Network News

X My Profile
View More Activity
Posted at 8:35 AM ET, 03/ 9/2011

The Morning Plum

By Greg Sargent

* Scott Walker, feeling heat, suggests compromise with labor and Dems: The Milwakee Journal Sentinal posts newly-released emails showing that Governor Scott Walker is privately floating ideas for a compromise with missing Democrats in order to find a way out of the standoff. Walker proposes to restore bargaining rights in certain areas and to allow unions to vote less often to remain active.

Labor and Dems dismiss the moves as laughably insufficient, pointing out that Walker's proposal still sharply limits bargaining rights in some crucial areas, and they argue that Walker is merely trying to create the appearance of an interest in compromise. But it's significant that Walker, under pressure, now feels the political need to drop his wholly uncompromising stance and refusal to negotiate -- both of which had won him plaudits from the right.

Indeed, Walker's offer suggests that he and Republicans know they're taking on water fast, and that they need to be seen dealing with Dems rather than continuing to pressure them to cave and swallow Walker's proposal whole. Also: The key question to ask about any compromise proposals floated by Walker is whether they still achieve the goal of fundamentally breaking the unions. More on this later.

* Senate Dems unveil new strategy in budget fight: This could get interesting: In a significant shift, Senate Dem leaders are now calling on House Republicans to broaden talks on the budget to include other areas, such as tax hikes, subsidies, and "entitlements."

The Dem game plan seems straightforward: The GOP is already rejecting the idea, and Dems will seize on this to argue that Republicans have an ideological obsession with cutting government that trumps any genuine desire to get the deficit under control by any means necessary.

* A clarifying moment on the GOP and spending? Ezra Klein comments on the new Dem strategy:

This might prove a clarifying moment. If Republicans are only willing to consider cuts to non-defense discretionary spending as part of a deficit-reduction deal, then whatever their aim is, it's not really deficit reduction.

* Yet another national poll shows strong support for public employees: A new Bloomberg national poll shows that 64 percent say public employees should have the right to bargain collectively for wages, 72 percent view public employees favorably, solid majorities say it's appropriate for them to have unions, and a plurality opposes state governors taking away their promised benefits.

Key takeaway: Though it's unclear how much this will impact the outcome in Wisconsin, labor, Dems and the left have absolutely crushed Walker and the right wing in the battle over national public opinion, which will have ramifications far beyond this one fight.

* Recall drive rattling Wisconsin Senate Republicans: The leader of Wisconsin GOP state senators says they are holding firm, but acknowledges that Republicans are feeling "pressure" and admits that the recall drive is "on everybody's minds."

* Undisclosed right-wing money starts flowing in union battle: The Rove-founded group Crossroads GPS, which doesn't have to disclose donors, is up with a new national ad bashing public unions, a sign that conservatives know how high the stakes are in Wisconsin and are aware they're badly losing the national public opinion war over public employees.

* Pete King's three ring circus, ctd.: With Rep. Pete King's hearings into Muslim radicalization set to kick off tomorrow, his previous support for the Irish Republican Army gets major treatment from the New York Times, and it's a great read that defly reveals the profound depths of King's buffoonery.

* Keith Ellison to bring sanity to King's show trial: Dem Rep. Keith Ellison previews his message at the hearings: "singling out one group and associating the whole group with terrorism is not only untrue, it mis-serves the ends of public safety."

* Congressional Dems backing GOP attacks on Obama over national security? As Digby notes, it really is amazing that some Congressional Dems appear willing to support a new GOP proposal to take decisions about trying terror suspects away from the Attorney General and hand them to the Defense Secretary.

* Mitt Romney versus Obama? Steve Kornacki says that Romney's health care conundrum notwithstanding, he's still the favorite for the 2012 nomination because "apostates" have a history of prevaling in GOP primaries despite the conservative base'shostility towards them.

* And from the department of self-promotion: I find it very gratifying to see that Paul Krugman reads this blog, and I was also glad to see that he reads Digby, Atrios, TPM, Steve Benen, Ezra Klein and Crooked Timber.

What else is happening?

By Greg Sargent  | March 9, 2011; 8:35 AM ET
Categories:  Foreign policy and national security, House GOPers, Labor, Morning Plum, Senate Dems, Senate Republicans, budget  
Save & Share:  Send E-mail   Facebook   Twitter   Digg   Yahoo Buzz   Del.icio.us   StumbleUpon   Technorati   Google Buzz   Previous: Happy Hour Roundup
Next: The GOP's war on voting

Comments

"that Republicans have an ideological obsession with cutting government that trumps any genuine desire to get the deficit under control by any means necessary."

This is soooo apparent to anybody paying attention! But I understand that the vast majority of Americans are not blogging away on political sites(with all due respect Greg :-) ) and that they really don't pay attention.

So perhaps a loud, strong, PR campaign is in order. At least it sounds like the Dems are finally beginning to figure that out.

Posted by: rukidding7 | March 9, 2011 8:41 AM | Report abuse

Everyone who pays attention knows very well Republicans aren't interested in deficit reduction.

The problem is communicating this to the people who aren't paying attention.

Posted by: DDAWD | March 9, 2011 8:45 AM | Report abuse

haha, wow

Posted by: DDAWD | March 9, 2011 8:49 AM | Report abuse

Democrats need to hammer relentlessly against subsidies for oil companies. With populist anger *finally* turning against the corporations, rising gas prices, and deficit reduction pressure, Democrats have an opportunity to turn over the rock and expose the writhing Republican slime nest that may not come again for some time.

Just pound at those subsidies, billions of dollars for companies making bigger profits than any in world history.

Posted by: caothien9 | March 9, 2011 8:58 AM | Report abuse

@DDAWD

Congrats to your Heels on their win over Duke...but did they really need to storm the court afterwards? :-)

In the race for the bottom of the favorability polls Gov Scott Walker has some stiff competition. Wisconsin ain't got nuttin' on Florida. Our jerk addressed the legislature with his plans yesterday.

http://www.tampabay.com/news/politics/national/gov-rick-scott-gives-hard-sell-brushes-off-critics-in-state-of-state/1156093

"Scott acknowledged his long line of critics but told lawmakers to stare them down."

"Don't blink," he said in the biggest applause line, drawing a standing ovation. "Don't let special interests persuade you to turn your backs on the people who elected you."

How ironic since the fraudster was elected by a "special interest" the Tea Baggers. Scott won in the closest election in state history with less than one fourth of the registered voters selecting him. Prior to actually taking office Scott had the largest negative rating of any of the newly elected Governors. Admittedly now that they're getting a chance to actually "govern" Scott Walker is giving Scott the fraudster a tough battle.

And in Florida it's not just the Dems that are concerned catch this from the Senate Pres a Republican who plans to run for Bill Nelsons U.S. Senate seat in the next election...i.e. he is FAR from moderate...

Senate President Mike Haridopolos laid out an agenda for his chamber that included Medicaid overhaul, pension reform and, in the face of a nearly $4 billion shortfall, strict limits on state spending.

"Whether we can actually reduce taxes, at the present time, in a responsible way remains to be seen," Haridopolos said. "If anyone can show me how we can realistically feed the increasing multitude with even fewer fish and less bread than we have now, then I will gladly follow him."

Yeah balance a budget shortfall by CUTTING taxes that's the ticket.

BTW For some entertainment read the comments section that you can click that follow the article. You'll get a good feel for how Floridians feel about Rick the Fraudster.

Posted by: rukidding7 | March 9, 2011 9:00 AM | Report abuse

"...defly reveals the profound depths of King's buffoonery."

I know you do this just to make me smile.

Posted by: shrink2 | March 9, 2011 9:01 AM | Report abuse

Quick note...

There is no lack of acknowledgement on the right that this crowd of Republican likely or possible candidates is the worst set of choices in everyones' lifetimes. Rush, Coulter, Frum - across the boards the same sentiment holds.

One significant aspect to this sour mood, perhaps the most significant aspect, is the negative consequences to activism and electoral turnout for Republicans in 2012.

And that underlines why there's a broad campaign across the states where Republicans hold power to prevent likely Dem voters from being able to easily get to the polls and get their votes placed. This is a common strategy for Republicans but this coming cycle with its particular circumstances make such electoral manipulations critically important.

Posted by: bernielatham | March 9, 2011 9:01 AM | Report abuse

For the last time, Reagan had tried to compromise (actually reaching a tentative deal before they reneged) but then did the right thing by firing the air traffic controllers in the face of negative polling too.

If you don't believe me, just ask mark_in_austin.

Posted by: clawrence12 | March 9, 2011 9:01 AM | Report abuse

Krugman's (short) post is absolutely fantastic. It's refreshing to see a prominent blogger like him just flat out say "Conservative blogs aren't worth my time" instead of giving false parity to them.

On that note...Digby is probably the best blogger on the 'nets right now. It's a serious, detrimental shame that she does not have a slot at a major outlet.

Posted by: TheBBQChickenMadness | March 9, 2011 9:01 AM | Report abuse

Greg:

""The Milwakee Journal Sentinal posts newly-released emails...""

Any idea when the e-mails were originally sent? The link does not say.

Posted by: ScottC3 | March 9, 2011 9:02 AM | Report abuse

I'm sorry to be a bit redundant here but this was just too funny...

A commenter who calls himself JasonHouse
posted this after the article about Scott's address to the legislature...I'm still spitting coffee at the computer screen..

"Rick Scott's message tonight to non-teabag Floridians, "Pull my finger". LMAO

Posted by: rukidding7 | March 9, 2011 9:03 AM | Report abuse

"Some have asked if there aren’t conservative sites I read regularly. Well, no. I will read anything I’ve been informed about that’s either interesting or revealing; but I don’t know of any economics or politics sites on that side that regularly provide analysis or information I need to take seriously. I know we’re supposed to pretend that both sides always have a point; but the truth is that most of the time they don’t. The parties are not equally irresponsible; Rachel Maddow isn’t Glenn Beck; and a conservative blog, almost by definition, is a blog written by someone who chooses not to notice that asymmetry. And life is short …"

- Krugman

Heh heh heh

Posted by: caothien9 | March 9, 2011 9:04 AM | Report abuse

Yes, the Republican Party is not interested in being serious on the econony or deficits. It is laughably obvious at this point.

They have even admitted that the programs that will be cut are mostly Democratic policies.

If the Dems play it right, and it sounds like they are -- I was heartened by Schumer's move to widen the budget talks -- they should reap the benefits on the blowback of the GOP's efforts at cutting social services and stalling the economy.

As I said before, America REJECTS governing out of spite and vengence and division. What the current GOP is doing is IDENTICAL to how Bush governed. The GOP has learned NOTHING since they were annihilated at the polls in 2006 and 2008. Just the same ol same ol, pedal to the metal with absurd economy-destroying, Middle Class killing policies.

Posted by: ronnieandrush | March 9, 2011 9:05 AM | Report abuse

@Cao

"Democrats need to hammer relentlessly against subsidies for oil companies."

Agreed 100%. Of all the corporate targets the oil companies are the low hanging fruit just waiting to be harvested. Pics of BP's failure to spend a minuscule amount to prevent the blowout at the Deepwater Horizon when the North Sea drillers were compelled to do so by regulation...of course those would follow pics of the prices at the gas pumps and charts showing Big Oil's obscene profits.

And yes Scott there are "times" when profits are obscene!

Posted by: rukidding7 | March 9, 2011 9:10 AM | Report abuse

If you don't believe me, just ask mark_in_austin.

==

Image of small child peering from behind mother's apron

Posted by: caothien9 | March 9, 2011 9:11 AM | Report abuse

@shrink

OT but I'm curious. Do you have any opinion on the Charlie Sheen debacle. Is the dude just burnt out from the drugs or our we watching him crack up (you can supply the clinical term) right before our eyes?

2nd question, the important one actually...do you feel as I do that this is a really ghoulish society that is featuring a man's mental breakdown on every outlet major and minor...and sometimes in real time...IMHO it's pathetic, and ghoulish...but perhaps that is because I have an in law who suffers from mental illness.

Posted by: rukidding7 | March 9, 2011 9:15 AM | Report abuse

"...You'll get a good feel for how Floridians feel..."

When you live in a place like the People's Socialist Republic of Oregon, you have to wonder about places like Florida. Why don't people in Florida stop electing wing nuts? Do they like boom and bust cycles? Slow, steady, sustainable growth doesn't sound as good as getting rich quick I suppose. Oregon learned its lesson, we hope, with the Packwood old growth log export boom...and bust. We got rid of the illegal labor exploiting "self-made" man, Gordon Smith and this state is so blue now it is as if the Republican Party can be ignored. So I can't wait to compare states in a few years, the West Coast versus the Red States: cage match.

Posted by: shrink2 | March 9, 2011 9:15 AM | Report abuse

I went to check out that Crooked Timber site mentioned in the Krugman piece and they had this up, something discussed at the end of last nights thread.

""The announcement that military show trials are to recommence at Guantanamo Bay, combined with the brutal and vindictive treatment of Bradley Manning, make it clear that, as regards willing to suppress basic human and civil rights in the name of security, there is no fundamental difference between the Obama and Bush Administrations. The first obvious question is, why? The second is, how to respond?

A natural starting hypothesis would be that Americans, or the American ruling class, benefit from the abandonment of the rule of law. It’s certainly true that the suppression of basic rights has gone hand in hand with the development of a culture of impunity for the ruling class, particularly in relation to crimes committed in the name of security. But there’s very little evidence to suggest that Gitmo, military commissions and so on have done anything to promote security. Most obviously, after nearly a decade, they have yet to secure any genuine convictions, just a couple of squalid (on the government side) plea bargains, and one case where the defendant boycotted proceedings. Prosecutions of accused terrorists in criminal courts in the US and elsewhere have produced far more convictions and prison sentences, although of course they have also produced some acquittals and releases, outcomes that seem unthinkable in the US context.""

""As regards a response, this depends on where you stand. In the short run, and within US politics, there is little choice but to support Obama and the Dems as the lesser evil, at least as regards domestic policy. Presumably there must be a political path back towards the rule of law, but it’s hard to see it at present.""

http://crookedtimber.org/2011/03/09/obama-and-bush/#more-19245

Posted by: lmsinca | March 9, 2011 9:18 AM | Report abuse

And yes Scott there are "times" when profits are obscene!

==

I wouldn't bother trying to get through to Scott on moral issues. Based on some of his recent posts, I'd say that Scott isn't quite "all there."

It's a little past the routine dishonesty and denial. That guy's clinical.

Ally polly loggies to shrink2 for verging on diagnosing without a license.

Posted by: caothien9 | March 9, 2011 9:18 AM | Report abuse

Obama must be taking lessons from George Bush as well as Bill Clinton on how to be president. Obama is becoming more like Bush every day.

Club Gitmo is thriving

Obama's Afghanistan war is raging

Gas is going to $5.00 a gallon.

The similarities are eerie!

Posted by: battleground51 | March 9, 2011 9:24 AM | Report abuse

Bernie:

""And that underlines why there's a broad campaign across the states where Republicans hold power to prevent likely Dem voters from being able to easily get to the polls and get their votes placed.""

This broad campaign has manifested itself how exactly?

Posted by: ScottC3 | March 9, 2011 9:29 AM | Report abuse

ruk, imo.

Charlie Sheen should have been jailed for his crimes against various women and forced into sobriety, if not Recovery. There is nothing funny, interesting or unusual about the trajectory of his life, he happens to be rich/famous. 5 kids. The sins of the father...

All bets to the contrary, he is not dead and so he has a shot at redemption, but obviously he is running out of time. Of course I work with people whose brains are as or more damaged than his and see them put their lives together, once in awhile. In this work, we don't give up, that is the main thing.

Posted by: shrink2 | March 9, 2011 9:31 AM | Report abuse

I agree with Cao, I think Scott and QB either have a sick sense of humor or they are totally disinterested in the concept of living in a modern society.

Posted by: ronnieandrush | March 9, 2011 9:31 AM | Report abuse

@bernielatham:

"Fla. Republicans set to make it harder for ex-felons to vote"

"Democrats and voting rights groups, which had made restoration of felons' voting rights a cause célèbre for years before Crist's action, are angry at Bondi for what they say is a secretive and hasty push to turn back the clock. Critics note Florida's importance to Obama's reelection next year, when minority voters will be a focus for his campaign.

"It clearly has the effect of suppressing the vote as we go into a presidential election cycle," said Howard Simon, executive director of the Florida chapter of the American Civil Liberties Union.

Elsewhere in the country, newly elected GOP leaders are advocating new voting laws that they argue would help curb election fraud. Democrats are pushing back, arguing that Republicans are simply looking for ways to depress voting among core Obama supporters."

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2011/03/08/AR2011030806672.html

--------------------

As you note, the Republican efforts to disembowel unions and to disenfranchise students* and felons is aimed at shifting subsequent electoral outcomes in their favor. To be blunt, Republicans are attempting to reestablish the Jim Crow/poll tax laws of yesteryear. And the scary thing is that, in some places, they are succeeding.

*http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2011/03/nh-gop-seeks-to-disenfranchise-students-who-just-vote-their-feelings-video.php?ref=fpb

Posted by: associate20 | March 9, 2011 9:33 AM | Report abuse

@shrink

"Why don't people in Florida stop electing wing nuts?"

There is no short answer to your question.
Scott is the result of the perfect storm.
The tidal wave of tea baggers...and young people staying at home and not participating.

Florida is catching on and our demographic trends are towards the blue end of the spectrum. e.g. We have more registered Dems than R's. But we also famously have a lot of blue hairs...old farts...who kill every education initiative..they've already educated their children back home in Jersey, Penn, Mich, N.Y. et al. And they are fertile ground for the tea baggers.

I too will be interested in the race with Oregon...although you guys are so far ahead already, and hard telling how far back into the stone age Scott will take us.....2012 will be interesting in Florida. If Obama gets out the young vote again he'll win in a cakewalk...more importantly Bill Nelson will get to keep his Senate seat...if not we'll get some loser like the afore mentioned Mike Haridopolis who is getting joked about because a Community College paid him six figures for a book that will not be used anywhere. This is how Marco Rubio used to do business...it's the Republican way in Florida..and when enough of these retired blue hairs who emigrated here to eff up our politics ,finally pass away perhaps we'll get our state back.

Posted by: rukidding7 | March 9, 2011 9:33 AM | Report abuse

@shrink

Thanks a bunch! In a sea of partisan bickering and anger you have made my day with a little ray of optimism. Heaven knows our country needs some optimism right now...this will be Obama's ace in the hole in 2012 because the R primary will have sucked the optimism out of everybody, they will be sooo sick of the sky is falling.

Thanks again for this shrink...

"Of course I work with people whose brains are as or more damaged than his and see them put their lives together, once in awhile. In this work, we don't give up, that is the main thing."

Posted by: rukidding7 | March 9, 2011 9:37 AM | Report abuse

This broad campaign has manifested itself how exactly?

==

Go to google news and type in "New Hampshire College," Mr. Smell-of-Burning-Photographic-Negatives.

Posted by: caothien9 | March 9, 2011 9:39 AM | Report abuse

It's amazing how one Republican governor can get the liberals' panties in such a knot from left coast to left coast as Wisconsin Walker has.

The guy is taking on the national wrath of the Democrat/Union party all by himself. The full power of the Democrat party and it's union legions are arrayed against this man and the Dem-Unionistas may eke out a little compromise from him.

BRAVO!

If this Republican "minor leaguer" can stand up to the national Dem-Union party in such a manner, just imagine what a few major leaguers could do.

Posted by: battleground51 | March 9, 2011 9:40 AM | Report abuse

"What else is happening?"

Ohio Gov. John Kasich (R) delivered his SotS address yesterday and was jeered when he got to the part of his speech about restricting collective bargaining rights of public sector unions.
http://politics.blogs.foxnews.com/2011/03/08/kasich-jeered-collective-bargaining-reform-during-ohio-state-state-speech

Interestingly, Kasich's proposal includes police and firefighters, groups who were given a free pass in Wisconsin.

Posted by: MsJS | March 9, 2011 9:40 AM | Report abuse

Everyone knows why Republicans don't want young people to vote. America, it turns out, is changing, which is not what being conservative is all about. Democrats might counter by passing laws prohibiting nursing home, assisted living etc., staff involving themselves with helping the Republican "values voters" base with their ballots.

Posted by: shrink2 | March 9, 2011 9:42 AM | Report abuse

It was that disenfranchising student push that got the entire discussion started over the last couple of day re voting and the tax base. Even Scott agreed that disenfranchising students was not a good idea. After that we parted ways though. I don't think they'll be bold enough to try to disenfranchise women but they're doing a pretty good job of getting some of us riled up with all their anti-women issues such as eliminating Title V and Planned Parenthood in addition to the states with their weird new Abortion rules. Every woman and girl in my family over the age of 18 has been to Planned Parenthood at one point in their lives and none of us has had an abortion. And women like to vote.

Posted by: lmsinca | March 9, 2011 9:45 AM | Report abuse

So, ruk, I gather you don't imagine Florida supermarkets putting in charging stations soon?

"This summer, Fred Meyer Stores will begin adding charging stations for electric vehicles at six of its Portland-area stores. The grocer, owned by Cincinnati-based The Kroger Co., also will install stations at six of its Seattle area stores."

Posted by: shrink2 | March 9, 2011 9:50 AM | Report abuse

I haven't linked to the Bradley Manning story yet but I read about him almost every day. It makes me sad and I feel like I'm already bringing too much negativity to the PL with all my banking and housing links etc., but this is a nice over view of what's been happening if you're interested and haven't been following it. Admittedly this diarist is a supporter of wikileaks and Manning so it's tilted in his favor, a point of view some of you may not agree with.

""Manning now faces charges that include the potential of capital punishment. He was charged with 22 additional counts for his alleged role in a massive leak of classified information to WikiLeaks, including a charge of “aiding the enemy” that can result in the death penalty. This charge is particularly disturbing as Glenn Greenwald points out: “This prosecution theory would convert acts of whistle-blowing into a hanging offense.”

This is particularly ironic since the former constitutional law professor who is now the U.S. president, said in 2008 when he was running for office “Government whistleblowers are part of a healthy democracy and must be protected from reprisal.” Further, as Secretary of State Clinton reminded us during a speech on Internet freedom, when President Obama spoke in China, “he spoke about how access to information helps citizens hold their own governments accountable. . . .”

Indeed, Hillary Clinton is lecturing the world on the importance of freedom of speech and press in the Internet age saying these are “values etched in stone” that “every generation of Americans has worked to protect.” Last month, in her second speech on freedom in the 21st Century she stated “We govern with the consent of the people, and that consent must be informed to be meaningful.” She applauded people around the world who used the Internet to “expose public corruption” and criticized countries that attempt to restrict the free flow of information. She proclaimed “Governments have to choose to live up to their commitments to protect free expression, assembly, and association.”"

http://my.firedoglake.com/kevinzeese/2011/03/07/bradley-manning-is-punished-for-seeking-a-more-perfect-union/

Posted by: lmsinca | March 9, 2011 9:51 AM | Report abuse

"Democrats might counter by passing laws prohibiting nursing home, assisted living etc., staff involving themselves with helping the Republican "values voters" base with their ballots."

Shrink...again spot on! Here in Florida that would change the dynamic completely.
But alas the Dems are not as immoral as the R's when it comes to disenfranchising voters. If you don't believe me follow Cao's link to New Hampshire. Where their state motto is "Live Free or Die Unless You're a Young Person".

Posted by: rukidding7 | March 9, 2011 9:51 AM | Report abuse

@associate20 - Yes. Think Progress has been covering this well also. Targeted as well are latinos and the elderly/poor. Vote suppression is a strategy Republicans use predictably. But I wanted to point to the connection between low enthusiasm on the right this cycle (the candidate choice issue) and the consequent "need" (if you are a certain sort of Machiavellian social psychopath) to really get to work on voter suppression.

One further quick note...

The problems up the road for Tunisians or Egyptians or other such populations previously dominated by a small dictatorial cliques is that those cliques have commonly gained and retained their power/wealth through dismantling prior social and community or national-level institutions. Such institutions could and would have contested the power and dominance of the dictatorial cliques and that's why they were dismantled. There's nothing original in that observation. It's widely understood to be the case.

But understanding the dynamics at work in the above provides the proper understanding of what the modern right in the US is up to. That they are working to dismantle institutions (or, as with the courts, to infiltrate and gain control of as much of the legal mechanisms as possible so as to make the legal system pliable to corporate interests) is not in question. That is the game.

It needs pointing out that in both instances the goals and the dynamic are the same.

Posted by: bernielatham | March 9, 2011 9:53 AM | Report abuse

"So, ruk, I gather you don't imagine Florida supermarkets putting in charging stations soon?"

In a state that just rejected 2.4 Billion for high speed rail. Yes I understand your question was rhetorical. But I am envious.
If your climate didn't suck I think about reversing the trend and retiring from Florida to Oregon...but that wouldn't please you much I suspect since the Californians are already going that route from what I read. Trust me you don't not want a big influx of retirees from another state...they bring plenty of baggage with them and lots and lots of tea.


Posted by: rukidding7 | March 9, 2011 9:56 AM | Report abuse

associate:

""...and to disenfranchise students...""

If you are referring to New Hampshire, no such effort exists from what I can tell. I am aware of two laws which have been introduced, one which would require students to have established residency in the district in order to be able to vote, and one which would require voters to register prior to election day.

It strikes me as odd that the former is not already law. How many places in the nation allow non-residents to vote? Not many, I imagine. And of course anyone prevented from voting on such grounds would still be eligible to vote in the district in which they had established residency, so no disenfranchisement at all. Nor is the latter, as anyone who wants to vote can, as long as they register prior to election day. Deadlines for when one must be registered in order to vote are no more an example of "disenfranchisement" than are deadlines for receipt of absentee ballots, or time limitations on when polls are open. If you show up at 8pm to vote at a poll that closed at 7, it is quite a stretch to claim that you have been "disenfranchised".

Posted by: ScottC3 | March 9, 2011 10:02 AM | Report abuse

"And women like to vote."

lmsinca that could be our salvation. I know of more than a few "bright" R women who are becoming embarrassed. They are among that vanishing breed of "moderate" R's and they are ashamed of the women the R's have elevated, specifically Sister Sarah and Michelle Bachmann. "I am not a witch" and "2nd Amendment remedies" didn't float their boats either. Most reasonable Republican women have been shown the door...of course not to be sexist, that's true of reasonable R men as well.

Posted by: rukidding7 | March 9, 2011 10:02 AM | Report abuse

Walker is just a Koch lap dog. WI is a battle against Koch greed for a larger accumulation of wealth on the backs of the middle class.

And re Ohio.

The Republican House switched committee members as did the Senate in Ohio to get the anti-union bill out of committee. If those members were aloud to stay in their committee's the assault on the middle class wouldn't have happened.

Posted by: mikefromArlington | March 9, 2011 10:04 AM | Report abuse

Funny thing, in Southern Oregon and just on the other side of the mountains, as for example, in Hood River, the weather is wonderful. The Californication of some sections of Southern and Eastern Oregon occurred, but retirees live on fixed incomes and the area where many of them settled (they remind me of the Israeli right in some ways, involuted religious nuts, armed to the teeth...), Bend/Deschutes County is now an economic disaster area, Oregon's worst. Seems the rampant 'growth' was all real estate speculation driven, so it wasn't real.

Posted by: shrink2 | March 9, 2011 10:06 AM | Report abuse

Man this PPP polling for the Republican lineup looks like a race for the biggest loser.

Barbour (R) 2.0%
Daniels (R) 4.0%
Gingrich (R) 19.0%
Huckabee (R) 19.0%
Palin (R) 17.0%
Paul (R) 8.0%
Pawlenty (R) 3.0%
Romney (R) 15.0%

Posted by: mikefromArlington | March 9, 2011 10:07 AM | Report abuse

ruk: "Scott is the result of the perfect storm. The tidal wave of tea baggers...and young people staying at home and not participating."

Same perfect storm everywhere, I'd say. At another time, we probably would have had a less intense GOP tidal wave with fewer flips, and more GOP moderates would have won.

I hope those that stayed home have learned something. (Yes, youngsters, I am talking to YOU!)

Posted by: suekzoo1 | March 9, 2011 10:07 AM | Report abuse

lms:

""It was that disenfranchising student push that got the entire discussion started over the last couple of day re voting and the tax base. Even Scott agreed that disenfranchising students was not a good idea.""

To be clear, I agreed with you that anyone in the military ought not have the right to vote, and so by implication, with regard to the voting age, anyone old enough to serve in the military ought to be considered old enough to vote.

Posted by: ScottC3 | March 9, 2011 10:09 AM | Report abuse

lms:

I said above "anyone in the military ought not have the right to vote,"

Obviously I meant "anyone in the military ought to have the right to vote."

Big difference.

Posted by: ScottC3 | March 9, 2011 10:10 AM | Report abuse

Hi shrink!

What you describe in your 10:06 has happened to a smaller extent in a large Chicago suburb. Around 1998 or so it set out to be a magnet for comfortable retirees downsizing out of their single-family homes. It turned into a real estate frenzy that went belly-up in 2008. The results are not pretty.

Posted by: MsJS | March 9, 2011 10:13 AM | Report abuse

Fair play to you, Nial O'Dowd. Keep speaking out.


"Some who have been close to Mr. King agree. Niall O’Dowd, an Irish-born New York publisher and writer who worked with him on the peace process in the 1990s, broke publicly with him Monday on his Web site, IrishCentral.com, describing Mr. King’s “strange journey from Irish radical to Muslim inquisitor.”

In Northern Ireland, Mr. O’Dowd said, they saw a Catholic community “demonized” by its Protestant and British critics and worked to bring it to the peace table. Seeing his old friend similarly “demonize” Muslims has shocked him, he said.

“I honestly feel Peter is wrong, and his own experience in Northern Ireland teaches him that,” Mr. O’Dowd said. “He’s a very honest, working-class Irish guy from Queens who’s had an amazing career. Now I see a man turning back on himself, and I don’t know why.”

From The Times article.

Posted by: Liam-still | March 9, 2011 10:13 AM | Report abuse

Okay Scott, we're clear. Didn't mean to put words in your mouth. I see from your earlier post you don't see an effort to disenfranchise students anyway, so there's that as well.

Posted by: lmsinca | March 9, 2011 10:14 AM | Report abuse

"I hope those that stayed home have learned something. (Yes, youngsters, I am talking to YOU!)"

I'm staying home in 2012 too because I didn't get the public option! See, I'll show NObama! Who cares if all the state houses and Governorships get taken out by a bunch of whacko's and middle class bargaining rights are stripped away. It'll just motive Dems more in 2016 or something!!!11!!1one!!!1

In all seriousness, this Wisconsin ordeal has re-focused progressive fire back at the Republicans fortunately. So, in a weird way, I'm thankful for Gov. Walkers complete lack of empathy and respect for teachers bargaining rights they've earned.

Posted by: mikefromArlington | March 9, 2011 10:14 AM | Report abuse

@ScottC3: It is not at all unusual for a state to allow students to vote where they are attending school; in fact, it's a pretty common practice.

Additionally, I'm not sure how you can say that any limiting of voting rights or accommodations doesn't amount to disenfranchisement. The steps being taking in NH are the very definition of the term: students' rights to vote while away from home will be abolished, forcing them to contend with absentee ballots, which may or may not get lost in the mail, etc., preventing their vote from being registered.

The same sentiment applies for poll-site registration. Efforts to restrict voting by requiring additional hoops, IDs, etc., necessarily restricts voting. Subsequently, voters who are required to undergo additional steps to submit a vote are winnowed.

Disenfranchisement does not have to be active to be detrimental, nefarious, or impactful; it can be passive -- -- as are the steps Republicans are currently considering -- and have the same outcomes.

Posted by: associate20 | March 9, 2011 10:19 AM | Report abuse

Exactly A20.

Posted by: lmsinca | March 9, 2011 10:21 AM | Report abuse

Idaho Legislature Passes Wisconsin-Style Bill Limiting Teachers Union Collective Bargaining Powers
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110309/ap_on_re_us/us_teachers_union_idaho

A bill that would phase out tenure for new teachers and restrict collective bargaining on their salaries and benefits is on its way to the Idaho governor.

TEA-haw!

Posted by: KaddafiDelendaEst | March 9, 2011 10:23 AM | Report abuse

Teach the College Students about using absentee ballots. That should get around any attempts by Republicans to deny them their voting rights.

In Wisconsin, the Republicans are about to pass their long pursued Voter ID law.

Posted by: Liam-still | March 9, 2011 10:23 AM | Report abuse

*Breaking* NPR CEO Vivian Schiller Resigns
http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/2011/03/09/134388981/npr-ceo-vivian-schiller-resigns

[Reports Say She Was Forced Out]

TEA-rific!

Posted by: KaddafiDelendaEst | March 9, 2011 10:26 AM | Report abuse

*Collective Bargaining in Action*

$10K a Year for Not Working
$6K to Carry a Pager
Two Pensions... and worse.
http://walker.wi.gov/journal_media_detail.asp?locid=177&prid=5675#

Posted by: KaddafiDelendaEst | March 9, 2011 10:31 AM | Report abuse

Way to go Idaho.
Drive out all those teachers:

Your new state slogan: Idaho, Where Ignorance Prevails.

Or perhaps you may wish to keep your current state slogan:

Larry Craig's Toe Tapping Code: I-Da-Ho

Posted by: Liam-still | March 9, 2011 10:32 AM | Report abuse

"It is not at all unusual for a state to allow students to vote where they are attending school; in fact, it's a pretty common practice."

it was actively encouraged at my school. they would hold registration drives on campus. i always declined and voted absentee. for president i don't think it's that big of a deal, but it didn't seem fair for me to influence local elections.

Posted by: NoVAHockey | March 9, 2011 10:34 AM | Report abuse

Remember that $7.5 million that was supposedly needed to clean up the capitol in WI from the protests? LIARS!

From Benen:

"But other testimony and news reports from the Capitol indicated that something was amiss.

Protesters had, by all accounts, policed themselves, including creating cleanup details and other organizational efforts. They used blue painters' tape to hang their signs -- at the request of state officials. Some protesters said the state had actually provided the tape to avoid lasting damage."

Posted by: suekzoo1 | March 9, 2011 10:34 AM | Report abuse

*VIDEO* Union Goon Threatens to Break TEA Teen's Neck
http://blog.eyeblast.tv/2011/03/union-member-threatens-to-break-cameramans-neck-language-warning/

"If you don’t that f**cking phone out of my face I’m going to break your g**damned neck."

[Ironically, the guy walks over and puts his head into the camera, then threatens to break the kids neck.]

*so progressive!&

Posted by: KaddafiDelendaEst | March 9, 2011 10:36 AM | Report abuse

associate:

""I'm not sure how you can say that any limiting of voting rights or accommodations doesn't amount to disenfranchisement.""

I live in Connecticut, but both work and pay taxes in New York. However, because I am not a resident of New York, my voting rights in New York are "limited" (indeed, non-existent). Have I been disenfranchised?

It is not at all clear to me why a single particular constituency, students, should be exempted from the same residency laws that apply to all other people. If students care enough about local issues to want to vote in a particular district or state, they can establish residency in that district/state precisely for that purpose. If they can't be bothered to do so, or want to maintain residency in another district/state for other reasons, that is a choice they make. Not being exempted from the same laws that all other voters have to follow is not an example of "disenfranchisement".

Posted by: ScottC3 | March 9, 2011 10:37 AM | Report abuse

Here's the one law enforcement presence at King's hearing which begins today.

""If you look at the witness list, you see that the hearings only include one member of local law enforcement: Los Angeles County Sheriff Lee Baca. It turns out that Democrats added him to the panel, so in King’s world, a hearing on Muslim radicalization and law enforcement wouldn’t have any law enforcement perspective.

I saw Baca speak last night at the “People’s Hearing on Defending Religious Freedom,” an event put on by the Southern California chapter of the ACLU. Baca will head to DC today for the hearings. Baca said that the only way to focus on the problem of extremist violence is to look at the statistics. “Since 9/11, 77 extremist efforts or attacks have been carried out by non-Muslim extremists in the United States,” said Baca. In addition, of the last 10 terror plots attempted by Muslims, seven of them have been thwarted by Muslims coming forward. “This is not a Muslim problem, it’s a people problem.”

Baca discussed the strategies he uses in his sheriff’s department, the largest in the United States, to work with local communities of faith. “I have an interfaith council of 200,” including members of the Muslim, Christian, Jewish, Buddhist, Baha’i and more communities. “I believe that interfaith harmony eliminates intolerance,” Baca explained. He also has instituted a Muslim-American Homeland Security Congress, made up of members of the Muslim community from all walks of life. And there are Muslim-American deputy sheriffs that make up a public affairs strategy. “It’s extremely effective to have positive interactions with the community,” he said. “And what we’ve seen is that the Muslim community is as eager to help as anyone. It’s not about spying on the community but about building public trust.”"

http://news.firedoglake.com/2011/03/09/sheriff-lee-baca-only-law-enforcement-witness-at-kings-muslim-radicalization-hearings-speaks-out/

Posted by: lmsinca | March 9, 2011 10:37 AM | Report abuse

The image I envision of Kaddafideblabla is a wart on Koch's backside with a few scraggly hairs poking out the top that need to be plucked...and some puss oozing freely out of it, that revels when the rich get richer and the middle class get beat back into submission.

Another middle class man's misery is another victory for Kaddafi the lapdog of the uber privileged.

Posted by: mikefromArlington | March 9, 2011 10:37 AM | Report abuse

Bipartisanship can work...

"By unanimous vote, the Oregon Senate gave final approval to Senate Bill 301 Tuesday.

One key provision would allow Oregonians a state tax deduction of up to $4,000 for college tuition, books and other related expenses. It also would allow parents to keep their children on their health plans until they reach age 26 without being taxed on the benefit.

The bill [included] a host of business tax breaks, including accelerated depreciation on equipment... The tax breaks will mean that businesses will save about $93 million and state government will have that much less to spend on schools, prisons and social services in the next two years. But supporters argued the breaks are necessary to get Oregon's economy back on track. Republicans pushed Monday to amend the bill to include the business tax breaks. In the end, 11 House Democrats went along.

Citing the overwhelming vote in the House, Senate Democrats said they wouldn't object. The Senate concurred with the House amendments Tuesday without debate." The O

Posted by: shrink2 | March 9, 2011 10:39 AM | Report abuse

In Wisconsin; Protesters are now banned from staying overnight outside the The State Capitol building in Madison.

Protesters in Cairo Egypt are still allowed to stay overnight in Tahrir Square.


Remind us once more; which place is supposed to be: The Land Of The Free?

Posted by: Liam-still | March 9, 2011 10:40 AM | Report abuse

Let me fix that for you, lame-brain.

[Liam: "Way to go UNIONS. Drive out all the COMPETENT teachers"]

There, that's better.

‘Outstanding First Year Teacher’ Laid Off
http://www.jsonline.com/news/education/96349689.html

Milwaukee Public Schools teacher Megan Sampson was laid off less than one week after being named Outstanding First Year Teacher by the Wisconsin Council of English Teachers. She lost her job because the collective bargaining agreement requires layoffs to be made based on seniority rather than merit.

Informed that her union had rejected a lower-cost health care plan, that still would have required zero contribution from teachers, Sampson said, “Given the opportunity, of course I would switch to a different plan to save my job, or the jobs of 10 other teachers.

Posted by: KaddafiDelendaEst | March 9, 2011 10:41 AM | Report abuse

[mike spat: "The image I envision of Kaddafideblabla is a wart on Koch's backside with a few scraggly hairs poking out the top that need to be plucked...and some puss oozing freely out of it"]

Good for you.

*stay classy*

Posted by: KaddafiDelendaEst | March 9, 2011 10:45 AM | Report abuse

Gitmo?

As I understand it, there are now less than two hundred detainees being held there, and we are not sending any more new detainees there. Is that correct?

Posted by: Liam-still | March 9, 2011 10:45 AM | Report abuse

shrink -- the $4,000 deduction also is a drain on the state coffers. did the article mention what that cost is? so it's 93 million plus whatever that amount is in total cost to Oregon.

Posted by: NoVAHockey | March 9, 2011 10:46 AM | Report abuse

I wonder, are Republicans are dying faster than they are being created?

Posted by: shrink2 | March 9, 2011 10:46 AM | Report abuse

All, good stuff from Adam Serwer on the GOP's war on voting:

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/plum-line/2011/03/republicans_war_on_voting.html

Posted by: Greg Sargent | March 9, 2011 10:49 AM | Report abuse

shrink:

""I wonder, are Republicans are dying faster than they are being created?"

Interesting question. Have you ever heard of the Roe effect?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roe_effect

Posted by: ScottC3 | March 9, 2011 10:53 AM | Report abuse

Way to go Idaho.
Drive out all those teachers:

Your new state slogan: Idaho, Where Ignorance Prevails.

Or:

Idaho, Now Growing Potatoes, And Turnips.

Posted by: Liam-still | March 9, 2011 10:53 AM | Report abuse

NoVA, that is a good question, I considered it before I posted and was unable to find the impact analysis of the D part (the education and health care tax breaks) of the bill that passed. Certainly The Oregonian had access to that info and chose not to publish it. I will spend a few more minutes trying to find the answer, please stand by...(not really, but I'll let you know if I find anything).

Posted by: shrink2 | March 9, 2011 10:55 AM | Report abuse

"I wonder, are Republicans are dying faster than they are being created?"

Um, yes. Couple that with the growing number of young voters of ethnic backgrounds, and the GOP is sailing into rough waters if they can't figure out how to broaden their appeal.

(Voto Latino expects 1.5 million new Hispanic voters in 2012, mostly young people. )

Posted by: suekzoo1 | March 9, 2011 10:59 AM | Report abuse

shrink -- pls don't go to any trouble. i just found it interesting that tax breaks for businesses were characterized (by the article not you) as a cost, while the other tax breaks seemed to get a pass. glad you saw the discrepancy too.

Posted by: NoVAHockey | March 9, 2011 10:59 AM | Report abuse

[shrink2 wondered: "are Republicans dying faster than they are being created?"]

Nope. Democrat abort their own progeny.

The most fecund Republicans are in heavily Mormon Utah, which (not coincidentally) was the only state where Bush received over 70%. Compare with low birth rate Washington, D.C. where Bush earned but 9 percent.

Posted by: KaddafiDelendaEst | March 9, 2011 11:03 AM | Report abuse

@NoVA

"I don't think it's that big of a deal, but it didn't seem fair for me to influence local elections."

I take your point but I'm not sure I'm in complete agreement. If you're talking about living in a community 4 years or even longer why shouldn't you participate in that community's elections. Obviously you shouldn't be able to vote in more than one locale's elections but if you have made the decision to give up voting in your "home" locality via absentee or otherwise I would have no problem with you voting in our local elections for example if you attended USF St Pete.

IMO a person is entitled to vote once per cycle whereever they are residing at the time. We have become such a mobile society and it's not just college students.

But if you wish to change the way things are, I'd be happy to see a law passed that said all retirees moving to Florida are forced to eff up their native locale's elections by absentee ballot for the rest of their remaining days. snark alert :-)

Posted by: rukidding7 | March 9, 2011 11:09 AM | Report abuse

Meanwhile, and in consideration all of the above, the Republican's "Dumbing down of America" campaign continues in full flower.... For a political party that represents business, it is a compliment to their messaging how they permanently hoodwink such a vast constituency of just, plain working voters to their cause. But, it has nothing to do with appealing to people's "higher angels," as their current nationwide tactic of using pension envy is now being to win support to remove public workers' collective bargaining rights. In their successful advocacy for a more plutocratic political order, however, they are really leading America down the "Road to Perdition."

Posted by: dozas | March 9, 2011 11:10 AM | Report abuse

Brigham Young U, forbids the drinking of tea and coffee.

Even Muslims drink Coffee. Did someone say Utah Sharia Law, American Style?

Posted by: Liam-still | March 9, 2011 11:13 AM | Report abuse

I found an earlier article which said..."The tuition break will cost the state an estimated $10 million a year, according to legislature's Revenue Office. The business breaks would have cost an estimated $52 million a year."

Now I have to drill into this...to find out where the $93m number came from.

Posted by: shrink2 | March 9, 2011 11:22 AM | Report abuse

Scott: I understand what you're saying, but I think you're overlooking an important difference. The right already exists for students to vote while attending school away from home. That right (nor any similar right) does not exist under the scenario you've identified. So, no, I would not call that disenfranchisement.

Furthermore, since it is common for students to attend schools away from home, why should additional burdens be placed on them for taking advantage of the opportunities they've earned? That sounds like something Republicans would traditionally oppose, which makes their support of doing so now, simply because its politically expedient, even more abominable.

By the way, anecdotally, it seems that most college students do not register to vote in local elections; college-age registration tends to be, overwhelmingly, for national/presidential elections. Most college students probably do not vote in local elections, precisely because they do not know the local politics and are not permanent residents. Again, that's an anecdotally derived assertion, but I think voting data would support it. Ultimately, I think your assertion that students should be required to obtain residency prior to voting, because of the potential impact on local elections is moot, because students' impact on local elections (i.e., non-presidential elections) is relatively minor to virtually nonexistent.

Therefore, requiring students to obtain residency to vote, when their primary interest lies in national, not local, politics is, again, an undue burden.

There is simply no justification for rescinding the commonly extended right for students to vote while studying in another state.

Posted by: associate20 | March 9, 2011 11:38 AM | Report abuse

"If you're talking about living in a community 4 years or even longer why shouldn't you participate in that community's elections."

i'm not opposed to it, but I think it's easy for college kids to have it both ways. if you're going to register to vote in your college town, i think you need change everything. example -- if I'm going to vote in the local elections, i should have to register my car in the state too if i have it on campus. but that's a huge hassle, so nobody does it. i had a part time job on campus, but i filed my state return in VA. not that i earned much, but should i have filed in my college state too?

i think you should vote where your permanent residence is. and it's fine if that's your college town, provided you treat everything like it's your permanent residence.

Posted by: NoVAHockey | March 9, 2011 11:51 AM | Report abuse

At 68, I've owned/own several businesses, worked for several corporations, taught school, and worked for a while in state government. In all that time I've never been a member of any union.

Like big business and big government they have some serious flaws. Having said that, I feel that they have every right to exist.

No, let me rephrase that.

I believe individual citizens/workers have every right to collective bargaining. In addition, unions/collective bargaining is not something that just happened, there is a reason that unions came into existance, and that reason hasn't gone away, remember reading about the sweat shops, mills, and child labor.

Without some counter forces at the ready, big business is ready to create those conditions again.

Regarding public employees unions, if it wasn't for the level of continuity the unions provide the political cronyism of the early 1900's would make any inefficiencies in our current governmental system look like child's play.

Within a year, Scott Walker and the Republicans would have Wisconsin's government in total nepotistic chaos.

Posted by: JedG | March 9, 2011 11:51 AM | Report abuse

@NoVA

Agree with your 11:51AM post.

Posted by: rukidding7 | March 9, 2011 11:55 AM | Report abuse

JedG

"Regarding public employees unions, if it wasn't for the level of continuity the unions provide the political cronyism of the early 1900's would make any inefficiencies in our current governmental system look like child's play.

Within a year, Scott Walker and the Republicans would have Wisconsin's government in total nepotistic chaos."

This is a fascinating argument, it rings true. Is it your opinion or do you have any cites/links in this regard.

Posted by: shrink2 | March 9, 2011 11:58 AM | Report abuse

@JedG

Haven't seen you here before but welcome and hope you stick around. I'm close to your age and have similar experiences.

The point you bring up at the end of your post truly deserves repeating as you have nailed it and we can see visible proof ALREADY that confirms your thoughts.

"Regarding public employees unions, if it wasn't for the level of continuity the unions provide the political cronyism of the early 1900's would make any inefficiencies in our current governmental system look like child's play.

Within a year, Scott Walker and the Republicans would have Wisconsin's government in total nepotistic chaos."

Madison — The father of the state’s two most powerful legislators was named Tuesday as the head of the State Patrol.

Department of Transportation Secretary Mark Gottlieb passed over five current top officials at the State Patrol to give the job to Stephen Fitzgerald, 68, a former Dodge County sheriff with four decades in law enforcement who was until May the U.S. marshal in the Western District of Wisconsin. Fitzgerald ran for Dodge County sheriff again in September in the Republican primary but was defeated 2-to-1 by incumbent Sheriff Todd Nehls.

Fitzgerald starts Monday and will earn $105,700, slightly less than the current acting superintendent.

Fitzgerald’s sons – Assembly Speaker Jeff Fitzgerald (R-Horicon) and Senate Majority Leader Scott Fitzgerald (R-Juneau) – took over the top positions in their respective houses after Republican victories in November’s elections. The appointment drew sharply divergent reactions in the capital city, ranging from praise to skepticism and outright criticism."

http://www.wisconsincrimenews.com/fitzgerald-selected-to-head-state-patrol-lawmakers-father-selected-over-five-other-candidates/

Posted by: rukidding7 | March 9, 2011 12:00 PM | Report abuse

These guys will even mis-represent people on their own side. Talk about untrustworthy.

Posted by: mypitts2 | March 9, 2011 2:47 PM | Report abuse


TO: Shrink2

Just got back. Here's a quick answer to your question.

It's been a while, but I believe before or right around 1900 there was no Civil Service laws/rules. If I remember correctly people were given not just the agency or department head positions as political rewards, but the cronyism went all the way down the ranks. No experience was required, just a friend of a friend and every party did it.

I believe this started around the time of Andrew Jackson (you may remember THE SPOILS SYSTEM) and then reached new highs under Ulysses S. Grant around the fairly effective Civil Service laws went into effect. Here in Vermont the Gov. can appoint his direct and extended cabinet, that's it.

Sounds like Scott Walker's giving the "SPOILS SYSTEM" a new lease on life, from what one of the other commentators was saying about the State Police and cronyism.

I'm sure the preponderance of Wisconsin State Troopers are wonderful, dedicated people. Stephen Fitzgerald may also be
a nice guy, but given Scott Walker's "phone conversation with the fake "David Koch" regarding "troublemakers" and the obvious cronyism I can't see how Stephen Fitzgerald, Mark Gottlieb and the State Police can function without serious conflicts of interest. One negative incident between the State Police and the protesters and heck could break loose. I think Walker has put the State Police in a no win situation. He's doing them and the Wisconsin citizens a serious disservice.

The police used to be a problem down south. This information makes me skeptical of traveling want to Wisconsin.

Posted by: JedG | March 9, 2011 8:43 PM | Report abuse

Post a Comment

We encourage users to analyze, comment on and even challenge washingtonpost.com's articles, blogs, reviews and multimedia features.

User reviews and comments that include profanity or personal attacks or other inappropriate comments or material will be removed from the site. Additionally, entries that are unsigned or contain "signatures" by someone other than the actual author will be removed. Finally, we will take steps to block users who violate any of our posting standards, terms of use or privacy policies or any other policies governing this site. Please review the full rules governing commentaries and discussions.




characters remaining

 
 
RSS Feed
Subscribe to The Post

© 2011 The Washington Post Company