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Posted at 12:58 PM ET, 02/16/2011

Should the Redskins draft a quarterback? Todd McShay thinks so

By Mike Jones

ESPN draft analyst Todd McShay still sees quarterback as "the premier need" for the Washington Redskins, and if either Auburn's Cam Newton or Missouri's Blaine Gabbert are sitting there when Mike Shanahan & Co. are on the clock with the No. 10 pick, McShay expects them to take one of those two passers.

"It's obviously a major need," McShay said during an NFL draft teleconference this afternoon. "The question is, will they find the right quarterback at No. 10?"

McShay's mock draft released on Feb. 10 had Gabbert going at No. 5 overall to Arizona and projected Newton to go 10th to Washington. Fellow ESPN draft guru Mel Kiper originally agreed with McShay on Newton in his initial mock draft. But in the version that was released today, Kiper has Newton going much higher -- No. 3 to Buffalo -- and he has Washington taking Gabbert.

Both Newton and Gabbert could meet the Redskins' needs despite possessing different skill sets.

"Gabbert and Newton are very different players. Gabbert is more polished. Newton has rare overall physical tools, but there's also more boom or bust potential there with him," McShay said. "But I think both could play under Coach Shanahan and fit in that system."

Both quarterbacks will need some work to transition from college to the NFL having both run spread offenses for their respective schools, McShay said. But both are talented enough to be able to do so. McShay said Gabbert is "an Aaron Rodgers type ... and has the potential to become very technically sound," along with the ability to take off and run if a play breaks down. The NFL quarterbacks that Newton is most similar to, according to McShay, are Ben Roethlisberger and Donovan McNabb.

McShay said character issues are the biggest concern about Newton, but the chance for him to sit down with teams next week at the NFL combine will be big for the quarterback as he tries to prove to officials that he isn't a risk. McShay also praised Newton for how he has handled the adversity and still managed to perform at a high level.

If the Redskins can't get their hands on Newton or Gabbert, McShay said he doesn't believe there's another quarterback worth spending the No. 10 pick on.

Outside linebacker, wide receiver and nose tackle, as well as cornerback are the Redskins' other biggest needs in McShay's eyes. Possible fits at nose tackle could be Illinois defensive tackle Corey Liuget, although McShay admitted the 10th pick could be a little high for Liuget to go. Von Miller, the talented outside linebacker out of Texas A&M, has been named as a possible prospect for the Redskins, but McShay doesn't expect him to be there.

North Carolina defensive end Robert Quinn is another player Washington could have an eye on with the intention of converting him from end to outside linebacker, McShay said.

By Mike Jones  | February 16, 2011; 12:58 PM ET
 
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Next: Defensive assistant Kirk Olivadotti leaving for Georgia; other coaching changes

Comments

Somebody on here noticed that a significant number of recent SB Winners had the same coach for at least 5 years...

Posted by: mattsoundworld | February 16, 2011 12:34 PM

This is how long recent coaches were with their team before winning the SB--and every single one of them went to the playoffs by their 2nd year:

2003: Jon Gruden - 1st season
2002, 2004, 2005: Bill Belichick -2nd, 4th, 5th seasons
2006: Bill Cowher - 14th season
2007: Tony Dungy - 5th season
2008: Tom Coughlin - 4th season
2009: Mike Tomlin - 2nd season
2010: Sean Payton - 4th season
2001: Mike McCarthy - 5th season

Posted by: Alan4 | February 16, 2011 1:00 PM | Report abuse

Yes...its true...QB is a major need...they have lots of major needs...please try and spin the 10 into more picks.

Posted by: PlayAction | February 16, 2011 1:08 PM | Report abuse


QB at #10

great, build the roof before the foundation.

Posted by: hessone | February 16, 2011 1:12 PM | Report abuse

zeke- Please stop regurgitating this on a bi-weekly basis.

"Second, they failed to rid themselves of assets that could have brought them value (Carter, Albert, DT11, Rocky Mc, Dockery, Fred Davis, Rogers) or got rid of guys for less value than they were worth (Campbell, Rock)"

Carter- NO
AH- 4th (gamble to keep him failed, but worth it if he pulled his head out of his ass)
DT11- NO
Rocky- NO
Dockery- NO
Fred Davis- NO, he was coming off a great 1/2 YR and a 3/4th in return isn't value
Rogers- who was going to play CB, not to mention no value in return
Campbell- They shopped him two YRs in a row and got what they could
Rock- You've got to be kidding me.

WaitingGuilty- I know what BR is and the article was written to increase comments/buzz. It's still nonsense.

Posted by: Diesel44 | February 16, 2011 1:13 PM | Report abuse

"The NFL quarterbacks that Newton is most similar to, according to McShay, are Ben Roethlisberger and Donovan McNabb."

Red flag! Red flag!

Posted by: NYPDee | February 16, 2011 1:14 PM | Report abuse

Shanahan will pick a QB only if he thinks its the right guy. He won't pressure himself into grabbing a guy in this draft just because there is a need.

As of now, the Skins are as close to a 'best player available' draft as I can recall. The only spots off-limits for picking are left tackle, TE and probably strong safety.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | February 16, 2011 1:16 PM | Report abuse

"ESPN draft analyst Todd McShay still sees quarterback as "the premier need" for the Washington Redskins, and if either Auburn's Cam Newton on Missouri's Blaine Gabbert are sitting there when Mike Shanahan & Co. are on the clock with the No. 10 pick, McShay expects them to take one of those two passers."

This is why McShay is considered a clown in his profession.

Posted by: Diesel44 | February 16, 2011 1:16 PM | Report abuse

Apart from Bill Cowher, you have to go all the way back to Chuck Noll to find a SB winning coach who took longer than 5 years to take his SB winning team there.

Noll took 6 years to win it in 1974.

Posted by: Alan4 | February 16, 2011 1:17 PM | Report abuse

Point for PlayAction...I win...next!

Posted by: PlayAction | February 16, 2011 12:13 PM | Report abuse

Good job, high puppet! (high 5 for those not in SPG)

Posted by: monk811 | February 16, 2011 1:18 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: onanygivensunday | February 16, 2011 12:55 PM

TV deal is guaranteed. The owners will be fine.

No scabs..it's a lockout, not a strike.

Posted by: Diesel44 | February 16, 2011 12:59 PM
------------------------------------------
My understanding is if the union decertifies, they can render the lockout illegal by decertifying and filing an antitrust suit. I believe they can freeze the television payments as part of the antitrust suit, so some owners with shallow pockets could really be hurting.

Posted by: RedSkinHead | February 16, 2011 1:18 PM | Report abuse

... I mean ITA.

Posted by: Original_etrod | February 16, 2011 12:50 PM

We don't do this often enough anymore. Would have been a good idea re: Daniel Snyder and the City Paper. Would have been a good idea for Brandon Banks and Stabby. We should do it more often up here.

Posted by: dcsween | February 16, 2011 1:19 PM | Report abuse

if the Redskins had been able to keep their #3 and #4 picks, the choice of a quarterback in Round 1 would not eliminate being able to upgrade the lines as well.

but with only a #2 between picks #35-160, Washington isn't going to improve itself very much in 2011 by simply taking a quarterback at #10 to sit for a couple of years and develop.

Newton is probably 2-3 years away from being a starting quarterback in the NFL.

It's not a good year to be looking for a quarterback. Last year wasn't either. It was Bradford and the abyss.

Then you go back to 2004 and there were quarterbacks available all through the first round who played in the NFL.

Posted by: RoyHobbs4 | February 16, 2011 1:20 PM | Report abuse

Let me know when McShay graduates from high school. In the meantime, where is Mayock on the matter?

Posted by: dcsween | February 16, 2011 1:21 PM | Report abuse

"The NFL quarterbacks that Newton is most similar to, according to McShay, are Ben Roethlisberger and Donovan McNabb."

Red flag! Red flag!


Posted by: NYPDee | February 16, 2011 1:14 PM | Report abuse

Great, a mix between McNabb and Big (and little) Ben? We'd be drafting a QB that can throw at the feet at ladies in the women's bathroom so they can't get out, NO THANKS!

Posted by: monk811 | February 16, 2011 1:22 PM | Report abuse

Sign 3 or 4 free agents. Give the rock to Clinton, Santana as WR, draft a couple of safeties and TE to address the needs (age and injuries) in D-Line and O-Line, and trade a couple draft picks for Kyle Orton or Senecca Wallace and PRESTO = instant super bowel CHAMPS!!!!

Posted by: vmrg1974 | February 16, 2011 1:16 PM | Report abuse
I like this guys thinking. More TEs and more CP... good times were had in the 70's.

Posted by: Stu27 | February 16, 2011 1:23 PM | Report abuse

Seymour signs an extension with the Raiders...now leagues highest paid DL.

Posted by: Diesel44 | February 16, 2011 1:26 PM | Report abuse

My understanding is if the union decertifies, they can render the lockout illegal by decertifying and filing an antitrust suit. I believe they can freeze the television payments as part of the antitrust suit, so some owners with shallow pockets could really be hurting.

Posted by: RedSkinHead | February 16, 2011 1:18 PM

Your understanding is probably close, but only in a theoretical sense b/c you don't know how it turns out till after the Judge decides. The thing that's missing from all the discussion about the CBA lapsing is the timing associated with a litigation strategy. Litigation does not move in months, much less weeks. Litigation takes years.

In the meantime, all the draft picks (whose draft slot and team, if the union is sucessful in an anti-trust claim) could no longer be exclusive to the team who picked them ... because that arrangement would be collusion.

The big fight that the union should force is about revenue sharing btwn big markets and small markets. The owners collective plan is that both big market teams and small market teams make more money by increasing the teams' share of the revenues (compared the locked share for the players).

The Commissioner and De Smith are lawyers. Neither played football. The owner who did (Jerry Richardson, Carolina) played for one year a million years ago and dismisses Peyton Manning about knowing nothing about player safety or financial statements. D!ck and d!ck moves. Eat stuff old man and turn over the balance sheets.

Posted by: dcsween | February 16, 2011 1:29 PM | Report abuse

Tamba Hali got tagged. Watch the chiefs draft Phil Taylor in the first round this year and kill people with their defense.

Posted by: PAskinsfan17 | February 16, 2011 1:30 PM | Report abuse

Mcshay -

You sir, are an idiot. The Redskins most glaring needs is their Offensive Line. Period. End of Story. Drafting a first round quarterback is only going to get him sacked early and often, and one of your picks (Cam Newton) can't handle that kind of pressure.

So take your advice and shove off. We need quality LINEMAN and backups before a 1st round QB is added.

Posted by: murrayh | February 16, 2011 1:31 PM | Report abuse

On QB related note- Jim Zorn headed to KC as QB coach.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=ap-chiefs-zorn

Posted by: RedCherokee | February 16, 2011 1:34 PM | Report abuse

The off and on Champ Bailey contract negotiations in Denver are back on.

“He’s a guy we definitely want to bring back,” coach John Fox told Mike Klis of the Denver Post, saying there have been “discussions” between the two sides. “You never know how things like that work out, but we’re moving forward as best we know how.”

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | February 16, 2011 1:34 PM | Report abuse

In interviews, Haynesworth used to refer reporters' questions to "Mike," referring to the head coach by his first name.

That mental image used to stick in my mind and make me want to like Haynesworth, thinking maybe in real life Haynesworth would be funny, like this guy:

http://img.poptower.com/pic-13091/craig-robinson.jpg?d=1024

But now I'm not that amused by Hayneworth anymore.

Posted by: dcsween | February 16, 2011 1:35 PM | Report abuse

Redskin fan comtemplating his wish list:

Vincent Jackson--gone

Haloti Ngata--gone

Tambi Ali--gone


Oh, woe is us!

No overpriced big money vets!

No dudes well past their prime farting it up on game day!

We're actually going to have to depend on the draft this time around.

I need a hug.

Posted by: MistaMoe | February 16, 2011 1:35 PM | Report abuse

Ugh i was really hoping Tamba wouldnt get tagged. He was on my wish list.

Posted by: Stu27 | February 16, 2011 1:35 PM | Report abuse

Mcshay -

You sir, are an idiot. The Redskins most glaring needs is their Offensive Line. Period. End of Story. ...

Posted by: murrayh | February 16, 2011 1:31 PM

Two quick ones:

1. Todd McShay doesn't actually read up here.

2. Skins also have glaring personnel needs on the defensive line and at linebacker.

Posted by: dcsween | February 16, 2011 1:37 PM | Report abuse

MistaMoe:

No overpriced big money vets!

Maybe so...

No dudes well past their prime farting it up on game day!

I wouldn't go that far. There are quite a lot of Joey Galloways, "Fast" Willie Parkers, and Larry Johnsons still available!

Posted by: Alan4 | February 16, 2011 1:38 PM | Report abuse

DC is know as the NFL frahcnise that obsses over the QB position. Of course Mcshay is going to have us taking a QB. Even if we had a good one we would still need a good second stringer just to debate about.

Posted by: Stu27 | February 16, 2011 1:39 PM | Report abuse

We should do it more often up here.


Posted by: dcsween | February 16, 2011 1:19 PM | Report abuse

ITA guide for RI


-ITA Flip_Fool at all times

-ITA hessone when the dollar signs or SAVE THE WHALES are broken out

-ITA Moe's fake dialogue scripts, except when he's offering Mrs. Moe as a prize!

-ITA beep when he's feeling EXTRA high and mighty and a know-it-all

-ITA RSH when he agrees with beep

-ITA Beantown's 'real' newsbreaks

-ITA Alan's pessimistic rants

-ITA Stu when he gets upset and starts missspeling werds!

-ITA IH8 and all Glee watchers

-ITA PlayAction, he just coattails off of monk811 anyway! hahaha

Posted by: monk811 | February 16, 2011 1:39 PM | Report abuse

paskinsfan

Watch the chiefs draft Phil Taylor in the first round this year and kill people with their defense.

The chiefs are young and well-stocked.

What they need is a receiver opposite D Bowe.

Moeki, their tight end, is very solid.

They have probably the best running game in the league.

But I don't think they have enough fire power in their receiving corp just yet.

Posted by: MistaMoe | February 16, 2011 1:40 PM | Report abuse

Our needs in order:

NT-none worth #10
FS-none worth #10
RILB-none worth #10
LOLB-Von Miller, Robert Quinn
RDE-Cameron Jordan, Marcell Dareus
LG-none worth #10
RG-none worth #10
WR-A.J. Green Julio Jones
QB-Eh, if these guys grade out very well they'll probably be gone by our pick anyway. If they don't grade out well then they aren't worth #10. I doubt we end up with one of the 2 top QBs.

I still think we're going to end up taking Cameron Jordan at #10.

Posted by: PAskinsfan17 | February 16, 2011 1:41 PM | Report abuse

i understand that rocky mac is not a pro bowler, but im still trying to figure out why everywhere i look every single person has him written off as, o yea he's gone dont re-sign him, there's not even a thought about it

w/ all the f-in problems we have on this team, why in the f would we just say peace to rocky mac?

it would be just another position in a long line of positions that again need to be filled

i just dont get it, he played 4 solid years and didnt say an F-in word, then last year the dude wants to get paid and everybodys like o F U Rocky Mac, he hasnt said anything since and people r like o he's a problem, he sucks

really? he's been extremely solid in his 5 years w/ the Skins

i wouldnt necessarily mind an upgrade, but an upgrade would be a perennial pro bowl player, nothing less and good luck with that

i much rather upgrade DT, DE, QB, FS, C, G, G, WR, OLB, CB...

that's 10 positions of the 22 starters i would look to upgrade and then and then maybe look to upgrade Rocky Mac's ILB

Posted by: retroskins14 | February 16, 2011 1:43 PM | Report abuse

zeke- Please stop regurgitating this on a bi-weekly basis.

"Second, they failed to rid themselves of assets that could have brought them value (Carter, Albert, DT11, Rocky Mc, Dockery, Fred Davis, Rogers) or got rid of guys for less value than they were worth (Campbell, Rock)"

Carter- NO
AH- 4th (gamble to keep him failed, but worth it if he pulled his head out of his ass)
DT11- NO
Rocky- NO
Dockery- NO
Fred Davis- NO, he was coming off a great 1/2 YR and a 3/4th in return isn't value
Rogers- who was going to play CB, not to mention no value in return
Campbell- They shopped him two YRs in a row and got what they could
Rock- You've got to be kidding me.


Posted by: Diesel44 | February 16, 2011

I put down the names of 3 starters on a defense ranked top 10 multiple times in the past few years (Carter, Rocky, Rogers) ... and you think there is ZERO value to any of them.

Wish I could help you Diesel, but its just too hard to fix stupid

Posted by: zcezcest1 | February 16, 2011 1:45 PM | Report abuse

i understand that rocky mac is not a pro bowler, but im still trying to figure out why everywhere i look every single person has him written off as, o yea he's gone dont re-sign him, there's not even a thought about it

Posted by: retroskins14 | February 16, 2011 1:43 PM

I like Rocky Mac... in a 4-3. I think what you're seeing is the reality that he's miscast in a 3-4 defense.

Posted by: Alan4 | February 16, 2011 1:45 PM | Report abuse

Moe, its not over yet. LaMarr Woodley is still out there, as is D'Qwell Jackson.

And Malcolm Floyd or James Jackson (or Cullen Jenkins!).

Chin up

Posted by: dcsween | February 16, 2011 1:46 PM | Report abuse

frahcnise that obsses

Posted by: Stu27 | February 16, 2011 1:39 PM | Report abuse

Hey PlayAction, I need my Stu-to-English dictionary, your puppet borrowed it and I'm getting a headache trying to figure this out. In the mean time someone get Stu some allergy medicine, obviously a big fat Dlineman has been around him, his fingers are starting to swell!!!

Posted by: monk811 | February 16, 2011 1:46 PM | Report abuse

Redskin fan comtemplating his wish list:

Vincent Jackson--gone--28

Haloti Ngata--gone--27

Tambi Ali--gone--27

Not to old or past their primes imo.

Posted by: Stu27 | February 16, 2011 1:47 PM | Report abuse

I understand that rocky mac is not a pro bowler


Rocky Mac is just another mid 2000, 2nd round redskin draft pick who did not live up to his pedigree, plain and simple.

Posted by: MistaMoe | February 16, 2011 1:48 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: monk811 | February 16, 2011 1:39 PM

When you're all specific about it, I don't think you're using the technique properly.

Retroskins, I myself have always wondered by they moved Rocky Mac inside in the first place, but figured that they had the roster they had and had to make do. I don't know enough about defensive coordinating to make the judgment, but I figure that everyone has always been nervous about Rocky's knees anyway, so the idea of saying that he doesn't fit in the defense is good enough reason for peeps to feel OK about him moving on.

Posted by: dcsween | February 16, 2011 1:50 PM | Report abuse

Well, my theory that in order to win a Super Bowl you must have players from Purdue and Georgia Tech on your team held up again this year. I think that's something like at least 8 years in a row. Since we have neither I say we start with Kerrigan and then go from there.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | February 16, 2011 1:50 PM | Report abuse

I also vote for a Malcolm Floyd acquisition.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | February 16, 2011 1:52 PM | Report abuse

......going to have to depend on the draft this time around.

I need a hug.

Posted by: MistaMoe | February 16, 2011 1:35 PM

Moe...At first glance...I thought you wrote "thug"...

top of mind, I guess.

Posted by: onanygivensunday | February 16, 2011 1:52 PM | Report abuse

Wish I could help you Diesel, but its just too hard to fix stupid

Posted by: zcezcest1 | February 16, 2011 1:45 PM | Report abuse

Funny considering Diesel is right in this argument. Carter and McIntosh are not NFL starters in a 3-4. How can you just totally overlook the fact that the scheme is completely different than what those guys are suited for?

Posted by: WaitingGuilty | February 16, 2011 1:55 PM | Report abuse

I believe that the 'Skins WILL draft a QB. I sincerely believe that McNabb is history, and the team will be looking for another QB to replace him on the roster. How early they draft a QB will depend largely on whether Shanahan thinks he can win with Grossman as the starter. Some may scoff, but Shanny may very well see Grossman as Jake Plummer redux. You'll never go broke overestimating Shanahan's ego, and he may believe that he can "coach up" Sexy Rexy and get him to flourish where other coaches could not. Remember that, like Grossman with the Bears, Plummer would also turn the ball over frequently while losing with the Cards, and I'm pretty sure that Shanny won a division title or two with Jake the Snake in Denver.

If Shanahan DOESN'T think that Rex is the man, then it will be early, perhaps at #10 if he likes his options there. If Shanny sees Rex as the starter, then it will be more of a developmental guy in the mid-to-late rounds. My guess is that, unless he sees one of the top guys as a franchise-type QB, it will be Rex as the starter with a developmental QB taken in the mid-to-late rounds.

Posted by: rufus_t_firefly | February 16, 2011 1:55 PM | Report abuse

Malcom Floyd doesn't spell his first name the way most people... woud.

Posted by: Alan4 | February 16, 2011 1:55 PM | Report abuse

Oh, and on QBs, I'm still in the draft Kaepernick camp ... with the full intention of having Rex Grossman start and relying on the running game and a better defense to carry the team to an 8-8 season.

I saw one mockery (walterfootball) that had Kaepernick move up into the second round (and I think to the Vikings).

That said, I'm guessing that if Gabbert or Newton is available at #10, then he is the choice, and if Locker is around in the second round, he is the guy. I just really, really, really hope that teams want to do deals with Shanahan to allow the Skins to move down and get more picks.

Posted by: dcsween | February 16, 2011 1:56 PM | Report abuse

Wish I could help you Diesel, but its just too hard to fix stupid

Posted by: zcezcest1 | February 16, 2011 1:45 PM | Report abuse

Funny considering Diesel is right in this argument. Carter and McIntosh are not NFL starters in a 3-4. How can you just totally overlook the fact that the scheme is completely different than what those guys are suited for?

Posted by: WaitingGuilty | February 16, 2011 1:55 PM

That's EXACTLY why we should have traded those guys BEFORE the 2010 season --- which was EXACTLY my point. Though it got lost because the thread was only partly copied.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | February 16, 2011 1:58 PM | Report abuse

that's 10 positions of the 22 starters i would look to upgrade and then and then maybe look to upgrade Rocky Mac's ILB
Posted by: retroskins14

I don't disagree with your points, but Rocky does have his weaknesses: Not great in coverage, looked lost much of the time in the 3-4, missed an awful lot of tackles, etc.

The problem is, what kind of contract do you offer a guy that you don't see as a long term solution? (Though I'm not sure he'll have a lot of suitors with all the FA's that will be out there.)

Posted by: NYPDee | February 16, 2011 1:59 PM | Report abuse

I like Rocky Mac... in a 4-3. I think what you're seeing is the reality that he's miscast in a 3-4 defense.

Posted by: Alan4

Rocky Mac is just another mid 2000, 2nd round redskin draft pick who did not live up to his pedigree, plain and simple.

Posted by: MistaMoe


ok, ok, he is coming off his best year statistically, but i see what you're saying, he's not a 3-4 ilb, but is it wise to let him go at this point w/ all the other problems? but if you all agree the Perry Riley is the man for his spot and is ready to step in, then so be it

and honestly, i dont think he's been a 2nd round bust by any means, but that's just me

Posted by: retroskins14 | February 16, 2011 2:02 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: zcezcest1 | February 16, 2011 1:58 PM | Report abuse

Ahhh..my bad. I thought you were saying they had value on the Skins, I see now you meant they had value being traded to another team.

Got it.

Posted by: WaitingGuilty | February 16, 2011 2:02 PM | Report abuse

gabbert built his career throwing 5-yard out patterns. His ability to accurately throw down the field is pretty limited...

Posted by: HankC_57 | February 16, 2011 2:05 PM | Report abuse

My understanding is if the union decertifies, they can render the lockout illegal by decertifying and filing an antitrust suit. I believe they can freeze the television payments as part of the antitrust suit, so some owners with shallow pockets could really be hurting.

Posted by: RedSkinHead | February 16, 2011 1:18 PM

Snyder has to be one of those shallow pockets owners of the above scenario..
All his other units (rockets, 6 flags, etc) are seriously hurting. And if he has to go out and get financing without a tv deal, 2011 concessions income, no preseason income (pure profit for owners) and a possible loss of anti-trust exemption.. the league might let him Sell.

I know.. pass the bong..but we can dream.

Jerah might have to give him a loan. Ironies of ironies...

Posted by: onanygivensunday | February 16, 2011 2:05 PM | Report abuse

I'm guessing that if Gabbert or Newton is available at #10

I want a front-7 defender in round 1 and Ponder in round 2.

Posted by: MistaMoe | February 16, 2011 2:06 PM | Report abuse

I put down the names of 3 starters on a defense ranked top 10 multiple times in the past few years (Carter, Rocky, Rogers) ... and you think there is ZERO value to any of them.

Wish I could help you Diesel, but its just too hard to fix stupid

Posted by: zcezcest1 | February 16, 2011 1:45 PM

You put down a lot of names with ZERO trade value. But lets focus on the three names you mentioned above.

Carter- NO TRADE CLAUSE
Rocky- tendered- skins could have lowered compensation but they wanted to see if he could play in the 3-4. He failed. Previous to this season, No trade value
Carlos- tendered- same deal. He played well this YR and no team was going to give us value for him coming into this season. No trade value.

Unless your idea was to subtract two starters Rocky and Los in exchange for conditional late RD picks, I'm not sure you understand the concept of value.

The Rock Cartwright is my favorite. How we didn't turn the 30 YR old special teamer into multiple picks is truly a mistake by this front office. As for stupid, every time you bring this up on RI....I can't help but put you in the pabrain category.

Posted by: Diesel44 | February 16, 2011 2:06 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: rufus_t_firefly | February 16, 2011 1:55 PM

co-sign. I don't think Shanny is afraid of going with Rex as his starter. I think he's more motivated to fix the lines than the QB. In 15 or so years of drafting with Denver, QB was not a big area for Shanny in the draft. He used a 1st rounder on Cutler, a 3rd on Brian Griese and a 4th on Jeff Lewis -- and a couple of QBs in the 7th round. Not much for 15 years worth of picks.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | February 16, 2011 2:07 PM | Report abuse

I still think we're going to end up taking Cameron Jordan at #10.

Posted by: PAskinsfan17 | February 16, 2011 1:41 PM | Report abuse

The DE from Purdue, Kerrigan, is rising up the mock drafts, I know #10 is a little too early for a DE but we need a guy with a high motor that can stop the run AND collapse the pocket to rush the passer.

The pick ultimately is either a QB or OLB, I think it depends on if we get rid of McNabb. If we keep McNabb then we don't draft a QB. A pass rushing LB is the only pick there at that point in the draft and it fills one of the top 2 or 3 needs on the team.

Posted by: monk811 | February 16, 2011 2:07 PM | Report abuse

but I figure that everyone has always been nervous about Rocky's knees anyway, so the idea of saying that he doesn't fit in the defense is good enough reason for peeps to feel OK about him moving on.

Posted by: dcsween

The problem is, what kind of contract do you offer a guy that you don't see as a long term solution? (Though I'm not sure he'll have a lot of suitors with all the FA's that will be out there.)

Posted by: NYPDee

knowledge is good and i guess if we can get a cheap replacement ie riley, then lets do it


just as long as we take care of business at DE, DT, C, G, QB yada yada yada, then i guess he's expendable, he's still a solid footballer

Posted by: retroskins14 | February 16, 2011 2:08 PM | Report abuse

Redskin fan comtemplating his wish list:

Vincent Jackson--gone

Haloti Ngata--gone

Tambi Ali--gone


Oh, woe is us!

No overpriced big money vets!

No dudes well past their prime farting it up on game day!

We're actually going to have to depend on the draft this time around.

I need a hug.

Posted by: MistaMoe


All of the guys you listed are still very much in their prime. I believe they are all 27 or younger. Haloti Ngata and Tamba Hali are young high character guys that you target with the money they gave Fat Al. They are also the type of players that teams don't let walk away. Ngata also does not want to leave Baltimore to play for putrid Redskins defense.

Posted by: srobert1117 | February 16, 2011 2:09 PM | Report abuse

Can someone remind me how Rex Grossman's Bears got to the Super Bowl? Was it that he was hurt for the second half of the season or had running backs or something?

Posted by: dcsween | February 16, 2011 2:12 PM | Report abuse

AAAAaaaack. Converting from End to LB... AAAAAACKK! Stop it!

Watching oSACKpo get beat on pass after pass. mech.

Posted by: DikShuttle | February 16, 2011 2:12 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: monk811 | February 16, 2011 1:39 PM

When you're all specific about it, I don't think you're using the technique properly.

Posted by: dcsween | February 16, 2011 1:50 PM | Report abuse

Ok, how about we create the TITA, Temporarily Ignore The Ass, for people you don't want to ignore all the time but just enough, like that NERD PlayAction, his puppet antics are starting to get on my nerves, but I can't ignore him all the time, you know, same brain and all.

Posted by: monk811 | February 16, 2011 2:15 PM | Report abuse

Rocky was right up there with Kareem Moore in missing tackles. I have no problem bringing him back to compete for a spot with Henson and Riley on a cheap deal if we can not sign or draft someone better. There is no way we are filling every need this offseason to be a contending team.

Posted by: ToddStinkston | February 16, 2011 2:15 PM | Report abuse

I say pass on a quarterback this year and bring back Grossman.

Forget about strengthening the offensive line -- and insist on playing the wonderkid Kyle's offensive "scheme" -- regardless of results.

That should guarantee the Redskins another 5-11 season (or worse), which might even bring them a top 5 pick in the 2012 draft.

Then with that pick, draft whatever shiny new QB who might be available then -- along with a new coach, coordinators, etc.

Posted by: Vic1 | February 16, 2011 2:16 PM | Report abuse

I don't think Shanny is afraid of going with Rex as his starter. I think he's more motivated to fix the lines than the QB. In 15 or so years of drafting with Denver, QB was not a big area for Shanny in the draft. He used a 1st rounder on Cutler, a 3rd on Brian Griese and a 4th on Jeff Lewis -- and a couple of QBs in the 7th round. Not much for 15 years worth of picks.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | February 16, 2011 2:07 PM

I agree with you zcez..

Shanny is going to be looking for smart fast footed zone blocking fat boys. He knows that is really how he got his rings. Once they were in place in Denver, Elway got a running game that set up his pass (and time to throw).

Posted by: onanygivensunday | February 16, 2011 2:16 PM | Report abuse

McShay is the man! Can't wait to see Cam fly into FedEx in Danny's helicopter.

Posted by: coparker5 | February 16, 2011 2:16 PM | Report abuse

Sween =- it was all the "D" & Hester, wasn't it?

Posted by: DikShuttle | February 16, 2011 2:17 PM | Report abuse

What do we know about Robert Quinn (UNC), other than that he didn't play this year? One of the mockeries (walter again) had the Skins using the #10 pick on him (with the assumption that Von Miller and Marcell Dareus don't last until the #10 slot).

Posted by: dcsween | February 16, 2011 2:18 PM | Report abuse

The Skins need defensive player suited for the 3-4 more than they need a QB. Which ever QB they choose will not help us now. The #10 spot is a good spot and we need to pick up value, and the value is in defensive players.
Its possible, that Quinn, Miller or Darius falls to us. If that happens we have to take one, if not we need to take Newton, I think he gives more value than Jordan and the rest of the defensive players left.

Posted by: tonytnt40 | February 16, 2011 2:22 PM | Report abuse

srobert1117 | February 16, 2011 2:09 PM


I was being sarcastic, sir.

I'm aware those players are young and are of value.

I was mocking how so many redskin fans study FA lists, but never know who's in the draft as that's how the team invariably selects talent.

Posted by: MistaMoe | February 16, 2011 2:22 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: monk811 | February 16, 2011 2:15 PM

Whether its temporary or not, ITA is not a collective action, it is a matter of personal responsibility ... and it requires ACTUALLY ignoring. If you don't ignore the poster, the ignored poster doesn't stop.

Dik, a PK/KR gets an extra TD once in a while - he doesn't get you to the Super Bowl. D keeps you alive in the playoffs, but doesn't get you to the playoffs. The Bears HAD to have had something (a kicker?) on offense, I'm just trying to recall whether Grossman was part of it.

[I remember the season or two after when Grossman was hurt or sucked, the #2 guy was hurt or sucked, and Orton actually made a name for himself. That team was so forgetable, I don't even remember who the #2 QB was.]

Posted by: dcsween | February 16, 2011 2:23 PM | Report abuse

What do we know about Robert Quinn (UNC), other than that he didn't play this year? One of the mockeries (walter again) had the Skins using the #10 pick on him (with the assumption that Von Miller and Marcell Dareus don't last until the #10 slot).

Posted by: dcsween | February 16, 2011 2:18 PM | Report abuse

I would much rather take Marvin Austin in the second round if he falls. Thing is the combine hasnt happend yet. There is a record number of underclassman coming out this year. Combine and individual workouts will be cruical. Keep an eye on Marvin Austin. This dude will be a playmaker.

Posted by: Stu27 | February 16, 2011 2:25 PM | Report abuse

I am so tired of stupidity from so called experts.

NO TO A QB.

N O

Nothing starts for the Redskins offensively till that swiss cheese of an offensive line is patched up for pass protection, and can make holes for the running game.

It's all about the lines stupid.

Posted by: theAnswerIs42 | February 16, 2011 2:27 PM | Report abuse

What do we know about Robert Quinn (UNC), other than that he didn't play this year? One of the mockeries (walter again) had the Skins using the #10 pick on him (with the assumption that Von Miller and Marcell Dareus don't last until the #10 slot).

Posted by: dcsween | February 16, 2011 2:18 PM | Report abuse

Well, he's kind of a risky pick. He would have to convert from 4-3 DE to OLB. He wouldn't be playing the right side either. He'd probably be on the left. He is a decent pass rusher and does tackle well but I don't think I've ever seen him in coverage. I think he's a big unknown. I wouldn't take him at #10.

Posted by: PAskinsfan17 | February 16, 2011 2:29 PM | Report abuse

Hate it when I'm TITA'd.

Posted by: PlayAction | February 16, 2011 2:31 PM | Report abuse

Bears had Thomas Jones in 2006. Rex had about 8 really good games and 8 really awful ones.

Posted by: ToddStinkston | February 16, 2011 2:32 PM | Report abuse

Temporarily Ignore The Ass, for people you don't want to ignore all the time but just enough,...

I'm sorry.

I try to read everything I see here, starting with the long timers, and dudes who usually have something interesting to read.

Yes: a lot of fols are stuck on themselves, but hey, that's the nature of this beast.

I don't ignore what might be entertaining or provocative or just downright stupid.

You can ITA my posts all day if you want.

But Imma bring it just the same.

Posted by: MistaMoe | February 16, 2011 2:36 PM | Report abuse

Carter- NO TRADE CLAUSE
Carter would have waived it to avoid the 3-4. He left SF because he didn't like the 3-4 and didn't play well in it. Plus, he had max'd his value by having a stellar 2009 -- the only guy with both more sacks and tackles than Carter was Woodley, who many people think is going to be franchised by Pitt!! That is some seriously good company. Playing in DC in 2010 cost Carter serious $$.

Rocky- tendered- skins could have lowered compensation but they wanted to see if he could play in the 3-4. He failed. Previous to this season, No trade value

Really, a starting LB has ZERO trade value? Guy was averaging 100 tackles a season and was 28 years old. There is value. Heck philly gave DET a 5th rounder for a guy coming off injury in ernie sims -- and most thought philly ripped off DET.

Carlos- tendered- same deal. He played well this YR and no team was going to give us value for him coming into this season. No trade value.

You must think starting CBs just fall off trees in this league. Most teams need 5 starting quality DBs. Rogers would play for almost any team in this league, as a 5th DB in some cases, a starter in most. Again, his contract was cheap.

I have no clue why you can't see value. None of these guys were going to bring a 1st round pick, but Carter could have gotten around a 3rd.

Here's the thing. All 3 guys were starters on defenses that had been top 10 in 3 of the 4 prior years. They are good players, not flukes and hardly worthless.

Trade the guys at their market peak and you get some real value. Destroy their value by letting them get to FA or playing them out of position ... just bad for everyone.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | February 16, 2011 2:37 PM | Report abuse

Stinkston, thnx. I un-lazied myself and got over to wikipedia to answer my own questions, and it was indeed the combination of Cedric Benson and Thomas Jones (plus Hester on returns and Berrian have an unbelievable year).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2006_Chicago_Bears_season

And this brings me back to my primary point ... which is that the Skins can upgrade a lot by bring in one solid RB to pair with Torain. Then they can bring a new QB up to NFL speed slowly and focus on getting better on defense. [Also, will need for the maybe victim/maybe assailant to get healthy breathing back ... and get a reliable KICKER!]

Final jeopardy answer: Brian Greise

Posted by: dcsween | February 16, 2011 2:40 PM | Report abuse

Moe, ITA is not about not reading. Its about not responding.

On the reading, I have the same affliction. I read everything. (Minus two or three that look too long, for example, and might not be "unique").

Posted by: dcsween | February 16, 2011 2:43 PM | Report abuse

The Rock Cartwright is my favorite. How we didn't turn the 30 YR old special teamer into multiple picks is truly a mistake by this front office. As for stupid, every time you bring this up on RI....I can't help but put you in the pabrain category.

Posted by: Diesel44 |

Rock was worth a conditional 7th. A trade might be if he makes the Raiders 2 years in a row, we get a 7th in 2012 or 2013. Most 7th round picks do nothing in this league -- so its really a no risk deal for OAK or us.

In terms of real value to the Raiders, Rock was absolutely worth that. Raiders special teams were probably top 5 in the league, Cartwright was their teams leader. He was involved in a number of major plays (blocked punt vs SD, key block on kickoff TD return vs KC, etc) that had impact on the outcome of games. Which is more than you'd expect from a 7th rounder.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | February 16, 2011 2:46 PM | Report abuse

Why are you even writing about the Washington Redskins? Their new name is coming soon ... the Washington Monuments! I can just imagine the helmet with a big white oblisk on the side.

Posted by: pejochum | February 16, 2011 2:48 PM | Report abuse

Ha! To repeat the level of performance of the 2006 Rex Grossman Bears, the Skins need a close win and for the opposing coach to completely lose it. In that season, it was the Bears beating the Cardinals that inspired Dennis Green's "CROWN 'EM" rant. [Of course, we would lose the Super Bowl, but Grossman did lead a team to a 13-3 record ...]

Posted by: dcsween | February 16, 2011 2:49 PM | Report abuse

dcsween


I feelya', bro'.

The dudes who write toolong need to learn how to make one simple sentence summarize a long thought.

10 simple, direct sentences are easier and faster to read than a paragraph ten sentences long.

Beyond that, I read as much as I can.

And if work gets in the way, I just close the door and tell my boss I'm busy.

'Cuz I am.

Posted by: MistaMoe | February 16, 2011 2:49 PM | Report abuse

Minus two or three that look too long

Posted by: dcsween | February 16, 2011 2:43 PM

I like Moe's double-spacing.

Seems to make posts easier to read...and gives me space to make corrections.

Posted by: PlayAction | February 16, 2011 2:50 PM | Report abuse

Can someone remind me how Rex Grossman's Bears got to the Super Bowl? Was it that he was hurt for the second half of the season or had running backs or something?

Posted by: dcsween | February 16, 2011 2:12 PM
------------------------------------------
It was a jedi mind trick. He'd stand behind the center and say, "Forty-one, blue, Twenty-nine, This is not the play you were looking for, fifty-three, hup, hup, hike!"

Posted by: RedSkinHead | February 16, 2011 2:52 PM | Report abuse

There are very few posters actually worthy of ITA.

They're pretty easy to spot: racist, completely off topic (advertising a product or website), people trying to duplicate someone else's name (like Risa_L) to impersonate them, etc.


Some people here get into a disagreement and start a pussified call for ITA. That's just silly.

Posted by: Alan4 | February 16, 2011 2:53 PM | Report abuse

... I can just imagine the helmet with a big white oblisk on the side.

Posted by: pejochum | February 16, 2011 2:48 PM

Please avoid the stereotypes ... we prefer "people of no color" ... plus the term "big" is misplaced. Size doesn't matter.

Posted by: dcsween | February 16, 2011 2:54 PM | Report abuse

Their new name is coming soon ... the Washington Monuments!

How 'bout the D.C. 'ITAs'?

They'll have a losing season, and we won't say anything about it or respond in kind.

Posted by: MistaMoe | February 16, 2011 2:56 PM | Report abuse

I vote for the Washington Sock Puppets.

Posted by: PAskinsfan17 | February 16, 2011 2:58 PM | Report abuse

Moe, ITA is not about not reading. Its about not responding.

On the reading, I have the same affliction. I read everything. (Minus two or three that look too long, for example, and might not be "unique").

Posted by: dcsween | February 16, 2011 2:43 PM | Report abuse

I should ITA more often and stick to it, so I'll try and take your advice sween.

I think most idiots on here that get ignored have no real aggenda, they want you to talk to them, they NEED attention.

I personnally don't care either way, I love talking football, but I gotta keep my schtick/football ratio to 60/40 or I'll be kicked out of the SPG, you guys understand!

Posted by: monk811 | February 16, 2011 3:00 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: dcsween | February 16, 2011 2:40 PM | Report abuse

I like a lot of the running backs coming out this year. Good mix of size guys, Ingram, Leshoure, Clay. and Speed guys Shane Vereen, Quizz Rogers, Noel Devine.
I would like to see a RB taken in the draft. I also feel the same way about WR however. We def need more picks in the mid rounds.

Posted by: Stu27 | February 16, 2011 3:01 PM | Report abuse

My understanding is if the union decertifies, they can render the lockout illegal by decertifying and filing an antitrust suit. I believe they can freeze the television payments as part of the antitrust suit, so some owners with shallow pockets could really be hurting.

Posted by: RedSkinHead | February 16, 2011 1:18 PM

Snyder has to be one of those shallow pockets owners of the above scenario..
All his other units (rockets, 6 flags, etc) are seriously hurting. And if he has to go out and get financing without a tv deal, 2011 concessions income, no preseason income (pure profit for owners) and a possible loss of anti-trust exemption.. the league might let him Sell.

I know.. pass the bong..but we can dream.

Jerah might have to give him a loan. Ironies of ironies...

Posted by: onanygivensunday | February 16, 2011 2:05 PM
------------------------------------------
As both sides stake out their options it sounds more like a pee-pee contest than a debate between reasonable individuals. The head of the NFLPA wants to make himself known and Goodell has a bunch of greedy owners pushing him into the ring. In the meantime, you have owners that won't be able to pay the bills without some serious finagling of funds and you have some players that will fall hard without the cash coming in. Art Rooney was the voice of reason in previous negotiations and it sounds like he's too tied up in his ambassador role to work with this one (and I think Goodell is too proud to ask for help). We can't expect any of the latter day owners to step up. I haven't seen much in the way of leadership from guys like Snyder and Jones: they're just in it for the money, so I am thinking we have a war on our hands.

Posted by: RedSkinHead | February 16, 2011 3:01 PM | Report abuse

I think we should call them the Washington Redskins.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | February 16, 2011 3:01 PM | Report abuse

I think we should call them the Washington Redskins.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | February 16, 2011 3:01 PM

That name is taken...and comes with alot of baggage.

Posted by: PlayAction | February 16, 2011 3:07 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: Stu27 | February 16, 2011 3:01 PM | Report abuse

I like the RBs too. I like Evan Royster. I think he would do very well here. I also like John Clay. I think we have room for another RB and if one falls to us in the 5th round then why not? We aren't going to get starters from the 5th anyway so may as well gamble on the best prospects that aren't tight ends.

Posted by: PAskinsfan17 | February 16, 2011 3:08 PM | Report abuse

What I'm thinking that it might not be completely crazy to think that Rex Grossman maybe could be adequate for a season while a lower round guy, esp. a "raw" candidate (KAEPERNICK!), rides pine, gets his footwork and progressions down, and watches film.

Seems like teams with QBs with the luxury to do that (assuming that the offense isn't designed ONLY for starting QB ... hint, hint ... see Kolb getting up to speed for an offense designed for one improvising scrambler) do OK.

Posted by: dcsween | February 16, 2011 3:08 PM | Report abuse

Different ignoring initials:

ITA - Ignore The Ass, recommended

TITA - Not recommended, gives the wrong idea

PITA - Pussified Ignore The Ass, Alan's way of calling out people that for whatever reason don't want to argue

Posted by: monk811 | February 16, 2011 3:09 PM | Report abuse

That name is taken...and comes with alot of baggage.

Posted by: PlayAction | February 16, 2011 3:07 PM |

I don't give a sh!t about baggage. Leave that to all the PC, skirt wearing, d bags that having nothing better to do then chase around those of us with real concerns.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | February 16, 2011 3:10 PM | Report abuse

I gotta keep my schtick/football ratio to 60/40 or I'll be kicked out of the SPG, you guys understand!

Posted by: monk811 | February 16, 2011 3:00 PM

Sadly my offeason ratio has dipped to roughly 98/2...I'm here for the attention...and the free snacks.

Posted by: PlayAction | February 16, 2011 3:12 PM | Report abuse

Zeke- A 3rd RD'er for Carter? Dude it's 60 degrees in the DMV, not exactly la la land that you're living in, but not to shabby.

Still wondering what you think we could get for 52 & 22 considering they were tendered and gardnered zero interest.

Posted by: Diesel44 | February 16, 2011 3:12 PM | Report abuse

dcsween

What I'm thinking that it might not be completely crazy to think that Rex Grossman maybe could be adequate for a season while a lower round guy...


I like only half of this argument.

Rex holding the fort until mid season while C Ponder waits is a better half to argue.

Posted by: MistaMoe | February 16, 2011 3:13 PM | Report abuse

Zeke- A 3rd RD'er for Carter? Dude it's 60 degrees in the DMV, not exactly la la land that you're living in, but not to shabby.

Still wondering what you think we could get for 52 & 22 considering they were tendered and gardnered zero interest.

Posted by: Diesel44 | February 16, 2011 3:12 PM

Again, Andre Carter will be an UFA when we refuse to pay his roster bonus.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | February 16, 2011 3:14 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: PAskinsfan17 | February 16, 2011 3:08 PM | Report abuse

Im down with Royster, he seems very versatile. John Clay might just be my ideal pick even above ingram, when he was healthy he was just unstoppable.

Even with the above listed, DeMarco Murray, Ryan Williams, Jordan Todman, Bilal Powell, Delonte Carter, even Da'rel. Some of these names are gonna have ti fall pretty far. good crop this year.

Posted by: Stu27 | February 16, 2011 3:15 PM | Report abuse

I think my point RE Grossman, Da Behrs & teh StuporBowel was that between the D and the return game they were getting great field position.

From there, a serviceable QB can get you close enough to score FGs. I don't have stats backup, but that's how I dismember it. Anyone?

Posted by: DikShuttle | February 16, 2011 3:16 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: Stu27 | February 16, 2011 3:01 PM | Report abuse

I like the RBs too. I like Evan Royster. I think he would do very well here. I also like John Clay. I think we have room for another RB and if one falls to us in the 5th round then why not? We aren't going to get starters from the 5th anyway so may as well gamble on the best prospects that aren't tight ends.

Posted by: PAskinsfan17 | February 16, 2011 3:08 PM
------------------------------------------
I think if you graded all of the positions from 1 to 10, you'd find the running back position sits closer to 10 than a lot of positions. Think about it. We know they need a nose tackle. If Mac and Los are allowed to walk, there will be two more big holes to fill. Let alone the fact that the team has a real hole at free safety. That is just on the defensive side. On the offensive side it is all about saving the whales. I think running back is waaaaay down on the list of positions they need to look at.

Posted by: RedSkinHead | February 16, 2011 3:20 PM | Report abuse

I think most idiots on here that get ignored have no real aggenda, they want you to talk to them, they NEED attention.

Posted by: monk811 | February 16, 2011 3:00 PM

That is the exact psychology about ITA. You don't have to ignore the poster, just the post. Some peeps who have been on the receiving end of no attention have come back and actually participated in discussions later.

scamp, on that team name (has a familiar ring to it), maybe there could be a big RED obelisk on the side of the helmet. [What IS the stereotype on red dudes that applies there? Big like Mistamoe big? Or tiny like gimmesomoe tiny ... or dcsween or beep beep tiny?]

Posted by: dcsween | February 16, 2011 3:22 PM | Report abuse

scamp, on that team name (has a familiar ring to it), maybe there could be a big RED obelisk on the side of the helmet. [What IS the stereotype on red dudes that applies there? Big like Mistamoe big? Or tiny like gimmesomoe tiny ... or dcsween or beep beep tiny?]

Posted by: dcsween | February 16, 2011 3:22 PM |

Why not get the spearhead or the Curly R back? Isn't the problem the use of the term Redskins in conjunction with the head on the helmet?

Posted by: scampbell1975 | February 16, 2011 3:26 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: DikShuttle | February 16, 2011 3:16 PM | Report abuse

I remember Grossman being pretty accurate and making some big throws throughout that year.

The Defense was the biggest reason Da Berzzz got to the SB, but having a guy like Hester and kicker like Gould for ST doesn't hurt you either.

The Grossman we have now I feel has lost some confidence from that year, and turns the ball over too much.

He doesn't have the good special teams or defense he had in Chicago, but if we keep adding players on both sides of the ball I don't see why he can't hold down the reigns while an un-and-comer gets ready.

Posted by: monk811 | February 16, 2011 3:26 PM | Report abuse

I like only half of this argument.

Rex holding the fort until mid season while C Ponder waits is a better half to argue.

Posted by: MistaMoe | February 16, 2011 3:13 PM

Well, you get the idea. I don't think even Sanchez started Week One. Seems like very few first round QBs start right away anyway. Maybe only Stafford in recent memory? I was surprised that the Broncos pulled Orton so early and went to Tebow so quickly ... maybe like Week Ten or around then?

You got your Pounder, I got my skinny guy. We'll see how it goes. Also, who is Andy Dalton? Is he the next Tom Brady or the next Colt Brennan?

Posted by: dcsween | February 16, 2011 3:28 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: RedSkinHead | February 16, 2011 3:20 PM | Report abuse

Yeah, we get that but in the FIFTH round are you going to throw a pick away on a lineman that probably won't even make the team or are you going to take a RB that can contribute? Are you going to draft some schlub left tackle from crapbucket state or john clay? I'd take the running back. We need oline starters. We have plenty of backups.

Posted by: PAskinsfan17 | February 16, 2011 3:31 PM | Report abuse

Why not get the spearhead or the Curly R back? Isn't the problem the use of the term Redskins in conjunction with the head on the helmet?

Posted by: scampbell1975 | February 16, 2011 3:26 PM

Seems like the beef is more about the guy's face than the title per say. Myself, I don't like the Curly R ... I like the blocky R in the white circle on gold with the feather on it ... they used it as the throwback helmet in 2007 ... or maybe lose the feather.

Posted by: dcsween | February 16, 2011 3:32 PM | Report abuse

Why not get the spearhead or the Curly R back? Isn't the problem the use of the term Redskins in conjunction with the head on the helmet?

Posted by: scampbell1975 | February 16, 2011 3:26 PM | Report abuse

The problem is the name. The retards think the name 'Redskins' is racist.

I think the first helmet was the feather going up the back, then the spear, then the R with the feather, then the face.

If people think the head is racist then they'll never go for the spear, so the R feather and gold helmet seems to be the most logical helmet.

I like our helmet and name, so hopefully they stay the same. My problem is the people that fill the helmets, oh and the people that make the decision on who fills the helmets. We should just wipe the slate clean and start over!

Posted by: monk811 | February 16, 2011 3:33 PM | Report abuse

Are you going to draft some schlub left tackle from crapbucket state or john clay? I'd take the running back. We need oline starters. We have plenty of backups.

Posted by: PAskinsfan17 | February 16, 2011 3:31 PM |

I'm sorry but if there is ANY player from a school named Crapbucket State that has made it into the NFL draft I want him on my team.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | February 16, 2011 3:34 PM | Report abuse

I say get rid of the helmets altogether...sissies!

Posted by: PlayAction | February 16, 2011 3:35 PM | Report abuse

Snyder has to be one of those shallow pockets owners of the above scenario..
All his other units (rockets, 6 flags, etc) are seriously hurting. And if he has to go out and get financing without a tv deal, 2011 concessions income, no preseason income (pure profit for owners) and a possible loss of anti-trust exemption.. the league might let him Sell.

I know.. pass the bong..but we can dream.

Jerah might have to give him a loan. Ironies of ironies...

Posted by: onanygivensunday | February 16, 2011 2:05 PM
------------------------------------------
As both sides stake out their options it sounds more like a pee-pee contest than a debate between reasonable individuals. The head of the NFLPA wants to make himself known and Goodell has a bunch of greedy owners pushing him into the ring. In the meantime, you have owners that won't be able to pay the bills without some serious finagling of funds and you have some players that will fall hard without the cash coming in. Art Rooney was the voice of reason in previous negotiations and it sounds like he's too tied up in his ambassador role to work with this one (and I think Goodell is too proud to ask for help). We can't expect any of the latter day owners to step up. I haven't seen much in the way of leadership from guys like Snyder and Jones: they're just in it for the money, so I am thinking we have a war on our hands.

Posted by: RedSkinHead | February 16, 2011 3:01 PM

I agree...
The Skins fans may be the only group rooting for a drawn out lockout if it creates any possibility of their team changing ownership.
Sweet irony if the City Paper outlasts Snyder in his lawsuit due to Snyder eventually feeling the pinch from the Lockout.

Posted by: onanygivensunday | February 16, 2011 3:41 PM | Report abuse

PAskinsfan

john clay? I'd take the running back.

I'd have no problem drafting Clay--but when?

What we need and don't have is a 3rd rounder.

I'd go defense round 1, quarterback 2, linebacker 3, guard/running back 4

Posted by: MistaMoe | February 16, 2011 3:43 PM | Report abuse

Are you going to draft some schlub left tackle from crapbucket state or john clay? I'd take the running back. We need oline starters. We have plenty of backups.

Posted by: PAskinsfan17 | February 16, 2011 3:31 PM

I'll call this partial persuasion, but it misses the mark. We just drafted that RB from LSU (the third down guy, name escapes me) in a later round. I'm thinking someone to combine with Torain to have the 1-2 punch like Cedric Benson-Thomas Jones (or DeAngelo Williams-Jonathan Stewart).

Also, though Crapbucket is a state school, I think it is formally Crapbucket Polytechnic University (Crapbucket Tech).

Posted by: dcsween | February 16, 2011 3:43 PM | Report abuse

Zeke- A 3rd RD'er for Carter? Dude it's 60 degrees in the DMV, not exactly la la land that you're living in, but not to shabby.

Still wondering what you think we could get for 52 & 22 considering they were tendered and gardnered zero interest.

Posted by: Diesel44 |

Today, no one gives up that for Carter because 2010 was a disaster for him and he's another year older.

But ...

Coming off his 2009 season and looking at a 3-4, would he have agreed to a trade? I think so, he didn't like the 3-4 in SF and came here to be a DE.

Why was Carter worth a 3rd coming into 2010?

He had about 5 years left as a good player (he was a former top 10 overall pick) and he'd probably get around $3-4million/year, not overly expensive for a starting DE.

He keeps himself in excellent shape, has an excellent attitude and plays hard.

Unlike most DEs, he rarely needs a play off, meaning he helps teams with the their DL rotation.

Plus, he can play either LDE or RDE.

And make no mistake, he had a very strong year in 2009 (same number of sacks as ware and Orakpo -- with more tackles than either) and been a part of 3 top 10 defenses in his 4 years in DC.

There is plenty of real value.

Now what does a 3rd round pick typically get you? I took a look at the 2005 3rd round. Roughly 40% didn't play in 2010. Roughly 40% were multi-year starters -- but only 2 ever made a Pro Bowl. Richie Incognito is in the top 1/3 of players in that class.

Is Andre Carter likely to be better than a guy I'd get in the 3rd round? Yes -- and its really not close.

Would a team like Chicago, who spent big on Peppers want a strong compliment at the other DE spot? Probably. Would a team like DET want to have a strong veteran to compliment Suh? Probably. Would NO, with GG as their DC who worked before with Carter consider him? Probably.

Bottom line, Carter had value, was coming off very strong year, filled needs for other teams and he was likely to give a team a lot more than they'd get from a 3rd round pick.

So yeah, I could have see a team pony up about a 3rd rounder for Carter prior to the 2010 season.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | February 16, 2011 3:45 PM | Report abuse

Snyder has to be one of those shallow pockets owners of the above scenario..
All his other units (rockets, 6 flags, etc) are seriously hurting. And if he has to go out and get financing without a tv deal, 2011 concessions income, no preseason income (pure profit for owners) and a possible loss of anti-trust exemption.. the league might let him Sell.

I know.. pass the bong..but we can dream.

Jerah might have to give him a loan. Ironies of ironies...

Posted by: onanygivensunday | February 16, 2011 2:05 PM

Boy you sure are assuming an awful lot. Danny has a lot more going on than Six Flags and Johnny Rockets. Dude's a billionaire, I wouldn't count on him being in financial trouble based on those two things. You show me any legitimate sign or source that claims Danny's pockets are anything but "straight" and then your assumptions may be worth a hoot but as of now I'd say you're grasping at straws.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | February 16, 2011 3:46 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: RedSkinHead | February 16, 2011 3:20 PM | Report abuse

Problem is how many pro ready NT are there. There are only so many holes that we can fill through the draft, i feel that NT wont be one of them due to this years crop of NTs. I see this years RB class as being very good, same as the WR class. So while it may not be our most pressing need it might be a smart position to draft. Keep in mind im talking latter rouinds.

And really RB shouldn't be that far down the list. Keep in mind Torain hasnt finished a full season of football since high school or Juco. And the stable aint that great behind it.

Posted by: Stu27 | February 16, 2011 3:50 PM | Report abuse

I pray that Cam Newton is not a member of the Washington football team coached by the Shanahans. Their treatment of McNabb and Haynesworth reflect their perception of Black players. A quarterback should be cerebral, a tactician, capable of manipulating sets of complex schemes and rely on mental acumen instead of his physical attributes. Hence, Mike Shanahan not so coded message (2 minute offense) that McNabb lacks those qualities but is dumb and incapable of executing multiple plays independently. Shanahan released information about Haynesworth’s conditioning to the press was a veiled attempt to humiliate him. A mature, emotionally health person would have handled it differently and most of all effectively. Shanahan created a maelstrom which haunted his team the entire year. That’s two of many examples that revealed the Shanahans’ immaturity, bias and prejudice. Don't let the Shanahans near Cam Newton. Their racism and prejudice and Kyle's insecurity are a potent formula that's deleterious and detrimental. If I were Cam, and were selected, I would go back to college; refuse to sign. Cam, pray for Divine intervention that you will be selected before it’s the Washington football team’s turn to pick. In advance and continously, give thanks to your Heavenly Father for his intervention.

Posted by: gvaway | February 16, 2011 3:51 PM | Report abuse

...and on that note...I'm outta here...

Posted by: PlayAction | February 16, 2011 3:54 PM | Report abuse

Andy Dalton? Is he the next Tom Brady or the next Colt Brennan?

Posted by: dcsween | February 16, 2011 3:28 PM | Report abuse

prob neither. Dude was a solid leader of one of the winningest programs in DI last few years. Dude put up numbers in a pass happy offnse. But its no June Jones gimmick like at Hawaii. he is like 50 TD to 14 INT for his Junior and Senior years. Im high on him mainly because of the price tag, chaep, 3rd or later.

Posted by: Stu27 | February 16, 2011 3:54 PM | Report abuse

Still think we ought to call them the Washington Negroes.

Could even keep the spear logos... and explain how it's really just meant to honor that time in our nation's history when Black Americans were given the right to vote, play on integrated teams, sit on the bus, etc.

As long as we're insistent on being racially offensive, we may as well play it to the max.

Posted by: Vic1 | February 16, 2011 3:56 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: scampbell1975 | February 16, 2011 3:46 PM | Report abuse

Exactly. I'm pretty sure Snyder is one of the more liquid owners in the league. If there were a top ten group of owners who could ride out a protracted labor war, he's likely on that list.

Actually, the NFL will protect it's own...

There is no chance in hell that any team will go under or be sold due to a labor dispute/canceled games/season.

Posted by: WaitingGuilty | February 16, 2011 3:57 PM | Report abuse

I pray that Cam Newton is not a member of the Washington football team coached by the Shanahans. Their treatment of McNabb and Haynesworth reflect their perception of Black players. A quarterback should be cerebral, a tactician, capable of manipulating sets of complex schemes and rely on mental acumen instead of his physical attributes. Hence, Mike Shanahan not so coded message (2 minute offense) that McNabb lacks those qualities but is dumb and incapable of executing multiple plays independently. Shanahan released information about Haynesworth’s conditioning to the press was a veiled attempt to humiliate him. A mature, emotionally health person would have handled it differently and most of all effectively. Shanahan created a maelstrom which haunted his team the entire year. That’s two of many examples that revealed the Shanahans’ immaturity, bias and prejudice. Don't let the Shanahans near Cam Newton. Their racism and prejudice and Kyle's insecurity are a potent formula that's deleterious and detrimental.

Posted by: gvaway | February 16, 2011 3:51 PM |

Hmmm, well, what about their treatment of every other black player on the team? Doesn't really jibe with your theory now does it? Joey Galloway and Roydell Williams got every chance under the sun and still sucked. Larry Johnson also had more than his share of opportunities. Let's face it, McNabb blew for far too long. He shoulda been benched earlier.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | February 16, 2011 3:59 PM | Report abuse

Draft Kaepernick ONLY, if any, Luck is the ideal ..

Shows how sensitive and how much heat the Skins FO is under for the trainer to lie about Banks..Snyder must be "spin-happy"...

Posted by: frak | February 16, 2011 3:59 PM | Report abuse

this team needs more than Luck to win.

Posted by: _Stumped_ | February 16, 2011 4:01 PM | Report abuse

Let's face it, McNabb blew for far too long. He shoulda been benched earlier.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | February 16, 2011 3:59 PM | Report abuse

He never should have been traded for in the first place. Why bring a guy into your rhythem and timing offense with a 58% completion percentage? It makes no sense. It's like we just ignored the 10 years of gamefilm and statistics we have on him.

Posted by: PAskinsfan17 | February 16, 2011 4:03 PM | Report abuse

Mike Shanahan = Racist mutant rat face.

Posted by: RedDMV | February 16, 2011 4:03 PM | Report abuse

He never should have been traded for in the first place. Why bring a guy into your rhythem and timing offense with a 58% completion percentage? It makes no sense. It's like we just ignored the 10 years of gamefilm and statistics we have on him.

Posted by: PAskinsfan17 | February 16, 2011 4:03 PM |

Agreed

Posted by: scampbell1975 | February 16, 2011 4:05 PM | Report abuse

Exactly. I'm pretty sure Snyder is one of the more liquid owners in the league. ...

Posted by: WaitingGuilty | February 16, 2011 3:57 PM

I see it differently. While I agree that he probably is among the wealthiest, I suspect that he is pretty heavily leveraged all over the place. And like all rich people in this country, I suspect all of the owners' individual fortunes (not their NFL portions) took a bath when the housing market bubble burst and the banks started melting. Also, didn't Daniel Snyder get taken huge by Bernie Madoff?

Posted by: dcsween | February 16, 2011 4:06 PM | Report abuse

I see it differently. While I agree that he probably is among the wealthiest, I suspect that he is pretty heavily leveraged all over the place. And like all rich people in this country, I suspect all of the owners' individual fortunes (not their NFL portions) took a bath when the housing market bubble burst and the banks started melting. Also, didn't Daniel Snyder get taken huge by Bernie Madoff?

Posted by: dcsween | February 16, 2011 4:06 PM |

We can only guess, which was my previous point. It's all nothing but wild speculation.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | February 16, 2011 4:08 PM | Report abuse

Draft Kaepernick ONLY, if any, Luck is the ideal ..

I dont want to burn a redshirt by playing him this year. lets wait till next year.

Posted by: Stu27 | February 16, 2011 4:10 PM | Report abuse

Diesel, I'll go thru the list and provide a value -- based on performance prior to 2010, compared to what a team might expect from a comparable draft pick. Mind you, this is 'sell high', but not absurd.

Carter: 3rd

Rocky: 4th (reasonable contract, every year starter, good tackler)

Carlos: 4th (similar to Rocky), especially since most teams play so much nickel -- demand is always very high

Rock: (conditional 7th)

Campbell: 3rd (at worst, he's a top 20 QB in this league -- and he's middle of the pack when considering all the 1st round QB picks)

Albert: 3rd, before it blew up. Though I think your argument that he was worth the risk, had merit.

Dockery: 6th, maybe conditional

Fred Davis: 3rd, he looked like a starting quality TE in his games in 2009.

DT11: 6th, again, maybe conditional. He at least showed something in 2009, someone might have been willing to take a chance for a 6th or 7th.

Of the 9 guys, 7 played for us in 2010, only 2 made a noteworthy contribution -- and both could walk for little/zero compensation at this point. Basically, its possible that none of the these 9 guys will be a starter for us in 2011.

So what might we have gotten.

4 3rd rounders
2 4th rounders
3 6 or 7th rounders, perhaps conditional

What we actually got was 1 4th rounder.

You can quibble Diesel, but at least 6 of these guys are starting players (or at least have that talent) in this league (Albert, Carter, Campbell, Rocky, 'Los and Fred Davis).

Given that the odds of anyone below a 3rd rounder becoming an every week starter are pretty modest (well below 50%), its not unreasonable to get 3rd and 4th rounders for starting players.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | February 16, 2011 4:12 PM | Report abuse

Also, didn't Daniel Snyder get taken huge by Bernie Madoff?

Posted by: dcsween | February 16, 2011 4:06 PM | Report abuse

Never heard about that...But if true, let me be the first to say:

Could not have happened to a nicer guy!

Posted by: WaitingGuilty | February 16, 2011 4:21 PM | Report abuse

So you take Campell of of that list and don't make the McNabb trade, and you've got:

1 2nd (a very early 2nd rounder)
4 3rds
2 4th
3 6-7 rounders

Which is pretty close to an entire draft.

That is what mgmt left on the table in 2010. As of now, the only guy that seems probable to be on the roster in 2011 in Fred Davis, and he's a backup.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | February 16, 2011 4:25 PM | Report abuse

I've never seen people so enmeshed in woulda, coulda, shoulda.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | February 16, 2011 4:26 PM | Report abuse

He never should have been traded for in the first place. Why bring a guy into your rhythem and timing offense with a 58% completion percentage? It makes no sense. It's like we just ignored the 10 years of gamefilm and statistics we have on him.

Posted by: PAskinsfan17 | February 16, 2011 4:03 PM |

Agreed

Posted by: scampbell1975 | February 16, 2011 4:05 PM

I assumed that the deal was in the works well before Allen or Shanahan arrived. McNabb was here too quickly after Shanahan got here to have been a full-on Shanahan deal. I just figured that The Owner wanted him and Allen was brought in to get the deal done. But I concede that the annoucement of Allen before Shanahan probably was just stage craft and that The Owner and Shanahan had been in negotiations from around the time Zorn accelerated the losing slide after the winning start.

Posted by: dcsween | February 16, 2011 4:28 PM | Report abuse

I've never seen people so enmeshed in woulda, coulda, shoulda.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | February 16, 2011 4:26 PM

That's what the RI offseason (and a huge part of the regular season) is all about!

What fans SHOULD be enmeshing in is "better be" about the CBA getting done before March 4th.

Posted by: dcsween | February 16, 2011 4:31 PM | Report abuse

You show me any legitimate sign or source that claims Danny's pockets are anything but "straight" and then your assumptions may be worth a hoot but as of now I'd say you're grasping at straws.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | February 16, 2011 3:46 PM

Ummmm right off the top of my cranium.. The Six Flags Bankruptcy. If his pockets were that deep.. He would of bought back the shares and acquired more control when the shares were heading into the pink sheets...or about to be delisted.

Cant think of any of his non-Redskin biz related units that are presently successful enough to carry a Redskin-less income year. So, I throw it back to you Scamp.. Show me what cash flow he has other than a guaranteed nfl tv deal (for now, until the NFLPA sues), and FedEx concessions (gone via lockout), Redskins Radio (Dan Jazeera)..whose Ad sales will disappear with a lockout, etc.
He could be thinner than we think, without the Redskins direct and/or related income.

Posted by: onanygivensunday | February 16, 2011 4:32 PM | Report abuse

I just hate the idea of the all mock drafts suggesting we will or should draft cam newton. One good year of major college football doesnt mean anything when it comes to the NFL. Its going to be hard to continue to support this team if they draft this guy.

Posted by: cwharrison | February 16, 2011 4:32 PM | Report abuse

He never should have been traded for in the first place. Why bring a guy into your rhythem and timing offense with a 58% completion percentage? It makes no sense. It's like we just ignored the 10 years of gamefilm and statistics we have on him.

Posted by: PAskinsfan17 | February 16, 2011 4:03 PM |

Agreed

Posted by: scampbell1975 | February 16, 2011 4:05 PM

I assumed that the deal was in the works well before Allen or Shanahan arrived. McNabb was here too quickly after Shanahan got here to have been a full-on Shanahan deal. I just figured that The Owner wanted him and Allen was brought in to get the deal done. But I concede that the annoucement of Allen before Shanahan probably was just stage craft and that The Owner and Shanahan had been in negotiations from around the time Zorn accelerated the losing slide after the winning start.

Posted by: dcsween

I don't think it was clear the McNabb was up for trade prior to the clunkers at the end of 2009. He had a very good year until then -- and if philly hadn't laid an egg in the postseason, McNabb might still be there. But back to back whippings in dallas and his fate was sealed.

So I don't think there was a deal before the end of 2009. but I'd agree that hiring Allen before Shanny was stagecraft -- Shanahan was in the fold before the 2009 season ended.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | February 16, 2011 4:35 PM | Report abuse

Uh oh. We have either hit the witching hour or I'm the target of ITA.

OK, here's another one ... the RI coin toss is not a choice btwn two equally probable outcomes.

Instead, its just about throwing small currency at each other.

The age-old conflict between those who seek change and those who resist change.

Posted by: dcsween | February 16, 2011 4:37 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: onanygivensunday | February 16, 2011 4:32 PM | Report abuse

Dude, I'm with you, I would love to see Snyder sell the team.

I can't offer you any balance sheets or P/L statements, but it's probably fair to assume Dan Snyder has plenty of money/revenue streams/credit/willing minority investors to weather any potential labor trouble or missed games.

Ans as for your 6 Flags take- Nope. Billionaires don't become billionaires by throwing good money after bad money.

(Insert Haynesworth/Archuleta/Lloyd/ Deion joke here)

Posted by: WaitingGuilty | February 16, 2011 4:38 PM | Report abuse

Go get some fresh air Zeke.

Posted by: Diesel44 | February 16, 2011 4:39 PM | Report abuse

I just hate the idea of the all mock drafts suggesting we will or should draft cam newton. One good year of major college football doesnt mean anything when it comes to the NFL. Its going to be hard to continue to support this team if they draft this guy.

Posted by: cwharrison | February 16, 2011 4:32 PM

I love the idea. Hopefully every other NFL assumes its true and doesn't jump ahead of us to grab one of the defenders we really need.

Posted by: dcsween | February 16, 2011 4:46 PM | Report abuse

You show me any legitimate sign or source that claims Danny's pockets are anything but "straight" and then your assumptions may be worth a hoot but as of now I'd say you're grasping at straws.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | February 16, 2011 3:46 PM

Ummmm right off the top of my cranium.. The Six Flags Bankruptcy. If his pockets were that deep.. He would of bought back the shares and acquired more control when the shares were heading into the pink sheets...or about to be delisted.

Cant think of any of his non-Redskin biz related units that are presently successful enough to carry a Redskin-less income year. So, I throw it back to you Scamp.. Show me what cash flow he has other than a guaranteed nfl tv deal (for now, until the NFLPA sues), and FedEx concessions (gone via lockout), Redskins Radio (Dan Jazeera)..whose Ad sales will disappear with a lockout, etc.
He could be thinner than we think, without the Redskins direct and/or related income.

Posted by: onanygivensunday | February 16, 2011

I don't know if Danny could survive without ticket revenues in 2011. The networks apparently need to pay on their contracts regardless (seems sort of like a loan, but I'm not clear on the details). Thing is, its essentially impossible to tell the real financial situation.

Cash flow and available cash (both in the bank and lines of credit) are really issues that are well beyond our abilities to know much about. Further complicating it, these are both team issues and owner issues -- I have no idea how or if the Skins 'retain' their earnings or if they pay them out as dividends. I don't know when they sold their minority stake if that cash stayed on the balance sheet or was used to reduce debts, etc. I don't know if Snyder could loan the team money in order to pay bills during a work stoppage.

But, I'm guessing there are franchises that will suck a lot of wind if 2011 doesn't happen. For example, jerruh built and awfully expensive palace ... I'm sure there's a good size mortgage that a few concerts and some college football won't come close to covering.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | February 16, 2011 4:47 PM | Report abuse

Ans as for your 6 Flags take- Nope. Billionaires don't become billionaires by throwing good money after bad money.

(Insert Haynesworth/Archuleta/Lloyd/ Deion joke here)

Posted by: WaitingGuilty | February 16, 2011 4:38 PM

understood.. Maybe the only hope to get him to sell the team is the loss of the anti-trust exemption.

Posted by: onanygivensunday | February 16, 2011 4:49 PM | Report abuse

Should the Redskins draft a quarterback? Todd McShay thinks so.

Mr. Jones.

May I call you 'Mike'?

No?

Fine, then.

He's an assignment: what's your opinion on the redskin quarterback situation?

We'd like to know.

In fact, let's consider each option you could consider:

--playing the 'all is forgiven game' and re-inserting D McNabb as the starter

--letting Rex start and groom a drafted kid behind him

--calling for an open competition between Rex and John Beck

-cutting Beck or Rex loose and starting fresh with other guys

--drafting a kid @ 10 and letting him start day 1

--bringing in an established NFL starter (Palmer, Smith, Young)


I think you get the point.

Lay out some plans for us in the peanut gallery to assault or support.

We had very little insight from the guy you're taking over from, so feel free to offer up some fresh ideas for us to rip into shrewds.

(Did I say that?)

Go 'head, christian--the lions are waiting.

Posted by: gimmesummoe | February 16, 2011 4:53 PM | Report abuse

Ummmm right off the top of my cranium.. The Six Flags Bankruptcy. If his pockets were that deep.. He would of bought back the shares and acquired more control when the shares were heading into the pink sheets...or about to be delisted.

Posted by: onanygivensunday | February 16, 2011 4:32 PM

You don't understand bankruptcy, do you? The shareholders lost control of the company to the debt holders. This happened because they weren't able to make enough money to pay the debt. He would have had to buy debt, not more shares, to get control.

Posted by: beep-beep | February 16, 2011 4:53 PM | Report abuse

Here we are in the same position as last yr. Please SKINS draft a QB this yr. I'm sooooo tired of talking about this position.. draft a QB and him grow with our organization, then we won't be talking about the samething in 2012... WE NEED A QB!

It's that freakin simple!

Posted by: taylormade218 | February 16, 2011 4:55 PM | Report abuse

Maybe the only hope to get him to sell the team is the loss of the anti-trust exemption.

Posted by: onanygivensunday | February 16, 2011 4:49 PM

No, the only hope is divorce.

Posted by: beep-beep | February 16, 2011 4:57 PM | Report abuse

One good year of major college football doesn't mean anything when it comes to the NFL.


Yes, Cam Newton should stay in college.

But as he'd prefer to help himself--and not the NCAA or AU get rich--I don't blame him for wanting NFL money.

I'd say any team taking him would have to see his selection in the same way NBA teams used to see the high schoolers they once took: strictly on potential.

And even if Cam flubs as a quarterback (which I doubt), he actually could become a fine pro tight end (6'6", 250 pds.).

I'd create an NFL spread type offense with quick reads and simple options, a strong running attack, and let him grow into the position as a pro.

Folks who doubt Cam see the old school, drop back 5-7 steps, read the field quarterback as the optimum.

Cam might be more like J Freeman, Mike Vick, or Big Ben in 3 years.

And that's not bad.

Posted by: gimmesummoe | February 16, 2011 5:11 PM | Report abuse

understood.. Maybe the only hope to get him to sell the team is the loss of the anti-trust exemption.

Posted by: onanygivensunday | February 16, 2011 4:49 PM | Report abuse
=================

The NFL doesn't have an anti-trust exemption! Only MLB does!

Posted by: dkidwell61 | February 16, 2011 5:29 PM | Report abuse

Supreme Court seems disinclined to give NFL antitrust exemption

By Robert Barnes
Washington Post Staff Writer
Thursday, January 14, 2010

Supreme Court justices Wednesday showed little support for exempting the National Football League from federal antitrust laws, a longtime goal of the league and other sports organizations.

The court considered a lawsuit challenging the NFL's decision to give a sole contract to Reebok to manufacture hats, T-shirts and other apparel bearing the logos of the league's teams. But the bigger question was whether the NFL should be considered a "single entity" -- rather than a collection of 32 independently owned teams -- and thus shielded from the Sherman Antitrust Act. A single company cannot be guilty of conspiring with itself to harm consumers.

Justice Sonia Sotomayor told the NFL's attorney, Gregg Levy: "You are seeking through this ruling what you haven't gotten from Congress: an absolute bar to an antitrust claim." Among sports leagues, only Major League Baseball has an antitrust exemption.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/01/13/AR2010011304394.html?wprss=rss_nation

Posted by: beep-beep | February 16, 2011 5:36 PM | Report abuse

Still looking for a QB....

The Skins have had 4 different QBs that led their teams to Super Bowls since 2003. Unfortunately 2 of them did it before they put on a Skins uni (McNabb 2005 and Grossman 2007). The other 2 did it after they left.

Ironically, the 2 QBs who left the Skins to play in the SB faced off against each other in the same SB in 2003: Brad Johnson and Rich Gannon.

The Skins have had some quality QBs they can win with over the years, but the supporting cast has been lacking.

Like Fred Smoot said, it's all about the fat boys.

Posted by: Alan4 | February 16, 2011 5:58 PM | Report abuse

I just hate the idea of the all mock drafts suggesting we will or should draft cam newton. One good year of major college football doesnt mean anything when it comes to the NFL. Its going to be hard to continue to support this team if they draft this guy.

Posted by: cwharrison | February 16, 2011 4:32 PM | Report abuse

-----------------

Neither does several "good years" mean anything!! The draft is a crap shoot!!
If you are such a pathetic fence sitter as to be effected by the drafting of a single player, please jump off now!! Heck, you probably are wearing a Packers Jersey this week anyway while your waiting for your Steelers jersey refund!!

Posted by: dkidwell61 | February 16, 2011 6:05 PM | Report abuse

Skins should change to "Bullets". I'd love to see those uniforms.

Posted by: coparker5 | February 16, 2011 6:13 PM | Report abuse

Cant think of any of his non-Redskin biz related units that are presently successful enough to carry a Redskin-less income year. So, I throw it back to you Scamp.. Show me what cash flow he has other than a guaranteed nfl tv deal (for now, until the NFLPA sues), and FedEx concessions (gone via lockout), Redskins Radio (Dan Jazeera)..whose Ad sales will disappear with a lockout, etc.
He could be thinner than we think, without the Redskins direct and/or related income.

Posted by: onanygivensunday | February 16, 2011

My point was, for the second time, that we really don't know what Dan Snyder's investments hold. But right off the top of wiki he owns Dick Clark Production, Red Zebra Radio (which you mentioned but is into far more than just Redskins radio), he's on the board of Ventiv Health and McLeodUSA, and he has investments in Tom Cruises production company. Those are the ones that a very quick search produced.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | February 16, 2011 6:42 PM | Report abuse

It's sort of silly to project a need pick for Washington at #10. They've got needs everywhere. With McNabb not a certainty, the team is essentially where they were before last year's draft -- except picking six spots lower.

They're going to have to grab whoever is highest on their board.

Posted by: Samson151 | February 16, 2011 8:58 PM | Report abuse

here is where i see a problem with picking either one of these quarterbacks you have the bills picking at 5 and the titans picking at 6 now unless you can be sure that gabbert is gonna be there you wait for him otherwise this is what you have to do trade down and get additional picks and build the offensive line sign a veteran quarterback for a two year deal something like that and come next year you trade your first round of 2012 and 2013 for andrew luck now the question then becomes where are you picking in the first round are you picking on top 5 if you are then it'll cost you something in the neighborhood of 1st 2nd possibly forth and a player if that's the case make the trade if it's not costing you extra forst round pick.

Posted by: rmnkevorkian | February 16, 2011 9:42 PM | Report abuse

Last year the useful idiots in this forum were screaming for an offensive lineman instead of a QB. So the Skins spent a gazillion dollars for one Trent Williams. IMHO he was a big waste of money. They could have gotten someone as good for a lot less.

Posted by: theBozyn | February 17, 2011 9:36 AM | Report abuse

Ignore the experts. Draft down and pick up an additional pick and take best interior lineman available. Keep Rex until the lines are solid and then get the best QB out there.

Posted by: agrimech | February 17, 2011 12:45 PM | Report abuse

I have to say....given that if there is no CBA done and could drastically affect how teams draft this year....SHANALLEN should follow the path that Shanahan adapted later in Denver.

Rebuild the OL & DL 1st...then add your skill positions later.

Gabbert & Newton are giving me huge flashbacks of SHULER & DILFER. Seriously.

Redskins should either draft a DL at 10 or trade down and pickup up more picks. We have too many holes to draft a QB that high and let him ride the pine for 3-4 years. I'd actually prefer us to stockpile picks, focus on other areas besides QB and take the growing pains and actually be in position to draft Luck next year.

Posted by: goosedude | February 17, 2011 4:32 PM | Report abuse

If there isn't a guy they are totally sure of at 10 (offensive/defensive line, linebacker, defensive back) they should trade down and draft Locker in the 2nd or 3rd round. Then see if they can't get Luck or whoever is "great" next year. Sign a decent vet to handle (example: Marc Bulger) the coming season at QB, and build up this offensive and defense through FA and the rest of the draft. Also they need to get a top notch WR (Sidney Rice) and maybe re-sign Moss IF it's on the cheap. DO NOT DRAFT A QB AT 10.

Posted by: corky1031 | February 18, 2011 1:06 PM | Report abuse

cool...so we trade back if we can...fill as many holes as we can focusing on the O and D lines...maybe a developmental WR or some DB/LB help. Then we let them play together for a year...tank the season...and draft Luck

Posted by: shanahananigans | February 18, 2011 1:12 PM | Report abuse

Oh I'd also like to add, if there's a kicker in FA this year that actually makes field goals, FREAKING SIGN HIM. Vinatieri was sitting out there a few years back, we spend all this money on garbage, and we can't just sign a kicker who makes his kicks. These guys are the difference between wins and losses. Go back over the last 15 years and look at games that were lost by 3 points or less. Then see how many missed field goals there were in those games. Then cry.

Posted by: corky1031 | February 18, 2011 1:14 PM | Report abuse

Black College Football Hall of Fame - Class of 2011

* Rosey Brown, OL, Morgan
* Earl Banks, Coach, Morgan
* Lem Barney, DB, Jackson
* Mel Blount, DB, Southern
* Willie Davis, DL, Grambling
* "Bullet" Bob Hayes, WR/KR, FAMU
* Joe Kendall, QB, Kentucky St
* Art Shell, OL, Md Eastern Shore
* Doug Williams, QB, Grambling
* Willie Jeffries, Coach, SC St/Howard

Posted by: typrather | February 18, 2011 6:08 PM | Report abuse

As great a player Cam Newton will be in the future it is best he not be here as a Washington Redskin. Their history with quarterbacks of color is the worst. Doug Williams won the superbowl but was gone quickly ater that. Jason Campbell was a quarerback with an arm but was ruined by Jim Zorn who was in his ear constantly telling him to throw 3 - 5 yard dump offs and finally the Shannahans vs Donovan McNabb need I say more. Cam please take a stand like Elway or the NY Manning by telling this team he does not want to play nere.

Posted by: smith_michael | February 19, 2011 11:40 AM | Report abuse

Redskins tend to destroy talented young quarterbacks...so please stick with the old folks and give the young kids a chance to succeed with a decent team.

Posted by: JCM-51 | February 20, 2011 5:25 PM | Report abuse

Draft best available at any needed position, and I'm starting to like Ingram by that standard.

Posted by: fr3dmars | February 20, 2011 7:00 PM | Report abuse

How about drafting a new name before anything else? Ditch the racist name and I'll start giving a s**t about this sorry franchise. Meanwhile, LET'S GO CAPS!

Posted by: jmarks09 | February 23, 2011 10:19 AM | Report abuse

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