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Position Battles the Sequel: Quarterback

As was established yesterday in our running back discussion, not all of these "Position Battles" involves starting roles. That is the case again today as we take a look at quarterbacks, everyone's favorite position to discuss.

Plus, we'd be remiss if we were in Washington in late June NOT talking about the backup quarterbacks.

QUARTERBACK

If the season opened today the starter would be: Jason Campbell, despite the efforts of the Redskins front office this offseason.

There certainly was plenty of action surrounding the signal caller during the spring, as Campbell had to deal with the Redskins' pursuit of Pro Bowl quarterback Jay Cutler, who ended up being shipped from Denver to the Chicago Bears, and then heard how much his team wanted to take USC quarterback Mark Sanchez in the first round of April's NFL Draft.

Neither move happened, however, and so Campbell enters his fifth season in Washington with tons of expectation. Entering the final year of his contract, Campbell is playing for a job - whether it's here or elsewhere.

He'll be doing so in a familiar offense for the first time in a long time, and Campbell certainly has made progress during his time as a starter in Washington.

In three seasons in which he has accumulated 36 career starts, Campbell's completion percentage has risen from 53.1 percent to 60.0 to 62.3. His quarterback rating has also jumped up from 76.5 to 84.3. And last season he was one of the most efficient quarterbacks in the league, throwing just six interceptions and going a franchise record 252 pass attempts without an interception.

Campbell has the confidence of his teammates and his coach, and throughout OTAs you heard from almost every coach and player how impressed they were with Campbell's grasp of the offense and improvement so far this offseason.

Still, Campbell has not yet gained the confidence of the front office or the fan base.

Where he has seemed to lack most is on delivering a truly prolific offense. Campbell threw for just 13 touchdowns last year, three more than he did in 2006 when he played in just seven games, and tied for 21st in the league with Oakland's JaMarcus Russell and San Francisco's Shaun Hill.

He averaged just 6.4 yards per attempt, last of the NFC East quarterbacks (Tony Romo 7.7, Donovan McNabb 6.9 and Eli Manning 6.8) and well behind league leaders Philip Rivers (8.4), Matt Schaub (8.0) and Drew Brees (8.0).

For now, it seems there are two camps when it comes to Campbell. Those who believe this year will be his breakout season and those who believe he will never be the answer for the Redskins. That will be decided by January.

Other Options: The real quarterback controversy during training camp will be the one going on behind Campbell.

The Redskins drafted Colt Brennan last year and he quickly gained the type of backup quarterback adoration that is accorded most No. 2s -- and Washington is no different.

Brennan undeniably has the type of moxie you want from a quarterback. His confidence teeters on the line of cockiness, a line many successful pro athletes toe, he commands the huddle and his play on the field is creative and, at least in the preseason, pretty effective. Still, he has a ways to go before he's ready to step in as a day-to-day starter in the NFL.

The Redskins coaching staff continues to work with Brennan on his sidearm release and the technical aspects of his game, and Brennan said during OTAs that he's learning to find a balance between when he falls back on what has brought him success in the past and what the ideal would be for the coaches.

Entering training camp, Brennan knows he has a shot at the No. 2 spot behind Campbell. But in order to win the job, he'll have to beat out Todd Collins, a savvy veteran who led the Redskins to the playoffs two seasons ago after stepping in for an injured Campbell.

Collins found his most success in Al Saunders' offense, where he had grown comfortable during his extended time under the former Redskins offensive coordinator. And last year, the 37-year old struggled in the preseason as he learned Jim Zorn's hybrid West Coast offense.

But like Campbell and Brennan, Collins has had a year in the system and entering the second year of a three-year deal valued at $9 million, will look to remain entrenched as the insurance policy should Campbell go down.

If Brennan were to beat Collins out for the job, however, it'd be difficult to see the Redskins keeping a third-string quarterback with a $3 million per year price tag.

Enter Chase Daniel.

Daniel was brought in as an undrafted free agent after a prolific college career at Missouri. Like Brennan, there are questions about his size and whether he benefited from a wide open, spread offense that inflated his numbers. But like Brennan, he has shown the ability to win and was very accurate in college.

During OTAs Daniel got very few snaps, though there were some raised eyebrows after a couple series he led on the final day of the practices in which he actually looked pretty good.

If Collins goes, Daniel certainly has a shot at cracking this roster at the No. 3 spot. But it'd also be a huge risk going into the season with two very inexperienced backups (0 career snaps in the regular season) behind Campbell.

If I were to guess, I'd imagine a Campbell, Collins, Brennan depth chart in Week 1, with Daniel on the practice squad.

By Paul Tenorio  |  June 25, 2009; 1:58 PM ET
Categories:  Redskins by Position  | Tags: Chase Daniel, Colt Brennan, Jason Campbell, Todd Collins  
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Next: Position Battles the Sequel: Linebacker

Comments

REgarding Rock and TDs on kickoffs ...

On KO returns in 2008, for the whole league, there were 12 kickoff returns for a TD, by 11 different guys.

The top 40 guys (in terms of number of returns) returned around 1400 kickoffs in 2008. So maybe around 1500 returns total, across the league in 2008, and 12 TDs.

That's 1 TD out of every 125 returns.

Posted by: zcezcest1

Posted by: zcezcest1 | June 25, 2009 2:27 PM | Report abuse

Is Collins money guaranteed? What's the cap hit if he goes?

Collins is easily the #2 QB, but every year, there are cheaper backups available (Leftwich in 2008, for example).

Posted by: zcezcest1 | June 25, 2009 2:31 PM | Report abuse

Best case scenario 2009-2010 QB:

Starter- Earl Campbell
Backup- Joan Collins
Clipboard- Colt McCoy
Practice squad- Charlie Daniels

Posted by: ElYeah | June 25, 2009 2:36 PM | Report abuse

"He averaged just 6.4 yards per attempt, last of the NFC East quarterbacks (Tony Romo 7.7, Donovan McNabb 6.9 and Eli Manning 6.8)"

Y'know, that's not a whole lot of difference. Would you assume that Tony Romo is a better QB than McNabb or Eli because his yards per pass was superior to theirs?

Posted by: Samson151 | June 25, 2009 2:42 PM | Report abuse

Great quote from Farrah Fawcett's obituary on the success of Charlie's Angels:

"When the show was number three, I figured it was our acting. When it got to be number one, I decided it could only be because none of us wears a bra."

Back in the day, she was #1. Inspired lots of fantasies for an entire generation of men. Dead at 62.

Posted by: talent_evaluator | June 25, 2009 2:43 PM | Report abuse

Would you assume that Tony Romo is a better QB than McNabb or Eli because his yards per pass was superior to theirs?

Posted by: Samson151 | June 25, 2009 2:42 PM

You'd probably assume he was throwing to TO and they weren't.

Posted by: talent_evaluator | June 25, 2009 2:48 PM | Report abuse

I'm getting good earthsign from Chase...He might be possible..

Posted by: frak | June 25, 2009 2:51 PM | Report abuse

Learned, did you just spell out that you were basing your decision on a video game performance?! lol...

Posted by: DikShuttle | June 25, 2009 1:20 PM

No. I was just picking up on brownwood's Madden reference.

And I'm not "ripping" Rock. His lack of break away speed is a fact. That's the funny thing about facts - sometimes they help and sometimes they hurt.

Posted by: learnedhand1 | June 25, 2009 2:52 PM | Report abuse

"He'll be doing so in a familiar offense for the first time in a long time, and Campbell certainly has made progress during his time as a starter in Washington."

You mean 2 years ago, his 2nd in the Al Saunders System (ASS)?

Posted by: WrongDog | June 25, 2009 2:52 PM | Report abuse

Back in the day, she was #1. Inspired lots of fantasies for an entire generation of men. Dead at 62.

Posted by: talent_evaluator | June 25, 2009 2:43 PM

Too true. Even boys had Charlie's Angels lunchboxes.

Posted by: learnedhand1 | June 25, 2009 2:56 PM | Report abuse

those were some serious glass cutters

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | June 25, 2009 2:56 PM | Report abuse

2009 Best Case Scenario:

Arm Chair Quarterback = JACK DANIELS!

woo hoo!

Srsly tho: COLTBRENNANCOLTBRENNANCOLTBRENNAN!

I understand all the negative reaction to the Cult of Colt. But I really do think he'll bring something special (good special, not 'short bus' special) to whatever team lets him play.

I don't deny Daniels may have the same underrated magic up his sleeve. I wouldn't mind a year of quarterback by committee if Soup doesn't work out this year...

Collins would be great coarching up some QBs in a saunders system somewhere...

Posted by: DikShuttle | June 25, 2009 2:57 PM | Report abuse

I'm fine with Campbell's 2008 numbers. I think Zorn's approach of a conservative offense made a lot of sense. When the OL worked, use the run game and a 'don't beat yourself' pass game.

When the OL didn't work and Moss was limited by his hammy, throwing the ball became high risk/low reward.

Campbell's stats are a reflection of how he was used. Overall, I think he was used reasonably well -- and his stats reflect the talent around him.

In 2009, we should have a very good defense. And it will again be important to play mistake free football. Play good defense and don't make mistakes ... you can win a lot of games that way.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | June 25, 2009 3:01 PM | Report abuse

Funny thing about facts is their interpretation is undefined. (it depends on what the meaning of the word IS is...)
[:-o

If breakaway speed is important in your kick returner, then he needs it. My contention is that is not the most important trait since you're pretty much going to face a wall every time you run it. It's more important to get a steady standard return (both Kick & Punt ret., IMO) than 6 points.

Props on extending the metaphor from Brownie, tho.

So do you think we should get rid of the 10th best kick returner in the league or not? That last post left me perplexed.

Posted by: DikShuttle | June 25, 2009 3:05 PM | Report abuse

So do you think we should get rid of the 10th best kick returner in the league or not? That last post left me perplexed.

Posted by: DikShuttle | June 25, 2009 3:05 PM

If someone in camp can beat him out, sure. That's why we have preseason.

Posted by: talent_evaluator | June 25, 2009 3:13 PM | Report abuse

On Transformers: I left not knowing whether I liked it. But I know minstrel characters when I see them and Skids and Mudflap fit the bill.

Posted by: learnedhand1 | June 25, 2009 3:16 PM | Report abuse

T_E, so you're willing to give up proven top NFL experience in a gutsy driven guy for untested flash in the pan pre-season hijinx?! For that matter, you'd me a Cult of Colt member then?

Sorry - I didn't see them go after any kick returners in the off season.

Man, you guys would question your Mom's own cooking, wouldn't you...?!

Posted by: DikShuttle | June 25, 2009 3:17 PM | Report abuse

Ew - that's not good, Learned.

They're on M&M's now, too. It's hard to imagine how hollywood can let this stuff go in this day & age.

Monty Python ate their minstrals... and there was much rejoycing.

Posted by: DikShuttle | June 25, 2009 3:19 PM | Report abuse

So do you think we should get rid of the 10th best kick returner in the league or not? That last post left me perplexed.

Posted by: DikShuttle | June 25, 2009 3:05 PM

If someone in camp can beat him out, sure. That's why we have preseason.

Posted by: talent_evaluator

You don't casually discard a top 10 guy in this league. But if someone shows up looking like another Devin Hester, then you gotta make the change.

fwiw, George Allen, who LOVED special teams, used to coach that the goal of every KO was to get to the 30. To him, the % of times the the KO got returned to the 30 or beyond was his key stat. Not how many TDs were scored.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | June 25, 2009 3:20 PM | Report abuse

I thought JC17 yards per attempt was closer to 3.5. At least on third and long situations

Posted by: iH8dallas | June 25, 2009 3:21 PM | Report abuse

Tru - I'll take Hester... lol

'CANES, baby!

Posted by: DikShuttle | June 25, 2009 3:22 PM | Report abuse

alright, kiddos.

Hail to 'em & fight the good fight.

L8rs

Posted by: DikShuttle | June 25, 2009 3:23 PM | Report abuse

DS I have to agree on Colt, give the boy a chance!

However, I was a Sonny guy and NEVER wanted to give Billy a chance...

Posted by: ElYeah | June 25, 2009 3:24 PM | Report abuse

Back in the day, she was #1. Inspired lots of fantasies for an entire generation of men. Dead at 62.

Posted by: talent_evaluator | June 25, 2009 2:43 PM

Too true. Even boys had Charlie's Angels lunchboxes.

Posted by: learnedhand1 |

Yes indeed, Learned. And these kids had Moms who wondered why their pubescent sons took ther lunchbox into the bathroom and locked the door.

Posted by: TheCork | June 25, 2009 3:24 PM | Report abuse

NFC East leading kick returners

Rock 25.6
demps 25.3 phi
bradshaw 22.2 jints
austin 21.1 dal

kickoff returns
Sproles 53 returns for 1376 yards (26.0)
Rock 51 returns for 1307 yards (25.6)

Posted by: zcezcest1 | June 25, 2009 3:29 PM | Report abuse

Dik, what TE said. And if he's slow, he's slow. That is not undefined. I wasn't addressing what you prefer in a kick returner.

Posted by: learnedhand1 | June 25, 2009 3:30 PM | Report abuse

There is no QB controversy this season.

JC is the man, for good or ill.

Colt Brennnan? As of now, he's just Babe Laufenberg 2.0.

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | June 25, 2009 3:34 PM | Report abuse

Yeah Cork. No internet back then.

Posted by: learnedhand1 | June 25, 2009 3:37 PM | Report abuse

Yes indeed, Learned. And these kids had Moms who wondered why their pubescent sons took ther lunchbox into the bathroom and locked the door.

Posted by: TheCork | June 25, 2009 3:24 PM

I think your Mom was the only one whose son took his lunchbox in the bathroom Cork.

Posted by: talent_evaluator | June 25, 2009 3:37 PM | Report abuse

But if someone shows up looking like another Devin Hester, then you gotta make the change.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | June 25, 2009 3:20 PM

Mr. Fumbles? Guys were blasting Betts on the last thread for fumbling. Hester has 20 fumbles with only three years in the league -- 19 of them on punt and kick returns. His career kick return average is 22.8 yards, lower than Rock's.

Posted by: talent_evaluator | June 25, 2009 3:47 PM | Report abuse

whats that old saying, "don't crap where you eat", or "don't eat what you crap".....does that apply with the lunch box/bathroom thingy....??

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | June 25, 2009 3:50 PM | Report abuse

NFC East leading kick returners

Rock 25.6
demps 25.3 phi
bradshaw 22.2 jints
austin 21.1 dal

kickoff returns
Sproles 53 returns for 1376 yards (26.0)
Rock 51 returns for 1307 yards (25.6)

Posted by: zcezcest1 | June 25, 2009 3:29 PM

Rock is solid. The question is with two less wedge blockers on the KO how effective will he be. The holes should close quicker so the best KR will be decisive and attack the hole, something I think Rock will do.

Posted by: TWISI | June 25, 2009 3:51 PM | Report abuse

T_E, so you're willing to give up proven top NFL experience in a gutsy driven guy for untested flash in the pan pre-season hijinx?! For that matter, you'd me a Cult of Colt member then?

Sorry - I didn't see them go after any kick returners in the off season.

Man, you guys would question your Mom's own cooking, wouldn't you...?!

Posted by: DikShuttle | June 25, 2009 3:17 PM | Report abuse

I've missed you twisted monkeys. Rock must stay - I'm supposed to play golf with him in a few weeks! Oh, and he's a special teams guru. Cannot "casually discard" that as someone astutely opined.

Forgive me all, been running around Europe for a couple months and no blogging - what happened to JLC??

Posted by: Notorious_LMG | June 25, 2009 3:51 PM | Report abuse

Sorry - I didn't see them go after any kick returners in the off season.

Posted by: DikShuttle | June 25, 2009 3:17 PM

Then you were looking the other way. Dominique Dorsey ring a bell? He was the CFL special teams player of the year last year. They didn't bring him in to challenge Marcus Mason.

Posted by: talent_evaluator | June 25, 2009 3:53 PM | Report abuse

what happened to JLC??

Posted by: Notorious_LMG | June 25, 2009 3:51 PM |

He's at NFL.com. Maybe a step up, even.

Posted by: talent_evaluator | June 25, 2009 3:54 PM | Report abuse

what happened to JLC??

Posted by: Notorious_LMG | June 25, 2009 3:51 PM |
-------------------------

He finally made the big time.

He's going to be backing up Billy Bush on the weekend edition of Access Hollywood.

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | June 25, 2009 3:55 PM | Report abuse

And they didn't bring Eloi in to challenge for a WR spot either.


LMG, JLC got a new job. He's on NFLN now.

Posted by: learnedhand1 | June 25, 2009 3:56 PM | Report abuse

WTF LMBG no PC in the EU? :-P

Posted by: alex35332 | June 25, 2009 4:08 PM | Report abuse

I would like to see Colt Brennan beat out Collins for the number 2 spot.

Posted by: 72Redskins | June 25, 2009 4:23 PM | Report abuse

Stats are fun.

JC-315 comp,34-20+ yds, 3-40+yds

Cooley - 83, 10.2 avg
Portis - 28, 7.8 avg
Betts - 22, 9.1 avg
Sellers - 12, 8.2 avg

Moss - 79, 13.2 avg
Randle El - 53, 11.2 avg
Thomas - 15, 8.0 avg

How many single coverage did he overlook to throw the safe one? How many 3rd and long did he throw short, with single coverage?

Ans- Most of the time. Rcvrs are paid to go after the ball.

Take all the safe throws away when we needed a 1st down with 9-15 yds to go and his "GREAT" stats would make him an average at best qb.

Just a few thoughts.

Posted by: HPYTRKR1 | June 25, 2009 4:29 PM | Report abuse

How many single coverage did he overlook to throw the safe one? How many 3rd and long did he throw short, with single coverage?

Ans- Most of the time. Rcvrs are paid to go after the ball.

Take all the safe throws away when we needed a 1st down with 9-15 yds to go and his "GREAT" stats would make him an average at best qb.

Just a few thoughts.

Posted by: HPYTRKR1 | June 25, 2009 4:29 PM


What happens if you add back in all the catchable balls that were dropped by receivers?

Posted by: dlhaze1 | June 25, 2009 4:34 PM | Report abuse

Been thinking about what it will take for this team to be great. Along the way, lots of thoughts. Here's one. How do other teams attack the Skins defense?

The Skins are extremely strong up the middle. Golston/Griff, Albert, Fletcher, Landry, Horton. Those are the guys the QB sees when he looks straight ahead. Bluntly put, opposing QBs will not enjoy that view.

So they'll look elsewhere. The corners are pretty good, nothing easy there.

Its the edges where the Skins are most vulnerable. The 2 OLBs and the 2 DEs.

Even with a modest pass rush, I think throwing against the Skins secondary is going to be tough. So the way to attack is to go underneath and outside the DE. Can the Skins OLBs cover the short game?

The same for the run game. No one will run effectively between the tackles. It was tough last year for most teams with Fletcher in the middle. Life won't be better for opponents trying to run past Albert. Once again, its the DEs and OLBs (to be continued ...)

Posted by: zcezcest1 | June 25, 2009 4:39 PM | Report abuse

At least he would have tried to get a first down. A QB who only throws the safe catchable is playing not to lose. That is for losers. Making the playoffs every 8-10 years sounds like the Lions, Cardinals, etc. but just think his STATS would be great.

Posted by: HPYTRKR1 | June 25, 2009 4:41 PM | Report abuse

Zcezcest
I agree with you to a point, each side will have a strength and weakness . But Daniel's has been a stout Run stopper at LE when he is out there, but who really thinks our rookie OLB *converted from a end, is going to cover the pass like ST21? On the other side I think RMac is solid as a OLB in the cover game and run stoping but Carter's ability to stop the run is questionable.

Posted by: alex35332 | June 25, 2009 4:47 PM | Report abuse

This team has shown a desire to get younger. My guess is that Brennan does not have to beat Collins, only show that he is even. If so, its sayonara Collins and Chase makes the active roster as emergency 3.

Posted by: SkinsfaninKaneohe | June 25, 2009 4:49 PM | Report abuse

Part 2
So how can a team attack the edges of our defense? Well, we don't know who the OLBs will be, but I'll assume its Rocky and Orakpo. Daniels at DE is a run stopper. Offensive RTs won't push Daniels anywhere. Really, the only place to run is at Carter. Carter isn't a great run stopper, but he's not bad, he hustles and he faster than most DEs.

Teams with a power run game go at Carter. Teams with a speed run game try to run outside of Daniels. We'd like a speed LB behind Daniels and a read/react/tackle LB behind Carter. Ideally, Orakpo is behind Daniels, because he has speed.

Thing is, most teams use OLBs based on where the TE is lined up, not based on side.

My guess is that most teams will work on Carter. They'll put a TE on that side. I think it'll be Carter, Rocky and Horton on the strong side. Still, it only works if the opponent has a solid power run game. I think that group has enough speed that you won't outrun them easily.

Bottom line is that the Skins have very few 'soft' spots that can be readily attacked. Whether the defense is a top 10 defense or a top 2 defense depends heavily on how our OLBs play in 2009.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | June 25, 2009 4:55 PM | Report abuse

also, fwiw, Orakpo reminds me a lot of Andre Carter. Carter was a better LB than he is DE. Both are similar size. Both have speed and not an ounce of body fat. With Orakpo, the only video I've seen is all about speed, with very little in the way of moves. Both seem to stay with the play. From what I've heard, both are on the intellectual side.

I'll be happy if Orakpo plays at the level Carter played ... at LB.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | June 25, 2009 5:01 PM | Report abuse

"But in order to win the job, he'll have to beat out Todd Collins, a savvy veteran who led the Redskins to the playoffs two seasons ago after stepping in for an injured Campbell. "

lol @ TC being "savvy"

Posted by: TheTruth11 | June 25, 2009 5:03 PM | Report abuse

Babe Laufenberg - best pre-season QB ever

Farrah Fawcett - best "babe" poster ever (Red bathing suit one)

Babe - best pig movie ever

help me I can't stop...

Posted by: noonefromtampa | June 25, 2009 5:22 PM | Report abuse

With our o-line we had better stack up on QBs... JC will not be vertical for every Sunday... opposing defenses are having dreams about red-dogging our offense... all four make the roster with 2 getting significant playing time....

Posted by: oldnova | June 25, 2009 5:46 PM | Report abuse

1. JC17
2. Colt 45
3. The Chase Begins

On the Cutting room Floor - $3 Million Dolla Baby Faced Collins.

Next Question!

(Dang Mike! Dang!)

Posted by: 4thFloor | June 25, 2009 5:52 PM | Report abuse

Michael Jackson and Farrah Fawcet dead in same day

Posted by: noonefromtampa | June 25, 2009 6:08 PM | Report abuse

Yep...SkinfanKaneohi is right. Colt performing equal to Collins means aloha to TC. Skins saves $$$. Colt at 2. JC sprained ankle equals Colt #1. New excitment in town and he's never going to let go.

Otherwise, Skins continue last season's nickel and dime offense.

GO COLT!!!!

Posted by: GoSk1ns | June 25, 2009 6:13 PM | Report abuse

LA Times reporting Michael Jackson is DEAD..

Posted by: frak | June 25, 2009 6:28 PM | Report abuse

Bad day for famous people from my youth. Just sad.

Posted by: will_ga | June 25, 2009 6:37 PM | Report abuse

RI Readers already know this, but what the hell...need a break from Hollywood deaths:

Portis Could See Workload Drop
Posted by Gregg Rosenthal on June 25, 2009, 7:04 p.m.
It was less than a week ago when Mr. Florio suggested that Clinton Portis was becoming a major problem for coach Jim Zorn. Reaction to the post depended on who read it.

Long-time observers of Portis’ complicated relationship with Zorn and the franchise were not surprised.

Portis heard about it, though, and denied there was any issue. It will be interesting to see if Portis stays on “good terms at this present moment” if his workload begins to decrease.

The Washington Post expects backup running back Ladell Betts to get more carries this season and potentially be “much more involved” offensively in an effort to preserve Portis. After struggling with injuries last year, Betts has impressed offensive coordinator Sherman Smith this offseason.

“The guy that’s been standing out to me is Ladell Betts. To me, he’s stepped his game up. He’s preparing like he’s a starter. He’s taken a leadership role … he’s jumped out to me.”

A larger role for Betts makes football sense. After a huge workload early last season, Portis sputtered to the finish line.

The former Sheriff Gonna Getcha averaged 2.87 yards per carry in his last five games and topped 80 rushing yards once after Week 8. It was the second straight year he declined in effectiveness down the stretch.

It remains to be seen if Portis agrees that less work is a good idea for the long run. After all, his lack of usage was precisely the issue that caused Portis to call Zorn a “genius” last December.

Posted by: brownwood26 | June 25, 2009 7:20 PM | Report abuse

This is a very discouraging article. Let's face it, JC is going to have to be very good this year in order to get another contract extension. Who in their wildest dreams thinks that is a possible scenerio. Flat out JC basically sucks. Just trade him and go on with it. He has had more time to prove himself than most would have been given. But I forgot, he is black isn't he? Affirmative action and all that politically correct stuff. He almost fooled me last year, but the second half of the season showed his true colors.

Posted by: theBozyn | June 25, 2009 8:15 PM | Report abuse

So-called franchise quarterbacks are very, very rare. How many can you count playing in the NFL right now?

Tom Brady
Peyton Manning
Ben Roethlisberger
Drew Brees
Donovan McNabb

Who else? I'm not counting Farve or Warner since they are at the very end of their careers.

32 teams and maybe, what, 7 or 8 "Franchise quarter backs."


Posted by: _Stumped_ | June 25, 2009 8:35 PM | Report abuse

Affirmative action and all that politically correct stuff. He almost fooled me last year, but the second half of the season showed his true colors.

Posted by: theBozyn |

Tom Brady or Peyton Manning would have sucked behind that damaged offensive line (Have we made this point, ad absurdum, on this sublimated frustration board?? Let's hope primates in charge get a clue before regular season kicks in..)

Posted by: frak | June 25, 2009 8:40 PM | Report abuse

The former Sheriff Gonna Getcha averaged 2.87 yards per carry in his last five games and topped 80 rushing yards once after Week 8. It was the second straight year he declined in effectiveness down the stretch.


I'll agree that Portis gets beat up and I recommended a plan before last season started to balance out the workload better. But Portis's 2nd half production had a more to do with the OL problems than injuries. Same with Campbell.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | June 25, 2009 8:49 PM | Report abuse

If I were to guess, I'd imagine a Campbell, Collins, Brennan depth chart in Week 1, with Daniel on the practice squad.
By Paul Tenorio | June 25, 2009; 1:58 PM ET

Well said and end of discussion.

Posted by: abxinc | June 25, 2009 9:06 PM | Report abuse

Well said and end of discussion.

Posted by: abxinc | June 25, 2009 9:06 PM |

Huh? The discussion doesn't end until the fat lady sings and the fat lady hasn't even arrived in the house yet.

Posted by: talent_evaluator | June 25, 2009 9:21 PM | Report abuse

The former Sheriff Gonna Getcha averaged 2.87 yards per carry in his last five games and topped 80 rushing yards once after Week 8. It was the second straight year he declined in effectiveness down the stretch.


I'll agree that Portis gets beat up and I recommended a plan before last season started to balance out the workload better. But Portis's 2nd half production had a more to do with the OL problems than injuries. Same with Campbell.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | June 25, 2009 8:49 PM

I guess that depends on your definition of down the stretch. In 2007 he had over 300 yards in his last 3 games with 4 TD's. The span before that was a little suspect.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | June 25, 2009 9:35 PM | Report abuse

Redskins QBs since the end of Gibbs 1.0. How many of these guys were more likely to lose a game for you than win a game for you?

2008 Campbell
2007 Campbell
2006 Brunell
2005 Brunell
2004 Brunell
2003 Ramsey
2002 Matthews
2001 Banks
2000 B Johnson
1999 B Johnson
1998 T Green
1997 Frerotte
1996 Frerotte
1995 Frerotte
1994 Shuler
1993 Rypien


notable others: Tim Hasselback, Danny Wuerffel, Jeff George

My way of saying that Jason Campbell is among the best QBs we've had in DC since Gibbs 1.0 ended. There really is no guarantee that anyone else that they bring in will be better.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | June 25, 2009 9:35 PM | Report abuse

Could Farrah sing TE? I was always kind of fond of Jaclyn Smith. Thought she was hottest of the trio.

Both Michael Jackson and Farrah dead on the same day. Its been a very, very strange week indeed.

Oh, QB? Who really cares? Whoever takes the snaps is going to get hammered because the OL is so precarious it would take much to snap this year. Campbell is the best athlete and scrambler so he probably has the best chance under those circumstances. Followed by Colt. Then Chevy Chase. Collins would just get creamed.

Posted by: periculum | June 25, 2009 9:37 PM | Report abuse

Trent Green wasn't bad had he stayed ... even then he looked pretty good. I'd say he was the best of that group.

Clearly Campbell has a much larger potential upside as he is the better athlete.

Posted by: periculum | June 25, 2009 9:40 PM | Report abuse


As far as running backs is concerned, Betts is simply a preseason diva who turns to micky mouse during regular season. I think everyone will be surprised if at season opener we have Portis, Mason, Rock and Aldridge as our runners, with Dorsey in the practice squad. Adios Betts.

Posted by: abxinc | June 25, 2009 9:41 PM | Report abuse

Betts is simply a preseason diva who turns to micky mouse during regular season. I think everyone will be surprised if at season opener we have Portis, Mason, Rock and Aldridge as our runners, with Dorsey in the practice squad. Adios Betts.

Posted by: abxinc | June 25, 2009 9:41 PM |

If Betts were Mickey Mouse, that would make you Goofy. Mason will take Betts place? In what parallel universe? Guy still hasn't had his first regular season carry. Couldn't catch on with the 'Skins, Ravens, or Jets. He will be out of football after this pre-season.

Posted by: talent_evaluator | June 25, 2009 9:59 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: Curzon417 | June 25, 2009 10:01 PM | Report abuse

The link above is for those who missed the Haynesworth interview.

The blog police ate my first post...

Posted by: Curzon417 | June 25, 2009 10:03 PM | Report abuse

This is Campbell's last year in Washington. I think he will put up some decent numbers but by the end of the season he will be regarded again, as he has been since entering the NFL, as a quarterback with unrealized potential.

Collins holds on to the football too long. He has a problem with his decision making, a problem that was masked very well by Al Saunders' offense. He is paid too much to be an inadequate backup. Unless he impresses everyone this preseason, I think he will be finding work elsewhere.

Colt Brennan is a fiery competitor but he still has issues with his mechanics. He's a bit of a gambler in the passing game, a quality that is in direct contrast to Campbell's protect-the-ball-at-all-cost mentality. I think Brennan needs another year of seasoning. He's ready to be the number two guy and could make it interesting if he gets to play late in the season.

Chase Daniel benefited from a spread offense in college that inflated his numbers. He is short by NFL standards but a good decision maker. The jury is still out on him, but I think he makes the team as a number three or possibly even as a developmental roster guy if Collins stays.

If the team dumps Collins early, look for them to grab another young QB to throw into the mix.

Posted by: RedSkinHead | June 25, 2009 10:20 PM | Report abuse

Whatsup, Curzon417, that was a good post..Albert is totally welcome here, but he'd be even more welcome if he was the Second Coming of Reggie White, uh-huh, TEAR-IT-UP!!!!! peace

Posted by: frak | June 25, 2009 10:23 PM | Report abuse

Guy still hasn't had his first regular season carry. Couldn't catch on with the 'Skins, Ravens, or Jets. He will be out of football after this pre-season.

Posted by: talent_evaluator

By the same token, how many regular season's carry did Betts have before joining the skins? You sound like one of those insane bosses who will not hire a phenom out of college simply because they have no experience,but you are forgetting that experience starts at an instance in life.

Posted by: abxinc | June 25, 2009 10:25 PM | Report abuse

Chase Daniels?

"Daniels got very few snaps, though there were some raised eyebrows after a couple series he led on the final day of the practices in which he actually looked pretty good."

Cult O' Colt?

Naaaaaaw....

Bring on Mr. Daniels.

Posted by: MistaMoe | June 25, 2009 10:47 PM | Report abuse

End of a legend, end of an icon; you will be missed Michael, rest in peace. Michael Jacson died today due to heart attack, may his soul rest in perfect peace.

Posted by: abxinc | June 25, 2009 10:50 PM | Report abuse

All the games I saw with Chase were solid, he can rack some numbers (points..remember them??), He knows how to use his multiple weapons, Makes GREAT decisions, could be a great one..

Posted by: frak | June 25, 2009 10:56 PM | Report abuse

Stumped, how are you defining "franchise QB"? If you asked the franchises, I'd bet there are quite a few more than those you listed. Brees, Rivers, Eli Manning, Matt Ryan, Cutler? I don't think the teams they play for are looking for their replacements.

Posted by: learnedhand1 | June 25, 2009 11:34 PM | Report abuse

Guy still hasn't had his first regular season carry. Couldn't catch on with the 'Skins, Ravens, or Jets. He will be out of football after this pre-season.

Posted by: talent_evaluator

By the same token, how many regular season's carry did Betts have before joining the skins? You sound like one of those insane bosses who will not hire a phenom out of college simply because they have no experience,but you are forgetting that experience starts at an instance in life.

Posted by: abxinc | June 25, 2009 10:25 PM |

And you sound like a kid who has been fired as a delivery boy at Pizza Hut three times, Dominos once and Papa John's once. Your excuse? "I had insane bosses who wouldn't give me a chance because I didn't have experience."

Posted by: talent_evaluator | June 26, 2009 6:11 AM | Report abuse

I don't get why, but the Post won't let me...um, post...PFT's recap of the Haynesworth interview. Here's a link anyway:

http://www.profootballtalk.com/2009/06/25/haynesworth-i-could-have-made-more-money-in-tampa-bay/

Posted by: brownwood26 | June 26, 2009 6:56 AM | Report abuse

By the same token, how many regular season's carry did Betts have before joining the skins? You sound like one of those insane bosses who will not hire a phenom out of college simply because they have no experience,but you are forgetting that experience starts at an instance in life.

Posted by: abxinc | June 25, 2009 10:25 PM

Bar none one of the dumbest posts EVER. Comparing a 2nd round pick getting a game vs. an undrafted rookie who ranks no higher than 4th on the depth chart is retarded. Mason would have to prove himself against Portis, Betts and Cartwright. Betts as a rookie was already the best back on the team since the starter back then was Trung f-ing Canidate.

Mason isn't getting run because he doesn't have experience. He's not getting run because he hasn't proven he can run against guys who were actually drafted.

Posted by: brownwood26 | June 26, 2009 7:02 AM | Report abuse

Campbell's numbers were accumulated under a mediocre line with average talent in his receiver corps and a carosel of different offensive philosophies/systems.

Joe Gibb's beat him into a check down, never throw a pick mind-set which is why his long pass numbers lag behind others in the conference.

All of this to indicate that yet again, Washington is likely to have spent multiple draft picks and invaluable in season games, maturing a QB who will go on to do big things for another team.

Posted by: DownTownClown | June 26, 2009 7:36 AM | Report abuse

This is Campbell's last year in Washington. I think he will put up some decent numbers but by the end of the season he will be regarded again, as he has been since entering the NFL, as a quarterback with unrealized potential.

Collins holds on to the football too long. He has a problem with his decision making, a problem that was masked very well by Al Saunders' offense. He is paid too much to be an inadequate backup. Unless he impresses everyone this preseason, I think he will be finding work elsewhere.

Colt Brennan is a fiery competitor but he still has issues with his mechanics. He's a bit of a gambler in the passing game, a quality that is in direct contrast to Campbell's protect-the-ball-at-all-cost mentality. I think Brennan needs another year of seasoning. He's ready to be the number two guy and could make it interesting if he gets to play late in the season.

Chase Daniel benefited from a spread offense in college that inflated his numbers. He is short by NFL standards but a good decision maker. The jury is still out on him, but I think he makes the team as a number three or possibly even as a developmental roster guy if Collins stays.

If the team dumps Collins early, look for them to grab another young QB to throw into the mix.

Posted by: RedSkinHead

AAnyone else scratching their head because of this one. The points that *are* correct are blatantly obvious and the rest is well...entirely off base

Posted by: all_star_0013 | June 26, 2009 7:45 AM | Report abuse

all_star_0013 posted:

AAnyone else scratching their head because of this one. The points that *are* correct are blatantly obvious and the rest is well...entirely off base

I'm scratching my head about YOUR post.

Posted by: RedSkinHead | June 26, 2009 8:02 AM | Report abuse

Cult O' Colt?

Naaaaaaw....

Bring on Mr. Daniels.
Posted by: MistaMoe | June 25, 2009 10:47 PM | Report abuse

The Chase Chasers?

Posted by: Original_etrod | June 26, 2009 8:09 AM | Report abuse

moe, welcome back, how was the trip??

Shmoltz was pretty shaky in the first but settled into a good rythym there after. He needs to somewhat relearn how to be a pitcher I think, lean more on his junk, than on the gas...

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | June 26, 2009 8:19 AM | Report abuse

Am I the only one up here who thinks that the Abe Pollin/Ernie Grunfeld front office might be worse than the Dan Snyder/Vinnie Cerrato front office?

Posted by: talent_evaluator | June 26, 2009 8:33 AM | Report abuse

I'm scratching my head about YOUR post.

Posted by: RedSkinHead

Let me give you an example of what I mean (to enlighten you). Dumping Collins (this year) is, at the very least, risky when you consider that there would be no backup QB on the roster who has taken a regular season snap. And, if they do dump Collins, I would be uttlerly perplexed if they went after yet another inexperienced QB already having Colt and Daniels. They will undoubtedly continue shopping for QBs next offseason, but the scenario you describe is pretty ridiculous. Happy Friday to all...

Posted by: all_star_0013 | June 26, 2009 8:36 AM | Report abuse

More fun question, who was the worst QB we ever had start a game since Gibbs 1.0?

My Money: Tim Hasselback who's passes seemed to have more hang time then a punt and still could almost never go deep. Worst QB in madden for something like 4 years in a row (not that that really counts). And he is married to one of the dumbest most nut-jobed people on TV.

Posted by: alex35332 | June 26, 2009 8:36 AM | Report abuse

I am not for dumping collins, but I am for the idea of having Collins prep as emergency backup for if JC goes down in a game, and Colt being a backup if JC17 is out for a full game.

Posted by: alex35332 | June 26, 2009 8:39 AM | Report abuse

Agreed Alex...the first Skins game I went to he played for an injured Patrick Ramsey and I swear he thought he was playing basketball. Bounce passes every other throw. And the Saints hadn't had a defense since Jim Mora. Then getting shut out by Dallas at home...easily the most embarrassed I'd ever been as a Skins fan.

Posted by: brownwood26 | June 26, 2009 8:42 AM | Report abuse

I am not for dumping collins, but I am for the idea of having Collins prep as emergency backup for if JC goes down in a game, and Colt being a backup if JC17 is out for a full game.

Posted by: alex35332 | June 26, 2009 8:39 AM

Oh God...this is the crap that helped tank Gibbs 2.0. If gotta do all that crap to back up your QB, then you just don't have a backup worth a damn.

Posted by: brownwood26 | June 26, 2009 8:46 AM | Report abuse

Wood,
I would do it more to see what Colt's got thats all.

Posted by: alex35332 | June 26, 2009 8:50 AM | Report abuse

Then I would just go ahead and play Colt, Alex. You're better off playing him on an in-game substitution because the opponent would have no preparation against him. No film, nothing. He'd play his best ball that way, I would think.

Posted by: brownwood26 | June 26, 2009 8:54 AM | Report abuse

I am not for dumping collins, but I am for the idea of having Collins prep as emergency backup for if JC goes down in a game, and Colt being a backup if JC17 is out for a full game.
Posted by: alex35332 | June 26, 2009 8:39 AM
Oh God...this is the crap that helped tank Gibbs 2.0. If gotta do all that crap to back up your QB, then you just don't have a backup worth a damn.
Posted by: brownwood26

My view…

It depends on where you are in the season and your record. If you lose your starter to injury for the year and you are still in playoff contention, there’s a strong argument to having a seasoned backup to plug in there.

If, however, your starter is lost for the year due to injury (or has stunk it up for 10 games), you could make the case for playing your Colt the balance of the season - to evaluate him.

Posted by: all_star_0013 | June 26, 2009 8:56 AM | Report abuse

If, however, your starter is lost for the year due to injury [and you are not in playoff contention] (or has stunk it up for 10 games), you could make the case for playing your Colt the balance of the season - to evaluate him.


Posted by: all_star_0013

Posted by: all_star_0013 | June 26, 2009 8:58 AM | Report abuse

Someone needs to let Paul know that it is highly unusual to put a QB on the practice squad. Ain't happening.

I think they should go with the same plan from Gibbs 2.0 - if JC is out a game go with Todd, any longer than that and you go with the #3 guy to see what you got.

Posted by: McMetal | June 26, 2009 9:01 AM | Report abuse

I am just saying that I think most of us on the blog would like to see Colt at the very least become a capable no 2 QB. In order for that to happen he does need to get some playing time in a real game. Even if its just maybe a few handoffs and 1-2 drops in a blow out game.

Posted by: alex35332 | June 26, 2009 9:06 AM | Report abuse

Someone needs to let Paul know that it is highly unusual to put a QB on the practice squad. Ain't happening.

I think they should go with the same plan from Gibbs 2.0 - if JC is out a game go with Todd, any longer than that and you go with the #3 guy to see what you got.

Posted by: McMetal | June 26, 2009 9:01 AM | Report abuse


Um no its not, we have had one on the practice squad almost every year.

Posted by: alex35332 | June 26, 2009 9:08 AM | Report abuse

Words O' Wisdom from St Joe:

"At some point you're going to have to take the team down the field in a driving hailstorm to win the game. If you get all uptight about stuff as the quarterback -- if [trade rumors] is something that bothers you -- you're in the wrong position."

Translation: Buck up, Jason.

'Buck up'?

I think Jason Campbell has proven he's a tough guy.

Did we all forget the offensive line play from last season?

Late last season, he got hit more than a blind boxer.

If anything, St Joe should speak to his drafting a quarterback in the 1st round, then not using a few picks to give him a line to play play behind.

I respect Joe like the next blogga, but a lot of the issues we all know exist in the roster's make up go back to his tenure of God of all things Redskin.

Posted by: MistaMoe | June 26, 2009 9:16 AM | Report abuse

bean

The trip continues.

SeaWorld today, drive home tonight.

Poverty the rest of the month.

Smoltz will peak sometime in August.

Trust me.

Posted by: MistaMoe | June 26, 2009 9:20 AM | Report abuse

moe, good stuff, you're a good dad for jumping into poverty for the betterment of the family......

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | June 26, 2009 9:23 AM | Report abuse

Moe, I don't think that Joe was being critical. I think he was just saying that the only thing to do in this situation is shake it off. I think that is exactly what jc17 did and that Joe was acknowledging that. I think that Joe was probably repeating the advice that he gave to Jason. Not knocking him.

Posted by: brian58 | June 26, 2009 9:34 AM | Report abuse

I don't buy the "Colt's Mechanics" argument. He has different mechanics. Work with it or get rid of him. Don't change what makes him a unique player.

Rice will tell you, Montana threw up some DUCKS! Tarkenton was an ugly passer. And Thiesman? Sometimes he could barely throw it straight. Colt reminds me of all of them. I'm not saying he's destined to be as good, but to me he's worth the shot.

Posted by: DikShuttle | June 26, 2009 9:46 AM | Report abuse

Well unless Campbell gets blown away in preseason, which is possible, you have to say he will start the season. Collins should be number 2 (unless he is terrible which he won't be) and Colt #3. Then it's just how long Campbell can hang in there. If he fails early, (Skins still have playoff hopes) go to Collins. If Campbell fails late (Skins no hope) do what Gibbs did when he benched Brunell, skip over Collins and go with Colt.. as he is right now the best hope the Skins have for the future. (Daniel, if looks good, practice squad, then next year after Skins get rid of Cambell, he can get shot at #3)

Posted by: sovine08 | June 26, 2009 9:47 AM | Report abuse

Clarification:

AS A BACKUP! Let's wait another year or two as a starter. (or keep him back there if Soup plays...)

Posted by: DikShuttle | June 26, 2009 9:48 AM | Report abuse

2008 Campbell
2007 Campbell
2006 Brunell
2005 Brunell
2004 Brunell
2003 Ramsey
2002 Matthews
2001 Banks
2000 B Johnson
1999 B Johnson
1998 T Green
1997 Frerotte
1996 Frerotte
1995 Frerotte
1994 Shuler
1993 Rypien
My way of saying that Jason Campbell is among the best QBs we've had in DC since Gibbs 1.0 ended.
Posted by: zcezcest1
_____
How do you figure? Brad Johnson, Mark Brunell and Todd Collins BTW have lead the Skins into the playoffs, something Campbell has never done. On other teams Johnson has won a Super Bowl, and Brunell and Trent Green had very successful runs. Frerotte has been around forever and has had lead teams into the playoffs. I look at this list and put Campbell above Shuler, Banks and Matthews. I won't say Ramsey because unlike Cambell he never really got the shot Campbell got to play.

Posted by: sovine08 | June 26, 2009 10:03 AM | Report abuse

Whar's Rodney Pete?

Posted by: DikShuttle | June 26, 2009 10:07 AM | Report abuse

I think that Jason is safe as the season long number one, unless he is just throwing careless interception after interception. He'll have to have like 6-10 interceptions in the first 6-8 games. and they have to be BAD throws. But if he's constantly under pressure and getting knocked around because of the line, then that will be his saving grace...UNLESS he's holding on to the ball too long, then that's a different story.

As for the #2...I really think that Collins should be released and the team goes young. Because no way will we have Collins as the #2 if Campbell goes next year. If there's a new coach, he'll want to have young guys to learn his new system......So having Colt as the number two should be good. People always complain about the players who doesn't have any experience, well how can they get experience if you never let them play???? The basics.....keep a QB clean by protecting him and he'll make ATLEAST DECENT progress. Look at Flacco, true he's on a bit better team, but they PROTECTED HIM....and actually I think that's what hurt the offense in the playoffs, they protected him a bit too much and didn't open up the offense against Pittsburgh.

And Daniels, hey what do you have to loose. The #3 qb spot should always be the guy that is the "future" and honestly, if he's doesnt become the #2 in three years, should get rid of him and get another rookie......also the #3 QB should be the "athlete", they scrambler and not just some old man on a roster. Now if you have three great qb's like SF did with Montana, Young, and Bono, then okay, but that's rare


But I say get rid of COllins and let the Colt kid show what he can do...he cant look no worse than collins....AND LETS NOT FORGET, COLLINS WAS A #2 AND #3 FOR YEARS IN KC, SO HE'S NOT A FRANCHISE QB AND HE'S 37!!!!!!! (nothing agains old people, but c'mon 37 and a career #2???...get outta here)

Posted by: impervious99 | June 26, 2009 10:08 AM | Report abuse

I think that Jason is safe as the season long number one, unless he is just throwing careless interception after interception. He'll have to have like 6-10 interceptions in the first 6-8 games. and they have to be BAD throws. But if he's constantly under pressure and getting knocked around because of the line, then that will be his saving grace...UNLESS he's holding on to the ball too long, then that's a different story.

As for the #2...I really think that Collins should be released and the team goes young. Because no way will we have Collins as the #2 if Campbell goes next year. If there's a new coach, he'll want to have young guys to learn his new system......So having Colt as the number two should be good. People always complain about the players who doesn't have any experience, well how can they get experience if you never let them play???? The basics.....keep a QB clean by protecting him and he'll make ATLEAST DECENT progress. Look at Flacco, true he's on a bit better team, but they PROTECTED HIM....and actually I think that's what hurt the offense in the playoffs, they protected him a bit too much and didn't open up the offense against Pittsburgh.

And Daniels, hey what do you have to loose. The #3 qb spot should always be the guy that is the "future" and honestly, if he's doesnt become the #2 in three years, should get rid of him and get another rookie......also the #3 QB should be the "athlete", they scrambler and not just some old man on a roster. Now if you have three great qb's like SF did with Montana, Young, and Bono, then okay, but that's rare


But I say get rid of COllins and let the Colt kid show what he can do...he cant look no worse than collins....AND LETS NOT FORGET, COLLINS WAS A #2 AND #3 FOR YEARS IN KC, SO HE'S NOT A FRANCHISE QB AND HE'S 37!!!!!!! (nothing agains old people, but c'mon 37 and a career #2???...get outta here)

Posted by: impervious99 | June 26, 2009 10:08 AM | Report abuse

'Buck up'?

I think Jason Campbell has proven he's a tough guy.Did we all forget the offensive line play from last season? Late last season, he got hit more than a blind boxer.
Posted by: MistaMoe
________
No one is saying Campbell isn't physically tough.. the question is he mentally tough? After he got hurt and Collins was leading the team into the playoffs he had to be constantly reassured he wouldn't lose the starting job. Saunders even had to come out before the Seattle game to announce Campbell would be the starter next year. And this year with trade rumors all the talk was how this is affecting his ego. Gibbs would have none of it and he was right.. Campbell needs to stop this woe is me no one likes me crap. Hey this is the NFL. if Campbell expected a safe job he should have worked for the Post office..

Posted by: sovine08 | June 26, 2009 10:17 AM | Report abuse

...There's an echo in here!...

Agreed, impervious. I'm ready for some young blood in the backups.

Posted by: DikShuttle | June 26, 2009 10:19 AM | Report abuse

Whar's Rodney Pete?

Posted by: DikShuttle | June 26, 2009 10:07 AM | Report abuse

He has a radio show on Oprah's XM radio station

Posted by: alex35332 | June 26, 2009 10:19 AM | Report abuse

How do you figure? Brad Johnson, Mark Brunell and Todd Collins BTW have lead the Skins into the playoffs, something Campbell has never done. On other teams Johnson has won a Super Bowl, and Brunell and Trent Green had very successful runs. Frerotte has been around forever and has had lead teams into the playoffs. I look at this list and put Campbell above Shuler, Banks and Matthews. I won't say Ramsey because unlike Cambell he never really got the shot Campbell got to play.


Posted by: sovine08 | June 26, 2009 10:03 AM


Getting into the playoffs means nothing in this discussion (especially since the Skins only get there about as often as we vote on a President), he's comparing who played best. And the assertion is Campbell is AMONG the best to play here since Gibbs 1.0, and I don't disagree.

To say Collins is better is dumb. He's a career backup who only played well in '07 because he knows the Saunders offense in his sleep. If you give JC a whopping 8 YEARS in the same system, you'll see how good he can really be.

I agree that Patrick Ramsey never got a real chance here, but Campbell hasn't either. Three going on four years in 3 different offenses is NOT a fair chance. And to rank him with the likes of Banks and Matthews is completely outlandish. Compare the numbers and you'll see how dumb that is.

Posted by: brownwood26 | June 26, 2009 10:22 AM | Report abuse

Am I the only one up here who thinks that the Abe Pollin/Ernie Grunfeld front office might be worse than the Dan Snyder/Vinnie Cerrato front office?

Posted by: talent_evaluator | June 26, 2009 8:33 AM | Report abuse


No way they're worse. Polin has won a title (albeit 30 years ago) and Grunfeld has a pretty good track record.

I don't think they're done this offseason. Free-Agency starts next week and they'll hopefully use their mid-level exception on a decent big man and maybe pull off a trade for one of the 37 guards they have on the roster.

Posted by: Original_etrod | June 26, 2009 10:22 AM | Report abuse

No one is saying Campbell isn't physically tough.. the question is he mentally tough? After he got hurt and Collins was leading the team into the playoffs he had to be constantly reassured he wouldn't lose the starting job. Saunders even had to come out before the Seattle game to announce Campbell would be the starter next year.

Posted by: sovine08 | June 26, 2009 10:17 AM


Seriously, where are you getting this stuff? If Saunders is going to the media with something like that, it's because someone asked the question. Unless you have some insider info that he had to have constant reassurance off the field, then this is nothing more than misreading a public statement.

One of Campbell's traits that's praised ad nauseum is his poise. Milquetoast QBs don't have good poise.

Posted by: brownwood26 | June 26, 2009 10:28 AM | Report abuse

"moe, good stuff, you're a good dad for jumping into poverty for the betterment of the family......"

Beats the trip to Jamaica to smuggle and deal drugs..

Posted by: frak | June 26, 2009 10:29 AM | Report abuse

I am just saying that I think most of us on the blog would like to see Colt at the very least become a capable no 2 QB.

Posted by: alex35332 | June 26, 2009 9:06 AM |

Yes, all of us would like that. And all of us would like to win the lottery this week.

Personally, I'd like to watch a few preseason games to see whether the guy is worth starting in a regular season game. And, I'm not buying lottery tickets -- just saving my money.

Posted by: talent_evaluator | June 26, 2009 10:34 AM | Report abuse

Am I the only one up here who thinks that the Abe Pollin/Ernie Grunfeld front office might be worse than the Dan Snyder/Vinnie Cerrato front office?

Posted by: talent_evaluator | June 26, 2009 8:33 AM

Yes. And I clicked 'report abuse'.

The Wizards had a 3 year playoff run before this year's collapse. And that's saying something for them. The Skins have made the playoffs 3 times in the last decade. Grunfeld has a pretty good track record as a GM, Vinny has none. And Abe is a great guy who is great for the community and loyal to a fault (the ONLY explanation for why Wes Unseld was allowed to kill that team for so long), while Snyder is a trigger-happy jerk when it comes to firing employees and has yet to make a meaningful difference in the D.C. community. He's also one of the most hated owners in sports.

And most importantly, Abe isn't picking players. He knows what he doesn't know. The only way your statement becomes true is if Danny wakes up and realizes what HE doesn't know...

Posted by: brownwood26 | June 26, 2009 10:37 AM | Report abuse

No way they're worse. Polin has won a title (albeit 30 years ago) and Grunfeld has a pretty good track record.

Posted by: Original_etrod | June 26, 2009 10:22 AM |

I'm looking at his "track record" with the Wiz. Never gotten past the first round of the playoffs. Same as Cerrato/Snyder.

I don't follow or understand this sport, but here's what I see: They have had the most unbalanced roster -- no big men, no fighters -- forever. They can't play defense. They threw away all their money on one moody star who was injured when they hired him. None of their draft picks have amounted to anything. Their coaching choices are not very impressive. And, there was the entire Michael Jordan fiasco on Abe, not on Ernie.

And they'll solve their problems by using a "mid-agency exception" on a decent big man? I'm not buying it.

Posted by: talent_evaluator | June 26, 2009 10:42 AM | Report abuse

"He averaged just 6.4 yards per attempt, last of the NFC East quarterbacks (Tony Romo 7.7, Donovan McNabb 6.9 and Eli Manning 6.8)"

Y'know, that's not a whole lot of difference. Would you assume that Tony Romo is a better QB than McNabb or Eli because his yards per pass was superior to theirs?

Posted by: Samson151 | June 25, 2009 2:42 PM

Just shows how little you know about FB. Yards/catch is cornsidered by many axeperts to be the single most important stat for measuring how good a team's passing game is:

* Teams that win the passing YPA battle almost always win the game.
* Teams that lose the passing YPA battle almost always lose the game.
* The winningest teams in history are typically the teams with the best passing YPA average.
* The winningest quarterbacks in history are typically the quarterbacks with the best passing YPA average.”

Here’s the list of quarterbacks with a YPA of greater than 7.5 in 2008:

Philip Rivers, SD, 8.4
Drew Brees, NO, 8.0
Matt Schaub, HOU, 8.0 (the surprise in this bunch)
Matt Ryan, ATL, 7.9
Jake Delhomme, CAR, 7.9
Chad Pennington, MIA, 7.7
Kurt Warner, ARI, 7.7
Tony Romo, DAL, 7.7

That the Skins' stat is 6.4 is a true measure of how pathetic their passing offense is.

Posted by: MrPink | June 26, 2009 10:51 AM | Report abuse

I saw enough of C. Daniels last year getting stomped in the big 12 to avoid him like the plague, even as a no. 3. But prac. sq. OK. Keep Collins as no. 3 and give my boy Colt a chance at no. 2.

Posted by: ElYeah | June 26, 2009 10:54 AM | Report abuse

The Skins have made the playoffs 3 times in the last decade. Grunfeld has a pretty good track record as a GM, Vinny has none. And Abe is a great guy who is great for the community and loyal to a fault (the ONLY explanation for why Wes Unseld was allowed to kill that team for so long)

Posted by: brownwood26 | June 26, 2009 10:37 AM |

Haven't the Skins and the Wiz made the playoffs the same number of times in the last decade?

Abe's loyal to a fault? Aren't you the one who complains that Snyder is too loyal to Cerrato?

Grunfeld's good track record? Which player has he drafted for the Wiz that's done as well as, say, Sean Taylor, LaVar Arrington, Chris Samuels?

Posted by: talent_evaluator | June 26, 2009 10:54 AM | Report abuse

Matt Schaub's not a surprise on that list because he was throwing to Andre Johnson all year.

Posted by: JohnDinHouston | June 26, 2009 10:54 AM | Report abuse

Unless you have some insider info that he had to have constant reassurance off the field, then this is nothing more than misreading a public statement.

One of Campbell's traits that's praised ad nauseum is his poise. Milquetoast QBs don't have good poise.

Posted by: brownwood26 | June 26, 2009 10:28 AM

As if you ain't ever made no "misleading public statements", Mr Glass House. Heh, heh.

Posted by: MrPink | June 26, 2009 10:58 AM | Report abuse

In a true west coast offense you dont average high numbers per catch because you are always throwing short passes (ie. Rich gannon 2000 & 2001 averaged only 7.3 yds and 7.0 yds per pass.) that is not far from 6.4 and we all remeber how good rich gannon and the raiders were during those years

Posted by: GreatOne1 | June 26, 2009 10:59 AM | Report abuse

Matt Schaub's not a surprise on that list because he was throwing to Andre Johnson all year.

Posted by: JohnDinHouston | June 26, 2009 10:54 AM

* Teams that win the passing YPA battle almost always win the game.

It a team effort. QB, OL, WRs.

Posted by: MrPink | June 26, 2009 11:01 AM | Report abuse

Ernie's track record:

They made the playoffs 4 years in a row after 1 apperance in the prior 15 years.

Caron Butler for Kwame Brown. That would be like Vinny getting Brandon Jacobs for Reed Doughty.

as far as draft picks, kids that go pro after high school (Andray Blatch) or 1 year of College (Nick Young, Javale McGee) don't become superstars overnight. They take a few years to develop. That goes for anyone not named LeBron. Most of the guys Ernie has drafted are still under 22 years old and haven't yet scratched the surface of what they can become. I'm not sure about Young, but I look for Blatch to blow up this year. Javale McGee will be one of the top big men in the league in a few years and Dominic McGuire will be an all NBA Defensive player.

Not to mention that prior to joining the Wiz, Grunfeld turned Miluakee into a perennial playoff team and build the 90's Knicks that could've won a tile or two had it not been for Jordan and Hakeem Olajuwon. All Vinnie did before he got here was run the 49ers and Notre Dame into the ground.

Posted by: Original_etrod | June 26, 2009 11:02 AM | Report abuse

'They take a few years to develop'

If only such patience was given the Redskins draft picks......

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | June 26, 2009 11:04 AM | Report abuse

Haven't the Skins and the Wiz made the playoffs the same number of times in the last decade?

Abe's loyal to a fault? Aren't you the one who complains that Snyder is too loyal to Cerrato?

Grunfeld's good track record? Which player has he drafted for the Wiz that's done as well as, say, Sean Taylor, LaVar Arrington, Chris Samuels?

Posted by: talent_evaluator | June 26, 2009 10:54 AM


You should probably stick to football, T_E...

First of all, the Wiz made the playoffs 3 CONSECUTIVE seasons. The Skins haven't done that since Gibbs 1.0. Plus both teams made the 2nd round once, though generally don't get past the first round.

Second, this isn't Grunfeld's first job. He was GM of a Knicks team that went to the Finals and did a fair job with the Bucks. And considering he's got the Wiz in the playoffs for ANY amount of years in a row after a time when the team couldn't make the playoffs if it paid admission is impressive in and of itself.

And let me clarify the "loyal to a fault" thing...there's a difference between being loyal to Wes Unseld because he's a son to you and he got you your first (and only) championship and keeping Vinny around because he lets you play with the keys to the football operations.

Posted by: brownwood26 | June 26, 2009 11:07 AM | Report abuse

Getting into the playoffs means nothing in this discussion (especially since the Skins only get there about as often as we vote on a President), he's comparing who played best.
Posted by: brownwood26
_____
And who has played best and who has gotten a team in the playoffs are NOT CONNECTED??? What planet are you from?? And the fact the Skins only get in the playoffs rarely means the QB play makes a difference.

To say Collins is better is dumb. He's a career backup who only played well in '07 because he knows the Saunders offense in his sleep. If you give JC a whopping 8 YEARS in the same system, you'll see how good he can really be.
Posted by: brownwood26
______
Again Collins being a career backup so what? Rich Gannon was a career backup for 12 years before he got a shot to start and as soon as he did he was elected to 4 straight pro bowls and lead the Raiders into the Super Bowl. And BTW if it was so clear cut that Collins would be a better QB than Campbell because he knew Saunders system how come he did start the whole year?? How come Gibbs who knows a little about football was so surprised and said he had never see a better performance of the bench. Campbell lost 4 games in a row then with the SAME TEAM Collins won the next 4 and was Offensive player of the month for the NFC. Collins was better.. and I believe still is.

I agree that Patrick Ramsey never got a real chance here, but Campbell hasn't either. Three going on four years in 3 different offenses is NOT a fair chance. And to rank him with the likes of Banks and Matthews is completely outlandish. Compare the numbers and you'll see how dumb that is.
Posted by: brownwood26
____
He has had his chance and has never stepped up. His stats are good because he plays not to lose, short safe passes beat weak teams but don't get you into the Super Bowl. Acually Cambell is alot like Banks, strong arm, a little bit moblie, but not accurate and can't get a team to the next level.

Posted by: sovine08 | June 26, 2009 11:08 AM | Report abuse

Unless you have some insider info that he had to have constant reassurance off the field, then this is nothing more than misreading a public statement.

One of Campbell's traits that's praised ad nauseum is his poise. Milquetoast QBs don't have good poise.

Posted by: brownwood26 | June 26, 2009 10:28 AM

As if you ain't ever made no "misleading public statements", Mr Glass House. Heh, heh.

Posted by: MrPink | June 26, 2009 10:58 AM


Um, when you put something in quotes, it should be...you know...a direct quote.

Hit me back when you can read what I wrote.

Posted by: brownwood26 | June 26, 2009 11:09 AM | Report abuse

Amen, Greg. Amen.

Posted by: Original_etrod | June 26, 2009 11:12 AM | Report abuse

Love me some Caron Butler. Helped take my Heat to a game 6 against the Pacers... AND helped get us Shaq!

Speaking of - is it just me, or does the league seem to want it's chosen ones playing w/ the only Big Man that counts...?

What a fixed league... lol.

Posted by: DikShuttle | June 26, 2009 11:12 AM | Report abuse

thanks for the update guys...HAIL

Posted by: Notorious_LMG | June 26, 2009 11:12 AM | Report abuse

"Redskins QBs since the end of Gibbs 1.0. How many of these guys were more likely to lose a game for you than win a game for you?

2008 Campbell
2007 Campbell
2006 Brunell
2005 Brunell
2004 Brunell
2003 Ramsey
2002 Matthews
2001 Banks
2000 B Johnson
1999 B Johnson
1998 T Green
1997 Frerotte
1996 Frerotte
1995 Frerotte
1994 Shuler
1993 Rypien

notable others: Tim Hasselback, Danny Wuerffel, Jeff George

My way of saying that Jason Campbell is among the best QBs we've had in DC since Gibbs 1.0 ended. There really is no guarantee that anyone else that they bring in will be better."

Reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeealllly, okay let's peep that list.

Rypien led the team to the playoffs 1990 (WC win), 1991 (Super Bowl & won SB MVP), 1992 (2nd round) and he only suffered when his WRs left due to management not re-signing them, and injuries to his OL...so if J Campbell gets that excuse so to does Ryp. So Argumment vs Ryp, defeated. Ryp wins.

Shuler Bust-a-rino Campbell is better than Shuler...but then again, so was Tony Banks during Martyball's 8-8 season...just a thought. Campbell wins.

Frerotte kind of a mixed bag-had potential just didn't maximize it. Actually Frerotte reminds me a LOT of Campbell. Had okay skills, and decent talent arond him, but the whole thing just never really clicked. The tie game really cost them the division AND a playoff spot in 1997 8-7-1...yeesh. Draw (so far).

Trent Green. The Redskins' biggest could have been. Are you SERIOUSLY saying his slew of playoff appearances in KC couldn't have been duplicated here? Didn't think so. Argument vs Trent Green...defeated. Green wins...handily.

Brad Johnson 1999-QBs 'Skins to NFC East crown and is a bad snap away from a potential NFC Championship berth. No contest Johnson over Soup.

Shane Matthews. This is another one you're likely not going to want to hear, but he was a lot like Campbell is. A big framed guy, with a strong arm, but not the most precise passer. His 'Skins tenure came when he was on the down side of his career though, and at a bad time of transition. Draw (so far).

Patrick Ramsey. Great arm strength, and ridiculous toughness, but was only slightly more mobile than the Washington Monument. The cast of 2nd and 3rd rate Wrs he was given makes it tough to really assess what he could have been before he was so savagely beaten. Edge Campbell.

Brunell. Also on his physical decline while here, but still got it done, led team to one playoff appearance & 1 win.

So basically Campbell is better than:
Heath Shuler, Patrick Ramsey, & Shane Matthews (as a 'Skin). Any Qb w/ a pulse the 'Skins have had has gotten the job done better and most of them taken us to the playoffs including Collins whom you left off the list, without whose 5-0 run we don't get to the playoffs with Campbell even on the roster. nice.

Wow. I'd trumpet that. Not.

Posted by: ThinkingMan | June 26, 2009 11:20 AM | Report abuse

... we all remeber how good rich gannon and the raiders were during those years

Posted by: GreatOne1 | June 26, 2009 10:59 AM

It were an abberation that sucked real hard.

Al Davis & WCO = oxymoron
Darryl LaMonica = The Mad Bomber
Ken Stabler = The Snake
Cliff Branch = 24.2 yards per catch average
Al Davis = Vertical offense

Kenny King's 80-yard, first-quarter, catch-and-run reception from Jim Plunkett remained the longest touchdown Super Bowl pass play for the next 23 years. Just because you throw short passes don't mean that you are going to have a low YPC stat. You shouldn't if you are playing the game right.

Posted by: MrPink | June 26, 2009 11:23 AM | Report abuse

sovine08: "And who has played best and who has gotten a team in the playoffs are NOT CONNECTED??? What planet are you from?? And the fact the Skins only get in the playoffs rarely means the QB play makes a difference. "

When the NFL reverts to a QB only league, let me know. Last time I checked, there's 10 other guys out there not setting the world on fire either.

And I also seem to remember Trent Dilfer having a Super Bowl win and Dan Marino having none. If you think Dilfer is better, check yourself into a hospital.

sovine08: "Again Collins being a career backup so what? Rich Gannon was a career backup for 12 years before he got a shot to start and as soon as he did he was elected to 4 straight pro bowls and lead the Raiders into the Super Bowl. And BTW if it was so clear cut that Collins would be a better QB than Campbell because he knew Saunders system how come he did start the whole year?? How come Gibbs who knows a little about football was so surprised and said he had never see a better performance of the bench. Campbell lost 4 games in a row then with the SAME TEAM Collins won the next 4 and was Offensive player of the month for the NFC. Collins was better.. and I believe still is."

More foolishness...unless the Skins rehired Al Saunders last night while everyone was talking Michael Jackson, Collins is worthless. He's old, slow and learning a new offense. You put him in now and he plays like the 3rd stringer he is.

And comparing him to Gannon is laughable. Collins is more like Elvis Grbac...excellent backup who played multiple years in the same system and looked better than he is in spot duty. Once you put him in for 16 games in a different system, he's garbage. Ask Baltimore.

sovine08: "He has had his chance and has never stepped up. His stats are good because he plays not to lose, short safe passes beat weak teams but don't get you into the Super Bowl. Acually Cambell is alot like Banks, strong arm, a little bit moblie, but not accurate and can't get a team to the next level. "

The only thing you can complain about with Campbell is lack of deep throws and touchdown passes. Dude has NEVER thrown more picks than TDs and his QB rating and Completion % have gone up every year as a starter. If that continues, he's headed for a 90+ QB rating this year.

By the way, "short safe passes" are a staple of the WCO.

I love the Skins and love Campbell, but part of me hopes he leaves next year. I'm extremely curious to see 1) who you think we're getting better on such short notice in a QB starved league and 2) who's fault it's going to be when JC isn't around to take the fall.

Posted by: brownwood26 | June 26, 2009 11:24 AM | Report abuse

I am gonna keep players career QB ratings in here to.
Heres how I rank the QB's in that list for their time here in DC:
1. Rypien- 78.9
2. Johnson - 82.5
3. Brunell - 84.2
4. Campbell - 80.4
5. Green - 86.0
6. Banks -72.4
7. Collins - 76.2
8. Ramsey - 74.9
9. Ferotte - 74.2
10. Matthews - 75.0
11. Wuerffel- 56.4
12. Shuler - 54.3
13. Hasselback- 63.6

Posted by: alex35332 | June 26, 2009 11:27 AM | Report abuse

Don't know what you're thinking with, because you leave out some smallish facts regarding your comparisons. Brad Johnson and Mark Brunell were both seasoned NFL quarterbacks when they got to D.C.; while Campbell should be seasoned soon enough, he's not yet well seasoned - so your comparison there should be "incomplete". Rypien had several years as a backup, a superior offensive line and a set of three recievers that had played with each other for many years, by NFL standards. Another "not apples to apples" comparison.

Actually your comparison is interesting because you've graded Campbell better than everyone of the 'Skins FAILURES at quarterback. That would indicate at least some thought that maybe, just maybe, Campbell will do better than all of the cast offs.

But, only time will tell, which is the frustrating thing about this discussion. He has not been horrible, he's shown enough to make us think he could be the man, but has not done the extra things yet that prove it.

Posted by: JohnDinHouston | June 26, 2009 11:30 AM | Report abuse

Well said, JohnD. You summed up in 3 paragraphs what I was trying to say in more than 3 posts. Damn I need this week to be over...

Posted by: brownwood26 | June 26, 2009 11:37 AM | Report abuse

As if you ain't ever made no "misleading public statements", Mr Glass House. Heh, heh.

Posted by: MrPink | June 26, 2009 10:58 AM

Um, when you put something in quotes, it should be...you know...a direct quote.

Hit me back when you can read what I wrote.

Posted by: brownwood26 | June 26, 2009 11:09 AM

Putting something in "quotes" don't always mean you are directly quoting somebody. It sometimes can connote the intent of the user to attach a "special" meaning to words used beyond their literal interpretation. But that must not have occurred to you. In any case you have often made a lot of self important "I know what I am talking about" (not a direct quote, by the way) pronouncements that are precisely what you are criticizing someone else for. You should be content to follow the dicktum "live and let live". Now that is a direct quote in case you are wondering. Hah!

Posted by: MrPink | June 26, 2009 11:46 AM | Report abuse

Ok - just a technicality, but Rypen was Gibbs' boy - so he's in the list for referrence only, not comparison. We already know he's better. He has a ring.
Sorry - that was just buggin' me. No need for a discussion on a non-topic.

But Collins is still better than Soup!?! He's had ample opportunity to overcome JC17 and never has. His success in that playoff run can be attributed to two factors: EONs in a system too complicated for all but a few QBs to master, especially in one shortened season. And having teams prepare for another QB, there being literally NO tape on the guy.

Posted by: DikShuttle | June 26, 2009 12:00 PM | Report abuse

Putting something in "quotes" don't always mean you are directly quoting somebody. It sometimes can connote the intent of the user to attach a "special" meaning to words used beyond their literal interpretation. But that must not have occurred to you. In any case you have often made a lot of self important "I know what I am talking about" (not a direct quote, by the way) pronouncements that are precisely what you are criticizing someone else for. You should be content to follow the dicktum "live and let live". Now that is a direct quote in case you are wondering. Hah!

Posted by: MrPink | June 26, 2009 11:46 AM


Thanks for the English lesson, d-bag. I'll be sure to mail you some Windex for your "glass house" (which is in quotes since that's LITERALLY what you said).

I love the "live and let live" crap at the end after a long diatribe getting on me for calling another man out on a ridiculous statement. We're here to discuss and argue and exchange ideas. You're the one doing the policing. If you're gonna go after me, at least find a conflicting statement. The excerpt you posted was not.

Posted by: brownwood26 | June 26, 2009 12:02 PM | Report abuse

Just saw some video of JLC on NFLN...they need to give him a stool or something. Dude is a full foot shorter than everyone else there.

Posted by: brownwood26 | June 26, 2009 12:09 PM | Report abuse

Quotes.. funny...

Here's a "Quote" from another "Thread" on our "Blog"

"Maybe he doesn't "tow the party LINE", maybe he's not "everyone's ALL AMERICAN", maybe he does hold "EYE CONTACT" a little too "LONG" while discussing sports, so he doesn't "BATHE REGULARLY"...

wait a minute, how did Chris Farley get in here...??"

With "quotes", that's how.

Posted by: DikShuttle | June 26, 2009 12:11 PM | Report abuse

Yeah, Brownie, and he sounds like he's in Junior high. His work on Comcast was much better. I'm sure he'll get it together though - just needs some time to acclimate. I'm sure it's regularly headdier company than he's used to keeping.

Posted by: DikShuttle | June 26, 2009 12:16 PM | Report abuse

Yeah Dik, yukking it up with Chick Hernandez is way different than the big L.A. lights with Rich Eisen and the crew at NFLN. Hope he does well because he's local, but they usually prop a guy up when there's that kinda height difference.

Posted by: brownwood26 | June 26, 2009 12:20 PM | Report abuse

they usually prop a guy up when there's that kinda height difference.

Posted by: brownwood26 | June 26, 2009 12:20 PM |

Maybe they're propping the other guys up as part of Jasno's hazing/initiation rituals. Gotta teach the boy some humility.

Posted by: talent_evaluator | June 26, 2009 12:26 PM | Report abuse

But, only time will tell, which is the frustrating thing about this discussion. He has not been horrible, he's shown enough to make us think he could be the man, but has not done the extra things yet that prove it.
Posted by: JohnDinHouston
_____
That is the frustrating thing.. he doesn't suck. If he did.. if he was another Schuler it would be easy to just dump him. Instead he has been mediocre which is in many ways worse. There is the hope he can get better.. so the Skins waste season after season to see if he will. At least this will be the last one.

Posted by: sovine08 | June 26, 2009 12:27 PM | Report abuse

I'd like to see Todd Collins change his first name to Tom, and Chase Daniels change his first name to Jack.

Posted by: TheCork | June 26, 2009 12:33 PM | Report abuse

Hey Dik,

Touchdowns, smuchdowns, huh?

I kinda thought the object of the game was to win games by scoring more points than the opposing team.

Posted by: Chia_Pet | June 26, 2009 12:35 PM | Report abuse

I linked to "resveratol on that barbara Waletrs ad on this page and found this:

"Scientists have identified a substitute to red wine called Resveratrol that they believe might do more than just protect the heart but could, significantly extend life by preventing a number of age-related illnesses.""

Who the hell needs a substitute for red Wine?

Posted by: TheCork | June 26, 2009 12:40 PM | Report abuse

How can a guy whom we can expect to return 1 kickoff for a touchdown, EVERY THREE YEARS, be not subject to some scrutiny?

Come on...

Posted by: Chia_Pet | June 26, 2009 12:43 PM | Report abuse

Who the hell needs a substitute for red Wine?

Posted by: TheCork | June 26, 2009 12:40 PM

Devout followers of the Prophet Mohammed, you narrow-minded Mick.

Posted by: talent_evaluator | June 26, 2009 12:50 PM | Report abuse

Win and Losses are the ONLY stat that matters.

QB ratings?

Ya, not so much...

Posted by: Chia_Pet | June 26, 2009 12:50 PM | Report abuse

Can we find a new word to use than "ad nauseum", its a word people like to use to sound smart, and since we are all on here 8-23 hours a day, none of us are as smart as we think, myself included.

Dont make me break out the Thesaurus and show you how how ridiculous it can get.

Posted by: gatorskinz2000 | June 26, 2009 12:52 PM | Report abuse

How can a guy whom we can expect to return 1 kickoff for a touchdown, EVERY THREE YEARS, be not subject to some scrutiny?

Come on...

Posted by: Chia_Pet | June 26, 2009 12:43 PM

Oh, mighty clay figure, get over it. He was in the top ten in the league last year. He's not the problem on this team. One every three years is not bad at all. And he is under scrutiny. They've brought guys in to take his job away.

Posted by: talent_evaluator | June 26, 2009 12:56 PM | Report abuse

Ad infinitum

Posted by: Chia_Pet | June 26, 2009 12:57 PM | Report abuse

chia everyone is under scrutiny ever year. Multiple players compete for the same position and the best player wins the job.....right?

Posted by: pabrian2003 | June 26, 2009 12:57 PM | Report abuse

"One every three years is not bad at all."

Posted by: talent_evaluator | June 26, 2009 12:56 PM

---------

If you say so.


Posted by: Chia_Pet | June 26, 2009 1:01 PM | Report abuse

Devout followers of the Prophet Mohammed, you narrow-minded Mick.

Posted by: talent_evaluator

You really need to show some respect.

Posted by: jm220 | June 26, 2009 1:01 PM | Report abuse

I'd like to see Todd Collins change his first name to Tom, and Chase Daniels change his first name to Jack.

Posted by: TheCork | June 26, 2009 12:33 PM | Report abuse

Finally.....a brilliant suggestion.

Posted by: gatorskinz2000 | June 26, 2009 1:02 PM | Report abuse

Pabrian,

Do you remember I Redskin named Ade Jimoh?

For some reason, Ade kept making the roster, and every time you look up at the TV, he's getting burned in the final seconds of a game.

Leigh Torrence?

Posted by: Chia_Pet | June 26, 2009 1:05 PM | Report abuse

"He has had his chance and has never stepped up. His stats are good because he plays not to lose, short safe passes beat weak teams but don't get you into the Super Bowl. Acually Cambell is alot like Banks, strong arm, a little bit moblie, but not accurate and can't get a team to the next level."

Now or never for Campbell. Earthsign Daniels (what, Joe Montana or Joe Theismann were considered small, too), and Co;lt can also sweep. 'Skins are fortunate to have such good stuff (though undeveloped) at QB..

Posted by: frak | June 26, 2009 1:06 PM | Report abuse

The answer is no.

The "best player" does not always win the job.

It depends on how you evaluate talent.

Posted by: Chia_Pet | June 26, 2009 1:07 PM | Report abuse

Chia, you can win a game 3-2. You can win a game w/ fieldgoals.

If you're relying on KO/Punt returns for your point production, you've already lost.

I'm not saying it wouldn't be nice - my point, as stated, was that controlling the game is more important than 28 points over the course of two seasons.

Posted by: DikShuttle | June 26, 2009 1:07 PM | Report abuse

This is just a question, no agenda. So really, stop, think and just answer what you believe....

Do you really believe that if the investment [in dollars and draft picks] were completely even, that Jason Campbell would be starting today over Todd Collins?

I don't.

I believe, if there were no "face saving" to be done (for ownership or Vinny), Campbell would have been riding the pine pony last season. Very likely soon after the Pittsburgh game.

I believe the team would have pulled him aside and said, "we need to work on your release and decision making a little, and if we can get you all worked out in a week or two, then it's your ship again...if we can't, well...we'll be sticking with Collins.".

That might have been the best thing for the team, and for Campbell.

However there were concerns about his performance being negatively affected and "ruining his confidence" with the investment the team made in Campbell, and their future hopes for him...which has obviously stopped being a concern this off season...yow!

Bonus Q: Do you think if the 'Skins start 4-2 and drop 2-3 games in a row AGAIN, that Campbell gets to keep the starting job?

Posted by: ThinkingMan | June 26, 2009 1:09 PM | Report abuse

Coach Joe Gibbs remarked in his meeting with Coach Zen that he was most proud of how the Redskins responded to the death of Sean Taylor by wining 4 straight games and nailing down a playoff spot.

I agree with Gibbs' assessment; that was incredible.

Who else needs to die tragically in order for this team to wake up?


Posted by: Chia_Pet | June 26, 2009 1:11 PM | Report abuse

What are the odds of us having two Colts on the roster next year. Will they have to change the name of Cult of Colt?

Posted by: gatorskinz2000 | June 26, 2009 1:15 PM | Report abuse

You really need to show some respect.

Posted by: jm220 | June 26, 2009 1:01 PM

I don't have a clue what you're talking about. What did I write that prompted this response?

Posted by: talent_evaluator | June 26, 2009 1:17 PM | Report abuse

Coach Gibbs also spoke about how a QB has to be able to endure adversity, and the crap that was thrown Joe Theismann's way, and all what Doug Williams had to deal with in his lifetime.

At some point, with 2 minutes left and the game on the line, your QB has to assert himself and prove he's a leader.

Posted by: Chia_Pet | June 26, 2009 1:19 PM | Report abuse

Bonus Q: Do you think if the 'Skins start 4-2 and drop 2-3 games in a row AGAIN, that Campbell gets to keep the starting job?

--------

Yes.

Posted by: Chia_Pet | June 26, 2009 1:21 PM | Report abuse

Thinker - if Soup pulls that again, he's gone. Solid gone.

Though I don't think they were putting him in last season to "save face". It was obvious there were bigger problems on that team than just the QB play.

And Collins had already shown he was not going to be any more successful in that offense. So switching to him would have only shown more weakness to the opposition.

My disgruntlement develops at the point where the coarch decides to punish his players instead of use them to win. Zorn just kept pluggin' the square peg in the round hole and then cryin' like a baby when it didn't fall through.

Posted by: DikShuttle | June 26, 2009 1:24 PM | Report abuse

"At some point, with 2 minutes left and the game on the line, your QB has to assert himself and prove he's a leader."

Campbell has a strong record coming from behind, but remember, he was at the top of QB rankings when the O-line was uninjured at the first half of the season...VINNY!!!..

o

Posted by: frak | June 26, 2009 1:27 PM | Report abuse

Who else needs to die tragically in order for this team to wake up?

Posted by: Chia_Pet | June 26, 2009 1:11 PM


Let's hope everyone who makes the team was a huge Ed McMahon, Farrah Fawcett, and Michael Jackson fan.....
I vote for a Farrah sticker on the back of everyone's helmet to improve team unity.

Posted by: dlhaze1 | June 26, 2009 1:28 PM | Report abuse

Dik,

The Redskins are losers; have been for a long time, for a multitude of reasons.

Is Rock Cartwright to blame? No, certainly not, not anymore than any one player, at any given time.

All other things being equal, I'd like to see us score more points than we allow the opposing team to score.

Posted by: Chia_Pet | June 26, 2009 1:29 PM | Report abuse

when I put up the QB list, in part, it says how tricky it is to find a good QB and even if you have one, how tricky it can be to realize it.

Clearly Trent Green stands out on that list. Brad Johnson also had considerable success. Yet they were both let go.

Campbell, in terms of the quality of his work -- while playing for the Skins -- is among the best on the list.

When you've gone thru 10 different starters in 16 seasons, it makes me ask why.

I think the answer is that the team wants a great QB -- so they made lots of changes in order to find that guy. But if they had been OK with a good QB (say Green or Johnson) and allowed him to develop in a competent system, this team would have been better off.

So where are we today? Campbell is a good QB. The WCO is a good system. And the front office tried to dump Campbell twice this offseason.

Same approach that has failed for 16 years.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | June 26, 2009 1:31 PM | Report abuse

haze,

Funny.

Michael Jackson's death was not tragic. That dude had it coming.

I wanna hear Malcolm Kelly free style. I'm sure he's torn asunder by the news of MJ's passing..

Posted by: Chia_Pet | June 26, 2009 1:33 PM | Report abuse

“Michael Jackson's death was not tragic. That dude had it coming.”


Hey now! I don’t recall any convictions……he was acquitted each time; you know….. just like OJ (until recently).

Lot of rich families with scarred for life kids out there though....

Posted by: dlhaze1 | June 26, 2009 1:40 PM | Report abuse

Don't think you can put JC in the same category as Trent Green, or Brad Johnson, not at all.

Both Green and Johnson were known more for their ability to manage a game than they were for being great athletes.

The Redskins are sticking with the wrong QB for the wrong reasons.

Posted by: Chia_Pet | June 26, 2009 1:40 PM | Report abuse

Regarding Rock and TDs on kickoffs ...

On KO returns in 2008, for the whole league, there were 12 kickoff returns for a TD, by 11 different guys.

The top 40 guys (in terms of number of returns) returned around 1400 kickoffs in 2008. So maybe around 1500 returns total, across the league in 2008, and 12 TDs.

That's 1 TD out of every 125 returns. Rock had 53 returns.

Bottom line, 1/3 of teams had a KO return for a TD in 2008. So one KO return for a TD every 3 years is average.


Posted by: zcezcest1 | June 26, 2009 1:41 PM | Report abuse

JC will always look better in practice than he will on game day.

Coach Zen should know better.

Posted by: Chia_Pet | June 26, 2009 1:42 PM | Report abuse

Sorry - I recognize the tragedy that was MJ's life, but it's really hard to feel sorry for a pedophile.

And before you jump down my neck, I know it wasn't proven in court. I'm comin' from the 'quacks like a duck' camp on this one.

Blanket?! Are you SJKing me?! Called his kid BLANKET?!?...

Farrah always lives in my mind in one pose - that one poster. ICON.

Posted by: DikShuttle | June 26, 2009 1:42 PM | Report abuse

Average?

Yes, and at 8-8, the Redskins are very average.

Posted by: Chia_Pet | June 26, 2009 1:43 PM | Report abuse

Dik,

Why are you defending Michael Jackson?

Posted by: Chia_Pet | June 26, 2009 1:45 PM | Report abuse

Are we really shooting for average?

Posted by: Chia_Pet | June 26, 2009 1:47 PM | Report abuse

I'm with you on the looks like a duck, quacks like a duck thing Dik.....

Posted by: dlhaze1 | June 26, 2009 1:47 PM | Report abuse

on Colt Brennan -- don't change his mechanics. First, changing mechanics never works. Second, his mechanics aren't a problem.

He needs to do what all young QBs do. Learn to read defenses, know where his WRs are going to be, not make mistakes like INTs or fumbles, etc.

I don't hold out much hope for Brennan here in DC. If Campbell goes, Danny won't be happy with Colt as his QB. I say if Colt looks good in preseason, trade him for a 4th round pick and make Chase Daniels the #3 QB.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | June 26, 2009 1:50 PM | Report abuse

Chia , I'm sure your right, occasionally. How the F do you know? Are you at every teams training camp with your best player computator? I'm not trying to bust balls, just wondering how people come to their conclusions.

Posted by: pabrian2003 | June 26, 2009 1:50 PM | Report abuse

If it smells like sh*t, and if it look like sh*t, why put it in your mouth?


Posted by: Chia_Pet | June 26, 2009 1:50 PM | Report abuse

I feel absolutely nothing for MJ's passing. I put it on facebook and will say it hear. The good michael jackson, everyone loved, died in the early 90's

Posted by: alex35332 | June 26, 2009 1:51 PM | Report abuse

How many people does it take to break the Internet? One, Michael Jackson

Best MJ headline so far. Knocked out TMZ, Perez Hilton, LA Times, CNN, Twitter

Posted by: noonefromtampa | June 26, 2009 1:52 PM | Report abuse

Michael Jackson won't be able to 'Beat It' anymore...

..dohp!

Posted by: DikShuttle | June 26, 2009 1:57 PM | Report abuse

On Michael Jackson. At his best he was amazing. He did great things. And lots of weird things. If that was the whole story, I'd be really sad today.

But pedophilia is a line I won't cross. Ever. For anyone.

And once I became convinced that he was a pedophile (and it took a long time), I had to let it go.

And fwiw, every time someone plays PYT (pretty young thing) on the radio, I feel sick.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | June 26, 2009 2:01 PM | Report abuse

How the F do you know? Are you at every teams training camp with your best player computator?

Posted by: pabrian2003 | June 26, 2009 1:50 PM

-------

No, I'm not.

Posted by: Chia_Pet | June 26, 2009 2:02 PM | Report abuse

lmao, ZZ - sad but true.

Y'kno - I heard that since MJ was 99% plastic they were actually going to melt him down and turn him into lego blocks...
... so kids could play with HIM for a change...

///maps///

Posted by: DikShuttle | June 26, 2009 2:10 PM | Report abuse

Bonus Q: Do you think if the 'Skins start 4-2 and drop 2-3 games in a row AGAIN, that Campbell gets to keep the starting job?

--------

Yes.

Posted by: Chia_Pet | June 26, 2009 1:21 PM | Report abuse
----------------------------------------

There are reasons for mid-season slumps.

Like Sean Taylor being injured and out in '07 (through said vacancy Brian Westbrook waltzed through to beat snatch victory from the jaws of defeat during a key stretch there) and in '08 we had Chris Samuels out late, with Portis and Moss being nicked...

Suddenly Cooley becomes your best WR and Heyer your starting LT. That's gonna work out, right?

Posted by: mattsoundworld | June 26, 2009 2:20 PM | Report abuse

Don't think you can put JC in the same category as Trent Green, or Brad Johnson, not at all.

Both Green and Johnson were known more for their ability to manage a game than they were for being great athletes.

The Redskins are sticking with the wrong QB for the wrong reasons.

Posted by: Chia_Pet | June 26, 2009 1:40 PM | Report abuse
------------------------------------

I find it hard to believe that Brad Johnson and Trent Green are suddenly better than Campbell.

Trent Green was slapped behind one of the best lines of the decade, handing it off to one of the best RBs of the decade, and chucking it to one of the best TEs of the decade.

Johnson did NOTHING in TB. I repeat: NOTHING. That TB team has gone down as one of the lousiest offenses ever to win the SB. 5 INTs, 3 of which were returned for TDs makes your QB look REAL good.

The argument should be supporting Campbell. Get him a defense and a decent offense, and he just might look like Green or win a SB!

Posted by: mattsoundworld | June 26, 2009 2:37 PM | Report abuse

so how do u know he's not the best?

Posted by: pabrian2003 | June 26, 2009 2:40 PM | Report abuse

Man - you guys are just talking in circles today.

Chia - You say you don't put JC17 in the same category as game managers when that's the ONLY thing he HAS done for this team. His team record is in not turning the ball over!~!!

And Matt - you defeat yourself when you say BJ has done NOTHING in his winning the STUPoRBOWL... huh? wtSJK?

Now, I'll take JC17 over Trent Green now. Can't say the same if we're talking Trent Green as Soup's age... But that could never happen... so why bother.

Posted by: DikShuttle | June 26, 2009 2:46 PM | Report abuse

F*ck Hollywood. Total braindead coma promoting a Warmachine. Just look at "Cheney's List" up on any strip mall crap-a-theater..

Posted by: frak | June 26, 2009 2:47 PM | Report abuse

Did anyone see the article that had Cambells stats up against theismanns? Cambells are better at this point, respectively. And, as efficient as Cutler. I'm with Campbell and Rock

Posted by: pabrian2003 | June 26, 2009 2:49 PM | Report abuse

Agreed, Brian. I just hope the line holds up!!

Posted by: DikShuttle | June 26, 2009 2:51 PM | Report abuse

The argument should be supporting Campbell. Get him a defense and a decent offense, and he just might look like Green or win a SB!
Posted by: mattsoundworld
_____
Get him a defense? The Redskin defense was ranked number 4th last year.. can't get much better than that. And the running game was solid with Portis and Sellers Pro Bowl.. The reason the offense wasn't decent was because of Campbell. So here's a better idea.. get a decent QB and the Skins just might make the playoffs and maybe even go to the S.B.

Posted by: sovine08 | June 26, 2009 2:56 PM | Report abuse

And Matt - you defeat yourself when you say BJ has done NOTHING in his winning the STUPoRBOWL... huh? wtSJK?

Posted by: DikShuttle | June 26, 2009 2:46 PM | Report abuse
--------------------------------------

Giving Johnson credit for that SB victory is like admitting Al Gore invented the internet.

Posted by: mattsoundworld | June 26, 2009 2:59 PM | Report abuse

Overwhelmingly, the evidence says Campbell's play is about the relative quality that surrounds him.

Campbell threw 6 picks in 2008. 4 of the 6 came vs the #1 and #2 ranked defenses. 1 came vs the #3 ranked defense. Campbell's QB rating against defenses not ranked in the top 3? Well into the 90's.

If you track Campbell's QB rating and Portis' yds per carry, you see a very strong correlation. Why? Because both are dependent on the OL.

If you track Campbell's QB rating pre-Moss hammy tweak and post hammy-tweak, big difference.

Campbell's play reflects the talent around him and how that talent compares to the talent of the defense he is playing against.

Give Campbell a good OL plus Reggie Wayne/Marvin Harrison level WRs and he'll look at lot more like Peyton than eli. But give Campbell Thrash, ARE, a hurting Moss and not much OL and he'll look like Rex Grossman.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | June 26, 2009 3:08 PM | Report abuse

Super Bowl I - Bart Starr, Green Bay

Super Bowl II - Bart Starr, Green Bay

Super Bowl III - Joe Namath, New York Jets

Super Bowl IV - Len Dawson, Kansas City

Super Bowl V - Earl Morrall, Baltimore Colts*

Super Bowl VI - Roger Staubach, Dallas

Super Bowl VII - Bob Griese, Miami

Super Bowl VIII - Bob Griese, Miami

Super Bowl IX - Terry Bradshaw, Pittsburgh

Super Bowl X - Terry Bradshaw, Pittsburgh

Super Bowl XI - Ken Stabler, Oakland

Super Bowl XII - Roger Staubach, Dallas

Super Bowl XIII - Terry Bradshaw, Pittsburgh

Super Bowl XIV - Terry Bradshaw, Pittsburgh

Super Bowl XV - Jim Plunkett, Oakland

Super Bowl XVI - Joe Montana, San Francisco

Super Bowl XVII - Joe Theismann, Washington

Super Bowl XVIII - Jim Plunkett, Los Angeles Raiders

Super Bowl XIX - Joe Montana, San Francisco

Super Bowl XX - Jim McMahon, Chicago

Super Bowl XXI - Phil Simms, New York Giants

Super Bowl XXII - Doug Williams, Washington

Super Bowl XXIII - Joe Montana, San Francisco

Super Bowl XXIV - Joe Montana, San Francisco

Super Bowl XXV - Jeff Hostetler, New York Giants**

Super Bowl XXVI - Mark Rypien, Washington

Super Bowl XXVII - Troy Aikman, Dallas

Super Bowl XXVIII - Troy Aikman, Dallas

Super Bowl XXIX - Steve Young, San Francisco

Super Bowl XXX - Troy Aikman, Dallas

Super Bowl XXXI - Bret Favre, Green Bay

Super Bowl XXXII - John Elway, Denver

Super Bowl XXXIII - John Elway, Denver

Super Bowl XXXIV - Kurt Warner, St. Louis

Super Bowl XXXV - Trent Dilfer, Baltimore Ravens

Super Bowl XXXVI - Tom Brady, New England

Super Bowl XXXVII - Brad Johnson, Tampa Bay

Super Bowl XXXVIII - Tom Brady, New England

Super Bowl XXXIX - Tom Brady, New England

Super Bowl XL - Ben Rothleisberger, Pittsburgh

Super Bowl XLI - Peyton Manning, Indianapolis

Posted by: _Stumped_ | June 26, 2009 3:11 PM | Report abuse

To which we must add Elisha and another win for Big Ben.

Posted by: _Stumped_ | June 26, 2009 3:14 PM | Report abuse

And the running game was solid with Portis and Sellers Pro Bowl..

Posted by: sovine08 | June 26, 2009 2:56 PM | Report abuse
-------------------------------------

Portis averaged 118 yards in 8 games, and 67.875 yards in 8 games. That kind of performance for half a season definitely does not merit a 'solid' grade.

Posted by: mattsoundworld | June 26, 2009 3:16 PM | Report abuse

"Deacon Jones will be the seventh Ram to have his jersey retired, joining an elite group that includes Bob Waterfield, Merlin Olsen, Jackie Slater, Jack Youngblood, Eric Dickerson and Marshall Faulk."

OK, tell me who decided that Deacon Jones ... 1st ballot HOF and perhaps the most terrifying DE in league history ... needed to wait 30 years to have his jersey retired?

And I thought Art Monk's HOF induction was overdue!!

PS -- Deacon Jones trivia question. How many points did he score as a Redskin?

Posted by: zcezcest1 | June 26, 2009 3:19 PM | Report abuse

I'm a homer for Soup...

but as the list above shows, more often than not it takes a top shelf QB AND a top shelf team to hoist the Lombardi.

Looking at this list, I think you need more than a good game manager.

I think we all know how important this season is.

Posted by: _Stumped_ | June 26, 2009 3:22 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: DikShuttle | June 26, 2009 3:29 PM | Report abuse

If you are feeling a bit down. This is the greatest moment in TV. Should make you feel better.

Posted by: alex35332 | June 26, 2009 3:52 PM | Report abuse

If you are feeling a bit down. This is the greatest moment in TV. Should make you feel better. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mV1LWhNpTJU

Posted by: alex35332 | June 26, 2009 3:52 PM | Report abuse

I love the Skins and love Campbell, but part of me hopes he leaves next year.
Posted by: brownwood26
________________
And I love the Redskins to but because I do I think they can do better than have Campbell as their QB.. But hey we agree I also hope he leaves next year...

I'm extremely curious to see 1) who you think we're getting better on such short notice in a QB starved league and 2) who's fault it's going to be when JC isn't around to take the fall.
Posted by: brownwood26
_______
Here's a crazy idea, don't name anyone starting QB.. let them all go though training camp and preseason as equals and let the best man win. Make whoever wins EARN IT!!! You know like what the Cardinals did last year with Leinart and Warner.. it worked out pretty well for them. Also as far as who's fault it will after Campbell leaves it's simple, whoever isn't playing up to expectations. You see it was never personal with Campbell, in fact I was for him replacing Brunell. But I can see now he is not the answer.. So let them all try out for starter and give it to the guy who gives the Skins the best chance to win. And if it's Collins or Colt but they also don't perform as well as they need to.. I'll be as hard on them also...

Posted by: sovine08 | June 26, 2009 3:58 PM | Report abuse

Washington Redskins defensive tackle Albert Haynesworth broke the bank during free agency with a seven-year contract with a maximum value of $100 million that includes $41 million in guaranteed money, but he claims he could have made even more money if he had signed with the Tampa Bay Buccaneers. During an interview with Adam Schein and Jim Miller of Sirius NFL Radio, Haynesworth revealed that the Buccaneers offered more money than the Redskins. Haynesworth said that the New York Giants made a significant offer, but it was much less than the Redskins and the Buccaneers' respective offers. He also said that the Atlanta Falcons and the Denver Broncos displayed some interest, too.

Posted by: gatorskinz2000 | June 26, 2009 3:59 PM | Report abuse

It’s funny, but out of all of those SB winning QB’s there are only about 10 who probably won’t ever be in the hall of fame. So there is an argument FOR needing a “franchise” type guy. But on the other hand, some of the guys who are in (Starr, Griese, Dawson) weren’t much more than very good “game managers”….they were just consistently good managers for a long time. I think that there was one Super bowl where Griese threw only something like 8 or 10 passes the whole game. Also, guys like McMahon, Dilfer, Johnson and Hostetler prove you don’t need a franchiser to win at least one big one (not to mention all 3 Redskin QB’s)…….But then again the Bears were the best team in 1986 all set to repeat, but Mcmahon got hurt and the Skins knocked them out…….but then again the Skins knocked them out again in 1987 with McMahon in there…….

The important thing to note is that aside from a few (rothlisberger/warner in 2nd year, staubach/montana in 3rd year), nobody won it until their 4th year in the league…..it takes some time, most of the time. My head hurts.

Posted by: dlhaze1 | June 26, 2009 4:00 PM | Report abuse

Washington Redskins defensive tackle Albert Haynesworth broke the bank during free agency with a seven-year contract with a maximum value of $100 million that includes $41 million in guaranteed money, but he claims he could have made even more money if he had signed with the Tampa Bay Buccaneers. During an interview with Adam Schein and Jim Miller of Sirius NFL Radio, Haynesworth revealed that the Buccaneers offered more money than the Redskins. Haynesworth said that the New York Giants made a significant offer, but it was much less than the Redskins and the Buccaneers' respective offers. He also said that the Atlanta Falcons and the Denver Broncos displayed some interest, too.
Posted by: gatorskinz2000 | June 26, 2009 3:59 PM

Funny, somehow all these other teams made offers to him within the first few hours of free agency, but the Redskins are the only ones being charged with tampering…..

Posted by: dlhaze1 | June 26, 2009 4:03 PM | Report abuse

Preseason isn't usually the place to decide on your QB. I recall once upon a time, the press saying that one preseason game would make or break a QB's continuing career with the team. That QB was an aging Sonny Jurgensen. Sonny had a fine afternoon and of course, stayed with the team.

But after the game Warner Wolf went off on all the people who predicted 1 preseason game would make or break Sonny. Basically, Sonny had been so good for so long, why base ANYTHING on one preseason game? In his final year in the league, SJ9 became the oldest player to lead the league in passer rating.

Ever since then, I make sure not to put too much weight into preseason stuff.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | June 26, 2009 4:09 PM | Report abuse

Still waiting for the answer to the Deacon Jones trivia question.

How many points did he score as a Redskin?

Posted by: zcezcest1 | June 26, 2009 4:13 PM | Report abuse

I'm down wid Jason and Rawk..I just think the backup krew needs to be reddy on the line..

Posted by: frak | June 26, 2009 4:13 PM | Report abuse

I say we play all 4 guys in the first 4 REGULAR SEASON games:

1st qtr – Jason Campbell
2nd qtr – Todd Collins
3rd qtr – Colt
4th qtr – Chase

This way they all go against 1st stringers on D, with the rest of the Skins 1st stringers in there…..rotate which qtr each guy plays each week and then pick your starter…..or you could eliminate one guy from the mix each week survivor style, with the rest of the 1st string offense as the “jury”…….

Posted by: dlhaze1 | June 26, 2009 4:14 PM | Report abuse

How many points did he score as a Redskin?

Posted by: zcezcest1 | June 26, 2009 4:13 PM

Tell me why his eyes are so yellow and I will tell you how many points he scored....

Posted by: dlhaze1 | June 26, 2009 4:16 PM | Report abuse

This sounds crazy but I love what Danny is doing. He's building a team predicated on defense,i.e Steelers,Ravens,Bucs. While adding via the draft depth at reciever, which we will have to wait and see. The O-line got some attention this year with Dock,Bridges and Fat Boy.Not to mention(and this is the crazy part)we have the same starting quarterback for the 3rd year in a row. That's like a decade in Snyder years. Believe me the Skins will be good this year.

Posted by: iH8dallas | June 26, 2009 4:19 PM | Report abuse

"I'm extremely curious to see 1) who you think we're getting better on such short notice in a QB starved league and 2) who's fault it's going to be when JC isn't around to take the fall."
Posted by: brownwood26


QB starved?? Try O-Linemen starved. It's not the glamorous "Charlton Heston" children aspire to, and JC would do fine with a 6-pack of Chris Samuels-clones surrounding him...

Posted by: frak | June 26, 2009 4:22 PM | Report abuse

Funny, somehow all these other teams made offers to him within the first few hours of free agency, but the Redskins are the only ones being charged with tampering…..

Posted by: dlhaze1 | June 26, 2009 4:03 PM |

Making an offer to a free agent in the first few hours is not tampering. Tampering has to do with contact with the player or agent BEFORE the start of free agency.

Posted by: talent_evaluator | June 26, 2009 5:05 PM | Report abuse

bp bp

Posted by: _Stumped_ | June 26, 2009 5:43 PM | Report abuse

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