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Readers Don't Buy Health Insurers' Claim

We have a suspicious bunch of Readers Who Comment this morning as they ponder a report from the health insurance industry -- once allegedly on board in support of reform -- which warns that a typical family premium in 2019 will cost $4,000 more than projected.

Many readers see this as the best argument yet for a so-called public option or universal Medicare to compete with an insurance industry they regard with suspicion. Others see this as proof that the Obama Administration has overreached or never had any business getting into health reform anyway.

The report, as Ceci Connolly writes, comes a day before the Senate Finance Committee is scheduled to vote on health care legislation and signals "an end to the fragile detente between two central players in this year's health-care reform drama.

We'll start with John1263, who wrote, "Kind of like a coke dealer telling you that crack is good for you. A report from the insurance industry the day before a vote on a reform bill that trashes the reform bill is about the strongest endorsment for that bill that it could possibly get..."

bdunn1 said, "How totally surprising a report bought and paid for by the insurance industry would say that. I'm shocked! Get a spine, Dems, and stand up to these predatory leeches."

scon101 wrote, "More scare tatics from the death panel brigade..."

But tnvret, in one of several posts, wrote, "Early in his quest, Obama wooed industry leaders in the hopes of neutralizing many of the players who helped defeat a similar effort by President Bill Clinton. Sounds like the rose colored glasses were really red tinted and foggy and somebody figured it out."

And MOMLEE said, "This bill will hurt the middle class if passed. Since the Medicaid expense will fall on states budgets, taxes will have to be increased. This administration is trying to bring the middle class to their knees. Wake up and don't let this happen."

But goldie2 wrote, "YES, we can believe the health insurance companies to pay for an unbiased report. They wouldn't lie to protect their high profit margin would they? All the more reason to pass the public option...They will raise the rates as high as they can, knowing nothing can stop them."

And npsilver said, "I view this as a self serving statement from the Insurance Industry. If may not be needed but if the current course of action is pursued it will happen. That is gun boat diplomacy at it's finest."

moebius22 wrote, "The bill is a swindle. You are getting crock versus the status quo. I can't afford insurance now, and the Federal government is going to penalize me for having none?! The bill is over a trillion dollars, but Congress decided to correlate the bill in a way that would make it seem cheaper than it really is."

mail-list said, "If premiums will be too high with reform, and they are too high now, its time to dump the health insurance companies and pass single payer national health insurance..."

BillWatson1 wrote, "...Providing health care efficiently saves lives and saves money. Nobody can collect the money to pay for health care as cheaply as the government can through a national sales tax, and nobody can deliver high quality care and medications as cost effectively as the VA. Two choices should be offered to everyone to use either; free public health care, sales tax funded, from a new system of government owned and operated hospitals, using the VA format, that would deliver all government funded care, or alternatively consumers could choose to use privately purchased private care..."

sbuck said, "No one has yet to tell me why profit is involved in the health care system, except to say that that's the way it's always been. My health has nothing to do with my employer -- that's just the pass-through mechanism. Profit is what is making our system so expensive. Perhaps if we eliminate the middle man, who makes most of the profit, we could have a system more focused on health outcomes than on EOBs and profits. It should be us, our doctors, and our government. We do it with Medicare. Let's try it with everything else."

kubrickstan wrote, "Well, they are after all salesman. Of course this is announced the day before the finance committee will vote. What a joke."

Casey1 said, "This is nothing but extortion, and anyone dumb enough to believe this crap is beyond help. To hell with insurance companies! To hell then! Medicare for everyone just like any other civilized country!"

But hz9604 offered that "It's common sense. How are you going to expand coverage like eliminating preexisting, no maximums, no dropped coverage and not raise the rates? The Baucus bill is rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic."

hogsmile wrote, "If the choice before us boils down to a form of socialized medicine similar to that in Japan and Switzerland, or today's corporate capitalized medicine that is overpriced, confiscatory and corrupt, guess which one will ultimately get the nod."

Ceeee said, "I'm convinced. We need to get rid of the middle man, the insurance industry, to cut costs. Just revamp and expand Medicare."

sjones77 wrote, "Maybe the U.S. should just nationalize the insurance industry. Despite the fact that severe "tort reform" measures are now the rule, rather than the exception, in most states, our insurance rates still continue to skyrocket -- and the insurance industry still pushes for more outlandish mesures, coupled with these kinds of threats that rates will continue to increase. Enough already. Private enterprise has proved it doesn't work in this arena."

We'll close with James10, who said, "The insurance industry also discovered that if the health reform bill passes the public will become sexually impotent.
And there will be HHS Impotent Panels to decide who will get Cialis and Viagra."

All comments on this article are here.

By Doug Feaver  |  October 12, 2009; 7:17 AM ET
 | Tags: Baucus, Health-Care Reform, Insurers  
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Next: Health Reform Anger Shifts to Insurers

Comments

testing

Posted by: captainal | October 16, 2009 10:33 AM | Report abuse

This is an emotional issue for many Americans. This so-called “public option” in Government run health care presents serious challenges for us. As Consumers we should be able to compare the cost and quality of health care services. How much is a specific surgery at one hospital, as compared with another? http://www.friendsoftheuschamber.com/media/

Posted by: mld678 | October 13, 2009 2:26 PM | Report abuse

I'm not at all a supported of the insurance industry, but I believe the basis of what their report says is TRUE. Here is why. We are expanding coverage, with gov't subsidies and NO cost controls. What does that mean? You don't need a PhD in Econ to know that means higher prices. We are requiring acceptance of pre-existing conditions, and rates based only upon age. The ONLY way a system like that works is to require EVERYONE to be in the pool. How do you get EVERYONE in the pool? Harsh penalties for not buying insurance if you can afford it.

The Baucus bill started out with those, but they were cut down significantly. So now there are no pre-existing condition ratings, you can't be denied coverage, and there are very limited penalties for not buying coverage. This sets us up for HUGE adverse selection issues, where people just pay the penalty each year, unless they come down with a chronic illness, then they jump into the exchange and pay the same rates as a healthy person.

So what's the insurance company to do? Raise rates for EVERYONE. The legislation says they must only offer generally the same rates to everyone, so they bump EVERYONE's rates up.

This WILL NOT work. The exchanges will FAIL. How do we know? They already have in several states where exchanges like the current bill have been tried. If you are not going to have the public option, you MUST have big disincentives for people to go without insurance.

So, yes, I do believe the claim by the insurers, because its just common sense. This bill as written will cause rates to be much HIGHER for everyone, except the chronically ill.

Posted by: truth5 | October 13, 2009 10:14 AM | Report abuse

Public Option = Consumer Choice
Consider the Connection to the Economic
Pyramid:
There are 2 sides to the Economic Pyramid.
NEGATIVE (-) & POSITIVE (+)
At the top of the NEGATIVE Economic Pyramid
Health Care Industry X______(Health Care
Profiteers, Lobbyists, and Invested Interests), collect money from the consumer
(U & I), and dispence Trickle-down Health Care, their primary care is the bottom line
$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
(-)___R___(+)
The choice should be ours.
Our health care, economy, & planet R N D balance!!!
Search 4 me:
CTC123GREEN

Posted by: jerry_mayeux | October 13, 2009 7:46 AM | Report abuse

In 2006 the health insurance industry paid out 20% less in medical payments than they had projected for the previous year.

In 2006 the health insurance industry raised premiums 7%. Go figure.

Single payer is the way to go.

Posted by: TheGeneral1 | October 13, 2009 5:01 AM | Report abuse

It'd be nice if we could look at other countries and figure out what they have done that works. Then pick and chose what works for us & do what we do best, which is to innovate something new. It'd be easier if we didn't get wound up about so-called Socialism, if the fire truck showing up at your house isn't Socialism and evil, why would the ambulance being around be a bad thing?

Really what we care about is keeping the most people healthy with the least cost & best care we can manage. Corporate profits should have no primary consideration in any planning we do.

Companies should enjoy no right to profit from another persons bloody suffering. That seems like a fairly low baseline expectation to set when dealing with the issue.

Posted by: timscanlon | October 13, 2009 12:25 AM | Report abuse

here ya go all be skeptical if ya want i say that insurance industry is the only one to listen to on this one.
the present administration has lied about everything from their campaign promises
to everything else. not to mention obamas dictatorial style which totallhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uN9P2plYVD4&NR=1y turns me off. at this point between his attitude and they way he acts towards the american people nothing separates him from a dictator except the geographical distance between wash dc and venuezla. him and the democrats have acted this way since january
watch this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uN9P2plYVD4&NR=1
according to inforwars.com if you dont take the pig flu shot and are stopped you will be forced to take the shot right there or hauled off to a concentration camp
so choose whatcha want and go for it
why didnt any of the senator act polite at the alleged town halls when they went home in august. i guess they were mad they actually had to do some work instead of play gulf
john mccain actually had a visually impaired woman removed
ann kirkpatrick walked away from a crowd in holbrook arizona
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NLjcmKMUwEc&feature=player_embedded

Posted by: tr7fan | October 13, 2009 12:16 AM | Report abuse

Between a system in which people are priced out of insurance and a system in which coverage for almost all is provided by additional taxes and fees on top of ever-rising high premiums, I'd favor the latter.
However, I'm not quite so cynical or politically motivated to pass any health care "reform" bill to believe there isn't a better system that might possibly be politically palatable.
Granted, that process would be a lot easier if unions and health insurers would disarm, call off their allies and allow politicians to do what's right by all Americans rather than special interests.

Posted by: cprferry | October 12, 2009 11:00 PM | Report abuse

Sorry to disappoint those who think that my opinions are paid for by a large corporation. They are based on education and research. I believe in working hard and giving back to my community and my loved ones. I believe in reform but there is no utopia. There are just as many greedy villains in government as in business. We have to have balance and throwing everything over to the government is not a solution.

Regarding the Swiss. Why would a company exist if not for profits? The private insurers are not allowed to earn a profit for the basic plan that everyone is required to own. However, it is a very basic plan and the companies can sell supplementals for vision, dental, etc.

By the way, that information came from NPR - not a right wing corporation.

Posted by: sander1 | October 12, 2009 9:41 PM | Report abuse

Karen Ignagni and AHIP's "analysis" is a crock! That group will do anything to deny Americans healthcare reform because then they might not be able to charge their increasingly outrageous rates.

Posted by: laSerenissima2003 | October 12, 2009 9:19 PM | Report abuse

Well, the same report is on other news sites such as Yahoo! news. we know what the insurance companies want. For them it makes good business sense because they are profit oriented, and they don't want their bottom line shorted. But for the average citizen they are parasites who do not belong in the middle between you and your provider, charging 30% or more in the process.

As an advocate of single payer systems I would like to see insurance eliminated and the savings passed on to consumers, businesses, and health providers. This is the right thing to do for society, and most of the developed world does it.

But if we have to grapple with insurance for political reasons (i.e. our politicians are in their pockets) then they should at least play nice and adapt to the massive change needed by cooperating to make it happen.

Forget right wingers. They have no power, and they are only shills for the insurance industry. If you are heavily invested in insurance and PhRMA then reinvest somewhere else. The time has come for health care justice. If you are an idiot who is simply parroting what Fox news says then you need to be on single payer so they can deal with your mental problems.

Posted by: Single_Payer | October 12, 2009 9:10 PM | Report abuse

This is proof that we need a public option. The insurance companies are already telling us that they intend to screw us all. Dems, get a back bone and stand up to these republican cretins.

Posted by: PepperDr | October 12, 2009 8:45 PM | Report abuse

King Obimbo sez, "We need "'stimulus' for shovel ready jobs." Where does the money go? A $3000 CASH, tax-free per person pay-out to all go little King Obimbo followers.

Folks, cameras don't lie. Go to: http://www.clickondetroit.com/news/21215978/detail.html?taf=det&fbc_channel=1#video

Now we have a bunch of the same thieves that want to sell "free healthcare' when it won't be ready to go for three years, but they'll be collecting the premiums in the meantime?

If the "Single Payer" or "Public Option" is such a great deal, why hasn't most of the states adopted such a plan?

BECAUSE IT'S A LOSER AND THE TAXPAYER IS ABOUT TO GET WHACKED WHILE WE ENABLE LOSERS FROM BECOMING SELF-RELIANT OR TO GET THEM INCENTIVIZED.

CAMERAS DON'T LIE. THEY AREN'T FRUSTRATED. AS MS. POSEY SEZ, I'M NOT FRUSTRATED, I'M "...JUST WAITING FOR MY REWARD, MONEY."

Posted by: Computer_Forensics_Expert_Computer_Expert_Witness | October 12, 2009 7:56 PM | Report abuse

It will raise unemployment to over 11%, but it makes sense to get rid of the needless insurance overhead.

But, the public option should be MOTEL 6. There will still be a place for private insurers when you prefer the Hilton.

Posted by: twstroud | October 12, 2009 5:38 PM | Report abuse

It’s Obama and his accomplices and brainwashed lemmings who seem obsessed with Obama’s color. The rest of us, don’t care if Obama is white, black, pink, purple or blue! We care that he’s about to destroy our health care, our economy and our country. We care he is working for our enemies and against us. We care that he’s siding with Castro, Chavez, Zelaya and the rest of the Marxist thugs who are destroying Latin America and who are working with drug terrorists and Islamic terrorists to destroy the U.S.

http://frontpage.americandaughter.com/?author=76

Posted by: AntonioSosa | October 12, 2009 5:28 PM | Report abuse

capone1, you can have your socialist medicine NOW. Just move to Cuba, Venezuela or North Korea. Is someone stopping you?

People who found refuge from socialism/communism in the U.S. now see with horror that Obama plans to turn the U.S. into another socialist/communist country like Cuba or Venezuela.

Venezuelans at least had the excuse that they did not know what was coming. Americans can just look at what happened in Cuba, and what is happening in Venezuela, Bolivia, Ecuador, and Nicaragua, to understand that socialism/communism multiplies poverty, corruption and despair; that it destroys human beings materially and spiritually. Where will our children and grandchildren find refuge if Obama succeeds in imposing Marxism in the U.S.?

Posted by: AntonioSosa | October 12, 2009 5:20 PM | Report abuse

The conservatives are against anything Obama would propose simply because they hate his popularity, smarts and most of all, his color. He is actually a person with a brain, unlike George "W" Bush (I don't read books) and the morons he appointed to his staff. They way "W" and Dick Chaney humiliated Colin Powell is the most shining example of how rock solid evil they are. They hate that Obama is initiating many necessary proposals that are meaningful, support the middle class, and should be passed. They include health care reform, credit reform, reform of environmental laws and international global warming issues. The republicans has 8 years to solve many problems, but they only created more that have put out nation at great economic risk. The economic flop of the Bush era will cost us trillions, but they don't care, they simply laughed all the way to the bank and passed the debacle onto the next administration. There is much that can be said, but I support Obama will every ounce of energy I have. He has the smarts, the insight, and the determination. Go Obama!

Posted by: ekk44 | October 12, 2009 5:19 PM | Report abuse

I agree with you, LarryG62. It makes more sense to believe Baghdad Bob than to believe in Obama and his accomplices, bent on transforming the U.S. into a third world wreck.

Obama wants his socialized health care program rushed before Americans realize how much it will hurt us and how much it will hurt future generations, which will have to pay for what Obama is doing. Anyone familiar with socialized health care programs knows they are extremely costly (to pay for the added bureaucracy) and profoundly inefficient (as all government programs are).

Posted by: AntonioSosa | October 12, 2009 5:17 PM | Report abuse

We need single payer health insurance covering every American and need it NOW, not 3 or 4 years from now. The insurance companies are operating as criminal enterprises and must be stopped. Tell the Dems to stop worrying about the Party of No and give us single payer now. Vote out all who vote against us. They have plenty of money to bail out banks etc, run their wars non-stop, but nothing to help the ones who pay for everything. It must stop now. While we're at it, we need a national referendum to outlaw ALL campaign contributions from any entity (company, PAC, organization, lobbyist etc). Only individuals may donate to any level politician. Period. Make them work for us, not corporations.

Posted by: capone1 | October 12, 2009 5:00 PM | Report abuse

Interestingly and also predictably, this health insurance industry report did not include a forecast on how much insurance premiums will rise between now and 2013. Yet rise they will. I do not believe it would surprise anyone if annual health insurance premiums rise by a minimum of $1500 between now and 2013.

Nor did this report attempt to analyze and project the potential impact on the price of health insurance premiums if corporations, small businesses, and people with employer-sponsored insurance were to have the opportunity to comparison-shop for the best insurance deals across state lines in 2013.

And of course, it did not address the potential price impact of a public option on private health insurance premiums. The private health insurance industry does not want to go anywhere near there.

In coming out so directly to fight legislation it has already much more than less "help" shape to match its best interest, the private health insurance industry has over-played its hand.

This industry has made a critical strategic mistake by unnecessarily providing the impetus for the inclusion of a public option and public choice.

Posted by: csfoster2000 | October 12, 2009 4:50 PM | Report abuse

You are right, LarryG62. Obama and his accomplices lie, manipulate, intimidate, coerce and commit fraud. That's how Obama got elected and that's how they are trying to force to swallow their scams.

By the way, that's exactly how Chávez, Ortega, Morales, Correa, and they rest of the Marxist thugs in Latin America got elected then became dictators.

Posted by: AntonioSosa | October 12, 2009 4:47 PM | Report abuse

Wrong, COLEBRACKETT! You won't find many Cubans who have escaped from Castro supporting Obamacare. Cubans who support Obamacare are Castro's operatives working for Castro in the U.S. to help Obama impose Marxism on us.

If you like socialized medicine, please move to a socialist/communist country!

Posted by: AntonioSosa | October 12, 2009 4:41 PM | Report abuse

The idiots who keep on carping about socialism and communism have never experienced either. I have lived in other countries, which had universal health care, and the care was excellent. They care more about health care, than profits.

As a self-employed insurance agent, I am unable to get coverage for myself or my wife because of pre-existing conditions. I must either go to work for someone else who provides insurance, move to another country, or wait 5 more years for medicare, a public program.

I have seen too many friends, associates, and clients suffer or die due to a lack of adequate care, all the while watching their premiums double while their coverage shrinks. And if you think decisions made by a bureucrat would be bad, consider that those decisions are being made now by a bean counter, with no regard to treatment, but based on return on investment. It's time to join the rest of civilzed society, and insure all Americans that health care is available and affordable.

Posted by: COLEBRACKETT | October 12, 2009 4:10 PM | Report abuse

AARP has issued a rebuttal. Please publish what they have to say.

Posted by: cdierd1944 | October 12, 2009 2:58 PM | Report abuse

Right-wingers are so gullible! You could sell them the brooklyn bridge if you wanted.

It never occurs to them to actually read up on what socialism really is, or communism for that matter, and their inherent differences. No, they just use the two interchangably, because that's what their radio and cable TV overlords tell them.

wonder what this country would be like if right-wingers actually thought for themselves instead of being told what to think.

Posted by: obx2004 | October 12, 2009 2:24 PM | Report abuse

The post below misses the point that the bureaucracy in Briton that runs their health care is the third largest employer in the world. The bureaucracy here would be the largest. Further, it would then be unionized and jack up the costs. Look at any organization that the union parasite has been attached to. Eventually it kills the host. The cost of this has not been estimated and would be staggering.

Posted by: Bubbette1 | October 12, 2009 2:01 PM | Report abuse

The AARP is out shilling Obamacare again. If you belong to AARP cancell your membership and join the American Services Associaiton which is against Obamacare:
"It is well understood that the AARP stands to gain financially from Obamacare, despite its recent public wobbly fence-sitting on the issue. However, the inevitable rationing and benefit cuts to care will undoubtedly harm seniors and many seniors know it."
http://axisofright.com/2009/08/20/aarp-vs-asa/

Join here:
http://www.americanseniors.org/Pages/home.aspx?Images=/images/index_new.gif


Posted by: Bubbette1 | October 12, 2009 1:57 PM | Report abuse

The recent report from the Washington Post regarding the Japanese Health Care System revealed that they dont allow Health Care Insurers to make profits. That is no doubt the root cause of the anti legislative stance they take. Health care is too fundemental a need for human beings that we should allow self serving individuals who have made billions off of people's health. The cost to both individuals and industry is far to great to let the few dictate over the many.

Posted by: joeye4 | October 12, 2009 1:51 PM | Report abuse

You are right, Steve-2. And don't forget to add the cost of the armies of ACORN-type government workers to run Obamacare.

In fact, in countries suffering with socialized medicine like Great Britain, the cost of bureaucracy is higher than actual medical costs, and bureaucracy keeps on growing and is almost impossible to stop. That's why thinking Europeans believe we must be nuts to want to imitate a system like theirs.

European parliament member Daniel Hannan, who represents South East England at the European parliament, says:

“How amazing to me that a free people, you know, citizens of a country founded on the principle of independence, independence for the citizen as well as independence for the state, should be contemplating, in peacetime, burdening themselves with a system like this, which puts the power of life and death in a state bureaucracy.”

Listen to Hannan: http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=204359

Posted by: AntonioSosa | October 12, 2009 1:38 PM | Report abuse

Premiums would go up? That's why we need public options. Yes, plural.

Posted by: Michiganmom | October 12, 2009 1:32 PM | Report abuse

You are right, nlynnc. kare1 demonstrates that Soviet defector Yuri Bezmenov was right when he warned us (in 1985) that our enemies were working hard at brainwashing us (dumbing us down): http://www.dailymotion.com/video/k6KUDv1wzraWhwlBt1

Dumbed down Americans are easily manipulated and fooled by Orwellian nonsense. They need to understand that when Marxists say they want to "help the poor," they mean they want to USE the poor to enslave everyone. Marxism multiplies poverty, corruption and despair.

As the most ignorant Venezuelans, Nicaraguans, Bolivians, Ecuadorians, many people in the U.S. were fooled with fairy tale promises of CHANGE to help to poor, to end corruption… to make everything better.

And now some are being fooled again and are ready to let a Chavez-like Obama take control of their health care system!

Fortunately, not all Americans have been dumbed down, as we can see in the town halls! Most Americans have not been dumbed down and prefer to be FREE.


Posted by: AntonioSosa | October 12, 2009 1:29 PM | Report abuse

Is there still a middle class? Obama and his Socialist advisers are working very had to remove the middle class. You see all socialist country only have 2 classes of people the poor and the rich.
Socialism suck the life and hope, it drains all incentive to achive your goals

Posted by: akeegan2 | October 12, 2009 1:28 PM | Report abuse

A few facts:

In this country, insurance companies pay out 85% of their revenue on claims.

Of the remaining 15%, somewhere from 10%-12% is spent on administration. I'm sure there are a few making higher profit margins, but these companies have a very small share of the market.

That leaves 3% - 5% of revenue as profit. Replacing the insurance compaies with a government-run plan will, therefore, provide a one-time cost savings of 3-5% of insurance company revenue. Underlying medical costs will continue to rise. And, given Congress' practice of giving Drs. and Hospitals whatever they ask for in the way of Medicare increases, the rates are likely to rise faster in the future.

Get rid of the insurance companies, if you wish. But don't fool yourselves into thinking that's going to solve the rise in medical costs.

Posted by: Steve-2 | October 12, 2009 1:26 PM | Report abuse

IF THE INSURANCE COMPANIES ARE GONNA GO UP ON THEIR PREMIUMS,THEN,WE NEED TO DO AWAY WITH THEM...IM FOR IT!! BYE BYE PRIVATE HEALTH INSURANCE...
LETS DO THIS..
LETS SET UP A GOVERNMENT GROUP PLAN..
1.SIGN UP ONLINE OR AT THE SS OFFICE THE 1ST 50MILLION AMERICANS(NOT ILLEGALS,AMERICANS)ON DECEMBER 1ST..

2.STARTING JAN.1,2010,WE ALL PAY 60 DOLLARS A MONTH FOR INDIVIDUALS,AND 90 DOLLARS A MONTH FOR A FAMILY OF 4(WITH 5 DOLLARS PER FAMILY MEMBER IF ITS OVER 4 ON YOUR FAMILY PLAN)..

3.FROM JAN.1,2010 TO APRIL 1,2010,
WE ALL WILL HAVE TO WAIT BEFORE WE CAN USE THE PLAN.
WE ALL WILL RECIEVE A CARD WITH OUR INFO THAT WILL BE ACCESSED BY DOCTORS OFFICES AND HOSPITALS TO SHOW YOUR MEDICAL HISTORY. AND,BY US WAITING FOR THE FIRST 3 MONTHS AND PAYING WHILE WE WAIT,THAT WILL INSURE MONEY INTO THE POT FOR EVERYONE..

4.THIS WILL ONLY BE ALLOWED FOR THOSE WHO CAN PAY,AND THE MORE PEOPLE WE HAVE SIGNING UP,THE LOWER THE COSTS PER MONTH CAN GET..HOW'S THAT???

5.THIS WILL BE A PAY AS YOU GO OPTION..
THEREFORE IT WON'T COST THOSE NUT BAGS WHO DON'T WANT GOVERNMENT RUN HEALTHCARE NOT A SINGLE DIME!!

IF WE ONLY HAD 50 MILLION INDIVIDUALS IT WOULD BE 3 BILLION A MONTH THAT WE WOULD ACCUMULATE..

THIS WOULD EQUAL,FREE DOCTOR VISITS,NO COST FOR A SPECIALIST,25 DOLLARS FOR MRI'S,5 DOLLARS FOR A MINIMUM OF 3 XRAY'S,AND LOW COST 4 AND 3 DOLLAR MEDICATION...
NO COST FOR SURGERY..
AND,THE DOCTORS,AND HOSPITALS WILL GET PAID THE SAME DAY OR THE VERY NEXT DAY..

Posted by: Earl02 | October 12, 2009 1:17 PM | Report abuse

All those who want socialized medicine and a socialist/communist country should move to Cuba or Venezuela. We would be happy to pay one-way tickets for all of them and would ask them to take their comrades Obama, Pelosi, Reid, etc. with them. They have no right to transform the U.S. into another failed socialist country like Cuba or Venezuela just because they happen to be dumbed down, as explained in Pravda.http://english.pravda.ru/opinion/columnists/107459-american_capitalism-0

Posted by: AntonioSosa | October 12, 2009 1:12 PM | Report abuse

@ kare1 who said: 45,000 people die every year in this country because they do not have access to good healthcare.
Posted by: kare1 | October 12, 2009 12:26 PM
-------------------------------------------
You do realize that 45,000 is a projection, based on a very narrow poll and some very broad assumptions, don't you? It's not a real number that reflects actual people.

The events of September 11, 2001 actually occurred and we know for certain that people died that day.

Health care is unaffordable for a small percentage of Americans; some health care costs are way too high. There are valid reasons to consider reforming health care in the United States to make it more affordable, more portable and more available. But there is no reason to correlate health care needs to the events of September 11. Shame on you for perverting that tragedy into a ridiculously contrived straw man just to promote your own anger. Thinking works better when you do it with your brain and not your emotions.

Posted by: nlynnc | October 12, 2009 1:01 PM | Report abuse

Mandates and private insurer lead generation and marketing schemes like the "Utah Plan" are proof positive the little guy is going to get screwed again and the insurance companies and their bought off Senators are going to get richer. This idea actually makes our economy worse by forcing the poor or unemployed to pay $6,000 per year premiums with $5,000 deductibles when they can't even afford their mortgages or food for their families. A forced payment to Cigna et. al. will cause more stress, health problems, violence and death.

The pigs in the Senate don't care though.
These slothful "little people" (some with dirty pre-existing conditions because they don't love Jesus) wouldn't vote for the likes of Baucaus, Grassly, Kyl or McCain anyway.

Posted by: coloradodog | October 12, 2009 12:53 PM | Report abuse

THE REPUBLICANS HATE AMERICA!!
THE REPUBLICANS HATE AMERICA!!
THE REPUBLICANS HATE AMERICA!!

THE ARE SO MAD THAT OBAMA WON THE ELECTION,THAT THEY WILL LIE AND SAY ANYTHING TO DISCREDIT THIS GREAT AMERICAN!!

I LOVE IT!!

AND HE WON THE NOBEL PEACE PRIZE,AND G.W.BUSH,DIDN'T WIN JACK SQUAT!!LMAO,I LOVE IT!!

WE HAVE NOT BEEN ATTACKED SINCE OBAMA HAS BEEN IN OFFICE,AND WITHIN THE 1ST 9 MONTHS OF THE BUSH/CHENEY REIGN,WE WERE HIT!!
THATS NOT A LAUGHING MATTER..
BUT THIS PRESIDENT IS KEEPING US SAFE,DISPITE ALL THE ILLEGAL PROGRAMS THAT BUSH HAS SET UP..

BUSH WAS NOT A LEADER..NOR WAS HE PRESIDENTIAL MATERIAL..

OBAMA,IS A WORLD LEADER,AND PRESIDENTIAL MATERIAL..AND THE REPUBS ARE JUST AS JEALUOS AND HATEFUL THAT WE NOW HAVE A FUN,SPIRITED,AND INTELLIGENT MAN LIKE WE'VE NEVER HAD BEFORE RUNNING THIS COUNTRY "OUT" OF THE GROUND!!

THANKS G.W...
THANKS FOR NOTHING!!

THANKS PRESIDENT OBAMA,WE ARE BEHIND YOU!!

Posted by: Earl02 | October 12, 2009 12:47 PM | Report abuse

Please explain again why I must be forced to buy my ticket from a scalper?? Some people define self interest very narrowly, "what will I pay or make now, and what will I get?". That isn't what insurance is. Insurance is sharing risks and costs as a community so that those relative few who need unaffordable services at any given time will get it from the pool, in order to have more stable futures for all. Most of the individual costs of the current system are hidden to large numbers of people, but they do pay; in lost wages,transfer of jobs to places with universal care not built into the cost of the product, getting cancelled when you need the service or just being locked out up front. You can say "premium" and our patriots nod in liberty affirming self-righteousness. Yet if you say "public option" it's a Tax instead of premium and they become pachyderms before the mouse.

Posted by: jpferg1 | October 12, 2009 12:40 PM | Report abuse

Where is the value of a human life in this debate?

45,000 people die every year in this country because they do not have access to good healthcare.

That is the equivalent of 9/11 every single month of the year. We went to fight two wars over the outrage we saw on 9/11.

And yet we are happy to sit by and let 122 people a day die, 44,000 people a year.

We should be at war with the insurance industry - instead we argue about the cost of program that may be the last time to make rational long-term changes to the way we treat EVERYONE in the country.

I am outraged that we let a 9/11 happen every month.
I am outraged that the INSURANCE TERRORISTS get to continue their ways by coming out with a report that implies that "WE HAVE THE POWER TO INDUCE TERROR IN YOUR FAMILY" by raising the rates of insurance so that people FEAR for their lives.

I am outraged that a 9/11 happens every month in terms of lives lost due to the greed of an industry that promotes profits over lives.

I am outraged every time I see a child coming through the emergency room and watch parents try to figure out how to pay for that ER visit - how to save their child, parent, husband, wife, sister, daughter, grandparent from pain and from DEATH only to be terrorized into paying for a service that feeds GREED not care.

I am outraged at this 9/11 every month, and no one is willing to wage a war on healthcare - we will wage war for oil, but not for human lives.

THINK about it - a 9/11 every month of every year and we sit idly by and allow it to happen.

Posted by: kare1 | October 12, 2009 12:26 PM | Report abuse

A public option will have the government deciding your health care and that's nothing short of scary.

Posted by: kathy26 | October 12, 2009 12:26 PM | Report abuse

Why would the health industry criticize legislation that would get them more paying customers if its report isn't true? The health industry stands to make more money from mandated health.

Posted by: kathy26 | October 12, 2009 12:23 PM | Report abuse

These republicans will say anything to keep the $$$$ in their pockets by allowing insurance companies ROB AND STEAL THE PUBLIC.

We may not get what we want to begin with, but if we stick with our President Obama we may be on our way to Health insurance that will give the average person a fighting chance for survival. Dont ask Nuthead Bush for his opinion, it sure as hell will not be for the benefit of the people who he has ruined their lives and taken all the goodies!

Posted by: LOONYBIN2000 | October 12, 2009 12:20 PM | Report abuse

And the headline is:"READERS DOUBT INSURERS. READERS DOUBT THEIR DOCTORS. READERS DOUBT GW BUSH. READERS DOUBT THEIR NURSES. READERS DOUBT CAPITALISM READERS DOUBT INDIVIDUALISM. READERS DOUBT RESEARCH AND DEVELOPMENT. READERS DOUBT CONSTITUTION. READERS DOUBT AMERICA. READERS SUPPORT OBAMA AND DEMOCRATS.

Posted by: chatard | October 12, 2009 12:19 PM | Report abuse

You don't have to be Price Waterhouse to see that this "reform" is going to cost everyone more.

Posted by: HarroldtheCat | October 12, 2009 12:13 PM | Report abuse

What a joke the Post has become. Commenting on readers' comments? And cherry-picking those? There appear to have been plenty of comments that treat the Obama plan skeptically -- just like the media used to treat the powers that be skeptically before it decided to shrug off the burdens of the Fourth Estate and instead play Tiger Beat to Obama's teen heart-throb.

It's obvious to anyone, with or without a consulting group's report, that this plan will cause the 87% of insured Americans to see their insurance costs skyrocket. You want to mandate that all pay the same rates, and put in place a $1,000 fee for those who don't have insurance? Who pays less than $1,000 per year in insurance? Almost nobody. Many people will take their chances with no insurance until they're ill, knowing they'd be saving money doing so. It's economic nonsense.

It's just too bad that we've devolved to the point where the Post is more trusting of a partisan, agenda-driven White House than it is of common sense.

Posted by: itchy1 | October 12, 2009 11:51 AM | Report abuse

I'd believe Baghdad Bob before I'd believe Odumbo, Gibbs, Axelrod or any of the other liars in the Obama cabal who are trying to turn our country into a third world wreck.

What an embarrasing bunch of #$%$# leftist they are.

Incompetent too.

Posted by: LarryG62 | October 12, 2009 11:44 AM | Report abuse

You are right, ohioan. Obamacare has NOTHING to do with improving our health care system. It's just a scam for additional power. But I would not blame all Democrats. Honest Democrats are against the Obamacare scam.

Honest Democrats and Republicans understand that Obamacare is just another power grab that will further destroy our health care, destroy our economy, steal money from our children and grandchildren, multiply our deficit, and enslave us through lies, manipulation, intimidation and coercion.

Imitating Hugo Chavez, Obama wants to nationalize everything, including our health care system! "Hey, Obama has just nationalized nothing more and nothing less than General Motors. Comrade Obama!" Chavez cheered on Venezuelan TV. He added that he and Cuba's Fidel Castro would now have to work harder just to keep up.
http://www.hacer.org/report/2009/06/us-obamas-red-chorus-investors-business.html

Fortunately, as we can see in the town halls and marches, most Americans are honest and have NOT been dumbed down. Most Americans DO NOT WANT to put the power of life and death in Obama’s ACORN-type bureaucracy. They will do whatever necessary to defend themselves, their children and grandchildren from the abomination of Obamacare and socialism/communism.

Posted by: AntonioSosa | October 12, 2009 11:38 AM | Report abuse

How can anyone believe that multiplying bureaucracy for Obamacare is going to save money or improve anything? Adding TRILLIONS to our deficit so Obama can pay his private armies of ACORN-type government workers -- to provide us with "end-of-life" (death) counseling and to decide who lives or dies – will further DESTROY our health care, our economy and our country.

Obamacare will only increase our deficit, further steal from our children and grandchildren, further deteriorate health care, and further destroy our country.

To fix our health care problems, we need to go in the OPPOSITE direction in which Obama is taking us. A socialized health care system would be another step to destroy our country, our future and the future of our children and grandchildren! LEARN about the horrendous problems of government-controlled medicine everywhere where it’s implemented, including Canada, Great Britain and even Taiwan -- http://www.thrf.org.tw/EN/Page_Show.asp?Page_ID=124

And Taiwan does not have a Chavez-like Obama! With a Chavez-like Obama, things would be much more corrupt and costly in the U.S.

Posted by: AntonioSosa | October 12, 2009 11:33 AM | Report abuse

The Democrats are more concerned about "passing something, anything" than solving the real issue, skyrocketing costs.
If the Democrats's bill doesn't STOP THE BLEEDING- that is, reduce business and individual's premiums, immediately -- they will only have more and more "uninsured",
and that means they Failed at Health Reform. The insurance companies don't create the costs, they only pass them along. That means you have to reform hospital, doctors, drug companies to truly
Reduce Costs. Have they done that? I don't think so. Democrats are playing politics, they are not solving problems.

Posted by: ohioan | October 12, 2009 11:33 AM | Report abuse

Why aren't the comments against Obamacare included? Obama’s operatives and brainwashed lemmings are busy demonizing the insurance companies.

Why are they not demonizing Big Pharma? Because Obama and the pharmaceutical lobby secretly reached an agreement through which Big Pharma will get richer at our expense by helping Obama enslave us with Obamacare.

"The memo... says the White House agreed to oppose any congressional efforts to use the government’s leverage to bargain for lower drug prices or import drugs from Canada — and also agreed not to pursue Medicare rebates or shift some drugs from Medicare Part B to Medicare Part D, which would cost Big Pharma billions in reduced reimbursements.

In other words, Big Pharma will get richer for helping Obama enslave us with Obamacare. http://www.floppingaces.net/2009/08/14/obama-pharma-make-secret-deal/

We may have issues with insurance companies, hospitals and doctors, but that does not mean we want the Obamacare scam. We do NOT WANT SOCIALISM/COMMUNISM!

Posted by: AntonioSosa | October 12, 2009 11:30 AM | Report abuse

The insurance companies' claim that increasing the covered population to include people with preexisting conditions will lead to higher premiums is valid.

The economics of insurance are very simple:
I= M + A + P

where I=Insurance premiums
M= medical payouts (to doctors, hospitals, etc.)
A= Administration costs, including exorbitant executive salaries
P=profits

Under the new plan, M will increase because the new members will have much higher payouts-that's why they don't now have insurance, because no company can take them on except at very high premiums which the members can't afford. Nothing in the plan will reduce A or P (a fatal flaw,but perhaps necessary to get some plan passed in "The best Congress that Money can Buy."

Therefore, I must (!) increase enough to cover increased M. Will it? No one knows, and the Price-Waterhouse guess is as good as anyone's. Just be prepared for that increase, or increased taxes to cover Congress's bets.

Posted by: Bethesdalew | October 12, 2009 11:25 AM | Report abuse

Which idiotic brainiacs with the insurance companies came up with the idea to do this study? It just makes more thoughtful people who are anxious about their insurance premiums more receptive to a single payer plan or public option - real smart!

Posted by: southernbutnotstupid | October 12, 2009 11:07 AM | Report abuse

America would be better off without the health insurance companies. Other countries have health: we have health insurance. It is a choice. We cannot have both.

Posted by: alzach | October 12, 2009 11:06 AM | Report abuse

A few things to remember.
1) The quality of healthcare is the reason it costs so much. If doctors still used asprin and leaches the cost would be very low. Bigger diagnostic machines and fancier prescriptions and longer lifespans up the price.
2) The Iraq war was originally estimated to cost $400 billion, that ballooned to several trillion. Govt. cost estimates are ALWAYS extremely lowballed.
3) Just like the post office, the government will pass laws to stifle real competition and eventually create a Health care monopoly. Over time, we will have to use their insurance.
4) This IS another program that will funnel middle and upper class income to lower class citizens. I call it forced charity. I'd rather give my money to St. Judes or the American Cancer society or to my retirement fund than to even one person able to work who chooses not to.
5) Think! It's not illegal yet!

Posted by: frontier_teg | October 12, 2009 10:57 AM | Report abuse

Doctors, lawyers, hospitals, pharmaceuticals, medical equipment manufacturers, insurance companies. All for profit. All making much, much more that average incomes off the back of the sick and injured.

Changing a broken system is "Socialistic" and "Anti-American". I guess their right. Having 44,000 people die each year from lack of health care while CEO's make millions is the free market system at it's finest. Makes you proud, doesn't it?

Posted by: averal | October 12, 2009 10:53 AM | Report abuse

The comments that ring the truest to me were by maillist:
mail-list said, "If premiums will be too high with reform, and they are too high now, its time to dump the health insurance companies and pass single payer national health insurance..."

Posted by: Thependulumswings | October 12, 2009 10:46 AM | Report abuse

Anytime you put the motive of profit ahead of ethical conduct, there will be conflict. I would like to see a model developed that showed every hospital functioning as non-profit and make it illegal for affiliations with any for-profit industry. In industry we always try to elliminate any risk that can bring the plant "to it's knee's". Items like health care, energy, and communications are such issues and until we create a system that will not only encourage each to be easily obtained, we will always have these considerable and avoidable risks that can bring this country to it's knee's as well.

Posted by: injuneer | October 12, 2009 10:46 AM | Report abuse

Healthcare costs are going up and there is not much that can be done about that. The demographics of our population will mean increasing costs for the foreseeable future. In addition, all of the "easy" to discover or invent drugs, devices, treatments, and procedures have been found. Research to find new and better drugs, devices, treatments, and procedures will cost more and the cost of them when available will be higher. It is time for our Obama and the Congress to stop misleading us and deal with the real reality. The current plans being considered do not address the problem and the rhetoric being used to push them is misleading us all. If our elected officials will not tell us the truth and address the reality of the situation, we shout VOTE THEM OUT!

Posted by: AngryMobVoter | October 12, 2009 10:44 AM | Report abuse

The insurance industry has had its way for years. So, how are the rest of us doing?

It's crucial that the people not take their eyes off all the players in this farce, including (especially), the key Democrats who are saying one thing while taking heaps of payola from said insurance industry.

We are being set up to get a lot of nothing. Someone should pay. Let that someone be Max Baucus, a top money-getter from the insurance industry and a major roadblock to real health insurance reform. We can't vote all the rascals out of office, but we can vote the head rascal out!

Posted by: iammyself | October 12, 2009 10:42 AM | Report abuse

If the insurance companies and republicans are against the healthcare bill it must be good for the average person.Insurance companies are a bunch of thieves who want nothing but pure profit and don't want to pay out anything.The country would be better off without insurance companies,lawyers and most politicians

Posted by: LDTRPT25 | October 12, 2009 10:27 AM | Report abuse

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