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The Clinton Welcome: The Genius of Flags

Whoever thought of having delegates and alternates wave American flags in welcoming Bill Clinton deserves a big raise. A sea of flags is a great, patriotic sight. And it allowed the crowd to unite and to give Clinton a rousing reception, while moving the convention away from the word "Clinton." Two nights of Clinton signs would have been a mistake. With all the Clinton chatter, this convention has been, at best, a 70 percent Obama convention. As soon as Bill Clinton leaves the stage, the Obama lieutenants need to make it a 100 percent Obama convention.

By E.J. Dionne  | August 27, 2008; 9:10 PM ET
Categories:  Dionne  | Tags:  E.J. Dionne  
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When the Clintons leave - so do I.

Obama is everwhere being crammed down our throats from the Women's Home Journal to the Today Show.

I can't vote for Obama because I can't take four years of Obamas being crammed down my throat while I can't afford the basics, let alone a Hawaian vacation.

Give me the McCains - nobody wants to put their pciture on magazines or have them on their television show - works for me!

I am leaving with Bill - and will not bother watching the big Obama show. ALthough it will be repeatedly forced in my face for days to come. Ugh.

Posted by: Clinton Supporter | August 27, 2008 9:23 PM | Report abuse

WHAT I'D LIKE TO HEAR in Barrack Obama's speech: . .

100% of all our electricity produced by renewables in 10 years. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

1) It will boost our economy with cheap energy,
2) help decrease global-warming,
3) help decrease our involvement in the madness of the Middle East,
4) help decrease the strong arming Russia,
5) help decrease financial support to terrorist,
6) and it will leave some resources for our grandchildren.

Posted by: Coldcomfort | August 27, 2008 9:50 PM | Report abuse

Dear so called "Clinton Supporter", I'm happy to hear you are leaving the party.

As to your vacation plans, perhaps the McCain's will let you vacation at one of the fourteen prime properties that they own.

Posted by: Paulie200 | August 27, 2008 9:51 PM | Report abuse

So, Paulie200 (at 9:52 P.M.) are you saying that in Obama's Amerika, it is a crime to privately own fourteen (or ever how many) prime properties? How about one mansion in Chicago purchased with the aid of a convicted felon? Is that okay in your messiah's new Amerika?

How many properties do you suppose the Obama children will one day inherit?

Posted by: Judy Kilgore | August 27, 2008 10:14 PM | Report abuse

Judy Kilgore, is "Clinton Supporter" your sock puppet? Is this your false flag operation you think I've offended?

But that wasn't my point. "Clinton Supporter" was begrudging Obama's fat Hawaiian vacation, which Obama could readily afford because he is smart, worked very hard and achieved the American dream.

To answer your question: No, owning fourteen-or-more fine homes for personal use isn't a crime... even if it IS reminiscent of Saddam Hussein. McCain should enjoy the largess and benefit of having married into a very wealthy family, after dumping his first family. His second family was wealthy enough to have also financed his initial run for the U.S Senate. What a great country...and what a small man.

Posted by: Paulie200 | August 27, 2008 11:00 PM | Report abuse

I hope the Clintons stick around for tomorrow night. Bill had said that there would be more twists and turns before November 4th rolls around. I believe that.

Many of us have had the experience where someone at work ended up being an important, and unexpected, ally. Going down the stretch, I hope this race is close enough so that Bill and Hillary are called on to deliver key speeches in Ohio and Florida and Colorado and Virginia. Because I know they will deliver for Obama. And he will benefit from a strong working relationship with the Clintons moving forward. We all will.

Posted by: Deep Blue | August 27, 2008 11:11 PM | Report abuse

a few months ago, obamaniacs were saying that hillary was insane, knocking obama in the knees, racist, mean, ugly, etc., now they are demanding just a bunch of hypocrites. i'm not voting for obama, and i dont care how many properties mccain owns. good grief. how many homes does warren buffet own? what about oprah? how many millions of dollars with shelly and barry make over the course of their lives? both parties are run by corporations. barry or mccain - more of the same. at least hillary didnt pretend to be some messiah coming to save people from evil. that's what i like about her. obama is going to deliver a warm and fuzzy message to a stadium of crying fans. what a crock.

Posted by: proud puma | August 28, 2008 12:40 AM | Report abuse

PLEASE correct me if I'm wrong - wasn't Obama born in Hawaii? While I'm sure they enjoyed their vacation in Hawaii couldn't it be construed on some small level that he returned to relax to some place that was familiar? That he went to visit family? Doesn't his sister live there? Or am I confused?

Posted by: R&B | August 28, 2008 9:03 AM | Report abuse

Paulie, your a tool.

Posted by: SMonty | August 28, 2008 10:28 AM | Report abuse

PUMA = Privately Unabashed McCain A*Kisser

Posted by: stan | August 28, 2008 10:29 AM | Report abuse

You can often tell the Rove-and-Limbaugh-inspired operatives by their use of the phrase "crammed down my throat" in connection with Sen. Obama. I'm convinced that many of this kind of poster aren't even Democrats, much less Clinton supporters.

Operation Chaos lives, unfortunately.

Posted by: green1 | August 28, 2008 10:29 AM | Report abuse

Hey Judy,

It is ok to have 14 properties, what is not ok is knowing how many you actually own? Do you know how many you own?

I do and every year since 2000 My taxes have gone up, sales tax, gas, food.

Thank giod we are finally ridding the party of 3 year olds like you.

Posted by: Ray | August 28, 2008 10:29 AM | Report abuse

Get off the Obama bought a house with help from a felon BS.
Truth of the matter is...for those of you who have ever bought a house...before moving forward, did you do a background check on your agent or your broker...did you pay the fee's necessary to make sure he or she met up to your pretentious standards?
I doubt I also doubt most of you ever even bought a house.

Posted by: Brandon | August 28, 2008 10:30 AM | Report abuse

Let's put this in perspective please.
I'm no big supporter of either but Barack Obama was raised in Hawaii and was visiting his grandmother. it is America, isn't it? It is one of the 50 states? Why are we faulting someone for returning to his family home for a few days?

Posted by: James | August 28, 2008 10:30 AM | Report abuse

It's easy to be tough and disagree online, but the confrontational attitudes need to stop. Everyone wants the same thing: a chance for a good life, equality, a better future for all. The last 8 years have been a big step backwards for the country, its infrastructure, the average family, etc. Name one thing that has gone really, really well the past 8 years? One thing that has gone great for the average U.S. family? Phelps winning 8 gold medals? Time to put people who care back in office again. Vote Democrat... or just continue to wallow in your anger 4 years down the road again? Bye!

Posted by: Eric | August 28, 2008 10:30 AM | Report abuse

Deep Blue ,only twist and turn now can be expected is McCain announcing Hillary as his VP choice,which could shake up the whole race.

Posted by: Arun1 | August 28, 2008 10:30 AM | Report abuse

Some of these "points" are hilarious

Posted by: eat it | August 28, 2008 10:30 AM | Report abuse

A great Convention! Now thats the Democrats I know!

Posted by: Cooday | August 28, 2008 10:31 AM | Report abuse

It's a good thing we, as a nation, have risen above the partisan bickering of the past. Just look at these comments (or the comments on any political blog) for proof! This is truly a new kind of politics.

Posted by: MDA | August 28, 2008 10:32 AM | Report abuse

Wow! I'm always amazed at what comes out of people's mouths in defense of who they support in politics. Here's an idea. Why don't we all just be quiet and LISTEN to what both parties have to say in their conventions and then make an educated decision. Hopefully we're all somewhat intelligent and have the ability to distinguish between the hyperbole and the issues. I, for one, don't care how many homes they have or where they go on vacation. They both, after all, better be highly successful to even consider taking on the biggest job in the world. However, I do care about their ideas for solving our country's problems. Let's stop the personal attacks and go back to the real issues and make our decision that way.

Posted by: JoAnn | August 28, 2008 10:32 AM | Report abuse

Always nice to hear the liberal appologists. Ever wonder why the so-called liberal voices of freedom have to use a counter voice when broadcasting a conservative on PBS, but not a liberal. Fear of the truth.

Yes, a patriot, if you consider disarming the country, lack of recognition of what terrorists are, having a felon help him finance his multi-million home, and lack of any understanding of what it takes to generate an electric base load. Stop listening to the lawyers and politicians say what we can do with power-talk to those who actually know something.

Posted by: slider | August 28, 2008 10:32 AM | Report abuse

'They're lucky they handed out American flags. If they handed out Burmese flags most of the Democrat delegates wouldn't know the difference. They had to put the pledge of allegiance on the telepromter because nobody knew it.'

I laughed out loud.

Posted by: JAW | August 28, 2008 10:33 AM | Report abuse

I am very impressed with the Democrats coming together as one in the same concern for the betterment of America. Division is divisive and there is no room for it with all the problems we the American people have been suffering for the last 7 1/2 years.

Go Obama!

Posted by: Hope | August 28, 2008 10:33 AM | Report abuse

All of the silly rhetoric from both sides of the equation. Doesn't anyone understand what these two gentlemen have sacrificed to run for the highest office in the land. Stop and think of the high purpose of being a public servant. These two Senators will sacrifice their privacy, be examined unnaturally to the core of their being and somehow people will criticize both of them as people. What have you done for your country lately and what sacrifice are you willing to make? Let's all join together for a higher purpose and make America stronger and better together.

Posted by: Jim | August 28, 2008 10:33 AM | Report abuse

Is 1+1=2 also genius? He is an American president. They are American flags.

Get a thought. Like who let Obama's ghastly bore of a wife blabber on about herself? Who cares? Why was she up there?

Posted by: Chicago1 | August 28, 2008 10:33 AM | Report abuse

wait. so its ok for obama to acheive the american dream and have a huge mansion and vacations but its NOT OK for mccain? yeah he married rich. they don't give away money though. someone had to earn it. both are going to be loaded. and really it has nothing to do with the race. yes obama is being shuved down everyone's throats. and yeah mccain seems rather unintelligent most of the time. its a matter of who you acutally feel will do a good job. not their financial status.

Posted by: michael | August 28, 2008 10:34 AM | Report abuse

Save Our Sister's rights. The democratic party was founded for equal rights. They all including Obama, Dean, Pelosi ect all failed to speak against the media and Obama camp race baiting and sexism.....that is when they lost my vote. The DNC Super Delegates have also failed in their only job which was to nominate the most electable candidate.

If Obama is elected, employers around this country have just learned that promoting the most qaulified person for a job is not required if the most qualified is a woman. If Obama loses then employers will know that there are large consequences to failing to promote women when they are the most qualified.

Lifetime democrat VOTING McCain 2008 and HILLARY 2012

Posted by: S.O.S. | August 28, 2008 10:34 AM | Report abuse

What is obvious to me is that more than half of the posts on this blog are by full on Republicans. I hope the democrats are taking notes and are posting to blogs disguised as republicans. It's all part of the machine brought to you by Carl Rove and company.

Posted by: Paul Grignon | August 28, 2008 10:34 AM | Report abuse

I've been flabbergasted that Clinton supporters would support McCain rather than Obama. I can't bring myself to believe it’s racism. But why would you abandon your party and your ideals?

Perhaps they are really just Republicans who didn’t like Bush and for whatever reason, liked Hillary. Lacking their favorite, they go back to their party?

Posted by: JE | August 28, 2008 10:34 AM | Report abuse

I still donot understand what people like about Obama. I tried to listen to him, to see his charisma, but he just does not get into details of anything, he just says what people want to hear knowing very well that cannot be done.... I am not sure.

I do admit that I was dissapointed when Hillary lost........

I am not sure who I am going to vote for, McCain does look descent too.

Posted by: aj | August 28, 2008 10:35 AM | Report abuse

I thought we were singing O Canada, thats news to me Ted

Posted by: Democratic delegate | August 28, 2008 10:35 AM | Report abuse

It is hard to heal. We have seen a historic primary campaign. Without Obama Clinton would've been the nominee. Four more years of a failure in the executive branch is unconscionable.

Being a narrow minded, selfish, bigot is not the best America has to offer. Yet the politics of hate and fear offer that. We can change and we must. I see a lot of bitter older white folks not really trusting the future, denying the future to their children so they can grasp what diminishing glory they see in their clouded mirror. Totally lame and hopeless.

I am willing to take a risk. There is hope there. But once the inauguration is over I will look for accountability.

Posted by: Jerry T | August 28, 2008 10:35 AM | Report abuse

yeah to the debate about mcCain's homes (and if he picks Romney oy)

the issue is not that he has that many homes...

the issue he could not put it into words...fopr whatever reason.

and why?

because he has never had to...and really can't...even when Jay Leno offered him a million dollars...

as smart as he thought he was being...

He STILL didn't answer.

John mcCain did not make his money...he did not have to go through financial challenges...when he was young his father took care of everything to get him where he needed to go...(and his brother even said that none of the men in the family ever had experience with financial matters...oy their "dad had several oil investments yes. but Mom took care of the money"


That is the issue...he divorced into money ...and never has had to worry.

Who wants a President making decisions about what effects those mortgage payment stressed and choices between putting a child in school and housing an aging parent...or knows not of the worth of what an education means to a vet who joined not for family legacy...but for financial reasons.

It is not whether Mccain is rich... Obama is rich...

but Obama earned his money. obama filled out those forms...and Obama knows what financial struggle and achievement actually means.

We do not need another President who does not know those things...seems we did that for the last 8 years.

P.S. someone should put a mortgage payment in front of mccain and see if he knows what it is.

Posted by: dl | August 28, 2008 10:35 AM | Report abuse

With our country facing economic crisis as well as significant military challenges abroad, aren't there more pressing issues to discuss than how many homes McCain or Obama own? I think it reflects the "two Americas" we read about, where the economic divide broadens and successful leaders are scrutinized for being savvy.-Jermaine Fanfair

Posted by: Jermaine Fanfair | August 28, 2008 10:35 AM | Report abuse

to Clinton supporter: do you vote for someone because you like them or because once in office they will implement the policies you support.

It's clear that Senators McCain and Obama disagree on some pretty serious issues. Shouldn't you vote for the person who comes closest to what you believe to be the right path?

On issues such as abortion, balanced budgets, court nominees, defense spending, environmental protection, financial aid to college students, and global warming, human rights, and Iraq, do your values reflect those of Sen. Obama or Sen. McCain?

Posted by: Steve | August 28, 2008 10:35 AM | Report abuse

I'm just glad that in the Pledge of Allegiance, my name is mentioned.

Posted by: Richard Stanz | August 28, 2008 10:35 AM | Report abuse

Ted -- how tired to belittle Democrats by pretending that they do not love our country. That won't get you anywhere and is a complete falsehood.

Posted by: Max | August 28, 2008 10:36 AM | Report abuse

Clinton Supporter or Judy, go ahead and take your hatred to another party. Obama is the best candidate for the Democrats, I hope the party will truly unite and work for his election.
Coldcomfort, while the goal you propose is worthy, I can't be achieved without dramatic consumption decreases. If Obama makes such a statement he sets himself on a path to failure. Better for him to present an achievable case to reduce our dependance on foreign fuel sources... but stay clear of Pickens Plan (he is a greedy capitalist).

Posted by: TNyankee | August 28, 2008 10:36 AM | Report abuse

R&B: yes, BHO was born in Hawaii, part of the continental US (unlike the Panama Canal, where McCain was born). BHO's grandmother still lives there. It takes a dedicated R troll to turn "visiting grandma" into a hateful, Satan-inspired talking point. Compared to that, claiming to be a "Clinton Supporter" when you've never voted D in your life is small potatoes. Pretty soon that sock puppet will be telling us that BHO losing his mom to ovarian cancer was God's will. A special ring in Hell awaits you, "Clinton Supporter."

Posted by: lpdrjk | August 28, 2008 10:36 AM | Report abuse

I don't get it, and please explain: why would a democrat, who worked hard to get their ideas elected vote for a republican? Because he's "Not Obama?" That just simply doesn't make sense.
Everyone knows (or at least those who take time to pay attention to what is going on around them, reading papers and watching unbiased news) that the Republican Party hasn't done much for a great majority of the country. So why elect them again? Because they're not Obama?
Because your gal Hillary didn't get the nomination. Neither did John Edwards, but you don't hear his supporters screaming "I'm not voting for Obama, I'm voting for McCAIN!" In fact, you don't hear ANYONE who supported another DEMOCRATIC candidate saying that. In my memory of primary elections, I don't recall ever hearing such talk of voting for THE OTHER PARTY because the one person you supported didn't get on the ticket.
It smells of racism and fear and quite frankly, stupidity.
Yes let's vote for the OTHER PARTY because the person I wanted to represent my party didn't get the nomination. Granted, the other party doesn't agree with ANYTHING I've wanted, nor anything the person who didn't get the nomination wanted... but I'm going to do it anyway.
You're a bunch of sniveling children.
But please: go ahead. Let's give Bush, err, McCain four more years to make things WORSE THAN THEY ARE TODAY. That will show Obama to get more deligates than Hillary. That will keep the "black man down."
You people are ridiculous.

Posted by: William Bruce | August 28, 2008 10:36 AM | Report abuse

If McCain can't remember how many houses he owns, can he really be expected to remember last weeks cabinet meeting? Perhaps he'll decide that he has to nuke Hiroshima cause the damned japs just won't give up the fight.
McCain is a dangerous choice.

Posted by: Bob Lees | August 28, 2008 10:37 AM | Report abuse


Mrs. Clinton, a Walmart boardmember, suggested the purchase of 1000s of USA flags from their favorite Chinese supplier.

Meet the new boss, same as the old boss.


Posted by: Truth | August 28, 2008 10:37 AM | Report abuse

This thread of comments - this very thread - demonstrates why the dems will lose this race. Your inability to have an intelligent discussion with each other precludes you from making progress in politics, and subsequently for Americans overall.

Posted by: Mando | August 28, 2008 10:37 AM | Report abuse

Puma mamas or simply disgruntled feminists are just overestimating themselves. One think I haven't seen about these disgruntled women is that they haven't been able to help Hillary pay her debt so far, but they claim to be in love with Hillary. If the pumas really mean what they say for Hillary, the first thing these oversellers would have done to demonstrate their strength would have been TO PAY HILLARY DEBTS instead running their large mouths. And I believe most of these women are post menopausal...guess

Posted by: Alain | August 28, 2008 10:37 AM | Report abuse

RE: the 14 homes. (paulie200)

So, if you met a girl/guy you fell in love with, and they owned 14 homes, you would make them sell them off just in case you ran for office one day? you would appear less rich?

Isn't it possible he simply was in love with Cindy?


Both Democrats and Republicans are rediculously rich. They are not "one of us". It is AMAZING to me that Democrats can still pull the wool over some many peoples faces that they are "one of us".


If I ran a McDonalds, I wouldnt hire a person with one year of experience as a store manager. President of the United States? Come on.


I am let down by Obama. I supported him early because he seemed different. Now he is cowtowing left and right, and turning into what he railed against in the beginning. (One Example: Support for NASA.)


Anyone who thinks McCain is a third Bush term really owes it to themself to research how much Bush and McCain hate each other. Try to find some articles or videos from the 2000 election.


Keep an open mind, carefully evaluate both canidates. Read from multiple news sources, not just the ones who tell you what you want to hear.

Posted by: Paulie200=naive | August 28, 2008 10:38 AM | Report abuse

Obama has a lot of promise and thats all.
I will never support any candidate that has been in bed with so many extremists and gutter dwellers, people who so blindly support Obama have no concept of what his goals are.
Look for massive,new foreign aid programs for Kenya, his home where he said that he felt more at home than any where in the world
Is the goal, any black person? rather than a well qualified black person?

Posted by: louis b. long | August 28, 2008 10:38 AM | Report abuse

I don't understand how a true Democrat can vote for a Republican. Truly, you want 4 more years of the same? All you supposed "Clinton Supporters" who are voting for McCain - SHAME ON YOU! I wonder why it was so easy for you to switch sides - I can guess it has something to do with Obama's "heritage". Let's be honest, it's veiled racism.

Posted by: TrueDemocrat | August 28, 2008 10:38 AM | Report abuse

It IS a rock show...

Posted by: Markkens | August 28, 2008 10:39 AM | Report abuse

-p.s. Ms. Kilgore... it is AmeriCa not AmeriKa.

Posted by: Clarissa Mena | August 28, 2008 10:39 AM | Report abuse

Sniveling children? That's mature.

Posted by: SMonty | August 28, 2008 10:39 AM | Report abuse

Oh, yeah, he went to Hawaii to see his grandmother, whom he hadn't seen in almost two years - for ONE hour. So glad he could squeeze her in. Guess that's all she could take of him!

Posted by: Ed | August 28, 2008 10:40 AM | Report abuse

I agree with the Clinton supporter. I too am sick of Obama. The media wants Obama so it is like Obamamania.
In my opinion neither candidate Obama or McCain is up for the job. Looks like that 8 s of tough times we have had with the Bush is about to go for 4 more for a solid 12 years of clueless government.

Posted by: ciercee | August 28, 2008 10:40 AM | Report abuse

The puma is the most ignorant person I have ever read. You belong with the Republicans who talk with authority and lack the facts. I don't think you heard Hillary's speech. Do you realize what you are saying? Are you willing to have your privacy invaded? Do you want your son's to be drafted? Do you want another Thomas or Scalia on the Supreme Court? Do you want to help the rich get richer? Because that is what you get by voting for McCain. You begrudge a man for going to Hawaii where he was born, where his grandmother and sister live and spending time with his wife and daughters but see nothing wrong with a man whose wife owns a private jet and they have 8 houses on 10 lots not knowing he has them and saying the economy is okay. There are great people who have much, there are adulterers that do great things (i.e. clinton) but it is not McCain

Posted by: hope2 | August 28, 2008 10:40 AM | Report abuse


Posted by: Anonymous | August 28, 2008 10:40 AM | Report abuse

Anyone who voted for Bush needs to sit this election out. It is clear that you do not have the intelligence to pick a President. Maybe the rest of us will do better this time around- could not do any worse.

Posted by: J. Peoples | August 28, 2008 10:41 AM | Report abuse

We all know pre- election every candidate is full of it. We all know they have corny messages. It's a load of crap- just ignore it. No real person is truly like this.

What confuses me is how people in the same party with the same ideals and goals can dump their party because their favorite player didn't get to become captain. Thats like me dumping the Yankees for the Red Sox because Derek Jeter lost his captainship to Robinson Cano. Is DJ still on my team (in the Senate)? YES! He'll play his role and help us win. (BAD sports analogy).

Mud will be slinging from both sides- it's par for the course. They are applying for a JOB, AND they know who they are up against. Could you imagine if HRs let all of the candidates for a job go in together and do research on one another beforehand?

They are applying for CEO of the largest economy in the world. I don't care where my CEO takes vacations- I merely care that they are guiding my company in the right direction and pay attention to the proper analysis (having the proper people in place to make this analysis) and act accordingly. Thats it.

I'll say it again- They are applying for a job. Thats it.

Posted by: Bmore | August 28, 2008 10:41 AM | Report abuse


And the 2 nights of the Clintons are the greatest nights in this convention. All the rests are nothing but lame crock. I can not vote for a spineless pretentious piece of crock. At least with McCain, I know what I am up to. Forget the houses and the millions, so is every candidate. Everyone deserves to be rich at some point in their lives. Stop your hipocricies... These Osamas are too hipocrites. And I can not even lay my eyes on someone who is a closeted MUSLIM. Remember all who died in the Tower and remember who caused it -- ALL MUSLIMS...

Posted by: MAX M | August 28, 2008 10:41 AM | Report abuse

Just who do the good people of the USA think will pay for off shore drilling. Hey my friends, reach for your wallet.
In Arkansas at this time an average of 4 new Nat Gas wells are going into production each day. Think nat gas prices will go down this winter. Nope, UP. Drilling is very coastly and we will pay for it.

Posted by: ken | August 28, 2008 10:41 AM | Report abuse

Wow. I can't believe the insightful commentary. Not.

To "Clinton Supporter": Obama is being "crammed down your throat" because he's the Democratic nominee for president. Duh. Do you really mean to say that your main criteria for choosing a president is whether or not you would like to see that person on TV and magazines? If so, please stay home on election night.

Here's a suggestion. Research the candidates' platforms and positions, their voting records, their leadership skills, and, yes, even their personality characteristics. Make a judgment of which one you think is better for the country. Make an actual mental effort. Do it for our country. Please.

Posted by: dhm | August 28, 2008 10:42 AM | Report abuse

I believe in obama because I KNOW he can solve our energy problems. He'll make all energy renewable in 10 years, just like he promised. And he'll take us all off oil, SOON. He's super good, we democrats know it, and you republican buffoons are craxzy.

Posted by: Crazy_for_obama | August 28, 2008 10:42 AM | Report abuse

OBAMA BIDEN and the Clintons together a Republicans worst nightmare. the four horsemen for the Republican apocalypse are upon them. Mc candid not support the GI Bill for our troops coming home from Afghanistan and Iraq so I say shame on him. his POW card is expired and are his age jokes. If Cindy Mc Cain made him sign a prenuptial then why should America trust this cheater? Family Values? I will take the Obamas and Bidens who came up from nothing to where they are today. No silver spoons like the Mc Cains. OBAMA BIDEN in 2008! No way No how No McCain!!!

Posted by: Col Tom Davis 101st Airborne | August 28, 2008 10:43 AM | Report abuse

"ENTER THE CLOWNS, THE CIRCUS BEGINS" It's hard to believe, you can fool all of the people some of the time, SOME OF THE PEOPLE ALL OF THE TIME,but not all of the people all the time. Can You hear me O'bama

Posted by: challie | August 28, 2008 10:43 AM | Report abuse

Hard to believe that all these R's are still blabbering about how important experience is. Please tell us what a terribly bad POTUS Lincoln was; he had less experience when elected than BHO.


Posted by: lpdrjk | August 28, 2008 10:43 AM | Report abuse

first of all, pretty much anyone can afford a Hawaiian vacation, you can do the whole thing for like $700.

AT this point I'm completely disgusted by these Clinton supporters who are now supporting McCain... Why? Because you're tired of the celebrity of Obama? That is so stupid! Personally, I'm tired of American foreign policy being bumbled by these war-monger Republicans.

I was never a die-hard Obama fan, or a die-hard Hilary fan... I'm a Democrat, and all that party stands for.

Hilary Clinton has become the new Ralph Nader, apparently. Are all you former Hilary - now McCain supporters going to join the military to support the endless wars we're going to have in the middle-east? just curious...

Posted by: jjb | August 28, 2008 10:43 AM | Report abuse

And thanks to Jim and others who are trying to raise the conversation a bit.

I do think the flags were a beautiful choice. Organizing these conventions does take a lot of thought since people pounce on any percieved slight like Obama showing his patriotism by his actions instead of a $2 pin made in China.

I thought his wife did a wonderful job, too. What a sacrifice all the families have made and especially Obama since it seems serious threats have been made on his life.

Posted by: Max | August 28, 2008 10:43 AM | Report abuse

The op-ed was about the good idea of the US flag being used at a US political function and you idiots here talk about everything but! This just goes to show the dismal state of the intelligence of the American public. Whether you support Obama or McCain, do yourself a favor and stick to the topic at hand otherwise you come off as a blathering idiot.

Sign me
Disgusted with american IQ.

Posted by: JGL | August 28, 2008 10:43 AM | Report abuse

The Rezco thing is allready dead, Repub tool. You should really try to think for yourself instead of endlessly regurgitating the lies spewed by Fox and Limbaugh.

Posted by: Michael | August 28, 2008 10:44 AM | Report abuse

Knowing others is intelligence; knowing yourself is true wisdom. Mastering others is strength; mastering yourself is true power. Wise men speak because they have something to say; Fools because they have to say something.” And remember Never mistake knowledge for wisdom. One helps you make a living; the other helps you make a life.”


Posted by: The Quotationist | August 28, 2008 10:44 AM | Report abuse

I love that the "Obama Craze" is bringing hope back to the country. Without hope we are nothing. Giving people inspiration is what this country needs because there are to many people out there are living for what the government can do for them rather for themselves. People blame government for everything. You should ask yourself when was the last time I did something to help the cause. If you want to ride on the McCain boat then feel free to help dig the country into more poverty because of your laziness to help the cause rather then relying on someone else too always fix the problems.

Posted by: Iceman101 | August 28, 2008 10:44 AM | Report abuse

We are not voting for Class King. We are voting for issues and the candidate who represents them. More war - McCain. More money to oil - McCain.

I'm ready for Barack Obama. It is insulting to America to suggest the ENTIRE nation is bigoted and cannot accept a president of color.

Women and minorities have moved forward this year - unless the spiteful push back. You can't push one back without pushing the other. They both advanced - keep the momentum.

Posted by: Candy Neville | August 28, 2008 10:44 AM | Report abuse

You ask us to name one thing that had been good for families in the last eight years. How about the fact that in a world teaming with terrorists itching to do away with us at every opportunity we have not had a terrorist attack in the US since 9/11. I consider that a pretty big benefit to my daily life. I can name many other things that have been good with life, not just material things that everyone is looking at. Maybe we should all look to helping each other make life better instead of looking to our government,ie. president make life really really good.

Posted by: Kaye | August 28, 2008 10:44 AM | Report abuse

The execution of a flawless national campaign by Obama / Biden is a sign of great things to come in January 2009.

Is it a red flag when the McCain campaign states that, when McCain speaks without a script, "he is not speaking for the McCain campaign"? This is a not a great vote of confidence for McCain by his own staffers.

It is sort of sad to see videos of McCain from 10-12 years ago. He was relatively articulate and seemed mildly bright. Not so much now. The Ambien Cowboy is muddled and confused. When the phone rings in the White House, I'd like my president to (1) be able to wake up and (2) speak intelligently.

Posted by: Paul McBrady | August 28, 2008 10:45 AM | Report abuse

Chicago1 -
How many conventions have you watched? The candidates wife always speaks, as will Cindy McCain next week. I for one was thoroughly impressed with Michelle. Like it or not, the first lady is an important counterpart to the president. Look at what Jackie Kennedy did for us in the eyes of the world. Can't wait to see how Cindy McCain measures up next to Michelle. I for one would be happy to have Michelle Obama represent us - smart, eloquent, and classy is what comes through!

Posted by: jerseygrl | August 28, 2008 10:46 AM | Report abuse

To all those who think Obama is a Muslim: doesn't it bother you that Satan will be holding your hand in the voting booth? Guess not.

Posted by: lpdrjk | August 28, 2008 10:46 AM | Report abuse

Well, as an American citizen who moved to Europe on order to escape from the American gang controlled neighborhoods and schools, on order to have High quality free and public health care and education and on order to be on place where the capitalism still works, I have just one thing to say:
The level of the debates between the two nominees from the two major parties just shows that our country has lost itself on oblivion and denial. We need to get our country together to rebuild it. We are falling down to pieces. Russians raped Georgia with total disregard for our ill-maintained military. European Union is a bigger economy than we are. Chinese own 4 trillion dollars of our national debt. Our education level is considered the lowest within the developed nations. We even lost the summer olympics to the Chinese! And you guys are still wasting time working to divide our country? It is pathetic to see Republicans having to dress as Clinton supporters to try to divide the Democratic party! I been a Republican my whole life, and never thought we could be on such a ridiculous situation! That is why I won't vote, and that is why I became an exilee, our government system, as our economy, is failed and broken beyond possible repair...

Posted by: Exilee | August 28, 2008 10:46 AM | Report abuse

I am CRAZY for Obama!!! H'es gonna save us brothas from damnation! Survive the brothas. survive the nation. Go Obama. We is great, and no thing can change thant.

Posted by: Obama_Nation | August 28, 2008 10:47 AM | Report abuse

I find it amusing that instead of talking about party platforms such as heath care plans, taxes, and social strategies, everyone seems to be caught up on how many houses someone owns and where someone vacations. I'm pretty sure those things have absolutely nothing to do with someones ability to lead the country. Smarten up America and start talking about the real issues instead of slinging mud.

Posted by: CrazyCanuck | August 28, 2008 10:47 AM | Report abuse

It is quiet simple. Obama is the best canidate in my opinion. Study the facts not the smear tactics and internet rumors. Make your own decision, don't parrot some party line or oxy poppin radio host. If you like McCain fine, don't give the crap that either one is the devil, or some form of evil incarnate.

Posted by: Republican-4-Obama | August 28, 2008 10:47 AM | Report abuse

I watched the convention last night... and all I can say is that the Republican talking heads got played big time. You told us all to watch... to see protesters riot in the streets, to see Hillary hijack the convention, to see Bill snub Obama.

Well... I watched it. I tuned in expecting some drama. And all I saw were reason upon reason to vote for Obama/Biden!

You'd have to be crazy to vote for McCain.

Posted by: Blip | August 28, 2008 10:48 AM | Report abuse

Yeah who cared about experience. I think I will go get my kidney removed from a guy that stayed in a Holiday Inn Express vs. the "experienced" doctor. Noob.

Posted by: SMonty | August 28, 2008 10:48 AM | Report abuse

again the question is not who is richer

the question is who knows the challenges and landscape of financially strapped, struggling and middle class America.

Who has had to face a student loan application...who has HAD to know what they own?

Who understand the fear behind an aging parent not having money for housing...or picking between kids who gets to go to school.

and is important that a candidate can not answer how many homes they own.

It is fundamental to the challenge facing America.

How can you make decision about finances when like other wealthy people and the middle and struggling classes... a candidate has probably never even seen a mortgage payment never mind what effexts it...

again seems to me we had a silver spoon president for the last 8'd that work out for ya?

I want the guy who earned his money...the guy who filled out applications to school ...who had to read things to get through school...who had to wrok to put himself through school...

who had to fill out his own tax forms...and who actually has had to sign the checks and mail the student loan and mortgage payments...

not the one who hasn't even had to know the number of his accountants (plural) or...the number of homes...

a question he himself STILL has yet to answer from his own mouth.

again seems to me we had that for 8 years... another 4 and ...

well I don't want to think about it.

Posted by: dl | August 28, 2008 10:48 AM | Report abuse

How about we all pick a candidate NOT from the 2 major parties to show the 2 major parties that there is more to America that fingerpointing and flag waving. I suggest there be an online vote the last day of october and everyone who thinks the two major parties are full of crap goes out and votes so that next time around, a third option gets federal funding. It only takes 5% of the popular vote to get a new party recognized at the federal level. Think about it. Or argue like children. Whatever, my America lives on.

Posted by: ryan2partymyth | August 28, 2008 10:48 AM | Report abuse

I was thinking the same thing when I saw the flags. Operation chaos doesn't seem to have stopped yet though...

Posted by: Publius | August 28, 2008 10:48 AM | Report abuse

Here's what I haven't heard anywhere addressed in any of the WP's blogs, articles or for that matter anywhere on the interwebs or the MSM: What if Hilary had got the nomination and HADN'T picked Obama as her VP? Now, that is an impossible scenario to wrap your head around isn't it? I'm voting for Obama; but I am deeply disappointed not only that HRC wasn't chosen to be the VP but also the way the Democratic party has acted. There are people who are nastier about the Clintons & self-identify as Obama supporters than Rush Limbaugh ever was. There is a kind of strange, almost –– dare I say it –– kind of fascist attitude about questioning –– from the people who want to vote for him, who've spent their whole lives voting Democratic –– OB's credentials, policies, ideas, and plans. I don't recognize myself anymore in the Democratic party. A group of people who would treat the Clintons so nastily; really who cares about their private life? let's take a look at yours? any affairs or bjs hiding in your closet? –– and it goes on here in these comments, like it will never end –– and these Democrats who clamp down on any questioning. I'm voting for Obama, but I really feel sad about the whole thing. I could never be a Republican but I used to think they were the graceless, nasty, idea-quelling party. Now, I think we're giving them a run for their money. I'll skip the rock star speech at the stadium, too. You got my vote, just don't make me have to hang out with your nasty supporters.

Posted by: Sad in Scranton | August 28, 2008 10:48 AM | Report abuse

Dear MAX M:
You are a racist bigot (redundant?); you also can't write to save your life. You are very reflective of most McCain supporters.

THIS TIME, we will vote for our hopes, and not our fears.

Posted by: jjb | August 28, 2008 10:49 AM | Report abuse

Yeah, Hawaii is the nice place for someone alive rather than dead.
Yeah, Hawaii is the right place to release your hate mind and anger soul.

Posted by: jy2008 | August 28, 2008 10:49 AM | Report abuse

The best thing is that GOP doesn't even realize they got punked...

Posted by: blip | August 28, 2008 10:50 AM | Report abuse

I is Obama. If you doesnt vote for me, you is Karaaazy!

Posted by: Obama | August 28, 2008 10:52 AM | Report abuse

I think it is easily safe to say that the majority of people on here claiming to be fleeing the Democratic party due to the loss of Hillary is nothing more then text book fear mongering and under handed Republican tactics. Likewise it'd be safe to say that said people aren't even democrat. But I digress.

Look at it this way, if you want four more years of the same old crap that we've dealt with for the last eight years then by all means vote for McCain. If you actually want change vote for Obama.

Lets see how long it takes before some ego hurt republican comes on here spouting about how McCain promises change, "and the right change too." And of course, by change, he means more of the same. Four more years of big business, big oil, and big breaks for the top 10 percent. Cries of moral and social outrage while the people he surrounds himself with are busy lining their pockets and lying through their teeth. Indeed. That is some good change.

Start your watches!

Posted by: justlikeaphoto | August 28, 2008 10:52 AM | Report abuse

Clinton supporter - you won't vote for Obama because he takes a vacation back where he grew up and stays with his own family there? Where the heck do you think Senator McCain takes his vacations?

Posted by: Jonathan | August 28, 2008 10:52 AM | Report abuse

I'm curious about all of the folks who think that electing Obama will heal racial rifts and ease white guilt, etc....
I'm thinking of all of the cities, even in the South, where blacks have completely taken over. Everything from police chief, mayor, school boards and on and on. Do blacks hate whites any less in these cities? Are whites "off the hook" for the slavery they never participated in? For that matter, are the lives of blacks in these cities any better off than when whites controlled the civilizations we created? No, in every case, by every measurable standard, their own lives are worse, as well as the lives of the white folks who either fled the area or are forced to live in increasingly dangerous and crappy neighborhoods.
Why does anyone think a kind-of black president will do any better on a larger, more complex scale?

Posted by: Byron | August 28, 2008 10:52 AM | Report abuse

If you're a Democrat, and you end up voting for the wrong side (John Mccain)and we have to endure 4 more years of Bush politics. You really have no room to talk here, because you're no better than Judah who gave our Savior to the Romans to be crucified with a kiss.Unfortunately we all have to suffer the consequences of your stupidity.Please stop crying about after you put them in office, just deal with it or go jump over a cliff.

Posted by: Asa | August 28, 2008 10:52 AM | Report abuse

In response to this comment made:

"I can't vote for Obama because I can't take four years of Obamas being crammed down my throat while I can't afford the basics, let alone a Hawaian vacation."

Are you kidding me? THAT is your reason for not voting for someone? That is what is wrong with this country. There are too many people who don't have the intelligence to focus and vote on the issues that affect this country. Instead, all you focus on is what the media creates.

If you can't take 4 years of seeing Obama, I hope you can tolerate 4 more years of the mess we are in. It will only continue with McCain. He actually thinks our economy is fine. I would too if I owned what he owns and lived like he lives. He is completely out of touch with our societal needs.

And if you have a young male family member that McCain is too willing to send off to war for no good reason... and you can actually sleep at night knowing you voted for him and put your loved one in that position, then I'd love to know how you can maintain a clean conscience.

I truly wish everyone would take the time to educate themselves on these two men. Ignore the media and rumors. Focus on their beliefs, plans and track records. Listen to what they say not what other's make up about them.

Take the time or we will all pay the price.

Posted by: Lara | August 28, 2008 10:53 AM | Report abuse

1700s- rich white landowners tell poor white appalachians that blacks are cause for their struggle.

Appalachians hate blacks.
We free blacks.
Appalachians have kids, move around, change name to Southerners.

More kids. Still hate blacks.

Southerners (and children of hate around country) fight each other. Rich White Landowners stay in power.

Divide and conquer.

Posted by: Bmore | August 28, 2008 10:54 AM | Report abuse

My gosh, you Obama haters are so bizarre. So it's okay, if you're successful, to have 13 homes (although I think the correct McCain count is something closer to 7). But it's unconcionable to go to Hawaii for vacation if your grandmother who's too sick to travel lives there. The so-called "Clinton Supporter" demonstrates this self-imposed ignorance precisely in his/her decision to turn off the TV before Obama and Biden come on. That way he/she can persist in his/her cocoon of anger and hatred without even considering the possibility that what true Democrats stand for and believe in have always gone far beyond "warm fuzzy" speeches or personality.

And if these so-called Clinton supporters had truly bothered to actually listen to (and not just watch) either of the Clinton speeches, like this Clinton supporter did, they may have got insight into what that stance and what that belief actually is.

But please, go ahead and leave. I'd rather have a party of rational, principled people who understand the stakes. I'd rather be part of a losing party that I can speak proudly to my kids about, than one of whining, dismissive "pumas" who seem to have forgotten that it was the Democratic Party--and not the Republicans--who allowed Hillary to advance the cause of women further than it was 19 months ago. I'd rather be proud of that, than vote for a man who happily takes money from people who make rape jokes. I'd rather commit to a wishy-washy sea of wishy-washy "change", than vote for a man who's against equal pay for women and comprehensive insurance coverage for children.

And if, God forbid, John McCain gets the chance to give the anti-abortionists that all-important fifth Supreme Court vote in the next four years, I will tell my daughters to blame the "proud pumas" who forgot themselves in chauvinist rage and gave him that chance.

We women would be wise to consider how far we got with the Democrats this election and seek, with the Democrats, to go further. That is a response worthier of Hillary's efforts than all these petulant complaints about how short we fell.

Posted by: Jacqueline Billings | August 28, 2008 10:55 AM | Report abuse


Posted by: MUSLIM OUT | August 28, 2008 10:56 AM | Report abuse

Wow. Why are some of you people so angry? It almost seems like it doesn't matter what was posted here by anyone, you're finding nasty things to say.

"Amerika"? Again, wow.

Posted by: Danny | August 28, 2008 10:56 AM | Report abuse

Dear AJ:

Does McCain look descent to you? Like the way an airplane makes its final descent in to the airport? Yeah, he looks like that to me, too. Except less of a descent, and more like a plane crash.

Learn how to spell. Thank you. Bye.

Posted by: jjb | August 28, 2008 10:56 AM | Report abuse

Did you know the pledge of allegiance was written by a Christian Socialist? Probably not. Most "conservatives" know very little about history, or they wouldn't fall for simplistic right wing propaganda and Orwellian republican distortions.
The little twisted versions of history right wingers shove down the world's throat mostly come from their high school football coaches' versions of American History.
As for current affairs, the media are slanted to the right of reality because they're sponsored by the corporate leaders who will either pull their adds, or buy their stations and fire the reporters if they they get too close to the real truth of important issues.
If you insist upon derailing those who are putting themselves on the line to remedy this republican nightmare then you'll need to continue to isolate yourselves from reality, for as Stephen Colbert has noted: "Reality has a well known liberal bias."

Posted by: Charles | August 28, 2008 10:56 AM | Report abuse

It's JFK vs Nixon all over again.

Posted by: Old Blue | August 28, 2008 10:56 AM | Report abuse

OK Hillary fans, I know your disappointed, but that's how the game goes. SHE is able to move on, why can't YOU? Obama is a WAY better choice than McLAME! If you're really going to vote for McCaine over OBAMA, than you must have your priorities wrong. RE-EVALUATE the choices, and get over the fact that Hillary is not one of them.

Posted by: trailsMcBond | August 28, 2008 10:57 AM | Report abuse

Strom Thurmond has more experience than McCain. The fact that he's dead shouldn't get in the way of him being nominated next week. Since when do R's care about the ability to govern?

He's also 100% gaffe-proof. Such a deal!

Posted by: lpdrjk | August 28, 2008 10:57 AM | Report abuse

Many of the posters above must listen to mainstream media, whose goal is to polarize. "For or against is the mind's worst disease" said a wise man thousands of years ago. I'm an independent voting for obama because all the republicans can do is point their finger at how bad obama is. Well, that's all fine and proven to work in history, but we need solutions. To date, the only ideas that republicans have come up with (ie offshore drilling) will not only not work (limited quantities and decades to develop) but will hurt us in the long run. We've had 8 years of "leaders" with no leadership skills and no ideas or solutions to our nation's economic problems. We've primarily had a republican congress and president for 8 years. If you are better now than 8 years ago, you should vote republican. If you are not, well, it seems silly to beat head against wall again.

Posted by: Brian N | August 28, 2008 10:57 AM | Report abuse


MY COUNTRY, the United States of America, is one made up of immigrants, and a land of religious freedom. You have issues; please get mental help. Thx.

Posted by: jjb | August 28, 2008 10:59 AM | Report abuse

There has been a growing mood of populist change in this country since the unexpected rise of Ross Perot. Ross and the political genius of Bill C. ended that. The economy in the 90's kept a lid on the mood for a while, as the business in Washington went on unchecked. But now, after Bush, 911,and the Terrorist we again feel the mood surfacing, as the younger generation starts to become involved again, as all of us begin to understand the old guard is killing our planet possibly beyond repair. People the issue is change not all the other stuff we are reading. We need a change in political,social and economic priorities in this country and in this world. The question is, which canidate has the best chance of starting that change process. Obamy or McCain. Don't get caught up in the personalities of this election like we always do, like the present system wants us to. Look beyond the two party system and vote for the party of survival, the party that will respond to all of us who get up and go to work each day, and then get up and do it again. Amen, Amen

Posted by: Harold Beals | August 28, 2008 10:59 AM | Report abuse

I think that the PUMAs are spambots.... and someone forgot to turn them off.

Because everybody watched to Democratic convention last night... and we all saw Bill's full-throated support for Obama. We heard him lay out a detailed argument about why Obama is the best president.

Yet, there are still some people sputtering away with their "I'm a Democrat but I am voting for McCain because of women's rights blah blah blah" nonsense. It's last weeks talking point! Go back to the Limbaugh trough and gorge yourself on some new propaganda....

Because you thought you had our number but you didn't. Y'all prayed for riots in Denver... but it isn't gonna happen! Y'all even sent some cranked up right-wingers, but the cops busted them and threw them in jail. YOU CANNOT STOP THE AMERICAN PEOPLE FROM REBUILDING AMERICA!!! JUST GET IT THROUGH YOUR HEADS!

Posted by: Blip | August 28, 2008 11:00 AM | Report abuse

How is the most "qaulified" person determined in your World?
Does spelling and command of the English language matter in any of your "qaulifications"
If we want to start mudslinging, there's plenty of dirt and half-truths that can be slung on both sides.
Savings and Loan Scandal
Enron's Ken Lay the main architect of our current energy policy.
Family Values - One Candidate is on first marriage, one candidate isn't
Manchurian Candidate - are you sure that the Chinese didn't brainwash McCain (Bush slung this bit of mud 8 years ago) and was it a coincidence that the remake of this movie came out earlier that year?

But mudslinging with ignorant pigs is a exercise in futility, they enjoy it to much or don't realise that they are covered in mud.

Posted by: ? SOS | August 28, 2008 11:01 AM | Report abuse

thanks mullims out. You hit the point...

Posted by: Dance | August 28, 2008 11:01 AM | Report abuse

The people who keep referring to Obama as a messiah are the only ones who refer to him that way! If being very intelligent,honest,sincere, and kind make someone a messiah then BARACK OBAMA IS MY MESSIAH! For all you bitter people left out there you can go sit in your corner and mumble at me from there.

Posted by: Obamaniac | August 28, 2008 11:02 AM | Report abuse

What I hate is for me to watch something on TV ,let it soak in and then have some glory seeking reporter or talk show host tell me what I heard and what to think!!

Posted by: bird3925 | August 28, 2008 11:03 AM | Report abuse

It is clear to me that the people whom are
against obama are hateful and most of all
racist. ( CLINTON SUPPORTERS). If you are
a true democrat and you truly care about
what happens in this country you shut up and put up. You would elect obama .I am so
tired of all this petty bickering. Act like adults and not like school children fighting for candy. I watch the news every
day. There are people around the world wish they had what we have . We as americans tend to take things for granted
if you ask me the republicans are only for the rich not the poor. I use to be a middle class american but now I am poor.
Our economy is in terrible shape and all you can talk about is war, and the color of someone skin. look at hurricane katrina.Look at the men and women in uniform that serves and protect our country every day. Where so busy sending
money all over the world while our own
fellow americans are starving, can't get a
good education, and dieing of disease
day after day.Are you kidding me people ,
are you really seriously kidding me!
Stop this nonsense . You are belittling
youself and your country.

Posted by: Idetha Selkridge from the Virgin Islands | August 28, 2008 11:04 AM | Report abuse

Muslim Out: What does it mean to "crust" someone's head?

I thought they arrested you in Denver with those other tweekers!!!!

Well...Have fun voting for McCain!!!!

Posted by: Blip | August 28, 2008 11:04 AM | Report abuse

It makes sense for a life long Democrat to vote against the party if he/she believes that the person running for the party will be ineffectual in office. Obama talks a good talk and goes through the motions, but in the end he won't deliver. Elect him and watch...

Posted by: Common Sense | August 28, 2008 11:05 AM | Report abuse

Why beer is better than Obama:

Beer is better than Obama because beers don't have friends who bombed the pentagon.

Beer is better than Obama because marines like beer.

Beer is better than Obama because imported beer doesn’t pretend to be domestic.

Posted by: SMonty | August 28, 2008 11:06 AM | Report abuse

p.s. mccain goes to hawaii, too (duh)

Posted by: jjb | August 28, 2008 11:07 AM | Report abuse

Idetha... the people who post here claiming they are Hillary supporters voting for McCain aren't Democrats. They are shills for the Republican Party. They are on all the blogs. They get free stuff from the McCain campaign for every bit of propaganda they post. I wouldn't worry about it.

Voting for McCain after backing Hillary in the primary would be the same thing as urinating on Hillary's legacy.

I am very active in my local Democratic Party. The PUMAs are mythical creatures... like Bigfoot... although Bigfoot might really exits.

Posted by: Blip | August 28, 2008 11:07 AM | Report abuse

Thank you Muslim Out. I am so tired of the same peopel. Every day every day every day. Show them the way out. They do not deserve to be in this country. Let them go back where they belong, IN HELL, ALL OF THEM. And I mean, ALL, ALL ALL ALL.....

Posted by: Gregory McViickun | August 28, 2008 11:08 AM | Report abuse

When I was growing up a friend asked how much my dad made. I didn't know so I asked him. Dad said it is not polite to ask someone about their financial situation and instructed me to just say, “I don’t know”. McCain gave the right answer. Clinton lowered the bar with his quick response to the” boxers or briefs” question. It gave us all a glimpse at his true character. Monica Lewinsky got a better peak later.

Posted by: Dave | August 28, 2008 11:09 AM | Report abuse

More reasons why Beer is better than Obama:

Beer won't send aid and assistance when hurricanes destroy a major US city.

Beer makes you feel stronger than you actually are.

Beer makes you feel better when you lose your house and job.

Beer won't place unfair taxes on the oil companies.

Beer seems to be the perfect candidate. Maybe even better than McCain. You should vote for beer.

Posted by: Blip | August 28, 2008 11:12 AM | Report abuse

And if the segment of evangelical rightist
who learned everything they know about Christinity from watching veggie tales and Tim La Faye want to continue messianic insinuations about Obama, then let them deal with Ronald Wilson Reagan whose name has six letters in all three parts (666). That number was also his street address in California. Reagan is worshipped as a savior by neocon's but his real legacy in South America and the MIddle East is abominable.

Posted by: Charles | August 28, 2008 11:13 AM | Report abuse

I DON'T TRUST OR LIKE EITHER PARTY. They have both been hijacked by the extreme edges, wealthly individuals and corporations. There is no party for the middle class anymore.

I would bet that if most posters on this site would sit down and talk they would learn that they have more in common with each other than with the respective parties. I have historically been conservative and my brother-in-law is a staunch democrat. I like him way more than anyone in the republican party. We need more independents and a new third party. Remember that our founding fathers told us that Government is not the solution, it is the problem. When is the last time an elected politician followed that creed.

The politicaly parties spend their time "spinning" news stories to make the otherside look worse, in the mean time they do nothing. Look at what we see on this board. MCCAIN didn't know how many houses he has. Well, probably because he did not care enough to know. Meantime; Obama is criticized for vacationing in Hawaii - give him a break. Why are we talking about this garbage?

Lets stop giving them our support, vote independent. Don't give money. Lets take the power back - the power that belongs to us.

Posted by: viewfromthemiddle | August 28, 2008 11:14 AM | Report abuse

Folks, Take a break. Have a home remodeling project to do? Post it online at:

And Freelancing Programming Web Design projects? Post it at

That simple.
Good Luck to McCain, The Clintons and Barak.

Posted by: CJ | August 28, 2008 11:15 AM | Report abuse

"What I hate is for me to watch something on TV ,let it soak in and then have some glory seeking reporter or talk show host tell me what I heard and what to think!!"

Don't you think there are so many political gays jumping up and down?

What a show on "The Emperor's New Clothes"!

Posted by: jy2008 | August 28, 2008 11:15 AM | Report abuse

If you're a woman you'd better make DAMN SURE you know about John McCain and women's issues before you flippantly announce you're going to vote for the man.

It's just shocking. SHOCKING.

Posted by: laughable | August 28, 2008 11:20 AM | Report abuse

mccain a rich soft cat who doesn't know anything about struggle? 6 years as a POW is more struggle than anyone currently living in America could face. Politics aside, he is a incredibly tough guy.

Posted by: rando | August 28, 2008 11:20 AM | Report abuse

You clowns parroting the Rezko talking points are insane. Check out's own summary of the matter:

Rezko Reality
August 22, 2008
McCain misfires as he attacks Obama's home purchase.
On the defensive over the extent of multiple McCain homes, the GOP candidate strikes back. But his TV spot gives an oversimplified and misleading account of how Obama bought his own $1.6 million house in Chicago.

* The ad says Chicago power broker Tony Rezko got "political favors" including "$14 million from taxpayers." But there's no evidence of any connection to the Obama home purchase. The $14 million was to build apartments for low-income seniors. Obama wrote a letter supporting the "worthy" project, but both men say Rezko didn't ask for the letter.

* It says Rezko "purchased part of the property [Obama] couldn't afford." Rezko's wife did buy an adjoining tract but later sold the land at a profit. Obama paid market price for his home.

McCain launched the attack after Obama ran one capitalizing on McCain's inability to recall for an interviewer how many homes the McCains own. Obama's ad says it's seven. The best tally we've seen puts the figure at eight, counting all the apartments and homes owned by McCain's wife, Cindy, and various family trusts, for themselves and their children.

Obama paid market price for his home. Obama paid market price for his home. Obama paid market price for his home. Obama paid market price for his home.Obama paid market price for his home. Obama paid market price for his home. Obama paid market price for his home. Obama paid market price for his home. Obama paid market price for his home. Obama paid market price for his home. Obama paid market price for his home. Obama paid market price for his home. Obama paid market price for his home. Obama paid market price for his home. Obama paid market price for his home. Obama paid market price for his home. Obama paid market price for his home.

Posted by: FACTCHECK | August 28, 2008 11:23 AM | Report abuse

"I am very active in my local Democratic Party. The PUMAs are mythical creatures... like Bigfoot... although Bigfoot might really exits."

The Obama girl is better to join with.

Posted by: jy2008 | August 28, 2008 11:25 AM | Report abuse

Several observations:
1. AmeriKa -- very crafty the way you changed the c to a k, and showed your racism. Are you proud of that?

2. Foreign aid for Kenya? Is that the only foreign policy Obama has discussed in public, or have there been others. Oh, you only hear what you want to hear and make your judgements based on that. Even if he does want to support foreign aid for Kenya, what is your problem with that? You'd rather keep spending money killing Iraqis than helping Kenyans? Another attempt at hiding one's pure racist hatred -- didn't work!

3. America was founded to allow ANYONE become president, not just the privileged rich few or those with years of experience in politics. American presidents surround themselves with experts on every subject, so they don't have to be experts on everything. All they need is to have a desire to better the American people. Nobody can know if Obama's ideas will take hold and fluorish, I only know that for the past 8 years, every idea tried by the Bush admin. has failed and average Americans have paid the price. McCain offers simply more of the same.

4. Number of Houses: doesn't matter a damn if the person who owns them understands how hard it was to become the owner of them. If he owns them through the blood, sweat, and determination that most Americans face every day, good for him! If he owns them because they or the money that purchased them was given to him, then it is simply an illustration of the disconnect between the VERY rich and the middle class. McCain is among the VERY rich and doesn't understand how hard most of us work just to make ends meet. That's the point, not simply how many houses he has.

5. Mando -- As far as intelligent discussion: so, if someone doesn't agree with you, his or her statement is not intelligent, right? If I'm not mistaken, many of the intelligent comments in this thread have actual names signed to them, while wild, racist, disconnected thoughts are posted with a pseudonym. Standing up for you beliefs is patriotic!

Good luck to everyone who listens, makes a thoughtful decision, and votes! If you're not voting, shame. If you're voting for a particular candidate because you believe in what he stands for, hurrah! If you're voting for a particular candidate because you're a closet racist or because of misguided advice of others, or because you don't think McCain could do a good job simply because he owns lots of houses, SHAME!

Posted by: Conan Crocker | August 28, 2008 11:28 AM | Report abuse


McCain snapped in 4 days to his Vietnamese captors and gave them detailed tactical and strategic information that cost hundreds if not thousands of men their lives. That's toughness alright! Hero my ass.

Posted by: STILTON | August 28, 2008 11:29 AM | Report abuse

Conan Crocker ROCKS! Well said. I love all you people on here. Even if I don't agree with you's great that we can actually have this kind of conversation and voice our personal opinions.

Posted by: SMonty | August 28, 2008 11:31 AM | Report abuse

This election is not about you or me as individuals. As Hillary said, it was not about her. Its not about, Barack Obama or John McCain. This election is about the United States and our legacy to the world and the future. It is about what we pass on to our children and their children.
To make decisions based on personal feelings is selfish and not democratic. It is hedonistic. Anyone who has made this personal is missing the point of the democratic process and not honoring our forbearers.
Please ask yourself which candidate represents your views the best? Vote on your values, vote on your vision for America, vote on what you want to leave you grandchildren. God bless you and God bless our world.

Posted by: Furlett Adamah | August 28, 2008 11:31 AM | Report abuse


I'll take Clinton and a BJ in the oval office over 8 years of a Bush- and Cheney-led criminal syndicate there any day.

Posted by: STILTON | August 28, 2008 11:32 AM | Report abuse

By the way, what Clinton said last night about 25 years of a conservative agenda finally getting their chance in 2001 when they controlled the Congress and the Executive Branch was absolutely on the money. It's a FAILURE:

"The choice is clear. The Republicans will nominate a good man who served our country heroically and suffered terribly in Vietnam. He loves our country every bit as much as we all do. As a senator, he has shown his independence on several issues. But on the two great questions of this election, how to rebuild the American dream and how to restore America's leadership in the world, he still embraces the extreme philosophy which has defined his party for more than 25 years, a philosophy we never had a real chance to see in action until 2001, when the Republicans finally gained control of both the White House and Congress. Then we saw what would happen to America if the policies they had talked about for decades were implemented.

They took us from record surpluses to an exploding national debt; from over 22m new jobs down to 5m; from an increase in working family incomes of $7,500 to a decline of more than $2,000; from almost 8m Americans moving out of poverty to more than 5 and a half million falling into poverty - and millions more losing their health insurance.

Now, in spite of all the evidence, their candidate is promising more of the same: More tax cuts for the wealthiest Americans that will swell the deficit, increase inequality and weaken the economy. More Band-aids for healthcare that will enrich insurance companies, impoverish families and increase the number of uninsured. More going it alone in the world, instead of building the shared responsibilities and shared opportunities necessary to advance our security and restore our influence.

They actually want us to reward them for the last eight years by giving them four more. Let's send them a message that will echo from the Rockies all across America: Thanks, but no thanks. In this case, the third time is not the charm."

Posted by: STILTON | August 28, 2008 11:35 AM | Report abuse

ARE YOU KIDDING ME!!!??? You guys are not adressing the issues. There is more than who owns what and who is what color involved here.

I am a Democrat and a Hillary supporter but I will vote for whichever candidate I feel is ready to lead this country. I am not sure who that is yet.

I think Obama has made some huge mistakes in his candincy already and McCain has not impressed me by being tied to Bush but my biggest concern is for safety. I want to feel safe and not worry that terrorist will be able to strike again. I want to know my country will remain strong!

We had to put up with four extra years of Bush because America wanted a ban on gay marriage. Wasn't that a huge issue that should drive a presidential election?

All I can say is if Obama continues to show poor judgement and not adress issues he will not win my vote.

Posted by: Frank | August 28, 2008 11:38 AM | Report abuse


Just wait until we see what Cindy has up there (if anything)!

She's got nothing on Michelle Obama, chum. Nothing.

Posted by: STILTON | August 28, 2008 11:41 AM | Report abuse

I get your point Rando... but I think there are people right now living in America in conditions equivalent to or worse than conditions that John McCain endured.

We have veterans of this war who are suffering... paralyzed... missing limbs... mentally ill. Many of whom live on the streets and bounce in and out of jail because they haven't gotten the appropriate treatment.

There are soldiers right now who are missing or imprisoned.

There are children who grow up in poverty, and are subject to abuse and exploitation daily.

There are people in this country, falsely imprisoned, waiting for their execution.

I am leery about elevating McCain into some sort of idol. He's a guy. He did what I think most Americans would do in the circumstances. And that's good for him. But there are many, many people who have suffered much worse than him. The fact is that McCain has not always behaved honorably.

(Could you imagine how his first wife suffered? Her husband went away to war... and was imprisoned. She was maimed in an accident. And when he finally returned... he cheated on her with another woman. I would hate to walk a mile in those shoes!!!)

Posted by: Blip | August 28, 2008 11:43 AM | Report abuse

Obama will soon be another "also ran"

Posted by: SEAN | August 28, 2008 12:00 PM | Report abuse

Mando- You got it exactly!
Max M - Learn to spell.
If you don't want to actually contribute to the conversation and just keep spouting the same old tired arguments and talking points then please stay home on election day and leave the voting to sentient beings. We get the leadership we deserve.

Posted by: sesme | August 28, 2008 12:09 PM | Report abuse

Please ask yourself which candidate represents your views the best? Vote on your values, vote on your vision for America, vote on what you want to leave you grandchildren. God bless you and God bless our world."

My view is bitter
My value is 20 years of church education
My vision is highway for flat-tire car
I leave with nothing but my togue
I am God

Posted by: Anonymous | August 28, 2008 12:19 PM | Report abuse

Of course the Republicans are going to cringe if they don't get elected. The press, senate or other investigative bodies my find punishable crimes by this current circus they call an administration.

Another reason, those in power have tons of money invested in stocks, can afford to have industry move abroad where labor is cheaper, environmental standards and quality lacking. They are interested in their stock portfolio's performance, not where they are going to stay after the foreclosure of their home etc. Somehow, we need to correct those with greedy attitudes, realize we are one human family with one home....our planet we call EARTH!

Posted by: Dennis Wiscon | August 28, 2008 12:43 PM | Report abuse

The problem with humans, as both Christopher Hitchens and George Carlin have averred, and the reason we can't have a rational discussion about anything of importance, is that our prefrontal lobe is yet too small, while the adrenal gland is too large--an argument supported by the unreflective and combative partisanship on this board and elsewhere.

Posted by: Dave | August 28, 2008 12:43 PM | Report abuse

Clinton Supporter= McCain Troll.

Nice try.

I too was not an Obama supporter at first. But now when I vote, it will be for Obama because I vote based on issues.

Posted by: Kirk G. | August 28, 2008 12:46 PM | Report abuse

"THIS TIME, we will vote for our hopes, and not our fears." = THIS TIME we will ignore economic reality in favor of the highly implausible.

You hope that instead of facing a serious economic crisis in our country it will all go away when the cabal of corporate villains alluded to by Mr. Obama pays more taxes Reality- the top 50% of wage earners in the pay 97% of the tax base and accounted for the biggest tax increase on "the rich" in history under the Bush administration. The people here in Flint, MI "hope" Mr. Obama will keep his commitment to bring the auto industry back to their city. Reality-GM is posting single quarter losses of $15 billion and if they do stay afloat, Flint would be the last place they build a manufacturing facility.

We all wish that Mr. Obama could have a one-on-one with radical islamic groups and alleviate the threat of terrorism. Reality-
well, I hope you didn't buy into that one too.

When is the buzz from this rock concert you have been attending going to wear off?
Hopefully before November.

Posted by: bis | August 28, 2008 1:40 PM | Report abuse

Funny watching the R's posting away on pages like this, their panic is palpable. Like drunken rednecks who are upset someone married their sister before they had a chance to themselves.

Posted by: Earving Waller | August 28, 2008 1:43 PM | Report abuse

The pleasure is all yours Earving. For the polls, bias as they are in Mr. Obama's favor, cannot help but indicate who should and should not be in a panic.

Posted by: Anonymous | August 28, 2008 1:59 PM | Report abuse

Too bad the Clinton supporter doesn't understand that he or she will be better off financially with Obama than McCain. McCain is keeping the unfair tax cuts for the rich--Obama will take them away. Obama is giving tax credits to middle class families--McCain is not. Lots more on economics if you bother to check out both campaign websites--but maybe you would rather sulk.

Incidentally, I will getting the same overdose of McCain next week.

Posted by: Joan from Virginia | August 28, 2008 1:59 PM | Report abuse

I am not voting for Obama.
He got lucky in riding the coattails of Oprah for publicity but he has made this campaign an ugly and flashy one. This is not any sign of change, this is a red flag of a country sinking further.

Obama should turn preacher, he has no clue of fact and only talks fluff. If he can point out Mrs. McCains properties, he is only fuelling the growing resentment people have towards those who are fortunate to have more. Does that mean the country should turn around and ask him and his children of their growth and question why he is not living in a trailer? It is shameful that he stoops so low and cunningly misleads people into believing that McCain's are wealthy and could not care less. People with money do more for the underprivileged. And this is something they do not have to do.

Also, Obama is supremely selfish and would not have done the same for Hilary had the tables turned. He is the weaker link and if it was change he truly wanted, he would have stepped out of the race, supporting the wiser, smarter and capable candidate - Hillary Clinton. He is a user, using race, celebrities and the Clintons to get ahead. I want a president who has experience and not someone who is desperate t become an overnight celebrity.

Posted by: Meisha | August 28, 2008 2:11 PM | Report abuse

Who's riding Oprah's coattails? Where does she fit into the political process? What evidence do you have for this statement? Aren't all the candidates endorsed by very famous people? Didn't Bush and doesn't McCain ride Limbaugh's and every other powerful conservative talk show host's coattails by your argument?

People are very afraid of change. When they are faced with it, they will often hide in the familiar in desparation. It is human nature and no one should be ashamed of that. But, when the familiar is dangerous, the law of survival of the fittest demands that those who avoid the familiar will be those who survive.

"Also, Obama is supremely selfish and would not have done the same for Hilary had the tables turned."

Again, this is your opinion, thankfully not shared by many Americans. What evidence do you have that Barak Obama is selfish? I have tons of evidence that he is no such thing. No one can know what he would have done if the situation had been reversed, and you certainly don't know him or his heart to make such a statement. This is just another example of letting our thoughts and hearts cloud the facts. Just because you assume he is selfish because he didn't drop out of the race when you thought he should doesn't make it so.

Posted by: Conan Crocker | August 28, 2008 3:05 PM | Report abuse

Proud Puma,

Concerning Warren Buffet's home ownership: I believe he owns one. One he bought, say, in the '60's. Not a good example of conspicuous consumption.

Posted by: David | August 28, 2008 3:31 PM | Report abuse

All this banal chatter is a sure sign of a country in denial and decline. The country needs huge change and Obama is the one that can deliver. McCain represents the old politics of division that have worked so well for Bush while devastating the country and the world.

Posted by: Richard | August 28, 2008 3:35 PM | Report abuse

"I don't get it, and please explain: why would a democrat, who worked hard to get their ideas elected vote for a republican?"

Is a real Republican running this time? Oh, you must mean John McCain... John McCain, whose positions and record on just about everything except the Iraq War are consistent with moderate Democrats.

There aren't very many real Republicans left, only real socialists (i.e. current Democrats) and real Democrats (i.e most Republicans these days).

Posted by: logicprobe | August 28, 2008 3:45 PM | Report abuse

Ha ha ha ... All these Republicans pretending to be "Clinton supporters". By now everybody knows, so please stop being lame. Even if you are a Clinton supporter, you're better off being a McCain supporter because you fit the profile: gullible and impressionable.

Posted by: Nash Plinkton | August 28, 2008 4:52 PM | Report abuse

I am shocked that the fact that the McCain’s have many homes is being regarded as a “bad” quality. Since when is being lucky and fortunate a bad quality. John McCain spent many years without any home and food for that matter. The fact that the McCain family is willing to jump in and take on this public office and hold their lives up for securitization and not sit around in one of their “houses” living the good life should be commended. Clinton Supporter who come nOvemebr will cast my vote for McCain.

Posted by: | August 28, 2008 4:58 PM | Report abuse

So glad you realize that you’re Anonymous; anyone who would refer to a Clinton supporter as racist, or write that SENATOR Clinton is an “unqualified carpetbagger housewife” is better off staying Anonymous along with their dear leader.

Posted by: Tompgirl | August 28, 2008 5:14 PM | Report abuse

"How long is the Beast allowed to have authority in Revelations? "

Revelations Chapter 13 tells us that it is 42 months...

... Almost a four-year term of a Presidency...

According to The Book of Revelations the anti-Christ is:

"...a man, in his 40's, of MUSLIM descent, who will deceive the nations with persuasive language, and have a MASSIVE Christ-like appeal....the prophecy says that people will flock to him and he will promise false hope and world peace, and when he is in power, he will destroy everything..."

Do we recognize this description?


Even if you don't believe in the Bible or it's teachings, how can we ignore the fact that this man has such close ties to the Muslim faith and it's beliefs?
And that the Pastor from his church preached hate against America?--No matter how much he may denounce him now, this was his spiritual leader for many years.


In a recent news broadcast, Barack Obama made this statement with pride, 'We are no longer a Christian nation; we are now a nation of Christians, Jews, Muslims, Buddhists, . .." To think our forefathers fought and died for the right for our nation to be a Christian nation--then to have this man say with pride that we are no longer that.

How far has this nation come from what our founding fathers intended it to be!

Posted by: Shayna Arnold | August 29, 2008 10:26 AM | Report abuse

Question: do the Comment Nazis wet themselves with excitement? And if so, does it short out there precious Comment Nazi computers?

Posted by: fukc you b1tch | August 29, 2008 5:16 PM | Report abuse

Nash Plinkton you are a misoganist pig and if a good woman ever meets you she will cut your balls of with a spatula.

Posted by: Marie | August 29, 2008 5:19 PM | Report abuse

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