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Heyer, Springs, Washington Updates

Jason La Canfora texts this in:

Tackle Stephon Heyer said he will not know whether he can practice this week until tomorrow at the earliest. Heyer said his shoulder is responding better to rest and treatment, but he is not yet to play fully.

"I want to make sure I'm 100 percent before I come back," Heyer said.

Jon Jansen has thrived in Heyer's absence and, as center Casey Rabach put it, it would be very hard ro take Jansen out of the lineup now.
...

Shawn Springs said his calf is feeling much better and he is certain he will be ready to play against the Rams. "I'll be rocking this weekend," he said. "I feel good. I'm playing."

Springs said he may be limited a bit in practice Wednesday but expects to be practicing fully by the end of the week.
"I'm gonna be out there this weekend," Springs said. "As good as we played without me. I might be coming off the bench, but I'm playing."

...

Strong-side linebacker Marcus Washington, slowed by recurring hamstring injuries the past two seasons, said he sat out Sunday's victory over Philadelphia "just to rest it a little more and make sure," he said. "I didn't [regress] or anything like that, but it still wasn't totally there. Instead of going out there, playing with the pain and trying to fight through it, I just wanted to maybe get it as close to 100 percent as possible."

Washington said he expects to play Sunday.

By Cindy Boren  |  October 6, 2008; 11:52 AM ET
 
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Next: Griffin Having MRI; Kelly's Knee Swells

Comments

these games are all meaningless. after all, we all know that every time the Giants win the Super Bowl, the Skins win the year after. Worked in 87, 91, and will work in '09. TAMPA, HERE WE COME!!!

Posted by: kman2 | October 6, 2008 12:00 PM | Report abuse

Not posting anything because it causes Beep Beeps.

Posted by: Corkczar | October 6, 2008 12:03 PM | Report abuse

The fact that McNabb no longer scrambles allowed Fletch to more or less shadow Westbrook rather than have to shadow McNabb like they have had to in the past. Enough can't be said about Fletcher he stuck with one of the best if not the best back in the NFL. All those years of practing aginst Marshall Faulk must have helped. After he made that last tackle against Westbrook and came back to the sideline screaming I thought i had left earth for a moment.

Posted by: Pleepleus | October 6, 2008 12:04 PM | Report abuse

these games are all meaningless. after all, we all know that every time the Giants win the Super Bowl, the Skins win the year after. Worked in 87, 91, and will work in '09. TAMPA, HERE WE COME!!!

Posted by: kman2 | October 6, 2008 12:00 PM | Report abuse

Does this mean that we'll beat the defending AFC champions (Patriots, this time) in Tampa? That also worked in 87 and 91...

Posted by: online360 | October 6, 2008 12:05 PM | Report abuse

Everybody wants to get healthy to play against St. Louis.

I wonder what Al Saunders is thinking when he looks at the Redskins offense under Zorn?

For that matter, what does Gibbs think? If Gibbs had only hired Zorn as OC instead of Saunders...

Posted by: talent_evaluator | October 6, 2008 12:06 PM | Report abuse

Agree Jansen has won back his job.

Marcus doesn't want to allow H.B. too much time in his stead.

Taylor? Take your time. We got it covered.

Springs? Welcome back, dude.

Kelly? Hey, Thomas caught two balls. Your turn against the Rams.


Posted by: Corkczar | October 6, 2008 12:06 PM | Report abuse

Yeh - when Fox showed all our prime guys on the sidelines, I got a queasy feeling in my stomach (in hindsight, it could have been the fried 'poppers').

And we STILL whopped 'em! Hail!

From previous post:

Hyougn & Magture are my favorite Vietnamese & Eastern European crime fighting duo!!

Posted by: DikShuttle | October 6, 2008 12:02 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: DikShuttle | October 6, 2008 12:07 PM | Report abuse

Sorry, Cork. When the maroon-and-black are 4-1, you have to stay nimble up here. (Which is a lot like staying medium....)

Posted by: CindyBoren | October 6, 2008 12:07 PM | Report abuse

++++ wonder what Al Saunders is thinking when he looks at the Redskins offense under Zorn?


Posted by: talent_evaluator | October 6, 2008 12:06 PM++++


That ripping sound? saunders tearing pages out of his playbook.

Posted by: Corkczar | October 6, 2008 12:08 PM | Report abuse

So cork, are you saying that perhaps all Thomas and some other rookies needed was a little time?? That maybe, just MAYBE the first week of the season wasn't the best time to pass judgement on them??

Wow.....

Posted by: BeantownGreg | October 6, 2008 12:12 PM | Report abuse

Fletch did an outstanding job on Westbrook, he far exceeded my expectations for him on the day. The play where he actually ran down Wesbrook from behind had me going nuts, I couldnt believe he made that one.

Posted by: Stu27 | October 6, 2008 12:15 PM | Report abuse

The other thing CC said on first take is that the are not looking down the road. They are looking at the next game.

Medium!!

Posted by: Curzon417 | October 6, 2008 12:10 PM

Posted by: Curzon417 | October 6, 2008 12:17 PM | Report abuse

So all you guys who demanded Jansen and Thrash be cut, come forward and take your medicine.


Posted by: Corkczar | October 6, 2008 11:56 AM

I was one that said Thrash must go. Too old to play. Pass the pie...

Posted by: Curzon417 | October 6, 2008 12:20 PM | Report abuse

The two live Stews are debating Skip. Doug Stew just said the the Skins are sill the last and worst team ini the East, that teams get hot at the right time skins are them. The other Stew said that were still behin the giants and Dallas cause we wont beat either at the end of the year. Skip said we will finish 12-4 Giants 13-3 end up a game behind them, said we have been great and won every quarter since after the fist at NY. Said we can run the ball and our D is outstanding, filling in for ST too.

Normall I like and agree with the Stew's but WTF how can you claim were the worst thats just crazy.

Stews just made Stus S list.

Posted by: Stu27 | October 6, 2008 12:20 PM | Report abuse

Random Thoughts:

I'm not ready to give J.C. a long term deal quite yet, but I like what I'm seeing.

I (think I) was one of the few voices defending Jon Jansen in the pre-season and took a lot of heat for it. I just like that guy being on my football team, that's all.

I said I hate Eagles fans way more than Dallas fans...although it's close. I've cleared some room for anyone who wants to jump on that bus.

Something tells me Sherman Smith is not getting enough credit for the job he is doing as our offensive coordinator. Same with Stump Mitchell. This can't all be Zorn.

We need to draft a punter next year.

Posted by: isnadd | October 6, 2008 12:21 PM | Report abuse

A fairweather fan is a fan that roots for teams that are playing well.
Being a fairweather or band wagon jumper fan is more popular than being loyal to one team.

Here is to hoping everyone remembers if we lose 2, or 3 of the next 5 or 6, STAY MEDIUM!!!!!

Posted by: Club320 | October 6, 2008 12:22 PM | Report abuse

So all you guys who demanded Jansen and Thrash be cut, come forward and take your medicine.


Posted by: Corkczar | October 6, 2008 11:56 AM

I was one that said Thrash must go. Too old to play. Pass the pie...

Posted by: Curzon417 | October 6, 2008 12:20 PM | Report abuse

I never said it, but I am pretty sure I thought it a couple of times (with Thrash, that is).

I'll take a slice.

Posted by: SirAnonymoustheGreat | October 6, 2008 12:23 PM | Report abuse

I might have thought that Thrash had outlasted his effectiveness, at one point.

Posted by: BeantownGreg | October 6, 2008 12:27 PM | Report abuse

How has Jansen earned the RT job? You don't lose your job due to injury. Prior to getting hurt, Heyer started in 2 wins and had not done anything to merit losing is spot.

Posted by: learnedhand1 | October 6, 2008 12:27 PM | Report abuse

We need to draft a punter next year.

Posted by: isnadd | October 6, 2008 12:21 PM

Be careful with that. What happens is you get your wish and people notice. Then the guy is inconsistent and starts cough up PRs for TDs. Then peeps fall back in love with the line driver who got cut (because at least he made those tackles and never had one of his punts returned to the house). [Then peeps lighten up a little when the guy they accidentally fell back in love with his pulling his crap on his new team ... and those peeps realize they were in a dysfunctional relationship with that guy.] Then peeps start posting stuff like this. Then you hope your drafted punter turns it all around and becomes a special teams rookie of the year, but you don't bet your mortgage on it.

Be careful. Stay medium.

Posted by: dcsween | October 6, 2008 12:28 PM | Report abuse

Am I the only one who thinks randle-el (i think) wasn't touched when he dived for the ball rand half way down the field until the ref blew the play dead!!!?? i mean if the play was dead why wait till the last second to blow the whistle
Posted by: Juniah922 | October 6, 2008 12:05 PM |

Totally agree. Refs were up to the usual ineptitude of the season. Also, what was up with that last play of our goal line stand? The play clock ran out, then they said the refs reset it, and the eagles ran, like another 15 seconds off before the snap???? Why was this not delay of game? Worked out okay though, heh.

Anyone know the rule about faceguarding? I thought for sure that Rocky was gonna get a penalty in the endzone in the 1st qtr. Looked like faceguarding to me, but Buck or Aikman said that you CAN try to shield the receiver's eyes........maybe they changed the rules, but I though that it was illegal......anyone?

Posted by: dlhaze1 | October 6, 2008 12:30 PM | Report abuse

However it came about, soooo glad we have Zorn!!

Greg, let me know if you need me to post the complete article.


http://www.philly.com/inquirer/columnists/ashley_fox/20081006_Ashley_Fox___Jim_Zorn_wins_the_coaching_battle.html
Ashley Fox: Jim Zorn wins the coaching battle

By Ashley Fox

Inquirer NFL columnist
Andy Reid said it, as he so often does.

"I have to get our guys into better positions to make plays, and when they are in those positions, we have to make sure that [plays] get made," Reid said minutes after the Eagles lost to the Washington Redskins, 23-17.

Try this. Steal a page or 50 out of Jim Zorn's playbook, because, boy, that rookie can coach, and in case you haven't noticed, your offense is in the midst of a wicked identity crisis.

Zorn's game plan, apparently, was to stay the course and use the running game to pound away yards while Jason Campbell dinked and dunked his way down the field. And then, when the Redskins got into the red zone, Zorn pulled out a play the Redskins had practiced once, and the result was a go-ahead touchdown and Washington's fourth consecutive win.

Posted by: Curzon417 | October 6, 2008 12:30 PM | Report abuse

I can't believe it, oh, yes I can. Two idiots on ESPN said that we are still the worst team in the NFC East and that we can't beat the other teams. Did I see a different last 2 games than them? What a bunch of idiots.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | October 6, 2008 12:30 PM | Report abuse

Everybody wants to get healthy to play against St. Louis.

I wonder what Al Saunders is thinking when he looks at the Redskins offense under Zorn?

For that matter, what does Gibbs think? If Gibbs had only hired Zorn as OC instead of Saunders...

Posted by: talent_evaluator | October 6, 2008 12:06 PM | Report abuse
Gibbs would have never let Zorn be Zorn. All these winning plays would never have happend because it wasn't Joe's style.

Posted by: Pleepleus | October 6, 2008 12:30 PM | Report abuse

Learned, there is a CATEGORICAL difference in the running game when Jansen is in there, and when Heyer is in there. With Jansen there is the ability to run to the right side. With Heyer, there is not. Jansen had handled himself well in the pass game as well.

He's just an ornery ol bastard, he's mean, and he likes to mix it up. Heyer needs to get healthy, and get a hair across his backside in the run game.

Posted by: BeantownGreg | October 6, 2008 12:30 PM | Report abuse

I said I hate Eagles fans way more than Dallas fans...although it's close.

Posted by: isnadd | October 6, 2008 12:21 PM

inadd,

Is it "way more" or is it "close"? Can't have it both ways. And I agree with you on Zorn/Smith/Mitchell. They keep saying on the game broadcasts that Zorn is "QB coach, OC, and head coach." I wonder where they get that from?

Posted by: talent_evaluator | October 6, 2008 12:30 PM | Report abuse

I think it's safe to say we all love Thrash as a locker room leader, core Redskin, and etc. -- if you didn't LOVE his TD catch last weekend, you are like the Tin Man, you have no heart -- but we're all ready for him to drop down the depth chart as these kid WRs get better and better.

And it looks like Thomas is taking steps to do just that, a little more each week, including growing pains... that kid has wheels, will be awfully nice to see that kind of threat lined up on both sides of the field...

Posted by: NateinthePDX | October 6, 2008 12:31 PM | Report abuse

Looked like faceguarding to me, but Buck or Aikman said that you CAN try to shield the receiver's eyes........maybe they changed the rules, but I though that it was illegal......anyone?

Posted by: dlhaze1 | October 6, 2008 12:30 PM

You can wave your hands in front of the guy's face, you just can't touch the mask.

Posted by: dcsween | October 6, 2008 12:33 PM | Report abuse

Nate, agreed on Thomas, I think he's gonna be a huge factor by week 16.

Curz, if its not too much trouble to post it, I'd appreciate it.

Posted by: BeantownGreg | October 6, 2008 12:33 PM | Report abuse

...
lh, i wanted to "correct" you on the vegas line thing courtesy of "casino"...the initial line is based on expert analysis of two teams facing eachother. and then after the line has been posted the betters move the line.
...

Posted by: dealer1 | October 6, 2008 11:56 AM

Huh? When did I say something about the "line"?

Posted by: learnedhand1 | October 6, 2008 12:34 PM | Report abuse

I don't remember what I posted during the offeseason, but based on what I feel like I've felt for a while, I probably said that Jansen's ankle won't get better (and that he's always had issues with pass blocking anyway) and that Thrash has always been a safe security blanket.

I also still agree with what I said earlier about not pulling a replacement QB when he's hot (i.e., keep Jansen till he runs out of gas). And I still remember that we ended a season (2006) on David Patten dropping two straight passes in a row ... and that Thrash would have reliably had those.

Posted by: dcsween | October 6, 2008 12:36 PM | Report abuse

Greg...

Ashley Fox: Jim Zorn wins the coaching battle

Andy Reid said it, as he so often does.

"I have to get our guys into better positions to make plays, and when they are in those positions, we have to make sure that [plays] get made," Reid said minutes after the Eagles lost to the Washington Redskins, 23-17.

Try this. Steal a page or 50 out of Jim Zorn's playbook, because, boy, that rookie can coach, and in case you haven't noticed, your offense is in the midst of a wicked identity crisis.

Zorn's game plan, apparently, was to stay the course and use the running game to pound away yards while Jason Campbell dinked and dunked his way down the field. And then, when the Redskins got into the red zone, Zorn pulled out a play the Redskins had practiced once, and the result was a go-ahead touchdown and Washington's fourth consecutive win.

The Eagles got 2 yards shy of the goal line needing a score to come back, and it was the Chicago game all over again. Donovan McNabb almost called a time-out, then didn't. He barked an audible that either the linemen didn't hear or didn't understand, and then Brian Westbrook got the football in a position where he could not succeed, took a 3-yard loss and that, folks, was the ball game.

In a similar situation, Zorn called for his quarterback to roll left as if he was going to pass, then hand off to Antwaan Randle El, who ran to the right sideline and found a wide-open Chris Cooley, who had run a delay route and found that, as he said, "no one covered me." It was an easy six.

To review: Zorn's play-calling was creative, Reid's was not. Zorn gambled, Reid did not. Zorn won, Reid did not.

And now, here we are, five weeks into the season, and the Eagles have a crisis of confidence and a lack of identity.

The natural reaction is to thank the football gods that San Francisco is up next on the old schedule, but even a game against that flailing franchise isn't a given. Not anymore.

The Eagles had a beautiful opening drive, totally exposing a blatant mismatch between tight end L.J. Smith and linebacker Rocky McIntosh, that ended when Brian Westbrook somehow plowed through a slew of defenders untouched into the end zone.

But that was really it for using Smith. He caught two passes that drive, one more later in the first half, and then the Eagles didn't go to him again. Asked if the Redskins took something away from Smith, McNabb just shook his head and said, "No, they didn't."

That, friends, falls on the head coach. Although Reid hasn't officially acknowledged this fact, he's calling the plays now, not offensive coordinator Marty Mornhinweg. Reid chose to get away from Smith, and go to what? A slew of three-and-outs that lasted nearly two quarters?

The offense that had run a sprint with Dallas just a few weeks ago couldn't do anything. The receivers were smothered, and had their share of drops. Westbrook, who added bruised ribs to his sprained ankle, didn't get enough carries to get into a rushing rhythm, and so, consequently, Reid abandoned the run altogether.

And the team faltered, like they had in Chicago, at the goal line.

No one either knew or would specifically say what happened on the third-and-1 play from the 2-yard line, they just knew they obviously failed miserably for a second consecutive week.

"It sucks. It sucks bad," Todd Herremans said. "I mean, we get down there at the goal line, we've got to be able to punch it in. It falls on the O-line again."

"If I had an answer, we would definitely know what's going on," McNabb said. "It's something that we definitely have to find an answer and solution for right now to get the job done."

That's the truth. And here's the bad news: Who knows whether Westbrook will be able to play at San Francisco. He got some kind of shot during the first quarter that allowed him to continue to play, but those ribs likely are killing him this morning, and that pain usually lingers. If he's not available, the Eagles are going to look like they did against the Bears, which was one-dimensional at best.

So here the Eagles sit. Reid promised that the team "will play hard, they will play hard for 60 minutes." He said that, yes, the Eagles can be the team he thought they were going to be, but admitted "we need to change this thing around obviously."

Reid has to get the offense settled down. If Westbrook can't go, he's got to be dedicated to consistently getting Correll Buckhalter the ball. He's got to get Smith involved more, and to spread it around to the receivers, including DeSean Jackson, who for whatever reason disappeared in the second half yesterday.

Reid's got to establish an identity for this offense. That's his responsibility, his job, and his No. 1 task right now. Everyone knows the Redskins will pound the ball then throw out a nifty play or two, knows the Giants will smash you in the mouth and spread it around, knows the Cowboys are a down-field team that can fall back on the run.

What exactly are the Eagles?

Reid needs to figure that out.

Posted by: Curzon417 | October 6, 2008 12:37 PM | Report abuse

Nate, agreed on Thomas, I think he's gonna be a huge factor by week 16.

Curz, if its not too much trouble to post it, I'd appreciate it.

Posted by: BeantownGreg | October 6, 2008 12:38 PM | Report abuse

Westbrook has fractured ribs -- status for Sunday against the niners is "unknown." Man, stick a fork in the Eagles.

Posted by: talent_evaluator | October 6, 2008 12:38 PM | Report abuse

Lets not get carried away on Thrash. 3 catches, 16 yards and 1 TD. He contributing at the level you'd expect from a 4th or 5th WR, which is what he is.

We cut Billy McMullen who has 7 catches for 124 in 3(?) games. Thrash is a keeper, as long as his plays at or near the vet minimum.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | October 6, 2008 12:41 PM | Report abuse

Thanks curz, good read.

"Zorn's play calling was creative".

Thats such a good thing for this team.

Posted by: BeantownGreg | October 6, 2008 12:42 PM | Report abuse

Anyone know the rule about faceguarding? I thought for sure that Rocky was gonna get a penalty in the endzone in the 1st qtr. Looked like faceguarding to me, but Buck or Aikman said that you CAN try to shield the receiver's eyes........maybe they changed the rules, but I though that it was illegal......anyone?

Posted by: dlhaze1

DLHAZE1 I don't think there's a faceguarding rule in the pros. I believe its only in high school and college. I may be wrong though.

Posted by: clark202 | October 6, 2008 12:42 PM | Report abuse

Two idiots on ESPN said that we are still the worst team in the NFC East and that we can't beat the other teams. Did I see a different last 2 games than them?

Posted by: scampbell1975 | October 6, 2008 12:30 PM

Who are you gonna believe: ESPN or your own eyes?

Posted by: talent_evaluator | October 6, 2008 12:42 PM | Report abuse

LH, would you shut up about the betting line already? I'm sick and tired of you going on and on with your theories about how Vegas works. Give it a rest, dude!

I know you have a gambling problem, but this ain't Gambler's Anonymous, man. Sheesh.

Posted by: NateinthePDX | October 6, 2008 12:43 PM | Report abuse

How has Jansen earned the RT job? You don't lose your job due to injury. Prior to getting hurt, Heyer started in 2 wins and had not done anything to merit losing is spot.

Posted by: learnedhand1 | October 6, 2008 12:27 PM | Report abuse

Sez who? Happens all the time in this league, where an injury replacement comes in, plays well, the team keeps winning, and the coach doesn't want to rock the boat by yanking the replacement when the former starter comes back. If I'm the 'Skins, I tell Heyer that we like him and he's still our RT of the future, but for now, we're sticking with Jansen.

Posted by: rbpalmer | October 6, 2008 12:43 PM | Report abuse

(just kidding, of course, LH... who knows what dealer's on about...)

Posted by: NateinthePDX | October 6, 2008 12:44 PM | Report abuse

Shawn Springs said his calf is feeling much better and he is certain he will be ready to play against the Rams. "I'll be rocking this weekend," he said. "I feel good. I'm playing."
Springs said he may be limited a bit in practice Wednesday but expects to be practicing fully by the end of the week.

Anyone else read into this that he won't be ready to play? Sounds like "I feel great and I'll play, BUT........"
Didn't he swear he was gonna play yesterday too?

I don't wanna sound too negative on Shawn.....maybe they should just rest him up for Cleveland and Braylon Edwards. All I know is that Smoot would be out there with a broken leg and separated shoulder.....

Posted by: dlhaze1 | October 6, 2008 12:44 PM | Report abuse

We cut Billy McMullen who has 7 catches for 124 in 3(?) games.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | October 6, 2008 12:41 PM

Right, and that's why the Seahawks are doing so badly -- they have to rely on guys who the Redskins cut.

Posted by: talent_evaluator | October 6, 2008 12:45 PM | Report abuse

Anyone know the rule about faceguarding? I thought for sure that Rocky was gonna get a penalty in the endzone in the 1st qtr. Looked like faceguarding to me, but Buck or Aikman said that you CAN try to shield the receiver's eyes........maybe they changed the rules, but I though that it was illegal......anyone?

Posted by: dlhaze1

DLHAZE1 I don't think there's a faceguarding rule in the pros. I believe its only in high school and college. I may be wrong though.

Posted by: clark202 | October 6, 2008 12:42 PM | Report abuse

There used to be a rule against faceguarding in the NFL, but they got rid of it a couple of years ago.

Posted by: rbpalmer | October 6, 2008 12:46 PM | Report abuse

Who are you gonna believe: ESPN or your own eyes?

Posted by: talent_evaluator | October 6, 2008 12:42 PM |
I believe my own eyes, I just can't figure out what the hell these guys are watching.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | October 6, 2008 12:48 PM | Report abuse

A bit of irony involving #50 for the Iggles. On DeSean Jackson's TD punt return, #50 clearly blocked our #50 Khary Campbell, in the back. I suppose you could have argued Jackson was already past Campbell, but seemed liked you gotta make that call.

In the 2nd half, Philly #50 gets a double flag, on ARE punt return....face mask and late hit out of bounds. Face mask seemed a bit weak, late hit seemed obvious. Big tack on.

Just seems like in the end, the bad calls kind of even out, no?

Hail!

Posted by: ksquare | October 6, 2008 12:50 PM | Report abuse

Someone put a big hit on big brother Westbrook:

BRIAN WESTBROOK HAS BROKEN RIBS
Posted by Michael David Smith on October 6, 2008, 12:29 p.m. EDT

Eagles running back Brian Westbrook was already nursing an ankle injury, and after Sunday’s loss to the Redskins he has another injury to worry about.

ESPN reports that Eagles coach Andy Reid said today that Westbrook has “fractured ribs.” He suffered the injury during the first half of yesterday’s game and returned after getting a painkilling injection. He finished with 12 carries for 33 yards and six catches for 51 yards.

Per ESPN, since Westbrook became the team’s starting running back, the Eagles have gone 36-23 with him and 3-7 without him.

There is no word on Westbrook’s status for Sunday’s game at San Francisco.

Posted by: Curzon417 | October 6, 2008 12:52 PM | Report abuse

K,
One cost a touchdown, the other, not so much.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | October 6, 2008 12:53 PM | Report abuse

A bit of irony involving #50 for the Iggles. On DeSean Jackson's TD punt return, #50 clearly blocked our #50 Khary Campbell, in the back. I suppose you could have argued Jackson was already past Campbell, but seemed liked you gotta make that call.

In the 2nd half, Philly #50 gets a double flag, on ARE punt return....face mask and late hit out of bounds. Face mask seemed a bit weak, late hit seemed obvious. Big tack on.

Just seems like in the end, the bad calls kind of even out, no?

Hail!

Posted by: ksquare | October 6, 2008 12:50 PM | Report abuse

a 15 yard penalty does not in anyway = a return touchdown that puts your team down 14 to 0 and would have crushed a lesser team. The call of Randel el being down when he wasn't touched was also inexcusable. The Eagles were at home with a big lead and the officals seemingly in their back pocket and they still lose. DMAC needs to wake up.

Posted by: Pleepleus | October 6, 2008 12:54 PM | Report abuse

But they only got to accept one 15-yard penalty, K2... Neither foul was flag-worthy in and of itself, but the combination was pretty clearly a foul... I think the refs got that one right.

Posted by: daggar | October 6, 2008 12:56 PM | Report abuse

ESPN reports that Eagles coach Andy Reid said today that Westbrook has “fractured ribs.” He suffered the injury during the first half of yesterday’s game and returned after getting a painkilling injection. He finished with 12 carries for 33 yards and six catches for 51 yards.

He probably had bruised/cracked ribs when he went to the sidelines.......and then fractured them when they showed him laying on the table with his arms crossed and the trainers on top of him putting all of their weight into his ribs.....thought that was kinda strange. Am I the only one who noticed that?

Posted by: dlhaze1 | October 6, 2008 12:57 PM | Report abuse

Yes, I totally agree that gambling is for gamblers ... anonymous ones (except for those who pick correctly, in which case its time to pay up) ... and I do not condemn gambling of any sort, esp. on football ... or darts ... or billiards ... or ... who am I kidding. My name is dcsween ...

Homer: "A terrible monster has taken your mother, children. And his name is Gamblor."

Posted by: dcsween | October 6, 2008 12:58 PM | Report abuse

Actually, regarding that #50 on the kicking team pushed his own slef in the back (these guys wont be working the playoffs), they made the same exact call against the iggles later in the game... then they also had those fouls out of bounds.... obvi > TD

Posted by: Zeebs | October 6, 2008 1:02 PM | Report abuse

condemn, condone, whatever

Posted by: dcsween | October 6, 2008 1:02 PM | Report abuse

I've loved Thrash since his first stint with the skins. If the new WRs have half the heart of that guy, we are in for some good stuff in the coming seasons.
That's part of what having Thrash around is good for. Being a great example for Thomas and Kelly.

You know, I remember Thrash having a monster game late last season. Then, he got hurt and was out for the rest of the year. Anybody have deets on that?

Posted by: MNSkinsFan | October 6, 2008 1:04 PM | Report abuse

For everyone blaming Brooks for the return TD, I was just wandering was he the only one for the Skins on the field? I watched the play 5 times there were 4 Skins within 10 yards of Jackson when he caught the ball, one got clipped and the others got used. The coverage team needs to make tackles, its as simple as that.

Brooks needs to do better but to blame one guy for a punt retun TD is dumb.

Posted by: Flounder21 | October 6, 2008 1:04 PM | Report abuse

Westbrook came off the field and took off his shoulder pads right after his TD. He got hit, but it didn't seem that hard. Anyone TiVo that? If it was a rib-breaking, but ultimately unsuccessful hit, my vote would be on LaRon. LFM.

Posted by: dcsween | October 6, 2008 1:05 PM | Report abuse

Skins have had no less than 6 calls that would have changed (likely) TDs -- all that went against the Skins

1. Moss catch vs nyg when he clearly wasn't touched after gaining possession
2&3. Rabach twice on the same drive vs dal
4. Heyer penalty on the bomb to Devin Thomas vs AZ
5. Flag thrown and then picked up vs phi on punt return
6. ARE play vs phi when he wasn't touched

Posted by: zcezcest1 | October 6, 2008 1:05 PM | Report abuse

Ksquare
I don't think that a blown call on a TD is canceled out by a 15 yard penelty. The NFL is gonna review that call and I think that ref will lose brownie points for blowing it.

We need full time refs with higher accountability standards.

Posted by: alex35332 | October 6, 2008 1:06 PM | Report abuse

Westbrook broke ribs in that game yesterday, fyi.

Posted by: CindyBoren | October 6, 2008 1:08 PM | Report abuse

Westbrook broke ribs in that game yesterday, fyi.

Posted by: CindyBoren | October 6, 2008 1:08 PM

Cindy we are trying to figure out who broke them?

Posted by: Flounder21 | October 6, 2008 1:09 PM | Report abuse

++++ wonder what Al Saunders is thinking when he looks at the Redskins offense under Zorn?


Posted by: talent_evaluator | October 6, 2008 12:06 PM++++


That ripping sound? saunders tearing pages out of his playbook.

Posted by: Corkczar | October 6, 2008 12:08 PM

I still think people make too much of that. Campbell inadvertently confirmed a couple weeks ago that Gibbs was essentially holding Saunders offense back and vetoing the more aggressive aspects. Also, considering the Terps playbook is reportedly 650 pages long, I don't think 700 is such a big deal in the pros.

Posted by: LiberalMike | October 6, 2008 1:10 PM | Report abuse

Anyone know the rule about faceguarding? I thought for sure that Rocky was gonna get a penalty in the endzone in the 1st qtr. Looked like faceguarding to me, but Buck or Aikman said that you CAN try to shield the receiver's eyes........maybe they changed the rules, but I though that it was illegal......anyone?

Posted by: dlhaze1

Old Ref Jerry Markbreit answers your question and others like it (or at least he used to do so in 2006).

http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/football/bears/askthereferee/cs-061212askjerrymarkbreit,0,7564550.story

Posted by: tafka | October 6, 2008 1:10 PM | Report abuse

"Anybody know what Cowherd is saying this morning? I can't tune him in on Monday's."
Posted by: MikeG22 | October 6, 2008 10:51 AM

Hey guys - I'm a 'Skins fan in Chattanooga so I'll update you on Cowherd since you are stuck with the Vinny circus. He said this morning that he "whiffed" on the Redskins - he said they got dominated by the Giants and he just didn't know how good the Giants were. He also addressed people who say that the Giants haven't played anybody - he said "They dominated the Redskins and the Redskins have dominated 4 straight teams since then." He also called the Giants, Redskins, and Titans the three most physical teams in the league, said he would take physical over finesse in the NFL in November and December, and said he would be worried if he were the Cowboys because the Giants and Redskins are so much more physical.

I know it is hard to believe, but I think Cowherd for the first time has admitted he was wrong about something.

Posted by: jwlemons | October 6, 2008 1:10 PM | Report abuse

Comments from the injured confirm a suspicion i had: The injured were held out as part of a strategic coaching decision. Its apparent from Heyer, Springs, Washington comments that all COULD have nutted up and played...but the staff chose to sit them and let the completely healthy start in their place. The reserves stepped up... because they all knew a) they could, and they were being trusted by their coaches and team mates to git 'er done.

It really is about the Team...from top to bottom.

But we are witnessing something very very very special. Enjoy the ride.

Last but not least I offer a belated tribute to the late great Mr Paul Newman: Rest of the NFL and all the media "Who ARE those guys???". They are learning.

Stay medium.

Posted by: SkinsfaninKaneohe | October 6, 2008 1:10 PM | Report abuse

We need full time refs with higher accountability standards.

Posted by: alex35332 | October 6, 2008 1:06 PM

How do you think "full time refs" will be better? Why not just expand the scope of instant replay? That would have solved some of those problems yesterday, but even full time refs will still make mistakes.

Posted by: talent_evaluator | October 6, 2008 1:11 PM | Report abuse

Also, considering the Terps playbook is reportedly 650 pages long, I don't think 700 is such a big deal in the pros.

Posted by: LiberalMike | October 6, 2008 1:10 PM

The Terps playbook is only that big for those times when The Fridge gets hungry during the game.

Posted by: tafka | October 6, 2008 1:12 PM | Report abuse

Thanks Tafka!

Posted by: dlhaze1 | October 6, 2008 1:14 PM | Report abuse

Did anyone else see Durant Brooks pursuing Jackson on the punt return for a TD?

At one point his arms were spinning around like windmills, as if the kid doesn't have enough problems...he is going to be mercifully heckled during special teams filming.

Posted by: isnadd | October 6, 2008 1:14 PM | Report abuse

That would be two busted ribs, for those of you keeping score at home.

Posted by: CindyBoren | October 6, 2008 1:15 PM | Report abuse

I just heard that a bridge collapsed in gainsville. trying to get confirmation.

Posted by: Original_etrod | October 6, 2008 1:16 PM | Report abuse

Andy Reid said the Westbrook rib injury happened on the Eagles' 8th play. Have to check it out on the DVR when I get home.

Posted by: PatM1 | October 6, 2008 1:17 PM | Report abuse

I think it was his first play that broke his ribs. 4 guys landed right on top of him and the ball....

Posted by: Zeebs | October 6, 2008 1:17 PM | Report abuse

Thanks jwlemon.


Posted by: Gweez | October 6, 2008 1:17 PM | Report abuse

Did anyone else see Durant Brooks pursuing Jackson on the punt return for a TD?

At one point his arms were spinning around like windmills,

Posted by: isnadd | October 6, 2008 1:14 PM

That was Frost's strong point -- he was a good tackler when they were running back his line drives.

Posted by: talent_evaluator | October 6, 2008 1:18 PM | Report abuse

Nevermind

Posted by: Zeebs | October 6, 2008 1:18 PM | Report abuse

Ksquare
I don't think that a blown call on a TD is canceled out by a 15 yard penelty. The NFL is gonna review that call and I think that ref will lose brownie points for blowing it.

We need full time refs with higher accountability standards.

Posted by: alex35332 | October 6, 2008 1:06 PM | Report abuse

Couldn't agree with you more. Maybe I should have used karma, rather than irony.

Skins clearly got hosed on the block in the back. Momentum was building, late 3rd quarter punt, which ARE returns for 28 to our 42. The penalties were just, pushing the ball to their 43. 6 plays later, we take the lead on the CP run.

That quick series not only offered the lead, but plenty of time to respond, if necessary. Love the grounded--double meanings aside--appproach. Staying positive, but medium.

Posted by: ksquare | October 6, 2008 1:19 PM | Report abuse

To me, that block in the back on the punt return was at best, questionable. K. Campbell was already juked and falling to ground when the other 50 touched him. IF he touched him. The replays I watched didn't show a whole lot of contact, and it certainly wasn't what put him to the ground. Didn't have any bearing on the play anyway, as Jackson was already racing up the field. IMO, it was a good no call. They should have thrown the flag on Doughty for not knowing how to use an angle.

Posted by: dlhaze1 | October 6, 2008 1:20 PM | Report abuse

Full time refs would be better for a simple factor that it would be a job as opposed to a part time gig. If thats your primary source of income then you are going to take it more seriously than if its a hobby.

Posted by: alex35332 | October 6, 2008 1:20 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: dealer1 | October 6, 2008 11:56 AM Huh? When did I say something about the "line"? Posted by: learnedhand1 | October 6, 2008 12:34 PM

3-4 days ago when people were complaining about filly being favored by 6.

hey nate, skins are favored by 14 points!!! is that the biggest point spread this year? has anyone covered that large of a spread this year? SMACK, where you at? we need you.

seriously what does jim zorn's success say about mike holmgren's ability to not know what he had with jim zorn? he coulda picked him to be his successor. and what does that say about jim mora for essentially not even hiring zorn to be the OC?

the hiring of jim zorn, no matter how convoluted the process was should go to vinny and danny. though 3 wr's in one round is lame. really LAME! last time a team tried to do that was philly and they didn't hit on any of the 3 CB's. not really. and ohh the patsies did that this year with LB's. i think they selected 3.

Posted by: dealer1 | October 6, 2008 1:20 PM | Report abuse

don't know if this has been posted yet, but pretty entertaining stuff from the Philly Inquirer's Eagles Blog

http://www.philly.com/philly/blogs/inq-eagles/


UP-DOWN DRILL WEEK 5

Now that the Up-Down Drill is back in the newspaper, you shouldn't have to wait to see it in print. Here's the ups and downs -- mostly downs for the Eagles -- from Washington's 23-17 win today at the Linc.

DOWN

ANDY REID

The head coach said this 2-3 start is his responsibility. It’s his fault, too.

UP

JIM ZORN

The Redskins’ rookie head coach has his team flying high with four straight wins since an opening-night loss to the New York Giants.

UP

JASON CAMPBELL

He might be the best quarterback in the NFC East.

DOWN

DONOVAN MCNABB

He might be the fourth best quarterback in the NFC East.

DOWN

BRIAN WESTBROOK

He returned from an ankle injury, but he was the second best running back on the field and suffered a rib contusion.

UP

CLINTON PORTIS

The Redskins’ star running back dispelled the notion that you can’t run against the Eagles.

DOWN

DAVID AKERS

Another 50-yarder, another miss.

UP

SHAUN SUISHAM

Meanwhile, the Redskins’ kicker connected on three field goals from beyond 40 yards, including a 50-yarder just before halftime.

DOWN

CORRELL BUCKHALTER

Westbrook returned to the field and Buckhalter returned to the bench. He carried the football just twice the entire game.

UP

DESEAN JACKSON

When was the last time the Eagles had a rookie this good? The answer may be never, but for some reason the ball was rarely thrown to him after his electrifying punt return put the Eagles up 14-0 in the first quarter.

UP

ANTWAAN RANDLE EL

His career passing stats are 19-for-23 for 264 yards and four touchdowns and that includes the 18-yard TD he threw to Chris Cooley today.

UP

CHRIS COOLEY

Another tight end has a big day against the Eagles. In fact, Cooley, with eight catches for 109 yards and a touchdown, did even more damage that Dallas ’ Jason Witten in that Monday night game.

DOWN

L.J. SMITH

The Eagles went to him twice early in the game, then just once the rest of the game.

DOWN

STEWART BRADLEY

The Eagles’ linebacker lost coverage on Cooley more than once, including on the touchdown pass from Randle El that put the Redskins ahead in the third quarter.

DOWN

TRENT COLE

The Eagles’ defensive end said during the practice week that Redskins offensive tackle Chris Samuels is the best in the business. Cole did nothing to disprove his own theory.

DOWN

TANK DANIELS

The linebacker’s costly penalty at the end of a Randle El punt return gave the Redskins the ball at the Eagles’ 42 and Washington turned its outstanding field position into six points.


Posted by Bob Brookover @ 6:04 PM

Posted by: rfzonadc | October 6, 2008 1:24 PM | Report abuse

Isn't the reason they made block in the backs illeagle mainly due to injuries? If you look at it from that POV, hitting a guy in the back if he is out of the play is more agregious.

Posted by: alex35332 | October 6, 2008 1:26 PM | Report abuse

Full time refs would be better for a simple factor that it would be a job as opposed to a part time gig. If thats your primary source of income then you are going to take it more seriously than if its a hobby.

Posted by: alex35332 | October 6, 2008 1:20 PM |

Right. That's why Redskins Insider needs to start paying a few of us so we take this more seriously.

Dude, Sally Jenkins is paid full time and she doesn't know as much football as most of us up here. How seriously does she take her job?

I'm sorry but a referee works 17-20 weeks a year, max, and even then for only two or three days max. This just isn't a full time job like blogging.

Posted by: talent_evaluator | October 6, 2008 1:27 PM | Report abuse

"Gibbs would have never let Zorn be Zorn. All these winning plays would never have happend because it wasn't Joe's style.

Posted by: Pleepleus | October 6, 2008 12:30 PM"


I'm so glad I read most of the threads so I can catch gems like these. "Winning plays" wasn't Coach Gibbs style? As someone has already said, Gibbs has 3 Superbowl rings, Zorn has 4 regular season wins. Gimme a break.

Posted by: TheTruth11 | October 6, 2008 1:27 PM | Report abuse

What was up with Yodes>? I saw Davis blocking numerous times in there... seemed to do fin with CC next to him...

Posted by: Zeebs | October 6, 2008 1:28 PM | Report abuse

He also addressed people who say that the Giants haven't played anybody - he said "They dominated the Redskins and the Redskins have dominated 4 straight teams since then." - goatherd

so like that is what i was thinking too...cuz i find it hard to believe that the skins just got that good overnight...and zorn has also said that he hasn't changed much since game 1. except for trusting jc...which could be a lot!!! and the skins dominated the gints in the 2nd half. shti i don't even rember the score from that game.

and yeah..there's def. something wrong with ARE's hand(s). speaking of having knobs for hands...#22 strikes again!!!! WTF??!!!! it's not funny no more...he needs to get serious about catching INT's like tiki barber got serious about not fumbling.

Posted by: dealer1 | October 6, 2008 1:28 PM | Report abuse

I am a Thrash thrasher and I still think he is a place holder until the rookies are ready. And D Thomas is getting closer and closer, but i really think its M Kelly who will replace him.
This is not to say that Thrash does not bring value to the team BEYOND his actual contributions on the field on Sunday. He is a consumate pro, is humble, great community guy, and teaches the aformentioned youngsters what it means to be a pro in The League. The best teams all have a Thrash type guy on their roster. They should anyway.

I think Thrash will make an excellent coach one day if he so chooses. He maximizes and actually exceeds his physical talents with hard work and dedication to excellence. So, I rally admire the guy for WHO he is.... but, the sooner he is relegated to #5 because the others have finally surpassed him, the better.

Posted by: SkinsfaninKaneohe | October 6, 2008 1:28 PM | Report abuse

The Eagles’ defensive end said during the practice week that Redskins offensive tackle Chris Samuels is the best in the business. Cole did nothing to disprove his own theory

I'd say he's up there.....pretty darn close to it.

Posted by: BeantownGreg | October 6, 2008 1:29 PM | Report abuse

When do the giants play the iggles or boys?

Posted by: Zeebs | October 6, 2008 1:30 PM | Report abuse

Decided to answer my own question

Monday, 10/13 8:30 PM ET ESPN @ Cleveland
Sunday, 10/19 1:00 PM ET FOX San Francisco
Sunday, 10/26 4:15 PM ET FOX @ Pittsburgh
Sunday, 11/2 4:15 PM ET FOX Dallas
Sunday, 11/9 8:15 PM ET NBC @ Philadelphia
Sunday, 11/16 1:00 PM ET* CBS Baltimore
Sunday, 11/23 4:15 PM ET* FOX @ Arizona
Sunday, 11/30 1:00 PM ET* FOX @ Washington
Sunday, 12/7 1:00 PM ET* FOX Philadelphia
Sunday, 12/14 8:15 PM ET* NBC @ Dallas
Sunday, 12/21 1:00 PM ET* FOX Carolina
Sunday, 12/28 1:00 PM ET* FOX @Minnesota

Posted by: Zeebs | October 6, 2008 1:31 PM | Report abuse

+++How has Jansen earned the RT job? You don't lose your job due to injury. Prior to getting hurt, Heyer started in 2 wins and had not done anything to merit losing is spot.

Posted by: learnedhand1 | October 6, 2008 12:27 PM+++

It can be argued Jansen LOST it due to the fact he hadn't fully recovered from his injury. he is playing MUCH better than he did when he was replaced.

In either event, it is a position of strength.

This is Corkczar. This screwed up registration deal no longer allows me to sign in as Corkczar,.

Posted by: TheCork | October 6, 2008 1:31 PM | Report abuse

also i'm finally seeing why thrash is in there and not the rookies(no, i was never a thrash basher)...in this offense it's more important to know your routes than your 40 time...

Posted by: dealer1 | October 6, 2008 1:32 PM | Report abuse

The gmen havent played ANYONE yet.... based upon strength of schedule, we are the strongest team in the NFL...

Posted by: Zeebs | October 6, 2008 1:33 PM | Report abuse

I'm so glad I read most of the threads so I can catch gems like these. "Winning plays" wasn't Coach Gibbs style? As someone has already said, Gibbs has 3 Superbowl rings, Zorn has 4 regular season wins. Gimme a break.

Posted by: TheTruth11 | October 6, 2008 1:27 PM

Truth, you are missing his point, no one is saying Gibbs 1.0 was not great!

Gibbs 2.0 was very conservative, and he would not have let Zorn run this type of offense, just like he did not let Saunders run his offense.

Your defense of Gibbs is honorable but Gibbs 2.0 can not be mixed with Gibbs 1.

Posted by: Flounder21 | October 6, 2008 1:33 PM | Report abuse

So cork, are you saying that perhaps all Thomas and some other rookies needed was a little time?? That maybe, just MAYBE the first week of the season wasn't the best time to pass judgement on them??

Wow.....

Posted by: BeantownGreg | October 6, 2008 12:12 PM |

I agree with Zorn who said they should have arrived in camp in shape.

Posted by: TheCork | October 6, 2008 1:33 PM | Report abuse

The 'no call' on the Jackson punt return was probably the right one. Not much contact there. But the ref did toss the flag. And it is about safety, not whether it impacts the play. I'm guessing ... obviously not sure, but if that return goes for 3 yards instead of a TD, they call the penalty.

As mentioned, 6 calls that have gone against the Skins where TDs were scored or likely. And they are still 4-1.

As for the flags on ARE's punt return, both were clear and obvious penalties.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | October 6, 2008 1:34 PM | Report abuse

The Eagles’ defensive end said during the practice week that Redskins offensive tackle Chris Samuels is the best in the business

greg, now that's called self fulfilling prophecy. btw...aside from rabach the line has been playing flawless. this is the same team in the iggles that sacked ben roth 7 times or something...

Posted by: dealer1 | October 6, 2008 1:35 PM | Report abuse

Boys havent played strong teams, Ten has played Jax, Houston, Cicy, Bmore and Minny....

Posted by: Zeebs | October 6, 2008 1:35 PM | Report abuse

beep beep

Posted by: CindyBoren | October 6, 2008 1:37 PM | Report abuse

When do the giants play the iggles or boys?

Posted by: Zeebs | October 6, 2008 1:30 PM |

Zeebs--What difference does it make? Who would you rather be -- the Redskins at 4-1 with their remaining schedule or the Giants at 4-0 with their remaining schedule?

Posted by: talent_evaluator | October 6, 2008 1:38 PM | Report abuse

Washington beats Dallas and then Philly and dumbo Peter King still has Dallas #2 and the Skins #4.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/writers/peter_king/10/05/week5/index.html?eref=T1

Dork.

Though he does write a couple of good things about the Skins' game yesterday.

Posted by: cmecyclist | October 6, 2008 1:38 PM | Report abuse

Cork, I didn't ask if you agree with zorn, I asked if maybe you were PREMATURE in writing them off.

Be a man and admit you were wrong, you can do it....

Posted by: BeantownGreg | October 6, 2008 1:40 PM | Report abuse

+++Lets not get carried away on Thrash. 3 catches, 16 yards and 1 TD. He contributing at the level you'd expect from a 4th or 5th WR, which is what he is.

We cut Billy McMullen who has 7 catches for 124 in 3(?) games. Thrash is a keeper, as long as his plays at or near the vet minimum.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | October 6, 2008 12:41 PM +++


First, Thrash is an ace special teams guy. Second, he was the first guy Zorn praised on this team, for coming to camp prepared, in shape, and ready to work. Third, the kids need to look up to people like that. Fourth, none of us are in the locker room, but I do believe Core redskin vets set the tone--and it's a tone I like.

Posted by: TheCork | October 6, 2008 1:41 PM | Report abuse

Beeb Beeb

Posted by: Flounder21 | October 6, 2008 1:44 PM | Report abuse

This Redskins team is a very good football team. The last 4 games have all been similar. All against powerful offenses. In each game, the defense has slowed down these offenses. The pass rush has few sacks, but the coverage has been excellent. The 4 man front has done a solid job against the run.

On offense, this is the o-line is the biggest surprise to me. They have good players, but as a unit, they have definitely improved over last season. Because of this, the run game has become a threat.

Nothing has excited me more about this team than the late game drives to close out these wins. Very reminiscent of the early Hogs, with Riggins just chewing clock, the opponents unable to stop what they know is coming. Like when the Yankees brought in Rivera in his prime, it was game over. Well, give the Skins the ball and the lead with 6 minutes left, it is lights out.

No question this team is among the best in the league. No question Jim Zorn was ready to be a HC (and I'll admit to one who had no idea if he was). No question this team has skills, talent and heart. And no player defines this team better than my league MVP choice, London Fletcher


Posted by: zcezcest1 | October 6, 2008 1:46 PM | Report abuse

To see how absurd Peter King's rankings are, look at the combined records of each team's opponents:

Redskins' opponents: 15-8
Dallas's opponents: 9-15
Giants' opponents: 5-13

Giants beat the Skins plus two winless teams (Rams, Bengals) and the Seahawks who have won only one game.

The Cowboys haven't beaten a team with a winning record.

Posted by: talent_evaluator | October 6, 2008 1:50 PM | Report abuse

Let the media hate, that is what us as skins fans have come to expect. Why would you want the media to love us and pick us in everything then we would just be like the cowboys, and I don't know about you guys but I don't want that to happen. The schedule will tell all for the g-men, you should be 5-0 at this point of the season. the only good team they played was us, and it was at home coming off of a superbowl victory, of course they were going to be fired up, and we still dominated the second half. they have a brutal end of the season. Even if we finish third in our division, which I do not beleive will happen, we will still make the playoffs and be at least the third best team. But I will continue to take Ellis Hobbs' route and eat that humble pie.

Posted by: theFreshinAU | October 6, 2008 2:27 PM | Report abuse

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