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John Hall Is Released

The inevitable is now official. The Skins oft-injured kicker John Hall, a Joe Gibbs favorite, lost his job this season when he was hurt again. Now he'll be on the free agent market. He's a hard-nosed guy who loved everything about football, but for three straight seasons he suffered major injuries and Gibbs showed much more loyaltly to him than seemingly anyone else would have.

But after going down again last season the writing was on the wall and Hall himself knew he would be let go, it was just a matter of when. Hall was due to count $1.5 million on the teams cap, so the Skins stand around $9-plus million under the cap, and could free up another $2.5 million should they opt to let Renaldo Wynn go at some point.

They could also always restructure a few more contracts should they require even more cap space (Marcus, Griffin and Daniels would all be candidates given the nature of their contracts).

By Jason La Canfora  |  March 7, 2007; 3:48 PM ET
 
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Next: The Skinny On The Biggies

Comments

Jason--Why did they let Hall go today and not yesterday or tomorrow? Do you read anything into the timing?

Posted by: KK | March 7, 2007 3:55 PM | Report abuse

Finally we let that guy go. Joe Gibbs is a bit too loyal to some players. He needs to worry more about the Redskins rather than to individuals he favors.

Posted by: Mode66 | March 7, 2007 3:56 PM | Report abuse

KK --

Dre Bly deal in the works.

Posted by: CMoney | March 7, 2007 3:58 PM | Report abuse

I just remember the excitement when we signed him.

It's gotta be disappointing.


Posted by: Cheyenne, WY | March 7, 2007 3:59 PM | Report abuse

CMoney--But Denver just told the AP that they'd give Captain Bly a few weeks to get aclimated to the altitude. They just know he'll come around.

Posted by: KK | March 7, 2007 4:01 PM | Report abuse

Cmoney, I don't think that's why they cut him.

Posted by: Lisa | March 7, 2007 4:05 PM | Report abuse

MAN U LILLE IS A snoozer 65 min in

Posted by: BIG J | March 7, 2007 4:07 PM | Report abuse

So who is out there to kick for us next year? I can never support an ex-cowboy as our kicker. Vanderjagt included.

Posted by: allstar | March 7, 2007 4:09 PM | Report abuse

Gibbs was definitely too loyal to John Hall. Even when he was healthy he was a pretty average kicker. Suisham is young with some upside. He had a shaky start, but started to look pretty consistent the last few games of the season. Hopefully he kicks well for us this upcoming season. We haven't had a really good kicker in a long time though.

Posted by: Ktron | March 7, 2007 4:09 PM | Report abuse

When players are cut & you say, money is freed up to sign someone else, I hope all realize that those players also have to be replaced!Vets take up 700,000 of cap space so all the players cut at the very least have to be replaced at this number!!Not as much free space as being portrayed!

Posted by: Our Cap misleading | March 7, 2007 4:09 PM | Report abuse

Lisa - we're just talking about timing. Obviously they were going to cut him at some point. But it makes sense to do it now to position themselves to absorb the cap hit involved with trading Springs and/or trading for Bly.

Posted by: CMoney | March 7, 2007 4:09 PM | Report abuse

I said in it on the other posts, if we trade for more picks, then we should draft Mason Crosby out of Colorado to kick for us. He has a huge leg.

Posted by: gethanr13 | March 7, 2007 4:11 PM | Report abuse

Jay feely is a FA might cost $$ but hes good and keeps him from gmen?

Posted by: sign jay | March 7, 2007 4:11 PM | Report abuse

When players are cut & you say, money is freed up to sign someone else, I hope all realize that those players also have to be replaced!Vets take up 700,000 of cap space so all the players cut at the very least have to be replaced at this number!!Not as much free space as being portrayed!

Posted by: Our Cap misleading | March 7, 2007 04:09 PM


Come on now poster under your 25th new name. You gotta come correct if you're gonna hate. When a vet signs for the "veteran minimum", the team gets a salary cap break, and the contract only counts $450,000 on the cap.

Posted by: 4-12 | March 7, 2007 4:12 PM | Report abuse

banged it in the ole onion bag

Larson's Last

Posted by: Tommy Smyth | March 7, 2007 4:15 PM | Report abuse

I was just riding in the car it sounded like Bram hand something new about the Bly trade saying it looked even closer to happening and it'll involve both teams' 1st rounder.......

Posted by: 4th Floor | March 7, 2007 4:16 PM | Report abuse

Geth,

I'm with you man, unfortunately we don't have the luxury of enough picks to take him in the mid-early rounds. We would have to hope he falls to the 5th, (he won't) and even then we still need DL and OL with our last 2 picks.

If we pull some of these trades and land some draft picks in return, i'd say go for it, he may be the next Elam, BUT Gibbs also has never been too much a fan of inexperienced kickers. Where's Lohmiller when you need him?

Posted by: allstar | March 7, 2007 4:16 PM | Report abuse

4-12 is right, besides, who says that spot needs to be filled by a Veteran?

Jason - any word on previous rumors that Springs was looking to "pull a LaVar" and give back a portion of his bonus to get out of here?

Posted by: BT | March 7, 2007 4:17 PM | Report abuse

From cnnsi.com re: Feely. I have seen him miss a number of kicks, a Seattle game comes to mind when he blew 2 or 3.

Kicker Jay Feely was in Miami meeting with the Dolphins, who seemed ready to sign him and cut ties with veteran Olindo Mare. Perhaps spurred by the interest, the Giants informed Feely they are preparing a more lucrative offer and now there's a chance he'll return for a third season in New York.
-- New York Post

Posted by: cdubb | March 7, 2007 4:18 PM | Report abuse

And then there was one (dun dun DUNNN. JetSkins that is). I said it once and I'll say it again. Shaun Suisham is the next Ali Haji Sheik.

Posted by: Denesh | March 7, 2007 4:20 PM | Report abuse

Does anyone else out there wish that we start bringing in FEWER players from teams like the 49ers, Vikings, Bills and Lions and more from the, you know, non-horrible teams?

Posted by: Diesel | March 7, 2007 4:22 PM | Report abuse

I think they released him today because Skins' geeks like me crave a new tidbit every day. Cruel to the players, I know. But MR. Snyder has me hooked on the news cycle like Deion Sanders hooked on his mirror. I gotta keep looking! Hurry up and trade somebody! I'm already bored.

Posted by: Kmag | March 7, 2007 4:29 PM | Report abuse

Diesel, We tried that with former Pats players and that didn't work.

Posted by: gethanr13 | March 7, 2007 4:30 PM | Report abuse

NFL's 10 Most Controversial Players according to (cnnsi.com)

1) T.O.
2) Randy Moss
3) Pacman Jones
4) Chris Henry
5) Jeremy Shockey
6) Tank Johnson
7) Michael Vick
8) Shawne Merriman
9) Sean Taylor
10) Ricky Willaims

Posted by: Ktron | March 7, 2007 4:30 PM | Report abuse

Diesel -- Not me. I care much more about the player (Smoot, Fletcher) than where he played last. We brought one in from the Patriots, and that didn't work out. We brought one in from the Super Bowl Steelers, and he's still adapting to our system (or our system to him).

Now if we could bring in a GM from one of the non-horrible teams, that's a different proposition. I'd be with you on that one.

Posted by: KK | March 7, 2007 4:33 PM | Report abuse

Kmag! Tell it like it is. Two thumbs up. Way up. Etc.

Posted by: KK | March 7, 2007 4:34 PM | Report abuse

Does anyone else out there wish that we start bringing in FEWER players from teams like the 49ers, Vikings, Bills and Lions and more from the, you know, non-horrible teams?

Posted by: Diesel | March 7, 2007 04:22 PM

Diesel, Diesel, Diesel... I thought we've gone over this already! You see, this is what they call a monopoly. You have a stranglehold on a market that's vastly untouched. Then you overpay for the goods to make the goods better. Giving them more money's bound to make them play oodles better, right? Right? I mean, it can't be the players that were bad, it was the teams they were on. Am I right, or am I right?

Now, let's get back to topic, Diesel. Can I call you Dies? Yes? Yes? Good. Dies, now about that land bridge to Asia....

Posted by: FlimFlam | March 7, 2007 4:34 PM | Report abuse

KK, Skins actually brought in two Patriots (Fauria and Patten).

Time to re-rev up the FO purge rumor ... Bobby de Paul from Chicago for GM!

Posted by: dcsween | March 7, 2007 4:35 PM | Report abuse

Poor Sean gets no respect. Only number nine? What's he got to do to move up on this Big Board?

Posted by: KK | March 7, 2007 4:36 PM | Report abuse

allstar - "Where's Lohmiller when you need him"? - probably still hitting the uprights. (he's actually a HS coach, I believe).

So, what are the "needs", as it stands, without considering Bly. Corner help, as always, O-lineman, D-lineman (multiple), and TE (a Warren type).

I think the Skins will bring in competetion for Suisham - they have to. But, Suisham only missed 1 kick, right? It was the difference in a game, though. I bet they look for a vet.

Posted by: Shotgun | March 7, 2007 4:37 PM | Report abuse

Fellas, Swish-ham was like 8-9 last year. Cut the kid some slack. He's got a strong leg and he'll be cheaper than Vandershank or Feely. And doing all this work to obtain addtional draft picks and then drafting a kicker? That's a Cerrato move, we're trying to stay away from those.

Put that cap space to good use by signing a nice stop gap guard like Raleigh McKensie.

Posted by: etrod | March 7, 2007 4:38 PM | Report abuse

John Hall is a good kicker.........FOR ME TO P**P on!

Posted by: ArtMonkToTheSticks | March 7, 2007 4:39 PM | Report abuse

btw, with Hall released, that's one more CORRECT for Jason on his Crystal Ball predictions from a few weeks ago. [Go back to the first post today "My Head Hurts, Too Many Numbers" to see Jason's so far stellar predictions.]

So the next up is Patten. I really liked Patten. Seemed like a straight up dude. Those last two (consecutive) drops for what could have been first downs in that last Giants game ... that turned out to be the last few plays of the game ... sorry, David.

Also, redskins.com doesn't list Jeff Posey on its free agency monitor. Did he get a two year deal?

Posted by: dcsween | March 7, 2007 4:41 PM | Report abuse

Sean Taylor gets no respect? Respect is scared of Sean Taylor. It knows better than to come near him.

Posted by: Anonymous | March 7, 2007 4:41 PM | Report abuse

NFL's top 10 most awesome players according to (etrod):
1. Sean Taylor
2. Sean Taylor
3. Sean Taylor
4. Sean Taylor
5. Sean Taylor
6. Sean Taylor
7. Sean Taylor
8. Sean Taylor
9. Sean Taylor
10. Sean Taylor

Posted by: etrod | March 7, 2007 4:42 PM | Report abuse

Sean already pointed a gun at respect, too?

Posted by: Anonymous | March 7, 2007 4:42 PM | Report abuse

I'm cool with giving Suisham a shot against somebody. If we let him go and he turns into David Akers, we'll look stupid once again.

Posted by: cdubb | March 7, 2007 4:43 PM | Report abuse

the gun was holding sean taylor back from kicking respect's guts out

Posted by: Anonymous | March 7, 2007 4:44 PM | Report abuse

Say, any of you nerds in this cyber circle jerk know where I can get some steamed squash?

Posted by: daveb55 | March 7, 2007 4:45 PM | Report abuse

Shotgun, truthfully, I think Skins are currently good at CB and OG. Enough guys (currently) in house to get the job done. If Springs leaves, different story.

The needs are what we thought they were (plus the one on Saunders' wish list). We need (1) DE ... Phil's sack #s slipping, (2) DT ... Cornelius aging, and (3) upgrade at blocking TE. Personally, I think Yoder is the guy, but apparently Saunders doesn't. Oh, one more thing we need ... we NEED more COWBELL. I got the FEVER for MORE COWBELL.

Posted by: dcsween | March 7, 2007 4:45 PM | Report abuse

dcsween- I don't think Posey signed with anyone yet. He's one of those vets that will probably be around during training camp, available for the veteran minimum.

Agree on Patten. Although, he apparently will only save about $750,000 if they cut him, so maybe they're waiting until June 1 to spread the remaining bonus money over '07 and '08

Posted by: 4-12 | March 7, 2007 4:47 PM | Report abuse

Todd Yoder is the Sean Taylor of blocking tight ends.

Posted by: etrod | March 7, 2007 4:47 PM | Report abuse

Maske reports OG Edwin Mulitalo was realeased by Ravens. Only played 4 games last year, but probably played with Casey, right?

Wonder if gets a look.

Posted by: Shotgun | March 7, 2007 4:48 PM | Report abuse

shotgun jlc had that info over an hour ago

Posted by: Anonymous | March 7, 2007 4:51 PM | Report abuse

FlimFlam (from The 13 Ghosts of Scooby Doo?),
I see now... so you're saying that the kid who does a terrible job of mowing my neighbors lawn for $15 will do a great job of mowing my lawn if I pay him $30.
BRILLIANT!
I should have paid more attention in my Micro Economics class at JMU.

Posted by: Diesel | March 7, 2007 4:52 PM | Report abuse

Edwin Mulitalo is 6'3 and 350. I can't help but think of Finch from the movie 'Wildcats'

Posted by: etrod | March 7, 2007 4:53 PM | Report abuse

Diesel --

It probably depends on how you write the contract. Put the right incentives in it and Voila! the grass is greener on your side of the fence.

I taught your micro course at JMU, and you spent too much time looking up skirts and not enough time looking in your book, but your priorities were probably right.

Posted by: KK | March 7, 2007 4:55 PM | Report abuse

perfect day of work, reading this, listening to UCONN get spanked by Syracuse and now I get to take my 16 year old daughter to a Nickleback concert--they better sell drinks there

Posted by: connskins | March 7, 2007 4:55 PM | Report abuse

Sean Taylor is really The Terminator sent to our time. Every opposing player has been reprogrammed in his system as Sarah Connor.

Posted by: Ktron | March 7, 2007 4:55 PM | Report abuse

With the draft coming up, I did a quick review of 116 Redskin draft picks from 1990 forward. I rated them with a quick top-of-my-head evaluation from excellent, good, fair or poor. And I tired to err on the side of optimism.

The results?

Excellent: 6 (Brian Mitchell, Stephen Davis, Champ Bailey, Jon Jansen, Chris Samuels, Chris Cooley)

Good: 16

Fair: 18

Poor: 75

These drafts have sucked - especially 3rd round and beyond. There was hardly anyone who ever even played backup roles or on special teams. Names like Andre Johnson (1st round 1996, OT); Mark Fisher (5th round 1998, C); Kurt Haws (4th round, 1994, TE); Lloyd Harrison (3rd round 2000, CB); Cliff Russell (3rd round 2002, WR).

I wonder, compared to other teams, where the Redskins stand, especially in mid-round picks who at least contribute on special teams or play significant secondary roles? Washington has been bad for a long time due to wasted picks like those.

Posted by: G Money | March 7, 2007 4:56 PM | Report abuse

The theory that nothing could put a scratch on Sean Taylor was disproven when Sean Taylor scratched himself. He then kicked his own a$$ because NOBODY puts a scratch on Sean Taylor.

It's good to see some new blood chiming in with the Reaper smack.

Posted by: etrod | March 7, 2007 4:58 PM | Report abuse

LaVar didn't rate as excellent?

Posted by: 4th | March 7, 2007 4:59 PM | Report abuse

Do you think the FO realizes they're no good at this and that's why they trade away all those picks? Maybe it would be simpler to hire someone who actually knows what he's doing. Hillary Clinton could pick better than Vinny Cerrato in the late rounds.

Posted by: KK | March 7, 2007 5:00 PM | Report abuse

Gus was a 7th rounder...

Don't let me pluck more holes over there....

Trent Green, whoops..

Posted by: 4th | March 7, 2007 5:00 PM | Report abuse

G-Money -

There is a certain #6 overall pick in 2004 that I just so happen to have a man crush on who does not appear on your 'excellent' list.

Posted by: etrod | March 7, 2007 5:01 PM | Report abuse

KK,
You are right... break down of that Econ 101 class Freshman year was 3 to 1 girls to guys... and 10 to 1 hot girls to plain girls (the norm for JMU).
Not sure what the #s mean... I didn't pay attention in my Statistics class either.

Posted by: Diesel | March 7, 2007 5:02 PM | Report abuse

Stephen Alexander....

Still doing his thing as a starter in the league last time I checked. He was good for us, too.......

Posted by: 4th | March 7, 2007 5:02 PM | Report abuse

Seems like the skins are making some good moves thus far. Trade for Bly and move Springs to Safety. Then try and get a defensive end from somewhere, anywhere! Maybe cut Wynn?

Posted by: Matt | March 7, 2007 5:03 PM | Report abuse

Classic Example - We plucked a SB MVP, he just didn't get it winning a SB with us, but we (Gibbs 1.0) plucked him.....

Posted by: 4th | March 7, 2007 5:04 PM | Report abuse

"Do you think the FO realizes they're no good at this and that's why they trade away all those picks? ...."

Posted by: KK | March 7, 2007 05:00 PM

With Mr. $nyder and Vinny Cerrato, there is no 'reality' to realize, only BIG NEWS.

Posted by: Anonymous | March 7, 2007 5:05 PM | Report abuse

Matt, moving Springs to safety is not a viable answer. In the Grilliam's D, the safety position requires MORE tackling, e.g., almost a LB, and thus someone who is MORE durable than a CB. Springs is and will be the #1 corner (unless HE decides otherwise).

Posted by: dcsween | March 7, 2007 5:09 PM | Report abuse

How many college FAs are currently on the Skins?

In Gibbs 1, those guys tended to stand out - even if they did not stick around long (exception - Jacoby). I'm wondering if the Skins have done better in that area than in mid-rounds during this run, too.

Posted by: Shotgun | March 7, 2007 5:11 PM | Report abuse

That was me with trying to do the HTML links to Snyder and Cerrato, but didn't work b/c of stray backslashes. Probably shouldn't have posted it anyway per the blog rule: "User reviews and comments that include profanity or personal attacks or other inappropriate comments or material will be removed from the site." Never mind.

Posted by: dcsween | March 7, 2007 5:11 PM | Report abuse

Damn 4th, now I gotta get into it with you about Desmond Howard. They traded up in the 1st round, picked him in the top 5 to become an addition to the Posse, who were starting to get old, and expected him to be an all-pro WR for the next decade. He was an absolute, utter, abject failure. So he won a SB MVP for returning a couple kicks. That doesn't matter one bit.

Ok 4th, onto much more important things. What's the latest on the job front?

Posted by: 4-12 | March 7, 2007 5:12 PM | Report abuse

I agree with Springs at safety. He has twice the physical skills of Ryan Clark (our last successful safety opposite S Taylor) and knows the defense better than anyone on the team (with exception to probably L Fletcher, who hasn't even played a down in it yet). Taylor needs someone back there that knows what he is doing, so that he can wreak havoc like he used to.

Posted by: drbatch | March 7, 2007 5:15 PM | Report abuse

Having played for a bad team doesn't make you a bad player. If any of of the companies you guys work for went out of business should your perspective employers hold you accountable? Wait a minute. Strike that.

Posted by: LH | March 7, 2007 5:18 PM | Report abuse

4-12 your right about the vet salary but thats only if you can get them to sign for that with NO BONUS! I dont think theyre lining up at the door? So your vet savings will not count for very many, and most vets will only sign the minimum if the team is contending so I guess that counts us out!! Bly is 30 giving him what he wants would be foolish?

Posted by: Nice try? | March 7, 2007 5:18 PM | Report abuse

Matt, moving Springs to safety is not a viable answer. In the Grilliam's D, the safety position requires MORE tackling, e.g., almost a LB, and thus someone who is MORE durable than a CB. Springs is and will be the #1 corner (unless HE decides otherwise).

Exactly. This is why Moving Springs to Safety isn't really a good option.

Posted by: Ktron | March 7, 2007 5:23 PM | Report abuse

uhhhhh, i don't get it....sean taylor is not that great, did you miss last year? do you realize how many times he got beat deep or gave up a stupid 15 yard penalty?

Posted by: reality check | March 7, 2007 5:23 PM | Report abuse

On the nfl.com website, they have team draft histories. Kansas City, in the Saunders era, doesn't look like they relied on the draft much for offensive players (other than Larry Johnson). Maybe Saunders is also on the "free agency over the draft" bandwagon.

Posted by: dcsween | March 7, 2007 5:24 PM | Report abuse

Nice try players sign for the bonus not the salary. The contractual salary is illusory cash because most of it won't be earned as contract is fulfilled.

Posted by: LH | March 7, 2007 5:25 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: Nice try? | March 7, 2007 05:18 PM

Hi there again whoever you are. Nice try, but you're 0 for 2 now. You can sign a vet minimum contract with a signing bonus up to $40,000, and it will still only count $450,000 on the cap. Now, please tell me school isn't cancelled again tomorrow so you'll be there instead of on here.

Posted by: 4-12 | March 7, 2007 5:28 PM | Report abuse

LH
read the other posts before jumping in and not knowing what was talked about? Talking about this yrs cap hit ONLY!

Posted by: Try again? | March 7, 2007 5:28 PM | Report abuse

4-12
your making my point and Ill save a space for you in class? WHO IN THE HELL IS GOING TO ONLY TAKE A 40,000 BONUS in this cap era??????Once again theyre not breaking down the door?? Its you whos 0-3, when do you get out of 3rd grade I can help you with COMMON SENSE issues??

Posted by: NO Common sense? | March 7, 2007 5:33 PM | Report abuse

Ethan Albright these past couple years, Ray Brown for 2 years before him, Holdman last year, Posey too. I could go on and on Boofer, but I'll spare you the humiliation.

Posted by: 4-12 | March 7, 2007 5:37 PM | Report abuse

4-12
Please list the Vets that will play for a 40,000 bonus? I think Dexter Manley is available to replace Wynn?

Posted by: vet 40,000 bonus list | March 7, 2007 5:38 PM | Report abuse

Ah jeez, here we go again.

tweeeeeeeeeeeeeeeet. 15 yard penalty for failing to ITA.

Posted by: dcsween | March 7, 2007 5:38 PM | Report abuse

I got sucked into an argument with a troll.

jm220, when you're done at the gym, I need a big smack to the back of my damn head!

Posted by: 4-12 | March 7, 2007 5:39 PM | Report abuse

4-12
washington was 5-11 with those cheap players so please go on and on because I like you making an a** of yourself??

Posted by: ON & ON | March 7, 2007 5:40 PM | Report abuse

thanks dcsween- I'm back to normal now. Phew.

Posted by: 4-12 | March 7, 2007 5:41 PM | Report abuse

dc
patten didn't drop either pass against the giants, first was over thrown, second was tipped by gybril wilson,patten never had a hand on either.

he should be cut in june or allowed to compete for 4th spot then cut if we can draft someone for a change.

Gmoney all that analysis, you could have asked us. we can't draft anyone after round 3 and very before that.

Posted by: Old School | March 7, 2007 5:41 PM | Report abuse

4-12
I here mark mosley will play for that 40,000 bonus to replace Hall?

Posted by: Vets for 40,000 bonus | March 7, 2007 5:43 PM | Report abuse

4-12
I here Joe jacoby is willing to play for your 40,000 bonus,you were right all along how stupid of me not to know all the vets wholl play for 40,000 bonus!!

Posted by: Im so dumb | March 7, 2007 5:46 PM | Report abuse

def bring back dexter, I love that dude, crack and everything!

Posted by: chris Larry | March 7, 2007 5:46 PM | Report abuse

4-12: I had one lead today (real optimistic on it too). My department is expected to get axed in about 4-6 weeks, so I have time, thankfully to try and find the right opportunity. Thanks for asking! You are a core Redskin (Blogger, that is).

Now back to blogging..

See, I tried not to say his name. I can't understand why all you peeps try to hate on the Desmond Howard pick. He won a SB MVP. If he sucked like he did, but became the SB MVP for US, no one would ever complain about the pick. It just so happened he did it for another team. So Desmond Howard = Excellant pick.

Posted by: 4th | March 7, 2007 5:48 PM | Report abuse

4-12
bottom line is if you got too many of those cheap players your not going to be very good?

Posted by: its all good | March 7, 2007 5:49 PM | Report abuse

George Allen made it to the SB with all of those old players......

So old, they were given a nickname....

Posted by: 4th | March 7, 2007 5:51 PM | Report abuse

4th- Good to hear that you've got time, and a strong lead. Now, back to blogging:

LMAO! Top 5 pick who's a complete bust as WR, but won the SB MVP as a kick returner. He's similar to, oh, let's say a $30 million "personal punt protector"! lol

Posted by: 4-12 | March 7, 2007 5:52 PM | Report abuse

4-12
one last thing(maybe),I hope your not saying that the starters who are leaving should be replaced by Vets who can only get the minimum? & if your not then those players will count for the max and I will be right as usual??

Posted by: this is fun | March 7, 2007 5:58 PM | Report abuse

Ok, I'll give you that. But, that personal punt returner never saved Brett Favre's a** by getting him (and MAn Boobs West) a SB......

Posted by: 4th | March 7, 2007 5:58 PM | Report abuse

QUADROUPLE SMACK TO THE DANG GONE HEAD

Posted by: NOT JM220 NOT BOOFER | March 7, 2007 5:59 PM | Report abuse

An avg kicker like suissam will lose 1 or 2 games for you!going cheap on kicker will come back to bite you!

Posted by: cheap kickers? | March 7, 2007 6:01 PM | Report abuse

Re: Desmond Howard
The skins gave up two 1st round picks that ended up being Troy Vincent and Carl Pickens (a really good WR for Cincinati). This for a career return guy. That was a horrible trade. They've needed a strong GM ever since Beathard left.

Posted by: skinswest | March 7, 2007 6:01 PM | Report abuse

4th, you're killing me. Man Boobs West! That's awesome.

Posted by: 4-12 | March 7, 2007 6:06 PM | Report abuse

4-12, which Week did you become 4-12? was it in the preseason?

Another thought, mostly b/c all this Bly chatter, esp. in the tubes, is distracting me. Been thinking for a while now that, after getting the double screws fix (in the thumb), Double Move can become the player we drafted him to be. Been thinking he could be the #2 CB of the future. Smoot has only ever been the #2 guy (tho the way he tells it, he was better than Champ). If this Bly chatter IS true, then do the coaches think Bly is going to be the #1 CB? Does that mean that Smoot hire was a vote of no-confidence for Double Move? That he and Smoot are going to have to compete it out for #2? If so, and esp. if Smoot is the #2 guy, I definitely foresee Carlos as the trade bait/cap problem/next guy-who-becomes-a-stud-on-his-next-team for this time NEXT year.

Posted by: dcsween | March 7, 2007 6:09 PM | Report abuse

OK, you put it in context for me.

I liked Pickens, he prob never made it to the playoffs. Vincent made it once (I think) to the championship game and that was it........

So, we'll just call Howard a wash.

Posted by: 4th | March 7, 2007 6:11 PM | Report abuse

reality check,

Sean Taylor is great not in relation to the safeties of all nfl history. He is great to us - this is after all a diehard Redskins blog. We allow stuff like that because we are fans.

If you are interested in staying absolutely grounded in reality, you can always just read about politics and the Iraqi war.

Posted by: charlie | March 7, 2007 6:14 PM | Report abuse

dcsween- Good question, and I don't remember which week. It was definitely in the regular season. Maybe after the 0-2 start when it seemed like 4-12 would be something to shoot for.

Posted by: 4-12 | March 7, 2007 6:15 PM | Report abuse

Micheal Smith on espn reports the broncos will let bly go only if its an offer they cant refuse? not good for redskins?

Posted by: news & notes | March 7, 2007 6:28 PM | Report abuse

Micheal Smith on espn reports the broncos will let bly go only if its an offer they cant refuse? not good for redskins?

Posted by: news & notes | March 7, 2007 06:28 PM

With the skins holding the #6 pick the Broncos should come to them. Who're the better poker players? Shanahan/Sundquist or Gibbs/Snyder? Oh shti! We're scrwed.

Posted by: skinswest | March 7, 2007 6:34 PM | Report abuse

4th Desmond Howard is no wash. It was an awful pick. He couldn't play WR - the position for which he was drafted. It ranks up there with Andre Johnson.

Posted by: LH | March 7, 2007 6:42 PM | Report abuse

Andre Johnson - now that was an awful pick. Didn't they trade up for him too?

Posted by: skinswest | March 7, 2007 6:45 PM | Report abuse

Yes. Two picks to the Cowboys, one of which turned out to be Kavika Pittman.

Posted by: LH | March 7, 2007 6:50 PM | Report abuse

4-12 we all get caught up in the game some times. So, I will give you a pass on this one.

Posted by: jm220 | March 7, 2007 6:51 PM | Report abuse

Well - That's the Skins fault wit htrading with the Cowboys.....

LH - I believe me and you went at it before about this. It wasn't a bad pick. It was just how he was utilized. They should have used him how they use Santana and Steve Smith now-a-days. He would then be a top-5 WR in the league.....

That dosen't change the fact that he beasted out in the playoffs and single handily got GB a SB....

Posted by: 4th | March 7, 2007 6:55 PM | Report abuse

Cindy,

Comcast keeps announcing the new Washington Post Show which will premiere on 3/19. Why, why is it on at 5:00 pm? People will be leaving work and traveling home - or still at work.

Any way they can change the time?

Posted by: Lisa | March 7, 2007 6:56 PM | Report abuse

Also - Moss ALMOST had the tag of only being a career Returner in the league AND he was drafted in the 1st. It took him a SECOND time with another team before he got the respect he commanded. Gibbs saw this (In Howard) and repeated it again. That's why he wanted to keep LC but LC didn't believe....

Posted by: 4th | March 7, 2007 7:00 PM | Report abuse

4th, everyone who ever saw him said he "couldn't play." He played for five teams in the NFL and was never anything other than a return man. They can't all have been wrong about his WR skills.

Posted by: LH | March 7, 2007 7:01 PM | Report abuse

Also, who will anchor the show? TK said he won't be doing anything. MAske said he will. How about Wilbon and Wise?

Posted by: 4th Floor | March 7, 2007 7:02 PM | Report abuse

Micheal Smith of ESPN said bly had a contract with redskins and then denver came with better deal(for detroit) & stole bly! Now hes trading him to skins if he gets an offer he cant refuse?Shanahan knows how bad skins are at deals? I say he did it on purpose knowing he could get a great deal from skins?They already have been seeing other FA CBs!TOTAL CONSPIRACY and if true SHANAHAN IS GOD OF DEALING!!!

Posted by: Youll luv this theory? | March 7, 2007 7:03 PM | Report abuse

It sometimes takes the right guy to use you the right way in be out in the right system now-a-days. I really think he would have been good in this pass happy recieving days where you can throw WR screens and take them 60 - 80 yards as if you were actually returning a kick....

Still. I'll agree to a wash and that's it....

Posted by: 4th | March 7, 2007 7:04 PM | Report abuse

Renaldo Wynn is a great Redskin - we need him in the locker room if not on the d-line end plugging the run.

Posted by: Gus in Leesburg | March 7, 2007 7:05 PM | Report abuse

Howard played 12 seasons and only had 123 receptions. That shows he was there for his pass catching acumen.

And he didn't single-handedly win that SB. The Packers dominated NE. Bledsoe got picked off multiple times. If he wasn't throwing a pick, Reggie White was sacking him. Howard got the MVP because he set an all-purpose yds record.

Posted by: LH | March 7, 2007 7:09 PM | Report abuse

My head hurts from reading and trying to catch up here today.

The BMBO (aka BIMBO, blogging my brains out) Award this month goes to: the unnamed poster/anonymous/boy-with-a-thousandnames/snert/PAMF.

ITPAMF.

The working acronym at Redskins Park should be: ITB(roncos) - trading with Denver never works out well in DC. Doing nothing at this point will increase the value of the #6 pick and allow the Bly situation in Denver to fester awhile.

Posted by: The Mole | March 7, 2007 7:11 PM | Report abuse

Ok, I slept thre that boring SB. I just remember it was in a Dome.

But hey, the guy played 12 seasons. Someone was paying him, right? But, I DO remember a playoff game where his Punt Return was crucial for them winning the game, correct? I forget who it was against, but it was at GB.....

I think this is the same playoff season the George Micheal did a special on turf purchased in MD that was going to Lambeau Field because the sod was soo torn out....

Posted by: 4th | March 7, 2007 7:14 PM | Report abuse

YEa the That my sean taylor is the real man Yea might remember when the redskins play the cowboys in 2005 and he had that hit on the receiver, I steal remember that it was just killing.

By the way shawn spring should movie to safety becasue SEAN TAYLOR needs somebody good in that backfield. so he can crack people again.

COWBOYS SOME TRASH man

Posted by: Wali | March 7, 2007 7:14 PM | Report abuse

Somebody found the keys to the warden's office.

Posted by: LH | March 7, 2007 7:17 PM | Report abuse

DCSween -

Just for the record, the draft is 7 weeks away. It's at the end of April, not the end of March. (I know you really know this, and is probably just one of those days for you as well.)

Posted by: The Mole | March 7, 2007 7:32 PM | Report abuse

By the way, for whoever was discussing with me last week the issue of Buffalo spending all of their available cap money this year:

You were right and I was wrong. Not only did they spend all of the $30 million, but a whole lot more as well. It looks like their fiscal management plan went out the window this year, since what they spent on Dockery alone was more than their available cap space.

It was bound to happen eventually, I guess. With a 90-something owner and an 80-something GM, can dementia be far behind?

Posted by: The Mole | March 7, 2007 7:38 PM | Report abuse

Assuming the Redskins trade down and gather some draft picks, my updated draft board guesses go like this:

1st round - best available CB/FS hybrid
2nd round - best available DE
3rd round - best available OT/OG hybrid
4th round - best available ILB/MLB
5th round - best available blocking TE
6th round - best available WR with PR/KR skills
7th round - best available DE/DT hybrid

With the now/coming-soon price escalation at OL and DB positions, the premium will be on drafting the best available players at those positions and letting most of them go in free agency after their rookie contracts expire.

In the future, only monster contracts will be going to: Franchise QBs; Franchise DE or DE/LB hybrids (based on 4-3 or 3-4 team); and Franchise CB/FS hybrids. Everyone else will be playing for vet and unsigned FA minimums, aka the rent-a-player mentality of the NBA and MLB.

The player discontent is going to be severe on some teams after the UFA bonanza for above-average players this year.

Posted by: The Mole | March 7, 2007 8:00 PM | Report abuse

It looks like everyone really did blog their guts out today. Must me GM time at Dorf's place.

Posted by: The Mole | March 7, 2007 8:04 PM | Report abuse

nice LH.... LMAO

Posted by: Anonymous | March 7, 2007 8:05 PM | Report abuse

Mole, yes, big duh here. I knew it was in April. Brain fart. Pardon. That means free agency lingers on for even longer. Does it seem like water torture this year? I'm mean even around the league. Any given day, half a dozen guys visit somewhere. A guy gets signed. Another guy gets cut. It's like EVERY move is being scrutinized by everyone else ... and its not your turn to make a move until xyz events occur. Today's lesson was the high end price for a TE (Watson) and the fair price for a blocking TE (Reggie Kelly). Big elaborate dance ... just wait till its time to calculate the pay scale for the draftees ...

Posted by: dcsween | March 7, 2007 8:25 PM | Report abuse

Adam Schefter of the NFL Network reports that the Denver Broncos have signed quarterback Patrick Ramsey to a two-year, $4.5 million contract.

Posted by: cload and daggar | March 7, 2007 8:27 PM | Report abuse

In case you missed it, Len Fatserelli wrote this on the Ramsey signing...

"Blessed with a strong arm and solid pocket presence, Ramsey has suffered from being overcoached at times and, certainly during his tenure under coach Joe Gibbs in Washington, he was mishandled and lost confidence.

Given the volume of teams that pursued him after the Jets released him, though, it appears there are still people in the league who value him."

I hate this guy more than any other writer out there. Shame on ESPN for keeping this loser on the payroll. For once it would be nice to see some impartial reporting.

Posted by: Armenian skins fan | March 7, 2007 8:31 PM | Report abuse

Mole,

Good to see you back in the fray. I like your draft rundown, but I would make a couple of changes. I would take a DE in the first round, and do whatever is possible to get more picks for next year. I realize most people, including Coach Gibbs, only focus on one year at a time, but two first rounders or two second rounders will go a long way next year. (I like the Cason kid out of Arizona at CB but that's for a later time).

I like the squad as it is right now, with another CB and MLB. I don't think it'll be hard to plug in another guard,

Posted by: Will | March 7, 2007 8:34 PM | Report abuse

is "solid pocket presence" a codeword for "white boy can't move, makes good target"?

Posted by: cload and daggar | March 7, 2007 8:58 PM | Report abuse

My favorite aspect of the Ramsey article is that it was labeled the "Ramsey Sweepstakes." When in the hell did Ramsey become that coveted?

Posted by: BT | March 7, 2007 9:31 PM | Report abuse

All I have to say to Len Fatserli is that Joe Gibbs knows just a little bit about more about QB's and how to handle them than he does, and probably more than any other coach in NFL history.

Gibbs is still the only coach to win 3 Super Bowls with 3 different QB's (3 different RB's too). Heck, one year he won it in 87 with a QB rotation which is supposedly impossible. And none of his QB's was anywhere near a Montana, Bradshaw or Elway. No other coach, past or present, can even come close to touching those accomplishments and I get really tired of the press not giving him all the respect he deserves.

Fatserili's hero; the smartest, I mean fatest coach in the league; Andy Reid has not even managed to win one Super Bowl yet with McNabb. He's just managed to lose 3 NFC championships and one Super Bowl. Belicheck is a great coach, but lets see if he would have one any Super Bowls if you take away Brady and give him Rypien or a rotation of Willaims and Schroeder.

Ramsey is tough and has a lot of arm strength but he can't make good decisons quickly and consistently and that is the key to being a successful QB.

Posted by: Greg in NC | March 7, 2007 9:32 PM | Report abuse

Don't want to interrupt tooling on one of the biggest (literally) guys in Big Media, but thinking about this chatter about the Skins looking for a blocking tight end.

Whatever happened to Jai Lewis? I know that he tried out with the Giants last year, where they put him at offensive tackle, and he decided to try again in basketball. Does anyone know if that's working out for him? If not, maybe the TE position might suit him better than OT (esp. with an occasional pass).

Posted by: dcsween | March 7, 2007 9:37 PM | Report abuse

4th Floor,

Russ Thaler of Comcast Sports Net will be hosting the Washington Post Show (at least that's what he said)

All: I heard Michael Smith on ESPN talking about Bly as well. He said that IF Denver gets a good enough offer they may trade him - mentioned the Skins AND the Giants and one other team on the East Coast (can't remember the name of the team).

Posted by: Lisa | March 7, 2007 9:43 PM | Report abuse

Jamal Lewis to the Browns ... I would have guessed the Bengals...

Posted by: cload and daggar | March 7, 2007 10:02 PM | Report abuse

I rarely agree with Fatsquarelli but he is right in this case. Ramsey was never given a fair shot because of the mancrush Gibbs has for Brunell. Who knows what he would have become in a more stable environment not having to look over his shoulder.

Posted by: cdubb | March 7, 2007 10:02 PM | Report abuse

cdubb -- in that same parallel universe, Ramsey was groomed to take over from 1st ballot hall-of-famer Heath Shuler, who connected with "player of the 90's" Mike Westbrook for an astonishing 4 Super Bowl victories for the skins...

Posted by: cload and daggar | March 7, 2007 10:07 PM | Report abuse

Darn, almost went a whole day without blogging... hey what the heck does "blog" mean anyway? I was pondering that during the SOLs today... but I can't talk about it or i might lose my job. haha.

I just remember Jason saying that the day after John Hall got placed on the IR, he was walking out of the park without limp or pain... just made it seem like things didn't add up.

oh well, we'll try it again tomorrow

Posted by: Dorf | March 7, 2007 10:11 PM | Report abuse

Ramsey was given more than a fair shot. He has 0 ability to make a correct choice to match his arm

Posted by: Anonymous | March 7, 2007 10:34 PM | Report abuse

How come they don't show any footage of Ramsey with the Jets?


Ohhh, I see....

Posted by: cload and daggar | March 7, 2007 11:13 PM | Report abuse

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