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10 fictitious Tea Party beliefs

Guest Blogger

In a recent Political Bookworm item focusing on his book “The Virtues of Mendacity: On Lying in Politics,” guest blogger Martin Jay noted that “truth-telling is not always the best policy in even the most democratic of political contexts.” John Amato and David Neiwert get quite worked up over this notion, especially as it applies to the conservative right. In their book, “Over the Cliff: How Obama’s Election Drove the American Right Insane,” due out in June from PoliPoint Press, the authors explore the false stories they say are propagated by figureheads of the right such as Glenn Beck, Rush Limbaugh and Lou Dobbs. Here they identify 10 beliefs of the Tea Party movement that they say are provably untrue. Amato is founder of Crooks and Liars, a progressive weblog. Neiwert is editor of the weblog Orcinus.

By John Amato and David Neiwert

We’ll admit up-front that the title of our forthcoming book,“Over the Cliff: How Obama’s Election Drove the American Right Insane,” indulges in some rhetorical imprecision: conservatives in the United States are of course not really insane in any clinical or legal sense, and we are not suggesting they undergo sanity hearings to determine if their rights should be suspended. We mean “insane” in the common-sense meaning of the word -- having taken leave of their senses.

What other word, after all, can properly describe the behavior of people who adamantly insist on believing things that are provably untrue? Einstein facetiously defined insanity as doing the same thing repeatedly and expecting different results. Defiantly clinging to exploded fantasies and thoroughly debunked false “facts,” even when evidence of their falsity is planted directly in front of them, is a kind of insanity too.

The numbers of things that the American Right -- embodied in its wildly popular new “grassroots” Tea Party movement – believes but that are provably untrue is actually a pretty long list. But we’ve put together the Top 10, listed by importance in their increasingly Planet Bizarro-like worldview:

1. The birth-certificate conspiracy. Reality: Not even official birth certificates from Hawaii, newspaper clippings from 1961, and the testimony of state officials will convince the true-blue Tea Partiers. Which is why WorldNetDaily’s Joseph Farah lectured the National Tea Party Convention for an hour about the “truth” of the birth-certificate story.

2. Death panels. Reality: PolitiFact named Sarah Palin’s Facebook invention its “Lie of the Year,” and the belief was thoroughly exposed as a falsehood by every news network (even Fox). Yet Palin still insists that the panels exist somewhere in the health-care reform bill that was signed into law, its actual language notwithstanding.

3. Obama is a Muslim/Socialist/Fascist. Glenn Beck’s fantasy of the week -- one week Obama was a Socialist, the next he was a Communist, then a Fascist. Then it was on to Marxism and Maoism -- was avidly adopted by sign-bearing fans at Tea Party gatherings, who sometimes shared Beck’s confusion by just calling Obama All of the Above. Reality: Give us a break. Obama’s self-evident cautious centrism, embodied by his health-care reform package stripped of a public option, as well as his more recent embrace of a limited offshore drilling program, has infuriated liberals in his party -- but it hasn’t stopped Tea Partiers from denouncing the president as a radical anyway.

4. Obama is going to take away our guns. Well, the NRA managed to scare a whole lot of people into buying up every gun and piece of ammunition in sight the first year or so after Obama’s election. And at least five police officers died because the suspects they were arresting feared Obama was going to take away their guns. But Obama not only has adhered to his promise not to address gun-control issues, there hasn’t been even a breath of it from his administration. Which, of course, just makes the paranoids that much more paranoid: It’s proof that he’s really up to something.

5. Obama is raising our taxes. Reality: Obama lowered taxes for 95 percent of working Americans in his first year in office. But, you know, he’s a liberal Democrat – and for true-blue right-wing folks, that ALWAYS means a tax hike.

6. Fascism is a left-wing phenomenon. We can thank Jonah Goldberg -- with a big assist from Beck -- for the popularity of this one, even though Goldberg’s thesis has been demolished and angrily dismissed by academic historians. It’s especially come in handy for Tea Partiers with Obama-as-Hitler signs, who are not impressed by those pointy-headed professorial types anyway.

7. Global warming is a hoax. So Sean Hannity assures us, citing the Climategate brouhaha -- which was itself shown largely to be a hoax of its own. Meanwhile, the world’s ocean levels keep rising, and glaciers and the polar ice cap keep receding -- regardless of the endless words thrown up denying that they are.

8. Some 16,000 new IRS agents will enforce the new health care reform act by throwing you in jail. Reality: The IRS is actually only increasing its spending in the coming budget year as it normally would -- but some Republican operatives decided to figure out how many positions its increased budget would buy, and came up with 16,000, a figure that then became gospel on Newt Gingrich’s lips. According to the same mythmakers, this nonexistent new army of health care police was going to start throwing people in jail if they failed to buy health insurance -- though in fact, the only penalties contemplated for such failures are fines and taxes.

9. Two million people were at the 9/12 March on Washington. At the culmination of a monthlong promotion (highlighted by a national Tea Party Express bus tour) by Beck and Fox News, about 70,000 people gathered on the National Mall on September 12 to protest. Beck cited an erroneous early report that over a million had shown up. Later that grew to be two million, the figure now commonly cited by Tea Party leaders as evidence of their tremendous numerical force.

10. The Tea Parties are a non-partisan, broad grassroots movement. Sure, if by non-partisan you mean rabidly paleo-conservative, to the point of even dismissing Republicans, and by grassroots you mean fake populism organized and whipped up by the most popular cable-news network on television, with a heaping helping of corporate financing.
Tea Party folks and their defenders also want to believe that they’re just ordinary Americans who want to be serious about helping their country. But it’s pretty hard to fit that description when you embrace plain old nuttiness.

By Steven E. Levingston  |  May 19, 2010; 5:30 AM ET
Categories:  Guest Blogger  
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Comments

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Posted by: gloryevalia | May 19, 2010 6:13 AM | Report abuse

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Posted by: DaisyTalina | May 19, 2010 6:38 AM | Report abuse

1. Not everyone believes the Birther crap. It is simply a cudgel the Left continues to use to de-legitimize their opposition.
2. "Death Panels" are not in the legislation but Palin's point is that in the fairy tale Obama world of more coverage and less cost the obvious result is rationed care.
3. Obama is a "cautious centrist"? Clearly this is the silliest statement in this entire column. No public option? Not because the President didn't want it. More drilling? So much for that.
4. True in the sense that Obama hasn't actively pursued this issue and ammunition supplies are low. However, Obama has publicly supported the D.C. gun ban in the past.
5. Technically true at this point in time, but the massive increases in spending and walk-back on the "no tax increase" pledge by Orzsag and the VAT talk by other admin officials dooms this claim. Also, state and local taxes are off the charts.
6. Fascism is not limited government regardless of labels. I guess only right-wing statism is unacceptable.
7. Global warming is not a hoax - the author is correct. However, Climategate was a legitimate scandal and all currently proposed legislation (e.g. cap and trade) will have no meaningful impact on global warming - but it will affect #5 on this list.
8. Only fines and taxes if Americans don't purchase federally-mandated health care? I guess we should be happy.
9. The author wouldn't go out of his way to write this article if the Tea Party had no steam.
10. Only Obama supporters are self-organizing grass roots activists? I hope that thought consoles you in November.

Posted by: TeaParty2 | May 19, 2010 7:24 AM | Report abuse

Enjoyed your blog, just hope that your fact checking is better than your spell-checking.
Urban dictionary has an entry for Fictious, but as a headline, i'm thinking that Fictitious is more credible....

Posted by: crayivp | May 19, 2010 10:27 AM | Report abuse

Well first off, if you don't answer the question about your own citizenship (2005) with 'yes I am' and instead say 'no matter, I'm not running for president' I'm sure that gives people cause for concern. Likewise, when your grandmother says she witnessed your birth in Kenya, that would also give people reason to think. However, this is not the backbone of the tea party movement and you won't find anything about this on my own tea party website. But, speech is still free, despite Cass Sunstein wanting to control it.

Second, Peter Orszag of Obama's administrations has said outright that there will be IDAP panels to decide how much to spend on the elderly, and this is in addition to the CER panels written into the stimulus, so whoever wrote this book is on the fringe.

Third, Obama didn't pray on national day of prayer but surely took his shoes off and prayed with the Muslims. You cannot attend school in Indonesia without being a Muslim and there are plenty of photos of him in Muslim garb. Besides, if you act like one that makes you one.

Fourth, Obama will get around our 2nd amendment laws using the UN Small Arms Treaty. Just watch him. After all, there's the flap with the EPA isn't there? He is not to be trusted so he and his cadre of criminals is capable of anything.


Fifth, the health care bill is also an admitted 'redistribution of the wealth'. That tells me I'll be taxed immediately especially since I don't plan to comply. It's in the bill stupid.

Sixth, fascist is as fascist does. Obama has proven to be a fascist and he never disappoints in this dept. It just gets worse. Obama is a Marxist. Period. He was born and bred into the cult. They are by nature fascists.

Seventh, global warming IS a hoax and that's why Obama had to circumvent the law to declare the air we breathe as a pollutant and to be taxed.

Eighth, please see Fifth.

Ninth, there were 1.7M people on the mall which is why you are so upset you have to write this tripe.

Tenth, the movement was not 'whipped up by' TV personalities. It started in 2007 by Ron Paul supporters, on Dec 13 to be exact and marched on DC in July of 2008. And it continues today stronger than ever.

Finally, by name-calling (saying we "embrace plain old nuttiness") this author has just obliterated any legitimacy his misconceptions might have had.

How could anyone take the author of Crooks and Liars seriously? His blog is self-named.

WaPo is fading as a news outlet, and this kind of writing proves why.


Posted by: username | May 19, 2010 11:20 AM | Report abuse

"Ninth, there were 1.7M people on the mall which is why you are so upset you have to write this tripe."
Your dreaming- I was there and 70k is being polite.

Posted by: dcperspective | May 19, 2010 12:17 PM | Report abuse

Someone who wants to repeal the Board of Education and the Federal Reserve, Rand Paul, has no shot to win a general, even in the south. Way too crazy.

The media has fed this whole thing, originally a Fox creation. Scott Brown is repelled by these folks.

Most members are rascists and don't like the fact that there is a black couple sleeping in the White House, that is why they are angry and want "their" country back.

Posted by: johnkomalley | May 19, 2010 12:27 PM | Report abuse

If you are willing to argue that comparative effectiveness research (aka good science) is a death panel, then you can argue anything. CER is simply research in to what treatment methods result in the best outcomes, so that doctors can follow the best available evidence. It's also called evidence-based medicine, and it's been around for decades. It's got nothing to do with rationing. It's called getting your money's worth by buying the better product.

Posted by: JoeT1 | May 19, 2010 12:30 PM | Report abuse

Sarah Palin....Teabaggers....you are very scary. It does not just scare me that some poor, dimwitted folks actually believe what you are saying. The scariest thought is the number of uneducated people in this once great country that choose to have a cable network entertainer as their leader. May God help us.

Posted by: david865 | May 19, 2010 12:53 PM | Report abuse

People believe what they want to believe, unfortunately for the truth. David865 is absolutely correct: what is really scary is the uneducated people who choose to believe everything Limbaugh,
Beck, Hannity, and Palin say.

Posted by: Aquarius1 | May 19, 2010 1:01 PM | Report abuse

TeaParty2,

1.Obama has shown his BC.

2. We have rationed care now. but we pay more and get less than all other industrialized nations. And everyone should talk about end-of-life care with their families.

3. Obama wanted a Public Option, but realized it was an easy clause to take out and show that he is willing to negotiate. The new health care bill actually helps the public sector.

4. Obama signed the law that allows gun owners to carry in public parks. Pro-gun members rallied in a public park to fight their rights being taken away. Laughable.

5. Taxes are at their lowest rates since the 1950s.

6. It is impossible for anyone to be a Muslim, Fascist, Communist, and Nazi at the same time, all while you hate his preacher.

7. You are right on this one. But I would argue that everyone has to go back to 4th grade science and relearn the meaning of scientific theory. I'm tired of the opposition saying, "There are holes in global warming and evolution, and it's just a theory anyway."

8. As a democrat, I didn't like this piece of the legislation, and it will probably come out of the final bill. But I also understood why it was put in there. It was hypocritical for Republicans to come out against this piece because it was central to their solution when the Clintons were trying to push health care.

9. The Tea Baggers have steam with the extreme of the base, or less than 20% of the electorate who call themselves Republicans. They will win primaries but they will have a hard time reshaping their positions for general elections.

10. In November, only the grassroots campaigns who focus on local issues will win. Both parties should keep that in mind. But they should also remember that they will have to win swing voters and so they have to keep their messages more practical than they think.

Posted by: pathfinder12 | May 19, 2010 1:33 PM | Report abuse

What a POS article - obviously the writer has not done ANY research. Can't wait for NOV elections. TeaParty2, you forgot one - Hillary Clinton just announced that she will support the UN Small Arms Treaty. This treaty will ignore our Consitution and enforce licensing and permits on all gun owners. Once the US goes the way of the UN, we are doomed.

Posted by: NO-bama | May 19, 2010 1:34 PM | Report abuse

One thing that continues to run through my head when anyone discusses "death panels"

(i.e. "2. "Death Panels" are not in the legislation but Palin's point is that in the fairy tale Obama world of more coverage and less cost the obvious result is rationed care.")

is the simple reality that all healthcare is already rationed. If you don't have enough money for expensive treatments, you die. There's no safety net, no cost sharing, you just die.

In its extreme case, how does that differ from "death panels"? Someone still dies due to lack of money.

Even with nationalized health care (and this law is hardly that...), everyone still has the right to find a healthcare provider willing to provide all the care he or she wants -- if he or she has the money to pay....

Of course, the dying patient (in either case...) could just "barter" for that care -- maybe a chicken or two?

Posted by: JimFromIndy | May 19, 2010 2:26 PM | Report abuse

That UN small arms treaty won't touch your guns, unless you plan to sell them to a terrorist or some foreign nationals.

But your masters at the NRA want you to think your guns are at stake because whether you know it or not, the NRA is no longer a fraternal organization of gun owning patriots, it is the haunt of one of the most powerful and pernicious lobbies in the history of our government.

They know they won;t be able to sell small arms to terrorists and third-world despots once those restrictions are in place, so they convince all of you half-wits your own guns are at stake.

You should be defying those liars, not the people who want to protect innocent African villagers from gun-toting Arab murderers. And regardless of whether you believe it, that is the essence of the small arms restrictions.

OBAMA does NOT want to take your guns away. Stop believing anyone who tells you otherwise. They are just using you to cover up the murder of children in Africa and elsewhere.

Posted by: JEP07 | May 19, 2010 2:27 PM | Report abuse

tea party 2;

"Not everyone believes the Birther crap. It is simply a cudgel the Left continues to use to de-legitimize their opposition."

If you have even an ounce of the courage you pretend to have, then go pronounce that statement out loud at the next armed Teamob rally...

Posted by: JEP07 | May 19, 2010 2:30 PM | Report abuse

There is much more of a "death panel" in the HMOs' accounting office than there is in their medical facilities.

Posted by: JEP07 | May 19, 2010 2:33 PM | Report abuse

Steve:
I give you a lot of credit for actually trying to pose an argument with some of your 10 points. Most Sudo intellectuals usually stoop to character assassination (Aka Saul Alinsky) or to shouting the lie to the mob, over and over again. (Aka Adolph Hitler) You really put some thought into this.

Fascism is neither right nor left of anything. It is the union of Government and Corporations (Aka Goldman Sachs, the Banks, Gm, Fannie Mae, the Insurance Companies, ECT.) to defraud (TARP) “THE CITIZENRY” (that’s you and me) of our Freedom and Prosperity.( like in the Constitution) Are we in agreement so far?

Now I'm not going to go point for point with you on the BS of whether Obaaama is a “Usurper,” what Beck said or didn’t say, is Global warming real or not, how many IRS agents can dance on the head of a pin or, any other debate which obfuscates the true debate. You will have lots of time to debate all this in a nice encampment in you future. So I’ll point out several “FACTS” and finish with some thoughts of much Greater Statesmen to drive home the point.

The Administrations continues in the practice of “Secret Prisons,” “Extraordinary Rendition,” “Torture,” and currently wants to repeal your Miranda rights (as if that matters) in cases of Terrorism of course. The Federal Government (that would be your beloved Obaama) continues to illegally listen to “ALL” Domestic communication (and has nonstop for over 30 years) with special emphasis on members of their enemies list.
NY TIMES (Federal Judge Finds N.S.A. Wiretaps Were Illegal By CHARLIE SAVAGE and JAMES RISEN Published: March 31, 2010)

The Federal Governments continues to deny the 5th Amendment, Due Process, to some of it's “Special” citizens and as for your 2nd Amendment rights, there is a current news flash. It won’t matter if you have one gun or a thousand; this Government has a can of woop ass just for you, to fix all that.

Lastly I say this to all who read this and love our Constitutional Freedoms, especially you Mr. Levingston:

"If ye love wealth greater than liberty, the tranquility of servitude greater than the animating contest for freedom, go home from us in peace. "We seek not your counsel," nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you; May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity "forget" that ye were our countrymen."
~~ Samuel Adams

None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free.
~~Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

History records that the money changers (That would be the Federal Reserve) have used “every form” of abuse, intrigue, deceit, and violent means possible to maintain their control over governments, by controlling money and its issuance.
~~James Madison

I wouldn’t think you would like to DEBUNK any of this?

I thought not!


Posted by: jafo2me | May 19, 2010 2:35 PM | Report abuse

As to Obama being a Muslim - Borack Obama was a member of the Trinity United Church of Christ in Chicago, a mainline denomination with roots in Congregationalism and Reformed Church traditions. His Pastor Jeremiah Wright was a Viet Nam vet - For some reason the mainline media - CBS, ABC, NBC, and most cable stations seem to be afraid to contradict the wingnuts.

Posted by: DonW2 | May 19, 2010 2:47 PM | Report abuse

Nice job laying out the facts behind those 10 whopping Big Lies the wingnuts preach as gospel. Too bad it won't work. For the teabagger crowd, this isn't ideology, it's religion, and you can't fight faith with facts. Those loons will believe what they want to believe, and slapping them across their slack-jawed faces with the truth will only make them dig in deeper. You just can't fix stupid.

Posted by: WaitingForGodot | May 19, 2010 2:47 PM | Report abuse

As to Obama being a Muslim - Borack Obama was a member of the Trinity United Church of Christ in Chicago, a mainline denomination with roots in Congregationalism and Reformed Church traditions. His Pastor Jeremiah Wright was a Viet Nam vet - For some reason the mainline media - CBS, ABC, NBC, and most cable stations seem to be afraid to contradict the wingnuts.

-------------------------

Bringing up Wright will never help Obama's case. Also, he only joined that church so he could look like he cared (Politician).

Posted by: Holla26 | May 19, 2010 2:51 PM | Report abuse

Death Panels have been alive and well in the United States--they reside not in government but in insurance companies which already ration care. Death panel verdicts are called denial of coverage, finding of pre-existing condition, refusal to cover treatment prescribed by the doctor, etc. These death panels work. People die prematurely as a result. The panels also work for their intended purpose--protecting profit margins of the insurance companies.

Posted by: Laurie6 | May 19, 2010 2:53 PM | Report abuse

Man those T-party folks and supporters are really uneducated and willful liars even the posters here like the one who spell Pseudo "Sudo".

The T-Partiers want to believe what they want to believe without proof and with proof. They're just stupid with a capital S, stupid, and racist with a capital R.

Tell these misinformed miscreants that the sky is blue and they'll say it's an Obama Left Wing Conspiracy to take their guns or take their freedoms or raise their taxes or any other stupidity that they happen to have gleaned from the Cosmos and Limbaugh.

They should all be wearing aluminum foil hats to keep the Left Wing Gamma Rays from penetrating their thick empty skulls.

Posted by: davidbronx | May 19, 2010 2:54 PM | Report abuse

Who says all Tea Party members believe these? Is this not a sweeping statement meant to stereotype this movement as stupid? Jeez, this is like me saying all Democrats believe Bush was in on 9/11. The only thing that brings the Tea Party together is this -

The Contract from America lists 10 agenda items that it encourages congressional candidates to follow:

1. Identify constitutionality of every new law: Require each bill to identify the specific provision of the Constitution that gives Congress the power to do what the bill does (82.03%).
2. Reject emissions trading: Stop the "cap and trade" administrative approach used to control pollution by providing economic incentives for achieving reductions in the emissions of pollutants. (72.20%).
3. Demand a balanced federal budget: Begin the Constitutional amendment process to require a balanced budget with a two-thirds majority needed for any tax modification. (69.69%)
4. Simplify the tax system: Adopt a single-rate tax system; eliminate the internal revenue code and replace it with one that is no longer than 4,543 words. (64.90%).
5. Audit federal government agencies for constitutionality: Create a Blue Ribbon taskforce that engages in an audit of federal agencies and programs, assessing their Constitutionality, and identifying duplication, waste, ineffectiveness, and agencies and programs better left for the states or local authorities. (63.37%)
6. Limit annual growth in federal spending: Impose a statutory cap limiting the annual growth in total federal spending to the sum of the inflation rate plus the percentage of population growth. (56.57%).
7. Repeal the health care legislation passed on March 23, 2010: Defund, repeal and replace the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act. (56.39%).
8. Pass an 'All-of-the-Above' Energy Policy: Authorize the exploration of additional energy reserves to reduce American dependence on foreign energy sources and reduce regulatory barriers to all other forms of energy creation. (55.5%).
9. Reduce Earmarks: Place a moratorium on all earmarks until the budget is balanced, and then require a 2/3 majority to pass any earmark. (55.47%).
10. Reduce Taxes: Permanently repeal all recent tax increases, including those to the income tax, capital gains tax and estate taxes, currently scheduled to begin in 2011. (53.38%).

Posted by: Holla26 | May 19, 2010 2:56 PM | Report abuse

Point by Point:

1. The distrust of his birth origin was related to not providing evididence when asked. Very few conservatives ever held that belief but if it helps your cause keep screaming foul.

2. Death panels are called Health care rationing boards. They are real in Europe and necessary where limited funds need to be stretched. Cost/benfit is done and if you are too old for that new hip, too bad.

3. Obama is certainly a socialist and although not a Muslim that might be better than Rev Wright's religion of separation and hate.

4. Obama would take away our guns if he thought it would not endanger the rest of the liberal agenda.

5. Obama is printing and borrowing money so the taxes can wait for the next guy to pay for everything.

6. Facist, Stalin like. What is the difference? Big government either way and certainly the shoe fits!

7. 125,000 years ago the seas were 20' higher than today and it was a much warmer climate than now. Who was to blame then? Global warming is real, so are ice ages. The open question is how much is man made. Since we are in an inter glacial period I hope someone is thinking how to prevent the next ice age unless Canada and half the US can be written off under a mile of ice.

8. What happens if you don't pay the fine or taxes? Jail?

9. Who cares? Alot of people will show up at the polls where it really counts. Bye Bye Dimocrats.

10. Yeah, we can't think for ourselves. It is all Rush's idea. Even if we have some good leaders who can articulate the message, how does that dismiss the people who agree with it? We won't take Hannity with us to the polls but we know which lever to pull.

Posted by: 1951dewey | May 19, 2010 3:00 PM | Report abuse

Another weak attempt to attack and demonize conseratives with inuendos and barefaced lies.The one thing Americans can always count on from our far left socialists, is name calling attempts to bully and character assassanation.
This is how I alway's Know the left is lying,not looking out for America's intrests. This same old plan socialist have used over and over serves to solidify my beliefs that they are A.Are power hungary B.believe they know whats best for you .c could not debate or convince ant rational person why their ideas would work.

Posted by: jburo | May 19, 2010 3:22 PM | Report abuse

Another weak attempt to attack and demonize conseratives with inuendos and barefaced lies.The one thing Americans can always count on from our far left socialists, is name calling attempts to bully and character assassanation.
This is how I alway's Know the left is lying,not looking out for America's intrests. This same old plan socialist have used over and over serves to solidify my beliefs that they are A.Are power hungary B.believe they know whats best for you .c could not debate or convince ant rational person why their ideas would work.

Posted by: jburo | May 19, 2010 3:24 PM | Report abuse

Steven ...

You're not only a feckless liar but also a damned liar .

Posted by: lagnafrah | May 19, 2010 3:24 PM | Report abuse

I will never cease to be amazed at the regurgitation of simplistic ideas repeated over & over again by main stream media, and then coughed up by people such as this writer. Racist, birthers, Sarah Palin devotees, Glenn Beck followers, go ahead and label all those who disagree with the current White House occupant and his minions on the Hill, but don't mind us when we laugh all the way to the voting booth in November. Dismiss us, Deny us, Ignore us, Mock us, Belittle us, whatever it takes to let you "O"bots sleep at night, but just because you believe these things to be true, does not make them true.

Posted by: CHAOS3 | May 19, 2010 3:32 PM | Report abuse

1. Not everyone believes the Birther crap. It is simply a cudgel the Left continues to use to de-legitimize their opposition.
2. "Death Panels" are not in the legislation but Palin's point is that in the fairy tale Obama world of more coverage and less cost the obvious result is rationed care.
3. Obama is a "cautious centrist"? Clearly this is the silliest statement in this entire column. No public option? Not because the President didn't want it. More drilling? So much for that.
4. True in the sense that Obama hasn't actively pursued this issue and ammunition supplies are low. However, Obama has publicly supported the D.C. gun ban in the past.
5. Technically true at this point in time, but the massive increases in spending and walk-back on the "no tax increase" pledge by Orzsag and the VAT talk by other admin officials dooms this claim. Also, state and local taxes are off the charts.
6. Fascism is not limited government regardless of labels. I guess only right-wing statism is unacceptable.
7. Global warming is not a hoax - the author is correct. However, Climategate was a legitimate scandal and all currently proposed legislation (e.g. cap and trade) will have no meaningful impact on global warming - but it will affect #5 on this list.
8. Only fines and taxes if Americans don't purchase federally-mandated health care? I guess we should be happy.
9. The author wouldn't go out of his way to write this article if the Tea Party had no steam.
10. Only Obama supporters are self-organizing grass roots activists? I hope that thought consoles you in November.

***************************************
1 If not everyone believes the birther crap, why do I hear so many teabaggers bring it up?

2 No, Palin said the bill set up death panels. That's a lie and you know it.

3 As far as you are concerned, all Democrats are leftists. So why bother on this one?

4 OK, you admit that this is another tea party fairy tale. Bravo!

5 Another fairy tale gone. Talk about a VAT means nothing, and Obama is not responsible for state taxes going up.

6. No one said limited government is fascism. However, plenty of teabaggers have said leftists are fascists.

7 Climategate was a minor scandal that did nothing to shake the scientific consensus on global warming. The first four months on 2010 were the warmest on record, by the way.

8 A fine is not a tax. That is like calling a speeding violation a tax.

9 I do think the tea party movement has steam, but it mainly produces hot air.

10 The point is that Libertarian elements in the GOP (Dick Armey) started this movement with corporate money.

Boy, you are too reasonable - I can't fight with you on many of these points.

Posted by: maggots | May 19, 2010 3:32 PM | Report abuse

I guess you didn't like the outcome of last night's elections. If this is the best you can come up (most of which is false) then it may be time for you to look for another job! (like the rest of your liberal friends)

Posted by: cmm1970 | May 19, 2010 3:33 PM | Report abuse

Unfortunately the title doesn't match the article. Telling the same lies over and over does convince the true believers, and as is the case with "Global Warming" and sheeple.

Some things in the article are reasonable, i.e., Obama has done a few things, maybe offshore drilling, maybe support for financing for nuclear power, etc., that don't match the kooks of the left, I'm sorry, I meant the Greens. However to accept as fact that there is global warming is patently absurd. There is considerable evidence that factors totally out of the control of humans are what really affect the climate. We are entering a period of La Nina, coupled with a start of the solar minimum, and further there is volcanic activity that due to the coincidence of these things many believe will cause major global cooling. Anyone who believes in the reliability of projections into the future certainly needs to re-examine their though process. Furture projections are notoriously incorrect. These ideas are strongly supported by groups that derive their incomes from the funding for these programs, and as such their bias should be strongly considered.

Academics in modern America become academics because of their inability to function in the real world by and large. For those of us who have hired PhD's and had to fire them because of their lack of actual knowledge of the real world this is axiomatic.

I submit that a great majority of politicians in this country are statists, Dems and Repubs alike, interested only in their own power. We need to cease using labels and look at voting records and the reasonableness of a politicians proposals; whether they help or hurt the citizenry. This unfortunately takes more than ideology and sound bites and I believe the vast majority of Americans are to lazy to invest the time and effort required to achieve this. It's a shame someone in the middle who rejects both the kooks of the left and the right hasn't appeared in our political life. Maybe what we really need is a new centrist party.

Posted by: independent25 | May 19, 2010 3:39 PM | Report abuse

5. Obama is raising our taxes. (from article)
The following is an analogy! (Don't want to be accused of lying.)
We (USA) were in a car heading for a cliff" during the Bush / Clinton / Bush Reagan / Carter / Nixon / Johnson years. Obama got control of the car and stomped on the gas. The cliff - that was 20 years away - is now only months away.
I'm sorry if we can't look at your pitiful tax cuts with any confidence or admiration. Forgive us if our voices are getting an octive higher and a good bit louder. We hear what Obama and these shrills for his cause are saying. We would change our tune and sing his praises if we didn't see him ON PURPOSE HEADING FOR THE CLIFF!
But seeing what he is doing takes all the joy out of the taxcuts! Once the car goes off the cliff, Facisim/Communism whatever - It won't matter. Gulag or concentration camps - the difference is purely academic. Check out Greece and the anarchy produced by cutbacks.) We think that this is what Obama wants.
Even conservatives will support marshall law over total anarchy. (We have anarchy on the Texas and Arizona borders and we can see this financial meltdown coming like a freight train.) We are not arguing what IS, as much as a whole bunch of the grown-ups in this country can see where this is going. Like Bill Clinton said, "I worked hard to give you the tax cuts I promised, but since I inherited the worst economy...I had to raise the taxes, EVEN THO I PROMISED IN THE ELECTION I WOULD NOT!
Your writing above is the equivelent of a room of teenagers who think their reasoning power is so far beyond everyone else; they make brilliant points; teenagers agree with them; not the adults, but who cares?
This is an apt descrition of the wisdom of the 60's.
Bill, Hillary, Obama, and Ayers; they're all winking at each other and laughing; but the adults can't get their eyes off of the stuff that's coming, just as sure as your miserable logic fouls the nation's air. It stinks and the adults can smell it!

Posted by: trevithick | May 19, 2010 3:45 PM | Report abuse

Facts and logic cannot dissuade people from beliefs that did not spring from facts or logic. They have faith that Obama is evil, so he must be.

Posted by: wd1214 | May 19, 2010 3:52 PM | Report abuse

The saddest thing, really, is that the GIGANTIC majority of those who are in full throat against the current administration would benefit so greatly by it's initiatives. Unless you are making multi hundred-thousand-dollar salaries and have a robust investment portfolio you are being duped. Big Right Media and Big Business (same thing, I guess) are feeding you with things to be afraid of, and they are laughing at you as you regurgitate them. Yes, they're laughing their fannies off...at you...as you carry their water for them.

Think, please, about what is REALLY in these socialist/fascist (polar opposite "isms", btw) programs and you will realize that you are fighting against your own best interests. If you won't or can't think in these terms, then I pity you. And I fear that the movie "Idiocracy" will soon be thought of as a documentary.

Posted by: JoeT63 | May 19, 2010 4:11 PM | Report abuse

It's easy enough to knock down the straw men the author has created. But it would be more honest to determine what actual tea party people believe, as opposed to what the author thinks they might believe.

Posted by: Trucker49 | May 19, 2010 4:35 PM | Report abuse

Isn't it hilarious? All the zany rightwingers on here are proving Steven's point by repeating the same lies the article says they believe...HI-larious!

Posted by: rednaxela1 | May 19, 2010 4:39 PM | Report abuse

When the writings cited claim that human activity is causing global warming, then all else in those writings can be dismissed as written by careless or lazy authors. The concept of human causation is a hoax. Overall global warming may be happening now as a naturla cycle, but please, don't claim it has anything to do with human activity.
If you think otherwise, ask who is behind this claim? Who has to profit? Who is pushing it? And then go to the technical papers themselves. You will find nothing but statistics based on very random data. Go ahead dear liberals, try it.

Posted by: rimantas1 | May 19, 2010 4:40 PM | Report abuse

I read the article and was going to put truth to the biased prospective of the author. Then I read the comments and discovered that TeaParty2 had done a credible job of debunking. I am just delighted that these 10 issues continue out there. Despite what the author says, they are NOT false and they are real. The author simply wishes to put a certain 'spin' on the truth - a spin with which I do not agree.

Posted by: IQ168 | May 19, 2010 5:03 PM | Report abuse

I know that this article is a bunch of baloney because it was in in the Post.

Posted by: depoulins | May 19, 2010 5:04 PM | Report abuse

Well number 4 (gun ban) is false right out the gate. Who can forget Eric Holder's attempt to jump-start a debate on a new ban on so-called "assault weapons?"

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/story?id=6960824&page=1
"Obama to Seek New Assault Weapons Ban:
Previous Ban Expired in 2004 During the Bush Administration

By JASON RYAN
WASHINGTON, Feb. 25, 2009

The Obama administration will seek to reinstate the assault weapons ban that expired in 2004 during the Bush administration, Attorney General Eric Holder said today. . . ."

Oh, well, better luck next time partisan warriors . . ..

Posted by: k_romulus | May 19, 2010 5:15 PM | Report abuse

"That tells me I'll be taxed immediately especially since I don't plan to comply. It's in the bill stupid."
---
You don't plan to comply?, why do you expect free health care then, do you honestly think you will go throughout life not taking a trip to the emergency room?, and if so then taxpayers will pay your bill at an inflated rate.

It's people like you who made this legislation necessary.

Posted by: JRM2 | May 19, 2010 5:26 PM | Report abuse

I’m a sixty five year old Tea Party enthusiast. I’ve never been politically active until last year when I attended five Tea Parties, including Washington D.C. and I had a ball. I would like to thank Mr. Levingston for helping to promote the Tea Party. Hopefully, we will rid our nation of the Obama plague and Mr. Levingston will be left to writing about grass root liberals like Acorn.

There’s only one question I would like to ask and it’s about Mr. Livingston’s item number ten. I paid all my expenses to travel to Washington D.C. from Chicago and I even made my own sign. Where can I get a “heaping helping of corporate financing” for the 9/11 march this year?

Posted by: veritas9 | May 19, 2010 6:01 PM | Report abuse

Thank you for an informative article. I read articles, looked at all television stations, seen videos where Tea party people expressed their views. What you stated is true. If people were interested in truth They would look at every source and think for themselves. When i hear the Tea Party yelling that they want their country back maybe they should ask the Indians about who the country belonged to and how did they lose it. My belief is that I don't want the country to go back I want it to go forward and become exceptional as it could be with people of good will and eliminate the toxic ideas going around. People believe what the want to when its comfortable and doesn't require investigating all sources and examining their own ideas. Tea party is being pimped and being lead them down the kool Aid path while Limbaugh, Palin, Beck and Fox commentators are building up their salaries

Posted by: newsman65 | May 19, 2010 7:22 PM | Report abuse

#8. fines and taxes - what happens if you do not pay these fines and taxes??? You forgot to tell us.

Posted by: rockey918 | May 19, 2010 7:26 PM | Report abuse

The Tea Party movement is gaining momentum & will continue to do so, in spite of the obvious lies of the mainstream media - who, btw, are doing a great disservice to this country. Tolerance is something that the Progressives have not yet learned - it comes with maturity & wisdom. Adults know that actions have consequences - making fun of people who are "different" from you and then passing "hate crime" laws is hypocritical. The hard-working "middle class" of this nation is being destroyed & many of them don't even know it yet. What "effort" did you put into this book when it is just talking points we hear on a daily basis - every day?

Posted by: dirtywaters | May 19, 2010 7:30 PM | Report abuse

The blog reaches a new low with this partisan hackery.

1. The picture of a cert we've seen isn't "official" in and of itself. A picture isn't an official copy. And, HI admits they've never authenticated that picture.

2. State officials never "testified" to anything, i.e., in court. HI has released two (2) statements on this matter.

3. Regarding the IRS agents, see the end of http://peekURL.com/vr88f3i where the IRS Commissioner refuses to answer how many agents he'll be adding.

Posted by: LonewackoDotCom | May 19, 2010 7:31 PM | Report abuse

What lunacy! After the authors ask rhetorically, "What other word, after all, can properly describe the behavior of people who adamantly insist on believing things that are provably untrue?" they go on to describe Barack Obama's "self-evident cautious centrism." ROTFLMAO
This entire article is a smug attempt to deride those who disagree with the authors' political opinions by selectively oversimplifying and mischaracterizing their positions. The same could be done to the feeble "evidence" that the authors present as "proof" of the superiority of their "truths."
Moonbats like these are as unwilling to face facts as the wingnuts. They just cloak their closed minds behind their smug elitism.
Both are PITAs.

Posted by: parkbench | May 19, 2010 7:39 PM | Report abuse

T Partyers have always been party animals. I grew up with them. They were the ones in school who always said "I'm never going to need to know this social studies or civics crap." Instead of studying they partied.

Posted by: ricktaft | May 19, 2010 7:50 PM | Report abuse

I know that this article is a bunch of baloney because it was in in the Post.

Posted by: depoulins | May 19, 2010 5:04 PM

==========================================

I really don't understand why people continue to dump on the Post, but still read it and comment on the stories. If you're drinking sour milk, the simple fix to end your torment is to stop drinking the sour milk.

Posted by: damascuspride04 | May 19, 2010 10:04 PM | Report abuse

6. It's probably not even conceivable for fascism to be a left-wing phenomenon to begin with. The lines between fiscal/moral conservatives who traditionally cater to big corps and individual rights driven liberal who cater to pet peeve rights and regulation and unions have ALWAYS been such that a wacko Dem was a communist and a wacko Rep was a fascist. It can play out no other way. One can at least use the arguments utilized by lib Dems for their pet projects to bolster ANY argument for ANY other indiviudal constitutional rights, which is rarely the case for things touted by Reps unless one wishes to focus on the right to bear arms or right to life or anything else God has told them to ignore in the Constitution or subsequent Amendments. For all other intents and purposes, they quash/crush individual rights to conform to "their" utopian ideals. That being said, point number ten is simply absurd. A person that doesn't agree with normal or extreme righties or lefties is simply a moderate libertarian; good for them if they are.
Tea partiers can be as unbalanced as either side can. It depends on the issue. More of what I have read about them seems to be geared towards issues rather than an overarching sentiment for balance and meaning with respect to ALL constitutional rights. Go loud, go proud, or go home. Constitutional individual rights equality is the key; are the tea partiers there yet? Certainly not. They are one party one day and the other the next. Reps and Dems already own that gig.

Posted by: godlymammon | May 19, 2010 11:12 PM | Report abuse

Perhaps the Tea Partiers think we should repeal Social Security and Medicare, too. Because if it were up to missguided folks like most of these people, who believe all the rhetoric that comes out of the mouths of the right wing extremists, like Rush, and Glen, to name a couple. we would not have ever had social security.

How do they think Social Security and Medicare came about? It sure wasn't by idiots like Glen Beck. Well, I take that back. He isn't an idiot.
He knows perfectly well what he is doing. He is playing to an audience that he is well paid to perform for. An audience that wants to believe anything and everything bad about the current President, and Administration. Even responsible Republicans are appalled. It is "One Flew Over The Coo Coo's Nest" time. People have gone berzerk! How about looking to yourselves people, for some of the blame. Wanting everything yesterday. Everything made easy. We are as much to blame as are politicians.

Then, you vote an administration into Office, and expect them to create miracles in a years time. The problems developed over a number of years. Give them a chance. The Congressmen and Senators are arguing with each other, and unable to find concensus, because You the American People can't make up your minds. They are trying to follow your lead. You put them in Office. Why not let them do their job for a change. At least give them a chance.

Posted by: suejuarez2000 | May 19, 2010 11:36 PM | Report abuse

Good try Levingston, but after hearing both sides and seeing the failure we have trying to run this country for over a year now, most Americans already know where they stand and what they believe. My best advice would be if you can't beat them, join them, so relax a little and have a cup of tea so we can continue enjoying our American pie in future generations.

Posted by: pwatkins52 | May 20, 2010 12:10 AM | Report abuse

"They're just stupid with a capital S, stupid, and racist with a capital R."

Naturally. We're so raaaacist, we run 32 black candidates and ditch some of the white ones. How many black candidates are the party of slavery and segregation running?

Thank you.

Posted by: EMT907 | May 20, 2010 5:13 AM | Report abuse

Teabaggers are always good for a chuckle. Most of us know it's all nonsense but it's still funny to watch a scraggly assemblage of fat old white people shouting about how life is so hard for them.

Posted by: wideblacksky | May 20, 2010 8:45 AM | Report abuse

Here are a couple of Truths...deal with it!
- The National Debt is exploding our childrens future!
- A Trillion Spent and still no jobs other than Gov't Jobs!!
- An Appology-a-Day from the WH is not world leadership.
- Words do not secure the borders.
- More intrusive Federal Gov't into individual lives is not the answer.

- Finally the NEW SOCIALIST DEMOCRATIC PARTY IS INFLUENCED BY THOSE IN THE WH WHO HAVE A COMMUNIST, MARXIST BACKGROUND...AND BELIEVE THAT AT LEAST A EURO STYLE SOCIETY IS BETTER THAN WHAT WE HAVE...DESPITE THE FAILURES OF LATE. Saying that is not so...does not change the fact...!

Posted by: NeoConVeteran | May 20, 2010 9:47 AM | Report abuse

They're just miffed that the Goldline "investment" they dumped their life savings into isn't worth 60% of what they paid. Its hard to be rational when you can be duped so readily.

Posted by: trident420 | May 20, 2010 9:47 AM | Report abuse

Get your facts straight Levingston. Just another jacka$$ liberal spouting nonsense. Keep it up man, you only have 2 years left until that Socialist/Marxist Barrack Hussein Obama is out of there! Now the thought of that puts a smile on my face like the cheshire cat.

Posted by: TheDr5544 | May 20, 2010 9:51 AM | Report abuse

>>> In a recent Political Bookworm item focusing on his book “The Virtues of Mendacity: On Lying in Politics,” guest blogger Martin Jay noted that “truth-telling is not always the best policy in even the most democratic of political contexts.”

Sad but true! Teapartybell.com features this as one of the top ten articles under category Tea Party

Posted by: miscparty | May 20, 2010 10:42 AM | Report abuse

" guess you didn't like the outcome of last night's elections. If this is the best you can come up (most of which is false) then it may be time for you to look for another job! (like the rest of your liberal friends)"...

A prime example of the depth of the Right's political and social views.

1.People who support social programs are out of work and just want "free stuff" from the government.

2.Only "liberals" and lazy people are out of work.

3."Liberals" are lazy, therefore.

Conservatives hate first, substantiate later. That's why their arguments are rife with "Us versus them" overtones. It's all hateful rhetoric. It's why they are so easily swayed by the talking heads who lead the right-wing noise machine. They'll believe anything that backs up their feelings of disdain.

After the 2008 elections, conservatives were all but guaranteed extinction. Barack Hussein Obama, by refusing to meet your ignorant rants and conjured up "facts" with bold and swift denouncements, by trying time and again to bring conservatives into the political process, has given you more legitacy and credibility than you could have done yourselves. He should have just let you embarrassing dopes fade into obscurity.

He rescued you from political extinction. Count your blessings.

Those of us on the Left recognize that this President is a step in the right direction, even if he lets us down continuously.

According to the the Imitation Tea Party, the answer to the eight years of mess ups by the previous administration is to do what George Bush did..Only twice as much. Screwy.

Come November, the Tea-flavored-Partiers will be exposed as the corporate funded, racist organization that it is.

Posted by: ajstick | May 20, 2010 11:46 AM | Report abuse

Guys: How about this, post the 10 things that are nutty on the LEFT, can you do that? Here's the conundrum - can the LEFT critique itself ?? Here's your chance...

Posted by: genefitzhugh | May 20, 2010 1:52 PM | Report abuse

So many teabags, so little time.

Teapartiers seem to be the human embodiment of lemmings, who mindlessly run off a cliff because other lemmings are running off the cliff. And the cliff is right there in front of you, but in order to see it, you'd have to open your eyes, and your minds.

At some point, tea partiers seem to have had a brain freeze - they gave up thinking for themselves and they believe everything every fear monger and populist demagogue says. They probably started as ditto heads, and once they allowed someone to call them that, they really gave up self-respect. So when they hit the cliff, the fall to reality is going to be a long way down.

President Bush did so much damage to our Constitutional rights. And where were the teaparty people then? Why didn't you rise to stop President Bush when he was taking away individual freedoms, privacy, imprisoning people without trial and acting like Glenn Beck's favorite scary person, Hitler?

According to those terrible people who examine facts, most members of the teaparty groups are white men, most retired, many comfortably retired, and with time on their hands. Idle hands are the... well you know. Idle minds are even worse.

Posted by: TPaine1 | May 20, 2010 5:41 PM | Report abuse

The debate between left and right is a joke. If any of you bothered to look outside your own country and see that the world thinks your two major parties are right wing (D) and more right wing (R) and in some cases Fascist, as it sleeps so well with big business, then you will realise the cold war has finished and you can get back to having left wing politics discussed in a rational manner.

It is ironic that movements like the Tea Party which crave independence think that being Green is somehow socialist. If you generate your own clean green energy,water and food and run it in a sustainable economy then you are giving yourselves control over your entire life. You aren't dependent on foreign energy sources,loans to pay for them, or the taxes/subsidies needed to pay for exploration or a huge defence force to invade Oil countries.
You pay more per head for Health care than the rest of the world yet 50 million of you go without.
You pay second only to Europe in subsidising your Farmers yet claim free trade.
Bush imposed a 30% tariff on steel imports yet you attack other countries for doing anything similar.
You pay more on war machinery/defence than the rest of the world combined.
When China is sucking up as much energy per head as you are then you will come to realise the world does have limited resources and you may need to share this planet.

Posted by: r333 | May 20, 2010 8:12 PM | Report abuse

You folks who still believe the alarmists' "climate change-nee global warming" refuse to listen to the former research director of the UN Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC). His name is Phil Jones and he resigned under pressure of the leaked/hacked emails which told the truth about "tricking" (falsely raising the temperatures) to make them agree with the alarmists and grant seekers. Jones has since stated to the media, "there has been no global warming over the past 15 years." That statement blows holes in the 2007 UN IPCC report the alarmists always quote. If you believe in "global warming" you believe in a fairy tale that Al Gore and others got rich on.

Posted by: RonKH | May 20, 2010 11:45 PM | Report abuse

In my opinion what is REALLY scary are the educated people who believe this crap!

Posted by: mcdonalsherry | May 21, 2010 3:10 AM | Report abuse

In my opinion what is REALLY scary are the educated people who believe in the Gospel of Beck, the language of Limbaugh, the fairy tales told by Fox and its crew.

Posted by: mcdonalsherry | May 21, 2010 3:17 AM | Report abuse

Republican Party = Nazi Party
Tea Partyists = Republican Party's SS

Posted by: glazer68 | May 21, 2010 9:57 AM | Report abuse

> not providing evididence when asked.

Because it was a stupid request.

> Death panels are called Health care rationing boards. They are real in Europe

They definitely are not. I live there.

> and necessary where limited funds need to be stretched.

I'm going to assume that you don't know what you're talking about.

> Obama is certainly a socialist

No he's not. I know that because I live in a social democratic country.

> and although not a Muslim that might be better than Rev Wright's religion of separation and hate.

Wright's a 'nam veteran. Show some respect.

> Obama would take away our guns if he thought it would not endanger the rest of the liberal agenda.

You're just guessing again.

> Obama is printing and borrowing money so the taxes can wait for the next guy to pay for everything.

Where were you when Reagan and Bush I & II did this?

> Facist, Stalin like. What is the difference?

Apparently beyond your feeble mind. Would it hurt to pick up a history book?

> Who cares? Alot of people will show up at the polls where it really counts. Bye Bye Dimocrats.

You're guessing again. And what's with the name-calling?

Posted by: LiberalGuy | May 22, 2010 4:39 PM | Report abuse

Republicans, is there anything they're not scared of?

Posted by: NigelTT | May 22, 2010 9:34 PM | Report abuse

I say hooray for all the citizens who understand where their money comes from. I say more Obaaama money for everbody. You don’t need logic to participate in a debate here or anywhere in the US. Look at California, 60 Billion in debt and no problem. New Jersey 8 Billion in debt and thousands are screaming in front of the Statehouse at the budget cuts. The progressives have the right idea. Support the Administrations march toward Totalitarianism. Who needs to debate whether it is socialism or fascism, right or left. I say down with the tea baggers, up with both descriptions of what’s happening here. I say we call it “social fascism”. What the hell, we needed "real change” anyway. We were all getting too soft.
Baaaa!

Posted by: jafo2me | May 23, 2010 4:33 PM | Report abuse

Damn you lie

Obama and the left are built on lies and are scornful of the truth

Want to see the Obomantion?

Look at Greece

Look at where Europe is going
Obamais vision


Free marker China will wipe the west out, with Obama on his high Camel.

Posted by: tremain2004 | May 23, 2010 7:07 PM | Report abuse

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