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Zorn on the Punting Situation

Dan Steinberg reports:

Jim Zorn's Monday press conference began with repeated questions about the punting situation, and he seemed less certain than Vinny Cerrato that a punting change was inevitable.

Zorn said that rookie Durant Brooks is getting an MRI today for a sore quadriceps in his kicking leg that has been bothering him for some time, which could affect the situation. He also said the team had arranged for other punters to come in for auditions based on Brooks's performance, but that Brooks would have an opportunity to win that competition. There is "absolutely" a chance that Brooks could be kicking next weekend, Zorn said.

"Here's the deal, I would say his position's in jeopardy because of performance, not because of injury, because of performance," Zorn said. "He may be the best guy out there, and then we'd have to continue to work. The thing is, he punted well all week long, he got to the game and he didn't punt well. So we know he's a good punter, but a good punter also punts in the game good and he did not."

Zorn said he didn't want to "falsify" or contradict what Cerrato had said this morning, and he suggested that Cerrato's certainty about a change was based on Brooks's injury.

"I think if you read what he said in context it was just assuming that [Brooks] was down," Zorn said. "We already had contacted some punters to come in regardless of the injury, the punters were coming in, so I think those two factors could help Vinny say that in context."

Zorn also said that, if a punting change is made, the new punter would have to have experience as a holder, and that the punter job is the "biggest question mark" on the roster.

By Cindy Boren  |  October 13, 2008; 12:42 PM ET
 
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Next: Plackemeier, Miller Among Punters Coming In

Comments

Hmmm, some jiggery pokery re Brooks' MRI???

Posted by: mikeysuperdons | October 13, 2008 12:50 PM | Report abuse

Ultimately, doesn't Zorn decide who is on the roster and not Vinny?

Posted by: will_ga | October 13, 2008 12:51 PM | Report abuse

Using hater/hating droolz
articulating your point with ideas rulz

Posted by: chrislarry | October 13, 2008 12:52 PM | Report abuse

JZ - "We're all in it together"

Gibbs 2.0 is being vindicated.......

Posted by: 4thFloor | October 13, 2008 12:51 PM

Posted by: 4thFloor | October 13, 2008 12:53 PM | Report abuse

inexcusable loss. talk about a turnonver jinx, amirite? ok i'm done now.

Posted by: bms46and2 | October 13, 2008 12:53 PM | Report abuse

If he's punting great in practice, and screws up in games, how do you create the competition?

Chokey McShank, Sr did the same thing... great in practice, pre-season, back to crappy in games.

How do you find a gamer through a practice competition?

Posted by: Alan4 | October 13, 2008 12:53 PM | Report abuse

Cerrato has no business having a radio show. Especially when it is on an hour before the coach has a press conference and they contradict each other. There is no doubt that Snyder pushed Cerrato into this idiotic position of being on the radio for four hours each week when he should be doing the business of the team. Maybe its about time that Jason reported on how Snyder, trying to promote his pathetic radio stations, has caused this to happen.

Posted by: MKadyman | October 13, 2008 12:54 PM | Report abuse

Worrying if the punting and holding was in the hands of one rookie.

Then again; if, after the Giants game, you'd offered me 5-3 at the halfway mark, I'd have been delighted. The 'Skins can still be 6-2.

Accentuate the positive!

Posted by: stevebeagrie | October 13, 2008 12:55 PM | Report abuse

JZ is backing off of Vinny's comments earlier.

Watch out for controversial post.....

Brooks is said to be hurt. I see IR coming...

Posted by: 4thFloor | October 13, 2008 12:34 PM |

Posted by: 4thFloor | October 13, 2008 12:56 PM | Report abuse

I said it before and I'll say it again. Large crowds will get to former GTech players. This kid is used to playing in front of 3000 fans who only went to the game because they got a free Coke and hotdog with the purchase of a ticket.

I wonder how well in he punted in his two losses in Athens. Maybe I'll check that out, prolly choked.

Posted by: TheTruth11 | October 13, 2008 12:56 PM | Report abuse

Chokey hit a 64-yd. punt yesterday for Green Bay. Too bad it was returned for 22 yards. Chokey hates that net yardage metric.

Posted by: tafka | October 13, 2008 12:57 PM | Report abuse

+++Cork - You mentioned the WR in philly. He only helps one or 2 plays a game. That's not a big contribution (Thomas contributes on the same amount of plays a game). –4th floor+++

Interesting Opinion. So I checked the stats:

DESEAN JACKSON, Phila,

29 catches for 433 yards.

19 Punt returns for 252 yards

DEVIN THOMAS Wash

4 catches for 40 yards,

O return yardage,

Yeah, you’re right. That’s pretty much a push.

Posted by: TheCork | October 13, 2008 12:57 PM | Report abuse

Also, I watched the game this morning and I saw 2 good punts and 2 bad punts.

The new 50/50 of the team?

Posted by: 4thFloor | October 13, 2008 12:58 PM | Report abuse

Ultimately, doesn't Zorn decide who is on the roster and not Vinny?

Posted by: will_ga |

Good one.

Posted by: TheCork | October 13, 2008 12:58 PM | Report abuse

Maybe its about time that Jason reported on how Snyder, trying to promote his pathetic radio stations, has caused this to happen.

Posted by: MKadyman | October 13, 2008 12:54 PM

Yeah, make Jason Reid do it this time. Keep JLAC in the foxhole.

Posted by: tafka | October 13, 2008 12:59 PM | Report abuse

I said it before and I'll say it again. Large crowds will get to former GTech players. This kid is used to playing in front of 3000 fans who only went to the game because they got a free Coke and hotdog with the purchase of a ticket.

I wonder how well in he punted in his two losses in Athens. Maybe I'll check that out, prolly choked.

Posted by: TheTruth11 | October 13, 2008 12:56 PM | Report abuse

I am embarrassed to be in the same state as you. Please move.

Posted by: will_ga | October 13, 2008 1:01 PM | Report abuse

Let's go Browns!

Posted by: freakzilla | October 13, 2008 1:04 PM | Report abuse

Sounds to me Cerrato is trying to save face for this waste of a pick by saying the guy is injured before they let him go. Is this not the Snyder/Cerrato way of doing things when they get rejected by a coach or they made the wrong selections with a player?

Posted by: JeanJak | October 13, 2008 1:05 PM | Report abuse

DeSean Jackson is definitely a player. Our guys not so much. At least not yet and unfortuantely right now is the only thing that matters. James Thrash can still have a limited role in the offense but he needs to be put in situations where he can succeed like the motion play for the TD in Dallas. One on one he is not gonna beat many CB's and will have to fight for all his catches.

Posted by: F_Registration | October 13, 2008 1:05 PM | Report abuse

Didnt Vinny draft JC too. The draft is a crap shoot for everybody

Posted by: CheyenneWY | October 13, 2008 1:08 PM | Report abuse

I also think personally, Cooley, Betts and Randel El are too casual with the ball in their hands. If I had to blame someone for the lost it would be Cooley who had no business a) trying to get an extra yard after getting the first down by 2 yards or so, and b) not protecting the ball while being tackled by 3 or 4 guys. This fumble, more so than Pete's (what do you expect from a lineman fumbling and returning it for a TD) cost us 3 points.

Posted by: JeanJak | October 13, 2008 1:09 PM | Report abuse

The knock on DeSean Jackson coming out of college was about his size and durability. He was always a very good player as long as he was healthy.

Posted by: tafka | October 13, 2008 1:09 PM | Report abuse

Not to sound like Captain Obvious, but you're not going to win many games when you turn the ball over 3 times.

The good news is our D played solid (no offensive TDs), Clinton rushed for 129 yards and 2 TDs, and JC still hasn't throw an INT.

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | October 13, 2008 1:11 PM | Report abuse

Who drafts a punter?

Posted by: JeanJak | October 13, 2008 1:11 PM | Report abuse


++++Point is JT has been injured this year, not apples to apples comparison.+++--POSTER1

+++I still like the JT move, and think he has been hampered by injuries.....++++ --POSTER2


+++My point is that JT will (if he's healthy) have more of an impact this year. +++--POSTER3

“If he’s healthy” is more than a parenthetical concern. Six games into the season and he has had three times as many leg and foot issues as sacks. Started with Plantar Fasciitis, then the knee, then the calf.

Guy hadn’t missed a game in forever and now he has three bum-wheel owies?

He's 34 years old and an undersized DE. Once the quicks go, he's toast.

Like you, I hope he heals his quicks return and he has fresh legs for the stretch run.

Posted by: TheCork | October 13, 2008 1:11 PM | Report abuse

Cooley always drags defenders with him. He has always been that way. He is going to fumble here and there.

Posted by: CheyenneWY | October 13, 2008 1:11 PM | Report abuse

Cork, you got me because I didn't phrase my question right.

DeSean = Santana Moss. Compare their stats.
Royal = Santans Moss. Compare their stats.

Now, give me the stats of rookie 'big' recievers and then I might concede......

Posted by: 4thFloor | October 13, 2008 1:12 PM | Report abuse

The Rams were a much better team than their 0-4 record coming in. They played a good defensive game and made relatively few mistakes on offense.

The things to me that showed up big.
1. lack of a pass rush with 4 guys
2. lack of a 3rd WR
3. pass protection, especially in blitz schemes
4. Special teams -- our kickoffs and punts both had multiple bad plays.

Our offense is run oriented. Run oriented teams are more vulnerable to the 5 yard penalty. Run oriented teams are usually less vulnerable to turnovers. All of our fumbles came on pass plays.

What stopped our drives
penalty 2
turnover 3
sack 4
just not gaining 10 yards!!!

Twice we finished a possession with 4th and less than 5, having incurred a 5 yard penalty in that same set of downs.

So what's the message? Don't make mistakes and protect the QB. Pretty basic, huh

Posted by: zcezcest1 | October 13, 2008 1:13 PM | Report abuse

But honestly though, we need pass rushers. Whatever happened to Erasmus James? Our defense is not breaking but it is only a matter of time before we do. The Giants are a perfect example of a team we have trouble against because their offensive line are GIANTS and they control our line. A good team like the Giants that run effectively to set up the play action will give us trouble if we can't muster any pass rush. I don't see us going far if we can't get any sacks with our front four. Look what Arizona did to Romo and the Cowgirls yesterday?

Posted by: JeanJak | October 13, 2008 1:16 PM | Report abuse

Chokey hit a 64 yard punt for Green Bay yesterday and managed to have just a 35.3 yard gross average on 4 punts?

Wow, he must have had a day similar to Brooks! I think good available punters will be hard to find right now. Green Bay has already looked.

You know, it seems like the fans in Green Bay were not unhappy with the punter Chokey replaced.

Here's what the Green Bay Press Gazette has to say after yesterday:

If the Packers do not replace punter Derrick Frost between here and the bye week it would be a big surprise. He averaged 35.3 yards per attempt (net and gross) with two downed inside the 20, but he’s no weapon using rolls for yardage and one was a 26-yard punt fair caught at the 16.

Posted by: Alan4 | October 13, 2008 1:16 PM | Report abuse

Looks like Romo could be out for up to 4 weeks.

How long before Brad Johnson and Team Obliterator end up scrapping in the locker room?

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | October 13, 2008 1:20 PM | Report abuse

+++Cork - You mentioned the WR in philly. He only helps one or 2 plays a game. That's not a big contribution (Thomas contributes on the same amount of plays a game). –4th floor+++

Interesting Opinion. So I checked the stats:

DESEAN JACKSON, Phila,

29 catches for 433 yards.

19 Punt returns for 252 yards

DEVIN THOMAS Wash

4 catches for 40 yards,

O return yardage,

Yeah, you’re right. That’s pretty much a push.

Posted by: TheCork | October 13, 2008 12:57 PM | Report abuse

Cork please leave me alone.

Posted by: Dead_Horse | October 13, 2008 1:21 PM | Report abuse

So Dallas (Romo) and Philly (Westbrook) have significant injuries. That will play a definite role going forward.

Hopefully, yesterday's embarrassment was just the wake-up call we needed.

Posted by: Alan4 | October 13, 2008 1:24 PM | Report abuse

Bobby Bowden steps down?

Posted by: 4thFloor | October 13, 2008 1:25 PM | Report abuse

This was predictable. Zorn is equivocating because they want to get Brooks' quadriceps "checked out".

They're going to stash the kid on IR and sign a punter to get them through the season. Good move, if you ask me...both getting a new punter, and not giving up on a draft pick with a good college pedigree.

Posted by: PDiddy | October 13, 2008 1:25 PM | Report abuse

When Andre Carter got here people were saying the same things about him, but he learned to adjust his game. Carter is paying off and he's not a lot bigger now. If the skins use him well he'll pay off during the playoff run. Taylor is competitive he'll adjust his game.
Posted by: TWISI |

Andre Carter has 18 tackles (10 solo) and one sack.

Taylor has 11 tackles, one sack and three injuries.

Chris Wilson has nine tackles and one sack.

NOBODY on the Redskins has more than one sack.

Another interesting stat. Guard Pete Kendall caught one more pass than all three drafted Redskins receivers combined.

Posted by: TheCork | October 13, 2008 1:25 PM | Report abuse

Actually, I think Dallas might be better with BJ for awhile. He doesn't turn the ball over as much, and they'll probably use Marion Barber more.

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | October 13, 2008 1:26 PM | Report abuse

Any ideas on what punters are out there?

Posted by: CheyenneWY | October 13, 2008 1:27 PM | Report abuse

Frost was a problem. Brooks doesn't appear to be the answer.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | October 13, 2008 1:27 PM | Report abuse

I'm sure this was covered on an earlier thread, but Romo is out with a broken pinkie. Poo' wittle Womo.

Posted by: PDiddy | October 13, 2008 1:28 PM | Report abuse

So Dallas (Romo) and Philly (Westbrook) have significant injuries. That will play a definite role going forward.

Posted by: Alan4 | October 13, 2008 1:24 PM


Also, Eli Manning doesn't know how to comb his hair.

Posted by: freakzilla | October 13, 2008 1:29 PM | Report abuse

Frosty may soon be available. We can bring him back ala Smoooot?

Posted by: 4thFloor | October 13, 2008 1:31 PM | Report abuse

Perhaps the Skins should be looking for a new Special Teams coach as well. Both the punt and punt return teams are playing terribly.

There were many reasons why the Skins lost to the Rams, however Brooks inconsistent performance was a factor that directly resulted in three points for the Rams in the 3Q. The blocking on the punt returns is awful and Randle El does not appear to have the burst necessary to be an effective punt returner with this blocking scheme. He's ranked as the 39th punter returner with a 6.8 yd average. So what's going on is it the scheme, the returner, or the blocking?

I highly agree that the holder needs to be able to throw a pass. That position should be reserved for the backup QB or a player like Randle El who could run or throw. There is little chance for a fake with the punter holding. And it's ludicrous to use the punter because he has time available for practice...

Posted by: siris | October 13, 2008 1:32 PM | Report abuse

I have a question other than why we traded for an old undersized end and overdrafted at a risky position for drafting and that wasn't as glaring a need as other positions and why we spent a 2nd rounder on a hopefully backup TE.......why in the world, on 3rd and 13 with the game on the line was Torrence in man coverage locked up on the fastest WR in the draft with no safety help over the top? To me, that one is on Blache, there was no reason to blitz both safeties on that play, especially when anybody who has watched the Skins the last few years knows that Torrence is a shaky corner at best so leaving him on an island might not be the best idea.

Posted by: zjfr2 | October 13, 2008 1:33 PM | Report abuse

Another interesting stat. Guard Pete Kendall caught one more pass than all three drafted Redskins receivers combined.

Kendall played all 66 offensive downs. What kind of receiving effort is that? 66 plays, one catch and a turnover? And he couldn't even run down the fumble return?

Last year at about this time, we were scanning the waiver wires for bug-eyed free agent WRs. This year, we had to cut a couple of seemingly decent players (Mix/McMullen).
If Mix had stayed healthy, I wonder where Thrash would be. If McMullen played well on Teams, he would be here.

Posted by: daggar | October 13, 2008 1:34 PM | Report abuse

++++Cork, you got me because I didn't phrase my question right.

DeSean = Santana Moss. Compare their stats.
Royal = Santans Moss. Compare their stats.

Now, give me the stats of rookie 'big' recievers and then I might concede......

Posted by: 4thFloor++++

It was cerrato who insisted on big receivers.

Jackson/Royal equals Santana Moss is not true.

I would HATE to gameplan against the Redskins with a three wide set of Moss ARE and Jackson or Royal, with Cooley underneath.

I STILL like Thomas in the long run. That's my story and I'm sticking to it. I'm assuming someday the light will switch on in his dome and he'll "get it."

Look at ol' Double-move. He's a shut down corner now. And all it took was realizing how study and learning from vets and watching film is important, he can't just get by on athleticism.

As for Kelly--maybe they SHOULD IR him, and start over with fresh knees next year,

I dont' know what the deal is with Davis.

Posted by: TheCork | October 13, 2008 1:34 PM | Report abuse

Sorry. Not Bobby, his son that coaches Clemson was ousted.....

Posted by: 4thFloor | October 13, 2008 1:36 PM | Report abuse

I also think personally, Cooley, Betts and Randel El are too casual with the ball in their hands. If I had to blame someone for the lost it would be Cooley who had no business a) trying to get an extra yard after getting the first down by 2 yards or so, and b) not protecting the ball while being tackled by 3 or 4 guys. This fumble, more so than Pete's (what do you expect from a lineman fumbling and returning it for a TD) cost us 3 points.

Posted by: JeanJak | October 13, 2008 1:09 PM

Are you on crack? Cooley had no business trying to get extra yards? What sport do you think he is getting paid to play? Casual, it usually "takes a crowbar to pry the ball out of Cooley's hands." You should go watch tennis or something.

Posted by: scampbell1975 | October 13, 2008 1:36 PM | Report abuse

Romo out 4 weeks with a broken finger!!!!

Posted by: dealer1 | October 13, 2008 1:37 PM | Report abuse

Interesting Opinion. So I checked the stats:

DESEAN JACKSON, Phila,

29 catches for 433 yards.

19 Punt returns for 252 yards

DEVIN THOMAS Wash

4 catches for 40 yards,

O return yardage,

Yeah, you’re right. That’s pretty much a push.

Posted by: TheCork | October 13, 2008 12:57 PM

pretty much pwnt.

However, i do think that Devin & Kelly if he ever gets on the field has the bigger upside. If JC ONLY had the rooks to throw to they would obviously have better stats.

Posted by: bms46and2 | October 13, 2008 1:38 PM | Report abuse

Brooks out 12 weeks with a bad leg?

Posted by: CheyenneWY | October 13, 2008 1:38 PM | Report abuse

The deal with Davis is that he "studied" at USC, which primarily meant going to movies and dating coeds (not that there's anything wrong with that!). It's been a tough summer/fall for him, learning how alarm clocks work, maps, such as....

Posted by: daggar | October 13, 2008 1:38 PM | Report abuse

Mix is still available, if Betts goes to IR I wonder if they would replace him with another back or add a WR who could help now. Imagine if it was 6'5" Mix on that early deep ball down the sidelines instead of Thrash.....

Posted by: zjfr2 | October 13, 2008 1:39 PM | Report abuse

I've always wondered why a team would use a 4 man pass rush if they don't get much pressure with it. If you're not getting much of a rush, then rush 3 and drop another guy back into coverage. Or rush 5 and create genuine pressure.

Our defense is effective and so its hard for me argue this point. The DL focuses on preventing screens and draws -- not getting fooled. And they've had plenty of chances to make picks.

Still, I can't help but think there is an upside to having a QB under more pressure than the Skins have delivered so far.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | October 13, 2008 1:40 PM | Report abuse

As for why you might want to have a second "solid" TE, look at the Lambs yesterday, who lost a good TE for the season and replaced him with Gilbert Glockenspiel.

Posted by: daggar | October 13, 2008 1:41 PM | Report abuse

frost burnt bridges when he left...no doubt he woulda been the first one they called...he can hold, punt, and familiar with the coaches ...thank you jasno!!! Did you have to call him???;)

Posted by: dealer1 | October 13, 2008 1:42 PM | Report abuse

However, i do think that Devin & Kelly if he ever gets on the field has the bigger upside. If JC ONLY had the rooks to throw to they would obviously have better stats.

Posted by: bms46and2 | October 13, 2008 1:38 PM | Report abuse


ya'll are way way way way overestimating Kelly and Thomas to say they would obviously have better stats if only JC could throw to them. First off, Thomas, other than being a lazy idiot has no excuse for why he isn't contributing right now, and Kelly.......well who knows, but DeSean Jackson is the 11th best WR in the league right now.....the 11th best.....to try and say that either of our guys would "obviously have better stats" is just ignorant.

And if we want our pick of punters we might not want to wait until tomorrow, looks like Frost is on the hot seat, and Dallas just lost McBriar so they need a punter as well.

Posted by: zjfr2 | October 13, 2008 1:44 PM | Report abuse

Andre Carter has 18 tackles (10 solo) and one sack.

Taylor has 11 tackles, one sack and three injuries.

Chris Wilson has nine tackles and one sack.

NOBODY on the Redskins has more than one sack.

Posted by: TheCork | October 13, 2008 1:25 PM | Report abuse

Noted. I don't know what people expect rookie linemen to produce. Check out the career stats from recent drfats for d-linemen. It takes a village. I suspect if/when the skins draft a d-lineman and he doesn't produce double digit sacks, most will call that pick a bust.

Posted by: TWISI | October 13, 2008 1:44 PM | Report abuse

Tommy Bowden steps down.

Posted by: CindyBoren | October 13, 2008 1:45 PM | Report abuse

1st off, I don't think Collins has ever held in his life, so scratch that idea. ARE is an interesting thought, perhaps he held in college.

As for Cooley, he does have a history of fumbling occasionally while trying to get the extra yards. Usually, once that happens in a season, it doesn't happen again, so maybe we got that going for us?

Posted by: bms46and2 | October 13, 2008 1:46 PM | Report abuse

Rookie Dlineman do take a little while for sure, but they tend to stay healthier than mid 30 year old lineman and when your mid 30 year old lineman aren't producing any better why pay them the more money with the higher injury risk and less upside?

Posted by: zjfr2 | October 13, 2008 1:48 PM | Report abuse

*****Fantasy Post*****

Dealer - I don't think you can win tonight....

*****End Fantasy Post****

Posted by: 4thFloor | October 13, 2008 1:48 PM | Report abuse

Dallas just lost McBriar so they need a punter as well.

Posted by: zjfr2 | October 13, 2008 1:44 PM | Report abuse

What's up with him. That hit on him was really bad.

Posted by: TWISI | October 13, 2008 1:51 PM | Report abuse

I'm not sure how good punters become good punters. Are they good out of the box or does it take a few years?

Posted by: zcezcest1 | October 13, 2008 1:51 PM | Report abuse

All NFL teams have to keep 7 position players + the 3rd QB on the inactive list each week. Those slots are usually reserved for injured players, backups who don't play on special teams, and rookies who require more experience...

In Davis case -- he's a rookie who is behind two veteran TEs, he doesn't play special teams, and he's still learning the offense. He'll be active if Cooley or Yoder gets hurt.

Posted by: siris | October 13, 2008 1:52 PM | Report abuse

I just did a Pro Bowl ballot on NFL.com, and Jason Taylor is listed among outside linebackers.

What's up with that?

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | October 13, 2008 1:53 PM | Report abuse

@zjfr2

You say some stupid stuff on occasion.

Didn't you notice that Torrence just so happened to be right in step with "the fastest WR in the draft"(not bad for the "fourth" corner on the team BTW), and Blache said yesterday that the fact that Landry was there late was "a problem", don't you pay attention?

You wrote this as if you had found some "big thing" that NOBODY else had found or realized. 'cmoooooon!!!

Posted by: craig2 | October 13, 2008 1:53 PM | Report abuse

team to beat is the gints...hopefully the browns win tonite or it's 4-3 for the skins after next week.

Skins, like any other team trying to be a contender is only as good as their next game. I blame yesterdays loss, all of it on zorn and zorn alone. This was a norvesque loss.

I hope we don't read 6-2 again onthis thread. What a stupid stupid way to think. Actually not stupid but young way to think. They are a good team with 4-2 record.

For the first time this season the offense asked the d to hold a one score lead and they couldn't.

Next game will tell a lot about this team and the rest of the season. A must win. For me atleast.

Posted by: dealer1 | October 13, 2008 1:54 PM | Report abuse

Actually, I heard the guy who blew it on that long pass wasn't Torrence but rookie Kareem Moore, who was supposed to blitz.

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | October 13, 2008 1:54 PM | Report abuse

"Tommy Bowden gets fired.

Posted by: CindyBoren | October 13, 2008 1:45 PM "

Fix'd.

Posted by: TheTruth11 | October 13, 2008 1:56 PM | Report abuse

Rookie Dlineman do take a little while for sure, but they tend to stay healthier than mid 30 year old lineman and when your mid 30 year old lineman aren't producing any better why pay them the more money with the higher injury risk and less upside?

Posted by: zjfr2 | October 13, 2008 1:48 PM | Report abuse


Because you don't draft one just for the sake of drafting one. C. Campbell had poor work habits during the draft process. Groves had characpter issues. Laws would have been an uunteresing pick but he would not have helped the DE issues the skin faced with their preseason injuries.

Posted by: TWISI | October 13, 2008 1:56 PM | Report abuse

I highly agree that the holder needs to be able to throw a pass. That position should be reserved for the backup QB or a player like Randle El who could run or throw. There is little chance for a fake with the punter holding. And it's ludicrous to use the punter because he has time available for practice...

Posted by: siris

Far more important than the ability to run a fake FG is the ability to catch, spin, and hold with consistency in stride with your kicker and long snapper. That ability comes with repetition in practice. Somehow I think Randle El's time is better spent running his routes. Maybe the backup QB could be an option if he has experience with it and doesn't need a lot of reps for practice, but if TC doesn't have that experience, then you have to go with the guy that has the time to put the work in. That would be the punter.

Posted by: psps23 | October 13, 2008 1:57 PM | Report abuse

why is this team so transfixed about having a punter be the holder as a qualification for the job?

Todd Collins has been a holder in the NFL and has experience.

We should be after the best PUNTER possible regardless of whether he can hold for field goals and points after or not.

Posted by: leopard09 | October 13, 2008 1:59 PM | Report abuse

In Davis case -- he's a rookie who is behind two veteran TEs, he doesn't play special teams, and he's still learning the offense. He'll be active if Cooley or Yoder gets hurt.

Posted by: siris

Sounds like great use of a 2nd round pick.

*sigh*

Posted by: psps23 | October 13, 2008 1:59 PM | Report abuse

if he's not overweight, bring in Todd Scott Sauerbrun

Posted by: gregskins | October 13, 2008 2:00 PM | Report abuse

Why is punting so difficult?

Hell, Danny White did it for years (as well was playing QB - backup and starter- AND holding on FGs!).

Posted by: MrRedskin21 | October 13, 2008 2:01 PM | Report abuse

and if he promises not to take DC Area taxis

Posted by: gregskins | October 13, 2008 2:02 PM | Report abuse

We need a punter. Bring back Sammy Baugh?

Posted by: zcezcest1 | October 13, 2008 2:02 PM | Report abuse

"Sounds like great use of a 2nd round pick.

*sigh*

Posted by: psps23 "


jeeze, cry a little more why don'tcha

Posted by: TheTruth11 | October 13, 2008 2:03 PM | Report abuse

"I said it before and I'll say it again. Large crowds will get to former GTech players. This kid is used to playing in front of 3000 fans who only went to the game because they got a free Coke and hotdog with the purchase of a ticket.

I wonder how well in he punted in his two losses in Athens. Maybe I'll check that out, prolly choked.

Posted by: TheTruth11 | October 13, 2008 12:56 PM | Report abuse

I am embarrassed to be in the same state as you. Please move.

Posted by: will_ga | October 13, 2008 1:01 PM"


did I hurt your feelings??

Posted by: TheTruth11 | October 13, 2008 2:04 PM | Report abuse

Re: WRs. Vinny Cerrato said on his show that DeSean Jackson was the most NFL-ready WR in the draft but the Skins went for size.

Posted by: learnedhand1 | October 13, 2008 2:05 PM | Report abuse

I don't fault Cooley for the fumble. As usual he broke the first tackle and was fighting for more yards. he was fighting through other people and someone poked it loose. It happens.

I'm more frustrated with Rabach's poor snap. He's always good for one good screw up per game.

but for that last play the Redskins D was again fantastic. I'm not worried. the offense was still solid (150+ yards rushing, 200+ yards passing) and those turnovers won't happen often. they'll happen but not in such a rush like they did yesterday. i feel bad for Cleveland. we're gonna light them up.

Posted by: DreamOutLoud | October 13, 2008 2:05 PM | Report abuse

"Re: WRs. Vinny Cerrato said on his show that DeSean Jackson was the most NFL-ready WR in the draft but the Skins went for size.

Posted by: learnedhand1 | October 13, 2008 2:05 PM |"

I don't think he had a show before the draft, so this doesn't surprise me. Hindsight, etc.

Posted by: TheTruth11 | October 13, 2008 2:07 PM | Report abuse

4th, you have to root for the browns and brsyln Edwards

Posted by: dealer1 | October 13, 2008 2:07 PM | Report abuse

craig2, he was there step for step, and he was beaten again....Torrence gets torched a lot as anybody watching knows. But my point wasn't that Torrence got burnt, my question was why he was locked up in man in the first place and why on 3rd and 13 when they aren't close to fg range and they are out of timeouts are we blitzing in the first place. All year we have stayed back and played coverage, the one time we shouldn't be blitzing and we should be covering the deep ball and the sidelines to force them to go over the middle and stay in bounds we blitz and leave our 4th corner in man coverage. That was my point, and it isn't stupid.

Posted by: zjfr2 | October 13, 2008 2:07 PM | Report abuse

In Davis case -- he's a rookie who is behind two veteran TEs, he doesn't play special teams, and he's still learning the offense. He'll be active if Cooley or Yoder gets hurt.

Posted by: siris | October 13, 2008 1:52 PM

Davis played yesterday. What game were you watching? He played on STs and was in on a few offensive plays.......

Posted by: 4thFloor | October 13, 2008 2:07 PM | Report abuse

Even football geniuses have days were they make mistakes. Zorn should have rushed the ball 50 times instead of trying to balance run and pass. I shoulda started Rivers instead of Delhomme in FF.

For what its worth, my FF teams have mimic'd the Skins this year. Lost the opener, won 4 straight and lost this past weekend

Posted by: zcezcest1 | October 13, 2008 2:09 PM | Report abuse

jeeze, cry a little more why don'tcha

Posted by: TheTruth11

You're right. I apologize for being dissatisfied with mediocrity. Continue on riding the mistake-free rainbow.

Posted by: psps23 | October 13, 2008 2:11 PM | Report abuse

By that logic Jason Campbell was a terrible draft pick because he never got in a game until his second season... let's reserve judgment on the effectiveness of the draft until the players have 2-3 years of experience. By then we should know if TE Davis was a good selection or a bust.

Posted by: siris | October 13, 2008 2:13 PM | Report abuse

Dealer - They don't need Edwards to win the game, well as long as he can't muster more than 10 fantasy points, I'll root for him. But still rooting for the Browns and Jemal Lewis and Dante Stallworth.......

Posted by: 4thFloor | October 13, 2008 2:16 PM | Report abuse

By that logic Jason Campbell was a terrible draft pick because he never got in a game until his second season... let's reserve judgment on the effectiveness of the draft until the players have 2-3 years of experience. By then we should know if TE Davis was a good selection or a bust.

Posted by: siris | October 13, 2008 2:13 PM | Report abuse

That's just dumb, QB is a completely different animal than any other position. You don't draft a TE in the second round for him to be inactive for a season.

Posted by: zjfr2 | October 13, 2008 2:16 PM | Report abuse

Don't forget, Cooley was a 3rd pick and he was an immediate impact player and is now a pro bowler. Davis is a second round pick, he should be able to get on the field and contribute, as should all our other SECOND ROUND PICKS!

Posted by: zjfr2 | October 13, 2008 2:18 PM | Report abuse

Davis was a dumb pick because you have an All Pro TE playing in front of him with a 6 year deal. You don't use a 2nd round pick to draft a backup.

TE isn't a problem for this team. So don't waste a pick on that position. Let alone a high pick.

Davis may become a nice player, its not his fault that the job is taken.

Posted by: zcezcest1 | October 13, 2008 2:19 PM | Report abuse

I was at the game, but I never noticed Davis was active... That's a good sign -- he's learning and (finally) earning the trust of the coaches.

Posted by: siris | October 13, 2008 2:21 PM | Report abuse

"You're right. I apologize for being dissatisfied with mediocrity. Continue on riding the mistake-free rainbow.

Posted by: psps23 | October 13, 2008 2:11 PM"

see that's where you're wrong.

1) Before the season started, you would've killed to be 4-2 after the first 6 games with wins AT Philly and AT Dallas.

2) Mediocrity is not having great depth at positions. Look at the talent we now have at TE with Cooley, Yoder, and Davis. That's the exact opposite of mediocrity. We will be a better team in the future because of that.

3) Are you going to blame losing to the Rams on Fred Davis, Malcom Kelly, and Devin Thomas not being great right out of the box as rookies?

Posted by: TheTruth11 | October 13, 2008 2:21 PM | Report abuse

As for Cooley, he does have a history of fumbling occasionally while trying to get the extra yards. Usually, once that happens in a season, it doesn't happen again, so maybe we got that going for us?

Posted by: bms46and2 | October 13, 2008 1:46 PM


Cooley's stats. 5 fumbles in 5 years in the league. @ lost. 3 in 2005. He has a history of fumbling occassionally while going for the extra yard. He averages 1 fumble per year. That's not occassionally, that's rarely.

YEAR TEAM G REC YDS AVG LNG TD FD FUM LOST
2004 WAS 16 37 314 8.5 31 6 23 0 0
2005 WAS 16 71 774 10.9 32 7 44 3 1
2006 WAS 16 57 734 12.9 66 6 33 0 0
2007 WAS 16 66 786 11.9 39 8 46 1 0
2008 WAS 6 30 345 11.5 28 1 18 1 1
Career 70 261 2953 11.3 66 28 164 5 2

Posted by: scampbell1975 | October 13, 2008 2:33 PM | Report abuse

I don't think he had a show before the draft, so this doesn't surprise me. Hindsight, etc.

Posted by: TheTruth11

He said that was how they assessed it before the draft. I will take him at his word. Wouldn't want to "falsify" him.

Posted by: learnedhand1 | October 13, 2008 2:34 PM | Report abuse

Bigger question is why it took until a loss for the Skins to finally admit Brooks needs to be replaced...two TD's run back on his short punts in the first 5 weeks. The Skins had to come back from 9 down against N.O. and 14 down vs. Philly to overcome those TD's. Yesterday's short punt guaranteed a FG for the Rams which meant they were only down only one point for the last drive.

Other special teams issues: who to return kicks if Rock Cartwright is our 2nd and only available backup to Portis (Is Marcus Mason available?) Betts will be out for at least 2-3 weeks minimum. Randel-El gets poor blocking on most punt returns and runs sideways to avoid getting hit hard. Why hasn't Devin Thomas been tried at returning kicks if he was so good at MSU?

Todd Collins should have been holding from the day that the Skins cut Frosty. Rookie punter Brooks had enough to learn about punting in the NFL without trying to hold for kicks. TC has experience, good hands, and won't make a mental error like Brooks did earlier this year calling for a snap before the ball was placed. Hope Vinny can redeem himself by signing a long-term replacement at punter which is a key position.

Posted by: wizfan89 | October 13, 2008 2:51 PM | Report abuse

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