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Day 4 of Camp (Morning Update)

Odds and ends from the morning workout:

Thanks to the prowess of Justin Geisinger and Ryan Boschetti in that little punt-catching competition between the linemen after practice, curfew has been pushed back to midnight. Jim Zorn spoke with reporters and said that tonight would be a night off for players. The veterans will skip the afternoon special-teams practice and don't have to attend meetings tonight. Zorn added that Jason Taylor worked some on the right side, but reiterated that, although they experiment with Taylor, he will play at left end. Oh, and the Fletchers have named their newborn son Cortland Steele Fletcher.
...

The morning practice just wrapped up and a punt-catching competition between the linemen is taking place, offense vs. defense. Justin Geisinger caught one and so did Ryan Boschetti for the D. Jasno reports: Good fun for all.
...

For those of you who were craving some real contact, this is your day. It's cool with a light drizzle and the guys are in full pads and popping each other. With the afternoon session scheduled to be special-teams driven and a lot of the veterans likely to be given a rest, the morning session got intense when the O squared off against the D.

Jasno reports that, for what it's worth -- and don't read too much into this -- today is shaping up as a rough one on the second team for Todd Collins. He was misfiring on some passes, the ball was sailing on him at times and there seemed to be some confusion on the breaks of some routes.

Earlier, the first team did inside running drills -- very physical, high-contact work with lots of popping. Jasno reported that LaRon Landry was trying to get in on the action from the perimeter. ... Jason Taylor (you remember him...) was seeing limited action. Demetric Evans was at left end on the first team.

London Fletcher was back and practicing after spending Tuesday with his wife, who gave birth to their second child, a boy. They also have a daughter.

Erasmus James and Kareem Moore are not in pads, but everyone else was participating to some extent.

If you have a moment, check out Mike Wise's piece on Clinton Portis -- who became a father during the offseason -- and Jason La Canfora's story on the offensive line.

By Cindy Boren  |  July 23, 2008; 11:27 AM ET
 
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Next: Redskins Unrestricted: J. Taylor Practices

Comments

Edible Panties!

Posted by: Anonymous | July 23, 2008 8:39 AM | Report abuse

I read all the articles today...very good

Posted by: Cheyenne, WY | July 23, 2008 8:42 AM | Report abuse

Skins are on the field, in full pads again.

If you're thinking of going to camp -- the last day it's open to the public is Monday -- Jasno reports that crowds are smaller than in past years. Not sure why, could be as simple as practice is up against morning rush hour and camp has opened a week earlier. Anyway, it figures to be jammed this weekend, so if you have time off and want to go, today and the next two days might be less crowded.

Posted by: Cindy | July 23, 2008 8:46 AM | Report abuse

Do you ever have to go out to Ashburn TheCindy?

Or are you just allowed to invoke 'WaPo Executive Privilege' and send the hoi polloi (Jasno2x) out there to swelter instead?

Posted by: Redcoat | July 23, 2008 8:51 AM | Report abuse

I've been debating on whether I should hit up Fan Appreciation Day or the Sunday practice instead. Has anyone ever gone to FAD? I like people, but man, I've heard it's kinda crazy. Is Sunday a better choice or is FAD worth it?

Posted by: [cc] | July 23, 2008 8:52 AM | Report abuse

Oh well, methinks I must away again to the conference room...

"Hi-ho, hi-ho, it's off to plan we go."

"12 more hours! 12 more hours!"

Posted by: Redcoat | July 23, 2008 8:53 AM | Report abuse

I usually hit the place once or twice during the season. It takes such a huge chunk out of the day to get there, that it's counter-productive for me.

Posted by: Cindy | July 23, 2008 8:54 AM | Report abuse

If it's true that Favre is calling the Vikings, isn't he tampering with himself?

Posted by: Cindy | July 23, 2008 9:09 AM | Report abuse

if it's true that Favre is calling the Vikings, isn't he tampering with himself?

Posted by: Cindy | July 23, 2008 9:09 AM

I am so sick of him right about now Cyn.

Posted by: jm220 | July 23, 2008 9:14 AM | Report abuse

if it's true that Favre is calling the Vikings, isn't he tampering with himself?

Posted by: Cindy | July 23, 2008 9:09 AM


He'll go blind!

Posted by: Cheyenne, WY | July 23, 2008 9:18 AM | Report abuse

I'm with you, JM. Last week, I publicly announced, "I've had it with Favre." He should go do "Hamlet" in a Southern Mississippi dinner theater. [Actually, that would be pretty watchable...And very funny, Cheyenne.]

Posted by: Cindy | July 23, 2008 9:20 AM | Report abuse

Cindy: A request. Can you ask the Jasons to point out who THREW the ball when they report on nice catches in practice? I think it gives a more complete picture of how the quarterbacks are doing.

Posted by: Prodgal Son | July 23, 2008 9:26 AM | Report abuse

anyone read the portis piece? He is a throwback man. The guy is just about the best person to have on a team. He never stops amazing me.

Posted by: Anonymous | July 23, 2008 9:27 AM | Report abuse

Ok, I have to get a smart azz comment in...Do you find yourself wagging your tail when you are happy? Nah, I try to not use anything to do with movement whatevers for down there, and think sideways just occurred to me now, before just inwards and back. Which seemed to seriously disturb, alike to ingrown and messing, alike inaccurate programs for the stage it's now in.
Seems more just something left ancestorial.

Posted by: wheelman | July 23, 2008 9:31 AM | Report abuse

JM220, did you even finish the Wise Portis article?!?!?!?! It was a total puff piece, was no hating on Portis in the slightest...

Posted by: chris larry | July 23, 2008 9:33 AM | Report abuse

Prodgal, if the WR (or whomever) is a first-teamer, the passer is Jason Campbell. If it's a second-teamer, it's Todd Collins. However, we will spell that out in the future just to be clear.

Posted by: Cindy | July 23, 2008 9:34 AM | Report abuse

Cindy, what WR's are first team at this point? are either of the rookies?

Posted by: Alex35332 | July 23, 2008 9:38 AM | Report abuse

Thanks, Cindy. I still have it stuck in my mind that there was some rotation taking place. But I forgot that you guys reported previously that Todd's reps are only with the second team. Seems crazy to me, but I'm in business, not football.

Posted by: Prodigal Son | July 23, 2008 9:40 AM | Report abuse

Hit refresh...Alex, it's a three-man formation of Moss, Randle El and Thrash.

Posted by: Cindy | July 23, 2008 9:44 AM | Report abuse

JM220, did you even finish the Wise Portis article?!?!?!?! It was a total puff piece, was no hating on Portis in the slightest...

Posted by: chris larry | July 23, 2008 9:33 AM

I like puff. It's a good balance with Jason, the Sky is Falling, LaCon. And I'm not trying to be cynical by saying this.

Posted by: Prodigal Son | July 23, 2008 9:44 AM | Report abuse

Morning CL. Nope I didn't finish it after reading that part. I was like wow where in blue bennie did that come from. CP has never came across as that type of person or player.

Posted by: jm220 | July 23, 2008 9:50 AM | Report abuse

According to Redskins.com:

"LaRon Landry will stay at the free safety position for the foreseeable future, defensive coordinator Greg Blache said this week."

"I just think LaRon brings so much to the table for us at the free safety spot," Blache said. "He's such a force back there, being able to play from sideline to sideline. I like the ability he has back there.

"Until I come up with something better, then we're not fooling with it."

Posted by: swb | July 23, 2008 9:51 AM | Report abuse

Here's an instant mini-update from Jasno that offers some clarity (particularly for you, Alex)...

Right now they are doing 11 on 11 hurry-up offense, and Chris Samuels, Chris Cooley and Clinton Portis are not taking part, but the rest of the usual starters are. Fred Davis is in for Cooley, Stephon Heyer for Samuels and Rock Cartwright for Portis, for example. Moss, Thrast and Randle El are the WRs.

Posted by: Cindy | July 23, 2008 9:52 AM | Report abuse

Read the whole article on Portis, its good. I think the lead was just suppossed to suggest Portis can be a chatty cathy to the press...I mean he is one of the best quotes on the team right?

Posted by: chris larry | July 23, 2008 9:54 AM | Report abuse

Thrash...You can tell I cut and pasted that txt msg....Thought I caught all the typos!

Posted by: Cindy | July 23, 2008 9:57 AM | Report abuse

Thanks, Cindy. In that one post I have a good idea who the starters and the primary backups are (except for Rock)!

Posted by: Prodigal Son | July 23, 2008 9:59 AM | Report abuse

Thanks Cindy.

Posted by: Alex35332 | July 23, 2008 10:00 AM | Report abuse

Did I ever mention that one of the Post's web people was at my 4th of july party? Aparently he is the BF of a friend of my gf. He asked me to pass something allong. Click the Adds so people at WaPo can keep there jobs.

Posted by: Alex35332 | July 23, 2008 10:01 AM | Report abuse

my never-swing-on-the-first-pitch prediction...

JC will not be the first string QB of this team by the end of this season. i was gonna say the 2nd game...but we live in washington...

Posted by: dealer | July 23, 2008 10:04 AM | Report abuse

LOL@alex!!!!

cindy, i'll do anything for you. but i'm not going to click on adds for a govt. IT contractors...who invoke 9/11 and terrorism fears...

Posted by: dealer | July 23, 2008 10:06 AM | Report abuse

JC will not be the first string QB of this team by the end of this season. i was gonna say the 2nd game...but we live in washington...

Posted by: dealer | July 23, 2008 10:04 AM

What are you basing this on?

Posted by: jm220 | July 23, 2008 10:08 AM | Report abuse

JM220, did you even finish the Wise Portis article?!?!?!?! It was a total puff piece, was no hating on Portis in the slightest...

Posted by: chris larry | July 23, 2008 9:33 AM

Disagree that it was a puff piece ... it seemed like it was just quotes ... for that matter, I disagree that it was a column ... Wise should not have attached his name to it. That said, I was glad to have a little opening monologue for my morning (plus I got all unexplainably raw again about Sean Taylor, a person who I never met but whose loss oddly affected me and my take on my own life).

Posted by: dcsween | July 23, 2008 10:09 AM | Report abuse

last year's performance, the year before's performance and the year before's performance.

Posted by: dealer | July 23, 2008 10:09 AM | Report abuse

if it's true that Favre is calling the Vikings, isn't he tampering with himself?

Posted by: Cindy | July 23, 2008 9:09 AM


He'll go blind!

Posted by: Cheyenne, WY | July 23, 2008 9:18 AM

Hilarious Chey.


Is it the middle of Sept. yet?

Posted by: Skinz | July 23, 2008 10:09 AM | Report abuse

Posted by: dealer | July 23, 2008 10:04 AM

What are you basing this on?

Posted by: jm220 | July 23, 2008 10:08 AM

unfilled prescription refills in the dealer household?

Posted by: dcsween | July 23, 2008 10:10 AM | Report abuse

Once again, could you PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE distinguish what the updated text is>

Posted by: Anonymous | July 23, 2008 10:10 AM | Report abuse

Thats a bold statement dealer...

That said, I can see that happening as well. Particularly with how well Collins did the end of last year. It would have to be an injury or VERY poor play to keep JC out. They have too much invested in him and I dint think Zorn being new to this area would want that kind of headache.

The fans hear would put him on an aggravation installment plan that would last for months.

Posted by: Cheyenne, WY | July 23, 2008 10:10 AM | Report abuse

Cindy, could you please text back to Jasno (or have a healthy bi-thumbed* editor do so) to ask whether the rookies have logos on their helmets yet? thx

* how's that rehab going?

Posted by: dcsween | July 23, 2008 10:12 AM | Report abuse

but in the interest of full disclosure,

I also have unfilled prescriptions

Posted by: Cheyenne, WY | July 23, 2008 10:12 AM | Report abuse

and you gotta love the excuse: umpteenth year in a row he will have a different "scheme" to learn...OMG! i wish people would let me use that excuse.

actually i just clicked on freddiemac's banner up at the top...but don't know how they gonna pay wapo after all the trouble they're in...

Posted by: dealer | July 23, 2008 10:13 AM | Report abuse

I don't think Zorn would pull J. Campbell based on very poor play. As a Zorn/Zen Master, he knows that growth happens through adversity and would require Campbell to play through and overcome it. Same reason that Tavaris Jackson and Rex Grossman are still starters.

Posted by: dcsween | July 23, 2008 10:14 AM | Report abuse

The fans hear would put him on an aggravation installment plan that would last for months.

not if they're winning...

Posted by: dealer | July 23, 2008 10:15 AM | Report abuse

I also have unfilled prescriptions

Posted by: Cheyenne, WY | July 23, 2008 10:12 AM

This is where proximity to Canadia comes in handy ...

Posted by: dcsween | July 23, 2008 10:15 AM | Report abuse

I refuse anything canadian. I will not even give them the benefit of capitaizing the first "c" in their name.

Posted by: Cheyenne, WY | July 23, 2008 10:20 AM | Report abuse

my wish is that zorn, the zen master can instill much needed confidence in him but i sorry i just haven't seen anything from the guy that makes me think jc will be up for it. i really don't know what his fans see in him.

also zorn picked colt 45. and i'm hearing he's looking good...

Posted by: dealer | July 23, 2008 10:21 AM | Report abuse

lol @ WY...dude, but they're so nice!

Posted by: dealer | July 23, 2008 10:22 AM | Report abuse

Hmmm, if not USA Jr. to the north, then maybe check in with BigMurf for a "prescription refill" ... should at least help with any transient glaucoma.

Posted by: dcsween | July 23, 2008 10:22 AM | Report abuse

I refuse anything canadian. I will not even give them the benefit of capitaizing the first "c" in their name.

Posted by: Cheyenne, WY | July 23, 2008 10:20 AM

Cheyenney whatcha gotta go n say that for eh?

Posted by: Canadien | July 23, 2008 10:24 AM | Report abuse

speaking of free healthcare...what's up with english people and bad teeth????? i was watching Death at a funeral and not one person had straight teeth. and same in hot fuzz...it's an epidemic!

Posted by: dealer | July 23, 2008 10:24 AM | Report abuse

Prodigal Son, I didn't think that necessarily meant Fred, Stephon and Rock are second on the depth chart at those positions, just that they're getting those reps today...

I would be surprised if Betts isn't the second RB on the depth chart. And is Stephon really #2 at LT, or would, say, Wade be the first guy in there (if, God forbid)? Hopefully those are just the guys benefiting from getting work while the studs are sitting... but I dunno...

Posted by: Nate in the PDX | July 23, 2008 10:25 AM | Report abuse

dealer, british smiles are the product of nationalized health care ... brits don't have a sense of ownership in their teeth ... more like rentals.

Posted by: dcsween | July 23, 2008 10:26 AM | Report abuse

also zorn picked colt 45. and i'm hearing he's looking good...

Posted by: dealer | July 23, 2008 10:21 AM

For a second I though that you were suggesting that Colt Brennan could get in there and replace JC. Couldnt be, right?

Man, I don't have enough bread crumbs to get home

Posted by: Cheyenne, WY | July 23, 2008 10:26 AM | Report abuse

Cleaning out my spam filter, I just dumped one with a subject line that read "Amero, the secret US currency" ... I'm wondering whether the Amero isn't just a Euro with the "Eu" scribbled out and replaced with "Ame" ... and whether the exchange rate is similar to that of bonus points.

Posted by: dcsween | July 23, 2008 10:28 AM | Report abuse

I have always viewed the canadians much like I viewed my former in-laws...

I dont't like them, but every once in a while they are helpful around the house

Posted by: Cheyenne, WY | July 23, 2008 10:29 AM | Report abuse

The rookies do not have logos yet. Jasno planned to blog about that yesterday, then got busy elsewhere. He may address that this afternoon, with special teams practicing.
Thumb is doing nicely, Sween, thanks for asking. I've got about half a thumbnail, which makes txting an adventure. And I was just kidding about the staff nurse yesterday. She didn't say I was an idiot.

Posted by: Cindy | July 23, 2008 10:29 AM | Report abuse

Yes, Nate is correct on the depth chart....

Posted by: Cindy | July 23, 2008 10:30 AM | Report abuse

dealer, you can join Dik on the Colt .45 Express. Dik freakin' loves Colt.

Me, I'm backing Jason Campbell all the way this year. I believe Snyder made it mission-critical for his new coach to do everything possible to help Soup succeed, to help him blossom into the franchise QB they have invested so much in. And I believe Zorn will give him a better chance to succeed at the position than he ever had under Coach Gibbs.

So yeah, I'm drinking the Kool-Soup, or whatever.

Posted by: Nate in the PDX | July 23, 2008 10:30 AM | Report abuse

Well doncha know Cheyenne whatcha gonna do aboot it eh?

Posted by: Canadien | July 23, 2008 10:33 AM | Report abuse

Nate, I'm with you. Colt can sit and rot on bench for four years as far as I'm concerned. I don't know what dealer's hearing. Me thinks "voices" in his head.

Posted by: bangkokben | July 23, 2008 10:34 AM | Report abuse

no, not colt...i think TC is right for this job right now. you never know they might pick up another QB in next year's draft...

don't the brits view that as a problem though? 3rd world country films have better looking people in their industry than the brits.

Posted by: dealer | July 23, 2008 10:35 AM | Report abuse

Thanks, Cindy. And I can't help wondering if Yoda is still entrenched at #2 TE or if he's already been supplanted by this newfangled rookie.

Also, Cyn, there was a question on the last thread about just what sort of coverage is "prohibited" by the Skins... is it broadcasting video from the Park? Anything else? And is WashPo subject to any different restrictions than anyone else, in this regard?

(Speaking to what I think is a mistaken perception that perhaps WashPo's, ah, sometimes strained relationship with the Skins FO might have resulted in special treatment/limitations...)

Also, Cyn, thanks to you and the peeps on the inside for keeping us up to date, the blog is ROCKIN' once again. Thank goodness.

Posted by: Nate in the PDX | July 23, 2008 10:36 AM | Report abuse

Cyn, is there an internation sign-up for text messages?

Posted by: bangkokben | July 23, 2008 10:36 AM | Report abuse

also zorn picked colt 45. and i'm hearing he's looking good...

Posted by: dealer | July 23, 2008 10:21 AM

That has more to do with no real #3 qb and Collins just about done. Collins prove to me in that playoff game. That he will be good as a fill in but not a starter for 16 games.

Posted by: jm220 | July 23, 2008 10:37 AM | Report abuse

I'd think that Heyer would truly be second at the moment. Hopefully that third rounder will be the second soon. I think Wade was over his head at left tackle and if you've ever seen him up close he doesn't exactly look coordinated enough to play the position.

Posted by: Skinz | July 23, 2008 10:38 AM | Report abuse

Cindy, could you please text back to Jasno (or have a healthy bi-thumbed* editor do so) to ask whether the rookies have logos on their helmets yet? thx

* how's that rehab going?

Posted by: dcsween | July 23, 2008 10:12 AM

I already saw they do in a photo. Atleast the pass catchers.

Posted by: 35332 | July 23, 2008 10:38 AM | Report abuse

Well doncha know Cheyenne whatcha gonna do aboot it eh?

Posted by: Canadien | July 23, 2008 10:33 AM

Nothing...

*whispers* until I get elected

Posted by: Anonymous | July 23, 2008 10:38 AM | Report abuse

I'm with Nate, I'll put all my hopes into Campbell. He's shown mistakes before but he does have a good arm and maybe Zorn can fix it...

With a fixed Campbell, this could end up a good year.

Posted by: svxcountry | July 23, 2008 10:38 AM | Report abuse

Great piece on the o-line today--thanks!. One thing I think is attractive about our team is how much the vets seems to take other players that they essentially compete with under their wing. Maybe not the exact same positions and i realizesome of our guys can realistically see their time coming anyway but Thomas and Daniels mentoring Alexander and Heyer come to minde and I wonder how prevalent that "attitude" is on other teams. Are we special in that way?

Posted by: Cookie | July 23, 2008 10:38 AM | Report abuse

....hmmm... someone dissin' colt?! whatz all dis jibba jabba?!! hmm.

Ok, I realize my enthusiasm over a late round QB is over the top. It's just a gut feeling, kiidz. So cut me some slak.

I do realize Soup is our starter and deservedly so. He just needs a lil' head adjustment, methinks.

...I just want our new guy to do well... (bring on Firestein...) is that so wrooong?!

Thanks for the update, Cyn. Gonna read the articles asap.

...and the word for the day is EXTRINSIC!

Posted by: Dik | July 23, 2008 10:41 AM | Report abuse

Its hard becuase of the staff changes and injury, he hasnt really had the necessary tuime develop (JC) so hopefully this can be his break out year.

Especially with Zorn being a pretty good QB in his own day. I never saw him play, I was still watching the Great Space Coaster in my underoos

Posted by: Cheyenne, WY | July 23, 2008 10:41 AM | Report abuse

High hopes for Colt too but he'll probably need a couple years for development...maybe he needs some EXTRINSIC motivation.

Posted by: svxcountry | July 23, 2008 10:43 AM | Report abuse

dealer, you can join Dik on the Colt .45 Express. Dik freakin' loves Colt.

Me, I'm backing Jason Campbell all the way this year. I believe Snyder made it mission-critical for his new coach to do everything possible to help Soup succeed, to help him blossom into the franchise QB they have invested so much in. And I believe Zorn will give him a better chance to succeed at the position than he ever had under Coach Gibbs.

So yeah, I'm drinking the Kool-Soup, or whatever.

Posted by: Nate in the PDX | July 23, 2008 10:30 AM

I think you're right on Soup getting another full year to prove himself. I have to believe this is the last year. He's not THAT young and the shelf life on this team has about 2 years left on it before the decline of the CB's, LBs, DL and OL.

Posted by: Skinz | July 23, 2008 10:43 AM | Report abuse

In JC I trust...if he falls flat than so be it, but I think he has the stuff, I don't get the haters honestyly, and if your calling for The Todd, well that just silly to me...

And Nate the word is "whateves"

Posted by: chris larry | July 23, 2008 10:43 AM | Report abuse

Let's see...I'll check, Ben, on the txt messaging thing.
As for video, we can't tape on their premises, hence jreid's bunker. And Steinbog pulled video from another site (that site invites users to imbed video..) yesterday and Skins called our lawyers to make us take it down, if you were wondering where that went.

Posted by: Cindy | July 23, 2008 10:44 AM | Report abuse

There's a new update with the end of the morning practice. I'll keep putting the most recent stuff at the top of the post, so all you have to do is look there.

Posted by: Cindy | July 23, 2008 10:45 AM | Report abuse

Cyn, this is kind of out of left field, but I was wondering if your boys could ask J-Tay to compare Zorn's camp to Cam Cameron's last year. Seems like pretty similar circumstances, first camp as an NFL head coach for each guy.

Just wondering if any interesting differences or similarities might register for a smart dude like Taylor... especially anything that might indicate Zorn's first season will be better than Cam's...

Aside from the Zornbrellas, I mean.

Posted by: Nate in the PDX | July 23, 2008 10:47 AM | Report abuse

Thanks, Cindy. I am appreciative of the updates.

Posted by: Anonymous | July 23, 2008 10:48 AM | Report abuse

today is shaping up as a rough one on the second team for Todd Collins. He was misfiring on some passes, the ball was sailing on him at times and there seemed to be some confusion on the breaks of some routes.

Sounds like that playoff game.

Posted by: jm220 | July 23, 2008 10:48 AM | Report abuse

Click the Adds so people at WaPo can keep there jobs.

Posted by: Alex35332 | July 23, 2008 10:01 AM

Do we have to buy the University of Georgia ringtones, too?

Posted by: talent evaluator | July 23, 2008 10:49 AM | Report abuse

I like the name "Zawning" better.

Posted by: Cindy | July 23, 2008 10:50 AM | Report abuse

Sounds like that playoff game.

Posted by: jm220 | July 23, 2008 10:48 AM

I thought we agreed never to mention that

Posted by: Cheyenne, WY | July 23, 2008 10:50 AM | Report abuse

Speaking of the punting situation Cyn, has anyone seen much on Brooks and how he is looking in comparison?

Posted by: svxcountry | July 23, 2008 10:50 AM | Report abuse

Speaking of the punting situation Cyn, has anyone seen much on Brooks and how he is looking in comparison?

Posted by: svxcountry | July 23, 2008 10:50 AM | Report abuse

I thought we agreed never to mention that

Posted by: Cheyenne, WY | July 23, 2008 10:50 AM

You know I am a rebel.

Posted by: jm220 | July 23, 2008 10:51 AM | Report abuse

Ooh, ellipsis as update separator! That'll do nicely.

Posted by: Nate in the PDX | July 23, 2008 10:53 AM | Report abuse

Special teams practice this afternoon, so we'll know much more then.

Posted by: Cindy | July 23, 2008 10:54 AM | Report abuse

nate, you said "they" meaning gibbs, snyder, cerrato. and you talk about giving JC a fair shot. what about zorn? is it fair to zorn to tie him to a QB he didn't pick, and has been inconsistent at the most over the past 3 years?

if zorn thinks tc is better or colt is better after 4 games then why wouldn't you let zorn make that move? after all he is a good QB coach if nothing else.

so if zorn goes 0-16 in his first year with jc. what do you do? fire zorn? and bring another coach to coach jc? just look at patrick ramsey...ramsey had more tools as a QB than jason...and look where he is now. i've never seen a QB be a QB in one scheme and not in another scheme.

sometimes (yes, i'm being sarcastic) fans are wrong when evaluating talent and coaches are right. we were all wrong about ramsey and gibbs and spurrier were right. i can't believe people still making excuses for ramsey up here. same people who're making excuses for jc. probly even after this year.

Posted by: dealer | July 23, 2008 10:55 AM | Report abuse

Sounds good...I just remember screaming at the TV numerous times after punts...I know it is not supposed to be nerve-wrecking when your team is punting.

Posted by: svxcountry | July 23, 2008 10:56 AM | Report abuse

Could someone please explain what the mano y mano or mano a mano cliche means to people??!!

mano > man!!

grr.

Posted by: Dik | July 23, 2008 10:57 AM | Report abuse

ok - the other "

it's supposed to say "not equal to"...

double grr.

Posted by: dik | July 23, 2008 10:59 AM | Report abuse

does mano mean hand in spanish. So isn't like hand to hand combat?

Posted by: svxcountry | July 23, 2008 10:59 AM | Report abuse

just look at patrick ramsey...ramsey had more tools as a QB than jason

OK now I know you are on some meds. Ramsey couldn't run worth sht and he didn't have a stronger arm than JC.

Posted by: jm220 | July 23, 2008 10:59 AM | Report abuse

Then, ellipses it is!!!!!!!! Oddly, I'm sitting about a quarter-mile from the Ellipse.

Posted by: Cindy | July 23, 2008 11:00 AM | Report abuse

Hand to hand (e.g., as in combat)? Like the Spanish version of tete a tete (French for head to head).

Posted by: dcsween | July 23, 2008 11:00 AM | Report abuse

Dik,

mano a mano = hand-to-hand

Posted by: talent evaluator | July 23, 2008 11:00 AM | Report abuse

Most of Jason Campbells problems have been things a good coach should be able to fix, not saying he is a pro-bowl QB, but he should be able to start for a while.

Posted by: Alex35332 | July 23, 2008 11:00 AM | Report abuse

Big deal ... so Ramsey hung out a Home Depot more than Jason Campbell did ... what does that have to do with offensive linemen catching punts?

Posted by: dcsween | July 23, 2008 11:02 AM | Report abuse

Not to be confused with mano a guante (hand to glove).

Posted by: dcsween | July 23, 2008 11:04 AM | Report abuse

Do we have to buy the University of Georgia ringtones, too?

Posted by: talent evaluator | July 23, 2008 10:49 AM

Did you go there for Skins news?

Posted by: Alex35332 | July 23, 2008 11:05 AM | Report abuse

where are the ellipses? don't see 'em...all i see is dashes...

Posted by: dealer | July 23, 2008 11:08 AM | Report abuse

And "WEARY" means you're tired of something, not suspicious of it... that would be "Leary", "Leery" or "Wary".

I assume people started misusing this by joining the two words... they may as well just say they're "Lary"!

Posted by: Dik | July 23, 2008 11:08 AM | Report abuse

ramsey had more tools as a QB than jason...

Dealer,

You really believe that? I'm not sure Ramsey got a fair shake as he was shell shocked from the first game under a college offense.

However, JC shows much more calm and poise then I ever saw from Ramsey. They both have rifles for arms and neither is all that accurate.

In terms of intangibles I think it's a landslide victory for JC.

Posted by: Skinz | July 23, 2008 11:08 AM | Report abuse

JC will be just fine under Zorn. I think he does have the poise and the skils to be a Pro Bowl QB.

He just needs to get them both going at the same time. Wouldnt hurt for him to have some big targets out there two.

Posted by: Cheyenne, WY | July 23, 2008 11:09 AM | Report abuse

Speaking of lack of oxygen, we really haven't talked enough about Favre since the Commissioner told the GB GM to get it over with after the impasse over Favre's list of teams he'd be willing to be traded to. Which brings us to why the Jets should be on his list ... solid offensive line (including upgrades through FA), plus 1st rounder TE and three solid receivers (Laverneus, Cotchery, and someone else I'm forgetting right now). Plus the Jets have nothing at QB. Favre to the Jets ... and then a round of oxygen on me!

Posted by: dcsween | July 23, 2008 11:09 AM | Report abuse

I think Ramsey had the poise beat out of him his first year. Once they got the "Ol ball coach" out of there...the damage was done.

Posted by: Cheyenney, WY | July 23, 2008 11:10 AM | Report abuse

Okay, I have been working less than 2 blocks from The Cindy, at Thomas Circle and did not figure it out until just now.

Posted by: Alex35332 | July 23, 2008 11:10 AM | Report abuse

I think if one of these rookie WRs pans out, JC will be in a lot better shape to have a bigger target and draw some of the double coverage off of Moss.

It will have the same effect as Carter not getting the double coverage now because of Taylor.

Posted by: svxcountry | July 23, 2008 11:11 AM | Report abuse

T_E,

Loved the geeky spreadsheet. Here's an old link with geeked up info about ALL-PROS.

http://www.twominutewarning.com/allpro.htm

Posted by: bangkokben | July 23, 2008 11:12 AM | Report abuse

I miss Heath Shuler.

Posted by: svxcountry | July 23, 2008 11:15 AM | Report abuse

Thanks for all the great posts, enjoying them a lot. Nice to take 2 mins from work and excursion into Skins land, keep 'em coming!

Posted by: Josh | July 23, 2008 11:17 AM | Report abuse

Dealer, your in mid season form, bat siht crazy!

Posted by: chris larry | July 23, 2008 11:19 AM | Report abuse

Ben,

The problem with that theory is that All-Pro is voted on during the season. Do the number of All-Pro = wins or do the number of wins = All Pro selections.

I think the tail wags the dog personally.

Posted by: Skinz | July 23, 2008 11:19 AM | Report abuse

Dealer, your in mid season form, bat siht crazy!

Posted by: chris larry | July 23, 2008 11:19 AM

LMAO!

Posted by: jm220 | July 23, 2008 11:20 AM | Report abuse

you know that calm and poise people talk about...don't know about that. when has he shown calm and poise...when he got rattled and spiked the ball against the giants? you know what i mean? some people ARE that way. they look like they're on weed. but that doesn't mean they're poised. does that make any sense?

Posted by: dealer | July 23, 2008 11:21 AM | Report abuse

... [:-|

yeah, guys. I knew that. I'm just tired of people using it to mean Man to Man or Man vs. Man grrr.


...y'know "Manos"... Hands of Fate...


''sorry y'all - grumpy today.

Posted by: Dik | July 23, 2008 11:22 AM | Report abuse

It doesn't mean he is always calm and poised but the majority of the time, for the hits he has taken, he is able to still calm down, step into the pocket and try to deliver another pass.

Posted by: svxcountry | July 23, 2008 11:22 AM | Report abuse

Favre traded to the retirement home for a plastic indoor bowling set to be named later works if you ask me;

but you didnt so please disregard.

Posted by: Cheyenne, WY | July 23, 2008 11:24 AM | Report abuse

Ben, Thanks for the link. Wow. That is WAY geeky. Right up my alley!

Posted by: talent evaluator | July 23, 2008 11:26 AM | Report abuse

you know that calm and poise people talk about...don't know about that. when has he shown calm and poise...when he got rattled and spiked the ball against the giants? you know what i mean? some people ARE that way. they look like they're on weed. but that doesn't mean they're poised. does that make any sense?

Posted by: dealer | July 23, 2008 11:21 AM

He's made many throws and runs to keep drives alive. He's marched us down the field at the end of games (admittedly throwing it to the other team at the end) and I think the players, veterans included, respond to him much better.

He was also still young. He's in his fourth year now and not a young pup with the equivelent of near 2 years starting. It's time for him to begin to translate the talent and ability into plays and wins though. In that sense I agree.

Posted by: Skinz | July 23, 2008 11:27 AM | Report abuse

Skins,

All-Pro is voted by the AP after the season, Pro-browls are voted by the fans and players during the season.

I also must call you out for this:

I think you're right on Soup getting another full year to prove himself. I have to believe this is the last year. He's not THAT young and the shelf life on this team has about 2 years left on it before the decline of the CB's, LBs, DL and OL.

Posted by: Skinz | July 23, 2008 10:43 AM

I agree about the LBs, but not the OL, DL or CBs - the replacement are in place for those units and then you "should" use all your resources to upgrade inadequate starters - ala trade picks shrewdly (Kendall, J. Taylor) Fletcher and possiblly Washington will need to be replaced in two years. O-line guys can play past they're 35 - barring chronic injury - NFL History is littered with old-time linemen. Kendall's replacement is on the roster, Jansens replacement is on the roster Samuels or Thomas' replacement is on the roster. Rabach is 30, Samuels is 31. Will need o-line top picks next year. I'd love to drop out the first and take two in the 2nd again. J. Taylor will need to be replaced and if Erasmus Jones heals this year who knows he may be the replacement. Griffin will need replacement maybe Monty's the guy and Golston can be a starter again. The window won't close on those units. IT NEED NOT CLOSE ON JASON CAMPBELL UNTIL MIDWAY THREW 2009! PATIENCE!

Posted by: bangkokben | July 23, 2008 11:32 AM | Report abuse

I miss Heath Shuler.

Posted by: svxcountry | July 23, 2008 11:15 AM

And Heath, in turn missed a lot of open receivers.

Posted by: cload & daggar | July 23, 2008 11:34 AM | Report abuse

I miss Heath Shuler.

Posted by: svxcountry | July 23, 2008 11:15 AM

And Heath, in turn missed a lot of open receivers.

Posted by: cload & daggar | July 23, 2008 11:34 AM

Man,

Cload came out of nowhere...Gave the old Lee Harvey Oswald treatment to svxcountry

Posted by: Cheyenne, WY | July 23, 2008 11:37 AM | Report abuse

Ben,

All Pro are voted on during the season and announced in the beginning of January.

and Beep Beep

Posted by: Skinz | July 23, 2008 11:37 AM | Report abuse

i think cindy's at lunch...

beep beep

Posted by: dealer | July 23, 2008 11:38 AM | Report abuse

The bullet definitely went through Heath's head, crossed the empty expanse between his ears, then exited and hit him again in the right wrist.

Posted by: cload & daggar | July 23, 2008 11:40 AM | Report abuse

If JC doesn't make big strides this year then we're in for a long season. As good as Collins was down the stretch last year I don't see him repeating that - hope I'm wrong. Brennan? He just sounds like a Koy/Ty Detmer type (or just about any of those backups Philly has had the past few years) - a little QB who was good/great in college but career 2nd-3rd stringer at best in the NFL.

Posted by: skinswest | July 23, 2008 11:40 AM | Report abuse

Ben,

You meant regular season I think. I gotcha.

Posted by: Skinz | July 23, 2008 11:40 AM | Report abuse

I thought since we were talking about Ramsey, I could bring up our other greats...Shuler, George, Weurffel (Spelling)....

Posted by: svxcountry | July 23, 2008 11:40 AM | Report abuse

It should also be said that going into THIS season, starting Campbell at QB gives us the best chance to have a successful year.

ToCo's brilliant run up to the playoffs will never be forgotten, but just like Brunell's two miraculous heaves to Santana, it's the exception that proves the rule, or some cliche such as.

And Colt is a rookie. From Hawai'i. He may turn out to be the future, but no way is he the now.

dealer, you go away for months at a stretch and then you're back and it's immediate BOOM! all over the blog. I love it, though it tends to drive me nuts.

(Hearkening back to your vehement assertion last year that you'd rather see Brady (and the Evil Empire) win his fourth ring than see BBM win his first.)

Posted by: Nate in the PDX | July 23, 2008 11:42 AM | Report abuse

sometimes (yes, i'm being sarcastic) fans are wrong when evaluating talent and coaches are right. we were all wrong about ramsey and gibbs and spurrier were right. i can't believe people still making excuses for ramsey up here. same people who're making excuses for jc. probly even after this year.

Posted by: dealer | July 23, 2008 10:55 AM

Didn't you know? everyone is a victim of Big Dan S. No one could ever just not be good.

Posted by: Anonymous | July 23, 2008 11:51 AM | Report abuse

I think you're right on Soup getting another full year to prove himself. I have to believe this is the last year. He's not THAT young and the shelf life on this team has about 2 years left on it before the decline of the CB's, LBs, DL and OL.

Posted by: Skinz | July 23, 2008 10:43 AM


Skinz, there may be legitimate questions about Jason Cambpell's ability to be a franchise QB for this team, but his age is not one of them. He is only 26 and QBs could perform at a high level well in their 30-s. Brett Favre was one of the best QBs last season and he is turning 39 this October. Todd Collins, although a career back up, had a nice run last season at the age of 36. Peyton Manning is 32, i.e., eight years older than Campbell, and no defense in this league views him as a washed up guy. I agree with you that there will be a need to add some young talent to the DL, LB and especially OL in the next 2 or 3 years. As for corners, everyone (except Springs) is under the age of 30 and I would not be surprised if they used their first draft pick next year on this position.

Posted by: M | July 23, 2008 11:51 AM | Report abuse

four day old nads

Posted by: Anonymous | July 23, 2008 11:52 AM | Report abuse

M is obviously not for Maths

Posted by: Anonymous | July 23, 2008 11:57 AM | Report abuse

what... no MST3K fans?? wow.

Posted by: Dik | July 23, 2008 12:28 PM | Report abuse

You really can't compare JC with the past errors that were brought in for this position, last year was an anomaly. JC was asked to run an offense that required too many adjustments after the snap, far different from the "Z" mans offense, you still check off recievers, but the routes don't have to adjust. JC HAS BEEN A WINNER whereever he has played that is the norm. PPA (please pay attention)

Posted by: skinfan4life | July 23, 2008 12:29 PM | Report abuse

Annon, you are right, M is not for maths. The age difference is six years, not eight, but the point is that Jason has more than 2 years left in him. Perhaps, I could takes some maths lessons from you, and in exchange, I will teach you how to sign your postings. :-)

Posted by: M | July 23, 2008 12:35 PM | Report abuse

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