Network News

X My Profile
View More Activity
On Twitter: SoccerInsider and PostSports  |  Facebook  |  Sports e-mail alerts  |  RSS

United Kickaround

Two D.C. United stadium stories prominently displayed at the top of the Post's Metro section in Thursday's editions:

A look at what went wrong with the D.C. negotiations and what went right in Prince George's County.

Columnist Marc Fisher -- gasp! -- thinks it's a bad move for everyone.

Meanwhile, former DCU midfielder Quavas Kirk, who didn't pan out with Seattle at training camp, has signed with the USL1's Minnesota Thunder. Ex-United forward Nicholas Addlery has moved from Vancouver to Puerto Rico.

With United in PR and a break in my college basketball schedule, I am going to try to take the day off -- well, at least until the first breaking news surfaces. You should know that MLS is close to naming the venue for the championship game (Seattle is the favorite) and is making strides on the All-Star Game opponent (Inter Milan is in the mix). You should also know that Seattle signed Colombian central defender Jhon Kennedy Hurtado, 24. He recently completed a trial with AC Milan and played in a friendly against Hanover.

Feel free to discuss any soccer matters in this thread.

By Steve Goff  |  February 18, 2009; 11:35 PM ET
Categories:  D.C. United , MLS  
Save & Share:  Send E-mail   Facebook   Twitter   Digg   Yahoo Buzz   Del.icio.us   StumbleUpon   Technorati   Google Buzz   Previous: Americans Abroad, Wed. Edition
Next: DCU Roster Update

Comments

A pretty balanced story from Nakamura although you'd think McFarland hasn't made a good investment in two years from his story. I won't even click on Fisher anymore.

Posted by: mbyrd28 | February 18, 2009 11:49 PM | Report abuse

How much for McFarlane's 20,000 sq foot penthouse?

And will he be able to refinance under the Obama plan?

Posted by: delantero | February 18, 2009 11:52 PM | Report abuse

I'm terribly disappointed that my mile 20 Marine Corps Marathon appeal to "build a DC United Stadium" to Mr. Fenty went unheeded.

But at least I beat him!

Posted by: delantero | February 18, 2009 11:56 PM | Report abuse

Fenty actually forbade Clark from talking to DC United about Poplar Point!

Posted by: PindarPushkin | February 19, 2009 12:16 AM | Report abuse

If Inter is the opponent for the ASG, I may actually be excited for it. I can only think of a few other teams that would attract more interest from the hardcore soccer fans (The Big 4, Madrid, Barca, and Milan)

Posted by: carmines757 | February 19, 2009 1:00 AM | Report abuse

Steve - as always, thanks for all of your hard work and excellent coverage. It's amazing to me the same publication can employ someone as good as you and as ridiculous as Fisher.

Posted by: Pedalada | February 19, 2009 1:40 AM | Report abuse

Well, Fisher's column ought to be "end of story" on Virginians who rip United for moving to PG, betraying their loyal NoVA fan base. Fischer makes clear that PG was not Plan B, but Plan C. Perhaps instead of directing their venom exclusively at United and DC officials, they might fault their own political leaders who never reciprocated United's interest in relocating there.

OF course, Fisher's column suffers from its own faulty logic. He notes that PG is a lousy location for United because of a "demographic mismatch". However, what was the alternative. Even if we put aside the revelations in the article by "the Nakumura" -- that Fenty went out of his way to signal his intention to block a DC soccer stadium (in Poplar Point, anyway) -- what would be the alternative for United?

As Fisher notes, Virginia officials were not interested in having a stadium there. So, if we assume that Poplar Point was the only "realistic" alternative, how would that be a significant improvement for the team? The "demographic mismatch" is even more pronounced in that section of Anacostia.

Of course, United's fans were never limited to a five-mile radius around RFK, so it's a bit silly to speak of PG's demographics. So long as United's fans can ride a few more stops on the Metro, or drive another five miles, it's an irrelevant issue. United was always going to have a fan base that commuted to games. Now, PG will serve as a new destination point for those fans.

Lastly, I had thought that United might still be merely upping the ante in a poler game with the city. The Nakamura's story. makes it clear that Mayor Fenty is glad to be rid of this political albatross.

Fisher is right about one thing -- the PG solution is not the best resolution. PG may benefit from the heightened exposure. In Poplar Point, the stadium would have added to the diversity of planned development. That's gone, and one has to wonder what's really left of the Poplar Point project. If Fenty had agreed to MacFarlane's plan, United would already have broken ground, and the neighborhood would have begun a revitalization that is much-needed. Without it, the plan for the area around the Half St. baseball park will never be fully realized, either. Not many people want to live so close to troubled Anacostia. Neither side of the river will grow much until and unless they grow together. I didn't want the stadium there because I thought it would be great for United. I thought it would be good for the city. Now, that appears to be lost, and United, smartly, has moved on.

Posted by: fischy | February 19, 2009 1:44 AM | Report abuse

Weird how demographics and crime rates relate, isn't it?

Posted by: BrownShirtGeorge | February 19, 2009 5:33 AM | Report abuse

Fisher is a jerk, but he's right about Virginians not heading to PG County to watch more than a handful of matches. DC United's biggest fanbase will need to be replaced.

Posted by: Hoost | February 19, 2009 6:53 AM | Report abuse

For a minute there, I could have sworn McFarlane had a 20,000 SEAT condo, not a 20,000 square FEET condo. Must be just my stadium pipe dreams...

Posted by: crs2 | February 19, 2009 6:54 AM | Report abuse

Couldn't Fisher's bizarre demographic mismatch and security concerns about PG County also have been applied to the Anacostia location?

Probably would have been. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if he just took out and dusted off an old opinion piece he had prepared earlier for a United stadium at Poplar Point.

What will be interesting is whether this is a one-time event at The Post or the beginning of a series of stadium-skeptic articles and opinion pieces.

More importantly, what are the Maryland media saying about this?

Posted by: seahawkdad | February 19, 2009 7:09 AM | Report abuse

I won't even click on Fisher anymore.

Posted by: mbyrd28 | February 18, 2009 11:49 PM
_______________________________
I'm afraid I couldn't help myself, just from the train-wreck-fascination aspect of it. I found it interesting that comments were running about 25-1 against Fisher's viewpoint. Of course, if logic and reason won't stop him, neither will the preponderance of public opinion, so I don't look for him to stop hatin' on DC United any time soon...

Posted by: schmuckatelli | February 19, 2009 7:51 AM | Report abuse

I think that there’s a fundamental misunderstanding about the Popular Point situation here. There are a number of steps that need to be done before any development could begin. First and foremost, the land has to be transferred from the Federal Government to the District. Before that can occur two things have to be completed: an environmental impact statement and the District coming up with a suitable location to transfer the Park Service facilities on the parcel which includes a heliport. As far as I know, the EIS will take another year and the District has no idea where it can locate the Park Service facilities.

Then Congress will have to pass legislation approving the transfer. That might end up being harder then people have been led to believe.

Now assuming Clark had the complete go ahead to begin construction, and assuming no serious environmental remediation is necessary (which no one is assuming) a completed stadium would likely be in the 2014 range – if then. We’d be looking at a 2012 stadium if the project had been green lighted five years ago.

Posted by: congguy | February 19, 2009 7:58 AM | Report abuse

Like mbyrd28, I won't give Fisher's article the web traffic, but I did read it at home this morning.

Meh. You'd think he'd be happy that Poplar Point won't see a shovel for 10 years. Instead, he can still pretend that it's a bucolic refuge for, um, somebody. The residents of Ward 8 are to busy commuting for groceries and hardware and jobs to spend much time kicking around the abandoned buildings and broken asphalt along the flotsam-and-jetsam-clotted waterfront there... He never could wrap his mind around the fact that 70 of the 110 acres at Poplar Point were to be parkland/open space.

Again, this is all on Fenty, who's been playing a political game in the face of the facts of this deal. This is NOT the MLB he railed against before he was Mayor, though he consistently and deliberately framed it in that context. The City was being asked for infrastructure cost (which Clark had pegged at near $300 million before backing out) while McFarlane was putting up $200 million for the stadium/hotel anchor to the development. He needs a paying customer in RFK (so the land does not revert to the US Government) while he tries to lure Dan Snyder back inside the District Line. It's a delicate game he's playing, having to bide his time between City-financed stadium projects, and any support has to be held for the beloved juggernaut that is the local NFL franchise.

So thank you, Prince Georges County, for keeping DC United here instead of St. Louis. I can't wait for opening day 2012. Trusty's Full Serve is the only place in the District that may get my game-day money now, as I stop off on the way to PG County via Metro from Shady Grove.

Posted by: StevanF | February 19, 2009 8:09 AM | Report abuse

What a tired, recycled column from Fisher.

1. His argument about demographics (ie: PG is mostly black--gasp! and most of DCU attendees are white and hispanic--so they won't come) is also true for RFK. It's also true for FedEx field--I guess that's why they have so many empty seats there. This is a very lame argument.

2. The independent economic assessment on the payoff of the stadium assumes only about 60 occupancy dates. But Fisher argues "only 60 events--empty about 300 days" as if the study didn't account for that.

3. Who's building right now? I have two cousins who are developers, a good friend who owns a construction firm, my wife works in a firm that partners with tradesmen/construction types. Isn't the whole idea of the STIMULUS package that--with the economy in the toilet, it was necessary for govt. to step up and spend money on some works project to minimize layoffs, keep tax revenue going? By letting Clark have Poplar Point, once the economy went south, they (Clark) were talking about not building for 8-10 years (until the market rebounded). Who's going to build office parks, condos, shops when demand is down, it's hard to get loans? DC United is one of the commercial businesses that's in a HURRY to build, that does not have an encentive to delay or wait until the market gets better. By Fisher's take, the entire stimulus package is a waste to American tax payers.

4. As for Virginia, I believe that the deal is that PRE-Poplar point, Payne and Co. commissioned a couple of studies in Virginia, located two sites. But the biggest issues were community restrictions (on the amount of traffic going in and out after hours, lights at night, crowd noise, number of events, ability to have youth games and events at the site). I never got the sense that Fairfax and Loudon County Govt was anywhere as bad as DC, just the Virginia residents (and yes, I live in Va.) were the obstacle. And then the sites were developed for other purposes. And I believe they were very far out.

So I can live (and be happy) with a PG site.

Posted by: JoeW1 | February 19, 2009 8:37 AM | Report abuse

Fisher is a jerk, but he's right about Virginians not heading to PG County to watch more than a handful of matches. DC United's biggest fanbase will need to be replaced.

Posted by: Hoost | February 19, 2009 6:53 AM

---------------------------------------------

Only because of their own egos and petty grievances. People come from places much further out than the Northern Virginia snobs already.

Too bad you and your friends are too in love with yourself to actually go out and experience life beyond your silly protective bubble. You won't be missed.

Posted by: beach3 | February 19, 2009 8:46 AM | Report abuse

The sad thing about Fisher's article is that it's boring. There's nothing new in what he's saying. He's someone who is anti-stadiums. That's it. If he were to have it his way, there would be no stadiums anywhere. It's just a boring opinion and a boring article.

Posted by: TCompton | February 19, 2009 9:01 AM | Report abuse

Only because of their own egos and petty grievances. People come from places much further out than the Northern Virginia snobs already.

Too bad you and your friends are too in love with yourself to actually go out and experience life beyond your silly protective bubble. You won't be missed.

Posted by: beach3 | February 19, 2009 8:46 AM

Since when does a person have to go to every single game to be a big fan? The attitude of some of you people in MD is pretty wretched. Let people from NoVA mourn, come 2012 they'll be there, maybe not as much as before but they'll be there.

Besides wehre does it say you have to be a season ticket holder to be a 'real fan'? There's other ways to support the team, and the emotional attachment has nothing to do if you're in the stadium.

There's people who live and die with United games who because of circumstances or distance can't make it to games, and then there's people who stand in the Barra who give a jack about the game but are just there to get wasted and be a part of the party.

Heck some of the biggest Skins fans I know, don't have season tickets and probably never will. I also know a few people who have season tickets but aren't even really Redskins fans.

So get off your high horse and just support United in the way you know how and let others support it in their own way and if it means going to only a few games a year, so be it.

But don't trash talk VA, if we pulled an "Its a Wonderful Life" and NoVA fans didn't show up you're talking only 8K fans and the BB,SE,LN would all take huge hits as well. You may sit very smug right now but if roles reversed and the stadium was in Springfield you'd probably be complaining right now too. So have some consideration and let it be.

Posted by: mcontento | February 19, 2009 9:12 AM | Report abuse

Only because of their own egos and petty grievances. People come from places much further out than the Northern Virginia snobs already.

Too bad you and your friends are too in love with yourself to actually go out and experience life beyond your silly protective bubble. You won't be missed.

Posted by: beach3 | February 19, 2009 8:46 AM

Our money will be missed. So don't worry about it, you'll have plenty of room to stretch out in the stadium. If, of course, it ever gets built.

Posted by: Hoost | February 19, 2009 9:13 AM | Report abuse

Does Garber's "vacation" to Spain play into the All-Star mix? Barcelona, maybe?

Posted by: roadkit | February 19, 2009 9:21 AM | Report abuse

Beach, you're a fool. A former NOVA resident, I moved/lived in DC long before "gentrification" but moved out because taxes, schools and services ARE horrible. But you're right as the only white guy for three blocks around New Jersey Ave . . my bubble was pretty protective. You are an ignorant jerk.
>>>>
yourself to actually go out and experience life beyond your silly protective bubble. You won't be missed.

Posted by: beach3 | February 19, 2009 8:46 AM

Posted by: delantero | February 19, 2009 9:24 AM | Report abuse

Our money will be missed. So don't worry about it, you'll have plenty of room to stretch out in the stadium. If, of course, it ever gets built.

Posted by: Hoost | February 19, 2009 9:13 AM

Betting on schadenfreude? Have fun with that. I'm banking on a stronger United, having a higher season ticket base in a new, appropriately sized stadium inside the Beltway.

Posted by: Kev29 | February 19, 2009 9:24 AM | Report abuse

Look - we all know I loathe Maryland. Pretty much everything about it (save Annapolis, which really the Commonwealth should see if we can annex - kidding).

However, I can forsee some trouble getting to all games if my schedule is busy. BUT - if all games at home, or 90% of them, are played on Friday, Saturday, Sunday - that's less of an issue. The BIG issue is weeknight games - Thursday's, Champions League, SuperLiga, etc. I love those games and wish they got the attendance they deserve - but suburban stadium with an extra 30 minute round-trip schedule is going to be a tough evaluation.

HOWEVER - I have more resolve than ever to help this endeavor succeed - at least on United's books. Fenty telling Clark that an Anchor on their HUGE and RISKY development is someone they can't talk to is petty and retarded. If he is so blind and anti-stadium, kick the Nationals out - turn off the lights on Opening Night. And then for all of these people to say that the demographics don't line up is ridiculous too. I've been to West Baltimore - I can handle anything. And PG County Stadium will have plenty of security for fans.

Let this be a rallying cry for the CLUB - prove Fenty and Fishcer idiots. Prove that DC let the World's game leave the Nation's capital and make them regret it for decades. Washington Redskins level regret!

Fellow Commonwealth residents, scrape what you can out of your schedule. If you downgrade from full season to half season - still go. You don't have to support Maryland but you have to prove these fools that they are as short-sighted as possible for not even attempting to play nice with United.

And to the residents of Ward 8, I feel sorry for you - Poplar Point will remain a park forever - your city leaders have let you down.

VBB - Sic Semper Tyrannis

Posted by: VirginiaBlueBlood | February 19, 2009 9:25 AM | Report abuse

""Well, Fisher's column ought to be "end of story" on Virginians who rip United for moving to PG, betraying their loyal NoVA fan base. Fischer makes clear that PG was not Plan B, but Plan C""

A) How's PG County feel being the third choice for the prom?

B) As far as the end of the story regarding NOVA . . . I'm not really sure Fischer/Nakamura made anything really clear about DC United's efforts to avoid PG County. Would like to have seen some more detail from those "DC executives."

C) As far as our political leaders . . if we had been given some public notice that United wanted a stadium somewhere in Crystal CIty, etc, maybe we could have gotten some community support going . . but SEE (B)

Posted by: delantero | February 19, 2009 9:29 AM | Report abuse

The sad thing about Fisher's article is that it's boring. There's nothing new in what he's saying. He's someone who is anti-stadiums. That's it. If he were to have it his way, there would be no stadiums anywhere. It's just a boring opinion and a boring article.

Posted by: TCompton | February 19, 2009 9:01 AM

Not anti-stadium, anti-soccer stadium. He would have beat his own mother for $20 if thats what it would have taken to build the Nats stadium.

Fisher has made it no secret that he hates soccer which makes it even more amazing that the Post is letting him publish "factual" articles on the subject.

I can't believe the same company employs Fischer and Goff.

Posted by: Southeasterner | February 19, 2009 9:30 AM | Report abuse

Jeez, don't feed to troll people! Fisher writes this drivel because he knows all those soccer nuts will come out of the woodwork and create traffic for his stupid opinions. Just ignore him. I don't agree he is anti-stadium. He was a big booster of the baseball stadium because he likes baseball. That's what makes him so predictable. Has anyone seen much development around THAT stadium that wasn't already in the works before the stadium? All of those condo projects were already happening.

I would imagine that without the DC United project there would be NOTHING at all happening on those empty plots in PG.

I am also bemused by all of this back and forth about whether the NoVA fans will go to PG. I am willing to bet that most of us will. Once people actually realize how little extra distance is involved they will be there. Like KP said yesterday, people are afraid of change.

Posted by: fedssocr | February 19, 2009 9:36 AM | Report abuse

"I am also bemused by all of this back and forth about whether the NoVA fans will go to PG. I am willing to bet that most of us will"

I will, sure, but forget weeknight games and forget all those friendlies against out of shape Euro clubs, and those early season matches against Joe Public in the cold rain-- where I have been for 13 years.

PG County, despite everyone's insistence that's it's only a few more minutes is not. In DC traffic land, a few more minutes can easily stretch to an hour or more.

Posted by: delantero | February 19, 2009 9:47 AM | Report abuse

Virginians, Marylanders, we are all United fans. Don't let Fisher get under your skin. Steve's poll is just as good as any:
49% attend the same number of games
29% attend fewer
21% attend more

Posted by: I-270Exit1 | February 19, 2009 9:49 AM | Report abuse

As a fringe Northern Virginian, in western Loudoun - I still plan on going to all the games. I would go to all the games anywhere within 3 hours drive. I'll just need to make sure I have a job where it's no big deal to leave at 2:30 for weeknight games - just like now. And if not, that's why god made vacation days :-)
We'll all figure out how to drive a different way to a new stadium once we get over the shock of the idea - and quite happily drop some cash in PG County establishments near the stadium (or at least the stadium store) in a few years.

I loved that United tried its hardest to be a part of Ward 8 revitalization. I'm upset at Fenty for being so petty and shortsighted - the residents of Ward 8 should be even more disappointed in him, but sadly they are probably used to being treated so poorly. So I am disappointed I will not get to spend my money in Ward 8, but hey some PG County areas need an influx of money just as much.

Can't wait to watch the stadium-cam next year as the stadium goes up :-D

Enjoy your day off, Goff.

Posted by: dcufan | February 19, 2009 9:49 AM | Report abuse

"Colombian defender Jhon Kennedy Hurtado has signed to play with the expansion Seattle Sounders FC. Hurtado, 24, played the 2008 season for Deportivo Cali where he was a teammate of Sounders' forward Fredy Montero . . . . "
========================

Montero introducing Hurtado in locker room: “Jou wanna f*** with me? Okay. Jou wanna play rough? Okay. Say hello to my little friend!”

Kasey Keller: "I knew Jhon Kennedy. I played with Jhon Kennedy in 1962. Jhon Kennedy was a friend of mine. Hurtado, you are no Jhon Kennedy."

Posted by: OWNTF | February 19, 2009 10:01 AM | Report abuse

Sounds like Seattle will be off to a good start. Where was D.C. in relations to going after Hurtado? Why are WE not trolling the AC Milan rejects?

Posted by: alan19 | February 19, 2009 10:03 AM | Report abuse

I think delantero has it just about right re: NoVa DCU fans; most of us will still attend games, just not as often, and predominantly on weekends. Navigating that extra four miles, as the crow flies, would be no big deal, but on the Beltway during rush hour, in a minivan full of youth soccer players or a car full of fellow BB/SE members? That's pretty beat. I remember trying to get to the old Cap Centre for weeknight Caps games back in the 90's, and I have no desire to do that again.

Having said that, I fully understand that DCU NEEDED to do something to ameliorate their current situation. RFK may be OUR dump but it's still a dump and they can't keep hemorrhaging money at the rate they are now. The DC gov't screwed the pooch with Poplar Point, and face it, Virginia was NEVER a viable alternative. Remember, JKC tried to move the 'Skins to Potomac Yards before he ended up in PC County, and that got shot down. Likewise, Virginia Baseball was the standard bearer for DC baseball for a DECADE before anyone else even cared about moving a team here, and they couldn't get a stadium built in VA either. The NIMBY types and the gov't in VA just aren't going to support ANY sports stadia.

So let's all agree to support DC United's efforts to build a world-class stadium, even if it isn't as convenient as we'd like. Hopefully they'll be showing HD broadcasts of all the games by the time it opens, and we won't still be getting bumped for 'Skins preseason scrimmages.

Posted by: jburksva | February 19, 2009 10:12 AM | Report abuse

This northern Virginian season-ticket holder will be at every weekend game, every league weeknight game, and every meaningful weeknight cup game. So basically, same as RFK -- but with cleaner ladies' rooms.

Posted by: BlackandRedRedDevil | February 19, 2009 10:19 AM | Report abuse

@Beach: Just a suggestion but maybe a little less of the stereoptypical rhetoric... How about the fact that people have limited resources (time is a resource) and may not want to schlep "all of the way" out to PG?

I can tell you straight up--I have never had any "cred" and never will-so I don't worry about it: If United or the Nats went to Loudon I would have only made maybe two United games a year (instead of nine or ten) and zippy Nats games (instead on one a year). Why? Has nothing to do with my "protective bubble" here in P freaking G; It has everything to do with it is just too freaking far. Like me going to Nissan Pavillion--It ain't gonna happen (unless your act is named Steely Dan--more melancholy than Morrisey I will have you know). It is just not convienent. Heck if United moved to Fair Oaks, it would have been the same.

All I'm saying is that the "bubble thing" was over the top. Some people just don't want to travel that far and it doesn't have zippy to do with the being "hardcore" or "gritty" or "urban hipsters" or "isolationists" or any freaking bubble that you might perceive.

Not trying to pile on, just saying that the "hipster"/"socially exposed" false god of diversity litmus test is less relevant than "do I really feel like be on the road car for almost 2 hours both ways" litmus test.

The new stadium has to have a Metro stop. That is a must. No Fedex shcuttle setups.

Maximun Respect, Playa.

Posted by: yankiboy | February 19, 2009 10:21 AM | Report abuse

Fisher's demographics theory came off as weak considering thr history of FedEx and the Captial Center which admittedly needed to be replaced but could still draw people from outside of PG (PG was already "Black" then).

Also, he forgets that we do have a significant Hispanic population in PG (some of them even live at my house and carry my last name they will go to games-gasp), and neighboring MoCo (who were already travelling far) and the District.

Overly simplistic to the point of being lazy.

Posted by: yankiboy | February 19, 2009 10:23 AM | Report abuse

Fisher seems to say that bonds will pay for 100% of the stadium now, and DCU will eventually reimburse 25% of that; I thought the deal was that DCU/MacF pays 25% now, then eventually reimburses the other 75%, which is raised through bonds. Maybe I'm wrong on both counts -- is the deal known?

Posted by: fallschurch1 | February 19, 2009 10:32 AM | Report abuse

Steven...any word on what the new United kits for 09/10 are looking like?

Posted by: moke26 | February 19, 2009 10:33 AM | Report abuse

Fisher seems to say that bonds will pay for 100% of the stadium now, and DCU will eventually reimburse 25% of that; I thought the deal was that DCU/MacF pays 25% now, then eventually reimburses the other 75%, which is raised through bonds. Maybe I'm wrong on both counts -- is the deal known?

Posted by: fallschurch1 | February 19, 2009 10:32 AM
___________________________________________
MD backed bonds pay 100% now; DCU rent pays back 25% over time and 75% paid via tax on revenue (tix, parking, beers, etc.) First bond payments aren't due until 2014 i.e. after it's built and making money.

Posted by: buck-bass-goal | February 19, 2009 10:42 AM | Report abuse

For United, the kits will be the same.

A few other teams (but not all) are getting new ones that can be seen in the MLS and Big Soccer online stores.

Posted by: Palin-McCain2012 | February 19, 2009 10:48 AM | Report abuse

Yes, that is the question for the Maryland politicians and taxpayers -- who will buy these bonds? Will their issuance harm the state's rating? That the only supporting economic analysis comes from Franchot is not comforting to say the least. This thing is a long way from done.

Posted by: OWNTF | February 19, 2009 10:49 AM | Report abuse

Steve,

Why is a soccer hating jerk like Fisher writing a column about the stadium and why is the Post promoting it. I understand freedom of the press but his headline is a complete distortion of the facts and is creating an unnecessary stir amongst the taxpayers of PG County. Further, his column altogether skirts around the payment of the stadium. It's as if he is trying to create a movement by himself. Please help me to understand the Post's editors decision on this one.

Posted by: croftonpost | February 19, 2009 10:54 AM | Report abuse

RE::There's people who live and die with United games who because of circumstances or distance can't make it to games, and then there's people who stand in the Barra who give a jack about the game but are just there to get wasted and be a part of the party.

Hey mcontento, so you think pople in the Barra only go to games to get wasted huh? well you are an IDIOT.. what knowledge do you have of the group? Do you have any idea what kind of people we have in the group? Those kind of comments make me sick and one again allow me to say !!YOU ARE AN IDIOT!!

Posted by: ThE-BaRRa-BrAvA-KiD | February 19, 2009 10:57 AM | Report abuse

PG County, despite everyone's insistence that's it's only a few more minutes is not. In DC traffic land, a few more minutes can easily stretch to an hour or more.

Posted by: delantero | February 19, 2009 9:47 AM
-------------------------------------------

Let this be the final word on this subject. For all those Virginians that love the drive to RFK, but wouldn't want tofind a way to drive 5 miles over the East Capitol Bridge -- I have a solution:

Drive to RFK. Park somewhere in the neighborhood. Get on the Metro. It's a 12 minute ride to Morgan Blvd. Even if you have to wait for a train it's no more than a half-hour. You don't have to worry about taking an additional hour to get to the new stadium.

Heck, maybe you talk United into working out something like the Nationals do, with the buses from RFK....

Posted by: fischy | February 19, 2009 10:58 AM | Report abuse

Seriously -- I don't know about the lease terms for RFK and the feds, but maybe Fenty could lease use of the lots to United and the Nationals and hold on to the land until the Redskins new stadium deal is nailed down?

Posted by: fischy | February 19, 2009 11:07 AM | Report abuse

I'm a bit mystified by the complaints of Virginians. I live in Maryland, but not near any of the mentioned sites for the stadium. I've taken the Metro to Morgan Boulevard for Redskin games, which is just as easy/difficult as going by Metro to many places in Virginia. The same could be said of driving to get there.

I just do not see this decision as a win for Maryland fans over Virginia fans.

Posted by: Rhio | February 19, 2009 11:17 AM | Report abuse

I can't wait for DC United to have it's own stadium. It sucks that the District wouldn't work with United to get the stadium built, but what can you expect from a city that burned by MLB... again.

After all, DC United and the City were working together pretty well up till a point when MLB came back into town like an ex-boyfriend and wooed the City back by dreams of America's past-time.

The city gets burned in the end and is afraid to start up another relationship knowing that they've got so much work to do already (schools, infrastructure, crime, etc.)

Whenever (and where ever) DC United's new home is built, location won't be the reason I will stop attending. That blame will most likely be economics... Will I be able afford to go to games?

Posted by: TCompton | February 19, 2009 11:17 AM | Report abuse

Am I reading the Nakamura article right to imply that MacFarlane essentially bought United for the purpose of worming his way into the Poplar Point development?

@OWNTF, another classic.

Posted by: benonthehill | February 19, 2009 11:32 AM | Report abuse

I haven't heard much of a mention of the US Open games DCU already hosts regularly at the soccerplex, and that place is such a pain to get to (even when I'm in MD) that the games might as well be in Baltimore. People didn't seem to cry bloody murder when these games were scheduled.

DCU will be have to be very savy in marketing midweek games, which as someone said is not much different from the situation at RFK right now (The US Open game against NE was embarassingly underattended).

Posted by: M__N | February 19, 2009 11:36 AM | Report abuse

I read Fisher's story. And I want a new stadium just as bad as the next guy. And, I do live in Loudoun. And, sadly to say, I agree with Fisher's assertions. It's a bad idea to go to PG County... period!

Posted by: SoyUnited | February 19, 2009 11:37 AM | Report abuse

As much as I hate the new stadium being in the burbs -- especially Maryland -- there was just no viable site in Virginia.

Loundon County would've been just awful. Worse than Pizza the Hut Park.

Posted by: Reignking | February 19, 2009 11:45 AM | Report abuse

While, I respect people's right to live in Loudon County, Nissan Pavillion (and really Merriweather too) are ample proof that there should never ever ever be a venue which is that far out and so dependant on cars. (Yes, Nissan is in PW county but still).

Here's a thought from a different side, if they don't put the stadium on a metro line, they will lose a chunk of different customer base, because there's zero change I'm going to a weekday game without getting there by metro.

Posted by: M__N | February 19, 2009 11:56 AM | Report abuse

Hey mcontento, so you think pople in the Barra only go to games to get wasted huh? well you are an IDIOT.. what knowledge do you have of the group? Do you have any idea what kind of people we have in the group? Those kind of comments make me sick and one again allow me to say !!YOU ARE AN IDIOT!!
-TheBarraBravaKid
----
As a long time BB member, that guy was right. It's become a place to be seen and party rather than a place to watch games with fellow supporters.
Last season was my last as a BB member, sadly.
I suspect you haven't been around long enough to have seen how it once was.
The decline has been sad to watch. Membership may have increased, but support for the team has decreased.
Not to say there aren't still a lot of passionate fans in BB, I know those names and faces.

Posted by: bs2004 | February 19, 2009 12:32 PM | Report abuse

bs2004..

I can agree to some of what you are saying ...you will find people like that everywhere.. and about being there long enough i been there from the start 96' im Oscars Son .. you can see how i am involved since th beggining ! but it is very unfair to say that people only go to get wasted.. because you being a long time member(sad to see you go) know that there is still support for the team i dont think that support has decreased at all .. thanks for the comment!

Posted by: ThE-BaRRa-BrAvA-KiD | February 19, 2009 12:40 PM | Report abuse

Wow, what a train wreck. And, it's really vital to learn that Fenty forbade Clark Reality from talking with D.C. United. So, from the date that Fenty was elected apparently United never had a chance. I'll always remember Fenty standing up at RFK before a game in late October just before the election, receiving a United jersey and promising us a new stadium. Dirtball.

While I don't much like the idea of a stadium located in Largo, Bowie or Landover, it'll be much better than a stadium located in East St. Louis -- and I think that the bottom line really was that United will move if the P.G. County deal falls through. Heck, at this point, they could rename the team P.G. United for all I care about being reminded of all the time and effort wasted on Poplar Point in the District. Good riddance, Fenty.

Posted by: Stevenho | February 19, 2009 12:41 PM | Report abuse

so is it too late for Quavas to take his GenAd scholarship money? this doesn't seem to be working out for him, unfortunately.

Posted by: joshuaostevens | February 19, 2009 1:00 PM | Report abuse

Hmm, Fisher talking about pro Lacrosse matches at the new stadium.

Did any DCU or PG officials even mention that? I'm not doubting it, but I don't recall seeing it RECENTLY, until Fisher's chat today.

If you add in amateur (HS and NCAA) lacrosse into the mix, that could be a lot of dates. For tournaments, you'd need some serious eatery's to handle teams and their hangers on.

I know for youth soccer tournaments that eateries within 5 miles of the fields were overrun on tournament days.

Posted by: JkR- | February 19, 2009 1:16 PM | Report abuse

I can agree to some of what you are saying ...you will find people like that everywhere.. and about being there long enough i been there from the start 96' im Oscars Son .. you can see how i am involved since th beggining ! but it is very unfair to say that people only go to get wasted.. because you being a long time member(sad to see you go) know that there is still support for the team i dont think that support has decreased at all .. thanks for the comment!
TheBarraBravaKid
----
I will always appreciate the good experiences I had back in the day and the memories will last.
I'm always happy to see the torch for DCU being carried by the younger generation. DCU deserves nothing less than the best fans in the league.
I hold no ill will towards BB, I just haven't enjoyed the direction it's taken in the past couple of years.

None of this is neither here nor there with the topic at hand. I'll consider going back to Supporters Groups at this fine new stadium (regardless of location). I'll have to see how the atmosphere is once we move in.

Posted by: bs2004 | February 19, 2009 1:23 PM | Report abuse

What is heartening to me is that I only saw one negative comment in Fisher's chat coming from a PG resident. That's just amazing.

Maybe that lack of pitchfork and torches reaction will cause aspiring journalists to look elsewhere for a story.

Posted by: seahawkdad | February 19, 2009 1:36 PM | Report abuse

fischy:

I think the argument persists because common-sense solutions or facts are being ignored by the people that post on every single thread about how miserable they are about the potential move and how they'll never be able to make a game again. You could offer to drive them to every game and buy them beers, and they'd still have the same complaints.

M_N:

Frankly, as a former PG resident, those USOC games at the Soccerplex would have been more convenient in Baltimore...maybe even in Towson. However, I think your memory is off; I remember a running complaint about 270 (the road, not the SI regular) that went on for about a week after every USOC game.

***

The Nakamura article's revelation that Fenty wouldn't allow Clark and DCU to talk reveals the depths Fenty would go to to keep us out of a new stadium in the District. If he had been overcome, I can easily picture him trying to sabotage construction of the stadium at night. Maybe he's a runner because he got cut from a soccer team in his youth.

Fisher would write an article against DCU having a stadium anywhere. We could build it on Mars, and he'd cite the same easily dismissed arguments. The sad thing is that his editors will print them all. On this topic, Fisher is clearly too biased one way to write for a respectable paper. Rather than looking at what's out there and forming an opinion, he has his opinion in place and then either mangles numbers in his favor or cherry picks whatever he can to bolster his losing opinion.

Posted by: Chest_Rockwell | February 19, 2009 1:47 PM | Report abuse

hey ThE-BaRRa-BrAvA-KiD, I think you misread that post and are over-reacting. All the guy said was that there were, indeed, people in the BB who only go to drink and party and couldn't care less about the team - he didn't say that was the typical BB member (and I'm guessing those guys don't even pay dues like the rest of us).
I'll buy you a beer at RFD on March 21st - it's all good :)
I might be late though, I have to drive from Loudoun County :-)

Posted by: dcufan | February 19, 2009 1:53 PM | Report abuse

wow...

do I see a shakespeare play in the making...

someone needs to tighten the leash..

Posted by: bonghits4gomez | February 19, 2009 1:58 PM | Report abuse

RE::There's people who live and die with United games who because of circumstances or distance can't make it to games, and then there's people who stand in the Barra who give a jack about the game but are just there to get wasted and be a part of the party.

Hey mcontento, so you think pople in the Barra only go to games to get wasted huh? well you are an IDIOT.. what knowledge do you have of the group? Do you have any idea what kind of people we have in the group? Those kind of comments make me sick and one again allow me to say !!YOU ARE AN IDIOT!!

Posted by: ThE-BaRRa-BrAvA-KiD | February 19, 2009 10:57 AM

Way to misinterpret what I said into a blanket statement.

I never said everyone in the Barra I never even alluded to everyone or even that it is a lot of people are that way I simply said there are people who are there who care less a about the game than the tailgate, getting wasted and being seen.

Call me an whatever you want but I know what I see, and I've stood with you guys plenty of times over the years so maybe you shouldn't be so dismissive of what I know.

If you want to be in denial that it happens that's up to you, but to say everyone who stands with the Barra is 100% hardcore support all the time is BS.

The point I was making which I guess you didn't catch is even people who might stand with our most hardcore group are not themselves always hardcore fans while some people who are as big a fan or United as anyone aren't even in the stands. There is nothing that says you have to be in the BB or SE or at every single game to be a big fan.

Being at the game doesn't make someone necessarily a better fan just blessed they have the opportunity to be there in person.

Posted by: mcontento | February 19, 2009 2:03 PM | Report abuse

I'm worried about Goff. It's not like him to go this late without a post....

Posted by: fischy | February 19, 2009 2:35 PM | Report abuse

Mr. Goff is sitting at home and hitting refresh as an episode of Jerry Springer has erupted on his post.

Well earned afternoon away from the Blogosphere

Posted by: VirginiaBlueBlood | February 19, 2009 2:40 PM | Report abuse

Goff's taking a day off.

Posted by: mcontento | February 19, 2009 2:41 PM | Report abuse

New topic: Stadium Theme Song contest

Entries in the Beatles Division:

Taxman
The Long and Winding Road (from Virginia)
Across the Universe (is closer than anywhere in Maryland)
Drive My Car (across the Wilson Bridge)

Posted by: I-270Exit1 | February 19, 2009 2:59 PM | Report abuse

I'll always remember Fenty standing up at RFK before a game in late October just before the election, receiving a United jersey and promising us a new stadium. Dirtball.

Posted by: Stevenho | February 19, 2009 12:41 PM

You mean this.......

"Thank you Kevin for this D.C. United jersey and congratulations on your terrific season. It is great to see over 20,000 fans here at RFK supporting D.C. United. It is my hope that your fans will soon be coming to your brand new soccer stadium at Poplar Point in Anacostia. World class fans, and a world class team like D.C. United, deserve a world class stadium. And I am going to make it a priority to help you build that stadium. Thank you -- congratulations and good luck to the Black-and-Red!"

-Adrian Fenty on Oct 29 2006 (right before a mayoral elction mind you)

link to full article: http://www.mlsnet.com/news/team_news.jsp?ymd=20061031&content_id=77524&vkey=news_dcu&fext=.jsp&team=t103

Posted by: Poopy_McPoop | February 19, 2009 3:01 PM | Report abuse

New topic: Stadium Theme Song contest

Posted by: I-270Exit1 | February 19, 2009 2:59 PM

"I'm Gonna Be (500 Miles)" by The Proclaimers just b/c of the hook.

But I would walk 500 miles
And I would walk 500 more
Just to be the man who walks a thousand miles
To fall see DCU in their new stadium

(okay so I added the last part)

Posted by: Poopy_McPoop | February 19, 2009 3:05 PM | Report abuse

New topic: Stadium Theme Song contest

Posted by: I-270Exit1 | February 19, 2009 2:59 PM

This one relates more to Fenty (of course it can be applied to pretty much any politician)

"Liar" by Henry Rollins

Posted by: Poopy_McPoop | February 19, 2009 3:07 PM | Report abuse

New topic: Stadium Theme Song contest

Posted by: I-270Exit1 | February 19, 2009 2:59 PM

This one relates more to what the who situation makes me want to do

"Hits From The Bong" by Cypress Hill

Posted by: Poopy_McPoop | February 19, 2009 3:09 PM | Report abuse

Wow, I'm so glad to see now that all of our stadium problems (insert sarcasm here) that all we have to argue about now are who are the bigger fans. The KiD's original comment was just in frustration to the usual negative characterizations imposed on the Barra. I've been there plenty of times and had plenty of arguments. Yes, we have people who just like the "idea" of being in the group, but the majority are there to support the team 100%. Ever hear the chants/drums at away games? And I don't mean just to NY or Columbus. I'm talking LA, Chicago, Costa Rica... yeah we are there in numbers. Things may have changed over the years, but the dedication hasn't lapsed.

So be in a group or not, it doesn't matter. The point is to support your team and the league. Don't knock the rest of us because we are passionate about being where we are.

Posted by: kasdc | February 19, 2009 3:12 PM | Report abuse

can i borrow the "zzzzz....." concept from the Poplar Point talk and reappropriate it for any talk about whether NoVa fans will go to PG for games? talk about bored/tired/annoying arguments. can we at least wait until:

1. A site is officially selected?
2. Financing is in place?
3. A shovel is in the ground?

Then we can commence with the rending of garments and gnashing of teeth about how for away the Metro is and how bad traffic is and how the stands won't bounce.

Posted by: dimesmakedollars | February 19, 2009 3:14 PM | Report abuse

New topic: Stadium Theme Song contest
>>
to the tune of the Battle Hymn of the Republic . . .

Mine eyes have seen the glory of the Eagle high above,

He is trampling out his rivals and on every pitch he'll score,

Unleashing razor talons, sharper than a sword,

UNITED MARCHES ON

Glory, glory to United
Glory, glory to United
Glory, glory to United
We'll bring the CUP ON HOME!

Posted by: delantero | February 19, 2009 3:14 PM | Report abuse

Since this has become a free for all (since Goff said that we could go anywhere we wanted soccer related)--

Has anyone ever heard the Bad Brains "DC United" song?

Is it anywhere near as good as the Mike Jones Houston Dynamo joint joint?

Posted by: yankiboy | February 19, 2009 3:37 PM | Report abuse

Forward trialist Ange N'Silu has been officially signed by DC United, as per behindthebadge.com. I like the strikers potential.

Posted by: BurchFan4 | February 19, 2009 3:38 PM | Report abuse

I can't believe you guys are wasting so much time talking about music and songs.

I got a question in on another chat by Kevin Payne today. Thought you'd want to see it:

Q: Congratulations on the stadium progress. One of the great things about the old Arsenal stadium was its proximity to the field -- a sense of the fan being in the action. Will the new stadium have the seating close to the field? by Haymarket, VA (that's me, by the way...)

Answer by KP: We are looking to design two key elements into the stadium -- we want to have the seats as close as practicable to the field, and we want the steepest permissible rake to the stands. We want to create the most inhospitable environment possible for the visiting teams. With a roof structure designed to keep sound in the building, and the tight and steep design of the seats, we want our opponents to feel surrounded!

Posted by: joedoc1 | February 19, 2009 3:40 PM | Report abuse

Forward trialist Ange N'Silu has been officially signed by DC United, as per behindthebadge.com. I like the strikers potential.

Posted by: BurchFan4 | February 19, 2009
----

Is "Ange" the new Kpene? Or something more...? I'm looking forward to hearing more about him.

Posted by: jealousmuse | February 19, 2009 3:52 PM | Report abuse

There have been some pro lacrosse teams based in these soccer specific stadiums. I really wouldn't make the Bayhawks part of this stadium sales pitch though.

Major League Lacrosse is reportedly about to fold 4 of its 10 teams. If that drastic tactic to save money doesn't work, pro lacrosse may simply not be around for 2012.

Posted by: evwill | February 19, 2009 3:54 PM | Report abuse

joedoc1 - That's one of the best answers I've ever heard. :)

yankiboy - I'm going with infinitely better being that it's a) by the Bad Brains and 2) about DC United. You can find it on YouTube, but the sound quality isn't great. Adidas also had it posted on their site a while back.

Posted by: kasdc | February 19, 2009 3:55 PM | Report abuse

I can't believe you guys are wasting so much time talking about music and songs.

Posted by: joedoc1 | February 19, 2009 3:40 PM

Why does this surprise you???

Should we go back to the "you got some clowns in your group"/"you don't understand the 'passion'" arguments???

Or should we go back to discussing the "Be happy with PG--your folks didn't want the stadium/Forget about us Virginians coming to the new stadium" bit again?

We are just trying to keep it light. A little levity (which I often botch and confuse with "brevity")...

Posted by: yankiboy | February 19, 2009 4:04 PM | Report abuse

*much of the stadium commentary is shovel-ready even if the stadium isn't

*great question, great answer by KP. I think the best minds among the supporters should turn to developing some new chants that can be perfected for the new venue. Sadly I suppose by then Blanco won't be around to appreciate them . . . .

Posted by: OWNTF | February 19, 2009 4:14 PM | Report abuse

Ummm, yankiboy? That was levity (consider the source).

And, as a mnemonic device for you:

"Brevity is the soul of lingerie" (Dorothy Parker)

Posted by: I-270Exit1 | February 19, 2009 4:18 PM | Report abuse

kasdc-thanks. I will check out youtube.

I remember MLS Cup 07. After the Galaxy one their last championship (at our place, no less), when the celebration started, that pumped up that Mike Jones joint over the PA. I asked a Dynamo supporter who it was and when she told me Mike Jones my mouth dropped open because I actually liked it. I hadn't even heard of the CD until then. Then I found out that Bad Brains did our song. Maybe Chcuk Brown was too busy or they figured we needed something more "harcore"...

Posted by: yankiboy | February 19, 2009 4:20 PM | Report abuse

Sorry, yankiboy. My humor can be a bit... oh, shall we say, hard to understand.

Posted by: joedoc1 | February 19, 2009 4:26 PM | Report abuse

joedoc1--Please. No worries. It should have been obvious that you were kidding around. I'm just a bit slow...

Posted by: yankiboy | February 19, 2009 4:31 PM | Report abuse

one thing that people like Fisher don't get is the chip on the shoulder of PG County in general. I don't mean that it a bad way, by the way, just as a statement of fact. In the DC area, all the attention is lavished on Fairfax, Alexandria and Montgomery counties, we hear about how great all of them are. PG is the bastard stepchild in the local dynamic. no one mentions that it has the largest public research university in the area (UMD); that it is the most affluent majority African American county in the US; that it is least developed county adjacent to DC, with the most green space? that the economic boom that built the orange line communities in Virginia somehow passed it by entirely? anyone know that it's the wealthiest county in the country to not have a major department store? no Macy's, no Nordstrom, no Saks? while people were busy building 25 story condos on the yellow and orange lines in VA, no one bothered with the Green and Blue lines. the county is desperate for development, but the boom pretty much skipped them (shocking, right? the economic boom skipped the majority black county? who'da thunk it?) why aren't there 20 story condo buildings and a harris teeter next to Largo Town Center? it's just as far from downtown as East Falls Church. Why is PG Plaza such a mess, while Pentagon City so fancy?

So PG pays a premium (oh, and they have the best bond rating of all the local counties, by the way) to attract more people and more development. it will come.

Posted by: joshuaostevens | February 19, 2009 4:50 PM | Report abuse

N'Silu's size (6', 185 lbs) indicates that he'll be a real target forward. Since an aerial target is something we lack, this is good in theory. Now, if he's got the size but is a French-African answer to Alan Gordon, we'll find out quickly and just hope that we don't see too much of him. However, if he can play a bit, it'll be a nice contrast to what we already have up front.

Moreno
Emilio
Quaranta
Doe
Pontius
N'Silu

If those last 2 pan out, we're pretty strong at forward. Obviously last year's struggles had more to do with the other end of the field but our front line looks to have improved, which is never a bad thing.

Posted by: Chest_Rockwell | February 19, 2009 4:59 PM | Report abuse

why aren't there 20 story condo buildings and a harris teeter next to Largo Town Center?
========================

Why don't you ask The Vic? He's the real estate developer with the big bucks. Your comment seems to me based on a softly bigoted assumption that non-black people control all the capital and that, if that capital is not deployed in PG . . . I mean Prince George's . . . it is because of race.

Posted by: OWNTF | February 19, 2009 4:59 PM | Report abuse

There was a DC streetpunk/oi band called United 121 (after section 121) that had some DCU-related songs. They later were known as Spitfires United. You can download all their stuff and read about 'em here:

http://www.dcshows.net/sfu.php

Posted by: edgeonyou | February 19, 2009 5:06 PM | Report abuse

joshuaostevens,

You're comparing a county with a median income of $68K vs. one with $102K and asking why developers are building more in the one with $102K.


Fail economics much?

Posted by: mcontento | February 19, 2009 5:20 PM | Report abuse

"Since this has become a free for all (since Goff said that we could go anywhere we wanted soccer related)--

Has anyone ever heard the Bad Brains "DC United" song?

Is it anywhere near as good as the Mike Jones Houston Dynamo joint joint?"

If you like Nu-Metal it's better.

Here ya go http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HUjBx_x5ZtA

Don't thank me, thank MLSR.

Posted by: fonkyou | February 19, 2009 5:24 PM | Report abuse

I wonder if Denyce Graves will do a cover of that.

Posted by: I-270Exit1 | February 19, 2009 5:34 PM | Report abuse

As a former N. Virginian, I can say I'd go to as many games at any new stadium as I went to at RFK. Either you love the game or you don't; but most of DC's fan base clearly loves the game. I just don't think the number of fans is going to drop off measurably regardless of the location.

I agree with other posters that it absolutely must be within a reasonable distance of a metro stop; otherwise DC is really shooting itself in the foot. At every game there are lots of folks who get there by metro and if it's a question of siting in traffic for an hour or catching the match at home on TV, well I'd rather catch the match at home on TV.

Anyway, there's no need to get snooty with each other. DC fans are DC fans, doesn't matter where they live or what group they are part of.

Posted by: hacksaw | February 19, 2009 5:43 PM | Report abuse

I'm a DCU fan in Arizona - this PGC place sounds FARRR! ;)

Posted by: ZidVicious | February 19, 2009 7:02 PM | Report abuse

""Your comment seems to me based on a softly bigoted assumption that non-black people control all the capital and that""

I didn't read it like that. I think joshuaostevens is simply presenting a lot of solid information about a county that is regularly maligned in the area---and on this board---right or wrong. He's enlightened me a bit about PG . . now what about Prince William, what a hole . .

Posted by: delantero | February 19, 2009 7:18 PM | Report abuse

mcontento: here's a question. yes, Fairfax has a higher household income. in fact, between 2001 and 2006, that number increased from 84k to 104k. meanwhile, PG increased from 58k to 64k. one went up 20%, the other 10%. which one was getting all the investment again?

in this time, the two counties grew in population at roughly the same rate. the difference is, the people moving to Fairfax were obviously wealthier than those moving to PG. Did you ever go to Ballston before about 1996? it was car dealerships and body shops. There's a reason the bar is called 'carpool' you know. twenty years ago there was no significant economic income difference between Ballston and Largo. except one was white and one was black.

I'm not saying this is, in fact, the reason, but you can imagine why people in PG consider it, no? that was the point.

so, fail anything besides Adam Smith 101?

Posted by: joshuaostevens | February 19, 2009 7:58 PM | Report abuse

joshuaostevens-

Yes, I clearly remember Ballston before the boom, when there was Parkington, a bunch of run down strip malls, car dealerships and little else. I grew up in McLean right on the North Arlington boarder. I also know that Arlignton and Fairfax both had aggressive growth strategies that were developed throughout the 80s and 90s.

Arlington centered their growth around the Metro, whereas Fairfax used tax breaks and other governmental measures to entice big corporations to come there and other businesses to choose Fairfax when deciding where to locate. Arlington also benefitted greatly from the proximity of Crystal City and Rosslyn to the Pentagon and got a lot of defense contractors (others decided to locate in Tyson's).

What did PG do during that time?

Also Fairfax has the largest workforce with college and post-secondary education in the region, why would businesses not want to locate where the highly educated workforce lives? And guess what when you have a highly educated, well paid workforce they tend to buy nicer and more expensive homes, so builders want to build there. The cycle repeats over and over and thus you have the 'rich getting richer' principal in play. Easy to understand isn't it?

I believe it is you who failed Adam Smith 101 as well as civics, politics, geography, maybe a few more. You clearly have zero understanding of how things work and just want to rabble rouse over race when it is not something so simple.

Posted by: mcontento | February 20, 2009 9:03 AM | Report abuse

The comments to this entry are closed.

 
 
RSS Feed
Subscribe to The Post

© 2010 The Washington Post Company