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Is Pelosi right on health care and jobs?

Was anyone else struck by House Speaker Nancy Pelosi’s argument in favor of health-care reform at the summit meeting last week? To hear her tell it, it’s all about, well, jobs, jobs, jobs: “In its life,” Pelosi asserted, reform “will create 4 million jobs, 400,000 jobs almost immediately. Jobs, again, in the health-care industry but in the entrepreneurial world as well.” Now that’s a novel view: health-care as economic stimulus! Let’s put Americans to work puncturing one another’s veins and cleaning bedpans.

Actually, though, Pelosi was making a different, more sophisticated, point, even if she did not express it very clearly. To the extent the cost of providing health insurance is a deterrent to hiring, reducing that cost would enable private sector employers to do more hiring -- other things being equal. And, so, if health reform lowered costs, it would boost jobs.

Pelosi’s claim was based on a study by the Center for American Progress, which assigned a notional value of savings to the health-care plans on the table as of early January, and then derived from that a range of 250,000 to 400,000 additional jobs per year over ten years. That’s pretty modest compared to a total labor force of more than 150 million, and even these small numbers probably suffer from the spurious precision inherent to all such estimates -- but the underlying theory is plausible.

In fact, a main reason to worry about health-care costs at all is that the ever-growing share of Gross Domestic Product devoted to health care diverts resources from other productive endeavors. We don’t want the whole country to go the way of General Motors, which went bankrupt largely because its revenues from making autos could no longer fund health benefits for union workers and retirees.

Here’s my problem, though: For Pelosi’s scenario to pan out, health-care reform must actually produce substantial cost savings. And that is more doubtful now that President Obama has offered a version that postpones the strongest cost-containment provision in the Senate bill -- the “Cadillac tax” on high-value insurance plans -- until 2018. That’s like postponing it this long. The president did this largely to appease organized labor and their allies in the House Democratic caucus -- led by Speaker Nancy Pelosi.

By Charles Lane  | March 1, 2010; 3:33 PM ET
Categories:  Lane  | Tags:  Charles Lane  
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Comments

After carefully listening to Nancy Pelosi's comments and statements over th past year is is obvious she has a some serious mental problems.

Posted by: badgerburg | March 1, 2010 4:02 PM | Report abuse


Q - "Is Pelosi right on health care and jobs?"

A - NO! The Democrats socialist plans have been a disaster. Trying more of what failed in the past is not a pathway to success.

Posted by: NormReisig | March 1, 2010 4:03 PM | Report abuse

At least puncturing veins and cleaning bedpans is done by Americans. In the last two years between Medicare and insurance provided as a retired teacher, over $200K has been spent on getting my father from age 93 to age 95 (in another month). There can be a good discussion of whether spending $200K to keep a sick 93 year old going makes sense, but at least all that money has gone to American hospitals, nursing homes, ambulance services, drug companies, makers of medical supplies, etc. Basically none has gone to Chinese makers of toys, clothing, flat screen TVs, car parts, etc.

To cut medical costs three things can happen:

1. Get rid of insurance overhead. That helps some, but has limits.

2. Offshore medical care. It may save money, but that money spent will do nothing to help the American economy.

3. Decide what medical care will be denied, or at least be left to be paid directly by individuals. I think this is what Republicans want, but are afraid to admit publicly, when they talk about smart consumers, etc.

Posted by: jimk8mr | March 1, 2010 4:10 PM | Report abuse

I wouldn't go to my hair dress for legal advise;
I wouldn't go to my clergy for auto mechanical problems;
I wouldn't go my veterinarian for plumbing advise;
so why would I go to Pelosi for health care, dental problems, addictions, and mental health counseling?

Posted by: 45upnorth | March 1, 2010 4:10 PM | Report abuse

I, personally, am continually at a loss to determine what made Mrs. Pelosi the best choice to be Speaker of the House, and the ipso facto voice of the Democratic Party (at least before we had a Democratic POTUS in the White House).

She is intensely divisive, and quite honestly, I see much in her that is reminiscent of George W. Bush in her ability to be "the decider". As she has made the Speaker position more of a road block to votes than any other speaker within recent memory, I find this to be of concern.

I have written my representatives to encourage them to discuss a change in the Speaker in this election year, as the Speaker is a biennial appointment. Mrs. Pelosi is actually a fairly belligerent voice in Congress and she does not speak to most centrists or ever seem to contribute to effective political dialogue that encourages compromise.

I think the Democrats were merely in love with the concept of electing a woman to the Speaker position. With the loss of political support in the recent passing of Representative Murtha, I think now is the time to reconsider who sits in the Speaker's chair and see if Congress can't have someone more generally moderate and reasonable in her place.

Posted by: Chasmosaur1 | March 1, 2010 4:12 PM | Report abuse

TO: 45upnorth who wrote:
“I wouldn't go to my hair dresser for legal advice;
I wouldn't go to my clergy for auto mechanical problems;
I wouldn't go my veterinarian for plumbing advice;
So why would I go to Pelosi for health care, dental problems, addictions, and mental health counseling?”

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

The obvious answer is that Nancy Pelosi is NOT going to be your hair dresser, your mechanic, your plumber or your doctor.

If you don’t know that this is about skyrocketing insurance premiums, well, then that must be why you’re asking that kind of question.

Obviously, your GOP leaders haven’t discussed anything at all with you or any GOP followers because the GOP is too busy taking millions from insurance and drug company lobbyists, and because GOP members are more concerned about their own families and where they’re going to send their children to college (and who’s going to pay for it).

The United States Constitution requires the Government to provide not only for the common defense, but also for the general welfare of the American People.


Posted by: lindalovejones | March 1, 2010 4:28 PM | Report abuse

The right has no interest in the only proven means of significantly lowering health care health care costs - a single payer system. All the rest is window dressing and PR work.

We will have single payer within ten years because it's the only alternative to a system in the process of imploding into a black hole that sucks up every dollar in sight.

Posted by: st50taw | March 1, 2010 4:30 PM | Report abuse


TO: Chasmosaur1 who wrote:
“…I think the Democrats were merely in love with the concept of electing a woman to the Speaker position…”

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

You deserve a hardy har har for that one!

Sarah “The Bimbo” Palin is the GOP’s favorite infatuation.


Posted by: lindalovejones | March 1, 2010 4:35 PM | Report abuse

I am still waiting for President Obama to report on the savings we are receiving from cutting waste and abuse from Medicaire. The government is cutting waste and abuse right now isn't it? Or was that something that won't be done until President Obama, Senator Reid, and Speaker Pelosi get what they want. These three employees of the American people have done such a poor job with this health care debacle that I am concerned whether they are competent enough to handle a National emergency at this point. Their fellow Democrats in Congress are following these Pied Pipers right off a cliff. It is hard to believe that these "smart people" will not begin to understand reality until after the results of the November elections.

Posted by: bobbo2 | March 1, 2010 4:37 PM | Report abuse

Dear5 45upnorth, The Constitution directs the Government to PROMOTE the general welfare. Boy oh Boy were the Founding Fathers smart.

Posted by: bobbo2 | March 1, 2010 4:49 PM | Report abuse

I keep seeing this comment pop up: we are spending a larger and larger portion of GDP on health care, money that is diverted from other productive endeavors. Are we to think if the government steps even further into our healthcare through still another entitlement that somehow no money will be diverted from productive endeavors? That somehow healthcare costs will drop to say 10% of GPD? When has anything our Federal government done been productive? I want well paid doctors and health care workers and fairly paid workers to administer the system, all in the private sector. There is so much rhetoric surrounding the "reform" and so much politics that I do not see how we could trust anything that comes of this, whether it is the promise of jobs, or savings, or lowered costs, or better access.

Posted by: carolina-born | March 1, 2010 4:54 PM | Report abuse

I apologize to 45upnorth, my comment was directed at lindalovejones. The government is directed by the Constitution to PROMOTE the General Welfare. There is a difference. It always amazes me how the Founding Fathers knew when to word something in a special way as to prevent the Government from overreaching.

Posted by: bobbo2 | March 1, 2010 4:55 PM | Report abuse

Pelosi does not have the votes in The House to pass healthcare-everybody on the hill knows this is a fact-Obama's failed administration was tied to it's passage and she did not deliver the vote because it is bad legislation by a not to be trusted Congress-she will be held accountable by Obama and Emanueul-she knows this-it is how the game is played.

Posted by: lappis | March 1, 2010 4:59 PM | Report abuse

Nothing gets the right wing waco's undies more twisted than Pelosi. A woman smarter that they are is too much to take. She will see that a good health care bill will be passed and the republicans will be toast.

Posted by: Bowerguy | March 1, 2010 5:03 PM | Report abuse

Of course lowering, or more realistically slowing the increase of healthcare costs would be a boon for the economy. The problem is that the bill before us only steepens the curve of rising healthcare costs. Lets get one thing straight. This bill is not healthcare reform. It is the creation of a massive new entitlement program with some health insurance reform thrown in. The long term fiscal problems we face as a nation have very little to do with health insurance and everything to do with healthcare. If all the insurance companies magically were willing and able to offer their services for free, we would see a one time drop in premiums, but we would be right back where we were inside of two years thanks to healthcare costs increasing by about 10% per year.

Don't get me wrong, a universal coverage bill is a lofty and praiseworthy goal. But it is most assuredly not healthcare reform. If it comes before healthcare reform we are only digging our hole deeper as a nation. The primary problem is that people have been divorced from the true costs of their healthcare thanks to increasingly generous employer provided health plans with small deductibles, copays, and out of pocket maximums. You still pay for it but the costs are hidden by government tax subsidies and lost wages (you don't miss what you never had). This has prevented the normal price signals from being sent to medical providers that would provide a much lower price ceiling in a less distorted market.

The bill before us only deepens the severe distortions in the healthcare marketplace by adding new government subsidies and vastly expands coverage under the current, self-destructive regimen. If it passes we will probably not see an effort towards actual healthcare reform until we are in much worse shape. The answers are painful now, but they will be much more painful then.

Posted by: jmcdavisum | March 1, 2010 5:26 PM | Report abuse

Obama is trying to spur jobs throughout the country, only to have white supremancists like Jim Bunting, obstructing his every move... If the American people are stupid enough to keep electing @ssholes like Bunting, who want to kill jobs????

Posted by: demtse | March 1, 2010 5:28 PM | Report abuse

Classic case of pay us now, we'll pay you back later. Yes, sometime in the far future, you'll be saving money. Or take Reid's we'll pay for it by cutting waste, which begs the question of why weren't you doing that already.

No, no dollars will ever be saved, and you won't even get healthcare, the dept will become even larger, the dollar will lose value, and all those extra dollars will end up buy less and less.

Posted by: jhtlag1 | March 1, 2010 5:30 PM | Report abuse

Nothing gets the right wing waco's undies more twisted than Pelosi. A woman smarter that they are is too much to take. She will see that a good health care bill will be passed and the republicans will be toast.
-------------------------------------------

Your comment would mean something if Pelosi was actually smart. I like smart women. Clinton seems smart even though I disagree with her ideas. Pelosi on the other hand very rarely makes any sort of sense and always seems over her head. She makes George W. Bush look like an intellectual giant.

Posted by: BradG | March 1, 2010 5:42 PM | Report abuse

Why does WAPO give space to Right-Wing Shills & their media pundits? Is it because they feel they are at their best when all they can accomplish in life is to whine, babble, criticize, and complain.

Nothing good comes from a bunch of people who do nothing but complain and whine 24 hours of the day, 7 days of the week.

Get a Life!

Posted by: lcarter0311 | March 1, 2010 5:43 PM | Report abuse

When you're wasting 20 percent of US GDP on health care to get HALF as much health care at TWICE the price of what Canada pays ... and the Canadians live 10 years longer ...

Yeah, Pelosi is spot on.

We here in the US have more people without health insurance than live in the entire nation of Canada - and they cover EVERY SINGLE CITIZEN.

Stop whining and give America what three-quarters of our American citizens want: single payer national health care, or at least a strong public option.

Posted by: WillSeattle | March 1, 2010 5:43 PM | Report abuse

Obviously, your GOP leaders haven’t discussed anything at all with you or any GOP followers because the GOP is too busy taking millions from insurance and drug company lobbyists, and because GOP members are more concerned about their own families and where they’re going to send their children to college (and who’s going to pay for it).

The United States Constitution requires the Government to provide not only for the common defense, but also for the general welfare of the American People.
Posted by: lindalovejones
-----------
While I am not particularly in love with the Republican party, I am not convinced that bashing Republicans is the right answer to every intelligent question raised by anyone.

As for the part about what the constitution requires, I would love to see exactly where it requires that the government do everything for everyone.

Posted by: rohitcuny | March 1, 2010 5:49 PM | Report abuse

If this was such a good idea, why hasn't it passed yet? Don't say it's the Republicans fault because they didn't have the power to stop it. It's either a bad plan or Zippy is a bad leader if they couldn't pass it with majorities in both houses.

Posted by: theBozyn1 | March 1, 2010 5:58 PM | Report abuse

NormReisig
A - NO! The Democrats socialist plans have been a disaster. Trying more of what failed in the past is not a pathway to success.
___________________________________________

Norm -- glad we know you're against Social Security, the VA and Medicare, but can you tell us when we've tried universal coverage? Seems to me you're the one who wants to keep trying the same failed solutions; hope you didn't get that latest 39% premium increase -- but don't worry, you will if things stay the same. How's that repeating the same thing and expecting a different result workin' out for ya?

Posted by: grclarkdc1 | March 1, 2010 6:00 PM | Report abuse

Atta boy Charlie! You're mentor Gerson is proud of ya!

Bash labor and Democrats and offer nothing positive as an alternative. It's the Haitt way. Maybe someday, if you work real hard, you'll be famous for your right-wing bias just like your Uncle The Reverend Mike!

Posted by: coloradodog | March 1, 2010 6:13 PM | Report abuse

PELOSI IS A FOOL


How many Medicaid forms do Asia and Europe buy?

NONE.

VALUE -- NONE.

When that fool puts HER MONEY at risk in "reform" -- I'll put mine. NOT BEFORE!!!

Posted by: russpoter | March 1, 2010 6:37 PM | Report abuse

The Republicans offer three major proposals to lower healthcare costs. Abolish lawsuits, keep junkies and alcoholics out of the hospitals (they've done it to themselves, and keep illegal aliens out of hospitals--savings over a trillion dollars. So don't say that the conservatives don't off solutions. My girlfriend just got chemo ($120,000) and breast surgery ($40,000) 100% paid for by her HMO. In England, she would have been told that she didn't qualify and would have died in two years. Go to mensunion.org and get the free download "The Hospital Nurse." Learn the facts, real cases, real stories. mensunion.org

Posted by: wolfpack2 | March 1, 2010 6:39 PM | Report abuse

Good Lord, Pelosi is a National Embarrassment!

Posted by: jas7751 | March 1, 2010 6:45 PM | Report abuse

"Is Pelosi right on health care and jobs?"

As soon as you have to ask a question like that, you have to quickly reassess what you're asking.

It's like saying "Do you think the creationists are really right"?

As soon as you ask the question, you realize it's so stupid that you wish you hadn't asked it.

The health care bill will not be a job creator because the way the bill is structured it will raise costs for small businesses which will then favor large companies.

Given that small companies are the economic engine that drives the U.S. (not large companies), this will be a jobs killer like no other.

You add in tax-and-cr*p, and you've set up a condition of uncertainly such that no sane small business will hire more than the bare minimum people.

I keep telling people, you can put all the mandates on business that you want. But you can't force businesses to hire people, and you can't force them to keep people if they think it's too expensive to keep them.

So if you think Pelosi is making any sort of sophisticated analysis, then that's mainly a reflection of either wishful thinking or too much alcohol.

Posted by: Ombudsman1 | March 1, 2010 7:02 PM | Report abuse

If you want to see where Obama’s going, you have to watch this Brand New, Viral

OBAMACARE - YEAR IN REVIEW video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Rv7aW3NF7w

This Hilarious and Shocking Video provides a Fast-Paced Look at the No-Lie-Too-Big, Socialist Ideologues Who Now Run Our Country.

MUST WATCH! 

Posted by: CommieBlaster | March 1, 2010 7:06 PM | Report abuse

After carefully listening to Nancy Pelosi's comments and statements over th past year is is obvious she has a some serious mental problems.
____________________________

You've got that right. Americans everywhere will celebrates when the worst speaker of the House in decades if not longer, takes her final broom ride back to San Fransicko.

Posted by: Maxim49 | March 1, 2010 7:08 PM | Report abuse

Q - "Is Pelosi right on health care and jobs?"

A - NO! The Democrats socialist plans have been a disaster. Trying more of what failed in the past is not a pathway to success.

Posted by: NormReisig | March 1, 2010 4:03 PM | Report abuse

#######################################

What "socialist plan" has failed in the past?

Medicare works very well and is far more cost effective than private insurance. Social Security? That works also - its problems arise from politicians raiding the surpluses.

The truth is that the current is failing and conservatives are blocking any real attempts to fix it.

Posted by: maggots | March 1, 2010 7:13 PM | Report abuse

There will be jobs alright. They estimate 111 new government bureaucracies will be needed to implement this monstrosity. If you think Medicare is filled with graft and corruption, and the left hand doesn't know what the right hand is doing with America's security - wait for this horrific debacle.

Posted by: inmanorj | March 1, 2010 7:19 PM | Report abuse

The healthcare system isn't "Broke", that is, it isn't "Broken". Although [ just like SS ] the Medicare segment is close to being "broke".

The US still has the best medical treatment and facilities and accessibility in the world.

The system has some flaws, but that doesn't mean it is "broken". It means that it needs a "tune-up", to fix what isn't working.

The govt. IS NOT the place to go when you want a "tune-up". Too much garbage in the bureaucracy, and to much corruption feeding the garbage, e.g., Frank, Dodds, Pelosi, Reid, Rangel, Jefferson, & on & on & on ...

To FIX healthcare, begin with tort reform. Get the corrupt ABA & trial lawyers out of the game, then address regulations that prohibit insurance companies from competing across state lines. You will not be disappointed when you learn that the free market [and not govt. socialized medicine] will produce positive results.

The public [ by 62% + ] doesn't want Obamacare, federally funded abortion, free healthcare for illegal aliens ("undocumented immigrants"), public option, fines for non-participation, etc., etc., etc.

Is Pelosi right on healthcare?

Do pigs fly? (with or without lipstick, Mr. President? )

Posted by: esquire2 | March 1, 2010 7:37 PM | Report abuse

Pelosi is dellusional. The Botox must be effecting her brain! Why would anyone quote anything from an organization backed by Soros?

Posted by: Jimbo77 | March 1, 2010 7:46 PM | Report abuse

It is very obvious she has some serious mental problems and should be removed from her position along with many others.

Posted by: drdavisdr | March 1, 2010 7:49 PM | Report abuse

In effect, this whole healthcare initiative is rotten to the core. This vacuous dominatrix of the House can't sell this legislation to the majority of Americans based on its own merit. So sell it based on one of the country's two main worries, unemployment.

She has no idea what this healthcare bill will produce. In 1970, the House Ways and Means Committee, absent a CBO projected the then new Medicare's 1990 expenses to be $12 billion. Twenty years later when 1990 arrived, Medicare spent nine times the forecast amount, or $110 billion.

No doubt they created a few jobs along the way as they proceeded to break the bank. And the taxpayer pays and pays. Twenty years from now the matron of the girly boy San Francisco area won't be around to savor the fruits of her destruction, but our children and grandchildren will be desperately clawing their way to the surface while being sucked down by the quicksand of government debt.

Medicare will tap its trust fund in less than five years, meaning it no longer will be self supporting and the United States general fund will have to begin paying back the money it has borrowed from Medicare over the last 35 years. Social Security will follow closely behind in time.

Deeper and deeper we sink.

Posted by: bbwk80a1 | March 1, 2010 7:54 PM | Report abuse

Q - "Is Pelosi right on health care and jobs?"

A - NO! The Democrats socialist plans have been a disaster. Trying more of what failed in the past is not a pathway to success.

Posted by: NormReisig | March 1, 2010 4:03 PM | Report abuse

#######################################

What "socialist plan" has failed in the past?

Medicare works very well and is far more cost effective than private insurance.
________________________

What?
Medicare,
*living off of IOUs

*NO reimbursement rate increase in over 10 years, some doctors no longer take Medicare patients or limit the number of Medicare patients, is SUBSIDIZED BY PRIVATE CARE PREMIUMS

*20% waste and fraud rate

* Obama will cut a half trillion dollars from Medicare when more baby boomers will just start to enroll...can you say RATIONING.

*given the above, Democrats wanted to reduce the age of enrollment to 55....can you say RATIONING ON STEROIDS...


Obama/Pelosi/Reid/Democrats all are Crap on Steroids...

Government in business is bad government and bad business...

Posted by: Maxim49 | March 1, 2010 7:59 PM | Report abuse

Come on, Charles. A little disclosure is in order. You were an editor at the proudly liberal New Republic, and failed to note that the Center American Progress, whose analysis is cited with a straight face, is a decidedly left-wing organization.

Once the hidden biases are exposed, Nancy Pelosi's arguments about a government takeover of 17% of the economy as a jobs bill doesn't seem so rational.

Posted by: mandog | March 1, 2010 8:10 PM | Report abuse

"Now that’s a novel view: health-care as economic stimulus! "

Only to a right wing know-nothing like Lane is this a new idea. I've heard economists commenting on increasing health care coverage to more Americans as an economic stimulus. And it does make some sense, in a way being a win-win. Sure, like any stimulus it costs money, but putting it into something that makes Americans healthier - and thereby more productive - makes sense.

Which is why Republicans will oppose it on principle. Anything that helps the country hurts the GOP right now, and they know it.

Posted by: B2O2 | March 1, 2010 8:13 PM | Report abuse

Yes she is right. The little brownshirt groups who can only echo their propaganda masters cry "socialism" and other words they have no clue about. If anything, the bill does not go far enough, having gone through too many 'compromises' to please irrational people from the opposition party.

Posted by: revbookburn | March 1, 2010 8:13 PM | Report abuse

Once Pelosi, Obama and Reid pass the health care bill our country will go broke. No more newspapers, no new cars, no new homes, no new clothes. Everyone will be on government run health care and on welfare. We'll be another Russia. Say goodbye to capitalism.

Posted by: 45upnorth | March 1, 2010 8:18 PM | Report abuse

"In England, she would have been told that she didn't qualify and would have died in two years."

This is worse than utter nonsense. It is a lie. I have lived in England and people get the health care they need. This is similar to the idiot who said Stephen Hawking would be dead if he lived in England.

People in England live longer. They live longer after reaching age 60. Their babies don't die as frequently. And so on.

They have good health care for ALL their people and they do it for an average cost per person of $2,992. Our average cost per person is $7,290.
But we have insurance executives who retire with a $1.5 Billion retirement plan.

Posted by: lensch | March 1, 2010 8:24 PM | Report abuse

Pelosi is right on this one. There is no political will in either Party to give America a Public Plan, the only short-term solution out of this mess; although already a privileged group of no less than 180 million citizens and illegals enjoy tax-payer subsidized Government Health coverage-while the rest of the minority of insured Americans pay for it, plus their own Plan. So most of America is now in a Public Plan and no one in this Privileged group has wanted out of it.

But even though this bill lacks the Public Plan, the Democrats have to pass it because the consequences of not passing anything at all woul be a total cave-in to the intimidation of the obstructionist Republican Party and they would come out looking like irresponsible cowards to the Democrats and Independents that voted them in.
And even an imperfect bill is better than the present system, given that the people now paying for the majority are suffering rapidly escalating premiums and the screaming is already beginning.

Posted by: lionelroger | March 1, 2010 8:26 PM | Report abuse

What's truly sad is that the one thing Americans most wanted--lower healthcare costs--is not even on the table.
I feel robbed. I feel violated. I feel that I've been rolled by bribe-taking politicians and their industry friends.
This is not right. And it's getting to the very basic core of who we are, and what it is we stand for.
At some point we will see that a destiny realized, is a destiny earned.
Now let's get to work.

Posted by: mtpeaks | March 1, 2010 8:35 PM | Report abuse

I looked at mensunion.org. It is filled with wacky conspiracy theories. I wonder if the author lives in Idaho in a tent with 74 automatic weapons.

Almost every sentence is wrong. For example, he says, "To fund government entitlements, $7 trillion dollars a year must be taxed away from the private sector worker and businesses."
This is a little hard to do since the total amount of ALL taxes in the US is about $4 TRILLION.

Posted by: lensch | March 1, 2010 8:35 PM | Report abuse

No...of course she's not right.

Those 400k jobs, if they materialize at all, will be gub'mint jobs. They create no wealth. They just suck taxpayer money in and spread it around. They are just one more self-licking ice cream cone...to the tune of trillions...of our money...those of us who don't yet work for the gub'mint. I would rather see insurance agents making money. I would rather see insurance companies making money. I would rather see hospitals making money. With competition there's an impetus to put out a quality product...not so with un-fireable gub'mint workers who will ultimately, invariably, and relentlessly spiral into mediocrity...just like all other US gub'mint organizations with the exception of our military folks who still insist on and instill discipline and demand excellence.

And all that is why Nancy and her Democrat cronies need to be unelected in 2010...all of them.

Posted by: PanhandleWilly | March 1, 2010 8:52 PM | Report abuse

Decoupling health care from employers will be the best thing that ever happened to American workers. I'm amazed that this aspect of the entire issue is so ignored. When workers are not chained to their employers, they will be able to consult, demand higher wages, and employers will be able to divert the money they used to spend on health benefits to meeting those demands.

Idiot Americans for being against this reform! Idiots!

Posted by: GeorgHerbet | March 1, 2010 9:04 PM | Report abuse

In addition to what badgerburg said.She in highly unethical and a liar.

Posted by: Imarkex | March 1, 2010 9:18 PM | Report abuse

If you take a few steps back from day-trading in this debate, it's become like a group of well-to-do people encountering a man in a ditch in the final stages of death by starvation, arguing over whether or not it would save them money in the long run to give him a crust of bread.

Posted by: douglaslbarber | March 1, 2010 9:23 PM | Report abuse

Now, at the count of three from mother Nancy, all you House Democrats fall on your swords!!

Posted by: bbwk80a1 | March 1, 2010 10:06 PM | Report abuse

Nothing gets the right wing waco's undies more twisted than Pelosi. A woman smarter that they are is too much to take. She will see that a good health care bill will be passed and the republicans will be toast.

Posted by: Bowerguy |
***********
The only way Pelosi will see a good healthcare bill passed is watching it on television after she's deposed. This woman is seriously delusional and carrying legions of Democrats into the burning pyre with her.

Posted by: SavingGrace | March 1, 2010 10:16 PM | Report abuse

The only thing that democrats and republicans have agreed on in recent memory was in 2008 when by everyone's estimation the financial system was in free fall and without government intervention the economy would collapse. I suppose that's the republican definition of a successful administration. It's hard to tell as they don't like to talk about it very much. They do love to talk about President Obama's "failed" administration though. They are consistently sure of themselves, their policies never change and they do like to use words like "idiots", "socialists" and a host of other pejoratives to describe the President and democratic leaders in congress. Americans might want to be a little circumspect of Congressional republicans who were first in lock step support of the administration that actually did fail and are now in lockstep opposition to a democratic administration charged with cleaning up the mess that they want to treat as a "cleanup on aisle nine" incident. Tell me again which party thinks the American people are stupid.

Posted by: tm13 | March 1, 2010 10:32 PM | Report abuse

Something has to be done. The USA cannot continue to spend so much on health care without destroying our economy. Just looking at other industrialized nations, it seems that single-payer is cheaper. Somehow we've got to cut national health care costs. I think it was fair for President Obama to give the GOP one last chance to participate. Since they have refused again, I think it is fair for him to proceed with what almost everyone knows has to be done to save our economy.

Why is it so hard for some to see that a single payer system would save the most? Administrative costs would plummet -- one set of paperwork. No need to advertise, come up with dozens of plans, etc. No profit motive to skew decisions about care. No need to wade through plans that might or might not work for a given family. No dependence on employers. (The time for employer-provided plans ended when we changed our working culture to one that encourages frequent job change and lots of moving around the country.)

Whatever else happens, I hope we see intense polling on just how many of us are aching for a single-payer plan or at the very least a public option. At least try expanding the Medicare age range, give it a try.

Posted by: shadowmagician | March 1, 2010 10:41 PM | Report abuse

Botox Denial Stretched faced San Fran Granny Nan is STILL a Liar !!!

She just hopes WE forgot about the CIA briefings LIE !!!

BTW: She's a Professional Politician !!! She lies for a living !!!

Posted by: thgirbla | March 1, 2010 10:50 PM | Report abuse

I notice a lot of conservative posters referring to Nancy Pelosi's "socialist agenda" for health care.

I encourage any such conservative to take a walk down te streets of Vancouver, Toronto, Montreal, or any other Canadian city. Then ask yourself, does this LOOK like a society wilting under the evil, oppressive, and dark forces of "socialist" health care?

The rather obvious truth is that Canadians live longer than Americans, are healthier than Americans, and have a higher average household net worth than Americans. All indisputable facts. Candadian cities are safer, cleaner, and have completely escaped the ravages of collapsed banks, and mile after mile of foreclosed homes. Oh and by the way, Canadians only pay about 60 cents for every health care dollar we spend, and yet they live an amazing three years longer on average.

How dare that evil Nancy Pelosi unleash this evil health care plot on us! As one of you genius tea baggers proclaimed at one of your rallies, "it's like a plot out of Nazi Germany!"

Chuckleheads.

Posted by: SkyBeaver | March 1, 2010 10:52 PM | Report abuse

You can fool all the people some of the time, and some of the people all the time, but you cannot fool all the people all the time.
Abraham Lincoln

Posted by: thgirbla | March 1, 2010 11:03 PM | Report abuse

dummy4peace wrote:
If Democrats give up now, it will take them decades to return to the majority.

------------------------------------------

Now that Americans see the dems for what they really are...they are screwed if it passes or not.

The once noble party of JFK has been hi-jacked. This ain't Mom and Dads Democrat party.

Posted by: Straightline | March 1, 2010 11:13 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: thgirbla
Botox Denial Stretched faced San Fran Granny Nan is STILL a Liar !!!

//
Your use of caps and punctuation is most convincing. A cruel democrat, willing to play your game might ask "Are you the one who through acid in John McCain's face?". But that wouldn't be very nice - would it? Oh well, we'll just have to put it down to a republican being a republican.

Posted by: tm13 | March 1, 2010 11:17 PM | Report abuse

Pardon my phonetic spelling - I meant "threw" - so please put the acid bottle back in your purse.

Posted by: tm13 | March 1, 2010 11:19 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: Straightline:
Now that Americans see the dems for what they really are...they are screwed if it passes or not.

The once noble party of JFK has been hi-jacked. This ain't Mom and Dads Democrat party.

//
You're too kind, really. We democrats are quite accustomed to having republicans oppose every bit of social progress that this country has made since Abraham Lincoln. Pity the poor man if he were alive today. To return the favor I'll admit that Dwight D. Eisenhower was also an honorable man and American hero. Of course yours is not the party of either Lincoln or Eisenhower, neither of whom could even come close to passing the Limbaugh/Palin test.

Posted by: tm13 | March 1, 2010 11:38 PM | Report abuse

The State of California has a $20 billion deficit to face, beginning in July. Counties did not get their share of sales tax revenues as the State is far under water. It looks like at least a million hard-core unemployed, who won't stand for it. So they won't be able to buy insurance and could be fined. They won't be able to pay the fines, so jail/prison is the next stop. California has been ordered to release 40,000 prisoners early to help with overcrowding. So, California will need many billion$ to build and staff jails for the million+ who could be sent to jail. So, if someone will respond and tell how California can avoid a major train wreck, I'll be checking my computer.

Posted by: hurleyvision | March 1, 2010 11:52 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: hurleyvision
//
Support CA Senate Bill 810 - Single Payer Universal Health Care.

http://tinyurl.com/ydk3fgp

Posted by: tm13 | March 2, 2010 12:09 AM | Report abuse

Yes, she is right. Health Care is a right and most western nations realize this. Insurance companies will raise your rates again and again. Is that right? I for one stand with her and I hope the Dems have the courage to do what is right. During the last adm. gross swelling of the deficit happened and yet you were strangely quiet.

I pray that you do not get cancer or lose your health care due to losing your job. I pray you never have to hear that your cancer is progressed beyond the stage where you can be cured due to lack of insurance. It happened in my family. I am sad to see so many thinking it is just fine for America to fund two wars that are killing thousands but fail to feel that funding programs to promote life are important

What have we become as a nation to be so jaded as to not hear the cry of those who die each day when lives could be saved and money saved over the next decade.

Posted by: patisok | March 2, 2010 1:40 AM | Report abuse

There is a difference between lowering costs and making HC policies more affordable for small business. Just creating larger pools for small businesses so they could enjoy the same costs as large corps would be a step in the right direction. This would enable the company I work for to be more profitable and hire in the future.

Posted by: Falmouth1 | March 2, 2010 5:24 AM | Report abuse

The right has no interest in the only proven means of significantly lowering health care health care costs - a single payer system. All the rest is window dressing and PR work.

We will have single payer within ten years because it's the only alternative to a system in the process of imploding into a black hole that sucks up every dollar in sight.

Posted by: st50taw | March 1, 2010 4:30 PM
++++++++++++++++++++++++++

If all you advocates of the single payer system would learn how the current single payer system (MEDICARE) works, you wouldn't be so excited to climb on board.
Yes you have BASIC coverage, nothing more! There are severe limits to what care you receive and the process you must go through to receive it.

There are a lot of doctors across the country who are NOT accepting any new medicare patients, due in part to the work load, but mostly because the government does not pay enough for the services rendered. 30 Million new patients at reduced costs will not alleviate that problem.

In case no one has informed you, the current medicare system which is supposed to be self funding has been raped so bad by our politicians, both parties, that it is going broke. 30 Million new clients will not alleviate that problem.

Why? if this system is so desperately needed now to help the economy and stimulate jobs, does it not take effect until 2014. However, taxes will be raised commencing in 2011.

You want anything beyond the basic coverage you pay for it yourself.

Posted by: frankn1 | March 2, 2010 5:33 AM | Report abuse

Dear socialist friends. The only thing you "create" when you forcefully take money from one group of people, and give it to your pals, is resentment. Not jobs. Count me with the crowd that thinks Pelosi is nuts; she's panting some insane remark almost daily. BTW- a bit off topic, but aren't there any Democrats in the House itching to take the leadership role away and standup to the White House?

Posted by: JohnnyGee | March 2, 2010 6:36 AM | Report abuse

To NormReisig:
Your comment that the so-called socialist plans in existence are failures reveals that you are totally ignorant of the history of your own country. It's also obvious that you have absolutely no idea what a socialist is. Better to stick to whatever it is you know, whatever that might be.

Posted by: rbe1 | March 2, 2010 6:46 AM | Report abuse

Badgerburg ~ it's not just mental illness, Pelosi sounds like she has BRAIN DAMAGE.

Like so many Democrats in recent years (Joe Biden and Teddy Kennedy spring to mind in fact) she probably needs brain surgery and fast.

I have no idea why Democrats are so attracted to the dangerous chemicals and practices that do this to them, but they are.

Posted by: muawiyah | March 2, 2010 7:00 AM | Report abuse

patisok ~ hmmm, are we arguing health insurance or health care?

There is a real difference.

In America, unlike France (for example) you can get medical treatment even if you don't have health insurance.

Might well ask you when France ceased being a Western nation, but I won't since that would sound so condescending.

So, I'll ask you ~ when did Poland cease being a Western nation? They have equally stringent requirements.

Posted by: muawiyah | March 2, 2010 7:03 AM | Report abuse

We've heard all the promnises from Hussein Soetero OBama and Pelosi. Jobs !! Shovel Ready JObs..hurry pass this legisltaiton = its an emergency - we MUST do it NOWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW or unemployment will go above 8 percent. REAL unemployment -and not the figures that Obama cooks- is probably at 11-15 percent. Where r the jobs ?? HUHHHHHHHH ??? Its laughable that they now want us to believe that we will be able to keep our own healthcare plans and there wont be rationing.... yea sure..wahtever you nimrods say ..uh huh...sure...yes you can..change and hope...rainbows and lucky charms....whats next ? Stimulus checks finally do arrive ?? Dont count on it...

Posted by: JUNGLEJIM123 | March 2, 2010 7:09 AM | Report abuse

You have to hand it to Fox News for having done a very effective job of demonizing Nancy Pelosi (and Harry Reid) in the minds of its viewers, most of whom could not actually point to anything in particular that she has done or not done to justify such demonization. But they've been told that she is evil, and have been shown mug shots of her that make her look evil, and that's all it takes: voila, they are now all 100% convinced that she is evil, and they obediently spend their days posting comments on WaPo blog threads declaring how evil she is. (And how Obama is a Marxist and the health care plan is a socialist takeover of health care, and on and on and on.)

So much for the educated populace that is essential to a functioning democracy. God help us all.

Posted by: herzliebster | March 2, 2010 7:11 AM | Report abuse

Another Nancy Pelosi article?

Another chance to tell her she's a traitor asking for a trip to the gallows.

Just keep pushing Obamacare, Nancy - the people aren't stupid.
---
http://www.wasillateleprompter.com/2010/02/sarah-on-the-summit.html

Posted by: michaelniland | March 2, 2010 7:15 AM | Report abuse

One major way the Democrats have screwed up health insurance reform legislation is by repeatedly trotting out new justifications for it. Cost savings. Health care "is" the reason for the federal deficit. Need to reduce share of GDP. Now, jobs, jobs, jobs. Result: No one can trust them. The ends are all different and supposedly justify the means -- a big ol' health insurance overhaul.

Posted by: DnMn | March 2, 2010 7:38 AM | Report abuse

STILL IN THE LONG RUN WHO IS GOING TO PAY FOR IT...?

I DON'T WANT TO PAY FOR SOMEONE WHO REFUSES TO AT LEAST "PREVENT" ILL HEALTH FOR EXAMPLE... BY NOT SMOKING OR DRINKING TO EXCESS... CAUSING THEIR OWN HEALTH PROBLEMS...GENETIC PROBLEMS CANNOT BE HELPED & WHILE IT MAY SEEM COLD... HOW IS THAT STILL "MY-AMERICA'S" PROBLEM?

I DON'T HAVE CHILDREN BECAUSE I CAN'T AFFORD THEM, BUT IT SEEMS FOLKS ON WELFARE HAVE NO PROBLEM AFFORDING THEM, WITH OTHER PEOPLES MONEY & THAT MEANS MEDICAL TOO... SO MAYBE IF WE STOP HANDING BENEFITS OVER ON A SILVER PLATTER AND PUT THEM TO WORK, THEY WON'T HAVE TIME TO BE LAZY & UNDERSTAND HOW HARD THE REST OF US HAVE TO WORK FOR WHAT LITTLE WE HAVE... WHILE THEY -WELFARE & HANDOUT RECIPIENTS REAP THE BENEFITS

DIDN'T ROME LEARN HOW A LAZY SOCIETY FULL OF "LET'S HAVE A GREAT DAY" REALIZE THAT THE "FEW" CAN ONLY SUPPORT THE MANY FOR SO LONG... WE ARE NOT AN EMPIRE... WE ARE A REPUBLIC... LET'S GET BACK TO ACTING LIKE IT...

Posted by: NATURLUS | March 2, 2010 7:45 AM | Report abuse

Let's see Dem in the White House both houses of Congress have a Dem majority and they can't stop the wars which Pelosi claims to be against? And now we are to trust her on health care? Yeah right!

Posted by: FLvet | March 2, 2010 7:59 AM | Report abuse

To frakn1 - Obviuosly you are not on Medicare. I am 71 years old and have had 11 different private health insurance plans. ALL of them restricted my freedom. ALL of them restricted my choice of physician. ALL of them interfered with my physician's choice of treatment. Now I have Medicare. I have complete freedom to choose my doctors; I have never been turned down. Medicare never comes between my physician and me. I would never, never go back to what I had before Medicare.

The cost of Medicare is going up at a much slower rate than private insurance. Paul Krugman has computed that if private insurance had gone up at the same rate as Medicare for the last 20 years, our premiums would be a THIRD lower.

Other industrialized countries with single payer systems get better health care as measured by all 16 bottom line public health statistics and they do it at HALF the cost (website of OEDC). It our system were as efficient as theirs, we would save about $1.3 TRILLION each and every year.

Posted by: lensch | March 2, 2010 8:08 AM | Report abuse

Pelosi has never been right. End of story. She is without doubt the worst Speaker of the House in the history of Congress.

Posted by: youngm1 | March 2, 2010 8:15 AM | Report abuse

Pelosi is all about rhetoric for the uninformed. I think it's time that one senator from each state is elected by the OTHER 49 states. That way, lulus like Pelosi are cancelled out.

Posted by: primegrop | March 2, 2010 8:21 AM | Report abuse

I am still waiting for President Obama to report on the savings we are receiving from cutting waste and abuse from Medicaire. The government is cutting waste and abuse right now isn't it?
=====================================================================================
It would be if the Republicans wouldn't block and filibuster every effort to do anything. There are items that would reduce waste in Medicare that the Republicans suggested in the Health Care bill that the Republicans won't vote for. Where's the logic in that? You can blame Pelosi all you want, but we all know who is causing the deadlock.

Posted by: rlritt | March 2, 2010 8:22 AM | Report abuse

Pelosi has never been right !

Name one issue, that she(pelosi) has ever been right about ?

Posted by: dashriprock | March 2, 2010 8:26 AM | Report abuse

Pelosi hasn't been right ever since she held the House's gavel aloft in her right hand since assuming the role of Speaker of the House.

Posted by: maldelus | March 2, 2010 8:29 AM | Report abuse

There is nothing in these bills about lowering cost, and to add 250-400 thousand more jobs requires someone to pay for them over the long haul.

These bills are deceptive in talking about lowering costs. They simply transfer the cost to new taxes and fees, which permeate these bills.

Ms. Pelosi and most of her colleagues are so set in doing things the way they have for so long that they cannot see any real answers to these problems, because they are too tied to the various special interest groups, who have pulled their strings for too long.

What should have happened is that both parties should have sat down, looked at the text of the two bills, decided what they could both agree with, and then rewrote one bill that takes in all those things that both can find agreement on. Then pass it. Then debate the elements they cannot agree on. The only thing the bill absolutely must have is a basic health plan for everyone, including those with prior conditions. Everything else is secondary!

Posted by: Tawodi | March 2, 2010 8:42 AM | Report abuse

You nitwit libs still don't get it. Pelosi has no clue about anything in the real world. She needs to sit down and shut up!!
Mr Lane, your analysis misses the entire fundamental reason that health care costs are out of control. You and all the rest of the stupid idiots in Washington will never admit it or address it.
Market forces have been all but destroyed, by the very government intervention that all you boneheads advocate. And you all want single-payer???.. There is NO incentive NOW for any attention to cost at any level, especially for the consumer. Until that begins to sink into the thick skulls inside the Beltway, there is no tax, or other alleged "cost-cutting" scheme that will improve anything. What BHO, Pelosi, Reid, and the rest of those socialist scum want is CONTROL. This has been the their wet dream since FDR. They don't care if you live or die, as long as they have control, period.

Posted by: Shrimper | March 2, 2010 9:07 AM | Report abuse

....The president did this largely to appease organized labor and their allies in the House Democratic caucus -- led by Speaker Nancy Pelosi....

When this President does something is NOT to appease organized labor and their allies in the House Democratic caucus, put it on the Front Page.

That would be news!

Posted by: TECWRITE | March 2, 2010 9:09 AM | Report abuse

In all of Pelosi's career she hasn't been correct about one thing. Now her mind is failing (difficult to tell given her lack of intellect) and she is becoming even more of a dotard.

Posted by: staterighter | March 2, 2010 9:12 AM | Report abuse

"Name one issue, that she(pelosi) has ever been right about?"

Opposing Dubya's attempt to gut Social Security.

Also, do you agree she was wrong to tell House Democrats that impeachment of Bush was "off the table"? Please tell me you think Nancy was wrong and Bush should have been impeached!

Do you think she's wrong about wanting to keep travel restrictions to Cuba in place? Do tell!

Posted by: hitpoints | March 2, 2010 9:13 AM | Report abuse

I think it is time to put down the canard of "Cadillac" health insurance. These "lavish" insurance were obtained by working people after hard bargaining in exchange for reducing wage increases. By all means tax them if you must but then raise the wages of the workers to cover the tax. The ones affected by the tax on "Cadillac" insurance are people earning middle class incomes, not management types earning $200,000 or more.
Why is it that increasing the tax burden on high incomes is fought fiercely by the GOP but they have no qualms about indirectly increasing taxes on lower income people?

Posted by: serban1 | March 2, 2010 9:41 AM | Report abuse

This is a cheap shot at the Democratic plan, so typical of the Washington Post these days. Go back and look at the scoring by the Commonwealth Fund, which remains the best independent analysis of health care plans. In every case, the strong public option lowers costs; Republican approaches of nibbling around the edges with subsidies raise costs. Pelosi has fought hard for the public option. And the plan we now have modestly lowers costs -- failing to reach the full benefit of a public option because of how much the plan has been watered down to appease conservatives. Sure, delaying the excise tax is a problem in terms of cost control, but so is avoiding a public option. And if the public option had been left in there in all its original glory, I don't think people would have been fighting to delay the excise tax.

Posted by: dblissmn | March 2, 2010 9:47 AM | Report abuse

Certainly we need some method of covering the uninsured and at the same time reducing costs or at least restraining the growth of costs. It is difficult for most people to imagine how that might work. I think that the President should present a detailed breakdown of the often quoted $7900 per capita cost of healthcare i.e. payments to doctors, payments to hospitals, payments to diagnostic testing labs, payments for pharmaceuticals, payments for supplies, the net of insurance premiums and insurance company payments on behalf of their insureds etc. Then show, category by category, how his plan will reduce or restrain the growth of these costs. Doing this on a per capita basis rather than presenting the eye-glazing total costs should be more meaningful to the average person and might get the public more on board with the plan. They are not on board now.

Posted by: ednorman | March 2, 2010 10:03 AM | Report abuse

Of course she's right. She's ALWAYS right. Just ask CHARLIE RANGEL. He'll tell ya. She's gonna DRAIN THE SWAMP. She's gonna RUN THE MOST ETHICAL CONGRESS EVER. She told the truth about that. Didn't she? Go ask CHARLIE RANGEL. She would NEVER LIE. Cause Liberals never lie. Adding 30 MILLION people to the rolls, and only raising taxes on the RICH, is gonna make HEALTH CARE CHEAPER. (Especially if you're in a UNION)
I believe her. I mean, when has the Governments' COST NUMBERS ever been WRONG?
See how STUPID they think we are? Especially this STUPID BEECH.

Posted by: GoomyGommy | March 2, 2010 10:04 AM | Report abuse

Of course she's right. She's ALWAYS right. Just ask CHARLIE RANGEL. He'll tell ya. She's gonna DRAIN THE SWAMP. She's gonna RUN THE MOST ETHICAL CONGRESS EVER. She told the truth about that. Didn't she? Go ask CHARLIE RANGEL. She would NEVER LIE. Cause Liberals never lie. Adding 30 MILLION people to the rolls, and only raising taxes on the RICH, is gonna make HEALTH CARE CHEAPER. (Especially if you're in a UNION)
I believe her. I mean, when has the Governments' COST NUMBERS ever been WRONG?
See how STUPID they think we are? Especially this STUPID BEECH.

Posted by: GoomyGommy | March 2, 2010 10:06 AM | Report abuse

"You have to hand it to Fox News for having done a very effective job of demonizing Nancy Pelosi (and Harry Reid) in the minds of its viewers, most of whom could not actually point to anything in particular that she has done or not done to justify such demonization. But they've been told that she is evil, and have been shown mug shots of her that make her look evil, and that's all it takes: voila, they are now all 100% convinced that she is evil, and they obediently spend their days posting comments on WaPo blog threads declaring how evil she is. (And how Obama is a Marxist and the health care plan is a socialist takeover of health care, and on and on and on.)"

HAHAHA HAHA MMM MMM MM

Fox News was the only network to show all the pork in that stimulus bill and to predict that it would do NOTHING to stop unemployment from rising !! There have been many instances of Pelosi and her lunacy- you must be watching MSNBC and CNN too much -those sugary sweet Obama /Pelosi stories 24/7 have warped your brain. Pelosi abuses her powers with her newly acquired jet that she uses to fly everywhere on personal matters at our expense. She REFUSED to have Bush impeached..she has called hard working middle class Americans NAZI's and red necks and astroturf... she inserted a massive amount in the stimulus for her husbands holdings in Samoa...she refuses to have criminal illegal aliens deported...the list is endless..wake up and stop watching Olbermann so much or you risk further mental illness..

Posted by: JUNGLEJIM123 | March 2, 2010 10:15 AM | Report abuse

"We don’t want the whole country to go the way of General Motors, which went bankrupt largely because its revenues from making autos could no longer fund health benefits for union workers and retirees."
Mr. Lane has come up with a third rationals for health care reform. Volkswagen didn't go bankrupt. FIAT is so prosperous it could afford to buy Chrysler. In part this is because the cost of health care and retirement is spread over the whole society.

@PanhandleWilly: "Those 400k jobs, if they materialize at all, will be gub'mint jobs. They create no wealth. They just suck taxpayer money in and spread it around."
What you're telling me is that a nurse who work for a profit-making institution produces something of value, but a nurse who does the same work for the VA produces nothing. This is absurd. Some conservatives have come to believe that government produces nothing of any utility. yet they drink their pasteurized milk, eat their government-inspected meat, drive on the public roads, and, like Glenn Beck, read in the public library.

Posted by: sjpatejak | March 2, 2010 10:36 AM | Report abuse

I dunno if she's right. She did say a while ago we were losing 500 million jobs a month in this country! Was she right then? Does anything coming out of her mouth make any sense? What is the IQ, collectively, of the people who vote for her in her district? It can't be above the mid double digits. They seem to understand her. That should bother a lot of people.

Posted by: vgailitis | March 2, 2010 11:03 AM | Report abuse

I agree with wolfpack2. Let's throw the alcoholics and drug junkies out of the hospitals because, as wolfpack 2 said, "they've done it to themselves." Using the same logic, let's throw smokers who need lung cancer treatment out of hopspitals. Let's round-up all patients who have had heart attacks because they ate too much fat and cholesterol and sat on their butts until they had a heart attack. They too did it to themselves. Lets throw them out. Why stop there? Patients who cannot control their diabetes even when they are told to are also "doing it to themselves." Out they go. Also, no treatment for diabetics among obese children. Throw them out. People who had strokes because they did not control their blood pressure, even after they were told to, are also "doing it to themselves." No hospital beds for them. YES, all these actions will truly reduce health care costs. Problem solved.

Posted by: pgpone | March 2, 2010 11:03 AM | Report abuse

Just the facts for Nancy Pelosi:

http://crosssection.wordpress.com/2010/03/01/nancy-pelosi-it-will-take-courage-to-vote-for-the-health-care-bill/

Posted by: BethFrederick | March 2, 2010 11:14 AM | Report abuse

Posted by: lindalovejones who wrote:
The obvious answer is that Nancy Pelosi is NOT going to be your hair dresser, your mechanic, your plumber or your doctor.

If you don’t know that this is about skyrocketing insurance premiums, well, then that must be why you’re asking that kind of question.

Obviously, your GOP leaders haven’t discussed anything at all with you or any GOP followers because the GOP is too busy taking millions from insurance and drug company lobbyists, and because GOP members are more concerned about their own families and where they’re going to send their children to college (and who’s going to pay for it).

The United States Constitution requires the Government to provide not only for the common defense, but also for the general welfare of the American People.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Oops! Another shining example of the obamabots.
Ready and waiting with hands outstretched for the freebies. Freebies that will be gotten on the backs of working people. People without the clout to make back room deals with the obamas and pelosis and reids who, by the way, are going to keep their "cadillac plans" and have enough to pay the taxes on them.
No. It'll be the little people. Those in between the freeloaders like yourself and the elitists like the obamas that fund this whopper. The same little people that are told to shut up by the Chicago thugs in Washington.

Posted by: tjmlrc | March 2, 2010 11:14 AM | Report abuse

It is not sin to try and fail. It is a sin to fail to try.

We are arguing this health care reform issue and people especially the ones in opposition seem to forget that not doing anything is more expensive than doing nothing.

If I was just pro-Obama then I would not have a leg to stand on, he may be out tomorrow. So does that make it any better of course not. Will the Republicans take the load and carry it over the line to completion? I doubt it, prove me wrong please!

Now if I was pro-Republican then to save money is the goal? What happened to jobs, jobs, jobs and then after that jobs. That takes money but from where? The people making the millions have no interest in working and building business they "got theirs" And if the country is sick who is going to show up for those jobs, jobs, and more jobs?

It seems so clear to me and mine. We as a Capitalist society are selling our future for a dollar now instead of spend the dollar now for a better future. Then we will have problems we never imagined.

The Soviet Union fell and anyone who thinks we are too big to fail is fatally deluded. If we fail it will be worse than Germany after WWI. Have we forgotten inflation? Working 40 hours for what we used to make in a hour? People who do not have the time for these issues are carrying the heavy load of day to day life and work. Money is not the issue?! Of course it is but we won't have any if we do not do something and now. People say we will leave a giant debt to our children. Well they won't have to worry because the problems left for them by lack of action and foresight will make a debt seem trivial.
Thank you

Posted by: katzedes | March 2, 2010 12:09 PM | Report abuse

Many different variables might push health plans into "Cadillac" territory, including geographic location, plan demographics, and other characteristics of the insured population. More at http://www.healthcaretownhall.com/?tag=cadillac-plan

Posted by: JEngdahlJ | March 2, 2010 12:12 PM | Report abuse

Here's one approach to healthcare reform that can increase jobs...The idea that people 55 or older should be able to buy into Medicare would instantly increase the number of people who would retire. Far too many people hold onto jobs that they are burnt out on until 65(and beyond)because they fear that they won't be able to afford health insurance. What a great way to help both older folks and younger people trying to break into the job market! Seems like a no-brainer to me. So how come no one is talking about this any more?

Posted by: cadbury | March 2, 2010 12:15 PM | Report abuse

Socialism, communism, capitalism are words. And human nature is always human nature. It is the very interesting situation now in the HOUSE. On one hand, Obama is continuing to push this health care bill, which the senate let through on Christmas Eve, and which lead to urgent election of Republican senator (first one in how mane years) by the most blue state in the nation. It also ended up temporary or on permanent basis the political history of Kennedy family. On the other hand, all house democrats are due to reelection in November of 2010. And what it means in connection for health care bill for each of this bill supporters has been already shown clear enough, let us say 'beyond any reasonable doubts' So, what would house democrats do? They could blame everything on Rahm Emmanuel, but one Jewish advisor-Kissinger is known to get away unharmed. And his boss was White, and this country is still full of bigots. Besides, Rahm Emmanuel was never directly in charge of health care, and Obama, as president, always was and is. They could start impeachment of Obama for the obvious attempt to cash on Medicare, but Pelosi didn't want to start impeachment proceeding against Bush/Cheney after 2006 referendum, which enabled and even REQUIRED her to become the speaker of the house with this condition. So, what would they do? How would they close this issue? Interesting, is it not?

Posted by: aepelbaum | March 2, 2010 12:47 PM | Report abuse

Only one thing is clear by now - everyone in the house, who would support this senate bill of 2009 Christmas Eve in the senate's voting, should be and would be replaced in November election, and all house democrats know it very well. The country won't let the annulment of Medicare. It was already brightly emphasized. It is really interesting what is going to happen next.

Posted by: aepelbaum | March 2, 2010 12:56 PM | Report abuse

Not only will it create jobs, as businesses do not have to assume all of the health risk of potential employees, it will help transition sick employees to retirement or reduced work schedules with diginity.

Too many employment decisions are influenced by the potential of future health care costs.

Posted by: MHawke | March 2, 2010 1:29 PM | Report abuse

Please start a petition and pledge and direct it to Senators Bayh, Bunning, the repukes, & blue dog democraps who are against publicly funded health care -- time to put their money where their loudmouth is: every elected official against health care reform MUST NOW give up their public-funded cadillac health care policies and retirement benefits forever -- IMMEDIATELY!!!!!!

To Each and every republican and you traitorous blue-dog DINO democratic elected official (senate, house, governors, republican party members AND their staff members AND ALL their family members) who are AGAINST or has voted against or is campaigning or speaking against the Health Care Reform Bills or any Publicly Funded Healthcare Options:

Will you give up your public funded healthcare insurance and retirement benefits now and forever starting TODAY?

And will you and your staff and family members only seek PRIVATE individual/family policies with the type of coverage available only in your state by private free market insurance companies that are approved for and at the same rates to available for members of and by your state, not through a trade association or business or any other type of coverage provided by a friend, crony or associate?

Will you promise not to accept discounted health care policies or discounts or special deals from any of your contributors or supporters or other private or public entity?

Ask this: Why don't so-called reporters and every media organization start asking them these questions of these hypocritical, self-important, self-enriching, America hating scumbag politicians?

Start a 'truth' database that focuses on each and every publicy elected official who opposes health care reform AND/OR publicly funded health care?

Make them put their money where their hypocritical loudmouths are by petition, pledge, database tracking and demanding the press to stay on top of it.

Isn't the fourth estate supposed to protect the public from these consummate practitioners of mendacity?

Posted by: flacan | March 2, 2010 1:32 PM | Report abuse

Pelosi is seriously the scariest mammal in politics. I wouldn't believe a word she says. I am not sure how someone with an IQ so low that it can't be calculated is up there presenting her ideas to the USA....

Posted by: bcspecdotcom | March 2, 2010 1:39 PM | Report abuse

Wow! Fantastic! HCR will bring 4 million new jobs. Add that to all the "green" jobs we'll be getting from Cap & Trade, as well as all the new jobs created by the Stimulus Bill. Oh, happy happy day! I guess that's why we no longer have an unemployment problem. Sarcasm aside, I know all pols lie, but the blatant transparancy of Pelosi's lies are staggering.

Posted by: JohnR22 | March 2, 2010 1:42 PM | Report abuse

This is one of the weakest essays that I've ever read. Rhyme nor reason supports your central premise. You use just one issue, Gitmo, to support it with just hints that if Democrats in Congress had just never considered a public option in HCR deliberations, all might have gone differently. There is absolutely nothing to support this - quite the contrary.

Since you don't make any real effort to support your title thesis - a reasonable inference is that your purpose is just rabble rousing with a tinge of race-baiting. From reading the submitted comments your efforts appear to have been successful. Certainly the sofa warrior class has taken the bait as has the demi-racist, government hating, water-boarding wing of the republican party.

Our small, all volunteer military will fight on in furtherance of American corporate interests that are not even related to American public interest, in Iraq for China and Israel, in Afghanistan for India and in Iran for Israel. None of these beneficiary countries have expended any of their blood or wealth in support of these American efforts - but they and certain "American" companies derive all of the benefits. Now, more than ever, American corporate interests are entirely distinct from American public interests. Rahm is the corporate man.

Your issues should have at least included the central question of why financial and health care reform were take out of order. Instead you have appealed to the blood lust of the sofa warriors and racists.

You have done a great disservice to your country by writing this piece of dribble. But even that fails to distinguish you as trashing America is as common today as it is vulgar.

Posted by: tm13 | March 2, 2010 1:58 PM | Report abuse

The only thing Pelosi is right about is abortion and it is to bad her mother didn't use it when she was pregnant with her we would all be better off..

Posted by: CaseClosed | March 2, 2010 2:11 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: Straightline:
Now that Americans see the dems for what they really are...they are screwed if it passes or not.

The once noble party of JFK has been hi-jacked. This ain't Mom and Dads Democrat party.

//
You're too kind, really. We democrats are quite accustomed to having republicans oppose every bit of social progress that this country has made since Abraham Lincoln. Pity the poor man if he were alive today. To return the favor I'll admit that Dwight D. Eisenhower was also an honorable man and American hero. Of course yours is not the party of either Lincoln or Eisenhower, neither of whom could even come close to passing the Limbaugh/Palin test.

-------------------------------------

Well that is just so sweet! Thank you so much for your sincere generosity!

I suppose if Eisenhower and Lincoln couldn't be considered Republicans any more, why they would just run right over to the new progressive democrats!

Yes pity poor President Lincoln if he were here today. But it isn't the private citizens that dissent like the Palin's or Limbaugh's or even the interference of foreigner George Soros that would have Lincoln spinning in his grave. It is the elected leaders like the Pelosi's and Reid's and Obama's that would bring a tear to his eyes.

Posted by: Straightline | March 2, 2010 2:23 PM | Report abuse

Hey, Lane, exactly which planet are you living on, anyway?

Pelosi states that passing health care reform would create 400,000 jobs "almost immediately." How? Where? As I recall, under both House and Senate bills, analyses show that health care premiums for many, particularly the young WOULD GO UP "almost immediately." The savings you believe that businesses are going to see won't kick in for some time (if ever....).

When I heard Pelosi utter this latest nonsense, I thought about her family. Who is going to ask her to go down to the Doctor's office and take that Alzheimer's screening test?

Posted by: Curmudgeon10 | March 2, 2010 2:59 PM | Report abuse

The Dems have been a majority in Congress for all but 10 of the last 60 years. They brought us SS and Medicare, both on the brink of bankruptcy. The healthcare plan would be another program that will be costly and will not reduce costs. The Prez says he's accepted 4 Republican ideas. Wow and we should be grateful. He obviously expects all Republicans to vote for it now. Pelosi is the most divisive majority leader we had in recent memory because it is all about power to her not what is best for the people. Obama is the least experienced Prez we have had in the last 60 years. He learned Chicago politics and expects that to be accpetable to the rest of the voters. It isn;t and unless this is a bi-partisan bill that attempts to reduce costs, it shouldn't pass.

Posted by: jschmidt2 | March 2, 2010 3:09 PM | Report abuse

Nancy will save the planet for her grandchildren ... by flying three planes to Copenhagen. She will run the most ethical House ever ... Charlie Rangel's nomination for Saint coming any day now.

From "Who Framed Roger Rabbit" ... she is one seriously demented "toon."

http://www.netherwood2010.com/posts/where-the-dollars-are-heading

Posted by: raynetherwood | March 2, 2010 3:44 PM | Report abuse

"The Dems have been a majority in Congress for all but 10 of the last 60 years."

And we are supposed to believe anything else this person says? I wonder what planet he lived on from 1994 - 2006? Since 1950 the Democrats have only controlled the Senate for 34 years let alone both houses. Sheesh!

Posted by: lensch | March 2, 2010 4:15 PM | Report abuse

lensch- ok-The Republicans only controlled Congress for 12 years. That's it. The Dems controlled it the rest. They made all the social programs that are bankrupt. This health bill will be no different.

Posted by: jschmidt2 | March 2, 2010 4:24 PM | Report abuse

The only thing Leatherface was ever right aboutis how much everyone outside her home town of Sodom hates her.

Posted by: carlbatey | March 2, 2010 4:34 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: Straightline:
Now that Americans see the dems for what they really are...they are screwed if it passes or not.

The once noble party of JFK has been hi-jacked. This ain't Mom and Dads Democrat party.

//
You're too kind, really. We democrats are quite accustomed to having republicans oppose every bit of social progress that this country has made since Abraham Lincoln. Pity the poor man if he were alive today. To return the favor I'll admit that Dwight D. Eisenhower was also an honorable man and American hero. Of course yours is not the party of either Lincoln or Eisenhower, neither of whom could even come close to passing the Limbaugh/Palin test.

-------------------------------------

Well that is just so sweet! Thank you so much for your sincere generosity!

I suppose if Eisenhower and Lincoln couldn't be considered Republicans any more, why they would just run right over to the new progressive democrats!

Yes pity poor President Lincoln if he were here today. But it isn't the private citizens that dissent like the Palin's or Limbaugh's or even the interference of foreigner George Soros that would have Lincoln spinning in his grave. It is the elected leaders like the Pelosi's and Reid's and Obama's that would bring a tear to his eyes.

Posted by: Straightline | March 2, 2010 5:23 PM | Report abuse

This article is a waste of words, and reading time.

Posted by: wcmillionairre | March 2, 2010 5:53 PM | Report abuse

This is an argument that has been made many times by politicians, media commentators and the man/woman on the street for several years. High insurance premiums are a major drag on businesses hiring new workers. If we provide coverage for more people through better and broader scope insurance and more are hired. You also fail to factor in the growth of GDP and therefore a reduction of deficit if healtcare reform creates new jobs, thus creating more income, thus creating more wealth and theoretically lowering debt. It 'ain't' that sophisticated, Lane. And it sure the heck isn't socialist!

Posted by: erichegy | March 2, 2010 5:58 PM | Report abuse

Pelosi to Dems: FALL ON YOUR SWORDS

Posted by: bbwk80a1 | March 2, 2010 6:11 PM | Report abuse

"Medicare works very well and is far more cost effective than private insurance. "

That can't be true. Obama & Redi want to cut funding because they tell us it's so wasteful.

So which is it? If it's really the model, then just extend Medicare. If it really isn't, shut it down, and quick.

Posted by: Ombudsman1 | March 2, 2010 6:30 PM | Report abuse

Keep the polarizing going for a few more months! Blame here and blame there! OK It is all the repubs fault! Feel better! Didn't think so! Actions not words work!!!!

Posted by: usmc1969 | March 2, 2010 6:41 PM | Report abuse

Unions are now dictating how we should tax people! AFL CIO wants to see a bill that taxes stock transactions. LOL
How about a bill that taxes the SEIU for all the illegals who are members of their union. Oh I forgot the Supreme court ruled that illegals can unionize. LOL

Posted by: usmc1969 | March 2, 2010 6:45 PM | Report abuse

pelosi is 'wrong' and 'left' on anything you want to mention.......

Posted by: UpAndOver | March 2, 2010 7:54 PM | Report abuse

Wow, most of the negative comments betray deep insecurity and blind ignorance of reality.

If you are an employer today, especially a small one, you do not want to hire because you do not want to incur the ever-exploding costs of health insurance. Note the article in Sunday New York Times -- if we do nothing, things will not stay the same. They will get significantly and horrifically worse, even for those among us who have good health insurance today.

You ideologues are so blinded by your preconceptions that you are apparently unable to read the bottom line. We are sinking. Life preservers would be a good idea.

Posted by: thmas | March 2, 2010 9:59 PM | Report abuse

It's so hard to understand Pelosi at times it's difficult to get the meaning of what the heck she's talking about. At least she didn't say it's for the people as if forcing the health care down the throats of the people is OK. Now, the health care bill is supposed to create jobs. What is the jobs summit supposed to do now. Pelosi even claimed they were part of the Tea Partiers. Are the American people so gullible after the election of President Obama that they will believe anything Pelosi and President Obama tells them. If President Obama is re-elected for a second term I guess they are.

Posted by: houstonian | March 2, 2010 10:09 PM | Report abuse

Someone could win a PhD by dissecting similarities and differences in the way Americans respond to Nancy Pelosi and Sarah Palin, and explaining them.

I'm too old for that, I'll just enjoy a good laugh.

Posted by: douglaslbarber | March 2, 2010 11:49 PM | Report abuse

THE Real Question might be " Is PIGLOSI EVER RIGHT ON ANYTHING" that is not Wasteful Spending????

Posted by: redhawk2 | March 6, 2010 1:23 PM | Report abuse

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