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Coach Joe And The Fans

I know we usually do the awards Friday, but this has been a weird week with the bye and all and not much going on at The Park. Plus, besides you guys, who could honestly deserve multiple TCCLs on a week like this?

So I wanted to take your temperature on something if I could. I'm a little late getting to this - meant to do it early in the week - but, hey, better late than never.

I'll preface this by saying some things, all of which are true. I do not mean to disrespect Coach Joe in any way. I enjoy working with him and covering him and he and his longtime coaches are some of my favorite people at The Park. But when he spends a considerable portion of time following one of the more crucial and distressing defeats of his second coaching tenure worrying about a dozen fans who showed up to send the team off on Friday, does that make any of you want to pluck your eyebrow hairs one-by-one?

I must say the first time he mentioned it, midway through his post-game presser, completely out of the blue, I thought it was maybe a joke. Joe said he had something he had to get off his chest, a big announcement ... I figured he was about to say he was changing QBs; turns out he wanted to give a shout-out to a few diehards (stalkers?) who came out to Ashburn. Joe forgot to stop the team bus to greet them, and urged them all to come back out to Redskins Park to get some free swag.

In that context, minutes after a loss, while being asked to dissect all that is wrong with the Redskins, I was stunned. Then Monday, during Coach's introductory remarks to the press, he repeated the entire spiel, gave us an update on the fans showing up at the Park that day, etc.

What the bleep?

Joe loves his fans, and it's not an act, and I admire him for it. I have seen him literally dive off a podium at training camp to track down some special needs adults and children, personally thank them for coming, shake their hands, make sure they got the autographs they wanted. He takes it very seriously and is the ultimate good-will ambassador for the franchise in every way possible.

But for something like this to be at the forefront of him mind at such a crisis point, frankly, makes me wonder. I don't want to speak for you guys, but I'm guessing that concerns about how the Neglected 12 fared on their return trip to The Park Monday was not the first item on the things-you-want-fixed-in-Ashburn list.

To many, it appears the Redskins are falling apart on both sides of the ball. There are QB issues. Free agent issues. Future draft pick issues. People fretting about why Jason Campbell and Rocky McIntosh and T.J. Duckett aren't playing. The whole scene just seems to odd to me.

Worst of all, I think in some ways it makes Joe come off as a politician, spinning things while the wolves circle and the public starts to pick away at the second Gibbs era. And I don't think that when he says this stuff anything nearly as contrived as some baby-kissing, public-nuisance, PR-trained fraud trying to get into office (sorry about that, but the glut of election ads in NoVa makes me want to vomit). That's not who he is.

But the repeated references to it during this of all weeks was just a little weird, right? Again, not a huge thing, but a topic I thought some might want to discuss. Am I the only one who was taken aback by this?

By Jason La Canfora  |  October 27, 2006; 9:00 AM ET
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What he needs to do is apologize to the fans for the terrible product he puts out on the field.

Posted by: Rob | October 27, 2006 9:15 AM | Report abuse

I think we all were thinking the same thing all freakin week!!

He also said it on the 'Joe Gibbs Show' on XXX, and he prob did it on George Micheal's Show, too (if anyone can verify).

I think this is a high note he is humming on, since we didn't win. If he had won, those fans wouldn't give a bleep(in JLCs words)!!

What can he do for the die hard fans who can't make it to Redskins Park and Boo them when some obvious things need to be changed, like the QB (which I do)?????

Posted by: 4th Floor | October 27, 2006 9:20 AM | Report abuse

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought he was answering a question when he first mentioned it in the post-game. Didn't someone ask him if he had anything to say to the fans?

Yes, it's a little odd to acknowledge the Neglected 12 in the wake of a bad loss. It's probably even more strange that he brought it up again.

Unlike our friend Czabe, I don't think he needs to apologize to the fans for the product on the field. Spurrier used to do that every week and he sounded so stupid. I just want to know that we're in this together, that we have character guys, and that we're fighting our guts out.

Posted by: Joe in Raleigh | October 27, 2006 9:31 AM | Report abuse

Up here, you have to take care of the fans because they take care of you.

Posted by: CMoney | October 27, 2006 9:34 AM | Report abuse

It just seems that Gibbs has put himself in a position that leaves him unable to voice many answers, at the moment.

His OC is handling the offense, the DC is handling the defense, and he's left in the bind of having to show faith in his coaches by not stepping on their respective shows, regardless of what the public thinks. However, I think he also feels obligated to acknowledge the fans' discontent by at least making a show of saying, "yes, we see you, thank you for your support", as Bartles & Jaymes-ish as the message might seem.

Gibbs doesn't strike me as the kind of guy that likes not being able to give a straight up answer. He's been known (at least in his 1st goaround as HC) as the adjustor, the 2nd half planner - he must have an answer, however wrong, ill-planned, or eventually fatal as it must seem to us, the fans. The fact that the team continues to linger at the edge of futility only exacerbates the situation - his tact only seems more egregious in the light of no improvement. He's just put himself in a pickle that requires him to do this little theater of the absurd, trying his best not to fall into either side of a Catch-22.

Posted by: FlimFlam | October 27, 2006 9:38 AM | Report abuse

The thing to remember about Coach Joe is that he is a fundamentalist Christian who believes in a wrathful god that meters our rewards and punishments; consequently, he is very superstitious. I have some of this in my upbringing and I suspect that Joe feels he was punished for not stopping the bus. He is atoning by publicly humbling himself. Let's hope it works.

Posted by: James | October 27, 2006 9:40 AM | Report abuse

I can't hate on Gibbs. I think it was genuine and heartfelt, which is somewhat endearing, and ultimately part of what makes me respect him so much.

Oh yeah, that and the fact that nothing really mindblowing ever comes from his pressers anyway. At least he didn't say they "fought their guts out" to wait for the bus. Wasn't one of our commenters out there that day? I thought I remembered reading a comment about how he felt.

If I thought for a minute he was truly agonizing over this at the expense of the team's well-being, then maybe it would upset me. But I respect Joe and have complete faith in him putting his full efforts and attention into fixing the team.

Hopefully he can do it. HAIL!!

Posted by: Bucktown Skins Fan | October 27, 2006 9:40 AM | Report abuse

I think we're nitpicking here. Gibbs was talking about (paraphrasing) "being 2-5 and trying to figure out how to fix this and that he's looking forward to getting back in front of our fans, that we have the best fans in the world"....and I think that just reminded him about the fans at the park. It's not like it was part of his opening statement.

I admit, it did seem a little politic. But Gibbs is just genuinely appreciative of the support we give the team - especially in the down times.

Posted by: CMoney | October 27, 2006 9:42 AM | Report abuse

I think you are on point FlimFlam. I think the problem these days is all the exposure we have compared to the last go around (internet/24 hour news cycle). 15 yrs ago I wouldn't be spending my day on a Redskin Blog, venting the obvious all day long...........

Posted by: 4th Floor | October 27, 2006 9:42 AM | Report abuse

"besides you guys, who could honestly deserve multiple TCCLs on a week like this?"

Wow, a page out of ol' Joe's playbook JLa? J/K

It did strike me as a bit of a Nero moment. I think it was a genuine, if ill-timed, expression. He is also very superstitious and religuous and I could see him thinking that was bad "karma". (I know it's absurd but he's like that.)

I think Joe's problems are many. Not the least of which is by giving up playcalling he gave up some authority. I don't mean in a real sense but in a way to the players.

Gibbs has always been a better leader and motivator then X and O guy. Not being directly involved in the O's success or failure probably diminishes his influence in a way.

Also, he is not under the same pressure that other coaches are. He can accept all the blaim because he's the "teflon don" for lack of a better term. It doesn't make a difference. He's still Joe Gibbs. I'm not sure that always works in his favor. I also think he doesn't do any favors to his team by getting them off the hook all the time.

Posted by: Skinz | October 27, 2006 9:43 AM | Report abuse

4th Floor,

I watched the George Michael interview on Monday, and there he discussed the fans waiting outside the bus at the hotel in Indy. He did say the same thing (I've got something for ya if ya come down to Ashburn) so I assume it's kind of the same deal.

It'll be interesting to hear what my cohorts have to say regarding this, but, we were some of the folks (stalkers) out in front of the Conrad in Indy. There were...~45 people out there, 1/2 Skins fans. He came up, shook hands, provided an autograph, and expressed his apprecciation to us for making the trip. It was kind of lucky timing, as we had just exited Champps (bloody mary's and eggs benedict, b-fast of champions) across the street and saw the crowd, where upon we jaunted over to JG's exit.

To be honest, he just seems really passionate about this enterprise and extremely distraught about it's failure. I'll try to qoute his interview, it was along the lines of:
I really want to apologize to those fans who made the trip to Indy. I come outta the hotel and there are folks to see us off. I mean, we're 2-4! I don't think there is another franchise in the country with fans like that...yada yada...The fans are who I feel terrible for. These folks have no control over what's happening. They're doing their part.

With that said, I do not want him focused on the fans! Worry about the friggin O-line or something. Give Chris Samuels a reason not to get pancaked for the 50th time next week!



Posted by: Pub Golf | October 27, 2006 9:44 AM | Report abuse

Good morning JLC.

"But the repeated references to it during this of all weeks was just a little weird, right"?

Understatement of the week my friend. It was more than just a little weird.

Posted by: jm220 | October 27, 2006 9:45 AM | Report abuse

JLC, great blogs this week. Just balling this week. This is what we hope for, incredible knowledge.

As to this forgotten fans issue, I think people are completely over-analyzing and over-reacting to it. This type of thing is right up 'The Czabe's' alley. We are sensationalizing this into a mega-issue when to me, there really isnt' anything there.

What would you guys have him do at a press conference? Start going into reasons why the team is bad? Think about the guys that have done that: Jim 'Playoffs' Mora and think about where they are now. We are so lucky that we don't have a guy like that. Someone that will roll his players under a bus. He knows we're bad. That man has forgotten more football than everyone on this blog combined and then sqaured.

People might jump on me for this but I for one am incredibly thankful that we don't have one of those recycled NFL coaches who fly off the handle (Dennis Green etc.) and rip guys in public. You had better believe that nice man public routine goes right out the window behind closed doors. That man is a BA (Bad A$$) and what he shows us does not for one second reflect the kind of discipline and toughness that he shows the players. That is why every team he has ever had has gone to war for him. Its why when you could keep 80 guys active, player # 80 felt like he was part of something even if his job was to get beaten up in practice.

I remember a story from my youth. Some guys were booing Rypien in pre-game warmups and JJG went over to them and looked them in the eye and said: "Are you with us?"

The men hung their heads and said: 'yes coach'.

JJG says: "Good. Because we are going to need you today".

It was the sense of duty that brought him back to DC in the first place. It's not some hokey song and dance. It broke his heart to watch the 13 years of ineptitude and futility and it drove him to come back for us. For us people. Take a step back and look around the league. Would you really rather have some hyped coordinating chooch off the Parcells/Belichik coaching tree screaming his head off at pressers for a soundbite to get ripped by 'the Czabe' leading to him getting fired in a year?

I know you guys are gonna scream about him telling you what you think you already know but that is not how he rolls. He is too good a man for that. This issue needs to be dropped and we are so lucky to have a guy that actually remembers that this team belongs to the people that support it.


PS, I met Gary Clark on Wednesday and he said to tell all of you hello.

Posted by: ArtMonkToTheSticks | October 27, 2006 9:48 AM | Report abuse

This entire mess would be easier to swallow if:

-We had a promising young quarterback playing and developing (i.e. Eli Manning, Philip Rivers)

-The team played smart aggressive football and didn't lead the league in penalties

- The team keeps it's few young players that actually develop into quality players instead of letting them go (i.e. Pierce, Clarke, Smoot)

- Build the team through the draft and quit acquiring over-paid free agents

- Quit letting go the draft picks (i.e. TJ Ducket)

How about doing those things for the entire Redskin nation?

Posted by: ez e | October 27, 2006 9:49 AM | Report abuse

I wish we had a real coach who could gain public respect by telling it like it is. Like Dennie Green.

Posted by: MezzySnare | October 27, 2006 9:57 AM | Report abuse


Very well said and all of us love the Coach. But you have to admit it was a little wierd.

And I would love to see Coach Joe just once go D Green.

"We are not what we thought we were damn it!" But we are in this together. lol

Posted by: jm220 | October 27, 2006 10:00 AM | Report abuse

It doesn't bother me at all. When you trot out a 2-5 team who gets manhandled in the second half you should acknowledge the few who came out to support you. Maybe he went overboard in the multiple apologies, but hey, at least you know he means well.

Like Flimflam said, he's not calling the plays on O or D. He's more of an ambassador for the team, really. And so he needs to make sure he can help in any way he can and that means fixing a slight to the fans.

Posted by: Posse Redux | October 27, 2006 10:01 AM | Report abuse

Mezzy, that was either incredible sarcasm or stunning opinion. Either way, good show sir.

Posted by: ArtMonkToTheSticks | October 27, 2006 10:02 AM | Report abuse

give chris cooley the ball more= better production by offense. Why let Al Saunders call the plays let the old ball coach call the plays again like last year a 10-6 team to a 6-10 team thats what al saunders is doing

Posted by: julian | October 27, 2006 10:03 AM | Report abuse

Right on AATTS! I think JG is committed to winning wherever he goes (eg NASCAR after JG v1.0) and desperately wants to put a winner together here again.

Posted by: PiggyB | October 27, 2006 10:04 AM | Report abuse

If games were only 1 half long the redskins would be 7-0

Posted by: Julian | October 27, 2006 10:05 AM | Report abuse

I guess I shouldn't find it surprising that in this fast paced world of constant media and high-tech, faceless communication via the internet, that people actual fault a coach for being genuine and caring about the fans.

Gibbs didn't come back to D.C. because he needed the money or had to prove himself. He came back because of the fans; to give the fans something to cheer about again. It isn't about winning a championship just to win a championship. It's about winning for the fans of D.C.

Posted by: QFB | October 27, 2006 10:05 AM | Report abuse

we should have kept lavar hes prone to injuries but he is a great run stopper

Posted by: julian | October 27, 2006 10:08 AM | Report abuse

CMoney, are you out there??

What happened to the Office website you sent the other day? Needed a Michael Scott fix since last night was a re-run.

The website is trying to get me to play backgammon.

Posted by: Joe in Raleigh | October 27, 2006 10:10 AM | Report abuse


I do not believe anyone is faulting the coach. (or at least I am not just having a little fun on a bye week)

To say that it was a little weird is just being honest. And we all know he is genuine and cares about the fans. That's why we love him so.

Posted by: jm220 | October 27, 2006 10:11 AM | Report abuse

Amen, ez e and AMTTS.

Posted by: skinswest | October 27, 2006 10:11 AM | Report abuse

I don't really think Joe thought he would go to hell if he didn't say something to those fans, that's silly. :) I think he was just trying to save face because he know's we're all mad at the Redskins right now.

I watched the whole game because I thought just maybe JC would FINALLY get into the game. Nope, disappointed yet again. Then after the game I quickly turned it to the post game press conference because I wanted answers like everyone else. What does he do? He talks about the wonderful job Brunell did and a hand full of fans seeing them off?

Give me a break Joe.

Personally speaking I think Joe has been hanging around Dan Snyder too much.

I don't recall Gibbs getting into the HOF for his GMing abilities. He should be stripped of his GMing or else be fired like Holmgren was threatened in Seattle. Then he should take over the reigns on offense, get rid of Saunders, and tell Snyder to hire a REAL GM instead of playing fantasy football every year.

For God's sake, they were one game away from the Super Bowl last year! Why so much of an overhaul? Add a few pieces on offense and keep the guys you have on defense on go with it. If R.Thomas stays healthy they may have actually went instead of Seattle!

Instead they let go all of the guys they DRAFTED who actually wanted to play(Clark, Pierce, Smoot, to name a few) and add these bums who only want to come here to get paid.

What's the big deal on not paying the guys who want to be here and play for these losers who only want to get paid? All of those guys wanted to stay but nooooo, Snyder can't have that. He has to play fantasy football every year!

You can say what you want about Smoot and the "love boat" all you want, but he is a solid corner in the NFL. Better then what we have.

What kills me is the ONE year they don't bring in all these dudes they go 10-6 and make the playoffs. Crazy isn't it?

I hope Joe is thinking about all of this right now. He's being stubborn on Brunell, his skills are rapidly deteriorating and the offense is inconsistent because of that. What's crazy is even Theismann said this about himself when he was QB in Washington and we saw how they had to take him out. John Hall ring a bell?

We had a really good team last year who was actually learning how to win and now this. Joe I'll always love you for the memories but your really blowing it right now.

Posted by: Ray | October 27, 2006 10:11 AM | Report abuse

I remember it like yesterday. It was a wednesday. I am at MCCXXIII backing down Remy after Remy after Remy (with ice on the side). Then, all of a sudden I see across bototm of the screen Joe Gibbs is back. That was the Happiest day of my life. I jumped around and did the hammer dance in the street all types of crazy things once I got home. It was unbelievable.

That being said, I put too much emotion in this dag-gone team. When I am high, I am HIGH. When I am low (o the team), I am ridicously low.

My name is 4th, and I am a Redskinholic. I am 15mins sober..........

Posted by: 4th Floor | October 27, 2006 10:12 AM | Report abuse

folks- let's just "stay the course" with the skins, everything will turn out ok.

Posted by: w | October 27, 2006 10:12 AM | Report abuse

I am not concerned that Joe Gibbs is going out of his way for a few fans. I am more concerned with people trying to deflect the fault of the disasterous season the Redskins are having away from Gibbs. Everything on the field, including the coaches, is a Joe Gibbs' production. It was not caused by Dan Snyder. Gibbs has done great things for the Redskins, but we all need to recognize that this 2-5 season is Gibbs' responsibility.

Posted by: Ted from Raleigh | October 27, 2006 10:14 AM | Report abuse

I think FlimFlam's original point is the best one: As CEO, Gibbs is like those old EAS (?) commericials. ("We don't make the product you buy, we make them better.") Gibbs' experience, etc, was supposed to add that something to make Saunders' and Grilliams' product better. And Gibbs feels awful that it hasn't, so he feels the constant need to apologize to his consumers, but he can't go beyond basically doing that without undermining his employees and a product he doesn't make.

Posted by: HaikuMan | October 27, 2006 10:14 AM | Report abuse

Joe is a good coach but he is still the Man in charge. As the man in charge he needs to admit mistakes and try to correct them. The OC with the 700 page playbook is not making it happen. Make a change in call playing or go with A QB that knows the system, at least he doesn't have a learning curve and we might be better off having success with a person who knows how to run the offense. The current QB, when hurt doesn't play well, just look at his history.

Changes, we have a running back that is healthy and has been sucessful. The team gave up a lot to get him, why not try something different and use him in a two back offense?

The defense is banged up and has a history of getting burned bad when Springs and Rogers are not playing. Progress is making changes, staying the course has given us a 2-4 record.
JOE, I love but make some changes and if you love the fans than do more then just say I see you and appreciate you. SHOW IT, DO something!!!
As leader of the pack, DO something, Doing nothing but thanking the fans is not good enough. Loyality to a players is nice but it does not win games, make changes, try Collins.

Posted by: rbk | October 27, 2006 10:14 AM | Report abuse

Gotta say I didnt think it was weird at all... what i think is weird, is people who think what JJG said was weird.

I hate losing, I hate it more than anything in the world... but to see Gibbs acknowledge "the best fans in the world" when he accidentally "blew" them off, man that makes me smile. Gibbs should be commended for his love of the fans, not criticized. And if anyone honestly believes that any of what Gibbs said was contrived then you are dead wrong.

Posted by: Inigo Montoya | October 27, 2006 10:14 AM | Report abuse

I dunno about you guys, but being a season ticket holder, Gibbs actually called me and apologized over the phone for not stopping the bus for those 12 fans, even though I wasn't even there. I'm sure the NSA has a transcript of the conversation stored away somewhere.

Posted by: Chief Clancy Wiggum | October 27, 2006 10:17 AM | Report abuse

man i'm stuck in such a dilemma. i want to beat the cowboys so bad and brunell probably gives us teh best chance to win. but say we do beat the cowboys then gibbs will have a reason to stick with brunell for the future. i mean if we have a legitimate shot to make the playoffs, i'm all for brunell being in there. but i say chances are we hit our 7th loss well before we get to our 6th win.

anyways say gibbs were to leave at the end of the year who do you think would be our next head coach??

Posted by: poop | October 27, 2006 10:17 AM | Report abuse

OK, this has nothing to do with Gibbs and his apologies to the fans etc; I'm with AM2TS on that one.

This is about more stupid stats; if you don't like 'em, you can skip it. And it's not any great revelation anywhoos, but good teams win at home right? Well, some of them do, home-field advantage is supposed to mean a lot in football, and I thought--even though we haven't been all that good lately--we'd still be a lot better than we are at FedBleX.

The following is broken down by the team's record at home, as played in their current stadium. I think these stats are through last year--not sure on that one though--I ripped them off, so we'll have to trust that they are accurate.

You'll notice they are 33 teams, why? Because I went and dug up the Skins record at RFK, and this would be utterly meaningless without it.

Here it is, home field win-loss broken down by team:

Team W L T %
1: NewEngland Patriots 28 7 0 0.800
2: Denver Broncos 34 9 0 0.791
3: KansasCity Chiefs 92 31 0 0.748
4: Seattle Seahawks 26 9 0 0.743
5: GreenBay Packers 81 30 0 0.730
6: Pittsburgh Steelers 31 11 1 0.721
7: SanFrancisco 49ers 86 38 0 0.694
8: Minnesota Vikings 84 39 0 0.683
9: Dallas Cowboys 83 40 0 0.675
10: Baltimore Ravens 45 22 0 0.672
11: Philadelphia Eagles 18 9 0 0.667
12: TampaBay Buccaneers 45 23 0 0.662
13: Miami Dolphins 80 43 0 0.650
14: Jacksonville Jaguars 58 33 0 0.637
15: Redskins RFK 173 101 3 0.631
16: Tennessee Titans 36 22 0 0.621
17: St.Louis Rams 53 34 0 0.609
18: Buffalo Bills 107 72 0 0.598
19: Indianapolis Colts 71 53 0 0.573
20: Chicago Bears 65 50 0 0.565
21: Atlanta Falcons 65 51 0 0.560
22: NewYork Giants 68 55 0 0.553
23: Washington Redskins 41 33 1 0.547
24: SanDiego Chargers 63 58 0 0.521
25: Oakland Raiders 47 44 0 0.516
26: Carolina Panthers 42 41 0 0.506
27: Cincinnati Bengals 25 26 0 0.490
28: NewOrleans Saints 56 59 0 0.487
29: NewYork Jets 55 61 0 0.474
30: Detroit Lions 15 20 0 0.429
31: Houston Texans 12 24 0 0.333
32: Cleveland Browns 18 41 0 0.305
33: Arizona Cardinals 1 3 0 0.250

Yes this doesn't really mean anything, yes they are just stupid statistics, but still--I loved RFK.

Joe Theismann: "I've only felt the earth shake in one stadium,I feel so lucky to have played there."

Posted by: Megskin | October 27, 2006 10:19 AM | Report abuse

I agree this "stay the course" plan is not working. Take a chance Joe, make some changes, and see what players are going to step up. It is so painful hearing the same old excuses each game. We all know Brunell is not the future of the team- make the change and atleast give us some hope.

Posted by: Richard Cranium | October 27, 2006 10:19 AM | Report abuse

Gibbs post game comments are a literal waste of time, so it really does not matter that he mentioned the folks they ran over on the way out. They ran over people leaving the locker room too. he was probably more upset it was only a few folks vs. it being more. Just as he always says he has to see the tape before he assesses people. Gibbs, you are a professional football coach. there are things i can see watching from my TV. you should have a solid general assessement at the end of the game on players and positions. if you see you safety making mos of the tackles, you should know you have problems with run defense, ETc.

Posted by: late on this one Post | October 27, 2006 10:25 AM | Report abuse

The fan comments are a little bizarre. It obviously means a lot to him, though mistimed. He does seem distraught. There are a lot of problems: turnover of players and injury on defense, over coaching. Not the least of the glaring obvious differences from last year is the new offense and turning over the play calling. They made their bed with these decisions. The Chiefs broke out in week 8 with Al Saunders and were very good on offense the second year. They have to hope for the same kind of results. Brunell does not seem comfortable with it (plus he's hurt) and will probably not be around next year. For now they have to weather it. Joe is in unfamiliar territory himself and he is still finding his groove. He did have his groove last year though and he lost it when he changed his approach. This could be good news for people like me stuck in the cheap seats.

Posted by: Section 418 | October 27, 2006 10:27 AM | Report abuse

I'm still just thrilled to have Coach Gibbs back...he loves the fans I too believe the fans are the only reason he came back. He just loves the redskins.

I'm not a doom and gloomer. Never have been, never will be. I think this team is much closer to being great than being horrible. The D problems are fixable, just like the O problems.

I might be late with this, but I'm a pretty big fan of Andre the Giant, so I thought I would start the day by sharing some of the weird info. on him that I've learned this morning. Did you know that the Andre the Giant movie is set to release around 2007? Did you know that when Andre was touring in Japan with WWF he couldn't fit into any of the bathrooms, so he would crap on news paper on his bed......then trick Hulk Hogan every time into looking at it? Did you know that Andre was offered a contract with the Redskins in 1974, but turned it down to wrestle? Did you know that Andre grew up on a small farm in rural France, and didn't fit on the bus, so he had to be driven to school?>>>>>>>Did you know who drove Andre to school? I'll tell you. His parents had no car. He had no family in the area. His next door neighbor drove Andre to school every day. Andre the Giant's neighbor happened to be 2 time Nobel Prize winning Irish novelist and playwrite, Samuel Beckett. Can you imagine it? Beckett is putting the final touches on Endgame or Waiting for Godot or Proust, and little Andre shows up. Heyyyyyyy Misterrrrrr Becckeeeettttttt!

Posted by: WrongDog | October 27, 2006 10:32 AM | Report abuse

Ahhh, my favorite breakfast: Megs & Eggs...
Old St. Joe is rambling like an old Grand Pa who can't figure out the remote control.
Time for a change. Hopefully the old boy can finish the season on a respectable note and leave with his legacy of three super bowl wins and not the Brunell years.

Posted by: Bob-Ashburn, VA. | October 27, 2006 10:34 AM | Report abuse

Late --

Gibbs is NEVER going to call out players or even units as performing poorly in his press conferences. Get over it. He has never been that type of coach and he never will be. It is all about the TEAM winning and losing together. And it is all about Gibbs taking all the blame. His players and assistant coaches respect him immensely for it, which is just one of the many many reasons he has been so successful as a head coach. So, yes, his pressers will be boring and uneventful. Because, with Gibbs, it's all about cultivating the ideal environment to produce wins; not giving a YouTube tirade clip throwing his team under the bus.

Posted by: CMoney | October 27, 2006 10:35 AM | Report abuse

What does TCCL stand for?

Posted by: dsmac | October 27, 2006 10:40 AM | Report abuse

CMoney, that's all well and good, but what about the Office website?! Where did it go?

Posted by: Joe in Raleigh | October 27, 2006 10:42 AM | Report abuse

Everybody worrying over what Gibbs is saying needs to shake themselves. He has one goal - keep the team together and if possible keep the fans behind them. Giving a rational and lucid analysis of the last few games would be extremely counterproductive. What do you want him to say - "Our free agents are playing awful, the defense can't stop anybody, there's no pass rush, O-line not blocking, Brunnell looks slow, indecisive, and limp armed,...." All great points, but that just starts divisions within the team. So, we're left with: "they're fightin' their guts out", "I want to thank all the fans who showed up." blah blah blah. What else can he say? What would you say in his position?

Posted by: fred | October 27, 2006 10:42 AM | Report abuse

Joe --

I did the EXACT same thing this morning and was pissed to see the website was down. NBC probably pulled the plug. Effin copyright laws.

I had missed the season premier, so last night was a new episode for me. Unbelievable. Made it into my top 5. Right up there with "Basketball" and "Dwight's Acceptance Speech".

I'm sure the streams will pop up somewhere else on the web, and I'll post if I find them.

Posted by: CMoney | October 27, 2006 10:42 AM | Report abuse

Andre the Giant's neighbor happened to be 2 time Nobel Prize winning Irish novelist and playwrite, Samuel Beckett. Can you imagine it? Beckett is putting the final touches on Endgame or Waiting for Godot or Proust, and little Andre shows up. Heyyyyyyy Misterrrrrr Becckeeeettttttt!

No wonder Godot never showed up. And to think, all this time we thought the play actually had some sort of existentialist meaning, when really it's all Andre's fault. Poor Sam, must have been scared out of his pants.

Posted by: Megskin | October 27, 2006 10:45 AM | Report abuse

Drop that knowledge, if you find it. As for the issue of Gibbs and his presser, at least we can put this topic to bed. That's what she said. Or he said.

Posted by: Joe in Raleigh | October 27, 2006 10:46 AM | Report abuse

Although ArtMonk made some good points, we simply can not deify Gibbs after the last two and half years.

Not unlike any other lifelong Skins fan, I was beyond excited when Gibbs decided to come back. St. Joe was going to ride in on the white horse and save a misguided, struggling for respect franchise. Two and a half years later, not much as changed, if anything we are worse off.

Although there have been some credible personnel moves, like Portis, Griffin, and Moss. It is not Brunell, because Gibbs obviously wanted a vet to run things, while grooming a younger one. Seems logical enough.

No one questions his ability to lead, inspire, and coach. Evaluating talent, and determing team needs, requires not only aptitude, but experience. Which he has little, if any.

The inability to assess defensive needs and the decision to target inferior players, whose own teams think so little of, they are willing to let go is most annoying. Gibbs, with all of his autonomy, has paniced, overpaid, and pissed away enough draft picks to choke a horse. How can you remain competitive year in, year out, with no picks, an aging roster, and players who are barely tradeable.

Gibbs, the GM, has been a collosal failure. It reminds me of when Michael Jordan tried to run the Wizards. Great player, bad executive. Tactical and managerial success are different mindsets.

I want to remember Gibbs as an innovative and successful, multiple Super Bowl winning coach, not the floudering, out of touch version we have before us.

Posted by: Kevin K | October 27, 2006 10:46 AM | Report abuse

What does TCCL stand for?

Check the FAQ...under 'Meg Rules!!' Last post on the insider.

Posted by: Megskin | October 27, 2006 10:49 AM | Report abuse

CMoney, I agree. I love Gibbs for two reasons... well actually three.

1. 3 SB rings, even though I was too young to appreciate and black out to them.

2. he just an amazing person... I don't think anyone can argue this. I was with PG in Indy this weekend and I was blown away by his kindness and flat out willingness to be accessible to the fans 4 hours before a HUGE game

3. like you said, he refuses to call out his players and handles everything internally. do I get frustrated with his pressers, yes. do we go crazy over his quotes, yes. but that is definitely the kind of coach I'd like to play for, that's for sure.

What concerns me about Gibbs, and many of you have said this, but he looks lost. He is out of touch with football in the 21st century, he's out of touch with the players and millionaire ego maniacs he has to deal with (despite dealing with Riggo, etc back in the day), and he has no clue how to handle the salary cap, draft, and personnel moves.

From day 1 after last season, I said keep the same team, keep the same system just add another WR, and we're set. But then free agency-palooza happened, Al Saunders happened, etc. There is no way to change all of that now. But from here I think he needs to do the following:

a. hire a real GM and let Vinny and his "don't worry, I have a plan" butt go work at the racquetball club.

b. go back to calling the plays and fire Saunders or just go ahead and let him call the plays without interference... AND with the QB of his choice (ideally Campbell since we gave away too much to get him)

c. treat the remainder of this season as early "pre-season" for '07. Obviously I want to try to win, but who wants to run out the string with MB then throw Campbell to the wolves in games 1-7 next year and be sitting at 2-5 again? UH, no one.

Posted by: Ricky Bobby | October 27, 2006 10:52 AM | Report abuse

"t was the sense of duty that brought him back to DC in the first place. It's not some hokey song and dance."

Yeah, I'm sure the $6 million a year had nothing to do with it.

Posted by: kovachs | October 27, 2006 10:54 AM | Report abuse

As a fan, I really wouldn't care if he brushed me off, as long as he was putting a consistently good product on the field every week - which he's not. I don't know what he's doing. Frankly, he's been looking pretty lost out there on the sidelines during games, like he's watching a train wreck and wondering, "What went wrong?"

Personally, Gibbs might be better off if he relinquished his head coach and GM duties and just became the full-time team president. Hire a good GM, promote one of your many assistants (I guess that would be Grilliams, with the way his deal is set up), and be the goodwill ambassador for the team, which lately is the only thing he has managed to do well. The problem with him playing goodwill ambassador at this point is this: As the coach, it makes him look weak and unfocused, like he's looking to focus on anything except how his team is doing.

Posted by: bandwagon blues | October 27, 2006 10:55 AM | Report abuse

Obviously I want to try to win, but who wants to run out the string with MB then throw Campbell to the wolves in games 1-7 next year and be sitting at 2-5 again? UH, no one.

Right. Barring some sort of Hammer of God miracle we are not going to the playoffs this year--and even if we do, we don't have the defense to make it to the Super Bowl. Next year Brunell is going to be 37, is Gibbs planning on starting him again? If he's planning on starting JC then we're going to go through a rough acclimation period, why? Because he didn't play him this year!

Start JC--he is the savior

Not really, but it sounded good.

Posted by: Megskin | October 27, 2006 10:59 AM | Report abuse

Ricky Bobby and Megskin I co - sign. (as I a sure everyone knows I been calling for Campbell since day one)But it's going to take Brunell to get hurt for him to be benched.

Posted by: jm220 | October 27, 2006 11:03 AM | Report abuse

Joe's comments after the loss last week and at his Monday presser on the few fans was nice and real, but for the love of GOD could you please focus on this disaster you have created! This team has become the laughing stock of the league and the example of HOW NOT TO RUN AN ORGANIZATION!! We have no draft picks, live in cap hell, and are in unbelievable need of a REAL GM. We let our own "REAL TALENT" leave to overpay underachieving players who do not blend in and refuse to play our own drafted players. It's time for Joe to take a real hard look at himself and how he has this whole operation set up. It would be nice to see him hire a real GM and stay out of the way and focus on what got him into the Hall of Fame..... Coaching!!!

Posted by: It's All Over Now... | October 27, 2006 11:03 AM | Report abuse

Seriously, just shoot me...we have turned into the Washington Bengals. Maybe we should bring Norv Turner back? At least he had the heart to make a change to Ferotte and concentrate on what matters during the week - not the choir band or any of the "expert" prostitutes who sway with each current or change of the wind. I have always stuck with Joe, but this episode leads one to think the guy has lost his mind. Screw the fans, play football & get your house in order - ya know?

Posted by: BigPERM | October 27, 2006 11:04 AM | Report abuse

Megs, I agree, but let's wait two more games. Watching how the cowboys and eagles are self destructing, we could go 9-7 and take the division!

Posted by: Bob-Ashburn, VA. | October 27, 2006 11:05 AM | Report abuse


Messing with my team is like messing with my emotion. (sorry couldn't pass that one up loved the movie)

Posted by: jm220 | October 27, 2006 11:06 AM | Report abuse

Megs, I agree, but let's wait two more games.


We need someone (LT maybe) to pull a Nancy Kerrigan on him, like now!

Posted by: Megskin | October 27, 2006 11:08 AM | Report abuse


We need someone (LT maybe) to pull a Nancy Kerrigan on him, like now!

Megskin you are a woman after my own heart. Love it!

Posted by: jm220 | October 27, 2006 11:09 AM | Report abuse

jason, i was just out doing something and i was thinking "what's joe doing now on this team?" he's not coaching anyone anymore. saunders doing that now. so is he the gm? nope. vinny and the scouts look for "talent" and brings to joe's attention.

so joe really doesn't have anything to do. so he has time to remember this kind of stuff. no games to plan for, just be the "gm" or the "president" of the team. and to the president of the team this stuff matters.

the last two years i've only seen one joe coached team come out flat and it was against the giants. never before and never after.

this year however...they've come out flat in every single game except the jax game.

so i don't think joe is coaching this team anymore. if you want to argue that point with me then tell me what he's coaching? and i really believe that there is a 5-10% chance that fisher rumors might be true.

and i still think that he and snyder had a private talk this offseason...telling snyder "look, i need help. my family's worried about my health. i just can't do all three duties anymore. let me hire someone to take over the offense. and i'll over see the whole operation."

anyways...sorry not much time to play around today.

hello, regulars. and good work meg. that statistic is more disturbing than any i've seen so far. because it's a reflection of us as fans. then's the chicken and egg arguement. maybe if we had a dominant team at fedex we'd cheer louder, harder. don't know.

Posted by: dealer | October 27, 2006 11:09 AM | Report abuse

Give me a break!! Gibbs apologies to the fans and takes heart to those that showed up in Ashburn. How about apologizing to the fans about the stupidity of his team. Case in points: Derrick Frost, Randle El, Santa Moss, Casey Rabach, etc. etc. etc. How is he going to fix all the stupid penalties this team racks up per game? When is he going to stop making excuses for his "character guys" and making them accountable for their actions? Danny-boy, are you feelin' me??

Posted by: fed up in SD | October 27, 2006 11:10 AM | Report abuse

oh, one more point. Gibbs needs to understand that in today's NFL most rookies start playing immediately. I could understand and accept the philosphy of no rookies, only vets if we were 5-2, but we're 2-5. Can it get any worse by playing these guys? Not in my mind.

Please play Rocky and JC... please.

Posted by: Ricky Bobby | October 27, 2006 11:11 AM | Report abuse

We need someone (LT maybe) to pull a Nancy Kerrigan on him, like now!???????
Megs, you just made me choke on my lunch...that was funny.

Posted by: Bob-Ashburn, VA. | October 27, 2006 11:12 AM | Report abuse

I don't mean to hijack this thread, but this has been a topic of discussion here and this is the most detailed explanation I have read, albiet from a Denver Bronco's perspective.

From the Rocky Mountain News:

The three Rs -- Redskins, rookie and running backs
Wednesday, October 25 at 12:01 AM | Trackbacks
Nate Strauch leads it off . . .

Q: With eight of their remaining nine games against winning teams, the Redskins are very likely to end up with one of the five worst records in the NFL. My understanding of the (Ashley) Lelie trade was that (the Broncos) flop first-round picks with the Redskins, unless Washington has a better record, which the Redskins clearly won't. When I Googled the trade to find out the exact details, you came up as an individual who perhaps understood it better than anyone, so my question to you is this: Are the Broncos looking at the possibility of a top-five draft pick or, was there a protection against that kind of thing built into the trade?

A: It's a complicated deal with a lot of unknowns because it isn't finalized until both teams have finished their seasons.

And a lot of folks, at least 10 or so, were still asking about this . . . so we aim to serve. Here's what I put in last week. It's everything I know at this point . . .

Contrary to what you've seen elsewhere, there is only one scenario where the Broncos get only one of Washington's draft picks in that deal. The rest of the scenarios call for the Broncos to receive two picks.

The best scenario, in the Broncos minds, would be if -- again this is just a general approximation at this point -- Denver finished as one of the Super Bowl teams in the draft order (Nos. 31 or 32 in the first round) and Washington was the last team to make the playoffs (No. 20 in the first round).

That kind of finish would mean the Broncos and Redskins would simply flip-flop No. 1 picks, a coup for the Broncos since Lelie had made it clear he wasn't going to report to the Broncos and Duckett isn't getting much playing time

But if the Broncos finish too far in front of the Redskins in terms of record, the Broncos get Washington's third-round pick in the 2007 draft and fourth in '08 (the Redskins don't have a four in the '07 draft, so that's why the second pick is in '08).

Those are the two picks the Broncos would also get if they finish too close to the Redskins as well -- likely within two or three draft positions.

There are also a few scenarios where the Broncos and Redskins flip flop their No. 1 picks and the Broncos also get Washington's third-round in the '07 draft OR the Redskins' fourth-round pick in '08.

Again, there have been a lot of reports out there the Broncos would get only the third-round pick in some scenarios. That simply isn't true. The only scenario where the Broncos get one draft pick in the deal is if they move up as far as the deal allows in the first round. Then the two teams flip-flop the No. 1 picks, and the deal is done.

But overall the deal, which was put together by Broncos management, is certainly creative. It is all based on a points system on the two teams' finishes and was a new enough approach that the league initially did a double take with it before approving it.

So, in short, fans hoping for the best move in the first round for the Broncos should want the Broncos in the Super Bowl and the Redskins to just sneak into the playoffs.

Posted by: Anonymous | October 27, 2006 11:19 AM | Report abuse

Jason, for the first time ever, I have to seriously disagree with you. I can't believe that after being a sports reporter and a damn good one for so long, you still don't get this.

Coach Gibbs loves the fans, and this city, more than he loves anything but his family and his God. He loves this place more than any other coach in the NFL loves their place of work (with the possible exception of Cowher in Pittsburgh). And acknowledging them at a point like this, in a season like this, only shows that this is what's on his mind every day of the job.

When Gibbs leads a team that's losing, you can see the pain writ large on that craggy old face. He's not Nick Saban, thinking about which panama hat he should buy next. He's not Jeff Fisher, trying to decide which job he should take after the season. When he loses, Gibbs doesn't feel like he's just a losing coach - he feels like he's betrayed the hopes and dreams of an entire city, a fanbase he loves like a family member.

And, to some extent, he's right. For true fans, a Redskin win or loss means a ruined week or a great week. They take it personally enough to show up at the Park at ridiculous hours just to show support - and Joe's appreciation of it isn't something that we ought to mock. It's a vestige of the way the NFL used to be.

Coach Gibbs had enough money. He had enough fame. He came back because he loves this place, the fans, the people. That's the kind of sentiment we should honor and respect, not mock.

Posted by: Ben D | October 27, 2006 11:22 AM | Report abuse

Please have the Kahuna's to sign your name next time Bronco-lovin' Bee-Autch!

Posted by: Bob-Ashburn, VA. | October 27, 2006 11:23 AM | Report abuse

Ricky Bobby is on point. The upper echelon of the NFL, the Patriots, Eagles, Bears, to name a few, do it the right way.
They all have a top notch front office, with first rate talent evaluators. They value draft picks like gold. They do not include them in player acquistions, rather try to acquire more for the future. They integrate rookies with a veteran presence. They allow them to grow together, and build a program. We have no continuity, or apparent plan for the future. It is live today, spend today, worry about tomorrow, later. That lack of vision is what will ultimately mark us as either the next Bengals or 49ers label. Sadly, it is probably going to get a lot worse, before someone, has an epiphany, and realizes that we have to rebuild, restock, rethink, how things are done.

Posted by: Kevin K | October 27, 2006 11:26 AM | Report abuse

Whoever posted the article on the Duckett deal just made me barf in my mouth. Of all the ridiculous moves we've made and the millions of dollars we've thrown away, this move makes me the sickest. We are literally screwing ourselves for years to come with every move that we make.

Posted by: Ricky Bobby | October 27, 2006 11:28 AM | Report abuse

Ben --


Posted by: CMoney | October 27, 2006 11:31 AM | Report abuse

...Coach Gibbs had enough money...
ben, could you also tell santa that i want a canon 500mm IS L this year!!! i'd been writing him for the past couple o years and i just don't think he knows i got 'enuff socks and ties and hoodies.

honestly, sincerely, i'm envious of your faith.

Posted by: dealer | October 27, 2006 11:33 AM | Report abuse

I guess he comes from the school of thought if you don't have something nice to say don't say anything at all. And given the preformace the past few weeks I'm sure he doesn't have many positive things to say about the team.

The fans have been fighting there guts out.

Posted by: dc | October 27, 2006 11:33 AM | Report abuse

Gibbs just needs to coach. He's thinking too much...he's babying the players too much...get on their millionare dollar a*#es!! The penalties we've been having were not tolerated when Gibbs first came back..what happened? On another note..the defense. The way we let good, quality defensive players walk out of here year after year - who's to say they won't do that to this years quality product (though there are none). Show some respect to those who play there hearts out...don't let them walk out the door and then sign a guy b/c his stats seem attractive. The owner...I dunno...I feel this franchise is doomed due to poor decision making. VERY POOR decision making. I could go on and on on those decisions but they're covered every day in this blog..we all know what they are. Jason..looking forward to your article this weekend. Everyone else..sorry had to vent..this team frustrates the bleep out of me.

Posted by: Jesse | October 27, 2006 11:35 AM | Report abuse

Kevin K, great post.

The saddest reality is that the blue print for success isn't some mad scientist secret that's kept under lock and key. Like you said, all the Skins have to do is look at Philly, NE, Pitt, and every other winning team.

Copy those teams. PLEASE.

But what do we insist on doing? How about the complete opposite of what the blue print for success says you should do. You know what I call that? One, stupidity. Two, stubborness. Admit you were wrong and that YOUR way of doing it is flat out wrong. Please. I don't care if it takes 2 years to correct it... just do it, because I honestly can't go into every offseason figuring out how we're going to get within 2 dollars of the cap, trade all of our draft picks, just to finish 5-11.

Posted by: Ricky Bobby | October 27, 2006 11:39 AM | Report abuse

Just switched on 980 to see what crap BMitch was talking about and was pleasantly surprised. Supposedly he is on vacation. He needs to get back quick, because Mark Stern is going to Wally Pip his arse. Stern is bringing it today and is about ten thousand times better than BMitch on the radio. I love BMitch, the former Skin, but he should not have a radio show.

Posted by: CMoney | October 27, 2006 11:41 AM | Report abuse

Jason La Confora - You have not been in this town long enough. You don't be going messin with Joe Jackson Gibbs 'round these parts. Did you know he won 3 SBs with 3 Different QBs? You are sooo lucky this is a Blog a not my home on a Saturday when everybody is drinkin. You could've caught a serious beatdown........

Posted by: Anonymous | October 27, 2006 11:43 AM | Report abuse

Hey look at me, I can post without signing my name too!!!

"Real Fans" question there team and it's president. It's just like politics. You can be patriotic and still question your country.

Posted by: Anonymous | October 27, 2006 11:46 AM | Report abuse

no name,

Gibbs won 3 SB's with 3 different QB's... 15 years ago. What has this town seen since then? 2 playoff births and 1 home playoff game? That is pathetic. Like Arizona Cardinals pathetic.

Don't get me wrong, I love Gibbs... but in today's world do you think a fortune 500 company gives its managers a break during a major down trend JUST because they made 3 deals 15 years ago?

Posted by: Ricky Bobby | October 27, 2006 11:51 AM | Report abuse

Isn't it funny that our friend the writer of this blog(JLC) critiziced Steve Czaban for throwing him under the bus and now he goes and talks about the same thing Czaban has been ranting over and over about..that Gibbs has lost it.

Its time JLC grow some & ask the Coach these questions rather than putting in a blog..after all he is the writer? right??

Posted by: Jimmy | October 27, 2006 11:55 AM | Report abuse

Ben D-- you should be willing to share whatever blunt you have been smoking.

After seeing or hearing about all of these blue light special draft giveaways, how is that helping? Acknowleding fans or glad handing is great, shows he cares. That he chose to do this immediately following a loss, was ill timed, if not downright strange.

Like it or not, the buck stops with him. Success or lack there of, is tied directly to the things that Gibbs does or has done.

What really bothers me is the hypocracy. Players that were labeled "core Redskins" were thought of so much, they were allowed to leave, in some cases with little if any respectable contract offer.

To see Pierce and Smoot prosper elsewhere, knowing we had them first.....then watch new signees flounder, much like they did with their former teams, is shabingus--hope I used that properly.

Most coaches or GMs with a track record like this, would be fired. How can you not expect more?

Posted by: Kevin K | October 27, 2006 11:56 AM | Report abuse

You are wrong. The Cowboys are coming. Coach Gibbs wants Fed Ex to rock and roll!
Ryan Clark is still lifting his face off of the Fed Ex field from LTomlinson, LJohnson, and Tiki stiff arms. Unfortunately, the NFL does not keep stats of tackles missed. Especially those that led to touchdowns. I posted a comment to you after the Duckett deal informing all readers of the line backer problem. Just think, if we only convinced Seau to be a Redskin. Wait, the Redkins would not know how to play him. This season is fast becoming what other NFL teams do in pre-season, evaluate players and evaluate what plays the players can properly execute. When will the game plan include plays that other teams used to attack our opponent? RayClay

Posted by: Anonymous | October 27, 2006 12:03 PM | Report abuse

Good reference, H-Man. It's BASF. "We don't make the Manboobs; we make them droopier."

Also, nice stats, Queen Bee. Someone alluded to the magic of RFK some days ago in this blog and it got me to thinking. The reason St. Joe is having such a tough time in this second go-round is that he's in the wrong stadium! That's why he's all out of whack. Unfamiliar territory, indeed, Section 418.

By the way, who's Ted from Raleigh? I'm sorry, but we've already got representation down there with Joe in Raleigh. I'm not telling you to move, but you gotta come up with a new name. Raleigh is Joe's.

Posted by: MV Dame | October 27, 2006 12:10 PM | Report abuse

If Gibbs main job now (sans playcalling) is to make personel moves and to be the Sunday motivator of the team, he is failing miserably. The team has looked super Flat at NY, at Dallas, and home against the Titans. The personel moves are awful.

If he was willing to turn over playcalling to Saunders and defense to Grilliams, maybe he will turn over the personel decisions to a new GM. He can then take tickets at the front gate on Sunday's and shake everyone's hand.

If he loves the fans so much, he will secure a home play-off game...and then he will hear first hand how the city loves him and the Redskins. As many people have said, "If you give the fans something to cheer about, they will cheer".

Posted by: Stonewall | October 27, 2006 12:11 PM | Report abuse


Good call, Czaben was the only one to notice that line and be outraged by it. Also, until now JLa hasn't ever critisised Gibbs.

I said it before and I'll say it again. What would Redskins Nation do without Czaben? The only person in the history of the Redskins to have an original though.

Thanks again for pointing all that out. As AM2DSticks says. "You should be a life coach."

Posted by: Skinz | October 27, 2006 12:11 PM | Report abuse

Dude is on a roll today filling in for BMitch. Just called out McCarver as sucking arse. Loving it. BMitch: stay on vacation.

Posted by: Mark Stern's Agent (aka CMoney) | October 27, 2006 12:13 PM | Report abuse

Bob in Ashburn --

I'm definitely NOT a Broncos fan. I'm a longtime Skin supporter, as distressed as (most) everyone on this blog about the sorry state of our football team. I was just in a hurry and didn't post my handle.

My post was in response to questions asked in earlier threads about the Duckett trade and my own curiousity about what the Redskins really gave up for a running back that doesn't play. After I read the Q/A my response was about the same as Ricky Bobby's..

Posted by: TechNomad | October 27, 2006 12:18 PM | Report abuse

skinz, i don't know if this warrants calling out jason. because he IS too close to the situation. and so much crap going on around him. and honestly i would've never reacted the way czabe reacted after the presser. it was something to talk about maybe the day after. because there was sooooooooooo much to talk about. and czabe said it too. this team is not a joe gibbs team.

but i've never seen czabe so mad on tv or anyone that mad. he looked livid at what joe said. i was like someone give him a glass of water.

but yes, more often than not he always point things out that i'm thinking about. probly cuz he's a local and a grew up as a diehard fan of this team.

Posted by: dealer | October 27, 2006 12:21 PM | Report abuse

So could I claim to be one of the neglected 12 and end up with some gift from Mr. Gibbs? Yes... I was there that night Coach, thanks for the coupon for a large pizza and a free order of Fudge-Ums.

No name: I really hope you're being sarcastic... It his job to question the stuff going on... Jason hasn't gotten up the courage to *cough* DRAFT PICKS during a presser, but he's getting the job done.

Since Joe Gibbs won 3 superbowls I decided to give him a 3 year grace period before I complained about anything... clock is ticking, time is almost up. Tell me, would you accept a piece of crap product from a company/corp. just because 15 years ago they were a good company/corp? No, you'd hold them accountable or eventually find a better product elsewhere. I know Gibbs is a Saint around here, but that doesn't mean he gets off the hook for bad coaching/decision making. He needed time to dust off the cobbwebs and we love him for his 3 superbowl wins, but its been far too long and too much money has been spent to accept a bad product.

Posted by: Dorf | October 27, 2006 12:21 PM | Report abuse

I forgive you my son for we all have sinned in our hearts for lusting after another mans draft.

Posted by: Bob-Ashburn, VA. | October 27, 2006 12:21 PM | Report abuse

I appreciate the Popeye's chicken bones the players tossed out as the bus drove by-so no need to apologize Joe. just put in Campbell and give us some hope for the future.

Posted by: Richard Cranium | October 27, 2006 12:24 PM | Report abuse

I'm sitting here thinking that only Meg and I were calling to start Campbell after Week 2 this year. (In all honesty, I was hoping Campbell would begin the year as the starter.) As a result, perhaps we've been more frustrated with Brunell's continued existence as a starting QB. Still, nice to see that many others are coming to the same conclusion: Start Campbell and see whether he will be the guy next year. If not, draft someone else and start all over. But don't go into next season not knowing.

Posted by: Colin | October 27, 2006 12:24 PM | Report abuse

Notre Dude, thanks for the shout out.

Posted by: Joe in Raleigh | October 27, 2006 12:26 PM | Report abuse


I was being sarcastic.

Posted by: Skinz | October 27, 2006 12:27 PM | Report abuse

I thought SARCASIM was the name of the game in this territory I'm not use to (blogging that is)??

Posted by: No Name | October 27, 2006 12:28 PM | Report abuse

JLC has a little one in diapers, he can't afford to lose the cush gig at the post right now and say what he thinks...what do you think he is Tony Kornheiser or something?

Posted by: Bob-Ashburn, VA. | October 27, 2006 12:29 PM | Report abuse

I don't doubt for a second that Coach Gibbs is working as hard as he possibly can to fix what needs to be fixed. That doesn't guarantee it'll work, but he's not shirking his effort in any way. If I thought he was spending valuable meeting time worrying about snubbing fans, then I'd be worried, but I sincerely doubt that's the case.

Posted by: Studio Reader Stan | October 27, 2006 12:34 PM | Report abuse


You are wrong my friend. I been calling for Brunell since week one. I called for his head since last year son. He looked just as bad last year as this year.

Posted by: jm220 | October 27, 2006 12:34 PM | Report abuse

Well, I got all of you beat. I've been calling for Brunell to be benched since Week 2 of his (and Gibbs) 1st year. Remember that game - at the Meadowlands???

We had 7 turnovers and still had a chance to win if they had pulled Brunell earlier due to that sore hamstring....

Posted by: 4th Floor | October 27, 2006 12:39 PM | Report abuse

or was it a quad injury? Either way, he should have been benched until it was fully healed......

Posted by: 4th | October 27, 2006 12:41 PM | Report abuse

4th Floor

Ok you got me beat. I only start calling for his head before, during, and after the 5 game win streak.

Posted by: jm220 | October 27, 2006 12:42 PM | Report abuse

Good Lord, I have each and every one of you on this blog beat! I was calling for Brunell to be benched back in 2002, half an hour before his corpse started to stink up the joint in Jacksonville. So there!

Posted by: FlimFlam | October 27, 2006 12:47 PM | Report abuse

Put me in coach.....i'm ready to day?

Posted by: Jason Campbell | October 27, 2006 12:50 PM | Report abuse

Has anyone noticed that Coach Joe is on the same path as Michael Jordan? He comes to town, gets the team to the playoffs, then gets run out of town by ownership without so musch as a thank you. Let's see if it ends as badly as it did for Jordan.

Posted by: Skins fan | October 27, 2006 12:52 PM | Report abuse

Skins fan

I cannot see that happening. The Dan would be move out the country. Jordan didn't have the history and beloved here like Coach Joe.

Posted by: jm220 | October 27, 2006 12:55 PM | Report abuse

Its the most bizarre comments after another pathetic loss that i have heared from a coach on any level

Posted by: mrpjs | October 27, 2006 12:56 PM | Report abuse

Just win, Joe. Just win.

Posted by: Daddy-O | October 27, 2006 12:56 PM | Report abuse

Skins Fan - You must not be a Wiz Kid Fan.

Jordan (Micheal, not Eddie) NEVA EVA got us to the playoffs, buddy.....

Posted by: 4th Floor | October 27, 2006 12:57 PM | Report abuse

hey there, wanted to clear a few things up.

1) Have never watched Czaban on TV - didn't know he was on - and do not listen to his show. Have no idea what his rants are except for one time a friend called my cell to tell me what he was saying about the local beat guys, and we remember how that went.

2) The idea that Gibbs is beyond reproach is laughable. He would be the first to say that. He expects to be second guessed and criticized at times like these. Also, to suggest that money played no role in his return is beyond naive.

3) Go back and read the entry I wrote. No one is being thrown under the bus. I am not attacking Gibbs. All I know is I have covered many games and many coaches in every sport and never before saw anything like Sunday/Monday. Every other reporter out there was thinking the exact same thing I wrote, and I was wondering what the fans thought about it. I figured it would be pretty split, and it seems like it was.

4) I'm not making a big deal out of it. I am just pointing out what I thought was one of very few interesting/unusual things to happen in what was a very slow week. It's just one of 130 entries on this blog right now, and it's not something I plan on pounding away at, but was worthy of a discussion point. Judging by the passion displayed on all sides in the comments, I would say that it's valid.

5) I think my web chats and blogs are as honest and blunt as could be expected. In terms of the actual print edition of the paper, I am a beat writer and not a columnist - paid to write the facts and not opinion. On the blog I have more freedom, and I try to put it to good use. I don't expect everyone to agree with what I say or how I say it - heck, that's part of the fun part, keeps people involved, (where would we be without BOOFER, for instance?) - but if even those who don't agree find what happens here to be timely, thought-provoking, funny, childish, or anything besides just being gramatically-impaired, I figure it was a worthwhile entry/comments.

Okay, I'm checking out for day.
Happy weekend.

Posted by: Jason La Canfora | October 27, 2006 12:58 PM | Report abuse

Gibbs giving attention to the fans doesn't bother me. Megskin's 1985 article did do a good job of pointing out how we've all got rose colored glasses when it comes to the first Gibbs era. If this is an off year for us, so be it. But give us something to cheer about, Joe! We are DESPERATE!

You don't have to boycott the Redskins to boycott the Redskins financial machine. There's got to be other ways to show displeasure than an all out Redskins boycott. Any thoughts? Boycott concessions? Boycott jerseys of players cuz you know they'll only be around for 1-2 years?

Posted by: Lavar Walt Clark | October 27, 2006 12:59 PM | Report abuse

Yo Boofer!!!
We need some boo hoo boxes up in here...STAT!!! This whole thread is soooo sad :(kk

Come on, you can come out now. It's been 4 days since the Dallas Debacle. Where you at 85????

Posted by: BooferSux | October 27, 2006 1:01 PM | Report abuse


"Where you at 85????"

Oh that is funny. But I love Chad and he is my starting WR on my fantasy team. So one picked Moss before I could get to him(damn draft) But I have CP and Cooley

Posted by: jm220 | October 27, 2006 1:04 PM | Report abuse

He did mention the forgotten 12 on George Michael as well. Drop the lithium and switch to scotch Joe.

Posted by: Queso | October 27, 2006 1:05 PM | Report abuse

BOOF came back yesterday. Said Romo was the real deal. We'll see.

Posted by: LWC | October 27, 2006 1:06 PM | Report abuse

Im honestly sick and tired of hearing from Gibsy that "We" (the Redskins) have the greatest fans. Thats all he says anymore. Trying to keep our attention by buttering us up with his praise. I dont want anymore praise. I want answers. I want changes to be made I want to see some fire in his eyes. He seems to just not have that grit he once had. This team is the most underachieving Redskin team that i can remember. We will be lucky to win one game the rest of the year. This Redskins team doesnt deserve Fans...DC should boycott the Cowboys game...and Empty Fed Ex field might wake up these lazy selfish no heart having players that steal my valuable time every Sunday. At least this Sunday i can enjoy the outdoors and not have to worry about seeing some pitiful sight from the Team I love so much.

Posted by: Hammer | October 27, 2006 1:10 PM | Report abuse

Boofo came back? I totally missed bad. Did he leave off any boo hoo boxes? Cause I'm gonna need one until we get a win up in here.


Posted by: BooferSux | October 27, 2006 1:17 PM | Report abuse

This may have been said already.

Maybe next year they (Danny, Joe, and the boys) won't break out the bandwagon in April. Talk about mismanaged expectations - a dagger to any business or gameplan.

Hopefully I can buy a new burgundy and gold liver at the Redskins store at some point.

Posted by: bringbacktheposse89854726 | October 27, 2006 1:17 PM | Report abuse

I was watching the presser live and I was literally stunned listening to him (especially the way he prefaced his remarks). Fans he accidently blew by??? WTF???!!! Are you kidding me?? Gibbs 2.0 (technically, Gibbs 2.0.3) is a personality. He's still schmoozing the fans they way he does sponsors at NASCAR. He's been $nyderized. Just like those recordings that say, "We value your call." Well, hell, pick up the phone then and let me talk to someone!! Doc Walker said it best, if $nyder really wanted to win, he would take some of that money from "the most profitable franchise in pro sports" and hire FOOTBALL people. BTW, do you think he would remain owner of "the most profitable franchise in pro sports" if you, the fans, didn't feel appreciated and know how much "every single fan in the best city in the world is needed" (to buy merchandise and the highest ticket prices).'s your ROI looking? The reason I believe it was contrived is b/c he repeated it throughout the week--presumably after the fans got the "something" he had for them. Watch his show Saturday and see if he says it again. He's not that stupid--he knows he's that last link to "the glory days" and once the fans turn on him--pitchforks and torches are being ordered for a trip to Ashburn. One thing for certain is that Artie Ziff--excuse me, Dan $nyder, will make a rooftop helicopter exit before the gates give way to enraged, fed-up fans, with Vinny hanging on his leg as they rise to the sky never to be heard from again.

Posted by: Green Baby G | October 27, 2006 1:18 PM | Report abuse

I don't think yours is valid criticism of Gibbs. There is so much that can be criticized and analyzed about the team that is much more relevant and newswothy than Gibbs' comments about fans. It is just piling on and cheap shotting to jump on him for it. Steve Czaban expressed the same views after the game; I thought his criticism was cheap and meaningless, too. That Gibbs mentioned the fans has no bearing whatsoever on his coaching ability or where the team is; it's just not relevant at all to anything that's important. This is just one more shrill and empty criticism in a sea of shrill and empty sports opinionating (I won't dignify it by calling it journalism), that we see all the time in the media. You and the other real journalists colleagues should get onto something real.

Posted by: EWN | October 27, 2006 1:22 PM | Report abuse

Amazing JC, absolutely amazing. You know I have been thinking along the political line myself with his post game interviews. I guess I was not all wrong. WOW

Posted by: Anonymous | October 27, 2006 1:25 PM | Report abuse

Jason, I don't think it was weird for Gibbs at all. Think about it. Not only is he the GM and the head coach, he personifies the Redskins' "brand." He knows that without the fans, sports don't sell. His remarks were not merely about 12 complaining fans (though I do remember those fans' complaints on the official blogsite ... I thought it seemed a petty). His remarks were directed toward the entire Skins' marketing demographic, i.e., it was another way for him to recognize that they need the fans and that they have been f***ing up. His MO is to take the entire blame for the team and focus it on blaming himself ("We have to go back and look at everything ... I have to look at what I'm doing wrong ... blah, blah, blah). Moreover, as the COACH, he is well aware of the demoralizing effect that booing by home team fans in FedEx has on his players. As the brand and coach of the team, he knows he has a fan mutiny on his hands.

There is nothing wierd about him dwelling on the bus thing as a metaphor for everything else that is going wrong.

Posted by: dcsween | October 27, 2006 1:25 PM | Report abuse

Green Baby G,

You get today's Gold Star.

Posted by: Skinz | October 27, 2006 1:28 PM | Report abuse

B&G Liver comment = priceless

I wish the team was the only joke right now. But let's talk about our stadium since someone else touched on it briefly.

Fed Ex Field = absolute joke

I've been a ticket holder for 3 years, all of Gibbs 2.0. I've also been to 6 cities now for road games. In other stadiums every seat is taken. It's loud. The parking isn't a joke and you aren't strip searched for peanuts at the door. In fact, at Giants stadium we took sandwiches, waters, chips, etc. in. You would be executed if you tried that at FedEx.

Anyway, at FedEx Field there are entire rows empty. Even during the bigger games last year, there were empty seats every where. It's flat out embarrassing.

Whoever said Synder wants to win is correct. But like others have said, I'd have to put winning at 1b, money at 1a on his list of priorities. And to a mult-billion dollar guy that's just sad.

This guy has repeatedly taken advantage of his loyal fans and I'm sick of it. I'll also be boycotting the Dallas game on the 5th and I hope others will too. I'm also seriously considering giving up or selling my tix next year. Why give that turd more money when he already has so much of mine in his pocket... and for what? NOTHING.

sorry, rambling... just frustrated.

Posted by: Ricky Bobby | October 27, 2006 1:31 PM | Report abuse

one more thing :)

i was thinking. is joe really the kind of coach that a rookie nfl qb would want to play for?

even BBM had ints his rookie year and so did carson palmer(2nd year). imagine the pressure a rookie must feel when playing for gibbs. not only he has to worry about "super" fast defenses but he has to worry about what gibbs is going to do to him if god forbid he throws a pick. or makes a mistake.

i'll be scared for JC if he ever makes it to the field this year.

Posted by: dealer | October 27, 2006 1:33 PM | Report abuse


JLC - THIRTEEN EGGS. I've never had such a quick emotional turnaround from mildly dissapointed to utterly impressed!!! If I had 13 HBE's, I'd be like a smelly morphing Fin Rozzelle with Willow holding the wand at me. Only difference is, in the end, instead of an aged wizard, you'd get an ornary green and yellow donkey.

I think I'm on point with "The Maniacs"...I believe I've watched many a football game and played many a flip cup upstairs there.

BTW, you think BMitch is bad, have taste of a J. Thompson Latte on the way home 2 nite. Closest to h#ll you'll come without peeing steam. Stern is amazing-good call.



Posted by: Pub Golf | October 27, 2006 1:33 PM | Report abuse

The Skins are in trouble, no doubt. But what needs to maintain in troubled times like this is a POSITIVE ATTITUDE...which is usually the first to go. Gibbs says the players are maintaining a great attitude through this stretch of losses, and that looks to be true. Everyone's frustrated, coaches, players, & fans too. The fact that Joe Gibbs makes a point to thank 12 fans that he feels he neglected is commendable. Keeping a positive attitude starts at the top, and Joe Gibbs was doing that with his typical eloquence. I don't have as much of a problem with this Gibbs\fan issue as I do with fans (who care) being referred to as "stalkers". Those 12 fans cared enough and took the time to show up and send the team off, in spite of the W\L record. This type of support shows a positive attitude, which we should all attempt to emulate if we are truly Skins fans! I know I was at Redskin Park to welcome the team back after we lost miserably to the Raiders in the Superbowl. There was only a handful of us there then too, but the team truly appreciated that we were there. I hate to think that I was thought of as a "stalker" then. Sorry to call you out on this JLC, but you should choose your references more carefully. Remember, it's the "stalkers" who choose, or don't choose to go to FedEx field, or read your articles. Without them spending their hard earned $$ and time, lots of people are out of a job!
Keep the faith, Skins fans!

Posted by: JT | October 27, 2006 1:36 PM | Report abuse

Jason, one more thought about Joe's use of the bus incident ... think about the symbolism ... the team leaves without its fans (or at least without acknowledging that they have fans).

Now that I'm thinking about it, his remarks were very intentional. How will he get the fans back (as represented by the 12 waving to the bus)? Come back to Redskins park for free stuff! The merchandise has value! [Very $nyder-like in its deviousness ... also very $nyder-like that only these 12 get the free stuff, not ALL the fans. The 12 represent the fans for the purposes of the apology and compensation, but not for the purposes of the actual sales.]

Posted by: dcsween | October 27, 2006 1:42 PM | Report abuse



JT take a deep breath bra. Now breath out it will be ok. I am sure the "stalkers" comment was a joke. Not sure if you are new to the blog or not. But JLC and all the regulars mix in jokes so we don't totally go over to the dark side. (though I have enjoyed my time there and ready to use my new found powers from Lord Vader on Coach Joe to get Campbell in)

Posted by: Anonymous | October 27, 2006 1:42 PM | Report abuse


Seriously, how many restraining orders do you have? Seriously?

Posted by: Pub Golf | October 27, 2006 1:43 PM | Report abuse

Pub Golf

LMAO! Pub you know that just not right.

Posted by: jm220 | October 27, 2006 1:45 PM | Report abuse

I like the fact that Gibbs is willing to thank/recongnize the fans - but lets do it W's. These guys get 4 hours a week to thank us fans.

I sure hope they show up against Dallas. I could see some serious fallout if they don't, which would be a shame.

Posted by: bringbacktheposse89854726 | October 27, 2006 1:46 PM | Report abuse

Not sure how we went down this road but let us remember one thing:

This exists because JLC takes the time to make it exist. Period. The dude takes time to interact with us and give us the kind of knowledge that the casual fan who turns in once a week cannot get. Let us all please strive to not act like ungrateful children who complain about receiving gifts and get sent to their rooms Christmas morning when I was 7.

Don't bite the hand that feeds and complain that its got too much lotion on it.

What is everyone doing on their bye week? I thought I might watch some of this 'NFL' football i've hear so much about on Sunday.


Posted by: ArtMonkToTheSticks | October 27, 2006 1:50 PM | Report abuse

sorry, still a lil bitter about missing the chat room. sorry JT.

Posted by: Pub Golf | October 27, 2006 1:51 PM | Report abuse


I agree, but I think it's already started. Look on ebay and see how many tickets are for sale. Give me your email and I'll forward you the email the Skins send me every week saying they have "visiting team returns" scattered all over the stadium PLEASE BUY. Or how about just walking up on game day and being able to get tickets from a scalper for below face value?

I remember when it used to be special to go to RFK. You were looked at like a God if you had season tickets. I can count on one hand the amount of games I was lucky enough to go to before FedEx opened.

Now? HA. You have to freaking beg people to go. My buddy called around with a free ticket for Tennessee and it took 10 calls to find someone willing to go... it's sad.

Posted by: Anonymous | October 27, 2006 1:53 PM | Report abuse

Let us all please strive to not act like ungrateful children who complain about receiving gifts and get sent to their rooms Christmas morning when I was 7.

lol I knew it was something I like about you ArtMonkToTheSticks. As far as the weekend. Can you say Ricky Bobby, Austin Powers, and Gladiator (like 100th time all time best man movie)

Posted by: jm220 | October 27, 2006 1:54 PM | Report abuse

sorry, the 80th vent above was from me

Posted by: Ricky Bobby | October 27, 2006 1:54 PM | Report abuse

PG, you naughty boy! say you're sorry!

Posted by: dealer | October 27, 2006 1:57 PM | Report abuse

Sorry folks, new to the chat, but NOT new to the Skins. Can't judge "tone of voice" in the written word, all you have is words and meaning. Maybe "stalkers" was a joke, maybe I should lighten up. Kinda hard to at (is it?)$104 million in players and 2-5! Seriously, no restraining orders here...never even been in jail! LOL And Lord Vader, while you're at it w\JC, see if T.J. can get some carries inside the 20!

Posted by: JT | October 27, 2006 2:02 PM | Report abuse

i have a bad feeling guys. i think #8's gonna have a good game against the girls. because he had a good game against someone this year cuz he didn't practice. let's hope he practices next week otherwise i'm gonna have to move my JC prediction to week 15 instead of week 12.

Posted by: dealer | October 27, 2006 2:02 PM | Report abuse

DCSWEEN - I'm begining to think you are right about this being a PR shceme.

You said some people mention this on the OFFICIAL redskins website blog, right? Well, there you go. Someone informed Gibbs of what they were writing and Gibbs took steps to correct it. That's all it is.....

Posted by: 4th Floor | October 27, 2006 2:03 PM | Report abuse

Happy Friday mother uhs...First, on the Skins, ArtMonktotheSticks and I are of the same mind when it comes to Joe Gibbs. That's why he's in the Hall. Same thing with Bill Walsh. That's why they go 1 and 2 in my book as the greatest coaches of all time. Lombardi gets his own awkward spot. Did you guys read the story about Matt Cavanaugh when he was a draft pick for the New England Patriots? The coach at the time walks into the room where all the rookies are waiting for him. He lights a cigarette and the coach says: "We don't need any of you." and walks out. Cavanaugh said he never felt so low. Then he gets traded to the 49ers to back up Montana and Young. Just as he walks into the building, Walsh sees him and runs up to him. He goes: "Thank God you're here. We really need you. You're going to help us make this a much better team. Welcome aboard." BOOYAKASHOT! Cavanaugh said he would never forget how Walsh made a third stringer behind two HOFers feel like an integral part of the team. That's how Joe Gibbs rolls. That thing to the fans was genuine. He knows he's disappointing us. He wants to make it better. And he is truly touched when fans go out to the park (even though they are stalkers...fine with me) when we're 2-4 going to Indy and about to have our lunch money ripped off and stuffed in a locker.

Second item of business. It is Halloween. Ask AMTTS, I am famous for rolling with huge animal suit costumes. A few year back, I was a giant bunny rabbit. Last year, I was Rudolph the Red Nosed Reindeer (DELIVER THE PRESENTS!). This year I want to go as an alligator. Good idea or bad? By the way, dressing up in animal costumes...chicks love it. I have no idea why, but I could be 280 lbs. and look like a ninja turtle (which would be cool) and blonde beautiful babies would still sweat me like the "Rump Shaker" video, SON! By the way, no one talks about it, but Rump Shaker is the greatest song/video maybe of all time. The bee-hatches on the speed boat with Dom Pizzle flowing, black dudes in sunglasses, flat tops and then the super tight trumpet sound. And then just when DC had had enough, Wrecks-In-Effect hit us all with the Reggae Remix. WHAT!? Are you KIDDING ME? Reggae SON! And we rocked that song for the rest of the year. Whammy.

Posted by: The Governor | October 27, 2006 2:04 PM | Report abuse

I know what your saying anonymous poster. I was talking more along the lines of a "poor form and classless" reaction at the stadium.

On a better note:

Here's a nice little treat for those that care. Starting at Midnight on November 10 Cinemax will play the Star Wars Saga (Episodes 1 - 6) back to back to back, etc..(is concurrently the correct word?) in HD. This will be the first time that the original Trilogy will be viewable in HD format.

I may be a geek for knowing and preeching this, but I love and grew up on those movies.

Posted by: bringbacktheposse89854726 | October 27, 2006 2:04 PM | Report abuse

JT--stalking is a bit harsh. You need to relax. Try upping the dosage on your lithium. Can we get you validated and get you out of here.....that would be great.

Posted by: Kevin K | October 27, 2006 2:05 PM | Report abuse

*throws flag on kevin k*
illegal use of a word. you can't use "lithium"(same punchline) more than once under one post. people gonna think you're a "one trick pony" (as czabe would say)

your penalty, as always. comment on nfl insider's blog just once since it was your first time.

Posted by: dealer | October 27, 2006 2:10 PM | Report abuse

i think everyone on here has said it great. If your going to appolgize do it to the 90,000 in the stadium, do it to the ones watching it at home, dont do it to 12 people on the side of the road. But i trully dont want to hear it, just tell me that you suck, brunell sucks and how your gonna fix it. his pressers are painful to watch.

Posted by: jake. | October 27, 2006 2:11 PM | Report abuse


It's all good. Skinz, Megskin, dealer, Ali, and many others will keep you laughing. (if I forgot any of the reg please forgive me)

I am new to the Jedi mind tricks so one task at a time. lol

Posted by: jm220 | October 27, 2006 2:14 PM | Report abuse

Gibbs' apology was the most bizarre thing I have ever seen. Pathetic could also be used to describe it. I never thought I would say this but I've had about enough of Coach Joe and his scared little faces on the sideline. He's made every move possible to give up the power that was all his when he came here. Bringing Saunders in was a huge mistake. The offense was lacking last year but it didn't need a complete overhaul. Lloyd and Randle El would've added enough to last year's offense to have improved it. I could go on and on here but in my opinion the Redskins will never come close to another Super Bowl or even just being a competitive team on a year to year basis until they bring in a proven GM to run the show by himself. Snyder's ways of throwing money at problems to fix them doesn't and never will work. Danny should be flown to a deserted island and should only be called when we need him to sign a check. He's nothing more than a fan who was able to buy his favorite team. He has about as much business being involved in personnel decisions as I do. Cerrato is just a joke. It's hard to believe he's so bad at judging talent with those big bug eye's of his but he is. He needs to go! Coach Joe by the way was never any good at judging talent either. Beatherd and Casserly put his Super Bowl teams together, not Joe. Remember, Joe traded up to #4 to get Desmond Howard. All I know is that well run organizations don't trade away 3rd round draft picks to acquire a player they have no plans of playing.

Posted by: Stumptown | October 27, 2006 2:19 PM | Report abuse

Dealer---flag for what? How did I f it up?

Posted by: Kevin K | October 27, 2006 2:21 PM | Report abuse

See JT, some of us really need some help.

The Governor out of control son. But that video did make you want to go break some backs.

bringbacktheposse89854726 you know what a brother is going to be doing that night. lmao (crazy Lord Vader breathing)

Posted by: jm220 | October 27, 2006 2:21 PM | Report abuse

jm220--While you're working on that, I'll see if I can talk to Danny about giving out Light Sabers at one of the games!

Dealer--Thanks for throwing the flag! Kevin K. made me feel so welcome here! RBG

Posted by: JT | October 27, 2006 2:22 PM | Report abuse

well said Stumptown, well said.

If we where those white on white uni's one more time i'm really going to lose it.

Posted by: Richard Cranium | October 27, 2006 2:23 PM | Report abuse

I used to do a local sports show on comcast cable in Reston. I was at Redskin Park for Gibb's return press conference. What an amazing night that was, the ex-players, the media, the fans outside. Everyone said the same thing, "Gibbs will win", might take a year but Gibbs WILL win here. Well it turns out that this NFL is not the same NFL that Gibbs ruled in the 80's. Here's why, the teams he built, his championship teams, were built on character and relationships that were built up season after season. This is almost impossible these days. Free agency has taken this away as we both know. He is also probably out of touch with the players of today...the fans are different, the media, the owner, Booby Bethard is gone....all of these factors contribute to the fact that Joe Gibbs is a shell of his former self. He doesn't call the plays so what does he do exactly? His M O was making adjustments at halftime...what happened to that?? He's become the face of the skins!
...thats all. We were all fooled into thinking that because this man was back that it meant that we would be back to our glory days. We didn't take into account that it's a different time with different players. Gibbs was a great coach and his hall of fame status shows the respect he has throughut the's just that it's in the past and unfortunately thats where it's going to stay. Any other way to look at it is living a dream.

-Bob Fairbairn (the guy who cried after Super Bowl 18)

Posted by: Fairbairn | October 27, 2006 2:24 PM | Report abuse

I beg to differ with you, AMTTS.

When you create a blog, I thought it takes on a life of its own (like The Blob)? Besides, I can almost be sure they threw JLC a couple of extra Ducketts his way to host this thing.


Posted by: 4th Floor | October 27, 2006 2:26 PM | Report abuse

Not sure if Jason will be putting up another thread for us tomorrow ... and it might be late in the day to start a new idea, but I got one.

I'm all for continuity and stability, esp. for the starting units (well, to the extent that Grilliams 'starters' average more than 2 downs in a series) ... but what about special teams? Assuming St. Joe fills out his contract, and Saunders doesn't want to leave without showing his magic can work, and that GG feels a need for redemption, is there any reason NOT to find some new magic with an innovative Special Teams coach?

Danny Smith is the man who keeps Derrick "but my head was really sweaty" Frost around. [I blame Joe for keeping Hall too long.] It's not just the O and the D that are stenching ... special team play has been boring, ineffective (other than ARE), and heavily penalized. How much stability do you need in special teams? Other than Khary and Sellers and Rock, are there any special teamers who are 'core' that would suffer under a coach with some new ideas? I like ST's special teams play, mostly because it gives him a chance to be even more punishing. But everyone else seems to be earning their 2nd/3rd string roster spot. Vernon Fox doesn't seem to have paid off. Jimoh and Thrash, special teams studs of the past, have gone flat.

I say the Skins need to start to evolve into this century at special teams. [I also think Grilliams has been figured out ... but I'm holding off on that critique until I read Jason's article this weekend. No pressure JLC, esp. after all the build up the past couple days.]

Posted by: dcsween | October 27, 2006 2:29 PM | Report abuse

"A few extra Ducketts."

Its almost too easy sometimes - I imagine that was a "seeded" word.

Posted by: bringbacktheposse89854726 | October 27, 2006 2:31 PM | Report abuse

while everyone is praising Joe for his devotion to the 12 fans- let's not forget what this organization is doing to TJ Ducket- this man is up for a new contract next year and he is riding the pines for what?

Posted by: bob f | October 27, 2006 2:34 PM | Report abuse

Where the heck is my Ali Shanks today anyway?

Now that we're ripping on fed ex, I can get rolling a bit (stretching, flag for illegal showing of skin).

I mean first off, how in sweet PETE'S name do my seats go up 38.75% in one year??? Tell me it's fuel Danny, seriously. They better have put Jenna Jameson next to me! Or maybe they decreased beer prices? Maybe I don't have pay 16 dollars for 25 ounces of foam? Maybe our stadium screens are now as big as the purple wearing freaks up north named after an opium loving POET of all things. (in real life, can you envision what an angry Native American would do to Edgar Allen Poe after a binger?) TELL ME I DON'T HAVE TO PAY TO PARK IN A CHURCH PARKING LOT!??!! Have 9'ers fans ever drank a beer checking their scalp for the 3 6's hearing whispers of "Damien"? Danny S...Gordan friggin Gecko...You know the type, loud as a motobike, but couldn't bust a grape in a fruit fight.

And how much does Fed Ex pay for the ability to turn RFK's replacement into a circus colored monolith???

I was having a good day too. What's up with the bio's? Ricky Bobby keeps asking me bout em.

ya heard me,


Posted by: Pub Golf | October 27, 2006 2:35 PM | Report abuse

I don't know what's worse, a 2-5 record or the fact that the 'Skins aren't playing this weekend. Even watching a loss is better than no game at all.

Posted by: disappointed | October 27, 2006 2:36 PM | Report abuse

Two things:

Kevin K: Smoot is "prospering" in Minnesota??? Yeesh, dude - he isn't even starting there! He's the nickel back! You wanted to pay him Springs money to stay?? See, us armchair GMs, we always know what's right...

JLC: So you're saying money was a major factor in Gibbs comeback? Really? Have you seen how much his racing team was making, money-wise?

I'm not saying that the money wasn't good, but Steve Spurrier had the exact same contract - 5 million per - and he had no trouble walking away to a much smaller deal with South Carolina. And he didn't have a successful NASCAR franchise, and the kind of bank Gibbs is known for in the philanthropic world.

Would you mind asking Gibbs that question in a presser? I'm absolutely serious. I would love to see the Coach's reaction to a question about whether or not the money he is paid played a significant role in his coming back.

Posted by: Ben D | October 27, 2006 2:38 PM | Report abuse

4th Floor, we'd still be commenting to each other on how great Brunnell is after 22 in a row in Houston without JLC updates. I think empirically, you have to recognize that without JLC, you and I are not having this conversation. I for one, am not in the business of ripping people who proivde me with things that I value.

Would you want to lose this conversation? I wouldn' means a lot to weird right then didn't it? Yeah...

Posted by: ArtMonkToTheSticks | October 27, 2006 2:39 PM | Report abuse

Ben D, Gibbs didn't come back for the money. He came back b/c he likes football and he wanted to get his son (Coy) started in the NFL as a coach. Mrs. Gibbs told him he would ruin his reputation, but recognized the opportunity for her son.

Posted by: dcsween | October 27, 2006 2:43 PM | Report abuse


hilarious, you're on point today. hell, you're on point this whole week.

not to mention, don't rip the guy who deals with the stuff so far outta the average fans "realm of info" on a minute to minute basis.

unless he brings up Natty Bo's again. That was just uncalled for. I threw up in my mouth a lil bit.

Posted by: Pub Golf | October 27, 2006 2:46 PM | Report abuse

what's Coy's title? assistant to the assitant to the assistant to the assistant offensive coach?

Posted by: mary k | October 27, 2006 2:46 PM | Report abuse

So this is what happens when I have to work.....I had been wondering all week. It sucks waiting until 1 pm to be checking in on my blog family.

How many of you think Jason baited us with this post. He's a slick dude that got more than a few new names out of the woodwork today.....I'm thinking we get to 500 again on this thread since he is taking the weekend off.

PG -- Had a question: Was the girl Ricky Bobby was with in Indy really 400 pounds?

I can't get the image of the fat girl dancing in Carlos Mencia's Kayne West sketch out of my mind.

Posted by: Ali Haji Shank | October 27, 2006 2:47 PM | Report abuse

Ben---last time I checked, Smoot was still starting, opposite Antoine Winfield. Even if he wasn't, you don't think he is a better option than Carlos Rogers, Kenny Wright, or Mike Rumph. Please. Springs has had the injury prone label before he came here. Anyway, my point, wasn't that Smoot was a stud, but he is certainly a guy we could have kept, since there was no plans for replacing him. To think you can just pluck someone off the waiver wire, and all will be ok is why we see what we see.

Posted by: Kevin K | October 27, 2006 2:48 PM | Report abuse

I love that St. Joe is (I think) sincere in his support and appreciation of the fans and that truth is none of us would be spending A LOT of time here venting and beating our heads against the wall if we didn't know that.

But - we're 2-5 with a team that is supposed to be "loaded with talent" and we aren't just 2-5 we are an incredibly crappy 2-5 because who'd we beat? Houston? Jags? Whoopdeedoo. I know you take the W you take the W, I take the W. Still we've had too many crappy losses - games where you just sit there jaw on the floor, shoulders sagged, scratching your head, thinking Whiskey Tango Foxtrot over?

I'll rally behind them - I always do god help me but when I watch the games I don't see, feel, hear, smell, taste any fire or passion from most of the team. Where's the anger? St. Joe has always been a steady presence which I think is great but he had players behind him running up and down the bench getting guys into the game. We don't see that or maybe I'm missing it. When CP, one of the few guys with some fire, says he's getting the hell outta town . . . well doesn't that sort of say it all?

I nearly cried and I jumped and I screamed and I walked around with a S**t eating grin on my face when JG came back. I thought 3 years - it's going to take 3 years but we'll get there. Well here we are 3 years later and we aren't within 100 miles of "there."

I think we'll probably beat Dallas. We'll catch a couple lucky breaks with Romo, execute the 2 or 3 good/great offensive plays we have most games and hold our breath hoping we don't blow it in the second half. Brunell's arm will be rested so he'll throw a couple long ones and then he'll be kept as starter and we may go as good as 7-9 and then probably do the same next year unless the heads are removed from some of the behinds.

Now I'm just sad and tired and pathetic for the long post. It's sunny and in the 70's here so I'm a gonna go outside and get a smile on my face.

Posted by: sfskin | October 27, 2006 2:48 PM | Report abuse

Why are you breaking John from Herndon's heart????

Posted by: Anonymous | October 27, 2006 2:49 PM | Report abuse


it was me with the biddy...she was Jacoby after a trip to Sizzla back in the day.

Seriously, I could touch fingers when I danced with her, and she was REALLY cool. shoot me.

Posted by: Pub Golf | October 27, 2006 2:50 PM | Report abuse

Remember: Walt Harris had as many interceptions in one game then our entire team has this year.

Posted by: Skin Patrol | October 27, 2006 2:51 PM | Report abuse

Why are you breaking John from Herndon's heart????

Don't you mean, 'Why are you continuing to break John from Herndon's heart? I've seen bread crumbs that are larger than the pieces you're stomping on!'?

Posted by: FlimFlam | October 27, 2006 2:55 PM | Report abuse

mary k, Coy Gibbs' position description is QC coach. It took me a while and reading a lot of google hits to figure out that one. The head coaches who have QC coaches use them PRIMARILY to scout trends in the next team they play after the upcoming game ... find the important parts of game film, like the advance team, that type of thing. I remember that Bellichek has had QC coaches for a long time.

Posted by: dcsween | October 27, 2006 3:03 PM | Report abuse

...(Campbell) has to worry about what gibbs is going to do to him if god forbid he throws a pick.

Exactly, dealer. St. Joe only allows his veteran quarterbacks to throw 4-5 picks in a game...

Posted by: MV Dame | October 27, 2006 3:04 PM | Report abuse


Don't ever, ever get me confused with Pub Golf again. He connected with the 400 pounder. Me? Well, I tried to hook with a 390 pounder but was denied.

Note to self... next time keep fritos in my pocket like PG does.

When do these bio's come out?

Posted by: Ricky Bobby | October 27, 2006 3:04 PM | Report abuse

Skin Patrol,

My boss had to talk me back off the ledge of our building following the Walt Harris post. Thanks.

Posted by: Ricky Bobby | October 27, 2006 3:06 PM | Report abuse

My bad Ricky. My bad.

I don't know on the bios, I would figure probably at least a few days as Jason mentioned he would be spending some personal time this weekend due to the bye week.

I think the Fritos thing is a good way to go. You have to fish where the fish are, right?

The only thing worse than showing up late to this party is having to go back through the posts. Loved the Jenna Jameson part PG, I thought she was automatic when you got to the Club Level seats. Or was that Jameson Irish Whiskey?

Posted by: Ali Haji Shank | October 27, 2006 3:12 PM | Report abuse

Just what the hell is wrong with (almost) everybody in this place? Are we actually bashing Gibby's love and appreciation for our support? Don't get me wrong, I'm EXTREMELY hurt and disappointed about how this season's shaping up, but are we gonna step on one of the only truthful, respectful, humble beings left in professional sports? Have you noticed how bitter Bill Parcells always sounds? Do we want a coach that throws the players under the bus? There's no other coach like Joe, probably never will be again. I sincerely believe he's doing the best he can...I'm just wishing he'd have just stuck with HIS offense.

Posted by: Mark Arcusa | October 27, 2006 3:16 PM | Report abuse

I waited by the bus hopefully to get coaches attention, but he didn't acknowledge me....maybe if I show up next week they'll give me a game worn jersey.

Posted by: Jason Campbell | October 27, 2006 3:20 PM | Report abuse

Oh, and PG -- the receptionist that picks teams by color taunted me today. She says "So, what team are you taking this weekend?" Then pauses, "Oh wait, you can't take a team this weekend can you?"


Posted by: Ali Haji Shank | October 27, 2006 3:21 PM | Report abuse

I waited by the bus hopefully to get coaches attention, but he didn't acknowledge me....maybe if I show up next week they'll give me a game worn jersey.

Posted by: Jason Campbell | October 27, 2006 3:21 PM | Report abuse


I agree... the team rattled off 6 straight before losing in Seattle. During that run they scored 30+ against the Giants, Philly, AND Dallas. Why not just add a 2nd WR and PR (Randle-El), keep the pricey D. Patten at 3rd WR, and keep it going.

I could understand a change if we were going to go with JC to start the season.
But to completely change the offense coming off of THAT run last season, combined with the fact that this team has a win NOW QB, was just mind boggling to me.

Posted by: Ricky Bobby | October 27, 2006 3:23 PM | Report abuse

For Arcusa...Check the record fella, Parcell's has some of the most loyal players in the game. He also gives the most informative press conferences in the league. He actually talks about how he feels the team is performing. On top of that he's dang (JJG term) funny. You Redskins fans should actually check out what's going on in the rest of the league before you make simply ingnorant and misinformed posts.

Posted by: Dallas PR | October 27, 2006 3:25 PM | Report abuse

What is St. Joe's official title?

According to wikipedia, it's Head Coach/CEO. Does anyone know if that is truly his official title?

Also learned a few interesting things about St. Joe in the wikipedia entry. It's a good read.....

Posted by: Ali Haji Shank | October 27, 2006 3:27 PM | Report abuse

Dallas PR is Boofer's older and more articulate brother I think.

Just remember the joke: What's the difference between a Cowgirls fan and a Raiders fan? The Raiders fan lives in the double wide....

Posted by: Ali Haji Shank | October 27, 2006 3:29 PM | Report abuse


I hear the Skins have an opening coming up for the Associate Assistant to the Head Coach - Defense. We should apply.

Someone told me, maybe on this blog, why they have so many F'd up titles like that. Apparently you are not allowed to steal an opposing teams coach UNLESS it's technically considered a promotion. So by throwing Assistant Head Coach to Grilliams and Associate Head Coach to Saunders made it okay to steal them from Muffalo and KC respectively, even though are still just the Defensive and Offensive Coordinators.

Kind of shady. Either way, I think the title names are reeeeedonkulous and that there should be a cap on coaches. Like if we're not ripped enough about the team, we also have to listen to how Danny gave 3 trillion for a coaching staff to produce a 2-5 team.

Oh, and hearing about TomKat and Six Flags and the trees in his yard is also a highlight. I think the fire eater and the tightrope walkers are down at FedEx interviewing as we speak.

Posted by: Ricky Bobby | October 27, 2006 3:35 PM | Report abuse

kevin, my bad. i thought it was you who used "lithium" as the punchline before but it was "queso". (just did a search on that word)

ben, can i be your friend? but to answer your question no, gibbs is making a LOT more than what spurrier was making. gibbs contract details were never made public but there are speculations out there that it's at least $7 mil per year for 5 years. not to mention he got a nascar(fedex) out of it. AND there're also speculations that he might have a little interest in the team(percent wise)...but i don't think snyder is that stupid. but you never know.

next you gonna tell me that us invading iraq had nothing to do with it having the second largest oil reserves in the world.

JASON, you owe me for the following: (you might know about this already...good games)

but those two web sites are worth 1/2 hour each!

Posted by: dealer | October 27, 2006 3:38 PM | Report abuse

I take no credit for anyone as ludicrous as someone naming themselves Boofer. Like all members of your family you must accept them for who they are ... Just as you must accept the three tooth, camoflage wearing, gun rack toting, Skins fans from West VA, who were only last able to by a piece of memorabilia from the '83 team and that's a faded yellow sweatshirt with some lady "hogs" on them...

Regarding Gibbs, 1 I was frightened when they brought him back and 2 I didn't remember him cackling like a crazy hoot during his first tenure.

Posted by: Dallas PR | October 27, 2006 3:43 PM | Report abuse

Yes, he did it on an evening show with George Michael and Sonny. To be honest, I'm so tired of all the fluff he puts out. I want a team that can win. I want to see Dennis Green like attitude after a lost. I want the old Joe Gibbs back (a Coach who wasn't afraid to take chances) or a new Coach all together.

Posted by: rrashad | October 27, 2006 3:48 PM | Report abuse


Yes, he did it on an evening show with George Michael and Sonny. To be honest, I'm so tired of all the fluff he puts out. I want a team that can win. I want to see Dennie Green like attitude after a lost. I want the old Joe Gibbs back (a Coach who wasn't afraid to take chances) or a new Coach all together.

Posted by: rrashad | October 27, 2006 3:53 PM | Report abuse

Ali --

According to the team's OFFICAL WEBSITE, it is "Head Coach/Team President."

Posted by: CMoney | October 27, 2006 4:08 PM | Report abuse

Trust me, even in California I can find the same three toothed, camoflage wearing, gun rack toting Cowgirls fan stepping out of their mobile home propped on cinder blocks, with tin foil in the windows (the ones still intact) and a faded blue tarp over the meth lab nestled between the four dogs on the back porch. The difference? Those Cowgirls fans are everywhere.

Oh and the next time you see leatherface in that pentagram in the owners box at the Great Toilet Bowl With The Lid Up where the Cowgirls play, please say hello for me.

Posted by: Ali Haji Shank | October 27, 2006 4:09 PM | Report abuse

Thanks CMoney. I was curious...

Posted by: Ali Haji Shank | October 27, 2006 4:12 PM | Report abuse

All this Denny Green talk. Really what good to those outbursts do? Do the Cardinals suck less? Does the outburst equal wins?

I can tell you one good thing it does -- it makes me want to rank the best all time coaching outbursts I can think of:

1. Jim Mora
2. Hal McRae when he managed the KC Royals
3. Denny Green

Anyone have any others? Bobby Knight has to get in here somewhere....

Posted by: Ali Haji Shank | October 27, 2006 4:18 PM | Report abuse

Joe Gibbs brought me much joy in the 80's and early 90's so hre can do and say whatever he wants.

Posted by: Mike Morgan | October 27, 2006 4:28 PM | Report abuse


John Chaney (aka Mike Tyson) and Herm Edwards "you PLAY to WIN the GAME" have to be up there too...

Hal McRae's telephone throw was classic though... nice pull. As was Bobby Knight's "game faces". But my favorite of all time will forever be "playoffs... PLAYOFFS". My buddies and I quote that all the time. For example, say my buddy was going to see a movie with his gf instead of drinking with the guys, the common response would be (in Jim Mora voice), "movies.... MOVIES???"


I was too young to appreciate the 80's and 90's. The '91 Bowl... I was in 8th grade. Don't get me wrong, I loved every minute of it, but you still don't appreciate things like that when you are that young.

It just sucks for me and my buddies b/c our prime window (18-30 years of age) is starting to close and all we've seen is 1 home playoff game.

Posted by: Ricky Bobby | October 27, 2006 4:39 PM | Report abuse

Again I say you can't overlook the braod popularity of the team, even by the less than desirable. I'll call you names like you do me but Redskin is already derogatory. Great job busting on the even want to open that can of worms...or our owner...incase you haven't notice Jerry and Danny are on the same side of the fence on many issues. Then again you are an ignorant skins fan that does notice anything outside the beltway.

Posted by: Dallas PR | October 27, 2006 4:40 PM | Report abuse

I live in California you knob.

Posted by: Ali Haji Shank | October 27, 2006 4:42 PM | Report abuse

Twelve guys but an important symbol. Les Robinson, two coaches back at North Carolina State, once bought pizza for the kids camping for tickets to see what wasn't, ahem, a great team. It takes Gibbs and it took Les fifteen minutes to symbolically cement their bond with "the greastest fans in the world."

Very efficient, very loyal. Shows Gibbs remembers, if a little late last week, that this is just a game. The people and relationships make it great.

(Of course, this also is part of why Brunell doesn't have the pine splinters his rump deserves -- and why there's not even a 2nd stringer on the team good enough to consider using to replace him. People. Loyalty. Ideals. Take the good with the bad, folk.)

Posted by: worstSeat | October 27, 2006 4:45 PM | Report abuse

Knob excellant....Redskin....go get a bottle of wild turkey...and bet on the ponies.

Posted by: Dallas PR | October 27, 2006 4:45 PM | Report abuse

Normally we don't pick on typos in this blog, and I won't in your case either. It's a wonder that the Cowgirl Nation has produced one semi-literate soul that can navigate this newfangled internet thing to find their way here to give a comment.

And I think it's Wild Turkey -- at least that's what the sticker said on the back of the dirty minivan with spinners that I was following today with the blue star on it.

Posted by: Ali Haji Shank | October 27, 2006 5:08 PM | Report abuse

Gibbs has so much credibility at this point that I trust him completely with the Redskins, and never question anything he does.

Posted by: dellis | October 27, 2006 5:10 PM | Report abuse

I love the coach and I can understand him wanting to talk about anything else besides the team at this point. There is nothing left to say about this team right now, so he mine as well show he cares about his fans. He knows what we are going through, because he feels the same pain as us, only multiplied by a factor of 100.

Posted by: Max | October 27, 2006 5:26 PM | Report abuse

If I have to listen to another Gibbs postgame press conference talk about how great of guys we have on this team and how they all fight their guts out I'm going to throw up. After Dallas beats us on a 4th quarter TD to T.O. I'd like to see him throw Adam Archulettanotherbigpassplay under the bus. Again, winning football organizations don't make Adam Archulettanotherbigpassplay the highest paid safety in NFL history. SHIP SNYDER AND CERRATO TO FIJI AND BRING IN A PROVEN GM!

Posted by: Stumptown | October 27, 2006 6:04 PM | Report abuse

So what is everyone dressing up as for Halloween? My favorite halloween story goes a little like this.

Baltimore/Dundalk 2000... Fells Point. Pub Golf is dressed as a pirate with eye patch, bird on shoulder, hook hand, everything. So we're at High Tops and we order 10 shots. As soon as the bartender sets them down, and before anyone can pick them up, PB swipes his hook hand across the bar top and hooks them all over. Hysterical.

I ended up hooking with a 300 pound "Nurse" from Essex that night...


Posted by: Ricky Bobby | October 27, 2006 6:25 PM | Report abuse

What's weirder: Joe talking about it all the time, or "US" in a column talking about Joe talking about it all the time?? At least he has a reason to!

What we need to get him to talk about is Campbell and the M.I.A. Defense!! Joe doesn't want to bench Mark. But, if we continue to play Mark and don't get Campbell on the field then we won't know what we have come draft time! Which might be a moot point...BECAUSE WE DON'T HAVE ANY FRIGGIN' DRAFT PICKS!!!!!

We need "the Danny" to pull one of his old tricks, stampede the coach's office, and demand to put an end to this Brunell crap!! Because we haven't had enough, or NO chances to watch Campbell in action, we don't know which one can lead us to mediocrity this year. By the way, for those of you that don't know, mediocrity is .500 football. Brunell has us headed for the basement. Heck, we can't even wish for the worst record so that we can get the number 1 overall pick! WHY CLASS? CAN U GUESS WHY?? NO DRAFT PICKS!! So, we need to get with the program and play Campbell enough games this year so that he will be ready for next year!

If Joe freed himself up so that he can focus more on personnel moves and the team as a whole, then why this debacle with Jason Campbell? We gave up a lot to get him...and we're not playing him!! Look at the Duckett move...the same friggin' thing!!! We go get Al "Playbook Extraordinaire" production. production! Archuletta...well, MINIMAL production! Rogers...minimal production! We had players we let go that we got far more production from! So, grade of an "F" for personnel moves Joe!

I love Joe. But like a woman once told me, (and I was like whatever after she said it - lol!), "SOMETIMES LOVE AIN'T GOOD ENOUGH"!!!

Fix it sans the ego Joe and the antiquated ways of coaching, or let some young, hungry maverick take over (like that stud of a coach down in Atlanta) that will make moves for the good of the team, and not because he stuck his foot in his mouth protecting a dinosaur of a quarterback who can't throw consistently over 20, nay, 15 yards!!! We may not get to the playoffs with Campbell this year, but at least we can finally see ***ALL*** of the much vaunted playbook in Ol' Al's possession! (or is it Lavar's?)------PEACE2FINGAZ!!

Posted by: Darksome | October 27, 2006 6:58 PM | Report abuse

After 25 years, People will say the following:

1)The greatest coach to coach in the NFL was Bill Belicheck.

2)Its so sad that Joe Gibbs & Bill Parcells couldn't win anything in their second stint. It must be the free-agency & coaching assistants that killed their chances. Bill Parcells couldn't win anything without Belicheck & Gibbs couldn't win without Bobby Beathard.

3)Snyder is in his early 60's & he still hasn't learned by going nuts in March. Why did they sign 2 TE's for $20 million signing bonus when they needed only one?

Posted by: Jimmy | October 27, 2006 8:11 PM | Report abuse

I think their biggest problem is mgmt. This is not fantasy football-chemistry is essential, yet the front office has proven they are completely oblivious to this fact. Napolean and Vinny keep getting rid of solid contributers to bring in the flavor of the day, and they are dead wrong 9 times out of 10. It seems to have started when they sent B-Mitch packing to bring in Deion, and has been repeated over and over again. It almost makes you feel kinda sorry for Carter and Archuleta- they get tossed into a mix that was working great, and they muck it up becasue it takes a year or two to really get into the flow. They're getting paid big money based on what they did before, but the reality is standing pat would probably have produced better results at less cost. What's most troubling is we have the talent to be a great team, but that talent needs time to learn how to work together, and the great players will probably tire of losing while they wait for that to happen. Who will be the first great player to go- Portis? Moss? Taylor? I can't blame them if they do. I foresee years of pain ahead. I'm just glad I no longer live in the area and waste my whole Sundays and untold thousands of dollars watching Danny's fantasy team.

Posted by: Scott | October 27, 2006 10:15 PM | Report abuse



Posted by: fred876 | October 28, 2006 12:32 AM | Report abuse

"It was the sense of duty that brought him back to DC in the first place. It's not some hokey song and dance"

whoever wrote that is sorely misguided. is that why he's working for free also, right? i mean, if he was here because it was his "duty", what difference would the money make? Oh that's right he makes almost 6-7 million a year. He came back for the duty.

Posted by: Skins Fan 202 | October 28, 2006 2:09 AM | Report abuse

Jimmy, from the explanations about why DUCKETT can't make it to active roster, it seems like its Saunders or Gibbs who wanted a third TE ... primarily for real blocking (not just chip blocks) on the line and downfield on the outside rushing game. What I still don't understand is why they don't have Sellers or Duckett himself doing that. Fauria seems OK as a blocking TE (replacing Royal), but has been hurt since nearly the middle of the preseason (though they don't list him as injured anymore). I can't say that I've ever noticed Yoder getting on the field.

Posted by: dcsween | October 28, 2006 8:52 AM | Report abuse

Thanks for the link to that upto10 site. Good stuff. Seasame Street is already a way of life for us. Was all over that one already.

The money aspect with Gibbs is more than fair. I never said he came back for the money; I said to deny it as a factor is naive. Come on. It's not like he came back for 500,000 a year. Also, he very well could end up with a piece of the team when he moves on, could end up with a consulting/management position beyond the five years, and, from what I am told, making money in NASCAR is very tough, takes a huge investment each year and with Joe Gibbs racing expanding so much, money is a real factor.
Joe is pretty blunt in his book 4th and Life, I believe it was called, about his prior bad investments and money issues. I'm not even saying it's a knock. Money is a big reasons why players end up where they do. It would be a monumental factor in any job/family decision I ever made. It's reality, guy.
To suggest otherwise, I think, is silly.

On the all-time great coaching rant, Howard Bryant his the best freak out ever on his ipd. It's from when I believe Jim Fergois was skipper of the Cubs, and he drops F-bombs on the fans in the bleachers - his own fans - for like 10 minutes. Honestly, I can't do it justice in this limited forum.
I'm sure you web-savvy peeps out there can find it on youtube or something like that.
It's sublime in both its approach and the pure creativity involved in the profanity itself.

Oh yeah, and stalkers was definitley a joke. Obviously, not everyone got it, so it probably wasn't a very good one. I'll have to learn to make those little smiley face things to make it more clear next time.

Okay, off to my godson's first B-day party.
Have a great weekend.

Posted by: Jason La Canfora | October 28, 2006 10:45 AM | Report abuse

I couldn't find the Fregosi one, but I found this one....a minor league manager going off the deep end. It's pretty good.

This is the full 3 1/2 minute clip. I may have been hearing things but I think when the announcer was referring to the groundskeeper he called him the "Sodfather"...

Anyway here is the full cut. I will follow it up with a remix of the episode on Jimmy Kimmel.

Posted by: Ali Haji Shank | October 28, 2006 8:38 PM | Report abuse

And here's the Kimmel version...

Posted by: Ali Haji Shank | October 28, 2006 8:40 PM | Report abuse

I found it...the crown one clip I give you:

Herm Edwards
Jim Mora (twice)
Jim Fassel
Mike Ditka

and starring, Denny Green

Enjoy folks...

Posted by: Ali Haji Shank | October 28, 2006 8:48 PM | Report abuse

Whooops! I forgot Bill Callahan. And Diddley-poo (Little Cube Of Poop's Cousin).

My bad.

Posted by: Ali Haji Shank | October 29, 2006 12:41 AM | Report abuse


Posted by: dealer | October 29, 2006 11:16 PM | Report abuse

It was VERY weird that Gibbs put so much attention on a dozen fans after the loss. It seems that he appears befuddled at how to react to each game. Essentially, he has been outdone by last year's five week winning streak. He mistakenly gave the team too much credit and overestimated their talent. They were mediocre last year, and they are worse than mediocre this year.

Posted by: Fretzdawg | October 30, 2006 12:33 PM | Report abuse

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