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Like it or not, the 2010 election is now (substantially) about immigration

galluparizona.jpg

The Democrats' immigration plan is based on a simple compromise: Restrictionists get increased border security, reformers get a path to legalization. And the compromise is in that order, too: The legalization path doesn't kick in until eight separate security benchmarks are met (head here for an excellent summary).

The question is whether anyone wants this compromise, at least right now. Consider this: The Arizona plan is popular. According to Gallup, 51 percent of Americans who have heard of the law support it. Only 39 percent oppose the legislation.

In our interview yesterday, Sen. Lindsey Graham argued that though the law shows the need for comprehensive reform, it also shows that Americans are moving toward border security and interior enforcement as the answer to the immigration issue. "In this environment," Graham said, "what you'd have is bipartisan rejection of immigration. You'd get 75 or 80 votes for the McCain-Kyl [border security] amendment. Then, when you tried to put the pathway to citizenship on the table without a long process of planning and thinking and building support, you'd probably get 60 people voting against it."

And Graham's opinion matters here: He's the only Republican who's been working with the Democrats on immigration reform. And without at least one Republican on their side, there's no chance of passage.

But that doesn't mean there's no reason to bring up the proposal. For one thing, Hispanics are an important part of the Democratic coalition. They're owed a response to the Arizona law. And denunciations aren't good enough: The only response that makes sense is an actual solution to the problem. The counterargument that Graham offers is that the bill probably can't pass, and bringing it up in this environment may make it harder to pass in 2011.

Or maybe not. Immigration is a dangerous issue to add into the election, but it's also an important one. Pretty much every Republican will admit that over the long haul, their party can't totally lose the Hispanic vote. Doing so would consign it to being a regional also-ran. If Republicans can't formulate a humane position on immigration for 2010, they're likely to poll abysmally with Hispanics come Election Day. And that may offer the necessary spur for them to attempt to solve this issue -- and repair that relationship -- before the 2012 election.

Either way, for all that some might not want to see immigration added to this electoral environment, it's done. And it's Jan Brewer and the Arizona legislature, not the Senate Democrats, that did it. Democrats have to respond with something constructive that shows they're working toward a better equilibrium, and Republicans -- and this is important, I think -- don't have to retrench into restrictionist xenophobia. It might be politically difficult to resist the electoral appeal of pandering to the country's worst instincts on this question, but, at the risk of sounding naive, it's also the right thing to do, both as a matter of policy and, in the long term, politics.

The other option would be to somehow table the question in a credible fashion. Graham calls for a bipartisan commission that would report back with a comprehensive reform proposal after the election is over. He even offers to serve on it. That makes some sense, but probably isn't enough. If Republicans wanted to show good-faith on the issue, however, and agree to fast-track the commission's recommendations and protect them from a filibuster, that would be a solution that both kicks the issue until after the election but looks like something more than an attempt to cower until the post-Arizona anger calms.

By Ezra Klein  |  April 30, 2010; 9:46 AM ET
Categories:  Immigration  
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Next: Is a biometric, national ID card an immigration game changer?

Comments

Looks like the more people hear about it the more they like it. Look for this to be replicated across the country.

Posted by: obrier2 | April 30, 2010 10:02 AM | Report abuse

Let's hope the commission route is taken. I don't see good policy being made in an election year.

Posted by: jduptonma | April 30, 2010 10:05 AM | Report abuse

what I was stunned about was that 27% of Democrats were in favor of it. I know Republicans are bigoted xenophobes but Dems? Really?

That being said Ezra you're right it absolutely is the case that this is front and center and I don't see a way that this doesn't kill Dems.

If immigration reform doesn't pass then Harry Reid is seen as inept and the large hispanic bloc of voters won't come out for Dems.

if it does pass then it further emboldens the Tea Partiers and conservative wing of the Republicans but this is probably better for Dems because at least Hispanics will vote with them.

That being said why wouldn't Republicans while not outwardly rooting for it to fail cheer it not being able to pass?

Posted by: visionbrkr | April 30, 2010 10:10 AM | Report abuse

Immigration will be to 2010 what healthcare reform was to 2009: a golden opportunity for the GOP to stoke its base and to undermine the Democrats' ability to govern the terms of a debate, let alone the country. Just you wait until the August recess: the Tea Partyers will make last year's "death panel" look like a kumbaya picnic in the park. If they've learned anything from healthcare, the administration better come out swinging with a strong policy and political strategy, the earlier the better. Otherwise, immigration reform will wedge *Democrats* rather than *Republicans*.

Nixonland is dead; long live Nixonland.

P.S. Ezra, Lindsey Graham is playing you just the way Olympia "She heeds the call of history" Snowe and Paul "I've got sensible healthcare reforms ideas, too -- abolish SS and Medicare" Ryan did on healthcare reform.

Posted by: scarlota | April 30, 2010 10:15 AM | Report abuse

So to hell with everyone else it is all about the Hispanic vote. A vote mind you that has the lowest turnout rate among Blacks, Whites, and Hispanics.

Posted by: cleancut77 | April 30, 2010 10:39 AM | Report abuse

If it passes with minor revisions, I don't see how the Republicans can realistically attack it. Two changes and it's a completely conservative bill, not a compromise at all: (a) take away the language investigating how badly America treated immigrants in the past. That's pointless and has no place in this bill; it's almost like the Democrats want to poison pill it and (b) add a Super Fence. Not only will it be an actual, physical fence (duh), it'll be a great place to put sensors, cameras, etc.

And, correctly engineered, a fence could indicate when it's been cut, etc. Then I think later it should be bundled, frankly, with more liberal immigration policies. We should streamline the process for legal immigration (with the same requirements of English language skills and a better knowledge of American history and civics than any public school student gets these days. ;)

The Democrats fumble on immigration, it'll be all about how they spin, defend, and explain the bill, not on the overall quality of the policy.

Posted by: Kevin_Willis | April 30, 2010 10:46 AM | Report abuse

Also, and example of the Dems fumbling on immigration might be all the attacks on Arizona, a state of the front lines and with legitimate concerns. "We think there might be a better way, and solid federal solution that works for everybody" is great. "Those xenophobic Arizona hicks that hate brown people" is not.

Posted by: Kevin_Willis | April 30, 2010 10:49 AM | Report abuse

I think the immigration thing was always going to be a wedge to split the tea party and the GOP, while energizing the Latino vote right before 2010. Trouble is, that would've fired up the Tea Party turnout, too. Now that the AZ GOP has done the political legwork for the Dems, though, they get more Latino vote without having to do anything. That sucks for the policy of all this, but it's good politics for the Dems.

Posted by: Chris_ | April 30, 2010 11:13 AM | Report abuse

Mr Klein makes the point that no one wants to acknowledge about immigration. Neither party is talking about what is in the national interest and what would be good immigration reform, but what they perceive is in their political interest. Anyone interested in immigration reform that would advance the national interest should read the report issued by a commission headed by Father Hesburgh thirty years ago and the one issued by a commission headed by Barbara Jordon fifteen years ago. Unfortunately, the political elites in congress took both reports and put them in the circular file. To me this means that they as I said earlier do not want immigration reform that is in the national interest but something that will advance their own interests. For you want a reason to oppose anything that comes out of congress I have given it to you.

Posted by: jeffreed | April 30, 2010 11:21 AM | Report abuse

The Republican game plan is simple: Postpone immigration reform until the next Congress. By then, the Dems will have lost approximately five Senate seats and a number of House seats to hardline, enforcement only Republicans and immigration reform will be dead until after 2012.
If Obama does not fulfill his promise to the Latinos, he will be unelectable in 2012, because the Latinos will not support Obama for re-election and the Republicans will win the Presidency.

Posted by: mehuwss | April 30, 2010 11:23 AM | Report abuse

Lets not forget people that the law will be struck down 9-0 by the supreme court.

Posted by: AndyR3 | April 30, 2010 11:35 AM | Report abuse


For Democrats to try and pass some form of Amnesty, when 26.4 million (full-time work) Americans are jobless is political suicide? Specifically in California where citizens-residents have to compete with millions of illegal immigrants? U.S. Citizenship & Immigration Services (CIS), an estimated 2,209,000 illegal immigrants
resided in California in 2000.
My Guess is Californian's will be digging into their already empty pockets, when illegal immigrants start pouring in from Arizona? These people already aware that state welfare entitlements are easy to get, so this state will be first preference? Thousands more fleeing will definitely head for Utah, Texas and New Mexico or onwards to the the rest of the 52 states looking for free handouts. The military should have been deployed to the border 15 years ago and now they must take the blame for the carnage and runaway illegal immigrant smuggling on the border. For not building two separate fences as initially planned, nor post or pre-administrations for not making it a felony for illegally entering America through the border, by plane or ship. Politicians have all the money they want to support wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. But out of the--TRILLION--dollars spent up to 2009 in far off lands, surely they could have used some of that money to protect and serve the US taxpayer? SO WHERE IS THE DEPLOYMENT OF THE NATIONAL GUARD ALONG THE BORDER?

It's no wonder Arizona drowning in debt from subsidizing a million illegal alien families, were desperate to enact this police enforcement law. NUMBERSUSA--needs all the members, who wish to stop any pro-amnesty lawmaker, to find out the outrageous costs of supporting foreign nationals. Join the million members team to start the program of ATTRITION--by self-deportation. Sen. Harry Reid must go in the midterm election, but we must watch for illegal aliens voting to keep him in office?

BOYCOTT STATES THAT BOYCOTT ARIZONA! A GREAT STATE FOR A VACATION. WHY ISN"T ICE ARRESTING GOVERNORS, MAYORS, JUDGES AND ELECTED OFFICIAL WHO ARE ENDORSING SANCTUARY POLICIES

Posted by: infinity555 | April 30, 2010 12:32 PM | Report abuse

Most laws that oppress minorities are favored by majorities. Nothing to see here, folks, move along.

Posted by: koolkat_1960 | April 30, 2010 2:05 PM | Report abuse

This is all 50 years too late. The AZ law will do nothing but create havoc and a Nazi police state. Society is now on wait, to identify who the first innocent victim of a misguided law will be.

After the Reagan amnesty ,nothing positive was done to secure the borders. His gesture to illegals, resulted in the biggest flood of illegal aliens into our country. The church's and social welfare politicians fed this great illegal migration with our resources and tax money.

Now, we have a disaster with over 12 million illegal aliens living and working in America. Draining our school, hospitals and every government resource in every county, city and state.

The AZ response is just one rifle shot after another, that will do absolutely nothing to sole the problem.

Immigration reform is desperately needed, and without reform this problem will escalate beyond our imaginations.

Posted by: COWENS99 | April 30, 2010 2:31 PM | Report abuse

I would love to understand how our health care reform expert believes a legalized population of currently illegal immigrants would interface with our new PPACA health insurance reform. What would the cost estimate be?

Posted by: lancediverson | April 30, 2010 2:41 PM | Report abuse

Us xenophobes have a secret weapon - a giant bulldozer capable of nudging some 10 million squatters back over the border whence they emerged.

Posted by: LeePefley1 | April 30, 2010 3:11 PM | Report abuse

I'm not sure I follow the notion that Democrats will be on board with amnesty. The unions, a major Democratic party constituency, are as mad about illegal immigrants taking good American jobs away as anyone else. Also, I wouldn't worry too much about Republicans "losing the Hispanic vote." Implying that all Hispanics vote the same way is kinda racist, don't you think? Ultimately, the Republican party succeeds when it sticks to its principles. Don't believe me? Ever heard of a guy named Marco Rubio? I believe he's both Latino and THE major rising star in the GOP.

Posted by: linguist64 | April 30, 2010 3:58 PM | Report abuse

Nothing like passing the buck until another time. This is what has got us into all of this BS

Posted by: laptoprick | April 30, 2010 4:13 PM | Report abuse

73 % of the HISPANIC Citizens in ARIZONA Agree with SB1070. 73% HISPANIC Arizonans do not want ILLEGALS of any color, shape, size,in the STATE of Arizona.
That is 73% HISPANIC CITIZENS who came here legaly, did what was right and followed the law.
73% Hispanic Citizens in Arizona ARE VOTING FOR THOSE WHO will enforce the law.

The Press is not reporting equal and unbiasly on this subject.

Won't get fooled again in 2010!
No Incumbants

Posted by: TDickson1 | April 30, 2010 4:21 PM | Report abuse

On the Democrats proposal: The best part is having those who want to stay here register for selective service! A minimum two to three years service in the military would make them appreciate what we have in this country! This should be a MANDATORY requirement!

Posted by: SeniorVet | April 30, 2010 4:30 PM | Report abuse

why is it always xenophobic and racist to want to be very strong on ILLEGAL actions and to immediatly deport ILLEGAL immigrants? i believe that decades from now, if we are strong on ILLEGALS, it will pay dividends for everyone including Hispanics. its like affirmative action, people look at some blacks and say well they got that job due to afirmative action. if we get rid of affirmative action folks can't say or think that. just as if we get rid of ILLEGALS, years from now folks won't look at all Hispanics as if they're all ILLEGAL.

Posted by: submarinerssn774 | April 30, 2010 4:31 PM | Report abuse

At the risk of being an "attack magnet," I think the old saying, "be careful what you wish for," is applicable here. First, all the studies show that undocumented aliens are actually a financial POSITIVE to the USA as a whole(and to Arizona specifically). They pay taxes for services they will never claim (medicare, SS, etc.), they rent apartments and houses that would otherwise be vacant, they spend virtually every cent they earn in local businesses, etc. They are working in jobs that keep our food cheap - imagine what we will be paying for produce if those jobs are taken by American unemployed workers, who demand minimum wages, social security tax payments, overtime and benefits. Same for the people who now trim hedges, wash dishes, provide child care and cook, clean and do laundry. Not to mention that many unemployed Americans are not willing to do those jobs anyhow. Yes, there are indeed many out-of-work folks who are willing to do almost any job, but many of them ARE working. There is a reason big employers and even medium and small ones look to undocumented workers - they come cheap, they are afraid to complain about conditions, they do not expect benefits, etc. We need immigration reform, although not, in my opinion, the Arizona type which places an untenable burden on police and lends itself to profiling - especially bad when a third of the LEGAL residents meet the likely undocumented profile. We were supposed to get real reform after Reagan's amnesty, but he didn't move on it, and so on through Bush who was also not willing to do anything. Whether Obama would have done so without Arizona's action is something we will never know, but when legislation is done in a hurry by politicians on both sides who are looking for political gain, we all lose. We also lose whenever the majority is allowed to legislate the rights of a minority, and for that reason alone, we need a fair, legal, moral reform program, not a knee-jerk law that makes one state so uncomfortable for one third of its LEGAL residents that they either move away or are afraid to go out of the house.

Posted by: rmcdetal | April 30, 2010 4:34 PM | Report abuse

The proposed Democratic plan is *precisely* the same plan they foisted off on the country under Carter. There is flat out no difference. Then, after the amnesty, they pretty much dropped employer sanctions, border enforcement, universal I.D., etc. What happened was, the draw of our misinterpretation of the 14th Amendment caused millions of additional illegals to flock here, drop their anchor babies on our doorstep, and demand educational and medical benefits, social services, and on and on. We now spend in excess of $1.5 TRILLION dollars annually on illegals, and that does included Medicaid benefits going to the mothers and siblings of those anchor babies.

The fact is, most legal scholars agree that Congress could pass a simple understanding of the 14th Amendment that would deny citizenship and any and all access to non-life threatening medical care, social services, schools, etc. The 14th Amendment was passed during Reconstruction, after the Civil War, expressly and solely to grant citizenship to the children of former slaves. Subsequent to that, one single case involving it, that of the children of legal Chinese laborers, has been before the Supreme Court. The whole notion of anchor babies, of automatic citizenship for the children of illegal immigrants, is based on a footnote in the Plylor decision by Marshall. There is no legal basis for automatic citizenship whatsoever. If COngress is really serious about "immigration reform", they will pass that understanding. Thus far, however, they wont even talk about it. One suspects that the Democratic COngress is merely playing games, trying to have it both ways. Throw these bums out!

Posted by: mibrooks27 | April 30, 2010 4:35 PM | Report abuse

Just do your damn jobs! Secure our borders and enforce our immigrations laws. NO COMPROMISES. Period. End of sentence. End of discussion.

Posted by: anna_78750 | April 30, 2010 4:35 PM | Report abuse

Only in a Democrat wet dream is this November about immigration; no, this November is about these wrecks getting skidmarks on their hind parts while sliding down the pavement hitting the curb, the more the merrier.

Posted by: hared | April 30, 2010 4:37 PM | Report abuse

Ezra...another WaPo mouthpiece...the good news there's a big mess down in the gulf of mexico that needs to be cleaned up...this is a win win for Obamadmin.

Posted by: billbrann | April 30, 2010 4:37 PM | Report abuse

That is the same deal we made with Washington in the 80's. We got the amnisty but not the closed border. Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me. I would not consider any deal other than mass deportation before the border is closed and even then I would be worried that the Dems would reopen it. There are just too many potiental Democrat voters in Mexico for the Democrats to resist.

Posted by: jdonner2 | April 30, 2010 4:41 PM | Report abuse

Why should someone, because they are of "Hispanic" descent, care so much about the welfare of illegal immigrants? I'm betting, most do not.

That's like saying all Caucasions should be weeping bloody tears over the plight of illegal immigrants from Europe. Screw the illegals, send them back.

Mexican illegals are NOT the responsibility of their American "counterparts".

It's assinine to assume that anyone of Mexican descent would give two damns about some border-hopping peasant family they don't know and aren't related to.

Close the border and follow the law and get rid of these assorted lawbreakers. We have it bad enough, without them asking for a handout.

Posted by: veerle1 | April 30, 2010 4:42 PM | Report abuse

Who decided immigration reform was the "hot " issue. We haven't finished with financial reform, we've got millions of people out of work. Of course, those issues are loaded with emotional drama so the MSM just decided we should all pay attention to something else-which just happens to hurt Dems politically.

Posted by: BBear1 | April 30, 2010 4:43 PM | Report abuse

Democrats are cooking up another huge AMNESTY scheme. They must be more stupid than I thought. They got their fingers burned badly last time they tried to push this off on America. I would have thought they'd have learned a lesson. Maybe they think Obama will work some magic for them.

AMNESTY is a proven failure as a solution for illegal immigration. It is a reward to chronic lawbreakers and it multiplies the number of illegals every time.

There's between 12,000,000 and 20,000,000 outlaw immigrants roaming America today. They stay here in the hopes that some sucker president and crony congress will give them AMNESTY.

I hope the Democrats' new AMNESTY scam fails miserably.......again!

Posted by: battleground51 | April 30, 2010 4:44 PM | Report abuse

Career Politicians, Self-Serving Individuals that run under the hospice of the Poor and Needy, and Linda Ronstadt who obviously was sanctified with a bit of "luck" (short lived music success), does not possess the discipline to control her food intake and lives among the privileged rich. In so doing, she has not been privy to conditions "law breakers" have inflected upon the rest of us, and thereby she has no creditability or experience in this area.

Ms. Ronstadt needs to close her boisterous orifice, and go home as she brings embarrassment to herself showing her ignorance.

U.S. representatives need to rally to the helm of Arizona!

Finally, this has everything to do with public health, safety, and the well-being - law loving - United States citizen, and WE COME IN ALL COLORS, SHAPES, SIZES, NATIONALITIES, AND CULTURES!

Posted by: justfacts2 | April 30, 2010 4:45 PM | Report abuse

of all the problems the u.s. faces this is the least important.

how about prosecuting the criminals in big business who have created modt of these issues with their never ending soulless greed?

Posted by: xxxxxx1 | April 30, 2010 4:48 PM | Report abuse

The idea that somehow enforcement of the law should wait on granting rights to lawbreakers is nuts. If we give path to citizenship to 20 million illegals, each will immediately file claims to bring in on average two family members. Remember that family reunification is a sacrosanct (and stupid) feature of our immutable immigration policy. So this is really a permanent movement of 60 million people from Mexico into the US, more than doubling the current Hispanic population that is due to double anyway by natural increase in 20 years or so.

Nobody wants to admit that Democrat Amnesty is a racist project to drive whites into the minority. I have seen the chaos, violence, litter, pollution, and corruption in US Hispanic communities and I don't wan that to be the new norm for American towns and cities. Nor would I wish my children to be driven into a minority with no power of political self-determination. We've already listened to the Chicano activists: they are loud, irrational, selfish, racist, violent, and not very bright. I hope the May Day demonstrations are huge so America can get a good look at their fututre if they do not invoke an immigration moratorium and hermetically seal the Mexican border.

Posted by: greg3 | April 30, 2010 4:52 PM | Report abuse

U.S. Rep James Sensenbrenner (R, WI) started a round-them-up immigration bill in early 2006, that the GOP backed and resulted in millions of Hispanic-Americans voting Democratic in the '06 and '08 election cycles.

So, which party really faces political risk this time? Most Americans want a middle-road documented worker policy, just as most want all Americans covered for health care.

And as with HCR, it will boil out that way and the GOP will be impaled on their standard extremist sword. Bookmark it.

Balkingpoints / www

Posted by: RField7 | April 30, 2010 4:53 PM | Report abuse

illegals are criminals. deport them. obozo and fellow followrs are disgusting in their flip flops to buy votes. this is a key issue that american CITIZENS demand.

Posted by: pofinpa | April 30, 2010 4:54 PM | Report abuse

It is NOT an ILLEGAL IMMIGRATION problem. It is the "Government Stupid" that refused to CLOSE the border in the first place. All for PARTY POLITICS.

The countries that these people come from down SOUTH have nothing to offer. No human rights and are very,very RACIST. The majority of the ILLEGALS are of Indian decent and are third class citizens in their own crap hole countries!!

We do not have a problem from Canada because they have something to offer its citezens!!

This should be more about SECURITY than ILLEGALS. CLOSE the damn border DOWN. Send in the National Guard. Our HIRE and create a new BORDER army. We do Have 15 million AMERICANS un-employed. Alot that are Veterans!!

Tell all the ILLEGALS they have till a certain date to leave the country. Or they will be LOCKED "IN"!!! and will have to pay BACK tax's!!! or a CITEZEN fee kind of like a MANDATORY Health-Care Plan. An annual being in the country ILLEGAL fee!!

Living in Texas from 1971 to 2006 you could see the INVASION take place. Like the cop says in this article people are people. When you add 15 million new faces to a country the percentage goes up that some are EVIL and NO good!! Houston's crime rate exploded also!!

Look at the increase in crime rates in Arizona!!! Mexico is on the verge of anarchy and cracking down. So were does a cornered animal GO anywhere there is an OPENING!!! It just so happens Americas BORDERS have been OPEN for YEARS!!!!

The differance is now some of the ILLEGALS are rabid and not just looking for work anymore but to infect Americans with its drug WARS!!

All you hear about is MORALS. Well the Coyotes and Drug cartels have NONE!!! It is open season in Mexico right now and it is the INNOCENTS that are caught in the cross-fire!! The ILLEGALS are not coming for work anymore but to escape the VIOLENCE!! America has NO work right now!!! So we are being told and the "Government Stupid" is fixed on WALL STREET and Sachs !! Not the Economy!!

So the MORALLY thing to do is to CLOSE the borders. Send troops and drones down to KILL the Kingpins play hardball with the CRAP countries. Hey maybe some TOUGH sanctions like we are going to do with IRAN!! LMAO!!!!

Lets not get caught up on the sideshow this new law, the problem is not the law, ILLEGALS,drugs,coyotes it is the "Government Stupid" and PARTY POLITICS!!

Maybe it is time for the military leaders in this country to do something?????? PARTY POLITICS is FAILING "WE THE PEOPLE" and the ILLEGALS!!!

TERM LIMITS NOW !!

FAIR TAX NOW !!

DEATH TO JIHADIST!!

Posted by: 79USMC83 | April 30, 2010 4:54 PM | Report abuse

Typical Washington Post!

Go to the heartland and ask what they think about amnesty. They'll tell you to enforce the law and deport illegals.

What a concept.

I'll bet the world would not end.

Posted by: jack29 | April 30, 2010 5:01 PM | Report abuse


The WaPoist wrote:

For one thing, Hispanics are an important part of the Democratic coalition.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

But let me get this straight: are these "Hispanics" illegal aliens? If so, it's a crime for them to even try to vote.

If they're not illegal aliens, why does it matter if they are "Hispanics"?

Oh, you're saying that "Hispanics" all vote for total failure of border security, total lack of internal enforcement?

You're saying, more or less, "you cannot get Hispanic votes unless you tolerate an illegal invasion mostly originating in Mexico", right?

IS that what you're saying? Because when you read between the lines, that does seem to be the core meaning of what you're saying.

Posted by: thardman | April 30, 2010 5:01 PM | Report abuse


The WaPoist wrote:

For one thing, Hispanics are an important part of the Democratic coalition.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

But let me get this straight: are these "Hispanics" illegal aliens? If so, it's a crime for them to even try to vote.

If they're not illegal aliens, why does it matter if they are "Hispanics"?

Oh, you're saying that "Hispanics" all vote for total failure of border security, total lack of internal enforcement?

You're saying, more or less, "you cannot get Hispanic votes unless you tolerate an illegal invasion mostly originating in Mexico", right?

IS that what you're saying? Because when you read between the lines, that does seem to be the core meaning of what you're saying.

Posted by: thardman | April 30, 2010 5:05 PM | Report abuse

Ezra, you stupid hack. Until you actually do your research and discover the negative economic and social effects of illegals - shut your pie hole. You stupid progressives want everyone taken care of - only not with your money. You hide behind your tax shelters in your ninth-floor apartment...and are completely uninformed about the reality of anything that involves real, working people.

Until borders are secure and protected - there can be nothing but border enforcement. Chew on that, you liberal, caca-eating fool.

Posted by: joesmithdefend | April 30, 2010 5:05 PM | Report abuse

"Oh, you're saying that "Hispanics" all vote for total failure of border security, total lack of internal enforcement? "

I think that is pretty much true when it applies to their co-ethnics. Of course, there are always a range of views in any community but Hispanic politicians, 95% Democrats, seem to concur that the Mexican-US border should be erased.

Posted by: greg3 | April 30, 2010 5:07 PM | Report abuse

This is all 50 years too late. The AZ law will do nothing but create havoc and a Nazi police state. Society is now on wait, to identify who the first innocent victim of a misguided law will be.

After the Reagan amnesty ,nothing positive was done to secure the borders. His gesture to illegals, resulted in the biggest flood of illegal aliens into our country. The church's and social welfare politicians fed this great illegal migration with our resources and tax money.

Now, we have a disaster with over 12 million illegal aliens living and working in America. Draining our school, hospitals and every government resource in every county, city and state.

The AZ response is just one rifle shot after another, that will do absolutely nothing to sole the problem.

Immigration reform is desperately needed, and without reform this problem will escalate beyond our imaginations.

Posted by: COWENS99 | April 30, 2010 2:31 PM

___________________________________________

Just like a progressive to imminently await an abuse of civil liberty so you can further decry the law you so obviously dislike.

This AZ law simply codifies and enforces Federal immigration laws/statues, and then adds a level of State penalties for violators of said law(s). This law prohibits outright discrimination and protects the civil rights of citizens and legal immigrants by forcing any questioning regarding one's citizenship to come during a Legal Contact, where an individual is contacted under suspicion of or caught in the commission of a crime.

Immigrants into the united States, who are here legally and are not yet citizens, are required to carry their immigration papers with them by Federal Law. This makes the "show me your papers" hysteria seem like a bad joke. You should read the provisions of this law, it would be educational.

I have spoken with and listened to legal citizens of the U.S. who were once Mexican citizens, and descendants of said citizens who are proud to be citizens of this fine country. They see it as unfair if those who came here illegally get a free pass, or amnesty. For those progressives always agitating from a point of "fairness," don't the legal immigrants from countries all over the world have voices too?

But anyhow, I went to the link posted by Ezra and the summary of said law looked fairly decent. I don't agree with Ezra on this issue being a solid knock one way or the other with the "Latino" vote, but this law looks to do the country a service if implemented "as is" without any major changes.

I was amused at the one liner telling States and municipalities they cannot enforce their own laws. It even makes sense, and if immigration law is reformed well, States will have no need to enforce anything beyond the federal codes. A bit of a clip on the chin to AZ, but as I mentioned before, AZ's law essentially codifies and enforces the standing Federal law on the books.

Posted by: OfConservativeMind | April 30, 2010 5:08 PM | Report abuse

There is a story going around in the area I live, California. It goes something like this, California, Utah, Arizona, New Mexico, Colorado, Oregon, Washington State are really part of Mexico. These states don't really belong to the United States but are part of Mexico. It's not yours we the Mexicans own it and we're taking it back. For anyone who knows their history, this is inaccurate. But it seems in my neck of the woods history is being re-written. This is why comprehensive immigration as I've come to understand it, will we be very difficult to implement.

Posted by: morphylius | April 30, 2010 5:09 PM | Report abuse

This is all 50 years too late. The AZ law will do nothing but create havoc and a Nazi police state. Society is now on wait, to identify who the first innocent victim of a misguided law will be.

After the Reagan amnesty ,nothing positive was done to secure the borders. His gesture to illegals, resulted in the biggest flood of illegal aliens into our country. The church's and social welfare politicians fed this great illegal migration with our resources and tax money.

Now, we have a disaster with over 12 million illegal aliens living and working in America. Draining our school, hospitals and every government resource in every county, city and state.

The AZ response is just one rifle shot after another, that will do absolutely nothing to sole the problem.

Immigration reform is desperately needed, and without reform this problem will escalate beyond our imaginations.

Posted by: COWENS99 | April 30, 2010 2:31 PM

___________________________________________

Just like a progressive to imminently await an abuse of civil liberty so you can further decry the law you so obviously dislike.

This AZ law simply codifies and enforces Federal immigration laws/statues, and then adds a level of State penalties for violators of said law(s). This law prohibits outright discrimination and protects the civil rights of citizens and legal immigrants by forcing any questioning regarding one's citizenship to come during a Legal Contact, where an individual is contacted under suspicion of or caught in the commission of a crime.

Immigrants into the united States, who are here legally and are not yet citizens, are required to carry their immigration papers with them by Federal Law. This makes the "show me your papers" hysteria seem like a bad joke. You should read the provisions of this law, it would be educational.

I have spoken with and listened to legal citizens of the U.S. who were once Mexican citizens, and descendants of said citizens who are proud to be citizens of this fine country. They see it as unfair if those who came here illegally get a free pass, or amnesty. For those progressives always agitating from a point of "fairness," don't the legal immigrants from countries all over the world have voices too?

But anyhow, I went to the link posted by Ezra and the summary of said law looked fairly decent. I don't agree with Ezra on this issue being a solid knock one way or the other with the "Latino" vote, but this law looks to do the country a service if implemented "as is" without any major changes.

I was amused at the one liner telling States and municipalities they cannot enforce their own laws. It even makes sense, and if immigration law is reformed well, States will have no need to enforce anything beyond the federal codes. A bit of a clip on the chin to AZ, but as I mentioned before, AZ's law essentially codifies and enforces the standing Federal law on the books.

Posted by: OfConservativeMind | April 30, 2010 5:10 PM | Report abuse

How's this for border enforcement? Only 40,000 crossed in a five-week period at this ONE illegal alien crossing in Arizona:

http://www.borderinvasionpics.com/Invasion.html

Go tell the widows that we just need to give amnesty to everyone. Go tell the orphans...the victims of abductions and deliberate vehicular assaults.

Then come whining to the public with your garbage.

Posted by: joesmithdefend | April 30, 2010 5:11 PM | Report abuse

From the L. A. Times

1. 40% of all workers in L. A. County ( L.A. County has 10.2 million people)are working for cash and not paying taxes. This is because they are predominantly illegal immigrants working without a green card.

2. 95% of warrants for murder in Los Angeles are for illegal aliens.

3. 75% of people on the most wanted list in Los Angeles are illegal aliens.

4. Over 2/3 of all births in Los Angeles County are to illegal alien Mexicans on Medi-Cal, whose births were paid for by taxpayers..

5. Nearly 35% of all inmates in California detention centers are Mexican nationals here illegally.

6. Over 300,000 illegal aliens in Los Angeles County are living in garages.

7. The FBI reports half of all gang members in Los Angeles are most likely illegal aliens from south of the border.

8 Nearly 60% of all occupants of HUD properties are illegal.

9. 21 radio stations in L.A. are Spanish speaking.

10.. In L. A. County 5.1 million people speak English, 3.9 million speak Spanish.

(There are 10.2 million people in L. A. County. )(All 10 of the above facts were published in the Los Angeles Times)

Less than 2% of illegal aliens are picking our crops, but 29% are on welfare.

Over 70% of the United States ' annual population growth(and over 90% of California , Florida , and New York ) results from immigration.

29% of inmates in federal prisons are illegal aliens .

We are fools for letting this continue


P.S. Ezra - contact me and you can send me your next paycheck.

Posted by: joesmithdefend | April 30, 2010 5:15 PM | Report abuse

Many hispanics are conservative and vote Republican because they believe in conservative values. The predominate religion is Catholic which opposes abortion. Do you think you are going to loose thier support because you oppose illegal immigration. The degree to which you are lead by the media reporting the radical La Raza view point is really alarming. Do you think La Raza is popular with conservative hispanics. Do you think conservative hispanics will change thier support based upon your enforcing immigration law. Some I know would hold the door for you while you kicked the interlopers out. There are hispanics in my home City of New Orleans whose families have been here for 400 years they did not just fall off the turnip truck. How about Texas some of those large ranches with all the oil under them, you guessed it hispanics. How about all the doctors, lawyers, politicians, businessmen and women. Can we dismiss this notion that the conservatives need to pander to the issue of immigration to get a significant hispanic vote.

Posted by: almorganiv | April 30, 2010 5:29 PM | Report abuse

.

Hey Democrats,

49 States watch Arizona

BYE BYE

DEMOCRATS

.

Posted by: kstobbe1 | April 30, 2010 5:40 PM | Report abuse

Rasmussen is reporting that 70% of voters not only approve of the Arizona law, but want similar laws enacted nation wide. At the same time, only 25% support any kind of amnesty. These polls echo's those in the U.K.. where a similar wave of national disgust over illegal immigrants (the largest recent weave of them, interestingly enough, from Mexico) looks to not just cost Gordon Brown the Premiership, but cost him his seat and cost the Liberal Party any say in the next government.

There is only one issue at work in elections across the globe --- JOBS. Illegal immigrants take jobs from citizens. They depress wages and benefits. They take (read: steal) money meant and needed for citizens for education, social services, police, fire, public welfare, medical care. Illegals undermine every nation they are permitted in by looting the safety net meant to protect that country's citizens and thereby prevent social unrest. This is why *every* European country actively rounds up illegals and deports them, going so far as to lock them up in prison camps. We should emulate Europe. And, if the Democrat's are so stupid as to take up this issue, along with the disaster they call healthcare "reform", accelerating job outsourcing, an economy in shambles and getting worse (contrary to the "happy news" coming out of Washington -- ' just think it is better and it will be' -- Tim Geithner's new Peter Pan economic principle), it will cost them losses that will threaten the very existence of their party and flat out cripple Obama's ability to lead or even govern.

Posted by: mibrooks27 | April 30, 2010 5:40 PM | Report abuse

Secure the border. Insist on real ID tat is simply checking the person standing before a government agency employee or institution receiving federal aide like welfare offices , DMV, Hospitals and schools and check on computer for social security identity. If Bebe Rabazo is sitting in front of you with Bill Carter's social security number or a dead person's social security number that person should be arrested and deported. Simple dems have blocked this idea for 60 years. They need more voters on the democrat plantation. They keep them warehoused and poor and trot them out on election day only.

Posted by: msmithnv | April 30, 2010 5:41 PM | Report abuse

So let me get this straight....we (this administration) will secure our boarder IF we get our own way...Hmmm let me see...is that called what obstruction of the laws that are on the books??? Is that derelict of duty to protect the people oh never mind we are leagel we do not count....sure makes you want to vote dem doesn't it...

Posted by: Immanurse | April 30, 2010 5:43 PM | Report abuse

The immigration issue shows how really destructive Democrat politics are. Specifically, the Dems believe it to be politically in their favor to encourage wide-scale violation of U.S. sovereignty in the form of illegal immigration,because those engaging in the violation and their supporters will likely vote Democratic. Republicans must avoid calling for a stop to the violations, otherwise they will be branded as racists and the violators won't vote for them. This is completely screwy and topsy-turvy, but sadly the Dems are probably right. Thus, for the sake of one party's political advantage, the nation as a whole must watch and pay the social costs as one class/ethnic group is pretty much given a free pass to break the law on a massive scale. This is very dangerous. What reason is there, then, for anyone to obey any law?

Posted by: liam358 | April 30, 2010 5:44 PM | Report abuse

No one trusts the guvament to do anything about border enforcement and we know how they put on a good face, speak of strict benchmarks and then, when the dust settles, the benchmarks are forgotten and its back to business as usual.

They LIED to us in the eighties and they're LYING again to us now. It doesn't matter whether the Republicans cook it up or the Democrats cook it up - none of them can guarantee consistent enforcement for more than the term of the seated Congress, if then.

What we want is for them to live up to the promises made during the last amnesty program. They can do that if they secure the borders for an EXTENDED period of no less than twenty years. SHOW ME you can do it, then we can do something about a path to citizenship for those who are still here.

Posted by: magellan1 | April 30, 2010 5:47 PM | Report abuse

The Conservative Republican share of a Hispanic population is one third. No matter what is said or done, that's it. The Conservative Republican share of the black population is 5%. It's a group identification thing. When blacks succeed on their own, without accessing quotas or affirmative action, they don't need Jesse Jackson or Barack Obama; they just want low taxes so they can enjoy the fruits of their labor. Same with Latinos. Whites will always vote in the majority for Conservative Republicans because they embody the individualistic impulse of Anglo-Saxons and northern Europeans.

Obama's election is the first time the white majority candidate lost in a presidential election. This should be a wake-up call that we are about to lose control of our political destiny.

Posted by: greg3 | April 30, 2010 5:49 PM | Report abuse

Yes, it's about immigration... and health care (you think we forgot?)... and cap and trade... and VAT... and anything else PBO and the dems step in between now and November.

Posted by: waterfrontproperty | April 30, 2010 5:51 PM | Report abuse

The whole Obama agenda is about one thing: politically annihilate the white middle class and turn them into apathetic tax slaves with no right to voice their social or economic concerns.

Posted by: greg3 | April 30, 2010 5:54 PM | Report abuse

Look at those ridiculous "benchmarks". Nothing pertaining to RESULTS, only more RESOURCES devoted to the problem, what kind of "benchmark" is that?

Typical Democratic "problem solving" - throw money at the problem and then throw more money at the problem and then throw even more money at the problem.

SECURE THE BORDERS - NUMBNUTS! Then we'll talk.

Posted by: magellan1 | April 30, 2010 5:55 PM | Report abuse

"The (AZ) Department of Education has told school districts that teachers with accents must not be allowed to teach English to students with limited English skills. . . . state education officials want to make sure that students learning English learn it from teachers who speak it 'flawlessly.'"

So, are all of these dittoheads who support the Arizona ethnic cleaning bill going to be excluded, too? Half the GOP, from George W. Bush to Sarah Palin, as well as their supporters, can't speak English properly. I'm not even sure what their "native" language is. It's not English. Oh, yea, I want somebody who speaks like J.D. Hayworth to teach in the schools. Why don't we just hire Randy Quaid after five shots of tequila?

What the heck is a "native Arizonan" anyway? Does that mean that all of these lily-white wingnuts, the one's who've arrived AFTER the invention of airconditioning, are going to be excluded, too? Why not have a bill that says that only those who are genuinely native to Arizona, such as the Hopi, Paiute, Maricopa, Mohave, Navajo and Yaqui peoples should be allowed to vote or hold elective office in Arizona? I'd like to see the ID's of the baggers and wingnuts. After all, these anger management dropouts are a bunch of johnny-come-lately interlopers who should go back to wherever they came from: Mississippi? Alabama? Oklahoma?

Posted by: osullivanc1 | April 30, 2010 6:07 PM | Report abuse

All I know is I am not going to be happy if the cost to get my lawn mowed doubles. Politicians take note.

Posted by: shocked-n-saddened | April 30, 2010 6:17 PM | Report abuse

Lets see, as I read this, here is the compromise.

1. At least 15 million trespassers will be issued citizenship, social security cards, access to the new health care system and all other welfare assistance and will gain the ability to sponsor relatives to enter the country.

2. In exchange, Janet Napolitano agrees to do her job -- sort of.

What's not to like!

Well, maybe because giving Homeland Security a bigger budget for more laser toys is not the same as promising to CLOSE THE BORDER. Also, how about a cap on the number of illegals that will actually get to stay. Say 40 million. Anything more than that may be excessive.

Posted by: FutureView2010 | April 30, 2010 6:20 PM | Report abuse

Does this make the 2010 election about the rule of law and how the Democratic party opposes it?

Posted by: edbyronadams | April 30, 2010 6:22 PM | Report abuse

You may not have noticed, but Arizona is already amending its new immigration law to modify what for many people was the main problem with the law: the fact that a cop could ask anyone for identification (which raises constitutional issues if that person is a U.S. citizen).

The new language in House Bill 2162 is: "B. For any lawful [delete 'contact'] STOP, DETENTION OR ARREST made by a law enforcement official or a law enforcement agency of this state ...."

State Senator Pearce and Gov. Brewer apparently suggested and support this change; which is still working its way through the legislative process.

See www.azstarnet.com for more details.

Posted by: ad9inaz | April 30, 2010 6:27 PM | Report abuse

Immingration is a tough and complicated issue but the majority of citizens have figured out that the key to solving the problem long term starts and ends with absolutely securint our borders. Any plan which either subordinates that objective or which tries to make it a conditional part of a plan is doomed to failure. Since what we have now (15 million illegals here and their supporters lobbying for amnesty and an easy path to citizenship) is a result of lax (non-existent?) border security, citizens are not going to buy any program which does not seal off the borders for the next 15 million.

Is that so hard to understand?

Posted by: bobfbell | April 30, 2010 6:31 PM | Report abuse

Immingration is a tough and complicated issue but the majority of citizens have figured out that the key to solving the problem long term starts and ends with absolutely securint our borders. Any plan which either subordinates that objective or which tries to make it a conditional part of a plan is doomed to failure. Since what we have now (15 million illegals here and their supporters lobbying for amnesty and an easy path to citizenship) is a result of lax (non-existent?) border security, citizens are not going to buy any program which does not seal off the borders for the next 15 million.

Is that so hard to understand?

Posted by: bobfbell | April 30, 2010 6:31 PM | Report abuse

Good old Harry really needs the votes so this is not so much a legitimate proposal as it is pandering to the Hispanics. A real proposal would have included the complete closure of the border. Of course that would anger the Hispanic activists and he would be in even worse shape.

Harry, I'm afraid you are a beyond help.

Posted by: FutureView2010 | April 30, 2010 6:46 PM | Report abuse

Perhaps the best solution is first to implement strict border control and prove by benchmarks (measured each year) that it's effective. Then, upon two straight years of effective control, address the illegals here. In the meantime, establish a verifiable way employers can identify and hire only legal residents and establish major penalties if they do not comply with employment laws regarding residency.
Most illegals have had to violate laws repeatedly, so a path to citizenship should be ruled out. Instead, require that anyone who wants to stay register with the US government and give certain facts about themselves. Then regularize as permanent resident aliens everyone who 1) came illegally at 12 or older; 2) did not return after a deportation;3) has no felonies and no more than two misdemeanors; 4) pays a *substantial* fine (say $5000) to be divided between US, state and city governments; 5) passes a standardized curriculum of English language and American history and civics courses within three years. Make them immediately deportable if they give false information, commit certain crimes, knowingly protect or live with unregularized illegals, etc. And forbid them to bring in any family members.
Any illegal who doesn't register is immediately deportable, except people who were brought as children under 12. Only they can be on a path to citizenship.

Posted by: mipost1 | April 30, 2010 6:55 PM | Report abuse

............"AGAIN!!!"


This is NOT about Immigration, THIS is about "ILLEGAL FELON IMMIGRATION" !!!

Just call IT what it IS !!!

It's the Invasion of the U.S. by ILLEGAL FELON IMMIGRANTS that are NOW demanding that THEIR Illegality be Legalized !!!

The Fed. Govt. is at fault for having allowed this problem to become so large and the Congress and O'BlahBlah are going to WhiteWash the real problem with a series of half hearted measures that do NOT prevent the problem from occurring AGAIN in the future !!!

Blanket Amnesty DIDN'T work when Carter did it, it did NOT work when Reagan did it, AND it did NOT work when Clinton did it !!!

THIS will just give more POWER to the Fed. Govt. to control another level of the lives of the Citizens of the U.S. !!!

Posted by: thgirbla | April 30, 2010 6:57 PM | Report abuse


Illegal immigration has always been strictly about cheap labor, and now it is also about getting a vote. Nobody really gives a damb about the inhumanitarian and immoral aspect of this.

Posted by: maphound | April 30, 2010 7:05 PM | Report abuse

............."AGAIN!!!"

WE don't need more Laws, WE just need the Fed. Govt. to enforce the currentl Immigration Laws that exist !!!

The current problem exists because the Fed. Govt. has either refused or denied that this is THEIR responsibility !!!

I believe that both apply !!!

Posted by: thgirbla | April 30, 2010 7:19 PM | Report abuse

I think we should adopt mexico immigration law to be fair....

“Authorities, whether federal, state or municipal ... are required to demand that foreigners prove their legal presence in the country, before attending to any issues.”

Guess whose law that is? It’s not Arizona’s. It’s Mexico’s Population Law Article 67 and it certainly reads like a “where are your papers” law.


http://phoenix.bizjournals.com/phoenix/blog/business/2010/04/mexicos_immigration_law_far_tougher.html

Posted by: billisnice | April 30, 2010 7:24 PM | Report abuse

"The Republican game plan is simple: Postpone immigration reform until the next Congress. By then, the Dems will have lost approximately five Senate seats and a number of House seats to hardline, enforcement only Republicans and immigration reform will be dead until after 2012.
If Obama does not fulfill his promise to the Latinos, he will be unelectable in 2012, because the Latinos will not support Obama for re-election and the Republicans will win the Presidency."

I agree with the following ideas. The Republican Party will then have Jeb Bush declare he is running in 2012 for president with Marko Rubio his running mate! And the Bush Empire will distroy America!


Posted by: lunetrick | April 30, 2010 7:27 PM | Report abuse

I don't want to hear about any new Immigration laws until it can be confirmed that two things are done:

1. Close the border - and this can be done as it has been done in the past.

2. Enforce the existing laws, in particular the employee sanctions for hiring illegals.

Posted by: Andrea_KC | April 30, 2010 7:36 PM | Report abuse

NO COMPROMISES.

NO AMNESTY.

Just do your damn jobs!

Secure our borders and enforce our existing immigrations laws.

Punish sanctuary cities for interfering with those laws.

Period.

End of sentence.

End of discussion.

Posted by: anna_78750 | April 30, 2010 7:38 PM | Report abuse


Check your dictionaries, folks.

This electoin isn't about "immigration".

This election will be about nothing at all but, at long last, fighting against INVASION.

Posted by: thardman | April 30, 2010 7:41 PM | Report abuse

When you're "leaderless in America", it's no surprise the President reversed himself again about immigration reform. Because he doesn't know how to lead, he usually "feels strongly both ways" on most issues. Trying to appease all, he appeases nobody. Making everything a #1 priority means he has none. Yes, my dem lib friends, you've been hoodwinked by the smooth talker, no "decider" CIC....enjoy being "leaderless in America."

Posted by: powerange | April 30, 2010 7:59 PM | Report abuse

LAUGHABLY RIDICULOUS

Uh, kid .. you forgot ..

GWB tried AMNESTY ..

was nearly DECAPITATED ..

Kid, you really need to read history .. would make you seem smarter .. and less ignorant ..

Posted by: russpoter | April 30, 2010 8:01 PM | Report abuse

It's not about the Supreme Court or next year. This is about 2010 and the Republicans will use this to get out the base - angry old pot-bellied white men and their rather large wives. This will do good for Republicans this year but will not do them in the long run (2012).

Hate, exclusion, anger, racism, moral inconsistencies, and of course death (they are old, white, and overweight) will harm the Republicans in the long run, and they know it. Right now and only now, because of the economy, they are poised to take at least the House. People who would NEVER consider voting for these vile cretins are holding their nose and voting because of the inability of the Democrat Party to get control of the message.

This will not last long. They have a short time to assume the mantle, but the sun is setting and they know it. 2010 to 2012, these creatures must try and legislate as opposed to hurling racial epitaphs or innuendos. What then? Perhaps a national Arizona?

Posted by: mjcc1987 | April 30, 2010 8:04 PM | Report abuse

"Restrictionists get increased border security, reformers get a path to legalization. And the compromise is in that order, too: The legalization path doesn't kick in until eight separate security benchmarks are met (head here for an excellent summary)."

This is exactly what we did in 1986 and it didn't work. As soon as the amnesty was passed all the security went by the wayside.

And after the amnesty comes chain migration.

Don't get suckered into it again.

Posted by: hipshot | April 30, 2010 8:07 PM | Report abuse

LOL.

Man, you MSM types sure are gullible.

It will still be about the positive growth in both jobs and GDP under our wise President and the anti-American actions of the Republic Party of No, not to mention a last minute flare up when some GOP Senator is caught encouraging US firms to export US jobs overseas to China.

Your goose is still cooked, Republicants.

Posted by: WillSeattle | April 30, 2010 8:13 PM | Report abuse

By the way, when are you going to admit that Sen. Lindsay Graham (R-SC) is actually gay?

We're waiting.

Posted by: WillSeattle | April 30, 2010 8:14 PM | Report abuse

By the way, when are you going to admit that Sen. Lindsay Graham (R-SC) is actually gay?

We're waiting.

Posted by: WillSeattle | April 30, 2010 8:14 PM | Report abuse

--------------------------------------

One of those Liberals trying to get in everyone's bedroom?

Probably very little going on in yours I suspect.
.

Posted by: hz9604 | April 30, 2010 8:27 PM | Report abuse

A sheriff's deputy was gunned down a few minutes ago in Arizona by an AK-47 wielding illegal alien. So it's getting close to us to begin shooting back.

Posted by: hared | April 30, 2010 8:44 PM | Report abuse

Gordon Brown of the Labor party was caught calling someone who asked him a question about immigration a bigot. It looks like the ruling Labor party will not only lose the election, but will come in third in a three horse raid. There is a lesson in here for American politicians. If they are as out of touch with ordinary hard working Americans on immigration, they may well find that voters will vote them out of office. In these circumstances, it will be interesting to see how politicians deal with immigration in an election. Since I believe most politicians are cowards, I suspect that they will put immigration off until sometime way in the future. They know there are far more people in this category than Hispanics. This is something that Mr. Klein does not seemingly comprehend.

Posted by: jeffreed | April 30, 2010 8:57 PM | Report abuse

In a nutshell:

The Economic prosperity America enjoyed lured workers to our land from the day we became a nation. Bigots, for Centuries have tried to keep our country “pure” (whatever that means) and persistently came up with campaigns designed to push their “ideologies” forward. One of their strategies called for demonizing workers who were doing jobs no American wanted to do. When this “strategy” to demonize workers did not materialized, these bigots imposed Economic burdens (Enron, gas prices, Financial industry misdeeds, including Goldman Sachs Group), depleting Americans from their assets, weakening them, making it easier to push their agenda for a “pure America”.
Apparently, the unlawful economic ills imposed upon the American public did the trick. Though NO American will ever be caught picking strawberries in a field, the bigots have managed to call attention to this non issue, stressing that “this undocumented workers are taking your jobs”, while covering up their vast illegal profits.

When America prospered, NO ONE ever brought up the issue of undocumented workers. By addressing the illicit economic calamities that engulfed our nation, identifying the villains and bringing them to justice, the issue of undocumented workers can easily be dealt with, and, with an open unrestrained clear mind.

Any resemblance between bigots and the Republican Party is purely coincidental.

Posted by: Shanan1 | April 30, 2010 9:09 PM | Report abuse

wow, lots of crazies hanging out in this thread.

know what i worry about? becoming an aging country. for example, california will for the first time have more in-state persons than out-of-staters this year. we are no longer a young country, and as we age i'm afraid we're just going to get more reactionary instead of more open.

yes, opening up the borders is not a good idea. but immigration itself definitely is. we don't want to be japan -- creeping along at a sucky growth rate because they got no immigration and the young people w/ their new businesses that come along w/ it. this is about ensuring economic vitality at a critical time in our history as much as it's about "the illegals."

that said, the whole "illegals" wording is a red herring. for much of our history, immigration was place-based. if you touched land, you got some rights to contest deportation and whatnot. now, whether you're an immigrant to the us is solely "law-based." if you didn't go through the processes, you aren't "really" here and don't enjoy our rights and protections. that shift in conception is bigger than people think. constantly thinking of immigration as "people who broke the law" ignores the critique of whether that law should be changed. it's circular, but the right can't see that for some reason.

Posted by: Chris_ | April 30, 2010 9:41 PM | Report abuse

"Like it or not immigration reform is coming". Really, Ezra? So, no matter what our laws are, and no matter what Americans want, it just doesn't matter. It's all about what politicians and their special interests want, right Ezra.

Posted by: allamer1 | April 30, 2010 9:42 PM | Report abuse

Dear President Obama:

I'm planning to move my family and extended family into Mexico for my health, and I would like to ask you to assist me.

We're planning to simply walk across the border from the U.S. Into Mexico, and we'll need your help to make a few arrangements.

We plan to skip all the legal stuff like passports,immigration quotas and laws.

I'm sure they handle those things the same way you do here. So, would you mind telling your buddy, President Calderon, that I'm on my way over?

Please let him know that I will be expecting the following:

1. Free medical care for my entire family.

2. English-speaking government bureaucrats for all services I might need, whether I use them or not.

3. Please print all Mexican government forms in English.

4. I want my grandkids to be taught Spanish by English-speaking(bi-lingual) teachers.

5. Tell their schools they need to include classes on American culture and history.

6. I want my grandkids to see the American flag on one of the flag poles at their school.

7. Please plan to feed my grandkids at school for both breakfast and lunch.

8. I will need a local Mexican driver's license so I can get easy access to government services.

9. I do plan to get a car and drive in Mexico , but, I don't plan to purchase car insurance, and I probably won't make any special effort to learn local traffic laws.

10. In case one of the Mexican police officers does not get the memo from
the president to leave me alone, please be sure that every patrol car has
at least one English-speaking officer.

11. I plan to fly the U.S. Flag from my house top, put U S. Flag decals on
my car, and have a gigantic celebration on July 4th. I do not want any
complaints or negative comments from the locals.

12. I would also like to have a nice job without paying any taxes, or have
any labor or tax laws enforced on any business I may start.

13. Please have the president tell all the Mexican people to be extremely nice and never say critical things about me or my family, or about the strain we might place on their economy.

14. I want to receive free food stamps.

15. Naturally, I'll expect free rent subsidies.

16. I'll need Income tax credits so although I don't pay Mexican Taxes, I'll receive money from the government.

17. Please arrange it so that the Mexican Gov't pays $4,500 to help me buy
a new car.

18. Oh yes, I almost forgot, please enroll me free into the Mexican Social Security program so that I'll get a monthly income in retirement. I know this is an easy request because you already do all these things for all his people who walk over to the U..S. From Mexico . I am sure that President Calderon won't mind returning the favor if you ask him nicely.

Thank you so much for your kind help. *You're the man!!!*

Posted by: NO-bama | April 30, 2010 9:50 PM | Report abuse

Mr. Obama and the democrats are politically dead in the water on passing any real immigration reform that will contain anything but their double talk, smoke and mirror act their so good at. They need the hispanic and latino votes so desperately to win an election that they are willing to ignore Arizona police officers and citizens murdered at the hands of illegal aliens, breaking US laws, while they look the other way for votes. What is worst, they then, in a disagreeable statement, DEMONIZE the Arizona law instead of offering any assistant, constructive suggestions, legal or financial aid that might help the border situation. Great leadership Washington, don't do your job then bad mouth State elected officials, in National media outlets, when those officials make honest attempts to save additional lives. Fact is, they only care about Americans that can swing an elections for them and sway elections results in their parties favor. The rest of us, we're dirt. Profiling is worst than MURDER? Just how many lives MR. OBAMA, is a vote worth these days? I am not sure if you understand your duties to SUPPORT US laws.

Posted by: dsperry2 | April 30, 2010 10:06 PM | Report abuse

mjcc1987 is an example of how the Chicano rights movement thinks. Young white people are invisible to them because only old whites hold out in places where Hispanics have ruined the quality of life, turning schools into special education centers for juvenile delinquents, parks into dumping grounds, strip malls into shooting galleries, and hospitals into MASH units and 3rd world maternity wards. Young whites are out there in America, they just don't want to raise their kids alongside the Mexican underclass.

Posted by: greg3 | April 30, 2010 10:11 PM | Report abuse

The Josepg Goebbels propaganda machine in AZ did a great job.

Posted by: juke2 | April 30, 2010 10:16 PM | Report abuse

I need to clear up this prevailing lie that most illegal aliens are just hard working people trying to support their families and its only a handful who commit crimes. They pretty much all commit crimes, especially burglaries and holdups, when they can't find work or their wages aren't meeting their needs.

Think about it -- they gotta eat and pay their rent right, and you don't see them sleeping on the street with the homeless. Every once in a while an illegal in CA tangles with some guy with a conceal carry permit and ends up on a slab; inevitably the local TV station interviews the wailing father who swears his son is a good boy who works hard for some roofing or dry walling company.

Their day jobs are good opportunities to case neighbors for easy victims.

Posted by: greg3 | April 30, 2010 10:35 PM | Report abuse

Someone wrote:

"that said, the whole "illegals" wording is a red herring. for much of our history, immigration was place-based. if you touched land, you got some rights to contest deportation and whatnot. now, whether you're an immigrant to the us is solely "law-based." if you didn't go through the processes, you aren't "really" here and don't enjoy our rights and protections. that shift in conception is bigger than people think. constantly thinking of immigration as "people who broke the law" ignores the critique of whether that law should be changed. it's circular, but the right can't see that for some reason."

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Isn't insanity so often refreshing and pleasant in its complete dissociation from reality?

This guy makes me smile, he's so "out there".

Simply stated, the US is full, it's like a lifeboat that's full, illegal aliens are like people trying to get in from the ocean which will swamp the lifeboat and kill everyone.

The people supporting the illegals are like people who are in the lifeboat, throwing out people who also are already in the lifeboat, because they don't care about anything -- not even about swamping the lifeboat -- other than getting their relatives out of the ocean and into the lifeboat.

If you're not their relative, they'll cheerfully throw you to the sharks, even if they know you are a doctor and their relative is a murderer.

Yay. That's what this election will be about: people who prefer a murderer of their own race, to a doctor of another race.

Lots of insanity going around these days, eh, folks?

Posted by: thardman | April 30, 2010 10:53 PM | Report abuse

Somebody here said "Undocumented worker from Mexico actually help us, as they dont claim what they paid in taxes. And because of them, we get our produce etc at the current prices, and if they are not there, then it would much more expensive.
I think Americans are ready to pay more money, if that ensures jobs here, and not taken by illegals.
And if his logic is to be really applied, then why not get 50 million more from some 3rd world country, who can get us our dozen oranges for 20 cents.
Be realistic and get the Immigration reform done very soon to protect our borders.

Posted by: chanakyacha | April 30, 2010 11:04 PM | Report abuse

Immigration reform? ... it all depends on what one's idea of reform is. If giving amnesty to millions of illegals is one's idea of reform, then, yes, Obama will probably try to pass Immigration reform. But if you think reform is creating border security, deporting all illegals and requiring them to go through the same channels that all other immigrants have to go through to migrate to this country, then "reform" is not in the cards for this administration.

Posted by: Freethinker4 | May 1, 2010 12:53 AM | Report abuse

Why is Ezra Klein paying so much attention to the Graham Cracker from SC? Most Republicans hate him and call him a RINO. He is all in favor of cap-and-trade. Appointing a commission on immigration is the best way to insure nothing will happen.

Richard Nixon appointed a commission on drugs of bi-partisan scholars to recommend what to do. The commission recommended to de-criminalize marijuana. What did Tricky Dicky do? He declared a war on drugs and started the DEA. That was over 40 years ago. We have wasted over a trillion dollars on the war on drugs and created a huge problem in both Mexico and the US. Colombia was nearly destroyed and we went to war against Panama.

Most of the "crime" committed by Mexicans in the US is drug related. The real crime is our drug laws. Most of the violence associated with Mexicans is drug related. The drug cartels in Mexico have taken over one third of the farm land in Mexico to grow marijuana, opium poppies and to crank out more crank of meth-amphetamines.

Where do the Mexicans go when they get kicked off their farmland? Bingo! They come to the USA. You can't separate the two issues - the war on drugs and immigration.

These two issues need to be addressed at the same time by the same congress people. It has nothing to do with E-Verify or sanctions against employers in the US. It has everything to do with all your friends, neighbors and children who use drugs.

The war on drugs have made bogeymen out of the Mexican population by the ranting talking-heads on FoxNews and talk radio.

Posted by: alance | May 1, 2010 9:01 AM | Report abuse

"In a nutshell:" Shanan1

Posted by: greg3 | May 1, 2010 9:20 AM | Report abuse

As a long-timme registered Independent, I usually find myself more in the camp of the Democratic Party. However, not on this issue of rewarding those who have deliberately broken our laws of immigration.

So - a quandary. Not liking most of the conservative programs of the candidates in AZ, where I have lived for a couple of years, but approving of their stance on immigration - what to do? This is going to take some research on the various candidates and their platforms, but I am sure not going to vote for someone who is promoting amnesty for lawbreakers.

I think there might be many Independents like me who face the same problem. Anyone have an answer?

Posted by: Utahreb | May 1, 2010 10:15 AM | Report abuse

What a lot of politicians do not grasp is there is a duality in views about the immigration and border issue down here in Arizona. First, we want a much better security environment at the border because of the drug cartel activities here. More Foreward Observation Bases for example. Second, we ALSO want comprehensive immigration reform that allows Guest Worker Visas and a fair resolution for the 12 million illegal entrants already in the country. the SB 1070 fuss is equivalent to one our famous dust torms...diminishing visibility of the real iussues and where most of us are really at. Folks need to remember that in the southern part of the state the border moved over its Hispanic residents and not the other way around. There are many Hispanic families here who lived here BEFORE this was even part of the United States.

Posted by: hughholub | May 1, 2010 10:51 AM | Report abuse

The old, Anglo fat cats in Sedona, Arizona kick back in an alcoholic haze and froth at the mouth after listening to Rush, Sean Hannity, Glen Beck, etc.

They tell each other we've got to do something about them drugs and those awful Mexicans. Sheeet, we've got to pass a law and kick those riff-raff back across the border.

The ones who own the big-agri-biz farms just keep silent and refill the drinks for their friends who keep on ranting.

Posted by: alance | May 1, 2010 11:24 AM | Report abuse

Since triple-fences were installed between California and Mexico, it is difficult for the drug runners to enter the U.S. unless they move down the border to Arizona. This has become the major drug route for the Mexican drug cartel. Some of the people in the U.S.seem mighty upset at having these runners stopped by the new Arizona law. We can watch carefully as they yell aliens have "civil rights" which is the cover.

Posted by: drzimmern1 | May 1, 2010 12:44 PM | Report abuse

I have tried to submit comments, only to have them stopped. Too much time has elapsed since my last comment for it to be "too soon". You are censoring me deliberately. I am recording all of this and will make a formal complaint.

Posted by: drzimmern1 | May 1, 2010 12:46 PM | Report abuse

Democrat leadership, all liberals, will pander for a few months and block any legislation that may have a chance of passing. Same as House leadership did with the DC voting privileges act. Claim the issue, obstruct legislative consensus, and blame the other party. Will America fall for it?

Posted by: cprferry | May 1, 2010 2:47 PM | Report abuse

"Looks like the more people hear about it the more they like it. Look for this to be replicated across the country.
Posted by: obrier2"

Isn't already? Loudoun County and other northern Virginia counties have similar laws. In fact, the NoVa laws are harsher. Rather than a misdemeanor (up to $500 or 6 months) as under the Arizona law, the NoVa laws hand criminal suspects of legally questionable residency status over to ICE for presumably deportation.

Posted by: cprferry | May 1, 2010 3:02 PM | Report abuse

You may not have noticed, but Arizona is already amending its new immigration law to modify what for many people was the main problem with the law: the fact that a cop could ask anyone for identification (which raises constitutional issues if that person is a U.S. citizen).

The new language in House Bill 2162 is: "B. For any lawful [delete 'contact'] STOP, DETENTION OR ARREST made by a law enforcement official or a law enforcement agency of this state ...."

State Senator Pearce and Gov. Brewer apparently suggested and support this change; which is still working its way through the legislative process.

See www.azstarnet.com for more details.

Posted by: ad9inaz | April 30, 2010 6:27 PM
___________________________________________

Good eye. This will definitely clarify the law even further to prevent possible civil rights problems.

http://azstarnet.com/news/pdf_64720634-4e56-11df-9876-001cc4c03286.html

This is the page for the revised law. I disagree with the statement in your first paragraph, that poses some Constitutional violation when an officer asks someone to show said officer their identification.

During a traffic stop, does the officer not ask you for your license and registration? If you are suspected of, or caught in the act of, committing a crime and an officer asks you for your identification, you are required to provide it so the officer may ascertain your identity.

Legal immigrants in this country are required by federal law to carry their documentation in public until they are full citizens, and this law doesn't require them to do any more than that.

Posted by: OfConservativeMind | May 2, 2010 1:02 AM | Report abuse

What a lot of politicians do not grasp is there is a duality in views about the immigration and border issue down here in Arizona. First, we want a much better security environment at the border because of the drug cartel activities here. More Foreward Observation Bases for example. Second, we ALSO want comprehensive immigration reform that allows Guest Worker Visas and a fair resolution for the 12 million illegal entrants already in the country. the SB 1070 fuss is equivalent to one our famous dust storms...diminishing visibility of the real issues and where most of us are really at. Folks need to remember that in the southern part of the state the border moved over its Hispanic residents and not the other way around. There are many Hispanic families here who lived here BEFORE this was even part of the United States.

Posted by: hughholub | May 1, 2010 10:51 AM
___________________________________________

Ok, so here's the problem: If they've been there since the Mexican/American war, and they dislike or even hate U.S. sovereignty of the land on which they live, why don't they apply for Mexican citizenship and move across the border?

IMO, it's simple. America simply offers more opportunities to provide wealth for its citizens(When they aren't being heavily taxed to subsidize a government-dependent underclass). Mexico's government is largely corrupt, and they would love nothing more than to foist a much poorer base of Mexican citizens onto our country.

Your "duality" statement acknowledges that there are individuals living in States under U.S. sovereignty that view certain tracts of land as not being legitimately under U.S. control. Many of these individuals are illegally present Mexican nationals as well as other illegally present nationals who do not want to assimilate into American society, much less learn English and celebrate American tradition.

This type of behavior is reprehensible and offensive to my sensibilities as an American citizen, and I believe that the illegal nationals should be removed from our country.

Certain groups like the SEIU public labor union and LaRaza would love nothing more than to see many illegally present nationals gain citizenship, one way or another, preferably through an immediate amnesty. This would do nothing but give a nod to those individuals who have criminally trespassed into our country without legitimately attaining citizenship, many of whom have been here for the better part of a decade.

Posted by: OfConservativeMind | May 2, 2010 1:28 AM | Report abuse

"Legal immigrants in this country are required by federal law to carry their documentation in public until they are full citizens, and this law doesn't require them to do any more than that."

True enough. But federal law also provides that there must be probable cause and an arrest warrant before there is an arrest by a federal agent for any immigration violation. Arizona law now compels a warrantless arrest of any person upon an officer's mere suspicion of an immigration violation, unless that person is able to immediately produce proper documents to dispel that suspicion.

The Constitution provides the federal government with plenary powers to make law with respect to immigration. With these mandatory warrantless arrests, Arizona blatantly violates the supremacy clause of the US Constitution.

Arizona SB 1070 will prove to be DOA in the courts.

Posted by: Patrick_M | May 3, 2010 12:03 AM | Report abuse

Let me see if I got this right...

· IF YOU CROSS THE NORTH KOREAN BORDER ILLEGALLY YOU GET 12 YEARS HARD LABOR.

· IF YOU CROSS THE IRANIAN BORDER ILLEGALLY YOU ARE DETAINED INDEFINITELY.

· IF YOU CROSS THE AFGHAN BORDER ILLEGALLY, YOU GET SHOT.

· IF YOU CROSS THE SAUDI ARABIAN BORDER ILLEGALLY YOU WILL BE JAILED.

· IF YOU CROSS THE CHINESE BORDER ILLEGALLY YOU MAY NEVER BE HEARD FROM AGAIN.

· IF YOU CROSS THE VENEZUELAN BORDER ILLEGALLY YOU WILL BE BRANDED A SPY AND YOUR FATE WILL BE SEALED.

· IF YOU CROSS THE CUBAN BORDER ILLEGALLY YOU WILL BE THROWN INTO POLITICAL PRISON TO ROT.

· IF YOU CROSS THE U.S. BORDER ILLEGALLY YOU GET .....

1 - A JOB

2 - A DRIVERS LICENSE
3 - SOCIAL SECURITY CARD
4 - WELFARE
5 - FOOD STAMPS
6 - CREDIT CARDS
7 - SUBSIDIZED RENT OR A LOAN TO BUY A HOUSE
8 - FREE EDUCATION
9 - FREE HEALTH CARE
10 - A LOBBYIST IN WASHINGTON ,
11 - BILLIONS OF DOLLARS WORTH OF PUBLIC DOCUMENTS PRINTED IN YOUR LANGUAGE
12 - AND THE RIGHT TO CARRY YOUR COUNTRY'S FLAG WHILE YOU PROTEST THAT YOU DON'T GET ENOUGH RESPECT

I JUST WANTED TO MAKE SURE

I HAD A FIRM GRASP ON THE SITUATION...


Posted by: PaulRevere4 | May 6, 2010 10:47 AM | Report abuse

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