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The D Line

Coach Joe continues to say all is fine with the D Line, that the Redskins "really didn't get close to taking anybody" for the line in the second day of the draft and that an improved secondary will elevate the play of the line.

I am not sure how this will work, but I guess we'll all find out. The fact that teams repeatedly beat them up, gashed them for long runs and wore them down, well, having another big-hitting safety in the box might help a bit, but they lack real big bodies on the D Line, period, to stuff the run. Griffin is a beast when healthy and the one true gem of the entire line, but will he ever be healthy and at his 2004 form again?

Coach Joe also said that by investing so much of their offseason resources into the secondary - draft Landry, sign Smoot and Macklin and Stoutmire - they "will force people to hold the ball" longer, and thus allow the D Line to do itsr job. Again, we'll see. They will try to rush Marcus and Rocky more from the LB spot and expect to have more leads and play from ahead, Gibbs said, when you tee-off on people with the rush.

Only time will tell, eh?

All I know is that for three years they have had a difficult time taking teams on straight up at the line and generating a rush. Expecting Salave'a, Griffin, Wynn and Daniels to be healthy and to revert to their old form is a stetch. Expecting Golston and Montgomery to be vital contributors as second-year kids might be a stretch, too. Golston could be a solid starter, but again, you are talking mostly high-motor guys on that line, tweeners like Carter, and no real specimens.

So, knowing these guys and how they operate, don't for a moment think they won't be sniffing around on trades. The Briggs thing won't be over until he is either dealt or signs an extension (highly unlikely), so they could start talking to the Bears about 2008 draft picks should they get the itch.

Also, Joe has not yet assured us entirely that they will have a full compliment of picks next year - exempting the 4th roudner they are already without from the horrible Duckett trade, of course - and I don't blame him. Shopping Springs hasn't and won't yield much and if they are going to make a play for a quality D Lineman in trade it will have to include 2008 picks.

So, who's out there?

Well, they have not expressed an iota of interest in franchised tackle Cory Redding (Motown) and end Justin Smith (Cincy). Carolina tackle Kris Jenkins (Maryland) is out there (although there are concerns about his weight and attitude among the Skins staff), but I have heard internally that people don't think tackle is near the need that end is. Would they look at the right tackle in the right deal? Sure, but the football people really want another end. It's their biggest need.

So, who do I think they might move for?

Well, I hear that things between Buffalo and pass-rushing end Aaron Schobel are getting dicey. He wants a new deal (he has 2 years left but is way underpaid compared to other players of his ilk) and I get the sense the Bills might eventually put more effort into dealing him. Now, would owner Ralph Wilson do a deal with Dan Snyder, one of his not-so-favorite-people? Maybe not. But I know Schobel was a stud in Gregg Williams's system and I know he would be welcome, if not coveted, around here. Going into next year with Carter and Daniels as starters and Demetric as the top backup might not work out.

Also, Oakland's Derrick Burgress, another pass rushing end, is pushing for a new contract and not showing up for voluntary OTAS and the like. The Raiders might try to make nice here, but he's a guy to watch.

Acquiring any of these kinds of players will be difficult and complicated and they won't come cheap. But they are the best options. Also, if the Redskins do make a big move, I would not be stunned if Springs were released to create cap room - in fact people close to the player tell me he is bracing for it - and if Springs is not here you tell me who the elite coverage CB in the secondary would be?

Bottom line is that I think this offseason is far from over.

From my perspective, the two big issues I will be watching are a trade for a D Lineman, and, to a lesser degree, the possible firing of scouts and/or Vinny or Riddick. I asked Coach Joe about it again Sunday and he essentially said those rumors are not true, but I will still monitor the situation.

By Jason La Canfora  |  April 30, 2007; 10:33 AM ET
 
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Comments

1st

Posted by: BIGfish | April 30, 2007 10:57 AM | Report abuse

Sean Taylor once peeled an onion and the onion cried.

Posted by: Anonymous | April 30, 2007 11:00 AM | Report abuse

NO GIVING UP '08 PICKS

sorry didnt mean to type so loud...I get emotional

Posted by: Cheyenne, WY | April 30, 2007 11:01 AM | Report abuse

I second that Cheyenne. I'll take my chances on the current roster before giving up next year's picks. Unless it's a late rounder (5th, 6th or 7th) for someone who will come in and start at DE like that guy from Boofalo.

Posted by: BIGfish | April 30, 2007 11:04 AM | Report abuse

JLac, can you absolutely positively without a doubt verify we lost our Fourth Rounder next year?

Posted by: duck | April 30, 2007 11:04 AM | Report abuse

Anyone know if we've signed any free agents today, whom did not get drafted?

Posted by: Greg(Boston) | April 30, 2007 11:14 AM | Report abuse

JLC any chance that we would take a chance on Walter Thomas, that 6-6 370lb monster that played at OSU?

Posted by: Joe (DC) | April 30, 2007 11:15 AM | Report abuse

Also read somewhere that Chicago was interested in shopping DE Alex Brown. I know he killed us in the '05 opener, and he'd be a quality pickup.

Posted by: Jason (Durham, NC) | April 30, 2007 11:16 AM | Report abuse

We gave a 3rd rounder in 2007 and a 4th in 2008 for Duckett. Will post a link as soon as I can find it.

Posted by: BIGfish | April 30, 2007 11:17 AM | Report abuse

If we keep Springs and are able to get a D-Lineman, then I think we'll have had a really good offseason. I like our offense and with the running game we have and the progression of JC, we should be fine there. Landry and Taylor are monsters, so if we could rush the passer a little bit better, who knows how well we could do.

P.S.--with everything the Pats have done this offseason, over/under we get beat by 3 TD's when we play them this year in Foxboro?

Posted by: Matt | April 30, 2007 11:17 AM | Report abuse

From last JLC post:

Brunell is a very capable back-up... as long as he heals okay. Dont let your hatred for the man blind you.

Posted by: Inigo Montoya | April 30, 2007 10:59 AM

Posted by: Inigo Montoya | April 30, 2007 11:18 AM | Report abuse

Damn forgot all about the 4th pick in the Duckett debacle...I mean trade.

Posted by: Cheyenne, WY | April 30, 2007 11:20 AM | Report abuse

I believe the Redskins are not through with making personnel moves, but I highly doubt they'll make any big trades. Landry's contract is going to take up quite a bit of cap room, being a #6 overall pick. This would make it hard for the Skins to pick up a bunch of other players. Especially starter quality D-Lineman. But then again they could cut a few players and get creative with the cap like they always seem to do. Whatever it is, I just hope we retain all our first day draft picks in 2008.

One more thing, Now that we have the Taylor and Landry safety pairing, I propose we refer to them as the Bash Brothers.

Posted by: ktron | April 30, 2007 11:20 AM | Report abuse

Yeah a capable backup if you want to throw 3 yard screen passes to betts and portis all game!

Posted by: ce1782 | April 30, 2007 11:20 AM | Report abuse

That is a good point...what would a great name be for Taylor and Landry.

I think Bash Brothers has been used to death. Great concept though

Posted by: Cheyenne, WY | April 30, 2007 11:23 AM | Report abuse

Springs is no doubt, the best cover corner on the Skins...when he is HEALTHY and actually plays. I'd rather cut/trade him and make cap room than run the risk of once again watching him sit on the sidelines for 10 games.

Posted by: CC | April 30, 2007 11:25 AM | Report abuse

The sky isn't falling JLA. London Fletcher should prove to be a huge improvement over Lemar Marshall. That alone will toughen up the middle. Drafting a first round D-lineman isn't much of a guarantee anyway (the Skins have certainly learned that lesson). I wish they could have traded down, but apparently no one else was all that interested in the 6th pick. I also think Carter will have a much better year this year. He finally started turning it on at the end of the season.

One more thing: Any chance you could try to proofread your blog? For a writer you have an amazing number of typos and misspelled words.

Posted by: Mike Diamond | April 30, 2007 11:27 AM | Report abuse

Hello 3-13!

The Washington Redskins are suing NBC because the name "Law and Order" is better suited for their new safety tandem.

If the Verizon center is called "The Phone Booth:, shouldn't Fedex Field be called "The Package"?

Posted by: etrod | April 30, 2007 11:28 AM | Report abuse

Springs should not be released! There is no one on the team who can do what he does (when healthy)or available for that salary. Then it is last season all over again.

Posted by: bangkokben | April 30, 2007 11:28 AM | Report abuse

The Duckett deal. Obviously the first scenario didn't work out so the second is what happened....

This is in reference to the three-team deal the Broncos were a part of that sent Ashley Lelie to Atlanta, Duckett to Washington and draft considerations to Denver. It is a complex set of scenarios based on a points system that absolutely will not be official until both teams have completed their seasons.

And contrary to what you've seen elsewhere, there is only one scenario where the Broncos get only one of Washington's draft picks in that deal. The rest of the scenarios call for the Broncos to receive two picks.

The best scenario, in the Broncos minds, would be if -- again this is just a general approximation at this point -- Denver finished as one of the Super Bowl teams in the draft order (Nos. 31 or 32 in the first round) and Washington was the last team to make the playoffs (No. 20 in the first round).

In the deal, that kind of finish would mean the Broncos and Redskins would simply flip-flop No. 1 picks. That approximately 12-slot move up in the first round would be a coup for the Broncos since Lelie had made it clear he wasn't going to report to the Broncos anyway and Duckett isn't getting much playing time in Washington.

But if the Broncos finish too far in front of the Redskins in terms of record, the Broncos get Washington's third-round pick in the 2007 draft and fourth in '08 (the Redskins don't have a four in the '07 draft, so that's why the second pick is in '08).

Those are the two picks the Broncos would also get if they finish too close to the Redskins as well -- likely within two or three draft positions.

Posted by: BIGfish | April 30, 2007 11:29 AM | Report abuse

Springs should not be released! There is no one on the team who can do what he does (when healthy)or available for that salary. Then it is last season all over again.

Posted by: bangkokben | April 30, 2007 11:28 AM

Agree with ya completely. Compared to the other FA signings this year, Springs contract is a bargain if he is healthy. I think it is a risk worth taking. I would love to see Springs and Smoot starting with double move playing nickel.

Posted by: ce1782 | April 30, 2007 11:31 AM | Report abuse

bangkokben--

You nailed the problem with Springs: "When he is healthy." How many games do you figure him to play next year? Six? Eight? We can't afford the kind of money he's getting for so few minutes on the field.

Posted by: KK | April 30, 2007 11:33 AM | Report abuse

If the Skins got either Schobel or Burgess, I might poop my pants and try to get season tickets. That would be sickness incarnate.

Bash Brothers? I believe the proper name would be the poach off the RI's very own ... Bang Brothers.

Posted by: dcsween | April 30, 2007 11:35 AM | Report abuse

This offseason has been terrible. Maybe that's a good sign. Every year we win the Superbowl in March and flop by November. Maybe we will reverse the trend this year...maybe not.

I have a terrible feeling that we're in for a loooong season.

Posted by: etrod | April 30, 2007 11:36 AM | Report abuse

dcsween--Is there a special section at FedEx for pants poopers?

Posted by: KK | April 30, 2007 11:38 AM | Report abuse

dcsween--Is there a special section at FedEx for pants poopers?

Posted by: KK | April 30, 2007 11:38 AM

The owners box.

Posted by: etrod | April 30, 2007 11:39 AM | Report abuse

KK, I hope so ... [maybe that place where the Bills' punter is supposed to sit]

Posted by: dcsween | April 30, 2007 11:40 AM | Report abuse

Springs has only played in all 16 games of the season in 3 out of the ten years that he has been in the NFL. He hasn't played a complete season since 2000. Smoot, Macklin and Rogers would be fine at corner and maybe we could swing a deal for Asante Samuel. I would hate to go into next season knowing that he accounts for the highest amount of cap space on our team and then have him go down halfway through the season.

Sean Springs for Michael Strahan!!

Posted by: BIGfish | April 30, 2007 11:40 AM | Report abuse

etrod--

Okay, it will be a long season, but aren't you looking forward to seeing Landry shake people's teeth loose? Sure, the score will be 35-10, but someone's going to pay for those 35.

Who do you think will have more personal fouls -- Landry or Taylor?

Posted by: KK | April 30, 2007 11:40 AM | Report abuse

I'm listening to Vinny on Sports Talk 980, and he just said the Briggs thing is a dead issue. I'm glad to hear that next year's picks won't be going out the window for that.

Posted by: JustMe | April 30, 2007 11:40 AM | Report abuse

Wait, if we get of Vinny won't Danny's right hand get cold?

Posted by: Peter | April 30, 2007 11:41 AM | Report abuse

Objectively, I guess it would be OK if they got Strahan (a guy w/ one year left for a guy w/ one year left). Subjectively, I just really don't like Strahan. Even on the bench sitting next to Landry ... if LL were to shake any more of Strahan's teeth loose, ...

Posted by: dcsween | April 30, 2007 11:42 AM | Report abuse

JustMe--Do you think they even tell Vinnie whether the deal is dead or not? One call to the owner and, like a vampire, it's out of its coffin.

Posted by: KK | April 30, 2007 11:43 AM | Report abuse

Do people honestly believe that Grilliams will start Landry anytime before the first 6-8 games unless someone else goes down? As much as I'd like to see it, I don't think he will do it unless Landry absolutely impresses everyone during OTA's, spring training and pre-season.

Posted by: BIGfish | April 30, 2007 11:45 AM | Report abuse

KK,

I think Springs is good for about 13 games next year. If the FO is going to give the benefit of the doubt to the D-line and M Washington, I think they owe it to Springs. It is a risk but cover corner cannot be replaced with this roster or that amount of cash. FYI: Samuels is the highest on the cap; Springs two.

Posted by: bangkokben | April 30, 2007 11:45 AM | Report abuse

I'm way late on this, but I just wanted to give mad props to the Gov and AMTTS for calling Landry MONTHS ago. Nice work. Hopefully this will be fun to watch...

Posted by: WrongDog | April 30, 2007 11:45 AM | Report abuse

Greg,

Vinny said they signed 10 free agents last night after the draft was over, including the QB from Maryland.

Posted by: JustMe | April 30, 2007 11:47 AM | Report abuse

"... FYI: Samuels is the highest on the cap; Springs two.

Posted by: bangkokben | April 30, 2007 11:45 AM"

I thought that Portis was the highest on the cap (I remember that, until recently, Brunell was between Portis and Samuels). Is Springs really higher than Marcus? That surprises me.

Posted by: dcsween | April 30, 2007 11:48 AM | Report abuse

Strahan would be just like getting B. Smith when we did - no way he meets the expectations. Much more chance he plays less than Springs this year.

Posted by: bangkokben | April 30, 2007 11:48 AM | Report abuse

dcsween - I don't like Strahan a whole lot either but we would be filling a position of need with a pro-bowl caliber starter and a leader in the locker room. Both players are on their last years in the NFL but the difference is that Strahan has a better chance at staying healthy.

Posted by: BIGfish | April 30, 2007 11:49 AM | Report abuse

BIGfish - Landry might not start, but he should get plenty of playing time as Williams likes to rotate players and give different looks on Defense. Also, I'm sure Danny doesn't want to see #6 type money sitting on the bench.

Posted by: CC | April 30, 2007 11:49 AM | Report abuse

Ok - her are a few names for the boys...

Assault & Battery

The Black & Blues Brothers

The Hitmen

The Punishers

The Crunch Bunch

Posted by: hail to 'em | April 30, 2007 11:49 AM | Report abuse

I'm excited for the Landry & Taylor experiment to begin. Maybe with more help over the top, Carlos Rogers can learn to sit on those 7 yard hitch patterns on 3 and 5.

Posted by: Peter | April 30, 2007 11:49 AM | Report abuse

According to this Springs is the highest towards the cap. Not Samuels.

http://www.skinsfans.com/pcinoz/Rule%20of%2051.htm

Posted by: BIGfish | April 30, 2007 11:50 AM | Report abuse

Peter, actually his right hand will now be warm... hint hint wink wink

So I have been off the radar last couple of days, fam situation... but what has any of the Branch supporters have to say about him going 1st in the 2nd round. Not to start anything, but I just wondered if they were surprised or if any of the talking heads on the broadcasts gave good reasons why.

Posted by: PDSquared | April 30, 2007 11:51 AM | Report abuse

I think we should call them Unneccesary Roughness.

Posted by: etrod | April 30, 2007 11:51 AM | Report abuse

Bigfish,

How do ya figure? Strahan couldn't even walk last year.

DC,

I think I read that Springs cap number in a recent JLC article. He or Ocho-ocho will probably have to clarify.

Posted by: bangkokben | April 30, 2007 11:52 AM | Report abuse

I know I'm in the minority, but I like the Landry pick and think if Springs misses the middle 8 games we're still a 11-5 team who can push in the playoffs. It'd be nice to grab another DE (Burchette from Va Tech went undrafted... he'd be a nice pickup) but if not I don't feel too bad about the defense right now.
Of course, if D-Line is supposed to mainly tie up blockers and allow LB's to blitz like crazy, why did #56 never dominate and was constantly in the doghouse? Seems contradictory to me.

Posted by: Skin in NC | April 30, 2007 11:52 AM | Report abuse

Maybe "Automatic First Down" would be a good nickname for them.

Posted by: etrod | April 30, 2007 11:52 AM | Report abuse

How about "Crash and Burn"?

Posted by: etrod | April 30, 2007 11:53 AM | Report abuse

Or the "fifteen yarders".

Posted by: CC | April 30, 2007 11:53 AM | Report abuse

Not to raise a nickname from the past..
but how bout Capital Punishment?

Posted by: Skin in NC | April 30, 2007 11:54 AM | Report abuse

The BRUISE BROTHERS

Posted by: hail to 'em | April 30, 2007 11:54 AM | Report abuse

bangkokben - Good point about the health. Does anyone know what the injury was to Strahan last year anyway?

Posted by: BIGfish | April 30, 2007 11:55 AM | Report abuse

Wow! I'm suprised about those first few guys and what they look like for cap purposes. I forgot about all the 'restructurings' in the off-season (presumably cash pay downs, esp. for Portis). I remember about Springs not wanting to do a restructure. Probably just b/c doing so makes it easier to be traded away (and making it more difficult, dead space-wise, to cut him).

Posted by: dcsween | April 30, 2007 11:56 AM | Report abuse

I believe Strahan was out with a nagging wife....

Posted by: Peter | April 30, 2007 11:56 AM | Report abuse

I was all for getting Landry and I know he's going to be a good player, but I'm sick to my stomach after the draft because we completely ignored the D-line. I figured we'd take someone later on.

Now we're going to mortgage our future by trading away more picks for average talent and then over-paying them.

Oye.

Posted by: etrod | April 30, 2007 11:56 AM | Report abuse

Wasn't it his foot? Or was that the year before.

Posted by: bangkokben | April 30, 2007 11:57 AM | Report abuse

I wonder who will play deeper off the line of scrimmage. Other than Rogers of course who will be 64 yards off the line of scrimmage.

Posted by: Skinz | April 30, 2007 12:00 PM | Report abuse

Must have been last year. The year before he played in all 16 games and had 11.5 sacks.

Posted by: BIGfish | April 30, 2007 12:00 PM | Report abuse

Sween,

Springs refused a restructure like the others because his, like Wynn's recent restructure, would include a pay cut. He stated very early in the offseason that he wouldn't have an issue with a restructure, but he absolutely would not take a pay cut.

Posted by: JustMe | April 30, 2007 12:02 PM | Report abuse

Hello Justme,
I actually agree with you regarding Wynn not doing anything for some time. Daniels has been better when healthy, no question.

The question is then, why was Wynn's contract recently restructured, if the Skins are planning on keeping Daniels and cutting Wynn?

Seems the plan is restructure Wynn, because he is not earning anything, look and see who becomes available June 1, and cut Daniels if the player is not as much a risk as the unhealthy Daniels.

Posted by: Redskin Ray | April 30, 2007 12:03 PM | Report abuse

I think Springs' father told him not to take the pay cut.

Posted by: CC | April 30, 2007 12:04 PM | Report abuse

I see some June cuts on our D-Line. Plus, don't forget Kenard Lang, Big Daddy Wilkinson, Courtney Brown. There's plenty of "talent" out there to tide us over 'til next year's draft when we can go after a big wideout.

Like etrod said, looong year.

Posted by: KK | April 30, 2007 12:04 PM | Report abuse

First thing... PLEASE FIRE VINNY!


2nd thing... as for a nickname tandem: Burnt Bruisers

Posted by: Go Skins Go | April 30, 2007 12:06 PM | Report abuse

BRUISE BROTHERS

Posted by: hail to 'em | April 30, 2007 12:07 PM | Report abuse

Let me get this straight the Patriots only have to give up a Rd 4 pick for a WR that perhaps [I didn't say will be] has a shot at being in Canton one day.

Meanwhile Vinny coughs up a #3 for Duckett?
A #2 for an over-the-hill QB who was already going to be cut soon anyway?

Unbelievable!!
Teams must joke behind closed doors:
"Well, don't make that trade until you at least call Washington. There is a sucker born every minute".

Vinny has no bargaining courage, it appears.
You have to hang in there, and not cough it up so easily.

What's worse our FO says publicly "we are aggressive". No, we are unwise, not frugal, not good negotiators; ie. we can't play poker!!

Posted by: Redskin Ray | April 30, 2007 12:10 PM | Report abuse

How about "The Playoff Spectators"

Posted by: etrod | April 30, 2007 12:11 PM | Report abuse

Sean Springs is only 32. Old but not for a DB. His injury was not to his legs. He doesn't want a pay cut because if he got cut he likely would have made that money back again. Didn't we give 7M to Smoot? Not one year, but bonus. Still Sean would have a guaranteed bonus similar. The market was crazy. Now after June it probablly will have cooled.

Posted by: bangkokben | April 30, 2007 12:12 PM | Report abuse

How about "Pump and Fake"

Posted by: Dorf | April 30, 2007 12:12 PM | Report abuse

Free Agents -- ive seen a couple names on the wires: DE from UCLA Hickman, Long Snapper from WVU, WR from Boston College Sele... anyone have a good list?

Posted by: txskin | April 30, 2007 12:13 PM | Report abuse

Bruise brothers? Let's see what they call themselves or what the coaches call them.

What do you think the coaches call the front office: Heckyl and Jeckyll? Mutt and Jeff? Abbott and Costello? Tweedledum and Tweedledee?

Posted by: KK | April 30, 2007 12:16 PM | Report abuse

From Peter King (so grain of salt...)

"And H.B. Blades going in the fifth? The Redskins stole him. Just stole him."

Posted by: chris larry | April 30, 2007 12:18 PM | Report abuse

I'm fine with the 'skins "aggressive" philosphy in pursuing players and giving up draft picks. But, your absolutely right about where those picks are. The Ducket deal is the worst trade the 'skins ever made. The Lloyd deal, second worst. However, getting Coles was a good use of a draft pick. Throwing in a 2 along with Champ is where that trade went bad. When you have a track record of 'giving' away draft picks it makes trading for fair value that much more difficult.

Posted by: bangkokben | April 30, 2007 12:18 PM | Report abuse

How about "Pump and Fake"

Posted by: Dorf | April 30, 2007 12:12 PM

----
I second this

Posted by: Go Skins Go | April 30, 2007 12:19 PM | Report abuse

I liked Law and Order, who threw that out threre?

Posted by: Inigo Montoya | April 30, 2007 12:20 PM | Report abuse

I don't know if it'll be as long of a year as some of you guys think. Ok, so the D-line still needs to be addressed. I think a lot of next season is resting on our starters being healthy. If Griffin is healthy, he is an impact player. If Springs can stay healthy enough for at least a dozen games, the same can be said for him. If Marcus and Rocky are healthy they should play pretty well. Fletcher is a definite upgrade at MLB over Marshall. I'll also take Smoot over Wright and Rumph any day. I don't see our Defense finishing 31st again.

We also have several things to look forward to on the offensive side. A healthy Portis + Betts combination. The whole offense now beaing familiar with Al Saunders's offense, and Campbell having some game experience from last year.

Now I'm not saying we're gonna go 13-3 or 16-0 or something ridiculous like that, but I don't think next season will be anywhere near as long as this past season.

Posted by: k-tron | April 30, 2007 12:20 PM | Report abuse

Assault & Battery

Posted by: hail to 'em | April 30, 2007 11:49 AM

Good one, it's got my vote. So far anyway

Posted by: skinswest | April 30, 2007 12:21 PM | Report abuse

I think we want to be careful calling this a "terrible" off-season. I think it is more of a "boring" off-season which is atypical given the Redskins track record or FA signings.

This is how most teams do it. Not too many big splashes in free agency and building through the draft. The redskins are a year or two away from being able to do that because they have given up so many picks in the past years on players that didnt work.

I think the slow off-season could be viewed as the Redkins learning a lesson that the big aquisitions does not equate to playoff berths or superbowl appearances.

I am Cheyenne, WY and I approve this message

Posted by: Cheyenne, WY | April 30, 2007 12:22 PM | Report abuse

If there are any trades this offseason, they should be to aquire draft picks in '08. This season is already lost.

I know it won't happen because St. Joe only has 2 years left in his divine plan.

Posted by: etrod | April 30, 2007 12:23 PM | Report abuse

Bite and Whiff? No and Danny?

Posted by: SMACK | April 30, 2007 12:24 PM | Report abuse

Cheyenne,

Most teams address needs in the offseason, they don't pick up 37 linebackers and safties.

I agree that the offense will be fun to watch next season, but I can totally see the defense finishing at 31 or worse. We'll see a lot of 42-35 losses this year.

Posted by: etrod | April 30, 2007 12:25 PM | Report abuse

K-tron--

The whole problem with your rosey scenario is that every sentence includes the phrase "if ... stays healthy."

Now, some of the them will stay healthy, but all of them won't. And, when they go down, who is there to back them up?

No one. All the backups were traded away in the form of draft picks. There is no depth at any position except safety.

Posted by: KK | April 30, 2007 12:25 PM | Report abuse

Bite and Whiff? No and Danny?

Posted by: SMACK | April 30, 2007 12:24 PM

I think we have a winner. Leave it to a Cowboys fan.

Posted by: etrod | April 30, 2007 12:26 PM | Report abuse

Considering the fact that the NFL doesn't allow anything that used to be considered football anymore they will likely be known as "PERSONAL FOUL" and "UN-NECESSARY ROUGHNESS" or maybe if you consider Taylor's favorite foul they will be known as "SPLISH" and "SPLASH".

Posted by: SKINSRULE | April 30, 2007 12:27 PM | Report abuse

The whole trade thing is relative...

Lloyd is considered the second worst trade behind Duckett only because he was ineefective last year.

If he comes out this year recharged and leads the league in receptions, YAC, and TDs then of course it would be one of the best traes in history.

The jury is still out on Lloyd.

Posted by: Cheyenne, WY | April 30, 2007 12:28 PM | Report abuse

Spit and Roasted?

Posted by: SMACK | April 30, 2007 12:29 PM | Report abuse

enough already about we gave up to get Brunell. Would you have rrrrrrrrrreally rather taken your chances with Ramsey? #8 did take up to within a few playes of the Championship game. I am not a huge fan of #8, but he was the best option. So what we paid a little much for him. Wasn't the price really worth that playoff run we had?

As far as Duckett, were any of us in the locker room, on the practice field? Did you honestly think Betts was going to have the kind of season he had? The same people that are bashing the trade would have been bashing Gibbs had he NOT got another running back on the team, with Portis hurt. If you don't think for one second that Betts didn't look at the signing of Duckett as a challange, you are wrong. Betts knew this was his chance to shine or else his career could be coming to a close. Again, to see Betts take the reins, and become someone we could actually depend on, was worth the Duckett trade. Again I realize we gave up too much, but I would have rather had that trade, lit a fire under Betts, than to have Betts and Rock share carries.

When we traded up to get Soups, most of you complained, we gave up too much. Who knows best? The guys that watch countless hours of film on these players, visit with their former coaches, or the guys working a 9-5 job who post comments on how they could do it better while they are on the company clock? I will take my chances with the Hail of Fame coach and a excellent staff over Bob Petertugger who works in accounting.

As always Hail to 'em and love 'em or leave em.

Posted by: hail to 'em | April 30, 2007 12:29 PM | Report abuse

So we have Bite and Whiff teamed up with Double-Move. We just need a nickname for Springs.

I suggest A-Game because that's about how much he'll play this season.

Posted by: etrod | April 30, 2007 12:29 PM | Report abuse

Well put Hail to 'Em

Posted by: Cheyenne, WY | April 30, 2007 12:31 PM | Report abuse

They will probably make some sort of trade for a DE. They're willing to part with future picks to do it (as we seen time and time again).

We've been blogging about the Defense like crazy for days now.

Can the offense keep our defense off the field? Or at least keep them fresh late in the game?

Posted by: Stumped | April 30, 2007 12:31 PM | Report abuse

Springs should be 'Ouch'. As in, "pumps once to get Double-Move to bite, then the receiver blazes past Ouch!"

This will be even more funny on the radio, because you won't know whether it was Springs getting burned or the WR getting decapitated.

Posted by: cload and daggar | April 30, 2007 12:34 PM | Report abuse

I think you are mistaken about our 4th rnd pick in '08. We were supposed to give the equivilent of a high 3rd rnd pick, and we did. the 4th would have come into play if the 3rd was to low. So we should still have our complete draft for '08.

Posted by: Dana in St. Aug, FL | April 30, 2007 12:35 PM | Report abuse

its all a beauty contest at this point. this teams picks are better than that teams picks, this guy they should pick, past on this guy, yada yada yada.

Has there been a study on lets say kipers rating of players vs how well they perform in the league. I bet no.

I'm waiting till i see them play.

Posted by: Old School | April 30, 2007 12:37 PM | Report abuse

Hail to em.... I love your posting name!!

However what do you mean, enough already?
You miss the point.
Vinny and Danny are not savy when it comes to trading draft picks!

Everyone knew the Jags already determined that Brunnel was now only going to be a veteran back up at best in Jax.

His value was down; we come in and offer a #2 and they probably couldn't keep a straight face! They jumped up and down laughing we gave them all of that when they had two much younger, stronger, mobile QB's already!

Same w/ Duckett and Lloyd.
Those trades are inexcusable.
I'm not saying they couldn't trade for those players but to give up what they did, is a fireable offense, and they should be publicly criticized!

AFter all, they want to be publicly praised if LL turns out to be a good choice don't they? YES!

Posted by: Redskin Ray | April 30, 2007 12:38 PM | Report abuse

Dana, that's what I thought. So JLC saying next year's 4th is a bit of a disappointment. Even if the 5th pick in the 3rd round isn't high enough shouldn't it be a 6th or 7th not another "Randy Moss."

Posted by: bangkokben | April 30, 2007 12:39 PM | Report abuse

How about Mantle and Maris?

[two heavy hitters]

Posted by: Redskin Ray | April 30, 2007 12:40 PM | Report abuse

KK I understand what you're saying. I just don't buy into the thought that we're automatically doomed again next season. Even with some injuries I don't see us performing as bad defensively. If Springs goes down again, I'd much rather have Smoot and Rogers starting than those bums Wright or Rumph. Lemar Marshall isn't a bad backup at LB. He can play middle or outside if need be if one of those guys goes down. I'm not saying this is a Super Bowl team, but I believe we'll have more to cheer about than we did last year.

Posted by: k-tron | April 30, 2007 12:40 PM | Report abuse

RR,

It wasn't a 2 we gave for Brunell we gave that to Denver with Champ for Portis. It was a 3, I think, maybe a 4.

Posted by: bangkokben | April 30, 2007 12:42 PM | Report abuse

H.B. Blades was the steal of the 2007 draft, hands down.

I have no confidence in the handicappers. They were too busy with stopwatch and measuring tape to see what these guys have done on the field. Blades commanded the defense in college and will be a solid backup to Fletcher for two or three years before he makes his mark in the NFL.

Aside from Landry, the other picks should fill out the practice squad nicely.

Posted by: 82skins | April 30, 2007 12:42 PM | Report abuse


I don't think they necessarily plan to get rid of any starters on the Dline. Even though it might not be ideal, I think they believe they'll be okay on the Dline and that they would have been fine last year had Griffin, Salave'a, and Daniels not been banged up to varying degrees the entire season.

More sacks from the line would be nice, but if you check out the stats from all 3 years Grilliams has been here, the difference in sacks last season reflects a decline in production from the linebackers and the secondary. The Dline was about the same, and I guess it makes sense since they seem to be asked to stop the run before anything else. No, for the most part they didn't do that well last season, but I don't think they're interested in a better pass rush at the expense of stopping the run. And, I think they believe the old guys they have on the roster now are perfectly capable of doing that if they are healthy.

Have there been any crazy proposed deals involving DTs or DEs? None that I can think of (unlike the Samuel and Briggs shabingi). It looks like they wanted to bolster the secondary and the LBs so they could get back to playing Grilliams' defense instead of a BS cover two, which is more dependent on pressure coming directly from the Dline in order to be successful.

I'm actually not all that upset that there's been no move to upgrade the Dline yet, as they can upgrade *both* lines next season with a full compliment of picks if they choose to. What *will* upset me, though, is if they get rid of Springs in addition to not upgrading the personnel on the Dline. In the couple of games last season that Springs played near his normal level, the entire defense looked much better. So, my guess is the thinking is if they can improve the defensive backfield enough to prevent getting gashed by the deep ball, the rest will take care of itself.

I can understand why they do not want to have to depend on Springs to be healthy for the success of the defense. But (and I hate this saying), it is what it is, and Springs is the best corner on the roster, and there are no corners available who are at least as good. They need to suck it up and pay him because they have no hand in this situation. Even though he hasn't entirely earned his pay by missing so many games, he still holds all the cards.

Posted by: JustMe | April 30, 2007 12:42 PM | Report abuse

How saavy was it for the BEAGLES to trade with the COWBOYS and let someone in your own division get a player that we will be getting creamed by for the next 10 years?
Everybody is always calling that FO a bunch of brainiacs! How stupid was that! You never, never, never help anyone in your own division! STUPID BEAGLES!

Posted by: SKINSRULE | April 30, 2007 12:42 PM | Report abuse

Hail to 'em--

I'm with you on Brunell, but can't see your case for Duckett. Skins had talent here that was better than Duckett. Duckett was never worth more than a fifth. Remember, they weren't trying to get him, but to keep him away from Philly at the time.

Lloyd, they're stuck with for another year, so maybe he can make something of himself. But, they way overpaid. They had a year on his contract and didn't have to give him a new one with the big signing bonus.

Posted by: KK | April 30, 2007 12:42 PM | Report abuse

Damn, sorry for the book. I didn't realize I had gone on for so long. LOL

Posted by: JustMe | April 30, 2007 12:43 PM | Report abuse

Im with k-tron

I think we will be much better than last year.

Posted by: Cheyenne, WY | April 30, 2007 12:43 PM | Report abuse

We had to make a trade for Lloyd because he was under contract. I think we gave up a 4th rounder and I don't have a problem with that.

The issue I have is the extention we gave him. That was a joke. Everyone knew his story, tons of potential but a complete kuckle head. If we had made him play for a new contract he would have had some motivation to play well. Instead we rewarded him for having potential and have him no reason to live up to it.

Posted by: etrod | April 30, 2007 12:43 PM | Report abuse

Another disappointing year ahead I fear. London Fletcher is a talent, but has problems sheading blocks. Guess what, since we haven't addressed our DL needs.. he'll have OGs all over Fletcher. Landry will be a solid player, but not what we needed. Springs is a huge liability, but the best cover corner we have BY FAR !?!?! Welcome to the 08' Season boys... our bad free agency move has put us in the dog house for the forseeable future.

Posted by: cwprice | April 30, 2007 12:44 PM | Report abuse

hey... didn't really stay on top of the FA situation before the draft, and i don't know what the salary situation looked like, but why didn't we even take a look at Charles Grant before he resigned?

Posted by: jl | April 30, 2007 12:45 PM | Report abuse

Etrod --

As I recall it, we gave up two picks for Llyod -- a fourth last year and a third this year -- or vice versa. That was too much, but the really bonehead move was giving him a new contract and signing bonus, equal to Randle El's before he'd ever even played a down.

Posted by: KK | April 30, 2007 12:47 PM | Report abuse

Mr. Diamond- OK,I'm admittedly an hour behind, but with all due respect- I don't see JLC's tone as desperate as you seem to (you should refer back to some of the Archuletta posts); this is more of a generally pointing out the obvious. The Skins D-Line was subpar. An "improved" secondary (still lots of uncertainty here- Springs and Prix back from injury, Carlos needs to prove himself, Macklin and Smoot are somewhat unknown quantities) may or may not provide "coverage pressure." Also, a major cog the LB core, Washington, is coming off major surgery. Yes, Fletcher will be an improvement in the middle, but that doesn't answer possible questions to his left and right. While we all think Landry is a beast and are glad to have him, the majority of folks out here- blogging or not- wanted D-line help. That's all Jason was saying.

Also, this is a blog, not a published article; typos are and have been for a long time 1.)common 2.)expected 3.)even appreciated as amusing and anecdotal. Not trying to hate- just gotta back my man.

Posted by: D7 | April 30, 2007 12:48 PM | Report abuse

Pain and Sufferin?

Posted by: skinswest | April 30, 2007 12:48 PM | Report abuse

Mike Diamond smack to the back of your damn head. It's a blog.

Posted by: jm220 | April 30, 2007 12:49 PM | Report abuse

Just got Burned Brothers (No pass rush)

Posted by: Rob | April 30, 2007 12:50 PM | Report abuse

Nickname for saftey combo:

Oh Snap!

pessimist: Oh snap! there's another six.
optimist: Oh snap! Was Terrel Owen's fibula?

Posted by: bangkokben | April 30, 2007 12:54 PM | Report abuse

etrod,
Isn't the free-spending a bigger problem?

If you're at the top of the pay scale some of the incentive to work hard is siphoned away.

Are the contracts full of incentives? Or does Danny just rely on their competitive instincts?

Posted by: Anonymous | April 30, 2007 12:54 PM | Report abuse

Skinsrule - I agree the cowboys/eagles move trade made no sense- but who helped who? I've heard both sides - Hopefully all of the players involved have the same impact as Andre Johnson - the skins traded up with the cowboys to get him. You don't trade within your division.

Posted by: skinswest | April 30, 2007 12:55 PM | Report abuse

Well, at least one of my burning questions was answered. PDSquared, you asked about Branch -- I didn't hear anything from the wandering herd on TV, but much like Quinn, once he started falling it wasn't too surprising that he kept falling. Only one other DT (Harrell?) was taken between him and Okoye, and everyone thought that Green Bay picked him a little early.
I believe the Governor said it best; when it reached about #25, I started to think about how the skins could get a pick right about there to grab him. But there really wasn't any way that would have worked. A 2nd and 4th rounder would've come in handy...

But I will note that I had us taking Tyler Ecker in the 7th in January; of course, that was part of my all-Michigan fantasy FA/draft, but I still have the Mel Kiper acorn in my mouth.

Posted by: cload and daggar | April 30, 2007 12:56 PM | Report abuse

The Seahawks traded Darrell Jackson to the Niners. You make a trade when you feel you are getting the upper hand in the deal. Why not hoodwink someone within your own division? I don't get that.

Posted by: SMACK | April 30, 2007 12:58 PM | Report abuse

If the Giants offered two #1 picks for Brunell, you guys would be like, sorry, you're in our own division? Please dismount your high horse.

Posted by: SMACK | April 30, 2007 1:01 PM | Report abuse

beep beep! new post

Posted by: Anonymous | April 30, 2007 1:02 PM | Report abuse

I'm with you "Hail to em,"...I get sick of rehashing the same trades from bandwagon fans.

Here's what the Skins have done well so far.

1) Hold the line on Springs. 7.2 million for a corner coming off of a sports hernia is too much. He's one of the best we've got but I wouldn't send us into cap hell for him.

2) not paying 18 million for Dockery. That would have been insane!

3) Resigning Sellars and Randy Thomas(give the FO some credit for locking up their own)

4) drafting the best available defensive player in positon of need (even though not the most need)

5) Naming Campbell the starter going into the season

6) drafting H.B. Blades (good pick, he was a beast...we'll see in the pros)

On another note...Is it me, or does the New England Patriots draft seem a bit over the top. I'm not giving them the trophy yet...Remember, we've done the fantasy football thing.

Posted by: sicwidit | April 30, 2007 1:03 PM | Report abuse

"How about Mantle and Maris?

[two heavy hitters]

Posted by: Redskin Ray | April 30, 2007 12:40 PM"

You must be thinking about JaMarcus Russell and Gaines Adams. Am I the only one who noticed Brady Quinn trying to start smoking pot right around pick #14?

Posted by: dcsween | April 30, 2007 1:03 PM | Report abuse

First of all - I love the Landry pick. Obviously the guys that sat around for the last 60 days and did nothing but review tape decided that there were no other defensive players worthy of that pick and did the right thing. He and Taylor will put the fear of God in a lot of receivers for years to come. As mentioned by others before, it is easy for those of us that have full time jobs outside of football to sit back and criticize like armchair quarterbacks.

Second - For those of you who are upset that we didn't go after a DT or DE in the later rounds, please go take a look at our roster on the Redskins website and see for yourself how many young DT's and DE's that we already have been developing. A late round pick would end up in the exact same spot as these guys. It would have been different if we would have had 2nd or 3rd round picks to get a D-lineman but we didn't.

Posted by: BIGfish | April 30, 2007 1:03 PM | Report abuse

I love The Crunch Bunch, that fit's perfectly...

As for extending Lloyd's contract before he played in DC, that's the exact same tactic we used when we traded for Portis. It's a show of faith and in CP's case it worked out because he felt wanted and respected and rewarded the Skins with a pretty darn good season including that TD rip on his first carry at FedEx. So I can't blame them for thinking the same thing would work with Lloyd eventhough it's obvious now that his character is quite a bit different than CP. But hind site is perfect at RI...as always

Posted by: Gibby | April 30, 2007 1:06 PM | Report abuse

Great point BIGfish! the Skins get criticized for not developing young players, but when you look at the youn lineman we have (Golston, Montgomery), it's not so bad. Personally, I don't think any DE can change a game without a good secondary.

Posted by: sicwidit | April 30, 2007 1:07 PM | Report abuse

It's not just Golston and Montgomery though and people don't realize that. Have a look at the young D-lineman we have. Not toppicks but they probably have a leg up on anyone that we would have taken in the later rounds.

http://www.redskins.com/team/;jsessionid=MJIJIIONPNAH

Posted by: BIGfish | April 30, 2007 1:12 PM | Report abuse

"I don't think they necessarily plan to get rid of any starters on the Dline. Even though it might not be ideal, I think they believe they'll be okay on the Dline and that they would have been fine last year had Griffin, Salave'a, and Daniels not been banged up to varying degrees the entire season. ...

Posted by: JustMe | April 30, 2007 12:42 PM"

Although the mouthpiece was Clinton Portis, I recall that it was the D-linemen who attributed, in part, the squallid performance and injuries to last season's early preseason workout grind. Something about how their bodies needed some downtime to recoup/recover/regenerate/heal. Hopefully, that was accurate and the change of plans this season results in a healthier team next season.

Posted by: dcsween | April 30, 2007 1:12 PM | Report abuse

SMACK - so who got hoodwinked there? Looks like Seattle. The niners get a decent vet WR for only a 4th rounder? So sure from the niners standpoint do the deal, but now the seahawks have weakened themselves and strengthened a rival - seems like a dumb move.

Posted by: skinswest | April 30, 2007 1:14 PM | Report abuse

SMACK - now if your division rival is going to be stupid then your absolutely right - Brunell for 2 #1's Git er done.

Posted by: skinswest | April 30, 2007 1:16 PM | Report abuse

sicwidit,

I enjoyed the 1:03pm post and, like you and others, am absolutely exhausted with the constant rehashing of the misdeeds of our Front Office since Snyder's owned the team. I swear, some people act like the Redskins are a lover who has repeatedly cheated on them, so they "take them back" after every incident, but throw the incident back in their faces at every opportunity. If I felt that way, I wouldn't even bother.

Anyway, it's nice when folks focus on the positive.

Posted by: JustMe | April 30, 2007 1:17 PM | Report abuse

There's a bunch of guys out there. We are gonna target somebody and see what happens. Hopefully we will get somebody who will play their guts out and give us 110%. It's too early to crown the Cowboys and that's just what you guys are trying to do. Crown them.

Posted by: JJ GIBBS | April 30, 2007 1:18 PM | Report abuse

"SMACK - so who got hoodwinked there? Looks like Seattle. The niners get a decent vet WR for only a 4th rounder? ...

Posted by: skinswest | April 30, 2007 01:14 PM"

The hoodwinking is on the Skins. Patriots get Randy Moss (bad attitude) for a 4th rounder. The Niners get Darrell Jackson (fine attitude) for a 4th rounder. Skins got Brandon Lloyd (bad attitude) for a 4th AND A THIRD rounder.

Posted by: dcsween | April 30, 2007 1:18 PM | Report abuse

how bout "Shake and Bake"

Posted by: Anonymous | April 30, 2007 1:19 PM | Report abuse

Sween,

Daniels was another of the players who wanted to work out on his own as he felt he was more productive, and that his body held up better over the course of the season, when he was able to train in his own way with his own trainer(s).

We'll see if it makes a difference. Hopefully, it will.

Posted by: JustMe | April 30, 2007 1:19 PM | Report abuse

dcsween - ugh - that puts it in perspective.

Posted by: skinswest | April 30, 2007 1:20 PM | Report abuse

I think the max I'd ever give up for Strahan at this point in his career would be a 5th rounder. For the past 3-5 years, when people bring him up in a trade scenario, I'd always think- are you kidding?! He's a thousand years old! I think that's been a partial reflection of my distaste for all things Giant. Now, of course, I think he is actually approach a thousand. No more giving up serious leverage for old guys who have max 70% of one season left.

Posted by: D7 | April 30, 2007 1:21 PM | Report abuse

Just wanted to say I love you guys... Barry Svrluga is a great writer and keeps his loyal well informed, but the people that follow his blog (Nationals Journal) are fairly boring/and or too serious.

well done friends.

For those of you who are too serious and get annoyed by people like me, back off... I was here first.

Posted by: Dorf | April 30, 2007 1:21 PM | Report abuse

The difference between Portis and Lloyd is that Portis had a body of work that warrented an extention. Back to back 1500 yard seasons to start your career warrants special treatment.

Lloyd's best season was 48 catches, 733 yards and 5 TD's. Average at best.

Posted by: etrod | April 30, 2007 1:25 PM | Report abuse

SMACK makes a great point if you think your trading partner is stupid then bombs away. The Giants would have to think we are stupid to trade an over-the-hill DE like Strahan to your division rival for less than oh let me see? 2 2nd round picks say in 08 and 09! That's about the equivalent of 2 #1's for Brunell! Strahan was great back in the day but like Springs can't stay healthy for 16-18 games.

Posted by: SKINSRULE | April 30, 2007 1:25 PM | Report abuse

I wasn't here much this weekend. Did we already talk about Goodell's idea for a 17 game season (with only 3 preseason game) where every team has to play a game where both teams are "away"?

Personally, I love it (and Portis probably does too).

4-12, however, might need to change his name to 4-13.

Posted by: dcsween | April 30, 2007 1:30 PM | Report abuse

A redskins fan since consciousness and the son of a 'skins fan since before Sammy Baugh. I got creds, my friends.

The secret to Gibbs football was to pump the score and make opponents play from behind. Defense had to be good enough. Looks to me that were in that position going into the season. I'm not annointing anybody in the coaches box or the FO, but I'm not ready to apply my fervent but limited knowledge to critiquing these guys. Give me an average offense of 25pts and an avg def of 20pts. It's funner that way. And I like GiGi's defensive scheme: Let the backers make the plays. It worked pretty well for the Ravens (never did like any Baltimore team, BTW...) I think we have a fine QB in Jason. Most of the passes he missed were in the dirt where nobody could catch the ball. I like that. We don't need a D that lights 'em up. We need a D that keeps us in the game so the O can light 'em up. Redskins: love 'em or leave 'em. Me, I've had a love hate with them for >45 yrs. It's fun.

Posted by: Neil in Durango | April 30, 2007 1:31 PM | Report abuse

Well we shouldn't be surprised but the Redskins draft was a bit of a non-event. Landry and then a bunch of guys. We're screwed for next year.

Posted by: Ed the Red | April 30, 2007 1:31 PM | Report abuse

4-12, however, might need to change his name to 4-13.

Posted by: dcsween | April 30, 2007 01:30 PM

Man thats harsh :)

Posted by: Cheyenne, WY | April 30, 2007 1:31 PM | Report abuse

sicwidit,

I agree with you optimism but disagree with your take on the 'skins holding the line with Springs. "He's one of the best we've got but I wouldn't send us into cap hell for him."

No, Springs is THE best we have. No, paying his salary now would not put us in cap hell. Right now it fits under the cap. The FO was trying to get him to take a cut so that they could have more room to sign free agents.

Trading him makes no sense because he will still count against the cap.

Posted by: bangkokben | April 30, 2007 1:31 PM | Report abuse

does anybody have the list of undrafted free agents we signed last night?

Posted by: TT | April 30, 2007 1:32 PM | Report abuse

How about naming the Giants bookend DE's

"Pissed off" and "Urination"

Posted by: SKINSRULE | April 30, 2007 1:33 PM | Report abuse

I can't believe anyone is advocating getting rid of Springs.

Does a starting tandem of Carlos "still plays like a rookie" Rogers and Fred "got benched for a rookie last year" Smoot scare anyone else?

Without Springs, our CBs become a huge liability. Anyone who's banking on Carlos becoming a #1 CB next year needs to take them burgundy sunglasses off.

Posted by: Clinton Hill | April 30, 2007 1:35 PM | Report abuse

Clinton's right!

Posted by: bangkokben | April 30, 2007 1:37 PM | Report abuse

If you look back at all the players that have created contract noise while with the skins where the the skins have backed down and submitted to the player...

probably not too often. It seems like the Skins have very little patience for these types of guys.

With that being said, Im not sure that Springs fits into that category . Fact is he is owed that money in his contract and has no obligation to restructure.

But that kind of money for a guy whos health coming into the season is risky (as are all players) he has the distinction of already being hurt much of last year.

Has anyone crunched the numbers on the defensive stats before and after Springs made his return...

was the defense that much better with him there (I mean 7 million dollars better)?

Posted by: Cheyenne, WY | April 30, 2007 1:38 PM | Report abuse

Darrell Jackson, like Springs, is also injury prone. If he stays healthy this year, it'll be a good trade for the Niners.

Posted by: CC | April 30, 2007 1:39 PM | Report abuse

Right now we are 5 mil under the cap and we still need to sign Landry. If we find a good DT or DE in a FA or a trade that requires a decent contract then Springs may just be a "cap casualty" If we cut him or trade him after June 1st then we clear up almost 5 mil of cap space. The only other player that can clear up close to that cap space if cut or traded would be Marcus Washington (4 mil).

Posted by: BIGfish | April 30, 2007 1:40 PM | Report abuse

How come no one says "If Jason Campbell stays healthy he will..." or "if chris Cooley stays healthy he will..."

That is because their bodies are not viewed as compromised like Springs' is.

Posted by: Cheyenne, WY | April 30, 2007 1:43 PM | Report abuse

Clinton Hill, not sure anyone is actually advocating releasing Springs, just predicting it based on stuff coming out to date. Personally, I think the math has to have changed from the Skins perspective. Given the salaries that #1 CBs are now getting in the NFL, the Skins MUST realize they are getting more value from the Springs contract compared to what they would have been thinking before.

Cheyenne, my 4-12 comment is not harshing on the Skins. Its just that 4-12 indicated earlier he would not change his blogname till the Skins win their 5th game, i.e., they have to EARN his new nickname. Here's to that happening at the beginning of Week 6!

Posted by: dcsween | April 30, 2007 1:44 PM | Report abuse

Has anyone crunched the numbers on the defensive stats before and after Springs made his return...

I don't really need stats to tell me how bad Carlos was as a #1 last year, or how bad Kenny Wright was as a #2.

Springs value was obvious just watching the games.

Yes Springs has injury issues (although last year was abnormally bad) and yes he's probably a little over-paid. But I don't see any other viable options. We need to over-pay him for one more year and deal with the secondary next year.

It's not worth cutting Springs so that we can spend his $7M on Lance Briggs or some other new big name.

Posted by: Clinton Hill | April 30, 2007 1:46 PM | Report abuse

Still, for all we know, instead of Springs being a June 1 cap casualty, maybe he could end up as a May 30 contract restructuring.

Posted by: dcsween | April 30, 2007 1:46 PM | Report abuse

S. Taylor and Landry will combine to provide "Capital Punishment" for opposing offenses. Landry is faster than any of our current CB's, including s. springs by the way.

Posted by: Max | April 30, 2007 1:51 PM | Report abuse

Here's to hoping D.C. (Springs restructuring)

Posted by: bangkokben | April 30, 2007 1:54 PM | Report abuse

LaReaper.

Posted by: Nate in the PDX | April 30, 2007 1:55 PM | Report abuse

4-13

Posted by: 4-12 | April 30, 2007 1:55 PM | Report abuse

Why are we trading 3rd and 4th round pics for a backup running back in TJ Duckett, when the Pats can get Randy Moss for only a 4th.

This FO is a joke.

Posted by: spicarde | April 30, 2007 1:57 PM | Report abuse

spicarde, I object to your use of the English language: "Why are we trading..."

We are not. We did. And knock on wood will never do it again.

Posted by: bangkokben | April 30, 2007 2:00 PM | Report abuse

Landry and Reaper = Bang Brothers

Posted by: Anonymous | April 30, 2007 2:01 PM | Report abuse

'cause some of their hits on the opposition are just OBSCENE.

Posted by: Anonymous | April 30, 2007 2:02 PM | Report abuse

Hey sicwidit!

You do bring up some good moves the Skins FO has made this year.
And that is the point, it is this year, finally!

But do you know why we had no #2, 3, 4 picks this past weekend? Because we are reaping what our FO sowed the last few years!

But don't refer to someone as a bandwagon fan, when you have no evidence of such!
I have posted on here several times, that I have been with this team since my childhood, and I am not jumping on ANY wagon that comes down the road.

To me, it is a mark of character and guts.
It takes more of both to continue to support one team than jump to another team.

I recall vividly the 13-13 year under Norv Turner.
I recall being upset with Joe Gibbs starting o-5, but they were my team.
I recall the Skins in 78 starting something like 6-2 but finishing 2-6 in the second half! That was agonizing to be so excited and finish so weakly.

No jump on wagons here;
I'm in for the long haul.

Posted by: Redskin Ray | April 30, 2007 2:03 PM | Report abuse

poor english aside, I would like to see JLaC ask Vinny to justify that one...

Posted by: spicarde | April 30, 2007 2:04 PM | Report abuse

Thanks spicarde...
my point in my earlier posts exactly!

Like I said, other teams say, "hey, did you call Washington yet? They will give you anything!!!"

Posted by: Redskin Ray | April 30, 2007 2:04 PM | Report abuse

I just hope Landry and Taylor don't get into a contest on who can hit the hardest during the games and forget that they still have to "tackle" the player. Not that I don't mind seeing the Reaper laying wood, but often times the players take a lick and keep going for another 5-7 yards...

Posted by: CC | April 30, 2007 2:05 PM | Report abuse

Redskin Ray just have me a great idea for nicknames for the safeties.

The Reaper and The Sower!

Posted by: etrod | April 30, 2007 2:05 PM | Report abuse

Hey spicarde, while you're at it, ask Vinny about

Bruce Smith
Mark Carrier
Deion Sanders
Jeff George
Randle- El getting All-Pro $
AA getting Canton $
Giving up a #1 for Jason Campbell when he wasn't on anyones board for another 20 selections?


Posted by: Redskin Ray | April 30, 2007 2:09 PM | Report abuse

SeanRon?

Posted by: BIGfish | April 30, 2007 2:10 PM | Report abuse

Hey Etrod,

What did you think of Mantle and Maris?

They were the two heaviest hitters in baseball and on the same team! Made for a powerful one-two punch!

Posted by: Redskin Ray | April 30, 2007 2:12 PM | Report abuse

Toast?

Posted by: etrod | April 30, 2007 2:12 PM | Report abuse

Hey Etrod,

What did you think of Mantle and Maris?

They were the two heaviest hitters in baseball and on the same team! Made for a powerful one-two punch!

Posted by: Redskin Ray | April 30, 2007 02:12 PM

And a lot of strikeouts. Works for me.

Posted by: etrod | April 30, 2007 2:13 PM | Report abuse

The big question is can Landry quarterback the secondary like Clark used to do (which was the only negative on Landry's scouting). The Reaper needs to be told where to go. If Landry can be the QB or Fletcher takes on that responsibility we will be in good shape.
If Taylor is back there with another guy who doesn't know where to position himself...we could be in trouble.

Posted by: spicarde | April 30, 2007 2:14 PM | Report abuse

Wow. I'm a real negative nancy today, aren't I?

Posted by: etrod | April 30, 2007 2:15 PM | Report abuse

I think Fletcher is more suited to QB the defense.

Posted by: Cheyenne, WY | April 30, 2007 2:15 PM | Report abuse

I recall vividly the 13-13 year under Norv Turner.

Posted by: Redskin Ray | April 30, 2007 02:03 PM

13-13? Now that's what we're talking about when we say it's going to be a loooong year!

Posted by: KK | April 30, 2007 2:15 PM | Report abuse

Yes, swinging for the fences, lots of big hits but some big whiffs as well.

Mantle and Maris works for me.

Posted by: Redskin Ray | April 30, 2007 2:16 PM | Report abuse

There is no hacggobing for ki i 207. Check the salary cap - thn't nough cap space to sign the players who were drafted. There aren't enough contracts left to be restructured. Someone has to go. Springs will be the one. Maybe they use him in a trade for Schobel. But Springs is GONE.

Posted by: Anonymous | April 30, 2007 2:16 PM | Report abuse

I think Springs is also a QB on the field for Taylor, that is WHEN Springs is on the field.

Posted by: CC | April 30, 2007 2:17 PM | Report abuse

Why are we trading 3rd and 4th round pics for a backup running back in TJ Duckett, when the Pats can get Randy Moss for only a 4th.

This FO is a joke.

Posted by: spicarde | April 30, 2007 01:57 PM


this is a great point!

Posted by: Anonymous | April 30, 2007 2:17 PM | Report abuse

Thanks KK, hadn't noticed my typo.
That was supposed to be the 94 year where we went 3-13.

Norv: how many times did he always seem to reply:
"We didn't make plays".

Every single play is a play to make.
What is that supposed to mean anyway?
It is really lame, you know?
It says absolutely nothing about anything.

Posted by: Redskin Ray | April 30, 2007 2:18 PM | Report abuse

Too many if's and when's to justify that kind of money for Springs.

I understand the logic that the alternatives are nbot great...but when you lose Springs for the season; you have the same depth chart and 7 million less than you had.

It's risk vs. reward.

Posted by: Cheyenne, WY | April 30, 2007 2:19 PM | Report abuse

"There is no hacggobing for ki i 207. Check the salary cap - thn't nough cap space to sign the players who were drafted."

Can someone translate this for me?

Posted by: BIGfish | April 30, 2007 2:19 PM | Report abuse

There is no hacggobing for ki i 207.

Posted by: | April 30, 2007 02:16 PM

That's what I'm talking about!

Posted by: Anonymous | April 30, 2007 2:19 PM | Report abuse

Let's see here:

Hurt in 2005 when we needed you in the playoffs.

Hurt in 2006

Age 32,

trying to play corner and can't get your hip / thigh healthy.

Oh, you won't take a restructured contract for the team when you are scheduled to make 7 mil?

C-YA.

Posted by: Redskin Ray | April 30, 2007 2:22 PM | Report abuse

The Raiders wouldve traded Moss for an assortment of Hot Pockets....he's an a$$

They wanted him gone.

Posted by: Cheyenne, WY | April 30, 2007 2:22 PM | Report abuse

I like the Mantle and Maris for now until they prove they can be consistent on the "swinging for the fences" part and not the "whiffs" but can we shorten that up to M&M to make it easier on the carpal tunnel?

Posted by: BIGfish | April 30, 2007 2:23 PM | Report abuse

Redskin Ray--

Didn't mean to rag on you about a typo -- it just fit in well with the earlier posts about a loooooong season as well as the nature of memory -- I was sitting here asking myself, "Why can't I remember that 13-13 season? What's he know that I don't? Damn, I need a record book like his."

Posted by: KK | April 30, 2007 2:23 PM | Report abuse

Hell, maybe Brunell could QB the defense. At least we wouldn't be asking him to make any tough throws, or ANY throws for that matter, and he'd fit in really well with all the senior citizens on the other side of the ball. He couldn't be any worse back there than Archuleta.

Posted by: Nate in the PDX | April 30, 2007 2:24 PM | Report abuse

Cheyenne, you just made me think of Jim Gaffigan's glorious riff on Hot Pockets. I do love me some Gaffigan.

Posted by: Nate in the PDX | April 30, 2007 2:25 PM | Report abuse

Springs missed 7 games last year and one each of the other years here. What makes you think he'll miss the whole year. He will be a year past his surgery. It wasn't a wheel. He'll be fine. I'm all for restructuring, I just think it's hogwash to ask him to take a cut. Hell we just gave Wynn 500,000 to restructure.

Posted by: bangkokben | April 30, 2007 2:25 PM | Report abuse


Why are we trading 3rd and 4th round pics for a backup running back in TJ Duckett, when the Pats can get Randy Moss for only a 4th.

This FO is a joke.

Posted by: spicarde | April 30, 2007 01:57 PM

**********************************

While I agree that far too much was given up for TJ Duckett, particularly considering how little he was used, I don't think you can really compare the situations. They truly have nothing in common other than desperation. And, the Skins were desperately trying to make an acquisition, hence the over payment for a player who wasn't as good as those already on the roster. The Raiders, however, were desperate to unload a problem player in time to get a pick in this year's draft. Further tying the Raiders ability to get good value for that same problem player was that he refused to take a pay cut for any team other than New England, making him virtually untradeable to anyone else. Under normal circumstances, there's no way a player like Moss (at least Moss when he doesn't quit on his team) gets dealt for just a 4th rounder.

Posted by: JustMe | April 30, 2007 2:26 PM | Report abuse

There is no hacggobing for ki i 207. Check the salary cap - thn't nough cap space to sign the players who were drafted.

Posted by: | April 30, 2007 02:16 PM

ack da hacggobing ki? i 207? splundh ertas en gniboggcah salary cap!

Posted by: Anonymous | April 30, 2007 2:26 PM | Report abuse

I'm not sure if this has been discussed in the past but does anyone know if the Redskins would be eligilble to recieve a compensatory pick next year for Derrick Dockery signing with the Bills?

Posted by: Rob | April 30, 2007 2:26 PM | Report abuse

Let's see here:

Hurt in 2005 when we needed you in the playoffs.

Hurt in 2006

Age 32,

trying to play corner and can't get your hip / thigh healthy.

Oh, you won't take a restructured contract for the team when you are scheduled to make 7 mil?

C-YA.

Posted by: Redskin Ray | April 30, 2007 02:22 PM

BINGO!!!!

Posted by: Cheyenne, WY | April 30, 2007 2:26 PM | Report abuse

Gaffigan on Hot Pockets.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=QUVmSBGyKm0

You can thank me later.

Posted by: Nate in the PDX | April 30, 2007 2:26 PM | Report abuse

"Did I eat it or rub it on my face?"

Posted by: Anonymous | April 30, 2007 2:28 PM | Report abuse

The FO's Nickname should be "Left Hand and Right Hand".

Posted by: Otter | April 30, 2007 2:28 PM | Report abuse

i love hot pockets!

straight cash homey.

Posted by: Anonymous | April 30, 2007 2:28 PM | Report abuse

How about

Tom and Jerry?

Two quick cats back there as safety?

Posted by: Redskin Ray | April 30, 2007 2:28 PM | Report abuse

What would be even worse is Springs stays, We go 13-3, win the division and make it to the playoffs, then he gets hurt on the last game of the regular season and we lose the first game of the playoffs because Rogers continously gets burnt.

If we do trade/cut Springs then we better be making some moves to get Samuel from the Pats. Oh wait - I bet that would involve next years picks. Maybe we should keep him after all?

Posted by: BIGfish | April 30, 2007 2:28 PM | Report abuse

Redskins Ray...

There are many out here who know nothing about the Redskins except what they hear on SportsTalk 980.

Personally, I think Springs is gone...

Posted by: sicwidit | April 30, 2007 2:28 PM | Report abuse

Thanks Jason. :)

- Ray

Posted by: Ray | April 30, 2007 2:29 PM | Report abuse

When is the NFL draft?

Posted by: kO | April 30, 2007 2:30 PM | Report abuse

2004 Shawn Springs led the team in interceptions and sacks.

Posted by: bangkokben | April 30, 2007 2:30 PM | Report abuse

probably a dumb question but here it goes...

If the doctors all say that Springs is 100% and he appears to be in great shape and ready to dominate...

do the Skins cut him anyway just to save the money, or do we give him what he is owed (legally not ethically)?

Posted by: Cheyenne, WY | April 30, 2007 2:31 PM | Report abuse

This idle talk about Asante Samuel - I don't think he is going anywhere. There was that little flare-up a few weeks ago and then nothing. My guess is the Patriots management told him to cool his jets until the draft was over and then his contract would be taken care of. The Patriots had the cap space and probably still do. They are probably just trying to work out the structure for his deal.

Posted by: Otter | April 30, 2007 2:31 PM | Report abuse

2004 Shawn Springs led the team in interceptions and sacks.

Posted by: bangkokben | April 30, 2007 02:30 PM

This is known as "the good old days." Hell, in 2004 I had all my hair.

Posted by: KK | April 30, 2007 2:32 PM | Report abuse

Everyone seems to be forgetting that Springs is the best corner on the freakin' team. Last I checked that counts for something.

And he's a bargain if you compare his current salary to whatever we would forfeit in cutting him or trading him, which would almost certainly yield a lesser CB.

Our bed is made for '07 personnel, to a HUGE extent. We're going to war with the players we have, with a very few exceptions. I'll take Springs' known knowns (including the injury history and age) over the known unknowns of anybody else we might dream up to be our #1 corner.

And by the way something, where is Lisa to leap to her boy's defense up here?

Posted by: Nate in the PDX | April 30, 2007 2:32 PM | Report abuse

new post, and it's terrible news.

Posted by: Anonymous | April 30, 2007 2:33 PM | Report abuse

beep beep

new post

Posted by: Anonymous | April 30, 2007 2:34 PM | Report abuse

sicwidit, I'll have you know that I don't listen to Sportstalk 980 now that I'm not a NoVA commuter, so I know even less than the 980-informed fans up here. Ha!

Posted by: Nate in the PDX | April 30, 2007 2:34 PM | Report abuse

Otter - Be it Samuel or any other young shut down corner...if we cut/trade Springs then we better have something in mind. Smoot could return to form being back at "home" and Rogers could improve but that's taking a big chance.

Posted by: Anonymous | April 30, 2007 2:34 PM | Report abuse

Going to keep my silly talk over here on this thread in deference to the sad news on the next thread.

Posted by: Nate in the PDX | April 30, 2007 2:36 PM | Report abuse

I agree that we need to keep Springs even if we can only count on him for 12 games. Smoot hurts his sturnum every time he makes a tackle. Without Springs on the roster that leaves Double Move covering the opponents #1 receiver at least a couple of games next season. We saw how well this worked out last year.

Posted by: spicarde | April 30, 2007 2:36 PM | Report abuse

If I had t listen to the radio for my football information then I would have to kill myself being that I live in Dallas.

Posted by: BIGfish | April 30, 2007 2:37 PM | Report abuse

Does anyone have the list of FA's we signed last night?


Apples to Oranges on the Moss/Duckett trades. Neither is the same. Without Duckett, we are looking at Betts (who had a history of staying healthy) Rock (history of putting the ball on the ground) and Nemo (exactly... no history)

remember we were building on going BACK to the playoffs without the services of our number 1 back. If things went differently. you guys would have been praising Gibbs for how great he was in keeping the team together.

Posted by: hail to 'em | April 30, 2007 2:37 PM | Report abuse

Now there is a great thread idea:

Vinny and Danny, what is their nickname to be?

Right hand left hand? That was creative!

What do you think of:

Felix and Oscar

Posted by: Redskin Ray | April 30, 2007 2:37 PM | Report abuse

Nickname for Springs should be "ER".

Posted by: Anonymous | April 30, 2007 2:39 PM | Report abuse

Laurel and Hardy? Moe and Curly? Beavis and Butthead? Dumb and Dumber?

Posted by: BIGfish | April 30, 2007 2:39 PM | Report abuse

Kevin Mitchell. Former Redskins LB passed away this morning.

http://www.redskins.com/news/newsDetail.jsp?id=1547

Posted by: BIGfish | April 30, 2007 2:42 PM | Report abuse

I'm afraid they think they are Batman and Robin, but are more like:
Kermit and Miss Piggy

That's it for me for awhile.... got to get back to work.

Posted by: Redskin Ray | April 30, 2007 2:43 PM | Report abuse

Actually, since Batman smells and Robin layed an egg, that may not be too far off.

Posted by: etrod | April 30, 2007 2:46 PM | Report abuse

Wow. I'm a real negative nancy today, aren't I?

Posted by: etrod | April 30, 2007 02:15 PM

*****************************

Yep. I normally really enjoy your posts -- especially the Sean Taylorisms. Come on... Dig up one to bring yourself out of your funk. You can do it. ;-)

Posted by: JustMe | April 30, 2007 2:48 PM | Report abuse

I think you overemphasize how bad the Skins DL was last year. The D line held strong, it was the linebackers who couldn't fill, and make plays.

Posted by: Mittens | April 30, 2007 2:53 PM | Report abuse

"London Fletcher is a talent, but has problems shedding blocks"

I just love when people make stupid comments like this.

London Fletcher has been in the top 10 in tackles made in every season since he became a starter. That must be a really difficult feat when one is on one's back, flattened by an O lineman. Since he is generally regarded as a "tackling machine", he must do all of that with his arms only, eh?

Try watching a few games - you'll be amazed at what you'll find.

Posted by: Study film, not columnists | April 30, 2007 2:56 PM | Report abuse

I think you overemphasize how bad the Skins DL was last year. The D line held strong, it was the linebackers who couldn't fill, and make plays.

Posted by: Mittens | April 30, 2007 02:53 PM

19 sacks. NINETEEN SACKS! In 16 games! Yeah, the DL was great last year.

Posted by: Anonymous | April 30, 2007 2:58 PM | Report abuse

Roy Williams + Talent = Sean Taylor.

(I tried, justme)

Posted by: etrod | April 30, 2007 2:59 PM | Report abuse

The D-Jack trade between Seattle and San Fran was about two issues. First, the Seahawks have more receivers than the Redskins have safeties. Second, D-Jack's attitude is somewhat suspect and his play varies accordingly. This is the last year of his contract and he was already making noise about getting restructured to a Branch-like pay level. By trading D-jack to San Fran, Seattle gets rid of a potential cancer in the locker room and makes room for their younger receivers to move up.

Posted by: Otter | April 30, 2007 3:07 PM | Report abuse

Totally agree mittens, excellent point. We have a HUGE improvement at middle linebacker this year which should help us stop the run. After all, the middle linebacker should lead the team in tackles.

Posted by: Max | April 30, 2007 3:11 PM | Report abuse

How about

Tom and Jerry?

Two quick cats back there as safety?

Posted by: Redskin Ray | April 30, 2007 02:28 PM

RR, this works for me, but Jerry was a mouse. I'm just sayin'.

Posted by: SMACK | April 30, 2007 3:12 PM | Report abuse

Strahan won't be coming to DC. There is no cap space available in Ashburn. He is old and would need a short contract, but he wants big money, so there is no way to spread out a large bonus. (After his recent divorce settlement, vet minimum is going to look like big money to Strahan.) That earlier nonsense appears to be an attempt to create a better bargaining positioning with the Giants.

Posted by: Otter | April 30, 2007 3:14 PM | Report abuse

etrod,

Yeah, you did. But, you're obviously not feeling it. :-(

Oh well, wallow in your funk now so you can be especially happy when they win a few more games this season. I'm not an especially optimistic person, but the moves they've made this off-season make sense to me. They're not necessarily perfect moves, but they've been fairly reasonable ones.

If this defense can just be in the top 15 or so, I think the Skins can have a winning record this season. I'm with Old School. Assuming the defense is even just average, the key to this season will be how much Campbell has developed. We will sink or swim based on what Soupie does.

Posted by: JustMe | April 30, 2007 3:17 PM | Report abuse

BRUISE BROTHERS

Posted by: hail to 'em | April 30, 2007 3:21 PM | Report abuse

Over the past 5 years London Fletcher has between 133-157 tackles per year. Lemar Marshall had 106 last year. The biggest mistake the skins have made thus far is believing that Lemar Marshall could be a middle linebacker. He was never cut out to play middle linbacker and it showed. We have improved our run defense DRAMATICALLY by adding fletcher. And the secondary looks solid. Enough of the negativity. The redskins could trade a 7th round pick for Tom Brady and Randy Moss, and you fans would still spin it as a negative trade for us. Enough of the negativity. We've had a solid off-season this year and we haven't made any mistakes this year. Defense is GREATLY improved, and offense will only get better in Al Saunders second year. I guarantee playoffs this year.

Posted by: Max | April 30, 2007 3:24 PM | Report abuse

A little humor for all you O's fans, if you haven't already seen it...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=21bb-Yo2W4g

Posted by: CC | April 30, 2007 3:25 PM | Report abuse

The redskins could trade a 7th round pick for Tom Brady and Randy Moss, and you fans would still spin it as a negative trade for us. Enough of the negativity. We've had a solid off-season this year and we haven't made any mistakes this year. Defense is GREATLY improved, and offense will only get better in Al Saunders second year. I guarantee playoffs this year.

Posted by: Max | April 30, 2007 03:24 PM

so true Max, so true. I think we have had a GREAT off season. well ok - better off season. We seem solid to me. (the team)

Posted by: hail to 'em | April 30, 2007 3:27 PM | Report abuse

"There is no hacggobing for ki i 207. Check the salary cap - thn't nough cap space to sign the players who were drafted."

We're either going to have to get a Finn or Jason to translate this for us.

Posted by: Otter | April 30, 2007 3:28 PM | Report abuse

I second Bruise Brothers. Has a nice ring to it.

Posted by: Max | April 30, 2007 3:28 PM | Report abuse

A name for taylor and Landry, how about the Snot Bubblers. They hit u so hard your snot bubbles

Posted by: Brut | April 30, 2007 3:31 PM | Report abuse

I can see the poster and T-shirts now. Burgandy hat with gold trim, burgandy suits with glasses on - fist clinched - BRUISE BROTHERS

Posted by: hail to 'em | April 30, 2007 3:32 PM | Report abuse

"ack da hacggobing ki? i 207? splundh ertas en gniboggcah salary cap!"

This is proof that the spirit of John Candy is still alive in North America.

Posted by: Otter | April 30, 2007 3:34 PM | Report abuse

Undrafted free agent signing ...

Seven LSU players head to NFL camps as undrafted free agents

BATON ROUGE, La. -- Seven LSU players who were not taken in
the seven-round NFL draft last weekend will be off to pro rookie
camps nonetheless, including one with the New Orleans Saints, after
agreeing to free-agent contracts.

Offensive tackle Peter Dyakowski will be making the 80-mile trip
southeast along the Mississippi River to New Orleans when the
Saints open their camp for first-year players on May 12.

Meanwhile, two former Tigers will join a couple of the Saints'
rivals in the NFC South Division.

Safety Jessie Daniels has agreed to terms with the Carolina
Panthers, while running back Justin Vincent is headed to the
Atlanta Falcons.

The Washington Redskins picked up defensive back Daniel Francis,
the Arizona Cardinals signed offensive lineman Brian Johnson and
the St. Louis Rams reached a deal with defensive lineman Ryan
Willis.

Punter and place kicker Chris Jackson, who also plays on LSU's
baseball team, has signed on with the Buffalo Bills.

The seven undrafted free agents bring to 12 the number of LSU
players headed to NFL teams.

Posted by: Skins or Skinned?? | April 30, 2007 3:34 PM | Report abuse

Well, you all know how much I LOVE Springs so these constant rumors about cutting him are driving me insane.

For whatever it's worth, Gibbs stated yesterday at his presser that he is looking forward to having a great secondary now that Shawn is healthy and the additions we have made.

Posted by: Lisa | April 30, 2007 3:36 PM | Report abuse

Snot Bubblers

Posted by: Brut | April 30, 2007 3:36 PM | Report abuse

Middle linebacker has always been key in the G. Williams defense. Our defense has been very solid under G. williams when we've had a serviceable MLB. So I expect good things this year. L. Marshall is a good OLB, but wasn't cut out for middle. Our stellar defense is back baby.

Posted by: Max | April 30, 2007 3:41 PM | Report abuse

Jason, thanks for the info. Must say I love these up-to-the-minute blogs from someone who (it feels like) is camped out at Redskins park on our behalf.

I think it's ironic that in Gibbs v 1.0 when we won all those superbowls, our front seven was invariable solid / excellent and our secondary (with the exception of Darrell Green) was just good enough. Can you name a pro-bowl safety on any of our Superbowl teams?

Now it seems like we have the reverse situation.

Posted by: Daddy-O | April 30, 2007 3:44 PM | Report abuse

Roy Williams pushes children on swings, one swing at a time.

Sean Taylor just stares at the swings, and all the kids start swinging at once.

Posted by: Otter | April 30, 2007 3:45 PM | Report abuse

On this Daniel Frances, LSU/DB (undrafted rookie signed last night), the intergoogles say he was the 'starting nickel' his senior year and a special teams standout (as a tackler).

Posted by: dcsween | April 30, 2007 3:46 PM | Report abuse

Also, Frances ran a 4.41 in the 40 on his Pro Day.

Posted by: dcsween | April 30, 2007 3:47 PM | Report abuse

Now if the Redskins could just sign Mkristo Bruce from Wash St - things would really be looking up.

Posted by: Otter | April 30, 2007 3:51 PM | Report abuse

Nate... i saw his comedy central special last year... It doesn't get any better than

HOT POCKETS!!

Thank you sir. Thank you.

Posted by: Dorf | April 30, 2007 4:06 PM | Report abuse

Otter,

I've been thinking of a way to incorporate the swinging commercial but wasn't sure if dissing charity was a cool way to go.

Sean Taylor would kill a wide receiver who dared to call himself Sean Taylor.

Posted by: etrod | April 30, 2007 4:19 PM | Report abuse

Otter, I found what seems like the one place that has the news about where M.Bruce signed ... the newspaper serving Moscow, ID/Pullman, WA, but it costs $6 to be an on-line subscriber. The college newspaper and student newspaper don't have it yet.

Posted by: dcsween | April 30, 2007 4:20 PM | Report abuse

Otter,

Mkristo Bruce signed with Miami. Unfortunately, so did my choice for return guy, Geoff Pope from Howard.

http://www.sun-sentinel.com/sports/sfl-dolsign0432807,0,5680849.story

Posted by: dcsween | April 30, 2007 4:26 PM | Report abuse

I for one think this has been a good off season so far. I'd like some D line help, but I'm happy with the teams quietness so far. No splashes. I just want a 10-6 playoff team.

If I recall correctly, Gregg likes to call a lot of blitzes but couldn't because the secondary was so bad. So what do they do? They add players to the secondary.

Posted by: the don | April 30, 2007 4:31 PM | Report abuse

apparently jay glazer is reporting on fox that had LL been taken at six the skins would have traded down for...

Ted Ginn.

Can you imagine?

Posted by: beat cal | April 30, 2007 4:37 PM | Report abuse

I'm trying to find out about which undrafted rookies the SKINS got. I wish I knew a Redskins Insider who could help me out with that. Think, think, think. Hmmmmm.

[SMACK and DC fan, I know what you did and I'm on you now. Thank you, Lisa (I have the same sentiment).]

Posted by: dcsween | April 30, 2007 4:49 PM | Report abuse

sween, the online paper for the Moscow-Pullman metroplop seems to be suffering from delusions of grandeur.

Charging a subscription fee for news from southeast Washington/western Idaho? Great business model. Good luck with that, fellas.

Posted by: Nate in the PDX | April 30, 2007 4:50 PM | Report abuse

Available FA Defensive Ends - AKA "Slim Pickings"

(McCray is a Restricted FA - would have to trade for him)

Elton Patterson - Jaguars - 6'2 271 (4)
Brandon Green - Rams - 6'3 264 (4)
Lance Legree - 49ers - 6'1 300 (6) (sounds more like a DT)
Kemp Rasmussen - Seattle - 6'3 265 (5)
Nick Eason - Browns - 6'3 305 (4)
Alvin McKinley - Browns - 6'3 294 (7)
N.D. Kalu - Texans - 6'3 265 (10) remember him?
Marcellus WIley - Jags - 6'4 275 (10)
Rodney Bailey - Steelers - 6'3 305 (6)

Most of these guys are career backups, over the hill, or "just a guy" type players. Unless there are some better DEs coming out because of June 1 cuts, the Redskins will have to use trades of picks or players to get something better.

Posted by: Otter | April 30, 2007 4:52 PM | Report abuse

If there's one positive thing I can come up with in my funk, it's that at least we're not the Dolphins right now.

Posted by: etrod | April 30, 2007 4:54 PM | Report abuse

Q. What do you get when you cross Sean Taylor with a Ferrari?

A. You get obliterated. Nobody crosses Sean Taylor.

Posted by: etrod | April 30, 2007 4:57 PM | Report abuse

...but he'll take the Ferrari.

(I'm really trying)

Posted by: etrod | April 30, 2007 4:58 PM | Report abuse

Anyone interested in a LaRon t-shirt?

Check it: http://www.cafepress.com/redskinsinsider

If you don't get the joke, you need to watch more Chris Farley.

Posted by: Bucktown Skins Fan | April 30, 2007 4:59 PM | Report abuse

It figures that a guy who played in the cold and rainy Pacific Northwest for 4 years would sign in sunny Miami. But what's the excuse for that kid from Howard. And where are all those Hampton University kids? Shouldn't they be local players and probably Redskins fans?

What really aggravates me about the useless Redskins FO is that most of the players they draft are from major or mid-major conference schools. They rarely get great prospects from Div. 2 or 3 or from small conferences. That tells me they don't really do any real scouting - they just read the scouting combine crap and choose accordingly. Wonder why we never get an Adalius Thomas or a Marques Colston? That's why.

Posted by: Otter | April 30, 2007 5:01 PM | Report abuse

Sween,

No need for an inside source. Here's the text of the press release:

PRESS RELEASE

For Immediate Release
April 30, 2007

REDSKINS AGREE TO TERMS WITH NINE UNDRAFTED ROOKIE FREE AGENTS;

SIGN FREE AGENT K TYLER FREDRICKSON

ASHBURN, VA - The Washington Redskins announced today they have agreed to terms with nine undrafted rookie free agents. In addition, the team announced the signing of free agent kicker Tyler Fredrickson.

Fredrickson, 6-3, 220, played college ball at California and first entered the NFL in 2004 with Seattle. He was released prior to the start of the 2004 season. He spent the 2005 training camp with Denver and was in training camp with Dallas in 2006.

The following is a list of undrafted rookie free agents that have agreed to terms with the Redskins:

Name Position College
Terry Caulley RB Connecticut
Daniel Francis CB LSU
Stephon Heyer OL Maryland
Justin Hickman DE UCLA
Sam Hollenbach QB Maryland
Zach Latimer LB Oklahoma
Marcus Mason RB Youngstown State
Taylor Sele WR Boston College
Deyon Williams WR Virginia


Caulley leaves UConn as the holder of nearly every major rushing record in school history. He started 31 of 36 games and rushed for 3,187 yards on 570 attempts (5.6 average) and 31 touchdowns. Caulley had 13 career 100-yard rushing games.

Francis played in the same defensive backfield at LSU as Redskins first-round draft selection LaRon Landry. He appeared in 48 games over his four-year career at LSU and totaled 76 tackles (39 solo), six tackles for a loss and 3.5 sacks. Francis was also a special teams standout on kick-off and punt coverage. He was selected to play in the 2007 East-West Shrine game.

Heyer played his college ball at Maryland. He overcame a torn ACL at the start of the 2005 season to earn honorable mention All-ACC honors as a senior. He started 37 games at left offensive tackle for the Terps.

Hickman earned first team All PAC-10 honors as a senior after totaling 42 tackles (30 solo), two forced fumbles, 19 tackles for loss and 12.5 sacks in 13 games. Prior to joining UCLA in 2004, Hickman played for Glandale Community College in Glendale, AZ. Hickman appeared in 35 games with 97 tackles (60 solo), 19.5 sacks and 31 tackles for loss while at UCLA.

Hollenbach finished his career as only the fourth Terrapin to throw for more than 5,000 yards in his career. During his time at Maryland he played in 28 games, starting 24, and throwing for 5,139 yards, 28 touchdowns and 26 interceptions. He finished his career on a high-note being named MVP of the 2006 Champs Sports Bowl.

Latimer earned All-Big 12 honorable mention honors for the 2005 and 2006 seasons. Over the course of his career he has appeared in 41 games with 26 starts, and totaled180 tackles (104 solo), 19 tackles for loss, seven sacks, two forced fumbles and three interceptions.

Mason was named Division 1-AA first-team All-America by the Associated Press as a senior thanks in large part to rushing for a school record 1,847 yards and 23 touchdowns. Prior to transferring to Youngstown St. he played at the University of Illinois. During his two seasons as a Penguin he rushed for 2,739 yards and 31 touchdowns and was named 2006 Gateway Offensive Player of the Year.

Sele played wide receiver and was a valuable member of the special teams coverage units at Boston College. He finished his career at BC catching 27 balls for 296 yards for an average of 10.9 yards per catch.

Williams appeared in 38 games while at Virginia totaling 95 catches for 1,237 yards and 10 touchdowns. He is the 26th player in school history to go over the 1,000 yard mark at UVA. As a junior in 2005 he earned honorable mention All-ACC honors.

Posted by: JustMe | April 30, 2007 5:02 PM | Report abuse

Taylor and Landry:
Con Cuss Twins
Con Cuss Ones
Light Switches
Or, how about just plain, "sir."

Posted by: Neil in Durango | April 30, 2007 5:02 PM | Report abuse

OK, I must not have seen enough Chris Farley - please explain.

Posted by: skinswest | April 30, 2007 5:03 PM | Report abuse

[SMACK and DC fan, I know what you did and I'm on you now. Thank you, Lisa (I have the same sentiment).]

Posted by: dcsween | April 30, 2007 04:49 PM

What did I do this time? I don't remember doing anything. Of course, that doesn't mean I didn't do it.

Posted by: SMACK | April 30, 2007 5:03 PM | Report abuse

Moscow? Where is that - Russia?
Pullman? Isn't that part of a train?

Surely those guys are kidding about charging for access.

Posted by: Otter | April 30, 2007 5:03 PM | Report abuse

And I know this is really bad verbage, but that Kevin Mitchell post really killed the blog for the day. (No disrespect intended to Mr. Mitchell or his family.)

Posted by: Otter | April 30, 2007 5:06 PM | Report abuse

let's count the united way and the deceased as victims of otter today. my niece has cerabal palsy. maybe you'd like to hate on her too.

Posted by: Anonymous | April 30, 2007 5:08 PM | Report abuse

I don't understand the free agent list. One O-lineman, one D-lineman. Weren't they looking to add some depth?

Posted by: KK | April 30, 2007 5:08 PM | Report abuse

skinswest, it's a line from a Matt Foley, motivational speaker sketch on SNL. Matt Foley is doing the weather during El Niño and yells out "El Niño means THE Niño."

Posted by: Bucktown Skins Fan | April 30, 2007 5:09 PM | Report abuse

KK -

Give them credit. At least there are no Safeties on the list.

If you're going to be a hater, at least post your name.

Posted by: etrod | April 30, 2007 5:11 PM | Report abuse

Man, what happened to the Redskins Insider golf shirt? I wanted one of those with the Shabingus Lifesaver logo.

I still like the "Bang Brothers" name. Would like to see a t-shirt about that and some reference to "XXX-rated". Ha Ha - F Snyder!

Posted by: Otter | April 30, 2007 5:11 PM | Report abuse

How about ex ex ex listener?

Posted by: etrod | April 30, 2007 5:14 PM | Report abuse

Hickman is 6'1.5, 254 - not big enough to be a DE in the NFL. Maybe he can be a MLB, since he isn't all that fast either. In any case, there is still no new young fast big DE talent coming in.

Posted by: Otter | April 30, 2007 5:17 PM | Report abuse

Thanks Bucktown, and here I was trying to figure out the connection between LaRon Landry, Charlize Theron and Chris Farley. With not much luck I must add.

Posted by: skinswest | April 30, 2007 5:17 PM | Report abuse

etrod--I'm sure that the CB can do safety if the other six go down. Also, on one of those re-caps of late round talent they mentioned that our fifth round linebacker could, with training, line up at safety. So, I feel we've got that position covered.

Posted by: KK | April 30, 2007 5:19 PM | Report abuse

Caulley is 5'7, 185 - hope he can return punts or kicks or something.

Posted by: Otter | April 30, 2007 5:19 PM | Report abuse

Otter, we have a backlog of shirt ideas to get to. I'll get some of them up in the next few days (promises, promises). But it's Bucktown who does the cool fancy graphics, I'm limited to the silly text-only ones.

Posted by: Nate in the PDX | April 30, 2007 5:20 PM | Report abuse

You know, I was just thinking about today's thread, and all I see is discussion about individuals. Since this is a team game, it leaves me to wonder what sort of team scheme the coaches and FO are thinking about.

Posted by: Neil in Durango | April 30, 2007 5:21 PM | Report abuse

etrod--

Here it is, Pat Kirwan on Dallas Sartz

"This is a versatile utility player. He has played safety, inside linebacker, outside linebacker and has stepped up to the line of scrimmage in some schemes. For a team like Washington, which likes to use all kinds of looks, he's a perfect fit. He plays a lot faster than he ran. He's a former high school quarterback."

Posted by: KK | April 30, 2007 5:22 PM | Report abuse

It's cerebral palsy. If you are going to rep for it, at least spell it correctly.

Posted by: Otter | April 30, 2007 5:23 PM | Report abuse

I've been saying "Hollenbach" for weeks now. He will beat out Palmer and Bramlet for the #2 spot and we'll be primed for a QB controversy in a few years leaving us with a Matt Schaub type deal.

Posted by: BIGfish | April 30, 2007 5:24 PM | Report abuse

The Reaper jokes are out of control. You guys have too much time on your hands. But keep them coming. LMGO

Posted by: jm220 | April 30, 2007 5:25 PM | Report abuse

Thanks, Nate.

"Silly" and "text-only" works most of the time for me. I really like that Shabingus Life Saver design, but only on a golf shirt. (I might suggest that the date on the logo be changed to 1999, however, since that is when the Snyder Shabingus began.)

Posted by: Otter | April 30, 2007 5:30 PM | Report abuse

Sean Taylor and the skins defense

Cruel and the Gang

Posted by: Cheyenne, WY | April 30, 2007 5:30 PM | Report abuse

Suppose we got a "big time" free agent D-Lineman??? Then, those haters would say..."Oh...they're just trying to make a big splash...here comes another big time free agent".

For once...the Skins are saying we're sticking with what we have and I have confidence in what we have. WHAT"S WRONG WITH THAT???? Damn, we can't win!!!

Posted by: sicwidit | April 30, 2007 5:35 PM | Report abuse

Sean Taylor can't stick his elbow in his ear, but he can stick your elbow in your ear.

Posted by: 4-12 | April 30, 2007 5:37 PM | Report abuse

sicwidit,

very well put. Sometimes it seems like the Skins cant catch a break.

Posted by: Cheyenne, WY | April 30, 2007 5:37 PM | Report abuse

According to Gil Brandt of NFL.com, regarding kick coverage on special teams -

Daniel Francis, LSU (5-10 5/8, 191, 4.50)
Francis ran a 4.5 40-yard dash and notched a 36½-inch vertical jump, a 10-foot-5 long jump and 18 bench presses at the LSU Pro Day. He was an outstanding high school athlete, playing running back and defensive back. He scored 46 touchdowns in two years as a running back and was a four-year starter on the basketball team. He played as a true freshman with 219 plays, 196 of them coming on special teams (where he notched 15 tackles). He can be an extra cornerback, a lot like Randall Gay of the Patriots.

http://www.nfl.com/draft/analysis/expert/brandt/st

Posted by: Otter | April 30, 2007 5:38 PM | Report abuse

Otter, McCray becomes a regular (unrestricted) free agent last Friday b/c he didn't sign his tender offer. The league deadline for that was this past Friday.

SMACK, it was a quip involving Eastern Motors and vegetables.

The relative non-signage of DEs says to me that they are still looking to work a trade or into free agency (even though, as Otter shows, the cupboard may be bare). I'm still all for signing Jared Allen even though he has to serve out a 4 game suspension for strike two on DUI.

They say that 1st rounders sometimes fail b/c of all the pressure on them to perform up to the level of their picks and paychecks. I wonder whether Justin Hickman, DE/UCLA realizes the tremendous pressure this blog has placed on him to become a starter (for the 35 cents the Skins paid him as a signing bonus).

Posted by: dcsween | April 30, 2007 5:38 PM | Report abuse

Maybe the versatile Dallas Sartz can add about 20 pounds and played end ...

Posted by: dcsween | April 30, 2007 5:42 PM | Report abuse

sween, I was reading that and I was like holy @#*&, this guy's got some cajones. And then I saw your name. Sorry for the bad joke, and the loss of the Market. At least nobody got hurt.

Posted by: SMACK | April 30, 2007 5:45 PM | Report abuse

What was the reaction at the park when Landry was picked?

I was at home begging for a trade after I knew Brady Quinn was going to be there. Initially I was a bit mad they didnt trade down, but I guess you have to have a partner to dance.

Posted by: Cheyenne, WY | April 30, 2007 5:45 PM | Report abuse

The kicker, Tyler Fredrickson, was in preseason camp with Suisham last year. Something descriptive about the guy. http://www.berkeley.edu/news/media/releases/2004/02/02_fredrickson.shtml Something tells me that, Suisham greeting Fredrickson is going to be like Seinfeld greeting Newman.

SMACK, people got all over my stuff w/o reading what I wrote. I wrote "affected me more than" and people read "is a bigger deal that". Your's was the good snark though. It always is. Question: have you ever actually BEEN to Dallas or even lived there?

Posted by: dcsween | April 30, 2007 5:51 PM | Report abuse

DC -

"Restricted free agents are players who have completed three accrued seasons of service and whose contracts have expired. They have received qualifying offers from their old clubs and are free to negotiate with any club until April 20, at which time their rights revert to their original club. If a player accepts an offer from a new club, the old club will have the right to match the offer and retain the player. If the old club elects not to match the offer, it may receive draft-choice compensation depending on the level of the qualifying offer made to the player."

http://www.nfl.com/freeagency

http://mvn.com/nfl-jaguars/2007/04/25/bobby-mccray-running-out-of-options/

Posted by: Otter | April 30, 2007 5:53 PM | Report abuse

DC -

In other words, McCray is no longer a free agent. His rights have reverted back to the Jaguars because they made him a tender offer. Because the Jaguars legally hold his rights, he cannot just walk away from them. He doesn't have to sign the offer, but he can't play or even be traded until he does.

Posted by: Otter | April 30, 2007 5:59 PM | Report abuse


here is the article i mentioned earlier regarding the skins trading down and taking Ted Ginn. how typical would that have been?


http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/6756344

Posted by: beat cal | April 30, 2007 5:59 PM | Report abuse

Sween, my reaction was that there are a lot of crybabies that shop at Eastern Market. You had to figure such a comparison would raise a little dander. People here are so delicate sometimes.

I've been to Dallas a few times, just for games. Certainly wasn't the city that lured me to the team. It's an okay place though, friendly people, a few too many western stores perhaps. Be tough to imagine living there in the offseason. I'll be going to check out the new stadium though, no doubt.

Posted by: SMACK | April 30, 2007 6:01 PM | Report abuse

Otter, if they have the Jags have the rights to McCray, they can still trade him even if he doesn't sign the offer sheet, right? Wasn't that how the Briggs deal was going to work? [Or would each of them need to sign in order to be tradeable?]

Posted by: dcsween | April 30, 2007 6:02 PM | Report abuse

SMACK, when I posted about the EM fire, I was feeling a little delicate ... kind of like how Skins fans would feel if RFK was gutted by fire ... or how Dallas fans would feel if ... if, if, if ... if Jerry Jones was out in the sun too long and his face burned down.

Posted by: dcsween | April 30, 2007 6:05 PM | Report abuse

Nicknames for Taylor & Landry?

How about acronymns instead?

OOP = out of position

and

BWAS = better wait and see

Posted by: notherNWskinsfan | April 30, 2007 6:12 PM | Report abuse

You don't think he had that face equipped with an automatic fire suppression system?

Posted by: SMACK | April 30, 2007 6:13 PM | Report abuse

SMACK, the thought did occur to me, esp. after reading about how the Cowboys have those special shoulder pads with recirculating cold water. Jerrah must have a tap there somewhere.

We haven't talked much about the other teams in the NFC East. Those crazy teams that are just crazy enough to value the draft. Crazy like a fox!

Posted by: dcsween | April 30, 2007 6:21 PM | Report abuse

So check this out....Washington Post Live is doing a remote from the Phone Booth (Verizon Center) before the Wizards/Cavs game (sadly the last game of the year for my beloved Wiz). They are interviewing Mike Sellers and Jason is sitting right next to him. After Sellers compliments the Landry pick, Jason basically criticized the pick saying we had too many other needs to fill and were 5-11 last season. Have we not exhausted the fact that the Skins were unable to trade for more picks? Jason did not give very high marks to Okoye either. Gotta say although I thought his remarks were nonsensical, can't believe he made them while sitting next to Cave Man Sellers.

Posted by: Lisa | April 30, 2007 6:32 PM | Report abuse

DC -

In the case of McCray, if a trade was worked out with another team, then McCray would have to sign the Jags' tender offer before the trade was made. I think it is about giving/acknowledging the team's and player's rights. (A player must be legally under contract to be traded.) The same issue came up with Turner/San Diego. He signed his tender offer just before the draft in case a trade was worked out during the draft.

In the case of Briggs, it is probably similar, since franchising a player also ties the player's rights to the original team, even in the absence of a contract. I don't think either player would refuse to sign if the intent was to facilitate a trade that was agreed upon by all parties.

In both cases, the receiving team has to work out the contractual details with the player and then the compensation issues with the club holding the player's rights (similar to the Trent Green case). While the CBA does mandate specific compensation for unilaterally-signed RFA players during the signing period or franchised players at any time when they are tagged, the team holding a player's rights can trade a player for any level of compensation they deem appropriate at any time.

What it all means - if the Redskins reach an agreement with McCray and the Jags, then McCray will sign his tender and the trade will be executed immediately thereafter. The chances are good that the Jags will ask for the same compensation that would have been required had the Redskins signed McCray during the RFA period (which ended on 4/20). As an alternative, the Jags can ask for something different as compensation - a pair of lower-round draft picks in 2008, or perhaps a player of perceived equal value, like Shawn Springs.

Posted by: Otter | April 30, 2007 7:34 PM | Report abuse

Danny and Vinny:

Barnum and Bailey

get it??

That's got some play, don't you think, folks?

Posted by: Redskin Ray | April 30, 2007 7:48 PM | Report abuse

Danny and Vinny:

Perhaps this has possibilities as well:
Bert and Ernie

Posted by: Redskin Ray | April 30, 2007 7:49 PM | Report abuse

Danny and Vinny:

Thelma and Louise?

Posted by: Redskin Ray | April 30, 2007 7:51 PM | Report abuse

Why patch the Dline now?

If the guys who weren't healthy last year come back healthy, the 'skins with a vastly improved back seven will be in the playoffs.

If they break down, the sklins will be in a good draft position with a full complement of picks to resolve the issue.

\
]

Posted by: CORKCZAR | April 30, 2007 8:08 PM | Report abuse

If the Redskins continue with this line of player personnel, we can call FEDEX Field the big empty box.

Also, I like the Bruise Bros. for Landry/Taylor.

Posted by: Brian Brown Eye | April 30, 2007 8:16 PM | Report abuse

Just had a detailed look at the stats, and this talk that the poor secondary play had a big effect on our sack/turnover/QB pressure levels starts to make sense -

2004- Total Sacks 40, 19.5-DL, 11-LB, 9-DB
2005- Total Sacks 32, 16-DL, 11.5-LB, 4.5-DB
2006-Total Sacks 19, 13-DL, 5-LB, 1-DB


Looking at those stats, you can see that there wasn't too much of a drop off from our D-Line, and if Grilliams was required to use his LB's in coverage more often rather than blitz them, that would explain why there is such a big drop off in sacks from the LB's and DB's. Also I'm sure it's not too outrageous to think that because there wasn't much blitzing, it made it more difficult for the DL to get sacks.

Posted by: kost52 | April 30, 2007 8:45 PM | Report abuse

Also is Carlos Rogers wasn't Roberto Duran (Hands of Stone) we might have had a few more intercepts.

Posted by: kost52 | April 30, 2007 8:49 PM | Report abuse

why sam hollenbach? just curious. (no dig intended back handed or under handed just an honest question)

lisa, jason is telling how it is.

Posted by: dealer | April 30, 2007 8:49 PM | Report abuse

No Mas!

Posted by: Carlos Rogers | April 30, 2007 9:03 PM | Report abuse

Without our dynamic duo, the Cavs can still barely beat us.

F the Cavs.

Posted by: SMACK | April 30, 2007 9:10 PM | Report abuse

what's the score?

Posted by: dealer | April 30, 2007 9:14 PM | Report abuse

smack, it's eddie jordan. no other way to explain it. and there's absolutely no way they should even think about trading agent zero

but jamison has GOT TO GO along with eddie. the guy scores 30 and gives up 50.

Posted by: dealer | April 30, 2007 9:17 PM | Report abuse

89-88 Cavs right now, couple minutes left. We might pull it out, but who cares. We're on our backs kicking like the roach that had developed the most immunity to raid.

Okay, I need to give up the metaphors. I don't know hoops as well as you do, I would have thought Jamison was a keeper.

Posted by: SMACK | April 30, 2007 9:22 PM | Report abuse

SMACK- How come you support Washington in the NBA and not the NFL?

Posted by: kost52 | April 30, 2007 9:23 PM | Report abuse

kost,

Thanks for providing the numbers above. I had looked them up before, but was too lazy to find them again and post them here.

Also, thanks for asking SMACK that question. I thought it, myself, just a few minutes ago.

Posted by: JustMe | April 30, 2007 9:28 PM | Report abuse

Anyone know if we've signed any free agents today, whom did not get drafted?

Posted by: Greg(Boston) | April 30, 2007 11:14 AM

I know of 2 WR from UVA Deyon Williams and Fontel Mines (maybe as TE) - Williams may be a good prospect, he missed most of his senior year with an injury but has good physicals.

Also D-Lineman Keenan Carter from UVA.

Posted by: mac2j | April 30, 2007 9:29 PM | Report abuse

hey dealer, anything about DC-area sports that you like?

Posted by: Johnnie Futbol | April 30, 2007 9:34 PM | Report abuse

I didnt see Fontel Mines and Keenan Carter on the list posted above but the Daily Progress reports them as having signed with the Skins.

"Hamilton was obviously alluding to several of his former teammates who inked free agent contracts - defensive lineman Keenan Carter, tight end/wideout Fontel Mines and wide receiver Deyon Williams signed with the Washington Redskins"

Posted by: Anonymous | April 30, 2007 9:36 PM | Report abuse

I didn't live in an NBA/NHL/MLB/MLS town until I came to DC. So I didn't already have favorites when I got here in 85. I don't actually try to be different, I love all those teams. But I've been a Boys fan since 1977 and that will never change.

I'm from Miami and knew at age 9, F the dolphins

Posted by: SMACK | April 30, 2007 9:40 PM | Report abuse

Fontel Mines (I coached him) He got signed by the Bears NOT the Skins.

Posted by: Hail to 'em | April 30, 2007 9:40 PM | Report abuse

SMACK - Fair enough mate, just seemed a little odd that's all.

So you don't mind me saying that I love what those Warriors are doing to the Mavs, and since I'm a Suns fan, it just makes it even sweeter!


JustMe - You can tell I get very busy at work can't you! haha

Posted by: kost52 | April 30, 2007 10:03 PM | Report abuse

JLC must just be salty that the Redskins have a potential long term answer at QB while the Ravens drafted a dude that will need to jump every time he passes the ball.

Posted by: Anonymous | April 30, 2007 10:04 PM | Report abuse

Jay Glazer: "The Redskins sent a contingency to meet with Ohio State WR Ted Ginn, Jr. this past week and seemed intent on going after him if they traded back in Round 1."

What sort of contingency do you think they sent?

Posted by: cload and daggar | April 30, 2007 10:05 PM | Report abuse

kost, I know, what are you gonna do. It's kind of like Arsenal, the original reasons I became a fan are long since retired, but once I love a team, that's it.

Posted by: SMACK | April 30, 2007 10:12 PM | Report abuse

J LC,

I think it would be better to be patient. Attempt to shop for more picks next year. They still have to groom a young QB. They still need a big receiver. They may lose Washington, Springs, and possibly Rocky McIntosh.

They really don't have any shutdown corners. The way you stop the run isn't just with the d-line it is best done with line backer blitzes. The better to pick up the play action when it happens. Grilliams is a blitzer who hasn't been able to utilize his best blitzers, especially Sean Taylor, because they are needed in coverage and to play center field just in case. I think they are covered at tackle. They do need a couple of ends.
Everything they say makes sense given Williams system.

The rub is he is out of luck without that elusive shutdown corner. Just like Gibbs is missing that elusive very fast, tall, strong, blocking receiver. That CJ gives you. Those are two really critical skill positions outside of QB and feature back.

Best to wait for the draft. Free agents cost more against the cap and seem to be more fraught with peril than the errant draft pick. And they have been hurt by NOT GETTING LOWER ROUNDERS that stick. AND THAT MAY BE WILLIAMS fault. HE has wasted an awful lot of picks on guys who didn't work out. As has Bugel.

~ Piero

Posted by: periculum | April 30, 2007 10:15 PM | Report abuse

dealer, you are off the mark (again). Antawn Jamison along with Antonio Daniels has carried the Wiz on his back since Gil and Caron went down. I can't say enough good things about him! Those two players never gave up for a second even though every one counted them out. I've never been prouder that they are on my team.

Posted by: Lisa | April 30, 2007 10:34 PM | Report abuse

Fans, don't be afraid. Our defense has magic dust this year that will make it jump up from #31 to #10 in the league. Your knowledgeable fellow bloggers Max and Cheyenne agree with me- look for those Six Flags T shirts in the mail guys...

Forget about all the negative talk. The last time we made a major jump in total defense ranking we went with improvement to the defensive line by bringing in hungry, mid-tier free agents like Salvea and Griffen and we had some good seasoned line backers and homegrown back-up players that became starters like Peirce. But that was too easy (BORING) and it also ended too quickly as the cheap and mid tier players got swallowed in free agency by teams that value performance over prestige. The magic dust will work longer and will be more exciting. Old players will feel like new and avoid injury. Players that could barely pressure the quarterback will suddenly generate massive pressure and enjoyable sacks of the QB, at least one every two games or your money back.

Let the amazement begin...

Posted by: Dan Snyder | April 30, 2007 10:39 PM | Report abuse

SMACK - That's the way it has to be! If you go swapping and changing, you aren't a real fan!

Posted by: kost52 | April 30, 2007 10:52 PM | Report abuse

On Feb. 10, 2007, hostile aliens from the planet Puntron 3 in the Gamma Pooch sector of the Landeta Major Galaxy decended upon Honolulu, HI in phase 1 of their diabolical plot to conquer earth.

After seeing Sean Taylor's hit on Bryan Moorman, the aliens smiled, offered us their technology, returned to their home planet and turned off all the lights.

We need a new thread.

Posted by: etrod | May 1, 2007 7:15 AM | Report abuse

i'm off the mark...again? :) funny stuff lisa.

guys, you have to have someone who plays defense once in awhile. jamison is a scorer and so is arenas. and jamison is the only guy that can be traded for a worthy defender. but he's got a huge contract. you can afford to have your guards a defensive liability but not your forwards and centers. yes, they're fun to watch runnin up and down the court but come playoffs if you don't play defense you don't win. that's a cliche for a good reason.

ummmm i love my skins and my terps and now my nats. les bullez are at the bottom of the list not because they're the les bullez but because they're in the NBA. don't really like the NBA much. hardly ever watch it. but i love their FO. and eddie wasn't this FO's pick...so who knows...

Posted by: dealer | May 1, 2007 8:06 AM | Report abuse

1st Smack, move back to Miami and cheer on your stinkin Cowpies. Became a fan in 1977? HMMM, oh yeah jump on the bandwagon when they beat Denver in the SB.... Second, I know a blog is for opinion. But, man it seems like this blog gets a lot of haters and real pessimists with the Skins. Unbelievable how much flack Gibbs gets as a three time CHAMP. Please take a look at the defensive scheme, and GGs history, he does not all the sudden stink and players all the sudden hate him. The D was killed by injuries and those still playing were injured. Washington did not even finish the season, and was hurt very early. Sean Taylor played the whole season with a sep. shlder. GGs scheme calls for SPEED and physical play out of his LBs and DBs. He WILL get this in 08. When a O-line has to worry about that watch how good the Dline gets. The O was dealing with Portis and his injuries and transition to a new QB. Doom and Gloom by the way for all the haters out there. And maybe for Taylor and Landry! Hate on the GIANTS, EAGLES, and THOSE STINKIN A$@ Cowgirls. After watching drafts and even the so called experts predict preseasons AKA who had the Saints in the NFC Championship. Let those that get paid make the decisions we will just HAIL!!!!!

Posted by: Dallassucks | May 1, 2007 8:09 AM | Report abuse

Jay Glazer: "The Redskins sent a contingency to meet with Ohio State WR Ted Ginn, Jr. this past week and seemed intent on going after him if they traded back in Round 1."

What sort of contingency do you think they sent?

Posted by: cload and daggar | April 30, 2007 10:05 PM

C & D -- i think he means they sent a team of scouts/coaches. personally i find it sickening that they would have traded down and gone WR instead of D-Line...

Posted by: beat cal | May 1, 2007 8:52 AM | Report abuse

Beat Cal--

I thought that the point of trading down was to get extra picks so that they could get a D-Lineman AND another player.

Ginn would have been great -- just not where Miami took him. 'Skins still don't have a legitimate #2 receiver.

Posted by: KK | May 1, 2007 9:07 AM | Report abuse

Sean Taylor once clogged a urinal.

Posted by: etrod | May 1, 2007 9:08 AM | Report abuse

I was kind of hoping for an upgrade for punt and/or kick returns. I don't see that here. http://www.redskins.com/news/newsDetail.jsp?id=25913

Skins, why do you treat me like I'm John from Herndon?

Posted by: dcsween | May 1, 2007 9:10 AM | Report abuse

let's face it we, as skins fans are a fan of a celebrity of a team. for a couple of reasons:
1. it's called "Washington", the so called capital of the free world.
2. because it's the richest franchise in sports in NA.
3. and if that wasn't enough for the skins to stand out they like to do things very very very differently UP HERE.

so skins do get more flack more than any other team. i don't mind it much anymore. cuz for 8 years i sat UP HERE and said "you will eat your words when my boy wonder revolutionizes the way teams win championships". it didn't happen. it took me 8 years to come to the conclusion that THOSE media writers and GM's might know what they're talking about.

just like not everyone who criticizes their government's actions (ie. iraq war) doesn't hate america. if we cricize bush or his administration does it mean we hate america?

we crticize and kid cuz we love this team. and humor and laughter is the best medicine to cure us of this snyderism/gibbsism.

but know this i will never ever let a fan of any other team criticize the skins just like i would never let a non-american criticize america. we're debating here. in OUR HOUSE aka ***SkinsInsider.

so to me it's all good. as far as defending joe gibbs. he's a good coach (still) but like tuna said "i'm my record" and his record after an ELEVEN year hiatus is A six game winning streak.

Posted by: dealer | May 1, 2007 9:13 AM | Report abuse

Yes, dealer, I meant what I said....and obviously you did not watch many Wizards games this season. They have not been a defensive team all season - in fact, not in recent years. Very good offensively, especially with Arenas and Butler playing (Butler was pretty good on defense). Antawn Jamison averaged around 20 ppg. while Arenas and Butler where playing...when they went down he put the entire team on his back and averaged over 30 ppg(even scoring 38 in one game) during the playoffs. He tried playing defense but that has never been his strength but at least he picked up the scoring slack for the others. I was simply amazed at how hard this guy worked and also how classy he is. So you really hit a nerve with me by putting him down and saying he must go.

Posted by: Lisa | May 1, 2007 9:13 AM | Report abuse

I was kind of hoping for an upgrade for punt and/or kick returns.

Posted by: dcsween | May 1, 2007 09:10 AM

Sween,

Come on. You didn't read it carefully. "The Redskins will host a Rookie Camp this weekend, May 4-6, in which upwards of 60 undrafted prospects will try out for the team."

Now, with 60 there will be about 45 safeties, a few 'backers, a punter and a returner. Wait 'til Monday. Vinnie says he'll get rid of the ten they signed if any of these 60 are better.

Posted by: Anonymous | May 1, 2007 9:15 AM | Report abuse

Last anonymous was me. I was in a hurry. Tried to post before Lisa and dealer, but I'm not fast enough.

We need a new thread.

Posted by: KK | May 1, 2007 9:20 AM | Report abuse

LaRon Landy jumped out of a truck and broke his teeth.

Sean Taylor jumped out of a truck and broke the road.

Posted by: Anonymous | May 1, 2007 9:32 AM | Report abuse

and if Antawn is traded, they'd better get BIG value. I agree with Lisa, he's a beast and did everything he could and more. In addition to being a scorer, he's a very good rebounder.

Les Boullez would be better off keeping the big three together and cutting some of the dead weight. Letting Jarvis leave and trading Haywood would be a great start.

Posted by: etrod | May 1, 2007 9:38 AM | Report abuse

etrod,

Haywood is as good as gone. I understand he took his nameplate off his locker and did not speak to anyone on his way out.

Posted by: Lisa | May 1, 2007 10:01 AM | Report abuse

OK, this may have already been addressed, but I'm a little out of the loop.

I think that the skins rookie FA class was pretty impressive, if such a thing can be said about free agents that didn't get drafted, with the obvious glaring exception that still no Dlineman were picked up... Not that there were any worth getting.

But, I like Terry Caulley. He is a quasi- local kid who played his high school ball at Patuxent in Lusby. Saw him play a lot when I used to teach down there. He is pretty fast and very strong for his size. He could be a good special teamer and is more of the proto-typical 3rd down back. A lot of competetion there, but I like that they signed him.

Stephon Heier is a physical specimen. The only reason he didn't get drafted was that he had some knee injuries that have slowed him a bit. My bet is that he makes the team.

I like the fact that they picked up Lando's teammate, again addressing there #1 depth issue last season. Sorry, JLC, they were thinner at Dback than anywhere, even Dline.

Don't know much about the other guys, but there may be some redemption in these FAs.

Cerrato still has to go, though.

Posted by: Larry Bud | May 1, 2007 10:13 AM | Report abuse

LaRon Landy jumped out of a truck and broke his teeth.

Sean Taylor jumped out of a truck and broke the road.

Posted by: | May 1, 2007 09:32 AM

*****************************

Me likey. Was that you, etrod? You're getting your mojo back. ;-)

Posted by: JustMe | May 1, 2007 10:15 AM | Report abuse

Oh, that guy from UCLA is a DE.

Posted by: Larry Bud | May 1, 2007 10:16 AM | Report abuse

Hopefully they can get some value for Haywood, although I doubt it.

Posted by: etrod | May 1, 2007 10:16 AM | Report abuse

JustMe-

Yes that was me. I'm in a little bit better of a mood today.

Posted by: etrod | May 1, 2007 10:18 AM | Report abuse

Found a website for answering the "what happened to [undrafted rookie]?" questions.

http://theredzone.org/2007/draft/udfa/index.asp

I know the Skins added their guys last night, but is there a limit on the number of guys that can be on the roster? What is the limit by the time camp starts? Is there a different limit for June 1?

Yesterday, Eagles whacked Dhani Jones and Buccs whacked Juran Bolden. Both these guys are up there in years. Wondering whether the Skins will have any age-related casualties.

Posted by: dcsween | May 1, 2007 10:23 AM | Report abuse

trying to catch up this morning:

Lisa, way to bring the Wizards knowledge and bring it hard and yes you are right... when were the Wiz a defensive team? Hasnt that been the complaint the past few years?

And about this Ted Ginn stuff... c'mon people the Skins were not going to draft him... they were exploring all of their options and if he had been there later in the first round (if the Skins had been able to trade down) then they would have had to look at him. At #9... Ginn was by far the biggest "reach" of the draft.

Posted by: Inigo Montoya | May 1, 2007 10:30 AM | Report abuse

dcsween, I was wondering about Dhani Jones as well....

Posted by: Lisa | May 1, 2007 10:32 AM | Report abuse

with all of the interest around LBers this offseason and the firing of Dale Lindsay, it appears that GG thinks that LBer was the weak link last year... hard to blame him. Watching Holdman bounce off of Tiki Barber 22 times a game can get pretty frustrating.

In GG's scheme, doesnt he use DL to "free up" everyone else to "stay in position" whether it be for a blitz or run or pass coverage???

Posted by: Inigo Montoya | May 1, 2007 10:35 AM | Report abuse

dcsween, I was wondering about Dhani Jones as well....

Posted by: Lisa | May 1, 2007 10:32 AM


He sucks... ask any Eagles fan, they hate him.

Posted by: Inigo Montoya | May 1, 2007 10:36 AM | Report abuse

Consider this list of teams that made the Super Bowl, and think about what sort of pass rush they had that year:

Colts - Bears
Steelers - Seahawks
Patriots - Eagles
Patriots - Panthers
Buccaneers - Raiders
Patriots - Rams
Ravens - Giants
Rams - Titans

Every team had an outstanding pass rush, except for the Raiders who lost to the Bucs. Now, recall the sort of pass rush the Skins had for all our Super Bowl appearances.

We might make this playoffs this year, but we will never be a Super Bowl team without an outstanding pass rush.

Posted by: Rush Man | May 1, 2007 10:36 AM | Report abuse

etrod,

Glad to hear it. :-)

Posted by: JustMe | May 1, 2007 10:38 AM | Report abuse

dc

certainly hoping we have seen the last of renaldo wynn.... nice guy wrong guy.

Posted by: Old School | May 1, 2007 10:40 AM | Report abuse

Justin Hickman, DE UCLA.

6'1", 260, 4.75/40,

31 solo tackes, 12.5 sacks in 2006 (tied for PAC 10 lead)

Good motor, too small and weak to play every down as a pro.

Posted by: Larry Bud | May 1, 2007 10:40 AM | Report abuse

No to Dhani Jones

Posted by: jm220 | May 1, 2007 10:44 AM | Report abuse

Old School,

He just restructured (with a pay cut), so he probably isn't going anywhere.

Posted by: JustMe | May 1, 2007 10:45 AM | Report abuse

dc

certainly hoping we have seen the last of renaldo wynn.... nice guy wrong guy.

Posted by: Old School | May 1, 2007 10:40 AM

Didnt he just re-structure for less money to stay with the team???

Posted by: Inigo Montoya | May 1, 2007 10:45 AM | Report abuse

Another NO to Dhani Jones. Terrible football player, and that whole rennaissance man routine annoys me.

Posted by: JustMe | May 1, 2007 10:46 AM | Report abuse

Dhani Jones is to Philly as Warrick Holdman is to DC.

Posted by: etrod | May 1, 2007 10:46 AM | Report abuse

What our defense really needs is for offense to improve. its been a long time since we have put a good offense on the field that can run and throw, move the ball consistently and score in the mid- twenties.

Posted by: Old School | May 1, 2007 10:51 AM | Report abuse

I wasn't advocating going after Dhani Jones (or Juran Bolden), I was just noting the whackage. On Renaldo, I'm guessing part of the heart-to-heart he had with St. Joe was something along the lines of, in exchange for the restructured contract, please try to trade (i.e., continue to project value) rather than cut. Carter seemed like he was playing every down, so I don't see a problem wearing down the opponent's RT by rotating Daniels, Wynn, Evans ... until an everydown DE becomes available on the market.

Posted by: dcsween | May 1, 2007 10:51 AM | Report abuse

Other than his 4 game suspension and recidivism (sure is one bone headed word), anyone think it would be a bad thing to try to get Jared "Booze" Allen, 4th year DE from Kansas City?

Posted by: dcsween | May 1, 2007 10:59 AM | Report abuse

On D sounds like to me we are going to play lots of people. rather than rely on a coule guys for QB pressure say like (manley and Mann). So the key is to play team defense and situation sub guys and put them in positions were they can make plays, and don't ask guys to do things they aren't very good at.

Posted by: Old School | May 1, 2007 11:00 AM | Report abuse

Sean Taylor wears a helmet to protect other players.

Posted by: etrod | May 1, 2007 11:01 AM | Report abuse

Zach Latimer- 6'1" 235

44 solo tackles 40 assists. 3 INTs. 2 forced fumbles.

Couldn't find a 40 time. What is it with 235 lbs LBs?????

Posted by: Larry Bud | May 1, 2007 11:01 AM | Report abuse

They have not been a defensive team all season - in fact, not in recent years.

lisa, that's not a good thing. like i said before you can't win without defense. it's not just me it's everyone who's saying that.

also the fact that they're not a defensive team IS a problem. the GM sees it. he gave eddie a chance. they were going to focus on defense this offseason but the guy can't make his players buy into playing any defense.

again NOT a good sign.

the reason i suggested antawn is because he's good. he'll be good for someone who needs a scorer. they have no one else to trade that would get you a quality player back.

you can't trade your crap for others stars. (i can't believe i just said that) but it's true. only an idiot would take your crap and give you back a star. right? and i don't watch enough nba to tell you who that idiot is.

and i don't want to trade arenas because he's good and more valuable to this team than antawn.

Posted by: dealer | May 1, 2007 11:02 AM | Report abuse

Lando's Teammate

5'11" 185

Only started 3 ganes as a senior. Was a special teams standout. Yeah...

Posted by: Larry Bud | May 1, 2007 11:03 AM | Report abuse

but antawn is making $16 mil a year. not a very tradeable cap number.

i really hope they get rid of this guaranteed contract thing. there's gotta be a compromise. it killed the bullez for years when they had juwan howard.

Posted by: dealer | May 1, 2007 11:04 AM | Report abuse

Why shouldn't we trade away our picks if this is what we do with them? I mean come on, maybe one of the picks other than Landry makes the roster and that's as a special teams/ 3rd stringer at best. Last year you get Golston and Montgomery, could we not have drafted DT's and DE's with all our late rounders and hope we hit on one or two. Backup linebackers are cheap and abundent, D-lineman are not! Also, a guy like Mason Crosby is around in the 6th and our kicker is Sean Suisham? Just saying, there were muuuuuuuuch better options, but its heartwarming to know that Snyder is comfortable with the front office as it is.

Posted by: Jack | May 1, 2007 11:05 AM | Report abuse

Lando's other teammate

8' Wookie.

Tears people's arms out of their sockets when he loses.

Posted by: etrod | May 1, 2007 11:05 AM | Report abuse

I think they are probably keeping Wynn around because he's reportedly a good locker room guy. One of the things Portis voiced at the end of last season was that the players were really frustrated with seeing "their guys" let go while others are brought in for much more money. Keeping him (and a couple of others) seems like a good will gesture on the part of the FO. It promotes continuity, which they claim is important to them, and they have last resort depth (in Wynn's case, they can plug him in at DT or DE) around for cheap.

Posted by: JustMe | May 1, 2007 11:06 AM | Report abuse

Wynn has zero value in a trade. has only locker value to us. This where the skins get sentimental (it's like crying in baseball) there's no crying in baseball.

Renaldo Wynn plays an impact position (DE) yet he has and is incapable of providing any. You keep or get an older de only if he has the skills to get after the passer at his advanced age a player like that has value (this is not the profile of wynn) this is more the profile of strahan (not advocating getting him) just making a point.

Posted by: Old School | May 1, 2007 11:07 AM | Report abuse

Jack--

You seem to be in a minority. 'Skins got a lot of good publicity from the draft gurus for the two LBs they took. SI rated the fifth rounder as one of the 10 steals of the draft. Others were praising them for stealing the 6th rounder.

When you only have five picks and about 15 needs, you just can't address them all. As for kickers, there are way too many good free agents to waste a pick on an unproven one.

Posted by: KK | May 1, 2007 11:09 AM | Report abuse

Lando's other teammate

60 something has been that tends to get himself frozen in carbon.

Posted by: Larry Bud | May 1, 2007 11:13 AM | Report abuse

I hear your locker point. but we have 2 guys at the same position with the same profile.....Daneils and Wynn. Both good guys . of the two daniels is the better player and has a little left in the tank.

Posted by: Old School | May 1, 2007 11:14 AM | Report abuse

Washington Redskins: GRADE: C-
Washington had only one pick in the first four rounds and made the most of it, getting LaRon Landry. (You could argue Landry was the best defensive player in the draft). Drafting Landry will allow Sean Taylor to play center field and roam the middle of the field. Landry will be in the box, and that will negate his weakness, which is judging the deep ball. In the fifth round, the Redskins took an average linebacker in Dallas Sartz; linebacker HB Blades was a decent sixth-round pick although a bit undersized; and QB Jordan Palmer never really emerged as a potential starter.


Taken directly from ESPN, my point was Blades will probably make the roster and that's it. We drafted backup linebackers (McCune, the Ivy League Guy, the UCLA guy) recently and they have done nothing, but our old injury prone D-line dictates that we gotta get younger and deeper, which they haven't done in FA or the draft. 19 sacks! Is there really anything we should be arguing about, do they really think that this line is good? we couldn't rush the qb or stop the run, that's kinda the only things a d-line is supposed to do.

Posted by: Jack | May 1, 2007 11:16 AM | Report abuse

I hear your locker point. but we have 2 guys at the same position with the same profile.....Daneils and Wynn. Both good guys . of the two daniels is the better player and has a little left in the tank.

Posted by: Old School | May 1, 2007 11:14 AM

*******************************

I agree. Daniels seems to have a little bit left, and may be rejuvinated a bit by being allowed to condition off-season the way he wants. But, Wynn is as weak as water. He's done.

Posted by: JustMe | May 1, 2007 11:19 AM | Report abuse

I seriously don't understand why everyone continues to gripe about not drafting at the DE/DT spots. Have you NOT reviewed the roster to see the youth that is on the line? Simply by adding yet another young prospect for the sake of adding makes no sense.

As for the LB's drafted Blades seems to be the mold of Fletcher, who as we all know is getting up in age. So if we can draft a replacement for him and he can learn from Fletcher, play special teams for two years and then move into the starting role isn't THAT rebuilding through the draft?

By drafting Dallas, two years ago Chris Clemons was the "sack specialist" on our team and he was average at best. Doesn't drafting a stronger, faster, better player like Dallas make sense?

I sometimes wonder if some of you really understand the concept of what goes on with roster moves.

Drafting Palmer... a bit of a surprise, however, the talent is there and in years past Gibbs had Hump, Ryp, and Jay on on the roster. Isn't developing young talent better than having, Collins,Bru, behind Soups better?!

I will take my chances any day with someone that reviews hours of film. I think Vinny is horrible, however if you think for one second, he has a say so over Gibbs, you just don't follow the Redskins. Gibbs had assumed player power over Beathard and Beathard was was one of the best GMs in the history. Vinny is a easy target to blame when it comes to player choices and I firmly believe before Gibbs arrived, he had alot to say about who we got. Now I think he is just a voice.

Please LOOK at what we drafted and the roles they will play for our team. Drafting DL for the sake of drafting DL vs adding a player that "fits" just doesn't work.

Hail freaking to 'em

Posted by: Hail to 'em | May 1, 2007 11:23 AM | Report abuse

Jack:

Taken directly from Sports Illustrated, Top Ten Steals of the Draft:

"Sartz is a quality linebacker who many graded as first-day material. He'll offer competition at linebacker and could eventually start."

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/multimedia/photo_gallery/0704/gallery.nfl.draft.steals/content.5.html

On the D-Line, we are getting younger. We have two men who they drafted last year. You don't think we need more LB's? Two of our projected starters are uncertain due to injuries.

You don't think we need a young QB? You don't think we need another tight end?

The simple fact is that they had too many needs, and not enough picks. They couldn't solve all their problems with five picks.

Posted by: KK | May 1, 2007 11:26 AM | Report abuse

Hail to 'em -
Thanks for talking down to all of us, we all really like that.

And enjoy your kool-aid. I hope it's Great Bludini.

Posted by: etrod | May 1, 2007 11:27 AM | Report abuse

KK- thank you... exactly what I been sayin. We have too many holes and too few means to address them. Last year, we had a few holes and "over-filled them". I like the approach this year, after having a quiet offseason in 2005, we went to the playoffs. We can be a playoff contender with a little luck this year...

Posted by: Inigo Montoya | May 1, 2007 11:32 AM | Report abuse

Inigo,

To me, the best news of the draft is that (so far) we still have all our picks for next year.

I've got to believe that they had to wrap duct tape around the owner 'til he looked like a mummy to keep him from trading next year's first for a late second this year.

On the playoffs, I agree that it requires luck, but I'm afraid it requires more than a little.

Posted by: KK | May 1, 2007 11:35 AM | Report abuse

No Kool Aid

Landry - Perhaps the best defensive player in the draft and a certain upgrade at the postion. (V.Fox, PP anyone?) - *not a retread

Dallas - Steal. Need play makers here I could post his stats if needed. (would you rather have Holdman?) *not a retread

Blades - Conference player of the year, Leader, natural Middle LB (how did the Marshall experiment look)*not a retread

Palmer - Leader, something to prove (rather have Collins?) *not a retread

TE - If he can block, and catch a pass or two great if not we always have Yoder. (See what I mean)

Posted by: Hail to 'em | May 1, 2007 11:35 AM | Report abuse

I gotta say I hate the "draft score" stuff, how many "experts" have given the Skins a low draft score b/c they didnt have any picks??? Shouldnt it be a score based on what you did with your picks???

etrod, this kool-aid is delicious!!! but noted about the talking down.

Posted by: Inigo Montoya | May 1, 2007 11:37 AM | Report abuse

JM220, lisa, i'm about to taper off my meat eating habit. right now to once a week. and i've started working out again after a 2 year rehabilitation period.

BUT i'm having a really hard time doing the cardio. i can't seem to find the time i should be putting in. any weekend activity anyone can recommend (other than major sports including soccer)?

Posted by: dealer | May 1, 2007 11:38 AM | Report abuse

rehabilitation period=laziness

Posted by: dealer | May 1, 2007 11:39 AM | Report abuse

kk, skins don't have their 4th round pick next year. (tj trade)

Posted by: dealer | May 1, 2007 11:40 AM | Report abuse

dealer, love to go biking... if you have kiddies, get one of those trailers and pull 'em along... makes for an even better workout and the kids love it.

Posted by: Inigo Montoya | May 1, 2007 11:41 AM | Report abuse

dealer:

rehabilitiation period=laziness

(but with a better excuse than the rest of us have)

Posted by: KK | May 1, 2007 11:42 AM | Report abuse

speaking of losing the 4th rounder in the 08 draft... the Duckett trade has to be the worst in the history of trades ever!!! I understood the "knee-jerk" reaction to Portis' injury last year, but c'mon the guy was awful and cost us two potential starters!!!

Posted by: Inigo Montoya | May 1, 2007 11:42 AM | Report abuse

even though we historically bad from a sack / turnover point of view. I will restate my point about the offense not helping the defense out in game after game last seasons and for most of the 3 years thus far. I many games last season where the D dispite lack of pressure played well enough overall to keep us in the game while waiting for this offense to do anything.

Minn
ny giants
tampa
phila

Holding teams in this league to 20 less you should win 80% of the time. many other games with 3 qtrs of good enough d no support from the O resultimg in a wilt down the stretch.

Posted by: Old School | May 1, 2007 11:43 AM | Report abuse

Just re-read the "talking down to us" comment. I was merely saying the same people moan and groan about the same stuff. What good would it have done to draft another 5th 6th 7th round DL? We have those guys on the roster ALREADY.

AND if there was a DL that good in the later rounds that was better than what we currently have, don't you honestly believe we would have picked them?

My OPINION is we will get better value out of the two LB than we would have a kicker/punter or another late round "project" at DL.

It certainly wasn't meant to speak down to anyone.

Posted by: Hail to 'em | May 1, 2007 11:45 AM | Report abuse

Dear Hail to 'em,

What on earth do you see as "youth" at our DE spot?

Our DEs are weak, and all but Andre "$30M/6sacks" Carter are old.

Signed,

Posted by: Clinton Hill | May 1, 2007 11:47 AM | Report abuse

Dealer that is a great move with not eating meat. For me it's about doing something different each time I do cardio. One week it might be the bike, next week treadmill, the week after that step master. Swimming, basketball, and biking are some other things that you could do.

Posted by: jm220 | May 1, 2007 11:52 AM | Report abuse

I am glad there are several of you who still give benefit of the doubt to the front office. I don't. I love Joe, but he's not a personel guy. As for Danny/Vinny -- nothing needs to be said. How many good low round (4th & below) draft picks have we made over the last few years? Sure, maybe we got a guy who can play on a mediocre d-line... but I'm not seeing evidence that we are very good at this. 4th - 7th round picks from 2003-2006: Gibran Hamdan, Mark Wilson, Jim Molinaro, Manny White, Robert McCune, Jared Newberry, Neihemiah Broughton, Anthony Montgomery, Reed Doughty, Kedric Golston, Kili Lefotu, Kevin Simon. Most of those guys are out of the league, maybe a couple from last year will become decent journeymen.

Posted by: beat cal | May 1, 2007 11:53 AM | Report abuse

The 'grading teams on the draft' stuff also makes me snore. These things are written by guys many years removed from actual talent evaluation, trying to lure readers to their mock draft sites, and now trying to maintain their relevance by 'grading' teams (usually based on how closely teams followed their expert mock draft advice). Please. All the lovey dovey 'consensus' among the mock drafters about Mason Crosby, the kicker that the teams collectively chose as the THIRD kicker in the draft, ought to receive the treatment that describes what they've done -- mockery.

The Skins were victims of past bad moves. The draft was an "accountability moment." Sometimes, you have to pay off your credit cards. The reason to use late round picks on LBs is because LBs are the fodder of special teams tackles. Rookies have tons of enthusiasm and are more durable for teams duty. It was a good move, even a better move if the guy is able to make the lineup as a position player.

I've been puzzling over the new QB controversy created for the #3 QB spot. Casey Bramlett v. Jordan Palmer v. Sam Hollenbach. When you think about it, forcing the controversy when the position is #3 should enable the cream pick for the eventual #2 guy to rise to the top. Seems like a good idea in hindsight. Let's hope one of them has the skills to be a solid #2 guy for many years (and, if necessary, a competitor for Soup should he slip up).

Posted by: dcsween | May 1, 2007 11:54 AM | Report abuse

Couldn't agree more that they have too many needs and not enough picks, but TE, I'm ok with Cooley, Yoder, and Sellers if necessary. I'm not saying that we don't need LB's, just saying that you can find cheap, experienced help at that position a lot easier than most, taking one....ok but taking two makes no sense. There were some decent D-line prospects taken after our 5th rounder. As too a young QB, what's Casey Bramlet? We can argue all day about which site is right on how good those linebackers are (SI vs. ESPN vs. NFL) and taking one is ok but at the end of the day (or offseason) not signing a single D-line player or drafting a single one when we set the record for fewest sacks and couldn't stop the run either is in-excusable. You honestly believe this was a successful draft/offseason?

Posted by: Jack | May 1, 2007 11:55 AM | Report abuse

CH, you take a look at what is apparently the Skins' current roster and there are a bunch of DE/DTs all born after 1983. I think Hail's point is that exactly like this bunch we already have, anyone we would have gotten after the first pick would have been a "Just a guy"-type. No improvement over what is already there (and admittedly is pretty uninspiring).

Posted by: stevie in ct | May 1, 2007 11:55 AM | Report abuse

Inigo: Duckett was not awful, the trade was. Duckett was valuable when he played but the team did not play him. 10 games, 38 carries, 2 TDs and 10 first downs (9 on carries) and a 3.5 yard average...not bad for a guy who is typcally brought in for a yard or less on obvious running plays. All that and TJ NEVER ONCE complained to the press, always supported the team and was a true pro for what was supposed to be his FA contract year. Class! I don't want to hear anyone badmouthing the player for the actions of the team.

Posted by: MrSpartan | May 1, 2007 11:58 AM | Report abuse

Anybody else sick to death of Brady Quinn? On the one hand Miami gets blasted for passing on him and on the other everybody talks about how is lack of accuracy is one of his negatives. Hello, an inaccurate QB? No thanks.

Posted by: skinswest | May 1, 2007 11:58 AM | Report abuse

In a spirt of disclosure(If you haven't figured it out), TJ Duckett was an MSU star and Grad. Go Green!

Posted by: Anonymous | May 1, 2007 11:59 AM | Report abuse

I'm not saying we should have necessarily used late round picks on the d-line, but the suggestion that we already have youth at DE is flat wrong.

DE and DT are different positions, and our DEs are old and mediocre (at best).

DE is a serious problem for this team right now. I don't know how anyone can see otherwise.

Posted by: Clinton Hill | May 1, 2007 12:00 PM | Report abuse

I wrote that about Duckett

Posted by: MrSpartan | May 1, 2007 12:01 PM | Report abuse

What on earth do you see as "youth" at our DE spot?

Our DEs are weak, and all but Andre "$30M/6sacks" Carter are old.

Signed,

Posted by: Clinton Hill | May 1, 2007 11:47 AM

"right here on earth" The Redskins active roster.


79 DT Alexander, Lorenzo 6'1" 301 1yr

73 DT Boschetti, Ryan 6'4" 301 3yr

99 DE Carter, Andre 6'4" 265 6yr

74 DT Clauss, Jared 6'4" 290 2yr

92 DE Evans, Demetric 6'3" 285 5yr

64 DT Golston, Kedric 6'4" 292 1yr

91 DE Green, Jamaal 6'2" 258 2yr

96 DT Griffin, Cornelius 6'3" 310 7yr

90 DT Manupuna, Vaka 6'0" 300 1yr

94 DT Montgomery, Anthony 6'5" 305 1yr

95 DT Salave'a, Joe 6'3" 317 8yr

71 DE Shaw, Bryant 6'3" 287 1yr

78 DE Sykes, Joe 6'2" 266 1yr

77 DE Wilson, Chris 6'4" 240 1yr

97 DE Wynn, Renaldo 6'3" 292 10yr

93 DE Daniels, Phillip 6'3" 290 11yr

Posted by: Hail to 'em | May 1, 2007 12:02 PM | Report abuse

Has anyone watched Bramlet in Europe. DREADFUL. (as am I for watching the NFL Europe, but thats beside the point)

Posted by: Hail to 'em | May 1, 2007 12:05 PM | Report abuse

Why are you listing DTs!? I'm talking about DEs. And specifically I'm talking about ones that get playing time:

Andre Carter, Philip Daniels, Renoldo Wynn and Demetric Evans.

Spare me the UDFA's who won't be in uniform on opening day.

DE is a serious need for this team, there's no getting around this point.

Posted by: Clinton Hill | May 1, 2007 12:06 PM | Report abuse

3 TEs is certainly not a crazy proposition and Sellers is a FB. If the LBers in the later rds were better players than the DL prospects, whats the issue with drafting them? Both LBers have been mentioned as "steals" when we got them. And Bramlet... I have no life and have watched some NFL Europa... he sucks. Collins sucks and Brunell is in his last season as a back-up. I like the move for a good arm and good genes in young Palmer, we could use a developmental QB.

Was the offseason what I envisioned? no, but I am happy with what was addressed. We needed someone in the middle of the D and added fletcher, we needed A LOT of secondary help anbd by adding a lot of guys that can contribute and a guy who could be a ridiculous stud in Landry the secondary was made MUCH better. Best of all we didnt break the bank on any one player.

Posted by: Inigo Monotya | May 1, 2007 12:06 PM | Report abuse

I watched a few minutes of NFL Europe the other day. I was semi-entertained.

Then again, maybe I'm just that desperate for football.

Posted by: Clinton Hill | May 1, 2007 12:07 PM | Report abuse

CH, Hail . . .

Went back and looked at the roster and I think your point stands, CH. I was going off the quick glance I took yesterday, and you are right, it is the DTs who are a young-ish group -- the DE may have little experience, at least with the Skins, but that ain't the same as youth.

However, the greater point -- that DE is a problem but that the draft wasn't a good one for addressing that need -- is probably something we can all agree on.

Posted by: stevie in ct | May 1, 2007 12:07 PM | Report abuse

or not

Posted by: stevie in ct | May 1, 2007 12:09 PM | Report abuse

thanks JM. i'm an idiot for not thinking about switching like that. cuz i HATE doing cardio.

inigo, but those damn trailers are expensive. like $150 right? also people tell me that others on W&OD with bikes will laugh at me if i buy a $200 bike from costco. but DUDE! $1000 for a bike is inasanity!

Posted by: dealer | May 1, 2007 12:10 PM | Report abuse

Bramlet has been aweful, but a mediocre quarterback with a big name from UTEP is an upgrade? Hollenbach was a productive starter in the ACC, he's a much better shot than Palmer's little bro. And just b/c you already have a little youth on a unit that is only remarkable in its futility doesn't mean you couldn't use some more youth. That set records for lack of talent and we have done nothing to address it. If that isn't the worst shot at our front office I don't know what is.

Posted by: Jack | May 1, 2007 12:12 PM | Report abuse

I seriously don't understand why everyone continues to gripe about not drafting at the DE/DT spots. Have you NOT reviewed the roster to see the youth that is on the line?

Posted by: Hail to 'em | May 1, 2007 11:23 AM

Why are you listing DTs!? I'm talking about DEs

Posted by: Clinton Hill | May 1, 2007 12:06 PM

I was taling about the DL as a whole. Again and again its been address, why DRAFT a guy just to draft a guy. WE ALREADY have those type of players ON OUR TEAM.

So with the few picks that we did have... wait for it... hold it... I think (my opinion) we took the best players for our needs. AND besides the Duckett trade we held onto yto all of our picks, added youth and depth and the BEST defensive player in the draft. All in all it seems pretty successful to me.

Posted by: Anonymous | May 1, 2007 12:12 PM | Report abuse

Inigo Monotya - HE GETS IT! I couldn't agree more with him.

Posted by: Hail to 'em | May 1, 2007 12:15 PM | Report abuse

Hail

I try and use hindsight as my only evaluation tool when looking at our and other rosters around the league.

I do not get to excited about young defensive taclkes that just make your roster.however golsten is a nice story and if he developes further i will be excited about a 6th round pick who starts and makes a solid contribution to a defense ranked better than 31. Montgommery has along way to go, at best best we can say he is young and very big.again lets see what he can do on the field.

My point is that for years we haven't gotten anything of real great value from the bottom of the draft. I am talking pro bowl impact players, that other teams year in year out seem to be able to land. I will give you an example (repeat) we all love Rock cartright. suppose instead of being a 7th round pick who makes your team as a special teamer/returner (nice story) Rock had become our feature back getting 1500 yds a season. not asking for this every year but once in awhile find someone.

Getting someone who can really play late adds so much to the talent level of your team. this is place that we have failed along with just not having the # picks . hey maybe this is the year that hb and dallas are going to be those late rounds gems, i'll be first to say now we are talk'n. but i gonna wait to see'm play awhile first.

Posted by: Old School | May 1, 2007 12:16 PM | Report abuse

dealer- Probably out of your way a bit, but I love riding the B&A trail, and now that it's completed, the BWI trail. They've built a connector spur so you can easily go from one to the other. Much less stopping on the BWI trail too.

Of course I've been using the baby as my excuse to not ride. That, and the fact the doctors can't figure out why my elbow has been in so much pain for like 7 months now.

Posted by: 4-12 | May 1, 2007 12:17 PM | Report abuse

Never said Duckett wasnt a class guy. But he was not very good, sorry. And Sellers would have been just as good if not better in the same situations. I swear it takes Duckett an hour to get moving out of the backfield!!!

I think Ramsey was a classy guy, but that doesnt mean he should be a starting QB.

The whole Duckett thing was a disaster and the FO is the main reason based on what they gave up, but he didnt help by playing like poopy. do you have a stat on how many times he had the ball in short yardage and failed to convert?

Posted by: Inigo Montoya | May 1, 2007 12:19 PM | Report abuse

Can we get a status of all the injuries and of season surgeries? What are the question marks?

Posted by: MrSpartan | May 1, 2007 12:21 PM | Report abuse

dealer, buy the $200 bike and tell everyone to kiss it!!! Mine works just fine, my wife bought it at Sports Authority. We got our trailer used on craigslist for $20... works great!!!

Posted by: Inigo Montoya | May 1, 2007 12:21 PM | Report abuse

I don't understand the point of looking at youth at DT and calling it "youth on the d-line". While technically correct, it glosses over the lack of youth at DE.

I just don't see the point of ignoring this fact about our DEs that get pt.

Again, I'm not saying we should have drafted DE with our late picks. I am saying: DE is still a huge need for our team and it will need to be dealt with next off season.

This year's draft was poor b/c we traded away our 2nd, 3rd and 4th rounders for garbage (and over-paying for Rocky Mac). Those are the rounds where you get quality depth, something this team is sorely lacking.

Landry is great, but we need depth in addition to star power. In fact, we have plenty of stars already.

Posted by: Clinton Hill | May 1, 2007 12:23 PM | Report abuse

Old School, I agree with you somewhat. I don't even think we need star talent out of our late round picks. What we need is the role players, the supporting cast, the Ryan Clarks to the Sean Taylors.

The best teams in the league get quality depth and spot starters out of the later round picks.

The Redskins under Snyder & Gibbs do not.

Posted by: Clinton Hill | May 1, 2007 12:25 PM | Report abuse

Old,

I with you too brother. All I am saying is it takes a while to "right the ship" The old way of doing things messed the team up horribly. However I have to believe that Gibbs & co. understand that building a winning team isn't done the way they did them in the PAST. I just have to believe that. (koolaid or not)

So when I see an effort to try and build versus settling in and not changing their way of doing things, I have to embrace it.

Just like every knucklehead, die hard, hog nose wearin, loyal fan, who reads and writes something in here just about everyday, even though we are months away from training camp, I have to find the silver lining.

If not... well then I would be like SMACK, who I am positive was a Cowpukes fan in the 70's, switched to the 49ers in the 80's and then switched back to the Pukes in the 90's and now has gotten too old to switch to the Patriots because his friends all know him as a Cowpukes fan now. Come on we ALL know that is true don't we SMACK?!!! ( I bet you were even a Bulls fan at one point. and... a Hurricane fan or wait... Florida State fan.

F' the Cowpukes

Posted by: Hail to 'em | May 1, 2007 12:27 PM | Report abuse

Man, you try to act as mediator -- the Jimmy Carter of Asburn, if you will -- and people just talk over you and say exactly what you said, only in way too many words. Oh well.

So much for peace in Skinsville.

Posted by: stevie in ct | May 1, 2007 12:28 PM | Report abuse

This is the last year for Daniels and Wynn. Next year, the Skins spend big bucks and bring in a big-name DE. The D-Line did it the season before last; 2006 was a bad year because of injuries. Let's see what we get with current roster.

Waiting until June to release Springs? I do not know the cap implications, but I assume that the Skins can lessen the cap hit this year by waiting until June to release Springs.

Last season for Joe? Reticence to spend next year's draft picks seems like Joe may be contemplating the end of his 2nd stay in D.C. He wants to leave the next guy something to work with, and not mortgage the future.

Posted by: rb | May 1, 2007 12:29 PM | Report abuse

I take it back -- rally around Old School!

Posted by: stevie in ct | May 1, 2007 12:30 PM | Report abuse

I take it back -- rally around Old School!

Posted by: stevie in ct | May 1, 2007 12:30 PM

lol

Posted by: Clinton Hill | May 1, 2007 12:31 PM | Report abuse

is this better?!!!

You're great stevie in ct!

Posted by: Hail to 'em | May 1, 2007 12:32 PM | Report abuse

rb, why come we have to release Springs? If we don't need the cap room for an immediate addition, I say we keep the best CB on the roster, even if he's only going to play 12 games.

Carlos & Fred as a starting tandem scare me.

Also, I love Joe Gibbs to death, but the day he steps aside for a GM will be a happy day for me. Gibbs has no qualifications whatsoever to be a personnel guy, and his track record during Gibbs II speaks for itself.

(sub .500)

Posted by: Clinton Hill | May 1, 2007 12:33 PM | Report abuse

I was suffering from a little pre-lunch grumpiness, I'm OK now.

Any of that Kool-aid left? I'll take purplesaurus rex if you've got it.

Posted by: etrod | May 1, 2007 12:36 PM | Report abuse

OH YEAH!

Posted by: Kool-Aid Man | May 1, 2007 12:37 PM | Report abuse

F anybody slamming SMACK up here. I've seen a couple of comments on this thread which are way out of line.

SMACK is a stalwart contributor up here, an important cog in our ongoing conversation. Anyone who paints him with the same brush as all other Cowboys fans hasn't been paying attention. Do your homework.

You step to SMACK, you're stepping to me.

HAIL

Posted by: Nate in the PDX | May 1, 2007 12:38 PM | Report abuse

Clinton Hill,

We have to release Springs because he costs too much and, even if we kept him, you can plan on Carlos and Fred to start 8-12 games while Springs is recovering from whatever knocks him out in the third week.

Posted by: KK | May 1, 2007 12:39 PM | Report abuse

I am stepping to Smack. Now what Nate? You want to see me!

Posted by: jm220 | May 1, 2007 12:44 PM | Report abuse

Hail to em, why's it so hard to believe someone can be a Boys fan for life. Don't be like that other idiot calling a 9 year old kid a bandwagon fan. You seem awfully insecure. Let's get this straight, for 30 years...

Cowboys
Miami Hurricanes
Holland - Oranje
Arsenal (okay maybe 16 years, so yeah put me on that bandwagon)

Pretty much F everyone else.

Posted by: SMACK | May 1, 2007 12:45 PM | Report abuse

Nate I am only joking. lol

Posted by: jm220 | May 1, 2007 12:45 PM | Report abuse

Yeah, just feeling needy here, Hail (you're the guy whose position I was initially defending, buddy!).

All the negativity -- starting with the ES influx some months back -- has kinda taken the fun out of the site. Disagreement = good. Stupid back and forth ("MY DE is younger than YOUR DE") only helps us get to 60K, I suppose.

Posted by: stevie in ct | May 1, 2007 12:45 PM | Report abuse

There's a great post on the next thread, from another Jason, a really nice remembrance of Kevin Mitchell.

Posted by: Nate in the PDX | May 1, 2007 12:46 PM | Report abuse

F Smack.
F Chris Larry

Posted by: jm220 | May 1, 2007 12:46 PM | Report abuse

Thanks Nate! New post!

Posted by: SMACK | May 1, 2007 12:46 PM | Report abuse

And look -- BEEP BEEP -- a new post!

I love you all.

Posted by: Nate in the PDX | May 1, 2007 12:46 PM | Report abuse

KK- but we're not in a cap crunch and we don't need Springs' money. Weakening our secondary because we're over-paying Springs (debatable) doesn't make any sense, especially if there's nowhere better to spend the money in '07.

Springs has played in 77% of his career games (81% since coming to Washington). Springs for 12 games next year is well worth $7M that isn't immediately needed elsewhere.

I can't believe anyone is advocating going with Carlos & Smoot as our top CBs. Carlos was a failure as a #1 last year, and Smoot lost his starting job as a #2 to a rookie in Minny.

They need Springs and so do we. Even if it's for 12 games.

Posted by: Clinton Hill | May 1, 2007 12:47 PM | Report abuse

OK Inigo ask and you shall recieve...

Duckett carried the ball 2 times last season in 3rd and short (4 or less yards)and did not deliver. Once in the Rams game (Week 16) and once in the Panther game(Week 12)

He was also blessed with 3 carries for 39 yards (14, 10, 15)that were called back due to penalties.

I agree that he was a bad trade for the team but he did not get a shake here. (FYI, Betts' first 25 carries resulted in 91 total yards about the same avg as Duckett) Hail!

Posted by: MrSpartan | May 1, 2007 12:59 PM | Report abuse

for the record SMACK and Nate, it was a joke ONLY because he is the ONLY Cowpukes fan that I see in here. So turn off your favorite WWE music Nate and relax.

As for SMACK... come on now I will buy the Cowpukes for 30 years, however... 30 years of rooting for the Canes? Unless you grew up from there it tough to believe, but for the sake of not having to be involved in a tag match with Nate, I will give you the benefit of the doubt.

I could careless who has your back...

F Romo
F Dallas
F T.Oh another drop.

Posted by: Hail to 'em | May 1, 2007 1:53 PM | Report abuse

stevie I know you had my back. I was really trying to change the subject as well. also trying to have more fun on the site. no harm

Posted by: Hail to 'em | May 1, 2007 1:55 PM | Report abuse

Casey Bramlet has a perfect skill set for holding a clipboard.

Posted by: Otter | May 1, 2007 2:44 PM | Report abuse

99 DE Carter, Andre 6'4" 265 6yr
92 DE Evans, Demetric 6'3" 285 5yr
91 DE Green, Jamaal 6'2" 258 2yr
71 DE Shaw, Bryant 6'3" 287 1yr
78 DE Sykes, Joe 6'2" 266 1yr
77 DE Wilson, Chris 6'4" 240 1yr
97 DE Wynn, Renaldo 6'3" 292 10yr
93 DE Daniels, Phillip 6'3" 290 11yr

Posted by: Hail to 'em | May 1, 2007 12:02 PM

Please note - I have deleted the DTs because it is a different position with different needs, as previously noted by Clinton Hill. Most DEs and DTs are NOT interchangeable

99 DE Carter, Andre - Needs a "Manley"
92 DE Evans, Demetric - not an "every down" player
91 DE Green, Jamaal - just a guy
71 DE Shaw, Bryant - just a guy
78 DE Sykes - another Carter-sized guy
77 DE Wilson - should be a LB based on size
97 DE Wynn, Renaldo - old/done
93 DE Daniels, Phillip - old

***

If you subtract Daniels, Wynn, Carter and Evans, you have four guys who should probably be working on their insurance sales skills. Sadly, the average age of Daniels, Wynn, Carter and Evans is around 31 (Avg 8 yrs experience).

The starting point for an above average DE is Strong Young Legs. Then add Solid Upper Body Strength. The final ingredient is Amazing Athleticism. Do you see any of that in Green, Shaw, Sykes and Wilson? If not, then it is time to spend some time and resources on finding DE replacements who are 26 or younger.

Like RIGHT NOW!

Posted by: Otter | May 1, 2007 3:05 PM | Report abuse

Hail,

SMACK did grow up in Miami. He said that yesterday.

(People should read the blog before posting.)

Posted by: Anonymous | May 1, 2007 3:19 PM | Report abuse

Washington Redskins
Best pick: LaRon Landry, S, LSU. The Redskins reportedly wanted to trade back and acquire more picks but they didn't get the right deal to move. Instead of reaching for a defensive lineman such as Anderson or Okoye with this pick, Washington took the best available defender in Landry. Now the team boasts the most talented young safety tandem in the NFL with Landry and former fifth-overall pick Sean Taylor.

Worst pick: HB Blades, ILB, Pittsburgh. There isn't much to go on here considering the Redskins' next selection after Landry didn't come until the fifth round. While the team got a good deal on Blades in the sixth round, it couldn't afford to draft luxury at that point. Washington would have been better served taking a chance on a guard such as Kasey Studdard (Texas) or a defensive tackle such as Matt Toeaina (Oregon).

That says it all right there.

Posted by: Jack | May 1, 2007 4:29 PM | Report abuse

A good comparison for Landry and Taylor is when the Broncos had Steve Atwater and Dennis Smith in the late '80's and early '90's. They were a feared tandem, and in '89 had the league's best defense.

But the Skins need Springs and have to hope he can be healthy. If they want to do what Coach Joe says and force the QB to hold the ball, they will need a healthy Shawn Springs.

Posted by: Anonymous | May 2, 2007 12:32 AM | Report abuse

Panthers are shopping Jenkins, who could help as a pass rusher!

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