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Zorn: Injuries in Loss to Ravens 'Not Serious'

The Redskins made it through Thursday's 23-0 loss to the Baltimore Ravens with no major injuries. "Not serious from the standpoint of guys being out" for significant time, Coach Jim Zorn said today at Redskins Park.

Defensive tackle-end Lorenzo Alexander (oblique), tackle Mike Williams (abdominal strain) and tight end Fred Davis (shoulder) were the most significant injuries. Williams has not played in a regular-season game since 2005 and has lost more than 70 pounds since signing with the Redskins in April.

"It's kind of like, 'Go as you can tolerate it,'" Zorn said. "As we treat it and it gets better and better each day, I think he'll work out of it. I don't think it's going to be a sustained situation. It's not getting worse. It's just a dull pain, basically."

By Jason Reid  |  August 14, 2009; 1:29 PM ET
Categories:  Jason Reid  
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Next: Zorn Bothered by Lack of Effort in Loss

Comments

The Redskins will finish with a 4-12 record.

It's time to say goodbye to Vincent Cerrato.

Too bad, Danny Snyder.

Maryland will finish with a 2-10 record.

Maryland's defensive line and linebacker corps are a joke --- no pass rush whatsoever and give up a ton of long yardage plays.

I have seen harder hitting teams in powder puff leagues.

The only hard hits the Terps make - are out of bound plays - which cost them an additional 15 yards - which are quite frequent.

California's running back - Best - will gain 296 yards in the opening game

I love it, when Maryland constantly gets embarrassed on national TV.

Prediction:

California -- 56
Maryland -- 10

It's hilarious to see Maryland win a game - and the very next week get clobbered by a Virginia Tech - Boston College.

It is great to see Maryland go down to a crushing defeat on recruiting front (the kids they have received commitments from - are a joke! - taking the bottom of the barrel)

Carolina Blue - Carolina WHITE - Go Tar Heels - Let's go Tar Heels !


Posted by: hclark1 | August 14, 2009 1:31 PM | Report abuse

Second!!!

Posted by: jiza32 | August 14, 2009 1:32 PM | Report abuse

...a dull pain, indeed!

Posted by: Alan4 | August 14, 2009 1:41 PM | Report abuse

I was real worried before about the O-line, now much less so. My O-line worries have been replaced by my worries about the All-Star premiere defense forget how to tackle. Also about how the entire team took a nap when they were on the sidelines. No wonder they were so un-sudden on the field. Zorn really should make them sit through an edit of the game that just has sideline shots ... then scream like he's been the piggy in Deliverance ... then walk out of the room so that some veterans man up and get serious with each other and with the team. Zorn, Danny Smith, and Bugel were the only guys with any energy on the sidelines last night.

Posted by: dcsween | August 14, 2009 1:41 PM | Report abuse

That's not much of an injury toll considering they were playing a very aggressive Ravens club -- let's hope they can say the same against the Steelers.

Posted by: Samson151 | August 14, 2009 1:43 PM | Report abuse

Not too concerned about Lorenzo--our d line is very deep. But we still need to see a lot from Williams. The experiment with Rhinehart at tackle should be officially over; he's a guard, period. Davis looked very good barring the fumbles (which he'll obviously correct), and he has as good a chance as Thomas or Kelly at being an impact receiever for us this year.

Posted by: pgugino | August 14, 2009 1:44 PM | Report abuse

Not too much encouarging from last night, I like Kelly's hands and Orakpo is a stud. Fumbleitis from Davis is a major concern. JC cannot miss hagans like that on the 3rd down play.

Man I am glad football is back

beantowngreg is a geek

Posted by: jpfterps | August 14, 2009 1:46 PM | Report abuse

Interesting to see if the Jets, Carolina, or Atlanta respond to the blitzing when they play the Ravens over the next few weeks.

Posted by: Samson151 | August 14, 2009 1:47 PM | Report abuse

dcsween,
I think the poor tackling is partly due to the rookies and overall youth on the 2nd and 3rd string. And, they don't go "live" with tackling in practices except scrimmage. I think/hope the tackling does improve, as should the DB coverage, which was particularly soft.

Posted by: pgugino | August 14, 2009 1:51 PM | Report abuse

Ravens shut Skins out,
Zorn says no one is injured
Vinny brings Kool-Aid.

Posted by: Kenbeatrizz | August 14, 2009 1:51 PM | Report abuse

The biggest concern with regards to the defense was London Fletcher's rookie-year-Tryon-esque coverage on Ray Rice. What was that?

He's no spring chicken anymore. I sure hope age isn't catching up with LBF.

Posted by: psps23 | August 14, 2009 1:54 PM | Report abuse

Remembering that we were crowned Super Bowl favorites after the Ol' Ball Coach pulled the pants down on the 49er's in Osaka, I shall refrain from consigning our season to the basement because some rookie mistakes popped up against the AFC Conference runner-up.

Posted by: mattsoundworld | August 14, 2009 2:00 PM | Report abuse

pgugino, on the tackling, I sure hope so. The Ravens' 2nd/3rd string guys didn't seem to suffer from the same lack of energy in tackling. I was just thinking that the whole idea of being on a defense in the NFL is that you get the feed the beast inside that wants you to go bat shti crazy. There wasn't that much over-committing or over-pursuit (except for that one Michael Grant whiff in coverage), which says to me there was a definite lack of pumpuppedness. Fortunately, enthusiasm and energy seem like things that can be fixed (but they better get fixed soon!).

Posted by: dcsween | August 14, 2009 2:02 PM | Report abuse

Man I remember when the Tar Heels lost to UVA last year. Pathetic.

Posted by: trezmartin | August 14, 2009 2:03 PM | Report abuse

hclark1: These are supposed to be posts about Redskin injuries. What in the world are you doing taking up all that space trashing the Maryland football team. Typical North Carolina fan ... ADD, can't stay on subject.

Posted by: Rational_Man | August 14, 2009 2:04 PM | Report abuse

Spurrier's Japanese exploits are past. Apples v. oranges. There should some genuine excitement to be able to crash into an opponent again. Baltimore had it (or took it away from the Skins before the 1st quarter was over). Its about playing SUDDENLY. SHOMER SHABBOS!

Posted by: dcsween | August 14, 2009 2:04 PM | Report abuse

Tryon's fast, and will be a major asset at FedEx. The company FedEx, mind you, not the playing field

Posted by: zcezcest1 | August 14, 2009 12:54 PM

Question for the group: Why is it that whenever a football player's career as a professional athlete is in doubt, the presumption is he's going to be relegated to a job doing manual labor like delivering packages?

Z, not trying to pick on you but your post is just the latest example so I'm using it. Mike Patrick said something similar during the game when the 3rd stringers were playing.

Posted by: learnedhand1

Learned -- I have no idea. Some years ago, might have been during the replacement season, heard about a guy who was delivering packages, then got an NFL gig. Could be an urban legend. Anyway, I picked up it up from there. Gigs over, back to delivering packages.

fwiw, I think the Skins had someone in their statistical leaders in the strike replacement season who was a plumber.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | August 14, 2009 2:05 PM | Report abuse

It appears the Skins QBs operated without a running game most of the day (10 RB carries for 19 yards until Cartwright showed up and offered another 24 yards on 6 carries and bloated the total to 43 yards on 16 carries), and passed for a net total of 140 yards.

It appears the Ravens ran the ball better (24 RB carries, 99 yards) and had each of their 3 QBs pass for over 100 yards (net total of 399 yards).

I didn't get to watch the game, but for those who did--apart from the Davis turnovers and Hagan drops--is this a fair narrative?

Posted by: Alan4 | August 14, 2009 2:06 PM | Report abuse

btw, I really really liked Jarmon at that end spot. The tip showed that the guy is mentally IN the game. Also, I'm not disappointed by Henson (one of the draft LBs ... don't remember if he's supposed to be outside or inside).

Posted by: dcsween | August 14, 2009 2:06 PM | Report abuse

well, I know that the Redskins lost all of their pre-seasoon games in one of the Super Bowl years, and maybe two of them. So, once again, I say - get the windex out and polish up the trophy case.

Posted by: JohnDinHouston | August 14, 2009 2:08 PM | Report abuse

Skins don't have an easy preseason matchup the next two weeks. Next week could be as brutal offensively. But I think they'll move the ball a little better. Certainly the third game will give us a better indication of where they are as a team. Just making it out of preseason without significant injuries would be a boon, too. But Orakpo had a good showing. Apparently Jarmon played well. Good see a punter get off a couple of boomers. And the offensive line held up relatively well.

And @jpfterps, beantown greg isn't a geek, necessarily. He's just seems to be a bitter guy with apparently no sense of humor. I could be wrong, of course, but that's what I've noticed recently.

Posted by: CDon | August 14, 2009 2:09 PM | Report abuse

learnedhand, the stereotype of the NCAA student athlete, esp. a football player of draft quality, is that the student athlete is not as rigorous in his studies as he is in his athletics. I agree that there are lots of exceptions though, esp. given the number of guys who go back to school (including post-graduate stuff) after they finish their NFL careers.

Alan Page/DT of Minnesota when they were THE Vikings (back in the 1970s) is now Minnesota Associate Supreme Court Justice Page.

Posted by: dcsween | August 14, 2009 2:10 PM | Report abuse

psp, I was never really a LFB fan. He makes a lot of tackles for sure but they're 5+ yds beyond the line of scrimmage. There's a reason he hasn't made any Pro Bowls.

Posted by: learnedhand1 | August 14, 2009 2:10 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: zcezcest1 | August 14, 2009 1:19 PM

I have no idea how you could possibly come away from that game feeling good! I can see not really caring because it was a meaningless pre-season game, but feeling good? The beer must have been flowing at your house last night!

I agree with your first point.

I strongly disagree with your 2nd point. Do you think that the Ravens played at full strength? I believe a small pash rushing threat named terrell Suggs sat out. You think that he might have had an impact on the way Zorn feels about our O-Line this morning?

Now, to address your 3rd point. What exactly did Kelly and Devin Thomas do last night? They sure as hell didn't visit the endzone! Reinhart and Williams played on the O-Line that coudl not make it past the ravens 30 yard line the entire game.

Your 4th point: You should care about how the back-ups play in this game. Who do you think plays if one of our starters gets hurt? Oh, that's right, no one ever gets hurt in the NFL. Also, not caring about Tryon and Barnes makes me sick. You do realize that these guys are supposed to be on the field in nickle and dime situations, right?

Your 5th point: How is it that you are good with some of our starters being rusty, but the Ravens starters looked like a well oiled machine? How many more practices have they had under their belts than us? What are they doing to get their players ready that we aren't?

Bottom Line: We are a 6-10 to 9-7 team who will be without a QB after this year when Campbell plays out his contract and leaves town. Then, we are back to square one and old Danny and Vinny will be hot on the trail of Colt McCoy and Sam Bradford without addressing the pathetic O-Line!

Posted by: NCMatt1 | August 14, 2009 2:13 PM | Report abuse

Granted this wasn't the start we wanted, but why does everyone seem to be overlooking the fact that this game was played almost in its entirety by third and fourth string players? And even for the couple of series when the first team was in they were missing key starters (Moss, Portis, Thomas, Haynesworth). And to expect either the offense or defense to get untracked in one or two series is pretty unrealistic. As I recall the Ravens first teams didn't burn it up either.

Last year when we beat teams in preseason everyone said "our scrubs beat their scrubs ... big deal". What is it about that logic that makes it inappropriate this year?

Posted by: Rational_Man | August 14, 2009 2:13 PM | Report abuse

Granted this wasn't the start we wanted, but why does everyone seem to be overlooking the fact that this game was played almost in its entirety by third and fourth string players? And even for the couple of series when the first team was in they were missing key starters (Moss, Portis, Thomas, Haynesworth). And to expect either the offense or defense to get untracked in one or two series is pretty unrealistic. As I recall the Ravens first teams didn't burn it up either.

Last year when we beat teams in preseason everyone said "our scrubs beat their scrubs ... big deal". What is it about that logic that makes it inappropriate this year?

Posted by: Rational_Man | August 14, 2009 2:13 PM | Report abuse

Injuries - who cares. As if if everybody was healthy they would stand a chance. They suck! The offensive is so incapable of scoring points they should all hide their heads in shame. A squandered and wasted offseason. What incompetants!

Posted by: Trout1 | August 14, 2009 2:13 PM | Report abuse

sween - Just in reading about other teams camps it seems they do a lot more hitting than the Skins do. You can bet Baltimore does more live tackling with that defense than the Redskins do. Only time I can remember somewhat recently reading about the Skins having a tough camp was Martyball.

jerkoff clark - take that UNC/Terp trash elsewhere. You love the heels. No one gives a shti for the 20th time.

Posted by: ToddStinkston | August 14, 2009 2:13 PM | Report abuse

What about the kid from MD that got hurt, Burley?

I happened to watch Mike Wms on a couple of plays. HE IS NOT THE ANSWER. It would be great to get him a year on IR to get in football shape, but dude was a full step slow often.

Posted by: oknow1 | August 14, 2009 2:15 PM | Report abuse

A chunk of the story in 2009 will be the quality of play by key youngsters. Though its not obvious how this could be the case, given the shellacking of last night, several of these youngsters showed promise.

From what I've read/heard the ones showing promise include:

Orakpo, Jarmon, Henson, Rinehart, Kelly and Thomas

Some didn't
Barnes, Tryon, Davis

Seeing which young players are ready to step up IS a huge part of what preseason is about. So far, the results aren't bad

Posted by: zcezcest1 | August 14, 2009 2:18 PM | Report abuse

btw, I really really liked Jarmon at that end spot. The tip showed that the guy is mentally IN the game.Posted by: dcsween | August 14, 2009 2:06 PM

Agreed on J.J's play, mental play and physical prowess is scary at the end spot
.. They hyped this kid up in mini camp but I was a little skeptical on NFL standards. Watched him in college a little bit and he was pretty good.. It's pretty refreshing to see some of the rookies pan out especially the ones that weren't even supposed to be here until next year.. Jeremy Jarmon for pres!
BTW.. Justin Tryon= Leigh Torrence reincarnated

Posted by: redshot84 | August 14, 2009 2:18 PM | Report abuse

Michael Lewis the return guy at one time for the Saints was a beer truck driver. Can't recall any dudes who actually worked for FedEx/UPS.

Posted by: ToddStinkston | August 14, 2009 2:18 PM | Report abuse

I happened to watch Mike Wms on a couple of plays. HE IS NOT THE ANSWER.

Posted by: oknow1 | August 14, 2009 2:15 PM

That depends on the question doesn't it? I don't think he's expected to start. I saw him too and he looked decent all things considered. Tell me what you saw that makes you say this. Maybe I missed something.

Posted by: learnedhand1 | August 14, 2009 2:23 PM | Report abuse

Michael Lewis the return guy at one time for the Saints was a beer truck driver. Can't recall any dudes who actually worked for FedEx/UPS.

Posted by: ToddStinkston | August 14, 2009 2:18 PM | Report abuse

Bernie Parmalee, the RB that had his best yrs with the Dolphins in the 90's was a UPS worker before the Dolphins signed him.

Now, I didn't watch the game but from what I gather, not putting ANY points on the board should be a slight concern. But to counter that, Moss and Portis, the main cogs of the offense did not play, now if they did and the Skins still didn't score, that would be cause for great concern. Anyhow, the big problem coming into this season was the Offense and they proceed to come out and put a big goose egg. All the while, Brady comes out and throws 2td's even though he hasn't played in a yr. Hmm..

Posted by: ga8085 | August 14, 2009 2:24 PM | Report abuse

beantowngreg=joe theisman!!!!

saw the game last night...good news is we don't have to worry about a quarterback controversy. the bad news is that we won't have a QB controversy. all our QBs are poop!

here's looking forward to 2010-11!!!!

Posted by: dealer1 | August 14, 2009 2:29 PM | Report abuse

NCMatt, whoa big fella, try some decaf

I'm not concerned that the Ravens are ahead of us at this moment, a month away from games that count.

Tryon and Barnes aren't key players. Our CBs are Hall, Rogers and Smoot. 3 deep. Our DBs are Landry, Horton, Doughty and Moore. 4 deep. Even with an injury or two, Barnes or Tryon won't be our prime nickel or dime guys.

On Thomas and Kelly, if you ONLY judge by endzone appearances, then you're right. But that's not the most useful way to judge a guy. Were they running good patterns, making catches when the ball came their way? The folks that saw the game seem to think so. Plus, we're not reading about either of them on the injury report today.

Williams and Rinehart could easily be total busts. From last night's reviews people saw that they had some game in them. That's good news.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | August 14, 2009 2:29 PM | Report abuse

LH, nah Fletch has the goods. He's not a turnover machine, he won't get sacks, but he knows the defense in and out, and he rarely gets beat. That's more than enough from a MLB for me.

...But, he DID get beat yesterday, and that's why I was so surprised. If those types of things start happening on a regular basis, LBF's positives go right down the drain.

Posted by: psps23 | August 14, 2009 2:29 PM | Report abuse


the difference between the two offensive strategies last night...

cam cameron for baltimore, found our weaknesses early on with the cornerbacks, then the linebackers covering the running backs and exploited them both all night long...

jim zorn however, seems to have set plays called, and we don't attack the defense weaknesses...

if the zorn's plays work... fine... if not... oh well...zorn hasn't figured out how to counter attack and re-strategize when something isn't working...

he stayed with the same pre-conceived, dink-dunk crap all night for every quarterback...

hey zorn, how about you game plan to your quarterbacks strengths...

campbell can throw it a mile, and yet you have him throwing 3 yard passes and flanker screens...

hey zorn, how about you game plan the defense weaknesses first and attack them from jump street, like baltimore did to us last night...

it's going to be a long year...

hey bill cowher & mike shanahan, get your popcorn ready!


Posted by: docdwb | August 14, 2009 2:32 PM | Report abuse

were any of the players or coaches upset, mad, pissed off about such a pathetic showing last night? it just seems like the skins accept these types of sorry performances

Posted by: coparker5 | August 14, 2009 1:26 PM

Yeah, Albert Haynesworth

I think I am going to actually like this dude, he was talking on the sideline with one of the reporters and you can tell he was irritated. He dont like to lose. I think he is going to be the type to be in players face and get after them if they aint producing.

Posted by: GreatOne1 | August 14, 2009 2:37 PM | Report abuse

You forgot to add that he doesn't get tackles at or behind the line of scrimmage either.

On another note, the level of panic after one pre-season game is hysterical.

Posted by: learnedhand1 | August 14, 2009 2:39 PM | Report abuse

The veterans have spent most of training camp being pampered by the head coach. Zorn hasn't come right out and said it, but the implied message is that training camp is for the rookies, second year guys and players on the bubble. So, when a limited group of veterans start in a pre-season game and they are sluggish and not really into it, that is the head coach's doing. You practice like you're playing and when you're playing, you don't have to elevate your game. Both Zorn and Campbell need to start raising their voices and getting into people's faces. They need to act like their jobs are on the line because they are. Stop making excuses for people and start demanding accountability.

When Cooley missed that block that almost got Campbell killed, Campbell should have gotten in Cooley's face and told him, "You stop worrying about looking good for the cameras and start worrying about protecting my backside or you'll never see another pass".

Clinton Portis is not my favorite player on the team, but he is the only player that has demanded accountability of his coaches and teammates. When he raked his offensive linemen over the coals at the beginning of last season, they responded because they knew he was right. There needs to be a vocal leader on this team, and if Campbell is going to hide in Zorn's petticoats, then it is time for someone else to step up.

Posted by: RedSkinHead | August 14, 2009 2:43 PM | Report abuse

Zeke, in his own world, comfortable that last night was a step forward for this team.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | August 14, 2009 2:45 PM | Report abuse

I dunno, what can you learn from a game like that?

John Thompson asked a guest on yesterday's show what he expected to see from the Redskins vs. Baltimore. The guest replied he wanted to see good crisp execution from the offense. Thompson was surprised. "Well, I doubt you'll see that," he said. Implying: what are you, nuts?

That's not what first preseason games are all about.

Before somebody jumps in and shouts that you saw great execution from the Ravens: no, you didn't. You saw unnecessary penalties and a few long passes based more on Skins' mistakes than Ravens' excellence.

What does it say about the upcoming season? Not much.

Posted by: Samson151 | August 14, 2009 2:49 PM | Report abuse

mattsoundworld

A voice of reason smothered by the fearful shouts of the maddening crowd:

"Remembering that we were crowned Super Bowl favorites after the Ol' Ball Coach pulled the pants down on the 49er's in Osaka, I shall refrain from consigning our season to the basement because some rookie mistakes popped up against the AFC Conference runner-up."


I hear ya, bruh.

Let's wait to the third game with the pats before we start with the torch and pitch forks.

Posted by: MistaMoe | August 14, 2009 2:52 PM | Report abuse

Forage through the flamepile, Dan..If the tree sh*ts, wear it..

Posted by: frak | August 14, 2009 2:53 PM | Report abuse

dealer = matt millen.....

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | August 14, 2009 2:53 PM | Report abuse

BTW, I notice the Oakland Raiders laid 31 points and 426 yards of offense on the Cowpokes last night.

Guess Raider fans ought to reserve their playoff tickets, huh?

Posted by: Samson151 | August 14, 2009 2:53 PM | Report abuse

Don't worry zeke, I'm there with you. Most of the actual question marks that were supposed to be tested in the game turned out to be positive. Pass-protection from the offensive line, Orakpo, Jarmon, Kelly, Thomas, and even Davis showed stuff you wanted to see. The overall flow of the game, the playcalling, the play of the starters...nobody should really care about that in the first preseason game.

Posted by: psps23 | August 14, 2009 2:54 PM | Report abuse

Also BTW, I sense that several of the regular posters here appear to have sustained some pretty serious injuries to the psyche. Let's hope they recover quickly.

Posted by: Samson151 | August 14, 2009 3:03 PM | Report abuse

Also BTW, I sense that several of the regular posters here appear to have sustained some pretty serious injuries to the psyche. Let's hope they recover quickly.

Posted by: Samson151 | August 14, 2009 3:03 PM | Report abuse
-----------------------------------------

We've had a spate of sprained prefrontal cortexes. I think we need to enforce warm-ups before breaking into blog

Posted by: mattsoundworld | August 14, 2009 3:06 PM | Report abuse

Joe Theisman and Matt Millen ... you guys really should log out and sign up again with those names.

Stinkston, I'm not sure that the lackadaisy was less live hitting in practice ... or some other level of unnecessary comfort during camp (new attitude toward protecting high value assets from injury, vets going home at night during two-a-days, maybe other stuff).

Posted by: dcsween | August 14, 2009 3:11 PM | Report abuse

"It's just a dull pain, basically."

Yeah..just like this blog

Posted by: Bebunk | August 14, 2009 3:13 PM | Report abuse

I'm optimistic about the Skins, based on what I've gathered about the O-line and the young receivers. I expect Zorn and Campbell both to make big strides this year.

Having not watched this game, my biggest concern is Ladell Betts. He has not been the least bit impressive in about 2 years.

Posted by: Alan4 | August 14, 2009 3:19 PM | Report abuse

Speaking of prefrontal cortex, mine rationalizes the priorities of preseason as this:

#1 - Health. Remember when Clinton Portis jacked that Bengals DB on the INT return? That was a sick hit, but eventually led to season ending surgery and our offense regressed (though I am more than happy to throw Weird Al under the bus on this one.

#2 - See #1

#3 - Evaluation. We pretty much know what we have in our vets. We don't know what we have from our rookies. Let them play.

#4 - Execution. Cooley is on tape whiffing on a block. I guess he wasn't kidding when he said JC needed to grow a pair (of crutches?). But this is the least important component of the preseason, ESPECIALLY during the first game. We still have 3 more to correct these things.

Posted by: mattsoundworld | August 14, 2009 3:23 PM | Report abuse

I love that it's a Friday afternoon in late summer and most of us are finding some way to obsess about the Skins... or obsess about others' obsessing about the Skins... this bodes well for the blog. Things are only going to get better as more fubbal activities are demonstrated.

Posted by: NateinthePDX | August 14, 2009 3:23 PM | Report abuse

With all the questions at O-line and heat on the offense this year coming from the media and people like us. One would think Zorn would want to make scoring look easy to shut us up, instead they laid an egg. I'm not worried because it's preseason and apparently the O-line pass protected well, but damn.....1 touchdown please. Pretty please

Posted by: iH8dallas | August 14, 2009 3:25 PM | Report abuse

Yeah, I agree with Nate. I believe that RI accomplished all of its objectives relative to the first pre-season game; angst, disgust, confusion and second guessing are all operating at mid-season form.

Posted by: JohnDinHouston | August 14, 2009 3:32 PM | Report abuse

I said before the game that if none of our starters played, I'd be fine because its really abut evaluating the 2nd tier.

I'm not worried about the defense because there are plenty of solid vets, plenty of talent and a very good D/C. And a few of the kids looked good, too.

I'm still concerned about the OL, but at least Rinehart might be OK after all. I'm not concerned that Campbell doesn't have his timing down with our #7 WR. Portis and Moss -- its about doing the minimum to get the timing down -- and the max about staying healthy. Yesterday, they stayed healthy.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | August 14, 2009 3:33 PM | Report abuse

Losing during preseason is okay. Being shutout is not. Being disgraced on the field of battle is not okay. Shame on any of you to say otherwise.

Someone on here mentioned the blowout preseason win against San Francisco years ago when Spurrier was a coach and how that had no reflection on how the regular season went for the Skins. How did San Francisco do that year? There has got to be a minimum level of mediocrity that you wiil refuse to hide under. It's just about pride in being a football player. Zorn should tell his starters that they play the next game until they score a touchdown.

Posted by: RedSkinHead | August 14, 2009 3:35 PM | Report abuse

I'm hoping Albert is getting hyped to play just watching from the sidelines, and takes out his adrenaline on Eli Manning's face.

Posted by: iH8dallas | August 14, 2009 3:36 PM | Report abuse

"We felt good. We felt comfortable. I thought the offensive line did a good job of protecting. We came out and completed our first two passes."
HAHAHA

0:23???????

Eight and eight

Back in acouple of weekd

Posted by: 8andeight | August 14, 2009 3:37 PM | Report abuse

I don't want to hate on Ladell Betts too much, but has anyone noticed dude has 11 career rushing TDs on 720 carries?

By comparison, a lot of us made a joke out of old T.J Duckett when he spent a single unproductive year on the bench here... Duckett has 44 career rushing TDs on 717 carries.

Am I wrong to think Betts has absolutely no nose for the end zone?

Posted by: Alan4 | August 14, 2009 3:37 PM | Report abuse

Someone on here mentioned the blowout preseason win against San Francisco years ago when Spurrier was a coach and how that had no reflection on how the regular season went for the Skins. How did San Francisco do that year? There has got to be a minimum level of mediocrity that you wiil refuse to hide under. It's just about pride in being a football player. Zorn should tell his starters that they play the next game until they score a touchdown.

Posted by: RedSkinHead | August 14, 2009 3:35 PM | Report abuse

I like the way you think

Posted by: iH8dallas | August 14, 2009 3:37 PM | Report abuse

Yeah, I agree with Nate. I believe that RI accomplished all of its objectives relative to the first pre-season game; angst, disgust, confusion and second guessing are all operating at mid-season form.

Posted by: JohnDinHouston | August 14, 2009 3:32 PM | Report abuse
----------------------------------------

*Bursting In*

No one expects the Insider Missionnnn! Our primary weapon is angst. Angst and disgust.

Our TWO primary weapons are angst and disgust. Disgust and angst. And confusion.

Our THREE primary weapons are angst, disgust, confusion and an almost undying devotion to the Redskins.

Amongst our weaponry are such diverse tools as... I'll come in again...

Posted by: mattsoundworld | August 14, 2009 3:38 PM | Report abuse

"Back in acouple of weekd"

In the time away, perhaps you could learn to spell.....

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | August 14, 2009 3:40 PM | Report abuse

Great....word is Colt Brennan is now dating Jessica Simpson. Not what this team needs right now.

Posted by: beas13 | August 14, 2009 3:42 PM | Report abuse

Great....word is Colt Brennan is now dating Jessica Simpson. Not what this team needs right now.

Posted by: beas13 | August 14, 2009 3:42 PM | Report abuse

Jim Zorn's playcalling reminds me of fighting my siblings when I was a kid. Zorn is the brother that lays on his back and kicks up at you. It's not going to hurt anyone or get them off your back. It's just easy to defend and annoying to watch, and eventually you will get hurt doing it. Sometime the little brother has to get up and throw a haymaker at you.

Posted by: iH8dallas | August 14, 2009 3:43 PM | Report abuse

I don't think it is time to panic yet. I do believe it is unacceptable to get goose egged in pre-season. We had several bright spots in Orakpo, Jarmon, and the young WRs. Tryon is still garbage regardless of the hype that goes with being associated with D. Green. The defense will be very good. It will all come down to Zorn's play calling which I believe was one of the worst in the league last year. Zorn needs to be held accountable and not blame the players for everything. He did take over a playoff team for goodness sakes. Big armed QBs shouldn't throw 3 yard passes all the time.

Posted by: dcwun | August 14, 2009 3:44 PM | Report abuse

RSH, I think the "Osaka Bowl" was in the 2002 preseason. The 49ers went 10-6 in 2002, including a week 3 win over the Redskins, and won a home playoff game before losing in the divisional round to the Bucs, who went on to win that Super Bowl.

Does that help or hurt the point you were making about the Skins' being shut out last night?

Posted by: NateinthePDX | August 14, 2009 3:45 PM | Report abuse

Hey, I was browsing a blog on healthcare reform and guess who I stumbled across? This guy:

"No Tort Reform.
No Health Care Reform.
It's that simple.
Posted by: hclark1"

I was expecting something along the lines of "Tort the Terps!! UNC Forever!!! I'm An Idiot!!!!"


Posted by: Samson151 | August 14, 2009 3:50 PM | Report abuse

Having not watched this game, my biggest concern is Ladell Betts. He has not been the least bit impressive in about 2 years.

Posted by: Alan4 | August 14, 2009 3:19 PM

I don't want to hate on Ladell Betts too much, but has anyone noticed dude has 11 career rushing TDs on 720 carries?

Am I wrong to think Betts has absolutely no nose for the end zone?

Posted by: Alan4 | August 14, 2009 3:37 PM

You're thinking of Old Betts. Now we got new BETTIS!

Posted by: dcsween | August 14, 2009 3:50 PM | Report abuse

learnedhand: "Question for the group: Why is it that whenever a football player's career as a professional athlete is in doubt, the presumption is he's going to be relegated to a job doing manual labor like delivering packages?"

I think they make that reference because of the stadium sponsor. If it was the Poulan WeedEater Bowl, I'm pretty confident they'd have made a joke about living on the edger.

Posted by: Samson151 | August 14, 2009 3:56 PM | Report abuse

The timing of the offense is obviously still a work in progress. That's why I do not understand sitting Portis and Moss. We need these games to get our timing up to game speed. Gotta get them in pads and on the field to work some of this out. Even if it's a quarter each game.

I'd rather work it out in August then all of September when the games count.

Posted by: edvar | August 14, 2009 4:00 PM | Report abuse

I don't want to hate on Ladell Betts too much, but has anyone noticed dude has 11 career rushing TDs on 720 carries?

Am I wrong to think Betts has absolutely no nose for the end zone?

Posted by: Alan4 | August 14, 2009 3:37 PM
----------------------------------------

Portis is going to take any goal line carries just because he wants to score, so I'm not sure that is a meaningful stat.

When you consider career YPC, Betts tallys 4.1 vs. Portis 4.5, which is bolstered by his two years in Denver at a 5.5 YPC clip.

I think we need a slasher, but Betts has been a reliable, quiet, guy for a long time.

Posted by: mattsoundworld | August 14, 2009 4:03 PM | Report abuse

Yeah, I agree with Nate. I believe that RI accomplished all of its objectives relative to the first pre-season game; angst, disgust, confusion and second guessing are all operating at mid-season form.

Posted by: JohnDinHouston | August 14, 2009 3:32 PM

Just like a family reunion. Everyone took up just where they left off last time -- blaming Vinnie.

Posted by: talent_evaluator | August 14, 2009 4:08 PM | Report abuse

Doesn't matter what happens in preseason, I know what we've got with:
Chris Horton
LaRon Landry
Carlos Rogers
DeAngelo Hall
Fred Smoot
London Fletcher
Albert Haynesworth
Andre Carter
Kedric Golston
Jason Campbell
Clinton Portis
Santana Moss
Chris Cooley
Derrick Dockery
Casey Rabach
Antwaan Randle El
Hunter Smith
Rock Cartwright
LaDell Betts
Todd Collins

I'm concerned about
Chris Samuels
Randy Thomas
Stephon Heyer
Cornelius Griffin
Rocky McIntosh


I'd like to know more about:
Orakpo
Barnes
Jarmon
Bridges
Henson
Philip Daniels
Wynn
Kelly
D. Thomas
Hackett
Rinehart
Montgomery
Alexander
Glenn
Mitchell
Williams (both of em)

And there are a bunch of guys that just aren't going to be critical.

I'm sure my list isn't quite right, but several of the 'I'd like to know more' guys did OK last night. Which is good news.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | August 14, 2009 4:11 PM | Report abuse

didn't see game because I'm in Maine eating lobster. Lots of Lobster.
So I agree with everyone.

But I wonder how the Pollyanna's are saoi thrilled about a zip-23 skunking.

Posted by: Corkczar | August 14, 2009 4:12 PM | Report abuse

Also mildly curious how signing in on a strange computer gets me back my old "corkczar" handle.

Sincerely,

TheCork

Posted by: Corkczar | August 14, 2009 4:15 PM | Report abuse

didn't see game because I'm in Maine eating lobster. Lots of Lobster.

Posted by: Corkczar | August 14, 2009 4:12 PM

Go to Maine. Eat a lobster. This is so predictable and so boring.

Go to Maine and eat a crab. That would be news.

Posted by: talent_evaluator | August 14, 2009 4:17 PM | Report abuse

The Washington Redkins, with the first pick in the 2010 NFL Draft, select Tim Tebow of Florida!

Posted by: oldnova | August 14, 2009 4:17 PM | Report abuse

"Just like a family reunion. Everyone took up just where they left off last time -- blaming Vinnie.

Posted by: talent_evaluator"

All we're missing is Sports_Guru. Surely he could blow our mind by stating that Brennan's interception was a result of Campbell's lack of leadership.

Posted by: psps23 | August 14, 2009 4:19 PM | Report abuse

cork, considering that its preseason, and the team came out of the game relatively healthy, thats a plus. I think pretty much everyone wants to see more progress offensively, so there you go. Take it for what its worth, which is a meaningless pre-season game......hopefully they take steps forward in their 2nd game.

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | August 14, 2009 4:19 PM | Report abuse

C'mon, psps23, you know Guru would blame Brennan's interception on Campbell's stupidity, not his lack of leadership.

Posted by: NateinthePDX | August 14, 2009 4:24 PM | Report abuse

Go to Maine and eat a crab. That would be news.

Posted by: talent_evaluator | August 14, 2009 4:17 PM | Report abuse
-----------------------------------------

You should see what passes for 'Maryland' crab cake here (Connecticut). It's pretty close to criminal.

Posted by: mattsoundworld | August 14, 2009 4:27 PM | Report abuse

C'mon, psps23, you know Guru would blame Brennan's interception on Campbell's stupidity, not his lack of leadership.

Posted by: NateinthePDX | August 14, 2009 4:24 PM | Report abuse
----------------------------------------

I'd havta disagree with both of you and say he would point to Campbell's slow release.

Posted by: mattsoundworld | August 14, 2009 4:28 PM | Report abuse

The Washington Redkins, with the first pick in the 2010 NFL Draft, select Tim Tebow of Florida!

Posted by: oldnova | August 14, 2009 4:17 PM


Tebow is the third Gator to win the Heisman Trophy, joining Steve Spurrier and Danny Wuerffel.

Considering Spurrier's and Wuerffel's NFL QB'ing, pardon me while I barf a little at the thought of the Skins wasting another 1st round pick on a QB.

Posted by: Alan4 | August 14, 2009 4:28 PM | Report abuse

hclark1,

First of all, from the bottom of my heart you can stick it up your arse. Second, you're a Carolina football fan and you have the nerve to talk trash? Carolina blue has traditionally stood for powder puff. If you're going to talk college football trash then at least come from a program that has traditionally fared better than Maryland. Not Carolina powder puff blue. Fear the Turtle!

Posted by: croftonpost | August 14, 2009 4:30 PM | Report abuse

I ate a whole lot of fiberglass insulation. It wasn't cotton candy like that man said... my stomach's itchy.

I drank a lava lamp. It wasn't lava.

I pooped a tape recorder.

I pooped a Cornish game hen.

I pooped a hammer.

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | August 14, 2009 4:33 PM | Report abuse

If theres a QB at #1, it'll be Bradford unless the butt burglar moves to Oklahoma.

Posted by: mattsoundworld | August 14, 2009 4:37 PM | Report abuse

hopefully they take steps forward in their 2nd game.

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | August 14, 2009 4:19 PM

Maybe they'll eat lobster instead of crab for their next pre-game meal.

Posted by: talent_evaluator | August 14, 2009 4:41 PM | Report abuse

I finally am watching the game and the Baltimore announcers are pretty boring. the thing that has strode out to me most was Kareem Moore. The dude is definately not afraid to smack the spit out of somebody! He looks really good and I keep getting that ST21 feeling when he lowers his shoulder. Fred Davis and tryon should be euthenized fred's last fumble was some weak sauce. I'm not too worried about the regular season our first team O looked pretty good. The running game was garbage but we had trashmen trying to run.

Posted by: murphyz | August 14, 2009 4:42 PM | Report abuse

Why is it that so many Raven fans think they are the standard by which all other NFL teams are built? For a team with one Lombardi trophy their fan base sure talks a lot of trash. They aren't even the standard in their own division. The last time I looked both the Redskins and Ravens have made the playoffs two out of the last four years.

Posted by: croftonpost | August 14, 2009 4:47 PM | Report abuse

That was a pathetic showing last night. As Don Banks says on SI.com:

"It's never too early to push the panic button in Washington, and I promise you somebody's mashing it as we speak in light of that debacle of a Redskins preseason opening 23-0 loss at Baltimore Thursday night. Not only did Washington's defense give up 500 yards of offense to the Ravens, with 399 of them coming in the passing game, the Redskins offense was just as ineffective.

Washington failed to reach the 50 on nine of its 12 possessions, and went 1 of 11 on third downs, with just 196 yards of total offense. That showing is going to do nothing to relieve the pressure on Redskins starting quarterback Jason Campbell, whose two drives produced only punts."

Posted by: quinn3 | August 14, 2009 4:49 PM | Report abuse

The running game was garbage but we had trashmen trying to run.

Posted by: murphyz | August 14, 2009 4:42 PM

Trashmen? This is our backfield outside of CPortis!

L Betts: 4 carries, 7 yards
M. Mason: 6 carries, 12 yards
R. Cartwright: 6 carries, 24 yards

This is a concern. Are our backs that crappy or was the O-line run-blocking that weak?

Posted by: Alan4 | August 14, 2009 4:49 PM | Report abuse

Keith Eoli for full time KR duties, he ran them back with a purpose

Posted by: murphyz | August 14, 2009 4:50 PM | Report abuse

Why is it that so many Raven fans think they are the standard by which all other NFL teams are built?

Posted by: croftonpost | August 14, 2009 4:47 PM

Better question was the one you already addresed: Why do Carolina fans think they've got anything other than roundball? UNC is the school that was built for people who couldn't get into Duke.

Posted by: talent_evaluator | August 14, 2009 4:50 PM | Report abuse

I don't want to hate on Ladell Betts too much, but has anyone noticed dude has 11 career rushing TDs on 720 carries?

By comparison, a lot of us made a joke out of old T.J Duckett when he spent a single unproductive year on the bench here... Duckett has 44 career rushing TDs on 717 carries.

Am I wrong to think Betts has absolutely no nose for the end zone?

Posted by: Alan4 | August 14, 2009 3:37 PM | Report abuse

Yes, I think you are. Duckett was the goal line/short yardage back for years in Atlanta when he was sharing the position with Warrick Dunn. Portis gets almost all the goal line carries for the 'Skins. You can't produce if you don't get the opportunities.

Posted by: rbpalmer | August 14, 2009 4:51 PM | Report abuse

That was a pathetic showing last night. As Don Banks says on SI.com:

Posted by: quinn3 | August 14, 2009 4:49 PM

It was a bad game. But, Don Banks would have written the same shti even if the 'Skins had won 35-3.

Posted by: talent_evaluator | August 14, 2009 4:54 PM | Report abuse

I think it was a combination bit more so the blocking. There were no holes for the backs to hit. Mason is the only one who showed the vision to at least try to bounce it outside. Betts only good season came behind a healthly OL who could run block. Our current cast outside of CP is a weak spot.

Posted by: murphyz | August 14, 2009 5:00 PM | Report abuse

If the Ravens had thrown for 399 on our first team defense in a regular season game -- yeah, panic would be about right. But they threw for 399 against guys who are rookies and aren't going to be here.

As for Campbell, his best WR target was ARE.

I'll push the panic button when there is reason to panic. This game was ugly, but its not even close to a panic scenario.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | August 14, 2009 5:04 PM | Report abuse

JM220, u made a statement and then seemingly backed off it by saying you considered dogs dirty irrespective of your faith...then why make the comment that "as a Muslim I know they are dirty animals"? I do not care if you/your faith consider them dirty or not (although there's clearly room for debate on the latter), they did not deserve the fate that Vick handed them. As for his punishment - I guess agree to disagree and have a wonderful day.

HAIL

Posted by: Notorious_LMG | August 14, 2009 5:04 PM | Report abuse

I've been boycotting SI since I found out Peter king was the reason it rook art so long to get into canton. I'm done with the major sports outlets they have gotten to the fox news point of complete bias.

Posted by: murphyz | August 14, 2009 5:05 PM | Report abuse

well, I know that the Redskins lost all of their pre-seasoon games in one of the Super Bowl years, and maybe two of them. So, once again, I say - get the windex out and polish up the trophy case.

Posted by: JohnDinHouston | August 14, 2009 2:08 PM | Report abuse

I believe they were 0-4 in '82 and '87 preseason?

Posted by: Notorious_LMG | August 14, 2009 5:07 PM | Report abuse

talent_evaluator... first you're an idiot... kids who go to unc typically never... ever wanted to go to Duke... mainly because Duke is actually a shi%$% school... in a terrible location... Education is solid but that's about all they have going for them... even the basketball program is in the decline...


Moving on... After reflecting about the game last night I am not nearly as upset with it. Yes we didn't show up. Yes our backups got embarrassed. Yes Tryon needs to be cut, now. However, we learned a lot and will have a lot of tape to go over.

Offensively we didn't have our 2 best offensive weapons on the field in CP and SM. I'm not saying that will make a huge difference, but it should help having our 2 best players on the field.

Also, on the defense, if Orakpo can create that kind of pressure with Haynesworth on the bench, imagine what he can do with him in the lineup. Plus, I think Jarmon isn't a project, I think he can be placed in the rotation this year and be productive. He looked great last night and definitely showed that he has potential.

Also, our O-line played way beyond anything I could have expected. Rinehart seems to be a guy who has potential as well, which would be nice since Randy is on his last tippy toe. If our line can stay healthy and play decent, I am not worried at all about this team. We will be a good team if they play well, if not, then we're looking at 8-8 if we're really really lucky.

Posted by: peoplearestupid1 | August 14, 2009 5:09 PM | Report abuse

That was a pathetic showing last night. As Don Banks says on SI.com:

Posted by: quinn3 | August 14, 2009 4:49 PM


Ok, your first mistake is listening to Don Banks...

"Pathetic" is quite the overstatement.

When you look at the starters...

*the pass-blocking was fine,

*the disappointment was JC throwing conservative, guess he's still watering his new "pair" and hopefully they'll be ripe by regular season

*run-blocking looked a little suspect, but there was no CP in the backfield, and I imagine that for purposes of that game the Oline was focused more on pass protection

*Ravens broke their drive open essentially on the one play when Ray Rice got away from London Fletcher, even so the Skins D looked good holding them to only 3 points after having 7-8 plays in the red zone (and on one of those plays, Andre Carter should have had a sack, but he was held and it wasn't called)


A bagel never feels good, granted. But the performance of the starters was not nearly as pathetic as Banks' overreaction to the stats.

Posted by: p1funk | August 14, 2009 5:14 PM | Report abuse

well, crap. I beeped the new post

beep beep

Posted by: JohnDinHouston | August 14, 2009 5:19 PM | Report abuse

talent_evaluator... first you're an idiot... kids who go to unc typically never... ever wanted to go to Duke... mainly because Duke is actually a shi%$% school... in a terrible location... Education is solid but that's about all they have going for them... even the basketball program is in the decline...

Posted by: peoplearestupid1 | August 14, 2009 5:09 PM

You must be a person because you illustrate so well your screen handle. Read what I said. I didn't say they wanted to go to Duke. I said they couldn't get in. They know their limitations and they're well suited for UNC.

"Education is solid but that's all they have going for them"? You say that like it's a bad thing. Dude, why do people (other than you) go to college?

It's in a terrible location? I always liked North Carolina, but if you've got something against it, then UNC is in a bad place, too.

Etc.

Posted by: talent_evaluator | August 14, 2009 5:19 PM | Report abuse

Does anyone have the Marty email add ? He can get this ship to float !

Posted by: FIREJIMZORN | August 14, 2009 5:24 PM | Report abuse

beep beep ... means new thread ... time for commenters to hit F5, reload, and move forward in time.

Posted by: dcsween | August 14, 2009 5:26 PM | Report abuse

I didn't see the game, but can anyone tell me whether the Ravens appeared to be game planning a little more than the Redskins? They seemed to be finding mismatches and exploiting them (repeatedly throwing toward Tryon), whereas, (according to some of you) Zorn did not seem to be responding to the conditions on the field. Not that that would make everything okay. Just wondering what you guys saw.

Posted by: FITS | August 14, 2009 5:33 PM | Report abuse

I have been censored so I can't respond talent but I will eventually.

Posted by: peoplearestupid1 | August 14, 2009 5:33 PM | Report abuse

One of the worst Redskin preseason performances ever was 1991. They were absolutely terrible that preseason. They were so bad that Gibbs was asked what he thought of a Super Bowl preseason prediction that looked pretty bleak at the time. Gibbs, who was really pissed about their preseason funk, retorted with the infamous Playboy rant. They smoked the Lions in their first regular season game in the process of an 11-0 start.

Posted by: croftonpost | August 14, 2009 5:39 PM | Report abuse

It did appear that way. However, who knows if it is in fact true. There is no question they were more motivated. The annual Redskin/Raven preseason game may mean nothing to us but it is real important to their fans and the coaches and players know it.

Posted by: croftonpost | August 14, 2009 5:42 PM | Report abuse


I went to the game. It was kind of frustrating in that you could see what they were trying to do and just didn't have the guy in the game that could do it. Running plays that would have gone for good gains if it were Portis, catches that would have been made if it was Moss or Cooley instead of Hagans or Davis. Davis has looked good at the practices I have attended, but he looked bad in real speed handling the ball loosely and fumbling twice. Another thing was with Sellars not in the game there was really no effective lead blocking from any of the TE. The O-line did not look that bad and for possibly the first time ever Jason Campbell actually checked down to his third option twice, but did not show any more accuracy than he evr has. WR still had to reach, jump and dive to try for too many balls. I think 1 of 6 was a well thrown ball, and the WR's still broke off routes too early to get the first down three times. Very Fristrating that guys who have played this game all their lives don't kno to run 7 yards on 3rd and 6 instead of 4 yards. Betts looked slow and indecisive. it may be time to put in a RB that has quicker feet and can hit the hole quicker.

The defense was exactly the same as last year when Springs was hurt. No real direction in the secondary and inferior athletes chasing faster players. The number of times Ravens QB's just dropped passes over out run DB's was sad, but each time I looked up it was good old Tryon or the other schmuck Dutch, both of which should be cut already unless Tryon can return kicks as he did in college. Tryon does have very good speed and I am not sure why he has not been given a chance on ST. Barnes looked like a rookie, but showed some skills at times. Probably didn't see it on TV because they don't show it when you actually cover your man good enough that he doesn't get thrown too. The pass rush again was a problem as the Ravens always had just enough time to get the play off. Jarmen is looking every bit as good as next years 3rd round pick would have looked, and with a year to learn should be head and shoulders above any college DE next year when he should have come out of college. I think the experiment of trying to make Orapko learn two positions should be over soon. He can play either spot and maybe this year we have plenty of DE so he should concentrate on LB until he learns that position in the NFL. Nobody manhandled him though that is for sure, but he was out of position a lot. If Haynesworth had played I think we would have seen a whole differetn attack.

I was disappointed that Marko Mitchell did not see more time as he has had exceptional hands in practice and is a big target.

As everyone has said it is just the forst preseason game and only about half the guys on each side of the ball will be the ones playing against the Giants on openiong day.

Posted by: dbrine1261 | August 14, 2009 6:57 PM | Report abuse

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