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Snyder and Gibbs want more Hall of Famers


(1987 AP photo)


Last thing from Canton. When I briefly chatted with Daniel Snyder during the Russ Grimm after-party, he mentioned, unprompted, that he wanted more Hall of Fame parties in the future.

"It's just the beginning," Snyder said. "We expect more. We're excited. We need Chris Hanburger in the Hall of Fame. Nine Pro Bowls, defensive MVP of the NFL....It's a big list. We've got to keep going, across the board. Theismann. Jacoby's a Hall of Fame player...."

And Joe Gibbs agreed.

(Skipping over Theismann reference.)

"That was four Super Bowls in 11 years," Gibbs said of his first era. "I'm really hoping that a number of our other guys will get in. I'm gonna start really trying to focus on that myself.

"That guy right there, that guy should be in, I can tell you that," Gibbs continued, pointing to Jacoby. "He was a stalwart in one of the best offensive lines that has ever been a part of palying in the NFL. I get credit for going to Super Bowls with three different quarterbacks -- think about it, those guys protected three different quarterbacks. We have a number of other guys on that team that deserve to get in."

"Hell, probably half the Hogs," Neal Olkewicz said, when I asked who should be next.

"Probably Jake," Jim Lachey said.

"I think it'll be Jacoby," Jeff Bostic said. "I thought he'd go in before Russ. He's a 13-year starter, he's a four-time Pro Bowler, he's a three-time world champion, four Super Bowl appearances. I mean, if Rayfield Wright's in, Joe Jacoby should be in."

That's kind of a consensus. Hey, since they all brought it up, here's what Jacoby had to say about his own candidacy.

"I don't think about it," he said. "I don't. I can't plan any of that. If it happens, that's great. I've said it to a couple other people, playing with Russ, Darrell Art, Coach Gibbs, John Riggins, I got to play with Hall of Famers. Matter of fact, I lived with one for 11 years on the road. I can take that with me. It's not something that's gonna make me any better of a person, it's not gonna define the football player that I was. If it happens, it'd be the crowning thing to my athletic career, and we'll enjoy that like we're gonna enjoy this one tonight."

By Dan Steinberg  |  August 10, 2010; 12:53 PM ET
Categories:  Redskins  
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Comments

Redskins who should be in the hall of fame in order:

1. Joe Jacoby
2. Chris Hanburger
3. Pat Fischer
4. Larry Brown
5. Gary Clark
6. Jerry Smith

Posted by: goose33 | August 10, 2010 1:13 PM | Report abuse

Don't leave Mark Mosley off the list. I know kickers don't get a lot of respect, but that guy was as automatic as the come, is still the only kicker to win the MVP, and (I think I'm right on this) is still the 'Skins all-time leading scorer.

Posted by: js_edit | August 10, 2010 2:13 PM | Report abuse

I agree with Jacoby, Smith and Hanburger (how is he not in). Pat, Larry and Gary were all good players-don't know abount HOF though. Personnally, I think the entire Offensive line from the 80's should be in. The were dominant. I think our defense gets short changed. They were pretty good in the 80's. Mann and Manley, Butz. Wilber marshall. Pretty stout group.

Posted by: jandlml | August 10, 2010 2:20 PM | Report abuse

Another one that is a little long overdue is Brian Mitchell. Before he retired he was the all-time leader in all-purpose yards punt+kick returns+yards from scrimmage (running & recieving).

Its just another way the NFL, HOF and most media (especially Mutt & Jeff (Kornheiser & Wilbon))

Posted by: rillbizi | August 10, 2010 2:21 PM | Report abuse

I agree with Jacoby, Smith and Hanburger (how is he not in). Pat, Larry and Gary were all good players-don't know about HOF though. Personnally, I think the entire Offensive line from the 80's should be in. They were dominant. I think our defense gets short changed. They were pretty good in the 80's. Mann and Manley, Butz. Wilber
Marshall. Pretty stout group.

Posted by: jandlml | August 10, 2010 2:22 PM | Report abuse

Why no mention of Deion Sanders? One of the great defensive backs ever and a true Redskin! I get goosebumps thinking ole Deion wearing the burgundy and gold.

Posted by: ShovelPlease | August 10, 2010 2:26 PM | Report abuse

I think Gary Clark outght to get in the same way Michael Irvin got in to me he should be next then Jacoby maybe Hanburger. He played on some bad teams so the era wasn't as heralded and should keep him waiting. To me players who had huge impact on a memorable eras should be considered 1st and foremost. Gary Clark deserves that. Jacoby as well for sure.

Jacoby probably shoulda got in before Grimm he had to battle the great pass rushers of that era.

Posted by: jrwalkerivory | August 10, 2010 2:37 PM | Report abuse

Charles Mann is never mentioned as a potential HOFer and i never understood why. Guy was a beast for a decade and made 4 pro bowls and won 3 super bowls (one with SF). He should at least be mentioned.

Brian Mitchell should have been a first ballot HOFer but there is a bias against special teams players.

Ken Harvey is another perennial pro bowler who should get some mention.

Mark Moseley is, as far as I know, the only kicker in history to win NFL MVP and I don't see that happening again in this lifetime. Set a bunch of records and was a 3 time pro bowler.

Last and definitely not least, Joe Bugel deserves to be enshrined as the greatest O-line coach in history.

Posted by: Barno1 | August 10, 2010 2:37 PM | Report abuse

First off, to ShovelPlease's note about SlimeTime Sanders ... I get a physical reaction at the idea of him wearing the Burgundy & Gold, too, but it's not exactly goosebumps.

To me, the next Skins to get in should be:
Joe Jacoby
Chris Hanburger
Dexter Manley
Brian Mitchell
Mark Moseley

Posted by: DC2Dallas | August 10, 2010 2:45 PM | Report abuse

Jacoby, definitely. Theisman, no way. The rest are borderline, at best. If you consider how long it took Monk to make it - and he retired he had the most catches in NFL history - then these other guys have little to no shot.

Posted by: shanks1 | August 10, 2010 2:46 PM | Report abuse

Brian Mitchell and Ken Harvey are good inclusions. Didn't think of Wilber Marshall, but he was definitely a dominate player for over 5 years. Wilber never got enough love with the pro bowl like Mitchell though.

Posted by: goose33 | August 10, 2010 2:57 PM | Report abuse

Redskins who should be in the hall of fame in order:

1. Joe Jacoby
2. Chris Hanburger
3. Pat Fischer
4. Larry Brown
5. Gary Clark
6. Jerry Smith

Posted by: goose33

Clark does not have the stats, Brown had some good years but so did a lot of backs Including Stephen Davis and Clinton Portis. Fisher does not have the numbers. However Mark Mosley was the MVP of the league and set the NFL record for most consecutive made by kicking a game winner in the playoffs. He should be there with Ray Guy as the two kickers that make the HOF.

Posted by: ged0386 | August 10, 2010 2:59 PM | Report abuse

No way Moseley gets in just because of the bias towards kickers and punters. If they did start letting kickers in, I would say Moseley still falls behind Morten Andersen, Gary Anderson, and Adam Vinateri.

Jerry Smith was the all time leader in TD Receptions for a tight-end, and was the premier pass catcher at the position when he played. The fact that he has NEVER been brought up for HOF was likely because he was a homosexual.

Pat Fischer played CB for 17 years and had over 60 interceptions (Darrell Green only had 54).

Posted by: goose33 | August 10, 2010 3:01 PM | Report abuse

Brian Mitchell will get in down the road.
Jacoby will get in. Joey T may not get in. I dont think he has the stats and he only has 1 SB win. Jim Plunkett will get in before Joey T. Chris Hamberger should have been in a long time ago. How can you make 9 pro bowls and defensive MVP and not get in? Thats a Ray Lewis/Lawrence Taylor resume.

Posted by: ged0386 | August 10, 2010 3:04 PM | Report abuse

goose33

Thanks. I was trying to find out if Fisher had more than green.

Posted by: ged0386 | August 10, 2010 3:08 PM | Report abuse

Clark will not get in I agree. But numbers don't always matter. Clark has similiar stats to Michael Irvin, and better numbers than Lynn Swann and John Stallworth.

He also 2 Super Bowl touchdowns (2 more than Art Monk). And I refer to my previous post about Pat Fischer's numbers being more than good enough if you compare to Darrell Green. If INT's are all that matter, then Paul Krause would not have had to wait 20 years to get in, and Darren Sharper will be a first ballot hall of famer.

Posted by: goose33 | August 10, 2010 3:09 PM | Report abuse

Pat Fischer had 56 career interceptions.

Posted by: shanks1 | August 10, 2010 3:12 PM | Report abuse

Zero doubt in my mind Jacoby belongs there. You can never mention Grimm without mentioning Jacoby, just ask John Madden.

Big #66 will get his due very soon.

- Ray

Posted by: rmcazz | August 10, 2010 3:14 PM | Report abuse

shanks1 -

you are right. i definitely thought it was 65. still, the guy does not get any hype when discussing top cornerbacks.

Posted by: goose33 | August 10, 2010 3:41 PM | Report abuse

This isn't supposed to be the Hall of Very Good Players, it's supposed to be the Hall of FAME.

I thought Jacoby should have gotten in before Grimm did. The fact that Grimm got in as a guard before Green Bay Packer Jerry Kramer (perhaps one of the greatest guards to play) is just stunning to me. And I'm old enough to remember those great Packer teams.

Hanburger should be in, as well as Jacoby. Theismann, Charles Mann and Gary Clark were not and are not HOF-worthy. Brian Mitchell won't get in because he's considered a special team player, even though he has fabulous total-yard numbers. The only special team guy that I can see going in for certain once he retires is Adam Vinatieri.

Jacoby may get in next year. The only two mortal locks that I see in that class are Marshall Faulk and Deion Sanders.

Posted by: owiz | August 10, 2010 4:44 PM | Report abuse

Where is the story about Riggins skipping the induction? Without these guys blocking for him he wouldn't be in the HOF. So where was he? At a Baltimore sports card show signing autographs for a fee.

Posted by: MKadyman | August 10, 2010 4:47 PM | Report abuse

FACEBOOK USERS.....HELP GET THIS MESSAGE OUT. JOIN THE THE JOE JACOBY FOR HOF GROUP ON FACEBOOK. Seriously, no way Jacoby isn't in the hall already with how he played, how much his teams won, and who he had to block. If facebook can get Betty White on SNL, maybe it can do something useful like get #66 the credit he deserves

Posted by: factor71 | August 10, 2010 4:48 PM | Report abuse

FACEBOOK USERS.....HELP GET THIS MESSAGE OUT. JOIN THE THE JOE JACOBY FOR HOF GROUP ON FACEBOOK. Seriously, no way Jacoby isn't in the hall already with how he played, how much his teams won, and who he had to block. If facebook can get Betty White on SNL, maybe it can do something useful like get #66 the credit he deserves

Posted by: factor71 | August 10, 2010 4:49 PM | Report abuse

FACEBOOK USERS.....HELP GET THIS MESSAGE OUT. JOIN THE THE JOE JACOBY FOR HOF GROUP ON FACEBOOK. Seriously, no way Jacoby isn't in the hall already with how he played, how much his teams won, and who he had to block. If facebook can get Betty White on SNL, maybe it can do something useful like get #66 the credit he deserves.

Posted by: factor71 | August 10, 2010 4:50 PM | Report abuse

Redskins fans need to FOCUS (not scatter) their attention and energy on the next most qualified Redskin for the Hall of Fame. That player is NOT Joe Jacoby, Gary Clark, Larry Brown, Jerry Smith or Pat Fischer. They were all great players, but the player most qualified for induction is Chris Hanburger! Nine-time Pro Bowler. Six-time All Pro. 1972 NFC Defensive Player of the Year on the Redskins first Super Bowl team. Handpicked by George Allen to call defensive signals for one of the best defenses in the NFL during the 1970's. There is no Hall-of-Fame eligible player with 15 or more combined Pro Bowl and All-Pro selections who is not already enshrined in Canton… except Chris Hanburger! Of all former players who are eligible to be selected by the Veterans Committee, Chris Hanburger is by far the strongest candidate in the field! We (the fans and the Redskins organization---Hey Bruce Allen!) need to put an end to this gross oversight and get Chris Hanburger inducted!

Posted by: bigmac128 | August 10, 2010 4:51 PM | Report abuse

Hanburger has never gotten his due. Not even with his own fanbase. People have short memories and often think in terms of the past 20 years. The Skins had some great years and can't get anyone into the HOF and have terrible years and were able to get Jurgensen, Taylor, Mitchell, and Huff in. It's hard to argue that Hanburger and Smith aren't as deserving.

Posted by: Jurgensen9 | August 10, 2010 4:53 PM | Report abuse

Why all the hate for Joe T.? Theisman led the team to back to back Super Bowls with an average RB and average WR's, yet he never ever gets any love from Skins fans. It's baffling really. Kurt Warner did the same with much better support and you can bet they kiss up to him in St. Louis. Sure, he's slightly annoying as an announcer, but that doesn't take away from his career. What other QB punted and returned punts as necessary? Totally underrated.

Posted by: Urnesto | August 10, 2010 5:01 PM | Report abuse

I don't think it is hate, Urnesto...
The reality of it is, at least in my opinion, is that Theisman's stats are average. Withuot the Hogs in front of him, Joe Theisman would have been average at best.

Posted by: TimDz | August 10, 2010 5:17 PM | Report abuse

Here is the Joe Jacoby Theatervision Commercial - easily the worst commercial ever
made - makes Mr Ray's Hair Weave look like Orson Welles.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NlvPBo_HalI

Posted by: nativedc | August 10, 2010 5:22 PM | Report abuse

I agree w/ Urnesto. The guy was the league MVP in '83 and led them to two Superbowls. They didn't call him "General Joe" for nothing. Although we've had some good QB's since his time, we haven't had one w/ his leadership since he was at the helm.

Posted by: mcwop | August 10, 2010 5:23 PM | Report abuse

I agree w/ Urnesto. I think people look at the personality on TV and forget what a great leader Joe T was. He was the league MVP in '83 and led his team to two Superbowls.

Posted by: mcwop | August 10, 2010 5:26 PM | Report abuse

Urnesto

We love Joe T!! But just like our RB's our QB's are a long list of good ones so Joe gets caught up in the shuffle. Think about it, We had 4 different SB QB's one just as famous and loved as the other not to mention Sonny. But he does not deserve HOF if Jim Plunkett, a guy with 2 rings and beat him head to head in one of the two SB's is not in.

Posted by: ged0386 | August 10, 2010 5:52 PM | Report abuse

To me Jacoby and Grimm have equivalent HoF pedigree, so Jake probably gets in some day, especially since he played left tackle.

Theisman, although a very good NFL QB, isn't a HOFer (Gibbs won w/ 2 other QBs as well). Chris Hanburger probably never gets in. He's been retired for what, 30 years? Same for Jerry Smith. Moseley should be considered.

Another name I'd throw into the mix is Dave Butz, a force in the middle of the defensive line. Pat Fischer wasn't a HoF caliber CB, although he absolutely maximized his abilities on the field. Small and slow don't make a good combination at cornerback.

Larry Brown at his peak was as good a back as there was in the league and definitely on his way to the HoF. Unfortuntely, he was used up quickly by George Allen so may not have the career numbers to get in.

Posted by: randysbailin | August 10, 2010 6:26 PM | Report abuse

I realize that most football fans don't think of Gary Clark and Micheal Irvin as similar players. The media bias for Cowboys players just gets them tons more exposure whenever they accomplish anything.

So, for all of you who think the two don't deserve to be in the same class, here's the stats:

Gary Clark: 11 seasons, 699 reception, 63.5 receptions per year, 10,856 yards, 987 yards per season, 15.5 yards per catch, 65 TDs

Michael Irvin 12 Seasons, 750 receptions, 62.5 receptions per year, 11,904 yards, 992 yards per season, 15.9 yards per catch, 65 TDs

Oh, one last stat for you:

Super Bowls won: 3-3

So, let's stop all the smirking about Gary Clark's candidacy for the HOF. If Michael Irvin is a first-ballot shoe-in then Clark has got to make it too.

Kevin Olson
Manassas, VA

Posted by: noslok | August 10, 2010 6:38 PM | Report abuse

Jacoby? No doubt he should be in. I vote "NO" for Joe Theismann, Dexter Manley, Charles Mann, Dave Butz, Larry Brown. I think Gary Clark and Chris Hanburger are marginal but probably not HOF'ers. I can't see Hanburger in the same class with Butkus, LT, Willie Lanier, or even Mike Curtis. I'd vote that Mark Mosley and Brian Mitchell should be in.

Posted by: BenThere | August 10, 2010 6:51 PM | Report abuse

Jacoby? No doubt he should be in. I vote "NO" for Joe Theismann, Dexter Manley, Charles Mann, Dave Butz, Larry Brown. I think Gary Clark and Chris Hanburger are marginal but probably not HOF'ers. I can't see Hanburger in the same class with Butkus, LT, Willie Lanier, or even Mike Curtis. I'd vote that Mark Mosley and Brian Mitchell should be in.

Posted by: BenThere | August 10, 2010 6:54 PM | Report abuse

While we're on the subject...

Chris Hanburger has a case as the single most outrageous omission from the HOF.

I could talk about him all day. But let's just leave it at this:

Pro bowls:

Dick Butkis 8
Chris Hanburger 9

Know how many playoff games Dick Butkis appeared in? Zero.

Now that doesn't make Hanburger better than Dick Butkis. All I'm saying is that they should be in the same conversation.

p.s. Jerry Smith retired as the NFL All-Time leader in TD receptions for a Tight End. It's a disgrace he isn't in either.

Posted by: noslok | August 10, 2010 7:00 PM | Report abuse

The fact that you can even throw Manley, Mann and Butz into a HoF discussion indicates that the defensive line on those Super Bowl teams gets largely overlooked.

Posted by: randysbailin | August 10, 2010 7:42 PM | Report abuse

Look at the coverage for this go round of the Hall inductees....you'd think there were only TWO going in..Jerry .Rice and Emmitt Smith. Makes no difference what sports web site you go to, all the commentary is about those two, not Grim, Randle, Dick LeBeau, Little, nobody else. Like has been mentioned, there should be a space for groups like the Hogs.

Posted by: bullwinkle1 | August 10, 2010 9:41 PM | Report abuse

Jacoby? No doubt he should be in. I vote "NO" for Joe Theismann, Dexter Manley, Charles Mann, Dave Butz, Larry Brown. I think Gary Clark and Chris Hanburger are marginal but probably not HOF'ers. I can't see Hanburger in the same class with Butkus, LT, Willie Lanier, or even Mike Curtis. I'd vote that Mark Mosley and Brian Mitchell should be in.

Posted by: BenThere | August 10, 2010 6:54 PM | Report abuse

=======================================

Hanburger marginal?

The former Redskin linebacker was elected to the Pro Bowl nine times during his careeer which is still the most in Redskin history. Additionally, eight times he was named first team all NFC, four times he was first team all NFL, two times he was second team all NFL, and once he was named NFL Defensive Player of the Year.

“He was at that time the smartest player in the league. We did everything we could to try to eliminate him from the play. We knew if we didn't neutralize him, then we had less of a chance of winning.”

John Hannah, NFL Hall of Fame 1991, Often cited as the greatest offensive lineman ever

Hanburger marginal? Only if you are marginally intelligent.


Posted by: croftonpost | August 10, 2010 9:56 PM | Report abuse

DAVE BUTZ

probably won't happen, but my nomination. He played on mediocre teams in the late mid to late 70's, and then when they began to get good...teams had to stop TRIPLE teaming him..then he got recognition...

'Bruno' was the unsung hero for over a decade on the skins line!!

Posted by: arioch666 | August 10, 2010 11:29 PM | Report abuse

DAVE BUTZ

probably won't happen, but my nomination. He played on mediocre teams in the late mid to late 70's, and then when they began to get good...teams had to stop TRIPLE teaming him..then he got recognition...

'Bruno' was the unsung hero for over a decade on the skins line!!

Posted by: arioch666 | August 10, 2010 11:30 PM | Report abuse

Totally agree with the Hanburger comments above. Chris Hanburger should have been in years ago, but he was never a media darling. No slight to Grimm, Monk or even Darrell, but he should have been in before any of them, and should be pushed to be the next skin to go into the Hall. The Gibbs era was more successful, but the George Allen Era was pretty darn good, and was where the Redskins really became a winner. If you didn't start watching the skins until the Gibbs era then you missed the best Redskin Linebacker of them all. Let's restate it again...

9 Pro Bowls
6x All-Pro (4 1st team, 2 2nd team)
8x All-NFC 1st team
1972 NFL/NFC Defensive Player of the Year

Hanburger was the defensive quarterback and signal caller for those great George Allen defensive teams. He was mentally and physically a great player. He and Kenny Houston were probably the best defensive players the Skins have ever had. And he had the best nickname of all them all...The Hangman!!

I grew up watching both era's. I love all the skins and want to see as many get in to the Hall as possible, but with all due respect Hanburger is by far the most deserving to get in. Its'a crime and a joke that he is not in.

Posted by: al89 | August 10, 2010 11:46 PM | Report abuse

Totally agree with the Hanburger comments above. Chris Hanburger should have been in years ago, but he was never a media darling. No slight to Grimm, Monk or even Darrell, but he should have been in before any of them, and should be pushed to be the next skin to go into the Hall. The Gibbs era was more successful, but the George Allen Era was pretty darn good, and was where the Redskins really became a winner. If you didn't start watching the skins until the Gibbs era then you missed the best Redskin Linebacker of them all. Let's restate it again...

9 Pro Bowls
6x All-Pro (4 1st team, 2 2nd team)
8x All-NFC 1st team
1972 NFL/NFC Defensive Player of the Year

Hanburger was the defensive quarterback and signal caller for those great George Allen defensive teams. He was mentally and physically a great player. He and Kenny Houston were probably the best defensive players the Skins have ever had. And he had the best nickname of all them all...The Hangman!!

I grew up watching both era's. I love all the skins and want to see as many get in to the Hall as possible, but with all due respect Hanburger is by far the most deserving to get in. Its'a crime and a joke that he is not in.

Posted by: al89 | August 10, 2010 11:48 PM | Report abuse

Chris Hanburger definitely belongs in. Prolly Mark Mosely also.
I don't think Dave Butz belongs there. He was dominant, but not HOF dominant.

Unfortunately, Joe Jacoby will never be elected, because no one will ever forget that game against the Giants when Lawrence Taylor embarrassed him.

By the end of that game, the Giants were rushing only 2 lineman, Taylor and one other, and still the Redskins could not keep Taylor off the QB.

Posted by: PriorKnowledge | August 11, 2010 1:23 AM | Report abuse

Here's the real list of which Skins deserve serious consideration:

Jerry Smith -- held the TD record for a TE for 30 years ... and has more TDs than EVERY TE in the HOF now.

Chris Hanburger -- 9 Pro Bowls-- can't believe he's not in

Larry Brown -- if Floyd Little and his short but special career is in, Larry Brown, whose career was better than Little's, deserves in as well. They overlapped most of their years. Brown was better.

Gary Clark -- compare to irvin. Clark was 8th in all time receiving yards when he retired, irvin 10th. Same # of TDs. If you count Clark's USFL numbers (1 mediocre year --and its the pro football HOF, a distinction the voters often make), their stats are shockingly identical. Clark didn't have a HOF QB, played in a less pass friendly era, and was in 3 WR sets, meaning he had less chances. Clark even had a higher yds/game in the SB and scored the go ahead TD in a SB. Clark's best 7 years are better than Andre Reed's 7 straight Pro Bowl years, the basis for his candidacy (Reed goes deep in the vote every year). From 1985 to 1992, the ONLY WR better than Clark (statistically) was Jerry Rice.

Jim Lachey -- probably the best of the Skins OL, though he split his career between the Skins and the Chargers(?), which makes it harder. His 1991 season was amazing.

Dave Butz -- member of the 80's all decade team. Watch the game he played in the Doug Williams SB -- and you might want to change your MVP vote. Totally dominant.

Len Hauss -- 6 Pro Bowls, not many stats for a C, though.

Joe Jacoby -- faced lawrence taylor 2x per year on the left side, then moved to right and faced reggie white 2x per year. He blew people off the line for the Skins run game. In my opinion, the best of the Hogs.


Others, Theismann, BMitch, Pat Fisher, Manley, Mann, Moseley, aren't serious HOF candidates.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | August 11, 2010 1:28 AM | Report abuse

Larry Brown?!?

Please! You can't be serious!

Brian Mitchell on the other hand is a definate HOF'er!

Posted by: whatyoutalkinboutman | August 11, 2010 1:56 AM | Report abuse

Larry Brown?!?

Please! You can't be serious!

Brian Mitchell on the other hand is a definate HOF'er!

Posted by: whatyoutalkinboutman

Compare Larry Brown to Floyd Little ... who is IN the HOF. They played mostly the same years. Little played 15 more games and had just 400 more yards of total offense.

Brown, with little argument, was the best RB in the game over a 5 year period. League MVP once, 1st or 2nd in yards from scrimmage 3 times. What other RBs won an MVP and were top 2 in yds from scrimmage 3 times? LaDanian Tomlinson, emmitt smiff, Walter Payton, oj simpson and Terrell Davis. 1st ballot guys except for Davis, who only had 4 productive seasons.

Little finished 1st in yds from scrimmage once and 3rd once. The only thing Little has over Brown is that Little was special teams standout -- but only for 2 years.

You can argue whether Floyd Little SHOULD be in the HOF. But Floyd Little is where the bar is set. Larry Brown clears that bar.

BMitch? Not a prayer. I agree with the HOF voters on this -- special teamers don't really deserve HOF spots.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | August 11, 2010 2:49 AM | Report abuse

To me, the HOF voters set the bar. The question is which Redskins meet the criteria. Clark compares nicely to irvin. When Clark retired, the only guys with more receiving yards were Rice, Largent, Monk, Ellard, Maynard, Lofton and Joiner. Only Ellard (another Redskin -- for a few seasons) isn't in the HOF from that group. Of that group, the only one to avg more yds/game was Rice ... Clark and Largent tied for 2nd.

When irvin retired, he was 10th in career yds, behind non HOF players Fryar, Andre Reed and Ellard.

Include Clark's 1 USFL season and he and irvin are separated by 7 catches, 200 yards and 2 TDs (Clark ahead in the TDs and receptions). In essence, ZERO difference.

irvin is the bar, Clark deserves in. Little is the bar, Brown deserves in.

With OL, its much tougher to compare anything. Jacoby, Lachey and Hauss all deserve serious consideration.

But you can count the number of guys with 9 pro bowls and 4 1st team All Pro selections that aren't in the Hall and only use 1 finger to do it. Its Chris Hanburger and no one else.

Jerry Smith, by the numbers, easily makes it into the HOF if the bar is Charlie Sanders, Mike Ditka, Bob Mackey and jackie smith. For starters, he has more TDs than any current HOF member. Shannon Sharpe finished his career with 2 more TDs than Smith, in 36 more games. Sharpe and Tony Gonzales are still, 40 years after Smith became the all time TD leader for TE, the only 2 guys with more TDs than Smith.

As for Butz, he'll get little recognition and he doesn't have the All Pro numbers. Made the 80's all decade team (as did Jacoby). But he was a beast for a long time. And go check the SB vs Elway if you want to see what happens when the guy in the middle pushes the pile -- play after play.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | August 11, 2010 3:49 AM | Report abuse

Chris Hanburger not being in is the biggest HOF injustice in any sport. I put him ahead of B-Mitch because he should have been in before B-Mitch's career even began. B-Mitch is second (retired as all-time combined yardage leader.) Jake is a total no-brainer as the anchor of the greatest o-line ever. And Gary Clark deserves to be in as much as Michael "Coke Man" Irvin does. Irvin played for the league's golden child so he got in on the first ballot (before Art Monk which was a complete joke.) Gary's numbers are essentially equal to Irvin's. Irvin played one more NFL season and won 3 titles to Gary's 2. But since it's the "Pro Football Hall of Fame" and not the "NFL Hall of Fame" why don't USFL stats count?

Posted by: largetony86 | August 11, 2010 8:41 AM | Report abuse

Special team players should not be shut out of the HOF. They are a very important part of the game. Teams that win Super Bowls usually have excellent special team units. If owners, commissioners and other non players can make the hall then why not the elite special teamers. Ray Guy, Mark Mosley, B-Mitch should be in and Adam Veniteri, Morton Anderson and Matt Stover should be after they become eligible.

Other Skins that should be in the hall:

Without a doubt:

Hanberger
Jacoby

Probably:

Joe Theisman
Gary Clark
Dave Butz
Charles Mann

Borderline but would probably compare favorably with other Hall members:

Dexter Manley(would be above borderline if it was not for drug suspension). Still should be seriously considered since the likes of LT are in.
Len Hauss
Jim Lachay
Larry Brown
Pat Fischer
Jerry Smith
Ken Harvey

Should at least have some consideration:

Mark May
Jeff Bostic
Joe Bugal

Posted by: hailtotheskinsalways | August 11, 2010 10:01 AM | Report abuse

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