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Haynesworth expected to practice

Defensive tackle Albert Haynesworth, who has missed three of the last four games because of a lingering ankle injury, is expected to participate in practice this week in hopes of returning to the lineup Monday night against the New York Giants at FedEx Field.

"We're going to limit his [practice] reps," Coach Jim Zorn said. "We're going to try to insert him [into practice] and then find out towards the end of the week whether he'll be able to really go or not."

Haynesworth has been slowed by the injury in the first year of a seven-year contract that could be worth as much as $115 million based on performance. In 10 games, Haynesworth has been credited with 29 tackles, including 23 unassisted, and he has three sacks. During the 2008 season, Haynesworth had a personal-best 8.5 sacks and he totaled 14.5 the previous two seasons combined.

Haynesworth regularly draws double teams, freeing others along the line to face one-on-one matchups. Without Haynesworth in the lineup, the Redskins had a season-high eight sacks in Sunday's 34-13 victory over the Oakland Raiders. Haynesworth has a base salary of $6 million this season. He is scheduled to receive a $21 million option bonus in March and his base salary drops to $3.6 million in the 2010 season.

By Jason Reid  |  December 14, 2009; 3:43 PM ET
Categories:  Jason Reid  
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Comments

please let me be first

Posted by: noonefromtampa | December 14, 2009 3:49 PM | Report abuse

I wonder if the presence of Haynesworth is a little bit toxic like Portis's. I wouldn't think so, but they've done really well without him.

Posted by: sugarstreet | December 14, 2009 3:53 PM | Report abuse

"I'm stoked that losers make you happy!"


Who said anything about being happy?

I just don't want the team to draft some other kid who'll have learn the offense, mature, go through tough times, find his game, get resigned, and then reach his potential just after I've lost interest in him.

We were there with Campbell already.

Why go back?

Add to the oline, draft a back, and resign Campbell to a short term deal--he only leaves if the team let's him.

Meantime, you draft a quarterback who's grooming while Campbell plays out the deal.

If he can't get in done in two-three seasons, you plug in the guy who's been sittingon the bench for a couple of seasons.

Explain to me why that's a bad idea.

Posted by: MistaMoe | December 14, 2009 3:56 PM | Report abuse

I wonder how many sacks the skins would have had if Haynesworth was playing.

2 more? 4 more?

Posted by: PortisPocketsStr8 | December 14, 2009 3:56 PM | Report abuse

Less sacks maybe? To quote Zorn "Who knows?"

Posted by: REXskins | December 14, 2009 3:58 PM | Report abuse

If JC plays like this all season, no one complains, right??

past couple of games are the first that the OL has even come close to resembling a real OL and JC has played pretty good, why not help him with building a better OL and seeing what the kid can do, we aint winning the Super Bowl next year regardless, so build around our strengths that are already there and for the future, JC can win in this league if pieces are there to help him...

Posted by: mhartz1 | December 14, 2009 3:59 PM | Report abuse

Add to the oline, draft a back, and resign Campbell to a short term deal--he only leaves if the team let's him.

Meantime, you draft a quarterback who's grooming while Campbell plays out the deal.

If he can't get in done in two-three seasons, you plug in the guy who's been sittingon the bench for a couple of seasons.

Explain to me why that's a bad idea.

Posted by: MistaMoe | December 14, 2009 3:56 PM | Report abuse

That is my ideal plan and what I want to see happen. But not a two or three year thing....Sign JC to the 3 year deal fine, but he has one season as the starter, if he fails to win then either by the end of the year or starting the next year the young guy gets his shot. JC has had his shot, if he is bought back it is with a short leash as should be the case with any 6 year veteran who hasn't won anything ever and has a career record well below .500.

Posted by: zjfr2 | December 14, 2009 3:59 PM | Report abuse

Explain to me why that's a bad idea.

Posted by: MistaMoe | December 14, 2009 3:56 PM | Report abuse

Reason #1: Because it makes sense
Reason #2: Because our owner is named Snyder
Reason #3: We cant win the off season trophy for doing these things.

Posted by: gatorskinz2000 | December 14, 2009 4:00 PM | Report abuse

Archie Manning

Dan Marino

Dan Fouts

Drew Brees

Philip Rivers

Barry Sanders

Pat Ewing


I'll stop now.

Posted by: MistaMoe | December 14, 2009 3:45 PM | Report abuse

You should.

With the exception of Manning, all those guys have been to and won playoffs games.

Campbell hasn't even led his team to a playoff game yet.

Is he the next Archie Manning? Maybe.

That's not something I'd be proud of.

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | December 14, 2009 4:00 PM | Report abuse

dcsween hearts monkeys (except for those really big-nosed ones ... and some of those shiny pink butt baboon ones).

Posted by: dcsween | December 14, 2009 3:32 PM |

dcsween working hard on referring to himself in third person. League-Source thinks dcsween wants to be seen as the new Truth.

Posted by: League-Source | December 14, 2009 3:36 PM

The dcsween wonders whether League-Source isn't the reincarnation of talent evaluator.

Posted by: dcsween | December 14, 2009 4:01 PM | Report abuse

Not that I know, but I don't think Haynesworth is "trouble" in the locker room.

My guess the "me first" or "look at me" players are more of an issue.

Portis, Sellers, Landry

Posted by: noonefromtampa | December 14, 2009 4:01 PM | Report abuse

Add to the oline, draft a back, and resign Campbell to a short term deal--he only leaves if the team let's him.

Posted by: MistaMoe | December 14, 2009 3:56 PM

If he's an RFA, then he can negotiate with any team in the league. If he gets a four-year contract from Carolina, 'Skins have to match it.

Posted by: League-Source | December 14, 2009 4:02 PM | Report abuse

Is he the next Archie Manning? Maybe.

That's not something I'd be proud of.

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | December 14, 2009 4:00 PM

At least not until its time to draft his kids, Peyton Campbell and Eli Campbell.

Posted by: dcsween | December 14, 2009 4:02 PM | Report abuse

YOu cant help but to wonder, how JC would have been playing if JZ wasnt such a control freak, worrrying more about his feet or style of throwing and concerns over trust and not just letting the kid go out and play his style of game, it feels like Zorn has tried too hard to correct EVERYTHING to be perfect.

Perfect is great, but you can win without being perfect...todays news conference he still said, well JC could have done that better or played a little better and we could have done this better...I imagine always having to be perfect causes some pretty big anxiety

Posted by: mhartz1 | December 14, 2009 4:02 PM | Report abuse

Doesnt JC have 7 game winning drives in the 4th quarter?

Posted by: mhartz1 | December 14, 2009 3:54 PM

Where did you get this from? I don't think this is true at all....

Posted by: 4thFloor | December 14, 2009 4:02 PM | Report abuse

It's unfortunate that Fat Albert has deigned that he might want to play again this season. I believe it sends the wrong message to those who believe in showing up, in shape, to practice and play to the best of their given abilities. Perhaps it's only coincidence that the Redskins finally started to show some fire and desire after the overpaid loafers (Hall, Portis, Haynesworth) all took a seat to allow the real players an opportunity.

Posted by: Vic1 | December 14, 2009 4:03 PM | Report abuse

The O-line needs to be addressed regardless of who the QB is in 2010. Same goes for RB.

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | December 14, 2009 4:03 PM | Report abuse

A lot of black fraternaties have hand-signs.

I'd like to see Davis' routine again.

It looked to me like the Kappa Alpha Psi handsign that frat brothers use to acknowledge each other.

Posted by: MistaMoe | December 14, 2009 3:50 PM

I wasn't implying that he was in a gang. He grew up in the Bay Area and went to USC, I'm sure he was giving a shout out.

This is what the NFL is looking for and any hand gesture will lead to a flag. Keep in mind, you've got fat old white guys wearing the stripes and they wouldn't know the difference.

Posted by: Diesel44 | December 14, 2009 4:04 PM | Report abuse

And I love it when JReid underestimates the Skins! Keep what happened to us not being competitive and losing out the rest of our games?

Doom and Gloom....NOT

Posted by: 4thFloor | December 14, 2009 4:04 PM | Report abuse

The dcsween wonders whether League-Source isn't the reincarnation of talent evaluator.

Posted by: dcsween | December 14, 2009 4:01 PM

Absolutely not. talent_evaluator's still around, but he wasn't getting the job done up here. He embarrassed the franchise and, as you pointed out many times, was a loser. I was brought in as an extra set of eyes. Now, I'm calling his plays for him.

Posted by: League-Source | December 14, 2009 4:05 PM | Report abuse

"YOu cant help but to wonder, how JC would have been playing if JZ wasnt such a control freak.."

excellent point that Doc has been making for awhile, once said "Campbell plays like Jim Zorn is holding his family hostage"

almost wrecked my car laughing at the humor and truth in that line

Posted by: divi3 | December 14, 2009 4:06 PM | Report abuse

4th

Fox posted the graphic last week against the saints that JC had 7 game winning or tying drives in the 4th quarter

Posted by: KingJoffeJoffer | December 14, 2009 4:06 PM | Report abuse

Explain to me why that's a bad idea.

Posted by: MistaMoe | December 14, 2009 3:56 PM | Report abuse

That's a great idea and I think we can all agree on that. I'd prefer to draft 2nd - 3rd round quarterbacks every couple years until we hit gold with one. I'd draft Chirstian Ponder next year. I think upper round quarterbacks are too much risk and not enough reward. I also think that you should always be developing a young quarterback. I mean if you strike gold on a late round QB you can trade him for picks. Look at the Pats and Matt Cassel. Look at the Falcons and Matt Schaub.

Schaub was a third rounder. He went for 2 second rounders and a first round swap.

Cassel was a 7th rounder and went for a 2nd rounder.

Of course any young QB would be given a chance to win the job. I don't think you should ever just hand someone the starting job. If campbell beats them out for the next 5-6 year then o well. If he gets beat out next year then o well. Fair is fair and the best player takes all.

Posted by: PAskinsfan17 | December 14, 2009 4:06 PM | Report abuse

If he's an RFA, then he can negotiate with any team in the league. If he gets a four-year contract from Carolina, 'Skins have to match it.

Posted by: League-Source | December 14, 2009 4:02 PM

You left out the most important part...

"skins have to match it" or receive draft picks in return.

Tendering JC has no downside.

Posted by: Diesel44 | December 14, 2009 4:07 PM | Report abuse

Fox posted the graphic last week against the saints that JC had 7 game winning or tying drives in the 4th quarter

Posted by: KingJoffeJoffer | December 14, 2009 4:06 PM

Is this the same Fox that posted graphics showing that George Bush won the war in Iraq 12 times?

Posted by: League-Source | December 14, 2009 4:07 PM | Report abuse

I think someone talked to Landry after last week, none of usual antics after making a decent play.

Posted by: noonefromtampa | December 14, 2009 4:08 PM | Report abuse

Not that I know, but I don't think Haynesworth is "trouble" in the locker room.

My guess the "me first" or "look at me" players are more of an issue.

Portis, Sellers, Landry

Posted by: noonefromtampa
___

Yeah, you are right probably. What I'm trying to say is that maybe the second tier players look at him and think "money" and owner favorite, and maybe it doesn't sit right. Neither does the laying out and forcing your team to take a time out (giving the game away), killing momentum.

Basically, not a team player.

Posted by: sugarstreet | December 14, 2009 4:08 PM | Report abuse

I bought my #98 jersey at training camp

Posted by: dpc2003 | December 14, 2009 4:08 PM | Report abuse

4th, I am looking for it, I thought we all had this discussion a couple of weeks ago and that was stated and confirmed...

Posted by: mhartz1 | December 14, 2009 4:09 PM | Report abuse

"Just trying to be fair and balanced......

Posted by: 4thFloor"

Hey, you haven't seen me on here pining to sign Campbell to a long-term contract, even after his recent form. I'm still where I was before (where I've been all along); that he's more than capable of being a very good QB in this league, provided he has the proper supporting cast. Lately, the supporting cast is supporting my claim. But unlike others, I avoid taking the shortcut definition of a team's record being the end-all, be-all of a QB's capability.

Posted by: psps23 | December 14, 2009 4:10 PM | Report abuse

Jake Locker is returning for his senior year. He was a potential top 5.

Posted by: Diesel44 | December 14, 2009 4:11 PM | Report abuse

Tendering JC has no downside.

which then gives it a lead pipe lock to happen with this team...if there is no downside to this, then we wont want anything to do with it....I mean, that just makes WAY too much sense...

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | December 14, 2009 4:11 PM | Report abuse

I think someone talked to Landry after last week, none of usual antics after making a decent play.

Posted by: noonefromtampa | December 14, 2009 4:08 PM

Hope the same person talks to Fred Davis this week.

Posted by: League-Source | December 14, 2009 4:11 PM | Report abuse

The only JC17 stat that counts is his W-L record... 20-29 to date...

He has never done any better than 8-8 (in 2008) -- and typically has done much worse.

This year's 4-9 record is not an aberation.

He's a loser, pure and simple, and the sooner that he is gone, the better!

Posted by: Vic1 | December 14, 2009 4:12 PM | Report abuse

Just trying to be fair and balanced......

Posted by: 4thFloor | December 14, 2009 3:51 PM

You're too impartial to be "fair and balanced."

Posted by: 4-12 | December 14, 2009 4:14 PM | Report abuse

The only JC17 stat that counts is his W-L record... 20-29 to date...

He has never done any better than 8-8 (in 2008) -- and typically has done much worse.

This year's 4-9 record is not an aberation.

Posted by: Vic1 | December 14, 2009 4:12 PM |

Your numbers don't add up to your conclusion. Between this year and last, he's 12-17. That means the rest of his career is 8-9. That's about the same as his best year. So how can you say that he has "typically done much worse"?

Posted by: League-Source | December 14, 2009 4:16 PM | Report abuse

Tendering JC has no downside.

which then gives it a lead pipe lock to happen with this team...if there is no downside to this, then we wont want anything to do with it....I mean, that just makes WAY too much sense...

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | December 14, 2009 4:11 PM | Report abuse

Agreed, and he should be tendered at the highest level. He's shown enough potential that someone may take a shot and sign him, if not, no big deal keep for a year and see what he can do behind a hopefully rebuilt oline.

But all of this ignores that it looks like Vinny will be in charge again, which all but guarantees at most there may be one oline signing or draft pick and we are for sure drafting a QB round one and letting JC walk and then getting some mid round linebackers and fullbacks who won't even make the team......

Posted by: zjfr2 | December 14, 2009 4:17 PM | Report abuse

I'd draft Chirstian Ponder next year...

Two issues with that for 2010 draft

He's coming off major surgery to his throwing shoulder.

He is currently planning to return to FSU

Maybe 2011 draft though

Posted by: noonefromtampa | December 14, 2009 4:18 PM | Report abuse

if they let JC walk, and get nothing in return, I mean, thats just mind numbingly stupid.....thats a clear case of spider face....as in cutting off your nose...

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | December 14, 2009 4:19 PM | Report abuse

"Sanchez is 6-6

Campbell is 20-29

You do the math

Posted by: MrRedskin21"

So wait, what you're saying is that despite the fact that Campbell has significantly higher completions, completion percentage, yards, TDs, yards per attempt, (lower) INTs, rush yards, and passer rating, Mark Sanchez is the reason why the Jets have a better record than the Redskins?

Really?

Posted by: psps23 | December 14, 2009 4:19 PM | Report abuse

there's no way Danny would bring along a new qb in the rational way mentioned here... drafting low, developing until the right guy is found. All the while letting the starter keep winning the job until he loses it.

These Clausen and the other Colt scouting trips should dash any hopes we have of anything other than jettisoning Campbell and starting over with a rook.

at the very least, JC now looks like the "good guy" and Danny the ahole given the offseason stuff and how he's handled it. No way Danny can have him on the team.

Posted by: divi3 | December 14, 2009 4:21 PM | Report abuse

In 07 and 08 he was 8-12... 6-7 in 2007 and 2-5 in 2006

Point is, he loses more than he wins... consistently.

Posted by: Vic1 | December 14, 2009 4:21 PM | Report abuse

In 07 and 08 he was 8-12... 6-7 in 2007 and 2-5 in 2006

Point is, he loses more than he wins... consistently.

Posted by: Vic1

the same can be said for the entire organization and everyone involved in it.

Posted by: divi3 | December 14, 2009 4:24 PM | Report abuse

correction

W L

2009 - 4 9
2008 - 8 8
2007 - 6 7
2006 - 2 5

Posted by: Vic1 | December 14, 2009 4:24 PM | Report abuse

Campbell's record this year should be 7-6 instead of 4-9.

Suisham lost 2 games.

Zorn being in charge cost the Redskins at least 1.

Not saying he's the best or worst qb. Just that people calling him a loser need to realize it's a team sport.

Posted by: PortisPocketsStr8 | December 14, 2009 4:24 PM | Report abuse

Point is, he loses more than he wins... consistently.

Posted by: Vic1 | December 14, 2009 4:21 PM

Are there other guys on the field or is he the only one? Are we discussing football or tennis?

Posted by: League-Source | December 14, 2009 4:25 PM | Report abuse

So wait, what you're saying is that despite the fact that Campbell has significantly higher completions, completion percentage, yards, TDs, yards per attempt, (lower) INTs, rush yards, and passer rating, Mark Sanchez is the reason why the Jets have a better record than the Redskins?

Really?

Posted by: psps23 | December 14, 2009 4:19 PM | Report abuse

I don't think so, but at the same time why does everyone just assume that no other QB could play well in DC because of all the excuses you make for JC. Todd Collins, he of the zero mobility and noodle arm, had a better 5 game stretch than JC ever had here with the same talent JC was playing with. Sure, Collins got one half this year after no reps since preseason and didn't light the world on fire but still connected on a deep pass to Moss and put more points on the board with the same talent in the same game than JC did. I don't understand why everyone assumes that this team/offense has performed to its absolute capacity under JC and that "nobody" could be successful here. I agree our oline is subpar and we've had issues, but no team is perfect and there are plenty of QBs that put up better stats and win more games than JC. There are also plenty who don't, and I agree, for what our options will be this offseason he's the best we got, but why does everyone just assume that nobody could do any better when a guy with maybe half the physical gifts as JC has outperformed him in his only opportunities.

Posted by: zjfr2 | December 14, 2009 4:28 PM | Report abuse

Locker will keep his room in Seattle
Posted by Mike Florio on December 14, 2009 4:25 PM ET
So the current score is Steve Sarkisian 1, Pete Carroll 0.

The current USC coach was unable in January to talk quarterback Mark Sanchez out of leaving school early. The former USC offensive coordinator and current Washington coach has managed to persuade quarterback Jake Locker to return for another season.

John Taylor of CFT has the details.

Though we're big proponents of guys who are playing for free graduating to the play-for-pay level of the sport when all indications point to the next level wanting, maybe Locker is making the right decision. He probably could use more experience in Sarkisian's pro-style offense. Also, if the expected crush of underclassmen entering this year's draft thins out the 2011 draft pool, it could be even easier for Locker to get to the front of the line next year.

Still, we generally think that a college football player owes no duty to his school or his coach to stick around once the NFL comes calling. We can understand why the coaches want to keep their players -- it helps the coaches keep their jobs and/or get raises and/or land better jobs.

That's the very kind of self-directed thinking that men who play an inherently violent sport are allowed to apply to themselves when the time comes to decide whether to keep helping the coach's family, or to help his own family instead.

Posted by: TWISI | December 14, 2009 4:28 PM | Report abuse

A long time ago, I posted that Vinny was not a bad judge of talent at all, just that he had no idea how to build a team. The 2008 second round draft class was supposed to be an aberration on what actually is a very good track record with finding talent for Cerrato. Now it seems to not be an aberration at all.

If Vinny wasn't so weaselly influential to Snyder, I would say that I'd like to keep Vinny around as a scout. He's still a mental marshmallow when it comes to team-building philosophy, but the guy actually does have an eye for talent.

Posted by: psps23 | December 14, 2009 4:28 PM | Report abuse

So it Clausen or the injured Bradford in rd #1. I'll pass.

Posted by: TWISI | December 14, 2009 4:30 PM | Report abuse

"Sanchez is 6-6

Campbell is 20-29

You do the math

Posted by: MrRedskin21"

the truth about Colt is that coaches and players think the idea of him beating out JC for the starting job is laughable and it's not something that is even considered outside of a certain group of fans.

Posted by: divi3 | December 14, 2009 4:30 PM | Report abuse

In 07 and 08 he was 8-12... 6-7 in 2007 and 2-5 in 2006

Point is, he loses more than he wins... consistently.

Posted by: Vic1 | December 14, 2009 4:21 PM

All of these records being thrown around need to be bullet points on Snyder's, Vinny's, and I hate to say it but Gibb's resume.

Football is the ultimate team game and the person in charge of constructing the team is mostly responsible for the W-L record.

It's simple the FO must tender JC and address OL, RB, OG, OLB, FS, QB, CB in the draft and Free agency.

Posted by: Diesel44 | December 14, 2009 4:31 PM | Report abuse

Well Locker just made it less likely that Clausen will end up a redskin next year by going back to school. Hopefully the skins can win another game or two and they will be out of the Bradford sweepstakes as well. That probably leaves us with McCoy in the second round, but at least they should be able to get a decent tackle like Davis from Rutgers in the first.

Posted by: KingJoffeJoffer | December 14, 2009 4:31 PM | Report abuse

A long time ago, I posted that Vinny was not a bad judge of talent at all, just that he had no idea how to build a team. The 2008 second round draft class was supposed to be an aberration on what actually is a very good track record with finding talent for Cerrato. Now it seems to not be an aberration at all.

If Vinny wasn't so weaselly influential to Snyder, I would say that I'd like to keep Vinny around as a scout. He's still a mental marshmallow when it comes to team-building philosophy, but the guy actually does have an eye for talent.

Posted by: psps23 | December 14, 2009 4:28 PM | Report abuse

on this we can agree, as long as we're talking scouting new talent, he's been a big part of some bad trades and free agent signings which goes back to team building and realizing how established players will fit in your system and team culture, but your right, early and late rounds he's done decently. His middle round picks have been pretty poor though, simply from a positional perspective as in not picking for needs.

Posted by: zjfr2 | December 14, 2009 4:33 PM | Report abuse

4th

Fox posted the graphic last week against the saints that JC had 7 game winning or tying drives in the 4th quarter

Posted by: KingJoffeJoffer | December 14, 2009 4:06 PM


I'm still calling B.S. on that ish. They need to spell those games out.

Off top of my head...

1. Saints '08
2.?
3.?
4.?
5.?
6.?
7.?


..............WAIT...

Posted by: 4thFloor | December 14, 2009 4:34 PM | Report abuse

"He's still a mental marshmallow when it comes to team-building philosophy, but the guy actually does have an eye for talent".

Maybe....but he did have 2 chances to pick DeSean Jackson last year didn't he?

It's great that Thomas and Davis are starting to look what we hoped for, but jeesus, what if it was DeSean Jackson and Malcolm Kelly?

Posted by: ksquare | December 14, 2009 4:34 PM | Report abuse

"but no team is perfect and there are plenty of QBs that put up better stats and win more games than JC."

which ones? that's all i ask really, is what qbs are in similar bad circumstances and are clearly better? Or just the ones that are clearly better? I think the list really isnt that long.

btw- Collins essentially completed 1 pass in that loss to KC, and looked like absolute dog poop otherwise. Why? Because our oline was beyond bad at that point, neither qb's fault there

Posted by: divi3 | December 14, 2009 4:35 PM | Report abuse

Wilbon today on Tony Kornheiser show said "Fred Davis is better than Chris Cooley"

Oh man, I don't know about that...

Posted by: RedskinRay1 | December 14, 2009 4:36 PM | Report abuse

I avoid taking the shortcut definition of a team's record being the end-all, be-all of a QB's capability.

Posted by: psps23 | December 14, 2009 4:10 PM

Add completion percentage to that one too...

I'm looking for a winner, not a stats guy as well....

Posted by: 4thFloor | December 14, 2009 4:37 PM | Report abuse

Jake Locker is returning for his senior year. He was a potential top 5.

Posted by: Diesel44 | December 14, 2009 4:11 PM

Which essentially guarantees him a season ending injury mid-season next year.

Posted by: dcsween | December 14, 2009 4:37 PM | Report abuse

My guess the "me first" or "look at me" players are more of an issue.

Portis, Sellers, Landry
---------------------------------------------

Of this group I would say that Portis is the worst. The owner gives him his own radio show, allows him to disrespect the coach in the open media, and exempts him from the preseason and practice. I blame Snyder for allowing Portis to get out of control.

Against such a system I can understand why Zorn has had difficulties keeping the team disciplined. How can any coach get the respect of his players if they know that all they have to do is go to the owner who will then take their side? And what message does it send to the morale of the other players when someone like Portis gets extra-favorable treatment from upper management? Under such a system even a coach like Bill Parcells or Mike Singletary would find it hard to achieve cohesion and discipline.

This is one issue that people haven't mentioned as much. I don't know why Snyder doesn't get that allowing one man out of 53 roster (Portis) to get all these (at least in my opinion) unearned perks will lower morale. I can only imagine how it feels to work hard and do well, only to see one player to receive special treatment that he just hasn't earned.

In the offseason and going forward one major change that upper management needs to implement is an end to the "me first player" enabling. The owner and GM need to back up the coach when players whine.

Posted by: jiacinto | December 14, 2009 4:38 PM | Report abuse

Random thoughts:

1. Yes, the Redskins have been behind 7 times in the 4th quarter and won those games when JC was the QB; he just ain't done it in the last two minutes.

2. League Source = Talent Evaluator

3. Do those of you who use the won-loss record when Campbell is QB REALLY think there's some sort of exact analogy to say, pitchers in baseball?

There's not. At least not exactly. Steve Carlton won 20 games for a Phillies team that lost over 100 one year. He kept the other teams from hitting the ball. An NFL QB has a few less things under his control.

Posted by: JohnDinHouston | December 14, 2009 4:39 PM | Report abuse

Maybe....but he did have 2 chances to pick DeSean Jackson last year didn't he

Not to defend Vinny because I cant stand him, but the last thing we needed was another smurf receiver. You are also assuming that he would be as effective as he is in Philly if he was here. The bomb McNabb threw after the Giants took the lead never would have happened here because JC would never have time the 6-7 seconds it took for him to get open.

Posted by: KingJoffeJoffer | December 14, 2009 4:40 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: zjfr2 | December 14, 2009 4:28 PM | Report abuse

The wide receivers were very young and inexperienced.

The offensive line fell apart and the running game went with it.

The play calling and play design was bad.

These weren't just excuses they were facts and can be proven. You guys brish this stuff off as excuses but it's real. We have Devin Thomas's scouting report that says not to expect anything out of him for 2 years. He went to Michigan State and played in a very rudimentary offense. He had to learn the fundamentals like where to line up, how to block, and how to run routes. We have Jim Zorn running left 5 times in a row including once into a stacked line. We have Zorn still calling 7 step drops when JC is getting sacks 5-6 times. We have Portis flopping over after a 3 yard gain. We have BMW and Heyer whiffing blocks. It's all on tape.

That's why when the receivers gained experience, the play calling/design was handed over to Sherm Lewis, and we signed Levi Jones/Quinton Ganther the offense became really good. That's why we did those things instead of replacing the QB. The QB isn't has never been the issue here.

Posted by: PAskinsfan17 | December 14, 2009 4:40 PM | Report abuse

All of these records being thrown around need to be bullet points on Snyder's, Vinny's, and I hate to say it but Gibb's resume.

Football is the ultimate team game and the person in charge of constructing the team is mostly responsible for the W-L record.

It's simple the FO must tender JC and address OL, RB, OG, OLB, FS, QB, CB in the draft and Free agency.

Posted by: Diesel44 | December 14, 2009 4:31 PM | Report abuse

Can everyone stop throwing Gibbs under the bus. He made some poor personnel decisions but he made some good ones too and he got us in the playoffs two of four years, and left a playoff roster with the needs of finding a FS, a 2nd WR, and oline depth. He left a strong coaching staff and a team that had banded together through a tragedy. Snyder than denied GG the chosen successor, fired Al Sunders (both of whom have gone on to be successful, and who had planned to give Collins a shot at starting), and let the roster totally deteriorate while forcing a system ill-suited for their talent and QB on the team and forcing the QB and coaches on an under qualified coach. Gibbs wasn't perfect, but the state we're in now isn't on him.

Posted by: zjfr2 | December 14, 2009 4:40 PM | Report abuse

"Maybe....but he did have 2 chances to pick DeSean Jackson last year didn't he?"

He did, but to both his credit and detriment, he said that while Jackson was the most NFL-ready receiver in the draft, he didn't want to take him because he was another "small" WR.

Hence, his judgment of Jackson's talents weren't missed, but his weak philosophical justifications got in the way.

Posted by: psps23 | December 14, 2009 4:41 PM | Report abuse

"I'm looking for a winner, not a stats guy as well....

Posted by: 4thFloor"

you think Sanchez is a winner? He was ok for a few weeks before there was any pro film on him. As soon as there was, he started throwing picks all over the place and hasnt looked good since maybe week2.

Benched.

but if that's what qualifies as a winner, so be it...

Posted by: divi3 | December 14, 2009 4:41 PM | Report abuse

He's still a mental marshmallow when it comes to team-building philosophy, but the guy actually does have an eye for talent.

Posted by: psps23 | December 14, 2009 4:28 PM

Damning a GM with faint praise. Its the mental marshmallow part that's the problem ... or at least, the symptom. The problem is that The Owner views himself as the team builder based on all of his vast knowledge of the game. If you recall the lockerroom rant from one of the games last year, "We play physical, we win!" Genius that guy. I wouldn't have a problem with Cerrato so much under a different owner, but whatever strengths he has in spotting talent are prostituted and thus squandered by doing whatever it is that he does for The Owner to enable his moron approach to building a team.

Posted by: dcsween | December 14, 2009 4:42 PM | Report abuse

1st to say ALL 32 TEAM had a chance to pick DeSean JAckson 2/3 times. All of them. HE did go in round 2...DIDN'T HE???

Leading your team to a FG should not count in the 7 4th QTR come from behind to tie or take lead....unless it was to win the game...All a tie is for the other team to go down and score with 2 mins left...

Posted by: 4thFloor | December 14, 2009 4:43 PM | Report abuse

A long time ago, I posted that Vinny was not a bad judge of talent at all, just that he had no idea how to build a team. The 2008 second round draft class was supposed to be an aberration on what actually is a very good track record with finding talent for Cerrato. Now it seems to not be an aberration at all.

If Vinny wasn't so weaselly influential to Snyder, I would say that I'd like to keep Vinny around as a scout. He's still a mental marshmallow when it comes to team-building philosophy, but the guy actually does have an eye for talent.

Posted by: psps23

I agree with this to a large degree. It's hard to separate Vinny and his assessments from others that might contribute, but overall, he'd done OK at drafting guys. Pro free agents/trades, not so much. Character. Not so much.

As for building a team, absolutely clueless. 100% agree. If you could look at what he drafted without knowing the results, you'd guess that this team would have too many TEs and not enough OL.

Its not rocket science. Draft 4 guys to fill one spot, you fill the spot and then some. Draft 4 guys to fill 5 spots, and you get holes.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | December 14, 2009 4:43 PM | Report abuse

Steve Carlton won 20 games for a Phillies team that lost over 100 one year. He kept the other teams from hitting the ball. An NFL QB has a few less things under his control.

Posted by: JohnDinHouston | December 14, 2009 4:39 PM

1. Maybe if he chewed tobacco he'd have more under his control?

2. JohnDinHouston is a guy named John D. who lives in Houston, not John Din Houston?

Posted by: League-Source | December 14, 2009 4:45 PM | Report abuse

'1st to say ALL 32 TEAM had a chance to pick DeSean JAckson 2/3 times'

all 32 teams didnt draft 3 other pass catchers in the same draft tho

Posted by: divi3 | December 14, 2009 4:46 PM | Report abuse

The only JC17 stat that counts is his W-L record... 20-29 to date...

He has never done any better than 8-8 (in 2008) -- and typically has done much worse.

This year's 4-9 record is not an aberation.

He's a loser, pure and simple, and the sooner that he is gone, the better!

Posted by: Vic1 | December 14, 2009 4:12 PM | Report abuse
_______________

The Redskins as a franchise are under .500 since Joe Gibbs retired after the 1992-93 season, so I don't think it's fair to lay JC's record out as a complete indictment of him. JC's completion percentage this season - 65.6% - is, at least according to the Washington Post, the second highest for a season in Redskins history, behind only one of the seasons of the great Sammy Baugh. He's been sacked, what, 36-40 times (is that right?), third highest in the league, and hit a whole bunch more. He's not had a strong running game to speak of this season, aside from a couple of performances here and there. His offensive line has been an atrocious disaster all year. He's looking better and better all the time and is starting to develop chemistry with Davis and Thomas. In my humble opinion, the Redskins would be idiots to draft a first round QB (which probably means they'll do it). They should absolutely use the first rounder (if not more) on the best OLT they can find, whether it's Okung or someone else. Is Campbell a future HOFer? Doubtful, but I think he's far from the biggest problem. And while I have faith (perhaps misguided) that Portis will be back to form next year, they need to think about his replacement - 2nd round RB perhaps? I'm okay with drafting a 2nd - 7th round QB, developing him, and hoping to strike gold, but I really have no taste for watching Colt McCoy (who's only a mediocre prospect, in my opinion) or Jimmy Clausen (better than McCoy but not great) throw for a 52% completion rate, a million interceptions and get crushed by sacks when we had a guy whose better than that right now and is still getting better. I don't think that either of those guys have JCs arm. Let's improve the team around JC and see what he can do.

Posted by: skinsfan713 | December 14, 2009 4:47 PM | Report abuse

"Add completion percentage to that one too...

I'm looking for a winner, not a stats guy as well....

Posted by: 4thFloor"

It's got to be both. I've always been a big believer in his overall abilities (and I believe his current stats and consistent progress each season are proving me right on that), but I'm still skeptical about him reaching that final level of passing the "all that matters is wins" test. Which is why you're not seeing me go crazy over his latest performances, even though I truly believe he can be that guy.

Posted by: psps23 | December 14, 2009 4:48 PM | Report abuse

phillies just got halladay....doc, that is...

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | December 14, 2009 4:48 PM | Report abuse

Looking long term, I'd prefer DT11 over DeSean Jackson.....

Once his legs leave him in 2 years, he'll be nada.....

Remember the once great Devin Hester? Not great anymore....

And DeSean went to a veteran team. Whose to say he would have done the same thing down here as he's doing up there? Or given the opportunity?

Posted by: 4thFloor | December 14, 2009 4:48 PM | Report abuse

Wilbon today on Tony Kornheiser show said "Fred Davis is better than Chris Cooley"

Oh man, I don't know about that...

Posted by: RedskinRay1
____

He might be.

But did Jason throw as much to Cooley as Davis?

Posted by: sugarstreet | December 14, 2009 4:48 PM | Report abuse

both

Posted by: JohnDinHouston | December 14, 2009 4:49 PM | Report abuse

beeps

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | December 14, 2009 4:50 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: zjfr2 | December 14, 2009 4:40 PM

Dude, I think the fact that Gibbs went to the playoffs 2 out of 4 years with the structure of this organization reaffirms his genius. They should put a second bust in the HOF for Gibbs 2.0.

As far as Gibbs the GM...Not so much.

This isn't the NBA where a player can when a championship, it takes an organization to win in the NFL.

Posted by: Diesel44 | December 14, 2009 4:50 PM | Report abuse

"but no team is perfect and there are plenty of QBs that put up better stats and win more games than JC."

which ones? that's all i ask really, is what qbs are in similar bad circumstances and are clearly better? Or just the ones that are clearly better? I think the list really isnt that long.

btw- Collins essentially completed 1 pass in that loss to KC, and looked like absolute dog poop otherwise. Why? Because our oline was beyond bad at that point, neither qb's fault there

Posted by: divi3 | December 14, 2009 4:35 PM | Report abuse

Vince Young came into a winless team and has won 6 of 7.

Aaron Rodgers
Big Ben
David Garrard

have all been sacked more than JC and have better records and numbers

Brett Favre
Donavon McNAbb (despite not playing in two games)
Tony Romo
Joe Flacco
all have been sacked in the high 20s which is not that far from JC's 33 and they all have better numbers and records.

Jamarcus Russel
Jay Cutler
and Matt Cassel
are the only ones that have similar sack numbers yet worse numbers and the Raiders have the same record, the Bears have a better record and the Chiefs beat us.

Posted by: zjfr2 | December 14, 2009 4:51 PM | Report abuse

'1st to say ALL 32 TEAM had a chance to pick DeSean JAckson 2/3 times'

all 32 teams didnt draft 3 other pass catchers in the same draft tho

Posted by: divi3 | December 14, 2009 4:46 PM | Report abuse

The only tackle we missed out on was John Greco. He was the only tackle taken between Fred Davis and Chad Rhinehart.

Posted by: PAskinsfan17 | December 14, 2009 4:51 PM | Report abuse

Redskins need a new GM to rebuild the team. Lot of holes still need to be filled besides the O-Line including 2 CB's, a free safety, and a worthy successor to London Fletcher. We may need a LB if Rocky McIntosh leaves. Too many holes for this team to complete unless it starts the rebuilding proces.

Posted by: wizfan89 | December 14, 2009 4:52 PM | Report abuse

zjfr2,

so what you're saying is we should pursue any of those qbs and that would be an upgrade?

Posted by: divi3 | December 14, 2009 4:55 PM | Report abuse

"He did, but to both his credit and detriment, he said that while Jackson was the most NFL-ready receiver in the draft, he didn't want to take him because he was another "small" WR".

You can't have it both ways. This team needed offensive playmakers, which included O Line. Why wouldn't you take the most NFL ready? So it'd be better to wait a few years to see how a bigger WR pans out? Jackson's already a star.


Weak philosophical justifications? Please.....as if he even has any.

Vinny f'd up by going WR-TE-WR, Vinny f'd up not taking Jackson, Vinny f'd up not replinishing the O line sooner, and clearly Vinny f'd up endorsing Zorn as the hire for HC.

F Vinny!

Posted by: ksquare | December 14, 2009 4:59 PM | Report abuse

the truth about Colt is that coaches and players think the idea of him beating out JC for the starting job is laughable and it's not something that is even considered outside of a certain group of fans.

Posted by: divi3 | December 14, 2009 4:30 PM |
-----------------------------------

And your source that both coaches and players find it "laughable" is?

Eh?

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | December 14, 2009 5:01 PM | Report abuse

zjfr2,

so what you're saying is we should pursue any of those qbs and that would be an upgrade?

Posted by: divi3 | December 14, 2009 4:55 PM | Report abuse

No, that's not what I said, I said JC should come back at a reasonable price and we should fix our other problems. But I don't get why you all just assume that JC is doing the best he possibly can do because of the excuses you make for him. I've watched every game and there are multiple times in every game where he misses wide open receivers, makes bad reads, and falls short at key moments. The play of the oline hasn't helped and I admit he has a tougher job than some in the league but he hasn't played particularly well until recently is all I'm saying and that recent good play has produced one win against the Raiders and now all of a sudden we don't have a qb issue and he's just fine if we just get a couple olineman? come on....

Posted by: zjfr2 | December 14, 2009 5:02 PM | Report abuse

"Maybe....but he did have 2 chances to pick DeSean Jackson last year didn't he"

Not to defend Vinny because I cant stand him, but the last thing we needed was another smurf receiver. You are also assuming that he would be as effective as he is in Philly if he was here.

Posted by: KingJoffeJoffer | December 14, 2009 4:40 PM

I make that assumption as well. I would swap Philly's smurf for either of the Skins smurfs straight up ... frankly, I'd throw in a second day pick ... and a ham sandwich.

Posted by: dcsween | December 14, 2009 5:04 PM | Report abuse

So wait, what you're saying is that despite the fact that Campbell has significantly higher completions, completion percentage, yards, TDs, yards per attempt, (lower) INTs, rush yards, and passer rating, Mark Sanchez is the reason why the Jets have a better record than the Redskins?

Really?

Posted by: psps23 | December 14, 2009 4:19 PM |
-----------------------------

Who is the reason the Jets have a better record than the Redskins then? Kellen Clemens?

The Jets roster is not as talented as the Skins, not by a long shot. I get to see all the Jets games where I live.

Sanchez is pretty good so far, he's 6-6, and he's a ROOKIE, not a 5-year veteran.

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | December 14, 2009 5:05 PM | Report abuse

I HATE TO SAY THIS FOLKS BUT VINNY HERE TO STAY..ALOT OF FOLKS WANT THE GUY TO BE FIRED BUT NOBODY HAS GIVEN THIS DUDE CREDIT FOR BUILDING A SOLID D FENCE HERE IN WASHINGTON.. NOW, I'M NOT SAYING I WANT THIS GUY AROUND BUT LET'S AT LEAST GIVE THIS DUDE CREDIT FOR BUILDING A D DENCE.. NOT TO MENTION DRAFTING MY GUY MR. TAYLOR

Posted by: taylormade218 | December 14, 2009 5:43 PM | Report abuse

Please Zorn - give Marko Mitchell, Malcolm Kelly, and Devin Thomas all the wr reps for the remainder of the season.

Posted by: coparker5 | December 14, 2009 8:38 PM | Report abuse

Leave all the prima donna players off the
starting line-up, and the sidelines, during the next game, even if they return "healthy". All players who were there in Oakland deserve to start the next game. They all played w/ heart and vigor, except ARE who a vy bad day (we all do). He
should sit and watch for awhile, at least until he gets football back into his mind instead of whatever else he has on his mind at present. I hope someone spoke to Davis about how that penalty could have been disastrous for the entire team. No one likes a show off. Be humble; it will be noticed more!

Posted by: DeployedFan | December 15, 2009 2:42 AM | Report abuse

21 friggin Million $$ for WHAT???? for his oscar poerformances of flopping on the ground? For his "breath right" nose bandages?? Give me some of that money and I'll run through brick walls every day for the Redskins....GEEEESH!

Posted by: wagenstill | December 15, 2009 6:59 AM | Report abuse

21 friggin Million $$ for WHAT???? for his Oscar performances of flopping on the ground? For his "breath right" nose bandages?? Give me some of that money and I'll run through brick walls every day for the Redskins....GEEEESH!

Posted by: wagenstill | December 15, 2009 7:00 AM | Report abuse

Portis карманы прямой

BOYCOTT $NYDER=FIRE CERRATO=JERRY JONES IS A DICK HEAD!

Posted by: hessone | December 15, 2009 7:45 AM | Report abuse

Schockey replaced by Boss; Cooley will be replaced by Davis in 2011.

Posted by: smokeybear2 | December 15, 2009 5:07 PM | Report abuse

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