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The Debate Over the Debate

Barack Obama and John McCain

Barack Obama and John McCain will have different sets of expectations to meet and hurdles to clear in Friday's debate.. (Photo by Shannon Stapleton-Pool/Getty Images)

It's debate week in Washington!

The first presidential debate between Barack Obama and John McCain is set for Friday night (hello viewers!) at the University of Mississippi in Oxford. The theme will be foreign policy -- theoretically ground on which both men are comfortable.

(The Fix will be twittering the debate live on Friday night so make sure to sign up for our feed a.s.a.p. We've got 982 followers. Who will be the 1,000th?)

And, what would a debate week be without loads of expectation setting?

David Broder, the dean of the Washington political press corps, started the week out right with his Sunday column (the political week in Washington starts on Sunday) in which he laid out the differing goals for Obama and McCain in their first tête-à-tête.

"Obama is known for his eloquence, while McCain often struggles even when given a decent script to read," writes Broder. "That creates an expectation that the Democrat ought to dominate when the two men are directly compared."

Not so, according to the operatives Broder talked with -- several of whom noted that McCain's declarative delivery makes him more effective as a communicator than he is given credit for while Obama's tendency to "bury the lead" in his answers makes him less effective.

So, what should the goalposts be that each man needs to reach Friday night?

Let's start with Broder's take.

McCain must, according to Broder, "somehow convince voters that he would be fundamentally different from George Bush, whose policies and methods have been overwhelmingly rejected."

Obama, on the other hand, must "show enough of himself that voters come to believe that despite not being able to identify with aspects of his exotic life story, they can trust him to look out for their interests as president," writes Broder.

What else do the two candidates need to do?

We'll have a full rundown later in the week when we handicap the debate but here are a few Fix thoughts to tide you over until then:

• McCain must avoid the robotic answers and forced smiles that hurt him during the Republican primary debates. McCain's messaging in those debates was spot on but the way he presented his points -- a staccato delivery punctuated by his "my friends" verbal tic -- made it difficult to see the proverbial forest through the trees.

• Obama, too, has stylistic work to do. Too often he seems removed from the real people behind each of the questions, too focused on making a sweeping point when a narrowly focused answer showing his empathy for voters would do better. Obama must be particularly cautious not to lapse into professor-speak in this foreign-policy themed debate. McCain is likely to make it a black and white issue; we have to win and the terrorists have to lose. Obama's positioning is more nuanced which can be dangerous in a debate setting where each candidate has two minutes or less to make his point.

• Debates, as we learned during the primary season, are all about one (or two) big moments that come to set the narrative. Both men are familiar enough with each other that they will almost certainly have a few witty rejoinders in their hip pocket to roll out. Can they find their own "I knew Jack Kennedy" or "I am not going to exploit for political purposes my opponent's youth and inexperience" insta-classic? If either does, he will have the early leg up in the post debate handicapping.

By Chris Cillizza  |  September 22, 2008; 3:40 PM ET
Categories:  Eye on 2008  
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Comments

Kudos to the debate Commission for not buying into this latest McCain stunt. Are we to believe that the candidates themselves are needed for the direct negotiations between Congress and the administration? Hardly. Is McCain trying to tell us he can't walk and chew gum at the same time? Or is he just plain chicken?

Posted by: jefflz | September 24, 2008 7:34 PM | Report abuse

will trade info and soldiers for food...
all you gotta do is ask ;)

Posted by: mccain aka songbird | September 24, 2008 3:58 PM | Report abuse

What's up with Barry Hussein's (aka Senator Purple Lips) hair?????

Posted by: Nadeem Zakaria | September 22, 2008 6:17 PM

----------------------------------
Nadeem, what's up with McCains (hair) comb over? What's wrong with his jaw area? Oh yeah, he has cancer. Is that the reason no hair and bad jaw line?

Posted by: Sherubye | September 24, 2008 2:14 PM | Report abuse

---------SEN. OBAMA IS A COWARD !!!!!!!!!!!!

One thing Sen. Obama is known for, superficial solutions. Unlike Sen. McCain who has experience to back up his answers on a debate, Sen. Obama relies on pre prepared answers and sound-good superficial answers/promises.

BTW, I see Sen. Obama is using an older white man to hone his debating skills. My bet is that he is also using this older white man to gain courage to face master, Sen. McCain. What a coward!!!

Posted by: Anonymous | September 24, 2008 8:16 AM | Report abuse

I AM NOT A CROOK!

Posted by: RICHARD NIXON (R) | September 23, 2008 9:02 PM | Report abuse

READ MY LIPS...THE ECONOMY IS SOUND!

Posted by: MCCAIN | September 23, 2008 8:27 PM | Report abuse

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Posted by: Anonymous | September 23, 2008 6:41 PM | Report abuse

Anonymous at 8:51 PM:

Are you a retard?

Posted by: JTR | September 22, 2008 10:26 PM

_________________________

no, but mccain is a traitor and 'manchurain candidate'

Posted by: Anonymous | September 23, 2008 4:45 PM | Report abuse

Sean Hannity has never danced with his wife. What a sissy and he had the nerve to mention that on FOXNEWS.

I bet Hannity's wife is dancing now. Hannity kissing someone's elses shlong when he kisses his wife!

Posted by: DANCE KING | September 23, 2008 4:10 PM | Report abuse

THANKS BUT NO THANKS PALIN! WE DON'T NEED YOUR KIND IN N.Y. TO PROTEST IRAN LEADER.

Posted by: GEORGIAN PRESIDENT | September 23, 2008 4:01 PM | Report abuse

Plain Palin nothing but a skid mark.

Posted by: duece coop | September 23, 2008 3:59 PM | Report abuse

4,153 U.S. SOLDIERS DEAD IN IRAQ....

Posted by: PENTAGON | September 23, 2008 3:55 PM | Report abuse

The debate over how many teleprompters Obama needs intensified this week. Obama also requested the ability to wear a headset, similar to what the coach wears at a football game, so he can get his answers from his "advisors" more rapidly and fit it into the two minute time limit!
An empty suit makes the loudest sound!

Posted by: WallyG | September 23, 2008 1:00 PM | Report abuse

I suggest president Obama appoint McCain U.S. Ambassador to Viet Nam.

Irony drips...

Posted by: Stephen | September 23, 2008 12:25 PM | Report abuse

CC...I think 'old man' David Broder is missing the point. I believe you need to throw out the primary debate performances. The first debate will be about foreign policy. Expect McCain to offer short direct answers except when talking about Iraq. I expect to hear a lot of "the surge has worked. We will not retreat in defeat" statements from McCain. I think Obama is going to come to the debate expecting a "knife fight" but will bring a "masheti"!

Posted by: Obama-Junkie | September 23, 2008 12:22 PM | Report abuse

@ mindCANADIAN: Well, the whole rest of the world must live a fantasy life of suburban luxury then because Obama is well-respected and McCain is loathed pretty much everywhere but in just under half of the USA.

Everybody has challenges in his or her life, friend. I really enjoyed my city blown to bits by that monster Colin Powell for no good reason and not being able to go to the supermarket because of marauding gangs of "the (bestill my heart) troops," hassling everybody, pretending to aim at them with their weapons, screaming rebel yells at the top of their lungs, shooting rifles in the air, and defacing churches. Nice.

I still think GHW Bush was a good president though. So, was Clinton. Obama will probably be a good one, too. It doesn't matter. My president is Martin Torrijos until May of 2009. He's sharper than either McCain or Obama. He figured out how to have 10% flat tax, 1% capital gains tax, and single-payer health care including branches of Johns Hopkins University Hospital, and Presbyterian.

Posted by: DexterManley | September 23, 2008 10:10 AM | Report abuse

Evaluate before placing emphasis on this Obama "bounce". This is the year a Democrat could put a dog as a nominee and still win. As we stand, Obama is questionably ahead nationwide, and his electoral college "led" is even more questionable. This is of course assuming the polls are a reasonable indication.

2004: On election day, John Kerry entered the day with a lead in all polls, and pundits confidently predicted he would win 300 electoral college votes. Even the venerated pollster James Zogby, of impeccable accuracy, predicted a Kerry Presidency. When the dust settled, Bush not only retained his ttitle, but did it with the highest number of votes a nominee ever received. The democratic shock was palpable: how was this possible? Then information filtered in regarding the ground game the Republicans ran. While the Democrats were busy hooting away on tv and radio, the long arm of the Republican party slowly chipped away in small towns, churches, parihes, community centers (you get the picture). Suddenly, a large swath of voters previously undetected by pollsters showed up and swept Bush into power. This is why many saw a Democratic nominee needs at least a 7-10 point lead just to be competitive.

As we speak, the McCain team is grinding away on the ground. The Evangelicals are rejuvenated, and that is major trouble for Obama. The size of the Evangelical voting block is massive, and they are spread through a large chunk of the country. When reports arrive of 60,000 at a local rally, this is concerning if you are a Democrat.

Thus the difference between the Democrats and Repuublican elite. The Democratic elite, and the "Obama nation", live in a fantasy world. They are individuals who grew up in relatively safe, un-eventful lives. They have a skewed view of life, one not seriously challenged to form their view. This is why they their fantasy views of mankind holding hands under a rainbow, singing and dancing. This is why they are oblivious to the fact that the political process is an organice entity which has survived the test of time, and adapted. To ridiculously come in and "change the system" is an open invitation to disaster. of course, if you grew up in a life with any type of challenge, you have a greater worldview...you have wisdom. They only thing they have is suburban angst.

I have many, many other reasons to describe why Obama will need a miracle to win. His race, his inability to connect with mainstream Americans and Republicans, the deepening staleness of his image, Michelle, the judgementalism his movement carries, his complete lack of experience. The list continues. The Democrats need to begin evaluating how to re-organize after this apocalyptic loss for their party.

There is a reason why the Republican representatives on television suddenly seem energized and confident. They know something the Democrats do not. It is called common sense and knowledge of life and human nature.

Posted by: mindCanadian | September 23, 2008 9:48 AM | Report abuse

Does anyone else miss the lean plate club?

Posted by: Sally Fan | September 23, 2008 9:46 AM | Report abuse

McCain's tasks: Learn the difference between fiscal and monetary. Double up on the white pancake makeup. An Adderall and a double-bourbon. Be as angry as possible. DON'T SAY THE "N" WORD!!!!!

Obama's tasks: He's got three debates with a guy short on brains and long on temper. Answer the questions simply and calmly with no rhetoric whatsoever. This is a stroll in the park on a sunny day. Wait for the the mean old man to lose it.

HERE'S A FUN GAME: SOME CABINET SCENARIOS

OBAMA WINS 290-245.

HEAD OF CEA: Alan Blinder

TREASURY SECRETARY: Mike Bloomberg

ATTORNEY GENERAL: Deval Patrick

SECRETARY OF DEFENSE: Wesley Clark

CHIEF OF STAFF: Eric Holder

SECRETARY OF STATE: The return of ZbigBrez

OR McCAIN WINS 270-265

HEAD OF CEA: Newt Gingrich

TREASURY SECRETARY: Carleton Fiorina

ATTORNEY GENERAL: Rudolph Giuliani

SECRETARY OF DEFENSE: Peter Pace

CHIEF OF STAFF: Steve Schmidt

SECRETARY OF STATE: Joe Lieberman

WHITE HOUSE COUNSEL: Jefferson Sessions

Posted by: DexterManley | September 23, 2008 9:38 AM | Report abuse

poortrekker- Excellent post on why to vote Republican! Shared it with some friends, with proper attribution to you.

Posted by: MemphisDem | September 23, 2008 9:06 AM | Report abuse

McCain had access to all the questions in his last debate with Obama. Let's hope it doesn't happen again.

Posted by: seems to me | September 23, 2008 9:01 AM | Report abuse

.

Voted One Of This Year's Best Political Blogs For the Election Of 2008

http://www.myspace.com/37thandostreet

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.


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Voted One Of This Year's Best Political Blogs For the Election Of 2008

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BOOKMARK IT NOW !!!!


.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 23, 2008 8:28 AM | Report abuse

Anonymous:

Yeah, I'm going to take that Jawa report page really seriously...especially with that Star Wars font, the US Border Protection banner ad (what screams Republican xenophobe more than patrolling borders with guns? Makes you wonder who the wall is really for), and the idiotic blanket statement that tolerance of evil is a crime (I guess that depends who is calling what "evil", doesn't it?).

And as for calling the New York Times' September 3rd article a "retraction", that's a stretch indeed; I would characterize it as more of a clarification. Mr Palin was a member of the Alaskan Independence Party for SEVEN years, and he's MARRIED to Sarah Palin. You don't think there's some mutual support going on there? On top of that, she recorded a video greeting for their convention. That's a pretty darn iron-clad association, folks.

Consider how the Republicans might have reacted if it came to light that Joe Biden (or even Michelle Obama--imagine THAT!) had been associated with a "third party" (gosh, lock up the children!).

Nice try.

Posted by: cbmtrx | September 23, 2008 7:47 AM | Report abuse

Vote Republican because the best way to improve military morale is to praise the troops in speeches while slashing veterans' benefits and combat pay.

Vote Republican because "Standing Tall for America" means firing your workers and moving their jobs to India.

Vote Republican because a woman can't be trusted with decisions about her own body, but multi-national corporations can make decisions affecting all mankind without regulation.

Vote Republican because Jesus loves you, and shares your hatred of homosexuals and Hillary Clinton.

Vote Republican because Government should relax regulation of Big Business and Big Money but crack down on individuals who use marijuana to relieve the pain of illness.

Vote Republican because group sex and drug use are degenerate sins unless you someday run for governor of California as a Republican.

Vote Republican because if condoms are kept out of schools, adolescents won't have sex.

Vote Republican because a good way to fight terrorism is to belittle our long-time allies, then demand their cooperation and money.

Vote Republican because HMOs and insurance companies have the interest of the public at heart.

Vote Republican because providing health care to all Iraqis is sound policy. Providing health care to all Americans is socialism.

Vote Republican because global warming and tobacco's link to cancer are junk science, but creationism should be taught in schools.

Vote Republican because Saddam was a good guy when Reagan armed him, a bad guy when Bush's daddy made war on him, a good guy when Cheney did business with him and a bad guy when Bush needed a "we can't find Bin Laden" diversion.

Vote Republican because being a drug addict is a moral failing and a crime, unless you're a conservative radio host. Then it's an illness and you need our prayers for your recovery.

Vote Republican because a president lying about an extramarital affair is an impeachable offense. A president lying to enlist support for a war in which thousands die is solid defense policy.

Vote Republican because Government should limit itself to the powers named in the Constitution, which include banning gay marriages and censoring the Internet.

Vote Republican because the public has a right to know about Hillary's cattle trades, but George Bush's driving record is none of our business.

Vote Republican because what Bill Clinton did in the 1960s is of vital national interest, but what Bush did in the '80s is irrelevant.

Vote Republican because trade with Cuba is wrong because the country is communist, but trade with China and Vietnam is vital to a spirit of international harmony.

Vote Republican because "Country First" is more important than "Family First".

Vote Republican because winning an election by hook or by crook is better for the country than losing it fairly and honestly.

Posted by: poortrekker | September 23, 2008 7:32 AM | Report abuse

[Subject] StateDemocracy.org Equips You for the 2008 Elections

Dear Citizen:
Are you ready yet for the November 4th Elections? How about your friends, family, and neighbors?
More Americans are expected to vote this year than ever before in history, so don’t be left out! Be sure to ask everyone you know the following questions:
 Are you registered to vote? If you moved recently, have you updated your voter registration?
 Did you apply for an Absentee Ballot? Do you know your state may not require any reason?
 Can you find your local Polling Place? Do you know it may have changed from last time?
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Lobby Congress Via StateDemocracy
StateDemocracy.org also equips you to maintain an active dialog with your state and federal lawmakers once they are elected. And RIGHT NOW is an especially opportune time to contact your U.S. Senators and House Member, as Congress takes up major legislation on such issues as offshore oil drilling, another economic stimulus package and all federal appropriations bills over the next few weeks.
As you lobby your elected officials, remember that lawmakers view your constituent input as reflective of scores of other citizens who felt similarly, but didn’t have (or take) the time to share their opinions.
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Over the past 5 months, you may have visited www.LobbyDelegates.com, along with 26,000 other visitors. This latest public interest portal by the StateDemocracy Foundation remained the only online tool enabling rank-and-file Democrats to lobby all 800+ Super Delegates on which candidate to back for the party’s Presidential nomination.
StateDemocracy Foundation Website Users Unite!
Many of you have used our StateDemocracy.org and LobbyDelegates.com tools in recent times, and have hopefully found your experience uplifting and empowering. I encourage all of you to help spread the news about StateDemocracy.org to enable more of our fellow citizens to Connect! Engage! And Empower!
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Posted by: timothy moriarty | September 23, 2008 5:58 AM | Report abuse

"smearing/destroying Sarah Palin"...? What a load. Here's a repetitive talking point that continues to fall flat. Sarah Palin is a lightweight, and the more journalists due their due diligence the more obvious this is. America has been run by a C grade student for eight years and look where it's brought us. We need no more of that. The last I looked, looking deeply at a person's resume and finding them wanting is not smearing them -- it's intelligent hiring!

Posted by: Flotsam | September 23, 2008 2:05 AM | Report abuse

You have got to read this beautiful piece of investigative journalism folks,

http://mypetjawa.mu.nu/archives/194057.php

How the Obama campaign has systematically gone about smearing/destroying Sarah Palin. If this bit of astro-turfing conducted by David Axelrod is not similar, even better than, the Rovian strategy of doing character assassination then what is?

Note how the involved parties, including David Axelrod, embarked today on trying to delete accounts and modifying wikipedia entries inside an hour after this piece was published.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 23, 2008 1:20 AM | Report abuse

You have got to read this beautiful piece of investigative journalism folks,

http://mypetjawa.mu.nu/archives/194057.php

How the Obama campaign has systematically gone about smearing/destroying Sarah Palin. If this bit of astro-turfing conducted by David Axelrod is not similar, even better than, the Rovian strategy of doing character assassination then what is?

Note how the involved parties, including David Axelrod, embarked today on trying to delete accounts and modifying wikipedia entries inside an hour after this piece was published.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 23, 2008 1:19 AM | Report abuse

You have got to read this beautiful piece of investigative journalism folks,

http://mypetjawa.mu.nu/archives/194057.php

How the Obama campaign has systematically gone about smearing/destroying Sarah Palin. If this bit of astro-turfing conducted by David Axelrod is not similar, even better than, the Rovian strategy of doing character assassination then what is?

Note how the involved parties, including David Axelrod, embarked today on trying to delete accounts and modifying wikipedia entries inside an hour after this piece was published.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 23, 2008 1:19 AM | Report abuse

Obama is really just an intellectual lightweight. He just spews the same old tired Democrat talking points we've heard for the last 30 years, hemming and hawing as he struggles to find words. I think that tough old salty dog McCain will clean his clock in the debate.

Posted by: daman1 | September 23, 2008 1:03 AM | Report abuse

Why would America REWARD complete Republican failure ?

We wont.

Posted by: PulSamsara | September 23, 2008 1:01 AM | Report abuse

"Daily Kos" is a bunch of gutter trash and lies spewed by America-hating, emotionally disturbed freaks with no life

Posted by: Jay | September 23, 2008 12:14 AM | Report abuse

"HC has raised millions for you jerks and received zilch from you guys in return towads her debt. We begged you to stop that garbage months ago and 43 day before the election we still have to listen to this nonsense. If O should lose we should hold you nasty O supporters responsible for it b/c you never quit spewing your obsessive hatred of the Clntons."

Get over yourself. Hillary was pretty damn vicious towards Obama and turned off a lot of people by doing so. No one forced her to insinuate that Obama is secretly a Muslim. No one forced her to start associating him with Louis Farrakhan. No one forced her to start talking about how Obama doesn't represent the will of "white" America. Non one asked her to disparage Obama supporters by calling them elitist and accusing them to force their will on the rest of America. No one forced her to stay in a race she had clearly lost.

Despite all that, Obama worked hard to get his donors to give her money. Its not his fault that people aren't interested in charity for a multi-millionaire. (make no mistake. Once she stopped running for President, all her donations became charity) People are interested in winning the Presidency and Senate seats.

Obama still tried, though. Obama continued to kiss her ass at every single speech.

Now its wonderful that 18 million Hillary supporters are in such a spot that they can afford to cast "spite" votes. By staying in the race too long and by disparaging Obama in that time, she has hurt the cause that she claims to have been fighting for. Now all the prominent Democratic politicians in country are working to get Obama elected. They would have done the same if Clinton got nominated. It's not unreasonable to ask her to put in the effort to do the same.

Now if she's not interested in doing so, that's fine. It's a free country and that's the decision she is free to make. But don't try and play some kind of emotional blackmail game. People have good reason to be upset at Clinton for how she behaved during the primaries. If her narcissism is so great that she feels she continues to deserve profuse ass-kissing, then she is lost to the cause. People can only put up with that kind of nonsense for so long. If the country can survive eight years of Bush, then it can survive eight weeks of Hillary.

Posted by: DDAWD | September 22, 2008 11:20 PM | Report abuse

Maybe Bush can come back on and claim to have passed a Patients Bill of Rights as Governor in Texas, when in fact the legislature overrode his veto. Even then he refused to sign it.

And afterwards, the networks can all hammer on Gore as the liar for claiming to have visited Houston with the FEMA director 6 years prior, when in reality it was the DEPUTY director.

Those were the last debates I ever watched. Basically W didn't pee on himself, and for "beating expectations," he was declared the winner. Sad and pathetic, sort of like American politics. And we wonder why we end up with sad and pathetic government.

Posted by: Cant Watch TV | September 22, 2008 11:15 PM | Report abuse

Dear Citizen:
Are you ready yet for the November 4th Elections? How about your friends, family, and neighbors?
More Americans are expected to vote this year than ever before in history, so don’t be left out! Be sure to ask everyone you know the following questions:
 Are you registered to vote? If you moved recently, have you updated your voter registration?
 Did you apply for an Absentee Ballot? Do you know your state may not require any reason?
 Can you find your local Polling Place? Do you know it may have changed from last time?
The answers to these questions -- and all your voting needs -- can be found at www.StateDemocracy.org -- the FREE 1-Stop citizen empowerment portal that Delivers Democracy to your Desktop! StateDemocracy is among the Internet’s first (since 2001) and most encompassing civic empowerment tools.
In order to boost voter participation this year, StateDemocracy.org is offering FREE widgets for all 50 states. You can simply download and embed these widgets into your own website so your visitors can register to vote, get an absentee ballot or find their local polling place.
Lobby Congress Via StateDemocracy
StateDemocracy.org also equips you to maintain an active dialog with your state and federal lawmakers once they are elected. And RIGHT NOW is an especially opportune time to contact your U.S. Senators and House Member, as Congress takes up major legislation on such issues as offshore oil drilling, another economic stimulus package and all federal appropriations bills over the next few weeks.
As you lobby your elected officials, remember that lawmakers view your constituent input as reflective of scores of other citizens who felt similarly, but didn’t have (or take) the time to share their opinions.
LobbyDelegates.com Further Empowered Grassroots Voices
Over the past 5 months, you may have visited www.LobbyDelegates.com, along with 26,000 other visitors. This latest public interest portal by the StateDemocracy Foundation remained the only online tool enabling rank-and-file Democrats to lobby all 800+ Super Delegates on which candidate to back for the party’s Presidential nomination.
StateDemocracy Foundation Website Users Unite!
Many of you have used our StateDemocracy.org and LobbyDelegates.com tools in recent times, and have hopefully found your experience uplifting and empowering. I encourage all of you to help spread the news about StateDemocracy.org to enable more of our fellow citizens to Connect! Engage! And Empower!
Sincerely,
Ken Laureys, Executive Director
StateDemocracy Foundation
Ken.Laureys@StateDemocracy.org

P.S. If you are interested in becoming more involved in our StateDemocracy Foundation -- including volunteering as an Advisory Board Member -- please contact me.

Posted by: Kathy | September 22, 2008 11:09 PM | Report abuse


Anonymous at 8:51 PM:

Are you a retard?

Posted by: JTR | September 22, 2008 10:26 PM | Report abuse

between mccain & palin you have 2 of the dumbest, yet evil and maniacal people in the country...

they are really bonkers, yet dangerous
give them the chance and they willmake the damage bush did to the Country look like childs play...

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 9:55 PM | Report abuse

$700 Billion to Save Goldman

money given to Goldman ex Boss

Who will operate in secret with exemption from all laws.

Hey Hank can I have a Job?

Posted by: thankgoditsonlyworthlessdollars | September 22, 2008 9:40 PM | Report abuse

hiari, a billion = a thousand millions, not a million millions.

Too bad...

Posted by: MarkInAustin | September 22, 2008 9:31 PM | Report abuse

Works for me, Hiari.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 9:07 PM | Report abuse

"Jokes about incest have no place in our society- that is simply sick and terrible."

but it's okay to force a female victim of incestuous rape to carry the pregnancy to term... and if she reported the rape to law enforcement, to pay for the rape kit from her own pocket. so demented.

worse than NIXON.

much worse.

Posted by: George W. McLiar | September 22, 2008 9:05 PM | Report abuse

Give every American 1 million dollars that would = 300 billion dollars across the united states, this is better then giving 700 billion dollars to the corporations who have been stealing and cheating us for the pass 150 years and a savings of 450 billion dollars based on the 700 billion dollar bailout figure and will definantly jumpstart the economy.

Give Every American 1 million dollars instead of crooked corporations 700 billion dollars.

hiari

Posted by: hiari | September 22, 2008 9:05 PM | Report abuse

"Dream on dems... I remember hearing that Mondale, Dukakis, Gore and Kerry were going to win for sure... 2 winners in 40 years, that's all you have..."

Yes, you have so much to be proud of. Good job with the George Bush pick. Although we can't count the time the Supreme Court elected him. Much to be proud of.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 8:59 PM | Report abuse

"Dream on dems... I remember hearing that Mondale, Dukakis, Gore and Kerry were going to win for sure... 2 winners in 40 years, that's all you have..."

I know, its pretty sad, especially when you look at the losers who beat them.

Posted by: DDAWD | September 22, 2008 8:53 PM | Report abuse

The Post should stop people from writing too much in the comment box. If people cannot be succinct in two paragraphs then they should stop commenting altogether. I will contact the Post to tell them to change it. Please join me in asking the post to stop these retards.

Posted by: Omidal | September 22, 2008 8:42 PM

Really?

FACT SHEET: Unremarkable Military record of John Sidney McCain III
Both McCain III’s father and grandfather were Admirals in the United States Navy. His father
Admiral John S. ”Junior” McCain was commander of U.S. forces in Europe - later commander of
American forces in Vietnam while McCain III was being held prisoner of war. His grandfather
John S. McCain, Sr. commanded naval aviation at the Battle of Okinawa in 1945.
McCain III, like his father and grandfather, also attended the United States Naval Academy.
McCain III finished near the bottom of his graduating class in 1958.

McCain III lost five U.S. Navy aircraft
1 - Student pilot McCain III lost jet number one in 1958 when he plunged into Corpus
Christi Bay while practicing landings.
2 - Pilot McCain III lost another plane two years later while he was deployed in the
Mediterranean. ”Flying too low over the Iberian Peninsula, he took out some power lines
which led to a spate of newspaper stories in which he was predictably identified as the
son of an admiral.
3 - Pilot McCain III lost number three in 1965 when he was returning from flying a Navy
trainer solo to Philadelphia for an Army-Navy football game. McCain III radioed, ”I’ve got
a flameout” and ejected at one thousand feet. The plane crashed to the ground and
McCain III floated to a deserted beach.
4 - Combat pilot McCain III lost his fourth on July 29, 1967, soon after he was assigned to
the USS Forrestal as an A-4 Skyhawk combat pilot. While waiting his turn for takeoff, an
accidently fired rocket slammed into McCain Jr’s. plane. He escaped from the burning
aircraft, but the explosions that followed killed 134 sailors, destroyed at least 20 aircraft,
and threatened to sink the ship.
5 - Combat pilot McCain III lost a fifth plane three months later (Oct. 26, 1967) during his
23rd mission over North Vietnam when he failed to avoid a surface-to-air missile. McCain
III ejected from the plane breaking both arms and a leg in the process and subsequently
parachuted into Truc Bach Lake near Hanoi. After being pulled from the lake by the North
Vietnamese, McCain III was bayoneted in his left foot and shoulder and struck by a rifle
butt. He was then transported to the Hoa Lo Prison, also known as the Hanoi Hilton.

1973 New York Daily News labeled POW McCain III a “PW Songbird”
On McCain III’s fourth day of being denied medical treatment, slapped, and threatened with
death by the communist (they were demanding military information in exchange for medical
treatment), McCain III broke and told his interrogator, ”O.K., I’ll give you military information if you
will take me to the hospital.” U.S. News and World Report, May 14, 1973 article written by former
POW John McCain.
It was then that the communist learned that McCain III’s father was Admiral John S. McCain,
the soon-to-be commander of all U.S. Forces in the Pacific. The Vietnamese rushed McCain III to
Gai Lam military hospital (U.S. government documents), a medical facility normally unavailable
for U.S. POWs.
By Nov. 9, 1967 (U.S. government documents) Hanoi press was quoting McCain III describing
his mission including the number of aircraft in his flight, information about rescue ships, and the
order of which U.S. attacks would take place.
While in still in North Vietnam’s military hospital, McCain III gave an interview to prominent
French television reporter Francois Chalais for a series titled Life in Hanoi. Chalais’ interview with
McCain III was aired in Europe.
Vietnamese doctors operated on McCain’s Leg in early December, 1967.
Six weeks after he was shot down, McCain was taken from the hospital and delivered to a
U.S. POW camp,
In May of 1968, McCain III allowed himself to be interviewed by two North Vietnamese
generals at separate times.” May 14, 1973 article written by former POW John McCain
In August 1968, other POWs learned for the first time that John McCain III had been taken
prisoner.
On June 5, 1969, the New York Daily News reported in a article headlined Reds Say PW
Songbird Is Pilot Son of Admiral, “ . . . Hanoi has aired a broadcast in which the pilot son of
United States Commander in the Pacific, Adm. John McCain, purportedly admits to having
bombed civilian targets in North Vietnam and praises medical treatment he has received since
being taken prisoner . . .” The Washington Post explained McCain III’s broadcast: “The English-
Language broadcast beamed at South Vietnam was one of a series using American prisoners. It
was in response to a plea by Defense Secretary Melvin S. Laird, May 19, that North Vietnam treat
prisoners according to the humanitarian standards set forth by the Geneva Convention.”
In 1970, McCain III agreed to an interview with Dr. Fernando Barral, a Spanish psychiatrist
who was living in Cuba at the time.
The meeting between Barral and McCain III (which was photographed by the Vietnamese)
took place away from the prison at the office of the Committee for Foreign Cultural Relations in
Hanoi (declassified government document). During the meeting, POW McCain sipped coffee and
ate oranges and cakes with the Cuban.
While talking with Barral, McCain III further seriously violated the military Code of Conduct by
failing to evade answering questions ”to the utmost of his ability” when he, according government
documents, helped Barral by answering questions in Spanish, a language McCain had learned in
school. The interview was published in the in January 1970.

McCain III was released from North Vietnam March 15, 1973
In 1993, during one of his many trips back to Hanoi, McCain asked the Vietnamese not to
make public any records they hold pertaining to returned U.S. POWs. McCain III claims, that
while a POW, he tried to kill himself.

McCain III was awarded “medals for valor” equal to nearly a medal-and-a-half for each
hour he spent in combat
For 23 combat missions (an estimated 20 hours over enemy territory), the U.S. Navy awarded
McCain III, the son of famous admirals, a Silver Star, a Legion of Merit for Valor, a Distinguished
Flying Cross, three Bronze Stars, two Commendation medals plus two Purple Hearts and a
dozen service medals.
“McCain had roughly 20 hours in combat,” explains Bill Bell, a veteran of Vietnam and former
chief of the U.S. Office for POW/MIA Affairs -- the first official U.S. representative in Vietnam
since the 1973 fall of Saigon.
“Since McCain got 28 medals,” Bell continued, “that equals to about a medal-and-a-half for
each hour he spent in combat. There were infantry guys -- grunts on the ground -- who had more
than 7,000 hours in combat and I can tell you that there were times and situations where I’m sure
a prison cell would have looked pretty good to them by comparison. The question really is how
many guys got that number of medals for not being shot down.”
For years, McCain has been an unchecked master at manipulating an overly friendly and
biased news media. The former POW turned Congressman, turned U.S. Senator, has managed
to gloss over his failures as a pilot and his collaborations with the enemy to become America’s
POW-hero presidential candidate.
For more information: www.againstmccain.com www.usveterandispatch.com

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 8:51 PM | Report abuse

Dream on dems... I remember hearing that Mondale, Dukakis, Gore and Kerry were going to win for sure... 2 winners in 40 years, that's all you have...

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 8:45 PM | Report abuse

The Post should stop people from writing too much in the comment box. If people cannot be succinct in two paragraphs then they should stop commenting altogether. I will contact the Post to tell them to change it. Please join me in asking the post to stop these retards.

Posted by: Omidal | September 22, 2008 8:42 PM | Report abuse

Leichtman...Not everyone that supports Obama feels that way about the Clintons. Hillary has shown extraordinary strength,character and class. 18 million supporters should not be ignored or forgotten. I believe Obama understands this, even if some of his supporters don't.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 8:40 PM | Report abuse

Leichtman:
Grow up,crybaby.

Posted by: HoosierDaddy | September 22, 2008 8:36 PM | Report abuse

On the eve of the greatest economic crisis since the Great Depression,McCain stated that the U.S. economy is 'fundamentally strong'.
Forget about any debate on foreign policy;it's the economy,stupid!
McCain can talk about the surge all he wants...to no avail.A resurgent Taliban and Al-Qaeda in Afghanistan and Pakistan(did anyone see what happened at the Islamabad Marriott?)negates any notion of McBush being credible on security and foreign policy.This lack of credibility in foreign affairs is surpassed only by his lack of creibility on economic issues.C'mon people,don't buy the McStooge 'bridge to nowhere'.
The only real surge taking place in politics is Obama in the polls.
November 4,2008: Obama 49% / McCain 45% /Barr,Nader,Mickey Mouse 6%
McCain only gets this close because of the closet rascists in this sick society.Fortunately,the die is cast for ol'McCain.
Obama-Biden 2008!


Posted by: HoosierDaddy | September 22, 2008 8:32 PM | Report abuse

On Intrade Obama is beginning to leave Mccain in the dust.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 8:30 PM | Report abuse

"O's campaign should get both WJC and Mrs. WJC off the campaign trail for good. They have their own agenda "

when I read garbage like that it almost makes me want to vote for McCain.

HC has raised millions for you jerks and received zilch from you guys in return towads her debt. We begged you to stop that garbage months ago and 43 day before the election we still have to listen to this nonsense. If O should lose we should hold you nasty O supporters responsible for it b/c you never quit spewing your obsessive hatred of the Clntons.

You will lose if you continue to p.o. her 18 million supporters.

Posted by: Leichtman | September 22, 2008 8:29 PM | Report abuse

When it comes to countries and war there is never a simple reason or solution. It's true that Americans like to be spoon-fed ideas that things are either good vs evil or right vs wrong, but the truth is, it is never that simple. Even George Bush has learned that the hard way. You don't see as much sabre rattling, but you do see a great more discussion.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 8:07 PM | Report abuse

O is up 4+ in VA, tied in NC. O may take NC.

This positive trending is in spite of Wm. J. Clinton's so-called "campaigning" FOR O on "the View" show.

Per usual he refused to endorse and praise O, saying only he thought O would win. How bogus is that?

O's campaign should get both WJC and Mrs. WJC off the campaign trail for good. They have their own agenda. Give WJ a free pass to the Scores gentlemen's club and give the Missus a free 4-hour "coaching session" from "Mrs." Billie Jean King and be done with them. Oy.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 8:03 PM | Report abuse


JOHN MCCAIN LEADER OR MADMAN
YOU BE THE JUDGE.

WASHINGTON — Senator John McCain arrived late at his Senate office on the morning of Sept. 11, 2001, just after the first plane hit the World Trade Center. “This is war,” he murmured to his aides. The sound of scrambling fighter planes rattled the windows, sending a tremor of panic through the room.


Erik Jacobs for The New York Times
John McCain said he had consulted Henry A. Kissinger on foreign policy before and after the Sept. 11 attacks.

Within hours, Mr. McCain, the Vietnam War hero and famed straight talker of the 2000 Republican primary, had taken on a new role: the leading advocate of taking the American retaliation against Al Qaeda far beyond Afghanistan. In a marathon of television and radio appearances, Mr. McCain recited a short list of other countries said to support terrorism, invariably including Iraq, Iran and Syria.

“There is a system out there or network, and that network is going to have to be attacked,” Mr. McCain said the next morning on ABC News. “It isn’t just Afghanistan,” he added, on MSNBC. “I don’t think if you got bin Laden tomorrow that the threat has disappeared,” he said on CBS, pointing toward other countries in the Middle East.

Within a month he made clear his priority. “Very obviously Iraq is the first country,” he declared on CNN. By Jan. 2, Mr. McCain was on the aircraft carrier Theodore Roosevelt in the Arabian Sea, yelling to a crowd of sailors and airmen: “Next up, Baghdad!”

Now, as Mr. McCain prepares to accept the Republican presidential nomination, his response to the attacks of Sept. 11 opens a window onto how he might approach the gravest responsibilities of a potential commander in chief. Like many, he immediately recalibrated his assessment of the unseen risks to America’s security. But he also began to suggest that he saw a new “opportunity” to deter other potential foes by punishing not only Al Qaeda but also Iraq.

“Just as Sept. 11 revolutionized our resolve to defeat our enemies, so has it brought into focus the opportunities we now have to secure and expand our freedom,” Mr. McCain told a NATO conference in Munich in early 2002, urging the Europeans to join what he portrayed as an all but certain assault on Saddam Hussein. “A better world is already emerging from the rubble.”

To his admirers, Mr. McCain’s tough response to Sept. 11 is at the heart of his appeal. They argue that he displayed the same decisiveness again last week in his swift calls to penalize Russia for its incursion into Georgia, in part by sending peacekeepers to police its border.

His critics charge that the emotion of Sept. 11 overwhelmed his former cool-eyed caution about deploying American troops without a clear national interest and a well-defined exit, turning him into a tool of the Bush administration in its push for a war to transform the region.

“He has the personality of a fighter pilot: when somebody stings you, you want to strike out,” said retired Gen. John H. Johns, a former friend and supporter of Mr. McCain who turned against him over the Iraq war. “Just like the American people, his reaction was: show me somebody to hit.”

Whether through ideology or instinct, though, Mr. McCain began making his case for invading Iraq to the public more than six months before the White House began to do the same. He drew on principles he learned growing up in a military family and on conclusions he formed as a prisoner in North Vietnam. He also returned to a conviction about “the common identity” of dangerous autocracies as far-flung as Serbia and North Korea that he had developed consulting with hawkish foreign policy thinkers to help sharpen the themes of his 2000 presidential campaign.

While pushing to take on Saddam Hussein, Mr. McCain also made arguments and statements that he may no longer wish to recall. He lauded the war planners he would later criticize, including Defense Secretary Donald H. Rumsfeld and Vice President Dick Cheney. (Mr. McCain even volunteered that he would have given the same job to Mr. Cheney.) He urged support for the later-discredited Iraqi exile Ahmad Chalabi’s opposition group, the Iraqi National Congress, and echoed some of its suspect accusations in the national media. And he advanced misleading assertions not only about Mr. Hussein’s supposed weapons programs but also about his possible ties to international terrorists, Al Qaeda and the Sept. 11 attacks.

Five years after the invasion of Iraq, Mr. McCain’s supporters note that he became an early critic of the administration’s execution of the occupation, and they credit him with pushing the troop “surge” that helped bring stability. Mr. McCain, though, stands by his support for the war and expresses no regrets about his advocacy.

In written answers to questions, he blamed “Iraq’s opacity under Saddam” for any misleading remarks he made about the peril it posed.

The Sept. 11 attacks “demonstrated the grave threat posed by a hostile regime, possessing weapons of mass destruction, and with reported ties to terrorists,” Mr. McCain wrote in an e-mail message on Friday. Given Mr. Hussein’s history of pursuing illegal weapons and his avowed hostility to the United States, “his regime posed a threat we had to take seriously.” The attacks were still a reminder, Mr. McCain added, of the importance of international action “to prevent outlaw states — like Iran today — from developing weapons of mass destruction.”

Formative Years

Mr. McCain has been debating questions about the use of military force far longer than most. He grew up in a family that had sent a son to every American war since 1776, and international relations were a staple of the McCain family dinner table. Mr. McCain grew up listening to his father, Adm. John S. McCain Jr., deliver lectures on “The Four Ocean Navy and the Soviet Threat,” closing with a slide of an image he considered the ultimate factor in the balance of power: a soldier marching through a rice paddy with a rifle at his shoulder.

“To quote Sherman, war is all hell and we need to fight it out and get it over with and that is when the killing stops,” recalled Joe McCain, Senator McCain’s younger brother.

Vietnam, for Senator McCain, reinforced those lessons. He has often said he blamed the Johnson administration’s pause in bombing for prolonging the war, and he credited President Richard M. Nixon’s renewed attacks with securing his release from a North Vietnamese prison. He has made the principle that the exercise of military power sets the bargaining table for international relations a consistent theme of his career ever since, and in his 2002 memoir he wrote that one of his lifelong convictions was “the imperative that American power never retreat in response to an inferior adversary’s provocation.”


But Mr. McCain also took away from Vietnam a second, restraining lesson: the necessity for broad domestic support for any military action. For years he opposed a string of interventions — in Lebanon, Haiti, Somalia, and, for a time, the Balkans — on the grounds that the public would balk at the loss of life without clear national interests. “The Vietnam thing,” he recently said.

In the late 1990s, however, while he was beginning to consider his 2000 presidential race, he started rebalancing his view of the needs to project American strength and to sustain public support. The 1995 massacre of 5,000 unarmed Bosnian Muslims at Srebrenica under NATO’s watch struck at his conscience, he has said, and in addition to America’s strategic national interests — in that case, the future and credibility of NATO — Mr. McCain began to speak more expansively about America’s moral obligations as the only remaining superpower.

His aides say he later described the American air strikes in Bosnia in 1996 and in Kosovo in 1999 as a parable of political leadership: Mr. McCain, Senator Bob Dole and others had rallied Congressional support for the strikes despite widespread public opposition, then watched approval soar after the intervention helped to bring peace.

“Americans elect their leaders to make these kinds of judgments,” Mr. McCain said in the e-mail message.

It was during the Balkan wars that Mr. McCain and his advisers read a 1997 article on the Wall Street Journal editorial page by William Kristol and David Brooks of The Weekly Standard — both now Op-Ed page columnists at The New York Times — promoting the idea of “national greatness” conservatism, defined by a more activist agenda at home and a more muscular role in the world.

“I wouldn’t call it a ‘eureka’ moment, but there was a sense that this is where we are headed and this is what we are trying to articulate and they have already done a lot of the work,” said John Weaver, a former McCain political adviser. “And, quite frankly, from a crass political point of view, we were in the making-friends business. The Weekly Standard represented a part of the primary electorate that we could get.”

Soon Mr. McCain and his aides were consulting regularly with the circle of hawkish foreign policy thinkers sometimes referred to as neoconservatives — including Mr. Kristol, Robert Kagan and Randy Scheunemann, a former aide to Mr. Dole who became a McCain campaign adviser — to develop the senator’s foreign policy ideas and instincts into the broad themes of a presidential campaign. (In his e-mail message, Mr. McCain noted that he had also consulted with friends like Henry A. Kissinger, known for a narrower view of American interests.)

One result was a series of speeches in which Mr. McCain called for “rogue state rollback.” He argued that disparate regional troublemakers, including Iraq, North Korea and Serbia, bore a common stamp: they were all autocracies. And as such, he contended, they were more likely to export terrorism, spread dangerous weapons, or start ethnic conflicts. In an early outline of what would become his initial response to the Sept. 11 attacks, Mr. McCain argued that “swift and sure” retribution against any one of the rogue states was an essential deterrent to any of the others. But Mr. McCain’s advisers and aides say his “rogue state” speeches stopped short of the most sweeping international agenda put forth by Mr. Kristol, Mr. Kagan and their allies. Mr. McCain explicitly disavowed direct military action merely to advance American values, foreswearing any “global crusade” of interventions in favor of relying on covert and financial support for internal opposition groups.

As an example, he could point to his 1998 sponsorship of the Iraqi Liberation Act, which sought to direct nearly $100 million to Iraqis who hoped to overthrow Saddam Hussein. The bill, signed by President Bill Clinton, also endorsed the ouster of Mr. Hussein.

Mr. McCain said then that he doubted the United States could muster the political will to use ground troops to remove the Iraqi dictator any time soon. “It was much easier when Saddam Hussein was occupying Kuwait and threatening Saudi Arabia,” the senator told Fox News in November 1998. “We’d have to convince the American people that it’s worth again the sacrifice of American lives, because that would also be part of the price.”

Hard Calls

Mr. McCain spent the afternoon of Sept. 11 in a young aide’s studio apartment near the Capitol. There was no cable television, nothing but water in the kitchen, and the hallway reminded him of an old boxing gym. Evacuated from his office but stranded by traffic, he could not resist imagining himself at the other end of Pennsylvania Avenue. “There are not enough Secret Service agents in the world to keep me away from Washington and New York at a time like this,” Mr. McCain told an adviser.


Over the next days and weeks, however, Mr. McCain became almost as visible as he would have been as president. Broadcasters rushed to him as a patriotic icon and reassuring voice, and for weeks he was ubiquitous on the morning news programs, Sunday talk shows, cable news networks, and even late-night comedy shows.

In the spotlight, he pushed rogue state rollback one step further, arguing that the United States should go on the offensive as a warning to any other country that might condone such an attack. “These networks are well-embedded in some of these countries,” Mr. McCain said on Sept. 12, listing Iraq, Iran and Syria as potential targets of United States pressure. “We’re going to have to prove to them that we are very serious, and the price that they will pay will not only be for punishment but also deterrence.”

Although he had campaigned for President Bush during the 2000 general election, he was still largely frozen out of the White House because of animosities left over from the Republican primary. But after Mr. Bush declared he would hold responsible any country condoning terrorism, Mr. McCain called his leadership “magnificent” and his national security team the strongest “that has ever been assembled.” A few weeks later, Larry King of CNN asked whether he would have named Mr. Rumsfeld and Colin L. Powell to a McCain cabinet. “Oh, yes, and Cheney,” Mr. McCain answered, saying he, too, would have offered Mr. Cheney the vice presidency.

Even during the heat of the war in Afghanistan, Mr. McCain kept an eye on Iraq. To Jay Leno in mid-September, Mr. McCain said he believed “some other countries” had assisted Osama bin Laden, going on to suggest Iraq, Syria and Iran as potential suspects. In October 2001, when an Op-Ed page column in The New York Times speculated that Iraq, Russia or some other country might bear responsibility for that month’s anthrax mailings, Mr. McCain interrupted a question about Afghanistan from David Letterman on that night’s “Late Show.” “The second phase is Iraq,” Mr. McCain said, adding, “Some of this anthrax may — and I emphasize may — have come from Iraq.” (The Federal Bureau of Investigation says it came from a federal government laboratory in Maryland.) By October, United States and foreign intelligence agencies had said publicly that they doubted any cooperation between Mr. Hussein and Al Qaeda, noting Al Qaeda’s opposition to such secular nationalists. American intelligence officials soon declared that Mr. Hussein had not supported international terrorism for nearly a decade.

But when the Czech government said that before the attacks, one of the 9/11 hijackers had met in Prague with an Iraqi intelligence official, Mr. McCain seized the report as something close to a smoking gun. “The evidence is very clear,” he said three days later, in an Oct. 29 television interview. (Intelligence agencies quickly cast doubt on the meeting.)

Frustrated by the dearth of American intelligence about Iraq, Mr. McCain’s aides say, he had long sought to learn as much as he could from Iraqi opposition figures in exile, including Mr. Chalabi of the Iraqi National Congress. Over the years, Mr. McCain often urged support for the group, saying it had “significant support, in my view, inside Iraq.”

After Sept. 11, Mr. Chalabi’s group said an Iraqi emissary had once met with Osama bin Laden, and brought forward two Iraqi defectors who described terrorist training camps and biological weapons efforts. At times, Mr. McCain seemed to echo their accusations, citing the “two defectors” in a television interview and attesting to “credible reports of involvement between Iraqi administration officials, Iraqi officials and the terrorists.”

Growing Impatient

But United States intelligence officials had doubts about Mr. Chalabi at the time and have since discredited his group. In 2006, Mr. McCain acknowledged to The New Republic that he had been “too enamored with the I.N.C.” In his e-mail message, though, he said he never relied on the group for information about Iraq’s weapons program.

At a European security conference in February 2002, when the Bush administration still publicly maintained that it had made no decision about moving against Iraq, Mr. McCain described an invasion as all but certain. “A terrorist resides in Baghdad,” he said, adding, “A day of reckoning is approaching.”

Regime change in Iraq in addition to Afghanistan, he argued, would compel other sponsors of terrorism to mend their ways, “accomplishing by example what we would otherwise have to pursue through force of arms.”

Finally, as American troops massed in the Persian Gulf in early 2003, Mr. McCain grew impatient, his aides say, concerned that the White House was failing to act as the hot desert summer neared. Waiting, he warned in a speech in Washington, risked squandering the public and international support aroused by Sept. 11. “Does anyone really believe that the world’s will to contain Saddam won’t eventually collapse as utterly as it did in the 1990s?” Mr. McCain asked.

In retrospect, some of Mr. McCain’s critics now accuse him of looking for a pretext to justify the war. “McCain was hell-bent for leather: ‘Saddam Hussein is a bad guy, we have got to teach him, let’s send a message to the other people in the Middle East,’ ” said Senator John Kerry, Democrat of Massachusetts.

But Mr. McCain, in his e-mail message, said the reason he had supported the war was the evolving threat from Mr. Hussein.

“I believe voters elect their leaders based on their experience and judgment — their ability to make hard calls, for instance, on matters of war and peace,” he wrote. “It’s important to get them right.”

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 8:03 PM | Report abuse

Give me an F'n break. Mccain tried to exploit it for political gain just as he did with the Hurricane Gustav. Hurricane Ike was a true disaster and you haven't heard a word from Mccain. I guess there was no way to exploit it so he doesn't give a sh&t.


=========
I can't argue with Mr. Broder's analysis that John McCain will be the underdog in the debates. Senator McCain is also the underdog in the race itself.
Much depends on the public's concerns about the growing threat from Russia towards Georgia and Eastern Europe. Senator Obama's initial position that both the huge, totalitarian Russian bear and tiny Georgia with its struggling democracy, are equally to blame tends to show lack of experience and judgement. Senator McCain's clear support for Georgia shows leadership.
Sometimes bluntness is more important than eloquence.

Posted by: Xanadu | September 22, 2008 7:57 PM

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 8:02 PM | Report abuse

I can't argue with Mr. Broder's analysis that John McCain will be the underdog in the debates. Senator McCain is also the underdog in the race itself.
Much depends on the public's concerns about the growing threat from Russia towards Georgia and Eastern Europe. Senator Obama's initial position that both the huge, totalitarian Russian bear and tiny Georgia with its struggling democracy, are equally to blame tends to show lack of experience and judgement. Senator McCain's clear support for Georgia shows leadership.
Sometimes bluntness is more important than eloquence.

Posted by: Xanadu | September 22, 2008 7:57 PM | Report abuse

Anon..While it's ok not to be a Constitutional scholar, it's not alright to not even know and understand the reason why we broke from England and started a new nation. Read a book once in a while.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 7:56 PM | Report abuse

"Let's start with Broder's take."

No. let's not.

Posted by: Integrity | September 22, 2008 7:52 PM | Report abuse

So, it looks like everyone has proven my point, no where in the constitution does it say to keep religion out of politics. I guess we can all agree that Mr. Harvard law was wrong.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 7:51 PM | Report abuse

The level of discourse on this thread is the worse I have ever seen. Everyone should take a break.

Posted by: bgjd1979 | September 22, 2008 7:47 PM | Report abuse

Biden has diarrhea of the mouth...

Biden criticizes Obama ad hitting McCain as technologically inept

Joe Biden offered perhaps his most off-message statement yet since being tapped as Barack Obama's running mate, saying in an interview that he thought one of his campaign's own ads was "terrible" and hadn't know about it in advance.

Asked by CBS's Katie Couric about an ad Obama released earlier this month mocking John McCain for not being able to use a computer, Biden criticized the commercial and suggested it had been aired without his knowledge.

"I thought that was terrible by the way," Biden said of the computer ad in an interview broadcast tonight on the CBS Evening News

Asked why it was aired, Biden said: "I didn't know we did it and if I had anything to do with it, we would have never done it."

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 7:44 PM | Report abuse

An open letter to the community:

I renounce my stupidity and idiotic racism.
I apologize for being a moronic fascist troll.
I apologize for sitting at home doing nothing but carpet-post on multiple websites anti-Obama sewage, 8am-11pm, 7 days a week.
I ask forgiveness for being of no value to the world except to convert oxygen into carbon dioxide.
I admit that HRC is a narcissistic psychotic and I am ashamed to be associated with her and her politics of personal destruction.
I realize being an HRC harpie is not a virtue but a diagnosable disease that can be treated.
I know Obama is the best candidate because of his message of hope and I am sorry I have not seen that because of my lack of intelligence and idiocy.
I ask forgiveness from the international blogoshere and promise to do what I can to redeem myself.
From this point on, I will post only intelligent, unbigoted posts that respect the viewpoints of others.
I am a pathetic fool, but I was just born that way.
I know in my heart Mrs. Todd Palin is a clown.

New AsperGirl...a new beginning

Posted by: New AsperGirl | September 22, 2008 7:42 PM | Report abuse

Every time a candidate is questioned about his or her religious beliefs, it is an attack against the Constitution.
And the Christian-right call themselves patriotic.

Posted by: RTK | September 22, 2008 7:39 PM | Report abuse

If the debate is legitimate with real issues-oriented questions (not, "Do you think Rev. Wright loves his country as much as you do?") and is not a "Saddleback" set-up (where one side has the qs in advance), it is game, set, match for O.

After all, when last seen, Mac was still trying to find Spain on the map and wondering who Zapatero was. But the debate may NOT be legit so who knows what'll happen. If Stephanopoulos and Gibson have nothing to do with the debate, O is probably safe.

O is up about 6 (DailyKos), which is where he needs to be to overcome the racial drag, so to "win" he just needs to do just a little better than hold serve.

On another subject, we are starting to see more attention on the Internet paid to Palin's embrace of the agenda of Westbrook Pegler, the late racist and anti-Semite.

Palin proudly quoted Pegler during her acceptance speech at the convention. Let's be clear no one accidentally quotes Westbrook Pegler. Frankly you probably wouldn't know who he is unless you totally agreed with him.

As NYT's Rich has pointed out, when Palin quoted Pegler she sent a clear signal to the organized hate community. It is not hard to believe that a fan of Westbrook Pegler like Mrs. Palin would call Obama a racial slur ("S-mbo") openly in front of others as reported Sept. 5 by Charley James of laprogressive.com (and as not reported by the MSM, who is sitting out this election, I guess).

Hate is not a family value.

Cap

Posted by: Captain America | September 22, 2008 7:37 PM | Report abuse

Where in the constitution does it say keep religion out of politics Mr. Harvard law?

Posted by: Anonymous


It has often been seen on the Internet that to find God in the Constitution, all one has to do is read it, and see how often the Framers used the words "God," or "Creator," "Jesus," or "Lord." Except for one notable instance, however, none of these words ever appears in the Constitution, neither the original nor in any of the Amendments. The notable exception is found in the Signatory section, where the date is written thusly: "Seventeenth Day of September in the Year of our Lord one thousand seven hundred and Eighty seven". The use of the word "Lord" here is not a religious reference, however. This was a common way of expressing the date, in both religious and secular contexts. This lack of any these words does not mean that the Framers were not spiritual people, any more than the use of the word Lord means that they were. What this lack of these words is expositive of is not a love for or disdain for religion, but the feeling that the new government should not involve itself in matters of religion. In fact, the original Constitution bars any religious test to hold any federal office in the United States.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 7:29 PM | Report abuse

every service contract will be 'no bid' and given to whomever they want

(2) entering into contracts, including contracts for services authorized by section 3109 of title 5, United States Code, without regard to any other provision of law regarding public contracts;

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 7:24 PM | Report abuse

Sec. 10. Increase in Statutory Limit on the Public Debt.

Subsection (b) of section 3101 of title 31, United States Code, is amended by striking out the dollar limitation contained in such subsection and inserting in lieu thereof $11,315,000,000,000.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 7:22 PM | Report abuse

Sec. 8. Review.

Decisions by the Secretary pursuant to the authority of this Act are non-reviewable and committed to agency discretion, and may not be reviewed by any court of law or any administrative agency.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 7:21 PM | Report abuse

the 1 trillion bailout is 2 pages long
to spend 1 tril, 2 pages

one clause says one man may do as he sees fit with the $$$, with no review, legislative interference, or any legal action/suit/court review what so ever...

so he could send the money to an offshore account without prosecution...or funnel it to bush cronies without any interference what so ever...

no accounting is required, records will be secret...1 tril$

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 7:15 PM | Report abuse

The separation of church and state is a legal and political principle derived from the First Amendment to the United States Constitution, which reads, "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof . . ." The phrase "separation of church and state", which does not appear in the Constitution itself, is generally traced to an 1802 letter by Thomas Jefferson to the Danbury Baptists, where Jefferson spoke of the combined effect of the Establishment Clause and the Free Exercise Clause of the First Amendment. It has since been quoted in several opinions handed down by the United States Supreme Court.

Article Six of the United States Constitution provides that "no religious Test shall ever be required as a Qualification to any Office or public Trust under the United States". Prior to the inclusion of the Bill of Rights, this was the only mention of religious freedom in the Constitution.

The phrase "separation of church and state" became a definitive part of Establishment Clause jurisprudence in Everson v. Board of Education, 330 U.S. 1 (1947),

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 7:12 PM | Report abuse

How about no statute of limitations for CEOs of the banking industry? How about fining these companies and CEOs what amounts to their total income for the time period they are employed with the company? A destitute CEO? How novel!

Posted by: EH | September 22, 2008 7:10 PM | Report abuse

Wow what a loser Mr. Harvard law (liar) can't answer because no where in the constitution does it say keep religion out of govt

*sigh*

Dude, its right at the beginning.

Posted by: DDAWD | September 22, 2008 7:04 PM | Report abuse

******ABOUT SNL PALIN-INCEST JOKE*******
If you were offended by the SNL Palin-incest joke, visit my blog for the personal email of the SNL producer. Jokes about incest have no place in our society- that is simply sick and terrible. Another attempt by NBC at character assasination?

http://www.mccain08-hillary2012.blogspot.com/

Posted by: dcpsychic | September 22, 2008 7:00 PM | Report abuse

"Don't worry, dude....we conservatives have most certainly done our homework on this situation...which is why we'd only vote for McCain..."

Bush too.

And let's face it. You all still love him. So yeah, don't complain about your lack of credibility. If Republicans could make an intelligent choice in voting once in a while, they wouldn't be lampooned on SNL.

But hey, if you ACTUALLY believe that Obama thinks there are 57 states, well, thanks for eliminating any doubt I had about you people.

Posted by: DDAWD | September 22, 2008 6:59 PM | Report abuse

Biden should step aside and Hillary asked in for VP. Bill gets an apology -he isn't rascist and get his econmic winning ways on board. It's not too late to save this country.

Posted by: Tom | September 22, 2008 6:59 PM | Report abuse

No, he would have been dead years ago. He is lazy and has never accomplished a thing in his life on his own. He has been a drunk, admitted and confirmed by everyone who has known him all the back to school days. Been a drunk for so many years he would be long gone by now.

=======
if mccain came from the background obama did, and didn't have rich connect daddy and grand-daddy...he'd just be another one of you indigent racist rednecks...

at least he's a wealther racist redneck

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 6:52 PM

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 6:58 PM | Report abuse

White - Obama 37% McCain 52%
Black - Obama 93% McCain 2%"

Black people are just politically savvier. They sure as hell didn't put Bush into office.

Posted by: DDAWD | September 22, 2008 6:55 PM

________________
at least 37% of the white folks aren't morons...vs 2% of he black that are

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 6:57 PM | Report abuse

Todays poll, Palin favorable now down to 42. That means only 4 in 10 have a favorable opinion of her. More amazing, only like 10 days ago it was 67. She may have blown through her 15 minutes of fame in only 5.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 6:41 PM

_______________________
the gleam is tarnished, the truth is out...
it'll be 30% b election day
the woman is insane and evil...couple with stupid does not a good combination make...

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 6:55 PM | Report abuse

"White - Obama 37% McCain 52%
Black - Obama 93% McCain 2%"

Black people are just politically savvier. They sure as hell didn't put Bush into office.

Posted by: DDAWD | September 22, 2008 6:55 PM | Report abuse

Is this some sort of attack on my brother in Africa? I sent him like 50 bucks last year.

Posted by: snObama | September 22, 2008 6:49 PM

______________________
you should try giving your sister more than $10 for the BJ she gives you

she's your sister and lover...typical inbred repub

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 6:53 PM | Report abuse

"also, when Obama gets inside the white house we are going to have a huge bonfire for flag-pins..."

Posted by: dl

Instead of worrying about flag pins and "support our troops" bumper stickers, it would do us all good to remember the vets by volunteering to help at your nearby Vet center or hospital. Talk, stickers and pins are cheap and easy.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 6:52 PM | Report abuse

if mccain came from the background obama did, and didn't have rich connect daddy and grand-daddy...he'd just be another one of you indigent racist rednecks...

at least he's a wealther racist redneck

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 6:52 PM | Report abuse

"And you, you will still be in your trailer eating Ramin noodles."


Is this some sort of attack on my brother in Africa? I sent him like 50 bucks last year.

Posted by: snObama | September 22, 2008 6:49 PM | Report abuse

Yeah, its pretty obvious that you don't know anything at all. You're a complete waste of time and should be ashamed to call yourself an American.

Posted by: palinwasapornstar | September 22, 2008 6:44 PM

I know this was aimed right at me. all insults are. and in my paranoia, I reply to every one of them.

you stink! Racist.

Posted by: snObama | September 22, 2008 6:47 PM | Report abuse

Gore, worth 200 million
Clintons, worth maybe 40 million
If Obama loses he will make hundreds of million and be one of the most important people of our time. The only real losers will be the American people.
And you, you will still be in your trailer eating Ramin noodles.
Obama will have a magnificent life with no regrets I am sure.
That being said, I believe he will win easily.
-------


If I lose this election, I won't be able to face myself. this was supposed to be my first bona fide accomplishment. If I get abandoned and blamed, like gore and Kerry, I won't ever find myself. My wife will probably take my pants away again and make me wear that dress every night, if she sticks around. I may even have to actually vote in the Senate or hold my committee meetings. how boring. I much prefer large scale adulation.
for the sake of me, me, me, vote D.

Posted by: snObama | September 22, 2008 6:40 PM

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 6:46 PM | Report abuse

Yeah, its pretty obvious that you don't know anything at all. You're a complete waste of time and should be ashamed to call yourself an American.

Posted by: palinwasapornstar | September 22, 2008 6:44 PM | Report abuse

False, she suggested we name the child Latrina.

I saw a war movie once and am VERY familiar with the military so I replied it might sound funny to some bigots. you know, like my name.

Posted by: snObama | September 22, 2008 6:43 PM | Report abuse

Todays poll, Palin favorable now down to 42. That means only 4 in 10 have a favorable opinion of her. More amazing, only like 10 days ago it was 67. She may have blown through her 15 minutes of fame in only 5.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 6:41 PM | Report abuse

OMG!!! Is it true that Michelle Shaniqua Obama wanted to name her first daughter "Afrika Midnight"? She is utterly ghetto and lacks the good breeding to be First Lady.

Posted by: Dianne72 | September 22, 2008 6:40 PM | Report abuse

If I lose this election, I won't be able to face myself. this was supposed to be my first bona fide accomplishment. If I get abandoned and blamed, like gore and Kerry, I won't ever find myself. My wife will probably take my pants away again and make me wear that dress every night, if she sticks around. I may even have to actually vote in the Senate or hold my committee meetings. how boring. I much prefer large scale adulation.
for the sake of me, me, me, vote D.

Posted by: snObama | September 22, 2008 6:40 PM | Report abuse

I want to read all your comments Nov. 5th.From both sides.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 6:38 PM | Report abuse

i didn't know 14 year olds graduated from harvard law

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 6:38 PM | Report abuse

also, when Obama gets inside the white house we are going to have a huge bonfire for flag-pins...

Posted by: dl | September 22, 2008 6:37 PM | Report abuse

Friday it is.

Posted by: Obama2008 | September 22, 2008 6:36 PM | Report abuse

Is that seriously your comeback? How very George Bush of you.

Posted by: palinwasapornstar | September 22, 2008 6:35 PM | Report abuse

Can I bring my wife out of the basement yet. She promises to love, honor and cherish amerika from now on. especially if I get elected. Otherwise, watch out. she knows how to build a bomb now, after our good friend Mr Ayers showed us.

It is just not fair that all my friends and associates are in hiding until nov 5th. why does everyone abandon me the minute they get to know me. Dad? Mom? Grandma? you all are so typical.

Posted by: snObama | September 22, 2008 6:35 PM | Report abuse

and on top of that they can't even get their facts straight on what caused this mess...

hint hint

the same thing that caused when John Mccain and Charles Keating were investigated last time and we lost a trillion dollars...

Posted by: dl | September 22, 2008 6:33 PM | Report abuse

Wow what a loser Mr. Harvard law (liar) can't answer because no where in the constitution does it say keep religion out of govt... you are obviously another dumb dem...hahahaha

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 6:32 PM | Report abuse

MCbama/Paden 08'

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 6:31 PM | Report abuse

Chris

I can't even read you post on this one ...

I am a white guy and the kkk comments on here...turn my stomach...

some of these people it would be better off with their racism (not even subtle but proud of their own ignorance kind of racism) need to be shipped to one of Cheney's foreign govenment stop overs that they deny existing.

I hope no matter who is the President he does something about the literally evil racists... that commented on here today.

so brave they are making racist statements on a blog...

most Americans would punch you all in the face if you made those comments in front of them...because most Americans are a great people...

you all are disgusting.

Posted by: dl | September 22, 2008 6:30 PM | Report abuse

Really? You don't see ANY difference between Bill Clinton and Todd Palin?

Posted by: DDAWD | September 22, 2008 6:23 PM

Well to be fair, Bill likes his chicks pretty thick. Me too!

Posted by: snObama | September 22, 2008 6:25 PM | Report abuse

"Interesting that for months we heard constant attacks against Bill Clinton with conjectures about his meddling in a Hillary administration but nothing about Palin; total silence. Should we be asking for his expertise on sovereign wealth funds and mortgage policies or just his opinions on ice fishing and snow mobiles? Maybe Paulson needs to be meeting with him before crafting a trillion dollar mtg bailout plan. What a team Palin/McCain. Obama meets with Warren Buffett, McCain with first dude to craft his economic policies. How reassuring America."

Really? You don't see ANY difference between Bill Clinton and Todd Palin?

Posted by: DDAWD | September 22, 2008 6:23 PM | Report abuse

you may notice I have begun to wear that false symbol of patriotism again, my flag pin. If this bothers you, don't worry. I intend to change all patriotism to the upper 5% who pay taxes only. this is just a fake out for those bitter gun toting religious freaks until election day. After that, the flags with red stars come out. nudge, nudge, wink wink.

Posted by: snObama | September 22, 2008 6:23 PM | Report abuse

You know what's funny, Barry Hussein's tax cuts will not happen due to the bailout of Wall Street. Bush has the last laugh...

Posted by: Nadeem Zakaria | September 22, 2008 6:22 PM | Report abuse

What's up with Barry Hussein's (aka Senator Purple Lips) hair?????

I got a poll result that said I would do better if I had gray hair.

Can I help it if I have blue blood and thin skin? It is most pronounced in my lips.

Posted by: snObama | September 22, 2008 6:20 PM | Report abuse

Are you kidding me? Read it for yourself. Show some initiative in life. Have some self-respect. Do something besides get drunk, shoot some guns and beat your women.

Posted by: palinwasapornstar | September 22, 2008 6:18 PM | Report abuse

Picture it, Trinity Church 2006. Michelle Shiniqua Obama is speaking from the pulpit. Her prominent nostrils are flared, brow furrowed, and a scowl across her face. With all the inner-ghetto she can muster, Michelle Shaniqua is ranting against "whitey" and how they keep "raising the bar". All the while punching the air with a fist-bump. This my friends is what we will see in October when they release her "whitey-gate" tapes on YouTube.

Posted by: Dianne72 | September 22, 2008 6:18 PM | Report abuse

Please don't bring up my time at ACORN and the community redevelopment act. My tap shoes are all worn out. I have enough trouble with econ as it is much less if anyone expects me to make sense.

People, chant with me (insert phrase of the day).

Posted by: snObama | September 22, 2008 6:18 PM | Report abuse

What's up with Barry Hussein's (aka Senator Purple Lips) hair?????

Posted by: Nadeem Zakaria | September 22, 2008 6:17 PM | Report abuse

I heard using these words makes me sound smart to my fellow clueless Libs.

Deregulation (bad)
profit (bad)
arugula (good)
carbon offsets (good)

can anyone phone in some more so I can at least appear to be intelligent in my debate?

Posted by: snObama | September 22, 2008 6:14 PM | Report abuse

Where in the constitution does it say keep religion out of politics Mr. Harvard law?

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 6:14 PM | Report abuse

WHERE ARE THE PHALIN TAX RETURNS?

WHERE ARE DRUG-ADDLED CINDY'S TAX RETURNS?

WHERE ARE McLiar's MEDICAL RECORDS?

Posted by: George W. McLiar | September 22, 2008 6:13 PM | Report abuse


LIKE IT OR NOT, THIS IS WHO THIS SOB IS.

THE Admiral SON.

In Oct. 26, 1967, the admiral's son while flying his 23rd mission over North Vietnam, once again fell from the sky, this time landing in the hands of a brutal enemy. He was beaten and bayoneted. His shoulder was smashed and his right calf was nearly perpendicular to his knee.
The severely wounded McCain was finally thrown on the back of a truck and hauled to the infamous Hanoi Hilton prison camp. Immediately, his captors began to interrogate him using sadistic methods they had perfected on hundreds of captured U.S. servicemen before him.

His interrogators demanded military information. When he refused, his guards kicked and pounded him mercilessly.
McCain admits that three to four days after he was captured, he promised the Vietnamese, "I'll give you military information if you will take me to the hospital."
McCain also admits that the Vietnamese rushed him to a hospital, but denies he was given "special medical treatment" because of his promise.
He claims he was given medical care normally unavailable to captured Americans only because the Vietnamese learned he was the son of Admiral John S. McCain, Jr., the soon-to-be commander of all U.S. forces in the Pacific including those fighting in Vietnam.

The Vietnamese figured that because POW McCain's father was of such high military rank that he was of royalty or the governing circle in the United States. Thereafter the communist bragged that they had captured "the crown prince"and treated him as a "special prisoner."

Less than two weeks after McCain was taken to a hospital, Hanoi's press began quoting him giving specific military information, including the name of the aircraft carrier on which he was based, numbers of U.S. pilots that had been lost, the number of aircraft in his flight, information about location of rescue ships and the order of which his attack was supposed to take place.
There is also evidence that McCain received "special" medical treatment from a Soviet physician.

After he was out of the hospital, McCain continued cooperating with the North Vietnamese for a period of three years. He made radio broadcasts for the communists and met with foreign delegations, including the Cubans. He was interviewed by at least two North Vietnamese generals one of whom was Vietnam's national hero, General Vo Nguyen Giap.

On June 4, 1969, a U.S. wire service story headlined "PW Songbird Is Pilot Son of Admiral," reported one of McCain's radio broadcasts: "Hanoi has aired a broadcast in which the pilot son of the United States commander in the Pacific, Adm. John McCain, purportedly admits to having bombed civilian targets in North Vietnam and praises medical treatment he has received since being taken prisoner.
McCain says he violated the Code of Conduct only when the North Vietnamese brutally tortured him. He further claims that he was so distraught afterwards that he tried to commit suicide. He has never explained why his "aid to the enemy" continued for more than three years.

Even though there are no reports in the public record from other POWs who witnessed McCain's claims of torture and heroics or his attempted suicide, the American media has accepted his version of events word for word, no questions asked.

Yet, the same press that transformed the admiral's son into an "incredible war hero--an inspiration to all Americans," vilified the two grunts.
Comparing the incidents surrounding the fates of three POWs,' who collaborated with the enemy, makes one question why two faced possible execution for treason, while the third won acclaim as a hero fit to be President of the United States.
Once more, Lady Luck had smiled on John McCain . . . or was it the admiral?


Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 6:11 PM | Report abuse

this Friday I will attampt to pull of what only PT Barnum could have imagined. I may successfully fool almost half of the US voters into thinking I know anything about foreign policy. their hatred has so blinded them, they are willing to suspend disbeleif just long enough to let me and my fellow soviets into office. I promise to live up to the Jimmy Carter standards. If anything goes wrong, we just blame it on Repubs as usual.

Liberals are so clueless and so essential.

Posted by: snObama | September 22, 2008 6:09 PM | Report abuse

Proud of you. But again, if you actualy believe in the constitution you'll KEEP RELIGION OUT OF POLITICS! It doesn't belong there!

Posted by: palinwasapornstar | September 22, 2008 6:09 PM | Report abuse

"De-regulators" responsible for things like Enron and a nearly TRILLION DOLLAR Wall Street bail-out are the *real* terrorists.

And those same terrorists have the temerity to call ordinary Americans "whiners."

Posted by: George W. McLiar | September 22, 2008 6:09 PM | Report abuse

cultural catholic, now i understand...

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 6:08 PM | Report abuse

Not Jewish. I was raised Catholic, but after studying religion I would not call myself Catholic.

But good try...keep it up!

Posted by: palinwasapornstar | September 22, 2008 6:06 PM | Report abuse

Xander:
"Actually, you did play the race card when you suggested that black people are inferior."

You cannot show where I did that.

"But sadly, it's time for me to make my long drive home. So unfortunately I cannot wax poetic with you about your obviously poor upbringing. Cya."

Time to go, eh? Don't blame you.

Posted by: JTR | September 22, 2008 6:04 PM | Report abuse


Xander:
"Actually, you did play the race card when you suggested that black people are inferior."

You cannot show where I did that.

"But sadly, it's time for me to make my long drive home. So unfortunately I cannot wax poetic with you about your obviously poor upbringing. Cya."

Time to go, eh? Don't blame you.



Go somewhere and pull off. You'll feel better.

Posted by: JTR | September 22, 2008 6:02 PM | Report abuse

the only consolation, if mccain cheats out a win, he'll be stymied by congress (both the house and senate will keep him in check) he'll never get anything done...and since all he'll do is bad things, that's a good thing...

look at bush, 8 years nada
SS, nope
healthcare, nope,
finacial sector...no need to comment
deficit, both trade & budget, massive
energy, screwed
Iraq, 4000+ dead Americans, 1/2 mil Iraqis
'Stan, more fuked than ever
China & Russia, stronger than ever
NK, nukes
Iran, close to Nukes

mission accomplished!!!!

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 6:02 PM | Report abuse

the only consolation, if mccain cheats out a win, he'll be stymied by congress (both the house and senate will keep him in check) he'll never get anything done...and since all he'll do is bad things, that's a good thing...

look at bush, 8 years nada
SS, nope
healthcare, nope,
finacial sector...no need to comment
deficit, both trade & budget, massive
energy, screwed
Iraq, 4000+ dead Americans, 1/2 mil Iraqis
'Stan, more fuked than ever
China & Russia, stronger than ever
NK, nukes
Iran, close to Nukes

mission accomplished!!!!

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 6:02 PM | Report abuse

the only consolation, if mccain cheats out a win, he'll be stymied by congress (both the house and senate will keep him in check) he'll never get anything done...and since all he'll do is bad things, that's a good thing...

look at bush, 8 years nada
SS, nope
healthcare, nope,
finacial sector...no need to comment
deficit, both trade & budget, massive
energy, screwed
Iraq, 4000+ dead Americans, 1/2 mil Iraqis
'Stan, more fuked than ever
China & Russia, stronger than ever
NK, nukes
Iran, close to Nukes

mission accomplished!!!!

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 6:02 PM | Report abuse

and you're jewish, right

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 6:02 PM | Report abuse

But to be honest with you, I am racist. I'm a white male, born and raised in New England. Like Obama, I have a degree in law from Harvard. I also have a doctorate from Princeton. I'm racist against rednecks and the ignorant people like you that are incapable of independent thought.

"Just do what God tells you and everything will be alright."

I know a few people who follow that creed like you: Osama Bin Ladin, Saddam Hussein, Zacharias Mussoui, Al Queda, the Taliban...I'll keep going all day in the name of God! Crusades, the entire Roman Empire!

Posted by: palinwasapornstar | September 22, 2008 5:59 PM | Report abuse

"Not insecure enough to play the race card, pal. You did that."

Actually, you did play the race card when you suggested that black people are inferior. Your obvious anti-black statements say that you are playing the "whites are superior" race card. But sadly, it's time for me to make my long drive home. So unfortunately I cannot wax poetic with you about your obviously poor upbringing. Cya.

Posted by: Xander | September 22, 2008 5:59 PM | Report abuse

Off Topic: Blog idea.
Reading the article about Virginia - McCain polls better as someone who can handle a "major unforseen event".

Well Wall Street was only too happy to provide one. How have the candidates handled it - and what does it say about them in general?

McCain seemed to flail around firing the SEC chairman (whether he was allowed to or not), and Obama seemed to take a much more measured response. McCain seemed to flip his flop about financial market regulation etc.

Posted by: NoOneImportant | September 22, 2008 5:58 PM | Report abuse

The level of discourse coming from the supposed right is downright shameful. This 'us against them', 'win at all costs' mentality is killing our country. We should be promoting ideas, not a party.

Let's face it- the Republican party left conservatism behind when they took control in 2000. They replaced 'tax & spend' with 'spend and rack up huge debts'. They are not conservatives in the legislative sense at all. They have no problem with infringing upon our constitutional rights. A more apt description of today's Republican party is 'Religious Liberals'.

Step back, breathe, and ask yourself: Is the US a better place than it was before the Republican party took control of it? Do you think the Republican party has held true to conservative principles? If you think so, vote for Palin/McCain. If you think not, then you need to vote for another candidate, or stay home.

Posted by: Concerned | September 22, 2008 5:57 PM | Report abuse

Its not about race JTR - its about your future and you don't even realize it. Scary!

Congrats Julie!!! You learned how to type!
We're so proud of you.

Posted by: palinwasapornstar | September 22, 2008 5:54 PM | Report abuse

repubs are usually small, insecure 'men' (term used loosly) who over compensate with guns and hate for all different...

all those they hold responsible for their miserable lot in life...

just because there are better black men out there than you, should not make you angry and resentful..try to improve yourself, not denigrate others...

you are worthless now, but you can change that with time and effort...

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 5:54 PM | Report abuse


Xander:
"It seems to me that an ignorant statement such as that warrants no rebuttal, since your mind is obviously blinded by your own insecurities."

Not insecure enough to play the race card, pal. You did that.

Posted by: JTR | September 22, 2008 5:54 PM | Report abuse


"well, if it walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, it must be a racist inbred skinhead..."

The Obama will come after you for such implications...


Posted by: JTR | September 22, 2008 5:52 PM | Report abuse

"Sure, bring up the race card when you can't defend. Too bad that's the best your mentality allows."

Why should I have to defend that black people have the ability to "respect?". It seems to me that an ignorant statement such as that warrants no rebuttal, since your mind is obviously blinded by your own insecurities.

Posted by: Xander | September 22, 2008 5:51 PM | Report abuse

Sure, bring up the race card when you can't defend. Too bad that's the best your mentality allows.

Posted by: JTR | September 22, 2008 5:44 PM
_____________________
well, if it walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, it must be a racist inbred skinhead...

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 5:50 PM | Report abuse


"The fact that JTR can't even understand implied sarcasm is a perfect example of the kind of people that are the 'conservatives.'"

Sure, plead sarcasm when you lose it. Well, at least you didn't play the race card. Congratulations.


Posted by: JTR | September 22, 2008 5:49 PM | Report abuse

--"... for Obama and McCain in their first tête-à-tête."--

I saw the video, and am glad to see you embrace your Eastern Elite roots.

--"The theme will be foreign policy -- theoretically ground on which both men are comfortable."--

Yea, given the history making going on around us right now - I wonder how 'themed' the debate on foreign policy is going to be. Everything links back home through either 'trade' or 'oil'. Obama will want to talk about it, and McCain will have to.

Posted by: NoOneImportant | September 22, 2008 5:49 PM | Report abuse

Wow, this is exactly my point:

"Respect the fact that he got shot down"

Respect ain't in the Obama's make-up, Sweetie.

Posted by: JTR | September 22, 2008 5:39 PM


The fact that JTR can't even understand implied sarcasm is a perfect example of the kind of people that are the 'conservatives.' Take away that they are clinging to "family values", ignoring the separation of church and state when making their choices.

This makes me wonder in every state, the higher educated counties are all blue and the 'idiots' are all red?

Posted by: palinwasapornstar | September 22, 2008 5:46 PM | Report abuse

Anonymous - stay off of this blog and go back to learning the language. Geez. When I find you, I will give you a good wake up call of waterboarding so you know what it feels like. So, please stay Anonymous! Also, go buy yourself some extra stain remover for the skid marks you leave on your underwear that your mommy has to wash.

Posted by: The Punisher | September 22, 2008 5:37 PM

________________________

wow, tough guy...
like most repubs, I have no doubt you are a coward, and would run from a fight...
just like dik cheney, 5 draft deferments...

now, get off your mom and go pick up a book...

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 5:45 PM | Report abuse

palinwasapornstar writes: "The most shocking part of the election though is you people. All of you conservatives who actually think McCain will help you. If you're making less than 250K he will hurt you. I'm positive you all are! Your taxes will be higher, your working benefits worse, environment worse AND YOU DON'T SEEM TO CARE!!! Incapable of independent thought? Do some research before you vote. If you can't read, find someone who can. If you need help ask! If that doesn't work then you flat out have no right to even vote as you should bury your head in the ground and let people kick your a** for the rest of your life!"

_______________

See, and all of us conservatives are wondering how in the heck you could possibly consider voting for such a socialist-minded, professorial windbag who can't string together ten intelligent words without uh-ing and um-ing as he tries to avoid actually answering any questions. He is a fence-sitter, much the same way Clinton was, in being non-commital until he has a finger in the wind.

Don't worry, dude....we conservatives have most certainly done our homework on this situation...which is why we'd only vote for McCain...

Posted by: julie | September 22, 2008 5:45 PM | Report abuse


Xander:
"Wow, it all becomes clear now. Well don't worry, I'm sure that after Obama gets elected there will still be racist groups out there that you can join."

Sure, bring up the race card when you can't defend. Too bad that's the best your mentality allows.

Posted by: JTR | September 22, 2008 5:44 PM | Report abuse

How in the world can anyone vote for a guy who does not know the difference between SPIC & SIPC and SEC & FEC...The man is Demented..Period...No Mas...

Posted by: N Busta | September 22, 2008 5:43 PM | Report abuse


"So you're basically saying that blacks, die-hard dems, and young people are all idiots?"

Idiot is your word, cowboy. I'll just say they are biased or racist enough to vote for the Obama. Gallup a few days ago:
White - Obama 37% McCain 52%
Black - Obama 93% McCain 2%

Posted by: JTR | September 22, 2008 5:42 PM | Report abuse

harvards website/law has all of obamas papers and writings...

don't you think that gutter snipe mccain would use this lack of performance if he could?
the problem is obama excelled, so it would only hurt mccain...

heck, mccains cronies called obama 'uppity'

palin called him 'sambo'...

these are the 'good' people to lead us? unify us?

learn to goose-step, the 4th reich is rising

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 5:42 PM | Report abuse

"Respect ain't in the Obama's make-up, Sweetie."

Wow, it all becomes clear now. Well don't worry, I'm sure that after Obama gets elected there will still be racist groups out there that you can join.

Posted by: Xander | September 22, 2008 5:40 PM | Report abuse


"Respect the fact that he got shot down"

Respect ain't in the Obama's make-up, Sweetie.

Posted by: JTR | September 22, 2008 5:39 PM | Report abuse

"Right, but you are wasting your wisdon on blacks, die-hard democrats, and youth who think the Obama is cool."

So you're basically saying that blacks, die-hard dems, and young people are all idiots?

Posted by: Xander | September 22, 2008 5:38 PM | Report abuse

Anonymous - stay off of this blog and go back to learning the language. Geez. When I find you, I will give you a good wake up call of waterboarding so you know what it feels like. So, please stay Anonymous! Also, go buy yourself some extra stain remover for the skid marks you leave on your underwear that your mommy has to wash.

Posted by: The Punisher | September 22, 2008 5:37 PM | Report abuse


Bob Miller:

Right, but you are wasting your wisdon on blacks, die-hard democrats, and youth who think the Obama is cool.

Posted by: JTR | September 22, 2008 5:36 PM | Report abuse

It's hard not to question McCain's fitness when he's had so many different illnesses, including many bouts with cancer. His health is entirely relevant with this election, because the runner up is just a scary Radical Republican with no real experience to fall back on. Her comments (even if they make cute soundbites) show her complete lack of respect for the foreign stage and our position in it. I don't want to trust my son's future on a woman who "can see Russia from her house sometimes".

Posted by: Xander | September 22, 2008 5:35 PM | Report abuse


Obama f-rts and snores, note.

Posted by: JTR | September 22, 2008 5:34 PM | Report abuse

McCain = Hero???????
Respect the fact that he got shot down in by far the most advanced aircraft of the vietnam war. Respect the fact that he graduated at the bottom of his class at the Naval academy. Respect the fact that he is a POW. But how would that make him a good president? He's already demonstrated his ignorance and stupidity by picking Palin. Lieberman would have ended this election as VP.

The most shocking part of the election though is you people. All of you conservatives who actually think McCain will help you. If you're making less than 250K he will hurt you. I'm positive you all are! Your taxes will be higher, your working benefits worse, environment worse AND YOU DON'T SEEM TO CARE!!! Incapable of independent thought? Do some research before you vote. If you can't read, find someone who can. If you need help ask! If that doesn't work then you flat out have no right to even vote as you should bury your head in the ground and let people kick your a** for the rest of your life!

To the undecided people: these debates will make up your mind.

To the left: make sure your young friends vote! They are the key to this victory, and a decent road ahead, one filled with security - both jobs/financial and terrorism. If they don't, we'll be stuck in the same spiriling downfall for another 4 years.

Posted by: palinwasapornstar | September 22, 2008 5:34 PM | Report abuse

Check out Obamas rise to glory below:

Obama 1996 - 2000
Senator Obama: promoted to Senior Lecturer in constitutional law at the University of Chicago Law School. Elected to the Illinois Senate. Sponsored more than 800 bills. In 2000, lost a Democratic primary run for the U.S. House of Representatives to four-term incumbent Bobby Rush by a margin of two to one.

What mattered was that, beginning on Jan. 2, 1996, his campaigners began challenging thousands of petition signatures the other candidates in the race had submitted in order to appear on the ballot. Thus Mr. Obama would win his state Senate seat, months before a single vote was cast. Note that when he finished he was the ONLY democrat on the ballot. Republican candidate had to step aside for political reasons.

The 800 bills he ALLEDGEDLY sponsored were actually submitted by other democrats and all OBAMA did was date and stamp. He voted present 130 times on bills that would require him to step out of the box. Gained a reputation that the ‘then’ governor would make him a United States Senator.

2001 - 2004
Obama: reelected in 2002 and became chairman of the Illinois Senate's Health and Human Services Committee.
Initially the committee was looking at Health Care for all residents of Illinois. After accepting funding from insurance lobbyists he insured that universal healthcare became merely a policy goal instead of state policy, Basically learned how to again use his power to benefit himself at the expense of doing what was right for the residents of Illinois.

Publicly spoke out against the invasion of Iraq BEFORE the congressional authorization in 2002, and then again before the actual invasion in 2003. This was a given speech that sounded great but was actually a speech that was critical of the war BECAUSE it was distracting from the real issue regarding the black community in the United States. (Note he was given ORDERS by one of his Wealthy Supporters in Chicago to SPEAK OUT AGAINST THE WAR. Being a good Chicago Politiocian, he naturally followed the orders and took credit for speaking out.. but not on his own.)

Wrote and delivered the keynote address at the 2004 Democratic National Convention.
The Black Elite in the DNC decided along with the good ole boys… that to put a Democrat President in the White House in 2008 that they needed to attract the black vote… and that a Black Harvard Lawyer named Obama was the one that they needed. He was seen as an upcoming star because he won the Illinois US Senate Seat. (See the real facts of how he won by such a large number.) No one knew the Republican Candidate)

November 2004: elected to the US Senate, receiving over 3.5 million votes, more than 70% of total.

Now this is an interesting election even by Chicago standards. Seems that the front runner (Hull) mysteriously become involved in a domestic abuse trial and withdrew his name from the race. (Sounds like the Chicago Political Machine may have dropped a dime on Blair.) So Obama had a cake walk to get the democratic nomination for the U.S. Senate Seat. (Reminds me of how he won his State Senate seat by having his legal team disqualify his opponent’s signature petitions. At the same time Jack Ryan won the Republican Nomination, but announced his withdrawal from the race — four days after the Chicago Tribune succeeded in persuading a California court to release previously-sealed child custody records containing embarrassing allegations by Ryan's ex-wife. Now how is that for being one LUCKY politician. Obama walked into the US Senate Seat, when the Republicans brought in the little known Keyes to run as a Republican. Now it looks like the Chicago Political Machine along with Ayers, Jackson, Rezko Wright and the rich and wealthy Black community in Chicago loaded the deck in Obama’s favor.

Also note that for a 'white middle-class individual to be considered for entrance into Harvard' they would have to be number one in their High School class. Be the top student at Occidental just to get into COLUMBIA, and the odds of them getting into HARVARD LAW school ARE SO GREAT.. they probably would win the lottery first.

Yet Obama has us believe (on FAITH) that he performed so brilliantly that he (had a 'B' average in High School) performed so brilliantly at Occidental, that he got into Columbia, and that he EARNED a slot into Harvard Law School. Then he and HARVARD expect us to believe that he PERFORMED SO BRILLIANTLY ACADEMICALLY that he EARNED his right to be EDITOR of THE HARVARD LAW REVIEW. (Now I challenge the Obama Campaign and any supporter to valid that he was the BEST CANDIDATE excluding the fact that he was BLACK instead of BI-RACIAL at any PRIVATE school that he attended.)

Amazing that there are no thesis papers, no legal briefs, no academic records, no scholarships received, no national test scores, no IQ scores, no legal briefs from his teaching in Chicago, or ANY LEGAL writings that wererequired of Editors of the Review... UNTIL Obama was selected.
I suspect that he received 'special' grants, scholarships, academic treatment not because he was brilliant... but because of the fact that these institutions... needed to promote black males the expense of better qualified female, and white male candidates. (I would hope that somewhere, someplace there is someone that can PROVE ME WRONG.)

And the amazing thing is... the MSM does not question any of this.

Shame on the MSM and shame on the Obama Supporters that BELIEVE in his Lies.

Remember he is spending over 600 million of YOUR dollars to BUY each and every American Vote that he receives. Amazing to think that you are being BOUGHT and selling out OUR Country to the RICH AND POWERFUL.

Posted by: Bob Miller | September 22, 2008 5:33 PM | Report abuse

Anyone who questions McCain's fitness and heroism could not last a second in his shoes. These are the type of people who express themselves with 20 bumper stickers on their paint worn, 1992 Honda Accord. Meanwhile, I'll try to shed some sympathy for all the times I've seen Biden cry since he was named VP mate. What a woos!

Posted by: Chuck | September 22, 2008 5:31 PM
______________________
mccain is a traitor
he sold his men out for food
get your head around it and outta your ass

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 5:32 PM | Report abuse


Anonymous:
"did your girlfriend leave you for a black guy because you are lacking in a certain 'catagory'?"

Hang it all out there, cowboy.

Posted by: JTR | September 22, 2008 5:32 PM | Report abuse

Anyone who questions McCain's fitness and heroism could not last a second in his shoes. These are the type of people who express themselves with 20 bumper stickers on their paint worn, 1992 Honda Accord. Meanwhile, I'll try to shed some sympathy for all the times I've seen Biden cry since he was named VP mate. What a woos!

Posted by: Chuck | September 22, 2008 5:31 PM | Report abuse

"Obama very rarely uses a teleprompter (I've only seen it once) That's why audiences can see him using notecards or an outline on the podium like all college speech classes teach us to do.

I am looking forward to this debate simply because it will show everyone who actually has thoughtful responses about the issues as opposed to quick (party-minded) responses that are supported by the same old party ideology that has gotten our country nowhere, the citizens in dire circumstances (unless they are rich), and helped corporations take over the small business sector. Good luck winning that debate John, at least if you are forced to stick to the truth you don't stand a chance."

Let me clarify: Obama rarely use a teleprompter. When I say I have only seen it once, I am not referring to "on view in the camera" I am referring to the fact he is not looking towards a specific point and READING from what appears to be a teleprompter. I do see him looking at the podium as moves from topic to topic, like people are trained to do when giving an effective speech. It's not that the camera has shown the teleprompter (as some seem to have interpreted) only once, it's the way the speech is given and what his eyes are focusing on.

I do agree with many though that debates are about finding out how candidates stances differ on the issues, and discovering who you agree with (if you do not already know.) I know who I agree with, but I still want to know this other person's perspective. I want to know if I will be able to rest at night, and live the life I work so hard for. I watched both conventions for the same reason. I find it hilarious that because people go to watch a speech in Florida it means that person is popular, no citizens want to know what you think about the things that matter to them. This is not (and should never be) about who delivers their answers best, but who gives the answer you agree with, who makes you feel comfortable with what they beleive, who do you trust to do what is best for the citizens of this nation, who is going to lead us in the direction that improves our standing with other nations, who will help our country live up to the ideals which bring tears to peoples eyes when they sing the Star Spangled Banner. "Oh say does that star spangled banner yet wave over the land of the free and the home of the brave" Lets feel the depth of our pride once more, and show the world we believe in those ideals again.
America '08

Posted by: Obama 08 | September 22, 2008 5:29 PM | Report abuse

How do you keep a stupid happy while you go to war? Let him Spend spend, buy homes that they can't afford, so the stupid runs around buying more and more for the home and can't find his way out! so we can bomb bomb. And we will wrap it up by calling it patriotic.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 5:29 PM | Report abuse


Anonymous:
"10 craps himself"

You counted them?


Posted by: JTR | September 22, 2008 5:29 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 5:18 PM MORE OBAMA SUPPORTER LIES -

he listed his race as white RIGHT !!!!!!!on his harvard app and did not have an interview RIGHT!!!!!!!

he was chosen as president of the review becasue of his writing...RIGHT!!!!!!!!

HA HA HA HA HA HA !!!!!!!

Posted by: Michelles Bioootch | September 22, 2008 5:23 PM

______________________
it's true

did your girlfriend leave you for a black guy because you are lacking in a certain 'catagory'?

lotta hate goin' on inside you...

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 5:29 PM | Report abuse

QUOTE Foreign Policy is important and we can expect John McCain to champion his military credentials for Commander in Chief. But the Founding Fathers were very specific that the role of Commander in Chief was to be in the hands of a citizen. ................
END QUOTE

And immediately thereafter, the first Commander-in-Chief was none other than General George Washington.

Posted by: Charlie Mike | September 22, 2008 5:28 PM | Report abuse


Obama Declares Himself Fiscal Conservative
by Associated Press

Now I have heard everything!!

This creature will say ANYTHING for
a vote, this is sad.

Posted by: simonsays | September 22, 2008 5:27 PM | Report abuse

The only restrictions to free speech the courts have recognized are if you are inciting violence or causing a danger to society, like yelling fire where there is none under an exception for public safety. You can call anyone any name you wish anywhere anytime, unless it constitutes libel or slander. Hurt feelings are not protected by the constitution. Those saying the first amendment is not a right are making the same kinds of uninformed arguments saying there is no wall of separation between church and state, really scary posts.

Posted by: Leichtman | September 22, 2008 5:27 PM | Report abuse

Really now - I'm glad Obama's act of sacrifice and service to country include:
1. Don't get hands sticky while serving donuts as community organizer
2. Send estranged brother a post card in his poor Kenyan village
3. Send National Enquirer like team to Alaska to dig out dirt on Palin
4. Embrace the original unabomber, Ayers
5. Embrace the anti white venom spewing Rev. Wright for 20 years!
6. Invent my own presidential seal, since I can't wait to be in Oval Office
7. Maybe, on the first day of my first term I will go ahead and plan my presidential library - I have more books on the subject than I do actual legislation, so I'll need a lot of shelves - I pale in comparison to accomplishment to McCain and Palin
8. Praying for my own despair and pride. The world doesn't need my prayers nor do its citizens. They need to elect me and not worry about me praying for their safety, peace and security
9. Been a fairy tale of the liberal media

You forgot:

A Muslim Father
An Atheist Mother
A Racist Wife
A Drug User
Said in an interview "My Muslim faith"
Said "Typical white people"
Calls women "Sweetie"


Posted by: JTR | September 22, 2008 5:27 PM | Report abuse

To NM Moderate:
Obama ran away from his race vs. being proud of it, or rather honest about it. Your drunk from your own stupidity if you think Obama has told you anything. He constantly stumbled on hard issues during Dem debates: no substance on Health Care, no substance on mortgage crisis. McCain can communicate. That's why he topped Romney, Guiliani, Thompson, Huckabee in primaries. A tough slew of opponents. America has confidence in him because he has confidence in America. Unlike the guilt trippin Obamas!

Posted by: Kelly Ray | September 22, 2008 5:25 PM | Report abuse

Xander,
I agree with you on that. Sadly in this world the strong rule the weak. But see, that's why I can't call it a "right". Not when it can be taken away. I mean, think of all the honored men and women that have fought and died on the wall, just so you and I can get up in the morning and say want we want.They fought for us so others can't take away our privilage to say what we want. Anyways thanks for the back and forth, and glad to know that we could talk as civilized individuals.

Posted by: Cannot Wait | September 22, 2008 5:24 PM | Report abuse

Let's get ready to rumble.

Posted by: Dmitriy | September 22, 2008 5:24 PM | Report abuse

I'm really glad mccain is a hero
1 daddy got him into NA
2 graduated 557/560
3 abandoned his kids and crippled wife
4 crashed 5 planes
5 killed 100+ guys on the forrestal
6 was a traitor to his country
7 sold men out for food
8 made videos, and acknowledged he was a war criminal
9 is senile
10 craps himself

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 5:23 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 5:18 PM MORE OBAMA SUPPORTER LIES -

he listed his race as white RIGHT !!!!!!!on his harvard app and did not have an interview RIGHT!!!!!!!

he was chosen as president of the review becasue of his writing...RIGHT!!!!!!!!

HA HA HA HA HA HA !!!!!!!

Posted by: Michelles Bioootch | September 22, 2008 5:23 PM | Report abuse

"It's about questioning the mental fitness of the potential leader of the free world."

Not only his mental health (which I'm seeing the beginning stages of Alzheimers sadly), but his health in general. This man has been battling Melanoma for years. He is expected to have another flare up within 10 years, and it's been 8. With the highly toxic treatments that are necessary for Melanoma, he would be unable to maintain his position as POTUS. That would leave us with the Hockey Mom with a 1800's mentality to run the country.

Posted by: Xander | September 22, 2008 5:22 PM | Report abuse

Fitness, I think you meant POTUS. And yes, it does matter. Will it ever be brought up? Probably not. There are websites and articles written by Vets addressing this exact issue however.

Posted by: YES WE CAN | September 22, 2008 5:21 PM | Report abuse

Okay I've avoided bringing this up but here it goes. McCain admittedly attempted suicide while a POW. He was stopped by a guard. Is this not relevant to him becoming P.O.S.? Is PTSD not relevant? The press have given him a pass on these issues but this isn't about dishonoring a soldier. It's about questioning the mental fitness of the potential leader of the free world.

Posted by: Fitness | September 22, 2008 5:17 PM

______________________
he's borderline sociopath with a penchent for violence and self-destructive tendencies...

'manchurian candidate'
he will get us into trouble with out think
9 am economy is sound
10 am economy is messed up

problem is once you pull the trigger, it can't be undone...

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 5:21 PM | Report abuse

So when Obama lama ding dong gets in front of the UNCRIPTED DEBATE (not the rehearsed crap where they know the questions ahead of time) exactly how much pain and suffering are we to endure before we put him out of our misery? Can I get my TiVo to edit out his fumbling bumbling mind numbing drivel and keep the intelligent answers of McCain?

Face it libs - The guy got into Harvard on AA, NEVER authored a single article when he was the "editor" at the Review, and speaks as eloquently as my kids gerbil. He is a moron and you know it. I can't wait to hear about the run on Depends for all those old socialists the day of the debates.


Posted by: Michelles Bioootch | September 22, 2008 5:15 PM

________________________
he listed his race as white on his harvard app and did not have an interview

he was chosen as president of the review becasue of his writing...

the only person wearing dependz is mccain...he 'soils' himself for sport

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 5:18 PM | Report abuse

Okay I've avoided bringing this up but here it goes. McCain admittedly attempted suicide while a POW. He was stopped by a guard. Is this not relevant to him becoming P.O.S.? Is PTSD not relevant? The press have given him a pass on these issues but this isn't about dishonoring a soldier. It's about questioning the mental fitness of the potential leader of the free world.

Posted by: Fitness | September 22, 2008 5:17 PM | Report abuse

"Why, if its a right that's been in our Constitution for so long, is it that its only been recently that more people have been abe to speak their minds without treat of harm or persicution?(s/p)"

Because people haven't been willing to fight for their rights. They've been afraid of their government, both in the highest powers and all throughout the judicial system. That's what we as Americans have forgotten. We have these rights. They are guaranteed to us. We have too long let the government control our rights, be it the FCC or any other source of censorship. If people would just be willing to fight for our rights, we wouldn't be in the borderline dictatorship that we now reside in.

Posted by: Xander | September 22, 2008 5:17 PM | Report abuse

Really now - I'm glad Obama's act of sacrifice and service to country include:
1. Don't get hands sticky while serving donuts as community organizer
2. Send estranged brother a post card in his poor Kenyan village
3. Send National Enquirer like team to Alaska to dig out dirt on Palin
4. Embrace the original unabomber, Ayers
5. Embrace the anti white venom spewing Rev. Wright for 20 years!
6. Invent my own presidential seal, since I can't wait to be in Oval Office
7. Maybe, on the first day of my first term I will go ahead and plan my presidential library - I have more books on the subject than I do actual legislation, so I'll need a lot of shelves - I pale in comparison to accomplishment to McCain and Palin
8. Praying for my own despair and pride. The world doesn't need my prayers nor do its citizens. They need to elect me and not worry about me praying for their safety, peace and security
9. Been a fairy tale of the liberal media
10. Have America sacrifice our strength

Posted by: The Punisher | September 22, 2008 5:16 PM | Report abuse

Hopefully the newly 100% anti-gay McCain will be asked why Mark Buse, his longtime Chief of Staff, is gay.

Posted by: Mark Buse's Lover | September 22, 2008 5:16 PM | Report abuse

So when Obama lama ding dong gets in front of the UNCRIPTED DEBATE (not the rehearsed crap where they know the questions ahead of time) exactly how much pain and suffering are we to endure before we put him out of our misery? Can I get my TiVo to edit out his fumbling bumbling mind numbing drivel and keep the intelligent answers of McCain?

Face it libs - The guy got into Harvard on AA, NEVER authored a single article when he was the "editor" at the Review, and speaks as eloquently as my kids gerbil. He is a moron and you know it. I can't wait to hear about the run on Depends for all those old socialists the day of the debates.

Posted by: Michelles Bioootch | September 22, 2008 5:15 PM | Report abuse

The Bush administration want to GRAB the people's money and run away with it.
THEY are using, AGAIN, the FEAR factor to say "Give us full, authoritarian control over $700 billion".
THEY, if allowed, WILL put all that money in "private funds", AWAY from the next administration.
HELL NO! is the correct answer to THAT.

Posted by: El Mugroso | September 22, 2008 5:11 PM

_______________________________
you're exactly right...this money will be used to reimburse all the fat cats who had huge losses...then they will foreclose on the average joe...

this is a scam of the highest order...
it's a 3 page document...for 700Bil!!!
no repayment provisions
no rules
no guidelines

I'd get fire for writing a 100k$ contract like that, let alone 700bil!

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 5:15 PM | Report abuse

"Obama needs to stop "um-ing and "uh-ing." Did he always have this habit? It seems it's gotten worse; is something external affecting his speech patterns?"

I'd have to say that it bothers me when people talk about this in a negative way. I'm not saying you in particular, but people in general. I'm sorry, but I stutter on occasion. Everyone does it. Sometimes your brain needs a second to catch up. Why people use this when McCain is even worse is beyond me. Whenever he starts speaking, he suddenly stops. Then we have to put up with the awkward silence and the blank stare that accompanies his brain farts. I'll take an um over a confused look any day :P

Posted by: Xander | September 22, 2008 5:14 PM | Report abuse

Protect The Wealthly Hedge Fund Managers who THRIVE on 15% rates........

Vote DipStick/LipStick 08

Protect the right to increase

MASSIVE FEDERAL DEBT
AND TRADE DEFICITS


Posted by: debatethis | September 22, 2008 5:12 PM | Report abuse

The Bush administration want to GRAB the people's money and run away with it.
THEY are using, AGAIN, the FEAR factor to say "Give us full, authoritarian control over $700 billion".
THEY, if allowed, WILL put all that money in "private funds", AWAY from the next administration.
HELL NO! is the correct answer to THAT.

Posted by: El Mugroso | September 22, 2008 5:11 PM | Report abuse

Xander,
i understand your're argument. However...
the bill rights in our constitution is not a global blanket that protects all everywhere. Second, if free speech was really a right, then could you walk up to Obama/McCain and call them what you want. Could you go on TV and say any words you wish. Could you continue to speak you're mind if someone told you it would cost you your life to continue to do so. The point that I'm trying to make is that, if it was a right then why are so many censored each day,everyday? Why, if its a right that's been in our Constitution for so long, is it that its only been recently that more people have been abe to speak their minds without treat of harm or persicution?(s/p)

Posted by: Cannot Wait | September 22, 2008 5:11 PM | Report abuse

just about anybody can work as a used-car
sale person.

How can a used-car sale person qualify
for a home morgage of $300,000 with $5,000
down?

What the hell kind of regualtion is it?

That why foreclosures.

Posted by: t n t | September 22, 2008 5:09 PM | Report abuse

Really now-

McCain was given an opportunity to leave right after his capture to gain favor with the American military because of his father’s position. He refused so instead of walking like a liberal coward would do - he stayed with his men and was tortured for 5 years so that "loser" in your eyes is what is known as to men with a spine - a hero.

Thanks for showing your ignorance, and cowardice; both of which are rife within the ranks of the left.


Posted by: Obama is a puppet | September 22, 2008 5:06 PM

____________________________
not true, he wanted to leave but his father the admiral vetoed it...it would be a propaganda coup' for the NV...

mccain was a traitor
made films, 30 of them
sold out buddies for a meal

not everyone in the military is honorable

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 5:09 PM | Report abuse

Obama well thought out sentences? Yes. With telemprompter. No without it. McCain is well-read,comes from a family who have served U.S. Obama is product of a one night stand by some guy named George from Kenya who came over and seduced a woman from Kansas.

Posted by: Kelly Ray | September 22, 2008 4:50 PM

Kelly, I don't think that Obama can be blamed for the circumstances surrounding his birth, do you? Furthermore, you have bought into the right-wing narrative that Obama is an empty suit who can only read someone else's words.
You may have missed it, but there was an article a few weeks back that quoted a woman who was responsible for editing Obama's first book, "dreams of my father". She said that she was very surprised how well-written the book was and how few edits she had to make. She said it was very rare that a first time author would turn in such a well-written manuscript. Keep in mind that Obama wrote it years before he entered politics.
Do you also know that Obama didn't even mention that he was half-black on his application to Harvard? No, he is not a product of affirmative action as the right-wing would like us all to believe.
I will concede that Obama's delivery is somewhat slow (you can actually see him thinking before he speaks), which doesn't translate well to debates and interviews. If you concentrate on what actually does come out of his mouth, it is surely more substantial than anything that comes out of McCain's mouth.

Posted by: NM Moderate | September 22, 2008 5:08 PM | Report abuse

OBAMA: Don't Phumpher. Attack McCain's "dangerous" VP pick. Be direct and show some spine.

McCAIN: Don't sound sophmoric. Don't parrot the same old cliche. Show some brains along with the bravado.


Obama needs to stop "um-ing and "uh-ing." Did he always have this habit? It seems it's gotten worse; is something external affecting his speech patterns?

Obama must give direct, simple answers, even if his intellectual side tells him to pontificate.

McCain is always direct, but too often his answers are cliched and simplistic. He needs to show skeptics that he can think on his feet and come up with intelligent arguments, not just spout talking points off an index card.

Obama needs to pounce on the judgment issue. He shouldn't be afraid of playing the Palin card. Obama's already let Palin get away with attacking his own preparedness. It's a tried-and-true disinformation technique: accuse your opponent of your own greatest vulnerability. Obama should consider landing a couple body blows against Palin so as to neutralize her effectiveness against him on the stump. It's really embarrassing how Obama's campaign is letting her get away with her constant attacks. It's reverse sexism to give her a break because she happens to be a woman. Zing McCain for a potentially dangerous VP selection.

McCain should attack Obama for constant equivocation and compromising, and for inconsistency on positions that his base considers off the table, like handgun control legislation and FISA. He also might note Obama's inconsistent rhetoric on the surge in Iraq and on the bailout (he was for giving Paulson broad authority before he was against it).

In the end, though, it's advantage Obama if he shows youth, vitality and intelligence. But if McCain turns in a feisty, snappy and smart performance, the tough old guy just might pull an upset.

Posted by: scrivener | September 22, 2008 5:06 PM | Report abuse

"and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances. "

And that part right there makes me laugh whenever someone says "well, it's not like we can take on the Government".

Posted by: Xander | September 22, 2008 5:06 PM | Report abuse

Really now-

McCain was given an opportunity to leave right after his capture to gain favor with the American military because of his father’s position. He refused so instead of walking like a liberal coward would do - he stayed with his men and was tortured for 5 years so that "loser" in your eyes is what is known as to men with a spine - a hero.

Thanks for showing your ignorance, and cowardice; both of which are rife within the ranks of the left.

Posted by: Obama is a puppet | September 22, 2008 5:06 PM | Report abuse

Bill of RIGHTS...
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the RIGHT of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 5:05 PM | Report abuse

I'm sure John McCain is a nice guy and all but someone explain to me how being a pilot that gets shot down, then gets captured by the enemy and tortured for years qualifies someone as a military leader?....AT LEAST HE ENLISTED. AT LEAST HE GOT IN THE PLANE. The closest a coward like you ever gets to the action is the X Box that your parents bought you because you sucked at sports and hated your cashier job at KFC.

Posted by: The Punisher | September 22, 2008 5:04 PM | Report abuse

"Xander,
Free speech is not a right. It is a privilage."

maybe in Palin's America. A driver's license is a privilige, life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness are inalienable rights. Why don't you try and learn something about the constitution before you post such drivel.

Posted by: Leichtman | September 22, 2008 5:03 PM | Report abuse

nobama' citizen of the world,
this issue is surely above
his pay grade,
I mean, there is evil
on the streets of america.
This guy is an enigma wrapped
in a riddle.
throw out some 'liar liar's
and who does he think he is kiddding?
I mean I came up with the change thing?
Yes, Me, Baraco Obama Invented Change.

Posted by: usa3 | September 22, 2008 5:03 PM | Report abuse

"McCain's body is his lapel pin." That's just beautiful. You've reduced McCain's war injuries to a lapel pin. Beautiful.

Posted by: PJ | September 22, 2008 5:02 PM | Report abuse

Obama uses teleprompters quite often - the media doesn't show them on camera as often as they do McCain's and Palin's.

Obama is like a deer in the headlights without his teleprompter and David Axelrod speeches. I can't wait to see McCain clean his clock in the debates!

Posted by: NObama | September 22, 2008 4:42 PM

______________________
funny

if this is a battle of wits, obama has a pump shotgun and mccain a pea shooter...

mccain is barely literate and graduated 557/560 and only got in and out becuase his daddy and grand-dad were admirals...

mccain's knees are gonna be sore from being obama biotch

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 5:02 PM | Report abuse

McSame Blames Bush and promise this that and other thing in his Dipstick Economic Plan.

Palin has ask God to Bless the Stock Market and Her War on Wall Streetor the LipStick PitBull Plan

DipStick/LipStick 08

ps: John McSame new social security plan... keep plenty of Gold on hand to bribe the border guard....

Posted by: dick cheney is a liar and corrupt | September 22, 2008 5:02 PM | Report abuse

"Xander,
Free speech is not a right. It is a privilage.It is a privilage granted by our constitution. It is something that we have the luxurary of using but, think about it, if someone forced you to not say what you wanted to say, is it still a right? Rights cannot be taken away, privilages on the other hand, can be taken away at any time. Think about it, would you still have rights if you went outside of this country to somewhere like say China where everything is censored by the government?"

Once again, being that it is written in the Bill of Rights, hence the Right to Free Speech, it is indeed a right. Your argument is completely off base. No one forces us to say anything that we say. It is our own thought process that brings us to the words we use.

Posted by: Xander | September 22, 2008 5:01 PM | Report abuse

Oh, yes, remember "The race is close".
With the emphasis on "race" - the new code- word for the Republicans.
Mark my words, come November the Ugly Americans will show their true face and
elect McCain. The morons populating this land would rather beg pennies from passers by than allow a n....r into the White House

Posted by: Sam | September 22, 2008 5:01 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 5:01 PM | Report abuse

"not being able to identify with aspects of his exotic life story" Please explain this statement what do you mean by exotic? Is being poor exotic? Is being in a one parent household exotic. Is going to school on a scholarship exotic? Is working as a community organizer exotic? Is exotic a code word for something you think but are not man enough to say?

Posted by: exoticmyass | September 22, 2008 5:00 PM | Report abuse

"McCain's body is his lapel pin. Your guy Obama and his wife are on record criticizing America and paint this as typical victimization: haves vs. have nots. Obama thinks there are 57 states. So he would be confused about the U.S. Flag."

To the punisher:

Your views on Obama and the whole situation are completely skewed. Your bias towards McCain is obvious. If you want to try to correct someone, do it in a way that is fair and educated, not just a blatant flame towards a different candidate.

To delta: Good lord don't go after the flag pin B.S. again. Why does someone have to wear a flag pin to be patriotic?

Posted by: Xander | September 22, 2008 5:00 PM | Report abuse

I'm sure John McCain is a nice guy and all but someone explain to me how being a pilot that gets shot down, then gets captured by the enemy and tortured for years qualifies someone as a military leader?

I know Obama has no military background but I'd rather go with an intelligent unknown than a proven loser.

Posted by: Really now | September 22, 2008 4:59 PM | Report abuse

Xander,
Free speech is not a right. It is a privilage.It is a privilage granted by our constitution. It is something that we have the luxurary of using but, think about it, if someone forced you to not say what you wanted to say, is it still a right? Rights cannot be taken away, privilages on the other hand, can be taken away at any time. Think about it, would you still have rights if you went outside of this country to somewhere like say China where everything is censored by the government?

Posted by: Cannot Wait | September 22, 2008 4:58 PM | Report abuse


OBAMA Uh , um, ohhh, errr, ferin HUH? - ohh, welllll, I guess, er, um, er......

Moderator - Mr Obama - would you like another 20 minutes to fumble through your response?

Posted by: Robert Campbell | September 22, 2008 4:58 PM | Report abuse

"Husband of Alaska's governor is involved in policy to a degree that surprises some observers."

Interesting that for months we heard constant attacks against Bill Clinton with conjectures about his meddling in a Hillary administration but nothing about Palin; total silence. Should we be asking for his expertise on sovereign wealth funds and mortgage policies or just his opinions on ice fishing and snow mobiles? Maybe Paulson needs to be meeting with him before crafting a trillion dollar mtg bailout plan. What a team Palin/McCain. Obama meets with Warren Buffett, McCain with first dude to craft his economic policies. How reassuring America.


Posted by: Leichtman | September 22, 2008 4:57 PM | Report abuse

"Why isn't McCain wearing a flag pin on his lapel? He claims to be patriotic but the contrary evidence is in front of our eyes." To Delta: McCain's body is his lapel pin. Your guy Obama and his wife are on record criticizing America and paint this as typical victimization: haves vs. have nots. Obama thinks there are 57 states. So he would be confused about the U.S. Flag.

Posted by: The Punisher | September 22, 2008 4:56 PM | Report abuse

undecided voter. I wish your view was shared by more, but unfortunately the average American is more swayed by negative campaigning and false promises. They expect everyone else to tell them what to think and what to believe as opposed to doing their own research and making an educated decision based on their own opinion as opposed to someone else's.

Posted by: Xander | September 22, 2008 4:56 PM | Report abuse

I'm just hoping McCain will show us his famous temper. KILL THE COMMIES!! Short of that, watching McCain is just eerie and sad. And American's used to dumbed-down sound bite answers will only be annoyed by Obama's thoughtful, intelligent answers. We like our leaders REAL DUMB--like us I suppose. C students RULE!

Posted by: PJ | September 22, 2008 4:55 PM | Report abuse

Kelly Ray - my goodness, where have you got your information? And have you listened to any speeches? Give Obama credit for something he does well - he actually can think and talk at the same time.

Posted by: Martine | September 22, 2008 4:54 PM | Report abuse

freeDom asked:

"Why doesn't the media get off its lazy butt and help explain the nuance to the public and raise the level of discourse, rather than continue to lower it?"

Because there is no media in this country, at least one worth its salt. When you convert every aspect of life to a business model, you wind up with a whole pile of sh...t. Indeed, everything business has touched/coopted was turned into sh...t: classical music (Mozart's Greatest Hits!), housing, visual arts, agriculture, ethics, aesthetics, medical care, government, education, female beauty, rock 'n roll, Albert Einstein, and yes, media.

Because media is a business, it makes most money by stooping to the lowest common denominator. This is in line with modern multi-national capitalist system whose greatest discovery in the second half of the 20th century was that marketing was more important than the product. A beautifully-packaged, inexpensive piece of turd was all that was needed for the masses to feel happy and free.

Nuance-shmuance!

To paraphrase John McCain: "We're all National Enquirer readers now!"

Posted by: Sam | September 22, 2008 4:54 PM | Report abuse

The idea of choosing a president based on who does better in a debate is a bit disconcerting. Would a football coach choose the starting quarterback based on how effectively the candidates debated the game plan?

I have hired a number of people based on job interviews, and it's a difficult task to effectively evaluate candidates.

My advice to voters would be as follows. Completely ignore any statements about "this is what I will do." Pay very close attention to any statements about "this is what I have done" and do your fact checking to see if it is true. If the candidate makes statements about "This is what I believe and this is what I stand for," ignore it unless the candidate can recite past actions that demonstrated that quality. If he can, then take it seriously.

Rely on your gut instinct as to whom you would trust to handle problems that we haven't even thought of yet. These will most likely be the next president's greatest challenge.

And to the media, please ask questions like, "Since you both claim to stand for change, please describe what you have changed and how you did it." Please do not ask questions like, "Please tell us what you plan to change and how you plan to do it."

I believe and hope that anyone experienced in evaluation interviews will agree an back me up on this.

- An undecided voter.

Posted by: undecided voter | September 22, 2008 4:54 PM | Report abuse

"Why would anyone currently want to be in power? you would have to have a BIG EGO with all the crap going on. It is beyond me. "

That reminds me of my thought process behind the two candidates. It seems to me that Obama wants the position because he believes he can change America for the greater good. As for McCain, he seems to be in it for the title and prestige that comes with it.

Posted by: Xander | September 22, 2008 4:52 PM | Report abuse

Why isn't McCain wearing a flag pin on his lapel? He claims to be patriotic but the contrary evidence is in front of our eyes.

Posted by: delta | September 22, 2008 4:51 PM | Report abuse

What about the debate to Open the debates and actually let other presidential candidates debate??? How is it that US people are only allowed to hear from the two corporate talking heads? Why can we hear from someone who will actually work for real US citizens and not bail out the corporate "citizens" on Wall St? Why? Because the debate commission who sponsors the debates is controlled by the Demo/Repub/corporate machine. Letting 3rd parties, like Ralph Nader, debate would let the majority of Americans voices be heard. It would also be a direct challenge to the machine that keeps the US people's nose to the grindstone while the rich roll in dough and the poor struggle to survive. Stop the media blackout and OPEN the Debates!!! .

Posted by: Rostapher | September 22, 2008 4:51 PM | Report abuse

Obama well thought out sentences? Yes. With telemprompter. No without it. McCain is well-read,comes from a family who have served U.S. Obama is product of a one night stand by some guy named George from Kenya who came over and seduced a woman from Kansas.

Posted by: Kelly Ray | September 22, 2008 4:50 PM | Report abuse

"I see that many of you are still wasting your privilage of free speech on nonsense"

Actually, it's a right, not a priviledge. Hence the "Right to Free Speech". So therefor it cannot be wasted, regardless of how inane and moronic the statement may be.

Posted by: Xander | September 22, 2008 4:50 PM | Report abuse

Why would anyone currently want to be in power? you would have to have a BIG EGO with all the crap going on. It is beyond me.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 4:50 PM | Report abuse

"Shame on the post for not mentioning the third party candidates unfairly excluded from these debates. Friday will not be so much a debate as a puppet show for the american people"

Considering that the chances for a third party candidate to win this election (with all the hype between the candidates from the major parties) is about slim to none. It would be interesting to see a third party group entered into the debates, but at this point they are considered a moot point.

Posted by: Xander | September 22, 2008 4:49 PM | Report abuse

I see that many of you are still wasting your privilage of free speech on nonsense

Posted by: Cannot Wait | September 22, 2008 4:49 PM | Report abuse

fools !!!!!!!!

Posted by: urmom | September 22, 2008 4:47 PM | Report abuse

Shame on the post for not mentioning the third party candidates unfairly excluded from these debates. Friday will not be so much a debate as a puppet show for the american people

Posted by: Shane | September 22, 2008 4:47 PM | Report abuse

Sen. McCain has the record to prove his foreign policy experience. So he doesn't need to be extraordinary to impress. He is also a little stiff. But for an old guy who wants to portray himself as serious and wise, this sort of personality is OK. He is also very authentic.

However, after saying all these nice things about Sen. McCain, I believe he should take this debate seriously and prepare very well for this debate. Remember, this race is close, and he doesn't want to make too much mistakes.

Posted by: McC Supporter | September 22, 2008 4:46 PM | Report abuse

If they want to seem a bit less out of touch, they could switch the theme of the debate to economic issues. Recent events have sort of pushed foreign policy to a side burner. The voters tuning in to the debates aren't going to care about the niceties of how this debate was agreed to months ago and we really can't wily nily go changing topics....

They want to be commander in chief, well part of the job is dealing when **** happens, so deal and let the theme be economic policy.

Posted by: muD | September 22, 2008 4:46 PM | Report abuse


Anonymous:
You write books, I suppose?


Posted by: JTR | September 22, 2008 4:46 PM | Report abuse

To Grace: for all of Bush's failures, at least America has not been attacked again. Further, future attacks after 9/11 have been thwarted. Obama wants to weaken our military. He can't even convincingly say that we should defeat the terrorists because in his heart of hearts he doesn't want to violate their rights!

Posted by: Kelly Ray | September 22, 2008 4:46 PM | Report abuse

I would far prefer to watch Obama speak in cogent well-thought-out sentances about the wide variety of foreign policy issues confronting our nation today than listen to McCain mangle the English language in search of an ignorant sound-bite.

The MSM needs to assist voters with this process by rewarding the person whose analysis is detailed, accurate, and lengthy and yes, nuanced. Not the debater whose world-view is summed up in the slick mindless phrases like "Bomb, bomb, bomb Iran" or "we are all Georgians now."

We need a nuanced leader now for a nuanced and dangerous world, not a bomb-thrower whose ideas are stuck in a foggy, simplistic 1960's time-warp.

Posted by: Revolver Trooper Palin | September 22, 2008 4:46 PM | Report abuse

"Obama lost the Saddleback debate."

Actually, Saddleback was a forum, not a debate. There is no way to lose a forum, since it is not a competition. And after all of the controversy that came from that forum, I would have to say that the only loser was the American people.

Posted by: Xander | September 22, 2008 4:46 PM | Report abuse


"Republicans - The Half-wits Party."

Better than no-witt there cowboy


Posted by: JTR | September 22, 2008 4:44 PM | Report abuse

Santa Claus is my legal name, and I'm a write-in candidate for President of the United States. Prior to my Santa days, I served as Director of The Terrorism Research and Communication Center (1978-86) and Member of the Federal Emergency Management Agency's National Defense Executive Reserve (1984-86). Friday's Mississippi debate on foreign policy might be more interesting with me included. www.SantaClaus08.com

Posted by: Santa Claus | September 22, 2008 4:44 PM | Report abuse

Obama lost the Saddleback debate. Hilary toasted him in most debates. If all you are worried about is your own pride, self inflated sense of self, then there's no teleprompter that will help you. None! When you vote "present" most of your time in state senate you demonstrate a lack of sincerity and lack of grasp of the issues. When you enter the Senate, wanting to run for president before you even know how to find the men's room in the Capitol, then you need a teleprompter!

Posted by: Chuck | September 22, 2008 4:43 PM | Report abuse

Doesn't anyone remember McCain saying if he was president he would find Bin Laden, he knew how to do it? And he's known for months now. So who would want a president that already knows how to get rid of Bin Laden but is waiting until and if he becomes President to tell us? I can't imagine why anyone would vote for him when he's done nothing about finding him before all this and now waiting to something real big if he is elected. Give me a break, he is too old to be considered and no way do we want Palin who has a past no one can find out about until after the elections. People need to wake up and smell the coffee or we will be right back where we've been for 8 years.

Posted by: Grace | September 22, 2008 4:43 PM | Report abuse

Obama uses teleprompters quite often - the media doesn't show them on camera as often as they do McCain's and Palin's.

Obama is like a deer in the headlights without his teleprompter and David Axelrod speeches. I can't wait to see McCain clean his clock in the debates!

Posted by: NObama | September 22, 2008 4:42 PM | Report abuse


JOHN MCCAIN LEADER OR MADMAN
YOU BE THE JUDGE.

WASHINGTON — Senator John McCain arrived late at his Senate office on the morning of Sept. 11, 2001, just after the first plane hit the World Trade Center. “This is war,” he murmured to his aides. The sound of scrambling fighter planes rattled the windows, sending a tremor of panic through the room.


Erik Jacobs for The New York Times
John McCain said he had consulted Henry A. Kissinger on foreign policy before and after the Sept. 11 attacks.

Within hours, Mr. McCain, the Vietnam War hero and famed straight talker of the 2000 Republican primary, had taken on a new role: the leading advocate of taking the American retaliation against Al Qaeda far beyond Afghanistan. In a marathon of television and radio appearances, Mr. McCain recited a short list of other countries said to support terrorism, invariably including Iraq, Iran and Syria.

“There is a system out there or network, and that network is going to have to be attacked,” Mr. McCain said the next morning on ABC News. “It isn’t just Afghanistan,” he added, on MSNBC. “I don’t think if you got bin Laden tomorrow that the threat has disappeared,” he said on CBS, pointing toward other countries in the Middle East.

Within a month he made clear his priority. “Very obviously Iraq is the first country,” he declared on CNN. By Jan. 2, Mr. McCain was on the aircraft carrier Theodore Roosevelt in the Arabian Sea, yelling to a crowd of sailors and airmen: “Next up, Baghdad!”

Now, as Mr. McCain prepares to accept the Republican presidential nomination, his response to the attacks of Sept. 11 opens a window onto how he might approach the gravest responsibilities of a potential commander in chief. Like many, he immediately recalibrated his assessment of the unseen risks to America’s security. But he also began to suggest that he saw a new “opportunity” to deter other potential foes by punishing not only Al Qaeda but also Iraq.

“Just as Sept. 11 revolutionized our resolve to defeat our enemies, so has it brought into focus the opportunities we now have to secure and expand our freedom,” Mr. McCain told a NATO conference in Munich in early 2002, urging the Europeans to join what he portrayed as an all but certain assault on Saddam Hussein. “A better world is already emerging from the rubble.”

To his admirers, Mr. McCain’s tough response to Sept. 11 is at the heart of his appeal. They argue that he displayed the same decisiveness again last week in his swift calls to penalize Russia for its incursion into Georgia, in part by sending peacekeepers to police its border.

His critics charge that the emotion of Sept. 11 overwhelmed his former cool-eyed caution about deploying American troops without a clear national interest and a well-defined exit, turning him into a tool of the Bush administration in its push for a war to transform the region.

“He has the personality of a fighter pilot: when somebody stings you, you want to strike out,” said retired Gen. John H. Johns, a former friend and supporter of Mr. McCain who turned against him over the Iraq war. “Just like the American people, his reaction was: show me somebody to hit.”

Whether through ideology or instinct, though, Mr. McCain began making his case for invading Iraq to the public more than six months before the White House began to do the same. He drew on principles he learned growing up in a military family and on conclusions he formed as a prisoner in North Vietnam. He also returned to a conviction about “the common identity” of dangerous autocracies as far-flung as Serbia and North Korea that he had developed consulting with hawkish foreign policy thinkers to help sharpen the themes of his 2000 presidential campaign.

While pushing to take on Saddam Hussein, Mr. McCain also made arguments and statements that he may no longer wish to recall. He lauded the war planners he would later criticize, including Defense Secretary Donald H. Rumsfeld and Vice President Dick Cheney. (Mr. McCain even volunteered that he would have given the same job to Mr. Cheney.) He urged support for the later-discredited Iraqi exile Ahmad Chalabi’s opposition group, the Iraqi National Congress, and echoed some of its suspect accusations in the national media. And he advanced misleading assertions not only about Mr. Hussein’s supposed weapons programs but also about his possible ties to international terrorists, Al Qaeda and the Sept. 11 attacks.

Five years after the invasion of Iraq, Mr. McCain’s supporters note that he became an early critic of the administration’s execution of the occupation, and they credit him with pushing the troop “surge” that helped bring stability. Mr. McCain, though, stands by his support for the war and expresses no regrets about his advocacy.

In written answers to questions, he blamed “Iraq’s opacity under Saddam” for any misleading remarks he made about the peril it posed.

The Sept. 11 attacks “demonstrated the grave threat posed by a hostile regime, possessing weapons of mass destruction, and with reported ties to terrorists,” Mr. McCain wrote in an e-mail message on Friday. Given Mr. Hussein’s history of pursuing illegal weapons and his avowed hostility to the United States, “his regime posed a threat we had to take seriously.” The attacks were still a reminder, Mr. McCain added, of the importance of international action “to prevent outlaw states — like Iran today — from developing weapons of mass destruction.”

Formative Years

Mr. McCain has been debating questions about the use of military force far longer than most. He grew up in a family that had sent a son to every American war since 1776, and international relations were a staple of the McCain family dinner table. Mr. McCain grew up listening to his father, Adm. John S. McCain Jr., deliver lectures on “The Four Ocean Navy and the Soviet Threat,” closing with a slide of an image he considered the ultimate factor in the balance of power: a soldier marching through a rice paddy with a rifle at his shoulder.

“To quote Sherman, war is all hell and we need to fight it out and get it over with and that is when the killing stops,” recalled Joe McCain, Senator McCain’s younger brother.

Vietnam, for Senator McCain, reinforced those lessons. He has often said he blamed the Johnson administration’s pause in bombing for prolonging the war, and he credited President Richard M. Nixon’s renewed attacks with securing his release from a North Vietnamese prison. He has made the principle that the exercise of military power sets the bargaining table for international relations a consistent theme of his career ever since, and in his 2002 memoir he wrote that one of his lifelong convictions was “the imperative that American power never retreat in response to an inferior adversary’s provocation.”


But Mr. McCain also took away from Vietnam a second, restraining lesson: the necessity for broad domestic support for any military action. For years he opposed a string of interventions — in Lebanon, Haiti, Somalia, and, for a time, the Balkans — on the grounds that the public would balk at the loss of life without clear national interests. “The Vietnam thing,” he recently said.

In the late 1990s, however, while he was beginning to consider his 2000 presidential race, he started rebalancing his view of the needs to project American strength and to sustain public support. The 1995 massacre of 5,000 unarmed Bosnian Muslims at Srebrenica under NATO’s watch struck at his conscience, he has said, and in addition to America’s strategic national interests — in that case, the future and credibility of NATO — Mr. McCain began to speak more expansively about America’s moral obligations as the only remaining superpower.

His aides say he later described the American air strikes in Bosnia in 1996 and in Kosovo in 1999 as a parable of political leadership: Mr. McCain, Senator Bob Dole and others had rallied Congressional support for the strikes despite widespread public opposition, then watched approval soar after the intervention helped to bring peace.

“Americans elect their leaders to make these kinds of judgments,” Mr. McCain said in the e-mail message.

It was during the Balkan wars that Mr. McCain and his advisers read a 1997 article on the Wall Street Journal editorial page by William Kristol and David Brooks of The Weekly Standard — both now Op-Ed page columnists at The New York Times — promoting the idea of “national greatness” conservatism, defined by a more activist agenda at home and a more muscular role in the world.

“I wouldn’t call it a ‘eureka’ moment, but there was a sense that this is where we are headed and this is what we are trying to articulate and they have already done a lot of the work,” said John Weaver, a former McCain political adviser. “And, quite frankly, from a crass political point of view, we were in the making-friends business. The Weekly Standard represented a part of the primary electorate that we could get.”

Soon Mr. McCain and his aides were consulting regularly with the circle of hawkish foreign policy thinkers sometimes referred to as neoconservatives — including Mr. Kristol, Robert Kagan and Randy Scheunemann, a former aide to Mr. Dole who became a McCain campaign adviser — to develop the senator’s foreign policy ideas and instincts into the broad themes of a presidential campaign. (In his e-mail message, Mr. McCain noted that he had also consulted with friends like Henry A. Kissinger, known for a narrower view of American interests.)

One result was a series of speeches in which Mr. McCain called for “rogue state rollback.” He argued that disparate regional troublemakers, including Iraq, North Korea and Serbia, bore a common stamp: they were all autocracies. And as such, he contended, they were more likely to export terrorism, spread dangerous weapons, or start ethnic conflicts. In an early outline of what would become his initial response to the Sept. 11 attacks, Mr. McCain argued that “swift and sure” retribution against any one of the rogue states was an essential deterrent to any of the others. But Mr. McCain’s advisers and aides say his “rogue state” speeches stopped short of the most sweeping international agenda put forth by Mr. Kristol, Mr. Kagan and their allies. Mr. McCain explicitly disavowed direct military action merely to advance American values, foreswearing any “global crusade” of interventions in favor of relying on covert and financial support for internal opposition groups.

As an example, he could point to his 1998 sponsorship of the Iraqi Liberation Act, which sought to direct nearly $100 million to Iraqis who hoped to overthrow Saddam Hussein. The bill, signed by President Bill Clinton, also endorsed the ouster of Mr. Hussein.

Mr. McCain said then that he doubted the United States could muster the political will to use ground troops to remove the Iraqi dictator any time soon. “It was much easier when Saddam Hussein was occupying Kuwait and threatening Saudi Arabia,” the senator told Fox News in November 1998. “We’d have to convince the American people that it’s worth again the sacrifice of American lives, because that would also be part of the price.”

Hard Calls

Mr. McCain spent the afternoon of Sept. 11 in a young aide’s studio apartment near the Capitol. There was no cable television, nothing but water in the kitchen, and the hallway reminded him of an old boxing gym. Evacuated from his office but stranded by traffic, he could not resist imagining himself at the other end of Pennsylvania Avenue. “There are not enough Secret Service agents in the world to keep me away from Washington and New York at a time like this,” Mr. McCain told an adviser.


Over the next days and weeks, however, Mr. McCain became almost as visible as he would have been as president. Broadcasters rushed to him as a patriotic icon and reassuring voice, and for weeks he was ubiquitous on the morning news programs, Sunday talk shows, cable news networks, and even late-night comedy shows.

In the spotlight, he pushed rogue state rollback one step further, arguing that the United States should go on the offensive as a warning to any other country that might condone such an attack. “These networks are well-embedded in some of these countries,” Mr. McCain said on Sept. 12, listing Iraq, Iran and Syria as potential targets of United States pressure. “We’re going to have to prove to them that we are very serious, and the price that they will pay will not only be for punishment but also deterrence.”

Although he had campaigned for President Bush during the 2000 general election, he was still largely frozen out of the White House because of animosities left over from the Republican primary. But after Mr. Bush declared he would hold responsible any country condoning terrorism, Mr. McCain called his leadership “magnificent” and his national security team the strongest “that has ever been assembled.” A few weeks later, Larry King of CNN asked whether he would have named Mr. Rumsfeld and Colin L. Powell to a McCain cabinet. “Oh, yes, and Cheney,” Mr. McCain answered, saying he, too, would have offered Mr. Cheney the vice presidency.

Even during the heat of the war in Afghanistan, Mr. McCain kept an eye on Iraq. To Jay Leno in mid-September, Mr. McCain said he believed “some other countries” had assisted Osama bin Laden, going on to suggest Iraq, Syria and Iran as potential suspects. In October 2001, when an Op-Ed page column in The New York Times speculated that Iraq, Russia or some other country might bear responsibility for that month’s anthrax mailings, Mr. McCain interrupted a question about Afghanistan from David Letterman on that night’s “Late Show.” “The second phase is Iraq,” Mr. McCain said, adding, “Some of this anthrax may — and I emphasize may — have come from Iraq.” (The Federal Bureau of Investigation says it came from a federal government laboratory in Maryland.) By October, United States and foreign intelligence agencies had said publicly that they doubted any cooperation between Mr. Hussein and Al Qaeda, noting Al Qaeda’s opposition to such secular nationalists. American intelligence officials soon declared that Mr. Hussein had not supported international terrorism for nearly a decade.

But when the Czech government said that before the attacks, one of the 9/11 hijackers had met in Prague with an Iraqi intelligence official, Mr. McCain seized the report as something close to a smoking gun. “The evidence is very clear,” he said three days later, in an Oct. 29 television interview. (Intelligence agencies quickly cast doubt on the meeting.)

Frustrated by the dearth of American intelligence about Iraq, Mr. McCain’s aides say, he had long sought to learn as much as he could from Iraqi opposition figures in exile, including Mr. Chalabi of the Iraqi National Congress. Over the years, Mr. McCain often urged support for the group, saying it had “significant support, in my view, inside Iraq.”

After Sept. 11, Mr. Chalabi’s group said an Iraqi emissary had once met with Osama bin Laden, and brought forward two Iraqi defectors who described terrorist training camps and biological weapons efforts. At times, Mr. McCain seemed to echo their accusations, citing the “two defectors” in a television interview and attesting to “credible reports of involvement between Iraqi administration officials, Iraqi officials and the terrorists.”

Growing Impatient

But United States intelligence officials had doubts about Mr. Chalabi at the time and have since discredited his group. In 2006, Mr. McCain acknowledged to The New Republic that he had been “too enamored with the I.N.C.” In his e-mail message, though, he said he never relied on the group for information about Iraq’s weapons program.

At a European security conference in February 2002, when the Bush administration still publicly maintained that it had made no decision about moving against Iraq, Mr. McCain described an invasion as all but certain. “A terrorist resides in Baghdad,” he said, adding, “A day of reckoning is approaching.”

Regime change in Iraq in addition to Afghanistan, he argued, would compel other sponsors of terrorism to mend their ways, “accomplishing by example what we would otherwise have to pursue through force of arms.”

Finally, as American troops massed in the Persian Gulf in early 2003, Mr. McCain grew impatient, his aides say, concerned that the White House was failing to act as the hot desert summer neared. Waiting, he warned in a speech in Washington, risked squandering the public and international support aroused by Sept. 11. “Does anyone really believe that the world’s will to contain Saddam won’t eventually collapse as utterly as it did in the 1990s?” Mr. McCain asked.

In retrospect, some of Mr. McCain’s critics now accuse him of looking for a pretext to justify the war. “McCain was hell-bent for leather: ‘Saddam Hussein is a bad guy, we have got to teach him, let’s send a message to the other people in the Middle East,’ ” said Senator John Kerry, Democrat of Massachusetts.

But Mr. McCain, in his e-mail message, said the reason he had supported the war was the evolving threat from Mr. Hussein.

“I believe voters elect their leaders based on their experience and judgment — their ability to make hard calls, for instance, on matters of war and peace,” he wrote. “It’s important to get them right.”

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 4:42 PM | Report abuse

Typical black people vote for the Obama.

Gallup a few days ago:
White - Obama 37% McCain 52%
Black - Obama 93% McCain 2%

Posted by: JTR | September 22, 2008 4:42 PM | Report abuse

Did I read that right? Obama has to be careful no to give too detailed an answer??? So being intelligent is a bad thing now is it?

Talk about shifting the goalposts. Now, in order to appear presidential, the media is demanding that Obama stick to one-line answers with small words. Like the kind McCain uses.

Republicans - The Half-wits Party.

Posted by: festinog | September 22, 2008 4:42 PM | Report abuse

I see that many of you are still wasting your privilage of free speech on nonsense

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 4:42 PM | Report abuse

Sarah Palin would agree, she is a "BIG" jew hater.

========
Yeahhh!...Yeahhh!...Whatever!!! One thing I now know is that jews are the most wicked people I ever known on this earth. I swear the Gosh!!!

Posted by: Ben | September 22, 2008 4:40 PM

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 4:41 PM | Report abuse

The GOP tries to slot everything into black and white, right or wrong in order to win support from the mindless middle americans clinging to their guns and bibles...

Posted by: Lee Keyanis | September 22, 2008 4:41 PM | Report abuse

I think Obama is obviously the better public speaker and will do well. I've seen him speak in person...the man is very convincing and connects with the people. It will come across that way in the debate as well. McCain, on the other hand, will struggle and therefore expectations are not very high for him. I, personally, will be looking for gaffes by McCain and hope the questioners will call him on it should they occur (as they should Obama, too). It will be interesting, but I'm sure the Spin-Doctors will paint a different picture than the one we will witness (particularly for McCain).

Posted by: Bob Good | September 22, 2008 4:41 PM | Report abuse

Obama is the communist with a communist agenda for this country.Do we need a muslim communist in WH ?

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 4:41 PM | Report abuse

JOHN MCCAIN, TRAITOR TO HIS COUNTRY, COLLABORATOR WITH THE ENEMY, MILITARY DISGRACE.
Ted Sampley, a Vietnam Veteran and former Green Beret, issued a CHALLENGE to John McCain "If you can show us that the information presented in our mailer is untruthful . . . we will Stand Down" This CHALLENGE was issued during an interview with INSIDE EDITION on January 17, 2008.
John, family members of Vietnam POW/MIA(s) have been waiting for more then 14 years for you to have the courage to face them eye to eye in front of the American Public - Here is your opportunity for some "STRAIGHT TALK." Stop hiding behind your fabricated "War Hero" persona. You know we can prove your collaborations with declassified government documents . . . It is time for the American people to get to know the REAL John McCain - the John McCain that the POW/MIA families witnessed during the 1991-93 US Senate Select Committee on POW/MIA Affairs .
Bring It On John! HERE IS OUR NUMBER 252-527-0442
*********** ************* ************** *********** ***********
Activists accused McCain of stonewalling the release of POW records because they contained evidence he had collaborated with the North Vietnamese.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9MUY9S6iCvk

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 4:40 PM | Report abuse

Yeahhh!...Yeahhh!...Whatever!!! One thing I now know is that jews are the most wicked people I ever known on this earth. I swear the Gosh!!!

Posted by: Ben | September 22, 2008 4:40 PM | Report abuse

""Obama's positioning is more nuanced which can be dangerous in a debate setting where each candidate has two minutes or less to make his point."

Is this what debate in our country has come down to? Imagine if Abe Lincoln had ever heard that! Why doesn't the media get off its lazy butt and help explain the nuance to the public and raise the level of discourse, rather than continue to lower it?

Posted by: freeDom | September 22, 2008 4:29 PM "

I couldn't agree more. If the subject we deal with in this country were not complex, were easily summed up and solved in a two minute sound bite, wouldn't everything be solved by now. The reason why we are voting for the person most capable, most thorough and intellectual is that the world's problems ARE complex. And we need someone who makes considerate decisions.. not coin flips "from the gut".

We depend on the media to demand the details and the nuance. Its disappointing when they point out that being detailed and expansive is somehow a negative.

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 4:39 PM | Report abuse

I have come to the sad conclusion that the reason Obama isn't at least 10 points ahead of McCain in all the polls is the one reason nobody will talk about. He is black. McCain is represents the economic policies of Regan, and Bush. The economy has been utterly trashed because of those ideas. And yet McCain is able to convince enough people that he represents change (including economic) that the race is close. Why is this? I think it is because, while unable to admit it to themselves, Obama's race makes enough people so nervous that they are willing to hope beyond reason that a Republican that has encouraged deregulation and wants to continue Bush tax policies really is the smarter choice.

This white man feels a deep sadness that we have yet to put aside our irrational fears of something as trivial as the melanin content of one's skin.

Posted by: BobC | September 22, 2008 4:39 PM | Report abuse

The liar John Mccain would be proud of you BUT!!!

From factcheck.org

You might as well know what actually happened so you can make up your own mind without the lies.
If you are interested read below.

Q: Does Obama have a real estate problem?

A political patron from whom he bought a strip of land is under federal indictment, but there's no evidence Obama did anything improper.
Here’s what happened: In 2005, Barack Obama and his wife, Michelle, bid $1.65 million for a house on the south side of Chicago. According to newspaper reports, the owner was also trying to sell an undeveloped parcel of land adjacent to the property Obama was buying, and he wanted the sales of the two to close on the same day. Obama has said that he mentioned he was buying the house to a longtime political patron, Antoin (Tony) Rezko, a developer. Rezko’s wife wound up buying the lot adjacent to Obama’s. At the request of the Obamas, who were seeking a bit more space for their yard, she later sold them a 10-foot wide strip, or about one-sixth, of her land. The Obamas paid $104,500 for it, or about one-sixth of what Mrs. Rezko had paid for the entire property.

Obama doesn’t appear to have reaped any financial advantages from the transactions. The reason the deal has received a good bit of attention is that Tony Rezko – whose political contributions to Illinois’ former governor, Obama and others totaled in the hundreds of thousands of dollars – was known to be under federal investigation at the time the Obamas were purchasing their home. In 2006, Rezko was indicted in three federal cases: Two involved fraud schemes in which he allegedly demanded payments from firms wanting work from the enormous Illinois teachers’ pension fund and from those wanting favorable rulings from a state board that regulates the building of new hospital facilities. In the third, he was charged with fraudulently obtaining more than $10 million in loans for a pizza restaurant business; in December 2007, prosecutors added more fraud counts to that indictment.

Obama has a relationship with Rezko that dates back many years, but there’s no indication Obama did anything improper. Shortly after finishing law school, Obama, who had turned down a job offer from the developer, went to work at a law firm where he represented some community groups that partnered with Rezko to apply for housing rehabilitation loans. As a state legislator, he wrote letters to city and state officials in support of Rezko’s efforts to build apartments for the elderly with government money; the senator asserts that this was a project the community wanted. Obama got together with Rezko a couple of times a year, he has said.

Obama has donated campaign contributions from Rezko and his associates to charity, and he said in 2006, when the real estate transaction was reported by the press, that he made a “boneheaded” mistake by participating in the deal when it was known that Rezko was being investigated. “I regret it,” Obama said. “I’m going to make sure from this point on I don’t even come close to the line.”


=======
Obama broke the law when he bought that house in Chicago together with criminal REZKO.No wonder considering his Chicago mob connection.Do we need the criminal in WH?

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 4:34 PM

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 4:39 PM | Report abuse

Obama doesn't care about not stinkin' debates!

http://www.slander08.com

Posted by: Bill Safe | September 22, 2008 4:39 PM | Report abuse

Why Obama can't debate one on one.Cause he is dim-witted.Without a teleprompter he is lost

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 4:38 PM | Report abuse


Typical black people vote for the Obama.


Posted by: JTR | September 22, 2008 4:38 PM | Report abuse

McCain has to avoid mixing up Sunni and Shia, know what countries border Iran, and whether or not Iran is sponsoring al Qaeda insurgents in Iraq. He also has to avoid insulting the elected leader of Spain or any other of our NATO allies.

McCain needs to avoid declaring that "we are all Georgians now" or that we are any other nationality other than Americans if he can help it. No sabre-rattling, please.

He needs to explain how the shallow uneducated earmarker Governor of Alaska is qualified to become president of the United States.

McCain also needs to explain why it is a bad thing that millions of people around the world admire and respect us because we are poised to elect Barack Obama president of the United States.

Posted by: dee | September 22, 2008 4:38 PM | Report abuse

Who is the bozo commenting on McCain's cars? McCain has 7 adult children. He probably, like most parents, purchased most those vehicles on their behalf. Obama and his elitist friends don't care about you and UAW nor manufacturing jobs.

Posted by: The Punisher | September 22, 2008 4:38 PM | Report abuse

I like McCain's policy of putting an end to sending money to countries that don't even like us, over the bill Obama wrote to give $50 billion a year to poor countries.

We are already overspent. Wrap up Iraq and get home. Secure the borders and let McCain/Palin cut wasteful spending over the next 4 years.

Let Israel take care of Iran if they feel like it, and let the military reflect on strategy in Iraq while preparing for a growing Russia. WW3 will be an inevitable energy war so cut the Socialism nonesense and invest nationally in a solid energy plan and independence. Quick wasting money overseas.

Posted by: Lenny | September 22, 2008 4:37 PM | Report abuse


Kelly Ray:
"Obama thinks that there are 57 states and he did not even know what city he was in during his DNC live satellite broadcast? "

The dude's smokin' pot again.........

Posted by: JTR | September 22, 2008 4:37 PM | Report abuse

It's going to be fun after the debate listening to Cillizza twist and contort himself into figuring out a way to make it look like Grampy McCain won.


Maybe Drudge can help you out again, right Chris?
.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IH0xzsogzAk
.

Posted by: Jeff Y | September 22, 2008 4:37 PM | Report abuse

Rufus- Obama very rarely uses a teleprompter (I've only seen it once) That's why audiences can see him using notecards or an outline on the podium like all college speech classes teach us to do.

I am looking forward to this debate simply because it will show everyone who actually has thoughtful responses about the issues as opposed to quick (party-minded) responses that are supported by the same old party ideology that has gotten our country nowhere, the citizens in dire circumstances (unless they are rich), and helped corporations take over the small business sector. Good luck winning that debate John, at least if you are forced to stick to the truth you don't stand a chance.

Posted by: Finally | September 22, 2008 4:36 PM | Report abuse

Finally, The debates are here!
I can't wait to watch this debate. Both candidates will have a lot of pressure to perform well.As it has been noted by some of you already, I feel that this debate will help to shift the decesion of the undecided towards one candidate over the other. I just hope that is is done based on the overall message given by the candidates. Unfortunatly it would be naive of me to believe that many, and I mean many Americans will take this debate at face value and make there decisions on who speaks better, who delivers better, and who comes off more "presidential". Still the debates are going to be ratings and attention grabbers that I don't think should be missed.

Posted by: Cannot Wait | September 22, 2008 4:35 PM | Report abuse

Since when does human being not have human rights? Since King George so declared? I remember a Declaration of Independence reasserting they did.

Posted by: Angry Dem | September 22, 2008 4:35 PM | Report abuse

Obama broke the law when he bought that house in Chicago together with criminal REZKO.No wonder considering his Chicago mob connection.Do we need the criminal in WH?

Posted by: Anonymous | September 22, 2008 4:34 PM | Report abuse

McSame:
"I will be the big winner in this debate if I can make it through without having to go pee."

Typical black people can hold more...

Posted by: JTR | September 22, 2008 4:34 PM | Report abuse

"Why doesn't the media get off its lazy butt and help explain the nuance to the public and raise the level of discourse, rather than continue to lower it?"

Because the general public have become so lazy that they need to have everything dumbed down for them to understand instead of taking the time to educate themselves on the issues. I myself would love to hear Obama speak for 10 minutes on a single issue. It would give me more insight into his personality and thoughts. But in the instant-now nation that we live in, anything that isn't delivered in 2 minutes or less is too long to wait for most Americans.

Posted by: Xander | September 22, 2008 4:34 PM | Report abuse

Do not talk about Wisdom unless you agree

Bush is worse
Congress is worser
Media is worst

Otherwise, how could such financial crisis happens wihtout anyone really knew it is coming.

I guess all were enjoying dancing with stars. Hopefully there is real God to save America.

Posted by: jy2008 | September 22, 2008 4:34 PM | Report abuse

Maybe Obama can explain why he is so concerned with the rights of terrorists?

McCain's foreign policy > Obama-lama-ding-dong's. Basically, Obama doesn't have one unless Biden gave him a plagiarized copy from someone else. Oh gawd... what if he stole it from Carter? Bwahahahah

Posted by: Michael | September 22, 2008 4:33 PM | Report abuse

Obama can't debate without a teleprompter. Will he need one to run the government? Also, why does media focus on McCain gaffes when Obama thinks that there are 57 states and he did not even know what city he was in during his DNC live satellite broadcast?

Posted by: Kelly Ray | September 22, 2008 4:32 PM | Report abuse


Angry Dem
"We will once again rise as Obama leads us from the melting pot ........... "

into the fire.

Posted by: JTR | September 22, 2008 4:32 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: proudtobeGOP | September 22, 2008 4:19 PM

JamesCH, On which foriegn policy issue will Obama gain the upper hand? Closing Gitmo? nope. Use of torture? nope. Effective leadership on military decisions? nope. Negotiating with terrorists? well, okay, I concede that one. Carter and Obama- cut from the same cloth.
--------------------------------

Reply to ProudtobeGOP (alias idiot)

Don't you follow the news?

McCain/Bush negotiating with Iran is appeasement and Obama countered that we should have direct tough negotiations. Now they both are onboard and Bush is negotiating.

McCain/Bush said that Afghanistan is not a problem and that Osama bin Laden wasn't a threat anymore. Obama countered that we should have more brigades in Afghanistan. Now they both are onboard and Bush is planning on sending more troops there.

McCain/Bush said that a timetable was bad and that it signalled weakness and would cause us to lose the war in Iraq. Obama countered we should have a set timetable and toughen up our requirement for Iraq to mend their internal politics. Now the Iraqi governmene is onboard and Bush is negotiating a time horizon, i.e. a timetable.

The list goes on and this should all come up in the debate. Obama has showed a clear-eyed understanding of national security and international relations. Far beyond that of Bush and McCain.

ProudtobeGOP you should watch and read other sources than just FOX news. This is stuff that has been widely accepted for a long time.

Posted by: ProudtobeanAmerican | September 22, 2008 4:31 PM | Report abuse

Eloquence + Exotic = Articulate Negro
Broder reinforces the new racism

Posted by: Ned Farmer | September 22, 2008 4:30 PM | Report abuse

Now that we have blown the deficit to the moon, I want to know how can we afford our foreign policy draining us dry

Posted by: nclwtk | September 22, 2008 4:30 PM | Report abuse

It is not John McCain who must convince Americans he is not George Bush, so much as it is Barack Obama who must convince Americans he is not Karl Marx.

Posted by: Greg | September 22, 2008 4:30 PM | Report abuse

Obama 08!

One Car, One House, One Spouse...

Posted by: Daniel | September 22, 2008 4:30 PM | Report abuse

"Obama's positioning is more nuanced which can be dangerous in a debate setting where each candidate has two minutes or less to make his point."

Is this what debate in our country has come down to? Imagine if Abe Lincoln had ever heard that! Why doesn't the media get off its lazy butt and help explain the nuance to the public and raise the level of discourse, rather than continue to lower it?

Posted by: freeDom | September 22, 2008 4:29 PM | Report abuse

Let us not forget the greatest debate of all time where Jesus, a community organizer, went up against Pilate, a governor. Though it seemed at first that Pilate won, Jesus had the last laugh a few days later!

Posted by: Back2theBook | September 22, 2008 4:26 PM | Report abuse

To bomb or not bomb Iran, that is the question. Whether tis nobler to suffer the slings and arrows of outrageous national debt or to whither at the approach of an aggressive and opulent bear (Russia). To spin. To spin, perchance to pander. Can a fallen nation continue to adhere to a simple minded diplomacy called unilateralism, or to reach across the bonds of Republican inflicted debt, to partner with our neighbors, who stream across McCain's arid duchy, to control our unchecked borders and secure peace, prosperity and tranquility? Nay, the silver fox and woman of false virtue shall not lead us down the path to our destruction. We will once again rise as Obama leads us from the melting pot to cast the ship of state in new grandeur.

Posted by: Angry Dem | September 22, 2008 4:26 PM | Report abuse

My worry as always with these debates is that the punditry, and through them, the public will not judge the debates on the points made by each man and the fundamental logic and principles that lead to each man's point of view. Instead, I fear the debate, as it did with Bush against Gore especially, will come down to which candidate meets "delivery" expectations. For instance, expectations for McCain can be set so low for McCain that short of him chewing on the podium from a violent fit, and presenting himself as a little more than a totem pole, he will be viewed as exceeding expectations and therefore will be declared a "winner".

I still remember how successful the spin doctors were at spinning Bush's inexperience and Gore supposedly debating brilliance such that Bush just had to refrain from drooling and he would come out the winner.

And thus our wonderful American "sport" of politics.

Posted by: DaveinFL | September 22, 2008 4:25 PM | Report abuse

David Broder, the Washington Dean of conventional wisdom. I seem to recall him talking about a Bush bounce in the polls a while back. Last I checked Bush was mired in the lower 20% approval ratings. Broder doesn't know what he's talking about.

Posted by: Cletus | September 22, 2008 4:23 PM | Report abuse

I hope they call out McCain on his record in voting on Veteran's issues. Obama needs to hit him hard on that point. He votes against the funding of improvements in Vets health system and will get really ticked off because he can't stand the truth. He feels it is questioning his patriotism or something.

Let the ill-tempered lout fume and explode on national TV! Oh man that would be sweet justice!

Posted by: Mike in Sac | September 22, 2008 4:22 PM | Report abuse

I wish the debate was on the current Fannie Mae situation so Obama could explain why he and Pelosi have nothing to do with it.

McCain could whip out this http://www.govtrack.us/congress/bill.xpd?bill=s109-190
and watch Obama turn into Porky Pig like he did at Saddleback uh uh uh ebida ebida "Above my paygrade!"

Posted by: Michael | September 22, 2008 4:22 PM | Report abuse

MCCain....

Posted by: Sutton | September 22, 2008 4:20 PM | Report abuse

JamesCH, On which foriegn policy issue will Obama gain the upper hand? Closing Gitmo? nope. Use of torture? nope. Effective leadership on military decisions? nope. Negotiating with terrorists? well, okay, I concede that one. Carter and Obama- cut from the same cloth.

Posted by: proudtobeGOP | September 22, 2008 4:19 PM | Report abuse

Cillizza of WaPo diddles Broder of WaPo. Conventional Widson squared.

Posted by: Jimmy James Jr | September 22, 2008 4:18 PM | Report abuse

Foreign Policy is important and we can expect John McCain to champion his military credentials for Commander in Chief. But the Founding Fathers were very specific that the role of Commander in Chief was to be in the hands of a citizen. ................
http://thefiresidepost.com/2008/08/28/commander-in-chief-role-of-a-citizen/

Posted by: Ohg Rea Tone | September 22, 2008 4:18 PM | Report abuse

I will be the big winner in this debate if I can make it through without having to go pee.

Posted by: McSame | September 22, 2008 4:18 PM | Report abuse

Barack without a teleprompter? That will be painfully funny to watch.

And Gov. Palin's going windbag hunting! Elmer Biden will be a punchline come the morning.

Posted by: Rufus | September 22, 2008 4:17 PM | Report abuse

The expectation has to be that the man with so much experience in the back and forth of the Senatorial consideration, a seasoned debater, will make short work of the young inexperienced community organizer.

Posted by: thebob.bob | September 22, 2008 4:16 PM | Report abuse

I would like, just once, for one of the candidates to proclaim, and mean it, that they are actually going to answer the question put to them rather than launch in to the closest prepared talking point they have. It would be a gamble but it would impress many Americans such as this one, and shame and expose the one who does not follow suit. I'm so tired of cliches and focus-group driven answers. Anyone who answered that way in a job interview would not get the job. Why should a President?

Posted by: Sam | September 22, 2008 4:16 PM | Report abuse

Caribou Barbies 15 minutes are up!

She can take her corrupt pathological serial lying butt back to Alaska anytime now...

Posted by: Paige Palmer | September 22, 2008 4:14 PM | Report abuse

CC, I'll be counting on you for a non-partisan synopsis and analysis of the debate, as I'll be working at that hour on Friday night. (Just doing my part to keep the economy rolling.)

Posted by: proudtobeGOP | September 22, 2008 4:13 PM | Report abuse

Obama has to throw McCain off balance. McCain has a reputation as someone prone to temper issues. If Obama can tactfully make McCain lose his cool, he can paint McCain as having too volatile a personality to lead.

Likewise, Obama must avoid the appearance that he overthinks his answers to foreign policy issues. If he can't keep his answers concise yet thoughtful, it will color him as lacking resolve.

Posted by: JamesCH | September 22, 2008 4:07 PM | Report abuse

I am prepared to release my new flat tax plan this week. It is pretty easy. anyone who makes over $30K will have it confiscated and handed to those who don't.

Except for committee chairmen of course.

Posted by: snObama | September 22, 2008 3:58 PM | Report abuse

Regulate or to De-regulate?
That is the question.
Whether tis nobler to let everyman suffer
As to steal from the poor and give to the rich.


Posted by: JakeD's shadow | September 22, 2008 3:54 PM | Report abuse

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