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Posted at 1:32 PM ET, 12/13/2010

Redskins fade in season's second half--again

By Jason Reid

The Redskins have experienced second-half flops the last three seasons. The team went 2-6 in its final eight games in the 2008 and 2009 seasons under former coach Jim Zorn. Things were supposed to change this season under Coach Mike Shanahan, who won a Super Bowl when he was the San Francisco 49ers' offensive coordinator and then led the Denver Broncos to consecutive Super Bowl championships as a head coach.

But the Redskins are again fading fast in Shanahan's first season. The team has lost three in a row and is 1-4 in the second half of the season.

Defensive lineman-linebacker Andre Carter is in his fifth season with the team, and he's still trying to determine why the Redskins finish so poorly.

"We've had three losses in a row. That has never been the plan," Carter said. "Just being a NFL player and being a professional ... the goals and keys are to always come out and win. It's been very disappointing."

The Redskins are 6-15 in the second half of their schedule over the past three seasons. In the NFC East this season, the Redskins (5-8) are a game ahead of the Dallas Cowboys (4-7), whom they face this week at Cowboys Stadium. If the Redskins finish last, it would be their third consecutive season in the division basement.

"I wish there was an easier remedy, or a better analysis of why we are the way we are," Carter said. "It could be a variety of things, from just the mentality. We have the players, we have the talent and we have the heart.

"It's just now ... I think it's more so detailing our work. As far as from assignment level to execution, etc. If you continue to do that for four straight quarters, it's great. I think our problem is we put in three quarters, or three-and-a-half quarters, of a game, and that last quarter ... kills us."

By Jason Reid  | December 13, 2010; 1:32 PM ET
Categories:  Andre Carter  
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Next: LaRon Landry to IR; Redskins will look at new kickers

Comments

Hey no one loves the skins anymore than I do, but hey this team is going to finish the second half under Shanahan 1-7

Posted by: RedskinRay1 | December 13, 2010 1:41 PM | Report abuse

That's what happens when you're old and suck...

How are we going to get 2 wins for the 2nd half?

Posted by: Scoonie97 | December 13, 2010 1:41 PM | Report abuse

Monk,
Give Danny Smith an offseason with your Swedish soccer player and the guy will be chanigng his name to Shidmist Sonofavich.

Posted by: RedSkinHead | December 13, 2010 1:42 PM | Report abuse

"We have the players, we have the talent and we have the heart." There in lies the problem. We always say we have the talent. Fact is we don't. You can easily get fooled watching film and say if I were a step over here or if would have just blocked him. Reality is you can't make that block because you are too slow, old, or not talented enough. Our players go year after year thinking they are better than they are.

Posted by: edavis291 | December 13, 2010 1:42 PM | Report abuse

So do we get rid of the rookie snapper that we've invested a year in, or do we give him a chance to win his job again in Training Camp and bring in some cometition?

Posted by: monk811 | December 13, 2010 1:44 PM | Report abuse

Gibbs' teams almost always finished the year strong, even Gibbs 2.0... and even when the team wasn't that great.

What did he do that's so different than the parade of coaches before and after him?

Posted by: Alan4 | December 13, 2010 1:50 PM | Report abuse

We're getting killed in the second half of games and in the second half of the season..Are we the oldest team in the league or what??

Posted by: frak | December 13, 2010 1:51 PM | Report abuse

So do we get rid of the rookie snapper that we've invested a year in, or do we give him a chance to win his job again in Training Camp and bring in some cometition?

Posted by: monk811 | December 13, 2010 1:44 PM

John Keim's take on that:

"It was a terrible day for specialists, but Tampa handled it well didn’t it? Sundberg’s snaps were no different than they’d been all season. He’s inconsistent and it hurt them. Hunter Smith is considered a terrific holder, but it’s hard to grab a slick ball and get it down. Do you grow with young guys like Sundberg and Gano? Or do you look for something else? I’d be more apt to find a new long snapper, but if you’re sold on Gano, and you think in two years he could be special then I guess you keep him. He is the sort of guy you rebuild with; a young player with promise. But he’s hurting them now."

Posted by: beep-beep | December 13, 2010 1:51 PM | Report abuse

horrible horrible team. I can't watch these fools anymore.

Posted by: isonic1 | December 13, 2010 1:52 PM | Report abuse

We have the players, we have the talent and we have the heart." There in lies the problem. We always say we have the talent. Fact is we don't. You can easily get fooled watching film and say if I were a step over here or if would have just blocked him. Reality is you can't make that block because you are too slow, old, or not talented enough. Our players go year after year thinking they are better than they are.

Posted by: edavis291 | December 13, 2010 1:42 PM
-------------------------------------------
Yep, I agree with the lack of talent. It has to start up front, though. On offense, you have to be able to block to run, and in a 3-4 defense you need those man-monsters to consume blockers. I'd say they should look at beef in the draft and look at speed in free agency.

Posted by: RedSkinHead | December 13, 2010 1:54 PM | Report abuse

We're getting killed in the second half of games and in the second half of the season..Are we the oldest team in the league or what??

Posted by: frak | December 13, 2010 1:51 PM | Report abuse

I think we're also getting killed in the second half of each quarter, and the second half of each minute, and the second half of each play. Wow, makes you think how we scored 16 points yesterday!

Posted by: monk811 | December 13, 2010 1:54 PM | Report abuse

There is a certain entertainment value in a team that consistently finds new and interesting ways to lose games.
I blame this one on shanny...

Posted by: Stu27 | December 13, 2010 1:55 PM | Report abuse

We have the players, we have the talent and we have the heart." There in lies the problem. We always say we have the talent. Fact is we don't. You can easily get fooled watching film and say if I were a step over here or if would have just blocked him. Reality is you can't make that block because you are too slow, old, or not talented enough. Our players go year after year thinking they are better than they are.

Posted by: edavis291 | December 13, 2010 1:42 PM
-------------------------------------------
Yep, I agree with the lack of talent. It has to start up front, though. On offense, you have to be able to block to run, and in a 3-4 defense you need those man-monsters to consume blockers. I'd say they should look at beef in the draft and look at speed in free agency.

Posted by: RedSkinHead | December 13, 2010 1:55 PM | Report abuse

It was fashionable to dump on Gibbs 2.0, but it was the one of oasis of hope in the last 17 years. At least those teams played mutha-funking hard and finished strong, even the Ledell Betts year. And this was with Vinny at the GM helm. Remember those two playoff drives?? Have we seen one ounce of grit like those teams had before or since. I mean they made the playoffs after Sean Taylor was murdered and Todd Freakin Collins was qb...TODD COLLINS!!!!!!!

F Gibbs 2.o haters...his only problem was quitting early compounded by not just naming Greg Williams HC that afternoon and seeing if we could continue the trend of at least not BEING THE LAUGHING STOCK OF THE LEAGUE!!!!!

Posted by: chrislarry | December 13, 2010 1:56 PM | Report abuse

Apparently Shanny has been down on the bayou studying at the "Les Miles school of crazy time clock management."

Posted by: Stu27 | December 13, 2010 1:57 PM | Report abuse

It was fashionable to dump on Gibbs 2.0, but it was the one of oasis of hope in the last 17 years. At least those teams played mutha-funking hard and finished strong, even the Ledell Betts year. And this was with Vinny at the GM helm. Remember those two playoff drives?? Have we seen one ounce of grit like those teams had before or since. I mean they made the playoffs after Sean Taylor was murdered and Todd Freakin Collins was qb...TODD COLLINS!!!!!!!

F Gibbs 2.o haters...his only problem was quitting early compounded by not just naming Greg Williams HC that afternoon and seeing if we could continue the trend of at least not BEING THE LAUGHING STOCK OF THE LEAGUE!!!!!

Posted by: chrislarry | December 13, 2010 1:58 PM | Report abuse

Shanny's teams should not fade.... isn't he all about how they practice and "cardiovascular endurance"?

Looks a lot like last year to me.

Posted by: Alan4 | December 13, 2010 1:58 PM | Report abuse

Your starters get banged up, can't play or can't play fulltime at 100%. So you go to your backups.

The Skins have mediocre-to-terrible backups because they haven't had enough picks to stockpile talent. Look at the running backs.

Few backups, little depth and over time, you'll get exposed.

Same old story.

Posted by: SteveMG | December 13, 2010 2:02 PM | Report abuse

Redskins fade in season's second half--again


The advantage to losing seasons is that the next season, you play a 'soft' schedule.

We face the AFC East next year and a mix of NFC West teams.

Perhaps we're next year, and facing teams we're even with in terms of talent and personnel.

Posted by: MistaMoe | December 13, 2010 2:05 PM | Report abuse

Apparently Shanny has been down on the bayou studying at the "Les Miles school of crazy time clock management."

Posted by: Stu27
______________________________________________

Oh my, hate to admit, but that is good, and just have to laugh or this Shanahan year is simply too painful

Posted by: RedskinRay1 | December 13, 2010 2:05 PM | Report abuse

Shanny's teams should not fade.... isn't he all about how they practice and "cardiovascular endurance"? ...

Posted by: Alan4
______________________________________________

Another good one, Alan.

Posted by: RedskinRay1 | December 13, 2010 2:08 PM | Report abuse

moe, what is a realistic expectation for next year...in your mind...

I'm thinking we're 7-9, or 8-8....not enough draft choices to make a difference...the offense has to be better right....I mean, there has to be some progression at some point...

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | December 13, 2010 2:09 PM | Report abuse

Why are you guys talking about drafting receivers? This team needs to draft big offensive linemen and nose tackles. Start witht he guys up front in any rebuilding project.

Posted by: RedSkinHead | December 13, 2010 1:38 PM

That wouldn't be my choice. My choice would be to trade back (if possible) and turn our top 10 pick into a late 1st and 2nd. Then pick a C/OG (Pouncey, Wisnewski) and a NT (Powe).

The problem is that it's difficult to trade a top 10 pick and if we're stuck with that pick then you have to draft an impact player. With our lack of talent that would mean best player available. So QB (Mallett- Luck & Newton will be off the board), WR (Jones), or DT/3-4DE (Fariley, Dareus, Paea).

Posted by: Diesel44 | December 13, 2010 2:10 PM | Report abuse

Though he stunk the whole game with his erratic, inaccurate throws, Donovan McNabb was very good in the last drive leading to the potentially tying score.

Hey great news, looks like Shanahan now sees #5DMN has now obtained the cardiovascular fitness to run the hurry up offense, huh?

Posted by: RedskinRay1 | December 13, 2010 2:11 PM | Report abuse

The problem is that it's difficult to trade a top 10 pick and if we're stuck with that pick then you have to draft an impact player...
Posted by: Diesel44
____________________________________________

Yes, Diesel, teams are more reluctant to trade for a top pick because the trend was the asking price was entirely too high.

Perhaps you trade down only a few spots say from 7 to 11 and pick up a #2 rd pick as well.
Then if you want to trade down they can trade again from #11 to say about #20 and pick up an additional selection.

But I agree with you, they need to trade down, and actually I posted on here more than a few times they should trade down and that was for this "PAST" NFL draft even though Vinny claimed he had drafted a Playoff roster and was throwing Zorn under the bus.

Posted by: RedskinRay1 | December 13, 2010 2:17 PM | Report abuse

We will continue to fail in the second half of the season until we get serious about building dominant lines.

Without dominant lines, you are too reliant on scheme and trickery to compensate, and once the other team gets some tape on you, you're done.

With dominant lines it is more about execution. "Sure, we're gonna pound it off the left side. Let's see if you can stop it this time."

Same thing on D.

You dictate the game when you control the lines.

When is the last time that we dictated a game to be played on our terms?

Posted by: edvar | December 13, 2010 2:18 PM | Report abuse

The complete and total draft year bust of 2008 is killing this team, wow was that a complete waste across the board. Final hopes Fred Davis and Kareem Moore aren't good either.

Also someon earlier used RB as example of lack of depth, hey have we had back ups at other positions like Torain and Williams we might be better off, not sure that is position I'd highlight...now Kline, dline, wr, safety, lb, cb....well some valid points there.

Posted by: chrislarry | December 13, 2010 2:21 PM | Report abuse

It's clear that "little Shanny" has serious trouble making halftime adjustments. When the Skins do their 2010 self scouting, that needs to be a key area for improvement.

Posted by: rich20ssu | December 13, 2010 2:23 PM | Report abuse

i noticed gano didn't do much "pointing at his sky god" yesterday. does he think god's not paying attention on the misses? that doesn't really seem rational.... also, one would think gano would STILL be thankful for god, or want to advertise for god, or do whatever he thinks he's doing by pointing upwards (would he point down during a night game?) after he makes a kick, even if he misses.

does god care whether he makes a kick?

Posted by: walter-in-fallschurch | December 13, 2010 2:27 PM | Report abuse

The problem is that it's difficult to trade a top 10 pick and if we're stuck with that pick then you have to draft an impact player. With our lack of talent that would mean best player available. So QB (Mallett- Luck & Newton will be off the board), WR (Jones), or DT/3-4DE (Fariley, Dareus, Paea).

Posted by: Diesel44 | December 13, 2010 2:10 P

I think that with a rookie wage scale that trades may be easier to make. I also think that with the RWS that some positions that would not be taken earlier like guard may go in the top ten because you would not have to sink so much cash into those positions coming out of the draft.

I have nothing to back this up, just my feeling that a RWS will change how teams draft and trades on draft day.

Posted by: kerzon417 | December 13, 2010 2:27 PM | Report abuse

I know the "work with Daddy" thing is a strong pull, but both teams and father son would have been better off staying put. Baby Shanny would have continued to develop on his own terms in Houston (he doesnt coach defense so no blame on him) and Daddy Shanny could have hired some stooge to take orders without all the "MA BOY!" horsesiht that seems to be playing out now.

Nepotism...ugh.

Posted by: chrislarry | December 13, 2010 2:27 PM | Report abuse

cL, agree. For the longest time I would crap on Gibbs 2.0 (back to back TOs kinda still pisses me off) but you have a point: At least they played hard -- with passion and pride. This sorry sack that trots out every Sunday is a gaggle of pathetic, weak AND soulless drones . No dignity, no sense of urgency. It's like they wait and sit around to FAIL because deep down they know that will be the final result: FAILURE!


After the loss to the Lions ['Skins were up by five with 8 mins left in 4th quarter only to yield 17 straight points to the Lions to end up losing by 12], I was not ashamed to be called a fan

After the Monday Night Massacre [Eagles were up 35-0 with 14:51 in the 2nd quarter] , I was not ashamed to be called a fan.

After the pitiful defeat at the hands of the Giants [24 point defeat, Giants were up 28-0 with 6:38 left in the 3rd quarter], I wasn't ashamed to be called a fan.


After yesterday, a game they loss by one point, I AM ashamed to be called a fan and have loss all confidence, belief, and optimism I use to carry for this team...

Posted by: RedDMV | December 13, 2010 2:28 PM | Report abuse

"Though he stunk the whole game with his erratic, inaccurate throws, Donovan McNabb was very good in the last drive leading to the potentially tying score.

Hey great news, looks like Shanahan now sees #5DMN has now obtained the cardiovascular fitness to run the hurry up offense, huh?

Posted by: RedskinRay1 "


The only way to despoil Torain's great early effort was to become predictable..Play selection was exceptionally conservative and imaginationless, we should have had 28 points at half with the running game clicking and McNabb, Moss , Cooley and Co...McNabb's attempts to land the Cam Newton Trophy didn't help, with his over and under throws..I'm down with Moss, this team's talent has been brutally wasted under the Snyder years..

Posted by: frak | December 13, 2010 2:29 PM | Report abuse

REDSKINS: Old, worn out, easily hurt. BAD second half

NE: Young draftees coming into their own GOOD second half.

It ain't rocket surgery.

Posted by: TheCork | December 13, 2010 2:29 PM | Report abuse


So do we get rid of the rookie snapper that we've invested a year in, or do we give him a chance to win his job again in Training Camp and bring in some cometition?

Posted by: monk811 | December 13, 2010 1:44 PM

John Keim's take on that:

"It was a terrible day for specialists, but Tampa handled it well didn’t it? Sundberg’s snaps were no different than they’d been all season. He’s inconsistent and it hurt them. Hunter Smith is considered a terrific holder, but it’s hard to grab a slick ball and get it down. Do you grow with young guys like Sundberg and Gano? Or do you look for something else? I’d be more apt to find a new long snapper, but if you’re sold on Gano, and you think in two years he could be special then I guess you keep him. He is the sort of guy you rebuild with; a young player with promise. But he’s hurting them now."

Posted by: beep-beep | December 13, 2010 1:51 PM
------------------------------------------
I think it takes a few years to develop a bona fide long snapper, so I'd be inclined to keep him around. I would, however, bring in some competition next season. If an established young-ish veteran were to become available I would snatch him up in a New York minute.

Posted by: RedSkinHead | December 13, 2010 2:31 PM | Report abuse

I posted it sometime ago, that it was really rare for the Skins to have a better 2nd half record in a season. If I recall correctly, Marty ball was the last time it happened.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | December 13, 2010 2:32 PM | Report abuse

they operate on rockets??

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | December 13, 2010 2:34 PM | Report abuse

this season is the afterbirth of last season's 12 lb yellow-brown corn-dotted steaming pile of sh!t - which is an extension of years and years of danny's tiny man i don't care about washington dc it's my team I bought it i get to do what i want with it fantasy football meddling.

last year we told him get a real HC and a true GM and back off - which he has done so I'm laying off little danny for now - it's still his fault though.

so shanahan has shown he might be able to address some of the institutionalized failure and incompetence that's taken root here.

suspending AH gives me hope he has an idea about how to root it out, to end the continued incompetence, frustration and failure we've come to expect on sunday - that's come to define what it means to be a redskins fan in the daniel snyder era.

i'm hopeful that at some point in the future when the skins have a lead it will be safe to feel positive about it.

despite the continued f-ing misery, i'm hopeful that some day in the future, even when the skins lose it will be with respect.

that going into a game you can feel like the team (not just a few true redskins on the roster) deserves to win so you can feel good about supporting them - and not just hopeful they don't ruin your day.

Posted by: BrooklynSkins | December 13, 2010 2:34 PM | Report abuse

does god care whether he makes a kick?

Posted by: walter-in-fallschurch | December 13, 2010 2:27 PM

I care.

Posted by: PlayAction | December 13, 2010 2:35 PM | Report abuse


does god care whether he makes a kick?

Posted by: walter-in-fallschurch | December 13, 2010 2:27 PM |
--------

no, only that he admits his sins

Posted by: hessone | December 13, 2010 2:37 PM | Report abuse

"I posted it sometime ago, that it was really rare for the Skins to have a better 2nd half record in a season. If I recall correctly, Marty ball was the last time it happened.

Posted by: zcezcest1"

or the two years they had late season rallies to make playoffs.....

Posted by: chrislarry | December 13, 2010 2:39 PM | Report abuse

this season is the afterbirth of last season's 12lb yellow-brown corn-dotted steaming pile of sh!t - which is an extension of years and years of danny's tiny man i don't care about washington dc it's my team I bought it i get to do what i want with it fantasy football meddling.

last year we told him get a real HC and a true GM and back off - which he has done so I'm laying off little danny for now - it's still his fault though.

so shanahan has shown he might be able to address some of the institutionalized failure and incompetence that's taken root here.

suspending AH gives me hope he has an idea about how to root it out, to end the continued incompetence, frustration and failure we've come to expect on sunday - that's come to define what it means to be a redskins fan in the daniel snyder era.

i'm hopeful that at some point in the future when the skins have a lead it will be safe to feel positive about it.

despite the continued f-ing misery, i'm hopeful that some day in the future, even when the skins lose it will be with respect.

that going into a game you can feel like the team (not just a few true redskins on the roster) deserves to win so you can feel good about supporting them - and not just hopeful they don't ruin your day.

Posted by: BrooklynSkins | December 13, 2010 2:41 PM | Report abuse

At the risk of stating the obvious, the reason why the team fades every year is a lack of depth in the roster.

They'll sign a few marquee players who may have had some talent at some earlier point in their careers -- and then fill out the roster with a bunch of no-hopers and cast-offs from other team's practice squads.

It also doesn't help that several of the players are graduates from the U -- and hence, not very bright -- which leads to some fairly predictable schemes, and a team-wide inability to make in-game adjustments to counter the opponent's strengths and capitalize on the opponent's weaknesses.

And then there's the matter of a constantly changing coaching staffs and schemes -- along the associated need to simplify the playbook and play-calling. And besides, who exactly is calling these plays anyway?

And that doesn't even account for the owner's own history of meddling in areas where he doesn't belong -- such as his apparent standing orders that the team is prohibited from ever playing any pass receiver who is taller than Dan Snyder.

In sum, lots of problems... all leading to the same lackluster result, year after year.

Posted by: Vic1 | December 13, 2010 2:42 PM | Report abuse

"I posted it sometime ago, that it was really rare for the Skins to have a better 2nd half record in a season. If I recall correctly, Marty ball was the last time it happened.

Posted by: zcezcest1"

or the two years they had late season rallies to make playoffs.....

Posted by: chrislarry

Not even then ... those 2 Gibbs 2.0 years, we actually had the same or worse records in the 2nd half of the season. The 10-6 year, we were 5-3 at midpoint, then lost 3 straight and won the last 5. Same

In the 9-7 season, we were 5-3 at the midpoint, lost 4, then won 4. Actually worse in the 2nd half of the year. Doesn't feel like it because of the strong last month, but that's what happened

Posted by: zcezcest1 | December 13, 2010 2:45 PM | Report abuse

Kerzon- as a long time poster you've accrued a lot of RI vacation days and since you can't carry them over, you've been using them. Welcome back and I completely agree about a rookie wage scale. That's 100% the problem with top 10 picks. You can rarely trade them and it's more of a burden than a reward trying to rebuild.

Posted by: Diesel44 | December 13, 2010 2:48 PM | Report abuse

DMV,

It's understandable to feel that way. Like many of us, I went through the great years, and have suffered through 18 or so years of general goofiness from this team.

It's not the losing this year that worries me; I know that they aren't very good and need more talent. I'm also not so worried about the coaching staff, at least not yet. They need more than a year to be assessed properly, and MS Allen need more time than a year to reset the culture around here.

Still...sometimes it feels we are cursed. I'm not a "curse" kind of guy, but a few things get to me.

One is the ending of this past game. Most teams end a game that way maybe once in 20-30 years, if ever. The Redskins seemingly something ridiculous like this EVERY YEAR. It's like the losing culture just "helps" it happen.

Two, Shaun S., are past K. This is a guy that the Redskins were patient with; he stayed here plenty of time to work out the kinks, and he was consistently bad as a kicker. His last year, he was (like Gano) the WORST percentage kicker in the league!

Now?

He goes to Pittsburgh, with their terrible weather and turf...and can't miss. Four (4!) 40+ kicks made in a single game. Another great game yesterday.

We haven't found a kicker worth a dang in forever...or have we, and they just can't kick *here*?

All AH silliness, lack of talent, coaching gaffes aside over the past several years, this team seems to have some VERY BAD mojo.

When will it end? (and incidently, when will Osackpo get a @#$%^&! holding call?)

Posted by: shaunsherman12 | December 13, 2010 2:48 PM | Report abuse

Thats splitting some fine hairs there zcezcest1....the issue was in the middle seasons on those gibbs 2.0 teams...silly point....other than that if you subtract marty year and the two gibbs playoff runs....we finish horrendously...

Posted by: chrislarry | December 13, 2010 2:49 PM | Report abuse

Sorry for the butchered grammar folks.

Posted by: shaunsherman12 | December 13, 2010 2:51 PM | Report abuse

I posted it sometime ago, that it was really rare for the Skins to have a better 2nd half record in a season. If I recall correctly, Marty ball was the last time it happened.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | December 13, 2010 2:32 PM

Yes, you posted that the 2nd half usually looks very much like the 1st half.

And, indeed, Marty had a losing 1st half starting (0-6) and a winning 2nd half (finishing 8-8).

But Shanahan's about to break that trend in the other direction, because he started off 4-4, and it appears he will have a difficult time replicating that in the 2nd half. He has to win all the remaining games to have a 4-4 2nd half... we shall see.

But still, Gibbs teams had a knack for fininishing strong:

Gibbs:
2004 (6-10): 3-5
2005 (10-6): 5-3 (finished with 5 straight wins)
2006 (5-11): 2-6
2007 (9-7): 4-4 (finished with 4 straight wins)

Posted by: Alan4 | December 13, 2010 2:53 PM | Report abuse

Thanks for the info beep. I say keep them both, they will hopefully get it together in the next couple years, and we can always push them by bringing in competition. Plus you don't want them getting away and going to a rival like Akers did.

Posted by: monk811 | December 13, 2010 2:53 PM | Report abuse

This dude won the Rimington Trophy(best center),Jake Kirkpatrick he has only played football since his senior year in HS, he used to be a bball player. At 6-3 305 this dude might be worth a look. The skins need more award winners.
The center position appears to be very deep this year in the draft, hopefully we can capitalize on this. Whoever they chose would look pretty nice lineedup next to Logan Mankins.

Posted by: Stu27 | December 13, 2010 2:53 PM | Report abuse

We probably should also consider the age of the roster -- which brings its own share of issues -- as many of the older guys have already donated too many brain cells to helmet design and concussion research, are barely getting by on whatever remaining cartilage they may still have in their joints -- while their ligaments and tendons are long past their sell by dates too.

Posted by: Vic1 | December 13, 2010 2:56 PM | Report abuse

ss12, yep, pretty much. I'm not a karma and "universe" kinda dude, but man, how else can you explain the freakishly bad luck this team endures year in year out?


Being 26, I can't remember the pre-'91 years, hell I barely remember 1991. It must have been like the time Henry Hill first met Jimmy Conway: Simply awesome times.

Now, the Redskins are the running joke in the league. Right up there with the Clip joint in basketball and the Pirates in baseball.

Posted by: RedDMV | December 13, 2010 3:03 PM | Report abuse

Umm since the Skins are out of the playoffs I hope they do finish last and end the season 5-11. They need to get the highest draft pick they can.

The one constant in this franshise is that they haven't had a FRANSHISE QB. Heath Shuler, Patrick Ramsey, Jason Campbell all 1st rounders who failed.

The Redskins need to take best QB availbale this draft. McNabb will be 35 next season.

Posted by: jimmyclausen | December 13, 2010 3:04 PM | Report abuse

we were really running well yesterday. especially in the first half. that was encouraging. what the heck happened in the second half. i don't remember what the run/pass ratios were, but did we stop trying to run or just not run well? my general vague sense is that we stopped trying to run.

Posted by: walter-in-fallschurch | December 13, 2010 3:04 PM | Report abuse

How many seasons until Chris Cooley is replaced by Logan Paulsen?

I say two, with increasing snaps for Paulsen over the duration.

Posted by: freakzilla | December 13, 2010 3:07 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: freakzilla | December 13, 2010 3:07 PM

He sure seemed happy to score.

Posted by: PlayAction | December 13, 2010 3:09 PM | Report abuse

We haven't found a kicker worth a dang in forever...or have we, and they just can't kick *here*?

Posted by: shaunsherman12 | December 13, 2010 2:48 PM
------------------------------------------
Danny Smith has been the special teams coach since 2004. During that time the play at kicker has been pretty bad. Maybe what the Redskins need to do is hire a coach who only specializes in kicker/punters, or fire Danny smith and get a real special teams coach.

Posted by: RedSkinHead | December 13, 2010 3:11 PM | Report abuse

"Please don't start WW3 with the Koreans, General," President Obama said. "First of all, we can't afford it. Secondly, it could wipe out all life on Earth. Thirdly, I've got tickets to the Hoyas next week.."

Posted by: frak | December 13, 2010 3:12 PM | Report abuse

we were really running well yesterday. especially in the first half. that was encouraging. what the heck happened in the second half. i don't remember what the run/pass ratios were, but did we stop trying to run or just not run well? my general vague sense is that we stopped trying to run.

Posted by: walter-in-fallschurch | December 13, 2010 3:04 PM | Report abuse


The Bucs adjusted on D and controlled the ball for about 12 minutes in the 3rd quarter.

Posted by: Original_etrod | December 13, 2010 3:17 PM | Report abuse

3 weeks ago, Kiper and 'other dude' had Cam Newton going in round 2.

2 weeks ago, Kiper and other dude had him going late in round 1.

1 Week ago, they had him as a top 15.

Now, Kiper and them are saying someone will scoop him up in the top 10.

By draft, he will supplant The Stanford dude, if the NFL can get over 'perceptions'.

Someone said this over the weekend. Cam should be the most coveted player in the draft if he was able to overcome all the daily adversity of whether he'll be ruled ineligable and still sh!t on his opponnet. If you can overcome that, then the NFL should be a snap!

Posted by: 4thFloor | December 13, 2010 3:19 PM | Report abuse

walter, the bucs adjusted their defense to stop the run, run blitzing in the A and B gaps.....the redskins countered this by getting sacked, throwing for 5 yards when 8 were needed, and running the ball into the aforementioned filled gaps....

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | December 13, 2010 3:20 PM | Report abuse

The skins haven't had a good kicker since Lohmiller. They haven't had a decent kicker since Brett Conway.

A lot of that, IMO, is patience on their part. They've had a quick hook for kickers for many years, sometimes too quick.

The season is in the crapper so there is no point in cutting Gano and starting over. They should hang on to him and see if he can get through his struggles and become more consistent. Maybe he'll turn out to be a player in the long run.

Posted by: Original_etrod | December 13, 2010 3:21 PM | Report abuse

or the two years they had late season rallies to make playoffs.....

Posted by: chrislarry | December 13, 2010 2:39 PM |
---------

2 out of 11 seasons under you know who ? c'mon, this is the attitude the whole team has had over, including fans. are we satisfied with these results ?

btw, how deep did we go in both those playoff campaigns ? the one playoff victory was ugly and set the wrong kind of offensive records for a winning team. clean it to the bone or:

same as it ever was, same as it ever was

Posted by: hessone | December 13, 2010 3:24 PM | Report abuse

Shanny Presser:

-Gano kicks if ribs ok.
-Landry to IR

That's about it.

Posted by: 4-12 | December 13, 2010 3:28 PM | Report abuse

Carter said they have the talent and the heart. . . that is true, but they have not learned to gel as a team and that's the owner's fault. With practically a new coach and QB every year, how can they come together and play as a team. I don't care how much money Snyder spends, he cannot buy a SuperBowl team. A lot of the players need to check their egos at the door and use the TEAM concept (Together Everyone Achieves More) . . . but it seems to be foreign to them . . . and I'm loving it.

Posted by: cc4music | December 13, 2010 3:30 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: shaunsherman12

I'm not one for curses usually either, but the place kickers have sucked since before Norv let Akers go to Philly, where he became their kicker for a decade.

When did Lohmiller retire? It seems like he was the last consistent kicker the team has had.

Posted by: NYPDee | December 13, 2010 3:33 PM | Report abuse

A lot of folks believed the strongest spot on the team was the TE spot. So far this year, here are the TE scoring TDs

Cooley: 2
Davis: 1
Paulsen: 1

Posted by: zcezcest1 | December 13, 2010 3:35 PM | Report abuse

Shanny Presser:


-Landry to IR

Posted by: 4-12

That's the smart call. Absolutely no good reason to jack around with LL's bad Achilles, the risk/reward ration is just far too high now.

I wonder if Shanny makes this same call if the Skins had won yesterday, though...

Posted by: Alan4 | December 13, 2010 3:35 PM | Report abuse

(My bad - I'm the only one thinking post season right now....apologies all around)
=============================

The complete and total draft year bust of 2008 is killing this team, wow was that a complete waste across the board. Final hopes Fred Davis and Kareem Moore aren't good either.

Also someon earlier used RB as example of lack of depth, hey have we had back ups at other positions like Torain and Williams we might be better off, not sure that is position I'd highlight...now Kline, dline, wr, safety, lb, cb....well some valid points there.

Posted by: chrislarry | December 13, 2010 2:21 PM

How can you blame the draft class.....Like a baby, they were brought into the redskins, they didn't ask to be born into a dysfunctional NFL team that switches management and coaches and offense and defensive systems every 2 years....STAMPED...

Consistency is what the Redskins are missing.

Norv post Snyder's purchase - 1 year
Casserly post snyder - 1 year
Marty as GM/Coach - 1 year
Spurrier/whoever was making managment decisions - 2 years
Gibbs as Offense Coordinator - 2 years
Saunders as OC w/ Gibbs personnel - 2 years
Zorn - 2 years
Cerrato as GM - 2 years

DO YOU NOTICE A COMMON DENOMINATOR?????!!!!!!!?!?!?!???!!!

CONSISTENCY is not us, the Washingotn Redskins.

Posted by: 4thFloor | December 13, 2010 3:36 PM | Report abuse

When did Lohmiller retire?

Posted by: NYPDee | December 13, 2010 3:33 PM

Left the redskins in '94...played a couple more years.

Posted by: PlayAction | December 13, 2010 3:36 PM | Report abuse

All this talk of luck...

Nonsense.

You make your own luck.

The team seems snake bit because of years of mismanagement, constant change and bad drafting strategies. When you are a perennial loser, all mistakes are amplified. Winning seems to smooth all that over and mistakes are more easily forgiven.

Perhaps if we improved our methods we would improve our luck as well.

Posted by: edvar | December 13, 2010 3:39 PM | Report abuse

-Landry to IR

Posted by: 4-12 | December 13, 2010 3:28 PM


Good. About the last thing we need is his tendon rupturing and him missing next season because we tried to bring him back for no good reason. Get well, Dirty 30.

Posted by: freakzilla | December 13, 2010 3:39 PM | Report abuse

edavis291 | December 13, 2010 1:42 PM

Well stated....co-sign

Posted by: bones21 | December 13, 2010 3:44 PM | Report abuse

Other than the $21 million signing bonus, now in dispute, how much more money are we on the hook for with Haynesworth?

Posted by: freakzilla | December 13, 2010 3:46 PM | Report abuse

Shanny Presser:

-Gano kicks if ribs ok.
-Landry to IR

That's about it.

Posted by: 4-12 | December 13, 2010 3:28 PM | Report abuse

Explanation of his clock management fail?

Posted by: Stu27 | December 13, 2010 3:46 PM | Report abuse

@ Posted by: 4thFloor | December 13, 2010 3:36 PM

Vinny was a constant during much of that time, except for during that one year of Martyball... his duty title changes seemed irrelevent to whatever damage he was being allowed to inflict upon the team.

But point well taken for the lack of continuity. That's why it's a killer to keep selling our future via draft picks when you're going to introduce a whole new philosphy every couple of years. One guy brings in a bunch of square guys, but the next guy's system has round holes. So the new guy gets rid of the square guys, only to be replaced by another guy who needs square guys... and on and on.

So we end up with a nasty combination of poorly developed young guys and over-the-hill specialists.

Posted by: Alan4 | December 13, 2010 3:52 PM | Report abuse

Other than the $21 million signing bonus, now in dispute, how much more money are we on the hook for with Haynesworth?

Posted by: freakzilla | December 13, 2010 3:46 PM

None. When AH skipped 'mandatory' mini-TC, the next 2 seasons become non-gaureented salaries. Like $9.4Mil. So we can cut him and be finished.

So, for 2 seasons, he's around @ about $33Mil he got paid, and the Skin sthink they can recoup $3-6Mil, per Casserly on CBS.......

Posted by: 4thFloor | December 13, 2010 3:57 PM | Report abuse

I knew that extra point would get f'd up.

It was a gut feeling.

The sports Gods do not like Dan Snyder.

What I notice is that the only guys that make a difference for us are the low-paid guys, or our draft picks. Which is the way it should be.

Who has been good this year?

Torain- Shanny draft pick/practice squad guy

Banks- Late draft pick

Armstrong- Undrafted FA/Practice squad guy

Trent- Draft pick

Orakpo- Draft pick

Landry- Draft pick

Keiland- Undrafted FA/ PS guy

Cooley- Draft pick

Exceptions to the FA rule-Hall/Moss/Fletch

This team needs to keep this system in place for more than 3 years and it will come together.

Posted by: iH8dallas | December 13, 2010 4:12 PM | Report abuse

Take a look at the roster and some of the salaries. If the guy next to you is making 10x what you make how does that effect your attitude? Just start cutting the over-priced FAs and rebuild. I love Moss but at 10 mil he's just not worth it when compared to Armstrong.

Posted by: heveymana | December 14, 2010 10:05 AM | Report abuse

When is the last time that we dictated a game to be played on our terms?

Posted by: edvar | December 13, 2010 2:18 PM | Report abuse

The first half of the Bucs game. Those are the Skins I remember from the glory days. (Well, maybe without the inability-to-score-in-the-red-zone part.) Run the ball, control the clock, wear down the opponent, keep the other team's offense off the field (aka the best defense is a good offense). I have no idea what happened in the second half, though it appears the young Bucs coaching staff made adjustments and our veteran staff did not have an answer for them.

This team will never win consistently without getting more talent on both front lines. For me at least, the core of the team is the O-Line. They make everything else - rushing, passing, consuming the clock - work. Unfortunately, Snyder has shown a never-ending tendency to pay for the BIG FREE AGENT, at the expense of addressing the core (and adding depth to the core) and adding multiple, role-playing guys.

2008 is a great example. We had the oldest offensive line in the league, but what did the Skins do? Use three second-round picks on 1) a guy with one good college season (Thomas) 2) a guy with constant injury issues (Kelly) and 3) a TE, Davis, when we already had a Pro-Bowler (Cooley) on the roster and serviceable backups (Yoder). The Skins are still paying for that draft. Hopefully, with Shanny/Allen in charge and not Snyder/Cerrato, similar mistakes that can set you back years will be a thing of the past.

Bottom line, the Skins have mediocre line talent and no depth. That's the reason for the late season collapses more than any other single factor. Until we rebuild there, we won't be dictating squat to anyone.

Posted by: johnwp | December 14, 2010 12:36 PM | Report abuse

Vince Young is as flaky as Jake Plummer. Shanny did okay with Plummer. Skins should trade McNabb for VY straight up. VY could run for his life behind the Redskin o-line for 1-2 years while Kellen Moore sits and learns the offense. Moore takes over the starting job during his 2nd season. By then the Skins will have rebuilt the o-line and acquired a legit wr.

Posted by: coparker5 | December 14, 2010 2:56 PM | Report abuse

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