Network News

X My Profile
View More Activity
On Twitter: RedskinsInsider and PostSports  |  Facebook  |  E-mail alerts: Redskins and Sports  |  RSS

For Redskins, combine offers more than just stats

Two of The Post's three Redskins beat writers are headed to Indianapolis today for the NFL scouting combine.

As the combine gets underway Thursday at Lucas Oil Stadium, Rick Maese and Jason Reid (Barry Svrluga must be on vacation again) will have a lot to share about players the Redskins might select in the three-day April draft.

Obviously, the combine is the league's biggest stage for potential new talent, and "it's a convenience beyond everything," Redskins General Manager Bruce Allen said in a recent phone interview. "You can't get that many players with your entire medical staff, your entire scouting staff and your entire coaching staff together for a concentrated week.

"That's what makes it such a valuable process. It'd be impossible to fly around to all the schools with your entire staff and be able to accumulate the information that we'll get from this one week there."

The show on the field -- 40-yard dash times, agility drills, throwing, catching, etc. -- is the part of the process that most intrigues football fans. But for NFL decision-makers, the closed-door interview sessions with players often are even more beneficial than the data obtained on the field.

"Character is one of the key measureables when evaluating the player," Allen said. "Besides the tape, the player's performance and the recommendation we'll get from the coaches, their college coaches, the instincts our coaching staff will have in how they're going to blend into our team, our locker room and our community is one of the critical factors in making a decision."

By Jason Reid and Rick Maese  |  February 24, 2010; 12:30 PM ET
Categories:  Bruce Allen  
Save & Share:  Send E-mail   Facebook   Twitter   Digg   Yahoo Buzz   Del.icio.us   StumbleUpon   Technorati   Google Buzz   Previous: Redskins' first question centers on the quarterback
Next: Campbell's future with Redskins should come into focus with draft

Comments

Busy up here all of a sudden :)

Posted by: NateinthePDX | February 24, 2010 12:43 PM | Report abuse

Tom Brady is a GOD, Haze!

roflcopter.

srry - you're right. I was a lil punchdrunk. m'bad - plz forgive. It was Diesel.

Posted by: DikShuttle | February 24, 2010 12:44 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: DikShuttle | February 24, 2010 12:46 PM | Report abuse

Whudabboud tha Wunderlic(sp)?

Posted by: DikShuttle | February 24, 2010 12:48 PM | Report abuse

I can see both sides of this draft QB/Olineman argument, except that people are not considering that first round O-lineman can be busts just as much as QB's.

We're going to need a QB at some point. Yes, there have been some mid round gems and busts, just like first round gems and busts.

Personally, I'd take a QB. He doesn't have to play right away.

Posted by: rickyroge | February 24, 2010 12:48 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: rickyroge | February 24, 2010 12:50 PM | Report abuse

The Houston Texans have informed cornerback Dunta Robinson(notes) they will not be using the franchise tag on him for a second consecutive year, according to Houston Chronicle beat writer and SN correspondent John McClain.

McClain reported Monday that Robinson had not heard a word out of the Houston camp, which made the inevitable all that more predictable.

Since negotiations on a new contract have ceased, Robinson will become an unrestricted free agent on March 5 and can sign with any team.

Robinson, a first-round draft choice in 2004 who played six seasons with the Texans, earned $9.957 million last year when he was designated as the franchise player, according to the newspaper.

Posted by: skinfanman | February 24, 2010 12:52 PM | Report abuse

roflcopter.

Posted by: DikShuttle | February 24, 2010 12:46 PM |

..................___\||/___
.\\...............|'-|--| .\\....\
..\ \_...........|--|---|..\\ ....\
../ L \____,/-------\___\___\
.|LOL|-------------O----- ----,\..
..\ L /______,---''-----------, /...
../ /.............\_________ ,/....
.//.............____//___ __\\__/.

Posted by: MrRed | February 24, 2010 1:09 PM | Report abuse

If Dan Snyder hopes to defend his streak of ten consecutive off-season championships, he's really gotta get going. Mike Shanny by himself isn't gotta win the championship for him. LT and B. Westbrook are right up his alley! Splashy, over-valued, and washed-up.

Posted by: REDneckSKINhead | February 24, 2010 1:12 PM | Report abuse

MrR - thaz byuful!

Skinhed - rite? git wth tha prgrm!

Posted by: DikShuttle | February 24, 2010 1:23 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: REDneckSKINhead | February 24, 2010 1:12 PM |

Dude. We wuz wondering where you wuz. Your cuz, Redskinhead, had no idea.

Posted by: MrRed | February 24, 2010 1:24 PM | Report abuse

The Houston Texans have informed cornerback Dunta Robinson(notes) they will not be using the franchise tag on him for a second consecutive year, according to Houston Chronicle beat writer and SN correspondent John McClain.

McClain reported Monday that Robinson had not heard a word out of the Houston camp, which made the inevitable all that more predictable.

Since negotiations on a new contract have ceased, Robinson will become an unrestricted free agent on March 5 and can sign with any team.

Robinson, a first-round draft choice in 2004 who played six seasons with the Texans, earned $9.957 million last year when he was designated as the franchise player, according to the newspaper.


Posted by: skinfanman | February 24, 2010 12:52 PM | Report abuse
Robinson and Dansby might be two good additions this offseason. Slim pickings otherwise...

Posted by: DCinSD | February 24, 2010 1:26 PM | Report abuse

"Character is one of the key measureables when evaluating the player ... the instincts our coaching staff will have in how they're going to blend into our team, our locker room and our community is one of the critical factors in making a decision."

I wonder who evaluated Landry when deciding to bring him here. I never pictured him being a solid locker room or community guy.

Posted by: Devo2 | February 24, 2010 1:26 PM | Report abuse

I wonder who evaluated Landry when deciding to bring him here. I never pictured him being a solid locker room or community guy.

Posted by: Devo2 | February 24, 2010 1:26 PM

That probably would have been the same guy who evaluated Sean Taylor -- Gregg Williams. Sean got off to a rocky start here, and Gregg worked with him. I think if Gregg had a longer time to work with LL, then LL would be a better player and team member.

Posted by: League-Source | February 24, 2010 1:31 PM | Report abuse

Select the thread with the most obvious main idea:

a. For Redskins, combine offers more than just stats.

b. Redskins' first question centers on the quarterback

c. Redskins heading in right direction, but turnaround will take time

d. Mike Mayock agrees Redskins should target quarterback in NFL draft

e. Redskins focus on present players, then draft and free agency


Tough call here as the trained eye notices that each title and subsequent writing offering pretty much summarizes the same idea:

There is no news coming from Redskins Park.

And for now, that's a good thing.

Posted by: MistaMoe | February 24, 2010 1:33 PM | Report abuse

""Character is one of the key measureables when evaluating the player ... the instincts our coaching staff will have in how they're going to blend into our team, our locker room and our community is one of the critical factors in making a decision."

Character is also very difficult to measure. You're talking about a league that thinks the Wonderlic measures intelligence (they actually like it because it's short). The only real indicator of a prospect's character is how he's behaved in the past. Everything else is pretty arbitrary.

Posted by: Samson151 | February 24, 2010 1:39 PM | Report abuse

"Woman says her love handles saved her life"

ATLANTIC CITY, N.J. — A Florida woman said her love handles saved her life when she was shot entering an Atlantic City bar. Samantha Lynn Frazier said she heard two pops when she walked into Herman's Place early Saturday. The massively obese 35-year-old then felt pain and saw blood on her hand after she grabbed her left side. Atlantic City police said Frazier was an innocent bystander.

The suspect remains at large.


Who said Florida women aren't tough?

And, of course, if a fat woman is the victim of a crime, the suspect will always be 'at large'.

Back to work.........

Posted by: MistaMoe | February 24, 2010 1:41 PM | Report abuse

There is no news coming from Redskins Park.

And for now, that's a good thing.

Posted by: MistaMoe | February 24, 2010 1:33 PM | Report abuse


What IS there for Larry Michaels to do?!?

Posted by: DikShuttle | February 24, 2010 1:44 PM | Report abuse

drafting a OL with our first would be a bad move... signing "LT" would be a great move!!!

Posted by: taylormade218 | February 24, 2010 1:46 PM | Report abuse

drafting a OL with our first would be a bad move... signing "LT" would be a great move!!!

Posted by: taylormade218 |

I sure as hell hope this is sarcastic...

Posted by: Rypien11 | February 24, 2010 1:58 PM | Report abuse

" ...signing "LT" would be a great move!"


Yea, for LaDanien Tomlinson and his agent.

The only older back in the league worth signing isn't availiable: Ricky Williams.

The guy was a joke for missing so much time due to suspension for weed, but I caught a glimplse of him in the saints v. fins game on NFL Replay, and he's got speed Portis used to have.

If Ricky Williams became availiable, there would be a long line of teams waiting to holla at his agent.

LT?: don't think so, the guy is done.

Posted by: MistaMoe | February 24, 2010 2:04 PM | Report abuse

I wonder who evaluated Landry when deciding to bring him here. I never pictured him being a solid locker room or community guy.

Posted by: Devo2 | February 24, 2010 1:26 PM


I don't think alot of "evaluation" took place with that pick. Cerrato took the "best player available", and LL was widely considered the top overall defensive player in the draft.

Posted by: p1funk | February 24, 2010 2:15 PM | Report abuse

LT?: don't think so, the guy is done.

Posted by: MistaMoe | February 24, 2010 2:04 PM

If he signs with another team it will be as dumb as when Emmitt Smith went to Arizona.

Posted by: League-Source | February 24, 2010 2:16 PM | Report abuse

Hmmmm...Dunta Robinson. UFA, no franchise tag, ties to Kyle Shanahan...Anyone see him in burgundy and gold by next weekend?

Posted by: wagman1 | February 24, 2010 2:20 PM | Report abuse

I don't think alot of "evaluation" took place with that pick. Cerrato took the "best player available", and LL was widely considered the top overall defensive player in the draft.

Posted by: p1funk | February 24, 2010 2:15 PM

I seriously doubt it. I don't see Gregg Williams taking a pig in a poke based on "widely considered the top overall" anything.

Posted by: League-Source | February 24, 2010 2:23 PM | Report abuse

LT?: don't think so, the guy is done.

Posted by: MistaMoe | February 24, 2010 2:04 PM

If he signs with another team it will be as dumb as when Emmitt Smith went to Arizona.

Posted by: League-Source | February 24, 2010 2:16 PM
------------------------------------------
I was thinking the same thing. Most teams have it figured out than when a running back gets in that 2000 carry point of their career, it is down hill from then on... and the buyer should beware. Westbrook maybe saw his decline a little ahead of schedule, but he had a lot of receptions that were behind the line of scrimmage therefore little difference from running plays. With the Eagles dumping Westbrook and the Chargers dumping LT, maybe the writing is on the wall for CP as well...

Posted by: RedSkinHead | February 24, 2010 2:30 PM | Report abuse

I wonder who evaluated Landry when deciding to bring him here. I never pictured him being a solid locker room or community guy.

Posted by: Devo2 | February 24, 2010 1:26 PM


I don't think alot of "evaluation" took place with that pick. Cerrato took the "best player available", and LL was widely considered the top overall defensive player in the draft.

Posted by: p1funk | February 24, 2010 2:15 PM
-------------------------------------------
The thought of having Sean Taylor and a physical specimen like Landry in the backfield at the same time had half of the front office foaming at the mouth. Shoulda, coulda, woulda...

Posted by: RedSkinHead | February 24, 2010 2:32 PM | Report abuse

I don't care what they do I'll roll with Shanny's opinion of JC and take his word for it. But we have a young group of receivers, young tight ends, old backs, a crap line, and a mediocre QB. If I were in charge and I'm not, but if I were, I'd get my young QB this year when I have my pick of the liter and let him grow with his young targets.

Trade JC for St. Louis' 3rd
Trade Carlos for a 3rd
They both have underachieved and their attitudes/baggage would be better on another team as we revamp this roster

I would draft:
1 - Clausen/Bradford
2 - Tackle
3 - RB
3 - Tackle
4 - Guard
5 - ILB
7 - WR

I would cut ARE, Smoot, Randy Thomas, and Betts.

I would sign Antrelle Rolle or another player to play FS and move LL back to SS, Larry Foote, Dunta Robinson, Gandy, Kareem McKenzie (who is likely to be cut http://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/features/rumors), and a guard preferably Chester Pitts.

I know it isn't drafting a tackle in round 1 so everyone will hate it but that's how I'd roll......but honestly, I don't care if this happens or not, in Shanny I trust.

Hail!

Posted by: zjfr2 | February 24, 2010 2:46 PM | Report abuse

With the Eagles dumping Westbrook and the Chargers dumping LT, maybe the writing is on the wall for CP as well...

Posted by: RedSkinHead | February 24, 2010 2:30 PM |

One can only wish you are right.

Posted by: sthai75 | February 24, 2010 2:48 PM | Report abuse

in Shanny I trust.

Posted by: zjfr2 | February 24, 2010 2:46 PM

So, are you serious or sarcastic here? If you're serious, I agree. If you're sarcastic, then I don't.

Posted by: League-Source | February 24, 2010 2:50 PM | Report abuse

Also, I would bring any and all undrafted LBs that have a ounce of potential to camp since my new staff wants a 3-4 and I would continue to draft young lineman heavily the next two years.

Posted by: zjfr2 | February 24, 2010 2:53 PM | Report abuse

Hmmmm...Dunta Robinson. UFA, no franchise tag, ties to Kyle Shanahan...Anyone see him in burgundy and gold by next weekend?

Posted by: wagman1 | February 24, 2010 2:20 PM | Report abuse

He's my pick for the free agent CB we need. I have seen him panned here, but we need a FS, CB, SSLB, and young up and coming DT. But didn't I see that LOS re'd up? So maybe they don't want two CB's with ROGERS in the house.

My others were NICK COLLINS after my infatuation for ERIC BERRY wore off, KARLOS DANSBY or BULLOCK/CROWELL in that order, and BARRY COFIELD with ANTONIO DIXON as a reach. If we stay in a 4-3 for this season, those four would be dy-no-mite IMHO. Of course COLLINS is an RFA and a pick might be involved, but he's unhappy in BUFFALO. COFIELD is also an RFA and again a pick would be involved, and the jints may have already signed him. I can't see ALLEN-SHANAHAN giving up two of their five picks for the defensive side of the ball. Better to get DUNTA or LOS and KARLOS and let the rest take care of itself. TERRELL WHITEHEAD FS from NORFOLK STATE would be a good post-draft pick-up if he falls out of the draft. I have no idea who might be a good LB post-draft prospect, but I'm sure some of you do.

Posted by: glawrence007 | February 24, 2010 2:54 PM | Report abuse

I seriously doubt it. I don't see Gregg Williams taking a pig in a poke based on "widely considered the top overall" anything.

Posted by: League-Source | February 24, 2010 2:23 PM | Report abuse


Well, with Vinny Cerratto in charge of the draft and making the picks and clearly articulating that he's going with best overall talent, I'm not sure that GG had much say in the decision.

Posted by: p1funk | February 24, 2010 2:55 PM | Report abuse

Well, with Vinny Cerratto in charge of the draft and making the picks and clearly articulating that he's going with best overall talent, I'm not sure that GG had much say in the decision.

Posted by: p1funk | February 24, 2010 2:55 PM

Funk, Vinny wasn't in charge of the draft then. Joe Gibbs was. Do you think Joe's going to listen to Vinny over Gregg? Remember Gibbs picked Gregg. Gibbs didn't pick Vinny.

Posted by: League-Source | February 24, 2010 3:02 PM | Report abuse

I can see both sides of this draft QB/Olineman argument, except that people are not considering that first round O-lineman can be busts just as much as QB's.

We're going to need a QB at some point. Yes, there have been some mid round gems and busts, just like first round gems and busts.

Personally, I'd take a QB. He doesn't have to play right away.

Posted by: rickyroge

If I'm not mistaken a QB drafted at #4 will want a whole lot more $$$$ than an O lineman drafted at that spot. And the O lineman can start immediately - after all, a rookie O lineman could not play any worse than some of the guys we had last season.

In the meantime we would be stuck paying a massive amount of $$$ to a QB who will not play immediately and will probably suck when he does.

Posted by: Lisa_R | February 24, 2010 3:03 PM | Report abuse

During Gibbs second tenure, all players were evaluated and given an overall "Redskins Grade". Coaches, scouts adn front office all had input. The players were than racked and stacked. During the draft, BPA were selected according to the Redskins grade generated draft board.

This process continued through the Zorn debacle.

The process is sound, but i think there has to be an overall philosophy that enables the team to decide which positions are "focus areas" going into the draft.

Blindly following he big board without an overall guiding strategy results in WR-TE-WR.

Posted by: SkinsfaninKaneohe | February 24, 2010 3:12 PM | Report abuse

In the meantime we would be stuck paying a massive amount of $$$ to a QB who will not play immediately and will probably suck when he does.

Posted by: Lisa_R | February 24, 2010 3:03 PM | Report abuse

Right cause Sanchez, Stafford, Ryan, Freeman, and Flacco over the last two years have all sat for their entire careers and all sucked.

But I know I know, JC has better stats then they do......

I'd take any of them right now over JC in a heartbeat and if you remove your burgundy and gold love of JC you would too.

Posted by: zjfr2 | February 24, 2010 3:14 PM | Report abuse

"Personally, I'd take a QB. He doesn't have to play right away."


To me, it depends.

A #4 pick starts on day one, I'm sorry.

A 4th rounder like LeFevour/Tebow should be allowed to sit and learn while Campbell gets a final day in the sun.

Posted by: MistaMoe | February 24, 2010 3:15 PM | Report abuse

Lisa, the 4th pick is going to want, and get, 4th pick money regardless if he is a QB, OT, RB, LB, or P. That's why K don't get drafted in the first round. Except in Oakland.

Posted by: SkinsfaninKaneohe | February 24, 2010 3:15 PM | Report abuse

LeFevour v Skelton. Anybody got anything?

Will Skelton fall to the 5th?

Posted by: SkinsfaninKaneohe | February 24, 2010 3:17 PM | Report abuse

Whoever we take at #4 is going to get a lot of money. It will be slotted like every other year. If we take a QB there will probably be incentives based on playing time, other measurable stats, etc. They will probably use Mark Sanchez contract as a starting point and add to it based on being 1 pick higher and 1 year later.

Posted by: ToddStinkston | February 24, 2010 3:18 PM | Report abuse

My draft priority, by position, obviously free agency can change this. I'm assuming a 4-3. My draft approach revolves mostly around 1 question -- what positions will have holes in 2 years? My top 4 slots are OL.

OT1
OT2
OG
C
LB1
CB
RB
FS
LB2
QB
RB2
WR
KR
DE

Let me explain:

On the OL, we'll need 2 new OTs, asap. RG might work out with Williams, but he's no better than 50/50. Rabach is also getting up there and hasn't been that good overall.

LB1 is a replacement for Fletcher.

CB is is dependent on what happens with Rogers, I'm not counting on Barnes or Tryon to pan out. Smoot will be gone in 2 years.

We need OL for the RB to succeed, which is why the RB is down the list. Its likely Betts, Portis and Rock will all be gone in 2 years (unless one turns into a Kevin Faulk type). On the plus side, RBs become contributors faster than most other positions, so we can wait a year.


*** Up to this point, I've mostly been replacing guys who I'm pretty sure are gone within 2 years. Beyond this, I'm replacing guys who could be here beyond 2 years, but where there are reasons to make a change.


FS is Landry's job, but he's been an underachiever. Time to have a plan B.

LB2, depth. Fletcher will be done in 2 years, Rocky has some injury risk and Orakpo is probably going to be a DE. We get thin pretty quickly.

QB, Campbell can do a good job and it will be a while before he is the low hanging fruit on this team. Still, we all know what a great QB can do to change everything.

RB2 see RB above. Second RBs are often available cheap, Ganther is a good example.

WR Its unlikely both Moss and ARE will be here in 2 years -- and maybe neither will be here. Still, there is room for optimism. Kelly, Thomas and Marko have a good chance of being a solid 1, 2, 3 combo. So we're really looking at the 4 and 5 guys.

KR Rock will go and I hate using an every down guy as a returner. I'd bump this up if a unique talent like Cribbs or Sproles are available at a reasonable price.

DE We'll need another rotation guy, especially if Carter moves on.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | February 24, 2010 3:21 PM | Report abuse

Right cause Sanchez, Stafford, Ryan, Freeman, and Flacco over the last two years have all sat for their entire careers and all sucked.

But I know I know, JC has better stats then they do......

I'd take any of them right now over JC in a heartbeat and if you remove your burgundy and gold love of JC you would too.

Posted by: zjfr2 |

You are so wrong about that...I absolutely would not take any of them.

Posted by: Lisa_R | February 24, 2010 3:23 PM | Report abuse

But OMG if they take a QB at #4 then they are doomed to have a terrible offensive line again, cause the only way to fix 3 spots on the line is to draft a lineman at #4.......

Posted by: zjfr2 | February 24, 2010 11:37 AM |

You don't think they can get some help on the line in free agency?

Posted by: League-Source


If I'm not mistaken, League, it's a weak year for FA Olinemen. And because of that people will overpay for mediocre players.

I just hope Not Macaca and Shanahanagain can make a first rate trade down with the #4 pick and grab not one but two-three top notch OL.

With an improved line, and and improved running game, Campbell can hold for the fort for another year, while they see if he's got it, or they need new blood.

Posted by: TheCork | February 24, 2010 3:23 PM | Report abuse

"In the meantime we would be stuck paying a massive amount of $$$ to a QB who will not play immediately and will probably suck when he does."


Dan Snyder says, "What's with this royal 'we get stuck paying' stuff?"

"I pay the guy, you whine about him."

"And since it's my money, I want a new handsome media face to sell seats and jerseys, and get buzz going like what that Sanchez kid did for the jets."

"Let tackles don't get the chicks to squeal like coverboy quarterbacks do."

"Sexy left tackles don't get the ESPN reporters to crowd around, my god, that Oher kid got a movie only because Sandy Bullock agreed to be in it."

"Listen: Imma bidness man who wants to sell tickets and swagga."

"I'll overpay for a rookie quarterback before extending Campbell. In fact, given how he plays, won't that be the same thing?"

Posted by: MistaMoe | February 24, 2010 3:24 PM | Report abuse

"If I'm not mistaken a QB drafted at #4 will want a whole lot more $$$$ than an O lineman drafted at that spot. And the O lineman can start immediately - after all, a rookie O lineman could not play any worse than some of the guys we had last season.In the meantime we would be stuck paying a massive amount of $$$ to a QB who will not play immediately and will probably suck when he does.Posted by: Lisa_R"

Looking at o-line taken in the top four picks in the last ten drafts, we have three certifiable successes (Joe Thomas, D'Brick Ferguson, and Chris Samuels), one who came on later in his career (Leonard Davis), two alleged 'busts' (Mike Williams, Robert Gallery), and two who it's probably too early to tell (Jake Long and Jason Smith). I'm sure that's a higher success rate than QBs taken in that spot, but the relative impact of a QB versus a left tackle is significant. LTs you can replace in FA; good QBs you often can't.

Posted by: Samson151 | February 24, 2010 3:27 PM | Report abuse

That's "and an" and "hold the fort" not "hold for the fort."

I'm not convinced anyone available the 'skins truly need is available at #4, unless Berry slips. I don't see the second coming of Elway on the board, and I doubt Shanahan does either.

Still and all, he'll be tempted to go QB. I hope common sense prevails and--even if it happens on draft day with the skins on the clock--they can extract some good picks and/or players for that #4 pick.

Posted by: TheCork | February 24, 2010 3:28 PM | Report abuse

It seems as though many people have already written off any chance of the Redskins actually competing for the division in 2010 -- that is, until JC17 and CP26 (among others) are gone and the Redskins have an opportunity to restock their skilled positions from the supposedly "deeper" draft classes coming in the years ahead.

(Sounds like a recipe for continuing long term frustration and failure.)

Regardless of what you think (or not) of JC17, it's readily apparent that the team will need at least two QBs to get through next season and beyond. And for too long, JC17 has had this team over a barrel because they had few viable alternatives -- while some regarded JC17 as the "least bad" of several other nasty alternatives.

Personally, I would like to see the Redskins draft a QB AND take one from free agency, and then if we must, offer a minimum tender to JC17 too.

I also find it hard to understand why Redskins can't fix the QB position and the O Line at the same time.

Posted by: Vic1 | February 24, 2010 3:28 PM | Report abuse

Right cause Sanchez, Stafford, Ryan, Freeman, and Flacco over the last two years have all sat for their entire careers and all sucked.

But I know I know, JC has better stats then they do......

I'd take any of them right now over JC in a heartbeat and if you remove your burgundy and gold love of JC you would too.

Posted by: zjfr2 |

You are so wrong about that...I absolutely would not take any of them.

Posted by: Lisa_R | February 24, 2010 3:23 PM | Report abuse

Lol, the kool-aid drinkers never cease to amaze.

Posted by: zjfr2 | February 24, 2010 3:29 PM | Report abuse

At the very least you wouldn't find anybody that wouldn't rather have Flacco or Ryan over JC..... but personally I would take Sanchez, Stafford, Ryan, and Flacco immediately over JC....Freeman mmmm that be tough, he didn't play a ton but he flashed some with mobility and accurate arm on a team that had an even worst offense then we did, I might be on the fence with him, the others no question.

Posted by: zjfr2 | February 24, 2010 3:35 PM | Report abuse

1st pick Okung
2nd Mays
3rd Trade into the 3rd round for.. wait for it..


Teeeeeeebow!

Posted by: skinsfanintampa | February 24, 2010 3:36 PM | Report abuse

I don't care what they do I'll roll with Shanny's opinion of JC and take his word for it. But we have a young group of receivers, young tight ends, old backs, a crap line, and a mediocre QB. If I were in charge and I'm not, but if I were, I'd get my young QB this year when I have my pick of the liter and let him grow with his young targets.

Trade JC for St. Louis' 3rd
Trade Carlos for a 3rd
They both have underachieved and their attitudes/baggage would be better on another team as we revamp this roster

I would draft:
1 - Clausen/Bradford
2 - Tackle
3 - RB
3 - Tackle
4 - Guard
5 - ILB
7 - WR

I would cut ARE, Smoot, Randy Thomas, and Betts.

I would sign Antrelle Rolle or another player to play FS and move LL back to SS, Larry Foote, Dunta Robinson, Gandy, Kareem McKenzie (who is likely to be cut http://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/features/rumors), and a guard preferably Chester Pitts.

I know it isn't drafting a tackle in round 1 so everyone will hate it but that's how I'd roll......but honestly, I don't care if this happens or not, in Shanny I trust.

Hail!

Posted by: zjfr2 | February 24, 2010 2:46 PM | Report abuse
I'd be ok with this scenerio, but think the 7th rounder should be a space-eater to back up the NT position in the eventual 3-4 system we're going with. And we'll need a ton of LB's if that's going to happen as well.

Posted by: DCinSD | February 24, 2010 3:37 PM | Report abuse

"I'd take any of them (Flacco, Ryan, Sanchez, Freeman) right now over JC in a heartbeat and if you remove your burgundy and gold love of JC you would too.

Posted by: zjfr2 |

Agreed.

And your point also illustrates why this, "Don't take a quarterback at 4 whining is just that."

If Campbell was the real deal, we wouldn't be questioning his being the starter.

But he's not, and so we do.

Bradford or Clausen?: who knows.

I have a sense a tall redskin is about to become a favored son in this town.

And if not him, well, we'll have to accept being stuck with a pickle.

Posted by: MistaMoe | February 24, 2010 3:41 PM | Report abuse

The CORK:

".........NOT Macaca........."

BRUCE doesn't roll that way does he?

Posted by: glawrence007 | February 24, 2010 3:44 PM | Report abuse

but personally I would take Sanchez, Stafford, Ryan, and Flacco immediately over JC....Freeman mmmm that be tough, he didn't play a ton but he flashed some with mobility and accurate arm on a team that had an even worst offense then we did, I might be on the fence with him, the others no question.

Posted by: zjfr2 | February 24, 2010 3:35 PM | Report abuse


I'd rather have the o-line and run game that teams like the Falcons, Jets, and Ravens have.

Posted by: PortisPocketsStr8 | February 24, 2010 3:50 PM | Report abuse

Apparently Vinny Cerrato has a new job. he does Olympic programming for NBC.

That's why they decided to show the US-Swiss hockey game on tape delay out here -- so they don't interrupt Bonnie Hunt.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | February 24, 2010 4:02 PM | Report abuse

I'd rather have the o-line and run game that teams like the Falcons, Jets, and Ravens have.

Posted by: PortisPocketsStr8 | February 24, 2010 3:50 PM | Report abuse

And again, its not an either/or question. I'm getting carpal tunnel typing this but drafting a QB at 4 doesn't mean we're doomed to have the same offensive line and running backs next season. We have 3 possibly 4 (center) spots on the line that need to be addressed and at the very least there probably be at least one new back. Darren Sproles, Reggie Bush, and Chester Taylor all will most likely hit the market. This is a deep draft for backs.

There will be some quality lineman available in FA. Will they be 21 years old and a start for a decade? Of course not, but there's no way we'd get 3 or 4 starters on the line from this draft anyway. Fixing the oline this season no matter what we do will be a combo of the draft and FA.

Posted by: zjfr2 | February 24, 2010 4:05 PM | Report abuse

Good and Bad from a skins fan who saw Duntae R. play 6 games up close and personal last year:

Good- dude can hit, esp. for such a bad injury he had in 2008. He will come up and wallop you. Only thing is usually the RB is 5 yards downfield by the time CB Duntae gets there.

Bad- dude was waaaay overpaid for the type of coverage he gave -- not shutdown by any means. One pick I think. He's only medium fast. He put "pay me Rick" on his game shoes for which he fined and reviled by H-Town fans.

PS they are saying on H-town sports radio that Titans are going to look hard at him. He wants a lot of $ - turned down 23 mil. guaranteed by the Texans last year before they franchised him.

Posted by: ElYeah | February 24, 2010 4:07 PM | Report abuse

OK who ordered the snow would you please call it off and hail skins

Posted by: joevick2 | February 24, 2010 4:10 PM | Report abuse

ElYeah -- Thanks for the reality check on Dunta. Anyone who turns down $23 mill guaranteed probably didn't score very high on his Wonderlic.

Posted by: League-Source | February 24, 2010 4:12 PM | Report abuse

1st pick Okung
2nd pick Colt 2.0

Pray to Tebow it goes down like this.

Posted by: ElYeah | February 24, 2010 4:12 PM | Report abuse

I'd rather have a passing game like the Saints, or Colts, or Chargers...

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | February 24, 2010 4:12 PM | Report abuse

OK who ordered the snow would you please call it off and hail skins

Posted by: joevick2 | February 24, 2010 4:10 PM

Probably Cerrato, maybe Snyder. They're responsible for everything else that's bad in the world. Oh, wait -- could have been George Bush or Dick Cheney.

Posted by: League-Source | February 24, 2010 4:16 PM | Report abuse

1) You can not do anything without an offensive line.
2) Clausen/Bradford have too many questions for the pick and the money they would get.
3) Would any mid-round team, picking from 15-25, trade a first and second for the number 4? I doubt it.
4) Okung or any high o-line pick is a greater need.

The o-line has been ignored too long. Until the offense has time to operate and keep the defense fresh, it is difficult to evaluate any of the talent on the team.

I hope Allenahan mantain straight pockets.

Posted by: chalkjock | February 24, 2010 4:16 PM | Report abuse

I'd rather have a passing game like the Saints, or Colts, or Chargers...

Posted by: BeantownGreg1

And yet, you wouldn't trade for Boldin

Posted by: zcezcest1 | February 24, 2010 4:16 PM | Report abuse

Re:DUNTA ROBINSON.

Like I said lot of folks have dissed him here, and LOS is signed so unless he trade bait for a pick, I gotta' believe the evil [strictly in a figurative sense]you know is better than the one you don't.

Posted by: glawrence007 | February 24, 2010 4:17 PM | Report abuse

OK who ordered the snow would you please call it off and hail skins

Posted by: joevick2

My plum trees are blooming

Posted by: zcezcest1 | February 24, 2010 4:19 PM | Report abuse

wow...thats just amazing z...do you write this stuff down in your diary or something....

"Dear Diary,

Today that meanie btg said trading for Boldin wasn't a good idea, he's no longer my bff"

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | February 24, 2010 4:19 PM | Report abuse

Funk, Vinny wasn't in charge of the draft then. Joe Gibbs was. Do you think Joe's going to listen to Vinny over Gregg? Remember Gibbs picked Gregg. Gibbs didn't pick Vinny.

Posted by: League-Source | February 24, 2010 3:02 PM | Report abuse


Vinny was VP for Football Ops and making alot of personnel decisions.

Why does everyone think Gibbs was some defacto GM calling all the shots?

He was the public face of the operation, but Snyder and Cerratto were as deeply involved in things as they'd always been.

There was alot of talk at the time of the draft that Vinny was the man in charge:

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1064-redskins-draft-part-1-skins-nab-laron-landry

Posted by: p1funk | February 24, 2010 4:19 PM | Report abuse

Re:DUNTA ROBINSON.

Like I said lot of folks have dissed him here, and LOS is signed so unless he trade bait for a pick, I gotta' believe the evil [strictly in a figurative sense]you know is better than the one you don't.

Posted by: glawrence007 | February 24, 2010 4:17 PM | Report abuse


Yes, g.

I've been dissing Robinson.

He's gonna demand #1 CB money, and he's not a #1 CB. Even with LOS on the roster, I don't see the need to go out and get a CB.

We've spent picks on Tryon and Barnes. We've still got Smoot on the roster. We don't need to invest in our secondary.

This offseason needs to be about Oline and (possibly) QB.

Posted by: p1funk | February 24, 2010 4:25 PM | Report abuse

You are so wrong about that...I absolutely would not take any of them.

Posted by: Lisa_R | February 24, 2010 3:23 PM | Report abuse

_____________________________________

Obviously, you have never seen Matt Ryan play. I would cut JC tomorrow if he were available.

Posted by: tony325 | February 24, 2010 4:27 PM | Report abuse

Vinny was VP for Football Ops and making alot of personnel decisions.

Why does everyone think Gibbs was some defacto GM calling all the shots?

Posted by: p1funk | February 24, 2010 4:19 PM

Maybe because the VP works for the President and not the other way around? Maybe because Gibbs negotiated for total control before he took the job? Do you really believe Gibbs said "Vinny just pick whoever you like. The coaches and I are gonna take draft day off."

Posted by: League-Source | February 24, 2010 4:27 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: League-Source | February 24, 2010 4:27 PM | Report abuse


And the President works for the Owner who gave the Football Ops over to Vinny C.

Did you read the article? Do I need to dig up more?

Posted by: p1funk | February 24, 2010 4:32 PM | Report abuse

wow...thats just amazing z...do you write this stuff down in your diary or something....

"Dear Diary,

Today that meanie btg said trading for Boldin wasn't a good idea, he's no longer my bff"

Posted by: BeantownGreg1

No, silly Greg.

While I appreciate your obsession with how I do stuff, you really don't need to have so many thoughts of me running around inside your head. After all, I'm not paying rent for the space.

Best wishes

Zeke

Posted by: zcezcest1 | February 24, 2010 4:33 PM | Report abuse

3) Would any mid-round team, picking from 15-25, trade a first and second for the number 4? I doubt it.


They just might to get Berry. And I think they would have to throw in another pick to come from that far back to number 4.

Posted by: SkinsfaninKaneohe | February 24, 2010 4:35 PM | Report abuse

They just might to get Berry. And I think they would have to throw in another pick to come from that far back to number 4.

Posted by: SkinsfaninKaneohe | February 24, 2010 4:35 PM

Or if Suh slips. Stranger things have happened. Remember when Ricky Williams slipped to the 'Skins and Ditka traded the Saints entire draft plus picks from the next year's draft to get him?

Posted by: League-Source | February 24, 2010 4:38 PM | Report abuse

USA Switzerland, 0-0 after 2 periods. I mentioned yesterday how Hiller could get hot. 32 saves in 2 periods, the Swiss have just 8 shots on goal.

But of course, I can't watch it on my nice TV because the NBC execs think I would rather watch Bonnie Hunt.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | February 24, 2010 4:39 PM | Report abuse

OKUNG OKUNG OKUNG OKUNG OKUNG OKUNG OKUNG!!
or draft down.

Posted by: dovelevine | February 24, 2010 4:47 PM | Report abuse

OKUNG OKUNG OKUNG OKUNG OKUNG OKUNG OKUNG!!
or draft down.

Posted by: dovelevine | February 24, 2010 4:47 PM | Report abuse

Repetitive Repetitive Repetitive Repetitive Repetitive Repetitive

and how do you draft down?

Posted by: zjfr2 | February 24, 2010 4:52 PM | Report abuse

US1SWI0

Posted by: SkinsfaninKaneohe | February 24, 2010 4:55 PM | Report abuse

QB is key in today's game. Your team doesn't have a chance without a legit QB. If Shanny's QB is on the board at #4 he'll have to take him. The Skins will address the o-liine no matter who QB's the team next year.

Posted by: coparker5 | February 24, 2010 4:55 PM | Report abuse

QB is key in today's game. Your team doesn't have a chance without a legit QB. If Shanny's QB is on the board at #4 he'll have to take him. The Skins will address the o-liine no matter who QB's the team next year.

Posted by: coparker5 | February 24, 2010 4:55 PM | Report abuse

Thank you, at least I got through to someone.

Posted by: zjfr2 | February 24, 2010 4:57 PM | Report abuse

And I'm not saying we have to draft a QB (not that there's anything wrong with that). I'm just saying whether we do or we don't the oline will get fixed.

Posted by: zjfr2 | February 24, 2010 4:59 PM | Report abuse

Darn it! Heath Shuler, Patrick Ramsey, we were that close to haveing Aaron Rogers drop to us instead we take Jason Campbell. This year @ #4 why can't we have a no brainer, slam dunk pick at QB! Are we cursed! I really have no clue what Shanny will do. Will he go the Ryan Clady route or Does he see a franchise QB at #4.

Posted by: sthai75 | February 24, 2010 5:01 PM | Report abuse

Okay, trade wizards. Set up a scenario to trade the number 4 and end up with 2 first round picks. It looks like a lot of the o-line talent will be gone before the second round. I would love to get Iupati and (choose 1) Bulaga, Williams, Davis, Campbell, or Brown. Maybe trade the first and second round for 15 and 25 or better?

Posted by: chalkjock | February 24, 2010 5:03 PM | Report abuse

So is Snyder going to the combine again as well or is he letting Allen/MS handle all that stuff? That could be telling on how much things have actually changed.

Posted by: skinswest | February 24, 2010 5:04 PM | Report abuse

He is having dinner with D Thomas' agent tonight.

Posted by: SkinsfaninKaneohe | February 24, 2010 5:11 PM | Report abuse

And I'm not saying we have to draft a QB (not that there's anything wrong with that). I'm just saying whether we do or we don't the oline will get fixed.

Posted by: zjfr2 | February 24, 2010 4:59 PM


If they dont build the line through the draft and there arent any quality unrestricted free agents how exactly are they going to fix the line?

Posted by: KingJoffeJoffer | February 24, 2010 5:11 PM | Report abuse

Did you read the article? Do I need to dig up more?

Posted by: p1funk | February 24, 2010 4:32 PM


funk,

What I read was one reference to Vinny Cerrato: "In the Redskins' predraft meeting, VP of Football Operations Vinny Cerrato made it explicitly clear that the team wouldn't reach for need positions, and would stick instead to a best-player-available strategy."

I'm not sure how you get from that sentence to infer that Vinny was running the draft or that he made the decision to pick Landry over the objections of Gibbs and Williams. And I'm not sure who the source of the sentence was or whether it was ever even spoken. Does anyone have it on tape?

I'd also be interested in your version of the organization chart where "Team President" reports to "VP of Football Operations" on personnel matters. Do you really believe Gibbs came out of retirement, negotiated control, and then sat by while Cerrato made all the personnel decisions on draft day?

Posted by: League-Source | February 24, 2010 5:16 PM | Report abuse

Hiller saves 43 shots, lets 1 in on a power play and the USA moves on, 2-0, with an empty net goal at the end.

Now, it'll be on TV in an hour out here in California, is it worth watching?

Posted by: zcezcest1 | February 24, 2010 5:17 PM | Report abuse

Darn it! Heath Shuler, Patrick Ramsey, we were that close to haveing Aaron Rogers drop to us instead we take Jason Campbell. This year @ #4 why can't we have a no brainer, slam dunk pick at QB! Are we cursed! I really have no clue what Shanny will do. Will he go the Ryan Clady route or Does he see a franchise QB at #4.

Posted by: sthai75 | February 24, 2010 5:01 PM | Report abuse
__________________________________________

Like all the mock draft guys have said... If Shanny thinks that Bradford is his guy, then draft him at #4. This guy would be QB of Lions right now if he didn't get hurt. I don't buy the fact that he won't hold up... So he got hurt, it happens.

I trust Shanny will make the right move... Shanny knows QB's & takes their game to another level... Cutler prime example.

Posted by: tony325 | February 24, 2010 5:17 PM | Report abuse


If they dont build the line through the draft and there arent any quality unrestricted free agents how exactly are they going to fix the line?

Posted by: KingJoffeJoffer | February 24, 2010 5:11 PM | Report abuse

It will be a combo of both, just because they may pick a QB at 4 doesn't mean they'll ignore the line the rest of the draft. And you really think there won't be a single quality FA that could provide 3 solid starting seasons while over the next 2 or 3 years we rebuild the trenches with multiple picks? Come on man.....

Why do people on here say we're in a 2 or 3 year rebuilding project but think the only option is to draft 5 lineman and expect to find three rookie starters.....

If you sign guys like Chester Pitts and Wayne Gandy, draft a starter at RT in the 2nd round, next year you can get the LT to groom behind Gandy for a season. Maybe you even sign a Tony Pashos or Kareem McKenzie if cut for depth. The day one top end quality starters at LT are rare, Jason Smith and Eugene Monroe, both top 10 picks last year and both rated at least as highly as Davis and Okung had rocky injury filled seasons. No matter what this year will be a combo of FA and the draft and the philosophy will have to shift over the next several years to investing in lineman in the draft not ignoring them for a decade. We didn't get to last year's line personnel by ignoring the line in one draft and no matter what, one draft isn't going to fix the problem either.

Posted by: zjfr2 | February 24, 2010 5:22 PM | Report abuse

Let's say we take Okung or Cambell or another OT at #4. Then, when pick #37 rolls around, Clausen is still on the board.

Do you take him then or is it still a bad pick?

Posted by: Original_etrod | February 24, 2010 11:43 AM

Sure, but he won't be available in then. I don't have a problem with Clausen (assuming the new guys like him). Seems like he's pretty accurate, doesn't throw picks (as in, he's the best junior QB at not throwing picks in the past decade ... including Peyton, Big Ben, Rivers, Elisha, Stafford, and Ryan), and has enough poise to come back from a 14 point deficit (which he did a few times). I don't care whether he's arrogant or whether the ladies under his arms are ugly. I'd root for the jersey, not the guy wearing it (not that I would ever pay NFL prices for an authentic replica jersey).

My concern is that there would be very high (and unrealistic) expectations about starting him as soon as he walked in the door ... that "grooming" a young QB has to be more than one preseason, esp. b/c it will take a while before he signs ... and that the Skins have a perfectly serviceable, if not good, QB corps who can move the chains while the TEAM re-builds for a year. Skins have lots of legitimate "holes" in the roster and it just doesn't seem like QB is as gaping as others if it gapes at all.

Posted by: dcsween | February 24, 2010 5:23 PM | Report abuse

Of the stuff I've read out there in the interwebnetubes, this one makes the most persuasive case for Clausen ... and this guy is not even his agent:

http://www.walterfootball.com/mattblog091229.php

My prediction is that one point will stick with peeps up here, specifically Clausen's low pick rate, which will become gospel up here within a week when people discuss the Clausen meme. [I said it ... the guy will become a meme before all is said and done ... a meme.]

Posted by: dcsween | February 24, 2010 5:28 PM | Report abuse

My take is now, may change later, take QB @ #4. Start Developing, groom your future QB NOW. Not a year from now, NOW. I know Bean will call me names, But history shows Shanny's Philosophy. Check out his past draft starting with 2006. He gets O-line in the later rounds and they become starters. It's all there. We've got our sheffler, we have hopefully our WR's.


Rnd Name College Note
1 Ryan Clady Boise State
2 Eddie Royal Virginia Tech
4 Kory Lichtensteiger Bowling Green
4 Jack Williams Kent State
5 Ryan Torain Arizona State
5 Carlton Powell Virginia Tech
6 Spencer Larsen Arizona
7 Josh Barrett Arizona State
7 Peyton Hillis Arkansas

2007
Rnd Name College Note
1 Jarvis Moss Florida
2 Tim Crowder Texas
3 Ryan Harris Notre Dame
4 Marcus Thomas Florida

2006
Rnd Name College Note
1 Jay Cutler Vanderbilt
2 Tony Scheffler Western Michigan
4 Brandon Marshall Central Florida
4 Elvis Dumervil Louisville
4 Domenik Hixon Akron
5 Chris Kuper North Dakota
6 Greg Eslinger Minnesota

Posted by: sthai75 | February 24, 2010 5:31 PM | Report abuse

So is Snyder going to the combine again as well or is he letting Allen/MS handle all that stuff? That could be telling on how much things have actually changed.

Posted by: skinswest | February 24, 2010 5:04 PM |

Your right because no owners go to the combine.

Posted by: Flounder21 | February 24, 2010 5:31 PM | Report abuse

sthai -- best as I can tell, Cutler is the only QB Shanny has ever picked in an early round. Both Allen and Shanahan have histories of drafting OL, early (Clady), middle and late.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | February 24, 2010 5:35 PM | Report abuse

Like all the mock draft guys have said... If Shanny thinks that Bradford is his guy, then draft him at #4. This guy would be QB of Lions right now if he didn't get hurt. I don't buy the fact that he won't hold up... So he got hurt, it happens.

I trust Shanny will make the right move... Shanny knows QB's & takes their game to another level... Cutler prime example.


Leinart would have been the qb for the 49ers if he came out in 05 and when he went back USC he dropped to number 10. Just because someone was projected to go number 1 doesnt mean they should have. Leinart like Bradford played with a stacked team at USC and its hard to gauge how much of his teams success was attributed to his play. Leinart hasnt turned out to be good so far. Why should we think Bradford is any different.

Follow the Parcells model, address your lines and build from there.

Posted by: KingJoffeJoffer | February 24, 2010 5:35 PM | Report abuse

NOW I TELL YOU, FUTURE IS NOW! aside from Clady the rest of the broncos starting o-line is made up of 3rd and later round pics.

Posted by: sthai75 | February 24, 2010 5:36 PM | Report abuse

NOW I TELL YOU, FUTURE IS NOW!

Posted by: sthai75 | February 24, 2010 5:36 PM

I heard that a few days ago ... makes me wonder whether the future was yesterday.

Posted by: dcsween | February 24, 2010 5:38 PM | Report abuse

Okay, trade wizards. Set up a scenario to trade the number 4 and end up with 2 first round picks. It looks like a lot of the o-line talent will be gone before the second round. I would love to get Iupati and (choose 1) Bulaga, Williams, Davis, Campbell, or Brown. Maybe trade the first and second round for 15 and 25 or better?

Posted by: chalkjock | February 24, 2010 5:03 PM | Report abuse
________________

The only way I see it is on draft day. St. Louis passes on Suh and takes a QB, which causes the domino effect of having the safety Berry to drop to #4. It seems to me (prior to the combine) that Suh and Berry are the only two players that would cause anyone to want to move up into the top 5. If a team starts to drool at that scenario, then perhaps the Skins could trade down and set up some sort of package where we get the other team's first rounder this year, a second 1st rounder in the 2011 draft, plus a lower pick this year like a 3rd rounder. I have no idea off the top of my head what team, if any, would be interested in something like that.

That's about the only realistic scenario I can see. I don't see any of our current players either worth a 1st round pick (Cooley or Davis are the most tradable, I think), or if they are worth a 1st rounder, having a tradable contract (hello, Albert H.). Plus, I wouldn't really want to trade Albert, anyway.

Posted by: skinsfan713 | February 24, 2010 5:41 PM | Report abuse

Well, remember, if the future is now, 40 men together can't lose!

Posted by: SkinsfaninKaneohe | February 24, 2010 5:42 PM | Report abuse

"Character" and "da U" are INCOMPATIBLE!!!!!!! Get ready for an exodus of homies.

Posted by: bundy44 | February 24, 2010 5:46 PM | Report abuse

"Okay, trade wizards."

For a moment I thought you were referencing the basketball team? Ten NBA players and a d-leaguer.

Posted by: glawrence007 | February 24, 2010 5:49 PM | Report abuse

Albert H.). Plus, I wouldn't really want to trade Albert, anyway.

Me either, but for a first and sixth in this draft, I would be mightily tempted.

Posted by: glawrence007 | February 24, 2010 5:52 PM | Report abuse

Maybe trade the first and second round for 15 and 25 or better?

Posted by: chalkjock | February 24, 2010 5:03 PM | Report abuse

I'd rather have #4 and #36 than to drop to #15 from #4.

Posted by: zjfr2 | February 24, 2010 5:53 PM | Report abuse

Follow the Parcells model, address your lines and build from there.

Posted by: KingJoffeJoffer | February 24, 2010 5:35 PM | Report abuse

Check and check.

Posted by: glawrence007 | February 24, 2010 5:55 PM | Report abuse

I guess the management has made me nervous. There is a big dropoff in o-line talent after the first round, and little reason for teams to let good linemen go unless they are overpaid.

Posted by: chalkjock | February 24, 2010 5:59 PM | Report abuse

I guess the management has made me nervous. There is a big dropoff in o-line talent after the first round, and little reason for teams to let good linemen go unless they are overpaid.


Agreed. I hope the FO is being shrewd by acting as if they want a qb to try and trigger another team to trade up. The thought of Bradford/Clausen at # 4 is triggering memories of Patrick Ramsey and David Carr getting punished.

Posted by: KingJoffeJoffer | February 24, 2010 6:17 PM | Report abuse

Trade down (if possible) or take Okung.

QB trumps OL, but only if there is a QB worthy of a top 5 selection. You don't reach for a QB just because it's on the list of needs. I'd have no problem taking either QB in the 2nd but not #4 overall, just too many red flags.

Just take the Rams for instance. They have a bigger hole at QB than the skins and they are leaning towards a DT. If neither is good enough for #1 then they aren't good enough at #4.

Top 10 picks that where QB busts
Akili Smith
Joey Harrington
Jamarcus Russell
Tim Couch
David Carr
Alex Smith
Ryan Leaf
Heath Shuler
Rick Mirer
Andre Ware
Todd Blackledge
David Klinger
Rich Campbell
Kelly Stouffer
Art Schlichter.

Top 10 picks that were OL busts
Levi Jones
Mike Willams
Tony Mandarich
Robert Gallery- although a productive OG, not worthy of the 2nd overall

Posted by: Diesel44 | February 24, 2010 8:05 PM | Report abuse

One period down in Shark on Shark action and its the Canadian Sharks dominating the Russian Shark goalie.

Nabakov faced 21(!!) shots in the first period -- more than the US team faced in the entire game against Switzerland.

Boyle has a goal and 2 assists, Heatley and Marleau also have assists.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | February 24, 2010 8:17 PM | Report abuse

I was glad to see that 80% don't want a QB at #4. Good call readers

Okung at 4, lupati at 37

Posted by: pabrian2003 | February 24, 2010 8:28 PM | Report abuse

I was glad to see that 80% don't want a QB at #4. Good call readers

Okung at 4, lupati at 37

Posted by: pabrian2003 | February 24, 2010 8:28 PM |

Good call by a bunch of people who know knothing about football, but how to watch it.

If Shanny and Allen think they can get a franchise QB then I back them up.

Shanny's fingernail knows more about football then everyone on this blog combined, so we can come on here and give opions but don't ever act like anyone here knows what there talking about.

Posted by: Flounder21 | February 24, 2010 8:32 PM | Report abuse

"I'd have no problem taking either QB in the 2nd but not #4 overall, just too many red flags"

OK, neither one of those guys is going to be there in the second round, so that's not an option, is it?

Setting aside Drew Brees for a moment, what's the success rate of QBs taken in the second round? Didn't somebody just do a post on that?

Posted by: Samson151 | February 24, 2010 8:35 PM | Report abuse

"Top 10 picks that where QB busts
Top 10 picks that were OL busts"

Well, there's a flaw in this observation. It's that QBs are picked in the top five so often, versus o-linemen. Think of all the years when a QB went number one. There was one year when the top three spots all went to QBs, for pete's sake.


Posted by: Samson151 | February 24, 2010 8:50 PM | Report abuse

JIMMY CLAUSSEN PLEASE!!!!

i don't know why you "expert" fans don't like this move.

Posted by: dealer1 | February 24, 2010 8:58 PM | Report abuse

Shanny's fingernail knows more about football then everyone on this blog combined, so we can come on here and give opions but don't ever act like anyone here knows what there talking about.

Posted by: Flounder21 | February 24, 2010 8:32 PM | Report abuse

But everyone on here is going to think they have the knowledge of Bill Walsh, Don Shula and Joe Gibbs because they go on the internet and find last 6 minutes of the 4th quarter stats and selectively argue their points with 20 years of NFL draft history.

Spending way too much time on NFL.com or reading Phil Steele's magazine does not make you smart(you bloggers know who you are).

Posted by: iH8dallas | February 24, 2010 9:01 PM | Report abuse

Well, there's a flaw in this observation. It's that QBs are picked in the top five so often, versus o-linemen. Think of all the years when a QB went number one. There was one year when the top three spots all went to QBs, for pete's sake.

Posted by: Samson151 | February 24, 2010 8:50 PM

Interesting point, Samson, but I think it works the other way. I just looked at the last five drafts and there were two more OT's taken in the top ten than QB's.

Posted by: League-Source | February 24, 2010 9:01 PM | Report abuse

ohh not cuz i want a QB but because i think jimmy claussen is a real deal. and i f'ing HATE notre dame. i hope to god they dont pick bradford. or any other qb at 4. either claussen at 4 or an OL or trade down...

Posted by: dealer1 | February 24, 2010 9:01 PM | Report abuse

That is exactly what I was talking about.

Posted by: iH8dallas | February 24, 2010 9:05 PM | Report abuse

Shanny's fingernail knows more about football then everyone on this blog combined, so we can come on here and give opions but don't ever act like anyone here knows what there talking about.

Posted by: Flounder21 | February 24, 2010 8:32 PM |

Let's follow the logic thread of your thinking:

1. "we can come on here and give opions but don't ever act like anyone here knows what there talking about."
2. You posted 1.
3. Ergo you did not know what you were talking about.

Whew, that's a relief! I was beginning to think that it would be futile for me to post anything here. Ah, the joys of the self-referencing paradox.

Posted by: MrRed | February 24, 2010 9:06 PM | Report abuse

OK, neither one of those guys is going to be there in the second round, so that's not an option, is it?

Setting aside Drew Brees for a moment, what's the success rate of QBs taken in the second round? Didn't somebody just do a post on that?

Posted by: Samson151 | February 24, 2010 8:35 PM

That suggests to me that if there isn't a top 5 worthy QB, then perhaps the skins should look for a developmental player at QB and look to rounds 4 or 5 to draft one. Perhaps in 2-3 years, that 4th or 5th round player, who has the tools but also has some issues to work through, becomes your starter. Perhaps that player becomes your backup. Perhaps he flames out. Either way, the team wouldn't have invested a gazillion dollars on a player that will not produce at an elite level, and wouldn't have invested the resources to build the franchise around a player that is supposed to be the franchise QB. Mind you, I'm not saying Bradford or Clausen aren't talented; but are they elite? We shall see. Elite is what the #4 pick should be. If you miss on the QB position at #4, the franchise will be stunted for 5 years (or whatever is the length of the original contract).

Posted by: TWISI | February 24, 2010 9:12 PM | Report abuse

Setting aside Drew Brees for a moment, what's the success rate of QBs taken in the second round? Didn't somebody just do a post on that?

Posted by: Samson151 | February 24, 2010 8:35 PM

Success rates? We're talking about football not a trial drug for erectile dysfunction.

Posted by: iH8dallas | February 24, 2010 9:17 PM | Report abuse

Elite is what the #4 pick should be. If you miss on the QB position at #4, the franchise will be stunted for 5 years (or whatever is the length of the original contract).

Posted by: TWISI | February 24, 2010 9:12 PM |

The QB doesn't have to be "elite". In fact, what you call "elite" may not be the best choice. The best choice is the QB who will do the best job running Shan's O. That could easily not be what somebody is calling "elite". Shan did an interview with CBS Sports in which he said that the two most important attribs his QB should have are 1. accuracy and 2. passion for the job. Typically when there is talk about elite QBs you don't hear peeps saying this dude is elite because of the passion he brings to the job. They tend to babble about stats and such.

Posted by: MrRed | February 24, 2010 9:22 PM | Report abuse

"JIMMY CLAUSSEN PLEASE!!!! I don't know why you "expert" fans don't like this move."

They don't like the idea because they didn't think of it first.

Isn't that how it usually works?

Posted by: MistaMoe | February 24, 2010 9:25 PM | Report abuse

". I just looked at the last five drafts and there were two more OT's taken in the top ten than QB's.Posted by: League-Source"

I thought I said top five...

Don't forget that the list of QB busts went back all the way to 1980...

Posted by: Samson151 | February 24, 2010 9:26 PM | Report abuse

... a trial drug for erectile dysfunction.

Posted by: iH8dallas | February 24, 2010 9:17 PM

ED Wang from Va Tech would be interested in something like this.

Posted by: MrRed | February 24, 2010 9:26 PM | Report abuse

"Success rates? We're talking about football not a trial drug for erectile dysfunction.
Posted by: iH8dallas"

You have personal experience of this, I gather.

Posted by: Samson151 | February 24, 2010 9:31 PM | Report abuse

"Shan did an interview with CBS Sports in which he said that the two most important attribs his QB should have are 1. accuracy and 2. passion for the job."


So you're saying Sam Bradford is going to be the guy?

Say wharever you can for or against the kid, but he is a very accurate thrower.

Posted by: MistaMoe | February 24, 2010 9:33 PM | Report abuse

I thought I said top five...

Don't forget that the list of QB busts went back all the way to 1980...

Posted by: Samson151 | February 24, 2010 9:26 PM

Samson, he said top 10. What does top 5 have to do with his claim? If you want to go back to 1980, go ahead. Having gone back five years, I don't think you'll find anything to support you. But, give it a shot.

Posted by: League-Source | February 24, 2010 9:38 PM | Report abuse

You have personal experience of this, I gather.

Posted by: Samson151 | February 24, 2010 9:31 PM | Report abuse

Oh Snap!!!!! Got me on that one.

Posted by: iH8dallas | February 24, 2010 9:40 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: MrRed | February 24, 2010 9:22 PM

I'll run with what you're saying. Just for argument sake, say by Shanahan's definition, Tony Pike is the "elite" QB for his system (not saying he is), should they draft him at #4? My point is that a player drafted at #4, particularly a QB, should have elite tangible and intangible skills. If the player is going to need 2 or 3 years to develop, then draft that player out of the top 10. With the amount of money a top 10 player counts against the cap, that player needs to be starting pretty much from day one of the regular season.

Posted by: TWISI | February 24, 2010 9:41 PM | Report abuse

"Elite is what the #4 pick should be. If you miss on the QB position at #4, the franchise will be stunted for 5 years (or whatever is the length of the original contract)."


Isn't this really the case with any player or position selected at that spot?

So why pick on the quarterback position?

Too, has the team been stunted because of the failures of Jason Campbell or a mismatched roster and lackluster scheme?

I think Shanny wants his own guy like every other new regime wants when it takes over.

Ramsey came because Spurrier wanted him.

Campbell came because St Joe wanted him and will go because Shanny does not.

PLayer turnover the nature of the business when a guy is not a shining star.

Besides, we'll get a quarterback at 4 and linemen later on in the draft.

And no matter what happens, we have to remember the team can only go up from last place in the NFC East.

Folks are posting and whining like Shanny is about to come in a re-arrange the settled roster of the colts when we are the last place redskins and need the re-arranging.

And if a rookie grows and eventually leads us from that inglorious spot, then that's all the better.

And if he bombs, well, we're already in last place, so what's the big loss?

Do what you want, Mr Shanahan, and whatever it is, you got my support: at least unitl you f!ck up.

Posted by: MistaMoe | February 24, 2010 9:53 PM | Report abuse

Top 10 picks that were OL busts
Levi Jones
Mike Willams
Tony Mandarich
Robert Gallery- although a productive OG, not worthy of the 2nd overall


Posted by: Diesel44 | February 24, 2010 8:05 PM | Report abuse

Yeah buddy, that's a mighty short list compared to the q-back busts.

BTW, how come half of your list are REDSKINS?

Posted by: glawrence007 | February 24, 2010 9:54 PM | Report abuse

Say wharever you can for or against the kid, but he is a very accurate thrower.

Posted by: MistaMoe | February 24, 2010 9:33 PM


Who isnt accurate when they have three days to throw. Colt Brennan was super accurate in college as well. How accurate was he in the preseason when he was running for his life.

Posted by: KingJoffeJoffer | February 24, 2010 9:57 PM | Report abuse

Ramsey came because Spurrier wanted him.

Posted by: MistaMoe | February 24, 2010 9:53 PM |

Spurrier didn't want Ramsey -- the owner wanted him. Spurrier wanted his own guys, Shane Matthews and that other one, Danny Woeful.

Posted by: League-Source | February 24, 2010 9:59 PM | Report abuse

My point is that a player drafted at #4, particularly a QB, should have elite tangible and intangible skills.

Posted by: TWISI | February 24, 2010 9:41 PM |

That sounds sensible. But it is always a balance of some kind isn't it? Teams sometimes find themselves caught between a rock and a hard place - (a) they have a real need, (b) there is the lowest pick that has a reasonable chance of snagging what they need, (c) there is the pick they have and (d) there are whatever options are available for trading down if their pick is overkill relative to their need.

Posted by: MrRed | February 24, 2010 10:03 PM | Report abuse

Top 10 picks that were OL busts
Levi Jones
Mike Willams
Tony Mandarich
Robert Gallery- although a productive OG, not worthy of the 2nd overall


Posted by: Diesel44 | February 24, 2010 8:05 PM | Report abuse

Yeah buddy, that's a mighty short list compared to the q-back busts.

BTW, how come half of your list are REDSKINS?

Posted by: glawrence007 | February 24, 2010 9:54 PM | Report abuse


Dean Steinkuhler, #2 overall out of Nebraska in 1984, never quite reached his full fumblerooski potential in the NFL. Stats are atrocious. Zero intentional fumbles recovered for zero touchdowns.

The U never forgets.

Posted by: SMACK1 | February 24, 2010 10:14 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: MistaMoe | February 24, 2010 9:53 PM

isn't this really the case with any player or position selected at that spot?

_____________

I agree.
-------------

So why pick on the quarterback position?

______________

I think you've said it before..It's a passing league. If you invest in one that high, he has to perform or you better hope there is a Kurt Warner out there to save the day.

--------

Too, has the team been stunted because of the failures of Jason Campbell or a mismatched roster and lackluster scheme?
______________

A little of both. First as you know JC wasn't a top 5 pick so he's not really a good example. As I said, if the QB isn't elite, don't waste a top 10 pick on him. While JC may have had his share of handicaps, he wasn't/isn't a finished product. He had to learn to read coverage, improve his throwing motion, pocket awareness etc. He's also struggled while the game was on the line. So part of the team struggles falls on him.

_____________

I'm not too concerned about the Bradford/Okung/Clausen/Davis/Berry debate. I think the team is in good hands. I was on board for Shanny/Shanny early so I'm in it with them for the long haul.

Posted by: TWISI | February 24, 2010 10:20 PM | Report abuse

"I'd have no problem taking either QB in the 2nd but not #4 overall, just too many red flags"

OK, neither one of those guys is going to be there in the second round, so that's not an option, is it?

Setting aside Drew Brees for a moment, what's the success rate of QBs taken in the second round? Didn't somebody just do a post on that?

Posted by: Samson151 | February 24, 2010 8:35 PM

Yeah, I did that 3 weeks ago. I try to provide an educated opinion and then give evidence, examples, players, etc to back it up. Pretty unique for RI, although usually repeated by someone weeks later.

Clausen and Bradford will both be gone before the 2nd but with the red flags that both have, that is where the reward outweighs the risk, IMO.

Posted by: Diesel44 | February 24, 2010 10:23 PM | Report abuse

How the times are no different is summed up in the fact that LT gets cut, Westbrook gets cut and CP is still here. We are doomed.

Posted by: 3rings | February 24, 2010 10:25 PM | Report abuse

Stats are atrocious. Zero intentional fumbles recovered for zero touchdowns.

Posted by: SMACK1 | February 24, 2010 10:14 PM |

Not familiar with the dude. Could be a case of program success obfuscating an objective appraisal of the individual's chances of succeeding.

Posted by: MrRed | February 24, 2010 10:25 PM | Report abuse

I'm dating myself, but that comes as a surprise to nobody.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b25G-ZkSJJI

Posted by: SMACK1 | February 24, 2010 10:28 PM | Report abuse

Portis should be very worried about now.

Posted by: iH8dallas | February 24, 2010 10:47 PM | Report abuse

I suspect that, if given the choice between Bradford and Campbell, all the coaches who've worked closely with Campbell for the last 5 years would select Bradford to run their offense.

Posted by: coparker5 | February 24, 2010 10:55 PM | Report abuse

Stats are atrocious. Zero intentional fumbles recovered for zero touchdowns.

Posted by: SMACK1 | February 24, 2010 10:14 PM |
==================================
Conversely speaking, jc-mancrushers.. How many turnovers by JC (fumbles and INTs) were returned for scores?

I know, I know, it was everybody elses fault and as JC whined to the media.. "the situation I was put in was unfair"..

Baaawhaaa..What a loser...

Please "Career W-L @ 4-21 NFC East" dont Start for the Skins next year and waste my season tix AND an above average 250 million dollar Defense......

jus saying..

Posted by: cliftonbiz | February 24, 2010 11:02 PM | Report abuse

Portis should be very worried about now.

Posted by: iH8dallas | February 24, 2010 10:47 PM

Tick Tick Tick Tick...

Posted by: edvar | February 24, 2010 11:05 PM | Report abuse

Clausen and Bradford will both be gone before the 2nd but with the red flags that both have, that is where the reward outweighs the risk, IMO.

Posted by: Diesel44 | February 24, 2010 10:23 PM
========================================================================================
Hope we get another Rhino.. I feel like pizza.

Posted by: cliftonbiz | February 24, 2010 11:06 PM | Report abuse

I suspect that, if given the choice between Bradford and Campbell, all the coaches who've worked closely with Campbell for the last 5 years would select Bradford to run their offense.

Posted by: coparker5 | February 24, 2010 10:55 PM
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Yeah.. its more than interesting that all of Campbell's ex Head Coaches and ex-Offensive Coordinators (Gibbs, Saunders, Lewis, Zorn, etc.. have made a very pregnant "no comment" on Campbell after their departures (although Zorn took a veiled shot at him).
Yet, Gibbs, on the week of his retirement, spent an inordinate amount of time praising Collin's work habits and being a "student of the game".

Posted by: cliftonbiz | February 24, 2010 11:20 PM | Report abuse

When speaking about Campbell, Gibbs said "...at some point your QB is gonna have to drive your team to victory through a hail storm..." or something like that. I wonder what he meant?

Posted by: coparker5 | February 24, 2010 11:57 PM | Report abuse

When speaking about Campbell, Gibbs said "...at some point your QB is gonna have to drive your team to victory through a hail storm..." or something like that. I wonder what he meant?

Posted by: coparker5 | February 24, 2010 11:57 PM
=======================
Gibbs had Campbell for 3 years..and Campbell has never rallied the team from behind to win a game in the last half of the 4th Qtr (still hasnt).
I would guess that is what Gibbs is referring to.. And maybe why some have suggested, he retired so quickly after making the playoffs with Collins.... Campbell loses control of his passes towards the end of a game if its tight (overthrows/underthrows..rarely on target). The last game of 2009 is a good example but, you can pick about 20. In the last game (SD) his last passes were 4 incompletes when the skins only had to move 25 yards for a tying FG. His last pass (Hail Mary) was well out of bounds with no WRs near it.

He'd be a good game managing back-up QB.

Posted by: cliftonbiz | February 25, 2010 12:07 AM | Report abuse

From CecIVC
For all you stat-maniacs who love to tout JC's 'improvement' over the years, why not look at the major statistic: his ability to win.

Over the course of his career while behind by one TD or less, JC has racked up 14 TDs and 12 INTs. Last year, in the same situation, 7 TDs to 7 INTs.

Over the course of his career with the game difference being one TD or less (where he needs to lead a comeback or put the nail in the coffin), JC has racked up 30 TDs and 22 INTs. Last year, 12 TDs, 12 INTs.

Finally, and here's the kicker, when behind in the 4th quarter by less than 7 or tied in OT, career 10 TDs and 11 INTs. Last year, 0 TDs & 3 INTs.

These are not even including final 'drives' that end in 4 & outs (a la SD week 17) he's barely above .500 in his ability to not lose the game.

You can't blame JC for the losses? Oh really?

Now let's compare to his competition from the NFC East:

Tony Romo:
2009 Season
Behind by 1 TD: 7 TD-2 INT; Within 1 TD: 21 TD-7 INT; 4th Quarter Within 1TD: 4 TD-1 INT

Donovan McNabb
2009 Season
Behind by 1 TD: 4 TD-2 INT; Within 1 TD: 14 TD-6 INT; 4th Quarter Within 1TD: 0 TD-1 INT

Eli Manning
2009 Season
Behind by 1 TD: 7 TD-3 INT; Within 1 TD: 14 TD-7 INT; 4th Quarter Within 1TD: 3 TD-1 INT

As clearly shown here, JC is significantly behind the curve when it comes to NFC East QBs.

And just for kicks, here's the Superbowl QBs stats:

Drew Brees
2009 Season
Behind by 1 TD: 11 TD-2 INT; Within 1 TD: 25 TD-5 INT; 4th Quarter Within 1TD: 5 TD-0 INT

Peyton Manning
2009 Season
Behind by 1 TD: 9 TD-2 INT; Within 1 TD: 23 TD-9 INT; 4th Quarter Within 1TD: 6 TD-1 INT

Bottom line, when it matters, JC fails.

Posted by: CecIVC | February 22, 2010 9:34 AM | Report abuse

Posted by: cliftonbiz | February 25, 2010 12:21 AM | Report abuse

Posted by: cliftonbiz | February 25, 2010 12:21 AM

Give it a rest. There may be 3-5 people on here that truly believe that JC17 is the future at QB.

QB is on the list. However, what are you suggesting? Drafting and reaching for a QB @ #4 or getting the best possible player and value @ #4. If there were no red flags and Brad and Claus were worthy, I would be all for the selection. Problem is #4 may be way too high for either.

Posted by: Diesel44 | February 25, 2010 12:35 AM | Report abuse

QB is on the list. However, what are you suggesting? Drafting and reaching for a QB @ #4 or getting the best possible player and value @ #4. If there were no red flags and Brad and Claus were worthy, I would be all for the selection. Problem is #4 may be way too high for either.

Posted by: Diesel44 | February 25, 2010 12:35 AM

================================================================================
I would have to guess if Kyle and Mike are doing what they say they are doing.. And that is, intent on watching every play from last year before going into the Draft.. They will appraise Dan, before April ? Draft Day, and say either "No, JC is not an NFL starter.. We need a franchise QB from the Draft or by Trade"..

Or, "Dan, we may be able to fix JC..lets re-sign him for a year and bait some OLine rich teams with our #4 and see what we can get??"

Last time Shanahan had a 1st pick he got Cutler in 2006 who went to the 2008 ProBowl. Shanahan may think that qualifies him as a QB drafting genius and do it again??

jus guessing..

Posted by: cliftonbiz | February 25, 2010 12:50 AM | Report abuse

...powers out in all the dorms...the kids trying to save the bees are all in a logjam of sleeping bags on the library floor...Jimmy the Bear wanders through the storm and easily breaks into a science building...He seeks warmth and an indescribable what in the dark halls...He searches in hs winter army overcoat , finds a beer , a coupla penniies and a drywall screw...He wanders back out, tripping a door alarm, but no one seems to bother...The "Bee People" get special priviledges..

Posted by: frak | February 25, 2010 12:53 AM | Report abuse

Sherm Lewis was a Bee person.

B4, B10, B9

Posted by: cliftonbiz | February 25, 2010 12:57 AM | Report abuse

httr and out..

Posted by: cliftonbiz | February 25, 2010 12:58 AM | Report abuse

I would offer both Ladanian Tomlinson and Michael Westbrook contracts, and if they accepted I would cut betts and cartwright.

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | February 25, 2010 5:14 AM | Report abuse

Boy Clifton, just can't get off the JC topic, not even for a minute. Hate to be the bearer of bad news, but there ARE other topics...

I'm not a fan of spending big in FA, seems to me making a run at Dansby is a good move but Dunta Robinson has had mixed results in Houston and I think he may have had some injury questions.

Rome wasn't built overnight. BUILD thru the draft, SUPPLEMENT with free agency. We've been doing the opposite for far too long.

Posted by: brownwood26 | February 25, 2010 5:21 AM | Report abuse

I would offer both Ladanian Tomlinson and Michael Westbrook contracts, and if they accepted I would cut betts and cartwright.

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | February 25, 2010 5:14 AM

Larry, You need to talk to your scouting staff. They're not up to the job. Michael Westbrook has been out of pro football for eight years, and he wasn't very good when he was in pro football. Both Portis and Betts are better than he is. Also, neither WR or Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu is a position of need right now.

Posted by: League-Source | February 25, 2010 5:27 AM | Report abuse

I would offer both Ladanian Tomlinson and Michael Westbrook contracts, and if they accepted I would cut betts and cartwright.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | February 25, 2010 5:14 AM


Either you meant BRIAN Westbrook or you have a sick sense of humor...

Posted by: brownwood26 | February 25, 2010 5:33 AM | Report abuse

Hate to be the bearer of bad news, but there ARE other topics...

...Dunta Robinson has had mixed results in Houston...

Posted by: brownwood26 | February 25, 2010 5:21 AM

brownwood making a very subtle attempt to introduce Randle El into the discussion....

I would guess that with the Houston coaches on our staff, Dunta Robinson won't be "in the mix" in Ashburn. elYeah from Houston posted up here yesterday that Dunta's not particularly well liked.

Posted by: League-Source | February 25, 2010 5:35 AM | Report abuse

I've heard the same, LS...I just don't get why the Skins seem to be the only team that doesn't understand that a big name FA being allowed to hit the market is usually a red flag, not manna from heaven. With the questions and concerns surrounding guys like Robinson and Peppers, any team handing a mint to those players would be crazy.

The circumstances surrounding Dansby being allowed to hit the market seem innocent...a cheap team not wanting to pay big money to a key performer. And a lot of teams are taking that same approach with the possibility of a lockout looming. So I could see a guy like that being a good pickup, but this year the biggest names present the biggest risk.

Posted by: brownwood26 | February 25, 2010 5:43 AM | Report abuse

"Yet, Gibbs, on the week of his retirement, spent an inordinate amount of time praising Collin's work habits and being a "student of the game".

Collins is as close to technical perfection as you're going to find in a backup quarterback. Skill-wise, given the unique requirements of the position, he's a remarkable example of what can happen when you're smart and apply yourself over many years of practice. Problem is, he got his shot when he was too young and inexperienced, and never got another. Basically a wasted career, and coaches know it.

A couple seasons ago some nunks on this board were blaming Collins for the defeat in Seattle, which never made much sense, any more than it would to blame Peyton for what happened in New Orleans. Collins basically picked that team up and carried it. They lost in Seattle because they were playing a classic 'home' team on the road. The Seahawks went east the next week and got clobbered, but in their own stadium they lost exactly once that season.

Collins had a lot of trouble with Zorn's stupid QB drills, but as usual he kept his mouth shut and did his job. This is probably the end for him but hopefully he'll wind up coaching somewhere.

Posted by: Samson151 | February 25, 2010 6:02 AM | Report abuse

This is probably the end for him but hopefully he'll wind up coaching somewhere.

Posted by: Samson151 | February 25, 2010 6:02 AM

My guess is that he has a better chance of being on the Redskins roster next fall than Colt has. But if he ends up coaching, do you think he'll be using Zorn's QB drills?

Posted by: League-Source | February 25, 2010 6:16 AM | Report abuse

twisi

"I think the team is in good hands. I was on board for Shanny/Shanny early so I'm in it with them for the long haul."


I think so as well.

I think we'll see major improvements by the end of the '11 season.

That is if there is an '11 season.

Posted by: MistaMoe | February 25, 2010 8:02 AM | Report abuse

"A couple seasons ago some nunks on this board were blaming Collins for the defeat in Seattle, which never made much sense, any more than it would to blame Peyton for what happened in New Orleans. Collins basically picked that team up and carried it. They lost in Seattle because they were playing a classic 'home' team on the road. The Seahawks went east the next week and got clobbered, but in their own stadium they lost exactly once that season."

Posted by: Samson151


This is an idiotic comment at best.

So, the fans were the cause of TWO pick sixes in the fourth quarter?

So, the fans were the ones who exposed Collins' inability to make certain throws?

You Collins sack suckers never ceases to amaze me. Every time people want to dignify Todd Collins they want to bring up the "last four games". But they some how seem to forget EVERYTIME that Portis had nearly 350 yards and four TDs in that span.

Again, I really don't understand yours, or anyone's Collins stroking. The guy has been picking splinters out of his ass for his entire career, but somehow people want to give this guy the benefit of the doubt? Based on what!?!?!?! The guy prior to starting those "last four games" in 2007 hadn't started a freakin game since 1997!!!!!

What does that tell you? Oh never mind, I know already.

That he's fan-freakin-tastic...

Posted by: RedDMV | February 25, 2010 8:04 AM | Report abuse

"This is an idiotic comment at best.
So, the fans were the cause of TWO pick sixes in the fourth quarter?
So, the fans were the ones who exposed Collins' inability to make certain throws?"

OK, you've lost me. Who said the fans caused Collins to throw INTs?

But this is America. There's no law against stupidity. You're legally protected.

Posted by: Samson151 | February 25, 2010 8:07 AM | Report abuse

'Nunk": an individual who, if he were smarter, would be a numbskull.

Posted by: Samson151 | February 25, 2010 8:08 AM | Report abuse

RedDMV and Samson151,
Who cares about Collins? I believe he will be cut this year. To Red's point, he's been riding the pine most of his career. I would have like to see what he could have done in place of Campbell last year, but that's done. Collins is another year older in a position where the Redskins need to get younger and more talented. He's done. I would think retirement would be a noble retreat for him at this point of his career.

Posted by: RedSkinHead | February 25, 2010 8:13 AM | Report abuse

Red, while I lack your, um, passion for the topic, I do agree that Collins is waaay overrated by some on here. Dude is a system QB who had a good run at the end of '07 because A) nobody had any film on him since he hadn't started a game in 10 years, B) knew that Saunders system like the back of his hand since he'd been in it for much of his career, and C) had the full support of the run game (as you pointed out). I've never understood why you keep him around when he's so obviously a system QB that is no longer in the system he's good in. Hopefully, Shanahan sends him packing and picks up a Jeff Garcia-type to compete for the starting job here.

Posted by: brownwood26 | February 25, 2010 8:18 AM | Report abuse

I've heard the same, LS...I just don't get why the Skins seem to be the only team that doesn't understand that a big name FA being allowed to hit the market is usually a red flag, not manna from heaven. With the questions and concerns surrounding guys like Robinson and Peppers, any team handing a mint to those players would be crazy.

The circumstances surrounding Dansby being allowed to hit the market seem innocent...a cheap team not wanting to pay big money to a key performer. And a lot of teams are taking that same approach with the possibility of a lockout looming. So I could see a guy like that being a good pickup, but this year the biggest names present the biggest risk.

Posted by: brownwood26 | February 25, 2010 5:43 AM
-------------------------------------------
That makes a lot of sense - surprisingly. I'd be all for Dansy, but I think the red flag should be waving over Dunta Robinson. I've seen a lot of posters say we should go out and get him, but his recent numbers have not really overwhelmed anyone. If the Chargers let Cromartie go, I think the same caution should be applied to him for declining production and off the field issues. Re-signing Rogers may not be everyone's favorite choice, but at least the team knows what they are getting with old stone hands.

Posted by: RedSkinHead | February 25, 2010 8:22 AM | Report abuse

"OK, you've lost me. Who said the fans caused Collins to throw INTs?"

Obviously you're too stupid to even remember what YOU posted so I'll help you: "They lost in Seattle because they were playing a classic 'home' team on the road. The Seahawks went east the next week and got clobbered, but in their own stadium they lost exactly once that season."

I guess THE FANS, you know the people that root for the HOME TEAM, wouldn't have anything to do with that home field advantage you suggested that the Seahawks had, would it?

Before you bump your gums and try to undervalue a persons intelligence, maybe you should evaluate your damn self.

A backbiting stupid fu_k = Samson151

Posted by: RedDMV | February 25, 2010 8:25 AM | Report abuse

Wow Red, take a deep breath, bro...

Posted by: brownwood26 | February 25, 2010 8:29 AM | Report abuse

Brown, the name 'Todd Collins' says it all.

If you were to ask most people are they familiar with him, I'm willing to bet that 90% of them would reply with: Who?

The Collins underpinning is one of those things you can ONLY read on RI, because no one else would give a rat's ass about some QB who rode the damn pine for 30 years -- except some brainless bama with an anti-Campbell agenda posting on Redskins Insider.

Posted by: RedDMV | February 25, 2010 8:32 AM | Report abuse

we're good....

Posted by: RedDMV | February 25, 2010 8:33 AM | Report abuse

I hear ya Red.

I wonder how many up here will be watching the combine...I'm only mildly interested in that stuff, I typically watch only when there's nothing else on at 2pm on a weekday. And with damn near none of the top-end QBs doing any throwing, that takes some of the drama out of it for me.

Posted by: brownwood26 | February 25, 2010 8:42 AM | Report abuse

What drills are they running today at the combine today, brown?

For all the talk about the senior bowl, it was a disappointment to me. For real, just give me the result workouts and bring on the draft.

Posted by: RedDMV | February 25, 2010 8:52 AM | Report abuse

And with damn near none of the top-end QBs doing any throwing, that takes some of the drama out of it for me.

Posted by: brownwood26 | February 25, 2010 8:42 AM

I'm only going to watch the highlights, however I'd be interested in players like Tony Pike, Jarret Brown, Skelton. I think Pike can really solidify himself this week. Brown, and Skelton can move up a bunch if they have worked on improving from the all star games.

Posted by: TWISI | February 25, 2010 8:52 AM | Report abuse

Morning Folks.

Just say NO to Dunta. Another me-first guy (look up his episodes regarding cleats, sitting out offseason, declining $11.5M a year, etc.).. an overrated malcontent who had exactly ZERO picks last year.

Posted by: Rypien11 | February 25, 2010 8:53 AM | Report abuse

an overrated malcontent who had exactly ZERO picks last year.


Who is Carlos Rogers....wait is this jeopardy??

sorry...

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | February 25, 2010 8:55 AM | Report abuse

Not sure what's going on today, Red but I get NFLN at work so I may be able to check it out in a few mins.

Nice pun, Greg. Rogers probably won't be our problem for much longer.

Posted by: brownwood26 | February 25, 2010 8:58 AM | Report abuse

One less FA target for the "sign everybody" crowd:

Steelers, Hampton set to announce new deal
Posted by Mike Florio on February 25, 2010 8:41 AM ET
On the same day that the Steelers faced a deadline for deciding whether to use the franchise tag on veteran nose tackle Casey Hampton, the two sides have finalized a new deal.

According to KDKA-TV, the Steelers have reached an agreement with Hampton. It's expected to be announced later today.

It's a three-year, $21 million contract, with $11 million guaranteed.

The 325-pounder (when weighed with one foot on the ground) joined the Steelers in 2001 as a first-round draft pick, and he has been a key member of the team's 3-4 defense, which requires the presence of a large, athletic man who can tie up blockers in the middle of the line.

If the Steelers had used the franchise tag on Hampton, he would have been entitled to a one-year, $7 million contract.

The $7 million average over three years falls far short of the high end of the market for defensive lineman, which currently is in the range of $12 million annually.

Posted by: brownwood26 | February 25, 2010 9:00 AM | Report abuse

Whats the over/under that LT or Westbrook is playing for us next year?

Posted by: FedorEm | February 25, 2010 9:01 AM | Report abuse

RedDMV,

Try this link:
http://www.nfl.com/combine

That has any updates. I think it is mostly interviews until Saturday and then the offensive linemen and tight ends work out. Sunday is th ebig day with the QB's, WR's and RB's... or at least, that is what the schedule says.

Any snow in the DMV? Syracuse is getting a taste. We had six inches on the ground this morning and another 12 to 16 on its way.

Posted by: RedSkinHead | February 25, 2010 9:02 AM | Report abuse

someone forwarded me the content of a write up on 'deadspin' regarding Tony K...all I can say is give it a read, he comes across as deserving of the 2 weeks, as well as much more...

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | February 25, 2010 9:03 AM | Report abuse

Whats the over/under that LT or Westbrook is playing for us next year?

Posted by: FedorEm | February 25, 2010 9:01 AM

You may not have heard that Snyder and Cerrato are no longer making the personnel decisions. I'll take the under.

Posted by: League-Source | February 25, 2010 9:04 AM | Report abuse

an overrated malcontent who had exactly ZERO picks last year.

Who is Carlos Rogers....wait is this jeopardy??

sorry...

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | February 25, 2010 8:55 AM
------------------------------------------
Bean, you're on your game this morning amigo, but I get you. Still, I think Carlos and Robinson aren't so far apart in ability with Rogers being the better tackler of the two, so why make the effort to sign Robinson? I read a little about the Cromartie situation yesterday and was thinking he is just another malcontent with off the field issues, so why bother? I'll take the stone hands behind door number two, Bob...

Posted by: RedSkinHead | February 25, 2010 9:09 AM | Report abuse

Bean - at least we're not paying Rogers $10M a year (which we would be for Dunta).

Fedorem - kind of hard to set an over/under for a yes or no question.

It should be Yes +500 No -600

Posted by: Rypien11 | February 25, 2010 9:10 AM | Report abuse

RSH, someone just said that we're supposed to get a little snow tomorrow and Saturday. What's crazy is that you all will get all that snow and everything will still be open the next day, while here everything shuts down for a week.

I'm so sick of snow. I kinda missed it for a little bit, now if I went another five years without seeing single flake I'd be good.

Posted by: RedDMV | February 25, 2010 9:11 AM | Report abuse

someone forwarded me the content of a write up on 'deadspin' regarding Tony K...all I can say is give it a read, he comes across as deserving of the 2 weeks, as well as much more...

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | February 25, 2010 9:03 AM

Write up I saw on deadspin said that he got suspended not for what he said about Storm but for what he implied about Chris Berman: "You're forced to apologize if you make fun of Hannah Storm. You get suspended if you make fun of Chris Berman."

Maybe you read something else? But this makes it look even more like Tony K. was hosed.

Posted by: League-Source | February 25, 2010 9:14 AM | Report abuse

Red, let me re-iterate that I hope your shovel breaks, and they run outta rock salt at the local Home Depot.....let me take it one step further, I hope you shovel a parking space and someone other than you takes it....how you like them apples...

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | February 25, 2010 9:14 AM | Report abuse

if I went another five years without seeing single flake I'd be good.

Posted by: RedDMV | February 25, 2010 9:11 AM

Red don't wanna see more flakes? He's saying he's gonna stop reading RI for five years? Red, we'll miss you!

Posted by: League-Source | February 25, 2010 9:16 AM | Report abuse

ls, name of the piece was "Great Moments of Tony Kornheiser being a Dick".......

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | February 25, 2010 9:21 AM | Report abuse

Greg, I'm reading that Deadspin stuff right now...nothing groundbreaking, I've not met him personally but I know people who do. Not a big secret that the guy is completely weird off-camera.

Besides...if wishing Jay Mariotti dead makes you a dick, then call me Ron Jeremy's package.

Posted by: brownwood26 | February 25, 2010 9:22 AM | Report abuse

if I went another five years without seeing single flake I'd be good.

Posted by: RedDMV | February 25, 2010 9:11 AM

Red don't wanna see more flakes? He's saying he's gonna stop reading RI for five years? Red, we'll miss you!

Posted by: League-Source | February 25, 2010 9:16 AM
------------------------------------------
Don't even suggest that. RI is like a breakfast cereal: once you get rid of the fruits and flakes, all you have left are a bunch of nuts...

Posted by: RedSkinHead | February 25, 2010 9:23 AM | Report abuse

Posted by: brownwood26 | February 25, 2010 9:24 AM | Report abuse

Riddle me this....what Heisman winning QB in the last 20 years has been truly successful in the NFL? I honestly cannot think of one. Carson Palmer has been the only one who has been "so-so" successful.

I'm sure you guys will tell me if I'm wrong.

Posted by: Lisa_R | February 25, 2010 9:24 AM | Report abuse

call me Ron Jeremy's package.

Posted by: brownwood26 | February 25, 2010 9:22 AM

LMAO! Next time I change my handle I'm going with it: RonJeremy'sPackage.

Posted by: League-Source | February 25, 2010 9:25 AM | Report abuse

Bean are you talking about this?:

http://deadspin.com/5479292/great-moments-in-tony-kornheiser-being-kind-of-a-dick-update

So that's deserving of a 2 week suspension, "or as well as much more".

You serious? Who on PTI do you like, can Reali get any props from you?

I don't get the hate over TK, dude can be a blowhard, but who isn't on TV nowadays? He says what he thinks, and those rifts that Deadspin listed weren't anything to get all pissy over. It's not like he got on TV or radio and slammed his fists and shouted that Jesus Christ is as real as the Boogie Man or something.

Posted by: RedDMV | February 25, 2010 9:28 AM | Report abuse

"I wonder how many up here will be watching the combine...I'm only mildly interested in that stuff"


What's so funny about the NFL Combine is that according to what I've read, most teams have already compiled their draft boards. This means the combine is worthless.

Those boards are based on what scouting individual teams did from game tape of college games, research, and Senior Bowl practices.

NFL teams already know what players they want and when. The only thing that changes is the dates on the calender leading up to the draft.

So the well-hyped NFL Combine is just another tease event designed to get ratings and stir up chatta.

Posted by: MistaMoe | February 25, 2010 9:30 AM | Report abuse

ls, name of the piece was "Great Moments of Tony Kornheiser being a Dick".......

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | February 25, 2010 9:21 AM | Report abuse

Makes it seem like TK hates seeing other DC sports guys have any kind of success.

Posted by: PortisPocketsStr8 | February 25, 2010 9:31 AM | Report abuse

red, as I stated yesterday, I don't watch ESPN except for the hunting/fishing shows on the weekend....

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | February 25, 2010 9:33 AM | Report abuse

So the well-hyped NFL Combine is just another tease event designed to get ratings and stir up chatta.

Posted by: MistaMoe | February 25, 2010 9:30 AM
=====
Oddly it may serve a purpose by revealing who DOESNT wish to attend.

Posted by: SkinsneedaGM | February 25, 2010 9:34 AM | Report abuse

moe, the combine is somewhat worthless....unless of course, benching becomes part of playing football, or running without pads does....its a total dog and pony show...ask Mike Mamula...

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | February 25, 2010 9:36 AM | Report abuse

NFL teams already know what players they want and when. The only thing that changes is the dates on the calender leading up to the draft.

Posted by: MistaMoe | February 25, 2010 9:30 AM


Not really...if a borderline guy has a great workout, some GMs could get mind boners over the guy and take him higher than he shoulda gone (see Mamula, Mike and Gholston, Vernon). I agree that draft boards are mostly set, but the it's the interview process that means more to the personnel guys than the workouts.

Posted by: brownwood26 | February 25, 2010 9:39 AM | Report abuse

Thanks, brownwood. I think that stuff is hilarious. That's what makes PTI worth watching. I love that show. Sometimes I even give up watching "Fast Money" on CNBC to tune in to Mike and Tony. Probably just as well because I don't think I've done much but lose money from those "Fast Money" tips. Prolly ought to call it "Gas Money."

Posted by: League-Source | February 25, 2010 9:40 AM | Report abuse

I don't know, if I've been a popular media dude for over 30 years in a certain market, I'd be kinda of territorial too I guess.

It does seems his act wore thin at The Washington Post though.

Posted by: RedDMV | February 25, 2010 9:40 AM | Report abuse

Last time Shanahan had a 1st pick he got Cutler in 2006 who went to the 2008 ProBowl. Shanahan may think that qualifies him as a QB drafting genius and do it again??

jus guessing..

Posted by: cliftonbiz | February 25, 2010 12:50 AM
===========
Not a good scenario.

Posted by: SkinsneedaGM | February 25, 2010 9:42 AM | Report abuse

It does seems his act wore thin at The Washington Post though.

Posted by: RedDMV | February 25, 2010 9:40 AM

As in "Here, Tony, we'll pay you a lot of money just to go away." If someone will pay me a lot of money, I'll go away. beantown -- that's MONEY, not your "beanus points." I can always come back as RonJeremy'sPackage, but Tony Kornheiser can never come back as Mr. Nice Guy.

Posted by: League-Source | February 25, 2010 9:43 AM | Report abuse

LS, I'm a PTI fan too...folks have to take TK for what he is--an entertaining personality on-air and a self-absorbed, d-bag off-air. If you view him thru that prism, the Deadspin article doesn't phase you at all.

I'd say TK is kinda like the guys in "Step-Brothers"...easily one of the top 5 LOL funny movies of the last decade, but if you were to meet those characters in real life, you'd probably shoot 'em where they stand.

Posted by: brownwood26 | February 25, 2010 9:49 AM | Report abuse

"I wonder how many up here will be watching the combine...I'm only mildly interested in that stuff"


What's so funny about the NFL Combine is that according to what I've read, most teams have already compiled their draft boards. This means the combine is worthless.

Those boards are based on what scouting individual teams did from game tape of college games, research, and Senior Bowl practices.

NFL teams already know what players they want and when. The only thing that changes is the dates on the calender leading up to the draft.

So the well-hyped NFL Combine is just another tease event designed to get ratings and stir up chatta.

Posted by: MistaMoe | February 25, 2010 9:30 AM
------------------------------------------
I disagree. If a guy runs a bad forty it could drop his draft value significantly. If a guy turns in a sub-4.4 forty, he's going to advance in the draft. You can't coach speed. You even have teams like the Raiders that perhaps put too much credence in forty times willing to go out on a limb for a guy who can burn it up on a track.

I think the interviews at the combine are also very valuable. This is the first chance for coaches to talk to many of the players. Although most of the players have been coached on what to say by their agents, there are still those revealing answers that help coaches assess what type of player they are looking at. This is cruical for players with off-the-field issues in their background. Is the player apologetic for what they did or do they blame everyone else for errors in their judgement?

I think the combine has become more of a media event over the last few years, but it still has immense value to teams assessing players.

Posted by: RedSkinHead | February 25, 2010 9:50 AM | Report abuse

I don't know, if I've been a popular media dude for over 30 years in a certain market, I'd be kinda of territorial too I guess.

It does seems his act wore thin at The Washington Post though.

Posted by: RedDMV | February 25, 2010 9:40 AM | Report abuse

True. But it's not like what Wise and Steinberg were doing would have any impact on Tony's money or popularity.

maybe stuff happened at the post that we don't know about.

Posted by: PortisPocketsStr8 | February 25, 2010 9:51 AM | Report abuse

Tony Kornheiser is my role model.

He didn't say anything objectable.

But someone should ask Ms. Storm if she, a mature professional wealthy woman who gads about in revealing clothes, if she was offended.

I doubt it.

Posted by: MistaMoe | February 25, 2010 9:54 AM | Report abuse

Did anyone remember how Tom Brady became ordinary when he faced NFC East style defense from NY Jets? Well, JC faces such, at least 6 times a year. Every successful QB needs super protection from O Line. How quickly have we forgotten the 6-2 start when we have a good line? Some says JC had Gibbs for 3 years, when? It was Mark Brunell that had Gibbs not JC. Bottom line is I trust the judgment of our new brain trust. Shanahan and Allen are more than capable of gradual systematic roster management. Don't be surprised if only few changes are made this year. For draft QB lovers, my instinct tells me Bradford and Claussen may not be in the top 20 pick. My hope is that we trade out of 4 for a first and second.

Posted by: abxinc | February 25, 2010 9:54 AM | Report abuse

You can't coach speed.

Posted by: RedSkinHead | February 25, 2010 9:50 AM

Is this an established fact? How do track coaches make a living?

Posted by: League-Source | February 25, 2010 9:55 AM | Report abuse

Is this an established fact? How do track coaches make a living?

Posted by: League-Source | February 25, 2010 9:55 AM


That's coaching a guy to MAXIMIZE his speed, not obtain it. If you run a 5.2 forty, you won't get coached into running a 4.2 forty.

So track coaches are like that old commercial..."we don't teach you run fast--we teach you to run faster."

Posted by: brownwood26 | February 25, 2010 10:00 AM | Report abuse

But someone should ask Ms. Storm if she, a mature professional wealthy woman who gads about in revealing clothes, if she was offended.

I doubt it.

Posted by: MistaMoe | February 25, 2010 9:54 AM

Moe--

You called it. This is what the deadspin piece said:

"Also — and this is important — Hannah Storm did not push for this suspension. She was a little hurt, a little annoyed, but other than that, she doesn't dive into the interoffice justice game. She just wants to talk into the camera, look pretty, and go home and play with her kids. She is bemused by any coverage of her wardrobe, mostly because she does not think it's that big of a deal."

http://deadspin.com/5478645/kornheiser-gets-two+week-suspension-for-on+air-comments-and-other-things-of-note

Posted by: League-Source | February 25, 2010 10:00 AM | Report abuse

reskinhead

"I think the combine has become more of a media event over the last few years, but it still has immense value to teams assessing players."


The average college football player on display at the combine has generated--at the minimum--44 games of videotape of himself playing football.

I don't see how a forty yard dash--no matter how fast--changes someone's perception of his ability as a football player.

You could argue the value of pro days at an individual player's school, but not the combine.

The combine is being morphed into a junior, ratings driven version of the draft where media types and football heads yak up the value of meaningless drills performed by sweaty muscle bound dudes in underwear.

And because of that, my gay friends will be watching.

As for me?: I'm gonna spend some time checking out the grass growing in my backyard.

Posted by: MistaMoe | February 25, 2010 10:01 AM | Report abuse

ESPN chick update:

--Dana Jacobson is in Orlando for that corny "ESPN the Weekend" bullsh*t. Looks like my girl dropped some weight for the appearance.

--Nothing new here, but Hannah Storm is wearing another mini-skirt. God bless cougars with nice legs.

Posted by: brownwood26 | February 25, 2010 10:04 AM | Report abuse

I disagree. If a guy runs a bad forty it could drop his draft value significantly. If a guy turns in a sub-4.4 forty, he's going to advance in the draft. You can't coach speed. You even have teams like the Raiders that perhaps put too much credence in forty times willing to go out on a limb for a guy who can burn it up on a track.

Posted by: RedSkinHead | February 25, 2010 9:50 AM | Report abuse


This is exactly why the combine is over-valued. Aquan Boldin ran a 4.7 at the combine and dropped all the way to the 2nd round. I believe we drafted Taylor Jacobs ahead of Boldin in that draft.

Posted by: dfbovey | February 25, 2010 10:05 AM | Report abuse

LMAO! Next time I change my handle I'm going with it: RonJeremy'sPackage.

Posted by: League-Source | February 25, 2010 9:25 AM


LS--What was your previous handle, or must you remain anonymous?

Posted by: BigE44 | February 25, 2010 10:06 AM | Report abuse

Did anyone remember how Tom Brady became ordinary when he faced NFC East style defense from NY Jets? Posted by: abxinc
____
Well the last time Brady faced the NFC East he was 4-0 in the regular season (crushing the Redskins of couse Campbell was horrilbe that day so he didn't help) The Pats lost in the Super Bowl to the giants but Brady gave them the lead, it was the defense that let the Pats down (of course it helped the Giants had a QB who can win a game in the final 2 minutes). Look no one is saying the OL doesn't need to improve but having a good OL but still have a crappy QB the team will still lose... Look the Skins NEED to draft a QB and LT as their first 2 draft picks.. The question is the order. But either way Campbell and at least 3 guys on the OL have to GO!!!!

Posted by: sovine08 | February 25, 2010 10:07 AM | Report abuse

the drills run at the combine are a sham

the value of the combine are the medical exams and the interviews

oh yeah, and the wonderlic test scores

Posted by: coparker5 | February 25, 2010 10:09 AM | Report abuse

As for me?: I'm gonna spend some time checking out the grass growing in my backyard.

Posted by: MistaMoe | February 25, 2010 10:01 AM | Report abuse

I'm going to bottle some homebrew beer. The combine tells us nothing. It may be useful for a bad GM or an Al Davis type owner. A guy that runs a 4.4 and knows how to take a proper angle is going to be better than a guy that can't take an angle and runs a 4.3. Game film against quality opponenets is about the only thing you need.

Posted by: PAskinsfan17 | February 25, 2010 10:09 AM | Report abuse

LS--What was your previous handle, or must you remain anonymous?

Posted by: BigE44 | February 25, 2010 10:06 AM

When the Redskins replaced Zorn as signal-caller, I was brought in from an old-age home to replace talent_evaluator. He just wasn't getting it done. Most people seem to think that I'm an upgrade over t_e.

Posted by: League-Source | February 25, 2010 10:10 AM | Report abuse

I don't see how a forty yard dash--no matter how fast--changes someone's perception of his ability as a football player.

Posted by: MistaMoe | February 25, 2010 10:01 AM
-----------------------------------------
Darrius Heyward-Bey (Maryland) - Had a 4.3 second 40 time at the combine and moved him up at least a dozen places in the draft. As I said before, the Raiders love speed and when this guy ran the fastest 40 of all receivers at the combine last year, they just had to have him.

Posted by: RedSkinHead | February 25, 2010 10:10 AM | Report abuse

I don't see how a forty yard dash--no matter how fast--changes someone's perception of his ability as a football player.

Posted by: MistaMoe | February 25, 2010 10:01 AM


Not that Al Davis counts as "someone" anymore, but he let Vinny off the hook for the worst '08 draft by--I can't make this stuff up--taking a safety in the 2nd round with a 7th round grade because he ran the fastest 40 of the DBs on the board. So while the good GMs have their boards pretty much set, the bad GMs distinguish themselves as such by getting preoccupied with combine numbers.

I mean, they took JaMarcus Russell 1st overall because he had the best arm strength--easily the most overrated aspect of a QB's game.

Posted by: brownwood26 | February 25, 2010 10:12 AM | Report abuse

I believe we drafted Taylor Jacobs ahead of Boldin in that draft.

thanks for reminding me....ugh...the spurrier years...

That first game versus AZ held such promise...Davis rushed for over 100, Matthews threw for over 300...they won...

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | February 25, 2010 10:12 AM | Report abuse

OK Sovine, we get it...you hate JC. Move on, dude. You're dangerously close to "Sports_Guru" territory...

Posted by: brownwood26 | February 25, 2010 10:13 AM | Report abuse

Darrius Heyward-Bey (Maryland) - Had a 4.3 second 40 time at the combine and moved him up at least a dozen places in the draft. As I said before, the Raiders love speed and when this guy ran the fastest 40 of all receivers at the combine last year, they just had to have him.

Posted by: RedSkinHead | February 25, 2010 10:10 AM | Report abuse


Further showing how valueless it actually is, when you take a guy like that over Michael Crabtree based on a 40 time.

Posted by: dfbovey | February 25, 2010 10:14 AM | Report abuse

Greg, you shoulda known better than get excited over a win against AZ...they were pretty bad back then.

Whenever I hear Spurrier's name, I have the same reaction as the gekko from the Geico commercials where he gets sucked into the tubing system:

"I...I still have nightmares..."

Posted by: brownwood26 | February 25, 2010 10:17 AM | Report abuse

As for me?: I'm gonna spend some time checking out the grass growing in my backyard.

Posted by: MistaMoe | February 25, 2010 10:01 AM | Report abuse

I'm going to bottle some homebrew beer. The combine tells us nothing. It may be useful for a bad GM or an Al Davis type owner. A guy that runs a 4.4 and knows how to take a proper angle is going to be better than a guy that can't take an angle and runs a 4.3. Game film against quality opponenets is about the only thing you need.

Posted by: PAskinsfan17 | February 25, 2010 10:09 AM
------------------------------------------
I guess Zorn was believing all of those college game films on Kelly last year when he was trying to get him deep. Kelly's draft position was hurt when he ran a slow forty time and the only way he can get deep in the NFL is if a safety gets caught on play action, regardless of what the game film shows.

Game film shows a lot, but it is sometimes hard to separate the wheat from the chaff when the teams play against inferior competition. These bigger colleges ensure they have three or four cream puff teams on their schedules so they can inflate stats and provide game highlights to scouts. Sometimes the combine surprises you.

I am not saying that I will watch it this weekend, because I, too, have a life outside of football, but I do think the combine has value to the scouts and coaches that are there. Or else, why would they be there?

Posted by: RedSkinHead | February 25, 2010 10:19 AM | Report abuse

I believe we drafted Taylor Jacobs ahead of Boldin in that draft....ugh...the spurrier years....

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | February 25, 2010 10:12 AM |

20-20 Hindsight. Boldin was the sixth WR in that draft. But Spurrier probably was the problem -- Boldin was from Florida State. It's not like Spurrier hadn't seen him a few times.

2. Charles Rogers (Detroit)
3. Andre Johnson (Houston)
17. Bryant Johnson (Arizona)
44. Taylor Jacobs
45. Bethel Johnsons (New England)
54. Anquan Boldin

Posted by: League-Source | February 25, 2010 10:21 AM | Report abuse

dfbovey, the combine isn't "valueless"...it's in place to keep the Raiders irrelevant and inept. Don't be shocked to see Al Davis REALLY lose his marbles and take QBs in every round (all the ones with the good 40 times, at least).

Posted by: brownwood26 | February 25, 2010 10:21 AM | Report abuse

Posted by: brownwood26 | February 25, 2010 10:13 AM | Report abuse

My favorite part was blaming the Pats defense for letting them down in a 17-14 game.

Posted by: PAskinsfan17 | February 25, 2010 10:22 AM | Report abuse

Combine can help someone like Chris Johnson.

I'm sure his 40 time helped put him on teams radar. Not sure how many scouts are paying close attention to what's going on at ECU.

So for a guy coming out of a smaller school, I'd say the combine is valuable.

Posted by: PortisPocketsStr8 | February 25, 2010 10:22 AM | Report abuse

The Collins underpinning is one of those things you can ONLY read on RI, because no one else would give a rat's ass about some QB who rode the damn pine for 30 years -- except some brainless bama with an anti-Campbell agenda posting on Redskins Insider.
Posted by: RedDMV
_____
And that's the shame of it.. if your not flashy no one knows you. I remember watching the Skins/Bears game in 2007 when Campbell got hurt. One announcer was shocked went Collins came in. He questioned why Gibbs was playing Collins and not Brunell. Well Collins won the game which Gibbs called the best performance off the bench he had ever seen. Collins went on to win the next 3, be called the offensive player of the month and scored a 106 QB rating.. not to mention get the Skins in the playoffs (something Campbell has NEVER DONE). Of course this is the Redskins and here where you are drafted or age is more important than performance. So Collins went back to the bench Campbell started again and we had 2 years in last place in the NFC East. Arizona meanwhile went by performance put Leinart on the bench started the backup guy.. and they went to the playoffs the last 2 years once even to the Super Bowl...

Posted by: sovine08 | February 25, 2010 10:22 AM | Report abuse

Did anyone remember how Tom Brady became ordinary when he faced NFC East style defense from NY Jets? Posted by: abxinc
____
Well the last time Brady faced the NFC East he was 4-0 in the regular season (crushing the Redskins of couse Campbell was horrilbe that day so he didn't help) The Pats lost in the Super Bowl to the giants but Brady gave them the lead, it was the defense that let the Pats down (of course it helped the Giants had a QB who can win a game in the final 2 minutes). Look no one is saying the OL doesn't need to improve but having a good OL but still have a crappy QB the team will still lose... Look the Skins NEED to draft a QB and LT as their first 2 draft picks.. The question is the order. But either way Campbell and at least 3 guys on the OL have to GO!!!!

Posted by: sovine08 | February 25, 2010 10:07 AM
=================
Campbell played badly against the pats.. but he beat the Gints that year when the Gints needed the win at home to have a playoff bye or home advantage (I think).

Posted by: SkinsneedaGM | February 25, 2010 10:24 AM | Report abuse

I love all of the absolutes that are proclaimed up here. Yeah, the combine is worthless and overvalued……right. Getting over-hyped, yes, but worthless? No.

Posted by: dlhaze1 | February 25, 2010 10:25 AM | Report abuse

Sovine--

Leinart was benched for several reasons, performance, was one of them.

Hmmmm, are you comparing Todd Collins to Kurt Warner? I hope not...

Posted by: BigE44 | February 25, 2010 10:26 AM | Report abuse

"Obviously you're too stupid to even remember what YOU posted so I'll help you: "They lost in Seattle because they were playing a classic 'home' team on the road. The Seahawks went east the next week and got clobbered, but in their own stadium they lost exactly once that season."I guess THE FANS, you know the people that root for the HOME TEAM, wouldn't have anything to do with that home field advantage you suggested that the Seahawks had, would it?
Before you bump your gums and try to undervalue a persons intelligence, maybe you should evaluate your damn self.A backbiting stupid fu_k = Samson151 Posted by: RedDMV"

LOL sensitive about our intelligence, are we? Believe it was you who brought the subject up --

reddmv: "This is an idiotic comment at best.So, the fans were the cause of TWO pick sixes in the fourth quarter?So, the fans were the ones who exposed Collins' inability to make certain throws?"

Some teams play better at home. Seattle was one that season -- 7-1 in Seattle, a losing record on the road. The cause of the two INTs in the fourth quarter was pressure, which the Seahawks had maintained throughout the game. Didn't produce sacks, but plenty of hurries.

Doesn't much matter if he rode the pine the rest of his career -- for that stretch, he was a season-saver.

Posted by: Samson151 | February 25, 2010 10:26 AM | Report abuse

Further showing how valueless it actually is, when you take a guy like that over Michael Crabtree based on a 40 time.

Posted by: dfbovey | February 25, 2010 10:14 AM
------------------------------------------
It doesn't prove anything of the sort. It just demonstrates how much value some teams put in the combine. There are teams that take game tape, combine numbers, interview results - the whole enchilada, and use that to evaluate players. The Raiders are idiots for zoning in on one metric, but they are an exception to the rule. Most GM's will acknowledge that the combine is a valuable part of their collection of player analysis - not the only part.

I think a guy like Tony Pike is going to help himself with this combine. There's a guy who faced a few mediocre teams in college so the scouts don't know how to rate him. He had a so-so performance at the senior bowl, but then again, he only had a few short days to absorb the offense and practice with the receivers. He's shown something already by agreeing to go to the combine and do all of the drills, instead of sitting it out like some of the other QB's. I'm betting there will be a lot more chatter about him after the combine.

Posted by: RedSkinHead | February 25, 2010 10:28 AM | Report abuse

Getting over-hyped, yes, but worthless? No.

Posted by: dlhaze1 | February 25, 2010 10:25 AM

A dose of reality from out of the haze.

Makes you wonder -- if it's worthless, why do they spend so much money to have it? I'll believe it's worthless when teams stop sending representatives. Worthless = pro day at the Eastern Shore Community College in Melfa, Virginia.

Posted by: League-Source | February 25, 2010 10:31 AM | Report abuse

And that's the shame of it.. if your not flashy no one knows you. I remember watching the Skins/Bears game in 2007 when Campbell got hurt. One announcer was shocked went Collins came in. He questioned why Gibbs was playing Collins and not Brunell. Well Collins won the game which Gibbs called the best performance off the bench he had ever seen. Collins went on to win the next 3, be called the offensive player of the month and scored a 106 QB rating.. not to mention get the Skins in the playoffs (something Campbell has NEVER DONE). Of course this is the Redskins and here where you are drafted or age is more important than performance. So Collins went back to the bench Campbell started again and we had 2 years in last place in the NFC East. Arizona meanwhile went by performance put Leinart on the bench started the backup guy.. and they went to the playoffs the last 2 years once even to the Super Bowl...

Posted by: sovine08 | February 25, 2010 10:22 AM
======================
Gibbs said Collins was the best QB in practice... But, what was Gibbs going to do? He is the one who told snyder to trade most of 2006 picks to get JC in 2005. He had to play JC or say he was wrong about the pick.

Skins also play you by the size of your Contract, not based on performance and progress at Practice.

Recall how much better the players were that stepped in last year after the big money guys went out injured. It was almost 100% across the board.. There is a snap shot of the Skins flawed personnel philosophy. Contrast to that.. The Giants and Pats have a "best player and most improved player each week plays on Sunday". If Portis played for Belichick he would of been either great or on the bench.. There would of been no in between.. maybe I'll practice and maybe I will show up to play.

Posted by: SkinsneedaGM | February 25, 2010 10:32 AM | Report abuse

wow...todd collins talk...I mean...really...todd collins....can't we discuss Pierce, or Neiamiah Broughton, heck how about your personal favorite adam archuletta moment...

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | February 25, 2010 10:39 AM | Report abuse

Posted by: RedSkinHead | February 25, 2010 10:19 AM | Report abuse

That's why I specified game film against quality opponents. If he was truly slow before the injury then it would have showed up on film the first time he played against a real CB. BTW, he didn't run at the combine. He ran at Pro day. So the combine still told us nothing about Kelly.

Injuries are a special concern. I wouldn't trust combine or pro day results or anything else. I'd have him evaluated by the team medical staff instead.

Posted by: PAskinsfan17 | February 25, 2010 10:40 AM | Report abuse

Some teams play better at home. Seattle was one that season -- 7-1 in Seattle, a losing record on the road. The cause of the two INTs in the fourth quarter was pressure, which the Seahawks had maintained throughout the game. Didn't produce sacks, but plenty of hurries.

Doesn't much matter if he rode the pine the rest of his career -- for that stretch, he was a season-saver.

Posted by: Samson151 | February 25, 2010 10:26 AM
================
Thought the Seahawks had 3 or 4 sacks in that game.. I believe Heyer was in as a rookie and a few other OLine guys were out injured.. Looked like a jail break coming at Collins on every play.

From NFL.Com..
The Seahawks linebackers -- Leroy Hill, Lofa Tatupu and Julian Peterson -- led the team in tackles. The trio was able to pressure starting quarterback Todd Collins for most of the game. Seattle had only four sacks but was constantly applying pressure on the Redskins quarterback. The Seahawks are 10-2 when they have at least one sack.

http://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/2008010500/2007/POST18/redskins@seahawks

Posted by: SkinsneedaGM | February 25, 2010 10:40 AM | Report abuse

wow...todd collins talk...I mean...really...todd collins....can't we discuss Pierce, or Neiamiah Broughton, heck how about your personal favorite adam archuletta moment...

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | February 25, 2010 10:39 AM | Report abuse
___________

My favorite Archuletta moment was the day he hopped in his Redskins-funded Bentley and drove his arse out of town for the last time....

Posted by: skinsfan713 | February 25, 2010 10:41 AM | Report abuse

Doesn't much matter if he rode the pine the rest of his career -- for that stretch, he was a season-saver.


Posted by: Samson151 |

Absolutely impossible to compare what happened in that month with any other time. The team was playing on a completely different level due to the ST circumstances. You're only going to see a team come together and play like that (overachieving) once every few seasons, and Todd was not the reason behind it. He was a part of it, but the team as a whole was playing completely out of their minds.

Posted by: Rypien11 | February 25, 2010 10:43 AM | Report abuse

News flash ... Saints put a second round tender on RFA Jermon Bushrod/OT.

Question: Should the Skins make the move to obtain Bushrod in order to avoiding out whether a drafted tackle is a bust? Bushrod has serious talent.

Bird in the hand, two in the bush. [Fiddle around with that the make something out of bush/Bushrod and "in the" in reference to second round ... where the result is something clever that says its better to know what you're buying. There will be a prize.]

Posted by: dcsween | February 25, 2010 10:44 AM | Report abuse

Campbell played badly against the pats.. but he beat the Gints that year when the Gints needed the win at home to have a playoff bye or home advantage (I think).


Posted by: SkinsneedaGM | February 25, 2010 10:24 AM | Report abuse

Collins was playing QB in that game against the Giants.

Posted by: iH8dallas | February 25, 2010 10:45 AM | Report abuse

wow...todd collins talk...I mean...really...todd collins....can't we discuss Pierce, or Neiamiah Broughton, heck how about your personal favorite adam archuleta moment...

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | February 25, 2010 10:39 AM
===============
not impressed with his American Idol appearance.

Posted by: SkinsneedaGM | February 25, 2010 10:45 AM | Report abuse

Am I the only one who heard ARE will get cut??

Posted by: 4thFloor | February 25, 2010 10:46 AM | Report abuse

Gibbs said Collins was the best QB in practice ...

Posted by: SkinsneedaGM | February 25, 2010 10:32 AM

Honest to Dog, the consensus at the Park for the time he was here was that Taylor Jacobs was the best WR in practice.

Unfortunately, the win-loss column is not decided on practice (or at least, that's what Portis says and he's stickin to it).

Posted by: dcsween | February 25, 2010 10:47 AM | Report abuse

avoiding out = avoid figuring out

4th, you're not the only one ... Clayton was saying that yesterday and the consensus up here was "duh".

Posted by: dcsween | February 25, 2010 10:49 AM | Report abuse

News flash ... Saints put a second round tender on RFA Jermon Bushrod/OT.

Question: Should the Skins make the move to obtain Bushrod in order to avoiding out whether a drafted tackle is a bust? Bushrod has serious talent.

Bird in the hand, two in the bush. [Fiddle around with that the make something out of bush/Bushrod and "in the" in reference to second round ... where the result is something clever that says its better to know what you're buying. There will be a prize.]

Posted by: dcsween | February 25, 2010 10:44 AM | Report abuse
I admit I am not too educated on the details of RFA and tenders. But if that means we have to give up our 2nd round draft pick then no, if it means we just have to pay him 2nd rd money then yes.

Posted by: iH8dallas | February 25, 2010 10:49 AM | Report abuse

Question: Should the Skins make the move to obtain Bushrod in order to avoiding out whether a drafted tackle is a bust? Bushrod has serious talent.

Posted by: dcsween | February 25, 2010 10:44 AM

Skins will have a first-round (original pick) tender on Carlos Rogers. Maybe we can trade Rogers for Bushrod and New Orleans' 4th round pick?

Bushrod was a 4th round pick out of Towson. If Saints won't trade him for 'Los or your boy, Andre Carter, then I wouldn't want to give up a #2 for him.

Posted by: League-Source | February 25, 2010 10:51 AM | Report abuse

"I love all of the absolutes that are proclaimed up here. Yeah, the combine is worthless and overvalued……right. Getting over-hyped, yes, but worthless? No."


If it's so valuable, then, with Tony Pike being the only quarterback of name throwing, he should be projected ahead of J Claussen and S Bradford, right?

Like I said.

If I'm an NFL general manager, I'm focusing in on multiple video 'cut-ups' of a player performing in plays that are similar to whatever scheme my team runs on both sides of the ball.

'Cut ups' can be broken down to a specific running play--for example--and you can watch a kid run it to see if there is a pattern of strength or weakness to his game.

This works for all positions on the field, btw.

I'd trust it more than a stop watch or bench presses so I can project him into my system or out if it looks like he can't do what my coaches teach at the level of need I want.

There is not one drill that tells you if a guy has the heart to go side line to side line to make plays.

The scope of things the combine is good for is very limited.

Me?: I go to the tape.

Posted by: MistaMoe | February 25, 2010 10:51 AM | Report abuse

I think so 4th...I haven't heard anything about that except from you.

Care to reveal your sources?

Posted by: brownwood26 | February 25, 2010 10:52 AM | Report abuse

News flash ... Saints put a second round tender on RFA Jermon Bushrod/OT.

Question: Should the Skins make the move to obtain Bushrod in order to avoiding out whether a drafted tackle is a bust? Bushrod has serious talent.

Bird in the hand, two in the bush. [Fiddle around with that the make something out of bush/Bushrod and "in the" in reference to second round ... where the result is something clever that says its better to know what you're buying. There will be a prize.]

Posted by: dcsween | February 25, 2010 10:44 AM
==============
trade down from the #4 and pick up a 2nd and a 3rd.. Use the 2nd on Bushrod.. Still have the original 2nd and you've replaced the 3rd lost on Jarmon?
Agreed.. Bushrod is a known talent.. Okung, who knows?.. He could be the Mike Williams of the 2002 draft.

Posted by: SkinsneedaGM | February 25, 2010 10:52 AM | Report abuse

I mean...really...todd collins....

Posted by: BeantownGreg1


This is what I'm saying about Todd Collins regardless...

Posted by: RedDMV | February 25, 2010 10:53 AM | Report abuse

Am I the only one who heard ARE will get cut??

Posted by: 4thFloor | February 25, 2010 10:46 AM
------------------------------------------
I haven't heard anything about any prospective cuts but I have to believe his name is on the list. I guess Allen is playing it close to the vest - maybe fishing for low round draft picks for players like ARE, and Cartwright before March 5th. I'm assumign they will ahve to shed some weight then if they plan on signing a few free agents.

Posted by: RedSkinHead | February 25, 2010 10:54 AM | Report abuse

Am I the only one who heard ARE will get cut??

Posted by: 4thFloor | February 25, 2010 10:46 AM

If Greg hasn't found it on PFT, then it's not happening.

Posted by: League-Source | February 25, 2010 10:57 AM | Report abuse

I heard about ARE getting axed from John Clayton. I don't think he said it was definite, but suggested that he more than likely would.

Posted by: RedDMV | February 25, 2010 11:00 AM | Report abuse

News flash ... Saints put a second round tender on RFA Jermon Bushrod/OT.

Posted by: dcsween | February 25, 2010 10:44 AM


That kind of thinking process has to be explored. I'm not sure about the guy. He has talent needs to develop. I saw Bushrod play the against Carter, Ware, Freeny and he looks to have trouble against speed rushers. I think with more experience he could improve. So I think if Brushrod fits the scheme, he could be a nice addition.

Posted by: TWISI | February 25, 2010 11:01 AM | Report abuse

Am I the only one who heard ARE will get cut??

Posted by: 4thFloor | February 25, 2010 10:46 AM
------------------------------------------

It not what you've heard, its what the credible people are saying. And thus far, they're saying nothing.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | February 25, 2010 11:01 AM | Report abuse

Hopefully your foresight will correct with the cut of ARE. Nice guy but never achieved with the Skins. We need play makers and ARE is not one of those.

Posted by: fearturtle44 | February 25, 2010 11:02 AM | Report abuse

no thanks on the bushrod for a 2nd...rather use a 2nd on another OL, similar to hopefully what they do in the first.....

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | February 25, 2010 11:02 AM | Report abuse

Okung, who knows?.. He could be the Mike Williams of the 2002 draft.

Posted by: SkinsneedaGM | February 25, 2010 10:52 AM

That's what I mean. Okung, Davis, Campbell, Bulaga, Capers, Brown, Black, who knows?

It doesn't matter that Bushrod was drafted in the 4th round out of Towson. Ryan Leaf was drafted out of the Washington in the 1st round. The difference is the player you see on the NFL field vs. the one you have project onto the field.

Chris Samuels needs to be replaced. This one isn't a hard call. If they DO want a QB with the #4 pick, who may or may not be the franchise guy ... and who they shouldn't (or we shouldn't) expect to be the franchise guy in only one season, then the 2nd round spot reserved for the Samuels' replacement has some insurance built in ... he's already been "trained up" to play NFL football.

Also, Sean Taylor needs to be replaced. Are there any Va Tech game watchers who can tell me about the downsides of Kam Chancellor? From the interwebgoogles, he sounds like the guy ... assuming he's still around in the 4th round.

Posted by: dcsween | February 25, 2010 11:03 AM | Report abuse

DANSBY, BULLOCK, or CROWELL in that order of preference for our FA SSLB next season.

Posted by: glawrence007 | February 25, 2010 11:06 AM | Report abuse

Gibbs said Collins was the best QB in practice ...

Posted by: SkinsneedaGM | February 25, 2010 10:32 AM

Honest to Dog, the consensus at the Park for the time he was here was that Taylor Jacobs was the best WR in practice.

Unfortunately, the win-loss column is not decided on practice (or at least, that's what Portis says and he's stickin to it).

Posted by: dcsween | February 25, 2010 10:47 AM
========
Out of context dude.. Gibbs said it when he was informed that Collins had been named NFL Player of the Month... The interviewer said.. "Did you know he was so good?" And Gibbs responded.. "Well he was always the best QB during Practice".

My point being.. That Collins never got to start because of CAmpbell's Contract size and the commitment the Skins made to him by giving up most of the 2006 Draft and the 1st pick they used on him in 2005.

Realistically..
You got a guy sitting on the bench who is 5-1 W-L and 2-0 in the NFC East the last 4 years..
Then you have the Starter who is 4-21 in the NFC East in his 51+ starts the last 4 years..
Any other team that lets the best player Start would have Campbell on the bench. But, Campbell continued to Start because the Skins and Snyder were desperate to get back the value of their 2005 commitment. Didnt matter if Collins beat him out during preseason .. it was the price that had been paid for him.

But, who knows Campbell's 6th year may be the One!!

Posted by: SkinsneedaGM | February 25, 2010 11:09 AM | Report abuse

That's what I mean. Okung, Davis, Campbell, Bulaga, Capers, Brown, Black, who knows?

Posted by: dcsween | February 25, 2010 11:03 AM |

New Orleans. They think they can get someone better than Bushrod with a second-round pick, otherwise they wold have tendered him as a first rounder. Why can't the Redskins?

Posted by: League-Source | February 25, 2010 11:10 AM | Report abuse

Anybody else find it amazing that all over the place there are rumors about trades, tenders, tags, and who teams are looking at in the draft and the best anybody nationally or on the Insider can come up with to talk about is will we or won't we draft a QB. No rumors about who we're talking to already in FA, no rumors about trades we're trying to pull off, and no even inkling of tenders or non tenders for our RFAs. Is it safe to say the Ashburn culture is already dramatically different than in the past?

Posted by: zjfr2 | February 25, 2010 11:12 AM | Report abuse

I hope some franchise gets desperate for one of the top two quarterbacks in this draft and is willinf to trade up into the 4th spot. Please make the deal Allen.

We don't need a quarterback. Campbell will do fine in Shanny's offensive system. Look at his skill set compared to other qb's that have done well in Shanny's system. Strong arm, above average athletism, toughness. (Cutler, Plummer, Elway). JC is better prepared to win then any qb we would draft.

RB we dont need one. Anybody can run in Shanny's system. (ie. Ruben Droughns, Mike Anderson, etc)

Wr/TE - we dont need any

O-line - We need a young stud at tackle, however there are 6-7 1st round talent tackels in this draft. We NEED to trade down to acuire a top lineman and a young FS/LB.

And I and sure that Shanny has a list of free-agent linemen that would fit his system perfect. He has only been out of coaching 1 year and "masterminding' his return. The skins will be ok!!

Posted by: digger76 | February 25, 2010 11:15 AM | Report abuse

While scanning....I see Todd Collins name alot...I don't know why...

...Unless you trade JC17...Draft Bradford/Pike and make them the Emergency QB all year long, with Colt45 being the back up.......

Posted by: 4thFloor | February 25, 2010 11:16 AM | Report abuse

Posted by: SkinsneedaGM | February 25, 2010 11:09 AM | Report abuse

That all changed when Zorn came in. It is well known that Collins had serious struggles with the WCO. He still does. The only thing he can do is throw that 1 pass up the middle of the field.

Posted by: PAskinsfan17 | February 25, 2010 11:16 AM | Report abuse

If it's so valuable, then, with Tony Pike being the only quarterback of name throwing, he should be projected ahead of J Claussen and S Bradford, right?
Like I said.
If I'm an NFL general manager, I'm focusing in on multiple video 'cut-ups' of a player performing in plays that are similar to whatever scheme my team runs on both sides of the ball.
'Cut ups' can be broken down to a specific running play--for example--and you can watch a kid run it to see if there is a pattern of strength or weakness to his game.
This works for all positions on the field, btw.
I'd trust it more than a stop watch or bench presses so I can project him into my system or out if it looks like he can't do what my coaches teach at the level of need I want.
There is not one drill that tells you if a guy has the heart to go side line to side line to make plays.
The scope of things the combine is good for is very limited.
Me?: I go to the tape.
Posted by: MistaMoe | February 25, 2010 10:51 AM


Read what I said; It’s not worthless. I never proclaimed it to be the be-all/end-all. You’re the one who said it was worthless. See your 9:30 am post. You say it is worthless and a well hyped tease to get ratings. Then in your 10:51 post you say that “The scope of things the combine is good for is very limited.” Which means that it does have things that are good/not worthless. Which is it? You just arguing to hear yourself talk again? All I’m saying is that it is not worthless. Again, what they get to focus on at the combine is things that you don’t get to see on the game films, which the schools that the players attended usually put together by the way. Especially the interviews. If, at the combine, Pike shows he has all the tools, is healthy, and interviews exceptionally well, then yes he could end up rated higher than Claussen and Bradford (if he already isn’t). I agree that tape is a big part of scouting….duh. And thanks for explaining that it works for all positions. I did not realize that they had game film on players like offensive lineman. I thought it was only QB’s and WR’s…..

Posted by: dlhaze1 | February 25, 2010 11:17 AM | Report abuse

dcsween:

Comments on WALTERFOOTBALL not flattering to CHANCELLOR. Listed as the 22nd best safety, ranked 7th round to undrafted.

Posted by: glawrence007 | February 25, 2010 11:18 AM | Report abuse

zjfr2, the one place that does seem to be chasing free agency rumor (and not the draft, and definitely not the combine) is NLF.com's own Jasno LaCanfora.

Saints have three starter quality OTs, one of whom was injured early allowing for Bushrod to step up from #3 OT to starter. The other two are Jon Stinchcomb (RT) and Jamaal Brown (IR/LT).

Posted by: dcsween | February 25, 2010 11:19 AM | Report abuse

New Orleans. They think they can get someone better than Bushrod with a second-round pick, otherwise they wold have tendered him as a first rounder. Why can't the Redskins?

Posted by: League-Source | February 25, 2010 11:10 AM

You could be right, but the Saints might not be looking at OL, like the Skins will be if they go QB in the first. The Saints are talented in the OL, so they can let a player with starting experience bring in some value for them. Smart on their part. As for the Skins, if Bushrod fits the scheme, then they could have a player with starting experience and NFL training. Now, the question is how much difference will the schemes make? Do the Skins want to train their OLmen up themselves. If all checks out with Allen/Shanahan acquiring Bushrod could be a win for both teams.

Posted by: TWISI | February 25, 2010 11:19 AM | Report abuse

Is it safe to say the Ashburn culture is already dramatically different than in the past?

Posted by: zjfr2 | February 25, 2010 11:12 AM
=============
great observation..
Its the difference between Bruce Allen who seems to not be seeking out the media like the former executive executive executive vice president of player personnel...who constantly needed his ego stroked by the press and his name in the news...

Posted by: SkinsneedaGM | February 25, 2010 11:20 AM | Report abuse

Posted by: digger76 | February 25, 2010 11:15 AM | Report abuse

I'm sorry, did you just lump Elway into the same sentence as Cutler, Plummer, and JC?

Wow......

Plummer doesn't belong in that list either, he was a proven starter who led the Cardinals to the playoffs and beat the Cowboys when AZ was abysmal.

Cutler and JC are comparable from one respect, neither has accomplished much in the NFL although Cutler has had a better statistical season then JC has ever come close to. But neither is a proven winner, or has ever won a playoff game.

Posted by: zjfr2 | February 25, 2010 11:21 AM | Report abuse

New Orleans. They think they can get someone better than Bushrod with a second-round pick, otherwise they wold have tendered him as a first rounder. Why can't the Redskins?

Posted by: League-Source | February 25, 2010 11:10 AM

Or maybe they feel that they have other team needs than keeping a spare LT on the roster and figure that putting a first round tender on him might be too high a price.

Posted by: dcsween | February 25, 2010 11:21 AM | Report abuse

I watched the SB with my wife. When she heard the name Bushrod, she laughed.

Posted by: skinfanman | February 25, 2010 11:22 AM | Report abuse

"Between sharing a few laughs, we (LaCanfora and I) both were busy checking out rumors about a potential Redskins trade that supposedly would send Jason Campbell, a restricted free agent, to the Buffalo Bills for safety Donte Whitner and a draft pick."

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | February 25, 2010 11:27 AM | Report abuse

MrRedskin, is that real or did you just make that up?

Posted by: brownwood26 | February 25, 2010 11:30 AM | Report abuse

That all changed when Zorn came in. It is well known that Collins had serious struggles with the WCO. He still does. The only thing he can do is throw that 1 pass up the middle of the field.

Posted by: PAskinsfan17 | February 25, 2010 11:16 AM
================
At least his passes are beyond 10 yards and accurate..

Having him step into the Giants game for the last 5 plays of the 1st half was the only highlight of that game (except JC's screen pass into the stands..haha).. Collins went 2 for 4 and 57 yards and Davis drops a sure TD. It was like.. for the first time in the game we had a real QB behind center. Then the next and last play of the Half, Zorn made it known he really wanted to be fired....He called the swinging gate play, twice...lmfao...

Posted by: SkinsneedaGM | February 25, 2010 11:31 AM | Report abuse

Beep Beep

Posted by: Flounder21 | February 25, 2010 11:31 AM | Report abuse

MrRedskin, is that real or did you just make that up?

Posted by: brownwood26 | February 25, 2010 11:30 AM |
-----------------------------

It's on the new RI Thread.

Not sure if it's serious or not though.

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | February 25, 2010 11:35 AM | Report abuse

Or maybe they feel that they have other team needs than keeping a spare LT on the roster and figure that putting a first round tender on him might be too high a price.

Posted by: dcsween | February 25, 2010 11:21 AM

We will have first round tenders on Rogers and Campbell, but I'm thinking if someone made a few phone calls they could get them for a lot less. Saints are saying that they don't even hope to get a first for Bushrod.

And, yeah, they've got two others tackles, but this is their depth -- which was essential to their winning the Super Bowl. Don't they want to keep him for at least one more year? They're saying they can get something better with a second -- so can the 'Skins.

If we can trade for him, I'd do it. (Maybe Gregg would like to be reunited with LL?) But I wouldn't give up our second, in this draft, now that Cerrato's not picking.

Posted by: League-Source | February 25, 2010 11:36 AM | Report abuse

Bushrod? Freeney was throwing that dude around like a rag-doll before Freeney's ankle finally gave out. Actually, the Colts win that game going away if Freeney could have played the whole game.

Posted by: coparker5 | February 25, 2010 11:50 AM | Report abuse

"Absolutely impossible to compare what happened in that month with any other time. The team was playing on a completely different level due to the ST circumstances. You're only going to see a team come together and play like that (overachieving) once every few seasons, and Todd was not the reason behind it. He was a part of it, but the team as a whole was playing completely out of their minds.
Posted by: Rypien11"

I guess it depends on who was watching. Here's the sequence of events:
1) Skins lose 3 consecutive games to fall to 5-6.
2) Monday 11-26-07, Taylor is shot. Dies Tuesday morning.
3) Skins lost to Buffalo on last minute FG. Gibbs gaffe.
4) Skins attend Taylor's funeral on Tuesday.
5) Thursday night: Skins play Chicago. Jason Campbell injured, out for season.
6) Collins comes in relief, leads team to victory over Bears.
7) Victory over Giants.
8) Rout of Minnesota
9) Rout of Dallas
10) Playoff loss in Seattle.

You could argue that the best break the Skins got that season was Jason's injury. Zorn made it clear after he was hired that it was Jason's job. Collins was simply too old, and the team had too much invested in their young QB.

Them's the breaks.

Posted by: Samson151 | February 25, 2010 1:06 PM | Report abuse

The comments to this entry are closed.

 
 
RSS Feed
Subscribe to The Post

© 2010 The Washington Post Company