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Posted at 10:52 AM ET, 03/ 7/2008

'Lost' Dueling Analyses: The Other Woman

By Liz Kelly

In which Jen and Liz dissect last night's episode, introduce today's new 2 p.m. ET "Lost" chat and unveil a new "Lost" feature.

Liz: Last night's episode title was clearly meant to throw the spotlight on to Juliet, the hour's prime mover and first flashback of season four. But I'm thinking this was really all about Ben, who deftly shifted between his portrayals of the puppet master and the man-child who smashes his toys when they don't bow to his desires. I worship at the altar of Michael Emerson, whose diabolical portrayal of an emotionally stunted basket case with brains to spare is a performance for the ages. But I have to ask:


Ben (Michael Emerson) spins a tale for John (Terry O'Quinn). (ABC)

How's that theory about Ben actually being one of the good guys faring? I'm wondering if it's a little anemic after last night's episode in which he was revealed to be a calculating murderer (yet again) and a stalker to fair Juliet, who just wants to be left in peace to love her Romeo -- be he Goodwin or Jack.

Jen: I, too, worship at the altar of Michael Emerson. Would someone please give him an Emmy for this performance, like, yesterday? His line deliveries are borderline poetry. Just listen to the way he told Locke: "Your people are going to be so angry when they realize you still don't have a plan." Genius. Clearly Ben has some serious problems, not the least of which is his mommy fixation. As Harper suggested, Juliet looks an awful lot like Ben's mother (who, to make things more freaky, is played by Emerson's real-life wife). It's hard to see how his means can possibly justify his ends. But I still contend that he believes he is working for a higher purpose that, if evaluated on its own merits without the messy knowledge that Ben has killed people because of it, may be a noble one. Is that mushy enough for you?

Liz: Right. Glad you pointed out the resemblance to Ben's mom, because many are buzzing that the resemblance to which Harper referred was Ben's childhood friend Annie.

Much more after the jump...

Jen: Speaking of Ben's purpose, we should probably analyze the story he told Locke about Charles Widmore.

Liz: Sure, let's start there -- there's probably a little bit of truth to it -- the bit about Widmore funding the freighter. But I doubt his purpose is to exploit the island as if it were some kind of midway freak show. My question: Is Widmore hunting for the island or for Ben or both?

Jen: I completely agree. Ben told Locke that Widmore sent the freighter people to the island. I believe that part is true, and I believe Abaddon also probably works for him (and that Sayid's Elsa may have been working for Widmore, too). However, I don't think Widmore wants to come to the island so he can turn it into some sort of tropical Graceland. I believe he is hunting for Ben, but that his overarching purpose has to do with assuming control over the island. I wonder if he understands the unique properties that impact the island and might want to exploit them in some way. As in, "Come to Widmore Island, where diseases get cured, disabled people can walk again and, every once in a while, a smoke monster attacks somebody and leaves them for dead. But only every once in a while."

Liz: Or, "where I can control the fabric of time." Here are some screengrabs of the Widmore video sequence.

Jen: I also think Ben knows that only half of what he told Locke is true. When he told John it was his "last bargaining chip," I thought, no way. That dude never runs out of chips. He's too smart for that.

Liz: Right. Ben is always in control and, as Harper told Juliet, right where he wants to be.

I want to backtrack for a second, just because it's easy to lose sight of things from season to season.

Last night we were treated for the third or fourth time to the flashback scene of Oceanic 815 splitting in two and crashing to the ground and Ben's subsequent plan to send Ethan and Goodwin off to the two main crash sites. His instructions included the direction that he wanted "lists" in three days. We've seen all this before. My new question, though, is why would Ben assume there would be survivors? Not to be morbid or pessimistic, but survivors of a jetliner crash are about as rare as Martians. This goes back to a central show mystery, but I think it's important to keep in mind and ask ourselves, was the crash orchestrated?

Jen: Don't tell me that! I'm not terribly fond of flying, so I sometimes comfort myself by thinking, "Well, at least if this plane crashes, maybe I'll get to hang out with Sawyer."

I thought Lindelof and Cuse had said pretty definitively that Desmond made the plane crash because of the system failure he caused in the Hatch (see end of season two). As for why Ben would assume survivors, I think he understands the unique electromagnetic properties of the island and maybe he guessed that at least some of the crash victims would be affected by them and prevented from dying? He did seem to know Goodwin had no chance of surviving, as Juliet implied, and I am not sure how he knew that.

Liz: I think he knew which way the wind was blowing with Goodwin's relationship with the Tailies and let it play out.

Jen: I have always believed the people on the plane were "called" to the island, though, so in that sense, there is orchestration at work, though possibly not by Ben.

Liz: Right. That's supported by the intermingling storylines and coincidences.

Another old island trick resurfaced last night, too -- the whispery voices. This time, Juliet was the target -- right before Harper emerged from the jungle. Lost Easter Eggs tried to reverse the audio to get something out of it, but I'm not hearing much.

Jen: I didn't hear much in that whisper audio either. But the presence of the whispers, especially noticeable when Harper suddenly showed up then disappeared, suggests that she was not really there. Juliet told Jack at the end of the episode that Ben had tried to get to her, which suggests he sent Harper or a manifestation of her to speak with Juliet.

As far as the whispers themselves, we typically hear them before the smoke monster shows up or when people get near Jacob's place, right?

Liz: Right. Though we know that Jack saw Harper, too, so it wasn't a phenomenon limited to Juliet's perception.

Jen: Agreed. But multiple people have seen Jacob and Smokey, so is it possible there is a connection?

I want to touch on the phrase you mentioned a little bit ago: "He's exactly where he wants to be." We heard that very same wording from Miles a few episodes back, just before he tried to extort a mega-wad of cash from Ben.

The obvious read on those lines is that they are where they want to be metaphorically. But what if both Ben and Miles are where they literally need to be, meaning the barracks are the only safe place on the island and immune to the electromagnetic fluctuations? Aren't the barracks inside the sonar fence?

Liz: That's an interesting point. The barracks are indeed inside the sonar fence and in one of Ben's flashbacks last season the ghost of his mother warned him off leaving their protective confines. And Ben certainly does seem content there. My favorite line of the night was his "See you guys at dinner" to Hurley and Sawyer. So good. So "dissociative psychopath."

Jen: Right. And if you remember back to our beloved McPatchy, when Locke pushed him through the fence, he had what appeared to be a cerebral hemorrhage, not unlike Minkowski.

Liz: Right. But -- correct me if I'm wrong -- we assumed at the time that McPatchy's hemorrhage was a result of coming into contact with the fence itself. We also know he recovered from it long enough to turn up at The Looking Glass station.

Jen: We did assume that's why McPatchy bled at the time. But if he were having the same issues as George and Desmond, that could explain why he managed to survive. He hadn't completely died and he was able to stabilize and show up again elsewhere on the island and underwater.

And "See you guys at dinner" was excellent. But my favorite line was Juliet's: "It's very stressful being an Other." I so want that saying on a nice ringed T. It's the perfect look for spring.

Liz: Let's touch on Harper, the hostile therapist with really frightening eyebrows and an uncanny resemblance to Priscilla Presley. Her full name -- "Harper Stanhope" -- is such a mouthful it just has to signify something. The closest I (and several other bloggers) can find is a reference to Charles Stanhope, who "disagreed with Edmond Burke's take on the French Revolution."

Jen: That's interesting about Stanhope. It could be an anagram of some sort, too, but I don't have the energy this a.m. to rearrange all those letters.

I wonder if Harper had experienced some weird issues with Ben, too. I am basing this on nothing concrete, but I wonder if she had tried to conceive, unsuccessfully, on the island, which made Ben angry with her and also caused a rift in her marriage. Which would make her even more likely to resent Little Miss Fertility Doctor? Again, total speculation.

Liz: Well, she certainly had something stuck up her... nose. Remember, she may also have been held on the island against her will. That's enough to make anyone mad.

Jen: True. Oh, I also thought it was funny that in the beginning, the writers set you up to think Juliet was one of the Oceanic Six because she talking about feeling like a celebrity. Clever.

Love, or the suggestion of it, was a major theme. What did you make of Jack kissing Juliet?

Liz: I'm glad you asked. I'm not sure Jack knew until that moment that he was choosing Juliet over Kate. But it was typical "don't tell me what I can't do (or have)" Jack. It may be more about his dislike of Ben than his feelings for Juliet.

Jen: Was he choosing Juliet over Kate? I'm not sure that he was.

Liz: Well, at least for now. I kept waiting for the shot of Kate seeing them kiss, but it never happened.

Jen: I see Jack and Kate as having the same conflict. Kate is drawn to Sawyer, the bad guy, as well as Jack, the good guy who could make her become a better person. Similarly, Jack is drawn to Kate, a fugitive, and Juliet, a woman with seemingly pure intentions. I do think Jack and Juliet bonded when he learned about her situation with her sister.

Speaking of Kate, I so thought of you when Charlotte hit her over the head, then said "What?" I thought, "Man, Liz has been wanting to do that for years!"

Liz: Yes, Charlotte definitely scored some points with me last night. So, want to talk about a totally unfounded rumor making the rounds?

Jen: Sure.

Liz: When Ben told Locke he'd better sit down to find out the identity of his man on the freighter we assumed Michael, right? Well, not so say the conspiracy theorists. They are speculating that Locke himself is Ben's man on the boat. Is that even possible?

Jen: Anything is possible. Especially if time goes all screwy when you leave the island. I actually would be psyched if the man on the boat were not Michael, only because it would be more shocking. We've all been saying Michael for weeks.

Liz: Right. The Michael assumption may be a total set up on the part of LindeCuse. I definitely wouldn't put it past them. They're almost as diabolical as Ben.

Jen: And we love them for it.

Okay, so the whole diffusing gas thing at the Tempest (last night's Shakespeare reference) ... what was up with that? When did Faraday and Charlotte suddenly realize they needed to go there, and how?


Dan's map. (Courtesy Lost Easter Eggs)

Liz: I have to ask, re: the Tempest -- did you also flash to the '80s version starring the John Cassavetes and Molly Ringwald?

Jen: Duh. Of course. I sometimes flash to Molly Ringwald without even being provoked. It is worth noting that the original "Tempest" is about people who wind up on an island after a shipwreck. So ... noted. Carry on.

Liz: Obviously Charlotte and Faraday had been tasked with disabling the gas from day 1. They arrived on the island with gas masks and Dan had a handy map.

Jen: True. But the situation suddenly got more dire and I wondered why. And who set up the system to unleash the gas. Charlotte said Ben, but did he really?

Liz: That use of Charlotte and Dan really reduces them to mere pawns in a Widmore vs. Ben war. Why would they agree to that? There must be something in it for them. I'm interested in what that tradeoff is. I thought about the timing, too. But this may have been their first opportunity to get to the Tempest. They've been busy helping Desmond survive his coming unstuck in time and trekking to the beach and playing cards.

Jen: Yeah, I feel like the freighter people don't fully know what the stakes of the game are. They clearly didn't know Naomi thought they were a bunch of rubes.

Jen: So next week's show ... it's Jin and Sun-centric. And we'll find out who the last two Oceanic Six survivors are. Which leads me to believe, as I said before, they are ... Jin and Sun.

Liz: Yes, it's titled "Ji Yeon" (presumably the name of Sun's baby) and Zoe Bell (of "Grindhouse" fame) will finally make her bow as -- well, we don't know.

I read one account of next week's show that cryptically read: "Ji Yeon also does something highly interesting with the flash device. Something you probably won't be able to figure out until the end." Tantalizing, no?

Jen: Indeed. This week's episode, while entertaining, didn't drop any major bombshells or deliver a twist ending. So I am hungry for one of those.

Liz: About this time, I would normally type "next week, then?" Happily, though, today we'll debut our new weekly "Lost" chat at 2 p.m. ET. And I believe there's something else you've been cooking up for us...?

Jen: Thanks for that segue, Liz. "Lost" can be a heavy show. So I thought we should put the fun back in Good Ol' Fun Times Hurley.

For starters, I came across this link to a band in Brooklyn who call themselves "Previously on Lost." That's right, each week they compose a new song about the previous week's episode. So if you're bored this afternoon, enjoy the sounds of "Be My Constant," "Ballad of Sayid" or, my favorite title, "Just Wink."

I will warn you that much of the music sounds like it was composed in someone's basement while using a 1986 Casio. But I give them points for creativity. And now, on to our more important announcement...
Presenting "Lost" Madness!

What is "Lost" Madness? It's much like March Madness, except it involves your favorite "Lost" characters instead of the North Carolina Tar Heels. In round one, which begins today, you'll vote for your favorite characters in a series of 32 match-ups. On Tuesday, round two will begin, and you'll all vote again for a series of winners to advance to the "Lost" Sweet 16. The competition will continue until we declare a "Lost" Madness Champion, otherwise known as your favorite "Lost" character of all time. It's full of bracket busters, baby!

Liz: I've already cast my votes and I'm so happy to finally be able to bracketize something in my life. I'm not much of a sports fan, alas, so this is a really welcome gizmo.

Big props to Jen and designers Jeremy Norman and Joe Hadley for getting this on the site.

Jen: Sorry, thought I was Dick Vitale for a second there. Anyway, for me it's a fun way to bridge two of the great loves in my life: "Lost" and college basketball. So please vote, and pass it on to your friends and their friends, and so on, and so on.

By Liz Kelly  | March 7, 2008; 10:52 AM ET
Categories:  Lost  
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Comments

"Lost" madness??? That's been going on for about 3 seasons now. God have mercy on you all.

Posted by: Anonymous | March 7, 2008 11:01 AM | Report abuse

Hey, I didn't see this episode, but does that map look familiar to anyone? Like really, really familiar?

Posted by: mdl rth | March 7, 2008 11:15 AM | Report abuse

1) Charlotte still annoys me.
2) Ben definitely isn't out of chips. He's not the type of man to run out.
3) The wife & I were talking about Ben's man on the boat last night and came up with a few thoughts. Everyone expects Michael, but the writers rarely do what is expected. My latest theory is that Ben's man on the boat is... wait for it... Charlie. We know that the island has healing properties of some sort. We know at least one person who died (McPatchy) didn't stay dead. We know from Hurley's flash forward that Charlie shows up in the future. And finally, we can surmise that it is someone Locke knows. Ben wouldn't tell Locke to sit down in preparation for a shock just to say, "It's John Smith. You don't know him, but that's who it is."

Posted by: fft5305 | March 7, 2008 11:16 AM | Report abuse

Juliet doesn't have exactly the most discerning taste when it comes to men. Remmber when Goodwin snapped that kid's neck without a second thought?

Whenever Locke (or any other Lostie) wakes up in the morning, he should look in the mirror, say "The Others are bad and Ben lies", and then keep repeating that to himself all day.

Posted by: Potter | March 7, 2008 11:17 AM | Report abuse

Not to throw water on the fire that's been burning so bright this season, but can we all agree that last night's episode kind of sucked? It felt lazy and recycled, and I think it was easily one of the worst of the series. Let it be said that I have absolutely no problem with that. Not every episode can be a gem, but as long as we regularly get episodes like "The Constant", I'm more than happy to pay for it with episodes like "The Other Woman."

Posted by: bigisland | March 7, 2008 11:17 AM | Report abuse

Dude, March Madness seeds teams. #1 plays #16. Yet you have Hurley and Sawyer paired up in the first round. You should have seeded them, with Hurley vs Nikki and Sawyer vs. Paulo or something.

Posted by: RT | March 7, 2008 11:18 AM | Report abuse

i was thinking maybe ben's man on the boat is ben himself. if it was michael, that revelation wouldn't require him to instruct locke to "sit down". seemed like he was about to drop a very big, confusing bombshell.

Posted by: dc | March 7, 2008 11:20 AM | Report abuse

Thanks for another great analysis, Jen and Liz! (and for March Madness--I can't believe you pitted Sawyer against Hurley!)

Sun and Jin cannot BOTH survive. To review: Oceanic Six are Kate, Jack, Hurley, Aaron, and Sayyid. Only ONE more survivor to be revealed!

Posted by: Another Kelli | March 7, 2008 11:26 AM | Report abuse

I actually preferred this week to last week. The over-arching plot has just gotten to stupid for words, I only enjoy the characters now, and Ben is great. I hate, hate, hate all of the assinine theoretical physics on this show.

Posted by: Chris | March 7, 2008 11:29 AM | Report abuse

whoops, also meant to say that i don't think locke could be the man on the boat because once locke is off the island, he's probably back to being in a wheelchair. that ship didn't look very wheelchair-accessible.

Posted by: dc | March 7, 2008 11:33 AM | Report abuse

Oh, also. 4) Jack has now moved on to Juliet because she needs rescuing from Ben and the Others. Kate doesn't "need" him any more because in Jack's mind, she has Sawyer. Now, especially that Juliet has told Jack to stay away because Ben's after her, he will be stuck to her like glue.

Posted by: fft5305 | March 7, 2008 11:33 AM | Report abuse

Wait, how can there be two for the Oceanic 6? We already know five - Jack, Kate, Hurley, Sayid, & Aaron. Or does Aaron not count because he wasn't born until after the flight crashed (though, technically, he was still on the flight)?

Posted by: Princeton | March 7, 2008 11:34 AM | Report abuse

I think most people are not counting Aaron, especially since he is considered Kate's son, and Kate was not pregnant on the flight.
I also want to concur with the horrible match-ups on Lost madness and that the people who put it together have absolutely no idea how to put together a bracket. You fools! You want to make the matchups more compelling as they move forward. Why in the world is Hurly's imaginary friend paired up with someone who we haven't even seen yet? It's just awful, you really should have done some seeding in there.

Posted by: Chris | March 7, 2008 11:40 AM | Report abuse


i believe it was confirmed by the producers, so there are 2 more spots.

guessing - sun and jin.

Posted by: aaron is not one of them | March 7, 2008 11:40 AM | Report abuse

It might be true that Widmore is planning to turn the island into some freak show/amusement park. Remember in season 2 when Sawyer and Michael were floating back to the island on the remnants of the raft and Sawyer comments on turning the island into a resort? A bit of foreshadowing? It would be pretty corny if that's how it all ends, but we've all seen the show stumble between greatness and Desperate Housewives before.

Posted by: Anonymous | March 7, 2008 11:44 AM | Report abuse

The episode 2 weeks from now is the one to keep your eye on. During the writer's strike there was much banter that if the season was reduced to 8 episodes that the final episode was (unintentionally or not?) quite the mindblower/cliffhanger whatever you want to call it such that if the season ended w/that episode, fans would still be satisfied.

Posted by: Lost | March 7, 2008 11:46 AM | Report abuse

No one has commented on the significance of the Widmore fight scene being on the Red Sox tape. That implies that Losties have left the island as recently as after Ben showed the tape to Jack. Does anyone recall if Jack watched the tape before or after the submarine exploded. This scene was not very shocking since everyone has assumed that Widmore was looking for the island because he sent Desmond on the sailing race and he purchased the diary of the Black Rock sailor. I agree that last nights episode was weak. It was the worst episode since the first group of episodes last season.

Posted by: Lake Ridge | March 7, 2008 11:47 AM | Report abuse

Just a thought about Ben's ally on the boat -- what if it's the real Sawyer, Locke's father, who wasn't really killed by James? That is something Locke would have to sit down for. I wish it would turn out to be Mr. Eko, but that's just me missing the big lug. I think Ben's tape proves nothing one way or the other about Widmore. Anyone can "fake" a video.

Posted by: scandibaby | March 7, 2008 11:47 AM | Report abuse

Random thought here: Shakespeare's "The Tempest" was supposedly written about the shipwreck of the 'Sea Venture' on the island of Bermuda in the early 1600s. That's right...Bermuda...of Bermuda Triangle fame. I forget, what's the time frame for when the 'Black Rock' ended up on the island in LOST?

Posted by: bdason | March 7, 2008 11:51 AM | Report abuse

a few thoughts -

harper and goodwin - I had the feeling that their's was an arranged marriage. It fits with the overall big picture thought process of the Others/Ben/Jacob.

the man on the boat - I think the favorites are Walt or Miles, with Walt in the clear lead. Walt would be a sit down moment for Locke, because Locke has been taking instruction from Walt. How mind blowing would it be for Locke to know that the person he was taking instruction from was taking instruction from Ben? (Miles is in 2nd as Locke would then be preventing the person who is helping them do his job.)

Posted by: SLK | March 7, 2008 11:54 AM | Report abuse

I have a wacky theory that the reason Daniel and Charlotte know what to do and when is that Daniel has been there before. Since he's unstuck in time too, right? That explains why he said "Juliet! You're not supposed to be here!" with particular inflection - he had been there before, and it had played out differently.

Posted by: bonnie | March 7, 2008 11:57 AM | Report abuse

one mind blowing followup if it is Walt on the boat....

what would be the possibility that Ben learned about the boat while Walt was in captivity with the Others. That is, at the time of captivity then-future Walt was on the freigher and present-Walt, having the ability to shift consciousness through time, could tell him about the boat.

Of course, this consciousness theory then wouldn't just apply to Walt. If Ben has this ability (which would fit somewhat) then Ben could be Ben's man on the boat. Also a sitdown moment.

Posted by: SLK | March 7, 2008 12:01 PM | Report abuse

One other point - the teaser from abc about the episode 2 weeks from now informs us that Michael's time after he left the island will be explored. While there are no mortal locks (or Lockes) in Lost world, I think Michael being the proverbial "man on the boat" is a sure thing.

Posted by: Lost | March 7, 2008 12:02 PM | Report abuse

Bonnie - oooh.. good one about Daniel. Was it just his quirky way of speaking, or was it more... I like "more".

Although until your post, I just figured they knew what to do through some of the final communications Widmore or someone else had with Dharma right before or druing the purge.

Posted by: slk | March 7, 2008 12:03 PM | Report abuse

BigIsland, I agree that last nights epeisode wasn't that great; especially when compared to last week's "The Constant." But series' do have ebbs and flows, so no biggie. I thought this episode was more about ben than anyone else, and just using juliette as the vehicle. It was fun to see ben prancing around, both in flashbacks and after he had negotiated his freedom with locke.

As for the spy on the freighter, it could be anybody, but my bet is on michael just because it makes the most sense (and thats what we have been pushing since the start of the season). It would be a total mind-blow if it was charlie or even ben himself, although that would take a lot of explaining to do because as far as we know the ship is only 30 minutes or so faster than the island, and that whole death thing with charlie or ben communicating with himeself.

Which brings me to my observation, it appears that alot more characters are doing the crazy time jump thing that they are letting on. Farraday seems to be living life backwards, having no idea whats going on one minute and then having a mastery of whats going on the next with knowledge he shouldn't have. And i think ben, in a similar style, is getting out of situations by time-jumping and leaving himself bargaining chips when necessary.

Also, i assume everytime i hear those voices it is the work of jacob. but it was interesting to see both juliette and jack interacting with him (as the therapist).

til next week.

Posted by: DudeAbides | March 7, 2008 12:04 PM | Report abuse

Another comment on the overanalysis of why Ben new there would be survivors of the crash. Remember, he said that the tail looked like it was heading into the water, which it did, and it is much easier to survive a crash into the water than on land. Also, Ben told Ethan to go where the fusilage landed, because there "might" be survivors there, he did not know ahead of time that there would be survivors.

Posted by: Chris | March 7, 2008 12:05 PM | Report abuse

Not to be a spoil sport but, how did Ben become in charge of the others and who are they. Remember, her killed the original people in the complex when he was a boy or young man. How then did he take over and eventually get the resources he had to apparently be able to leave the island as he pleases.

I think that he must have made some sort of deal with some other group (Widmore ???) or even Hanso to continue the work on the island and doublecrossed someone in the process. Otherwise, Ben and his crew would truly be a bunch of barefoot castaways with no resources

Posted by: Greg | March 7, 2008 12:11 PM | Report abuse

slk:

Two things about Daniel: 1)He said "Juliet! You're not supposed to BE here", rather than the more common "Juliet! YOU'RE not supposed to be here."
2)I think he drew his own map to the Tempest.

Posted by: bonnie | March 7, 2008 12:13 PM | Report abuse

A request re. "Lost Madness"...could the bracket sheet be made available for easy download and priniting, please?

Posted by: ckf | March 7, 2008 12:15 PM | Report abuse

Yea, how could you pit Hurley and Sawyer against each other??? They are my top 2! I went with Sawyer, but that was a tough one.

Posted by: Chicago | March 7, 2008 12:18 PM | Report abuse

I don't think Aaron is one of the 6. Everyone seems to think that Aaron is Kate's son. So my theory is that part of the big ruse was that she was 5-6 months pregnant on the plane and had him on the island. Obviously there would be an age difference but we actually don't know when they get off the island so it might not be that obvious and there must have been an agreement amongst the survivors as to the happenings on the island that Jack so clearly recited at her trial. That leaves us two survivors left to be revealed. Or I am completely wrong and Aaron is one of the six.

Posted by: Anonymous | March 7, 2008 12:19 PM | Report abuse

Go Heels! Ben Linus is a Duke fan.

Posted by: 75vega | March 7, 2008 12:21 PM | Report abuse

"...it is much easier to survive a crash into the water than on land." True story: water is harder than the ground at falling from thousands of feet speeds. If your parachute doesn't open, the worst thing you could do is aim for a body of water.

Posted by: jw | March 7, 2008 12:23 PM | Report abuse

Last night's episode felt like one of the many stalling-for-time episdoes of last year. Except for the Charlotte-Kate catfight; then it felt like an episode of "Alias."

Posted by: SAF | March 7, 2008 12:33 PM | Report abuse

SAF --- Alias
That is exactly what I said to my wife after last nights episode. The two "evil" groups getting ready for a big show down, the girls fighting each other, the strange plot twists.
I turned to my wife and said when did they bring Alias back without Jennifer Garner?

Posted by: DW | March 7, 2008 12:38 PM | Report abuse

Although I agree there could be some time-jumping going on all over the place, wouldn't that mean we'd see Ben's limp body every now and then, when he visits the ship/outside/etc. Same thing with Daniel and Charlotte.

Posted by: kc | March 7, 2008 12:38 PM | Report abuse

Your bracket is ridiculous. Did you even consider ranking the characaters and not just matching them up based on a category? How can you have Hurley and Sawyer matched up in the first round? or Kate and Claire? I don't think this will tell you who the true fan favorite is.

Posted by: Lost Madness...whatever | March 7, 2008 12:44 PM | Report abuse

Some else already mentioned it, but I think the man on the boat is Ben, as well. and I think Michael is one of the 6 - Maybe the person in the coffin.

Posted by: TL | March 7, 2008 12:48 PM | Report abuse

I just have to say I am so frustrated.

My local affiliate out here in Wisconsin moved Lost to 1 am. Why? Because local high school basketball playoffs needed to be aired.

I have to go watch the ep online later today...grrr...

Posted by: Chasmosaur | March 7, 2008 12:53 PM | Report abuse

Jen, about that shirt you wanted....

http://www.cafepress.com/stressfulother

Posted by: shirtgal | March 7, 2008 12:59 PM | Report abuse

What is up with that bracket? Sawyer against Hurley? Really?

Posted by: oceana | March 7, 2008 1:04 PM | Report abuse

Didn't Daniel Farraday ask if Desmond had recently been exposed to radiation or something electromagnetic when trying to figure out why he was "confused" on the ship? Couldn't this be related to the incident with the hatch explosion?

Posted by: SouthernerInDC | March 7, 2008 1:19 PM | Report abuse

Dont understand how Ben could be his own man on the boat - as someone mentioned, the boats reality is only an hour or so ahead of the islands reality...even considering the ratio of time elapsed when traveling back and forth (more time spent in the past than in the future), doesnt make sense does it?

Posted by: CSH | March 7, 2008 1:23 PM | Report abuse

I think DudeAbides has it right. Dan and Ben (and Charlotte) are living the mind-travel reality that freaked Desmond out, but they have better control of it, heading back into the past with information on how not to let something happen or do it differently, as Des did. Ben is an expert at it, Desmond is a complete amateur, Dan is learning how to use it out of scientific curiosity, and Charlotte is learning it to challenge Ben on his terms in the future. She already had one success, wearing the bullet proof vest when Ben shot her, which scared the bejezzus out of Ben if you watch it again, since it seems Ben now has a real adversary.

The mole on the ship - Miles, since Miles seemed to give Ben a message when he tried to extort him. If Miles really knew who Ben was and what he could do, the last thing he would do is try to extort him.

Has anyone tried to determine the time lags when traveling to and from the island? The missle should have landed in a minute but took about 30 minutes. The chopper should have landed in 30 minutes but took over a day. So it seems things travel much slower going to and from the island. About 30 times slower. Now consider Michael and Walt. Their boat moves much slower than the helicopter. So it would take weeks to reach the distance of the freighter. I'm expecting an episode where we see Michael/Walt making that journey and finding the freighter after having gone 40 miles in about a month or however long its been since they left in the boat, but only a few hours of their time.

Posted by: Sully | March 7, 2008 1:24 PM | Report abuse

ok, lost madness is gimped. how can you have hurley face off against sawyer in round 1!!!!???!!! that's preposterous. that should be like the last round competition there.

Posted by: 3inst3in | March 7, 2008 1:25 PM | Report abuse

Yes, mdl rth, the map does have some similarities to Middle Earth - but not entirely. Still, very clever.

Posted by: youmeanmiddleearth? | March 7, 2008 1:30 PM | Report abuse

If it's not Locke in the coffin, then I have no idea who the other two O6 are...

What's with the $3.2 million dollars - Locke knows about it too?

Posted by: ami | March 7, 2008 1:52 PM | Report abuse

kate told locke that miles had bargained with ben for $3.2 million.

Posted by: dc | March 7, 2008 1:53 PM | Report abuse

All of the back and forth between the Bad Ben and the Good Ben ended last night.

Once he advised Locke that he had taped over a Red Sox game, Ben certified himself as, Evil.

Posted by: Nor'Easter | March 7, 2008 1:57 PM | Report abuse

Stanhope anagram. See link below. This list gave me a new one:

Hanso Pet

Hmmmmm....

http://www.ssynth.co.uk/~gay/cgi-bin/nph-an?line=stanhope&words=2&dict=dat&doai=on

Posted by: Michael In VA | March 7, 2008 2:03 PM | Report abuse

does Ben taping over the Red Sox game, presumably the same tape he shows Jack while Jack wasbeing held "prisoner", mea that the video footage of Charles Whitmore was fairly recent?

Posted by: Ryan in Chicago | March 7, 2008 2:08 PM | Report abuse

I worked until midnight last night and stayed up until 1:00 to watch the episode once I came home. What a waste! Very disappointing. And who are they fooling with their teaser for next week - "you'll see a face you never thought you'd see again"? Well, given that Harold Perrineau's name has been in the credits since Jan., don't count on us being too surprised...

Posted by: Joy | March 7, 2008 2:38 PM | Report abuse

does Ben taping over the Red Sox game, presumably the same tape he shows Jack while Jack wasbeing held "prisoner", mea that the video footage of Charles Whitmore was fairly recent?

Posted by: Ryan in Chicago | March 7, 2008 02:08 PM

Yes, I think so.

Posted by: Lost at Work | March 7, 2008 3:04 PM | Report abuse

A few thoughts:
1) stop whining about the LOST Madness game. We get it...you don't like that it's not seeded. We don't need 20 of the same comments. You know you could say, "hey even though I don't like the way the matchups are set, thank you so much to the Washington Post (and .com) staff for dedicating so much space to this great show and us the fans!"

2) I agree with some others that the "man" on the ship isn't Michael...too obvious and the writers don't tend to swing that way. I do however like the idea of Walt. Perhaps the large (apparently) black man with the binoculars from last weeks ep (http://losteastereggs.blogspot.com/2008/03/man-at-observation-desk.html) could be a much aged Walt.

3) Jen and Liz, thanks for another great week of filling an otherwise boring, gray Friday. But I can't believe you all missed the line of the ep. Ben looks at the Rabbit and says to Locke, "Are you sure this didn't have a number on it?" (in ref to the "promo" video of the Dr. Candle in the Orchid orientation video) The writers really love us fans!

Posted by: Da Plane Da Plane | March 7, 2008 3:04 PM | Report abuse

"Are you sure this didn't have a number on it?"

That was an excellent line; it made me laugh outloud!

Posted by: Lost at Work | March 7, 2008 3:07 PM | Report abuse

And as for Juliet and Jack's "couple" name, I think it has be JACKET. Definitely.

Posted by: Lost at Work | March 7, 2008 3:09 PM | Report abuse

It's got to be Michael on the boat somewhere. Not necessarily the mole, but "the friend" who unlocked the door at least. It's not the most exciting answer, but I think it's him. Look at the facts: Episode #8 is Michael centric. I bet they reveal Michael on the boat in the last few minutes of next episode to nicely set up episode 8. And the teaser for next week talked about seeing someone we never thought we'd see again. It would be awesome if it were someone really twisted, but I think this is an easy call this time... at least I think so.

Posted by: kkn4 | March 7, 2008 3:12 PM | Report abuse

In regards to the whispering voices - I thought it was just The Others making noises to scare the Losties. And that they made the noises to distract Juliet when Harper was showing up and did the same thing again so she could slip out unnoticed.

Though the biggest question for sure is: Why couldn't The Others just take care of stopping Faraday and Charlotte themselves? Why did they have to ask Juliet to do it?

Posted by: Sawyer's Mom | March 7, 2008 3:13 PM | Report abuse

while i thought this episode was mediocre in terms of excitement and plot, just watching Ben act like a two year old ("you're mine!") was priceless.

Posted by: Anonymous | March 7, 2008 3:14 PM | Report abuse

Can we get a new love interest for Sawyer? You know, a Juliet for James? Kate is so annoying and it would be such sweet revenge for BOTH Jack and Sawyer to be with someone else... is it too late in the game? How about Charlotte? She isn't my first choice (I am), but at least she whacked Kate, that counts for something.

Posted by: mango | March 7, 2008 3:28 PM | Report abuse

Not that any of these literary references really help in making sense of things...but Ben's decision to send Goodwin off to the battlefield certainly reminded me of the Biblical David who sent his lover Bathsheba's husband off to the front lines to be massacred.

Theoretically, one could argue Ben, in the form of David, slayed Goliath, the Dharma group, with a sling-shot (in the form of a ton of poisonous gas). At the same time, there are certainly a number of messiah issues floating around here and there, but, I'm not sure how useful the comparison is...unless, of course, he's also playing a Solomon role and his verdict to split the baby somehow helps explain why Kate and Aaron make it back to civilization while Claire does not.

Posted by: Bilbo B. | March 7, 2008 3:31 PM | Report abuse

I wonder if Widmore is a red herring. I think the boat may be Widmore's, but if Widmore was the person trying to get Ben or the island, wouldn't Ben have Sayid go after Widmore. There seems to be someone important who Sayid or Ben don't have any information about, who may be more important than Widmore.

Posted by: aep | March 7, 2008 3:56 PM | Report abuse

"Kate is drawn to Sawyer, the bad guy, as well as Jack, the good guy who could make her become a better person."

Wow. That right there is about the most simplistic, stereotypical interepetation of these characters I've ever seen. And how sad that it's coming from a woman. Jack can "make" Kate become "a better person?" What, by the power of his transcendent, Christ-like love and powers of forgiveness? Even though he spends most of his time on the island not trusting her, blaming her for things, and shutting her out?

And Sawyer is "the bad guy?" Funny how this bad guy was also the one who was willing to kneel in the rain to take a bullet in the head just to spare Kate's life, while Jack leaves her in handcuffs with the Others to go home on a submarine, on the slim chance he'll get to come back someday. It's quite obvious from the writing and the acting which one of these two men is in love with Kate... and it sure as hell ain't Jack.

What show are you ladies watching? I think I just lost all respect for your point of view on these characters.

Posted by: Sarah | March 7, 2008 4:03 PM | Report abuse

I love the idea of the "Previously on Lost" band.

Another Juliet quotation shirt:

http://www.zazzle.com/it_s_very_stressful_being_an_other_shirt-235847572197956361

Posted by: detour | March 7, 2008 4:05 PM | Report abuse

In light of last week's fantasmagorical Penny/Desmond story and episode in general, I must say the whole Jack-Kate-Juliet nonsense was BOR-ING.

Posted by: ayepenny | March 7, 2008 4:27 PM | Report abuse

Evidently, Harper Stanhope is a reference to Harper Lee, author of "To Kill A Mockingbird" - a book about mistaken identity and alienation. At least according to the fab bloggers over at The Transmission...

And Sarah - they don't mean Sawyer's literally a bad guy -- he's more of a "bad boy." And I agree and lurve him!

Posted by: Gretchen | March 7, 2008 4:39 PM | Report abuse

I THINK THE BEN'S GUY ON THE BOAT IS SAYID

Posted by: MR | March 7, 2008 4:47 PM | Report abuse

"To Kill a Mockingbird" is about doing what is right and moral not what is easy. It has nothing to do with mistaken identity and little to do with alienation. There were no mistakes in identity in the book. If you don't want to read, rent the movie with Gregory Peck -- a must see classic.

Posted by: mockingbird | March 7, 2008 4:50 PM | Report abuse

WHAT!!? There is no way that Sayid is Ben's man on the boat. That's just ridiculous!

Posted by: Heather | March 7, 2008 4:51 PM | Report abuse

Could the man on the boat be Locke's Dad?

Posted by: Jeremy | March 7, 2008 4:52 PM | Report abuse

What book was Ben reading while he was a prisoner? Couldn't catch the title.

Posted by: LHaynes | March 7, 2008 4:55 PM | Report abuse

Re: This poster's comment: "I don't think Aaron is one of the 6. Everyone seems to think that Aaron is Kate's son. So my theory is that part of the big ruse was that she was 5-6 months pregnant on the plane and had him on the island."

....Someone else may have addressed this, but my assumption when kate called the baby in the crib Aaron, was that it was Claire's son. Isn't he named Aaron? So, Claire was somehow killed and Kate brought her son back -- am I alone in that theory?

Posted by: kar | March 7, 2008 4:55 PM | Report abuse

I don't think is safe to assume Claire is dead...would she give up seeing her son grow up so that he has a life that exists outside the island? I think so, but I'm just not sure how this all goes down.

Posted by: LHaynes | March 7, 2008 5:03 PM | Report abuse

Yes - I've always thought that the crash of Flight 815 was "engineered" - to bring the listees to the Island. I used to think there was some sort of tractor beam at work - that worked on aircraft or sea vessels - that would account for the small plane containing the drug smugglers, the hot air balloon, the Black Rock and 815 - or some facet of the strange electromagnetic field. Minkowski said something about the dinghy he and his coworker was in being "drawn" to the island. Much as Prospero the magician conjures the storm that brings his nemesis to the island - someone - whether Ben or "Jacob" made this happen.

In terms of "Tempest" analogy - I think smokey is the Sycorax - a long dead witch of possibly African origin - and perhaps Jacob is Caliban, her deformed and grotesque humanoid son. That would leave Ben to be Prospero - though so far we can't know how he might have been "wronged" - either by Mr. Widmore or anyone else - since he mostly looks like the one doing the wrong rather than the wrongee.

If you have some spare time (ha ha) you might enjoy watching Peter Greenaway's 1991 "Prospero's Books" or Derek Jarman's 1979 "The Tempest". Both are far more avant garde than Paul Mazursky's 1982 "The Tempest" starring John Cassavetes and Molly Ringwald.

"Prospero's Books", in particular, makes the point that the books are central to Prospero's magic. Thus, it was interesting to see Ben (re) reading Philip Dick in his confinement.

Posted by: Jean | March 7, 2008 5:03 PM | Report abuse

At one point in Juliet's flashback she tells Ben that a couple of the kids keep asking about their mother in L.A., and Ben says something like 'Well their names are on the list...' Yet another clue that the crash was planned.
And back when the Losties thought the frieghties were good and they were about to leave the island, were they just going to leave the kids behind with the Others?

Posted by: Koygya | March 7, 2008 5:38 PM | Report abuse

Kar, you're not alone. For some reason, tons of Lost fans think Kate is trying to pass off Claire's son Aaron as her own biological son. While I'll never rule ANYTHING out on this show, I really don't think that's what's happening. Does no one recognize the legitimacy of adoption? Kate could still refer to Aaron as her "son" and "child" if she adopted him after his mother died giving birth to him on a desert island, which seems to be the story the Six are telling people. Even so, I don't think Aaron counts as one of the Oceanic Six, because he wasn't on the flight or the manifest. Just my take, of course. I'll never pretend to have any idea what's really going on :)

Posted by: muffins | March 7, 2008 5:40 PM | Report abuse

As I have previously posted on here, the flight of the rocket from the freighter to the island was supposed to take about 28 seconds and actually took 31 minutes, which would yield roughly a 60 to 1 ratio. But if time on the island is really that far behind, then the Losties would have already been on the island 5,940 days (94 days x 60) or about 16 years and the flight from the island to the freighter would have taken 20 hours. So I don't think it is as simple as just time slowing down. Something else must happen with time but I am not sure what it is. Theories?

Posted by: Mr. T | March 7, 2008 5:40 PM | Report abuse

I think Ben is able to control "being unstuck from time". Similar to what Desmond is going through, but Ben is a able to control it. That would explain why he knows everything and is still masterminding the situation. That would also explain why he wanted to be captured. He spends most of his time alone in a room, which would allow him to time travel. What if the guy getting the crap kicked out of him in the video is Sayid? He may also be the saboteur on the ship if he's later unstuck from time. Remember he was a communications officer and is now working for Ben in the future.

Posted by: D | March 7, 2008 5:41 PM | Report abuse

Would a red sox fan ever record over them winning the series. I think not.

Posted by: Lost Art | March 7, 2008 5:48 PM | Report abuse

I have to agree with a number of the posters that this episode was not up to the standard of the first 5 shows this year but I can understand how difficult it would be to keep it at that high level on every show. Hopefully they will rebound swiftly. I do agree with one poster that this show was really more about Ben than Juliet. Unfortunately, I thought Ben was going thru the motions in this episode. The whole "You're mine" line was way overdone and slightly ridiculous in the context of the scene. He came across as petulant and almost goofy rather than the evil genious he usually is. That being said, I'm hooked for the run of this show whereever it leads.

Posted by: emcdoj | March 7, 2008 6:00 PM | Report abuse

i'm curious as to why flashbacks now for juliet? we've only seen flashforwards up to this point in all of season 4 until this one.

i was looking forward to seeing how juliet's life would turn out, but yet nothing. does this signify that anyone who doesn't get off the island does not have a future life? stuck in time? stuck on the island?

don't get me wrong, still love the flashbacks to fill in back story, but i just wonder if this change from flashforward to flashback has any significance...

Posted by: no flashbacks | March 7, 2008 6:04 PM | Report abuse

More Anagrams:

Stanhope = Hoe Pants
Possibly relating to her OWN extra-marital affairs ...

Harper Stanhope =
Partner Has Hope
Hope Ran Past Her
The Hanso Rapper

Posted by: Sixagon | March 7, 2008 6:24 PM | Report abuse

I think Jacob morphs into different people.. Jack's dad.. the woman last night

Posted by: Bob | March 7, 2008 6:42 PM | Report abuse

I think the theory on Ben being able to jump back in forth in time may turn out to be true. I have gone back to watch the episode again but when Locke first opened the safe I only saw the tape. Then later there was the files. Maybe I just missed it or did Ben put the files in the safe once he knew Locke was hooked by the video of Widmore?

Posted by: Bigchuckdogg | March 7, 2008 7:14 PM | Report abuse

"More Anagrams:

Stanhope = Hoe Pants
Possibly relating to her OWN extra-marital affairs ..."

Sixagon, that was too funny. I also like The Hanso Rapper. Both may turn out to be true.

One intrigiung thought about who is timetraveling on the island - didn't Daniel Farraday say to Charlotte about the Tempest mission, "What if I can't do it this time?" while they were walking to the station? Or am I remembering that wrong?

Posted by: Mr. T | March 7, 2008 7:52 PM | Report abuse

I'm not a Juliette fan so didn't particularly enjoy the episode. One curious thing for me is that last night's show seems to imply that she is on the up and up and that she came to the island with pure intentions. But I noticed for the first time (although I've seen the crash about a dozen times) the entirely inappropriate reactions (or lack thereof) of Juliette and the Others (excluding Ben) to the plane crash. She and Ethan are doctors! Wouldn't they want to offer aid to any possible survivors? Instead she doesn't bat an eye as Ben sends Goodwin and Ethan off to infiltrate the groups of survivors. If it were a surprise wouldn't someone scream or at least say "Wow"? And she certainly takes the kidnapping of the surviving children in stride. So it seems that she has to know a lot more than she lets on and is in fact complicit with Ben.

Posted by: Bowie | March 7, 2008 8:42 PM | Report abuse

....Someone else may have addressed this, but my assumption when kate called the baby in the crib Aaron, was that it was Claire's son. Isn't he named Aaron? So, Claire was somehow killed and Kate brought her son back -- am I alone in that theory?
Posted by: kar | March 7, 2008 04:55 PM

Yes, the overarching theory of fans is that Kate has for some reason yet to be seen taken Aaron as her own. As for the people asking, "why don't people think she just adopted him?", do you REALLY think that any judge would let an accused murderer (among other things she's being tried for) adopt a baby? I think not. I think it's pretty clear from the way the episode was played that Kate is passing off Aaron as her own.

Posted by: kkn4 | March 7, 2008 9:46 PM | Report abuse

...The whole "You're mine" line was way overdone and slightly ridiculous in the context of the scene. He came across as petulant and almost goofy rather than the evil genious he usually is...
Posted by: emcdoj | March 7, 2008 06:00 PM

Actually, I think Michael Emerson played this all brilliantly! Shows the other side of Ben's genius being an emotionally stunted man.

Posted by: kkn4 | March 7, 2008 9:47 PM | Report abuse

Sixagon, I think Liz should give you Celebritology Comment of the Week for your anagrams! That was hilarious. I think you have unlocked the secret of Lost with that one post. Thank you, I really needed a laugh today.

Posted by: kkn4 | March 7, 2008 9:48 PM | Report abuse

John and Ben are relating as if John had not been shot by Ben then left for dead in the pit filled with corpses. John, too trusting in the past, looks as if he may not have learned from earlier betrayals.

Posted by: Cheri | March 7, 2008 11:35 PM | Report abuse

Often I feel lost when watching Lost.

www.IGotUGGs.com
www.BehindtheApprovalMatrix.com

Posted by: haqikah | March 8, 2008 1:43 AM | Report abuse

Re: the plane crash we've seen several times now -- Ben assumes there will be survivors because he knows it's not an ordinary crash. The scene we've seen looks very odd -- the plane breaks apart in mid-air for no reason and the pieces go off in different directions. I'm beginning to assume that wasn't just sloppy CGI. It looks like a Star-Trek style "tractor beam" pulled it apart. In which case, the pieces might fall more gently than they would due to gravity alone.

Posted by: Charodon | March 8, 2008 2:47 AM | Report abuse

Good point about the "others" reactions to the crash. Most folks would be shocked seeing a plane break apart in flight. So they must have been expecting something and Bens needs a list of surviors to compare against his own list. Also maybe Clare was pushed to the flight by Ben's opertives(sp). Aaron could be the child that the others want, since they take the kids from the surviors, they just do not know he was not born yet. Kate takes him off the island to keep him away from Ben??? Just an idea

Posted by: CrudeinTX | March 8, 2008 9:54 AM | Report abuse

I've got so many different ideas, I can't decide where to start ...

Oh, wait - how about this? It's Walt on the boat, but he's all grown up - and Harold Perrineau is playing Walt as an adult! Just a little bit of makeup and he could look sufficiently different to be the son instead of the father. Since time acts so very weirdly around the island, perhaps the sailboat took years to get away, instead of months. And Walt obviously has some bond with the island (perhaps the "good" spirit vs. Ben's "bad" one), and he wants to get back.

Posted by: blondie | March 8, 2008 9:59 AM | Report abuse

"Stanhope" is the name of the main character in Charles Williams' novel "The Descent into Hell." He is the mysterious poet with a strange spiritual power. The plot involves his writing a play, also with strange spiritual power, based upon "The Tempest" and characters shipwrecked on an island!

Posted by: Gene Veith | March 8, 2008 10:45 AM | Report abuse

Anyone have any coments about the scene in the previews showing Claire jumping into the water holding Aaron?

Posted by: Witchy | March 8, 2008 11:59 AM | Report abuse

Just read the transcript to yesterday's chat which I missed. Someone wondered why Claire all of a sudden was stepping up and asking Locke to talk to Miles. Unfortunately, I think that this is setting her up for a confrontation of some sort with Miles or those on the freighter that ultimately is going to lead to her death, which will set Kate up to have to care for Aaron. She's choosing to step up now and will assert herself in someway which will be her downfall in an episode to come.

Posted by: Lost at Work | March 8, 2008 4:30 PM | Report abuse

weighing in - i wouldn't trust Juliet as far as I could throw her.
Something is off with her - she always seems to be kinda hypnotized. Ben does too, come to think of it. I'm not saying they have been literally hypnotized.... I'm just saying.

In The Tempest, Caliban represents the earthy and uncontrolled instincts of man (and woman). He's uncivilized in the sense of not being socialized, he is basic and true. Just a comment.

I still think Kate kidnaps Aaron and will believe that until the show proves otherwise. Although the depth of guilt that Jack and Kate both feel after the island must go deeper than this.

This show made me realize I no longer trust *anyone* on the show. Well, I trust Hurley. And Sawyer. So... never mind.

Posted by: cam | March 8, 2008 7:05 PM | Report abuse

"I still think Kate kidnaps Aaron and will believe that until the show proves otherwise. Although the depth of guilt that Jack and Kate both feel after the island must go deeper than this."

I think that if this were the case, Jack would have had a much stronger reaction to Kate asking him to come see Aaron than just turning her down and looking sad. He would have said something alluding to it if she had really stonlen Aaron. He would have been angry with her - Jack would never be OK with it if Kate stole Aaron. His look and words were more sadness, probably about Claire not being around (and perhaps him not being able to save her) than anger at Kate stealing him.

Posted by: Lost at Work | March 8, 2008 7:41 PM | Report abuse

LostAtWork - good point. still I have this gut feeling. maybe Jack doesn't know Kate kidnapped Aaron - feels responsible for whatever took Claire's life and/or believes the child is Sawyers.

actually - do we *know* that Claire ends up dead? hmmm.

Posted by: cam | March 8, 2008 8:17 PM | Report abuse

No, we don't know for sure that Claire dies, but I'm worried for her. Either way, she's separated from Aaron and that can't be good.

Posted by: Lost at Work | March 8, 2008 8:32 PM | Report abuse

GOOD NEWS!I HAVE EVER READ ONE ABOUT THIS TOPIC AT A niche interracial dating site iasiancenter.com,HOWEVER,IT seems THAT it is be different from the one HERE*****

Posted by: susanli1985 | March 8, 2008 10:10 PM | Report abuse

just can't let this end on the note that what is found here is different from what is found on an interractial dating blog.
it's an astute observation, of course, but moving right along....

i wonder if Ben's *man* on the boat is the same *friend* who opens the door so Sayid and Desmond and the other guy can get to the communications room for Des to call Penny.

if Ben's contact is helping Sayid and Desmond... then 1) he's not *really* helping them or 2) he's no longer allied with Ben or 3) Ben *wants* to help Des contact Penny for some reason.

Or the lines between "the good guys" and "the bad guys" is really starting to blur - perhaps as lessons are learned and motivations are shifted. who's good, who's bad, who knows?

The name Locke also makes me think of Lockwood, who is the narrator of Wuthering Heights. It is common to think of Nellie Dean as the narrator, but actually she is telling the story to Lockwood who in turn is telling the story to us.

Obscure? You bet. Helpful? Probably not. But ya never know.


Posted by: cam | March 9, 2008 2:38 PM | Report abuse

Ben's spy on the freighter isn't Michael...it's Walt. Just you wait.

Posted by: GD | March 10, 2008 12:03 AM | Report abuse

I think Michael is on the boat, but I don't think he is Ben's man. As everyone else has already noted, it is way too obvious. And the writer's knew that by putting Harold's name in the credits, everyone would be trying to figure out when we are going to see him again.
I'm hoping his mole turns out to be a jaw dropper. So excited!

Posted by: Ohyouknow | March 10, 2008 11:55 AM | Report abuse

As I have previously posted on here, the flight of the rocket from the freighter to the island was supposed to take about 28 seconds and actually took 31 minutes, which would yield roughly a 60 to 1 ratio. But if time on the island is really that far behind, then the Losties would have already been on the island 5,940 days (94 days x 60) or about 16 years and the flight from the island to the freighter would have taken 20 hours. So I don't think it is as simple as just time slowing down. Something else must happen with time but I am not sure what it is. Theories?

Posted by: Mr. T | March 7, 2008 05:40 PM

I wish that more people would understand this....so many people think that there is a 31 minute time difference.....NO THERE IS NOT!

Posted by: Heather | March 10, 2008 12:54 PM | Report abuse

"Ben's spy on the freighter isn't Michael...it's Walt. Just you wait."
Posted by: GD | March 10, 2008 12:03 AM

But why would Locke need to sit down before Ben tells him who it is if its Walt. Locke might be surprised, but not shocked. He would be shocked if it as Locke himself, or Locke's dad as someone else pondered. I was thinking it was Miles but that would not be shocking either. So its either someone who Lockes believes is dead or someone Locke does not believe would be working with Ben.

My list:
-Naomi
-Miles (I'll keep him on the list since it seems logical to me)
-McPatchy (almost too obvious but not shocking enough)
-Walt (makes some sense but that would instantly make Ben a good guy and I would be surprised the writers would do that now).
-Locke himself, who ends up on the freighter in the future, mind travels back to, say, a week from now when Locke and Ben are working together and tells Ben, then Ben mind travels back with the information so he knows it now. So the shock will not just be the mind traveling but that Locke and Ben will work together in the near future.

"I have a wacky theory that the reason Daniel and Charlotte know what to do and when is that Daniel has been there before. Since he's unstuck in time too, right? That explains why he said "Juliet! You're not supposed to be here!" with particular inflection - he had been there before, and it had played out differently."
Posted by: bonnie | March 7, 2008 11:57 AM

This makes a lot of sense and also explains the spooky visit by Harper Stanhope. She disappears, like Walt has done numerous times. This is different that mind traveling. Its a ghost-like manifestation. I believe this is a new ability that the Others have and taught Walt. They can travel not only in time but in space and, in this case, Harper tells Jack and Juliet about the Tempest, which they then try to stop. The question is whether Dan was telling the truth or not about disabling the gas. If the Others are the good guys, then stopping Dan makes Dan a bad guy, or at least doing something bad whether he knows it or not. So assume Dan and Charlotte were successful in releasing the gas, then Harper goes back a few hours in time and tells Jack/Juliet to stop it, which they do. Dan had to stop the release since his mask was off.

Considering Goodwin, I'm thinking that Harper had something to do with him ending up dead. I was thinking for a while that if Harper could time trip, then she could have gone back and stopped his affair with Juliet, but never underestimate a woman scorned. Once it happened, in her mind it was forever, and changing the past would never be enough. Killing Goodwin would satisfy Harper and Ben. Ben says to Juliet that the tailies must have discovered that Goodwin was not one of them. Hmmmm, I'll need to think back to those episides and see whether that information got to Anna Lucia somehow through Harper time tripping or manifesting herself.

Posted by: Sully | March 10, 2008 1:23 PM | Report abuse

Harper Stanhope anagrams to "Perhaps An Other." Not sure if that means much, but I thought it was clever.

Posted by: Kg | March 12, 2008 4:10 PM | Report abuse

If you have some spare time (ha ha) you might enjoy watching Peter Greenaway's 1991 "Prospero's Books" or Derek Jarman's 1979 "The Tempest". Both are far more avant garde than Paul Mazursky's 1982 "The Tempest" starring John Cassavetes and Molly Ringwald.

"Prospero's Books", in particular, makes the point that the books are central to Prospero's magic. Thus, it was interesting to see Ben (re) reading Philip Dick in his confinement.

Posted by: Jean | March 7, 2008 05:03 PM

* * * * * * *

I second Jean's recommendation of Prospero's Books if for no other reason than because it is such a visually stunning film. (And to listen to Gielgud's voice.) It is a flawed, but daring work.

Posted by: Anonymous | March 12, 2008 5:24 PM | Report abuse

All of this discussion is great. Tons of ideas that open up all sorts of possibilities for next season.

But, you're all missing something.

Hurley is going to drag the O-6 back. Think about that. Screw the "right now," 'cause that obviously doesn't matter. Or, well, maybe it does. But, still.

They are going back.

There is much fun to be had.

Posted by: notforyou1 | March 13, 2008 2:16 AM | Report abuse

Yeah, that reminds me that on this episode Hurley said something about, "I'm lucky" or "we're in luck," or anyway, LUCK--and then a shadow crossed his face. Because he was the "lucky" winner of the lottery back in the real world and everything went to hell.

Posted by: waster | March 13, 2008 12:34 PM | Report abuse

MESSAGE

Posted by: ISHMAel back | March 13, 2008 6:29 PM | Report abuse

MESSAGE

Posted by: ISHMAel back | March 23, 2008 4:26 AM | Report abuse

MESSAGE

Posted by: ISHMAel back | March 23, 2008 4:26 AM | Report abuse

MESSAGE

Posted by: ISHMAel back | March 23, 2008 4:27 AM | Report abuse

MESSAGE

Posted by: ISHMAel back | March 23, 2008 4:27 AM | Report abuse

MESSAGE

Posted by: ISHMAel back | March 23, 2008 4:27 AM | Report abuse

MESSAGE

Posted by: ISHMAel back | March 23, 2008 4:27 AM | Report abuse

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