'm glad your daughter got a hearing and hope it goes her way. She will be in my prayers, indeed...

Posted by: slyness | October 12, 2010 9:17 PM | Report abuse

You mean when Larry King started being an old frt and asking obtuse questions and demonstrating his hasbeeness? Me neither. I'm now on CBC also.

Posted by: Yoki | October 12, 2010 9:19 PM | Report abuse

Sooooooo jellus of Yoki & dmd et al right now... :-)

Posted by: Scottynuke | October 12, 2010 9:23 PM | Report abuse

Oh, and Larry's introduced us to CNN's newest correspondent --

Sanjay Goop-ter

*SIGHHH*

Posted by: Scottynuke | October 12, 2010 9:25 PM | Report abuse

Scotty, try BBC America. They're live, and I'm there (only, you know, BBC Canada).

Posted by: Yoki | October 12, 2010 9:25 PM | Report abuse

Don't be jealous Scotty, they are currently running the National news, lets just say a dark day in Canadian foreign policy.

Posted by: dmd3 | October 12, 2010 9:26 PM | Report abuse

I am feverishly searching for BBC America to avoid Jesse Ventura on CNN... ACK!

Posted by: Scottynuke | October 12, 2010 9:27 PM | Report abuse

I'd search freakin' Guy Fiori to avoid Jesse Ventura.

Posted by: Yoki | October 12, 2010 9:30 PM | Report abuse

Arrrrrrrrrrrrgh... BBCa is showing Gordon frickin' Ramsey. *fuming*

Posted by: Scottynuke | October 12, 2010 9:34 PM | Report abuse

for a long time wheel was not moving, now capsule going down again

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 9:37 PM | Report abuse

Braguine, please, my Spanish is so rudimentary that I cannot follow the comments, what is going on?

Posted by: gmbka | October 12, 2010 9:39 PM | Report abuse

this is so cool. i'm watching the Incredibles with my son and getting the equivalent of a live feed of the rescue. with Brag as our embedded correspondent.

Posted by: -jack- | October 12, 2010 9:43 PM | Report abuse

Capsule failed first test, shok absorbers on wheels were changed for stronger ones. Now doing second test

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 9:46 PM | Report abuse

Capsule seems stopped at the 465 meter level.

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 9:53 PM | Report abuse

At the moment President is with miner families.

capsule going back up fast

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 9:57 PM | Report abuse

Dont cha wish the people executing this had been in charge of the deepwater rigs/wells?

Posted by: -dbG- | October 12, 2010 9:59 PM | Report abuse

That is a hole of small diameter to be bringing human beings through...

Posted by: slyness | October 12, 2010 10:01 PM | Report abuse

Whew! Back to Anderson Cooper. :-)

Posted by: Scottynuke | October 12, 2010 10:04 PM | Report abuse

Lawrence O'Donnell on MSNBC is covering the rescue. Kerry Sanders (sp?) is reporting from Copiapo. He speaks Spanish which makes his interviews better and probably his information also.

Posted by: badsneakers | October 12, 2010 10:06 PM | Report abuse

capsule returning, opinion is that is working well

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 10:06 PM | Report abuse

Miguel Gonzales entering capsule for real trip

RESCUE BEGINS!!!!

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 10:10 PM | Report abuse

Now I am very tense and intense.

Posted by: Yoki | October 12, 2010 10:10 PM | Report abuse

http://cut.gd/guiS

Map of where the heck Copiapó is. Looks about 400 mi. N. of Santiago.

Posted by: Jumper1 | October 12, 2010 10:13 PM | Report abuse

Activatin all systems for manned trip, communications, on, oxygen, on. harness hooked
latches checked

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 10:13 PM | Report abuse

Jumper, you are right

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 10:15 PM | Report abuse

Were those bottles green? Oxygen is nasty stuff to be taking down in a confined space...

Posted by: slyness | October 12, 2010 10:16 PM | Report abuse

Descent about to begin.
Gonzales is a mining engineer and rescue expert

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 10:18 PM | Report abuse

First rescuer almost in the capsule, looks like they want to make sure the oxygen is flowing. A good idea, methinks.

And away he goes...

Posted by: Scottynuke | October 12, 2010 10:19 PM | Report abuse

Down he goes!

adjusting cable position
People are singing national anthem

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 10:21 PM | Report abuse

120 meters (total 624 to bottom)
Going well
According to the protocol, Gonzales will not go all the way down

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 10:26 PM | Report abuse

the national anthem

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 10:29 PM | Report abuse

Speed of capsule diminshed

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 10:32 PM | Report abuse

Capsule has arrived!!!

Posted by: Scottynuke | October 12, 2010 10:36 PM | Report abuse

This is extraordinary

Posted by: Yoki | October 12, 2010 10:37 PM | Report abuse

Speed of capsule diminshed

Capsule reached bottom

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 10:37 PM | Report abuse

Incredible. Like Armstrong on the moon.

Posted by: Curmudgeon5 | October 12, 2010 10:38 PM | Report abuse

*weeping*

Posted by: Yoki | October 12, 2010 10:39 PM | Report abuse

Gonzales meets miners!!!
Now he will select first evaquee

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 10:39 PM | Report abuse

Truly astounding how calm the miners are, welcoming and hugging the rescuer as if he's just stopped by the corner pub.

Posted by: Scottynuke | October 12, 2010 10:40 PM | Report abuse

I cannot get over the quality of the pictures from the mine! This is awe inspiring!

Posted by: badsneakers | October 12, 2010 10:42 PM | Report abuse

A disciplined lot at the bottom

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 10:42 PM | Report abuse

The first brave soul going down on that capsule, my hat's off to 'em, big time.

I'm reminded of Apollo 13, but I know this situation is quite different.

Every time I watch Larry King, I'm reminded of why I don't watch Larry King.

bc

Posted by: -bc- | October 12, 2010 10:43 PM | Report abuse

A disciplined lot at the bottom

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 10:43 PM | Report abuse

Can you imagine the pure hope in seeing a healthy person come down?! Hope. Hope is a virtue. And these remarkable men have held to it throughout.

Posted by: Yoki | October 12, 2010 10:45 PM | Report abuse

Avilos is in the capsule, getting wired up...

Posted by: Scottynuke | October 12, 2010 10:52 PM | Report abuse

Alfonso Avila will be the first miner out.
He is now in the capsule

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 10:54 PM | Report abuse

And up goes the capsule!

Posted by: Scottynuke | October 12, 2010 10:55 PM | Report abuse

lift off!
succesful reinsertion of capsule

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 10:56 PM | Report abuse

In a few minutes, first miner out!!!!!

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 10:57 PM | Report abuse

Flag next to platform is used to shield miners as they come out

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 10:59 PM | Report abuse

<|: ) 1776

Posted by: SpendNomore | October 12, 2010 11:01 PM | Report abuse

expect a siren, this is to alert the medical personnel in diferent reception and helicopter areas

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 11:04 PM | Report abuse

Oh, BTW, Cliff Lee throws a complete game 6-hitter as the Rangers eliminate the Rays.

Here comes the capsule!!!

Posted by: Scottynuke | October 12, 2010 11:10 PM | Report abuse

Oh, yes. Lovely.

Posted by: Yoki | October 12, 2010 11:11 PM | Report abuse

Emerged!

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 11:11 PM | Report abuse

*HUGSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS* all around!!!! :-)))

32 to go!!

Posted by: Scottynuke | October 12, 2010 11:13 PM | Report abuse

Verklempt.

Posted by: Curmudgeon5 | October 12, 2010 11:13 PM | Report abuse

Wait, just beauty.

Posted by: Yoki | October 12, 2010 11:16 PM | Report abuse

The breaking the sueface of the capsule has been one of the most touching scenes- Avalos looked like anything but a victim :)

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 11:16 PM | Report abuse

So glad I watched that.

Posted by: dmd3 | October 12, 2010 11:16 PM | Report abuse

well done.

Posted by: -jack- | October 12, 2010 11:17 PM | Report abuse

Yeah, huggggsss everyone

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 11:18 PM | Report abuse

He looked like a victor. He was.

Posted by: Yoki | October 12, 2010 11:19 PM | Report abuse

Mario Sepulveda, a navy sergeant, paramedic is going down next, he is about to be promoted to officer.

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 11:23 PM | Report abuse

One down. Or up, as the case may be.

Posted by: yellojkt | October 12, 2010 11:26 PM | Report abuse

*Doing a Mad Happy Dance with puffy fists*

Posted by: Yoki | October 12, 2010 11:27 PM | Report abuse

Testing

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 11:29 PM | Report abuse

It is Roberto Rios going down

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 11:31 PM | Report abuse

Brag, what is the reaction, if any, in Santiago - loud cheers in the streets or is everyone waiting until all the minors are out.

National day of celebration tomorrow?

Have to go to bed soon, thank you for your posts.

Posted by: dmd3 | October 12, 2010 11:32 PM | Report abuse

Hey, all. I've been right here with you (watching alternately on MSNBC and Wapo livefeed) while reading the dispatches. Thank you, Brag! What a moment to share with all of you. Fervant hopes for continued success to the rescuers and joyful celebrations all around. Amazing!

Posted by: talitha1 | October 12, 2010 11:41 PM | Report abuse

We now have two looong days to go.

Capsule reached bottom again!

Posted by: Braguine | October 12, 2010 11:44 PM | Report abuse

CHI CHI CHI !

LE LE LE !

Posted by: seasea1 | October 12, 2010 11:49 PM | Report abuse

I worry

Posted by: Yoki | October 12, 2010 11:57 PM | Report abuse

The second miner heading out. Soon this will become routine.

What medical personnel had planned seems to be collapsing. They expected zombies.

Posted by: Braguine | October 13, 2010 12:00 AM | Report abuse

Dmd3
Some people are gathering on Plaza Italia, Think once last guy is out then people will go nutz

Posted by: Braguine | October 13, 2010 12:04 AM | Report abuse

I celebrate that they're not Zombies.

Posted by: Yoki | October 13, 2010 12:08 AM | Report abuse

Ha ha ha, Sepulveda brought presents with him. Rocks from the bottom

Posted by: Braguine | October 13, 2010 12:12 AM | Report abuse

This guy is great!!!

Posted by: talitha1 | October 13, 2010 12:13 AM | Report abuse

Ha ha ha, Sepulveda brought presents with him. Rocks from the bottom

Posted by: Braguine | October 13, 2010 12:19 AM | Report abuse

Trouble with the door. Will secure it with plastic ties.

Seems will need to use another capsule after a few trips.

The capsule bends, on the top and bottom-
3rd Miner about to go out.

Posted by: Braguine | October 13, 2010 12:47 AM | Report abuse

Man two came up; it was awkward, but beautiful.

Posted by: Yoki | October 13, 2010 1:12 AM | Report abuse

3rd guy is out. They are still sending people down as it will be a long two days for the dispatchers.

I will post updates tomorrow.

Brag :)

Posted by: Braguine | October 13, 2010 1:23 AM | Report abuse

The capsule is on the way down for miner number four, the young Bolivian. MSNBC is reporting ironically that he had only been one the job five days when the mine collapsed. I think he will not be going under ground again.

Posted by: bh72 | October 13, 2010 1:44 AM | Report abuse

Wondrous stuff.

Posted by: Bob-S | October 13, 2010 3:53 AM | Report abuse

Being able to watch all that and share with the Boodle is worth bleary eyes this morning... :-)

*semi-zombie-shuffling-to-the-Dawn-Patrol Grover waves* :-)

Posted by: Scottynuke | October 13, 2010 5:03 AM | Report abuse

SHOOTING STARS AREN'T/WEREN'T STARS

Er, sorry to break it to you Joel, but "shooting stars" are actually meteors, just bits of comet debris shooting through our atmosphere and getting super-heated from the friction of doing so. Star count remains at a bajillion.

Posted by: abekatsman | October 13, 2010 5:41 AM | Report abuse

Good morning, you all. Thank you Brag, for your wonderful commentary....maybe you should write a book??? If you do, don't forget to mention stalwart boodlers who were watching with you on the boodle last night.

Posted by: VintageLady | October 13, 2010 6:18 AM | Report abuse

'Morning, Boodle. #7 is up.

I'm sure Joel really appreciates your input, abekatsman, into matters that are deeply astronomical, as he is notoriously weak as a multi-decade science writer in all things astronomical. (He still thinks the moon is made of green cheese, and that "bajillion" is an actual number, so your thoughtful corrections are welcome.) Many of us here on the Boodle have tried unsuccessfully to educate him about stuff like this, but he keeps making these sorts of fanciful mistakes, and quite frankly, some of us are about ready to throw up our hands when he gets all whimsical on us. It's all part of the overall decline of the news media, we believe, caused by the introduction of fluoride into drinking water.

I mean, he even thinks that he will someday be able to put his eye up to the Hubble telescope and see Mars with it. There's really not much one can do with a person like this.

Posted by: Curmudgeon5 | October 13, 2010 6:28 AM | Report abuse

God loves us so much more than we can imagine through Him that died for all, Jesus Christ.

Good morning, friends. Just wonderful that they're getting the miners out. I saw some of it, but eventually fell out. I know their families are some kind of happy.

Busy day today, getting dressed now. Have a wonderful day, folks, and love to all.

Hope you are feeling a little better this morning, Slyness, and you too, CPQ!

Posted by: cmyth4u | October 13, 2010 6:52 AM | Report abuse

Good morning all... fell asleep last night before the first miner emerged. What a wonderful success story this is turning out to be. I hope it continues until all of them are home safely.

I'm so glad Latinos are a hugging people! As a person of Mediterranean descent, it's great to see the men grasping hands and then drawing each other into a hug. This is the emotion such an event calls for and makes it that much more satisfying.

Posted by: -TBG- | October 13, 2010 7:57 AM | Report abuse

Ai chihuahua... Calling the Tinfoil Hat Brigade!

http://www.boston.com/business/articles/2010/10/13/suit_alleges_tracking_chip_caused_cancer_in_cat/

*SIGHHHHHHHHHHHHHH*

Posted by: Scottynuke | October 13, 2010 7:59 AM | Report abuse

Good morning, Boodlies!

11 Miners out!!!

Only problem is the door, which is out of alignment. This was spotted during the test, nevertheless, they decided to proceed.

Only one came up hooked up to the oxygen tank due to suffering from silicosis.

Rescue continues at one miner per hour. Should be finished tomorrow morning.

Brag :)

Posted by: Braguine | October 13, 2010 8:11 AM | Report abuse

So glad everything is proceeding well, obviously I seriously underestimated how long the rescue would take - they seem to be taking every precaution which is good.

TBG, I was thinking something similar last night (re the hugging) watching the Chilean President who seemed near giddy with joy. I tried to picture our current PM's reaction should an event like this take place here - somehow a cool yet heart felt hand shake would not have the same optics.

Shameless cheap shot at our PM :-)

Posted by: dmd3 | October 13, 2010 8:15 AM | Report abuse

BIG thanks to Braguine!

Posted by: gmbka | October 13, 2010 8:18 AM | Report abuse

Brag... who knew you'd be moving to the center of the world?

Posted by: -TBG- | October 13, 2010 8:20 AM | Report abuse

Case in point,

http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20080929/election2008_harper_080930/20080930?s_name=election2008

Posted by: dmd3 | October 13, 2010 8:21 AM | Report abuse

I expected to see human messes in clean coveralls to emerge. Instead, the guys arrive shaved, trimmed hair and acting like conquring heroes. A lot of credit should go to the medical team. Miners were kept on a special diet and a strict program of exercises and work.

One of them is already writing a book, another composed a song.

Over a billion people around the world watched the rescue on TV
Brag

Posted by: Braguine | October 13, 2010 8:26 AM | Report abuse

The center obviously follows Brag, TBG... :-)

Posted by: Scottynuke | October 13, 2010 8:26 AM | Report abuse

Evo Morales, the president of Bolivia is at the mine now.

As Chile rebuilds from the earthquake, this event is going to shove forward the country with a can do attitude.

Posted by: Braguine | October 13, 2010 8:37 AM | Report abuse

This really is a heartwarming heroic story. It is such a bitter contrast to the recent mine disasters we have had here in the US. Such dirty brutal work just so we can burn dinosaurs.

Posted by: yellojkt | October 13, 2010 8:39 AM | Report abuse

Morales is trying to talk Bolivian miner, Carlos Mamamani to return with him to Bolivia. The poor guy sits uncomfortably between the two prezes

Posted by: Braguine | October 13, 2010 8:54 AM | Report abuse

We are nearly all pretty confirmed Darwinists here, but the following may cause us to reflect upon our notions. From this morning's Borowitz Report:

"Palin’s Evolution into O’Donnell Proves Darwin Was Wrong

"Scientists Propose ‘Theory of Devolution’

"OSLO, NORWAY (The Borowitz Report) – Two of the theory of evolution’s most vociferous doubters, Sarah Palin and Christine O’Donnell, may be living proof that Darwin was wrong, leading scientists believe.

"A conference of the most prominent evolutionary scientists in the world has concluded that the apparent evolution of Ms. Palin into Ms. O’Donnell suggests, in the words of Dr. Hiroshi Kyosuke of the University of Tokyo, “that Darwin got it backwards.”

“We still believe that evolution is more than a theory and is, in fact, a very real thing,” said Dr. Kyosuke. “However, in the case of Palin and O’Donnell, it seems to be moving in a reverse direction.”

Dr. Kyosuke stunned the conference when he presented his scholarly paper, “Tea Party Politicians and the Theory of Devolution,” in which he studied the so-called “reverse natural selection” at play in GOP candidates for Governor of New York.

“If we chart the trend line from George Pataki to Carl Paladino, within fifty years New York might be governed by Cro-Magnon Man,” he said.

Mr. Paladino did not offer an official response to the scientist’s remarks, but said that he had one hundred aides typing on one hundred typewriters simultaneously to craft a statement.

For her part, Ms. O’Donnell today released her official campaign platform, in which she opposes the use of simple tools and the discovery of fire.

Posted by: curmudgeon6 | October 13, 2010 9:07 AM | Report abuse

Spendid morning to y'all.

Just wonderful to watch this rescue, knowing that the world is watching along. It really does remind me of the '69 moonwalk and, especially of Apollo 13. I should throw in that yesterday started out hard for me ... husband's 65th b'day and the first in 11 years we'd spent apart ... but as the beautiful Autumn reality set in and then last evening's rescue began I was able to really put things into perspective. A breath of fresh air for those men and their families and rescuers, for the world, and for little me.

dmd - love your take on how your PM might react. Especially this line from your link - "Reporters travelling with the prime minister christened his aircraft Sweater-Vest Jet, while comedian Mary Walsh burned a sweater vest on a Newfoundland beach Tuesday to protest Conservative cuts to arts and culture funding." --- I'd love to have been out there with Mary Walsh, even though burning a sweater (though the PM's was probably mass-produced) would be painful for "me". ;)

And that was one "giant Boodle-inclusive hug" last night, huh? Thanks again to Brag!

Posted by: talitha1 | October 13, 2010 9:10 AM | Report abuse

Good morning, y'all.

Lots of warm muffins, coffee and OJ on the table for munching whilst the rescue operation continues.

Thank you all for the running commentary. It's been extraordinary.

Posted by: MsJS | October 13, 2010 9:12 AM | Report abuse

I am going off the air. Will return in a few hours with a report on what is going on in town.

Latta, Boodlies and thanks for sharing this event.

Brag

Posted by: Braguine | October 13, 2010 9:20 AM | Report abuse

It's scary to think Carl Paladino might have any sort of chance to someday command the NY National Guard... :-O

Posted by: Scottynuke | October 13, 2010 9:20 AM | Report abuse

New kit about The Rescue

Posted by: yellojkt | October 13, 2010 9:25 AM | Report abuse

Post a Comment

We encourage users to analyze, comment on and even challenge washingtonpost.com's articles, blogs, reviews and multimedia features.

User reviews and comments that include profanity or personal attacks or other inappropriate comments or material will be removed from the site. Additionally, entries that are unsigned or contain "signatures" by someone other than the actual author will be removed. Finally, we will take steps to block users who violate any of our posting standards, terms of use or privacy policies or any other policies governing this site. Please review the full rules governing commentaries and discussions.




characters remaining

 
 
RSS Feed
Subscribe to The Post

© 2010 The Washington Post Company