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Matchday Sudamericana [With Quotes!]

Greetings from Taberna de Suerte, where there are several dozen DCU fans. Here's the bad news: Fred isn't dressing. Here's the lineup:

GK Perkins; Ds Namoff, Boswell, Vanney, McTavish; MFs Olsen, Simms, Gomez, Gros; Fs Moreno, Emilio.

Reserves: Nolly, deRoux, Carroll, Mediate, Moose, Dyachenko, Kpene.

In-game, post-game and meta-game thoughts welcome below.

Post-game quotes, courtesy of phone interviews kindly set up by communications manager Boris Flores. Btw, if a Friday night visit to Kansas City three days after a dispiriting loss in Mexico doesn't qualify as a trap, I don't know what does.

Vanney specifically mentioned something I missed in the broadcast (although I didn't miss the ad for BosomMax): DCU's players thought that Emilio was fouled with a knee to the back before the frantic sequence that led to the Morales goal.

"The guy hits a great shot in the upper corner, but in our mind that never should have happened," Vanney said. "We should have had the ball in the other direction."

Boswell had less to say about the goal; he hadn't seen it, since Estadio Jalisco has no monitors. No clocks, either.

"We didn't really need a goal, that doesn't mean we weren't playing for a win," Boswell said. "We stuck to our gameplan. The ball's bouncing around, he hit it and it went in. It's a rough night."

Boswell on the big picture: "You get the result you want at home and you come in here with high hopes. It's one of the few scores that would beat us, and it did. It just sucks."

More after the jump.

Vanney on the Chivas attack: "They had a lot of possession and actually attacked quite a bit. The reality was they weren't ever very dangerous. We did a good job of putting out the fires and dealing with counterattacks, and did a pretty good job of taking care of most of their attacks."

Vanney said the plan was to tempt Chivas's outside backs to come forward and join the attack, and then win balls and push forward into an advantage, but that plan required United to dispossess Chivas better than it did.

"They're very good at keeping possession, they very rarely turn over the ball. We were finding a hard time keeping possession and exploiting it the way we wanted in the first half," Vanney said. "I don't think we were trying to be negative in any way. We were trying to be cautiously optimistic about how we attacked and when we attacked. We really felt we could defend them for 90 minutes. We thought we could have played them to a shutout. We were close to doing it, and if we had that one call maybe we would have, but that's not the way it went."

Boswell also said the conservative play was not the team's pre-game plan.

"They threw a lot of numbers forward and we had to adjust, and it was a more defensive-minded adjustment," Boswell said.

Vanney on the post-goal mindset: "We were man-on-man in the back, which is a little risky, but we had a lot more possession and we had a lot more attack. We had two or three chances where we had pretty good looks at their net. All in all we should have gotten a point out of this game, at least, and been moving on to the next round, but that's not how it went, but we've got to put it behind us and focus on the task at tend, which is MLS and Supporters Shield and trying to get to the MLS Cup."

Finally, I asked Boswell whether this felt similar to March in Guadalajara.

"It's worse," he said. "It's worse, because we got the result we needed at home this time around. We knew what we were getting ourselves into, there's no mystery in this one. It was just coming down here and getting it done, and unfortunately we weren't able to do that. It would have been nice to silence their fans and get a 'W' for the first time down here, but tonight wasn't our night. It's a cruel game sometimes."

By Dan Steinberg  |  October 2, 2007; 8:47 PM ET
Categories:  D.C. United  
Save & Share:  Send E-mail   Facebook   Twitter   Digg   Yahoo Buzz   Del.icio.us   StumbleUpon   Technorati   Google Buzz   Previous: More Chivas Notes and Quotes
Next: D.C. United's Attendance Struggles

Comments

Just logged onto Matchtracker which says the match is starting at 10:15 PM ET? I thought kickoff was at 9...

Posted by: Bret | October 2, 2007 9:04 PM | Report abuse

I'm watching FSE and am not getting any sound... anybody else experiencing the same?

Posted by: ML | October 2, 2007 9:05 PM | Report abuse

anyone know where I can listen to it on the INternet?

Posted by: b | October 2, 2007 9:10 PM | Report abuse

I think the Bogman said that DCUnited might be offering a radio feed on their website, but I cannot find it.

Posted by: hoyanick | October 2, 2007 9:11 PM | Report abuse

if i order the MLS video thing, will i be blacked out for this game?

Posted by: jon | October 2, 2007 9:13 PM | Report abuse

No sound here as well for FSE on RCN (except the commercials. Not that I understand much Spanish...But would like the atmosphere.

Posted by: all's quiet | October 2, 2007 9:13 PM | Report abuse

Sound is back on FSE. You'd think Fox is a Mexican channel based on the commentary.

Vamos United!!!

Posted by: ML | October 2, 2007 9:13 PM | Report abuse

ML they are introducing the players now

Posted by: Anonymous | October 2, 2007 9:14 PM | Report abuse

Isn't Limarzi supposed to be doing an Internet broadcast? If so, whouldn't there be a link from the DCU site?

Posted by: Section 410 | October 2, 2007 9:15 PM | Report abuse

Where is the DCU audio feed? Anyone find it?

Posted by: Sean | October 2, 2007 9:15 PM | Report abuse

Jon,

Mlslivetv won't be covering this game -- only league matches.

If anyone knows how to watch/listen to the game over the internet let us know!!

Posted by: Bret | October 2, 2007 9:19 PM | Report abuse

No feed tonight if MLS website is to be believed.

Posted by: bristol | October 2, 2007 9:21 PM | Report abuse

D at DCCenters said that there would at least be an audio feed. Darn it.

I wish the club would publicize more just what is going to be out there so we don't do these mad scrambles.

Posted by: Sean | October 2, 2007 9:23 PM | Report abuse

Theres a thread on BigSoccer which tells you how to view the game. Only problem is the audio is not working at the time, but its better that nothing

http://www.bigsoccer.com/forum/showthread.php?t=606384

Posted by: AJ | October 2, 2007 9:24 PM | Report abuse

I wonder whether Goff is watching this match and/or lurking on this blog.

Posted by: Section 410 | October 2, 2007 9:24 PM | Report abuse

What's the scene at Lucky Bar?

And where's the 40k? They can't fill this place even wit free tickets?

Posted by: DC Centurion's Shield | October 2, 2007 9:29 PM | Report abuse

If you have RCN, you can get the commentary in Spanish on channel 721 (at least in DC).

Posted by: seth dc | October 2, 2007 9:30 PM | Report abuse

Do away gols count as tiebreaker?

Posted by: matt y | October 2, 2007 9:32 PM | Report abuse

The rules are the same as in Europe and Copa Liberatdores. Away goals count for more than home goals. If United lose 3-2, they go through. If they lose 1-0, they are out.

Posted by: bristol | October 2, 2007 9:33 PM | Report abuse

Seth, you are the best. Thanx for the RCN tip.

Posted by: Anonymous | October 2, 2007 9:35 PM | Report abuse

good chance for gomez on the free kick...

Posted by: niv | October 2, 2007 9:35 PM | Report abuse

do they just not have english broadcasters tonight or is there something wrong with the feed of fse?

and thats right- put that goalie to work!

Posted by: laur | October 2, 2007 9:35 PM | Report abuse

Fred isn't dressing, no Burch.

Sounds like a repeat of last March . . . the guys have to play out of their heads tonight.

And no mistakes Troy. Let the wall do it's job on free kicks ..

Posted by: Anonymous | October 2, 2007 9:36 PM | Report abuse

min by min here in spanish (I believe, I am hoping to be able to read the important words):

http://www.chivascampeon.com/noticia/2567/

Posted by: moth | October 2, 2007 9:38 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: bob | October 2, 2007 9:40 PM | Report abuse

thanks for the Chivas spanish link,

looks like Jaime tried to catch the keeper of his line . . from midfield!

Posted by: Anonymous | October 2, 2007 9:41 PM | Report abuse

United on their back heels. Troy Perkins getting a workout. Not looking good.

Posted by: Bristol | October 2, 2007 9:43 PM | Report abuse

Back 6 look like they are playing up a hill. They keep clearing it forward, and back it comes. No possession from the front 5. DCU can't keep that up.

Posted by: JkR | October 2, 2007 9:45 PM | Report abuse

Why are DC playing 11 guys behind the ball? They look awful. Not keeping possession. Perkins is the DC man of the match so far, and he keeps booting the ball down the field, giving away possession in less than 30 seconds.

I can't understand why they look so lethargic. The strategy needed to be to go down there and attack, from the first minute. Instead they're playing slow ball and completely defensive.

DC's going to run into a wall when Chivas eventually scores first...

Posted by: Eugene | October 2, 2007 9:47 PM | Report abuse

thanks for the gamecast, those who can read spanish, keep us others up to date, please.

merci

go jaime! go everyone!

Posted by: moth | October 2, 2007 9:47 PM | Report abuse

BTW, the game is on Fox Sports en Espanol, the sister channel to FSC.

Posted by: Eugene | October 2, 2007 9:47 PM | Report abuse

"looks like Jaime tried to catch the keeper of his line . . from midfield"

Only problems were that (a) the keeper wasn't actually his line, and (b) Jaime missed wide right by twenty yards or more.

That's tired play. And it's only the first half.

Posted by: Don K | October 2, 2007 9:48 PM | Report abuse

Team's playing well so far. Very composed, putting together some good passes. So far, so good.

Posted by: Bill in Md. | October 2, 2007 9:50 PM | Report abuse

I don't think we're losing possession as a strategy. It's because we have the passing accuracy and first touch of a team of lumberjacks.

Posted by: JkR | October 2, 2007 9:51 PM | Report abuse

DC is not being aggressive. Making lots of mistakes. Not keeping possession. I have seen this team play so much better so many times before... c'mon guys, attack!

Posted by: Eugene | October 2, 2007 9:51 PM | Report abuse

""That's tired play""

Maybe, but that's also Jaime play. He's done that several times in his career. I think he learned it from Marco.

Posted by: Anonymous | October 2, 2007 9:52 PM | Report abuse

Chivas players are so much faster than United players. How many corner kicks have they had?

Posted by: Bristol | October 2, 2007 9:52 PM | Report abuse

Bill in Md.: Check your local listings. You're on the wrong station....:)

Posted by: JkR | October 2, 2007 9:53 PM | Report abuse

I think this slow pace is a tactic. Sit and absorb, then do what the U.S does aginst Mexico every year ... counteratack. Chivas has to go forward. We have very little depth this game with Burch and Fred out. so go slow, store your energy, and then when Chivas has to get everything forward, you counter to Luchi and Gomez and Olsen.

Of course, we have to perfect in the back, but I think we can do it.

Yikes, that was scary. Good stuff by Simms.

Vamos United.

Posted by: DC Centurion's Shield | October 2, 2007 9:53 PM | Report abuse

Don't disagree about Moreno's willingness to bomb the ball in, but the keeper was about eight yards from goal. That one had just no chance at all-- it wasn't a matter of good aim, it was just a wasted chance.

Posted by: Don K | October 2, 2007 9:54 PM | Report abuse

What a block by Simms!

Posted by: Bill in Md. | October 2, 2007 9:54 PM | Report abuse

I love our team. Simms has been a great revelation this year. Even without Burch and Fred, we're standing up tall against these cabrones de Mexico!

Posted by: Bill in Md. | October 2, 2007 9:57 PM | Report abuse

Centurion, that's a recipe for disaster. The team would be much better off keeping possession, attacking and putting pressure on Chivas in the final 3rd.

If they play slow, they're going to put themselves to sleep and Chivas will eventually break through. DC is already looking lethargic and has barely made any shots on goal.

DC has a razor thin advantage on aggregate going into this game. If they give Chivas the space and time to attack, Chivas will eventually score and the DC advantage will be lost.

It's much better to keep Chivas on the defensive than to play a counterattack strategy. In fact, I would even say that sitting with 11 guys behind the ball and playing the counterattack is pretty naive -- I hope that's not Soehn's strategy.

Posted by: Eugene | October 2, 2007 9:59 PM | Report abuse

You fatalistic types are probably the same ones who were posting in this blog in June that Fred and Emilio were busts. Viva United!

Posted by: Bill in Md. | October 2, 2007 10:01 PM | Report abuse

Aiiii Moreno's down. Is it just a time killing ruse?

Posted by: Don K | October 2, 2007 10:02 PM | Report abuse

ooo bad kick to the back of the leg for Jaime.

Posted by: Niv | October 2, 2007 10:02 PM | Report abuse

just get to halftime and regroup!!! hang on for a few more minutes

Posted by: bristol | October 2, 2007 10:04 PM | Report abuse

Yeah, but we don't have the attacking players or the skill to pressure Chvas. And you can already see the counter attacks happening and us coming out of the shell. We made it through the first 30 minutes and are just a minute short of half, and it's working. We'll be okay. If we can get through this half you'll see.

And Eugene, I see your point as well, and that's what we'll hope to do in the second half.

I love how this half has played out.

Posted by: DC Centurion's Shield | October 2, 2007 10:06 PM | Report abuse

Chivas def had most of the good chances that half. It was at least encouraging that our best few minutes were at the end of the half.

Posted by: Niv | October 2, 2007 10:10 PM | Report abuse

I wonder if our SopCast source is going to start watching TEN during the half.

Posted by: Don K | October 2, 2007 10:10 PM | Report abuse

45 minutes to play. Hold on to your hats! I'm glad we don't have any cards. Defense is holding up strong. Maybe when Chivas starts throwing everything at us, we can get the insurance goal.

Posted by: Bill in Md. | October 2, 2007 10:10 PM | Report abuse

Centurion,

I hear what you're saying, but it would be bad to give up a single goal late in the game and have this thing go to penalty kicks. The way it's looking now, this game may get decided by one goal.

I just hope that if DC give up the first goal, they can get enough cajones together to find a way to equalize.

So far so good though, the first half is history. 0-0

Posted by: Eugene | October 2, 2007 10:12 PM | Report abuse

between what you all say, espn's match cast and chivas's site, i havent a clue what is going on, but man it is exciting. espn has the game at 90 mins so is hardly believable, but they say shots are 4 to 3 DC and on goals are 2 to 0 DC, you all have chivas dogging as goats and united holding on to whatever that beast's frothing teeth. cant wait for the second half. go united!!! and props to the post, bet they never thought they would be a game cast entity.

goff if you know zorlu say hi.

Posted by: moth | October 2, 2007 10:16 PM | Report abuse

The SopCast link works. However, no audio. Still better than nothing.

Posted by: Bart | October 2, 2007 10:20 PM | Report abuse

If DC gives up a single goal and the score ends 1-0 (2-2 on agg) Chivas wins on away goals.

Posted by: Hey Eugene | October 2, 2007 10:20 PM | Report abuse

Funny thing is the audio works for commercials. Could it be there's no audio because this is an English feed going to Spanish audience?

Posted by: Bart | October 2, 2007 10:21 PM | Report abuse

Maybe this is telling, the matchcast on ESPN has DCU 0, Chivas 0 90 minutes FINAL!!

Man, that'd be nice

Posted by: delantero | October 2, 2007 10:21 PM | Report abuse

Chivas dominated first half in terms of possession, but really only had one dangerous scoring chance that Medina or Bravo put well over the bar. DC did not have anything threatening in terms of scoring chances. 70/30 Split of possession in favor of Chivas. McTavish is all over the place for DC...

Posted by: Keenan | October 2, 2007 10:22 PM | Report abuse

Yes, thanks to all of those who are posting here. Your comments say a lot more than ESPN. Keep up the good work! (please)

Posted by: Rex | October 2, 2007 10:22 PM | Report abuse

Game seems to be similar to the previous one in DC... Chivas mounting most of the attacks, DC defending and giving up the ball midfield, very few opportunities on offense. At least we have 11 players going in to the half. Hope Soehn can rally the troops as he did for the Toronto game.

Vamos United!!!

Posted by: ML | October 2, 2007 10:24 PM | Report abuse

yes those of you with acsess to the game please post with details. i am a very dedicated dcu fan (la norte) stuck in jackson missisipi on work. i want the boys to pull this off so badly.

Posted by: thank you from la norte member | October 2, 2007 10:25 PM | Report abuse

soccernet matchtracker seems to think the game is over. what's with that?

Posted by: de | October 2, 2007 10:25 PM | Report abuse

Possession is nice, but overrated.

An away team in a hostile environment without two starters needs to keep shape and take it's punches. Now and again they'll get to throw one or two and, hopefully, land one.

Posted by: d | October 2, 2007 10:26 PM | Report abuse

Audio is back on SopCast. It's in spanish though.

Posted by: Bart | October 2, 2007 10:27 PM | Report abuse

DC doing a much better job of possessing the ball so far this half.

ben is getting riled up, hope he doesn't get goaded into a card.

Posted by: pat | October 2, 2007 10:28 PM | Report abuse

oof - jaime with an awful giveaway to pineda right at the 18, we are lucky he didn't get a better shot off

Posted by: pat | October 2, 2007 10:31 PM | Report abuse

did that coach just try to keep the ball in bounds? got sopcast finally! can see what you all are talking about. go united!

Posted by: moth | October 2, 2007 10:31 PM | Report abuse

I love the PA announcer playing Queen "We are the Champions" over and over again on the PA system at Estadio Jalisco...

Posted by: Keenan | October 2, 2007 10:31 PM | Report abuse

Anyone....

0-0 Draw gets us passage to Quarterfinals or Extra Time???

Posted by: Keenan | October 2, 2007 10:33 PM | Report abuse

Why are they playing "We are the Champions" in Mexico?

Posted by: CY | October 2, 2007 10:33 PM | Report abuse

Close call. Danger averted.

Posted by: Bart | October 2, 2007 10:33 PM | Report abuse

0-0 draw is an aggregate win.

Posted by: Don K | October 2, 2007 10:34 PM | Report abuse

DC had one good opportunity in the first half when Gomez blasted the ball almost inside the Chivas left post off a free kick/dead ball situation. If that doesn't count as a shot on goal, it certainly should.

Chivas is dominating possession but struggling in the final 3rd. They're putting lots of crosses into the box, but not being able to successfully redirect them on goal, so the shots on goal stat for them is deceiving. Chivas is basically having a finishing problem, which apparently has been dogging them for some time. However, they must have put 10-20 crosses into the box in the first half.

DC is struggling with possession, typically losing it in the middle 3rd. They're barely spending any time in the Chivas final 3rd.

Didn't know that at 2-2 this game gets decided on away goals, can a second person confirm? If that is the case, this defense first/counterattack strategy is even more dangerous.

Looks like Chivas may be preparing to sub.

Controversial offsides call on Chivas. DC is playing with fire.

Posted by: Eugene | October 2, 2007 10:35 PM | Report abuse

Good call by AR on the offside by Chivas 56'

Posted by: Keenan | October 2, 2007 10:35 PM | Report abuse

Thanks!

Don K

Posted by: Keenan | October 2, 2007 10:36 PM | Report abuse

Little bit o' luck on that offsides call. This match is our destiny

Posted by: Bill in Md. | October 2, 2007 10:36 PM | Report abuse

Offside Chivas 58'

Posted by: Keenan | October 2, 2007 10:36 PM | Report abuse

pineda's out? he's been the most threatening goat for most of the past two games.

Posted by: pat | October 2, 2007 10:37 PM | Report abuse

Chivas subs Arellano for Pineda

Posted by: Eugene | October 2, 2007 10:37 PM | Report abuse

Do they not want to score? With that sub, I think this one is in the bag.

Posted by: Don K | October 2, 2007 10:38 PM | Report abuse

I hate to say it, but we need to play for the 0-0 Draw at this point... We have had nothing positive towards goal the whole match...

Posted by: Keenan | October 2, 2007 10:38 PM | Report abuse

moreno with an awful giveaway right above the box again, and then gives up on the play once he gives it up. what is up with him?

Posted by: pat | October 2, 2007 10:39 PM | Report abuse

Bowell Yellow Card 60'

Posted by: Keenan | October 2, 2007 10:39 PM | Report abuse

Yellow card for Boswell. There is some good news though, Chivas is looking tired

Posted by: Eugene | October 2, 2007 10:40 PM | Report abuse

any tie-we go through
2-1 chivas-PKs
1-0 chivas-they go through on away goals
any dc win -we go through obviously

Posted by: the scoop | October 2, 2007 10:40 PM | Report abuse

Simms Yellow Card 63'....

This is not looking good...

Posted by: Keenan | October 2, 2007 10:41 PM | Report abuse

Yellow for Simms. C'mon guys, don't melt down!

Perkins is still the man of the match for DC.

Moreno needs to get subbed ASAP, his heart doesn't look like it's in this game.

Posted by: Eugene | October 2, 2007 10:42 PM | Report abuse

And another yellow...

Posted by: RK | October 2, 2007 10:42 PM | Report abuse

Chivas goal

Posted by: game over | October 2, 2007 10:42 PM | Report abuse

Okay, yellow cards on Boswell and Simms. No more cards, por favor!

Posted by: Bill in Md. | October 2, 2007 10:43 PM | Report abuse

Goal Chivas - defense broke down.

Posted by: ML | October 2, 2007 10:43 PM | Report abuse

There it is Chivas goal.

I'm crying inside. This is exactly what happens with this strategy. Now DC is really in a bind

Posted by: Eugene | October 2, 2007 10:43 PM | Report abuse

Goal Chivas.

Posted by: Bart | October 2, 2007 10:43 PM | Report abuse

oh boy. better luck next time

Posted by: bristol | October 2, 2007 10:43 PM | Report abuse

damn it.

Posted by: niv | October 2, 2007 10:44 PM | Report abuse

This is going to end 3-0.

Posted by: Anonymous | October 2, 2007 10:44 PM | Report abuse

*ucking Queen!!!!

Posted by: Keenan | October 2, 2007 10:44 PM | Report abuse

Oh lord, I brought down the curse.

Come on Gomez.

Posted by: Don K | October 2, 2007 10:44 PM | Report abuse

Well, not much you can do about a strike like that. Carrol comes in.

Posted by: edgeonyou | October 2, 2007 10:44 PM | Report abuse

These long balls aren't doing us any good.

Posted by: Bart | October 2, 2007 10:44 PM | Report abuse

So unlucky...

BCarroll running in w/ some new instructions...

Posted by: RK | October 2, 2007 10:44 PM | Report abuse

Brian Carroll on for Jaime Moreno, just a few minutes too late.

I've been watching DC this year since the Concacaf Champions Cup at the beginning of the season, this is easily the worst I've seen the team play.

Posted by: Eugene | October 2, 2007 10:45 PM | Report abuse

Screw Poplar Point. Is there anything closer to a mile above sea level so no one can score away goals on us?

Posted by: UVA to RFK | October 2, 2007 10:45 PM | Report abuse

Do I have any magic left?

Posted by: Ben Olsen's beard | October 2, 2007 10:45 PM | Report abuse

chivas is lighting it up now

Posted by: niv | October 2, 2007 10:46 PM | Report abuse

Again with the long pass out from the back.

Posted by: Bart | October 2, 2007 10:46 PM | Report abuse

dc is getting stroked. possession is overrated? are you an idiot?

Posted by: jay | October 2, 2007 10:46 PM | Report abuse

chivas isn't toronto, but we were down 1-0 on saturday . . .

Posted by: Anonymous | October 2, 2007 10:46 PM | Report abuse

Chivas is leading 1-0...and Moreno is replaced by..... Caroll? I do not get this one!
A defensive midfielder replacing a forward when DCU needs tot score? What is Soehn thinking???

Posted by: Charles | October 2, 2007 10:46 PM | Report abuse

Okay, time to go back to playing our game, with the 2-2 tie on aggragate.

Posted by: Bill in Md. | October 2, 2007 10:46 PM | Report abuse

Shot by DC. Emilio has discovered his nuts

Posted by: Eugene | October 2, 2007 10:47 PM | Report abuse

Bad miss by Emilio...that's got to be on net

Posted by: CY | October 2, 2007 10:48 PM | Report abuse

All we need is 1 goal. 1 freaking goal and we win. Can't get easier than that.

Posted by: Bart | October 2, 2007 10:48 PM | Report abuse

Never fear, Kpene is just waiting to explode!

Posted by: Anonymous | October 2, 2007 10:48 PM | Report abuse

Nice strike by Emilio, fractionally right

Posted by: Bill in Md. | October 2, 2007 10:49 PM | Report abuse

Well Rod Dyachenko is in now. Bobby is out. Interesting that McTavish stays in.

Posted by: Bart | October 2, 2007 10:49 PM | Report abuse

Can anyone confirm if this thing gets decided on away goals or if it goes to penalty kicks if this game is a draw on aggregate after 90 mins?

Posted by: Eugene | October 2, 2007 10:49 PM | Report abuse

These commentators are really pro-Mexican...and I don't even speak Spanish that well.

Posted by: Anonymous | October 2, 2007 10:49 PM | Report abuse

Game's starting to open up, after the Chivas goal.

Posted by: Bill in Md. | October 2, 2007 10:50 PM | Report abuse

Here's the skinny: United needs a goal to survive.

A 1-1 draw. United goes through.

A 2-1 loss sends it to OT.

So even if Chivas score again, we still need only 1 goal.

Posted by: Bristol | October 2, 2007 10:51 PM | Report abuse

Dirty goats everywhere on TV...disgusting.

Posted by: Anonymous | October 2, 2007 10:51 PM | Report abuse

Here comes the fakery.

Posted by: Don K | October 2, 2007 10:51 PM | Report abuse

Crap what a weak shot

Posted by: RK | October 2, 2007 10:51 PM | Report abuse

DC looks like they're playing a man down - scrambling defensively, little mid-field control.

At least KC shouldn't be intimidating after this.....

Posted by: PotomacBoater | October 2, 2007 10:52 PM | Report abuse

We really miss Burch sending in balls from the left.

Posted by: CY | October 2, 2007 10:52 PM | Report abuse

"We are the Champions" is officially off the iPod

Posted by: Anonymous | October 2, 2007 10:53 PM | Report abuse

How much time is left?

Posted by: Paul | October 2, 2007 10:53 PM | Report abuse

Nice stop by Perkins on the attempted cross by Chivas!

Posted by: Bill in Md. | October 2, 2007 10:54 PM | Report abuse

15'

Posted by: Anonymous | October 2, 2007 10:54 PM | Report abuse

Eugene, that was the drawback to the strategy. But I think we can still get it. Dyachenko is motivated huh?

And anonymous, the "We are the Champions" is officially off the iPod is the post of the night. Hands down.

Posted by: DC Centurion's Shield | October 2, 2007 10:55 PM | Report abuse

DeRoux getting set to enter.

Posted by: CY | October 2, 2007 10:55 PM | Report abuse

Has DC made all three subs? If this thing goes to overtime, the decision to use all the subs at around 60-70' will have been a mistake by Soehn

Posted by: Eugene | October 2, 2007 10:56 PM | Report abuse

Unless DC score...then "Champions" is back on the playlist!

Posted by: Anonymous | October 2, 2007 10:57 PM | Report abuse

Gotta give them credit. They know how to dive.

Posted by: Bart | October 2, 2007 10:57 PM | Report abuse

If DC scores and makes it through, I'm gonna run down Poplar Point with nothing but a Screaming Eagles hat.

Posted by: Bristol | October 2, 2007 10:58 PM | Report abuse

Burch Vanney is not.

Posted by: CY | October 2, 2007 10:58 PM | Report abuse

If we go to OT? We gotta score 1.

Posted by: RK | October 2, 2007 10:58 PM | Report abuse

Easy on the tackle, Vanney!

Posted by: Bill in Md. | October 2, 2007 10:58 PM | Report abuse

i think this tournament gives four subs, no? looks like we still have guys warming up after deroux came in.

Posted by: pat | October 2, 2007 10:59 PM | Report abuse

Away goals is clearly the tiebreaker.

Chivas is bunkering too much at home for it to not be.

C'mon BOYS!!!!!

Posted by: DC Centurion's Shield | October 2, 2007 10:59 PM | Report abuse

At least DC is getting opportunities now...Let's go UNITED!!!

Posted by: CY | October 2, 2007 11:00 PM | Report abuse

Yeah, Benny! Some fighting spirit!

Posted by: Bill in Md. | October 2, 2007 11:01 PM | Report abuse

oh man i thought that shot by carroll went it

Posted by: pat | October 2, 2007 11:01 PM | Report abuse

Shot just wide from Carroll. Chivas are still the champions

Posted by: CY | October 2, 2007 11:01 PM | Report abuse

And it should be noted, that as bad as the reffing in Central America usually is, this referee is having a good game.

Why did that ball come out of the back of the net?

Posted by: DC Centurion's Shield | October 2, 2007 11:01 PM | Report abuse

C'mon Centurion, that strategy is fraught with drawbacks. That's why I said it was naive, if in fact that was Soehn's plan. It's much better to try to increase the aggregage lead in the first 20-30 minutes than to play for a 0-0 draw in this game or to try to win the game in the last 20 minutes when everyone is tired.

DC has definitely livened up. Just maybe too little too late. Their competitive edge was dulled when they played sleepy ball in the first half.

Posted by: Eugene | October 2, 2007 11:01 PM | Report abuse

Corner kick por United!

Posted by: Bill in Md. | October 2, 2007 11:02 PM | Report abuse

Vanney got lucky there...

Posted by: RK | October 2, 2007 11:02 PM | Report abuse

ESPN GameCast says Jeff Carroll missed a shot. PLEASE tell me they have the wrong Carroll.

Posted by: UVA to RFK | October 2, 2007 11:03 PM | Report abuse

Wasted opportunity by Gomez

Posted by: Anonymous | October 2, 2007 11:03 PM | Report abuse

Chivas asleep on a corner leaving Carroll for an open look from the 18 -- doesn't even get it on frame...

Posted by: edgeonyou | October 2, 2007 11:03 PM | Report abuse

That was the chance!

Posted by: Bart | October 2, 2007 11:04 PM | Report abuse

Nice turn by Gomez! We're close, fellas!

Posted by: Bill in Md. | October 2, 2007 11:04 PM | Report abuse

time check please...

Posted by: Anonymous | October 2, 2007 11:05 PM | Report abuse

Gomez creates space for an open look from the circle and doesn't get it on frame either!

Posted by: edgeonyou | October 2, 2007 11:05 PM | Report abuse

horrible cross by DeRoux

Posted by: Anonymous | October 2, 2007 11:06 PM | Report abuse

Talk about lousy finishing. Puta Chivas!

Posted by: Bill in Md. | October 2, 2007 11:06 PM | Report abuse

And Chivas just wasted a golden chance.

Posted by: Bart | October 2, 2007 11:06 PM | Report abuse

5 min.

Posted by: edgeonyou | October 2, 2007 11:06 PM | Report abuse

Good God Chivas is not the team it has been in prior years. I can't believe this team, with it's huge finishing problems, sold Bofo. He wasn't great, but at least he knows where the het is.

Posted by: Eugene | October 2, 2007 11:06 PM | Report abuse

Worst.shot.ever

Posted by: RK | October 2, 2007 11:07 PM | Report abuse

DC corner...now or never.

Posted by: Anonymous | October 2, 2007 11:07 PM | Report abuse

2 min

Posted by: Anonymous | October 2, 2007 11:07 PM | Report abuse

C'mon boys! Let's pull out a goal

Posted by: Bret | October 2, 2007 11:08 PM | Report abuse

olsen with a perfect chance.

3 mins of stoppage time to go.

Posted by: pat | October 2, 2007 11:08 PM | Report abuse

Never it is...corner for Chivas now...welcome to the corner for holding possession. Chivas remain champions

Posted by: Anonymous | October 2, 2007 11:08 PM | Report abuse

time's like these that i wish we had a designated player

Posted by: Anonymous | October 2, 2007 11:09 PM | Report abuse

Cercissima!

Posted by: Bill in Md. | October 2, 2007 11:09 PM | Report abuse

arghhhhhh! that was it!!!!

Posted by: edgeonyou | October 2, 2007 11:09 PM | Report abuse

!!!!

Posted by: RK | October 2, 2007 11:09 PM | Report abuse

DC puts a rocket on frame, Chivas 'keeper had to dive to put it over, gave up the corner.

Corner for DC was wasted.

Chivas came back on the counter, pulled Perkins out and then missed an empty goal.

If Chivas is playing as if 2-2 gets them through, Perkins is still playing at 1/4 speed, as if 2-2 gets DC to OT...

Posted by: Eugene | October 2, 2007 11:09 PM | Report abuse

You know what's awesome? giving the ball away in your own half when in need of a goal in the 91st minute. Priceless.

Posted by: Anonymous | October 2, 2007 11:10 PM | Report abuse

deroux has been a complete waste of a sub

Posted by: pat | October 2, 2007 11:11 PM | Report abuse

Game over. Commentators celebrate.

Posted by: Anonymous | October 2, 2007 11:12 PM | Report abuse

Chivas is definitely playing like they want it more. They are getting all the 40-60 balls. Not to talk of the 50-50 ones.

Posted by: Bart | October 2, 2007 11:12 PM | Report abuse

MLS and DCU needed this...

Posted by: RK | October 2, 2007 11:13 PM | Report abuse

Is final score 1-0?
Oh no, my husband is going to be pissed when he gets home tonight.

Posted by: Soccergirl | October 2, 2007 11:13 PM | Report abuse

damn...this just sucks. Really wanted to hold them off. I love a home and home series, but I hate the damn away goal....

Posted by: mcn107 | October 2, 2007 11:13 PM | Report abuse

If Queen were still alive, I'd kill him.

Posted by: CY | October 2, 2007 11:14 PM | Report abuse

We were so close...agree with you all about the bad strategy of trying to protect a one-goal lead for 90 minutes on the road.

Posted by: Bill in Md. | October 2, 2007 11:14 PM | Report abuse

Keeper didn't have to dive, he threw his hands straight up to block it. If that shot had been two feet to either side it's a goal.

Posted by: edgeonyou | October 2, 2007 11:15 PM | Report abuse

lame. 2-2 and lose on away goals. thats about as stupid a deciding factor as getting caught offside fewer times or number of corner kicks awarded (fwiw, I reffed a tournament where this was a tie breaker in the past)

Posted by: russ | October 2, 2007 11:15 PM | Report abuse

It's over. 1-0 (3-2) aggregate in favor of Chivas. I knew it would come down to this as soon as I saw we let them score in DC. Maybe someone needs to explain the away goal rules to American soccer players. Because when you are hosting first leg, a 1-0 win is better for you than a 2-1 win. So after scoring 2 goals, you defend like your life depends on it. Even if it means keeping all 11 players behind the ball and playing keep-away.

Posted by: Bart | October 2, 2007 11:15 PM | Report abuse

and if hallmark ref didnt give out that second card in the first game... ah, what ifs; can you tell i am a Caps fan? thanks for sharing folks. the quest is not over, yet.

Posted by: moth | October 2, 2007 11:15 PM | Report abuse

Left-footed shot with very little time to set up. Let's not blame Olsen for the loss.

Posted by: Anonymous | October 2, 2007 11:16 PM | Report abuse

No question - we deserved to lose that one. I hate that.

Glad Perkins had a good night though - hopefully that'll make up for his blunder there earlier this year and carry into the MLS playoff's.

Hopefully, this experience/lesson learned will carry into the rest of the season and the playoffs for the entire team.

Posted by: PotomacBoater | October 2, 2007 11:16 PM | Report abuse

Game over. 1-0 Chivas win and the 11 guys behind the ball/counterattack strategy fails again.

When will coaches ever learn that the team needs to come out fighting from the first minute? That this game is about possession and short passes, not long ball, not goalkeepers booting the ball all the way down the field.

DC could have and should have owned this Chivas team.

I hate to say I called the 1-0 disaster in process, but this situation has played itself out exactly the same way so many times before.

Oh well, at least there will likely be opportunities for international glory next year.

Posted by: Eugene | October 2, 2007 11:17 PM | Report abuse

Of course. How typical. Blame it on the away goal rule. It's the rule.

What I want to know is how come we never get a chance to host the 2nd leg of these international competitions? It's always first leg here and second over there. And invariably we never win.

Posted by: Bart | October 2, 2007 11:18 PM | Report abuse

would have been great to win and advance - but now less distractions from winning the supporter's shield and mls cup

Posted by: emanon | October 2, 2007 11:18 PM | Report abuse

Why did DC go into the game on a defense mentality? When you know that one against goal can through you off the tournament.

Since the game started I knew that playing D the whole game wasn't going to work.

I think that from the start they should of attacked more. And not wait until chivas scored to say" Oh wait were losing, we should attack"

I hope DC learned from this mistake.

Posted by: LUiS | October 2, 2007 11:19 PM | Report abuse

Thanks to all who kept us non-viewers updated...

Posted by: Rex | October 2, 2007 11:21 PM | Report abuse

Even without the defend-only strategy, I am sure DC would have "owned" Chivas. After DC went down 1-0, Chivas was still out playing us. They were quicker and seemed more prepared to dig in and get dirty. Each time a DC player two-touched the ball, Chivas was right there to contest the second touch.

Posted by: Bart | October 2, 2007 11:21 PM | Report abuse

I meant to say "I am not sure DC would have "owned"..."

Posted by: Bart | October 2, 2007 11:22 PM | Report abuse

I agree with Bart; Chivas was the better team over both games. DC were unlucky to lose Burch to cards and Fred to injury, but Chivas were the better team, as much as I hate to say it.

Posted by: CY | October 2, 2007 11:23 PM | Report abuse

I think for next season we should find a forward who is fast, quick with his feet and not afraid to run at defenders.

Having a forward could really help us out A LOT.

Posted by: LUiS | October 2, 2007 11:23 PM | Report abuse

I quit.

Posted by: Coach Soehn | October 2, 2007 11:25 PM | Report abuse

solution: 1 game in Canada

whats the rationale of away goals?

Posted by: howard | October 2, 2007 11:25 PM | Report abuse

Is Kaka available?

Posted by: Anonymous | October 2, 2007 11:25 PM | Report abuse

At least now we can focus on supporters shield and mls cup, and give it another try next year..

Posted by: ngu | October 2, 2007 11:26 PM | Report abuse

Hey Dan, can somebody ask DC officials is they'll ever actually grow a set and try to take the game to a team in Mexico? This 'defend for 90' strategy had NEVER WORKED FOR A US TEAM IN MEXICO. Perhaps they hadn't noticed.

Posted by: Matt | October 2, 2007 11:28 PM | Report abuse

Two final thoughts:

(1) The most frustrating part of the series was to see how far ahead Chivas was. Speed, on the ball skills, creativity...hopefully MLS continues to close the gap.

(2) Wanted to win one of the tourneys, but alas, let's focus on the two most important prizes.

Posted by: mcn107 | October 2, 2007 11:28 PM | Report abuse

Are you guys touting this "possession" game serious? It's quite obvious that we tried to do that, but weren't given the time nor space by Chivas (unlike MLS).

The only reason the game wasn't worse than 1-0 was because DC U played 11 behind the ball.

Plus the strategy of tight defense first, counter attack second has won many World Cups.

Is it the beautiful game? No, but it can be effective.

Any of you who think otherwise are fooling yourself into thinking DC U is capable of playing jogo bonito for 90 minutes at altitude in a hostile stadium.

Posted by: d | October 2, 2007 11:28 PM | Report abuse

remember the huge disappointment the players talked about at the start of the year for losing to chivas.......they better put this behind them quickly

Posted by: howard | October 2, 2007 11:29 PM | Report abuse

The rationale for away games: my guess is since you are playing away the home team already has an advantage. So to compensate, your goals count for double. Hence it's better to keep the away team scoreless. Even better, realize the away goal rule is in effect and play like the score is tied. Not like you have a 2-1 lead. 'Cos even if there wasn't an away rule, playing defense will just get you a tie. Which will result in overtime and possibly penalties. How much hostile will their home crowd be for penalties?

Posted by: Bart | October 2, 2007 11:30 PM | Report abuse

Our best chance to win against a mexican side was the last competition held in the US. That was our chance and we blew it. Simply can't win a 2nd leg game in Mexico.

Posted by: Bart | October 2, 2007 11:32 PM | Report abuse

"Plus the strategy of tight defense first, counter attack second has won many World Cups."

Posted by: d | October 2, 2007 11:28 PM
---------------------------------------------

yea but world cups aren't played in a two leg series.

Posted by: LUiS | October 2, 2007 11:34 PM | Report abuse

Two final thoughts:

(1) The most frustrating part of the series was to see how far ahead Chivas was. Speed, on the ball skills, creativity...hopefully MLS continues to close the gap.

(2) Wanted to win one of the tourneys, but alas, let's focus on the two most important prizes.

Posted by: mcn107 | October 2, 2007 11:35 PM | Report abuse

That Toyota player was pretty good - seemed to be all over the field.

Posted by: ML | October 2, 2007 11:35 PM | Report abuse

I'm buying a Nissan.

Posted by: I Hate Toyota | October 2, 2007 11:36 PM | Report abuse

It's so clear we lack the depth to play internationally

Posted by: Anonymous | October 2, 2007 11:37 PM | Report abuse

Notice how all the Chivas players have their name etched on their shirts right above their asses?

Posted by: Jake | October 2, 2007 11:37 PM | Report abuse

Look, the teams know the rules going into this thing. You can't blame playing in Mexico for the 2nd leg for DC not taking a commanding league at home in the first leg.

And possession/short pass game does not equal jogo bonito. I'm not saying they need to play jogo bonito. All I'm saying is that you can't score if you don't have the ball and it's much easier to control the game when you control possession. It doesn't matter if you play jogo bonito or ugly if you don't have the ball -- either way you're sitting on a ticking time bomb until the other team scores.

For everyone who believes DC got outplayed in both games, I 100% beg to differ. For everyone who says MLS is a step behind on being able to compete on this level, I 100% beg to differ. I've seen DC play much better than this -- why they failed here, I believe, is much more psychological relating to not taking the game to your opponents, not being on offense and not building the team's confidence throughout 90 minutes. DC has the talent and skill to have won here, especially against a Chivas team that is in disarray from having their coach sacked, from having a bad season in their domestic league and from struggling to score goals.

The problem was that DC gave them too much space and time to score one. It's just numbers. If Chivas can put the ball in front of our goal 20-30 times, eventually one of those opportunities will find its way into the back of our net. Even if the goal is a stinker, not the well-placed shot that decided this series.

DC has a 20-30 goals/season player in Emilio. But if the team is afraid to be aggressive, they'll find ways to lose in any competition at any level.

What did they have to lose here? They should have just gone for it and attacked like crazy. Even if they lost with that kind of fighting mentality, at least they would have gone down gloriously.

This kind of heartless loss just leaves a bitter taste in your mouth.

Posted by: Eugene | October 2, 2007 11:45 PM | Report abuse

picture of simms on front of mexico's largest newspaper

http://www.eluniversal.com.mx/noticias.html

Posted by: howard | October 2, 2007 11:46 PM | Report abuse

"Commanding lead" not league.

Ok d, but how many World Cup matches have been lost by not playing for the win? By not trying to kill the other team.

Like someone said, WC matches are not played in two games with aggregate goals, the strategy has to change a bit when teams are faced with this situation.

Away goals rule or not, second leg in Mexico or not, to improve the probability of winning on aggregate DC needed to build up goal differential at home as priority #1, then keep Chivas from scoring away goals as priority #2. If you're Soehn and you're faced with the situation that you have a one goal lead going into the second leg and you've given up at least one goal at home, the LAST strategy in your mind should be to defend for 90 minutes and let Chivas take the game to you when they're playing in their own house.

The strategy should be to keep bombing their goal with shots. From distance, from crosses, from set pieces, from any opportunity or half-opportunity that you can muster. At least you will keep the ball away from your goal that way, even if you can't manage to score.

Posted by: Eugene | October 2, 2007 11:55 PM | Report abuse

It's so clear we lack the depth to play internationally"

Keep in mind that if Fred and Burch play, Carroll, and DeRoux (or Dyachenko) probably don't go in and our depth is looking pretty good.

Posted by: Anonymous | October 2, 2007 11:56 PM | Report abuse

Eugene,
Chivas is one of the best teams on the planet, you cannot say that they are in disarray, their core players, bravo,medina,rodriquez,morales,pineda, magallon are all veteran national players and have played together for some time, also the goalie, michel is now a nat'l team goalie, araujo,esparza,santana, are now on nat'l team. Chivas is history and their players know how to play, their skills are superior to those on our national team, I am dc first, chivas is not in disarray, they allow the second fewest goals in the first division, disarray for chivas is not dominating the game which is why the coach was let go. don't be mad at dc, im surprised they have played so well in the last two series against chivas. I am so proud of these dc players, they fought. I was in mexico for dc vs. pumas, 5-0 loss for dc, those players did not fight, olsen, moreno, played, that game was years ago and that was a lesson to be learned, dc should fight no matter what and now, this team, does that.

Posted by: howard | October 3, 2007 12:02 AM | Report abuse

Sighhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

Posted by: marksman | October 3, 2007 12:16 AM | Report abuse

Howard: I think the main rationale for the away goals rule is to encourage the visiting team to attack and discourage bunkering for 0-0 draws.

Posted by: Oscar M. | October 3, 2007 12:16 AM | Report abuse

what is the team salary of chivas vs. that of United? isn't that dispositive?

Posted by: Anonymous | October 3, 2007 12:50 AM | Report abuse

I don't know what game some of you were watching but we just got dominated up until the point that Chivas changed their formation after their goal. Great rigid tactics there Soehn.

Posted by: Dave | October 3, 2007 12:56 AM | Report abuse

#*&^%$@...

Wonder what woulda happened if Burch and Fred were able to play in this game...

Here's hoping Arsenal de Sarandi beats THE SNOT outta Chivas...

Posted by: Juan-John | October 3, 2007 12:56 AM | Report abuse

Gottta figure out how to overcome this Curse of the Lambino...

Posted by: Juan-John | October 3, 2007 1:00 AM | Report abuse

As with all tournaments, once the American representation is out I begin hoping that whatever Mexican team is left gets the crap beat out of it.

I look forward to the day that DCU waltz into Guadalajara and beat the snot out of those xenophobic (only signing Mexican players) goats.

But really, I don't want to get past them by playing counter attack ball. I want us to mercilessly run up the score and thoroughly dominate the game. Sure, it will be a while, but I hope it happens some time in the next decade.

Posted by: bribri | October 3, 2007 1:04 AM | Report abuse

Sorry, I just can't see how anyone could say this was even or that we weren't outclassed tonight...we were...plain and simple...depth is certainly an issue, but so is our lack of possession, them having more shots than us, them pressuring us off the ball so much that we barely could string passes together...them blazing on the wings while we looked gassed...and I saw a lot of that in the first game.

We're not ready to beat Chivas...yet...but we will.

Posted by: BillP | October 3, 2007 1:11 AM | Report abuse

We were outplayed by a great Chivas team. We had a shot and couldn't pull it off. Still a great effort by DCU and MLS.

I wonder if MLS wanted a DCU win as much as DCU did. If they want MLS to represent in Continental tournaments, they need to give their good teams the tools to succeed. Not punish good teams with low picks, and not to expand to take away the depth of good teams.

You don't see the European leagues punishing their champions for the sake of parity.

Posted by: brooklyn fan | October 3, 2007 1:14 AM | Report abuse

We are getting closer every year Mexico. Can you see your dominance slipping away?

DCU with a couple designated players, their own stadium, a little higher salary cap, and some players moving up through the youth system is going to be THE force in the Americas in 5-10 years.

Posted by: Sean G | October 3, 2007 1:16 AM | Report abuse

That's because the European leagues have an incredibly well established product that is not in danger of folding like MLS

Posted by: Andrew | October 3, 2007 1:18 AM | Report abuse

At least I never much liked Queen in the first place

Is it just me, or did the announcer on the English feed sound like he was working through Babelfish? An awful lot of idoms I assume are Mexican, tournament for league, a lot of oddities.

Hate to say it, but the better team won. If Chivas could have executed a cross to save their lives last week they could have had 3 or four more goals, and tonight wasn't as close as the score. It took a while to close the gap at the national team level, the club level is taking a little longer.

Posted by: just sayin | October 3, 2007 1:22 AM | Report abuse

just finished watching. perkins looked fantastic, shame that he was screened on the goal. dcu clearly came into this wanting a 0-0 tie, but considering the speed of chivas and their ridiculous possession advantage in the first half, i'm pleased with how the defense held up.

depth is an issue up top. dcu has guys like kpene or deroux who bring speed, but not finishing.

and while emilio has been fantastic this year, i still cringe whenever he tried to dribble in a one v. one situation.

still: a good two game performance against a solid chivas team. and hey: dc united got a mexican coach fired. that's not too bad.

Posted by: dco | October 3, 2007 1:28 AM | Report abuse

If they want MLS to represent in Continental tournaments, they need to give their good teams the tools to succeed. Not punish good teams with low picks, and not to expand to take away the depth of good teams.

You don't see the European leagues punishing their champions for the sake of parity.

Posted by: brooklyn fan | October 3, 2007 01:14 AM
__________________________________________
I don't know where to begin...Sports, up until 15 years ago or so, were FAR different in Europe. Every club was owned by the citizens of the town not 1 man. They are all watered down by virtue of the 28 level league system; it only appears to not be the case because their system has changed to a 'buy the best talent money can buy' model.

re: parity. The G-14 has been pushing to make a European superleague that would essentially emulate the US model so they could protect their assets and maximize their revenues.

Parity in MLS isn't a bad thing. If we had a situation where only 2 teams have a realistic shot of winning it all every year, the league would be dead in 2 years. Beside, this year there is a much clearer division between the best and the worst teams so it is changing a bit. However, the dominant team can change from year to year which is good for the league right now. There is a reason baseball (Yankees & Cardinals) slipped in popularity to the NFL (full of parity)

On to the match...
DC played a tactically horrible match. Soehn has to go into the match as if they were tied. He played like a team up 2 goals or up a goal with no away goals conceded.
If DC plays the whole match like they play the last 20, they win easy.

Not a bad showing. I am looking forward to seeing what the MLS teams might do in the Champion's Cup next year.

Posted by: papa bear | October 3, 2007 1:36 AM | Report abuse

As far as I could tell, it took 20 minutes for us to complete 4 passes. That is problem #1. We had no possesion to counteract Chivas and it let them set the tone early in the game. We need to learn to pass the ball to the players wearing black. Is MLS really so weak that we can play so well in the league then look so bad against Chivas??? I really thought US soccer had progressed....I guess I was wrong. I really feel like we should have beaten Chivas this time around.

I took my youngest child to our local Nature Center...I had a really hard time NOT strangling the goats today!

Posted by: Andy In Asheville | October 3, 2007 1:39 AM | Report abuse

Just got home from the bar, where I was forced to watch the FSC feed. Frustrating night all around. You could see that DCU was playing with fire the whole night. I don't think that DCU was that far behind Chivas as far as desire went, but technically, they weren't on par with the Mexicans. DCU wasn't even close to scoring. No build-up, no possession, no chances in front of goal. If luck held out, we might have squeaked through with a goal-less draw. But it only takes one chance, and if you give up that many chances, something is bound to happen. Next time around, DCU needs to protect their home turf, and guard against that away goal. That's what killed us. Anyways, good night East Coast! Now, go for the Cup!

Posted by: dug | October 3, 2007 1:44 AM | Report abuse

Not necessarily blaming MLS for doing what they need to do to survive. But if MLS wants to be respected worldwide, and I think it does, it needs to move past just having former MLS players play in other leagues, it needs to have its teams compete with teams in other leagues. And if thats the case, it doesn't need to give its good teams an extra advantage, but it shouldn't punish the good teams for succeeding. I am not blaming MLS for promoting parity (well maybe a little bit due to emotions from this loss) but just pointing out that its top teams are going to find it harder to win if they continue to expand and continue to promote parity.

In regards to the match, being unable to string together passes was horrible, but a defensive strategy was not a bad idea. Chivas scored on a great shot, but DC was in it (as in, not conceding a goal and winning the aggregate) for the majority of the match.

Posted by: brooklyn fan | October 3, 2007 1:46 AM | Report abuse

Meant to say 4 CONSECUTIVE passes...

The donkeys and sheep were nice!

Posted by: Andy In Asheville | October 3, 2007 1:48 AM | Report abuse

I disagree that Chivas were the better team. As was mentioned already, we came out in a bunker from minute 1 and never got into the game psychologically.

Once we were forced to come forward, even though the squad was exhausted and missing two of our best offensive talents (Moreno and Fred) we still created three or four decent chances in the last 15mins. The Chivas defense is not very good. If we just played our game instead of coming out with a coward's mentality, I believe we would've asserted our quality and scored at least one goal.

Also, I think if DC is allowed to play with 11 for the entire game at RFK, we beat them 2-0 at least, we were dominating that game before the dismissal. And that red card to Burch was harsh to say the least.

Overall, this was a harsh result for DC, but, and I hate to say this, we deserved it for coming out like we did. Personally, I always root against teams that come out with no intention to play for a goal. And watching this game was both sickening and embarassing because I can't remember ever seeing a DC United team come out in a shell. I'd rather see them come to play and lose 3-0 then bunker from minute 1 and lose 1-0. There were several times, starting in the first 5mins of the game, when our wingers were in our defensive third while their defense had possession in their half without a black shirt within 10 yards. That's uber-bunker. Embarassing. Even if, by some miracle, we managed to draw 0-0 and got through I'd still be embarassed.

Posted by: uranderson | October 3, 2007 1:48 AM | Report abuse

But yes, DC was beat by the superior team tonight. We can only hope that we put up a better fight in the future.

Posted by: brooklyn fan | October 3, 2007 1:48 AM | Report abuse

Why do people say we bunkered from the beginning? I don't think so...we wanted to go forward and did when we could hold the ball...we just couldn't hold it...Chivas took us out of our gameplan...they were better...plain and simple.

This should give us something to shoot for...we need speed, but speed with quality...we need to be able to stay on the ball and not be pushed off...and we need to not be intimidated...

Posted by: BillP | October 3, 2007 1:53 AM | Report abuse

CHIVAS!!!

We play like crap, the team is crap, the team is going nowhere, the owner is an ego-maniac ---> but we still beat DCU! =D

Posted by: Vic | October 3, 2007 5:38 AM | Report abuse

Vic,

You forgot to add:

The fans are tools who don't even show up when the tickets are free.

Posted by: Ash | October 3, 2007 6:30 AM | Report abuse

Shirt sponsor?

Posted by: Chang's Bald Head | October 3, 2007 8:26 AM | Report abuse

I'm not sure if it was the lack of Burch and Fred, the altitude or what but this wasn't the same quality team that played Chivas in RFK.

I though our defense and Perkins had a good game but our midfield couldn't hold the ball for more than a second. The goal by Chivas was pretty nice and I don't even know how Perkins saw the ball and knew where to dive. When they showed the shot from the goalie angle you could just barely see the player shooting.

I think we showed that we can play at their level but just not at their level in their country. However, the more games we play in Latin America the better it will be for our team.

Posted by: Southeasterner | October 3, 2007 8:35 AM | Report abuse

I'm not a DCU fan, but I'd like to say that they were not defeated by a better team. Rather, the team that wanted that particular game more was the winner. Chivas made tons of errors, but DCU practically never went on a high speed counter. They sent only 2-3 players forward for most of the game, then sat back to absorb the next Chivas attack. Not a good strategy, IMHO. Got to play to create chances. If not, the opposition will, on probability alone, get a goal. That's exactly what happened.

Posted by: Larry | October 3, 2007 9:04 AM | Report abuse

I hope that this is not something that tips the ownership toward a BIG Money DP - but more towards building out what has already been put in place with Emilio and Fred and hopefully we can shore up some weak areas through the draft and help acquire stars to learn for a spell under Gomez and Moreno and Olsen.

Posted by: Designated Player | October 3, 2007 9:16 AM | Report abuse

i miss player ratings....

Posted by: therealfan | October 3, 2007 9:36 AM | Report abuse

brooklyn fan wrote:
"I am not blaming MLS for promoting parity (well maybe a little bit due to emotions from this loss) but just pointing out that its top teams are going to find it harder to win if they continue to expand and continue to promote parity."

A rising tide lifts all boats - MLS needs to continue to spread the talent around and give all teams a reasonable shot, while also continuing to sell the league and grow futbol in the USA. As the overall quality of MLS play develops, our best sides (DCU among them) will get better, too, of course.

And then we will beat the crap out of the Goats. :-)

Posted by: KR in DC | October 3, 2007 9:45 AM | Report abuse

this was the worst game i've seen from moreno in a long time.

hopefully they can get this loss out of their heads before the KC game. at least there's nothing left to focus on other than the SS and Cup now.

Posted by: ugh | October 3, 2007 9:46 AM | Report abuse

I don't know how the team is going to get up to play in front of 6k in KC.

I totally agree with Brooklyn fan- the MLS needs super teams.

Posted by: DC | October 3, 2007 9:46 AM | Report abuse

I say rest the starters in KC, let the bench guys get in some much needed time in anticipation of the playoff push.

They'll be missing Conrad and some other guy I don't want to Google right now, so it's a good opportunity to have DeRoux let the pony gallop.

Posted by: Logan Circle | October 3, 2007 10:01 AM | Report abuse

yeah, I saw that same foul on Luchi and a few others that the ref let go either by totally ignoring them or playing advantage. We got screwed by those non-calls. But we also never countered at high speed. It's always a pass forward to Luci, who's foot is like a brick, and then hope he keeps it and gets it to someone else, that can in turn find... exactly... nobody running! Crushing defeat because they were not better...

Goff, you need to get a picture ASAP of a bald Chang!

Posted by: Soy United! | October 3, 2007 10:01 AM | Report abuse

Ash,

So what? Who gives a crap? They'll show up vs. Arsenal (or whomever else they have to play), you can watch those games on TV, HA!

Posted by: Vic | October 3, 2007 10:14 AM | Report abuse

a loss is what happens when you play for a tie. Dumb strategy against a good team. from what I saw DC had good short passes but failed to move the ball forward quickly and when it did the passes were intercepted. dissappointing game. Hopefully, the team will rebound and conitue to tear up the league...go DCU!!

Posted by: Anonymous | October 3, 2007 10:26 AM | Report abuse

Roster depth was an issue vs. Chivas. With Fred and Burch out, we couldn't effectively counter. Chivas's quality was evident but they were frustrated by our defense. Perkins was huge last night. The goal was fortunte for Chivas but showed that they are opportunistic and could punish on that one error. MLS/DCU at least has closed the gap vs. Mexican clubs - but lets face it, the top tier of their league is superior to ours; they have many high quality players. I bet the DCU payroll is a fraction of Chivas's. Vergara the Chivas owner is one of the richest men on earth!!! Great effort last night that fell just short.

Posted by: sbg | October 3, 2007 10:27 AM | Report abuse

The defeat was a blow. Hopefully not as serious in the spring but Soehn should have an excellent focus from here on out that he can get the club pointed toward. 3 games to wrap up the Supporters Shield.

Houston and Chivas play each other in their last 3 - meaning, at best only one of those teams can get 57 points.

New England plays two of the same opponents as DC (@Chicago, Columbus). So, if DC pick up a win on Friday on the road (good chances despite last night as Conrad and Arnaud are gone due to Red Card suspension).

New England plays 2 games on the Road - @Chicago and @ Toronto - you gotta imagine that the support for the home sides in both will be great (TFC trying to end year on a positive note).

Chivas has 2 road games @RSL and their turf and @FCD and away from HDC is where they actually lose.

I'm calling the magic number to be 57.

After we pull of the Supporters Shield which gets us into SuperLiga and CCC then we focus on winning 4 games enroute to the BIG GOLD STAR.

Posted by: Supporters Shield | October 3, 2007 10:34 AM | Report abuse

Away goals notwithstanding, we did play them to a draw in the series. That's gotta count for something, right (in terms of MLS getting closer to the level of Latin American teams)?

Too bad Christian's ball was just a foot too low. If it had gone in...

OK, I'm gonna stop thinking that... :-}

Posted by: Juan-John | October 3, 2007 10:39 AM | Report abuse

Posted by: RK | October 3, 2007 10:40 AM | Report abuse

Didn't MLS teams SPANK most of the Central American teams in the CCC last March? How in Hades can they be ranked higher?

Posted by: Juan-John | October 3, 2007 10:45 AM | Report abuse

DCU didn't lose the ball in the midfield due to tactics. They lost it because they had the foot-skills of a gang of lumberjacks in hob nail boots. We have no idea whether the tactics were effective or not; they totally lacked in execution from the forward 5. The back 5 had a decent match.

Watching the touch and technique of the Mexican teams reminds me of where MLS needs to improve in general. Give aways in MLS play are not as devastating, because the other team is likely to give it back. The Mexican teams we have seen so far have not been as generous.

That said, possession doesn't score goals. For all the Goats' possession, they had remarkably few good chances.

Posted by: JkR | October 3, 2007 10:46 AM | Report abuse

Goff, I'm pretty sure I saw the same foul on Emilio -- I remember yelling foul, but that was replaced by the "oh no" when I saw Simms dueling for the ball. Clyde has some speed and he can make some stops, but he's a giveaway waiting to happen if he has the ball under pressure. DCU narrowly escaped a Simms' giveaway a minute earlier, but the presure stayed on.

Ultimately, the strategy did them in. If they hadn't given the away goal advantage at RFK, the bunker would've made some sense. This way, it was ticking time bomb, waiting to go off in their faces -- the later it goes off, the worse it is, so you can't say it was looking good for 60 minutes. If you shut then out, you say it was lucky, and maybe that the strategy was effective, but you can't say the strategy won the game.

United showed they could attack against Chivas -- it's a shame they waited until the final 15 minutes to try.

Posted by: FischFry | October 3, 2007 10:54 AM | Report abuse

Maybe they are doing better in Libertadores and Sudamericana?

Posted by: RK | October 3, 2007 10:59 AM | Report abuse

Who even pays attention to the club and country rankings by the IFFHS, or whatever its called? As useless as the BCS if you ask me.

Posted by: Vic | October 3, 2007 11:04 AM | Report abuse

United showed they could attack against Chivas -- it's a shame they waited until the final 15 minutes to try.

Posted by: FischFry | October 3, 2007 10:54 AM


With all due respect, the only reason it looked better in the last 15 mins. was due to Chivas's subs and change of their own tactics.

We couldn't dictate tactics; we didn't have the ball. In order to switch from bunker to attack, you have to have the ball, and then KEEP it.

Posted by: Anonymous | October 3, 2007 11:06 AM | Report abuse

Very disheartening performance last night. We played not to lose rather than to win which is a perfect prescription for losing. It was a poor game plan and Soehn has to take the blame for it.

I thought Luciano had his poorest game of the season. He was largely invisible, perhaps because he got so little service in spots where he could do something.

The Carrol-Moreno substitution made no sense to me until the the Dyachenko-Boswell sub was later made. It was a 2-for-2 swap but then why not do them together rather than several minutes apart?

With Fred and Burch in the lineup things MIGHT have been different, but I doubt it, because it seemed the collective team mentality for this match was just plain wrong.

All that said - we did get an aggregate tie vs. a storied club and that is something to build on for future int'l competitions. The guys need to quickly shake off the result and get back to the main task at hand vs. Kansas City and I think they will...the lesson of the hangover after the last Chivas defeat should still be fresh in everyone's minds. Winning the league is always foremost and DC has a great chance at pulling off the double. Now is the time to get locked in.

Posted by: CMJHawk86 | October 3, 2007 11:16 AM | Report abuse

I think it is unfair to criticize Emilio for his performance last night. He is not the type of player to be left alone up front and try to beat people on the dribble.

He is an excellent striker, but he needs to get service in order to maximize his opportunities. The only real thing he can be criticized for last night, in my opinion, was when he did not get his one clear shot on frame somewhere during the last 10 minutes. Otherwise he was usually having to try and dribble around 2 Chivas defenders, which is obviously not his forte.

Posted by: tmc | October 3, 2007 11:24 AM | Report abuse

I continue to be shocked by posts decrying the tactics. Poor touch and careless passing is not a tactic. It was (lack of) execution and perhaps skill level that gave Chivas the ball, not tactics.

Had the skill been there to execute the tactics, then you can pick apart the game plan.

Posted by: JkR | October 3, 2007 11:34 AM | Report abuse

I thought the tactics were right but the team just came up a bit short. A little luck and it could have been a 0-0 tie. Especially without Fred in the lineup, I don't think we were in a position to go toe-to-toe with Chivas, which is clearly the more talented team.

Given the obvious talent gap between the two teams, I'm surprised that there's so much controversy here.

Posted by: Mitch | October 3, 2007 11:36 AM | Report abuse

ok game, Moreno the best first half, second half trash. Emilio needs to start scoring on international matches or go to Brazil to sell oranges on the corners. Why get mad, we kind of knew the outcome before hand....2-1 at home is like a loss.
Mediocre performance from a mediocre team...... what can we expect from this team internationally (NOTHING)......

Posted by: TRUTH | October 3, 2007 11:40 AM | Report abuse

Gotta agree with JkR's post. I stayed up to watch the game last night and was frustrated by poor technique not tactics. DCU is typically very good in possession, so I think you have to credit Chivas for not letting our team get comfortable at all. I was amazed at times to constantly see our midfielders pressured by 2 and 3 Chivas players immediately. They really gave us nothing!

Anyway, highly disappointed in the match, but still proud of DCU for making strides and representing MLS fairly well.

Posted by: jasonVA | October 3, 2007 11:41 AM | Report abuse

How is Moreno's ankle - Obviously he came out and played with it taped for the start of the second half, but perhaps it was contributing to his subpar performance

Posted by: emanon | October 3, 2007 11:46 AM | Report abuse

I just learned that Ben Olsen in Spanish translates to "Horseradish tree Olsen" in English (at least, according to babelfish).

Posted by: DE | October 3, 2007 11:49 AM | Report abuse

I'm not trying to make excuses or necessarily blame this for the loss... But I agree that it would definitely have been in our favor to have the second leg at home in DC. That could have changed the game in DC completely. How do they determine which team gets the second leg at home? Because we ALWAYS seem to be playing the second leg on the road. I can't think of a time that we had an international home-and-home series and the second leg was at RFK.

Posted by: Shatz | October 3, 2007 12:16 PM | Report abuse

IF THE GAME WAS SO IMPORTANT FOR YOU, WHY HAD NOT SAVED PLAYERS AGAINST TORONTO?


Campinas - São Paulo - Brasil

Posted by: CEU_CARMESIM | October 3, 2007 12:21 PM | Report abuse

"How do they determine which team gets the second leg at home? "

In the first stage the choice is made by drawing.


"I can't think of a time that we had an international home-and-home series and the second leg was at RFK."

Imagine if you are scored a goal yesterday?

Campinas - São Paulo - Brasil

Posted by: CEU_CARMESIM | October 3, 2007 12:30 PM | Report abuse

OK -- Just watched the goal on the rebroadcast. The play begins just shy of midfield, with Emilio on his knees, clutching his back with one hand and holding the other one up, appealing for a foul. Chivas plays it forward, starting the attack down the wing McTavish defends with a weak slide that only pushes the ball into a more central position. Simms also fails to clear the ball as it goes from one Chivas player to another -- Simms is late getting to the the next guy, and nearly fouls him as the pass goes in towards the center of the box. Olsen defends, knocking it away from the target and out of the box -- unfortunately it goes right to Morales, who blasts it for the goal.

Anyone here who says they saw the foul against Emilio is imagining things, myself included. The television was showing players in the United defensive half, as the possible foul was occurring near midfield. We only got to see the aftermath, with the announcer saying there is no foul -- meaning no foul called.

Posted by: FischFry | October 3, 2007 2:33 PM | Report abuse

Whatever they say now, they got the tactics all wrong and should be very disappointed in themselves and the coaching. They can't defend Chivas for 90 minutes and shouldn't have thought so -- they almost certainly needed to get a goal and they didn't attack enough.

Posted by: RB | October 3, 2007 3:23 PM | Report abuse

Whatever they say now, they got the tactics all wrong and should be very disappointed in themselves and the coaching. They can't defend Chivas for 90 minutes and shouldn't have thought so -- they almost certainly needed to get a goal and they didn't attack enough.

Posted by: RB | October 3, 2007 03:23 PM

Actually, other than a chance, fluke but gorgeous strike, they almost did defend Chivas for 90 mins. Had they had any sort of touch at all, it would have been a walk in the park. For all the possession Chivas had, they had few good chances. If Olsen buries that shot at 89', the tactics would have been superb...

Posted by: JkR | October 3, 2007 3:44 PM | Report abuse

Those who say that Chivas is "clearly" the superior side didn't watch the first half at RFK. We came to play in that game, and before the Burch dismissal we made them look like second best. This is not the Chivas of old, this was a very beatable team and we should've gone through. (And honestly, yeah I sound like a homer, but I believe we can play with any club in this hemisphere if we just play our game.)

As for inferior technical skills? My opinion is that the technical ability of Moreno, Gomez, Emilio or Fred is easily on par or better than anyone on that side. They were faster overall, yeah, but pace isn't everything. The problem in Guadalajara was that we set out to stall from the beginning. Perkins was time-wasting in minute 1! Dis. Grace. Ful.

Pyschology, or confidence, call it what you want, is a huge factor in soccer. When you play for long stretches without getting the ball, attacking and making positive things happen with it, you can lose confidence and your touch with it. I blame the poor technical display in Guadalajara directly on the tactics which never let us get into the game, mentally or physically.

Anybody who's followed this team with regularity should know how technically skilled it is, last night was the exception not the rule. And the really crazy part is that depite playing a man down for 45min, and playing like we didn't want to leave our half for 65min, we still ended up tying them 2-2 over 180min. I don't see how they were so clearly superior.

Posted by: uranderson | October 3, 2007 3:57 PM | Report abuse

JkR:

No... Chivas had a number of good chances and were about 2 passes from scoring for the entire game. It was a matter of time given the choice in tactics. If it had worked out, it would still have been bad tactics -- though I would have been happy!

Posted by: RB | October 3, 2007 9:28 PM | Report abuse

I don't see why most of the fans of DC united are crying about... Have you ever had a win in a meaningful competition? To be more specific: outside the U.S. to a major club?
Boca juniors, Sao Paulo, River plate, or at least playing the semifinal or final of sudamericana or libertadores cup's.
Come on! wake up! Chivas has been in the last 3 years twice in semifinals of libertadores and 1 time quaterfinals. They beat boca 4-0 at home and scoreless at the bombonera in buenos aires and had played in the Morumbi(sao paulo house) twice. When you reach libertadores semifinals twice or at least the semifinals in sudamericana cup you can say that DC is at the same level than chivas. For your learning experience take a few minutes and watch the highlites of some sudamericana or libertadores matches in bombonera or Morumbi and tell me if your "boys" can match up to that. Don't think so!!

Posted by: SL | October 4, 2007 3:39 PM | Report abuse

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