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Sharing Holiday Travel Experiences

Fellow Thanksgiving travelers know that there's a curse on Delaware. There's something about that short stretch of I-95 across The First State that finds a way to create trouble for motorists.

On Sunday, left Cape Cod at 6 a.m., and had a pretty smooth trip, even clearing the lane merge around Exit 8 on the New Jersey Turnpike with no trouble at 11:15 a.m. (By the way, it worked well for us to stay in the truck lanes, rather than the cars-only lanes, at that merge. There were few trucks, and there is no merge for the right-most lane.)

Even the toll plaza at the Delaware Memorial Bridge was a breeze. Then it stopped. Traffic on I-95 was backed up across the entire state of Delaware because of an accident near Elkton, Md.

After I tuned in the Delaware Department of Transportation's radio at 1380 AM and learned the cause and extent of the backup, the Grid Spouse went into action, pulling out a map and plotting this course: Route 141 north to Route 2 west to Route 273 to Route 272, then back to I-95, just before the Chesapeake House rest stop.

I know you'll tell me this isn't the shortest or most efficent route, but it worked well for us, given the situation. You could stop for coffee in Newark, Del., and see the Maryland Horse Country along Routes 273 and 272 provided a nice break from the tedium of I-95.

What was your holiday travel experience? While it's still fresh in your mind, give the rest of us some advice we can sock away for the next round of holiday traffic.

By Robert Thomson  |  November 27, 2006; 8:12 AM ET
Categories:  holiday travel  
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Comments

We left FL on Fri, thinking that getting back into DC on Sat would be a whole lot easier that on Sun - boy, were we wrong. Everyone else thought the same thing. I95 from the merge with 295 in Richmond was SLOW. IT took us forever. I guess we should have left from our stopover earlier on Sat, but we did leave at 10:15 and hit that spot at about 2 - we thought we would be easily home by 4:30 but it was 6:30.

Posted by: wrongtimecharlie | November 27, 2006 9:45 AM | Report abuse

We were in the same backup Sunday morning in Elkton as the good Dr., except I was driving just behind the incident, and was the last car allowed through before they closed the highway. Unfortunately there was a fatality, with much blood and the gruesome body bag right in the middle lane as we squeezed by to the left. Not sure if it was a motorcyclist involved, but there were many stopped cars and much commotion. It was shocking and certainly gave us pause to be thankful coming home from the Thanksgiving holiday.

Posted by: AJA | November 27, 2006 10:40 AM | Report abuse

We did a shorter version of Dr. Gridlock's trip, leaving Mays Landing, NJ at 2pm and heading home to Alexandria, VA. We knew there would be no good time so took our chances.

Crossing NJ on Rt 40W wasn't too bad. But traffic was backed up over the Delaware Memorial Bridge, beginning to slow on the NJ side (this was about 3:15pm). We got through the tollbooth and moved right, taking DE Rt13 down to 40 and heading west. That was somewhat slow but mostly due to stoplights. We got back on I-95 at MD279, and should have waited until MD272, as the traffic was very slow at that point, although moving.

Now it was about 4:30pm and we stopped at Chesapeake House and were there for about an hour. Traffic was sill slow and stayed that way until we took I-895 for the Baltimore Tunnel. Luckily we were late enough to miss football traffic. Unfortunately, there were still a bunch of slow patches, and before the Wilson Bridge, it just crawled through the road work. (I think I regret not taking MD295 instead and getting on just before the bridge).

We arrived home at about 8pm -- a full six hours after we left, and five hours of total driving. With a not-quite-3-year-old (who was actually quite good given the situation).

Going up was no picnic, either, but was a shorter ride. I don't know what can be done about this route, but I wish I could figure something out. We do this a few times a year and get to dread it each time. It seems no matter when we leave (in either direction), it's a very long drive.

I think 895 is helpful, as is MD/DE40 for at least part of the trip north. But 95 is really unavoidable.

And DE ought to do something about that toll, it's a menace.

Posted by: capsfan6 | November 27, 2006 11:40 AM | Report abuse

From Dr. Gridlock: Aside from the unfortunate situation in Delaware, we had a surprisingly smooth trip Sunday from Cape Cod to Washington: Starting at 6 a.m., it took nine hours and 15 minutes to drive 450 miles. A normal trip would take me about eight hours. E-ZPass helped, as always, especially in New Jersey, where we take the Garden State to the NJ Turnpike.

Posted by: Dr. Gridlock | November 27, 2006 11:47 AM | Report abuse

DC to SC Thanksgiving day only took about 7 hours (avg 8). Coming back Sunday took 9 but I was expecting 10. Still came to a complete stop a few times between Richmond and Quantico, but that usually horrific stretch flowed smoother than I'd ever seen it on a holiday weekend.

One complaint: there were a lot of people in NC and So.VA who for some reason insisted on keeping 100 yds back from the car in front of them during those 40mph/stop stretches. Infuriating, especially in the left lane. If everybody drove like that, every car on 95 would be slowed from FL to NY.

Posted by: booyah | November 27, 2006 12:14 PM | Report abuse

My trip? Ah...from the kitchen table to the fireplace. 600 feet of clear traffic, with a random cat tearing up and down the stairs for a safety hazard. We stayed local this year and had Thanksgiving on Saturday. By doing this untraditional strategy, we avoided the last minute grocery crush, the travel traffic, and the stressed out cooks. That way, Thanksgiving day was spent relaxing with family (no slaving away at the stove.) The actual meal was cooked over Friday and Saturday, with a very relaxed atmosphere.

We did hit a backup on 395 north on Friday evening at the Springfield interchange. A nice rolled over SUV and a passenger car with crumpled front end and side closed all lanes of 395 northbound just south of Edsall Road. Not going to ask how that happened, but we were thankful to have avoided being out on the road much this long weekend. My only gripe: it's impossible for deaf people to know what the heck is going on with traffic, since the news websites never have any info in a useful format (handheld, PDAs, etc). The mobile sites are just worthless. Hearing folks have their WTOP radio, but us deafies have no recourse other than to page around hoping someone happens to know what's going on a mile up the road. There's just no text-based traffic services, and that's pretty disappointing.

Posted by: CyanSquirrel | November 27, 2006 12:18 PM | Report abuse

We attempted going back to DC from Connecticut Saturday afternoon, but I think a lot of other people had the same idea. After hitting slow patches in Fairfield and then near Scarsdale - the real kicker was the warning of a 15 mile backup on the NJ Turnpike after exit 9. We decided to stay w/family near Tom's River, NJ (taking the Garden State Pkwy to rt 70), leaving Sunday morning.
Sunday morning was fine on the NJ Turnpike. There was traffic, but moved smoothly from exit 4 until the tolls. (Having EZPass helps) The Delaware Memorial Bridge didn't have any problems either. It was before Exit 1 that we encountered the traffic. The alternate we took: 896 South to rt 40 West to MD 272 to I-95. It was smooth going at that point; we didn't even encounter football traffic in Baltimore or DC! Total driving time was 4.5 hours for a trip that should take 3.5 hours. Not bad overall.

Posted by: bjt | November 27, 2006 12:28 PM | Report abuse

I drove 20 minutes to my parents' place in Fairfax for the day on Thursday. Big thing I noted, in the rain on the Beltway, was the huge number of invisible cars, i.e., cars/SUVs being driven in the pouring rain with no headlights. I'll never understand why some people think they're exempt from using their lights in bad weather. It's dangerous.

Posted by: Rich | November 27, 2006 12:28 PM | Report abuse

When I travel from Philly and points north, I never stay on 95 through Delaware. Take DE-1 south after Wilmington (just past the 95/295 merge). Hop over to US-301 near Odessa and take it to US-50 and points west. Once 301 enters Maryland (it's less than 10 miles in DE by that point) there are ZERO traffic lights or toll booths until you're home. There's a $1 or $2 toll on DE-1, but that's much less than the 95/895 tolls. Depending on your destination, this route can be a bit longer than staying on 95, but the reduced stress is well worth it.

Note that the reverse trip doesn't always work quite as well due to the backups on 50 at the Severn River and Bay Bridges.

Posted by: GhettoBurbs | November 27, 2006 12:51 PM | Report abuse

I was one of those airport travelers. I went from DCA to Syracuse Wednesday thru Sunday.
I got to Reagan early smart, 6:30 for 10 a.m. flight. The traffic was manageable. There were n lines at Regan on Sunday at 1 going out and there were no traffic in Syracuse.

Posted by: Reid | November 27, 2006 1:04 PM | Report abuse

We came back to Bowie on Saturday night from south of Richmond to avoid the Sunday traffic.

Bad idea. Traffic was great in the Richmond area, thanks to their I-295 bypass freeing up I-95. The backups and "expect delays" signs began at the northern 295/95 junction and got steadily worse as we headed north. A normally 2-hour trip took 5 1/2 hours. I'm willing to bet metro DC's lack of a bypass had a lot do with it. Thank you, road opponents. And an honorable mention to the environmentalists for all the wasted "foreign oil" fuel and attendant pollution thanks to their opposition to every bypass highway proposed in the DC region.

Not to worry. We can take comfort that "alternatives" like Dulles rail and the Purple Line will greatly improve the situation on I-95 (yeah, right).

Posted by: CEEAF | November 27, 2006 1:42 PM | Report abuse

I left at 11am Wed. morning heading south on I95 towards Richmond. I had a hair appointment at 2pm leaving me with a comfortable 1 hour cushion to get there on time. But, like the fellow in your chat I too ran into some ungodly traffic at the expressway merge. There was an accident in Fredericksburg that had 2 right lanes closed and traffic backed up all the way to the express lanes. Needless to say my 2 hour drive turned into a 4 hour drive and I missed my appointment.

But wait it gets worse...

I decided to return on Sat. so I could miss the Sunday nightmare but to my dismay yet another traffic accident; this time on I95 South 1 mile south of the expressway exit. Now you may notice that I was now traveling North, why am I b***hing? Well, I sat in traffic from Fredericksburg all the way to the expressway lanes going under 10mph so all those idiots could get a good long look at the accident from the other side of the road. (grrrrrr, rubberneckers)Yes, you read that right I sat in a somewhat identical accident traffice coming and going.

The return trip was a grueling 31/2 hours.

But on the positive side I got home and I got home safe!

Posted by: Germantown | November 27, 2006 1:55 PM | Report abuse

I traveled to Buffalo from Baltimore for T-giving. Normally the drive isn't too bad except for "Breezewood". But I was really playing it safe, and left Tuesday at 5:00 am; returned Friday leaving Buffalo at 10 am. No problems at all. I think I'll do that again next year. Added benefit: sunny, 50's in Buffalo the whole time.

Posted by: Coleenh | November 27, 2006 2:35 PM | Report abuse

Given clear skies and dry pavement both Friday and Sunday, what did the idiots do to crash?

Posted by: Joey Chitwood | November 27, 2006 3:23 PM | Report abuse

The crashers were most likely locals hurrying from A to B to get their year end shopping done. My guess. Or local meets out of towner unwise to the lunatics on the road in DC.

Posted by: CyanSquirrel | November 27, 2006 3:42 PM | Report abuse

I'd say the crashes were caused by idiots changing lanes even though there isn't enough room between the cars that are already there...

I had a multi-stage trip -- left Tuesday morning around 9:30 for Long Island -- tried to miss the Delaware construction by taking 50E to 301N to 40N to the Delaware Memorial Bridge. All went fine except for Rte 40, which just has too many stoplights. New Jersey was a breeze, but I hit NYC rush hour around 3:30 so I crawled all the way from Staten Island to Long Island.

Then on Wednesday I headed up to Connecticut. On the road by 9:30, arrived in Cheshire around noon, with no traffic at all. Returned to Long Island on Friday afternoon, leaving at 2:00, and again had no problems. Just drove back to Arlington today, leaving Long Island at 9:45 and arriving home at 3:30. My goal was to get here before the DC rush hour hit, and I just made it. Next time I'll leave around 9:15 a.m.

Posted by: so glad to be home | November 27, 2006 4:07 PM | Report abuse

I live in Arlington and left for my parents place out near Middleburg Virginia. Normally this is a 50 minute trip and I usually take I-66 West. I left on Wednesday, and because of the rain decided to take route 50 instead of 66 West. That was a huge mistake. It took me over 3 HOURS to get to Middleburg from Arlington on Wednesday. Unbelieveable. The traffic was bumper to bumper well in to Loudoun County. I could't figure out what the heck was causing the traffic to be like this. I left on Sunday around 2pm and took 66 East. I had zero problems and hit zero traffic. Go figure.

Posted by: Steve | November 27, 2006 4:47 PM | Report abuse

Columbia, MD to Charlotte, NC.

On Wednesday, we left at 7 and took 70W to 15S to 29. As you may know, 29 becomes "785" south of Lynchburg. Except for the sheeting rain over the mountains, a good ride.

Coming back on Saturday was pure pleasure. We left around noon and barely even had to tap the brakes until our dinner stop in Charlottesville.

Posted by: dynagirl | November 27, 2006 5:16 PM | Report abuse

I'm probably one of only a few that would do this...

To skip horrendous I-81 traffic, I drove from the deep south beginning Sunday at 2am EST. I came home at 12:00pm EST. 730mi in 10 hrs. I have done this for 3 years straight and will continue to do this.

Anyone hear of reports of I-81 traffic in VA?

Posted by: allnighter | November 27, 2006 5:31 PM | Report abuse

I had a fairly decent experience. Flew out of BWI early in the morning on Tuesday to Denver and flew back Friday afternoon. My only bad experience was some guy who had to sit right on my bumper going up the BW Parkway. I was in the right hand lane doing 70 mph and the left lane was completely clear for him to pass. He came onto the BW Parkway 3-4 exits after me so I don't think it was a case of him being upset that he thought I had cut him off or something. I was very tempted to slam on my brakes but decided that whatever problem he had was his. I moved to the left lane, he passed me and that was that. I hope he got to where he was going and stayed there.

Posted by: blogbunny | November 27, 2006 6:27 PM | Report abuse

Colleenh - I'm not sure that going through Breezewood is your best option for going from Baltimore to Buffalo, as I assume you are then taking the PA Turnpike to the Pittsburgh area and I-79 up to Erie.

Try I-83 to I-81 to US22/322 in Harrisburg. Then, US22/322 to US15 north of Harrisburg and on to Corning, NY. From there, I-86 to I-390, then take NY36/NY63 to US20 or US20A or Thruway to Buffalo.

US15, which you will be on thru most of PA, is not an interstate, but significant portions are 4-lane divided limited access, at interstate standards or near interstate standards. The only real slow part is for a few miles thru Shamokin Dam and Lewisburg. Most of 15 north of Williamsport, and I-86, and I-390 are 65 MPH.

Posted by: RBW | November 27, 2006 10:57 PM | Report abuse

I left midday Wednesday, just as the rain was getting going, heading south to Richmond. The first 40 miles to Fredericksburg took about 4 hours. The last 50 miles took another hour. We can usually make the same trip in about 1:45 on a good evening.

Coming back was a breeze. We left around 8:30 pm on Friday night and were back in the mixing bowl area just before 10. I became one of the lucky people crossing all 5 lanes of 95 from my usual left lane Outer Loop exit over to the Franconia Rd exit to avoid the complete lane closure farther north.

Posted by: John | November 28, 2006 9:02 AM | Report abuse

We left for just south of Richmond on Tuesday night from Arlington. Even with the rain, it wasn't too bad, though there was one maniac 18 wheeler scaring the crap out of us. Some slowdowns.

We left mid-afternoon on Friday and had the easiest drive ever on the way back. 95 was clear.

Posted by: Sean | November 28, 2006 9:40 AM | Report abuse

We left Tampa, FL Saturday night at 7pm-we were in Arlington, VA at 9am the following morning. Absolutely no delays. Do the math and figure out what our average speed was, also..hehehh

Posted by: Noggin | November 28, 2006 10:04 AM | Report abuse

I took off mon to avoid sunday traffic. going from ct to dc yesterday was a breeze. I left around 9 to avoid both morning and afternoon rush hours. Very little traffic the whole way and a fairly smooth ride along I 95 and the NJ turnpike. I will definitely do that again next year.

Posted by: emm | November 28, 2006 11:02 AM | Report abuse

RI-MD drive: worked, went home and slept, left at 11:30 PM Wednesday night, drove down and arrived at 6:30 AM Thursday. Beautiful, no delays though the weather was bad. Left Sunday at 1:30 PM and once through DE all was fine and home by 10:15 PM. 95-Jersey Turnpike-Garden State across the Tappan Zee, back to 95 in CT and back. I'm convinced Metro DC's traffic planners have part-time jobs in DE.

Posted by: College Park Gal | November 28, 2006 11:14 AM | Report abuse

It was worth getting up at 5:00 am on Thanksgiving to miss most of the traffic and bad weather on the 285 mile trip from Arlington to CT. I did the same thing for the return trip on Monday morning and was home in time to have lunch and get to the office by 1:00. Both trips clocked in around 5 hours and were relatively smooth sailing (though some of the drivers in NJ/NY on Thursday morning were driving like maniacs given the pouring rain at that point). I love EZ-pass! No more 7-9 hour nightmares on T-giving Wednesday and Sunday for me, even if it is painful to get up at 0 dark hundred.

Posted by: D | November 28, 2006 11:55 AM | Report abuse

RDW/colleenh: depending on where in Buffalo, also consider the 219 (Southtowns, the Ralph).

Posted by: Joey Chitwood | November 28, 2006 1:24 PM | Report abuse

""allnighter" wrote: I'm probably one of only a few that would do this...

"To skip horrendous I-81 traffic, I drove from the deep south beginning Sunday at 2am EST. I came home at 12:00pm EST. 730mi in 10 hrs. I have done this for 3 years straight and will continue to do this."

I *hope* allnighter is one of the few to do this. 730 miles in 10 hours is an *average* of 73 mph. And if he or she ever stopped or slowed down to make a pit stop, go through a toll booth, get something to eat, buy gas, and so on, that means the average *driving* speed would have had to be much higher. Just what we need more of: idiots going 80 mph or higher on busy holiday-driving days.

Then there's "bjt", who said: "Total driving time was 4.5 hours for a trip that should take 3.5 hours." The trip was from somewhere in Connecticut to DC. From around Newark, NJ, to DC is around 225 miles; from Connecticut to DC would be, maybe, 275 miles? (It depends on where in Connecticut, obviously.) So this is another bozo who's *averaging* nearly 80 mph. Am I the only one who thinks this is crazy and dangerous--not to mention illegal?

There seems to be no end of idiots who brag about how fast they drive. When did that become something to brag about?

Posted by: jaded | November 28, 2006 2:59 PM | Report abuse

"jaded" has obviously never driven anywhere outside the DC area. The prior poster who went 730 miles in 10 hours said he drove "from the deep South." The speed limit on Interstates in most of the South is 70 mph outside the cities, so right there you lose your #1 beef with someone averaging 73 mph (ie, THREE MPH over the limit....whoa, now THAT'S bad!!!!)

More importantly, there is nothing dangerous per se in going 80 mph if the traffic is light and the conditions good, especially on an open highway. The fact that Texas has posted an 80 mph speed limit on several hundred miles of Interstate proves the point--the mere fact that someone is doing 80 doesn't inherently make it unsafe. I can tell you that one time on I-59 in rural northeastern Alabama I had the cruise control set at 100 mph and people were still passing me (and I made a point of staying in the slow lane). Imposing driving standards appropriate for urban routes in DC to rural Interstates is unrealistic and is why the stupid National Speed Limit was repealed. (Of course, if you go 80 on Rock Creek Parkway, you deserve to lose your license.)

The Europeans generally have higher speed limits than we do (130 km/h is normal, although the Italians post 150 km/h in places) and lower fatality rates, especially the Germans, who have NO speed limit on many stretches of autobahn. The Germans rigidly enforce laws such as keeping right except to pass and not passing on the right. Americans could learn a lot from them.

The biggest problem on our roads is two-fold--(1) people who refuse to move right for faster traffic and (2) people who slalom in and out as a result of (1). BOTH are hazards. You can't realistically demand that everyone go your preferred speed. If everyone in the right lane is doing 60, and everyone in the left lane is doing 75, then you do not have the option of doiing 65--you are to slow down and move right or speed up and move left, but you have no business trying to make everyone else do 65. But at the same time, the guy with the super-dark tinted windows, stupid loud muffler, and phony spoiler who wants to do 90 has no business tailgating and weaving in and out, either--he needs to learn to suck it up and do 75 until he breaks free of traffic.

Posted by: Rich | November 28, 2006 3:36 PM | Report abuse

I agree with Rich completely. On our way back to Arlington from Tampa, there were stretches of I95 in Georgia and South Carolina where it was possible to attain speeds of about 100-110 for about 30 seconds at a time, dropping down to 85-95 afterwards. This was at 3am, with absolutely no traffic on the road, with the high beams on and the pavement smooth as glass. Absolutely nothing inherently wrong with that-the sooner you lose that 'drive 55 and live' mentality, the better. I will also say that I wasn't the only one doing this-to the gentleman in the Acura from New York state...right on!

Posted by: Noggin | November 28, 2006 4:25 PM | Report abuse

CEEAF,
You really should consider taking 301 back to Bowie from Richmond. Going isn't always smooth sailing, but by and large you're moving the whole time (the worst back-up is going south when you hit the Rte. 5 merge).

And you're right - there needs to be an interstate connecting I-97 to Southern Maryland and back around to north of Richmond. It would greatly ease traffic in Southern Maryland and create the DC bypass you seek.

Posted by: Baltimore | November 28, 2006 5:02 PM | Report abuse

We had 3 stops: 2 at rest areas for the bathroom and one for gas. This is roughly 15 min off. There are no toll booths, and no need for food when the other two are sleeping.

And yes, most of Alabama (I-59), and half of Tenn(1-75,41,81) is all 70mph zone. If you average 77-80 in those, and 70-73 in VA (I-81), which is exactly half of the trip, you can get an average of 75 mph for the whole trip. 730 miles at an average of 75 mph with a 15 min total stop is roughly 10 hours.

Bottom line - open stretch of highway is much safer and quicker. And whoever drove was fully awake.

Thanks to Rich for the support.

Posted by: allnighter | November 28, 2006 6:51 PM | Report abuse

Back in college when I was a race driver for a race team in the 24 hrs of Daytona I routinely drove from Burke Va to Daytona Beach is less than 8 hours. Best time ever was just over 7.5hrs and back in the days of 55mph in the late 70's. Team owner wanted his 911 Kremer turbo down in Fla but didnt want to drive it himself. Never got a ticket or had an accident but had to watch out for the late arriving snowbirds and RV drivers.

Posted by: vaherder | November 28, 2006 7:49 PM | Report abuse

"You really should consider taking 301 back to Bowie from Richmond. Going isn't always smooth sailing, but by and large you're moving the whole time (the worst back-up is going south when you hit the Rte. 5 merge)."

That's a good route, but my wife hates it after dark because of the deer.

Posted by: CEEAF | November 28, 2006 11:14 PM | Report abuse

Let's also remember that driver training is also different in Europe (more widespread) and cars are different. Manual transmission and steering can give the driver greater control over the vehicle. American drivers are used to the comforts of automatic features on cars that don't go well with fast driving. I agree that for the most part, you can drive safely at speeds of 70+ on the open , uncongested highway. But every driver should be aware of his individual limitations. And deer.

Posted by: to Rich | November 29, 2006 12:24 PM | Report abuse

I've never owned a car that didn't have a manual transmission :-)

Posted by: Rich | November 29, 2006 12:32 PM | Report abuse

Alexandria to Paterson, NJ

Drove up Thanksgiving Day. We left at 6:40 AM and arrived at 11:30 AM. I95 to Baltimore Beltway, I-695 to I-83 N to Harrisburg, PA, I-81/I-78 E to I-287 in NJ, and then 287 N for 35 miles or so. No slow downs whatsoever, even with intermittent rain. Added 50 miles to the trip, but worth it.

Departed Paterson 10:00 PM on Saturday, arrived Alexandria 2:00 AM. GS Parkway to NJ Turnpike to I-295 S (excellent idea, by the way - it was a ghost town) through Jersey, then I-95 rest of the way. Only "slowdown" (2-3 minutes max) occurred at Newark Toll Plaza (half the booths were closed). Otherwise, smooth sailing.

Thank you for all the advice I read here before the journey!

Posted by: overnight drive | November 29, 2006 1:20 PM | Report abuse

Agreed with Rich. Manuals are the only way to go.

Posted by: CyanSquirrel | November 29, 2006 2:32 PM | Report abuse

Rich and CyanSquirrel -- but not everyone is coordinated enough to drive a manual --

I had planned to spend a nice, quiet weekend at home in Wheaton but my plans were changed; a family death in Ohio meant that we were heading west on the Ohio and PA turnpikes on Thanksgiving Sunday. We found out that that is definitely the direction to go on that day. Traffic was light in our direction and heavy in the other. But it did not seem to be as heavy as I remember from the past when we made that trip with grade-school children.

Last night, driving back was not bad though the truck/car ratio was heavy on the truck side.

Posted by: Historian | November 29, 2006 5:24 PM | Report abuse

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