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Posted at 1:52 PM ET, 03/ 5/2011

OPEN THREAD: Maryland vs. Virginia

By Matt Bonesteel

It's game time. Leave your thoughts on the Maryland-Virginia game in the comments

TV: WTTG-5, WNUV-54.

Radio: WTEM (980 AM).

By Matt Bonesteel  | March 5, 2011; 1:52 PM ET
Categories:  Men's basketball  
Save & Share:  Send E-mail   Facebook   Twitter   Digg   Yahoo Buzz   StumbleUpon   Technorati   Google Buzz   Previous: Maryland bounced by Georgia Tech in ACC women's basketball tournament
Next: Terps open ACC Tournament Thursday against N.C. State


Please keep Tucker and Bowie on the bench for the rest of the game,,You gave them the start, and they have quit on the program...

Posted by: frostanna | March 5, 2011 3:22 PM | Report abuse

Don't know what to say. Can't remember when a Gary Williams coached team deteriorated as the season progressed, but this one has. Sad end to a sad season.

Posted by: RITerp | March 5, 2011 4:02 PM | Report abuse

Good win for the Hoos. Bennett did a lot this year without many weapons (Landesburg left, Scott out for the year...lost 34 man-games) Definitely on the way up.

Posted by: Hoo34 | March 5, 2011 4:10 PM | Report abuse

Not to worry!

Terps are saving themselves for the ACC Tourney!

Posted by: p1funk | March 5, 2011 4:42 PM | Report abuse

Maryland Men's as well as the Women's Basketball programs are on a downward spiral.

Gary and the Seniors couldn't get squat done this year!

And, not sure why Brenda hasn't been able to get the Women's program as a top 5.

Are we even any good in Lacrose any more?

Posted by: mi6-007 | March 5, 2011 4:43 PM | Report abuse

I think both us Garyhaters and Garylovers are all depressed at this point, so my last point about Gary and why I think he is failing is for all you very smart MD Business Grads out there, I hope this makes sense and you can understand, why I think Gary is and has been failing as a College Basketball coach in general, not as an X and O coach alone:

I was thinking about my sales team/company, and this is a truth that Gary at 66 cannot understand and why I also think he is over-rated and is not a HOF'r, cannot carry Lefty's jockstrap:

In business/sales/life- to sell any product, including yourself, you have to sell directly to the Decision Maker i.e. recruit and/or to the Key Influencer i.e the Parents, in order to close big deals i.e. big recruits. If you do not even meet with either the DM or KI, then you will not win big deals, you may occassionally close small deals and get lucky that those deals with grow/over-achieve ie. Nat Champ Team, but in the long run, your company due to the law of averages, will fail to succeed long the MD Basketball Program in its current status/last 8 years.

If a coach is too lazy/cocky to come to my house, as the Key influencer to my child, and show me that he is going to take care of my prize possession, i.e. my child, and another/every other coach is coming to me personally to insure and convince me that they will take care, protect, help grow, my child, then where do you think, I as the KEY INFLUENCER, in my childs life, am going to tell my child where to go???????

I hope this helps some of you very smart Business School MD grads understand the basic concepts behind running and leading a multi-million dollar business, like the MD Basketball Program. And, I hope you understand, why some HUGE MD fans like us, are sick of Gary for not doing or even trying to do a key component of his job, and why we think he is a failure and over-rated. If he has enough time to drink and party with coeds, then his lonely 66 year old single butt, can go see some parent/Key influencers, to close some big deals ie. Big time recruits,,,and stop making excuses for why he cannot or does not want them. The truth is he is lazy/cocky and doesnt want to try.

Gary or Anderson...if you happen to read this please retire Gary or Fire Gary, at the very least go take a basic business class and psychology class, so you can learn to run this very important business.

Sad times for true MD fans, this sucks!

Ps, whoever thinks we are getting invited to the NIT, right now we are a bubble NIT team, so thats even a wish, very pathetic job by Gary Williams. 4th NIT in 8 years, if we get invited.

Posted by: cm88 | March 5, 2011 4:43 PM | Report abuse

To take the business analogy even further for those out there still convinced that Gary is sacrosanct, and should only go when he says so, is that a successful businessman knows when his product/service has "jumped the shark," and it's time to pack it in. Staying the course when a business is failing, and losing money leads to bankruptcy. Knowing when to cut losses and get out to save some face, and money, is what a smart businessman does.

Gary was a wonderful coach, and brought us Maryland fans and alums the greatest time we've had in half a century, but he has run his course. His inside-out flex offense is antiquated. His inability, reluctance, or just plain stubborness to not recruit top talent in one of the most talent rich areas of the country is laughable. Gary will go down as one of the great game day coaches, but it is time for Maryland to move onward and upward in this century, and return to national prominence as they once were throughout the Lefty era.

Settling for 20 wins and an NIT bid or a game, maybe two, in the NCAAs is not the legacy that the Lefthander built, and Maryland fans should demand more.

Posted by: bigdaddy33 | March 5, 2011 5:10 PM | Report abuse

GW knows what his two (glad they were on the team for four years)seniors and one junior could do. Absolutely zero (for six in the first half)! Hope they got their degrees and will have success in whatever field they go into. Cause it ain't gonna be basketball that's for sure!
It was nice to see a real 6'10" player (Weijs) go in for what, 3 minutes, get a block, a rebound and a field goal over the same size Cavs. Not taking anything away from JWill, but he sure doesn't seem to play 6"10". But Weijs looked like he was a bit more intimidating in the paint.

Anyway, back to the point. If GW knew what his seniors and one junior (13 minutes playing time) wouldn't or couldn't do, then he probably knew this was a lost game by keeping them in.
Also, why doesn't GW or his assistants teach boxing out????? How many bounds did the Terps lose by watching Sien or Sherrill get the inside positioning?

I'm not a Gary hater, but he should have had a better game plan. To lose to Virginia? Seems now the Terps are below mediocre along with the Cavs, GT, WF and Miami.
Truly disgusting, truly depressing...

Gotta believe next year there will be much improvement.

Go Terps.

Posted by: M20832 | March 5, 2011 5:24 PM | Report abuse

Excellent analysis, cm88. I am not for firing GW, but I do share your frustration and I too have concluded hat he isn't going to turn the program around. At some point in the near future, if KA concludes that he hasn't or isn't going to earn an extension, then a buy-out may be the solution. Without that our ability to recruit will be zero. I hope I am wrong and next year we have a magical recovery. But I don't see that happening.

Posted by: petecard | March 5, 2011 5:30 PM | Report abuse

Thanks Petecare, I am done with all the hate and personal attacks, I think we are all just frustrated and disappointed. But my sales/business analogy is exactly what is wrong with Gary, its just the truth and people can attack me, but if you really think about it, its true.

I would never send my kid to a school if the coach didnt have the time/decency to come by and "sell" me.

As a leader, KA should really dig into Gary's "sales" metrics and see how many calls he is making/face to face appts, etc. If I didnt dig in when one of my staff was failing, I would be failing at my job by not coaching my mngr or rep. Its time for KA, whether we like him or not, to dig into Gary's recruiting skillset/effort.

Otherwise, KA is just as guilty as Gary is and as Yow was.

Posted by: cm88 | March 5, 2011 5:39 PM | Report abuse

It will be interesting to see what the FOG's have to say about today's disaster. Sell those ACC tickets on Stub Hub. Bury your heads in the sand. For the 4th time in 8 years I will run my NCAA pool for 75+ people from around the country and my Terps will be in the NIT... maybe. Maryland WAS a basketball school. Now maybe we are a soccer school. Sad, sad, sad. But Gary won us an NC. He should be allowed to be HC for life. Isn't that right?

Posted by: petecard | March 5, 2011 5:49 PM | Report abuse

Well for years I have been upset by Gary's attitude. Scream and yell, party, attend football games and live large. Fine he earned it but have the self respect to retire and enjoy your life but stop messing up the B Ball program. Please Stop before it decays to the point it will take 10 years to recover. Gary, you have accomplished too much to leave another Ward program at MD. Resign and go out with your head high you do not need the salary for another couple of years.

Posted by: geoski | March 5, 2011 6:03 PM | Report abuse

OMG...a humiliating loss to lowly UVa. (at home no less). Something's gotta change! When have you seen a UM player make a fake before shooting, run a successful play for the last shot at the half, defend the 3, shot the three (the future of college b-ball), make a lay up. Think these things fall on the players alone? And why are Bowie -5pts, Tucker-5pts and Mosley-0pts still playing? If the Flex Offense is so good why doesn't Duke, NC, Kan, Tex, Ohio St., Pitt, Louis, Wisc. (you get the picture) run it. Two rookie ACC coaches take two mediocre teams (BC, Clem.) to the NCAA's. Give Bennett a few years to recruit and he'll be there also. Even NCSt will make the move to improve at year's end. No other ACC school would ride the wave to the NIT. There's no reason that UM can't compete for talent and be on a par with Duke....absolutely none. Who was Coach K before taking a loser (including his first year) and turning it into the Duke of today. Don't be afraid of change, the time has come.

Posted by: 70Terp | March 5, 2011 6:24 PM | Report abuse

Here is my prediction for next year...
1) I get really excited come November.
2) Terps play mediocre at best out of conference.
3) Terps lose an important ACC game.
4) To save my gf from having to hear it again, I rant on TI.
5) Terps then manage to sneak into the NCAA tournament due to a weak ACC.
6) My rant gets reposted proving how amazing GW is for getting the Terps in the top 50 nationally.
7) Terps lose in the first weekend.

Posted by: lkfkd876 | March 5, 2011 6:26 PM | Report abuse

CM88 you're talking crazy with a metrics driven organization and accountability. I would love to grade out Gary over say the last 6 years how many times the #1, # 2 target in each class was landed. Rather than disparage his 3 seniors who were the lower rated players in a 6 man class how about Gary say this is on me? Say I've failed to recruit acc caliber talent and I've not developed players like mosley and Tucker. UVA looks on the upswing which is the last thing we need.

BTW there was a lot of talk about Boozeman on another thread. I'm not sure if he's the right guy ,but we have a tradition in this country of 2nd chances when people pay their dues and our contrite. From what I've seen he passes this test. Some of these posts saying boozeman = Wade smack of some racism to me. Yes I'm looking at you terpmafan or whatever you call yourself.

Posted by: restonhoops | March 5, 2011 6:55 PM | Report abuse

OMG...a humiliating loss to lowly UVa. (at home no less).<<<

A well deserved loss to a gutsy, hardworking team.Go Hoos.

Posted by: nanonano1 | March 5, 2011 7:00 PM | Report abuse

How is it that the Terps make other teams look so good? They've allowed numerous, deadly flurries of three pointers from many teams this year. Our guys are not much better nor worse than the other teams in the 15th to 30th percentile of division I teams, but all too often they draw the very best efforts from other mediocre teams. Is it coaching? The water in College Park? The solar wind?

No, it's that Gary Williams won't follow the advice of some commentators on this board. Yes, that must be it.

Posted by: AncientTerp | March 5, 2011 7:51 PM | Report abuse

And how about the Lady Terps? They slaughtered Carolina and Duke, but unaccountably lost to what seem to have been lesser teams.

Again I ask, is it the water in College Park, the lousy dining hall food (well, it was terrible in the 1950's anyway), bad karma on campus, schizo coaches, sunspot activity, classroom persecution by underpaid, jealous professors?

Posted by: AncientTerp | March 5, 2011 7:58 PM | Report abuse

Not sure there is any point in risking an injury to Terrell or Jordan in a dopey NIT tourney run.

Posted by: GraniteState | March 5, 2011 9:08 PM | Report abuse

I was at the game tonight and it was a pathetic showing. Thank goodness I smuggled in some booze or else it would've been downright unbearable.

But, don't worry fellow Terp fans, NEXT year will be our year........Yeah that's the ticket.

I don't wanna say that Gary won his NCAA Title and has started slacking afterwards, but if you look at the trend, it kinda looks that way. Of course the FOG's will now retort with their excuses (and yes they are merely excuses) as to why Gary can stay coaching until he is 100 so it's of no consequence.

If only everyone had that kind of job security.

Posted by: P00PY_MCP00P | March 5, 2011 9:44 PM | Report abuse

Hey petecard, nothing wrong with the Terps being a soccer school. It's a beautiful game.

Of course, it would be nice if UMD was recognized as a BBall and/or Football school as well. Not to be I guess.

Posted by: P00PY_MCP00P | March 5, 2011 9:46 PM | Report abuse

Where are the FOGs tonight? Barno is great a bringing up quotes from blog posts 5 years ago. I was only able to pin him down once in terms of what period of time does a downward trend become an unacceptable result. Basically his point is Gary is above accountability because he took over while we on probation over 20 years ago and he won a national championship which is basically 10 years in the mirror now. I don't think you will find any program in the top 100 that misses 4 out of 8 years and still has the same coach. Please find one and let me know Barno. If we keep down this path we could become an NC State or Michigan.

Posted by: restonhoops | March 5, 2011 9:47 PM | Report abuse

Will someone please call Barno and see if he's OK?

Posted by: 70Terp | March 5, 2011 11:14 PM | Report abuse

Didn't Gary Williams coach the ACC regular season champs LAST YEAR? Wasn't he ACC coach of the year LAST YEAR?

Man, some of you would have wanted to fire Roy Williams last year too, huh?

Posted by: someguy100 | March 6, 2011 12:27 AM | Report abuse

I could careless about some meaningless award. Last year we tied for first in a down ACC and went out in the first round of the ACC tournament and the 2nd round of the NCAAs. When that's your highlight in a 6-7 year period, woopdie do! That'd be a nice story at Valprasio or UMBC.

Posted by: restonhoops | March 6, 2011 12:32 AM | Report abuse

Go Hoos go. Should be a good year next year, with the basketball program on the upswing. Coaches Bennett and London have their shot to turn around basketball and football, similar to what Coach Connor has done for UVa baseball. Good academics and athletics are not mutually exclusive. Now for some turtle soup.

Posted by: CVilleUPer | March 6, 2011 8:51 AM | Report abuse

Are we even any good in Lacrose any more?

Posted by: mi6-007 | March 5, 2011 4:43 PM

Lost at Duke in OT yesterday :-( Otherwise, should be a strong team

Man, some of you would have wanted to fire Roy Williams last year too, huh?

Posted by: someguy100 | March 6, 2011 12:27 AM

Roy Williams recruited Harrison Barnes and Kendall Marshall last year - how'd they do last night? And Carolina fans were plenty pissed in 2010, that's for sure. But they know that their incoming talent wil eventually put them back on top.

Posted by: Kev29 | March 6, 2011 9:18 AM | Report abuse

Gary is gonna stick around...I guess the good news for CM88 is that he will get to cheer for Terp losses for a while longer....

Bravo dude!

Oh and great recruiting analysis! Perhaps another book in the are a genius for making sure your sales people talk to the buyer or decision maker! Truly revoluntionary!

To make a statement that Gary doesnt do that, I assume you know who he is recruiting and you have his car on GPS and his phone tapped to determine that he doesnt talk to the kids parents? Funny though, I remember JWs uncle and parents say that their conversations with Gary were some of the most important facts in deciding to come to UMD?

You have been exposed as a know nothing blowhard, who again thinks that Garys personality does not fit your style and will reach for anything to rip him down.....

Posted by: TerpfanMA | March 6, 2011 10:51 AM | Report abuse

18-13 record

4th NIT in last 8 years

Downward trend since winning NCAA Title.

How sweet it is.

Fear The Turtle? Darn tooting.

Posted by: P00PY_MCP00P | March 6, 2011 10:56 AM | Report abuse

All other things being equal (they're not, of course), next BB season, our Terps will do about as well as this year, within a margin of plus or minus 3 ACC games. That means 4 to 10 ACC wins. The most likely outcome is 7 and 9.

Posted by: AncientTerp | March 6, 2011 11:07 AM | Report abuse

Coach Williams has an overall NCAA tournament record of 29–16 (.644), 25–13 (.658) at his alma mater. His 29 wins in the NCAA tournament places him seventh among active coaches in that category. Williams has coached Maryland to fourteen NCAA tournament appearances, including a streak of eleven consecutive appearances (1993-1994 season to 2003-2004 season), as well as four post season NIT appearances, allowing Maryland to own the longest current consecutive streak of postseason appearances in the ACC (Wake Forest, who had previously had the longest active streak, failed to qualify for the postseason in 2007.) Additionally, Williams has 71 wins over top-25 ranked opponents, 33 wins over top-10 ranked opponents (at least one every season since 96-97), 20 wins over top-5 opponents, three ACC regular season titles (co-champions in 1995 and 2010, and outright champions in 2002), and an ACC tournament title (2004). Williams' NCAA Tournament accomplishments include seven Sweet Sixteens, two Elite Eights, two Final Fours, and a national championship in 2002. Williams also leads active coaches with seven wins over top-ranked teams, the most recent coming against North Carolina on January 19, 2008. Since 1995, Coach Williams and Maryland have averaged 22.5 wins per season. Williams has led the Terrapins to at least 20 wins in 10 of the last 13 seasons and is tied with Rick Pitino for 6th among active coaches with 17 career 20-win seasons.

Posted by: TerpfanMA | March 6, 2011 11:11 AM | Report abuse

An objective view is that the Terps have the possibility, if not a likelihood, of doing well in the forthcoming ACC tournament and NIT.

But the vibes say something quite different. Only with divine intervention can our lads win a tournament game and a NIT game.

If the recent past is prologue, however,they won't win another game. O quam cito transit gloria mundi anus 2001.

Posted by: AncientTerp | March 6, 2011 11:17 AM | Report abuse

An objective view is that the Terps have the possibility, if not a likelihood, of doing well in the forthcoming ACC tournament and NIT.

But the vibes say something quite different. Only with divine intervention can our lads win a tournament game and a NIT game.

If the recent past is prologue, however,they won't win another game. O quam cito transit gloria mundi anus 2001.

Posted by: AncientTerp | March 6, 2011 11:18 AM | Report abuse

Great post, TerpfanMA, and thanks a million for some badly needed perspective on Coach Williams and his teams!

I hope you can post your most recent reminder every day that we disappointed Terps give way on this board to our hurt feelings.

Again I say, well done!

Posted by: AncientTerp | March 6, 2011 11:23 AM | Report abuse

Dude, if you're gonna straight copy/paste from wikipeida you could at least cite the source and give credit where credit is due.

Posted by: P00PY_MCP00P | March 6, 2011 11:24 AM | Report abuse

Yes AncientTerp it would be nice for an uncited paragraph from wikipedia to be posted every day......

What would be even more nice would be for UMD to play to a better record than 18-13.

Posted by: P00PY_MCP00P | March 6, 2011 11:28 AM | Report abuse

TerpfanMA, I like and respect you but the case you make about GW's post season record simply misses the point. When we look back at his career everyone should say well done. But when we look at what has happened to the program since the NC we are looking at something like the last years of an aging former star baseball slugger. The bat has slowed down and the legs are giving in. He has lost his edge. It's not just the record over the last 8 years. It's also the lack of enough top talent. Just watch the ESPN piece if you want to see an uninspiring coaching performance. It may be the single worst profile piece I have ever seen on ESPN. In my view, next year is as make-or-break year for Gary's future. KA will certainly be watching closely. If the football program is trending well then he may feel secure enough to do something with the basketball program. Let's see how GW does in his "free agency" year.

Posted by: petecard | March 6, 2011 11:28 AM | Report abuse

Ahhh TERPFAN going back to the old, he is cheering for the terps to lose routine and going to Wiki to try and make a point, guess he is finally agreeing that Gary is doing a bad job.

And I guess all the articles and players that said gary isnt spending money compared to other programs, even the womens program on recruiting or that allllll the players, coaches, parents that have said in articles where all lying, yeah Terpfan, I would rather take their word than yours or a Coach that is know by many sources over the years to be lazy/cocky.

Sorry you didnt see he sound analogy between business and the terp basketball program and had to resort back to personal attacks and opinions.

Truth, we are going to our 4th NIT in 8 years, if we even get invited, everything else be Garylovers/Garyhaters is basically opinion. If you think that is the level of success you want for this team, that is your opinion, but my opinion is that it should be much higher.

Go terps, hope we can sweep the ACC tourn!!!!!

Posted by: cm88 | March 6, 2011 11:41 AM | Report abuse

And for the ones that keep making the lame point, I bet you would have wanted Roy Williams gone last year!

NO,we havent been complaining about our coach for years, we have left him alone and given him time. But if you want to be stupid and bring up Roy Williams, lets see, in the past 8 years Gary has taken us to one ACC title, sorry actually that was John Gilchrist, and 3 or 4 NIT's, if we get invited. And, 4 2nd round losses in the NCAA, when we made it in.

Roy, has taken them in the same period to 1 NIT, where they where runners up. 2 Nat Champ, and they went to the NCAA's 7 out of the 8 years.

I dont expect Gary or any coach to Win 2 Nat Champ in that time at MD, but everything else is VERY realistic, and should be our MINIMUM goal!

Maybe you can add those stats to your Wiki search or start coming up with another lame excuse on why you love Gary more than MD.

You really should stop calling us bad fans, when you are the ones that have Mid Major expectations and goals for the MD program, very pathetic as a true fan.

Posted by: cm88 | March 6, 2011 11:50 AM | Report abuse

The sky is falling! The sky is falling! Please people: Relax! We were co-champs of the ACC LAST YEAR. We lost two great seniors (Vasquez and Hayes) and one good one (Milbourne). We had SIX new players on this year's squad. We were one shot away against MSU from making a run to the final four. The players who we thought would step up were exactly what we thought they were, role players (Bowie, Tucker, Gregory). Next year we are getting a true PG in Gibbs and the outside shooter we clearly need (Faust). Jordan isn't going anywhere. You tell me how he's going to get his shot up against NBA players around the rim. The guy can't jump high enough to put a piece of paper under his feet at his highest point. Until he develops a face-up jumper, no way he makes it in the NBA. So to all the "Fire Gary" crowd, I point you to the Friedgen situation, which was at best a lateral move. If we get rid of Gary, we will get some chump you never heard of and it's back to the late 80's of never making to the tourney. As for Barno, he is either locked in his closet, or God forbid, he actually has other stuff to do on a Saturday than post on here.

Posted by: aviscardo | March 6, 2011 12:28 PM | Report abuse seems you cant follow your own lame said talk to the decision maker.....nobody on here has the power to fire Gary, so you lame postings are just a complete waste of time....why dont you contact Kevin Anderson and set up a meeting....I am sure he would love to hear your thoughts on MDs coaches...

"Hi Kevin....I played football at Southern CT University because my grades and talent werent good enough for much else...anyway, now I am an internet executive who recognizes the importance of talking to decision makers and parents during the recruiting process....I think Gary is too animated on the sidelines for my liking and I dont think he speaks to parents during the recruiting process.....I would like to meet with you to discuss my concerns about him and how this has impacted UMDs ability to make the NCAA tournament every year.

A Fan"

Posted by: TerpfanMA | March 6, 2011 1:28 PM | Report abuse

The sky isn't falling, it already fell on this team and program. Gary had a great career as did Denny Crum, Nolan Richardson, Gene Keady. Great coaches comes to an end. TerpMAFan and Barno where ever you're hiding. can you really say that you think four NIT trips in eight years is an acceptable performance level at MD? Really? You gonna stand by that?

Posted by: restonhoops | March 6, 2011 2:09 PM | Report abuse

Reston...are you really the guy who called me a racist for comparing Bob Wade to Bozeman? Seriously? Thats your MO?

Posted by: TerpfanMA | March 6, 2011 2:21 PM | Report abuse


I understand your point and if the last 4 or 5 years consecutively had been getting worse, I would agreee with you...but this is the first time in 3 years that we will (probably) miss the tourney..and last year was successful in my book.

I interpret that as proving that Gary can still get it done and to reach back 5 years ago to make the case that he cant strikes me as wrong. I look at our team as having very good talent especially with Faust and Gibbs joining us...

Faust, Gibbs, Williams, Howard, Stoglin...these guys are ACC caliber players and will make up the core of our team next Padgett, Parker, Paulsson and the new kid from overseas (cant remember his name)

18-20 wins and missing the tourney is not a good year, so we dont need to complain that my standards arent high enough

I respect your opinion, but we differ on remedies

Posted by: TerpfanMA | March 6, 2011 2:52 PM | Report abuse

Will someone please call Barno and see if he's OK?

Posted by: 70Terp | March 5, 2011 11:14 PM | Report abuse

Sorry, I was actually AT the game yesterday unlike a certain few non-season ticket holders and non-alumni on here who are calling for Gary Williams head. Sorry if I have a life on a Saturday night and aren't busy spending my weekend on the internet calling for the firing of a legendary coach from a school I didn't even attend.

Posted by: Barno1 | March 6, 2011 3:54 PM | Report abuse

Terpfan, sorry but actually if you knew anything about business or basketball, then you would know that I am not trying to sell, I am having a discussion/debate with you guys. I really hope you didnt pay for your MD degree, because you didnt learn much at all. Btw, the school/degree got me to where I am today, which is much further along than I am sure you are, so I would'nt preach from that little mountain that you are on for too long :)

Good having a debate with you guys, some of you have made some good points, others are just sadly blind and not open to seeing why some of us are just disappointed and want more for our team.

Good luck Terps in the ACC Tourn!!!! Its great to be a fan of a team I grew up loving, even if I decided not to go to MD...probably a good choice after seeing the crowd, yikkkeesss! Go to the gym or at least take a shower once in a while, whew :) haha!

Posted by: cm88 | March 6, 2011 4:45 PM | Report abuse

I think most fans who are tired of GW, mention the past 8 years. Very poor after a NC. We do not know what happened but it looks like GW went to sleep. If he comes back great. He should have a good run the next 3 years if he can recruit one or two impact players each of the next three recruiting seasons. (someone who can rebound and block shots and someone that can shoot). No one is mentioning one bad year which would be the case if you turned on NC. Do not forget they just won the NC and are looking good this year. One bad year is easy to accept, 8 is hard especially when the Terps went out of the NCAA in two games and did not show up for the ACC conf. championship tour. last year.


Posted by: geoski | March 6, 2011 5:13 PM | Report abuse

Geoski, I dont know if this is correct, but on Scout, a poster just made to great points.

1. 6 of the last 8 years, Gary has been .500 or below in the ACC, another stat that shows how amazing a coach he is.

2. This should make all the Garylovers happy, he has a provision in his contract that automatically extends his contract if he makes the NCAA. If that is true, then we know understand why Gary wanted the field expanded, also you see why he does the bare minimum every year, all he has to do is keep squeeking in, and he has a job for life.

Congrats Garylovers, if this is true, you get your guy for as long as he wants to keep doing the bare minimum, AWESOME news for us real Terp Fans that want a winning program, more .500 season and NIT''s with the occassional squeek into the NCAA wooohooo!

Posted by: cm88 | March 6, 2011 5:37 PM | Report abuse

opps, two great points

Posted by: cm88 | March 6, 2011 5:38 PM | Report abuse

As of now, (7)Terps play (10)NCSU first round at 7 on Thursday on the deuce. Winner plays (2)Duke at 7 on Friday. Winner of that game plays FSU/BC/GT at 3 on Saturday. Championship is Sunday at 1.(1)UNC is on the other side of the bracket. One game at a time Terps. How do you want to go out UMD?

Posted by: Realness1 | March 6, 2011 6:01 PM | Report abuse

Gary is sticking around so all this debate is pointless. The Terps are stocked with young talent and Gary knows this. He can't wait for next year and neither can I. We will be a team to reckon with over the next 4 years or so.

This year was a downer but there is no point in blaming anyone. We will be back next year and the team will have talented players two and three deep at each position. Fear the Turtle.

Posted by: torope | March 6, 2011 6:10 PM | Report abuse

cm88...enjoy your lonely existence, trolling out sales anlogies from the business world as direct relationship to recruiting 18 yr old kids. I'm sure your direct contacts in the recruiting world have given you key insight into the number of phone calls Gary makes and how he pitches the program to kids and their parents. Its asinine for you to even suggest you know what goes on in recruiting. You write as if you were in the living room with Tobias Hrris and Johnny OBryant. Get a life...I see cloudy skies ahead for you, because face it, Gary Williams isnt going anywhere. He's got a 1st team All-ACC player returning, a 1st team All-rookie returning, and the top player from Baltimore coming in next season. He's been to 3 of the past 4 NCAA tourneys (yeah, or 4 out of 7, or 6 out of 9, depends on which #s fit your skewed arguments) and will be back after a bad season with a bad senior class that I'd bet hes glad to rid himself of.

Posted by: asnis715 | March 6, 2011 6:13 PM | Report abuse

1999-00 25-10 11-5 25 17 Gary Williams NCAA 2nd Round 3
2000-01 25-11 10-6 4 11 Gary Williams NCAA Final 4 3
2001-02 32-4 15-1 1 4 Gary Williams NCAA Champion 1
2002-03 21-10 11-5 10 17 Gary Williams NCAA Sweet 16 6
2003-04 20-12 7-9 24 19 Gary Williams NCAA 2nd Round 4
2004-05 19-13 7-9 - - Gary Williams NIT
2005-06 19-13 8-8 - - Gary Williams NIT
2006-07 25-9 10-6 20 17 Gary Williams NCAA 2nd Round 4
2007-08 19-15 8-8 - - Gary Williams NIT
2008-09 20-13 7-9 - - Gary Williams NCAA 2nd Round 10
2009-10 24-9 13-3 20 20 Gary Williams NCAA 2nd Round 4

Here is Garys record over the last 10 years. Looked at from the positive perspective, Gary has been .500 or better in 8 out of the last 11 years. Not too shabby for operating in a conference who has crowned 5 out of the last 10 NCAA champions....

Of course if you are CM88 and dont like his personality, you will look at it the other way to justify your case

Posted by: TerpfanMA | March 6, 2011 6:17 PM | Report abuse

Terpfan, I don't think these stats help Gary. It clearly demonstrates a downward trend. You could point to 09-10, but in light of this year's disappointment, it appears as more of an aberration. A norm has been established, roughly 20 wins with an early exit from the tournament. I suppose many schools would appreciate such consistency, but for a program with a national title, it strikes me as frustrating.

Football has an easy and practical excuse for its struggles. They are recruiting from areas with limited resources, especially when compared to Texas, California, and Florida. It's an uphill battle. However, some of the best basketball in the country is played in the D.C. area. Gary couldn't get Freeman, Wright, Reynolds, Cook, Oladipo, Selby, etc. Any one of those players would change the direction of the program. It seems like he strikes gold every five years (Dixon, Vasquez, Williams), but nothing consistent. How often have we heard that we are reloading next year, only to find our there is no point guard or center? MD has a fantastic arena, and great local resources to mine. No excuse for this sort of mediocrity.

Posted by: Finnucane | March 6, 2011 7:17 PM | Report abuse

Im sorry...I dont see how going from 19 to 20 and then 24 wins over the last 3 years is a downward trend

Posted by: TerpfanMA | March 6, 2011 7:33 PM | Report abuse

Why put up the past ten years if you only want to focus on the past three? Over the past ten years, a more significant data sample than three years, MD's average win and tournament success rate has fallen. Furthermore, you imply there is an upward trend over the past three years, but you ignore the 18-13 record this year.

Posted by: Finnucane | March 6, 2011 8:24 PM | Report abuse


you imply there is an upward trend over the past three years, but you ignore the 18-13 record this year.
-- Yes because this year is not complete yet
-- And I am not implying anything...the numbers are factual

Why put up the past ten years if you only want to focus on the past three?
-- Look at whatever timeframe you feel comfortable with...bear in mind that after winning the NC, your record in following years will always be lower unless you win a 2nd title which has only been achieved by 4 active coaches

Posted by: TerpfanMA | March 6, 2011 8:38 PM | Report abuse

Also, outside of the NC year, 09-10 and 06-07 have been 2 of Garys most successful seasons so I just dont see a "downward trend"

And, while we dont know whats going to happen this year because there is still basketball to be played, the variance between wins in his good years and his worst years is +/- 6 games or 20% of the entire season...(again not counting the NC year where we won 32 games)

Thats pretty consistent for a major college coach playing 30 games per year

Posted by: TerpfanMA | March 6, 2011 8:45 PM | Report abuse

TERPFANMA....hahaha, you mean 09-10 season when we lost a bunch of games to unranked schools Cinn., Wisc., and then that powerful William and Mary team, but we got to 20 wins by beating the mighty UNCG, Winston Salem, Chaminade, Eastern Kentucky,Longwood, oh wait we beat Florida...oh no, that was Florida Atlantic. And then we had that really tough ACC season last year. And thats one of GARY's most successful seasons??????

06-07, when we lost to that MIGHTY Miami squad in the first round of the ACC? And the 2nd round to the long time powerhouse Butler in the NCAA's? But he did a great job beating another 11 schools that all sound like St. Sisters of Agnus for Girls, so great job with the 20 win season stats, they really mean a ton! 20 wins is much more important than ACC or NCAA tournments....hahahaha, you crack me up kid!

Thank you TerpfanMA for making my point for me! And you dont see a downward trend? did I mention that some of the Garylovers where blind or what???

Thanks again, debating with you is a lost cause, see ya.

Good luck Terps! Lets crush NC State!!!!

Posted by: cm88 | March 6, 2011 11:49 PM | Report abuse

Gary and the kids are tired --- I mean REALLY tired and they deserve a break. Flopping to the U and UVa are two sure signs that this group of Terps give no one reason to Fear the Turtle. Save the cost of the trip -- forfeit to the Wolf Pack and head for spring break. I mean Gary and the kids REALLY need a break....

Posted by: SouthernTerp | March 7, 2011 7:47 AM | Report abuse

Complete FAIL TerpFan. .500 or better 8 of last 11, yet aren't the MIGHTY Terps 7-9 at the conclusion of this year? That makes 8 of 12, and to skew the data in another way, that makes 6 of 8 that the team has been .500 or below. Inexcusable at a school that once was, and should be, in the national debate yearly.

Posted by: bigdaddy33 | March 7, 2011 7:50 AM | Report abuse

Despite disappointment in the Terps results thus far this season, am enjoying the banter post UVA loss. In my book, losing to the Wahoos is always inexusable. What a pathetic end to the season. I am disappointed in the team, and to a certain extent GW. However, I am nowhere near joining the chorus for calling for his head. How is it that DG is the only senior escaping criticism? Were our expectations that LOW for him?

Now I do have to commend TFMA for fighting the good fight on behalf of the FOGs; cm has proven unwavering in his criticism and dislike of GW. It's hard to be the "Barno" when things go wrong for the program and we are talking about next year in early March.



Posted by: HughGRection | March 7, 2011 8:18 AM | Report abuse

HughG, We are talking about next year because this year is down the toilet. I have to tell you that I do not have high hopes for next year. While we have a couple of pieces in JW and TS, I have little confidence in the others and I certainly don't expect the coming recruits to add much value in their freshman year. In my view this is the beginning of the end for GW and I hope that KA will manage the transition is an effective manner. I fully expect the AD to live up to his call for greatness.

Posted by: petecard | March 7, 2011 10:05 AM | Report abuse

TFMA last years team didn't even live up to the half dozen years before we won the national championship. The ACC was putrid last year. It's putrid again this year which makes our 7-9 shameful and a firing offense based off the last 6-7 years. What happened to the buck stops here?

Posted by: restonhoops | March 7, 2011 11:05 AM | Report abuse

I've got to post this every year...

Guess which team is 3rd in ACC winning percentage since Gary has won the NC...

It's Maryland.

Guess which team is the only team to never finish worse than 7-9 in the ACC since Gary has won the NC...

It's Maryland.

Posted by: someguy100 | March 7, 2011 12:00 PM | Report abuse

"last years team didn't even live up to the half dozen years before we won the national championship." The ACC was putrid last year." -Restondupe

The ACC was putrid last year? You mean the league that had the second best conference RPI in the country last year? You mean the league that produced 6 teams in the NCAA tournament, including the national champion? That ACC?

It must take a special kind of Terp Club member, season ticket holder, UMD alumni, booster to knock the accomplishments of this program so much. Wait, what's that you say? Restonhoops isn't any of those things? He didn't even attend UMD?? You've got to be kidding...I would never have guessed from his rock solid loyalty to the coach who has done so much for this university that this guy was never even a student at Maryland. Well, I guess that explains some things doesn't it?

Posted by: Barno1 | March 7, 2011 12:15 PM | Report abuse

Reston is loyal to the program, not the coach. The coach has lost his touch, probably because he just doesn't have the energy to recruit with the best programs.

Posted by: petecard | March 7, 2011 1:46 PM | Report abuse

Petecard, you moron!!! You cannot be a MD fan if you didnt go to MD, or if you dont have season tickets...what on earth where you thinking???

I just found this out, so since I was born in VA, I can not longer be a Skins fan, since they are in Washington, well actually in MD, but especially since I am not willing to waste my money on season tickets since they are terrible, just like MD. So I guess my routing for them and being friends with JD Gibbs and partying with Juan Dixon back in the day, all is for nothing. I am not allowed to be a fan, according to the all-knowing and rule maker of fandom, Barno the Racist!

I love when he makes it so easy to make fun of his points and febble like mind :)

Posted by: cm88 | March 7, 2011 2:54 PM | Report abuse

"The coach has lost his touch, probably because he just doesn't have the energy to recruit with the best programs."

But in 1998 when he was busy recruiting Juan Dixon and Lonnie Baxter he had the energy back then? Those guys were not 4 or 5 star recruits Pete. neither was Joe Smith. or Greivis Vasquez. Or Jordan Williams. Or Terrell Stoglin. His recruiting is still the same as it was back then, Pete. And claiming something has changed--i.e. his energy level--is just plain ignorant.

Posted by: Barno1 | March 7, 2011 2:55 PM | Report abuse

"Petecard, you moron!!! You cannot be a MD fan if you didnt go to MD, or if you dont have season tickets...what on earth where you thinking???" Certified Moron88


No one said you cannot be a MD fan if you didn't go to MD. This is where you lose every single argument on this site: you always resort to inventing positions your opponent didn't take because you simply can't argue point for point with the ACTUAL positions we take.

Sure you can be a fan of a school even if you didn't attend. But let's not pretend there aren't some key differences that really come out on this board. 3 of the most outspoken anti-Gary people on this board all have at one point or another admitted didn't attend UMD--including you. To me that's telling.

I think if you are a fan of Maryland bball but didn't attend the school, you aren't nearly as likely to have the same kind of loyalty to Gary Williams. What he has done for UMD with his bball success is immeasurable.

I don't think it's a coincidence that the school went from a second tier "back up" school during the 90s to one of the more prestigious state schools in the country in the last 10-15 years. If you are simply a Maryland bball fan but not an alum, do you really even care about any of that?
Do you feel any sense of loyalty to the person who is in many ways partially responsible for that?

Does CM88 give a damn that Gary's success has brought in hundreds of millions of dollars to the university over the years? I highly doubt it. And I think that's a key difference between an alumni fan and someone who didn't go to school here.

Posted by: Barno1 | March 7, 2011 3:19 PM | Report abuse

Barno, give it a rest. Gary, Gary, Gary. Man it's almost sick the infatuation you have for him. He is a basketball coach. He is pretty uninspiring. He is a lousy recruiter. He now runs a mediocre basketball program. Thanks for the NC. Go play golf. We need some new life in the program.

Posted by: petecard | March 7, 2011 4:24 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: cm88 | March 5, 2011 4:43 PM | Report abuse

I too have concluded hat he isn't going to turn the program around. Posted by: petecard | March 5, 2011 5:30 PM | Report abuse

Wow. Just wow. Where to begin with such misguided, myopic drivel? How quickly we forget...

Petecard- you're absolutely correct...Gary isn't "GOING to turn the program around". He did that 20 years ago. And then 15 years ago he made them respectable again. And then 10 years ago he made them an elite team. And the next year he won it all.

Am I happy with this season? No. But I also realize that we just lost 3 of our top 4 scorers, including a 2,000 point guy/hear and soul of the team. We have 5 freshmen/1st yr guys. Anyone that expected more than 8 or 9 wins in the ACC this season was kidding themselves. I'm disappointed we regressed but young teams normally wear down. Terps will finish in the top 3 of the ACC next year and make a run in March. Lord knows he's no saint, and reasonable minds can disagree about his recruiting strategy. But anybody that would trash Gary Williams hasn't a clue about Maryland basketball.

Posted by: Notorious_LMG | March 7, 2011 4:33 PM | Report abuse

Maryland: don't have anybody who can shoot the three or anyone who can guard the other team shooting a three. End of story for this year.

It is troublesome that we always have trouble guarding the three, even after a guy hits his 1st 3 or 4. You would think we would prioritize guarding the guy.

Posted by: sruppert | March 7, 2011 4:54 PM | Report abuse

Petecard, several unprovoked attacks coming from today do realize I was quoting CM above...not you, right? Is the Great Petecard-Barno Truce of 2011 over? Sorry if it is...the relative peace and calm on the boards was a nice change of pace. Now Md bball has a really rough week and you're back to your old self...

Posted by: Barno1 | March 7, 2011 5:14 PM | Report abuse

For the first time ever, I agree 100% with TerpFanMA. Go get 'em man! Sidenote: It appears cm"I-Learned-This-in-Business-School"88 has taken over the role of Blog Idiot.

Posted by: aviscardo | March 7, 2011 8:46 PM | Report abuse

SWEET!!!! I won a role, awesome!!!

Posted by: cm88 | March 8, 2011 3:41 PM | Report abuse

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