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Tony Pashos reaches agreement with Cleveland, after visiting Redskins

If there was any confusion Saturday night about whether tackle Tony Pashos was Washington-bound, there shouldn't be now. Pashos is signing with the Cleveland Browns, according to ESPN.com.

Pashos, a free agent from San Francisco, was in Ashburn on Friday and had dinner with Coach Mike Shanahan and offensive line coach Chris Foerster that night at Morton's Steakhouse. But the two sides couldn't hammer out a deal Saturday. Pashos's agent, in fact, characterized the talks as "nowhere near close."

"He left the building," agent Rick Smith said Saturday night. "He's headed to Cleveland right now."

According to the ESPN.com report, Pashos's contract with the Browns is a three-year deal for $10.3 million. Pashos might've seemed like a natural fit with the Redskins because of Foerster, his position coach in Baltimore and San Francisco.

Though the Redskins' have signed Artis Hicks, a versatile lineman from Minnesota, they still need to address their hole at left tackle. Pashos was brought in to discuss the right tackle slot, so it seems they might be looking for an upgrade there, as well.

By Rick Maese  |  March 7, 2010; 3:36 PM ET
Categories:  Free agency  
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Next: Casey Rabach takes on added responsibility as Redskins rebuild offensive line

Comments

WOW...

Too Frugal...

Posted by: WRBD | March 7, 2010 3:43 PM | Report abuse

Does anyone know what Levi Jones is asking for?

Posted by: p1funk | March 7, 2010 3:45 PM | Report abuse

Respect.

Too steep a price.

Posted by: Oogalaboogala | March 7, 2010 3:51 PM | Report abuse

10 milli for 3 years is cheap

Posted by: ATLredskin | March 7, 2010 3:54 PM | Report abuse

However re: the Pashos signing by Cleveland, frankly I am a little biffled.

Think we should've taken him at that price, at least for right side.

Posted by: Oogalaboogala | March 7, 2010 3:56 PM | Report abuse

Just because his POSITION coach is here does not mean that he was a fit here for the price he wanted.

Yes, he could have filled a need, but it is way too early to get out the pitch forks and light the torches because some older FAs did not get signed.

Until they give me reason not too, I will believe in this FO.

Posted by: Curzon417 | March 7, 2010 3:58 PM | Report abuse

This hurts - we aren't in a position to haggle over a million or two when addressed a huge position of need...$10 mill over 3 years seems like reasonable compensation for a starting RT in today's league (ie. we aren't talking Julius Peppers type money here).

Hope they aren't getting overconfident in their negotiating and putting themselves in a bad position come draft day.

Posted by: PDXskin | March 7, 2010 3:59 PM | Report abuse

Also keep in mind that Hicks could earn up to 9 mil, but will most likely earn below 5 mil of that. This may be the area that Bruce wanted Pasho's at and the Browns were willing to pay more.

Posted by: Curzon417 | March 7, 2010 4:01 PM | Report abuse

This hurts - we aren't in a position to haggle over a million or two when addressed a huge position of need...$10 mill over 3 years seems like reasonable compensation for a starting RT in today's league (ie. we aren't talking Julius Peppers type money here).

Hope they aren't getting overconfident in their negotiating and putting themselves in a bad position come draft day.

Posted by: PDXskin | March 7, 2010 3:59 PM | Report abuse
We finally have a good FO/coaching staff. Foerster should be the best judge of his abilities. Until I see some problems, I'm willing to go with their judgments.

Posted by: frediefritz | March 7, 2010 4:04 PM | Report abuse

it is way too early to get out the pitch forks and light the torches

Posted by: Curzon417
___________________________

Yes, everything about the new FO is now being called into question.

Posted by: Oogalaboogala | March 7, 2010 4:05 PM | Report abuse

Who cares?

The guy was a back up on a non playoff team. What if Heyer came to town and we let him slip away? Maybe we got lucky.

Posted by: edvar | March 7, 2010 4:08 PM | Report abuse

This hurts - we aren't in a position to haggle over a million or two when addressed a huge position of need...$10 mill over 3 years seems like reasonable compensation for a starting RT in today's league


Posted by: PDXskin

We're ABSOLUTELY in a position to haggle over money. Its about time. I want guys who want to win, not get the max $$. If a guy wants to play for Mangini instead of Shanahan, let him.

This front office has to be about value. That said, not sure how good Pashos is ... seems he signed for money right in between Rabach and Hicks.

If Pashos is a starting quality RT, then I'm not sure why we paid similar amounts to Rabach (older and marginal center) and Hicks (older and likely backup)

Posted by: zcezcest1 | March 7, 2010 4:08 PM | Report abuse

Just because his POSITION coach is here does not mean that he was a fit here for the price he wanted.

Yes, he could have filled a need, but it is way too early to get out the pitch forks and light the torches because some older FAs did not get signed.

Until they give me reason not too, I will believe in this FO.

Posted by: Curzon417 | March 7, 2010 3:58 PM

Exactly. Actually, the fact that his old position coach is here AND he isn't tells me something about him.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | March 7, 2010 4:13 PM | Report abuse

Pashos sucks. Teams don't let high quality tackles get away... Cleveland is his 3rd team in 3 years.

Smart move by Shannahallen.

Look, we're not going to be over .500 next year, we're BUILDING for the FUTURE.

We always say that we want the team to build, well, we got it, but we have to do our part and be patient. This is going to be borring and a little ugly for the next 2 years... but, chances are, it will be well worth the wait.

Posted by: jgarrisn | March 7, 2010 4:14 PM | Report abuse

They go from spending alot to not spending anything. It seems 10 mil over 3 years for a starter is not too much to spend.

Posted by: jmy999 | March 7, 2010 4:15 PM | Report abuse

They go from spending alot to not spending anything. It seems 10 mil over 3 years for a starter is not too much to spend.

Posted by: jmy999 | March 7, 2010 4:16 PM | Report abuse

We don't know what the Skins offered Pashos, but if it was anywhere close to what the Browns offered, then he's an idiot and we don't want him. I mean, picking the Browns over the Skins? I know, I know. The Skins haven't won a Super Bowl lately, but how long has it been since the Brownies have even made the playoffs? A winning season??

Posted by: Ireland2 | March 7, 2010 4:16 PM | Report abuse

Well they tried,,,,

I believe, Its going to take at a minimum 2 off-seasons to correct the O-line woes.

I could be wrong but I think its been at least 10 years since this team, drafted a 1st round O-lineman.

That being "Chris Samuels & Jansen, and Jansen sucked.

Posted by: dashriprock | March 7, 2010 4:16 PM | Report abuse

He was released by Jax last Fall. Albeit pending UFA et al.. But, nonetheless he was thought expendable by that franchise....so, possibly the Skins saw the same issue...whatever that may be? Maybe as simple as not worth the asking price?

Posted by: SkinsneedaGM | March 7, 2010 4:21 PM | Report abuse

If Pashos is a starting quality RT...

Posted by: zcezcest1 | March 7, 2010 4:08 PM

Is he? He appeared in five games for the 49ers last year and he started only one. Does that sound like a starter to you?

Posted by: League-Source | March 7, 2010 4:23 PM | Report abuse

That being "Chris Samuels & Jansen, and Jansen sucked.

Posted by: dashriprock | March 7, 2010 4:16 PM

Doubly wrong. Jansen was a second round pick. And, he was rock solid before he got hurt.

Posted by: League-Source | March 7, 2010 4:24 PM | Report abuse

One guy I would bring in is Fargas -- he's a short term solution, shouldn't be too expensive. He's always done more with less.

Shanahan knows the guy well since he played in the same division. His last 3 games playing against Shanahan, Fargas totaled 388 yards.

Fargas just turned 30, but has only about 900 career touches (low mileage) and has averaged 4.1 yards per carry in Oakland.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | March 7, 2010 4:26 PM | Report abuse

The Raiders said Fargas was realized due to a failed physical. He says he is fine. Redskins need to do their homework before even considering.

As for Pashos maybe he hasn't completely recovered from his injury or just wasn't a fit.

Posted by: lifelongfan | March 7, 2010 4:31 PM | Report abuse

This looks ridiculous. If this dude was worth bringing in and is likely a starter, why not give the dude a front loaded contract for the uncapped year and fill the need for some BS 3.5mil/year? If he can't play, cut him; it's just danny's money not a salary cap issue. I don't know all the details, but it seems like the FO may have screwed this one up unless they can find other FA oline out there because the draft is likely going to be use for other positions in rnds one and two.

Posted by: monkeymayonaise | March 7, 2010 4:38 PM | Report abuse

I wish they would trade landry for a second rounder and if things fall their way maybe they could get okung in the first and campbell in the second. They could resign smoot and play him at safety only.

Posted by: skinztattoo89 | March 7, 2010 4:40 PM | Report abuse

We're 3 days into free agency I have yet to discern a 'strategy' from Shanahan and Allen on who they want to sign, but I did get the memo.

We didn't pursue Dansby even though we could use an LB for a 3-4.
We didn't pursue Peppers who wants to play in a 3-4.
We didn't trade for Boldin, even though our roster contains only 1 WR that has ever had 400 receiving yards in a season
We didn't go after Van den Bosch, Dunta Robinson or Rolle or ANY of the pricier free agents, even those that could have filled a need.

The memo, for those who didn't get it, reads as follows:

To: NFL players
From: Redskins Management
Re: Getting paid
Date: March 2010

From this point forward, the Redskins are no longer the team you call to get paid big money.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | March 7, 2010 4:41 PM | Report abuse

I'm sure that the 1.7 mil that the Raiders owed Fargas this week had nothing to do with it.

Posted by: Curzon417 | March 7, 2010 4:41 PM | Report abuse

That being "Chris Samuels & Jansen, and Jansen sucked.

Posted by: dashriprock | March 7, 2010 4:16 PM

Jansen sucked?
dashiprock, quit posting until you know more about the team.

Posted by: monkeymayonaise | March 7, 2010 4:41 PM | Report abuse

Zcezcest1, we rarely agree, but I said the same thing about Fargas yesterday!

I love the revisionist history...Jansen sucked??? Yeah maybe after years of wear and injuries...but dude balled for like 7 years...was an excellent second round pick and a good redskin.

Posted by: chrislarry | March 7, 2010 4:42 PM | Report abuse

Some of you guys just don't get the message thats being sent here by Bruce & Mike do you?

This FA class is full of second tier players of similar abilities, wehy overpay the first - sorry - the third guy you bring in?

Pashos is solid, so is Jones, so is Gandy, so is Sims.......so is Hicks

Patience people patience

Posted by: PCinOz | March 7, 2010 4:45 PM | Report abuse

Some of you guys just don't get the message thats being sent here by Bruce & Mike do you?

This FA class is full of second tier players of similar abilities, why overpay the first - sorry - the third guy you bring in?

Pashos is solid, so is Jones, so is Gandy, so is Sims.......so is Hicks

Patience people patience

Posted by: PCinOz | March 7, 2010 4:45 PM | Report abuse

The memo, for those who didn't get it, reads as follows:

To: NFL players
From: Redskins Management
Re: Getting paid
Date: March 2010

From this point forward, the Redskins are no longer the team you call to get paid big money.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | March 7, 2010 4:41 PM |
=======================

Seems about right. But since the previous strategy has sjked for the entire term that Teh Owner has been here, maybe the new people deserve a chance to show what they can do.
~

Posted by: ifthethunderdontgetya | March 7, 2010 4:46 PM | Report abuse

Word on the memo.

Posted by: Curzon417 | March 7, 2010 4:47 PM | Report abuse

Seems to me that players are trying to use the Redskins to bosst thier salaries.

I'm glad that the new FO is not biting either!

"Is he? He appeared in five games for the 49ers last year and he started only one. Does that sound like a starter to you?"

Nope.

And I am sure that his former position coach is well aware of what he can do and not do, and that's why he left here withno contract. :P

I am all for not overpaying losers to play here anymore.

Great job new FO!

- Ray

Posted by: rmcazz | March 7, 2010 4:48 PM | Report abuse

If this dude was worth bringing in and is likely a starter, why not give the dude a front loaded contract for the uncapped year and fill the need for some BS 3.5mil/year? If he can't play, cut him; it's just danny's money not a salary cap issue. I don't know all the details...

Posted by: monkeymayonaise | March 7, 2010 4:38 PM

Details? You don't even know the vague outline.

The man was with San Francisco last year. He was injured and he missed 11 games. He played in five games. Of those five games, he only started one game. His position coach in San Francisco is now with the Redskins. He has seen Pashos play. Have you?

"Likely a starter?" Not in San Francisco. Not in Washington. Cleveland? Maybe.

Posted by: League-Source | March 7, 2010 4:50 PM | Report abuse

Some of you guys just don't get the message thats being sent here by Bruce & Mike do you?

This FA class is full of second tier players of similar abilities, wehy overpay the first - sorry - the third guy you bring in?

Pashos is solid, so is Jones, so is Gandy, so is Sims.......so is Hicks

Patience people patience
Posted by: PCinOz | March 7, 2010 4:45 PM

Yeah...ur probably right. I am convinced that O line is a FA task largely (for now), because the draft will yield greater long-term value for us if we draft other positions with our 1 and 2 rnd pcks. So missing opportunities to get oline in FA seems frustrating initially.


Posted by: monkeymayonaise | March 7, 2010 4:51 PM | Report abuse

The Raiders said Fargas was realized due to a failed physical. He says he is fine. Redskins need to do their homework before even considering.


Posted by: lifelongfan

Fargas was due a roster bonus of $1.7million -- and got cut before he was going to get paid. The Raiders still have RBs Michael Bush and Darren McFadden -- and they paid McFadden big money -- he was the 4th pick in 2008.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2010/03/07/SPQA1CC2E2.DTL

The Skins need to do their homework with any FA, but I wouldn't believe what Raider mgmt says -- about anything!!

Posted by: zcezcest1 | March 7, 2010 4:52 PM | Report abuse

Zcezcest1, we rarely agree, but I said the same thing about Fargas yesterday!

I love the revisionist history...Jansen sucked??? Yeah maybe after years of wear and injuries...but dude balled for like 7 years...was an excellent second round pick and a good redskin.

Posted by: chrislarry | March 7, 2010 4:42 PM |

I think it was more like 5 years but the song remains the same. He was high quality for some time and then injuries caught him. What makes me laugh is the fools that keep saying 10 million isnt too much to pay for a starter when referring to Pashos.
1) 10 mil isn't too much to pay for a starter 2) Pashos is not a starter anywhere except here. What this says to me is that we will be happy to draft a starter or wait for a quality one rather than just grab a guy because he's there. At least Hicks can play a bunch of positions.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | March 7, 2010 4:53 PM | Report abuse

So missing opportunities to get oline in FA seems frustrating initially.

Posted by: monkeymayonaise | March 7, 2010 4:51 PM

That would be. But Pashos wasn't an opportunity.

Posted by: League-Source | March 7, 2010 4:53 PM | Report abuse

Rumor has it we may look at Barry Sims. No visit scheduled as of yet.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | March 7, 2010 4:55 PM | Report abuse

Details? You don't even know the vague outline.

The man was with San Francisco last year. He was injured and he missed 11 games. He played in five games. Of those five games, he only started one game. His position coach in San Francisco is now with the Redskins. He has seen Pashos play. Have you?

"Likely a starter?" Not in San Francisco. Not in Washington. Cleveland? Maybe.

Posted by: League-Source | March 7, 2010 4:50 PM

Yes...this is why I said if he is likely a starter. Are we bringing in back-ups primarily? Seems like we are flush with potential backups. He got injured agreed, but apparently is worth bringing in.

I'm just hopeful we don't let "gunshy" screw up our opportunities to have the leverage to get good value players instead of being force to draft for an immediate need.

Posted by: monkeymayonaise | March 7, 2010 4:56 PM | Report abuse

Yes...this is why I said if he is likely a starter. Are we bringing in back-ups primarily? Seems like we are flush with potential backups. He got injured agreed, but apparently is worth bringing in.

I'm just hopeful we don't let "gunshy" screw up our opportunities to have the leverage to get good value players instead of being force to draft for an immediate need.

Posted by: monkeymayonaise | March 7, 2010 4:56 PM

Tell us what available starters you think are out there. I bet we'd bring 'em in if they were there. Name 'em.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | March 7, 2010 4:58 PM | Report abuse

Are we bringing in back-ups primarily? Seems like we are flush with potential backups.

Posted by: monkeymayonaise | March 7, 2010 4:56 PM

Take a look at the talent available as unrestricted free agent OL. They're mostly over 30 (you have to be in the league six years to be unrestricted) and some were starters once, but won't be next year.

Some of our "potential backups" were starters last year and weren't getting it done. So, yeah, we're bringing in competition in an attempt to upgrade.

Posted by: League-Source | March 7, 2010 5:04 PM | Report abuse

Here's a list of the better UFA OL still available

Offensive Tackle
Mike Gandy (Arz)
Barry Sims (SF)
Levi Jones (Was)
Mark Tauscher (GB)

Offensive Guard
Chester Pitts (Hou)
Bobbie Williams (Cin)
Keydrick Vincent (Car)
Jeremy Bridges (Arz)
Maurice WIlliams (Jax)
Montrae Holland (Dal)
Ben Hamilton (Den)
Ray Hadenot (Cle)

Offensive Center
Kevin Mawae (Ten)
Casey Wiegmann (Den)

Posted by: PCinOz | March 7, 2010 5:06 PM | Report abuse

All we are looking for is a solid pro group heading into the draft.

Posted by: PCinOz | March 7, 2010 5:09 PM | Report abuse

Maybe I did get a little over-excited about Pashos...although I'd say his former line coach wouldn't have bothered to bring him in if he didn't think he was worth considering.

Our line is just so bad/non-existant right now, I'm kind of desperate to see them address it with some FA signings (even just "average joes") so we at least have our options open going into the draft.

O.k., taking a deep breath and keeping my fingers crossed for more progress in fortifying the line in the days ahead. To switch topics, is there any word out there regarding what Darren Sharper is doing? Are we going to take a look at him?

Posted by: PDXskin | March 7, 2010 5:12 PM | Report abuse

Turn that frown upside down people. The Skins might be able to get Barry Simms who can play RT. He's 35 but couple provide a one year stopgap, The beauty with the Hicks signing is that he can play RT as well. There are some interesting RG prospects still out there. Montreal Holland played for Shanny. Two former Denver players (Hamilton, Hochsten (sp)) are UFA. Hadnot is a possibility. Then there is Rob Simms who is a RG that is on the come and available as a RFA for a 4th round pick. Several options are still available any of which can be a cheaper alternative to compete with BMW.

Posted by: TWISI | March 7, 2010 5:13 PM | Report abuse

What's your best guess, Cork? Coach wouldn't put him on the field because he didn't know the playbook? He overslept practice one morning and was being punished? He was out of shape?

Doesn't really matter, does it? He could have started at three different positions for the Redskins last year. And, let's hope he doesn't start at any positions this year.

Posted by: League-Source |

It only matters if the Redskins are looking to improve the OL to the point they contend for a SB. Plugging in non-starters and other team's castoffs, is no way to build IMO.

Unless, of course, they actually plan for him to be a backup and are gonna get someone better, or he's better than Minny thought.

But even he appears to be the Redskins third choice for an OL free agent, behind Clinfton and Pashos.

Posted by: TheCork | March 7, 2010 5:13 PM | Report abuse

Tell us what available starters you think are out there. I bet we'd bring 'em in if they were there. Name 'em.

Posted by: scampbell1975

Good point. It's more like starters for us.. not for teams with good Olines. We may have to be practical about getting adequate people in the 2nd tier rather than picking a longterm stud to be Samuel's replacement in the draft.

This is perhaps the part of the overall strategy I think the team must be taking. Criteria being:
We got the forth overall pick and huge needs shorterm. If shanallen is/are horney for a franchise qb (like Clausen for instance), this may be our only opportunity for years to get someone we are convinced can be a franchise qb; we probably won't be picking 4th next year.

We are in an uncapped year. Frontloading contracts is salary-cap-free pay for this year. So a strategy may be to get people in here with danny's money and see who can play, if they don't work out, cut them. He has the cash and has been screwing us for years...so fukc him.

Maybe pashos ain't it...but missed opportunities always hurt, especially when ur rebuilding.

Posted by: monkeymayonaise | March 7, 2010 5:16 PM | Report abuse

Jeremy Bridgers did a pretty good job at tackle in some of the games I watched. Would not mind another chance to see him in camp this year.

Posted by: Curzon417 | March 7, 2010 5:16 PM | Report abuse

Some of you guys are proving that you'd be no better than Snyder if you were running the team.

Whining over lost free agents who are no better than Stephon Heyer who at least has a bit of upside. Why should we play millions to a guy who wasn't a starter and is old! We shouldn't, that's what. Better a 7th rounder with upside than old and busted for too much money.

Posted by: lordtwang | March 7, 2010 5:16 PM | Report abuse

Hochstein resigned with Denver.

Barry Sims can also play LT.

Again the guys I listed are all similar in ability so they won't be rushing to sign and overpay any one of them.

We have'nt even gotten to trades yet.

Posted by: PCinOz | March 7, 2010 5:17 PM | Report abuse

I'll say this.............

If Shanny and Foerster didn't think that Heyer or BMW didn't have upside they would never have tendered/resigned them.

Think about it.

Posted by: PCinOz | March 7, 2010 5:19 PM | Report abuse

I don't know what people are complaining about. Yes we have only signed one guy this FA butit was a signing that addressed a huge need.

The FO is not going to fix this team in one year. Draft Okung, the best Oline available at 37 and have fun with the rest of the picks that probably won't make the team. I'd personally like to see a young RB in the 4th.

If they aren't signing every linemen that comes to visit that is fine with me. Take your time and do it right. 11 years of this crap is enough.

Posted by: Buckleycj | March 7, 2010 5:22 PM | Report abuse

I'm willing to give the FO time to play this out their way. I'm sure they have done their due diligence on Pathos. I just hope they're not reading all of the good press about how great they are for being conservative. If I were in their position, I would never look at a paper, less it might subconsciously influence me.

Posted by: elderdave1 | March 7, 2010 5:23 PM | Report abuse

A wise man once told me that there are 3 kinds of putty - good, better and best.

Using that analogy for our Oline

best (lt) and 4 goods is worse than 5 better. 1st rd Oline peeps are not necessarily a recipe for greatness. Great teams can have 2nd, 3rd, 4th rd types that work like a smooth oiled machine and get to the promised land just as quick.

Why are so many wanting to open the bank for some of these players? The "WTF" is danny doing in the past has got us to where we are today - in the pits.

I love what they are doing so far.

Peeps who say you can find stars at QB much later in the draft, referencing Brady forget you have to have a winner to begin with. He only got the chance because of injury. Plus getting someone like him that late it like hitting the lottery.

Just saying folks, calm down. This is uncharted territory for the Skins and I for one welcome it.

Posted by: HPYTRKR1 | March 7, 2010 5:24 PM | Report abuse

I'm willing to give the FO time to play this out their way. I'm sure they have done their due diligence on Pathos. I just hope they're not reading all of the good press about how great they are for being conservative. If I were in their position, I would never look at a paper, less it might subconsciously influence me.

Posted by: elderdave1 | March 7, 2010 5:23 PM

Heheheheh, yeah.

Posted by: monkeymayonaise | March 7, 2010 5:26 PM | Report abuse

"Is he? [Pashos] appeared in five games for the 49ers last year and he started only one. Does that sound like a starter to you?Posted by: League-Source"

It really doesn't. And neither did Chad Clifton except as a stopgap. Nor does the NT they're supposedly talking with.

or Hicks, for that matter.

Posted by: Samson151 | March 7, 2010 5:26 PM | Report abuse

it is way too early to get out the pitch forks and light the torches

Posted by: Curzon417
___________________________

Yes, everything about the new FO is now being called into question.

Posted by: Oogalaboogala

Not by me, Ooga, Obviously they have a long way to go before despair sets in. This is just a first reading of entrails and tea leaves, and admittedly not an impressive start, tho. And face itm, a blog is for early panic, pollyanna hopes and everything in between.

Still, unlike the last suits, at least Shanahan and Allen have a track record to keep hopes high.

Posted by: TheCork | March 7, 2010 5:26 PM | Report abuse

Jeremy Bridgers did a pretty good job at tackle in some of the games I watched. Would not mind another chance to see him in camp this year.

Posted by: Curzon417 | March 7, 2010 5:16 PM

Pretty sure he was starting in Arizona in the playoofs. Maybe I'm wrong.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | March 7, 2010 5:28 PM | Report abuse

In an uncapped year, THERE'S NO REASON TO UNDERBID. I couldn't be more unimpressed with this crew. Pile it all into guaranteed paragraph 5 salary in 2010 so that THERE'S NO CAP EFFECT, and sign these guys for depth.

I've been frustrated about Skins management before, but never as frustrated with them as I am now. When your neurosis can finally be a strength, they fold up the wallet? INSANE.

Posted by: WorstSeat | March 7, 2010 5:33 PM | Report abuse

Pretty sure losing the off season gets you the same prize as winning the off season. And that nothing. At least this way were not seen as the overpaying joke franchise anymore.

Posted by: mack1 | March 7, 2010 5:39 PM | Report abuse

We didn't pursue Peppers who wants to play in a 3-4.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | March 7, 2010 4:41 PM

Agree with the memo.

RE: Peppers
It's funny how he said he wanted to play in a 3-4 and ended up with Chicago who runs a 4-3 on day 1 of FA. He was only interested in the biggest contract, not a particular formation.

Posted by: Diesel44 | March 7, 2010 5:40 PM | Report abuse

A wise man once told me that there are 3 kinds of putty - good, better and best.


Posted by: HPYTRKR1

How wise could he be if he didn't mention the most famous putty of all, Silly Putty.

Posted by: TheCork | March 7, 2010 5:43 PM | Report abuse

In an uncapped year, THERE'S NO REASON TO UNDERBID. I couldn't be more unimpressed with this crew. Pile it all into guaranteed paragraph 5 salary in 2010 so that THERE'S NO CAP EFFECT, and sign these guys for depth.

I've been frustrated about Skins management before, but never as frustrated with them as I am now. When your neurosis can finally be a strength, they fold up the wallet? INSANE.

Posted by: WorstSeat | March 7, 2010 5:33 PM

Absolutely fukcing exactly. We don't want to spend like we used to, but doing the opposite isn't the answer-especially in an uncapped year and in our position; FRONTLOAD, theyll take the money.
Just don't screw up 2011 will overpaying FA's with expensive constracts for that year, and lock-up shorterm needs with available FAs this year.
I don't love the qb class this year, but if shanny thinks one is a franchise qb, we would be stupid not to take him while the got the 4th overall.

Posted by: monkeymayonaise | March 7, 2010 5:44 PM | Report abuse

Guys, these Chefs knows how to shop and cook, if you pay proper attention to what Bruce and Allen had been saying, you will notice they both preach acquiring players through the draft, within, and through free agency. Now, if the players we have within has potential or have skills set close to the equivalent player in the free agency, I would rather think its wise to keep the player within to allow them to grow; there is a reason we drafted those players. Look, the unwanted players on our roster has already been purged. Replacing them and acquiring offensive line is the main task, and I belief, it is achievable.

Posted by: abxinc | March 7, 2010 5:53 PM | Report abuse

Jeremy Bridgers did a pretty good job at tackle in some of the games I watched. Would not mind another chance to see him in camp this year.

Posted by: Curzon417 | March 7, 2010 5:16 PM

Jeremy Bridges is a guard who was forced into duty at tackle. No one considers him a starter at tackle, and bleacher report doesn't even list him in their top five guards.

Posted by: League-Source | March 7, 2010 5:53 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: WorstSeat | March 7, 2010 5:33 PM

You don't rebuild with 30+ year old journeymen lineman. This is a 2-3 year process. You might be able to see this if you didn't always sit in the WorstSeat.

The rules prevent you from heavily weighting a contract for 2010. No need to overspend for guys that won't be on the roster in 2012 but their contract will.

Posted by: Diesel44 | March 7, 2010 5:54 PM | Report abuse

Plus who's out there who's worth overspending on? The only legitimate starting LT was Chad Clifton, and he's 35 years old.

Posted by: League-Source | March 7, 2010 5:57 PM | Report abuse

Bleacher Report on Tony Pashos (their #5 UFA at guard) and Jeremy Bridges:

Tony Pashos, San Francisco 49ers

Pashos has actually seen starting time at tackle in recent years, but he's over-matched at the position and really doesn't have any business starting outside.

He does make for a strong backup lineman, however, with experience at guard and tackle and the ability to be a serviceable fill-in on the inside.


* Jeremy Bridges, Arizona Cardinals — Bridges held his own one-on-one against Jared Allen in 2009, but is overall a weak tackle and average guard. He's best suited for a sixth lineman job as someone that can play all across the line.

Posted by: League-Source | March 7, 2010 6:00 PM | Report abuse

WorstSeat, how can you be more frustrated when the other way of doing things led to losing and embarrassment?

Do some research on these guys they turned down and you'll understand why they weren't worth what they wanted.

Posted by: lordtwang | March 7, 2010 6:01 PM | Report abuse

Cork I was doing my imitation of tweety bird, but that was a good one. lmbo

Posted by: HPYTRKR1 | March 7, 2010 6:03 PM | Report abuse

* Jeremy Bridges, Arizona Cardinals — Bridges held his own one-on-one against Jared Allen in 2009, but is overall a weak tackle and average guard. He's best suited for a sixth lineman job as someone that can play all across the line.

Posted by: League-Source | March 7, 2010 6:00 PM

Which is why I would not mind seeing him brought in to camp again this year. He would fit the same way Hicks fits. Both as a quality back up at multiple positions and $ wise.

Posted by: Curzon417 | March 7, 2010 6:04 PM | Report abuse

My guess is they were looking at Pashos as a backup and wanted to pay him similar money to Hicks - and given Pashos' actual history there's nothing to say that's an incorrect perspective to take.

Bruce + Mike are not dumb - they'll look at what they can get from free agency that fits their plan / system. Whatever they can't get they'll plan the draft around.

I think it would be a mistake to assume that the lack of big free agent signings so far is indicative of a lack of action on the FO's part or being overly frugal.

Posted by: mac2j | March 7, 2010 6:06 PM | Report abuse

"Here's a list of the better UFA OL still available

Offensive Tackle
Mike Gandy (Arz)
Barry Sims (SF)
Levi Jones (Was)
Mark Tauscher (GB)

Offensive Guard
Chester Pitts (Hou)
Bobbie Williams (Cin)
Keydrick Vincent (Car)
Jeremy Bridges (Arz)
Maurice WIlliams (Jax)
Montrae Holland (Dal)
Ben Hamilton (Den)
Ray Hadenot (Cle)"

That list right there is the problem.

Posted by: Samson151 | March 7, 2010 6:08 PM | Report abuse

Absolutely fukcing exactly. We don't want to spend like we used to, but doing the opposite isn't the answer-especially in an uncapped year and in our position; FRONTLOAD, theyll take the money.
Posted by: monkeymayonaise | March 7, 2010 ____________________________
We have the guys previous position coach, maybe he had something to say about the value of this guy... or maybe, they value another player at that type of coin... or there is a character issue... Let's just see how it all (FA & Draft) plays out. For once we're being discreet/cautious and it's a good thing.


Posted by: tony325 | March 7, 2010 6:13 PM | Report abuse

hicks is better than pashos and plays more positions. I see wash. signing 1 more veteran o-lineman and going after a LT in the first round (if they can draft down they can get a RT in the 4th or 5th rd). don't be surprised if hicks starts at RT and m. williams starts(if he can stay healthy)at RG. rinehart, e.williams ,the player they bought in G/C formerly of denver,w.robinson and heyer,oldenburg will be given another chance to make the roster,the key player will be the new LT he must START this season.

Posted by: wathu19 | March 7, 2010 6:17 PM | Report abuse

"Seems about right. But since the previous strategy has sjked for the entire term that Teh Owner has been here, maybe the new people deserve a chance to show what they can do."


`
tehy certainly do. lets hope they draft an LT or trade out.

oh, but the team was sucking b4 Snyder took over as well and we'll continue to suck or be avg. until we find a consistent QB.

Posted by: Vicc | March 7, 2010 6:30 PM | Report abuse

I do hope some of the young WR's flourish under Shanahan. Giants have a really good tandem now at safety with Rolle and Robbins. We seem to never beat them anymore. Dallas, is well, Dallas, we'll beat them when we shouldn't and lose when we shouldn't. Eagles, may be on the decline, but depends on the QB IMO.

Our O, beyond the O-line(obvious) isn't scary for our division opponents.

Posted by: 1965skinsfan | March 7, 2010 6:31 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: 1965skinsfan March 7, 2010 6:31 PM


I'll put my lack of reputation on the line here and remember who you heard it from:

Devin Thomas will flourish in Mike S. system.

Posted by: Vicc | March 7, 2010 6:37 PM | Report abuse

It seems pretty clear they are going to draft offensive tackles in this very tackle deep draft. Where and when, depending on trade,s doesn't matter. It seems pretty clear that is their intent.

Posted by: periculum | March 7, 2010 6:40 PM | Report abuse

Next year's draft is better for quarterbacks. Its better to wait, give Campbell another year and sign another veteran if they can.

Posted by: periculum | March 7, 2010 6:41 PM | Report abuse

So will MK12

Posted by: SkinsfaninKaneohe | March 7, 2010 6:42 PM | Report abuse

Campbell has improved every year he has been in the league. If not a starter he is almost certainly a better than average backup. The line has to come first. It has too many holes. Quarterback does not.

Posted by: periculum | March 7, 2010 6:43 PM | Report abuse

The Redskins had a very very good O-line from 2003-2007

Made the playoffs in 04-05 when Brunell had one of his best seasons as a Pro. And Clinton came on for the final 5 game stretch

Made the playoffs in 07-08 when Collins had to have a perfect 4-game stretch coupled with another Clinton final 4 game burst

2006 was gonna be a great year before Clinton got hurt and even played hurt...had 7tds in 8games b4 he went IR that year.

Posted by: Vicc | March 7, 2010 6:48 PM | Report abuse

Campbell has improved every year he has been in the league. If not a starter he is almost certainly a better than average backup. The line has to come first. It has too many holes. Quarterback does not.

Posted by: periculum | March 7, 2010 6:43 PM
==========================================================================
Not true at all... 4th Quarter stats (situational) are near bottom in the league. And much worse than last year.
When the game is on the line.... he goes in the opposite direction... steps down, not up.
If anyone watched the games last year.. you dont need to look at the stats to know this (but you can find them at NFL.Com). Sad thing is.. even his mop up stats (2/3rds of the season) didnt save him from a 61.0 overall QB rating in the last seven minutes of the games.
Maybe this is why, so far, no one wants to give up a First for him.. And Skins dont want to extend his Contract.
You would think a 5 year experienced NFL QB vet, originially selected in the First round would attract at least the same if he really did improve every year.. ??
Obviously not.

Posted by: cliftonbiz | March 7, 2010 7:00 PM | Report abuse

So will MK12

Posted by: SkinsfaninKaneohe

`

Hope so

can't be sure about him. he can't seem to get separation and everytime we throw a lob to him, MK seems to land outta bounce..while only catching the pass..what? 30% of the time?

Posted by: Vicc | March 7, 2010 7:02 PM | Report abuse

1st Okung
2nd Fox, OT from Miami (can play left or right)

I hate Miami but this guy can play

Posted by: photoassign | March 7, 2010 7:04 PM | Report abuse

Which is why I would not mind seeing him brought in to camp again this year. He would fit the same way Hicks fits. Both as a quality back up at multiple positions and $ wise.

Posted by: Curzon417 | March 7, 2010 6:04 PM

I don't think so. We just hired Hicks. That job is taken.

Posted by: League-Source | March 7, 2010 7:10 PM | Report abuse

It's a long offseason...

Let's be patient!

Posted by: rickyroge | March 7, 2010 7:22 PM | Report abuse

That job is taken.

Posted by: League-Source | March 7, 2010 7:10 PM |

Well if the Skins only have one position for a versatile back-up OL that plays multiple positions and not very expensive, then yeah, I guess your right.

Posted by: Curzon417 | March 7, 2010 7:29 PM | Report abuse

Maybe this is why, so far, no one wants to give up a First for him.. And Skins dont want to extend his Contract.
You would think a 5 year experienced NFL QB vet, originially selected in the First round would attract at least the same if he really did improve every year.. ??
Obviously not.

Posted by: cliftonbiz | March 7, 2010 7:00pm
}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}


Stop the JC hating. 4-21 lifetime against the NFC East....lets keep him!!
When he last had an above average OLine, in 2007 before he was injured, he was 5-7 W-L including 0-2 in the NFC East.

With an improved line in 2010, he'll be the same percentage... 7-9 W-L and most likely 1-7 in the NFC East (one NFC East win probably be the Gints at home).

If he Starts?... I have to believe if he doesnt show a command of the Shanahan playbook during preseason, it will be a different QB opening the 2010 season. Saunders/Gibbs and Zorn were patient because of the large investment in JC.. Shanny wont care..
If JC doesnt "get it"..most likely a vet QB familiar with Mike or Kyle's playbook wiil be signed. They're out there.. Grossman, Orton, even Cutler?? Or really dive head first in the cast off bin.... Patrick Ramsey, Brian Griese..Jake Plummer..(wherever they are???) Then a QB in the 2011 Draft?
You nevah know.

Posted by: SkinsneedaGM | March 7, 2010 7:32 PM | Report abuse

In an uncapped year, THERE'S NO REASON TO UNDERBID. I couldn't be more unimpressed with this crew. Pile it all into guaranteed paragraph 5 salary in 2010 so that THERE'S NO CAP EFFECT, and sign these guys for depth.

I've been frustrated about Skins management before, but never as frustrated with them as I am now. When your neurosis can finally be a strength, they fold up the wallet? INSANE.

Posted by: WorstSeat | March 7, 2010 5:33 PM

This may be the most assinine comment I've seen on here in a while. Let's sign a bunch of nobody's and has beens because THIS YEAR there's no effect. Then, if next year the cap comes back, we're screwed again with a bunch of 30 plus players that ain't worth a crap.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | March 7, 2010 7:35 PM | Report abuse

When he last had an above average OLine, in 2007 before he was injured, he was 5-7 W-L including 0-2 in the NFC East.
Posted by: SkinsneedaGM | March 7, 2010 7:32 PM |

The O line sucekd in 2007 too.

Posted by: photoassign | March 7, 2010 7:41 PM | Report abuse

SkinsneedaGM-

Is it tough juggling your 3 other handles...You know Cliftonbiz, Vic1, MrRedskin21.

What's your solution? You want to just dump him or would you like to keep him for one more year and address the 5-8 more pressing personnel needs.
.

Posted by: Diesel44 | March 7, 2010 7:42 PM | Report abuse

Not saying JC-17 is the long term answer. Saying the team has bigger problems then having an average QB. Let's get the O line set. Let's Get the D line set. Let's get RB figured out, Let's get a friggen CORNER already.

All of those make JC a better QB this year, and create a great opportunity for the QB we get next year to succeed.

Posted by: edvar | March 7, 2010 7:42 PM | Report abuse

The new CBA will be veteran friendly.

With a rookie salary cap, the NFL will see more proven veterans receive that 30 million signing bonus versus say a Jamarcus Russell.

Rookie deals will be shortened to 2-4 year contracts.

So a team like the Raiders or Browns will not be cruelly and unusually punished--salary cap wise--for missing on a top 5 prospect.

Posted by: Vicc | March 7, 2010 7:45 PM | Report abuse

WOW...For those who are complaining about the lack our own bad UFA signings...

Kampman cashes in

Posted by Mike Florio on March 7, 2010 7:39 PM ET

So much for a torn ACL and a subpar season before the injury.

Defensive end turned linebacker turned defensive end Aaron Kampman will earn big money in Jacksonville.

Michael C.Wright of the Florida Times-Union reports that Kampman inked a four-year deal worth $26 million, with $11 million guaranteed.

As Kevin Seifert of ESPN.com points out, the deal matches the package received by new Lions defensive end Kyle Vanden Bosch.

Posted by: Diesel44 | March 7, 2010 7:46 PM | Report abuse

Wow, my head is reeling. We went from spend thrifts to tight wads all in one season...

Seriously, though, I think they are doing the right thing. Pashos was going to be a right tackle which commands far less on the market. I am sure Holmgren smiled when he realized he outbid the Redskins for the player.

Posted by: RedSkinHead | March 7, 2010 7:48 PM | Report abuse

Cornerbacks often develop. It's more a rarity to see a Corner come in off the jump and play at a high level.

I wouldn't say Corner is a need for us until we give our youngins more time.

Many Corners reach their peaks sometime after the age of 25 and continue playing strong well into their 30's

Posted by: Vicc | March 7, 2010 7:48 PM | Report abuse

If Jason Campbell and Carlos Rogers were unrestricted FAs, they'd ah been scooped by now.

Posted by: Vicc | March 7, 2010 7:52 PM | Report abuse

If Jason Campbell and Carlos Rogers were unrestricted FAs, they'd ah been scooped by now.

Posted by: Vicc | March 7, 2010 7:52 PM

Oh yeah! Sure!

Mediocre QB's and dumbazz CB's who can't catch have been flying off the board. Good observation.

Posted by: edvar | March 7, 2010 7:59 PM | Report abuse

one mans trash is another edvars jewel

Posted by: Vicc | March 7, 2010 8:04 PM | Report abuse

Does anyone know what Levi Jones is asking for?

Posted by: p1funk | March 7, 2010 3:45 PM | Report abuse

Too much whatever it is.

Posted by: glawrence007 | March 7, 2010 8:05 PM | Report abuse

edvar-

Is it tough juggling your 3 other handles...You know Diesel44, Curzon417, SkinsfaninKaneohe.

What's your solution? You want to keep him for one more year and usher in a new O era with a lame duck QB? Good luck with that dude.

Posted by: ArcticCat | March 7, 2010 8:06 PM | Report abuse

Oh C'mon! You can't hang out a statement like:

"If Jason Campbell and Carlos Rogers were unrestricted FAs, they'd ah been scooped by now."

...and not expect a little fun coming back your way.

Cat - if you read this post more than once you'd know my position already...

Posted by: edvar | March 7, 2010 8:12 PM | Report abuse

It's just not a good offseason of UFAs...

...Just face it...

..2 year Rebuild.....3 if we don't get a QB until next year...

Posted by: 4thFloor | March 7, 2010 8:16 PM | Report abuse

It's just not a good offseason of UFAs...

Posted by: 4thFloor | March 7, 2010 8:16 PM |

Could be of mufas though.

Posted by: ArcticCat | March 7, 2010 8:23 PM | Report abuse

edvar

you're right.. :)

"If Jason Campbell and Carlos Rogers were unrestricted FAs, they'd ah been scooped by now."

I truely feel that way though.
b/c
there are still a bunch of nuts(RI posters and NFL teams) out there who feel like you can win in the NFL with JC17 at qb. *chuckle*

Posted by: Vicc | March 7, 2010 8:24 PM | Report abuse

"Not true at all... 4th Quarter stats (situational) are near bottom in the league. And much worse than last year....Sad thing is.. even his mop up stats (2/3rds of the season) didnt save him from a 61.0 overall QB rating in the last seven minutes of the games."

this argument would be more persuasive if the games were only seven minutes long. But there are too many variables involved to condemn a quarterback based on the last half of the last quarter. I'm not saying Jason is a great comeback QB; he isn't. But QB rating is a flawed measure in the first place, and looking at less than 15% of minutes played doesn't improve it any.

A coach might look at such a measure as part of a larger analysis of offensive performance over a particular stretch of games, but as an overall measure to judge the quality of a quarterback's play, it's not very helpful.

Posted by: Samson151 | March 7, 2010 8:25 PM | Report abuse

It seems as though the JC17 defenders and bashers are finding more middle ground.

Since rebuilding takes more than a year, take a tackle in a tackle heavy draft this year and a qb in a qb heavy draft next year.

i can't wait until the 'Skins begin winning again. JC17 defenders will claim it is b/c we stacked our O-line this year and JC17 bashers will claim it is b/c we found our franchise qb next year.

Posted by: Vicc | March 7, 2010 8:30 PM | Report abuse

""If Jason Campbell and Carlos Rogers were unrestricted FAs, they'd ah been scooped by now."

They might well have been, but that's more a reflection of the available FA class than an endorsement of Campbell and Rogers.

Some of these signings to date are pretty odd. Dansby by the Dolphins to play inside LB? That's a lot of money to pay for somebody who plays that particular position. Julius Peppers is a quality player but if we think Albert has motivation problems, wait til you see Julius with his hand on the turf.

About the trades: the Jets might have scored with Cromartie, but they gave up a fair amount too. They're obviously hoping to have two shutdown corners so maybe even Vern Gholston can get to the QB.

Posted by: Samson151 | March 7, 2010 8:32 PM | Report abuse

Seems to me that the big issue right now is that, with the change in UFA/RFA patterns and the uncapped year, it's pretty hard to figure out if the price you're paying is the right price. For teams that aren't under the gun to "DO SOMETHING!", I think it makes sense to stand on the sidelines and see what happens after the initial surge of bidding takes place.
If we finish the season "one Tony Pashos away from the playoffs", I'll pour the first round.

Posted by: daggar | March 7, 2010 8:33 PM | Report abuse

It seems as though the JC17 defenders and bashers are finding more middle ground.

Since rebuilding takes more than a year, take a tackle in a tackle heavy draft this year and a qb in a qb heavy draft next year.

i can't wait until the 'Skins begin winning again. JC17 defenders will claim it is b/c we stacked our O-line this year and JC17 bashers will claim it is b/c we found our franchise qb next year.

Posted by: Vicc | March 7, 2010 8:30 PM |

When in fact it will be a combination of the 2. I've got to say this though, JC is the best of the horrible quarterbacks we have drafted over the last umpteen years.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | March 7, 2010 8:33 PM | Report abuse

didnt save him from a 61.0 overall QB rating in the last seven minutes of the games."

Posted by: Samson151 | March 7, 2010 8:25 PM |

Stat looks a little suspic. Why 7 min? If last half of last qtr then should be 7.5 min. But we don't need no stats to tell us that Camp ain't one of them proverb strong finishers. Not even close.

Posted by: ArcticCat | March 7, 2010 8:33 PM | Report abuse

If we finish the season "one Tony Pashos away from the playoffs", I'll pour the first round.

Posted by: daggar | March 7, 2010 8:33 PM |

Line of the day!

Posted by: scampbell1975 | March 7, 2010 8:35 PM | Report abuse

If we finish the season "one Tony Pashos away from the playoffs", I'll pour the first round.

Posted by: daggar | March 7, 2010 8:33 PM |

Line of the day!

Posted by: scampbell1975 | March 7, 2010 8:35 PM |

Hey, the day ain't done yet dude.

If we finish the season "one Cliftonbiz away from the playoffs", I'll pour the first round.


Posted by: ArcticCat | March 7, 2010 8:47 PM | Report abuse

The Browns signed Fujita. I might have liked to take a look at him. I guess with Rocky Mac, Orakpo, Wilson, and Blades we don't need another OLB?

Posted by: scampbell1975 | March 7, 2010 8:55 PM | Report abuse

JC is the best of the horrible quarterbacks we have drafted over the last umpteen years.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | March 7, 2010 8:33 PM

Scott Campbell here is looking to provoke the Colt Brennan debate. I'm not taking his bait.

Better than Sage Rosenfels and Gibran Hamdan?

Posted by: League-Source | March 7, 2010 8:56 PM | Report abuse

Hicks could very well be a tremendous pick up. He was the "5th man" on a tremendously deep pro bowl caliber Minnesota offensive line. Pashos didn't start on a crap SF line! This front office is going to make smart decisions and not overpay due to desperation or "one player away" from the playoffs.

Posted by: RedskinJim1 | March 7, 2010 8:56 PM | Report abuse

i wonder how much money the FO spent getting OUT of contracts for old guys this offseason.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | March 7, 2010 8:56 PM | Report abuse

Oh I'm sure thats facetiousness I detect LS.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | March 7, 2010 8:58 PM | Report abuse

scamp,

Rocky Mac and Blades will play ILB with LBF.

Our current crop of OLB is:

Orakpo, Carter, Wilson and L.Alexander

Posted by: Vicc | March 7, 2010 9:00 PM | Report abuse

scamp,

Rocky Mac and Blades will play ILB with LBF.

Our current crop of OLB is:

Orakpo, Carter, Wilson and L.Alexander

Posted by: Vicc | March 7, 2010 9:00 PM |

Yea, I don't buy it.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | March 7, 2010 9:04 PM | Report abuse

Rocky Mac will be a MLB in the 3-4.

He's actually very solid in coverage.

Posted by: Vicc | March 7, 2010 9:06 PM | Report abuse

Rocky Mac will be a MLB in the 3-4.

He's actually very solid in coverage.

Posted by: Vicc | March 7, 2010 9:06 PM |

I was talking more about the OLB's.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | March 7, 2010 9:09 PM | Report abuse

Since free agency goig a little slow this year which a good thing i was wondering about trades..

what do yall believe the market is for Andre Carter??

Posted by: PardenMiSwage | March 7, 2010 9:15 PM | Report abuse

If we finish the season "one Tony Pashos away from the playoffs", I'll pour the first round.

Posted by: daggar | March 7, 2010 8:33 PM |

Line of the day!

Posted by: scampbell1975 | March 7, 2010 8:35 PM |

Hey, the day ain't done yet dude.

If we finish the season "one Cliftonbiz away from the playoffs", I'll pour the first round.


Posted by: ArcticCat | March 7, 2010 8:47 PM | Report abuse

Funny stuff fellas!


Remember, when Eli Manning made that incredible play and throw to David Tyree?

Remember, Joe Montana got flushed out the pocket in 81' and threw to Dwight Clark?

Remember Ben Rothelisberger's throw to Santonio Holmes?

...no one remembers who the Left Tackle was...it was the QB and the receivers that made the plays...

ALTHOUGH...

We all remember the LT in 1983 who freed Riggins for 43 yards to seal the game!


My point is...Pashos ain't walkin' through that door!

Posted by: rickyroge | March 7, 2010 9:18 PM | Report abuse

what do yall believe the market is for Andre Carter??

Posted by: PardenMiSwage | March 7, 2010 9:15 PM


`

Well the bears needa pass rusher, oh wait, they got Peppers..

Carter is gonna stick around awhile.

Posted by: Vicc | March 7, 2010 9:18 PM | Report abuse

If I had to bet on one thing happening this offseason...

I think Carlos Rogers get traded on or before draft day.

Posted by: rickyroge | March 7, 2010 9:21 PM | Report abuse

Hicks could very well be a tremendous pick up. He was the "5th man" on a tremendously deep pro bowl caliber Minnesota offensive line. Pashos didn't start on a crap SF line! This front office is going to make smart decisions and not overpay due to desperation or "one player away" from the playoffs.

Posted by: RedskinJim1 | March 7, 2010 8:56 PM


I agree. If you're going to go shopping for UFA OL, it's a better move to go shopping for backups on the best OL in the NFL, instead of the Niners and Packers. No one on our OL would have been a starter on the Vikings.

Hard to argue with any of the moves so far...although I was posting about Fujita & Dansby a month ago. Still a measured and calculated approach is better than the Bears have done so far.

Posted by: Diesel44 | March 7, 2010 9:23 PM | Report abuse

I think Carlos Rogers get traded on or before draft day.

Posted by: rickyroge


sounds too good to be true

Posted by: Vicc | March 7, 2010 9:24 PM | Report abuse

Who cares?

The guy was a back up on a non playoff team. What if Heyer came to town and we let him slip away? Maybe we got lucky.

Posted by: edvar | March 7, 2010 4:08 PM | Report abuse

Agreed. This guy wasnt even good in Jacksonville thats why they didnt re-sign him. This is not that big of a deal for us.

Posted by: wattsicon | March 7, 2010 9:25 PM | Report abuse

The one thing I'm surprised at is that I thought the Skins would be a little more aggressive on the trade front. It could happen for Carlos sooner than latter since it seems the market for Dbs is being set.

POSTED BY: DOUG FARRAR, NORTHWESTFOOTBALL.NET
AT 03/07/2010 8:29 PM ET

Falcons Trading Houston to Lions
With their multi-year deal with Dunta Robinson wrapped up, ESPN's Adam Schefter reports that the Atlanta Falcons are going to trade cornerback Chris Houston to the Detroit Lions for a sixth-round draft pick and a swap of the teams' fifth-round picks. Houston was drafted in the second round in 2007, but he was one of the reasons the team really struggled in pass coverage last season, and he may be more successful in a defense like Detroit's in which he can play closer to the line. Of the remaining cornerbacks from last year's defense, Falcons head coach Mike Smith has said the most positive things about Brent Grimes, who might have the lead to start opposite Robinson in 2010.

Posted by: TWISI | March 7, 2010 9:26 PM | Report abuse

"Carr agrees to terms with 49ers"

Looks like the Niners are trying to corner the market on #1 overall QB busts.

At least our guy has more shown more than these two noodle armed sack/pick machines.

Posted by: Diesel44 | March 7, 2010 9:26 PM | Report abuse

Jacksonvilles 1st and 2nd round picks last year were:

LT Eugene Monroe and RT Eben Britton...Pashos became expendable.

Unfortunately for Jacksonville they still need a QB and the joke is on them if they think a solid O-line = solid QB.

Posted by: Vicc | March 7, 2010 9:29 PM | Report abuse

I would think that Rogers would be valued closer to Cromartie, 2nd or 3rd next year which is a 3rd or 4th in this draft than Houston.

Posted by: TWISI | March 7, 2010 9:31 PM | Report abuse

Diesel44,

It's such a shame bout dem 49ers. Some idiot over there can't seem to figure out how close they are to being really good.

Jason Campbell is better than any QB they've had in the past 5 years.

Posted by: Vicc | March 7, 2010 9:32 PM | Report abuse

If Clausen and Bradford seemed to warrant it, I'd have no problem drafting one of them. But we desparately need to rebuild our O line and all of our superbowls were predicated on a strong O line. In case some haven't heard, there is a LT who is a consensus value pick at #4, Mr. Okung. IT IS A NO BRAINER! We need an O line cornerstone, and unless Detroit grabs him, he's ours. If he's gone, I'd try to trade down and grab another of the top LT prospects, and I'd go for a RT in round 2. If we can't get a decent deal for a trade down, I'd to for Eric Berry at #4. I don't believe in reaching with a top 5 pick, and many say Berry is the best player in the draft. And FS IS a big need. I don't care about the "conventional wisdom" of drafting a safety in the top 10. If anyone could get a young Ronnie Lott or bring back Sean Taylor with this pick, would you do it? I would. If Berry were not there, I would even go with one of the DT's, as they are true value at that pick, even though they are not positions of our highest need. But if you have Okung, go for him.

Posted by: kenboy1 | March 7, 2010 9:33 PM | Report abuse

Here's my take...

I am willing to start over this year evaluating our O-line talent and here's why?

We had:

an average QB who tended to hold the ball too long

a coach who was in over his head

a change in playcallers mid season

I think Levi Jones and Mike Williams are starters...maybe not elite but starter caliber.

Posted by: rickyroge | March 7, 2010 9:33 PM | Report abuse

and I'd rather have Jason Campbell as my qb than David Carr.

Posted by: Vicc | March 7, 2010 9:34 PM | Report abuse

kenboy....

No disrespect...BUT are any of us qualified to evaluate if Claussen or Bradford are worthy of the #4 pick or not?

We're only going by what we here others say.

Posted by: rickyroge | March 7, 2010 9:36 PM | Report abuse

I think Carlos Rogers get traded on or before draft day.

Posted by: rickyroge

sounds too good to be true

Posted by: Vicc | March 7, 2010 9:24 PM

Disagree. Carlos Rogers sh_t in his pants. Now, I think he should sit in his sh_t for a good long while before he gets to change his pants.

Posted by: League-Source | March 7, 2010 9:45 PM | Report abuse

Disagree. Carlos Rogers sh_t in his pants. Now, I think he should sit in his sh_t for a good long while before he gets to change his pants.

Posted by: League-Source | March 7, 2010 9:45 PM |

...and now my vote for worst line of the day.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | March 7, 2010 9:50 PM | Report abuse

Disagree. Carlos Rogers sh_t in his pants. Now, I think he should sit in his sh_t for a good long while before he gets to change his pants.

Posted by: League-Source | March 7, 2010 9:45 PM | Report abuse


`

*chuckle*

We don't want any of our players to miss a game b/c of infection, though, do we?

Imagine the rash...

Posted by: Vicc | March 7, 2010 9:50 PM | Report abuse

Disagree. Carlos Rogers sh_t in his pants. Now, I think he should sit in his sh_t for a good long while before he gets to change his pants.

Posted by: League-Source | March 7, 2010 9:45 PM

L-S, you sound bitter. Sounds like one of the orderlies needs to change your depends at Seizure World..

TWISI- Rodgers can tackle, Cro is adverse to tackling. CR is believe it or not better than Cro.


Posted by: Diesel44 | March 7, 2010 9:56 PM | Report abuse

I believe Andre Carter going to get traded because he struggled in the 3-4

Rogers he may get dealt on draft day but we need as many picks as possible!!

Posted by: PardenMiSwage | March 7, 2010 9:57 PM | Report abuse

didnt save him from a 61.0 overall QB rating in the last seven minutes of the games."

Posted by: Samson151 | March 7, 2010 8:25 PM |

Stat looks a little suspic. Why 7 min? If last half of last qtr then should be 7.5 min. But we don't need no stats to tell us that Camp ain't one of them proverb strong finishers. Not even close.

Posted by: ArcticCat | March 7, 2010 8:33 PM



Ref the "The last 7 minutes QB Rating.." Its on NFL.com..maybe "suspect" in that it is on NFL.com? who knows if its correct?
I have seen it referenced on ESPN as a good measure for QB's under pressure when the game is on the line. And actually less mop up Stat padding than the first 7 minutes of a 4th Qtr in a blow out.


Even though in the large blow out losses, last year, JC had some mop up stats in the last 7 minutes, too. But, alot of games were out of hand in the mid 4th Qtr and Skins made it close, during the opposing team's prevent D. Thus, some misleading final scores.. The Lions game comes to mind.

In my opinion, JC hasnt been the same QB since the season ending knee injury in 07. I noticed tentativeness in his play in 08 and 09 versus the more aggressive JC in the previous years, prior to the detached knee cap.
He, by his own admission, is a body worshipper type.. yoga, pilates, etc. Nothing wrong with that.. but, it does change such a mindset when you see your kneecap detached and floating behind your knee instead of secured to the patella tendon in the front.
He doesnt wait that last extra half second for that final WR separation required for a longer than 10 yard completion. . He panics and hits (or misses) the short out. The last 4 plays (which were incompletes) of the year (SD Game) are an excellent example of his panic in the pocket. That extra second a QB has to stand in there to make the long throw versus a short dump is the difference in Campbell of 08 and 09 versus the Campbell of 07, 06.
He plays scared now with short easy dumps. I would guess its also why 80 percent of his passes were 10 yards or less in 09. Far different from pre-injury performances.

Posted by: SkinsneedaGM | March 7, 2010 10:00 PM | Report abuse

Rogers he may get dealt on draft day but we need as many picks as possible!!

Posted by: PardenMiSwage | March 7, 2010 9:57 PM

Rogers is gonna be traded for a pick in next year's draft -- same as Cromartie.

Posted by: League-Source | March 7, 2010 10:02 PM | Report abuse

TWISI- Rodgers can tackle, Cro is adverse to tackling. CR is believe it or not better than Cro.


Posted by: Diesel44


`

this maybe true. Cromartie benefited from a crucial pass rush two years ago.

realistically an elite(or any) corner can only cover a wr for 3 seconds or less.

This is why corners are not as important to a defense as say D-linemen. Or better yet a secondary is only as good as their front 7.

I love getting opportunities to share football knowledge with youse guys and dolls

Posted by: Vicc | March 7, 2010 10:03 PM | Report abuse

Vicc--

I thought garrard made the pro bowl plaing behind those two rookie tackles?

Posted by: BigE44 | March 7, 2010 10:04 PM | Report abuse

Vicc--

I thought garrard made the pro bowl plaing behind those two rookie tackles?

Posted by: BigE44 | March 7, 2010 10:04 PM


He sure did, didn't he. Had a helluva game too!

LMAO

Ur funny

I know u really not tryna get me started, so i'll keep it simple:

Jacksonville ain't winnin sh!t so long as Garrard is their starting QB!

Where you think 'Skins goin with tha 4th pick?

I hope tackle.

Posted by: Vicc | March 7, 2010 10:14 PM | Report abuse

Vicc-

The student has nothing to share that the professor doesn't already know. You can draw me a cartoon for entertainment purposes tho..

Posted by: Diesel44 | March 7, 2010 10:15 PM | Report abuse

SkinsNeedAGM...

Good analysis and I agree...I've watched every snap since he became a starter. He's never looked comfortable although he had good games.

This man has never brought us from behind, and his receivers must be wide open for him to throw to them.

Not that this is a fair comparison, but I saw Philip Rivers throw a touchdown into triple coverage without hesitation.

Posted by: rickyroge | March 7, 2010 10:18 PM | Report abuse

I consider you a fellow RI colleague, Diesel44. Schools out.

I'm not a cartoonist, btw;

you alrealy knew that tho..

Posted by: Vicc | March 7, 2010 10:18 PM | Report abuse

TWISI- Rodgers can tackle, Cro is adverse to tackling. CR is believe it or not better than Cro.


Posted by: Diesel44


I can't disagree with that statement. However I don't think teams will spend a 1st or a 2nd round pick on a CB who cannot get turnovers. How many times have we seen Los drop an interception, keeping a drive alive that ultimately hurts the club? I think his inability to catch will keep his value in the 3rd or 4th round range.

Posted by: TWISI | March 7, 2010 10:19 PM | Report abuse

Share ur knowledge, vicc, and try not to waffle as you've done with your jc comments tonight. At #4 skins should take a tackle, but I'd be fine with a reach such as spiller.

Posted by: BigE44 | March 7, 2010 10:21 PM | Report abuse

Me thinks that Redskins fans will be watching Rogers demonstrate his tackling skills for the Skins this year. Catching INTs not so much.

Posted by: Curzon417 | March 7, 2010 10:24 PM | Report abuse

C.J. Spiller is NOT a reach at #4!

...a game changer!

Posted by: rickyroge | March 7, 2010 10:31 PM | Report abuse

I do stand in the unfavorable side of Jason Campbell, BigE44. Just tryna kill time. Sharing requires two and i do enjoy posting here while hearing other opinions.

Spiller reminds me a lot of Clinton Portis.

Posted by: Vicc | March 7, 2010 10:35 PM | Report abuse

"didnt save him from a 61.0 overall QB rating in the last seven minutes of the games."
Posted by: Samson151 | March 7, 2010 8:25 PM"

I didn't say the above. I'd cut and pasted it from a post I was criticizing. I think the last 7 minute QB rating is a misleading stat and shouldn't be relied on without a bunch of other data.

Wish people would check this stuff before they misquote you. Then again, this is a newspaper, right?

Posted by: Samson151 | March 7, 2010 10:36 PM | Report abuse

Im not saying Rogers is better than Cromartie but we should try to get a pick for him in this years draft for example if the Lions were willing to give up the first pick in the fourth round for Houston it has to be a similar deal for Rogers there talent level are not that far from each other...

Posted by: PardenMiSwage | March 7, 2010 10:36 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: Curzon417 | March 7, 2010 10:37 PM | Report abuse


C.J. Spiller is NOT a reach at #4!

...a game changer!

Posted by: rickyroge | March 7, 2010 10:31 PM

UGH! With all the needs we have you want them going after a part time player. The guy can not run between the tackles - at all. He's just a third down back / returner. This would be a terrible pick for them.

Posted by: photoassign | March 7, 2010 10:45 PM | Report abuse

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/sports/Now-Allen-needs-to-be-86772862.html

Posted by: Curzon417 | March 7, 2010 10:37 PM

I could see that as well. I wouldn't trade any of the TEs. I really would like to see what could be if they both were on the field at the same time.

Posted by: TWISI | March 7, 2010 10:50 PM | Report abuse

In the [vain] hope that folks will stop posting about Jason Campbell's QB rating in the last 7 minutes of games, here are some common criticisms of the QB rating system in general:

1) it's hands-down the most maligned stat in all of team sports.

2) it's not really a stat, but an amalgam of other stats. Here's how it is calculated:
Step 1: Complete passes divided by pass attempts. Subtract 0.3, then divide by 0.2
Step 2: Passing yards divided by pass attempts. Subtract 3, then divide by 4.
Step 3: Touchdown passes divided by pass attempts, then divide by .05.
Step 4: Start with .095, and subtract interceptions divided by attempts. Divide the product by .04.
The sum of each step cannot be greater than 2.375 or less than zero. Add the sum of Steps 1 through 4, multiply by 100, and divide by 6.

3) every year there are QBs who rank high but who can be legitimately criticized for the quality of their play. Likewise there are always QBs who have been very successful but who rank much lower in terms of QB rating. This is the sort of thing that makes statisticians question the validity of any measure.

4) The rating system favors QBs who play it safe.

5) in calculating the QB rating, it’s actually better for the QB to get sacked, fumble and have it returned for a touchdown, than to throw an incomplete pass. The reason is, sacks, sack yardage and fumbles are not part of the formula, but incompletions are included.

Taking this convoluted formula and reducing the evaluation period to only the final minutes of every game does not improve its accuracy.

Posted by: Samson151 | March 7, 2010 10:51 PM | Report abuse

To me, the argument about drafting QB at #4, or keeping JC or whether or not he's a winner has gotten too convoluted. I think you do not draft QB this year so you spend all of your available resources creating an environment that a QB can thrive in.

We are not going to fix this in one year.

By building a great O line, by gathering young, fast capable running backs, by fortifying the D line and secondary to create turn overs, you are creating that environment.

Then you make your move at QB. If Jason suddenly transforms in Shanny's offense - then good for us. If it's more of the same, then when we bring in the new QB, we are handing him a situation in which he can thrive right away, not just survive as we continue to try to fix this mess.

We are not going to fix this in one year.

So let's build the lines, strengthen the D and collect some skill players. Next year, we build off of that.

Posted by: edvar | March 7, 2010 10:53 PM | Report abuse

Not that this is a fair comparison, but I saw Philip Rivers throw a touchdown into triple coverage without hesitation.

Posted by: rickyroge | March 7, 2010 10:18 PM


Yeah, that's just what we need.

Posted by: photoassign | March 7, 2010 10:56 PM | Report abuse

David White, of the San Francisco Chronicle, reports free-agent RB Justin Fargas (Raiders) has a visit scheduled with the Kansas City Chiefs.

Updating a previous item, Tony Grossi, of the Cleveland Plain Dealer, reports Cleveland Browns LB Scott Fujita signed a three-year deal worth $14 million, according to a source.

Jeff Darlington, of The Miami Herald, reports free-agent S Ryan Clark (Steelers) visited with the Miami Dolphins Sunday, March 7. Clark said he would like to make it his one and only stop. Clark added, "That's the reason we waited so long to take any (free agent) trips. We had interested teams that I didn't really want to go to, and I didn't want to try to make myself look busy by going to a bunch of different places. There were a lot of good offers, and a lot of good fits. But this seems like a good spot. So I'm praying to goes well."

Adam Caplan, of Scout.com, reports New Orleans Saints restricted free-agent RB Mike Bell will make his first visit with the Seattle Seahawks.

Gil Brandt, of NFL.com, reports the Seattle Seahawks have scheduled an individual workout with Florida QB Tim Tebow. The workout will be conducted after his school's Pro Day March 17

Posted by: skinfanman | March 7, 2010 11:08 PM | Report abuse

This past weekend has led me to realize that Vinny really was nothing more then a fan with a GM job. I mean of all the weird suggestions we see here on RI and message boards, well Vinny was like a real life version of that, except with the ability to pull the trigger on such decisions.

If Vinny was still Super VIP executive vice president of football stuff then right now we'd most likely see 5 of the most recently cut guys still on the team along with Julius Peppers, Chad Clifton, Tony Pashos, and maybe even LT. You might have also seen an attempt to trade for Brandon Marshall if Vinny was still around running the show. Kind of feels good to know that cooler heads are now working in the front office as opposed to a wirey coke head that was in a weird state of panic and one player away.

Posted by: CapsXXVI | March 7, 2010 11:15 PM | Report abuse

A quick look at the most important on-campus workouts this week:

Dez Bryant, WR, Oklahoma State. After missing most of the season and then not working out at the Combine, he must show elite quickness, explosiveness and speed Wednesday to be the first receiver drafted.

Terrence Cody, NT, Alabama. He must weigh-in Wednesday at 340s and prove he has the endurance and athleticism to play more than 15-20 snaps per game.

Rolando McClain, ILB, Alabama. He chose not to workout at the Combine, putting it all on the line Wednesday.

Gerald McCoy, DT, Oklahoma. Unless he delivers a big-time workout Tuesday, Ndamukong Suh could well end the defensive tackle debate Thursday.

Tony Pike, QB, Cincinnati. He must throw with more consistent zip and accuracy Wednesday and prove he has a mental capacity to grasp NFL passing concepts.

Trent Williams, OT, Oklahoma. He could overtake Russell Okung as the No. 1 tackle if he shows up in great shape Tuesday and shines.

Posted by: skinfanman | March 7, 2010 11:17 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: CapsXXVI | March 7, 2010 11:15 PM | Report abuse


`

yeah.

the final straw was Vinny C claiming to have given Jim Zorn a "playoff roster"

That's when Danny Boy figured out how full of sh!t Vinny was.

Posted by: Vicc | March 7, 2010 11:20 PM | Report abuse

The Arizona Cardinals will bring in free-agent linebacker Joey Porter for a visit on Tuesday, according to Adam Schefter of ESPN.

The Steelers’ rare free-agent pursuit of wide receiver Arnaz Battle could put Limas Sweed’s future with the team in doubt, according to the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette. Battle, 30, reportedly is weighing offers from Pittsburgh and Seattle. Sweed, a 2008 second-round pick, missed three games last season because of undisclosed personal issues. …

Posted by: skinfanman | March 7, 2010 11:23 PM | Report abuse

In the [vain] hope that folks will stop posting about Jason Campbell's QB rating in the last 7 minutes of games, here are some common criticisms of the QB rating system in general:

1) it's hands-down the most maligned stat in all of team sports.

2) it's not really a stat,

3) every year there are QBs who rank high but who can be legitimately criticized for the quality of their play. Likewise there are always QBs who have been very successful but who rank much lower in terms of QB rating. This is the sort of thing that makes statisticians question the validity of any measure.

4) The rating system favors QBs who play it safe.

Taking this convoluted formula and reducing the evaluation period to only the final minutes of every game does not improve its accuracy.

Posted by: Samson151 | March 7, 2010 10:51 PM | Report abuse

uuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu

au contraire Samson151...you wrote "The Rating system favors QB's that play it safe?" "the most maligned stat in all of sport"?
Below is the actual data from NFL.Com and the QB rating accuracy seems to speak for itself.. I didnt have time to put the team W-L record next to the QB rating... but, its pretty well known.

>Non-First year QBs and their 1st Qtr and 4th Qtr last 7 mins QB Rating (from NFL.Com)

Jason Campbell 1st Qtr = 69.8
4th Qtr last 7 minutes = 61.0

Peyton Manning 1st Qtr = 101.7
4th Qtr last 7 minutes = 132

Drew Brees 1st Qtr = 110.7
4th Qtr last 7 minutes =106.6

Brett Favre 1st Qtr = 107.4
4th Qtr last 7 minutes =118

Rony Romo 1st Qtr = 90.5
4th Qtr last 7 minutes = 102.4

Ben Roethlisberger 1st Qtr = 108.7
4th Qtr last 7 minutes =98.2

Kurt Warner 1st Qtr = 114.6
4th Qtr last 7 minutes = 88.1

Posted by: SkinsneedaGM | March 7, 2010 11:24 PM | Report abuse

Redskins may be powerless to get Bradford
Eric Edholm, ProFootballWeekly.com


The Redskins appear to have set their sights on Oklahoma QB Sam Bradford, but it’s looking more unlikely that they will be able to get him. Unless the Rams, who have passed on potential franchise quarterbacks the past few seasons, get cold feet on Bradford’s shoulder, they are appearing to lean more toward taking him first overall. The Redskins pursued but lost out on free-agent OLT Chad Clifton(notes), who would have been the anchor for a rebuilt offensive line, we hear, and chief protector of the quarterback. But getting the Rams to change their minds just might not happen if Bradford works out well at his pro day on March 9.


Such a development would change the Redskins’ strategy dramatically in the draft. Would they take Notre Dame QB Jimmy Clausen at No. 4? That might be a reach, though quarterbacks clearly are valued on a different scale. After all, few people thought Mark Sanchez(notes) was worth a top-five pick at this point last year, but the Jets made a bold move up to the No. 5 pick and landed the player they want to build their franchise around. The Redskins, too, could decide that Clausen is worth taking that high. Assuming the Lions and Buccaneers — teams that took QBs with first-rounders last year — remain at Nos. 2 and 3, respectively, in the first-round draft order, the Redskins would have Clausen there to pick at No. 4.

Posted by: skinfanman | March 7, 2010 11:26 PM | Report abuse

San Francisco 49ers veteran free agent offensive tackle Barry Sims has drawn interest from the Seattle Seahawks and the Washington Redskins, according to a league source.

Sims is also still talking with the 49ers about a potential return.

Per a source, Sims is expected to have a new deal within the next week.

Sims, 35, started seven games last season for the 49ers and played in all 16 games.

Sims has started 134 career games, spending his entire career in the Bay Area.

The 6-foot-5, 300-pounder played for the Oakland Raiders for nine seasons before signing with San Francisco in 2008.

Posted by: skinfanman | March 7, 2010 11:31 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: TWISI | March 7, 2010 11:35 PM | Report abuse

Redskins may be powerless to get Bradford
Eric Edholm, ProFootballWeekly.com


The Redskins appear to have set their sights on Oklahoma QB Sam Bradford....

=====================================

Considering the people in the know had the Skins signing Peppers and Dansby early Friday morning, I do not put any stock in these types of reports.

Plus I am hoping that this FO has the smarts to know that none of these QB are worth the #4 pick.

Okung should be the pick.

Posted by: Curzon417 | March 7, 2010 11:36 PM | Report abuse

Considering the people in the know had the Skins signing Peppers and Dansby early Friday morning, I do not put any stock in these types of reports.

Plus I am hoping that this FO has the smarts to know that none of these QB are worth the #4 pick.

Okung should be the pick.

Posted by: Curzon417

I so agree with you!!!

Posted by: Lisa_R | March 7, 2010 11:57 PM | Report abuse

Skinsneedagm,
We get that you don't like JC. I admit he has not shown a lot to distingish himself but your last comparision is somewhat over the top. Sure compare him to two future HOF QBs, the QB of the superbowl winner, a playoff QB and a long-time playoff QB. All of which are on much better teams then the Redskins. I doubt even the most ardent JC fan thinks he is that caliber of QB. As many have stated and I agree he is not an elite QB but given the right tools he could help the team.

Posted by: lifelongfan | March 8, 2010 12:07 AM | Report abuse

Considering the people in the know had the Skins signing Peppers and Dansby early Friday morning, I do not put any stock in these types of reports.

Plus I am hoping that this FO has the smarts to know that none of these QB are worth the #4 pick.

Okung should be the pick.

Posted by: Curzon417

I so agree with you!!!

Posted by: Lisa_R | March 7, 2010 11:57 PM

}}}}}}}}}

Good points.. but the best GM in football would disagree with you.. Colt's Bill Polian..
If you have a lottery pick like #4 in the NFL Draft and the decision is between an unskilled position that effects about a fifth of your OLine.. Or, a skilled impact point scoring position, ie. QB. You pick the skilled position.
If both players turn out average.. your best return on investment is the skilled position, QB... Not the OLine guy.
If Okung is mediocre.. maybe a 4th round trade.. If Bradford is mediocre.. 2nd or 3rd round value as a backup.. Backup QBs cost far more than backup OT's.

If Bradford or Clausen are either available at #4 and the Skins dont trade down.. one of them will be a Skin.

Posted by: SkinsneedaGM | March 8, 2010 12:13 AM | Report abuse

Skinsneedagm,
We get that you don't like JC. I admit he has not shown a lot to distingish himself but your last comparision is somewhat over the top. Sure compare him to two future HOF QBs, the QB of the superbowl winner, a playoff QB and a long-time playoff QB. All of which are on much better teams then the Redskins. I doubt even the most ardent JC fan thinks he is that caliber of QB. As many have stated and I agree he is not an elite QB but given the right tools he could help the team.

Posted by: lifelongfan | March 8, 2010 12:07 AM
}}}}}}}}}}
You missed the context of the posting..
I was responding to Samson, who said QB Ratings were bogus measurements..
My point.. Match the W-L records of the QBs with the highest ratings.. And the QB ratings are pretty much "dead on" accurate.. and thus relevant.

Posted by: SkinsneedaGM | March 8, 2010 12:16 AM | Report abuse

Posted by: SkinsneedaGM | March 8, 2010 12:13 AM

You left out if both are bust, then the QB sets your team back longer than the LT.

Also keep in mind that you could move that average LT to RT or guard. Where can you move the average QB? Neither Bradford nor Clausen can be a WR in the NFL, so if both the QB and LT turn out to be average, you are better off w/the LT.

But all of these if will not be known before the benefit of hindsight.

And the big plus here is that there will be a rookie cap next year (or 2021 if there is a lock out) which would make it safer to draft a QB then. Not to mention that next years class seems to be stronger at QB. Skins should not look at a QB this year in any round IMO.

Posted by: Curzon417 | March 8, 2010 12:21 AM | Report abuse

Hate to disagree with Polian since his track record is so good. But the odds of a QB pick in the top 5 becoming a good long term investment are less than 50/50. Polian got the best of the best in Peyton, but more often than not, you get someone who isn't worth it.

The odds of getting it right are better on selecting OL.

As for Campbell in the 4th quarter, he did struggle in several games, especially on the final drive. In at least 3 games, Zorn took the ball out of his hands while on good drives once the Skins got in scoring position, running and getting FG attempts instead of passing to score a TD.

I'm in Campbell's corner and to me, he regressed in 2009. I put a lot of that on Zorn.

Campbell played well in the 4th quarter in 2008. The reality is that he is fine when he has decent protection. Which hasn't been the case for his last 24 games.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | March 8, 2010 12:37 AM | Report abuse

Interesting so many of you mention Okung, and he's not even considered a top 5 pick on many draft boards.

Posted by: wagman1 | March 8, 2010 12:55 AM | Report abuse

As many have stated and I agree he is not an elite QB but given the right tools he could help the team.

Posted by: lifelongfan | March 8, 2010 12:07 AM

3rd down RB's. nickle cb/lb, dime cb/lb/safety, backup linemen, blocking te's are signed if they can help the team. QB's are signed to win games, period. QB's who are good between the 20's but cant seem to get it in the endzone are what gets coaches fired. JC just does not have that it that it takes and so who wants to sign him, even as backup? I dont hate him, he is just a less than average QB with some decent stats. He wont even be good as a mentor to a new QB, so that makes him less valuable. The new QB needs to be here this year as a learning year so the coaches can work with him and the Oline can see what to expect of him in different situations. Pick #4 is an ideal spot.

On stats alone, I would take Clausen over Bradford. But I have never watched either. So I hope Shanny and co. take whichever they think is best. Next year, if we finish out of the top 10, we will have to trade the farm for one of those supposedly much better QB's.

Posted by: HPYTRKR1 | March 8, 2010 1:06 AM | Report abuse

Interesting so many of you mention Okung, and he's not even considered a top 5 pick on many draft boards.

Posted by: wagman1 | March 8, 2010 12:55 AM | Report abuse

What? I mean come on I want Bradford as much as anyone else, but posting something like that is pretty reckless if you ask me. I don't think I've seen him on a mock draft fall past 5.

Posted by: CapsXXVI | March 8, 2010 1:25 AM | Report abuse

Next year, if we finish out of the top 10, we will have to trade the farm for one of those supposedly much better QB's.

Posted by: HPYTRKR1 | March 8, 2010 1:06 AM

Just because Bradford and Clausen are the top two QB in this draft does not mean that they are top 5 or even top 10 pick worthy. IMO they fall in the 11-20 pick, which is where the Skins will be picking next year.

My point being that we would not have to trade any picks next year to get the same quality QB as Bradford and Clausen next year picking in the 10-22 slot.

Posted by: Curzon417 | March 8, 2010 1:39 AM | Report abuse

Posted by: Curzon417 | March 8, 2010 1:39 AM

Then I guess that we agree to disagree. I Shanny/Allen I will trust for at least 3 years.

Go SKINS!

Posted by: HPYTRKR1 | March 8, 2010 1:48 AM | Report abuse

We either need a vastly improved line, or a vastly improved quarterback. Since it looks like they are trying to do more than fill holes, they are probably planning on at least 2 years of rebuilding. JC will probably serve as a tackling dummy. Hopefully, he will be a pleasant surprise. (Not as a dummy.)It is risky to spend the $nyders for a high draft quarterback. I think we could get some linemen by trading down, or trading the pick for some young, proven linemen. Whatever happens, I am 90% pleased with the patience shown by the fo. (I also want the trainers to keep the guys healthy.)

Posted by: chalkjock | March 8, 2010 3:07 AM | Report abuse

the final straw was Vinny C claiming to have given Jim Zorn a "playoff roster"

That's when Danny Boy figured out how full of sh!t Vinny was.

Posted by: Vicc | March 7, 2010 11:20 PM |

Vicc, Vinny's claim was greater than that: that it was a Super Bowl roster. But, I think it was a playoff roster. If Shanahan had been coaching that roster last year he would have gone 10-6. Morale, play-calling, game management would have been better. He would have won games against Detroit, Carolina, Kansas City, Dallas, New Orleans, and Oakland.

Posted by: League-Source | March 8, 2010 5:25 AM | Report abuse

LS, you keep saying that but this team has been built wrong and allowed to get old in a hurry. I agree that the team would have fared better under Shanahan, but Vinny didn't hand Zorn a playoff roster, he handed him a mutilated limb with band-aids all over it.

Zorn sucks, but he was never given a chance to succeed either. You don't go 4-12 simply because the coaching was bad. This team went 4-12 because the team was built ass-backward and didn't have a coach who could turn a turd into a Snickers. A lot of folks up here give Gibbs grief over the 2.0 Era, but I think he showed his HoF chops by taking that talented-yet-overrated roster to two playoff appearances.

Posted by: brownwood26 | March 8, 2010 5:43 AM | Report abuse

Bottom feeders feed on the bottom.
Not sure I like this Redskin image.
Sure wish we could have made a bigger splash to shore up at least one position.
My choice for our first pick has not changed.

Posted by: skinsfan0524 | March 8, 2010 5:54 AM | Report abuse

Bottom feeders feed on the bottom.
Not sure I like this Redskin image.
Sure wish we could have made a bigger splash to shore up at least one position.
My choice for our first pick has not changed.

Posted by: skinsfan0524 | March 8, 2010 5:54 AM


Right...because the "First in Free Agency...Last in the Standings" approach was working so well. Unbelievable that this new regime would try to get as far away from that approach as possible.

But I could understand your apprehension over the way things are going...especially when the cool, calm and calculated way the Redskins are handling free agency looks way too much like the way NFL bottom feeders like Pittsburgh and Indianapolis do things. I mean, who would want to be mentioned in the same sentence as those losers?

(end sarcasm)

Seriously, this ain't Madden. Loading up on FAs doesn't work. A decade worth of failure proves that. I'm not sure how many more years of futility it would take for you to get wise to that but I've seen more than enough.

This offseason gives me the most hope for this franchise that I've had in any of the 17 years I've watched Redskin football. For once, our FO has a plan that extends beyond tomorrow. There's no more delusion about how good this team and this roster is. Emphasis is being placed on the draft. If you can't see that, you're every bit as bad as Vinny.

Posted by: brownwood26 | March 8, 2010 6:11 AM | Report abuse

Sure wish we could have made a bigger splash to shore up at least one position.

Posted by: skinsfan0524 | March 8, 2010 5:54 AM

Right, because there was so much talent out there, at the positions we need to "shore up," and we just didn't make any effort to grab it.

Personally I can't wait for my Artis Hicks jersey to arrive.

Posted by: League-Source | March 8, 2010 6:14 AM | Report abuse

Yes I was being sarcastic about the bottom feeding.
The odd thing about all this free agency stuff is that maybe the available second and third tier players are just not that attractive a player to sign. Or maybe they aren't healthy enough to sign. Or maybe they just don't fit. There are no big names out there for the O-line that you could say I must have.
Bottom feeder bait swimming around looking for a bottom feeder.

Posted by: skinsfan0524 | March 8, 2010 6:24 AM | Report abuse

League,
I felt like dansby would have been a great fit but I guess the $$$ were to much.

Posted by: skinsfan0524 | March 8, 2010 6:26 AM | Report abuse

A couple of questions.

What's the buzz on the players who were cut...Any of them resign somewhere else?

What's the status of the players we had on the practice squad...Any news on them?

Posted by: skinsfan0524 | March 8, 2010 6:36 AM | Report abuse

still not one bit of interest in our tendered free agents? We need more draft picks!

Posted by: 1965skinsfan | March 8, 2010 6:50 AM | Report abuse

This offseason gives me the most hope for this franchise that I've had in any of the 17 years I've watched Redskin football. For once, our FO has a plan that extends beyond tomorrow. There's no more delusion about how good this team and this roster is. Emphasis is being placed on the draft. If you can't see that, you're every bit as bad as Vinny.

Posted by: brownwood26 | March 8, 2010 6:11 AM | Report abuse


Ouch...Vinny?

With 5 picks in this years draft and all the wishful thinking about finding a suitor to trade down and give us all their picks.

Not saying they didn't but if I were emperor, I would have looked harder at maybe a Dansby or a Rolle to sign and plug them in a hole so we could use those draft picks on another position.

On another fantasy thought I hope there are some discussions with other teams about trading player for player situations. I liked the Jets trade for Cromarty (sp).

Additionally, I am a little delusional about how good this team and the players are. Can you enlighten me?

Posted by: skinsfan0524 | March 8, 2010 7:00 AM | Report abuse

still not one bit of interest in our tendered free agents? We need more draft picks!

Posted by: 1965skinsfan | March 8, 2010 6:50 AM

We're not getting picks for our RFA's. Or, if we do, it will be like Cromartie, who was traded for a pick in next year's draft. Even Boldin only netted one pick for the Cards -- they got a 3 and a 4 but had to give up their #5. So, if that's what Boldin and Cromartie are worth, what do you think you can get for Rodgers? Liverwurst.

Over time, I think what you'll start seeing are player trades, maybe with a late pick or pick from next year thrown in to equalize value. But this is uncharted territory and 32 GM's are trying not to make a mistake.

So, if we need picks, our best hope is to wait until next year.

Posted by: League-Source | March 8, 2010 7:10 AM | Report abuse

Its kind of nice that we aren't landing our top choices this year, suggests the team isn't budging in salary talks. We lost a guy who eventually took a 3-year, $10 million dollar contract? Skins' brass has paid guys more than than in guaranteed money for 1 year before. These are all positive signs.

Posted by: agupta1 | March 8, 2010 7:25 AM | Report abuse

Additionally, I am a little delusional about how good this team and the players are. Can you enlighten me?

Posted by: skinsfan0524 | March 8, 2010 7:00 AM


First of all, we're not plugging EVERY hole on the roster this year. We'll use the draft and pick up mid-level FAs to fill out the roster for this year, but the focus is on building the roster through the draft and making the most of what's available to us now. I couldn't be happier with that approach.

To answer your above question, this team isn't good. Nor is the roster. We went 4-12 last year. This roster needs a complete overhaul and trying to do it all in one year or trying to piece it together in free agency is the exact mindset that got us into this mess to begin with. We as fans need to wrap our heads around the fact that this team isn't doing business the way we've seen them do it in the last several years. We have competent football men in charge of football operations for a change, and that means our offseasons are gonna be boring. A small price to pay if we're finally gonna get the desired results in the regular season (and hopefully post-season).

Posted by: brownwood26 | March 8, 2010 7:28 AM | Report abuse

Players have over-valued themselves when coming to DC. It's about time some of them leave without a contract. Nice job not wasting $$$.

Posted by: bgmathis | March 8, 2010 7:30 AM | Report abuse

You'll see more interest in RFA's and more trades across the league after the first wave of UFA signings has come to a halt.

Posted by: PCinOz | March 8, 2010 7:36 AM | Report abuse

Such a change of pace... pleasant to a degree... but a previous poster was right, hoped they'd have filled at least one need by now to allow for an OL draft focus... now we need FS, RB, OL, QB, LB...

Does anyone get the feeling they might be dealing players (Cooley... one of our SS's) for some draft pics?

Posted by: bschaef12 | March 8, 2010 7:41 AM | Report abuse

Beep Beep

Posted by: Flounder21 | March 8, 2010 7:46 AM | Report abuse

Does anyone get the feeling they might be dealing players (Cooley... one of our SS's) for some draft pics?

Posted by: bschaef12 | March 8, 2010 7:41 AM

No. I think they like the players they've kept. I think they see a lot of talent on the team - talent that's underachieved as a team. It's most likely they'll address the need of a LT in the draft. Beyond that they haven't really indicated where they see a weakness.

Posted by: skinfanman | March 8, 2010 7:47 AM | Report abuse

Brown

"There's no more delusion about how good this team and this roster is."

This was your quote.

I don't believe I know how good the team and the players are at this point. I know we weren't good last year if you base it on the win/loss record.

And oh by the way, Duh! to everything else you said in the response. Or as you all say up here "beep".

Posted by: skinsfan0524 | March 8, 2010 7:48 AM | Report abuse

Brownwood and I rarely agree on things but I've got to say that he is spot on this morning. Seems a lot of folks are going through "splash" withdrawal. This team will be better simply through preperation, discippline, and coaching without the splash. We've got holes...who doesn't. We're not going to fill them all this year. Most teams operate with just some guys in spots. Oh no, we'll have to do it too. That's what the good coaches do. They plug in just guys and get the team to perform greater than the sum of tgheir parts.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | March 8, 2010 7:53 AM | Report abuse

F Cromartie. Dude just mailed in against the Jets in the playoffs last season.

Could the 'Skins have done more to get Kerry Rhodes? Arizona got him for this years 4th and next years 3rd.

Posted by: RedDMV | March 8, 2010 7:59 AM | Report abuse

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