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Early-entry deadline

Early entry candidates for the June 26 draft have until 5 p.m. today to make a decision on whether to say in the draft or not (as long as they have not hired an agent). Obviously, the Wizards, who hold the 18th and 47th picks, would love to see as many guys stay in as possible because they may drive someone down to them.

I still see the Wiz doing one of two things: A) Sit at 18 and take the "best player available." Last year, that was Nick Young after guys like Thaddeus Young and Julian Wright went off the board. (I still don't know what the Wiz would have done had Rodney Stuckey somehow slipped past Detroit at 15. Stuckey had a promise from the Pistons and didn't even workout for the Wiz.)
B) Ernie Grunfeld could still make a move and trade the pick. Right now, I do have not read on which players the Wiz really like or how they have their board stacked because the brass isn't sharing that information (or even disinformation). We'll have to wait and see.

By Ivan Carter  |  June 16, 2008; 9:42 AM ET
 
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Comments

Get out the shank! WE better take Roy Hibbert. He ain't ever been in the lock down.

Posted by: Prison Balls | June 16, 2008 10:05 AM | Report abuse

Hibbert may have never been in lock down....but he sure is a stiff.

Posted by: TruthAboutIt.net | June 16, 2008 10:15 AM | Report abuse

I would really like to see the Wiz trade the pick, we have to many young guys right now anyway

Posted by: NickJ | June 16, 2008 10:33 AM | Report abuse

Yes. Cancel all draft hype for the Wiz. Trade the picks. There's no one at 18 or beyond that can help us near term, and we have too many young guys already.

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 16, 2008 10:39 AM | Report abuse

It's sad when the "Wizards Insider" has no idea what the Wizards are going to do. But that's how the Wizards' brass plays it.

A couple of guesses:
- Perhaps because they've seen so much of him and love him, the Wizards have already decided they are going to take Hibbert if he's available. So the draft process is just determining who they will pick if Hibbert is gone, and their 2nd round pick.
- I think it's noteworthy that Eddie showed up only one day at the draft workouts, when Chalmers, CDR and Courtney Lee worked out. That may provide a clue.
- If somebody drops, will Ernie grab him? It doesn't appear that Ernie has done that in the past -- it seems he has locked in on a guy and taken him regardless of who is on the board. What if Gallinari drops because of some of his comments about playing in Europe? Can you really pass on him at 18?

Posted by: Anonymous | June 16, 2008 10:42 AM | Report abuse

Hopefully we trade the pick for someone that can help us out right now. If we do take the pick I hope we do take the best pick available b/c that is definitely not what we have done in the past.

There is a lot of depth in this draft and I won't really argue with any picks unless its Roy Hibbert.

ROY HIBBERT has bust written all over him....especially with the NBA becoming a smaller mans game.

Posted by: Anonymous | June 16, 2008 10:51 AM | Report abuse

More Hibbert news/rumour: Draftexpress is reporting that DeAndre Jordan and Javale McGee were outplayed at workouts by lower-ranked players like Alexis Ajinca and Roy Hibbert. Hibbert is also supposedly impressing folks both on court and off court.

Draftexpress is guessing Hibbert gets picked at no. 25 by the Rockets.

Posted by: rgz | June 16, 2008 10:58 AM | Report abuse

I posted this elsewhere, but these threads get retired fairly quickly. Here's what rgz is referring to:

http://www.draftexpress.com/article/Word-on-the-Street-Golden-State-Workout,-Walker-Injury-2927/

-Two players we haven't heard great things about from their workouts so far as DeAndre Jordan and JaVale McGee. Both have reportedly been outplayed by lower rated prospects such as Alexis Ajinca (in Charlotte) and Roy Hibbert. Jordan has not impressed anyone by showing up for his job interview (what this is essentially) in a t-shirt and shorts while players such as Hibbert and Courtney Lee arrived prepared to get down to business in a suit and tie. Hibbert has gotten some strong reviews from teams who have seen him so far, as he appears to be in excellent shape and is reminding people why he was considered a lock for the lottery just a year ago, running the floor well (better than his peers), finishing with either hand around the basket, and shooting the ball better than expected from outside. Not surprisingly, the 21-year old Georgetown product has been extremely impressive off the court as well--which is an underrated element in this process.

Posted by: Johnnie Futbol | June 16, 2008 11:07 AM | Report abuse

LOL @ Hibbert haters, if anything, Hibbert's stock is rising, and the move atheletic DeAndre Jordan and JaVale McGee are plummeting according the DX:

"Two players we haven't heard great things about from their workouts so far as DeAndre Jordan and JaVale McGee. Both have reportedly been outplayed by lower rated prospects such as Alexis Ajinca (in Charlotte) and Roy Hibbert. Jordan has not impressed anyone by showing up for his job interview (what this is essentially) in a t-shirt and shorts while players such as Hibbert and Courtney Lee arrived prepared to get down to business in a suit and tie. Jordan, in the words of one scout "could drop right out of the lottery" if he isn't careful, based off the way he's been working out. Hibbert on the other hand has gotten some strong reviews from teams who have seen him so far, as he appears to be in excellent shape and is reminding people why he was considered a lock for the lottery just a year ago, running the floor well (better than his peers), finishing with either hand around the basket, and shooting the ball better than expected from outside. Not surprisingly, the 21-year old Georgetown product has been extremely impressive off the court as well--which is an underrated element in this process."

Granted, Hibbert IS slow, and Speights the better fit for us, but I wouldn't be pissed if we took Hibbert (doubtful), he'd be the perfect backup to Haywood, still has a huge upside, and I could totally see him be a dominant big-man in a few years. NOT a bust.

Posted by: Wizzy | June 16, 2008 11:13 AM | Report abuse

Grunfeld plays it close to the vest.

Reporters are only going to get something out of him when the time comes.

I do think (and continue to hope) that it will be Hibbert, though he may go higher based on what he has shown in the camps as opposed to his relatively disappointing last season at Georgetown.

Posted by: khrabb | June 16, 2008 11:17 AM | Report abuse

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 16, 2008 11:17 AM | Report abuse

Yeah, I'd like to see the Wizards do one of the two things:

1. Package the pick as part of a trade to land a proven veteran.

2. Pick the best available player, with some bias going towards filling a positional need. Hibbert might not be that player, but there's no question he's good enough for serious consideration.

Posted by: Johnnie Futbol | June 16, 2008 11:18 AM | Report abuse

"More Hibbert news/rumour: Draftexpress is reporting that DeAndre Jordan and Javale McGee were outplayed at workouts by lower-ranked players like Alexis Ajinca and Roy Hibbert. Hibbert is also supposedly impressing folks both on court and off court.

Draftexpress is guessing Hibbert gets picked at no. 25 by the Rockets.

Posted by: rgz | June 16, 2008 10:58 AM "

Drafting a player isn't just about players outplaying other players in front of the brass. It's also a lot about the upside potential of the player, and I don't see it in Hibbert.

If people still think it's a big deal about one player outplaying another in a workout, then they should refresh their memories about Kwame Brown and how he outplayed Tyson Chandler during the workouts here. The rest is history.

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 16, 2008 11:20 AM | Report abuse

Ain't it great how the Boston Celtics went from a lottery team to now a championship contender when the ownership team decided to spend some money and get some players?

Sure, this season may be Boston's only chance, but most people would trade 1 season of glory for 30 seasons of misery.

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 16, 2008 11:41 AM | Report abuse

Khrabb:
Ernie does keep it close to the vest, but that shouldn't be Ivan's only source for info. I'm sure he's developed sources within the Wizards organization so he doesn't have to rely on Ernie.
Can't Ivan squeeze some info from the Verizon Center parking lot attendant, since they are family and all?

Posted by: Anonymous | June 16, 2008 11:43 AM | Report abuse

Ernie does not tell the parking lot guy any more than he tells the reporters. Nor is it likely you will find a crumpled copy of his list of draft choices in a Verizon Center dumpster.

My sense is that he runs a "loose lips sinks ships" organization and anyone in it who is caught leaking will quickly be shown the door.

Posted by: khrabb | June 16, 2008 1:20 PM | Report abuse

Wow, even Gilby can't dunk yet!

http://www.latimes.com/sports/basketball/nba/clippers/la-spw-clippers16-2008jun16,0,2121409.story

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 16, 2008 11:17 AM

Dunking was not really a featured part of Gilbert Arenas' game. How many times did have we see him dunk a ball in a game?

BTW Shaun Livingston is 6'7" to Gilbert's 6'3".
Do we really want a PG dunking? I still have a queasy moment when AD falls to the floor after dunks.
Now Songaila - at 6'9" that's a guy I would like to see dunk.

Posted by: Anonymous | June 16, 2008 1:24 PM | Report abuse

"Dunking was not really a featured part of Gilbert Arenas' game. How many times did have we see him dunk a ball in a game?

BTW Shaun Livingston is 6'7" to Gilbert's 6'3".
Do we really want a PG dunking? I still have a queasy moment when AD falls to the floor after dunks.
Now Songaila - at 6'9" that's a guy I would like to see dunk.

Posted by: | June 16, 2008 1:24 PM "

Gilby used to dunk on a regular basis while driving the lane before he hurt is clavicle last season.

Given that, Gilby didn't even dunk on the 9 ft. rims while playing in Barry Farms last summer, as reported by Ivan.

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 16, 2008 1:29 PM | Report abuse

has anyone worked out Joey Dorsey from Memphis? if he's around in the 2nd, i'd love to see the wiz pick him

Posted by: G$ | June 16, 2008 2:05 PM | Report abuse

Iverson used to dunk all the time in his first couple seasons, but hasn't gotten anywhere near the top of the rim in years. Playing below the rim hasn't seemed to have hindered his game in the slightest.

It's really no surprise that Hibbert has impressed scouts in workouts. One of the things most often touted in college was his work ethic. NBA execs like guys who show up ready to work.

Drafting a player is about whether that player has to tools to help your team win. Hibbert does.

Posted by: kalorama | June 16, 2008 2:40 PM | Report abuse

"Drafting a player is about whether that player has to tools to help your team win. Hibbert does."

How does drafting Hibbert help the Wizards' defense?

Posted by: Anonymous | June 16, 2008 2:48 PM | Report abuse

How does drafting Hibbert help the Wizards' defense?

Posted by: | June 16, 2008 2:48 PM

You're kidding?

Posted by: Johnnie Futbol | June 16, 2008 3:15 PM | Report abuse

Sasha Kaun was on my flight yesterday. He's working out for the Wiz today...he could add some size too...

Posted by: Guy | June 16, 2008 3:15 PM | Report abuse

"Iverson used to dunk all the time in his first couple seasons, but hasn't gotten anywhere near the top of the rim in years. Playing below the rim hasn't seemed to have hindered his game in the slightest.

Posted by: kalorama | June 16, 2008 2:40 PM "

LOL!

There he goes again, taking things to the extreme. Next thing you know, I'll be accused of recommending Baron Davis as Obama's running mate.

Whether or not AI is able to dunk has absolutely nothing to do with me saying Livingston & Gilby and their ability to dunk. Did AI come off major knee surgery? Why is AI even part of this discussion?

What I am saying though is that both Livingston and Gilby came off major knee surgeries, and it looks like Livingston has gotten his legs/hops back while Gilby hasn't even tried to jump during a game at Barry Farms, nevermind in an NBA game.

On one breakaway during this past season, Gilby went with a flat footed layup. Hope Gilby is working out his jumping ability while on his plane to China.

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 16, 2008 3:21 PM | Report abuse

"Whether or not AI is able to dunk has absolutely nothing to do with me saying Livingston & Gilby and their ability to dunk. Did AI come off major knee surgery? Why is AI even part of this discussion?"

What does Livingston being able to dunk have to do with Arenas? Why is he even part of the discussion? No reason at all except you chose to make him part of the discussion to make a point, just as I chose to include Iverson to make a better, much more pertinent point. Deal with it. or don't. No big to me either way.

Iverson, like Arenas, is a smaller guard who dunked on the break and (generally only on the break) when he had a wide open lane. Losing the ability to do so has not hindered his game and there's no reason to think it will hinder Arenas'. If he was a guy who routinely dunked in traffic over bigger guys, like Wade, it might be a concern. But he can finish off wide open breaks with layoffs just as easily as dunks. It's two points either way.

But don't let the (plainly obvious) facts get in the way of your latest anti-Arenas tirade. Please continue. (Not that you need encouragement.)

Posted by: kalorama | June 16, 2008 3:50 PM | Report abuse

"What does Livingston being able to dunk have to do with Arenas? Why is he even part of the discussion? No reason at all except you chose to make him part of the discussion to make a point, just as I chose to include Iverson to make a better, much more pertinent point. Deal with it. or don't. No big to me either way.

Iverson, like Arenas, is a smaller guard who dunked on the break and (generally only on the break) when he had a wide open lane. Losing the ability to do so has not hindered his game and there's no reason to think it will hinder Arenas'. If he was a guy who routinely dunked in traffic over bigger guys, like Wade, it might be a concern. But he can finish off wide open breaks with layoffs just as easily as dunks. It's two points either way.

But don't let the (plainly obvious) facts get in the way of your latest anti-Arenas tirade. Please continue. (Not that you need encouragement.)

Posted by: kalorama | June 16, 2008 3:50 PM "

Apparently you don't read or failed in elementary school reading comprehension last year.

I mentioned SL and Gilby in the same breath because they have both come off majory knee surgery (SL being much worse), and SL is able to dunk now, whereas Gilby was still reported to be hobbling.

Being able to dunk has nothing to do with success in the NBA (thus the reference to AI being absolutely unrelated) , but has everything to do with athletic ability and shows how far SL has come since his surgery.

BTW, AI not dunking anymore has absolutely nothing to do with his quickness and being able to get by his man.

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 16, 2008 4:03 PM | Report abuse

This back and forth discussion on SL and Gil is missing one important part of the equation. Livingston has been rehabbing much longer. Gil will back dunking by November, just wait and see.

Posted by: SportzWiz | June 16, 2008 4:23 PM | Report abuse

"I mentioned SL and Gilby in the same breath because they have both come off majory knee surgery (SL being much worse), and SL is able to dunk now, whereas Gilby was still reported to be hobbling."

So? What does Livingston's state of recovery have to do with Arenas? They're two different men with different injuries, different bodies, different healing rates, different recovery schedules ... you get the picture (yeah, wishful thinking I know). Is there some kind of bet on who recovers quicker? If not, who cares how quickly Livingston is recovering? He doesn't play for the Wizards and his recovery says nothing of value about Arenas'.

"Being able to dunk has nothing to do with success in the NBA "

Then why is Arenas' inability to dunk such an earth shattering concern to you? If he can be successful without it, then what's the problem?

" but has everything to do with athletic ability and shows how far SL has come since his surgery."

Which has nothing whatsoever to do with or any bearing/significance on the Wizards, Arenas, his current state of recovery, or the future impact of his career. The one is utterly unrelated to the other. Yet you shoehorned them together to make a point, the same point you make 25 times a day regardless of the topic at hand. We get it. You hate Arenas. Find a new chew toy.

"AI not dunking anymore has absolutely nothing to do with his quickness and being able to get by his man"

And the same may well hold true of Arenas when he's fully recovered. But we won't know that until he is fully recovered. But hey, why wait for the facts when you can use half-truths and willful misrepresentations to launch another negative tirade against your favorite target?

Tally-ho!

Posted by: kalorama | June 16, 2008 4:29 PM | Report abuse

It is impossible to figure out what the Wizards are going to do come draft time because the so called experts are starting to think the team only drafts offense.

Posted by: SportzWiz | June 16, 2008 4:35 PM | Report abuse

If the rumors about the Wiz trading away AD are true (hope not, I like AD), I think a trade with the Jazz for some front court help sounds good. I like young Paul Millsap's toughness and rebounding, though he is short.

Posted by: SportzWiz | June 16, 2008 4:42 PM | Report abuse

Back to the draft, If anything I see Hibbert going above the Wiz at 18 at this point. Take a look at these draft projections and then compare them to draft night.

Seldom are these guys that do mock drafts really close with their inside info.

For those that want to can Arenas and go with Daniels at point, I would think they would really love the idea of Hibbert. He is going to excel in the half court game and Daniels at point makes the Wiz a half court team.

What would Hibbert do for the Wizards defense? Big Z doesn't look one bit pretty on the court, and isn't really known as a shot blocker. Yet Cleveland plays some of the best D in the NBA with LeBron mostly guarding nobody.

A really big man with a long set of arms takes up a lot of room in the paint. That's what a guy like Hibbert could do for the Wizards defense. Teamed with a rangy quick shot blocking power forward like Blatche, Hibbert could shut down the lane once he gains some strength and learns the NBA game.

And on offense he's got great hands for a big man. The idea that the Wizards have too many young guys ignores two things. Players on their rookie contracts are cheap for four seasons and the young guys the Wiz have are talented.

Next year the Wiz will be a deeper team just because of the experience the rookies got this year. If Grunfeld can add two more good picks this year the Wiz will have a far deeper team for Eddie to work with.

Look for Ernie to work deals with Gilbert and Jamison that leave him room to work with his MLE.

Posted by: GM | June 16, 2008 4:43 PM | Report abuse

This entry is confusing to follow. Right in the middle there's a link to a Shaun Livingston that has nothin to do with nothin. WTF? Reading comprehension zingers? really?

Another point of these workouts is how they are paced. In other words, at any time has Hibbert had to run like he will once he's in a NBA game, for an extended period? Considering he wasn't asked to do that at Gtown it would be a chief concern if i had to decide whether to pick him. Still, the guy is 7'2 and plays 6'9. Even ND's Harangody could challenge his shots. Do we want a 7'2 center that plays below the rim?

He's rail thin but this Alex Ajinca kid is looking like Brendan Wright. He duplicates too many of Blacthe's skills for this team but he looks like a prospect for someone, maybe the Spurs.

Posted by: Monte | June 16, 2008 5:03 PM | Report abuse

There's no way the Jazz would trade Millsap for Daniels.

Posted by: kalorama | June 16, 2008 5:31 PM | Report abuse

Or Grunfeld could take a Efthimios Rentzias-type and "stash him overseas." Kinda like the Pesh pick. Instead of Pecherov, the Wiz coulda had Rajon Rondo (21), Kyle Lowry (24), or Jordan Farmar (26). There are always guys available. I wish somebody would hold Ernie accountable for failing to utilize the draft better.

Posted by: Steve C. | June 16, 2008 5:33 PM | Report abuse

"Another point of these workouts is how they are paced. In other words, at any time has Hibbert had to run like he will once he's in a NBA game, for an extended period?"

From the linked article:

"Hibbert on the other hand has gotten some strong reviews from teams who have seen him so far, as he appears to be in excellent shape and is reminding people why he was considered a lock for the lottery just a year ago, running the floor well (better than his peers), finishing with either hand around the basket, and shooting the ball better than expected from outside.

Posted by: kalorama | June 16, 2008 5:35 PM | Report abuse

SportzWiz, I hope what you heard about AD being packaged/traded is not true, I like AD also as a player and as a person he seems to be one of the good guys. He is no slacker. However I recognize that Ernie has to find money somewhere if he is going to pay Gilbert and Antawn what they want, plus sign the first and second rounders, plus maybe bring over VV if he is free (not sure that he will be available till next year).
So if anything EG might be trying to "dump" some salary with the usual suspects AD, Darius, Etan.

Posted by: rgz | June 16, 2008 6:40 PM | Report abuse

Ivan any thought's on the ref scandal news thats been going on? found a good article on espn.com that says the FBI found all that Dognhey said was found to be true. Starting to get annoyed by all this, stern still has the same attitude toward the situation, the refs are never wrong yadda yadda.

Anyway here is the link tell us what you think

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/columns/story?id=3439659

Posted by: NJ | June 16, 2008 7:31 PM | Report abuse

Never let up.

Posted by: SAVA | June 16, 2008 8:29 PM | Report abuse

"So? What does Livingston's state of recovery have to do with Arenas? They're two different men with different injuries, different bodies, different healing rates, different recovery schedules ... you get the picture (yeah, wishful thinking I know). Is there some kind of bet on who recovers quicker? If not, who cares how quickly Livingston is recovering? He doesn't play for the Wizards and his recovery says nothing of value about Arenas'."

You seem to care, since you're responding to my post. SL looks like he's working hard to get back from his injury. Kudos to him for recovering from his much worse injury (compared to Gilby) and showing that he's got some of this athleticism back. Can't say the same for that Wiz player though.

"Then why is Arenas' inability to dunk such an earth shattering concern to you? If he can be successful without it, then what's the problem?"

Then why are you equating AI's lack of dunking to him being still a great player? The point of SL being able to dunk is that he's got his athleticism back. Gilby though, is still busy hobbling on one leg.

Gilby's inability to dunk so far is a clear indicator that he's not fully recovered and thus a huge risk to the Wiz. Not only can he not dunk, but he was essentially playing with one leg.

"Which has nothing whatsoever to do with or any bearing/significance on the Wizards, Arenas, his current state of recovery, or the future impact of his career. The one is utterly unrelated to the other. Yet you shoehorned them together to make a point, the same point you make 25 times a day regardless of the topic at hand. We get it. You hate Arenas. Find a new chew toy."

Oh sure it does. Go find a snausage snack and go to your corner where your water dish is at.

"And the same may well hold true of Arenas when he's fully recovered. But we won't know that until he is fully recovered. But hey, why wait for the facts when you can use half-truths and willful misrepresentations to launch another negative tirade against your favorite target?"

Not really. Gilby at 26 isn't as quick as AI when he was 26, so you're comparing apples to oranges. Also, don't assume a guy who's had two knee surgeries including a setback in between will be fully recovered, ever.

Half truths is your middle name. Keep babbling your nonsense about Baron Davis, and while your at it, babble some more of your usual nonsense about the other 10 players that I called out, as well as many others, as possibilities for the Wiz. After that, keep babbling about how EJ is such a great coach that he convinced EGrunfeld to keep him.

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 16, 2008 9:04 PM | Report abuse

Yeah, and keep babbling about how EJ is so good a coach that he was totally right about BTH.

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 16, 2008 9:08 PM | Report abuse

No Lawson or Dozier for the Wiz.

Back to school

Player School
A.J. Abrams, Jr. Texas
Josh Akognon, Jr. Cal St.-Fullerton
Chase Budinger, So. Arizona
Lee Cummard, Jr. BYU
Robert Dozier, Jr. Memphis
Wayne Ellington, So. UNC
Danny Green, Jr. UNC
Lester Hudson, Jr. Tennessee-Martin
Ty Lawson, So. UNC
Jeremy Pargo, Jr. Gonzaga
Ronald Steele, RS Sr. Alabama
Robert Vaden, Jr. UAB

Posted by: pg posse | June 16, 2008 9:36 PM | Report abuse

"Not really. Gilby at 26 isn't as quick as AI when he was 26, so you're comparing apples to oranges."

DCMan, I think Kal's point is that you're doing the same thing with the Shaun Livingston comparison.

Posted by: Anonymous | June 16, 2008 9:47 PM | Report abuse

"The point of SL being able to dunk is that he's got his athleticism back. Gilby though, is still busy hobbling on one leg."

And, again, so what? Livingston's rate of recovery has nothing to do with Arenas. Livingston's recovery is further along. Good for him. Does that mean that Arenas will never recover? Of course not. Does it mean he's hobbled forever? Of course not. It means nothing of any consequence. Much like everything you post.

"Then why are you equating AI's lack of dunking to him being still a great player?"

And, of course, I did no such thing. I was equating his inability to dunk with having no impact on his ability to play effectively, thus debunking your ridiculous stance that Arenas' (current, supposed) inability to dunk when he's not yet fully recovered has rendered him permanently incapacitated. Which is, of course, nonsense.

"Gilby though, is still busy hobbling on one leg."

Which, to those of us operating on facts and not obsessive agendas simply means he's still rehabbing. Which, y'know, is what happens when a guy gets hurt and has surgery.

"Not only can he not dunk, but he was essentially playing with one leg."

Which, to the logical, objective observer might be seen as another sign of him having not finished rehabbing the knee with nothing to say about how good he'll be when he is.

"Also, don't assume a guy who's had two knee surgeries including a setback in between will be fully recovered, ever."

Why, because you say so? Yeah, that's always a good reason to believe something.

"Keep babbling your nonsense about Baron Davis"

By "nonsense" you of course mean pointing out the documented facts that he's older, more expensive, more injury-prone, and has a longer history of bad coach relationships than Arenas yet you suggested the Wizards trade Arenas for him all the while ripping Arenas for being injury prone, too expensive, and being too much trouble to coach.

"the other 10 players that I called out, as well as many others, as possibilities for the Wiz. "

And, of course, the fact that you mentioned a bunch of other players that the Wizards, have no chance of getting doesn't alter the fact that you wanted to trade Arenas for Davis. I can see where you might think that though, given your usual strategy of throwing out crap and hoping the sheer bulk of it obscures the general erroneousness of what you say (that is when you're not changing your story from post to post, apparently hoping people will get lost in the maze of shifting positions and give up). But keep dancing. Maybe if you spin enough you'll lull someone into enough of a trance to buy your bs.

"After that, keep babbling about how EJ is such a great coach that he convinced EGrunfeld to keep him."

And of course I never said either of those things. (Hey, there's a surprise; DC Man lying in a weak attempt to make a point. Shocking.) I said (more than once) that Jordan is a very good coach (never "great"), an opinion shared (and stated publicly) by a number of analysts, columnists, former players and coaches and other people who know more about basketball than me, you, or anyone else on this board. And while I never expressed any opinion about Jordan "convincing" Grunfeld of anything (which cheek did you pull that one out of?), last I checked he's still the Wizards' head coach, so the evidence suggests he must have convinced Grunfeld of something otherwise he wouldn't be. Would he?

Posted by: kalorama | June 16, 2008 9:48 PM | Report abuse

"Keep babbling your nonsense about Baron Davis, and while your at it, babble some more of your usual nonsense about the other 10 players that I called out, as well as many others, as possibilities for the Wiz. After that, keep babbling about how EJ is such a great coach that he convinced EGrunfeld to keep him."

Actually, Kal has been spot on with his comments about those situations.

Posted by: Anonymous | June 16, 2008 9:49 PM | Report abuse

Any chance Gil isn't really travelling as he's been playing Xbox online an awful lot lately?

Posted by: Joe | June 16, 2008 10:35 PM | Report abuse

Hey Ivan, why didn't the Wiz attend the mass draft workouts held out west? That would seem like something they would want to attend considering the number of potential draftees participating. There is suppose to be another mass workout planned but I didn't see the Wiz listed as going to be in attendence. Also, why does it seem like every player brought in to workout by the Wiz are considered 2nd round picks or people that won't get drafted at all?

Posted by: Anonymous | June 16, 2008 10:57 PM | Report abuse

The Wizards already have Roy Hibbert on the roster; his name is Brendan Haywood.

Compare:

- 7-footers yet both play smaller
- can score down low, but it takes a loooooong time for them to get their shot up
- despite their size, neither is much of a rebounder or shot blocker

If the Wiz get another big man, they need a banger, not another finesse-ish type. I like Hibbert in general, but doesn't make sense here.

Trading the pick makes the most sense. I was hoping Ty Lawson would be around. If they keep the pick, Chalmers, Douglas-Roberts or take a flyer on McGee

Posted by: Ben | June 16, 2008 11:39 PM | Report abuse

How many picks / young scrubs would we need to give denver to get Marcus Camby. I know that he only has a couple of years left in the tank, but in my opinion, there is not a better center that we can reasonably obtain.

Posted by: ATLwizFAN | June 17, 2008 1:30 AM | Report abuse

Another offseason of Ernie can do no wrong. I like Pesh, but judging from perspective that time has afforded, it is clear that Rajon Rondo (who Eddie wanted), may have been a better pick.

You win some, you lose some, however; let's try critiquing him honestly and stop the hero worship.

Posted by: Anonymous | June 17, 2008 1:32 AM | Report abuse

Roy Hibbert at 18
Sean Singletary at 47


Posted by: Darnell | June 17, 2008 5:17 AM | Report abuse

Darnell called McGuire last year. I'm useally slow to jump on the local players bandwagon in the draft, but I'd have to agree with Darnell on both draft calls.

I think Singletary could be a real sleeper in this draft. A lot of the draft experts have him going undrafted, but I love the guy's moxie. He might spend a lot of games in D League or on the bench in street clothes his first year, but I like the kid's chances to make it.

At point the Wiz would be looking for a guy to develop to bring into the rotation once Daniels is gone. Daniels won't have as much trade value this summer as he will when he come up on his last year of his deal, so I think he's going to be here next year.

Ernie's also going to want to have the vet around so they can take it slow with Gil this time around.

In the first round there are going to be a whole group of bigs to choose from at 18 if you beleive the draft boards at all. I'd sit at 18 and wait for one of those guys to fall to me if I was Ernie.

If the bigs go earlier then that then a really talented wing is going to drop into his lap. If that happens Ernie might broker a deal.

Posted by: GM | June 17, 2008 8:00 AM | Report abuse

Also, why does it seem like every player brought in to workout by the Wiz are considered 2nd round picks or people that won't get drafted at all?

Posted by: | June 16, 2008 10:57 PM

If I were betting man, I would say the Wiz know what they are going to do with the 18th pick, and may not what invite the potential draft pick in for a workout. That might clue other teams into what player they are leaning towards. This is done in football all the time. Team A does not invite a potential first round pick for workouts, but on draft day that player is taken. IMO, that is why they are a boat load of second round players coming through.

Posted by: Anonymous | June 17, 2008 8:16 AM | Report abuse

"And, again, so what? Livingston's rate of recovery has nothing to do with Arenas. Livingston's recovery is further along. Good for him. Does that mean that Arenas will never recover? Of course not. Does it mean he's hobbled forever? Of course not. It means nothing of any consequence. Much like everything you post."

The point that you missed is that SL is busy rehabbing after his injury, and apparently doing it the smart way because he's coming along. In contrast, the Wizards fool was running behind parachutes and reinjured himself, which took him out of about 70 games last season. Now, the same fool opted out and will be traveling in the far east and probably not getting the treatment he needs. Certainly not worth max money there.

"And, of course, I did no such thing. I was equating his inability to dunk with having no impact on his ability to play effectively, thus debunking your ridiculous stance that Arenas' (current, supposed) inability to dunk when he's not yet fully recovered has rendered him permanently incapacitated. Which is, of course, nonsense."

Nonsense, then why even mention AI? My comments were about SL and Gilby. You brought AI into the conversation for no worthwhile reason...again.

"Which, to those of us operating on facts and not obsessive agendas simply means he's still rehabbing. Which, y'know, is what happens when a guy gets hurt and has surgery."

Yeah, let's hope he's not rehabbing on his own again this time. It'll be interesting how far along he is while traveling the far east. If he gets resigned by the Wiz, it's easy to assume that he still won't be ready this coming season and will not be going into training camp without issues. Of course, SL had a more devastating injury, did it smart, and is now jumping and dunking. Great for SL.

"Which, to the logical, objective observer might be seen as another sign of him having not finished rehabbing the knee with nothing to say about how good he'll be when he is."

Not finished, or not serious about rehab? Sounds like the latter. The doctors said he was ready to go and had no risk of injuries back in April.

"Why, because you say so? Yeah, that's always a good reason to believe something."

Unfortunately, what you say is no reason to believe something though.

"By "nonsense" you of course mean pointing out the documented facts that he's older, more expensive, more injury-prone, and has a longer history of bad coach relationships than Arenas yet you suggested the Wizards trade Arenas for him all the while ripping Arenas for being injury prone, too expensive, and being too much trouble to coach."

Don't forget to comment on the other 10 or so players that many others mentioned here. Go ahead and nitpick Baron Davis. It's no worse than you looking like a fool for criticizing BTH who had a great season.

"And, of course, the fact that you mentioned a bunch of other players that the Wizards, have no chance of getting doesn't alter the fact that you wanted to trade Arenas for Davis. I can see where you might think that though, given your usual strategy of throwing out crap and hoping the sheer bulk of it obscures the general erroneousness of what you say (that is when you're not changing your story from post to post, apparently hoping people will get lost in the maze of shifting positions and give up). But keep dancing. Maybe if you spin enough you'll lull someone into enough of a trance to buy your bs."

And of course, you haven't mentioned any trades worthwhile either, but aren't worth anything but to sit back and yap and nitpick this and that. You bring absolutely nothing to the table, but keep dancing and maybe you'll learn to move something else besides just your little fingers on the keyboard.

It's no secret that you're not a fan of BTH. I'm glad his great play this season made you eat your words.

While you're at it, it's probably as tasty as you saying the Memphis Grizzlies "got exactly what they wanted," but then I disproved what you pulled out of your behind by showing a quote from the Memphis owner disputing your very own brilliant assessment. Again. You're worthless kalorama. A totally worthless joke.

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 17, 2008 8:20 AM | Report abuse

"Of course, SL had a more devastating injury, did it smart, and is now jumping and dunking." He also had longer to rehab. Also, Washington has a history of poor recovery from injuries, it's not just Gil. Makes you wonder about the doctors...

"Don't forget to comment on the other 10 or so players that many others mentioned here. Go ahead and nitpick Baron Davis."
What 10 other players? The only players I recall were AK, Baron, and Elton Brand...at least, those were the only ones that were seriously discussed. And of those, Baron IS the worst candidate to trade for.

"While you're at it, it's probably as tasty as you saying the Memphis Grizzlies "got exactly what they wanted," but then I disproved what you pulled out of your behind by showing a quote from the Memphis owner disputing your very own brilliant assessment."
Can you link this again? I would really like to see this.

"You're worthless kalorama. A totally worthless joke."
Actually, most of what he writes I find to be informative and actually contribute to the discussion...most of the time. You, on the other hand, don't really seem to add much to the discussion besides "ARENAS SUCKS".

Posted by: babbtong | June 17, 2008 8:33 AM | Report abuse

babbytong...just to let you know...you wish I care, but I don't. thanks though.

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 17, 2008 9:12 AM | Report abuse

"Also, Washington has a history of poor recovery from injuries, it's not just Gil. "

Yeah, those darn Wiz doctors shouldn't have told Gilby to run behind a parachute, bike around town without a helmet, and play unsupervised pickup games at Barry Farms. Then he wouldn't have strained his knee and gotten RE-injured in the first place.

If EG had any cajones, he would make Gilby sign a contract (if resigned at all) that forbids him from participating in any dumb activities that would save him from hurting himself.

Gilby is lucky that EG/Abe didn't file a grievance, if possible, to collect Gilby's salary from last season because Gilby "wasn't smart" and went against doctor's orders on how to rehab, thus resulting in the reinjury.

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 17, 2008 9:17 AM | Report abuse

BTW babythong, what have you written that provided insight into anything? Nothing.

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 17, 2008 9:19 AM | Report abuse

funny that a dungpile like 88 would call kalorama a totally worthless joke. you ever look in the mirror, hippocrite?

Posted by: Anonymous | June 17, 2008 9:39 AM | Report abuse

babbytong...just to let you know...you wish I care, but I don't. thanks though.

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 17, 2008 9:12 AM

babbtong, 88 likes to say this when he has no other comeback and he actually cares and it's eating him up inside.

Posted by: Anonymous | June 17, 2008 9:41 AM | Report abuse

babbytong...just to let you know...you wish I care, but I don't. thanks though.

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 17, 2008 9:12 AM

babbtong, 88 likes to say this when he has no other comeback and he actually cares and it's eating him up inside.

Posted by: | June 17, 2008 9:41 AM

Whoever is doing that to me, stop it! You're going to make me cry like a baby. I hate it when I cry

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 17, 2008 10:14 AM | Report abuse

Yes. Cancel all draft hype for the Wiz. Trade the picks. There's no one at 18 or beyond that can help us near term, and we have too many young guys already.

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 16, 2008 10:39 AM

This the same DC Man88 that ripped the Wizards last year for only having 12 players on the roster?

If you "trade the picks", you'll have to trade a player too. You can't just trade picks for players. Incoming salaries must match outgoing salaries. Draft choices have NO salary. Therefore you can trade a player WITH a Draft Pick for another player... but that only means you've swapped players for players, and used the Draft pick(s) as a "sweetener" ..

The Wiz have only 10 players under contract for 2008-2009. If they re-sign Arenas and Jamison, they will have 12. (They WILL lose Mason to Free Agency).

I also dismiss the myth that you have to draft someone that will help in the "near term". The more young, talented players you have under contract, the more assets you have as an Organization. In my opinion, once you're past your starting five and the first few critical reserves - you can never have too many young guys.

Posted by: Rook | June 17, 2008 10:33 AM | Report abuse

Last night nbadraft.net changed its projection of whom the Wizards will pick. They now predict Hibbert.

Posted by: Anonymous | June 17, 2008 10:46 AM | Report abuse

I love Ivans work, hate this board. What no one seems to have mentioned to 88 is that SL hurt his knee during the 06-07 season, yet is dunking just now? And you are comparing him to Gil, who actually played in games THIS season? And SL is still no lock to be able to play at the start of next season. So.....yeah that a great rehabbing job. A full year without playing and he can finally dunk, woohoo.

Posted by: Anonymous | June 17, 2008 10:58 AM | Report abuse

I love Ivans work, hate this board. What no one seems to have mentioned to 88 is that SL hurt his knee during the 06-07 season, yet is dunking just now? And you are comparing him to Gil, who actually played in games THIS season? And SL is still no lock to be able to play at the start of next season. So.....yeah that a great rehabbing job. A full year without playing and he can finally dunk, woohoo.

Posted by: Anonymous | June 17, 2008 10:58 AM | Report abuse

Granted, Hibbert IS slow, and Speights the better fit for us, but I wouldn't be pissed if we took Hibbert (doubtful), he'd be the perfect backup to Haywood, still has a huge upside, and I could totally see him be a dominant big-man in a few years. NOT a bust.

Posted by: Wizzy | June 16, 2008 11:13 AM

While I won't dispute that Hibbert would be a good backup to Haywood - I don't think he has a tremendous upside. I don't see him as a "dominant" big man. He will improve, but I think he'll be, at best, a good starting Center in the League.

I also think that of all the Center prospects coming out this year (INCLUDING Brook Lopez), Hibbert is the ONE player that is experienced enough, and polished enough to contribute right away. But because I don't see a big upside for him, what you see now is what you're gonna get.

Posted by: Rook | June 17, 2008 11:09 AM | Report abuse

Or Grunfeld could take a Efthimios Rentzias-type and "stash him overseas." Kinda like the Pesh pick. Instead of Pecherov, the Wiz coulda had Rajon Rondo (21), Kyle Lowry (24), or Jordan Farmar (26). There are always guys available. I wish somebody would hold Ernie accountable for failing to utilize the draft better.

Posted by: Steve C. | June 16, 2008 5:33 PM

Agreed. For some reason Ernie gets a pass on this ... but his draft record stinks.

Posted by: pepcoenergy3 | June 17, 2008 11:13 AM | Report abuse

Ain't it great how the Boston Celtics went from a lottery team to now a championship contender when the ownership team decided to spend some money and get some players?

Sure, this season may be Boston's only chance, but most people would trade 1 season of glory for 30 seasons of misery.

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 16, 2008 11:41 AM

Gee, Ain't it great how the LA Lakers went from a lottery team (a few years ago) to now a championship contender when the ownership team decided to spend some money and get some players?

Now they're on the verge of becoming LOSERS - just like the other 29 teams that didn't win.

Posted by: Anonymous | June 17, 2008 11:15 AM | Report abuse

Oh sure it does. Go find a snausage snack and go to your corner where your water dish is at.

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 16, 2008 9:04 PM

Really relevant....right on topic, as usual.

Posted by: Anonymous | June 17, 2008 11:32 AM | Report abuse

Actually, Kal has been spot on with his comments about those situations.

Posted by: | June 16, 2008 9:49 PM

Actually, not just spot on, but interesting, refreshing, and downright scary that someone can remember all the crap that spews out of DC'ers keyboard.

Posted by: Anonymous | June 17, 2008 11:45 AM | Report abuse

If EG had any cajones, he would make Gilby sign a contract (if resigned at all) that forbids him from participating in any dumb activities that would save him from hurting himself.

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 17, 2008 9:17 AM
It's cojones meaning balls, and not cajones meaning boxes.

There is a part of all player's contracts that prohibits players from doing dangerous things during the offseason, and may require the player to obtain insurance to compensate the team if he is unable to play. That is how riding motorcyles without helmets, playing full contact football, rock climbing, playing for one's Olympic team and such things could be grounds for team ownership to obtain relief.

Posted by: Anonymous | June 17, 2008 11:46 AM | Report abuse

Also, why does it seem like every player brought in to workout by the Wiz are considered 2nd round picks or people that won't get drafted at all?

Posted by: | June 16, 2008 10:57 PM

That's a pretty easy one to deduce. I'd bet that Grundfeld has alreay made up his mind on several players for the #18 pick.

The workouts are probably to find out which undrafted players they want to invite to Summer League.

Posted by: Rook | June 17, 2008 11:47 AM | Report abuse

Roy Hibbert at 18
Sean Singletary at 47


Posted by: Darnell | June 17, 2008 5:17 AM

Good picks Darnell... But I like Kyle Weaver in the 2nd Round better. He's a lock down defensive guard, and at 6'5" can play PG.

Posted by: Anonymous | June 17, 2008 11:50 AM | Report abuse

babbytong...just to let you know...you wish I care, but I don't. thanks though.

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 17, 2008 9:12 AM

but you responded, didn't you!

Posted by: Anonymous | June 17, 2008 11:54 AM | Report abuse

"Granted, Hibbert IS slow, and Speights the better fit for us, but I wouldn't be pissed if we took Hibbert (doubtful), he'd be the perfect backup to Haywood, still has a huge upside, and I could totally see him be a dominant big-man in a few years. NOT a bust."

HAHAHHAHAHAHHAHA that is pure comedy. You could do stand up with this material.

Posted by: Anonymous | June 17, 2008 11:55 AM | Report abuse

kalorama who thinks he is the voice of reason anytime there is an argument on this site....has got to be the most annoying person on this blog. With PSPS23 or whatever and Mark coming in a close 2nd.

Posted by: Anonymous | June 17, 2008 11:57 AM | Report abuse

My wishes at this time
#18 - SF Pat Calathes, shows outstanding all around numbers in Draftexpress's SF evaluation
#47 - C Sasha Kaun or PG/SG Jamont Gordon
Please NOT Trent "alligator arms" Plaisted

Undrafted free agent - Sean Singletary

Posted by: rgz | June 17, 2008 11:58 AM | Report abuse

Roy Hibbert at 18
Sean Singletary at 47

Posted by: Darnell | June 17, 2008 5:17 AM

Good picks Darnell... But I like Kyle Weaver in the 2nd Round better. He's a lock down defensive guard, and at 6'5" can play PG.

Posted by: | June 17, 2008 11:50 AM

I like JR Giddens better as he shown he's matured a lot and plays with lots of versatility even if he isn't a PG. The Princeton offense doesn't need a pure PG, but somebody who knows when to shoot, pass, cut, rebound, read the defense - all things Giddens showed major improvements this year not to mention his length and top notch athleticism.

Posted by: Anonymous | June 17, 2008 11:59 AM | Report abuse

Good picks Darnell... But I like Kyle Weaver in the 2nd Round better. He's a lock down defensive guard, and at 6'5" can play PG.

Posted by: | June 17, 2008 11:50 AM

that was my post.

Posted by: Rook | June 17, 2008 11:59 AM | Report abuse

Calathes would be a good steal in the 2nd too, but as an 18th pick, would be a MAJOR reach.

Posted by: Anonymous | June 17, 2008 12:03 PM | Report abuse

I agree Giddens would fit great with Wiz too, as he's also a great defensive player who can still shoot the ball when open. Weaver is supposedly not a good shooter at all.

Posted by: Anonymous | June 17, 2008 12:05 PM | Report abuse

all things Giddens showed major improvements this year not to mention his length and top notch athleticism.

Posted by: | June 17, 2008 11:59 AM

Don't get me wrong, I wouldn't be upset if the Wizards chose Giddens - but the need right now is a PG....

In the Princeton, the only thing the PG needs to do is bring the ball over the half court line without turning the ball over - then he becomes another cutter, another shooter.

One of Giddens shortcomings is his dribbling skills. His assist to turn over ratio is also not very good.

Weaver, on the other hand, has legitimate PG skills...and he brings something the Wizards desperately need - perimeter defense.

Posted by: Rook | June 17, 2008 12:08 PM | Report abuse

Babythong...smells stinky.

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 17, 2008 12:12 PM | Report abuse

"There is a part of all player's contracts that prohibits players from doing dangerous things during the offseason, and may require the player to obtain insurance to compensate the team if he is unable to play. That is how riding motorcyles without helmets, playing full contact football, rock climbing, playing for one's Olympic team and such things could be grounds for team ownership to obtain relief.

Posted by: | June 17, 2008 11:46 AM "

The point was that EG didn't make Gilby give any of his unearned money back.

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 17, 2008 12:13 PM | Report abuse

I can not believe there is not more backlash to the strong likelihood of Arenas being given a max contract - or at least some attention given to the possible downside of a max contract. This would haunt the Wizards for the next 5 or 6 years. I wish Ivan would write a piece describing what a max deal to Gilbert along with a new deal to Jamison (what are they saying $6 - 8 M per year?)would mean to the Wizards cap flexibility over the next few years. It kills it,right?

I am of the belief there are only a very few "max players" in the entire league and Gilbert is NOT one of them. Kobe, CPaul, Duncan (he has been one over the last several years, obviously you would not sign him to a max deal moving forward), Lebron, maybe Dwight Howard and that is about it at this point. I don't think KG is or ever has been a max player nor Wade and certainly not players like Dirk, Vince carter, Michael Redd or any of the other 10 - 15 very good, All Star caliber players who probably feel they are max level players.

I have read on the Insider that the market sets itself, and a player is worth what another team is willing to pay him. That is one way of looking at it. Another is that if you don't think a player (Gilbert) is worth a max deal, and that signing him to a max deal will not earn you a Championship and will only saddle your salary cap for the next several years, then you should not commit more to the one player (Gilbert) than you believe he is worth. If that means losing him, so be it. Let another team make the mistake of maxing him out and wallowing between the 5th seed and the lottery for the next 6 -8 years.

If they max Gilbert and bring back Jamison Ernie is saying he is sticking with what he's got ... this is the team he will roll out for at least the next 3 years. Compared to other teams in the East the Wizards will suddenly be an old team with no shot at winning this conference.

Right now fans(and most writers it seems) may want Gilbert at whatever the cost. but in two years when they realize the team hasn't gone any further, and we are still on the hook for a maximum contract to a shoot-first, no-defense-playing, suddenly old, hybrid guard they will turn on him.

I like Gilbert, and am not opposed to re-signing him. But only at a reasonable contract that leaves some flexibilty to continue building the team. Because as it stands this team will not get any better with the current set of bench and role players. I love AD, but he only has a year or two left in the tank - probably the same for Jamison. The young "projects" - Pech and Blatche - are a joke. At some point they will have to cut their losses on both of them. I think caron has maxed his potential and hopefully can stay healthy and continue to play at that level for the next 4 or 5 years. But the bottome line is they need some new blood on that roster.

Does Ernie really think a Gilbert Arenas led team can win a Championship?

Posted by: pepcoenergy3 | June 17, 2008 12:16 PM | Report abuse

I agree Giddens would fit great with Wiz too, as he's also a great defensive player who can still shoot the ball when open. Weaver is supposedly not a good shooter at all.

Posted by: | June 17, 2008 12:05 PM

I would disagree that Giddens is a "great defensive player".... I've watched the Lobo's this year and last. I used to live in Albuquerque - and still follow the team.

Giddens is a very good shooter... Good all around on Offense... and he has all the "tools" to be a good defender.... but right now he's not. With work, he could become a good defender..

Kyle Weaver has been called the best defensive College player in the Country. He can guard PG's, SG's and SF's... and has done so all year. He has guarded the other team's best player each game - including games where he "shut down" guys like O.J. Mayo..

Oh - and by the way.... shooting can be "fixed" (Dave Hoopla?)

Posted by: Rook | June 17, 2008 12:18 PM | Report abuse

"Agreed. For some reason Ernie gets a pass on this ... but his draft record stinks."

"Stinks" may be a bit strong. Uneven, underwhelming, sure. Since Grunfeld took over the Wiz have drafted:

Jarvis Hayes, Steve Blake, PJ Ramos, Andray Blatche, Nick Young, Oleksiy Pecherov, and Dominic McGuire, and Vladimir Veremeenko.

The only outright bust in the group (so far) has been Ramos, a second-rounder. Hayes had a good rookie year and was on his way to being a quality NBA scorer before injuries did him in. Blake is a quality PG that they should have kept. Blatche has a ton of potential, it's just a question of whether he'll realize it. The rest haven't had a chance to make a mark yet.

No home runs (yet) but really only one outright strike out.

Posted by: kalorama | June 17, 2008 12:20 PM | Report abuse

Since Gilby said he will take the scraps left over after AJ signs, Ivan should report on that too.

How much money will be left for Gilby after AJ signs, along with someone to replace Mason and the rookie contracts, without going over the cap.

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 17, 2008 12:22 PM | Report abuse

Calathes would be a good steal in the 2nd too, but as an 18th pick, would be a MAJOR reach.

Posted by: | June 17, 2008 12:03 PM

At the SF position, Draftexpress' stats have him all around better than first round SFs, including Joe Alexander, Danilo Gallinari, Omri Kasspi and Nicolas Batum (and Malik Hairston and Chase Budinger who pulled out). Not in every category, but enough that he is better in most categories than the "average" first round prospect.

Ernie Grunfeld is supposedly pretty good at taking surprise picks, I hope they keep track of this guy and get him in a workout if possible.

Posted by: rgz | June 17, 2008 12:23 PM | Report abuse

all things Giddens showed major improvements this year not to mention his length and top notch athleticism.

Posted by: | June 17, 2008 11:59 AM

Don't get me wrong, I wouldn't be upset if the Wizards chose Giddens - but the need right now is a PG....

In the Princeton, the only thing the PG needs to do is bring the ball over the half court line without turning the ball over - then he becomes another cutter, another shooter.

One of Giddens shortcomings is his dribbling skills. His assist to turn over ratio is also not very good.

Weaver, on the other hand, has legitimate PG skills...and he brings something the Wizards desperately need - perimeter defense.

Posted by: Rook | June 17, 2008 12:08 PM

In previous years Giddens didn't do so well playing a team game, but this year his assist to turnover ratio is just below that of Weaver's. Look at the charts in terms of PG skills, he's barely behind Weaver but is much better than Weaver (and others) in many of the other skills.

http://www.draftexpress.com/article/Just-by-the-Numbers-Evaluating-This-Year-s-Shooting-Guard-Crop-2924/

Giddens also plays very good defense, maybe not quite as good as Weaver but still within range. As a shooter, he is great but is much better than Weaver. I fear with Weaver, we'd have another Ared Jefferies - we'd be playing 4 on 5 with defenses leaving Weaver wide open cause he couldn't shoot.

In either case, Weaver and Giddens can both be good 2nd round picks if available. I just think Giddens has more to offer as far as being more well rounded, just my opinion.

Posted by: Anonymous | June 17, 2008 12:27 PM | Report abuse

pepcoenergy3, I don't think it's so much that people want Arenas "at whatever the cost." I think it's more a case that, given all the factors, there's very little, if any, chance that trading Arenas will yield the kind of return that would allow the Wiz to get immediately better, let alone turn them into a contender.

They aren't going to get the likes of Elton Brand back in trade for Arenas or Jamison. Could they trade them for draft picks and young players with some upside? Sure. But if they do that they're essentially starting from scratch and entering a several year rebuilding plan, which is clearly not the direction the Wizards brass want to go in.

I think most people are looking at it (realistically) as being a choice between (A) keeping the core together and hoping that good health (which they haven't had), internal improvement from the young guys, and some tweaks around the margins of the roster will make a difference or (B) scrapping the whole thing and starting over from scratch. There doesn't seem to be a lot of plausible middle ground between the two.

Personally I think A is a bit of wishful thinking and would be OK with B, as long as it was done in pursuit of a well thought out plan. But the message we seem to be getting from Grunfeld is that B is not an option.

Posted by: kalorama | June 17, 2008 12:28 PM | Report abuse

grunfeld didn't draft hayes and blake. that was wes unselds last draft.

Posted by: Anonymous | June 17, 2008 12:41 PM | Report abuse

How much money will be left for Gilby after AJ signs, along with someone to replace Mason and the rookie contracts, without going over the cap.

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 17, 2008 12:22 PM

If Mason leaves (and I believe he will), I think the plan is to give his minutes to Nick Young.

Posted by: rbpalmer | June 17, 2008 12:47 PM | Report abuse

"grunfeld didn't draft hayes and blake. that was wes unselds last draft."

That's right. I wasn't sure from memory about the timing of Grunfeld's hire. Even so, the point still stands. Of the picks he did make, the only one that's proven to be a bust is Ramos. The rest still haven't had a chance to really develop.

Now, if you want to judge him based on the guys he could have had with those picks versus the ones he did take, then the picture changes a bit. I would love a do-over on the Pecherov pick.

Posted by: kalorama | June 17, 2008 12:55 PM | Report abuse

re. calculating salaries, according to reports the player's association gave the following estimates:
Salary cap about $58.5M, luxury tax threshold projected at 71 million dollars, and MLE about $5.55M.

Posted by: rgz | June 17, 2008 1:08 PM | Report abuse

In either case, Weaver and Giddens can both be good 2nd round picks if available. I just think Giddens has more to offer as far as being more well rounded, just my opinion.

Posted by: | June 17, 2008 12:27 PM

Good call on the A/TO ratio for Giddens - I never looked at his improvement... only at the career number.

I tend to look at a player in the 2nd round to see if they have an NBA ready skill. McGuire, for example, could obviously block shots - and that skill translates directly to the NBA. Nick Young can get his shot off against anyone - again, a skill that directly translates to the NBA. Now, both of those players need to continue to work on other parts of their game, but they can do SOMETHING right now at the NBA level.

Giddens, while certainly a nice player, does not have an NBA ready skill. He's a nice shooter. He can penetrate some.

Weaver's defensive ability will directly translate at the NBA level, right away.

But, again, I certainly understand your preference for Giddens.

Posted by: Rook | June 17, 2008 1:20 PM | Report abuse

How much money will be left for Gilby after AJ signs, along with someone to replace Mason and the rookie contracts, without going over the cap.

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 17, 2008 12:22 PM

Caron Butler $9,780,970
Etan Thomas $7,350,000
Antonio Daniels $6,600,000
Brendan Haywood $6,000,000
Darius Songaila $4,526,000
DeShawn Stevenson $3,886,928
Andray Blatche $3,013,636
Nick Young $1,714,800
Oleksiy Pecherov $1,547,640
Dominic McGuire $770,000
TOTALS: $45,189,974

You do the math!

Posted by: Rook | June 17, 2008 1:28 PM | Report abuse

Pepco:
Resigning Gilbert to a max contract would not be the biggest mistake in the world. Compare signing Gilbert to a $15 million per year deal to a $13 million per year deal. Is that $2 million per year difference really that important? Signing DeShawn or Songalia were arguably more damaging to the Wizards' cap situation. (Did signing those guys bring the Wizards any closer to a championship?)

When the option is to overpay a little, or scrap everything and start from scratch, a lot of GMs will choose to overpay a little.

Posted by: Anonymous | June 17, 2008 1:32 PM | Report abuse

It's not about going over the cap, it's about not going over the luxury amount. They are allowed to go over the cap and have been over the cap.

Posted by: Anonymous | June 17, 2008 1:34 PM | Report abuse

Even if the don't re-sign Arenas and jamison, who's out there they could get with that cap room that would be more likely to make the team into a contender?

If they spend the money on a couple of potential all-star caliber/nonfranchise players (like Okafor or Deng), there'd still be the question of who'd be the lead guy. Butler's a damn good player, but is he good enough to be the A-1 guy on a contender? Not really.

And there really aren't any true franchise/max-caliber players available on the FA market. Brand is the closest thing, and that's assuming he opts out. And him in place of Arenas and Jamison doesn't really come across as an overwhelming net improvement.

Posted by: kalorama | June 17, 2008 1:42 PM | Report abuse

TOTALS: $45,189,974

You do the math!

Posted by: Rook | June 17, 2008 1:28 PM

Gulp! That might allow only $13M for Gilbert, $10M for Antawn to allow for two or three rookies and still stay under the luxury tax. Based on that, I think EG will be pushing real hard to trade a couple of the players, and maybe not just limiting to the usual suspects. That scenario encourages the Trade Arenas/Trade Jamison camps. Signing them to large salaries but trading one or even both of them might make business sense. Not that I'm in favor of trading either of them, it just seems to be too difficult keeping both, unless Thomas, Songaila and Daniels are traded.
Or maybe EG will take the easy way out and stash both picks in Europe for a year or two.

Posted by: rgz | June 17, 2008 1:46 PM | Report abuse

rgz I also like Cathales alot! But I think 18 is too high, and I think he'll be gone by 47. That is why I like Singletary at 47, he should be there and I like what he brings to the team. But Cathales with his passing skill at sf would be a great fit in our offense. I really like Hibbert and Singletary for us in this draft because of the different skills and looks they would provide that we didn't have last year. Center and PG are the 2 hardest positions to fill, and we need more depth at both of those spots, especially considering Gil and Etan both missed practically all last season with major surgeries. I like the size Hibbert gives us off the bench, and the quickness Singletary adds. These moves would allow us to eventually move AD and Etan. And both are very skilled, are good defensively, work hard, and are team players. Both have the experience and attitude to contribure sooner rather than later. And both guys will give us offense off the bench. Last year our bench offensively was lacking. NY was the only really good scorer, and Mason who will be gone. AD is not a scorer, and neither is Etan, so Hibbert and Singletary would give us another option and should get PT off the bat in those situations and based on matchups. And I know alot say Hibbert coming would take Blatche's PT, but I actually think Hibbert being on our team will help Andray. I could go on forever about why I like these 2, but I think I went on long enough.

Posted by: Darnell | June 17, 2008 2:15 PM | Report abuse

Barbosa is probably another Gilby, a quicker Gilby, but the Suns might have to give him up since they want another 1st round pick. Would EG trade our pick (and necessary bodies) for Barbosa and then do a sign and trade for Brand with Gilby?

http://www.eastvalleytribune.com/story/118706

If the knicks are willing to trade down (from 6), then we should seriously consider Love if he's available. Or, stay put if EG thinks we can get Darrell Arthur.

BTW, Detroit won a championship with no single superstar, which means if EG can assemble the right cast together, sans Gilby, then the Wiz do have some hope. The Wiz of course though, would have to turn into a premier defensive team.

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 17, 2008 2:35 PM | Report abuse

"Agreed. For some reason Ernie gets a pass on this ... but his draft record stinks."

"Stinks" may be a bit strong. Uneven, underwhelming, sure. Since Grunfeld took over the Wiz have drafted:

Jarvis Hayes, Steve Blake, PJ Ramos, Andray Blatche, Nick Young, Oleksiy Pecherov, and Dominic McGuire, and Vladimir Veremeenko.

The only outright bust in the group (so far) has been Ramos, a second-rounder. Hayes had a good rookie year and was on his way to being a quality NBA scorer before injuries did him in. Blake is a quality PG that they should have kept. Blatche has a ton of potential, it's just a question of whether he'll realize it. The rest haven't had a chance to make a mark yet.

No home runs (yet) but really only one outright strike out.

----
kalorama - "stinks" is probably a little strong, and you were right in your later comment ... it is what Ernie could have taken at some of those spots that make the picks seem even worse. i think there is hope for Young and McGuire, hopefully we will look back on the 2007 draft as a solid showing by Ernie.

I am sorry, but I do think Pech was a bad pick and looking more and more like a horrible pick ... considering where he was selected, what he's shown to this point and what was passed up. Blatche was a second rounder, and I guess considering where he was picked it was a decent pick ... I just dont think he will ever become much more than he is right now.

Posted by: Anonymous | June 17, 2008 2:35 PM | Report abuse

Wasn't it EG who signed ET to that huge contract? Even before his heart surgery, ET was an average player.

Also, DSong better not have issues/questions about getting his legs back this coming season again. Does anyone know if DSong is representing his country in the olympics?

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 17, 2008 2:44 PM | Report abuse

I don't disagree about Pecherov (and have said so in the past), thus the "so far" qualifier about busts. I doubt he'll ever be good enough to justify taking at 18 (although the same probably holds true for some of the guys Grunfeld could had taken instead, like Millsap or Farmar), although he could end up a usable NBA player of some kind. But at the same time, after one injury shortened season, we can't know for sure.

Posted by: kalorama | June 17, 2008 2:47 PM | Report abuse

@rgz - I have to take issue with your math. There is no way Antawn gets $10 mil. More likely 6 or 7 mil.

As far as the salary cap is concerned, people should realize that AJ is going to take pay cut this year because his previous contract was huge and most of Gil's increased salary will come from there. Means similar financial situation to last year, no worse no better.

Posted by: SportzWiz | June 17, 2008 2:56 PM | Report abuse

And there really aren't any true franchise/max-caliber players available on the FA market. Brand is the closest thing, and that's assuming he opts out. And him in place of Arenas and Jamison doesn't really come across as an overwhelming net improvement.

Posted by: kalorama | June 17, 2008 1:42 PM

exactly true. but i just don't see that because there are no other "max deal" players out there that it means you have to sign your best payer to a max deal. Every offseason players get overpaid for this very reason. I just think a smart GM would avoid these pitfalls and not overpay players because there are no other immediate options.

it gets back to your A option (keeping this team together)and B option (overhaul / mimi-overhaul / rebuild, etc.) from before.

Ernie chooses A ... but after another year or two of getting bounced in the first round, Gilbert is suddenly one of those unmovable contracts. In 2010 Ernie may wish he could take Option B, but at that point his hands are somewhat tied. I guess Etan and AD will be off the books around then, but still ...

I don't mean to be so negative, just don't see the point in continuing much longer with the exact same roster ... and paying more for it. I think this group has maxed out what it can achieve and will only have more injury / age questions moving forward.

Posted by: pepcoenergy3 | June 17, 2008 3:02 PM | Report abuse

Offering AJ 6-7 mil/year may be a slap in the face, especially for a guy at the prime of his career coming off career 21-10 numbers, being Abe's favorite player, all star season, and proving his durability by averaging about 75 games/season since he's been with the Wiz.

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 17, 2008 3:05 PM | Report abuse

"Every offseason players get overpaid for this very reason. I just think a smart GM would avoid these pitfalls and not overpay players because there are no other immediate options.",/i>

The reason why there are so many non-franchise players getting max money is because that's the way the system works. GMs can either play by the rules of the game or sit back and watch someone else win. When you've got a legitimate star quality player on your team and you let him go, odds are it'll be a while before another one comes around. Is keeping Arenas a sure road to a title? Of course not. But is letting him go and starting over a sure road that what they'll end up with is better? Nope. It's a crap shoot either way. And in a situation like that, people often tend to go with the devil they know.

Posted by: kalorama | June 17, 2008 3:09 PM | Report abuse

Pepco:
Resigning Gilbert to a max contract would not be the biggest mistake in the world. Compare signing Gilbert to a $15 million per year deal to a $13 million per year deal. Is that $2 million per year difference really that important? Signing DeShawn or Songalia were arguably more damaging to the Wizards' cap situation. (Did signing those guys bring the Wizards any closer to a championship?)

When the option is to overpay a little, or scrap everything and start from scratch, a lot of GMs will choose to overpay a little.

Posted by: | June 17, 2008 1:32 PM

good point. paying someone $6 M instead of $3 M is just as bad as paying someone $15 M instead of $12. it all adds up. at the same time an unmovable contract is an unmovabe contract. Etan and Songaila are as untradable now as Gilbert could be in two years if he gets a max deal and it turns out he is not the player he was before the knee problems.

Posted by: pepcoenergy3 | June 17, 2008 3:12 PM | Report abuse

Without Gilby on this team, and with a remaining team that consists of Caron and AJ as the leaders, it's likely that the Wiz make the playoffs again next season anyway. They did it this past season.

And, although it was one and done, it's no worse than 3 seasons ago when they were one and done with Gilby, or even 2 seasons ago during the downward spiral to almost playing themselves out of the playoffs when Caron was out hurt right before Gilby tore his knee.

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 17, 2008 3:17 PM | Report abuse

Absolute worst case scenario possible:

We sign Gilby to a max contract; Gilby stops playing to get paid and instead focuses on doing what it takes to win- including playing solid D; the Wiz go on to win a championship.

That would be horrible!

Posted by: DC Man(44+44) | June 17, 2008 3:28 PM | Report abuse

"That would be horrible!

Posted by: DC Man(44+44) | June 17, 2008 3:28 PM "

It's horrible b/c it would never happen.

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 17, 2008 3:29 PM | Report abuse

I don't mean to be so negative, just don't see the point in continuing much longer with the exact same roster ... and paying more for it. I think this group has maxed out what it can achieve and will only have more injury / age questions moving forward.

Posted by: pepcoenergy3 | June 17, 2008 3:02 PM

What method of ESP or prescience did you use to determine that this group has "maxed out" and will only have "more injury / age questions"???

I would really like to see what this team can do when they're all together and healthy. There's as much talent on the Wizards as there was on Detroit last year - and everyone thought Detroit was a "Contender" ...

Last year, the entire starting line up for Detroit only missed 26 games. Key reserves Jason Maxiel and Jarvis Hayes played in all 82 games.

If the Wizards could only get that kind of luck!

MY ESP tells me that if the Wizards starters stay healthy for an entire year, they're a 55 win team - and a Contender.

Posted by: Rook | June 17, 2008 3:30 PM | Report abuse

The reason why there are so many non-franchise players getting max money is because that's the way the system works. GMs can either play by the rules of the game or sit back and watch someone else win. When you've got a legitimate star quality player on your team and you let him go, odds are it'll be a while before another one comes around. Is keeping Arenas a sure road to a title? Of course not. But is letting him go and starting over a sure road that what they'll end up with is better? Nope. It's a crap shoot either way. And in a situation like that, people often tend to go with the devil they know.

Posted by: kalorama | June 17, 2008 3:09 PM

this is my last post for now ... I agree with this, and understand it is the way the NBA works. In this particular case I think there is too much unknown with Gilbert - mainly the knee, and also whether he has peaked as a player. Ernie made a great move to sign him and Gilbert was the main reason this team became relavant after being essentially a joke for about 20 years. We were also fortunate enough to have his services at a reasonable deal - one might even say a steal before the injuries came about.

I hope I'm wrong if they bring Gilbert back ... hopefully he is the Gilbert of 05 and 06 and the team can win the Atlantic and compete for the East. I just don't feel like that's how its going to go.

also i hope they draft Chalmers

Posted by: pepcoenergy3 | June 17, 2008 3:34 PM | Report abuse

Offering AJ 6-7 mil/year may be a slap in the face, especially for a guy at the prime of his career coming off career 21-10 numbers, being Abe's favorite player, all star season, and proving his durability by averaging about 75 games/season since he's been with the Wiz.

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 17, 2008 3:05 PM


Antawn is a team player who already "got paid" in his prime. If the team gives him some security with a 3 or 4 year deal, there is no way he asks to be paid more than Caron. And a multi-year deal is good for the team because more of the salary can be at the end of the contract, after ET comes off the books.

Posted by: SportzWiz | June 17, 2008 3:40 PM | Report abuse

Jamison will get a 4-year deal, starting at $9 or $10 Million....

Posted by: Rook | June 17, 2008 3:44 PM | Report abuse

"I would really like to see what this team can do when they're all together and healthy. There's as much talent on the Wizards as there was on Detroit last year - and everyone thought Detroit was a "Contender" ...

Last year, the entire starting line up for Detroit only missed 26 games. Key reserves Jason Maxiel and Jarvis Hayes played in all 82 games.

If the Wizards could only get that kind of luck!

MY ESP tells me that if the Wizards starters stay healthy for an entire year, they're a 55 win team - and a Contender.

Posted by: Rook | June 17, 2008 3:30 PM "

And why are you comparing the Wiz with Detroit in the same light?

Detroit plays hard nosed defense, have balanced scoring, draft well, and they have inside scoring....all important for success in the playoffs.

Also, their franchise is aggressive and has the bar set high. They don't just hope...they go out and try and do.

The Wiz have little to none of that.

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 17, 2008 3:46 PM | Report abuse

I hope our youngsters develop far enough so that we can win 45+ games next year with our starters each playing only around 30 minutes per game.

Posted by: Anonymous | June 17, 2008 3:46 PM | Report abuse

I just want to throw something out there for people who think Gil will never play defense. Has anyone seen Paul Pierce lately? I don't even recognize him. What happened to his matador defense? He is really stepping up his D trying to get a ring. I hope the Wiz are watching the finals to see what happens when a great offense meets a team committed to defense.

Posted by: SportzWiz | June 17, 2008 3:47 PM | Report abuse

"Antawn is a team player who already "got paid" in his prime. If the team gives him some security with a 3 or 4 year deal, there is no way he asks to be paid more than Caron. And a multi-year deal is good for the team because more of the salary can be at the end of the contract, after ET comes off the books.

Posted by: SportzWiz | June 17, 2008 3:40 PM "

And if you called the shots for the Wiz, AJ would be playing on a different team next season, by choice.

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 17, 2008 3:47 PM | Report abuse

"I just want to throw something out there for people who think Gil will never play defense. Has anyone seen Paul Pierce lately? I don't even recognize him. What happened to his matador defense? He is really stepping up his D trying to get a ring. I hope the Wiz are watching the finals to see what happens when a great offense meets a team committed to defense.

Posted by: SportzWiz | June 17, 2008 3:47 PM "

LMAO!

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 17, 2008 3:50 PM | Report abuse

""I just want to throw something out there for people who think Gil will never play defense. Has anyone seen Paul Pierce lately? I don't even recognize him. What happened to his matador defense? He is really stepping up his D trying to get a ring. I hope the Wiz are watching the finals to see what happens when a great offense meets a team committed to defense.

Posted by: SportzWiz | June 17, 2008 3:47 PM ""

Next thing you should predict is that Big Ben and Shaq will become 90% free throw shooters because it's been a glaring weakness in their games.

Oh wait, how about Patrick Ewing Jr. growing more 6 inches just in time for the draft.

Even better, how about Joakim Noah retiring from the NBA to seek a career in tennis.

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 17, 2008 4:07 PM | Report abuse

Or DC Man88 getting a clue.

C'mon SportsWiz, you know these things will never happen.

Posted by: Johnnie Futbol | June 17, 2008 4:19 PM | Report abuse

Next thing you should predict is that Big Ben and Shaq will become 90% free throw shooters because it's been a glaring weakness in their games.

Oh wait, how about Patrick Ewing Jr. growing more 6 inches just in time for the draft.

Even better, how about Joakim Noah retiring from the NBA to seek a career in tennis.

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 17, 2008 4:07 PM

No one is saying the Wiz will become the Celtics. I am saying that the team needs to realize that even if they become a great offensive team they won't win that way.

Posted by: SportzWiz | June 17, 2008 4:21 PM | Report abuse

Ivan,

Can you get me one of those cool "Staff" shirts you wear in those commericals. ;);)

- Ray

Posted by: Ray | June 17, 2008 4:21 PM | Report abuse

"No one is saying the Wiz will become the Celtics. I am saying that the team needs to realize that even if they become a great offensive team they won't win that way.

Posted by: SportzWiz | June 17, 2008 4:21 PM "

What you implied was that Pierce appeared to be playing D, and so Gilby can too. That's quite far fetched.

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 17, 2008 4:27 PM | Report abuse

'hopefully he is the Gilbert of 05 and 06 and the team can win the Atlantic and compete for the East. I just don't feel like that's how its going to go."

I feel much the same way (not so much about how Arenas recovers but for the team's overall prospects when he does). I said before the season ended, that if they were undone by injuries and got bumped in the first round changes should be considered. And they probably were. But most likely the decision was made (based on what we know so far) not to make them because there weren't any realistic avenues to anything better. I wish that weren't the case, but I can certainly see the reason in it.

Posted by: kalorama | June 17, 2008 4:28 PM | Report abuse

It doesn't matter how much better Gil gets, the Wiz will NEVER win the atlantic division. It doesn't matter what the Wiz do, what moves they make this offseason or any future offseasons, they aren't winning the Atlantic division next year or the year after that. They could trade for Kobe and Lebron and they still would not win the Atlantic division. The wiz will never win the Atlantic division.

Posted by: Anonymous | June 17, 2008 4:58 PM | Report abuse

Or DC Man88 getting a clue.

C'mon SportsWiz, you know these things will never happen.

Posted by: Johnnie Futbol | June 17, 2008 4:19 PM

Or DC Man88 having anything positive to say about anything.

Posted by: Anonymous | June 17, 2008 5:03 PM | Report abuse

It doesn't matter how much better Gil gets, the Wiz will NEVER win the atlantic division. It doesn't matter what the Wiz do, what moves they make this offseason or any future offseasons, they aren't winning the Atlantic division next year or the year after that. They could trade for Kobe and Lebron and they still would not win the Atlantic division. The wiz will never win the Atlantic division.

Posted by: | June 17, 2008 4:58 PM

Orlando Magic fan?

Posted by: Anonymous | June 17, 2008 5:06 PM | Report abuse

If Gil comes back pre-injury, and if we stay healthy, we really are not that far away IMO. I think healthy and with a Gil of old we are capable of beating either of these teams that are in the finals. And I also think we could have beaten the Cavs team that got to the finals last year. And I think we have shown we can beat those teams when we are fully loaded.

Posted by: Darnell | June 17, 2008 5:06 PM | Report abuse

I ! AM ! the real DC Man wahahahaha.

Posted by: DC Man 88 | June 17, 2008 5:07 PM | Report abuse

It doesn't matter how much better Gil gets, the Wiz will NEVER win the atlantic division. It doesn't matter what the Wiz do, what moves they make this offseason or any future offseasons, they aren't winning the Atlantic division next year or the year after that. They could trade for Kobe and Lebron and they still would not win the Atlantic division. The wiz will never win the Atlantic division.

Posted by: | June 17, 2008 4:58 PM

Orlando Magic fan?

Posted by: | June 17, 2008 5:06 PM

no a REAL wiz fan. one that realizes that we play in the SOUTH EAST not the atlantic. i was being facetious

Posted by: Anonymous | June 17, 2008 5:09 PM | Report abuse

no a REAL wiz fan. one that realizes that we play in the SOUTH EAST not the atlantic. i was being facetious

Posted by: | June 17, 2008 5:09 PM

LOL

Posted by: Rook | June 17, 2008 5:52 PM | Report abuse

Arthur is a beast. He could provide the spark and defensive intensity that is lacking on this team. His athleticism and nack for loose balls would be a total asset. I personally don't care for Gil and would prefer him to be traded. I really hope Arthur is still around when we pick. Any thoughts Ivan?

Posted by: LK | June 17, 2008 6:21 PM | Report abuse

SportzWiz, I do think it is possible. Players learn a lot from each other. Aside from Doc Rivers asking Pierce to change his game, the arrival of KG and Thibodeau had a lot to do with it. KG has given interviews where he said each of the Boston team have had to give up something to adjust and make the whole team better, and he used the word pain. He also said that the veterans respect each other and get on each other's cases.

The Wiz have Ayers as defensive coach, they have Eddie asking Gilbert to play more defense and should remind him.
Jamison will need to step up his own defensive intensity. Butler needs to add his voice. I expect Gilbert will hear about it from those two and from Daniels and Stevenson also.
I think by now after playing together a while that these guys will help each other get better.

Posted by: rgz | June 17, 2008 6:46 PM | Report abuse

I think that most of us can agree that the team will improve a lot if they take on more of Caron's personality. That would even help Gil.

Posted by: SportzWiz | June 17, 2008 7:25 PM | Report abuse

Gilby marches to the beat of his own drummer. To think that he would do a 180 and adopt some sort of team mentality, or that his teammates would step up to him and tell him to start playing D and share the ball is wishful thinking at best.

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 17, 2008 10:04 PM | Report abuse

I have been away from the board for some time and on my return I see you guys/gals are still dealing with dcwoman00. Too funny.

Posted by: Skeef | June 17, 2008 10:20 PM | Report abuse

"I have been away from the board for some time and on my return I see you guys/gals are still dealing with dcwoman00. Too funny.

Posted by: Skeef | June 17, 2008 10:20 PM "

Skeezie...you should have stayed away.

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 17, 2008 10:23 PM | Report abuse

Time for everyone to take a break and watch how the Celtics are ripping apart the Lakers... There is another half to go but unless the Mamba comes out of his hole big time they're going to be hanging another banner in another Garden.

Posted by: khrabb | June 17, 2008 10:34 PM | Report abuse

Congrats to the celtics. I was really pulling for KG to get a ring. I really, REALLY hope all the Wizards were watching that game and saw how defense and sacrifice were how they won that series. I like Arenas as a person but I have my doubts that the Wiz can win a championship with the way he plays. I hope he can adjust his game for this team to take the next step. When he came back I didn't see the commitment to defense. Arenas has the ability, he justs needs to realize scorers are a dime a dozen; champions are one in a million.

Posted by: Anonymous | June 18, 2008 12:20 AM | Report abuse

Sup! Are we done with workouts?

Posted by: Wizzy | June 18, 2008 6:21 AM | Report abuse

Jamont Gordon and George Hill today

Posted by: Anonymous | June 18, 2008 7:50 AM | Report abuse

Gilbert, Team USA doesn't want him, and neither should we. The AI's and Gilbert Areana's never bring out the best in a team.

Posted by: Just sayin | June 18, 2008 8:17 AM | Report abuse

Gilbert, Team USA doesn't want him, and neither should we. The AI's and Gilbert Areana's never bring out the best in a team.

Posted by: Just sayin | June 18, 2008 8:17 AM

So what is your thought? What is the alternative?

Posted by: Anonymous | June 18, 2008 8:33 AM | Report abuse

The Celtics deserve this Championship, their big three played their hearts out and they got some great performances from Eddie House, PJ Brown, and Posey to mention a few.

But for those who say the Wizards can NEVER compete, look back to before Caron suffered a serious hip injury and how the Wiz were playing. Caron led the Wiz to back to back wins against the league's new champs when they looked unbeatable.

The common theme here seems to be that the Wiz can't improve with their current roster. They did greatly improve this last season. They actually won more games then the year before WITHOUT their best player from the previous season.

They did so with three rookies and Blatche who is younger then the rookies and even some of the players they've worked out THIS year. No room for improvement?

Young and McGuire both show the talent work ethic and the ability to improve to become solid contributors this coming season. If Young can gain enough strength and gile to defend at an NBA level he'll be a starter before next year is out. And TMac shows signs of being a high energy defensive minded rebounder off the bench.

Pecherov missed nearly half of his rookie season with a foot/ankle problem, the slowest thing for a big man to get over. I'm not as eager to write off a hard working 7' with some skills as many on this board. I haven't seen any indication that Grunfeld has any intention of doing so either.

Jamison, Caron, and Gil form a solid core to build around and this team has some improving young talent in hand. Another solid draft or a swap to bring in a solid vet and this team could take a solid step up.

By the way, there's no way Jamison resigns for 6 or 7 million anywhere. He is too highly regarded in places like Cleveland, San Antonio, and Charlotte for that to happen. My quess is 9-11 million for 4 years with an option or partial quarentee for year 5.

Gil wants the max, but he's already said he wants Jamison to be taken care of, that's an indication he'll take less then the full amount up front if he's maxed out in increase and years. My quess there is 13-high 14m range in year one.

Somewhere in that range for each guy would give Ernie nearly the full MLE to work with. To do that he would have to exceed the luxury Tax to sign his rookies unless he stashes someone overseas.

But the point is there are guys out there to be had at the MLE that could really help this team. There are players on this roster that can possibly become major contributors next year in Young and Blatche.

So I'm not buying the "blow up this team and start over" line of thinking. I've been a Bullets/Wizards fan for 40+ years. I've seen the lets trade and try for one big year approach, anybody else remember Moses Malone as a Bullet?

I'd rather see Ernie build on the core that's gotten them to the playoffs for the past 4 years. I'd rather come to the phone booth knowing our team has a chance to compete night in and night out then pay to watch what we had before Grunfeld, Jordan, Arenas, Jamison and then Caron got here.

Posted by: GM | June 18, 2008 8:47 AM | Report abuse

The Wiz's success against Boston during the regular season is a weak indicator that the same success can be repeated in the playoffs. Also, it's not about whether the Wiz can beat the Celtics. It's about whether the Wiz can beat ALL the playoff teams they are slated to play in the playoffs and then win in the Conference Finals. It's much more of a monumental feat than just having a winning record against the eventual champion in the regular season. You should know that given your 50 years watching the NBA.

During the season that the Ravens won the superbowl, guess what, the Skins beat them also. What does that mean? Nothing.

BTW, we all know that Gilby changes his mind like a fart in the wind. What he says, may not be necessarily what he means, and what he means, can and will change probably as soon as he says it.

In the end, these players want to get paid, and it would be absolutely stupid of Gilby to give up money so that AJ can be paid because if Gilby learned nothing during his recent knee injuries, he should have learned that there is no guarantee for tomorrow in the NBA.

One more injury and his career could be over. Therefore, he needs to get paid as much as he can as soon as he can. This "kind gesture" on the surface by Gilby doesn't pay for the grotto or extra cheeseburgers for his kids.

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 18, 2008 9:19 AM | Report abuse

LMAO!

The Celtics winning the championship means that both KG and especially PP will be especially unbearable with the trash talk against Caron. Should be fun.

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 18, 2008 9:24 AM | Report abuse

I can't wait for next year to hear them jaw at each other. Team Defense, Team defense!!! The Celtics are full of role players minus the big three, just like us. All you need is a Good to Great Defense to be competitive in the playoffs. IT MUST CHANGE THIS YEAR WIZ KIDS!!!!

Posted by: Burg w/ a U | June 18, 2008 9:55 AM | Report abuse

Damn DC Man, give it a rest already. There is no reason to believe that Gil can't become as dominate defensively as he was offensively if healthy. This Gilby crap is getting old and tired. We have read that crap year after year and enough already! With that being said, now that the finals are over, I can't wait to see what the Wiz will do during the sign and trade period. It should be interesting to say the least.

What a great performance by the Celts! Even though I am a huge Wiz fan, I was still rooting for the Eastern team and thoroughly enjoyed that game. That is the way basketball is supposed to be played. They put on a clinic last night! All I could think was, damn! We had Thibodeau. At least for a week. I still wonder what made him leave and join Boston. By the way, great post GM. I agree with you analysis wholeheartedly. It would be beyond foolish to blow up this team. Maybe seeing the Celts win, will show the Wiz what they need to do in order to get there. I also believe that if the Wiz can stay healthy, play with consistency and unselfishly, throw in some defense, we can definitely make some noise next season. Also, muzzle Deshawn. Don't talk, just play.

Posted by: Anonymous | June 18, 2008 10:14 AM | Report abuse

Also, I get the impression that DCMan88 wants Gil to get hurt again. I hope that is not true. I just can't help but wonder who this person is and why they detest Gil so. I have never seen anyone with a fixation on a person like this before. It is somewhat scary.

Posted by: Anonymous | June 18, 2008 10:17 AM | Report abuse

"Also, I get the impression that DCMan88 wants Gil to get hurt again. I hope that is not true. I just can't help but wonder who this person is and why they detest Gil so. I have never seen anyone with a fixation on a person like this before. It is somewhat scary.

Posted by: | June 18, 2008 10:17 AM "

Does me "wanting" Gilby to get hurt affect anything? It affects nothing.

What I said was that Gilby's 2 knee surgeries should have made him realize that he is mortal, just like any other NBA player, and that his career can end with the next injury, just like any other NBA player.

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 18, 2008 10:39 AM | Report abuse

"Damn DC Man, give it a rest already. There is no reason to believe that Gil can't become as dominate defensively as he was offensively if healthy. This Gilby crap is getting old and tired. We have read that crap year after year and enough already! With that being said, now that the finals are over, I can't wait to see what the Wiz will do during the sign and trade period. It should be interesting to say the least.

What a great performance by the Celts! Even though I am a huge Wiz fan, I was still rooting for the Eastern team and thoroughly enjoyed that game. That is the way basketball is supposed to be played. They put on a clinic last night! All I could think was, damn! We had Thibodeau. At least for a week. I still wonder what made him leave and join Boston. By the way, great post GM. I agree with you analysis wholeheartedly. It would be beyond foolish to blow up this team. Maybe seeing the Celts win, will show the Wiz what they need to do in order to get there. I also believe that if the Wiz can stay healthy, play with consistency and unselfishly, throw in some defense, we can definitely make some noise next season. Also, muzzle Deshawn. Don't talk, just play.

Posted by: | June 18, 2008 10:14 AM "

And, what reason do you have that Gilby can be "dominant" defensively? How many players in the league can score 29 pts/game and also "dominate defensively?"

Make some sense and get a grip on reality.

Also, I laugh when people make assumptions based on "if the Wiz can remain healthy..."

When you have a subpar 2nd team, and you lean on your first team with huge minutes, chances are that your first team will break down. We've seen it the past 2 seasons.

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 18, 2008 10:43 AM | Report abuse

Gm, looking at this list:

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?page=2008freeagents

I have to strongly disagree with this:

"But the point is there are guys out there to be had at the MLE that could really help this team."

This is a pretty weak class of FAs. The only real noteworthy unrestricted ones are guys (Brand, Magette, B. Davis, J. O'Neal) making max or near max deals who would only become unrestricted FAs if they opt out. And even if they do (which is unlikely for most of them) they'd be way out of the Wizards price range. There are some guys with restricted FA status who could make a difference, but they won't be signing the likes of Josh Smith or Emeka Okafor for the MLE.

And that's to say nothing of the fact that, if they do keep Arenas and Jamison, any MLE signing they make puts them over the lux tax threshold.

Posted by: kalorama | June 18, 2008 10:47 AM | Report abuse

And what reason do YOU have that GILBERT can't dominate defensively. This talk is all purely subjective! YOU make some sense and get a grip on reality instead of always fixating on Gilbert. Who made YOU the authority on Gilber or the Wiz for that matter. You sound like a GILBERT stalker to me.

Posted by: Anonymous | June 18, 2008 11:05 AM | Report abuse

"And what reason do YOU have that GILBERT can't dominate defensively. This talk is all purely subjective! YOU make some sense and get a grip on reality instead of always fixating on Gilbert. Who made YOU the authority on Gilber or the Wiz for that matter. You sound like a GILBERT stalker to me.

Posted by: | June 18, 2008 11:05 AM "

What is your reason? You sound like an obsessed Gilby fan. I, on the other hand, am an objective Wiz observer. :D

My reason is that Gilby's focus and energy is on offense. Offense is what pays his bills and gives him the limelight he craves, like a drug. Gilby has never played defense in his life.

The reason he was let go of his high school team, which is what he uses as his personal ammo that he openly broacasts, is because he refused to buy into the team concept. It was reported by Wise. Gilby was let go because all he wanted to do was shoot the ball.

Gilby may have the ability to play defense, but Gilby is not a physical player, does not like contact, and Gilby wants all his energy focused on offense. Name some guys who are 30 pt scorers who excel in both areas.

MJ....Kobe.....Gilby is no way in their league.

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 18, 2008 11:17 AM | Report abuse

Gilbert said "I can score 22 on a bad leg", fine, I just don't want to pay you a "Max" salary to do it. Who knows if and when he'll ever be back to %100. Look what happened to Orlando, they were crippled for years.

Posted by: No | June 18, 2008 11:32 AM | Report abuse

DC Man you need to get a life! Just because a fan likes a player does not a fanatic make. A fanatic is someone like yourself who can't even write a post without bringing Gilbert into your conversation. I was just responding to your foolishness because I had a break at work and wanted to make you go off on a rant. I succeeded and am now going back to work. Don't have time for your foolishness.

SEE YA!

Posted by: Anonymous | June 18, 2008 11:41 AM | Report abuse

GIlly sucks...will never dominate at D and will never help the Wiz win anything. If this franchise wants hope...get rid of gilly aka the black hole.

Posted by: Anonymous | June 18, 2008 11:47 AM | Report abuse

"DC Man you need to get a life! Just because a fan likes a player does not a fanatic make. A fanatic is someone like yourself who can't even write a post without bringing Gilbert into your conversation. I was just responding to your foolishness because I had a break at work and wanted to make you go off on a rant. I succeeded and am now going back to work. Don't have time for your foolishness.

SEE YA!

Posted by: | June 18, 2008 11:41 AM "

Thanks for confirming that you have absolutely no valid reasons to explain why you think Gilby can continue to score 29 pts/game and also "dominate" defensively.

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 18, 2008 11:53 AM | Report abuse

For people who think that the Wiz can get by and somehow sneak into the echelons of the east and win it all, keep dreaming.

Look at the teams that have won championships recently. They have either spent big money and were aggressive (Heat & Celtics), or drafted and managed wisely (Spurs & Pistons).

The Wiz can keep the team together and if you look at the team itself, it looks somewhat promising with 2 all stars from last season and some young, but green bucks.

Then you look at other teams in the east and they have the same or better (Cavs, Hawks, Orlando, Raptors, Chicago, etc.), have a much more aggressive ownership/management team, and are deeper.

Therefore, go ahead and pay someone max money, go ahead and draft more young guys, and go ahead and keep everything intact. We'll just have another season of hope.

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 18, 2008 11:59 AM | Report abuse

Blah,blah,blah,blah. Blah,blah.

Posted by: Anonymous | June 18, 2008 12:18 PM | Report abuse

DC Man88

Please give me your fair, realistic off-season moves that would improve the wizards, assuming all wizards are touchable, and keeping in mind the salary cap.

Posted by: Anonymous | June 18, 2008 1:00 PM | Report abuse

"DC Man88

Please give me your fair, realistic off-season moves that would improve the wizards, assuming all wizards are touchable, and keeping in mind the salary cap.

Posted by: | June 18, 2008 1:00 PM "

Who the heck are you?

Are you the same dork who said she was taking a break from work?

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 18, 2008 1:06 PM | Report abuse

No. I am somebody different, and no dork. I don't play with children. Why you on the defensive? I asked you a simple question and said please. I meant no offense to you. Please don't take none. If you don't want to answer, you don't have to. If you choose not to answer the question, you unqualify yourself of having anything worthwhile to say about the wizards.

Posted by: G-Man | June 18, 2008 1:22 PM | Report abuse

No. 18 pick whether its Hibbard, R. Lopez, or someone else won't have a major impact on the Wiz next year. If Etan Thomas returns (has no trade value given his health issues and contract), EJ will have no option but to play him as the backup center based on his experience.

Better option is to package the No. 1 pick and a player (Blatche or Songaila) to a team who has a legit backup bigman that can play the 4 or 5. Not sure if any of our reserves have much trade value, but our No. 18 may entice a team looking to move up or get younger.

Whether we resign Jamison and Arenas is a moot point until we address the gaping hole for depth at the 4 and 5 positions. Did anyone notice the contributions made by PJ Brown and Leon Powe for the Celtics? It's not a coincidence that teams need these type of players in the playoffs to advance. It continues to amaze me that no one holds EG accountable for picking Pecherov in 2006 or the other Russian bigman the same year.

Posted by: wizfan89 | June 18, 2008 1:28 PM | Report abuse

Everybody and their mother likes to come on this blog and post without a name. Who knows who is whom?

As I've said many times before, the playoffs showed the team's glaring weaknesses.

They need a 4 who can score in the paint and play defense. They need a killer spot up shooter. They need a 1 who will come out and be a leader and who can set up and run an offense (and play defense), not just throw a few cute passes on a fast break.

Giving max money to Gilby does not make sense especially since the team made the playoffs without him this season and had the same amount of success compared to two seasons before, with him.

There are many players available or tradeable that can help this team. They include Brand, Calderon, Josh Smith, etc. Other players that can help also include Devin Hester.

Of course, those content with status quo say that none of these players are available, so it's wishful thinking? Are these players "not available or untouchable" because their team won a ring this year? NOT!

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 18, 2008 1:29 PM | Report abuse

Devin Harris

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 18, 2008 1:31 PM | Report abuse

I never thought I would see the day when DC Dork is giving basketball advice. Give me a break, this guy know no more about the Wiz than you or I. All he does is make anti-Gilbert posts and talk about anyone who defends him. This forum still sucks I see.

Posted by: MdWizFan | June 18, 2008 1:42 PM | Report abuse

"I never thought I would see the day when DC Dork is giving basketball advice. Give me a break, this guy know no more about the Wiz than you or I. All he does is make anti-Gilbert posts and talk about anyone who defends him. This forum still sucks I see.

Posted by: MdWizFan | June 18, 2008 1:42 PM "

So what purpose do you serve for this blog since you are a self acknowledged moron when it comes to the Wiz?

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 18, 2008 1:45 PM | Report abuse

At the MLE level guys that could help the Wizards depending on which way the team would draft or what trades would be: Ron Artest, PJ Brown(if he wants anther year after the ring), Micheal Finley, Eddie House, Alonzo Mourning, Nestrovic, James Posey, Kenny and Kurt Thomas. And of course or own Anthony Mason.

Grunfeld has said repeatedly that the team has no set orders to stay below the Luxury Tax. Of course no one in their right mind would have lost their share of this year's LT fund to sign Ming Ming or a D league guy. That would have been paying 4 to 5m to get a stiff.

But once you're at or above that level AND you have a salary exception to use team's don't seem to flinch to go over it that much. Everyone seemed to ignore that Grunfeld had nothing to offer last year because his exceptions were used.

This summer it appears that Grunfeld will have the MLE available if he chooses to use it. So there are routes to go to add to what he has.

Posted by: GM | June 18, 2008 2:23 PM | Report abuse

Ron Artest isn't going to be had with the MLE. PJ Brown only came out of retirement to play for a title with the Celtics (he'd rejected numerous offers from noncontenders before signing with Boston). If he doesn't return to Boston, odds are he goes back into retirement. Finley, Posey, Mourning, Kurt Thomas are the kind of wizened, end-of-career vets that are great to have on deep contending teams in limited roles. They don't make much sense for a lower rung playoff team that's still trying to build/establish itself. Nesterovic is a lesser version of Haywood and Kenny Thomas is another undersized, low to the ground "big" man, which the Wiz really don't need any more of. If the Wizards re-sign Arenas, spending the MLE on a guy like House, who is essentially a much, much less talented version of the same kind of player (long-bombing PG) would seem to be a bad use of resources.

In the Wizards' current state, none of those guys is worth going over the lux cap for. They're margin fillers and window dressing. The Wizards still need to finish putting up walls and a roof on the house.

Posted by: kalorama | June 18, 2008 2:39 PM | Report abuse

BTW, Artest has an opt out clause in his contract, but has been quoted as saying he most likely won't use it and will remain with the Kings.

Posted by: kalorama | June 18, 2008 2:43 PM | Report abuse

I forgot...Can Etan play defense? Perhaps he'll add real value at PF if we can get a Center in the draft to spell Haywood.

Posted by: Cballer | June 18, 2008 2:44 PM | Report abuse

Messing with your head . HaHa

Posted by: MDWizFan | June 18, 2008 3:22 PM | Report abuse

ATTENTION ALL GIL BASHERS!

GIL WILL BE BACK IN A WIZ UNIFORM NEXT YEAR! BET!

Posted by: Anonymous | June 18, 2008 3:24 PM | Report abuse

"At the MLE level guys that could help the Wizards depending on which way the team would draft or what trades would be: Ron Artest, PJ Brown(if he wants anther year after the ring), Micheal Finley, Eddie House, Alonzo Mourning, Nestrovic, James Posey, Kenny and Kurt Thomas. And of course or own Anthony Mason.

Posted by: GM | June 18, 2008 2:23 PM "

GM has lost his marbles.

Did Anthony Mason come out of retirement after all his years with the knicks?

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 18, 2008 3:27 PM | Report abuse

It was Roger Mason. Just checking to be sure you were still reading every word of my posts...

Ron Artest and just about every body on that list will play for the MLE or below if they want to get to a contender.

House and Posey will be competing for the same MLE dollars in Boston, somebody's going to be available.

The Wizards don't need to come up with a starter, and using the MLE to sign someone could also allow the packaging of another player. A guy like Posey could be an important addition off the bench.

Or Artest could be the kind of shut down defender that could up the defensive effort as a starter.

There are some guys on the restricted list that teams will have problems matching bids for as well.

Gee Kal, all this conversing with 88's making you all negative...

Posted by: GM | June 18, 2008 4:42 PM | Report abuse

One more injury and his career could be over. Therefore, he needs to get paid as much as he can as soon as he can. This "kind gesture" on the surface by Gilby doesn't pay for the grotto or extra cheeseburgers for his kids.

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 18, 2008 9:19 AM

So - you would be willing to say you were WRONG, if Gilbert Arenas signs for less than the maximum salary?

You would be willing to tell everyone on this blog that Gilbert Arenas was telling the TRUTH - and that your constant negative comments about his "kind gesture" were just so much hot air?

Posted by: Rook | June 18, 2008 5:00 PM | Report abuse

BTW, Artest has an opt out clause in his contract, but has been quoted as saying he most likely won't use it and will remain with the Kings.

Posted by: kalorama | June 18, 2008 2:43 PM

But he's also said he'd be interested in playing for the Knicks... AND his agent said that Ron Ron understands if he leaves the Kings, he'd most likely have to settle for a team's MLE.

So, it's not outside the realm of possibility.

Posted by: Rook | June 18, 2008 5:09 PM | Report abuse

"Ron Artest and just about every body on that list will play for the MLE or below if they want to get to a contender."

The Wizards aren't a contender. (I had a bunch more stuff I was going to add, but then I figured it would overkill).

"House and Posey will be competing for the same MLE dollars in Boston, somebody's going to be available."

(A) Neither one of those guys is going to get the full MLE from another team (House is making the minimum and Posey is making less than $3.5 mill). Unless someone offered to wildly overpay them, Boston would easily be able to keep both by splitting the MLE between them. (B) It's not really an issue, because Posey will only be a FA is he decides not to exercise the 2nd year option in his deal, which seems very unlikely. The chance to win another title will be more than enough incentive for them to stay.

"There are some guys on the restricted list that teams will have problems matching bids for as well."

(A) Not at the MLE level (which is all the Wiz have and (B) none that will make any real difference.

Posted by: kalorama | June 18, 2008 5:20 PM | Report abuse

"So, it's not outside the realm of possibility."

The Earth veering out of its orbit and crashing into the sun isn't outside the realm of possibility. But it's pretty unlikely.

Artest was quoted yesterday (while watching Game 6 of the Finals in Boston) that he was "99%" certain he was not going to opt out.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=3449929

But even if he does and even if he's willing to take the MLE, what reason is there to think he'd take the Wizards' MLE over the MLE being offered by all of the other teams that would pursue him, likely including several contenders (or at least more legit contenders than the Wizards)?

Posted by: kalorama | June 18, 2008 5:26 PM | Report abuse

"So - you would be willing to say you were WRONG, if Gilbert Arenas signs for less than the maximum salary?

You would be willing to tell everyone on this blog that Gilbert Arenas was telling the TRUTH - and that your constant negative comments about his "kind gesture" were just so much hot air?

Posted by: Rook | June 18, 2008 5:00 PM "

Huh?

What are you talking about?

I'm saying Gilby is a bald faced liar if he says he's willing to take less money. The injury should have woken his diva arse up about how precious his time is in the NBA.

If I were Gilby, I would want to get paid as much as possible, but, I probably would have taken EG's extension offer instead of opting out, because as I said before, he was assuming a lot of risk to turn it down, and guess what, I was spot on.

If Gilby does get the scraps after AJ signs, then I'd be wrong about Gilby.

If Gilby gets less than max, I wouldn't be wrong because I said he didn't deserve max to begin with.

There's a big difference between "less than max" compared to "scraps."

I'm pretty sure if EG offered Gilby less than what another team can offer him (5 year money), then Gilby would bolt DC and not look back faster than MJ when he left VC in his Aston Martin.

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 18, 2008 9:26 PM | Report abuse

"It was Roger Mason. Just checking to be sure you were still reading every word of my posts...


Posted by: GM | June 18, 2008 4:42 PM "

It's been a bit more bearable since I suggested that you break up your comments into single sentence paragraphs.

Besides, I need a good chuckle once in awhile, and your posts easily provide that.

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 18, 2008 9:29 PM | Report abuse

DC Man 88, you are a trip. On the one hand you bash Gil for wanting the max, then you turn around and say if you were him, you would take the max. Which is it? Why would he listen to the likes of you as to what he should do. LOL Eveyone on this post seems to be wrong but you. That is in your eyes. Bottom line is this, no matter what Gil does, it is none of your business and won't affect your wallet, so let it go and talk about something other than Gil. Your fixation on this man borders on crazy. So, go ahead and spew your hate to my message cause a brotha don't give a damn!

Posted by: Anonymous | June 19, 2008 7:41 AM | Report abuse

"DC Man 88, you are a trip. On the one hand you bash Gil for wanting the max, then you turn around and say if you were him, you would take the max. Which is it? Why would he listen to the likes of you as to what he should do. LOL Eveyone on this post seems to be wrong but you. That is in your eyes. Bottom line is this, no matter what Gil does, it is none of your business and won't affect your wallet, so let it go and talk about something other than Gil. Your fixation on this man borders on crazy. So, go ahead and spew your hate to my message cause a brotha don't give a damn!

Posted by: | June 19, 2008 7:41 AM "

me neither brotha.

Posted by: DC Man88 | June 20, 2008 7:29 PM | Report abuse

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