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Betts may have played his last game with Redskins

Running back Ladell Betts, who will miss the remainder of the season because of torn knee ligaments, is under contract through the 2013 season. But Betts, 30, is not guaranteed money beyond this season, in which he has a base salary of $900,000 and is due another $450,000 in roster and workout bonuses. His base salary increases to $1.65 million next season, but considering the long rehabilitation process involved with torn anterior cruciate and medial collateral ligaments, it appears Betts has played his last game for the Redskins after having been selected by the team in the second round (No. 56 overall) in the 2002 draft.

"I plan to be around the team for the rest of the year, the only time I wouldn't be is if I have to leave to have the surgery," Betts said. "All I'm really thinking about right now is getting my knee right so I can get back to work again."

By Jason Reid  |  November 24, 2009; 2:43 PM ET
Categories:  Jason Reid  
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Next: Snyder issues statement on Pollin's death

Comments

WWST21D?

todaysskins14

Posted by: retroskins14 | November 24, 2009 2:50 PM | Report abuse

Can we change the subject of this post to "Portis" or "Rogers" instead of Betts?

Posted by: mattylight | November 24, 2009 2:52 PM | Report abuse

He would be trying to get out of this chicken outfit. Prolly head to Naw Leans ... y'all.

Posted by: periculum | November 24, 2009 2:53 PM | Report abuse

Uh oh, here comes Spiller. Watch him end up on the IR due to a complete lack of competent blocking.

Posted by: periculum | November 24, 2009 2:54 PM | Report abuse

Sad

Posted by: alex35332 | November 24, 2009 2:54 PM | Report abuse

I'm confident Vinnie can find another 30+ RB to replace him. Vinnie could trade next year's first round pick to the Chargers for LT.

Posted by: james808d | November 24, 2009 2:56 PM | Report abuse

at those salaries, I'd keep him around....in 13 starts, he's gone over 100 yards 7 times....give him 15 carries per game, just to pound the defense...

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | November 24, 2009 2:56 PM | Report abuse

The reason I disagree here is because next year must be looked as a partial rebuilding year. We need to go into next year building for the future and that means playing young players and if a LT and RT are chosen in the 1st two rounds, then they should start and get the experience they need. To sit a player drafted in the 1st or 2nd round would be a huge mistake.

We cannot go into next year thinking we will be winning the SB. If the team that is put together next year makes a playoff run, then great, but the one player away mentality needs to stop.

Posted by: Curzon417 | November 24, 2009 2:32 PM | Report abuse


I agree it's a multi year rebuild. I just don't believe in handing over the starting position. I think they should compete for it. I think every position should be up for grabs every year. My point is that we need 4 starting linemen. I want to see if BMW can be a very good right guard. If he can then that leaves us with needing 3 starting linemen.

LT
RT
C

We draft a LT in round 1. Then in round 2 we can draft either a right tackle or a center. So now the question is would you rather have:

LT-Levi Jones
RT-elite tackle prospect
C-elite center prospect

or:

LT-Elite Left tackle prospect
RT-Elite Right tackle prospect
C-Rabach

So it comes down to would you rather replace Levi Jones or Casey Rabach next year? I'm going with replacing Rabach if O'Dowd or Wizniewski are available in round 2.

Posted by: PAskinsfan17 | November 24, 2009 2:54 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: PAskinsfan17 | November 24, 2009 3:00 PM | Report abuse

Although I always liked Betts attitude and play, I must say that even without this injury, it was time for us to catch up with the rest of the league and move Betts AND Portis along. Since Portis is guaranted 6.5 million next year regardless- he will likely be back...but RB is a position for guys on the bottom side of 30.

Posted by: MadeRED | November 24, 2009 3:02 PM | Report abuse

If it takes the typical year to get back from an ACL tear time to move on. Thanks Ladell. We hardly knew ya outside of your nice run in 2006.

Posted by: ToddStinkston | November 24, 2009 3:02 PM | Report abuse

Alex, your point on the OL is valid.

Ideally, I think you have 3-4 solid starters. You gotta draft or get these guys via FA. You pay for them. The old Hogs got Bostic and Jacoby undrafted, but paid for May, Grimm and Lachey in trade or high pick.

When you only need to fill one slot, you can try out 5 guys in and there is a good chance 1 will exceed expectations.

But when you have 3 or 4 slots, it becomes much harder to look at 10 guys in various combinations. Especially since OL play is often dependent on how the OL interacts among each other.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | November 24, 2009 3:04 PM | Report abuse

He would be trying to get out of this chicken outfit. Prolly head to Naw Leans ... y'all.

Posted by: periculum | November 24, 2009 2:53 PM | Report abuse

I doubt that the Saints are in the market for a 30 yr backup coming off major knee surgery.

Posted by: PortisPocketsStr8 | November 24, 2009 3:06 PM | Report abuse

at those salaries, I'd keep him around....in 13 starts, he's gone over 100 yards 7 times....give him 15 carries per game, just to pound the defense...

Posted by: BeantownGreg1

For what you're asking they can go and get Shaun Alexander, steal Bettis from NBC, or say f it and go get that turdbag John Riggins.


30 years old

Plays running back (depended on cutting on knees and ankles and speed -- wasn't like he was the fastest guy anyway)

tears ACL and MCL

He was here a long time and I appreciate longevity, but he's more than likely completely done.

Sorry.

Posted by: RedDMV | November 24, 2009 3:06 PM | Report abuse

As for Betts, I made th same comment yesterday, though I didn't know his contract situation. Tough to hold a roster spot for a 31 year old RB who needs to rehab his knee after major damage.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | November 24, 2009 3:07 PM | Report abuse

let's get Tiki Barber@!!! nyuk nyuk nyuk. Hey Moe!

Posted by: DikShuttle | November 24, 2009 3:09 PM | Report abuse

red, I guess my point was that he's a low dollar guy, and given the need to address the OL almost exclusively, it makes sense to keep a guy like this around. They're not going to the super bowl next year, so draft along the lines....

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | November 24, 2009 3:12 PM | Report abuse

Awesome! Now this will give Vinny an excuse to blow draft picks on an RB along with the CB and kicker we're bound to be pursuing.

Afterall that is what is keeping this 'playoff caliber' team from being in SB right?

I had the hideous thought that if the Skins play another couple of games like Dallas The Grand Delusional Ones in the FO will think we're right there just right there so no major changes needed. . .

I think we should all send postcards and emails to Snyder with Parcell's point "You are what your record says you are."

Posted by: sfskin | November 24, 2009 3:12 PM | Report abuse

$1.65 Mil isn't bad for a back up.....

Posted by: 4thFloor | November 24, 2009 3:12 PM | Report abuse

Hey - Haynesworth may seem like a bargain to some teams next year, so let's trade him!!

He's awesmoe, but we need more than him.

Posted by: DikShuttle | November 24, 2009 3:18 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: PAskinsfan17 | November 24, 2009 3:00 PM

This is why you play your young guys. I would wait to see how E Williams develops before I make that decision, but agree w/your logic there.

Posted by: Curzon417 | November 24, 2009 3:18 PM | Report abuse

4th, thats kinda my point....keep him around, and who knows if you actually USE HIM, he and Rock could be a good tandem....

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | November 24, 2009 3:18 PM | Report abuse

$1.65 Mil isn't bad for a back up.....

Posted by: 4thFloor | November 24, 2009 3:12 PM | Report abuse


But we've already got a $7 mill backup lined up for next year...

Posted by: p1funk | November 24, 2009 3:18 PM | Report abuse

$1.65 Mil isn't bad for a back up.....

Posted by: 4thFloor | November 24, 2009 3:12 PM

Again, I say let's see what MM and QG have over the next 6 games before deciding on Betts. If one or both have something, and both would be cheaper than Betts, let Betts walk.

Now is time to see what we have in the young uns.

Posted by: Curzon417 | November 24, 2009 3:21 PM | Report abuse

$1.65 IS bad for a 30 year old back up coming off of major knee surgery. You can't count on Betts being at even 90% next year.

Posted by: james808d | November 24, 2009 3:26 PM | Report abuse

ZEKE'S UNIQUE PERSPECTIVES
again brought to you by the fine people at Yahoo!

Part 1

First of all, Happy Thanksgiving to one and all. Despite DEBACLE '09 ®, we have much to be thankful for.

As the season hits the home stretch, the final 6 games aren't going to be about playoffs. It will be about who Snyder deems responsible for DEBACLE '09 ®. That determines who gets fired, and with that in mind, its time to look at the roster turnover. For reference, I'll look at the 2008 team and consider the 28 most important slots, 22 starters and 6 reserves spots that get lots of playing time.

In 2008, the DE's were Jason Taylor and Andre Carter. The tackles, Cornelius Griffin and Kedric Golston. Taylor is gone and Griff is nearing the end. Carter, with his play this year, may see a contract renewal that wasn't likely until his improved play this year. The rotation guys were Demetric Evans and Anthony Montgomery. Evans is gone and Alexander passed Monty on the depth charts. Jarmon could be the 3rd DE, as soon as Philip Daniels calls it a career, which will be in the near future.
DL Turnover, 4 of 6 slots

The LBs were Marcus Washington, London Fletcher and Rocky McIntosh. Marcus is gone and Fletcher is the classic case of nothing good lasts forever. There is no clear cut successor for Fletcher and those massive shoes won't fill easily. Though it likely won't happen for 2010.
LB Turnover, 1 of 3 slots

The DBs are interesting. In 2008, the starters were Horton, Landry, Springs and Hall. Rogers and Smoot were the top backups. Springs is gone, Smoot is also nearing his end and Rogers is likely to be gone. Doughty seems to have taken a spot in the rotation, Horton is on the bubble. Whether Tryon, Barnes or Moore can step up to solidify their role is open. Certainly Tryon is getting the chance to make his case.
DB Turnover, 3 or 4 of 6 slots

Posted by: zcezcest1 | November 24, 2009 3:32 PM | Report abuse

from footballoutsiders.com on Jason Campbell in Week II:

"23. Jason Campbell WAS 24/37 256 0 1 13 13 0"
"Whoa. What a weird day. Campbell was 12-of-12 on third down, picking up 150 yards and seven first downs in the process. He extended virtually every one of the Redskins' drives, and helped keep the Cowboys offense off of the field in the process. The reason he's [ranked] 23rd [among their impact players in Week 11], of course, is because he was 12-of-25 for 106 yards on first and second down. On the bright side, Campbell only took one sack, and his interception was a fluky bounce off of a defender's helmet. Because of the situation, it ranks as an extremely important play; take it out and Campbell goes from 23rd to 14th."

Posted by: Samson151 | November 24, 2009 3:33 PM | Report abuse

why don't we see how his rehab goes, before we say we can't count on him......

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | November 24, 2009 3:33 PM | Report abuse

Part 2

On the offense, the RB situation is clear. In 2008, it was Portis, Betts and Sellers. Portis is nearing the end. Betts recent knee injury likely ended his career. Rock is doing a nice job filling in, but at 30, his future as an RB is on borrowed time. Realistically, there is no other RB that has shown anything in house at this point. Sellers plays a role which has seen guys play past 35, so there may be more years ahead for Big Mike.
RB Turnover, 2 of 3 slots

The receivers are a unique situation. It was Moss, ARE and Thrash in 2008. Kelly and Thomas were supposed to surpass Thrash and didn't. ARE may be on borrowed time. He is a good #3 WR, but the young WRs, including Marko Mitchell, will be given plenty of chances to claim the job. Moss still seems to have a lock on the top WR spot.
WR Turnover, 1 or 2 of 3 slots

The TE was, is and will be Chris Cooley.
TE Turnover, 0 of 1 slot

The QB was, is and might be Jason Campbell. Or someone else. Who knows.
QB turnover, 0 or 1 of 1 slot

The OL was Jansen, Thomas, Rabach, Kendall and Samuels. Only Rabach remains in the mix. Dockery at LG is the only other position on the line that appears settled.
Turnover, 4 of 5 slots

Of the 28 slots, the turnover from 2008 going into 2010 is substantial. I count 15 to 18 slots that will change in this 2 year period. That is simply too many changes to handle adequately in that short a time frame. 10 players are essentially gone already, with 5-8 more coming up in the offseason. What is noteworthy is that many of the slots have already opened up, but no one has laid a clear claim to the slot. Though 15-18 slots are being turned over, only 5 players have made a clear claim to a slot. These are Albert, Orakpo, Alexander, Doughty and Dockery. Still up for grabs are 10-13 slots. 3 OL, 1-2 WR, 0-1 QB, 2 RB, 1 DL, 1 LB, 2-3 DB. 13 slots out of 28 most important -- is nearly 50%. Lots of job openings at Redskins Park.

The roster has significant talent, but with so many key slots essentially unclaimed, the rest of 2009 should offer more than a glimpse into the future. Muddying the waters, however, it should be noted, is that the men who made decisions in 2009 shouldn't get the chance to do it again in 2010. Both Vinny and Zorn have been in their respective jobs far too long and should be gone in 6 weeks.

Turnover, change, whatever you want to call it. There is definitely a major remodeling going on, much of it unplanned for by team management. Which is why the demolition part is happening quickly, while the repairs and upgrades aren't.

And that is the Thanksgiving week wrap on ZEKE'S UNIQUE PERSPECTIVES, as always, brought to you by the fine and festive people at Yahoo!

Posted by: zcezcest1 | November 24, 2009 3:33 PM | Report abuse

Betts still has to have surgery, then months of rehab. It's not just a simple, "Oh, we need to save this $$, let's cut Betts."
They can't release him before he's healthy without an injury settlement.
He's under contract, one that seems reasonable.
Also seems reasonable to "wait and see" how he recovers before deciding to dump him.

Posted by: 4-12 | November 24, 2009 3:35 PM | Report abuse

zce: "Ideally, I think you have 3-4 solid starters. You gotta draft or get these guys via FA. You pay for them. The old Hogs got Bostic and Jacoby undrafted, but paid for May, Grimm and Lachey in trade or high pick."

Hmmm? If I remember correctly, Grimm was a third-rounder, and Lachey came in trade for Jay Schroeder, who they were desperately trying to get rid of. Lachey had been a Pro Bowler with SD before he got to Washington, and was on one Super Bowl team here.

I dunno, that just doesn't sound like strategic planning to me. More like getting really lucky.

Posted by: Samson151 | November 24, 2009 3:38 PM | Report abuse

I don't think its reasonable to "wait and see" on Betts at all. This team is going to be blown up during the offseason and hanging onto Betts accomplishes what exactly? Injury settlement during the offseason is exactly the way to go. We need new young players, not 30 year old RBs with reconstructed knees. Even if Betts didn't need surgery there wouldn't be much point in keeping him for next year.

Posted by: james808d | November 24, 2009 3:40 PM | Report abuse

Realistically, few 30+ RBs that are comong off major surgery are worth much. If Betts can carve out a Kevin Faulk type role, then he'll stick around a bit longer. But only a few teams look for guys like Faulk. My guess is that the Skins won't be one of them.

Of course, the bigger decision is when will Skins mgmt stick a fork into Portis. They may be reluctant to lose both Betts and Portis in such close proximity, but may need to do it anyway.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | November 24, 2009 3:40 PM | Report abuse

Does anyone know:
Is it possible for the Skins front office to get out of Portis' RIDICULOUS contract?
Like with his concussion related symptoms or something like that?
Thanks everyone and Happy Thanksgiving!

Posted by: RedskinRay1 | November 24, 2009 3:41 PM | Report abuse

Greg doesn't like people doubting the older dudes.

You and that bama Betts should join hands and sing 'Kumbaya' over the 'We Shall Overcome' instrumental.

I mean by all means have faith in your boy, but the odds are STACKED against him for him to return to HALF of what he was before this past Sunday.

Posted by: RedDMV | November 24, 2009 3:42 PM | Report abuse

BTW "hoping for the best" on old injured players is exactly how we ended up with the current OL.

Posted by: james808d | November 24, 2009 3:43 PM | Report abuse

The whole offense will likely be reworked in the off season. I wouldn't worry about running backs and more about getting productivity out three or 4 wide receiver draft picks still with the team. I suspect that one could potentially put Cooley and/or Randle El in the backfield if necessary and go with a pass oriented offense. But you still need a quarterback (next year they will need 3) and an offensive line. That should be and likely will be the focus of the next head coach.


Defensively, you have a reasonably young line. You will likely lose Montgomery, whereas you should lose a Philip Daniels, a Griffin etc. Hopefully, they find a way to keep him here.

At safety they could use another 1st rounder. At corner they could use 2. These are critical positions especially since Rogers will be gone. And Hall is inconsistent.


Bottom lines of bottom lines: to field a deep into the playoffs winner as quickly as possible 3 components are needed.

1. An offensive line.
2. A set of quarterbacks and a decent offensive system.
3. A defensive backfield upgrade.

Excluding any severe hemorrhaging of talent because Snyder Carcinoma is the owner and the debacle of '09.

Posted by: periculum | November 24, 2009 3:43 PM | Report abuse

Of course, it would also be "reasonable" to have:

1) A real GM,
A) An owner who gets the [heck] out of the decidering process, and
Z) A real head coach.

However, I understand that "reasonable" is also "very unlikely" with this organization.

Posted by: 4-12 | November 24, 2009 3:45 PM | Report abuse

there are many more needs ahead of this is all I was trying to say...I know its fun to play fantasy and dump the whole team and resign 54 new guys, but realistically thats probably not going to happen...lets get a new OL this OFF-SEASON...then, after thats in place, lets get a new rb/qb...

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | November 24, 2009 3:46 PM | Report abuse

The TE was, is and will be Chris Cooley.
TE Turnover, 0 of 1 slot

H-back. They go back to Air Coryell and drop the west coast nonsense.

Posted by: periculum | November 24, 2009 3:46 PM | Report abuse

Is this the same Betts that a week ago was being called the breath of fresh air over Portis? And now we're talking about his having played his last game? Wow, and people think football isn't only about the dollars...

Posted by: garyolney | November 24, 2009 3:49 PM | Report abuse

james, without my items 1, A, and Z happening this off-season, "keep/cut Betts and/or any other player" is irrelevant, as it will be more of the same dysfunction from the top down.

Posted by: 4-12 | November 24, 2009 3:50 PM | Report abuse

red, you bamafied bama, I hope your turkey is dry, and your potatoes are lumpy...

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | November 24, 2009 3:50 PM | Report abuse

o, and by the way, does anybody agree with me that Charlie Weiss will be the next Redskins coach? Big name, head coaching experience, pro coaching experience, ties to Belichek and Vinny C. Able to bring Jimmy Clausen with him. Welcome to DC CW.

Posted by: garyolney | November 24, 2009 3:51 PM | Report abuse

o, and by the way, does anybody agree with me that Charlie Weiss will be the next Redskins coach? Big name, head coaching experience, pro coaching experience, ties to Belichek and Vinny C. Able to bring Jimmy Clausen with him. Welcome to DC CW.

Posted by: garyolney | November 24, 2009 3:52 PM | Report abuse

4-12 no argument there. Even if we get 1 A and Z, we are years from being a good team, given the current talent level.

Posted by: james808d | November 24, 2009 3:54 PM | Report abuse

You need to be patient when the situation calls for it.

The other times you move swiftly and go get s*** done.

I'm not saying they should cut Betts today, but to expect him to return from this and be half of what he was before is sort of wishful thinking. There is a lot to like about Betts, he's a lot alike Cartwright and Thrash -- All three are constantly canonized up here.

How many RBs you know that have went on to have decent careers after tearing their ACL and MCL at age 30?

Posted by: RedDMV | November 24, 2009 3:54 PM | Report abuse

o, and by the way, does anybody agree with me that Charlie Weiss will be the next Redskins coach? Big name, head coaching experience, pro coaching experience, ties to Belichek and Vinny C. Able to bring Jimmy Clausen with him. Welcome to DC CW.

Posted by: garyolney | November 24, 2009 3:52 PM | Report abuse

No, no one agrees with you.

You forgot the part about how he can't win at the college level even though he gets top 10 classes consistently.

Posted by: PortisPocketsStr8 | November 24, 2009 3:55 PM | Report abuse

weiss will go to KC most likely...

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | November 24, 2009 3:57 PM | Report abuse

I think we have to move on from Betts for a couple of reasons.

1. He won't be ready next year and you don't hold roster spots for back up RB's with a blown out knee on the wrong side of 30. It takes two years to get back.

2. We need more spark in our running game. If we are stuck with Portis, then we need either a speed back or a BIG back. Or both. RB is a great place to continue the youth movement on this team.

3. We will have a new coach next who has no loyalty to him.

He was a great insurance policy while he lasted, but it is time to move on.

Posted by: edvar | November 24, 2009 3:58 PM | Report abuse

are we years from being good? Really?

The Bengls were 1-11-1 last year and have been 10-3 since.

The Titans were 0-6 to start this year, 4-0 since.

Turnarounds can happen quickly. Especially if you have talent, and we do have talent.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | November 24, 2009 3:59 PM | Report abuse

Hmmm? If I remember correctly, Grimm was a third-rounder, and Lachey came in trade for Jay Schroeder, who they were desperately trying to get rid of. Lachey had been a Pro Bowler with SD before he got to Washington, and was on one Super Bowl team here.

I dunno, that just doesn't sound like strategic planning to me. More like getting really lucky.

Posted by: Samson151

Not sure I follow. Draft in an early round, trade for a top player. Sounds like a plan. Are there elements of luck? Sure. But its a lot more likely to pull in 1 or 2 longshots than it is to pull in 5.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | November 24, 2009 4:02 PM | Report abuse

HA-HA, Usually I don't eat turkey on Thanksgiving.

I eat *gasp* an oven stuffer roaster aka Chicken.... It taste better with the stuffing, ham, potatoes, mac & cheese... everything.

Anyone remember my Lions win over the Titans last year for the Thanksgiving game?

This year I have the Raiders over the Cowboys.

Book it, bank it, or whatever it is y'all do.

Posted by: RedDMV | November 24, 2009 4:03 PM | Report abuse

Betts will most likely be cut during camp next year, but it is way too early to have this convo. There will be plenty of roster spots to put him into once the season is over.

The focus should be, what do we have with Rock, Mason and Gunther. And getting Portis bone spurs as straight as his pockets.

Then depending on how they do, what FAs are available and how Betts recovery is going do we make a decision.

Posted by: Curzon417 | November 24, 2009 4:03 PM | Report abuse

zcezcest1 -- we're going to be starting with a new coach, a new QB, a new OL (if we are lucky) and new RBs. You expect a play off run next year???

Posted by: james808d | November 24, 2009 4:03 PM | Report abuse

whateves, on what you're eating red, I'm hoping the ham is undercooked, and the rest of it is overcooked, I'm hoping also that some family member shows up, gets drunk, and proceeds to puke all over your stuff.......bama....

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | November 24, 2009 4:05 PM | Report abuse

Bean, Is Todd haley a O or D coordinator?

If he is the D coordinator, then yeah, Weiss more than likely will go to KC.

Posted by: RedDMV | November 24, 2009 4:08 PM | Report abuse

why don't we see how his rehab goes, before we say we can't count on him......

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | November 24, 2009 3:33 PM

Welcome to the blog, first time poster! Good to have your fresh insights, but that's not how we work here. Our motto is shoot first and ask questions later. Next question?

Posted by: League-Source | November 24, 2009 4:08 PM | Report abuse

RIP Abe Pollin - may not have always put a great product on the court but a gentleman who knew how to treat fans and a city.

Posted by: sfskin | November 24, 2009 4:08 PM | Report abuse

I just had a thought: How could we keep Campbell?

He'll want as big a contract as he can get. The Skins would probably only want to offer him a 1-2 year contract to give them time to build the o-line before getting a QB (if that's the route they want to go).

I'd be happy with that, I like the guy well enough to keep him while we build the line at least.

But.. Jason wont be happy with that. He'll want more money and more duration in his contract. Some other team will give it to him. A lot of people hate on him, but he's a lot better than a lot of other guys starting right now. Go ask buffalo for example if they wouldn't be happy to have a guy who can actually throw it down the field, with TO and Evans.

So I don't really see any situation where he stays here, given the conflict of what he will want and what the FO would want (supposing the wanted to keep him at all)

Posted by: REXskins | November 24, 2009 4:10 PM | Report abuse

red, I believe todd is the HC, pioli the GM....

league, thanks, first time, long time...

ready

fire

aim

gotcha....

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | November 24, 2009 4:10 PM | Report abuse

Yes RIP Mr Pollin, not the greatest owner but he did more to rebuild DC then anyone I can recall.

Posted by: alex35332 | November 24, 2009 4:11 PM | Report abuse

I dunno, that just doesn't sound like strategic planning to me. More like getting really lucky.

Posted by: Samson151

Not sure I follow. Draft in an early round, trade for a top player. Sounds like a plan. Are there elements of luck? Sure. But its a lot more likely to pull in 1 or 2 longshots than it is to pull in 5.

Again, thinking like a Snyderator Carcinoma maker. You seem to forget that Gibbs and company were also responsible for the other "components" of that storied line that featured bookend tackles Lachey and Jacoby plus HOF G Grimm? Not just Bostic, but Ray Brown, Mark Schlereth (who helped Elway finally win a couple of the big ones), and Raleigh MacKenzie. We won't even mention Donny Warren who might as well be called another tackle.
McKenzie and Schlereth were 10th rounders. Bostic was undrafted I believe. All of this took ability, ability and a keen eye for talent. That Joe Gibbs had and has. This is not the case with Snydercerratocarcinoma.

Posted by: periculum | November 24, 2009 4:12 PM | Report abuse

Abe Pollin was 85, that's pretty amazing...

Posted by: edvar | November 24, 2009 4:12 PM | Report abuse

That's still pretty young ... wonder who takes over? Guess they sell the team?

Posted by: periculum | November 24, 2009 4:14 PM | Report abuse

Ha, Beans. Keep on hoping and wishing... The DMVseses always eat good.

As for the dunk family member -- that'll probably be me. I get real nice watching the game with my uncles and cousins that are the same age. This is usually done after we played football with all the young-ins in the DMV clan.

Posted by: RedDMV | November 24, 2009 4:14 PM | Report abuse

Abe Pollin died?

Damn.....

Posted by: RedDMV | November 24, 2009 4:16 PM | Report abuse

Zeke,
I would not use the Titans in your example, since they were 13-3 last year, a far cry from the Redskins 8-8.

The Bungles may be a better point of comparison. At the skill positions, I would take Palmer over Campbell, Ochocinco over Moss, and Benson over Portis. Hands down. The Redskins don't have the talent that the Bungles do, at least on offense.

TE may be an exception, but TE's are not the core positions on offense.

BTW, for all you guys thinking the Redskins need to draft OL, consider Cincy's line

2 2nd round picks, 1 3rd round pick, and 2 undrafted, both in 2007.

Taste it Vinnie!!

Posted by: dpc2003 | November 24, 2009 4:17 PM | Report abuse

so then you're younger, more successful, better looking brother "4th floor" is gonna blow you up, like he blowed up Dockett....right??

you're about to be debacled....

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | November 24, 2009 4:17 PM | Report abuse

RIP Abe Pollin...

Posted by: mattylight | November 24, 2009 4:18 PM | Report abuse

... wonder who takes over? Guess they sell the team?

Posted by: periculum | November 24, 2009 4:14 PM

Hadn't Leonsis already negotiated to buy the team? Isn't he already a minority owner?

Posted by: League-Source | November 24, 2009 4:18 PM | Report abuse

RedDMV,
Just announced, he passed in the AM.

Posted by: alex35332 | November 24, 2009 4:18 PM | Report abuse

Wikipedia says that Leonsis already owns 44% of the Wizards:

Leonsis is also the founder, chairman, and majority owner of Lincoln Holdings LLC, a sports and entertainment company that holds ownership rights in several entities including 100% of the NHL's Washington Capitals and the WNBA's Washington Mystics. Lincoln Holdings also owns approximately 44% of Washington Sports and Entertainment Limited Partnership (WSELP), which owns the NBA’s Washington Wizards, the Verizon Center and the Baltimore-Washington Ticketmaster franchise

Posted by: League-Source | November 24, 2009 4:20 PM | Report abuse

I like Betts, but his playing days are done. Backups at the RB position should be young guys. Does he play special teams?

Posted by: dpc2003 | November 24, 2009 4:20 PM | Report abuse

If I was Grunfeld, I'd be worried with a new owner coming in, especially with that suspect contract he gave burgeoning locker room cancer Gilbert Arenas hanging around his neck...

Posted by: mattylight | November 24, 2009 4:22 PM | Report abuse

zcezcest1 -- we're going to be starting with a new coach, a new QB, a new OL (if we are lucky) and new RBs. You expect a play off run next year???

Posted by: james808d

With a good HC, we would have made a playoff run this year. Of course, the weak schedule would have helped ...

Posted by: zcezcest1 | November 24, 2009 4:23 PM | Report abuse

Have we already ripped Zorn for calling for a FG with 15 seconds left in the first half? What kind of mentally challenged, panty-waisted, lilly-livered coward doesn't take at least 1 shot into the end zone? J-F-C.

That was BS.

And the Cowboys had not 1, but 2 offensive linemen over the LOS on their touchdown play. Dallas SUCKS.

Posted by: dpc2003 | November 24, 2009 4:25 PM | Report abuse

Sad to hear Abe Pollin died. Like Snyder, he didn't have much on the court success. Unlike Snyder, he gave a damn about the fans and community.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | November 24, 2009 4:27 PM | Report abuse

Aren't the Lerners also minority owners of the Wizards?

Posted by: periculum | November 24, 2009 4:29 PM | Report abuse

Zeke, I'm not sure that with a good HC the Redskins make a playoff run. Getting Samuels and Thomas on IR really hurt: against ATL the line started to jell, then Rhino goes IR. Cooley is done, Portis is done. Lots of injuries.

Posted by: dpc2003 | November 24, 2009 4:34 PM | Report abuse

$1.65 IS bad for a 30 year old back up coming off of major knee surgery. You can't count on Betts being at even 90% next year.

Posted by: james808d | November 24, 2009 3:26 PM | Report abuse

Even if the 'Skins front office next season is still being run by Cerrato or some other as-yet-unknown Snyder sock puppet (and, Gawd, I hope it isn't), there's no way that Betts is invited back next year at 1.65 mil. The most likely outcome is that they reach an injury settlement and release him. At the very least, Betts would have to agree to a vet's minimum contract (which, I think, is about 800 large for a player of Betts' experience). He might agree to such a deal, if offered, because he would be unlikely to get a better offer elsewhere.

Posted by: rbpalmer | November 24, 2009 4:34 PM | Report abuse

Zeke, I'm not sure that with a good HC the Redskins make a playoff run. Getting Samuels and Thomas on IR really hurt: against ATL the line started to jell, then Rhino goes IR. Cooley is done, Portis is done. Lots of injuries.

Posted by: dpc2003

Good HC and we're 5-2, with enough talent to win 50% of the remaining games. That gets you to around 9-7 or 10-6. If we bring in Levi Jones when we should have, or Runyan or Kendall to fill the gaps left by the young underachievers, we'd have been better up front. If a coach recognized that Portis wasn't cutting it, could have replaced him before his bell got rung. etc etc

Even with all this, we just lost to a 6-3 team by 1 point due to missed FGs. Heck, if Zorn runs a 3rd down play, maybe we get the 3 points at the end of the half and win that game.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | November 24, 2009 4:41 PM | Report abuse

We shouldn't just let Betts walk. We should totally trade him for a 2nd round pick

RIP Abe.

Posted by: Original_etrod | November 24, 2009 4:42 PM | Report abuse

Who will be QB next year. There isn't much out there in free agency.

Posted by: Redskins001 | November 24, 2009 4:43 PM | Report abuse

Sad to hear Abe Pollin died. Like Snyder, he didn't have much on the court success. Unlike Snyder, he gave a damn about the fans and community.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | November 24, 2009 4:27 PM

Sad to see that zeke can't mourn Pollin without using it as an occassion to bash Snyder. Low, Zeke. Just for that I'm boycotting your sponsor, Yahoo.

Pollin did have on-the-court success -- he won it all in 1977-78 the year that Coach Motta coined the phrase, "It ain't over 'til the fat lady sings."

Posted by: League-Source | November 24, 2009 4:46 PM | Report abuse

Yeah, I agree that if Zorn runs a play maybe they get SEVEN points. Fred Davis was having a pretty good game and I am surprised they didn't run more seam routes for him. I thought the playcalling got way too conservative in the second half. Classic Zorny. Maybe all 8 of his plays were in the second half, eh?

Well, maybe the Skins could be sitting at 6-4 now, and with a game upcoming against OAK they've got a W. But... Dallas again, the Giants again, Philly again, New Orleans, and SD are on the schedule. Getting three wins out of that schedule, that's tough.

Posted by: dpc2003 | November 24, 2009 4:47 PM | Report abuse

Who will be QB next year. There isn't much out there in free agency.

Posted by: Redskins001 | November 24, 2009 4:43 PM | Report abuse

Probably Tim Tebow. He has pretty high thetan levels.

Seriously though a lot of it depends on the CBA negotiations.

Logical approach:

If uncapped JC is restricted and we'll probably match the offer. He stays and becomes the starter for next year.

If capped the JC is unrestricted and would be stupid to come back to this craphole. He'll go to Carolina, Denver, Buffalo, Seattle, etc and compete for the starting job. Most of those teams have either a running game or a line. Therefore they are better options than us.

Those are the logical guesses but we aren't exactly working with a full deck.

Snyderrato:

Let him go without getting any compensation.

Draft a QB of the future in the first round.

Neglect the offensive line again claming that there were no starters available at our draft position.

Start him right away.

Act surprised and wonder why we have such bad luck after he seperates his shoulder in week 3.

Posted by: PAskinsfan17 | November 24, 2009 4:52 PM | Report abuse

Zorn is a complete tool.

Just run his azz already.

Posted by: SkinsfaninKaneohe | November 24, 2009 4:53 PM | Report abuse

RIP Abe Pollin

85 is a pretty good run, I'll sign up for that right now.

Posted by: Diesel44 | November 24, 2009 4:57 PM | Report abuse

I never know if anybody reads this stuff, but here's an interesting link on the some football assumptions:

http://www.footballoutsiders.com/extra-points/2009/malcolm-gladwell-vs-steven-pinker

Posted by: Samson151 | November 24, 2009 5:05 PM | Report abuse

Sad to hear Abe Pollin died. Like Snyder, he didn't have much on the court success. Unlike Snyder, he gave a damn about the fans and community.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | November 24, 2009 4:27 PM

Sad to see that zeke can't mourn Pollin without using it as an occassion to bash Snyder. Low, Zeke. Just for that I'm boycotting your sponsor, Yahoo.

Pollin did have on-the-court success -- he won it all in 1977-78 the year that Coach Motta coined the phrase, "It ain't over 'til the fat lady sings."

Posted by: League-Source

Loved the Motta comment. Fully, "The opera ain't over until the fat lady sings".

Pollin has had 70-ish seasons with the Caps and Wizards/Bullets -- and 1 championship. I do recall that championship year well. I also recall the stunned shock of the year we got swept by the Warriors in the championship series. Can't say there was much success was on the court/ice, there was some.

But Abe's goodwill goes a long way. And given this is a Redskins blog, its absolutely fair game to compare and contrast the owners

Posted by: zcezcest1 | November 24, 2009 5:07 PM | Report abuse

You keep JC as your QB next year and build your O-Line. you dont draft a rookie QB with a new line.

Posted by: GreatOne1 | November 24, 2009 5:07 PM | Report abuse

Perhaps this wouldn't even be an issue if the Skins had drafted Adrian Peterson instead of LaRon Landry.

Oh well....

Posted by: owiz | November 24, 2009 5:09 PM | Report abuse

There's one place that JC17 would be a good fit, and that's SF. I don't think SEA or DEN are good fits since they're 1) WCO and 2) have competent QB's.

Let's see, going down the list:
BUF - maybe
MIA - nope
NE - intriguing backup
NYJ - nope
BAL - nope
CIN - nope
CLE - from the pan into the fire
PIT - nope
HOU - nope
IND - you're kidding, right?
JAC - possibility
TEN - also a good fit. He's a game manager, but more skills than Collins
DEN - nope
KC - nope
OAK - from the pan, past the fire, straight to hell
SD - nope

So in the AFC I see the best fit as TEN, with a chance at JAC or BUF

Posted by: dpc2003 | November 24, 2009 5:11 PM | Report abuse

Colt comes back. David Carr will be available next year. These guys aren't up to Jason Campbell level. Although Carr has some upside given his experience with Houston and now the Giants. He is healthy, just turning 30. Could be a potential pseudo-franchise QB with a decent line. They still need one more guy and it shouldn't be Todd Collins. It should be someone young. Maybe JaMarcus Russell or Alex Smith if the 9'ers let him go.

There really are quarterbacks out there. But you really do need an offensive line with some reasonable depth. And you need a real coach and a good system.

Posted by: periculum | November 24, 2009 5:11 PM | Report abuse

Gladwell is rarely as insightful as he thinks he is. He is interesting and there is some substance to what he puts out, but not nearly as much as he wants people to believe.

Apparently, I do have an opinion on almost everything. Except wallpaper.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | November 24, 2009 5:12 PM | Report abuse

beep.

Posted by: periculum | November 24, 2009 5:14 PM | Report abuse

So in the AFC I see the best fit as TEN, with a chance at JAC or BUF

Posted by: dpc2003 |

No way Ten. They have a game manager already only theirs knows how to slide. And he runs the option.

Posted by: Curzon417 | November 24, 2009 5:16 PM | Report abuse

Sheesh, does everyone here think like the Snyderatoator Carcinoma maker? Huh?

Let's see, going down the list:
Minn - Yes. Favre is after all 40 isn't he?
CHI - Maybe. Stuck with Cutler? No.
Dallas - Maybe.
Tampa Bay- Strong possibility.
Carolina - Maybe, DelHomme looks terrible.
PHI - Andy Reid might like this possiblility.
StL Rams - over Bulger? Definitely.
BUF - Probably.
MIA - Maybe. Parcells could pull the trigger.
NE - nope. Brady.
NYJ - nope. Stuck with the rookie ... suckers!!!
BAL - Maybe. He looks better than what they have.
CIN - Over Carson. Probably not.
CLE - Quinn is looking better. He could land there.
49'ers - Maybe.
PIT - Big Ben is getting older. Concussions. Maybe.
HOU - Sure.
IND - Peyton needs a backup . Not JC.
JAC - Probably.
TEN - Sure.
DEN - Maybe.
KC - Over Cassel? Hell yes.
AZ - Hell yes.
OAK - With JaMarcus gone definite possiblity.
SD - Rivers. no.

C'mon wake up and smell the coffee. He is followed by scouts from other team every single game now. And he is improving.

Posted by: periculum | November 24, 2009 5:28 PM | Report abuse

+++++
Sheesh, there are some mean cusses on here. Cheering ACL injuries and so on. Lighten up, fellows.

Posted by: Towards_Light | November 24, 2009 7:36 PM | Report abuse

"Bottom lines of bottom lines: to field a deep into the playoffs winner as quickly as possible 3 components are needed.

1. An offensive line.
2. A set of quarterbacks and a decent offensive system.
3. A defensive backfield upgrade."

this is my fave today, because it's crazy and uses a previously unknown method of counting

Posted by: pabrian2003 | November 24, 2009 8:08 PM | Report abuse

If Campbell gets a good offer elsewhere, we should out bid that offer, because... every other teams GM is smarter than ours.

Collins will retire, right? Brennan has had an injury to both hips in as many years w/o a single reg season snap. Behind our line he's done before he starts.

So, even if we draft a QB AND get a free agent, not having Campbell for competition would be absolutely idiotic, so that is what we will do then.

Posted by: pabrian2003 | November 24, 2009 8:19 PM | Report abuse

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