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We've Gone Too Long Without a Sellers Post (Update 4)

Fullback Mike Sellers is a beast and has a diverse skillset. He is able to lead block, get out into space and catch balls, and carry the ball on occasion (though he has some struggled in short-yardage spots in spot duty there). A few years back he was a dynamic red zone option, catching a bunch of touchdown passes and having a career season, while last season his role was diminished in the passing game.

With the arrival of Coach Jim Zorn and the West Coast offense, Sellers hopes to become a playmaker again. Zorn believes there will be ample opportunity to exploit Sellers's ability.

"He's got a very flexible role," Zorn said, "because we use him in the backfield, we use him up close to the line of scrimmage, we've even used him at the tight end position on a play," Zorn said. "We've given him the ball preseason to watch him run with it, and he's got excellent hands. I would say with the versatility that he affords us with his talent, we'll try to use him in all those ways."

Zorn, who has been very forthcoming in his public comments, declined to say if Sellers would be a factor carrying the ball in short-yardage situations, an area the team struggled in last season under Joe Gibbs.

Sellers was not featured much with the ball in hands in the preseason save for a few carries, and said he can't really predict how many balls will be thrown his way until the season begins to unfold. Zorn does have certain pass plays designed for the fullback to catch the ball, "but in this offense anybody can get the ball."

Overall, Sellers said the playes' progress in grasping the offense has been steady.

"Having the offseason to go through it and all of training camp, you get to a certain comfort level," Sellers said, "but every week there's always something new and you're constantly learning stuff. For the most part we've got most of it down to the point where if it's called we don't second-guess it, we just go do it."
...
Jason Reid reports that practice is underway with players in shorts and shells. Jason Taylor came onto the field with his knee, but, about 40 minutes in, began taking part in drills. After practice, he left the field without speaking and while wearing his helmet. Could that be, Jason La Canfora wonders, a nod to former teammate Ricky Williams? ... Rookie wide receiver Malcolm Kelly was tossing a ball on the sideline with wide receivers coach Stan Hixon. Kelly is in sweats with no shoulder pads. ... Malcolm Kelly and Kareem Moore are not participating. ... Shawn Springs is also not on the field; we'll find out why.

By Jason La Canfora  |  September 2, 2008; 11:18 AM ET
 
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Next: Springs Has X-Ray; Taylor Gives It a Go

Comments

TE;

It wasnt only Jasno's theory.

On WASH post live Al Koken and ivan carter said the same thing...

Posted by: Zebra | September 2, 2008 11:03 AM

Posted by: Zebra | September 2, 2008 11:04 AM | Report abuse

can we please stop talking about punters!!!!!!!

Posted by: chrIS lArry | September 2, 2008 11:08 AM | Report abuse

Al Koken is the exact opposite of ChriS LaRry Michaels.

Koken is the biggest hater of every move the skins make. Even more than LaConfora and his Red Sox hat wearing self?

Isn't there rules against that in the work place? Should he not show any allegiance to any sports team Cindy?

Posted by: Anonymous | September 2, 2008 11:10 AM | Report abuse

Fox Mill for life.

Posted by: Fox Milla Gorilla | September 2, 2008 11:10 AM | Report abuse

4th

Posted by: 4th | September 2, 2008 11:11 AM | Report abuse

5th

Posted by: 5th | September 2, 2008 11:12 AM | Report abuse

that chris larry michaels joke is beyond lame, and not even correct considering I am not a full fledged kool-aid drinker...

Posted by: chrIS lArry | September 2, 2008 11:14 AM | Report abuse

Seriously, what's with getting down on the FO about keeping all 10 rookies? If they cut 3 of them, then we'd be hearing "they wasted 3 picks on ____". For those who can't read lower case, YOU CAN'T JUDGE A DRAFT UNTIL 3 YEARS HAVE PASSED. And even then you can't be sure. After 4 years, LaVar looked like a bona fide superstar. Now he's out of the league and nothing more than a footnote in Redskins draft history.

You're trying to grade guys who have exactly 5 PRESEASON games to their credit. How dumb does it look to cut a draft pick for a bad camp on account of an undrafted rookie? By Week 15 you might see these rookies playing some solid ball. Or in 2010 they'll be Pro Bowlers. Or they'll be cut next year. You won't know before 2010 at the earliest.

There's plenty to hate about the FO (God knows I hate it more than most), but this doesn't count. For every undrafted gem a team unearths, there's about 50 more that are just "a guy".

Posted by: brownwood26 | September 2, 2008 11:17 AM | Report abuse

Zebra, Anonymous is correct....Al Koken is a HATER. But I thought he was relatively subdued yesterday.

However, Ivan Carter also stated that EVERY NFL TEAM will do their best to sign their draft picks...NOT just the Skins.

Posted by: Lisa | September 2, 2008 11:17 AM | Report abuse

BEAST BEAST BEAST

HE EATS PEOPLE

Posted by: 45!!! | September 2, 2008 11:19 AM | Report abuse

By the way, the Foxworth dream is now over for Skins fans...


BRONCOS TRADE FOXWORTH TO FALCONS
Posted by Mike Florio on September 2, 2008, 9:54 a.m.
CBS 4 in Denver reports that the Broncos have dealt cornerback Dominique Foxworth to the Atlanta Falcons.

In return, the Broncos will receive a seventh-round pick. If the Falcons re-sign Foxworth this year, the pick upgrades to a sixth-rounder.

Foxworth, a third-round pick in 2005, started 18 games in three seasons. He played mainly as a nickel back last year.

Foxworth was one of the players who took the January 2007 death of Darrent Williams particularly hard, and the simple reality could be that Foxworth needed to move on before he truly could move on.

Posted by: brownwood26 | September 2, 2008 11:19 AM | Report abuse

You can't tell me that Foxworth for a conditional 6th or 7th isn't worth it. Regardless of how many picks got traded this offseason.

Posted by: brownwood26 | September 2, 2008 11:20 AM | Report abuse

http://projects.washingtonpost.com/nfl/crimewatch/

Posted by: 4th | September 2, 2008 11:01 AM

This "nfl crime watch project" is a hateful piece of work by the Post's Emil Steiner on a few levels.

First off, the illustration is a pair of handcuffs. How many of the so-called criminals were ever placed in handcuffs?

Second, most of the cases that were settled were actually "dismissed" or "charges dropped." So, if this was the outcome, there was no crime. Why are these falsely accused men listed on a "crime watch"?

Third, the list ignores the crimes which are commited against NFL players, like the one earlier today.

Fourth, the list is largely composed of African-American men. Do you think the Post would compile the list if it were largely whites or females?

I think the Post's Sports Editor and Ombudsman should take a look at this "project" and shut it down.

Posted by: talent evaluator | September 2, 2008 11:21 AM | Report abuse

Posted by: brownwood26 | September 2, 2008 11:17 AM

Glad to see we are back on the same page this week. When reading your post, I thought I wrote it the way it was sounding.......

Posted by: 4th | September 2, 2008 11:22 AM | Report abuse

i hate puppies

Posted by: Anonymous | September 2, 2008 11:25 AM | Report abuse

brown, nice work on your statements about the FO, and rookies above. Couldn't agree more....

Posted by: Greg | September 2, 2008 11:26 AM | Report abuse

PREDICTION #1... REDSKINS BEAT GIANTS PLAYING TOUGH DEFENSE, GOOD RUNNING GAME AND GOOD ENOUGH PASSING....
PREDICTION#2... SARAH PALIN IS NOT THE MCBUSH'S VP BY THE END OF THE CONVENTION....

Posted by: Obama is da Man!!! | September 2, 2008 11:26 AM | Report abuse

The thing about Foxworth is that he would arrive at the expense of Tryon, a player who was just drafted so it would have essentially cost us 2 picks, one next year and the one we used on JT this year. too much for a 4th CB.

Posted by: etrod | September 2, 2008 11:27 AM | Report abuse

Taylor's playing...I just know it!

Posted by: chrIS lArry | September 2, 2008 11:27 AM | Report abuse

I never saw a teapot I didn't like.

Posted by: Warren G. Harding | September 2, 2008 11:28 AM | Report abuse

However, Ivan Carter also stated that EVERY NFL TEAM will do their best to sign their draft picks...NOT just the Skins.

Posted by: Lisa | September 2, 2008 11:17 AM

Ivan Carter? He writes about basketball, right? Certainly value his opinion.

What has been completely lacking from the Post is any research. They're long on opinions and short on facts.

Is there anyone down there who could look up what the other teams did? Did all of them keep all their picks? I read that Kansas City kept eight of ten and put one on IR. What about the other teams in the league?

What about second round receivers? How many of them were cut by other teams? How many of them even had a good pre-season?

A little factual perspective would be much more insightful than "league sources" "scouts from another team" "NFL executives" or even -- dare I say it -- "talent evaluators."

Posted by: talent evaluator | September 2, 2008 11:29 AM | Report abuse

Posted by: Warren G. Harding | September 2008 11:28 AM

Vice President Nate Dogg?

Posted by: etrod | September 2, 2008 11:30 AM | Report abuse

BACK TO D. EVANS

+++"I've never had a problem playing Demetric Evans anywhere, any time any place," said defensive coordinator Greg Blache, the defensive line coach in Washington the previous four seasons. "In [2005] when we had a good run, Demetric started a bunch inside at the three-technique after he had worked at end. Demetric is what you call a true pro. He's a guy I trust. He's a young man whose mama raised him well, that's the only way I can put it. He's got it all together as a person and as a player, and I feel totally confident in him."+++--JASNO

If I didn't realize Jasno was just printing this because he hates the Redskins, I'd almost say I agree. (Ooops, for a moment there I was channeling TE, Kmpc & Anon)

Truthfully, I'd rather have 280 pounds of highly motivated D. Evans starting, with James and Wilson backing him, PLUS $8 million more in the Cap kitty, PLUS a 2nd and 6th round pick. Instead, the 'skins got a 244 pound, sore footed, bad-kneed, 34-year-old, eyes-on-his-next-career $8 million-a-year, 2nd & 6th round pick-costing Jason Taylor.

While Evans was getting bigger and stronger this Winter, Taylor was spending his offseason dancing on TV.

Zorn is on a tough learning curve. By the time he's got it figured out, JT will be an action movie star an Miami's Tuna will be starting his 2nd round gift from the redskins FO.

I hope I'm wrong. I hope Taylor has 31 sacks and is MVP this year.

But I dont' se this team getting better by continuing to rent old players unhappy with their current team at the cost of high draft picks. And NO ONE, least of all Vinny, gets well trying to out-fox Bill Parcells

Posted by: Corkczar | September 2, 2008 11:31 AM | Report abuse

Pinecrest pool owned.

Brownwood,

What else should we discuss. I don't have a problem cutting draft picks for UFA if the UFA looks better. Furthermore training camp and preseason should give the "experts" plenty of time to figure who's a baller and who's not. That's what they get paid to do. Are you right 100% of the time, no. But hopefully more often that not.

It's a rarity that you keep all your draft picks. That doesn't mean it's wrong, no one can know Vinny's reasoning. It just makes me concerned but again, my football IQ= 0.0

Posted by: Skinz | September 2, 2008 11:32 AM | Report abuse

Thanks, 4th. It just really gets me that folks are ready to fold up shop just because names like Marcus Mason and Billy McMullen and Matteral Richardson (who made the practice squad) are gone for draft picks. A couple years ago we HAD to sign guys like that because there were no draft picks. Now we have 'em and folks want 'em outta here. Unreal...

Posted by: brownwood26 | September 2, 2008 11:33 AM | Report abuse

I think the Post's Sports Editor and Ombudsman should take a look at this "project" and shut it down.

Posted by: talent evaluator | September 2, 2008 11:21 AM
-----------

Yeah, I gotta agree on this one. This is a bad stereotype. Not to mention that many are presumed guilty prior to conviction

Posted by: What? Who? | September 2, 2008 11:33 AM | Report abuse

I like your optimism, cL, but it sure seems unlikely that Jay-Tay will play. Is he officially a "game time decision"? Fingers crossed...

Posted by: Nate in the PDX | September 2, 2008 11:35 AM | Report abuse

No chance Taylor plays Thursday.

Posted by: Insider | September 2, 2008 11:35 AM | Report abuse

Reminds me... was wondering when the official team injury reports for this game have to be filed, since we're opening the season three days before the rest of the league... nothing up on NFL.com's injury page yet.

Posted by: Nate in the PDX | September 2, 2008 11:36 AM | Report abuse

I'm on the positive sports fan kick and think JT plays as well. He hasn't missed a game in many years and dudes like that show up.

Posted by: Skinz | September 2, 2008 11:36 AM | Report abuse

I still say this section is too hard to find. I had to plug it into the search feature.

And I'm not as stupid as I look =)

Posted by: Jenna | September 2, 2008 11:36 AM | Report abuse

I HAVE no football IQ.

Posted by: Daniel Simpson Day | September 2, 2008 11:37 AM | Report abuse

+++... (The FO) see these guys in practice every day. We see them only in parts of five exhibition games. I trust them to choose the best roster +++--TALENT EVALUATOR


And how's that been working out for you so far?

Posted by: Corkczar | September 2, 2008 11:38 AM | Report abuse

Instead, the 'skins got a 244 pound, sore footed, bad-kneed, 34-year-old, eyes-on-his-next-career $8 million-a-year, 2nd & 6th round pick-costing Jason Taylor.

Posted by: Corkczar | September 2, 2008 11:31 AM

JT does not have bad knees. If he had bad knees then what happened to him in preseason would have snapped his leg at the knee. He injured his knee.

Posted by: Curzon417 | September 2, 2008 11:39 AM | Report abuse

Posted by: Skinz | September 2, 2008 11:41 AM | Report abuse

Posted by: brownwood26 | September 2, 2008 11:17 AM

The simple fact of the matter is that once these guys enter camp, they're no longer draft picks - they're rookies. Why should Justin Tryon be more valuable than Matteral Richardson - simply because he was drafted? Surely you can admit that just because one was drafted doesn't automatically make him better than one who was not. The problem is compounded if you futilely waste time and effort to get the pick to work out. Not only would he be a waste of a draft pick, but he would be a waste of a roster spot too. And of course, this is the job of the FO, to determine these things.

Now maybe Tryon ends up actually working out. But this would have nothing to do with whether or not he was drafted. Him and Richardson are both rookies, both with the same experience, both with similar "upside". Richardson seemed to outperform him this preseason (considerably). Just my opinion, but I'm not too sure about the FO's decision on this one. You like Tryon's potential, then take your chances with the practice squad and see how he develops through the season. On a team like this, they shouldn't be gambling this much on a guy that is clearly a long ways away from being trusted to perform.

Posted by: psps23 | September 2, 2008 11:41 AM | Report abuse

And how's that been working out for you so far?

Posted by: Corkczar | September 2, 2008 11:38 AM

A lot better than if you'd been picking them.

Posted by: talent evaluator | September 2, 2008 11:41 AM | Report abuse

TE arguing just to argue. The FO is not judged against Cork, they are judged against their peers. So far, they are subpar.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 2, 2008 11:43 AM | Report abuse

On a team like this, they shouldn't be gambling this much on a guy that is clearly a long ways away from being trusted to perform.

Posted by: psps23 | September 2, 2008 11:41 AM

So we should be trusting Richardson to perform? I like hot-wheels, but if either Tryon or Richardson is playing for the Skins this year we are in big trouble.

If I knew I could put Richardson on the PS and he would not be signed and was not sure that Tryon surviving waivers, I would have done as the Skins done. Tryon making the roster does not mean he stays there.

Posted by: Curzon417 | September 2, 2008 11:47 AM | Report abuse

Instead, the 'skins got a 244 pound, sore footed, bad-kneed, 34-year-old, eyes-on-his-next-career $8 million-a-year, 2nd & 6th round pick-costing Jason Taylor.

Don't ever let logic or facts get in your way Cork....

Posted by: Greg | September 2, 2008 11:47 AM | Report abuse

Jasno sez that Jason Taylor is taking part in some drills now...

Posted by: Cindy | September 2, 2008 11:47 AM | Report abuse

If we can get Kareem Moore healthy I think he will prove to be the steal of the draft.

Posted by: Great One | September 2, 2008 11:48 AM | Report abuse

I think the Post's Sports Editor and Ombudsman should take a look at this "project" and shut it down.

Posted by: talent evaluator | September 2, 2008 11:21 AM

I made a comment about this last week about people's 'arrest record' and I feel exactly the same as TE stated above.....

Posted by: 4th | September 2, 2008 11:48 AM | Report abuse

If we can get Kareem Moore healthy I think he will prove to be the steal of the draft.

Posted by: Great One | September 2, 2008 11:48 AM

Maybe, but he's going to have to beat out Durant Brooks for that title.

Posted by: talent evaluator | September 2, 2008 11:49 AM | Report abuse

Jason Reid reports that practice is underway with players in shorts and shells. Jason Taylor came onto the field with his knee****

Good thing he didn't forget his knee in the locker room...

Posted by: Curzon417 | September 2, 2008 11:50 AM | Report abuse

What does Richardson have to do with Tryon? There are plenty of options at CB. You need a minimum of 5 Corners on your squad. Tryon may work out and be solid or it may come to pass that he was a substandard corner who relied on speed in college to make up for his other deficiencies. We'll find out soon enough I guess. Right now his grade is "not ready for primetime"

Posted by: Skinz | September 2, 2008 11:51 AM | Report abuse

I made a comment about this last week about people's 'arrest record' and I feel exactly the same as TE stated above.....

Posted by: 4th | September 2, 2008 11:48 AM

4th--I've already sent an e/m to the Ombudsman. I doubt that the Sports Pages understand the points. I wonder if this "project" is about making Wilbon look good?

Posted by: talent evaluator | September 2, 2008 11:51 AM | Report abuse

Oh yeah. The PATRIOTS cut their 2nd Round pick form just 2 years ago, Chad Jackson. And they traded a 3rd to move up in the 2nd round to get him.

Picking WRs in the draft is basically a crap shot.......

Posted by: 4th | September 2, 2008 11:53 AM | Report abuse

see! The dude hasn't missed a game in 10 years.......he's playing!

If you can't be a homer pollyanna on opening week when can you be

28-0 Skins

16-0!!!!!

Posted by: chrIS lArry | September 2, 2008 11:53 AM | Report abuse

I think comparing Richardson and Tryon is not a fair comparison.

Richardson played almost exclusively man 2 man coverage in college, so at the NFL level he might have a leg up in man coverage, but we do not know how he adjust to coverage when it is not man 2 man.

Tryon on the other hand looks like he played more cover packages in college and his man 2 man skills need to sharpened.

sometimes the system can help out a defensive player. as you recall Richardson got burnt against Jaxville when he was not playing man 2 man showing that there was confusion, Tryon got burnt playing man 2 man, but looked decent in cover packages.

Just a little clarity to help evaluate a little better.

Posted by: Great One | September 2, 2008 11:53 AM | Report abuse

Just got back from doing some actual work what a pain in the a$$.

Curz,

Agree Tryon nor Richardson will see the field this season except maybe on special teams, so keeping both of them was good give them a year to practice and we will see next year. If Tryon still stinks then get rid of him.

Posted by: kmdp4 | September 2, 2008 11:53 AM | Report abuse

talent evaluator, yes Ivan Carter does currently cover the Wizards but he formerly covered the NFL (the KC Chiefs was one team he covered).

Posted by: Lisa | September 2, 2008 11:54 AM | Report abuse

Wilbon's a fool. It's not possible to make him look good anymore, no matter what they do.

Posted by: Withheld | September 2, 2008 11:55 AM | Report abuse

"Jason Taylor came onto the field with his knee" - Just one? Wouldn't he need two?

Posted by: Mark in 21132 | September 2, 2008 11:55 AM | Report abuse

4th, good call on CJackson. The person that was taken in the spot that the Pats vacated was Greg Jennings.

Posted by: Greg | September 2, 2008 11:56 AM | Report abuse

talent evaluator, yes Ivan Carter does currently cover the Wizards but he formerly covered the NFL (the KC Chiefs was one team he covered).

Posted by: Lisa | September 2, 2008 11:54 AM

Thanks, Lisa. I don't follow it regularly, but when I do I love the job he does on the Wizards blog. Always insightful.

Posted by: talent evaluator | September 2, 2008 11:56 AM | Report abuse

I like to go to work with one knee, I leave my other on my couch to save my seat.

Posted by: kmdp4 | September 2, 2008 11:56 AM | Report abuse

The guys on the line need to dig in for the most part. Over the next few weeks we will see their growth in waves.

Posted by: Sharpie | September 2, 2008 11:56 AM | Report abuse

So we should be trusting Richardson to perform? I like hot-wheels, but if either Tryon or Richardson is playing for the Skins this year we are in big trouble.

Posted by: Curzon417 | September 2, 2008 11:47 AM

I would trust Richardson far more right now than Tryon. Neither are ideal, but I would at least find Richardson serviceable as a dime-back if necessary. I want Tryon nowhere near the field on defense.

Posted by: psps23 | September 2, 2008 11:57 AM | Report abuse

It's a rarity that you keep all your draft picks. That doesn't mean it's wrong, no one can know Vinny's reasoning. It just makes me concerned but again, my football IQ= 0.0

Posted by: Skinz | September 2, 2008 11:32 AM

Tell me, what does it mean to "keep all your draft picks"? In my book, if a guy is either on the 53-man roster OR on the practice squad he's still in your system. And I would rather stick a UFA on the practice squad and hope the other 31 teams don't know he can play than to expose a guy I already gave up something for to being signed away by another team. I'm pretty sure that's the mindset with most NFL teams. Unless a draft pick is hurt and/or demostrating that he flat out can't play, the undrafted guy is going to go more often than not.

Posted by: brownwood26 | September 2, 2008 11:57 AM | Report abuse

Skinz, I was responding to psps23 stating that once both are on the team that they are both rookies and draft status does not matter in the evaluation process. That is what one has to do with the other.

Posted by: Curzon417 | September 2, 2008 11:57 AM | Report abuse

Greg,

That proves that even the best FO makes mistakes now and again.

Posted by: kmdp4 | September 2, 2008 11:58 AM | Report abuse

"Jason Taylor came onto the field with his knee"

Oh good, did he have his elbows, hands, and head with him too?

Can we please stop this practice of calling injuries simply by their body parts!?!?!? Jason Taylor doesn't have a knee, he has two. He has ONE KNEE INJURY. It drives me BATS#lT CRAZY.

Posted by: Ben | September 2, 2008 12:00 PM | Report abuse

The 5th corner will be inactive for most games I am sure.

I do not know enough about the league to do it but can somebody list what positions are inactive for most games, I am sure it changes from game to game.

3QB
Anyone else.

Posted by: kmdp4 | September 2, 2008 12:01 PM | Report abuse

"I try to keep reminding myself that it took Hasslebeck 3 years to perfect Holmgrens offense. Sadly I doubt we will give JC that kind of leash."

Posted by: Zebra | September 2, 2008 9:49 AM

This is part of the reason I think the game should be (and will) be placed onto Clinton Portis' back. Given that the Skins' D has to bring 5 or 6 for EVERY down* in the first quarter (except punting ones) to rattle Eli (and they will, and do so effectively), I predict this will be a very LOW scoring game. Neither team breaks 20 points. Frankly, I say the dcsween line is 20 and I'm taking the under.

* The Skins' biggest liability, as it always has been, is Plaxico Burress (the most dangerous WR in the NFL today), so the corners have to be on him like glue ... with FS support.

Posted by: dcsween | September 2, 2008 12:01 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: psps23 | September 2, 2008 11:57 AM

Psps, I too like hot-wheels but in a dime package I may go for speed because we are probably playing more of a zone coverage.

Posted by: Curzon417 | September 2, 2008 12:01 PM | Report abuse

We're talking about back ups. We're talking about back ups. Back ups. Reserves. Not starters. Back ups.

A.I. as told to Learned Hand

Posted by: LH | September 2, 2008 12:01 PM | Report abuse

I have found my inner zojo about the roster cuts ... after posting up here that I thought that Frost had won the preseason competition, after re-watching the shank in the Jags game, I have changed my mind and now say that Frost lost (fair and square) by providing that little reminder ... also, McMullen can't reliably hold onto a pass in his hands if his arms are outstretched ... he can only catch balls in his body. On Mason, good for him to find a team where he will be starting games before the season is over. We had too many able bodies RBs ... it was like the TE position and Goode, for all his upside, he never had a chance. It was a bird in the hand v. two in the bush proposition. Skins were smart to go with hand. The only question I have is Tryon over Richardson, but I think Richardson will not get picked up by another team, so he still has a statistical shot at making the Skins' active roster (based on injury probabilities) before the season is over.

Posted by: dcsween | September 2, 2008 12:06 PM | Report abuse

+++This "nfl crime watch project" is a hateful piece of work by the Post's Emil Steiner on a few levels.

TALENT EVALUATOR+++

I think the thing to remember, is that, the only difference between pro sports and everyday life is the public knowledge and our desire to "be plugged in". More than likely, if you went back through the last 2 years, you could do the same "crime log" for the WaPo, IBM, American Airlines, etc. The only difference is the public figure aspect.

We all have done things that are against the law. We all have gone out to the bar watch the Skins game, had 4-5 or more beers and drove home. I'm sure somebody up here on the RI Blog has had experience with some kind of illegal substance...myself included.

Some will argue "Yeah, but these guys are being paid millions of dollars and should stay out of trouble." I say ... just because you are "paid" doesn't mean you are perfect.

I have a wife, 2 kids , a mortgage, and a good career(...uh, ok DECENT career) But I still go out, pound a few and drive home. You could argue , losing your life and you family is worth MORE than any NFL contract.

Bottom line...it is easy to judge.

(sorry about the rant)

Posted by: cej75024 | September 2, 2008 12:07 PM | Report abuse

PREDICTION #1... REDSKINS BEAT GIANTS PLAYING TOUGH DEFENSE, GOOD RUNNING GAME AND GOOD ENOUGH PASSING....
PREDICTION#2... SARAH PALIN IS NOT THE MCBUSH'S VP BY THE END OF THE CONVENTION....


Posted by: Obama is da Man!!! | September 2, 2008 11:26 AM


Prediction #3- You're a tool.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | September 2, 2008 12:08 PM | Report abuse

I dont think you can necessarily use kid gloves with JC. But I will stop short of the ol' sink or swim comment.

But we must pare it down to begin with. Scripting the first 15 should help although i am not a fan.

It is common in WCO, have we heard yet if JZ will do this?

JC is a pro, he should be able to make plays in the O...

Posted by: Zebra | September 2, 2008 12:09 PM | Report abuse

psps23,

The bottom line is we're talking about the bottom third of the roster. If you're playing substantial minutes with those guys you're already done. My point is you don't know who can play and who can't at this point (unless they're either spectacularly bad or spectacularly good), and the benefit of the doubt is going to the guy you drafted. Period. It may not be fair, but that's football.

If you're going to hate the FO, this ain't the reason why. Hate 'em because we had a stack of 2nd rounders and didn't take a single lineman. Don't hate 'em because they didn't deify some undrafted locals like some on this blog.

Posted by: brownwood26 | September 2, 2008 12:10 PM | Report abuse

I'm sure this has been brought up before, but why on earth does the NFL have a roster mandate of 53 players and have to deactivate some on game day? Either have a player on the roster or not. I understand practice squads players not being eligible to play on game day, but I never understood the active/inactive rule.

Posted by: Nico | September 2, 2008 12:10 PM | Report abuse

I do not know enough about the league to do it but can somebody list what positions are inactive for most games, I am sure it changes from game to game.

3QB
Anyone else.

Posted by: kmdp4 | September 2, 2008 12:01 PM

53 Man Roster. Only 45 Active Game Day. 8 people must be deemed inactive. These 8 would include those too injured to play, 3rd QB, and the remainder would be those who are the weakest or players they don't anticipate using or don't know the playbook (*cough* LaVar *cough*).......

Posted by: 4th | September 2, 2008 12:10 PM | Report abuse

++++ I have a wife, 2 kids , a mortgage, and a good career(...uh, ok DECENT career) But I still go out, pound a few and drive home. ++++

Well that sounds like a great way to lose your family and job, by drinking and driving, Slick.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 2, 2008 12:11 PM | Report abuse

It's a rarity that you keep all your draft picks. That doesn't mean it's wrong, no one can know Vinny's reasoning. It just makes me concerned but again, my football IQ= 0.0

Posted by: Skinz | September 2, 2008 11:32 AM

Back this statement up.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | September 2, 2008 12:11 PM | Report abuse

Jason Taylor came onto the field with his knee, but, about 40 minutes in, began taking part in drills....

Was his knee attached to his body, or was he carrying his knee in his hand???

Posted by: Dr. Rey | September 2, 2008 12:11 PM | Report abuse

How is an NFL crime blotter any different than a crime/neihborhood crime blotter than runs in almost every paper?

Posted by: chrIS lArry | September 2, 2008 12:13 PM | Report abuse

Instead, the 'skins got a 244 pound, sore footed, bad-kneed, 34-year-old, eyes-on-his-next-career $8 million-a-year, 2nd & 6th round pick-costing Jason Taylor.

Posted by: Corkczar | September 2, 2008 11:31 AM

JT does not have bad knees. If he had bad knees then what happened to him in preseason would have snapped his leg at the knee. He injured his knee.

Posted by: Curzon417 | September 2, 2008 11:39 AM

Before you start arguing with him, just remember that Corky is just like another Corky from a long cancelled sitcom.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | September 2, 2008 12:15 PM | Report abuse

I finally got a legitimate answer on the 53 man roster from a friend who works for the Jets. The theory is that by the end of the season, some teams have more injuries than others. The 45 man active roster ensures that the healthier teams don't have an advantage over the less healthier teams (the healthier teams would have a deeper bench).

If you think about it, it kinda makes sense.

Personally, I still think it's stupid.

Posted by: P Diddy | September 2, 2008 12:16 PM | Report abuse

Prediction #3- You're a tool.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | September 2, 2008 12:08 PM

I would have labelled it a proven fact, but scamp gives him the benefit of the doubt.

Posted by: talent evaluator | September 2, 2008 12:16 PM | Report abuse

++++ I have a wife, 2 kids , a mortgage, and a good career(...uh, ok DECENT career) But I still go out, pound a few and drive home. ++++

Well that sounds like a great way to lose your family and job, by drinking and driving, Slick.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 2, 2008 12:11 PM


Thanks, Mr...uh...anonymous. Thank you for making my point. Now, lets find out all of your faults....oh that's right...your perfect.

Posted by: cej75024 | September 2, 2008 12:16 PM | Report abuse

He wrote
"Jason Taylor came onto the field with his knee"

Well I would certainly hope so!!

Posted by: sept02 | September 2, 2008 12:20 PM | Report abuse

My point is...athletes are humans just like you and I. Let's try not to judge their faults while hiding or excusing others in "real life"

Posted by: cej75024 | September 2, 2008 12:21 PM | Report abuse

Prediction #3- You're a tool.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | September 2, 2008 12:08 PM

I would have labelled it a proven fact, but scamp gives him the benefit of the doubt.

Posted by: talent evaluator | September 2, 2008 12:16 PM

LOL!

Posted by: scampbell1975 | September 2, 2008 12:21 PM | Report abuse

I would think that my posts in general would back up the fact that my football IQ is 0.0 Scamp. If you mean the rarity thing I read somewhere that the Chiefs and Skins were the only teams to keep all their draft picks and the Chiefs are in a youth movement phase. I tried to look where I read that and couldn't find and quite frankly I'm not going to waste anymore time searching for it. Take my statements for what they were, jibba jabba on the internet. Feel free to dismiss...

Curz,

Gotcha

Posted by: Skinz | September 2, 2008 12:21 PM | Report abuse

slick

Posted by: cej75024 | September 2, 2008 12:22 PM | Report abuse

CL your point would be well taken if TWP like a lot of small town papers actually had a "crime blotter" section where it listed all of the people that got arrested and the crime(s) with which they had been charged. I'm with TE on this. What's the point of that NFL list?

Posted by: LH | September 2, 2008 12:23 PM | Report abuse

Foxworth was traded to Atlanta for an undisclosed draft pick.

Posted by: Cindy | September 2, 2008 12:23 PM | Report abuse

stop giving the argument that these guys make millions of dollars so they should make better decisions. if money changed peoples decisions making we wouldnt send people to jail, we should just give them a check for a million and they wont commit another crime.

fool without money=fool with money

that doesnt mean people dont change, because they do but money isnt going to be the motivator

Posted by: Great One | September 2, 2008 12:23 PM | Report abuse

How is an NFL crime blotter any different than a crime/neihborhood crime blotter than runs in almost every paper?


Posted by: chrIS lArry | September 2, 2008 12:13 PM

Maybe in your neighborhood they single out NFL players, but not in mine.

And maybe in your neighborhood the paper has a "Crime Watch" that lists the names of people who were found not guilty or against whom charges were dropped, but not in mine. They are not criminals and shouldn't be listed among criminals.

Posted by: talent evaluator | September 2, 2008 12:24 PM | Report abuse

Good point LH...I am pro-player and dont think I disagree.....but you cant argue that athletes and arrests/incidence are news....PFT does something similar...but yes I too find it a bit off-putting....

I generally was just asking what the difference is b/c a crime blotter feature is pretty common in newspapers..

Posted by: chrIS lArry | September 2, 2008 12:27 PM | Report abuse

Great one, what are you talking about? I'm not going to launch into the dynamics of a open market system but suffice to say, they get paid the big bucks because they are supposed to be good at what they do. I think you are just trying to argue symantics for lack of a real answer so I won't waste anymore of my time on this.

Posted by: Skinz | September 2, 2008 12:27 PM | Report abuse

people, people, people, people

MVP Taylor can take over a game from the end position- hall of fame stuff-not many can do or have done that-(superbowl rookie should have been the MVP from the end?)

# 20 will be hard pressed to help this year excepted maybe as a punt returner-need a heart check, is he fearless enough?

I CAN'T WAIT FOR THURSDAY!!!!

Posted by: skinzfanforlife | September 2, 2008 12:27 PM | Report abuse

Update #3: Shawn Springs is also not on the field; we'll find out why.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 2, 2008 12:28 PM | Report abuse

I would think that my posts in general would back up the fact that my football IQ is 0.0 Scamp. If you mean the rarity thing I read somewhere that the Chiefs and Skins were the only teams to keep all their draft picks and the Chiefs are in a youth movement phase. I tried to look where I read that and couldn't find and quite frankly I'm not going to waste anymore time searching for it. Take my statements for what they were, jibba jabba on the internet. Feel free to dismiss...

Curz,

Gotcha

Posted by: Skinz | September 2, 2008 12:21 PM

Yea, I actually meant the rarity thing. I would actually like to know how many draft picks, overall and per team, are signed.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | September 2, 2008 12:28 PM | Report abuse

Cindy,

Are there any updates on Richard Collier's condition? I assume that you'd interrupt regularly unscheduled jibba-jabba to announce them, right?

Posted by: talent evaluator | September 2, 2008 12:29 PM | Report abuse

Maybe in your neighborhood they single out NFL players, but not in mine.

And maybe in your neighborhood the paper has a "Crime Watch" that lists the names of people who were found not guilty or against whom charges were dropped, but not in mine. They are not criminals and shouldn't be listed among criminals.

Posted by: talent evaluator | September 2, 2008 12:24 PM

In addition, "we" (strictly in general terms) "We" then convict them without due process. Suddenly, a guy that has been arrested on a flimsy charge, is now a "thug".

Posted by: cej75024 | September 2, 2008 12:30 PM | Report abuse

anyone else miss "Mull it"....I know I do......

Posted by: chrIS lArry | September 2, 2008 12:31 PM | Report abuse

people chill....I was simply throwing out that newspapers do generally run lists of arrests/crimes etc.....

I am not advocating or defending anything.

Posted by: chrIS lArry | September 2, 2008 12:33 PM | Report abuse

Either have a player on the roster or not. I understand practice squads players not being eligible to play on game day, but I never understood the active/inactive rule.

Posted by: Nico | September 2, 2008 12:10 PM

IT's to give a few more reps to players who may not necessarily be 'ready' and for a few injuries that constently occur.

Posted by: 4th | September 2, 2008 12:33 PM | Report abuse

anyone else miss "Mull it"....I know I do......

Posted by: chrIS lArry | September 2, 2008 12:31 PM

Well played, cL. Personally, I miss Skippy.

Posted by: Mull It | September 2, 2008 12:33 PM | Report abuse

How is an NFL crime blotter any different than a crime/neihborhood crime blotter than runs in almost every paper?

Posted by: chrIS lArry | September 2, 2008 12:13 PM

Neighborhood blotters report the crime, not the names of those arrested (at least in the WaPo) e.g., "A break-in occurred in the 700 block of Main Street"

Posted by: Anonymous | September 2, 2008 12:34 PM | Report abuse

Thank you ANON...good distinction...I think I have seen names in community papers, but that was a good response to my open inquiry.

Posted by: chrIS lArry | September 2, 2008 12:36 PM | Report abuse

Gotcha....gotcha...I agree...there are more things to be worried about....

Good post on by Steinberg with Redskins over/unders....

Redskins o/u 7.5 wins .... THOUGHTS?

Posted by: cej75024 | September 2, 2008 12:37 PM | Report abuse

In fairness to this new "Crime Watch" feature, its introductory blurb is claiming somewhat higher moral ground than that database of "police actions" would indicate:

"Crime happens everyday, but when super star athletes are involved we pay more attention. NFL Crime Watch will examine this cultural phenomenon while keeping a critical eye on the media's coverage of it."

If the "Crime Watch" feature is honestly going to cover the cultural phenomenon of why we pay more attention to incidents where NFL people come up against law enforcement people, that coverage is not evident today.

But maybe Emil has only just begun. I get the impression the blog/comments will be the discussion with the database over on the side providing discussion fodder.

Posted by: Nate in the PDX | September 2, 2008 12:38 PM | Report abuse

Keeping all 10 draft picks? No doubt there was an agenda there.

You can make a case for any of the 10, but only a few of them looked like they deserve a roster spot based on what I saw on the field (mind you, I only saw the Jax game and a bit of the HIOF game).

The Spaghetti Gang looks a little schitzophrenic (sic, no doubt). Keep all 10 pix, but also sign 34 year old Jason Taylor -- a "win now" signing.

Posted by: AL Zeke etc | September 2, 2008 12:40 PM | Report abuse

PFT does something similar...but yes I too find it a bit off-putting....
I generally was just asking what the difference is b/c a crime blotter feature is pretty common in newspapers..

Posted by: chrIS lArry | September 2, 2008 12:27 PM

That's the one main thing I don't like PFT about. Everybody is a 'Turd' no matter how the matter plays out. Innocent or not.

I believe WaPo is copying PFT for more hits.

And, As LH and TE said above, they don't mention names, convictions, nonconvictions, etc. It's only the crime, what hundred block, time stamp, and whether anyone was arrestted w/o using their name. Probably because they weren't convicted.

Posted by: 4th | September 2, 2008 12:42 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: Skinz | September 2, 2008 12:42 PM | Report abuse

al, why haven't you guys traded for me yet? When are you going to continue your whiney campaign for me?

Posted by: Anquan Boldin | September 2, 2008 12:42 PM | Report abuse

Sorry, had to go to a meeting. I will indeed update you on Collier; there's nothing new yet.

Posted by: Cindy | September 2, 2008 12:44 PM | Report abuse

When stop making retarded posts Anquan. Now go back under the bridge where you belong.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 2, 2008 12:44 PM | Report abuse

First of all skinz, they do get paid the big bucks because of their profession and not the personal conduct. but as soon as something happens or is aledged we tie their contract for their profession into the personal life, and give the excuse that they shouldnt act like that because they make alot of money, that argument is not accurate.

so pay attention to the post idiot

Posted by: Great One | September 2, 2008 12:45 PM | Report abuse

Cindy,

Any insight into how many teams kept all their draft picks this year or how often that happens? thanks.

Posted by: Skinz | September 2, 2008 12:45 PM | Report abuse

Al,

If you did not see all the preseason games then do not comment on how people did or who they should keep.

This is a moot point they kept them so shut up about it. If you actually knew enough about football to make these determinations, I am sure you would have a job in the league.

The games start Thursday if a draft pick actually plays and does a bad job then by all means give him hell on Friday.

Posted by: kmdp4 | September 2, 2008 12:46 PM | Report abuse

+++al, why haven't you guys traded for me yet? When are you going to continue your whiney campaign for me?

Posted by: Anquan Boldin | September 2, 2008 12:42 PM+++

We can't trade for you, Anquan. We have all of these "golden child" draft picks that we have to keep. Besides we have to fill up the injury list with somebody, don't we?

Posted by: cej75024 | September 2, 2008 12:47 PM | Report abuse

brownwood26 - I don't hate the FO, just think they made mistakes this year.

And I don't agree with the idea that you need to give your rookies a year on the roster. Maybe when you only draft 3 guys, then yes, this becomes more important. But when you draft 10 guys, it's almost more important that the guys you keep can actually contribute. There's only so many "projects" that you can have on your roster at one time. You can't have 10 guys on the roster that are "wait and see", especially when you have other true uncertainties as well (like Rogers, Macintosh, James, etc.). Just my opinion, but for this particular team, the bottom of the roster should have been used for reliable guys that can step in for spells (the way Godfrey and Mccardell were last season). By my count, here is the list of players that are in danger of not being up to game speed once the season starts:

-Laron Landry
-Jason Taylor
-Erasmus James
-Rocky Macintosh
-Carlos Rogers
-Devin Thomas
-Malcolm Kelly
-Kareem Moore

Considering that 4 of those guys are starters on the same side of the ball, it seems imperative to me that as much of the roster as possible be comprised of guys that can step in, if needed, right away. Every roster spot counts. That's the way I see it. The FO is banking way too much on having these guys at full speed.

Posted by: psps23 | September 2, 2008 12:47 PM | Report abuse

The one thing I don't understand. The WRs

1. Moss is fine
2. Randle El has a broken bone in his hand
3. Thrash, a #4-5 WR at best
4. Devin Thomas has shown nothing
5. Malcolm Kelly continues to be hurt w/o ever playing

OK, that the WRs. So why do they cut McMullen? At least he's healthy. From what I've read here, he was the best Skins WR in preseason. That one makes no sense to me at all.

Posted by: AL Zeke etc | September 2, 2008 12:48 PM | Report abuse

I may have missed a comment about it up here over the long weekend, but I would like to offer my hearty and completely sincere congratulations to the University of Georgia football team for defeating the Georgia Southern University football team with a final score of 45-21.

Georgia surpassed even the loftiest expectations with this resounding victory over a quality opponent, justifying all the praise which was showered on them up here and demonstrating that the national title is all but sown up, and therefore it will not be necessary to post any further comments praising (or in any way related to) the Bulldogs for the remainder of the season.

Thank you. Dawg bless America.

Posted by: Nate in the PDX | September 2, 2008 12:48 PM | Report abuse

That "NFL Crime Watch Project" is nasty. They have listed Darrell Hackney of the Broncos. His crime? "Failure to stop at a stop sign and driving without proof of insurance" on 12/1/07. In what state is this a "crime"?

This stuff is pernicious because it is like the Duke Lacrosse Players. They were convicted in the press without a trial. Then it turned out that their accuser was a liar. Here, in the Post, they would still list these kids as charged with rape, charges dropped. Is that a fair way for the Post to treat victims of vicious slander and prosecutorial misconduct?

We brought that kick returner up from Houston last year, Jerome Mathis. There was a lot of hate for him on this blog. but the charges were dropped against him. There was no case. But he's still in the Post data base, "accused of assault."

Posted by: talent evaluator | September 2, 2008 12:49 PM | Report abuse

I also watched two entertaining CF games this weekend the VA Tech loss and last nights Tenn/UCLA...

Was good to watch games that counted for something....

Posted by: chrIS lArry | September 2, 2008 12:50 PM | Report abuse

Damn Greg Williams is having to deal with this agian within a year!

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=3564534

Posted by: Leevi | September 2, 2008 12:50 PM | Report abuse

Somebody, help me, please: are "drills" off on the side as in "individual drills" or with the team?

Posted by: Not Anonymous | September 2, 2008 12:50 PM | Report abuse

I've been walking the streets at night
Just trying to get it right
It’s hard to see with so many around
You know I don't like being stuck in the crowd
And the streets don't change
But maybe the names
I ain't got time for the game cause I need you
Yeah, yeah, yeah, cause I need you
OOO I NEED YOU, WHOA I NEED YOU!
OOOOH, ALL THIS TIME!

Posted by: W. Axl Rose | September 2, 2008 12:52 PM | Report abuse

"Failure to stop at a stop sign and driving without proof of insurance"

Actually I have a friend (NYC)who was driving a work vehicle without insurance, he got tix, turned into boss...he went to a different job. A year Later was pulled over and taken directly to Jail where he was held for 36 hours without being told what he was in for. Was forced to plead guilty and wasnt even told what the crime was until a DMV worker told hi after they sent him there....

Posted by: chrIS lArry | September 2, 2008 12:54 PM | Report abuse

Al,

If you did not see all the preseason games then do not comment on how people did or who they should keep.

This is a moot point they kept them so shut up about it. If you actually knew enough about football to make these determinations, I am sure you would have a job in the league.

The games start Thursday if a draft pick actually plays and does a bad job then by all means give him hell on Friday.

Posted by: kmdp4 | September 2, 2008 12:46 PM


This is a board and you do not have any reason to suggest I "shut up". You are a miserable little POS a$$h-le for even suggesting it. Try taking your head out of that orafice of yours, you might see the sunshine one day.

Posted by: AL Zeke etc | September 2, 2008 12:54 PM | Report abuse

TE;

Driving without insurance is indeed a crime...

Posted by: Zebra | September 2, 2008 12:55 PM | Report abuse

beep beep

Posted by: Cindy | September 2, 2008 12:55 PM | Report abuse

Not that I agree with that crime watch.... just that it is a crime.

Posted by: Zebra | September 2, 2008 12:56 PM | Report abuse

If you did not see all the preseason games then do not comment on how people did or who they should keep.

Posted by: kmdp4 | September 2, 2008 12:46 PM

I would go further. "If you did not see all the preseason games AND ALL THE PRACTICES..."

Coaches see a lot more than we get to see, and unless you think they're deliberately trying to undermine the team's success then it's hard to see the basis for second guessing them.

Of course, we'd have nothing to write about, and I mean that like it's a bad thing.

Posted by: talent evaluator | September 2, 2008 12:56 PM | Report abuse

+++al, why haven't you guys traded for me yet? When are you going to continue your whiney campaign for me?

Posted by: Anquan Boldin | September 2, 2008 12:42 PM+++

We can't trade for you, Anquan. We have all of these "golden child" draft picks that we have to keep. Besides we have to fill up the injury list with somebody, don't we?

Posted by: cej75024 | September 2, 2008 12:47 PM

Q, wish you'd come this way. I think you'd be able to get a starting role, though Malcolm Kelly, Devin Thomas and James Thrash are all really tough to beat out.

Posted by: AL Zeke etc | September 2, 2008 12:59 PM | Report abuse

+++Instead, the 'skins got a 244 pound, sore footed, bad-kneed, 34-year-old, eyes-on-his-next-career $8 million-a-year, 2nd & 6th round pick-costing Jason Taylor.

Posted by: Corkczar | September 2, 2008 11:31 AM

JT does not have bad knees. If he had bad knees then what happened to him in preseason would have snapped his leg at the knee. He injured his knee.

Posted by: Curzon417 | September 2, 2008 11:39 AM+++

Dr. Curzon--

Clumsy English on my part. Before his injury Taylor HAD good knees. NOW he has a bad one. I didn't make that clear.

Of course, Joe Theismann HAD good legs until he lost a step and ended up with a VERY BAD leg.

Now then, some clarity, please from you. Since Taylor now has a "bad knee," are you recommended he be sat until it's 100% better, rather than risk having his leg "snapped at the knee."

Posted by: Corkczar | September 2, 2008 1:27 PM | Report abuse

If I knew I could put Richardson on the PS and he would not be signed and was not sure that Tryon surviving waivers, I would have done as the Skins done. Tryon making the roster does not mean he stays there.

Posted by: Curzon417 | September 2, 2008 11:47 AM


Good point Curz. And besides all this, I think Tryon is higher-valued on special teams coverage. His speed is a big advantage there.

Posted by: frediefritz | September 2, 2008 1:28 PM | Report abuse

If we can get Kareem Moore healthy I think he will prove to be the steal of the draft.

Posted by: Great One | September 2, 2008 11:48 AM

Maybe, but he's going to have to beat out Durant Brooks for that title.

Posted by: talent evaluator | September 2, 2008 11:49 AM

Looking long-term, don't forget about Colt.

Posted by: frediefritz | September 2, 2008 1:29 PM | Report abuse

AlZeke-Couldn't agree more about McMullen. There's a lot of chaff in the draft picks we kept, and we're awfully thin at WR. I've read talk here about Mason's trouble with blocking, and so it makes dumping him more understandable, but I hated to see the kid go.

Posted by: mfpierce49 | September 2, 2008 1:36 PM | Report abuse

Although any self-respecting Baltimoron hates the Redskins from birth, it’s not that so much as Ceratto. Vincent plays his cards close to the vest when trades are imminent and for some unknown reason, LaCanf can’t figure out why.

Posted by: guy | September 2, 2008 2:06 PM | Report abuse

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