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The Final Debate: Angry White Man

John of the Grimaces met Barack the Unflappable in Hempstead tonight, and the guy with the arctic cool, not surprisingly, prevailed.

Now we know why Obama’s aides were goading McCain earlier this week to raise the Bill Ayres issue in the debate. They wanted to play McCain’s rage against Obama’s measured, judicious, statesmanlike, even a bit boring presidentiality. And McCain obliged them big time.

The Arizona senator had been doing well up until that moment, which came about half an hour into the debate. But as he recounted the Obama attack ads (which may outnumber McCain’s in raw numbers, since Obama has more money than God, but which come nowhere close to the percentage of McCain commercials that are attack ads), McCain started seething, and after Obama answered his attack on the Ayres connection, McCain couldn’t stop. He kept on attacking, then remembered that people didn’t actually like this, pirouetted to say that his campaign was about issues, and fell flat on his face, not to rise again for the duration of the debate.

The Obama campaign has always believed that if McCain was going to be knocked out in the course of a debate, it would be at the hands of McCain. Obama’s role, not the most scintillating, was to swat away the attacks and get back to some real-world issue for the second-half of each answer. It was to look resolute, but also to be the world’s least
angry -- or more precisely, anger-able -- black man.

At times, McCain recalled the Bob Dole of the ’96 campaign, mixing indignation with the Beltway shorthand that even a candidate running against Washington cannot escape after spending several decades in Congress. Discussing the merits of the Colombian Free Trade agreement with references to the FARC -- how many Americans knew what the hell he was talking about? By the debate’s last half-hour, in which the candidates went over health care, energy, abortion and education, Obama was on his home turf and McCain plainly wasn’t. (Watching CNN, which has those squiggles representing swing voter reaction to every word, I noted that the dials moved not at all as McCain got into the weeds of his health care plan: On health care, McCain was flat-lining.)

Plainly, Obama’s goals in the three presidential debates were to show his understanding of how the nation’s problems affect real people and to put out some plausible-sounding solutions, and, just as if not more important, to show people he was serious, reliable, thoughtful and safe -- just the guy to steer us through rough economic times. As the debates dwindled down to a precious one, McCain’s goals were all but contradictory: to attack Obama hard enough to get the kid to crack and to reverse voter sentiment, but not hard enough to reinforce the impression that he was waging a preponderantly negative campaign or, worse yet, that he was an angry white man. In short, he had to square a circle. In short, he didn’t.

By Harold Meyerson  | October 16, 2008; 12:19 AM ET
Categories:  Meyerson  | Tags:  Harold Meyerson  
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Next: The Final Debate: Their Essential Selves

Comments

This is the finest analysis I have read of the debate so far - 100% in accordance with my impressions. Nice!

Posted by: afd2008 | October 16, 2008 12:48 AM | Report abuse

I watched all three debates, and I'm surprised that hardly anyone noticed how awkwardly nervous and desperate McCain appeared tonight. True, some of his incessant blinking could be attributed to the bright stage lights, but it was so constant -- and only when he was talking -- that it was obviously a nervous tick of sorts, which is a good indicator that the speaker isn't being candid or honest.

At least he managed to look at Obama a few times this go-around -- it helped that their chairs were angled toward each other -- but even so, each quick glance was patronizing and scoffing -- a marked difference to Obama's nods and sincere demeanor. Even though McCain avoided refering to Obama as "that one", he couldn't manage the cordiality to refer to Obama by name in his closing statement. On the one hand, McCain almost was in tears telling his story about allegedly being labeled intolerant by one of his Senate colleagues, yet his actions and his words belie some disturbing traits and an ugly attitude.

I'm really tired of all the deference (excuses) McCain has been accorded because of his POW past, especially by the press. If the tables were turned and Obama exhibited half of "that one's" queer mannerisms and offensive quirks, the media would be having a field day.

Posted by: honest_news | October 16, 2008 12:54 AM | Report abuse

Obama gets the 'best' performance award on TV tonight. He was "unflappable", polished. Smiling, sarcastically sometimes. But smiling.

But i'm not electing an actor. Or most popular. Or best looking. What I want is: most likely to succeed. Not as the first black president. Or the oldest president.

But the PERSON who can change...for the BETTER. Not just change for change sake.

John McCain is angry about the mess this country is in. So am I.

Posted by: ustimes | October 16, 2008 12:59 AM | Report abuse

McCain was disturbed and disturbing. What was the bit about the veterans' caps?

Posted by: bdunn1 | October 16, 2008 1:08 AM | Report abuse

This was McCain's best performance. He kept Obama on defensive. Obama was cool and calm and his answer to McCain offense was a goofy smile. He needs to watch out as there are still 20 days for the election and if does not reply to McCain's offense he may be stuck with McCain's portrayal.

Posted by: krishna5002 | October 16, 2008 1:08 AM | Report abuse

Again, Obama was thoughtful, had a plan, and stuck to it. During the primaries he went after delegates and during the main campaign has sought electoral votes. He's not only run a campaign to help himself, but has set up a ground force to help other Democrats as well.

McCain has shot from the hip, done what ever he thought necessary to win, and has universally hurt other Republicans.

I can have a beer with my neighbor, I want a President that is smart and purposeful.
That is obviously Barack Obama

Posted by: don1one | October 16, 2008 1:13 AM | Report abuse

On the surface, it was McCain's best - but when he degenerated into incoherence, anyone listening carefully probably wouldn't call it so good at all.

And, krishna, I don't think Obama can possibly be "stuck with McCain's portrayal." McCain has totally squandered his credibility in this campaign. Fewer and fewer people trust, much less, believe, anything he says.

Posted by: pasc1 | October 16, 2008 1:13 AM | Report abuse

Congratulations Harold, you're the first columnist in any major publication to take the "CNN squiggles" seriously.

I suggest the Post hire the squiggles to replace you; probably cheaper, and definitely easier to look at.

Posted by: jd5024 | October 16, 2008 1:32 AM | Report abuse

The prominence of Columbia and William Ayers in this debate brought to mind John McCain's OWN ties to terrorists - ones who (unlike Ayers, who killed nobody) are actually murdering and kidnapping people in that South American country. McCain's chief fundraiser and member of his "Ohio Victory Team", Carl Lindner, was fined by the US government for funding the AUC to the tune of $1.7 million. Why has William Ayers taken over our national debate but Carl Lindner isn't even worth a mention? Truly bizarre.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/07/02/mccain-fundraiser-oversaw_n_110354.html

Posted by: B2O2 | October 16, 2008 1:34 AM | Report abuse

McCain's anger bothers me. He seems like a hot headed fighter pilot - not a cool headed statesman
But I wish Obama had shown a little more passion - he's wife says he has it and I have heard it in some of his speeches
But in the end both men were true to who they are
McCain the passionate and erratic fighter.
Obama the cool and thoughtful leader
I think that in this country it often comes down to faith based politics - I have faith that this is the path the country needs to be on (not I have studied the problems and have found that this is the most logical solution)
In the end I will vote for Obama because I "believe" that McCain might end up leading us into a horrible war involving nuclear weapons. And I am sure that Palin would

Posted by: lindamack5 | October 16, 2008 1:34 AM | Report abuse

MCCAIN IS ANGRY BECAUSE OBAMA IS HIJACKING HIS LIFETIME OF SERVICE TO AMERICA, BY TELLING VOTERS WHAT THEY WANT TO HEAR, NAMELY:

1. WE WILL REDUCE YOUR TAXES - HE EVEN SAID HE WOULD REDUCE JOE THE PLUMBER'S TAXES ++++ AFTER ++++ LEARNING THAT JOE MADE 25k OVER HIS 250k LIMIT.

2. WE WILL COMPEL UNIVERSAL HEALTH CARE -- EVEN CLINTON COULDN'T DO THIS WITH A BUDGET SURPLUS.

3. WE WILL KEEP HOMEOWNERS IN THEIR HOMES, EVEN IF THEY CAN'T AFFORD THEM.

4. WE WILL SAVE THE ECONOMY BY 'GOING GREEN.' ONLY THOSE BUYING ALL THIS BS ARE 'GREEN.'

5. WE WILL IMPROVE EDUCATION -- DA !!!

+++++++ AND WE WILL DO ALL OF THIS AND LOWER THE DEFECIT AND YOUR TAXES AS WELL ALL AT THE SAME TIME ++++++++++++++++++

+++++++++I GUESS MCCAIN IS ANGRY AT THIS BS ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Posted by: brucerealtor@gmail.com | October 16, 2008 1:36 AM | Report abuse

Obama missed a chance when McCain cried out that "That's what Herbert Hoover did and he turned a recession into a depression"...

Obama should have told him "I'm not Herbert Hoover and if you wanted to run against Herbert Hoover, you should have run against him in your 30s, Lord knows you were old enough"

McCain actually inspired more pity in me than he did in the other debates... He's just not as Smart as Obama and his Campaign advisors are not Smart either.

still, I'll be glad Obama is President, but there were many times in the debate I thought McCain would explode or burst into flames...

I actually thought that if Obama really got him going, really answered back tit for tat on some of McCain's outrageous talking points, That McCain would stab Obama with his pen.

For Instance: If every time, and there were PLENTY, McCain proposed supporting some new project or plan (including continuing to send billions of dollars to Colombia), that Obama would say, "So, you can't do that without tax money"... McCain would have surely physically attacked him.

I guess Obama did the smart thing and, once again, McCain didn't... He listened to Bush's Handlers, but times have changed. Bush is now the worst President in the History of the United States of America...

And John McCain is NOT Bush. He's a little smarter and a LOT angrier. Other than that, he's exactly the same.

Posted by: LeftwithNochoice | October 16, 2008 1:46 AM | Report abuse

"John McCain is angry about the mess this country is in. So am I.
Posted by: ustimes | October 16, 2008 12:59 AM"
No, John McCain is angry that he's losing. If he has a problem with the mess this country is in, the proper reaction from him (and you if you voted for Bush) is GUILT. You have no right to anger.


"McCain was disturbed and disturbing. What was the bit about the veterans' caps?
Posted by: bdunn1 | October 16, 2008 1:08 AM"
It was a shout-out to Nixon's Checkers speech.

Posted by: light_bearer | October 16, 2008 1:56 AM | Report abuse

The Angry White Man vs the grinning empty suit?

I'll take the Angry white man any day.

BTW Meyerson? White Man? Are you a racist a##hole in bed with Obama?

Posted by: ekim53 | October 16, 2008 1:56 AM | Report abuse

BRUCEREALTOR@GMAIL.COM,

YOU DON'T HAVE TO YELL, +++++++ IS ANNOYING, AND YOU PROBABLY DON'T NEED TO PUT YOUR EMAIL ADDRESS AS YOUR HANDLE.

OTHER THAN THAT, I SEE YOUR POINT EXCEPT CLINTON DIDN'T INHERIT A SURPLUS, HE BUILT ONE AFTER 12 YEARS OF REPUBLICAN ADMINISTRATIONS.

AND I DIDN'T NOTICE MY TAXES BEING HIGHER UNDER CLINTON... MAYBE THAT'S BECAUSE GAS WAS LESS THAN A DOLLAR A GALLON, HOME PRICES MATCHED INCOMES, AND THERE WAS OPPORTUNITY EVERYWHERE.

OH, AND THIS:

"3. WE WILL KEEP HOMEOWNERS IN THEIR HOMES, EVEN IF THEY CAN'T AFFORD THEM."
is what John McCain claims he's gonna do while cutting taxes.

OH, YEAH, AND THIS:

"4. WE WILL SAVE THE ECONOMY BY 'GOING GREEN.' ONLY THOSE BUYING ALL THIS BS ARE 'GREEN.'"
He didn't say. He said "Clean Energy" will be the industry of this Century and the US should lead on it. He never said, "going green to save the economy"

UNLIKE MCCAIN WHO SAID HE WOULD BUILD 45 NUCLEAR REACTORS TO POWER THE NATION IN HIS FIRST TERM. SO, ARE WE GONNA POWER OUR CARS WITH NUCLEAR POWER? WHAT IS HE TALKING ABOUT?

HE REALLY DOES NOT SEEM WELL. BUT ROMNEY WOULD HAVE BEEN WORSE. HE'S A PENCIL PUSHER EXTRAORDINAIRE. What a Dork.

ANYWAY, BRUCEREALTOR@GMAIL.COM, NEXT TIME, TRY WATCHING THE DEBATE BEFORE YOU GO ONLINE TO LIE FOR YOUR REPUBLICAN LOSER CANDIDATE...

PALIN/ROMNEY 2012

Posted by: LeftwithNochoice | October 16, 2008 2:00 AM | Report abuse

ekim53/ROMNEY 2012

PRO36/PALIN 2012

(loooooserrrrrs.)

Posted by: LeftwithNochoice | October 16, 2008 2:05 AM | Report abuse

He kept Obama on defensive.
****
dear krishna,
are you on crack?

Posted by: frieda406 | October 16, 2008 2:06 AM | Report abuse

GREAT analysis Mr. Meyerson!!!

Posted by: T-Prop | October 16, 2008 2:06 AM | Report abuse

JOE MADE 25k OVER HIS 250k LIMIT.
****
so why shouldn't joe, if he makes almost 300k a year as a plumber (any job openings in his city?), pay more taxes? the moronic republican trickle down theory is a bunch of cow pies. never worked, will never worked. just kept the rich richer and the rest of us paying for it.

Posted by: frieda406 | October 16, 2008 2:09 AM | Report abuse

Posted by: brucerealtor| October 16, 2008 1:36 AM
"MCCAIN IS ANGRY BECAUSE...I GUESS MCCAIN IS ANGRY AT THIS BS ==================================
So, Bruce...I take it you are unhappy? - Or is your caps lock is stuck?

Posted by: T-Prop | October 16, 2008 2:10 AM | Report abuse

McCain took the bait and the rest is hisotry

Posted by: ramsistla | October 16, 2008 2:19 AM | Report abuse

McCain took the bait and the rest is history

Posted by: ramsistla | October 16, 2008 2:21 AM | Report abuse

Maybe its time for Mrs. McCain (John's mother) to "Get the water" - the cold water immersion treatment his parents had to use when he would petulantly hold his breath until he passed out while flying into a rage at not getting his way as a small child.

It appears he's regressing, rapidly.

Posted by: trnmstr | October 16, 2008 3:04 AM | Report abuse

After Six-Pack Joe and Joe the Plumber, next time it's Joe Cocker singing "With a little help from my funds."

Posted by: bekabo | October 16, 2008 3:09 AM | Report abuse

ha ha ha. McCain spends the summer proclaiming himself a "leader" w/ "experience. Then he gets schooled 3 times by a political tool like Obama. Jeezz have ya ever counted the number of times Ocrapa says "uh". He isn't even a good speaker.
I speak better than Ocrapa.

To you GOP losers. True leaders don't ever proclaim themselves as leaders.

McCain never would have even made it to the senate without Cindi's money.

Oh and btw. I freaking hate the democrats like you idiots could never imagine. But at least I have real reasons. all you idiots could come up with was Ayers, the flag lapel pin, pledge of stupidity, "spreading the wealth", Rev. wright's true and accurate comments and ACORN.

Jeez what a joke. GW Bush has dumbed you all down past the point of no return.
Have fun at the Palin rallies. I hope you ask her when she is going to go on Jeopardy and show the world how much smarter than Obama she is.

Posted by: torro67 | October 16, 2008 3:11 AM | Report abuse

For someone knowing this was his last shot at the white house, McCain ran his campaign and acted like he was running for the outhouse. Game over!

Posted by: tydicea | October 16, 2008 3:16 AM | Report abuse

C'mon , You wrote this BEFORE the debate, didn't cha.
You didn't want to watch it through.


Obama didn't look COOL, He obfuscated on some serious issues.

And the canard proclaiming "Kill Him" was shouted at McCain Rallies could not be corroborated. I added a link below.

OBAMA needs to Apologize for his remarks about that and also REPUDATE Mr. Lewis comments.

FYI - OBAMA has raised NEARLY ONE TRILLION DOLLARS for his campaign. He has even purchased his own Station. 24/7 OBAMA. He is flooding the market with ads and buying a 30 minute slot on several media channels

And you don't mention that but mention all of McCains ads are Negative?

No INtegrity. John McCain is have to do everything he can to get his message out and the media has done its part for Obama in pushing it back.

JOURNALISM IS DEAD!!!

Secret Service says "Kill him" allegation unfounded

http://www.timesleader.com/news/breakingnews/Secret_Service_says_Kill_him_allegation_unfounded_.html

Posted by: TexasTeaParty | October 16, 2008 3:36 AM | Report abuse

DECAF BRUCEREALTOR! It works wonders for anger management. And torro67, how can you HATE people that you don't know, haven't done anything personally to you and have such animosity towards your fellow humans? That's not American. . . . or is that what some of us have become?

And if you watched the debate and TIVO'd it, watch it again with the sound off (and/or with closed captions). I think you'll get the point. We need clear thinking, not rhetoric. The USA is going down like John McCain's fighter jets (plural). Let's put the USA back on the world leader map and get out of this war-mongering state we've been in for the last 5 years. Help by voting for REAL CHANGE! Nuff said!

Posted by: HumanofEarth | October 16, 2008 3:41 AM | Report abuse

OLD MAN YELLS AT CLOUDS AND BLINKS HIMSELF TO DEATH...

Posted by: braultrl | October 16, 2008 3:43 AM | Report abuse

So, TexasTeaParty, ALL the news cast that have the sound track that EVERYONE in the WORLD heard was faked, huh? Who you gonna believe, you or my lying ears? Go drink some more of that kool-aid the Repugs dish out. It's powerful stuff! And they didn't say "Terrorist!" either, did they. Guess all the news organizations got it wrong. . . even the little old lady that call Obama an Arab before John took the mike away from her. Oh, and if you replay the clip, John DID NOT repudiate her accusation . . he said "Mr Obama is a fine family man (and was then boo'd by his own minoins). Never did he say, "No Ma'am, HE NOT an Arab, he's an American".

His own station, . . a Trillion dollars . . . OH, I get it, you're joking! My bad! Sorry!

Posted by: HumanofEarth | October 16, 2008 3:50 AM | Report abuse

"Old man yells at cloud."

Posted by: DuttonPeabody | October 16, 2008 4:06 AM | Report abuse

The neocons hate the worm, but it was used without permission in Australia last year and it was spot on with the election result.

We had an old man who had been the PM for over a decade trying to tell us that he would change the government - except we knew we would only have more of the same and attacking his own record and his colleagues just looked stupid.

McCain has been part of Washington for 26 years, how on earth can he say he is not part of the problem when he supported Bush and his deranged war that has ended up pretty much destroying the US?

Many people have said this for years now and the repugnicons simply refused to listen.

Posted by: shepherdmarilyn | October 16, 2008 4:08 AM | Report abuse

OBAMA PROVED SUPERIOR STRESS TOLERANCE - THE MOST IMPORTANT QUALITY FOR A PRESIDENT

Stress destroys judgment, intelligence and creativity and calls forth mental imbalance and aggressiveness. Even worse, it activates defense mechanisms - "psychological blinders", that distort the perception of reality.

Therefore, high stress tolerance is by far the most important quality of a president.

The stressful presidential debate is a good "stress tolerance test". Once again Sen. Obama proved his high stress tolerance "in battle".

It is evident that with Obama, we will have a president capable of making intelligent, wise, realistic and balanced judgments, keeping his mind cool under the very stressful conditions of presidency that will be worse than ever due to the severe economic crisis.

Regarding McCain, judge for yourself..

J.Grandville, M.D.
Expert on stress and developmental psychology

Posted by: drgrandville | October 16, 2008 4:10 AM | Report abuse

It was an interesting debate but it was exactly what I expected it to be last night.

John McCain is mad, alright, but it's not the same reason why the average working person is mad. McCain is mad because he is losing at the moment.

I watched last night and I could see a man that wanted to try to land as many cheap shots as he could (score the most points in as little as time as possible). He had a nervous 'edge' about him sitting there last night. Often, he would not let Senator Obama finish with his answer.

McCain is another Bush (never excepting responsibility for anything over the last 8 years). McCain has money and he has the best health care (he has never had to struggle like an average citizen) yet he tries to act like he knows what the average citizen is going through during hard times.

This, to me, seems like a guy that is not angry at the same reasons why I'm angry. McCain represents the party that is mostly to blame for the mess this country has experienced over the last 8 years (I am not letting Democrats off the hook, totally, but the facts are the facts).

And lastly, how can you separate yourself from the current administration when you were obviously FOR that administration 90 percent of the time?

Posted by: ssanford00 | October 16, 2008 4:40 AM | Report abuse

wow, meyerson went there!

i pity john mccain. wait a minute, sarah palin just flashed through my brain and reminded me of just how bad off this country would be if mccain became too angry and died from a stroke or a heart attack. scary. they both are decked out in their most frightening regalia and in comparison, obama appears to be far more presidential than either one of them.

the debate cemented support for obama by the independents and may have swayed some mccain supporters into the obama column. it really was an embarassment to watch mccain self-destruct on national tv. he made me cringe.

Posted by: glenknowles | October 16, 2008 5:05 AM | Report abuse

I like the way you write....'phirrhoueted'....great word...McCain in a tutu!

I would have also mentioned McCain's defense of those yelling 'terrorists' and 'kill him' at his rallies. That was shocking -- an admittance of what the base of the Republican party has become.

And Joe the plumber -- again McCain doesn;t understand that someone making $250,000 a year is NOT middle class.

Good journalism!

Posted by: gnkollia | October 16, 2008 5:17 AM | Report abuse

No one has any idea who or what Obama is..
I will give him credit for being a great actor and full of it.

Take a look at what some of his tax 'relief' means to the Taxpayer. His give from the rich to the poor scheme.. will bankrupt America. With him Reid,and Pelosi in control of the United States.. you will be putting the foxes guarding the hen house.. and the who knows what will happen.

he specific tax changes Obama has laid out are:
- Increase the top individual tax rate from 35 percent to 39.6 percent.
- Raise the capital gains tax rate from 15 percent to 28 percent.
- Increase the stock dividends (tax?) rate from 15 percent to 39.6 percent.
- Impose a 20-percent surtax on all incomes above $250,000 per year.
- Raise the death tax rate to 55 percent for any income past the first $1million exemption.
- Raise social security taxes by 4 percent for individuals, businesses or anyone who makes at least $250,000 per year.
- Increase the top rate from 37.9 percent to 54.9 percent for self-employed tax payers (who already pay ordinary income taxes as well as self-employment taxes).
- Increase the tax rate on Subchapter S corporations (small businesses) by up to 15.3 percent (from a top rate of 35 percent to 50.3 percent).

http://canadafreepress.com/index.php/article/5590

Posted by: miller51550 | October 16, 2008 6:15 AM | Report abuse


Yes bo2o2:

Why all the reckus about a non-event, the so-called Ayers'affair and nothing about Karl Lindner, McVain's chief Ohio funraiser, and his proved ties with real terrorists and killers in South America?

Again the double standard. just like with Rev Jeremiah Right, the 'topic' is blown out of proportion by the MSM.

Same with the shameful ad falsely accusing obama of intending to give sex-ed to kindergartners, with small indignetion for a day or two.

Or lipstick on a pig making the headlines for weeks, while Six-Gun Paliin is labeling Barrack Obama "terrorist", and there is no national outrage ord huge coverage from the MSM."

The MSM has not only been bizarre, but often biased, right from the start towards Obama.

I do not agree with all that Obama says, and totally disagree with him on a certain number of hot topics.

That said, I firmly believe that he should have the presidency with high colors, because he showed real talent and personality to come this long way unscathed, and a lot to offer to anxious voters.

Contrary to Big Mac, who just kept on making a fool of himself on a daily basis.

As to Moose Skiner!!!!!

Posted by: bekabo | October 16, 2008 6:23 AM | Report abuse

AN OLD MAN RECALLING faded glorys of his war years in comments about veterans with hats, fading fad ing fad i n g .......a w a y..........

Posted by: JudgeAlan | October 16, 2008 6:27 AM | Report abuse

The media needs to stop looking to be entertained by a debate. It's not a prize fight as it is often compared and certainly not a one liner competition as many pundits hope it to be. This just lowers the public discourse.

McCain did indeed look angry, but more importantly he couldn't answer questions about how he would pay for anything. I found his comments about education particularly lacking as far as how he would fund vouchers, special education, and teacher pay especially since he has said he would take a hatchet to the budget.

Posted by: 12345leavemealone | October 16, 2008 6:43 AM | Report abuse

McCain and Palin? Unstable and unable.

No thanks.

Posted by: trace1 | October 16, 2008 6:43 AM | Report abuse

I don't think the McCain camp told him there was going to be a split screen. It doomed him. Everytime Obama was talking they'd show McCain squirmimg, smirking, rolling his eyes, grinding his teeth. I thought maybe his underwear was riding up on him.

I'm sure he's going to chew someone's butt when he sees the tapes.

Posted by: CHICO13 | October 16, 2008 6:53 AM | Report abuse

Criticizing McCain's demeanor is like kicking someone who's already down. Maybe it is constant physical pain from his permanent injuries that's the cause. He didn't break Obama's "cool" and he had to do that to have any chance. This one's over.

Posted by: rmpatera | October 16, 2008 6:57 AM | Report abuse

This ad is brought to you by the Washington Post annex of the Obama campaign and we approve this message.

Posted by: bdstauffer | October 16, 2008 7:00 AM | Report abuse

HumanofEarth "Oh, and if you replay the clip, John DID NOT repudiate her accusation . . he said "Mr Obama is a fine family man (and was then boo'd by his own minoins). Never did he say, "No Ma'am, HE NOT an Arab, he's an American".

- Would'nt the more appropriate answer be "Ma'am, actually Arabs are not bad people. Terrorists are bad people. There are nearly 2 million Arab americans living here right now. It is a signifier of the larger cultural problem the U.S. has. Muslems are not bad people. All muslems are not terrorists". Come on! anyone who believes that someone could not run a country because they are Arab American and therefore -a terrorist ... shut up. Thats ignorant. Stay at home on election day.

Posted by: ryanmcdonald84 | October 16, 2008 7:05 AM | Report abuse

McCAINS BEHAVIOR FURTHER CONFIRMED HIS UNSUITABILITY

In this debate, as well formerly, he has showed clear signs of a high level of stress.

Stress destroys judgment, intelligence and creativity and calls forth mental imbalance and aggressiveness. Even worse, it activates defense mechanisms - "psychological blinders", that distort the perception of reality.

Obama on the other hand has shown a superior stress tolerance in demanding stressful situations like the presidential debate and in unprepared TV-interviews.

In him, we will have a president capable of making intelligent, wise, realistic and balanced judgments, keeping his mind cool under the very stressful conditions of presidency that will be worse than ever due to the severe economic crisis.

For more, see my blog at: http://drgrandville.blogspot.com/2008/10/suitability-of-president-should-be.html

J.Grandville, M.D.
Expert on stress and developmental psychology


Posted by: drgrandville | October 16, 2008 7:17 AM | Report abuse

In Sarah Palin speak: "It's all over now but the shoutin." But I'm guessing the shoutin will be quite loud. If I hear about Bill Ayers from McCain one more time, I may write-in for Ayers. If he's that powerful, maybe he's the best person to get us out of the mess Bush is leaving us in.

Posted by: SharptonVoter | October 16, 2008 7:23 AM | Report abuse

Umm...this section of the paper is called "Post Partisan" right? Therefore you should expect that the columnist is going to have a certain set of ideologies. You may want to stop calling him a shill for the Obama camp and find a columnist in this section that appeals to your particular point of view (they're there).

I thought Obama was not as tiptop as in previous debates at the beginning but once he got into his groove he was just fine. I kept telling my husband that McCain was going to yell at him to get off his grass! And I think many people have come to the realization that, as much as we all want lower taxes in an ideal world, in the real one we need to come together to clean up the mess Dubya will leave behind. My family is part of the population that will see the Bush tax cuts expire (which is different from a tax increase, thanks) but if the current Administration had not mired us in a useless secondary war that's cost nearly $1 trillion then our economy would be better equipped to deal with fixing the shredded fabric of our society - education, health care, energy, national security, etc.

It's going to be a painful couple of years ahead but I believe that under an Obama adminsitration we WILL come out ahead.

Posted by: docwife | October 16, 2008 7:25 AM | Report abuse

McCAINS BEHAVIOR FURTHER CONFIRMED HIS UNSUITABILITY

In this debate, as well formerly, he has showed clear signs of a high level of stress.

Stress destroys judgment, intelligence and creativity and calls forth mental imbalance and aggressiveness. Even worse, it activates defense mechanisms - "psychological blinders", that distort the perception of reality.

Obama on the other hand has shown a superior stress tolerance in demanding stressful situations like the presidential debate and in unprepared TV-interviews.

In him, we will have a president capable of making intelligent, wise, realistic and balanced judgments, keeping his mind cool under the very stressful conditions of presidency that will be worse than ever due to the severe economic crisis

==================================

At one point McCain almost snapped. He just started spitting out a bunch of words because he was so bent out of shape.

Posted by: HemiHead66 | October 16, 2008 7:34 AM | Report abuse

Wow! Given your other editorials this campaign season, Mr. Meyerson, I'm *shocked* that you'd declare Obama the winner.

Shocked.

Posted by: arlingtonresident | October 16, 2008 7:35 AM | Report abuse

I saw "Angry White Man" and thought this was an autobiographical piece from Comrade Meyerson. Anyway, I'm not sure about the racial reference "White". Anyone know the relevance of the racial reference?

Posted by: hz9604 | October 16, 2008 7:36 AM | Report abuse

Senator McCain, we know George W Bush and he is no friend of ours. Senator, you are Bush.

Posted by: medogsbstfrnd | October 16, 2008 7:36 AM | Report abuse

There was a lot of fun last night. And it was the best debate. McCain had to wade into the Ayer's trap. He would have lost points if he did not. But in doing so, he gave Obama a chance to list his advisors in a way that did not seem to be bragging. McCain's lowest point to me was when he tried to be outraged at being compared to George Wallace. He is too thin skinned to be president. He would blow a blood pressure gasket the first year and we would have Palin for a three year term and that would be too long.

Posted by: Thependulumswings | October 16, 2008 7:37 AM | Report abuse

The republicans really treat Americans like we are stupid. The issue of money for negative ads is simple: Obama has more money for ads, he is spending more on ads. So the 1/3 of his ads (per a neutral organization who looks at these things) cost more because there are more ads. However, this same organization found that 100% of McCain/Palin ads were negative. Not 1% were positive about John McCain. That's remarkable. Also, there is a qualitative difference in the definition of "negative." Obama's ads criticize McCain's policies (I do take exception to the computer ad, which was silly). McCain's ads have attacked Obama's person and tried to make him out to be "dangerous" and "scary." Of course, most Americans don't follow politics as closely, so saying, "Obama spent the most on negative ads" is assumed to be palatable for the stupid Americans, which is how republicans seem to see us.

Same thing with the Bill Ayers issue. McCain disregards the facts that Obama laid out: there were prominent republicans on that board, the Annenbergs were friends and an ambassador for Ronald Reagan, and Mrs. Annenberg has endorsed McCain! McCain just kept repeating "We need to know the truth.." What truth??? Just keep stoking the fears of the stupid Americans strategy.

I would like to see our election process shortened to 6 weeks like other countries. There is way too much time and money spent in these elections on nonsense.

I like that Sen. Obama rises about most of this and doesn't throw back McCain's ties to G. Gordon Liddy, lobbyists to Saddam Hussein, etc. He has tried to stay on message about the economy, health care, and other issues that matter to Americans. He has to fire back from time-to-time, but he has not run a culture war/character attack Rove-style campaign as McCain has. Thank you Sen. Obama. I look forward to President Obama.

Posted by: bethechange1 | October 16, 2008 7:44 AM | Report abuse

I am disappointed in a discussion supposedly on economic issues, neither candidate mentioned the elephant (pun intended) in the room on breaking the economy and our future - the Iraq War and Occupation. Billions of dollars wasted, yes wasted, against a threat to national security that did not exist. No WMDs and no intent if Saddam had them, to give them to Islamic fundamentalists.

The second big point ignored. McCain wants to get government out of everyone's lives but for pregnant women, where his running mate wants to force women to carry their rapist's child to term so some loving Christian fundamentalist can adopt them.

Posted by: jonmiktay@hotmail.com | October 16, 2008 7:50 AM | Report abuse

From John McCain's Mouth: "That's big government at its best. Now, 95 percent of the people in America will receive more money under my plan because they will receive not only their present benefits, which may be taxed, which will be taxed, but then you add $5,000 onto it, except for those people who have the gold-plated Cadillac insurance policies that have to do with cosmetic surgery and transplants and all of those kinds of things."


http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/washington/2008/10/debate-transcri.html

So first he is going to tax our health benefits and then he is going to give us a $5,000 tax credit for a family. Which means as a single person I get $2,500. His plan would put a lot of people into another tax braket because of his plan. Meaning that they will be paying more taxes that this $2,500 will not even begin to cover.

Next he lump transplant surgery with cosmetic surgery. Hmmmm ... so those of you out there that have a child that needs a transplant or yourself ... well that cosmetic and you don't really need it. That's what I'm reading that if your have insurance that covers this then you have a gold-plated Cadillac insurance policy. Intresting ... what other thing would he consider not worthy. What about me as a woman paying for extra coverage just in case of cancer? Would that be a gold-plated Cadillac insurance policy?

So lets review:

(1)Taxing health insurance which will increase the person's tax level;
(2) Transplants are considered conmitic surgery by McCain;
(3) His tax credit is $5,000 limit for a family; $2,500 for a single person.

Hmmmm ... out of the two, I pick Obama's policy thanks.

Posted by: ThisWomansOpinion | October 16, 2008 7:55 AM | Report abuse

Well, EJ, I think you've overlooked the corrosive effect of racism in this campaign.
And that might explain a lot of the anger you saw in one candidate.

My heart went out when Honest John said how hurt he had been by some Congressman from Alabama's comments against him,.

When will this country stop discriminating against white man?

When for God's sake?

Posted by: R49Thomas | October 16, 2008 7:56 AM | Report abuse

Please note your racism........what the he*l does angry WHITE man have to do with anything?????

Oh, that is right...racism has been privatised for "BLACK" use only.........

Shame on the Washington Post......know that IF socialism wins over capitalism, do you really think people will spend $$$ on newspapers???? And what will happen to your jobs? Hope you have some other survivor skills for yourself and your family.

Posted by: accountability_in_gov | October 16, 2008 8:05 AM | Report abuse

I'm not voting for Obama just for his cool temperament (likewise, I'm not voting against McCain because of his uneven temperament), but I have to say I'll feel more comfortable with someone who can be poised and collected both among foreign officials and in stressful times.

How many times has McCain called opponents and colleagues (and his wife) names that can't be printed here? The next president isn't in for smooth sailing and should be someone who can handle difficult matters with confidence, logic and reason, not bullying or childish name calling.

Posted by: sarahabc | October 16, 2008 8:12 AM | Report abuse

McCain wants to lose the election. That realization hit me mid-way through last nights "debate". McCain knows he has his base sewn up, he knows he must win over independents those voters who are uncomfortable with Obama's blackness, oops, I mean stand on the issues. How else to explain McCain's angry rants, grunting, morris code eye blinking, hand flailing, smamrmy smirks, snide comments, and overall grumpy old man behavior? His handlers told him and he knows full well that his attacks and obvious disdain for Senator Obama is a turn off to the voters McCain must win over. McCain has realized what the majority of voters in this country have known all along....

Posted by: pgiaquinto | October 16, 2008 8:13 AM | Report abuse

Obama can keep cool all he wants but that won't erase the fact that he is a liar.

Posted by: ttj1 | October 16, 2008 8:15 AM | Report abuse

It cracks me up every time a Republican partisan characterizes the Democratic party as "socialist" even as a Republican administration nationalizes banks.

Posted by: officermancuso | October 16, 2008 8:17 AM | Report abuse

A very good analysis. Issues matter. If Obama were remotely guiltly of some subverive activities, we would know it by now. The personal attacks by the McCain campaign have moved to an area that John Lewis discussed. The problem is that no one criticizing John Lewis has read his full comment. However, Frederick of the Republican Party of Virginia minced no words in his contempt for Obama.

How do you ever work with people who have no issues to debate other than manufactured character flaws? Obama still shows how he can be a bipartisan President. McCain failed at every chance. Talking bipartisanship and using the rhetoric of an extreme partisan is an oxymoron. The polls should begin to move even more in Obama's favor at this point. McCain showed that he was more McNasty than statesmanlike.

Posted by: EarlC | October 16, 2008 8:23 AM | Report abuse

As the night lingered on, Mccain's facial expressions clearl;y showed him becoming more agitated and annoyed.
We do not need a president who cannot even sit with his opponent to have a health discourse/debate.
What will he do when he has to face many leaders of nations we are on shaky ground with?
It's my opinion that that Hillary voters Mccain seeked to gain with his nomination of a woman all but turned against him last night when he stated he'd give no choice to women and what they can/cannot do with their bodies.
Wrong man, out of touch, from a different time.
And my gosh, did he look old or what?

Posted by: cmmdee | October 16, 2008 8:24 AM | Report abuse

Obama's ads criticize McCain's policies (I do take exception to the computer ad, which was silly). McCain's ads have attacked Obama's person and tried to make him out to be "dangerous" and "scary."
==============================
Well said. Not only do McCain's ads attack, their all lies. I dare someone to prove me wrong. Every ad McCain put out, weather it be on his voting record or his associations are lies. The only time I've heard McCain tell the truth was when he said Obama hasn't been to IRAQ and Afghanistan in X amount of days. I think McCain thinks we're still stuck in the 60's when people didn't have the truth at their finger tips.

Posted by: HemiHead66 | October 16, 2008 8:26 AM | Report abuse

Welll done, I agree with this 100%.

To me, the debate would have been an order of magnitude better if it would have included Nader and the rest and stuck to one issue.

For example, it would have been nice, since this was supposed to be about "the economy", for the candidates to be quizzed about how exactly stealing $850 billion from the taxpayers is going to "fix" it.

-Wexler

Posted by: WWWexler | October 16, 2008 8:26 AM | Report abuse

Angry White Man (with his neverous liars twitch) & Sarah (Munchkin) Palin who has a winking problem, couldn'r follow the yellow brick road to the White House unless the Tin Man and the Cowardly Lion lead the way!

Obama on the other hand, has clearly spoke to the middle class with his explanation of Ayers and others, and somehow Angry White Man who was sitting right next to him must of blocked that out. Five seconds after Obama explained his lack of involvement, the Angry White Man said Obama still has to come clean? Duh? How come (Munchkin) Palin skips State Suphoena's and doesn't go directly to jail like you and I? McCain apoligized for his bribe and trip taking from Keating, so I guess to the republicans that makes his admitted dishonesty O.K.? What a World they live in, definately time for a change. Barack will give it to them, thats for sure! Thats what their scared of! Barack Obama, he's got them running scared and it shows. The crooks are finished! Sicerely, White Man for Obama!

Posted by: Neal898 | October 16, 2008 8:26 AM | Report abuse

I wonder how well Senator Obama would look on stage if he had been beaten tortured and stabbed for five years of his life. It is so easy to say how great the young never been touched Obama looks when compared to someone that has given his entire life to this country. Unfortunatly in this country, charisma wins everytime...

Posted by: MarkUSAF | October 16, 2008 8:26 AM | Report abuse

A word about "Joe the Plumber," first, I don't think Joe even looked at the Obama tax plan, because if he did he would have seen that if his business makes $227,000-603,000 he would pay exactly $12 in extra taxes...that's right folks, a big $12! If Joe makes 250,000 up to $227,000 he'll get a tax cut ($2,789), although not as big as McCain would give him. On top of that, Obama has proposed giving businesses a $3,000 tax break for every new job created. (BTW, after seeing where Joe lives, I feel that his income must be "projected" rather than reality, and Joe is probably a die hard Republican in any event.)

Posted by: Hold_that_tiger | October 16, 2008 8:28 AM | Report abuse

At times, McCain recalled the Bob Dole of the ’96 campaign, mixing indignation with the Beltway shorthand that even a candidate running against Washington cannot escape after spending several decades in Congress. Discussing the merits of the Colombian Free Trade agreement with references to the FARC -- how many Americans knew what the hell he was talking about?

---------

lmao ! nail on the head !!

Posted by: ripley8 | October 16, 2008 8:50 AM | Report abuse

At first I was upset Obama didn't say anything regarding Palin when brought up. Then I realized later....he doesn't have to. He relegated her to persona non grata, which is EXACTLY where she needs to be. Alaska, you can have her back. She doesn't represent the average continental American.
Personally, I think McCain's insane choice of this redneck ignorant woman has done him irreparable damage, almost as much as his anger did last night. That is one testy man. Can you imagine him negotiating anything????

Posted by: SYWanda | October 16, 2008 8:51 AM | Report abuse

Can anyone with high speed internet tell me what this is all about. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pf14fh6k0c8

Posted by: HemiHead66 | October 16, 2008 8:51 AM | Report abuse

This was the best debate to date, mainly because of Schiffer. Schiffer did a masterful job at asking substantive questions and keeping the candidates on track.

I was impressed with McCain at the outset, I did not like his opener though (used the word angry 5 times) he did much better than he has done almost his entire campaign, however in the second portion he lost his footing and his famous "McNasty" reputation reared it's ugly head and bascially erased what little ground he had made up.

Obama was cool as usual and stayed on message, which frankly was a problem for him in primary debates. He missed many golden oppurtunites to hit back, but I honestly think, this was on purpose. You don't want to be aggressive toward an elderly,frail war hero. He also side stepped the trap of critiszing Palin. Obama knows that there's plenty of that going on already, especially within the republican party itself.

McCain did better, it was indeed his best try, but it was not enough.

Posted by: robind_nc | October 16, 2008 8:56 AM | Report abuse

I can't let the comment go by that the excuse for John McCain was that he was a POW.
If one is a die hard Republican, one doesn't allow ANY EXCUSES. Period. What a ridiculous comparison of Obama to McCain. Who are you, sir/madam, that you think you can judge from outward appearances that McCain had it tougher? Perhaps you should step a foot into a biracial or black child's life at the time of Obama's childhood and see the nasty, nasty words/actions that I'm sure were said to him and around him. I don't hear Obama saying "feel sorry for me" like every other utterance from McCain. The Senator from AZ seems to have deluded himself into believing that to have been a POW predetermined him to become President. And that's a fool's mission if ever there was one, because that's a little more self serving than having served in the military selflessly without the advertising of it.

Posted by: SYWanda | October 16, 2008 8:58 AM | Report abuse

I respect our veterans as much as the next person, but the idea that they can become teachers without going to school is the most preposterous thing I have heard in a long time.

Posted by: corridorg4 | October 16, 2008 8:58 AM | Report abuse

Palin has been very successful using the media, but I, for one, like some other comment writers, refuse to take her seriously and would never consider voting for the ticket until she stands up and appears in person on Meet the Press, Face the Nation and This Week. These live, Sunday face-off's have become de rigueur for political hopefuls. For the McCain camp to think she can be kept in a controlled "cone of silence" letting her out to only selected media will be a decision they will come to regret. A fact that I have seen under-reported is that Palin, as Governor, successfully used the media to her advantage before consideration as VP. Palin hired an outside public relations expert hired under a $31,000 contract to set up media interviews and gain her more national prominence. Her public relations campaign paid off, helping Palin win notice from political pundits, who began including her on lists of long-shot choices for the GOP vice presidential spot. As Mayor of a town with fewer than 5,000 people and as a Governor of a state with fewer residents than the city where I live, I marvel at her consideration as a VP hopeful and at Republicans claiming her breadth of experience.Both her education and experiences are clearly not noteworthy. With her first passport stamped 2007, one gets a real sense of her foreign experience.

Posted by: sherardg | October 16, 2008 9:01 AM | Report abuse

ustimes,
You are right about John McCain being angry. He should be angry, that his economic ideology did not work for most Americans;however, his anger is against Obama for not going into the gutter with him.

It was Mccain that was going to change the way elections are fought but we are watching Obama be the person that John Mccain wants to be but is unable to do so.

I felt sorry for John McCain last night, he was angry and emotional, which should not be mistaken for passion.

Where is the John McCain of Old?

Posted by: alan15 | October 16, 2008 9:02 AM | Report abuse

I am not looking for a president that can throw jabs at their opponent. I'm looking for a president that can relate to the American people and make a change. Obama made his points, explained his plans, defended the jabs all while remaining calm and articulate. Senator McCain just came across as bitter and angry. His focus during this debate was more on making Obama look bad, rather than showing us what he is going to do as president. Obama has always had my support, but this debate just reassured me. I feel confident that he is going to bring about the change this country needs. The only confidence I feel in McCain is that he is going to lead this country down the same destructive path we have been going. And I will say this, being a VET doesn't automatically qualify somebody to lead the country. While I appreciate the fact that McCain did serve, it still doesn't make me secure that he can turn this country around. Obama/Biden for the win.

Posted by: Rootsy | October 16, 2008 9:03 AM | Report abuse

I admire that John McCain when called by the US goverment to go over to the POLICE ACTION in Vietnam. Personally, I think we should have stayed out of Vietnam and we had no right to go into another country because the Veitnam people voted for communism. This was in the middle of the cold war and the US government decided to show these unbeleivers the true path. We invade a country on a believe that our way of government was the best.

But lets get back to McCain and the POW camp. Yes he survived a POW camp, yes that should be acknowledged, but because of this he should be president.

No.

He has on his staff, a man that lobbied for Hussin to get the US to lower embargos on Iraq. McCain encourages us working with Columbia government which has death squads, run by Drug Cartells, and where workers who are trying to unionize are killed, how about death camps. Great McCain ... just great.

Posted by: ThisWomansOpinion | October 16, 2008 9:04 AM | Report abuse

McCain did not apologize for his supporters threatening to Kill Barack Obama! That is the MOST disturbing thing I heard and the second was putting my health as a woman in air quotes!!! At this point the 2000 McCain was an act...THIS IS THE REAL MCCAIN!!! An angry, petty, jealous, ugly troll of a man who doesnt put Country First he puts the Rich and the Wing Nuts First.

BTW can someone explain to me why its socialism to help Americans, but freedom fighting to spend $10B in Iraq to help Iraqis???

Posted by: Beka13 | October 16, 2008 9:05 AM | Report abuse

What were you watching? Obama has never answered for his associations and tonight he continued to bob and weave....and speaking of angry -- just read some of these long, incoherent posts from the self-hating losers with too much time on their hands who now project their anger onto McCain. Pathetic. These people are the angry ones.

Posted by: dbunkr | October 16, 2008 9:05 AM | Report abuse

As an Independent voter and Navy veteran who is not voting for either one of these men, since Ron Paul is no longer running for President I am now voting for Ralph Nader and I made that decision a while ago, I did watch last night's debate. My observations for the past several weeks are still the same. If McCain wants to win, he better change his strategy. McCain keeps negatively talking about and attacking Obama and it is not working. McCain needs to talk about what he is going to do during his four years as President for us Americans. Obama talks more about what his plans for our country and less time attacking McCain. This is working. "What are you going to do to make the lives of my family and friends, my life, and the lives of all Americans better and get our nation back on track," is the question Americans want answered. McCain needs answer these questions hard and over and over until Election Day. Back off of the negative attacks. Keep walking down this road and you are giving the election to Obama. Right now, if I was forced against my will to vote for either one of these men, I would vote for the lesser of two evils, Obama.

Posted by: cafm70 | October 16, 2008 9:08 AM | Report abuse

McCain has shown over the course of the campaign that he is temperamentally unsuitable for the White House. He personally despises Obama, not because of anything about Obama personally, but because Obama dares to blunt his ambitions. I suspect he would have treated Hillary Clinton with equal or greater contempt.

McCain has been impetuous, rude, quixotic and unstable throughout the campaign. He cannot justify his pick of Palin in any way other than a gimmick. His "suspension" of his campaign was another gimmick. His performance at the debates beats any antics of any Presidential candidate on a televised debate, while his running mate was barely able to read her note cards, let alone "debate".

McCain's campaign is based on the notion that Obama is too "risky". I would have a hard time sleeping at night with McCain & Palin running the White House.

Posted by: AxelDC | October 16, 2008 9:10 AM | Report abuse

USTimes said:

"But i'm not electing an actor."

* * * * * *

It all started with an actor, Ronald Reagan, the patron saint of modern-day Republicans. I trace the financial crisis right to his door. His annual budget deficits which accrued due to massive tax cuts for the wealthy started it off. Greed was well on its way under his presidency.

Angry people do not really solve as many problems as they create. Attitude is a factor in whether or not a workable solution can be found.

Obama has solutions and is willing to work for better solutions. He is not nearly as egocentric as is McCain. McCain's solutions are purely to try to win a few more votes.

Posted by: EarlC | October 16, 2008 9:17 AM | Report abuse

For the last few years I have been actually physically uncomfortable when George Bush speaks on television. I have to turn it off or walk away. Last night I was uncomfortable with John McCain and his pointed anger and attacks. I'm not going to spend another four years being uncomfortable every time my president opens his mouth. No more. Hell no!

Posted by: lfrenchsmith | October 16, 2008 9:18 AM | Report abuse

McCain is washed up. So is his bid for the presidency.

McCain is an erratic liar, a self-absorbed bloviator who could not possibly govern with his temperament.

Stick a fork in him -- he's done.

Posted by: HillRat | October 16, 2008 9:19 AM | Report abuse

Finally a reporter who saw the same debate my family did. Obama remained cool and patient during McCain's ramblings, smirking, rolling eyes, and overall disrespectful behavior. I can't imagine McCain treating foreign leaders like that - Lord knows the world hates us enough as it is!

Obama was very kind to Palin. He could have dinged her for turning that marvelous pipeline over to a Canadian company (no Alaskans making money off that one), and he could have dinged her on Alaska being #1 in high school dropouts and test scores in their school system, and being #1 in violence against women. He could have destroyed her easily with Wasilla being in the black when she took office as mayor, but was $22 million in the red when she left, but his simple, "let the American people decide" showed his class. THAT is the kind of person I want running this country, not a hot tempered, "erratic", angry old man.

Posted by: GenuineRisk | October 16, 2008 9:19 AM | Report abuse

What were you watching? Obama has never answered for his associations and tonight he continued to bob and weave....and speaking of angry -- just read some of these long, incoherent posts from the self-hating losers with too much time on their hands who now project their anger onto McCain. Pathetic. These people are the angry ones.

Posted by: dbunkr | October 16, 2008 9:05

**********************************
dbunkr said: "Obama has never answered for his associations and tonight he continued to bob and weave" . What the heck are you talking about? Haven't you notices the polls and my opinion too. Who the heck cares?

Posted by: sherardg | October 16, 2008 9:20 AM | Report abuse

Senator Obama,was great last night, he looked very relaxed and looked very comfortable, his body language showed that, McCain looked like he was ready to explode his faxial expressions and his body langauge across the table, & I want someone that is cool calm and collected to run this country, and that is not McCain
you could see his body language was very eratic, he was seathing at times you could hear him, and that was scary. Obama did better on the issues and this iw what Americans wanted to hear and how we can
fix this economy, & I am voting for Obama.

Posted by: jgipson1 | October 16, 2008 9:21 AM | Report abuse

Just a reminder about McCain. How damaging is this video, now spreading around the web, showing John McCain squirming, stumbling, and then claiming ignorance about his position on providing women with birth control?

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/07/10/mccains-birth-control-pro_n_112048.html

Posted by: sherardg | October 16, 2008 9:25 AM | Report abuse

There's a followup to all the flap about Congressman Lewis comparing the McCain Palin rallies to those of the late George Corley Wallace. McCain has a new ad out about fighting for America. He closes with an exhortation of "Stand Up for America." While the late Governor Wallace may be more famous for his line and action about standing in the school house door to prevent integration the slogan most often proclaimed by his campaign was "Stand Up for America." I wonder if we will hear it at McCain Palin rallies rather than Country First.

Posted by: ejgallagher1 | October 16, 2008 9:26 AM | Report abuse

I, too, could not help but notice McCain's excessive blinking. It reminded me of the show trials the North Vietnamese held to try downed US aviators for "war crimes". Using Morse code, one of the prisoners blinked out "T-O-R-T-U-R-E" repeatedly in the desperate hope that someone watching the film back home would realize he was under duress.

In last night's debate, McCain was probably blinking
"H-E-L-P-M-E-D-I-T-C-H-P-A-L-I-N".

Posted by: RaoulDuke1 | October 16, 2008 9:29 AM | Report abuse

If Mc Cain wants an apology from John Lewis I suggest he calls " his good buddy" Mr. Lewis and demand one.....What Mc Cain should do is have a talk with his VP choice and ask her to tone down the hate speeches and false accusations....He should also consider anger management, he doesnt have a poker face at all...hes out of control with anger and Palin is out of touch and out of control with her mouth and rhetoric......Obama did the right thing, if youre ahead in 11 rounds of a championship bout you dont go out in the 12th round and start brawling...its not Obamas demeanor...he beat Mc Cain with brains, tact and calmness

Posted by: MASGRL | October 16, 2008 9:30 AM | Report abuse

anyone else think McCain might have been on somethign last night? Like uppers or something? His eyes creeped me out.

Posted by: desaparecidokb | October 16, 2008 9:30 AM | Report abuse

McCain's anger bothers me. He seems like a hot headed fighter pilot - not a cool headed statesman "lindamack5"


You know, being hot-headed and a fighter pilot is a really bad combination. The best fighter pilots are the ones who are very cool and collected. They don't get rattled.

That's why the very best fighter pilots (and the most level-headed) were the ones who were tapped for the nascent NASA programs. You have to be level-headed when under extreme pressure in order to survive whatever disaster is unfolding.

Posted by: Skowronek | October 16, 2008 9:36 AM | Report abuse

I think McCain blew his last change. The lynch mob wanted him to really go after Obama's character. He failed. I actually feel the McCain is not about that. Now the lynch mob is really mad. Watch the blogs and check out FOX. Hannity friends will be throwing out a bunch of stuff for the next three weeks to see what sticks.

Posted by: sherardg | October 16, 2008 9:41 AM | Report abuse

For those of you accusing Meyerson of being part of the Obama campaign, it would behoove you to remember he's a columnist and sharing his opinion. If he has decided Obama is a better candidate and has explained how and why he came to that decision over the course of this very long campaign, there is nothing wrong with his stating that. He gets paid to share his opinion. His opinion is that Obama will make a better President. Given that so many conservative columnists share Meyerson' opinion that Obama is the better candidate (Christopher Buckley, David Brooks, George Will to name a few), do you also think they are in Obama's camp?

Posted by: TessDC | October 16, 2008 9:42 AM | Report abuse

Why is everyone overlooking the fact that Sarah Palin is A liar,about troopergate,and god only knows what else the woman is power hungry and to even think of her in any public office is scary,as Vice President? God Help Us. And all these so called die hard Republicans refuse to accept 1 fact she is NOT QUALIFIED OR HONEST.

Posted by: mercyalone | October 16, 2008 9:45 AM | Report abuse

What kind of vetting did McCain do with Palin?! Does he understand the nature of baby Trig's "special needs". Sen McCain kept referring to autism and the wonderful things Palin has and will be able to do with this rising problem...I believe Trig is Down Syndrome, which is very different thing from Autism. What specifically has Palin done for either of these groups? Is McCain/Palin proposing more funding for research/help of special needs children...better access to insurance and education/therapy? That would be rather difficult, I think with an across the board funding freeze!

Posted by: mcamele | October 16, 2008 9:49 AM | Report abuse

I am a scientist, an educator, and an environmentalist, and I am disheartened that neither candidate gave nearly enough time to the major issue facing this world: the human-created destruction of our environment.
However, I am pleased that the need to keep science education and research strong has been a recurring theme.
Too bad that someone hasn't pointed out that all of Obama's closest science advisors are scientists, and none of McCain's are - they are politicians and business CEOs.
If he hadn't already had my vote, Obama would have won it decisively with his closing comments last night to turn off the TV, put away the video games, and instill the passion for learning. I would add that that behavior shouldn't be limited to our children!
(Too bad Obama didn't point out that the $3 million "overhead projector" that McCain keeps slamming him for is actually a highly complex, computer-driven projector for a planetarium at a science museum - $3 million is a reasonable price for such an educational tool.)

Posted by: CellBioProf | October 16, 2008 9:50 AM | Report abuse

McCain's incessant and annoying blinking; Palin's incessant and annoying winking. What a pair!

Posted by: nanmccarthy | October 16, 2008 9:52 AM | Report abuse

Why is it that McCain can't engage in a debate without seething, condescending and patronizing behavior? Why does he get so angry and emotional? Why on a day when the Dow crashed 700 points did he think it was a good idea to spend so much time on petty personal attacks? It's like he takes offense to the idea that he has opposition to his claim on the White House. How dare this other person even think he can share the stage with the great John McCain.

Posted by: skrut003 | October 16, 2008 9:57 AM | Report abuse

Well you know what I am and have voted conservatively for the three elections that I have been able to vote in. Last night McCain (who is more a left republican) did what he usually does by starting out strong and fizzling towards the end by unintentionally revealing his temperment. I feel that McCain overall had the specifics as in naming actual passed and not passed legislation, records, etc., and not just giving general explanations like Obama, yes Obama we know about your 95% TEMPORARY tax cut, but we didnt hear anything new, as the moderator asked the candidates to do at the beginning. But it has come down to voting for your party and not the candidate because most feel its time to get a democrat in the WH, and im sure swarms of people would say otherwise because Obama does give them a sense of hope by telling them what they want to hear (false or not we will see). But all in all I admit that McCains campaign is pretty much dead because he waited to do too little too late. So given that Obama will be our next president, as an American I feel its our duty to support him and move on to action. But Obama has the most daunting tasks ever faced by any US president ahead of him, and the world is in its most volatile state ever, and we have decided to put the most inexperienced candidate ever in office, and on top of that he will have to unite the American people which I dont see possible because he'll have to earn everyones trust, not just talk about it. I just hope for everyones sake that he can succeed and do what he's promised, if not, it may be a long time before another democrat will get in office, because unlike his debates he doesnt just have to show up in the White House to win over the rest of skeptical America, he is going to have to finally become a man of action, and after the election Ill & most level headed republicans will even give him the chance to prove to us hes not what we think he is, and I hope he does, and then and only then could he unite Americans.

Posted by: egibson888 | October 16, 2008 9:58 AM | Report abuse

Yes Sen. Obama sounds smart. He has a fine mind and speaks well. Buit what it comes down to is this. He is wasting a fine mind chasing down the wrong path of socialism.

Sen McCain comes down on the side of affluence. Great! He wants everybody to be prosperous...the more the better. That is best achieved by letting every person rise or fall based on ability--the essence of liberty. It's messy but economically everybody eventually gets out what they put in. You can't legislate stupid out of people...but you sure can legislate it in.

Sen Obama comes down on the side of equality...which isn't liberty. He wants to collect and spread the remaining wealth around (because there won't be any new wealth) until it's all gone and we achieve socialist utopia...just like who...Cuba?

If you want to have every level of government telling you what you can't do (which is what bureaucracy is best at...because it involves the least amount of effort), then by all means vote for Sen Obama. If you have abdicated your basic right as an American to fail, get up, dust yourself off and try again just for the ease and comfort of having an inefficient government tend to your needs from cradle to grave (knowing full well that government will continually redefine your needs to less than you think is adequate until your needs are defined by the government), then by all means vote for the smart guy who speaks well.

However, if you want to continue to live as free people, who cherish the liberty to chart your own life that defines our Americanness, then you must join me and vote for Sen McCain. Despite the fixing that the Republican Party needs, it's core beliefs are that we the people can manage our lives better than the few can managing it for the rest of us.

Vote for McCain or vote for your gradual enslavement by your own government.

Posted by: PanhandleWilly | October 16, 2008 10:00 AM | Report abuse

I am a Republican and have disagreed with most of the past Presidential debate analysis and disagree to some degree with this one yet, I believe the author has a point. One thing I DID notice that was missing was the term "my friends" that McCain used far too often in past debates. My problem with Senator Obama in all three debates, and the campaign in general, is that he has refused to answer the questions. His campaign's release of his "resposnes" 10 hours before last nights debate clearly shows that he wasn't interested in responding to questions. He was only interested in promoting his agenda. NEITHER candidate answered questions last night. Senator Obama's demeanor came across much better than McCain's last night and I believe that has been the #1 thing he has had going for him throughout the campaign. Both Hillary and Senator McCain appear much more of on the "attack." My opinion of who to vote for has not been swayed though. I am voting McCain/Palin.

Posted by: JimHerring | October 16, 2008 10:00 AM | Report abuse

Frankly, I can't wait for Obama to get elected. Since there will have to be an increase in payroll taxes to fund Social Security, Medicare, universal healthcare, those who are employed won’t have much left to spend. I won't have to pay a dime since I will be retired in a few years. I'll be living in a house that I own outright, while the rest of you pay $8 or more for gas, pay your high rent, and ever increasing payroll taxes. Also, since I will make under $150,000 a year, I’ll get a tax break under Obama. My 401k has been safe since I moved it out of equities. I wonder if any of you did the same.

Obama will have to tax us. He has no choice. 700 billion to bail out Wall Street. 700 billion in deficits. All of it is coming out of your pockets. Obama wants to tax corporations. Countries , like Ireland , are trying to lure corporations to their country. Obama wants to tax corporations 40%. Ireland taxes corporations 12%. Guess where all your job will go once corporations are taxed 40%? Obama wants to tax small businesses. Small businesses employ most of the workers in the US. If small businesses are taxed more, they won’t employ as many workers. This is not rocket science. If you think 6.1% unemployment is bad, wait until you see double digit unemployment, just like the Jimmy Carter years.

To all you young, employed Obama supporters who will be working until you're at least 70 or more, I want to thank you, in advance, for paying exorbitant payroll taxes to fund my early retirement. Go Obama!

Posted by: Dodgers1 | October 16, 2008 10:14 AM | Report abuse

MCCAIN IS ANGRY BECAUSE OBAMA IS HIJACKING HIS LIFETIME OF SERVICE TO AMERICA, BY TELLING VOTERS WHAT THEY WANT TO HEAR, NAMELY:

1. WE WILL REDUCE YOUR TAXES - HE EVEN SAID HE WOULD REDUCE JOE THE PLUMBER'S TAXES ++++ AFTER ++++ LEARNING THAT JOE MADE 25k OVER HIS 250k LIMIT.

2. WE WILL COMPEL UNIVERSAL HEALTH CARE -- EVEN CLINTON COULDN'T DO THIS WITH A BUDGET SURPLUS.

3. WE WILL KEEP HOMEOWNERS IN THEIR HOMES, EVEN IF THEY CAN'T AFFORD THEM.

4. WE WILL SAVE THE ECONOMY BY 'GOING GREEN.' ONLY THOSE BUYING ALL THIS BS ARE 'GREEN.'

5. WE WILL IMPROVE EDUCATION -- DA !!!

+++++++ AND WE WILL DO ALL OF THIS AND LOWER THE DEFECIT AND YOUR TAXES AS WELL ALL AT THE SAME TIME ++++++++++++++++++

+++++++++I GUESS MCCAIN IS ANGRY AT THIS BS ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
---------------------------------------
Whoa tiger! Pop that zanex first before posting cause you seem more upset than McClame and he blew it beyond imagination. I can't help it if the american people opened their eyes and saw the TRUE picture. Tell ya what, I'll let you know what everyone else but YOU apparently is seeing. They see a little angry shrew who can't focus on anything but will say ANYthing to get elected. They see a black man who is more presidential than our president. they see the bullcrap being shovelded into your mouth and you swallowing it like it was your last meal and they are saying WTF? Obama is so much the better leader, pick, person. simple as that. So, I understand your anger, your worst nightmare is coming to reality and your little hitler guy, you know the one frothing at the mouth with all his anger, well he can look forward to being in the senate until he pretty much croaks.

Posted by: gabbamonkey | October 16, 2008 10:15 AM | Report abuse

MarkUSAF stated:
"I wonder how well Senator Obama would look on stage if he had been beaten tortured and stabbed for five years of his life. It is so easy to say how great the young never been touched Obama looks when compared to someone that has given his entire life to this country. Unfortunatly in this country, charisma wins everytime..."

Mark sounds like a bitter person. Perhaps he also clings to his guns and religion. :)

Perhaps Mark would like to have walked in Obama's shoes for even one day in his life as a son of a biracial marriage, growing up in a world where he was neither understood nor welcome. Granted that McCain spent 5 years in a POW camp. However, comparisons like the ones that Mark is attempting to make are not possible. One must look at intellect, responses, attitude, and so forth.

For me, the Democratic platform and Obama's stated programs, policies, and positions agree with my own sense of fairness.

As a former US Navy pilot, I appreciate the service that McCain did for our country. However, if I had crashed my first plane which was ruled 100% pilot error, I would probably never have flown again. I served on pilot disposition boards as a young lieutenant.

For McCain to explain away that he was not elitist for the fact that he grew up in a military family sidesteps the point of the fact that he grew up in an officer's family, an officer who went on to become an admiral. To try to compare his background of reasonable affluence as similar to or even less privileged than that of Obama was ludicrous.

I marvel at the fact that an outstanding Harvard graduate even bothered to go to southside Chicago to serve a community that was frought with problems. There is much to Obama's character. What people have witnessed in each debate is not an actor but the real deal. Every once in a while an authentic person hits the political scene. Obama proved his authenticity again last night. McCain has proved that being a military hero does not guarantee that you are ethical and honorable.

While I served in the military, both Johnson and Nixon were my commanders-in-chief. I was apolitical as I was supposed to be. The Republicans have taken great delight in politicizing the military. However, neither Johnson nor Nixon were my chosen Presidents. Each had major flaws.

I have settled on the Democratic Party for one major reason: economic and social policies. Many of the other issues are wedge issues that I have resolved in my own family. I, for one, whould never have felt less than a man or threatened if gays were in my squadron. It might surprise people to know that gays actively served their country back then as they do now. Back then as now, if they were found out, they were dismissed. If we can put women in harm's way, surely we can put gays there.

My mom just reminded me about McCain's statement about "health of the mother" on the abortion argument. McCain has shone that he has no compassion for women.

Posted by: EarlC | October 16, 2008 10:17 AM | Report abuse

I don't want an angry, vindictive hot head as my president. That might have been OK when we sent the White Fleet around the world to cow our little brown brothers, but, even then, we walked softly and carried a big stick. McCain seems like he will go around kicking, screaming and sulking, while flailing away with the stick. He was angry to the point of being unintelligible and incomprehensible. You know he is angry, but his point gets lost in the babbling about caps and other esoteric minutiae. The real root of his anger is that he sees his final chance to be president slipping from his grasp; maybe he thinks a bench clearing brawl in mid-field will result in the game being called. The man is too proud, and he has gotten his ego wrapped up in this race to the point where he is no longer putting country first; it has become all about him.

Posted by: csintala79 | October 16, 2008 10:18 AM | Report abuse

Dodgers1, how's that 401 k looking? Where you planning to take that early retirement? I hear Alaska is nice, they are always looking for part time help to patrol the russian boarder, and hey, maybe you could get a job on the police force, assuming you marry right......don't let the grandaughters drink the water up there though, it causes pregnancy.....

Posted by: pgiaquinto | October 16, 2008 10:20 AM | Report abuse

However, if you want to continue to live as free people, who cherish the liberty to chart your own life that defines our Americanness, then you must join me and vote for Sen McCain. Despite the fixing that the Republican Party needs, it's core beliefs are that we the people can manage our lives better than the few can managing it for the rest of us.

Vote for McCain or vote for your gradual enslavement by your own government.

Posted by: PanhandleWilly | October 16, 2008 10:00 AM
***********************************
Yeah, vote for a government that wants to take away women's right choose. Vote for a government that wants the rich to get richer and the poorer to get poorer.
By the way sharing the wealth also means education benefits. Through education, one can pull themselves up.

Posted by: sherardg | October 16, 2008 10:30 AM | Report abuse

CLEAN SWEEP FOR OBAMA/BIDEN

That's 4 debates and 4 convincing wins for Obama/Biden!

In recent history, has there ever been such a feat? Maybe Clinton got a clean sweep over Dole, I can't remember.

But usually, the other guy/girl wins at least one of these things.

McCain can't seem to learn from his mistakes. In every debate, he came across as angry and frustrated. He did not show any respect for his worthy opponent. His answers, while at times firey, were typically incoherent an rambling.
In fact, McCain seemed to get worse, or at least grumpier, with each debate.

Obama, on the other hand, remained cool, calm, and collected each time. He gave clear answers to the important issues of this election. He looked much more presidential and made me far more comfortable envisioning Obama as president.

I can't imagine McCain, or, GULP, Palin, as president, especially at a time in our history where we need a reassuring and calm leader to see us through things.

Posted by: jgarrisn | October 16, 2008 10:32 AM | Report abuse

What were you watching? Obama has never answered for his associations and tonight he continued to bob and weave....and speaking of angry -- just read some of these long, incoherent posts from the self-hating losers with too much time on their hands who now project their anger onto McCain. Pathetic. These people are the angry ones.

Posted by: dbunkr | October 16, 2008 9:05 AM

===========================

What are you talking about? It took Obama a whole one minute to put Ayers and ACORN to bed because he's not involved with either of them. If Obama wasn't such a decent guy he could've hurt McCain real bad. I think the American people would want to know about McCain's transition advisor William E. Timmons and his association with Saddam Hussein. McCain deals with a whole list of shady people that Obama could've used against him. He didn't even bring up the fact that McCain continuously votes against our soldiers health care. That don't seem like putting country first to me.

Posted by: HemiHead66 | October 16, 2008 10:39 AM | Report abuse

So what if McCain is an angry white man. I happen to be an angry white woman.... You in the media who have placed this arrogant, racist, empty suit on a pedastal and have all but shoved him down the throats of the American people.. Of course there are millions who are angry. This man associates with domestic terrorists, financed his house ($300K below market value) with assistance from a convicted felon who was funded himself by Syrian Nationalist terrorists, sat in a pew for 20 years and listened to vile hatred spewed against whites and jews and has personally funded an association who is buying this election with forged and invalid voter registrations... And you have the gall to say we shouldn't be angry. Did I also mention how absolutely disgusted we are with publications such as yours and others (NYT, Newsweek) and the spineless, blind fools on NBC, CNN, MSNBC and others.... The whole lot of you disgust me..... If Americans fall for this guys' crap, we have no one to blame but ourselves for the fallout....

Posted by: lmcintyre | October 16, 2008 10:43 AM | Report abuse

John McCain didn't look nasty...he looked amazed that such a know-nothing light weight with no real record and questionable friends could be so close to leading this country. Barack Obama doesn't display stress because he has no conscience or sense of conviction. John McCain "showed" his unease with the way the campaigns are getting negative...Obama just smirked. He's glad they're in the toilet. After all, he's a Chicago pol and that's the way they like 'em. Obama's not stressed over the economy because he knows that all he'll really have to do as President is go along with whatever Pelosi, the unions, and his friends at ACORN tell him to do. We are about to dismiss, for the next 4 years, ANY checks and balances between the Executive branch and Congress...all because a guy looks "cool" and "unstressed". Is this American democracy or Star Search? Think people.

Posted by: mnolan2 | October 16, 2008 10:43 AM | Report abuse

@EarlC

I'm glad another aviator has brought up what is obvious about McCain's naval career. For one, someone who graduates at the bottom of their class at Annapolis is simply not going to get the opportunity to be a fighter pilot, under normal circumstances. Secondly, as you said, crashing that many aircraft in a career is pretty rare from what I understand. It is clear to me that he owes a lot of his military career to the fact that his father and grandfather were admirals.

Not that this disqualifies from the office of president or anything of the sort. But it totally invalidates this absurd argument that somehow Obama is elitist or that Obama graduated at the top of his class at Harvard Law school because of affirmative action. If any candidate benefited from 'handouts' in their career it was McCain.

Posted by: eine1 | October 16, 2008 10:47 AM | Report abuse

I just hope when the dust settles and John McCain is reflecting back on what happened, he will realize that he lost because he sold his soul to the far right. I used to support McCain but he seems now like a man pocessed,not rational, struggling with his decision to get down into the dirt. It is too late now for him to change back, and I and millions of other voters will be giving Sen. Obama our support.

Posted by: whitneyril | October 16, 2008 10:47 AM | Report abuse

McCain seems to have degenerated into a mass of facial tics and angry, tight-lipped expressions that scare small children.

I don't know if his mental health can handle another 3 weeks.

Posted by: EnemyOfTheState | October 16, 2008 10:58 AM | Report abuse

So what if McCain is an angry white man. I happen to be an angry white woman.... You in the media who have placed this arrogant, racist, empty suit on a pedastal and have all but shoved him down the throats of the American people.. Of course there are millions who are angry. This man associates with domestic terrorists, financed his house ($300K below market value) with assistance from a convicted felon who was funded himself by Syrian Nationalist terrorists, sat in a pew for 20 years and listened to vile hatred spewed against whites and jews and has personally funded an association who is buying this election with forged and invalid voter registrations... And you have the gall to say we shouldn't be angry. Did I also mention how absolutely disgusted we are with publications such as yours and others (NYT, Newsweek) and the spineless, blind fools on NBC, CNN, MSNBC and others.... The whole lot of you disgust me..... If Americans fall for this guys' crap, we have no one to blame but ourselves for the fallout....

Posted by: lmcintyre | October 16, 2008 10:43 AM

John McCain didn't look nasty...he looked amazed that such a know-nothing light weight with no real record and questionable friends could be so close to leading this country. Barack Obama doesn't display stress because he has no conscience or sense of conviction. John McCain "showed" his unease with the way the campaigns are getting negative...Obama just smirked. He's glad they're in the toilet. After all, he's a Chicago pol and that's the way they like 'em. Obama's not stressed over the economy because he knows that all he'll really have to do as President is go along with whatever Pelosi, the unions, and his friends at ACORN tell him to do. We are about to dismiss, for the next 4 years, ANY checks and balances between the Executive branch and Congress...all because a guy looks "cool" and "unstressed". Is this American democracy or Star Search? Think people.

Posted by: mnolan2 | October 16, 2008 10:43 AM
********************************
Here they come. Hannity's Americans

Posted by: sherardg | October 16, 2008 11:05 AM | Report abuse


My name is Jack,
I live in a box, no job no future
that's life, with McSame.

If war is good,
and poverty better, then
McCain and Palin rule!


Who needs a Pilot,
that can not fly or a beauty queen,
whose lost her luster.

Posted by: nallcando | October 16, 2008 11:06 AM | Report abuse

Since 1994 angry white men have been in charge. And what an unholy mess they have made of this country. Thank goodness the crazies are finished. Hopefully we will never hear angry white male blather again in the USA.

Posted by: buzziea | October 16, 2008 11:12 AM | Report abuse

If this article read as "The Final Debate: Angry Black Man" there would be more posters angry about why someones race was being used to bash them......talk about double a standard.

Posted by: cordler | October 16, 2008 11:15 AM | Report abuse

"I wonder how well Senator Obama would look on stage if he had been beaten tortured and stabbed for five years of his life._________________________________________________________________________________
If McCain was stabbed for five years he would be dead now!
Not to diminish McCain's torture, but he started singing to the Vietnamese soon after he crashed his plane...Think about it, once it was established that McCain was the son of an Admiral, McCain was hospitalize and his injuries were given medical care...Like many American POWs, McCain broke down under torture and offered a "confession" to his North Vietnamese captors. Dramesi, in contrast, attempted two daring escapes. For the second he was brutalized for a month with daily torture sessions that nearly killed him. His partner in the escape, Lt. Col. Ed Atterberry, didn't survive the mistreatment. But Dramesi never said a disloyal word, and for his heroism was awarded two Air Force Crosses, one of the service's highest distinctions. McCain would later hail him as "one of the toughest guys I've ever met."


Posted by: nallcando | October 16, 2008 11:29 AM | Report abuse

It became clear last night that when ReThuglicans say Obama's been running all "attack" ads, they mean ads attacking John McCain's policy POSITIONS.

The "attack ads" McCain has been criticized for are not those concerning Obama's policy positions, they are those attacking his character by calling him a liar and saying he pals around with terrorists.

If some "journalists" can't see that distinction, maybe they need to find a new profession.

Posted by: RealCalGal | October 16, 2008 11:29 AM | Report abuse

McCain seemed to rely on the same-old cliches that have worked for Republicans since Reagan but are no longer applicable.

Posted by: ffcaruso | October 16, 2008 11:33 AM | Report abuse

So far, all the conclusions by all the pundits are
totally based upon POLLS. Not a single actual vote
has been cast yet. Obama supporters gush at how
well their man has done in the debates, which proves
once again that Obama is a good debater and a good
speaker. It doesn't say anything about his character,
judgement, or what kind of a leader he would be.
I still would rather trust a man who would not sell out
his fellow prisoners, even during 5 years of torture,
than to trust a man who betrayed a 20 year friendship,
for personal ambition. And ... regarding this election,
until people actually vote ... it ain't over till it's over!

Posted by: howard521 | October 16, 2008 11:35 AM | Report abuse

"McCain's chief fundraiser and member of his "Ohio Victory Team", Carl Lindner, was fined by the US government for funding the AUC to the tune of $1.7 million."

Guess who Charles Keating worked for before he went to Phoenix to start his own company? Carl Lindner!

This also explains McCain's obsession with Colombia in last night's debate.

Only connect....

Posted by: thrh | October 16, 2008 11:38 AM | Report abuse

miller51550: Um, I don't see your point. I'm up with all those tax increases. People at the top have NOT been paying enough for quite some time. From those to whom much has been given, much is required.

The rich have ripped off this country so badly that we're drowning now. Maybe if they had paid more taxes there would at least be an adequate safety net for those of us who are now going to be living on only our Social Security since our 401(k) plans have been wiped out along with their gambling losses.

Step up. Think about the country rather than your wallet for once.

Posted by: RealCalGal | October 16, 2008 11:41 AM | Report abuse

USTimes,

You say that you are "not electing an actor" and that "John McCain is angry about the mess this country is in."

We DID elect an actor who was angry, and that sent us down this road of "hate your government" and "deregulate everything."

THAT is the cause of the mess we are in, about which McCain is angry. Well, I would love to think that he is that last gasp of those Reaganites who purport to be so patriotic, but aren't willing to FUND the SOCIAL needs of this country (that just aren't going to get funded except through a government being committed to the society it serves...)

You will angrily call this the hated "SOCIALISM", as if what we're doing for Wall Street isn't exactly what you say you hate...

Obama isn't an actor, but he knows how to behave with dignity, and he deserves respect for his level-headedness, intelligence, education, grasp of the issues, knowledge of the world... In other words, he's presidential...

Maybe we'll get a couple of terms for those who truly do stand for the PEOPLE of this country, not just the rich fatcats... Maybe even a couple of decades will result in which we're struggling with the hard situation the angry actor against our government created (with his handlers)...

But a day will come when people forget... Some new Rove will emerge and convince the uneducated to TRUST them again... WE know who your enemies are...! WE have this great idea and we won't call it "trickle down" this time...! Let us privatize the profits and socialize the losses, all the while spewing anger at the government that's supposed to be of the people, by the people, for the people... NOT just the rich who use it as a way to enrich themselves at THE PEOPLE'S expense...

Yeah... I'm angry too... But give me the guy with something more than anger... We've got too much challenge facing us to just stagger about ranting about how angry we are...


Posted by: LeroyTheRoadie | October 16, 2008 11:43 AM | Report abuse

Americans have yet to get over the denial that the self-centered mentality that garnished votes for Neoconservatives for years. It is taking it's toll on the country's health and welfare.

9/11 is a good example. "It's your money, Republicans think you know how to spend it better than government."

Once the cut-taxes mania starting winning elections, Democrats had to agree just to stay in the running.

Espionage Intelligence and tracking terror was not something Joe the Plumber would know how to do ver well, yet tax cuts and running the government on deficits resulted in cutting the FBI and CIA budgets in half.

What used to be the best in the world, didn't even have a dozen Arab translators to interpret Al Qaeda's phone calls before 9/11.

Posted by: ffcaruso | October 16, 2008 11:43 AM | Report abuse

The Angry White Man vs the grinning empty suit?

I'll take the Angry white man any day.

BTW Meyerson? White Man? Are you a racist a##hole in bed with Obama?

Posted by: ekim53 | October 16, 2008 1:56 AM

//

LOL...

predictable as always, Mike.

But you're losing your cool. "racist a##hole"? Come on.

Two words, my friend. Get used to them: "President Obama."

Posted by: Attucks | October 16, 2008 11:56 AM | Report abuse

If Joe Plumber is making $250,000.00 and can't start his own business, I'm thinking he can't manage money. My income for a year is just over $12,000.00 and I started my own business. I wish I had 250,000 to work with.I"d like to meet Mr. Plumber.

Posted by: fairydust53050 | October 16, 2008 12:02 PM | Report abuse

Barack did a good job last night, but could have done better. Wish Barack would have called out McInsane on how he was against Bush's tax cuts for the rich in the first place, and now has flip flopped. The USA is $11 trillion in debt and this debt has to be paid off somehow, and the rich have received a free ride while the middle class shrinks and the poor get poorer. Like Warren Buffet says, he pays a lower tax rate than his secretary does. McInsane's garbage about corporations paying 35% taxes is total garbage- with all the loopholes and offshore accounts, a lot of corporations barely pay any taxes at all. Personal income taxes make up by far the largest source of government revenue. The tax cuts for the rich have NOT created jobs. They just hoard their money, taking it out of the system.

The amount the USA spends on so-called "defense" is obscene, while other countries are working to make lives better for their citizens, spending money on health care and infrastructure. The USA's infrastructure is a total joke.

Posted by: bushisacrook | October 16, 2008 12:05 PM | Report abuse

Well, it looks as though the US is going to have to start planning for an Obama presidency, meaning that we'll also need to make provisions for a significant minority of furious older white conspiracy theorists like bdstauffer, ekim, and the other regulars here.

They'll soon have nowhere to go, so in order to provide food and shelter for them, Fox News has a plan.

Fox is purchasing the Queen Elizabeth 2. Instead of turning it into a Dubai hotel/museum, Fox will refit the ship stem-to-stern, and house all the infuriated right-wing news trolls who need safe haven on the boat in windowless, comfortable padded cells. They won't have to have contcat with the outside world. they'll be able to watch Fox shows 24/7--Hannity, Ingraham, O'Reilly--and listen to Rush Limbaugh as loud as they want. They can push buttins to activate food dispensers, and use the Wall Street Journal for their sanitary needs. They'll be provided with toy weapons to keep them occupied.
The boat will be anchored in international waters, so they won't be troubled by proximity to the actual United States, and while their news feeds will be incessant, they won't be notified of the actual calendar date, so in their minds, it will always be 1983.

Anyone from the mental health professions, or from animal husbandry, who wishes to volunteer for the crew, can earn the grateful thanks of the nation these former citizens have rejected.


Posted by: Attucks | October 16, 2008 12:06 PM | Report abuse

Does anyone notice how angry the conservative right is? Is this something that they have learned from the Rovian tactics or have they always been this way? They are acting like spoiled children that are not getting their way. claudiatucsonaz

Posted by: claudiam1 | October 16, 2008 12:11 PM | Report abuse

Where was McCain's flag pin last night? If Obama hadn't had one on, Rush Limbaugh would have been the first to say something about it.

Posted by: londonlinda | October 16, 2008 12:12 PM | Report abuse

John McCain's stiff and spastic stage presence - particularly when it is repeated over the course of three 90 minute debates - has revealed the type of person he is and what kind of president he would be. Chaotic, bombastic, frenetic, borderline-psychotic - just about every negative "tic" you can think of.

He was so desperate to use the phrase "breath of fresh air," that he botched it - "bresh of freth air." Well, at least he didn't describe his veep choice as a maverick, again, or as an ethics examplar.

Campaigns may run too long, but just think about it: It took all this time to finally out the phony, but he is outed.

Posted by: rjheitman | October 16, 2008 12:20 PM | Report abuse

The test of Little John's mettle came when experience showed it has nothing to do with longevity in the old boys club.

Posted by: KraftPaper | October 16, 2008 12:22 PM | Report abuse

Had McCain been taking breathing lessons from Al Gore? He certainly was huffing and puffing enough.

Posted by: tperry1 | October 16, 2008 12:24 PM | Report abuse

When McCain/Palin guarantee that all babies (including special needs infants) born because of their stance on abortion will be adopted by Republicans;

When McCain/Palin guarantee that thorough sex-education, including birth control methods other than abstinence, will be taught in our public schools;

When McCain/Palin guarantee that an affordable college education will be available to ALL qualified and desirous students;

When McCain/Palin acknowledge that affordable, quality health care is a RIGHT for ALL our citizens;

When McCain/Palin acknowledge that diplomacy and not military action should be the first choice in any conflict between nations;

When McCain/Palin acknowledge that our use of fossil-fuel energy far exceeds our fossil-fuel resources and the development and use of other sources of energy MUST be a priority in the USA;

When McCain/Palin acknowledge that this world is not US-centric and that we need to work together with our allies AND our foes to ensure peace;

When McCain/Palin realize that a label ("Arab", "Muslim", "Black" "Liberal" "Elite") does not a bad person make:

Then and only then will I vote for their ticket. Until then, I'm a proud Obama/Biden supporter!

Pam

Posted by: pamela18335 | October 16, 2008 12:29 PM | Report abuse

Bravo! Well written article.

Posted by: Bob43 | October 16, 2008 12:33 PM | Report abuse

Dear John McCain: would you like some jam with that T-O-A-S-T?

Posted by: efreeti | October 16, 2008 12:37 PM | Report abuse

A Hard-Hitting Final Round
HEMPSTEAD, N.Y., Oct. 15 -- Seeking to recapture the momentum in the presidential race, John McCain aggressively criticized Barack Obama's past relationships and challenged his character Wednesday night while Obama sought to link McCain to President Bush and direct the conversation to "solving the...
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By Michael D. Shear and Robert Barnes

Comments
caroll1 wrote:
McCain came across as angry, irritated and even crazed. He continually repeated misrepresentations of Obama's positions (like a mantra) even after Obama set him straight. He seems to think repeating these misinterpretations will make them true. His POW captivity and the abuses he was subjected to by Bush/Rove when McCain last ran for President have unhinged him. To his discredit, he now uses these same dishonest, unethical tactics on Obama.

Imagining McCain as President is frightening. I can see him meeting with world leaders, repeatedly blinking, giving them that same crazed, angry stare, making faces and rolling his eyes, just before he stomps off! He needs therapy.

Posted by: caroll1 | October 16, 2008 12:40 PM | Report abuse

McCain pandering to the angry white bluehair retiree? WTF?

Posted by: efreeti | October 16, 2008 12:40 PM | Report abuse

Do any of you really think that either McCain or Obama are anti-American? It's doubtful that either are and there is no legitimate proof to show otherwise. Unfortunately we are stuck with a two party system in this country. I think the best presidential candidate is Ralph Nader. He's been fighting for citizens his whole career w/o political motivation. Both the Dem's and Rep's can share blame for all of our national woes. Which party is worse often depends on your ideological point of view. I have voted for Ralph in the past but due to the importance of this election I cannot "waste my vote." While both candidates wish to do the right thing neither has fully explained or outlined plans to comprehensively address the issues. This is politics people. They're not aware of how to address each issue. Based on what we have seen from both we need to ask ourselves who will most likely do the best job. I prefer someone who will use their intelligence and judgment to make careful, informed decisions which affect oar's and our children's future. I am voting for Obama because what I have witnessed during this campaign suggests that he is abundantly more thoughtful and less likely to make decisions and policy based on emotion. What we need is logic tempered by sound judgment to confront the overwhelming problems of this complex world. I would love to see the next cabinet comprised of the best minds in the country. This never happens though. I don't believe that Obama or any other politician will live up to all promises made but we need best effort. The mean spirited attacks of the campaigns, media and the American public are entertaining but shameful. Too much is based on political and social ideologies. The only player in this election who has extremist views and scares me is Palin. Just look at the facts. I don't usually contribute to blogs but I couldn't help myself here. I'm fed up with the state of this country and pissed off all to hell but am trying to stay centered and realistic so I had to say something, somewhere. It sucks to see how truly divided we are. I guess that's human nature, huh.

Posted by: billleiner | October 16, 2008 12:42 PM | Report abuse

I was looking to these debates to show me exactly which candidate I could trust to clearly, succinctly, and rationally discuss the incredibly important issues that are confronting our nation. Sen. Obama stood head and shoulders above Sen. McCain. He has the demeanor to be president, the courage to tell it straight to America that they have to change their evil ways in a way that doesn't condescend, and the common decency not to whine, moan, and sound like a yappy dog in a public forum.

Sen. McCain looked old, sounded old, and on several occasions had me scratching my head wondering what was his line of thinking.

It's not going to be an easy road for President Obama, and I wish him well in his first term in office.

Posted by: luv2bikva | October 16, 2008 12:44 PM | Report abuse

OMG. McCain forgot to wear his flag pin! No wonder he was so grumpy.
If you lived in a house between John McCain and Barack Obama, which one of them would you be afraid of if your kids bounced a ball over the fence?
We've had enough of the "angry white male" mentality. This white male says our country is bigger and better than that!

Posted by: dougbob | October 16, 2008 12:45 PM | Report abuse

RE: If Joe Plumber is making $250,000.00 and can't start his own business, I'm thinking he can't manage money. My income for a year is just over $12,000.00 and I started my own business. I wish I had 250,000 to work with.I"d like to meet Mr. Plumber.

Posted by: fairydust53050
---------------------

Let's look at this. Joe the Plumber is not starting a business (some drain cleaners, tools, a truck, ads, etc.) He is trying to buy a huge plumbing service/contracting outfit.

He is not creating jobs, he's hiring plumbers and staff (probably "buying" them with the business,) who would be working for someone else if not for him.

Joe is not creating plumbing contracts to bid on, nor is he creating repairs to be done. The work he does would be done by someone else, if not him. He has nothing to do with the demand for plumbing work. The work is what employs people, not the company that does it. If the work's not there, they'll get laid off.

"Creating jobs" would be discovering/installing a revolutionary new form of heating unit that pays for itself in fuel saving, when the "supply" of companies installing that unit cannot keep up with the demand for it.

That would create jobs. I have no problem taxing people like Joe to give a tax break to someone who would save the country from buying more Arab oil.

It's one way the government can manage progress and promote positive change.

Simply owning a business does not necessarily "create" jobs.

Posted by: ffcaruso | October 16, 2008 12:46 PM | Report abuse

While all that you said is probably true, all the networks are talking about is Joe the Plumber. So who really won?

Posted by: kojer1 | October 16, 2008 12:49 PM | Report abuse

Gee, it's hard not to get caught up and to participate in The White Man's Anger! Really, what is the White Man so angry about? And, how come He only gets so angry that He cannot be distinguished from Frankenstein when He absolutely must deal with Black people the same way He deals with his own? The mess which He claims inflamed His current rage cannot be attributed to Obama, Black people, or any of the issues usually blamed on Blacks! What gives? And by the way, I don't know what the Secret Service was listening to, but I heard a Frankenstein yell "Kill him!" at one of those lynch mob gatherings called a McCain/Palin rally! They better not try and come back with some doctored recording now, either. It reminds this spectator of the Rodney King jury's perception of all those night-stick body blows, tasering, and jack-boot stomps as "not that bad"! The Angry White Man has chosen the candidate He made in His own image. How ironic that this time, the candidate conjured the same mob which ran him out of town eight years ago in favor of the Dracula which has drained the nation and left so many White men trembling with anger at having to trust a Black man to try and save Him this time!

Posted by: iphoenix | October 16, 2008 12:49 PM | Report abuse

I honestly didn't expect the bozos who are mismanaging McCain's campaign to take the 'attack' bait, but they fell for it hook, line and sinker! Amazing! Who in their right mind would ever hire them again?

I have this image of Rove as Homer Simpson going "Doh!"

Anyway -- we didn't need the sound bites -- McCain's body language, nearly inhuman, was like a robot in need of a battery charge.

Ultimately, it is a terrible pity that republicans, obviously believing that the attack strategy was their only valid debate option, apparently believe as well that the lunatic fringe is their only solid base (and they are probably right).

Posted by: saj_pratt | October 16, 2008 12:49 PM | Report abuse

While all that you said is probably true, all the networks are talking about is Joe the Plumber. So who really won?

Posted by: kojer1 | October 16, 2008 12:49 PM | Report abuse

Glad both Obama and McCain used the "decision" rather than the euphemism "choice" but it would have been better to refer to the abortion issue as a "privacy" matter.

After all Roe v Wade was not about decisions or choices, but about privacy.

Posted by: ffcaruso | October 16, 2008 12:49 PM | Report abuse

Joe the plumber won the debate. He got his 15 minutes of fame and probably more free advertising and business than he could manage.

Posted by: ffcaruso | October 16, 2008 12:51 PM | Report abuse

McCain met his Waterloo. Money makes you stupid, and his second wife was loaded with money.

Had he spent the last 30 years caring for his disabled first wife, he's be a much wiser person today, but maybe not a Senator of Arizona, his wife's father's turf.

Posted by: ffcaruso | October 16, 2008 12:55 PM | Report abuse

Its funny, McCain's blinking was more noticeable, but my friends and I decided to count up each candidates blinks and Obama was blinking just as often. I think his blinks were less noticeable because he has smaller eyes than McCain. Obama has this sort of perpetually stoned look to his face.

I do believe that Obama IS anti-american. not in the sense that he wants to blow up buildings, or goes around saying "god damn america" but anti-american in the sense that he not only understands but TOLERATES people who blow up buildings and say "god damn america" in a public forum.

Intellectually, I understand the passions that drive Bill Ayers and Jeremiah Wright to do what they do and say what they say.

My values and convictions are, however, such that I do not tolerate those views. Obviously, I cannot stop anyone from voicing them opinion. I can, however, vote with my feet, in a sense, and never associate myself with them or do anything that legitimizes them or their beliefs.

In short, you learn a lot about someone and their beliefs from the circles they move in. Barack Obama is clearly one of these guilt-ridden Americans that thinks we have to attone for sins. I happen to think that guilt should not be the guiding light for the worlds greatest country.

after all, what country can claim to be our moral superior? I dont any other countries attoning for sins.

Posted by: dummypants | October 16, 2008 12:56 PM | Report abuse

Where was McCain's flag pin last night? If Obama hadn't had one on, Rush Limbaugh would have been the first to say something about it.


Posted by: londonlinda | October 16, 2008 12:12 PM
*************************************

Funny you mentioned that. Listened to a local radio morning show today that interviewed children 14 and under and asked "Who would they vote for and why?" One child stated they would vote for McCain because he wears a US Flag pin which means he's patriotic and Obama is unpatriotic because he doesn't wear one. The child came to this conclusion because they were told by their teacher that's what it symbolizes. All I can say is "Wow...." Needless to say, I would prefer that an unbias individual teach my current events or history for that matter....

Posted by: tbill08 | October 16, 2008 12:58 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: ffcaruso:
And the almighty Obama will magically create heretofore unknown energy technologies to save the little people from devious corporate villains.
........................

You people are as naïve as your messiah.

Posted by: dcn1 | October 16, 2008 12:59 PM | Report abuse

Senator Obama was not cool in the debate. His body language betrayed his annoyance.
In particular, when asked about ACCORN.
Obama lied about ACCORN. The FBI found 11 states with electoral fraud. Obama's campaign paid ACCORN over $800,000 to recruit voters. Remember, Senator Hillary Clinton lost the primaries against Senator Obama. I wonder about the connection between ACCORN and those Popular Caucuses were Obama won.

Posted by: mmarii | October 16, 2008 1:02 PM | Report abuse

Both of these men obviously really care about America and the issues we face. Neither one will ruin this country nor will either one be our saviour. The best part about them is that neither one of them is George Bush.

Posted by: ALLOST | October 16, 2008 1:06 PM | Report abuse

I guess your headline could have read angry white man versus slick black man. Sound right harry?

Posted by: KABOOKEY | October 16, 2008 1:16 PM | Report abuse

It cracks me up that people still think that giving tax cuts to the middle and lower class is going to bankrupt the country. All I ask these people is: HAVE YOU READ THE PAPERS LATELY?
Fact: Tax cuts to the RICH have led to the bankruptcy of this country as EVIDENT by recent economic meltdown and WHO IS PAYING FOR IT????? The middle and lower class.
Trickle down economics, m A$$. More like trickle UP.

Posted by: phorse | October 16, 2008 1:18 PM | Report abuse

To Krishna---You are scary. Are these really your opinions or do you just listen to right wing Mommy and Daddy. Crack, for sure.

Chico13--McCain is too old to see.

brualtri--Too Funny!!

McCain and Palin are running the "Oldie Goldie, Winky and Blinky" campaign. SNL is sure to find some great jokes watching McCain.
Honestly I do honor McCain's time served as a former POW. He is obviously a very patriotic man and deserves the upmost respect from American's. That said though, this does not mean that he should be the President. He is out of touch....he is too old.....these things do not make him a bad man. It is just fact. Medically, he is on the downside of physical and mental performance. This is something that happens to all of us as we age---and that is in the best case scenario. This man was tortured, beaten and left to die as a POW. He was younger when he had to live through this hell. His youthful mind and body kept him alive. The Presidency will be just as hard, if not harder. on him now that he is older. As much as I honor him as a fellow American, I wonder how much damage was done to him as a POW.....where do his fears live in his subconscious and what would it take for him to lose it under pressure now that he doesn't have the umbrella of youthful vitality to protect him? The Presidency is not an awards banquet. Don't mix up feeling honor towards McCain and wanting to give him the Presidency as his reward. To do so would be a huge mistake for all of us. He won't be able to keep up with the World and all that it requires. If something happened to him, then we would have to let Governor Palin take over. If that doesn't scare you then you haven't been listening.

Obama is what we need right now. Biden knows what we need also. Obama/Biden is the only ticket that makes good American sense.

Posted by: jlpark | October 16, 2008 1:19 PM | Report abuse

So jackie, you want the plumber to work harder so you can move into a new box? Would be nice for someone to work so you don't have to, I guess that is why you are voting for Saint O. Jackie, whose fault is it that you have nothing? Could it your first grade education? Your five kids out of wedlock? The blow addiction?


***

My name is Jack,
I live in a box, no job no future
that's life, with McSame.

If war is good,
and poverty better, then
McCain and Palin rule!


Who needs a Pilot,
that can not fly or a beauty queen,
whose lost her luster.

Posted by: nallcando | October 16, 2008 11:06 AM

Posted by: KABOOKEY | October 16, 2008 1:20 PM | Report abuse

Obama lied about ACCORN. The FBI found 11 states with electoral fraud. Obama's campaign paid ACCORN over $800,000 to recruit voters.

Posted by: mmarii | October 16, 2008 1:02 PM
---------------

Did the Obama Campaign specifically pay those people to lie? Were they paid to lie? That's what you have to prove.

They were just employees ripping off ACORN. but we also don't know if they were really working undercover for Republicans trying to Sabotage the ACORN program. It would be typical of Rovian dirty tricks.

We probably cannot prove that either.

The worse you say is the ACORN did not do extensive backround checks on the kids they hired. Yea, right?

Posted by: ffcaruso | October 16, 2008 1:21 PM | Report abuse

Obama clearly won though McCain will surely energize his base with a better performance than in the past. Does anyone know why Obama seemed flat in the first half? He picked it up in the second half though. Was he too complacent with his marginal lead? Was he indeed angry? Was he ill? I do believe this will be a fight to the finish and we must not believe the polls and must not stop working on those undecided voters. Though at this point, if you are still undecided, what is it going to take for you to make a decision? If McCain is elected, be ready for Depression II.

Posted by: goheidigo | October 16, 2008 1:23 PM | Report abuse

@brucerealtor@gmail.com

Nice teletype! I hope I never get old...

Posted by: sararehr | October 16, 2008 1:23 PM | Report abuse

Well Harold- I was a nervous, anxious, grimacing and at times angry white man as well. The confabulated statistics and socialist ideal that were being spewed by Obama had me squirming to. I hope McCain was grimacing. I hope I dont have work 90 hours a week to keep my house so the folks who were to stupid to understand their responsibilities can keep theirs.

Posted by: dbakerpa | October 16, 2008 1:23 PM | Report abuse

>>> Of course there are millions who are angry. This man associates with domestic terrorists,....

Posted by: lmcintyre | October 16, 2008 10:43 AM <<<

You mean the same Bill Ayres who palled around with Lenore Annenberg, the venerable widow of Ambassador Walter Annenberg, the same Mrs. Annenberg who is staunch GOP supporter?

Using McCain and your logic, are you telling us that Mrs. Annenberg, a Republican along with her Republican associates and friends who served the Annenberg Foundation, and 1993, created the Annenberg Challenge for the Annenberg Foundation, pal around with domestic terrorists - in particular, Bill Ayers? That is, the same Bill Ayers invited by Leonore Annenberg herself to have Ayers join the Annenberg Foundation on the board for the Annenberg Challenge?

Those are mad statements in themselves. McCain really needs to stop acting as though he's entitled because he waiting his turn for years.

Posted by: ldsw | October 16, 2008 1:27 PM | Report abuse

I will vote for the calm, studied, thoughtful candidate every day over the agitated,angry,nervous one. Picture John Kennedy on the phone with Russia during the Russian Missle Crisis and picture each of our two candidates in his chair instead. His finger right next to the button that declares war! You should probably do the exercise with Sara Palin also since she could be soooo close to the presidency.
Thank God for Barack Obama

Posted by: theoreys | October 16, 2008 1:27 PM | Report abuse

It cracks me up that people still think that giving tax cuts to the middle and lower class is going to bankrupt the country.

Posted by: phorse | October 16, 2008 1:18 PM
-----------

The Swedes tax the rich very heavily. Some celebrities actually leave the country because of it. But the Swedes have a healthy economy and are hardly effected by the meltdown.

They have a healthy manufacturing sector (we sold ours to the Chinese) and export more than they import. Because of that, they may suffere from less imports, but their core Socialist-Capitalist hybrid economy is healthy and the people are happy.

Posted by: ffcaruso | October 16, 2008 1:30 PM | Report abuse

I mean... the Swedes will suffer for less EXPORTS.

Posted by: ffcaruso | October 16, 2008 1:32 PM | Report abuse

Wow! Lot of anger going around. Tough times in America. How did we get here?

The most successful national politicians must possess charisma, because most Americans and television demand it. It's when substance is combined with charisma that we get a really compelling politician. JFK, Ronald Reagan, and Bill Clinton showed us this. We are beginning to learn that this may work regardless of ethnicity.

Obama is an intelligent and charismatic man. Moreover, he has shown himself to be like many Americans who value education, hard work, and family. Yet, we are asked by the McCain campaign, "Do we really know Obama?" Unless we have spent time with that person, we can't really know anyone. So we have to use visual, spoken, and written cues to identify with our presidential candidates.

McCain is an intelligent man who used to be charismatic. Somehow, he decided that he needed to change to win. That was a mistake! We all thought we knew McCain, didn't we? Until he changed right before our very eyes. Even those who really know him have said so. I believe this why he is losing. We can now ask the same question of him.

As men, I like both Barack Obama and John McCain. However, I am voting for Obama because I believe it is McCain's party that brought America to where it is today (economically and socially), and McCain started running with his party before he started last night to run against it.

Posted by: funkyspur1 | October 16, 2008 1:51 PM | Report abuse

Anti American and running for pres. I don't think the two go together.Some have been using the word anti-Christ. Obama will(with some luck)bring this country back to how it is suppose to be. It will take alot of time and effort but it can and will be done. My biggest fear (as I'm sure is some of yours)is some Wacko will try to take him out. I've heard alot of people talking about the fact he is black. First of all he is both black and white so who better to be in charge. he has both sides of the fence covered. And he seems to very down to earth, not angry and smug. McCain had cut his own throat. I feel it was over for him when he picked Palin to run with him. Of all the people to choose from, why her?

Posted by: fairydust53050 | October 16, 2008 1:52 PM | Report abuse

If you need any more evidence that you cannot trust the media in this election, here you go.

All week, every media organization in America has been endlessly repeating that someone shouted “Kill him” at a Sarah Palin rally when Barack Obama’s name was mentioned. Talking heads like Meyerson use it promote the view that McCain and Palin were deliberately inciting “dangerous extremism.”

Just one little problem. The Secret Service investigated the incident, interviewed security agents and dozens of audience members, and the only person in that whole crowd who heard “Kill him” was ... the reporter, David Singleton of the Scranton Times-Tribune.

It’s a PHONEY STORY - which is all to promote the media myth of the "angry" Republican. NONE of you can be trusted any longer - WaPo, NYT, CNN, etc...

Posted by: pgr88 | October 16, 2008 1:53 PM | Report abuse

Poor little Barry and his legions of haters. Seems nobody ever did yell "kill him" during one of those awful right wing American meetings.

Well, it sounded so good, the media and B Hussein just had to spread the good news.

But, just like the rest of little Barry's campaign - it turns out its BS.

You know, like Todd Palin "doing" the daughters.....

Who would have thunk it.

Posted by: VirginiaConservative | October 16, 2008 1:58 PM | Report abuse

its very clever, but completely misleading, for Obama to point out that the money for his left wing education activist group came from Annenberg.

First, it came from Annenberg only in the sense that it came from his foundation, after Annenberg after had been dead. Clearly, Annenberg did not, as Obama seems to be suggesting, personally approve, or even have any knowledge of the grant. He could not have--he was dead.

Second, Obama has a lot of never even attempting to make this connection because it raises a question that points down a road that, we know, Obama has frequently traveled: siphoning money off for purposes it was never met to put. Clearly, the Annenberg foundation was meant, in part, to fund educational initiatives. Obama and Ayers may have nominally been interested in education--indeed, thats how they got the grant, by purporting this to be the case. In fact, their "educational" initative was really a front for stealth, fly under the radar left wing indoctrination.

Its a troubling pattern from Obama. Remember, he also inaccurately labeled nearly $1 million in payments to ACORN, which ended up being earmarked for ACORN's "election services" to the Obama campaign. As we all know now, ACORN offices have been raided by the FBI in 11 states, and their operatives have been busted for widespread election fraud, including bribing low-income people who say they are already registered to register a second time with cigarettes and alcohol.

Obama plays it clever, stealth and dirty. Just like Nixon. McCain is increasinly looking like a sucker for not busting out the "Rev." Jeremiah Wright. McCain is putting honor above winning, and it is going to cost him the election.

Posted by: dummypants | October 16, 2008 2:05 PM | Report abuse

ACORN only fills out the forms. A person matching the "qualified by election committee" card has to show up in PERSON! Now, if Mickey Mouse can prove that he is indeed Mr. Mouse with (in most states a photo ID), then Mr. Mouse is able to vote. It's not fraud if he/she is really there. So stop with the ACORN crap and come up with some REAL reason to not vote for the MOST qualified person running . . and it ain't the "Angry old White Man"!

Posted by: HumanofEarth | October 16, 2008 2:08 PM | Report abuse

Well stated, Harold. Your analysis is spot on.

BTW, good ol' Joe the Plumber has gotten more free advertising in one night than he could have ever imagined. And for the record, he did state that he's UNDER the $250K threshold, not over.

Barack Obama was as cool as Muhammad Ali, putting the "Rope-A-Dope" on Mr. McGoo, and allowing him to hang himself with his own contradictions. Muthuselah even used Barack's slogan of "America being ready for a new direction". Talk about a rat taking the bait. McCain has no ideas, no vision, no direction; his campaign is like a rudderless ship. And it's sprung a leak.

His choice of an incredibly unqualified Sarah Palin shows how shallow and cynical his judgment really is. Between McSenile and Caribou Barbie, You couldn't generate enough electrical brainpower to light a 40-watt bulb.

America deserves better.

Posted by: owiz | October 16, 2008 2:11 PM | Report abuse

come on mmarii, do you have any idea what you are talking about. ACORN was not at fault, the people working for them were in the wrong. they were lazy , wanted to get paid, but didn't do the leg work to earn the pay. Those people just wrote any ones name down so they wouldn't have to get off their lazy a**es and work. Before you post, make sure you know what you are talking about.

Posted by: fairydust53050 | October 16, 2008 2:19 PM | Report abuse

the only person in that whole crowd who heard “Kill him” was ... the reporter, David Singleton of the Scranton Times-Tribune.
**********

Is that true? I would have thought news organizations would have written an article about how it DIDNT happen.

how perfect, Obama repeated the lie at the debate last night.

guess its true, what they say about if you float something as the truth it tends to stick even if its a complete lie.

Posted by: dummypants | October 16, 2008 2:23 PM | Report abuse

I agree with you meyerson.

A couple other points;

Did you notice how agitated magoo got when Obama made the comment about magoo getting his feelings hurt over the negative ads and when magoo, himself, mentioned the t-shirts?

Magoo is easily agitated. I would think America could throw a couple dozen more t-shirts and negative ads at him and he would, quite literally, start reaching around behind himself trying to pull a ripcord so he could just bail out of his own campaign.

Posted by: vote4magoo | October 16, 2008 2:24 PM | Report abuse

First of all I want to say:
"WE ARE ALL GEORGIANS, SO GET PREPARED TO GO TO WAR WITH RUSSIA."

Next I want to say:
McCain used to be great -- a maveric -- but he has changed (with the help of McPalin) and now he is a right-winger. So I will vote Democratic.


Posted by: nkwari | October 16, 2008 2:37 PM | Report abuse

come on mmarii, do you have any idea what you are talking about. ACORN was not at fault, the people working for them were in the wrong.
********

Actually, that is the exact opposite of what they law is. Clearly, you are clueless.

The law sets forth a very simple premise: you are responsible for the actions of your employees, and you are liable if in carrying out their job they commit malfeasance.

By your logic the big investment houses shouldnt be blamed, just everyone who works for them!!!

If ACORN wants to effect the electoral process by signing people up to vote, then they have a responsibility to take it seriously. Either they need to do better background checks of the people they hire, so they are not hiring lazy jokers who dont take the job seriously. Else they need to better supervise their people in the field. End of story.

Its a pain in the ass, I know, and I'm sure it will require more resources. But hey, I'm sure Obama can funnel them some more of his campaign money.

But what would be the point of Obama giving ACORN money if they couldnt engage in election fraud on his behalf?

Posted by: dummypants | October 16, 2008 2:43 PM | Report abuse

Yes, I agree that John McCain is an angry white man-with one additional word inserted. He's an OLD angry, white man who has sold his soul to win at all costs because he believes that somehow, he is entitled.

The way I interpret John McCain's anger is this: how dare a young, black, self-motivated, educated, intelligent man achieve such stature?

McCain's station in life has been developed, in part, as a result of riding on the coattails of his grandfather and father. McCain has led a privileged life which happens to include being white and male.

The sad part is, that he probably doesn't even recognize the ways in which he has been afforded a privileged status- as his entire generation of white, male counterparts were.

Posted by: PatC1 | October 16, 2008 2:43 PM | Report abuse

That McCain thinks taking a "mothers health" into consideration to be an extremist point of view will probably loose him a ton in the undecided vote

Posted by: shadow27 | October 16, 2008 2:44 PM | Report abuse

I noticed something kind of interesting last night. I am an Obama supporter and when I watched the debate I thought that McCain "won" by attacking and scoring points. However, watching the reaction of independents the couldn't stand the attacks and went for Obama. I realized how much a partisan view can really affect your viewpoint, even when the other guy is scoring points on your guy. The Independents wern't keeping a scorecard and saw things very different. Good for Obama for keeping his cool!

Posted by: MarcMyWords | October 16, 2008 2:46 PM | Report abuse

How can Obama expect to be respected as president if he funnels money to an organization who does not respect the electoral process enough to ensure that it is not engaging in electoral fraud.

it misses the point to blame it on "the employees", the employees ARE ACORN.

Look, everybody knows Obama is full of sh!t. he is just better at lying than McCain. which honestly, when he sits down with Iran's leader, I hope Obama is a good liar, otherwise he is going to get his clocked cleaned.

Posted by: dummypants | October 16, 2008 2:54 PM | Report abuse

John McCain reminds me of a android begining to short-circuit because of too much input that he was not programed to handle.

It was like watching a future sci-fi movie.

He would spout out some nonsense and Obama would calmly respond that he was in error. Remember, it was 'ol McCain himself who said he was going to "kick Obama's arse" during the debate.

His programers had him stoked. He was ready. Trouble is, it was with software that hadn't been updated since 2000.

Today presents a whole new set of issues that his old software just couldn't process, thus the rapid eye blinking, rageful appearance, rambling speech pattern... all signs of a android meltdown for sure.

Somebody better re-boot him before he totally crashes.


Posted by: Jaxon1 | October 16, 2008 2:55 PM | Report abuse

The split screen revealed McCain twitching, grimacing and blinking rapidly and continuously. Do Americans want this nasty old grump around them for the next four years?

Posted by: emainland | October 16, 2008 2:56 PM | Report abuse

If McCain is the seasoned one with the experience and judgment required for these difficult times, he was very successful at not showing it during this campaign and during these debates. His facial contortions revealed the full extent of his resentment for his opponent. If McCain cannot even have a civil unparodical debate with an American Presidential candidate, how is he going to muster the temperament, judgment and patience necessary to resolve the many crises we have, be it economic, energy or foreign policy?

Posted by: bob55 | October 16, 2008 2:57 PM | Report abuse

I live in Plymouth, Indiana and just received a call from a woman who claimed to be from the RNC. She immediately started to inform me "that John McCain's opponent, Barack Obama associated with the known terrorist William Ayres who bombed the Pentagon and threatened to bomb the United States Capitol Building." I couldn't believe my ears. I stopped her at this point and told her I didn't appreciate her calling me and spreading that crap. Assuming she correctly represented herself, that apparently is the the road the RNC feels it must go down. What a shame. Who's running that campaign now, G. Gordon Liddy?

Posted by: 5IN5 | October 16, 2008 2:59 PM | Report abuse

After seeing the debate and recording it for review, I saw the differences between these two men as far as temperament as a justifiable reason to vote for Obama. To quantify my decision, I remember how JFK dealt with the Cuban missile crises, which showed the need for cool heads prevailing in times of crises. Had McCain been President at that time, we would not be here now, we would have been blown up by the Russians and forgotten about. Someone mentioned Cuba as being Socialist, when in fact it is still a Communist country, meaning that their government cares no more about them or their lives than ours appears to have been caring about us during the last 8 years definitely, but including the administrations of Nixon and Reagan. The Clinton win came along at a time that is very similar to this one, big budget deficits from daddy Bush and an economy in the dumper. It is amazing that people have to fight and claw their way to lead, after the Republicans destroy everything they touch and in turn our lives and futures. When will people realize that we can no longer stand like the we are the end all and be all of running the world correctly, especially without even consulting other countries, by the way, most of whom have been around centuries as compared to our mere years of sovereignty? That egocentric attitude that most White folks hold onto, is fading fast, so those of you who continue to hold onto your biased ideas about who can and who cannot seek office or achieve their goals, need to realize that we no longer need your permission to advance as a people or to become part of the governing body of this country. Minorities will prevail historically as leaders just because there will be more of us than Whites in our future. Just like men and woman think and feel differently about issues because of the way they are wired mentally, the different parties will have to understand that the name "White House," has nothing at all to do with the capability of anyone who is a person of color, occupying it in the 21at century! Just because something has not been done before does not mean that it should not be done. If that were the case, we would have been listening to the debate like the FDR fireside radio chat before TV came out!

Posted by: plwood01 | October 16, 2008 3:10 PM | Report abuse

A good analysis and one that's amplified by my own experience. As I have for all 3 debates, I had to be somewhere last night (thank you CNN & MSNBC for the looping afterward). I listened to the beginning of the debate ON THE RADIO. I thought McCain was doing surprisingly well. When I got home and saw the CNN split screen (especially) that showed McCain's angry reaction shots, I had a whole different impression. Like the famous 1960 Great Debate in which Richard Nixon's lack of makeup and 5 o'clock shadow doomed him, McCain's 72 year old pasty visage was just overwhelmed by HDTV. It picked up every bump, emphasized every grimace and spotlighted the grunts and eyeblinks -- is he wearing poorly fitting contacts? Eye blinking is one of those non-verbal cues of lying and somebody counted 3,000 last night for McCain. I don't want to overemphasize this, but McCain also appeared stuffed into his suit -- did anybody else think his head looked really small in proportion to his chest? I guess you rarely see him sitting with a starched white shirt creating a turkey neck. So fair or not, I think a lot of the overall impressions have to do with his appearance. OF course, once he got to women's issues it was as if he decided to get into the back seat of Thelma & Louise's convertible as it flew off the cliff. Women's "finger quote" health "finger quote?" on the late term abortion issue .... and total tin ear on equal pay issues? I hope all those PUMAS out there are looooovvvvinn their ol'man. You desrve him.

Posted by: Omyobama | October 16, 2008 3:16 PM | Report abuse

I wonder how well Senator Obama would look on stage if he had been beaten tortured and stabbed for five years of his life. It is so easy to say how great the young never been touched Obama looks when compared to someone that has given his entire life to this country. Unfortunatly in this country, charisma wins everytime...

Posted by: MarkUSAF | October 16, 2008 8:26 AM

________________________________________
I'm sorry, what is winning is truth and facts. What is losing is spoiled 5-yr old mentality throwng themselves on stage and holding their breath until everyone sees things through artificial rose colored glasses. Charisma isn't winning per se, facts-fortitued-faith, that is what is winning. Mr. Obama has more than charisma, he has character. Sorry John, my friend (NOT AND STOP CALLING US THAT), your fiction just doesn't jibe with the facts. Before throwing stones, make sure Cindy hires a glass factory.

posted by betty buttcrack- joe plumbers sister in-law, married to joe six-pack

Posted by: Smarra | October 16, 2008 3:22 PM | Report abuse

Obama has associated with known terrorist, and it is up to responsible, enlightened American's to make sure that we don't elect a terrorist-sympathizer to office. The Republican Party is looking out for YOU. Don't be sucked into the Democrats' spin machine. Vote for the experienced, intelligent, patriotic, ant-terrorism candidate. Go McCain.

Posted by: TheChin | October 16, 2008 3:22 PM | Report abuse

What do you think the MSM would say if this Title on this article was; FINALE DEBATE: ANGRY BLACK MAN!

Posted by: Acros | October 16, 2008 3:24 PM | Report abuse

And the Emmy goes to: John McCain. He performed brilliantly in Rush Limbaugh's and Sean Hannity's "Last Stand". These two directors took a B list actor and shoved all of those lines down his throat like he was Linda Lovelace. To think that McCain actually listened to these guys and his advisors (and the dems who goaded him) instead of being the maverick he claims to be is incredible. I guess Jim Henson's muppets could use him after the Republicans are finished with him since he's allowed their hands to reach all the way up through his throat to speak on their behalf. What ashame. The N. Vietnamese couldn't break him but the neocons did. Now, if he fires his entire staff, never appears on Fox News again, and asks Sarah Palin to step aside in favor of Mitt Romney, he's got a puncher's chance. Best supporting actor goes to: Obama. He supports a middle class tax cut, ending the war in Iraq, winning in Afghanistan, taking out Osama bin Laden, education, energy efficiency, job creation, etc. Yes, he has negatives too, but not as many as Puppet Man McCain.

Posted by: bkhoward | October 16, 2008 3:26 PM | Report abuse

The current issue of Rolling Stone magazine has an excellent article on the life of John McCain. McCain has had a chip on his shoulder all his life, suffering from the classic "little man's disease" of only being 5'9" tall. He has few friends in the Senate because of his anger and foul temper often calling fellow Senators four letter words when angry. The image of him snarling and growling during the last debate last night only reinforces what the Rolling Stone's article said about his true nature. Thank God he's not going to make it to the White House! We've had enough of these under-educated, incurious, war mongering, vindictive men sitting in the Oval Office. Three Cheers for Barack Obama, next President of the United States!

Posted by: logcabin1836 | October 16, 2008 3:29 PM | Report abuse

Both candidates have worked hard to keep race out of the presidential campaign but you journalists are so determined to wind up a controversy that you racially color titles like "The Angry White Man"...no shame...you are all becoming trash...you trash candidates, women, children, and even autistic babies. Go get a real job and make an honest living.

Posted by: jrfees2 | October 16, 2008 3:30 PM | Report abuse

Both candidates have worked hard to keep race out of the presidential campaign but you journalists are so determined to wind up a controversy that you racially color titles like "The Angry White Man"...no shame...you are all becoming trash...you trash candidates, women, children, and even autistic babies. Go get a real job and make an honest living.

Posted by: jrfees2 | October 16, 2008 3:31 PM | Report abuse

Dummypants(the name says it all) Maybe you should be in charge of ACORN. You sound like you could get that whole situation under control. When you hire someone to do a job you expect it to be done correctly. If you work in a bank and steal the money, you mean to tell me it is your employers fault that you are a thief. I don't think so.

Posted by: fairydust53050 | October 16, 2008 3:39 PM | Report abuse

Was I the only person creeped out when McCain tried his "Hey Joe the Plumber, you're rich," sarcasm? I cringed when Obama called Hillary likeable enough, but McCain was downright creepy ranting how Obama had just made Joe the Plumber rich.

Posted by: caribis | October 16, 2008 3:46 PM | Report abuse


Recall that McCain suddenly cam out of the weeds, suddenly had money, suddenly, unexpectedly won the primaries?

Recall that Lieberman was constantly with him, not even the requisite 3 stes behind.


And then note that the McCain campaign foisted Palin forward...McCain bit (they knew he would, pretty female).

Consider that the neocons of McCains top campaign wanted a regency. Knowing that McCain is not completely all there, (many insiders think)or won't be long.

Lieberman was to have been the veep, then the regent (the person who pulls the strings in a disabled king)...but that plan failed.

So Palin was to be the new weak president, with Lieberman and his people pulling the strings.

Hard to explain. Perhaps just say the neocons, who took over the bush presidency on day one, don't want to give up their power. Their power that has brougth this country to it's knees.

Posted by: whistling | October 16, 2008 3:48 PM | Report abuse

Interestingly enough, did anyone notice that McCain was not wearing a minature american flag pin on his suit last night? All I can remember is how Obama caught hell for that tiny, stupid violation during the primaries. What a fantastic hypocritical world we live in.

Posted by: KBDC | October 16, 2008 3:54 PM | Report abuse

Watching the final debate my kid made a comment about McCain. She said that McCain reminder her of, Elmer Fudd. As I watched McCains facial expression I couldn't help but agreeing with her. I thought to myself, whats next, Betty Boop? Oh I forgot, we got her already too. Never the less, it was comforting in know that I got a teenager who will vote when she becomes of age. This is not a trend (young voters) but a fact.

Posted by: egghd1697 | October 16, 2008 4:06 PM | Report abuse

Mr. Myerson is exactly right, I think; Obama's campaign deliberately goaded McCain into raising the Ayers canard, and it was a brilliant piece of political Judo to take a vicious attack and turn it into an inescapable trap for the Republican.

If McCain hadn't taken the bait he would have looked weak to the angry Republican base, many of whom were never all that enthusiastic about John McCain as candidate to begin with. But by engaging in such obvious, and easily refuted (Annenberg anyone?), character assassination in front of the whole country he came off looking like a petty, angry man with no answers to the real issues.

Either way McCain lost and Obama won.

Posted by: AHermit | October 16, 2008 4:10 PM | Report abuse

NOW GET OUT THE VOTE!

This is all fine and good but my fellow Americans if you do not VOTE you'll have Palin/McCain in the Whitehouse...

Because EVERY wing-nut religio-facist is DEFINITELY VOTING FOR PALIN ON ELECTION DAY!

GO VOTE OBAMA/BIDEN!!!

Posted by: onestring | October 16, 2008 4:24 PM | Report abuse

FYI - OBAMA has raised NEARLY ONE TRILLION DOLLARS for his campaign. He has even purchased his own Station. 24/7 OBAMA...
Secret Service says "Kill him" allegation unfounded

http://www.timesleader.com/news/breakingnews/Secret_Service_says_Kill_him_allegation_unfounded_.html

Posted by: TexasTeaParty
------------------------------------
Hey Joe (Sixpack, Plummer, Smit, Stupid, Say it Ain't So, or Whomever, lol), from a donator to the Obama campaign, you are such an idiot. One Trillion dollars, lol...are you kidding, lol...no, it's half a billion; get it straight and it's in the form of $3,200 maximum donation from each donor...that's like ONE TRILLION AMERICANS (LOL in your mindset) wanting to get the Repukes out of office and away from our national financing--ONE TRILLION, LOL!!! All this stupidity pushing me to go back to www.BarackObama.com to donate some more "trillion dollars", lol...

Posted by: Beingsensible | October 16, 2008 4:35 PM | Report abuse

The coughing anus of former UN fame has just given his endorsement of Obama.

Of course, this is the same former UN head who just attended a conference in Teheran which excluded Jews.

Ain't diversity wonderful!

Posted by: VirginiaConservative | October 16, 2008 4:44 PM | Report abuse

'It sucks to see how truly divided we are. I guess that's human nature, huh.

Posted by: billleiner | October 16, 2008 12:42 PM'

Unfortunately, being divided is not human nature, self preservation is human nature. What saddens me most is that Wall Street bankrolled by non-existant tax dollars encourages the self-preservation at the expense of others. Sorry you have no where else to vent these issues. I find that it is almost impossible to resolve this issue because when someone has their minds made up, there is no changing it. That is why conversations of politics and religion turn into arguments instead of debate.
Many teachings from many cultures try to encourage thinking outside of yourself and find hope in helping others. The peace corp, Jimmy Carters helping hands, the Clinton/Bush foundation to help those hit by the ravaging hurricanes, all of these are ways to raise the standard on 'the human nature' Good luck in making your choice, which ever candidate you choose. I hope that when it is all said and done, and written in the history books, we will find leadership that governs with the average citizen in mind and not just the elite lobbyists or bank accounts..

Posted by: Smarra | October 16, 2008 4:50 PM | Report abuse

Re: Joe the Plumber
It gets better and better. Joe is practicing plumbing without a license! Link to Associated Press story:

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/J/JOE_THE_PLUMBER?SITE=CALAK&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT

Posted by: Joesnoplumber | October 16, 2008 4:51 PM | Report abuse

GOP REPUBLICAN WALL STREET FRAUD AND BLIND GREED HAS KILLED SUPER-CAPITALISM

Thanks to GOP Republican Wall Street fraud, the International Banking System will no longer use capitalism.

Asia and Latin America will stay far away from American super-capitalism.

Europe will demand transparency and strict enforcement of International Banking Laws for ALL NATIONS, especially the United States.

Europe views Wall Street CEOs and investors as criminals unworthy of trust who must be closely monitored commensurate with their dishonest nature.


DEMOCRACY RISING RALLIES TO EDUCATE AND EMPOWER AMERICAN CITIZENS


COMMERCIAL ALERT AND CITIZEN RIGHTS
(PROTECT AMERICAN FAMILIES, COMMUNITIES, U.S. DEMOCRACY FROM WALL STREET FRAUD AND CORPORATE CORRUPTION)


THE RICH ARE STEALING AND SELLING AMERICA: STOP THEM!!!


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


SUPER RICH GOP REPUBLICAN MILLIONAIRES / BILLIONAIRES ARE HIDING $3TRILLION STOLEN FROM THE TREASURY (AMERICAN PEOPLE) IN FOREIGN BANKS, PROPERTIES AND SWEATSHOPS.

CONFISCATE ALL PROPERTIES (DOMESTIC / FOREIGN) BELONGING TO RICH REPUBLICANS INVOLVED WITH ROBBING THE TREASURY AND RETURN THE $3TRILLION TO THE AMERICAN PEOPLE.

IT IS RIGHT TO PROSECUTE ACTS OF TREASON AGAINST THE AMERICAN PEOPLE.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Since 1929, Republicans and Democrats have each controlled the presidency for nearly 40 years. So which party has been better for the American pocketbook? If you invested $10,000 exclusively under either Democratic or Republican administrations, this is how you would you have fared:

From 1929 to 2008, $10,000 invested in S & P under the GOP Republican Presidency would have grown to $11,733. ($51,211 if you exclude Herbert Hoover’s presidency during the Great Depression)

From 1929 to 2008, $10,000 invested in S & P under the Democratic Presidency would have grown to $300,671.

Democrats have always been better for the American People, than GOP Republicans.

GOP Republican high propensity for Greed and Fraud has finally destroyed their Wall Street Golden Goose.

Give the GOP Republican criminals handcuffs and property confiscation.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


AMERICA, EUROPE AND THE WORLD NEED HEALING THROUGH FORWARD THINKING IRISH-AMERICAN HARVARD LAW SCHOLAR BARACK OBAMA


When Obama ends the illegal GOP Republican Iraq War, $1Trillion will flow back into the United States and create a million American jobs through the multiplier effect.

Obama loves America, while GOP Republican McCain loves tax loopholes for the rich.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Posted by: dwashington1 | October 16, 2008 4:54 PM | Report abuse

I wonder how well Senator Obama would look on stage if he had been beaten tortured and stabbed for five years of his life. It is so easy to say how great the young never been touched Obama looks when compared to someone that has given his entire life to this country. Unfortunatly in this country, charisma wins everytime...

Posted by: MarkUSAF | October 16, 2008 8:26 AM
----------------------------------------
I wonder how well Senator McSame would sound on stage if he had studied while at Navy Academy rather than bar hopping, beer benging, womanizing, and the likes. I wonder how Senator McSame would feel about the middle class had he not left his first wife because she suffered a disforming car accident after raising his children as a single parent worried and waiting for him while he was being beaten tortured and stabbed for five years of his life only to be dumped for another woman half his age who inherited a beer empire that started from illegal bootlegging. It's easy to say that you understand the "anger" of the middle class, but it's truly hard to really understand it when you have 7 (according to your staff, because you don't truly know) houses and 8 cars. Rich beats middle class everytime with the Repukes.

Posted by: Beingsensible | October 16, 2008 5:00 PM | Report abuse

It's obvious that most of you Liberals writing comments here have not served your country and are full of HATE. Shut your traps and go out and do something positive for mankind....there's nothing worse then a bunch of SELFISH people who put themselves above others. I would bet that after reading most of these comments that 99% of you are COWARDS and would run for the hills to save your own asses. There is no comparison of these two men as far as service and sacrafice. May God help all of you miserable excuses for Americans. God said in the bible that there would be false Idols, I guess the great Barak Obama is your false Idol. Wake up you stupid idiots.....

Posted by: williambergmann1099 | October 16, 2008 5:08 PM | Report abuse


THE DEBATE WAS A GOOD TEST OF SUITABILITY

Good stress tolerance is the most important quality of a president.

This is because stress blocks intelligence and judgment. Even worse, it activates defense mechanisms - "psychological blinders", that distort the perception of reality, making the judgment even worse.

Therefore it is of vital importance that the president has a high level of stress tolerance.

The presidential debates have been good tests of stress tolerance, because in an unprepared TV appearance, the candidates are exposed to a highly stressful situation that reveals their true nature.

To judge for yourself who is most suitable, see the "Voter's guide for assessing the suitability of a president" at
http://drgrandville.blogspot.com
It is based on the most recent knowledge in the field.

J.Grandville, M.D.
Expert on stress and developmental psychology

Posted by: drgrandville | October 16, 2008 5:09 PM | Report abuse

Here is an article from Alaska about why
Sara Palin will not hire Africian Americans in her office.

Villagers, my view is that character is measured by the things you do when nobody is looking. Do you wonder what vice presidential candidate Sarah Palin was thinking about African Americans before she stepped onto the national stage?

The following is a statement from one of the Juneteenth Directors in Alaska:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


"As for Governor Sarah Palin's involvement in the African American community, the Governor's office hasn't participated in any of our Alaska Juneteenth Events. All previous Alaskan Governor's have traditionally attended and participated in our annual Juneteenth Celebration. Gov. Palin was the first governor not to send out a congratulatory letter or assist us in any way with our Juneteenth activities.

I didn't have the courtesy of receiving a reply when I asked for a representative from the Governor's office to come and speak at our Juneteenth Celebration if Governor Palin was unable to attend. I never even heard of Gov. Palin until she was elected Mayor of Wasilla, Alaska, in Mat-Su Valley.

Governor Palin is a very energetic and spontaneous woman. With some of the things being said and going around this state right now, I'm surprised none of the national media have bothered to come here and get the words directly from the mouths of the people who have lived with her all of these years instead of 'surfing the net!'

My other opinion is why would an individual who, to my knowledge, has not hired any African Americans on her gubernatorial staff, insist so passionately on being on a television show owned and operated by an African American, Oprah Winfrey?

While meeting with Black leaders concerning the absence of any African Americans on her staff, Gov. Palin responded that she doesn't have to hire any Blacks and was not intending to hire any. What kind of attitude is this toward African American for who may be the first Vice-President of the United States?

Posted by: jgipson1 | October 16, 2008 5:09 PM | Report abuse

Well, well, well.

We have Meyerson the socialist 'journalist' supporting Obama the democratic socialist candidate.

Boy,is this country in for a suprise if Obama wins.

Posted by: wilsan | October 16, 2008 5:36 PM | Report abuse

What is ironic is that McCain spent most of his campaign trying to reasure the right wing of the Republican party that he's conservative enough (which is where his admissions that he supported Bush more than most Republicans comes from). Now that the economy is in the toilet he's been trying to fight the McSame label that he helped foster. I can understand why he's frustrated, but he did it to himself.

Posted by: clamb1 | October 16, 2008 5:38 PM | Report abuse

Poor little Barry and his legions of haters. Seems nobody ever did yell "kill him" during one of those awful right wing American meetings.

Well, it sounded so good, the media and B Hussein just had to spread the good news.

But, just like the rest of little Barry's campaign - it turns out its BS.

You know, like Todd Palin "doing" the daughters.....

Who would have thunk it.

Posted by: VirginiaConservative |
----------------------------------------
Todd Palin did his daughters? Wow, you Repukes just keep putting Palin's business out there and then getting upset when someone brings it up. Are you saying that Todd Palin is the father of Bristol's baby? Now that's news to me and definately TMI (too much information.)

Posted by: Beingsensible | October 16, 2008 5:49 PM | Report abuse

During his Navy flying career, John Sidney McCain III was noted for his distain for checklists and safety precautions. He once famously said, "Kick the tires and light the fires. Anybody can be slow." This attitude may have had something to do with the five aircraft he crashed. Bravado and impetuosity may be assests in a fighter pilot, but they are handicaps in a statesman.
Watch McCain's demeanor during the debates. Can you tell when he's angry or upset? Of course you can. You can almost see the steam coming out of his ears. This is why craps is his game and not poker. Who would do better in a negotiation with a foreign leader, John the Volcano or Barack the Unflappable? I think we've all seen the answer.

Posted by: kguy11 | October 16, 2008 6:04 PM | Report abuse

...But i'm not electing an actor. Or most popular. Or best looking....
Posted by: ustimes
**************

Why do I have this feeling you previously DID vote for a well-spoken, good-looking actor in the '80s???

Could it be, after all, that ideology is your hang-up? How can you justify voting Republican after the past eight years?

Posted by: abqcleve | October 16, 2008 6:06 PM | Report abuse

The word Socialism has been thrown around a lot as if this is a dirty word.

What is wrong with giving everyone access to healthcare?

Ok lets say no heathcare for anyone, no Medicare, no nothing. You get your own issurance, just like McCain plan has proposed.

You have your heath care that's fine, but what about your aged mother, father, grandparents. Do you care about them?

Remember insurance companies will make them pay a large premimum because of their age. That $5,000 dollars won't cover them both.

So here is your parents or grandparents having to decided about insurance for heathcare or paying for heat for the winter, for food after all they are on a fix income.

Suddenly your 65 year old dad has a heartattack or you grandmother falls and breaks a hip. Neither has health insurance so what does that means?

That means that they will lose everything to pay the medical bills. They will lose their home, their savings everything.

Is this what you want?

Let's say you single. You got health insurance using McCain's plan. Ok, what if you found out that you have cancer. Those insurance companies then inform you that sorry, this is a pre-existing condition and we will not pay. Bills start to come in, you lose your job, you lose your home, and you probably lose your life because you didn't want Socialized heath care.

This is what you want?

Posted by: ThisWomansOpinion | October 16, 2008 6:12 PM | Report abuse

It's obvious that most of you Liberals writing comments here have not served your country and are full of HATE. Shut your traps and go out and do something positive for mankind....
Posted by: williambergmann1099
****************

Like kill people in illegal, immoral wars without questioning "leadership"? No, the hate comes from a group of people whose personal prejudices, whether they be ideology, race or blind pride, cause them to continually vote against their own interests.

Posted by: abqcleve | October 16, 2008 6:19 PM | Report abuse

We don't need John the Volcano (so aptly put) or John the contemptuous or John the Erratic or John the I can't believe I'm losing or John I have no ideas since I left them in Annapolis 40 years ago. He would be a dangerous person as president especially with his numbnuts sidekick, I can see Russia from my doorstep. Wow. This will be looked at as a cartoon duo, nothing but fear & loathing on that campaign. I wonder how they sleep & dream.

Posted by: diamonddave2 | October 16, 2008 6:23 PM | Report abuse

John McCain was one step away from screaming, "GET OFF MY LAWN, BOY!"

Posted by: jimcummings | October 16, 2008 6:33 PM | Report abuse

McCain appears more and more like Col. Jessup sitting on the stand in the last scene of "A Few Good Men". The guy is completely losing it....

Posted by: buzzsaw1 | October 16, 2008 7:04 PM | Report abuse

I really hope both candidates will announce their chosen cabinet members before November. McCain isn't over. He always comes back.

Posted by: dummy4peace | October 16, 2008 7:04 PM | Report abuse

In a normal election year, Obama's link to Wright's "black values system" would disqualify him from the presidency in the eyes of most Americans.

1. Obama told a crowd in Elko, Nevada,"I need you to go out and talk to your friends and neighbors. I want you to argue with them and get in their face." IS THIS ACCEPTABLE TO YOU? DIRTY POLITICS!

2. When Stanley Kurtz began researching Obama's ties with terrorist William Ayers, the papers in the Richard J. Daley Library in Chicago were at first closed off to him for several days, apparently at the bequest of Nobama supporters. When Kurtz was appearing as a guest of Milt Rosenberg's radio show, Obama's supporters were ALERTED by campaign email and jammed the radio station (WGN) phone lines and sent in hundreds of protest emails.IS THIS ACCEPTABLE TO YOU? What happened to free speech? DIRTY POLITICS!

3. Last month, St.Louis City Circuit Attorney Jennifer Joyce warned citizens that they would bring libel prosecution against anyone who made "false" statements against Obama. What happened to free speech? DIRTY POLITICS!


4. Similarly, the Obama camp called for a criminal probe of the American Issues Project when it linked Obama to Ayers. DIRTY POLITICS!

5. Saturday Night Live ran a spoof of the fininacial crisis that skewered Democratics like House Chairman Barney Frank. The tape disappeared from NBC's Web site and was replaced with another that omitted the reference to Frank.

6. Obama sent 31 of his hired employees to Alaska to ASSIST in the Troopergate investigation? WHAT WAS HE THINKING? Just more dirty politics to try and dig up dirt on Sarah Pallin? DIRTY POLITICS!

IS AMERICA NO LONGER THE LAND OF THE FREE?

THE LACK OF INTEREST IN KNOWING JUST WHO OBAMA IS IS STUNNING!

Posted by: Cantabrigian | October 16, 2008 7:17 PM | Report abuse

FYI - OBAMA has raised NEARLY ONE TRILLION DOLLARS for his campaign. He has even purchased his own Station. 24/7 OBAMA...
Secret Service says "Kill him" allegation unfounded

http://www.timesleader.com/news/breakingnews/Secret_Service_says_Kill_him_allegation_unfounded_.html

Posted by: TexasTeaParty
------------------------
What! You are an idiot. No way $1 trillion. Get back on your medications fool.

Posted by: Classic60 | October 16, 2008 7:25 PM | Report abuse

This is an excellent analysis of the debate. McCain looked extremely uncomfortable and agitated. He seems to be insulted that he is getting waxed by a younger man, but he is getting waxed anyway. McCain has gotten away with a lot for a long time. He is taking this opportunity to reveal himself as a whiner and a fit waiting to be thrown. All in all, not a good day for McCain.

Posted by: ElectricBill | October 16, 2008 7:48 PM | Report abuse

I'm not sure why Sen. McCain is such an angry man, he's been that way since he got the nomination and it has gotten old. Maybe he thinks he's being tough, but from where I sit, he just comes across as a mean-spirited, grumpy old man.

He also came across as someone who either didn't hear, didn't comprehend or was deliberately and repeatedly misprepresenting what Sen. Obama said on a number of issues. His total misrepresentation of Sen. Obama's position on healthcare drove me up the wall.

And he didn't do himself any favors with the women I know - 1.)Sarah Palin is no role model for most American women, McCain maybe proud of her, but many of us think she's a national embarrassment and 2.)his rather dismissive attitude to "if the life of the mother is at risk" was alarming.

Given the state our country is in at this time, sorry, but I'd rather have someone who is calm, cool and collected, not to mention intelligent, making decisions.

Posted by: laSerenissima2003 | October 16, 2008 7:59 PM | Report abuse

Myerson, you're SO full of baloney!
McCain grimaces just like you would have done if you were bright enough to notice that Obama was like a little kid, trying to look so relaxed after getting caught with his hand on the cookie jar. He got pinned by Mccain, who called him on several issues he for which he could offer NO defense. I reacted something like McCain did whenever Yo'Mama gave a dishonest answer or made an untrue charge.
Obama is a very smooth talker..TOO smooth. A special on the History Channel this past week revealed how Obama tried to cover himself with his carefully measured voice, but anybody who can read body language could tell he was avoiding a lot of McCain's questions. And, yes, they DID tell on Obama. It's a shame YOU didn't see it...but, then, you'd probably never have believed it anyway. People like you have trouble dealing with the truth!

During the debate I kept telling my wife, "He did it again" every time 'Mama sidestepped one of McCain's questions, and I said it so many times I think she was getting annoyed. I was also getting annoyed at Y'Mama for not having the GUTS to answer to McCain's charges. He KNEW that if he did, he'd either stick his foot in his mouth or would have to lie his way out of it. He kept his voice very calm, betraying the fear he showed in his eyes.

So why don't you grow up and quit trying to bring race or any of your OTHER fears into the conversation? If you can't print the truth, why don't you get a real job??

Posted by: flipper49 | October 16, 2008 8:02 PM | Report abuse

Great essay Meyerson. McCain really derailed last night with the negativity. Obama was the true statesman indeed.

Posted by: ghuntcustom | October 16, 2008 8:08 PM | Report abuse

Cantabrigian, this has never been the land of the free for anyone who isn't a white male. When our nations' Constitution was written, the WHITE men who wrote it never imagined that their slaves would one day be free or capable of interpreting, speaking, reading, or writing the English language, nor did they think this land would be inhabited by the many diverse cultures our population now consists of.

This election marks a pivotal point in America's history. It will either set the tone for perpetual change or inevitable downfall. If John McCain becomes this nation's next leader it will certainly earmark the downfall of what was once recognized as a great nation. Internationally, other nations are watching this election and ultimately they are preparing for unification or battle. With McCain and Palin "the baracuda" it will certainly be the latter. Through the campaign we have seen that each Republican candidate lacks the integrity and composure to lead this nation in these difficult times. McCain's choice for a VP was an obvious display of his irrational judgement and an absolute mockery on the intelligence of Republican voters. He bargained on most of his Republican supporters doing just as he did....sticking with the party, no matter how base the decision just as he supported Bush on many of the decisions that have contributed to the downfall of the nation's economy. Bush is leaving the office yet some are prepared to re-elect his clone. The smile, the wink, the wave-everything was identical.

For all we know McCain may be in the early stages of dimensia. His behavior has been quite erratic-calling supporters "fellow prisoners," confusing Down syndrome with Autism, obviously unable to think of Obama's wife Michelle's name-irrational behavior. Can you really imagine Grandma Sarah running the nation? Give me break! The antics of the Republican candidates have undermined and made an absolute mockery of this nation's political system as it will our nation if they are elected!

Posted by: theanswer08 | October 16, 2008 8:28 PM | Report abuse

Did I hear Sen. McCain say "TROOPS FOR TEACHERS"? now that is a stellar representation of thinking on one's feet.

Posted by: longtermthinker | October 16, 2008 8:51 PM | Report abuse

Sen. McCain was so anxious to show his concern for his running mate's special needs child, he did not even remember that Ms Palin's child has Downe's syndrome. Is that caring? Wow.

Posted by: longtermthinker | October 16, 2008 8:54 PM | Report abuse

I wish a moderator would ask any anti-choice candidate what re-criminalization of abortion would look like. The answer is, girls and women dead from amateur abortions, and pregnant women caught seeking abortion being locked up until they give birth with their legs shackled to the bed, just as all pregnant women in prison give birth.

If a candidate thinks that 53% of the country are second-class citizens, they are NOT getting my vote.

And when McCain mocks laws which try to protect the life and health of pregnant women - could his contempt for women be any more conspicuous?

Posted by: ankhorite | October 16, 2008 11:16 PM | Report abuse

Since January this year, the media has elected Obama president. It now switches to broadcast the new propaganda: "McCain, resistance is futile!"

Posted by: FloridaCounts | October 16, 2008 11:41 PM | Report abuse

I wonder how Harold Meyerson is feeling today when almost every poll with the exception of one or two that remain unchanged show McCain closing the gap.

This won't be the first or last time that he'll have to wipe egg of off his face I'm sure.

Most people saw McCain as aggressive and not angry and a helluva lot of Americans detest Obama's smug attitude and painted on Hollywood smile.

For a better understanding of how Obama may have blown his chances by revealing his re-distribution plans and a look at why many whites are lying about their attentions, and we're not talking about the Bradley effect - take a look at
http://priestandpalin.notlong.com/

Mike


Posted by: redmike | October 17, 2008 9:28 AM | Report abuse

"Most people saw McCain as aggressive and not angry and a helluva lot of Americans detest Obama's smug attitude and painted on Hollywood smile."

I would beg to differ with you on that redmike-a moniker I'm sure describes you to a tee. Perhaps those with closed minds and eyes wide shut think like you, but the majority of Americans with any common sense know that McPalin is not capable of leading this nation. Putting Palin a heartbeat away from the Presidency is absurd. That's like taking any woman off the street and telling her to lead the nation, which is essentially what McCain has done. The only difference is he picked someone from a remote area, probably in the hope that no dirt could be uncovered on her. I mean she lives in Alaska for goodness sakes right? Wrong. The corruption of her politics and abuse of authority HAS been uncovered. It's needless to point out the corruption within her home, but I will. Her teenage daughter is pregnant resulting from misguidance or no guidance due to her parents' selfish aspirations. In reading some of the previous blogs it has even been suggested that Todd is the child's father, which is actually not an inconceivable notion. I'm sure many of the McPalin supporters are products of incest!

Posted by: theanswer08 | October 17, 2008 10:06 AM | Report abuse

BTW, THE TRUTH ABOUT JOE THE PLUMBER-www.nytimes.com

"One week ago, Joe Wurzelbacher was just another working man living in a modest house outside Toledo, Ohio, and thinking about how to buy the plumbing business where he works. But when he stopped Senator Barack Obama during a visit to his block last weekend to complain about taxes, he set himself on a path to becoming America’s newest media celebrity — and as such suddenly found himself facing celebrity-level scrutiny.

As it turns out, Joe the Plumber, as he became nationally known when Senator John McCain made him a theme at Wednesday’s final presidential debate, may work in the plumbing business, but he is not a licensed plumber.

Thomas Joseph, the business manager of Local 50 of the United Association of Plumbers, Steamfitters and Service Mechanics, based in Toledo, said Thursday that Mr. Wurzelbacher had never held a plumber’s license, which is required in Toledo and several surrounding municipalities. He also never completed an apprenticeship and does not belong to the plumber’s union, which has endorsed Mr. Obama. On Thursday, he acknowledged that he does plumbing work even though he does not have a license.

His full name is Samuel J. Wurzelbacher. And he owes back taxes, too, public records show. The premise of his complaint to Mr. Obama about taxes may also be flawed, according to tax analysts. Contrary to what Mr. Wurzelbacher asserted and Mr. McCain echoed, neither his personal taxes nor those of the business where he works are likely to rise if Mr. Obama’s tax plan were to go into effect, they said."

Yet another failed attempt to steer the election.

Posted by: theanswer08 | October 17, 2008 10:25 AM | Report abuse

Interesting that the fanatics of the Republican party tried to deny that the average american who is both concerative and liberal (I believe in a woman's choice, but at the same time I believe in the death penality especially for serial, child, and cop killers) don't like McCain because he really doesn't have a clue of what to do about the fincial crises. I have been listening to his speaches but he really hasn't given me anything but generalities. I get more from Obama.

I'm not the only one:http://news.yahoo.com/page/election-2008-political-pulse-souring-on-mccain;_ylt=Ak45aIuVta0Di3bivE5u1tlsnwcF

I think I would respect him more if he just came out and said, "Look folks, I have no idea how to fix this financial crises and neither does my opponent, but maybe together we can come up with a solution." All I hear and see from him is negativity.

Obama had some nice things to say about both Palin and McCain during the debate. He didn't have to be nice to Palin, he could bring up the fact that her husband belongs to a separatist group, that she has been found guilty of abusing her powers as governor, that she belongs to a church that women are subservant to men and that she got blessed by a witch hunter to protect her from witchcraft. But he didn't. He compliment her and John McCain.

He treats McCain with respect of POW survior and his years of service in the government. Obama does critize McCain's policies because they sound like Bush's, but that's what I expected not personal attacks.


McCain on the other hand critized Binden and Obama from the moment he open his mouth. Binden considers McCain a friend someone to respect but McCain doesn't return this same respect.

I think what rubbed me the wrong way with McCain is that I'm 43 years old and I have been in my field for 20 years. The way McCain dismissed someone my age as nave and experience is insulting. Twenty year olds are nave and inexperience not 40-some year olds.

The way he acted on stage is another reason. He acted like a child with ADD, not being able to sit still and making funning faces while someone is talking. It made him look foolish.

The truth is that the Republican party made a mistake picking a candidate.

We have people on both sides bring up crap. Obama has terrorist ties well so does McCain. We have people who refuse to believe that Obama was born in Hawaii, well guess what McCain was born in Panama Canal Zone in 1936 (http://www.snopes.com/politics/mccain/citizen.asp). The Panama Canal is outside of the US and therefore he is not considered "natural-born citizen" this phrase in the Constitution Article II, which specifies that "No person except a natural born Citizen" can be president. There are three court cases that have been filed which means we might have to do this whole crap over again.

My suggestion is for the Rebuplican party to disqualify McCain stating the above and place another candiate out. They might have better luck.

Posted by: ThisWomansOpinion | October 17, 2008 10:27 AM | Report abuse

I guess if you're going to look angry in public these days, you'd better not be John McCain. He looks like a man in constant physical pain. Perhaps the lengthy medical records did not say it all, and that's real cause for concern.

Posted by: rmpatera | October 17, 2008 7:00 PM | Report abuse

All that mention of Joe the Plumber and Joe would benefit from Obama's tax plan not McCain's. If Joe can find a business to buy that will yield 270k/yr income, good luck borrowing the money to buy it. Good article, like the writer.

Posted by: bwcolq | October 18, 2008 12:38 AM | Report abuse

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