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Saturday Night - Cap. Hill

This is the last entry on this subject, promise (will write a half decent Skins blog entry with my offseason predicitions Wed.). So judging from the few blog night out responses that came in, The Hill is the winner. I am thinking 8 ish on Sat. So now all we need is the establishment.
So, pick the place. As always, the mob rules.

By Jason La Canfora  |  February 20, 2007; 9:01 PM ET
Save & Share:  Send E-mail   Facebook   Twitter   Digg   Yahoo Buzz   StumbleUpon   Technorati   Google Buzz   Previous: The Social Outing Is Settled, Kinda
Next: Another New Orleans Trip


memo to self: Moveable Type should be renamed Loseable Type.

Posted by: cload and daggar | February 20, 2007 10:07 PM | Report abuse

4th floor

Posted by: Triple post move. Taking a step up, eh? | February 20, 2007 10:51 PM | Report abuse

Are there any pictures of the Danny's Redskins One aircraft on the internet?

Posted by: Steve B | February 20, 2007 11:03 PM | Report abuse

I vote Archibald's

Posted by: Steve B | February 20, 2007 11:06 PM | Report abuse

J-La, excited to hear your offseason predictions tomorrow. We've been guessing and predicting up here for quite a while. So it goes in the wake of such a thoroughly disappointing, dispiriting season.

Posted by: Nate in the PDX | February 21, 2007 1:07 AM | Report abuse

So I just finished watching the documentary "Hey Is Dee Dee Home?" What a grueling, sad little film. I don't even shoot the heroin and it made me feel all skeezy.

Not quite what I expected, basically a long form interview with Dee Dee about smack and Johnny Thunders and Richard Hell and the song 'Chinese Rocks.' Weird and gripping and sad.

Midway through Mrs. Nate (sewing nearby) was asking "Who the hell is that?" because of the relentless flow of itchy edgy ramblings in Dee Dee's rough NYC accent.

Good stuff, but damnable bleak.

Posted by: Nate in the PDX | February 21, 2007 1:35 AM | Report abuse

Not as much news on the interwebtubes this morning ... more crime (Koren Robinson gets 90 days for drivin away like one of them Duke boys), Dominic Rhodes takes a massive cut in whatever contract he'll sign in FA (might even have to work for the Colts again) ... Browns All-Pro center, Bentley, requires more surgery (Cleveland lockerrooms still staph haven) ... I think everyone who makes or reports news was on a plan to Indy yesterday for the combine. Combine starts today.

Posted by: dcsween | February 21, 2007 7:20 AM | Report abuse

The Ugly Mug (8th and I SE)

Posted by: LincolnParker | February 21, 2007 7:20 AM | Report abuse

wrote plan, meant plane

Posted by: dcsween | February 21, 2007 7:22 AM | Report abuse

Regarding the NFL newsmakers/newsreporters on the plane to Indy for the Combine, I should clarify that I was referring only to non-crime-related NFL news. I'm pretty sure the Bengals were in New Orleans yesterday for Mardi Gras (where disorderly conduct lands you in the pokey till the celebration is over, but does not result in prosecution ... kind of like a bye week for public misbehavior).

On Capitol Hill crawl, my only thought would be to start somewhere where the music isn't too loud. Ugly Mug (from the Eastern Market Metro down 8th Street across from the Marine Barracks) wouldn't be too loud. Hawk and Dove (same metro, up Pennsylvania, across 6th Street) wouldn't be too loud. I don't know about the Pour House and haven't been to the Capitol Lounge since the fire or Tunnicliffes in a while, so I don't know about Saturday night volume levels there.

I have a new thought about choosing among Gaines Adams, Jamaal Anderson, and Alan Branch. Draft the one who is not represented by Drew "Next Question!" Rosenhaus.

Posted by: dcsween | February 21, 2007 9:12 AM | Report abuse

Amusing glossary for terms used by scouts to describe players, includes more amusing snark about Roy Williams and T.O. ...

Posted by: dcsween | February 21, 2007 9:44 AM | Report abuse

NEW ORLEANS (AP) -- The Saints will designate defensive end Charles Grant as their franchise player, meaning he will most likely remain in New Orleans for at least one more season.

Grant, 28, was scheduled to become an unrestricted free agent on March 2, but the Saints didn't want to let one of their top defensive playmakers go without any compensation.

As the franchise player, Grant can still negotiate with other teams, but the Saints have the right to match any offer he signs. Or, if they decide to let him go, Grant's new team would have to compensate the Saints with two first-round draft picks.

The Saints, in turn, must offer Grant a one-year salary worth $8.644 million -- the average of the top five players at his position. Meanwhile, they can continue to negotiate on a long-term deal.

Generally, players don't like being designated as the franchise player because they would prefer long-term security. Last month, Grant said he hoped to avoid the tag.

Grant, riding Tuesday in one of several parades held to commemorate Mardi Gras, told WGNO-TV that he was told Monday of the designation which came as a bit of a surprise.

"The GM told me I wasn't one of them guys midway through the season, that I wasn't one of them guys that deserved money like that. So I said to myself, 'I'm a loyal individual to this community and to this team. If I'm not one of them guys, let me touch that free agent market."

The Saints tagged defensive end Darren Howard as their franchise player in both 2004 and 2005 but never signed him to a long-term deal. The Saints did not designate a franchise player last year. Before Howard, the last time they used the franchise tag was with defensive end Joe Johnson in 1999.

Grant is the fifth NFL player to be tagged as a franchise player this season, joining Cincinnati defensive end Justin Smith, Indianapolis defensive end Dwight Freeney, Chicago linebacker Lance Briggs and New England cornerback Asante Samuel.

Posted by: cdubb | February 21, 2007 9:59 AM | Report abuse

I may make it out Sat. night, I'm going to Fogo de Choa downtown a very full Skinz may come down and try and fit some liquid bread in the belly.

Also and more importantly. I'm officially throwing my weight behind Alan Branch (not that he needs it) I don't know why but I just have a feeling this guys a beast.

I wanted Tommy Harris and we didn't get him. I think this guys going to be a beast.

Posted by: Skinz | February 21, 2007 10:01 AM | Report abuse

Midway through Mrs. Nate (sewing nearby) was asking "Who the hell is that?" because of the relentless flow of itchy edgy ramblings in Dee Dee's rough NYC accent.

Good stuff, but damnable bleak.

Posted by: Nate in the PDX | February 21, 2007 01:35 AM

uh, nate, sewing, i didn't realize you were 85 years old.

Posted by: steven | February 21, 2007 11:10 AM | Report abuse

Go with out me guys... I'll host a pub crawl of 1 here in the Burg.

Posted by: Dorf | February 21, 2007 11:19 AM | Report abuse

Sorry for the blog issues, loyal peeps. I am told that Moveable (yeah, move THIS) Type will be installing new hardware Thursday. Thanks for your patience!

Posted by: Cindy | February 21, 2007 11:43 AM | Report abuse

Skinz, I was on the "draft Branch" bandwagon waaaay back, like ten threads ago. I think when you're as bad against the run as we were, so soft in the middle, DT is the desperate need, and it also seems like a rookie DT could be effectively immediately.

But now I'm convinced a stud DE -- a bookend opposite Carter, who will be the player we thought he was -- would be just as good if we stay at #6 (which through the magic of the blog I am also convinced will be the case).

I guess I don't really care, as long as the dude we pick gets to play in the real games (I'm looking at you, Grilliams) and acquits himself well out there.


steven, we live in Portland, and we are more or less freaks, albeit congenial ones. Lots of freaks are sewing and knitting these days. Maybe you didn't get the memo.

Posted by: Nate in the PDX | February 21, 2007 11:44 AM | Report abuse

nate -

a couple days ago i saw a special on homeless kids in portland and how they are all drug addicts. it looked really sad. when you say freak, you're not one of them are you?

Posted by: steven | February 21, 2007 11:52 AM | Report abuse

i still really think that we need too many players to take just one high round pick. is anyone for trading down like i am and getting two starters versus one? we have an aging defense and one DT or DE guy ain't gonna fix that.

Posted by: dan | February 21, 2007 11:54 AM | Report abuse

We must not give the Nate family grief for being Oregon sodbusters....

Posted by: Cindy | February 21, 2007 11:58 AM | Report abuse

Portland has no shortage of damaged people wandering and apparently living on the streets. I wouldn't say it's better or worse than any other big city I've been in, but there are a lot of kids out there. Very sad. There's a huge meth usage epidemic here which has been widely reported.

And no, we're not that kind of freaks. I meant freak in a more generic sense of weirdos, as opposed to, say, yuppies or suburbanites. Different in a (hopefully) interesting way. Somethin' like that.

Posted by: Nate in the PDX | February 21, 2007 11:58 AM | Report abuse

Cyn, so glad the Moveable Type people are coming in to fix this baby up. The blog, she's wheezing.

dan, we had a long discussion about the prospects of trading down. I think many of us -- including me -- agree with you that if somebody gave us two day one picks for #6 we should take it, since we have so many needs to address. But some folks made a convincing case that it's highly unlikely such a trade offer will come our way.

Remember, we've also gotta have some faith in the front office to pick people, whether in the draft or in the FA market, which is a tad difficult given their track record.

Posted by: Nate in the PDX | February 21, 2007 12:03 PM | Report abuse


Can we get a preview of that article today JLaC? I am craving Redskins info right now.......

Posted by: 4th | February 21, 2007 12:04 PM | Report abuse

You'd think that, what with my mad Moveable Type skillz, I would have faster building pages. But no.....
Nate, we kid because we love. Portland is a great city. Friends of mine used to live there. I heart Oregon.
But I must ask, is it true that there were more Nates, but that you had to eat some members of your party when you were stranded in a blizzard as you crossed the Cascades?

Posted by: Cindy | February 21, 2007 12:07 PM | Report abuse

The only problem with drafting a DE at #6 is that the guys who are rated that high are all the lighter, faster, Carter types -- and we already have one of those. Carriker would be a good fit, but most mocks have him in the late first/early second round.
The DE's we're trying to replace are 6-3 290 Daniels, who has been solid when healthy but not healthy enough to pay his current salary, 6-3 285 Demetric Evans, and 6-3 285 Renaldo Wynn.

Posted by: cload and daggar | February 21, 2007 12:09 PM | Report abuse

We had a plan that apparently didn't occur to that Donner bunch: we traversed the Rockies and then the Cascades in the summer. No blizzard, no stranding, no cannibalism.

Anyway, I heard that the Donner folks got a bad rap, that some revisionist history was being done on that story. I'll see if I can dig up a link.

We heart Portland.

Posted by: Nate in the PDX | February 21, 2007 12:11 PM | Report abuse

cload, are you in the DT camp if we stay at #6, or are you thinking about another position if we pick up there?

Posted by: Nate in the PDX | February 21, 2007 12:19 PM | Report abuse


Here are a couple links that refute the Donner party cannibal legend

I also vaguely remember seeing the following History Channel special*&filter=1

(It re-aired fairly recently, if I'm not mistaken).

While it categorically stated that the party ate everything else that wasn't nailed down (including all family pets, boiling books to eat the parchment and leather bindings, and a whole bunch more wacky stuff), it concluded that they could not prove cannibalism had occurred during the trip


Posted by: EaglesFan | February 21, 2007 12:25 PM | Report abuse

Great work, Adam, thanks.

So neither the Nate party nor the Donner party were cannibals. That we know of.

Posted by: Nate in the PDX | February 21, 2007 12:28 PM | Report abuse

cload, I was thinking the same think about Carriker (6'6", 295) because he is described as a DE/DT "tweener" rather than a DE/OLB "tweener". [Might be the most overused college scout word I've seen.] I figure he will be available late in the first round or early second. The gripe about him is that, given his height, he doesn't get the right leverage. The reports out of the Senior Bowl runup, however, are what jumped him over a bunch of other guys. The bummer (which I think I read here) is that NO ONE trades into the top 5 unless they are targeting a specific player (Calvin Johnson), so trading down is wishful thinking. The Skins ARE on the other side of that #5, but the one trade possibility I read about sent Texans' #8 to Denver for Plummer, Tatum Bell, and their #21. If that trade is to be believed, then the FMV for a #6 might just be too much.

If there is trading on #6, I think it would focus more on players under contract rather than two picks on the first day.

Posted by: dcsween | February 21, 2007 12:30 PM | Report abuse

But if you're looking for cannibalism laced survival tales, here's your story

Who's up for lunch?


Posted by: EaglesFan | February 21, 2007 12:31 PM | Report abuse

Nate -- As of now, yes. We have to fix the MLB problem in free agency, and so I get to assume that on draft day we have someone like Napoleon Harris or Fletcher-Baker (is he a fletcher, or a baker, or does he make arrow-shaped cakes?) on the roster. So I take Branch if he's there, Anderson if he's not, Adams if he's all that's left. If Branch and Anderson are gone, then either Johnson or Peterson are still on the board, so then a trade becomes more possible. If I can't get Branch, I'd like to trade down a few, get Okoye (DT) and a second round safety (Weddle) or MLB prospect (Harris).

Posted by: cload and daggar | February 21, 2007 12:38 PM | Report abuse

I think you're right about the trade possiblities -- but there are a couple of teams that might jump at the chance for Johnson at #6. NE needs a receiver who doesn't drop wide open passes and very little else -- and with a salary slot at #6 vs. #3, the price might be right.
And how could Atlanta not seriously consider getting a hometown hero, someone who would help Vick's numbers tremendously... and all for the #10 and #46.
But having typed that, I'm not basing my plans on it.

Posted by: cload and daggar | February 21, 2007 12:53 PM | Report abuse

cload, you're hired as my VP for Player Personnel. On that note, do we have someone posted outside Vinny's house on the lookout for a "for sale" sign?

Also, like defensive end, this draft is supposed to be pretty good for WRs:

That said, I still think the WR position has the most tapped unpotential in the draft ... and the ones who actually thrive in the NFL are the biggest prima donnas on the field (exceptions for Santana, Marvin Harrison, Donald Driver, and Mike Furrey).

Posted by: dcsween | February 21, 2007 1:10 PM | Report abuse


I hear what you're saying. My thought process is this. Grills first year we were #3 and got a lot of pressure. Wynn and Daniels were our DE's and I don't remember a tremendous amount of pressure being generated from them.

Our pressure came when we shut down the run, they doubled Cornelius and the LB's got in there.

If our rotation is Branch/Salavea and Griffin/Goldsten I think we can stop the run and get to the passer with LB's. If we have to rely on Goldsten and Salavea being full time or Griff staying healthy I think we are in trouble.

Posted by: Skinz | February 21, 2007 1:17 PM | Report abuse

Bipolar disorder and alcoholism frequently occur together. In some cases, bipolar disorder clearly develops before alcoholism. Bipolar disorder may increase the risk of alcoholism or other forms of substance abuse. It's not clear why this occurs. But it may have a genetic component.

When bipolar disorder and alcoholism occur together, each can worsen the symptoms and severity of the other. Alcohol or other substance abuse can also complicate treatment efforts for bipolar disorder, and vice versa.

A psychiatrist may use the term "dual diagnosis" when referring to a person who has both bipolar disorder and alcoholism. Treatment may require the expertise of psychiatrists and other mental health care professionals who specialize in treating people with dual disorders.

Posted by: loco mullin | February 21, 2007 1:17 PM | Report abuse

"I'd heard a slightly different version of the same deal. I like this one better. The Texans would send the eighth pick of the draft to the Broncos for Jake Plummer, Tatum Bell and the 21st pick."

Posted by: 4th | February 21, 2007 1:33 PM | Report abuse

"The Lions are expected to look at free-agent middle linebackers with experience in the Tampa Two defense, such as Buffalo's London Fletcher-Baker."

Posted by: 4th | February 21, 2007 1:35 PM | Report abuse

Burg = Harrisonburg. Sorry, there's too many burgs up here and I'm sure everyone in a burg thinks their burg is "the" burg. My bad 4th. You were thinking Gaithersburg?

Other Burgs of note:

Did I miss anyone?

Posted by: Dorf | February 21, 2007 1:38 PM | Report abuse

4th, heard the one about Lions wanting F-B (and the Browns wanting Clements).

The next thing I want to try to figure out would be a deal roughly equivalent to the Texans-Bronco trade rumor, specifically, two vets who get replaced by new blood on a team near the bottm of the draft order.

Posted by: dcsween | February 21, 2007 1:39 PM | Report abuse

I was talking Gaithersburg......

Posted by: 4th | February 21, 2007 1:43 PM | Report abuse

"6. Starting the trade machine: The combine gets the trade talk going. The Redskins, who pick sixth, are like several other teams in the top 10 and willing to shop their pick to get more draft choices. Veterans such as Denver's Jake Plummer and Houston's David Carr are being shopped in trades. Something could be resolved before next Tuesday. A couple of years ago, the Randy Moss trade was brokered at the start of the combine. Moss wants out of Oakland, and if the Raiders wish to accommodate him they could find out if there are any interested teams here in Indianapolis."

Posted by: 4th via Clayton | February 21, 2007 1:47 PM | Report abuse

Prediction based on chatter on the inter-web-tubes: If the Skins lose Dockery, he ends up in either Seattle, Arizona, or Buffalo, with special emphasis on Arizona where Russ Grimm will know to poach off Gibbs/Bugel (even though Dockery was a Spurrier pick).

Posted by: dcsween | February 21, 2007 1:55 PM | Report abuse

Hey, loco, como esta?
Since we have #6 and nothing else, I'm not sure that depth at WR is something we can use. I'm convinced that, once you get past the second round, you're picking based more on guesswork and a decent fit on your existing system rather than talent. It is my hope that we'll take three CB/Safety types with the 5,6,7 and one of them will pan out as a nickel/#2 safety/teamer.

Posted by: cload and daggar | February 21, 2007 2:09 PM | Report abuse

Is PDXburg a place?

Is Posey expected to be more of a factor next year or will he remain a special teamer? When I saw him at the Eagles game, I couldn't believe how big he was...

Posted by: Dorf | February 21, 2007 2:10 PM | Report abuse

This is one of the worst FA classes ever. No real studs... do you think, I mean, is it possible, that the skins FO knew that this would be a weak year for FA and planned accordingly by using all our money the past few years?

Anyway, looks like if we don't keep Springs and we can't sign Clements, then we're screwed:

Try to ignore the hottie in the 'mate1' online dating ad.

Posted by: Diesel | February 21, 2007 2:19 PM | Report abuse

Doing a little research to see whether there are any analogs out there to the Texans-Plummer-Tatum Bell-first round swap on the defensive side, I did find one team with a similar set of facts -- the Giants.

Matias Kiawanuka (first round last year) at DE makes Strahan (11 years) or Umeniyora (4 years) a third DE. Same with Corey Webster's effect on R.W. McQuarters (9 years) and Sam Madison (10 years).

I'm not saying this would be a good idea, e.g. we send #6 to the Giants in exchange for Strahan, either McQuarters/Madison, plus Giants' #20 pick, but I think it would be the defensive analog to the Texans-Bronco rumor.

Lather, rinse, repeat.

Posted by: dcsween | February 21, 2007 2:19 PM | Report abuse

Thought some of the names on the trade possibilities were interesting. Kris Jenkins is a UMD guy, right?

Posted by: Diesel | February 21, 2007 2:24 PM | Report abuse

After Clements, I think the next FA candidate for CB would be someone like Nick Harper (Colts).

Posted by: dcsween | February 21, 2007 2:32 PM | Report abuse

With the lack of talent out there in FA, maybe we save some money this year, sign Springs and Dockery for another 3 years, bring in N. Harris as our MLB and Smoot as a #3 CB. Draft Branch for DL help. And gor DE, hope Daniels stays healthy or trade for KGB

Posted by: Diesel | February 21, 2007 2:40 PM | Report abuse

Like the aying goes 'Neva Get High On You on Supply'

The Football saying goes 'Never Partner a Trade with your DIVISION RIVALS!!'

Posted by: 4th | February 21, 2007 2:43 PM | Report abuse

Dorf, how about Gatlinburg, right up the road from Pigeon Forge? A sort of white trash nirvana. Dollywood!

Did you know Pittsburgh was supposed to be pronounced like Edinburgh, "pitts-burrah." I read that somewhere.

Is there some way we could trade our #6 pick for Jake Plummer? That would be awesome.

Posted by: Nate in the PDX | February 21, 2007 2:51 PM | Report abuse

Hey Guys -
Sorry for keeping a low profile lately.
I've been reading a bit and waiting for JLC to come back.
I had to pipe in now though - I can't miss this!!!
I actually have an event on the Hill Saturday night so I'm gonna try to sneak away to say hello.
Please let me know where ya'll are gonna be.
Can't wait to meet everyone.

Posted by: Scott (DC) | February 21, 2007 2:51 PM | Report abuse

Diesel -- It's not so much that the skins could've planned for it -- it's that the new CBA bumped up the salary cap enough that no one is crunched for cash right now. A couple of years ago, no one could afford to franchise a player -- the cap hit was too great. Now, you make the tag offer and work on a deal that lowers the cap hit even more; if you make it, great, if not, you can swallow the hit for one year, then reassess.
Clearly, since Samuels, for example, is franchised, that drives up the price for Clements. But were there only two "shut down" corners whose contracts were to be free agents? There are some 'name' CBs from the 2003 draft, did their teams take advantage of the CBA to lock them up already?

Posted by: cload and daggar | February 21, 2007 2:53 PM | Report abuse

Yeah, either Plummer or Steve Pelluer for our #6 overall.

Posted by: Diesel | February 21, 2007 2:55 PM | Report abuse

Jamaal Anderson, DE, Arkansas: Anderson is another big name, big producer who could experience a drop on draft day. With monster performances against the elite SEC teams, Anderson's statistics appear to be both consistent and dominant. Statistics rarely tell the while story, however, and this is true in Anderson's case. He has great size, long arms and an explosive burst off the snap, all of which he uses to generate pressure on the quarterback. Anderson was switched from right end to left end in 2006, meaning he was lined up opposite the right tackle, usually the lesser of an offense's pass blockers. Also, the Arkansas defense frequently used stunts and blitzes to free up Anderson in his pursuit of the passer. A former wide receiver who has grown into a 6-6, 275 pound monster, Anderson has as much upside as any defender in this draft and is a virtual lock for the top 10. But there has to be some "buyer beware" with him as Anderson isn't the finished product his 2006 statistics indicate.

Posted by: Skinz | February 21, 2007 3:00 PM | Report abuse



Posted by: BOOFER | February 21, 2007 3:09 PM | Report abuse

Nice post, Skinz... so if we draft Anderson, we satisfy 2 positions: DE and possession WR

Posted by: Diesel | February 21, 2007 3:10 PM | Report abuse

any of you pole smokers know where I could get a tasty ham and cheese sandwich?

Posted by: daveb55 | February 21, 2007 3:22 PM | Report abuse

Good Point Deez.

Sorry that came from Sportsline, forgot to cite. My college prof. would be so ashamed.

Posted by: Skinz | February 21, 2007 3:23 PM | Report abuse

Oh daveb come over to my house. I'll smoke your pole again and make you a sandwich.

Posted by: Bruce | February 21, 2007 3:27 PM | Report abuse

Over at the extremeskins blog, someone found an old post (Sept. 06) from a Skins fan with an interesting tidbit about Dockery. The guy posting was a bouncer at some bar in Arizona and Kili Lefotu stopped by after he got cut. [Note: Lefotu has since been re-signed.] The guy was chatting up Lefotu like any Skins fan would. Among other thing, Lefotu said that Bugel would die for 4 out of his 5 starters, but that he didn't really like Dockery. Then there was something about how Bugel plays favorites and Dockery didn't get it. Contrasting this to the stuff that Bugel was saying at the begining of last summer (about how Dockery had turned himself around by dropping some pounds in the offseason) makes me wonder whether there isn't more to the inability to get Dockery signed.

Posted by: dcsween | February 21, 2007 3:34 PM | Report abuse



Posted by: BOOFER | February 21, 2007 3:34 PM | Report abuse

dave, I have no ham, but Uruguayan rugby players taste very similar, apparently.
What kind of cheese do you prefer?

Posted by: cload and daggar | February 21, 2007 3:36 PM | Report abuse

Don't try and steal my man cload. I've already invested alot time in him. I had to adjust all my mechanics to pleasure someone so poorly endowed. It's a totally different stroke at only 2 inches.

Posted by: Bruce | February 21, 2007 3:51 PM | Report abuse

Some people here are trying to be funny but it's just stupid. Zzzzzzzzzz.


Posted by: charlie | February 21, 2007 3:53 PM | Report abuse

Dunno I thought it was pretty funny.

Posted by: Skinz | February 21, 2007 3:59 PM | Report abuse


That's very strange since I've heard Bugel interviewed many times and he has always praised Dockery. Maybe it was for TV though.

Posted by: Lisa | February 21, 2007 4:04 PM | Report abuse

Seemes to me that Dockery is above average, but not a great lineman... he may be the worst out of the starting 5... but I think we should go ahead and pay the man, at least for the sake of continuity. (and Lord knows we have no depth on the line)

Posted by: Diesel | February 21, 2007 4:07 PM | Report abuse

Charlie -

you are a grade A jerkoff......just thought you should know......fool

Posted by: PG | February 21, 2007 4:14 PM | Report abuse

Now see you have to admit, PG was pretty funny.

Posted by: Skinz | February 21, 2007 4:17 PM | Report abuse

How is that funny? I am all for mean and gross but has to be funny.....most of the "funny" stuff on here is lame...

Posted by: chris Larry | February 21, 2007 4:21 PM | Report abuse

And Samuels wants Dockery to stay.....

Posted by: Lisa | February 21, 2007 4:24 PM | Report abuse

There is plenty of grass in Portland; sod, not so much.

Posted by: Doobie Dude | February 21, 2007 4:27 PM | Report abuse

I wouldn't doubt that Bugel has favorites, but what does that mean... are we supposed to infer that Dockery's feelings have been hurt, or he has endured some grievance?

It makes sense that the youngest dude in the starting five would get the most attention from the old-school coach. And let's be honest -- Dockery has come a long way. He's competent, capable, and I hope we keep him, for continuity's sake.

But if his feelings were hurt by Buges, maybe it's better to go someplace more loving. I think there's a gentle, loving, turkey-necked new coach in San Diego with a shoulder to cry on.

Posted by: Nate in the PDX | February 21, 2007 4:28 PM | Report abuse

I like Dockery b/c:

A. the dude is BIG

B. We drafted him, developed him and we have watched him improve each year.

C. I hate seeing guys we grow develop other places and thats what would happen.

D. Sets a good trend and message about guys we draft. I rare success story.

F. Samuels like him and the idea of keeping line intact is a huge plaus going into next year.

Are there better guys, obviously, but seems to me we need to keep him.

Posted by: chris Larry | February 21, 2007 4:28 PM | Report abuse

Lisa, I have the same recollection (and not just TV, but also print media) about Buges saying that Dockery was his leaps-and-bounds improved player. That's why I was surprised about Lefotu's take on the relationship. [In other news, your post about Springs leaving caused a wildfire over at the extremeskins blog. Then when Jason didn't deny it, it was like gasoline.]

Posted by: dcsween | February 21, 2007 4:28 PM | Report abuse

And I forgot to mention... ITA

Posted by: Nate in the PDX | February 21, 2007 4:29 PM | Report abuse


Well, dave was just being a d-bag for no apparent reason. Then Bruce essentially turned the tables on his insinaution.

At which point cload responded with an equally random counter point.

Bruce came back with another great line insinuating he was small.

But it was PG who ended any insinuation and cut right to the chase.

and that is why it was funny....

Posted by: Skinz | February 21, 2007 4:30 PM | Report abuse

During the season, someone on the the extremeskins blog site started a weekly thing where they did a "separated at birth" string where people would post pictures of someone on the opposing team, and who they looked like. Fan sites in other cities caught on before too long, and links to those sites were posted too. The two consistent "separated at birth" comparison that other teams' blog sites had for the Skins were to compare Archuleta to Vanilla Ice, and Dockery to Mr. Peanut (as in Planters Peanuts).

So add that as another letter on chris Larry's list (what happened to E?) ... re-sign Dockery for love of the shape of his head.

Posted by: dcsween | February 21, 2007 4:35 PM | Report abuse


A. Dave's random "hey a-holes anyone know a good place to...." are actually funny, kind of a regualar gag, harmless, and I think he may actually need lunch recomendations...

B. The comebacks were not funny, way to obvious....

C. Alls poor Charlie did was give an opinion on the humor level and that he gets some mean spirited insults thrown his way...which seemed weird and well...not very creative or funny....

So color me confused....

Maybe ITA but seemed some regular names attached...

Posted by: chris Larry | February 21, 2007 4:36 PM | Report abuse

Skinz, come on, ITA, buddy! We're better than that up here!

sween, I love hearing about the cross-pollination between the blogs. I don't read any of the others because of the high assclown factor, so I never would have known. And I still hope Lisa's source is wrong about Springs leaving.

Posted by: Nate in the PDX | February 21, 2007 4:38 PM | Report abuse

I have heard Bugel seem less than enthusiastic about Dockery, most notably in his appearances with George Michael on NBC 4.

The drift of it was Bugel needed to get on Dockery in order to get him inspired.

It sounded to me like Bugel did not think Dock had enough fire for the game.

Posted by: Cliff Huxtable | February 21, 2007 4:39 PM | Report abuse


Posted by: chris Larry | February 21, 2007 4:41 PM | Report abuse

We'll just have to agree to disagree. He didn't call anyone A-holes he used a term that denegrates peoples sexuality. I think that's where some may have taken offense.

Not that there is anything wrong with that...

Anyway I think he's gotten too much attention as it is, so I'll just stick to the topic at hand.

I think that we should keep Dockery as well, provided his demands are reasonable.

Posted by: Skinz | February 21, 2007 4:42 PM | Report abuse

Skinz, when you said "cut to the chase" ... it reminded me of one of members of the Famous Crazy Ladies Hall of Fame, Lorena Bobbit, who told her then husband "It won't be long now."

[Seeing that I can no longer make jokes at the expense of the recently departed Anna Nicole Smith or the recently entering rehab/depression therapy Britney Spears, the only other recent entry into that Hall of Fame is the Shuttle Astronaut, Lt. Diaper.]

Posted by: dcsween | February 21, 2007 4:43 PM | Report abuse

"F E

Posted by: chris Larry"

Brilliant, chris Larry. E really had that one coming.

Posted by: Nate in the PDX | February 21, 2007 4:45 PM | Report abuse

I heard bugel and dockery went out to lunch with daveb55 and ever since then things have been weird between them. came from lisa's source, so......i'm not saying....i'm just saying

Posted by: PG | February 21, 2007 4:46 PM | Report abuse


You're really funneying your guts out today. I tell you what, aint another group of guys that I'd like to be funny with. HEE HEE HEE

Posted by: JJG | February 21, 2007 4:51 PM | Report abuse

new post.


Posted by: Nate in the PDX | February 21, 2007 4:55 PM | Report abuse


Posted by: BRADY A | February 21, 2007 4:59 PM | Report abuse

nate - i have to see that dvd. "hey is Dee Dee home?" is a line fron Chinese Rocks, maybe the greatest rock song ever, that Dee Dee wrote and everyone else stole (Thunders/Heartbreakers and Hell both did killer versions of it).
The song is about scoring drugs and getting wasted. sad but true.

Posted by: Jason La Canfora | February 21, 2007 4:59 PM | Report abuse

Dee Dee was a genius, Thanks Nate for the tip. I once sang Chineese Rocks with a live band at a Punk Rock highlight there...

Have you seen End of The Century? Is Kill Me Now one of the best books ever? Survey says....yes!

Posted by: chris Larry | February 21, 2007 5:04 PM | Report abuse

dudes, it was rough watching that documentary. Very raw, just Dee Dee being interviewed and a few vintage clips of Thunders. A double feature of that and "New York Doll" would be wonderful and brutal. Great stuff.

chris Larry, "Please Kill Me" (that's what you meant? the oral history of punk?) is one of the best books ever, yes, yes, yes. Due for a re-reading. Great call.

Posted by: Nate in the PDX | February 21, 2007 5:10 PM | Report abuse

Nate, you are on the money about the other blogs, but the extremeskins one has about 20-30 folks who post that often come up with something interesting ... the other 6000, less so. The problem is that there is a lot of throat clearing/"I agree"-type posts because every time you post, your number goes up ... and as your post numbers increase above fixed levels, the little picture that accompanies your post gets better. Bad incentive -- that feature.

Somebody there today put two and two together in a way that horrified me. It was about an article from Clayton (on that mentioned the Skins trading for a second time this week. In that same breath, he talks about how some trades happen at the Combine, citing the example of Randy Moss. Somebody wondered WHY he would talk about Randy Moss getting traded at THIS Combine in his little blurb about the Skins. Could someone who follows player contracts PLEASE tell me that the Skins would NOT do a straight up trade of Randy Moss for Brandon Lloyd (who seems to have the same absurd contract, only without the history of production)?

Posted by: dcsween | February 21, 2007 5:13 PM | Report abuse

Nate yes: I meant Please Kill Me I see the people who are still alive here in NY all the time Richard Hell Wayne/Jayne County, Tom Verlaine, David Johanssen, Lou Reed, Penny Arcade....I need to see NY Doll as well...

About 5 years ago I saw a Johnny Thunders Documentary at the NY Underground Film Festival that was screened as a work in was BRUTAL...but had some amazing ended with his 14 year old kid in Juvie hall....repeat cycle I guess...Thunders was amazing scene had a KILLER version of Pipeline that would feature him escaping behind the amp for lines of coke...and the come back and rip.....I never heard why that movie never was released.....

Also desperately wanting to see the MC5 movie that is stuck in legal hell....I might buy a bootleg from a dude I know...

OK end Proto-Punk

Posted by: chris Larry | February 21, 2007 5:21 PM | Report abuse

Lloyd for Moss. Hmm, a guy who can't play, for a guy who won't play. Sounds about right. But the Skins need to throw in a #2 and a ham and cheese sandwich.

Posted by: SMACK | February 21, 2007 5:28 PM | Report abuse

I read the Clayton piece.....I saw no connection between the skins stuff and the moss stuff...seperate thoughts on a simialar topic...

Posted by: chris Larry | February 21, 2007 5:51 PM | Report abuse

Yeah, Randy for Brandon would be a lousy trade, that doesn't make sense.

But Moss for Moss -- Randy for Santana -- NOW you're talking. Let's get Vinny on the horn and see about getting that done.

Posted by: Nate in the PDX | February 21, 2007 6:04 PM | Report abuse

Have the Nats changed their primary color to fuchsia, or is my monitor on the fritz?

Posted by: Nate in the PDX | February 21, 2007 6:08 PM | Report abuse


I did not post my info about Springs on ExtremeSkins.....guess they were reading this blog and ran with it - or got the info elsewhere. I will have to check it out. As I have mentioned ad nauseum, I will be devastated when Springs departs. And I want us to keep Dockery as well.

Posted by: Lisa | February 21, 2007 6:18 PM | Report abuse

Devestated? My last straw was Steven can get that wrapped up in them as individuals...the Skins have treated many players way worse than springs and for worse reasons.

Posted by: chris Larry | February 21, 2007 6:27 PM | Report abuse


Special note to Cindy - Hopefully the new equipment will have something a little newer than the 486 processor that MT is currently using. Have you considered a Core 2 Duo with the fabulous new Windows Vista? Of course it is big bucks, but definitely worth it.

After all, would I lie?

Posted by: B. Gates | February 21, 2007 7:55 PM | Report abuse

Are we actually any closer to figuring out what the deal is with where the get-together is going to happen? Haven't seen it mentioned in the last 50 or so posts. :)

Posted by: FlimFlam | February 22, 2007 2:21 AM | Report abuse


Posted by: Anonymous | February 22, 2007 5:11 PM | Report abuse

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