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Campbell Sees Some Encouraging Signs

Despite the Redskins' problems in the red zone Sunday against the St. Louis Rams, quarterback Jason Campbell felt the offense showed some signs of improvement in the 9-7 victory.

"We definitely did some good things out there," Campbell said. "We put together some long drives, we moved the ball, and we can build on that. But, yeah, we've got to put the ball in the end zone. We've got to do better with that."

Yes, they do. The reality is the Redskins haven't been great on offense since, well, Gibbs 1.0. And in 18 games under coach and play-caller Jim Zorn, Washington has been among the league's least-productive teams in that key area. Washington averaged 16.6 points last season, ranking 28th out of 32 teams. Through two games this season, Washington is averaging 13 points.

It's not Zorn's fault that wide receiver Devin Thomas and fullback Mike Sellers dropped passes that could have given the Redskins a 14-0 lead in the first half, but, as the Redskins' leader everything obviously falls on him.

"We just have to understand every play is big no matter what quarter it is, no matter where we are on the field, and we've got to get the ball in the end zone," Campbell said. "No matter how much we move the ball, we have to score points."

()()()

There's a chat at 11:30 with Cindy Boren, who can't imagine what could possibly be on your minds.

By Jason Reid  |  September 21, 2009; 5:51 AM ET
Categories:  Jason Reid  
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Next: Cooley, Redskins Seeking Answers (Updated)

Comments

Not a hater, not much of a commenter on these stories. Today, I am compelled to say something.

I'm happy with the win. 0-2 would have been a disaster, BUT...

Up two with 2 minutes left and you go for it on 4th down TWICE in the red zone? With a great defense?? The other team has NO TIMEOUTS??? This is as close to a fireable offense for an offensive coordinator (in this case, Zorn). I had friends from across the COUNTRY call me to say Zorn was in over his head, and once they saw Danny Smith yelling at him like a child who couldn't manage the clock it sealed the deal. The guy is not ready for this job yet.

Posted by: 4seamed | September 21, 2009 6:09 AM | Report abuse

I'm very disapointed with the coaching. It is not a crime to allow someone else to call the plays or coach the QB's at the end of the day we need someone who is propared to lead a team as the coach. Zorn is not ready. You guys will find a way to blame Campbell, but I think we all know where the shortfall is on this team and it is not on the field it is on the sideline. No 1st down passes. Last week Zorn said "The guys did what we asked them to" we have to as fans stop looking through tinted shades and focus on the real problem. Zorn and Cerrato are the problems.

Posted by: jtrob_1 | September 21, 2009 6:18 AM | Report abuse

And, unless Detroit can pull off a miracle, we're gonna be 2-1 next Monday, regardless of your fervent hopes that we will lose again.

Posted by: talent_evaluator | September 21, 2009 6:00 AM


Sorry if I don't get a boner over a 9-7 win against the worst team in the league like you do. You may lovingly eat any crap sandwich served to you by the burgundy and gold, but I expect this band of overpayed professionals to bring their A-game against ALL comers, not just the division opponents and elite teams. Dogging it for 60 mins and settling for 3 pointers in the red zone is inexcusable.

And I would hardly call Detroit beating us a "miracle". A miracle would be the Redskins scoring 30 points in a game.

Posted by: brownwood26 | September 21, 2009 6:26 AM | Report abuse

And just wait until they crap the bed against Detroit next week...the blog will be on fire!

Posted by: brownwood26 | September 21, 2009 5:36 AM |

Fire on the blog? Wow, won't that be something. You and the other pyromaniacs who are trying to turn a 9-7 win into a loss will be back again? Ooh, at least I can look forward to that.

Okay. I'll wait. But you're so afraid they'll win that you want to start pizzing on them now. What's your Plan B for a Redskins victory? Right -- ignore the score and pizz on them anyway. "Well, we won, but we'll lose next week."

Today we are 1-1. We have the same record as Philly, Dallas, New England, San Diego and -- your fave -- Pittsburgh. We won yesterday and they lost. We're winners; they're losers. And, unless Detroit can pull off a miracle, we're gonna be 2-1 next Monday, regardless of your fervent hopes that we will lose again.

Posted by: talent_evaluator | September 21, 2009 6:27 AM | Report abuse

There were some problems in the Redzone for sure, Zorn needs to do a lot better. He needs to mix it up throw some fade routes on 1st down. I agree with TE a win is a win and I'll take it. Some of you want us to lose so you can get what you want, Zorn fired and JC benched. If that happens fine but I will not whish it to happen.

Posted by: Flounder21 | September 21, 2009 6:43 AM | Report abuse

There is no doubt that yesterday highlighted Zorn's lack of trust in his players, and I supposed Campbell in particular. With that written, what more does Zorn want from Campbell? He made good decisions all day, threw the ball well(aside from a couple of throws) and obviously is ready to be properly tested. Zorn needs to let it fly.

Posted by: craig2 | September 21, 2009 6:56 AM | Report abuse

The reality is the Redskins haven't been great on offense since, well, Gibbs 1.0.

By Jason Reid | September 21, 2009; 5:51 AM ET


Actually, Norv had this team 2nd in offense to the "Greatest Show on Turf" Rams in 1999. If we could pair that offense with this defense, wow this team could be something...

Wow. So THIS is what rock bottom feels like--pining for the days of Norv Turner...

Posted by: brownwood26 | September 21, 2009 6:59 AM | Report abuse

another reason for wondering why we are fans of the Redskins..

++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Perhaps the most animated player was backup linebacker Robert Henson, who took to Twitter to repeatedly criticize the home crowd,

"All you fake half hearted Skins fan can .. I won't go there but I dislike you very strongly, don't come to Fed Ex to boo dim wits!!" he wrote, among many other jabs. "The question is who are you to say you know what's best for the team and you work 9 to 5 at Mcdonalds," he wrote later.

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/dcsportsbog/2009/09/so_is_it_really_time_to_boo_th_1.html?hpid=topnews

Posted by: SkinsneedaGM | September 21, 2009 7:05 AM | Report abuse

Our only hope is for the trainwreck to become so bad Zorn gets canned and a high profile head coach demands a new front office, instead of Hobbytown USA.
Jason Reid might be the new mayor of Baloney Sunshinetown, but the rest of us have been around through the ten long years of mediocrity.
Zorn was the product of a bassackwards coaching search that was resoundingly criticized by the rest of the league. Even the team that knew him the best, the Seahawks, weren't promoting him to offensive coordinator and brought in some completely other guy (Jim Mora) to be groomed as the replacement for Holmgren.
The Giants and Eagles have been able to get dependable receivers out of the past two drafts. Heck, the Falcons signed Marty Booker off the street a month ago.
So, again, let's all agree that this season is not a referendum on the players, coaches, fans, but the front office. Until they change, nothing does.

Posted by: minorthread | September 21, 2009 7:07 AM | Report abuse

We have the worst RB's and the worst QB of the division

Posted by: t-bone67 | September 21, 2009 7:08 AM | Report abuse

Personally, I will NEVER stop being a Redskins fan, it's in my blood and can't be denied. I also happen to be a football fan, have coached the game, and understand that while the FO has not done a good job for a long time, they have shown signs of change. I still think Zorn can be a good head coach, but he has to learn to trust his players and let them play the game. Gibbs had the same issue. Campbell played well yesterday, but was handcuffed when it mattered, in the red zone.

Posted by: craig2 | September 21, 2009 7:15 AM | Report abuse

Playcalling in the redzone was atrocious.
These are the problems I see:
1) Trick plays against a weak team is self-defeating. They are not good enuf to be fooled or over pursue.
2) Redzone play calling was terrible. Where is the simple fade route that others use successfully? What about a naked bookleg on 3rd and goal that others call successfully?
3) One Campbell error in particular I remember, a screen pass to Moss in the 1st half. Moss had pass rushing defenders still in front of him. You always throw a screen OVER the pass rush, not in front of it. Sheesh. Either he should have waited or thrown it away, but instead he completed it for a big loss.
4) Sadly, receivers Thomas and Kelly are not working out. How long will we wait for them to turn pro? Is this going to be another Westbrook? We waited too long to cut him.
5) Same goes for Campbell. He will never be a great QB. But he is not a bad QB. He's a 5 on a scale of 1-10. In the right system with competant play calling, he would be OK. This is the wrong system for him with poor play calling. Sadly, he will never be much better than he is now.
6) I feel badly for Zorn. He is a good man, with some good ideas, but he is a poor offensive coordinator and head coach. His offensive game plans and play calling are poor. He does not inspire confidence in his team. His teams are always flat. They don't play with urgency. That whole "medium" thing was terrible. That is OK for a QB going thru a rough time, but terrible for most other positions. He still has not fixed getting his plays to the QB in time. I doubt replacing him in the middle of the season would be better. I don't know if Greg Blanch is even ready. I don't think Bill Cowyer is a good fit for us. Mike Shanahan or Jon Gruden maybe.

Posted by: PriorKnowledge | September 21, 2009 7:22 AM | Report abuse

Robert Henson can kiss my ass. For the prices those fans are paying and the effort we're getting for that money, he's lucky there's no pitchfork and torch revolt outside Redskins Park. If he doesn't like the booing, go out and make a f*cking play!

Posted by: brownwood26 | September 21, 2009 7:38 AM | Report abuse

Where to begin, where to begin...

It is my personal opinion that Washington, D.C., might be one of the most difficult places for to play. And I don't mean for opposing teams, I mean for the home team. Perhaps it has something to do with the fact that the city's politics lends itself to a natural sense of skepticism among its residents, and this skepticism spills over into the sports world. And let's face it, the Redskins haven't been very good over the last 17 years or so, so it is difficult to believe that any good will come. But until the mindset of the FANS changes, it will continue to be very very difficult for this team to do good things. As fans, we have a responsibility to our team - to support and encourage them, to root for them, to make FedEx as difficult a place as possible for opposing teams. Booing YOUR OWN TEAM helps motivate the people on the other sideline! Do you all not understand that? I understand the disappointment. I want to see more touchdowns too. But they won. And I'm encouraged by the way the offense moved the ball all game. And there are appropriate times and places to voices our concerns and in the stadium, during a game, is not one of them. We must stay positive. We must believe this team is capable of great things, and great things will begin to happen. And what do we have to lose by allowing ourselves to believe in these Washington Redskins? Perhaps some disappointment, but we cannot let that possibility outweigh our hopes that this franchise will be successful again. Hail to the Redskins!

Booing? Seriously? In week 2 when the team WON?

Posted by: mmeixler | September 21, 2009 7:43 AM | Report abuse

Zorn needs to give up the playcalling duties and concentrate on being a Head Coach, or he won;t be a Head Coach much longer...

Posted by: Jason10 | September 21, 2009 7:45 AM | Report abuse

"The reality is the Redskins haven't been great on offense since, well, Gibbs 1.0."
--JReid

I am annoyed with the team's performance too, but this is inaccurate. Norv had one great (and a couple of good) offensive seasons, while Gibbs 2.0 had one great offensive season (with Brunell as the starter, Ramsey one the bench and Jansen and Samuels in their prime).

Posted by: jcabana | September 21, 2009 7:52 AM | Report abuse

In my mind, Campbell is off the hook for this one. He did a pretty good job. Sellers and Thomas should run wind sprints tomorrow until they puke for dropping those touchdown tosses.

As for play calling, I think Zorn learned a week too late to put Campbell in the shotgun and to run a little no-huddle. Yes, Sellers and Thomas dropped balls, but why weren't the twin towers, Marko Mitchell and Malcolm Kelly, in on some fade patterns there in the end zone? And the Portis option on that one play? Pure bone headed play calling. Another bone headed call? Running on fourth down to the left where you had run about a dozen times already did not fool anyone. If you have that little confidence in the right side of your line or you passing game, then just kick the field goal.

I am not sure about the extent of the Randy thomas injury but here we go again. Chris Samuels had to rest his knee one day of practice last week, and now Thomas has an injury. If there is a tear in Thomas' tricep, they need to immediately put him on injured reserve and sign Jaimie Thomas off of the Colts developmental roster.

I don't think I have ever felt so bad about a win. It was pathetic that the Redskins had to struggle so much to beat a team that is really quite bad. Zorn has demonstrated he can make changes but his game calling reflexes are just not those of an NFL coach. I still do not think he maximizes the talents of his players. It's going to be a long, painful season watching this downward spiral. The coaches and players will soon start to revolt. Eventually the owner will have to put pressure on Zorn to make changes he does not want. Ultimately, it may mean Zorn gets the boot before the end of the season.

Posted by: RedSkinHead | September 21, 2009 7:53 AM | Report abuse

It is probably funny for you guys to hear me say this, but Jason Campbell is not the problem. The problem is Jim Zorn. The man cannot call a game.

I do have to admit that I am surprised that the Redskins won. I was the only one on the Redskins Insider predicting the Rams to win... and Zorn did everything in his power to make that happen.

Alas, the Redskins won, in spite of Jim Zorn. How many more such victories can we expect under this regime? Not many, unles Jim Zorn is fired TODAY.

Posted by: Sports_Guru | September 21, 2009 7:55 AM | Report abuse

Let this be a lesson to everybody who calls for Mason, Marko, Colt and every other scrub who shines in the 3rd quarter of preseason games. They suck, they may become better in a year but currently they can't out preform a brick. 3 carries for 5 yards that completely stalled a drive...piece of crap

Posted by: NFeKPo | September 21, 2009 7:55 AM | Report abuse

Robert Henson, that's no way to treat your future employer.

That being said, fans should never boo a team executing the victory formation. If this team makes the playoffs (PLAYOFFS!?), it won't be because we had the most style points. It wil be based solely on wins and losses.

Posted by: Kenbeatrizz | September 21, 2009 7:58 AM | Report abuse

1965 not sure if you reading the blog this early. But check out this quote about Zorn instructions to JC in the redzone. How damn dumb is Zorn? Even if JC see that the sorry a** play Zorn calls he can't change it. Sooo ready for Zorn to go!

Campbell lined up and saw the Rams loaded to the left side. The play was to Portis just that way. But deep in the red zone, Zorn doesn't want Campbell changing plays, lest a communication problem cause a costly turnover.

Posted by: jm220 | September 21, 2009 7:58 AM | Report abuse

But until the mindset of the FANS changes, it will continue to be very very difficult for this team to do good things...

Posted by: mmeixler | September 21, 2009 7:43 AM


Dude, put down the pom-poms and smell the sh*t covered roses. This ain't a high school or college team where it's kids who need love and encouragement. This is the big leages, the pros. These guys are paid millions of dollars to play a kid's game and half of 'em would rather get their drink on in Georgetown than watch film to make themselves even a little bit better at their craft. Some of these guys are here for the money, not to win ballgames. And God only knows what nonsense actually motivates their borderline retarded head coach.

The fans aren't the problem, the front office is. If you're not building a team properly or hiring the right coaches, it doesn't matter in the least what the fans are doing, the team will still fail. And blowing sunshine up their collective asses won't do anything but enable them to think their poo-poo effort is in some way acceptable.

I think fans have paid a pretty high price for the right to boo and damn well should if they see fit. The team has a very simple solution that it seems to be overlooking: play good football. Not great, not dominant...we'll settle for just good. And there's no amount of spin in the world that can make that performance yesterday seem like a good one.

Posted by: brownwood26 | September 21, 2009 7:59 AM | Report abuse

Let this be a lesson to everybody who calls for Mason, Marko, Colt and every other scrub who shines in the 3rd quarter of preseason games. They suck, they may become better in a year but currently they can't out preform a brick. 3 carries for 5 yards that completely stalled a drive...piece of crap

Posted by: NFeKPo | September 21, 2009 7:55 AM |

I agree on Mason and Colt, but you have know bases for the Marko Mitchell comment. He has not been given a shot yet.

Posted by: Flounder21 | September 21, 2009 8:00 AM | Report abuse

Ive never felt more disgusted after an actual win like I was at that game. The ticket prices, the nickel and diming from vendors, the traffic, the disconnected feeling from the on-the-field activity--I can take all that in stride when the team puts its best out on the field. What I saw was a team that underplayed. No urgency. And a coaching staff that continued making bad calls, not putting players in the best position to make plays. Was the booing justified? Absolutely. And one person said it best, the booing was directed more at the ownership than anything else.

Posted by: pgugino | September 21, 2009 8:09 AM | Report abuse

Our troubles start up front.

Compare our run-blocking and pass protection against the Giants D.L. to what the Cowboys did last night.
~

Posted by: ifthethunderdontgetya | September 21, 2009 8:10 AM | Report abuse

I agree on Mason and Colt, but you have know bases for the Marko Mitchell comment. He has not been given a shot yet.

Posted by: Flounder21 | September 21, 2009 8:00 AM | Report abuse

In general I was lumping him in with all the other players in his situation. But I still contend that if he was ahead of MK or DT he would be a drop off. He may be better next year but that doesn't mean he should get time this year.

Posted by: NFeKPo | September 21, 2009 8:11 AM | Report abuse

Thomas can hardly be blamed for his drop. He ran a pattern that took him 2 yards off the line and got nailed twice in the 3 steps prior to the ball getting there

Posted by: 3rings | September 21, 2009 8:13 AM | Report abuse

Classic example of Zorn's incompetence at head coach. He decides to call a timeout and signals to the ref. ST coach Dan Smith has to intervene and tell Zorn to wait until the playclock drains down before the TO gets called. Look, I don't doubt Zorn would make an okay coordinator, but his gadget plays and bad clock management are continuous problems, problems that wouldn't happen with a person that knows what to do as a Head coach.

Posted by: pgugino | September 21, 2009 8:14 AM | Report abuse

You guys with TiVo, here's a suggestion: go back and watch the game again with the sound turned off. It looks different when you're not getting that hysterical commentary fed into your brain.

Posted by: Samson151 | September 21, 2009 8:14 AM | Report abuse

Booing as they ran out the clock to win was terrible, made no sense

Posted by: drewkinnear | September 21, 2009 8:15 AM | Report abuse

Henson needs to credit the same fans with a big assist on the last 4 D- stops where the noise was deafening.

Posted by: 3rings | September 21, 2009 8:16 AM | Report abuse

Our troubles start up front.

Compare our run-blocking and pass protection against the Giants D.L. to what the Cowboys did last night.
~

Posted by: ifthethunderdontgetya | September 21, 2009 8:10 AM

Youa re right about our troubles starting "up front"... as in the "front office"

Posted by: Sports_Guru | September 21, 2009 8:16 AM | Report abuse

We also need to harass the opponents receivers within 5 yards of the line of scrimmage. get in their faces, ajam them up. NO MORE CUSHIONS!!!

Posted by: Sports_Guru | September 21, 2009 8:19 AM | Report abuse

didn't see the game, was at the nascar race in nh, however I did read the play by play, seems like they ran the offense all over the field between the 20's, DT, and MS dropping td's didn't help.

A win is a win, do I wish they won by 40 sure, but I'll take 1-1 at this point.

I'm pissed that Mason got into the game, that means my old stand by of "I've got the same career numbers as Mason" is out the window.......sigh......

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | September 21, 2009 8:19 AM | Report abuse

Booing as they ran out the clock to win was terrible, made no sense

Posted by: drewkinnear
see comment posted 8:09 -- Ownership and to a lesser extent coachin were the main targets of the booing from my perspective at the game. Not the players, though they underperformed as a team.

Posted by: pgugino | September 21, 2009 8:20 AM | Report abuse

Booing as they ran out the clock to win was terrible, made no sense

Posted by: drewkinnear | September 21, 2009 8:15 AM

Are you an idiot?

They were booing the inept offense, the abysmal play calling, and the fact that if it were any other team... WE WOULD HAVE BEEN BLOWN OUT BY 30 POINTS!

Posted by: Sports_Guru | September 21, 2009 8:21 AM | Report abuse

I'm ashamed to admit I was almost relieved when Randy Thomas got that triceps injury. Anything but his neck.

Will Montgomery isn't as talented, but he might represent an upgrade in terms of stamina and good health. He's a smart player rather than a brute, and they tend to be a little more adaptable than average. He'll still need help against the real tough defensive lines, however.

Somebody mentioned that the Skins don't run right -- that's largely true. Last season they ran most often off Samuels. Very different from other running clubs like Baltimore, which got most of its yards off guard.

Posted by: Samson151 | September 21, 2009 8:21 AM | Report abuse

THE ONLY ENCOURAGING SIGN WOULD BE CAMPBELL ON THE SIDELINE WITH A CLIPBOARD. THIS GUY IS HORRIBLE AND OUR SEASON WILL BE FLUSHED DOWN THE TOILET BEFORE WE KNOW IT. I AM SO SICK OF THIS GUY. HE IS TOO MECHANICAL AND HIS BYRON LEFTWICH-LIKE RELEASE ISN'T HELPING US EITHER. THIS TEAM HAS A LOT OF TALENT AND A LOT OF POTENTIAL (THEY BETTER FOR THE MONEY) AND WE CAN'T MOVE THE BALL AND GET TOUCHDOWNS. THIS FALLS DIRECTLY ON THE QB AND HEAD COACH. I LOVE THE SKINS, BUT I WILL NOT BE SURPRISED WHEN WE LOSE TO DETROIT NEXT WEEK. THE ONLY PROBLEM IS, WE DON'T HAVE ANYONE ELSE TO PLAY QUARTERBACK. DOES ANYONE SEE THIS TEAM AS A PLAYOFF TEAM WITH JASON CAMPBELL AT THE HELM? AM I MISSING SOMETHING?

Posted by: HogInCharlotte | September 21, 2009 8:23 AM | Report abuse

A win is a win jeez, have then nurse give you your meds today

Posted by: drewkinnear | September 21, 2009 8:25 AM | Report abuse

I say, Any time in the first 3 quarters past the oppositions 30, take out the smurfs (moss and ARE) and put in the big 3 receivers with Cooley, and Throw the ball. They will get better or not, but we really do not know WHAT we have as they are totally untested. Manningham did not look good in preseason, and Eli just kept throwing to him and the kid got some confidence, and he looked all world last night. Throw them the ball ......throw them the ball......THROW THEM THE BALL.

Posted by: boysheadcoach | September 21, 2009 8:27 AM | Report abuse

Off last year, I'm glad the 'SKINS played well enough to win, but I'm surely not pleased that we did not dominate a clearly inferior team. Too dammed many penalties and turnovers kept St. LOUIS in the game.

MONTGOMERY drew one penalty, but looked as good today as he did during the x-season. And he played out of position at RG. I knew THOMAS was done. I believe he will call it a career. SAMUELS is next, but his departure is not imminant by any means.

Still, we need two o-line draftees in the second and fourth rounds next year. You do not want to see RINEHART filling in for either THOMAS or MONTGOMERY. I believe ED WILLIAMS should play before RINEHART despite CHAD's badd-azz chin whiskers.

Still should pick CB #1 in 2010. If we can do something about CAMPBELL during the off-season in FA so be it. Otherwise, keep him through 2010 then draft a #1 QB.

Did you see the route DEVIN THOMAS ran down the sidline when he made the out-of-bounds catch? Too close to the side-line, and smothered by the DB. Why didn't he run a little more inside the side-line so he could fade out a bit and stay in-bounds while making the catch? The announcers laid it on CAMPBELL, but I think JASON would have put it in bounds if there had been any room to manouver.

I gotta' believe MARKO MITCHELL would have run a correct route and made the catch in-bounds. He is a smart receiver. THOMAS's route-running looks as dumb as owl-shyt. Oh hell, I'm just pyssed that he didn't make the catch in-bounds. Anyway, we won. No need for recriminations. I'll let the coaches do that.

And yes, I saw DANO warn off JIM on the play-clock thing. Makes me wonder who's in charge of the zoo.

You do know bloggers, SPAGNOLO would be the REDSKINS head-coach if DAN SNYDER was a JACK KENT COOKE-type owner. But DANO just can't stay out of the kitchen, and too many cooks.....well, you get the idea why SPAGNOLO and every other potential head-coach worthy of the name avoids WASHINGTON's franchise like the plague.

Voila, offensive co-ordinator to head coach. Don't be too hard on JZ. He's in over his head, and knows it.

Posted by: glawrence007 | September 21, 2009 8:30 AM | Report abuse

I'd like to see CRhine, get the start this coming week, see what he can do.

For those who watched the game, if someone could update me on how the following played:
Portis/OLine
Haynes/Dline

thanks.

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | September 21, 2009 8:31 AM | Report abuse

It's not as simple as W's and L's -- it's how you play from start to finish. A loss sure hurts, but if you play to your fullest and come up short, you at least know you gave it everything you had, and there's peace of mind in knowing that. But that's not the case when this team ekes out its wins. There's an array of missed opportunities, clumsy play mixed with bad coaching decisions--indicative of a team not improving.

Posted by: pgugino | September 21, 2009 8:32 AM | Report abuse

I'm tired of this "a win's a win" garbage. The Redskins players need to stop TELLING everyone they're good and start SHOWING everyone they're good. There's a definite difference between the two. I hate how the Skins only give as much effort as they think they need to to win. And that may not be true everyone, but it seems like Moss and Portis are the real culprits there. (Maybe once this season Moss will run a route like he means it, like he wants to get open, like he cares about playing football.)

Am I happy they? In the grand scheme of things, it's nice they did. But you can't put up nine points against one of the worst teams in the league and call your afternoon successful.

Posted by: CDon | September 21, 2009 8:34 AM | Report abuse

I'd like to see CRhine, get the start this coming week, see what he can do.

For those who watched the game, if someone could update me on how the following played:
Portis/OLine
Haynes/Dline

thanks.

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | September 21, 2009 8:31 AM |

Portis played well very good in blitz pickup/ O-Line played great in the pass, played OK in run

Haynesworth had a great game he was stuffing the middle and was the main reason we got could pressure on the QB.

D-Line was solid all game, a lot of pressure.

CB played off, tackling was better but they still need to press the receivers at the line.

Posted by: Flounder21 | September 21, 2009 8:35 AM | Report abuse

thanks flound, good to hear. I'm taking this win as a win...could it have been better sure, but in the end, its goes in the books as a W.....

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | September 21, 2009 8:42 AM | Report abuse

Wow. So THIS is what rock bottom feels like--pining for the days of Norv Turner...

Posted by: brownwood26 | September 21, 2009 6:59 AM | Report abuse

No, rock-bottom is living in Detroit in 2008, Miami in 2007. At least we are competitive with most teams in the league.

Posted by: frediefritz | September 21, 2009 8:48 AM | Report abuse

Let's try to add some bright-side perspective for those of you who love to hate?

We played against a team that did horrible last week, yes. But we played against a coach and a defensive scheme that has crushed us for years. Spagnolo didn't know the hawks like he knows the skins, plus they were playing angry from being shut out last week. So simply saying we should have blown out this team is really downplaying the Rams and not giving enough credit to Spags.

I think we showed improvement, and that's the best you can ask for. We showed deficiency in play calling in the red zone yes, except of course we should have had two touchdowns but we didn't thanks to drops, not play calling or Campbell.

But if you look overall at how the offense performed, I saw significant improvement and that's really encouraging. We are very fortunate to have an easy early schedule in which to find our offensive identity, and we made progress on that in this game.

You can look at the gints/boys game last night two different ways. On the one hand, you can look at how great they both performed offensively and cry because we can't do that. That was my initial reaction.

But now the way I look at it, our defense vastly out performs both of theirs. Consider how many points the gints put up in a LOUD away game, compared to how many they scored on offense in their own house vs. us. If our offense continues to improve every week, I remain optimistic until our RECORD proves otherwise.

Posted by: REXskins | September 21, 2009 8:52 AM | Report abuse

'I'd like to see CRhine, get the start this coming week, see what he can do.'

He's a 3rd round pick has yet to dress for a single nfl game on a team desperate for oline help. The coaches know what he can do, or in this case, can't do.

This game illustrated beyond a shadow of a doubt the offenses biggest problem is Jim Zorn. Campbell played just fine and the oline held up as well as they will all season. The problem is the playcalling, and it smacks you in the face the minute you watch other teams play (ie cowboys/gints last night).

Where are the throws 25 yards downfield between the numbers? Campbell doesnt even get the chance to make those plays. Dink and dunk to the 10yd line, then stall out.

Zorn needs to open the playbook pronto!

Posted by: divi3 | September 21, 2009 8:52 AM | Report abuse

If they thought the booing was bad yesterday, wait until they end the Lions losing streak. Zorn is gutless and I don't even blame him. Once again it is the 2 idiots in charge that hired him. 8-8 will be a miracle with this pop warner offense.

Posted by: ToddStinkston | September 21, 2009 8:53 AM | Report abuse

"He's a 3rd round pick has yet to dress for a single nfl game on a team desperate for oline help. The coaches know what he can do, or in this case, can't do"

So....if he hasn't played in a game, how do they know what he can do?

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | September 21, 2009 8:57 AM | Report abuse

Where to begin, where to begin...

It is my personal opinion that Washington, D.C., might be one of the most difficult places for to play. And I don't mean for opposing teams, I mean for the home team. Perhaps it has something to do with the fact that the city's politics lends itself to a natural sense of skepticism among its residents, and this skepticism spills over into the sports world. And let's face it, the Redskins haven't been very good over the last 17 years or so, so it is difficult to believe that any good will come. But until the mindset of the FANS changes, it will continue to be very very difficult for this team to do good things. As fans, we have a responsibility to our team - to support and encourage them, to root for them, to make FedEx as difficult a place as possible for opposing teams. Booing YOUR OWN TEAM helps motivate the people on the other sideline! Do you all not understand that? I understand the disappointment. I want to see more touchdowns too. But they won. And I'm encouraged by the way the offense moved the ball all game. And there are appropriate times and places to voices our concerns and in the stadium, during a game, is not one of them. We must stay positive. We must believe this team is capable of great things, and great things will begin to happen. And what do we have to lose by allowing ourselves to believe in these Washington Redskins? Perhaps some disappointment, but we cannot let that possibility outweigh our hopes that this franchise will be successful again. Hail to the Redskins!

Booing? Seriously? In week 2 when the team WON?

Posted by: mmeixler | September 21, 2009 7:43 AM | Report abuse

Well said, mmeixler. I understand the frustration of under-achieving from a highly compensated team. I suspect that the booing was directed at JZ. But I still think it only encourages the opposition, and should not be done unless the team is lacksidasical. And there was a lot of effort displayed on the field yesterday. All 3 units did their jobs well, except for the red zone collapses. And I put that on JZ's shoulders. He needs to be more imaginative in his red zone calling.

Posted by: frediefritz | September 21, 2009 8:58 AM | Report abuse

agree on Mason and Colt, but you have know bases for the Marko Mitchell comment. He has not been given a shot yet.

Posted by: Flounder21 | September 21, 2009 8:00 AM | Report abuse

In general I was lumping him in with all the other players in his situation. But I still contend that if he was ahead of MK or DT he would be a drop off. He may be better next year but that doesn't mean he should get time this year.

Posted by: NFeKPo | September 21, 2009 8:11 AM | Report abuse

First, 3 carries for 5 yards is hardly a sufficient sample size to judge MM. Second, I loathe Colt and will not defend him. Third, Mitchell, as noted above, hasn't been given a chance and should not be "lumped in" just because he's young and a late round pick. I think he will be a good WR in the coming years.

But onto the real issue - execution. We should've scored TD's, no doubt, and that needs to be improved upon. But bottom line is we won and we did move the ball. Must develop a killer instinct and yes, Zorn's play calling inside the 10 was at time mystifying, but don't forget that we had 4 drives of over 60 yards. It wasn't all bad, folks.

JC/Zorn haters, take a break and enjoy the win.

Posted by: Notorious_LMG | September 21, 2009 9:00 AM | Report abuse

"Compare our run-blocking and pass protection against the Giants D.L. to what the Cowboys did last night."

True -- the Boys revealed some serious weaknesses in the NY run defense. Pass protection, not so much; NY has never been a great pass blocking club. It just doesn't show as much when they can run the ball. Plus Dallas rushes the passer as well as anybody.

Those two plays at the end of the half, where Witten kicked the ball and the one where Manningham made that reception in the end zone -- the first was 100% dumb luck, the second 80% dumb luck. I don't think anybody expected a shootout, but if Tony Romo had played halfway decent, that game belongs to Dallas.

Posted by: Samson151 | September 21, 2009 9:01 AM | Report abuse

'You can look at the gints/boys game last night two different ways. On the one hand, you can look at how great they both performed offensively and cry because we can't do that.'

Except we CAN do that. In fact, Campbell almost assuredly throws a better ball 30-40 yards vertically than he does all the short crosses and sideline junk he's currently attempting. We could be more vertical but we arent. That's the tear inducing part

Posted by: divi3 | September 21, 2009 9:01 AM | Report abuse

8-8 will be a miracle with this pop warner offense.

Posted by: ToddStinkston | September 21, 2009 8:53 AM


That's an insult to Pop Warner offenses everywhere. In fact, here's a list of the Pops with more offensive firepower than the Redskins:

Pop Warner
Pop Winans
My 3 year-old singing "Pop Goes the Weasel"
Any Soda Pop vendor

Posted by: brownwood26 | September 21, 2009 9:02 AM | Report abuse

So....if he hasn't played in a game, how do they know what he can do?

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | September 21, 2009 8:57 AM | Report abuse

What do you think they do during practice? Other than not go through red zone plays. You act like just because you don't see what the man has to offer there is no way the people on a 1st name basis with him could know either. If the man isn't producing in practice then he shouldn't dress on Sunday. PERIOD

Posted by: NFeKPo | September 21, 2009 9:02 AM | Report abuse

"So....if he hasn't played in a game, how do they know what he can do?"

He's another Cerrato BUST. Would have been cut this year if he wasnt a 3rd round pick.

Unless of course you think being unable to perform well enough in PRACTICE for the coaches to deem you worthy of suiting up speaks to greatness

Posted by: divi3 | September 21, 2009 9:04 AM | Report abuse

For those who watched the game, if someone could update me on how the following played:
Portis/OLine
Haynes/Dline

thanks.

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | September 21, 2009 8:31 AM | Report abuse


Portis ran great when he was running between Samuels and Dock. He still has great vision when running downhill. The line was ok in run and very good in pass. We didn't have a big day on the ground because we really didn't need to. The passing game looked really great until we hit the redzone. We had 4 drives that stalled inside the 10 and 1 fumble in the red zone. The score should have been 27-7 but we crapped the bed every time we saw a goal post. The Dline looked great and Bulger was pretty much a punching bag with a helmet yesterday. I'm sure he'll be spending some time in the whirlpool this week. Our biggest concerns by far are Dhall, the nickel CB of the week, and our red zone play calling.

Posted by: PAskinsfan17 | September 21, 2009 9:04 AM | Report abuse

A win, Is a Win...I agree. Still a little disappointed with the win, but we were also playing against someone who knows us pretty damn well in SPAGS. Having said that...I still have concerns. I am also not that impressed with our defense -Landry looked awful at times and I think he has regressed, corners still playing way off the line at times and we gave up a 1st down on what 1 and 15 due to the corners giving so much space, we had one play when it was like 3rd and 6 and Rogers was playing 10 yards off, WR went 6 yards sat down and presto chango - first down. My other issues:
1.) does Zorn know what a fade route is or understand that MK12 is taller than most DB's, he did drop the first pass though, he looks awkward when he goes up for the ball.
2.) we continue to abandon Portis to early
3.) Moss looks like he rather be playing elsewhere
4.) team looks like they dont want to win for Zorn
5.) Zorn lacks trust in all players not named Portis/ Cooley

A win was nice and hopefully we can build on it with a win at Detroit, but we have always been plagued with playing down to our opponents.

hail Skins.

Posted by: mhartz1 | September 21, 2009 9:06 AM | Report abuse

8-8 will be a miracle with this pop warner offense.

Posted by: ToddStinkston | September 21, 2009 8:53 AM


That's an insult to Pop Warner offenses everywhere. In fact, here's a list of the Pops with more offensive firepower than the Redskins:

Pop Warner
Pop Winans
My 3 year-old singing "Pop Goes the Weasel"
Any Soda Pop vendor


Posted by: brownwood26 | September 21, 2009 9:02 AM | Report abuse

I hope you haters own up to these ridiculous comments when we are 5-2 going into our break...actually, it'll probably be "Pop Warner teams could've beaten the Rams, Lions, Bucs...our offense still sucks" I'm not thrilled with our offense's performance so far either but give it a rest.

There is just no pleasing some people.

Posted by: Notorious_LMG | September 21, 2009 9:06 AM | Report abuse

"Did you see the route DEVIN THOMAS ran down the sidline when he made the out-of-bounds catch? Too close to the side-line, and smothered by the DB. Why didn't he run a little more inside the side-line so he could fade out a bit and stay in-bounds while making the catch? The announcers laid it on CAMPBELL, but I think JASON would have put it in bounds if there had been any room to manouver"

That's a really hard throw to make -- maybe one of the hardest for any QB, with the sideline acting as an extra DB. Oddly enough, Vinny Testarverde excelled at it.

Posted by: Samson151 | September 21, 2009 9:08 AM | Report abuse

hey Washington post, your redskins front page has looked like crap since yesterday, i know you all are busy with your neoconservative media planning, but can we get someone to fix that, it looks terrible

Posted by: BMACattack | September 21, 2009 9:09 AM | Report abuse

pa, thanks.

nek/divi, I'm going to fall back on what buges said about him, versus, the mere speculation that you're throwing out there....buges seemed to think that CR made significant progress from last year to this, so lets let him play a couple of games and see what he can do.....

brown, seriously, how about taking some time off from following this team...its a beautiful day out there, cloudless sky, take a walk, or go do something other than watch the Redskins this coming weekend....

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | September 21, 2009 9:09 AM | Report abuse

"I hope you haters own up to these ridiculous comments when we are 5-2 going into our break...There is just no pleasing some people."

We were 6-2 last year and finished 2-6 due 110% to the lousy offense and decrepit oline. Seeing the current situation for what it is aint hating. 2 weeks into the season we have seen NOTHING to indicate the offense has improved upon last year's 28th ranked juggernaut.

Meanwhile the D remains awesome.

Song remains the same do far, and that is not encouraging for the season.

Posted by: divi3 | September 21, 2009 9:11 AM | Report abuse

Samson151,
I will give you a pass this once, but please refrain from analyzing an NFC East battle that did not involve the Skins on this blog, that doesn't begin and end with "Scum of the planet" or "Worst thing to happen to mankind since Mayonnaise"

Posted by: NFeKPo | September 21, 2009 9:12 AM | Report abuse

With Jim Zorn as coach, we will be 4 - 12 this year.

Posted by: Sports_Guru | September 21, 2009 9:12 AM | Report abuse

The Junkies had a great comment, they should get Jim Zorn a PSP and have him hit ask madden when he gets to the red zone.

Posted by: alex35332 | September 21, 2009 9:13 AM | Report abuse

That's a really hard throw to make -- maybe one of the hardest for any QB, with the sideline acting as an extra DB. Oddly enough, Vinny Testarverde excelled at it.

Posted by: Samson151 | September 21, 2009 9:08 AM

I was hoping that was a bad route and not the intended positioning. I want to think the idea was for the wr to be running downfield and not out of bounds.

But our whole offense (as Ray Lewis noted last year?) is predicated on staying in front of the defense rather than getting behind them, so who knows.

Posted by: divi3 | September 21, 2009 9:14 AM | Report abuse

S_G,
which assistant do you want to replace zorn?

Posted by: alex35332 | September 21, 2009 9:14 AM | Report abuse

The Redskins on Defense did what winners do. They got critical stops and turnovers.

The Offense showed some things, but still get a failing grade.

However, upset that we did not beat the Rams handily, I think it might just be that for some reasons the Rams will always play well against us.

I know that sounds like making an excuse for the Redskins, but the Rams may be one of those Teams that we will always struggle against no matter whether we should or not.

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | September 21, 2009 9:15 AM | Report abuse

We were 6-2 last year and finished 2-6 due 110% to the lousy offense and decrepit oline. Seeing the current situation for what it is aint hating. 2 weeks into the season we have seen NOTHING to indicate the offense has improved upon last year's 28th ranked juggernaut.

Meanwhile the D remains awesome.

Song remains the same do far, and that is not encouraging for the season.

Posted by: divi3 | September 21, 2009 9:11 AM | Report abuse

365 total yards. Good run-pass mix. JC sacked once. I KNOW, I know...points win games, not yards. But to say that the O-line was "decrepit" and the offense was "lousy" isn't really true. Moss fumble cost us points. CP trick play was stupid, as was most of the play calling in the "green zone". But overall we moved the ball and protected JC. You can laugh but I'd say there was improvement yesterday. Next week hopefully we can actaully FINISH drives.

Posted by: Notorious_LMG | September 21, 2009 9:15 AM | Report abuse

There is just no pleasing some people.

Posted by: Notorious_LMG | September 21, 2009 9:06 AM


I'm actually very easily pleased. All I ask for is the following:

A team built to compete for the long haul and players bringing the same level of effort for EVERY opponent.

If after that another team is better than you on that day, then so be it. But don't give me grief because I'm sick of the same crap every year. I drove over an hour each way to see this team play down to the awful Rams for 60 minutes. That performance was complete horsesh*t and there's no sugarcoating the crap I saw yesterday.

Posted by: brownwood26 | September 21, 2009 9:16 AM | Report abuse

"Although the Redskins outgained the Rams in total yards, 362 to 243 -- and Campbell passed for 242 yards while again operating effectively out of the shotgun formation and in a no-huddle offense"


Good to hear that JZ had JC in the shot, and was running the no huddle.....I think you can give credit to the many guys on here who were clamoring for this last week....anyone heard from cl, or did he drink himself into oblivion yesterday.....

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | September 21, 2009 9:17 AM | Report abuse

I'm probably alone on the island on this, but I thought Jason Campbell played brilliantly yesterday. Other than the near-safety, when he held the ball a lot longer than I'd have liked, I liked every decision he made in the entire game.

My problem is with the play-calling. Once again, Zorn got cute (the RB pass in the red zone) rather than let his quarterback throw the ball into the endzone. Once again, the Redskins never exploited single-coverage on the outside by just throwing a go route and daring a receiver to make a play on it. And, once again, Zorn let Campbell march the team up and down the field almost at-will, only to take the ball out of his hands in the red zone. I hate to say it - I've been a fan of his all along - but I'm starting to turn on Zorn. At some point, he has to stop trying to make plays with his scheme, and start letting his players make some of their own.

Posted by: manalive | September 21, 2009 9:21 AM | Report abuse

"But don't give me grief because I'm sick of the same crap every year. I drove over an hour each way to see this team play down to the awful Rams for 60 minutes. That performance was complete horsesh*t and there's no sugarcoating the crap I saw yesterday"

Dude, give it a rest already, no one FORCED you to to go the game, and NO-ONE is forcing you to follow this team. We GET IT..you're not happy, but for frig's sake, either go follow another team, or take a walk....

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | September 21, 2009 9:23 AM | Report abuse

"I drove over an hour each way to see this team play down to the awful Rams for 60 minutes"

At what point does it become not playing down to the other team but just what we are offensively?

How many games do you give an offense (and playcaller) before 'it is what it is'? We are at week18 in the Zorn era...and I dont think players should talk about how many points they left on the field until there have been multiple games where they actually scored points.

If offense is judged on points at the end of the day, then Zorn's offense stinks and the players need to feel that way until they produce. I dont know what happens behind closed doors, but Zorn heaps praise onto an anemic offense every single week. Come on Coach, call some guys out occasionally.

Posted by: divi3 | September 21, 2009 9:25 AM | Report abuse

Posted by: 4thFloor | September 21, 2009 9:25 AM | Report abuse

Meanwhile the D remains awesome.

Song remains the same do far, and that is not encouraging for the season.

Posted by: divi3 | September 21, 2009 9:11 AM

I dont really think our Defense played that great to be honest with you. DB's still got burned, game could have been alot worse if Avery could hold onto the ball...I honestly think we need to look at bringing in one OL and one DB for tryouts, arent there a couple decent players out there still...McAllister, L. Jones, whomever...not saying they are the answers to us defeating the world, but I think Hall needs to be scared a little bit...his play has been atrocious.

Zorn's offensive play callling is as bad if not worse then the Hokies play calling.

How is that every team we play can take out our WR corp altogether, give us that assignment on a big WR and they have a great game????

Posted by: mhartz1 | September 21, 2009 9:26 AM | Report abuse

"thanks flound, good to hear. I'm taking this win as a win...could it have been better sure, but in the end, its goes in the books as a W.....

Posted by: BeantownGreg1

BG, its obvious you didn't see the game, b/c no one who watched can feel good about that win. "W is a W" is so last season. Look where that got the team. IF they can make big strides and get better when it matters post Halloween, than this "w is a w" game will be huge obviously.

But that game was putrid. The defense played solid, but consider the opponent. Zorn is the farthest thing thing the NFL has as a HC who actually holds the position.

Zorn has lost this team. Players don't like being overcoached and untrusted to play, and that is what is happening. The players looked depressed, there is no fire, speed, attack or heart. Its like Spurrier redux with pinch of Norv.

I watch a lot of NFL football, and was watching the Lions/Viking game on the TV next to skins at sports bar. Lions looked crisper than skins, and the skins better be prepared to play next week b/c I know that team is going to think they can get off the snide next week against us.

I will end on some positives:

- an actual MK12 sighting
- JC played decent, he might not be a great QB, but to me he is being waaay overcoached at this point.
- Cooley. The cooley haters from last week need to shut up.
- Big Al did his job
- Rocky Mac had a very god game.

Posted by: chrislarry | September 21, 2009 9:26 AM | Report abuse

Alot of Pollyannas out w/ the burgundy/gold-colored glasses this morning.

How long are you gonna eat turd sandwiches and shrug your shoulders and tell yourself that at least you aren't going hungry?

The team's perfomance yesterday was VERY DISAPPOINTING. Even the players said so.

Last year we eaked out wins against the Browns and the Lions early on in the year; happy about the "W"s right? And then when we started lining up against "real" teams we went 2-6 down the stretch.

I'd rather take a "W" than an "L", but there are still TONS of problems w/ this team:

1) Zorn continues to look like he's in over his head.
2) Defense continues to have problems getting off the field on 3rd downs.
3) Cornerback play still looks real shaky - thank God for Chris Horton, who looks like the only playmaker back there.
4) Redzone offense is crap.
5) Devin Thomas, will you please show up one of these days?

How long have we been talking about this stuff?

If these things are "correctable", then CORRECT THEM ALREADY!

Our offense is SOOOOOOOOO predictable: Run over the left side, pass to Cooley.

Once teams start covering Cooley, God help us.

Something drastic needs ot happen, b/c now that teams have 2 games of film on our woefully predictable offense that can't score TDs, we are gonna have a harder and harder time moving the ball, especially as injuries on the Oline mount up...

Posted by: p1funk | September 21, 2009 9:26 AM | Report abuse

A win that feels like a loss, this is getting old quick, Campbell see improvement? wtf? I for one had hope that with 2 years with this system Campbell would thrive but I just see the same Campbell with his deer in the headlights look.Bring Collins in to salvage the season and finally get our downfield action going..and

Posted by: gwjuniors | September 21, 2009 9:27 AM | Report abuse

"I'm probably alone on the island on this, but I thought Jason Campbell played brilliantly yesterday."

I think many agree with you after yesterday, a game where JC did almost everything well but wasnt really given a chance to finish drives. How about some passes INTO the endzone from the 15yd line? What about a play-action on 1st&goal?

At this point it looks like JC is being limited by the coach rather than the other way around.

He's a 1st round pick well into his career- unleash him!

Posted by: divi3 | September 21, 2009 9:28 AM | Report abuse

brownwood26,
Why should the Snyder change his ways? Fools like you give your hard earned cash to him for being an idiot and running this franchise into the ground.

Here is a brilliant idea:

Wait for the skins to put proper management in place, draft well, play hard, and THEN you can go out and give Snyder you money. that's the way it should work not the other way around. Until then invite your buddies over and enjoy watching a sport that is made for TV.

Posted by: NFeKPo | September 21, 2009 9:28 AM | Report abuse

Posted by: CindyBoren | September 21, 2009 9:29 AM | Report abuse

I was the only one on the Redskins Insider predicting the Rams to win... and Zorn did everything in his power to make that happen.

Posted by: Sports_Guru

Au contraire, I had the Rams winning as well. I made a lot of money off that game yesterday. Whenever the Redskins are favored by more than 8 points it's like free money.

This team is on the verge of a freefall, they are clinging on for dear life. Zorn and JC are as good as gone short of a remarkable turnaround in the last 14 games.

I think this is the season where hard decisions have to be made for the future. Moss and Portis may be just about done. The O-line is on its way to being a shambles. (Sad news on Randy, but not a surprise at all)

It's just going to get so much uglier this year.

Posted by: McMetal | September 21, 2009 9:30 AM | Report abuse

At what point does it become not playing down to the other team but just what we are offensively?


Posted by: divi3 | September 21, 2009 9:25 AM


At the point they're scoring better against better teams and not against the dregs they're supposed to beat.

So far this year, they put up a decent 17 points on the Giants and get only 9 on a horrible Rams team. Last year, they could only manage 14 on the Browns yet scored 26 on the Cowboys. They have the talent to do well but they seem to think they're good enough to coast to victory against the bad teams and they sooo aren't.

Posted by: brownwood26 | September 21, 2009 9:32 AM | Report abuse

The Detroit game scares me. It is a "Trap Game" for a team playing with no consistency or confidence.They barely beat Detroit last year.

Posted by: ATLSkinsFan1 | September 21, 2009 9:32 AM | Report abuse

I was the only one on the Redskins Insider predicting the Rams to win... and Zorn did everything in his power to make that happen.

Posted by: Sports_Guru

Au contraire, I had the Rams winning as well. I made a lot of money off that game yesterday. Whenever the Redskins are favored by more than 8 points it's like free money.

This team is on the verge of a freefall, they are clinging on for dear life. Zorn and JC are as good as gone short of a remarkable turnaround in the last 14 games.

I think this is the season where hard decisions have to be made for the future. Moss and Portis may be just about done. The O-line is on its way to being a shambles. (Sad news on Randy, but not a surprise at all)

It's just going to get so much uglier this year.

Posted by: McMetal | September 21, 2009 9:30 AM

So let me get this straight, you're casting your lot with _guru and bragging that you were wrong? But somehow because you covered that makes you right?

Posted by: scampbell1975 | September 21, 2009 9:33 AM | Report abuse

this is the same offense that was horrrible last year, only this year Zorn is worse. send the west coast offense back west. again Collins should be playing QB, but we need a smart coach for that to happen.

Posted by: cavalieri10 | September 21, 2009 9:33 AM | Report abuse

I will end on some positives:

- an actual MK12 sighting
- JC played decent, he might not be a great QB, but to me he is being waaay overcoached at this point.
- Cooley. The cooley haters from last week need to shut up.
- Big Al did his job
- Rocky Mac had a very god game.

Posted by: chrislarry |

Agreed...what does a team think when they see Danny Smith coach of our putrid Special Teams screaming at Zorn and acting like a child and Zorn taking it...someone wrote earlier that the team looks completely disorganized and lacking any direction or discipline.

Rocky Mac looked like an animal yesterday, probably pumped cuz the Canes are in the Top 10...Landry looked just BAD.

Posted by: mhartz1 | September 21, 2009 9:33 AM | Report abuse

Being at the game yesterday.....The team deserved to be booed (though I didn't partake in it).

But, after seeing CP's comments I am still keeping the faith.

One. Game. At. A. Time.

(And the Lions are good......)

Posted by: 4thFloor | September 21, 2009 9:33 AM | Report abuse

Dude, give it a rest already, no one FORCED you to to go the game, and NO-ONE is forcing you to follow this team. We GET IT..you're not happy, but for frig's sake, either go follow another team, or take a walk....

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | September 21, 2009 9:23 AM


Yeah, yeah, yeah...until this becomes "Blind, Deaf and Dumb Redskins Followers Only" territory, shut it up. If you don't like what I'm saying, you have the right to gloss over it and move on. Nobody gives you grief for your Snyder crotch nuzzling so get off me when I vent my frustration.

Posted by: brownwood26 | September 21, 2009 9:34 AM | Report abuse

Steinbog on the twittertalk sparked by Robert Henson:

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/dcsportsbog/2009/09/robert_hensons_vs_redskins_fan.html

Posted by: CindyBoren | September 21, 2009 9:29 AM | Report abuse


BMitch pretty much said was I was thinking...

Posted by: p1funk | September 21, 2009 9:35 AM | Report abuse

Jason,

I think Campbell takes far more heat than he deserves and yesterday was definitely the victim of some seriously questionable play calling. Plus, Sellers dropped a perfectly thrown ball in the Red Zone.

This kid has talent and had he not been forced to deal with the constant offensive scheme changes, and questionable pass protection, I truly believe he'd be among the elite.

BTW... fans where I was watching, in Clearwater, FL, booed often, but never at the PLAYERS. They were ruthless at the play calling though. And while I think most of us fans don't know squat about the intricacies of the professional game, this time, I think they may be right.

Posted by: Redskinrex | September 21, 2009 9:35 AM | Report abuse

Henson is an idiot.

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | September 21, 2009 9:36 AM | Report abuse

Agreed...what does a team think when they see Danny Smith coach of our putrid Special Teams screaming at Zorn and acting like a child and Zorn taking it...someone wrote earlier that the team looks completely disorganized and lacking any direction or discipline.

Rocky Mac looked like an animal yesterday, probably pumped cuz the Canes are in the Top 10...Landry looked just BAD.

Posted by: mhartz1 | September 21, 2009 9:33 AM |

Putrid special teamsa? They've been a bright spot so far. A touchdown on a fake. Last week Hunter the Punter was on point. No long returns. Danny saves Zorn from himself yesterday. What putrid? Pre season? News flash, that doesn't count.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | September 21, 2009 9:36 AM | Report abuse

Agreed...what does a team think when they see Danny Smith coach of our putrid Special Teams screaming at Zorn and acting like a child and Zorn taking it...someone wrote earlier that the team looks completely disorganized and lacking any direction or discipline.

Rocky Mac looked like an animal yesterday, probably pumped cuz the Canes are in the Top 10...Landry looked just BAD.

Posted by: mhartz1 | September 21, 2009 9:33 AM |

No what your talking about before you write, he was screaming at him to wait to call the timeout until the play clock had run all the way down.

Posted by: Flounder21 | September 21, 2009 9:36 AM | Report abuse

Yeah, yeah, yeah...until this becomes "Blind, Deaf and Dumb Redskins Followers Only" territory, shut it up. If you don't like what I'm saying, you have the right to gloss over it and move on. Nobody gives you grief for your Snyder crotch nuzzling so get off me when I vent my frustration.

Posted by: brownwood26 | September 21, 2009 9:34 AM | Report

Look dik, if you have the right to b!tch constantly, he has just as much right to call your a$$ on it. If you don't like it kick rocks.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | September 21, 2009 9:39 AM | Report abuse

brown, all I'm saying is that it comes across as petulant whining, "wah, I drove 60 minutes, wah, the team won but didn't win the way I wanted them too...wah, I drove 60 minutes home....wah, wah, wah"..

"Blind, Deaf and Dumb Redskins Followers Only" territory"....let me know the first, the FIRST time I advocate for this.....but I digress....please continue your pissing and whining about how much you paid for a hot dog, or how long the ladies room line was....go right ahead.....

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | September 21, 2009 9:40 AM | Report abuse

Re: Sellers' drop.

We hold that drop up as an example of "see, if he made that play things wouldn't be as bad".

Sellers is not a pass-catcher.

WTH is he in there running that route? We could just put one of TEs back there as a blocker to flair over the middle.

Another example of inept play design/play calling.

When you run a passing play to a guy who doesn't catch well, don't be surprised when he drops the ball.


Posted by: p1funk | September 21, 2009 9:41 AM | Report abuse

Am I the only one worried about the possible season loss of Randy Thomas? Its not just his healthy, or inability to play because of injury. I feel we've lost a big leader on that right side, and we remember a couple years ago, we lost Jansen to a fluke injury then Thomas in consecutive games. Well who's next on the list? Samuels? Rabach? Dockery? Rheinhart better get himself ready is all I can say.

Posted by: Veretax | September 21, 2009 9:41 AM | Report abuse

Just cut Henson, wasn't he the cat that was suspended in college or am I confused? What a maroon.

My football highlight from week 2: Spanking 4th Floor in Fantasy Football. Oh yeah!!!!!!

Posted by: chrislarry | September 21, 2009 9:41 AM | Report abuse

"WTH is he in there running that route? We could just put one of TEs back there as a blocker to flair over the middle."

Paging Fred Davis??!!?! What a botched draft pick....

Posted by: chrislarry | September 21, 2009 9:43 AM | Report abuse

Cut Henson and re-sign Pete Kendall.

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | September 21, 2009 9:44 AM | Report abuse

"I'm probably alone on the island on this, but I thought Jason Campbell played brilliantly yesterday."

I think many agree with you after yesterday, a game where JC did almost everything well but wasnt really given a chance to finish drives. How about some passes INTO the endzone from the 15yd line? What about a play-action on 1st&goal?

At this point it looks like JC is being limited by the coach rather than the other way around.

He's a 1st round pick well into his career- unleash him!


Posted by: divi3 | September 21, 2009 9:28 AM | Report abuse

I agree. JC played very well despite what you read on this blog. He looks like a good QB. We need to let him run the game. He marched us down the field 5 times seemingliy at will. We need to let him finish the drives. That twin TE set just doesn't work in the red zone. Stop trying to use it. The defense just plays on the line and they don't have to worry about getting burnt deep. The TEs are too slow so the defense plays right on the line and when you try to run they are already right there to stop it. Moss and ARE are too short and can't get the seperation they need down in the red zone. You need the tall guys down there. You need MK12, DT11, or MM. You need someone capable of making a play deep in the end zone if you want to spread that defense out.

Posted by: PAskinsfan17 | September 21, 2009 9:45 AM | Report abuse

Chris Horton > Leigh Torrence

Posted by: PortisPocketsStr8 | September 21, 2009 9:45 AM | Report abuse

First time poster, long time reader...

I'm glad I was not the only one that noticed our play calling vs. competent play calling inside both 20's.

The first year you expect conservative type stuff. This year everyone has a full year in this "system", so where is the innovation? Why is Candle not allowed to audible out of another debacle?

From reading the posts on this topic I know a number of you saw the boys vs. giants game last night. Did you notice those QB's changing protections, moving players, making adjustments or just flat changing the plays at the line? When do we get to see Candle do that?

By the way, how nice was it to see the boys lose in their billion dollar home opener?

Posted by: jimmydeanloveshogs | September 21, 2009 9:47 AM | Report abuse

Just cut Henson, wasn't he the cat that was suspended in college or am I confused? What a maroon.

My football highlight from week 2: Spanking 4th Floor in Fantasy Football. Oh yeah!!!!!!

Posted by: chrislarry | September 21, 2009 9:41 AM


You're confused on both items.

Henson was NOT the guy arrested in college. He's T D Jakes son-in-law

And in FF, right now, you're nothing but the 6-2 Redskins of last year who failed to make the playoffs......Like your pool....It's a marathon....Not a race....All I need to do is get in the playoffs, and I think I know my team now.....

Book it!

Posted by: 4thFloor | September 21, 2009 9:48 AM | Report abuse

Steinbog on the twittertalk sparked by Robert Henson:

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/dcsportsbog/2009/09/robert_hensons_vs_redskins_fan.html

Posted by: CindyBoren |

------------------------------------------

Wow, I actually am applauding B(itch)ell's comments...the Apocalypse is surely upon us.

Hey Henson - I'm a Skins fan and I don't work at a McDonald's. Care to compare SAT scores, Brainiac?

Posted by: McMetal | September 21, 2009 9:48 AM | Report abuse

i AM a committed fence sitter on JC, but I agree that he had a decent game and is being severly handcuffed. Let playas play!


The half back option play on 3rd and goal was asinine. At least run it on 1st down when they think Portis is going to come at them. By definition they are playing pass and run on third and goal from 4 yards out. They had the entire play covered. You have tons of early rounders on offense including 3 pass catchers and QB. Let them try.

Gimmick plays by weak offensive teams=power rankings

Posted by: chrislarry | September 21, 2009 9:51 AM | Report abuse

I think most fans who attend games would agree, Dan Snyder has done everything he can to make FedEx the LEAST enjoyable gameday in the NFL. Latest move: buying the cash parking lot (was $20 a game) and converting it to 'Copper Parking' which is now $40 to park a mile away from your seats.

Yeah, yeah "dont go if you dont want to."

That's the wrong attitude. As anyone who has gone to games for years can tell you. empty seats are at an all-time high. Dont be surprised if the legendary Skins fanbase is suddenly facing blackouts in the not-to-distant future.

Posted by: divi3 | September 21, 2009 9:52 AM | Report abuse

"I agree with TE a win is a win and I'll take it."

Whether it be by 1 point or 40, it's a win.

And yes, the rams are sorry, and just the team Zorn needed to let JC get into a groove against.

The schedule is front-loaded with these kinds of teams, so let's hope JC is continually put into position to make throws or get things done with scrambling.

Folks, let's chill, and take this thing one game at a time. The "Hope the Redskins Open-up the Offense Express" is trying to get out on to the wide freeway of a modern NFL passing game.

In time, it'll ride with no problem.

Posted by: MistaMoe | September 21, 2009 9:54 AM | Report abuse

So let me get this straight, you're casting your lot with _guru and bragging that you were wrong? But somehow because you covered that makes you right?

Posted by: scampbell1975
-------------------------------
Well geez, I guess it does sound stupid when you put it like that.

Not casting my lot with anyone, at least until I see PSP weigh in on this debacle, but I do want credit for my pessimism. :)

And I'll be the first to proclaim, unlike many of the Hate Parade, that I would rather be wrong than see the team fail.

Posted by: McMetal | September 21, 2009 9:56 AM | Report abuse

God Help Us!

Posted by: jtrob_1 | September 21, 2009 9:56 AM | Report abuse

"Henson was NOT the guy arrested in college. He's T D Jakes son-in-law"

TY 4th for the correction on that. Also thank you for sucking at FF.

Its a long season no doubt, but its also a war each week. Mano y mano...2 man enter 1 man leave. I was that man!!!!

(Also in your heart of hearts you know my team is beast.)

Posted by: chrislarry | September 21, 2009 9:56 AM | Report abuse

You know, I saw this style of play week in and week out during the 50's. Stout defense, sorry offense. I've seen it. Bad end with 1-12-1 record is what you end with. MIKE NIXON where are you?

Everyone agreed at the time, a change of ownership was the solution to GEORGE PRESTON MARSHALL's stewardship. Too many similarities to this current regime to suit me.

Despite JASON REID's commentary in the RICHMOND paper today, WIL MONTGOMERY is doing an excellent job of filling in for RANDY THOMAS. But Mr. REID made it seem like there was some dire emergency at RG and the player comments he posted reinforced that feeling. I compared shoulder pads and helmets yesterday during the game. WIL's smaller than any other line-man including CASEY RABACH. But he's tough and gets the job done. BUGES is no fool. He knows MONTGOMERY is being asked to play out of position, but he also knows he's the best he's got at the moment. I would rather see ED WILLIAMS start than CHAD RINEHART. WILLIAMS showed me more during the x-season. I say the only reason CHAD CHIN-WHISKERS is on this club is because he was picked in the third round of the draft, period, and that he will be gone in two seasons.

Posted by: glawrence007 | September 21, 2009 9:57 AM | Report abuse

Look dik, if you have the right to b!tch constantly, he has just as much right to call your a$$ on it. If you don't like it kick rocks.

Posted by: scampbell1975

brown, all I'm saying is that it comes across as petulant whining, "wah, I drove 60 minutes, wah, the team won but didn't win the way I wanted them too...wah, I drove 60 minutes home....wah, wah, wah"..

"Blind, Deaf and Dumb Redskins Followers Only" territory"....let me know the first, the FIRST time I advocate for this.....but I digress....please continue your pissing and whining about how much you paid for a hot dog, or how long the ladies room line was....go right ahead.....

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | September 21, 2009 9:40 AM


I'll address you simultaneously...if you don't like criticism and frustration expressed over a clearly mediocre team, then go to Redskins.com and enjoy Larry Michael's sunshine bidet they call coverage. I just find it funny that you guys only want the rosey bullsh*t and come to the Washington Post...the biggest critic of the Snyder Redskins.

If I didn't care, I wouldn't be pissed. If you guys are gluttons for punishment then eat up, enjoy. Just don't get on me because I know crap when I see it and call the team out on it.

Posted by: brownwood26 | September 21, 2009 9:57 AM | Report abuse

Zorn must recognize that what he has been trying is not working. Either you acknowledge your mistakes and correct then or you will be let go. I have to think he is on a very short leash. There is a name for someone that keeps trying the same thing but expect a different result. Nothing has changed from last year.

Posted by: napadcfan | September 21, 2009 9:57 AM | Report abuse

From Mike Sellers:
"I am pissed off," he said. "I dropped a touchdown. I'm one of the guys you depend on, and I had it in my hands, and I didn't catch it. I didn't come through with what I was preaching to everybody else all week long."

Rage was trickling out through his eyes. You've never seen a victorious player fume like this. I asked whether the win didn't make him feel better.

"No," he said. "We won, yeah, but my performance, I'm not happy with it. I'm not. I've got to be hard on myself, because I expect more out of myself. Lack of concentration. Don't worry about it, I'll be on the JUGS machine, working on it."

Sellers wasn't the only one in a foul mood. I'm no NFL locker room veteran, but this was definitely one of the grumpiest winning locker rooms I've visited.

Good to hear, they won, but they're not satisfied....

Moe, 5 games, could this go down to the wire??

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | September 21, 2009 9:58 AM | Report abuse

(Also in your heart of hearts you know my team is beast.)

Posted by: chrislarry | September 21, 2009 9:56 AM

I've been playing this game for 8 years now. And every year is the same for me. Slow Start. Great Finish.........

Posted by: 4thFloor | September 21, 2009 10:00 AM | Report abuse

I want to know why we don't run the play that the Cowboys scored on last night. The play action pass to the TE on the goalline. That play works every time. Cooley is the perfect red zone target. Also, spread em out and go 4 wides down there. You have a better chance of a mismatch. This running up the gut when the whole world knows your gonna do it is not working. I gotta believe you will see some new plays next week in the red zone. They got nothing to lose. Marko and Malcolm need to be in there inside the 10. Zorn needs to open it up and trust Jason. Sellers has no business being a pass target down there with his stone hands.

Posted by: FedorEm | September 21, 2009 10:01 AM | Report abuse

As far as I am concerned, Sellers doesnt get any more chances to catch a td or run one in from the 2yd line like last year.

He's not a good receiver nor a good running back, he's a blocking fullback. When he drops tds or fumbles away games...cant really blame him so much as the person who asked him to make those plays.

Posted by: divi3 | September 21, 2009 10:02 AM | Report abuse

That's the wrong attitude. As anyone who has gone to games for years can tell you. empty seats are at an all-time high. Dont be surprised if the legendary Skins fanbase is suddenly facing blackouts in the not-to-distant future.

Posted by: divi3 | September 21, 2009 9:52 AM | Report abuse

Dan Snyder is a very greedy business man. He wants to jack up the prices to the limit in order to maxmize his profits. The only reaosn he does this is because people are willing to pay. Once he starts losing money on empty seats he will have no choice but to lower prices. Seriously, don't go. Once enough people stop going he'll lower prices. He doesn't care about you or anything else excepy his bottom line. That's the only way you'll get him to change.

Posted by: PAskinsfan17 | September 21, 2009 10:03 AM | Report abuse

14 years here 4th, how many championships you got?

Dude you got whipped, own it. enough weak azz spin.

what about all that "make sure chris larry is in the league" I am and I sat you down!

(good time good times, can't wait for game 2!)

Posted by: chrislarry | September 21, 2009 10:03 AM | Report abuse

Skate Skate Skate.....

Skate...uuuuughhhh...PUNK!

Posted by: DikShuttle | September 21, 2009 10:04 AM | Report abuse

JC played very well despite what you read on this blog. He looks like a good QB. Posted by: PAskinsfan17
_____
Of course he looked good.. it was against the RAMS!!! Here's the thing Collins would have looked good to.. heck you could have suited up Zorn and he would have looked good. Problem is POINTS!! 9 points will beat the Rams but NOT the Giants, Eagles or Cowboys.. or most other good teams. So until Campbell can score a ton of points against a bad team or beat a good team.. no one should really be happy because beating the Rams by 2 leaves more questions than answers...

Posted by: sovine08 | September 21, 2009 10:04 AM | Report abuse

brown, tell us more about your 60 minute commute to and from the stadium...please....

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | September 21, 2009 10:05 AM | Report abuse

Jason Campbell's Rankings by stat cat. so far this season:
Category: Stat (Ranking)

Attempted: 61 (21)
Completion: 42 (13)
Comp %: 68.9% (7)
Att/G: 30.5 (22)
YDS: 453 (14)
AVG: 7.4 (12)
YDS/G: 226.5 (16)
TD: 1 (23T)
INT: 1(6T)
1st: 26 (6T)
1st%: 42.6% (5)
LNG: 35 (22)
20+: 5 (20T)
40+: 0 (20T)
Sck: 3(14T)
Rate: 89.0 (12)

Never too early to look at the numbers as I like to say. Here is the good news, his completion % is up about 5% from last year, and his overall rating is up too, sacks is down on average. At the current rate he is on pace for 3,624 yards 400 yards more then last season. TD and INT still down.

Posted by: alex35332 | September 21, 2009 10:07 AM | Report abuse

Just don't get on me because I know crap when I see it and call the team out on it.

Posted by: brownwood26 | September 21, 2009 9:57 AM

Brown,

Crap is all you know and you call it whether you see it or not. Already you're beating the team up for losing to Detroit, a game they won't play until next Sunday. We know crap when we see it, and you're spewing it like diarrhea.

Posted by: talent_evaluator | September 21, 2009 10:07 AM | Report abuse

Re: Sellers' drop.

We hold that drop up as an example of "see, if he made that play things wouldn't be as bad".

Sellers is not a pass-catcher.

WTH is he in there running that route? We could just put one of TEs back there as a blocker to flair over the middle.

Another example of inept play design/play calling.

When you run a passing play to a guy who doesn't catch well, don't be surprised when he drops the ball.


Posted by: p1funk | September 21, 2009 9:41 AM | Report abuse

funk you know ur my man, but sellars is a football player. he should be able to make that play, excuse me he has to make that play. i've seen 4th string o lineman catch short kickoffs, i saw pete kendall last year catch a pass that was batted 15 ft in the air. why should we not expect our newly re-signed fb (sellars got a raise and an extension last week) to catch a 7 yd pass. i think he had 3-4 receiving tds a couple years ago with gibbs. no excuses for the dropped balls, those are points off the board. DT was in the end zone and sellars woulda walked in untouched. the line did their jobs and JC did his job. great game from jason, i don't know much else you coulda asked from him.

Posted by: lilhollywood10 | September 21, 2009 10:08 AM | Report abuse

"he's a blocking fullback. When he drops tds or fumbles away games...cant really blame him so much as the person who asked him to make those plays"

Right. Sellers drops a TD, and its the coach's fault.....right...logical...and all that....

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | September 21, 2009 10:08 AM | Report abuse

Second time poster, long time reader...

Something I forgot to mention in my first post...

Is the Rams secondary that good? Anybody else notice that none of our wide-outs got open yesterday?

Posted by: jimmydeanloveshogs | September 21, 2009 10:09 AM | Report abuse

bean

"...5 games, could this go down to the wire??"


I'm saving my baseball mind for October.

Right now, I'm trying to get the Redskins Offense Express out of the parking lot.

Posted by: MistaMoe | September 21, 2009 10:10 AM | Report abuse

I was listening to Sam Huff yesterday morning, another guy of note besides Arrington, that indicates this Team is not in shape.

Huff says the Team is not tough. He says that when Lombardi came to the Skins he changed Sonny Jorgenson's career for the better. Lombardi believed that everybody had to be football tough and Sonny had to do all the football drills, sprints, calithenics, etc. just like everybodyelse and as a consequence he was a tougher player as well as the Team.

In commenting on the conditioning of AH, he says that he only played one series in preseason, so there is no way he can be in shape. Significant numbers on this Team just walked through training camp and preseason.

When asked whose fault this is, Sam Huff said it is the coaches fault.

Everyone knows that Offense has to catch up with Defense. This could explain why our Offense is not performing the way it shoud be because it is not game tough yet. A better word, SHARP!!!

The defense is good but, if what Sam Huff says is true then that can also explain why we still allow critical 3rd down successes against us. And, our D-backs can't cover anyone yet.

And that comment that Blache made about driving a car, you got to test them out because they drive different. Yeah, that would be right, but thats what practice is for. HELLO!!!

You did not have to be at Redskin Park everyday to know that key players did not train throughout training camp and preseason. This is a fact and we know this.

I totally agree with Sam Huff and LaVar Arrington.

This team is playing itself into the game shape it should have been in at the beginning of the season.

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | September 21, 2009 10:10 AM | Report abuse

No Spin. You won. You put the better team on the field. My QB went to the hospital. My RBs have failed me.

Look for a different team next time. But the (FF) season is far from over....No championships have been handed out yet.....

Posted by: 4thFloor | September 21, 2009 10:12 AM | Report abuse

Re: Sellers' drop.

We hold that drop up as an example of "see, if he made that play things wouldn't be as bad".

Sellers is not a pass-catcher.

WTH is he in there running that route? We could just put one of TEs back there as a blocker to flair over the middle.

Another example of inept play design/play calling.

When you run a passing play to a guy who doesn't catch well, don't be surprised when he drops the ball.


Posted by: p1funk | September 21, 2009 9:41 AM | Report abuse

Please see Gibbs 2.0 and how he used Sellers and your comment makes you look like an idiot, and shows you have no idea what you are talking about. When Sellers had 7 receiving TD's in a year.

I guess when Gibbs throws to Sellers he is a genius and when Zorn calls a similar play he is a moron. Unbelievable.

Posted by: gatorskinz2000 | September 21, 2009 10:13 AM | Report abuse

From Mike Sellers:
"I am pissed off," he said. "I dropped a touchdown. I'm one of the guys you depend on, and I had it in my hands, and I didn't catch it. I didn't come through with what I was preaching to everybody else all week long."

Rage was trickling out through his eyes. You've never seen a victorious player fume like this. I asked whether the win didn't make him feel better.

"No," he said. "We won, yeah, but my performance, I'm not happy with it. I'm not. I've got to be hard on myself, because I expect more out of myself. Lack of concentration. Don't worry about it, I'll be on the JUGS machine, working on it."

Sellers wasn't the only one in a foul mood. I'm no NFL locker room veteran, but this was definitely one of the grumpiest winning locker rooms I've visited.

Good to hear, they won, but they're not satisfied....

Moe, 5 games, could this go down to the wire??

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | September 21, 2009 9:58 AM


Wow, Greg...so let me get this straight...you get a boner because the guys getting paid millions to suck are fuming mad about their performance after a win. But the guys who paid big bucks out of their own pockets to watch the same awful performance should shut up and take their medicine? Yeah, plenty fair dude. Real consistent. Please, share with us some more of your f*cked up life views. We're all ears.

Posted by: brownwood26 | September 21, 2009 10:13 AM | Report abuse

Even though a 9-7 win against a bad team doesn't tell you much the skins do have some positive things going.

Defense in general was good. Good pass rush. Bulger only threw for 120 and outside of 1 run Jackson was a none factor.

Offensively. Portis looked good when we gave him run. Campbell had time and didn't lose the game for us(which is all the team really asks of him). Cooley looks good, should have another strong year.

There were also some negatives but those have been gone over extensively. I will just say Zorn needs to step up his play calling.

Posted by: PortisPocketsStr8 | September 21, 2009 10:13 AM | Report abuse

"Dont be surprised if the legendary Skins fanbase is suddenly facing blackouts in the not-to-distant future."

1- i don't think that would happen remember 200,000 seat waiting list (cough)

2- While as much as that would SUCK in the near term i think Snyder needs that in order to get his act together. This isn't like Jacksonville that can't support a team, we can easily support a team that deserves it.

Posted by: NFeKPo | September 21, 2009 10:14 AM | Report abuse

it was only a matter of time before we came full circle back to the team is not in shape.....I like it....lets do we should have re-signed peirce next.....

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | September 21, 2009 10:14 AM | Report abuse

Of course he looked good.. it was against the RAMS!!! Here's the thing Collins would have looked good to.. heck you could have suited up Zorn and he would have looked good. Problem is POINTS!! 9 points will beat the Rams but NOT the Giants, Eagles or Cowboys.. or most other good teams. So until Campbell can score a ton of points against a bad team or beat a good team.. no one should really be happy because beating the Rams by 2 leaves more questions than answers...

Posted by: sovine08 | September 21, 2009 10:04 AM | Report abuse

Todd Collins is not a good quarterback. The only reason he looked good 2 years ago is because he had 12 years in the Al Saunders offense. Saying Todd Collins should be playing makes you look naive. We have switched over to a new offense and Todd had a lot of trouble with this offense. JC looks much better than Todd right now. You are also trying to blame JC for the lack of points. This is confusing given that Santan Moss fumbled, Sellers and Thomas both dropped TD passes, and we tried to run up the gut from a twin TE set on the other 2 stalled drives. JC did nothing wrong in the redzone yesterday. My question for you is, did you even watch the game? What example do you have that JC had anything to do with the lack of points? What did JC do wrong yesterday that cost us points?

Posted by: PAskinsfan17 | September 21, 2009 10:15 AM | Report abuse

Such a lovely morning, isn't it?

Posted by: RedDMV | September 21, 2009 10:15 AM | Report abuse

Wow, Greg...so let me get this straight...you get a boner because the guys getting paid millions to suck are fuming mad about their performance after a win. But the guys who paid big bucks out of their own pockets to watch the same awful performance should shut up and take their medicine? Yeah, plenty fair dude. Real consistent. Please, share with us some more of your f*cked up life views. We're all ears.

Posted by: brownwood26 | September 21, 2009 10:13 AM | Report abuse

In the words of one Chad Ochocinco.

Child Pleazz!

Posted by: PortisPocketsStr8 | September 21, 2009 10:16 AM | Report abuse

"

No Spin. You won. You put the better team on the field. My QB went to the hospital. My RBs have failed me.

Look for a different team next time. But the (FF) season is far from over....No championships have been handed out yet.....

Posted by: 4thFloor"

Agreed game 2 will be much more important, and much anticipated. Book it!

Posted by: chrislarry | September 21, 2009 10:18 AM | Report abuse

I wasn't pleased with the Redskins performance or the playcalling for that matter. I got the feeling though watching the game that this offense is turning into Jason Campbell's offense now and not Clinton Portis'. I love Clinton, but I think if we are going to do anything we need to hand over the keys to Campbell. I thought he played really well and can't understand why he isn't permitted to do what he does best: throw it deep.

I tthink when he is slinging it to Cooley, Moss, El hopefully the young guys soon and Betts out of the backfield he is dangerous. I think he can be a stud if he is allowed to play.

Posted by: lavararrington | September 21, 2009 10:18 AM | Report abuse

brown, I was actually hoping that Mike would comment on how long it took him to get to the stadium before the game.....was it less than 60 minutes, more than 60 minutes.....

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | September 21, 2009 10:19 AM | Report abuse

"he's a blocking fullback. When he drops tds or fumbles away games...cant really blame him so much as the person who asked him to make those plays"

Right. Sellers drops a TD, and its the coach's fault.....right...logical...and all that....

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | September 21, 2009 10:08 AM | Report abuse

Add to that DT's drop, those two balls caught and all of you up here wouldnt be b!tch!n. But like Bean said, it must be Zorns fault.

Posted by: gatorskinz2000 | September 21, 2009 10:19 AM | Report abuse

manalive - you are alone on that one....he played ok, not brilliant. This qb can't put up points on the board...I know it was caveman and thomas' fault but the fact still remains... jason campbell can not score touchdowns in the NFL...plain and simple. HE DUNSKI

Posted by: kdofour2000 | September 21, 2009 10:19 AM | Report abuse

Such a lovely morning, isn't it?

Posted by: RedDMV | September 21, 2009 10:15 AM

F U Red! Don't come in here and say SJK! A win is a WIN! 15-1 still possible!

(Turn Sarcasim off)

Posted by: 4thFloor | September 21, 2009 10:20 AM | Report abuse

if what Sam Huff says is true...

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | September 21, 2009 10:10 AM |

You know, this is a generational thing. "In the good old days, we were real men. These guys today have it so easy..."

It is two different eras. Sam Huff played football for 12 games and then drank beer until camp started. Preseason was six games because the guys were so out of shape. Today football is year-round with OTA's, mini-camps, off-season weight-lifting.

And the players are entirely different. There was no one in the league the size of Haynesworth when Huff was playing.

It may be that the 'Skins are not as well conditioned as other teams in the league, but I wouldn't come to that conclusion based on Sam Huff's "Back in the day..." reminiscences.

Posted by: talent_evaluator | September 21, 2009 10:20 AM | Report abuse

By the by, all of you morons who are so quick to look at JC's stats need to know what ur talking about. Gibbs and Zorn are so conservative. If he played for a guy like Sean Payton or Norv Turner he would be permitted to take more shots. And in doing so his TD passes and INTs would go up dramatically. It's not his fault he has been neutered in these offenses.

Posted by: lavararrington | September 21, 2009 10:21 AM | Report abuse

'Right. Sellers drops a TD, and its the coach's fault.....right...logical...and all that....'

hey, why not have sellers throw the halfback options too? he should be able to throw the ball 10yds right? why not call it? if it dont work, it's sellers fault.

Despite all the media friendliness and fan love...Mike Sellers aint all that. Let the SKILL players make the SKILL plays. Lord knows there are enough highly paid ones on this roster

Posted by: divi3 | September 21, 2009 10:21 AM | Report abuse

As I say, you can't blame everything on Zorn.

Maybe about 60-65%, sure. But not everything.

Anyone that vouches for James Zorn as a legit NFL head coach most definitely wears the new 'skins edition Dolce Gabbana shades.

For all that "a win is a win" talk, keep in mind that they won by two whole damn points to the St. Louis Rams, who lost 28-0 the week before, and will be in the bottom half of the league.

You don't win with gimmick plays and kicking field goals in this league.

'Skins should have lost that game.

Posted by: RedDMV | September 21, 2009 10:21 AM | Report abuse

Always concerned about 'shape'... but in this case it's SHAPE UP!

I can't believe Zorn's arrogance.

Posted by: DikShuttle | September 21, 2009 10:22 AM | Report abuse

Does anyone else think JC is so worried about getting the ball out quickly that he:

1. Is a "first option here" and doesn't check down well.

2. Throws the ball to hard and fast. I think if he could take somethiing off the throws, especially in red zone, than the catchers might haul in a few more. Watching Eli last night I noticed that he throws some ugly azz ballz but at the same time they are floaters that the receivers can easy grab and go....

Just some thoughts, start lining up to call me an idiot.

Posted by: chrislarry | September 21, 2009 10:23 AM | Report abuse

I wasn't pleased with the Redskins performance or the playcalling for that matter. I got the feeling though watching the game that this offense is turning into Jason Campbell's offense now and not Clinton Portis'. I love Clinton, but I think if we are going to do anything we need to hand over the keys to Campbell. I thought he played really well and can't understand why he isn't permitted to do what he does best: throw it deep.

I tthink when he is slinging it to Cooley, Moss, El hopefully the young guys soon and Betts out of the backfield he is dangerous. I think he can be a stud if he is allowed to play.

Posted by: lavararrington | September 21, 2009 10:18 AM | Report abuse

You're wrong...Jason Campbell is only dangerous to his own team. HE'S DUNSKI. ship him out ASAP.

Posted by: kdofour2000 | September 21, 2009 10:23 AM | Report abuse

LARRY in C, MD.:

I roll with that, but SAM had six exhibitions, and he got time off when that season was played out. There were some real marshmellows in the league when he played also. Today's players have more were-and-tear on them when they arrive from NONE college or wherever, and then much more when they play in the NFL. Back then, guys had an off-season. Their bodies got a chance to heal up a bit. Today the season's year 'round. So maybe these factors mitigate what HUFF knew in the 50's and 60's, and maybe they don't. Anyway, I do believe they will be in better game-shape half-way through the season than they are now. But I don't like the play calling at all. And that's not on the playa's. ZORN gave all the appearance of a man coming unglued from reality yesterday ala MIKE NIXON.

Posted by: glawrence007 | September 21, 2009 10:24 AM | Report abuse

"Anyone that vouches for James Zorn as a legit NFL head coach most definitely wears the new 'skins edition Dolce Gabbana shades."

Unfortunately, when you look at Zorn's coaching career pre-Skins and how he became our HC...it kinda tells the tell. So far anyway, hopefully he gets it together

Posted by: divi3 | September 21, 2009 10:25 AM | Report abuse

On record:

We better vastly improve over this performance or I fully expect to be 1 and 2 next week. The Lions have played two of the tougher NFC teams in New Orleans and Minny and played them both pretty tough. I watched both games (Brees and AP on my fantasy squad, love the sunday ticket) and I'll say this, game 1 Brees was superhuman cause Stafford, CJ, and Kevin Smith put up some points and game 2 Detroit's defense was all over Favre all game that was no blow out or easy win for the Vikings. I don't think we match up with CJ and our oline is going to have its hands full with Jim Schwartz' blitzes. There better be no more drops in the red zone or retarded play calling or we'll be in big trouble.

Posted by: zjfr2 | September 21, 2009 10:25 AM | Report abuse

Pass to Sellers was a good call. He just dropped it. Devin Thomas also dropped a TD (tough catch but he's got to make it in the endzone). Skins also got hosed on a BS roughing penalty that negated a turnover deep in Rams territory. There were several other bad breaks.

I know it was frustrating and boring to watch, but the fact is that even good teams have games where nothing goes right (dropped passes, an unusual turnover, poor officiating) that turns a rout into a close game. The good teams still find a way to win. I'm not saying the Skins are good at this point. I'm just saying that we should probably take a win as a win and hope that the breaks even out a little in Detroit.

Posted by: mhaslup1 | September 21, 2009 10:26 AM | Report abuse

manalive - you are alone on that one....he played ok, not brilliant. This qb can't put up points on the board...I know it was caveman and thomas' fault but the fact still remains... jason campbell can not score touchdowns in the NFL...plain and simple. HE DUNSKI

Posted by: kdofour2000 | September 21, 2009 10:19 AM | Report abuse

You didn't watch the game so let me give you a recap. JC had the 2 drops. Moss fumbled and the other 2 drives we decided to run out of a twin TE set that has yet to work. JC didn't score points because he wasn't allowed to. How is he supposed to score points on a hand off?

Posted by: PAskinsfan17 | September 21, 2009 10:26 AM | Report abuse

Let's stay medium about this, folks.

Unfortunately the Redskins are just a mediocre team. Not terrible, but not great either. They have a defense that will keep them in every game this season. But unfortunately every week each opponent will be in the game as well, right now it looks like because of the very low scoring offense.

Every week they can win. I want them to win. But - and I said this in a comment last night - I am afraid that Detroit is going to get their first win since 2007 next week.

See you at the local watering hole for the game.

Posted by: hithere1 | September 21, 2009 10:27 AM | Report abuse

4th, whateves....

brown, vent by all means dude. There are a lot of people up here that can't take any criticism of their beloved 'skins.

But as far as complaining about the FedEx experience, well homie, that's entirely on you.

But I fully support the fact that a win isn't always a win. Depending on how you win, it can serve as an underlining for other things.

No TDs, and a two point win. Against the Rams.

Hey if you all want to eat that bs up, go right ahead.

Posted by: RedDMV | September 21, 2009 10:28 AM | Report abuse

cl, didn't see this game, but you might be onto something regarding going to the 2nd/3rd/4th options, but then that also could have a lot to do with how much time he has as well...good thoughts...

regarding JC's fastball, not sure about tha....worth watching going forward....touch has somewhat been a problem for JC in the past however....

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | September 21, 2009 10:28 AM | Report abuse

On record:

We better vastly improve over this performance or I fully expect to be 1 and 2 next week. The Lions have played two of the tougher NFC teams in New Orleans and Minny and played them both pretty tough. I watched both games (Brees and AP on my fantasy squad, love the sunday ticket) and I'll say this, game 1 Brees was superhuman cause Stafford, CJ, and Kevin Smith put up some points and game 2 Detroit's defense was all over Favre all game that was no blow out or easy win for the Vikings. I don't think we match up with CJ and our oline is going to have its hands full with Jim Schwartz' blitzes. There better be no more drops in the red zone or retarded play calling or we'll be in big trouble.

Posted by: zjfr2 | September 21, 2009 10:25 AM | Report abuse

Lions are definitely capable of beating the Redskins if they play poorly and the red zone offense doesn't improve. I agree. I would point out that I think our defense is superior to either of the ones Detroit has faced (far superior to New Orleans).

Posted by: mhaslup1 | September 21, 2009 10:29 AM | Report abuse

No Greg, it would have been better for him to glowingly brag about how great it was to score 9 points against the worst team in football and how good they are for being able to half-ass it for 60 minutes and still win. Much better course of action to embrace the mediocrity than to actually expect something of a team that's so well compensated.

Posted by: brownwood26 | September 21, 2009 10:29 AM | Report abuse

"We definitely did some good things out there," Campbell said.

----------

Rudimentary.

Fundamental.

Abecedarian.


Posted by: Chia_Pet | September 21, 2009 10:29 AM | Report abuse

The Skins lack of depth at LB is border line ridiculous:

Chris Wilson
H.B. Blades
Robert Henson

I thought Henson played well in the preseason and he's basically one injury away from playing kick and punt cover. Can he have a Khary Campbell impact? Who really knows but dude needs to mind his manners and remember he's a rookie.

Posted by: elfreako | September 21, 2009 10:29 AM | Report abuse

Anyone that vouches for James Zorn as a legit NFL head coach most definitely wears the new 'skins edition Dolce Gabbana shades.

For all that "a win is a win" talk, keep in mind that they won by two whole damn points to the St. Louis Rams, who lost 28-0 the week before, and will be in the bottom half of the league.

You don't win with gimmick plays and kicking field goals in this league.

'Skins should have lost that game.

Posted by: RedDMV | September 21, 2009 10:21 AM

Three things:

1. I'm wearing the Estrada shades from the Burger King commercial.

2. Last year we lost to the Rams. This year we beat them.

3. 'Skins should have won the game, and they did. Thing is they should have won 27-7, not 9-7.

And a bonus:

4. I think that girl Rachel pwned your SJK butt last night.

But I'll give you that Jim Zorn isn't HC much longer. He'll be delivering pizzas for Domino's.

Posted by: talent_evaluator | September 21, 2009 10:29 AM | Report abuse

Cooke, Beathard head 17 Canton nominees By David Elfin
on Sept. 19, 2009
into Redskins 360

Late owner Jack Kent Cooke and former general manager Bobby Beathard are among 17 men with ties to the Washington Redskins who are on the just-released list of 131 nominees for election to the Pro Football Hall of Fame's Class of 2010.

Cooke, who ran the Redskins from 1979 until his death in 1997, and Beathard, the GM from 1978-89, were last-minute additions to last year's ballot so this year marks their first full-fledged candidacies.

Guard Russ Grimm, who made it to the round of 10 during last year's election, was automatically returned to the ballot. He's joined by former linemates Joe Jacoby and Jim Lachey, quarterback Joe Theismann, tight end Frank Wycheck, receivers Gary Clark, Henry Ellard, Irving Fryar and Andre Reed, running backs Larry Centers and Brian Mitchell, defensive linemen Dexter Manley and Charles Mann, linebacker Ken Harvey and late punter Reggie Roby.

The list will be reduced to 25 semifinalists in November and then to 15 finalists who will join Seniors nominees Dick LeBeau and Floyd Little as the subjects of discussion by the 44 selectors (including yours truly) on Feb. 7 in Miami when Five, six or seven candidates will be elected as members of the Class of 2010.

-- David Elfin

Posted by: 4thFloor | September 21, 2009 10:29 AM | Report abuse

Rudimentary.

Fundamental.

Abecedarian.

RFA = Real Fargin Amatuerish

Posted by: Chia_Pet | September 21, 2009 10:30 AM | Report abuse

F medium, thats half the problem right there! Other than that hithere I can find little disagreement....

Posted by: chrislarry | September 21, 2009 10:30 AM | Report abuse

I hear Zorn got in a heated talk with Sonny, where Sonny said if he were QB, he would be audabuling out of the calls Zorn was making in the red zone to pass plays and Zorn replied that he would then bench his starting QB if he did that, its very telling.

Posted by: alex35332 | September 21, 2009 10:31 AM | Report abuse

I feel a little better this morning than I did at 4pm yesterday, but bottom line is we are in a 3 way tie for 2nd in the division, and we have the Lions to prep for. Hopefully the dline will step up some more this week. I agree that our d could be more ferocious, and that the corners need to play up more. I was pretty much shocked to see that Bulger only threw for 125 yds. Seemed like he was chucking it all over the place, especially on 3rd down. Feels like the defense last year – good overall stats, but they just don’t seem to intimidate anybody, or get enough actual sacks. They came through in the end though, and had a takeaway given back by the refs (I guess it was a fair call though).

I agree that the handcuffs need to come off and that Zorn needs to open it up. Good to see Kelly Johnson asking JC17 point blank where the fades to MK12 are……although they did take one shot to MK12 from about the 29 I think, but JC threw it out of the endzone……I will say that JC17 impressed me a lot yesterday…there were times when he threw to Colley or ARE with the pocket collapsing around him that he didn’t used to be able to make; looks like they have his throwing motion corrected almost to the point of having a quick release. I also thought he made great choices when he took off and ran. I would like to see some 4WR sets next week, with Marko going deep…they just need to try it once or twice. In preseason Zorn called a bunch of long balls early to try and keep the defenses honest….where did that go?
They also need to try and throw more on 1st down inside the 10…..that could open up the play that Todd Collins ran so well where he immediately fakes a quick hitch to the WR or TE and then gives a draw to Portis…..that single play helped them beat the giants the least time they actually beat the Giants….

Bottom line is that they could have done better but they won, and IMO, last years team would have found a way to actually lose that game. Bring on the Lions…..HAIL VICTORY!!

Posted by: dlhaze1 | September 21, 2009 10:31 AM | Report abuse

RFA label applies to the whole organization, including Jim Zorn.

Posted by: Chia_Pet | September 21, 2009 10:32 AM | Report abuse

JC had nothing to do with that game being horrendous. He played well, I'm a hater and admit, he had a nice game. His deep passes still need work first one to Kelly and the one out of bounds to DT but that was a pretty ball to ARE and he made the plays to Sellers and DT. JC played well, the problem with that game was he got let down by two drops, Moss' horrible play (two guys there just get on the ground or out of bounds!), and the red zone play calling was predictable we run left on 1st down every single possession, 13 snaps inside the 20 not one fade to Kelly not one play action. Zorn was/is the biggest problem with this team. JC didn't help week 1 and he's not anything more than average but he's not the problem right now.

Posted by: zjfr2 | September 21, 2009 10:32 AM | Report abuse

You didn't watch the game so let me give you a recap. JC had the 2 drops. Moss fumbled and the other 2 drives we decided to run out of a twin TE set that has yet to work. JC didn't score points because he wasn't allowed to. How is he supposed to score points on a hand off?

Posted by: PAskinsfan17 | September 21, 2009 10:26 AM | Report abuse

I actually did watch the whole game...it was very boring...very boring...you can defend Campbell all you want but I know what he's done since he's been our starting qb, which is nothing. I did say that it was caveman and thomas fault that we didn't get 2 touchdowns but the point remains when we play any playoff caliber team JC gets scary on us and starts to show his true colors...HE IS FEARFUL...NOT LOOSE...NOT CONFIDNENT...NOT GOOD.

Posted by: kdofour2000 | September 21, 2009 10:33 AM | Report abuse

I'm officially off the Jim Zorn bandwagon.

Posted by: Chia_Pet | September 21, 2009 10:34 AM | Report abuse

"Perhaps the most animated player was backup linebacker Robert Henson, who took to Twitter to repeatedly criticize the home crowd"

I'm not normally for players giving backlash to their fans, but I couldn't agree more with Henson here. The display put on by the home fans of Fed Ex yesterday was absolutely disgusting. The Redskins fan base, as a whole, might be one of the least in-tune, mot out-of-touch with reality fan bases in the NFL.

The team was kneeling out the clock, and the fans were booing. I can't describe to you how ignorant, ill-conceived, and ugly that made Redskins fans look across the nation. I was embarrassed to be a redskins fan watching that.

Posted by: psps23 | September 21, 2009 10:35 AM | Report abuse

Giants vs. Cowboys, now THAT was a good game.

Posted by: Chia_Pet | September 21, 2009 10:36 AM | Report abuse

No TDs, and a two point win. Against the Rams.

Hey if you all want to eat that bs up, go right ahead.

Posted by: RedDMV | September 21, 2009 10:28 AM | Report abuse

Yes, but can't you also read too much into a close win? The Skins scored two touchdowns against the Giants. Does that mean the Rams defense is better than the Giants defense? Probably not. Does it mean the Redskins offense got worse this week? Probably not - I think we all can agree they seemed much more dynamic other than their red zone issues.

This team is a work in progress. It's going to be fits and starts all year. They are capable of losing to the Lions or blowing them out. They are capable of beating division opponents or getting embarrassed. All we can hope is that they become more consistent over the course of the year. I recall that year 2 of the west coast offense didn't look great in Seattle either.

Posted by: mhaslup1 | September 21, 2009 10:36 AM | Report abuse

One reason for saving players and not putting them through the rigors is because you don't want them to get hurt.

A better reason for putting them through the rigors is that you find out what players can play through the rigors and thus you might have a better team.

Players that continually get hurt from praticing hard, maybe, should not be on your Team anyway.

But then, when you save them from the rigors of practice and they go in the game and still get hurt, Randy Thomas, what good are they really.

BeantownGreg1, this Team may have been in shape to you, but not for me.

Sam Huff brought it up yesterday and I will continue to bring it up, because not being in shape in football is fools gold.

You call all the wrong plays, play the wrong players, go 6-2 and then 2-6.

Love my Redskins, but Dem' Boys' Ain't' In' Shape'. That is Zorn's fault and not mine.

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | September 21, 2009 10:36 AM | Report abuse

'The Redskins fan base, as a whole, might be one of the least in-tune, mot out-of-touch with reality fan bases in the NFL.'

Heaven forbid the fans expect some improvement on the previous seasons' problems. Dany Snyder, Vinny, and Zorn need to hear those boos.

The punter is tied for the team lead in TDs.

'nuff said

Posted by: divi3 | September 21, 2009 10:38 AM | Report abuse

The Redskins fan base, as a whole, might be one of the least in-tune, mot out-of-touch with reality fan bases in the NFL.

The team was kneeling out the clock, and the fans were booing. I can't describe to you how ignorant, ill-conceived, and ugly that made Redskins fans look across the nation. I was embarrassed to be a redskins fan watching that.

Posted by: psps23 | September 21, 2009 10:35 AM

---------

True, but only to an extent.

The team doesn't exactly inspire a great amount positive fervor.

Having said that, the DC Metro set is waaayyyaaay lame.

Posted by: Chia_Pet | September 21, 2009 10:39 AM | Report abuse

I'm officially off the Jim Zorn bandwagon.

Posted by: Chia_Pet | September 21, 2009 10:34 AM | Report abuse

So your saying all that's left of the bandwagon is Jim Zorn family and friends?

Posted by: PortisPocketsStr8 | September 21, 2009 10:39 AM | Report abuse

larry, point noted....enjoy that island...so every player on this team isn't in shape....right...good call....

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | September 21, 2009 10:40 AM | Report abuse

A little perspective. In year 2 of implementing the west coast attack in Seattle, the Hasselbeck/Holmgren-Seahawks went 7-9, starting the season 0-3 and 1-5 (including a 9-6 loss to the Giants).

What we are seeing is, unfortunately, normal. They will get better.

Posted by: mhaslup1 | September 21, 2009 10:41 AM | Report abuse

Whoever is up on this team after beating the SJKing RAMS by 2 pnts and not scoring ONE TD needs to get their head examined.

I love my Skins and hate what the organization is doing.

Unfortunately, the 'positives' on the stat sheet will continue to allow Zoron tha Moron and his cast o' crappy to SKATE along for another week largely unscathed and with a bunch of 'atta'boys...

I feel sick.

Posted by: DikShuttle | September 21, 2009 10:41 AM | Report abuse

This team is a work in progress.

Posted by: mhaslup1 | September 21, 2009 10:36 AM

---------

What you describe is not "progress," this fits and starts business.

One step backward plus one step forward means you're going nowhere.

Posted by: Chia_Pet | September 21, 2009 10:42 AM | Report abuse

brownie:

O-o-o-o, my man, your 10:13 a.m., harsh, harsh, true IMO, but harsh.

BOSTON GREG:

I've watched the "SKINS since their nickname was only offensive to the Native Indians of America. This game was offensive as in s-h-t-anking offensive.

I put the play-calling on the coach and I put it on the owner that the offensive co-ordinator had to step up after no one wanted the head coaching job with both co-ordinators already on board. Until SNYDER stays out of the kitchen, no one of NFL caliber-worth will take the head job. They've already got a head-case running the show.

Posted by: glawrence007 | September 21, 2009 10:42 AM | Report abuse

The team was kneeling out the clock, and the fans were booing. I can't describe to you how ignorant, ill-conceived, and ugly that made Redskins fans look across the nation. I was embarrassed to be a redskins fan watching that.

Posted by: psps23 | September 21, 2009 10:35 AM | Report abuse

To be fair I think most fans stand behind the players.

Jim Zorn was the one being booed yesterday. And Jim Zorn deserved to be booed yesterday.

Posted by: PortisPocketsStr8 | September 21, 2009 10:42 AM | Report abuse

Zorn did the same thing last year against the Rams, stifling, unnecessary "ball-control ball" against the worst team in the league, but the Skins fumbled and had it returned for a TD resulting in a loss last year..The red-zone hyper-conservatism mold HAS to be broken, the TD drought MUST be broken..I understand the sense of "Apocalypse Now" doom and gloom in hardcore, anyone that takes a glance at the History of the World can't help but have a bitter taste of nihilism in their mouth..I'm just sayin' , why not "Paradise Now", scr*w the fascist and communist and capitalist wanna-be controllers of the world, and engage in the Great International Celebration of Life?? How about it??..

Posted by: frak | September 21, 2009 10:42 AM | Report abuse

so every player on this team isn't in shape....right...good call....

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | September 21, 2009 10:40 AM

Hey, do you doubt Sam Huff? He's a real authority and he said they're not in shape.

Posted by: talent_evaluator | September 21, 2009 10:43 AM | Report abuse

Just some thoughts, start lining up to call me an idiot.

Posted by: chrislarry | September 21, 2009 10:23 AM

You're far from an idiot. You know what else I saw? When he had to step up in the pocket yesterday, he didn't re-set and look for a receiver, he took off running. It's like he took advice from last week's game but misapplied it.

And are we really crediting DThomas with a drop? Really?

Posted by: learnedhand1 | September 21, 2009 10:44 AM | Report abuse

...the Hasselbeck/Holmgren-Seahawks went 7-9, starting the season 0-3 and 1-5 (including a 9-6 loss to the Giants).

Posted by: mhaslup1 | September 21, 2009 10:41 AM

----------

The Seahawks play in a weak division, and always get mopped up in the playoffs.

The copious amounts of marijuana smoked in Seattle make it tolerable for the fans, and that's about it.

Posted by: Chia_Pet | September 21, 2009 10:45 AM | Report abuse

If we are to assume that Redskins fans want the time to improve, then there is something that has to improve besides just the playcalling, or execution or front office.

Us. As fans, we currently stink more than I can ever remember. Now, no doubt our stinky-ness has a lot to do with the teams mediocrity over the past 15 years. Still...

I don't boo at the games, I don't see how that helps. That being said, I don't get bothered at all at the fact that people do it. It's a way to vent, and there is a good argument that the fans should voice their disapproval of the play on the field. When fans boo as the team goes into halftime, I can understand when it is a losing effort to that point against a poor team such as the Rams. So, down 7-6 in a typical grudge match where the Redskins keep a bad team in the game may deserve some booing.

Fine. BUT YOU DON'T BOO WHEN THE TEAM HAS WON THE GAME. If people want to do that, stay home. Boo at the television. Come here and write about how awful they are. But you don't boo a win. Never. Ever.

As fans, we can hate the owner, and claim they can't win until he sells the team, changes, or dies...but we can't control him, and he can't be fired. So let it go. Pull for your team, folks. Perception truly can become reality, and though the Redskins are frustrating to no ends, we aren't helping right now...not a bit.

Posted by: shaunsherman12 | September 21, 2009 10:47 AM | Report abuse

Oh, and is it possible that the fade isn't called b/c the coach doesn't think his QB can throw? Just sayin'.

Posted by: learnedhand1 | September 21, 2009 10:48 AM | Report abuse

"If we are to assume that Redskins fans want the time to improve"

---

I meant "want the TEAM to improve".

BOOOOOO where is the edit button? :)

Posted by: shaunsherman12 | September 21, 2009 10:48 AM | Report abuse

Fine. BUT YOU DON'T BOO WHEN THE TEAM HAS WON THE GAME

Posted by: shaunsherman12 | September 21, 2009 10:47 AM

----------

W
A
K
E

U
P

(this team isn't very good.)

Posted by: Chia_Pet | September 21, 2009 10:48 AM | Report abuse

'The Seahawks play in a weak division, and always get mopped up in the playoffs.

The copious amounts of marijuana smoked in Seattle make it tolerable for the fans, and that's about it.

Posted by: Chia_Pet

This approach has not helped me.....

Posted by: chrislarry | September 21, 2009 10:49 AM | Report abuse

"...this is a team in progress..."


Wise words.

Folks have to understand the issues with the offense will work themselves out over the course of the season.

It would nice for the skins to have the offense the saints do. But Drew Brees isn't about to walk in through the door at Redskin Park.

Let Zorn keep scheming plays and formations that fit the personnel he has.

Y'all have just gotta chill.

Posted by: MistaMoe | September 21, 2009 10:50 AM | Report abuse

I don't remember ever feeling this bad after a Redskin win, though I have developed the faculty of selective memory as a self-defense technique after all the years of rooting for this team.

The lingering bad feelings are about on Zorn's playcalling and clock management first, and on Devin Thomas and Mike Sellers' drops second.

To think I was worried we would blow out the Rams and get a falsely inflated sense of how good the Skins are! What a fool I was to worry about that. It's impossible to think this is a good football team right now, even with all the pieces that I think have looked good to great: Fletch, Mr. Haynie, Soup, Cooley, Brother Malcolm, Horton, Doughty, maybe a few others.

Posted by: NateinthePDX | September 21, 2009 10:50 AM | Report abuse

Oh, and is it possible that the fade isn't called b/c the coach doesn't think his QB can throw? Just sayin'.

Posted by: learnedhand1 | September 21, 2009 10:48 AM

Are you talking about the coach who thinks that Clinton Portis can throw?

Posted by: talent_evaluator | September 21, 2009 10:50 AM | Report abuse

d. brees is insane...crazy good..i love watching him play.

By all accounts i should have been wasted yesterday at the bar, but this limp dik victory hindered the 6 beers/2 shots/3 hits of "medicine" from having any positive affect....unless you count being pissy to the wife.

Posted by: chrislarry | September 21, 2009 10:53 AM | Report abuse

chia_pet

"...(this team isn't very good.)..."

And whereas that's true, it does have some parts which are rather attractive: young wide receivers, a great tight end, a solid defense, decent special teams.

The turn around for this team will come.

Chill.


Posted by: MistaMoe | September 21, 2009 10:53 AM | Report abuse

They need to work on red zone situations and bust out some new plays. Its a copy cat league right? Look at film of teams that have success in the red zone and use some of those plays, or plays you have in your playbook that resemble those plays. The D will keep us in games. Once they can score some TD's they will look better. But until they do they are very mediocre.

Posted by: FedorEm | September 21, 2009 10:53 AM | Report abuse

My wife does not cook.

My wife does not clean.

I have to beg to get her to lift her shirt.

but according to shaunsherman 12, I have a great marriage.

Posted by: Chia_Pet | September 21, 2009 10:53 AM | Report abuse

The team was kneeling out the clock, and the fans were booing. I can't describe to you how ignorant, ill-conceived, and ugly that made Redskins fans look across the nation. I was embarrassed to be a redskins fan watching that.

Posted by: psps23 | September 21, 2009 10:35 AM


Dude, use some common sense...nobody was booing the victory formation, the booing was for the crappy effort and the lousy coaching. If you can't see that, you're the one whose view of this team is "ignorant and ill-conceived".

Posted by: brownwood26 | September 21, 2009 10:55 AM | Report abuse

first post on this thread:

"Up two with 2 minutes left and you go for it on 4th down TWICE in the red zone? With a great defense?? The other team has NO TIMEOUTS??? This is as close to a fireable offense for an offensive coordinator (in this case, Zorn)."

That's just stupid. Holding the ball, keeping the Rams pinned back (with that great defense, and with the Rams' lack of timeouts), and taking a shot at putting the game away were worth a lot more than another three points at that time. If you're going to bash Zorn, you lose credibility by trashing the handful of decisions he made that were absolutely correct, and directly resulted in a win.

Posted by: Godfather_of_Goals | September 21, 2009 10:55 AM | Report abuse

'BUT YOU DON'T BOO WHEN THE TEAM HAS WON THE GAME.'

I dint boo, but I understand why people did. If horton stumbles, we lose the game (and the season) on a 98yd td by one of the worst teams in the league who also beat us last year. After not scoring a single td with 4 possessions inside the 10yd line, and dominating the stat sheet.

People can complain all they want about how ignorant the fans appear to be. But guess what? Long time fans KNOW WHAT THEY ARE SEEING and it aint good. In fact, it's terrible. Only a complete change of philosophy in Zorn's playcalling will help the team...he NEEDED to hear those boos.

and Snyder charges people an arm and a leg to see the games, no issue here with fans voicing their opinions of the product

Posted by: divi3 | September 21, 2009 10:55 AM | Report abuse

Moe.

No.

You chill.

Me, I'm for a good healthy rant.

(tired of seeing teams like the Giants and Cowboys light it up on Monday night after we snuff it out on Sunday.)

Posted by: Chia_Pet | September 21, 2009 10:56 AM | Report abuse

Oh, and is it possible that the fade isn't called b/c the coach doesn't think his QB can throw? Just sayin'.

Posted by: learnedhand1 | September 21, 2009 10:48 AM | Report abuse

That's exactly why it isn't called and that's exactly why we think Zorn needs to stop calling the plays. Anybody can throw it. JC can throw it. Just the threat of throwing it opens up some room underneath. If he has two tall receivers to throw to in the corners he most likely will find Moss or Cooley open underneath. The Rams D didn't have any pressure all day. Why not keep throwing the ball?

Posted by: PAskinsfan17 | September 21, 2009 10:56 AM | Report abuse

From Boswell's column:
"We'll get killed again tomorrow," said Campbell, meaning the inevitable Monday-morning quarterbacking (like this)Washington life..."Take it for what it's worth.

Here's what it's worth, genius...it's worth the money you're getting paid that can barely be justified. It's worth the opportunity for people that have been devoted to this team to wake up gameday morning feeling like, yeah, there's a good chance the Skins are gonna get it done today. It's worth you getting your head out of your *** and at least pretending you were somehow prepared for the NFL.

Do me a favor, open a car dealership, become the spokesman for the president's physical fitness program, see if the Auburn alums will toss you a bone and take you on as an assistant coach...anything but continue to look like you just landed on Planet Earth every time you get under center.

Posted by: InRealAmerica | September 21, 2009 10:56 AM | Report abuse

I wonder if the NE Pats fans (Brady 23/47 for 216 yards, 0 TDs, 1 INT, 53.1 rating) are lighting up their team for losing against a rookie QB like RI fans are for an ugly win against the Lambs?

Posted by: Alan4 | September 21, 2009 10:59 AM | Report abuse

Chia Pet,

Good or not, booing a win is really stupid. This isn't really a debate about whether they are good or not.

Booing a win = dumb. There just isn't much argument for otherwise.

So, maybe you should "wake up" and realize that if you feel that is the proper way to "support" the team, you are actually just another part of the problem.

Posted by: shaunsherman12 | September 21, 2009 10:59 AM | Report abuse

My wife does not cook.

My wife does not clean.

I have to beg to get her to lift her shirt.

but according to shaunsherman 12, I have a great marriage.

Posted by: Chia_Pet | September 21, 2009 10:53 AM


LOL...post of the day. That's the best way to sum up the world of a Redskins fan!

Posted by: brownwood26 | September 21, 2009 11:00 AM | Report abuse

The team was kneeling out the clock, and the fans were booing. I can't describe to you how ignorant, ill-conceived, and ugly that made Redskins fans look across the nation. I was embarrassed to be a redskins fan watching that.

Posted by: psps23 | September 21, 2009 10:35 AM | Report abuse

They weren't booing the kneeling out the clock, they were booing the 9 points and terrible playcalling against the freaking rams. Zorn deserves to be booed. Also, every stop saying the "I'm ok with going for it" line, that call was idiotic. There's a difference between creativity and aggression and risky stupidity. They had no timeouts! a 5 point lead and they have to go the distance and punch it in against our D is a lot lot more difficult than they have to go 65 yards to kick a long field goal, it was a horrible decision that was bailed out by a great play by Horton. But Zorn was a Leigh Torrence from being the goat of the NFL.

Posted by: zjfr2 | September 21, 2009 11:01 AM | Report abuse

I weep for the Redskins players and coaches.

Being subjected to vocal criticism - either from fans in the stands or via the media - is wrong.

What the players and coaches need are blind support and perpetual encouragement.

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | September 21, 2009 11:02 AM | Report abuse

"I wonder if the NE Pats fans (Brady 23/47 for 216 yards, 0 TDs, 1 INT, 53.1 rating) are lighting up their team for losing against a rookie QB like RI fans are for an ugly win against the Lambs?"

The pats got booed at home last year, in their first home loss in 2 years or whatever. This coming off a 16-0 season and with their franchise qb out for the year.

Posted by: divi3 | September 21, 2009 11:03 AM | Report abuse

The copious amounts of marijuana smoked in Seattle make it tolerable for the fans, and that's about it.

Posted by: Chia_Pet | September 21, 2009 10:45 AM | Report abuse

According to my quick research DC rates higher then the state of washington in terms of pot use (DC 6th Wash 16th) no data for seattle itself on hand. We also are the no 2 city in alcohol consumption per-capita I recall, Vegas is no 1.

So I don't think thats it.

Posted by: alex35332 | September 21, 2009 11:04 AM | Report abuse

A little perspective. In year 2 of implementing the west coast attack in Seattle, the Hasselbeck/Holmgren-Seahawks went 7-9, starting the season 0-3 and 1-5 (including a 9-6 loss to the Giants).

What we are seeing is, unfortunately, normal. They will get better.

Posted by: mhaslup1 | September 21, 2009 10:41 AM | Report abuse

Why are we trying to impliment an attack didn't win a championnship in Seattle?

Posted by: kdofour2000 | September 21, 2009 11:05 AM | Report abuse

My wife does not cook.

"My wife does not clean.

I have to beg to get her to lift her shirt.

but according to shaunsherman 12, I have a great marriage."

----

You just don't get it. It doesn't matter if they stink. When they win, you give them credit for victory, which in the end is the only way the game will be measured in the standings.

Booing a team while they run off the clock in a victory is more embarrassing than the poor play on the field, and fans of other teams are laughing at us as much or more than at the team, believe it.

The worst part of this is, if they started converting in the redzone, and blowing people out, you same folks would be singing their praise just a month from now.

Posted by: shaunsherman12 | September 21, 2009 11:06 AM | Report abuse

So, maybe you should "wake up" and realize that if you feel that is the proper way to "support" the team, you are actually just another part of the problem.

Posted by: shaunsherman12 | September 21, 2009 10:59 AM


Dude, wake up. You're probably one of those guys who wears Redskin undies on game day and thinks that ritual is somehow directly connected to the team's on-field performance. It doesn't make one bit of difference if fans are booing or cheering. If that's the case, the team should always be 8-8...8-0 at home and 0-8 on the road.

This franchise has a lousy owner and a lousy front office. And that tandem hired a lousy coach. That's why this team is mediocre. Not because fans exercised their God-given right to boo the crap they just paid hundreds (and some paid thousands) of dollars to see. If you can't see that you're just delusional.

Posted by: brownwood26 | September 21, 2009 11:08 AM | Report abuse

The Seahawks play in a weak division, and always get mopped up in the playoffs.

The copious amounts of marijuana smoked in Seattle make it tolerable for the fans, and that's about it.

Posted by: Chia_Pet | September 21, 2009 10:45 AM | Report abuse

Exactly, they struggled that much to get this offense going while playing in a terrible division. I'm just saying that I think the fans' expectations are getting to be as unrealistic as Snyder/Vinny's have been. In year 2, this team is not built to be a true West Coast team. Closer than last year, but still not quite there. It will take a couple weeks for Zorn to figure out how to coax points out of our "hybrid" team. If he can string together a win or two in the process, maybe the team has a chance to make noise in the second half.

Look at it this way: at least we haven't already lost a division game at home. Yikes Dallas. Yikes.

Posted by: mhaslup1 | September 21, 2009 11:08 AM | Report abuse

"Dude, use some common sense...nobody was booing the victory formation, the booing was for the crappy effort and the lousy coaching"

Excuse me while I pull this pencil from out of my eye with this comment. We've got to have the dumbest fanbase in the league, I'm quickly being convinced.

You boo poor coaching when the poor coaching actually occurs. Not when the team is lining up to seal the victory.

Posted by: psps23 | September 21, 2009 11:09 AM | Report abuse

I'll address you simultaneously...if you don't like criticism and frustration expressed over a clearly mediocre team, then go to Redskins.com and enjoy Larry Michael's sunshine bidet they call coverage. I just find it funny that you guys only want the rosey bullsh*t and come to the Washington Post...the biggest critic of the Snyder Redskins.

If I didn't care, I wouldn't be pissed. If you guys are gluttons for punishment then eat up, enjoy. Just don't get on me because I know crap when I see it and call the team out on it.

Posted by: brownwood26 | September 21, 2009 9:57 AM

Dude, this ain't a 1 extreme or the other thing. I don't want or expect the rosy color glasses crap. All I said was that beantown has as much a right to call you on your negativity as you have to be negative. You tell him to get lost for the same right you are expressing. I see points on both sides and express them both.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | September 21, 2009 11:10 AM | Report abuse

"Not because fans exercised their God-given right to boo the crap they just paid hundreds (and some paid thousands) of dollars to see"

not even taking into consideration how long certain fans drove to, and from the stadium.....I mean, we're talking 60 minutes!!!!!!

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | September 21, 2009 11:11 AM | Report abuse

No one seems to be talking about the fact that this year is all on cerrato...he lead the charge and danny boy gave him full control.
zorn was his idea. this team has been built to fail since snyder took over....if he finally wakes up and stops trusting cerrato, i will have some hope, otherwise we are just doomed to fail... i have been a skins fan for 20 yrs and dont plan to stop, but this is painful

Posted by: jj44skins | September 21, 2009 11:11 AM | Report abuse

No one seems to be talking about the fact that this year is all on cerrato...he lead the charge and danny boy gave him full control.
zorn was his idea. this team has been built to fail since snyder took over....if he finally wakes up and stops trusting cerrato, i will have some hope, otherwise we are just doomed to fail... i have been a skins fan for 20 yrs and dont plan to stop, but this is painful

Posted by: jj44skins | September 21, 2009 11:11 AM | Report abuse

The worst part of this is, if they started converting in the redzone, and blowing people out, you same folks would be singing their praise just a month from now.

Posted by: shaunsherman12 | September 21, 2009 11:06 AM


Um, yeah. That's how it works. You perform, you get praise. Play like a JV team (win or lose), get booed. It's simple math, really...

Posted by: brownwood26 | September 21, 2009 11:11 AM | Report abuse

I'll address you simultaneously...if you don't like criticism and frustration expressed over a clearly mediocre team, then go to Redskins.com and enjoy Larry Michael's sunshine bidet they call coverage. I just find it funny that you guys only want the rosey bullsh*t and come to the Washington Post...the biggest critic of the Snyder Redskins.

Posted by: brownwood26 | September 21, 2009 9:57 AM

...oh and Redskins.com has a new writer that bashes away. Don't believe me?

http://www.redskins.com/gen/articles/Redskins_Still_Struggling_to_Touch_Down_In_End_Zone_52171.jsp

Posted by: scampbell1975 | September 21, 2009 11:12 AM | Report abuse

This is what happens when your headcoach goes on a scouting trip to see a cornerback and somehow falls in love with the qb....who he claims threw the best fade route in the redzone he's seen in a longtime...yet, they won't allow him to throw it in the NFL. Please end this experiment...it's not working.

Posted by: kdofour2000 | September 21, 2009 11:12 AM | Report abuse

It's our $$ that pays the bills and we cna call them out on anything we want.

btw - 60$ Theismann Jersey (stitched lettering) at Champs this weekend!! woo woo!

Posted by: DikShuttle | September 21, 2009 11:13 AM | Report abuse

"If you guys are gluttons for punishment then eat up, enjoy."

If that isn't the pot calling the kettle black, I don't know what is.

Seriously, a guy who boos a win is calling out someone else for being a glutton for punishment. Only on RI.

Posted by: psps23 | September 21, 2009 11:13 AM | Report abuse

"We've got to have the dumbest fanbase in the league, I'm quickly being convinced."

Dumb is praising a 2pt win over the worst team in the NFL, after watching $100million spent in the offseason to improve the #4 defense while knowing full well the offense has been the problem for years.

again, fans KNOW WHAT THEY ARE SEEING. And expect a team that can compete for reals with the NFL elite when it counts. We were nowhere near that last season because of the offense, and now it appears the same way this season.

Zorn deserves to hear the boos

Posted by: divi3 | September 21, 2009 11:14 AM | Report abuse

"Dude, wake up. You're probably one of those guys who wears Redskin undies on game day and thinks that ritual is somehow directly connected to the team's on-field performance."

WAIT! This doesn't work. Good thing, cuz mine are getting crusty as a mofo!

Posted by: chrislarry | September 21, 2009 11:15 AM | Report abuse

This is ENTERTAINMENT.

People PAY to be entertained.

Players or coaches saying, "Well, at least we won" after a pathetic effort is not an excuse in the entertainment industry.

When Robert DeNiro appears in a terrible film (which he's been doing frequently as of late) it's doesn't make the people who paid good money to see that awful film feel any better to hear DeNiro say, "Well, at least I delivered all my lines on cue."

The Redskins will be criticized - and rightfully so - until they start putting points on the board and winning consistently.

I can't think think of anything more pathetic than a bunch of overpaid young men whining about how their feelings were hurt because the fans had the audacity to let them know they played poorly.

Wait... There is one thing more pathetic: sycophant "fans" who defend those same spoiled players when they're booed.

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | September 21, 2009 11:16 AM | Report abuse

My prediction is that this team crushes the Lions on the road. They'll be happier and play loser away from the watchful eye of their "fans."

Posted by: mhaslup1 | September 21, 2009 11:17 AM | Report abuse

"again, fans KNOW WHAT THEY ARE SEEING."

You obviously haven't been reading this blog for too long.

Posted by: psps23 | September 21, 2009 11:17 AM | Report abuse

My wife does not cook.

My wife does not clean.

I have to beg to get her to lift her shirt.

but according to shaunsherman 12, I have a great marriage.

Posted by: Chia_Pet | September 21, 2009 10:53 AM

Best post so far

Booing a win = dumb. There just isn't much argument for otherwise.

So, maybe you should "wake up" and realize that if you feel that is the proper way to "support" the team, you are actually just another part of the problem.

Posted by: shaunsherman12 | September 21, 2009 10:59 AM | Report abuse

Dumbest post so far.

Skins fans have been overly patient, for 18 years we haven't even sniffed quality football. The team is consistently overpaid and under talented. We have little to no depth most everywhere and although we have some nice talent and "weapons" we have a terrible coach who is handcuffing the team with his playcalling. Whether they were booing the product Danny put out there for him to hear or whether they were booing the job Zorn has done for him to hear they have every right to do so.

Posted by: zjfr2 | September 21, 2009 11:17 AM | Report abuse

"Dude, use some common sense...nobody was booing the victory formation, the booing was for the crappy effort and the lousy coaching"

Excuse me while I pull this pencil from out of my eye with this comment. We've got to have the dumbest fanbase in the league, I'm quickly being convinced.

You boo poor coaching when the poor coaching actually occurs. Not when the team is lining up to seal the victory.

Posted by: psps23 | September 21, 2009 11:09 AM

Both of you are kind of right. We got the ball left with something like 1:30 left inside their 5. The fans wanted them to punch it in as I know I did as I was so unfulfilled at the game. The fact that they went into victory formation basically capped off our frustration of the offenses whole day of not scoring any TDs.

People feel robbed who went to the game. Luckily, I didn't pay for my ticket and me and my son got Gary Clark's and Ricky Sander's autograph. And they chilled with my son in the suite we were in the whole second half. MY son now tells everyone he is good friends with Gary Clark and Ricky Sanders, though he didn't know they existed until yesterday.....

Posted by: 4thFloor | September 21, 2009 11:17 AM | Report abuse

Da Nile is not only a river in Egypt.

It meanders through Ashburn, Virginia and spills put onto da blog.

Posted by: Chia_Pet | September 21, 2009 11:18 AM | Report abuse

“and once they saw Danny Smith yelling at him like a child who couldn't manage the clock it sealed the deal. The guy is not ready for this job yet.”

POSTED BY: 4seamed


Well put. Smith appeared to yell “not yet” when Zorn called time out with a running clock right after a play ended. The issue wasn’t calling timeout to discuss stategy, but to first drain some time the Rams wouldn’t have when they got the ball back.

In and of itself, no worse that Gibbs calling two consecutive timeouts, but Gibbs had a nice resume at that point, it was an abberation. Zorn’s gaff is a pretty good indicator why Zorn doesn’t make Grade A decisions in the heat of battle, and there’s plenty of other evidence for that.

And yes it is indicative that as good a coach as Zorn may someday be, few men can handle the jump from quarterback coach to head coach/playcaller.

Unless Zorn's learning curve accelerates exponentially, Dan will have his next "shiny new object" lined up very soon.

Posted by: TheCork | September 21, 2009 11:19 AM | Report abuse

Last year, this team started strong... but completely collapsed in the 2nd half of the season as the O-line fell apart and the offense became impotent.

This year, the team is flailing early in the season and the O-line is falling apart now... get that crap out of the way first and in the 2nd half of the season is BREAKOUT!!

Last year's pattern will not be repeated... Skins roll hot into the playoffs!!

Geez, isn't it obvious?

Posted by: Alan4 | September 21, 2009 11:19 AM | Report abuse

not even taking into consideration how long certain fans drove to, and from the stadium.....I mean, we're talking 60 minutes!!!!!!

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | September 21, 2009 11:11 AM


I can't even tell you how big an idiot you look like right now...I said something about them playing like crap for 60 minutes and you confuse that with my commute. I drove from PA to get into Redskin territory to see that game, and I said "over an hour each way", which if you could do math, is more than 60 minutes. Either way, your joke is crap.

You get off on 9-7 wins against crap teams, I get that. Move on.

Posted by: brownwood26 | September 21, 2009 11:20 AM | Report abuse

This is what happens when your headcoach goes on a scouting trip to see a cornerback and somehow falls in love with the qb....who he claims threw the best fade route in the redzone he's seen in a longtime...yet, they won't allow him to throw it in the NFL. Please end this experiment...it's not working.


Posted by: kdofour2000 | September 21, 2009 11:12 AM |


Excuse me while I pull this pencil from out of my eye with this comment. We've got to have the dumbest fanbase in the league, I'm quickly being convinced.

Posted by: psps23 | September 21, 2009 11:09 AM

PSPS23 your point is well taken.

Posted by: TWISI | September 21, 2009 11:20 AM | Report abuse

Dude, wake up. You're probably one of those guys who wears Redskin undies on game day and thinks that ritual is somehow directly connected to the team's on-field performance.
Posted by: brownwood26 | September 21, 2009 11:08 AM

Umm, weren’t you the one saying that you were constantly negative because when you have high expectations they tank it and when you are negative or don’t expect anything they play well?....

Anyway, I can’t speak for everyone, but many of us up here are pretty accepting of the fact that the team deserves some criticism, and will dole out some ourselves. Those of us that jump on you are critical of the fact that all you do up here is criticize, criticize, criticize, and defend your right to criticize. All we are saying is lighten up, you’re just coming across as a whiny little girl. Trying saying something, anything positive once in a while. They won...sheesh.

Posted by: dlhaze1 | September 21, 2009 11:20 AM | Report abuse

Wow 4th that is amazing! The Posse 4 ever! Gary Clark will always be The Man!

I also agree with your first paragraph. I was like just try to score for the sake morale/mojo. I understand its not the "smart move" but after that game it was like...my gawd score!

Posted by: chrislarry | September 21, 2009 11:21 AM | Report abuse

'In and of itself, no worse that Gibbs calling two consecutive timeouts, but Gibbs had a nice resume at that point, it was an abberation.'

Gibbs had also been away from the game forever, and was dealing with ST's murder.

Gibbs pulled off 2 season ending win streaks to sneak us into the playoffs, mainly because despite the same offensive woes the players seemed to be willing to run through a brick wall for him.

I dont get that feeling one bit on Zorn's relationship with these players, if it means anything we shall see

Posted by: divi3 | September 21, 2009 11:22 AM | Report abuse

Chia Pet,

Good or not, booing a win is really stupid. This isn't really a debate about whether they are good or not.

Booing a win = dumb. There just isn't much argument for otherwise.

So, maybe you should "wake up" and realize that if you feel that is the proper way to "support" the team, you are actually just another part of the problem.

Posted by: shaunsherman12 | September 21, 2009 10:59 AM

shaunsherman12,

Guru is correct.

The boos were well placed.

There is nothing acceptable about beating the worst team in the league 9-7.

There is nothing acceptable by scoring one offensive touch down with 2 games gone in a 16 game season.

There is nothing acceptable about 2 sacks registered with 2 games gone in a 16 game season.

There is nothing acceptable in the team's production in that win.

That win shows we will probably be 4 - 12.

The fans are booing the big picture, not the single "win"

Please wake up.... as should all of the blind fans that will follow this team off the cliff.

It is up to true fans like chia, and myself to drive these points to the highest points in order to exact the kind of change that will bring a winning tradition back to our beloved burgundy and gold.

Posted by: Sports_Guru | September 21, 2009 11:23 AM | Report abuse

I meant to say chia is correct... sorry.

Posted by: Sports_Guru | September 21, 2009 11:24 AM | Report abuse

Thx Cl...I know Sween and 4-12 will hate me since we met up before the game....Proof will be up tonight on Facebook...

Posted by: 4thFloor | September 21, 2009 11:26 AM | Report abuse

4th, that is pretty sweet......congrats...

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | September 21, 2009 11:27 AM | Report abuse

3rd and goal at the 5. Other than "punt", I can't think of a worse play call than half-back option pass.

dcsween and 4th Floor...Great time! That was an excellent "power hour" of boozing before the game.

chRIs laRRy...send me the info to pay for the pick'em league.

Posted by: 4-12 | September 21, 2009 11:27 AM | Report abuse

"Dumbest post so far.

Skins fans have been overly patient, for 18 years we haven't even sniffed quality football. The team is consistently overpaid and under talented. We have little to no depth most everywhere and although we have some nice talent and "weapons" we have a terrible coach who is handcuffing the team with his playcalling. Whether they were booing the product Danny put out there for him to hear or whether they were booing the job Zorn has done for him to hear they have every right to do so. "

----

Of course they have the right to do so. That however doesn't make it any less stupid to do. Booing the team in the MOMENT OF THE WIN is dumb, just dumb. Complaining about the team during the game, after the game, on the Insider is totally understandable - they are disappointing thus far.

Booing IN THE MOMENT they win? Outright stupid.

You're bitter about the last several years of mediocrity. So am I. Now, you tell me what would we could do to help the team perform better: cheer the team and give it a good home field advantage by backing them up, or booing them in a tight game, making the stadium a cozy place for visiting teams?

Truly, folks who were going to boo at the kneel down should have left after the third quarter. They were going to be bitter regardless of a win or loss, so why not beat the traffic and go home. They would have better served the team's efforts there.

...as for the multiple other posts I've seen supporting booing a win, I guess your venting is more important than a strong home field. Oh well!

Posted by: shaunsherman12 | September 21, 2009 11:28 AM | Report abuse

Why am I going to hate you 4th?

Posted by: 4-12 | September 21, 2009 11:30 AM | Report abuse

Well, I see everyone is making excuses for JC again. Face it people the guy will never be anything other than a back up QB or a mediocre starter. It speakes volumes that during the offseason Denver would not do the Cutler deal because they did not want Campbell. When the Redskins shopped him around the league there were no takers. Fifth year in the league and he still does the same things he did 3 years ago. I was hoping this would be a breakout year for him but up to this point, same old Jason, he is allergic to the goal line. I know there were dropped passes, play calling, etc. ( can't he audible? ) but the bottom line is that it is the same as always he can't get them a touchdown. I hope after next week I have to eat my words, but it looks like the defense is going to have to carry the team again this year. I have been a fan of the Skins for over 50 years but it is such a chore to watch the offense now. I'm glad we won but God, it was hard.

Posted by: rmcpks73 | September 21, 2009 11:30 AM | Report abuse

Read 11:17 AM post.......

Posted by: 4thFloor | September 21, 2009 11:32 AM | Report abuse

Here's my question, and this is just a question, I'm not advocating the move, I'm not saying it should happen, I'm not pleading that this is the solution to our problems. But, what does the peanut gallery think would be the result if Sherman Smith and JZ were canned, the rest of the staff retained, and Shanahan hired this week. IMO we'd go with bare bones basic offense for the weeks heading into the bye and then progress as the season went on and I think we'd improve dramatically with Shanny's basic principles of one cut zone blocking running (what we already use) and then the shotguns, play action, and bootlegs that he runs being a perfect fit for what JC does well. I just think Zorn has been forced to use a QB that couldn't fit his system worse. JC is not a drop back quick read quick release guy, it just isn't what he does well. The most successful we were yesterday was when the plays broke down and he moved the pocket and found guys or was in the shotgun. Not exactly west coast principles. IMO this offense will be bad until either Zorn or JC is gone, but I don't think it has to be both.

Posted by: zjfr2 | September 21, 2009 11:32 AM | Report abuse

At the risk picking on an apparent retard, and contrary to his assertions otherwise, this 9-7 win over hapless St Louis did not inspire much confidence in Jason Campbell or the pitiful performance of his offensive team.

While I can Jason's understand habit of deflecting guilt and accept some other people's interests in digging deep to find some sense of positive news in this otherwise dismal performance -- I could only vomit when Coach Zorn suggested that the offensive line's efforts to "protect Jason" stood out as one of the highlights of Sunday's play.

Maybe we should remember that this coach was a sub-par quarterback in his own right -- and has now seemed to develop an unhealthy tolerance for his quarterback's sustained poor performance. (Like father, like son?)

It shows again that while Zorn may useful as a quarterbacks coach, he will never, ever be true head coaching material -- if only because he refuses to make the tough decisions like benching Campbell and getting someone -- anyone -- out there who can make some plays and score some points.

Posted by: Vic1 | September 21, 2009 11:33 AM | Report abuse

Hey Skins fans, it could be worse, you could be a Rams fan. I live in Las Vegas and was looking for a place to watch the game and went to a Ram's bar. (found a Redskin bar for next week.) Fans are all the same, Rams fans complaining about every ref call that didn't go their way, and calling Bulger "Booger". We came close to having Spagnoulo as a coach and he's far from being impressive. The Boiz rang up 30 points on the Giants but LOST! I'll take our inept victory over that.

Posted by: VegasJim | September 21, 2009 11:34 AM | Report abuse

At least the Skins and the 'Girls are in the same boat when it comes to their QB.

Romo = waeker armed Jeff George

Campbell = Shaun King

Posted by: 4thFloor | September 21, 2009 11:34 AM | Report abuse

I was hoping this would be a breakout year for him but up to this point, same old Jason, he is allergic to the goal line. I know there were dropped passes, play calling, etc. ( can't he audible? ) but the bottom line is that it is the same as always he can't get them a touchdown. I hope after next week I have to eat my words, but it looks like the defense is going to have to carry the team again this year. I have been a fan of the Skins for over 50 years but it is such a chore to watch the offense now. I'm glad we won but God, it was hard.

Posted by: rmcpks73 | September 21, 2009 11:30 AM |

JC played a very good game the play calling was horrible in the redzone and like you said two dropped TD passes.

To your audible question, according to Zorn who told Sunny last night that if he had audibled out of those redzone play calls he would have been benched.

Posted by: Flounder21 | September 21, 2009 11:35 AM | Report abuse

Talent_evaluator and Glawrence007,

Your points about the year round conditoning of todays players as compared to Sam Huffs era does make a distinct difference in comparing the two.

However, once we get these finely conditioned players into football camp, it is what we do with them that separates the successful performing Teams from the nonsuccessful.

I would submit that the Redskins have relied mostly on the year round conditioning of their football Team than football camp and preseason conditioning.

However, those organizations that use the year round conditioning as a starting point but also make football camp and preseason the major focus to get their Team into Game Shape are far ahead of the Redskins.

Our Defense is good, but we could be talking about the best Defense in the League if they were in much better shape.

Our D-backs should be blanketing receivers all over the field, which thus will give our D-line an extra pass rush second or two.

Our Defense should never be afraid to blitz on any down, but we don't because we are not yet fast enough to trust our coverage.

We talk about big hits, but you can't make big hits, unless you are in tip top shape. Instead you miss tackles and play off receivers.

A critical flaw of offensive inconsistentcy is poor conditioning. Repetition in offensive practice is critical to the success of all plays. The more repetition the better and the better the conditioning. You can tell by some of Jason's comments that they still need more offensive football practice.

It is not that we do not practice, but too many of our key signifact players that we pencil in as starters have not been for several years now. Not just this one year.

And, if you haven't won anything since the 90's, you should not prepare this way. Champions are ready Game One.

When the Redskins hired Charley Casserly as GM, our front office leadership left the building. GM's build your football and demand what type of Team you put on the field. We have had some great players since Bethard, Gibbs, and Mitchell, left the building, but we haven't had a tough organization since, to include the second Gibbs.

Marty got close, but he wasn't allowed to stay around.

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | September 21, 2009 11:35 AM | Report abuse

I think the passing game looked a lot better this weekend, but I have concerns about the running game. The part of the offense that was not supposed to be broken isn't looking so good. NFL.com has the Redskins rushing offense ranked as 17th. Last year at this time I believe the Redskins were ranked much higher and I know they led the league in rushing offense for several weeks during the season.

I know Zorn made a point of mentioning last week that the shotgun giveth the pass but take awayeth the run, but this is about more than the shotgun offense (BTW - still looking for that shotgun draw...). Zorn has lost faith in the right side of his offensive line being able to open any holes and his philosophy has been duly noted by such lackluster defenses as possesed by a team like the St Louis Rams. Samuels and Dockery are great run blockers, but even they cannot open holes for Portis when there are five defenders loaded on that side. Zorn's lack of faith in the right side is probably going to continue, because Randy Thomas' injury means Rhinehart will be getting the start. Rhinehart may be an adequate replacement, but he is no Randy Thomas. Still, the only way Heyer and Rhinehart are going to improve as run blockers is to allow them to run block. Zorn can give them help, but he cannot afford to remove dimensions of his offense. Defenses love this because it gives them one less thing they have to prepare for.

Posted by: RedSkinHead | September 21, 2009 11:36 AM | Report abuse

Trying saying something, anything positive once in a while. They won...sheesh.

They did win. However, and nothing good ever comes after that word, they look like they have some serious issues.

This is ENTERTAINMENT.
People PAY to be entertained.

It was definitely entertaining. Something along the lines of a circus though, and that seems rather inappropriate for the venue.

I will remind people that as bad as they looked on offense, the Steelers, last year, had to go through the same thing, and look where they ended up. That's not saying I really think they will pull this thing together, just that it's possible. Then again, they have Mike Tomlin, we have Jimmy the Amazing Zornoff whose neat trick is to shove his head up his own a$$.

Ah, this was familiar. And familiarity breeds contempt. -Larry Weisman

No arguments there. Same thing, different year.

Posted by: Megskin | September 21, 2009 11:36 AM | Report abuse

Re 11:17...Awesome! And yes, hate you.

Posted by: 4-12 | September 21, 2009 11:37 AM | Report abuse

What's disappointing to me is that during the off season , we kept hearing Zorn say he better understand his personnel. IMO he hasn't shown that he has a better understanding of how to use his personnel, nor how to take advantage of what other teams want to do against his personnel. Zorn will be better served relinquishing some of his game day responsibilities. I don't think his ego would allow for that. Ultimately that part of his character will get him fired if he doesn't get things turned around.

Posted by: TWISI | September 21, 2009 11:40 AM | Report abuse

"We talk about big hits, but you can't make big hits, unless you are in tip top shape. Instead you miss tackles and play off receivers.

A critical flaw of offensive inconsistentcy is poor conditioning"


simply brilliant...........

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | September 21, 2009 11:41 AM | Report abuse

Whine away, folks.

The biggest issue right now, isn't the lack of scoring.

It's that the right side of the offensive line--the weakside, mind you--has suffered greatly with the injury to R Thomas.

It's time for another pick from the '08 class to step up: Rhino.

Memba him?

We spent the summer hating on the wide outs forgetting that the third round pick Chad Rhinehart has underwhelmed as well.

So now, Thomas is down, and Montegomery is a stand-in.

It's Rhino's time to earn his check.

Posted by: MistaMoe | September 21, 2009 11:42 AM | Report abuse

Whine away, folks.

The biggest issue right now, isn't the lack of scoring.

It's that the right side of the offensive line--the weakside, mind you--has suffered greatly with the injury to R Thomas.

It's time for another pick from the '08 class to step up: Rhino.

Memba him?

We spent the summer hating on the wide outs forgetting that the third round pick Chad Rhinehart has underwhelmed as well.

So now, Thomas is down, and Montegomery is a stand-in.

It's Rhino's time to earn his check.

Posted by: MistaMoe | September 21, 2009 11:43 AM | Report abuse

Sherman Smith has been noticeably absent from these discussions.

Posted by: BrooklynSkins | September 21, 2009 11:43 AM | Report abuse

But, what does the peanut gallery think would be the result if Sherman Smith and JZ were canned, the rest of the staff retained, and Shanahan hired this week.

We still have no OLine. We only run to the left side, this is going to be a serious problem when we play better teams than the Rams. Assuming Shanahan has some pull in the FO to get some real linemen in here it might work.

Then again it sure wouldn't be as exciting as watching Zorn make a complete fool out of himself for the rest of the year.

Just make sure Blache goes with him.

My favorite overheard phrase of the week: We do less with more talent than anybody else in the league

Posted by: Megskin | September 21, 2009 11:44 AM | Report abuse

I guess your venting is more important than a strong home field. Oh well!

Posted by: shaunsherman12 | September 21, 2009 11:28 AM


Again...fans aren't to blame for this. Pricing tickets out of affordability for "real" fans did that years ago. The architecture of the stadium doesn't help (at least not compared to RFK), and you overlook the fact that the team HASN'T BEEN GIVEN MUCH TO CHEER FOR!

Posted by: brownwood26 | September 21, 2009 11:44 AM | Report abuse

Obe One Kanobe

Obe One Kanobe

Posted by: wizard5 | September 21, 2009 11:45 AM | Report abuse

MY son now tells everyone he is good friends with Gary Clark and Ricky Sanders, though he didn't know they existed until yesterday.....

Posted by: 4thFloor

Friends, schmends. Get them out of the suite and into a Uniform.

Seriously, their behavior is a wonderful memory your son will have for life. I wish more players realized that.

Posted by: TheCork | September 21, 2009 11:45 AM | Report abuse

Sherman Smith has been noticeably absent from these discussions.

Posted by: BrooklynSkins | September 21, 2009 11:43 AM |

Thats because he does not call the plays, and we have know idea of how much influence he has on the gameplain.

Posted by: Flounder21 | September 21, 2009 11:45 AM | Report abuse

"I think the passing game looked a lot better this weekend, but I have concerns about the running game. The part of the offense that was not supposed to be broken isn't looking so good."

Hey, an actual real-life observation! My god, I didn't think I'd see the day.

But you're absolutely right. The offense has taken one step forward, and one step backward. The good thing is, throughout BOTH games, the Redskins have moved the ball up and down the field through the air very well. The bad thing is that the red zone causes an allergic reaction to Jim Zorn's mind. And the run blocking is really, really bad in goal-line situations. The 3-and-outs have largely been eliminated, multiple different players have been utilized in the offense (8 different receivers were hit for completions, 9 were targeted), but it all comes down to red zone efficiency. And that looks really, really bad right now.

Posted by: psps23 | September 21, 2009 11:46 AM | Report abuse

Detroit 23
Wash 9

Posted by: wizard5 | September 21, 2009 11:47 AM | Report abuse

4-12:

FB is sucking this AM, so sending here too:

I am sending payment email this week. Payment deadline will be by game 6. Paypal is preferred but I will be offering a "wife friendly" option, so dont sweat it. Nice picking by the way.

Posted by: chrislarry | September 21, 2009 11:48 AM | Report abuse

Let this be a lesson to everybody who calls for Mason, Marko, Colt and every other scrub who shines in the 3rd quarter of preseason games. They suck, they may become better in a year but currently they can't out preform a brick. 3 carries for 5 yards that completely stalled a drive...piece of crap

Posted by: NFeKPo | September 21, 2009 7:55 AM


NFeKPo is a another guy or girl who should not write about football. How can you judge anyone with three carries? He did hit the holes with speed and he ran hard. Did he fumble? did he fall as he was running? did he go the wrong way? No what he did do was run hard and got tackled by another team that is paid to tackle just as well.

Posted by: thebanker21 | September 21, 2009 11:48 AM | Report abuse

Chia Pet,

Good or not, booing a win is really stupid. This isn't really a debate about whether they are good or not.

---

You want to know how dumb Redskin fans are? They even booed Chris Cooley every time he caught a pass. Talk about morons.

Boy is that stupid. I've even seen fans boo Lou Pinella when his teams win, and Lou Brock when he made a great play. It's really stupid. Almost as stupid as someone about to post an explanation for that, claiming I'm the moron..

Posted by: TheCork | September 21, 2009 11:49 AM | Report abuse

Zorn will be better served relinquishing some of his game day responsibilities. I don't think his ego would allow for that. Ultimately that part of his character will get him fired if he doesn't get things turned around.

Posted by: TWISI

I'm not advocating that the inmates run the asylum, but I think that some veteran leaders on this team should confront Zorn about his playcalling and inability to tailor the scheme to personnel. If Zorn continues to stick to his script, he will lose his players' trust early in this season. Who are the leaders of this team on offense? There needs to be a group offensive players that step up as leaders and address their concerns with the coach. It may be the only thing that saves the season. At this point, it's not about ego; it's about keeping a job.

Posted by: Kenbeatrizz | September 21, 2009 11:49 AM | Report abuse

It is entirely possible the this team will go 1-15 this year under Zorn.

To me, that is plenty of reason to boo.

Posted by: Sports_Guru | September 21, 2009 11:50 AM | Report abuse

Sherman Smith has been noticeably absent from these discussions.

Posted by: BrooklynSkins | September 21, 2009 11:43 AM

Because he is a token coach. Zorn's pot smoking buddy back from the 70s.

One day, while smoking pot in those high Seattle Mountains, they made a promise to each other that if one of them ever became a head coach, they would bring the other on.

Zorn kept his pact. Irregardless of the fact Sherman Smith NEVER was involved in a WCO. How Vinny let this slide? I have no clue.

HELLO!??!?

Vinny/Danny couldn't even fire Zorn in the middle of the season if they wanted to. He's the ONLY one on offense who knows the plays. GENUIS!

Posted by: 4thFloor | September 21, 2009 11:50 AM | Report abuse

Other than Seller's and Thomas' drops, I can't think of any players who played poorly yesterday. This one is ENTIRELY on the coaches.

Posted by: Rypien11 | September 21, 2009 11:51 AM | Report abuse

Seems to me that "if" Reinhart isn't the new #1 RG, then I'm missing why he's on the active roster at all. I can understand him being inactive in order to cover G/C with Montgomery, but if he's a one-trick pony then it's time for him to step up -- or go on the practice squad.
Doc Walker wondered aloud this morning if you might see BMW at RG now. Putting him in the interior might give you all the upside without putting too much stress on his (in)ability to work in space. It might also allow us to run right on occasion.
Heyer is making me yearn for Jansen.

Posted by: daggar | September 21, 2009 11:51 AM | Report abuse

Flounder, thanks for clarifying the audible situation. I hope Jason improves but I am very septical

Posted by: rmcpks73 | September 21, 2009 11:51 AM | Report abuse

play calling, etc. ( can't he audible? ) but the bottom line is that it is the same as always he can't get them a touchdown.

Posted by: rmcpks73 | September 21, 2009 11:30 AM |

He can't audible. Zorn wants goal line plays run as he calls it. In fact Sonny said to Zorn after the game, that he (Sonny) would have changed out of the CP pass. Zorn's response was that he would have pulled Sonny out of the game because he didn't run the play called.

Posted by: TWISI | September 21, 2009 11:51 AM | Report abuse

more whining.....nice...

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | September 21, 2009 11:52 AM | Report abuse

The sooner we are all united in our call to get a professional GM calling the shots, the sooner the Skins win. Not just a game here or there, not just another woulda/coulda/shoulda 4th place in the NFC EAST.
Even the best of players, when submerged in a dysfunctional work culture like this one, aren't going to play to their potential. And after 10 years of mediocrity, what kind of free agents are attracted here? Cha-ching!
Campbell might indeed thrive somewhere else.
In a few more years, Zorn might make a good OC.
But pretending it's happening here, now, is buying these bozos a few more years to blame on the fans, JLC, the quarterback, the coach (they went out on a limb to choose), the players.
Seeing the truth of the situation doesn't make us haters.
Again, if the Skins don't crack .500 this year, can we ALL get onboard with this? If we do, we can influence things. Remember how we influenced the Fassel signing?
I want to believe in this team again.

Posted by: minorthread | September 21, 2009 11:52 AM | Report abuse

I keep seeing praise up here for W. Montgomery, but every time I noticed him yesterday he was either being pushed into the backfield or whiffing altogether. Was it really a mixed bag and I didn't see the plays where he took care of business? Or was I imagining his ineptitude?

Posted by: NateinthePDX | September 21, 2009 11:52 AM | Report abuse

cL - RI is dominating the leader board in your pool. The Underdogs are serving me well. And I will never pick another REdskins game....

Posted by: 4thFloor | September 21, 2009 11:55 AM | Report abuse

"The defense is good but, if what Sam Huff says is true then that can also explain why we still allow critical 3rd down successes against us. And, our D-backs can't cover anyone yet.posted by larryinclinton"

The Rams' success on 3rd down is basically why they were still in the game. They only ran about 50 plays which is probably 10-15 less than you would expect in a competitive game. I'd compare it to the Skins' performance against the Giants.

I didn't see the whole game, but I'd guess the problem from the defense's POV was lack of pressure. Bulger is a very experienced QB and given enough time will check down to somebody who is open. He's aided by the threat of the big RB. Maybe the Skins were so concerned with containing Jackson that sacrificed some pressure.

One thing for sure: St. Louis is not as weak a club as they looked against Seattle.

Posted by: Samson151 | September 21, 2009 11:57 AM | Report abuse

Agreed 4th RI is representing.

Posted by: chrislarry | September 21, 2009 11:58 AM | Report abuse

The stadium should have gone silent after Horton broke up that 4th down pass. The fans should have quietly exited while Campbell took those kneel-downs. The players already know that something is wrong. Apparently you could have heard a pin drop in the locker room after the game.

Posted by: coparker5 | September 21, 2009 11:59 AM | Report abuse

blaming the fans is straight tart. really? C'mon.....

Posted by: chrislarry | September 21, 2009 12:01 PM | Report abuse

Or was I imagining his ineptitude?

Posted by: NateinthePDX | September 21, 2009 11:52 AM | Report abuse

I think you were imagining a little. He did have a couple mistakes, but he didn't give up a sack, held the point of attack pretty well and was certainly driving better than Heyer was on run plays. I thought for what he is (a journeyman swing backup with no real experience) he played well.

Posted by: zjfr2 | September 21, 2009 12:01 PM | Report abuse

"Again...fans aren't to blame for this. Pricing tickets out of affordability for "real" fans did that years ago. The architecture of the stadium doesn't help (at least not compared to RFK), and you overlook the fact that the team HASN'T BEEN GIVEN MUCH TO CHEER FOR!"

The stadium stinks, no argument there, but it is for the moment what we have - much like our owner, there isn't a darn thing we can do about it.

There hasn't been much to cheer for...but when there is, you CHEER. Certainly, you make some noise and support the team in a close game, regardless of whether it "should" be close or not.

So now it's not the fans fault, it's just the "wrong kind" of fans are at the game? Please, there are multitudes of avid fans here, and there is loads of money in this area as a whole. Ticket prices find their market value - that is the way it is. If we don't like it, stop buying them. Until ownership sees the need to bring them down or level them off at least.

Posted by: shaunsherman12 | September 21, 2009 12:01 PM | Report abuse

Randy Thomas going down should not hinder this Team. The O-line will be better. Randy Thomas was one of those guys that did not practice consistently. The O-line won't miss a beat.

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | September 21, 2009 12:02 PM | Report abuse

I'm getting a little tired of the small minds who keep saying that JC isn't part of the problem and laying it all on Zorn. Let's get one thing clear: this is not a either/or situation, it's BOTH. Zorn obviously sucks big time as a head coach. He's in over his head and that is completel obvious now.

But JC is also a mediocre QB at best. Actually, he might be okay if he were in a really good system, with great coaching, but then again that can be said of most all starting QBs in the league today.

As another RI poster pointed out, Campbell is "a 5 on a scale of 1-10. In the right system with competant play calling, he would be OK. This is the wrong system for him with poor play calling. Sadly, he will never be much better than he is now."

I have been a big Campbell supporter, but I now realize that the dude just doesn't have the mental skills to excel as a starting QB. That doesn't take any of the blame off of Zorn, who called a horrible game, especially in the red zone, and who is in way over his head. But the one doesn't take away from the other--Zorn is a suck-a$$ head coach and Campbell a mediocre-to-bad QB. Unfortunately, we don't have a good alternative at either QB or coach at this point (thank you very much Danny/Vinny - i.e. root of all evil), so it will be another miserable season.

Posted by: gringoinmiami | September 21, 2009 12:02 PM | Report abuse

Attitude and trust. Those are two missing ingredients in the red zone offense. Zorn doesn't trust his quarterback to audible. He doesn't trust his wide receivers to run the fade. He doesn't trust the right side of his offensive line to open any holes in the running game. And no one out there seems to have the attitude to get that last yard.

Posted by: RedSkinHead | September 21, 2009 12:03 PM | Report abuse

No what your talking about before you write, he was screaming at him to wait to call the timeout until the play clock had run all the way down.

Posted by: Flounder21 | September 21, 2009 9:36 AM

Wasnt saying Zorn did anything wrong, was basically stating, it doesnt look good when the ST coach is screaming at the HC, whether or not it was helping or not, it looked bad...you could see it on the players faces on the sideline.

Posted by: mhartz1 | September 21, 2009 12:05 PM | Report abuse

touchdowns and extra points were also missing.

Posted by: daggar | September 21, 2009 12:06 PM | Report abuse

Other than Seller's and Thomas' drops, I can't think of any players who played poorly yesterday. This one is ENTIRELY on the coaches.

Posted by: Rypien11 | September 21, 2009 11:51 AM | Report abuse


Think a little harder then......
How about the late hit on the QB that over turned a fumble we recovered.

How about Santana's fumble?

How about you not go with whats trendy, like putting it all on the coaches.

How about some Ginko Biloba for that poor memory of yours.

Posted by: gatorskinz2000 | September 21, 2009 12:07 PM | Report abuse

I think Corny Zorny is dangerously close, if he hasn't already to losing this team.

Posted by: chrislarry | September 21, 2009 12:08 PM | Report abuse

I,m gonna say this cause I am a Redskin blogger and Fan. Hate Dem Cowboys!!! Glad they got rid of TO, because if they had not, he might have helped them beat the Giants. LOL.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | September 21, 2009 12:08 PM | Report abuse

think or hope cl??

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | September 21, 2009 12:10 PM | Report abuse

ok, the Santana thing is starting to really get to me. If the f'ing ref had called the face mask penalty on Atogwe (have you ever had your head pulled back like that?) we have a first down at the ~15 with 1:36 to go in the half.
Of course, we'd settle for a FG, but we wouldn't be calling out Santana Santanadana quite so harshly.

Posted by: daggar | September 21, 2009 12:12 PM | Report abuse

BG? huh. no i don't hope. but you didn't watch the game, you were at NASCAR. Box scores don't tell the whole story.

Posted by: chrislarry | September 21, 2009 12:13 PM | Report abuse

I'm just saying that you've made your point about zorn, you dislike strongly, so I just was looking for some clarity on it...

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | September 21, 2009 12:14 PM | Report abuse

Heyer is making me yearn for Jansen.

Posted by: daggar | September 21, 2009 11:51 AM |

daggar,

I was with you up till this point Heyer is a 100 times better in pass protection. They don't know how good he is in run blocking because they never run that way.

Posted by: Flounder21 | September 21, 2009 12:14 PM | Report abuse

But has Santana done this year??? He let the DB get in his head last week and it hindered his play, this week he fumbled...not saying 100% his fault, but he still fumbled.

He seems uninterested in playing, that is my opinion of what I have seen.

Again, how is it that so many teams WR can make plays, get open and have big games on us, but our WR never seem to be open for the big plays...is it the playcalling, JC holding the ball to much or what???

Since there are so many experts on here on all subjects...any ideas on this?

Posted by: mhartz1 | September 21, 2009 12:16 PM | Report abuse

cl, what makes you say you think he's lost the team?

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | September 21, 2009 12:16 PM | Report abuse

I think Corny Zorny is dangerously close, if he hasn't already to losing this team.

Posted by: chrislarry | September 21, 2009 12:08 PM | Report abuse

I completely agree, and I don't think he helped himself with the 4th down decisions everyone I know watching the game was freaking out with the clock management and the decisions screaming why isn't he kicking, Snyder had to be thinking the same thing. Listening to the interviews of Moss and Campbell after the game, when you start hearing things like "all we can do is try and do the best with what's called" or "yeah I'd like the opportunity to throw the fade to Malcolm, we've been working on it" you get the sense that the next sentence would be "but our dumb*** coach won't call the plays that give us a chance to win" if they could say that. The defense is starting to get there a little too I think, Horton was talking about how he knew he had to make a play on that fumble because 7 points there meant the game might be lost.....wow, he actually believes that 14 points presents an insurmountable level of points for our offense, that's sad. I think IF the go to Motown and get find that ever elusive rhythm JC speaks of, Zorn could be in for a really short season.

Posted by: zjfr2 | September 21, 2009 12:17 PM | Report abuse

Think a little harder then......
How about the late hit on the QB that over turned a fumble we recovered.

How about Santana's fumble?

How about you not go with whats trendy, like putting it all on the coaches.

How about some Ginko Biloba for that poor memory of yours.

Posted by: gatorskinz2000

Seriously? You're using two inconsequential plays to detract the fault from the coaches?

The late hit was dumb, but cost us nothing. They punted a few plays later.

Santana's fumble was our only turnover. If we only turn the ball over once per game, we're fine. It happens. We MIGHT have gotten another FG out of that drive.

Our two drops directly cost us 14 points.

Take a look at the stats - we dominated statistically, but our play inside the 10 didn't reflect that.

We had more time of possession. Fewer penalties. Many more plays, many more first downs. One measley turnover.

JC had as many yards as the Rams did total. Clinton had a good game. The Defense had a good game. Cooley had a good game. Our other WRs DIDN"T GET A CHANCE TO HAVE A GOOD GAME.

Sounds like someone else needs the memory boost...

Posted by: Rypien11 | September 21, 2009 12:17 PM | Report abuse

"They don't know how good he is in run blocking because they never run that way."

Justin Tuck ate Heyer alive in the run game against the Giants. The first play following Hall's INT that game was an off-tackle run to the right, and Tuck blew it up for a 6-yard loss.

But yes, he's been much, much better in pass-protection. The running game has been horrific to that side, however.

Posted by: psps23 | September 21, 2009 12:18 PM | Report abuse

gringoinmiami,
Totally disagree. Did you ever notice a bad quarterback go to another team and he suddenly becomes the second coming of Joe Montana? That has to do with coaching. A good coach uses his players' strengths and covers their weaknesses. I am tired of all of this, "he's not a west coast offense quarterback or a west coast offense receiver", as if the west coast offense is some exclusive club. This is the NFL. If you don't have the players to run your brand of offense, then you invent something else. That's what Zorn needs to do. He doesn't have years to get the players that meet a certain profile. He has to win with what he has or this will be his last year. And if his players do stupid things like miss blocks and drop balls, he needs to coach them out of it.

Posted by: RedSkinHead | September 21, 2009 12:21 PM | Report abuse

OK...so the WR arent given a chance to have a good game??? Is that Zorn's fault, JC's fault or the WR's fault?

I think JC played pretty damn well, WR running the routes well, I dont know what JC sees, but it seems to point to the play calling or lack of trust in the WR?? Still waiting on the perfect answer from all the experts...

Posted by: mhartz1 | September 21, 2009 12:21 PM | Report abuse

Even though I am hard on the Skins for not being in shape, this is still a good Team.

Zorn has more work to do than Campbell. Campbell's approach to the game is still predominantly determined by Zorn.

Campbell will figure this out. If he does it sooner than later, he can save Zorn's butt.

One thing that Campbell must do is convince Zorn that audibling plays on the field may not be a bad thing.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | September 21, 2009 12:22 PM | Report abuse

What was up with CAMPBELL continually getting hit in the face with the football from center yesterday? Did anyone else think the shotgun execution was a little shaky?

Posted by: glawrence007 | September 21, 2009 12:22 PM | Report abuse

But you're absolutely right. The offense has taken one step forward, and one step backward. The good thing is, throughout BOTH games, the Redskins have moved the ball up and down the field through the air very well. The bad thing is that the red zone causes an allergic reaction to Jim Zorn's mind. And the run blocking is really, really bad in goal-line situations. The 3-and-outs have largely been eliminated, multiple different players have been utilized in the offense (8 different receivers were hit for completions, 9 were targeted), but it all comes down to red zone efficiency. And that looks really, really bad right now.

Posted by: psps23 | September 21, 2009 11:46 AM

I don't believe they moved the ball "up and down" the field "throughout" the Giants game. I respect your knowledge but you tend to exaggerate a bit to make a point which weakens your argument. You're satisfied with the passing game and the QB play? Are you talking big step forward or small steps? JC actually looks better to you? He looks the same to me.

Posted by: learnedhand1 | September 21, 2009 12:23 PM | Report abuse

I was with you up till this point Heyer is a 100 times better in pass protection. They don't know how good he is in run blocking because they never run that way.

Week 1 -- Heyer lets Tuck shoot by him, Portis gets credit for a -5 run.
Week 2 -- Heyer still in his crouch as the DE and DT blow past him. At least he could've said "Hey!" like the palace guards in a Monty Python movie.

Jansen was a weak link, I'm pretty confident they slid the protection over to him a lot last year to help him out, and Heyer has stabilized the pass protection somewhat. But he still misses plays in an unacceptable and dangerous manner. He is on the wrong page too often.

Posted by: daggar | September 21, 2009 12:23 PM | Report abuse

psps23,
Do you get the feeling Zorn decided he wasn't going to run to the right side again until he could get Mike Williams in at right tackle? What coach decides on a player to start and then doesn't trust them? Isn't that pretty damning of the front office and the talent he has been given?

Posted by: RedSkinHead | September 21, 2009 12:25 PM | Report abuse

mhartz1:

B/C you haven't read the one you want to see? Just askin'.

Posted by: glawrence007 | September 21, 2009 12:25 PM | Report abuse

cl, what makes you say you think he's lost the team?

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | September 21, 2009 12:16 PM | Report abuse

I would like to know this as well. This statement doesnt go with anything I have heard. Cooley was on DC 101 this morning saying the team was actually pleased with how they moved the ball but upset that they didnt finish.

This statement seems more of a wish or personal opinion with nothing to back it up.


Posted by: gatorskinz2000 | September 21, 2009 12:25 PM | Report abuse

Just because you feel strongly about something that can be perceived as negative, doesn't mean you want it to happen.

That whole "you wanna it to happen (something negative) so you can say that you were right", 85% of the time is bs.

So what if someone doesn't share the same view as you. Look dammit, you're going to have fans that are content with the 'skins beating the Rams the way they did, and your going to have fans that aren't because of the way they did. It doesn't make them less of a fan.

It just brings a different perspective.

I'm probably the last one to suggest you all chill, but damn, it's like reading some "I'm a better fan than you because..." nonsense.

Me, I'm fortunate. I see both sides of the content/discontent fight. Both sides have valid points.

Posted by: RedDMV | September 21, 2009 12:25 PM | Report abuse

I think Zorn, for real, lost this team at some point during the 2nd half slide last year.

His refusal to take accountability and arrogance are the main reasons I think he's lost the players.

Posted by: RedDMV | September 21, 2009 12:28 PM | Report abuse

Had to listen to the game on radio. Heard Sonny and Sam say they should take away Zorn's little card because they could call better plays than he could. Gotta love their alcohol driven frankness!

Posted by: nixx46 | September 21, 2009 12:28 PM | Report abuse

RedSkinHead:

Or of the coaching abilities of ZORN?

Posted by: glawrence007 | September 21, 2009 12:28 PM | Report abuse

The JC haters are mistaken, but then again, anybody who watched Colt Brennan and thought he should be our starter clearly doesnt have much NFL sense.

Watch Romo, Eli, Rodgers, Carson Palmer, ect from yesterday. They all make some terrible throws and big mistakes (palmer has led nfl in 4th quarter ints previously)...but they also get the OPPORTUNITY to make big plays downfield. Vertical throws.

JC does not get those same opportunities to the same extent due to play calling. If you dont call aggressive plays, you wont get big plays without defenders falling down etc.

Truth is, JC is quickly becoming the best player on the offensive side of the ball...and the wins/losses should rest more upon his shoulders than halfback option debacles and fake fgs

Posted by: divi3 | September 21, 2009 12:29 PM | Report abuse

"Campbell Sees Some Encouraging Signs"
_______________________

Keep putting more lipstick on that pig, JC...

Posted by: chasgiffen | September 21, 2009 12:30 PM | Report abuse

RedskinHead, sure it's possible for some QBs to thrive when they play in certain systems or for certain coaches and not for others. No doubt Campbell would be much more successful with a coach who actually knows what he is doing. But, unfortunately, it's become clear to me that JC will never be an outstanding or even very good QB no matter what system and what coach. He's increasingly looking more like Patrick Ramsey, who I thought maybe would excel in another system if given the chance. Turns out that having a big, strong arm is not enough. You have to have a certain level of football intelligence and also the ability to read defenses, know where your receivers are, and make good, split-second decisions.

The more I watch Campbell, the more I realize he just doesn't have those abilities. Granted, it doesn't help having a lousy head coach who apparently doesn't have much confidence in him. But there are lots of plays I watch where the coaching and play-calling don't seem to be the issue, but rather JC's own limitations as a QB. Again, I don't like that, and I'd love to be wrong, because at this point he's still our best option (forget about Collins, I don't think he'd do much better and possibly a good bit worse). But I have very little doubt at this point, having watched JC for all this time, that the dude just doesn't have the skills required of a solid starting NFL QB.

Posted by: gringoinmiami | September 21, 2009 12:30 PM | Report abuse

I did like the way our D stepped it up after we blew it on 4th down. I sure many of us were imagining a receiver breaking a tackle and going 60 yards to put the Lambs in FG range and stealing the game.

Not this time. Orakpo and company get after Bulger and shut the door.

Posted by: edvar | September 21, 2009 12:32 PM | Report abuse

Zorn presser on 980. When asked why he only runs left he said the right side of line is just as important on those plays because they have to block the backside.

Is this dude serious?

Posted by: learnedhand1 | September 21, 2009 12:33 PM | Report abuse

Seems to me that "if" Reinhart isn't the new #1 RG, then I'm missing why he's on the active roster at all. I can understand him being inactive in order to cover G/C with Montgomery, but if he's a one-trick pony then it's time for him to step up -- or go on the practice squad.
Doc Walker wondered aloud this morning if you might see BMW at RG now. Putting him in the interior might give you all the upside without putting too much stress on his (in)ability to work in space. It might also allow us to run right on occasion.
Heyer is making me yearn for Jansen.

Posted by: daggar | September 21, 2009 11:51 AM | Report abuse

Paging Pete Kendall, paging Pete Kendall . . . Would Mr. Kendall please pick up the white courtesy phone?

Posted by: rbpalmer | September 21, 2009 12:34 PM | Report abuse

Zorn's presser on....

It's simialer to Spurrier's pressers...

(HeHe...He just said,'We're all in it together'.....)

Posted by: 4thFloor | September 21, 2009 12:34 PM | Report abuse

Why are we trying to impliment an attack didn't win a championnship in Seattle?

Posted by: kdofour2000 | September 21, 2009 11:05 AM | Report abuse

Well. It won 4 or 5 in San Francisco. Nobody can seriously argue that the west coast system doesn't work. It just doesn't happen overnight (or even in one or two years). This team will be better than last year's barring any more catastrophic injuries.

Posted by: mhaslup1 | September 21, 2009 12:34 PM | Report abuse

And where did Devon Thomas even earn the PT? Why not have Marko Mitchell trying to catch that td?

He has been better on the field and in practice, put him in the game. Screw where they were drafted and what they are paid.

Posted by: divi3 | September 21, 2009 12:35 PM | Report abuse


Zorn presser on 980. When asked why he only runs left he said the right side of line is just as important on those plays because they have to block the backside.

Is this dude serious?

Posted by: learnedhand1 | September 21, 2009 12:33 PM | Report abuse

Probably not just as important, but if the right side isn't at least "effective" you can't run to the left. That is true.

Posted by: mhaslup1 | September 21, 2009 12:36 PM | Report abuse

glawrence007,
All of the above. Fire the lot and get a real front office and coach.

Posted by: RedSkinHead | September 21, 2009 12:36 PM | Report abuse

Samson, I disagree. St.Louis is exactly as weak as they looked against the Seahawks.
The Redskins beat themselves yesterday. Again. Two dropped passes that could have been, should have been TDs. I've said it before, Mike Sellers is as over-rated as LaRon Landry. They both stink, IMO.
Sellers because his best days are behind him and Landry because he's playing out of position and trying to be the next Sean Taylor.
#21 had his share of whiffs going for the big hit highlight reel play, but he made up for it with actual hits and his ability to ballhawk and change games when he picked up fumbles.
#30 has shown none of those talents.
After 50 years of watching the Skins, I'm now looking for other things to do on Sunday.
I can no longer spare the emotional energy it takes.

Posted by: RedskinWillie | September 21, 2009 12:37 PM | Report abuse

Zorn's pressers are eerily similar to Norvals...

Posted by: divi3 | September 21, 2009 12:37 PM | Report abuse

He has been better on the field and in practice, put him in the game.

Methinks Cerrato would get more credit for an all-pro 7th rounder than an all-pro 2nd rounder.
The conspiracy theory that players are getting reps in spite of their performance in practice doesn't make a lot of sense, particularly when the theory comes from someone who can't actually see the practices.

Posted by: daggar | September 21, 2009 12:39 PM | Report abuse

Zorn presser on 980. When asked why he only runs left he said the right side of line is just as important on those plays because they have to block the backside.

Is this dude serious?

Posted by: learnedhand1 | September 21, 2009 12:33 PM

Thanks for clearing that up. I thought I heard him wrong. Confusing.

He's worse than Spurrier at this point....

Posted by: 4thFloor | September 21, 2009 12:39 PM | Report abuse

mhaslup1, sure the right side is important on runs to the left but that is not the reason he isn't running right. If that's the case, let your left side seal the back side on runs to the right.

Posted by: learnedhand1 | September 21, 2009 12:39 PM | Report abuse

It is said often that JC doesn't get a chance to go verticle, and that are WR's aren't given a change to make plays.

I'd agree with this around the redzone, where we seem allergic to throwing the ball INTO the redzone.

Otherwise, they've taken some shots...and missed. First play of the game this week: Kelly is open, but the ball in underthrown.

JC needs to start hitting some of those throws. Having said that, they have moved the ball more effectively this year so far in the air than last.

Also, are the WR's open consistently? I don't think so. Moss has been quiet; ARE has been very good. The WR2 spot? Hmmm...that needs to pick it up, IMO.

Posted by: shaunsherman12 | September 21, 2009 12:41 PM | Report abuse

"The conspiracy theory that players are getting reps in spite of their performance in practice doesn't make a lot of sense, particularly when the theory comes from someone who can't actually see the practices."

There wasnt a single bit of reporting or commenting from any player, nor anything seen in preseason, to suggest Devon Thomas is a better player or had a better camp than Marko Mitchell.

Posted by: divi3 | September 21, 2009 12:42 PM | Report abuse

I would like to know this as well. This statement doesnt go with anything I have heard. Cooley was on DC 101 this morning saying the team was actually pleased with how they moved the ball but upset that they didnt finish.

This statement seems more of a wish or personal opinion with nothing to back it up.


Posted by: gatorskinz2000


And what exactly makes this some sort of endorsement from Cooley RE: Zorn and his faith in him as the leader of the football team?

He could have been simply talking about the 11 guys on offense.

And last I checked this blog is full of personal opinions.

Like the opinion that Tebow is a franchise QB.

Posted by: RedDMV | September 21, 2009 12:43 PM | Report abuse

"The Redskins beat themselves yesterday. Again."

Apparently, they are QUITE a few people up here today that think that we lost the game.

Using that as a springboard. YES - we should have scored two touchdowns and three field goals yesterday, that being said:

1. Only one turnover committed by the 'Skins
2. Good pass protection.
3. Ran for over 100 yards
4. Got Betts in the game for a couple of postive plays
5. Four catches by Kelly.
6. Factoring out the 60 some yard run by Jackson, the defense shut down the Rams. Period.
7. JC only sacked once.

Yes, these are all things that we SHOULD do against a team that will win less than 4 games this year.

However, maybe our view is skewed by the 6-2 start last year. We KNOW that Zorn has to learn on the job.

We put every facet of the game together yesterday, except getting the ball into the end zone. (which is the most important of course)

But the Skins won, showed some postive efforts, and know what they HAVE to work on now.

Posted by: JohnDinHouston | September 21, 2009 12:43 PM | Report abuse

Hey 4th!

Spurrier never, or could have led the team to a 15-1 record.

Sucka!

Posted by: RedDMV | September 21, 2009 12:45 PM | Report abuse

There wasnt a single bit of reporting or commenting from any player, nor anything seen in preseason, to suggest Devon Thomas is a better player or had a better camp than Marko Mitchell.

And yet, one gets all the playing time, the other gets to find out if he's dressing right before game time. That is really all the proof you're going to get.

Posted by: daggar | September 21, 2009 12:45 PM | Report abuse

beep beep

Posted by: daggar | September 21, 2009 12:47 PM | Report abuse

gringoinmiami,
I don't think Campbell is an elite QB, but I think the Redskins could win with him. They need to put him in the right situations. I think putting him in a no-huddle shotgun offense was a good move yesterday and they should try more of that. He used his legs very well and they should continue to give him free reign to pull it down and run it. I read that Zorn said Campbell did not have the option to audible in the red zone. This just sounds wrong to me. You have to give the QB a little discretion in the red zone.

I am not a Campbell fan. I don't think he's a great leader in the huddle, he holds onto the ball too long, he's got a long windup, yadda, yadda, yadda... but the Redskins could win with him if they molded the offense to fit. AND Zorn cannot exactly come forward after defending Campbell the entire offseason and say he was wrong about that.

Posted by: RedSkinHead | September 21, 2009 12:48 PM | Report abuse

I think Zorn, for real, lost this team at some point during the 2nd half slide last year. His refusal to take accountability and arrogance are the main reasons I think he's lost the players.
Posted by: RedDMV
----------------------------------------
Red, you may have seen something I didn't, but I really don't think Zorn is arrogant. I think he is not very smart and too laid back. His press conferences last year were so bad I stopped watching them.

Looking at the bright side, we have a lot of strengths on this team and our Defense is one of the best in the league. Next year I expect we will have a new head coach, a new QB, and figure out how to move the ball.

Shanahan would be a dream come true at this point.

Posted by: isnadd | September 21, 2009 12:48 PM | Report abuse

"I don't believe they moved the ball "up and down" the field "throughout" the Giants game. I respect your knowledge but you tend to exaggerate a bit to make a point which weakens your argument. You're satisfied with the passing game and the QB play? Are you talking big step forward or small steps? JC actually looks better to you? He looks the same to me.

Posted by: learnedhand1"

Alright, I misspoke there. In the Giants game it didn't come throughout, but that was largely because of the lack of possessions held by the offense, as well as the playcalling. Even before his final drive against the Giants, which all of his detractors are claiming padded his stats, he was still connecting on 70% of his passes for 7.75 YPA. The lack of ball movement through the air early in the game was heavily affected by the fact that Campbell didn't have his first traditional drop back until 5 minutes were gone in the second quarter. He only had one attempt in the first, and it was a designed screen pass to Cooley.

I am very satisfied with the passing game between the 20s. By far the weakest point in Campbell's game last season were YPA and the zone between the half line and the redzone in the opponents territory. Those two issues have largely improved.

But I did say red zone efficiency as a whole looks really bad. And it does. Part of that is on Campbell, but a lot of what he's doing is correct. The issue 'plaguing' Campbell in the red zone is the same issue that plagued Campbell in the first quarter of the Giants game -- lack of opportunity provided to him by the head coach. He had 4 attempts in the red zone last game -- on 5 possessions. Four pass attempts -- and 2 of them were drops. It's tough for Campbell to put it in the endzone when the play call on two consecutive red zone drives looked like this: Portis run, Portis run, Portis pass, FG, Betts run, Betts run, Portis run, Portis run.

Posted by: psps23 | September 21, 2009 12:49 PM | Report abuse

Let's see,going into this season the worst-case scenario was something like this:

-Offense is anemic like it was last year.
-Defenseve Line is improved, but our secondary gets burned early and often.
-We loose key OL player early in the season.

So, how are we doing?

(I could go on...)

Posted by: _Stumped_ | September 21, 2009 12:53 PM | Report abuse

The late hit was dumb, but cost us nothing. They punted a few plays later.

Posted by: Rypien11 | September 21, 2009 12:17 PM | Report abuse

Ok, with that statement I will let you live in your delusional world.

In my delusional world, causing a turnover 20 yards out from the endzone is big. The crowd was going nuts, when they overturned the air went out of the stadium very fast. I will take a turnover basically in the redzone over a fielded punt at the our 35 every time. But it cost us nothing

"Our two drops directly cost us 14 points"

And you say this game was ENTIRELY on our coaches. Dont see how you came to this conclusion, but have at it.

Posted by: gatorskinz2000 | September 21, 2009 12:53 PM | Report abuse

Snyder fails at life.
Vinny fails at life.

Zorn is blameless.

Posted by: Randy_Hawkins | September 21, 2009 12:55 PM | Report abuse

'And yet, one gets all the playing time, the other gets to find out if he's dressing right before game time. That is really all the proof you're going to get.'

actually that speaks to very Cerrato conspiracy theory you are trying to negate.

I agree he would get credit for a diamond in the rough wr no one else saw...

BUT..as of now, 9/10ths of his 2008 draft class is either a bust or a nonfactor. And those cost $$$. There's no doubt Vincent needs them to perform to keep his job

Posted by: divi3 | September 21, 2009 12:55 PM | Report abuse

Santana's fumble was our only turnover. If we only turn the ball over once per game, we're fine. It happens. We MIGHT have gotten another FG out of that drive.

Posted by: Rypien11 | September 21, 2009 12:17 PM | Report abuse

That turnover was right before half at the 2:44 mark 30 yards out from scoring. I would say that was all Zorns fault as well using your rational, and that is crazy.

So the difference between the field goals and touchdowns is 8 pts, plus a minimum of 3 pts lost due the fumble is 11 pts.

So we left 11 pts on the field.

Would you still be upset with a 20-7 victory? Those 11 pts are on the players, not the coaches. At least that is how I see it, we obviously view it differently.
Players are paid to perform, and here are 3 distinct plays that the PLAYERS F'D up and cost us 11pts. Not the Coaches.

Posted by: gatorskinz2000 | September 21, 2009 1:00 PM | Report abuse

Yeah, Zorn may be clueless, but Snyder hired a guy who had never called plays or been a coordinator, let alone a head coach before. Snyder hired a QB coach with no play calling experience so him calling crappy plays and looking clueless shouldn't be a shock. Snyder grew up worshiping Joe Gibbs so that's different, but maybe a real head coach with confidence who won't kiss his @ss is too threatening to Danny's ego. I blame him for everything................including the situation in North Korea.

Posted by: nixx46 | September 21, 2009 1:12 PM | Report abuse

Thomas Boswell's piece today is actually very good. This team has a mediocre offense, no matter how hard the fans wnat it to be great.

What does it all mean? Well if you are a leader of this team, as any other organization, the problem needs to be addressed from the top down. So Mr. Snyder, should ask himself, as would a Warren Buffet, or steve Jobs, or Bill Gate, what can I do better?

Mr. Snyder will realize that his choice of GM, whether a nice guy or a friend, has not done a good personnel job for him. His Head Coach, while a nice man, has not done a great job preparing this team. Yes, we do not expect miracles, but we expect a full effort and when it fails, a solution.

Now, I understand that the answer is not always fire everyone and start fresh. But the answer may come after a thorough review, including a review of the reviewers! Assuming that Mr. Snyder will continue to own this team, he needs to start with his own circle and do quality improvement.

As far as a "Jason Campbell" is concerned, he needs to play better, period. Everyone can out perform their scheme and their surroundings. He needs to find out why he cannot find/reach an open receiver and make it happen. Eli Manning, you can just see, sometimes amkes plays of his own, he has a "will" to get the ball to somebody. JC shouldn't just be afraid of interceptions. That is cowardly stuff. He needs to play to win.

Posted by: peaceful2008 | September 21, 2009 1:13 PM | Report abuse

So, when was the last time that the Redskins had a dominant offensive scheme? Do we expect Zorn to improve a team that hasn't played well on the 0 side of the ball in several years in just 18 games?

Posted by: JohnDinHouston | September 21, 2009 1:14 PM | Report abuse

As far as a "Jason Campbell" is concerned, he needs to play better, period. Everyone can out perform their scheme and their surroundings. He needs to find out why he cannot find/reach an open receiver and make it happen. Eli Manning, you can just see, sometimes amkes plays of his own, he has a "will" to get the ball to somebody. JC shouldn't just be afraid of interceptions. That is cowardly stuff. He needs to play to win.

Posted by: peaceful2008


Are you serious? Jason had 1 bad throw (the Kelly miss) and you still give him grief. Zorn has to be the worst and most predictable play caller in the league. Be critical of Campbell when it is deserved and yesterday isn't on him.

Posted by: dcwun | September 21, 2009 1:19 PM | Report abuse

Note to coach Zorn,

Even though you want to keep a positive environment for your team to be successful, by not clearly acknowledging deficiencies, you lower the standards for the players.

The head coach needs to come out after the game and hold players and himself accountable for clear mistakes. Let others give you a break.

It is quite simple really. You cannot do spin and damage control in the NFL. You are better off coming out and take blame for your mistakes and blame others for their mistakes. If you can solve those problems, you'll stay, if not, you are out. Doesn't matter how much you sugar coat it!

Posted by: peaceful2008 | September 21, 2009 1:22 PM | Report abuse

As far as a "Jason Campbell" is concerned, he needs to play better, period. Everyone can out perform their scheme and their surroundings. He needs to find out why he cannot find/reach an open receiver and make it happen. Eli Manning, you can just see, sometimes amkes plays of his own, he has a "will" to get the ball to somebody. JC shouldn't just be afraid of interceptions. That is cowardly stuff. He needs to play to win.

Posted by: peaceful2008


Are you serious? Jason had 1 bad throw (the Kelly miss) and you still give him grief. Zorn has to be the worst and most predictable play caller in the league. Be critical of Campbell when it is deserved and yesterday isn't on him.

dcsun
----------------------

Ok, in that case he needs to go and complain to the coach about play calling and game planning

Posted by: peaceful2008 | September 21, 2009 1:23 PM | Report abuse

Can the Redskins devise plays where a receiver is behid a defender? Can we design plays where the receiver is running towards the end zone beyond the corner back or safety? It seems to this amateur here that would be a good way to get into the end zone. May be it is "low percentage" but how much lower than zero can you go?

if you run up and down the field for 60 minutes and score 3 field goals, why not try throwing some "possible TD" plays for a while and see what happens?

Posted by: peaceful2008 | September 21, 2009 1:27 PM | Report abuse

Haha...Sonny told Zorn he's calling an audible if the call is a hb option. Way to go Sonny.

Posted by: kdofour2000 | September 21, 2009 1:34 PM | Report abuse

So, when was the last time that the Redskins had a dominant offensive scheme? Do we expect Zorn to improve a team that hasn't played well on the 0 side of the ball in several years in just 18 games?

Posted by: JohnDinHouston | September 21, 2009 1:14 PM | Report abuse

Yes we do...have you noticed what the ravens and falcons did? They turned their teams arpund in no time. Stop with the low expectations.

Posted by: kdofour2000 | September 21, 2009 1:39 PM | Report abuse

If you want to blame someone there is plenty to go around equally between coaches and players.
What I saw from section 220 appeared to be a lack of hustle and urgency from too many of the players. Player execution in many cases was as poor as some of the red zone play calling. Dropped balls, fumbles, poor route running, missed blocking assignments and last but not least spotty coverage by the corners. I saw more hustle and better execution from my local Pop Warner Pee-Wee's on Saturday than I did at Fed-Ex on Sunday.
To those of you that say we shouldn't boo the home team, I disagree. I pay for season tickets, therefore I help pay their salaries. I expect a 100% effort from everyone on that field, just as my boss expects from me at my job. Besides they get to practice at it for 5 days, before they make their 1 presentation on Sunday. If everyone got to practice 5 times before they did anything, don't you think you could get it right. Until this team starts to get it right more times than not, I will continue to let my feelings be known good and bad.

Posted by: jswanson51 | September 21, 2009 2:01 PM | Report abuse

During the tenure of Gibbs 1.0, it took him 6 games to figure out what he had as a team and to RESHAPE his game plans to match his players' skills.

During the tenure of Zorn 1.0, it has taken him 18 games to ignore his team's skills and to offer us the Greatest Snore on Turf.

As I see it, the Redskins have exactly three consistent offensive weapons - Cooley, Portis, and Santana Moss. The rest of the offense is for all intents and purposes, the filler in the meatloaf. You can't count on them consistently.

So, you have to maximize what you have and accept that this offense will be pretty boring, but it can be effective:

Point One. We know that the opposing defenses will take away Santana Moss deep - likely double cover him. Throwing to Chris Cooley until the defenses stop him or double him will remove the deep extra coverage; and just for fun, let's start throwing screens to Portis and to Betts. Maybe even have Portis lineup as a wide receiver to give the defenses something to think about.

Point Two - Jason Campbell is more effective in the shotgun and in the no huddle. Keep him in the shotgun and constantly change the tempo of the game - defenses wear out if you keep the ball and no huddle them.

Point Three - The defense will also try to stop Clinton Portis like they will Moss. So use the short passing game with Betts, Davis, and Cooley to remove the eight men in the box - and go no huddle doing it. Once you see eight in a box, initiate no huddle - short to medium quick passing and don't stop - keep the tempo up - use the short passing game as a running game and then spring a run on the defense that is now tired - we had a glimpse of this when Portis was hitting runs for 10 yards or so.

Point Four. Defenses will likely also key in on Cooley so also employ Randle El to the short to medium passing game - giving a fourth passing option to Cooley, Portis/Betts and Moss.

Point Five. Spread the offense out - once the defense is in an eight man front, audible to a four wide receiver formation (using running back in a wide receiver position) and then put the running back in motion - man to man adjust call to a pass, zone hand the ball off quickly.

Posted by: laserwizard | September 21, 2009 2:28 PM | Report abuse

beantown

"...more whining.....nice..."

Ya, I know.

That's why I've avoided this place all day.

It reads like a daycare center for men who need to be put in time out or get back to work.

Posted by: MistaMoe | September 21, 2009 2:34 PM | Report abuse

The fans have a right to boo. I am with the bloggers that says they do.

And too the commentor above that wonders why Mitchell is not ahead of Thomas.

Another instance of penciling guys in who have not earned the right in practice.

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | September 21, 2009 5:06 PM | Report abuse

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