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The Town Hall Debate: What I'd Give for a Follow-Up

At this point, I’d give all the money in my pocket – admittedly, not all that much – for a follow-up question. The format in this debate is basically an invitation for the candidates to give greatest-hits snippets from their stump speeches. They intersperse these mini-speeches with tendentious claims about the other guy – which the other guy then feels compelled to answer (instead of the next question).

Who’s winning? Seems to me that Barack Obama is trying to associate John McCain with the Bush administration’s policies and failures and is doing a pretty effective job. McCain is trying to raise doubts about everything Obama has ever proposed or thought of proposing. That’s harder to do, when Obama – as soon as he gets the floor – will immediately contradict everything that McCain said.

One moment struck me as particularly unfortunate for McCain: When Tom Brokaw asked whether health care was a privilege, a responsibility or a right. McCain said it was a responsibility, but left unclear whose responsibility it might be. Obama said he believed it should be a right, and talked about how his mother, who died of cancer at 53, had to spend the last months of her life arguing with insurance companies. Pretty powerful, I thought.

By Eugene Robinson  | October 7, 2008; 10:16 PM ET
Categories:  Robinson  | Tags:  Eugene Robinson  
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Next: The Town Hall Debate: Punch, Counterpunch

Comments

Surprised McCain didnt drop the F bomb during the debate, like he does in this video http://www.mccanes.com

Take Part in a national poll at http://www.watchdebate.com They want to know what you thought of the debate.

Posted by: pastor123 | October 7, 2008 10:59 PM | Report abuse

McCain Won Hands Down

Posted by: gdodd414 | October 7, 2008 10:59 PM | Report abuse

who sat next to michelle obama at the debate was it Osama?????

Posted by: noobama08 | October 7, 2008 11:00 PM | Report abuse

McCain=Unstable
Palin=Unable

McCain is a spoiled brat...reffering to Obama as "That one"...and refusing to shake Obama's hand at the end.

McCain=FAIL

Posted by: hdtex1 | October 7, 2008 11:00 PM | Report abuse

Agreed. Follows were in short supply and desperately need.

Posted by: tommyd60 | October 7, 2008 11:02 PM | Report abuse

Tom Brokaw was totally in the pocket for McCain. He should be forced to resign. He cut off Obama and gave McCain every opportunity to rebut Obama.

Posted by: jonmiktay@hotmail.com | October 7, 2008 11:02 PM | Report abuse

From:
Head of State
http://headofstate.blogspot.com/2008/10/that-one.html

Tuesday, October 07, 2008

"That One"

What a very odd thing for McCain to say.

McCain repeatedly invoked the need for a "steady hand on the tiller" tonight--for someone who will be calm and cool in the crises that the upcoming years will present us.

Yet this is a man who is utterly unable to contain his contempt--even on a night when, even as Bill Bennett says, he needed to "break through", and even when such a strange expression of disdain could only highlight pettiness, anger and partisanship that voters wish that candidates would steer away from in the greater interest of the nation.

McCain's fundamental position--one from which he finds his momentum and meaning--is so often one of a contemptuous anger for those who do not understand what he has learned. In 8 years of a position that began with an angry, assumed knowledge, we have seen the results.

So this time: choose that one.

Cite:
Head of State
http://headofstate.blogspot.com/2008/10/that-one.html

Posted by: robthewsoncamb | October 7, 2008 11:03 PM | Report abuse

McCain won tonight and he will win the election

Posted by: noobama08 | October 7, 2008 11:04 PM | Report abuse

Health care is indeed a RIGHT, and correctly relates to the Constitutional Right to LIFE, and Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness.

Unfortunately, here, in the USA, it is neither a Right, nor a Responsibility.

It is a BUSINESS, above all.

Posted by: ElMugroso | October 7, 2008 11:07 PM | Report abuse

McCain talked to the audience as if they were children. Obama engaged in adult conversation.

The "that one" comment was a slip of the tongue that, though likely just a nervous sort of fumbled improv, isn't going to help him.

McCain = B-
Obana = A

Posted by: old_hippie | October 7, 2008 11:08 PM | Report abuse

Am I the only one around here that thought we were watching a couple first graders at snack time?

"If We're going to have follow-ups, I want one too!"

And McCains "Humor"... ugh...

I am a registered Republican, normally right wing on most of the issues.

However, A "Republican" president who once contemplated crossing the isle, isnt a "Republican" to me. Sounds like "Change" but not the kind im looking for.

Posted by: jeremyreger | October 7, 2008 11:09 PM | Report abuse

Senator Obama was even better tonight than last time. He was at ease, was articulate, answered questions before him and related them to full circle within the concept of Government. Senator McCain, again, used his time to tell us how much he knows, without specifics, who he knows, and how he will do things, without any specifics. He expects us to trust him and, frankly, after what I have seen and heard in the last 48 hours, I wouldn't trust him to walk my dog.
I would be so proud to have a tall, modern, intelligent, dignified, articulate man who understands human nature and who would be willing to try international relations to improve the world situation. Wars cannot be won anymore; we need to strive for improved international relations.
And that man is not "That one!"

Posted by: nana4 | October 7, 2008 11:09 PM | Report abuse

Is Letterman on yet?

Posted by: jeremyreger | October 7, 2008 11:10 PM | Report abuse

uh, I believe Sen. McCain's 'mortgage buyback' proposal to help keep folks in their homes IS ALREADY IN THE RECENTLY PASSED 'BAILOUT' BILL. If he had read it, he'd look smarter.

Posted by: Kath2 | October 7, 2008 11:10 PM | Report abuse

McCain was patronizing. "My friends" this and "my friends" that - and what with the pent up anger and soft sounding tone like talking to a child? Neither candidate really answered the questions which is expected, but why be so patronizing? Voters are smart enough that we don't need someone talking down to us. Just answer the questions, please.

Posted by: drumbug | October 7, 2008 11:12 PM | Report abuse

McCain lost.

He did nothing to change the current dynnamics.

He needed to at least make an impact, if not knock it out of th epark.

None of that happened.

Obama's lead in the polls keeps clicking up.

One more thing, in terms of understanding the issues, Obama was very clear.
McCain in contrast hunched over and had a squinty giddiness of some school kid that just stole a watermellon.

The economy is tanking and McCain talks about hair transplants, the good old days with Tip O'Neal and Teddy Roosevelt...jeez. Time for the old folks home.

Posted by: plaza04433 | October 7, 2008 11:13 PM | Report abuse

Neither really said much that we had not heard before but I was gratified to hear Obama handle McCain's falsehoods straight on.

What struck me most was how much Obama looked like the president we need right now.

It goes without saying that Obama won the debate hands down.

Anyone who would vote for McCain after this debate needs psychiatric help - if they can afford it.

Posted by: nyrunner101 | October 7, 2008 11:14 PM | Report abuse

I'm an Obama supporter, but I could see how independent undecideds could go either way and score either candidate a winner. They weren't that different in their manner and neither made any major gaffes.

However, when the other person on the ticket is thrown into the mix (the VP candidate) McCain is weighed down by Palin and that's an insurmountable problem for him. The woman isn't ready for prime time and undecideds who read/see enough about Palin just aren't going to go for her.

Decision on November 4th: Obama.

Posted by: ScoutieDog | October 7, 2008 11:16 PM | Report abuse

Obama won this one HANDS DOWN. He was clear, direct and poised all through the debate.

McCain looked awkward, irrascible, and slightly irritated. His jokes fell flat, and some of his claims were just flat false, such as his claim that Obama will impose "fines" on people for failing to get health care. And I really can't wait to see how McCain's plan to cut back on Social Security and Medicare benefits will play out among seniors in Florida.

Prediction: national polls will give this one to Obama by about the same margin as the last one: two to one.

Posted by: austintexas | October 7, 2008 11:17 PM | Report abuse

THAT ONE called Obama is the next President of the USA.

Thanks for reminding the people, John McCain.

Posted by: ElMugroso | October 7, 2008 11:18 PM | Report abuse

The debate was a push. Neither made a major mistake or introduced new ideas. Obama continues to make promises he won't be able to fulfill - the tax cut is not going to happen with a $700 billion rescue and his other social agenda items to pay for. The $250,000 tax will affect more us than is being let on... it's not on just your paycheck, it's based on AGI - so if you have property, stocks, bonds, and any other form of income that brings you to $250k - you're going to pay. Guess what - we'll see H&R Block find all kinds of loopholes and all of sudden find ourselves with fewer $250K+ incomes!

McCain, on the other hand, continues be general and unable to commit to a plan. He used vague and broad statements. Look at his answer on the question about fixing Medicare and SS - "let's have the smartest people around the table to discuss..." What is that?

I guess we're the losers in all this - we're getting the same political rhetoris we always get.

Posted by: eliahs474 | October 7, 2008 11:19 PM | Report abuse

"THAT ONE" won the debate. "That One is going to be the next president of the United States come Jan.

Posted by: MILLER123 | October 7, 2008 11:20 PM | Report abuse

"Health care is indeed a RIGHT, and correctly relates to the Constitutional Right to LIFE, and Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness.

Unfortunately, here, in the USA, it is neither a Right, nor a Responsibility.

It is a BUSINESS, above all."

Posted by: ElMugroso


Hey, buddy...

You don't have a right to come into my office, & demand service for free.

Why would I have a responsibility to offer you free health service? Get outta here.

You're twisting the Constitution to your benefit, which is what happens under a democracy, the people vote themselves gifts from the public treasury with the result that democracies always collapse because of loose fiscal policy but guess what, THIS IS A REPUBLIC.

Posted by: fenderguitar3 | October 7, 2008 11:20 PM | Report abuse

Powerful if you do in fact believe that healthcare is a right. Healthcare is not a right it is a privlege. If you look at the history of healthcare, as it's being discused, health insurance - it's a pretty new system that took off in the 1940's. Next thing you know we'll be saying that having a job is a right and having a house is a right. Wait a minute, how's that working out? The healthcare system may be broken, but health insurance and healthcare is not a right. Life and healthcare are very different things.

Posted by: cmlawrence_36 | October 7, 2008 11:20 PM | Report abuse

I think McCain has to lie about everything. Obama didn't receive more money from Fannie and Freddy. Here are the real facts -

The total listed for Obama is $126,349 - a tiny fraction of the approximately $390 million his campaign has raised, according to the Center for Responsive Politics. The list shows McCain has received a total of $21,550 from Fannie and Freddie employees. The list includes donations of at least $200 from those who receive paychecks from Fannie and Freddie.

The New York Times has published a separate list looking at contributions from "directors, officers, and lobbyists for Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac" for the 2008 campaign cycle. That list - using figures from the Federal Election Commission - shows McCain receiving $169,000, while Obama received only $16,000.

Check it out - http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2008/09/19/fact-check-did-obama-profit-from-fannie-and-freddie/#more-19364


One could say that it was McCain who got more money from the leadership team that showed poor judgment.

And there's more -


McCain top 10 Donors

1. Merrill Lynch $230,310

2. Citigroup Inc. $219,551

3. Blank Rome LLP $189,226

4. Greenberg Traurig LLP $157,487

5. AT&T Inc. $153,005

6. Goldman Sachs $139,520

7. Morgan Stanley $136,651

8. JPMorgan Chase & Co. $129,400

9. Credit Suisse Group $110,725

10. Lehman Brothers $96,050

9/20/2008

Posted by: HemiHead66 | October 7, 2008 11:21 PM | Report abuse

Independent here. No knock-out in this debate. I was expecting McCain to flip (possibly drop the N bomb), but surprisingly, he was audibly reserved.

It's interesting how both candidates closed their answers with a red herring, which the other would then focus on, thereby reducing their opportunity to ANSWER THE %^@#$% QUESTION!

It was like watching two geasers poke each other all night.

Posted by: ifinallyfoundyou | October 7, 2008 11:21 PM | Report abuse

I noticed MCCain kept rambling on & on causing him to go way over his time slots. Is he color blind? I mean could he even see the green, yellow & red timing lights?

Posted by: JoeNTx | October 7, 2008 11:22 PM | Report abuse

Most of the pundits on TV keep saying the debate was uninteresting. Not so for me. McCain definitely got some shots in and his proposal for stabilizing home values is a major deal. Once again, the pundits are saying "why weren't we informed of this idea beforehand." Please. It's not McCain's job to pre-brief his ideas.

Posted by: APalinFan | October 7, 2008 11:22 PM | Report abuse

"That one" displays a level of contempt just below that of an outright curse. One only has to read the Rolling Stone's Oct. 16 cover story to understand why.

"That One" for the Change that isn't a Psychopath.

Posted by: whodema | October 7, 2008 11:22 PM | Report abuse

Obama won. If McCain cant speak coherently and refers to Obama as "that one" how do we expect he is going to keep cool when talking to russia or iran ? McCain cant keep cool or civil in a debate, how can we trust him to keep cool in a crisis ? My vote is for Obama

Posted by: bluewhale1 | October 7, 2008 11:22 PM | Report abuse

To the person who commented that McCain=unstable and is "spoiled brat."

You're a disgrace...and represent everything that is wrong with the loss of civil debate and disagreement in this country.

I strongly support Obama, his policy positions and his cause. But John McCain is a good man with different opinions on how to lead this counry. That doesn't make him unstable. And by saying that, it simply makes you look like the one who is a spoiled brat.

Posted by: EDED | October 7, 2008 11:23 PM | Report abuse

Everyone's comments here are so very funny! I think our sense of humor is sharpened here because we can all relate to each other perfectly. Too bad, McCain was unable to play nicely with others.

Posted by: Lynne1 | October 7, 2008 11:23 PM | Report abuse

I think it is kind of rediculous to say that health care is provided to all as a right. If it is a right we all have, then who is supposed to pay for it? Everyone else has to pay for mine?

But more than anything it Shows Barack Obama's twisting of the thought process. If health care is a right of everyone, then why did he vote four times to PROHIBIT health care for infants born alive in an abortion?

McCain is not much to offer.

Obama is truly dangerous.

Posted by: cheetahpilot | October 7, 2008 11:25 PM | Report abuse

This (socialist) person's post represents EXACTLY what INDEPENDENT, FREEDOM lovers are up against:
--------------------

Health care is indeed a RIGHT, and correctly relates to the Constitutional Right to LIFE, and Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness.

Unfortunately, here, in the USA, it is neither a Right, nor a Responsibility.

It is a BUSINESS, above all.

Posted by: ElMugroso | October 7, 2008 11:07 PM

Posted by: LanceInCALIF | October 7, 2008 11:26 PM | Report abuse

YES, "THAT ONE" has my vote! Amen

Posted by: JoeNTx | October 7, 2008 11:26 PM | Report abuse

McCain? Was an arrogant twit.

Rude to his opponent, his 'that one' comment was unworthy of a man running for president of the country.

Add to that the pitbull in stilettos and lipstick, who is taking advantage of her gender to spout outrageous exaggerations without fear of reprisal as the men don't wish to appear sexist.

Disgusting

Posted by: windamyr | October 7, 2008 11:26 PM | Report abuse

I'm voting for Obama but I thought McCain was better tonight than in the last debate. Having said that, there were huge errors in judgement.

- McCain's "That one" comment was a bizarre moment that at best is a throw back style to the last century, and at worst is disrespectful and contemptuous (in fact, just the physical attitude suggests the latter). Is this what we want in a President?

- McCain made a tactical error in continuing his litany of false claims against Obama when Obama simply stood up and corrected these on followup.

- While he seemed more alert tonight McCain was almost distracting with the amount of writing on his pad. He was so furiously scribbling I half expected him to produce a sketch of Obama at end of the debate!

- Obama was cool as usual, in fact a little too cool. I think I'd break out in a cheer if he would simply say something directly to McCain like "Senator, with all due respect why do you keep lying about my record?" Let these guys do a Lincoln/Douglas on each other instead of this artificial and sterile talking AT each other. 30 minutes like that and I predict you'd learn more than in hours of this flawed format.

Obama won in my opinion, and I'm sure McCain won in the opinions of those who are already decided in his favor. Wonder what the independents think.

Posted by: LincolnX | October 7, 2008 11:26 PM | Report abuse

Nice to read Mr. Robinsons non-usual WaPo crap.

Posted by: tucanofulano | October 7, 2008 11:27 PM | Report abuse

"who sat next to michelle obama at the debate was it Osama?????

Posted by: noobama08"

That ugly dude with the beard was yo mama, Noobama.

Posted by: Lou3 | October 7, 2008 11:27 PM | Report abuse

"You don't have a right to come into my office, & demand service for free.

Why would I have a responsibility to offer you free health service? Get outta here.

You're twisting the Constitution to your benefit, which is what happens under a democracy, the people vote themselves gifts from the public treasury with the result that democracies always collapse because of loose fiscal policy but guess what, THIS IS A REPUBLIC." -Fenderguitar-
-------------------------
You believe that only the RICH have the RESPONSIBILITY to be healthy then?
-Or would you disclose ignorance by saying they have the RIGHT?

Posted by: ElMugroso | October 7, 2008 11:29 PM | Report abuse

McCain was really unhinged and went off the track within 15 minutes into the debate.

Obama was cool as a cucumber and very presedential, what a class act.

While McCain looked foolish walking all huffed and puffed and hunched, whispering my friends my friends like a slimy old mean politician that he is.

Great performance President Obama.

Posted by: obee1 | October 7, 2008 11:30 PM | Report abuse

"But more than anything it Shows Barack Obama's twisting of the thought process. If health care is a right of everyone, then why did he vote four times to PROHIBIT health care for infants born alive in an abortion?

cheetahpilot"

That is a many-times-refuted lie.

Go have your own babies and leave the rest of us alone. We're all tired of Repro-Fascism.

Posted by: Lou3 | October 7, 2008 11:31 PM | Report abuse

Obama is so concise on what needs to be done and considerate of the poor and middle class. McCain is full of garbage, his defense of his supporting the failure Bush in his own words "over 90% of the time" is to shamelessly point out those same failed policies he helped create by giving the wealthy more huge tax cuts to fix it all? He would invest all our money left, on tax cuts for his wealthy friends, all we have left on the waste product Iraq war and have a domestic "spending freeze" that would paralyze America here at home for good. One of the main reasons America is in the trouble we are in because the Bush administration instead of investing in the American people with more Domestic spending invested in Iraq and tax cuts for the wealthy! Obama will reverse all of that and get us out of Iraq taking those tax cuts and wasted war spending and re-invest that money in job creation, energy, health care, housing and everything Americans desperately need right NOW. It's obvious why more and more Americans are turning away from the failed policies and ideas of McCain/Bush and moving to get behind Obama.

Posted by: Hillary08 | October 7, 2008 11:31 PM | Report abuse

Everyone has the Right to healthcare or we might as well throwing people out based on preconditions, weight, heredity, or financial status.

Posted by: MILLER123 | October 7, 2008 11:31 PM | Report abuse

McCain had to win; he didn't. With all of his years of experience, McCain couldn't win two debates against a relative newcomer to the Senate and the national scene, who is black, and whom fully 10% of Americans still insist on believing is a Muslim. If he can't win in these debates, what makes him think he can win in Iraq or Afghanistan? Fire the ejection seat now, John. It's over and you're going down in flames.

Posted by: ThePhotogsBlog | October 7, 2008 11:33 PM | Report abuse

Yes indeed, Obama is TRULY dangerous with regards to our future freedoms as citizens of the USA. Vote Obama IF you want Socialism to erode our liberties over the next decade. My true fear IF he were to be elected by the crackheads now being registered fraudulently by Dem orgainizations across our once great country: he would place racist individuals (i.e., the ones who do not work for a living, and who also have the title "Reverend" in front of their names!) in positions of power which will help ignite a race war.

Posted by: LanceInCALIF | October 7, 2008 11:33 PM | Report abuse

Senator Obama appeared comfortable and confident, with thoughtful responses to the questions. Obama's rebuttals to McCain demonstrated his ability to speak truth to power without pedestrian or insulting language. I didn't hear anything new, but I didn't expect to with less than a month before the election of my lifetime.

Not surprising, Senator McCain seemed awkward and kind of creepy. I couldn't help noticing how close he got to the audience members sometimes (my comfort bubble would have burst!) He began most of his responses with "my friends" which is merely a rhetorical strategy to stall while he gathers his thoughts. The news about the government renegotiating bad mortgages was a surprise, a good one for many struggling homeowners, but I kept thinking that this was the same man who can't quite recall how many homes he owns.

I was impressed that Sen. Obama connected his energy doctrine to President Kennedy's by comparing it to the Space program initiative and moon landing.

At the same time, I noticed that McCain mentioned Tip O'Niel twice, called President Reagan his hero before remembering that he had a different one. I felt bad for the McCain family, because it had to be apparent to everyone that their patriarch is really struggling.

Posted by: cheryllyne | October 7, 2008 11:33 PM | Report abuse

One minute simply wasn't long enough for either candidate to say anything substantial about any of the questions they were presented. There was very little debate to the debate, and I felt the candidates felt fenced in by the short time limit. I almost felt it was a waste of my time. For anyone who's been paying a modicum of attention, nothing new was said here tonight by either candidate.

Posted by: katie84 | October 7, 2008 11:34 PM | Report abuse

No thank you to Obama's plan to fine people who don't have insurance. I can't afford it now and then to top it off he is going to fine me when I can't afford it in the first place. I don't think so! He only talked about people who already have insurance and what he will do for them but did not say a thing about people without.

Posted by: ForMcCain | October 7, 2008 11:34 PM | Report abuse

"You believe that only the RICH have the RESPONSIBILITY to be healthy then?
-Or would you disclose ignorance by saying they have the RIGHT?

Posted by: ElMugroso | October 7, 2008 11:29 PM "

You have the responsibility to take care of yourself and buy the insurance plan you think you will need.

If regular people can't afford it, it's the fault of the companies not the individual & they go out of business.

Posted by: fenderguitar3 | October 7, 2008 11:35 PM | Report abuse

.

McCain exposed Obama for the pork he cost taxpayers. Three million for an overhead projector? Obama knocked McCain for voting down a pork laden bill. Clearly Obama is not focused too much on eliminating corruption.

.

Posted by: Billw3 | October 7, 2008 11:36 PM | Report abuse

McCain was really unhinged and went off the track within 15 minutes into the debate.

Obama was cool as a cucumber and very presedential, what a class act.

While McCain looked foolish walking all huffed and puffed and hunched, whispering my friends my friends like a slimy old mean politician that he is.

Great performance President Obama.

Posted by: obee1 | October 7, 2008 11:30 PM
-----------------------
Agree, specially when McCain said "THAT ONE voted for it" and you know WHO voted against it? Me"
-I don't know why the Mini-me came to memory. Maybe the way he grabs his fingers and shows his temper?

Posted by: ElMugroso | October 7, 2008 11:36 PM | Report abuse

McCain's lies are getting so ridiculous that I feel bad for this old grump,maybe his senility is getting better of his judgement. 'That one' ? huh.. Its really pathetic to see him strain and stretch the truth and trying to convince himself of it.. really sad to see him get to this state manipulated by the 'base' - bible thumping right wing wackos..

Posted by: fLyingMaverick | October 7, 2008 11:36 PM | Report abuse

I'm voting for Senator "That One" for President of the UNITED STATES and I'm about to send him another donation

Posted by: MILLER123 | October 7, 2008 11:37 PM | Report abuse

"You believe that only the RICH have the RESPONSIBILITY to be healthy then?
-Or would you disclose ignorance by saying they have the RIGHT?

Posted by: ElMugroso | October 7, 2008 11:29 PM "

You have the responsibility to take care of yourself and buy the insurance plan you think you will need.

If regular people can't afford it, it's the fault of the companies not the individual & they go out of business.

Posted by: fenderguitar3 | October 7, 2008 11:35 PM
====================
Now you are saying that Money and Responsibility are one and the same thing.
-You realize that's a confussion?

Posted by: ElMugroso | October 7, 2008 11:38 PM | Report abuse

"Now you are saying that Money and Responsibility are one and the same thing.
-You realize that's a confussion?

Posted by: ElMugroso | October 7, 2008 11:38 PM "

You mean to tell me you're not responsible for your own finances?

Posted by: fenderguitar3 | October 7, 2008 11:42 PM | Report abuse

Question on Health Care:

I suspect that especially in the DC area and other places with a lot of government and professional class workers, we have a fair amount of people getting redundant (versus supplemental) coverage between working couples... how prevalent is redundant coverage? can it be reduced? if so could this help to lift wages a bit while also saving insurance costs for employers? could it open up some capital leverage for insurance providers to cover more people?

Just a thought...

Posted by: DannoMc | October 7, 2008 11:43 PM | Report abuse

It's over, its done, John McCain has officially conceded the election.

What a bone head, he looked like he needed a nap. And god help America if we hear " My Friends " one more time.

And then the famous last line " That One "

night night john, its time for your jammies and a nice cup of tea, you don't have to stay up past your bedtime anymore.

You're done, Sarah's done.

Its over and done,

Say goodnight John!

Posted by: kentaylor1 | October 7, 2008 11:44 PM | Report abuse

Everyone has the Right to healthcare or we might as well start
throwing people out based on preconditions, weight, heredity, or financial status.

Posted by: MILLER123 | October 7, 2008 11:44 PM | Report abuse

Powerful if you do in fact believe that healthcare is a right. Healthcare is not a right it is a privlege. If you look at the history of healthcare, as it's being discused, health insurance - it's a pretty new system that took off in the 1940's. Next thing you know we'll be saying that having a job is a right and having a house is a right. Wait a minute, how's that working out? The healthcare system may be broken, but health insurance and healthcare is not a right. Life and healthcare are very different things.

Posted by: cmlawrence_36 | October 7, 2008

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

The reason health care don't work is because it's run by Wall Street. Always wanting More More More profits. I don't know about health care being a right or privilege, but people shouldn't have to suffer. These fat cats with their million dollar pay checks and stock options have got to go. A few at the top really abuse the system and everyone else whines up paying for it. Ya know, this system we have doesn't work. If a company clears 500 million dollars a year after everything it's not good enough. Being a public company means you always have to grow. Everyday people can't keep up with that. It's highway robbery.

Posted by: HemiHead66 | October 7, 2008 11:44 PM | Report abuse

It's nice to watch all the rats jumping off the sinking Republican ship ... Wonders how many years it's going to take for the Republican Party that McCain & Bush destroyed to arise from the ashes ?

Posted by: gatorsn09 | October 7, 2008 11:45 PM | Report abuse

Obama's idea that healthcare is a "right" clearly shows that he (like his many socialist supporters) regards the "liberty" referred to in the Declaration of Independence as "liberty to take other people's money, via the government," and a resultant *Dependence*, on everyone's part, on that government. As a fairly low income person myself, I might benefit in the short run from a further slide into socialism, but I don't want my kids to grow up in a country impoverished by it.

Forget about the "lower" or "higher" expectations on this or that candidate in a debate: If we sink further into socialism our whole country will suffer from drastically lower expectations for the foreseeable future.

Posted by: westminsterabs | October 7, 2008 11:45 PM | Report abuse

I was convinced by what happened after the debate. I was watching CNN.com. Barack Obama and Michelle stayed and took pictures, signed autographs, shook hands, and mingled with the 80 persons on stage.

McCain did not stay.

Posted by: theodosia1 | October 7, 2008 11:45 PM | Report abuse

.

fenderguitar3:
"You mean to tell me you're not responsible for your own finances?"

No, Obama said it's his right. Let someone else foot the bill.

.

Posted by: Billw3 | October 7, 2008 11:47 PM | Report abuse

Indeed, clear corruption out of wall-street so hospitals can run properly for regular people.

Posted by: fenderguitar3 | October 7, 2008 11:47 PM | Report abuse

Get ready for the Great Republican Depression of '09. I predict that McCain and his pitbull, Vag Cheney, are going to lose in a landslide.

Posted by: hamishdad | October 7, 2008 11:47 PM | Report abuse

It's pretty sad when in this day and age people vote for an empty headed man because he appears Presidential. I fear for this country in a big way because obviously there are a bunch of empty headed youths casting a vote for someone who looks presidential but does not think like a President. Sorry but not enough experience for me. The older you get the more knowledgeable you become with age.

Posted by: ForMcCain | October 7, 2008 11:47 PM | Report abuse

And yes, it is upsetting to hear That Zero referred to as "That One."

Posted by: westminsterabs | October 7, 2008 11:50 PM | Report abuse

"No, Obama said it's his right. Let someone else foot the bill.

Posted by: Billw3"

Obama saying this and that is a right doesn't make it so.

Let someone else foot the bill...think about that for a second and tell me if that isn't the attitude that got us in this financial mess in the first place.

Posted by: fenderguitar3 | October 7, 2008 11:50 PM | Report abuse

McCain is a scary old man, and little else.

And I'm sick to death of hearing about his military record, which he thinks makes him qualified to be commander in chief. Face it: he crashed five jets trying to be a hotshot and was a POW for five years in a war that the USA lost. How does that qualify him to do anything other than be locked up, fully medicated, in the psyche ward of a VA hospital?

He stomps around rattling his figurative saber, recounting a failed military career as if it were a series of heroic, world-saving missions, as if he were a real soldier like Patton, Ceasar or Napolean. He's not even qualified to shine their boots.

And I love watching him trying to control the physical tremors he has. He can barely contain them.

Is he doing his best not to flip out and scream at the top of his lungs, or take a swipe at Obama? Or is he teeming with adrenaline, looking forward to his first day in office, when he can lauch a full-scale retaliatory nuclear attack on Hanoi?

A bet every night he falls into a fitful sleep muttering, "Payback is hell, payback is hell ..."

Scary old man.

Posted by: aetherashe | October 7, 2008 11:51 PM | Report abuse

IF you missed FOX's special Sunday night at 9:00 on Obama, you need to watch it. There is way too much about Obama we don't know, and his friends and associates worry me. How did he purchase a 1.2 million dollar home?

He spent 2 years in a drug fog during college? his own words........ was this to handle stress, to find himself,....... or just what?
He worked for Acorn.....

bad taste......... like Michelle's silver zipper that was glittering up her back today.............and her panty line........

Posted by: cici3 | October 7, 2008 11:51 PM | Report abuse

They both lost. Can't we have a debate rule that prohibits them from referring to the policy of the other? We're more interested in their positions than what they think of the other's.

And let's face it, an effective president "presides" over the government and doesn't govern by veto to advance their own personal values on the nation.

I can take issue with both candidates strategies for resolving problems that they both recognize. Personally, the McCain choice of Palin, a campaign strategy gamble at best, is the deciding factor to lean toward Obama. While I can respect her in her profession she adds nothing to the ticket. McCains "maverick" approach in this regard is dangerous as it appears to set himself up the unilateral authority. We can ill afford another commander-in-chief assuming self-interpreted constitutional authority to make decisions on behalf of our nation.

Posted by: mjabs | October 7, 2008 11:51 PM | Report abuse

.
westminsterabs re Obama's idea that healthcare is a "right"

That's Obama's mindset, i.e. his socialist/liberal/irresponsible view. Get what you can for nothing.

.

Posted by: Billw3 | October 7, 2008 11:52 PM | Report abuse

The vitriol being expressed here, especially by the Obama supporters, is shameful. Senator McCain is not creepy, shambling, or unhinged. He's a bright thoughtful man who's served his country with honor for years, and who has a deserved reputation for working in bi-partisan ways on important issues. He might make a very good president.

On the other hand, Senator Obama is no socialist or radical and isn't dangerous to the nation. He has some problems, among them a record entirely bare of any accomplishment in public office--he's my senator and I've known about him from the start. I was sorry that he couldn't answer that interesting question, "What do you NOT know, and how will you learn it?" He simply cannot admit he has any faults or lacks whatever; he has never admitted to a mistake, or a failing of any kind. That kind of arrogance will be problematic when he's President.

I'm going to vote for Obama, though McCain is the better man. I think Democrats in control for the next few years will be better for our country. But I have no illusions about Obama and his failings.

BTW, those who keep repeating the "That One" comment with such outrage merely prove that you are appendages of the Obama campaign. They have put out an angry statement focusing on that, and on little else, and urged their troops to push the argument. Grow up, my friends, and think for yourselves a bit more.

Posted by: donald169 | October 7, 2008 11:54 PM | Report abuse

Poor old John lost again .... GOOD !!!

Posted by: gatorsn09 | October 7, 2008 11:54 PM | Report abuse

Powerful if you do in fact believe that healthcare is a right. Healthcare is not a right it is a privlege. If you look at the history of healthcare, as it's being discused, health insurance - it's a pretty new system that took off in the 1940's. Next thing you know we'll be saying that having a job is a right and having a house is a right. Wait a minute, how's that working out? The healthcare system may be broken, but health insurance and healthcare is not a right. Life and healthcare are very different things.

Posted by: cmlawrence_36 | October 7, 2008

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++
There is NO reason whatsoever why Healthcare can not be like EDUCATION.
-There's BOTH in the USA.
NOW, let me point out that the Constitution DOES NOT even say "The unalienable Right to EDUCATION". Yet it does say "The unabienable Right to LIFE".
-HECK, if a dog gets in an accident and is suffering he is rushed to help by the authorities and gets free treatment. And the dog has no money and no Constitutional rights even.

Posted by: ElMugroso | October 7, 2008 11:54 PM | Report abuse

Did anyone notice that Senator McCain's breathing was extremely labored as he walked around the stage responding to questions? With no malice or disrespect intended, I must now question his physical ability to lead our nation for four years. As I must now also question his choice of Sarah Palin as running mate

Posted by: treasuresoftheart | October 7, 2008 11:55 PM | Report abuse

The major problem with healthcare is that Americans believe the federal government has a role it should not have, particularly because the Constitution does not detail healthcare as a power of the federal government. True, government has a responsibility to ensure that there are medical standards in place to prevent abuse, malpractice and corruption but this is better left to state governments.

Posted by: eliahs474 | October 7, 2008 11:56 PM | Report abuse

McCain exposed Obama for the pork he cost taxpayers. Three million for an overhead projector? Obama knocked McCain for voting down a pork laden bill. Clearly Obama is not focused too much on eliminating corruption.

.


Posted by: Billw3 | October 7, 2008 11:36 PM

++++++++++++++++++++++++++

That projector was for educational purposes. Better on that than is some CEO's pocket.

Posted by: HemiHead66 | October 7, 2008 11:56 PM | Report abuse

.

fenderguitar3
"Let someone else foot the bill" think about that for a second and tell me if that isn't the attitude that got us in this financial mess in the first place.

Yes it did, and thanks for proving my point. Obama thinks it's a right.


.

Posted by: Billw3 | October 7, 2008 11:56 PM | Report abuse

Notice how those who say McCain won just say "YEAH! HE WON!" with no explanation as to why. McCain supporters acting just like McCain.... We're hearing a lot of the same from both candidates... more finger pointing from McCain and more depth from Obama. There is NO way (especially in this economic crisis) McCain will win. We need REAL change!

Posted by: jtcarebear | October 7, 2008 11:57 PM | Report abuse

To FORMCCAIN:

Interesting that you would consider Senator Obama empty-headed, and amusing that you think he is ahead based on his appearance.

Sarah Palin, while she is not running for president, is hardly an Einstein. She does give great sound bite, though, and hey, how about those gosh darned gams?

Posted by: cheryllyne | October 7, 2008 11:57 PM | Report abuse

Healthcare is something a business owner should provide as a moral responsibility. To make healthcare a right is to force business owners to act justly, rather than making it a free moral choice on their part.

Posted by: APalinFan | October 7, 2008 11:58 PM | Report abuse

"There is NO reason whatsoever why Healthcare can not be like EDUCATION.
-There's BOTH in the USA.
NOW, let me point out that the Constitution DOES NOT even say "The unalienable Right to EDUCATION". Yet it does say "The unabienable Right to LIFE".
-HECK, if a dog gets in an accident and is suffering he is rushed to help by the authorities and gets free treatment. And the dog has no money and no Constitutional rights even.

Posted by: ElMugroso"

Apparently you haven't seen the new graduates coming out of our high schools.

If you think health care is expensive now, wait until it's free.

Posted by: fenderguitar3 | October 7, 2008 11:58 PM | Report abuse

Donald, well stated, I concur

Posted by: mjabs | October 7, 2008 11:58 PM | Report abuse

.

HemiHead66:
"That projector was for educational purposes. Better on that than is some CEO's pocket."

Projectors cost around ten thousand maximum. Whose pocket did the rest of the three million go into?

.


Posted by: Billw3 | October 7, 2008 11:59 PM | Report abuse

I voted yesterday for Obama, had I watched the debate tonight without Biden/Palin being factored into the equation Maybe McCain would have stood a chance. However the young, fresh educated man who has brought together the masses and given us hope got my vote. He's had my vote based on one issue all along, no special interest PAC dollars, and the people responded in kind.

Posted by: grandma4 | October 8, 2008 12:04 AM | Report abuse

cheryllyne - You tell me how I am going to get health Insurance under Obama. I did not hear him say anything about helping people who are without it, he only stated what he will do for the people who have it already through their Companies. You tell me right now because I am very angry! He states that he will fine people who don't purchase it and this is suppose to help a person who doesn't have it to begin with. I have been hearing this for 30 years now, yes 30 years including good ole Bill Clinton, but he didn't do a thing about it either. None of them have!

Posted by: ForMcCain | October 8, 2008 12:05 AM | Report abuse

Apparently you haven't seen the new graduates coming out of our high schools.

If you think health care is expensive now, wait until it's free.

Posted by: fenderguitar3 | October 7, 2008 11:58 PM
=================
I KNOW, for a fact, that the vast majority of USA doctors went to public schools as long as they were there and NONE can claim of not having benefited from PUBLIC funds.
-And so it is for the majority of other professions and trades.
-The same is true of our police forces. The majority is PUBLIC FORCE, yet we also have PRIVATE for those who feel they need beyond that, can and want to afford it.

Posted by: ElMugroso | October 8, 2008 12:09 AM | Report abuse

Youth versus old age, brains versus decay .... Being Bush's puppet equals a long walk back to Arizona. Poor John, maybe he'll remember the number of houses he owns, wonders who holds their Mortgage ?

Posted by: gatorsn09 | October 8, 2008 12:10 AM | Report abuse

Healthcare is NOT a right. The only rights we have are the ones listed in the Constitution and extrapolated through legal decisions.

As a matter of mercy, hospitals do not require payment prior to treatment. The problem is that immigrants and other poor people clog the emergency room for "emergency" treatment of sinus infections, athsma, back pain, etc., knowing they will get treated but not billed. Insurance is expensive because Americans expect access to MRIs, exotic pills and surgeries.... This is on top of massive beurocracies to manage insurance claims, investment in medical research, and generally high wages. If you just walked ito a MDs office and said "I have cash" you'd find his bill was very reasonable. Insurance pays for much more than the good doctor.

Regardless, their is no healthcare line item in the Consitution.

Posted by: Supernaut | October 8, 2008 12:10 AM | Report abuse

IF you missed FOX's special Sunday night at 9:00 on Obama, you need to watch it. There is way too much about Obama we don't know, and his friends and associates worry me. How did he purchase a 1.2 million dollar home?

He spent 2 years in a drug fog during college? his own words........ was this to handle stress, to find himself,....... or just what?
He worked for Acorn.....

bad taste......... like Michelle's silver zipper that was glittering up her back today.............and her panty line........

Posted by: cici3 | October 7, 2008 11:51 PM

++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Don't you know we've covered all of this already? Obama made a lot of money on those books. And I'm not gonna waste my time with the rest. Guilt by association is a waste of time. FOX news is the most corrupt organization I've ever seen. If your smart you'll stay away from those nut-jobs.

Posted by: HemiHead66 | October 8, 2008 12:13 AM | Report abuse

I KNOW, for a fact, that the vast majority of USA doctors went to public schools as long as they were there and NONE can claim of not having benefited from PUBLIC funds.
-And so it is for the majority of other professions and trades.
-The same is true of our police forces. The majority is PUBLIC FORCE, yet we also have PRIVATE for those who feel they need beyond that, can and want to afford it.

If they did so well, explain to me why 3rd world countries' education and health care systems produce better graduates and better doctors.

Public school is a joke, it breeds a standard citizenry and kills originality and dissent.

I hope you like our police forces' new tazers.

Posted by: fenderguitar3 | October 8, 2008 12:14 AM | Report abuse

Regardless, their is no healthcare line item in the Consitution.

Posted by: Supernaut | October 8, 2008 12:10 AM
-----------------
That's because the details of implementation are left to the States.
-Public Education is not in the Constitution specifically, either. Now if EDUCATION is a PUBLIC need, what so more can be said about HEALTH?

Posted by: ElMugroso | October 8, 2008 12:18 AM | Report abuse

So many comments about health care. My husband and I have our own business w/one part time employee. We cannot afford health care for ourselves let alone our employee. Having said that, I wouldn't want what the health care coverage in this country provides. Patients are over medicated with pharmaceutical drugs & unnecessary operations. Patients are offered little or no guidance of how to take care of themselves. I don't know of any health care insurance program including most PPO's that include acupuncture or herbal therapies. Wake up America and stop looking for our government to take care of what ails you. In most (not all) cases people are sick because of what we do and don't put in our bodies. Americans are the fattest in the western hemisphere. It is not the responsibility of our government to keep us healthy it is ours. Stop eating the garbage. take a walk and turn off the TV. We'll all feel and be a lot healthier.

Posted by: 1hyplady | October 8, 2008 12:18 AM | Report abuse

"That's because the details of implementation are left to the States.
-Public Education is not in the Constitution specifically, either. Now if EDUCATION is a PUBLIC need, what so more can be said about HEALTH?"

I hope you know that public education is plank number ten on the communist manifesto.

Posted by: fenderguitar3 | October 8, 2008 12:20 AM | Report abuse

I'm glad Obama got McCain on his Bomb Bomb Bomb Iran speech. McCain got away with it the last time. He also got away with what he said about storing nuclear waste in his state. On that one McCain jumped in so Obama couldn't be heard.

Posted by: HemiHead66 | October 8, 2008 12:24 AM | Report abuse

1hyplady - Very well put! I also own my own business but can't afford Health Insurance. I am healthy like you say and do take care of myself, but what if you or I get cancer, will we be left in a waiting room to die because we don't have health insurance? I would like to see the cost go down so I can afford it.

Posted by: ForMcCain | October 8, 2008 12:25 AM | Report abuse

I hope you know that public education is plank number ten on the communist manifesto.

Posted by: fenderguitar3 | October 8, 2008 12:20 AM
-----------
Looks like you are saying that our having Public Schools is a Communist institution.
-You do realize that needs of human beings COME BEFORE political ideologies?

Posted by: ElMugroso | October 8, 2008 12:25 AM | Report abuse

It took guts to call healthcare a right, Mr. President.

Historically, healthcare is not a human right (except for Canada and most of Europe), and anti-socialism is ubiquitous in America. We allow poverty stricken cancer patients to rot in this country. We let teenagers die of kidney failure because the insurance company calls a kidney transplant "too experimental." We turn seniors out into the streets when they can't pay the nursing home.

It was downright courageous to say--while running for the highest office in the most advanced capitalist republic ever--that the free market will only push those cancer patients, teenagers, and seniors aside in favor of the paying customers. It showed exceptional wisdom to stand up for the most vulnerable and helpless among us.

Thank you, Mr. President, Al Gore.

What? Sorry, Barrack Obama.


Posted by: rckstrdave | October 8, 2008 12:28 AM | Report abuse

Indeed, public schools are a communist institution. At least we have private schools, but hey guess what, those are also regulated by government.

What political ideologies are you talking about? Where did that even come up? If you want to know who I support, I support neither Obama nor McCain. Both don't know a damn thing. I support third parties & non-voters, because it's not like your vote actually counts...electoral college decides.

Posted by: fenderguitar3 | October 8, 2008 12:30 AM | Report abuse

Indeed, public schools are a communist institution. At least we have private schools, but hey guess what, those are also regulated by government.

What political ideologies are you talking about? Where did that even come up? If you want to know who I support, I support neither Obama nor McCain. Both don't know a damn thing. I support third parties & non-voters, because it's not like your vote actually counts...electoral college decides.

Posted by: fenderguitar3 | October 8, 2008 12:30 AM
===============
You brought up the term "Communism" and now you ask "What political ideology? I refer to?"
-And now we are advocating Communism because we have public schools? You know THEY ARE NOT mandatory. Only mandatory for kids to go to school, if you want, to private schools. But education is mandatory for kids because they have the Constitutional right to the pursuit of happiness, and there is no happiness under ignorance. The same is true, if Life is a Right, how can there be Life without Health?
-Who you vote for is your right to chose also. Imagine if voting were only for those who can afford it, which has been tried, by the way.

Posted by: ElMugroso | October 8, 2008 12:39 AM | Report abuse

Guess what, California made home-schooling illegal therefore public & private education are the only options and they are one of the same thing.

Education is not mandatory for kids because they have a Constitutional right to the pursuit of happiness.

Education is mandatory because the state is part owner of your child via your registration of the child through a birth certificate & your marriage license.

Posted by: fenderguitar3 | October 8, 2008 12:45 AM | Report abuse

Guess what, California made home-schooling illegal therefore public & private education are the only options and they are one of the same thing.

Education is not mandatory for kids because they have a Constitutional right to the pursuit of happiness.

Education is mandatory because the state is part owner of your child via your registration of the child through a birth certificate & your marriage license.

Posted by: fenderguitar3 | October 8, 2008 12:45 AM
-----------------------
Well, imagine if a parent had the legal right to issue a phd degree to his son, based on "home education". That could put public at risk who'd require the "graduate's" services.

You state "Education is mandatory because the state is part owner of your child via your registration of the child through a birth certificate & your marriage license." which sounds like a radical or confused thought to me, because if you REALY BELIEVED what you are saying, THEN you ought to agree that the State should take care of the child's health.
-
Anyway, I do wish you geat health. See you.

Posted by: ElMugroso | October 8, 2008 12:53 AM | Report abuse

FOR MCCAIN:

If you go to Obama.com, his healthcare policy is clearly articulated. Even a caveman would understand it.

I would be angry, too, if I needed healthcare and was denied same because of insurance snafus, or lack of coverage. I recently went through a period of unemployment and couldn't afford COBRA to get me through the transition. Fortunately, I remained healthy.

I believe Senator Obama was talking about the health benefits that all Congressional members and their staff enjoy. I think he would consider opening up availability to uninsured through those same healthcare channels.

I can't believe McCain's plan is altogether practical. People would get a $5,000 credit and could shop for their healthcare coverage accordingly. Wouldn't they need the money up front? Wouldn't just as many citizens not bother doing anything at all rather than trying to find a reputable insurer and then try to jump through whatever hoops and loopholes are created by the tax credit? And, AND, wages are taxed before employee deductions? Puhleeeze.

Posted by: cheryllyne | October 8, 2008 12:55 AM | Report abuse

IF you missed FOX's special Sunday night at 9:00 on Obama, you need to watch it. There is way too much about Obama we don't know, and his friends and associates worry me. How did he purchase a 1.2 million dollar home?

He spent 2 years in a drug fog during college? his own words........ was this to handle stress, to find himself,....... or just what?
He worked for Acorn.....

bad taste......... like Michelle's silver zipper that was glittering up her back today.............and her panty line........

Posted by: cici3 | October 7, 2008 11:51 PM

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Here ya go. FOX news asks a diner full of people who their going to vote for. One person raises their hand for McCain, then the reporter says it's about even. Totally biased. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KTkqosRiyYo

Posted by: HemiHead66 | October 8, 2008 12:58 AM | Report abuse

Most home-schooled kids are PhD potential and lately have been excelling when compared to public school kids.

There's nothing radical about it. Marriage licenses were invented after the civil war for couples who wanted to intermarry, as in 2 different races. People have been conditioned to applying for a marriage license. What constitutes a Common Law marriage is concensus of the 2 parties, not concensus of the state.

Once you have the marriage license, everything you and your significant other produce is liable to the state because they are the 3rd party in your marriage and as a result they are part owner of what you two produce: children.

Posted by: fenderguitar3 | October 8, 2008 1:01 AM | Report abuse

I can't believe McCain's plan is altogether practical. People would get a $5,000 credit and could shop for their healthcare coverage accordingly.
---
With McCain plan, the $5000 DOES NOT go to an individual. It goes to an insurance company.
-When individuals can not come up with the difference, the money IS NOT refunded to no one.
-So, eventually, the tax-payer's money is being funneled to PRIVATE companies, which he insists "don't need regulation".

Posted by: ElMugroso | October 8, 2008 1:01 AM | Report abuse

"That One" for President of the UNITED States of America !

Posted by: PulSamsara | October 8, 2008 1:52 AM | Report abuse

It was quite amazing to watch Senator McCain try to take credit for the mortgage portion of the $700 billion bailout that was signed into law last week. Even the Press could not tell immediately that what he claimed was a new proposal during the debate was already part of the bailout package. He is simply straining at straws and the voters must be educated about this being part of the bailout plan before they cast their votes. Another point that needs to be highlighted is his childish behavior when he tried to convince people that Senator Obama voted for an energy bill which he did not support. Frankly, he exhibited the proof that he lacks the temperament to lead this great nation in the era of globalization.

Posted by: eneibi2 | October 8, 2008 4:46 PM | Report abuse

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