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Sellers' injury a thigh contusion

Mike Sellers' injury information was updated last night by the Redskins; he has a thigh contusion, not a hip injury. Coach Jim Zorn will have an update on his condition when he talks to the media at 12:25 today; there will be no player availability, the team said.

By Rick Maese  |  December 7, 2009; 7:03 AM ET
 
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Next: Suisham comes under fire for key misses

Comments

Sorry Guys....I jinxed the skins yesterday...

Just as we were kicking the chip shot FG.....I was yelling at the exact same time in the house, 'WE EATING SIX TOPPINGS TOMMOROW!!!'....Half a sec later....missed FG...

Sorry again!

Posted by: 4thFloor | December 7, 2009 7:13 AM | Report abuse

"I was thinking we were sitting pretty good in the game," Coach Jim Zorn said. "But this high-potent offense, they maintained their composure and drove the ball down. It's hard to stop that offense."

So why would you play for 3 points and not 7? This damn stupid coach really needs to go

Posted by: jm220 | December 7, 2009 7:16 AM | Report abuse

Yes JM220....Zorn not going for 7 as usual was also a reason, like always, Zorn underestimates the other team, but admits they have the strentghs to over come the underestimations?

Confusing, right?

Posted by: 4thFloor | December 7, 2009 7:19 AM | Report abuse

Just caught up on some of the older posts here...didn't realize nobody had thrown for 400 yards on us since that 500 yard game from Boomer back in the day. I still remember that game like it was last season...

Posted by: brownwood26 | December 7, 2009 7:25 AM | Report abuse

And JReid once again proved he doesn't know this team he's following...and he doesn't believe in Sherm Lewis, who learned the WCO at the feet of the creator.....

4th's evidence #3 that Vinny will be staying:

yesterday's game

Posted by: 4thFloor | December 7, 2009 7:45 AM | Report abuse

So why would you play for 3 points and not 7? This damn stupid coach really needs to go

Posted by: jm220


Didn't have a problem with Zorn trying to burn clock this time. You simply HAVE to make that FG. No excuses. Suisham needs to be cut. Sorry if that sounds overreactive.

Posted by: Predator48 | December 7, 2009 7:48 AM | Report abuse

4th's evidence #3 that Vinny will be staying:

yesterday's game

Posted by: 4thFloor | December 7, 2009 7:45 AM

What was reasons #1 & #2. If Shanahan comes I believe Vinny stays. Everything I've been reading lately points to that. I don't think Vinny will have as much control however.

Posted by: TWISI | December 7, 2009 7:54 AM | Report abuse

I am with Preditor, you kick the FG. The thing I saw missing was a reliable short yardage back for the skins and a big enough line for the run game.

No problem with conservative play calling at the 4th quarter red zone if you have the personnel to execute.

Posted by: alex35332 | December 7, 2009 8:11 AM | Report abuse

so much for the redskins getting blown out, and so much for GWILL coming back and inflicting his anger on the Redskins.

As I said last night, Suisham, Landry, and Sellers are to blame for this game. I mean, Suisham can't hit a 23 yrd fg??

I was on the dump JC wagon prior to yesterday, but he's shown me something. Thats the kind of offense that they need to have every week, 30 points, 400 plus yards....

So it turns out, if you actually throw the ball to DT/MK/FD, they can play football......wow...who knew....

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | December 7, 2009 8:15 AM | Report abuse

Can one of the coaches please tell Landry to stop acting like a gangster thug on the field with his head-nodding, arms-folding, hands-pounding antics. He's an embarassment to this team and I hope we cut his a$$. He taunts people after tackles too - he could have gotten at least two 2 15-yard personal fouls that I saw. He's a terrible safety. Who gets beat on a double move as the last line of defense in the last drive of the game. He should have been stationed at the goal line for god's sake. What a loser.

Posted by: quinn3 | December 7, 2009 8:17 AM | Report abuse

So it turns out, if you actually throw the ball to DT/MK/FD, they can play football......wow...who knew....

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | December 7, 2009 8:15 AM | Report abuse

Bean, I agree with you dude. Not sure how Suisham can possibly survive this latest miss. Seattle in the playoffs, Dallas 3 weeks ago, the 23-yard FG yesterday...dude needs to go.

As for JC17, I was ecstatic to see him play so well, but gosh man I just can't get behind him 100% until I see him lead us down the field when it matters. He gets tight and makes terrible decisions / poor throws in critical situations for whatever reason. That pick was awful...he's got to take us down the field ONCE in crunch time to prove to us all he actually has that ability...

Posted by: mattylight | December 7, 2009 8:21 AM | Report abuse

Okay here is a crazy thought on "trade bate"

Santana Moss

Still talented, a bit up there in years, the 2nd rounders and Marko are looking ready to be the starting WR core, maybe with El in the slot.

Posted by: alex35332 | December 7, 2009 8:24 AM | Report abuse

ml, that is troubling no doubt, and agreed he does tend to tense up...he got good protection, and he played great, if the team can fortify the line, then lets not add to the list of needs.

Oh, and Suh in the first round, for the record...this cat is a MONSTER...

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | December 7, 2009 8:28 AM | Report abuse

No problem with conservative play calling at the 4th quarter red zone if you have the personnel to execute.

Posted by: alex35332 | December 7, 2009 8:11 AM

When have they been able to run successfully in the red zone this year? When have we been able to hold onto a lead against a good offense this year? When has your red zone passing game been as effective as in yesterday's game?

Someone said it best last night. In the red zone, you play to score TDs not settle for FGs. Especially when your team isn't as talented as the other team. Yes Susiham should've made the kick, but think about the message sent to the offense by not taking at least one shot at the end zone.

Posted by: TWISI | December 7, 2009 8:29 AM | Report abuse

anyone else care to conjecture that we threw that win in order to get draft position?

Posted by: DikShuttle | December 7, 2009 8:32 AM | Report abuse

Oh, and Suh in the first round, for the record...this cat is a MONSTER...

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | December 7, 2009 8:28 AM | Report abuse

Ha, yeah, I'm not for dumping JC, just wish he would relax during those moments...

Suh and AH would be unstoppable...

Posted by: mattylight | December 7, 2009 8:35 AM | Report abuse

Oh, and Suh in the first round, for the record...this cat is a MONSTER...

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | December 7, 2009 8:28 AM

Suh and Haynesworth in the middle,Orakpo and Carter outside...nice. You'd have to trade up to get Suh so I think Gerald McCoy from Oklahoma is more likely if the skins go that direction.

Posted by: TWISI | December 7, 2009 8:37 AM | Report abuse

I agree that the conservative play calling would not have mattered had the stupid kicker made a simple, easy FG. I am still bummed by this game. While we are talking about getting rid of people, how about jettisoning Sellers. He's big and acts tough but plays soft on the field. The guy's blocking leaves a lot to be desired. We bring him in for tough yardage and he seldoms makes a defining block. Suisham has to go. Only a Skins kicker would miss that chip shot. I'm tired of hearing Zorn's aw-shucks analysis of the game, about playing hard and competing, yadda, yadda, yadda. Please, shut the f*ck up! Win a game for crying out loud!

Posted by: jfoster13 | December 7, 2009 8:41 AM | Report abuse

Okay here is a crazy thought on "trade bate"

Santana Moss

Still talented, a bit up there in years, the 2nd rounders and Marko are looking ready to be the starting WR core, maybe with El in the slot.


Posted by: alex35332 | December 7, 2009 8:24 AM


Personally, I'd get rid of ARE before Moss. I think you could get some good production out of Moss in the slot for a couple years before dumping him for a younger guy.

For folks salivating over Suh...just stop it. O-line takes precedent over D-line for at least the next 2 years. Plus Suh is almost a lock for the 1st overall pick and it would be ridiculous to trade up. This team will likely be picking in the top 5 anyway; take the best O-lineman available and keep steppin'.

Posted by: brownwood26 | December 7, 2009 8:43 AM | Report abuse

Sellers is sadly one of the best fullbacks in the NFL. Its a league wide problem, the position has become so thin. I mean the last great one was Alstot (sp?) in Tampa. If Portis put on 50 lbs I think he could play fullback though.

Posted by: alex35332 | December 7, 2009 8:45 AM | Report abuse

Suisham, to me, is a lot like JC. So I'm kind of glad, in an evaluation sense, that we got to see what he can -- or can't -- do under pressure.
Coach Daggar would've tried harder to put it in the end zone, particularly on 3rd down when any reasonable-length play would've hit the 2:00 warning. That rollout TD JC scored last week, for example, would've been a better call on second down, and another rollout pass/run option on third (like the Yoder TD) would play off that. the W-L record doesn't matter anymore; I want to evaluate players, not evaluate whether the playcaller staff can eek out a FG.
But if Zorn comes out and says, "I wanted to see is Suisham could win the game for us", then I'm okay with their choice. The bonus was that, with the quick tying TD, JC got the ball in his hands with 1:00+ and two timeouts.
Suisham got the basic RFA tender this year -- basically, right-of-first-refusal -- because he hasn't proven himself with clutch kicks.
JC -- in Daggar-as-GM-land -- gets the same thing -- RFA at the 1st+3rd tender amount. With a coach/offensive coordinator selected to make him shine, and a guarantee that I'll give him the long-term contract as soon as he wins a game "singlehandedly". If he can't, I'll let him go UFA next year and he can go win super bowls (or head-butt walls, whichever, I don't care) somewhere else.

Posted by: daggar | December 7, 2009 8:47 AM | Report abuse

For the record, since the Dallas game, the trips have put up the following:

30 catches, 398 yards, 4tds. Not world beating, but goes to show that they can play, when they're utilized. I still think they need to throw to MK more often..

I've been pimping them since being drafted, but DT is TALENTED, cat is big, fast, and is figuring this all out.

And no on trading Tana...move him to the slot, like some old, slow, bama yanks fan has been suggesting...

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | December 7, 2009 8:47 AM | Report abuse

Well, myself, mattylight, and MrRedskin won the prop bet, sadly for zjfr2.

I don't even feel like gloating about it. I was hoping for high draft pick, but I really wanted to win yesterday. I feel like we cheated ourselves, that we WERE cheated, and that Suisham altered history forever (I'll be nauseous if we have to sit through 2 weeks of 18-0 vs. 18-0 in January and a subsequent unbeaten Saints team).

All the same, any props for picking what SHOULD have been a great upset?

Posted by: Rypien11 | December 7, 2009 8:49 AM | Report abuse

Not one post about the alleged fumble call in the OT period. Even the announcers said he was down before the ball came out and the ref was on top of it and blew the play dead. Just goes to show you that the NFL wants the Saints to win. Look at the replays, we was robbed! Hope the NFL reviews the call. But as usual they'll back the Refs even if they are wrong.

Posted by: DSBJB1244 | December 7, 2009 8:50 AM | Report abuse

CUT Suisham.

It's not overreactive. Ask zorn about his shank in Seattle 2007. He has sucked before the Dallas game. His kickoffs are pitiful too. He brings nothing. Bring BRANDON COUTU. Or anyone.

For anyone that thinks he should stay, picture the redskins down two in a future nfc championship game, at the opponents 29 with two seconds left to kick the game winner. Do you want suisham in that situation?? NO!! So get on with it and let's see a new kicker on a 4wk tryout.

Posted by: AdamCr | December 7, 2009 8:51 AM | Report abuse

Now that I'm no longer fuming about the officiating, I can look at the bright side. Campbell looks fantastic, the OL played its guts out, the defense played admirably considering the competition (except for Landry of course).

After the past 3 games, and this game especially, it's pretty clear what the team needs to do:

1. New HC
2. Keep Blache if possible w/ new HC
3. Re-sign Campbell
4. Release or Trade if possible:
Portis
Betts
Randel El
Landry
Suisam
Sellers
5. Draft OL, RB, Safety
6. Use extra money from those cuts to fill OL, RB, Safety gaps not filled from the draft.
7. Win!

Remember next year is probably uncapped and we can really take advantage of that by cutting our "veteran" players who we owe a ton of money, and rebuilding like a pro team would.

Posted by: REXskins | December 7, 2009 8:52 AM | Report abuse

wood, I can see dumping either, but I m not sure on how good moss is doing slot shifting and shimmy. Plus if we are desperate for picks you get more for Moss then El.

Posted by: alex35332 | December 7, 2009 8:52 AM | Report abuse

I was wondering about the call in OT as well. Even if the referees decided it was a fumble, the whistle clearly was blown before anyone recovered the ball, wasn't it? So I don't understand if the whistle was blown and the play called dead, even inadvertently, how can you decide the Saints recovered the fumble? It was a weird sequence to be sure...

Posted by: mattylight | December 7, 2009 8:53 AM | Report abuse

Dear Mr. Reid,

We appreciate all of the updates. However, please don't update again until you can write the Suisham release headline. Thats all we really care about right now. You can also let us know about potential replacements.

Love,
all of us

Posted by: Buckleycj | December 7, 2009 8:54 AM | Report abuse

P.S. you are also allowed to write about Cerrato being fired.

Posted by: Buckleycj | December 7, 2009 8:55 AM | Report abuse

Andy Pollin swears that this guy Lombardi who is in his words (The Peter King of his particular media outlet) is reporting the Shanahan will be coach next year and Vinny is 100% staying on as defacto GM. Heard this on Monday Morining QB this morning. Thoughts.........

Posted by: FedorEm | December 7, 2009 8:56 AM | Report abuse

So how did BMW do at right guard? I thought he did well. I didn't see the interior line getting pushed back into JC's face and it appeared that we had an actual pocket for most of the day. Did anyone else get any good looks at BMW?

Posted by: PAskinsfan17 | December 7, 2009 8:59 AM | Report abuse

@ brownwood26 I think we all agree that OL is the most important position, but with the #5 pick at the moment and with only one projected top ten OL man currently, chances are that palyer, Okung, would be gone by the time the skins picked unless they trade up. To that extent, I certainly wouldn't want the skins to reach for a OL prospect at #5 if they couldn't trade back. Better to get an OL prospect in the second round and draft hopefully one of the DT.

Posted by: TWISI | December 7, 2009 8:59 AM | Report abuse

I still haven't heard why the Sellers play wasn't an INCOMPLETE. Sellers barely had his second foot down, didn't make a football move, and didn't maintain possession through the tackle. I have seen plays ruled incomplete where the receiver has held on to the ball for longer, since they instituted the more stringent rules for completions. Complete, fumble, and possession change should have been the LAST ruling possible.

Not that that was worse than the Moore call, who was ON TOP OF SHOCKEY when he fell.

Or the incomplete pass to the Saints ruled a completion.

Or the 'Brady rule' on JC that didn't get called.

Posted by: Rypien11 | December 7, 2009 8:59 AM | Report abuse

[Cut Suisham.] For anyone that thinks he should stay, picture the redskins down two in a future nfc championship game.

Have we mentioned that the odds of us making the championship game are pretty low at this point [unless there's some sort of "losers bracket" championship that I don't know about]?
Do you want to cut him today, or by the end of the year? If today, realize that you'll be cutting into Zorn's spa treatment, rolfing, and zen session. And Danny Smith will have to take time away from teaching KBarnes how to avoid a descending punt.
I'm all for trying to upgrade at K. But it's not my highest priority.

Posted by: daggar | December 7, 2009 8:59 AM | Report abuse

Andy Pollin swears that this guy Lombardi who is in his words (The Peter King of his particular media outlet) is reporting the Shanahan will be coach next year and Vinny is 100% staying on as defacto GM. Heard this on Monday Morining QB this morning. Thoughts.........

Posted by: FedorEm | December 7, 2009 8:56 AM

I heard that to, that guy is a big insider and most of us have always said that if it's Shanahan Vinny would stay.

Posted by: Flounder21 | December 7, 2009 8:59 AM | Report abuse

Does upchucking count as a thought, Fedor?

Posted by: DikShuttle | December 7, 2009 9:00 AM | Report abuse

FYI on Campbell, I just was thinking about it. His future depends entirely on if the team stays with the west coast offence or if they go to something else.

If they stick with West Coast I think JC will continue to progress as he will be at that 3 year mark when it all should click for him. The system is not the best suited for his skills, but the mental is more important then the physical in a QB. A good coach can adjust the west coast system to fit Jason's skill set a bit.

IF they change philosophies again, then the team should get rid of Jason, that would be too many different philosophies for 1 player.

Posted by: alex35332 | December 7, 2009 9:02 AM | Report abuse

Yeah I am not sure I like that idea. I mean, the team though still losing and painfully at that, is still playing good ball under Zorn. Maybe they like him, well at least the young guys and back ups do. I was hoping for no Vinny, but I knew that was far fetched. They are attatched at the hip. You can only hope that he now knows not to ignore OL for 10 years and waste 100 million on 1 dude. They may get it 1 day, it just takes those morons a while to get it. Devin Thomas is going to be a beast next year.

Posted by: FedorEm | December 7, 2009 9:05 AM | Report abuse

If true about Shanny, then they'd probably run/continue with a WCO type offense..

Tell you what, I'm impressed with Ganther...I like this cat, runs hard, and has some shake to him...

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | December 7, 2009 9:07 AM | Report abuse

I was reading about Campbell and how he may draw interest... well trade him then because he had a nice stat day, he usually does, but when they needed him most he choked and threw a huge pick... Brees did the oppisite against a better defense, under more duress and in a hostile environmet.

Posted by: Burrasta1 | December 7, 2009 9:08 AM | Report abuse

word on 106.7 is that Vinny has been bad mouthing Snyder around the league behind his back.

If Mike Holmgren is on the team as a president or FO type, then Zorn will be fired.

Posted by: alex35332 | December 7, 2009 9:10 AM | Report abuse

Have we mentioned that the odds of us making the championship game are pretty low at this point [unless there's some sort of "losers bracket" championship that I don't know about]?
Do you want to cut him today, or by the end of the year?
___________________

Today. Barnes play was bad but it's his second game ever. Young guys make mistakes. With all the mistakes, suisham makes a high school field goal, we win.

I'm not talking about NFC championship this year, obviously [read: "future"]. But suisham CANNOT be part of the plans so let's see someone else now so we have an idea for next year. Suishams multi year tryout has gone on long enough.

Posted by: AdamCr | December 7, 2009 9:11 AM | Report abuse

They lost again, and although Suisham is the culprit for this particular game, the season is all about Jim Zorn.

He's a sham. Although he comes off publicly as a "stay medium" neo-hippie wannabe Zen master, when the game is on the line, he becomes as TIGHT as a tourniquet.

Consequently, with their head coach being tight in games, the players become tight as well.

He's got to go.

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | December 7, 2009 9:12 AM | Report abuse

tell you what, i saw Barnes put a lick on Reggie Bush in the open field, I was impressed with that.

On the opposite end I saw smoot get turned, burned, and twisted by every saints WR...seems like smooter might have lost something.

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | December 7, 2009 9:13 AM | Report abuse

Tell you what, I'm impressed with Ganther...I like this cat, runs hard, and has some shake to him...

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | December 7, 2009 9:07 AM | Report abuse

Ganther has the best YPC on the team, he may not be a every down back, but bringing him back next year to replace betts is a good move.

Posted by: alex35332 | December 7, 2009 9:14 AM | Report abuse

Fred Davis-32 catches for 319 yards and 3 TDs
Devin Thomas-23 catches for 287 1 yards and 3 TDs
Malcolm Kelly-14 catches for 194 yards

progress.

Posted by: alex35332 | December 7, 2009 9:16 AM | Report abuse

Im not sure I want Shanny. I mean, the guy has already won 2 SB's. He can come in, give it a go for 2 or 3 seasons and when/if he fails, he leaves and the team is ONCE AGAIN left searching for the next big move. The cycle is never ending... it could start to be broken by

FIRE(ing) VINNY!!!

Posted by: VaBeachBlitz | December 7, 2009 9:17 AM | Report abuse

About the missed field goal, Cooley said the snap was high and it caused the kicker to pause for a sec in his steps before the kick.

Posted by: SAK2 | December 7, 2009 9:20 AM | Report abuse

I'm a little confused by folks today, though...

There's loads of talk about how the newbs played well... and then comments about firing Vinnie

How can you have it both ways?

Posted by: DikShuttle | December 7, 2009 9:20 AM | Report abuse

word on 106.7 is that Vinny has been bad mouthing Snyder around the league behind his back.

If Mike Holmgren is on the team as a president or FO type, then Zorn will be fired.

Posted by: alex35332 | December 7, 2009 9:10 AM | Report abuse

I heard on the Skins post game radio show that Vinny had "berated" Zorn after the Philly loss (most recent one). If he's berating Z man and talking trash about the Danny... maybe he IS on his way out.


God, I hope so.

F Vinny and his bug eyed zombie stare

Posted by: VaBeachBlitz | December 7, 2009 9:23 AM | Report abuse

I'm a little confused by folks today, though...

There's loads of talk about how the newbs played well... and then comments about firing Vinnie

How can you have it both ways?
------------

every decision vinny made hasn't been horrible, just enough over the years to deserve a firing. The oline we trotted out to start the season is enough.

Posted by: AdamCr | December 7, 2009 9:24 AM | Report abuse

WOW, i tell ya what, these last 3 losses have been really tough, but WOW, the Skins are playing entertaining football right now and we are still going to have a top 10 pick, it's good to see the young guys step up......suisham needs to be cut today, end of story

Posted by: retroskins14 | December 7, 2009 9:24 AM | Report abuse

I'm a little confused by folks today, though...

There's loads of talk about how the newbs played well... and then comments about firing Vinnie

How can you have it both ways?

Posted by: DikShuttle | December 7, 2009 9:20 AM | Report abuse

Are you a Vinny enthusiast? The guy may be able to identify talent... but marrying that with team needs, building a team/roster is out of his skill set. Have you been paying attention to this teams transgressions???

Posted by: VaBeachBlitz | December 7, 2009 9:26 AM | Report abuse

So we're gonna pick Suh from Nebraska with out #1 pick right? I know our offensive line needs work but did any one SEE the Big 12 Conference Championship Game! Suh was a beast. How do you pass that guy up? Make it happen Vinny!

Oh yeah, Cut Suisham! Now! And Kareem Moore: Next time, just FALL DOWN!!! We did not need a touchdown there and you are clearly not used to handling the ball. Some lessons are harder learned than others...

Posted by: MEssex | December 7, 2009 9:27 AM | Report abuse

who said Zorn will be fired if Holmy is hired?
Zorn is like a son to him.. Most likely Zorn will be kicked upstairs or back to QB coach.

Ref Shanny.. Yeah, if hired Vinny stays if Shanny calls the shots.. He and Vinny are tight from SF days.

Posted by: cliftonbiz | December 7, 2009 9:28 AM | Report abuse

I was reading about Campbell and how he may draw interest... well trade him then because he had a nice stat day, he usually does, but when they needed him most he choked and threw a huge pick... Brees did the oppisite against a better defense, under more duress and in a hostile environmet.

Posted by: Burrasta1 | December 7, 2009 9:08 AM | Report abuse

ok, brees is better than Campbell and just about every NFL qb. Got it. Who do you plan to replace Campbell with?

Posted by: AdamCr | December 7, 2009 9:28 AM | Report abuse

Dik, its all about track record as AdamCr comments. Maybe if your eyes were as wide open as Vinny's, you could see that...

Sorry, not trying to be a total dik, but did you hear Vinny's comments to reporters earlier this year? I think it was JReid who asked Vinny about the OL. Vinny, the guy who is for all intents and purposes the GM of this team, the Head of Football Operations, replies with " You mean with all the sacks and stuff?"

"and stuff" ....


"and stuff" .....


OMFG....

You want this guy running your favorite team??

Posted by: VaBeachBlitz | December 7, 2009 9:29 AM | Report abuse

Boycott Snyder -- or else the mediocrity keeps going and going and going and going and going and going and going and going and going and going and going and going and going and going and going and going and going and going and going and going and...

Posted by: Pepper5 | December 7, 2009 9:31 AM | Report abuse

word on 106.7 is that Vinny has been bad mouthing Snyder around the league behind his back.

If Mike Holmgren is on the team as a president or FO type, then Zorn will be fired.

Posted by: alex35332 | December 7, 2009 9:10 AM


Wow, I hope that's true...as sensitive as Snyder is, Vinny is as good as gone if he catches wind of that.

As for Holmgren/Zorn: Zorn was on his staff in Seattle. That's pretty damning of Zorn and essentially a nail in Zorn's coffin at the NFL level if he can't even land a gig with the guy who brought him into his most successful gig in the pros.

Posted by: brownwood26 | December 7, 2009 9:32 AM | Report abuse

Fred Davis-32 catches for 319 yards and 3 TDs
Devin Thomas-23 catches for 287 1 yards and 3 TDs
Malcolm Kelly-14 catches for 194 yards

Al, yeah its progress, and at this point in time its water under the bridge, but this progress should have happened last year..oh well I guess.

Did anyone hear the annoucers talk about how Fred Davis is the hardest guy on the team to tackle....to think that he'd still be rotting on the bench if not for Cooley getting hurt....

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | December 7, 2009 9:36 AM | Report abuse

I'm a little confused by folks today, though...

There's loads of talk about how the newbs played well... and then comments about firing Vinnie

How can you have it both ways?

Posted by: DikShuttle | December 7, 2009 9:20 AM | Report abuse

There are plenty of reasons he should get canned. Last couple of games notwithstanding the O-Line is still bad, and he didn't address it in the offseason, and waited until we were like 2-4 to bring a guy like Levi Jones in. He, from all accounts, was instrumental in hiring Zorn, which was obviously a bad hire, underscored by the fact that our offense is much improved since he got axed as a playcaller.

Other personnel moves -- the Jason Taylor trade in particular, have been questionable at best. I'll give him the nod that the 2008 draft might not be nearly as bad as was made out to be earlier this year, but like I have said before, many a GM in the NFL will get the boot solely off a bad HC hire. Vinny should be held accountable for bringing in Zorny...

Posted by: mattylight | December 7, 2009 9:37 AM | Report abuse

So, I'm anti-Shanahan as GM/HC. Separation of those roles is critically important.
I strongly believe that Snyder as an owner is what he is, isn't going away anytime soon, and has to be managed. What does he want to do? Beyond win, he wants to participate in the FA process. Perhaps he wants to watch the combine.
So the GM/VP has to (a) manage the owner; (b) develop and maintain a Pro Personnel evaluation staff (aka Morocco Brown); (c) develop and maintain a college evaluation staff; (d) develop and maintain the coaching staff; (e) execute fair and reasonable trades; and, (f) manage the salary cap.
I'm not, apparently, as anti-Vinny as most. His biggest mistake IMO has been Zorn, but if the only alternative was Fassel, then I'm not sure it's a fair choice; and if Snyder was his wingman through the selection process, it's going to be hard to pin the blame entirely on him.

Posted by: daggar | December 7, 2009 9:37 AM | Report abuse

Anybody who isn't going to choke

Posted by: Burrasta1 | December 7, 2009 9:37 AM | Report abuse

yea vinny sucks and he's got to go, all these guys he drafted are starting to do well the last 3 weeks and guess what we are 0-3....we are 3-9 on the season and we might be 6-6 or 7-5 with a sold o-line

the Skins are playing well, but we are our record 3-9, vinny and suisham need to be cut

todaysskins14

Posted by: retroskins14 | December 7, 2009 9:37 AM | Report abuse

biggest story here is the Payton timeout during OT. And the network commentator's influence on the booth review which has the game feed next to their DVR review device.
The network played the Sellers fumble over and over (forward reverse forward, etc), during the timeout, until predictably the booth review was announced before the timeout expired and play resumed.

The NFL should remove the commercial game feed from that review booth.

On a related note, to support the removal of the commercial feed, its interesting to see in ESPN games continuous replays of questionable plays during ESPN broadcasted Giants or Jets games, supporting a review in favor of those teams. A high percentage of the video guys in the ESPN media trailers are mostly NY/CT residents... They can feed the replays to the commentators and suggest a questionable play..who in turn can influence the booth review, if its in effect.
Removing the commercial game feed from the review booth would negate this.

Posted by: cliftonbiz | December 7, 2009 9:38 AM | Report abuse

Ref Shanny.. Yeah, if hired Vinny stays if Shanny calls the shots.. He and Vinny are tight from SF days.


Posted by: cliftonbiz | December 7, 2009 9:28 AM | Report abuse

The murmurs from the Shanahan camp earlier in the year was that Shanny will not work with Vinny C.

And why would he? Shanny is a successful class act.

Vinny is a walking disaster and the butt of NFL jokes who holds his position simply b/c he shares a bunk bed with the owner.

As long as Vinny C is around no self-respecting football exec/coach will be interested in the Skins.

The organization would only attract the desperate first-timers looking for a head coaching gig or the desperate retreads looking to get back in the league.

Posted by: p1funk | December 7, 2009 9:38 AM | Report abuse

Kareem Moore should be the starting FS for this team. The guy can make plays on the ball and can deliver big hits (Ive seen him lay some big time "make you say ouch from your couch" hits). Give the guy some PT and he learns to secure the ball after making an INT.

Landry needs to be dealt with. Whether its a harsh talking to, a demotion to the bench... somethings gotta give. Bobbing his head like a gorilla after barely making a tackle on 2nd down??? STFU and line up for the next play son. He is clueless.

Posted by: VaBeachBlitz | December 7, 2009 9:39 AM | Report abuse

While we're (rightfully) jumping on landry, is there some reason he can't use his arms to tackle people? This isn't hockey or lacrosse. You can actually use something other than your shoulder (or head) to hit somebody. On the play before the last touchdown where he shoulder jabbed brees, I think he potentially causes a fumble if he gets his hands involved in that tackle sequence. Why are his fundamentals so bad and why isn't anyone apparently trying to fix them?

Posted by: Pennsylhoya | December 7, 2009 9:41 AM | Report abuse

I was SCREAMING for JC to quick snap the ball before they had a chance to review the play....oh well...

I'm pissed they lost, but I saw progress, I saw them taking steps FORWARD, and not backwards. I saw the offense moving up and down the field, and the opposing defense had no answer for it.

Brees giving ACarter the Heisman, then throwing for a TD, made me throw up in my mouth a little....

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | December 7, 2009 9:44 AM | Report abuse

The single solitary item on my end-of-season-wish-list all year has been:

1) Fire Vinny


After yesterday's game, I've added a second item:

1) Fire Vinny
2) Trade Laron Landry


That's right. I don't care if we keep Zorn. I don't care if we keep Campbell.

I want LL30 gone. After his play (or lack thereof), his wiggling gyrations on the field after routine tackles (the ones he actually makes instead of whiffs), and his arrogant post-game comments, the guy has proven to be a first-class chump.

He is the anti-SeanTaylor.

Posted by: p1funk | December 7, 2009 9:44 AM | Report abuse

I still haven't heard why the Sellers play wasn't an INCOMPLETE. Sellers barely had his second foot down, didn't make a football move, and didn't maintain possession through the tackle. I have seen plays ruled incomplete where the receiver has held on to the ball for longer, since they instituted the more stringent rules for completions. Complete, fumble, and possession change should have been the LAST ruling possible.

Not that that was worse than the Moore call, who was ON TOP OF SHOCKEY when he fell.

Or the incomplete pass to the Saints ruled a completion.

Or the 'Brady rule' on JC that didn't get called.

Posted by: Rypien11 | December 7, 2009 9:45 AM | Report abuse

Kareem Moore should be the starting FS for this team.

Sorry, somebody else Up Here just cut him for fumbling.

Posted by: daggar | December 7, 2009 9:47 AM | Report abuse

Landry is extrememely disappointing. From the Seattle playoff game when he had 2 picks to now has been a huge drop off. To think we could have had AP makes me want to vom.

Posted by: FedorEm | December 7, 2009 9:47 AM | Report abuse

I'm not, apparently, as anti-Vinny as most. His biggest mistake IMO has been Zorn, but if the only alternative was Fassel, then I'm not sure it's a fair choice; and if Snyder was his wingman through the selection process, it's going to be hard to pin the blame entirely on him.

Posted by: daggar | December 7, 2009 9:37 AM | Report abuse

There were many more candidates for the HC job on this team than Zorn and Fassel. Any assistant coach on any team could have been interviewed for the job. And Vinny/Danny hired the entire coaching staff and expected to fill in the HC... who does that?! ONly these 2 clowns. This team needs someone to stand up against the owner and tell him no. I know, easier said than done.

Posted by: VaBeachBlitz | December 7, 2009 9:50 AM | Report abuse

If Landry is not benched for the next game then there is no accountability on this team. If Los gets benched for repeatedly biting on the double move than Landry needs to get benched too, it's as simple as that.

Posted by: Moose33 | December 7, 2009 9:50 AM | Report abuse

I want LL30 gone. After his play (or lack thereof), his wiggling gyrations on the field after routine tackles (the ones he actually makes instead of whiffs), and his arrogant post-game comments, the guy has proven to be a first-class chump.

He is the anti-SeanTaylor.

Posted by: p1funk | December 7, 2009 9:44 AM | Report abuse

He's frustrating, I agree. I have no problem with a temporary demotion or move to SS. But I wouldn't quit on him. ST21 had plenty of growing pains and whiffs before he achieved his potential.

Posted by: AdamCr | December 7, 2009 9:50 AM | Report abuse

Why are his fundamentals so bad and why isn't anyone apparently trying to fix them?

Posted by: Pennsylhoya | December 7, 2009 9:41 AM | Report abuse


Because if you are a high draft pick and/or make alot of $$ you run the show on this team. And you are not accountable to anyone.

It took them about 4 years to finally discipline/bench Rogers for consistently getting beat on the double moves.

I guess at this rate we have to withstand 2 more years of poor coverage, blown assignments and poor tackling from LL30 before they do something about it.

Posted by: p1funk | December 7, 2009 9:52 AM | Report abuse

pfunk..
on my end of season wish list.

The NFL buys the team from Dan Snyder (give him LA) and reorganizes the Skins ala the Green Bay model (fan ownership).

Posted by: cliftonbiz | December 7, 2009 9:53 AM | Report abuse

Bottom line is we went toe-to-toe with the favorite to represent the NFC in the Super Bowl, and a 12-0 team. The game, to me, just underscored how small the margin is between being a good team and being a bad team in the NFL. We saw both sides of it yesterday. The Skins can play with anyone on any given day, but repeatedly make the same small mistakes in crunch time that you can't make if you want to win, and the Saints didn't.

In particular: Moore just can't get stripped on the INT. Suisham cannot miss that FG. Campbell cannot throw such a bad pick on 1st down in opposing territory with the game on the line. Sellars cannot fumble the ball in OT like that -- use both hands and take care of the ball. Landry cannot let guys get behind him on the final drive of the game for the Saints. Some might argue with this, but I hated Zorn going conservative there at the end. Something tells me Payton would have gone for a TD....


So I walked away frin the gane being encouraged, yet really disappointed.

So frustrating...

Posted by: mattylight | December 7, 2009 9:55 AM | Report abuse

This team will continue to play close games and choke, because their head coach always chokes.

He plays not to lose, he frets, he worries, he second-guesses.... He's the main problem.

Zorn's got to go.

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | December 7, 2009 9:57 AM | Report abuse

I want LL30 gone. After his play (or lack thereof), his wiggling gyrations on the field after routine tackles (the ones he actually makes instead of whiffs), and his arrogant post-game comments, the guy has proven to be a first-class chump.

He is the anti-SeanTaylor.

Posted by: p1funk | December 7, 2009 9:44 AM | Report abuse

He's frustrating, I agree. I have no problem with a temporary demotion or move to SS. But I wouldn't quit on him. ST21 had plenty of growing pains and whiffs before he achieved his potential.

Posted by: AdamCr | December 7, 2009 9:50 AM | Report abuse


ST21 was coachable.

He had one really bad year because they were mis-coaching him (by Gregg Williams own admission). They were asking him to do too much to come up and play the run and that left him vulnerable in play-action on the deep balls. Once that was corrected he had a ProBowl season.

After the game, LL30's comments about biting on the double-moves were startling. He basically said he'd do it again b/c he gonna always be trying to break on the ball and make a play. A couple times on plays he's missed, he's talked about the guy not being his assignment anyways...are you kidding me? You are a free saftey?? Isn't your job mostly about tackling the guys who get past the other defenders?

Not only that, but we frankly don't need him.

Doughty and Horton will do fine at SS. We can develop Moore, Smoot and Lendy Holmes at FS.

Trade him and get some picks in return.

Yeah, they may not torpedoe people the way LL30 does, but I bet they'd get beat in coverage less and I bet they'd be more willing to learn how to tackle people.

Posted by: p1funk | December 7, 2009 9:58 AM | Report abuse

Calls were horrendous from the refs, I thought beyond the calls that hurt us, they screwed up a ton of calls.

The youngsters played really well and gave us a view of the future of what they can do if they are indeed played and thrown to.

I loved the defense that we played until the end of the game, I hate the prevent zone defense more than I hate Suisham and Zorn.

I think if we are going to rebuild, then we go hard in that direction with the youth...trade Cooley, Moss, ARE and Landry. Davis is a real deal TE and we have seen Yoder is a great back up.

The OL played pretty well yesterday, BMW even played well, I was pissed when I noticed E. Williams was a non active, but BMW played pretty well.

AH makes a huge difference in this defense, period.

Posted by: mhartz1 | December 7, 2009 9:59 AM | Report abuse

I have no problem with running the clock and kicking the field goal however...3rd and goal and they snapped it right before the 2 min warning. Throw it...if it's incomplete, the clock is stopped anyways. Great place for a play action pass for a QB who was lights out....yeah, I mean Campbell not Brees.

Posted by: svxcountry1 | December 7, 2009 9:59 AM | Report abuse

I wouldn't pretend Jason Campbell's anything but a decent to average NFL quarterback, but it's ridiculous for people to criticize his game yesterday. For those who say he didn't come through in the clutch, who drove the Skins down for the game-clinching field goal with two minutes left? It's not Campbell's fault we have a kicker who should be cut from most high school teams. After all, the Redskins will be the Redskins.

It's also not Campbell's fault if his coach takes the ball out of his hands inside the red zone. The wide-right drive might have been a game-clinching TD drive if Zorn wasn't so chicken----. I mean, that off-tackle stretch play hasn't worked inside the 5 all year, yet it's still their go-to play for some reason.

Posted by: closer44 | December 7, 2009 10:01 AM | Report abuse

@cliftonbiz:

How do the commentators effect the booth review in any way?

I was under the impression the refs didn't listen to the commentors. Are you suggesting they have a direct line of communication?

Posted by: REXskins | December 7, 2009 10:02 AM | Report abuse

"Landry cannot let guys get behind him on the final drive of the game for the Saints"

This to me, was the most aggregious of the problems they had...mostly because it happened twice, once with Meachem, and once with Colston....

Why aren't Rogers/Landry making progress, or working harder...thats what I want to know....

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | December 7, 2009 10:03 AM | Report abuse

I want LL30 gone.

Posted by: p1funk | December 7, 2009 9:52 AM

I'd like to see him benched, because that's the only way he'd understand that his play is not up to par. I don't think he should be cut. He made some really good plays yesterday. I think he doesn't have, or care for, the FS mentality. Put him in the box where is over aggressive nature won't be too harmful to the team. BTW there should be some decent Free agent FS this off season.

Posted by: TWISI | December 7, 2009 10:03 AM | Report abuse

Trade him and get some picks in return.

Yeah, they may not torpedoe people the way LL30 does, but I bet they'd get beat in coverage less and I bet they'd be more willing to learn how to tackle people.

Posted by: p1funk | December 7, 2009 9:58 AM | Report abuse

If we could get high picks, fine, but i doubt we can. I don't think we know if he's coachable based on press conference comments. He's at fault plenty of times this year, but I think we can work with him.

Is Shaun Suisham coachable??? He's been making the same mistakes for years now. Short kickoffs, missed chippies, etc, and it keeps happening. And he has no special talent that makes you think he could ever be a decent kicker. CUT HIM. It's 10:06am already, where's the press release???

Posted by: AdamCr | December 7, 2009 10:07 AM | Report abuse

So why would you play for 3 points and not 7? This damn stupid coach really needs to go

Posted by: jm220 | December 7, 2009 7:16 AM | Report abuse


DING DING DING! We have a winner!

I missed most of the game yesterday but I did get to see 3rd & goal from the 6 with 2:00 left and a touchdown lead.

I said, "here comes the stretch play" and damn if I wasn't right. The missed FG serves as proof that the football gods hate that play call as much as we fans do.

On a positive note, all we need to do to is lose to Oakland next week and we'll have the #5 pick wrapped up. Then we can all cheer for Detroit to pull it's head out of it's arse one more time this year so we can move up to #4.

With any luck, we'll have a new coach and GM who might know what to do with that pick.

Fingers crossed, ladies and gentlemen.

Posted by: Original_etrod | December 7, 2009 10:07 AM | Report abuse

"I wouldn't pretend Jason Campbell's anything but a decent to average NFL quarterback, but it's ridiculous for people to criticize his game yesterday."

Campbell's play has been trending upward since the second half of the Falcons' game.

A lot of bloggas just can't bring themselves to see that for whatever reason.

Looking forward, a young core of Campbell, Thomas, Davis, Mitchell, and Kelly is very attractive.

Unlike most folks, I'm not in the mood to 'start all over again' with a new coach, philosophy, and starting quarterback.

We do that every 3.5 years in redskinsland.

Let's just keep what we have and add to it.

Posted by: MistaMoe | December 7, 2009 10:08 AM | Report abuse

I thought Moore dropped the ball when he hit the ground, so no INT, no strip, no TD.

And why are our DB's falling for double moves with less than 2:00 left in the game and the lead? Do we even have a secondary coach? (Oh yeah, Jerry Grey - that guy should be our next HC! Ha ha ha ha ha )

The last three weeks, late in the fourth quarter 2-3 minutes left, the other team has been able to drive for TD's and FG's, yet we have not been able to drive for the winning FG without throwing an INT or three-and-out. Why is that?

Still waiting for that last possession of the game drive for the winning FG.

Sigh...

Posted by: edvar | December 7, 2009 10:09 AM | Report abuse

My thinking on the last play before Suisham's missed FG:

Hindsight is 20/20 obviously, so no doubt Suisham has to make the kick, and all this is a moot point. I just wish we had a killer instict. We had success in the red zone all day, with underneath stuff to Davis and Thomas open whenever we wanted it, so to play it safe there at 3-8 to me is awful. Go for it for the players' sake. They deserved the win -- leave no doubt. Also, I thought you could pass it there anyway, and here's my thinking: whoever calls in the play tells JC that if there is nothing there, don't throw it away, just scramble and fall down. We're on the 6 yard line anyway, even if he takes a 5-yard sack it's a 28 yard FG and the clock is still running. Now some might disagree with that -- just trying to think outside the box a little.

But I wish we would start going for it in those situations. It's contributed at least in part to us losing to Philly and NO...

Posted by: mattylight | December 7, 2009 10:10 AM | Report abuse

Funny thing about Landry--on his sack of Brees, his inability to make a proper tackle actually paid off for once. He hit Brees and (as usual) didn't wrap up, so Brees stumbled back about five yards before he went down. If LL could actually tackle, it would have been about a six yard loss rather than an 11-yard one.

Posted by: closer44 | December 7, 2009 10:11 AM | Report abuse

Why aren't Rogers/Landry making progress, or working harder...thats what I want to know....

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | December 7, 2009 10:03 AM |

Accountability and lack of competition.

Posted by: TWISI | December 7, 2009 10:11 AM | Report abuse

We wuz robbed in a way no one has mentioned here: holding penalties

Didn't it seem like B Orakpo was held on just about every passing play by the saints' left tackle?

Posted by: MistaMoe | December 7, 2009 10:12 AM | Report abuse

moe, I've come around to keeping JC, improve the line, and lets see what we can do...if next year is uncapped, then Samuels, Thomas, Portis all have to go, this is a passing league, no one plays ball control any longer, you have to pass to set up the run......you can have a top tier passing attack, NO for example, and two guys, Mike Bell/Pierre Thomas at rb who aren't close to the TOP backs in the NFL, but are still successful, because of the passing...

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | December 7, 2009 10:13 AM | Report abuse

"I have no problem with running the clock and kicking the field goal however...3rd and goal and they snapped it right before the 2 min warning. Throw it...if it's incomplete, the clock is stopped anyways."

Exactly. They snapped the ball with about 2:03 left on the clock. There is no way the 2-minute warning isn't hit, regardless of whether or not you throw an incompletion. I have no problem going conservative there and forcing the Saints to use timeouts, but that's a situation where you're gifted a passing play in an unexpected situation. And when you have an aerial attack as potent as the Redskins were yesterday, especially in the red zone, it's unfathomable how you don't at least give them an opportunity.

Posted by: psps23 | December 7, 2009 10:14 AM | Report abuse

"so to play it safe there at 3-8 to me is awful."

It's fine to play it safe--3 points may well have sealed the victory. Just don't play it safe in the exact same way you've (unsuccessfully) played it safe all year long.

Posted by: closer44 | December 7, 2009 10:16 AM | Report abuse

Was it just me, or did Orakpo get a lot less playing time yesterday? I saw a heck of a lot of HB Blades out there, and decent amount of Orakpo on the sideline.

Posted by: psps23 | December 7, 2009 10:17 AM | Report abuse

Devin Thomas haters - sorry that he might be good I know you are disappointed, same for Davis and Kelly

Jason Campbell haters - 15th in yds and rating, 6th in 1st down %, 7th comp %

Fred Davis haters - he has 3 more catches than Cooley

maybe if you haters just gave guys a legit chance we'd all be a little better

judgemental critical player haters - little danny snydrratos

Posted by: pabrian2003 | December 7, 2009 10:19 AM | Report abuse

I thought Blades was out there because Orakpo played a lot more DE than usual. Could be wrong though.

Posted by: closer44 | December 7, 2009 10:20 AM | Report abuse

Posted by: pabrian2003

Who is hating? No one is hating on the young guys and even the JC haters are coming around.

Of course, we'll probably dump JC, now that he's turned the corner.

Posted by: Rypien11 | December 7, 2009 10:21 AM | Report abuse

Moore was down, sellars was down

victory goes to the booth

Posted by: pabrian2003 | December 7, 2009 10:21 AM | Report abuse

Why are posts that clearly explain how the Sellers play was blatant cheating on the part of the refs being deleted? I still dont' see my last post? I can only conclude that Washingon Post is in on this conspiracy as well.

Posted by: bosshog7169 | December 7, 2009 10:21 AM | Report abuse

No, REXskins..to a direct line of communication.
However, I have seen the tv network feed monitor (ie. what you and I see at home) directly next to the booth review officials DVR and monitor that they use for their review.
Basically during Payton's timeout, the officials who decide if there should be a review (last 2 minutes of a half or OT) were watching what we were watching.. That is the Fox network commentators questioning the Sellers play over and over (reversing, forwarding the tape etc). And seconds before Paytons' timeout expired they decided to review the play. Genius move by Payton who obviously is also aware of outside influences on the booth review personnel. Wish he was the Skins HC.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
REXskins wrote:

@cliftonbiz:

How do the commentators effect the booth review in any way?

I was under the impression the refs didn't listen to the commentors. Are you suggesting they have a direct line of communication?

Posted by: cliftonbiz | December 7, 2009 10:23 AM | Report abuse

psp, agreed with closer44, I thought rak was getting HELD play, after play at DE...while Blades was playing in his LB spot....

Did Rogers even play yesterday??

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | December 7, 2009 10:24 AM | Report abuse

Trade bait:

LL
Montgomery
Rogers
Moss OR ARE
Portis
Smoot

Posted by: Rypien11 | December 7, 2009 10:24 AM | Report abuse

If i see one more person say the Jason Campbell shoudl stay i am goign to freak out. He hit VERY open recievers yesterday, but guess what they were ALL underthrown, Devin Thomas and Santana Moss both shoudl ahve had LONG TD throws but they were severely underthrown, i have RARELY seen Campbell hit a receiver in stride, our WR's always have to make an adjustments mid flight and as such lose there momentum. If Brees was on our side of the ball for Offense he would ahve thrown for 500 yards.

By the way Campbell also threw a pick at the worst possible time, you cant look past that. He was very gutsy and very mediocre yesterday, but that is all teh credit i can give him.

Posted by: skinball77 | December 7, 2009 10:26 AM | Report abuse

"so to play it safe there at 3-8 to me is awful."

It's fine to play it safe--3 points may well have sealed the victory. Just don't play it safe in the exact same way you've (unsuccessfully) played it safe all year long.

Posted by: closer44 | December 7, 2009 10:16 AM | Report abuse

playing it safe is keeping a kicker on your roster who makes you look like a fool for playing it smart. CUT #6.

That said, I'd have liked to roll out Campbell before the 2 min warning. Let him run or hit a receiver, throw it away if no ones wide open. Still, suisham is to blame.

Posted by: AdamCr | December 7, 2009 10:26 AM | Report abuse

ryp, every single person you listed is either hurt, or having a lousy year, thus lowering their trade value....and who is going to want that??

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | December 7, 2009 10:26 AM | Report abuse

This is the worst, most blatant fixing of a game I have ever seen. Yes it is ridiculous that Suisham missed and we probably would have lost either way, but was I the only one who heard the ref repeatedly blow the whistle like 50 times as soon as Sellers hit the ground. That means the play is dead and cant be overturned. Its a clear and simple rule. For some reason the announcers didn't even mention it which I thought was pretty fishy right away, and then they overturn it? Someone explain how this could happen. There are cameras out there, its not like we didn't see what happened. Someone explain how thats legal? I am so confused and I expected us to lose in OT but to see an NFL game be blatantly fixed like that is something I have never witnessed and makes me sad for this sport. Someone tell me I was hallucinating all 50 of those whistles to kill the play. Sellers didn't fumble and the play was not overturnable anyways. And how did the Saints get their timeout back? So many rules broken blatantly in one play. How does this happen?!

Posted by: bosshog7169 | December 6, 2009 8:16 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: bosshog7169 | December 7, 2009 10:27 AM | Report abuse

I agree a fumble is reviewable, however the problem with that paticular play was the fact that the whistle had blown. Watch the replay, Sellers goes down, the ball pops out, Sellers is lunging fighing for the ball as well as the Saints player, as soon as it pops out the side judge blows the whistle and rules Sellers down. Once that whistle was blown Sellers stops fighting for the ball because the whistle was blown. Now as NBC said last night "you have to play to the whistle" and that was a crap statement because the whistle blew well before the saints player actually picked up the ball. Once the whistle blows the play is dead and anything that happens after the whistle doesnt matter. In my opinion the skins need to point this out to the league office. Im saying that play is the reason the skins lost but the officials messed up that call and what really bothers me is the fact that none of the network announcers are talking about it. Im not saying it was a fixed game but I am saying it was a very bad call by the official.

Posted by: hudginsc | December 7, 2009 7:33 AM | Report abuse

Exactly. Its refereeing 101. Plays like this happen about once every week and are always ruled unreviewable if the whistle has already been blown because you aren't supposed to keep fighting for the ball when the ref is repeatedly blowing the whistle and waving his arms. I cant believe more people aren't outraged at this obvious fix. I said the same thing during that Pheonix Suns playoff game years ago and nobody believed it then either. But it turns out years later that was a fix as well, as admitted by the ref in that game. I'm sure in a few years this ref will write a similar book explaining how the NFL stood to profit a lot more by the Saints winning this game so he blew the call on purpose because nobody could be that blind and ignorant to the rules. This one was even more blatant that that Suns game and should be getting a lot more news coverage. It honestly is the worst call I've ever seen.

Posted by: bosshog7169 | December 7, 2009 10:29 AM | Report abuse

Skinball77, do you also give Brees no credit for hitting VERY open receivers?

Posted by: AdamCr | December 7, 2009 10:30 AM | Report abuse

Bean - if we can't get anything out of them, then cut them.

We seem to be playing better with young, unproven guys in there. We don't need the old fat weighing us down.

Bosshog - the rule has been changed since the Hochuli game, although I don't think the Saints "clearly" recovered, as that was after about 5 seconds and 10 whistle blows.

Posted by: Rypien11 | December 7, 2009 10:30 AM | Report abuse

By the way Campbell also threw a pick at the worst possible time, you cant look past that. He was very gutsy and very mediocre yesterday, but that is all teh credit i can give him.

Posted by: skinball77 | December 7, 2009 10:26 AM | Report abuse

367 yards passing 3 TD's 1 INT is "very mediocre" ...? I'm with you on the pick, it was a bad throw, but get out of here with that. He's been mediocre in many games this year, but yesterday wasn't one of them...

Posted by: mattylight | December 7, 2009 10:30 AM | Report abuse

I dont understand why people are ripping Zorn. Yes they ran the ever so predictable stretch play, but if they run a pass and JC fumbles or threw a pick, you would be ripping him for that. He went by the books and it should have been enough for the win. The coaches cant play for the guys on the field. That being said I am glad that Blache is going to retire at the end of the season. Our defense gets way to much credit to never stop anybody when it counts.

Posted by: KingJoffeJoffer | December 7, 2009 10:32 AM | Report abuse

I have said for a while dirty30 has not been a successful Free Safety. The problem for the skins is that they have 3 Strong Safetys on the roster. We need to trade 1 of them and get a stop gap Free Safety from Free Agency.

My gut says you get the best value for Horton or Doughty, not LaRon.

Posted by: alex35332 | December 7, 2009 10:32 AM | Report abuse

hey closer44.. you must of been in the restroom when Campbell threw the INT directly to Vilma the last minute of the game.

Campbell is a serviceable QB when the game isnt close.. But, when the game is tight, he panics and forgets his mechanics and "one reads" to the primary receivers until he gets picked off. Just look at the close games this year (most recently the last two).. Its more than a trend and the opposing team D Coordinators know this. DBs sit back and watch and wait when JC starts to panic and lock in. Asante Samuel's two picks in the philly game is a classic example (including Vilma and the Dallas DBs).

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++


I wouldn't pretend Jason Campbell's anything but a decent to average NFL quarterback, but it's ridiculous for people to criticize his game yesterday. For those who say he didn't come through in the clutch, who drove the Skins down for the game-clinching field goal with two minutes left? It's not Campbell's fault we have a kicker who should be cut from most high school teams. After all, the Redskins will be the Redskins.

It's also not Campbell's fault if his coach takes the ball out of his hands inside the red zone. The wide-right drive might have been a game-clinching TD drive if Zorn wasn't so chicken----. I mean, that off-tackle stretch play hasn't worked inside the 5 all year, yet it's still their go-to play for some reason.

Posted by: closer44 | December 7, 2009 10:01 AM

Posted by: cliftonbiz | December 7, 2009 10:33 AM | Report abuse

skinball77, Campbell's a decent QB who had a good game. I don't think Brees is available.

Posted by: closer44 | December 7, 2009 10:33 AM | Report abuse

bean

"...I've come around to keeping JC, improve the line, and let's see what we can do...this is a passing league, no one plays ball control any longer, you have to pass to set up the run..."

I agree.

You also have to have stability and patience.

Changing coaches every 3.5 years doesn't bring that.

Let's keep what we have and add to where we know weaknesses exist.

Adding a scoring offense to a strong defense is the best way to fix the ten year broken thing know as the redskins.

Posted by: MistaMoe | December 7, 2009 10:33 AM | Report abuse

ryp, you can't just cut some of these guys:

LL
Montgomery
Rogers
Moss OR ARE
Portis
Smoot

Rogers, ARE, Smoot, and Portis can go after the season, but keep Moss/Monty and LL....

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | December 7, 2009 10:33 AM | Report abuse

Landry and ARE need to learn what integrity is. You make a play - act like you have done it before. Its your damn job. I don't get up and dance every time I send an inner-office email. Grow up guys - we dont want that crap in DC. Go to B-more for that crap.

Posted by: gregstrang | December 7, 2009 10:34 AM | Report abuse

I understand the fustration.... trust me, I do. Yes, LL got beat by double moves...yes, Suisham missed the fg....yes, JC threw the interception.

Lets talk about the bigger problems.
1. Blatche allows this LL to play FS
2. Vinny never addressed FS or OL and other positions in the off season
3. Vinny brought back Suisham
4. JZ doesn't play to win...he plays not to lose. (It is proven that this team can't win this way)
5. JC is not an accurate QB
6. JZ or Danny Smith allows Randel El to return punts...STILL with no production
7. JZ won't put Marko and Devin/Malcom at the ends and put Santana in the slot (Redzone mistake)


Any other suggestions........

Posted by: liasdavis | December 7, 2009 10:35 AM | Report abuse

Bean - Moss is fine to keep if we cut ARE. We don't need both with the 3 young guys stepping up and Cooley back.

Monty is rotting on bench, unhappy, and hes young. Someone will want him.

LL? Useless. He's made ONE good play in his career here (pick at Seattle). And we lost that game.

Posted by: Rypien11 | December 7, 2009 10:38 AM | Report abuse

Landry and ARE need to learn what integrity is. You make a play - act like you have done it before. Its your damn job. I don't get up and dance every time I send an inner-office email. Grow up guys - we dont want that crap in DC. Go to B-more for that crap.

Posted by: gregstrang | December 7, 2009 10:34 AM | Report abuse

I love this comment. I swear Landry started dancing after he pushed some guy out of bounds after a fifteen yard gain for a first down. I want to like him but he makes it impossible. I also just want to reiterate that despite the Hochuli rule, the Sellers play was obviously not able to be overturned. I think the refs should be thrown in jail for handing the Saints what had been an extremeyl exciting game up to that point.

Posted by: bosshog7169 | December 7, 2009 10:41 AM | Report abuse

Nope I saw it. It was a bad pass at a bad time. Perhaps you were in the bathroom a few minutes earlier when he led a clutch should-a-been-game-sealing drive. I'm not saying he's a great QB, just that he played a good game I'll give him his due. If a Redskins receiver had ripped the ball out of Vilma's hands and run it for a TD, would Campbell be off the hook?

hey closer44.. you must of been in the restroom when Campbell threw the INT directly to Vilma the last minute of the game.

Campbell is a serviceable QB when the game isnt close.. But, when the game is tight, he panics and forgets his mechanics and "one reads" to the primary receivers until he gets picked off. Just look at the close games this year (most recently the last two).. Its more than a trend and the opposing team D Coordinators know this. DBs sit back and watch and wait when JC starts to panic and lock in. Asante Samuel's two picks in the philly game is a classic example (including Vilma and the Dallas DBs).

Posted by: closer44 | December 7, 2009 10:41 AM | Report abuse

beeps

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | December 7, 2009 10:43 AM | Report abuse

(self-post)

"Let's keep what we have and add to where we know weaknesses exist."

What weaknesses you say?

Need(s): right tackle, a real free safety, a multiple use speed back or a power back with some speed.

If you trade away the '11 first pick, you can satisfy those needs in rounds 1-2 next April and get quality.

That's three picks in the first two rounds or a third rounder and an additional late rounder.

Not doing this would expose another redskin weaknesses: a lack of FO creativity.

Posted by: MistaMoe | December 7, 2009 10:45 AM | Report abuse

gregstrang,

Integrity...really? I agree that Landry's celebration after a tackle that sets up a 3rd and 4 can be annoying. You should also remember that football is a game of emotion. I have no problem with Santana's or ARE's first down celebrations. I do wish Landry would tone it down some,especially when he celebrates when we are losing.

Posted by: KingJoffeJoffer | December 7, 2009 10:46 AM | Report abuse

bosshog, flat out, you are wrong. It's a reviewable play -- specifically made that way due to the incorrect play call Ed Hochuli made on Jay Cutler last season (when Hochuli ruled that Cutler threw an incompletion instead of a fumble, which ended up losing the game for San Diego). When the whistle blows, the play is dead in that the ball may not be advanced, but if a clear recovery is made then the play is reversable.

Whether or not Sellers actually fumbled is a different argument...

Posted by: psps23 | December 7, 2009 10:47 AM | Report abuse

I have said for a while dirty30 has not been a successful Free Safety. The problem for the skins is that they have 3 Strong Safetys on the roster. We need to trade 1 of them and get a stop gap Free Safety from Free Agency.

My gut says you get the best value for Horton or Doughty, not LaRon.

Posted by: alex35332 | December 7, 2009 10:32 AM


I promise you a first day draft pick comes your way for Landry. Some team out there will think he's got too much upside to pass on. I'd bet the Raiders and Texans would happily give up at least a 3rd rounder for him.

But you're right on the strong safety point...this team needs a guy who can play the free spot so that LL can go to his natural strong spot. One guy who'd be a perfect FA signing this offseason?

Ryan Clark.

Posted by: brownwood26 | December 7, 2009 10:48 AM | Report abuse

granted closer44.. he did get us to the missed FG.
Here is a question.
If you had to score a TD in 2 minutes and move the team 80 yrds to win the game and you were given the opporunity to select any starting QB from 16 of the 32 NFL teams, would Jason Campbell be one of them?

+++++++++++++++
closer wrote:


Nope I saw it. It was a bad pass at a bad time. Perhaps you were in the bathroom a few minutes earlier when he led a clutch should-a-been-game-sealing drive. I'm not saying he's a great QB, just that he played a good game I'll give him his due. If a Redskins receiver had ripped the ball out of Vilma's hands and run it for a TD, would Campbell be off the hook?

hey closer44.. you must of been in the restroom when Campbell threw the INT directly to Vilma the last minute of the game.

Campbell is a serviceable QB when the game isnt close.. But, when the game is tight, he panics and forgets his mechanics and "one reads" to the primary receivers until he gets picked off. Just look at the close games this year (most recently the last two).. Its more than a trend and the opposing team D Coordinators know this. DBs sit back and watch and wait when JC starts to panic and lock in. Asante Samuel's two picks in the philly game is a classic example (including Vilma and the Dallas DBs).

Posted by: closer44 | December 7, 2009 10:41 AM

Posted by: cliftonbiz | December 7, 2009 10:49 AM | Report abuse

Oh my - I highly recommend someone invest in some Topricin pain cream for pete's sake!

Posted by: smilinggreenmom | December 7, 2009 10:51 AM | Report abuse

We wuz robbed in a way no one has mentioned here: holding penalties

Didn't it seem like B Orakpo was held on just about every passing play by the saints' left tackle?

Posted by: MistaMoe | December 7, 2009 10:12 AM | Report abuse

Yes, Yes, and Yes! I was calling for it all day.

Posted by: Devo2 | December 7, 2009 11:41 AM | Report abuse

Alstot a great fullback..you are dreaming alstot was a horrible blocker he was fullback size but not a fullback zorn could block as well as he could. brees is NOT better than campbell he is in a system that fits him a short white qb average arm avg athlete nice release on a franchise that is on the way up, campbell on the other hand was picked to be a deep passer with down hill running game using alot of max protection all of that changed when cirRATO and snyder hired jim pumpkin puss zorn these idiots have no clue about nfc east(mostly cold weather football)run the ball, let defense bring up safety's to stop it and hit them over the top. this dynamic duo of cerrato and snyder don't have the common sense to draft young o-lineman and probably will not do it in the next draft these moronic dweeb's will draft a field goal kicker in the first round and release him after training camp.

Posted by: wathu19 | December 7, 2009 1:05 PM | Report abuse

Boy 5 years ago if you had tried to write out a list of crazy impossible ways to lose football games you could not come up with what we have had to suffer through. double time outs. missed field goals. wierd fumbles. Big leads. You just couldn't come up with this crap. You put that field goal and that strip together and it's 10 points we literally just gave away. Wonder what it'll be next week or the week after. Every time I think I've seen it all, we come up with something new.

Posted by: Pennsylhoya | December 7, 2009 6:15 PM | Report abuse

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