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Lingering Questions About the Kicking Change

When the Redskins board a plane Saturday for Oakland, they'll have a new kicker with them. But four days after cutting Shaun Suisham for rookie Graham Gano, there's still some lingering questions surrounding the change and who was behind the decision.

There were whispers this week around Redskins Park that none of the four kickers brought in for a tryout impressed coaches.

Nick Novak, who kicked for the Redskins in 2005 and again in '06 was one of the four kickers in Ashburn. Each kicked 10-12 field goals. Novak said he missed only one kick. The others -- including newly-signed Gano -- each missed two or more.

Gano said he couldn't remember how many he made or missed.

"I always feel like I can do better," Gano said. "But I felt like I did pretty good."


Gano was flown in late Monday night, said he slept about 3 1/2 hours and headed to Redskins Park for the tryout. Gano, the Lou Groza Award winner last year at Florida State, said this was his third NFL tryout in recent weeks and said "this one was the most testing." He said special teams coordinator Danny Smith didn't simply want to see field goals and deep kickoffs, "he wanted to see how you hit the field goals and what ammo you had."

Said Novak, in an email: "Gano overall kicked well, he has a live leg and in my opinion has an opportunity now to be in the league for a long time. I haven't seen many kickers come out of college with his kind of focus and consistency."

There are some in Ashburn who felt none of the four were better options than Suisham, who missed a key field goal late in last Sunday's loss to New Orleans and was 18-for-21 on the year before he was released. Several players were especially disappointed that Suisham was sent packing.

So who made the decision?

Zorn was pretty clear about this earlier this week, but Vinny Cerrato, the team's vice president of football operations, cast a bit of doubt on the question Friday.

On Monday, Zorn discussed the situation and didn't sound like a move was imminent. He acknowledged the team might work out some kickers, but the auditions don't necessarily "mean that [Suisham's] cleaning out his locker."

On Wednesday, he said: "It was my decision. I didn't just go, 'Hey, I think I'll cut Shaun today.' I tried to look at all the issues involved."

But here's part of what Cerrato had to say on his weekly radio show on ESPN 980 Friday: "So my feeling was, after he misses the kick, it wasn't fair to the rest of the team to keep him on the team. Because this was a re-occurring thing. The Dallas game, he missed a 39-yarder. And I remember in the playoff game in Seattle he missed a short field goal. So there's some critical field goals that he missed.

"And then my question to the coaches and everything, is he the kicker for next year? No, probably not. So all right, let's let him go and let's try some guys and see if we find a guy who's gonna be consistent and make the kicks that he's supposed to make. That's all."
Sure didn't sound like it was a group decision or that the head coach was pushing for Suisham's ouster.

As for Novak, the University of Maryland product who has bounced around the league the past few years, he was just grateful for the call, so he says he's not bitter that another kicker got the contract.

"Having had the opportunity to kick for the Redskins and the great Coach Gibbs was a privilege, not a right," he said. "Trust me, in order to play at the highest level you must earn it. It's not always the player with the most talent that has the long NFL career. It's the one that makes the least amount of mental and physical errors."

By Rick Maese  |  December 11, 2009; 12:27 PM ET
 
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Comments

redDmv

Okay.

Okay.

I plead guilty to 'misguided' by ranking Deion Sanders behind Lawyer Milloy and John Lynch as top modern dbacks.

My complaint, though, is with folks who want to put him ahead of Darryl Green.

From the top of my head, I believe where Deion has the INTS, Darryl has the tackles.

They were both stud cover guys.

But because Deion "The Gary Sheffield of the NFL" went to where the winners were in free agency, you wonder what he would've been like had he stuck it out on some bad teams with no pass rush.

Green stayed in one place and played well no matter what the front seven did.

That's why he's the best to me.

Posted by: MistaMoe | December 11, 2009 12:34 PM | Report abuse

mrsmoe says Tiger 'Hood has about a billion things on me.

She's just waiting for her turn to tell on Tiger.

You see, she's taken a look at the racial composition of the mostly blonde women Tiger's fooled around with and realized she has a chance to integrate his bedroom.

Posted by: MistaMoe | December 11, 2009 9:49 AM |

Fat chance. Your wife is so ugly Tiger would have to work his way past Rasputia to get to her. And Rasputia would give Precious a run for her money in the fat chick derby. Actually it is more like a waddle for her money. Hah!

Posted by: SonOfStan | December 11, 2009 12:36 PM | Report abuse

And to the surprise of no one, our dear friend Vinny makes another decision for the coaching staff.....

Posted by: skinsfan713 | December 11, 2009 12:37 PM | Report abuse

What the F? So Vinnie spills his whole thought process on cutting a kicker on the air? Does he does this every week?

What a freakin' tool.

Posted by: JohnDinHouston | December 11, 2009 12:38 PM | Report abuse

oh boy, here we go....

Over / under JReid ends up writing 10 posts about the Skins cutting Suisham. This is reminding me of JLa's mancrush of Leigh Torrence, which he wrote about for weeks...

Posted by: mattylight | December 11, 2009 12:39 PM | Report abuse

Green stayed in one place and played well no matter what the front seven did.

That's why he's the best to me.

Posted by: MistaMoe | December 11, 2009 12:34 PM | Report abuse
____________

Amen, brother. We could probably use DG today given the problems our secondary has had with the double moves. Someone tell Vinny to call him.

Posted by: skinsfan713 | December 11, 2009 12:39 PM | Report abuse

JR get over it we know he was your but buddy but dam give it a rest already, SS was not very good and his KO's sucked.

Posted by: Flounder21 | December 11, 2009 12:40 PM | Report abuse

At least we didn't draft him

Posted by: BrooklynSkins | December 11, 2009 12:40 PM | Report abuse

There were whispers this week around Redskins Park that none of the four kickers brought in for a tryout impressed coaches

sounds like someone sticking up for their bff....

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | December 11, 2009 12:41 PM | Report abuse

He said he asked the coaches if this was the guy for next year and they said no, so why not get somebody in now to kick in live games and see how he does.

Posted by: Flounder21 | December 11, 2009 12:42 PM | Report abuse

"There were whispers this week around Redskins Park that none of the four kickers brought in for a tryout impressed coaches"

I call BS. He didn't even cite the annoying "unnamed sources" or "sources who wished to remain anonymous"

Lock of the century that the first time Gano misses, JReid writes a piece about how the Skins already had a reliable kicker, 18-21 blah blah blah but cut him for no good reason....

Posted by: mattylight | December 11, 2009 12:43 PM | Report abuse

It's 72 degrees here.

And I do mow the lawn on Fridays after work.

Posted by: MistaMoe | December 11, 2009 9:03 AM |

In your case I would have figured that you would Moe the lawn, whatever that may be.

Posted by: SonOfStan | December 11, 2009 12:44 PM | Report abuse

JR do you have access to the park, because it sure seems like you just rehash the same sh_t over and over again.

Why don't you go out to the park and get some real stories.

Posted by: Flounder21 | December 11, 2009 12:45 PM | Report abuse

I like this move. We aren't going to win this year why not bring a guy in that has a promising future. Suisham was never going to be that good anyway. We need to see more of this.

Start Edwin Williams at center.

Start Kevin Barnes instead of Smoot.

Start Lendy Holmes at free safety.

Let's see what we have before we go into the draft.

Posted by: PAskinsfan17 | December 11, 2009 12:46 PM | Report abuse

It has been puzzling to me why Zorn would cut Suisham when he (Zorn) only has 4 weeks left... What's the flippin point?

This leads me to believe it was Vinny.

Posted by: Lisa_R | December 11, 2009 12:46 PM | Report abuse

"And then my question to the coaches and everything, is he the kicker for next year? No, probably not."

"...Sure didn't sound like it was a group decision or that the head coach was pushing for Suisham's ouster."

Actually, that's exactly what it sounds like.

Posted by: psps23 | December 11, 2009 12:47 PM | Report abuse

I mean, off the top of my head, how about talking to Ganther about getting the start?? Instead of, 'wah, they cut my friend after he shanked a 23 yarder'....

There are some in Ashburn who felt none of the four were better options than Suisham, - bullcrap

Several players were especially disappointed that Suisham was sent packing - and bullcrap..

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | December 11, 2009 12:48 PM | Report abuse

flounder21

"Why don't you go out to the park and get some real stories."

Amen.

I'd like some words from Ganther about getting the starting role in and NFL game--that's a dream for anybody.

Posted by: MistaMoe | December 11, 2009 12:49 PM | Report abuse

Wonder if Green would make a good DB coach...cuz I am not all that impressed with Gray.

Why are we dragging on the Kicker issue? Seriously, I still think a TD should count as 7 points and screw the kickers.

Somebody take Vinnie hunting and shoot him in the face...

Posted by: mhartz1 | December 11, 2009 12:50 PM | Report abuse

Suisham had a problem hitting clutch kicks. I don't care whether it was Vinny or Zorn who made the call. With Zorn nearing the end of his tenure as HC it was probably Vinny.

Posted by: skinswest | December 11, 2009 12:50 PM | Report abuse

So once again Vinny tells Danny I can fix this AND make Zorn look bad. Vinny tells Zorn to do what I say or you get fired for cause. Simply from building a successful organization point of view I would keep Zorn growing pains and all and FIRE VINNY.

Posted by: Keyskonnection | December 11, 2009 12:50 PM | Report abuse

So, if it was Cerrato who made the decision, then three cheers for Cerrato: hip, hip, hooray.

Posted by: League-Source | December 11, 2009 12:50 PM | Report abuse

WTF!!! Will now be talking about a damn kicker for the next 2 years like we have Lee?

Posted by: jm220 | December 11, 2009 12:53 PM | Report abuse

JR do you have access to the park, because it sure seems like you just rehash the same sh_t over and over again.

Why don't you go out to the park and get some real stories.

Posted by: Flounder21 | December 11, 2009 12:45 PM


Thank you...and if they are arent those stories, then they are the stories that JLA hashed a million times.

Friend of mine use to be a strenth coach assistant at Ashburn before getting a job with the Dolphins and he said JLA used to sit in the lobby and fight with his wife on the phone constantly, rarely did interviews with any player and once saw Springs give JLA the stiff arm trying to come into the locker room, lol.

Posted by: mhartz1 | December 11, 2009 12:54 PM | Report abuse

In what world is Dan Snyder qualified to scout any position, much less quarterback?

Posted by: zyvo23 | December 10, 2009 9:22 PM

In every world where he owns the team.

Posted by: League-Source |

Not to beat your horse with a dead stick, League, but as the board's only quantum physics rocket surgeon, I feel compelled to point out that Everett's Many World's theory includes one where Dan Snyder is a stone football genius.

Posted by: TheCork | December 11, 2009 12:54 PM | Report abuse

Wonder if Green would make a good DB coach...cuz I am not all that impressed with Gray.
Why are we dragging on the Kicker issue? Seriously, I still think a TD should count as 7 points and screw the kickers.
Somebody take Vinnie hunting and shoot him in the face...
Posted by: mhartz1 | December 11, 2009 12:50 PM

Didn’t they say that Darrell Green coached up J Tryon over the off season? He is leaps and bounds ahead of where he was last year….not sure how much of that goes to Greens credit, but I don’t cringe when I see #20 in there anymore. Dg is prolly too busy with his foundation to take a full time gig with the skins though.

Posted by: dlhaze1 | December 11, 2009 12:55 PM | Report abuse

I list Green up there with Deion in the top three all-time CBs..

This bs that Reid is shoveling shouldn't be a surprise to one of you here. This is how the man rolls. If he gushes over a certain player, and the player or Reid himself feels that they were wronged, he'll go at great lengths to speak out the injustice done to that player.

But then again, look who he was taking notes from.... it all sounds too familiar to me.

Posted by: RedDMV | December 11, 2009 12:55 PM | Report abuse

Zorn did not have the sak to cut SS. He's still playing ARE as punt returner. Young guys are playing because of injuries.

Zorn is an idiot, but so is Vinny so it's amazing the right thing got done.

Posted by: Curzon417 | December 11, 2009 12:56 PM | Report abuse

Not to beat your horse with a dead stick,

Posted by: TheCork | December 11, 2009 12:54 PM

Look, if a dead stick is the only stick you got then by all means whip it out and have at the horse.

Posted by: League-Source | December 11, 2009 12:58 PM | Report abuse

I would put DG in the top 5 corners of all time...without a doubt. Plus you have to look at all the intangibles he brought, he could return punts and was an incredible leader and great for the community.

Will always remember his punt return against the Bears for a TD, when he lept over the defender, ridiculous.

Posted by: mhartz1 | December 11, 2009 12:58 PM | Report abuse

Not to beat your horse with a dead stick, League, but as the board's only quantum physics rocket surgeon, I feel compelled to point out that Everett's Many World's theory includes one where Dan Snyder is a stone football genius.

Posted by: TheCork | December 11, 2009 12:54 PM

I'll go out on a limb and suggest it's not this one though.

Posted by: skinswest | December 11, 2009 12:58 PM | Report abuse

If Zorn gets canned after the season, I for one, hope he writes a tell-all book about his time as coach in Washington. It would be very interesting to find out what kind of decision making authority he actually has. Although knowing Snyder, there is probably a provision in his contract that won’t let him write any books……

Posted by: dlhaze1 | December 11, 2009 1:01 PM | Report abuse

The JReid critics here are grasping at straws. Not quite sure what the beef is.

If it were JLA covering this bit, we'd have gotten hate-quotes from Suishy, a jigged-up statistical analysis telling us that the Skins cutting Suishy makes no salary-cap sense, a paragraph reminding us of Jason Taylor, and 5 paragraphs of hodge-podge hate-infused criticism of the Skins FO.

JReid is mild in comparison.

Posted by: p1funk | December 11, 2009 1:03 PM | Report abuse

Start Edwin Williams at center.

Start Kevin Barnes instead of Smoot.

Start Lendy Holmes at free safety.

Let's see what we have before we go into the draft.

Posted by: PAskinsfan17

The line is playing reasonably well, and when surrounded with 330-350 pounders, Rabach is not a liability at center. In fact, he he calls blocking assignments. Williams may start at ORG this week, by BMW moved out to ORT.

Barnes is getting some minutes. Let's not crush his confidence by overmatching him.

Lendy Holmes? Seriously?

You are aware they have these things called practices where they can sometimes determine who is ready to start, right?

Naah, that's facetious, but no coach playing for his job next year or his next one is going to sabotage his chances of winning by "trying out" guys as starters.

Posted by: TheCork | December 11, 2009 1:03 PM | Report abuse

In fairness to Reid he didn't write this post. But it does seem to have his fingerprints on it.

Posted by: AdamCr | December 11, 2009 1:04 PM | Report abuse

If Zorn gets canned after the season, I for one, hope he writes a tell-all book about his time as coach in Washington. It would be very interesting to find out what kind of decision making authority he actually has. Although knowing Snyder, there is probably a provision in his contract that won’t let him write any books……

Posted by: dlhaze1 | December 11, 2009 1:01 PM

No, it's common sense that he won't write the book. Whatever royalties he gets from selling 5,000 copies of "I Lost My Skin" will be greatly offset by the fact that his future employment prospects in professional football will be greatly diminished.

Posted by: League-Source | December 11, 2009 1:06 PM | Report abuse

While I appreciate that this is a "blog", this isn't just random guys website talking about Redskins football. As a part of the Washington Post, I, as a reader, expect that the blog be considerably less single-minded. Yes, Suisham was rather accurate and is likely being scapegoated for the loss to NO. However, you can cut kickers and not take the hit that cutting LL30 would create. So Vinny cut him. Might work out, might not. The fact that you liked him and are sad to see him go shouldn't make his replacement a multiple posting event AFTER the new guy is signed. Things more people care about than the replacement of a kicker that had a habit of missing the "big kick":

1) Quinton Ganther and his elevation to starting RB.

2) Projections of who the Skins should take in the draft.

3) Projections of who the Skins seem to be the most interested in the draft (as we know, 2 and 3 are different, sadly).

4) An analysis of who the Redskins have under contract for next year and who on the roster that isn't under contract has the best chance of sticking around.

5) Maybe a breakdown of players available in free agency in a capped vs. uncapped 2010.

6) Skittles versus Reese's pieces.

Seriously, anything other kicking. If the kid misses everything, then theres a story. Otherwise, let it go.

Posted by: AppleScience | December 11, 2009 1:06 PM | Report abuse

cork, in theory your statements about trying out guys works, however given that we've found that Davis can actually play this game, who knows what this coaching staff is doing.....

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | December 11, 2009 1:06 PM | Report abuse

Not to beat your horse with a dead stick,

Posted by: TheCork | December 11, 2009 12:54 PM

Look, if a dead stick is the only stick you got then by all means whip it out and have at the horse.

Posted by: League-Source |

Ah so you bought the "quantum physics rocket surgeon" claim eh? Call me. I can put you in a Florida Doublewide with a view of some of the finest other Doublewides in the entire state. Maybe even next to your wife and sister. I hear she lives there.

Posted by: TheCork | December 11, 2009 1:07 PM | Report abuse

Here's an excerpt from Vinny's conversation w/ Mel Kiper:

"Now Mel, who's your top 5?" Cerrato asked at one point. "If the draft was today, who's your top 5?"

"Well, Ndamukong Suh and Gerald McCoy, the two defensive tackles, they're gonna scrutinize them, the NFL will, and it depends on the system you're in as to who you take," Kiper said. "Certainly the quarterbacks will follow suit. Eric Berry would be at 3, the safety from Tennessee who they moved around this year, to get him in a lot of different areas and show a lot of the skills that he has."

"You think a safety will go in the top 5, Mel?" Cerrato asked, sounding surprised.

And certainly the quarterbacks," Kiper continued. "You would line them up there after, with Jimmy Clausen, Jake Locker, Sam Bradford, Ryan Mallett if he decides to come out. Those four quarterbacks, depending on who comes out, would be in that next tier."

It sounds like the top of the draft is gonna be defensive tackles and quarterbacks and a running back," Cerrato concluded.

------------------------------------

What's interesting to me is the "and a running back". Mel didn't mention a running back....hmmmmm.

Posted by: TWISI | December 11, 2009 1:08 PM | Report abuse

"Lingering Questions About the Kicking Change"

I'm glad the Post is looking for answers to questions that nobody cares about(except for J. Reid).

Posted by: PortisPocketsStr8 | December 11, 2009 1:08 PM | Report abuse

You are aware they have these things called practices where they can sometimes determine who is ready to start, right?

Naah, that's facetious, but no coach playing for his job next year or his next one is going to sabotage his chances of winning by "trying out" guys as starters.

Posted by: TheCork | December 11, 2009 1:03 PM | Report abuse

I guess Randle El is taking punts to the house in practice then!!! I bet Zorn is thinking that if he can just win 4 games this seaosn he's safe!!!

Posted by: PAskinsfan17 | December 11, 2009 1:09 PM | Report abuse

unless Adrian Petersen re-enters the draft, then no thanks to a RB......

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | December 11, 2009 1:10 PM | Report abuse

You are aware they have these things called practices where they can sometimes determine who is ready to start, right?

Posted by: TheCork | December 11, 2009 1:03 PM

I used to subscribe to this theory until I saw how the subs played once they got a chance. Now, I question whether the coaches even go to the practices.

Posted by: League-Source | December 11, 2009 1:11 PM | Report abuse

p1funk the beef is how many damn times is he going to write about this? How many game winning kicks did he make this year? We know he missed two that cost us game. He need to stop acting like the guy is an all pro kicker. I guess he forgot the guy was the worst in the NFL last year. Time to move on is all everyone is saying.

Posted by: jm220 | December 11, 2009 1:12 PM | Report abuse

Aren’t we free to talk about whatever we want up here? WE (the commentors) don’t have to discuss the kicker just because the new “thread” is about the kicker…..besides Rick Maese posted that, not J Reid……what a bunch of whinybabies.

Posted by: dlhaze1 | December 11, 2009 1:12 PM | Report abuse

If Zorn gets canned after the season, I for one, hope he writes a tell-all book about his time as coach in Washington. It would be very interesting to find out what kind of decision making authority he actually has. Although knowing Snyder, there is probably a provision in his contract that won’t let him write any books……

Posted by: dlhaze1 | December 11, 2009 1:01 PM |


Seriuously do you want to read a book written by Zorn, the man can barely put together a coherent sentence to answer a question and you want him to write a book.

More power to you

Posted by: GreatOne1 | December 11, 2009 1:15 PM | Report abuse

... will be greatly offset by the fact that his future employment prospects in professional football will be greatly diminished.

Posted by: League-Source | December 11, 2009 1:06 PM |

Dude. You funny. Tell how to "greatly diminish" zero. All of math awaits you answer with baited breath.

Posted by: SonOfStan | December 11, 2009 1:15 PM | Report abuse

the skins are run by a$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$clowns!!!!!

Posted by: jimmy_the_crickett | December 11, 2009 1:16 PM | Report abuse

reddmv

"I list Green up there with Deion in the top three all-time CBs."


All-Time...?

That's some tough choosing.

Let's see (from the top of the head):


Mike Haynes

Lester Hayes

Mel Blount

Rod Woodson

Anyone else?

I'd put Haynes in as he was a big corner and could play today at either safety or corner.

Posted by: MistaMoe | December 11, 2009 1:16 PM | Report abuse

I used to subscribe to this theory until I saw how the subs played once they got a chance. Now, I question whether the coaches even go to the practices.

Posted by: League-Source | December 11, 2009 1:11 PM | Report abuse

I'm with you. It all makes so much sense now. The coaches don't go to practices, Skins bring in "an extra set of eyes," who proceeds to actually attend practices, hone in on players' abilities / weaknesses, etc., and...shocker...we start putting up points on offense!

This also makes sense on the defensive side of the ball -- Blache and Gray aren't attending practice, Blache is inside reading ProFootballTalk, Gray sending out resumes, thus the fact that Landry and Rogers both haven't seemed to grasp how to defend the dreaded "double move" (insert Bean's favorite CR line)...

Posted by: mattylight | December 11, 2009 1:16 PM | Report abuse

These questions only linger in the minds of people in the WaPo Sports department. I sleep pretty well at night knowing Gano is our kicker on Sunday.

Posted by: RedSkinHead | December 11, 2009 1:16 PM | Report abuse

BG I can agree with your position on not drafting a RB high in rd #1, but if Spiller grades out as an elite player I can understand the thought process of drafting him.

Here's Vinny on the current state of the Skin's young players....

But you'd like to see the continued development of these guys. Devin, Malcolm, Marko, Fred, Jason Campbell, Ganther, all these guys keep performing and keep improving. Because we are making progress offensively and stuff, so I think that's what you'd like to see.

-------------------------------------

Vinny mentioned JC, so maybe a decision hasn't been made of his status with the team going forward.

Posted by: TWISI | December 11, 2009 1:17 PM | Report abuse

nothing you can do about it....

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | December 11, 2009 1:17 PM | Report abuse

Suisham had to go! What's the worse that Gano can do? Miss a 23 yarder and have kickoffs that reach the 15 yard line?

Posted by: VegasJim | December 11, 2009 1:18 PM | Report abuse

Vinny not losing his job is complete BS. He hired Zorn and now is passing all the blame on him. We have no hope. Fah-Q Snyderatto.

Posted by: ToddStinkston | December 11, 2009 1:20 PM | Report abuse

... will be greatly offset by the fact that his future employment prospects in professional football will be greatly diminished.

Posted by: League-Source | December 11, 2009 1:06 PM |

Dude. You funny. Tell how to "greatly diminish" zero. All of math awaits you answer with baited breath.

Posted by: SonOfStan | December 11, 2009 1:15 PM
------------------------------------------
I always thought negative numbers were less than zero. Of course, that's real world math and not NFL coaching math. What would a negative number equate to in a job search in the NFL? Consultant? BINGO!

Posted by: RedSkinHead | December 11, 2009 1:20 PM | Report abuse

This should really be titled "Lingering Questions About Who Really Wrote This Post"

Posted by: mattylight | December 11, 2009 1:20 PM | Report abuse

dlhaze

"Aren’t we free to talk about whatever we want up here?"

I do all the time.

And nothing for or against Mr. Reid, but he's slippin'.

So many new guys are getting playing time, and what, h can't get an interview and post that as a thread?

C'mon, mayor.

You slippin', bro'.

Posted by: MistaMoe | December 11, 2009 1:22 PM | Report abuse

I have a theory for everyone up here, please give me your thoughts.

I have seen over the past two years that Jerry jones has openly called out Marion Barber.

What happens if they cut Marion Barber do we pick him up?

Or is Marion Barber ask for a trade do we grant that trade if it is for a 4th rounder

Thoughts

Posted by: GreatOne1 | December 11, 2009 1:22 PM | Report abuse

Seriuously do you want to read a book written by Zorn, the man can barely put together a coherent sentence to answer a question and you want him to write a book.
More power to you
Posted by: GreatOne1 | December 11, 2009 1:15 PM

Yeah, I’d love to read a book about how he wanted to start so and so, or draft so and so but Vinny and Dan told him to go with their guy or else….we already know they won’t let him call plays….what else can’t he do that other coaches can? Coming from the Holmgren “tree”, odds are that he didn’t want to play Portis as much as he did based upon practice reps….call me crazy but methinks that the owner has a little more to do with coaching decisions than Zorn is “allowed” to tell the public while he is under contract as coach.

Posted by: dlhaze1 | December 11, 2009 1:22 PM | Report abuse

great,

Barber is a beast that would be a tough call, but I would not give anymore then 5th or below.

Posted by: Flounder21 | December 11, 2009 1:24 PM | Report abuse

What happens if they cut Marion Barber do we pick him up?

Or is Marion Barber ask for a trade do we grant that trade if it is for a 4th rounder

Thoughts

Posted by: GreatOne1 | December 11, 2009 1:22 PM

What is this team's history with ex-Cowboys?

Posted by: League-Source | December 11, 2009 1:24 PM | Report abuse

twis, keeping jc, I think at this jucture is a good move...I've been a big detrator of his, but lets not create more holes to fill....

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | December 11, 2009 1:24 PM | Report abuse

No to Barber. No more cowgirl retreads. And a big NO to a trade for him.

Posted by: Curzon417 | December 11, 2009 1:25 PM | Report abuse

Or is Marion Barber ask for a trade do we grant that trade if it is for a 4th rounder
Thoughts
Posted by: GreatOne1 | December 11, 2009 1:22 PM

I’m not usually one of those grammar police-guys, but……..Ladies and Gentlemen, give it up for Emmit Smif!!!!

Or was that Skippy?

Posted by: dlhaze1 | December 11, 2009 1:28 PM | Report abuse

GreatOne1 I'd pass on Barber if it involved a trade. He's in his 5th year, and based on his running style he'd be lucky to make it through another 3 years. I'd be more incline to use the draft pick on a younger RB.

Posted by: TWISI | December 11, 2009 1:29 PM | Report abuse

Thoughts

Posted by: GreatOne1 | December 11, 2009 1:22 PM | Report abuse

No, MBIII is a power back. They have an even shorter lifespan than regular backs. Guys like him and Jacobs rarely last more than a 5-6 years. I wouldn't be surprised if he and Jacobs never return to form.

Posted by: PAskinsfan17 | December 11, 2009 1:31 PM | Report abuse

"What happens if they cut Marion Barber do we pick him up?"


Other than being a couple of ex-Gophers, both Barber and Laurence Malroney haven't really excited the league after their breakout seasons.

I don't like either.

J Dwyer-GaTech is the next best thing to them, and I'd no prob if the team snagged him.

Dwyer is Betts with a tad more speed.

He has hands, too.

But let's see Ganther in action before making that call.

I have a hunch Ganther might be a find like Ryan Grant was for the packers a few years ago.

Posted by: MistaMoe | December 11, 2009 1:31 PM | Report abuse

Vinny mentioned JC, so maybe a decision hasn't been made of his status with the team going forward.

Posted by: TWISI | December 11, 2009 1:17 PM
------------------------------------------
"Vinny mentioned JC..." Do you read what you write? Are you so eager to see Campbell respected that hang on Vinny Cerrato's every word? I mean this is Vinny Worm-Tongue we are talking about. You're acting like the great Joe Gibbs came down to the park and said, "Campbell must come back next year to finish what I started" (and before you get your knickers in a twist - no, he did not say that).

You and PASkin need to get over Campbell. If he stays they are drafting a QB to replace him. If he goes they are drafting a QB to replace him. Snyder wants a QB that can bring fans into the stands and sell t-shirts. He doesn't believe Campbell is the guy. Read my lips, "They tried to trade him twice last year and now they are scouting college quarterbacks". If you are a Campbell fan, you should hope that he gets cut loose from the Redskins and go somewhere where they haven't already made a decision about his abilities.

Posted by: RedSkinHead | December 11, 2009 1:33 PM | Report abuse

What's interesting to me is the "and a running back". Mel didn't mention a running back....hmmmmm.

Posted by: TWISI | December 11, 2009 1:08 PM

I listened this morning and remember Mel talking about Spiller. He said he should have been in the top 5 for the Heisman.

He also stated that Suh and Spiller would be the better pros out of that bunch.

It's truly shocking every Friday to listen to Vinny talk to Mel and Vinny be genuinely surprised by Mel's player analysis. It's almost like he's hearing these names for the first time.

Posted by: Diesel44 | December 11, 2009 1:33 PM | Report abuse

RSH chill. I unlike you and others on this blog don't live of die on the JC subject. I made an observation on what I read. Get over it. Better yet find another hobby beside sattacking everything or everyone that mentions JC.

Posted by: TWISI | December 11, 2009 1:38 PM | Report abuse

Diesel44 thanks for the sharing that. In the transcript I read it didn't mention Spiller. Still Spiller is interesting. It'd be a tough call on him if he grades out like most expect him to.

Posted by: TWISI | December 11, 2009 1:41 PM | Report abuse

(and before you get your knickers in a twist.

Posted by: RedSkinHead | December 11, 2009 1:33 PM | Report abuse

These days shouldn't it be "Before you get your KICKERS in a bunch?"

Posted by: Gunnerfan | December 11, 2009 1:43 PM | Report abuse

Has anyone made a Violent Femmes joke about the new kicker yet?

Posted by: NateinthePDX | December 11, 2009 1:45 PM | Report abuse

Has anyone made a Violent Femmes joke about the new kicker yet?

Posted by: NateinthePDX | December 11, 2009 1:45 PM |

I think we're all waiting for you, Nate. Maybe start of the next thread? "FIRST to make a Violent Femmes joke..."

Posted by: League-Source | December 11, 2009 1:49 PM | Report abuse

"What happens if they cut Marion Barber do we pick him up?"


Ummm, if Barber gets cut, we sit around and make fun of him for coming to FedEx and posting negative 6 yards rushing in a game.

No, we do NOT pick him up.

We already have an aging RB who is showing signs of wear-and-tear, has little motivation b/c he's gotten paid, and whose best years are behind him.

The reality with Barber is that he was a beast as a part-time platoon back, but not nearly as effective as a feature guy.

Bill Parcells knew how to use him perfectly - as a 4th quarter closer after Julius Jones had gotten the defense a little tired out.

Posted by: p1funk | December 11, 2009 1:50 PM | Report abuse

Has anyone made a Violent Femmes joke about the new kicker yet?

Posted by: NateinthePDX | December 11, 2009 1:45 PM |
--------------------------

Dunno.... But the first thing to pop into my head when I read his name was Colonel "Bat" Guano from Kubrick's "Dr. Stangelove..."

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | December 11, 2009 1:51 PM | Report abuse

It's truly shocking every Friday to listen to Vinny talk to Mel and Vinny be genuinely surprised by Mel's player analysis. It's almost like he's hearing these names for the first time.

Posted by: Diesel44 | December 11, 2009 1:33 PM | Report abuse


That's because he is.

Posted by: p1funk | December 11, 2009 1:51 PM | Report abuse

Barber sucks, and his little toughman celebrations after a 6- or 7-yard run are tiresome (although he doesn't have many of those against the Redskins - they've shut him down consistently).

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | December 11, 2009 1:55 PM | Report abuse

Or is Marion Barber ask for a trade do we grant that trade if it is for a 4th rounder
Thoughts
Posted by: GreatOne1 | December 11, 2009 1:22 PM

I’m not usually one of those grammar police-guys, but……..Ladies and Gentlemen, give it up for Emmit Smif!!!!

Or was that Skippy?

Posted by: dlhaze1 | December 11, 2009 1:28 PM


hay hoo told u it wus me?

Wuz it Mikel Erven, or Troy, dose gies r allways tellun on sumboty.

Posted by: GreatOne1 | December 11, 2009 1:56 PM | Report abuse

It's truly shocking every Friday to listen to Vinny talk to Mel and Vinny be genuinely surprised by Mel's player analysis. It's almost like he's hearing these names for the first time.

Posted by: Diesel44 | December 11, 2009 1:33 PM | Report abuse


That's because he is.

Posted by: p1funk | December 11, 2009 1:51 PM |

Possible reasons:

1. He's got his poker face on.
2. Snyder hasn't talked to the guys' agents yet and pinged Vinny.

Posted by: League-Source | December 11, 2009 2:01 PM | Report abuse

From the Times:


DeAngelo Hall will join Albert Haynesworth and Mike Sellers on the inactive list on Sunday.

A day after All-Pro defensive tackle Albert Haynesworth and Pro Bowl fullback Mike Sellers said they wouldn't be playing at Oakland, coach Jim Zorn just ruled the trio out because of injuries.

Posted by: BeantownGreg1 | December 11, 2009 2:07 PM | Report abuse

"Bill Parcells knew how to use him (M Barber) perfectly - as a 4th quarter closer after Julius Jones had gotten the defense a little tired out."

So you mean Pacells really knew what he meant when he said he wanted to shop for his groceries as he knew what kind of meal he wanted to prepare?

And despite the mangled metaphor, it's a nice plan and method of selecting talent: you get guys who fit a specific purpose.

Doesn't seem to be the case for the redskins on offense.

Posted by: MistaMoe | December 11, 2009 2:08 PM | Report abuse

Lingering questions? The only lingering question is why we're still whining about Shaun Swiss Ham. He could barely kickoff and missed crucial field goals.

Posted by: PAskinsfan17 | December 11, 2009 2:10 PM | Report abuse

The college football season is basically over.

Texas will get beat like a bad child by the Crimson Tide.

So picking the Heisman might be the best college game until next fall period.

pick'em:


Tebow

McCoy

Suh

Ingram

Gerhart


Who'll get the most over-rated trophy in the land?

Moe goes with Suh in an upset.

His name has some deep, intelligent Africa meaning.

But come next April, he'll change it to 'Mr. Millionaire'.

Posted by: MistaMoe | December 11, 2009 2:13 PM | Report abuse

So you mean Pacells really knew what he meant when he said he wanted to shop for his groceries as he knew what kind of meal he wanted to prepare?

Doesn't seem to be the case for the redskins on offense.

Posted by: MistaMoe | December 11, 2009 2:08 PM

So wrong. We bought exactly the right groceries for the meal we're serving up: bratwurst and sauerkraut.

Here's the rub: We're serving this meal week in and week out at a Gala $150 a seat fund raiser. Some of the guests were expecting better.

Posted by: League-Source | December 11, 2009 2:13 PM | Report abuse

... will be greatly offset by the fact that his future employment prospects in professional football will be greatly diminished.

Posted by: League-Source | December 11, 2009 1:06 PM |

Dude. You funny. Tell how to "greatly diminish" zero. All of math awaits you answer with baited breath.

Posted by: SonOfStan | December 11, 2009 1:15 PM
------------------------------------------
I always thought negative numbers were less than zero. Of course, that's real world math and not NFL coaching math. What would a negative number equate to in a job search in the NFL? Consultant? BINGO!

Posted by: RedSkinHead | December 11, 2009 1:20 PM |

employment prospects = probability of being hired

probability = x, where x can range from 0 to 1, 0 being no chance and 1 being certainty.

Negative numbers are excluded.

Posted by: SonOfStan | December 11, 2009 2:21 PM | Report abuse

Has anyone made a Violent Femmes joke about the new kicker yet?

Posted by: NateinthePDX | December 11, 2009 1:45 PM |
--------------------------

Dunno.... But the first thing to pop into my head when I read his name was Colonel "Bat" Guano from Kubrick's "Dr. Stangelove..."

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | December 11, 2009 1:51 PM
------------------------------------------
If Gano misses this will go down on his "Permanent Record" but he will probably tell everyone to "Kiss Off". I got nothing.

Posted by: RedSkinHead | December 11, 2009 2:22 PM | Report abuse

Here's the rub: We're serving this meal week in and week out at a Gala $150 a seat fund raiser. Some of the guests were expecting better.

Posted by: League-Source | December 11, 2009 2:13 PM |

It's called milking a fanbase that is still living in the dreamworld of 3 SB victories when the last was almost 20 ys ago.

Posted by: SonOfStan | December 11, 2009 2:23 PM | Report abuse

Negative numbers are excluded.

Posted by: SonOfStan | December 11, 2009 2:21 PM | Report abuse

I don't think so. If his chances are negative it probably means that not only will he not get the job but they will laugh at him and take turns kicking him in the junk just for applying. Being kicked in the junk is less than zero in anyone's book.

Posted by: PAskinsfan17 | December 11, 2009 2:24 PM | Report abuse

SonOfStan,
I can see Zorn going back to Seattle - especially if Holmgren goes back. He probably won't rate anything higher than a QB coach, but at least he will be able to supplement the millions of dollars he will be getting from Dan for the final year of his contract...

Posted by: RedSkinHead | December 11, 2009 2:25 PM | Report abuse

Honk Honk

Posted by: Original_etrod | December 11, 2009 2:37 PM | Report abuse

My Lil Bro ran into Haynie, LL, Orakpo, Rocky, & Smoot at the Wizards game last night.

Haynie had a pronounced wobble in his step and LL couldn't find enough sea cows to give his number out to.

Haynie got off a MF blast at a fan for an unauthorized picture and Orakpo was more than happy to stop for a picture with anyone who asked.


Posted by: Diesel44 | December 11, 2009 2:38 PM | Report abuse

Haynie got off a MF blast at a fan for an unauthorized picture and Orakpo was more than happy to stop for a picture with anyone who asked.


Posted by: Diesel44

????
If you are in a public place, there aren't any unauthorized pics. Seems a bit full of himself to me. He's definitely FULL of something.

Posted by: 1965skinsfan | December 11, 2009 2:46 PM | Report abuse

Unterhosen.

Posted by: Rotfrau | December 11, 2009 3:06 PM | Report abuse


oh boy, here we go....

Over / under JReid ends up writing 10 posts about the Skins cutting Suisham. This is reminding me of JLa's mancrush of Leigh Torrence, which he wrote about for weeks...

Posted by: mattyligh

That's funny! That Leigh Torrence/World's Most Interesting Man thread was hysterical.

I mean, give it a rest, Jason...it's a kicker. They rolled their boy up in Baltimore a few weeks ago for less.

Posted by: PS7900 | December 11, 2009 7:18 PM | Report abuse

What happens if they cut Marion Barber do we pick him up?

Or is Marion Barber ask for a trade do we grant that trade if it is for a 4th rounder

Thoughts

Posted by: GreatOne1 | December 11, 2009 1:22 PM

What is this team's history with ex-Cowboys?

Posted by: League-Source

NO MORE DALLAS REJECTS!!! tell em LS/TE

Posted by: bhoang888 | December 11, 2009 8:08 PM | Report abuse

Seems to me the team already took their chance on Suisham. He was mediocre last season and yet they kept him. He was solid this year until he developed that case of the yips. The new guy has a much stronger leg, for what that's worth, but really, they made the change just for the sake of making one.

Posted by: Samson151 | December 11, 2009 10:15 PM | Report abuse

There's little doubt Vinny made the decision and Jim had to implement it, and make it his own. Happens at many people's work. I was once told by my boss that I had to let some contractors go by noontime that day. It wasn't a performance issue, it was that the boss had mismanaged funds and was called on it. So he orders me to do his dirty work. I refused, so he got another person to 'volunteer' to do it. It was right before the Christmas holidays too. The boss was later asked to leave the company for money reasons. Justice was served. So Zorn likely was ordered to own the decision. Vinny's incompetence will prove true again as Suisham beats us next year with a FG when he's playing for another team. No more Redskins for me if Vinny stays. Too many good teams out there without the daily soap opera, and with so much on dish and cable one can easily be a fan of the NFL and another team. - Skins fan since 1965.

Posted by: bfjam | December 12, 2009 7:43 AM | Report abuse

It's the kicker on a 3-9 team bro. No one gives a crap.

Posted by: themantoyou | December 12, 2009 8:11 AM | Report abuse

cerrato is right, he was missing the big kicks and had to go. now after they get rid of campbell, who can not make the big pass, they will be on the right track.

Posted by: cavalieri10 | December 12, 2009 10:30 AM | Report abuse

funny how these two fools (vinnie and zorn) vie for top dog in their public appearances --- each puts their own spin on a given situation to make it seem like "they" are in charge --- they're both idiots and hopefully gone soon --- we all know the dark one isn't going anywhere, except to hell

Posted by: bestmick1 | December 13, 2009 9:36 AM | Report abuse

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