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Posted at 12:00 AM ET, 01/17/2011

A legacy

By Tom Toles

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By Tom Toles  | January 17, 2011; 12:00 AM ET
 
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Comments

You might want to reconsider your concept of righteousness and justice.
Dave

I have reconsidered dave and I no longer want association with closed minded know it all's that cannot consider new viewpoints or admit to their own shortcomings.
Posted by: dalyplanet

My Reply...
These are desperate times for many people and I have spent many years working on four books that are the "how to" that is necessary to reach the next level of civilization. We need to make major changes in our social systems to support our present level of technocracy and social needs.
As far as I can tell; I am being ignored.
I had hoped I might reach some people that understood the urgency of the situation and who would work towards the right solutions for our problems instead of hassling over trite disagreements.
Dave

Posted by: OckamsRazor | January 18, 2011 1:09 PM | Report abuse

Yo Pete...do I know you..ha,ha,ha!

Posted by: bertzel | January 17, 2011 8:54 PM | Report abuse

Even Tom kept it to himself today, and I am sure that we were denied a killer rant. The only way this conversation could have been more inappropriate is if someone had called this holiday Lee-Jackson-King day. Sheesh...

Posted by: pete1013 | January 17, 2011 6:09 PM | Report abuse

redhead

I have been using s2191_EPA as my reference. Is there another more current version.

Posted by: dalyplanet | January 17, 2011 6:08 PM | Report abuse

wow...such a peaceful day here on this occasion.


~~MLK was a life-long registered Republican. anti-gay, pro-life. He was in fact a social conservative~~~~staightline

His downfall was, dare I say it? What the hell...Religion...he was a minister...he saw God he had vision....it was also clouded by religion and the man laws......

Dave, I'm sure you have a point but I don't see it other than that finger pointing thing.

Ranger, realistically speaking we are no longer the most powerful. Shhh...but don't tell the rest of the world... and militarily HA..All you need is a few Nuclear warheads and a button.

K I'm going back to sleep to keep the dream alive...carry on with that finger pointing you all do so well : )

Posted by: bertzel | January 17, 2011 4:09 PM | Report abuse

The truth hurts, don't it.

Posted by: bushidollar

-------------------

Everyone lays claim to the 'truth.' No one has the whole 'truth' but the best of us are always seeking it (such as dalyplanet), sure we won't ever quite find it but the search is worth the journey.

Now 'hurt' is a horse of another color. Even those that lean left in our happy blog such as OckamsRazor know about 'hurt.' 'Dave,' as he is otherwise known, is a judo expert and fought in the Korean War. Dave knows 'hurt.' Unoiamrite appears to have served in the Marines. Marines know about 'hurt.' Your earnest poster here has 3 tours in Ranger and Para units; and one Iraq tour. I know about 'hurt.' We've had experience dishing out 'hurt' and being 'hurt.'

What you wrote in your blog post is neither the truth nor does it hurt.

All it tells me is that you are an insignificant speck who made a disgusting, infuriating accusation on a federal holiday meant to honor someone special in our history - someone who believed in peace.

Posted by: pararanger22 | January 17, 2011 4:06 PM | Report abuse

~~~~bigoted segregationist, misogynists. The kind of folks that considered it a great family past time to have a picnic at the Sunday afternoon lynching of a black man.


No more like this!!! JW

Posted by: dalyplanet | January 17, 2011 3:34 PM | Report abuse

The truth hurts, don't it.

Posted by: bushidollar

What hurts is that YOU that claim the moral high ground will create such an ugly lie, and then restate it again. You are either morally bankrupt or very stupid.

Posted by: dalyplanet | January 17, 2011 3:30 PM | Report abuse

No It was Democrats then and continues to this day. It is all about labels with Democrats labels labels labels names names names,

Posted by: dalyplanet

Labels like "Liberal" and "Socialist" and names like "Democrats," for instance.

Posted by: jhnnywalkr | January 17, 2011 3:27 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: pararanger22 | January 17, 2011 2:53 PM
"So let's slightly re-shape your post here. Today's Conservatives are a 'group of bigoted Dixie-crat wannabes' and yesterdays Conservatives were bigoted segregationist, misogynists. The kind of folks that considered it a great family past time to have a picnic at the Sunday afternoon lynching of a black man.

Your post is sickening and a lie. Find some other place to dwell you despicable bottom-feeder."

The truth hurts, don't it.

Posted by: bushidollar | January 17, 2011 3:16 PM | Report abuse

You might want to reconsider your concept of righteousness and justice.
Dave

I have reconsidered dave and I no longer want association with closed minded know it all's that cannot consider new viewpoints or admit to their own shortcomings.

Posted by: dalyplanet | January 17, 2011 3:06 PM | Report abuse

Many blacks were Republicans back then. Republicans back then were not the group of bigoted Dixie-crat wannabes that they are today. With very rare exception, Blacks left the Republican party once the Republican party embraced the philosophy of the Dixie-crats. As for him being "pro-life", he was against the death penalty. As for your claims of him being a "anti-gay", so what? No one is perfect. You like taking things out of context. The social conservatives of that time period were bigoted segregationist and misogynists. The kind of folks that considered it a great family past time to have a picnic at the Sunday afternoon lynching of a black man.

Posted by: bushidollar

------------------

So let's slightly re-shape your post here. Today's Conservatives are a 'group of bigoted Dixie-crat wannabes' and yesterdays Conservatives were bigoted segregationist, misogynists. The kind of folks that considered it a great family past time to have a picnic at the Sunday afternoon lynching of a black man.

Your post is sickening and a lie. Find some other place to dwell you despicable bottom-feeder.

Posted by: pararanger22 | January 17, 2011 2:53 PM | Report abuse

~~~~Republicans back then were not the group of bigoted Dixie-crat wannabes~~~~

No It was Democrats then and continues to this day. It is all about labels with Democrats labels labels labels names names names, look back on last weeks chatter for proof. Always, 'what is different' not what is similar or the same. Democrats have managed to institutionalize racism in the press, courts , and especially government programs and they do it with a smile. Democrats want government to salve this wound so they don't have to deal with it personally. White Guilt obviously does not work for productive public policy.

Posted by: dalyplanet | January 17, 2011 2:52 PM | Report abuse

Your standard insults and lies are tiring, no different than a daily repetition, say it enough it must be true. It is easy to insult but rewarding to create dialog.
Posted by: dalyplanet

My Reply...
I am just using the same tactics as the conservatives who use this tactic.
If the "shoe does not fit" fine but if the shoe does fit. You need to be reminded.

The complete Dr. Martin Luther King quote is; "Until Justice rolls down like waters and righteousness like a mighty stream".

You might want to reconsider your concept of righteousness and justice.
Dave

Posted by: OchamsRazor | January 17, 2011 2:41 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: Straightline | January 17, 2011 1:30 PM
"MLK was a life-long registered Republican. anti-gay, pro-life a true social conservative"

Many blacks were Republicans back then. Republicans back then were not the group of bigoted Dixie-crat wannabes that they are today. With very rare exception, Blacks left the Republican party once the Republican party embraced the philosophy of the Dixie-crats. As for him being "pro-life", he was against the death penalty. As for your claims of him being a "anti-gay", so what? No one is perfect. You like taking things out of context. The social conservatives of that time period were bigoted segregationist and misogynists. The kind of folks that considered it a great family past time to have a picnic at the Sunday afternoon lynching of a black man.

Posted by: bushidollar | January 17, 2011 2:29 PM | Report abuse

Straightline - Thank you !!! I have been biting my tongue all morning on those issues. I am sure many or most progressives do not realize how liberal policies have harmed black families in the last forty years. They have destroyed generations of families under the umbrella of helping and are mainly blind to the damage they are doing and continue to do. It has driven me from from the democrats. The soft racism of low expectations is one of the legs of our welfare state. I dare any to argue this point.

Posted by: dalyplanet

-------------------

DP - you and Straightline rock today. Nice work.

Posted by: pararanger22 | January 17, 2011 2:05 PM | Report abuse

Straightline

Thank you !!! I have been biting my tongue all morning on those issues. I am sure many or most progressives do not realize how liberal policies have harmed black families in the last forty years. They have destroyed generations of families under the umbrella of helping and are mainly blind to the damage they are doing and continue to do. It has driven me from from the democrats. The soft racism of low expectations is one of the legs of our welfare state. I dare any to argue this point.

Posted by: dalyplanet | January 17, 2011 1:50 PM | Report abuse

If 'Gary' wants to develop a national concept for change, fine, but he should do proper project analysis, within valid assumptions and acceptable constraints.

Just here to help.

Posted by: pararanger22

Just like the Founding Fathers did.

Posted by: jhnnywalkr | January 17, 2011 1:38 PM | Report abuse

Dave

~~~~According to the conservatives, their visions are "Bla bla bla".~~~ Where do you get this stuff, I think you make it up. You ask repetedly for unity and vision but are the most insulting and divisive here !!! Why?

Your smug insulting generalities make you better by belittling others?? or do you cover your lack of a better method or plan for society with taunts and rudeness.

Posted by: dalyplanet | January 17, 2011 1:30 PM | Report abuse

Martin Luther King...a true progressive American hero.
Posted by: PrairieDog60

-----------------------------------------

Sorry dog, but you can't lay claim to MLK for "progressives". Not even close.

MLK was a life-long registered Republican. anti-gay, pro-life. He was in fact a social conservative.

If Dr. King hadn't died at the hands of a registered democrat assassin maybe African Americans wouldn't have been corralled into ghettos and oppressed by the plantation racist "progressives".

MLK was a life-long registered Republican. anti-gay, pro-life a true social conservative

Posted by: Straightline | January 17, 2011 1:30 PM | Report abuse

Why are Dr. Martin Luther King's facial features exaggerated? What's the point & is there a need to continue this unhidden racism?

Posted by: ahrj | January 17, 2011 1:12 PM | Report abuse

Dave

Your standard insults and lies are tiring, no different than a daily repetition, say it enough it must be true. It is easy to insult but rewarding to create dialog.

Posted by: dalyplanet | January 17, 2011 12:58 PM | Report abuse

Martin Luther King Jr. was a man who 'saw God'. He had clear vision. He is one of few.
His is remembered with the respect he deserves tho I'm sure he does not/would not consider himself to be a hero.
Posted by: bertzel

My Comment...
Part of his vision was to "let justice rain down". According to the conservatives, their visions are "let injustice, inequity and disaster rain down".
Dave

Posted by: OckamsRazor | January 17, 2011 12:40 PM | Report abuse

unoiamrite wrote:

WE HAVE MET THE ENEMY AND HE IS US.

disce quasi semper victurus vive quasi cras moriturus - Semper Fi

-----------------

I agree with your post, Ghandi, but we can do the military part and fight smoking and poor food quality too.

My sister passed away from lung cancer when she was 36. She gave up smoking at 30 but it didn't help. A tiny girl not made for the ravages of tobacco.

I can't tell if we're any better off in food production than we were in the 70s but at least there is more selection with the emergence of organic chow.

Posted by: pararanger22 | January 17, 2011 12:20 PM | Report abuse

“OBL launched 9/11 successfully killing nearly 3000 Americans (more if you add in the cancer killing asbestos unleashed into the air). If we sit still and do nothing, OBL launches more attacks, more Americans die. Simple equation here: attack OBL and his diaspora or Americans die. Attack OBL or die. Simple.”

The point is, if you’re that concerned about a small foreign threat, why don’t you do something about a large domestic threat that is killing and maiming (gross obesity) hundreds of thousands of Americans. Hey maybe even millions.

In defense of this illogic, you may fire when ready rwing. To quote Quark;

Quark: What's that disgusting smell?
Nog: I think it's called tobacco. It's a deadly drug. When used frequently, it destroys the internal organs.
Quark: If it's so deadly, then why do they use it?
Nog: It's also highly addictive.
Rom: How do they get their hands on it?
Nog: They buy it in stores.
Quark: [stunned] They buy? If they buy poison they'll buy anything. I think I'm gonna like it here.

The same applies to your food. Way, way too much sodium and fat.

WE HAVE MET THE ENEMY AND HE IS US.

disce quasi semper victurus vive quasi cras moriturus - Semper Fi

Posted by: unoiamrite | January 17, 2011 12:05 PM | Report abuse

unoiamrite wrote:

["How many people died unnecessarily because of the glorious tobacco industry? What about the crap that is in your food? Look around folks, that ain’t evolution at work. Yeah rwing - they must have the freedom to kill themselves and be a burden to the medical system.. And you’re worried about a bunch of guys living in mud huts????. Watch out, if you think red china is your friend Si vis pacem, para bellum"]

---------------------

I get the Latin phrase; and I agree with that -- but otherwise, I don't understand the point of your post.

Posted by: pararanger22 | January 17, 2011 11:15 AM | Report abuse

bertzel wrote:

["What makes you think America is the most powerful Nation on earth ranger?"]

------------------

Let's break it down.

Diplomatically. We're on our back foot a bit but only China is in the same league. Just add up the number of diplomats for a start.

Informationally. Again, a bit on our back foot these days but most immigrants still want to come to the US because the US brand is still better than the rest.

Militarily. No one comes close. Budget is higher than the next 40 countries combined. Air and Sea Superiority is unquestioned. Land - the toughest environment - no Nation can match us. Littorals - our USMC is bigger than most every other Nation's Army.

Economically. Still the largest economy in the world - may stay that way if the politicians work together to integrate necessary austerity measures.


Posted by: pararanger22 | January 17, 2011 11:07 AM | Report abuse

How many people died unnecessarily because of the glorious tobacco industry? What about the crap that is in your food? Look around folks, that ain’t evolution at work. Yeah rwing - they must have the freedom to kill themselves and be a burden to the medical system.. And you’re worried about a bunch of guys living in mud huts????. Watch out, if you think red china is your friend

Si vis pacem, para bellum

Posted by: unoiamrite | January 17, 2011 10:51 AM | Report abuse

What makes you think America is the most powerful Nation on earth ranger?

Posted by: bertzel | January 17, 2011 10:49 AM | Report abuse

Martin Luther King...a true progressive American hero.

It's a shame the south had to be arm-twisted into accepting this holiday. Until 2000, SC still gave state employees the option of taking one of three Confederate holidays off instead of MLK day!

Arizona (in the news for lots of bad stuff these days), led by John McCain's vocal opposition to the holiday, basically had to be dragged kicking and screaming into accepting a holiday in honor of King.

Reagan showed little enthusiasm for it, and only endorsed it after it became obvious that a veto-proof majority of Congress was going to pass it.

Jesse Helms tried to smear King with FBI reports that King was involved with communists and other "subversives", in an effort to defeat passage of the bill.

King was one of the few Americans not ever elected to public office, that we consider a great leader in this country. He stood by his belief in non-violence in the face of terrible and tragic events perpetrated on African Americans; from lynchings, beatings, cross-burnings, fake trials with all white juries freeing men who had tortured, raped or killed African Americans, and all the other awful things going on, mostly in the south, during King's time. How many of us would be brave enough to still talk non-violence when watching our brothers and sisters, our family members, tortured and killed?

Here's to you Dr. King. Thanks for providing a true example of what it means to be a great human being.

Posted by: PrairieDog60 | January 17, 2011 10:42 AM | Report abuse

bertzel wrote:

What can I say ranger...I am what I am.

Why do you state, and I quote,
" * America must remain world's largest economy"????

-------------------

America is the most powerful Nation on earth. I would like it to stay that way in all areas of DIME.

If 'Gary' wants to develop a national concept for change, fine, but he should do proper project analysis, within valid assumptions and acceptable constraints.

Just here to help.

Posted by: pararanger22 | January 17, 2011 9:33 AM | Report abuse

~~~There was nothing controversial about jornolibists' comments. Why do you always have to be so shallow, especially when discussing MLK?
Posted by: pararanger22~~~

What can I say ranger...I am what I am.

Why do you state, and I quote,
" * America must remain world's largest economy"????


Posted by: bertzel | January 17, 2011 8:54 AM | Report abuse

Posted by: dougdupin@yahoo.com | January 16, 2011 10:37 PM
"It's a shame that his memorial is being built by imported, unpaid labor..."
I volunteer nearly every week / weekend to help out in my school or community. And, not to be obvious, but I don't get paid for my time.
Setting aside comments from pararanger22 (which take this post in a different direction - accuracy), are you saying that works shouldn't be done unless the labor is paid for?

Posted by: Rudesan | January 17, 2011 8:39 AM | Report abuse

garybrumback1 wrote:

["Our nation is torn, our wars are endless and benefit no one other than the war industry, other big business interests, and politicians.

Or do we want our legacy to be that we signed a Second Declaration of Independence and vowed to replace in a peaceful and legal way the American corpocracy with a true American democracy and to go on to provide for the general welfare of all Americans?"]

---------------------

In regards to the first quote, it simply isn't true and it's actually quite silly. Actually the war in AFG benefits you. OBL launched 9/11 successfully killing nearly 3000 Americans (more if you add in the cancer killing asbestos unleashed into the air). If we sit still and do nothing, OBL launches more attacks, more Americans die. Simple equation here: attack OBL and his diaspora or Americans die. Attack OBL or die. Simple.

In regards to your second quote, you are insane. Dump American corporations. Replace with 'real' Democracy. I suppose you actually have a plan for this objective? Of course, there are just a 'few' planning limitations (what you must do and what you can't do) my friend whilst you orchestrate this transition, to whit:

* America must remain world's largest economy
* No jobs lost in transition
* Must maintain America's security posture
* Because we're peace-loving Americans, we must allow the existing American Corporations to depart our shores to other less sophisticated Nations with their copyrights, equipment, et al without objection

I can think of a 100 other limitations and assumptions that will make this a very hard operation to pull off.

But hey, you're a crack industrial and organizational psychologist. I'm sure you have a full, USG, integrated plan to get it done.

Let's hear it.

Posted by: pararanger22 | January 17, 2011 7:55 AM | Report abuse

bushidollar & dougdupin wrote:

["It's a shame that his memorial is being built by imported, unpaid labor. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F79kqoo3Z6I
The video not played by the Washington Post from December during the building of the statue."]

Free market capitalism at its finest.

-------------------

It's amazing the conclusions you two Liberal half-wits come up with from a you-tube video. Let's review a few facets of this non-issue:

1 - As of December 2008, the Martin Luther King National Memorial Project Foundation had raised approximately $108 million, including substantial contributions from such donors as the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation, The Walt Disney Company Foundation, the National Association of Realtors, and filmmaker George Lucas. The figure also includes $10 million in matching funds provided by the United States Congress.

Thus, over 91% of the construction of the MLK Memorial is being paid for by private funds. Assessment: the unions are entitled to bid for that portion of work that the $10M in Federal funding supports.

2. In 2001, the foundation's efforts to build the memorial were stalled because Intellectual Properties Management Inc., an organization operated by King's family, wanted the foundation to pay licensing fees to use his name and likeness in marketing campaigns. Cambridge University historian David Garrow, who won a Pulitzer Prize for his biography of King, said of King's family's behavior, "One would think any family would be so thrilled to have their forefather celebrated and memorialized in D.C. that it would never dawn on them to ask for a penny." He added that King would have been "absolutely scandalized by the profiteering behavior of his children."

Thus, the wisdom and benevolence of MLK was not passed down to his children.

3 - Harry Johnson, an African American, President of the Alpha Phi Epsilon fraternity (MLK's fraternity fyi) with noteworthy educational and business accomplishments, appears to have led all the painful, morale defeating, bureacratic work to gain USG approval to build the MLK Memorial; raise private funds for it; and select a design. A noteworthy accomplishment. He stated that 95% of the sculpture construction was being done by Americans. The union and the King family on the other hand added nothing to the concept development other than to demand they get paid. Want to build it? Pay me. Want to use MLK's likeness and words in the sculpture? Pay me.

Bushidollar, although your context was wrong, your words were correct 'Free market capitalism at its finest.' The free market appears to be prevailing after running the usual gauntlet of the 'me first' labor crowd and greedy relatives.

This vignette should be shocking except that is how it is in America with any good idea.

Pay labor or don't play.

Posted by: pararanger22 | January 17, 2011 7:24 AM | Report abuse

Today we are honoring a man who in 1963 gave a memorable and stirring speech to the nation, who was later awarded the Nobel Peace Price, and who then lost his life for his country. We need him today more than ever before. Our nation is torn, our wars are endless and benefit no one other than the war industry, other big business interests, and politicians. All the while our poverty and misery are growing.
At the moment I see no one among us, very disappointedly not even President Obama, who might take the mantle from Reverend King and President Kennedy to help us reverse America’s downward spiral. But that does not stop me from expressing here my hopes for America’s future. Indeed, in the absence of courageous leadership and statesmanship I am more determined than ever to speak out, as insignificant a former public servant that I am. If I sound ostentatious and presumptuous, I do not mean to be. I am simply an American patriot who says not, “my country right or wrong,” but instead, “my country, please do right and no wrong.”
Eleven score and 15 years ago our forefathers fought for their freedom from the tyranny of the British Crown and his oppressive, chartered corporations. Shortly afterwards they declared their independence from the Crown’s subjugation.
But the independence was short-lived. Americans did not crush in its birth, as a fearful Thomas Jefferson had hoped would happen, “the aristocracy of our moneyed corporations which dare already to challenge our government to a trial of strength and bid defiance to the laws of our country.”
Over the years that aristocracy has amassed more and more power over the American people. What we have in our midst today is a tyrannical monster, the American corpocracy, an unholy marriage between powerful corporate interests and their pawns in every branch of government. The monster is far too powerful to be brought down by another armed revolution by the citizenry.
What do we want our legacy to be, that we knew and yet laid still and silent about our loss of liberty to a corpocracy that would rather fight wars to expand its hegemony than to provide for the general welfare of all Americans as written in our Constitution? Or do we want our legacy to be that we signed a Second Declaration of Independence and vowed to replace in a peaceful and legal way the American corpocracy with a true American democracy and to go on to provide for the general welfare of all Americans?
That leaves our legacy up to people like you and me. We have amazing potential. We can alone and together muster and unleash our “democracy power.” It created our nation. And it can save us if we will just rise to the occasion. There are many peaceful and legal ways to do it if there is the will to do it.

Gary B. Brumback, PhD
www.democracypowernow.com

Posted by: garybrumback1 | January 17, 2011 7:13 AM | Report abuse

If you ask anyone about our legacy of non violence today, most will say "Yes, but..."
Then they will explain that it really could not work with this or that group.

But it was a nice "ideal."


The fact is we still have a long way to go.

Posted by: GaryEMasters | January 17, 2011 7:04 AM | Report abuse

["The rest of your comment is irrevelent."]

Posted by: bertzel

-----------------

There was nothing controversial about jornolibists' comments. Why do you always have to be so shallow, especially when discussing MLK?

Posted by: pararanger22 | January 17, 2011 6:41 AM | Report abuse

Posted by: dougdupin@yahoo.com | January 16, 2011 10:37 PM
"It's a shame that his memorial is being built by imported, unpaid labor. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F79kqoo3Z6I
The video not played by the Washington Post from December during the building of the statue."

Free market capitalism at its finest.

Posted by: bushidollar | January 16, 2011 11:04 PM | Report abuse

It's a shame that his memorial is being built by imported, unpaid labor. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F79kqoo3Z6I
The video not played by the Washington Post from December during the building of the statue.

Posted by: dougdupin@yahoo.com | January 16, 2011 10:37 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: jornolibist | January 16, 2011 8:55 PM
"MLK was a Christian Minister."

Yes he was. He was one of the few x-tians that took Jesus' sermon on the mount to heart. Dr King fought for the little gal/guy. Dr. King fought for the person who is never given credit for their contribution to society, but who’s contribution is necessary to the normal function of society; the guy whose station in life is lowly, and is considered lowly because it. MLK spoke truth to power. I was not around when he was alive, and I so wish to have met him. Had I had the opportunity, I would thank him for getting decent people together and inspiring them to make this nation a much more perfect union. Dr. King, you may be gone, but your spirit and your fight for justice for the common man will not be forgotten.

Posted by: bushidollar | January 16, 2011 10:22 PM | Report abuse

Martin Luther King Jr. was a man who 'saw God'. He had clear vision. He is one of few.
His is remembered with the respect he deserves tho I'm sure he does not/would not consider himself to be a hero.
Equality ......
The rest of your comment is irrevelent.

Posted by: bertzel | January 16, 2011 9:59 PM | Report abuse

MLK was a Christian Minister.

Posted by: jornolibist | January 16, 2011 8:55 PM | Report abuse

He was a home grown hero and born here and we love his legacy so much because his word was the word of freedom

Posted by: jornolibist | January 16, 2011 8:09 PM | Report abuse

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