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Cap Corrections, Clarifications

Wanted to clear up a few things from the earlier post. Made a few calls and figured out from a few cap guys why some team sources had told me the word from management/ownership was that Jon Jansen would likely be here for another year.

Stay with me here. With the collective bargaining agreement being in flux now, as it currently stands, barring some miracle extension, we are looking at no June 1 rule in 2009, thus teams can not spread cap hits over multiple seasons - any remaining proration of a contract comes due immediately.

For most of the cases I presented with cap savings, the numbers remain as I presented them (Jason Taylor, Shawn Springs, Marcus Washington). However, in the case of Jansen, because he has multiple years of proration left from his last restructuring, it would actually cost the Skins $6 million in dead cap space to cut him, versus keeping him at a $4.5 million cap figure. Now, they would be cutting him a $1 million check on July 1 with a roster bonus due should they keep him, but it makes more sense now why sources in that building believe there's a good chance the tackle will be back.

Similarly, Andre Carter has that $2.5 million roster bonus due July 1, and, he, like Jansen, has multiple years left on his deal (he's signed through 2013). So, actually, to cut Carter would cost the team $300,000 more in cap space than it would to keep him. That $2.5 million check won't be easy to stroke coming off his performances over the past three seasons, but some coaches figure that they need to at least keep one starting end under contract and he could still be here.

One more correction, with no June 1 cap rule, cutting Cornelius Griffin would save the Skins $2.1 million in cap space, and not $4.2 million.

As for other veterans on the bubble, maybe Phillip Daniels returns for the vet minimum, but not his current deal. This could be the end for James Thrash, too, though we say that every year.

By Jason La Canfora  |  December 16, 2008; 11:33 AM ET
 
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Comments

JLC thanks for the clarification on that I tried to look it up on the net but not much there.

Posted by: Flounder21 | December 16, 2008 11:42 AM | Report abuse

Great job JLC

Posted by: PEACE8 | December 16, 2008 11:42 AM | Report abuse

first!

Posted by: jscrna | December 16, 2008 11:42 AM | Report abuse

Trade Portis for a 1st or 2nd round pick, and trade down to later in the first round in the draft for another pick.

That would leave us with potentially 2 first round picks and a second, or a first round pick and two seconds, where we can address needs at O-Line, LB, and D-Line....

Thoughts?

Posted by: mrizzle | December 16, 2008 11:39 AM |

Nobody is going to take on the Portis contract that would be very stupid, plus why would anyone give up that high of a pick for a back that can not take it to the house anymore.

Portis will be done in 2-3 years if not sooner do to the amount of carries he has in his career.

Posted by: Flounder21 | December 16, 2008 11:45 AM | Report abuse

first!

Posted by: jscrna | December 16, 2008 11:42 AM |

NOT

Posted by: Flounder21 | December 16, 2008 11:46 AM | Report abuse

Do people not read, you cant trade portis, regardless of what you think his contract wont let it.

second why trade moss, if you trade moss watch how more sub par our offense becomes


Posted by: GreatOne1 | December 16, 2008 11:47 AM | Report abuse

Thank you for the correction.

This is what I have been saying for months, but we'll let JLaC get all the thanks on this.......

Posted by: DaReal4th | December 16, 2008 11:47 AM | Report abuse

It would be good if all rules were known in the last capped year of 2009:

you CAN NOT HAVE POST JUNE 1ST CUTS. You absolutely will be disallowed to push dead mony to future years because there are no future capped years.

That's an issue if you people and JLaC keep pimping this non existent idea.....

Posted by: DaReal4th | December 16, 2008 11:11 AM

Posted by: DaReal4th | December 16, 2008 11:49 AM | Report abuse

So here's a serious question for Jasno.
Based on the performances of Heyer and Fabini against a weak Bengals dline, Jansen was the starter for a reason, not just because Bugel has some sense of loyalty to him.
Jansen clearly has limited mobility now -- go back and look at D. Thomas' TD run from a couple of weeks ago, Jansen has to run 4-5 steps to find someone to block, and by "run" I mean "lurch". Recalling his injury last year, how bad that ankle was, is it that the ankle will never be the same, or is it kinda like a knee injury where an additional offseason might help?
If he's un-cuttable, I'd like to have some hope that he could get better...

Posted by: daggar | December 16, 2008 11:50 AM | Report abuse

even if we could get rid of Portis without a contract issue, no one would give a first or second rounder for him, let alone a first and second rounder


I think we have an overinflated idea of how good our players are.

Posted by: TheTruth11 | December 16, 2008 11:50 AM | Report abuse

We need to trade betts for a 3rd or 4th round pick, and pick up a young RB in the draft that is a speedster, we need a change of pace

CP is a back that wears you down, and betts is a bruiser. they are basically the same thing except CP is better. pretty much no change of pace.

We need a change of pace back that can come in after CP starts wearing them down that can run circles around a tired and battered defense.

Posted by: GreatOne1 | December 16, 2008 11:50 AM | Report abuse

JLC thanks for the clarification on that I tried to look it up on the net but not much there.

Posted by: Flounder21 | December 16, 2008 11:42 AM

It has been widely known for over a year now......

Posted by: DaReal4th | December 16, 2008 11:51 AM | Report abuse

I'd like to have some hope that he could get better...

Posted by: daggar | December 16, 2008 11:50 AM | Report abuse

Hope in 1 hand and shti in the other and see which one fills up first.

Posted by: Original_etrod | December 16, 2008 11:52 AM | Report abuse

Trade Portis for a 1st or 2nd round pick, and trade down to later in the first round in the draft for another pick.

That would leave us with potentially 2 first round picks and a second, or a first round pick and two seconds, where we can address needs at O-Line, LB, and D-Line....

Thoughts?

Posted by: mrizzle | December 16, 2008 11:39 AM |

Impossible for a few reasons. Least of all being the only front office in the league stupid enough to trade draft picks for dwindling talent is ours.

Posted by: mack1 | December 16, 2008 11:52 AM | Report abuse

The other big issue regarding the last capped year is that all ULTBE incentives WILL count against the current year's cap.

So, it will be highly unlikely teams and agents will use this mechenisism this offseason......

Posted by: DaReal4th | December 16, 2008 11:54 AM | Report abuse

Daggar,

they both played better then jansen has, I did not see either one of them picked up and thrown back into JC which is the norm with Jansen.

JC had plenty off time to throw in that game.

Posted by: Flounder21 | December 16, 2008 11:54 AM | Report abuse

It has been widely known for over a year now......

Posted by: DaReal4th | December 16, 2008 11:51 AM |

Sorry dareal,

You get all the credit, does that make you feel better.

Posted by: Flounder21 | December 16, 2008 11:55 AM | Report abuse

We draft a RT or pick up Jordan Gross. Jansen is the backup.

Rhinhart takes Kendalls spot.

We draft a center to take Rabachs place this year or next.

In 2010 we draft a RG to replace Thomas, or we sign Chris Snee.

Heyer moves to backup Samuels and take his place when Chris leaves.

Ive had enough of being 'nice' to players just to be loyal. If you cant play, step aside.

Posted by: Rypien11 | December 16, 2008 11:56 AM | Report abuse

This post makes up for the last post and the upcoming


"Why did the Skins let Sterling Palmer walk during Plan B Free Agency" post.

Posted by: cej75024 | December 16, 2008 11:57 AM | Report abuse

Posted by: cej75024 | December 16, 2008 11:58 AM | Report abuse

so, does our FO not get credit for having the decision of freeing up nearly 30 mil in cap space this upcoming offseason?


Isn't that a positive thing? That doesn't happen every year to every team....

Posted by: TheTruth11 | December 16, 2008 11:58 AM | Report abuse

Ryp,

Agreed we have won nothing with the players on this team, none of them deserves an automatic starting spot.

When you team is not that good and the Skins are not that good, everyone needs to be challenged for a job.

Posted by: Flounder21 | December 16, 2008 11:59 AM | Report abuse

You get all the credit, does that make you feel better.

Posted by: Flounder21 | December 16, 2008 11:55 AM

Thanks, we all need a little rubbing of the belly......

Now I can get to work!

Posted by: DaReal4th | December 16, 2008 11:59 AM | Report abuse

The only player on the team that would even warrant another team considering to trade a first or 2nd rounder would MAYBE be Samuels. If they could trade him for a 2nd rounder, I think I would seriously consider it. In my opinion, he's a little over rated and Ware's b*tch.

Posted by: ga8085 | December 16, 2008 12:02 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: CindyBoren | December 16, 2008 12:03 PM | Report abuse

tell us what you really feel, ga!

Posted by: TheTruth11 | December 16, 2008 12:03 PM | Report abuse

tell us what you really feel, ga!

Posted by: TheTruth11 | December 16, 2008 12:03 PM | Report abuse

LOL

Posted by: ga8085 | December 16, 2008 12:05 PM | Report abuse

Are we really talking about trading Cooley? You're kidding right? He's only the fan favorite and best player on our team. Yeah, Redskins fan have loyalty.

Say we pillage every other team in the league for 1st rounders by trading all of the guys you're suggesting. Are you saying Vinny will pick one player who's equal (not even better) caliber? No way; I don't think he's capable.

Posted by: Vinnymustgo | December 16, 2008 12:06 PM | Report abuse

Ryp...I tend to agree with you. While loyalty is a touchy subject, I am tired of going 8-8 with "true Redskins".

Thrash, et el...are nice...but that's just it. But to quote Charles Barkley ( God help for this) "You can't win an NBA title with 5 milk drinkers"

Dump those that are not contributing.

Posted by: cej75024 | December 16, 2008 12:06 PM | Report abuse

they both played better then jansen has, I did not see either one of them picked up and thrown back into JC which is the norm with Jansen.

JC had plenty off time to throw in that game.

Against inferior competition, Fabini stuggled to get back into pass protection position fast enough, resulting in one illegal formation penalty (he was thinking he was an RB) and one false start. And he had no push when run blocking.
Heyer -- I didn't notice him much in pass protection, but he joined CP in the backfield a couple of times when run blocking. And I did notice him in pass protection against the Ravens... he was overmatched.

Posted by: daggar | December 16, 2008 12:06 PM | Report abuse

OMG!!! you guys are still talking about the skins? WHY?!

if you don't stop with this draft/free agency geekfest and start talking about non-skins stuff i'm gonna have to go find something else to do...

Posted by: dealer1 | December 16, 2008 12:11 PM | Report abuse

"Say we pillage every other team in the league for 1st rounders by trading all of the guys you're suggesting. Are you saying Vinny will pick one player who's equal (not even better) caliber? No way; I don't think he's capable.

Posted by: Vinnymustgo"

Exactly. Trading away productive players do not help your team, unless you have somebody that can adequately take his place.

Get rid of dead weight, not the muscle of your team.

Posted by: psps23 | December 16, 2008 12:12 PM | Report abuse

Dealer - 24 starts in a few weeks? Do you follow?

Posted by: DaReal4th | December 16, 2008 12:12 PM | Report abuse

OK --

All time top five 80's actors who recorded albums.

Eddie Murphy
Bruce Willis
Don Johnson
Patrick Swayze
Michael Damian

Posted by: Original_etrod | December 16, 2008 12:14 PM | Report abuse

1) It's lunchtime.
@) I'm working from home.
R) I've spent a fair amount of time this morning discussing "Patterns for a RESTful SOA", and Hamster Nation is the exact opposite of that.
^) But what else do you have in mind? The best way to throw a shoe? Whether Obama's ears can provide cover for his children if it rains during inauguration?

Posted by: daggar | December 16, 2008 12:17 PM | Report abuse

Trade Cooley? Or Moss? It's time to start looking at every quality player on our squad as a miracle. Be thankful. Because it won't likely be repeated with Vin at the helm.

Posted by: mack1 | December 16, 2008 12:21 PM | Report abuse

Some one called Cooley a sacred cow yesterday.

If there was ever a sacred cow on the team that distiction must go to one James Thrash.

You couldn't cut Thrash with those big ceremonial scissors.

Thrash isn't uncuttable
Thrash isn't expendable
Thrash is a "core redskin" [newsflash: that core crap sailed with Gibbs on the way out to sea; get me some damn playmakers! Mike Vick - paging Mike...]
Thrash works hard
Thrash is a warrior
I love Thrash

T(h)rash = Cartwr(ong)ight

Dudes should've been sent packing last year, and have done NOTHING the last few years (save the special team crap for someone else). But everyone is ready and willing to part ways with the two most PRODUCTIVE players on the team the last few years in Portis and Moss.

Moss: 4029 YDS, 268 CTH, 27TDs - Includes current season (4 total)

Portis: 5953 YDS, 1438 CAR, 41TDs - Includes current season (5 total)

Portis is an all-time Redskin; nearly 6K in rushing - nearly 50TDs - but some of you don't appreciate it, or was probably plain sick in the face when we traded Bailey for him, so more than likely you ALWAYS had an agenda against the man anyway.

Moss hasn't had great numbers every season since he's been here, but they haven't been terrible. His worst season here is still better than Randel El's best season EVER, but no one is screaming trade him - or tagging ARE as part of the problem.

10K and 70TDs between Moss and Portis - show some f'n respect!

Posted by: RedDMV | December 16, 2008 12:22 PM | Report abuse

Despite all the sal cap talk, two words are always important when discussing ways to solve the Skins' problems:

ROSTER TURNOVER

Let them swish around in your mouth. They're the new coffee. Anybody determined to 'change things around' with the team as it is presently consistuted is nuts.

Don't trade players with value because they're popular? I'm sorry: I love the team, not the players. The players change like clouds in the sky. It's the winning sunshine that makes the day...and the Skins ain't winning this day or the next....

...and without a strong gm with a track record, the cap space and freed up picks mean nothing but more of the same. Somebody get me Joe Banner or Scott Pioli or a Parcells clone the on the phone, stat!!!!!

Posted by: MistaMoe | December 16, 2008 12:25 PM | Report abuse

in the short-term the Redskins are by their own maneuvers going to be a mediocre at best club.

a poor draft in 2008 combined with the picks surrended for the clearly over the hill Jason Taylor and the veteran contracts, means this team now has very limited wiggle room to improve the roster quickly.

in my opinion you are looking at the 2010 offseason before the Redskins can return to being a club that can both fully participate in the draft (all picks) and have enough cap space to go after selected free agents.

until then I think we are doomed to see a 6-10 type product on the field in 2009 and most likely 2010.

there is no objective reason other than money for Jansen, Marcus Washington, Randy Thomas, Cornelius Griffin or a host of others to be back again in 2009.

and when you keep players not because they are productive but because you are paying them other players know this and lose respect for the organization.

The Caps did the right thing in 2003-2004 in trading Jagr and taking the cap hit for the veteran's contract as well as trading away the other vets who were underperforming.

Though 3 years of pain and suffering the club was able to draft and trade for younger players who are now emerging stars in the NHL.

Meanwhile on a 45 man active roster, the Redskins have just a few potential building blocks in Landry, Rogers, Cooley, McIntosh, Golston, etc.

These guys are young enough to be part of the future as well as the present.

Posted by: leopard09 | December 16, 2008 12:26 PM | Report abuse

I wonder if any other NFL team's major newspaper(s) blogger/beat reporter gives as much insight and info as JLC does. This stuff is great.

I've also wondered often whether or not Cindy Boren is hot.

She, in my book, gets at least 5-6 points (on a scale of 1-10) for being involved with Sports as much as she is.

Posted by: TiredOfLosers | December 16, 2008 12:29 PM | Report abuse

All of you that trashing CP. (yes that includes you JLC) What would this team record be with him not in the line up? Just man up and come out and say you don't like the the guy. Leading rusher most of the year and he is the reason the team sucks.

JM220

Posted by: icetotalpackage | December 16, 2008 12:29 PM | Report abuse

leopard,

You must not read the post JLC just told you they can clear up around 20 mill. Thats alot of room to get what you need.

Posted by: Flounder21 | December 16, 2008 12:30 PM | Report abuse

OK --

All time top five 80's actors who recorded albums.

Eddie Murphy
Bruce Willis
Don Johnson
Patrick Swayze
Michael Damian

Posted by: Original_etrod | December 16, 2008 12:14 PM | Report abuse

Why is Phillip Michael Thomas's musical career so overlooked? In 1985, I was at Q records and tapes on S. Dixie Highway, having finally saved up the $16 to buy Pink Floyd's Ummagumma, and Thomas was there signing copies of his album "Living the Book of My Life". There were four other people there. I wish I'd had the stones to ask him to sign Ummagumma for me.

Posted by: SMACK1 | December 16, 2008 12:37 PM | Report abuse

Don't trade players with value because they're popular? I'm sorry: I love the team, not the players. The players change like clouds in the sky. It's the winning sunshine that makes the day...and the Skins ain't winning this day or the next....

MistaMoe | December 16, 2008 12:25 PM

See the problem is that you and others want these guys traded because you feel that you aren't winning with them, but you're not looking at the areas of the team that is causing this 2nd half meltdown - AGAIN!

Portis, Moss, and others CAN NOT BE TRADED - their salaries prevent this from happening. Well, you could trade them but it'll handcuff the franchise for a few years, and NO ONE would want the contract.

The Madden GMs need to seriously give it a rest with the trade talk - its beyond funny at this point.

Posted by: RedDMV | December 16, 2008 12:37 PM | Report abuse

"The Caps did the right thing in 2003-2004 in trading Jagr and taking the cap hit for the veteran's contract as well as trading away the other vets who were underperforming."

Underperforming is the key word. Moss, Cooley, and Portis do not fit that description.

Gutting Jagr is the equivalent of gutting Jason Taylor, which nobody would mind.

And as much as I love the Caps, you have to admit that their success now was predicated on lucking out and being able to draft a player that could go down as top 10 of all-time when his career is done. That's not exactly something that occurs every year. It would take a substantial amount of luck for the Redskins to land an Ovechkin-equivalent, no matter how many draft picks they acquire in the next 2 years.

It is not sound management to cut guys that can still help your team. There's more than enough dead weight around here that can be let go to cause a "shake-up".

Posted by: psps23 | December 16, 2008 12:38 PM | Report abuse

DOC just asked JC why no deep routes he said it was not in the gameplan.

Also was mentioning that perfect sh!t again.

DOC told him no one is perfect you guys just have to play.

Posted by: Flounder21 | December 16, 2008 12:38 PM | Report abuse

Yes I follow 24 sorta watched that 2 hour episode couple of weeks ago. But I like prison break much better

Patrick swatze????? E???? Don Johnson????? Whaaa ;)

Posted by: dealer1 | December 16, 2008 12:39 PM | Report abuse

All of you that trashing CP. (yes that includes you JLC) What would this team record be with him not in the line up? Just man up and come out and say you don't like the the guy. Leading rusher most of the year and he is the reason the team sucks.

JM220

Posted by: icetotalpackage | December 16, 2008 12:29 PM | Report abuse

Same reason people bust on TO dude.

Posted by: SMACK1 | December 16, 2008 12:39 PM | Report abuse

Yech. That's all you can really say about that game...and about how this season has gone down the tubes...


Still, it may be for the best. No late surge to keep the ownership/GM/Coaches/Fans thinking we have the talent to win this thing, just an ugly, bitter end to the year. That will leave no excuses not to make some needed changes on this team.

The 2004 class is for the most part finished. Let 'em go. Draft lineman, bring in lineman in FA, give tryouts to lineman, whatever it takes to infuse some more youth in those two lines (more the O than the D, but they both need some help).

Portis is probably untradable, so deal with the fact that he is the way he is and emphasize the things he does so well. If he WAS tradable, I'd do it in a heartbeat. All due respect DMV, he's a running back, one of the most easily replaced positions in football, he's Uber-expensive, and he's a malcontent.

Don't draft or pick up any more pass catchers. We'll just have to gamble and see if these kids will develop, or not.

See if any LB's are available in FA or you can grab one in the draft. That's the next position after the O-line to deteriorate now, because of our age. How long can Fletcher keep it up?

Sign Hall back, if the contract demands aren't outrageous. Let Springs go...great he can play safety...for what, 7 games? Not worth the price. See if they can get a Rogers deal done...if not, it can wait a year, IIRC.

Suisham is dead meat if I'm the GM. The guy is last in the league in missed kicks (or first I guess)...good...bye. Maybe he stays to compete with another kicker, but I'm not giving him anything up front, period. Plackmeister is toast. Bring in some punters to tryout.

Leave Zorn, and by extension Campbell, alone. This isn't a quick fix, and pretending it could be by firing a coach and resetting the QB yet again is not an answer.

Accept you will probably regress for at least one year, and be better than today in 2-3 years.

The last part is the hardest - for fans and the ownership. The coaches deep down probably know it has to go that way.

Posted by: shaunsherman12 | December 16, 2008 12:42 PM | Report abuse

Same reason people bust on TO dude.

Posted by: SMACK1

I have to disagree with you on that one Smack. No one comes close to destroying a looker room like TO.

JM220

Posted by: icetotalpackage | December 16, 2008 12:42 PM | Report abuse

I agree that the CP bashing is pretty rediculous. Its soo easy to forget that he was leading the league in rushing by a mile for the first half of the season. But whats even more amazing looking back on it, was that he did it with what is basically the same bunch of worthless O-linemen that we have right now.

Posted by: REDneckSKINhead | December 16, 2008 12:43 PM | Report abuse

Flound, thanks for posting that, makes me glad that I'm unable to listen to that stuff...perfect...what a joke...

Also, if the game plan doesn't change this week versus philly, then I might jump ship on JZorn....he might need to go....If he comes out and runs the same crap, that hasn't worked since October, then he's not understanding this whole thing.....

Posted by: BeantownGreg | December 16, 2008 12:43 PM | Report abuse

JLC doesn't like Portis because CP doesn't talk to him one-on-one.

Aside from being a lousy reporter, he's a whiny little f***er who takes all of this personally. I've got his email replies that underscore that fact.

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | December 16, 2008 12:44 PM | Report abuse

After just listening to JC on the DOC Walker show I see what his problem has been.

He is scared to make any kind of mistake, that is why he only throws to guys that are wide open. This is the NFL guys do not get wide open much.

He needs to throw the ball and stop worrying about this perfect crap.

Posted by: Flounder21 | December 16, 2008 12:44 PM | Report abuse

Okay this is so lame...we got Disney music cassette tapes as a present yesterday!!!! We dont have a tape player. Who does??! Talk about the ultimate regift!!!

Posted by: dealer1 | December 16, 2008 12:44 PM | Report abuse

Get rid of dead weight, not the muscle of your team.

Posted by: psps23 | December 16, 2008 12:12 PM

Perfect! Couldn't agree more.

Now the question is: who exactly is "dead weight"?

Posted by: RedDMV | December 16, 2008 12:44 PM | Report abuse

Same reason people bust on TO dude.

Posted by: SMACK1

I have to disagree with you on that one Smack. No one comes close to destroying a looker room like TO.

JM220

Posted by: icetotalpackage | December 16, 2008 12:42 PM | Report abuse

Been a long time since I had the chance to destroy a looker room. But anyway...

~) Throws his O line under the bus
G) Throws his coach under the bus
+) He can take himself out of the game, but the coach can't take him out of the game, or he'll have a tantrum.

Six of one half-dozen of the other.

Posted by: SMACK1 | December 16, 2008 12:47 PM | Report abuse

Portis ran behind a strong, still fresh, if old O-line in the first part of the season.

Portis ran behind a tired, worn-out, can't make it through the whole schedule anymore O-line the second part.

He couldn't make lemonade out of the that second half lemon of an O-line...no running back can. So why canonize him? Because without him we might have averaged 15 points instead of 16.5?

Posted by: shaunsherman12 | December 16, 2008 12:49 PM | Report abuse

Everyone is born good looking...what makes them ugly is their experience in the world. Some rise above it but most cannot and this turn ugly.

Anyways...I was thinking you guys think that if you took USC defense and Texas offense they could beat the skins or lions?

Posted by: dealer1 | December 16, 2008 12:51 PM | Report abuse

"The Madden GMs need to seriously give it a rest with the trade talk - its beyond funny at this point.

Posted by: RedDMV"

Sorry Red, what would you rather we talk about? We can continue to cry about how our team sucks balls if you want. Please let us know.

Posted by: TheTruth11 | December 16, 2008 12:53 PM | Report abuse

Flounder21, JC worries about being "perfect" because Zorn has drilled it into him. Zorn is the one who does not call deep passes....JC mentioned a few weeks ago that he would love to go deep...he has a big arm.

Zorn also will not even give the Wildcat a try OR try anyone other than Randle El or punt returns (OR Santana if Tana is up to it).

At this point, let JC throw deep to the rookies, let Tryon or Hall run back punts. We are out of it now so why not take risks?

Posted by: Lisa_R | December 16, 2008 12:53 PM | Report abuse

"Now the question is: who exactly is "dead weight"?

Posted by: RedDMV"

Careful there, that's about what all these "Madden GMs" have been talking about.

Posted by: TheTruth11 | December 16, 2008 12:54 PM | Report abuse

One of the better posts I've seen:


And he went through the ENTIRE '06 free agency class, including the one guy that was actually a bargain (Todd Collins).

Let's see, in '06 free agency (and trade), we signed:

WR - $30 million
WR - $30 million
TE -
SS - $30 million
DE - $30 million
QB -

Hmm, looks eerily familiar. Where have I seen that list of positions before?

2008 draft:

WR
WR
TE
SS
DE
QB
G
CB
FS
P

Bottom line, that was the ultimate offseason failure for this franchise. We spent $120 million + on contracts for guys that we needed to replace through the draft just two years later.

Posted by: psps23 | December 16, 2008 8:32 AM

Posted by: zcezcest1 | December 16, 2008 12:54 PM | Report abuse

When did they starting holding comments for approval...

Posted by: mhartz1 | December 16, 2008 12:55 PM | Report abuse

Lisa,

You will get no argument from me. I do not care if it is JC or Zorn someone needs to fix it.

Posted by: Flounder21 | December 16, 2008 12:55 PM | Report abuse

"Been a long time since I had the chance to destroy a looker room. But anyway...

Posted by: SMACK1"

Biiiig difference is that TO has made his teams substantially worse by "destroying the locker room", then leaving the team.

CP is here, and will still be here down the road. He called out his offensive line and his head coach. What are the two biggest talking points for the Redskins right now?

- The offensive line is old, worn-down, and can't get it done. Obvious #1 need heading into the offseason.

- The head coach may not have the chops for this job. He needs to adjust his playcalling and scheme, because what he's doing now isn't good enough.


This is not the case of TO deflating 3 pro-bowl quarterbacks. As I said before, when CP calls out his teammates or coaches, chances are something is wrong.

Posted by: psps23 | December 16, 2008 12:55 PM | Report abuse

I agree Lisa, there's nothing to gain or lose at this point in the season.

I even say give Todd Collins a start and Colt a start. No point in risking injury to JC and it will have the added bonus of shutting up the Cult of Colt people when they see Colt literally die on the field.

Posted by: TheTruth11 | December 16, 2008 12:56 PM | Report abuse

When did they starting holding comments for approval...

Posted by: mhartz1 | December 16, 2008 12:55 PM |

If it is a long comment they hold it.

Posted by: Flounder21 | December 16, 2008 12:56 PM | Report abuse

Lisa, hopefully Zorn realized this week that the whole 'perfect' school of thought needs to go.

I'm not kidding, if against Philly, its the same offense, nothing new, then Zorn needs to go.

Posted by: BeantownGreg | December 16, 2008 12:57 PM | Report abuse

We can't run the wildcat until we pick up Vick from the clank this offseason.

Also, Re: Wildcat....

ARE is NOT a good option. He can not run up or down, just laterally.......

Posted by: DaReal4th | December 16, 2008 12:59 PM | Report abuse

This is not the case of TO deflating 3 pro-bowl quarterbacks. As I said before, when CP calls out his teammates or coaches, chances are something is wrong.

Posted by: psps23 | December 16, 2008 12:55 PM | Report abuse

So it's OK for CP to stab his team in the back simply because the facts are on his side?

Posted by: SMACK1 | December 16, 2008 1:00 PM | Report abuse

Greg,

Agreed,

They need to open the offense up and see what they can do, your loosing every week anyway you've got no chance at the playoffs.

Win or lose this last two games makes no difference see who can help you next year and who can't.

Posted by: Flounder21 | December 16, 2008 1:01 PM | Report abuse

The Skins have always oushed the cap, and that has led to some bad management decisions. They tend to perpetuate. To sign some new player, they renegotiate with someone else ... and that player becomes a cap issue a couple years later. Jansen is the poster child for that. Portis is terrific now, but if he breaks down, we'll be stuck with that one, too.

The Jason Taylor trade was the ultimate 'win now' move. We gave up 2 draft picks AND the ability to clear additional cap space this year.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | December 16, 2008 1:01 PM | Report abuse

Chris Cooley best player on the current roster; you're kidding right? in addition to being slow he is fumble prone and a knucklehead(see his website)and he looked like a lot of the Redskins the past few weeks, "LACKING HEART" as far as CP is concerned name another back who would have gained 1300 yds. with this sorry excuse for an O-line, as fans we need to stop being so reactionary that being said i would look for a backup to CP and as already stated he is untradeable he is not as worn as some of us might think and none of this would be an item had he and Zorn both kept their mouth's shut!!.

Posted by: dargregmag | December 16, 2008 1:01 PM | Report abuse

Flound, I feel like if Zorn does that, as much as I want him to, if he opens it up, and throws the ball all around the place, he'll only open himself up to more criticism, and more speculation.

Posted by: BeantownGreg | December 16, 2008 1:06 PM | Report abuse

Shove it Truth, no one said a damn thing to you.

It's silly to talk about things that can't happen. While we're talking about shti that can't happen, lets discuss more hypothetics; shall we?

BS#1: I would rather float Saturn in a jacuzzi rather than a regular porcerlin tub because Saturn's density is less than that of water, and besides it'll look cool.

BS#2: Lets trade Santana Moss for Randy Moss straight up, because you know, it'll be cool and we wouldn't have to change the name on the back of the jersey.

BS#3: I wonder if I wore my dark blue Armani suit with my italian shoes; would Halle Berry dump her model boyfriend/fiancee for me?

Sounds dumb doesn't it, Truth? I'm just recycling your BS with a few word changes, but the theme is still the same.

Dumbness.

Posted by: RedDMV | December 16, 2008 1:07 PM | Report abuse

I say we go get Haynesworth in FA...draft a LB or OL in the first round, OL in the 3rd round, keep springs, keep Hall, Keep Rogers and Smoot. Springs and Horton can 50/50 the safety position, whoever is not hurt that week. I think we need to cut ARE, Thrash and Yoder. Bring back Marcus Mason as potential back up to Portis and move Betts to Full back...we pound with 2 TE in the lineup and Betts and Portis in backfield. We need to press man cover more, we have one of the best 4 person tandems in the league at CB.

Posted by: mhartz1 | December 16, 2008 1:07 PM | Report abuse

10 thoughts:

1. Bringing in Jason Taylor while giving up two draft picks AND cap space was all about 'winning now'
2. Bringing back all of last years starters from a playoff team was about 'winning now'
3. Not signing any free agents and getting the cap under control was about 'wining later'
4. Keeping all the draft picks was about 'winning later'
5. The offensive line got old very quickly. In the week between game 8 and game 9.
6. Character has left the building. Gibbs 2.0 was hardly perfect, but no one disrespected Gibbs the way Portis did Zorn.
7. Gibbs chose not to run Portis against the jints at the goal line last year and lost. Zorn does the same thing vs Cincy this year. Different coaches, same brain freeze.
8. Where is the solid base to build from? 15 of our top 30 players will be done within 3 years. Our 2 best asst coaches are likely to retire. The HC, GM (aka exec VP) and owner have no track record of success in the jobs they hold.
9. Bill Cowher isn't coming here
10. Its time to see the rookies on the field. All of them.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | December 16, 2008 1:07 PM | Report abuse

Flound, I feel like if Zorn does that, as much as I want him to, if he opens it up, and throws the ball all around the place, he'll only open himself up to more criticism, and more speculation.

Posted by: BeantownGreg | December 16, 2008 1:06 PM |

Why because it will probably work and he should have done it earlier, I can see that.

Posted by: Flounder21 | December 16, 2008 1:08 PM | Report abuse

I just had a vision of ARE running the Wildcat.

He runs left 3 yards, then right 6 yards, then falls down for a gain of zero yards.

Posted by: TheTruth11 | December 16, 2008 1:10 PM | Report abuse

I say we go all the way vs. the Eagles, let it rip and lets see what some of these kids can do, JC included. M. Kelly is huge, D. Thomas is damn quick, as is Moss - air it out on 2nd and 3rd down, still pound Portis. You cant win if you dont try!

Posted by: mhartz1 | December 16, 2008 1:11 PM | Report abuse

Yeah, lets say, he throws the balls to the rookies, and they produce, because they're being USED, doesn't that make what he's done all year with them seem foolish.

Posted by: BeantownGreg | December 16, 2008 1:12 PM | Report abuse

Truth, you're an azzhole, word to my mother.

Why all the slick-talkin' posts? Whats up with tall the corny ass wit, boy?

Your mother working that steel mill part time job today? She isn't there to give you the "tit" treatment?

If you're looking for attention, go bother chrisLarry, but then again he hates you more than I, so it looks like you're SOL.

F&*k off, d-bag.

Posted by: RedDMV | December 16, 2008 1:13 PM | Report abuse

darg,

Take it easy on Cooley. He does tend to fumble but it's not like he puts it on the ground as soon as he's hit. It's usually because he's fighting for more yards. He's not afraid to go over the middle or lay out and take the hit to get a catch.

I don't see how his website makes him a knucklehead. He's a quirky guy who doesn't give canned answers to questions. The kind of guy fans love and he's a good teammate by all accounts.

Posted by: Original_etrod | December 16, 2008 1:13 PM | Report abuse

Truth, that sounds about accurate, maybe a twirl in there once or twice...

D. Hall is pretty damn good at returning punts and we have depth at CB if he gets hurt, plus leverage in talks...

Posted by: mhartz1 | December 16, 2008 1:13 PM | Report abuse

yikes! i'm trying to find any good news anywhere and i just can't...everything about the economy's down, skins suck, terps don't have any blue chipers, wiz suck, nats don't want to spend any money...everwhere i look there's doom and gloom.

we needed this experiment to work more than ever!!! to cheer something about, to get our minds off of more important, very sad stuff. i guess that's why this hurts the most this year. and i'm hoping this hurts danny boy too in his bank account.

Posted by: dealer1 | December 16, 2008 1:14 PM | Report abuse

"So it's OK for CP to stab his team in the back simply because the facts are on his side?

Posted by: SMACK1"

Well, the way I see it, Portis' criticisms could actually benefit the team. Maybe Portis' comments about Zorn turned on a light in Zorn's head that his scheme isn't actually perfect. Maybe Portis' comments about his o-line will spark Vinny to realize that although he has a great RB, his stats will never rival those of the other "stud" RBs because he doesn't have the line to go with it.

Now, it was not "okay" for CP to do it the way he did. Were his comments self-serving? Yes. Were they in a professional manner? No. But by calling out his teammates, his comments could prove to be constructive. It probably would have been better for him to do that in private, however.

TO's comments, on top of being self-serving, were completely wrong. Half of them weren't even football based (Garcia's sexuality, Romo and Witten conspiring against the rest of the WRs, McNabb being jealous of TO in Philly).

I'm not saying I liked what CP did. Not at all. But it's not the same as Terrell Owens' situations with SF and PHI, and his plain incorrect assumptions with Tony Romo.

Posted by: psps23 | December 16, 2008 1:14 PM | Report abuse

Jla- do you have any "insider" information or is that just a catchy name for your blog?

Posted by: Ilikecougars | December 16, 2008 1:14 PM | Report abuse

$24 Million in cap space buys you 3 quality linemen, plus 1 starting LB. We use the draft on TOP DL and Top OL with 1st and 3rd round picks. Now we have 5 quality linemen added to this group, 3 OL and 2 DL with another LB to replace Marcus. This will not be building through the draft but with Haynesworth and a few quality OL UFA out there I think we can turn things around next year and hopefully keep our 2010 draft picks to help build for the future.

Posted by: 1footballguru | December 16, 2008 1:16 PM | Report abuse

but we'll always have red vs. t1

Posted by: dealer1 | December 16, 2008 1:16 PM | Report abuse

Dealer, become a SJ Sharks fan. There is lot in that tunnel ... and its not an oncoming train

Posted by: zcezcest1 | December 16, 2008 1:17 PM | Report abuse

I dont know if he does or not, but I LIKE COUGARS TOO!

I going to catch hell for this, but I would like to get a more aggressive Defensive Coordinator...

Posted by: mhartz1 | December 16, 2008 1:17 PM | Report abuse

More hypothetical BS:

I think it'll be better to take a 60 year nap becasue by the time I reach the end of the solar system I won't be that sleepy.

I can't wait for the light year to hurry up and pass.

Posted by: RedDMV | December 16, 2008 1:18 PM | Report abuse

ummm, 'light' in that tunnel, not 'lot'. I gotta review my typoing more

Posted by: zcezcest1 | December 16, 2008 1:19 PM | Report abuse

I agree with one thing you said, Red.

The "Dumbness." part.


Jeeze, lighten up.

Posted by: TheTruth11 | December 16, 2008 1:20 PM | Report abuse

Yep lets rag on Cooley, Moss, and Portis...

Man, WHAT. THE. F&*K!?!?!?!?!?!

Are they perfect? NO! But, they're the least of the problems.

Wow.

Posted by: RedDMV | December 16, 2008 1:20 PM | Report abuse

Anyone know if that Cody kid from AL is coming out in this draft?

What other DT will be available to us that will make an honest impact - unlike V. Gholston for the Jets?

Posted by: mhartz1 | December 16, 2008 1:21 PM | Report abuse

speaking of Gholston, he was a healthy scratch for the Jets this past weekened....must be a bust...

Posted by: BeantownGreg | December 16, 2008 1:23 PM | Report abuse

You all have a Happy Holidays! I am out.

Posted by: mhartz1 | December 16, 2008 1:23 PM | Report abuse

Well, the way I see it, Portis' criticisms could actually benefit the team.

Posted by: psps23 | December 16, 2008 1:14 PM | Report abuse

If by "team", you mean the Bengals, then sure, worked like a charm.

Posted by: SMACK1 | December 16, 2008 1:24 PM | Report abuse

Man, I've been in that lock down forever. I'm out.

The Redskins suck, but we can't trade Portis. No one will take him. It's kind of like trying to give away Dumplins that have been sh*t on in the Prison Yard.

Posted by: PrisonBalls00 | December 16, 2008 1:24 PM | Report abuse

Unrestricted FA OL for 2009
Matt Birk, UFA, Minnesota Vikings
Birk is a Pro Bowl center who has gotten the job done for the Vikings for the last decade. He’s fairly athletic for a lineman and is playing alongside another great lineman, guard Steve Hutchinson, making Birk’s life even easier on the field. He’s grounded in Minnesota, so the chances of him choosing to leave seem slim at the moment. However, Minnesota is grooming John Sullivan in hopes that he will eventually replace Birk.

Marc Colombo, UFA, Dallas Cowboys
Although he was injury prone early in his career, Colombo has become a solid tackle in Dallas. He allowed just a single sack in his first go round with the Cowboys and he has since been a big reason for the success of the running game and the protection afforded to Tony Romo. At 29, teams will consider the fact that he probably has several seasons left in him.

Mike Goff, UFA, San Diego Chargers
While the Chargers would probably prefer to keep Goff, the franchise has been effective in drafting and developing linemen and might look for Goff’s replacement at a better price. Goff has been a leader who simply goes about his business and players like running back Ladainian Tomlinson have benefited from his level of play. Goff has played for a quality line for some time and he’s a big part of the equation when it comes to success.

Jordan Gross, UFA, Carolina Panthers
A first round pick in 2003, Gross earned a starting role in his rookie season and held that role as a tackle for the entire season. His ability to step in and play well right away paid off for the Panthers, as the team put together a run to an NFC Championship. He’s continued being a starter since that rookie season and is a solid player. Carolina slapped the franchise tag on him for this season, and chances are he will be another team come ’09.

Mark Tauscher, UFA, Green Bay Packers
Tauscher is a seventh round pick that became a success story. In his first season in the NFL, he was forced into a starting role because of an injury to another player. Tauscher isn’t an elite player, but he is solid in his role as a starter and hasn’t missed a game since 2002. Tauscher could be at the top of many team’s lists because he could come cheaper than some of the other free agent lineman, but could be nearly or equally effective.

Other Offensive Lineman
Stacy Andrews, UFA, Cincinnati Bengals
Jordan Black, UFA, Houston Texans
Vernon Carey, UFA, Miami Dolphins
George Foster, UFA, Detroit Lions
Chris Gray, UFA, Seattle Seahawks
Pete Kendall, UFA, Washington Redskins
Seth McKinney, UFA, Cleveland Browns
Jon Runyan, UFA, Philadelphia Eagles
Tra Thomas, UFA, Philadelphia Eagles
Fred Weary, UFA, Houston Texans
John Welbourn, UFA, Kansas City Chiefs

Posted by: 1footballguru | December 16, 2008 1:25 PM | Report abuse

Unrestricted FA DL
Julius Peppers, UFA, Carolina Panthers
A freakish athlete, Peppers struggled in ’07, but has come back strong in ’08. Teams will be lining up to try and lure him away from Carolina with a huge contract offer. The 6’7” end has nine sacks and five forced fumbles through ten games. He could be the top free agent player as teams look to add an end that has had double-digit sack totals four times in six seasons, including 13 in ’06. He also has four career interceptions and has been making quarterback’s lives miserable since he entered the league. Peppers probably shouldn’t be able to do some of the things that he can and many teams would prefer to have those things happening for them rather than against them.

Albert Haynesworth, UFA, Tennessee Titans
Haynesworth has had his share of controversy surrounding him, but lately he’s turned things around and has focused on simply playing the game. He has improved upon his ’07 season when he made six sacks and 40 tackles in 13 games. Through week eleven he has 39 tackles, seven sacks, and two forced fumbles. The Titans look like a different team on defense depending on whether or not Haynesworth is on the field; with him on the field they are one of the best defenses in the league because of the pressure he took off of others. Expect Tennessee to work hard to keep him in hopes that he continues to bolster their defensive play as a whole.

Terrell Suggs, UFA, Baltimore Ravens
Being a converted linebacker has helped Suggs become a defensive end that can track the ball above average. In his first five seasons, Suggs had 299 tackles and 45 sacks to his credit. Through eleven weeks of the current season he is putting together another strong showing with 47 tackles, five sacks, and two interceptions. Suggs may not be as rewarded as Peppers or Haynesworth will be in free agency, but he will certainly be pursued by a number of teams who want to save a little money and still come away with a quality defensive end. Baltimore is constantly pumping out quality defensive players, so they may not be willing to match a big offer if one comes along, but they will miss Suggs if they lose him.

Bertrand Berry, UFA, Arizona Cardinals
Berry has four sacks and two forced fumbles for the Cardinals in eight games of action. He may not be the most coveted potential free agent at his position, but he’s definitely effective when he’s healthy and playing his best. He’ll be looked at as a role player on the market and there’s a decent chance that the Cardinals will move on.

Other Defensive Linemen
Jonathan Babineaux, UFA, Atlanta Falcons
Bertrand Berry, UFA, Arizona Cardinals
Kevin Carter, UFA, Tampa Bay Buccaneers
Shaun Cody, UFA, Detroit Lions
Tank Johnson, UFA, Dallas Cowboys
John Thornton, UFA, Cincinnati Bengals
Marcus Tubbs, UFA, Seattle Seahawks

Posted by: 1footballguru | December 16, 2008 1:26 PM | Report abuse

This week in Good Choices/Bad Choices

Good choice: Vinny skips his radio show where fans would have gone nuts on him
Bad choice: Going to a league meeting where all your peers are laughing at you behind your back ... because you lost to Cincy

And that's all for this week in Good Choices/Bad Choices

Posted by: zcezcest1 | December 16, 2008 1:26 PM | Report abuse

I all for cuttin somebody...as long as I can use that Colon Shank!

Posted by: PrisonBalls00 | December 16, 2008 1:28 PM | Report abuse

Good choice : RedDepartmentofMotorVehicles logging onto Redskins Insider this morning.

Bad choice : RedDepartmentofMotorVehicles posting comments on Redskins Insider this morning.

Posted by: TheTruth11 | December 16, 2008 1:28 PM | Report abuse

of those OL prospects, Gross, and Andrews to me are the most appealing...

Philly could be in a pickle with both their starting tackles.....

Posted by: BeantownGreg | December 16, 2008 1:29 PM | Report abuse

agreed Red, silly talk,

Posted by: chrislarry | December 16, 2008 1:31 PM | Report abuse

With JLC's info as reference I'll take a stab at Armchair GM for the offseason.

Fire:
Danny Smith

Cut:
Washington
Griffin
Taylor
Thrash
Daniels

Resign:
Evans
Campbell
Albright
Fincher
Green

Sign all Restricted Free agents

Free Agency:
Look for cheap and young D-Linemen, O-Linemen, and Linebackers. No trying to trade for former pro bowlers who are expensive and have no upside. Check for any punters and/or kickers that may be available to possibly replace Suisham and/or Plackemeier.

Draft:
Trade back in the first round and keep trying to trade back in rounds to recoup the draft picks lost. Target O and D Linemen, Linebackers and either another CB or WR specifically to return punts and kicks.

Offense:
Coaches need to get Thomas, Kelly, Davis, and Rinehart ready to contribute next season. We need to get Kelly or Thomas as the eventual starter opposite Moss so Randle El can move back tot he slot. Davis needs to be backing up Cooley next season not Yoder. Rinehart needs to be brought in as the starter to replace Kendall or as the primary guard backup if someone else is brought in through Free Agency or the Draft. Heyer needs to start at RT with Jansen as the primary backup since we have to keep him one more year.


Defense:
Springs needs to be back despite his injury history because I wouldn't break the bank to resign Hall. Coaches need to reevaluate some of the players that have been on the roster a few years but have played below expectations or haven't made any real impact. (Wilson, Doughty, Blades, Mcintosh, Rogers, Montgomery, and yes Landry too) Coaches also need to make sure the Defensive draft picks from last year not name Horton are ready to be every game contributors and not sitting on the inactive list every game. (Moore, Jackson, Tryon) Need to identify potential replacements for Andre Carter, London Fletcher, and Fred Smoot who are at or over 30 and need to be replaced after next season.

Special Teams:
A Returner who can field both Kickoffs AND Punts must be found. A new coach needs to be brought in to get more out of current group. Need to look for upgrades at Kicker and Punter before training camp. There doesn't need to be any Kicking competition again during Preseason. Either find replacements before Training camp or stick with what we have if they can't find anyone.

Posted by: moseley_brian | December 16, 2008 1:32 PM | Report abuse

More hypothetical BS:

When I'm blowing my piff with former president Bill Clinton and president-elect Obama, I'd make sure to inquire about the national debt, that presidential book of secrets, and Truth's bulldogs...

Posted by: RedDMV | December 16, 2008 1:34 PM | Report abuse

"More hypothetical BS:

When I'm blowing my piff with former president Bill Clinton and president-elect Obama, I'd make sure to inquire about the national debt, that presidential book of secrets, and Truth's bulldogs...

Posted by: RedDMV"

Would you rather this blog have zero responses? Jeeze, I'm sorry the text hurts you so much, but give it a rest.


And if you have any questions about the Bulldogs, I'll be happy to answer them.

Posted by: TheTruth11 | December 16, 2008 1:36 PM | Report abuse

"If by "team", you mean the Bengals, then sure, worked like a charm.

Posted by: SMACK1"

That's true, we're hurting right now. But again, the difference is that Portis won't bolt town the way TO did to SF and PHI.

Posted by: psps23 | December 16, 2008 1:37 PM | Report abuse

Dead Weight::

Jansen
Thrash
Griffin
Taylor
M. Washington
Springs
R. Thomas
P. Kendall
Yoder

This team should not rush into free agency and cash in on the first big name they see. History suggests that most big name free agents do not produce once transplanted... a lot of their success comes from the situation they are in.

Don't dump Zorn or Cambell (although Campbell should not be given a long leash) just yet. I think that we will find Zorn is a better coach than this late season dive suggests. Zorn is only as good as the talent he has on hand. If anything good could be drawn from this season, it is that we know with very little doubt what the off-season needs are for this team. I am not convinced that Zorn finding this out is really all that bad. The reality is that we have gone for some time now without a high caliber offense; (even Gibbs 2 could not come close to producing the same results as during his prior reign)

One thing that remains a constant in this league is the need to control the line of scrimmage; we have not done this for a long time.Focus on long term successes through the draft. We have a person in the Front Office who would put this team back on the map and if Snyder had any balls he would put Morroco Brown in charge of draft day.

Posted by: grizzlyaka | December 16, 2008 1:37 PM | Report abuse

Good choice: TheTruth letting his girl hang out with her girls.

Bad choice: TheTruth kissing that same broad after "hanging" out with her girlfriends.

You're such a LOSER. Gosh dude, You make me wretched!

GO. AWAY.

Posted by: RedDMV | December 16, 2008 1:41 PM | Report abuse

"speaking of Gholston, he was a healthy scratch for the Jets this past weekened....must be a bust..."

Beantown thats exactly what they are calling him up here in NYC.

Posted by: chrislarry | December 16, 2008 1:41 PM | Report abuse

"Dead Weight::

Jansen
Thrash
Griffin
Taylor
M. Washington
Springs
R. Thomas
P. Kendall
Yoder"

Posted by: grizzlyaka

I agree with everyone on this list, with the exception of R. Thomas. I'd swap his name with Rabach, who's been blown back off the line numerous times this year. I think Thomas' woes stem more from being situated next to Jon Jansen. He can hold out for another year or two, IMO.

I'd also add Phillip Daniels and Fred Smoot to that list.

Posted by: psps23 | December 16, 2008 1:44 PM | Report abuse

cl, really? Thats WAY premature. Did he play in a 4-3, or a 3-4 in college??

Tell the Jets to cut him, and we'll take him off their hands.

Posted by: BeantownGreg | December 16, 2008 1:47 PM | Report abuse

psp, agreed on smooty, he seems to have forgotten how to cover....

Posted by: BeantownGreg | December 16, 2008 1:48 PM | Report abuse

maybe premature but if you cant contribute on the sorry azz Jets D....you might suck.

Posted by: chrislarry | December 16, 2008 1:50 PM | Report abuse

not-so hypothetical BS:

When I make one of my many trips to Charleston to visit friends, I spot a toothless, "out-of-shape", scraggly faced chick. Just for the hell of it, I ask does she know a guy who cheers for the Geogria Bulldogs, still lives at home with his moms, and has bouts with bipolar.

Without hesitation she suggests that person must blog on voices.washingtonpost.com/redskinsinsider, and goes by the name TheTruth11. She then asks about the one guy who he seems to have some sort of obsession over: RedDMV.

I let the not so-attractive broad know that I am he, she then wants to see what the obsession is all about - she gets a "taste" of my swag, then validates TheTruth's obsession - personally.

Posted by: RedDMV | December 16, 2008 1:51 PM | Report abuse

"psp, agreed on smooty, he seems to have forgotten how to cover....

Posted by: BeantownGreg"

I don't know what happened to the guy. Last season following ST's death, he was playing the best football of anybody on the team, bar none. And he was playing tight, tight man coverage. I have no idea where that went.

Posted by: psps23 | December 16, 2008 1:53 PM | Report abuse

"Good choice: TheTruth letting his girl hang out with her girls.

Bad choice: TheTruth kissing that same broad after "hanging" out with her girlfriends.

You're such a LOSER. Gosh dude, You make me wretched!

GO. AWAY.

Posted by: RedDMV"

I don't get it.


Why don't you stop playing blog police and let people talk about Redskins football however they want?

It was pretty good conversation until you busted in telling everyone to shut up.

Posted by: TheTruth11 | December 16, 2008 1:54 PM | Report abuse

To me the Redskins future challenge is simple. You've got to become dominant within the NFC East first, everything else is moot. Now compare these team lists and see which team you'd rather be next year:

Iggles:
QB - McNabb (definite after last 3 years)
RB - Westbrook, Buchalter
WR - Westbrook, Jackson, Curtis, Avanti, Baskett
TE - Lewis plus guys whose name I can't remember
OL - solid, maybe needs a tweak or two
Defense - very solid, great schemes, very very good secondary

Giants:
QB - Eli
RB - Jacobs, Ward, Bradshaw
WR - Ward, Toomer, Smith, Hixon
TE - Boss
OL - current best in football
Defense - top 3

Grrls:
QB - Romo
RB - Barber, Choice, Jones
WR - TO, Fitzgerald, Crayton Austin
TE - Witten, Bennett
OL - very solid
Defense - good line, suspect secondary, but improving

Skins:
QB - JC
RB - Portis, Betts
WR - Moss, ARE, Thrash, Kelly, Thomas
TE - Cooley, Yoder, Davis
OL - tired, in need of rebuilding
Defense - DL needs rebuilding, secondary is very good

Take off the fan-colo(u)red glasses for a moment and tell me which roster you would rather go into next season with. I love you guys, but you really do have the weakest roster in your division, so why are you surprised you are finishing fourth this year and may well do so again next year?

If you want to beat the other three teams on a regular basis you have to;

%. Hope they get worse (a bad plan).
7. Plan to get better/younger (costs money and picks).
m. Add in an 'X factor' like an inspirational coach to close the gap with 'belief'.

As Zorn isn't yet an inspirational coach, and doesn't strike me as the sort to become one, that means you have to go with % or 7.

My Fins are having a great season, but we still have the weakest roster of the 4 teams in our division, we just have some inspired leadership, plus NE are without Tom Brady Old Lady, and the Bills have imploded. Otherwise we're still #4 in the AFC East. The real test for us comes next year when we have to strengthen everywhere on the roster.

Posted by: Redcoat | December 16, 2008 1:57 PM | Report abuse

It was pretty good conversation until you busted in telling everyone to shut up.

Posted by: TheTruth11 | December 16, 2008 1:54 PM

And the world was a pretty good place until your parents decided to participate procreation.

GO. AWAY.

Posted by: RedDMV | December 16, 2008 1:59 PM | Report abuse

rc, both tackles for Philly are hitting free agency, and shawn andrews has back issues, so I'd say that they might be very similar to us in that regard.

Posted by: BeantownGreg | December 16, 2008 2:01 PM | Report abuse

I don't think Red has an issue with arm chair GMing per se, I think he reacts negatively, as do I, to the "Sports talk caller" type comment

i.e.:

"yeah this is c larry from the BK. first time/long time. I think we should trade portis and moss to the vikings for AP and three #2 draft picks. then sign Boldin for league minimum. After that we can stock the O/D lines with cheap probowlers off the street."

am i right Red, if i am not let me know with a string of blue insults!

Posted by: chrislarry | December 16, 2008 2:01 PM | Report abuse

I meant McNabb is definite after last 3 WEEKS play. :)

Posted by: Redcoat | December 16, 2008 2:01 PM | Report abuse

I don't live in Charleston anymore, Red.

Posted by: TheTruth11 | December 16, 2008 2:01 PM | Report abuse

+++So which argument do you want to make -- that they chose the wrong guys at the right positions, or that they chose the wrong positions?

Posted by: daggar++++

Yes.

To clarify: Had they chosen the right guy with one of the receiver picks, they could have spent the other ones more wisely.

My point is in rounds 2 through 4, the Redskins, in need of help at many positions, took five guys who haven’t helped them anywhere.

Then, before you can say “drafting for the future,” they squander some of the the future on a broken down DE.

You have to be delusional to think these picks weren’t needed this year. You bring in a new coach with a WCO, and tell him his #2 receivers have to be Randle El and Thrash? You look at the oldest line in the NFL and think, no need to bring in stud blockers… You draft a guy as your nickel and he can’t get on the field?

I hope ALL THREE receivers “get it” next year. But by then, the both lines will have fallen apart, there will probably be a new coach, the defense is in a shambles, and they STILL don’t have a punter, a field goal kicker, or a punt returner.

Posted by: TheCork | December 16, 2008 2:02 PM | Report abuse

You're right, although I think the Iggles have the cap space to fix that though Greg.

Posted by: Redcoat | December 16, 2008 2:03 PM | Report abuse

rc, 2 tackles?? They might have the cap space, doesn't mean they're going to spend it.....I don't see McNabb back in Philly after this year......

Posted by: BeantownGreg | December 16, 2008 2:05 PM | Report abuse

there is no doubt we have the least amount of talent/depth in nfc east, anyone who argues differently if coo coo for coco puffs.

fire vinny......i am on dealers (short) bus.

Posted by: chrislarry | December 16, 2008 2:06 PM | Report abuse

That's true, we're hurting right now. But again, the difference is that Portis won't bolt town the way TO did to SF and PHI.

Posted by: psps23 | December 16, 2008 1:37 PM | Report abuse

Bolt town? You couldn't get rid of him if you wanted to. Again, he's got you by the short hairs.

Posted by: SMACK1 | December 16, 2008 2:07 PM | Report abuse

if=is

mcnabb will be back...reid maybe not.

Posted by: chrislarry | December 16, 2008 2:07 PM | Report abuse

We're stuck with Portis probably until a year after he's any good.

Posted by: TheTruth11 | December 16, 2008 2:08 PM | Report abuse

If they make the playoffs Reid is definitiely back. If Reid is back McNabb is back.

Can't they at least franchise one of the tackles? Gets them into a possibly uncapped year...

If those things don't happen, you guys get the benefit and one of your rivals gets weaker. Now you have the #3 roster in the NFC East...

I really think you guys have to build to win your division, if you can't win that you'll never have a strong playoff run.

Posted by: Redcoat | December 16, 2008 2:09 PM | Report abuse

++++Albert Haynesworth, UFA, Tennessee Titans
Haynesworth has had his share of controversy surrounding him, but lately he’s turned things around and has focused on simply playing the game. ++++

Pass. Here's why. Big Daddy and Stumblefield. Those guys were beasts until they got the big payday. Then they stunk. Guess who got them during the stinking years?

Yup. YOUR Washington Redskins....

Like it or not DC has become a haven for guys in it for the money. It's happened time and time again. Snyder and Vinny have kind of a free agent Radar for finding guys who will mail it in once the check clears.

It's hard work and smarts, but the key is to hunt out people who want to win and will play hard AFTER they sign and stay healthy enough to play. So far, that's been limited to Fletcher and um....

...help me out here....


Posted by: TheCork | December 16, 2008 2:10 PM | Report abuse

FA OL I'd like to get some opinions on both on the Saints roster.

Jon Stinchcomb
Jhari Evans

Also, I noticed Tommie Harris is a FA this. He's been injured the last couple of years. Any chances the Bears let him hit the market?

Posted by: TWISI | December 16, 2008 2:11 PM | Report abuse

"It's hard work and smarts, but the key is to hunt out people who want to win and will play hard AFTER they sign and stay healthy enough to play. So far, that's been limited to Fletcher and um....

...help me out here....


Posted by: TheCork"


LaVar!?!

Posted by: TheTruth11 | December 16, 2008 2:12 PM | Report abuse

Jon Stinchcomb played at UGA!

10/10 sign him to a 10-year 75 million contract!

Posted by: TheTruth11 | December 16, 2008 2:13 PM | Report abuse

rc, Tra Thomas, and Jon Runyan, neither of which are worth tagging, both are older than you'd want for starting tackles...

Posted by: BeantownGreg | December 16, 2008 2:15 PM | Report abuse

def pass on haynesworth....his injury history alone is a red flag. corky is right he is typical redskins mistake signing.

Posted by: chrislarry | December 16, 2008 2:15 PM | Report abuse

T1, I'm calling this one. I'm throwing in the towel for you. Redmv, I'm sure everyone is LTAO just like me but I can't help but feel guilty. this fight just ain't fair.

Posted by: dealer1 | December 16, 2008 2:17 PM | Report abuse

I enjoy the lengthy lists of starters that people want gone right away. Exactly who is going to fill these slots?

Guys who are totally unproven. Do you really want an OL with Reinhart, Geisinger, Rabach, TBD and Samuels?

Yes, this roster is going to get turned over. I estimate 15+ slots from our top 30 guys in the next 3 years. That is a lot of turnover and the trick will be figuring out who to let go and when.

Blow it all up at once and we become the Bengals. Though, after Sunday, is that an upgrade??

Posted by: zcezcest1 | December 16, 2008 2:18 PM | Report abuse

b-town you are splitting hairs RC is %100 correct in roster comparrison in nfc east....even eagles aging o-linemen are better than our aging o-lineman...

viiiinnnny muuuust gooooooo vinnnnny muuust gooooo! (sung to tune of tomahawk chop chant)

Posted by: chrislarry | December 16, 2008 2:18 PM | Report abuse

corky, gotta ask, if this team makes you so miserable, and they're so full of incompetence in your mind, why follow them?

Posted by: BeantownGreg | December 16, 2008 2:19 PM | Report abuse

cL, your 2:01 sums it up.

That call sounds like something some clueless idiot would come on the air and say. Living in NY I know you must hear that shti all the time, because here in D.C. I hear it on the regular.

Let's cut him. Let's sign him. let's fire him... it's like some people are living their Madden fantasy, by spewing hypo B dot S.

Keep it on the 360s and PS3s.

Posted by: RedDMV | December 16, 2008 2:19 PM | Report abuse

"Bolt town? You couldn't get rid of him if you wanted to. Again, he's got you by the short hairs.

Posted by: SMACK1"

There is ALWAYS a way to get rid of somebody. Are you telling me Lavar Arrington wasn't just as beloved or didn't have just as much of an "untradeable" contract?

No matter how you put it, Portis is nowhere near TO's level. You want to compare him to somebody? Compare him to Tiki Barber. That at least would be a fair comparison that I would accept.

Posted by: psps23 | December 16, 2008 2:20 PM | Report abuse

Grrls:
QB - Romo
RB - Barber, Choice, Jones
WR - TO, Fitzgerald, Crayton Austin
TE - Witten, Bennett
OL - very solid
Defense - good line, suspect secondary, but improving

Redcoat, are we getting F. Scott or Ella? i don't think we're getting Larry.

Posted by: SMACK1 | December 16, 2008 2:20 PM | Report abuse

Hey SMACK! Good catch, I gave you Larry when I should have given you the 'other' (good) Roy Williams. Sorry about that.

And congratulations on trouncing me in our consolation fantasy game this week - without even fielding a quarterback!!

Posted by: Redcoat | December 16, 2008 2:24 PM | Report abuse

No matter how you put it, Portis is nowhere near TO's level. You want to compare him to somebody? Compare him to Tiki Barber. That at least would be a fair comparison that I would accept.

Posted by: psps23 | December 16, 2008 2:20 PM | Report abuse

Alright psps23. I think you're cutting him too much slack because of the maroon pants, but we'll go with Tiki for the moment.

Posted by: SMACK1 | December 16, 2008 2:26 PM | Report abuse

The Skins should cut: Batiste, Boschetti, Khary Campbell, Clark, Collins, Daniels, Doughty, Fabini, Fincher, Griffin, Will Montgomery, Moore, Plackemier, Suiseham, Thrash, Tryon, Washington, and Wilson.

They should resign: Albright, Evans, Hall, Kendall, Golston, Green, and Montgomery.

FA Signings: (1) DT Haynesworth, (2) SLB Terrell Suggs, (3) Starting RT, (4) #2 WR, (5) Kicker, (6) Punter, (7) Starting LG, (8) Veteran Backup T, (9) Backup LB who can play ST, (10) Punt Returner

Draft Needs: LB, C, RT, DE, G, QB

New Coaches: Special Teams, Strength

Posted by: siris | December 16, 2008 2:28 PM | Report abuse

The only way we could trade Portis for a 1st or even a 2nd is if we are allowed to trade with ourselves.

Hey!

If present Danny could get permission from the league to make trades with future Danny, we could solve all our personnel problems!

Posted by: farstriker | December 16, 2008 2:28 PM | Report abuse

Hey SMACK! Good catch, I gave you Larry when I should have given you the 'other' (good) Roy Williams. Sorry about that.

And congratulations on trouncing me in our consolation fantasy game this week - without even fielding a quarterback!!

Posted by: Redcoat | December 16, 2008 2:24 PM | Report abuse

I didn't even know consolation games were being played. It's a lesson for Snyder. My team finally won when I stopped sjking around with it for five minutes.

Posted by: SMACK1 | December 16, 2008 2:30 PM | Report abuse

We have two more weeks of games SMACK. And it serves me right for picking up Tarvaris Jackson just so you couldn't replace Gus with him!!

Posted by: Redcoat | December 16, 2008 2:31 PM | Report abuse

haynesworth is fools gold for skins. any other team he shines, but you know if he comes here he is stubblefield 2.0. We will wish he was half the player big daddy was for us.

Posted by: chrislarry | December 16, 2008 2:31 PM | Report abuse

I'll take Haynesworth over Griffin any day...

Posted by: siris | December 16, 2008 2:33 PM | Report abuse

On ESPN radio this morning Mike Tirico said that because of the questions regarding the collective bargaining agreement, he's hearing that a much larger than normal group of underclassmen will declare for the draft this year. He referred to it as a "real stud class."

And yes, I'm mentioning it partly to take a shot as Vinny for trading away draft picks this year.

Posted by: TheCork | December 16, 2008 2:33 PM | Report abuse

corky, gotta ask, if this team makes you so miserable, and they're so full of incompetence in your mind, why follow them?

Posted by: BeantownGreg | December 16, 2008 2:19 PM | Report abuse

Great question! I'd also like to add: "America, Love IT or Leave It"
and
"Shut up and get back in line!"

Posted by: mack1 | December 16, 2008 2:35 PM | Report abuse

We have two more weeks of games SMACK. And it serves me right for picking up Tarvaris Jackson just so you couldn't replace Gus with him!!

Posted by: Redcoat | December 16, 2008 2:31 PM | Report abuse

Well if that ain't the nadir of fantasy pettiness, I reckon I don't know what is!

Posted by: SMACK1 | December 16, 2008 2:36 PM | Report abuse

corky, gotta ask, if this team makes you so miserable, and they're so full of incompetence in your mind, why follow them?

Posted by: BeantownGreg | December 16, 2008 2:36 PM | Report abuse

List of 'top 30' guys who will be gone in 3 years, mostly due to age:

Portis, Sellers
Moss or ARE
Jansen, Thomas, Kendall
Collins
Carter, Griffin, Taylor, Daniels
Fletcher, Washington
Springs

Other guys who could also be gone due to age/health issues:
Samuels, Rabach

At risk:
Smoot, Doughty, Rocky

From the 2008 opening day list of starters, that is 8 of the 11 offensive starters (only Cooley, Campbell and 1 WR remain) and 7 of 11 defensive starters.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | December 16, 2008 2:37 PM | Report abuse

++++there is no doubt we have the least amount of talent/depth in nfc east, anyone who argues differently if coo coo for coco puffs.

fire vinny......i am on dealers (short) bus.

Posted by: chrislarry ++++

If I ain't driving that muther, I at least got Shotgun.

Posted by: TheCork | December 16, 2008 2:38 PM | Report abuse

"I think you're cutting him too much slack because of the maroon pants

Posted by: SMACK1"

Could be. Could also be that you're judging him too harshly because of the maroon pants as well. And/or taking TO's exploits too lightly because of the silver & blue.

Unfortunately, no way to find out how our biases distort the opinions on this blog. We'd probably have to go to a Jacksonville Jaguars blog to find an objective opinion.

Posted by: psps23 | December 16, 2008 2:40 PM | Report abuse

Agree, Portis is more like Tiki than TO.

When did Portis become a problem child? All the great ones have diva like attitudes... Michael Jordan, and all though he did a great job at masking it to the public Jerry Rice (yeah that one) was a prima donna as well.

Hell we'll bring it a little close to home - John Riggins had the same diva, prima donna like behavior too.

But because he won a super bowl (which I'm sure he won all by himself - since many of the Portis haters sarcastically think he does it all by himself) he gets a pass.

Funny.

And people wonder why does everything turn into a racial issue (and for the record I AM not making it one or believe it is) They have the same type of behavior, known for production on the field, but thet way the fans and the media view and treat them is inconsistent.

Posted by: RedDMV | December 16, 2008 2:41 PM | Report abuse

Well if that ain't the nadir of fantasy pettiness, I reckon I don't know what is!

Posted by: SMACK1 | December 16, 2008 2:36 PM | Report abuse

I plead no contest.

Posted by: Redcoat | December 16, 2008 2:44 PM | Report abuse

when you post something on the blog, and it gets held because of length, do they ever come back and tell you why it was not ever posted? And if it was for content, do they tell which part was not approved?

Posted by: connskins | December 16, 2008 2:45 PM | Report abuse

1981 murder of Adam Walsh solved. Wow! Press conference this afternoon.

Posted by: SMACK1 | December 16, 2008 2:46 PM | Report abuse

"T1, I'm calling this one. I'm throwing in the towel for you. Redmv, I'm sure everyone is LTAO just like me but I can't help but feel guilty. this fight just ain't fair.

Posted by: dealer1 "

Regulars like you and Red are so cool.

You actually thought his joke about him going to Charleston was funny? Hrm.

His point of that joke was that I was "obsessed" with him, yet he seems to know a lot about me, much more than I know about him (he likes the Redskins).


and I actually didn't know we were having a competition, so I guess anybody having a competition against someone who doesn't know he is in the competition should win.

Posted by: TheTruth11 | December 16, 2008 2:54 PM | Report abuse

.12 guage to the back of the head for the guy who did it...justice served...

Posted by: BeantownGreg | December 16, 2008 2:54 PM | Report abuse

All of your trade scenarios are ridiculous crap, people. These remind me of the suggestions/scenarios I used to hear on Wizards post-game shows: "Let's trade Kwame Brown, Royal Ivey, and a pick to San Antonio for Tim Duncan!"

NO ONE will trade for Portis. His contract is ridiculous, he is old for football years, and with the emergence of guys like Chris Johnson, Steve Slaton and Matt Forte; everyone sees that you can get a great cheap RB through the draft instead of an old used one through a trade.

NO ONE will trade for Chris Samuels. Everyone knows that he's done and so are his knees. We keep starting him b/c we have not groomed anyone to take his place.

Here's another "trade" to put on your lists:

Let's trade James Thrash and a handful of Pringles to AZ for Anquan Boldin...

Posted by: p1funk | December 16, 2008 2:55 PM | Report abuse

F vinny!

cl, the very first thing that needs to happen for me and any sane person with a life who's not confused about being a LOYAL fan is vinny needs to get fired...look at what parcells did in one year, look at what that dude in ATL did in one year. look at what mayhew did in ONE F'ing DAY on the job in detroit.

F vinny!

Posted by: dealer1 | December 16, 2008 2:55 PM | Report abuse

This could be the end for James Thrash, too, though we say that every year.

By Jason La Canfora | December 16, 2008; 11:33 AM ET

Every year, we also say that the Panthers and the Cards are finally going to make it to the playoffs. This year, however, its actually going to happen.

Posted by: dcsween | December 16, 2008 2:56 PM | Report abuse

Well once again who can you thank for giving contract extensions to old past their prime players. Well Vinny of course. I say screw the cap hits and cut these old washed up players. Take the hit and rebuild for the future. It is obvious this team is not a contender and will not be any time soon. So why not blow it up and rebuild so maybe in 4 years they can compete. If they stick to Vinny's plan signing old washed up players they will continue to lose and be the laughing stock in the NFL! Fire Vinny he must Go!

Posted by: bigjofc | December 16, 2008 2:58 PM | Report abuse

If Vinny must stay, then they AT LEAST have to STOP taking flyers on drafting injuries directly out of college, see, RockyMac, Kelly, frankly, Kareem Moore ...

Yes, RockyMac had a great start this year, but how many years can you expect out of those knees.

Same thing about taking a flyer on injured free agents, see Archuleta.

Posted by: dcsween | December 16, 2008 3:01 PM | Report abuse

Parcells hasn't fixed the Fins yet Dealer. We got lucky this year.

Patriots - Without Old Lady Brady? Not as good.
Bills - having the exact same season arc as the Skins, but with less 'drama')
Jets - were good enough to send us Chad after they rented Brett for a year

So as I said, we still probably have teh weakest overall roster in our division, but we have some 'x factor' going to for us in Spsrano and Chad Pennington's leadership (see my post last week about him having his own meetings for all the offensive players).

Without this we'd still be #4 in the AFC East. It's how we build on this next year that really matters.

Posted by: Redcoat | December 16, 2008 3:02 PM | Report abuse

hey, I'd do that Boldin deal ...

Back in April, I was up for offering AZ plenty for Boldin, because he would have solved a major issue. Solved it. Done, over. We have a top flight starting WR for 5-7 years. Instead, Thomas, Kelly and Davis have solved exactly nothing. Mgmt has to prep for 2009 with the exact same question marks at WR.

AZ would have strongly considered 3 #2 picks for Boldin. Especially since AZ is notoriously cheap on paying guys and Q is clearly due for huge $$$ after this year.

Trade 3 possibles for 1 known. I do that deal.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | December 16, 2008 3:03 PM | Report abuse

t1, fyi, you're a regular bud. you post up here more than anyone and definitely more than me. and thank you for calling me cool.

and no, i wasn't laughing at his posts only but your reactions to them. i'm not saying you're a bad person or he's a bad person but just don't pick a fight with him up here. you could probly kick his a $$ in real but up here it's sad what he does to you. how about not picking a fight with anyone? cuz cL is pretty harsh on you too.

Posted by: dealer1 | December 16, 2008 3:04 PM | Report abuse

Oh and one more thing to add to the Portis comments. Portis is a great player but what he is not is a team player. He is an individual who want to do it his way and not the teams way. That is clear by the way he called out his team and his coaches on a radio show! That should stay in the locker room. I do not see this team winning anything with selfish players like that. He is a pro bowl player and a star but, a team player and a leader no way.

Posted by: bigjofc | December 16, 2008 3:05 PM | Report abuse

Truth, can the freakin' BS and go change your rag, you whiney little beyotch.

what dealer eats shouldn't make you shti, know what i'm sayin? basically, why are you catching feelings over his post or mine for that matter.

STFU and post, dude.

i know pregnant women who are less emotional than you.

can someone get him a damn xanax or valium already, or maybe he needs the new and imporoved massengill d-bag.

Posted by: RedDMV | December 16, 2008 3:05 PM | Report abuse

Red, only one of us has continually cussed and only one of us has hurled multiple personal insults.

I just reply to posts, you, on the other hand, cuss and insult people and their parents.

So yeah, pretty safe to say which one is catching feelings....

Posted by: TheTruth11 | December 16, 2008 3:12 PM | Report abuse

Ever slept with a woman that looked really hot after those 7 beers? And then woke up in the morning with a hangover? And despite your blurred vision, realized that this was not a 7 on a scale of 10, not even close. That she was just ugly and her personality sucked and that now you're hoping there were no witnesses?

Substitute 'free agency' for 'woman', 'money' for 'beer' and 'morning for 'lose to Cincy' and that pretty much describes Cerrato's world

Posted by: zcezcest1 | December 16, 2008 3:12 PM | Report abuse

screw giving valium/xanax to the truth, give'em to me!!!!

funny azz line about emotional pregnant chicks...

Posted by: chrislarry | December 16, 2008 3:13 PM | Report abuse

easy red......take some breaths....

Posted by: BeantownGreg | December 16, 2008 3:13 PM | Report abuse

"t1, fyi, you're a regular bud. you post up here more than anyone and definitely more than me. and thank you for calling me cool.

and no, i wasn't laughing at his posts only but your reactions to them. i'm not saying you're a bad person or he's a bad person but just don't pick a fight with him up here. you could probly kick his a $$ in real but up here it's sad what he does to you. how about not picking a fight with anyone? cuz cL is pretty harsh on you too.

Posted by: dealer1 "

Eh, I guess I should apologize for trying to keep it civil....

Posted by: TheTruth11 | December 16, 2008 3:13 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: p1funk | December 16, 2008 2:55 PM

p1funk, I completely agree that, other than the Jawas in Star Wars, no one trades for old junk.

I've always thought, however, that Betts was a serviceable and ultimately unnecessarily redundant RB. How high a pick do you think the Skins could get for Betts? 4th round?

Same with Randel El ... his pass dropping and inconsistent punt returns make me think he might have some trade value.

Anybody else? I figure that teams might be interested in trading for Anthony Montgomery (or at least more interested than I would be in retaining him if there were someone willing to offer up an offensive lineman or a 4th round pick or better).

Our starters are so highly paid (and comparatively old) and our depth so correspondingly underpaid and underplayed that it feels like the Skins don't have a lot to offer on the "player leaving" side of potential trades.

Also, based on results, the picks traded (plural) for Jason Taylor feels like as hard a loss of picks as the Brandon Lloyd trade.

Posted by: dcsween | December 16, 2008 3:16 PM | Report abuse

Bills - having the exact same season arc as the Skins, but with less 'drama')

Posted by: Redcoat | December 16, 2008 3:02 PM

Hmm, another victim of the media propaganda, perhaps?

(OG)Red, there isn't any drama going on. People around here want it to be just so they can talk about the 'Skins when they aren't relevant anymore in a few weeks. That is why all the SUDDEN Portis is a "quiet cancer", and Moss is trade bait. People want to point the finger so bad they're willing to use Portis and Moss as fall guys for why the team has faded like your favorite tie-dye shirt in the '80s.

Posted by: RedDMV | December 16, 2008 3:18 PM | Report abuse

"... Randel El ... his pass dropping and inconsistent punt returns make me think he might have some trade value. ..."

What I meant to say is that there might be value to the Skins trading him ... to teams who don't pay as much attention to the pass dropping and inconsistent punt returns.

Posted by: dcsween | December 16, 2008 3:20 PM | Report abuse

I missed all the trade Portis/trade Moss talk (shows what scanning/skipping can do) ... does that preclude talking about trading the guys one spot down from them (i.e., trade Betts/trade Randel El)?

Posted by: dcsween | December 16, 2008 3:22 PM | Report abuse

Actually RedDMV I think it's more that expectations for the Bills were not - and never would be - as high as they were/are for the Skins.

If Dallas had continued that slump they suffered a few weeks back, they would have out-drama'd you guys easily! But as they didn't, we end up with Portis (sorta) calling out his coach on the radio. As far as I'm aware, that's not happening up in Buffalo.

Are the media fanning the flames? Of course.

Posted by: Redcoat | December 16, 2008 3:23 PM | Report abuse

We're stuck with Portis probably until a year after he's any good.

Posted by: TheTruth11 | December 16, 2008 2:08 PM

His "Priest Holmes" year.

Posted by: dcsween | December 16, 2008 3:24 PM | Report abuse

Who had the worse week between?

Blagoyavich or Cerrato?

S. Moss or his towel?

Madoff's clients or Jim Zorn?

Madoff or Snyder?

Posted by: zcezcest1 | December 16, 2008 3:25 PM | Report abuse

The Lloyd trade wasn't as awful as the Lloyd trade-and-sign-to-a-generous-contract.
And how does Gibbs not hear about his character?
I mean, I know about how talented his fingertips were, but come on!

Posted by: daggar | December 16, 2008 3:27 PM | Report abuse

Favorite headline of the day

"Nude Models Strip to Protest Low Pay"

Like that's gonna work. If you pay them less, will they protest more?

Posted by: zcezcest1 | December 16, 2008 3:28 PM | Report abuse

winner: Madoff's clients

c'mon you lose 500 million you "win" that contest every week.

y oh y couldn't snyder been wrapped up in that???!!!

Posted by: chrislarry | December 16, 2008 3:31 PM | Report abuse

My letter to Mr snyder, that I am sure he would of read, requesting him to fire Vinny was blocked by the blog, so I mailed it to him

Posted by: connskins | December 16, 2008 3:31 PM | Report abuse

dcsween,

I don't know what the market is for RBs. Everyone has got a few RBs that they are working on, and I can't think of a team that would cough up a pick for Ladell. It is simply not a premium position for trades (unless you are Dan Snyder), and Ladell isn't a premium guy.

Randle El is the same story. Everyone out there has a smallish RB/WR guy that they experiment with on PK/KR. Besides, no one is dumb enough to take on his contract. Remember we gave him $30 MILL...

Bottom line is that we need to steel ourselves for NO radical changes to this team. The best we can hope for is to pickup Terrell Suggs, Haynesworth or Peppers in FA. And have a radically different approach to the draft (i.e. linemen, linemen, linemen).

The only radical change that I think might be feasible and that I might agree with is to dump Zorn/Campbell and bring on Josh McDaniels/Cassell.

Posted by: p1funk | December 16, 2008 3:32 PM | Report abuse

"yeah this is c larry from the BK. first time/long time. ..."

Posted by: chrislarry | December 16, 2008 2:01 PM

But for registration, the Awards Committee would have presented this one wit the Award for Outstanding Performance in the Abbreviation Cat.

Posted by: dcsween | December 16, 2008 3:33 PM | Report abuse

Truth, why is it when you get punked like you're in the "yard", you get on your e-mo ish?

Don't clam up now dude, I was regulating the conversation right, (shoutouts to cL and Bean) now that I've directed my comments at you, you're still not satisfied?

Truth, I swear - the emotional hang-ups, the flip-flop behavior, and the indecisiveness you show, I know for a FACT you must be a woman!

You don't have to get your Mulan on to post up here, TT.

Posted by: RedDMV | December 16, 2008 3:33 PM | Report abuse

Anyone that can make a statment such as Thomas Jones and CP are interchangable is more of an asshat than anyone could expect.

Posted by: Pleepleus | December 16, 2008 3:33 PM | Report abuse

The Lloyd trade wasn't as awful as the Lloyd trade-and-sign-to-a-generous-contract.
And how does Gibbs not hear about his character?

Posted by: daggar | December 16, 2008 3:27 PM

This is one of the reasons I don't buy the "not Vinny's fault, Gibbs picked the guys" line from the ES defenders inside the Park.

Posted by: dcsween | December 16, 2008 3:35 PM | Report abuse

sween, i agree. that was brilliant stuff by cl.

Posted by: dealer1 | December 16, 2008 3:36 PM | Report abuse

A moral question here...Lets say you were leaving the Fed Ex a night after the usual loss and you noticed Vinny was getting beat up by 1 or 2 drunk fans...Would you help Vinny? Would you defend him from getting pummeled any further? Or would you watch him go down and take his wallet when he was unconscious

Posted by: Tyler84101 | December 16, 2008 3:38 PM | Report abuse

... The best we can hope for is to pickup Terrell Suggs, Haynesworth or Peppers in FA. ...

Posted by: p1funk | December 16, 2008 3:32 PM

I noticed these three come up in discussions plenty too. For me, the only one worth shooting for would be Suggs ... and then have him play more OLB than DE. He's like Jason Taylor, only heavier and more stout against the run.

Posted by: dcsween | December 16, 2008 3:39 PM | Report abuse

Sorry, Red, but I didn't personally insult you. I just called you out for 1) telling everyone to stop talking about something and then 2) talking about the same exact thing 5 minutes later.

Then you begin talking about my parents and claiming I have mental illnesses and cussing. Kinda lost me in all that, just looked like a bunch of gibberish from a very strange person. Didn't have much to reply to because you got off topic and just started with the personal insults.

I'm personally not down with that, I don't know enough about you to give a bunch of personal insults, nor do I care. I do find it strange\awkward you know so much about me, though.

Posted by: TheTruth11 | December 16, 2008 3:39 PM | Report abuse

truth is def mad emo....

Posted by: chrislarry | December 16, 2008 3:41 PM | Report abuse

The Lloyd trade wasn't as awful as the Lloyd trade-and-sign-to-a-generous-contract.
And how does Gibbs not hear about his character?

Posted by: daggar | December 16, 2008 3:27 PM

I am amazed by the logic/thinking of some of these people in charge of personnel acquisition. At some point in Redskins Park, someone in charge of something had the following conversation with themselves:

"Brandon Lloyd is a talented, but inconsistent player with a reputation for not practicing hard and being somewhat of a lockeroom malcontent...I KNOW! Let's give him $30 million straight up for doing nothing! That should motivate him!".

Posted by: p1funk | December 16, 2008 3:42 PM | Report abuse

dang Tyler .. that is a tough choice !! Is Vinny a lawyer? Makes it an easier call for me.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | December 16, 2008 3:43 PM | Report abuse

Suggs also is much younger than Jason Taylor ... and apparently, he likes the Wizards.

Posted by: dcsween | December 16, 2008 3:43 PM | Report abuse

dc, you wouldn't want a guy like peppers on the end of your line?

Posted by: BeantownGreg | December 16, 2008 3:43 PM | Report abuse

btw redcoat=red
redDMV=redmv

red, there's no way vinny does what parcells did to that team. he got 2 picks for an old "dancing with the tackles", and he did okay in the draft (not familiar at all about the mia draft but it can't be worse than skins. ) and he was able to land pennington. i hope he turns out for you guys.

re. the drama...i really really hope people would stop caring but you know there're 7 million in this area so you this team would have to suck for a long time until majority of the fans stop caring.

Posted by: dealer1 | December 16, 2008 3:43 PM | Report abuse

I noticed these three come up in discussions plenty too. For me, the only one worth shooting for would be Suggs ... and then have him play more OLB than DE. He's like Jason Taylor, only heavier and more stout against the run.

Posted by: dcsween | December 16, 2008 3:39 PM | Report abuse

I say Suggs is the best bet of the bunch especially b/c he is more of a LB/DE hybrid. Also with Washington and Rocky Mac, we seem to be in desperate need of play-making LBs.

Posted by: p1funk | December 16, 2008 3:45 PM | Report abuse

"truth is def mad emo....

Posted by: chrislarry | "

I have to ask


why are you and RedDMV so obsessed with me? Yall know way too much about me. Other people have posted stuff about their personal lives on here, but I can't remember any of it and I'm guessing yall can't either.

Red even remembered where he thought I lived, which is weird.

Posted by: TheTruth11 | December 16, 2008 3:45 PM | Report abuse

Lloyd was a talent and a problem, and both were well known. Living here in SF area, I recall when the Skins signed him. One of the radio guys said "Good luck". As in, the 'how can you be so stupid' kind of 'good luck'

Posted by: zcezcest1 | December 16, 2008 3:46 PM | Report abuse

Nope zcezcest1..Vinny is still Vinny the GM..I personally would wait til hes pummeled and take his wallet..I figure its even, since Vinny and Danny have been sealing my money for years

Posted by: Tyler84101 | December 16, 2008 3:47 PM | Report abuse

Rank 'em, most to least:

Who is most responsible for the Skins 2008 season to date?

Danny Snyder
Vinny
Zorn
Gibbs
Campbell
Portis
Danny Smith

Posted by: zcezcest1 | December 16, 2008 3:50 PM | Report abuse

OK. Lots of people want Vinny out, so I have to ask:

Who would they want as GM (or whatever his actual title is, VP of Football Ops)?

I'd like to see a list, please.

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | December 16, 2008 3:51 PM | Report abuse

Tyler, I'm all for kicking a lawyer when he's down. Vinny's an idiot, but I wouldn't call him a crook. Hence my moral dilemma.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | December 16, 2008 3:52 PM | Report abuse

okay, since this idiot won't stop i'll end it here.

Truth, the only reason why I know you live in S.C. or about is because you've POSTED THAT INFORMATION about 500 times up here, just like a good number of people know that I live in or the area of VA...

Quit it with your self-righteous, self-serving BS. No one gives a damn about you up here, dude. Where you from, where you live, who your team is - I couldn't give two shtis, okay dude?

The only reason why people know that is because what you post. Always be careful what you put on a public forum, jackass.

Posted by: RedDMV | December 16, 2008 3:53 PM | Report abuse

dealer, the key is that it was NOT Parcells who drafted this year. He brought Jeff Ireland in as GM from Dallas. Ireland only came because he has sole control over all personnel decisions - including the coach.

Miami FO structure:

Huizenga - Owner, pays for everything, not allowed to make decisions
Parcells - EVP, hires GM, sets tone for franchise, goes and plays golf
Ireland - GM, hires all players and coaches
Sparano - head coach, input on players, in charge of all team-related matters

It's pretty simple. In business they call it "hired hard, manage easy". In other words you find guys whose approach to the franchise is in-step with yours and then let them run their show. They are empowered to take decisions and accountable for the outcomes.

Poor old Huizenga has tried every other combo and it didn't work. This one will because the lines of power and communication are both clear and sensible.

But Danny would have to set his ego aside to do that...

Posted by: Redcoat | December 16, 2008 3:55 PM | Report abuse

truff,

you would guess wrong, i remember most of what people say about their lives, and the way they represent themselves. So dont make an azz out of u and me that i dont remember.

butt truff i was basing my emo call simply on how you rep yoself in your posts. You love to be aggressive and than shell up when it comes backatcha. You are a classic dish it/can't take it type.

but whateves let your freak flag fly....like my boy russ simmons sez: Do you!

Posted by: chrislarry | December 16, 2008 3:56 PM | Report abuse

Who would they want as GM (or whatever his actual title is, VP of Football Ops)?

I'd like to see a list, please.

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | December 16, 2008 3:51 PM

I only have three.

Ron Wolf
Ted Leonsis
Scott Pioli

Posted by: RedDMV | December 16, 2008 3:56 PM | Report abuse

you wouldn't want a guy like peppers on the end of your line?

Posted by: BeantownGreg | December 16, 2008 3:43 PM

Its mostly about that Suggs seems more versatile and less celebrity than Peppers. [Ravens list him as OLB, whereas NFL lists him as DE ... Ravens' site notes he started as situational pass rushing DE].

I can imagine getting as excited as everyone else about Peppers ... then watching him get injured and playing through it at less than top performance levels. He's taller than Suggs, but a year older. I dunno. I don't think the Skins can (or should try to) afford both.

Skins have a bigger need at OLB right now (unfortunately). DE feels more like a want ... and OLB and DT feel more like needs. [Same thing on the O-line ... going into the season, I would have focused on replacement of Kendall at OG ... now the "need" feels like OT.]

Posted by: dcsween | December 16, 2008 3:58 PM | Report abuse

Ron Wolf was the one that immediately came to my mind too, because he lives (or he used to) in the Annapolis area.

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | December 16, 2008 3:58 PM | Report abuse

Who is most responsible for the Skins 2008 season to date?

Danny Snyder
Vinny
Zorn
Gibbs
Campbell
Portis
Danny Smith

Posted by: zcezcest1

I'm pretty sure you put that in order already.

Posted by: psps23 | December 16, 2008 3:59 PM | Report abuse

"butt truff i was basing my emo call simply on how you rep yoself in your posts. You love to be aggressive and than shell up when it comes backatcha. You are a classic dish it/can't take it type.

but whateves let your freak flag fly....like my boy russ simmons sez: Do you!

Posted by: chrislarry "

no see that's the problem

I don't attack people. I didn't "attack" Red earlier, I just called out his blog policing. Then because he cusses me out and I choose not to do that, I'm suddenly pansying out?

Basically it's cause I'm not a regular like yall are, but that's cool.

Posted by: TheTruth11 | December 16, 2008 4:00 PM | Report abuse

When are "Skins fans going to come to the realization that this team does not have the overall talent to be a consistent playoff team. They made the playoffs last year as result of emotion and Joe Gibbs' coaching talent. Repeat after me, THEY DON'T HAVE THE TALENT. And who do we lay the blame on? Well Snyder and Vinnie, of course. They have been the constants during Snyder's ownership with the excetion of the Marty year. When Boy Blunder finally gets tired of not making the playoffs and competing for the Bowl, he will cut the strings with Vinnie and bring in a true NFL personnel guy who will build both lines, the LB corps, draft receivers in the 4, 5 and 6 rounds, and voila, we have a winner. It's not that hard, other teams do it.

Posted by: pjente | December 16, 2008 4:02 PM | Report abuse

I would not normally agree with JLC but the numbers are not that much different, I know everyone thinks Portis is great but there are plenty of RB's in the league just as good if not better.

Portis Rushing
YEAR TEAM G ATT YDS AVG LNG TD FD FUM LOST
2004 WAS 15 343 1315 3.8 64 5 65 5 4
2005 WAS 16 352 1516 4.3 47 11 74 3 2
2006 WAS 8 127 523 4.1 38 7 29 0 0
2007 WAS 16 325 1262 3.9 32 11 61 6 5
2008 WAS 14 291 1337 4.6 31 7 66 2 2
Portis Receiving
YEAR TEAM G REC YDS AVG LNG TD FD FUM LOST
2004 WAS 15 40 235 5.9 18 2 10 0 0
2005 WAS 16 30 216 7.2 23 0 13 0 0
2006 WAS 8 17 170 10.0 74 0 5 0 0
2007 WAS 16 47 389 8.3 54 0 19 0 0
2008 WAS 14 27 207 7.7 29 0 10 0 0

Thomas Jones Rushing
YEAR TEAM G ATT YDS AVG LNG TD FD FUM LOST
2004 CHI 14 240 948 4.0 54 7 49 2 1
2005 CHI 15 314 1335 4.3 42 9 61 2 2
2006 CHI 16 296 1210 4.1 30 6 61 1 1
2007 NYJ 16 310 1119 3.6 36 1 55 2 0
2008 NYJ 14 263 1222 4.6 59 13 61 2 1
Thomas Jones Receiving
YEAR TEAM G REC YDS AVG LNG TD FD FUM LOST
2004 CHI 14 56 427 7.6 45 0 16 0 0
2005 CHI 15 26 143 5.5 41 0 6 0 0
2006 CHI 16 36 154 4.3 21 0 5 0 0
2007 NYJ 16 28 217 7.8 25 1 8 0 0
2008 NYJ 14 32 177 5.5 19 2 10 0 0


Posted by: Flounder21 | December 16, 2008 4:04 PM | Report abuse

my list:

promote morocco brown

wolf obvie

pioli

ok....short list but not gonna post Retreads like floyed reese or newly free Carl Peterson, Casserly

Butt I would wager your morgage that the league is sick with young hungry canidates. We need our version of Jerry reese. Look at baseball...all the great GMS are under 50.

I think M. Brown might be that dude. I will tell you this if it meand bye bye vinny I am ready to find out!

Posted by: chrislarry | December 16, 2008 4:05 PM | Report abuse

You people want The Truth?


I AM VINNY CERRATO AND YOU'RE ALL MORONS

Posted by: TheTruth11 | December 16, 2008 4:07 PM | Report abuse

Morrocco Brown should take Vinny's place, Every player that he has selected for our practice squad has been snatched up

Posted by: GreatOne1 | December 16, 2008 4:07 PM | Report abuse

JZ IS TEARING CZBEN A NEW ONE!!

Posted by: DaReal4th | December 16, 2008 4:10 PM | Report abuse

see my letter to Mr snyder says the exact smae thing, fire vinny, hire m brown

Posted by: connskins | December 16, 2008 4:10 PM | Report abuse

Basically it's cause I'm not a regular like yall are, but that's cool.

Posted by: TheTruth11 | December 16, 2008 4:00 PM

Truth... *UGH*

God bless you, guy.

You're lucky this isn't back in the day when retarded "funny" acting men like you were taken out to the fields and were executed.

I don't regualte conversation... wait, stop... Think about how ridiculous that sounds in the first place. How could I or anyone except Cindy & 'em regulate anything. Why is this worth discussing any damn way - over, over, over, and over again.

What in the hell AM I doing? Enough of this...

Truth = woman going through menopause

I would say that your Aunt Flo is visiting, but I think your problems are much more complicated than that, and I think you need professional help.

Really.

Good day.

Posted by: RedDMV | December 16, 2008 4:10 PM | Report abuse

red, totally forgot...i know someone mentioned that earlier on the radio...wow!!! that's some setup. and that should've been the setup with gibbs here.

gibbs
gm
coach

i really don't get what danny's hesitation is...isn't the ultimate prize to win championships? or is it what owner can make THAT hire or pick THAT player? ...

Posted by: dealer1 | December 16, 2008 4:12 PM | Report abuse

portis
cooley
samuels
sellers

pro bowlers

Posted by: SmallPen15 | December 16, 2008 4:13 PM | Report abuse

Well, it's interesting that Jones' time in Arizona and Tampa are not on that graph, nor are CP's years in Denver.

But at any rate, put Thomas Jones in the NFC East for 4 years and see what his numbers look like.

I've watched the cat play (I'm in NYC); he's slow, he can't block for peanuts and he isn't anywhere near as tough as CP.

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | December 16, 2008 4:13 PM | Report abuse

4th, YOU GOTTA POST the DETAILS!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Posted by: dealer1 | December 16, 2008 4:14 PM | Report abuse

Our talent level was not the issue. The same OL 5 that blew the girlz DL backwards in the first meeting were blown apart in the second.

The talent was there.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | December 16, 2008 4:14 PM | Report abuse

PS: My personal belief is that anyone who begins a post, "I'm no fan of JLC, but...." is spinning like a top.

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | December 16, 2008 4:15 PM | Report abuse

red, earlier I said to relax with tt, after these latest posts, have at it...guy deserves what he brings on himself....

4th, what is JZ saying....

Posted by: BeantownGreg | December 16, 2008 4:15 PM | Report abuse

Redskins making the 2009 ProBowl roster:
Clinton Portis, Chris Cooley, Chris Samuels

Notables who did NOT make it:
London Fletcher

Posted by: p1funk | December 16, 2008 4:16 PM | Report abuse

jz: i didn't call anyone out but rookies in the training camp...

Posted by: dealer1 | December 16, 2008 4:17 PM | Report abuse

...sorry, forgot about Sellers as starting Pro Bowl FB.

Posted by: p1funk | December 16, 2008 4:17 PM | Report abuse

Well, it's interesting that Jones' time in Arizona and Tampa are not on that graph, nor are CP's years in Denver

Because JLC comments were from 2004 not before.

Jones is bigger then CP I do not think playing in the NFC east would have changed anything.

Posted by: Flounder21 | December 16, 2008 4:17 PM | Report abuse

jz: i would do it again...

Posted by: dealer1 | December 16, 2008 4:18 PM | Report abuse

jz still doesn't think defering is a good thing on coin flip...

Posted by: dealer1 | December 16, 2008 4:19 PM | Report abuse

Jones is bigger then CP I do not think playing in the NFC east would have changed anything.

Posted by: Flounder21 | December 16, 2008 4:17 PM |
----------

Like I said, I live up here and get all the Jets games; the fans go crazy when Leon Washington (the excellent returner) gets touches at RB... T. Jones? Not so much.

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | December 16, 2008 4:20 PM | Report abuse

PS: My personal belief is that anyone who begins a post, "I'm no fan of JLC, but...." is spinning like a top.

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | December 16, 2008 4:15 PM |

I am far from a fan of JLC you can ask most on here, or go back and look at some of my previous comments.

Posted by: Flounder21 | December 16, 2008 4:20 PM | Report abuse

He said to Czaben:

I've noticed every week I come on here you always start asking negative questions. And I don't appreciate it. {some other stuff along those lines, Maps}

Posted by: DaReal4th | December 16, 2008 4:20 PM | Report abuse

Like I said, I live up here and get all the Jets games; the fans go crazy when Leon Washington (the excellent returner) gets touches at RB... T. Jones? Not so much.

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | December 16, 2008 4:20 PM |

Really he has 100 yards less then CP this year, maybe the Jets fans are stupid because it looks like he is doing fine to me.

Posted by: Flounder21 | December 16, 2008 4:22 PM | Report abuse

Did Czabe throw his shoes at Zorn?

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | December 16, 2008 4:23 PM | Report abuse

okay jz is just plain dumb. what the hell did he do to make an impression to vinny???? again, the F head couldn't find a minority smarter than this freak????????? to warrant consideration???????????????????

Posted by: dealer1 | December 16, 2008 4:24 PM | Report abuse

is there anything worse than recieving the ball to start the game. if i was a HC i want ball to start 2nd half every game.

Posted by: chrislarry | December 16, 2008 4:25 PM | Report abuse

Cerrato is going anywhere, so everyone might as well let that go.

DMV - Ted L. as the GM? What in the world does he know about football?

Posted by: shaunsherman12 | December 16, 2008 4:25 PM | Report abuse

Flounder, for the record, CP is listed as 5' 11" 221, T. Jones as 5' 10" 215.

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | December 16, 2008 4:25 PM | Report abuse

i don't know greg, i feel sorry for the guy. there ought to be a mercy rule...and ITA...

Posted by: dealer1 | December 16, 2008 4:27 PM | Report abuse

Flounder, for the record, CP is listed as 5' 11" 221, T. Jones as 5' 10" 215.

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | December 16, 2008 4:25 PM |

Those listings are wrong more then they are correct

Posted by: Flounder21 | December 16, 2008 4:27 PM | Report abuse

cl

The prevailing wisdom is that Andy Reid and Donovan McNabb are tethered at the hip. Either they both go or they both stay.

My guess (at the moment) is that unless the Iggles lose (and lose quite badly) to both the Skins and the Boys to close the season, both are back for 2009.

Redcoat/Greg

On the offensive side of the ball, the Iggles and the Skins aren't too dissimilar. Both have thin, aging O lines, average (at best) receiving talent, and an excellent RB. My (biased) 2 cents is that the Iggles are slightly better then the Skins on O because

1. A McNabb/Westbrook combo is better (at the moment) than a Campbell/Portis combo
2. Our older guys have remained a little healthier and played a little better than the Skins older guys

It's the other side of the ball (i.e. on D) where I think the Iggles have the bigger advantage moving forward

Still, I see the Iggles/Skins as numbers 3 and 4 of the NFC East.

Adam

Posted by: wtf_is_up_with_wp_registration | December 16, 2008 4:28 PM | Report abuse

Pro Bowl who cares?

Posted by: bigjofc | December 16, 2008 4:28 PM | Report abuse

cL, not just that...it's THIS OFFENSE he's giving the ball too. the better part of this team is the D not the O. i could see a good O taking the field first but not this O!

Posted by: dealer1 | December 16, 2008 4:29 PM | Report abuse

mr redskins...i have watched almost every jets game, thomas jones has ben great....not sure what you are watching. Also he was pretty good with Bears....SB anyone?

Not saying I would take him over Portis, but the dude is a good back. Jets be sub 500 without him this year.

Posted by: chrislarry | December 16, 2008 4:29 PM | Report abuse

We have such worthless, lousy fans here in D.C...

I'm not so sure we really deserve a good football team anymore.

Posted by: shaunsherman12 | December 16, 2008 4:29 PM | Report abuse

I'm happy Sellers made it.

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | December 16, 2008 4:29 PM | Report abuse

So the Redskins only sent offensive players to the Pro Bowl?

lol.. That's ironic.

It's the defense that has played well all year and kept us in games.

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | December 16, 2008 4:31 PM | Report abuse

shaunsherman12,

Yup its the fans........

Posted by: chrislarry | December 16, 2008 4:31 PM | Report abuse

We have such worthless, lousy fans here in D.C...

I'm not so sure we really deserve a good football team anymore.

Posted by: shaunsherman12 | December 16, 2008 4:29 PM |

Would you care to elaborate on this.

Posted by: Flounder21 | December 16, 2008 4:32 PM | Report abuse

happy for big mike, but London truly deserved it.

Posted by: BeantownGreg | December 16, 2008 4:32 PM | Report abuse

London Fletcher not going shows what a F-ing joke the PB is.

Posted by: Flounder21 | December 16, 2008 4:33 PM | Report abuse

Thomas Jones in the NFC East = Julius Jones in the NFC East.

Posted by: SMACK1 | December 16, 2008 4:33 PM | Report abuse

No idea how London Fletcher doesn't make the Pro Bowl. The Skins D would take a giant step backwards without him.

I'm also confused as to how all the Skins Pro Bowl selections are offensive players. It's not like that unit strikes fear in the hearts of many (or any) other teams...

Adam

Posted by: wtf_is_up_with_wp_registration | December 16, 2008 4:35 PM | Report abuse

"The Madden GMs need to seriously give it a rest with the trade talk - its beyond funny at this point.

Posted by: RedDMV | "

"Sorry Red, what would you rather we talk about? We can continue to cry about how our team sucks balls if you want. Please let us know.

Posted by: TheTruth11 |"


"Now the question is: who exactly is "dead weight"?

Posted by: RedDMV "


"Careful there, that's about what all these "Madden GMs" have been talking about.

Posted by: TheTruth11"


"Shove it Truth, no one said a damn thing to you.

It's silly to talk about things that can't happen. While we're talking about shti that can't happen, lets discuss more hypothetics; shall we?

BS#1: I would rather float Saturn in a jacuzzi rather than a regular porcerlin tub because Saturn's density is less than that of water, and besides it'll look cool.

BS#2: Lets trade Santana Moss for Randy Moss straight up, because you know, it'll be cool and we wouldn't have to change the name on the back of the jersey.

BS#3: I wonder if I wore my dark blue Armani suit with my italian shoes; would Halle Berry dump her model boyfriend/fiancee for me?

Sounds dumb doesn't it, Truth? I'm just recycling your BS with a few word changes, but the theme is still the same.

Dumbness.

Posted by: RedDMV"

Posted by: TheTruth11 | December 16, 2008 4:36 PM | Report abuse

There it is, I love how I'm always the bad guy, yet it's clear as day Red freaked out and busted a brain vessel after my first comment to him, which wasn't even an insult as he'd like everyone to think.

But again, the cool regulars will make me look bad. YAWN

Posted by: TheTruth11 | December 16, 2008 4:37 PM | Report abuse

I thought Julius Jones was in the NFC West now?

I agree with CL that T. Jones is a GOOD back. Not a great back.

And I have a problem with comparing him head-to-head with CP over the last 4 years, omitting CP's time in Denver (which was very successful) and omitting T. Jones time in Arizona and Tampa (which was not very successful).

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | December 16, 2008 4:37 PM | Report abuse

I think this year showed that it dosen't matter how much the fans vote, it really will depend on what the coaches and players think.

We have the SAME Pro Bowlers as last year's team if you subtract Sellers and and ST21.

What does that tell you?

Posted by: DaReal4th | December 16, 2008 4:38 PM | Report abuse

It seems like we might have enough $$ to make a run at TJ Houshmanzada who probably wants out of cincy and is a free agent. TJ and Moss are an awesome duo and then develope Thomas and Kelly for your 3 and 4 receivers. ARE is ideal for the wildcat next year and he could be serviceable in the slot but if we kept him at the 3 spot that would slow the growth of thomas and kelly. That would be a tough call. I would try to package randel el with someone and maybe grab a 4th round pick if thats even possible..maybe some sucker will bite. Draft a LB or O line in round 1.. isn't J Peppers a free agent? something to look at.
Line:
Samuels, Rinehart, Rabach, Rookie, Heyer

Posted by: jeffco01 | December 16, 2008 4:39 PM | Report abuse

Due to visiting team returns, a limited number of tickets are available for the December 21, 2008 game against the Philadelphia Eagles.


Call 301-276-6800 or Click Here
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Posted by: DaReal4th | December 16, 2008 4:39 PM | Report abuse

I love the "you may unsubscribe by" bit on Redskins emails, they NEVER unsubscribe you!

Since I bought that blasted 'signed' Archuleta shirt they won't leave me alone, no matter how many times I try to opt out.

I should have expected no less from a marketing 'genius'.

Posted by: Redcoat | December 16, 2008 4:42 PM | Report abuse

ARE is only good for the Wild cat if all you are going to do is pass, ARE is not going to run. He is scared to return punts, what makes anyone think he will want to run through the D-line.

Posted by: Flounder21 | December 16, 2008 4:42 PM | Report abuse

dont go after TJ, he is good but other needs, I say go after Suggs, A DT, and draft strictly DL's and OL's

Posted by: GreatOne1 | December 16, 2008 4:43 PM | Report abuse

T. Jones season took off when his O-line came together (Mangold, Faneca, etc.)around weeks 6-7...which is usually the way it works with running backs.

Posted by: p1funk | December 16, 2008 4:44 PM | Report abuse

Never said the fans are the reason...but the fans are just as silly as the claim the owner and GM to be.

Fire the coach? After one season, a season almost everyone had us with a record similiar to/worse than the one we currently have?

That is completely retarded, and just a lazy, quick-fix hope for a solution when the truth is we need better players, and that is a longer fix.

As for my ripping the fans, we deserve to be ripped.

We cry about Fedex Field, but it doesn't have crap for noise despite 90k + fans in there every week.
We cry about the owner's lack of patience, then scream "off with his head" regarding the head coach...while forgiving the prima donna RB that hasn't helped us win squat around here, because he's CLINTON PORTIS, the WORLD BEATING RUNNING BACK, who plays with NUMEROUS INJURIES that he goes to pains to tell us about, when the truth is he should shut his trap and do his job. Everyone looooves Clinton, when he is the epitome of what is wrong with this organization - the inmates run the prison.

Heck, we got shouted down by opposing fans in our own stadium. What's more pathetic than that.

Proceed with flaming.

Posted by: shaunsherman12 | December 16, 2008 4:45 PM | Report abuse

I think we have had enough of big time FA WR's, no thanks on TJ.

I would rather go with the rookies we drafted this year.

Posted by: Flounder21 | December 16, 2008 4:46 PM | Report abuse

Anyone else getting the vibe Zorn's touchy feely jesus freak surfer guy west coast personality is starting to crack in the uber political dawg eat dawg east coast? His actions/mood swings this week seem like a dude ready to hightail it back to Aspen, Big Sur or Malibu Beach...

Posted by: chrislarry | December 16, 2008 4:46 PM | Report abuse

Czaben in Vermont Teddy Bear Commercial:

Everyone needs a Teddy Bear Hug...

Coach Zorn needs a bear hug...


------------------------------

Czben is a bout to lose another job when interacting with the team.......

Posted by: DaReal4th | December 16, 2008 4:46 PM | Report abuse

I lov me some CP but even I know we couldn't get a first or second round pick for him from an arena league team let alone a team in the nfl!

Posted by: will_ga | December 16, 2008 4:48 PM | Report abuse

He also said you could order a Vermont Teddy Bear with "a flat-top, in honor of coach Zorn" or something like that....lol


Posted by: MrRedskin21 | December 16, 2008 4:48 PM | Report abuse

someone get shaunsherman12 a hairshirt and a gift card for self flagulation treatment at the local spa.....

Posted by: chrislarry | December 16, 2008 4:48 PM | Report abuse

"It seems like we might have enough $$ to make a run at TJ Houshmanzada who probably wants out of cincy and is a free agent."
***************

Yeah, let's give alot of money to another WR who hasn't played in the WCO.

If we bring in ANY free agent who is not a top-tier lineman or LB, I will begin a shoe-throwing plot against Vinny and Danny.

Posted by: p1funk | December 16, 2008 4:49 PM | Report abuse

shaunsherman12

what we've got is a failure to communicate

the inmates run the ASYLUM
the warden runs the prison

Adam

Posted by: wtf_is_up_with_wp_registration | December 16, 2008 4:50 PM | Report abuse

pro bowl rosters?

Posted by: FAB88 | December 16, 2008 4:51 PM | Report abuse

Czben is a bout to lose another job when interacting with the team.......

Posted by: DaReal4th | December 16, 2008 4:46 PM |

Czabe,

Will not be fired by Snyder because if he is everyone will no why and Snyder will be crucified.

Plus Czabe has a national morning show which he makes alot more money on then his afternoon local show.

Posted by: Flounder21 | December 16, 2008 4:51 PM | Report abuse

Thanks Cl for saying what I have been thinking for a looong time (Game 1 post game comments)....

I'll always remember some article in the post that interviewed Steve Largent saying he told Zorn that this ain't Seattle and the Football team gets a 'little' more attention than the Seahawks got.....

Posted by: DaReal4th | December 16, 2008 4:51 PM | Report abuse

can you throw shoes onto the field on sunday if you promise not to hit anyone?

Posted by: connskins | December 16, 2008 4:52 PM | Report abuse

someone get shaunsherman12 a hairshirt and a gift card for self flagulation treatment at the local spa.....

Posted by: chrislarry | December 16, 2008 4:48 PM | Report abuse

If you want to punish him, just get him a looping video of the Rams and Bungles games ...

Ba-dum ching!

Posted by: Redcoat | December 16, 2008 4:53 PM | Report abuse

...and a gift card for self flagulation...

Hmmm, I never would've guessed that you needed a gift card for that!

Posted by: daggar | December 16, 2008 4:54 PM | Report abuse

Flounder - I didn't say he was going to get fired. I said he was gonna lose another job where he actually interacts with the Redskins.

Joe Gibbs Show in '04 - Yanked
CSN Post Game Show in '06 - Yanked
JZ Show - [See a pattern here??]

Posted by: DaReal4th | December 16, 2008 4:55 PM | Report abuse

Yeah, we are one of the richest/most profitable franchises in sports history that sells out a 90K stadium every year. We temporarily occupied Canton this year when our boys D.Green and art Monk made the Hall. All this because our fans suck.

Right on shaunsherman...

Posted by: p1funk | December 16, 2008 4:55 PM | Report abuse

Joe Gibbs Show in '04 - Yanked
CSN Post Game Show in '06 - Yanked
JZ Show - [See a pattern here??]

Posted by: DaReal4th | December 16, 2008 4:55 PM |

Thats because they are wimps and can't anwser the tough questions.

Posted by: Flounder21 | December 16, 2008 4:57 PM | Report abuse

cl,

Not a whole lot of debate from you, so I guess what I wrote you couldn't argue against.

Or delude yourself if you'd like.

The first step to fixing the problem is acknowledging you have one.

We have numerous, and they AREN'T just the upper manangement or the coach.

Posted by: shaunsherman12 | December 16, 2008 4:57 PM | Report abuse

Posted by ESPN.com's Matt Mosley

Here are the NFC East starters for the 2009 Pro Bowl: FB Mike Sellers, Redskins, TE Jason Witten, G Chris Snee, C Andre Gurode, DE Justin Tuck, DT Jay Ratliff, OLB DeMarcus Ware, P Jeff Feagles, PK John Carney

Reserves: QB Eli Manning, RB, Clinton Portis, TE Chris Cooley, OT Chris Samuels, C Shaun O'Hara, CB Asante Samuel, FS Brian Dawkins

Cowboys: 5
Giants: 6
Eagles: 2
Redskins: 4

My biggest disappointment: Redskins linebacker London Fletcher should be in the Pro Bowl. He's had a great season. Patrick Willis and Jon Beason made it in front of Fletcher. Hopefully Fletcher will make it as an alternate, but that's not the same. It looks like the Redskins' ballot-stuffing didn't pay off that much. Sellers deserves to be starting. And Clinton Portis, Chris Samuels and Chris Cooley all deserve backup spots. Early in the fan voting process, the Redskins were leading at 17 positions.

Posted by: The_Doc | December 16, 2008 4:58 PM | Report abuse

What if we traded Clinton Portis, Chris Samuels, Shawn Springs, Antwaan Randle El, and our 2010 1st and 2nd round draft picks for Detroit's two 1st round draft picks and 2nd round draft pick in 2009?

We would then have 3 1st round picks and a 2nd. We could fix our O-Line (1st pick overall and in the 3rd round), D-Line (third pick), and LB (second pick) before the second day!

Posted by: TDawg1 | December 15, 2008 9:07 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: TDawg1 | December 16, 2008 5:01 PM | Report abuse

what the guy is trying to say is that for all the redskins fans in the area they need to show a little more support, ie attendance at home games so that it does not feel like a road game. no reason more people from visiting should want to come to fed ex.

Posted by: GreatOne1 | December 16, 2008 5:01 PM | Report abuse

Cap Space SCHMAP Space. Get rid of anyone on the bubble and start shoppin'. No more vets.

Dallas did the coach switch & kept on movin'

This team's got nuthin'. Move 'em out.

Gimme two years on the bottom, puhleaze.

Posted by: DikShuttle | December 16, 2008 5:02 PM | Report abuse

qeed qeed

Posted by: dcsween | December 16, 2008 5:03 PM | Report abuse

Yep. Great fans, who can't even drown out opposing fans in the stadium, many of whom regular moan and groan for others around them to sit down during the biggest plays of the game, who sit on their damn hands time and again, and then make noise when the fricken' offense is on the field.

Right on, Pfunk. We kick butt.

Yeah, we sell that sucker out...then loads of fans don't show up, and half of them are absent for almost the whole third quarter. WoooHoo! We are AWESOME.

It was great we stormed Canton. Why can't we do that during the damn season in our own stadium?

Problem is, this message goes to all the wrong people. The people HERE are diehards, who will cheer, root for them when they stink, travel to see their games, etc...so I'll get panned here. But: we have WAY too many crappy fans that occupy our place.

Posted by: shaunsherman12 | December 16, 2008 5:04 PM | Report abuse

Skins totally need a tall wide receiver still, as Devin Thomas and Kelly are still flounders..I'm nervous about bringing in ANY name wide receiver because they all seem to be in some MKULTRA program on CIA LSD..Houshmanzadeh has an uncanny resemblance to Snoop Dogg and Boldin would probably beat up his girlfriend and then go Terminator postal in the night club, with our damn luck..Whatever happened to the Jerry Rices and Art Monks, jeez...

Posted by: frak | December 16, 2008 8:49 PM | Report abuse

I will repeat a broken record: We complained about Gibb's 'stale' offense, but that offense looks pretty damn good wearing Ravens purple, Panther turquoise and black, and Steeler black and gold. IT'S THE PLAYERS, AND WE DON'T HAVE ENOUGH OF THEM.
No Dexter Manley, no Dave Butz, no Charles Mann; some Jim Lachey, Mark May pretenders, and definitely no Russ Grimms. Lots of Ricky Sanders and Gary Clarks (maybe), but no Art Monks. NO RIGGINS, NO EARNEST BYNERS, NO GERALD RIGGS, NO JOE WASHINGTONS OR EVEN NICK GIOQUINTOS.

Forget 'where have you gone, Joe Di'maggio?': where the hell is Bobby Bethard?

Posted by: pdfordiii | December 16, 2008 8:49 PM | Report abuse

"Bottom line, that was the ultimate offseason failure for this franchise. We spent $120 million + on contracts for guys that we needed to replace through the draft just two years later."

..What part of "VINNY MUST GO" don't the nay-sayers understand??

..At least Jerry Rice never tripped "Woodstock brown-acid"in the club..They still celebrate "Jerry Rice Day" in SF, a little ego-tripping is fine, just as long as youve got numbers to back it up..

I kinda like squarer than square Casserly, but his CBS commentaries are boring as f*ck, definitely NOT ready for new school players..

Let's keep up the search and the banter for a bright eyed and squirrely-tailed GM, like a young Bobby B....

Posted by: frak | December 16, 2008 11:46 PM | Report abuse

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