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Smoot Shoots for Home Opener

From Jason Reid

Cornerback Fred Smoot is ready to face the New Orleans Saints. Well, almost.

Smoot injured his hip in Thursday's 16-7 loss to the New York Giants at Giants Stadium, but he expects to play Sept. 14 in Washington's home opener against the New Orleans Saints, he said today.

"I took a knee to the hip" in the game, Smoot said. "They [Washington's trainers] say nothing [is] out of place, nothing fractured. What is it? From a bruised hip bone to maybe a hip pointer or whatever they want to call it. I think I should be good."

The extra time off between games should help, Smoot said.

"Get rest and stay off of it," he said. "That's basically all you can do."

In the first half against the Giants, Smoot struggled against wide receiver Plaxico Burress, who had seven receptions for 98 yards at halftime. But the Redskins made adjustments and shut out the Giants in the second half. Washington limited Burress to only three more catches for 35 yards.

Redskins secondary coach Jerry Gray told Smoot and cornerback Carlos Rogers to switch to press-man coverage in the second half and "make them beat us deep," said Smoot, who in the third quarter intercepted a pass by Giants quarterback Eli Manning. "From about the end of the second quarter 'til like the end of the game, basically, they didn't get any more deep passes. I guess that was the thing to do."

The Giants scored on their first four possessions in taking to a 16-0 lead, but produced only 113 yards in the final two quarters. Defensive coordinator Greg Blache "did a great job," Smoot said. "Especially when we came in at halftime, he knew everything we needed to do and corrected everything."

By Cindy Boren  |  September 5, 2008; 5:22 PM ET
 
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Next: Redskins Take a Break Today

Comments

even with Smoot, they can't cover

Posted by: sickcuz | September 5, 2008 5:32 PM | Report abuse

One day while closely observing Doughty in a meeting, Jackson noticed Doughty was watching his mouth move as if he were lip-reading. Jackson figured Doughty must have had trouble hearing, and a hearing test revealed Doughty had moderate to severe hearing loss. The Redskins made adjustments to help Doughty, and he has become a key contributor on defense and special teams.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 5, 2008 5:33 PM | Report abuse

Someone please ask Blache why there were so few line games and stunts.

Posted by: Corkczar | September 5, 2008 5:38 PM | Report abuse

Right now, even as we speak, network execs are huddled around, wondering if it would be "too tasteless" or a good ratings move to send Hannah Storm to cover Storm Hannah.

Posted by: Corkczar | September 5, 2008 5:39 PM | Report abuse

How can Snyder be financially successful when he fails miserably at basically every other facet of life? We're stuck with him for like the next 40-50 years.

Posted by: Carl Williams | September 5, 2008 5:08 PM

You can criticize him as an owner, but you can't back up your hateful "fails miserably at every other aspect...." The guy has come up big in a lot of other aspects, particularly in times of tragedy -- Sean Taylor's murder, Joe Buge's daughter's death, Marty Schottenheimer's family's cancer. No one except you has ever said a bad word about this.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 5, 2008 5:41 PM | Report abuse

Outside of the terrible first quarter, the defense bent but did not break. I don't think we have to worry about the defense this year.

As for the offense.....

Posted by: charlie | September 5, 2008 5:41 PM | Report abuse

Outside of the terrible first quarter, the defense bent but did not break.

Posted by: charlie | September 5, 2008 5:41 PM

I agree and once we get Tryon out on the field, the defense won't even bend.

Posted by: talent evaluator | September 5, 2008 5:46 PM | Report abuse

Someone please ask Blache why there were so few line games and stunts.

Posted by: Corkczar | September 5, 2008 5:38 PM

Charles Mann asked him and he said we run a basic defense

Posted by: sickcuz | September 5, 2008 5:50 PM | Report abuse

Late afternoon ESPN talk-shows are blistering the Redskins.

I have never heard the media launch like this...

Brutal.

Posted by: GAD | September 5, 2008 5:55 PM | Report abuse

Doughty's hearing problems is OLD news....where have you been, Anon????

Posted by: Lisa | September 5, 2008 5:56 PM | Report abuse

Back at it huh TE?

Posted by: scampbell1975 | September 5, 2008 6:05 PM | Report abuse

how long do you think before the skins win their first game this year?

Posted by: sickcuz | September 5, 2008 6:05 PM | Report abuse

Back at it huh TE?

Posted by: scampbell1975 | September 5, 2008 6:05 PM | Report abuse

Week 3

Posted by: scampbell1975 | September 5, 2008 6:06 PM | Report abuse

I doubt it will be against the Cardinals, they're a borderline good team

Posted by: sickcuz | September 5, 2008 6:09 PM | Report abuse

I think the defense will improve faster than the offense.Partially, because they don't have as far to go and also it looks like Blache showed some decent halftime adjustment skills last night. Who does Zorn have to help him with adjustments during games? I read earlier today that he seemed isolated a lot last night. What roles do Smith and the other offensive coaches have during the game?

Posted by: will_ga | September 5, 2008 6:10 PM | Report abuse

I don't think it matters if Smoot or Springs plays! Bottom line is, with that offense, 10 points beats us every week!!!

Posted by: redryan400 | September 5, 2008 6:11 PM | Report abuse

I think the defense will improve faster than the offense.Partially, because they don't have as far to go and also it looks like Blache showed some decent halftime adjustment skills last night. Who does Zorn have to help him with adjustments during games? I read earlier today that he seemed isolated a lot last night. What roles do Smith and the other offensive coaches have during the game?

Posted by: will_ga | September 5, 2008 6:10 PM

Their role is watch Zorn and listen as Portis tells them what plays could work

Posted by: sickcuz | September 5, 2008 6:12 PM | Report abuse

Charles Mann said last night in the Post Game show that when he played under Gibbs they had goals every week
(1) Score at least 21 points
(2) Hold the other team to 17 (preferably under)
(3) 2 INTS (I think)

I wish I could see this team scoring 21 points but I was actually thrilled they scored 7 last night.

Posted by: Lisa | September 5, 2008 6:15 PM | Report abuse

JC lacks confidence. He's tight. He wants to be successful but he has not shown any grit or willingness to takes risks.

Second, this receiver corps is below average. I don't think any of them should be entrenched as starters. When you have a young QB struggling with confidence, you can't drop balls.

Next week against NO is critical. Getting a win is a must but it's how we win that will tell the story. I guaruntee JC will play better if he puts a couple of good drives together

Posted by: sicwidit | September 5, 2008 6:23 PM | Report abuse

Boo-freaking-hoo. For as much as he has been generous during the tragedies with 21 and Joe's grandson and Buges's daughter, there's also as much evidence that he deals horribly with people. If you're in the family, you're golden. If you're not, well, you're effed.

Posted by: Carl Williams | September 5, 2008 6:28 PM | Report abuse

Next week against NO is critical. Getting a win is a must but it's how we win that will tell the story. I guaruntee JC will play better if he puts a couple of good drives together

Posted by: sicwidit | September 5, 2008 6:23 PM

If JC puts a couple of good drives together, it'll be a couple more than they put together in this game.

Posted by: AL Zeke etc | September 5, 2008 6:32 PM | Report abuse

Zorn thought it was a ONE-SCORE GAME!!! The old boss didn't know the rules, the new boss doesn't know simple math!

Posted by: Scoop Jackson | September 5, 2008 6:36 PM | Report abuse

I don't like Sean Springs....that bit*h could have played last night. Sore calf...whateva!

Posted by: sicwidit | September 5, 2008 6:38 PM | Report abuse

I wish I could see this team scoring 21 points but I was actually thrilled they scored 7 last night.

Posted by: Lisa | September 5, 2008 6:15 PM

Agreed. I actually said "oh thank god! We scored." Just a big feeling of relief.

Posted by: will_ga | September 5, 2008 6:44 PM | Report abuse

Welcome to Spurrier Redux

Posted by: Anonymous | September 5, 2008 6:51 PM | Report abuse

Boo-freaking-hoo. For as much as he has been generous during the tragedies with 21 and Joe's grandson and Buges's daughter, there's also as much evidence that he deals horribly with people. If you're in the family, you're golden. If you're not, well, you're effed.

Posted by: Carl Williams | September 5, 2008 6:28 PM

I see you're at it again Carl. You sound like your one step away from slitting your wrists. Did the FO foreclose on your home or get you fired from your job or something? If your gonna keep b!tching, fine a new target. We get it, you hate the front office. It's getting tired and played out.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | September 5, 2008 6:53 PM | Report abuse

I wish I could see this team scoring 21 points but I was actually thrilled they scored 7 last night.

Posted by: Lisa | September 5, 2008 6:15 PM

Me too.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | September 5, 2008 6:55 PM | Report abuse


"Welcome to Spurrier Redux"

Posted by: Anonymous | September 5, 2008 6:51 PM

Spurrier had a reputation for not putting the effort into his job that was required. I haven't heard anyone say that about Zorn yet.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 5, 2008 6:55 PM | Report abuse

I doubt it will be against the Cardinals, they're a borderline good team

Posted by: sickcuz | September 5, 2008 6:09 PM

I don't buy it. They play at being a borderline good team but always end up sucking a$$ in the end.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | September 5, 2008 6:57 PM | Report abuse

"Spurrier had a reputation for not putting the effort into his job that was required. I haven't heard anyone say that about Zorn yet."

Meant to add "... and I don't think we will."

Posted by: will_ga | September 5, 2008 6:57 PM | Report abuse

FYI -- Tryon (#20) was on the field in the dime packages; although he didn't register a tackle...

I don't understand why fans blame the owner and GM when the team failed to execute on offense... bottom line is this was a winnable game. The defense and special teams played well enough to win. The loss is squarely on the offensive coaches and players -- more on the latter (QB/WR/TE) if you ask me.

The offensive line played decent -- only 1 sack and 84 yds rushing. With the exception of the end of the game -- the play calling balance wasn't bad -- 51 offensive plays -- 27 passes (with 15 completions) and 24 rushes. The problem is there were not enough 3rd down completions to sustain drives. Anyone think the poor performance is due the the QB, WRs, TEs, or perhaps even the Giants defense?

PS. -- If you don't like the owner, then put your money where your mouth is and make him an offer... 1 billion might be enough.

Posted by: Siris | September 5, 2008 6:58 PM | Report abuse

I said before the game that our intensity would be huge. Because this was an intense team in 2007, for obvious reasons. And it led to several wins.

Bad enough the team lacked fire most of the game. But in that possession at the 6 minute mark, someone had to step up the urgency. I don't get that at all.

It would be interesting to know if Zorn thought this was a 1 score game. I doubt we will ever know -- if he did make that error, he will lose the team's confidence almost instantly.

Posted by: AL Zeke etc | September 5, 2008 6:59 PM | Report abuse

No, the owner and "front office" have only destroyed the franchise I want most to succeed and return to glory. But, hey, if you're OK with them, I won't rain on your parade!

See, that's the new Carl coming thru!

Posted by: Carl Williams | September 5, 2008 7:03 PM | Report abuse

More likely -- Zorn thought the game was not winnable and continued playing for additional offensive snaps/experience... Maybe we'll get more insight in today's presser.

Posted by: Siris | September 5, 2008 7:04 PM | Report abuse

Brian Mitchell for HC...or at least halftime hype man.

Posted by: Anon Sequitur | September 5, 2008 7:05 PM | Report abuse

You play to win the game.

Posted by: Herm Edwards | September 5, 2008 7:05 PM | Report abuse

No, the owner and "front office" have only destroyed the franchise I want most to succeed and return to glory. But, hey, if you're OK with them, I won't rain on your parade!

See, that's the new Carl coming thru!

Posted by: Carl Williams | September 5, 2008 7:03 PM

See the new Carl, same as the old Carl.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | September 5, 2008 7:08 PM | Report abuse

No, the owner and "front office" have only destroyed the franchise I want most to succeed and return to glory. But, hey, if you're OK with them, I won't rain on your parade!

See, that's the new Carl coming thru!

Posted by: Carl Williams | September 5, 2008 7:03 PM

I've not often had nice things to say about the dynamic duo but I got tired of b!tching about it to no avail long ago.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | September 5, 2008 7:10 PM | Report abuse

I've missed something here.....does someone actually think zorn thought we were down by one score?

Posted by: will_ga | September 5, 2008 7:11 PM | Report abuse

It's not Dan Synder the owner thats the problem, it's Dan Synder and Vinney Cerroto the GM's that the problem.

I think Jason Taylor is going to to be a bust. We should have used those picks for a cornerback. We could have got Lito Shepperd for a 2nd.

Posted by: Mike | September 5, 2008 7:15 PM | Report abuse

The Z Man told Sonny he didn't want to leave the Giants too much time on the clock at the end!

Put that together with the nonchalant drive down the field at the end and you got yourself a big fat WTF moment.

Posted by: Sccop Jackson | September 5, 2008 7:16 PM | Report abuse

Andy Polly had a GREAT IDEA and I don't mind advancing it:

Sonny killed JZ when interviewing him after the game about clock management and Zorn said there was plenty of time (8 mins he said) and JZ said they can get big chunks if need be. JZ also said if the Skins scored, they didn't want to give the giants TOO MUCH TIME ON THE CLOCK.

Andy said he thinks that maybe Zorn thought he was down by only 8 instead of 9, which wouuld only require a one posseision to tie.

That is how they were playing and I am kind of believing it by the way JZ was acting. You can look on redskins.com and see this interview for yourself.

We need an Ass't HC who knows how to/when to call TOs and understand clock Management. Also, when to go for 2. Maybe even when to pass past the 1st down marker.

Thoughts?

Posted by: 4th | September 5, 2008 5:18 PM

Posted by: AL Zeke etc | September 5, 2008 7:17 PM | Report abuse

JC doesn't look comfortable and often looks lost out there.. I know, I know, the 5th offensive sysytem in 5 years etc.. blah, blah, blah.
I, like most professionals have to contantly learn new systems, and trends, and products to comptete. For crying out loud, it's his job! It all comes across as another excuse for a subpar QB.
The rabid base of fans has to take off their rose colored lenses and see what is going on.
Mediocre at best QB, 1 good, not great receiver= Moss. CP is good, not great anymore. average D-line, below average O-line, and yet the braintrust drafts three players that can barely get on the field, and can't even overtake a career back-up, Thrash.

Here's another long season, but if you keep going, the Danny will keep getting richer!
It's hard being a skins fan especially since I'm old enough to remember them actually winning.

Posted by: longsufferingskinsfan | September 5, 2008 7:19 PM | Report abuse

Jason Taylor got shoved around like he was wearing roller skates during pre-season and regular season. The Tuna is probably laughing at Snyderatto.

Posted by: WhinersRUs | September 5, 2008 7:19 PM | Report abuse

I'd give the GM at least a 3-5 year time frame to see how the roster moves, scouting, and drafts pan out. However, you're stuck with the owner, unless you can afford to buy the team.

Why do so many people hate Snyder? He negotiates contracts with agents and pays players selected by the GM/Scouting/Coaches. He doesn't play QB or WR...

Posted by: Siris | September 5, 2008 7:21 PM | Report abuse

I think Jason Taylor is going to to be a bust. We should have used those picks for a cornerback. We could have got Lito Shepperd for a 2nd.

Posted by: Mike | September 5, 2008 7:15 PM

Right, because Lito Sheppard would rush the passer and stop the run...

Let me say it terms folks will understand:

THIS WAS ONLY ONE GAME!!!!!

On the road, against a division opponent (who just happened to win the f-ing Super Bowl), in prime-time (where the Skins tend to play worse). Let's get to Week 4 before we start making any sweeping proclamations for the team.

Posted by: brownwood26 | September 5, 2008 7:23 PM | Report abuse

fwiw -- if anyone finds a link to that interview cited above, please post it here.

Posted by: AL Zeke etc | September 5, 2008 7:24 PM | Report abuse

Write it down - this is the high water-mark for the season.

Enjoy the ride...

Posted by: GAD | September 5, 2008 7:26 PM | Report abuse

Unless he said it in another interview, Zorn didn't say anything to Sonny in the locker room about leaving the Giants too much time on the clock at the end.

Posted by: Carl Williams | September 5, 2008 7:26 PM | Report abuse

Prediction

Snyder is highly impatient. Gibbs legacy buried that impulse, but it will re-emerge soon.

If the wheels come off, he will pull Zorn this year - midseason if necessary.

Posted by: GAD | September 5, 2008 7:29 PM | Report abuse

The Skins are cursed, Khary Campbell gets injured during the coin toss, WTF.

Posted by: WhinersRUs | September 5, 2008 7:29 PM | Report abuse

If the season becomes a loss, let Colt Brennan get some experience back there.

Posted by: Whambulance | September 5, 2008 7:33 PM | Report abuse

I, like most professionals have to contantly learn new systems, and trends, and products to comptete. For crying out loud, it's his job! It all comes across as another excuse for a subpar QB.

Posted by: longsufferingskinsfan | September 5, 2008 7:19 PM

Please, don't make the mistake of comparing your job to pro football. When you learn your "new systems, and trends, and products to comptete", do you have a 300 pound lineman trying to stop you from implementing your "new systems, and trends, and products"? Is the competition devising schemes to conceal what's really going on in the market?

Say what you want about Campbell, folks. He's your QB. Period. For this year and next. Get used to it. Colt can't play yet and Collins without Saunders is like Superman with a kryptonite necklace.

Heaven help us if JC actually turned the ball over last night...

Posted by: Anonymous | September 5, 2008 7:33 PM | Report abuse

It time to say it folks...

JC is not the QB for this team...

The first play of the game summed up all we need to know about JC. I have been a Campbell cheerleader for two years, but I challenge anyone to name 3 starting veteran QB's right now that JC is better than????

He may come around, but he doesn't look like any other NFL QB. He looks confused, unsure, and unconfident.

Colt Brennan may be young and unorthadox but the kids throws the damn ball!

Posted by: sicwidit | September 5, 2008 7:34 PM | Report abuse

Gotta go to redskins.com and look at the intervies. It was todays press conference where he talked about the end of the game stuff.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | September 5, 2008 7:35 PM | Report abuse

Snyder is highly impatient. Gibbs legacy buried that impulse, but it will re-emerge soon.

If the wheels come off, he will pull Zorn this year - midseason if necessary.

Posted by: GAD

I hope you're wrong. Zorn is inexperienced, but i think he will do fine given enough time and support. The WCO is what Philly runs, and it has been effective with the right personnel. The problem starts with JC, and then who to throw too? Moss is good, but remember last years playoff game? The took him out of the game and made the skins try to beat them with ARE and the old guy. It's a shame a career back-up, Thrash beats out two draft picks at WR. He can't get any separation from any DB in the league.
The O-line could be better, but JC is the problem more than the line.


Posted by: longsufferingskinsfan | September 5, 2008 7:35 PM | Report abuse

That was me at 7:33

Posted by: brownwood26 | September 5, 2008 7:36 PM | Report abuse

Zorn tells Sonny he needed two scores

lockerroom 9-4
http://www.redskins.com/do/videoGallery

JZ also said if the Skins scored, they didn't want to give the giants TOO MUCH TIME ON THE CLOCK."

I didn't see that anywhere.

Posted by: AL Zeke etc | September 5, 2008 7:36 PM | Report abuse

Please, don't make the mistake of comparing your job to pro football. When you learn your "new systems, and trends, and products to comptete", do you have a 300 pound lineman trying to stop you from implementing your "new systems, and trends, and products"? Is the competition devising schemes to conceal what's really going on in the market?

Say what you want about Campbell, folks. He's your QB. Period. For this year and next. Get used to it. Colt can't play yet and Collins without Saunders is like Superman with a kryptonite necklace.

Heaven help us if JC actually turned the ball over last night...

Posted by: Anonymous


I do have fortune 500 companies constantly trying to take away my market share and yes they also are slick enough to try to be stealthy about it. I am not facing 300lb linesmen, but the analogy still holds that it is his profession. If JC can't learn new tricks he will go the way of countless young men that have tried to make it at this level, only to fail even after having sometimes brilliant colleg careers. Or the Skins get smart and trade him to a team out of the division that may need a non-WCO QB.

Posted by: longsufferingskinsfan | September 5, 2008 7:42 PM | Report abuse

He said he wanted to save his TOs at the end of the games so that, if the Skins scored, he would be able to stop the Giants from running out the clock and force them to punt.

Posted by: Carl Williams | September 5, 2008 7:44 PM | Report abuse

I challenge anyone to name 3 starting veteran QB's right now that JC is better than????

Posted by: sicwidit | September 5, 2008 7:34 PM

Kyle Orton, J.T. O'Sullivan, and Tavares Jackson. Anything else I can help you with?

Posted by: brownwood26 | September 5, 2008 7:49 PM | Report abuse

no way Snyder fires Zorn midyear

Posted by: sicwidit | September 5, 2008 7:52 PM | Report abuse

Zorn also said the pass plays [at the end of the game] were designed to go out of bounds, but the players didn't execute them properly. And that [in hind-sight] he wished he had run a no-huddle instead of wasting valuable minutes at the end of the game.

So he was playing to win, but the Giants defense played good prevent and the Skins offense did execute effectively...

Posted by: Siris | September 5, 2008 7:54 PM | Report abuse

longsufferingskinsfan,

Agreed.

Zorn is off to very rough start. He spent his honeymooon 'cash' and now he has zero goodwill left in the bank.

This town looked the other way for years while Gibbs bumbled thru several seasons, and now I have the distinct feeling that there will be hell to pay if things do not go well real soon.

I have sensed ill-will re: Gibbs as he mindlessly coached the last few years.

This time it is different. I feel that there is blood in the water. Fans want some scalps this time.

New Orleans has a high octane offense. The Skins better roll out a truly new version next weekend or its going to get ugly in a hurry.

Posted by: GAD | September 5, 2008 7:54 PM | Report abuse

I do have fortune 500 companies constantly trying to take away my market share and yes they also are slick enough to try to be stealthy about it. I am not facing 300lb linesmen, but the analogy still holds that it is his profession. If JC can't learn new tricks he will go the way of countless young men that have tried to make it at this level, only to fail even after having sometimes brilliant colleg careers. Or the Skins get smart and trade him to a team out of the division that may need a non-WCO QB.

Posted by: longsufferingskinsfan | September 5, 2008 7:42 PM

Dude, do you watch football? What do all the elite QBs have in common?

THEY PLAY IN THE SAME SYSTEM THEIR ENTIRE CAREERS!!!!

JC was screwed the minute the Redskins handed in that draft card with his name on it. The ONLY way this kid has a chance to succeed is if he's allowed to play in a place where there's stability. Period. He's got the tools to play in this league, but if you're going to change offenses on him every 2 years, he'll fail. Just Peyton Manning would, just like Tom Brady would and just like Big Ben would.

There's no way to actually verify this, but I'd be willing to bet that if JC played in New England or Indy or Pittsburgh he'd be a pretty damn good QB. You know why? They've played the same damn offense for several years. When you have to know where 10 guys are supposed to be, when they're supposed to be there, and know that for an upwards of 200+ different plays, it helps to run the same offense with the same personel and the same coaches year in and year out. Until JC gets that chance, I don't fault him for a damn thing.

Posted by: brownwood26 | September 5, 2008 7:56 PM | Report abuse

C'mon Brown....

What evidence to you have to support those three?

Posted by: sicwidit | September 5, 2008 7:57 PM | Report abuse

Please, don't make the mistake of comparing your job to pro football. When you learn your "new systems, and trends, and products to comptete", do you have a 300 pound lineman trying to stop you from implementing your "new systems, and trends, and products"? Is the competition devising schemes to conceal what's really going on in the market?

Posted by: Anonymous | September 5, 2008 7:33 PM


You've obviously never heard of Terry Tate, office linebacker.

Oh, wait. You said lineman.

Sorry.

Posted by: freakzilla | September 5, 2008 8:18 PM | Report abuse

Please, don't make the mistake of comparing your job to pro football. When you learn your "new systems, and trends, and products to comptete", do you have a 300 pound lineman trying to stop you from implementing your "new systems, and trends, and products"? Is the competition devising schemes to conceal what's really going on in the market?

Posted by: Anonymous | September 5, 2008 7:33 PM


You've obviously never heard of Terry Tate, office linebacker.

Oh, wait. You said lineman.

Sorry.

Posted by: freakzilla | September 5, 2008 8:19 PM | Report abuse

Oh, NOW it posts it.

Twice


Bah.


Here's some Terry Tate for your Friday evening.

Posted by: freakzilla | September 5, 2008 8:22 PM | Report abuse

C'mon Brown....

What evidence to you have to support those three?

Posted by: sicwidit | September 5, 2008 7:57 PM

They've been in the league over 2 years (more than JC's starting experience, at least), they're starters, and they suck. What other proof do you need?

Posted by: brownwood26 | September 5, 2008 8:25 PM | Report abuse

Dude, do you watch football? What do all the elite QBs have in common?

THEY PLAY IN THE SAME SYSTEM THEIR ENTIRE CAREERS!!!!

Uhhh, no I guess I don't watch football, that's why I am posting on a Redskins blog!
Don't ask stupid questions.

If you had read the end of my previous post, it said he may need to go somewhere he could use his sklii set, not the WCO.
Stop making excuses for a slow reacting QB.
Wake up and see it for what it is.
I'd love nothing more than to be wrong and watch him take off and really lead this team to the next level. I simply don't think he has IT for this scheme. I also am not in the camp to throw Collins or Colt in there either. Bottom line, were in for another long season.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 5, 2008 8:26 PM | Report abuse

oops, forgot to post as ME in response to brownwood.

Posted by: longsufferingskinsfan | September 5, 2008 8:28 PM | Report abuse

By the way, I do miss some Terry Tate...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RzToNo7A-94

Posted by: brownwood26 | September 5, 2008 8:28 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: freakzilla | September 5, 2008 8:28 PM | Report abuse

I am curious to see how Tavares Jackson progresses this season. At least he is agile enough to avoid many sacks and not tuck away the ball and fall.

Posted by: longsufferingskinsfan | September 5, 2008 8:30 PM | Report abuse

Bottom line, were in for another long season.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 5, 2008 8:26 PM

Well, LSSF we can agree on that. I've said all along that I think this is an 8-8 team. They played average ball last night, so I don't think I'm wrong in that assumption. But whether it's Zorn or someone else, this team needs to put a staff in place for the long haul and let it grow. That's the only way.

I just get riled up when people crack on JC like it's HIS fault the team can't keep a coach and an offense here for more than 2 years. The same thing happened to Patrick Ramsey when he was here. I don't think it's that Ramsey can't play. I think he had an idiot coach (Spurrier), an offense that doesn't fit in the NFL, and Gibbs never liked him from Day 1 because his resume didn't 10 years NFL experience like Brunell's did.

You have to put a coach and a QB together for the long haul. Look at McNabb and Reid in Philly. Hasselbeck and Holmgren in Seattle. Indy's offense has been run by the same coordinator since Peyton got there. I like JC and I hope he does well here, but let's not make it sound like he's retarded and can't play at this level because he can't go 16 games without playing in a new offense.

Posted by: brownwood26 | September 5, 2008 8:40 PM | Report abuse

I am curious to see how Tavares Jackson progresses this season. At least he is agile enough to avoid many sacks and not tuck away the ball and fall.

Posted by: longsufferingskinsfan | September 5, 2008 8:30 PM

I'm not. He's a poor man's Mike Vick. Without the dog fighting, of course.

It's actually pretty spooky to watch. He's got the same delivery and everything.

Posted by: brownwood26 | September 5, 2008 8:42 PM | Report abuse

Too bad for some of you out there but Campbell will be the starting QB for the whole year (at least) if healthy and Zorn is going to be our coach for a minimum of two years.

All you can do is be patient.

Posted by: charlie | September 5, 2008 8:48 PM | Report abuse

Well said, Charlie. I'll part with one more clip of our old friend Terry Tate:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=17jplpjCaec&NR=1

Posted by: brownwood26 | September 5, 2008 8:50 PM | Report abuse

Some of you all that have been doggin' the Skins after their first "L" of the season are fairweather fans. Dude, where's the loyalty? I'll admit the game wasn't pretty, but still... some of you all have the patience of an infant, when it's time to eat or get your do do diaper changed, you want it done right then and there. "Have patience young Skywalker..."

Anyway, here are the JinxMan's (3rd person, I know) observations from Week 1:

Offense: Obviously, this is the unit that needs the most work.
QB ~ JC needs to just go out there and have fun, play & not be afraid to take chances. Dude has the arm, ability and the smarts to be a good one, it just seems like something is holding him back.
OL ~ They had a horrendous start and remained shaky throughout the game. They did open some running lanes for Portis, but too little too late. Samuels could've really hurt Kiwanuka at the end of the game... that was ugly.
TE ~ Non-existent. Cooley needs to work on his blocking, he blew some assignments and the run game paid for it.
WR ~ This group didn't play well either. Whether it was running a pattern short of the first down or dropped passes, it wasn't pretty. It's disappointing that these guys get paid to make catches and they failed to do so in this game. I was taught, if the ball hits your hands, you better catch it, and this crew didn't do it last night.
RB ~ Decent game. Portis definitely is one of the better backs who picks up blitzes and chips DEs on the line.

Defense: Never in my wildest dreams did I think this squad would get dominated in the first quarter and a half. They made Jacobs look like a superstar.
DL ~ Got manhandled all night long. Is the Giants OL that good? Where was the new vaunted pass rush? Eli had all weekend to throw except on a couple instances when the Skins blitzed. I know Taylor was less than 100%, but if you're lacin' them up, you gotta do better than that.
LB ~ Too many missed tackles. Made Jacobs & Ward look like superstars
DB ~ Too many dropped INTs. LBM should've had at least 3 INTs on his stat line last night. Springs not being on the field probably hurt morale. BTW, what's up with the giggling when your team is in the midst of getting stomped? Doughty got exposed in coverage. Doubt it will be long before we start seeing Horton on the field more. Landry played okay. The highlight of him getting "truck-sticked" by Jacobs will play on the highlight reels for the remainder of the season

Special Teams ~ Brooks was okay. He certainly took one for the team when he got clobbered by McDougle. Need to be more consistent with the punts though. If anyone were to get a game ball for the game, it would be your boy Rock Cartwright. It seemed like he was the only one up to play this game.

Overall ~ There was no sense of urgency or passion with the team and play-calling last night. I thought the constant theme of training camp was for the offense to play at a faster pace. Well, it didn't happen last night. I know it was Zorn's first game as head coach, but he has to do better with game management. Coach Z needs to get those hurry-up offenses installed, so we don't see the same thing occur for the rest of the season. You don't use the first regular season game to discover what your flaws are. I know it's a learning experience, but come on. Cartwright seemed to be the only one who wanted to play and he and the kickoff team made it a point to get the Offense in great field position for their only points of the game. He also had that great tackle on the punt team coverage. Other than that, the only other player to appear slightly fired up was Portis and it looked like he was venting in frustrated. Someone needs to fire these guys up, not sure who, but if they come out flat again, they'll look like JV against the Saints at FedEx.

Gettin' off my soapbox... Until next week. HTTR!

Posted by: JinxMan | September 5, 2008 8:51 PM | Report abuse

Unless he said it in another interview, Zorn didn't say anything to Sonny in the locker room about leaving the Giants too much time on the clock at the end.

Posted by: Carl Williams | September 5, 2008 7:26 PM

That was at today's press conf. sorry for the confusion......

Posted by: 4th | September 5, 2008 8:53 PM | Report abuse

I agree with you too about keeping a QB and an offense together. It makes a world of difference.

I'm the same age 43 as the owner, (without the billions of course) and he can't seem to separate himself from being a fan, versus an owner.
Beathard was really good at finding talent and JKC allowed coaches and FO peolpe do their thing.

Again, I think Zorn is a breath of fresh air when he calls it like it is, calls out players, and himself. At least he seems like he wants to play to win, instead of playing not to lose like Gibbs II. Gibbs I aired it out and had exciting (at the time innovative plays). I hope Zorn gets a fair shake to make it with players he'd like to have running his system.

Posted by: longsufferingskinsfan | September 5, 2008 8:53 PM | Report abuse

suffice it to say, I hope Zorn gets HIS chance to get HIS players to run HIS offense the way HE would like. I'm not at all convinced Moss, ARE, and Thrash scare anyone in the league.

The D better be reasy for NO next week, as it will be harder than the NY offense, ie; more explosive.

Posted by: longsufferingskinsfan | September 5, 2008 9:03 PM | Report abuse

Jinxman,

You can say the defense was horrible for the first four drives but the Jints didn't score after that. Not too shabby. If there was any offense, a win would have been possible. (BIG FAT IF!)

Posted by: charlie | September 5, 2008 9:06 PM | Report abuse

Just like most folks said before the season, Zorn is just keeping the seat warm. He is NOT a head coach at this stage of his career. Vinny is to blame for this mess. A horrific draft that will go down as one of the worst we've seen and not hiring Greg Williams will doom us again. Rarely did you see our defense play as listless as they did yesterday to start a game. Thanks again Vinny!

Posted by: Anonymous | September 5, 2008 9:33 PM | Report abuse

I think what is horrifying to so many Skins fans is based on last year. We were blown out of a game only 1 time. vs NE -- and they were blowing out everyone so it wasn't a shock.

In this game, we were blown out from the opening snap. Literally. I never felt like the Skins were even in this game. The score didn't look like a blow out, but it sure felt like one.

By rejecting GG and going with Zorn, I think there was a sense of Zorn being a 'diamond in the rough'. Someone who had been overlooked too long for all the wrong reasons. That his unconventional ways might just be brilliant.

This is such a huge step back from 2008. Should we have expected to win last night? Maybe. Should we have expected to be competitive? Yes.

And that is the trauma of being a Redskins fan today.

Posted by: AL Zeke etc | September 5, 2008 10:22 PM | Report abuse

I can some this up quickly.

They Suck....

Posted by: Leevi | September 5, 2008 10:47 PM | Report abuse

go to this link and hear what Colin Cowherd had to say about the skins. I think some will find it interesting.

http://query-origin.andohs.net/8000A6/content-root3.andomedia.com/origin/mp3/espnradio/insider/herd/herd_09052008_hr1.mp3

Posted by: longsufferingskinsfan | September 5, 2008 10:52 PM | Report abuse

It might make sense if the Spaghetti Gang (Danny and Vinny) decide to make Greg Blache the HC/DC and Zorn the OC.

Zorn has a big job to get the offense rolling and he needs to focus on that alone, not other issues. Blache's defensive unit is clearly far ahead.

Now there might be ways to accomplish this without changing titles, etc. But Zorn doesn't need to be doing press conferences about injury reports. He has a big task and needs to focus on it.

That kind of 'out of the box' thinking isn't what the Spaghetti Gang is known for ... but who knows what is going on behind the scenes. Can't imagine Danny or Vinny slept well last night ...

Posted by: AL Zeke etc | September 5, 2008 10:54 PM | Report abuse

"I know I can't start that trend again," Rogers said of his drop-itis.

Now I'm not a big stats guy, but I'd love to see Rogers dropped balls vs. ints since we drafted him. He is the fing worst.

Posted by: Jeff Hayes | September 5, 2008 10:57 PM | Report abuse

For those of you that watched Zorn's press conference today, was anyone remotely impressed with him?

Distracted
Difficulty making points
Stating the obvious
Confused
Laid back

I'm not judging Zorn after 1 game for the on-field performance, but I was not impressed with the press conference at all.

p.s. the video is available on redskins.com

Posted by: isnadd | September 5, 2008 11:07 PM | Report abuse

This mess will continue until "The Vinny" is gone. How does a smuck like this guy keep his job? The Redskins are horrible at every position with the exception of running back. This team needs a major overhall - but not buy Mr. racketball...

Posted by: VInny | September 5, 2008 11:27 PM | Report abuse

Listening to Zorn, yeesh. Miss Teen South Carolina called, she wants her analytical mind back.

Posted by: SMACK | September 6, 2008 12:17 AM | Report abuse

PS. -- If you don't like the owner, then put your money where your mouth is and make him an offer... 1 billion might be enough.

Posted by: Siris | September 5, 2008 6:58 PM

I did. We would have had a deal but he insisted on $50 down.

DAMN YOU, Mortgage lending crisis.

Posted by: Corkczar | September 6, 2008 12:26 AM | Report abuse

+++"Welcome to Spurrier Redux"

Posted by: Anonymous | September 5, 2008 6:51 PM

Spurrier had a reputation for not putting the effort into his job that was required. I haven't heard anyone say that about Zorn yet.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 5, 2008 6:55 PM+++

Anonymous responding to anonymous.... Hmmm I fear there's a tear in the Space/Time continuum.

Posted by: Corkczar | September 6, 2008 12:31 AM | Report abuse

++++I don't understand why fans blame the owner and GM when the team failed to execute on offense...--SIRIS+++

Allow me to 'splain. Because they hired a head coach who had no experience calling a game on offense and had never been a coordinator before, and because of their ineptness in the past at acquiring FAs, trading away draft picks, letting good players leave, and drafting too many bad ones have left the team in less than sterling shape.

That said, give Zorn a little time to gain OJT experience, before writing him off..

Posted by: Corkczar | September 6, 2008 12:36 AM | Report abuse

++We need an Ass't HC who knows how to/when to call TOs and understand clock Management. Also, when to go for 2. Maybe even when to pass past the 1st down marker.

Thoughts?+++

Is teh guy Gibbs used to help him cal TO's available. Oh, wait....

Posted by: Corkczar | September 6, 2008 12:40 AM | Report abuse

.
+++QB ~ JC needs to just go out there and have fun, play & not be afraid to take chances. Dude has the arm, ability and the smarts to be a good one, it just seems like something is holding him back.+++--JINXMAN

There's a term for starting QBs who take that approach, jinx. It's "former starting quarterback."

Posted by: Corkczar | September 6, 2008 12:44 AM | Report abuse

+++It might make sense if the Spaghetti Gang (Danny and Vinny) decide to make Greg Blache the HC/DC and Zorn the OC.+++--AL, Zeke

Al, last sports idea I heard this good was those two Yankee pitchers who decided to switch wives.

Posted by: Corkczar | September 6, 2008 12:46 AM | Report abuse

Colt's '08 preseason rating: 109
T.C.'s '08 preseason rating: 81
#17's (no idiots, not Doug) '08 preseason rating: 70...

That is all....

Posted by: Anonymous | September 6, 2008 12:48 AM | Report abuse

Vinny got the job by doing an excellent job of mowing snyders lawn and mulching superbly

Posted by: Anonymous | September 6, 2008 12:50 AM | Report abuse

we could have traded down and gotten merriman instead of loser carlos rogers, aka "the run stopping corner".

Posted by: Anonymous | September 6, 2008 12:53 AM | Report abuse

smack, that's messed up. we haven't played you guys yet...

Posted by: dealer | September 6, 2008 12:56 AM | Report abuse

speaking of cerrato...i was just thinking today...there is no way danny fires vinny. cuz can you imagine the ishti that's going to come out if he fires vinny...tell all book by vinny...a la danny's nanny.

Posted by: dealer | September 6, 2008 12:57 AM | Report abuse

alright...that's all the thinking my brain could handle...i'm out...gn!

Posted by: dealer | September 6, 2008 12:58 AM | Report abuse

What's the name of the QB that led DC to the playoff's LAST SEASON again geniuses? Gibbs won 3 rings w/ 3 vet's @ QB.

Posted by: realness | September 6, 2008 1:13 AM | Report abuse

Rypien was the least of them

Posted by: realness | September 6, 2008 1:15 AM | Report abuse

Although there are signs that Campbell may not pan out, the Skins offense cannot be declared DOA until mid-season. If you recall, even the talented Charges offense (with a more proven qb), struggled with their new offense for the first half of last season. Even Gibbs I was 0-5 to start. So, although our offense may never pull out of its apparent nose dive, let's wait at least 4 or 5 games before pulling the plug.

Posted by: LA Skins Fan | September 6, 2008 2:07 AM | Report abuse

+++It might make sense if the Spaghetti Gang (Danny and Vinny) decide to make Greg Blache the HC/DC and Zorn the OC.+++--AL, Zeke

Al, last sports idea I heard this good was those two Yankee pitchers who decided to switch wives.

Posted by: Corkczar | September 6, 2008 12:46 AM

Was that a good thing?

Cork, I did follow that up with a more pragmatic approach -- "Now there might be ways to accomplish this without changing titles, etc. But Zorn doesn't need to be doing press conferences about injury reports. He has a big task and needs to focus on it."

100% if Zorn's focus should be on getting the offense right. The teams and defense are not problems.

Posted by: AL Zeke etc | September 6, 2008 2:40 AM | Report abuse

I like the way Jom Zorn seems to be more up front with his thinking about the gameas and practices.

Joe Gibbs would have just said it's my fault, it starts with me, etc.

But I still love St. Joe!!

Posted by: Cheyenne, WY | September 6, 2008 4:30 AM | Report abuse

Zorn doesn't appear nearly as articulate and comfortable when addressing the media as I thought he would be. Watching Zorn answer questions is like watching JC on passing plays. Both seem hesitant and unsure and have a shellshocked look.

I think both have the ability to improve but its going to take some time and experience before they start to seem sure of what they're doing.

Posted by: will_ga | September 6, 2008 5:15 AM | Report abuse

I'd feel a lot better about Zorn throwing his players under the bus if his own decision making during the game hadn't left me thinking "WTF" so many times.

Posted by: will_ga | September 6, 2008 5:57 AM | Report abuse

The players went through training camp, but Jim Zorn didn't to Coaches' Camp. Sure, the players threw pilates balls and Jason Campbell, but Zorn just stood there and watched. He isn't in shape for actual games yet.

Zorn needs to design some drills for himself as head coach. All the other coaches stand around in a circle and throw clipboards at him while he calls plays into the offense and the play clock ticks down; he acts in control while the players call him out for bad game management; he delivers a halftime speech while a golf cart chases him around the practice field.

A few weeks of conditioning and he'll be the real deal.

Posted by: talent evaluator | September 6, 2008 6:54 AM | Report abuse

Zorn didnt throw any players under the bus...he, as the head coach, said the same things we said as fans

Posted by: Cheyenne, WY | September 6, 2008 6:56 AM | Report abuse

Has anyone forgotten 1981-82 when the Redskins' new coach started 0 -5?
With that, the o-line may be a concern, but not so much from ability as philosophy. This is a Joe Gibbs, smash-mouth o-line, with a big-armed qb; Zorn's true measure will be his ability to adjust his offense/play-calling to the talent this team has, and Snyderrato being patient yet aggressive in acquiring the players that best fit this system. Except for that first play, Heyer stood up pretty well I thought; still, the one constant throughout Gibbs 1.0 was a quality o-line; people remember Jacoby, Grimm, and Bostic, but don't forget Schlereth, Lachey, and McKenzie who stepped in and maintained that high level of performance, too. I agree Snyderrato messed up not going for more o-line, which is symbolic of their fascination with glamour; pray this is the last year we worry about these strategic blunders, and pray HARD.

Posted by: pdfordiii | September 6, 2008 7:44 AM | Report abuse


What is wrong with the Redskins? Here's my analysis.

Disclaimer: Yes, it's one game but we can still see the following:

1) The talent level on offense is mediocre starting with the QB. For those that say JC is learning his 7th offense in as many years are right, but his problems are not system problems. Holding the ball too long, locking in on receivers, pattting the ball...those are skill set issues and confidence issues. As Sonny Jurgenson said, he's thinking rather than playing.

2) This WR corps is putrid, but "fans" are pointing the finger squarely at Vinny on this one. Remember, it was Gibbs who loved Thrash, Lloyd, Patten, etc...Gibbs was the Vice President of the team and Vinny answered to him. This team has no true playmaker at WR. You can talk all you want about Chad Johnson, TO, etc. they make plays and score touchdowns. James Thrash, ARE, Santana Moss. Are you really going to win a championship with those guys?

3) I don't understand why fans crucify Vinny over this draft. These guys have been pros for three months. To even see Devin Thomas in the game catching one pass (albeit short of the first down) is encouraging. The real blame should be placed on Vinny, Gibbs and Snyder for drafts and FA pickups of the past. We have overpaid for mediocre talent and that falls at the feet of Snyder. I'm not gonna call him names and tell him to sell the team, but I think now he had learned, but it's been so messed up that it will take time to turn it around.

4) There is a bright side to this. I think Vinny is trying to amass new, young talent. I think they should be commended for not falling into the "quick fix" of high priced FA's although I might have seriously considered a strong run at Anquan Boldin. He's young, big, proven and is a receiver that D-backs have to worry about.

5) Recommendations- They must watch JC carefully. If he continues to display tendencies that can't be fixed, they must cut ties. I'm not suggesting at week 5 or even week 10. You must give him enough time to be able to say he's a boom or he's a bust. I suspect the latter and I have been a JC apologist since he came.

If there's one FA move I'd make, it would be at the CB position. They need help and they need it quick. Let's stop pretending that Carlos Rogers is a shut down corner or even a starting one. Springs is the best corner on the team, but he has yet to be replaced by a good one.

This was a playoff team last year. After one game we looked bad, but we still have enough talent to compete, but's on Zorn and it's on JC. JC needs to take control of this team and his career or he and Zorn will be out together.

Message to JC....JUST PLAY FOOTBALL!!!!

Posted by: sicwidit | September 6, 2008 7:59 AM | Report abuse

That first play was JC's fault...held the ball too long. Heyer did a good job all things considered. Our O line isn't the problem. It's the plays and offense. Wrong offense for JC.
Ironically, an updated 'Gibbs I' offense would be perfect here. Run and play action pass off the run. An updated variation of the monk, clark, sander offense would work. Just account for the blitzing in the modern game with checkdowns and hot routes and we're fine. JC is better suited to deep ball throwing.

Posted by: mark | September 6, 2008 8:16 AM | Report abuse

Here's my analysis:

1. One game with a new coach, new system, new roster tells you nothing that you can use to make long-term decisions about the coach, the system, or the roster.

2. Wait until sixteen games have been played and then size it up. We can't change anything before then other than two or three personnel moves, so why try to judge before the facts are in?

3. In the meantime, avoid the hare-brained haters from the Post and their unnamed sources who are trying to convince you that the season was over before the first game ended. For a more balanced, less agenda-driven perspective, try Rich Tandler:

http://realredskins.com/2008/09/doom-and-gloom-from-post.html

Posted by: talent evaluator | September 6, 2008 8:28 AM | Report abuse

from tandler's blog

http://realredskins.com/2008/09/doom-and-gloom-from-post.html

FRIDAY, SEPTEMBER 05, 2008

Doom and gloom from the Post
I expect the message board community and the postgame show callers to overreact after one season-opening loss. After the Washington Redskins' loss to the New York Giants on Thursday, the knee-jerk brigade is led by the bench Campbell contingent and running close behind with torches lit and rope in hand are the fire Zorn mob, the Portis stinks gang, and the throng that wants to send the Redskins' entire O-line on a one-way retirement cruise immediately.

What astounds me is how many sky-is-falling pieces we see in today's papers. The pros are the ones who are supposed to bring some perspective to the situation.

Apparently the editors at the Washington Post believe otherwise.

Sally Jenkins believes that she can come up with "inescapable facts" about the Redskins after one game, 6.25% of the first season under a new head coach. The Skins will have to "claw mightily to be better than a .500 team", says Jenkins, who reached this conclusion by halftime, or after 3.125% of the season.

Elsewhere in the Post, Les Carpenter had this reasoned analysis of the Skins' first play. It was a sack, the Giants' only one of the game, in fact.

Still it was a harbinger of the calamity to come, one in which the Redskins only had 11 first downs, 1 touchdown and 133 passing yards with an offense that was supposed to make everyone forget previous coach Joe Gibbs and his conservative, run-first game plans that had grown stale to many Redskins fans.

Did anyone really expect the offense to hum like a well-oiled machine on the road against the Super Bowl champs? It was a "calamity"? I'm no pro writer, but I would suggest to Mr. Carpenter that he save such words for actual calamities. In 2005, 36-0 in the Meadowlands was a calamity, at least in football terms. Last night, 16-7, even though the game wasn't that close, was not cataclysmic.

And one game, 27 passes into Jason Campbell's adaption to Jim Zorn's offense, and into Zorn's real-life experience as an NFL play caller, Jason LaCanfora found a guy who said that Campbell was doomed to fail. Quoting an NFL personnel executive (someone who, by the way, has a vested interest in seeing the Redskins fail):

When I watch that team, I think something's going to have to give. Is it the scheme or the quarterback? At some point either the coach is going to have to change what he does to fit the quarterback, or they're going to need a different quarterback. . . You can trace it all back to that, and if that doesn't work then your team is in trouble. It could take four years to dig out of something like that. If the coach doesn't have the right personnel to run his system, then you're starting over again.

So we have a season's that's over, depending on which Post scribe you want to believe, after either the first game, their first half of that game or even the first play of that game.

I'd call that static analysis, but that gives it credit for being analysis.

Why do Jenkins, Carpenter, and LaCanfora have to rush to judgment? Are they afraid that the Redskins will be 1-8 and the Post will be out of ink and paper for them to blast Snyder, Cerrato, Zorn, Campbell, Justin Tryon and Durant Brooks then?

Don't get me wrong, the Redskins and Zorn deserve all the criticism they are taking for what happened on Thursday night. They were tentative, they blew a boatload of opportunities, they were whipped on both sides of the line of scrimmage, and were thoroughly outclassed by a team that is very good, but not great.

But to think that things will stay this way, that Zorn won't adjust, that Campbell won't learn, that the quality of the opposition will stay the same, is lazy journalism at best.

Unfortunately, in these days of the Post-Redskins feud, it's what I've come to expect.

POSTED BY RICH TANDLER AT 9/05/2008 08:27:00 PM

Posted by: jonthefisherman | September 6, 2008 8:39 AM | Report abuse

my bad about the Dupe

Posted by: jonthefisherman | September 6, 2008 8:43 AM | Report abuse

i've got your agenda right HERE. how'z about play better and win some games? thats how you shut your critics up

Posted by: Anonymous | September 6, 2008 8:50 AM | Report abuse

I had quit reading anything about the Skins on the Post's website until curiousity got the better of me and I had to check and see how bad it was after the loss. All you need to know about LaCanfora is the articles and comments all last year about Heyer. I believe, "Somebody's going to get hurt, he has no business being in the game" were common last year. Now its, "You can't help but pull for the guy, He took the time to find us on the way to meetings",etc. So because he TALKED to you, now he's a good player who you're pulling for? It's utterly pathetic. DO YOUR JOB!! It shouldn't matter if somebody talks to you or not. Present the facts without a negative bias. It's almost like you have "little man syndrome." Oops, now there I go making a post with bias!!

Posted by: Tommy in Raleigh | September 6, 2008 8:55 AM | Report abuse

i've got your agenda right HERE. how'z about play better and win some games? thats how you shut your critics up

Posted by: Anonymous | September 6, 2008 8:50 AM

Really? When has anything ever shut the Post up?

Posted by: Anonymous | September 6, 2008 9:38 AM | Report abuse

Read this, it's pretty good:

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/dcsportsbog/

Posted by: scampbell1975 | September 6, 2008 9:43 AM | Report abuse

Let's see, I predicted 3 & out in the first series...Check!

The Gints would hang 40. Wasn't even close.

The Skins would struggle to reach double digits....Check!

First first down in the 3rd quarter. I was so close! (I'm not counting the penalty first down! That was actually a bad call)

JC looked lost out there. Portis looked good. The wasting of time at the end of both halves was a joke. Guess this season will be Zorn learning his job on the fly. If only he had some experience calling plays before!

Posted by: Anonymous | September 6, 2008 9:51 AM | Report abuse

Sorry, that was me at 951

Posted by: Danny's Boyz | September 6, 2008 9:52 AM | Report abuse

challenge anyone to name 3 starting veteran QB's right now that JC is better than????

Posted by: sicwidit | September 5, 2008 7:34 PM

Kyle Orton, J.T. O'Sullivan, and Tavares Jackson. Anything else I can help you with?

Posted by: brownwood26 | September 5, 2008 7:49 PM


Campbell is just as bad as the Guys you mentioned...Even worse actually because Campbell has a better team around him AND has been in the NFL longer with more starts....so I disagree....Campbell sucks and is a bust FACE IT! Stop making excuses for a QB who everytime he plays the offense can't move the ball and looks lost and oput of sync...but a bad QB like Collins can outshine him? Campbell is a BUST!

Posted by: Leevi | September 6, 2008 9:59 AM | Report abuse

http://realredskins.com/2008/09/doom-and-gloom-from-post.html

Thanks for the link. So what is driving the feud? Why does their work seem biased against the Redskins? More importantly, why are the writers allowed to be biased? I thought editors were supposed to help with ethical issues as well as grammar. Does Cindy have to approve of what Jason writes or just correct it? What is her role in this supposed feud?

Posted by: will_ga | September 6, 2008 10:00 AM | Report abuse

Samuals being accused of dirty play


http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=3571642

Posted by: Leevi | September 6, 2008 10:03 AM | Report abuse

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/dcsportsbog/

Posted by: scampbell1975 | September 6, 2008 9:43 AM

That was a good post. Maybe we can start a trade Jasno for Dan petition for RI!

Posted by: will_ga | September 6, 2008 10:11 AM | Report abuse

Tandler is on point. I too have had knee jerk reactions, but that's what is expected of me.........

Posted by: 4th | September 6, 2008 10:18 AM | Report abuse

That was a good post. Maybe we can start a trade Jasno for Dan petition for RI!

Posted by: will_ga | September 6, 2008 10:11 AM

Consider it started

1) Scampbell1975
2)

Posted by: scampbell1975 | September 6, 2008 10:24 AM | Report abuse

Patient Lloyd looking to catch on with Bears

By Vaughn McClure | Chicago Tribune reporter

Defensive coordinators scheme for Devin Hester. The Bears coaches continue to rave about Rashied Davis.

And Brandon Lloyd remains in the background, quietly waiting to make an impact for his new team.

"Football is football. That's the easy part," said Lloyd, the Bears new addition at receiver. "I'm prepared. I've been studying a lot. I'm ready."

The Bears don't have an established No. 1 receiver, so Lloyd should have ample opportunity to prove his value. He was somewhat quiet in exhibitions with seven catches for 69 yards, but Lloyd has more career catches (130) than Hester, Davis and Mark Bradley combined (97).

The 6-foot, 194-pound Lloyd could be a pivotal player Sunday night at Indianapolis when he will start along with Davis.

Lloyd isn't concerned about being a primary target.

"I run every play like I'm getting the ball," he said. "That's the only way I know how to do it. You just go. If they choose my number, great. If they don't, I'm just going to continue to run my routes like that."

Quarterback Kyle Orton expressed confidence in Lloyd.

"He's an explosive player, a really good route-runner," Orton said. "He's one of our best route-runners, and certainly one of our big-play-potential guys.

"Brandon just goes up and gets the ball. He's not as tall as I thought he was when he first came here, but he plays big. I remember watching him on TV and seeing all these plays, jumping over guys and stuff. He certainly plays bigger than he is."

Posted by: PepperRod | September 6, 2008 10:24 AM | Report abuse

From Saturday Post article:

That was Campbell's intention, but when he dropped back to throw "I couldn't see him," Campbell said, referring to Moss. "I lost sight of him; I couldn't see him through the linemen. I tried to stick with him just a little bit too long to see if he won [the one-on-one matchup]. You learn from that. You move on to the next play."

__________________________

At 6' 5", how can JC not see something downfield?

In all seriousness -- have the team doctors checked his vision? Does he have good peripheral vision? Is there some brain function interacting with his vision that makes him "lock in" and then not be able see other things -- if he locks in on the D-line, then he can't see downfield? Did he have some sort of trauma happen in high school or college football (when most impressionable) that makes him hesitate now -- a concussion, back injury, eye injury?

As long as the Redskins are committed to making him their franchise player, may as well leave no stone unturned.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 6, 2008 10:29 AM | Report abuse

As long as the Redskins are committed to making him their franchise player, may as well leave no stone unturned.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 6, 2008 10:29 AM

Dumbest post of September. Santana's about 5'6". The Redskins left no turn unstoned: drafted two big WRs. When they get on the field, no stopping the 'Skins.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 6, 2008 10:34 AM | Report abuse

concerning the bias the post has against the redskins, I think these writers are fans of rival teams

Posted by: sickcuz | September 6, 2008 10:47 AM | Report abuse

You post, Anonymous, then call your own post dumbest? Priceless.

Posted by: MasterCard | September 6, 2008 10:48 AM | Report abuse

I don't mean to be an alarmist but you do realise that this week is a make or break for the 2008 season, don't you? Or do you think it's a nice idea to start the season 1-4? I want Colt on the red phone against the Quaints. I want that boy's cleats knotted, his pants hitched up and a warm pigskin in his paws - cause something tells me this team will sink or swim with The Colt this year. My guess is that he will turn this thing around, with his rocket arm, his passion and refusal to lose. Come on Zorn, at the first sign of offensive timidity, pull Colt's trigger! You'll never look back and you'll never regret it.

Posted by: Bud Jackson | September 6, 2008 10:51 AM | Report abuse

Consider it started

1) Scampbell1975
2) Will_ga
3) Anonymous
4)

Posted by: will_ga | September 6, 2008 10:55 AM | Report abuse

On principal, I don't sign no petitions. And I don't cotton to badgering neither.

Posted by: Bud Jackson | September 6, 2008 10:57 AM | Report abuse

Hey, Bud. What do you do on principle?

Posted by: Anonymous | September 6, 2008 11:01 AM | Report abuse

concerning the bias the post has against the redskins, I think these writers are fans of rival teams

Posted by: sickcuz | September 6, 2008 10:47 AM

There's gotta be another answer. The WaPo is filled with employees who have received great acclaim for their work. There have been movies & tv shows about/with them. Surely, even the sports writers there should be held to a higher standard than the tabloid garbage you buy at the checkout line.

Posted by: will_ga | September 6, 2008 11:12 AM | Report abuse

A QB that has tunnel vision and can't remember to work quickly through his checkdowns every play, then throw the ball on time shouldn't even start a high school JV game. Yet so many poster's support JC? Those people need to put the pipe down. The O scheme and play calling are secondary to the fundamentals of the position. He's played QB for how many years? We need a big receiver; put him out wide, get to the playoffs AGAIN w/ Collins then go to Colt.

Posted by: Realness | September 6, 2008 11:23 AM | Report abuse

Hey guys I found this Fun Football Game. You should check it out.

http://goallineblitz.com/game/signup.pl?ref=19506066

Posted by: K Bronx | September 6, 2008 11:27 AM | Report abuse

Start Colt now....Let's see what the kid can do...We have seen Jason not move the offense for how many chanes now? New system Blah blah blah...Jason never has looked as good as colt did even when Jason was a rookie...BUST!

Posted by: Leevi | September 6, 2008 11:28 AM | Report abuse

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/dcsportsbog/

That was a good post. Maybe we can start a trade Jasno for Dan petition for RI!

Posted by: will_ga | September 6, 2008 10:11 AM

Consider it started

1) Scampbell1975
2) Will_ga


Just to be fair, I don't think anonymous will work, so come up with "a real fake name." (Not that the same person couldn't come up with a hundred of these) I don't actually think this will go anywhere anyway, but it will be interesting to see how many posters on here would actually support this. Just for fun.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | September 6, 2008 11:33 AM | Report abuse

Let's watch and wait. Maybe Zorn was hired to be the hatchet man for Campbell anyway -- like a lot of corporations will bring in a new CEO specifically to clean house. It's up to Campbell to keep the job by capitalizing on his experience. Pretty obvious Zorn has a real affection for Brennan.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 6, 2008 11:34 AM | Report abuse

This is hilarious!

Very busy yesterday no time for reading and blogging.
Got on this morning and see where you guys had some fun w/ me missing the Animal House reference.

I had a good laugh at myself too!
It was funny, and I don't mind you laughing at me at all.
Actually for some reason, never saw that one. I probably chose to read the WPost or something...


Also noticed Greg and Dealer going at it and later someone thinks I was involved in it?

Nope, but I did get a good laugh out of the Animal House reference.
Perhaps I will go out and rent it some time soon.

thanks!

Posted by: RedskinRay1 | September 6, 2008 12:05 PM | Report abuse

Just to be fair, I don't think anonymous will work, so come up with "a real fake name."


I know, I know, but I did accidentally post as anonymous one time so I thought I would try and get credit for it.

Posted by: will_ga | September 6, 2008 12:07 PM | Report abuse

Don't know if anyone posted this Friday; I was busy all day from about 10 am until bed time.

so if you've seen it, sorry.

If not, it makes me feel bad, how bad NFL.COM thinks we really are.

ugly!

http://www.nfl.com/videos?videoId=09000d5d80a8dea0

Posted by: RedskinRay1 | September 6, 2008 12:07 PM | Report abuse

This evaluation by NFL.COM is even worse!
They really unload on Jim Zorn.
They believe JC can play in this league
I hope they are right.

http://www.nfl.com/videos?videoId=09000d5d80a8dea0

Posted by: RedskinRay1 | September 6, 2008 12:12 PM | Report abuse

I checked out nfl network's coverage and it's realistic what they're saying. They mentioned a lack of a sense of urgency...I'd also add to it, the team (in general) lack of fire.

Posted by: sickcuz | September 6, 2008 12:26 PM | Report abuse

I agree with Sick. Other that Rock, Portis and Fletcher the rest of the team looked like they were just going through the motions!

Posted by: GLFLVER2 | September 6, 2008 12:34 PM | Report abuse

Just read the article on Zorn's take on the game and the offensive troubles. I don't know if it was JLa's interpretation or what, but no way should Zorn be talking about Campbell like that. As much as I hated the, "our guys played their guts out" from Gibbs the last few years, it was better than saying you "think" your QB can play in this system and you think he "needs to get better." Campbell was reduced to giving excuses and reasons that one play was missed. And Moss was defending his QB. This has the makings in week one of a team against their coach and a coach throwing up reasons not to get fired. If things don't get Way better by the New Orleans game, things could get really ugly. There is no one left to settle things down.

Posted by: PA Skins | September 6, 2008 12:38 PM | Report abuse

"I've always said it takes three years, but three to where they know where to go," Holmgren said. "Then, in years four and five, you polish your trade to really become good, not just to know what to do, but do it well. It takes until then so they know where to go, [and] to make the throw. It takes until then where you know you're getting this type of pressure here, so sidestep and make the throw. That's what you get the more you play the position."

Interesting take on Hasselbeck's training and establishing a new offense, for more see

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/playoffs05/columns/story?columnist=clayton_john&id=2311953

Campbell and the whole team just need more time to master the offense. Regardless of your faith or lack of faith in Campbell, it doesn't matter who's throwing until the WR's are able to run their routes well.

Dave (from http://riggosrag.com/) made the good point that the offense severely lacked audibles and adjustments at the line - which is particularly going to kill you against a team like the Giants. I think that the offense will get better once (if?) they get a little more flexible and attend more to reading the d.

I have to ask, what's up with the New Orleans Saints? Ever since I've been following they've always struck me as bland and boring, not losers but nothing special. Am I missing something? What's their deal?

And a belated thanks for the informative article about Cerrato, it was balanced and well-written, and it seemed to put things in perspective, with Zorn being the new hire, and Cerrato doing everything he can do to back Zorn and make his life easier.

Posted by: Josh | September 6, 2008 12:55 PM | Report abuse

+++I think Jason Taylor is going to to be a bust. We should have used those picks for a cornerback. We could have got Lito Shepperd for a 2nd.

Posted by: Mike | September 5, 2008 7:15 PM

Right, because Lito Sheppard would rush the passer and stop the run...+++BROWNWOOD

I'd have kept the picks, because this team is a leaky boat and needs to rebuild through the draft. Unfortunately, with Vinny doing the picking...that day may never come.

But, Brownwood, Taylor was eaten alive by a 325 pound tackle, followed by a 266 pound fullback, followed by a 264 pound tailback.

The Redskins are small and old. You don't improve that by trading picks for more small and old.


Posted by: Corkczar | September 6, 2008 1:08 PM | Report abuse

I can't wait three years.

Posted by: I don't know about you | September 6, 2008 1:08 PM | Report abuse

I feel sorry for Campbell, because these consistent changes in offense are ruining his career. I would of been angered to no end if I was him when I found out there was going to be ANOTHER change in the offense. It has done nothing but retard his career and Snyder has enough common sense to realize that. Campbell should of demanded a trade because the owner is screwing up his career.

Posted by: ga8085 | September 6, 2008 1:14 PM | Report abuse

AAAhhhh the poor lidle pudey cat can't wait three years. Toughen up Son, I say Toughen Up!

Posted by: Foghorn Leghorn | September 6, 2008 1:17 PM | Report abuse

Somebody mentioned Tom Cruise when I commented how Snyder was basically a failure at life. Well, after Tropic Thunder, that is WRONG, WRONG, WRONG! The Tom is back!!

Posted by: Carl Williams | September 6, 2008 1:24 PM | Report abuse

The Redskins problem for the last decade or so has been twofold. On the one hand they have not seen themselves accurately, as others see them. The Skins and we fans have drunk more kool-aid than a fat 11 year old in a Bakersfield summer. The OL and DL are the powertrains of a team's engine, and we have been undersized, old and slow for a decade. We need to write off the next 3 years and just build this team from the ground up like the Steelers did in the early 70s. Keep no one over 30. Draft lineman for Sumu size (like the Boys OL), draft recievers for height and build things back up around The Colt. We will not win the SB with this "generation". We do not need bandaids, its far more serious than that and no one here seems willing to face the truth. Do you want to win or not. Well, then do as I say...immediately.

Posted by: Bud Jackson | September 6, 2008 1:31 PM | Report abuse

We will not win a SB with Colt. Talk about drinking some Kool-Aid.

Posted by: Kool-Aid Man | September 6, 2008 1:34 PM | Report abuse

I am learning Joe Gibbs was a alot smarter than I realized.

He would not ridicule his players in public, but you know he let them have it in private!

He would not have expressed his displeasure w/ JC, though JC was terrible at times last year.

Jim Zorn is already losing that coach- player respect for how you challenge a player at practice, in team meetings, in the privacy of an office etc.

But not in the public media.

Posted by: RedskinRay1 | September 6, 2008 1:34 PM | Report abuse

RR1,

Excellent points all around. Bill Parcells - though a good talent evaluator - belittled certain players who were not "his guys". This condescending tactic rarely worked (e.g. see Bledso). I thought Zorn would be in the Gibbs, Landry, Walsh, Bud Grant mold, where professionalism and player rapport are concerned.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 6, 2008 1:40 PM | Report abuse

Blame Schnyderato as much as you want to, but who drafted that ineffective QB JC? Joe The Saint.

Who abandoned ship at the most inopportune moment when he realized he could not cut it after the last non salary cap season? Joe The Saint.

Who made all the final personnel decisions for the last four years? Joe The Saint.

Who left again after he realized that he has an aging team that needs an overhaul and will probably lose almost as many games as under Pettitbone? Joe The Saint

It is time to give Cerrato a brake. He has a good track record at the 49-ers and at ND. Wait and see.

Posted by: johnbear1 | September 6, 2008 1:43 PM | Report abuse

Hey Kool-Aid Man,

Right, okay I just wrote down your comments and date-stamped the parchment. Sorry buddy you're on record now, and neither Colt nor I will ever forget what you wrote. Colt's gonna be super ticked but, if my plan is followed, he's gonna get the last laugh when he hoists that Lombardi in 2013.

Posted by: Bud Jackson | September 6, 2008 1:47 PM | Report abuse

He left having taken us to the playoffs 2 of the last three years, and we have plenty of good players under 30.

and he told the Danny the best move was to keep Gregg Williams .

So don't blame Joe Gibbs for what Danny and Jim Zorn do, folks [johnbear1 in particular]

Posted by: RedskinRay1 | September 6, 2008 1:51 PM | Report abuse

F Tom Cruise
F Scientology

Snyderatto ruined this franchise and Campbell's career. So many holes to plug by terrible decision makers - it's an endless cycle of mediocrity.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 6, 2008 1:54 PM | Report abuse

The players went through training camp, but Jim Zorn didn't to Coaches' Camp. Sure, the players threw pilates balls and Jason Campbell, but Zorn just stood there and watched. He isn't in shape for actual games yet.

Zorn needs to design some drills for himself as head coach. All the other coaches stand around in a circle and throw clipboards at him while he calls plays into the offense and the play clock ticks down; he acts in control while the players call him out for bad game management; he delivers a halftime speech while a golf cart chases him around the practice field.

A few weeks of conditioning and he'll be the real deal.

Posted by: talent evaluator | September 6, 2008 6:54 AM

++++++++++++
THis was VERY FUNNY!!! I has to be from a FAKE poster. Talent Evaluator (rumored to be Cerrato) ISN'T that funny.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 6, 2008 1:55 PM | Report abuse

THis was VERY FUNNY!!! I has to be from a FAKE poster. Talent Evaluator (rumored to be Cerrato) ISN'T that funny.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 6, 2008 1:55 PM

Anonymous--I met most of the regulars at the shabingus, so folks know who I am. You? We're not so sure. Anyway, every once in a while I get off a good one.

Posted by: talent evaluator | September 6, 2008 2:06 PM | Report abuse

Actually, what Zorn said about the timing at the end of the game made sense if you listen to it properly in his presser. He sounds like he is seeing a lot of specific points for improvement, but hasn't had the time to implement them. I'm not worried in that department. I'm more worried that he needs a freaking motivational speaker and a "mentor" to talk to during the game to ask questions and get answers/advice from. That would have helped him yesterday, telling him to go no huddle. Zorn seems like he's seeing and thinking about too much at times, and sometimes needs to be told the obvious. Also, I'm not sure it's a good thing to be saying that much about the specifics of the offensive plays/screwups in pressers. Although other teams have film dept.s to scout them, I'm not sure Zorn should be helping them. Also, from what Zorn is saying at the end of the presser yesterday, to me it seems like Soups is farther along than Hasselbeck was. Lastly, I did not see that mental lapse look from JC. My only negative comment on his body language is that he wasn't fired up enough and didn't get his offense fired up while on the field. Even Eli was more animated than he was, which is scary.

Overall, too many missed opportunities/stupid correctable mistakes (of course assuming stone hands is a treatable condition). Period. Lastly, I don't understand how the last play was a dirty one by Samuels, it just seemed like he was trying to protect his quarterback at all costs.

Posted by: Karen | September 6, 2008 2:23 PM | Report abuse

Lastly, I don't understand how the last play was a dirty one by Samuels, it just seemed like he was trying to protect his quarterback at all costs.

Posted by: Karen | September 6, 2008 2:23 PM

Have a 300 lber toss his body onto the back of your knee/ankle, and see how it feels - easy way to end someone's season. Samuels isn't normally a dirty player, but that was a dirty play.

Posted by: J. Theismann | September 6, 2008 2:32 PM | Report abuse

I am learning Joe Gibbs was a alot smarter than I realized.

Posted by: RedskinRay1 | September 6, 2008 1:34 PM

No your just a lot more of an idiot than you realized. Now go stick your head up your a$$.....see if it fits.

Posted by: Jack Venom | September 6, 2008 2:32 PM | Report abuse

RedskinRay1:
He left having taken us to the playoffs 2 of the last three years, and we have plenty of good players under 30.
and he told the Danny the best move was to keep Gregg Williams .
So don't blame Joe Gibbs for what Danny and Jim Zorn do, folks [johnbear1 in particular]

I do not blame Joe The Saint for what Danny and Zorn do! Read my post again!

My point is he left after the 1991 very successful season and last year because he knew that the teams he left behind could not cut it!

Plenty good players under 30: name ten – I give you plenty – name 5 and it is enough – make sure you exclude Cerrato’s draft picks this year!

Posted by: johnbear1 | September 6, 2008 2:48 PM | Report abuse

Jim Zorn is already losing that coach- player respect for how you challenge a player at practice, in team meetings, in the privacy of an office etc.

But not in the public media.

Posted by: RedskinRay1 | September 6, 2008 1:34 PM

I think as long as he's telling the players the same thing as the media, Zorn calling the players out won't be a problem. I do think that Zorn needs some help on game day with clock management, etc. I'm hoping that Sherman Smith will pick up the slack and keep some of these details in mind, since Zorn is doing the play calling.

Posted by: MJ | September 6, 2008 2:50 PM | Report abuse

I'm sending Kiwanuka a case of Kleenex.

Funny, I didn't hear Clinton Portis whining like a girl after Gerris Wilkinson and Antonio Pierce decided to unload on him after he was already down.

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | September 6, 2008 2:53 PM | Report abuse

I didn't see Samuels simply fall on Kiwanuka's legs. I saw him wrap up K's legs with his arms and bring his body down. I see no difference between that and a normal tackle by a defensive player. Really, that tackle isn't wrong if it's done by a defensive player, and if the guy is 300 lbs, then it's the same scenario. Again I don't get how it's a dirty play.

Posted by: Karen | September 6, 2008 2:56 PM | Report abuse

re: Samuels' 'dirty' play... when I saw it real-time, it looked like he deliberately tackled the DE, going low on the legs -- a real, dirty, personal-foul, chance-to-really-injure someone, type of play.
On replay, it was pretty clear that he just fell on Kiwa's leg.

Posted by: cload & daggar | September 6, 2008 3:01 PM | Report abuse

I don't care if Samuels did it intentionally or not.

Someone needs to remind Kiwanuka that:

A) Chris Samuels' job is to protect his team's QB.

B) Chris Samuels' job is NOT to ensure Mathias Kiwanuka stays healthy so he can keep playing and collect his paycheck.

C) If Kiwanuka cannot grasp B he should find himself another line of work.

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | September 6, 2008 3:03 PM | Report abuse

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/dcsportsbog/

That was a good post. Maybe we can start a trade Jasno for Dan petition for RI!

Posted by: will_ga | September 6, 2008 10:11 AM

Consider it started

1) Scampbell1975
2) Will_ga


Just to be fair, I don't think anonymous will work, so come up with "a real fake name." (Not that the same person couldn't come up with a hundred of these) I don't actually think this will go anywhere anyway, but it will be interesting to see how many posters on here would actually support this. Just for fun.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | September 6, 2008 3:04 PM | Report abuse

Sorry, deliberately blocking like that is a personal foul. And gets called enough.
I don't think it was deliberate, and the officials didn't, but YMMV.

Posted by: cload & daggar | September 6, 2008 3:07 PM | Report abuse

Samuels broke Antonio Garay's leg last year on an illegal chop block. Wait till it happens to one of our players, and this town will be all upset and crying about it.

Posted by: WhinersRUs | September 6, 2008 3:10 PM | Report abuse

Shawn Springs steals money and laughs about it on the sidelines. No surprise there.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 6, 2008 3:13 PM | Report abuse

Zorn didn't throw any players under the bus...he, as the head coach, said the same things we said as fans

Posted by: Cheyenne, WY | September 6, 2008 6:56 AM

After being used to JG taking the blame and praising his players efforts even when their performance was bad its hard to get used to Zorn saying negative things about individual performances.

The difference is that the players don't need to respect the fan's opinions like they do Zorn's. I just don't think its good to be criticizing the players when his decisions and leadership were so questionable during the game.

Posted by: will_ga | September 6, 2008 3:14 PM | Report abuse

What a dirty sob.

Posted by: A. Garay | September 6, 2008 3:15 PM | Report abuse

+++Somebody mentioned Tom Cruise when I commented how Snyder was basically a failure at life. Well, after Tropic Thunder, that is WRONG, WRONG, WRONG! The Tom is back!!

Posted by: Carl Williams | September 6, 2008 1:24 PM+++

Great performance as a fat bald studio exec. Not exactly "back" for Tom, tho, more like trading in his leading man clout for Veteran Character Actor status.

It will elongate his career and help his image (by making fun of his image), but the days of automatic greenlights for "Tom Cruise Projects" is over. Another old vet Snyder acquired who didn't pan out as hoped.

Posted by: Corkczar | September 6, 2008 3:22 PM | Report abuse

I just don't think its good to be criticizing the players when his decisions and leadership were so questionable during the game.

Posted by: will_ga | September 6, 2008 3:14 PM

He was even-handed in criticizing himself, too, but yeah, what's the point in calling out your players in the press? I can't see anything that can be gained by it, and a lot can be lost. Not a good idea.

Posted by: talent evaluator | September 6, 2008 3:22 PM | Report abuse

Joe Gibbs is Joe Legend. He had this team steaming hot at the end of the season, and they just fell a tad short. If he were in the saddle we would be 1-0 instead of the only team with a losing record in the entire league. Joe knows ball.

Posted by: Greg | September 6, 2008 3:29 PM | Report abuse


Mr. redskin21, classily posts....

"I don't care if Samuels did it intentionally or not.

Someone needs to remind Kiwanuka that:

A) Chris Samuels' job is to protect his team's QB.

B) Chris Samuels' job is NOT to ensure Mathias Kiwanuka stays healthy so he can keep playing and collect his paycheck.

C) If Kiwanuka cannot grasp B he should find himself another line of work."

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | September 6, 2008 3:03 PM

WHILE IN BIZARRO WORLD..

Kareem McKenzie of the Giants did the same thing to Jason Taylor and "Mr.Giant21" posted...

++++I don't care if McKensie did it intentionally or not.

Someone needs to remind Taylor that:

A) Kareem McKenzie's' job is to protect his team's QB.

B) Kareem McKenzie' job is NOT to ensure Jason Taylor stays healthy so he can keep playing and collect his paycheck.

C) If Taylor cannot grasp B he should find himself another line of work.

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | September 6, 2008 3:03 PM+++

Posted by: Corkczar | September 6, 2008 3:29 PM | Report abuse

So you guys won't mind it if opposing teams start falling onto the back of Jason Taylor's sprained knee and Andre Carter's ankles. Easy way to prevent sacks, just end the other person's career.

Posted by: Conan the Cimmerian | September 6, 2008 3:29 PM | Report abuse

We don't have to worry about other teams falling on our players, they can beat us without imitating Conrad Dobler at the bottom of a dog pile. Greg, you are right about Gibbs, he had this thing moving in the right direction, till he pulled the rug out from under himself. And he wasn't some quitter when the inevitable down cycle hit our team...er at least I wish that were true.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 6, 2008 3:34 PM | Report abuse

Don't bail on Campbell just yet!

Interesting stats from the Seahawks website from Matt Hasselback's first year in Seattle (under Zorn):

*For those who might have forgotten, Seattle traded the 10th overall pick and a 3rd rounder for Hasselback and the Packers' 1st rounder (17th overall - subsequently used to take Steve Hutchinson).

from Seahawks site:

2001: Opened season as starter for Seahawks and finished starting 12 of 13 games played. Attempted 321 passes completing 176 (54.8%) for 2,023 yards, seven touchdowns, and eight interceptions for a 70.9 rating. Rushed 40 times for 141 yards, most rushing yards for Seahawks by a quarterback since Rick Mirer’s 191 in 1996. Had a string of 123 pass attempts without an interception, tied for the seventh-longest streak in team history. Did not start versus Jacksonville (10/7) or Denver (10/14) because of a groin injury suffered at Oakland (9/30). Did not start final two games of the season at San Diego (12/30) or versus Kansas City (1/6/02) due to a shoulder injury. Returned from groin injury to start versus Miami and had finest game of the season, completing 16 of 28 attempts for 230 yards and two touchdowns for a 107.7 rating. Completed six of 12 passes for 127 yards and two interceptions at Washington (11/4), but was relieved by Trent Dilfer to open the second half. Versus Oakland (11/11), complemented Shaun Alexander’s 266-yard rushing performance by completing 15 of 23 passes for 181 yards and a touchdown. Attempted a career-high 37 passes at Denver for a career-high 243 yards with one touchdown and two interceptions.

2002: Started 10 games after entering camp as the team’s second quarterback behind Dilfer. Started the season opener at Oakland (9/8) for Dilfer (knee) before taking over the remainder of the season after Dilfer suffered a season-ending Achilles injury at Dallas (10/27). Completed 267 of 419 passes for 3,075 yards, 15 touchdowns, and 10 interceptions for an 87.8 passer rating. Passed for more than 300 yards four times and surpassed 400 yards twice, both club records for a single season. Set team marks for completions (36) and yards (449) at San Diego (12/29) after attempting a franchise-record 55 passes at San Francisco (12/1). Completion percentage (63.7) was tops in the NFC (5th NFL) and 87.8 passer rating was second in the NFC (6th NFL). Led an offense that averaged an NFL-high 476 yards per game over the final six games, which included a franchise-record three 500-yard games. Guided club to victory in four of final six contests, including final three, the second-most consecutive victories to close out a season and most since five in 1986. Versus Kansas City (11/24), completed 25 of 36 passes for a then career-high and NFL week 12 best 362 yards with a career-best three touchdowns for a 129.6 rating. The career performance only lasted one week after passing for a franchise-record 427 yards on a club-high 55 attempts at San Francisco (12/1). Set a personal high with 30 completions, third-most in team annals, while tying a personal mark with three touchdown passes. Became just the second quarterback in team history to throw for 300 yards in back-to-back games, joining Zorn who did it twice (1979 & 1981), and the first Seahawks quarterback to throw for multiple 300-yard games in the same season since Krieg in 1985. Led team to 32 first downs versus Kansas City, and combined with the Chiefs’ 32 set an NFL record for most in one game (64). Also led Seattle to 534 total yards in that game, first time eclipsing 500 team yards since October 26, 1997, versus Oakland. Led team to 507 yards versus San Francisco, the first time Seattle had ever posted back-to-back 500-yard games. Passed for 303 yards and a touchdown versus St. Louis (12/22) and 298 yards with a touchdown at Atlanta (12/15). In record-breaking season finale at San Diego, scored first-career rushing touchdown on a 1-yarder with one second remaining in regulation to send the game into overtime.

2003: Validated one of the finest seasons by a quarterback in club history with a trip to the Pro Bowl after leading club to first-ever undefeated home record. Finished the season second in the NFC with a franchise-record 3,841 passing yards (behind Marc Bulger’s 3,845) and tied Brad Johnson for second with 26 touchdown passes behind Favre (32). Passer rating of 88.8 tied Aaron Brooks for third in the conference behind Daunte Culpepper (96.4) and Favre (90.4), while his rating on third down (107.3) was second in the NFC (3rd NFL). In addition to setting the club record for most passing yards in a single season (surpassing Warren Moon’s 1997 total—3,678), he tied Moon’s single-season club record for most completions (313). Tied own record for most 300-yard games in a season (4). Total of 26 touchdown passes ranked third on the club’s all-time single-season list, while becoming the first quarterback since Mirer in 1993 to start all 16 games. Posted at least an 85.0 passer rating 10 times, including the opener versus New Orleans (9/7) where a 99.4 rating was the result of two touchdowns and no interceptions. Had another two-touchdown performance (110.6 rating) the following week at Arizona (9/14) that included touchdown passes of 55 and 66 yards to Darrell Jackson. Led Seattle back from a 23-10 fourth-quarter deficit to defeat St. Louis (9/21) 24-23. Completed a 3-yard touchdown pass to Koren Robinson with one minute to play for the go-ahead score. Also rushed for season-high 28 yards in that game. Led team to a Sunday night football victory over San Francisco (10/12). Led team on another game-winning drive versus Chicago (10/19) after directing a seven-play, 72-yard drive that resulted in the go-ahead touchdown with :58 to go. Completed 19 of 27 passes for 215 yards, a touchdown, and interception in that game. Passed for season-high 347 yards and tied season high with 26 completions at Cincinnati (10/26), but also threw a season-high three interceptions after attempting a season-high 43 passes. Enjoyed a sweet November compiling a 107.4 passer rating during the month after tossing 11 touchdowns to just two interceptions. Led Seattle to a 3-0 home record during the month, passed for at least 300 yards three times, and took Seattle’s offense from 11th to fourth overall. Against Pittsburgh (11/2), posted a 152.1 rating in the second half completing 10 of 15 passes for 139 yards and a touchdown. Posted career-best completion percentage (75.0, 21 of 28) versus Detroit (11/16). Earned NFL/FedEx Air Player of the Week in one of the guttiest performances of career at Baltimore (11/23) against the NFL’s third-rated pass defense. Tied Moon’s and Krieg’s team record with five touchdown passes. Completed 23 of 41 passes for 333 yards and a 122.3 passer rating. Connected with Jackson for a career-long 80-yard touchdown. Repeated as NFL/FedEx Air Player of the Week after completing 26 of 35 attempts (74.3%) for 328 yards, three touchdowns, and an interception the following week versus Cleveland’s (11/30) second-rated pass defense. The game marked the first time in Seattle history with a 300-yard passer, 100-yard rusher (Alexander-127), and two 100-yard receivers (Robinson-122, Jackson-102). Ended regular season with a 315-yard performance in victory over the 49ers (12/27). Set club postseason record with 305-yard game at Green Bay (1/4/04). Also set club postseason records with 25 completions and 45 attempts.

Let's give JC a chance folks! Oh, and in case you were wondering, Matt Hasselback is 6'4 225 lbs. Not all that different from JC. (Course JC has a better arm)

Posted by: almost famous | September 6, 2008 3:34 PM | Report abuse

I didn't think Samuels' play was dirty. I thought it was illegal, the oline can't just tackle the dlineman. If there wasn't a flag there should've been one. It just looked like a desperation move by Samuels to protect his QB after he got beat.

Posted by: skinswest | September 6, 2008 3:35 PM | Report abuse

OK Skinswest you can run the team down but when the bandwagon gets fired up by December, don't moan if we quote your words back to you.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 6, 2008 3:38 PM | Report abuse

If it was deliberate, then it was illegal. If it was deliberate, then it was dirty.
Hoculi was right there, it looked like it was in his line of sight, he threw no flag.
Therefore, I assume that it was not deliberate. But YMMV... the TV isn't the complete picture, and refs don't always see everything (shocking, I know).

Posted by: cload & daggar | September 6, 2008 3:45 PM | Report abuse

Corkczar, it has nothing to do with "class," it's the reality of the situation.

It's a contact sport.

Lame parallelisms don't change that.

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | September 6, 2008 3:47 PM | Report abuse

Almost Famous,
Reading your book-length post has required me to have a lie down and 2 Excedrin. Please keep it to a short story next time.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 6, 2008 3:50 PM | Report abuse

But if you WANT a parallelism, I already provided one earlier:

"I didn't hear Clinton Portis whining like a girl after Gerris Wilkinson and Antonio Pierce decided to unload on him after he was already down."

Portis wasn't injured (although Wilkinson was flagged for unnecessary roughness) and Kiwanuka wasn't injured either.

Now, which one of them spent the post-game whining about their respective incidents?

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | September 6, 2008 3:52 PM | Report abuse

almost famous your post reminds me that we're going to have watch the growing pains of this offense. As fans we shouldn't be so quick to jump on the easy bus that the Post and other local media would want us to board. This offense is going to struggle most of this year, howevr I look to the Vikings and Packers, both who recently had new coaches who brought ttheir version of the WCO to those respective teams. It took both clubs a couple of years to get cranked up, now both teams are mentioned as possible SB teams.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 6, 2008 3:58 PM | Report abuse

Anonymous--I met most of the regulars at the shabingus, so folks know who I am. You? We're not so sure. Anyway, every once in a while I get off a good one.

Posted by: talent evaluator | September 6, 2008 2:06 PM

Evaluator, I was about to post with my regular name and a "my bad" as I was very tired and sometimes forget to put in my name, but then I read your smart ass reply and decided to just say "f@_k it."

Still a very funny post, Vinny.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 6, 2008 4:10 PM | Report abuse

But if you WANT a parallelism, I already provided one earlier:

"I didn't hear Clinton Portis whining like a girl after Gerris Wilkinson and Antonio Pierce decided to unload on him after he was already down."

From the replay, Portis' knees weren't down, and the ref didn't blow the whistle, yet. Pierce's hit wasn't even close to being a personal foul.

Posted by: WhinersRUs | September 6, 2008 4:11 PM | Report abuse

F Larry Michael

Posted by: V. Cerrato | September 6, 2008 4:12 PM | Report abuse

From the replay, Portis' knees weren't down, and the ref didn't blow the whistle, yet. Pierce's hit wasn't even close to being a personal foul.

Posted by: WhinersRUs | September 6, 2008 4:11 PM
__________________________________

Even Madden originally called it on Pierce, even with the slo-mo replay, and Wilkinson WAS flagged for it.

What was Samuels flagged for?

LOL... Only on RI can you find knuckleheads worrying and whining about other team's players - who themselves whine and worry about being hit, clipped, shoved, smacked, etc., in a pro football game.

Imagine that.

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | September 6, 2008 4:14 PM | Report abuse

Several articles, including today's, Zorn mentions how he wants Campbell to adjust. I'l go back to what I mentioned before, Campbell seems over-coached. Let him be as natural as he can. Tweaks can work, but major changes usually don't.

One back story that no one has mentioned. Vinny loves the WCO and he brought Zorn in to implement it. Gibbs brought in Campbell, a Doug Williams sort. Not a WCO sort.

The mismatch between Gibbs' philosophy and Cerrato's philosophy is playing out now. I'm sure there have been some casualties along the way -- and perhaps more to come. Saunders? GG? Campbell's career? Zorn? Pure speculation on my part, but it does fit together.

My recollection is that several years ago, Jerry Krause (the GM) wanted more credit for Jordan's Bulls being so successful. He felt he was a smart b-ball guy and he knew how to be successful. Of course, after Jordan and Pippen left, Krause proved he wasn't any better than the average GM. I see some parallels here. Mgmt's egos are bigger than their accomplishments.

Posted by: AL Zeke etc | September 6, 2008 4:15 PM | Report abuse

Now, which one of them spent the post-game whining about their respective incidents?

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | September 6, 2008 3:52 PM

I'm sure this whole city will be crying foul when someone breaks CP/JT/AC/JC's legs/ankles doing a Chris Samuels.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 6, 2008 4:16 PM | Report abuse

Even Madden originally called it on Pierce, even with the slo-mo replay, and Wilkinson WAS flagged for it.

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | September 6, 2008 4:14 PM

Madden gets EVERY play call right... CP wasn't down, he was laying on someone.

Posted by: WhinersRUs | September 6, 2008 4:20 PM | Report abuse

I'm sure this whole city will be crying foul when someone breaks CP/JT/AC/JC's legs/ankles doing a Chris Samuels.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 6, 2008 4:16 PM
__________________________________________

Always the optimist, eh?

Save the karma claims for the Fortune Teller's tent at the county fair.

Personally, I never worried about Sean Taylor jacking someone up - whether the person who was jacked up thought it was "fair" or not - having it come back to haunt the Redskins.

That seems to be a decidedly stupid (not to mention illogical and superstitious) way to approach the most violent of sports.

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | September 6, 2008 4:23 PM | Report abuse

Madden gets EVERY play call right... CP wasn't down, he was laying on someone.

Posted by: WhinersRUs | September 6, 2008 4:20 PM
__________________________________

Even Madden originally called it on Pierce, even with the slo-mo replay, and Wilkinson WAS flagged for it.

Just let me know which part of "Wilkinson WAS flagged for it" you didn't understand.

:)

Posted by: Anonymous | September 6, 2008 4:24 PM | Report abuse

Nope, nothing bad can happen from Samuels diving at knees.

Posted by: A. Garay | September 6, 2008 4:24 PM | Report abuse

Completely unrelated to Redskin's link to chad85's name change. I am so glad we didn't get him.
http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/years/2008/0905081ocho1.html

(his kids include Chad II, Chade, and Cha'iel).-Apparently, some of Chad's ancestors were from Krypton.

Posted by: will_ga | September 6, 2008 4:26 PM | Report abuse

Nope, nothing bad can happen from Samuels diving at knees.

Posted by: A. Garay | September 6, 2008 4:24 PM
______________________________

Yes. What we need here in DC is a starting LT who will put the safety and health of his opponent ahead of that of his QB.

Then we'll have Good Karma. Then we'll be well-liked. Then we'll win many games.

Selah.

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | September 6, 2008 4:28 PM | Report abuse

Just let me know which part of "Wilkinson WAS flagged for it" you didn't understand.

:)

Posted by: Anonymous | September 6, 2008 4:24 PM

So CP's knees aren't down, and Wilkinson is supposed to not do anything? The refs should of blown the whistle to stop play.

Posted by: WhinersRUs | September 6, 2008 4:29 PM | Report abuse

So CP's knees aren't down, and Wilkinson is supposed to not do anything? The refs should of blown the whistle to stop play.

Posted by: WhinersRUs | September 6, 2008 4:29 PM
____________________

Which game did you watch?

Pierce was arguably late with his hit on Portis, then, a WEEK LATER, Wilkinson came in and piled on; the whistle had already blown, and he was immediately flagged for unnecessary roughness.

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | September 6, 2008 4:33 PM | Report abuse

Play until the whistle blows. Nope, never heard of it.

Posted by: D. Snyder | September 6, 2008 4:36 PM | Report abuse

The refs did blow the whistle for the Pierce and Wilkinson play; that's why it was a foul.

There would have been a flag on Samuels for holding had there been time left. Understand - unless it's a defensive penalty, the game doesn't go on when time expires without a kickoff (overtime). Therefore, they don't call penalties on the offense on the last play of the game unless it's before the snap.

And nobody's really explained why that's so dangerous and yet a normal lower wrap up tackle by the defense isn't similar (especially if the defensive player is huge).

Posted by: Karen | September 6, 2008 4:37 PM | Report abuse

I agree that the Skins were awful. But then I started looking at things from a different perspective. JC was horrible and still completed 15 of 27(?). That's pretty good for horrible. The line gave up 1 sack (could have been 2-3). That's also not horrible. The defense adjusted after a terribe start and gave up 17 points. That's not bad.

THE REAL PROBLEM: The Skins don't have a 3rd receiver. Even Gibbs, who loves Thrash, knew this was the case. His solution, Brandon L., sucked...but he diagnosed the problem correctly. Everybody keeps looking at the QB. I guarantee you, even if you had Brett Favre, this offense would struggle without a third receeiver. I have confidence that JC will get better, but the known unknown is whether we will find a third receiver before it's too late to salvage the season.

Posted by: Prodigal Son | September 6, 2008 4:40 PM | Report abuse

I didn't think Samuels' play was dirty. I thought it was illegal, the oline can't just tackle the dlineman. If there wasn't a flag there should've been one. It just looked like a desperation move by Samuels to protect his QB after he got beat.

Posted by: skinswest | September 6, 2008 3:35 PM
There was a flag, as there should have been. It looked to me like Sameuls lost his balance when spinning, and took a swipe at his ankles, which is holding. I did not think it was a dirty play or an attempt to hurt him.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 6, 2008 4:40 PM | Report abuse

Jason Taylor plays like he wears roller skates.

Posted by: Conan the Cimmerian | September 6, 2008 4:40 PM | Report abuse

4:40 Anon was me.

Posted by: frediefritz | September 6, 2008 4:41 PM | Report abuse

Brandon Jacobs should have been flagged for attempted murder when he trucked Laron Landry.

Posted by: Whambulance | September 6, 2008 4:44 PM | Report abuse

Prodigal - I agree with the 1st paragraph. I disagree with the second. The main problem on offense was that nobody knew where the sticks were. When you complete passes but are continually 1-3 yards short of the first down, you've got a different problem than not having a third receiver. The defense was simply horrible in that they had stone hands. Without stone hands, we easily win.

Posted by: Karen | September 6, 2008 4:45 PM | Report abuse

I agree the short of a first down passes were a problem but I think that's a symptom of not having a third receiver who can beat a third cornerback consistently. If you have a stud third WR, you don't throw those dinky passes.

Posted by: Prodigal Son | September 6, 2008 4:49 PM | Report abuse

The Skins don't have a 3rd receiver.

Posted by: Prodigal Son | September 6, 2008 4:40 PM

The 'Skins drafted two guys in hopes one would be the third receiver. Neither guy has been on the field much because they reported out of shape.

Look for McMullen to come in as the third receiver this week.

Posted by: talent evaluator | September 6, 2008 4:52 PM | Report abuse

McMullen is a stopgap, he's not a solution.

Posted by: Prodigal Son | September 6, 2008 4:54 PM | Report abuse

Prodigal Son

I agree with you. Our WRs are a major problem. Good call to say Gibbs saw it but his attempt (Lloyd) to solve it didn't work. Who solves the problem. Thrash doesn't. Kelly and Thomas might solve this somewhere down the road (though the odds are they don't). I've been very pro-Boldin (much to the dismay of others) because he is a solution, both near term and long term.

Still, I'd say the WRs are our third biggest problem.
1. Intensity (that was the real disaster from my viewpoint)
2. Coach and QB not on the same page
3. WRs
4. OL

The defense is going to be OK (though injuries can always screw that up). The special teams look to be OK as well.

Posted by: AL Zeke etc | September 6, 2008 4:56 PM | Report abuse

JC doesn't look comfortable and often looks lost out there.. I know, I know, the 5th offensive sysytem in 5 years etc.. blah, blah, blah.
I, like most professionals have to contantly learn new systems, and trends, and products to comptete. For crying out loud, it's his job! It all comes across as another excuse for a subpar QB.
The rabid base of fans has to take off their rose colored lenses and see what is going on.
Mediocre at best QB, 1 good, not great receiver= Moss. CP is good, not great anymore. average D-line, below average O-line, and yet the braintrust drafts three players that can barely get on the field, and can't even overtake a career back-up, Thrash.

Here's another long season, but if you keep going, the Danny will keep getting richer!
It's hard being a skins fan especially since I'm old enough to remember them actually winning.

Posted by: longsufferingskinsfan | September 5, 2008 7:19 PM

Longsuffering, I feel your pain. I'm in the same boat, remembering those long-gone glory days. But every QB who has played in the Bill Walsh system whom I've heard talk about it (and that includes some great ones, like Steve Young), has said that it takes a QB a considerable amount of time to get good at it. JC has exactly one regular season game of experience in this offense.

Here's the thing: If we're going to do anything this year as a team, it will be with JC at QB. Colt isn't ready yet, and Todd is an excellent backup, but doesn't have the arm to be a starting QB in this league (and, besides, he was even worse during the preseason than JC was).

JC needs at least a full year in this system before a reliable evaluation can be made as to whether he can make it work, or whether the 'Skins need to look for another QB. I've seen enough improvement in his game to make me believe that he can still be a winning QB in this league. I say let's be patient for this season. If, at the end, he still isn't getting it done, then let's start grooming Colt, or get someone else.

Posted by: rbpalmer | September 6, 2008 4:59 PM | Report abuse

Zeke:

Agree. But I can see how they will solve the first two. The WR problem is the harder nut to crack.

Posted by: Prodigal Son | September 6, 2008 4:59 PM | Report abuse

Didn't see enuf of the preseason to make a call on McMullen. Seems the folks on this board who did see him were mixed, but more favorable than not. His numbers were good plus he's played in the NFL. Unless the Spaghetti Gang has something up their sleeve (ie Boldin), a stopgap would prove very helpful to this team.

Posted by: AL Zeke etc | September 6, 2008 5:00 PM | Report abuse

Samuels makes me proud.

Posted by: C. Dobler | September 6, 2008 5:01 PM | Report abuse

Zeke:

Agree again about using McMullen as a stopgap since I think he's better than Thrash. But again, saying he's better than Thrash is damning with faint praise (btw...I like Thrash overall, just not as our third WR)

Posted by: prodigal Son | September 6, 2008 5:04 PM | Report abuse

as it stands now your 3rd option at receiver is Cooley...I don't expect the skins to make the playoffs, but I hope to see something positive by the end of the year to build on

Posted by: sickcuz | September 6, 2008 5:06 PM | Report abuse

Just for the record, I think Jason Campbell is capable of being a good and perhaps very good NFL QB.

As legend has it, Joe Theismann had a heart to heart with Joe Gibbs in Gibbs first year as coach. Gibbs came from San Diego, the Air Coryell offense with HOF QB Dan Fouts. Theismann told Gibbs, "I can't be Dan Fouts. This offense needs to work with what I can do, not what Fouts can do"

Jason Campbell may need to have a similar conversation with Jim Zorn.

Posted by: AL Zeke etc | September 6, 2008 5:06 PM | Report abuse

Still, I'd say the WRs are our third biggest problem.
1. Intensity (that was the real disaster from my viewpoint)
2. Coach and QB not on the same page
3. WRs
4. OL

The defense is going to be OK (though injuries can always screw that up). The special teams look to be OK as well.

Posted by: AL Zeke etc | September 6, 2008 4:56 PM

I agree with the assessment. I don't really understand why the intensity wasn't there but it wasn't.

Posted by: will_ga | September 6, 2008 5:07 PM | Report abuse

and it's funny to see folks on here crying about Gibbs left us...considering the ST tragedy and his young grandson fighting his illness, it made perfect sense

Posted by: sickcuz | September 6, 2008 5:07 PM | Report abuse

what's the deal with Fred Davis

Posted by: sickcuz | September 6, 2008 5:08 PM | Report abuse

Prodigal, yes and no. When your 1 and 2 wide outs come up 1-2 yards short of the first down, that's just receiver stupidity. There were a number of things that Madden got right in his mineutia - 2 false starts on ARE, unacceptable; multiple receivers coming up just shy of the first down, unacceptable and mainly on the receivers.

Posted by: Karen | September 6, 2008 5:29 PM | Report abuse

and it's funny to see folks on here crying about Gibbs left us...considering the ST tragedy and his young grandson fighting his illness, it made perfect sense

Posted by: sickcuz | September 6, 2008 5:07 PM

Considering that he had another year on his contract and that he didn't give the owner any notice he was even thinking of leaving it seemed like a pretty scummy move from a devout Christian who thinks he has so much integrity.

Posted by: motivator | September 6, 2008 5:33 PM | Report abuse

Come on motivator, this has nothing to do with religious beliefs. think about it from the aspect of dealing with the loss of Sean Taylor, then reflecting on the time he's missing with his young grandson

Posted by: sickcuz | September 6, 2008 5:35 PM | Report abuse

The WR's have butterfingers, and the CB's have hands of stone. JC could of used help from the play makers to, you know, make plays.

Posted by: Whambulance | September 6, 2008 5:39 PM | Report abuse

Prodigal, Our D gave up 16 points not 17. One TD and 3 field goals....2 of those field goals not happening if Smoot and Rogers had made the INTs.

Posted by: Lisa | September 6, 2008 6:13 PM | Report abuse

Just for the record, I think Jason Campbell is capable of being a good and perhaps very good NFL QB.

As legend has it, Joe Theismann had a heart to heart with Joe Gibbs in Gibbs first year as coach. Gibbs came from San Diego, the Air Coryell offense with HOF QB Dan Fouts. Theismann told Gibbs, "I can't be Dan Fouts. This offense needs to work with what I can do, not what Fouts can do"

Jason Campbell may need to have a similar conversation with Jim Zorn.

Posted by: AL Zeke etc | September 6, 2008 5:06 PM

LOL you can't be serious? Show me one thing Campbell has shown that he is a good Qb? Everytime Campbell plays from the last system to this system...HE CAN'T MOVE THE OFFENSE..PERIOD!

Posted by: Leevi | September 6, 2008 6:14 PM | Report abuse

Why don't you QB the team Leevi - since you think you know everything!!!! Hilarious!

Posted by: Anon | September 6, 2008 6:39 PM | Report abuse

Here's the thing: If we're going to do anything this year as a team, it will be with JC at QB. Colt isn't ready yet, and Todd is an excellent backup, but doesn't have the arm to be a starting QB in this league (and, besides, he was even worse during the preseason than JC was).

JC needs at least a full year in this system before a reliable evaluation can be made as to whether he can make it work, or whether the 'Skins need to look for another QB. I've seen enough improvement in his game to make me believe that he can still be a winning QB in this league. I say let's be patient for this season. If, at the end, he still isn't getting it done, then let's start grooming Colt, or get someone else.


Posted by: rbpalmer

I don't disagree. We have no one else to go to realistically at QB. I think that speaks volumes about the FO. JC is a nice young man, but that doesn't mean he was made for the WCO. Zorn wants a certain style of QB, back, and WR's. I think it may be 3 years before he gets the players he wants. I do, contrary to some people's opinion, fell like Snydey/Cerrato will be patient with Zorn. Time will tell.

Posted by: longsufferingskinsfan | September 6, 2008 7:01 PM | Report abuse

This season will be known as "The Curse of Tyler Ecker" Vinny offers the guy a spot on the practice squad and then leaves him hanging.

What Vinny did not know is Tyler was raised as a poor black child in the back alleys of a neighborhood in Haiti and is an expert in the art of VooDoo dolls.

Posted by: Revolving Door | September 6, 2008 7:51 PM | Report abuse


I think they'd be better off to let Colt take the offense and take his licks this year since this is clearly a rebuilding project. Short term, it's hell; in the long-term, it's probably best for the team. JC is just not a fit. The longer the wait, the longer the rebuild. JC looks just he did in his very first outing. In many ways not his fault; in other aspects it clearly is. The Doug Williams analogy may be apt, but I think JC has more skills than Doug ever had. Doug really had only one standout quarter in his career; the remainder was simply putting in his time. But oh what a quarter that was! Anyway, tough old world Mr. Campbell, but that's the way it goes.

Posted by: 4th in the East | September 6, 2008 8:49 PM | Report abuse

I am learning Joe Gibbs was a alot smarter than I realized.

Posted by: RedskinRay1 | September 6, 2008 1:34 PM

No your just a lot more of an idiot than you realized. Now go stick your head up your a$$.....see if it fits.

Posted by: Jack Venom | September 6, 2008 2:32 PM

Wow, Jack, no substance, not even an attempt; just name-calling and "venom".

You don't think Gibbs was wise in how he dealt w/ players, criticized them?
You don't already see a contrast that is stark?

Perhaps you might wish to locate the actual location of your own head?

Posted by: RedskinRay1 | September 6, 2008 10:22 PM | Report abuse

I'll show you.....I'll show you all!!!!

Just remember I told you....

Posted by: jason campbell | September 6, 2008 11:05 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: 4th in the East | September 6, 2008 8:49 PM

Your leash on JC is like Gibbs on Ramsey. Let's bench Campbell after 1 game in a new offense for the project Colt Brennan. One of the dumbest posts I have read in months. Campbell may not be the answer but to throw in the towel completely after 1 game is loser mentality.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 6, 2008 11:05 PM | Report abuse

Never be too quick to judge. Remember, God waits till the end.

Posted by: GLFLVER3 | September 6, 2008 11:14 PM | Report abuse

Never be too quick to judge. Remember, God waits till the end.

Harvey Penick

Posted by: GLFLVER3 | September 6, 2008 11:15 PM | Report abuse

Just announced....The 2008 VH1 Hip Hop Honorees

1) Naughty by Nature
2) De La Soul
3) Too Short
4) Slick Rick


YEAHHHHHHHH!!!!!


Is RI familiar with any of these legends?

Posted by: sicwidit | September 6, 2008 11:20 PM | Report abuse

it's only been one game, you idiots.

Posted by: Anon | September 6, 2008 11:24 PM | Report abuse

Plenty good players under 30: name ten – I give you plenty – name 5 and it is enough – make sure you exclude Cerrato’s draft picks this year!

Posted by: johnbear1 | September 6, 2008 2:48 PM
_____________________________________________

1. Ladell Betts
2. Andre Carter
3. Rock Cartright
4. Chris Cooley
5. Santana Moss
6. Clinton Portis
7. Antwaan Randle El
8. Fred Smoot
9. Laron Landry
10.Rocky McIntosh

And there are other players under 30 upon whom this team is depending a great deal, who have fared well at times.

Shuan Suisham
Anthony Montgomery
Kedric Golston
Lorenzo Alexander
Stephon Heyer
Chris Wilson
Khary Campbell
Jason Campbell

Posted by: RedskinRay1 | September 6, 2008 11:29 PM | Report abuse

I guess I don't totally understand why some are calling for JC's head and his butt on the bench after one game in a brand new offense. Colt Brennan may very well become a good or even great QB but right now how is he possibly the solution? He'll play and do a lot of stupid things and then everyone will be yelling for his head.
Todd Collins isn't a serious option.

I can't remember who said it above and several have said it before but I think the notion that JC is being overcoached is not a bad one. He spent a year trying to learn the 700 page Saunders system but was handcuffed by Gibbs and now he has to learn WCO at the NFL level which isn't a walk in the park. Name one QB rookie or otherwise who walked into the WCO and was good or even average in his first go round. Especially with having to learn and unlearn a whole load of crap.
In civilian jobs if you are indtroduced to new technology for example it takes a while to get a hang of it and I'm sure there are any number of hamsters up here who hit the wrong button so to speak and SNAFUed their office for a day. Should you be fired at that point?
Or what if your kid goes to school and fails a test even though they studied really hard. Would you like me as a teacher to send them home and say you know what they're just not cut out to be a student dont' bother letting them come back.
We've had 15 years of heartbreak and slogging and endurance. We can wait this out for some games.

Posted by: sfskin | September 6, 2008 11:38 PM | Report abuse

Eleventy-seven. Tryon

Posted by: Anonymous | September 6, 2008 11:39 PM | Report abuse

sfskin, I think you are right on target. JC - and his WRs - are starting over....yet again....

I also think JC has been "overcoached" - Of course I know nothing about coaching :) But JC did say after the game the other night that they need to just let loose and play ball. The poor kid is under tremendous pressure from everywhere...no wonder he hesitates and "overthinks."

Posted by: Lisa | September 6, 2008 11:51 PM | Report abuse

Diagnosing the skins is like trying to figure out what this could have happened to this woman.
I mean, I'm sure there's a reason, but clearly not one that's explained by normal, human behavior.

Posted by: cload & daggar | September 6, 2008 11:53 PM | Report abuse

The 'poor kid' is a football player. He's under pressure to succeed, but the pressure is to do well ($), not save his job. The Todd and The Dolt are no threat.
However, it's clear he is risk-averse as tends to hesitate. He's been pretty consistent doing this. He checks down so often -- last year and this -- that he's become the anti-Brett Favre. I'm not sure I want JC to force things the Favre way, but I'll take a few interceptions for a more dangerous offense.
There are a few decent plays from Thursday that I'd focus JC on. I'd even be tempted to show some tape of Favre.

Posted by: cload & daggar | September 7, 2008 12:15 AM | Report abuse

+++Corkczar, it has nothing to do with "class," it's the reality of the situation.

It's a contact sport.

Lame parallelisms don't change that.

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | September 6, 2008 3:47 PM+++

Congrats. You know the term "sport."

Now look up sportsmanship.

I'm always impressed by some brave poster trotting out machor phrases like: "it's a contact sport." Tell you what, why don't you tell Kiwanuka to his face he should try another sport. I'm sure he'd get a big chuckle, probably invite you out for a brew with him.

Samuels is not a dirty player, and what he did was likely from exhaustion mixed with frustration and bad judgement.


Posted by: Corkczar | September 7, 2008 12:17 AM | Report abuse

LOL you can't be serious? Show me one thing Campbell has shown that he is a good Qb? Everytime Campbell plays from the last system to this system...HE CAN'T MOVE THE OFFENSE..PERIOD!

Posted by: Leevi | September 6, 2008 6:14 PM

This may be the most retarded statement made on here. I seem to recall JC moving the offense quite well last year. The problem was finishing it off. That offense moved up and down the field at will, just imploded in the redzone. See, you're thinking is clouded by the Todd's games. JC was NOT ineffective moving the ball, he was ineffective IN THE RED ZONE. That takes maturation and confidence to cure. In other words TIME.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | September 7, 2008 12:21 AM | Report abuse

This may be the most retarded statement made on here.

Hmm, I tend to vote for the 'fire Danny' posts myself.

Posted by: cload & daggar | September 7, 2008 12:23 AM | Report abuse

+++THis was VERY FUNNY!!! I has to be from a FAKE poster. Talent Evaluator (rumored to be Cerrato) ISN'T that funny.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 6, 2008 1:55 PM

Anonymous--I met most of the regulars at the shabingus, so folks know who I am. You? We're not so sure. Anyway, every once in a while I get off a good one.

Posted by: talent evaluator | September 6, 2008 2:06 PM+++

Yes, TE Isn't Cerrato, he just plays him on this blog..

we kid because we love.

Seriously...Johnbear is Cerrato, not TE.

Posted by: Corkczar | September 7, 2008 12:24 AM | Report abuse

This may be the most retarded statement made on here.

Hmm, I tend to vote for the 'fire Danny' posts myself.

Posted by: cload & daggar | September 7, 2008 12:23 AM

Yea, that's pretty retarded too.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | September 7, 2008 12:25 AM | Report abuse

Seriously...Johnbear is Cerrato, not TE.
Cerrato spending time here rather than making plashes would be an improvement, right?

Posted by: cload & daggar | September 7, 2008 1:03 AM | Report abuse

LOL you can't be serious? Show me one thing Campbell has shown that he is a good Qb? Everytime Campbell plays from the last system to this system...HE CAN'T MOVE THE OFFENSE..PERIOD!

Posted by: Leevi | September 6, 2008 6:14 PM

This may be the most retarded statement made on here. I seem to recall JC moving the offense quite well last year. The problem was finishing it off. That offense moved up and down the field at will, just imploded in the redzone. See, you're thinking is clouded by the Todd's games. JC was NOT ineffective moving the ball, he was ineffective IN THE RED ZONE. That takes maturation and confidence to cure. In other words TIME.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | September 7, 2008 12:21 AM

Your post makes even less sense.The ball doesn't change shape once it's in the red zone. If you don't score points then what is the point? Collins (106 rating in '07) bailed out #17 (losing record as a starter in '07 w/ a 77 rating )and the team last year. It's pretty much the same team now. JC's rating dropped at least 10 points in the second and fourth qtr last year. He is a choker who should've known how to read a defense in high school and you want to waste/give him more TIME? there are only 16 regular season games. Playoffs AGAIN w/ Collins now and ride Colt next. Both can already read defenses and get the ball off on time. He's the same now as he was then.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZH6eO6mj60Y

Posted by: Realness | September 7, 2008 2:46 AM | Report abuse

Hail to the Redskins and F U JLC, the Redskin INsiders and the Washington Post for not firing them for incompetents!

Sorry you guys had to burn the bridge.

Your petty, small and have no consideration for your readers.

Your front office rants are tiresome. Grow up and grow a spine JLC!

I've been here since the beginning and I have had enough....so seriously F-OFF!

you're a friggin disgrace to sport journalism.

Hail to the Redskins!!!

Posted by: Longtime Redskin Insider Contributer | September 7, 2008 5:29 AM | Report abuse

And yet you're afraid to sign your post with your actual blog handle, "Longtime Redskin Insider Contributer". 'Sup with that?

Posted by: jon | September 7, 2008 5:47 AM | Report abuse

jon--

You are so naive. The Post can be very vindictive. Cindy is like a pit bull with lipstick. It's best not to use your real name up here. I know a kid who attacked Jasno, and Cindy turned him into Santa Claus and he got no Christmas gifts. For four years.

Another kid attacked Snyder up here. Next time he went to Johnny Rocket's his milkshake was made with water, day-old french fries, and ketchup.

Never trust anyone up here. I'm not even going to post this with my real fake blog name, but will lay the jinx on someone else.

Posted by: talent evaluator | September 7, 2008 7:46 AM | Report abuse

I think the theory of JC being overcoached is a good one. Although I still have my doubts about JC, I think he and this offense need a couple of good drives to build confidence. Also, I'd be coaching up our new WR's to get on the field. Having Thomas on the field the last game was encouraging.

This team will recover.

Posted by: sicwidit | September 7, 2008 7:52 AM | Report abuse

Having Thomas on the field the last game was encouraging.

This team will recover.

Posted by: sicwidit | September 7, 2008 7:52 AM

I do think when Thomas, Kelly, & Davis start contributing JC will look better. Will it be this year, I sure hope so!

Posted by: will_ga | September 7, 2008 8:07 AM | Report abuse

I think JC was trying to say he can't see the receivers because they are so short. Santana Moss could be the Wes Welker of this Offense with a true #1 deep threat.

Posted by: sicwidit | September 7, 2008 8:17 AM | Report abuse

sic,

of course dude....De La Souls 3 Feet High is one of the best albums of all time.

Posted by: chrIS lArry | September 7, 2008 8:28 AM | Report abuse

I saw De La Soul at the Rock the Bells Tour....AWESOME!!!!!

Posted by: sicwidit | September 7, 2008 8:57 AM | Report abuse

this team is going to have a horrible year if they don't pull it together fast. the giants made this game look closer than it was. zorn is going to be one and done - the team look unprepared. bottom line

Posted by: Anonymous | September 7, 2008 9:14 AM | Report abuse

zorn is going to be one and done - the team look unprepared. bottom line

Posted by: Anonymous | September 7, 2008 9:14 AM

Dude--The "bottom line" comes at the end of the year. What you just wrote is the top line.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 7, 2008 9:17 AM | Report abuse

go to this link and hear what Colin Cowherd had to say about the skins. I think some will find it interesting.

http://query-origin.andohs.net/8000A6/content-root3.andomedia.com/origin/mp3/espnradio/insider/herd/herd_09052008_hr1.mp3

Posted by: livingoutsidethebeltway | September 7, 2008 9:18 AM | Report abuse

here's someone that could help, and different than a draft pick, he's a proven playmaker in this league. I don't know how it would be afforded.

Anquan's position right now has been well-documented," Rosenhaus said. "He's not interested in doing a new contract with the team. That (Burress' deal) will have no bearing on his situation."

There are similarities between Burress' situation and Boldin's. Rosenhaus represents both players. Both had three years remaining on their contracts but wanted extensions that would put them among the highest paid receivers in the NFL.
But Rosenhaus said Boldin won't be re-signing with the Cardinals.

"Essentially that bridge has been blown up," Rosenhaus said. "He's looking to play as hard as he can for the club, for his teammates, but the sooner he is traded the better."

Boldin has requested a trade and would like to be dealt before the Oct. 14 trading deadline, Rosenhaus said.

Posted by: longsufferingskinsfan | September 7, 2008 9:38 AM | Report abuse

A lot of thoughts about how Jim Zorn managed the offense, and he will manage his players going forward, but one thing occured to me. In the 4th quarter, when I was screaming at the TV "where's the hurry up offense" - if Jason Campbell was a true leader HE would have called a timeout and gone to the sidelines and said, "um...coach - we need to score twice"

Realizing this, I now know that Jason Campbell is still a long ways from being a superlative quarterback.

Posted by: John D in Houston | September 7, 2008 9:43 AM | Report abuse

John D in Houston do you really think showing up your coach in national TV is a good way to go. I think only a hand full of players/QB could have even imagin to have done that. Zorn is the leader of the team,and the offense. It's his call how to manage the clock. If JC had stepped beyond Zorn's leadership, how much respect do you think Zorn would have among the team. I think in the long run, Zorn will learn from this gaffe and move on.

Posted by: MJ | September 7, 2008 9:52 AM | Report abuse

I say make the Boldin deal happend NOW!!! He's young, big, fast and he can catch. He instantly makes this WR corps better. Does Arizona run the WC offense.

I say give them a conditional 3rd round pick this year and a 6th in 2010.

You've got Boldin and Moss split wide with ARE in the slot and Thrash on Special Teams where he belongs. You bring on Kelly or Thomas in 4 WR sets.

Where's the down side in this?

Posted by: sicwidit | September 7, 2008 9:53 AM | Report abuse

Boldin is going to at least a first round pick I think. He's not dividing the team as yet, (from what I've read he's not that type of player). I don't think there is urgency for the Cardinals to not get appropriate value for Boldin.

Posted by: MJ | September 7, 2008 10:05 AM | Report abuse

Anonymous; go inflate your girlfriend and leave us grownups converse.

There's no way JC has a future with this team. Not because he hasn't got skills. He has. And not because he hasn't got the desire. He has that, to an extent. But JC doesn't have that spark, that almost undefinable something that says I will lead this team to a win when the chips are down. You all saw how he performed in clutch moments last year with the game on the line. That is, he didn't. I've never thought that he was the answer. You see him stand there with his mouth open and his eyes as big as saucers after a play, and you know...

Posted by: 4th in the East | September 7, 2008 10:08 AM | Report abuse

4th in the East I would agree except that people had said the same thing about Eli Manning, Matt Hasselbek, McNabb. Young QB's have to learn how to win. Just like teams have to learn how to win. I think JC will do it, I hope we see him take that step this year.

Posted by: MJ | September 7, 2008 10:15 AM | Report abuse

Your post makes even less sense.The ball doesn't change shape once it's in the red zone. If you don't score points then what is the point? Collins (106 rating in '07) bailed out #17 (losing record as a starter in '07 w/ a 77 rating )and the team last year. It's pretty much the same team now. JC's rating dropped at least 10 points in the second and fourth qtr last year. He is a choker who should've known how to read a defense in high school and you want to waste/give him more TIME? there are only 16 regular season games. Playoffs AGAIN w/ Collins now and ride Colt next. Both can already read defenses and get the ball off on time. He's the same now as he was then.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZH6eO6mj60Y

Posted by: Realness | September 7, 2008 2:46 AM


Why don't you actually pay attention to the conversation. The original post said JC can't move the offense PERIOD and that he never could. You're not even respondeing to the conversation we're having. Realness? Realness is reading comprehension not just posting to see yourself posting. Go back to school or pass your GED then come talk to me.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | September 7, 2008 10:21 AM | Report abuse

OK Skinswest you can run the team down but when the bandwagon gets fired up by December, don't moan if we quote your words back to you.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 6, 2008 3:38 PM

If it was deliberate, then it was illegal. If it was deliberate, then it was dirty.
Hoculi was right there, it looked like it was in his line of sight, he threw no flag.
Therefore, I assume that it was not deliberate. But YMMV... the TV isn't the complete picture, and refs don't always see everything (shocking, I know).

Posted by: cload & daggar | September 6, 2008 3:45 PM

Anon - Huh? Run the team down? I thought it was holding on Samuels rather than a dirty play. So now I hate the skins? Nice logic.

C&D - I liken it to a DB grabbing a WR when he knows he's beat - not dirty but a desperation move that should get flagged.

Posted by: skinswest | September 7, 2008 10:21 AM | Report abuse

Zorn just needs to make sure he doesn't lose the team if they come out say, 1-4 or 2-5.

If that happens, we go from a train-wreck to an abortion.

Posted by: GAD | September 7, 2008 10:26 AM | Report abuse

Can someone please tell me why you guys have spent TWO days debating the Samuels hit???? Geez...the game is over..Samuels is OUR player.....the guy he tackled was a player for one of our biggest OPPONENTS. Let it go!!!!! Or go root for the Giants!

Posted by: Anonymous | September 7, 2008 10:41 AM | Report abuse

The roster is set. Once everyone settles down and gets clicking, I think they will be something to watch. I dont think it will take long to get everyone in rythym.

If JC is able to take some snaps in the shotgun, I think it will do wonders for his confidence.

Posted by: Cheyenne, WY | September 7, 2008 10:44 AM | Report abuse

As far as the JC vs. Colt debate, its ridiculous.

I remember a few years back hearing the same thing about Brad Johnson and Jeff George.

Bottom line...better the devil you know than the devil you dont

Posted by: Cheyenne, WY | September 7, 2008 10:47 AM | Report abuse

Your post makes even less sense.The ball doesn't change shape once it's in the red zone. If you don't score points then what is the point? Collins (106 rating in '07) bailed out #17 (losing record as a starter in '07 w/ a 77 rating )and the team last year. It's pretty much the same team now. JC's rating dropped at least 10 points in the second and fourth qtr last year. He is a choker who should've known how to read a defense in high school and you want to waste/give him more TIME? there are only 16 regular season games. Playoffs AGAIN w/ Collins now and ride Colt next. Both can already read defenses and get the ball off on time. He's the same now as he was then.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZH6eO6mj60Y

Posted by: Realness | September 7, 2008 2:46 AM


Why don't you actually pay attention to the conversation. The original post said JC can't move the offense PERIOD and that he never could. You're not even respondeing to the conversation we're having. Realness? Realness is reading comprehension not just posting to see yourself posting. Go back to school or pass your GED then come talk to me.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | September 7, 2008 10:21 AM

You took move the ball to mean get one yard I guess. The wind can do that sometimes. Move the ball means scoring, genius. Not get 9 and punt on fourth down and lose ballgames.

Posted by: Realness | September 7, 2008 10:52 AM | Report abuse

Admittedly the QB gets the brunt because he touches the ball every time. The WC offense is predicated on timing and rythym. When the O-Line cant maintain that kline and give the QB some time, then you cant put all the blame on him.

He definitely needs to work on his decision making, but he is still pretty young. He protected the ball, thats first and foremost. Some of the balls he threw should have been caught.

The O-Line needs to give him some time tolet the routes develop, right now he does not have that

Posted by: Cheyenne, WY | September 7, 2008 10:56 AM | Report abuse

Move the ball means scoring, genius. Not get 9 and punt on fourth down and lose ballgames.

Posted by: Realness | September 7, 2008 10:52 AM

Wow, this is an interesting discussion. Can I weigh in? Move the ball means move the ball. Sometimes the wind does it, usually not. Move the chains means getting first downs. Scoring means scoring. Got it?

Anyone up here got an opinion on what the meaning of is is?

Posted by: motivator | September 7, 2008 10:57 AM | Report abuse

I am Cheyenne, WY and I approve that message

Posted by: Cheyenne, WY | September 7, 2008 10:57 AM | Report abuse

Leevi's recent posts have been about #17's inability as a QB. Discussions on terms like move the ball, chains, scoring, etc. don't change the facts presented by realness (w/ actual numbers to back them up) about what J.Campbell is: a below average NFL QB.

Posted by: Bigpicture | September 7, 2008 11:48 AM | Report abuse

I say make the Boldin deal happend NOW!!! He's young, big, fast and he can catch. He instantly makes this WR corps better. Does Arizona run the WC offense.

Where's the down side in this?

Posted by: sicwidit | September 7, 2008 9:53 AM

There's no down side to getting a first-rate wide receiver. But it's real hard to swing the deal when your team has only $658,000 in salary cap space. Mr. Boldin wants a substantial increase in pay in his next contract. The Redskins can only offer him a pay cut in the short term.

Posted by: Cappy | September 7, 2008 12:00 PM | Report abuse

Zorn just needs to make sure he doesn't lose the team if they come out say, 1-4 or 2-5.

If that happens, we go from a train-wreck to an abortion.

Posted by: GAD | September 7, 2008 10:26 AM

1981 season.

Joe Gibbs, 0-5.

Just think how good the Redskins could have been in the 1980s if Gibbs hadn't lost the team early in his first year. Wow!

Posted by: Anonymous | September 7, 2008 12:07 PM | Report abuse

Congrats. You know the term "sport."

Now look up sportsmanship.

I'm always impressed by some brave poster trotting out machor phrases like: "it's a contact sport." Tell you what, why don't you tell Kiwanuka to his face he should try another sport. I'm sure he'd get a big chuckle, probably invite you out for a brew with him.

Samuels is not a dirty player, and what he did was likely from exhaustion mixed with frustration and bad judgement.


Posted by: Corkczar | September 7, 2008 12:17 AM
------------------------

And I'm always impressed by low-rent maggots such as yourself, who end up whining about the poster rather than the validity of the post.

Must be a symptom of being a RI "regular," eh, old sport?

I can just as easily send you a case of Kleenex too, just like the one I'm sending to Kiwanuka.

Next time, butch up, cupcake.

:)

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | September 7, 2008 12:20 PM | Report abuse

beepity beep beep

Posted by: Anonymous | September 7, 2008 12:28 PM | Report abuse

point about Campbell being a bust was proved today...There were ROOKIE QBs in new systems and new to the league playing today who lit it up...As well as many QBS in new systems lit it up....I mean cmon! Campbell can't even get a first down!

Posted by: Leevi | September 7, 2008 7:05 PM | Report abuse

Zorn just needs to make sure he doesn't lose the team if they come out say, 1-4 or 2-5.

If that happens, we go from a train-wreck to an abortion.

Posted by: GAD | September 7, 2008 10:26 AM

1981 season.

Joe Gibbs, 0-5.

Just think how good the Redskins could have been in the 1980s if Gibbs hadn't lost the team early in his first year. Wow!

Posted by: Anonymous | September 7, 2008 12:07 PM

STOP comparing Zorn to Joe Gibbs..are you kidding me?????

Posted by: Anonymous | September 7, 2008 7:06 PM | Report abuse

Leevi's recent posts have been about #17's inability as a QB. Discussions on terms like move the ball, chains, scoring, etc. don't change the facts presented by realness (w/ actual numbers to back them up) about what J.Campbell is: a below average NFL QB.

Posted by: Bigpicture | September 7, 2008 11:48 AM

Are you agreeing with me? hard to tell...

But your right...Jason has not been able to move the offense very well...I have seen so many QBs in new systems excel...even rookies today playyed better than Campbell ever has in their first game. You want numbers? I think we all know the numbers...it's the internet and you can see this...I didn't think I needed to insult the intelligence of all the posters here. All I know is everytime Campbell is in...The offense just does not look in sync.

Posted by: Leevi | September 7, 2008 7:11 PM | Report abuse

LOL you can't be serious? Show me one thing Campbell has shown that he is a good Qb? Everytime Campbell plays from the last system to this system...HE CAN'T MOVE THE OFFENSE..PERIOD!

Posted by: Leevi | September 6, 2008 6:14 PM

This may be the most retarded statement made on here. I seem to recall JC moving the offense quite well last year. The problem was finishing it off. That offense moved up and down the field at will, just imploded in the redzone. See, you're thinking is clouded by the Todd's games. JC was NOT ineffective moving the ball, he was ineffective IN THE RED ZONE. That takes maturation and confidence to cure. In other words TIME.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | September 7, 2008 12:21 AM

First off....how is my statement "retarded" Campbell throws too many high balls...holds on to the ball too long and you just validated my point by stating he chokes in the redzone ...well hmmm last time I checked good NFL QBs don't do that....Seems you need points to win right? DUH!

Posted by: Leevi | September 7, 2008 7:16 PM | Report abuse

Keep drinking the coolaid on Campbell all ya want..Believe me I want nothing more than to see Cambell excel and take us to the bowl...but I do not see this happening...how many more seasons does this team have left...we have already wasted 3 years with bad QB play...the window is closing and I'm ready to see ANY Qb come in and move the ball ...no matter who it is....

Posted by: Leevi | September 7, 2008 7:20 PM | Report abuse

The problem with that Leevi is nobody is able to come in and move the chains. Colt is too raw and Collins is much much worse than JC. So are you going to get an old, washed up or young ignorant/raw QB to play this season? You're points are rediculous at this point because although Zorn would like him to progress at particular things a bit faster, he's ahead of Matt Hasselback, and is missing intelligent receivers. When you have stupid receivers who don't know where the first down markers are, you can't win.

Posted by: Karen | September 7, 2008 10:22 PM | Report abuse

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