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Samuels Does Not Know How Long He'll Be Out

Pro Bowl left tackle Chris Samuels -- ruled out of Sunday's game against the Kansas City Chiefs because of a neck injury -- does not know how long he will be sidelined and is scheduled to be re-evaluated next week, he said today before practice at Redskins Park.

"Just kind of waiting right now to let everything calm down," Samuels said. "I'm positive, though. I think everything will turn out fine."

Samuels was injured on the Redskins' second play from scrimmage in the 20-17 loss to the Carolina Panthers. Hit hard by a Carolina defensive end on the snap, Samuels suffered what team medical personnel diagnosed as a stinger. Because of a tingling sensation he experienced, Samuels, who has played with the spinal condition of stenosis since high school, was held out of the remainder of the game for precautionary reasons.

"The guy bull rushed me, and I just got a bad stinger. It kind of shot down my arms a little bit," Samuels said. "Just kind of an electric feeling."

The plan is for Samuels to meet with team physicians Tuesday in an effort to determine his status for the remainder of the season. Samuels did not rule out the possibility of sitting out the Redskins' final 11 games.

"You have to take it all into account," said Samuels, who has remained in the lineup despite a knee problem. "Any time you're dealing with your spine, you've got to be safe about it. I've got to meet with then [doctors] to find out the ups and downs of it. I'm just staying positive. We'll see what happens."

By Jason Reid  |  October 14, 2009; 12:52 PM ET
Categories:  Jason Reid  
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Next: Anthony Montgomery Being Shopped Around

Comments

Rumor has it Jon Gruden will be the next HC.

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | October 14, 2009 12:56 PM | Report abuse

All fans can do is pray for wisdom for Snyder. Cerratto is an off season problem to be addressed. Like the O line (yes, should've been fixed previously). Bugel shouldn't take blame for the lack of talent on the line. Why should Zorn for an offense led by an illiterate QB?

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2009/oct/14/thom-loverro-who-should-play-qb-is-reasonable-ques/


This one move can greatly improve DC's playoff chances in 2009.

Too bad The Post's writers' seem unwilling to call blue sky blue or gray sky gray.

Posted by: Realness1 | October 14, 2009 12:57 PM | Report abuse

Looks like the season is even that much closer to being completely over. I figured it was pretty much done when they fell apart in the second half of the game, but us fans can't catch a break. Anyone know if Levi Jones or Langston are still available?? at this point, a cardboard cut out of the G-mens offensive line is probably going to be more athletic than this duct tape and glued line we will have for the rest of the year

Posted by: PanteraCFH | October 14, 2009 12:57 PM | Report abuse

Safety first big man

Posted by: CheyenneWY | October 14, 2009 12:58 PM | Report abuse

That rumors been circulating for several days now. Nothing new.

Posted by: bighairedaristocrat | October 14, 2009 12:58 PM | Report abuse

Chris Samuels is a wonderful player and deserves the best. Whatever that turns out to be.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | October 14, 2009 12:59 PM | Report abuse

I FULLY understand the vitriol on bringing in a Cowsuck to coarch.

I don't share the feeling in regards to JJ, 'cause he was my ballcoach FIRST (broke my heart to see my skins pan on 'Canes and let Dallas take 'em).

Now, for those so vehemetly opposed, imagine this: in a Favreian turnaround we take a Cowsuck and make him a true Skin - pounding the owner that spurned him and taking our team to great highths!

...ok...not gonna happen, but still a nice dream. Imagine how the forlorn the Cowsuck fans would be.. hehehehehehehehehehhe

Posted by: DikShuttle | October 14, 2009 1:02 PM | Report abuse

I saw that an LT for another team (forget who) is out for the season with a neck stinger. Don't want to fool around with those.

Posted by: skinswest | October 14, 2009 1:02 PM | Report abuse

Didnt catch the game this past weekend, did the Skins deploy any two TE sets to help the fledgling line?

Posted by: CheyenneWY | October 14, 2009 1:02 PM | Report abuse

Rumor has it Jon Gruden will be the next HC.

I don't see why Chucky would want to come here... had likes to have about 18 QBs on the roster, and we only have 3.

Posted by: daggar | October 14, 2009 1:02 PM | Report abuse

levi yes, langston no, I believe he signed with the raidahs...

somewhat surprised they haven't brought anyone in for a look see...

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | October 14, 2009 1:02 PM | Report abuse

All fans can do is pray for wisdom for Snyder. Cerratto is an off season problem. Like the O line (yes, should've been fixed previously). Bugel shouldn't take blame for the lack of talent on the line. Why should Zorn for an offense led by an illiterate QB?

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2009/oct/14/thom-loverro-who-should-play-qb-is-reasonable-ques/


This one move can greatly improve DC's playoff chances in 2009.

Too bad The Post's writers' seem unwilling to call blue sky blue or gray sky gray.

Posted by: Realness1 | October 14, 2009 12:53 PM

Yeah, this would be entertaining for about 3 plays, when the immobile Collins is finally broken in half. Have you already forgotten what he looked like in the Seattle playoff game when he threw 2 pic-sixes under pressure?

Posted by: Alan4 | October 14, 2009 1:03 PM | Report abuse

REPOST, Natch,

“Snyder, when it comes to generating income, is the best in the game.

Snyder, when it comes to getting his team to win football games, is closer to the bottom of the league. That, too, starts with ownership.”

From: WILBON COLUMN

This may help you understand how Snyder ratiionalizes his performance as a Redskin owner. When I was in college I had a fraternity brother who was 5’3” Good guy, but needless to say, often kidded about his lack of height. His standard response? “Yeah, but I’m big where it counts” and then he’d point to his crotch.

In that loose affiliantion of millionaires and billionaires to which Snyder is a card-carrying member, how one performs on the field is far less important than the bottom line. The rest of us see what a fallacious argument that is and think him a stone loser. But in HIS world, to HIS peers, Dan still thinks of himself as the King.

And by the way, ex-Cowboy or not, Jimmy Johnson is spot on.

Posted by: TheCork | October 14, 2009 1:03 PM | Report abuse

Didnt catch the game this past weekend, did the Skins deploy any two TE sets to help the fledgling line?

Posted by: CheyenneWY | October 14, 2009 1:02 PM

On Portis' TD, they deployed a 4 TE set (Cooley, Yoder, Davis, and Sellers).

Posted by: dcsween | October 14, 2009 1:04 PM | Report abuse

This one move can greatly improve DC's playoff chances in 2009.

Too bad The Post's writers' seem unwilling to call blue sky blue or gray sky gray.


The fact that one of Loverro's main points is that Sonny says the skins would be 4-0 if Collins started leads me to believe that article is garbage. He doesnt mention the line problems or problems with other personnel. He only made a small comment regarding Cerrato's role in this mess. The Post's writers arent paid by Snyder like Loverro is. That fact that he works for Snyder's radio station makes it a conflict of interest for him to put management on full blast like anybody else who has seen this team week in and week out.

Posted by: KingJoffeJoffer | October 14, 2009 1:07 PM | Report abuse

"The first five weeks of the season have led to the widespread belief that Jim Zorn's got about as much time left in the nation's capital as a Congressman found in a hotel room with three dead prostitutes."
(From: http://nfl.fanhouse.com/2009/10/13/jon-gruden-atop-dan-snyders-wish-list-to-coach-redskins/)

Actually this may be a bad analogy based on the last 5 years or so of Congressional misbehavin' this means Zorn is HC for life.

Posted by: sfskin | October 14, 2009 1:08 PM | Report abuse

The plan is for Samuels to meet with team physicians Tuesday in an effort to determine his status for the remainder of the season. Samuels did not rule out the possibility of sitting out the Redskins' final 11 games.-_RI

Dear Chris,

Don't JUST meet with Redskin doctors, bring in a specialist who doesn't answer to Dan Snyder as well as Hypocrites.

If THESE DOCTORS say there is even a CHANCE you may become paralyzed while in the normal course of events playing tackle, for God's sake RETIRE.

You have no more to prove as a Redskin. With Snyder running the show, you'll be out of football anyway by the time the Redskins challenge anyone--if they ever do.

Think of your family and the fifty or so more years you have on this planet.

And go with our blessings.

Personally, I of course hope you will get a clean bill of health and continue playing the sport you love. But please make sure that clean bill coms from an independent source.

Posted by: TheCork | October 14, 2009 1:08 PM | Report abuse

rumor has it that Snyder is in Japan scouting Sumo wrestlers to play for the skins

To make space on the roster he will release Haynesworth, Portis, and Cooley

Posted by: pabrian2003 | October 14, 2009 1:08 PM | Report abuse

Let's give Tre Johnson a call and see what he is up to.

Posted by: Alvin_Walton | October 14, 2009 1:09 PM | Report abuse

I appreciate all that Samuels has given to this organization. I hope that he'll end up ok and then retire soon after.

Posted by: BREV1 | October 14, 2009 1:10 PM | Report abuse

Sonny actually believes Todd Collins would have been 4-0 before the Carolina game?

I'm sorry, but age must be catching up with him. Collins is not anymore familiar with this offense than Campbell, and far less mobile. How in the world would he be an upgrade when our O-line would have him be a sitting duck back there?

I just don't see it, Sonny.

Posted by: shaunsherman12 | October 14, 2009 1:10 PM | Report abuse

Samuels out for an indeterminate period ... that's comforting ....

Posted by: dcsween | October 14, 2009 1:10 PM | Report abuse

Actually this may be a bad analogy based on the last 5 years or so of Congressional misbehavin' this means Zorn is HC for life.

Posted by: sfskin |

Is that you, Senator Craig?

Posted by: TheCork | October 14, 2009 1:10 PM | Report abuse

...oh yeah, about Gruden...GREAT!


Can he block?

Posted by: shaunsherman12 | October 14, 2009 1:11 PM | Report abuse

corky, that was about the cheapest of cheap shots....to suggest that the team would put Chris's health secondary, is really bush league....

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | October 14, 2009 1:12 PM | Report abuse

does anyone care what Dan Snyders religion of choice is??

I could not care less....

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | October 14, 2009 12:53 PM

---------

You should care.

Scientology is no ordinary religion.

It's a cult.

Posted by: Chia_Pet | October 14, 2009 1:12 PM | Report abuse

Well said, Cork.

Posted by: RedDMV | October 14, 2009 1:14 PM | Report abuse

Yeah, this would be entertaining for about 3 plays, when the immobile Collins is finally broken in half. Have you already forgotten what he looked like in the Seattle playoff game when he threw 2 pic-sixes under pressure?


Posted by: Alan4 | October 14, 2009 1:03 PM |
--------------------------------

He also threw two TDs, and more importantly, led the team to 4 straight wins to earn that playoff berth.

I find it hilarious that anyone would dump on Collins for his performance in a single playoff game - when postseason play is something Campbell still hasn't experienced and probably never will - as JC continues to lose, lose, and lose.

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | October 14, 2009 1:15 PM | Report abuse

You've got the rest of your life ahead of you, Chris Samuels. Not worth risking it to come back and try to save this sinking ship.

Posted by: freakzilla | October 14, 2009 1:15 PM | Report abuse

Samuels should retire and just carry Danny around on his shoulders

Master blaster master blaster master blaster

Posted by: pabrian2003 | October 14, 2009 1:16 PM | Report abuse

chia, again, why should I care??

He's the owner of the football team that I follow......what does his religion matter??

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | October 14, 2009 1:16 PM | Report abuse

Does anyone else think Gruden would be a bad hire?

He won SB with Dungy's team. Then TB slowly fell apart. He did help the Raiders but given they were playing in a fairly weak division at the time I don't know.

Here is where I defer to those with greater football geek wisdom.

Posted by: sfskin | October 14, 2009 1:16 PM | Report abuse

Let's give Tre Johnson a call and see what he is up to.

Posted by: Alvin_Walton | October 14, 2009 1:09 PM | Report abuse
========================================
He's sitting at the buffet (not at a table at the actual buffet) at the Golden Corral in Capital Centre Plaza. He's about 450, but maybe Vinny can put him on the B-Williams diet plan.

Posted by: clark202 | October 14, 2009 1:17 PM | Report abuse

For God's sake, shut Chris Samuels down for the year so he doesn't risk his well-being trying to prop up this lost cause of a football team. No man should go out on a stretcher while playing on this team, imprisoned in Vinny and Danny's latest misadventure, and certainly not a warrior like Samuels.

Posted by: TedNutmeg | October 14, 2009 1:17 PM | Report abuse

"Don't JUST meet with Redskin doctors, bring in a specialist who doesn't answer to Dan Snyder as well as Hypocrites."

I'm hoping you meant Hippocrates. But maybe you spelled it corectly after all.

Posted by: Samson151 | October 14, 2009 1:17 PM | Report abuse

...oh yeah, about Gruden...GREAT!


Can he block?

Posted by: shaunsherman12 | October 14, 2009 1:11 PM | Report abuse
=========================================
No, but if he does become the coach, we're guaranteed to have 10 QBs on the roster.

Posted by: clark202 | October 14, 2009 1:18 PM | Report abuse

This one move can greatly improve DC's playoff chances in 2009.

Too bad The Post's writers' seem unwilling to call blue sky blue or gray sky gray.

Posted by: Realness1 | October 14, 2009 12:53 PM

Yeah, this would be entertaining for about 3 plays, when the immobile Collins is finally broken in half. Have you already forgotten what he looked like in the Seattle playoff game when he threw 2 pic-sixes under pressure?

Posted by: Alan4

I'd be for trying it. If Collins comes in and stinks up the joint, maybe people would lay off Campbell... or maybe they would want the guy off the developmental roster to play... But, what if Collins lights it up? Wouldn't that tell us Campbell was part of the problem? Either way, I would like to see - just like I would like to see Alridge and Mason get carries to see what we have there.

Posted by: RedSkinHead | October 14, 2009 1:18 PM | Report abuse

Hiring a coach without a GM isn't going to address the root of the problem, imho.

Hire a GM - maybe Holmgren would like to GM instead of coach, who knows - and then let that person hire a head coach.

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | October 14, 2009 1:19 PM | Report abuse

Who gives a s*** about Snyder's religion?

Just hire a GM and get the f out the way.

Posted by: RedDMV | October 14, 2009 1:19 PM | Report abuse

He's out for the season, they just haven't said it yet.

We need to just start playing ba**s out.... figure out who we want to rebuild with here next year, and who wants to leave.

Posted by: Rypien11 | October 14, 2009 1:19 PM | Report abuse

The Wilbonic article points out that Snyder is good at marketing, the Skins having the most revenue of any NFL team. While Snyder has shown himself to be a marketing genius, the product that he has been marketing is another story. Since assuming ownership of the organization, the Skins have had at best mediocre teams. You can see what is going on here can't you? Snyder's $$$ have come from a deft milking of fan enthusiasm and optimism, mainly the result of the 3 SB wins in the Gibbs era but also to a limited degree from flashy FA signings and coach hires. But the SB wins were 30 years ago and fading. When you match up (a)a product quality curve that is declining over time and (b)a memory of 3 SB victories that is vanishing every more rapidly over time what you have are the precursors of a revenue curve that is going to be declining over time as well. We already have evidentiary of this in the report on Steinbog's Berg that ticket resale prices are at an all time low. You don't have to be a rocket scientist to see that this is a business model that cannot sustain itself.

Posted by: ElDrano | October 14, 2009 1:19 PM | Report abuse

Does anyone else think Gruden would be a bad hire?

He won SB with Dungy's team. Then TB slowly fell apart. He did help the Raiders but given they were playing in a fairly weak division at the time I don't know.

Here is where I defer to those with greater football geek wisdom.

Posted by: sfskin | October 14, 2009 1:16 PM

He'd be a better game day coach. Would he have the patience to oversee the rebuilding (oline, QB, RB, LB, WR?) that would be required - no idea.

Posted by: skinswest | October 14, 2009 1:21 PM | Report abuse

If I'm Jason Campbell, I'm demanding from here on out, that I'm throwing from punt formation.

Posted by: clark202 | October 14, 2009 1:21 PM | Report abuse

Yeah, this would be entertaining for about 3 plays, when the immobile Collins is finally broken in half. Have you already forgotten what he looked like in the Seattle playoff game when he threw 2 pic-sixes under pressure?

Posted by: Alan4 | October 14, 2009 1:03 PM

A QB that can actually go through his progressions and throw the ball on time is always better than one that can't, behind any O line.

Posted by: Realness1 | October 14, 2009 1:21 PM | Report abuse

I agree. Chris take care of yourself. Don't guarantee wheel chair at 60 for a few more games of futility.

The Toddster may have better instincts but his immobility behind this line would be. . .ugh . . . he'd be the Ewoks and Gints D would the Deathstar and there ain't no Han Solo/Luke Skywalker coming to save him.

Posted by: sfskin | October 14, 2009 1:22 PM | Report abuse

Actually, that Scientology thing explains A LOT of this crap.

They do that whole 'mind over matter' thing to an emarrassing degree. (research Maxwell Maltz's Psycho Cybernetics, what Dyanetics is based on).

Of COURSE Dan thinks he can run a football team. He's done it over and over in his mind.

Reality's a beeeyyyotch.

Posted by: DikShuttle | October 14, 2009 1:22 PM | Report abuse

Its all just whistling past the graveyard.

With an ineffective O-Line, NO coach makes us any better this year.

No to Gruden, No to the sexy coach hire, No to firing Zorn

Posted by: CheyenneWY | October 14, 2009 1:23 PM | Report abuse

Jason Campbell is 18-23.

The amazing thing is that he's played 41 games, has a record of 18-23, and has never been benched.

That's taking "patience" way too far.

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | October 14, 2009 1:24 PM | Report abuse

Greg,

I'll do everyone a favor and get off the topic.

The last thing that I will say is that IF Dan Snyder is immersed in the Cult of the Thetans, it would help to explain, provide some context for the parade of gaffes he's been wheeling around the NFL on Sundays.

I look at his actions, and I'm at a loss. I can find no other plausible explanation.

Cerrato is in on it too, and as a Redskins fans I'm offended by both of these clowns.

They are seriously screwing up my weekends, for reals.

Now I'll shut my cake hole...

Posted by: Chia_Pet | October 14, 2009 1:25 PM | Report abuse

With Snyder on Samuels shoulders yelling "Who runs barter town"

Posted by: Skins281 | October 14, 2009 1:25 PM | Report abuse

But how many coaches and offenses has be been through in those years/games. There is no continuity in the organization.

Posted by: CheyenneWY | October 14, 2009 1:26 PM | Report abuse

Scientology is not a religion. Would you become a Starwarsist b/c Lucas said so, well its basically no different.

I am with Chia on this, and have followed the rumors as well. I think some explanations could lie there myself.

Although I do think, "hey do you/freak flag fly...." so whateves...but scientology is very behavior based, so it could be a telling look in to the less than normal decision making flow chart in Skins HQ.

Every time I pass the scientologist set up in the NYC subways I start screaming, "Free Katie Holmes!"

Posted by: chrislarry | October 14, 2009 1:27 PM | Report abuse

Collins did what he did in 2007 in an offense that he could coach.

He won't solve any problems for this team. It would just give some people temporary hope that simply switching out one player could be the difference - which it is not.

Posted by: shaunsherman12 | October 14, 2009 1:27 PM | Report abuse

- as JC continues to lose, lose, and lose.

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | October 14, 2009 1:15 PM

Precisely ... it was JC who tried to block the punt coverage guy when ARE signaled for a fair catch ... it was JC who whiff tackled Delhomme for a QB scramble first down ... it was JC who was out of place when Stewart danced in for a TD ... I'm forgetting about the Panther's TE TD ... was JC out of position on that one too or did he get burned in coverage?

Posted by: dcsween | October 14, 2009 1:28 PM | Report abuse

"Jason Campbell is 18-23."

Oh, I forgot JC plays tennis.

Attributing win-loss records to individuals in football is moronic. It's the ultimate team sport.

Posted by: Yoder-lay-hee-who | October 14, 2009 1:30 PM | Report abuse

I think the scheme is right, but the personnel are suffering.

I remember under Spurrier, i felt the scheme was just way off...I dont think thats the issue here. We go all the way to plan D without even looking at plan A.

There must be some leadership qualities present because the team is standing beside him. That has to be worth something. Bring in a no kidding Offensive play caller and give Zorn more time to focus on all sides of the ball.

Posted by: CheyenneWY | October 14, 2009 1:31 PM | Report abuse

Heck imagine how much Snyder could make if he would put the people in place and actually be markting a good team !!

Posted by: rjohnson66 | October 14, 2009 1:31 PM | Report abuse

Every time I pass the scientologist set up in the NYC subways I start screaming, "Free Katie Holmes!"

Posted by: chrislarry | October 14, 2009 1:27 PM | Report abuse

ROFLMAO - this is the post of the day (okay non-fubol related post)

Thanks ChRIsLaRRy for bringing a little ray of sunshine to our football sadness.

Posted by: sfskin | October 14, 2009 1:31 PM | Report abuse

baaah....if both JC, and CR walk after this year, ugh, the 2005 draft is such a waste, 2 first round picks and absolutely nothing to show for it....kind of reminds me of 2000, when we had 2 first round picks and still have nothing to show for it....sigh...the more things change, the more they stay the same...meet the new boss...same as the old boss

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | October 14, 2009 10:27 AM

Bean, they ain't just gonna leave us empty handed.

Best Believe Vinny will slap their SJKs with the restricted tag so we can get picks for them or they will have a miserable season on the bench if no one wants them.....

Posted by: 4thFloor | October 14, 2009 1:32 PM | Report abuse

JC17 in a consistent system with even a an average offensive line can win games for you. He started 6 - 2 last year until the O-Line pooped the bed.

Posted by: CheyenneWY | October 14, 2009 1:32 PM | Report abuse

Collins already worked in the WCO for 2 seasons before Zorn's arrival.... DC had 9 plus minutes left (4th qtr.) in the Carolina game to comeback and win. Who was the QB that played every snap and (as usual) did not?

Posted by: Realness1 | October 14, 2009 1:33 PM | Report abuse

I don't know if the Redskins would be 4-0 with Collins starting but ask your self if Collins would have done this:

-Thrown the ball when three yards past the line of scrimmage.

-Not stepped into the pocket creating a fumble when Osi slapped the ball out of his hand.

-Threw an incomplete backwards pass to a running back resulting in a fumble and loss of yardage.

-Try to pick on the same defender who already had two picks on you in the same game.

-Fumble 8 times in five games.

-Throw 3 interceptions and fumble twice in a game.

Campbell has played like dookie and it would be interesting to see what Collins could do. I have to believe he wouldn't do have off these things. He's not as strong armed as Campbell, true, but how many long passes has Campbell connected on? He's not as mobile as Campbell, but how often does Campbell's mobility mean anything in the last few games? He's not Michael Vick and he has no pocket awareness. I cannot see Collins being sacked anymore.

As for all of you who believe Sunday will be sack city for the Chiefs, I say only maybe. If Zorn is smart, he will give his offensive linemen plenty of help in pass blocking, and try to get the running game going strong. Of course, if Zorn were smart, we'd be 4-0...

Posted by: RedSkinHead | October 14, 2009 1:36 PM | Report abuse

Agreed 4th, Skins are in control of JC/Double Move's future contractually....but I am holding on hope that its not Vinny's choice to make....

a boy can dream can't he?

Posted by: chrislarry | October 14, 2009 1:36 PM | Report abuse

"Who was the QB that played every snap and (as usual) did not?"

Who dropped the beautiful bomb that would have allowed the Skins to at least tie the game???

Get off it dude. Soooo many problems on this team. You could single out every single player, minus Fletch.

Posted by: Yoder-lay-hee-who | October 14, 2009 1:36 PM | Report abuse

http://espn.go.com/blog/nfceast/post/_/id/4929/snyder-should-hire-jimmy-johnson-as-gm

Matt Mosely commenting on Wilbon's article saying Snyder should back a Brinks truck up to JJ's place in the Keys to make him GM. He also says at the end that JJ wouldn't take the skins job in a million years.

So he's sayin there's a chance...

Posted by: skinswest | October 14, 2009 1:37 PM | Report abuse

4th, is that how it works?? I was unaware, thats a lot more palatable, than what I thought would happen...

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | October 14, 2009 1:37 PM | Report abuse

The Patriots arent known for a world class O-Line and look how much time Brady has to look at each receiver twice to decide where he wants to throw it.

We are not making this stuff up, the review at the end of the year highlighted the need for an O-Line.

But the FO decided to try the 2000 Ravens approcah and have a shut down defense. When the Ravens won the SB with Dilfer, what was there PPG average that year.

It was not the worst idea in the world, it just didnt work.

Posted by: CheyenneWY | October 14, 2009 1:38 PM | Report abuse

Um, I don't know how much of the first eight games from last year you all remember, but I remember this dude named CLINTON PORTIS carrying the team to a 6-2 start. Jason Campbell didn't much to do with that start.

Before someone cites it, save the "no picks". Of course you aren't going to throw picks on curls, screens, and quick slants.

The first eight games was "Gibbs run-off" in affect. They were mostly doing the same things they did when Gibbs was coach:

Run, run, run, run, run, run, run, pass, run, run, run, pass, run, run, run, run, run...

In the final eight games when they needed Campbell and Zorn to flex, neither of them could.

And neither of them still can't.

Posted by: RedDMV | October 14, 2009 1:39 PM | Report abuse

More JC talk will leave me whimpering fetally in the corner....

Posted by: chrislarry | October 14, 2009 1:40 PM | Report abuse

I said this before the season even started, a lot of people did. All it's going to take is for Samuels to go down and it's over.

I thought it wouldn't be until the second half of the season though.

Whoever gets put behind center is at serious risk of injury and we're looking at getting blown out several times.

That is UNLESS, Danny can figure out a way to channel the power of XENU, then all will be saved. I really hope Tom Cruise and the Cult of Scientology are helping him to figure out how to do that.

Posted by: BrooklynSkins | October 14, 2009 1:40 PM | Report abuse

Ugh...more of the "It's JC, no it's not" crudola.

Obviously, it's the media. Big meanies.

Posted by: 4-12 | October 14, 2009 1:40 PM | Report abuse

Todd Collins is a statue back there and with the O-Line the way it is, after one good hit, he would go from back-up QB to usher on the Muppet Show.

Collins would get his a** kicked so bad, it would make Ike Turner queasy

Posted by: CheyenneWY | October 14, 2009 1:41 PM | Report abuse

Every time I pass the scientologist set up in the NYC subways I start screaming, "Free Katie Holmes!"

Posted by: chrislarry | October 14, 2009 1:27 PM


Did we ever find if out if she cried out in childbirth? That's how the Thetans find you, you know.

Posted by: freakzilla | October 14, 2009 1:41 PM | Report abuse

Bring back the Jumbo package.

Posted by: RedDMV | October 14, 2009 1:42 PM | Report abuse

Collins already worked in the WCO for 2 seasons before Zorn's arrival.... DC had 9 plus minutes left (4th qtr.) in the Carolina game to comeback and win. Who was the QB that played every snap and (as usual) did not?

Posted by: Realness1 | October 14, 2009 1:33 PM | Report abuse


If you merged Elway, Montana, Marino, Jurgenson, and Baugh into one super QB, he couldn't come back behind the OFFENSIVE line we had on the field after Samuels went down. And when did Collins have 2 years of WCO experience before Zorn? Was that Joe Gibbs or Al Saunders WCO, oh yeah they never ran a WCO.

Collins makes Mark Rypien look like Randall Cunningham in terms of mobility. With that OL out there he is probably on the sidelines praying that he doesn't have to go into the game and get killed.

Posted by: rjohnson66 | October 14, 2009 1:43 PM | Report abuse

prolly better than New Day Adventist/Church of Scientology talk regarding the owner, cl...

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | October 14, 2009 1:43 PM | Report abuse

Mr. Samuels - retire and enjoy your wealth with your wife and kids. There is no more for you to accomplish as this team will be watching the playoffs from their living rooms.

Thanks for all you contributed!

Posted by: oldnova | October 14, 2009 1:43 PM | Report abuse

Precisely ... it was JC who tried to block the punt coverage guy when ARE signaled for a fair catch ... it was JC who whiff tackled Delhomme for a QB scramble first down ... it was JC who was out of place when Stewart danced in for a TD ... I'm forgetting about the Panther's TE TD ... was JC out of position on that one too or did he get burned in coverage?

Posted by: dcsween | October 14, 2009 1:28 PM |
-------------------------------------
He isn't a utility infielder, idiot.

He's the starting QB.

Passing off responsibility from the guy who handles the ball on every snap is about as short-sighted an analysis as you can offer up.

And complaining about a defense that is 4th in the league statistically (5th in points allowed) giving up points when the offense - which is led by the QB - has yet to crack the 20-point barrier is equally ridiculous.

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | October 14, 2009 1:44 PM | Report abuse

There must be some leadership qualities present because the team is standing beside him. That has to be worth something. Bring in a no kidding Offensive play caller and give Zorn more time to focus on all sides of the ball.

Posted by: CheyenneWY

Poor logic. My kids stand beside the Swann Ice Cream man, but that's just because he sells tasty ice cream. Tasty ice cream doesn't make a good leader. Zorn's players are standing behind him because he's a nice man - a good man, but that has nothing to do with leadership or coaching abilities. To put Zorn's shortcomings bluntly, "He doesn't hold his players accountable, and he is a lousy play caller/creator."

Posted by: RedSkinHead | October 14, 2009 1:44 PM | Report abuse

Obviously, it's the media. Big meanies.

Posted by: 4-12 | October 14, 2009 1:40 PM

--------

No.

It's the fan base.

We're horrible.

Posted by: Chia_Pet | October 14, 2009 1:45 PM | Report abuse

...oh yeah, about Gruden...GREAT!


Can he block?

Posted by: shaunsherman12 | October 14, 2009 1:11 PM | Report abuse

Changing coaches is just rearranging deck chairs on the Titanic, and means nothing if the same people (i.e., Snyder and Cerrato) are still guiding the ship.

Posted by: rbpalmer | October 14, 2009 1:45 PM | Report abuse

I owe you a coke, cL.

Posted by: 4-12 | October 14, 2009 1:45 PM | Report abuse

CheyenneWY,

The ravens had a beast o-line the year they won the SB and ran the ball very, very well.

The Patriots have had an above average o-line at worst in this run. Also they have played together along time which is huge factor (as have Giants)...

People hate on Dilfer, but the dude was a smart, battle tested veteran who threw accurately when it mattered.

CheyenneWY, how many games have you actually watched this season? I am just curious, not being a dik. B/C your patience approach just seems sorta out of step with what I see on the field.

Posted by: chrislarry | October 14, 2009 1:45 PM | Report abuse

Jason Campbell is 18-23.

The amazing thing is that he's played 41 games, has a record of 18-23, and has never been benched.

That's taking "patience" way too far.

Posted by: MrRedskin21

Wow! So its back to being Jason Campbell's fault that this team is bad huh? HOfer Sonny's record wasn't that great either. We probably should have benched him sooner too right?

Its amazing how someone can be discussed as a possible MVP candidate at the midway point last year to being a horrible QB a year later. He's not the problem. That line would make ANY QB or RB in the league look bad.

Posted by: dcwun | October 14, 2009 1:46 PM | Report abuse

Ike Turner?

"Aw c'mon, eat the cake Anna Mae"

Posted by: RedDMV | October 14, 2009 1:46 PM | Report abuse

Shut Samuels down and play for draft picks. ARE can be the QB since he can move, a necessity when one doesn't have an O-line. Call all pass plays to get Kelly, Thomas, and Davis more experience. Fire Cerrato ASAP and get a real GM.

Posted by: TBDog | October 14, 2009 1:46 PM | Report abuse

Oh, I forgot JC plays tennis.

Attributing win-loss records to individuals in football is moronic. It's the ultimate team sport.

Posted by: Yoder-lay-hee-who | October 14, 2009 1:30 PM |
-----------------------------

If you're going to cut & paste, get the whole post.

He's played 41 games, is 18-23, and has NEVER been benched.

That is what is "moronic."

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | October 14, 2009 1:48 PM | Report abuse

I don't know if the Redskins would be 4-0 with Collins starting but ask your self if Collins would have done this:

-Thrown the ball when three yards past the line of scrimmage.

-Not stepped into the pocket creating a fumble when Osi slapped the ball out of his hand.

-Threw an incomplete backwards pass to a running back resulting in a fumble and loss of yardage.

-Try to pick on the same defender who already had two picks on you in the same game.

-Fumble 8 times in five games.

-Throw 3 interceptions and fumble twice in a game.

Campbell has played like dookie and it would be interesting to see what Collins could do. I have to believe he wouldn't do have off these things. He's not as strong armed as Campbell, true, but how many long passes has Campbell connected on? He's not as mobile as Campbell, but how often does Campbell's mobility mean anything in the last few games? He's not Michael Vick and he has no pocket awareness. I cannot see Collins being sacked anymore.

As for all of you who believe Sunday will be sack city for the Chiefs, I say only maybe. If Zorn is smart, he will give his offensive linemen plenty of help in pass blocking, and try to get the running game going strong. Of course, if Zorn were smart, we'd be 4-0...

Posted by: RedSkinHead | October 14, 2009 1:36 PM | Report abuse

--------------

No, we wouldn't be 4-0. Because when your O-line is not just average, or mediocre, but PATHETIC, you aren't going to be able to score many points.

That's it. Collins, Campbell, Zorn, Gruden, whatever. No O-line = bad team.

Red Head, you cited Campbells mistakes, is if you could subtract all of those, without considering the problems with Collins in the game. You say his mobility hasn't helped....what?! He's been directly responsible for extending drives on third down several times using his feet - something that Collins isn't going to do.

I just don't see how anyone can believe a extremely immobile QB with an almost empty resume would be better off in a situation where the offensive line is a sieve.

Posted by: shaunsherman12 | October 14, 2009 1:49 PM | Report abuse

I hope everyone here has joined to boycott. Regardless of our differences re: JC and Zorn, we can ALL agree that nothing will fundamentally change until the football operations are run by a true GM. Snyder has to be FORCED to change his approach. We need to hit him with empty seats, empty parking spaces, and unpurchased concessions. He'll still make money but, trust me, he won't be able to stand slipping to 3rd or 4th on the money making list.

Watch the games at home until they are blacked out.

Posted by: mhaslup1 | October 14, 2009 1:49 PM | Report abuse

First you assemble a stout OL, which can be done is short order, through the draft and FA pick ups, and then after about 20 regular season games of gelling, they should be consistently pushing people around on the LOS.

Posted by: Chia_Pet | October 14, 2009 1:49 PM | Report abuse

Collins = useless. This team's not losing because of Campbell. Or Zorn. It's losing because it sucks.

Posted by: mhaslup1 | October 14, 2009 1:51 PM | Report abuse

I try to watch every game and If I cant watch it at the sportsbar, I listen to Sonny and Sam on 980.

I think the patience comes more with the idea that after a a couple of games its time to blow it up and start again. 7 coaches in 11 years and we have still barely finished 8 - 8 over those spans.

You cant tell me that all 7 of those coaches were bad coaches. There is zero stability in the organization except in the top of the pyramid (Snyderatto)

I have seen JC17 show alot of poise and ability over the last few years and the idea that there is someone out there right now (Collins/Gruden) that can right the ship at this point is laughable.

We want the Skins to be undefeated but we are not. Alot of folks on the blog beat the crap out of Snyder for his impetuous nature and gut shot calls. But after losses they fall victim of the same thing.

This is a rebuilding year, the youth movememnt has already begun. Let them grow together.

Posted by: CheyenneWY | October 14, 2009 1:52 PM | Report abuse

If you're going to cut & paste, get the whole post.

He's played 41 games, is 18-23, and has NEVER been benched.

That is what is "moronic."

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | October 14, 2009 1:48 PM | Report abuse

The team has NEVER had a better option. That is the bottom line.

Posted by: mhaslup1 | October 14, 2009 1:52 PM | Report abuse

Wow! So its back to being Jason Campbell's fault that this team is bad huh?

Posted by: dcwun | October 14, 2009 1:46 PM |
-----------------------------------

No.

But he isn't making this team any better.

That being the case, why keep starting him?

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | October 14, 2009 1:53 PM | Report abuse

First you assemble a stout OL, which can be done is short order, through the draft and FA pick ups, and then after about 20 regular season games of gelling, they should be consistently pushing people around on the LOS.

Posted by: Chia_Pet | October 14, 2009 1:49 PM | Report abuse

Exactly! You give this team a stout offensive line and then it would be 5-0. Blaming this mess on Zorn or on Campbell is stupid! This team stinks because the offensive line stinks....Period. The offensive line stinks because of the front office and it's incompetence.

Posted by: rjohnson66 | October 14, 2009 1:54 PM | Report abuse

Soup lovers, It's unfortunate that you bet on the wrong horse, so to speak. Enjoy watching another season (like last year and 3/4's of 2007) go down the toilet w/ him at the helm and blaming everyone else for the losses. Make sure you DVR the Chargers game because it should be the last time Soupy takes the field for DC. Maybe you can get a Fathead of him to put in your room, Since he's headed to backupville and I'm sure you'll miss him.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZH6eO6mj60Y&feature=fvw

He make the same mistakes this year that he did in 2003. But he's improving right?

Posted by: Realness1 | October 14, 2009 1:54 PM | Report abuse

I missed the explanation on how good QB play and/or good coaching can make up for a nonexistent OL. Can someone repost it?

Posted by: mack1 | October 14, 2009 1:55 PM | Report abuse

But if I get this gig in Oxon Hill I will get to hear all the good jibba jabba.

Cheyenne is getting old. We had eight inches of snow this weekend

Posted by: CheyenneWY | October 14, 2009 1:55 PM | Report abuse

"First you assemble a stout OL, which can be done is short order, through the draft and FA pick ups, and then after about 20 regular season games of gelling, they should be consistently pushing people around on the LOS.

Posted by: Chia_Pet

Then you go to the spirtual sauna to sweat out the E-grams while consulting with high grand wizard Tom Cruise to plan your thetanic assault on the psychatric industry while grooving to the new Beck album and prepping your monologue for Jeffery Tambor's acting seminar.

Oh and planning a lawsuit and Supreme Court brief against Chia Pet and ChriS Larry who defamed your "religion" on Redskins Insider. Can we get Beantown Greg as a witness?

Posted by: chrislarry | October 14, 2009 1:55 PM | Report abuse

If only JC would stop hitting people like Sellers and DT in the hands with the ball, he might throw more TDs.

What kind of lousy QB lets his recievers drop sure TD catches?

Posted by: Alan4 | October 14, 2009 1:56 PM | Report abuse

The first eight games was "Gibbs run-off" in affect. They were mostly doing the same things they did when Gibbs was coach:

Run, run, run, run, run, run, run, pass, run, run, run, pass, run, run, run, run, run...

Posted by: RedDMV | October 14, 2009 1:39 PM

I don't know about that. During that span JC had 2 300 yard games. In his first 4 games he threw 6 TD's. JC needs a supporting cast to be really effective, however he's not the turd some make him out to be.

Posted by: TWISI | October 14, 2009 1:57 PM | Report abuse

They can do one of two things.

They can play Collins at some point and see what he can do, or they can hope that The Great Pumpkin delivers 5 all-pro offensive linemen in time for their game against the Eagles.

Since the latter seems unlikely, give Todd a shot.

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | October 14, 2009 1:57 PM | Report abuse

He's out for the season, they just haven't said it yet.

We need to just start playing ba**s out.... figure out who we want to rebuild with here next year, and who wants to leave.

Posted by: Rypien11 | October 14, 2009 1:19 PM | Report abuse
_______________________

It's the same condition that ended Michael Irvin's career. Wouldn't surprise me if Samuels is not only done for the year, but pushed into retirement.

I wish him the best either way and definitely hope it doesn't come to that.

As far as the franchise is concerned, if Samuels DOES have to retire... Snyder better hope there is no cap next season. Because the cap hit for Samuels will be impossible to wiggle around if they have to do it with a salary cap in place.

Posted by: dfbovey | October 14, 2009 1:57 PM | Report abuse

Mack1

I asked the same question and none of the usual experts can seem to answer it. No doubt you will get alot of the fluff talk about the "culture of winning" and alot of subjective stuff.

No tangible examples of how a new HC/QB makes this better.

I was always taught when the ship is going down, get in a lifeboat...dont stand there and yell at the iceberg.

Posted by: CheyenneWY | October 14, 2009 1:58 PM | Report abuse

They can do one of two things.

They can play Collins at some point and see what he can do, or they can hope that The Great Pumpkin delivers 5 all-pro offensive linemen in time for their game against the Eagles.

Since the latter seems unlikely, give Todd a shot.

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | October 14, 2009 1:57 PM | Report abuse

I agree!!! I hate Todd Collins lets get his immobile a$$ killed!!!!!!! We can finally be rid of his geritol swigging butt!!!!!!! ;-)

Posted by: rjohnson66 | October 14, 2009 1:59 PM | Report abuse

Beep

Posted by: CheyenneWY | October 14, 2009 2:00 PM | Report abuse

We cannot hire a permanent coach without getting a PERMANENT GM. Doing this backwards will not solve the problem, it will continue the problem! A competent GM will want to hire his own coach. Any GM willing to accept someone elses selection of a coach is not a worth GM.

Posted by: 1of9000 | October 14, 2009 2:01 PM | Report abuse

TWISI,

How far were those TD tosses?

One of those 300 yard games came against the Saints who last year had one of the worst secondaries in the NFL.

Posted by: RedDMV | October 14, 2009 2:02 PM | Report abuse

Jurgenson: Skins would be 4-0 if Collins started (including a win against the Giants).

Tony Dungy: "Well, I'm not going to blame it all on the quarterback. He threw for a lot of yards [340 in Sunday's 19-14 loss to Detroit] today; they're having trouble scoring. But I think it goes to a bigger thing, maybe an organizational thing.

"It's always new free agents, new players, all-star guys. They've got to build a team concept there ... and it's not always getting the best players, it's building a good team, building a team that everyone has confidence in, and right now they don't have confidence."


Sonny was a great QB, but he never won a single postseason game--proof positive it's a team sport.

We all know about Dungy.

Who do you believe?

Posted by: Alan4 | October 14, 2009 2:02 PM | Report abuse

No.

But he isn't making this team any better.

That being the case, why keep starting him?

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | October 14, 2009 1:53 PM

Likewise, Clinton Portis. And Sant[onio]ana Moss. And Chris Cooley. And London Fletcher. And Laron Landry. And Carlos Rogers. Sit 'em all, since the Skins are 18-23 in their last 41 with these guys too. Clearly, none of them are making the team any better.

Posted by: 4-12 | October 14, 2009 2:03 PM | Report abuse

I hope everyone here has joined to boycott. Regardless of our differences re: JC and Zorn, we can ALL agree that nothing will fundamentally change until the football operations are run by a true GM. Snyder has to be FORCED to change his approach. We need to hit him with empty seats, empty parking spaces, and unpurchased concessions. He'll still make money but, trust me, he won't be able to stand slipping to 3rd or 4th on the money making list.

Watch the games at home until they are blacked out.

Posted by: mhaslup1

Hell no I'm not joining this. It's not about money with Snyder because he does spend it and I believe he wants to win. His decision making has been sh!!ddy. He needs to get a football person in there and stop trying to be Jerry Jones Jr.

Posted by: dcwun | October 14, 2009 2:05 PM | Report abuse

And when did Collins have 2 years of WCO experience before Zorn? Was that Joe Gibbs or Al Saunders WCO, oh yeah they never ran a WCO.

Collins makes Mark Rypien look like Randall Cunningham in terms of mobility. With that OL out there he is probably on the sidelines praying that he doesn't have to go into the game and get killed.

Posted by: rjohnson66 | October 14, 2009 1:43 PM

Oh yeah, Collins played for Buffalo and KC before DC. Mobility? Is your favorite Offense the wildcat, triple option or the pistol?

Posted by: Realness1 | October 14, 2009 2:05 PM | Report abuse

First you assemble a stout OL, which can be done is short order, through the draft and FA pick ups, and then after about 20 regular season games of gelling, they should be consistently pushing people around on the LOS.

Posted by: Chia_Pet | October 14, 2009 1:49 PM

This is the real reason behind the solidness of the Jets. Rex Ryan and Marc Sanchez would just be Eric Mangini and Chad Pennington but for the draft when they picked up D'Brickashaw Ferguson and Nick Mangold and free agent Damien Woody (yes, Damien Woody). Faneca was a gift of disgruntlement in last year's free agency. The Jets are who they are because of getting serious about their offensive line. It comes a point where your guys (R. Thomas, P. Kendall), even though tight solid, get old and you need to bite the bullet and plan for that. Or, you can live in the "let's hire former SB champ coaches" mindset ... live in the past ... and go out to sign Randy Thomas and Pete Kendall after they leave the Jets.

In the NFL, the past is not prologue. Its epilogue.

Posted by: dcsween | October 14, 2009 2:09 PM | Report abuse

No.

But he isn't making this team any better.

That being the case, why keep starting him?

Posted by: MrRedskin21

Who is making this team better on the offensive side of the ball?

Posted by: dcwun | October 14, 2009 2:09 PM | Report abuse

I don't give a damn if they dug up Tom Landry and asked him to be the GM then hired Jimmy Johnson as HC, Troy Aikman as QB coach, and Emmitt Smith as RB coach.

Just because someone used to have ties to a 'Skins rival don't mean s*** to me.

They need someone other than the current "brain trust" to come in and right this clusterfudge.

Posted by: RedDMV | October 14, 2009 12:23 PM

This bama must be the President of the Norv Turner fan club...

Posted by: 4thFloor | October 14, 2009 2:12 PM | Report abuse

Hell no I'm not joining this. It's not about money with Snyder because he does spend it and I believe he wants to win. His decision making has been sh!!ddy. He needs to get a football person in there and stop trying to be Jerry Jones Jr.

Posted by: dcwun | October 14, 2009 2:05 PM | Report abuse

Everything is about money with Snyder. He wants to win more than he wants a winner. If he can't be the "mastermind" of the winning, he would rather lose. The only way we will change that is by hitting him in the pocket book and making him realize he can't make as much money as he would like if he continues to pull the strings. BOYCOTT. BOYCOTT. BOYCOTT.

TO THE BARRICADES!!!!

Posted by: mhaslup1 | October 14, 2009 2:15 PM | Report abuse

shaunsherman12,
I'd like to see Collins in there. If he stinks it up, then we'll all feel better about Campbell at QB come Monday morning.

As for Campbell's mobility extending drives... I can't believe you even think this makes a difference. Eight touchdowns. That's all the Redskins have gotten. How many drives did Campbell extend? How many times has Campbell scrambled into the end zone?

Posted by: RedSkinHead | October 14, 2009 2:18 PM | Report abuse

Everything is about money with Snyder. He wants to win more than he wants a winner. If he can't be the "mastermind" of the winning, he would rather lose. The only way we will change that is by hitting him in the pocket book and making him realize he can't make as much money as he would like if he continues to pull the strings. BOYCOTT. BOYCOTT. BOYCOTT.

TO THE BARRICADES!!!!

Posted by: mhaslup1

If it was just about money, he'd be as cheap as Donald Sterling who owns the Clippers. Snyder is just not a football guy and his decisions, outside of one, have been terrible. I like the fact that this team could go after any player they want. When he finally hires a real football person, I want that GM to have the same ability to go after a player and not be handcuffed as the Jaguars and teams who simply don't have that luxury.

Posted by: dcwun | October 14, 2009 2:22 PM | Report abuse

I can’t believe the moronic crap that is put up in this message board. Todd Collins???????? Scientology?????? As last checked this was NOT Schnyder’s religion. Blame JC17?????????
An offensive Offensive Line!!!!!! That is the problem!
Blame Gibbs: squandering draft picks, drafting JC17, Duckett, getting Lloyd, Archuleta, and most of all overpaying Brunnell – and the list goes on.
In his last year in Gibbs 1.0 he quit when realizing there was nothing to gain for him personally and that the team is in shambles, he quit (see result!!!!!!!!!, remember Richard P with his dangling cardboard in front of his fat belly?) because he realized this team is not going anywhere.
And when he realized that he had mismanaged the roster, the drafting, free agent acquisitions and knew the Skins will not be able to have a successful season for a few years, he quit again before his contract ran out!!!!!
Stop drinking the Gibbs Kool-Aid

FIRE CERRATTO

Posted by: johnbear1 | October 14, 2009 2:42 PM | Report abuse

I'm sorry, but nothing is worth the possibility of being permanently disabled (especially considering this team is going nowhere this year...)

Posted by: nojunk4me | October 14, 2009 2:52 PM | Report abuse

Samuels has been a great Redskin and one of the best LT's in the league. He should worry first about his long-term health and 2nd about the team. Neither Snyder or Cerrato will be sending him condolescence cards if he ends up a serious neck injury or worse. He should be smart and sit out the rest of the season.

The argument that we'd have won games with Collins as QB instead of JC is funny....we have no line so the protection is always spotty and Campbell is usually running for his life or is hit on almost every throw. If an immobile Collins had played even one game after the injury to Thomas, he would have been snapped in two and out for the year. Since there's no time to throw, how can anyone rationally think that Collins would have achieved better results.

Posted by: wizfan89 | October 14, 2009 3:25 PM | Report abuse

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