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Redskins at the bye week: the offense

By Barry Svrluga

The Redskins reached the midway point of their first season under Mike Shanahan at 4-4 -- matching their win total from a year ago but knowing they might have won each of the games they lost. Over the next three days, we'll look at each element of the team -- defense, offense and special teams -- analyzing what happened, and what might come next.

Today, the offense:

What went right: Given what's expected from a Mike Shanahan-coached offense, not a whole heck of a lot.

With quarterback Donovan McNabb in the middle of his first season in Washington, the Redskins have shown a newfound ability to make big plays. McNabb has completed six passes of at least 50 yards, a number that's tops in the NFL. Receiver Anthony Armstrong, who quickly established himself as the Redskins' starter opposite Santana Moss, has emerged as a legitimate downfield threat. Armstrong's average of 21.6 yards per reception ranks second in the NFL, trailing only Pittsburgh's Mike Wallace (23.4).

Moss, too, has been steady. He's not as explosive downfield, but McNabb has consistently found him underneath. He has 48 catches at the midway point, a total that ranks third in the NFL and puts him on pace to easily pass his previous career high of 84 receptions set in 2005, his first year in Washington.

Tight end Chris Cooley has, too, been typically productive despite a few more drops than normal. Cooley, who missed some of a loss to Indianapolis after suffering a concussion, has 39 catches and two touchdowns, and he has been the target of 61 of McNabb's passes - more targets than any tight end in the league other than Dallas's Jason Witten.

Ryan Torain, who didn't even make the team out of training camp, has emerged as a decent replacement for starting running back Clinton Portis, who went out Oct. 3 with a groin injury. Torain posted back-to-back 100-yard games against Indianapolis and Chicago, and his average of 4.3 yards per carry matches the best Portis has ever put up in seven seasons with Washington.

The Redskins also have done a decent job taking care of the ball, with just 11 turnovers in eight games, a total that puts them tied for 11th in the league - and all but one of the 10 teams ahead of them have played one fewer game.

What went wrong: Where to start?

Over the two seasons of Jim Zorn's tenure in Washington, the Redskins averaged 316.3 yards per game, which ranked 21st in the NFL during that time. Shanahan's Redskins, with a new quarterback, new offensive line and entirely new scheme? They average 325.5 yards per game, 20th in the league.

The problems are everywhere, but start with McNabb, who not only hasn't been a savior, he has been sub-par. The averages for every NFL quarterback through Week 8: 60.9 percent completion rate, a passer rating of 83.5, and a touchdown-interception ratio of 1.4-1. McNabb's numbers: a 57.4 percent completion rate, a passer rating of 76.0, to go with seven touchdowns and eight interceptions. Those stats put him on pace to have his second-lowest completion rate and his lowest quarterback rating in his 11 years as a fulltime starter. Duplicate those numbers in the second half, and he would also set a new career low in touchdown passes and a new high in interceptions.

All that would have been bad enough, but the final game before the bye week brought McNabb's benching with less than two minutes left, and an unsettled offense now has an unsettled quarterback.

McNabb's struggles also reflect - or perhaps cause - those of the rest of the unit. Shanahan considers third-down conversions to be a key element of any offense. But the Redskins are converting just 24 percent of their third downs, second-to-last in the league. McNabb's numbers on third down are stunningly bad - a 44.9 percent completion rate and a 62.8 passer rating.

The problems are not all of McNabb's making. Washington's remade offensive line - which now has new players at four positions - has struggled in pass protection. After allowing seven sacks against Detroit, the Redskins have given up 23 on the year, second-most in the league. New right tackle Jammal Brown is not over a hip injury that cost him all of 2009, and new left tackle Trent Williams missed two games with minor injuries.

The receiving corps, too, is something of a mess. After Moss and Armstrong, no Redskins wideout has more than Joey Galloway's nine catches. Veteran Roydell Williams has two catches all year, and third-year receiver Devin Thomas was cut.

The result: An offense that has had trouble putting up points. The Redskins have 13 offensive touchdowns, a total that ranks 25th in the league. All seven of the teams that have scored fewer touchdowns from scrimmage have played just seven games.

MVP: Cooley. Maybe this spot should be left vacant, given the Redskins' overall struggles, and Cooley has been down on himself for the drops. But when Cooley's not in the game, the Redskins lose one of their best blockers, and the running game falls off, too. The guess here is that he becomes McNabb's most reliable - and most targeted - receiver in the second half.

Highlight: In Week 2, against a suspect Houston defense, McNabb looked like a quarterback who would run this offense efficiently for years to come, completing 28 of 38 throws for 426 yards as the Redskins' offense put up a season-high 27 points - albeit in what became an overtime loss.

Lowlight: The debacle in Detroit not only included seven sacks, but it could be the defining moment of both the season and McNabb's tenure in Washington. Trailing 25-20 with 1 minute, 50 seconds left, the Redskins had the ball at their own 30 yard line - and Shanahan replaced McNabb with backup Rex Grossman. Grossman was promptly sacked by Kyle Vanden Bosch; he fumbled, and Lions rookie Ndamukong Suh scooped it up and returned it for a clinching touchdown. McNabb's benching incited a storm of controversy, controversy the Redskins carried into the bye week.

Looking ahead: Offensive coordinator Kyle Shanahan called his unit "the weak link" at the midway point, and if the Redskins are to make a serious playoff push, that will have to stop. Once Portis is healthy, the Redskins will have to decide whether he ever returns to his spot as the franchise's marquee back.

But the dominant theme of the second half of the season will be McNabb. Mike Shanahan said McNabb would start the Nov. 15 game against Philadelphia, and he called him a "franchise quarterback." But until Shanahan faces a situation in which the Redskins must run their hurry-up, two-minute offense, and he keeps McNabb in the game, and McNabb leads a game-winning touchdown drives, there will be questions about the coach's confidence in his quarterback and the quarterback's comfort in the system. All of this could affect whether McNabb gets a contract extension - or if the Redskins head into 2011 looking for his replacement.

By Barry Svrluga  | November 4, 2010; 10:00 AM ET
Categories:  Anthony Armstrong, Chris Cooley, Clinton Portis, Donovan McNabb, Kyle Shanahan, Ryan Torain, Santana Moss, quarterbacks, wide receivers  
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Comments

No chance Cooley is any higher than 3rd on the offensive MVP list...McNabb is FIRST, Moss is 2nd, IMO.

Posted by: brownwood26 | November 4, 2010 10:17 AM | Report abuse

Ugh...it's already begun:

Jay Cutler trade fantasies start up in Chicago
Posted by Gregg Rosenthal on November 4, 2010 9:36 AM ET

22 games into the Jay Cutler era, some Bears fans have had enough.

David Haugh of the Chicago Tribune writes a column Thursday in which he wonders whether Cutler could wind up back with Mike Shanahan in Washington. Apparently, fans have started dreaming about the Bears signing hometown boy Donovan McNabb as a free agent and subsequently shipping Cutler to D.C. (The Bears would also have to acquire Rex Grossman for the two minute drill.)

Haugh makes it clear this is just a fantasy, and not remotely likely. It's way too early for this sort of thing. But the piece took a number of shots at Cutler's ability to lead a team, which I found more interesting then random trade speculation.

1. "Cutler's unrelenting immaturity too often undermines his immense talent. And when he loses focus, he can lose teammates and games," Haugh writes.

2. He calls McNabb the anti-Cutler in terms of charisma.

3. Cutler "has no leadership skills." Haugh has to be getting this from those inside the organization. He even takes a shot at Cutler's girlfriend, which seems a little out of place in an otherwise engrossing column that accuses Cutler of immaturity.

I can't help but think of Stefan Fatsis' great book A Few Seconds of Panic and some interviews I heard from the author after it came out. Cutler's aloof lack of leadership was painted in much the same way.

Five years into Cutler's career, the 27-year-old's ability to lead has apparently stagnated in much the same manner as his quarterback rating.

Posted by: brownwood26 | November 4, 2010 10:19 AM | Report abuse

"He didn't "singlehandedly" win us either the Cowboys"

actually he did...in the cowboys game, the Redskins scored 13 points, and won 13-7. Take away halls TD, and its 7-6, and the redskins lose....

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | November 4, 2010 10:16 AM

That's pretty silly greg.

Posted by: PlayAction | November 4, 2010 10:22 AM | Report abuse

Skins fans are so obsessed with QBs! Of all the NFL team fans, one would think our fans would be savvy enough to know it's all about the O-line.

3 Super Bowls with 3 different QBs, none of whom will go to the Hall of Fame.

Remember The Hogs?... HELLO!!!!

The Steelers were 4-1 to start this year with random QBs, and they would be a legitimate Super Bowl threat with any one of half the starting QBs in the NFL.

This team has a lot of holes to fill, and I will withold further judgement until a couple of years go by.

But I'm not overly impressed that a team that won 9 games in 2007 and 8 games in 2008 is 0.500 right now. Last year was an outlier, this is at it's core a 0.500 team. I'm not convinced the last regime couldn't have done this (if you get Vinny out of the picture).

Posted by: Alan4 | November 4, 2010 10:25 AM | Report abuse

brown, I'd prefer no part of Cutler.....

pa, what part wasn't factual...?

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | November 4, 2010 10:26 AM | Report abuse

I'm not hating on D-Hall (altho I've done my share of that) but LaRon Landry is a pretty clear cut first half MVP for this team. His play has made everyone's job easier.

Posted by: Notorious_LMG | November 4, 2010 10:11 AM


Sounds like you are hating.

By your logic, a QB can't be an MVP if he throws 28 TDs coupled with 15 INTs. DHall has certainly given up some plays, but I would be willing to say that 6 picks and 2 TDs is extraordinary enough to outweigh whatever negative plays he may have had.

He's made plays when we've absolutely needed them. And to say he "singlehandedly" won the Cowboys and Bears games (not sure where you were going with talk about the Eagles game) may be a bit overstated, surely you see how it's a safe bet we lose those games sans his TDs. While Landry has a similar such play against the Packers in OT, he didn't take it to the house...plus that potential pick that bounced about 40 yards off his helmet in the Bears game is something straight out of the Carlos Rogers playbook.

Don't get me wrong...I see the value in LL this year and he gets legit consideration from me for Most Improved Player. All I'm saying is that if we're looking at the first 8 games of the season alone, DHall is the obvious choice.

Besides...if you're talking intangibles and "making everyone's job easier", nobody is ahead of London Fletcher.

Posted by: brownwood26 | November 4, 2010 10:31 AM | Report abuse

Skins fans are so obsessed with QBs! Of all the NFL team fans, one would think our fans would be savvy enough to know it's all about the O-line.

3 Super Bowls with 3 different QBs, none of whom will go to the Hall of Fame.

Remember The Hogs?... HELLO!!!!

The Steelers were 4-1 to start this year with random QBs, and they would be a legitimate Super Bowl threat with any one of half the starting QBs in the NFL.

This team has a lot of holes to fill, and I will withold further judgement until a couple of years go by.

But I'm not overly impressed that a team that won 9 games in 2007 and 8 games in 2008 is 0.500 right now. Last year was an outlier, this is at it's core a 0.500 team. I'm not convinced the last regime couldn't have done this (if you get Vinny out of the picture).


Posted by: Alan4 | November 4, 2010 10:25 AM | Report

A lot of what you say is true, but it is also short sighted. Different teams win different ways. Some teams win on the attributes of their QB's above all else. There are quite a few Superbowl winning teams that if you take away their QB and just put in some guy they don't even make the show.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | November 4, 2010 10:31 AM | Report abuse

Five years into Cutler's career, the 27-year-old's ability to lead has apparently stagnated in much the same manner as his quarterback rating.

Posted by: brownwood26 | November 4, 2010 10:19 AM
-----------------------------------------
Thanks for the post, but Brown, that is just wrong to hang it all on Cutler. Sure, he's not very charismatic, but any knock on his leadership ability has to be counter-knocked with a garbage offensive line and Mike Martz's QB-killer offense. The guy was productive in Denver, and now he is not productive in Chicago. What changed? It wasn't the player...

Posted by: RedSkinHead | November 4, 2010 10:33 AM | Report abuse

Greg, 100% agree on Cutler...he's so awful that even Charlie Villanueva called him a cancer patient...

Alan, agreed...how a fanbase (and an owner, for that matter) that came up rooting for teams that were basically defined by their O-line can be so blind to the importance of building one is irony at its absolute cruelest...

Posted by: brownwood26 | November 4, 2010 10:36 AM | Report abuse

scampbell1975, you summarized precisely what I'm saying.

So why do we try so hard to be a team that "wins on the attributes of their QB's above all else", when this formula has never worked for us before?

Posted by: Alan4 | November 4, 2010 10:36 AM | Report abuse

This is flawed because they used average#s instead of using the median #. BIG difference.

Posted by: 4thFloor | November 4, 2010 10:37 AM | Report abuse

good kg pull brown....not sure what to believe in that one...kg's categorically insane, and has one of the worst mouth's in the NBA....

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | November 4, 2010 10:39 AM | Report abuse

Let me be the first to say watch out for Dennis Dixon. I am telling you, he is a type of QB Shanny would love to mold.

Posted by: roccoskins | November 4, 2010 10:41 AM | Report abuse

RSH, it's not just about Cutler's charisma...besides being a Grade A D-bag, he doesn't inspire confidence in the huddle, makes poor decisions with the football and doesn't show accountability when sh*t goes wrong. I wouldn't want him if the Bears offered him up for free...

Posted by: brownwood26 | November 4, 2010 10:43 AM | Report abuse

Cutler has always sucked. He was untouched in Denver so his stats were okay. You take away that protection and viola you have the Jay Cutler that was always there.

Posted by: bangkokben | November 4, 2010 10:43 AM | Report abuse

pa, what part wasn't factual...?

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | November 4, 2010 10:26 AM

Haha...come on greg...it is factual...but do you think a touchdown in the first half...winning 3 to 0...is "really" a game winning touchdown?

Posted by: PlayAction | November 4, 2010 10:43 AM | Report abuse

Cutler has always sucked....

Posted by: bangkokben | November 4, 2010 10:43 AM

...and yet Snyderatto was prepared to give up two 1st rounders for him!

Posted by: Alan4 | November 4, 2010 10:46 AM | Report abuse

good kg pull brown....not sure what to believe in that one...kg's categorically insane, and has one of the worst mouth's in the NBA....

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | November 4, 2010 10:39 AM


I think he did it. People that know KG say he wouldn't do it but Charlie isn't just making sh*t up. Plus the excuse KG offered up is flimsy at best, so I think it happened.

Both of my grandmothers have had breast cancer so it's not a topic lost on me...but you gotta admit that Charlie DOES look like someone on the front of one of the pamphlets for the cancer centers...

Posted by: brownwood26 | November 4, 2010 10:49 AM | Report abuse

Alan,

Can you imagine, Jay Cutler but no Trent Williams or Brian Orakpo? Then what would we be talking about?

Posted by: bangkokben | November 4, 2010 10:51 AM | Report abuse

yeah brown,he probably did say it...he's straight up crazy....he loses his mind...no excuses though...

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | November 4, 2010 10:52 AM | Report abuse

3 Super Bowls with 3 different QBs, none of whom will go to the Hall of Fame.

Remember The Hogs?... HELLO!!!!

Posted by: Alan4 | November 4, 2010 10:25 AM | Report

The Hogs were awesome, the best ever as a unit in my opinion, but they couldn't take ANYONE to the SB. Theismann was a good leader, Williams pulled it out in the clutch, in fact we won more games that year with him on the bench as a backup coming in then we did when he started a game, and Rypien finally pulled it together that one year with the deep ball. We couldn't win with Schroeder or Williams when he became the full time starter, and Rypien sucked when he got a contract extension. Those Gibbs teams were more than the Hogs, it was solid defense and a QB that knew how to lead and win. We need at least a semi-good QB to succeed, and the last time I checked this group ain't the Hogs, which means we need better than semi-good, we need a good to great QB, and at least in the first part of his stay here in Washington that's not McNabb.
I agree we need a better Oline, the question is will McNabb get his act together and start playing like the player we traded for? Cause otherwise if he keeps playing like he has been, he won't see how good our Oline can be.

Posted by: monk811 | November 4, 2010 10:52 AM | Report abuse

...and yet Snyderatto was prepared to give up two 1st rounders for him!


Posted by: Alan4 | November 4, 2010 10:46 AM


Don't forget the two first rounders they offered up for Ochocinco.

Ugh...SO glad that nightmare is over. Kinda puts the Shanahan's ego trips in perspective, doesn't it?

Posted by: brownwood26 | November 4, 2010 10:52 AM | Report abuse

Monk, not sure how you can say that when the only 3 constants over our 3 SB titles were the Hogs, Joe Gibbs, and Art Monk. Beyond that, it was mostly expendable parts.

I mean, we beat a damn good Broncos team 42-10 with a backup QB and a backup RB. I know it understates Doug Williams a bit, but I think you see my point here...

Posted by: brownwood26 | November 4, 2010 10:59 AM | Report abuse

No to Cutler. Period!

Any possible trade scenario involving draft picks would be too expensive given that we've already burned a 2nd and a 3rd on McNabb. We have so many other desperate needs that we also need to fill that we cannot have so many high picks tied up in one position - especially for that arrogant dismissive interception machine.

We also do not have the depth to trade players for him.

We need to focus on building a better TEAM, and that will require lots of draft picks as well as targeted FA acquisitions. Any QB will have better success with us AFTER we get the O line fixed and deepen our RB and WR corps.

We are not one player away from the Superbowl - especially if that player is Jay Cutler.

Posted by: edvar | November 4, 2010 11:00 AM | Report abuse

Alan,

Can you imagine, Jay Cutler but no Trent Williams or Brian Orakpo? Then what would we be talking about?

Posted by: bangkokben | November 4, 2010 10:51 AM

Exactly, and as Brownwood pointed out, two 1st rounders for Ochocinco, too.

Snyderatto wasn't content with making the Skins suck in the present, they were trying to break this team for years to come...

Can you imaging if both the Cutler and Ochocinco deals went through? Four 1st round draft picks gone...

Some people don't understand my appreciation for Jim Zorn, but to me he's awesome!!! Zorn is the guy who finally took down Vinny.

Posted by: Alan4 | November 4, 2010 11:03 AM | Report abuse

Cutler has always sucked....

Posted by: bangkokben | November 4, 2010 10:43 AM

...and yet Snyderatto was prepared to give up two 1st rounders for him!

Posted by: Alan4 | November 4, 2010 10:46 AM

Is this an endorsement of Cutler or more evidence that Snyderatto was (is) functionally brain dead?

Posted by: edvar | November 4, 2010 11:03 AM | Report abuse


"He didn't "singlehandedly" win us either the Cowboys"

actually he did...in the cowboys game, the Redskins scored 13 points, and won 13-7. Take away halls TD, and its 7-6, and the redskins lose....

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | November 4, 2010 10:16 AM

That's pretty silly greg.

Posted by: PlayAction | November 4, 2010 10:22 AM |

the rest of the team just stood on the sideline and watched as dhall won the game. this comes from a guy who says its a team sport ? jeez

Posted by: hessone | November 4, 2010 11:04 AM | Report abuse

I wonder how many folks up here would accuse Lombardi of being on an ego trip... Or Allen (well... hehe).

But seriously guys, this is how you build a program. You make the unpopular decisions. You shoulder the blame. You work to make the team better.

McNabb needed the message: "What you're doing is not acceptable." Message received.

Enough player coddling. It certainly didn't get us anywhere w/ Stompy. Payed him 21 Mil - he sits out drills. He didn't start acting right 'till he was benched.

Posted by: DikShuttle | November 4, 2010 11:05 AM | Report abuse

Monk, not sure how you can say that when the only 3 constants over our 3 SB titles were the Hogs, Joe Gibbs, and Art Monk. Beyond that, it was mostly expendable parts.

I mean, we beat a damn good Broncos team 42-10 with a backup QB and a backup RB. I know it understates Doug Williams a bit, but I think you see my point here...

Posted by: brownwood26 | November 4, 2010 10:59 AM | Report abuse

Yes, I agree the Hogs were the MAIN reason why we won 3 SB's, but I just wanted to prove the point that even with the best Oline in history they couldn't take a couple QB's to the SB. The solid Defense and Gibb's playcalling and halftime adjustments put them over the top.

Even if we work really hard on our Oline the next 2 years, we still need a QB that can lead us to victory and get it done. We shouldn't be bringing in our 'backup' to run a 2-minute drill!

McNabb does something in the 2nd half of the year or we use our 1st round pick to draft a QB of the future! 'Monk' it down!!!

Posted by: monk811 | November 4, 2010 11:07 AM | Report abuse

Some people don't understand my appreciation for Jim Zorn, but to me he's awesome!!! Zorn is the guy who finally took down Vinny.

Posted by: Alan4 | November 4, 2010 11:03 AM


Kinda like "Sid the Squid" was the man who took down Batman, right?

You can't possibly be that inept on purpose...no way...

Posted by: brownwood26 | November 4, 2010 11:07 AM | Report abuse


Monk, not sure how you can say that when the only 3 constants over our 3 SB titles were the Hogs, Joe Gibbs, and Art Monk. Beyond that, it was mostly expendable parts.

I mean, we beat a damn good Broncos team 42-10 with a backup QB and a backup RB. I know it understates Doug Williams a bit, but I think you see my point here...

Posted by: brownwood26 | November 4, 2010 10:59 AM |

brown, richie petibone and his defense says howdy too you

Posted by: hessone | November 4, 2010 11:08 AM | Report abuse

scampbell1975, you summarized precisely what I'm saying.

So why do we try so hard to be a team that "wins on the attributes of their QB's above all else", when this formula has never worked for us before?

Posted by: Alan4 | November 4, 2010 10:36 AM |

I'm on your side by the way. Anyone that has been on this blog over the last few years knows I've been a strong advocate of oline first. Actually, pretty much anyone with half a brain has been. That's why Cerrato wasn't...he doesn't even have half a brain.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | November 4, 2010 11:12 AM | Report abuse

"He didn't "singlehandedly" win us either the Cowboys"

actually he did...in the cowboys game, the Redskins scored 13 points, and won 13-7. Take away halls TD, and its 7-6, and the redskins lose....

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | November 4, 2010 10:16 AM

That's pretty silly greg.

Posted by: PlayAction | November 4, 2010 10:22 AM |

the rest of the team just stood on the sideline and watched as dhall won the game. this comes from a guy who says its a team sport ? jeez

Posted by: hessone | November 4, 2010 11:04 AM | Report abuse

Yeah, but 2 or 3 other guys stood him up, then Andre Carter knocked the ball out, THEN DHall picked it up and ran for the TD. Sounds like it WAS a team effort to me!

Posted by: monk811 | November 4, 2010 11:12 AM | Report abuse

scampbell1975, you summarized precisely what I'm saying.

So why do we try so hard to be a team that "wins on the attributes of their QB's above all else", when this formula has never worked for us before?

Posted by: Alan4 | November 4, 2010 10:36 AM |

I'm on your side by the way. Anyone that has been on this blog over the last few years knows I've been a strong advocate of oline first. Actually, pretty much anyone with half a brain has been. That's why Cerrato wasn't...he doesn't even have half a brain.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | November 4, 2010 11:13 AM | Report abuse

We shouldn't be bringing in our 'backup' to run a 2-minute drill!

Posted by: monk811 | November 4, 2010 11:07 AM

I thought he is our "Two Minute Drill Specialist"?

Posted by: PlayAction | November 4, 2010 11:14 AM | Report abuse

Kinda like "Sid the Squid" was the man who took down Batman, right?

You can't possibly be that inept on purpose...no way...

Posted by: brownwood26 | November 4, 2010 11:07 AM

Sid the Squid experienced a delusion, because Batman wasn't dead... but Vinny really IS gone!

Anyway, Zorn was given sh!tty circumstances to work under and produced sh!tty results. There were a ton of injuries and some plain old bad luck too, but for the sake of argument we'll just say he is to blame.

Bottom line, he stood up to Vinny and didn't quit. And Vinny's gone.

Yay!!!

Posted by: Alan4 | November 4, 2010 11:18 AM | Report abuse

Anybody see a pattern here? Jason C has no time to throw, sacked continuously, and ends up having a low QB rating.

McNabb has no time to throw, sacked continuously, and ends up having a low QB rating.

Maybe the bigger problem is the O-line rather than QB.

Look, I can see all of McNab's mistakes too (under- or over-throwing to open receivers) -- but what I see more of is McNabb under a lot of pressure: hurries, sacks, etc.

We need an O-line before we can even begin to decide how good McNabb still is.

Posted by: ADCWonk | November 4, 2010 11:22 AM | Report abuse

Jay Cutler = Ryan Leaf 2.0 except Cutler's had one good year.

Posted by: Devo2 | November 4, 2010 11:28 AM | Report abuse

good kg pull brown....not sure what to believe in that one...kg's categorically insane, and has one of the worst mouth's in the NBA....

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | November 4, 2010 10:39 AM
-----------------------------------------
Hey, I'm not saying we should get Cutler, but the same argument is there as it is here: the QB's performance is not solely a function of the things they have in their power to control. Cutler won in Denver. He could win in Chicago if he had a better offensive line and an offensive coordinator that thought pass protection was more than just a fantasy. Just the same it is with McNabb, the play at quarterback isn't all about the quarterback...

Posted by: RedSkinHead | November 4, 2010 11:30 AM | Report abuse

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | November 4, 2010 10:16 AM

That is not necessarily what that means. Couldn't you also say Orakpo won it because he created a holding call that took what would have been the winning score for the Cowboys off of the board? Additionally, if the Cowboys kneel on the ball at the end of the half, the play doesn't happen. Do the Skins still win? If Hall doesn't give up the TD to Austin does the game still come down to the holding call in the end? If things that actually happened didn't happen, that doesn't mean that everything else that happened would still occur.

Posted by: learnedhand1 | November 4, 2010 11:35 AM | Report abuse

O-Line is still this team's overriding concern.

The whole league knows this. Did you see Detroit's gamplan? Smear the Qu[B]eer.

What gets me is that we've actually regressed on that front. I realize there are a few injuries, but still. The gameplan needs to start accounting for the O line problems earlier than the 3rd quarter.

How about after the first two drives?

Posted by: DikShuttle | November 4, 2010 11:35 AM | Report abuse

How did Lichenstein move ahead and replace someone like Derrick Dockery? The pass protection seems to have broken down without Dockery and the media has been awfully quiet in pointing this out as a factor in the offense being so anemic.

Posted by: Robmic812 | November 4, 2010 11:36 AM | Report abuse

We need an O-line before we can even begin to decide how good McNabb still is.

We've added 6 new offensive linemen (one a pro bowler) with 4 of them starters.

Are we finished?

Nope.

Should we just keep adding offensive linemen and disregard, say, the defensive line, and offensive backfield?

Nope.

So what's a way out of our bad way?

Suggestion: take the two name players on our roster, move them, bring back additional picks to go with what we already have, draft for need, and build from there.

I'm not feeling the idea of buidling with older players with warts philosophy anymore.

The bucs got bad, got young, and are slowly creeping back.

The rams are young and are creeping back.

The pats are rebuilding their defense after using older players for so long.

Again: upside--and youth--is everything.

Posted by: MistaMoe | November 4, 2010 11:36 AM | Report abuse

Yeah, but 2 or 3 other guys stood him up, then Andre Carter knocked the ball out, THEN DHall picked it up and ran for the TD. Sounds like it WAS a team effort to me!

Posted by: monk811 | November 4, 2010 11:12 AM | Report abuse

THere were a couple other guys standing up Choice, but it was DHall who stripped the ball and recovered it. Watch the replay again

Posted by: p1funk | November 4, 2010 11:36 AM | Report abuse

Galloway has 9 catches?

Wow.

That's twice as many as I thought he had.

Posted by: p1funk | November 4, 2010 11:38 AM | Report abuse


For those who are against a "win now" philosophy, I have two points.

First, long term rebuilding is not really happening in the NFL now like it did in past decades. Teams now regularly go worst to first in a year, and several teams have managed to stay competitive for long periods of time.

Posted by: manlius1 | November 4, 2010 9:41 AM |

please, list all these teams you say go from worse to first, win championships, and stay competitive long term. don't forget to leave the steelers, patriots, and colts off your list. not sayin' it can't be done, but I'd rather build a powerhouse than build a flash in the pan

Posted by: hessone | November 4, 2010 11:39 AM | Report abuse

That's twice as many as I thought he had.

Posted by: p1funk | November 4, 2010 11:38 AM

You thought he had 4 1/2 catches? haha

I'm trying to remember just two!

Posted by: PlayAction | November 4, 2010 11:42 AM | Report abuse

Cool, halfway through the season and Galloway is ALMOST in double figures for catches...

Posted by: Alan4 | November 4, 2010 11:44 AM | Report abuse


THere were a couple other guys standing up Choice, but it was DHall who stripped the ball and recovered it. Watch the replay again

Posted by: p1funk | November 4, 2010 11:36 AM |

true p1, but dhall didn't have any help in doing so, right ?

Posted by: hessone | November 4, 2010 11:44 AM | Report abuse

Yeah, but 2 or 3 other guys stood him up, then Andre Carter knocked the ball out, THEN DHall picked it up and ran for the TD. Sounds like it WAS a team effort to me!

Posted by: monk811 | November 4, 2010 11:12 AM | Report abuse

THere were a couple other guys standing up Choice, but it was DHall who stripped the ball and recovered it. Watch the replay again

Posted by: p1funk | November 4, 2010 11:36 AM | Report abuse

Um, I DID watch the replay, and the ball wasn't stripped UNTIL Carter came and knocked the ball out with his helmet. Thank you for trying, come again......

Posted by: monk811 | November 4, 2010 11:46 AM | Report abuse

The offense is terrible. 100% garbage.

It's impossible to believe that a bunch of grown men could develope, work on, and display such a piece of feces.

Should fire Shanny Jr. after season and get a real OC in here.

Posted by: alocowboy | November 4, 2010 11:48 AM | Report abuse

The offense is terrible. 100% garbage.

It's impossible to believe that a bunch of grown men could develope, work on, and display such a piece of feces.

Should fire Shanny Jr. after season and get a real OC in here.

Posted by: alocowboy | November 4, 2010 11:48 AM | Report abuse

DM is a franchise qb and I hope the private conversation recognized that. We should resign him and focus on OL. That is what is wrong with offense, we could run with anyone if OL was deeper (see Texans)- that would take pressure off DM (I thought this was the idea) and allow him to scramble a bit and hit big plays downfield like he did when Eags went to (dare I say it) Super Bowl.

Posted by: ElYeah | November 4, 2010 11:54 AM | Report abuse

Anybody see a pattern here? Jason C has no time to throw, sacked continuously, and ends up having a low QB rating.

McNabb has no time to throw, sacked continuously, and ends up having a low QB rating.

Maybe the bigger problem is the O-line rather than QB.

Posted by: ADCWonk | November 4, 2010 11:22 AM


Right. But to some, I guess it's just more fun to pile on one guy instead of a whole inept unit....

Line play is the foundation of ANY unit. Building it any other way is building a house roof first...

Posted by: brownwood26 | November 4, 2010 11:56 AM | Report abuse

brown, "Garnett later issued a statement that his comment "was in fact, ‘You are cancerous to your team and our league.’"

whateves at this point, already over played in the media....

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | November 4, 2010 11:59 AM | Report abuse

The offense is terrible. 100% garbage.

It's impossible to believe that a bunch of grown men could develope, work on, and display such a piece of feces.

Should fire Shanny Jr. after season and get a real OC in here.

Posted by: alocowboy | November 4, 2010 11:48 AM | Report abuse

You apparently did not watch last years team. You also must have no patience.

This roster was that horrible, it can't b e corrected in one year, and quite simply is still not that good. IT WILL take time to turn things around.

Deal with it, and try to stay positive and root for them in the mean time.

You know like...Hail to the Redskins

Seriously people. It's time to separate ourselves from the last 10 years of mismanagement and mediocrity which have defined this team since Snyder took over.

This new regime is for real, and it will take time. Be supportive, positive, and faithful.

Redskins fans now = Eagles fans. You're not happy unless you're angry and complaining. It's getting old already.

4-4 is a positive step and at seasons end of 8-8 will be a huge improvement from last years Zorneratto debacle. With another year, we'll see 9-7 or 10-6. See the trend?

Posted by: Devo2 | November 4, 2010 12:01 PM | Report abuse

THere were a couple other guys standing up Choice, but it was DHall who stripped the ball and recovered it. Watch the replay again

Posted by: p1funk | November 4, 2010 11:36 AM |

true p1, but dhall didn't have any help in doing so, right ?

Posted by: hessone | November 4, 2010 11:44 AM | Report abuse


NO he didn't need help.

DHall is 10 feet tall; he shoots lightning from his eyes and fireballs from his arse.

Posted by: p1funk | November 4, 2010 12:02 PM | Report abuse

We shouldn't be bringing in our 'backup' to run a 2-minute drill!

Posted by: monk811 | November 4, 2010 11:07 AM

I thought he is our "Two Minute Drill Specialist"?

Posted by: PlayAction | November 4, 2010 11:14 AM | Report abuse

He should be our "Valet Specialist" outside FedEx Field parking cars during home games.

Posted by: monk811 | November 4, 2010 12:03 PM | Report abuse

Cutler won in Denver...

Posted by: RedSkinHead | November 4, 2010 11:30 AM


Whoa, whoa, whoa...what?

What did Cutler win in Denver? Never won a playoff game...mainly because he never PLAYED in a playoff game. So what did he win to make you think he earns ANY form of benefit of the doubt?

He's a former 1st round pick that had one 4,500 yard season. That's the extent of his good accomplishments in this league. That's ALL...

Posted by: brownwood26 | November 4, 2010 12:03 PM | Report abuse

typical WAPOST article- header reads "what went right" - followed by "nothing - here's how much the Redskins suck". Excellent job following in Jason LaCanfora's footsteps.

Posted by: mountjacksonmudcats | November 4, 2010 12:04 PM | Report abuse

There were a ton of injuries and some plain old bad luck too, but for the sake of argument we'll just say he is to blame.

Two words, swinging gate.

Posted by: wireman65 | November 4, 2010 12:04 PM | Report abuse

Atually Sexy Rexie is 60 sec man according to his So 15 seconds of loving, 15 seconds of pushing and pulling and then in 30 seconds he is a sleep.

Ask the HC he knows!

Posted by: sheepherder | November 4, 2010 12:05 PM | Report abuse

DHall is 10 feet tall; he shoots lightning from his eyes and fireballs from his arse.

Posted by: p1funk | November 4, 2010 12:02 PM

Holy SH*T!!!

Automatic MVP!

Posted by: PlayAction | November 4, 2010 12:05 PM | Report abuse

think the Raiders would trade us JC for DM? We'll even toss in the latest workout stats for Jamarcus as a bonus!

i like that kyle readily admits that his offense is the weak link. The first step to solving any problem is avoiding self-denial.

Posted by: cstanton1 | November 4, 2010 12:07 PM | Report abuse

I thought he is our "Two Minute Drill Specialist"?

Posted by: PlayAction | November 4, 2010 11:14 AM | Report abuse

He should be our "Valet Specialist" outside FedEx Field parking cars during home games.

Posted by: monk811 | November 4, 2010 12:03 PM

You're probably right monk...but he should get another chance...I think he was confused because there wasn't exactly 2 minutes on the clock.

Posted by: PlayAction | November 4, 2010 12:09 PM | Report abuse

Sure, DHall is a badass - but P1 is getting dangerously close to Leigh Torrence territory.

I think we can all agree that DHall is NO Leigh Torrence!

Posted by: DikShuttle | November 4, 2010 12:11 PM | Report abuse

typical WAPOST article- header reads "what went right" - followed by "nothing - here's how much the Redskins suck". Excellent job following in Jason LaCanfora's footsteps.

Posted by: mountjacksonmudcats | November 4, 2010 12:04 PM | Report abuse

Actually, you can thank Adam Shefter for leaving NFLNetwork and going to ESPN, which opened up his spot for LaCanfora to leave the Post. My question is what kind of crappy local Community College newspaper did Jason Reid come from and who did he have to bl*w to get this job? He needs to go back to 'Cutting and Pasting 101'.

Posted by: monk811 | November 4, 2010 12:11 PM | Report abuse

The "weakest link" is the usual under the Snyder regime... the OL. McNabb can't hide a bad OL and has the bruises to prove it.

Posted by: clandestinetomcat | November 4, 2010 12:12 PM | Report abuse

That is not necessarily what that means. Couldn't you also say Orakpo won it because he created a holding call that took what would have been the winning score for the Cowboys off of the board? Additionally, if the Cowboys kneel on the ball at the end of the half, the play doesn't happen. Do the Skins still win? If Hall doesn't give up the TD to Austin does the game still come down to the holding call in the end? If things that actually happened didn't happen, that doesn't mean that everything else that happened would still occur.

Posted by: learnedhand1
________________________

Learned Hand would call this concept "but for causation", to be distinquished from "proximate causation" (the more direct degree of causal relationship recognized under the law).

On worst-to-first, from ESPN on 9/9/10: "In each of the past seven seasons, and in nine of the 10 seasons of this decade, one of the NFL's last-place teams has gone from worst to first." If you want the team names, google away . . ..

Posted by: manlius1 | November 4, 2010 12:13 PM | Report abuse

i can guarantee right or wrong, there is no way the Skins extend McNabb. Not now, not after the way this has played out. Shanahan won't allow a QB to be such a prime focus in this town that he has to walk on eggshells around him. It'll never happen. The only way it COULD happen was if we were talking about an excellent young QB. We're not.

I expect we'll draft yet another QB next yr and try and develop him. Kinda sucks because we've drafted so many QBs (Shuler, Ramsey, JC) and haven't yet found our franchise QB. I'd be happy with a seasoned veteran like Rosenfels.

Posted by: cstanton1 | November 4, 2010 12:19 PM | Report abuse

Good Lawd, kiidz

QB is NOT the issue here. It's oLine and getting a mediocre team to play with the best available execution.

When Shenannigans find the young QB they like, they'll get him. In the meantime, they've got tools. These aren't the future.

This isn't a quick fix w/ no pics under our belt. This is a makeshift squad and we should be very happy to be at .500. I am.

Posted by: DikShuttle | November 4, 2010 12:19 PM | Report abuse

DHall is 10 feet tall; he shoots lightning from his eyes and fireballs from his arse.

Posted by: p1funk | November 4, 2010 12:02 PM

Holy SH*T!!!

Automatic MVP!

Posted by: PlayAction | November 4, 2010 12:05 PM | Report abuse

Yeah, but with the NFL cracking down on illegal hits with the helmet, I thing they would put more fines in place for Hall's 'special talents', and the refs would call newly added penalties because of Hall!

Referee - "Personal Foul! Farting a Fireball in Eli Manning's face! 15 Yard Penalty, and the player is ejected for burning off his eyebrows, he looks even more retarded now!!!"

Posted by: monk811 | November 4, 2010 12:19 PM | Report abuse

Aside from Trent Williams, ZERO OFFENSIVE LINE IMPROVEMENT!!! Sacks per game have increased since Portis has been out - no running back picks up a blitz like Portis! And how does Fred Davis drop two scoring passes last week?

The Skins should be 6 - 2, or at least 5 - 3.

Posted by: BenThere | November 4, 2010 12:20 PM | Report abuse

Good Lawd, kiidz

QB is NOT the issue here. It's oLine and getting a mediocre team to play with the best available execution.

When Shenannigans find the young QB they like, they'll get him. In the meantime, they've got tools. These aren't the future.

This isn't a quick fix w/ no pics under our belt. This is a makeshift squad and we should be very happy to be at .500. I am.

Posted by: DikShuttle | November 4, 2010 12:20 PM | Report abuse

DM is a franchise qb

--------------

He's old, he's banged up, he's not very bright as evidenced by the ridiculous decisions he makes in the passing game, his mechanics are terrible, and his athleticism is waning.

But if you look past all of that, yep he's a franchise QB !

Posted by: cstanton1 | November 4, 2010 12:22 PM | Report abuse

And how does Fred Davis drop two scoring passes last week?

first one had #5 throw a bullet when Davis was 4 yards away...

second was was thrown poorly..

those are BOTH on the qb....

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | November 4, 2010 12:23 PM | Report abuse

The offense is terrible. 100% garbage.

It's impossible to believe that a bunch of grown men could develope, work on, and display such a piece of feces.

Should fire Shanny Jr. after season and get a real OC in here.

Posted by: alocowboy | November 4, 2010 11:48 AM | Report abuse

You might be right but I don't think so.

Shanny Jr. ran the best offense in the league last year. How is that offense doing with out him this year they are 7th.

The Redskins offense has stunk for over 10 years so is it the crappy players or is it Shanny Jr. Maybe it's the fact that they have no O-Line or that they don't have a high powered RB or maybe even still it could be because the WR's suck.

You can thank Cerrato for the terrible players, Shanny has done more with this crap then anyone could.

Your on a Redskin site take the Cowboy out of your name.

Posted by: Flounder21 | November 4, 2010 12:24 PM | Report abuse

The stats for McNabb's 3rd down efficiency seem a bit suspect (I mean they are not all his fault).

I recall way too many 3rd and 10+ yards to go in recent games. It would be interesting to see what the 'Skins average yards to go on 3rd down is relative to the rest of the league. I bet the 'Skins are near the bottom, and those long 3rd downs make for poor passer efficiency.

Posted by: swowra | November 4, 2010 12:25 PM | Report abuse

I expect we'll draft yet another QB next yr and try and develop him. Kinda sucks because we've drafted so many QBs (Shuler, Ramsey, JC) and haven't yet found our franchise QB. I'd be happy with a seasoned veteran like Rosenfels.

Posted by: cstanton1 | November 4, 2010 12:19 PM | Report abuse

What sucks is we drafted Rosenfels back in the day also! Not that he would have been the next Joe Montana or anything, but I would have settled for Tony Montana. Watch out for his 'little friend'......

Posted by: monk811 | November 4, 2010 12:26 PM | Report abuse


Anybody see a pattern here? Jason C has no time to throw, sacked continuously, and ends up having a low QB rating.

McNabb has no time to throw, sacked continuously, and ends up having a low QB rating.

Maybe the bigger problem is the O-line rather than QB.

Posted by: ADCWonk | November 4, 2010 11:22 AM


Right. But to some, I guess it's just more fun to pile on one guy instead of a whole inept unit....

Line play is the foundation of ANY unit. Building it any other way is building a house roof first...

Posted by: brownwood26 | November 4, 2010 11:56 AM |

but brown, the redskins have been and still are building the house, roof first. what don't you understand about that in regards to getting mcnabb in the first place. we agree on the o-line is the first priority in the draft, but if you count last years trades, its more of the same and it set us back a couple of notches.

I guess my question is, when in the freakin world is the FO going to change this philosophy ? dump older vets for picks, as moe has stated, and start taking our chances drafting YOUNG players ?

once we have established a strong nucleus on the o-line thru the draft, THEN we should add the talent positions thru draft, FA's.

lest we forget, the hogs were built on draft days, not at the beginning of FA and not thru trade, and yes one was undrafted

Jeff Bostic - Undrafted in 1980
Russ Grimm - 3rd round 1981
Mark May - 1st round 1981
George Starke - 11th round 1971
Don Warren - 4th round 1979
Rick Walker - 4th round 1977

there's your original hogs. looking at the draft years kind of makes me feel my age a little bit, but enjoy the ride folks, it's later than ya think


Posted by: hessone | November 4, 2010 12:27 PM | Report abuse

Great article on Jake Plummer, If you read through to almost the bottom he talks about how Shanny wore him down in Denver.


http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/blog/shutdown_corner/post/Ex-NFL-QB-Jake-Plummer-is-playing-a-new-sport-th?urn=nfl-282499

Posted by: GreatOne1 | November 4, 2010 12:28 PM | Report abuse

Not that anybody cares, but the folks at MAddenNFL11 obviously take Shanny's "cardiovascular endurance" dig at McNabb very seriously, as their online updated drops McNabb's stamina from 95 to and 87. Surprisingly Anthony Armstrong ( who i'm not very impressed with) makes the jump from a 69 overall to a 72.

Posted by: lilhollywood10 | November 4, 2010 12:30 PM | Report abuse

Jay Cutler trade fantasies start up in Chicago
Posted by Gregg Rosenthal on November 4, 2010 9:36 AM ET

22 games into the Jay Cutler era, some Bears fans have had enough.

David Haugh of the Chicago Tribune writes a column Thursday in which he wonders whether Cutler could wind up back with Mike Shanahan in Washington. Apparently, fans have started dreaming about the Bears signing hometown boy Donovan McNabb as a free agent and subsequently shipping Cutler to D.C. (The Bears would also have to acquire Rex Grossman for the two minute drill.)

Haugh makes it clear this is just a fantasy, and not remotely likely. It's way too early for this sort of thing. But the piece took a number of shots at Cutler's ability to lead a team, which I found more interesting then random trade speculation.

1. "Cutler's unrelenting immaturity too often undermines his immense talent. And when he loses focus, he can lose teammates and games," Haugh writes.

2. He calls McNabb the anti-Cutler in terms of charisma.

3. Cutler "has no leadership skills." Haugh has to be getting this from those inside the organization. He even takes a shot at Cutler's girlfriend, which seems a little out of place in an otherwise engrossing column that accuses Cutler of immaturity.

I can't help but think of Stefan Fatsis' great book A Few Seconds of Panic and some interviews I heard from the author after it came out. Cutler's aloof lack of leadership was painted in much the same way.

Five years into Cutler's career, the 27-year-old's ability to lead has apparently stagnated in much the same manner as his quarterback rating.


Posted by: brownwood26

The only way Jay Cutler will ever work in DC is if DHall switched to offense.

Posted by: Predator48 | November 4, 2010 12:31 PM | Report abuse

cstanton just poked holes in why a 6-time Pro-Bowler with more championship game appearances in the last decade than we've had total playoff games in the last TWO decades is NOT a franchise QB...yet yearns for a "seasoned vet" like Sage Rosenfels. Simply amazing...some stuff you just can't make up...

Posted by: brownwood26 | November 4, 2010 12:34 PM | Report abuse

Yes the Skins could have won at least 3 of the 4 they lost , but at the same time they could just as easily have LOST all 4 that they won , so 4-4 at this point is probably about where they should be .... DMac may be off to a slow start with his new team , but it's still crazy to start talking about Grossman starting (see Joe Theisman's comments) ... Lets face it, it's a process : 1) DMac has to adjust to a new team/offense , 2) the OL might have 4 new starters but the improvement is not huge so OL will again need to be an off-season priority, 3) kids like Armstrong & Torain are nice finds, but WR & RB still need to be improved .... Everyone needs to just chill and give it some time , 'cause whatever the pros&cons of Shanny/Allen it still beats the he** out of what we had before ...

Posted by: RoidRage | November 4, 2010 12:34 PM | Report abuse


On worst-to-first, from ESPN on 9/9/10: "In each of the past seven seasons, and in nine of the 10 seasons of this decade, one of the NFL's last-place teams has gone from worst to first." If you want the team names, google away . . ..

Posted by: manlius1 | November 4, 2010 12:13 PM |

dude, how many of those worst to first teams won championships and which remained close to that level. I stand by the concept of building a powerhouse and not a one year wonder.

Posted by: hessone | November 4, 2010 12:37 PM | Report abuse

Referee - "Personal Foul! Farting a Fireball in Eli Manning's face! 15 Yard Penalty, and the player is ejected for burning off his eyebrows, he looks even more retarded now!!!"

Posted by: monk811 | November 4, 2010 12:19 PM

Haha...well they don't call it the No Fun League for nuthin!

Posted by: PlayAction | November 4, 2010 12:39 PM | Report abuse

Beep - Offense MVP Poll - Beep

Posted by: PlayAction | November 4, 2010 12:44 PM | Report abuse

McNabb won't be back.

He clearly doesn't fit Kyle Shanahan's ideal qb for his offense.

Shanahan wants a pocket passer like Schaub that is going to be mechanically excellent even if limited athletically.

McNabb is a playmaker. He is at his best when he is rolling out and finding guys in the intermediate zone who then get RAC yardage. When he is in the pocket Reid had him throwing the ball quick off a short drop to the RBs, TEs. He didn't have Donovan go back in 7 steps and progress from 40 yards and in.

Since Shanahan and his son have shown that they are not really willing to alter the schemes for the talent, I wonder why either the staff OR McNabb would want to come back here in 2011.

Posted by: RoyHobbs4 | November 4, 2010 12:49 PM | Report abuse

This team has been subpar for 11+ years!

The offense sucks because no coach has been around long enough to allow it to take.

This team is not that talented and has holes nearly everywhere!

To be 4-4 and still in the division race is miraculous.

Many fans are stupid!

McNabb has not been playing well!

Shanahan benched him at the wrong time!

People expect Shanahan to give McNabb a big fat kiss in the mouth because we hurt his little feelings!

Do you remember Mark Brunell?

Do you remember when Joe Gibbs showed "loyalty" to him for a season too long?

I'm willing to give Shanahan time!

McNabb is not healthy right now!

If he performs to the level of expectations, he will get an extension...if he doesn't he shouldn't get one.

Brian Mitchell is related to McNabb, so you can imagine how he's killing the Skins!

That is ALL!

Posted by: rickyroge | November 4, 2010 12:54 PM | Report abuse

RoyHobbs...

How do you know that the schemes have not been altered to the level of talent?

Posted by: rickyroge | November 4, 2010 12:58 PM | Report abuse

I don't have all the facts here, and I haven't run a regression analysis, but it seems that McNabb looks more comfortable and is more successful when he takes the snap from under center, does a play-action fake and rolls out AWAY from the pocket (and AWAY from that crappy o-line). When they do that, he has some freedom and some space. Wondering whether they should do that more. Maybe defenses would catch on, but it might work for a while, or for the first half of games before adjustments.

Either way, D-Mac in the pocket is just dreadful. We need a solution.

Posted by: ktp70 | November 4, 2010 1:07 PM | Report abuse

Can't the Skids save fans a lot of useless and hollow sports commentary by the I-don't-know-anymore-about-the-NFL-than-you-do Post writers, and get on with JaMarcus's next failure -- and draft another franchise QB?

Posted by: clitteigh | November 4, 2010 1:44 PM | Report abuse

Redskin thoughts:
Somebody please help me understand:
How does Raymer… oh sorry Rabach continue to have a job?? (They even gave him a contract extension last summer. They must didn’t watch the Dallas games last year.)
How does a 285lb interior lineman start in todays NFL against 350lb monsters??? (Lightsteiger absolutely sucks)
How can a coaching staff come out of training camp with A Carter as an outside lb (he moved like my grandfather in open space, it was comical watchin him at lb in the preseason???
Why does it take a staff so long to figure out that you don’t put your most athletic talented def lineman at nose guard???
Im beginning to think that Shanny and the staff are retards!
At least I know Kyle Shanny’s problem. He can’t think straight he is always hungry. Clearly the young man needs a meal. Just look at him!!!

Posted by: digger76 | November 4, 2010 1:51 PM | Report abuse

Hey stupid, the 1st problem with the offense is the offensive line, thats why we cant ru and get so many sacks, second problem is only 1 reciever and 1 tight end who can get open, 3rd problem is the play calling. McNab is the last problem on offfense, you idiot

Posted by: urbantao | November 4, 2010 2:01 PM | Report abuse

Hollywood could not have fashioned a more spectacular script--what are the odds that the most overrated QB and coach of the last decade+ would find one another in the nation's capital, amidst a delusional fanbase finally emerging from a 10+ year fever-dream to a world where McNabb has less mastery of the offense than Jason Campbell and Shanahan has less control of the team than Steve Spurrier . . . .

The rapidly-tarnishing legacies of both men depend on the other, yet they are both keenly aware of the other man's shortcomings and still somehow completely oblivious to their own. This is truly pathetic--both in the modern sense and the classical sense of the pathos evoked by great drama.

Posted by: mulletover | November 4, 2010 2:07 PM | Report abuse

Sorry, this article totally missed the boat. Redskins offensive issues do not begin with Mcnabb. They begin with the OLine.

Posted by: matthew_wolf28 | November 4, 2010 2:10 PM | Report abuse

Don't blame Mcnabb...blame the Oline... find another QB with a weak O line that has succeded? You cant name one. Why? Cause it ALL starts with the Line. The line gives qb time to go thru his progressions...it allows receivers to run their routes and opens up holes for the run game. Not even Manning oculd make it work. Yes, he goes thru his progressions quickly..but he gets to go thru them..Mcnabb doesnt. To blame a qb thats been to the NFC championship game 5 times and superbowl once is insane. Guess what..he had a beast of an O line EVERY YEAR. I think Shanny gets that and knows theirs nothing he can do about it this year. Except with Lichtensteiger..he doesnt even belong on the practice squad. Shanny...i get that he likes guys that work hard..on that note..I work hard..does that mean I should play for you. NO. Talent + Hard Work + Coaching + Execution = Wins. Wake up Shanny

Posted by: veeshul | November 4, 2010 2:11 PM | Report abuse

Remember the Hogs! Great movie title. The Redskins currently don't have any hogs, they look more like mice. Look at Jason Campbell out in Oakland the past few weeks, he had some blocking and a running game. The offense scored 50 points. If the quarterback has no protection he can not complete passes. Proven over and over again in the NFL. Peyton Manning would be sub-par with this line blocking.

Posted by: lvdave | November 4, 2010 2:21 PM | Report abuse

its all about the OLine-has been for the last several years. how can a QB put up decent numbers when he's running for his life on every play?
This year it's also about the offensive play calls. There have been critical plays in several games that are questionable.
Last Sunday 2:15 left in the fourth-4th and 10-3 points behind. An OLine that was bad all day-punt the damn ball, why would you go for it? That, to me, was the turning point in the game. Shanny's arrogance and need for control, with Kyle calling plays is NOT the amswer.

Posted by: alyd69 | November 4, 2010 2:30 PM | Report abuse

its all about the OLine-has been for the last several years. how can a QB put up decent numbers when he's running for his life on every play?
This year it's also about the offensive play calls. There have been critical plays in several games that are questionable.
Last Sunday 2:15 left in the fourth-4th and 10-3 points behind. An OLine that was bad all day-punt the damn ball, why would you go for it? That, to me, was the turning point in the game. Shanny's arrogance and need for control, with Kyle calling plays is NOT the amswer.

Posted by: alyd69 | November 4, 2010 2:31 PM | Report abuse

its all about the OLine-has been for the last several years. how can a QB put up decent numbers when he's running for his life on every play?
This year it's also about the offensive play calls. There have been critical plays in several games that are questionable.
Last Sunday 2:15 left in the fourth-4th and 10-3 points behind. An OLine that was bad all day-punt the damn ball, why would you go for it? That, to me, was the turning point in the game. Shanny's arrogance and need for control, with Kyle calling plays is NOT the amswer.

Posted by: alyd69 | November 4, 2010 2:31 PM | Report abuse

its all about the OLine-has been for the last several years. how can a QB put up decent numbers when he's running for his life on every play?
This year it's also about the offensive play calls. There have been critical plays in several games that are questionable.
Last Sunday 2:15 left in the fourth-4th and 10-3 points behind. An OLine that was bad all day-punt the damn ball, why would you go for it? That, to me, was the turning point in the game. Shanny's arrogance and need for control, with Kyle calling plays is NOT the amswer.

Posted by: alyd69 | November 4, 2010 2:31 PM | Report abuse

Cooley is certainly the MVP of the offense.. McNabb has been average at best. Hard to see if the Skins never got McNabb and went with Grossman that they would be much worse than 4-4. And that way still have 2 extra draft picks. Shanahan needs to look for his franchise QB in next years draft. Whether McNabb will be around for one more year or Rex will hold the fort until the new guy is ready has to do with how well McNabb does from here on out and whether McNabb will accept a short term deal.

Posted by: sovine08 | November 4, 2010 2:32 PM | Report abuse

Sorry-computer malfunction

Posted by: alyd69 | November 4, 2010 2:33 PM | Report abuse

One thing missing from this analysis: O-Line is the #1 issue with this team. It is also #2, #3 and #4. Until it gets fixed, we are in big trouble.

Posted by: SkinsFanNYC | November 4, 2010 2:40 PM | Report abuse

If possible, this article is dumber than the one on the defense. Cooley MVP? I like Cooley but he has a decent replacement. There is no one behind McNabb. He is the MVP hands down. Without him, we are dead last in every offensive category.

Any fool can see that 75% of the offense's problems come from a terrible line. I have doubts that Shanahan's zone stretch scheme can work against a hard charging defensive line like Detroit showed us last week anyway, so we may be looking at another Gibbs 2.0 reset. Probably not though. Shanahan is too stubborn to admit anything he does is not perfect. Blame the front office here, as they could have signed Flozell Adams(good enough to start for the Steelers).

The remainder of the offensive struggles are on one of the least impressive receiving corps in the league. I blame the coaches for this. They were the ones who decided to keep Galloway and Williams.

Posted by: Iamhumongous | November 4, 2010 2:45 PM | Report abuse

There is no talent at WR. Teams just double Moss and blitz everyone. Then everyone blames the line.


And WHAT DOES IDIOT SHANNY DO? PASSES ON BRANDON MARSHALL, TO and Moss.


And idiots like Armstrong and Galloway start after being cut by their previous teams.


Shanny and son are clowns. Bruce Allen has always been a horrible GM.


Snyder is a clown, he finally did the right thing and got rid of control, but to the wrong idiots.


Shannahan is a product of John Elway.

Posted by: Snyderratostinks | November 4, 2010 2:45 PM | Report abuse

There is no talent at WR. Teams just double Moss and blitz everyone. Then everyone blames the line.


And WHAT DOES IDIOT SHANNY DO? PASSES ON BRANDON MARSHALL, TO and Moss.


And idiots like Armstrong and Galloway start after being cut by their previous teams.


Shanny and son are clowns. Bruce Allen has always been a horrible GM.


Snyder is a clown, he finally did the right thing and got rid of control, but to the wrong idiots.


Shannahan is a product of John Elway.

Posted by: Snyderratostinks | November 4, 2010 2:45 PM | Report abuse

McNabb has two problems:
1. Th O-line has not been able to protect under Shanahan's scheme, and
2. Shanahan (either one) has refused to adjust to get McNabb out of the non-existent pocket.
Since the defense KNOWS he will be sitting in the pocket and stepping up, he is an easy target. He may not be the best in the league but very few QB's could do well in this offensive scheme. I put 75% of the problems on the "offensive geniuses" named Shanahan. Stand pat and die or change and prosper.

Posted by: pjohn2 | November 4, 2010 2:53 PM | Report abuse

"All of this could affect whether McNabb gets a contract extension - or if the Redskins head into 2011 looking for his replacement."

Contract extension? Are you joking? mcNabb is gone after this year. Then Kyle-boy can have his man Rex Grossman in charge.

Posted by: mcstowy | November 4, 2010 3:39 PM | Report abuse

WHEN can we get a good White QB??

Posted by: Smarg | November 4, 2010 3:42 PM | Report abuse

Jason Campbell should win the "MHP" of the Year award, "Most Happiest Player of the Year" for not being in Washington to take the blame for the crap that's going on down there!

Posted by: Raidersfan2 | November 4, 2010 3:48 PM | Report abuse

starts with the running game - which is the offensive line and the running backs, both of which have been banged up.

that allows teams to blitz the crap out of us and they are succeeding. we're getting murdered and can't get into any kind of rhythm.

haslet's high risk defense has produced a few turnovers, but the offense can't do jack sh!t w them so it equates to a below-average defense.

get the running game going and we should get to 8 - 8, give or take a game depending on injuries.

Posted by: BrooklynSkins | November 4, 2010 3:57 PM | Report abuse

Offensive Line is the problem, QBs need time to throw last time I check McNabb was not responsible for pass protection who is Kyle is.

I hope McNabb leaves the Redskins after this year because this team doesn't deserve him.

Posted by: agarnett1000 | November 4, 2010 3:58 PM | Report abuse

the question is will McNabb get his act together and start playing like the player we traded for? Cause otherwise if he keeps playing like he has been, he won't see how good our Oline can be.

Posted by: monk811 | November 4, 2010 10:52 AM | Report abuse

McNabb is exactly what I expected him to be- a game-manager, like Mark Brunell was. Only difference is he has a stronger arm and can run when he has to.

I don't buy the complaints that he isn't playing well. There has been effectively NO pass protection since Portis was injured. Teams have learned that they can easily get sacks and hurries with only 1 blitzer.

When the recievers have time to get open, McNabb usually puts the ball in the right place. He sometimes throws too hard, throws underneath, or past the reciever, but he tends to commit such errors on the side of incompletions rather than interceptions.

Posted by: jboogie1 | November 4, 2010 4:07 PM | Report abuse

Jason, you focus too much on McNab. Until the OL is respectable you could have Brady, or either of the Mannings, or Jurgensen, or Baugh himself and they'd have a QB rating in the 50's.

Posted by: peedeesc | November 4, 2010 4:28 PM | Report abuse

Jeff Bostic - Undrafted in 1980
Russ Grimm - 3rd round 1981
Mark May - 1st round 1981
George Starke - 11th round 1971
Don Warren - 4th round 1979
Rick Walker - 4th round 1977

there's your original hogs. looking at the draft years kind of makes me feel my age a little bit, but enjoy the ride folks, it's later than ya think


Posted by: hessone | November 4, 2010 12:27 PM | Report abuse


Don't forget Joe Jacoby (undrafted)!!!

Posted by: jboogie1 | November 4, 2010 4:29 PM | Report abuse

Skins fans are so obsessed with QBs! Of all the NFL team fans, one would think our fans would be savvy enough to know it's all about the O-line.

3 Super Bowls with 3 different QBs, none of whom will go to the Hall of Fame.

Remember The Hogs?... HELLO!!!!

The Steelers were 4-1 to start this year with random QBs, and they would be a legitimate Super Bowl threat with any one of half the starting QBs in the NFL.

This team has a lot of holes to fill, and I will withold further judgement until a couple of years go by.

But I'm not overly impressed that a team that won 9 games in 2007 and 8 games in 2008 is 0.500 right now. Last year was an outlier, this is at it's core a 0.500 team. I'm not convinced the last regime couldn't have done this (if you get Vinny out of the picture).


Posted by: Alan4 | November 4, 2010 10:25 AM | Report abuse

Although your right in a sense its a QB league now. Its not enough to have a solid o line. The rules have changed since the 80's. You just can't stick anyone back there and expect a SB. Theismann, Williams, and Rypien were all pretty good QB's too.

Mcnabb has my support but his play her has been awful. If the coaches are trying to work with him and he's not responding then they have every right to bench him. Throwing into clear as day triple coverage in the 4th with the lead I was ready to yank him.

Maybe we franchise him and get a pick out of who ever wants him next season if he's not with us. Otehrwise we're in a disaster.

Posted by: Eman8 | November 4, 2010 4:48 PM | Report abuse

McNabb has two problems:
1. Th O-line has not been able to protect under Shanahan's scheme, and
2. Shanahan (either one) has refused to adjust to get McNabb out of the non-existent pocket.
Since the defense KNOWS he will be sitting in the pocket and stepping up, he is an easy target. He may not be the best in the league but very few QB's could do well in this offensive scheme. I put 75% of the problems on the "offensive geniuses" named Shanahan. Stand pat and die or change and prosper.

Posted by: pjohn2 | November 4, 2010 5:08 PM | Report abuse

OH!!! now all of a sudden Jay Cutler's a horrible QB but last year a lot of you i would even say most of you were ready to get rid of Jason Campbell in favor of Cutler now who's getting the last laugh? I am so happy that Jason is doing well in Oakland and that they are winning while the ego-maniac that is the evil Mike Shannahan and his diabolical son the "OC" have managed to again derail the Redskin's season ohhhhhhhhhhhhh!!! the agony,the pain, the........................... ah well you get the idea, Jim Zorn had no business coaching the Redskins but at least he was gentleman, Mike Shannahan's a liar and a first class jerk and i hope they run him and his punk azz son out of DC.

Posted by: dargregmag | November 4, 2010 5:16 PM | Report abuse

McNabb's the Offensive MVP jack-a$$

Posted by: tylo | November 4, 2010 5:52 PM | Report abuse

the media is so-called white, hamm-o-KLAN the so-called coach is so-called white the 2 worst players on the o-line are so-called white even reid who is merely nothing more than a safe-negro" says very little now try figuring it out why the o-line is not being mentioned as the REAL problem and hamm-o-KLAN the ogre, I have mentioned many of times has weakened it and did nothing to bolster WR's and many of you think this DIC-tater is a great coach you deserve him because he is one of YOU.

Posted by: wathu19 | November 4, 2010 7:33 PM | Report abuse

redskin mentality has not changed since the days of george preston marshall!

Posted by: merrimac238 | November 4, 2010 7:55 PM | Report abuse

McNabb also show a propensity to throw deep on 3rd and 4th downs... those are the least reliable pass plays of all.

Posted by: Redskinrex | November 4, 2010 8:28 PM | Report abuse

O-line O-line O-line. Give number 5 at least 3 seconds to throw and see what he can do. It would be interesting to see a break down comparison of how McNabb's passing percentage between when he had time to throw from the pocket and when he was scrambling for his life with a linebacker breathing down his neck. The way to beat Payton Manning is to get in his face. If McNabb is sacked and hurred every play we'll be beaten too.

Posted by: VMIFury | November 5, 2010 9:11 AM | Report abuse

O-line O-line O-line.

Give number 5 at least 3 seconds to throw and see what he can do. It would be interesting to see a break down comparison between McNabb's passing percentage when he had time to throw from the pocket and when he was scrambling for his life.

The way to beat Payton Manning is to get in his face. If McNabb is sacked and hurred every play we'll be beaten too.

Posted by: VMIFury | November 5, 2010 9:12 AM | Report abuse

Don't know how many of you saw the article on the mechanics of the forward pass in this week's SI. Interesting that the 'consensus' ranked Sonny J. as the most 'precise' passer ever...

Posted by: Samson151 | November 5, 2010 9:17 AM | Report abuse

The Redskins primary problems are:
1) A defense that gives up a lot of yards and therefore stays on the field far too long.
2) A weakness at wide receiver with only one player that can be considered a starter and no super stars.
3) A rookie Left Tackle that is going to need a couple of years to develop, a Right Tackle that has not fully recovered from his hip injury of last year, and no upcoming player depth at guard, which makes the line at best a next year target for improvement.
Even with all those problems a possible 8-8 year is a big improvement over the 4-12 record of last year.
As for McNabb, he is probably as good a solution as the Redskins could expect for the next 2 years. However; given his age he is ending the end of his football career and a long term solution is a question that needs an answer in the upcoming offseason.

Posted by: edeshields | November 5, 2010 10:28 AM | Report abuse

Offensive MVP at the half - Trent Williams.

Defensive MVP at the half - several candidates; Landry, Orakpo, Hall, Alexander.

As brownwood said earlier this week though; "London Fletcher is the straw that stirs the drink".

Posted by: stevebeagrie | November 5, 2010 10:43 AM | Report abuse

Thinker_Shuler..........Thinker_Poop

Thinker_?

Posted by: tomass169 | November 5, 2010 10:48 AM | Report abuse

Thinker_Shuler..........Thinker_Poop

Thinker_?

Posted by: tomass169 | November 5, 2010 10:50 AM | Report abuse

1st: the skins were at the top of the league with a 3-4 defense( why change what worked well)

2nd: The offensive live is a peace of crap..
you could put jesus christ back there and he would get drubbed... as long as that sorry line cannot run/pass block the skins will continue to be scrubs.... man just remember the good old days... when we had a o-line that could block.... forget all the other skill positions... no blocking = no winning... why people are not talking about that crap line... that is were it starts and stops

Posted by: Icallemlikeiseethem | November 5, 2010 12:10 PM | Report abuse

It's Toretto, Brian......it's always been Toretto

and in this case, Toretto is the O line. We will need to focus next year on upgrading this unit. yeah Donovan has thrown some balls into the dirt but the O line is not giving him a chance. A receiver taller than me would be nice too!!

Posted by: mhadidia | November 5, 2010 4:06 PM | Report abuse

"Monk, not sure how you can say that when the only 3 constants over our 3 SB titles were the Hogs, Joe Gibbs, and Art Monk. Beyond that, it was mostly expendable parts."

I'm dating myself here, but I cannot believe anyone would forget the only PK to ever win league MVP -- Mark Moseley!

Posted by: messykat | November 5, 2010 8:20 PM | Report abuse

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Posted by: ajdfhdfgtsdgasd | November 6, 2010 2:38 PM | Report abuse

You guys benched McNabb??! And many wonder why we released him. To quiet some the only reason, you won against us this year is that you took out our QB Vick. Now he's back, play like athletes this time and like sportman. Obviously you're afraid of him...sad. GO EAGLES!!!

Posted by: monique226 | November 6, 2010 4:43 PM | Report abuse

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