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Is it just me, or does the Tea taste kind of weak this morning?

By Greg Sargent  |  August 28, 2010; 9:18 AM ET
Categories:  Miscellaneous  
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Next: Beck and Palin strive for historical immortality

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I came across this on TPM.

Twitter:

http://twitter.com/PJCrowley/status/22300291485

"
Americans should heed our #travel warning and avoid North Korea. We only have a handful of former Presidents. http://go.usa.gov/cAO #DPRK about 16 hours ago via web Retweeted by 100+ people

PJCrowley
Philip J. Crowley"

..................

Crowley is the Assistant Secretary of State for Public Affairs, i.e., chief spokesman at the State Department.

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 9:28 AM | Report abuse

Greg,

My Mug of Irish Breakfast tea tasted off this morning. It tasted like A Dick Armey had just marched through it.

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 9:31 AM | Report abuse

And A Clown Shall Restore Our National Dignity.

Self Described "Rodeo Clown" Today holds a DC Rally to "Restore Honor" to America.

From the NY Times

" Mr. Beck says he believes every word he says on his TV show, and the radio show that he still hosts from 9 a.m. to noon each weekday. [...]

At the same time, though, he says he is an entertainer. “I’m a rodeo clown,” he said in an interview, adding with a coy smile, “It takes great skill.” [...]

He added later: “I say on the air all time, ‘if you take what I say as gospel, you’re an idiot.’“

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 9:32 AM | Report abuse

The Tea has been weak since the beginning...

Posted by: TheBBQChickenMadness | August 28, 2010 9:33 AM | Report abuse

Speaking of tea, let's start with English Breakfast.


The growing power of Murdoch in England...

"Mark Thompson, the BBC director general, has launched a scathing attack on Rupert Murdoch's media empire, warning that BSkyB is too powerful and threatens to "dwarf" the BBC and its competitors.

Delivering the annual MacTaggart lecture at the Mediaguardian Edinburgh television festival, Thompson rounded on Sky's chairman, James Murdoch, who used the same speech last year to attack the corporation.

"A year ago, James Murdoch fretted aloud about the lamentable dominance of the BBC," he said. "He was able to do that only by leaving Sky out of the equation."

Thompson said Sky was "well on its way to being the most dominant force in broadcast media in this country".

He said that News Corp, in effect controlled by the Murdoch family, now enjoys unprecedented industry power in the UK. News Corp owns 39% of Sky and is in the process of buying the part of the broadcaster it does not already own.

"If News Corporation's proposal to acquire all of the remaining share in Sky goes through, Sky will not just be Britain's biggest broadcaster, but a full part of a company which is also dominant in national newspapers as well as [being] one of Britain's biggest publishers," Thompson said. That would be "a concentration of cross-media ownership that would not be allowed in the United States or Australia"." http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2010/aug/27/bbc-mark-thompson-murdoch-mactaggart

As I've noted earlier, the great Brit screenwriter Dennis Potter observed Murdoch's extraordinary power and influence on Brit media and political discourse a bit more than a decade ago and held Murdoch as the fundamental cause of the decline in political discourse there. (watch this... http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/video/2007/sep/11/dennis.potter )

As I've also noted earlier, Ted Turner, in a talk from around the same time, related that he had talked with his friend Tony Blair and warned of the growing power in Brit politics of Murdoch to which Blair responded, "I can't touch Rupert. If it weren't for him, I wouldn't be PM."

Posted by: bernielatham | August 28, 2010 9:36 AM | Report abuse

Typically thoughtful piece from Tomasky...

"The great Obama-Axelrod-etc. mystery"
http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/michaeltomasky/2010/aug/27/obama-administration

Posted by: bernielatham | August 28, 2010 9:43 AM | Report abuse

Bernie -- I love Tomasky. I don't know if I've said this before but I interned at the Village Voice back when he was there God knows how long ago. One of these days I'm going to get him to guest blog here.

Liam -- your imagery is as vivid as ever, though it's growing a bit more disconcerting...

and BBQ -- but ... but ... it's a movement that's transforming American politics!

:)

Posted by: Greg Sargent | August 28, 2010 9:49 AM | Report abuse

It's because that is Koolaid you are drinking.

Posted by: quarterback1 | August 28, 2010 9:55 AM | Report abuse

Well, at least these Morons did not cross into N. Korea, or head to DC to have their Dignity restored by "A Rodeo Clown".

"(CNN) -- The facts: On August 27, 1891, a passenger train jumped the tracks on a tall bridge near Statesville, North Carolina, sending seven rail cars below and about 30 people to their deaths.

The legend: On the wreck's anniversary, the sounds of screeching wheels, screaming passengers and a horrific crash might still be heard. You might also see a uniformed man with a gold watch.

Shortly before 3 a.m. Friday, on the 119th anniversary of the Bostian Bridge train tragedy and at about the same time, between 10 and 12 ghost hunters were on that approximately 300-foot long span.

They were hoping to hear the sounds of the crash, and perhaps see something.

Instead, a real Norfolk-Southern train -- three engines and one car -- turned the corner as it headed east to Statesville, about 35 miles north of Charlotte, authorities said.

The terrified "amateur ghost watchers" ran away, back toward Statesville, trying to cover the nearly 150 feet to safety, said Iredell County Sheriff's Office Capt. Darren Campbell.

All but two made it.

Christopher Kaiser, 29, of Charlotte, was struck and killed, said Campbell.

A woman who witnesses say Kaiser pushed to safety fell about 30 to 40 feet from the trestle and was injured. Her name and condition were not known Friday night. She was being treated at Carolinas Medical Center in Charlotte.

"There was no way out, said Campbell. "They almost made it."

The engineer of the train, which was traveling at its customary 35 to 40 mph, hit the horn and "stopped as fast as he could," Campbell said.

Campbell, 38, is from the area and has heard all the stories, although he said he knows of no one who has ever seen or heard the "ghost train.""

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 9:57 AM | Report abuse

If there's any piece I'd recommend today, it's Greenwald here..
"It requires extreme blindness or extreme dishonesty to deny that our politics is more racially and ethnically polarized than it has been in a long time." (there's much more) http://www.salon.com/news/opinion/glenn_greenwald/

Posted by: bernielatham | August 28, 2010 9:58 AM | Report abuse

@Greg - Yes, you mentioned it once some months back. I always read Tomasky and watch many of his little vid chats. He seems and extremely likable fellow with an enviable evenness of keel.

Posted by: bernielatham | August 28, 2010 10:04 AM | Report abuse

Greg,

Are you going to go check out the scene at the Lincoln Memorial, and post a report on it?

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 10:09 AM | Report abuse

A simple chart detailing the incredible similarities in the lives and accomplishments of ML King and Glenn Beck...

http://crooksandliars.com/david-neiwert/glenn-beck-does-remind-us-civil-righ

Posted by: bernielatham | August 28, 2010 10:11 AM | Report abuse

If you look really closely, you'll see one of Abe's middle fingers is slightly extended with a small smirk on his face.

The Lincoln Memorial is my favorite place in D.C. but, not today. *sigh*

Posted by: ChuckinDenton | August 28, 2010 10:14 AM | Report abuse

Restoring honor to American with the help of Lapin and Hagee... http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2010_08/025421.php

Posted by: bernielatham | August 28, 2010 10:17 AM | Report abuse

TPM has a live feed from the rodeo:

http://www.talkingpointsmemo.com/news/2010/08/watch_glenn_beck_restoring_honor_rally.php?ref=fpblg

Posted by: suekzoo1 | August 28, 2010 10:19 AM | Report abuse

Meanwhile, we at OFA are knocking on doors today, apparently under the radar of the media, fascinated as it is by the monstrosity on display in downtown DC.

Posted by: Mag3 | August 28, 2010 10:23 AM | Report abuse

The question is...can the D.C. police handle the 9 trillion people who will reportedly be on the mall today?

Posted by: getjiggly | August 28, 2010 10:27 AM | Report abuse

I think the Beck and Palin show in DC needs a catchier title.

Something like, perhaps, "the Million Moron March."

Sure, there won't be a million people there. But they'll claim that there were. And there will certainly be enough stupid among those who do attend to go around for a million.

Posted by: JennOfArk | August 28, 2010 10:31 AM | Report abuse

"Facts and reality mean nothing to Beck. And there is no road too low for him to slither upon."

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/08/28/opinion/28herbert.html?_r=3&src=twr

Posted by: schrodingerscat | August 28, 2010 10:33 AM | Report abuse

Here is the link: for OFA

http://www.barackobama.com/

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 10:33 AM | Report abuse

One of the contentions of the right has been that they find it insulting that reasonable people call them "all" ignorant racists. This is both sad and false.

Actually, the point of the discussion regarding the ignorance and racism on the right is that we hope that they are NOT all ignorant racists. The point is to highlight the lack of accuracy of the claims of their leaders and the bigotry that they are promoting so that the reasonable members of the right can disavow it.

Can't wait to see what happens today. Could be a real turning point.

Posted by: cmccauley60 | August 28, 2010 10:38 AM | Report abuse

It looks like a pretty big crowd -- Palin speaking now.

Posted by: clawrence12 | August 28, 2010 10:39 AM | Report abuse

"Meanwhile, we at OFA are knocking on doors today"

Yes, we are! :o)

Posted by: suekzoo1 | August 28, 2010 10:39 AM | Report abuse

Bernie, I can understand why you would like Greenwald's piece on the one hand, the right wing's preying upon the economic woes of hard working Americans. We've been talking about that for over a year now and how insidious they are. But I am surprised that you agree, or maybe you dont', with the notion that the Administration did not use the public's anger and economic slide as the opportunity to right the ship.

I remember last year arguing with Tena and others that we were missing the opportunity to channel the "summer of discontent" into public policy that would truly reverse the decline of the middle class. There wasn't much agreement then and most everyone agreed let's just get what we can.

I guess I find it curious that you never really address that side of the coin, no disrespect intended, I really am curious.

Sorry for the questions and then running out but I have an appointment and have to hit the road.

Posted by: lmsinca | August 28, 2010 10:41 AM | Report abuse

Palin just quoted Lincoln, though not the phrase that she most needs to learn, you know, the one about "a house divided against itself cannot stand," since she's all about separating out the "real America" from the rest of the country.

Now she's blathering on about her self-sacrifice as the "mother of a combat veteran." You know, the oldest kid, the one who joined the military to clear up some trouble with the police back home.

I just threw up in my mouth a little.

Posted by: JennOfArk | August 28, 2010 10:43 AM | Report abuse

Palin sounds like Minnie Pearl.

Was that music that played her on, actually Aaron Copeland's Rodeo?

It sure sounded like it was. How great would that be, if it was a snippet from Rodeo, considering that Beck described himself as "A Rodeo Clown".

The MSNBC online feed is not panning the crowd. It does not sound like there has been much applause.


Did you catch the line from Beck, before he brought on The Quitter Grizzly Granny;

"Family is the secret". That is what Beck said.

Thank you "Rodeo Clown" for revealing that big secret, to all of us.

Now Quitter says that "the rally is about restoring honor, though honor was never lost" Huh?

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 10:44 AM | Report abuse

lmsinca - we never address "that side of the coin" because the Democrats don't want to address it either. Unfortunately, they too have bought into the ridiculous notion that "freedom" = "allowing the few to grab everything." We'll never have widespread prosperity in this country again so long as our political class - and close to half of our populace - cling to this idea that the ability to amass unlimited wealth (if you have the good fortune to be positioned to do so) is the ultimate calling of democratic government. That's such a twisted notion that it really jumps out at you when phrased that way, doesn't it? Which is why you'll never hear an elected official of either party saying anything about the perversity of a democratic government, allegedly organized to protect the interests of all, setting as its highest goal and priority protecting the right and easing the path for the very, very few to Own It All.

Posted by: JennOfArk | August 28, 2010 10:49 AM | Report abuse

I do love been lectured about never quitting, when faced with an obstacle, by someone who Quit on the voters of Alaska, as soon as the going got just a little rough.

Never Quit, says The Queen Of All Quitters.

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 10:49 AM | Report abuse

"We Will Never Give Up". Quitter Palin just said that!

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 10:52 AM | Report abuse

Yes, JenofArk, please make fun of Marcus Lutrell, Eddie Wright, and Tom Kirk too.

Posted by: clawrence12 | August 28, 2010 10:53 AM | Report abuse

Now the "Rodeo Clown" is claiming that God was talking to him.

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 10:57 AM | Report abuse

To Restore America all, those Right Wing Chicken Hawks should stop wetting their beds, when one brain washed loon sets his underwear on fire.

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 11:03 AM | Report abuse

Now, the Native-American chief is claiming that we should be looking forward to a great awakening, introducing an African American Pastor Jackson.

Posted by: clawrence12 | August 28, 2010 11:05 AM | Report abuse

If I didn't have to go to lunch in NW DC I would have slapped on my Obama shirt, grabbed my video camera and took a stroll through the hate fest.

Posted by: mikefromArlington | August 28, 2010 11:09 AM | Report abuse

The native American said that we should never look back. That would suit all those who put his people on Reservations, in his own homeland, just fine.

Only a moron would urge people to never study the past, and learn from it.

Well there goes the Tea Party's big claim about the original intent of The Founding Fathers. They were just told, to stop looking back.

Wait a moment. He just brought up Jesus. Talk about never looking back; and then he turns right around and looks back two thousand years.

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 11:10 AM | Report abuse

Some one should tell the African American preacher, that Glenn Beck, "Rodeo Clown", who organized the whole cattle call, is not a follower of Jesus. He is a Mormon.

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 11:14 AM | Report abuse

clawrence12 - what on earth are you referring to?

I'm making fun of Sarah Palin, because she's imminently spoofable. Perhaps your reading skills aren't quite up to snuff.

Oh, and as suggested to me by a pinko commie comrade elsewhere, I'd like to amend "Million Moron March" to "Million MORAN March."

Posted by: JennOfArk | August 28, 2010 11:17 AM | Report abuse

"Hope is our eternal flame" that is what is now been said to the audience.

What ever happened to Quitter Palin sneering at "Hope" and asking: "how is that hope thing working out for you"?

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 11:20 AM | Report abuse

The GOP destroyed the economy and most other things of national importance but Obama's election, followed by the criminal incompetence of his Administration, has resulted in Democrats getting blamed for the GOP's failures. Worse, Obama and the Administration have managed to discredit and undermine Liberalism without ever adopting or employing it. A horrifying development for Liberals but, far more importantly, a catastrophic failure for the country.

The Democrats are going to get clobbered in November and lose the House at least. That result guarantees that nothing will get done legislatively until the next presidential election. At this point, I fully expect Obama to lose to whomever the GOP nominates (unless it's Palin). Conservatives will most likely "get their country back," like it or not.

We are, however, headed for economic disaster. Once the GOP is back in power they will have to deal with a staggering economy using Conservative principles. They will fail spectacularly. And next time, Liberals must be ready to govern and lead.

Posted by: wbgonne | August 28, 2010 11:20 AM | Report abuse

They are giving out a "hope" award, after they have spent the last eighteen months belittling the word, because President Obama used it!

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 11:22 AM | Report abuse

So, I haven't had the stomach to watch this morning: did Palin deliver the speech that "wins her the White House"?

Posted by: schrodingerscat | August 28, 2010 11:24 AM | Report abuse

Now is the next time loser. Only a lunatic loser would have conceded to the Republicans, months before any votes have been cast.

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 11:25 AM | Report abuse

JennofArk, I am referring to the three combat vets Sarah Palin introduced and honored. Oh, perhaps you want to make fun of Pastor Jackson or Albert Pujols instead?

Posted by: clawrence12 | August 28, 2010 11:25 AM | Report abuse

Jesus Christ been very very good to me. He has been giving me twenty million dollars a year, to play a child's game. Albert Pujols

"Give me your tired, your huddle masses" That is what they just preached, and they forget to add: except Hispanics showing up in Arizona.

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 11:29 AM | Report abuse

I "hope" so, schrodingerscat.

Posted by: clawrence12 | August 28, 2010 11:29 AM | Report abuse

WaPo home page says huge applause for Palin. Has anybody seen an overhead shot of either crowd? The sky shot has always been a hallmark of a Mall rally. I'd like to see that perspective. The feed is lame. As Palin was wrapping up, two black-suited young security guys, Secret Service wannabees, strode across the stage behind her, and it looked spooky

Posted by: KathleenHusseininMaine | August 28, 2010 11:31 AM | Report abuse


BREAKING: Faith Medal Goes to Beck Guest Who Compared Beck to Biblical King:

http://headofstate.blogspot.com/2010/08/liveblogging-beck-rally.html

Posted by: ibidibid | August 28, 2010 11:32 AM | Report abuse

scat, not even close! It was word-salady in a few places, but most platitudinal and not at all memorable.

Posted by: suekzoo1 | August 28, 2010 11:33 AM | Report abuse

I'm watching lots of crowd shots on C-SPAN.

Posted by: clawrence12 | August 28, 2010 11:34 AM | Report abuse

Liam:

When exactly did you become BlogGod? I must have missed that.

Posted by: wbgonne | August 28, 2010 11:36 AM | Report abuse

"Glen Beck's award for charity" ?

Sweet mother of God. What is the award; a discount coupon on "gold coins" purchase?

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 11:38 AM | Report abuse

clawrence12 - you listened long enough to see her wrap it up? I pity you, man.

But no, as I think my comment makes quite clear, I was ridiculing only Palin.

Unless, of course, you think she's really sincere in her paens to the military rather than just using them as usual to polish her American-lovin' credentials with people who lack the power of rational thought.

Posted by: JennOfArk | August 28, 2010 11:38 AM | Report abuse

"Oh, perhaps you want to make fun of Pastor Jackson or Albert Pujols instead?"

Hell yeah! It never ceases to amaze me to see members of the minority community letting themselves be used as visual props.They are crapping in their hat. Take a look at some right wing politician giving a speech before a crowd of followers and there is always some lone black face behind them. I think they are rented for special occasions. As for Pujols, he and his manager have been roasted by fans on the pages of he St. Louis Dispatch for being dupes of what is clearly a political event.

Posted by: filmnoia | August 28, 2010 11:40 AM | Report abuse

I thought that she was sincere, so that makes me "irrational" (probably "racist" too). Keep posting, JennofArk.

Posted by: clawrence12 | August 28, 2010 11:42 AM | Report abuse

They were honoring John Huntsman for promising to give away his fortune. The person who accepted the award for him, kept talking about Jesus Christ, but John Huntsman is A Mormon. What the hell is going on here?

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 11:43 AM | Report abuse

clawrence - I'd have to agree with that assessment.

Posted by: JennOfArk | August 28, 2010 11:45 AM | Report abuse

"Martin Luther King held strong while his detractors spewed hate. But he had the truth on his side."

Posted by: clawrence12 | August 28, 2010 11:46 AM | Report abuse

WoeBegone,

Here is a new flash for you. You only had to quit, and surrender to The Republicans just once. We got it, the first time you said you were giving up, and not going to vote. Why do you think that you have to keep telling us the same thing every day. You are starting to look like one of those phony liberals, who is actually a Right Wing Operative. All you do, is talk up how The Republicans are going to win, and all you ever do is attack this President.

If you are not a Right Wing Troll, pretending to be a liberal, you might as well be.

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 11:47 AM | Report abuse

And, Liam, if you think that mocking Beck the Clown is going to rescue the Democrats you are a bigger fool than I already think you are.

Posted by: wbgonne | August 28, 2010 11:49 AM | Report abuse

It looks like BET has taken over the Glenn Beck rally!

Posted by: clawrence12 | August 28, 2010 11:49 AM | Report abuse

Now the real Clawrence is revealed. He does not like it one bit, that there are so many African Americans featured at the "Rodeo Clown's stampede.

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 11:52 AM | Report abuse

MLK had something on his side that these clowns don't, then.

The bit bemoaning "spewing hate" is ironically amusing, however, given the numerous rallies over the past year in which protestors have waved signs depicting our president as Stalin, Hitler, or worse. Funny, I don't recall any big liberal rallies from this past year, so it must have been coming from the side that's suddenly all concerned about people "spewing hate", i.e., pointing out hateful and extremist language for what it is. Oh, the horror, the horror...

Posted by: JennOfArk | August 28, 2010 11:53 AM | Report abuse

Hey, BlogGod. Didn't you already deign to banish me into non-existence? Why do you respond to my comments after saying you never would again?

And you don't know the first thing about me so stop presuming you do. You have decided that Plumline will be an Obama-Democrat cheerleading forum and that Republicans are reasonable and should be treated nicely. Fine. Do what you like. But don't ever presume to tell me what to do or say.

Arrogant fool.

Posted by: wbgonne | August 28, 2010 11:54 AM | Report abuse

Woebegone, how is that third party, you called for, coming along. That will really strengthen The Democratic party.

Y

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 11:55 AM | Report abuse

By all means, filmnoia, please denounce Alveda King as just another Uncle (Aunt?) Tom.

Posted by: clawrence12 | August 28, 2010 11:56 AM | Report abuse

I'm late joining in here, can I make fun of Albert Pujols still? Did anyone at the rally check his papers before they let him on stage? Did they let him on without them? Or his he the good kind of immigrnat - the rich kind?

How a Latino shows up at a rally with Quitter Palin, endorser of Papers Please laws is beyond me. Well, it's not really as I'm a sports fan and understand what these entitled athletes living in their own fantasy world are like. Pujols was supposed to be one of the exceptions but I'm thinking not anymore. Tony LaRussa - this just backs up all the a-hole stories I've heard about him over the years.

Posted by: zattarra | August 28, 2010 11:57 AM | Report abuse

It looks like BET has taken over the Glenn Beck rally!

Posted by: clawrence12 | August 28, 2010 11:49 AM

................

Only Clawrence gets to make fun of African Americans.

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 11:58 AM | Report abuse

Liam, did I say I don't like it?

BTW: KathleenHusseinMaine, they just showed a wide shot of the crowd all the way back to the Washington Monument.

Posted by: clawrence12 | August 28, 2010 12:00 PM | Report abuse

The Yahoo News page has their article about the Glenn Beck rally listed under the Entertainment section.

Exactly where it belongs. ;)

Posted by: elscott | August 28, 2010 12:00 PM | Report abuse

"Jews and Gentiles together, in the name of Christ". That is what the preacher just said.

Jews in the name of Christ? Really? Could he possible have been any more demeaning toward Jews.

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 12:01 PM | Report abuse

Is this the same Alvida King who claims civil rights as her birthright and blood heritage and then denounces homosexuality and gay marraige? I don't care who you are related to, a bigot is still a bigot.

Posted by: zattarra | August 28, 2010 12:01 PM | Report abuse

So what you're saying is that there's enough folks there that they can more easily conflate it into a million than the 40,000 or whatever from last year they tried to make into a million.

Which makes it a Million Moran March.

Posted by: JennOfArk | August 28, 2010 12:02 PM | Report abuse

"By all means, filmnoia, please denounce Alveda King as just another Uncle (Aunt?) Tom."

From what I understand she is a pariah in the King family - the equivalent of the crazy aunt who lives in the attic.
To be at a rally given by a guy who called Obama a racist just makes her another dupe, living in a fog of false consciouness.

Posted by: filmnoia | August 28, 2010 12:03 PM | Report abuse

The crowd sure looks "inspired" don't ya think?

Posted by: suekzoo1 | August 28, 2010 12:03 PM | Report abuse

To be fair, I'm sure they could have reached a Million Morans on the Mall, except a not-insignificant fraction of their number were confused by the word "mall" and ended up at a shopping center in Tysons Corner.

Posted by: JennOfArk | August 28, 2010 12:04 PM | Report abuse

Clawrence, you didn't say you did either, but you did say that it looked like that it was been "taken over" by BET.

"Taken over". That is all you had to say. Those words of yours, exposed what you really are.

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 12:05 PM | Report abuse

Hey BlogGod:

This may be blasphemy to you but I DON'T CARE ABOUT THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY. I care about the country. And I know that Liberalism is the only way forward. To the extent the Democratic Party can serve as a vehicle for progressive change it has my support. But it is plain to all but the blind that the Democratic Party as a governing bloc is no more committed to Liberalism than the Republicans are. Not only that but your hero Obama has managed to discredit Liberalism when he isn't even a Liberal and hasn't governed as such.

You can cheer Democrats and wave pom-poms for Obama all you like but -- notwithstanding your delusions of grandeur -- you have no business telling other people what to say or think.

I am happy to have us ignore one another but if you are intent upon attacking me that's another matter.

Posted by: wbgonne | August 28, 2010 12:06 PM | Report abuse

Liam - he only said "taken over" because he doesn't know the word "usurped."

Posted by: JennOfArk | August 28, 2010 12:06 PM | Report abuse

Alveda King is anti-abortion and anti-gay-marriage, Amen!

Posted by: clawrence12 | August 28, 2010 12:06 PM | Report abuse


Is this the same Alvida King who claims civil rights as her birthright and blood heritage and then denounces homosexuality and gay marraige? I don't care who you are related to, a bigot is still a bigot.

Posted by: zattarra | August 28, 2010 12:01 PM |

..................

I recall Thurgood Marshall once saying; "It does not matter what color a snake is; a black snake will bite just a quickly, as a white one will. I think he was responding to a question about the appointment of Clarence Thomas to the Supreme Court.

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 12:10 PM | Report abuse

Liam, if I simply pointed out that Jews for Jesus have "taken over" the rally, that does not imply a negative opinion.

Media estimate of crowd size: 300,000-500,000

Posted by: clawrence12 | August 28, 2010 12:13 PM | Report abuse

What? "God only knows how many there are" Glen Beck.

Since he said God talked to him, and told him what to do, why doesn't he just ask God for the answer?

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 12:13 PM | Report abuse

Liam - he only said "taken over" because he doesn't know the word "usurped."

Posted by: JennOfArk | August 28, 2010 12:06 PM

....................

Yes indeed. Clawrence wishes they would know their place, and not be acting uppity.

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 12:16 PM | Report abuse

Liam the BlogGod has decreed that everyone must join together and mock Beck the Clown because that will ensure Democratic victory in November. Liam the BlogGod will let everyone know when mocking Beck the Clown shall cease.

Posted by: wbgonne | August 28, 2010 12:18 PM | Report abuse

"Media estimate of crowd size: 300,000-500,000"

What media, GOP-TV?

Posted by: suekzoo1 | August 28, 2010 12:18 PM | Report abuse

No, Liam, I don't think that.

Posted by: clawrence12 | August 28, 2010 12:19 PM | Report abuse

We get it. One-twelfth to one-sixth of one percent of the population in this country is mad enough, crazy enough, and stupid enough to pi** away hundreds of dollars on trip to Washington in order to stand around with fellows who are as mad, crazy, and stupid as they are in order to be indoctrinated into becoming even madder, crazier, and more stupid by people who are making millions of dollars off of them.

I'm supposed to be impressed by that?

Posted by: JennOfArk | August 28, 2010 12:20 PM | Report abuse


Liam, if I simply pointed out that Jews for Jesus have "taken over" the rally, that does not imply a negative opinion.

Media estimate of crowd size: 300,000-500,000

Posted by: clawrence12 | August 28, 2010 12:13 PM

...............
Clawrence, If If If.

If your aunt had testicles she would be your Uncle, or Quitter Palin's idea of what The Female Gov. Of Arizona really is.

And if you had testicles, you would be your Aunt's nephew.

I know what you actually said, so I do not need to bother with what you did not say.

you lamented that it looked like the event was being "Taken Over By BET". That is what you said; no if,ands, or buts, about it.

If you had said something different, then that would have been different, but you didn't. You said what you said.

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 12:24 PM | Report abuse

Not at all, JennofArk, keeping spewing hate.

Posted by: clawrence12 | August 28, 2010 12:25 PM | Report abuse

"I choose advance" Glenn Beck. That surprised the hell out of me. I was almost certain he was going to say:" I choose to perish".

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 12:26 PM | Report abuse

I love when Slave Owners get inspired, and liberate their selves only, and keep black people, and all women, subservient, and without representation.

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 12:28 PM | Report abuse

Liam, that was not a lament, no matter how many times you insist on mis-reading my mind.

Posted by: clawrence12 | August 28, 2010 12:29 PM | Report abuse

We're never going to get anywhere if you Teabaggers keep insisting that "truth" = "hate". I mean, where did you get such a crazified notion? Those aren't even antonyms.

Posted by: JennOfArk | August 28, 2010 12:32 PM | Report abuse

Clawrence, and yet you chose to say that it looked like BET was taking over.

You said that you were watching it on C-Span, and yet you appear to not have noticed that sea of white faces. You only notice the few black faces, and said that it looked like they were taking over.

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 12:33 PM | Report abuse

What the hell did the "Rodeo Clown" consume for breakfast: a copy of Bartlett's Quotations?

That is all he has been regurgitating all morning.

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 12:36 PM | Report abuse

The Rodeo Clown says they are "reclaiming" the Civil Rights Movement" at this shindig, correct?

This presumes that the Civil Rights Movement of the '50s and '60s was usurping *another*, earlier one, yes?

One wonders what that "earlier" movement consisted of in reality. If in fact there was another one (and not just in the Clown's imagination).

Separate but equal?

Posted by: ChuckinDenton | August 28, 2010 12:36 PM | Report abuse

JennofArk, I am not "stupid" so that is not truth, but rather hate.

Posted by: clawrence12 | August 28, 2010 12:36 PM | Report abuse

As my wife has said "size doesn't matter." Who cares how big the crowd is?
The size of the crowd doesn't validate the message or the messenger. I'd like to know how many gold coins Beck gave to Alveda King and the other minority head cases that are there today.

Posted by: filmnoia | August 28, 2010 12:37 PM | Report abuse

What the hell did the "Rodeo Clown" consume for breakfast: a copy of Bartlett's Quotations?

That is all he has been regurgitating all morning.

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 12:37 PM | Report abuse

Beck converted, and became a Mormon, so why is he preaching about The Resurrection of Jesus. Beck abandoned him, and became a Mormon.

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 12:41 PM | Report abuse

clawrence - sorry, but if you accept this blather about Beck "reclaiming the civil rights movement", his claims that "WE" were the ones who made it happen, without recognizing that A) at the time of the March on Washington, Beck wasn't even yet a gleam in his father's eye and B) would have been a year or less out of diapers by the time of King's assisination, then yes, you are stupid.

And that's not even getting to the business about Beck having been raised up in a church that claimed that blacks were "the seed of Cain" and refused to admit them until the very late 1970s.

So yes, it's quite the sure thing that Glen Beck was one of the shining heroes of the Civil Rights Movement. I'm sure if we search the film archives, somewhere we'll find footage of a 1 or 2-year old Glen Beck, leading a march for equality in his diapers and crying the real tears of an infant rather than the fake ones of the TV charlatan.

Posted by: JennOfArk | August 28, 2010 12:43 PM | Report abuse

What civil rights are they trying to "re-introduce"? I'm waiting for anyone at the Rodeo to disavow the AZ racial profiling laws. Anyone? Beuller?

Posted by: ChuckinDenton | August 28, 2010 12:43 PM | Report abuse

Has Beck broken out the blackboard yet? I'd like to see him expound on the dangers of the "OLIGARHY" for the benefit of the Morans on the Mall.

Posted by: JennOfArk | August 28, 2010 12:45 PM | Report abuse

What does he mean God is not yet done? Palin claims that God finished the entire job, in seven days, about 6,000 years ago.

God really delivered for the Native Americans, when he guided all of us over the mountains, didn't he "Rodeo Clown"?

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 12:51 PM | Report abuse

National Park Service estimate: 300,000-350,000; Organizers estimate: 500,000.

Posted by: schrodingerscat | August 28, 2010 12:53 PM | Report abuse

Man, John Stewart has just been delivered a whole season of material by the "Rodeo Clown". Especially the part, where he talked about telling "the whole truth, and nothing but the truth".

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 12:55 PM | Report abuse

Much better turn out than you guys were predicting here.

Posted by: clawrence12 | August 28, 2010 12:56 PM | Report abuse

Is BernieLathem ok? He hasn't compared anything to Nazi's yet. Greg, better track down his IP and send the police in for a welfare check.

Posted by: TrollMcWingnut | August 28, 2010 12:57 PM | Report abuse

Is Beck going to run for Office soon?

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 1:00 PM | Report abuse

Glenn Beck is such a legend in his own mind.

No doubt he fancies that some day there will be a monument of him on the Mall....probably made out of gold, courtesy of Goldline. Hahaha!

Posted by: elscott | August 28, 2010 1:02 PM | Report abuse

How sad that Glenn Beck has to wear a bullet-proof vest.

Posted by: clawrence12 | August 28, 2010 1:03 PM | Report abuse

Does anyone else notice that all the non-whites in the crowd appear to be behind and right near the front of where Beck and friends are speaking? If you look at other shots of the crowd, they appear to be almost all white.....

Posted by: pac12 | August 28, 2010 1:03 PM | Report abuse

There is that word again: "Hope"

It was bad, when President Obama used it,

but suddenly it has magical properties, when Palin and Beck talk up "Hope".

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 1:03 PM | Report abuse

William Jennings Beck.

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 1:05 PM | Report abuse

@ clawrence12 | August 28, 2010 1:03 PM

"How sad that Glenn Beck has to wear a bullet-proof vest."

Who said he had to?

Posted by: CalD | August 28, 2010 1:09 PM | Report abuse


How sad that Glenn Beck has to wear a bullet-proof vest.

Posted by: clawrence12 | August 28, 2010 1:03 PM |

..................

Better safe than sorry. That is the sort of thing one has to fear, when a Tea Party Candidate for US Senator, threatens Violent 2nd Amendment Solutions.

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 1:14 PM | Report abuse

His security consultants.

Posted by: clawrence12 | August 28, 2010 1:14 PM | Report abuse

I watched a little of this Beck thing and I think it is absolutely hysterical. Nothing like some dramatic readings of pre-civil war literature to fire up the troops. Big-time eyeroller. It's too boring to watch, but in general I think it's great if more people learn about the early history of this country, whatever their intentions. Maybe people will even read about Martin Luther King Jr since he was an authentic American hero.

Posted by: Ethan2010 | August 28, 2010 1:17 PM | Report abuse

Were they quoting stuff from the KKK? Senator Byrds speaches can be quite inciting.

Posted by: TrollMcWingnut | August 28, 2010 1:21 PM | Report abuse

Shouldn't we be "happy" they have so many folks? Cerainly this will cause some kind of bad tension with the 'sane' GOP? Maybe winger craziness will scare the crap out of moderates and indies?

Posted by: ChuckinDenton | August 28, 2010 1:21 PM | Report abuse

So, what was the message that people are supposed to take away from this?

What exactly have the people been asked to do? All I heard was a lot of talk about Jesus(The Prince Of Peace) and just as much talk in praise of war.

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 1:21 PM | Report abuse

@Is BernieLathem ok? He hasn't compared anything to Nazi's yet. Greg, better track down his IP and send the police in for a welfare check.

It doesn't matter what Bernie says Troll..you do REALIZE that BECK himself has compared this rally to a Nazi gathering.
After Obama's acceptance speech in front of 75,000 in Denver..Beck had Ben Stein on his show who said..

"Seventy-five-thousand people at an outdoor sports palace, well, that's something the Fuehrer would have done"

A large crowd at a big monument...perhaps the Nuremburg rally...I'm not playing the Nazi card...I'm trying to point out to your brainless people like Troll McWingnut

THAT STEIN AND BECK SAID A LARGE OUTDOOR RALLY IN FRONT OF CHEERING FOLKS IS SOMETHING LIKE THE FUHRUR DID!!! DOESN'T THAT MAKE THIS THE SAME THING MORONS.

Sorry to go caps here but the freaking HYPOCRISY and lack of facts from the tea party new confederate imbeciles like troll is getting really disgusting.

Let's see..when Obama speaks to large crowds he = Nazis

When Beck does the VERY SAME THING He = proud American. You people are jokes...PATHETIC JOKES!!!!

Posted by: rukidding7 | August 28, 2010 1:22 PM | Report abuse

JennOfArk -

"We'll never have widespread prosperity in this country again so long as our political class - and close to half of our populace - cling to this idea that the ability to amass unlimited wealth (if you have the good fortune to be positioned to do so) is the ultimate calling of democratic government."

My family and I are always batting this back and forth and I agree with you, except I might delete the word "again." :)
It always infuriates me to hear a politician of any stripe talk about "working hard and playing by the rules," and seeing so many people nod at the wisdom of it, when so many of them don't understand or don't care that there are two sets of rules: one for businesses and the wealthy; the other for everybody else.

Posted by: carolanne528 | August 28, 2010 1:25 PM | Report abuse

I take it all back Ethan2010. Beck, through his mouthpiece Stein were the first in history to go full Godwin. In fact, I'm pretty sure that when Be k and Palin used words like "the"'and "and" they were quoting, exactly, Nathan Bedford Forrest and Jefferson Davis! Holy Cow! I found the racist link! If only I could cap lock then people would listen. I blame
Diebold

Posted by: TrollMcWingnut | August 28, 2010 1:30 PM | Report abuse

Senator Alan Simpson calls people on Social Security, " a bunch of greedy old geezers", but Alan Simpson has been drawing a very large Federal Pension for many years now, since he left office.

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 1:32 PM | Report abuse

btw tea party maroons...you have NOTHING in common with the Patriots at the Boston Tea Party...their cry was "no taxation without representation" and it was directed at a foreign power seen to be an occupier.

You idiots are perhaps too stupid to vote and so here a lesson lame brains...
voting=representation!!! You have not been taxed without representation!!! You are railing against the United States of America not a foreign power. What you are advocating with Angle's 2nd Amendment solutions and watering the Tree of Liberty with blood is CIVIL WAR...not revolution.
You are not tea partiers...you are confederates..you have everything in common with the folks who fired on S.C. and NOTHING in common with the Boston Tea partiers. But then perhaps like the Wasilla Hillbilly you all slept through American History class.

tea party=fact free protests...

Fact...our country is now paying the least amount of taxes since 1950. That's right maroons...facts don't matter to you..but you selfish, whiny pigs are griping about supporting YOUR country at a time when we have two wars, a republican economic crisis, and a growing deficit..but let's all sit around and worry about those poor helpless hedge fund bankers and wall street traitors who created financial derivatives and credit default swaps and blame it all on the poor and middle class in this country.

http://www.usatoday.com/money/perfi/taxes/2010-05-10-taxes_N.htm

Tax bills in 2009 at lowest level since 1950. Amid complaints about high taxes and calls for a smaller government, Americans paid their lowest level of taxes last year since Harry Truman's presidency, a USA TODAY analysis of federal data found.

Posted by: rukidding7 | August 28, 2010 1:35 PM | Report abuse

This Neo Tea Party is Dyslexic.

They are calling for Representation Without Taxation.

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 1:37 PM | Report abuse

Gee, I do no one gets crushed as they flood back to the buses that FreedomWorks chartered to bus them in to this thing.

Despite the entertainment value, it's important not to dismiss the dangerous subtext of this rally.

"Restoring honor" and "reclaiming the civil rights movement" is code for restoring the Presidency to a white guy.

This rally was timed to be right before the midterm election season starts to really heat up. The GOP is already salivating at the possibility of taking back the House and beginning the first steps toward impeachment hearings. Some of them can hardly contain their glee at the prospect.

They, of course, won't be able to impeach President Obama but they hope to weaken him so much politically that he will be defeated in 2012.

Given their sorry lineup of potential GOP nominees and their alienation of most of the Latino and black voting public, it's really their only desperate shot at unseating Obama in 2012.

This rally to fire up their ignorant, misformed base was step 1.

Posted by: elscott | August 28, 2010 1:39 PM | Report abuse

I listened to Beck's closing speech. Does anyone get what he is saying? He talks about taking action, but never says what, how or who or when. The only specific thing I heard about was tithing to your church. That's it?

People drove for hours and days to listen to Glenn Beck push tithing and talk about God?

Posted by: 12BarBlues | August 28, 2010 1:39 PM | Report abuse

@Liam....or as has been said...they are the something for nothing crowd...give me my Medicare..my S.S...but damn it don't expect me to pay for any of it.

Or perhaps like Geo W they are badarses who want to kick some Muslim butt...as he once famously said.."Bring it on"...yeah bring it on...start two freaking wars but don't pay for any of it...that's the tea party way...they are the ultimate welfare queens who want something for nothing!

Posted by: rukidding7 | August 28, 2010 1:41 PM | Report abuse

@elscott...Your post is dead on...we already have a maroon on this site who claims to be an attorney and he is one the record here exactly as you point out.

He's licking his chops for the R's to regain the House so they can continue gridlock and begin impeachment...on what freaking grounds?
This man is an attorney and presumably therefore educated and so I can only think of him as one of the worst kind of traitors our country can have. NO talk about how to fix problems..ALL talk about gridlock and impeachment.

Posted by: rukidding7 | August 28, 2010 1:45 PM | Report abuse

I watched the entire event on C-Span, mainly because I want to see this Beck guy in action, I have heard so much about him, but I have never seen his TV show. Is that the way he usually talks on his show?

I still do not know what to take away from the event. What were the people who came, supposed to go back home and actually do?

It just sounded like a very strange blend of A Christian Revival Meeting, combined with a pro war rally.

I did not hear any specifics of what is supposed to be wrong, and what specific changes are supposed to be brought about, by the actions of the people in attendance and the viewing audience.

Did any of you, hear an such specifics?

All I heard was hurrah for Jesus, and Hurrah for Warriors.

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 1:48 PM | Report abuse

Alaska gets back six dollars from Washington, for every dollar that it sends to Washington. On top of that Palin, pushed through a massive increase in Revenues to be collected from the oil companies, at a time that the State was already running a budget surplus, just so Palin could send out free oil money checks to residents of the State, where there is no state income tax.

That makes Quitter Palin The Former Welfare Queen of A Welfare State.

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 2:01 PM | Report abuse

Liam - I'm not surprised. This "rally" was more about Beck's need for self-aggrandizement than anything else. They couldn't have a partisan program because Fox has decided their on-air people can't appear at Tea Party events anymore - it undermines that "fair and balanced" joke they use as a tagline...nevermind their $1 million donation to the GOP governor's group.

I actually think what they were trying to accomplish here was a rally without any overt racism, which is why the podium was "taken over by BET" and why those who attended were asked not to bring signs.

They're trying to put a polish on this turd before the elections roll around, and rehabbing their image as a bunch of racist loony-tunes is part of that. Which I'm sure was quite a disappointment to the attendees.

Posted by: JennOfArk | August 28, 2010 2:02 PM | Report abuse

Jenn,

It was all very odd. No red meat. No specifics about what is been done wrong, and who is to blame. No specifics about what solutions are called for, and who is proposing the best answers.

I guess he was just preaching to the choir, and just trying to appear less threatening to the rest of the nation.

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 2:10 PM | Report abuse

edit:

is being done wrong....

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 2:12 PM | Report abuse

rukidding, you are right -- there are absolutely no grounds for impeachment, but I think they are figuring on a gullible media that will play along with them. We know any trumped-up investigations will get 24 hour news coverage on Fox, and then CNN will be silly enough to follow suit, and...well, we all know how it has worked in the past.

But ultimately, I don't think it will work. I think they have already played their hand too early on this by advertising their intentions.

That's why I think the Dems must keep pointing out exactly what the GOP is planning and keep highlighting the real intentions and out-of-the-mainstream spoutings of the Tea Party candidates.

I know Greg thinks that is a weak strategy, but I don't see how the Dems can let the GOP get away with their schemes without making it crystal clear to voters what they are really all about and what they intend to do.

I expect to hear President Obama taking this on rather forcefully in the next couple of months.

Posted by: elscott | August 28, 2010 2:19 PM | Report abuse

Doesn't look like buffoon-fest got much of a turnout after all.

Posted by: CalD | August 28, 2010 2:32 PM | Report abuse

@liam

I am befuddled as to the purpose of this Glennfest unless he is a codetalker. Why would his corporate sponsors support this meandering pointless rally?

What are the crowd estimates? Anyone?

Posted by: 12BarBlues | August 28, 2010 2:39 PM | Report abuse

@elscott I agree with all of your observations. And in fact of course they don't need to actually have an impeachment trial, all they need to do is have one of their looney tunes offer it up..get it seconded and then the debate begins. Grounds or no grounds are irrelevant..we can see the new confederates are a fact free party..they will simply try to gin up as much publicity as possible.

I hope you are correct and that Obama does take this head on. I think among those of us old enough to remember that there is still impeachment fatigue from the Clinton era...All O has to do is take the words of one R Congressman or former R official like Tom Tancredo...he can then look right into the camera and say..."I realize that not all of you agree with what my administration has accomplished...however to hear Republicans talk about gridlock instead of offering solutions is not the patriotic way to run our country...and to hear some of those Republicans talk about impeachment is just frightening for the future of our country. There are no grounds for impeachment and if the r's are going to behave like children losing a game everytime Democrats win the W.H. then it's a sad day for American. Governing this great country of ours is not a game!

Posted by: rukidding7 | August 28, 2010 2:46 PM | Report abuse

12BarBlues

The only thing I can come up with is they know that they can not win with Tea Party votes alone, in November. They can win Republican primaries with them alone, but not the General elections, so they decided to stage some Kabuki theater to try and convince moderates, that the Tea Party members are very reasonable God fearing folks, just like them.

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 2:48 PM | Report abuse

@12barblues.....The National Park Service no longer does estimates after catching grief for their reported attendance estimates on the Million man march. And so Glen will say some University determined with satellite imagery that there were one to two million.

We'll just have to wait and see if any CREDIBLE sources report accurately. Of course Beck/Hannity and Fox are disqualified since they LIED through their teeth about the attendance at Glen's 9/12 rally!!!! Lies that in Hannity's case involved putting up pics of an old rally and calling it the 9/12 rally. They have NO shame!

Posted by: rukidding7 | August 28, 2010 2:51 PM | Report abuse

Meanwhile, back in the real world:

"KABUL, Afghanistan – U.S. and Afghan troops repelled attackers wearing American uniforms and suicide vests in a pair of simultaneous assaults before dawn Saturday on NATO bases near the Pakistani border, including one where seven CIA employees died in a suicide attack last year.

The raids appear part of an insurgent strategy to step up attacks in widely scattered parts of the country as the U.S. focuses its resources on the battle around the Taliban's southern birthplace of Kandahar.

Also Saturday, three more American service members were killed — two in a bombing in the south and the third in fighting in eastern Afghanistan, the U.S. command said. That brought to 38 the number of U.S. troops killed this month — well below last month's figure of 66.

The militant assault in the border province of Khost began about 4 a.m. when dozens of insurgents stormed Forward Operating Base Salerno and nearby Camp Chapman with mortars, rocket-propelled grenades and automatic weapons, according to NATO and Afghan police.

Two attackers managed to breach the wire protecting Salerno but were killed before they could advance far onto the base, NATO said. Twenty-one attackers were killed — 15 at Salerno and six at Chapman — and five were captured, it said.

Three more insurgents, including a commander, were killed in an airstrike as they fled the area, NATO said.

The Afghan Defense Ministry said two Afghan soldiers were killed and three wounded in the fighting. Four U.S. troops were wounded, NATO officials said.

U.S. and Afghan officials blamed the attack on the Haqqani network, a Pakistan-based faction of the Taliban with close ties to al-Qaida. Camp Chapman was the scene of the Dec. 30 suicide attack that killed the seven CIA employees.

Afghan police said about 50 insurgents took part in the twin assaults. After being driven away from the bases, the insurgents approached the nearby offices of the governor and provincial police headquarters but were also scattered, said Khost provincial police Chief Abdul Hakim Ishaqzai.

"Given the size of the enemy's force, this could have been a major catastrophe for Khost. Luckily we prevented it," he said.

Small-arms fire continued through the morning, while NATO helicopters patrolled overhead. The dead were wearing U.S. Army uniforms, which can be easily purchased in shops in Kabul and other cities, possibly pilfered from military warehouses".

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 2:52 PM | Report abuse

@liam,

Maybe so, about the moderates. But, just how uber religious are moderates? Somehow, this God talk message doesn't seem very targeted to moderates.

This isn't a helpful analysis, but I felt like I was watching someone else invade Beck's body. This isn't him, it's not his shtick, I doubt very many people wanted to spend a grand and drive for days to hear Beck do Godtalk.

Posted by: 12BarBlues | August 28, 2010 2:57 PM | Report abuse

12BarBlues

Since I have never watched Beck before today, I do not have a lot to go on, but I get the impression that his viewers, are much like The Big Fat Pillbilly's Ditto Heads, and treat Beck more like their cult leader, than someone they can take or leave.

Wouldn't it be delicious Irony, If Beck was trying to slap a smiley face on the face of Right Wing Extremism, and it turned out that his legion of Becker Heads, actually took what he said today, to heart, and a goodly number of them stopped distrusting President Obama.

I did notice that amidst all that calling for mutual understanding, and all that talk about following Jesus Christ, not one of them paused to mention that they truly believe President Obama is a sincere Christian, just like all of them.

Strange how that was not cleared up, by those Apostles of understanding and social harmony; isn't it?

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 3:09 PM | Report abuse

@ rukidding7 | August 28, 2010 2:51 PM:

That's when it was. Someone mentioned a National Parks Service estimate upthread and an I knew it had to be bogus, but I was trying to remember exactly when it was that they stopped doing them. Thanks very much.

Posted by: CalD | August 28, 2010 3:10 PM | Report abuse

It always strikes me; when I see coverage of those many many tea party rallies;

If you can afford to take time off, and pay to travel and put up at hotels, so often, then you must be doing OK during this Bush/Cheney Great Recession Era.

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 3:17 PM | Report abuse

@liam,

I haven't watched Beck a lot, but I have seen many clips of his rants. He is very paranoid, always drawing sinister connections between people and organizations that tie into some creepy plot, and he is melodramatic and weepy. Now today, he comes off (relatively speaking) as a sincere Christian looking for church-centered activism. WHAT? Who he? as they say.

Posted by: 12BarBlues | August 28, 2010 3:17 PM | Report abuse

"Someone mentioned a National Parks Service estimate upthread and an I knew it had to be bogus,...."

That was me...got it from an NBC reporter's tweet. This is what they said:

"There won't be official #s. Parks Svc/police don't do that anymore. But official at top of memorial said 300-325K. "

Take it for what it's worth. :)

Posted by: schrodingerscat | August 28, 2010 3:24 PM | Report abuse

12BarBlues

Plus he kept dropping in comments about Jesus, and the Resurrection, like he is trying to pass as a Christian, when in fact he and his entire family converted to Mormonism several years ago.

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 3:25 PM | Report abuse

@liam,

Just so you know, LDS consider themselves Christian. BTW, I am not LDS but I lived in Utah for a number of years so you get tuned into the LDS faith.

Posted by: 12BarBlues | August 28, 2010 3:28 PM | Report abuse

12BarBlues (dig your blog handle, btw...)

Yeah, LDS believe Jesus reappeared in the Western Hemisphere and left tablets in the ground somewhere in upstate New York, IIRC.

Posted by: ChuckinDenton | August 28, 2010 3:33 PM | Report abuse

Have a good afternoon all. I will check back tomorrow.

One thing that does appear to have changed; the organizers must have done a good job of keeping the most extreme wack jobs away from the event.

During the previous Tea Party gatherings in DC, to protest Health Care reform etc; as soon as the Teabaggers hit town, this blog was always over run by a massive amount of comments from ranting right wingers, and as soon as they left town, that would always end.

This time; we have not seen that inundation from them, either yesterday or today.

I am off to get myself on God's side, because William Jennings Beck told me to. Now where the hell can I get my hands on such a tall ladder, that I will be able to climb up next to The Great Sky Wizard?

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 3:35 PM | Report abuse

clarification: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mormonism_and_Christianity

Posted by: ChuckinDenton | August 28, 2010 3:38 PM | Report abuse

@chuck,

I know, I know, but...LDS members will proclaim to high heavens that they are Christian. If you listen to their spoken prayers and blessings, the name of Jesus is always spoken. I'm not defending the Christianity of the LDS Church, I'm just reporting what the regular Mormon in Utah says.

Posted by: 12BarBlues | August 28, 2010 3:40 PM | Report abuse


12BarBlues (dig your blog handle, btw...)

Yeah, LDS believe Jesus reappeared in the Western Hemisphere and left tablets in the ground somewhere in upstate New York, IIRC.

Posted by: ChuckinDenton | August 28, 2010 3:33 PM |

.............

Wouldn't that count as the second coming of Jesus? or did he just sneak back in an unofficial capacity, for to just have some fun, by setting up a scavenger hunt?

Posted by: Liam-still | August 28, 2010 3:44 PM | Report abuse

12Bar-

Word. I was agreeing with your comment about them considering themselves Christian. I don't know how that squares with "mainstream" Christianity. The obsession with invoking Jesus is likely an attempt to make them look more mainstream.

Posted by: ChuckinDenton | August 28, 2010 3:46 PM | Report abuse

@ Liam-

Maybe we should as Joe Smith? Heh, heh...

Posted by: ChuckinDenton | August 28, 2010 3:48 PM | Report abuse

@chuck,

It's kind of hard to have much of an informed opinion about the LDS theology. I lived within a stone's throw of a ward house and was there many times for community events. But their religious services are not open to outsiders, nor do the members talk about them to outsiders. My impression was that LDS members (in Utah) are very self contained and don't care what outsiders think.

Posted by: 12BarBlues | August 28, 2010 3:56 PM | Report abuse

Greg,

What? You can't taste the MIRACLE? This is a freaking miracle right here. How exactly is it miraculous? No one knows. And THAT is the miracle... or something.

All I know is that this is a miracle, as foretold by the great prophets of dumb, the Insane Clown Posse.

"Effin' Palin, how does show she work?"

The answer: For about half as long as she's supposed to.

Posted by: michael_conrad | August 28, 2010 4:21 PM | Report abuse

After reading these many comments, why so much fear, hatred and derision? After all, isn't Beck beneath comment, just a risible, feckless "rodeo cowboy?" Why the fuss?

Where are all the comments on how great Sharpton's counter rally was? Hmmm?

boy."

Posted by: marybel9999 | August 28, 2010 4:25 PM | Report abuse

After reading these many comments, why so much fear, hatred and derision? After all, isn't Beck beneath comment, just a risible, feckless "rodeo cowboy?" Why the fuss?

Where are all the comments on how great Sharpton's counter rally was? Hmmm?

Posted by: marybel9999 | August 28, 2010 4:26 PM | Report abuse

@ schrodingerscat | August 28, 2010 3:24 PM:

I just did a little dead reckoning here. Found an areal shot of the Beck rally. Then I went on Google maps and took satellite photos of the Mall in DC and the Meadowlands Sports complex, dropped them into Photoshop, scaled them identically, then sliced out bits of stadium and pasted them over the mall.

Looks to me that if the crowd at Beck rally were as densely packed as stadium seating, you'd have roughly the attendance the same attendence as two sold out Giants games. But of course it wasn't. I'd guess a figure between 100 - 150k people would be pretty defensible though, which is still a lot of dimwits.

Posted by: CalD | August 28, 2010 4:27 PM | Report abuse

I'm working, so missed all the fun.

@Ims - to your question re Greenwald, mainly I was pointing to his analysis of what Obama faces. How to respond to the nature and behavior of this modern conservative movement is no simple matter, strategically or ethically. My position has changed since the early point of the presidency when I believed it was in the nation's interests for Obama and team to model a sort of politics which put responsibility in governance above the raw lust for power and the destructive cynicism of the opposition. I thought that the political structures of the nation would respond positively and that a new ethic would be supported.

But that hasn't happened because, so far as I can analyse this, the institutionalization of centers of wealth and power is very deep. There is a relatively tiny percentage of the nation who are benefiting enormously from things as they now are and they do not wish to have their hold on power/wealth compromised or reduced. And they, as an institutionalized structure, do not care a whit about the population except so far as that population might be drained further of what they have or so far as they might be utilized (through all the techniques we see now of deception, fear-mongering, media control/influence and the propaganda potential that makes available) to target and blame other citizens for their increasing travails rather than the structures which are actually bringing this about.

The problem that always arises when dealing with social pathology of this sort is how to meet it and best it while, so much as possible, not falling to the same pathologies (eg an alley fight where the opponent, regardless of his claims, really abides by no rules).

So, my position has changed in light of what the last year and a half has demonstrated. We are going to have to go through a period where the left fights as dirty as the opposition. It's a moral hazard, of course, but it looks a far greater moral hazard to not engage this battle realistically because of the likely or certain consequences if we do not.

Posted by: bernielatham | August 28, 2010 4:28 PM | Report abuse

After reading most of the comments on this thread, I wonder why there is so much fear, hatred and derision about Beck's rally. Isn't Beck just some stupid beneath comment "rodeo cowboy?"

Where are all the comments about Sharpton's counter protest? Hmmm?

Posted by: marybel9999 | August 28, 2010 4:31 PM | Report abuse

For the record: "You don't have to be high to look at the sky."

Really, it's true. But you do have to be high to think Glenn Beck makes sense.

And don't talk to scientists about magnets or climate change, because there is an international scientist conspiracy to lie to us about both.

Are Juggalos just Beckerheads in make-up? There are disturbing similarities. Where's a chalkboard when I need one?

Posted by: michael_conrad | August 28, 2010 4:33 PM | Report abuse

@ marybel9999 | August 28, 2010 4:31 PM:

For the record, I read most of the thread to and I have to tell you, I didn't really see much in the way fear or hatred. Plenty of ridicule and disgust, but that might have something to do with the fact that Glenn Beck is in fact pretty ridiculous, in an often disgusting sort of way.

Posted by: CalD | August 28, 2010 4:41 PM | Report abuse

I understand the Beck/Palin rally was predominantly white people. It really is time that white people took back ownership of the civil rights movement from the blacks who kidnapped it for their selfish and inherently racist purposes.

Posted by: bernielatham | August 28, 2010 4:47 PM | Report abuse

@marybel9999

Fear, no. Hatred... borderline yes, at least on my part.

I live in the heart of Beck Country, and I've seen just what this virulent idiot has done to people. You have no idea how many exchanges I've had with family, friends, neighbors over this guys garbage.

When he calls me part of a cancer, you can rest assured I'm going to hit back in whatever way I can. (Though I was hitting back long before CPAC.)

Beneath comment? No. Beneath contempt. Yes.

http://www.progressiveblue.com/diary/5571/glenn-becks-character

Look, he really is THAT stupid... and beyond reckless.
I don't believe in intellectual, moral, and political welfare for prominent vile know-nothing megalomaniacal nutjobs. Glenn Beck is a chronically weepy amoral piece of crap. If he doesn't want to get to called out on being one, he should stop being one.

Until then, mock him until hell freezes over, and then mock him on the ice. (h/t David Van Os)

Posted by: michael_conrad | August 28, 2010 4:49 PM | Report abuse

As a Vietnam Vet...I've had enough of this faux patriotism. Complete cowards like DICK 5 deferrment Cheney are rewarded with millions and millions for sending our boys overseas to die in two unnecessary wars.

Demagogues like Glen Beck are allowed to lie and distort and prance around like rodeo clowns in front of one of our most sacred Monuments. And I went overseas so idiots like Marybel and the rest can whine about their taxes when they are now at
THE LOWEST LEVEL SINCE 1950!!!
Here's an idea...how about if you don't wish to pay for your country's expenses you simply leave! There are a couple of million latinos and people from every culture who would be glad to come to our country...take your place...and pay their taxes. Unlike you they are not asking for something for nothing and they probably understand that people making more than a million dollars aren't really suffering and do not need any more tax relief.

Think Glen Beck ever had the cojones to serve his country. Let's see how large the expenses are on this beckapalooza. Remember the pope of the tea partiers agreed to donate all the proceeds from this even to the worthy Tampa charity that helps our Vets. Lets see how much the 32 million dollar man and his grifter companion the Wasilla Hillbilly take from these appearances...perhaps glen picked up some more $ selling those overvalued gold coins to his legions of idiots...

I'm done...besides John Fogarty said it so well during our war and the lyrics still apply....

Fortunate Son

Some folks are born made to wave the flag,
ooh, they're red, white and blue.
And when the band plays "Hail To The Chief",
oh, they point the cannon at you, Lord,

It ain't me, it ain't me,
I ain't no senator's son,
It ain't me, it ain't me,
I ain't no fortunate one, no,

Some folks are born silver spoon in hand,
Lord, don't they help themselves? oh.
BUT WHEN THE TAXMAN COME TO THE DOOR
Lord, the house look a like a rummage sale, yes,

It ain't me, it ain't me,
I ain't no millionaire's son, no, no.
It ain't me, it ain't me,
I ain't no fortunate one, no.

Yeh, some folks inherit star spangled eyes,
ooh, they send you down to war, Lord,
And when you ask them, how much should we give,
oh, they only answer, more, more, more, yoh,

Posted by: rukidding7 | August 28, 2010 4:50 PM | Report abuse

I take back what I said yesterday. It would appear that Bernie ~does~ do humor after all.

Posted by: CalD | August 28, 2010 5:05 PM | Report abuse

@rukidding7

Your comment wins the day, for numerous reasons. "Fortunate Son" is one of the all-time greats.

Thank you for your service.

Posted by: michael_conrad | August 28, 2010 5:11 PM | Report abuse

Digby on Dick Armey's real constituency, as evidenced by his non-base position on immigration - it is the Chamber of Commerce position... http://digbysblog.blogspot.com/2010/08/weak-teabag.html

But that is who Armey always works for and it's how he's become a multi-millionaire. And traces of sincerity in concern for citizens en masse aren't terribly convincing. This guy is a serious jerk.

Posted by: bernielatham | August 28, 2010 5:12 PM | Report abuse

Thank you Michael. It's reading posts like yours that make me realize the entire country hasn't had a sudden attack of August lunacy. What is it about August that brings out the wack jobs?

Posted by: rukidding7 | August 28, 2010 5:15 PM | Report abuse

@CalD - new meds

Posted by: bernielatham | August 28, 2010 5:19 PM | Report abuse

Kevin Drum gives us the quote of the day, from Dick Armey...

"One of the things that we see as we look at Glenn Beck's work that's been fascinating to me, is we see a more true and accurate history of the United States, and we see it documented at levels of rigor that, in fact, one would expect out of Ph.D. dissertations — it is serious, scholarly work....[Liberal critics] don’t have to argue with Glenn Beck. They have to argue with his documentation and they can’t match that level of rigor."

As Drum adds, "just shoot me now".

Posted by: bernielatham | August 28, 2010 5:49 PM | Report abuse

Heh.

http://blogs.thetimes-tribune.com/johncole/wp-content/uploads/2010/08/082810coletoon.jpg

Posted by: suekzoo1 | August 28, 2010 5:53 PM | Report abuse

bernie-

He was an economics prof (as you may already know) at my alma mater, NTSU, here in Denton. Oy.

voodoo economics, that is...

Posted by: ChuckinDenton | August 28, 2010 6:14 PM | Report abuse

sue-

Nice. My 'toon of Abe woulda had a slighly different finger positioning (as I alluded to waaaay upthread).

Posted by: ChuckinDenton | August 28, 2010 6:17 PM | Report abuse

"He was an economics prof (as you may already know) at my alma mater, NTSU, here in Denton. Oy."

Hey....I went to NTSU, too. Only for awhile, though. Too much time spent on Fry Street. Finished my degree up elsewhere. Good times, good times......

Posted by: schrodingerscat | August 28, 2010 6:21 PM | Report abuse

From a Balloon Juicer:

"It strikes me the that today’s rally attendees, unlike those who attended the King event, are protesting their “suffering” that is the results of the policies enacted by the politicians they’ve been voting for since 1980."

Ain't that the truth.

Posted by: suekzoo1 | August 28, 2010 6:29 PM | Report abuse

Heh II - Celebrate the Dream, Reject the Nightmare

http://blogs.seattleweekly.com/dailyweekly/glenn%20beck%20martin%20luther%20king%20jr%20flowchart.jpg

Posted by: suekzoo1 | August 28, 2010 6:31 PM | Report abuse

Wow, you guys were really interested in the Beck rally. I'm impressed. I haven't watched a second of it. I do lime Palin, but the whole rally on the mall sounded boring to me. Unless it was going to be a chance for Forrest Gump and Jenny to reunite, I'm just not that interested.

I did watch the first bit of Wallace and Grommet's a Mayter of Loaf and Death. "Electronic Surveillance for Dogs". Brilliant!

Posted by: Kevin_Willis | August 28, 2010 6:34 PM | Report abuse

@Chuck - Yes, I did know. What can one say?

Posted by: bernielatham | August 28, 2010 6:36 PM | Report abuse

There were, like, a Billion. Easy.

"Rep. Michele Bachmann (R-Minn.), speaking soon after the Beck rally at her own impromptu event nearby, said: "We're not going to let anyone get away with saying there were less than a million here today - because we were witnesses."" http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/08/28/AR2010082801106.html?hpid=topnews

Posted by: bernielatham | August 28, 2010 6:55 PM | Report abuse

"CBS News estimates that there were approximately 87,000 people at the rally. The estimate was made using aerial photos taken at noon, which was judged to be the height of the event. The estimate has a margin of error of 9,000 people. "

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503544_162-20014986-503544.html?tag=stack

Posted by: schrodingerscat | August 28, 2010 7:00 PM | Report abuse

The PR people running today's Wackapalooza would have had several goals:

- limit or eliminate the sorts of racist and seriously nutty visuals that earlier Tea Party events produced in abundance

- get as many bodies there as possible (and then, as Bachmann predictably does, lie and increase) to promote the perception of citizen consensus

- try to suggest that Glenn Beck and Sarah Palin and all those white folks are closer heirs to the MLK and civil rights history than a black president and those who voted for him (yes, it's insane)

- try to wrest the narrative away from anything approximating a libertarian social message while hoping those folks don't notice and the religious right component does (thus all the God talk)

This last one is, in a way, the most interesting because its probably the key problem for building a consensus between the Ron Paulites and the more typical Republican base which the movement MUST achieve to be successful over the next two cycles.

Posted by: bernielatham | August 28, 2010 7:24 PM | Report abuse

The Tea is stronger than ever, you're just in denial. Actually it's the left that's falling apart. And, I'd rather listen to a hundred self-titled "rodeo clowns" than myopic liberals bent on destroying everything that is great about the best country in the world. Socialism has been tried and has failed everywhere it's been implemented. Heard about Greece lately? November should be very interesting. Comments welcome!

Posted by: gmas4bgsrgr8 | August 28, 2010 7:26 PM | Report abuse

Of all the people whose opinion I would respect, I would put "self professed rodeo clowns" near the bottom. I don't think that the paramount political choice in the U.S. is between socialism and rodeo clown intellectuals.

Posted by: 12BarBlues | August 28, 2010 7:35 PM | Report abuse

@gmas - Well, I think Israel is the best country in the world. For example, life expectancy there is markedly higher than that of citizens in the US.

Posted by: bernielatham | August 28, 2010 7:38 PM | Report abuse

ps - that's according to CIA data which I think we can trust

Posted by: bernielatham | August 28, 2010 7:39 PM | Report abuse

But on second thought, perhaps that's not an appropriate measure for "best country" as Israel and many of the 48 other nations which enjoy longer lives than Americans have a socialized medical system... https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/rankorder/2102rank.html

Probably we ought instead to use the OECD research on happiness of citizens in their respective nations where America places...well, not sure but apparently not in the first 10 (all of which have, oddly, socialized medicine)... http://www.tripbase.com/blog/top-10-happiest-countries-in-the-world/

But there's bound to be some measure that proves dead cold that the US is the "best" country in the world. Let me keep looking because you must have this right.

Posted by: bernielatham | August 28, 2010 7:48 PM | Report abuse

I know! The US will surely be the "best" country in the world because of the lack of crime.

Actually, boy that's a surprise, the US incarcerates a higher percentage of its citizens than any other nation in the world.

But I'm not giving up here, gmas. Hand in there.

Posted by: bernielatham | August 28, 2010 7:53 PM | Report abuse

I'll help gmas. The U.S. spends the most on healthcare per person in the world. Also, we spend dramatically more than anyone else on defense. That, of course, leads to record profits of benefiting corporations. And out of those record profits comes ginormous lobbying funds to keep the U.S. spending more than any one else on the globe.

Of course, maybe gmas didn't mean that.

Posted by: 12BarBlues | August 28, 2010 7:59 PM | Report abuse

Got it! Addiction to drugs like cocaine is simply bound to be almost negligible in the best country in the world. Bound to be. Checking now...

Dang. WHO tells us http://www.who.int/substance_abuse/facts/en/index.html
that cocaine use/addiction is highest in developed or producing countries but higher in the US than other developing nations. I shan't quit though. Stay tuned.

Posted by: bernielatham | August 28, 2010 8:02 PM | Report abuse

Murder? Wow, the US has a whole bunch of countries beat on this one like Venezuela and South Africa and Jamaica! There are actually, get this, 23 countries where murder is more common than the best country in the world. Sure, there's nearly 40 where fewer citizens get murdered by their neighbors but we're making real progress here.
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_mur_percap-crime-murders-per-capita

Posted by: bernielatham | August 28, 2010 8:08 PM | Report abuse

So, the Troubled Masses came "from all over" to hear their new Messiah and Sistah P. They talked about crossroads, darkness, and Gone with the Wind. Frankly, it's what right-winged folks do when their party is out of power; they have always had a hard time dealing with it. As if starting two wars, creating the largest deficit in history, and hosting the greatest financial meltdown since the Great Depression was not enough for them. I wonder what they collectively have in store for this Great Country, next?

Posted by: dozas | August 28, 2010 8:11 PM | Report abuse

"Actually it's the left that's falling apart. And, I'd rather listen to a hundred self-titled "rodeo clowns" than myopic liberals bent on destroying everything that is great about the best country in the world. "

Best at what? Infant mortality? Nope - 46th according to the CIA World Factbook. Life expectancy? Nope - 50th. Social Mobility? Nope - according to a recent study the US is well below Canada and the Nordic countries. Math? Nope - 28th. Reading? Nope - 18th. Science? Wrong again - 22nd.

On the brightside, the US is #1 in the developed world for teen births! Woo Hoo! USA! USA! USA!

Posted by: schrodingerscat | August 28, 2010 8:17 PM | Report abuse

And feel free to comment at any point, gmas. Probably you've got something in mind that will make the convincing case for "best" country in the whole dagnab world.

Posted by: bernielatham | August 28, 2010 8:18 PM | Report abuse

Thanks 12bar! (just saw your post now). And you gave us just the metric we need.

The US sells more weapons to the rest of the world than any other nation! Top of the heap. Best of the best. http://www.boston.com/news/world/articles/2006/11/13/us_is_top_purveyor_on_weapons_sales_list/

Posted by: bernielatham | August 28, 2010 8:22 PM | Report abuse

I should add too my own guess (no good science to back this one up) that the US is the best country in the world if we measure how many Americans are willing to believe that there country is the best in the world regardless of any and all information which might lead to another conclusion all together. Quite possibly top dog on this measure.

What do you think, gmas?

Posted by: bernielatham | August 28, 2010 8:30 PM | Report abuse

And just saw your helpful help, schrod. Thanks for chipping in. Though gmas is surely the strong silent (American) type and has no internal need to be bolstered in his certainties, just as a matter of intellectual integrity it is a fine thing to point out that other aspect in which America is "best".

Posted by: bernielatham | August 28, 2010 8:33 PM | Report abuse

Fire at Tenn. Mosque Building Site Ruled Arson

Construction Equipment at Site of Planned Islamic Center Torched; Vocal Protests Against Mosque Have Been Ongoing

(CBS/AP) Federal officials are investigating a fire that started overnight at the site of a new Islamic center in a Nashville suburb.

Ben Goodwin of the Rutherford County Sheriff's Department confirmed to CBS Affiliate WTVF that the fire, which burned construction equipment at the future site of the Islamic Center of Murfreesboro, is being ruled as arson.

WTVF reports firefighters were alerted by a passerby who saw flames at the site. One large earth hauler was set on fire before the suspect or suspects left the scene.

The chair of the center's planning committee, Essim Fathy, said he drove to the site at around 5:30 a.m. this morning after he was contacted by the sheriff's department.

"Our people and community are so worried of what else can happen," said Fathy. "They are so scared."

The fire was smoldering by the time Fathy and the center's imam, Ossama Bahloul, had arrived. Fathy was told that responders had smelled gasoline near the fire, but would not say it was caused by arson.

"They didn't say that," said Fathy. "But of course it looks like somebody did that."

Fathy was later contacted by members of the FBI and the Department of Homeland Security, who told him the incident was under investigation and to remain calm.

Digging had begun at the site, which was planned as a place of worship for the approximately 250 Muslim families in the Murfreesboro area, but no structure had been built yet, according to Saleh Sbenaty, a member of the planning committee and a professor of engineering technology at Middle Tennessee State University.

"This is a shock," said Sbenaty. "We've had small act of vandals. But this is going to be a crime and whoever did it, they should be punished to the full extent of the law."

The center had operated for years out of a small business suite. Planning members said the new building, which was being constructed next to a church, would help accommodate the area's growing Muslim community.

"We unfortunately did not experience hostilities for the 30 years we've been here and have only seen the hostility since approval of the site plan for the new center," said Sbenaty.

Opponents of a new Islamic center say they believe the mosque will be more than a place of prayer; they are afraid the 15-acre site that was once farmland will be turned into a terrorist training ground for Muslim militants bent on overthrowing the U.S. government.

"They are not a religion. They are a political, militaristic group," Bob Shelton, a 76-year-old retiree who lives in the area, told The Associated Press.

Shelton was among several hundred demonstrators who recently wore "Vote for Jesus" T-shirts and carried signs that said "No Sharia law for USA!," referring to the Islamic code of law.

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2010/08/28/national/

Posted by: suekzoo1 | August 28, 2010 8:49 PM | Report abuse

Nothing to see here.

"ALBANY, N.Y. (AP) -- New numbers confirm what the sweaty brows of Northeasterners have been saying for months: The summer of 2010 was a record-breaking scorcher.

Preliminary figures provided by the Northeast Regional Climate Center at Cornell University on Friday show 28 cities from Washington, D.C., to Caribou, Maine, set record highs for average temperature from March through August."
http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2010/08/28/us/AP-US-Hot-Summer.html?ref=news

Posted by: bernielatham | August 28, 2010 9:07 PM | Report abuse

Hey, Schrod-

Yeah, Fry Street. Good to hear from another Dentonite, if only for a while. Cheers!

Posted by: ChuckinDenton | August 28, 2010 9:36 PM | Report abuse

B,

The hockey-stickers insisted in the strongest terms this winter that DC under ten feet of snow (twice) was not, not, not indicative of evidence for you know what denial due to it's regional nature and short seasonal sample etc., etc. and so forth, {via hacked e-mail}.

Make up your superior, scientific, expert consensus minds for Gaia's sake, willya.

Posted by: tao9 | August 28, 2010 9:41 PM | Report abuse

BTW, y'all spent all day watchin' Beck--indoors, on TV or stream {while baseball was on also if you're gonna be a veg inside); on the 2nd2last weekend of summer; on at least in the "scorching" NE, a beautiful day. And you posted it! {giggle}

heads...space rented

Posted by: tao9 | August 28, 2010 9:53 PM | Report abuse

From Dick Armey's interview on CBC...

"King was spreading the message, "Let's have a nation in unity... Let's talk about the character of the nation," Armey told CBS News chief Washington correspondent Bob Schieffer on CBSNews.com's Washington Unplugged. "This is exactly what Glenn Beck's doing."

Exactly. And then comes this...

"Schieffer pointed out that some people are upset because of Beck's past, racially divisive comments, such as saying that President Obama "has a deep-seated hatred for white people or the white culture."

"I've never heard him say these things," Armey said."
http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503544_162-20014949-503544.html

Armey is a lying sack of excrement, but that's a known known.

As morally and intellectually despicable and as destructive, is Bob Schieffer and the CBS bookers who give Armey this platform and fail to put his head on a pike after this sort of outright deceit.

Posted by: bernielatham | August 28, 2010 10:11 PM | Report abuse

Bernie, just caught your response and I assumed you would select that out of Greenwald's piece, and I totally agree as far as it goes. I think we were all somewhat shocked that during a national economic emergency, with a President who really did want and hope to be able to lead us out of the abyss across party lines, that he faced such a well endowed and committed opposition party.

I do think it's important to highlight the lack of seriousness and outright lies and revisions of recent history the GOP engages in with the help of Fox and Friends (Murdoch), Limbaugh, Palin etc., but there are other issues we need to address as well and I think in the long run they are more important. We all choose our battles and while I respect your research and comments, I'm not sure I totally agree with lowering our discourse to their level. Just me though, I'm not wired that way.

We need to face the fact that our government is still largely controlled by corporate power and influence and respond accordingly. Whichever "Masters of the Universe" who were working against the middle class in the last three decades are still enjoying their influence as well as enriching themselves at the expense of the majority of Americans. Perhaps around the edges we've made a few changes and I'll celebrate that, but we have "miles and miles to go before we sleep".

For anyone here still downplaying the deficit commissions work and the risk it poses to Social Security, I hope you will continue to indulge my comments and links. We have compromised on so many liberal issues already but this is really AFAIC, a line in the sand. Are they working on REAL ways to cut the deficit, does anyone know, or is SS the main program they've set their sights on? If it is, and I don't know because it's a secret society of sorts, then they are spitting on a 75 year old program that has been historically one of the most successful government programs ever.


Posted by: lmsinca | August 28, 2010 10:16 PM | Report abuse

We need to do better. People are truly suffering almost two years after the crash of the banking system, the housing market and Wall Street, we're in charge for better or worse, and I think we really need to get to work.

We need to read, understand, and work to change the dynamics here.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Not only are people pessimistic about the overall economy, they have a strong sense that the deck is stacked against regular people. The poll found only 35 percent of Americans think everyone has a fair chance to get ahead, while 62 percent believe that only a few people at the top that have a chance to prosper in today’s economy. Combined, these numbers paint a picture of an incredibly unhopeful country that doesn’t think change is possible. For a president and a party that tried to brand themselves as the embodiment of hope and the agents of change, these are bad numbers.

The economy is growing very slowly, but, most importantly from a political perspective, regular people feel it is getting worse. The voters are naturally going to blame the party in power, Democrats, for the economic failings. This should be terrifying to elected Democrats because it looks, as we approach November, that there are likely to be more and more, not fewer, voters who feel the economy is getting worse. November could be even worse than the poll currently indicates.

Yet, as the economy stagnates and Senate Dems re-election prospects evaporate around them, do they rush to pass grand, WPA-style direct employment legislation to deal with the lack of jobs, or legislation to provide real relief for homeowners who were not helped by the ineffective, illiberal HAMP program (which has proven to be the Obama administration’s way of slighting homeowners to help banks profit)? No, because that would require dealing with the silly, broken, made-up rules and “traditions” of their chamber. That would bring accountability to the Senate, which is the one thing they fear most of all.

Instead, Democrats will blame the mean old, tiny Senate Republican minority, pretending the Majority’s hands are tied while obscuring their own failings by screaming about how crazy the new crop of Republican candidates are. (By the way, that part is true.–this new crop of Republicans hold some scary positions.)

h/t Jon Walker

Posted by: lmsinca | August 28, 2010 10:26 PM | Report abuse

lms,

"...a President who really did want and hope to be able to lead us out of the abyss across party lines..."

A question: how did President Obama demonstrate this? The stimulus?

Posted by: tao9 | August 28, 2010 10:29 PM | Report abuse

@tao - As a matter of free will, you're tongue ought to be allowed wherever you wish it to go.

But as we both understand, global warming models predict two phenomena:

1) overall warming trends (which are occurring)

2) increased variables and extremities in weather phenomena (which are occurring)

Posted by: bernielatham | August 28, 2010 10:29 PM | Report abuse

@Ims - I don't disagree that a stronger push towards the sort of role for government you and I see as not merely beneficial but necessary would be a fine thing indeed. And along with it, a PR drive as loud or louder than that which opposes. My notions are best guesses so far as my education and wits allow me to figure things out. Your notions and comments are treasured, just so you know.

Posted by: bernielatham | August 28, 2010 10:35 PM | Report abuse

@tao - please lay out for us what situation we'd be in without the (Bush administration initiated) stimulus?

Posted by: bernielatham | August 28, 2010 10:38 PM | Report abuse

For those interested in the performance of propaganda as carried out in the context of modern America, tune in to Fox and Friends with guest Glenn Beck... http://blogs.orlandosentinel.com/entertainment_tv_tvblog/2010/08/fox-news-sunday-to-showcase-glenn-beck.html

Posted by: bernielatham | August 28, 2010 10:42 PM | Report abuse

"Meteorologists caution against reading too much into the hot weather, saying such a short-term weather pattern alone cannot be interpreted as a sign of global climate change."

Bernie,

That graf is from the article you cited!
Do you even read what you post?

What's with the Royal "We" lately.

Golly, as a matter of free will, you're ego ought to be allowed wherever you wish it to go, but PL docent ain't the place.

Posted by: tao9 | August 28, 2010 10:51 PM | Report abuse

Bernie, the east was hot, the west was cool and in South America it was a downright frigid winter for awhile. As the scientists say, "weather is not climate".

http://wattsupwiththat.com/2010/08/28/nature-notices-the-cold-global-warming-blamed/#more-24026

Posted by: actuator | August 28, 2010 11:04 PM | Report abuse

I believe that this probably pretty accurately describes the president's religious orientation.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/ali-a-rizvi/barack-obama-closeted-non_b_692751.html

Posted by: actuator | August 28, 2010 11:17 PM | Report abuse

tao, Obama ran a campaign, especially after Sept. 08, of bringing the country together to fix not only the economy but Washington as well. He didn't put a bunch of "lunatic left" or "professional left" folks on his transition team, but rather stacked it with economists and advisers, who were known to work across party lines, and were more centrist in economic persuasion.

He DID reach out to the minority and was met with both resistance and negative exaggeration of his ideology. In order to pass the stimulus, HCR, and financial regulation the Administration both incorporated well known conservative ideas and also bent over backwards, a little too far in my opinion, to compromise on policy that should have been less influenced by both lobbyists and two or three Republican votes.

The dialogue of the nation was steered toward "socialism, neo-marxism, Acorn, blah, blah, blah, instead of "how the hell are we going to plug the leak in this sinking ship"?

We can debate the best economic policy all day or the best way to repair the broken health care system which some claim is superior to every other industrialized country or we can debate whether Obama was born in Kenya, he's a secret Muslim, or Glenn Beck is a Rodeo Clown, Sarah Palin is a "fundie" and Limbaugh is a racist or not. I'll take economic policy thank you very much.

I don't personally object to those other debates but it does seem to minimize the real issues and who the hell is going to actually address them. I'm not overly impressed with Democrats in Congress right now but I'd lay down with them over the Tea Party or right wing ideology any day.

Posted by: lmsinca | August 28, 2010 11:21 PM | Report abuse

For what it's worth, I'm with imsinca on Social Security.

SS benefit reductions have absolutely no place in an honest discussion about the long-term budget deficit. Suggestions to the contrary are absurd on their face.

A recommendations "package" that unnecessarily weakens Social Security, and then is put to a vote in a lame duck session is plausible.

There are precious few votes on the commission that represent the mainstream of the Democratic Party (progressives, populists, or standard Ds) on the Commission. It is stacked with right-wingers, and a combination of Blue Dog, DLC, and Hamilton Project Democrats.

Bruce Reed is the point person Yay! Team I Love The 90's! And it's meeting in secret. SS cut is hardly a conspiracy theory. It's certainly plausible. And it's not something Democratic rank and file would go along with if it was taking place in the light of day.

How would they get to 14 votes?

Republican votes - 5: Alan Simpson, David Cote, Judd Gregg, Mike Crapo, David Camp,

Simpson already took on the Reagan Myth (not afraid to anger conservatives) and he's not in elected office anymore. Gregg won't be soon. Cote isn't. Camp has been around forever.

Possible defectors from the right are Jeb Hensarling, Tom Coburn, and Paul Ryan, because the package would have to be something the far-right won't like to give the Dems a fig leaf. "Have this pickle with your crap sandwich, Democratic base" basically.

Is Coburn even interested in a 3rd term (he will have just been elected to his 2nd... IIRC, he has made a big deal out of not wanting to be in DC for too long), and is plenty conservative on other things to mitigate any damage.

Ryan and Hensarling are both trying to make deficit mania a signature issue, so they could go along with it.

Democratic votes - 5: Max Baucus, Kent Conrad, John Spratt, Alice Rivlin, Ann Fudge

We're at 10.

Coburn, Ryan, Hensarlin
Durbin, Stern

4 of those 5 do the trick.

Generally, I like Dick Durbin. But do I trust him to buck the White House if they go for this? Not really. Stern likes to be contrarian.

In other words, yeah... the threat is basically real. It's at least plausible. And in a lame duck session, significant # of GOPers + Blue Dogs + close WH allies makes a majority.

And who trusts the WH's approach to negotiations? Because there's a good case to make that this is not their strong suit.

At any rate, hell no to SS cuts. They're simply indefensible.

Posted by: michael_conrad | August 28, 2010 11:27 PM | Report abuse

Tao9: Next time it snows in January, will you remember your 'meteorologists caution' line, or call Al Gore fat?

Posted by: Tangerine3 | August 28, 2010 11:35 PM | Report abuse

lms,

I genuinely wonder (fly on the wall at the Exec mtgs) how the President received the various recommendations of his econ team. Romer is no Keynesian, and Summers is lukewarm on the demand side to boot. Who pushed the stim?

The construction side hasn't happened, even yet. The tax cut has expired. The states have already spent the aid for Medicaid, teachers and state employees. Romer knew this would blip the GDP up, due to the govt. outlays component of that metric, but also knew that was the end of it's utility and also that it would have minimal effect on employment. That's why she left the admin..

The benificiaries of the stim and fin/reg seem to have been local/state/fed beauracracies, Wall Street w/ Goldman Sachs ascendant, and if you look a little elsewhere, GM/Chrysler/UAW. These are all the home constituencies of the Dem Congressional leadership.

HCR and the proposed tax reform policies have resulted in universal uncertainty in the private sector. The sense of drift of this admin has created a serious deflation of confidence in the populace.

Increased demand is often cited as the required tonic for the economy. Uncertainty and non-confidence decimate demand.

I believe Mr. Obama's intentions were those WE all believed in, because I gave him the benefit of the doubt at the outset because he was MY president, also.

I think he has been ill advised, and quite simply, at this point hasn't the experience or temperament to see he has actually exacerbated the serious errors of Mr. Bush. He's boxed himself, and will now quite likely have to learn how to govern with a divided Congress.

Posted by: tao9 | August 28, 2010 11:55 PM | Report abuse

Michael, we need you here to keep working the numbers on the deficit commission. We already settled for a bi-partisan stimulus, an industry friendly HCR bill which left out both drug re-importation and the PO, a mortgage modification program that puts off the inevitable crash, no word yet on Warren to head the CFPB, and a surge in Afghanistan.

I can somehow deal with all of that, but if SS benefit cuts become the new poster child for faux bi-partisan deficit reduction I think it will be time to take to the streets. Seriously, the "professional left" has it's limits, LOL.

Posted by: lmsinca | August 28, 2010 11:58 PM | Report abuse

lms,

Agree w/ you on the sideline stuff: it is the tactical Lilliputian play. But it's baseball. Happened to Bubba, definitely happened to W (any news/slug asked Obama what he regrets yet, or if what his worst mistake has been? Uh, no).

The blare of the Fox, et.al. megaphone is deceiving. They still all only reach 20 million people or so...Limbaugh included.
And I bet a 1/6 of them are libs, plus all the unfortunate interns and droids at MediaMatters and ThinkRegress.

Posted by: tao9 | August 29, 2010 12:05 AM | Report abuse

lms,

If you take it to the streets you'll probably need some security. I won't necessarily always agree with you, but it won't effect my job performance.

I also understand Riverside is lovely.
;>)

Posted by: tao9 | August 29, 2010 12:10 AM | Report abuse

schrodingerscat, I would have thought that 10:40 am (Palin's speech) was the height of crowd estimates.

Posted by: clawrence12 | August 29, 2010 12:21 AM | Report abuse

Thanks Tao, my hubby hates it when I get all funky for protesting but then he tells everyone about my latest shenanigans sort of proudly while sort of admitting the "crazy relative syndrome". I guess it depends who he's talking to.

Also, agree re Fox, not that huge of an audience, but their waves travel beyond the studio.

Posted by: lmsinca | August 29, 2010 12:32 AM | Report abuse

"HCR and the proposed tax reform policies have resulted in universal uncertainty in the private sector. The sense of drift of this admin has created a serious deflation of confidence in the populace.

Increased demand is often cited as the required tonic for the economy. Uncertainty and non-confidence decimate demand."

tao, after reading this statement a second time I have to heartily disagree. It's sort of a "which came first" statement. Considering the fact that the private sector is now sitting on some 1+Trillion dollars and the banks have rebounded with money to lend but no demand, it's time to actually put workers back to work. I'm open to suggestions, but IMO we need a "radical" demand side program to get it done. I doubt it will happen now if it didn't happen when we really had the chance over a year ago.

I think we're really looking at stagnation if Dems control the Legislative branch going forward with a smaller majority and a backwards slide if Repubs take over. Either way, the middle class suffers.

Posted by: lmsinca | August 29, 2010 1:04 AM | Report abuse

@tao - You've got a point in that I ought not to have underlined the local and temporary and given it an overdue relevance. Sorry, I was grumpy. But on the other hand, as I noted, the climate models predict just what we are seeing and that's not nothing.

Those of us old enough or interested enough to follow this "debate" over the last three decades have seen an evolution not just in the science but in the PR campaigns run out of corporate-funded PR agencies. First - "It ain't happening" to "It's happening but it's happened before and it's cyclical and not man-made" to "It's partially man-made but that's still in doubt for some and besides it will hurt more to do anything about it than not". Not to mention the claims of how grand it will be when the mid-west can put in acres and acres of orchids rather than boring old wheat.

The over-arching and most critical facts in all of this are 1) the overwhelming scientific consensus on the fact and the cause of global warming and 2) the investment of (now, surely) billions of dollars in PR funded by related industries (often hidden as to sourcing via front groups) to invalidate the science and to move policy in a direction which will protect their bottom line absolutely regardless of any broader moral or ethical concerns.

Posted by: bernielatham | August 29, 2010 8:18 AM | Report abuse

The totalitarian-minded notion of rights is that they apply only as convenient to the wishes of those holding power. It is absolutely predictable that this mindset will insist that citizens must, as a matter of patriotic duty, forgo the practice of such rights because the expression/practice of those rights threatens the continuation of those rights. Rumsfeld is a case in point. So is Netanyahu.

A group of Israeli actors boycott performances in settlement territories and Netanyahu says (though he sure doesn't want to suppress any rights):

"The last thing we need at this time, when we are under such assault, is a boycott attempt from within ourselves."
http://www.nytimes.com/reuters/2010/08/29/news/news-us-palestinians-israel-theatre.html?hp

Posted by: bernielatham | August 29, 2010 8:54 AM | Report abuse

@lmsinca Your 11:27PM post was excellent!
Well thought out and written and even Tao became flummoxed.

@tao You had to resort to the lame conservative sputter...they did it to Bush as well...using the example of "the is there anything you regret?" Obama is certainly to get that question...meanwhile I NEVER heard a SINGLE Democratic legislator approach an important issue...the wars..Bush's drug plan...with the attitude and an actual statement that totally ignored issues and called for pure obstruction and Bush's "Waterloo". I never saw corporate funded astroturf groups, such as we saw during the HCR debate from people like Rick "Scum" Scott..the Koch brothers...DICK Armey...these are all well documented.

And while I agree that Fox itself reaches only a small part of America...it has been an agenda setter for the MSM...even staging and producing "tea party new confederate" rallies...with their producers standing off camera and directing crowd behavior as if it's spontaneous...again there is photographic evidence of this.

And tao as for your point about Romer not being a Keynesian...not sure...but she was certainly for a "Keynesian" stimulus big time. You are certainly aware she resigned because of friction with Summers.
That friction began when Obama asked his advisors for 3 different stimulus amounts.
Romer was in favor of the HIGHEST amount realizing that the lesser two would have precisely the effect the chosen one had...a jolt to the economy for a couple of quarters and then run out of steam.
Summers did not even present the highest amount for Obama to consider because Summers didn't want that amount. This cheesed Romer and was the beginning of the the vaunted Summers-Romer feud which existed because Summers had access to Obama and Romer did not.

Posted by: rukidding7 | August 29, 2010 9:26 AM | Report abuse

BTW tao does make an excellent point about the limited reach of Fox and talk radio.

Take yestersday's prayer meeting...errr..rally. So far the only credible source I've heard or read is CBS news analysis of 87,000 +- 5,000. That puts the crowd at 100,000.

Now imagine if Lady Gaga held a "love and peace" rally and MSNBC ala Faux News gave it several months of heavy promotion. Do you think there would have only been less than 100,000, and her audience would have featured far greater diversity. Yes to put things in perspective Lady Gaga is more influential than Glen Beck...not only in this country but worldwide.

Now the obvious retort from a smart conservative like tao or Kevin will be..but do Gaga's concert goers vote? Beck's audience does.

And so that is the real question about the midterms. The GOTV. Will millions sit on their hands and let 90,000 people move the country in a direction that is the polar opposite or middle class interests.

Posted by: rukidding7 | August 29, 2010 9:34 AM | Report abuse

All, my take on the Glenn Beck and Sarah Palin rally yesterday:

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/plum-line/2010/08/beck_and_palin.html

Posted by: Greg Sargent | August 29, 2010 9:42 AM | Report abuse

"And tao as for your point about Romer not being a Keynesian...not sure...but she was certainly for a "Keynesian" stimulus big time. You are certainly aware she resigned because of friction with Summers. That friction began when Obama asked his advisors for 3 different stimulus amounts. Romer was in favor of the HIGHEST amount realizing that the lesser two would have precisely the effect the chosen one had...a jolt to the economy for a couple of quarters and then run out of steam.
Summers did not even present the highest amount for Obama to consider because Summers didn't want that amount. This cheesed Romer and was the beginning of the the vaunted Summers-Romer feud which existed because Summers had access to Obama and Romer did not."

Well explained, ruk. That's how I've read it too. There is only one thing I have ever with John Boehner about and it is that Summers and Geightner should get canned. Alas, I suspect the stimulus decision-making was far more political than economic.

Incidentally, there was a story in the NY Times today about a recent economic symposium.

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/08/29/business/economy/29fed.html?_r=1&ref=business

The story is matter-of-fact but the economists are saying that things are bleak and are going to get bleaker. Unsettling.

Posted by: wbgonne | August 29, 2010 1:02 PM | Report abuse

Just wondering how you found the tea this morning, Greg. Of course you might have been one of the media that reported about 1,000 people showed up to hear Glenn and his guests, I don't know. By all accounts of the people who want to admit what happened, there where in excess of 500,000 "poor lost souls"- NOT- who showed up. I think the tea is brewing extra strong these days. And such a short time until November! I'll be the first to eat my words if the Dems hold the House, but it's not looking so good.

Posted by: gmas4bgsrgr8 | August 29, 2010 8:30 PM | Report abuse

I enjoyed the responses to my post. I'm thinking that if I didn't think this was the best country on earth, I'd be living where I thought it was.

Posted by: gmas4bgsrgr8 | August 30, 2010 2:16 PM | Report abuse

A crowd of 500,000 is "weak tea"?! Talk about unrealistic expectations.

Posted by: JakeD2 | August 30, 2010 4:22 PM | Report abuse

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