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The Dole Ad: Over the Line?

UPDATE, 8:35 pm: Unbowed by the criticism over her first ad attacking state Sen. Kay Hagan (D) for her connections to the Godless Americans PAC, North Carolina Sen. Elizabeth Dole (R) is up with a new commercial tonight that doubles down on that message. The full ad is below but here's the toughest line it it: "They want to take God out of the Pledge of Allegiance and our everyday lives. If Godless Americans threw a party in your honor, would you go?"

ORIGINAL POST

As we head into the final weekend of the most historic election in modern times, the cable news coverage of the presidential race between Barack Obama and John McCain is being squeezed out by -- of all things -- an ad being run by Republican Sen. Elizabeth Dole.

The ad, which, unless you have been hiding under a rock for the last few days, you have either seen or heard about, seeks to raise questions about state Sen. Kay Hagan's (D) religiosity by attacking her for attending a fundraiser with the founders of the Godless Americans PAC.

Here's the ad:

It has been roundly condemned by editorial boards in the state and even Carter Wrenn, a legendary political consultant with long ties to the late North Carolina Republican Sen. Jesse Helms, wrote on his blog: "My guess is the next sound you may hear will be the roof falling in on Liddy Dole."

Hagan is up with her own response ad which decries the Dole commercial, a commercial that closes with this tag line: "I approved this message because my campaign is about creating jobs and fixing our economy, not bearing false witness against fellow Christians."

Here's the Hagan ad:

Is Dole's ad over the top? Or does it have the potential to be a game-changer in a race in which she is clearly behind? And what about Hagan's response? Effective or not?

By Chris Cillizza  |  October 31, 2008; 5:55 PM ET
Categories:  Ad Wars , Senate  
Save & Share:  Send E-mail   Facebook   Twitter   Digg   Yahoo Buzz   Del.icio.us   StumbleUpon   Technorati   Google Buzz   Previous: The FINAL House Line: The Top 50!
Next: Did the Debates Matter?

Comments

Is this jack-a$$ DorchesterAndCongress posting this Republican spewing on all the message boards? Does he think everyone is as stupid as he is? Does he think this accomplishes anything expect making himself look even dumber than he is?

DorchesterAndCongress - go back to your job as head slurpee maker at the quickie mart. The world has enough cretins that can cut and paste.

Posted by: xconservative | November 3, 2008 10:00 AM | Report abuse

.


.


If there was a white Presidential candidate who was found to be a member of a racist church, same as the Rev. Wright's church except substitute "white values" for "black values" and visa vera, THE MEDIA WOULD BE IN TOTAL ATTACK MODE AGAINST THAT WHITE CANDIDATE.


OBAMA IS A RACIST - OBAMA HAS GIVE $20,000.00 TO A RACIST CHURCH IN ONE YEAR.


Washington Post - there are a lot of Churches in Chicago which are black and which are not racist - Obama did not have to give $20,000.00 to this one Church - STOP GIVING OBAMA A PASS ON HIS RACISM AGAINST WHITES.


WAKE UP WASHINGTON POST WAKE UP MEDIA.


WAKE UP AMERICA.


.


.


Exactly right he's racist. Just listen to Irreverend Wrong, his pastor for many, many years.


Exactly right he's socialist. Just listen to him admit it to Joe the Plumber, or his interviews in the past.


Exactly right he's a rotten human being. Just look at his abortion voting record.


Exactly right he has questionable judgment. Just look at his associations with people in his past.


Exactly right he's corrupt. Just look at the Rezko land deal.


Exactly right he's a liar. Just look at what he says about taxes vs. how he's actually voted.


Exactly right he has no executive experience. Just look at his resume -- or lack thereof.


Exactly right he's secretive. Just look at his lack of birth certificate, SAT scores, grades, etc. etc., etc.


Exactly right he'll be challenged in his first 6 months of office if elected. Just look at what he says about meeting unconditionally with world leaders.


We cannot be SERIOUS about electing this guy!! Obama in charge of nukes?! What. The.


Sorry George Washington, we messed everything up.


We stopped demanding the best people in the White House.


.


.

Posted by: DorchesterAndCongress | November 2, 2008 11:10 PM | Report abuse

The totalitarian religious right that brought us the utter travesty of Bush and Cheney never stops the inquisition.
Elizabeth Dole is just one member of the misguided group that won't follow the Constitution and refuse to follow their own savior.

Jesus Himself said; "Render unto Caesar the things that are Caesar's, and unto God the things that are God's."
He believed in the separation of the church and the government almost 2000 years ago.

The American Taliban doesn't care about that because they have evolved into a religion unto themselves.

Posted by: seemstome | November 2, 2008 8:35 PM | Report abuse

President George W. Bush Endorses Barack Obama For President
Says He Was Always In The Tank For The Illinois Senator.

http://askaboutpolitics.blogspot.com/2008/11/president-george-w-bush-endorses-barack.html

Washington DC - In perhaps the most surprising move in what has been an unpredictable campaign season, president George W. Bush called a press conference early Monday to announce that he will be supporting the Democratic nominee Barack Obama for president. President Bush joins a long list of Republicans who have endorsed the Democrat, but his endorsement was probably the least expected. No American president in recent history, if at all, has ever crossed party lines to endorse the candidate of the opposing party to succeed them. As the news reverberated around the country there was initial shock followed by disbelief. Even the Obama campaign at first thought it was a joke before issuing a statement saying they did not appreciate the late Bush endorsement. “This is a last minute ploy by the president to help get his friend John McCain elected,” the campaign said. On the other hand, the McCain campaign was quick to say that “the Bush endorsement shows Senator Obama will continue the disastrous polices of George Bush.

Posted by: askaboutpolitics | November 2, 2008 6:17 PM | Report abuse

I'll be honest. It's over the top. However, just like any over the top ad, there is a kernel of truth. Honestly, as a politicians running in the South, you should know better than to take $$$ from something called the Godless America PAC. What, was the DSCC not pouring in enough cash?

While it probably will not hurt her, it's a bonehead move. Why not take money from NAMBLA PAC or something?

Posted by: BobT13 | November 2, 2008 3:22 PM | Report abuse


.

.

Sounds like everything in Elizabeth Dole's ad is true so let the voters decide -

.

.


If there was a white Presidential candidate who was found to be a member of a racist church, same as the Rev. Wright's church except substitute "white values" for "black values" and visa vera, THE MEDIA WOULD BE IN TOTAL ATTACK MODE AGAINST THAT WHITE CANDIDATE.


OBAMA IS A RACIST - OBAMA HAS GIVE $20,000.00 TO A RACIST CHURCH IN ONE YEAR.


Washington Post - there are a lot of Churches in Chicago which are black and which are not racist - Obama did not have to give $20,000.00 to this one Church - STOP GIVING OBAMA A PASS ON HIS RACISM AGAINST WHITES.


WAKE UP WASHINGTON POST WAKE UP MEDIA.


WAKE UP AMERICA.


.


.


Exactly right he's racist. Just listen to Irreverend Wrong, his pastor for many, many years.


Exactly right he's socialist. Just listen to him admit it to Joe the Plumber, or his interviews in the past.


Exactly right he's a rotten human being. Just look at his abortion voting record.


Exactly right he has questionable judgment. Just look at his associations with people in his past.


Exactly right he's corrupt. Just look at the Rezko land deal.


Exactly right he's a liar. Just look at what he says about taxes vs. how he's actually voted.


Exactly right he has no executive experience. Just look at his resume -- or lack thereof.


Exactly right he's secretive. Just look at his lack of birth certificate, SAT scores, grades, etc. etc., etc.


Exactly right he'll be challenged in his first 6 months of office if elected. Just look at what he says about meeting unconditionally with world leaders.


We cannot be SERIOUS about electing this guy!! Obama in charge of nukes?! What. The.


Sorry George Washington, we messed everything up.


We stopped demanding the best people in the White House.


.


.

Posted by: DorchesterAndCongress | November 2, 2008 7:43 AM | Report abuse

That ad was way over the line.. I guess the REPCONS are up to their dirty tricks again. I guess these idiots don't know about separation of church and state. McCain and Caribou Barbie need to take a refresher course in Government 101, and learned the Constitution all over again.

Posted by: pookeyw1 | November 2, 2008 3:56 AM | Report abuse

Pittsburgh Tribune-Review 11/2/08

"Welcome to the 2008 presidential race. This nation's liberal elite and its predominantly liberal media have anointed as the next president Democrat Barack Obama, 47, the junior senator of Illinois.

The liberal tutorial is that Sen. Obama is a visionary, a man of hope, if not the political equivalent of the Second Coming. And a plurality of the student body appears to accept this at face value. But Obama has sparse political experience, no executive experience, no leadership experience, really, and woefully little experience at much of anything.

That is, other than rationalizing quite leftist and collectivist views that include everything from the worst of command economics -- sure to turn recession into depression -- to perverting the U.S. Constitution by making it and the Supreme Court some kind of rule-of-law relative social re-engineering tool.

Talk about manifest danger.

The only truly experienced leader in this race -- the gentleman whose resume actually is worthy of the phrase -- is John McCain, 72, war hero, former congressman and longtime U.S. senator of Arizona.

We first endorsed Mr. McCain for president in February, long before we knew Sen. Obama would be the Democrat nominee. But our words then are even more apropos now.

John McCain is fiercely independent. And he makes no apologies for the principles he holds dear, even if they be at odds with the traditional party base. But he has never wavered in his core belief of what Republicanism (with a capital "R") and republicanism (with a lower-case "r") are all about:

Small government. Fiscal discipline. Low taxes. A strong defense. And a judiciary that does not legislate from the bench.

Compared with Barack Obama's long and dangerous statist laundry list of the ever more expansive role government should play in our lives, John McCain sums it up quite succinctly, quite effectively and quite nicely, thank you.

Indeed, we have differences that are more than quibbles with some of Sen. McCain's positions. We stridently disagree with his campaign finance and immigration "reform" efforts. And we've told him so face to face.

But it being, as once was written, a golden rule that one should never judge men by their opinions but rather by what their opinions make of them, it would be imprudent of us to allow our respectful differences to preclude our support.

Thus, we again today wholeheartedly endorse John McCain for president of the United States. For it really is time to stand up and fight."

Posted by: thecannula | November 2, 2008 1:51 AM | Report abuse

Funnier than John McCain on SNL-

The 5 Greatest Jokes of 2007-8:

1. I could no more disavow Rev Wright than I could an Uncle: I never in 20 years heard him say anything controversial

2. Allowing Mrs Rezko to buy me a sideyard was a Bonehead Move

3. Bill Ayres was a guy in my neighborhood:our kids knew each
other: I didn't know about his Weatherman background

4. Khalidi was a guy in my neighborhood: I didn't about know his PLO background

5. I didn't know my Aunt was in America


Posted by: thecannula | November 2, 2008 1:44 AM | Report abuse

I'm thinking this is way too out of character, or at least the character she has always managed to project, for it to do anything but hurt Libby Dole. She was, among other things, once president of the Red Cross. I think her constituents will now be asking themselves who she really is and whether they really know her. Not good when you are running for reelection. When Carter Wrenn says you've gone to far, you really have gone way, way to far.
Hasta la vista, Liddy!

Posted by: wmw4 | November 1, 2008 7:18 PM | Report abuse

No sympathy here but it's unfortunate that this is what people will remember whenever Senator Dole's name is mentioned. Not a good legacy.

Posted by: danielfboone | November 1, 2008 7:02 PM | Report abuse

Asking the question "is Dole's ad over the top" is about as silly as asking did Hitler start World War II in Europe. McCain, Palin, Dole and many Republicans have openly embraced smear, McCarthyite tactics, outright lies, on a level unssen in this country, even among Republicans, since McCarthyism itself.

This raises many questions. First, what values, especially "moral" values, do these Republicans have that lead them to lie in atempts to gain or hold on to office. They certainly do not believe in "country first." Second, these Republican smear tactics and the applause they receive from many right wingers reflect how much of this nation has drifted away from any semblance of civility, moral decency and integrity. Third, the McCain-Palin-Republican attacks on "sharing' or "spreading" wealth in this country, by increasing taxes on the rich to what they paid during most of the 1990's, shows how intensely greed, selfishness, and indifference to the plight of tens of millions of people, have become entrenched in the Republican party. Yet most of these people claim to be "Christians," despite seeming to reject the basic moral teachings of Jesus, with his emphasis upon blessing the poor, peacemakers, showing compassion, avoiding been greedy and selfish, and helping the needy.

Dole's "godless" ad and McCain, with other Republicans, calling Barack a "socialist" or "Marxist." are new lows in presidential campaigns in modern history. How can they not feel shame for such un-American, dishonest, smear campaigns?

Posted by: Aprogressiveindependent | November 1, 2008 6:42 PM | Report abuse

HAHAHA!!!


YOU CAN'T ASK FOR WORSE PRE-ELECTION KARMA THAN THIS!


Dick The VP Throws McCain Under The Bush:


The least popular vice president in history endorses McCain, his personal choice to succeed the least popular President (Bush) in history.
.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z3Y8n9FWz4E
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In Barack Obama's prepared remarks for Pueblo, CO, he congratulated McCain on getting on Dick the VP's endorsement:


President Bush is sitting out the last few days before the election. But earlier today, Dick Cheney came out of his undisclosed location and hit the campaign trail. He said that he is, and I quote, "delighted to support John McCain."


I’d like to congratulate Senator McCain on this endorsement because he really earned it. That endorsement didn’t come easy. Senator McCain had to vote 90 percent of the time with George Bush and Dick Cheney to get it. He served as Washington’s biggest cheerleader for going to war in Iraq, and supports economic policies that are no different from the last eight years. So Senator McCain worked hard to get Dick Cheney’s support.


But here’s my question for you, Colorado: do you think Dick Cheney is delighted to support John McCain because he thinks John McCain’s going to bring change? Do you think John McCain and Dick Cheney have been talking about how to shake things up, and get rid of the lobbyists and the old boys club in Washington?
.
http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/1108/Obama_knocks_Cheney_vote.html?showall
.


DON'T GET DICKED BY CHENEY, PEOPLE!!!


OBAMA/BIDEN 08!
GOTV TUESDAY NOVEMBER 4th, 2008!
.

Posted by: DrainYou | November 1, 2008 5:21 PM | Report abuse

The Canoli wrote:

"Zogby Runs a 3 Day Poll- Updating daily- Well, 10/31 was a GREAT Day for John McCain- UP 48-47 over Obama for the first time in eons!

It makes good sense: after all Obama said it was "good to spread the wealth around" YET HE doesn't walk the talk- His Aunt, about whom he wrote in his memoirs, Is living ILLEGALLY in a South Boston Housing project(reported tonight by AP), and his half brother lives in Kenya in very primitive conditions....SO, America is waking up to the hypocritical redistributive economics of Barack Obama- he wants to REDISTRIBUTE OUR income to take care of his illegal aunt, when HE won't!"
*****************************************

YAWN....

Every day there's something new for you wingnuts to try to latch onto, a non-issue that matters only to you. You can only cry "Wolf" so many times before people learn not to pay attention.

Try to enjoy the next couple of days. You're not going to enjoy election night.


Posted by: Skeptic21 | November 1, 2008 4:27 PM | Report abuse

Living down here in NC, I have to tell y'all these ads may be the most damaging mistakes that Liddy Dole could have made. For one thing, you DO NOT challenge a fellow-Carolinian on her religion. Kay Hagan's response was swift and clear. I think this will certainly win the Senate seat. Tarheels will be happy to have an actual resident of the state representing them in the Senate. (Mrs. Dole spends most of her time in Washington, DC. )


Posted by: DCexpatinDurham | November 1, 2008 4:16 PM | Report abuse

Yes,

Absurdly over the line. Not even in Kansas can this violation of Church and State be effective. It is time the Doles left the stage. And take down that ridiculous idolatrous monument to Bob at the University of Kansas.

Posted by: Carlthe3 | November 1, 2008 3:42 PM | Report abuse

popasmoke,

Thank your for your service to our country.

Posted by: rharring | November 1, 2008 3:14 PM | Report abuse

Can you imagine four more years of hearing:

My Friends

My Friends

My Friends

over and over and over again?
.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WdBsv0uCT0c
.


OBAMA/BIDEN 08 - GOTV TUESDAY NOV 4th, 2008!
.

Posted by: DrainYou | November 1, 2008 3:01 PM | Report abuse

"McCain MUST win Pennsylvania."

McCain has actually closed the month going relatively strong in the state. For essentially the entire month, he had struggled to bring the margin down to single digits. But the last three or four polls in the state all had McCain within single digits. And some of them were as low as 4 or 5.

Of course, its only four days out from the election. I think its too late for McCain to catch up. Whatever game changer McCain needed just simply hasn't shown up.

Posted by: DDAWD | November 1, 2008 2:51 PM | Report abuse

Would I go?

For free? The only issue that gets me out of the house for free are dog-related shows/festivals etc. So no.

For MONEY? Whoa!! Who's money wouldn't I take? Let's see. Hummm. If someone us giving away free money. There must be someone. Sheesh, I guess it's true: I'm a soulless mercenary. I'd even take money from the Republicans.

Posted by: DonJasper | November 1, 2008 2:43 PM | Report abuse

Elizabeth Dole's ad not only went way, way over the line of decency, it is truly despicable. Elizabeth Dole should be ashamed of herself, and North Carolina voters should issue a strong rebuke to her gutter politics and turn her out of office on Nov. 4.

Posted by: AtlantaSW | November 1, 2008 2:42 PM | Report abuse

Elizabeth Dole's ad not only went way, way over the line of decency, it is truly despicable. Elizabeth Dole should be ashamed of herself, and North Carolina voters should issue a strong rebuke to her gutter politics and turn her out of office on Nov. 4.

Posted by: AtlantaSW | November 1, 2008 2:42 PM | Report abuse

Wonder is it's godly to have such a bad face lift. At any rate Elizabeth Dole needs to be put out to pasture. She's another one that is out of touch with the REAL world. Elizabeth, sit down and keep your mouth shut!

Posted by: Willard11 | November 1, 2008 2:01 PM | Report abuse

Elizabeth Dole - the new face of the extreme right vile smears. Demos will rule long and wide thanks to ignorance like hers, Stevens, Larry Craig, GWBush.... the list goes on. Bye-bye GOP.

Posted by: buzziea | November 1, 2008 1:52 PM | Report abuse


For months I have been writing on this blog in support of Barack Obama. I have tried to push back on the lies and offer some arguments of why Mr. Obama is the right man and John Mccain is not. I don't really have any words left but I want to leave you with this.

BEFORE YOU VOTE VISIT THIS WEBSITE

http://www.vietnamveteransagainstjohnmccain.com/

BEFORE YOU VOTE YOU MUST READ THIS INFORMATION.

http://www.vietnamveteransagainstjohnmccain.com/cin_declassified_landing.htm

BEFOTE YOU VOTE YOU MUST WATCH THIS DOCUMENTARY

http://www.mccainbetrayspows.com/

John Mccain is "Not" the man some of you may think he is. John Mccain is damaged goods. Perhaps due to an inherent personality flaw, or from his war experience John Mccain lacks any empathy for another human being. It has been shown many times in how he has treated his wives and others. He cares about no one but himself. He will lie cheat, steal and exploit anyone for his own selfish needs what ever they are at the time. He is not trustworthy nor an honorable man in any way. I don't really know what else to say. The last straw for me was when he added to his spiel a story about sitting on a flight deck of a carrier with a mission and a target during the Cuba missile crises. More lies by this self aggrandizing phony hero.

This is my closing argument I guess. Please do your own research if need be, it is not too late and protect our country from who would be a very sick and dangerous leader.

I am a veteran, I hold a
Bronze star
Distinguished Service Cross
Soldiers medal
2 Purple Hearts

As a helicopter crewman my job was to retrieve wounded soldiers from the battle field often under fire. I met and knew so many "REAL" heros, I have a very hard time watching and listening to John Mccain as he spews his lies and venom. John Mccain is a piece of filth and I lack the vocabulary to even put into words what a phony he really is. On November 4 you have a choice.

Posted by: popasmoke | November 1, 2008 12:47 PM | Report abuse

Libby Dole - just as effective running for office as her husband.

Libby has jumped the shark!

Posted by: Roofelstoon | November 1, 2008 12:44 PM | Report abuse

Come January 2009, an eerie disembodied voice will echo through the Senate chambers, proclaiming, "There is no Elizabeth Dole."

Posted by: optimyst | November 1, 2008 12:38 PM | Report abuse

where is the link to the nad?

Posted by: goodwater1 | November 1, 2008 12:26 PM | Report abuse

Look, what really needs to be done is to rid the voter registry of people who hate God and hate America. An easy start would be to simply take off anyone identified as being sympathetic to the Democratic Party. The independents will be a bit harder to wean out, but that's what wire taps are for, aren't they? Even some registered Republicans ought to be expunged. After all, there are folks like Dick Cheney who will have to go. All they care about is getting tax breaks and sucking off the teat of no-bid government contracts. Seriously, does anyone really think Dick Cheney is anything other than a Satan lover?

Posted by: daweeni | November 1, 2008 11:23 AM | Report abuse

As a "Godless American" I am offended that the Republican party feels I should not be able to participate in the electoral process without damaging my candidates chances due to my religious beliefs. I guess I should start sending money to my candidates' opponents.
================
respondinding to the post above. one of the things that bugs me is when, during the holiday season, people would say 'merry christmas' rather than 'happy holidays'. those people either do not realize or are disrespectful of those who may not celebrate christmas. for the same reason, many in this country hold sacred the belief in god and do not consider that many who do not believe in god for whatever reason. the usa is a melting pot of many, therefore we might try to repect all.

Posted by: bernedroy | November 1, 2008 11:06 AM | Report abuse

Liddy Dole is the godless one. And the Botox makes her look like death warmed over. Time for her to go.

Posted by: DemoDevil | November 1, 2008 11:04 AM | Report abuse

"Complilation of latest polls.

http://blogs.tnr.com/tnr/blogs/the_plank/archive/2008/10/31/today-s-polls-by-process-of-elimination-mccain-needs-pa.aspx

McLame chance of winning down to 2.8%.

McCain MUST win Pennsylvania.

Posted by: toritto | November 1, 2008 10:41 AM"

Gallup O +9, Post +8, NY Times +11, RCP Poll of Polls 6.4+. Unless there's trickeration (and there are signs of it in PA, WVA, and NC), this is over. As for PA, are we sure Rendell is on OUR side???? Why is Rendell saying it's O +4, when the polls say O's in double digits? Having Rendell and Murtha on your side is like drinking industrial strength Drano.

Posted by: broadwayjoe | November 1, 2008 11:03 AM | Report abuse

YAHOO NEWS:

AP: Obama aunt from Kenya living illegally in US

WASHINGTON – Barack Obama's aunt, a Kenyan woman who has been quietly living in public housing in Boston, is in the United States illegally after an immigration judge rejected her request for asylum four years ago, The Associated Press has learned.


++

wow, that's change I can't believe in.

This is stunning. The heartless sob can't even help his Black relatives.

Posted by: cintronlourdes | November 1, 2008 10:44 AM | Report abuse

Complilation of latest polls.

http://blogs.tnr.com/tnr/blogs/the_plank/archive/2008/10/31/today-s-polls-by-process-of-elimination-mccain-needs-pa.aspx

McLame chance of winning down to 2.8%.

McCain MUST win Pennsylvania.

Posted by: toritto | November 1, 2008 10:41 AM | Report abuse

From the canoli: "AP: Obama’s aunt living in U.S. illegally
Immigration judge denied Kenyan woman’s request for asylum in 2004
updated 11:27 p.m. ET, Fri., Oct. 31, 2008"

Who cares? How is that relevant to anything? People are losing their homes. They don't have health insurance. We are fighting two wars.

No thinking person cares about O's aunt's immigration status, tenured college professor Bill Ayers, or the nationally respected Palestinian college professor.

On Nov. 4 America will have a choice. A message of hope or a message of hate. Peace or war. Calm or rage. Humanity or bigotry. Intelligence or stupidity (Couric: What newspapers do you read, Mrs. Phalin?). America's choice...

Posted by: broadwayjoe | November 1, 2008 10:27 AM | Report abuse

No guy in NC is going to vote FOR "E. D."

Notwithstanding Drudge's idiotic cherry-picking this morning (selecting one day polling from one of 15 polls), O is up 6.4 (he was up 5.0 pre message of hope). O has the MO.

Posted by: broadwayjoe | November 1, 2008 10:15 AM | Report abuse

As a "Godless American" I am offended that the Republican party feels I should not be able to participate in the electoral process without damaging my candidates chances due to my religious beliefs. I guess I should start sending money to my candidates' opponents.

Posted by: Left_of_the_Pyle | November 1, 2008 10:06 AM | Report abuse

ATTENTION Thrh -"Illegally" refers to OUTSIDE the Immigration Laws in this country- we have them you know! (- not to how nicely she gets along with the legal tenants- from the home of Keith Olberman:)

Now AP Report Confirmed by (of all places) MSNBC!

AP: Obama’s aunt living in U.S. illegally
Immigration judge denied Kenyan woman’s request for asylum in 2004
updated 11:27 p.m. ET, Fri., Oct. 31, 2008
WASHINGTON - Barack Obama's aunt, a Kenyan woman who has been quietly living in public housing in Boston, is in the United States illegally after an immigration judge rejected her request for asylum four years ago, The Associated Press has learned.

Zeituni Onyango, 56, referred to as "Aunti Zeituni" in Obama's memoir, was instructed to leave the United States by a U.S. immigration judge who denied her asylum request, a person familiar with the matter told the AP late Friday. This person spoke on condition of anonymity because no one was authorized to discuss Onyango's case.

Information about the deportation case was disclosed and confirmed by two separate sources, one of them a federal law enforcement official. The information they made available is known to officials in the federal government...

************
Again- she's living in public housing in Boston, which means she's not only illegally here- We're paying to keep a roof over her head, while her Millionaire nephew tells US that he wants to decide how to "spread the wealth around"!

Posted by: thecannula | November 1, 2008 9:15 AM | Report abuse

Dole's ad is despicable! Even though I don't live in North Carolina and am not a Republican, I sent her a contribution last week because I didn't want to see the Democrats win both the presidency and 60 senate seats – and I saw her as a moderate Republican whom I respected. Now I'm furious and am looking forward to watching her lose next Tuesday.

Posted by: im_moderate | November 1, 2008 6:26 AM | Report abuse

It's hard work, keeping up with all the yobbos! Fortunately, it is also extremely entertaining!

Posted by: thrh | November 1, 2008 3:09 AM | Report abuse

As a progressive Atheist [that's with a capital A, Jack!] all I can say about Liddy Dole's ad is the old country saying, "I ain't laughed so hard since the pigs et my little sister!"

What a piece of misconceived garbage! It's almost as funny as nominating Sarah Palin!

Posted by: thrh | November 1, 2008 3:06 AM | Report abuse

"How about Obama's aunt living here illegally in public housing"

Where do you get the "illegally" part? According to the Boston Housing Authority, she has been a model tenant, and very helpful in educating and assisting other tenants. But what do they know? They don't watch Fox News.

Posted by: thrh | November 1, 2008 3:03 AM | Report abuse

Elizabeth Dole seems to be even dumber than her husband, which is no mean accomplishment. Maybe she'll get to do an ad with Britney spears, pretending to be sexually aroused?

Posted by: thrh | November 1, 2008 2:57 AM | Report abuse

DDAWD: This the poll you mean? From the Zogby International Website:

Released: 11-01-2008

Subscribers can login here: https://interactive.zogby.com/clickon/index2.cfm

Next Release: 11-02-08, 1:00AM

UTICA, New York -- Republican John McCain made a small gain against Democrat Barack Obama and has pulled back within the margin of error, now trailing Obama by five points, 49.1% to 44.1%, the latest Reuters/C-SPAN/Zogby daily tracking telephone poll shows.

Almost two days worth of the polling -- or about half of the current sample in the three-day rolling poll of likely voters nationwide, was conducted after Obama's 30-minute commercial aired Wedn

Posted by: thrh | November 1, 2008 2:51 AM | Report abuse

"Obama's FOR THE FIRST TIME BEHIND yesterday in the Zogby poll..."

Not sure where you trolls get this. Drudge sans he's down 1 point in the Zogby poll; the Zogby website shows him up by 7.2 points.

Posted by: thrh | November 1, 2008 2:45 AM | Report abuse

"How about Obama's aunt living here illegally in public housing"

Where do you get the "illegally" part? According to the Boston Housing Authority, she has been a model tenant, and very helpful in educating and assisting other tenants. But what do they know? They don't watch Fox News.

Posted by: thrh | November 1, 2008 2:42 AM | Report abuse

How about Obama's aunt living here illegally in public housing and donating to his campaign?...What a story- you know a lot of border states are very concerned about illegal aliens...and some that only border border states...

Posted by: thecannula
--------------------

Doesn't bother me.

But you'd make a wonderful character in a Dicken's novel...someone like Bill Sikes, I think.

Posted by: wpost4112 | November 1, 2008 2:31 AM | Report abuse

Ddawd- McCain's up an average of 4 yesterday in Arizona- Obama's FOR THE FIRST TIME BEHIND yesterday in the Zogby poll...

How about Obama's aunt living here illegally in public housing and donating to his campaign?...What a story- you know a lot of border states are very concerned about illegal aliens...and some that only border border states...

Posted by: thecannula | November 1, 2008 2:25 AM | Report abuse

Real Estate Dictionary: Public Housing
Government-owned housing units made available to low-income individuals and families at no cost or for nominal rental rates.

From the Huffington Post-
Zeituni Onyango (Obama's aunt)
Volunteer Resident Health Advoca
Boston Housing Authority Updated
Q3/2008
Barack Obama
$260 81 ORTON MAROTTA WAY
South Boston MA

*********************

So, our tax dollars have been subsidizing Obama's aunt's housing for the past 5 years, while she is living here Illegally AND DONATING $260 to her nephew's campaign!

AND Obama's now chastising people who don't trust him to share our income judiciously!

Posted by: thecannula | November 1, 2008 2:20 AM | Report abuse

"Zogby Runs a 3 Day Poll- Updating daily- Well, 10/31 was a GREAT Day for John McCain- UP 48-47 over Obama for the first time in eons!"

Meanwhile, RCP moves Arizona to tossup status.

Posted by: DDAWD | November 1, 2008 2:03 AM | Report abuse

Zogby Runs a 3 Day Poll- Updating daily- Well, 10/31 was a GREAT Day for John McCain- UP 48-47 over Obama for the first time in eons!

-------------------

Actually it's a great blessing in disguise for Obama. A very tight race will mobilize Obama's supporters, esp the youth vote. Plus the weather is supposed to be excellent on Tuesday..which always favors the Dems.

No more complacency. Couldn't ask for a better development.

We have em exactly where we want em!

;)

Posted by: wpost4112 | November 1, 2008 1:59 AM | Report abuse

Zogby Runs a 3 Day Poll- Updating daily- Well, 10/31 was a GREAT Day for John McCain- UP 48-47 over Obama for the first time in eons!

It makes good sense: after all Obama said it was "good to spread the wealth around" YET HE doesn't walk the talk- His Aunt, about whom he wrote in his memoirs, Is living ILLEGALLY in a South Boston Housing project(reported tonight by AP), and his half brother lives in Kenya in very primitive conditions....SO, America is waking up to the hypocritical redistributive economics of Barack Obama- he wants to REDISTRIBUTE OUR income to take care of his illegal aunt, when HE won't!

Posted by: thecannula | November 1, 2008 1:46 AM | Report abuse


After 9/11, the Chimp and his zealots wanted to fight the Moslem extremists abroad to avoid fighting them home. They had God in their mouth whenever they adressed the public. It became a habit to hear the prez invoke the name of God for anything, even whenplaying withe his pet dog.

Under his benevolent watch, and his hypocrite devout posturing, the Christian Talibans like Elizabeth Dole have prospered and start throwing their masks.

Today it's a violent attack against fellow citizens whose only crime is tobe no-believers, thus un-American. Same for those who vote for them I suppose.

Next, they'll start chasing gays, lesbians, and playing "The Scarlet Letter" part II.

Posted by: bekabo | November 1, 2008 1:30 AM | Report abuse

The real Zogby poll:

Next Release: 11-02-08, 1:00AM

UTICA, New York -- Republican John McCain made a small gain against Democrat Barack Obama and has pulled back within the margin of error, now trailing Obama by five points, 49.1% to 44.1%, the latest Reuters/C-SPAN/Zogby daily tracking telephone poll shows.

Almost two days worth of the polling -- or about half of the current sample in the three-day rolling poll of likely voters nationwide, was conducted after Obama's 30-minute commercial aired Wednesday evening. There is no evidence it helped him, as he has dropped 1.1 points in the last two days, while McCain has gained 0.8 points during the same period.

Pollster John Zogby: "Is McCain making a move? The three-day average holds steady, but McCain outpolled Obama today, 48% to 47%. He is beginning to cut into Obama's lead among independents, is now leading among blue collar voters, has strengthened his lead among investors and among men, and is walloping Obama among NASCAR voters. Joe the Plumber may get his license after all. "Obama's lead among women declined, and it looks like it is occurring because McCain is solidifying the support of conservative women, which is something we saw last time McCain picked up in the polls. If McCain has a good day tomorrow, we will eliminate Obama's good day three days ago, and we could really see some tightening in this rolling average. But for now, hold on."

Posted by: wpost4112 | November 1, 2008 1:23 AM | Report abuse

Drudge Report Tonight- Just Announced on Fox News-

ZOGBY: MCCAIN MOVES INTO LEAD 48-47 IN ONE DAY POLLING (TOMORROW'S RESULTS)

also,

AP: Obama aunt from Kenya living in US illegally...

Posted by: thecannula | November 1, 2008 1:12 AM | Report abuse

I think that Hagen's original response was spot on. The newest Dole ad plays a card that Chris seems to have missed --- did you see the religious imagery used during the grudging admission that this "isn't about Hagen's faith?" It's all Renaissance Catholic stained glass and "papist" look. Chris, you may only associate the KKK with racism, but I grew up a Catholic in Kansas where my Mom was prevented from teaching in the public schools during the '30s because of her faith ... my Dad railed against the "ku kluckers" throughout his life. Don't think that imagery was chosen without purpose for the hills of NC... yet another, deeper more sleazy piece of Libby Dole's end of days.

Posted by: Omyobama | November 1, 2008 1:04 AM | Report abuse

Here's a funny anti-McCain ad:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PqhHUAFBB0k

Posted by: LisaJM | November 1, 2008 1:01 AM | Report abuse

So what does Elizabeth Dole think about Karl Rove, atheist? Would she go to a fundraiser that he threw?

Of course, this is all repugnant. Religious belief (Dole's, Hagan's, the donors') is utterly irrelevant to qualifications for office, as the founders recognized. I Hope Dole is crushed in this election.

Posted by: FredfromPescadero | November 1, 2008 12:45 AM | Report abuse

This Godless American thinks Dole's ads are over the line, but that they likely work in the target market. On the other hand, Hagan's 'false witness' rebuttal was a very effective counter to the first ad. Round One: wash. Can Hagan keep the ball in play in round two, or did Dole's quick return catch Hagan off-guard?

Posted by: bsimon1 | November 1, 2008 12:37 AM | Report abuse

GUYS, I AM HAVING PROBLEM POSTING ON "WHO GOT THE MOMENTUM" ARTILE, IS THIS ALSO HAPPENING TO YOU GUYS?

BTW, THERE SEEMS TO BE 100 POSTINGS ON THAT ACTICLE, YET I CANT SEE ONE.

Posted by: lazerboy | November 1, 2008 12:19 AM | Report abuse

splashy8 -

Please. News Flash.

There are many good people who are NOT Christian.

There are many good people who are Christian.

Also many awful people have called themselves Christian for political reasons. Hitler may have had strong beliefs - but not in Christianity.

Here's a bit of insight...you can find a lot more - even on Wikipedia.

"Joseph Goebbels notes in a diary entry in 1939: "The Führer is deeply religious, but deeply anti-Christian. He regards Christianity as a symptom of decay." Albert Speer reports a similar statement: “You see, it’s been our misfortune to have the wrong religion. Why didn’t we have the religion of the Japanese, who regard sacrifice for the Fatherland as the highest good? The Mohammedan religion too would have been much more compatible to us than Christianity. Why did it have to be Christianity with its meekness and flabbiness?"[18][19] In the Hossbach Memorandum Hitler is recorded as saying that "only the disintegrating affect of Christianity, and the symptoms of age" were responsible for the demise of the Roman Empire.[20] In 1941, Hitler praised an anti-Christian tract from 362 AD, neo-platonist and pagan Roman emperor Julian the Apostate's Against the Galileans, saying "I really hadn't known how clearly a man like Julian had judged Christians and Christianity, one must read this..."


Of course, too many people just cannot resist associating people of opposing views with the ultimate personification of evil - Hitler.

It's ridiculous how politicized "faith" has become in this country. People of either party can be and ARE people of faith - or not! My goodness, you'd think this was a Democracy or something.

Posted by: ClareA1 | November 1, 2008 12:15 AM | Report abuse

Associated Press
AP poll: 1 in 7 voters still persuadable
By ALAN FRAM 10.31.08, 9:19 AM ET

WASHINGTON - Patrick Campbell worries Barack Obama will raise his taxes but thinks John McCain will send people off to war. He says that leaves him leaning toward Obama ... maybe.

"I'm split right down the middle," said the 50-year-old Air Force Reserve technician from Amherst, N.Y. "Each one has things that are good for me and things that are bad for me. And people like me."

With the sand in the 2008 campaign hourglass about depleted, Campbell is part of a stubborn wedge of people who, somehow, are still making up their minds about who should be president. One in seven, or 14 percent, can't decide, or back a candidate but might switch, according to an Associated Press-Yahoo (nasdaq: YHOO - news - people ) News poll of likely voters released Friday.

KEEP THROWING PROMcCAIN REPORTERS OFF THE PLANE OBAMA REPLACING THEM WITH JET AND ESSENCE MAGAZINE WRITERS- YOU'RE LETTING AMERICA SEE YOUR TRUE AUTHORITARIAN SIDE A FEW DAYS TOO SOON: Fairness Doctrine comes next - cut off conservative radio- like you cut off that tv station in Orlando-

YOU'RE WORSE THAN BUSH- HE DIDN'T TRY TO CUT OFF MSNBC! and 1 IN 7 ARE DECIDING...

Posted by: thecannula | October 31, 2008 11:54 PM | Report abuse

I was tempted to give money to Hagan over this, but no one - including Hagan - is showing the courage to stand up and say "by the way, there's nothing wrong with being an atheist." We're being made into non-citizens thanks to Dole's unveiled bigotry and Hagan's silence.
http://nearearth.wordpress.com/2008/10/31/if-you-threw-a-party-invited-everyone-you-knew/

Posted by: qshio | October 31, 2008 11:20 PM | Report abuse

Dole is saying the only thing she has to run on is that she wants to remove the separation of church and state, that some people in this country don't have a right to representation because of their religion (or lack of)? I'm pretty sure that's what she is saying. I find it repulsive myself.

Posted by: delusionalangel | October 31, 2008 11:18 PM | Report abuse

If you are an atheist and your strongly support a candidate with financial resources you have to keep your mouth shut in this country.

If you are running for mosquito control officer and you are an atheist you have to keep your mouth shut.

Used to be that no white candidate in the South wanted overt black support.

No candidate in the South wants overt gay support.

....and nobody, I mean nobody wants the support of atheists.

That is the definition of oppression.

Posted by: toritto | October 31, 2008 11:12 PM | Report abuse

Question for the God squad; Suppose I am an atheist, am I not entitled to free speech and the right to assemble? Do I not have a right to speak with an elected official? And conversely, should not an elected official be able to speak with me, or accept a donation from me without being damned as Godless? No doubt the Taliban among you would have no problem denying an Atheist any rights. Next step of course would be to deny rights to those who worship a God - but not the right God. Next will be those who worship your God - but not the way you see fit (look out Catholics and LDS). I thought Sen. Dole was a better human being than this episode suggests. I guess it's true what they say; power corrupts.

Posted by: HeavyD1 | October 31, 2008 11:02 PM | Report abuse

If the GOP goes down to crushing defeat next week (it aint over till its over) real Republicans will need to pick up the pieces.

Your platform for the future should read:

1. We will defend the United States and the Constitution against all enemies.

2. We will be careful stewards of your money and control spending.

3. We will not tell you how to live your life.

4. All are welcome in our tent.

Return to the days when the GOP was a fiscally conservative, socially moderate coalition.

Marginalize the extremist crackpots, neo-fascists, outright bigots, the purposely ignorant and those waiting for the rapture. They will vote for you anyway.

Cut ties with the likes Limbaugh, O'Reilly, Savage, Coulter, FOX NEWS, National Review, Neo-Con culture etc.

Build a true center-right Republican party.

America will respond and America will need you.

Posted by: toritto | October 31, 2008 10:55 PM | Report abuse

When the news broke of the Bush-Rumsfeld atrocities at Guantanamo, I wrote to Sen. Dole and she wrote me back, agreeing 100% that the news was shameful and disgusting. Of course, she never lifted a finger about it (after all, she's only a senator), but she did at least agree with me. News alert: I'm an atheist. Do we not conclude from this that Liddy Dole writes letters agreeing 100% with atheists, even though her words mean nothing? And now she implies that I am a lesser citizen and have not even the right to speak to a candidate for her office, despite the fact that -- unlike she -- I actually live and work in North Carolina. So look who's shameful and disgusting now. Oh, and btw, look who's voting now.

Posted by: JPMinNC | October 31, 2008 10:51 PM | Report abuse

What the hell is the difference?

She's never in North Carolina anyway....until election time.

The state would be better off with a full time Senator who actually lived there.

:-)

Posted by: toritto | October 31, 2008 10:44 PM | Report abuse

This could push the state of North Carolina to Obama. Clearly the ad is offensive. Tonight the N.C. Council of Churches condemned it. If you don't think the churches in North Carolina have some clout, you've never spent any time in the Bible belt. This might be the equivalent of "Macaca" and it seems to me could drag away precious votes from McCain. Aw that would be so sad. I may lose some sleep over it tonight.

Posted by: fheflin21 | October 31, 2008 10:36 PM | Report abuse

Atheists are the most closeted oppressed group in America.

Millions of them just keep their mouths shut.....

Posted by: toritto | October 31, 2008 10:36 PM | Report abuse

If Lizzie loses, this will be the first time in 50 years that there is not a Bush or a Dole in elected office.

Times they are achanging....!

:-)

Posted by: toritto | October 31, 2008 10:34 PM | Report abuse

Another shoddy ad from a once-respected lawmaker willing to sell her character for the preservation of her power. Let her stay in N.C… er, Kansas… er, that doublewide Watergate unit.

Posted by: FlownOver | October 31, 2008 10:28 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: toritto | October 31, 2008 10:01 PM | Report abuse

Ms. Dole's campaigning appears to be having and unintended impact (although many of us will be feeling good:

"While the race for the White House drew most of the attention, minority Republicans in Congress braced for the loss of more seats in both the House and Senate.

Some said fresh polling in North Carolina suggested that incumbent GOP Elizabeth Dole had fallen further behind since airing an ad that tried to tie Democratic rival Kay Hagan to atheists." NYT Oct 31.

Posted by: portiaperu | October 31, 2008 9:56 PM | Report abuse

Dummypants: Except Hagan is NOT for removing God from money and pledge. Can I run an ad accusing Dole of sexually molesting children because it's an issue people care about? Um, no.

Anecdotally, I think this hurts Republicans up and down the ticket. I don't see that it has done a thing for Dole's base, but man has it fired up independents and Dems. For those 1-in-4 evangelicals like me who don't always vote Republican, it's also a big issue. We're tired of seeing our religion used in such crude and incendiary fashion.

Posted by: starthom | October 31, 2008 9:10 PM | Report abuse

Over the line? It is so far past the line it doesn't remember what the line looks like or when it was actually crossed.

Posted by: KansasDem | October 31, 2008 9:07 PM | Report abuse

Sleaziness, maliciousness, & hate-mongering: Republican modus operandi. I never expect anything better from them. As long as Rove was able to win elections that way with a total incompetent like W, they'll keep on trying it- at least until the country has realigned with a strong Democratic majority. That starts Tuesday!!

Posted by: DoctorB | October 31, 2008 8:54 PM | Report abuse

Coming from NC, a state that has had many such classic, below the belt ads which play on fear and ignorance, this one adds a high water mark that will be hard to beat.

It's ads and images such as these that have managed to keep much of this state looking like the same ass-backwards collection of fools and rubes it was legendary for repeatedly sending Helms back to DC. Here's hoping Dole gets sent packing.

Posted by: arielpoly | October 31, 2008 8:51 PM | Report abuse

How in the world is this over the line? you've got to be kidding me Wapo.

if it perfectly understandable if some people (i do not happen to one of them) think that religion touches on morals and values, and that public policy should reflect certain morals and values.

some people undoubtedly find obama's pledge to "spread the wealth around" morally appealing, and they might vote for him based on that.


moreover, there are undoubtedly a lot of people out there who are opposed to taking "in god we trust" from the dollars or "under god" from the pledge of allegiance (I happen to be one of these people)


liberals have there own scurrilous way of decalring certain issues "off limits", which sometimes smacks of opression and authoritarianism

Posted by: dummypants | October 31, 2008 8:51 PM | Report abuse

I think Dole's ads win her reelection. Brilliantly manipulative, and brilliantly timed.

Posted by: goldbergjeffrey | October 31, 2008 8:49 PM | Report abuse

Interestingly enough, Dole has doubled down with a new ad along the same lines, so she clearly thinks she's hitting a nerve with voters. North Carolina has been known to reward deplorable campaign tactics in the past, so we will see how this plays.

I think Dole misses an important point in a post-Bush/Rove election -- people associate these tactics with candidates who run campaigns well but government badly. I now am literally praying (being very much a Christian) that Hagan wins. I did not have a huge preference in this race until I saw this ad, but now I see a Dole loss as an imperative. We have to move beyond this nonsense as a country.

Dole's ad put my vote and $100 dollars into the Hagan column.

Posted by: starthom | October 31, 2008 8:47 PM | Report abuse

I live in NC and let's put it this way -- I've seen the Hagan response ad but neither of the Dole ads. It may be controversial but it's not getting much play. Nor does it seem to be getting play on the local news out here. Dole just doesn't have the money to get it on the air out here. Or she gave up on the Raleigh and Greensboro media markets.

Also, I won a shirt once, when can I get it?

Posted by: jesyke | October 31, 2008 8:45 PM | Report abuse


For months I have been writing on this blog in support of Barak Obama. I have tried to push back on the lies and offer some arguments of why Mr. Obama is the right man and John Mccain is not. I don't really have any words left but I want to leave you with this.

BEFORE YOU VOTE VISIT THIS WEBSITE

http://www.vietnamveteransagainstjohnmccain.com/

BEFORE YOU VOTE YOU MUST READ THIS INFORMATION.

http://www.vietnamveteransagainstjohnmccain.com/cin_declassified_landing.htm

BEFOTE YOU VOTE YOU MUST WATCH THIS DOCUMENTARY

http://www.mccainbetrayspows.com/

John Mccain is "Not" the man some of you may think he is. John Mccain is damaged goods. Perhaps due to an inherent personality flaw, or from his war experience John Mccain lacks any empathy for another human being. It has been shown many times in how he has treated his wives and others. He cares about no one but himself. He will lie cheat, steal and exploit anyone for his own selfish needs what ever they are at the time. He is not trustworthy nor an honorable man in any way. I don't really know what else to say. The last straw for me was when he added to his spiel a story about sitting on a flight deck of a carrier with a mission and a target during the Cuba missile crises. More lies by this self aggrandizing phony hero.

This is my closing argument I guess. Please do your own research if need be, it is not too late and protect our country from who would be a very sick and dangerous leader.

I am a veteran, I hold a
Bronze star
Distinguished Service Cross
Soldiers medal
2 Purple Hearts

As a helicopter crewman my job was to retrieve wounded soldiers from the battle field often under fire. I met and knew so many "REAL" heros, I have a very hard time watching and listening to John Mccain as he spews his lies and venom. John Mccain is a piece of filth and I lack the vocabulary to even put into words what a phony he really is. On November 4 you have a choice.

Posted by: popasmoke | October 31, 2008 8:44 PM | Report abuse

This is the most disgusting political ad I have seen since the death of Jesse Helms. Just go to shows you that North Carolina Republicans will do anything.

Posted by: OHIOCITIZEN | October 31, 2008 8:35 PM | Report abuse

Over the line? That's an understatement. The ONLY good thing about this ad is that maybe, maybe, Republicans will be so shamed that they will never run such scurrilous ads again.

Hagan's response was perfect; "not bearing false witness" was priceless.

Posted by: -pamela | October 31, 2008 8:28 PM | Report abuse

this ad was definitely over the line and so is this...

Watch: McCain Just Said Joe The Plumber is "My Role Model"
http://sensico.wordpress.com/2008/10/31/watch-mccain-just-said-joe-the-plumber-is-my-role-model/

Posted by: coba11 | October 31, 2008 8:22 PM | Report abuse

Sorry, I meant North Carolina and not South Carolina in my previous post. (Just waiting to be ridiculed by the Right for my onerous mistake)

Posted by: CynthiaD1 | October 31, 2008 8:00 PM | Report abuse

Samuel Johnson was wrong. It's religion and not patriotism that is the last refuge of a scoundrel.

That this ad seems to backfiring in SC, maybe the heart of the Bible Belt, has given me hope about America.

Posted by: CynthiaD1 | October 31, 2008 7:56 PM | Report abuse

ZWrite - I think you're a little over the top with your criticism of this remark: "The ad, which, unless you have been hiding under a rock for the last few days, you have either seen or heard about."

It's not at all unreasonable to assume that the people who frequent this blog have indeed seen the ad unless they've been without electricity or hiding under a rock. The blog isn't written for or likely of any interest to the 90 percent of the population to which you refer. So maybe you might want to lighten up just a hair?

I'm just saying.

Posted by: kemp13 | October 31, 2008 7:54 PM | Report abuse

I live in NC and voted today. I voted for Obama, and had been thinking about voting for Dole, even though she has been largely useless as our Senator, only because I have some misgivings about the Democrats having completely unchecked power.

But after seeing Dole's ad, no way would I ever vote for her again. In fact, I have decided that I don't care if the Democrats end up with 100 Senators.

The Republican party, which I once proudly called myself a member of, has so disintegrated at very level, so sold their soul I can no longer stand it.

If the Republican party can no longer be anything other than a mouthpiece for the fear mongering Christianists, and the no nothing likes of Palin and "Joe the Plumber", then I hope it is crushed into the dustbin of history.

Maybe one day the ghosts of Goldwater and Reagan can insp[ire a new party to become what the Republicans should be. Until then, I will take my chances with the Democrats being fully in control.

Posted by: sagedil | October 31, 2008 7:50 PM | Report abuse

Zwrite,
First off there is no need to be insulting towards CC (calling someone an "idiot" is no way to conduct a civil debate).

Secondly I think his comment wasn't meant to be taken all that seriously. So please chill out!

Thirdly the ad has been all over cable news, so you don't have to be a political junkie to have come across it. So CC's off hand comment is actually not that off base. It is conceivable that regular channel flippers would have come across it too (and without having to dig up polls, I can tell you that is probably 2/3 of the US pop).

Now on to the ad. It very nicely surmises what the GOP is all about. Fear mongering, name calling and unethical campaigning.

Posted by: mujnoon | October 31, 2008 7:38 PM | Report abuse

Are the republicans purposely trying to lose as many elections as they can? First we have Michelle Bachman trying to figure out which one of her colleagues are "un american", then we have Dole essentially calling her opponent "Godless", and McCain and Palin basically calling Obama every name in the book! Haven't they figured out that the American people are tired of this and will reject it out of hand? Not very bright campaign strategies.

Posted by: jerzygrl | October 31, 2008 7:27 PM | Report abuse

Cilizza--"The ad, which, unless you have been hiding under a rock for the last few days, you have either seen or heard about."

Cilizza, you are so far out of it that it defies description. I'm a political junkie so I have heard about the ad. I spent three or four hours per day reading political and news stories and I think I first read about the ad yesterday.

For you to insult the 90-plus percent of Americans who have NOT heard about the ad shows that it is YOU who is living under a rock.

Are you really so out of touch that you think that anyone who isn't a news junkie is an idiot? Sir, it is you who is an idiot.

I have seen the "living under a rock" phrase used for many facts, but never for anything as trivial as a North Carolina Senate advertisement that has been in the news for about a minute.

Your thinking is emblematic of "Inside The Beltway" thinking. It doesn't surprise me that so many "Inside The Beltway" thinkers are so often wrong although they think they can't possibly be wrong.

Shalom,
ZWrite

Posted by: zwrite | October 31, 2008 7:20 PM | Report abuse

Actually, Balabanto, Hitler was a church-going Christian who put religion into most of his speeches. That is why he targeted Jews, because they "killed Christ" and other groups such as gays and gypsies.

This kind of political BS thrown around is why it is so important to separate church and state. Combining them leads to corruption on both sides. They are supposed to address different things in life: church is for spiritual and moral things, state is for material and social/societal things where people of different belief systems must work together for the common good.

When they are mixed you end up with big problems. It's not a pretty picture.

Posted by: splashy8 | October 31, 2008 7:18 PM | Report abuse

I thought the Republicans were the party speaking from high moral rectitude. This ad from Dole obviously came from the wrong end of the elephant.

Posted by: bcause | October 31, 2008 7:17 PM | Report abuse

Way, Way out of line, as are 90% of the Republican's ads. When will they learn? Everybody knows that swiftboating (slandering) opponents delivered us George W, the hugest disaster in American history. People have stopped listening! People are disgusted! Can't believe anything they say anymore. The Republican's childish, deceptive, immature personal attacks have absolutely set the GOP back decades.

Posted by: rsampson02 | October 31, 2008 7:10 PM | Report abuse

I'm not a Christian. I'm Jewish AND non-practicing. I don't even live in the state in which the ad was run.

Nonetheless, Elizabeth Dole's ad is offensive to me not as a religious person, but as an American.

America was founded on these principles:

1) Separation of Church and State: Your faith has nothing to do with your ability to govern. That's the entire point of living in this country. The fact that Elizabeth Dole chose to do this is not only just plain rude, it ignores the fundamental precepts upon which the founding fathers designed our constitution.

2) Good Manners: It's rude, in ANY company, to call someone else "godless." It has connotations above and beyond religion, and implies a kind of ruthlessness of character that decries all good sense. Hitler is godless. Osama Bin-Laden is godless. Kay Hagan is not. The word Godless not only implies that you have forsaken God, but, in addition, that you have willfully and deliberately given yourself to EVIL.(And yes it is possible to be good without religion, just as it is possible to be evil without religion) If you're not religious, it's just plain mean. If you are, it means you're making a judgement above and beyond your perogatives in your own religion. Either way, it's wrong.

3)This is a smear on the Republican party as a whole and reflects badly on John McCain. People might not see it that way, but right now, that state is a swing state and it will affect people's vote at the national level. It shows a kind of poor judgement and disrespect for one's own political party, as well as a disrespect for other people in that party who are running for office. Am I voting for Barack Obama? Sure! But that doesn't mean that this isn't disrespectful of other Republicans, who are still, at this moment, WAY more American in their beliefs and values than Elizabeth Dole and her decision to run this ad.

Posted by: Balabanto | October 31, 2008 7:10 PM | Report abuse

This ad really takes the cake for worst - and most desperate - political ad in quite a long time. Literally using fake a voice over to imply that your opponent really said the words is beyond the pale.

http://www.political-buzz.com/

Posted by: parkerfl1 | October 31, 2008 7:07 PM | Report abuse

Way over the line.

This Dole is ripe to be canned.

Posted by: svreader | October 31, 2008 7:06 PM | Report abuse

It’s a shameless ploy by Dole to tar an obviously religious opponent. It’s the same guilt-by-association sleaze that’s being purveyed from top to bottom (by the Republicans) this election season. Here’s to hoping that the massive surge of early voting in North Carolina will help Hagan overcome Dole’s last minute sleaze-fest. (Almost 60% of the total voters in 2004 have already voted in NC.)

One quick aside, is there no cognitive dissonance when the “appoint strictly constructivist judges” crowd brushes away separation of church and state?

Posted by: sahildmehta | October 31, 2008 7:04 PM | Report abuse

This is the nail in the coffin for Dole. Liddy went one step too far in desperation, and the local press is eviscerating her for mistake.

Posted by: Groundhogday1 | October 31, 2008 6:00 PM | Report abuse

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