Network News

X My Profile
View More Activity

Shooting it while it's down

Cap-and-trade has been dead for months, but that didn't stop West Virginia governor (and Senate candidate) Joe Manchin from shooting it -- yes, with a gun -- in his latest ad:

In case you were wondering, Manchin is the Democrat in the race.

By Ezra Klein  | October 11, 2010; 10:42 AM ET
 
Save & Share:  Send E-mail   Facebook   Twitter   Digg   Yahoo Buzz   Del.icio.us   StumbleUpon   Technorati   Google Buzz   Previous: How to raise revenues without raising taxes
Next: Column: An ugly word for an ugly economy

Comments

"In case you were wondering, Manchin is the Democrat in the race."

Awesome! That's great. For us radical right wingers, this couldn't be a much better election cycle. While I'd personally like fewer O'Donnells and more Buckleys and Reagans, a conservative has to be pretty stoked when the choice is between a conservative Democrat and and even more conservative Republican in many of the races.

3 Cheers for Joe Machin!

Posted by: Kevin_Willis | October 11, 2010 10:47 AM | Report abuse

"3 Cheers for Joe Manchin!"


i understand that maybe you are cheerful about the election cycle. that is understandable.
but i dont agree that it is a good thing for guns and gun referencing to be used in the manner that they are now.
to take dead aim at things you dont like, with a gun, is not a good message for children.
sarah palin set her targets, that were living people in government, in the crosshairs....now this.
militia people appear with guns in parks where children are walking and watching.
this is not a good thing.
years ago, when people lived undefended in cabins at the edges of forests, guns were commonplace for finding food and for defending oneself.
that is no longer what our culture is about.
and for hunters that see gunshooting as a sport...
using a gun to shoot the ideas of people down, or using the image of crosshairs on human beings you disagree with, is not a good thing.
why would you call that awesome or great?
i understand, again, that you are happy with the election cycle, but if you are involved with children in your life, where do you draw the line.
this is contributing to the craziness in our society. and you dont need a research study on violence to prove it.
use common sense.
there may be a place for guns....
but not used in this way.
this commercial is awful.

Posted by: jkaren | October 11, 2010 11:28 AM | Report abuse

i dont think the national rifle association should endorse that commercial. it should not be at its essence, that the message of this commercial, is compatible with their philosophy.
you dont use guns or the threat of violence to shoot down ideas or people.
the national rifle association should be speaking out against this commercial, not endorsing it.
everything seems to be upside down and backwards lately.
:-(

Posted by: jkaren | October 11, 2010 11:33 AM | Report abuse

@jkaren: "but i dont agree that it is a good thing for guns and gun referencing to be used in the manner that they are now.
to take dead aim at things you dont like, with a gun, is not a good message for children."

Fair enough. I'm cheering in the abstract, based on Ezra's description (I can't see the commercial). Though I don't object to the use of guns in commercials (actually, I love it in political commercials), but--to each their own. In the real world, I'm dubious about the value of gun ownership, and, myself, I don't own any kind of gun. And had the opportunity to inherit a couple of nice guns, but just had no interest.

However, entertainment is another thing. Gimme a BFG in a video game, and set me free to mow down mutants, and I'm a happy camper.

But, I like the idea of a conservative Democrat beating up on cap-and-trade of all things.

Posted by: Kevin_Willis | October 11, 2010 12:43 PM | Report abuse

I need a better political party.

Posted by: PorkBelly | October 11, 2010 1:11 PM | Report abuse

"However, entertainment is another thing. Gimme a BFG in a video game, and set me free to mow down mutants, and I'm a happy camper."

as a separate issue, what do you think of young people, playing a game like "modern warfare, call of duty?"
do you think it is appropriate for kids that are young pre-teens, having access to a game like that?
just curious about your thinking on this....as it seems to be popular, and i find that game is bloodcurdling.
and then we wonder why kids arent doing well in school.
a while back, there was a cartoon-type article here, on how young people's thinking processes become rewired with digital learning. i just wonder what a game like that, does to the thinking and rewiring and sensibilities of a young person, when they play it a great deal. how do they start to see the "real world?"
and i cant help but wonder if the lines of reality and fantasy and normality dont become blurred.
..when you see supposedly" respectable" people who govern and influence, like palin or manchin or beck...really stretch the boundaries of what is acceptable, kind.
what does all of this teach about the sacredness of life?
of human beings?
it teaches nothing, nothing, nothing good or redeeming.

i know that kids play many violent games, but that video game is really shocking. i watch kids play it. they are not my own children, so i cannot say anything....but when i see the blood splatter on the screen, and there is cheering to such extreme graphic violence, i wonder what influence i can possibly have, bringing in yellow gingkho leaves or pinecones.
what can reality offer to match that....unless they raise the ante?

what are your feelings about the effects and messages of these kinds of games?
i dont care how much research comes out saying that these games dont affect the psyches of young people....how can this level of "beyond violence," not have a warping effect, day in and day out?
young children in a playground out here in california were just the targets of someone who opened fire on them.
maybe the next video games will be like that.
wont they have to up the ante, when kids become bored with this generation of violent video games?
what then????????

Posted by: jkaren | October 11, 2010 1:25 PM | Report abuse

@jkaren: "as a separate issue, what do you think of young people, playing a game like 'modern warfare, call of duty?'"

I'd have to know more about the games to say. I haven't actually played them. Though I like old-fashioned first person shooters, I'm more into Super Mario and Legend of Zelda. Some of the stuff (Grand Theft Auto, for example) makes me a bit squeamish. Fortunately, I have two girls, and they don't seem that interested in war games and shooters and whatnot. So, that's good.

"and then we wonder why kids arent doing well in school."

Kids aren't going well in school because their parents are lazy. My kids are doing reasonably well in school, but it's because homework comes before everything else. Which means in addition to working all day, I also have to do remedial (for me) school work, and read her social studies and science and check all her answers and read the English work and check her math problems (which usually means doing them all) . . . it's a lot of dang work. I'm not surprised a lot of parents don't want to get that engaged.

But I'm from a parenting style that says, even if we allow Call of Duty or Grand Theft Auto (my oldest daughter has a text plan, as a comparison, that takes up a lot of her time), if the grades are low all that stuff gets taken away. You will not simultaneously be playing Call of Duty and getting bad grades. You won't be doing _anything_ and getting bad grades. Bad grades mean you have no social or entertainment life. TV disappears from the bedroom (in our case), text plan disappears . . .

I could go one. But kids aren't doing well in school because parents let them do poorly. And I understand. It's a lot of darn work. I look forward to summer now as much as when I was a kid, because . . . yay! No homework! No studying for tests!

" i wonder what influence i can possibly have, bringing in yellow gingkho leaves or pinecones"

Good teachers are important, but there's only so much you can do if the parents aren't taking care of their part.

"what are your feelings about the effects and messages of these kinds of games? "

Not great, not the end of the world. They do have ratings systems, and those ratings should be respected. Fortunately, there's no demand for those games in my household. Although my daughter has seen more adult comedies and dramas than I feel are appropriate for a 12 year old, but . . .

It's a struggle. Do we want to impinge on folks creative (even if it's bloody) freedom? There's been gore and violence in movies for half-a-century or more. More, really. I used to read Fangoria as a teenager, read Stephen King. I don't think it warped me too bad.

I enjoyed playing Quake and Doom, lo these many years ago, and a few other first person shooters. But these days, I stick to Mario.

Posted by: Kevin_Willis | October 11, 2010 5:43 PM | Report abuse

kevin willis


well, you sound like a very engaged, conscientious father, and that is wonderful:-)

Posted by: jkaren | October 11, 2010 7:02 PM | Report abuse

I loves me some video games, including Grand Theft Auto and other games with that level of violence. Of course, I'm 31 (sigh). Games have a ratings system just like movies (though I think it's a bit lax on violence and puritanical on sex) and parents should be involved in what their kids are playing and should be determining if something is not age appropriate. But just as with violent movies, and the rap music before it, and the rock music before that, and the comic books before that, media just isn't going to make a normal kid with involved parents into a killer, and an analog life isn't going to make a troubled kid into a saint.

Posted by: MosBen | October 11, 2010 10:02 PM | Report abuse

"media just isn't going to make a normal kid with involved parents into a killer, and an analog life isn't going to make a troubled kid into a saint."



one hopes so, anyway.
i guess, like with everything, it is a matter of balance....
how a child feels about themselves...
and knowing that someone else cares about them, and what they are feeling.
knowing that they are loved, that there is not excessive bullying, or too much loneliness in their lives, and just that someone really cares about what happens to them, and how they are feeling about things in the "real" world.
( and an occasional golden ginghko leaf and pine cone!)



Posted by: jkaren | October 12, 2010 8:29 AM | Report abuse

Post a Comment

We encourage users to analyze, comment on and even challenge washingtonpost.com's articles, blogs, reviews and multimedia features.

User reviews and comments that include profanity or personal attacks or other inappropriate comments or material will be removed from the site. Additionally, entries that are unsigned or contain "signatures" by someone other than the actual author will be removed. Finally, we will take steps to block users who violate any of our posting standards, terms of use or privacy policies or any other policies governing this site. Please review the full rules governing commentaries and discussions.




characters remaining

 
 
RSS Feed
Subscribe to The Post

© 2010 The Washington Post Company