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Posted at 4:26 PM ET, 01/18/2011

Garbage in, garbage out?

By Washington Post editors

Is trash talking good or bad for the NFL? Our expert panelists provide their opinion in The League

By Washington Post editors  | January 18, 2011; 4:26 PM ET
 
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Next: Brian Orakpo to play in second straight Pro Bowl

Comments

fwiw, I keep bringing up Campbell because of the way this organization -- including the CURRENT leadership -- has looked at the QB spot. We've tossed away several quality QBs over the years in the hunt for something better.

You'd think it wouldn't be hard to improve on Campbell. But ... its harder than people think. We didn't do it with a 5 time Pro Bowler and a genius offensive-minded HC.

Historically, we've also let go of guys that turned out to be pretty good -- Trent Green and Rich Gannon among them.

The big picture is that this team -- including the CURRENT leadership -- has spent a ton of resources fixing the wrong things. Campbell isn't a great QB, but he wasn't near the top of the list of problems, either.

As long as management keeps trying to fix the things that aren't problems (like the 4-3 defense) or the QB, this franchise will struggle.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | January 18, 2011 4:37 PM | Report abuse

Was it just me who thought how very unprofessional it was for players to be trash talking the coaches on the sidelines of Sunday's Jets-Pats game?

While I can understand a little bit of mouthiness and mind games between players inside the hash marks, I also tend to think that taking it to the sidelines and grandstands is way out of bounds.

Posted by: Vic1 | January 18, 2011 4:38 PM | Report abuse

It's neither good nor bad. It's part of the game.

Re Jason Campbell: I'm happy to see him playing well but I don't miss him here at all.

Posted by: Original_etrod | January 18, 2011 4:39 PM | Report abuse

Give the kid props: he hasn't choked on the big stage.

gimmesummoe | January 18, 2011 3:57 PM

True enough and more than happy to grant him that.

But until they face somebody in the play-offs who shuts down their rush attack and scores on their defense and Sanchez has to pass 40+ times and bring them back with passing, I cannot get past that 54.8 completion %.

Even at the end of his second season he has something like one game is it with 35 - 40 plus pass attempts? OK many coaches don't necessarily want to put a young QB in a position where he has to pass that many times and carry the offense/team and they can win other ways so don't necessarily need to.

But until such time as he has proven he can, I'm not sold on him.

Maybe it will happen against Pittsburgh though - would have thought there is a good chance they will try to stop the Jets ground game first.

Posted by: craig81 | January 18, 2011 4:42 PM | Report abuse

ProFootbalFocus

Jenkins and Hall have given up most rec yards in a season of any corner over past 3 seasons. Somehow Hall made Pro Bowl off that

Retweeted by john_keim and 1 other

Posted by: learnedhand1 | January 18, 2011 4:49 PM | Report abuse

ProFootbalFocus

Btw, Guess what corner was 2nd to Mike Jenkins' 994 yards yielded? PRO BOWLER DeAngelo Hall, gave up 965 yards

Posted by: learnedhand1 | January 18, 2011 4:51 PM | Report abuse

Just a quick run down on "fixes" this team has tried in just the past couple years, most are on the current mgmt, some aren't:

Acquire Jason Taylor and play him at a different position than the one he was DPOY.

Acquire Albert Haynesworth and play him at a different position than where he was DPOY.

Take Andre Carter, coming off a year in which no player in the entire NFL had both more sacks and more tackles than he did, and play him at a different position.

Take Brian Orakpo, who earned a Pro Bowl spot for his play at DE, and play him at a different position.

Trade Campbell for not much, give up a bunch for McNabb and wind up with Grossman as the QB.

Its such a consistent theme with this team -- fixing things that don't need fixing -- and doing limited work in the areas where the needs are greatest.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | January 18, 2011 4:51 PM | Report abuse

"Garbage in, garbage out" ... sounds like my wife talking in the bedroom.

Next season, if there is a next season, Skins play the AFC East, the NFC West, plus the Vikings and the Panthers.

Super Bowl! [Or, at least, a slot in the 2012 draft that is 17 or higher ... or ... at least ... more than six wins ... woo ... hoo.]

Posted by: dcsween | January 18, 2011 4:51 PM | Report abuse

Give the kid props: he hasn't choked on the big stage.

gimmesummoe | January 18, 2011 3:57 PM

True enough and more than happy to grant him that.

But until they face somebody in the play-offs who shuts down their rush attack and scores on their defense and Sanchez has to pass 40+ times and bring them back with passing, I cannot get past that 54.8 completion %.

Even at the end of his second season he has something like one game is it with 35 - 40 plus pass attempts? OK many coaches don't necessarily want to put a young QB in a position where he has to pass that many times and carry the offense/team and they can win other ways so don't necessarily need to.

But until such time as he has proven he can, I'm not sold on him.

Maybe it will happen against Pittsburgh though - would have thought there is a good chance they will try to stop the Jets ground game first.

Posted by: craig81 |

Too early to write the story on Sanchez. He's not a good QB yet, but he's done a number of things well and I think he'll be a good QB, with a modest chance of being a great QB, in the next few years.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | January 18, 2011 4:56 PM | Report abuse

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n62N7GnbjlU&feature=related

Looks like NPI/P_F's uncle caught him posting on the internet

Posted by: learnedhand1 | January 18, 2011 4:57 PM | Report abuse

Too early to write the story on Sanchez. He's not a good QB yet, but he's done a number of things well and I think he'll be a good QB, with a modest chance of being a great QB, in the next few years.

zcezcest1 | January 18, 2011 4:56 PM

Oh yes, definitely early days yet. But I would prefer to see him a bit further along at this point, or at least given a chance to be further along. At what point if any does trying to protect a young quarterback actually retard their development?

Though I suppose that what happens when you are trying to win now with running game, defense and a QB who doesn't lose you the game.

Posted by: craig81 | January 18, 2011 5:06 PM | Report abuse

This is what happened to the draft picks we've traded away recently.

Nate Allen
Dominique Franks
Dennis Morris
Marquis johnson
Pat White
Sammie Lee Hill
Jasper Brinkley
Eddie Williams
Sam Baker
Harry Douglas
Jack Williams
Kroy Bierman
Chris Chamberlain
Eric Weddle
Ryan Harris
Jay Moore
Manny Lawson
Brandon Williams
Brandon Marshall
Drew Coleman
Josh Bullocks
Karl Paymah
Ciatrick Fason
Trent Cole

I wonder who we got in return.

Posted by: PAskinsfan17 | January 18, 2011 5:12 PM | Report abuse

lol lh, if only more parents were like that uncle.

Posted by: kerzon417 | January 18, 2011 5:25 PM | Report abuse


JC17 no longer plays here so if you want to suck his d-ck please go to Oakland and do it.

Posted by: Flounder21

well that was rude

Posted by: zcezcest1 | January 18, 2011 4:12 PM |
-------------

adolescent

Posted by: hessone | January 18, 2011 5:31 PM | Report abuse

Is this the crap we can expect until we get a new blog owner?

Posted by: Flounder21 | January 18, 2011 5:36 PM | Report abuse

craig

But until they face somebody in the play-offs who shuts down their rush attack

How is it any quarterback's issue that no one can shut down his offense's rush attack?

The knock on Sanchez was that he didn't have the college playing experience to be an NFL quarterback--and to date, he has not choked on the big stage of the playoffs.

The kid is in his second year as a starter--who thinks he's supposed to be Johnny Unitas at this point in his career?

His play was erratic to start the game Sunday, but he made 3 very solid passes for touchdowns: the touch pass to Holmes in the corner of the end zone was pretty.

He's led his team to wins against two of the best franchises in sports: the Pats and the Colts.

And you give him props as the quarterback gets the hoots when his team loses and should get the cheers when they win.

That's just how it is.

Posted by: MistaMoe | January 18, 2011 5:38 PM | Report abuse

The Jets and Bears are where they are in spite of their qbs not because of them. Both are decent but nothing more at this point. If the 'skins had Bradford they wouldn't have a left tackle. The Bears and Jets prove that if you have a dominant defense, a running game and solid special teams you can win with a qb like Cutler or Sanchez.

Posted by: bangkokben | January 18, 2011 5:39 PM | Report abuse

Is trash talking good or bad for the NFL? Our expert panelists provide their opinion in The League.

How does one become an expert in 'trash talking'?

And then why does such a person wind up working as a sportswriter?

The average fan in the stands or watching on tv doesn't even hear any of the trash talking--so how can he have an opinion about how it effects the game?

Posted by: MistaMoe | January 18, 2011 5:46 PM | Report abuse

The Bears and Jets prove that if you have a dominant defense, a running game and solid special teams you can win with a qb like Cutler or Sanchez.

I'd say this was proven in 1972 when the 17-0 Miami Dolphins used two quarterbacks (one a back up) the year they won a championship.

Thing is, folks keep comparing extremely young quarterbacks (Sanchez-Cutler) to nothing as they don't measure up to the best of all time.

Given the amount of passing that goes on today, some of these guys folks criticize now (Rivers, Cutler, Sanchez, Bradford, Roethlisberger, Freeman, Rodgers, Flacco, Ryan, Fitzpatrick, et al.) will totally re-write the league's passing numbers.

We're living in one of the most prolific periods of offensive production in the history of football, and mock good young quarterbacks.

Why?

'Cuz we ain't got one, that's why.

Posted by: MistaMoe | January 18, 2011 5:55 PM | Report abuse

Is this the crap we can expect until we get a new blog owner?

Posted by: Flounder21 | January 18, 2011 5:36 PM

Like usual, our team is done for the year. The draft, free agency and OTA's are a long way away. What do you expect?

Posted by: mack1 | January 18, 2011 6:02 PM | Report abuse

Moe,

True we live in a time when passing records will be broken. (McNabb would've broke the yardage record for this franchise but no one was saying he was playing his best.) Still, Cutler is not a good qb. He will throw at least two picks Sunday including one in the redzone. Sanchez is just young, but he shouldn't be compared to Big Ben at this stage of his career as Roethlisberger led his team by managing the game and not making mistakes. Sanchez is like a streak shooting point gaurd. He has the ability to get hot and then has the ability to miss the backside of a barn.

The prolification of offense has more to do with the rules and the schemes than talent.

Posted by: bangkokben | January 18, 2011 6:13 PM | Report abuse

"garbage in, garbage out" pretty much sums up the past decade of Redskin football futility.

Posted by: mohawk44 | January 18, 2011 6:16 PM | Report abuse

With regard to the question whether the Redskins should have been more aggressive in pursuing Sanchez and Cutler, this is a stupid question. No!The problem is and has been the lack of an excellent offensive line. Look how well Jason Campbell is now doing in Oakland. Play the tape of the Redskins/Chicago game, and ask yourselves again, why did Cutler look so pitiful? His offensive line did not protect him; now it is doing that. I heard Kurt Warner(a Superbowl winning quarterback) state recently how important it is for the Offensive Coordinator to adjust to his quarterback's strengths and not simply try to fit the quarterback into the Offensive Coordinator's "system". Did Kyle Shananhan do this with McNabb? No! Everyone was singing the praises of Grossman after his first start, and the voices became very quiet after the next two.One does not need the brains of Einstein to see the problem that even Stevie Wonder could clearly see.When McNabb leaves and goes to another team, miraculously, he will regain his pro bowl form, and "Junior" Shanahan will be struggling to get another quarterback to fit into his system.

Posted by: nmyricks | January 18, 2011 6:22 PM | Report abuse

We're living in one of the most prolific periods of offensive production in the history of football, and mock good young quarterbacks.

Why?

'Cuz we ain't got one, that's why.

Posted by: MistaMoe | January 18, 2011 5:55 PM

(Day 5)

C'mon, Moe, let's turn that frown upside down!

On our roster, we have 2 QBs who led their teams to Super Bowls, including one who is a 6x Pro-Bowler.

How many teams can boast THAT kind of record at the QB position?

This is just the lull before the storm!

Posted by: Alan4 | January 18, 2011 6:24 PM | Report abuse

And you give him props as the quarterback gets the hoots when his team loses and should get the cheers when they win.

That's just how it is.

MistaMoe | January 18, 2011 5:38 PM

It certainly is Moe. Too much credit when they win and too much blame when they lose!

The comment about the running game being shut down wasn't a knock on anything that Sanchez has done, but really just to say that I just want to see Shanchez win a game passing when the Jets run game and defense aren't working.

I'm not saying I expect him to be Johnny Unitas and he certainly throws some good passes, but I would just like him to be further along before I put him in the company of the other quarterbacks you mentioned later (5.55pm).

Though I'll freely admit that he hasn't been given any opportunities to show if he can or not yet because the Jets have set themselves up so he doesn't have to.

However until such time as he shows me he can take the team on his shoulders I would take any of those other quarterbacks over him.

And if I'm allowed a Cerrato moment, I would give three first round draft picks for Aaron Rogers.

I'm expecting a call to GM an NFL franchise any time now....

Posted by: craig81 | January 18, 2011 6:24 PM | Report abuse

The Jets have one in spite of Sanchez, not because of Sanchez.

Posted by: RedSkinHead | January 18, 2011 3:32 PM |

Dude - you must have nodded off when San made them nifty, thread-the-needle, tight-spiral throws to Edwards, Holmes and Crotchety against the Pats.

Posted by: TubularBells | January 18, 2011 3:41 PM | Report abuse

------------------------------------------
I live in Syracuse and I see Sanchez and the Jets on local televsion way too much. My son even played in the band when they did their scrimmage in Cortland. Sanchez is not a great quarterback. He's streaky in the way that Grossman is streaky. He will make some brilliant plays and then follow that up with some stupid pass that he had no business throwing. Maybe some day he will grow out of it, but you watch against the Steelers. I guarantee at least two interceptions.

Posted by: RedSkinHead | January 18, 2011 6:35 PM | Report abuse

Its such a consistent theme with this team -- fixing things that don't need fixing -- and doing limited work in the areas where the needs are greatest.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | January 18, 2011 4:51 PM | Report abuse

Nice analysis, dead on.
this team goes nowhere until we get some consisently good decision making from the front office, regardless of whether it means we lose 10 or more for a year or two (not saying that would happen but if it meant getting right I'm in; we've sucked for 20 years, what's a couple more?).
I am not down with taking a qb at #10, either trade back or take the highest player on your board at a position of need, likely WR or Dline this year. Keep the picks, choose smart in FA (find the guys who will be names, not the ones who have been names for years)and watch the results.

Posted by: DEskinzfan | January 18, 2011 6:37 PM | Report abuse

Take Brian Orakpo, who earned a Pro Bowl spot for his play at DE, and play him at a different position.

Its such a consistent theme with this team -- fixing things that don't need fixing -- and doing limited work in the areas where the needs are greatest.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | January 18, 2011 4:51 PM

Zeke- for the love of god. Please stop with the Orakpo DE nonsense. He played OLB last Yr and OCCASIONALLY he would line up at DE, but he was primarily an OLB and earned a Pro Bowl because of his sack totals rushing from OLB.

He is now a rush OLB much like Ware, Merriman, Harrison, Suggs, etc. He made the pro bowl again, despite being held every game, playing with an abysmal DL in front of him, and being our only true pass rusher

Posted by: Diesel44 | January 18, 2011 6:39 PM | Report abuse

Is trash talking good or bad for the NFL? Our expert panelists provide their opinion in The League.

How does one become an expert in 'trash talking'?

And then why does such a person wind up working as a sportswriter?

The average fan in the stands or watching on tv doesn't even hear any of the trash talking--so how can he have an opinion about how it effects the game?

Posted by: MistaMoe | January 18, 2011 5:46 PM
-----------------------------------------
I, for one, feel the "trash-writing" that goes on here at the blog is really bringing my game down.

Posted by: RedSkinHead | January 18, 2011 6:42 PM | Report abuse

Take Brian Orakpo, who earned a Pro Bowl spot for his play at DE, and play him at a different position.

Its such a consistent theme with this team -- fixing things that don't need fixing -- and doing limited work in the areas where the needs are greatest.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | January 18, 2011 4:51 PM

Zeke- for the love of god. Please stop with the Orakpo DE nonsense. He played OLB last Yr and OCCASIONALLY he would line up at DE, but he was primarily an OLB and earned a Pro Bowl because of his sack totals rushing from OLB.

He is now a rush OLB much like Ware, Merriman, Harrison, Suggs, etc. He made the pro bowl again, despite being held every game, playing with an abysmal DL in front of him, and being our only true pass rusher

Posted by: Diesel44

LOL!! Orakpo made an impact when he was playing DE last year, not when he was OLB. He made an impact this year when he was on the line rushing the passer, essentially playing a DE on those downs. Whether he had his hand down on the ground or not, he was a beast when he was on the line, not so much when he wasn't.

The guy is a terrific talent, I wish we'd use him doing what he does best -- all the time. Its not running with felix jones 30 yards downfield on a pass play.

Duh.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | January 18, 2011 6:46 PM | Report abuse

I heard Kurt Warner(a Superbowl winning quarterback) state recently how important it is for the Offensive Coordinator to adjust to his quarterback's strengths and not simply try to fit the quarterback into the Offensive Coordinator's "system". Did Kyle Shananhan do this with McNabb? No!

Posted by: nmyricks | January 18, 2011 6:22 PM

Actually the team did make some changes mid-season to better accomodate McNabb, the argument was over whether they had gone far enough.

However I have a thought that I just know is not going to go down very well here with a lot of people given the comments I've been reading over the year, but here goes:

In the same way we really do need to be patient with young players and the ShanAllen regime, perhaps we need to be a bit patient with Kyle Shanahan as a playcaller?

The rumours coming out of Houston are that whilst Shanahan designed the plays (which have had a lot of praise) it was Kubiak that called them. Which if true would have made 2010 his first year calling plays.

So it, like so many things, may take a bit of time.

And anyway, unless Shanahan snr goes (cue those who want to fire him after one season) Kyle ain't going anywhere.

And before everybody piles on, lets use a comparision, just how long do they think many fans or Snyder would really have been patient with the growing pains of an up and coming co-ordinator as head coach (such as Raheem Morris, John Harbaugh or Mike McCarthy)?


Posted by: craig81 | January 18, 2011 6:48 PM | Report abuse

And before everybody piles on, lets use a comparision, just how long do they think many fans or Snyder would really have been patient with the growing pains of an up and coming co-ordinator as head coach (such as Raheem Morris, John Harbaugh or Mike McCarthy)?

Posted by: craig81 | January 18, 2011 6:48 PM

That should of course be construed as the growing pains that the likes of Morris, Harbaugh and McCarthy went through on becoming head coaches.

Tampa Bay almost fired Morris after his first year in charge? lets play guessing what Snyder would have done in a similar situation.

Though I'm starting to wander from my initial point(less).

Posted by: craig81 | January 18, 2011 6:55 PM | Report abuse

Swear to god, when I saw this headline, I thought it might be a piece about the info the scouting dept provided Gibbs 2.0, and why the team didn't improve significantly under him.

Posted by: TheCork | January 18, 2011 6:56 PM | Report abuse

Zeke- You don't need to have your hand in the dirt to rush the passer. Last Yr he would move around and BLITZ not lined up a DE but at the OLB spot. He BLITZED over 200x last YR and the goal was that he could come close to doubling that this Yr as a rush OLB.

A rush OLB in a 3-4 is not a traditional OLB...They primarily rush the passer, hence the word "rush". Occasionally as part of the deceptive nature of the 3-4 a rush OLB drops in to coverage. Put even an average DL in front of him and he'll start in the Pro Bowl instead of being an alternate.


Posted by: Diesel44 | January 18, 2011 6:57 PM | Report abuse

I heard Kurt Warner(a Superbowl winning quarterback) state recently how important it is for the Offensive Coordinator to adjust to his quarterback's strengths and not simply try to fit the quarterback into the Offensive Coordinator's "system". Did Kyle Shananhan do this with McNabb? No!

Posted by: nmyricks

What is clear is that Shanahan didn't think Campbell could handle it and McNabb didn't handle it. There is reason to be concerned about a system that 2 different NFL starting-quality QBs can't handle.

A system has to be flexible enough to account for the talent on hand. That didn't happen with either QB (the one that finished 2009 and the one that started 2010) and it didn't happen with the defense (except for moving LL30 back where he belonged).

I'm OK with Grossman running the show in 2011 if we spend our energy on the lines. Because this system plays to his strengths. Still, I hope Shanny is more willing to adapt as we go forward.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | January 18, 2011 7:05 PM | Report abuse

There is reason to be concerned about a system that 2 different NFL starting-quality QBs can't handle.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | January 18, 2011 7:05 PM

Taking a lot of jump shots tonight and nothing but air.

Posted by: Diesel44 | January 18, 2011 7:09 PM | Report abuse

Zeke- You don't need to have your hand in the dirt to rush the passer. Last Yr he would move around and BLITZ not lined up a DE but at the OLB spot. He BLITZED over 200x last YR and the goal was that he could come close to doubling that this Yr as a rush OLB.

A rush OLB in a 3-4 is not a traditional OLB...They primarily rush the passer, hence the word "rush". Occasionally as part of the deceptive nature of the 3-4 a rush OLB drops in to coverage. Put even an average DL in front of him and he'll start in the Pro Bowl instead of being an alternate.


Posted by: Diesel44

Its so funny because I was a pretty lonely voice in liking the Skins plan in 2009 to use him at both OLB and at DE. I thought he had the speed to play OLB and questioned whether had the ability to be a top DE. Well, he was great at DE -- including better than I expected vs the run -- and so-so at OLB.

I'd like to see him be a full time DE. In effect, its a 3-4 with 4 linemen. I think he rushes better with his hand down, but if he matches up better with certain guys from a standing position, got no issue with that. As for moving him around, sure. He can go from either side, a la Peppers. Find the match-up that he can dominate and turn him lose.

But we're back to where we were a while back:

agree to disagree.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | January 18, 2011 7:15 PM | Report abuse

ProFootbalFocus

Btw, Guess what corner was 2nd to Mike Jenkins' 994 yards yielded? PRO BOWLER DeAngelo Hall, gave up 965 yards

Posted by: learnedhand1 | January 18, 2011 4:51 PM

That site turned into a pay site simce last YR. Any idea how many TDs Dhall gave up? I lost count..

Posted by: Diesel44 | January 18, 2011 7:20 PM | Report abuse

Its so funny because I was a pretty lonely voice in liking the Skins plan in 2009 to use him at both OLB and at DE. I thought he had the speed to play OLB and questioned whether had the ability to be a top DE. Well, he was great at DE -- including better than I expected vs the run -- and so-so at OLB.

I'd like to see him be a full time DE. In effect, its a 3-4 with 4 linemen. I think he rushes better with his hand down, but if he matches up better with certain guys from a standing position, got no issue with that. As for moving him around, sure. He can go from either side, a la Peppers. Find the match-up that he can dominate and turn him lose.

But we're back to where we were a while back:

agree to disagree.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | January 18, 2011 7:15 PM |

Every team that runs a 3-4 has a OLB that rushes the QB 90% of the time so there all 3-4 with 4 linemen.

Some are better in coverage then others but they only cover sparingly anyway.

Examples of OLB who rush 90% of the time.
D. Ware
T. Suggs
C. Matthews
B. Orakpo
J. Harrison

I'm sure there are more but you get the idea.

Posted by: Flounder21 | January 18, 2011 7:27 PM | Report abuse

That site turned into a pay site simce last YR. Any idea how many TDs Dhall gave up? I lost count..

Posted by: Diesel44 | January 18, 2011 7:20 PM

4 million

Posted by: scampbell1975 | January 18, 2011 7:38 PM | Report abuse

mohawk44

"garbage in, garbage out" pretty much sums up the past decade of Redskin football futility.

All snarkiness aside, I say we are in a 'calm before the storm' period.

Now that the older vet (Parker/Johnson/Galloway/McNabb) additions have failed, I'd say Shanny will embrace the youth movement so many of us have wanted.

Yeah, we might have another 6-10 or 7-9 season, but that is still progress after back to back 4-12 finishes.

I'm looking for this team to suddenly show signs of improvement the second half of the 2011 season..

...with 2012 being things show signs of dramatic improvement.

Posted by: MistaMoe | January 18, 2011 7:44 PM | Report abuse

beep beep

Posted by: scampbell1975 | January 18, 2011 7:46 PM | Report abuse

Its so funny because I was a pretty lonely voice in liking the Skins plan in 2009 to use him at both OLB and at DE. I thought he had the speed to play OLB and questioned whether had the ability to be a top DE. Well, he was great at DE -- including better than I expected vs the run -- and so-so at OLB.

I'd like to see him be a full time DE. In effect, its a 3-4 with 4 linemen. I think he rushes better with his hand down, but if he matches up better with certain guys from a standing position, got no issue with that. As for moving him around, sure. He can go from either side, a la Peppers. Find the match-up that he can dominate and turn him lose.

But we're back to where we were a while back:

agree to disagree.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | January 18, 2011 7:15 PM
-----------------------------------------
Been following your string and I am a little confused. You seem to be saying that when Orakpo puts his hand down this makes him a defensive end, and when he plays standing up he's a linebacker. Is that correct? Lawrence Taylor used to play with his hand down and I never once heard anyone refer to him as an end. I don't think that is how you tell the difference between the two. What do you do with a 5-2? Who is the linebacker and who is the defensive linemen? Seven guys sometimes have their hands in the dirt.

I guess my point is you can call them what you want, but it is really hard to tell the difference in some defenses. I've seen the Steelers drop nose tackles back into pass coverage. Does that make the nose tackle a linebacker or a safety? Orakpo rushes the passer on almost every passing down but a linebacker in a 3-4 sometimes has to cover. I watched the Packers beat up the Eagles, and I saw Clay Matthews in coverage on McCoy. He did a lousy job by the way, but that is what happens with linebackers in pass coverage. I wouldn't dare say Matthews is a lousy linebacker and should be a defensive end.

Posted by: RedSkinHead | January 18, 2011 7:59 PM | Report abuse

BTW, I have only two problems with how they use Orakpo: 1) they need to move him around more and 2) they need to teach him how to work the zebras so they'll start looking for some of those holds.

Posted by: RedSkinHead | January 18, 2011 8:02 PM | Report abuse

Trash Talk in the NFL? I thought we were talking about this blog.

Posted by: notindc2 | January 19, 2011 1:48 PM | Report abuse

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