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Posted at 2:30 PM ET, 12/21/2010

Football Insider Live: Future QB options, Jags preview and how it went wrong in 2010

By Washington Post editors

Barry Svrluga and Rick Maese joined Dan Steinberg and host Jonathan Forsythe on this week's webcast to talk about Rex Grossman's future and how the 2010 season slowly fell apart.

You can also download the podcast of this show or subscribe to the podcast.


By Washington Post editors  | December 21, 2010; 2:30 PM ET
 
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Next: Roster analysis: Redskins have plenty of cost-cutting options

Comments

I'll watch this.

Posted by: Diesel44 | December 21, 2010 2:47 PM | Report abuse

So glad I don't have to watch this.

Something went wrong?! I'm sorry - if we were like last year... I could see complaint - but I'm all roses here. Anything more would be surprising.

Posted by: DikShuttle | December 21, 2010 2:49 PM | Report abuse

DikShuttle, help me out....

Why are you all roses this year? I need a hit of that.

Posted by: Alan4 | December 21, 2010 2:53 PM | Report abuse

PA won't watch this BEEPS---->

Posted by: Diesel44 | December 21, 2010 2:49 PM

Haha

I'm not watching this...I can't watch this...let me know how it is.

Posted by: PlayAction | December 21, 2010 2:55 PM | Report abuse

I don't see the progress, Dik.

We've still got a putrid offensive line. Giving up picks and getting rid of Campbell for McNabb was a big step backward.

On defense, Orakpo was a great pickup. But net-net, is our defense any better? London Fletcher doesn't have many years left, and so that LB spot is another big hole to fill.
~

Posted by: ifthethunderdontgetya | December 21, 2010 2:55 PM | Report abuse

I don't see the progress, Dik.

We've still got a putrid offensive line and giving up picks plus getting rid of Campbell for McNabb was a big step backward.

On defense, Orakpo was a great pickup. But net-net, is our defense any better? London Fletcher doesn't have many years left, and so that LB spot is another big hole to fill.
~

Posted by: ifthethunderdontgetya | December 21, 2010 2:56 PM | Report abuse

And he wants to stay in D.C. to re-live 'Redskin Rebuild'?

Our Truth Meter says "no" and " @#!*% no".

Dude is lyin'.

Posted by: MistaMoe | December 21, 2010 2:00 PM | Report abuse


He speaks the truth Moe.

He speaks it 16 million times over...

Posted by: p1funk | December 21, 2010 2:58 PM | Report abuse

McNabb's contention that being told only 72 hours before the next game is "somewhat disrespectful" has the same feel as a teenage girl obsessing on the meaningless minutiae of being broken up with. 72 hours...120 hours...meaningless details. It's just something to focus on and validate the one man pity party he's had going on for years.
If he were still an Eagle, he would be due obsequious consideration which is maybe one reason Reid dumped him. The Skins have paid him handsomly for his mediocre play this one season he's been around and don't owe him any special respect. 72 hours is fine. If they had told him any sooner, McNabb would say it was too soon after the Tampa game.
Donovan McNabb is about as relevant to the Redskins future as Fred Smoot. When the coach stops a reporter from asking a question at a press conference to say that he told a player he couldn't quarantee he would be back next year...that player is as good as gone.

Posted by: MColeman51 | December 21, 2010 2:59 PM | Report abuse

More wins (win, singular?). Wins in the divison. Bloat off the books or on the bench. Coach solidifying his position.

I actually like this season more than the JG2.0 playoff years.

What did people expect? More than 6 wins with this team? Would I like that 2nd rounder back... yeah. Would it have made much difference... not really.

I was thinking 6 wins. Let's see if we can't win this weekend and dare I say, against the ginas.

Posted by: DikShuttle | December 21, 2010 3:02 PM | Report abuse

dies, in the previous you said something about VJax getting franchised...where did you see that?? I thought they couldn't after what happened with him...

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | December 21, 2010 3:05 PM | Report abuse

Dik, just wondering... if this is a good year for you, what are your expectations for next year? Thx!

Posted by: Alan4 | December 21, 2010 3:08 PM | Report abuse

To the guys thinking we even have the slightest chance to get ngata.. You two are smoking some crack. Harbaugh said at the beginning of the season no way he'd give him up.. That is they're priority in big contracts for the off season.. Sorry .. Moving on..

Posted by: SteveOman | December 21, 2010 2:30 PM

Crack is so 90s. But as an ALLEGED crack smoker, I say fine. If Ngata is tagged (which I don't think can happen the year unless there is a new CBA in place prior to the expiration of the current one), then Trevor Pryce is available. Plan B at NT/DT would be Aubrayo Franklin (SF) who was so pissed at being tagged that he showed up late for camp.

Posted by: dcsween | December 21, 2010 3:11 PM | Report abuse

I don't see the progress, Dik.

We've still got a putrid offensive line. Giving up picks and getting rid of Campbell for McNabb was a big step backward.

On defense, Orakpo was a great pickup. But net-net, is our defense any better? London Fletcher doesn't have many years left, and so that LB spot is another big hole to fill.
~

Posted by: ifthethunderdontgetya | December 21, 2010 2:55 PM | Report abuse

The defense has taken steps backwards. We converted to a defensive scheme that was supposed to turn Rak loose. Instead he'll finish the season with fewer sacks than last season.

We got a jump in production from Landry, which is mitigated by a total drop-off in Andre Carter, who has been rendered totally useless in the 3-4.

We got more turnovers this year - thanks in large part to D.Hall's play - but, oh yeah, we are LAST in yardage allowed.

We lost our most talented D-linemen and will get nothing in return.


On offense, we discovered that the 2nd-tier low-rate vets that Shanny brought in play like 2nd-tier low-rate vets. Trent Williams looks like a replacement for Chris Samuels, but a replacement is not a "step forward".

Ryan Torain looks like a keeper, but that lone bright spot doesn't nearly makeup for the major hit we took with the McNabb Debacle.

No progress at all in our receiving corps. Tana played like Tana. Cooley played like Cooley. We got a little bump from Anthony Armstrong, but Fred Davis took a step back, so that's a wash. No real number 1 receiver on the horizon, and when you are counting on the return of Malcolm Kelly to take your WR corps to the next level, you know you are grasping.

Brandon Banks was a nice bright spot, but he's tailed off as the season has progressed and one wonders if that 150pounds can make it through a 16 game schedule - if not, then we're back at square one b/c a dynamic return man is no good if he's only there for 8 games.

Sooooooo...

Long way of saying: No progress.

Posted by: p1funk | December 21, 2010 3:12 PM | Report abuse

And while Hall is at the ProBowl, Los can work on the jugs machine.

The only thing that is "occasional" is you contributing anything thoughtful or interesting up here.


Posted by: p1funk | December 21, 2010 1:36 PM | Report abuse

Oh Snap! In your face cork.

Posted by: iH8dallas |

Hey, I love a good snap as much as the next man. dallas. Doesn't change the fact that D. Hall is a liability and Funk is a tool.

The best DBs rarely have the flashy stats Hall has for interceptions. Fella named Greene had clank hands. Who gives Asomugha a chance for ints? He had one int. in 2009. Woodson, Bailey, Revis... Look up how many many ints they have in 2010. And they give up fewer TDs in a season than Hall did last week against Dallas.

Smart offenses don't throw the ball their way. That's where the term "shut down corner" comes from. When's the last time you've heard that term in reference to D. Hall?

I thought so.

I don't recall Revis or Asomugha or Bailey whining that the other corner got to cover the other team's best receiver, like Hall once did. Nor did they then say they were now in charge of the defense. THIS is the guy you're in love with, Funk?

Oh and bottom line me some team stats while you're at it fellas. How'd D. Hall help the Falcons before he was run out of Atlanta? They've fallen apart since then.

And Oakland! Now there's an impact corner. He impacted Eddie Royal's stats brilliantly. They couldn't WAIT to get rid of him. The Rayduhs too have fallen apart since they convinced the Vinny Cerrato Redskins--those legendary fine judges of football horseflesh-- to wrangle him away and ink him for a mere $60 mil. (Same class of overpaid FAs as Haynesworth and Dockery)

And sure enough, Hall's turned it around for the Redskins, too. With all those Ints, how DO the redskins manage to be one of the worst defenses in the NFL?

He's still a DB who can't cover big receivers and can't cover quick receivers. He lurks in the vicinity where he uses his considerable skills at jumping routes, taking chances and making the occasional brilliant play. One game with 4 ints doesn't make a great corner any more than a perfect game made Don Larsen a great pitcher.

While we're using baseball comparisons, D. Hall is like a baseball slugger who'll hit 40 dingers and bat .220 for a last place team.

You are defending Hall as a run stuffer? Most of his tackles come from dragging down guys after the catch.

I'd try him as a receiver tho--his hands are that good,

FYI, I wasn't using the fact that they pick on Hall when Rogers is opposite him to pump up Rogers but point out that teams PICK ON HALL when Rogers is opposite him. So your trashing Rogers just makes Hall look worse.

Before I let you get back to stewing in your own bile and picking on cripples.... think of me as a Shut down Corner on RI. I think of you, Funk, as a QB arrogant or dumb enough to lob one my way.

Oh, and Happy Holidays.

Posted by: TheCork | December 21, 2010 3:13 PM | Report abuse

Why are peeps even discussing McNabb? His career as a Redskin is over.

Posted by: iH8dallas | December 21, 2010 3:15 PM | Report abuse

"McNabb benching has Redskins playing "scared," Portis says"

John Beck must be TERRIFIED! 7th rounders and UFAs are shaking in their cleats.

"McNabb wants to be back" If this ain't, New Soup (R)-Chunky Brunell Flavor, i gotta say...........

"Future QB options" YOUR MOM!

I think what McNabb & Grossman proved this year is that a QB can have a darn good game and we still lose. Campbell 7-4 in games he played in strengthens that it wasn't the QB.

so, whatever Shanny get's his extra pre-season on the fan's dime. And, probably an IPF. And, maybe a shiny new young QB.

Posted by: pabrian2003 | December 21, 2010 3:16 PM | Report abuse

Why are peeps even discussing McNabb? His career as a Redskin is over.

Posted by: iH8dallas | December 21, 2010 3:17 PM | Report abuse

Cam Newton.

Posted by: 4thFloor | December 21, 2010 3:18 PM | Report abuse

Just sign this nice little form with the notation at the top saying, "National Society of People Who Don't Know Their Ass From a Hole in the Ground".

Posted by: RedSkinHead | December 21, 2010 2:55 PM

Excellent...just had the form notarized and sent off via courier...we should have peace and quiet...and the shoe laces...by new years.

Posted by: PlayAction | December 21, 2010 3:19 PM | Report abuse

Why are peeps even discussing McNabb? His career as a Redskin is over.

Posted by: iH8dallas | December 21, 2010 3:17 PM

...because the repercussions continue.

And also, it's a reflection on Team Shanny. Will they evaluate draft talent better than they evaluated an NFL QB with 11 years of game film?

Posted by: Alan4 | December 21, 2010 3:21 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: pabrian2003 | December 21, 2010 3:16 PM |

The only thing dumber than your opinions are the feeble, confused way you try to express them.

Posted by: MColeman51 | December 21, 2010 3:21 PM | Report abuse

"One game with 4 ints doesn't make a great corner any more than a perfect game made Don Larsen a great pitcher"

using this logic, 6 SEASONS with only 7 interceptions, means that Rogers isn't anything special....

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | December 21, 2010 3:25 PM | Report abuse

bean-

Report: Chargers want to franchise Vincent Jackson

Posted by Evan Silva on December 20, 2010, 8:31 PM EST

Vincent Jackson dominated last Thursday night’s game against the 49ers, catching five passes for 112 yards and three touchdowns. It comes at an unsurprising time, then, that the Chargers have grown increasingly interested in retaining their contract-year receiver into the 2011 season.

According to Kevin Acee of the San Diego Union-Tribune, the Bolts are considering placing the franchise tag on Jackson this offseason. Acee reports that there is “almost no chance” of Jackson receiving the long-term contract he desires, at least from San Diego. The team is reportedly still wary of Jackson’s history of DUIs, and the hefty financial risk that would accompany a commitment to a player at risk of lengthy suspension should he again violate the league’s conduct policy.

Acee’s report contains plenty of caution, though. There’s no guarantee that a franchise tag will be available without a new Collective Bargaining Agreement, and no one knows what a franchise tag would look like if there is one.

Another risk of franchise tagging Jackson would be the possibility that he refuses to accept the one-year tender. Jackson and his representatives showed in 2010 that they are not afraid to prolong a holdout deep into a season.

Posted by: Diesel44 | December 21, 2010 3:26 PM | Report abuse

the "new culture" seems oddly similar to the "old culture"

1 trading draft picks - check
2 big name free agent(s) - check(s)
3 losing - check
4 poorly handled PR - check (mcnabb, hayney, punter, blame game, etc)
5 aging roster - check
6 offseason champs - check
7 glaring holes in roster - check

Posted by: pabrian2003 | December 21, 2010 3:28 PM | Report abuse

p1, there wasn't one big-picture issue in your entire list.

I'll counter that the positives you've listed actually don't mean as much. Though I agree with you that I like them, too. But I think of them as gravy compared to the two things I listed as most important at the end of last season:

1) Establish an identity (we're getting there - firing Fat Al & McLovin' are perfect examples)

2) get wins in the division.

Then there's my personal measure of success - beat Dallas. We got one. Almost two. I'm happy.

I'll counter with a question: Would more wins have meant success to you? I don't think it would have mattered having a better record, unless it was in the division.

Posted by: DikShuttle | December 21, 2010 3:28 PM | Report abuse

p1funk,
I am not nearly as pessimistic as you are.

For one, I think everybody is surprised when rookies taper off at the end of their first season. It's a fact that this happens to most rookies - Banks and Williams are no exceptions. They simply aren't used to playing a 16 game season.

Although he is not a rookie, I think this is true with Lorenzo Alexander, too. He never was a full time starter for an entire season. He was always part of a rotation or a backup, so this full season has hit him hard, too.

I think Armstrong is a player. This kid showed what he could do when there was a QB who understood the offense pitching the ball. One of the things I really like about Armstrong is he will block.

The jury is still out on guys like Austin and Banks at wide receiver. We haven't seen enough to comment.

By and large, the team took a step in the right direction this season, but this is a process and it will take time. I really hope Shanahan and Allen take a very focused attack at getting younger. What the team needs now is youth and players that fit, but it will take time...

Posted by: RedSkinHead | December 21, 2010 3:29 PM | Report abuse

Why are peeps even discussing McNabb? His career as a Redskin is over.

Posted by: iH8dallas | December 21, 2010 3:17 PM

...because the repercussions continue.

And also, it's a reflection on Team Shanny. Will they evaluate draft talent better than they evaluated an NFL QB with 11 years of game film?

Posted by: Alan4 | December 21, 2010 3:21 PM | Report abuse

Trent Williams was a horrible draft pick. Boy I wish we could have that one back.

I think Shanny has more hits than misses in the draft. Especially in the early rounds.

Posted by: iH8dallas | December 21, 2010 3:30 PM | Report abuse

Alan - I'd like a more developed, younger core. I'd like more consistent run blocking. Better play calling on both sides of the LoS. And I'd like a winning record in the division.

What realistic goals do you have?

Posted by: DikShuttle | December 21, 2010 3:33 PM | Report abuse

For one, I think everybody is surprised when rookies taper off at the end of their first season. It's a fact that this happens to most rookies - Banks and Williams are no exceptions. They simply aren't used to playing a 16 game season.

Although he is not a rookie, I think this is true with Lorenzo Alexander, too. He never was a full time starter for an entire season. He was always part of a rotation or a backup, so this full season has hit him hard, too.

I think Armstrong is a player. This kid showed what he could do when there was a QB who understood the offense pitching the ball. One of the things I really like about Armstrong is he will block.

The jury is still out on guys like Austin and Banks at wide receiver. We haven't seen enough to comment.

By and large, the team took a step in the right direction this season, but this is a process and it will take time. I really hope Shanahan and Allen take a very focused attack at getting younger. What the team needs now is youth and players that fit, but it will take time...

Posted by: RedSkinHead | December 21, 2010 3:29 PM | Report abuse

Co-Sign. Anthony Armstrong just seems to get better every week.

Posted by: iH8dallas | December 21, 2010 3:34 PM | Report abuse

DikShuttle,

Some of Shanny's first year accomplishments you listed were also accomplished in Zorn's 8-8 first year. Zorn started off 2-1 in the division with road wins at Dallas and Philly. The team regressed the following year. That, and Shanahan's recent record, is why I'm a skeptic.

Regardless, I'm very curious about what you would define as a successful year next year?

Posted by: Alan4 | December 21, 2010 3:35 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: iH8dallas | December 21, 2010 1:31 PM | Report abuse

So you are a ho? You would degrade yourself for money. Your life must SUCK.

Posted by: COLUMBIASKINS | December 21, 2010 3:21 PM

Having absolutely ZERO sense of humor must really SUCK.

And BTW...for $15 million...my boss could kick me in the nuts too...who are you Bill Gates? It's really great that you have such integrity.

Posted by: PlayAction | December 21, 2010 3:35 PM | Report abuse

How long do we have guys like AA and BB tied up for?

Posted by: PlayAction | December 21, 2010 3:38 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: TheCork | December 21, 2010 3:13 PM | Report abuse


One would think that as the keeper of the Journalistic Flame you'd have a concept of doing things like "researching facts".

First, you keep saying that teams pick on Hall when Rogers is in the game. Do you have any kind evidence to back up that claim? Any kind of metric? Any kind of statistic? Do you have anything ANYTHING to produce to back up your assertion that Hall is a giant liability in coverage and gets picked on all the time?

And the stuff that you pull out of your old-man pampers doesn't count - though I know that's what you are used to relying on for your opinions up here.

"Flashy stats"??? WTH does that mean? You mean forcing turnovers? Yeah, forcing turnovers is such an OVERRATED aspect of the game. I mean, who needs TURNOVERS in the NFL these days?

Anyhow, to your busted point -

Last season Charles Woodson was named Defensive MVP. He had 9 picks, 4 forced fumbles and 2 sacks - guess the voters weren;t turned off by those "flashy stats" eh?

When Darelle Revis made a name for himself as a "shutdown" corner over the past 2 seasons, he had 6 and 7 turnovers. And this season his production is down - he's been injured.

And if "winning seasons" is such an important stat to you, how many "winning seasons" has Nnamdi Asamghoua helped the "Rayduhs" to, eh? How much winning has he contributed to over there, eh?

How many winning seasons has "shut-down" Champ Bailey contributed to the past couple of years, eh???


And if your idea of a "shutdown corner" is Carlos Rogers, then you are 100% right about one thing.

You are DEFINITELY the "Shutdown Corner of RI".

Posted by: p1funk | December 21, 2010 3:39 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | December 21, 2010 3:25 PM

Interceptions aren't the only measure of good cornerback play.

Posted by: MColeman51 | December 21, 2010 3:40 PM | Report abuse

dies, thanks, not sure what to make of that...if they slap the tag on him, he's not showing up for half the year again...I'd still LOVE for the redskins to make a run at him in free agency...

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | December 21, 2010 3:40 PM | Report abuse

DikShuttle,
I'd say next year is mildly successful if the team is 8-8 and at least splits within the division. 7-9 is a very marginal season (any coach can do that--might as well keep Zorn and let him develop). 6 wins or less is a complete failure.


For someone who wants to be a HOF coach, I expect a winning season next year: 9 wins or more.

Posted by: Alan4 | December 21, 2010 3:41 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: iH8dallas | December 21, 2010 1:31 PM | Report abuse

So you are a ho? You would degrade yourself for money. Your life must SUCK.

Posted by: COLUMBIASKINS | December 21, 2010 3:21 PM

Having absolutely ZERO sense of humor must really SUCK.

And BTW...for $15 million...my boss could kick me in the nuts too...who are you Bill Gates? It's really great that you have such integrity.

Posted by: PlayAction | December 21, 2010 3:35 PM | Report abuse

Thank you PA. Who is this loser and why is he/she responding to a post that is SOOOO 2 hours ago?

Posted by: iH8dallas | December 21, 2010 3:43 PM | Report abuse

So you are a ho? You would degrade yourself for money. Your life must SUCK.

Posted by: COLUMBIASKINS | December 21, 2010 3:21 PM

Do you work for a living? If you do, well, ho. If you don't, well, liberal.

Posted by: TheScamp75 | December 21, 2010 3:48 PM | Report abuse

p1, there wasn't one big-picture issue in your entire list.

I'll counter that the positives you've listed actually don't mean as much. Though I agree with you that I like them, too. But I think of them as gravy compared to the two things I listed as most important at the end of last season:

1) Establish an identity (we're getting there - firing Fat Al & McLovin' are perfect examples)

2) get wins in the division.

Then there's my personal measure of success - beat Dallas. We got one. Almost two. I'm happy.

I'll counter with a question: Would more wins have meant success to you? I don't think it would have mattered having a better record, unless it was in the division.

Posted by: DikShuttle | December 21, 2010 3:28 PM | Report abuse

THe big picture issue would be the dearth of young promising talent.


The bright spots I mentioned were along those lines - TW, TOrain, banks.

1) We don't have an identity. What is our identity? What is it exactly that we do? We have SHanahan. Is that a team identity?

2) We got a couple wins in the division. We eaked out 2 - which is certainly more than last season, but we were a missed Suishy FG away from stealing one at Dallas last year, you may recall. It's not like our division wins were something astounding - they were close and fluky and came down to the last play. SOunds alot like some games last year if you ask me.

Of course more wins would have meant success. But the bigger issue to me is - who is in the cupboard for this team?

Posted by: p1funk | December 21, 2010 3:48 PM | Report abuse

...because the repercussions continue.

And also, it's a reflection on Team Shanny. Will they evaluate draft talent better than they evaluated an NFL QB with 11 years of game film?

Posted by: Alan4 | December 21, 2010 3:21 PM
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++
This, to me, is the scariest part of the Shanahan/Allen combination.

I don't have any problems with Shanahan benching McNabb. If he thinks that Grossman can run his offense better than McNabb, Grossman SHOULD be the QB. I don't have any problem with him cleaning house of players that either can't or won't perform for his offense and his chosen defense. I didn't have any problem with him bringing in Johnson and Parker in the preseason to see if they could help this team.

The scary part is that, from what I have read, neither Shanahan or Allen are particularly known as great judges of personnel. If they missed this badly with McNabb, how can anyone have confidence that it was a "one off" miss?

This team needs serious help, both through the draft and through free agency. Is this team going to be up to the task?

Posted by: smurff1 | December 21, 2010 3:49 PM | Report abuse

Thank you PA. Who is this loser and why is he/she responding to a post that is SOOOO 2 hours ago?

Posted by: iH8dallas | December 21, 2010 3:43 PM

No problem...heck if I know...but the Sock Puppet Gang has its eyes on them now.

Posted by: PlayAction | December 21, 2010 3:56 PM | Report abuse

p1,

The identity is that we're not going to put up w/ bs. If you don't want to win in this program, we don't want you.

The talent issues are serious - but aren't Allen's hands kinda tied? Again - one 2nd rounder isn't going to make or break anything. McNabb didn't pan out. Too bad. If it woulda worked, it could have been nice. At least the bleeding is minimized.

Other positives - the line beginning to run block well. Let's hopefully get some more young talent there.

We have to suck it up another season, at least. Overall, I'd like to get real quality middle grade talent we can hang on to. Hopefully that's what Allen is thinking, too. If Jarmon can stay healthy, I think he's an example of that.

Posted by: DikShuttle | December 21, 2010 3:58 PM | Report abuse

And if "winning seasons" is such an important stat to you, how many "winning seasons" has Nnamdi Asamghoua helped the "Rayduhs" to, eh? How much winning has he contributed to over there, eh?

How many winning seasons has "shut-down" Champ Bailey contributed to the past couple of years, eh???


And if your idea of a "shutdown corner" is Carlos Rogers, then you are 100% right about one thing.

You are DEFINITELY the "Shutdown Corner of RI".

Posted by: p1funk | December 21, 2010 3:39 PM | Report abuse

Oh Snap! In your face again Cork!

Posted by: iH8dallas | December 21, 2010 4:00 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: TheCork | December 21, 2010 3:13 PM

Thank you Mr. Cork. p1funk is still pimping that DHall is better than Los junk. Hall's pick numbers are inflated because an arrogant QB had so little respect for his cover skills that he kept throwing (bad throws I might add) to whoever Hall was on. The guy just got eaten up this Sunday, including by a tightend and you're still riding his jock. Riddle me this: If Los is so bad, why isn't he targeted as much as Hall?

Posted by: learnedhand1 | December 21, 2010 4:01 PM | Report abuse

" the "new culture" seems oddly similar to the "old culture"

1 trading draft picks - check
2 big name free agent(s) - check(s)
3 losing - check
4 poorly handled PR - check (mcnabb, hayney, punter, blame game, etc)
5 aging roster - check
6 offseason champs - check
7 glaring holes in roster - check


Posted by: pabrian2003 | December 21, 2010 3:28 PM"

Yo pa, you forgot

"8 Fans & bloggers who know next to nothing abbout football expecting a 100 % reversal of fortune instantly out of a partial draft inherited from the previous administration."

Now to address your other silliness.

Regarding:

1 Yes, three draft picks were traded away, to get a QB who started the majority of the season and was [like it or not] an upgrade over Jason Campbell.

Also please note the SEVEN draft picks the Skins possess going into the 2011 draft

1 [Own pick]
2 [Own pick]
5 [Own pick]
5 From Jammal Brown Trade
6 [Own pick]
7 [Own Pick]
7 Conditional pick (IND) for Tryon based on play time

Sooooo, sure the team has some non-premuim picks, but they are GOING IN to the draft with 7 shots.

Who knows, McNabb, Haynesworth, and/or others could be traded garnering even more picks. (SCORE: Reality 1, pabrian2003 0)

2 Other than McNabb which other big name free agent came in the off season? Answer: NONE....everyone else was a bargain signing. (SCORE: Reality 2, pabrian2003 0)

3 Losing (SCORE: Reality 2, pabrian2003 1)

4 Poorly Handled PR You play to win the games. Sometimes you don't play well enough. Sometimes the other team is just better that day, or just luckier.

(SCORE: POINT=PUSH Reality 2, pabrian2003 1)

5 Aging Roster Actually this roster has dropped in average age throughout the season, so....not so much. (SCORE: Reality 3, pabrian2003 1, & [1 tie])

6 Offseason champs This is just being silly...but I'll address it. Actually this off-season the Skins made solid and economical moves to pare dead weight players with big contracts, and sign bargain stopgaps. So, ummmmm, no...again.

(SCORE: Reality 4, pabrian2003 1, & [1 tie])

7 Glaring holes in roster. Absolutely, but there are less of them. Does the team still need a lot? Sure, but by the end of the next Free Agent and draft period this team should be ready to be far more competitive and possibly contend.

(SCORE: Reality 5, pabrian2003 1, & [1 tie])

So in summary, pabrian2003, ummm...try again soon, and next time bring more facts than opinions, ok?

Posted by: ThinkingMan | December 21, 2010 4:05 PM | Report abuse

Riddle me this: If Los is so bad, why isn't he targeted as much as Hall?

Posted by: learnedhand1 | December 21, 2010 4:01 PM

Oh crap...who's gonna bust out the link to that website ranking the DBs again.

Posted by: PlayAction | December 21, 2010 4:05 PM | Report abuse

1 Yes, three draft picks were traded away, to get a QB who started the majority of the season and was [like it or not] an upgrade over Jason Campbell.

Posted by: ThinkingMan | December 21, 2010 4:05 PM
================================

J. Campbell 2010

D. McNabb 2010

A ThinkingMan ought to be able to use google in this day and age.
~

Posted by: ifthethunderdontgetya | December 21, 2010 4:12 PM | Report abuse

1 Yes, three draft picks were traded away, to get a QB who started the majority of the season and was [like it or not] an upgrade over Jason Campbell.

Posted by: ThinkingMan | December 21, 2010 4:05 PM
================================

J. Campbell 2010

D. McNabb 2010

A ThinkingMan ought to be able to use google in this day and age.
~

Posted by: ifthethunderdontgetya | December 21, 2010 4:12 PM | Report abuse

And also, it's a reflection on Team Shanny. Will they evaluate draft talent better than they evaluated an NFL QB with 11 years of game film?

Posted by: Alan4 | December 21, 2010 3:21 PM | Report abuse
---------------------------

Lets compare Team Shanny year 1 to Team Gibbs year 1.

Has Shanny mortgaged the farm to McNabb like Gibbs did Brunell?
Has Shanny shipped off a HOF DB plus a pick for a good RB?

mmmm last time I checked, no. And yet, the Skins went on to win a playoff game the next year, didn't they?

Despite Gibbs having the gall to let our budding star at MLB (Pierce) run off to a division rival, drafting Jason Campbell, and *gasp* benching Brunell for Ramsey. Despite having Moss, Cooley, and... David Patten?

See, we've all seen this act before, and this time we don't have a nut job relying on a lil' pitch n catch or Pilate balls to save the franchise.

Posted by: mattsoundworld | December 21, 2010 4:16 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: PlayAction | December 21, 2010 4:05 PM

Bust it out. I think is was shown that it didn't exactly prove p1's point.

Posted by: learnedhand1 | December 21, 2010 4:18 PM | Report abuse

Here is the underlying problem with Shanahan in 2010. We expected him to know what to do. He isn't an amateur that we hoped would grow into the job. You give Leslie Frazier some slack in Minny because he'll need to grow into the job.

Mike Shanahan doesn't need to grow into the role. He came here as a completed product.

14 games into his tenure, he looks more like the amateur we hope will grow into the job and not so much like the savvy product Snyder thought he'd hired.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | December 21, 2010 4:23 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: PlayAction | December 21, 2010 4:05 PM

Bust it out. I think is was shown that it didn't exactly prove p1's point.

Posted by: learnedhand1 | December 21, 2010 4:18 PM

I'm heading home...think that discussion took place sometime after week two...or whenever DHall said this is HIS defense...don't think thats something I would admit.

Posted by: PlayAction | December 21, 2010 4:28 PM | Report abuse

It's hard to say definitively how much, if any we have improved as a team.

I would like to see the offense operate at a high level and score over 21 points for the next two weeks. I'd like to see them control the clock late in the fourth quarter and drive to win the game.

I'd like to see our defense hold the other te...or never mind - they just suck.

I'd like to see our Special Teams dominate and control field position and execute perfectly on FG/Extra Point try's.

I'd like to see better game management, effective adjustments at halftime and impressive clock and time out management

I'd like to see four consistent, solid, intense quarters of football each week.

I'd like to see the things we all want, but have not seen in a long time. Good, solid, smart, physical football.

Let's start there.

Posted by: edvar | December 21, 2010 4:30 PM | Report abuse

A ThinkingMan ought to be able to use google in this day and age.

Posted by: ifthethunderdontgetya | December 21, 2010 4:12 PM | Report abuse
---------------------------------

Does Google factor in playing in a weaker division, getting 4 games against the NFC West, having a RB averaging 5.2 ypc, and having the same number of TDs as Farve and Tony Romo?

Posted by: mattsoundworld | December 21, 2010 4:31 PM | Report abuse

And also, it's a reflection on Team Shanny. Will they evaluate draft talent better than they evaluated an NFL QB with 11 years of game film?

Posted by: Alan4 | December 21, 2010 3:21 PM

If you had any expectations at all about Mike Shanahan, given his history, it'd be that he'd make good calls on the QB.

He's coached QBs including Plummer, Cutler, Elway, Steve Young, Brian Griese, Steve Beuelein, Jay Schroeder. He knows good from bad. Or so one would have thought ...

Posted by: zcezcest1 | December 21, 2010 4:31 PM | Report abuse

It's hard to say definitively how much, if any we have improved as a team.

Posted by: edvar | December 21, 2010 4:30 PM | Report abuse
--------------------------

Correct answer, wrong question. Have we improved as an organization? Yes. 1000 times over.

Posted by: mattsoundworld | December 21, 2010 4:35 PM | Report abuse

p1funk loves himself some DHall.

Posted by: Diesel44 | December 21, 2010 4:35 PM | Report abuse

@Thunder: McNabb was an improvement over Campbell; the difference for Campbell this year is that when he throws a checkdown pass, its to a young Darren McFadden and not an older Clinton Portis. I liked Campbell when he was here but he's the kind of player that needs a perfect cast or, at the very least, several good players and one elite talent to win ..... some of his games. Ultimately, McNabb gets the nod for the increased number of long yardage plays. Both throw the deep ball; McNabb just completes it more often.


Unfortunately for us, McNabb isn't the answer either. This team requires a 5 year rebuild, provided Shanahan and Allen remain in charge. A suberb personnel guy like Pioli or Newsome could get this turned around in three, but only because they're less likely to miss in the mid-rounds on defensive players the way Shanahan did in his days in Denver or Allen did on offensive players in Tampa. McNabb was a miss, Williams was a hit. Brown remains to be seen as do Cook and Capers. But the free agents (KWilliams, Banks, Torain) help to lessen the sting of the mid-round misses.

Ultimately, this upcoming free agency period will make or break this team over the short-term (say next 2yrs). Smart spending will place us into the >.500 arena; Haynesworth-style mistakes will leave us in last place.

Shanahan/Allen aren't suberb, but they are competent. Competent isn't something we've had here in a long, long time. Hopefully, we'll be allowed to see a competently-designed team develop into championship team.

Posted by: AppleScience | December 21, 2010 4:39 PM | Report abuse


p1funk loves himself some DHall.

Posted by: Diesel44 | December 21, 2010 4:35 PM |
-------

dhall got beat by "speed dial" witten. no excuse on that one

Posted by: hessone | December 21, 2010 4:43 PM | Report abuse

It's hard to say definitively how much, if any we have improved as a team.

Posted by: edvar | December 21, 2010 4:30 PM | Report abuse
--------------------------

Correct answer, wrong question. Have we improved as an organization? Yes. 1000 times over.

Posted by: mattsoundworld | December 21, 2010 4:35 PM |


Hmmmm...

Jury is still out on that one still, me thinks.

I do so hope you are correct, though.

Posted by: edvar | December 21, 2010 5:01 PM | Report abuse

Cam Newton.

Posted by: 4thFloor | December 21, 2010 3:18 PM

Rex Grossman for a little while longer ... then 5th rounder, Colin Kaepernick of evada. [Tune into the the Kraft Fight Hunger Bowl, January 9th, to learn more.]

Posted by: dcsween | December 21, 2010 5:10 PM | Report abuse

Unfortunately for us, McNabb isn't the answer either.
==========================

And that's the point. We gave away picks for someone who wasn't the answer. I doubt if our record would be any worse if we kept Campbell (I think it might even be better, but whatever).

That 2nd rounder this year and what looks to be a 4th next year are the picks we need to be using to get badly needed young talent on the team.

P.S. Sorry Dik Shuttle, I think you're wrong to dismiss this waste.
~

Posted by: ifthethunderdontgetya | December 21, 2010 5:10 PM | Report abuse

Also please note the SEVEN draft picks the Skins possess going into the 2011 draft

1 [Own pick]
2 [Own pick]
5 [Own pick]
5 From Jammal Brown Trade
6 [Own pick]
7 [Own Pick]
7 Conditional pick (IND) for Tryon based on play time

Sooooo, sure the team has some non-premuim picks, but they are GOING IN to the draft with 7 shots.

Posted by: ThinkingMan | December 21, 2010 4:05 PM

>>> This is off by a couple of Day Two picks:

The Saints' compensation in the Brown deal is tied to the Redskins' trade with the Eagles for quarterback Donovan McNabb in April.

Washington will now be without its third- and fourth-round draft picks in 2011, but it will also get back a later pick from New Orleans.

Washington owes the Eagles a third- or fourth-round pick in 2011 for McNabb, based on how the quarterback plays or the team performs. If the Redskins win nine games, go to the playoffs or McNabb gets selected to the Pro Bowl, Philadelphia will receive Washington's third-round pick and New Orleans will get Washington's fourth. If none of those happen, the Eagles will get the Redskins' fourth-round pick and the Saints will get the Redskins' third-round pick.

If New Orleans receives Washington's third-round pick, then the Redskins will get a 2011 fifth-round pick back from the Saints. However, if Washington's third-round pick goes to Philadelphia, then the Saints will send a 2011 sixth- or seventh-round pick back to the Redskins.

Posted by: dcsween | December 21, 2010 5:15 PM | Report abuse

Evada? I hardly knew'a!

Posted by: NateinthePDX | December 21, 2010 5:24 PM | Report abuse

And that's the point. We gave away picks for someone who wasn't the answer. I doubt if our record would be any worse if we kept Campbell (I think it might even be better, but whatever).

That 2nd rounder this year and what looks to be a 4th next year are the picks we need to be using to get badly needed young talent on the team.

P.S. Sorry Dik Shuttle, I think you're wrong to dismiss this waste.
~

Posted by: ifthethunderdontgetya | December 21, 2010 5:10 PM |

He is dismissing it because his time machine is broken and he can't go back and change what happen.

Joe Gibbs traded a 3rd round pick for a RB that played like two snaps.

He also traded a 3rd round pick for a QB that was going to be cut.

He also trade a top CB and a 2nd round pick for a RB who played well here but never took the team on his shoulders. He also caused many of the issues Shanny is now dealing with.

No coach is perfect even the great Joe Gibbs, if you thought Shanny was going to be perfect and turn this team around in one year you obviously haven't been watching the last few years. This team had bottom of the NFL talent and even worse then that most of them felt entilted to there positions.

Posted by: Flounder21 | December 21, 2010 5:26 PM | Report abuse

It's hard to say definitively how much, if any we have improved as a team.

Posted by: edvar | December 21, 2010 4:30 PM | Report abuse
--------------------------

Correct answer, wrong question. Have we improved as an organization? Yes. 1000 times over.

Posted by: mattsoundworld | December 21, 2010 4:35 PM |


Hmmmm...

Jury is still out on that one still, me thinks.

I do so hope you are correct, though.

Posted by: edvar

We've definitely improved as a team and as an organization. But mostly, its because the bar was laying on the ground -- and mgmt still managed to stumble on it.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | December 21, 2010 5:26 PM | Report abuse

actually, never mind ... I see Thinking Man got the 3rd/4th thing accurately.

Posted by: dcsween | December 21, 2010 5:30 PM | Report abuse

Nate, that was something Nedvar wrote ...

Posted by: dcsween | December 21, 2010 5:32 PM | Report abuse

Have we improved as an organization? Yes. 1000 times over.

Posted by: mattsoundworld | December 21, 2010 4:35 PM

This cannot be stated conclusively until The Coroner from Munchkin land unrolls the scroll and sings the song to confirm that Vinny Cerrato really is no longer associated with the organization.

Posted by: dcsween | December 21, 2010 5:36 PM | Report abuse

is this thing on? testing, testing, one, two, one, two

Posted by: dcsween | December 21, 2010 5:37 PM | Report abuse

shibboleth, shibboleth

Posted by: dcsween | December 21, 2010 5:39 PM | Report abuse

and RIP Sgt Deitrich aka Steve Landesberg. Always enjoyed seeing him and his dry humor on the screen.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | December 21, 2010 5:41 PM | Report abuse

J. Campbell 2010

D. McNabb 2010

A ThinkingMan ought to be able to use google in this day and age.
~

Posted by: ifthethunderdontgetya | December 21, 2010 4:12 PM |


Why when you just used google to prove his point.

Posted by: Flounder21 | December 21, 2010 6:01 PM | Report abuse

Loved Sgt. Dietrich. And everything about that show, starting with the killer theme song.

Posted by: NateinthePDX | December 21, 2010 6:02 PM | Report abuse

As I recall, Steve Landesberg went on to be the face of Schlotsky's, which once upon a time was an interesting new entry in the fast food scene.

Which gives you an idea the kind of pop culture ephemera what get lodged in my brain.

Posted by: NateinthePDX | December 21, 2010 6:05 PM | Report abuse

Man, am I excited about the 2011 draft.

Predictions: Are the Jagwires going to run for more or less than their 151.4 yard average against the Skins?

Posted by: NateinthePDX | December 21, 2010 6:12 PM | Report abuse

I'm still willing to be patient with the Allen/Shanahan regime.

I will say this, with the exception of Haynesworth, I don't see any overspending on the books and we have a FEW building pieces.

Banks
Williams
Torain
Landry
Armstrong
Orakpo

Posted by: rickyroge | December 21, 2010 6:16 PM | Report abuse

Why when you just used google to prove his point.

Posted by: Flounder21 | December 21, 2010 6:01 PM
=========================

Being stubborn isn't going to make either of you right. You don't want your qb throwing more interceptions than tds.
~

Posted by: ifthethunderdontgetya | December 21, 2010 6:19 PM | Report abuse

I'm still willing to be patient with the Allen/Shanahan regime.

I will say this, with the exception of Haynesworth, I don't see any overspending on the books and we have a FEW building pieces.

Banks
Williams
Torain
Landry
Armstrong
Orakpo

Posted by: rickyroge | December 21, 2010 6:16 PM |

They didn't overspend on Haynesworth, they gave him the money he was going to be owed anyway. They gave it to him this year so it wouldn't be a cap hit in the future.

Posted by: Flounder21 | December 21, 2010 6:20 PM | Report abuse

There will be 400 UFA's available this off-season. I honestly see the Redskins signing at least 15 UFA's to contracts. We have the money, we certainly have the openings.

I see 25 new faces on the roster next season.

Posted by: JSchon | December 21, 2010 6:23 PM | Report abuse

Why when you just used google to prove his point.

Posted by: Flounder21 | December 21, 2010 6:01 PM
=========================

Being stubborn isn't going to make either of you right. You don't want your qb throwing more interceptions than tds.
~

Posted by: ifthethunderdontgetya | December 21, 2010 6:19 PM |

Your right JC is better this year then Mcnabb because he threw 3 more TD's then INT's.

Don't judge the other stats or the pathetic teams JC has played against.

Posted by: Flounder21 | December 21, 2010 6:26 PM | Report abuse

So, just a couple of crazy thoughts about what the Redskins might want to do in the offseason.......

Free Agency: Now is the time to try to restock the offensive line and defense with first-time free agents. Diesel 44 offered up this starting point earlier today:

______________

Repeat after me..

Ryan Kalil C
Ryan Harris RT
Carl Nicks OG
Tamba Hali OLB
David Harris ILB

Posted by: Diesel44 | December 21, 2010 2:20 PM
_____________________

OK, good starting point here. Each of these guys (or an equivalent) should be available for "not-stupid" money. Got to add a NT to this group. Ngata has been suggested, but the Ravens won't let that happen. Find the best NT available in FA -- and pay him what you have to to get him here. After that, add to this list with additional help for the secondary.

OK, so now, let's think draft. Here's our current draft picks this coming year, courtesy of dcsween:

1 [Own pick]
2 [Own pick]
5 [Own pick]
5 From Jammal Brown Trade
6 [Own pick]
7 [Own Pick]
7 Conditional pick (IND) for Tryon based on play time

Based on the McNabb debacle, Shanahan is going to to go for a QB in the draft -- Grossman will start next year until either Beck or the draftee are ready to take over. We need a QB to develop, I'll grant that -- but we DON'T need to use our first or second rounder to get him. Get whatever you can for AH and DM -- hopefully one of these will produce at least a 3rd/4th rounder, and use that to get Ricky Stanzi out of Iowa. Played in a pro-style offense, should be gettable in the 3rd or 4th. Add in a late round pick or two to the 3rd/4th to move up, if you have to.

Everything else in the draft goes to building FOUNDATION (Foundation, in my dictionary, means Off and Def line, followed by every other position on the defense). Start with either line (best available player on either side) with the first and second rounders, take best available at any foundation position with every other pick that you have.

Other than Shanahan's developmental QB, spend NO draft picks on RB/WR/TE/glittery toys. Everything needs to concentrate around building the foundation for the future.

Now let's think about trades. If there are players on this roster that others are interested in (and that don't fit the O or D scheme here), trade them for FUTURE draft picks. I'm talking 2012 and beyond. Start building the abundance of picks in the future years -- similar to the way the hated Patriots do it-- so that you have manueverability in the future.

This may be the best year in recent history for free agents. Use it to fill immediate gaps in the foundation. Get as much as you can for AH and DM, package it as necessary to get a developmental QB in the mid-rounds. Select the best available foundation player that you can with every other pick. Trade 'waste' on your team for future draft picks.

Dammit -- it's all so simple as I sit here with a Vodka and Tonic.

Posted by: smurff11 | December 21, 2010 6:28 PM | Report abuse

There will be 400 UFA's available this off-season. I honestly see the Redskins signing at least 15 UFA's to contracts. We have the money, we certainly have the openings.

I see 25 new faces on the roster next season.


That would be fine with me as long as all of them combined don't get as much as AH got the year he was signed. None of the can be over the age of 31.

Posted by: Flounder21 | December 21, 2010 6:30 PM | Report abuse

Mistakes prior to Shanahan and Allen

-Albert Haynesworth
-Jason Taylor (2 picks; 1 and done)
-T. J. Duckett (2 picks; 1 and done)
-only drafting 3 olineman in 10 years
-Portis "rules"
-Brandon Lloyd (picks and a new contract)
-Adam Archuleta (highest paid safety in history)
-letting Ryan Clark go
-letting Antonio Pierce go
-Ruining Jason Campbell
-playing Mark Brunell (couldn't throw deep)
-Sherman Lewis
-Jim Zorn
-"Swinging Gate"
-clock management
-Gibbs vs. Saunders offense
-Steve Spurrier
-Shane Matthews
-Danny Wuerfull
-Devin Thomas
-Chad Rinehart
-firing Marty Schottenheimer too soon
-Jeff George
-Trung Candidate
-Antwaan Randle-El as punt returner
-David Patten
-Darnerian McCants
-no youth during the Gibbs years
-running Portis as a between the tackles back.

I'm sure I'm forgetting something

Mike Shanahan/Bruce Allen's era mistakes

-a 2nd and 4th round pick for McNabb
- benching McNabb in Detroit
- "disrespected" McNabb by telling him Thursday he wouldn't play Sunday in a effort to evaluate other players

I'm sorry...I need to see the rest of the movie...10 years doesn't compare to 13 games.

PATIENCE!

Posted by: rickyroge | December 21, 2010 6:30 PM | Report abuse

I'm sorry...I need to see the rest of the movie...10 years doesn't compare to 13 games.

PATIENCE!

Posted by: rickyroge | December 21, 2010 6:30 PM |

I'm your huckelberry thats just my game.

Posted by: Flounder21 | December 21, 2010 6:33 PM | Report abuse

Can anyone...logically...explain why the Redkins should not draft a QB in the first round (assuming they would address O Line in Round 2)?

If Mallet, Newton, Locker, etc. are available to us...should be not pick any of these guys and pick an O-lineman.

Maybe the next Tom Brady is in the 6th round.

Posted by: rickyroge | December 21, 2010 6:36 PM | Report abuse

Flounder...

A team can be rebuilt with the Draft and RESPONSIBLE free agency...With all the mistakes Shanahan has made, OVERPAYING hasn't been one of them.

Posted by: rickyroge | December 21, 2010 6:38 PM | Report abuse

As I recall, Steve Landesberg went on to be the face of Schlotsky's, which once upon a time was an interesting new entry in the fast food scene.


Posted by: NateinthePDX | December 21, 2010 6:05 PM
+++++++++++++++++
Now you're making me hungry. I love Scholtsky's!!

Still got the recipe for the awesome bacon/avacado/foccaccia sandwich that we blogged up last Winter?

Posted by: smurff11 | December 21, 2010 6:39 PM | Report abuse

Between the 400 UFA's and the draft, a young accurate passer needs to be on the priority list.

Posted by: JSchon | December 21, 2010 6:42 PM | Report abuse

I'm sure I'm forgetting something

Mike Shanahan/Bruce Allen's era mistakes

-a 2nd and 4th round pick for McNabb
- benching McNabb in Detroit
- "disrespected" McNabb by telling him Thursday he wouldn't play Sunday in a effort to evaluate other players


I'm sorry...I need to see the rest of the movie...10 years doesn't compare to 13 games.

PATIENCE!

Posted by: rickyroge | December 21, 2010

Let me help you with the Shanny/Allen mistakes:

Vonny Holiday (cheap but horrible)
M. Kemoeato (however you spell it)
Joey Galloway
Roydell Williams
"Cardiovascular issues"
"the best players will play"
changing to the 3-4 defense without the personel

Add those names/quotes and Shanny's on track to keep pace with the previous 13 years......

Posted by: dcwun | December 21, 2010 6:43 PM | Report abuse

smurff11, despite the counseling received from you kind fellows up here, I'm still having issues managing on-sandwich avocado slices. I remain reluctant to perform the sandwich compression necessary to prevent significant avocado slippage.

I've just gotta keep fighting through it, I guess. This is my journey.

Posted by: NateinthePDX | December 21, 2010 6:47 PM | Report abuse

If Mallet, Newton, Locker, etc. are available to us...should be not pick any of these guys and pick an O-lineman.

Maybe the next Tom Brady is in the 6th round.

Posted by: rickyroge | December 21, 2010

Mallet is this year's Tony Pike. Jake Locker is a lock to be a bust. He's Tebow lite. Ask the left coast bloggas, they see him play all of the time.

Luck and Newton are the only first round picks.

Posted by: dcwun | December 21, 2010 6:48 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: smurff11 | December 21, 2010 6:39 PM

I've noticed your posts over the last couple of days and there is something very familiar about your posts..In a good way.

Care to share your previous handle?

Posted by: Diesel44 | December 21, 2010 6:49 PM | Report abuse

Vonny Holiday (cheap but horrible)
M. Kemoeato (however you spell it)
Joey Galloway
Roydell Williams
"Cardiovascular issues"
"the best players will play"
changing to the 3-4 defense without the personel

Add those names/quotes and Shanny's on track to keep pace with the previous 13 years......

Posted by: dcwun | December 21, 2010 6:43 PM |

You're kidding right? Ypou can't possibly believe that the four players in that list combined in any way compare to any one of the other errors mentioned in the other list in money, picks, or all around stupidity? Please think before you post. None of those guys cost us anything and, as a matter of fact, those guys replaced guys that were high cost nobodies.

Posted by: TheScamp75 | December 21, 2010 6:51 PM | Report abuse

smurff11, despite the counseling received from you kind fellows up here, I'm still having issues managing on-sandwich avocado slices. I remain reluctant to perform the sandwich compression necessary to prevent significant avocado slippage.

I've just gotta keep fighting through it, I guess. This is my journey.

Posted by: NateinthePDX | December 21, 2010 6:47 PM

+++++++++++++++++++++++++

May I suggest -- more bacon.

Good luck with your quest, my friend. And let us know when you have achieved....nirvana.

Posted by: smurff11 | December 21, 2010 6:51 PM | Report abuse

PATIENCE!
Posted by: rickyroge

Thank you for that. And just a question to all the Shanahan bashers: If you think so little of him, why would you expect him to turn around ten years of mess in one season? You must actually think he is a true genius if you expected him to be flawless and make zero mistakes while cleaning up Vinny and Dan's car wreck.

Posted by: NYPDee | December 21, 2010 6:52 PM | Report abuse

Why do people forget that that because of the uncapped year there were 200+ UFA's taken off of the market.

There weren't a lot pieces available to rebuild with.

Posted by: JSchon | December 21, 2010 6:55 PM | Report abuse

Man, am I excited about the 2011 draft.

One truism about the draft is that despite all the "Draft 0-lineman" noise, this is not a draft with a lot of 1st round type players.

It is a WR, Q-back, LB, DE type draft.

We cannot demand from the draft what it does not have.

Posted by: MistaMoe | December 21, 2010 6:57 PM | Report abuse

There weren't a lot pieces available to rebuild with.

Even with that, it made no sense to trade away picks for a tackle and quarterback (who you later decide to unload).

Rebuilding means preserving picks for starters and using FA to add low-cost depth players.

It's a simple thing.

Posted by: MistaMoe | December 21, 2010 7:01 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: smurff11 | December 21, 2010 6:39 PM

I've noticed your posts over the last couple of days and there is something very familiar about your posts..In a good way.

Care to share your previous handle?

Posted by: Diesel44 | December 21, 2010 6:49 PM
+++++++++++++++++++
It hasn't changed, Diesel. Always been Smurff up here. Just don't post a lot. Read a lot -- just don't post a lot.

I'm still the 53 year old, white, USAF vet living on the East Coast that I always have been. Redskins fan since I was 6 (God, that was a long time ago) growing up in South Carolina. Back then, the Redskins were the team of the South.

Patiently waiting, like the rest of us, until they are relevant again....

Posted by: smurff11 | December 21, 2010 7:02 PM | Report abuse

Mallet is this year's Tony Pike. Jake Locker is a lock to be a bust. He's Tebow lite. Ask the left coast bloggas, they see him play all of the time.

Luck and Newton are the only first round picks.

Posted by: dcwun | December 21, 2010 6:48 PM

Not exactly.

Pike is a tooth pick with a noodle arm. Everybody wanted us to take TP with our 2nd up here but me. Mallett has a Man's frame with an above average arm and has a high comp % in a pro style O. He'll be on the board when we pick and will definitely be a consideration.

Locker would have challenged Bradford for the #1 overall pick last year and will probably go mid to late first. Locker's stock has dropped because all he's done is lose, has been inconsistent, and is comp % is way to low. I like his athleticism and he's a much better QB prospect than Tebow.

Posted by: Diesel44 | December 21, 2010 7:04 PM | Report abuse

Patiently waiting, like the rest of us, until they are relevant again....

Posted by: smurff11 | December 21, 2010 7:02 PM

Well, some of "us" expect miracles immediately. Patience isn't a characteristic a lot of people up here possess.

Posted by: TheScamp75 | December 21, 2010 7:07 PM | Report abuse

One truism about the draft is that despite all the "Draft 0-lineman" noise, this is not a draft with a lot of 1st round type players.

It is a ... DE type draft.

We cannot demand from the draft what it does not have.

Posted by: MistaMoe | December 21, 2010 6:57 PM

++++++++++++++++++++++++++

DE draft, you say? I'll take some of that.

Jealously hoping that they could grab Bowers out of Clemson--not sure that's gonna happen, though....

Posted by: smurff11 | December 21, 2010 7:11 PM | Report abuse

Mallett has a Man's frame with an above average arm and has a high comp % in a pro style O. He'll be on the board when we pick and will definitely be a consideration.

Ryan Mallett = Matt Schaub

.....and that's why Kyle Shanahan will convince his dad to draft him.

Posted by: MistaMoe | December 21, 2010 7:12 PM | Report abuse

One truism about the draft is that despite all the "Draft 0-lineman" noise, this is not a draft with a lot of 1st round type players.

It is a ... DE type draft.

We cannot demand from the draft what it does not have.

Posted by: MistaMoe | December 21, 2010 6:57 PM

Same with NT

Posted by: TheScamp75 | December 21, 2010 7:13 PM | Report abuse

You're kidding right? Ypou can't possibly believe that the four players in that list combined in any way compare to any one of the other errors mentioned in the other list in money, picks, or all around stupidity? Please think before you post. None of those guys cost us anything and, as a matter of fact, those guys replaced guys that were high cost nobodies.

Posted by: TheScamp75 | December 21

First, what's up with the new handle? Sounds a little Hollywood now that you're in SoCal.

Now, no-one is saying that finacially they are equal. The point is bad decisions. Why give DM another 3.5M if they knew he wasn't in the plans next year? It not a coincidence that a few of those players have thrived since leaving the Skins. Again, Shanny placed 30 of the 53 on this roster. Looking back, some of the replacements are very questionable. The QB experiment is the big one. That was supposed to get more than 1-2 more wins.

Posted by: dcwun | December 21, 2010 7:15 PM | Report abuse

welcome back smurff and feel free to post more often.

maybe a little less for dcwun...I kid, I kid.

Posted by: Diesel44 | December 21, 2010 7:19 PM | Report abuse

Now, no-one is saying that finacially they are equal. The point is bad decisions. Why give DM another 3.5M if they knew he wasn't in the plans next year? It not a coincidence that a few of those players have thrived since leaving the Skins. Again, Shanny placed 30 of the 53 on this roster. Looking back, some of the replacements are very questionable. The QB experiment is the big one. That was supposed to get more than 1-2 more wins.

Posted by: dcwun | December 21, 2010 7:15 PM |

Those choices don't even belong on the same list. The least of the first list was Rinehardt and even he cost us draft pick. Those guys you mentioned are one year minimum cost trials until we can get a real FA class.

The new handle is a by product of pissing off the mayor and him blocking my other one. I'd gladly take my old one back as I fear change but alas a change was forced upon me. I didn't want to hide behind something completely different as I am fine with who I am.

Posted by: TheScamp75 | December 21, 2010 7:21 PM | Report abuse

Ryan Mallett = Matt Schaub

.....and that's why Kyle Shanahan will convince his dad to draft him.

Posted by: MistaMoe | December 21, 2010 7:12 PM

+++++++++++
Too high on the board. Hoping that they wait until later in the draft to get Shanny's project.

Posted by: smurff11 | December 21, 2010 7:22 PM | Report abuse

Too high on the board. Hoping that they wait until later in the draft to get Shanny's project.


Posted by: smurff11 | December 21, 2010 7:22 PM |

I'm hoping Shanny's project is already here in Beck. Not holding my breath of course.

Posted by: TheScamp75 | December 21, 2010 7:34 PM | Report abuse

Locker would have challenged Bradford for the #1 overall pick last year and will probably go mid to late first. Locker's stock has dropped because all he's done is lose, has been inconsistent, and is comp % is way to low. I like his athleticism and he's a much better QB prospect than Tebow.

Posted by: Diesel44 | December 21, 2010

I'll give you the Pike observation but Locker will not go in the first. He is very athletic but 53% comp % doesn't cut it coming out of college and he struggles badly reading defenses. At least Tebow had a high comp % and while his mechanics are a mess, he does throw a good ball.

I would take Colt McCoy or Clausen before Locker and Mallet.

Posted by: dcwun | December 21, 2010 7:39 PM | Report abuse

I'm hoping Shanny's project is already here in Beck. Not holding my breath of course.

Posted by: TheScamp75 | December 21, 2010 7:34 PM

===============
Agreed. It's a given he's drafting someone else. Please God, let it be on the second day....

Posted by: smurff11 | December 21, 2010 7:43 PM | Report abuse

Agreed. It's a given he's drafting someone else. Please God, let it be on the second day....

Posted by: smurff11 | December 21, 2010 7:43 PM

As of last year..Or on the third day.

Posted by: Diesel44 | December 21, 2010 7:46 PM | Report abuse

maybe a little less for dcwun...I kid, I kid.

Posted by: Diesel44 | December 21, 2010

That'll be 2 Zima 6 packs for the shot at me....

Posted by: dcwun | December 21, 2010 7:49 PM | Report abuse

maybe a little less for dcwun...I kid, I kid.

Posted by: Diesel44 | December 21, 2010

That'll be 2 Zima 6 packs for the shot at me....

Posted by: dcwun | December 21, 2010 7:53 PM | Report abuse

So isn't Lamar Woodley about to be a FA?

Posted by: TheScamp75 | December 21, 2010 8:05 PM | Report abuse

Too high on the board (Ryan Mallett). Hoping that they wait until later in the draft to get Shanny's project.

Shanny's 'project'?

Son, if the redskins were in position to draft Sam Bradford this past Spring, Shanny would've taken him.

And Sam Bradford coming out of college was nobody's project.

And neither were Matt Stafford and Mark Sanchez.

Cam Newton, like Tim Tebow, is a 'project'.

But guys like Luck, Locker, Mallett, Ponder, Stanzi, and Moore all come out of NFL-lite passing systems, and have started 2-3 years in major college programs.

Such players are not 'projects'.

They can read coverages, have seen NFL type defenses, and know what's it's like to have the weight on the offense on their shoulders.

Rebuilding the Washington Redskins is what's a 'project'.

And in a quarterback driven league, you must bring in a kid who can start at quarterback within a year or from jump.

The NFL is awash in young guns (from Flacco to Ryan to to Rodgers to Schaub to Vick to Freeman to McCoy to Cassel) while D.C. hopes to pin it hopes on dudes who are 'projects'.

Living on the hopes of 'projects' sucks--just ask anyone who lives in one, they'll tell you the same.

We may have 7-9 picks in the upcoming draft: 6-7 picks and the scrupulous use of FA will allow the team to add a guard, center, nose tackle, wide receiver, outside linebacker, free safety, right tackle, and defensive end.

But the 1st pick must be the new face of the franchise: not some 'project'.

Watch Arkansas v. Ohio State

You'll see that Ryan Mallett should be that face.

Posted by: MistaMoe | December 21, 2010 8:10 PM | Report abuse

Watching SportsNet Central I saw Kelly Johnson`s interview with Mike and he said with the current CBA the draft will probably be before Free Agency. Can anyone confirm or deny that. Cause if that is the case that changes alot of things. Thanks

Posted by: TheScamp75 | December 21, 2010 8:12 PM | Report abuse

But guys like Luck, Locker, Mallett, Ponder, Stanzi, and Moore all come out of NFL-lite passing systems, and have started 2-3 years in major college programs.

Posted by: MistaMoe | December 21, 2010

Moe....

My QB order would be Luck, Ponder, Mallet. I'm probably in the minority on Ponder. I know it appears as though I'm hatin' on the kid but Locker will be a bust. Unlike the others, can you think of any memorable throws or games that will make you say Jake Locker is the guy?

Posted by: dcwun | December 21, 2010 8:24 PM | Report abuse

I'm sure I'm forgetting something

Mike Shanahan/Bruce Allen's era mistakes

-a 2nd and 4th round pick for McNabb
- benching McNabb in Detroit
- "disrespected" McNabb by telling him Thursday he wouldn't play Sunday in a effort to evaluate other players


I'm sorry...I need to see the rest of the movie...10 years doesn't compare to 13 games.

PATIENCE!

Posted by: rickyroge

Just keep reading ZEKE'S UNIQUE PERSPECTIVES to get a good feel for Shanahan's issues. And mind you, I was supportive of him as a HC.

-9 guys (not including McNabb) that he has devalued that either currently don't have a role or won't have a role with this team shortly. 9 opportunities to 'sell high' that Shanahan missed. Probably adds up to the equivalent of a couple high picks.

-Switching to a 3-4, creating many new holes in our roster -- and, as a bonus for bad, watching Orakpo get injured in pass coverage.

-Handling Albert ineffectively

-inability to make halftime adjustments

-hiring his son to be OC

-failing to recognize that 2010 needed to be a rebuild year, not a 'win now' year

-risking guys like Torain on the practice squad while keeping Larry Johnson

-attempting to do too many jobs at once

-leading a team in "20 MINUTES OF CHAOS"® where we were outscored 53-0 in 20 consecutive minutes of football, beginning at the end of the DET game and ending 1 play into the 2nd quarter vs philly. Outscored 53-0 in 20 minutes!! Think about it. If anyone looked, I'd bet that would be an all-time record and no one would be close to it for ineptitude.

-returning Portis to the lineup when he wasn't ready to come back from his injury

Posted by: zcezcest1 | December 21, 2010 8:45 PM | Report abuse

Zeke- You might want to sharpen your axe before you start to grind it.

It's pretty clear you're not a fan of Shanahan but most of your criticisms are just a bit off.

I'll condense your list:

Trading a 2nd and 4th for McNabb.

Posted by: Diesel44 | December 21, 2010 8:54 PM | Report abuse

Zeke- You might want to sharpen your axe before you start to grind it.

It's pretty clear you're not a fan of Shanahan but most of your criticisms are just a bit off.

I'll condense your list:

Trading a 2nd and 4th for McNabb.

Posted by: Diesel44 | December 21, 2010

No No Zeke, your list was spot on. Nobody has a axe to grind either. The truth is the truth. Again, I'm not saying fire him after 1 season either but he was Zorn-esque in many ways this season.

Posted by: dcwun | December 21, 2010 9:04 PM | Report abuse

Zeke- You might want to sharpen your axe before you start to grind it.

It's pretty clear you're not a fan of Shanahan but most of your criticisms are just a bit off.

I'll condense your list:

Trading a 2nd and 4th for McNabb.

Posted by: Diesel44

You might want to open your eyes and realize how many times Shanahan has messed up. I left out his biggest screw-up, which was trying to win now, instead of commit fully to a rebuild.

I didn't go off on low risk decisions that haven't panned out (Vonnie Holliday, Kemoeatu, etc) because they were reasonable decisions that didn't pan out.

And I didn't mention some other decisions, like allowing Brandon Banks to get picked up by other teams before putting him on the roster.

Shanahan has made far too many mistakes for a guy who has this much experience.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | December 21, 2010 9:05 PM | Report abuse

No No Zeke, your list was spot on. Nobody has a axe to grind either. The truth is the truth. Again, I'm not saying fire him after 1 season either but he was Zorn-esque in many ways this season.

Posted by: dcwun | December 21, 2010 9:04 PM |

Oh yeah, spot on. Please, you need to stop posting. A win now year? Are you kidding? That's why we put our stock in a whole free agency full of second tier backups instead of going after the Dansby's, etc. etc. like half the people on here wanted to do. That's why we got Bolden and went after Jackson. We pick up one qb and it's win now. And yea, hiring his son who coached the Texans offense to the #1 offense spot was stupid too. And yeah, stashing an injury prone running back that nobody else wanted on the practice squad for 3 weeks was a HUGE risk.

Posted by: TheScamp75 | December 21, 2010 9:11 PM | Report abuse

dcwun-

Are you auditioning for a role as my nemesis?

I guess the one two many roles would be team doctor. It's Shanahan's fault that a banged up, aging, and injury prone running back was cleared by team doctors and suffered another (different) injury.

Why keep him around then? Let's get rid of him because he's apparently ruined a 4-12 team that he inherited.

Posted by: Diesel44 | December 21, 2010 9:13 PM | Report abuse

Take your shots, but you know I'm right.

What I'm really amazed at is that almost no one seems to have noticed that Orakpo got injured in pass coverage. If Orakpo had been injured in game 5 in pass coverage, this board would have been raising he!! of the stupidity of putting him out there to cover fast RBs.

Who even mentioned that other than me?

Posted by: zcezcest1 | December 21, 2010 9:20 PM | Report abuse

We know you're right? The only thing we know is that you think you're right.
It's like Ronald Reagan once said, "The trouble with our liberal friends is not that they're ignorant; it's just that they know so much that isn't so."

Posted by: TheScamp75 | December 21, 2010 9:23 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: zcezcest1 | December 21, 2010 9:05 PM

Once again, trading a 2nd and 4th for McNabb was a mistake.

The rest are ridiculous and adding hypothetical mistakes to your list is the icing on the cake.

Agree to disagree. Because your objectivity is shot regarding Shanahan.

Posted by: Diesel44 | December 21, 2010 9:24 PM | Report abuse

Scamp, what's with all the political crap recently? A liberal take your lunch money/old RI handle or something?

Posted by: stevie_in_gp | December 21, 2010 9:27 PM | Report abuse

Scamp, what's with all the political crap recently? A liberal take your lunch money/old RI handle or something?

Posted by: stevie_in_gp | December 21, 2010 9:27 PM |

Where have you been the last 4 years?

Posted by: TheScamp75 | December 21, 2010 9:28 PM | Report abuse

Are you auditioning for a role as my nemesis?

I guess the one two many roles would be team doctor. It's Shanahan's fault that a banged up, aging, and injury prone running back was cleared by team doctors and suffered another (different) injury.

Why keep him around then? Let's get rid of him because he's apparently ruined a 4-12 team that he inherited.

Posted by: Diesel44

dumb stuff Diesel. Portis injured the area adjacent to his earlier injury -- an injury usually requires not just correcting the injured area, but the adjacent muscle groups as well. Thing is, I said before Portis took the field tht I'd like to see him go full speed in practice for a week before putting him in. I mean, if I could figure that out ...

As for getting rid of Shanahan, I haven't taken that position. I'm really amazed at his ineptness. As I said earlier, this mgmt team has raised the bar -- mostly because the last folks left the bar sitting on the ground.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | December 21, 2010 9:29 PM | Report abuse

...and the liberals are trying to take every working mans lunch money.

Posted by: TheScamp75 | December 21, 2010 9:31 PM | Report abuse

Iraq, Afghanistan, DC.

And reading RI every day.

Why?

Posted by: stevie_in_gp | December 21, 2010 9:32 PM | Report abuse

Riddle me this: If Los is so bad, why isn't he targeted as much as Hall?

Posted by: learnedhand1 | December 21, 2010 4:01 PM | Report abuse


Riddle me that: Got any kind of records, metrics or stats to back that up?

?

Or are you just helping Cork fish around in his pampers.

Posted by: p1funk | December 21, 2010 9:34 PM | Report abuse

well, it is time to correct Reagan's statement.

"The trouble with Reagan and our liberal and conservative friends is not that they're ignorant; it's just that they know so much that isn't so."

Posted by: Skins2 | December 21, 2010 9:34 PM | Report abuse

Who even mentioned that other than me?

Posted by: zcezcest1 | December 21, 2010 9:20 PM

You also like to say that the 3-4 marginalizes our best player. I assume you mean Orakpo and not Landry.

The 3-4 highlights a player like Orakpo. The problem this season is that our entire DL is garbage, LoA can't play the other OLB position, and our ILBs need to be upgraded. You put even an average 3-4 DL out there and #98 is going for 16+ sacks.

Even guys like Harrison, Ware, etc occasionally have coverage duties. So the reason it wasn't mentioned is because it's ridiculous, Haslett called for a zone dog and you for whatever reason want to blame Shanahan.

Posted by: Diesel44 | December 21, 2010 9:35 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: zcezcest1 | December 21, 2010 9:05 PM

Once again, trading a 2nd and 4th for McNabb was a mistake.

The rest are ridiculous and adding hypothetical mistakes to your list is the icing on the cake.

Agree to disagree. Because your objectivity is shot regarding Shanahan.

Posted by: Diesel44

I'm being completely objective. Can you seriously say that you're happy with Orakpo in pass coverage?

I've given Shanahan credit where its due. I wrote a favorable ZEKE'S UNIQUE PERSPECTIVE on the Scrap Heap 5 -- guys who Shanahan took of the scrap heap and gave them shots (Armstrong, Banks, Torain, KWilliams and Lichtensteiger). Though Shanahan got lucky that a couple of those guys were snagged off our practice squad.

I've been objective all along and even been clear about things I would have done differently. But hey, if McNabb is the only mistake, I guess you're fine with our 32nd ranked defense.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | December 21, 2010 9:41 PM | Report abuse

Dies, by highlights you mean, makes clear he's not a 3-4 type, right?

Honestly, he's an athlete, he'll compete and be relatively successful whichever system, but the switch is not a good one for him. Is that the consensus?

Posted by: stevie_in_gp | December 21, 2010 9:41 PM | Report abuse

Who even mentioned that other than me?

Posted by: zcezcest1 | December 21, 2010 9:20 PM

You also like to say that the 3-4 marginalizes our best player. I assume you mean Orakpo and not Landry.

The 3-4 highlights a player like Orakpo. The problem this season is that our entire DL is garbage, LoA can't play the other OLB position, and our ILBs need to be upgraded. You put even an average 3-4 DL out there and #98 is going for 16+ sacks.

Even guys like Harrison, Ware, etc occasionally have coverage duties. So the reason it wasn't mentioned is because it's ridiculous, Haslett called for a zone dog and you for whatever reason want to blame Shanahan.

Posted by: Diesel44

Funny you should mention that one. Last year, I was in favor of trying Orakpo at both LB and DE, and seeing where he played best. Make his rookie year an experiment and once we figured it out, then let him play to his strength for the next 10 years. The LB argument made sense to me -- Orakpo was small-ish for an NFL DE and it wasn't clear if he was strong enough to battle good OTs. Plus, he had better speed than most DEs.

Most people said play him at DE and very few people agreed with me that it was worth running the experiment.

Well, the experiment did get run and guess what -- the people that said put him at DE were right all along.

2009 showed, at least to me, how explosive he is with his hand down, that he was adequate against the run, that he was strong enough to match up with OTs and that his speed was constantly getting OTs off balance. To me, it was a no brainer -- every time Orakpo went into coverage, it has him doing something he's just not that good at.

Orakpo is a player you build a defense around. I really think he's that good -- with the potential to be the best DE in the history of this franchise and perhaps even a HOF guy.

And yeah, I put Orakpo ahead of Landry as our best defensive player.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | December 21, 2010 10:03 PM | Report abuse

Repeat after me..

Ryan Kalil C
Ryan Harris RT
Carl Nicks OG
Tamba Hali OLB
David Harris ILB

Posted by: Diesel44 | December 21, 2010 2:20 PM


You add a guys like Marcus Spears and Aubrayo Franklin to the DL, then the Skins have the flexibility to move on a franchise qb early in the draft. Perhaps even to #1 overall for one Mr. Luck.

Posted by: TWISI | December 21, 2010 10:03 PM | Report abuse

Honestly, he's an athlete, he'll compete and be relatively successful whichever system, but the switch is not a good one for him. Is that the consensus?

Posted by: stevie_in_gp | December 21, 2010 9:41 PM |

Steve- He's the prototypical, picture in the dictionary, dream 3-4 OLB. He just needs an adequate NT and 2 3-4 DEs in front of him.

Zeke- Objective??
1. Using hypotheticals (what if a team took said player off our scout team) as mistakes
2. Blaming Shanahan for our team's physician clearing Portis
3. 9 players that had their value diminished? Ok Vinny.
4. When would be a good time to switch to the 3-4? It's a process, and last years D was a paper champion (ranked 10th in YDs allowed, 20+ in PTs allowed, Precious few TOs, yada, yada)
5. Albert dictated what packages he would play in and defined his role. F Albert
6. His son could have had his choice of OC jobs, we were lucky to get him.
7. This is a rebuild- We are 40+ mil under a projected cap

Yes Shanahan has made mistakes but your argument is rendered invalid/dumb.

Posted by: Diesel44 | December 21, 2010 10:10 PM | Report abuse

You add a guys like Marcus Spears and Aubrayo Franklin to the DL, then the Skins have the flexibility to move on a franchise qb early in the draft. Perhaps even to #1 overall for one Mr. Luck.

Posted by: TWISI | December 21, 2010 10:03 PM

I liked Franklin last year and Spears would be a great addition if it was for the whole Cowboy thing.

We're 40+ million under the cap in what will be a GREAT FA market. I can almost live with trading our 1st and 2nd to get Luck if were are diligent in FA.

I've said it before...Luck is the best QB prospect since Peyton Manning.

Posted by: Diesel44 | December 21, 2010 10:19 PM | Report abuse

...and the liberals are trying to take every working mans lunch money.

Posted by: TheScamp75 | December 21, 2010 9:31 PM
=========================

Stick to being wrong about the Redskins, it'll improve your average.
~

Posted by: ifthethunderdontgetya | December 21, 2010 10:21 PM | Report abuse

Dies, educate me: not really big/good enough to play the run from the end position in the 4-3?

I'd argue you change the players before you change the system, and that's from a guy who thinks they should have been more upfront with the (idiot) fans who couldn't see for themselves from the start that it was a rebuild.

But whatever. It was a lost season and L-squared (and Rak, as you say, Dies) are better suited for this system. Anyone else?

(They were trying to have their cake and eat it, too: don't tell anyone it's a rebuild and don't go into full-blowup mode . . . but it's a rebuild.)

Posted by: stevie_in_gp | December 21, 2010 10:27 PM | Report abuse

I've said it before...Luck is the best QB prospect since Peyton Manning.

Posted by: Diesel44 | December 21, 2010 10:19 PM |

He def real good, don't know if he that good. Would be nice to see what his Wonderlic score is. McNabb had a real low one which is why he can't do the Shannys' O. It turned his brains to mush. Andy Reid had to baby him along when he in Philly. The Shannys should have known this about him and not blown 2 val draft picks. Lose out to go 5-11 and see if the Skins can trade up to get him. That would be ideal. The prob is that there are worse teams than the Skins like the Cards and the Pants that also need a franchise QB real bad. If Buff has the #1 pick then it possible the Skins get Lucky.

Posted by: DLoad | December 21, 2010 10:52 PM | Report abuse

steve-

The 3-4 essentially only effects the the 3 (DL) and the 4 (LBs). . It all starts with the NT, which we don't have, he has to control the A gaps, the two openings between the center and guards, and not get pushed back into the linebackers. You've seen Kemo fail all season and I believe that Bryant has a future off the bench.

Then you need two 290-300lb former DTs that have a combination of size and strength and should be able to take on double teams and they must control run gaps. This hasn't happened either and we have no one that is of starter caliber.

The OLBs are usually undersized DEs ("tweeners") that must be athletic and strong enough to shed blocks by FBs, TEs, and OTs to get to the RB and QB. These guys should lead the team in sacks and are occasionally responsible for some coverage duties. We have Orakpo and that's it, LoA is a special teamer. The philosophy here is that it's easier and cheaper to find 3-4 linebackers while it's harder to find defensive linemen to play a 4-3 and pay for all of them.

The ILBs need to have speed, be sure tacklers, and be decent in coverage. We have an aging LFB.

All seven need to be guys that can defeat blockers and we have one guy that can do that when he's not getting held. Orakpo is the center piece moving forward.

We also need a FS but the secondary doesn’t change in a 3-4/4-3.

So we have two guys in total that I would build around on this D. Orakpo and Landry.

Posted by: Diesel44 | December 21, 2010 11:00 PM | Report abuse

I just looked at the NFL standings. Crissakes, the Bills have actually won 2 in a row! I don't know how that happened. Anyway, now I guess we have to hope either Cincy or Den has the #1 pick. If the Pants get it then the Skins might as well wait until the next draft and Matt Barkley. The Pants actually drafted a QB of some reknown last yr in the 2nd round, Jimmy Clausen, but he turned out to be a dud (QB rating = 59, 2 TDs, 7 Ints), as many were predicting in spite of the big boner that Mel Kiper had for the guy.

Posted by: DLoad | December 21, 2010 11:18 PM | Report abuse

Man I'm looking forward to the offseason. When's it all start up???

Posted by: brandon_in_cali | December 21, 2010 11:31 PM | Report abuse

captain (Shanahan), there are doubts
regarding your ability
to lead them the men
lead them

there are doubts in your ability
there's too many blanks in your analogies

lieutenant (Kyle) there is talk
pertaining interpretations
the problems describe them
problems

there are doubts in your ability
there's too many blanks in your analogies

the enemy turns captain
the captain turns civilian
the lieutenant becomes casualty
the lieutenant becomes casualty

the enemy turns captain
and the captain turns civilian
the lieutenant becomes casualty
the lieutenant becomes casualty

there are doubts in your ability
there's too many blanks in your analogies
there's too many doubts in your ability
there's too many blanks in your analogies

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ptKi6pP5jGU&feature=related

Posted by: Diesel44 | December 21, 2010 11:31 PM | Report abuse

Nobody took the bait earlier, so I'll try again: predictions for whether the Jaguars will go over or under their season average for rushing yards of 151.4/game?

Posted by: NateinthePDX | December 22, 2010 12:02 AM | Report abuse

Under, Nate. The Red Raider will have a monster game.

(Only being 99.9% sarcastic.)

Posted by: stevie_in_gp | December 22, 2010 12:06 AM | Report abuse

Nate- over. A bowling ball of a running back against a team that can't tackle.

Posted by: Diesel44 | December 22, 2010 12:10 AM | Report abuse

Stick to being wrong about the Redskins, it'll improve your average.
~

Posted by: ifthethunderdontgetya | December 21, 2010 10:21 PM

Stick to being a d0uchebag. It'll assure that you never fail.

Posted by: TheScamp75 | December 22, 2010 12:13 AM | Report abuse

Moe's Movie Moment:

Film Black Swan

You know a movie is jacked up when celeb shoplifter Winona Ryder delivers the most ironic line:

"You stole from me!!?"

Beyond that, Black Swan is a great movie.

Posted by: MistaMoe | December 22, 2010 12:42 AM | Report abuse

Diesel44

Trading a 2nd and 4th for McNabb


Lemme fix this:

Trading a 2nd and 4th for McNabb to a division foe already replete with draft picks and playmakers.

Now, that's more like it.


Posted by: MistaMoe | December 22, 2010 12:48 AM | Report abuse

Diesel44

A bowling ball of a running back (Maurice Jones-Drew) against a team that can't tackle.

Indeed, Skins v. Jags promises to be as unattractive as any game can get for us about right now.

BTW: don't forget to educate folks about David Garrard.

He's one of the better untalked about quarterbacks in the league right now.


Posted by: MistaMoe | December 22, 2010 12:53 AM | Report abuse

My wife is from Jax & a Jags fan. I've seen (had on "the other TV") pretty much all their games this year. Garard certainly can be good and he has played well against the Skins in the past. MJD is real too, he could gut the middle of our D if we play like we've played most of this season. We are going back east to see my family this Christmas, and I've warned her not to get to crazy during the game or else. I've also suggested perhaps we go to a bar for the game to avoid ruining her relationship with the inlaws.

Posted by: msrent | December 22, 2010 1:03 AM | Report abuse

BTW: don't forget to educate folks about David Garrard.

He's one of the better untalked about quarterbacks in the league right now.

Posted by: MistaMoe | December 22, 2010 12:53 AM

Moe (RI's power rankings #1 blogger)-

David Garrard is a man's man of QBs at 6'1 250. This ECU product (4th RD in 2002) is the most underrated player in the NFL (and a better person). He's the definition of efficiency and will be in the pro bowl this year for his 2nd time or as well all know the pro bowl will continue to be a joke.

This is a very good and yet under the radar Jacksonville team.

Posted by: Diesel44 | December 22, 2010 1:11 AM | Report abuse

Lemme fix this:

Trading a 2nd and 4th for McNabb to a division foe already replete with draft picks and playmakers.

Now, that's more like it.


Posted by: MistaMoe | December 22, 2010 12:48 AM


That's the killer right there.

I think I am more excited about FA than the draft this year. We can cure a lot of hurt by getting the right combination of guys in here.

Can't say I am overly confident about Bruce or Shanny picking the talent, however.

Bobby Beatherd where are you?

Posted by: edvar | December 22, 2010 1:17 AM | Report abuse

Took the evening to watch the Sharks take care of Edmonton, then took a moment to catch up on your views, Diesel, You ought to take your head out once in a while an look around, there really isn't much light up there.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | December 22, 2010 1:23 AM | Report abuse

The Redskins have played the Jaguars four times in the regular season and lead the series 3-1.

The most memorable game in the regular season series was the last matchup in 2006 at FedExField. In a hard-hitting, back-and-forth shootout, the Redskins defeated Jacksonville 36-30 in overtime.

Mark Brunell, the former Jaguars quarterback, threw a game-winning touchdown pass, a 69-yarder to Santana Moss who had to split two defenders on his way to the end zone.

It was Moss’s third touchdown of the game. He finished that game with four catches for 138 yards. Clinton Portis also rushed for a season-high 112 yards on 27 carries.

Let's keep this trend going.

HTTR

Posted by: msrent | December 22, 2010 1:53 AM | Report abuse

zeke- You're a good dude and I'll let you get away with the dumb and the head in the ass statement.

I'm a half full kind of guy and you're easily the opposite.

Like I said hours ago...Agree to disagree.

Posted by: Diesel44 | December 22, 2010 1:55 AM | Report abuse

zeke- You're a good dude and I'll let you get away with the dumb and the head in the ass statement.

I'm a half full kind of guy and you're easily the opposite.

Like I said hours ago...Agree to disagree.

Posted by: Diesel44

Wouldn't take the bait, would you? Oh well.

fwiw, the ZEKE'S UNIQUE PERSPECTIVES theme was about looking at a person and their body of work, and seeing who gets the benefit of the doubt. I cited SJ9, Donovan and Grossman as examples.

Didn't include Shanahan in that, but he also gets the benefit of the doubt in the bigger picture, mostly as a coach. Still, it doesn't mean he hasn't been bad in DC so far.

My sense is that Shanahan is trying to do to many jobs himself. He hasn't really shown it, but I think he'd be a pretty good exec if that was his primary job. He'd be a better coach if that was his primary job. But having to do both AND have your kid on the staff? Seems like a flawed management structure to me.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | December 22, 2010 2:13 AM | Report abuse

Have to agree with that Zeke. And though I don't always agree with Zeke's Unique Perspectives, they are always a good read, unlike some of the long winded s**t others (Vic1) put up here.

My sense is that Shanahan is trying to do to many jobs himself. He hasn't really shown it, but I think he'd be a pretty good exec if that was his primary job. He'd be a better coach if that was his primary job. But having to do both AND have your kid on the staff? Seems like a flawed management structure to me.

Posted by: msrent | December 22, 2010 2:24 AM | Report abuse

And with that, I say good night to all RI peeps, HTTR

Posted by: msrent | December 22, 2010 2:27 AM | Report abuse

"Despite demotion, Donovan McNabb wants to come back"


Finally...someone who exhibits the traits of a glutton for punishment more than we Redskins fans do...

Say what you will about McNabb...dude is a class act to the bitter end. Just think of the foul things coming out of Jay Cutler's mouth if ever this happened to him...

Posted by: brownwood26 | December 22, 2010 5:13 AM | Report abuse

Anyone else see this?

Santana Moss is open to returning to Redskins
Posted by Gregg Rosenthal on December 21, 2010, 5:51 PM EST

After Washington’s Week 14 loss to the Bucs, Santana Moss sounded like a guy that was about done with his Redskins experience.

“I’m just getting tired of it,” Moss said. “Everybody play for their own perspective and their own reason, but I put too much in it and it means too much.”

Moss, now 31, is headed for unrestricted free agency. He’s having a solid campaign with 953 yards and six scores on a mediocre offense. While he may not break as many big plays as he used to, Moss looks like a guy that will age better than, say, his old doppelganger Laveranues Coles.

After another painful loss — this time to the Cowboys — Moss was asked by TBD.com’s Mike Jones whether he’d hesitate to return to the Redskins.

“Naw. No,” Moss replied. “Like I said I can only control what I can control and that’s play football. I want to play football. So if the team wants me here, I want to be here. I don’t go out looking. My mind isn’t on that anyway. My mind is on playing ball.”

Moss should get a solid deal when free agency starts next year. (If it starts next year.) He knows as well as anyone it’s never smart to take the Redskins out of the bidding.

Posted by: brownwood26 | December 22, 2010 5:29 AM | Report abuse

Studs and Duds: Redskins-Cowboys

By: John Keim


Studs

LB London Fletcher. It wasn’t just the goal-line stop, though that encompassed a lot of what makes Fletcher good. Plays like that are the ones any kid fantasizes about as a kid; leaping over the pile to make a stop. And when that play is made, there’s no thought about a team’s record or the direction they’re headed, it’s just pure joy. Pure effort; pure joy. That’s Fletcher. But he also blitzed in the fourth quarter, forcing Jon Kitna into a sack. Later, he took on pulling guard Leonard Davis, drove his right shoulder into him and came off to make the tackle. Fletcher had his miscues, but overall he played well.

QB Rex Grossman. Yes, he started poorly with a horrendous decision that led to an interception. Classic Rex, perhaps. But he also hadn’t started in two years and had only attempted seven passes this year. And, yes, his fumble led to another touchdown, though that resulted from pressure allowed by the line. Still, anyone out there think he’d throw four touchdown passes, two two-point conversions and nearly lead a win? Anyone? Me neither. He found a rhythm in the second half and delivered a near comeback. A couple things I liked: Grossman’s ability to hit receivers in stride -- even his misses were in front of receivers; and his footwork. Grossman kept an excellent base, which enabled him to move and still be accurate. On the five-yard touchdown pass to Chris Cooley, he had to move to his left, but his base was excellent and he found Cooley – his third or fourth option. The good base allowed him to make an accurate throw. No passes were bounced Sunday; drives were sustained. His last interception was the result of perhaps getting fooled a bit by the coverage or not getting enough air under the ball. Regardless, he had to force the throw because of the time remaining.

WR Anthony Armstrong. He posted his first 100-yard day, with five catches. Got open deep with just speed and a decent sell of a fake, leading to a 47-yard catch that would have been longer had Grossman not underthrown the pass. Armstrong also caught passes on slants and crosses, showing he’s not just a guy who can run post routes. Also liked his blocking, especially on the Ryan Torain screen pass that ended up a touchdown.

TE Chris Cooley. Not sure why they’re waiting to get him involved, but until he started catching passes he’d been doing a solid job blocking, particularly taking care of the ends/linebackers. They’d use him to stop backside pursuit and he wound up getting the better of DeMarcus Ware a couple times; just getting in his way is a help. But in the end, he finished with five catches for 62 yards, one touchdown and a two-point conversion. I like that Grossman found him in the red zone. Cooley made a nice catch on both of those plays, with each coming while tightly covered.

more...

Posted by: brownwood26 | December 22, 2010 5:33 AM | Report abuse

continued...

WR Santana Moss. I know he dropped a pass late, but he also caught eight passes for 72 yards and two touchdowns. He made a beautiful catch in the back of the end zone for one score and got inside the DB on a slant for another. Moss has become a gritty receiver, taking screens and trying to weave through traffic. It’s not an easy task. My other beef with him is his blocking. Don’t think it’s been that terrific; missed a couple Sunday and that would have helped on some runs. Seen that happen in other games, too.

RB Ryan Torain. Too bad they didn’t get him the ball a little more early on; I understand Dallas’ weakness is the secondary, but they were rather lopsided with their run-pass ratio. Still, when Torain got the ball he produced with 53 yards on 11 carries. He also had five catches for 48 yards, including a 19-yard screen for a touchdown and another screen for 20 yards. Torain had a couple of screw-you runs, including one where he barreled through tackles and ran over safety Alan Ball. He made a mistake in protection, it appeared, on one occasion going to the middle where his help wasn’t needed and allowing Orlando Scandrick to blitz off the Redskins’ right side for an easy sack. But another time Torain saved a sack when, after lining up eight yards deep, he had to cross Grossman’s face to pick up a linebacker blitzing between center and left guard. Torain barely got him, but it gave Grossman enough time to throw the ball away.

Duds

P Sam Paulescu. He should have been called for tripping; as it were, his punts were mostly bad. Of his four punts, one was a good one – a 45-yarder with no return because of its height. And it came from deep in Redskins territory, so that was good. But for the most part he had low loners and had a net average of 26.0.

CB DeAngelo Hall. His instincts are usually excellent, but they’ve failed him the past two games. Sunday, he went for an interception vs. Jason Witten, but it really didn’t look like he had a chance. Had he gone for the tackle, Witten would have been stopped short of a first down and Dallas would have kicked a field goal. Instead, he scored a touchdown. Now, Hall’s instincts are what make him a unique player, but when you swing and miss, you end up a dud. Just the way it is. Hall also missed a tackle on a smoke route, leading to first down on a catch and run. He did have a nice tackle on Witten later in the game.

more...

Posted by: brownwood26 | December 22, 2010 5:35 AM | Report abuse

continued...

FS Kareem Moore. I want to believe in Kareem Moore; and I think it’s funny looking back on it now how many people ripped Reed Doughty while subbing for him – and how they thought life would be grand once Moore entered the lineup. Hard to name a big play he’s made this season. Not everyone can be a playmaker and some of that comes with experience, but Moore continues to try and tackle everyone up around the shoulder pads and that leads to trouble. On Tashard Choice’s touchdown run, Moore came in too high and that led him to not get any power on his attempted tackle. A guard then hit him in the side (along with Andre Carter).

LG Kory Lichtensteiger. Thought he had a very good game vs. Tampa Bay, but that was not the case Sunday. Didn’t mark down many G’s (for good) next to his name in watching this one again. I’ll skip to the second half because that’s where a lot of his troubles occurred. He was shoved back by end Stephen Bowen on one play. Later, another lineman stunned him with a punch, then got inside. A play later, Bowen again won the battle as ‘Steiger put his head down on contact and Bowen went inside. On the next series he fell while pulling to his right. On the next series, Victor Butler blitzed a linebacker through his hole. Now, I haven’t asked him what happened on the play, but Butler, a linebacker, was standing right over him and ‘Steiger didn’t look at him first, instead initially turning to his right and then coming back. He didn’t block anyone and the ‘backer got through. His fault? Recognition? Anyway, there was already enough to land him on this side.

LB Lorenzo Alexander. Looks like Alexander is a bit tired and worn down from all the special teams duties. He does not look as spry in space as he did earlier this year. Can’t say that I blame him; that’s a heavy burden placed on him. Anyway, Alexander has not been as effective tackling in space lately and that was true Sunday. Missed a couple tackles in space. He did have a near tackle for a loss, but missed the ballcarrier in the backfield; he did force him up into a swarm of teammates. But it could have been a two-yard loss. Alexander had one good pressure on Kitna.

Nose Tackles. Anthony Bryant is an upgrade over Maake Kemoeatu, or at least has played a little better. But neither is anything more than a backup at this point. Bryant, when he plays lower, does OK. Other times he takes himself out of plays by getting too upright, as he did on a solid run right before the game-winning field goal. Of course, two plays earlier he did a nice job of holding his ground. Sort of how his day went. He had more G’s than Kemoeatu – Bryant seems to have more leg strength. But they both had a lot of B’s as well. Until the Redskins get the middle fixed, they’ll struggle to stop the run. In fairness, both did a good job in the goal-line stand of getting very low.

more...

Posted by: brownwood26 | December 22, 2010 5:37 AM | Report abuse

continued...

Half Stud-Half Dud

LT Trent Williams. Another guy who finished a heck of a lot better than he started. He allowed inside pressure to DeMarcus Ware in the first quarter and on the next series he played Bradie James to go wide. James went into him, then darted inside for pressure. In the third quarter, Ware got around him with speed. Williams reached for him, got off-balance and then fell. Ware wound up with a sack/fumble of Grossman. But after this play, Williams was pretty good the rest of the way. Stopped Ware every time they battled thereafter, even when the Cowboy linebacker tried a spin move. Didn’t faze Williams. Oops, another bad one: he opted to take a blitzing corner off the edge rather than block Ware on the slant touchdown pass to Moss. Now, the pass was complete, but Ware was nearly in the passing lane; not sure how someone lets him come through free and instead takes the corner. Still,

RG Will Montgomery. He has been consistent and in the few times he was matched vs. Jay Ratliff, he appeared to do just fine. Yes, he was pushed back a couple times, but not that many. And he threw a very nice block on the Torain touchdown catch, paving the screen (gotta give props to Casey Rabach, too, for a key block on Torain’s 20-yard catch). There was one time Montgomery got knocked back far enough that it affected Torain’s run. On Torain’s screw-you run, Montgomery took care of Ratliff (of course, the next play on a stretch to the left, Ratliff got through him). Ratliff also got him with a swim move on the last series. But overall Montgomery has made improvement.

Read more at the Washington Examiner: http://washingtonexaminer.com/blogs/nfl/2010/12/studs-and-duds-redskins-cowboys#ixzz18psEcrzp

Posted by: brownwood26 | December 22, 2010 5:39 AM | Report abuse

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