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Posted at 12:45 PM ET, 02/18/2011

Wisconsin's governor is not Hitler

By Stephen Stromberg

Rachel Maddow on Thursday night called the war over public-sector union law in Wisconsin an "existential fight for the Democratic Party." Overstatement? Maybe, but it's tame compared with the despicable slogans that some of the union protesters have been injecting into the debate.

I must note that most of the protesters are carrying signs with civil slogans on them -- "Care about educators like they care for your child," for example. I don't think the unions or most of their supporters endorse the views expressed in some of the other placards. And, even if they did, the practical merits of the issue should be kept separate from the rhetoric that surrounds it, as in any debate.

Yet, just as the offensive behaviors of some Tea Partyers, birthers and others on the right deserve to be condemned, so, too, do some of the things that the mass protests in Wisconsin have dredged up. Here is a sampling of the some of the signs that the Wisconsin GOP says it has found among the protesters:

Scott Walker = Adolf Hitler

Midwest Mussolini

Hosni Walker, WI Dictator

Why Do Republicans Hate People?

Walker
Terrorizes
Families

RAPE Is Never "a Good Choice"! (Raping public employees is not the way to balance the budget)

1933 Hitler abolishes unions! Look it up!

In 1936, Hitler also hosted the Olympic Games. Look it up! Last October, I pointed out that Christine O'Donnell was dishonest when she compared her opponent in the Delaware Senate race, Chris Coons, to Karl Marx because Coons didn't want to abolish the inheritance tax. Some of my commenters insisted that Marx favored eliminating inheritance, so it was okay for O'Donnell to insist that Coons advocated a "tenet of Marxism." No, it's not okay. It's ridiculous guilt by association. Just as Hitler was about a whole lot more than abolishing unions, Marx was about a whole lot more than establishing inheritance taxes. Neither existed in the same political universe that contemporary American politicians, Democratic or Republican, inhabit. And it's both intellectually weak and morally contemptible to draw such comparisons.

This isn't delegitimizing the substance of the unions' argument for me to point out any of this. If the unions' case is hurt by some of the extreme rhetoric on display, those carrying the signs are the ones who did it.

By Stephen Stromberg  | February 18, 2011; 12:45 PM ET
Categories:  Stromberg  | Tags:  Stephen Stromberg  
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Next: Tyranny in Wisconsin, part 3

Comments

Republicans are trying to destroy the middle class in Wisconsin and you are upset about some signs?

Wow.

If I were in Wiscinson, I would be standing two inches from Taliban Mullah Scott Walker's face and spitting into it.

How you like them apples, Sparky?

Posted by: ExConservative | February 18, 2011 1:22 PM | Report abuse

I love it when the real face of leftism rises. Nasty, violent, bigoted and entitled (for what I am not sure). These union goons are absolute parasites on our country.I am also quite sure that the Post will ignore those signs made by our children's educators after this blog post of yours. Wisconsin teachers avg compensation is $89,000 per year for a 9 month job. That pay is considerably higher than the state avg. They are having a hissy fit about paying 12% of their own health care? Really? Buzzards.

Posted by: j751 | February 18, 2011 1:25 PM | Report abuse

I guess all the fake platitudes about "civility" heard a few weeks ago have been forgotten by the Dems and their union thugs?

Posted by: pgr88 | February 18, 2011 1:29 PM | Report abuse

ExConservative has clearly demonstrated the thought process of the American Left.

Demonize, exaggerate, refuse to address real issues.

Posted by: pilsener | February 18, 2011 1:29 PM | Report abuse

A Governor showing leadership, congratulations Wisconsin. Most of the politicians, including the President, other than Christie and Walker just ignore the problems and hope they go away. Like it or not these leaders are addressing huge budget problems. We badly need this type of leadership in California.

Posted by: sarno | February 18, 2011 1:38 PM | Report abuse

Offensive behavior of Tea Partiers? Really? Still waiting for evidence (that isn't a Dem plant.)
Seriously, it's funny how liberals always have to qualify their actions as they try to marginalize their hypocrisy.

Posted by: fishguts | February 18, 2011 1:39 PM | Report abuse

I noticed that the nasty "exconservative" has now posted two items on two different articles today about spitting in someones face....stay classy.

Posted by: j751 | February 18, 2011 1:39 PM | Report abuse

Hitler is so overused, but facism is a valid allegation. Much of the Republican victory last election was due to white blue collar males. The current Republican assault on labor, from Missouri (unbelievable child labor legislation changes), Florida with governors proposal to dramatically shorten standard unemployment benefit, and union busting in Wisconsin and other states. My takeaway is Republican might have a jobs agenda but it not for jobs worth having.

Posted by: chucko2 | February 18, 2011 1:41 PM | Report abuse

Hitler was all about taking back his country from "deviants" (i.e. homosexuals) and "traitors", destroying unions, allying the government with corporations, promoting German "exceptionalism," duping the people with simple slogans . . .

Look it up.

Posted by: newsraptor | February 18, 2011 1:42 PM | Report abuse

Hitler was all about taking back his country from "deviants" (i.e. homosexuals) and "traitors" (i.e. liberals and civil libertarians), destroying unions, allying the government with corporations, promoting German "exceptionalism," duping the people with simple slogans . . .

Look it up.

Posted by: newsraptor | February 18, 2011 1:44 PM | Report abuse

It seems wrong to increase taxes on wage earners who have no benefits to cover the cost of benefits to salaried public employees.

When a business becomes too unprofitable due to labor costs, it goes bankrupt. When a state can't meet its payroll and benefits obligations it increases taxes.

Posted by: blasmaic | February 18, 2011 1:45 PM | Report abuse

"Hitler was all about taking back his country from "deviants" (i.e. homosexuals) and "traitors", destroying unions, allying the government with corporations, promoting German "exceptionalism," duping the people with simple slogans . . .

Look it up.

Posted by: newsraptor"

Your simplistic and myopic understanding of history is astounding.

Posted by: j762 | February 18, 2011 1:47 PM | Report abuse

Of course he is Hitler. All us republicans are hitlers and racists. And guess what? We couldn't care less what you call us.

Posted by: johnfchick1 | February 18, 2011 1:48 PM | Report abuse

The "Wisconsin GOP" says something and you believe them? Psst... here is a little clue for you, politicians lie.

Posted by: gjcomm | February 18, 2011 1:55 PM | Report abuse

If "most" are not comparing the governor to hilter then why write this column? Did you see the signs that you are writing about - on TV or in print? Also, why was Rachel Maddow mentioned?

Posted by: rlj1 | February 18, 2011 2:00 PM | Report abuse

The libs need to tone it down or someone is going to get shot!!!!

Posted by: englundc | February 18, 2011 2:00 PM | Report abuse

I thought these cheeseheads would be happy after winning the Super Bowl; but it's been a long winter. And Stromberg, your cover photo look eeriely like Rick Santorum, you may want to shoot that photo from another angle. Just trying to help you out there.

Posted by: MikeV2 | February 18, 2011 2:04 PM | Report abuse

It's good to call out the boorish behavior. It happens on both sides. The governor is not the anti-christ any more than Harry Reid or Nancy Pelosi is. But there is no shortage of partisans that frequent these boards who will say otherwise.

It would be good for people to understand the meaning of integrity and not use name calling as an excuse to badmouth the other side. Too many people act like they never made it past 10th grade.

Posted by: mikem1 | February 18, 2011 2:07 PM | Report abuse

The first thing both Hitler and Lenin did on seizing power was to destroy the trade unions.

The teahadist Brownshirt cadres have taken this lesson to heart.

Ein Volk!
Ein Reich!
Ein Beck!

Posted by: Garak | February 18, 2011 2:13 PM | Report abuse

I love how Democrats are so ignorant of their own party's history.

Hitler was a Democrat. Leader of the Nationalsozialistische Deutsche Arbeiterpartei or the National Socialist German Workers' Party. And in that, Obama isnt that much different than Hitler. The different? Obama hasnt begun killing people to keep Democrats in power yet, but there are two years left of his regime...

Posted by: xatiannorthsea | February 18, 2011 2:14 PM | Report abuse

Didn’t president obama say we should all live within our means? All these unions live off the tax payer. What happens when there is no more money?

Posted by: gfhoward258 | February 18, 2011 2:15 PM | Report abuse

"Hitler was all about taking back his country from "deviants" (i.e. homosexuals) and "traitors", destroying unions, allying the government with corporations, promoting German "exceptionalism," duping the people with simple slogans . . .

Look it up.

Posted by: newsraptor"

Your simplistic and myopic understanding of history is astounding.

Posted by: j762 | February 18, 2011 2:16 PM | Report abuse

Ah yessss, the old "Hitler was all about" trick. Third time I've seen it this week.

Hitler was against inflation of the mark, so anyone opposing rampant inflation is Hitlerian.

Hitler was all about grabbing guns, so any proponent of gun control is Hitlerian.

Mussolini was all for trains running on time, so anyone opposed to trains appearing at random unpredictable intervals is Fascist

Stalin was all about a strong economy, so anyone who wants economic growth is Stalinist.

Clearly C.S. Lewis was right: they no longer teach logic in the schools. And Orwell was right about the new meaning of Fascist being "anything I don't like."

Posted by: RES_ | February 18, 2011 2:30 PM | Report abuse

So now we know.

The agenda of the Republican Party of No for the next two years consists of two goals.

The first is to keep the number of unemployed high which will hurt the re-election of President Obama.

The second is to weaken and/or destroy the middle class's only source of economic and political power, its right to form and belong to a union.

In the first instance, the Republicans and their sponsors, the haves and want mores, know any success Obama has in creating jobs and relieving the economic stress created by the Republicans and the greedy rich will help his being re-elected in 2012. If he does not succeed the Republicans will try to use it against him. That the middle class will continue to suffer is of no concern to the Republicans or the wealthy class, when workers suffer the rich get richer.

In the second instance, the Republicans and there sponsors want to eliminate the only organized counter to the massive amounts of campaign monies the corporations give to the Republican Party and other conservative anti-worker groups. The Unions played a decisive role in defeating the war-mongering and greed driven policies of the Republican Party of NO in the 2008 elections.

With this two-tiered attack on Obama - preventing any economic recovery and removing the largest and most effective support base he has - the Republican Party sees its chance of victory in 2012 and and the resumption of attacks on the living standards of middle class America.

But they have a problem.

Workers know how to fight back and when we are attacked we relearn the lesson of why the unions are so important to us.

We remember the power of unity.

We remember the the truth of the union slogan, "An injury to one is an injury to all".

Today in Wisconsin and Ohio we see the spirit of unity, the need for unity, is never forgotten, we keep it in our back pocket right next to out union card.

Posted by: apspa1 | February 18, 2011 2:31 PM | Report abuse

Actually, Wisconsin didn't HAVE a financial crisis. The republican governor and republican controlled legislature enacted approx 140 million in NEW spending that pushed Wisconsin over to a deficit next year. Facts people! Facts.

Also, where does j751 come up with the figure of $89000 per year in compensation for teachers in Wisconsin? How does that compare to the state average for all wage earners? And who is included in that average?

Posted by: grin720 | February 18, 2011 2:35 PM | Report abuse

Actually, Wisconsin didn't HAVE a financial crisis. The republican governor and republican controlled legislature enacted approx 140 million in NEW spending that pushed Wisconsin over to a deficit next year. Facts people! Facts.

Also, where does j751 come up with the figure of $89000 per year in compensation for teachers in Wisconsin? How does that compare to the state average for all wage earners? And who is included in that average?

Posted by: grin720 | February 18, 2011 2:36 PM | Report abuse

For me, just look at the scene at the "after-rally". Tea Partiers clean up after themselves. Dems leave a mess behind. Microcosm/Macroscosm.

Posted by: cartmaneric | February 18, 2011 2:39 PM | Report abuse

For me, just look at the scene at the "after-rally". Tea Partiers clean up after themselves. Dems leave a mess behind. Microcosm/Macrocosm.

Posted by: cartmaneric | February 18, 2011 2:40 PM | Report abuse

Obama/Unions SHUT-DOWN THE SCHOOLS!
This should help private schools, because
most parents Don't agree with Union tactics.
We need more privately-run schools anyway.
Unionized teachers are the worst. They are, really are!

Posted by: ohioan | February 18, 2011 2:40 PM | Report abuse

Actually, Wisconsin didn't HAVE a financial crisis. The republican governor and republican controlled legislature enacted approx 140 million in NEW spending that pushed Wisconsin over to a deficit next year. Facts people! Facts.

Also, where does j751 come up with the figure of $89000 per year in compensation for teachers in Wisconsin? How does that compare to the state average for all wage earners? And who is included in that average?

Posted by: grin720
===================

Regardless..why does j752 think
$89k is a lot of money??

Why is he jealous??

Posted by: pdq5 | February 18, 2011 2:41 PM | Report abuse

I'm assuming this is the kind of column you phone-in when you are looking forward to the long weekend. So much easier than thinking.

Posted by: margaretmeyers | February 18, 2011 2:46 PM | Report abuse

To a lot of people $89k is a lot of money for lazy teachers working 9 months out of the year in a low cost state. Unfortunately, most people are not a trust fund babies like your hero's ted kennedy, algore, rockafeller and on and on and on....

Posted by: j751 | February 18, 2011 2:50 PM | Report abuse

Coming from a family of teachers, I guess what I find so disappointing about the signs is the fact that it's actually teachers who are the ones making these off base analogies of Hitler and an American governor. What an abject failure in historical perspective. I will, however, jump right to their defense as soon as the governor and his administration start stockpiling Zyklon B. Come on, folks. Get real.

Posted by: ANCLvr | February 18, 2011 2:54 PM | Report abuse


So once a day or more every Jewish/zionist columnist

has to write a story about Hitler or the holocaust. It's just the case.

What happened to the rabbi's organization that wanted such not to be mentioned again. Except by themselves, apparently, asevery time Israel pulls some outrage, as yestrday with the Iranian ships, we get another bunch.

Something on one placard, in one demonstration in one state. And wowie, we have to get a whine.

Posted by: whistling | February 18, 2011 2:56 PM | Report abuse

ExConservative has clearly demonstrated the thought process of the American Left.

Demonize, exaggerate, refuse to address real issues.

Posted by: pilsener

========================================

Not to mention he would probably be arrested for assault.

Posted by: bbface21 | February 18, 2011 3:00 PM | Report abuse

I agree! Hitler was Hitler; not a Republican from Wisconsin or a Democrat from Illinois; we need to leave these stupid comparisons alone.
Speaking of stupid, j751 judging by your stupid comment, if teachers have to deal with you/children they deserve at least 100K

Posted by: doesntmatter | February 18, 2011 3:01 PM | Report abuse

The first thing both Hitler and Lenin did on seizing power was to destroy the trade unions.

The teahadist Brownshirt cadres have taken this lesson to heart.

Ein Volk!
Ein Reich!
Ein Beck!

Posted by: Garak
=====================================

Ein Volk!
Ein Reich!
Ein Beck!

How about Ein Vollidiot?

As someone who lost family members to the Nazis making any kind of comparison is so stupid, ignorant and damn offensive.

Posted by: bbface21 | February 18, 2011 3:05 PM | Report abuse

Mullah Walker should be hanged for treason. I hope the teachers crucify him.

Posted by: ExConservative | February 18, 2011 3:06 PM | Report abuse

i am just wondering what the point of this "gotcha" moment is? that people who are defending their rights are just as bad as the tea baggers who want to keep their fellow citizens from having access to affordable health care? excuse me, but i don't get the connection. since we can trace the funding of the tea party to insurance companies and the koch brothers, i would like to know who is funding these people who are trying to keep the governor from taking away their hard fought-for union representation? i am sure your astute attention did not miss the fact that many of these signs simply took up the themes that were used in tea party rallies last year and turned them around in irony?

Posted by: mkmcfr | February 18, 2011 3:06 PM | Report abuse


Stromberg, You are the dishonest one.

Christine O'Donnell called Coons a Marxist because that is what he called himself in an article he wrote about his transformation while on a trip to Kenya.

From Politico.com

“Chris Coons: The Making of a Bearded Marxist.”

In the article, Coons, then 21 years old and about to graduate from Amherst College, chronicled his transformation from a sheltered, conservative-minded college student who had worked for former GOP Delaware Sen. William Roth and had campaigned for Ronald Reagan in 1980 into a cynical young adult who was distrustful of American power and willing to question the American notion of free enterprise."

And Stromberg, what about how the Journolista's used the off-handed witch remark from her high school years and ran with it constantly on WaPo?

The liberal Journolistas control the not-so-free press (as in the Bill of Rights) and can make or break a candidate because there are so many uninformed citizens who actually trust that what the press writes is the truth. So sad.

Journalism died in 2008.


Posted by: janet8 | February 18, 2011 3:06 PM | Report abuse

j751 wrote the following lie:
“I love it when the real face of leftism rises. Nasty, violent, bigoted and entitled (for what I am not sure). These union goons are absolute parasites on our country. I am also quite sure that the Post will ignore those signs made by our children's educators after this blog post of yours. Wisconsin teachers avg [sic] compensation is $89,000 per year for a 9 month job. That pay is considerably higher than the state avg. They are having a hissy fit about paying 12% of their own health care? Really? Buzzards.”
- - - - - - - - -

j751 appears to be a paid right-wing goon passing off lies as facts. The starting salary for a teacher in Wisconsin is $25,000 and the average salary is $46,000. For jobs that require a Master’s degree, I don’t see where these people are “parasites” or “buzzards”. And as for violent, it was the Governor who threatened to call out the National Guard to bust heads even before one protestor arrived on the capital steps.

Posted by: codexjust1 | February 18, 2011 3:08 PM | Report abuse

Some of these comments are beyond inane. These public sector workers pay nothing for health insurance and virtually nothing for their pension. The "hitler" gov is not even proposing to raise their contributions to the level of other public sector workers much less that of private sector. If the morons of Wisconsin want to keep paying that is their business, just do not come to me for a Federal bailout

Posted by: commenter4 | February 18, 2011 3:10 PM | Report abuse

What's with the violent rhetoric? Don't Obama's sycophants remember his Tuscon speech?

Wow. No one pays attention to Obama anymore...

Posted by: HughJassPhD | February 18, 2011 3:11 PM | Report abuse

What's with the violent rhetoric? Don't Obama's sycophants remember his Tuscon speech?

Wow. No one pays attention to Obama anymore...

Posted by: HughJassPhD | February 18, 2011 3:15 PM | Report abuse

Many private sector workers in Wisconsin make far less than these state union workers and they work 12 months per year not 9 months. The private sector does not offer generous pensions and free health care any more. The private sector fluxuates with the market, the public sector expects continuous raises regardless of the market. The teachers on strike should be fired. The law makers hiding out should be discharged from their posts. The protestors look like 'Greece.'

Posted by: windmill3 | February 18, 2011 3:17 PM | Report abuse

1933 Hitler abolishes unions! Look it up!

In 1936, Hitler also hosted the Olympic Games. Look it up!

Seriously? That's the best response you have, is to imply Hitler wasn't that bad a guy either?

Posted by: FredEvil | February 18, 2011 3:24 PM | Report abuse

What's with the violent rhetoric? Don't Obama's sycophants remember his Tuscon speech?

Wow. No one pays attention to Obama anymore...

Posted by: HughJassPhD

=========================================

The call to civility only applies to the center-right. Just another liberal double standard.

Posted by: bbface21 | February 18, 2011 3:24 PM | Report abuse

Republicans are trying to destroy the middle class in Wisconsin and you are upset about some signs?

Posted by: ExConservative
___________________________________________

I agree with the column. As a Tea Party hating liberal who who has a particular disdain for their hateful signs, it's only fair for Stromberg to point out that the call for greater civility in public discourse is the responsibility of all sides.

Posted by: Jumpy66 | February 18, 2011 3:26 PM | Report abuse

751 appears to be a paid right-wing goon passing off lies as facts. The starting salary for a teacher in Wisconsin is $25,000 and the average salary is $46,000. For jobs that require a Master’s degree, I don’t see where these people are “parasites” or “buzzards”. And as for violent, it was the Governor who threatened to call out the National Guard to bust heads even before one protestor arrived on the capital steps.

I said compensation genius, not pay. Compensation includes all benefits. Oh, the horror asking someone to pay 12% of their own health care bill and some of their retirement. Do the think they are in Congress or something? The horror! How is calling out the guard violent? Was the calling out the guard violent after Katrina? You know, Katrina the huge storm everyone in NO knew was coming for 3 days and still didn't leave. Then blamed Bush because of their own ignorance.

Posted by: j751 | February 18, 2011 3:26 PM | Report abuse

The use of state power to deny workers an independent voice in negotiations is a hallmark of facism (it turns out communism also did the same).
What I don't understand is why we privilege corporations (they are "people", according to the Supreme Court, when it comes to making campaign contributions, but they aren't people when it comes to holding them responsible for their actions--this is what limited liability is all about). Labor unions are seen as bad even though they are also a form of organization, only of labor rather than capital.

Posted by: garbage1 | February 18, 2011 3:27 PM | Report abuse

This Nation is coming to realize what these baggers are: authoritian

Baggers days are numbered. 2012 is coming

Posted by: mjcc1987 | February 18, 2011 3:27 PM | Report abuse

But tea-bagger republican hate signs at those hate rallys are just fine?

Posted by: jeffc6578 | February 18, 2011 3:31 PM | Report abuse

Why do Republicans hate people?

Posted by: SarahBB | February 18, 2011 3:35 PM | Report abuse

Middle class rubes arn't competent to have a say so in their wages or working conditions.

These are best decided by their betters, e.g., officers is some international corporation operating out of Dubai.

The Republican Party is correct in taking the power of unions out of the hands of the American rubes and returning it to the mega corporations.

As Buckley and Cheney said, we will never have a truly conservative nation as long as we have a prosperous middle class.

Posted by: Deirdre_K | February 18, 2011 3:35 PM | Report abuse

Steven Stromberg is not Jewish, as he has written before. However, I object to your abhorrent implication that Jewishness is bad or shameful.

There was indeed a trade union in Nazi Germany: "Freude Durch Arbeit," which translated to "Work Through Joy." It was, of course, a state-sanctioned union, and it was the only union in the country, and it was a fraud -- less a union than a method of government control, as is often the case in authoritarian regimes that pretend to be derived from workers' movements. Other unions were destroyed. But, at least for a time, the Nazi regime attempted to preserve the appearance of trade unionism.

Posted by: AlexRemington | February 18, 2011 3:43 PM | Report abuse

I'm sure you feigned indignity when the Tea Party had Obama Hitlerized to the hilt.

Posted by: CHICO13 | February 18, 2011 3:44 PM | Report abuse

I can't believe what the Republicans are doing. They are making people pay for almost HALF their pension, what gall. How dare you make me pay almost 13% of my health care premiums? What is this, communist Russia? I can't afford a midle class life if other people pay only 87% of my costs. When I retire with a bloated, manipulated pension that I paid 6% of, things are going to get tight.

Posted by: kaneg423 | February 18, 2011 3:44 PM | Report abuse

Forgive my mistranslation. "Freude Durch Arbeit" is "Joy Through Work."

Posted by: AlexRemington | February 18, 2011 3:46 PM | Report abuse

The call to civility only applies to the center-right. Just another liberal double standard.

Posted by: bbface21 | February 18, 2011 3:24 PM | Report abuse

What? Shouldn't you be defending "freedom of speech?"

Seriously, plenty of hypocrisy on both sides here.

Posted by: mikem1 | February 18, 2011 3:49 PM | Report abuse

Fortunately stromboli, all the placards are true and correct, they have a bunch of fascists running the state of Wisconsin.

Posted by: mtravali | February 18, 2011 3:51 PM | Report abuse

What makes people think that those protesting the actions of the Wisc Governor were, at one time, also not demonstrating for the Tea Party? People are frustrated, furious, and seem to seek any available outlet. The GOP action reeks of political corruption -- paying off their political and ideological supporters. It is an amazingly wild reaction if this were only about money. It isn't. It is an 1880s style attack on working people and unions.

Posted by: stpaulmike | February 18, 2011 3:54 PM | Report abuse

Mullah Walker will get what's coming to him.

Posted by: ExConservative | February 18, 2011 4:04 PM | Report abuse

Lil' Stromberg gon' pee his pants :*(

Posted by: ExConservative | February 18, 2011 4:06 PM | Report abuse

I can see Stromberg's point on most of the slogans he cites. The last one appears to be fact-based and therefore tolerable, even though some may find it objectionable.

However, a few bad apples should not be taken as representative for the demonstration. Stromberg does not choose to provide a clear sense of the scope of the problem he is objecting to. If it was just these few signs among hundreds or thousands, then it is really a straw-man argument he is presenting.

Posted by: AgentG | February 18, 2011 4:06 PM | Report abuse

awwww, you're just upset because all the signs had the correct spelling at the Wisconsin rally.

Posted by: clintt5 | February 18, 2011 4:08 PM | Report abuse

All this talk of civility would be amusing if the Governor wasn't bent on destroying collective bargaining. "My way or the highway" isn't civil and it isn't smart employer/employee relations. The Union (it's really all the folks in it, not some amorphous evil) hadn't had the opportunity at this point to agree or disagree. I understand concessions had been made by the public employees before so why the urgent need to eliminate bargaining?

Posted by: sthalsey | February 18, 2011 4:10 PM | Report abuse

Destroy all public employee unions.

Now.

Posted by: pmendez | February 18, 2011 4:10 PM | Report abuse

I'm curious.
The de facto leadership of the Republican Party all seem to come from Wisconsin today. They also look a lot alike.
What is the source of Wisconsin's GOP funding?

Posted by: OldUncleTom | February 18, 2011 4:11 PM | Report abuse

"Republicans are trying to destroy the middle class in Wisconsin and you are upset about some signs?"

Correction: Teacher's Unions are tryign to distroy the middle class.

Unions DO NOT reperesent the working middle class; they take advantage of them to pay for their worker's benefits.

Unions are distructive. When lay offs happen at public schools, it's from the bottom up, because of the unions. So we lose the most eager, freshest, and most innovative teachers and keep all those tired ones we've been dealing with forever. That's not to say there aren't newbies that are worthless and veterans that are more precious than gold; it's just that the union way of doing things is oblivious to the individual and to merit. They will NOT get rid of the poorer quality teachers.

Posted by: hebe1 | February 18, 2011 4:12 PM | Report abuse

What ever happened to the calls for civility? I’ll tell you what happened. Beck, Palin, Rush, Fox News and the rest of the right-wing lunatic fringe (the propaganda arm of the GOP) rejected them. The calls for civility lie in the gutter with the blood of Democratic martyrs. So, when a fascist Governor attempts to take away the democratic rights of workers, rights that are enshrined in the Universal Declaration of Human Rights, don’t expect civility.

Posted by: codexjust1 | February 18, 2011 4:13 PM | Report abuse

Wisconsin's governor is not Hitler, he is a Leninist comrade that is cleverly moving forward and it is best to look at the bright side of what is being manipulated in Wisconsin sub-rosa.

When health care coverage is lost by public employees the huge amount of premium cost covered by the state (by far the largest payer of top premium dollars) will be gone from the private insurers bottom line, and with this massive loss of subsidization of their operation premium income will tank, cost soar beyond affordability, they will collapse and the nation will limp into to universal health care.

Posted by: Islewood | February 18, 2011 4:16 PM | Report abuse

Some of these comments are beyond inane. These public sector workers pay nothing for health insurance and virtually nothing for their pension. The "hitler" gov is not even proposing to raise their contributions to the level of other public sector workers much less that of private sector. If the morons of Wisconsin want to keep paying that is their business, just do not come to me for a Federal bailout

Posted by: commenter4
________________________
it was irresponsible politicians who got the unions to take pension and health care benefits instead of higher wages, so that the cost wouldn't hit their budgets but rather some future governor's. They would be delighted to have "normal" pension and health care contributions in return for "normal" wages.

the governor is using his self created one time crisis as a smokescreen for an anti-union agenda. rather than negotiate benefit givebacks to balance the current budget, which the union would be happy to discuss in lieu of layoffs, he is pushing a permanent elimination of collective bargaining over anything but wages, and really gutting that, too, with a cap of the CPI. meaning the union will have nothing to negotiate over (who would ever accept less than the CPI, and how hard would it be to get?) and therefore no reason to exist, and therefore little argument for collecting dues, and therefore no political power.

this is all about busting the union for partisan politics, and nothing about balancing the budget, which the unions would gladly do.

Posted by: JoeT1 | February 18, 2011 4:16 PM | Report abuse

Wisconsin's governor is not Hitler, he is a Leninist comrade cleverly moving forward and it is best to look at the bright side of what is being manipulated in Wisconsin sub-rosa. When health care coverage is lost by public employees the huge amount of premium cost covered by the state (by far the largest payer of top premium dollars) will be gone from the private insurers bottom line, and with this massive loss of subsidization of their operation premium income will tank, cost soar beyond affordability, they will collapse and the nation will limp into to universal health care.

Posted by: Islewood | February 18, 2011 4:17 PM | Report abuse

Wisconsin's governor is not Hitler, he is a Leninist comrade cleverly moving forward and it is best to look at the bright side of what is being manipulated in Wisconsin sub-rosa. When health care coverage is lost by public employees the huge amount of premium cost covered by the state (by far the largest payer of top premium dollars) will be gone from the private insurers bottom line, and with this massive loss of subsidization of their operation premium income will tank, cost soar beyond affordability, they will collapse and the nation will limp into to universal health care.

Posted by: Islewood | February 18, 2011 4:17 PM | Report abuse

Oh! the hypocrisy of the right. Tea party people protest and they're "true Americans." People protest for their legal right for representation, and they are enemies of the state. If it wasn't so serious it would be laughable.
And according to some sources I've read, there is no budget crisis in Wisconsin, even after the tax cuts and give a ways to political cronies. So, this is just another republican excuse to bust the union.

Posted by: Historian1960 | February 18, 2011 4:19 PM | Report abuse

The Gov. is a Leninist comrade moving forward in Wisconsin sub-rosa. When health care coverage is lost by public employees the huge amount of premium cost covered by the state (by far the largest payer of top premium dollars) will be gone from the private insurers bottom line, and with this massive loss of subsidization of their operation premium income will tank, cost soar beyond affordability, they will collapse and the nation will limp into to universal health care.

Posted by: Islewood | February 18, 2011 4:23 PM | Report abuse

I see sanity is in short supply in Wisconsin. Too much snow?

Posted by: kchses1 | February 18, 2011 4:25 PM | Report abuse

In fact the unions are absolutely right in their comparisons. Marx was a philosopher and economist, whereas Hitler and Mussolini actually had power - and used it brutally. Unions were the first target by Hitler for the same reason thousands died in the USA and the world at the hands of Big Business thugs in the late 19th early 20th century.

The importance of unions should NOT be underestimated which is why they have been so vilified by many the right wing (and even some “liberal” media) media in the USA for years. They are not only effective in standing up for rights of the middle and working classes but they stand up for a public space for services most low and middle class people.

As they say propaganda is to a democracy what force is to a totalitarian state. Hitler and Mussolini were only slight extreme examples of far right and could disband unions at the snap of a finger. Walker and the far right republicans who rode in on the back of intense propaganda ...such as “financial crisis” …after giving back taxes to the coporates (and few votes as compared to functioning democracies in the rest of the world), may get the same results without force.

Posted by: britb | February 18, 2011 4:27 PM | Report abuse

It's SO interesting to read and hear this debate about offensive signs and caustic, hateful rhetoric during protests. I worked on the horsemounted unit of the police department for over 20 years and attended almost every major and many, many minor demonstrations in downtown Washington D.C. during that period. I saw thousands of viscous and vulgar signs, and heard vitriol and vulgarity of an indescribable level that was usually directed at a Republican president and administration or policies, frequently by college aged protesters. I would guess 90% of those demonstrations were Democratic leaning. Where was the great outcry then, by the Democrats, for gentler debate and toning down the anger? Incredible hypocrisy on is now on parade!

Posted by: hitx | February 18, 2011 4:29 PM | Report abuse

Odious.

In the middle east they are freedom fighters.

In the United States when people stand up to the same offensive right-wing policies the protesters are odious.

That and a resounding "So be it!" pretty well sums up right-wing politicians and the paid media hacks driving this country today.

The United States doesn't need any foreign enemies as long as we have these right-wing regressives doing all they damage they can from within.

This, people, is the Reagan Legacy.

Posted by: PoliticalPrisoner2012 | February 18, 2011 4:31 PM | Report abuse

These protestors in Wisconsin are the true American patriots. They seem to be the only ones with the guts to stand up to the GOP.

If a Republican governor can create a crisis and then clamp down on his political enemies, what's to prevent this from happening on a nationwide scale? In the meantime, Walker's supporters are getting even richer, thanks to him.

Posted by: chi-town | February 18, 2011 4:43 PM | Report abuse

Be prepared for a lot worse bahavior from Government employee unions and other privileged liberal Dem groups used to Government subsidies.

This is what happens when parents spoil their children. When deprived of the free goodies they are used to, spoiled brats act out.

Personally, I recommend buying ear plugs and letting the brats scream until they exhaust themselves. Eventally, they'll figure out their behavior is hurting them more than us. If they start breaking things, however, then a spanking is in order.

We're all suffering from decades of spoiling them so there is some justice to us having to suffer a reasonale time through their tantrums. Next time, we'll know better than to give in to childish demands.

Posted by: jfv123 | February 18, 2011 4:50 PM | Report abuse

For all those people complaining about lazy teachers, I would love to see them in a classroom for a semester. Not for just a day or two but for a full semester and have to deal with the discipline problems, lack of supplies, and irrational parents, working late grading papers and preparing classes, involved in extracurricular activities including weekends. Let them do this for a starting salary - maybe 40k if they are lucky, not the top end pay of a master teacher with many years experience under their belt. Just love to see it.

Posted by: stevenasmith | February 18, 2011 4:53 PM | Report abuse

It's about a sense of entitlement, me firstism.
Never mind whether it will mean hardship for
others to pay for me and mine. Never mind whether there is or ever will be money to keep paying. Just borrow. How to repay the loans?
Who cares? It's truly the road to serfdom, and some have already arrived. Yell, strike, obstruct, have a tantrum. That's the way to get what you want. If you're going to lose the
vote, disappear. Contempt? Derilection of duty? Plenty of that.

Posted by: vadata060440 | February 18, 2011 4:54 PM | Report abuse

It's not only the hate being display in the posters and the slogans. Public opinion is turning against these anti-government protesters because they used the children as shields and that is not acceptable. They showed the parents, this is what is teaching your children in schools. How are these anti-government protesters going to talk about bullies anymore to the children when they acted like bullies. The average school teacher makes eighty nine thousand dollars a year plus benefits and they got upset because they were asked to pay for some of their health insurance. These anti government protesters never should have exposed the children to their agenda.

Posted by: houstonian | February 18, 2011 4:59 PM | Report abuse

As Mr. Obama famously said on January 23, 2009, "Elections have consequences." The citizens of Wisconsin have the right to govern themselves through their elected representatives. Last fall, the majority of them voted to put the Republicans in charge. Whether you agree with that decision or not, it was the decision of the sovereign people of Wisconsin. The elected Republicans are carrying out the will of the people; doing what they were elected to do.

Some disagree with the concept of representative government. They have formed mobs, mobs of public union members who illegally walked off their jobs to demonstrate in the public square, and shut down the schools. The mobs, with their signs and bullhorns and sheer numbers, are attempting to intimidate the freely-elected legislators. They seek no debate, as their Democrat representatives fled the state. Those mobs lost the debate among the voters before the last election, they could not prevail by logic and reasoning and argument. Now they are threatening force. We are witnessing a battle, pitting the rule of law against rule by the mob.

For many years, across the world, America has been a shining light to unfree people everywhere. Here, the people, through their elected representatives, ruled. Others dreamed that it could be thus in their countries, and took inspiration from our shining example. That light is flickering today.

Posted by: CapnRusty | February 18, 2011 5:03 PM | Report abuse

No reason to believe that Conservatives are serious about deficit reduction until they are willing to discuss compromise regarding their own sacred cows--- military spending and tax rates. Until then they are just exploiting a crisis for partisan gain.

Posted by: ablum1 | February 18, 2011 5:04 PM | Report abuse

Discourse in the US has been pretty nasty, with (as you acknowledged) a fair amount coming from the major players on the right -- Tea Party and various right wing talking heads (Limbaugh, Beck, etc.) who are making a LOT of money off of their vitriol.

So, now some 'lefties' figure it is time to match the vitriol (though aside from Maddow - none of them are making a lot of money off of the return vitriolic fire).

Note, the evaporation of the middle ground HAS happened in other countries and bad things resulted from it.

Frankly though, the vitriolic voices of the right have been quite a bit more present in the 'dialogue' of the past few years, so perhaps if those voices calmed down (and if Republicans in power avoided efforts to eliminate collective bargaining among other things), perhaps a return to civility would occur.

At this point though, folks on the left, having seen virtually NOTHING in terms of civility from the uber-right and their talking heads, can be at least understood by responding with similar tactics.

I will say though, that if instead of eliminating collective bargaining in Wisconsin, the approach was to negotiate reductions (and toss out a few Republican 'babies' along with Democrat 'babies' in search of draining out the bath water of deficits) perhaps a balance would be in the cards.

Posted by: Barry8 | February 18, 2011 5:31 PM | Report abuse

Oh wait, someone already has...

"The libs need to tone it down or someone is going to get shot!!!!

Posted by: englundc "

Posted by: Barry8 | February 18, 2011 5:33 PM | Report abuse

It does not matter at all what anyone said about the protesters, or Obama, or anyone that supports Unions or other organized labor. It does not matter one bit.

Protesters must conduct themselves better than that. Their cause is Just and Righteous. Let the truth speak for itself.

"In the process of gaining our rightful place we must not be guilty of wrongful deeds. Let us not seek to satisfy our thirst for freedom by drinking from the cup of bitterness and hatred.

We must forever conduct our struggle on the high plane of dignity and discipline. We must not allow our creative protest to degenerate into physical violence." - Dr. Martin Luther King.

We shall overcome, indeed. Power to the People!

Posted by: obcat | February 18, 2011 5:39 PM | Report abuse

How many of the posters here, or thoughout our country realize that the unions have been the leaders and organizers for all the following benefits enjoyed by nearly all workers, unionized and not, and that all of these were and some still are resisted by corporate management:

Child labor laws, mimimun wage, 40 hour work weeks, vacation time, paid vacation, maternal leave, work place safety regulations, lunch breaks, the list goes on, and you can thank the unions for them.

Oh, and it was the work of the unions, not the conservatives or management, that forestalled and prevented the communist and Marxist unification of the workers in this nation, because our unions actually had a positive influence for the common man.

Ignorance of history will doom us.

Posted by: goheen1 | February 18, 2011 5:39 PM | Report abuse

The spectacle of public school teachers acting like angry longshoremen from On The Waterfront strikes me as sad. Then I remember that teachers are loyal union members whose sizable union dues are funneled directly to the Democrat Party for use during elections. Unions are a main support of Democrats. That was fine when workers in private industry were the majority of unionized workers- that has shrunk to 7%. Most union members today are government workers. Democrat office holders invariably work hard to increase salary and health and retirement benefits for them. It's a payoff for their unwavering support. Now many states are buckling from the enormous burden of those benefits. The union position is that pay and benefits can only go up- never down. In my state of California nearly 50% of the budget goes to public education and we are nearly broke. The unions are wrong- their day is almost over.

Posted by: mhr614 | February 18, 2011 5:48 PM | Report abuse

The spectacle of public school teachers acting like angry longshoremen from On The Waterfront strikes me as sad. Then I remember that teachers are loyal union members whose sizable union dues are funneled directly to the Democrat Party for use during elections. Unions are a main support of Democrats. That was fine when workers in private industry were the majority of unionized workers- that has shrunk to 7%. Most union members today are government workers. Democrat office holders invariably work hard to increase salary and health and retirement benefits for them. It's a payoff for their unwavering support. Now many states are buckling from the enormous burden of those benefits. The union position is that pay and benefits can only go up- never down. In my state of California nearly 50% of the budget goes to public education and we are nearly broke. The unions are wrong- their day is almost over.

Posted by: mhr614 | February 18, 2011 5:48 PM | Report abuse

it was good when teabaggers were spewing all over democratic legislatures a couple of years ago, but what are fairly tame signs are despicable compared to some of the trash that has been spewed the last few years about socialists, facists tactics etc ad nauseum. Save your crocodile tears. Rumsfeld said it, democracy can be a little messy and these tea baggers got into office by lying about what they were going to do, now they are paying for it

Posted by: chet_brewer | February 18, 2011 5:54 PM | Report abuse

"When a business becomes too unprofitable due to labor costs, it goes bankrupt." - Or, we bail them out to the tune of billions, so they can keep paying unearned bonuses.

Posted by: blackmask | February 18, 2011 6:10 PM | Report abuse

"When a business becomes too unprofitable due to labor costs, it goes bankrupt." - Or, we bail them out to the tune of billions, so they can keep paying unearned bonuses.

Posted by: blackmask | February 18, 2011 6:11 PM | Report abuse

goheen1: Yes, the unions fought the battles in the old days. Their victories were enshrined in the law. Because of them, workers today in the linen mills of New England . . . oh, wait a minute, there aren't any more linen mills in New England. Well, today the guys who shovel coal into the boilers of the steam engines . . . oh, wait a minute. Um, the steel makers in Youngstown ..

Times have changed. Unions are dinosaurs. The global workforce that is eating our lunch don't go on strike. Get used to it.

Posted by: CapnRusty | February 18, 2011 6:13 PM | Report abuse

Adolph Hitler attempted to deal with labor and workers until backed against the wall by the money changers and elements in germany along with international business led by the roosevelt cabal,,when ww2 was forced upon him he had to abolish unions and barganing as an anti bolshevik measure. Comparing things in the various states is another attempt by the same types to slander a misunderstood leader.

Posted by: schmidt1 | February 18, 2011 6:15 PM | Report abuse

My father was a well-educated and well-awarded teacher in the state of Wisconsin. My father was voted state teacher of year in 1968, he had a masters degree in science education, he was the chairman of the science department for a large affluent suburban school system. When I went to bed at 10 pm on week nights, he was in his chair correcting papers while trying to catch the nightly new. He spent many unpaid hours working at high school athletic events and science fairs all over the state (his specialty and love).

So obviously you know where my sentiments are on the current protests here in WI. And I am quite tired of hearing my father referred to as a lazy union hack. He was anything but that. He was a great teacher that gave his all (for $20,000 a year).

But I also agree with your premise that the vitriolic protest signs need to vanish. Protesters, as angry as there are, need to step back and take the higher ground. Comparisons to Hitler only diminish the lives lost in the reign of that truly evil creature.

Walker is short-sighted, vindictive, arrogant, naive, and quite frankly, just a petty stooge for the corporate interests in a big game of chicken. But he's no Hitler and no one is dying because of his actions. The protester's diminish their standing and cause by comparing this petty little man and his corporate backed vendetta by calling him Hitler.

Protesters, we need to rise above the tactics of our opponents. The only way to victory is the high road!

Posted by: wordzworth_ink | February 18, 2011 6:17 PM | Report abuse

It seems that a lot of folks need a bit of historical perspective.

Back in the pre-Reagan days, compensation in the private sector for workers was quite a bit higher than in the public sector. In the public sector, to compensate for relatively lower wages, workers saw better health care and retirement benefits, along with better job security. That attracted a lot of folks who had been in the private sector.

With the Reagan revolution, the private sector (at the top only) was increasingly able to compensate the very top end of the pay scale, and others in the private sector found their compensation stagnating. This has pretty much continued for the past 25 years.

In the public sector, workers were getting 'catch up' wage compensation -- relatively easy to do since wages in the private sector stagnated.

What in part bought off the private sector workers was a long running hustle regarding perceived net worth as housing values were 'bubbled up' creating a boom of perceived wealth which was financed by debt.

So the bubble burst, taking with it the stock market, 401K values, and private sector jobs. Suddenly, the public sector looked to be overcompensated -- job security, pension plans, health care benefits looked way out of sync with the private sector since not only did the private sector have wage stagnation and job insecurity, but benefits attrition as the compensation ratio from the top end and middle end (let alone the lower end) in the private sector got increasingly top heavy as it is today.

So the screwed portion of the private sector (as in any who lost jobs, or have jobs with limited benefits and limited compensation gain over the past two decades) resent those in the public sector who were in many ways insulated from the Reagan (trickle down) revolution.

OK -- so what to do. The thinking is clearly the public sector compensation (particularly benefits) needs to be reduced to bring it in sync with the compensation stagnation and job insecurity of the shafted private sector.

And Republican governance knows how to do this -- keep taxes on the uber rich low, reduce government support for the lower and middle classes, and blame it on those nasty civil servants who didn't get shafted.

It's a nice trick -- misdirection at its best. And it seems it will work too.

Posted by: Barry8 | February 18, 2011 6:22 PM | Report abuse

yay

this teabag monarch has already lost its grip

viva the principles of the Declaration

Posted by: lichtme | February 18, 2011 6:29 PM | Report abuse

This is the new Republican playbook nationwide.
First we give our rich buddies a free pass on their taxes.
Then we tell the people who work in our state that they are going to pay for it.
There is only one response:
EVERY person working under a union contract in the state of Wisconsin should leave their job.
Forget fire-fighting.
Forget generation of water treatment plants.
Forget collecting garbage.
Forget police protection.
Forget snow removal.
Forget schools; shut ‘em all down.
Tell the people of Wisconsin if they are so enamored by their Republican overlords, let them leave their private sector jobs, or work after hours and run the schools, the water treatment plans, serve as police officers, tend the state offices.
Hey, Wisconsin allowed this fool election.
Now, let Wisconsin citizens pay the price for electing this dolt.
Unions succeed by solidarity.
Time to solidify union support state-wide and teach the state a lesson in whether the jobs they offer are worth having.
Shut the stupid state down.

Posted by: Judy-in-TX | February 18, 2011 6:35 PM | Report abuse

No reason to believe that Conservatives are serious about deficit reduction until they are willing to discuss compromise regarding their own sacred cows--- military spending and tax rates. Until then they are just exploiting a crisis for partisan gain.

Posted by: ablum1

Precisely - it's all a lie for purposes of political gain and political retribution. I'll listen when they start talking honestly about the real welfare queens, the military and subsidies, tax credits & tax 'abatements' to corporations. Throw in means testing of entitlements and fully taxing earnings for SS instead of giving the wealthy a break, and I'll listen some more. BUT, I don't expect to hear any of that from the GOP - they can't upset their masters.

Posted by: kg1957 | February 18, 2011 6:48 PM | Report abuse

If there is any justice in the world, they will fire the public employees and hire the thousands of unemployed that would love to have half the freebies these leaches are demanding from us. The Dems and their determination to add more and more welfare programs are ruining this country. If the PHD's etc think they can do better then let them get into the real job market an compete with the true workers of this nation and stop whinning that they are owed something more than everyone else. They chose theoir profession and now that they have to deal with real life they can't handle it. Maybe if they did teach instead of run off at the mouth about how they are being abused, they may gain some support but as it stand, the Gov of WI is simply trying to keep his state sound and in tact. Obama and other need to deal with problems like unemployment 2 wars and an unsecured border. They can't do their jobs much less tell a public servant how to do his. If they'd take a lesson from some of the state goverments and for once try to keep one of their promises instead of faulting someone else that does.

Posted by: Hopinghere2 | February 18, 2011 7:04 PM | Report abuse

Remember Obama said "We won", "Get in the back of the Bus", that the left was calling people peacefully protesting Nazis, Racist and Bigots? Well where is the outrage now? Oh you only see it in Wisconsin because the governor is not a democrat. You don't see them doing the same in Maryland where workers have been on temporary furloughs for over a year. You don't see it in New York where the governor is getting ready to do the same thing do you? As far as I am concerned the Governor has just as much right as Obama did to say "We Won".

But the simple matter is the money is not their folks, it is just not there. It this or layoffs. It is the end of largess by government unions at the expense of taxpayers who are hurting. Wonder why revenues are down? Because people just don't have the money. But the Government workers have failed to realise that, they fail to realise who they work for. They are telling people they deserve whatever they want first before the taxpayers families. Well to quote the President's preacher the chickens have come home to roost. Americans are tightening their belts, doing without and they demand the government to do the same.

Posted by: Pilot1 | February 18, 2011 7:10 PM | Report abuse

So once a day or more every Jewish/zionist columnist

has to write a story about Hitler or the holocaust. It's just the case.

What happened to the rabbi's organization that wanted such not to be mentioned again. Except by themselves, apparently, asevery time Israel pulls some outrage, as yestrday with the Iranian ships, we get another bunch.

Something on one placard, in one demonstration in one state. And wowie, we have to get a whine.

Posted by: whistling | February 18, 2011 2:56 PM | Report abuse

---

Typical antisemite leftie.

Posted by: scoran | February 18, 2011 7:13 PM | Report abuse

RIGHTIST THUG GOVERNOR WALKER CREATED THE BUDGET CRISIS IN WISCONSIN OUT OF THIN AIR !!!


Walker and the new Republican-controlled state legislature in Wisconsin largely created the deficit problem they claim must be solved on the backs of public servants.


Walker claims that the state is broke. However, the Wisconsin Fiscal Bureau, a sort of in-state CBO, disagrees with Walker and projects a net positive balance of 56 million for the state by the end of June, 2011. Further, the Bureau argues that the state would have had an additional $139.7 $202.8 million to work with over the next two years if not for the tax cuts already passed during Walker’s brief administration. Yet further, as recently as February 1st, Walker did not announce his plans on how to pay for those cuts:


The measure joins three others Walker has signed in his first month in office that he said will send a message that Wisconsin is more business friendly. Walker, a Republican, has seen his legislative agenda speed through the Republican-controlled Legislature even though he has yet to explain how he'll pay for everything in light of the state's projected $3 billion budget shortfall.


WALKER IS EXAGGERATING AND FUELING WISCONSIN'S FISCAL CRISIS AS AN EXCUSE TO BUST UNIONS !!!


http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2011/02/wisconsin-gov-walker-ginned-up-budget-shortfall-to-undercut-worker-rights.php


The top salaries for gov't workers in Wisconsin would include Walker and his Republican pals, who are currently taking a sh^t on their lower wage counter parts.


Why isn't anyone demanding that Walker and Co take a severe pay cut and give up their benefits?


There is no budget crisis in Wisconsin, that's why.


Walker created this "crisis" out of thin air just for the opportunity to bust Wisconsin unions.


PASS IT ON, DEMOCRATS !


LET'S TAKE BACK OUR FREEDOM FROM THE DICTATOR RIGHTIST GOONS !!!


IMPEACH MULLAH WALKER AND THE RIGHTIST TEABAGGER THUG GOV'T IN WISCONSIN !!!


.

Posted by: DrainYou | February 18, 2011 7:21 PM | Report abuse

Hey libbies, since your darlings are using hateful rhetoric, if there is violence against any republicans in WI, will you accept the blame? Or another double standard you have?

Posted by: scoran | February 18, 2011 7:22 PM | Report abuse

Poster called j751 who said the average teacher salary in Wisconsin is 89,000 per year is lying.

I got the spreadsheet for teacher salaries per district for 2010 off the a Wisconsin website. It showed high, average and low salaries per district. I selected the average column and averaged it. And the answer is, 49,000. The highest of the averages was 61,700. The lowest was 36,100. As with every state I've ever lived in, these differences are the result of differing levels of wealth in the different districts. They also explode the myth of the Monolithic Union Money Extracting Monster. It's just another republican lie.

Posted by: jimdim | February 18, 2011 7:42 PM | Report abuse

union thugs? i wouls suspect the persson who made this commentr is against the minimum wage, in favor of child labor, against unemployment compensation, abortion rights
, believes obama was not born in the us and is a muslim. hy were the police ,firwe and state trooper unions exempt in this bill? DEid they support endorsed the gov in the last election? are they among the protesters?

Posted by: dartking2010 | February 18, 2011 7:43 PM | Report abuse

All in all I think decying the lack of civility on protest signs is akin to decrying the lack of civility in blog posts.

Still, theoretical factual errors or whatever aside, I think Mr Stromberg is right to say that no matter how accurate we think our outlandish comparisons are, they almost never help and often hurt the side of whomever is using them. Also, it doesn't take much courage to fling poo at one's adversary. It does take courage to tell people you may normally agree with that you don't agree with their current course of action.

Now for the fun part:

Kaneg423 wrote:
I can't believe what the Republicans are doing. They are making people pay for almost HALF their pension, what gall. How dare you make me pay almost 13% of my health care premiums? What is this, communist Russia? I can't afford a midle class life if other people pay only 87% of my costs. When I retire with a bloated, manipulated pension that I paid 6% of, things are going to get tight.


Yes, wow, so meaningful. I mean you just took those numbers, put some words around them, and magically made a mocking shame of organized labor. Good for you.

I mean it's not like YOU would find it at all onerous or underhanded if the healthcare benefits you took instead of a pay increase suddenly cost you twice as much. Or if you found out the only reason for this increase was to reduce a budget gap made by the very person pushing the increase.

The best part about your whole wonderfully reasoned little speech is the fact that you completely ignore the main factor of the argument that is the limitations of collective bargaining rights. What a shrewd move! Instead of addressing the issue head-on with a reasoned approach like the idea that workers should be able to choose to belong to unions or arguing that it is not unreasonable for union workers not to get wage increases that are unreflective of the current rate of inflation without public support, you just ignore it and mumble something about Russia. Well done my friend, well done.

And THAT is how satire is done b***h.

Posted by: ashtar377 | February 18, 2011 7:50 PM | Report abuse

j751 wrote "I love it when the real face of leftism rises. Nasty, violent, bigoted "

===================================

Kind of like looking in a mirror for j751 and I guess j751 did not like what it saw -- himself from the right looking at what they looked like as they marched with posters of Obama as Hitler, Stalin, etc. -- but that was okay because it was the right doing it and God knows GOD prefers the right because the right tells us so.

Posted by: Freethotlib | February 18, 2011 7:50 PM | Report abuse

Its hard to understand how taking away the collective bargaining rights of the public workers is about the budget.

The truth is that instead of rewarding public workers with salary increases, governments have been instead giving them benefits. Teachers, policeman, fireman, etc. don't make high salary's compared to people in the private sector. They do have better benefits. So its a balancing act.

Minnesota just just taxes for the wealthy, now they need to balance the budget on the workers. This is the Republican strategy and has been for decades. Take from the poor and middle class and give to the rich. Its called class warfare.

Posted by: reussere | February 18, 2011 7:55 PM | Report abuse

And the headline is correct. Walker is not hitler. He's just another lying republican semi-fascist who gins up the resentments of the poorly paid (who should be in unions) and of the ignorant (who should be praying for higher wages for teachers) in order to achieve the corporate agenda, which equals less power and less pay for workers.

It's like the argument over immigration. Business wants lots of immigrants to beat down wages. The republicans, owned by business, kicked off the massive influx in 1986. However, the not very well off, the ignorant, and the stupid hate immigrants, and are willing to blame them for pretty much everything. So Republicans tell these people that they are against all this immigration, legal and illegal. The not well off, the ignorant and the stupid (all of whom who should be in unions) vote republican.

And the day the republicans stop immigration will be the day their business donors stop giving them huge chunks of money. So when do you think that's going to happen? Maybe after they break all the unions, and get their semi-literate voters to work for immigrant wages.

Posted by: jimdim | February 18, 2011 7:57 PM | Report abuse

"the rights of the individual are subordinate to the state",,Martin Bormann 1941,,these repeated slanders against greater Germany are totally uncalled for,,communist inspired worker uprisings cannot be permitted in todays verld.

Posted by: schmidt1 | February 18, 2011 8:02 PM | Report abuse


OH, PAY NO ATTENTION!!

Once a day (OR MORE), in every newspaper, some Jewish columnist
has to write a story mentioning Hitler or the holocaust. And let out a big whine.

(ESPECIALLY when Israel has just done outrageous thing, like ysterday's big lie screaming about the Iranian ships.)

THAT'S JUST THE WAY IT IS! Don't pay any attention. Tomorrow will be the same thing..

Posted by: whistling | February 18, 2011 8:07 PM | Report abuse

Republicans are trying to destroy the middle class in Wisconsin and you are upset about some signs?

Wow.

If I were in Wiscinson, I would be standing two inches from Taliban Mullah Scott Walker's face and spitting into it.

How you like them apples, Sparky?

Posted by: ExConservative

-- Yup. And I'd be laughing whole-heartedly when the secret service cracked your skull in.

Posted by: enaughton27 | February 18, 2011 8:10 PM | Report abuse


Stromberg thinks

Hitler belongs only to him

and his. To use in his stupid column, or not. NO ONE ELSE CAN MENTION HIM.

Actually, HItler belongs to all the millions of the world of WWII, all the fathers and sons and brothers and grandfathers (mine) killed, all the horrors and fears,
all the houses, and countriside and nations he ruined. All the fear and horror he committed.

But Stromberg thinks he owns the name, and can instruct everyone how to use it.

Posted by: whistling | February 18, 2011 8:23 PM | Report abuse

What a mistake by rightwingers, and you are one of them. Let's see what you do when you're fired, Stromberg

Posted by: dudh | February 18, 2011 8:26 PM | Report abuse

What a mistake by rightwingers, and you are one of them. Let's see what you do when you're fired, Stromberg

Posted by: dudh | February 18, 2011 8:31 PM | Report abuse

[@ 7:57 PM on February 18, 2011 jimdim Posted: "...just another lying..."]
= = = = = = =
So many misconstruals, so little time. Guess Wright trumps Right, dimjim. Anybody would rather be semi-illiterate, than semi-illegal, rather be anything than a total brain shrunken big empty head looking for a pin to be the head of.

Snot Bloggers suck the light and life out of the discussion, the Republic, and the World.

Posted by: RichNomore | February 18, 2011 8:33 PM | Report abuse

Responding to:
I love how Democrats are so ignorant of their own party's history.

Hitler was a Democrat. Leader of the Nationalsozialistische Deutsche Arbeiterpartei or the National Socialist German Workers' Party. And in that, Obama isnt that much different than Hitler. The different? Obama hasnt begun killing people to keep Democrats in power yet, but there are two years left of his regime...

Posted by: xatiannorthsea | February 18, 2011 2:14 PM | Report abuse
____________

This is one of the most moronic comments I have seen yet. You don't know a thing about German or Austrian history. Hitler grew up in Austria and was influenced by the Catholic Socialist party. Sounds Socialist, doesn't it? Unfortunately for all you Beckheads, the Catholic Socialist party was viscerally opposed to Socialism and Communism; it was "social" in that it provided soup kitchens and the like, as the Catholic church still continues to do.

The Nazi party was "socialist" in the same way--it provided soups kitchens and the like. But it quickly destroyed all independent unions and handed power over the workers to big business. The Nazi party viciously persecuted union leaders, socialists, and communists, building concentration camps to terrorize them and other resisters to their regime. So how are the modern Democrats in any way, shape, or form like the Nazis?

Here's another bit of reliable information for all you Beckheads: the Democratic party is not now and has never been "socialist." The American and English Liberal traditions are radically different than the Marxist tradition. Read John Stuart Mill, for instance, one of the guiding spirits of liberalism: Mill is programatically opposed to the founding ideas of Marxism, as Marx was fundamentally opposed to the founding ideas of liberalism. The Democratic party is overwhelmingly a liberal party, which means that it is a liberal capitalist party.

Is it possibly that a few of you might finally open your minds up to some real historical information? You'll need to shut your mouths for a bit and sift out all the right-wing propaganda that's accumulated in your brains.

Until then, I really hope you'll stop polluting these response sites with your filth.

Posted by: GeorgeSanders | February 18, 2011 8:39 PM | Report abuse

"morally contemptible"

to use placards reprising Hitler?

MY GOOODNESS, this little Stromberg is very delicate, isn't he? Hitler''s name has been used a million million times on placards, fund raising papers, nsults, since the '30s, but

Stomberg thinks it "morally contemptable" to do it again. It passes unnoticed by most.

Maybe something new...like the savage invaders of Gaza...the cluster bombers of women and children in Lebanon...which made the rest of the world wretch in fury.
Now, themaybe they'd be new and shocking on placards. Stromberg should save his rage for something new.

Posted by: whistling | February 18, 2011 8:39 PM | Report abuse

Over-reaching? Yes! Their rhetoric is excessive. Tone it down.

On the other hand, Tea Party Conservatives have routinely compared Obama to Hitler, and liberals to Nazis (even though Nazism was a Conservative political movement). Why don't these people read a little history?

Par for the course.

Posted by: samsara15 | February 18, 2011 8:44 PM | Report abuse

Responding to

If there is any justice in the world, they will fire the public employees and hire the thousands of unemployed that would love to have half the freebies these leaches are demanding from us. The Dems and their determination to add more and more welfare programs are ruining this country. If the PHD's etc think they can do better then let them get into the real job market an compete with the true workers of this nation and stop whinning that they are owed something more than everyone else. They chose theoir profession and now that they have to deal with real life they can't handle it. Maybe if they did teach instead of run off at the mouth about how they are being abused, they may gain some support but as it stand, the Gov of WI is simply trying to keep his state sound and in tact. Obama and other need to deal with problems like unemployment 2 wars and an unsecured border. They can't do their jobs much less tell a public servant how to do his. If they'd take a lesson from some of the state goverments and for once try to keep one of their promises instead of faulting someone else that does.

Posted by: Hopinghere2 | February 18, 2011 7:04 PM | Report abuse
___________________

Here is why we need professors––to correct the spelling and grammar of people like you.

"Leach" is not "Leech"--you chose the wrong word.
"Whinning" is not an English word.
"Theoir" is not an English word.
"As it stand" should be "as it stands".
The sentence in which this phrase appears is a run-on; you need a comma before "but".
"In tact" is nonsense; you meant "intact".
You need commas in this passage: "unemployment 2 wars and an unsecured border".
"Goverments" is misspelled.
The final sentence is a very long fragment. An "if..." clause of this sort requires a "then..." conclusion.
The end of this sentence should be "someone who does". The "else" should be removed.
After correcting these mechanical faults of your posting, you need to move on to fix the incoherent sequence of thoughts and work on formulating your thoughts precisely. Ensuring that your posting relies on facts (i.e., true statements about the real world) is, of course a necessary step that you will need to take. Until then, I will have to give your posting a failing grade.

Now, as a professor, I am certain that you cannot just walk into my job and do it for me. Your posting proves that you have not been educated to that level. So perhaps you should take back your claim that "anyone" can do my job.

Posted by: GeorgeSanders | February 18, 2011 8:56 PM | Report abuse

What a mistake by rightwingers, and you are one of them. Let's see what you do when you're fired, Stromberg

Posted by: dudh

========================================

Since the WaPo is a private company he would be out of luck. If he belonged to a government union and was a teacher in, say, New york City, he wouldn't be fired.

He would be sent to a city-owned "rubber room." While the union fought any disciplinary action tooth-and-nail he would be paid full salary and not work. He can read the paper or play with himself all day long.

Not such a bad deal.

Posted by: bbface21 | February 18, 2011 9:04 PM | Report abuse

Responding to:
What's with the violent rhetoric? Don't Obama's sycophants remember his Tuscon speech?

Wow. No one pays attention to Obama anymore...

Posted by: HughJassPhD | February 18, 2011 3:15 PM | Report abuse
_________________________________
Dear HughJass,

There was nothing violent in Obama's Tucson speech, and there was no incitement to violence. Therefore, your comment is a dishonest piece of garbage. I do not believe that you have a PhD; where I come from, no one who had earned a PhD could comment such as yours demonstrating complete academic incompetence could live with him- or herself.

Posted by: GeorgeSanders | February 18, 2011 9:47 PM | Report abuse

Nasty Democrat union thugs on full display before the whole country. Obama offering full throated encouragement. Tim Kaine dispatching outside agitators to stir up more trouble. As a Tea Partier let me say, "Thank you, thank you, thank you."

Posted by: jy151310 | February 18, 2011 9:48 PM | Report abuse

False equivalencies are the usually boring attempts to excuse the vomitous behavior of low live conservatives.

Posted by: tuonela | February 18, 2011 10:26 PM | Report abuse

As the wife of a long time Wisconsin teacher w/his Master's degree....I want to know in what district teachers are making $89,000. We'll move there tomorrow!
The only people in education I know making that much are administrators - and they aren't in the union!

Posted by: lmi55 | February 19, 2011 1:11 AM | Report abuse

So, let me see, the Wisconsin Governor and the NJ Governor go after the female dominant college educated teachers and call their salaries and benefits extravagant while protecting and venerating their police and firefighters. Gee, do I detect the stench of sexism here? It's like the Republicans to speak about the sanctity of life while cutting off monies to clinics that provide prenatal and postnatal, cancer screening, contraceptive counseling and services by calling them 'abortion providers' while deeming military funding as sacred. It seems as if women are fair game to demonize and exploit for political gain and to gather out their anti-middle and working class agenda.

In NJ the Governor has demonized the teachers as greedy with extravagant pensions, meanwhile, being almost silent about the pensions of police and firefighters whose pensions are based on their salaries plus overtime for their three highest years of pay. Maybe, the Wisconsin and NJ Governors are afraid of going after the police and firefighters so they act like bullies towards women.

There is ample evidence that public employees are paid below the the private sector yet the MEDIA DOES LITTLE TO REPORT THE FACTS ABOUT THEIR PAY. So, the public goes after their neighbors rather then face the real facts which are as simplistic as the Republicans are making them out to be.

Posted by: anne15 | February 19, 2011 1:48 AM | Report abuse

See what is going on in wisconsin with your own eyes and see how this bill is being RAMMED through. This was live coverage of the assembly meeting today, 2-18, click on PART FOUR. You will need to watch a very minimum of about ten minutes. http://www.wiseye.com/Programming/VideoArchive/EventDetail.aspx?evhdid=3759

Posted by: laramill | February 19, 2011 1:49 AM | Report abuse

Ah, the pathology of the parasite. You people disgust me.

These public employee union parasites would gladly, given half the chance, do away with their most troublesome obstacle. Their students.

I had to stay home from work & sacrifice a day's pay because my 7 year old's teacher is taking another PAID "sick day". Do you think I'll be compensated for the time I'm not working, like she will?

But hey, it's understandable, right? These "educators" are far too emotionally traumatized to be expected to "work" on a day like this. Can you believe it, they're actually being asked to personally contribute a whole 12 & 1/2 percent of the cost of their own health care coverage. Dear God, what tyranny!

See, they're demanding that I PAY FOR IT ALL. As well they should. "Public service" means the tax-paying public only exists to serve those on the public payroll, clearly. Yep, my 2nd grader's "teacher" DESERVES her $93,700 a year & tenure/absolute job security with zero performance accountability whatsoever, no matter how incompetent she is with her finger coloring. She's ENTITLED to a guaranteed salary & benefits for life, she teaches 2nd grade!

& now that the state's broke & there's no money to pay her with, it's her DUTY as an "educator" to abandon her "students"  & agitate on the Capital steps with her fellow communists (I mean "educators") to protect all the taxpayer funded goodies she's ENTITLED to in perpetuity. She's a public servant. The public must serve her.

& the kids? Screw em! Little bastards are ranked 32nd in the nation in English comprehension skills, & 35th in math (Wallstreet Journal 2/14). Sure, Wisconsin public teachers are SPECTACULAR failures, but we mustn't EVER consider giving parents any choice in which public school they're children must attend. That would mean that schools would have to actually COMPETE to offer their students the best education. This wouldn't be FAIR to all the incompetent teachers, & they're be far less need for the multiple layers of administrative beurocrats, each making 70-200k a year. & if teacher actually earned what they're worth, there would be no need for Unions. & how would Democrats get elected, if they couldn't buy the loyalty of all their Union constituents by promising them more & more opulent "benefit package",  using taxpayer money?

Since the status-quo is working so beautifully, there's no need to make any changes. Vastly improving the quality of our children's education is just code for "attacking workers' rights".

I'll be in Madison tomorrow, with thousands more like me. We'd have been there during the week, but unlike public employees & professional grievance hustlers, we don't get paid to blow off work to gather at the Capital to demand that our fellow citizens pay for our lavish, unsustainable, & frankly, obscene "collectively bargained" benefit packages.

Posted by: ThisMachineKillsFascists | February 19, 2011 2:43 AM | Report abuse

I love it when the real face of leftism rises. Nasty, violent, bigoted and entitled (for what I am not sure). These union goons are absolute parasites on our country.I am also quite sure that the Post will ignore those signs made by our children's educators after this blog post of yours. Wisconsin teachers avg compensation is $89,000 per year for a 9 month job. That pay is considerably higher than the state avg. They are having a hissy fit about paying 12% of their own health care? Really? Buzzards.

Posted by: j751
----------------------------------------
Teacher's pay averages less than $50,000 a year.

Your Estimate must include Principals and other Administrators whose salaries are Over $100,000 Annually. They don't Teach Students.

Posted by: ddoiron1 | February 19, 2011 3:06 AM | Report abuse

OK, so the guy doesn't speak German so it is a false comparison to equate him with Hitler.

He clearly a Fascist, an American Fascist.

Posted by: timothy2me | February 19, 2011 6:04 AM | Report abuse

"Wisconsin teachers avg compensation is $89,000 per year for a 9 month job. That pay is considerably higher than the state avg. They are having a hissy fit about paying 12% of their own health care? Really? Buzzards."

The average teacher pay in Wisconsin is $46,000. The starting pay for new teachers in Wisconsin is $24,000 which is ranked second to the lowest in the country, 49th.

There is a trade off that goes on during collective bargaining between pay and benefits. It was the states themselves that preferred to increase benefits in place of increasing pay.

One can compare the benefits that Private industry gives their college grads to what states give teachers and clearly the teachers receive higher benefits. But there is the other side of that coin. If you compare pay then teachers receive far less pay.

This is not about benefits. It is about the right to collective bargaining.

Posted by: timothy2me | February 19, 2011 7:11 AM | Report abuse

Blather. Not even good blather.

You should be ashamed.

Posted by: GaryEMasters | February 19, 2011 7:23 AM | Report abuse

You're right, it's unfair to say Republicans hate people. They only hate people who aren't rich. They love the rich and are willing servants in exchange for donations.

Posted by: guyachs | February 19, 2011 9:33 AM | Report abuse

Responding to:
What's with the violent rhetoric? Don't Obama's sycophants remember his Tuscon speech?

Wow. No one pays attention to Obama anymore...

Posted by: HughJassPhD | February 18, 2011 3:15 PM | Report abuse
_________________________________
Dear HughJass,

There was nothing violent in Obama's Tucson speech, and there was no incitement to violence. Therefore, your comment is a dishonest piece of garbage. I do not believe that you have a PhD; where I come from, no one who had earned a PhD could comment such as yours demonstrating complete academic incompetence could live with him- or herself.

Posted by: GeorgeSanders
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Georgie Boy - You should really go back to school for a remedial reading course. The guy is referring to the violent rhetoric in Madison in the face of Obama's call for civility in his Tucson speech.

Posted by: alexandria6351 | February 19, 2011 10:01 AM | Report abuse

wow, j751
from the looks of it, you seem to think it's ok for YOU to use words like "goons,"
"bigoted," "parasites," and "buzzards."
you know if i were asking "the other side" to tone the rhetoric down a bit, i would make sure mine was toned down first.
just a friendly suggestion.

Posted by: UnionMadeMaid | February 19, 2011 10:31 AM | Report abuse

So the Wisconsin GOP found a few offensive signs among the protestors in Madison? What evidence do they provide that those signs were not planted there by the Wisconsin GOP to discredit the protestors? I'll answer, they give no evidence.

Posted by: chaos1588 | February 19, 2011 11:10 AM | Report abuse

I believe Obama is more of a Marxist, then Gov. Walker is a Fascist

Posted by: nomobarry | February 19, 2011 11:27 AM | Report abuse

Georgie Boy - You should really go back to school for a remedial reading course. The guy is referring to the violent rhetoric in Madison in the face of Obama's call for civility in his Tucson speech.

Posted by: alexandria6351 | February 19, 2011 10:01 AM | Report abuse
___________
Alexandria,

At least your response is coherent, for which I thank you.

HughJass wrote,"What's with the violent rhetoric? Don't Obama's sycophants remember his Tuscon speech?" Your explanation of what he meant is reasonable, but what he wrote could be interpreted several ways because it is barely coherent.

For example, those protesting in Madison are not "Obama's syncophants"; many union members, especially those in teacher unions are very angry with the Obama administration. They took the lead in these protests, and the Obama administration supported them after the protests had started. What is more, Obama's Tucson speech was non-partisan: his message was not aimed toward his supporters, but rather at all Americans. If HughJass thinks it is a good idea, he should call on all Americans to adhere to it, not just the side he doesn't like.

Second, whatever "violent" rhetoric has appeared in Madison is child's play compared to the right-wing gunplay rhetoric over the last few years; for example, I haven't seen any signs among the protesters in Madison calling for "2nd-amendment solutions" to the problem or calling for violent overthrow of the government. So there is no relationship between the mildly overheated rhetoric in Madison and the extremely violent rhetoric generated mostly by the right wing, which understandably became a focus of concern after people were killed and wounded in Arizona. Therefore, HughJass's posting is logically irrelevant.

I think you'll agree with me that HughJass is the one who needs to go back to school and learn to formulate his thoughts precisely. A course in logic wouldn't hurt.

Posted by: GeorgeSanders | February 19, 2011 1:18 PM | Report abuse

It is comical to see the con trolls trying to hurl their little empty missles at the union protesters. They claim the left is nasty--not like those models of civility, the Tea Party boobs who depicted Obama with a bone in his nose, and called him without irony, Hitlerian and Marxist. They claim they are violent--again, not like their Tea Party mates who vandalized offices, spit at Congressmen and fought with non-believers. And who showed up openly armed to underscore their "points". They claim the left feels entitled--unlike the trolls and the TEABAGGERS, who want to take "their America" back, as though the rest of us --you know, the ones who overwhelmingly defeated you--exist as treasonous interlopers.

This false budget crisis in Wisconsin was not of the unions making. Wisconsin has a SURPLUS for this year..and it would be larger were it not for the Republican governor and his legislative allies giving tax cuts to corporations and the wealthy. The thread goes back to the Wall Street greed merchants who sold toxic assets to state pension funds, collapsing their balances and creating the crisis. The unions have offered to concede every point EXCEPT the right to collectively bargain--the bedrock right of all unionized workers. This is about Republican Party politics--and trying to slam the one group that stands up for regular Americans against the corporations.

Posted by: bklyndan22 | February 19, 2011 2:37 PM | Report abuse

Bravo, bklyndan22,

Your response cuts right to the heart of the matter. Right-wingers consistently hold the left wing to the highest standards of behavior, but exempt themselves from any standards. On the contrary, they have been plumbing the depths over the last few years, competing with each other in discovering ever more violent, inflammatory, and contemptuous rhetoric. The media plays along with this game, and Democrats have been suckers for it for too long. When you are playing with dishonest, foul-mouthed opponents, the first thing you need to do is keep them from succeeding. Sometimes you have to bend your own rules for behavior; this is bad, but the consequences of allowing malicious liars into power are far worse.

Posted by: GeorgeSanders | February 19, 2011 5:24 PM | Report abuse

This thing in Wisconsin is going to spread all over America and I believe when all is said and done people like Gov. Walker will be dealt with harshly. Walker should consider what happened to King Louis XVI and Marie Antoinette in 1792 France. Same issues folks and it can happen again. Also, who does he think he is talking about the National Guard??
Does he fancy himself a president or just the Nazi he is.

Posted by: edgordon2003 | February 19, 2011 6:10 PM | Report abuse

Tea Party FASCISTS: Go back to Nazi Germany, where you belong!

Posted by: thomasmc1957 | February 19, 2011 6:21 PM | Report abuse

$300,000,000.00 Fund Raiser for """Obama Proof of Eligibility""" Right now millions of Americans want to donate money to any group who will go after Obama and produce all his records? Upwards of 100 million people are demanding his records and willing to pay to see them, even large amounts of money woudl be donated some say by individuals? One person said, "Real long term success and greatness in our country are founded upon the principles that people do not lie, cheat, or steal but Obama does not know the meaning of these words. Our nation is neither succeeding nor is great at this point in time because we have allowed Obama's voice to grow and spread throughout our society. Shame on us, we shuld have said stop the lying long ago...
Our nation does have the potential to be a fabulous nation again; however, let’s stop kidding ourselves in thinking that we are a great nation currently. How is it that America has lost its greatness? One word, Obama!!!!

Posted by: Richie5 | February 19, 2011 6:39 PM | Report abuse

Responding to
$300,000,000.00 Fund Raiser for """Obama Proof of Eligibility""" Right now millions of Americans want to donate money to any group who will go after Obama and produce all his records? Upwards of 100 million people are demanding his records and willing to pay to see them, even large amounts of money woudl be donated some say by individuals? One person said, "Real long term success and greatness in our country are founded upon the principles that people do not lie, cheat, or steal but Obama does not know the meaning of these words. Our nation is neither succeeding nor is great at this point in time because we have allowed Obama's voice to grow and spread throughout our society. Shame on us, we shuld have said stop the lying long ago...
Our nation does have the potential to be a fabulous nation again; however, let’s stop kidding ourselves in thinking that we are a great nation currently. How is it that America has lost its greatness? One word, Obama!!!!

Posted by: Richie5
________

Richie,

"Let’s stop kidding ourselves in thinking that we are a great nation currently." So you don't think that America is a great nation, simply because your candidate lost the last election? You really don't like America much, don't you? I mean by "America" the real, existing country you live in, not the fantasy you've dreamt up. You also apparently hate the American political system, which requires that the side that loses an election form a loyal opposition, rather than trying to destroy the country.

It's clear that you are full of bitterness, and you blame everything that's going wrong with your life on the President of the United States. Someone knocked over your trash can? Must be Obama's fault. The weather's cold and miserable? Guess who's to blame.

You wrote, "Real long term success and greatness in our country are founded upon the principles that people do not lie, cheat, or steal but Obama does not know the meaning of these words." Well, if Obama does not know the meaning of "lie," "cheat," or "steal," then he must be an awfully honest fellow. I think you tripped over your words here.

Actually, I'm not sure if there's any use writing to someone who is delusional enough to believe that 100 million Americans are demanding to see his birth certificate. No, it's only the thousands of loons like you who are unable to distinguish their fantasies from reality. Enter the real world, stop blaming the president for your trivial problems, and please stop whining and polluting the discourse with your fantasies.

Posted by: GeorgeSanders | February 19, 2011 7:11 PM | Report abuse

The fact that the teachers are calling off sick and not going to work is a perfect example of how Unions work. When they don't get their way they just call out sick. Personal experience with Unions,has taught me they are a bunch of thugs. I have to pay 50 percent of my medical benefits and our company stopped retirement benefits. What these individuals are ask to pay is quite modest. Don't forget teachers work 9 months a year. So their salaries are based on a 9 months of work. Pay me between 30 and 45,000 and only expect me to work 9 months--I'll take the job.

Posted by: ONEWHICH | February 20, 2011 2:15 AM | Report abuse

Wisconsin represents a mere infantile temper tantrum. As in Greece... it shall wane. All the governor needs to do is to be patient. A huge majority of the US voting population is behind this effort... and Obama only damages his chances for a second term by encouraging this behavior.

Posted by: Guarapari | February 20, 2011 9:21 AM | Report abuse

"If I were in Wiscinson, I would be standing two inches from Taliban Mullah Scott Walker's face and spitting into it."

I see "ExConservative" (I don't believe that) is taking a page from 0bama's playbook when he told his followers to "get in their faces". Is "ExConservative" also going to follow through on 0bama's suggestion to bring a gun to the fight? Well, if the President says it's OK, does that make it OK?

Posted by: gjtitus | February 20, 2011 9:30 AM | Report abuse

And the Democrats hiding out and cringing in the shadows aren't exactly profiles in manliness. What a bunch of sissies! They can't even man up to come and vote, instead vacationing on the taxpayers' dime. You and I would never get away with this on our jobs. These miscreants and thieves should be recalled.

Posted by: gjtitus | February 20, 2011 9:40 AM | Report abuse

Anticipating the next levels of the attack I'm busy drawing my "Malia is Hitler" signs.

We'll be passing them out shortly

Posted by: muawiyah | February 20, 2011 9:46 AM | Report abuse

edgordon2003 ~ like the schoolteachers Louis XVI was a GOVERNMENT EMPLOYEE.

They cut off his head and ELECTED a successor.

I think you are treading on some dangerous ground here 'cause it's YOUR HEAD not Governor Walker's at risk.

Posted by: muawiyah | February 20, 2011 9:51 AM | Report abuse

You have got to love the complete and utter stupidity by the usual Leftist.

In November the PEOPLE of Wisconsin and tea partiers completely destroyed and voted out their Democrats and elected the Republicans to clean up the mess starting with the unions.

But like true idiots, they simply are too dense to understand. So the crow about democracy, bahahshsh. The people have spoken you idiots at the votiing booths

YOU LOST. FIRE ALL OF THEM AND START OVER. These UNION-lead idiots have destroyed our world education rankings over the past 40 years anyway. We used to be #1 but now rank down below Bangladesh. Now we can see why???

Fools and morons are teaching our children.

Posted by: LogicalSC | February 20, 2011 10:13 AM | Report abuse

What are "some" of these things that TEA Partiers did? oh and you cannot use Lyndon LaRouche Democrats signs with Obama as Hitler...and that leaves you with...nothing!

Posted by: Jaded2 | February 20, 2011 11:29 AM | Report abuse

The remarkable thing here is that liberal rhetoric has devolved into such venomous slander that the Washington Post is forced to point out that the latest target of lefty loony wrath is not, in fact, Hitler. And look at the pushback from loony lefty legions when common sense breaks out in the WaPo! Why, anybody who claims the Republicans aren't Hitler MUST BE HITLER, TOO! Pretty soon, all the sane people will be Hitler and the only non-Hitlers left will be the rabid, drooling lefty gangsters.

Do you see why we conservatives find your calls for civility so hypocritical? When lefty protestors were carrying Dubya's head on a stick in front of the White House, among other uncivil acts, there was nary a peep from the Washington Post.

Everybody is on to your scam.

Posted by: Steve-Gregg | February 20, 2011 1:17 PM | Report abuse

I'm going to assume that you are similarly outraged over the assertions on the Right that Obama is Hitler, that he's Stalin, that he's a Communist, a Fascist, a Muslim, a Manchurian Candidate, Satan?

Did I leave anything out?

So glad to see the Left is finally energized to fight something existential (and it is) for a change, instead of the war. We will win too, in spite of people like Glenn Beck and Stephen Stromberg.

Posted by: bujeeboo | February 20, 2011 4:55 PM | Report abuse

Madoff was forced to return his ill gotten gains, the same rule should apply to government workers. Courts should decide if an employee deserved their salary. The guilty should be garnished until all over payments are returned.

Posted by: morristhewise | February 20, 2011 5:54 PM | Report abuse

It took more than a week for the negative signs to show up, that makes them suspect to me. I believe they are plants from the GOP. I don't believe these people are a part of the negativity toward governor Walker, they want to talk but he doesn't want to listen. I believe it is, as always, GOP dirty trick to sway public opinion. It was not until the national media picked up the story on or about day four that these signs began to appear. Again, I don't believe it's the protesters.

Posted by: mryfrtsn | February 21, 2011 3:58 PM | Report abuse

No, Walker's not Hitler. He's just a common thief, sticking his hands in the pockets of hardworking people, taking their money, and giving it away to wealthy donors.

We probably won't even have to recall him -- I'd imagine he's cruising for a corruption scandal down the road.

Posted by: IHATETHISFACKINGLOGIN | February 22, 2011 3:41 PM | Report abuse

The more the left (including the media) displays their true nature, the more they lose indy support. I hope the unions ratchet up the protests and all the idiocy that goes along with them. It may have been cute in the '60s, but it sure looks ridiculous now. Skipping school, skipping work, living comfortably off taxpayers while productivity goes down, this doesn't make for sympathetic "victims." The parasites are starting to irritate and enrage the host. Good luck with that parasites.

Posted by: johneb | February 22, 2011 4:02 PM | Report abuse

The Right Wing Hyperbole machine grinds on. Referring to peaceful protesters as "thugs, miscreants, theives, bigots, etc". Charging them with being "rich, lazy and entitled". Such compassion and thought behind the Right's bully-pulpit words.

Thanks for your party's encouragement for everyone to be hands-off to big business, many the same people who bankrupted the Treasury and looted the dreams of our next generation. And you have the audacity to call it, "class warfare" by the (once) middle class. Pathetic. While there is ample reason to ask for sacrifice from all, including teachers, public safety personnel with regard to benefits and wage, your hypocrisy glares brightly when we see the stink you raise when it comes to proposing sacrifice by the rich and powerful. You change your tune mightily then. What gives? Oh, and frame your response without your usual, "we work hard to earn our money and the rest of society are lazy welfare cheats". The middle class are not welfare cheats. Yet. You haven't ground the middle class under your designer boot-heels yet. Class warefare? It's soon will be.

Posted by: tdub55 | February 24, 2011 3:55 PM | Report abuse

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